From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jun 12 02:54:03 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1315516A41F; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 02:54:03 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: from dragon.NUXI.org (trang.nuxi.com [66.93.134.19]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EBC043D1F; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 02:54:02 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: from dragon.NUXI.org (obrien@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dragon.NUXI.org (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j5C2s2if069145; Sat, 11 Jun 2005 19:54:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@dragon.NUXI.org) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by dragon.NUXI.org (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id j5C2s2rl069144; Sat, 11 Jun 2005 19:54:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Date: Sat, 11 Jun 2005 19:54:02 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: John Baldwin Message-ID: <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, John Baldwin References: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 6.0-CURRENT Organization: The NUXI BSD Group X-Pgp-Rsa-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Rsa-Keyid: 1024/34F9F9D5 User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i Cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Death to toor X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2005 02:54:03 -0000 On Thu, Jun 09, 2005 at 04:40:19PM -0700, John Baldwin wrote: > Is there any good reason to keep the toor account around nowadays? Yes. Some of us use it. > vipw has existed since 4.0BSD and chsh and friends have existed since > 4.3BSD-Reno so I think that it's safe to say that folks are more than > capable nowadays of changing root's default shell if desired. I wouldn't say we are totally safe changing root's default shell away from /bin/csh. We still see people give the advice that one should not change root's default shell. > Also, > '/bin/csh' and '/bin/sh' aren't very hard to type once you are logged > in as root whatever the default shell may be. We could default to only /bin/sh as the login shell globally. 'csh', 'zsh', 'bash' aren't very hard to type once you are logged in. -- -- David (obrien@FreeBSD.org) From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jun 12 03:37:39 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E42A16A41C; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 03:37:39 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from rcoleman@criticalmagic.com) Received: from saturn.criticalmagic.com (saturn.criticalmagic.com [69.61.68.51]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C745343D49; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 03:37:38 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from rcoleman@criticalmagic.com) Received: from [172.16.0.202] (adsl-34-205-243.asm.bellsouth.net [67.34.205.243]) by saturn.criticalmagic.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A44B13BD21; Sat, 11 Jun 2005 23:37:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <42ABAE43.1000704@criticalmagic.com> Date: Sat, 11 Jun 2005 23:38:43 -0400 From: Richard Coleman Organization: Critical Magic User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (X11/20050502) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org References: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> In-Reply-To: <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: John Baldwin Subject: Re: Death to toor X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2005 03:37:39 -0000 David O'Brien wrote: > I wouldn't say we are totally safe changing root's default shell away > from /bin/csh. We still see people give the advice that one should not > change root's default shell. That sounds like old school sysadmin conservatism. I don't think there is any technical basis for such advice. I'm not suggesting that the default be changed, since consistency is also a desirable thing (I get irked when I log into a box as root and suddently find that I'm in bash). But I doubt it hurts anything to changes root's shell these days. As to the status of toor, I say remove it. Anyone that wants to keep it can skip that mergemaster step. Richard Coleman rcoleman@criticalmagic.com From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jun 12 04:02:30 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7355B16A41F; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 04:02:29 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.208.78.105]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2789243D1F; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 04:02:29 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.13.3/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j5C42RiT006852; Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:02:27 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.13.3/8.13.1/Submit) id j5C42P2M006851; Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:02:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sgk) Date: Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:02:25 -0700 From: Steve Kargl To: Richard Coleman Message-ID: <20050612040224.GA6790@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> References: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> <42ABAE43.1000704@criticalmagic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <42ABAE43.1000704@criticalmagic.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Death to toor X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2005 04:02:30 -0000 On Sat, Jun 11, 2005 at 11:38:43PM -0400, Richard Coleman wrote: > > As to the status of toor, I say remove it. Anyone that wants to keep it > can skip that mergemaster step. > BSD has historically had a toor account. A person who installs FreeBSD from a CD created after toor removal will not have a toor account. How does mergemaster restore a historical toor account? This is a really dumb bikeshed. toor is 1 uid out of a rather large number of possible uid's. -- Steve From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jun 12 04:08:45 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02C1D16A41F for ; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 04:08:45 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: from dragon.NUXI.org (trang.nuxi.com [66.93.134.19]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B166343D48 for ; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 04:08:44 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: from dragon.NUXI.org (obrien@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dragon.NUXI.org (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j5C48g5U071768; Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:08:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@dragon.NUXI.org) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by dragon.NUXI.org (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id j5C48gAr071767; Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:08:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Date: Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:08:41 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: Steve Kargl Message-ID: <20050612040841.GF67746@dragon.NUXI.org> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, Steve Kargl , Richard Coleman References: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> <42ABAE43.1000704@criticalmagic.com> <20050612040224.GA6790@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20050612040224.GA6790@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 6.0-CURRENT Organization: The NUXI BSD Group X-Pgp-Rsa-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Rsa-Keyid: 1024/34F9F9D5 User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i Cc: Richard Coleman , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Death to toor X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2005 04:08:45 -0000 On Sat, Jun 11, 2005 at 09:02:25PM -0700, Steve Kargl wrote: > On Sat, Jun 11, 2005 at 11:38:43PM -0400, Richard Coleman wrote: > > As to the status of toor, I say remove it. Anyone that wants to keep it > > can skip that mergemaster step. > > BSD has historically had a toor account. A person who installs > FreeBSD from a CD created after toor removal will not have a > toor account. How does mergemaster restore a historical > toor account? > > This is a really dumb bikeshed. toor is 1 uid out of > a rather large number of possible uid's. Actually toor does not even consume a uid. (since 0 is already used by root) -- -- David (obrien@FreeBSD.org) From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jun 12 04:55:54 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DF1716A41C for ; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 04:55:54 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: from hydrogen.funkthat.com (gate.funkthat.com [69.17.45.168]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BBFC043D48 for ; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 04:55:53 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: from hydrogen.funkthat.com (ufeqgt@localhost.funkthat.com [127.0.0.1]) by hydrogen.funkthat.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j5C4tp7V091533; Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:55:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.funkthat.com (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id j5C4toPt091532; Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:55:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmg) Date: Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:55:50 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Steve Kargl Message-ID: <20050612045550.GG742@funkthat.com> Mail-Followup-To: Steve Kargl , Richard Coleman , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org References: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> <42ABAE43.1000704@criticalmagic.com> <20050612040224.GA6790@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20050612040224.GA6790@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.4-RELEASE-p1 i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ X-Resume: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/resume.html Cc: Richard Coleman , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Death to toor X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2005 04:55:54 -0000 Steve Kargl wrote this message on Sat, Jun 11, 2005 at 21:02 -0700: > On Sat, Jun 11, 2005 at 11:38:43PM -0400, Richard Coleman wrote: > > As to the status of toor, I say remove it. Anyone that wants to keep it > > can skip that mergemaster step. > > > > BSD has historically had a toor account. A person who installs > FreeBSD from a CD created after toor removal will not have a > toor account. How does mergemaster restore a historical > toor account? Which is useless unless someone sets a password for it, or installs a port like sudo that lets you to switch to it... For me, I always change root's shell to /bin/sh, so I could care less about toor... and since less is usually better, my vote is to drop it.. It's easy enough to add it back.. Time marches on.. -- John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 415 225 5579 "All that I will do, has been done, All that I have, has not." From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jun 12 07:08:18 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5464E16A41C for ; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 07:08:18 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from tim.des.no (tim.des.no [194.63.250.121]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E22E543D1D for ; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 07:08:17 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from tim.des.no (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spam.des.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FA3160F3; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 09:08:10 +0200 (CEST) Received: from xps.des.no (des.no [80.203.228.37]) by tim.des.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id F02CC60F2; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 09:08:09 +0200 (CEST) Received: by xps.des.no (Postfix, from userid 1001) id D834133C1C; Sun, 12 Jun 2005 09:08:09 +0200 (CEST) To: Steve Kargl References: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> <42ABAE43.1000704@criticalmagic.com> <20050612040224.GA6790@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20050612045550.GG742@funkthat.com> From: des@des.no (=?iso-8859-1?q?Dag-Erling_Sm=F8rgrav?=) Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2005 09:08:09 +0200 In-Reply-To: <20050612045550.GG742@funkthat.com> (John-Mark Gurney's message of "Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:55:50 -0700") Message-ID: <86vf4kt5ly.fsf@xps.des.no> User-Agent: Gnus/5.110002 (No Gnus v0.2) Emacs/21.3 (berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Learn: ham X-Spam-Score: -5.2/5.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.2 (2004-11-16) on tim.des.no Cc: Richard Coleman , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Death to toor X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2005 07:08:18 -0000 John-Mark Gurney writes: > Which is useless unless someone sets a password for it, or installs > a port like sudo that lets you to switch to it... For me, I always > change root's shell to /bin/sh, so I could care less about toor... > and since less is usually better, my vote is to drop it.. It's easy > enough to add it back.. > > Time marches on.. It does no harm, many people use it (regardless of your opinion of its usefulness), and it is a piece of BSD history. Allow me to quote from src/sbin/tunefs/tunefs.8: .\" Take this out and a Unix Daemon will dog your steps from now until .\" the time_t's wrap around. DES --=20 Dag-Erling Sm=F8rgrav - des@des.no From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 07:49:45 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 830D116A41C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 07:49:45 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from itchy.rabson.org (mailgate.nlsystems.com [80.177.232.242]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D061443D48; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 07:49:44 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from herring.rabson.org (herring [10.0.0.2]) by itchy.rabson.org (8.13.3/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j5D7nQlb051881; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 08:49:26 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) From: Doug Rabson To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 08:49:25 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.8 References: <864qc9mgqc.fsf@xps.des.no> <42A75303.2090203@elischer.org> <42A75591.7080502@elischer.org> In-Reply-To: <42A75591.7080502@elischer.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200506130849.26026.dfr@nlsystems.com> X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.8 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED autolearn=failed version=3.0.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.2 (2004-11-16) on itchy.rabson.org X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.83/934/Sun Jun 12 23:44:50 2005 on itchy.rabson.org X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Dag-Erling =?iso-8859-1?q?Sm=F8rgrav?= , Julian Elischer , arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Retiring static libpam support X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 07:49:45 -0000 On Wednesday 08 June 2005 21:31, Julian Elischer wrote: > adding more to my revious mail.. > > Julian Elischer wrote: > > Dag-Erling Sm=F8rgrav wrote: > >> Julian Elischer writes: > >>> I gues it would be ok if the basic binary is static and the PAM > >>> modules are loaded using dlopen. > >> > >> You can't load dynamic objects from a static binary. It doesn't > >> have a working dlopen() (since dlopen() is implemented by the > >> run-time loader), and even if it did, there is no relocation table > >> there to resolve dependencies in the dynamic object. > > > > so basically that would screw us. > > Or force us to abandon static linking of apps, > which might be an OK decision, but basically > I think it's kind of the thin edge of the wedge for fully > desupporting all static > binaries. if nothing that does authentication > can be static then there is no such thing any more as a fully static > system and one might as well just not bother. You can link statically to some libraries and dynamically to others -=20 that might work quite well. You would probably end up linking=20 dynamically to libc otherwise you might get two copies of libc when you=20 load a pam module. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 07:49:45 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 830D116A41C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 07:49:45 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from itchy.rabson.org (mailgate.nlsystems.com [80.177.232.242]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D061443D48; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 07:49:44 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from herring.rabson.org (herring [10.0.0.2]) by itchy.rabson.org (8.13.3/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j5D7nQlb051881; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 08:49:26 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) From: Doug Rabson To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 08:49:25 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.8 References: <864qc9mgqc.fsf@xps.des.no> <42A75303.2090203@elischer.org> <42A75591.7080502@elischer.org> In-Reply-To: <42A75591.7080502@elischer.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200506130849.26026.dfr@nlsystems.com> X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.8 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED autolearn=failed version=3.0.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.2 (2004-11-16) on itchy.rabson.org X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.83/934/Sun Jun 12 23:44:50 2005 on itchy.rabson.org X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: Dag-Erling =?iso-8859-1?q?Sm=F8rgrav?= , Julian Elischer , arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Retiring static libpam support X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 07:49:45 -0000 On Wednesday 08 June 2005 21:31, Julian Elischer wrote: > adding more to my revious mail.. > > Julian Elischer wrote: > > Dag-Erling Sm=F8rgrav wrote: > >> Julian Elischer writes: > >>> I gues it would be ok if the basic binary is static and the PAM > >>> modules are loaded using dlopen. > >> > >> You can't load dynamic objects from a static binary. It doesn't > >> have a working dlopen() (since dlopen() is implemented by the > >> run-time loader), and even if it did, there is no relocation table > >> there to resolve dependencies in the dynamic object. > > > > so basically that would screw us. > > Or force us to abandon static linking of apps, > which might be an OK decision, but basically > I think it's kind of the thin edge of the wedge for fully > desupporting all static > binaries. if nothing that does authentication > can be static then there is no such thing any more as a fully static > system and one might as well just not bother. You can link statically to some libraries and dynamically to others -=20 that might work quite well. You would probably end up linking=20 dynamically to libc otherwise you might get two copies of libc when you=20 load a pam module. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 08:16:42 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 060F016A41C for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 08:16:42 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from pasmtp.tele.dk (pasmtp.tele.dk [193.162.159.95]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A963243D48 for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 08:16:41 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (0x535c0e2a.sgnxx1.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk [83.92.14.42]) by pasmtp.tele.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57BA21EC351 for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 10:16:40 +0200 (CEST) Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.freebsd.dk (8.13.4/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j5D8GAfF011810; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 10:16:11 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) To: Bakul Shah From: "Poul-Henning Kamp" In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 11 Jun 2005 08:46:29 PDT." <200506111546.j5BFkToq011515@gate.bitblocks.com> Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 10:16:10 +0200 Message-ID: <11809.1118650570@critter.freebsd.dk> Sender: phk@critter.freebsd.dk Cc: Antoine Brodin , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: RFC: Stack saving/tracing functionality. X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 08:16:42 -0000 In message <200506111546.j5BFkToq011515@gate.bitblocks.com>, Bakul Shah writes: >> ... but it would be neat if it could also save/print userland stacks >> so that we could get tracebacks from abort()'ing userland programs. > >Along these lines; wouldn't it be neat if there was a sysctl >to leave a segfaulted or aborted process around so that you >can attach a debugger to it and find out what went wrong (and >may be even correct it!)? Debugging a live process (even if >fatally injured) yields more clues as you can poke around at >its I/O connections, its caller process etc. A separate >program can be used to create a coredump if you really wish >to preseve the dead body for later autopsy. Ideally a coredump should include anything sockstat and fstat can tell you about the process. /me longs for the MVS dumps level of details... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 09:08:11 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EA5116A41C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 09:08:11 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from neuhauser@sigpipe.cz) Received: from isis.sigpipe.cz (fw.sigpipe.cz [62.245.70.224]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E484743D49; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 09:08:10 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from neuhauser@sigpipe.cz) Received: by isis.sigpipe.cz (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 9A52D1F87BED; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 11:08:08 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 11:08:08 +0200 From: Roman Neuhauser To: Dag-Erling Sm?rgrav Message-ID: <20050613090808.GB1789@isis.sigpipe.cz> Mail-Followup-To: Dag-Erling Sm?rgrav , freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.org References: <200506090027.j590R2t0070899@repoman.freebsd.org> <20050609003619.GA10578@xor.obsecurity.org> <20050609100815.GB16677@over-yonder.net> <20050609160316.GC16677@over-yonder.net> <20050610062431.GA78875@isis.sigpipe.cz> <86fyvq3c4o.fsf@xps.des.no> <20050610112857.GB80719@isis.sigpipe.cz> <86psuuv1z6.fsf@xps.des.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <86psuuv1z6.fsf@xps.des.no> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i Cc: freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Bug in #! processing - "pear broken on current" X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 09:08:11 -0000 # des@des.no / 2005-06-10 14:19:09 +0200: > Roman Neuhauser writes: > > That simply shows that all these *Linux* distros don't handle > > shebang lines well. > > Actually, it shows that they handle shebang lines *correctly*, and > that we don't unilaterally break Pear by aligning ourselves with them. These two were identical before: #!/usr/local/bin/php -n -q -dsafe_mode=0 -doutput_buffering=1 % /usr/local/bin/php -n -q -dsafe_mode=0 -doutput_buffering=1 These two are identical now: #!/usr/local/bin/php -n -q -dsafe_mode=0 -doutput_buffering=1 % /usr/local/bin/php "-n -q -dsafe_mode=0 -doutput_buffering=1" Obviously, "correct" is whatever behavior we declare as such. But is the latter actually useful? The Linux distros you shown hacking around the shebang parsing limitations (forking another shell to achieve the correct parsing) shows just that: Linux distros basically avoiding anything above the simplest "#!/bin/sh". -- How many Vietnam vets does it take to screw in a light bulb? You don't know, man. You don't KNOW. Cause you weren't THERE. http://bash.org/?255991 From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 10:25:48 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F1E716A41C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 10:25:48 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from tataz@tataz.chchile.org) Received: from postfix4-2.free.fr (postfix4-2.free.fr [213.228.0.176]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 045B543D5C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 10:25:47 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from tataz@tataz.chchile.org) Received: from tatooine.tataz.chchile.org (vol75-8-82-233-239-98.fbx.proxad.net [82.233.239.98]) by postfix4-2.free.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1107831DAC6; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 12:25:44 +0200 (CEST) Received: by tatooine.tataz.chchile.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 03C3D407E; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 12:25:24 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 12:25:24 +0200 From: Jeremie Le Hen To: Garance A Drosehn Message-ID: <20050613102524.GE30017@obiwan.tataz.chchile.org> References: <200506090027.j590R2t0070899@repoman.freebsd.org> <20050609003619.GA10578@xor.obsecurity.org> <20050609100815.GB16677@over-yonder.net> <20050609160316.GC16677@over-yonder.net> <20050610062431.GA78875@isis.sigpipe.cz> <20050610104829.GA80719@isis.sigpipe.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i Cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org, Roman Neuhauser , "Matthew D. Fuller" , freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.org, Kris Kennaway , Florent Thoumie Subject: Re: Bug in #! processing - "pear broken on current" X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 10:25:48 -0000 Hi Garance, > However, I do agree that the previous behavior could be very useful > in other situations. I will soon have a version of `env' which will > provide all the benefits that used to happen due to the previous > parsing behavior. In fact, it will be even more flexible and support > even more options than the previous parsing behavior did. And I think > I can even define it in such a way that other operating systems could > pick up these changes to `env' (if they wanted to), and enjoy the same > flexibility. And more important to me, I could recompile this new > `env' on other operating systems, and at least *I* would have those > benefits on all platforms I work on! I'm surely too much impatient, but what are those powerful features ? :) Regards, -- Jeremie Le Hen < jeremie at le-hen dot org >< ttz at chchile dot org > From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 11:26:32 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 033F616A41C for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 11:26:32 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from antoine@madhouse.dreadbsd.org) Received: from barton.dreadbsd.org (madhouse.dreadbsd.org [82.67.196.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7261D43D1D for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 11:26:31 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from antoine@madhouse.dreadbsd.org) Received: from barton.dreadbsd.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by barton.dreadbsd.org (8.13.4/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j5DBQLM1017636; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 13:26:22 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from antoine@madhouse.dreadbsd.org) Received: (from antoine@localhost) by barton.dreadbsd.org (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id j5DBQLn6017635; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 13:26:21 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from antoine) Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 13:26:21 +0200 From: Antoine Brodin To: Jeff Roberson Message-Id: <20050613132621.310a3deb.antoine.brodin@laposte.net> In-Reply-To: <20050608162637.U16943@mail.chesapeake.net> References: <20050608162637.U16943@mail.chesapeake.net> X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 1.9.12 (GTK+ 2.6.7; i386-portbld-freebsd6.0) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: simplify disksort, please review. X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 11:26:32 -0000 Jeff Roberson wrote: > http://www.chesapeake.net/~jroberson/disksort.diff > > Our disksort algorithm used to be complicated by the BIO_ORDERED flag, > which could cause us to make some exceptions in the sorting. When the > ordered support was removed we never simplified the algorithm. The patch > above gets rid of the switch point and associated logic. It's now a > simple hinted insertion sort with a one way scan. Since it's a fairly > central algorithm, I'd appreciate a review. Sorry for the late review, but there's perhaps a problem: If you have this situation: queue:------------ 5 - 6 - 7 last_offset: 4 | insert_point:------+ And you bioq_disksort a bio with an offset of 1: queue:------------ 5 - 1 - 6 - 7 last_offset: 4 | insert_point:------+ It looks weirdly sorted. IIRC, the previous algorithm gave: queue:------------ 5 - 6 - 7 - 1 Looking at revision 1.83, it looks like insert_point was useless, not switch_point. I can't test this change since disksort doesn't seem to be used by ata(4) anymore (is there any reason ?). Cheers, Antoine From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 12:44:43 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43DEA16A41C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 12:44:43 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from tataz@tataz.chchile.org) Received: from postfix3-2.free.fr (postfix3-2.free.fr [213.228.0.169]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E465543D1D; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 12:44:42 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from tataz@tataz.chchile.org) Received: from tatooine.tataz.chchile.org (vol75-8-82-233-239-98.fbx.proxad.net [82.233.239.98]) by postfix3-2.free.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 121FCC12E; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 14:44:40 +0200 (CEST) Received: by tatooine.tataz.chchile.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id BDBAE407E; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 14:44:20 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 14:44:20 +0200 From: Jeremie Le Hen To: Garance A Drosehn Message-ID: <20050613124420.GG30017@obiwan.tataz.chchile.org> References: <20050609003619.GA10578@xor.obsecurity.org> <20050609100815.GB16677@over-yonder.net> <20050609160316.GC16677@over-yonder.net> <20050610062431.GA78875@isis.sigpipe.cz> <20050610104829.GA80719@isis.sigpipe.cz> <20050613102524.GE30017@obiwan.tataz.chchile.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20050613102524.GE30017@obiwan.tataz.chchile.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i Cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Bug in #! processing - "pear broken on current" X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 12:44:43 -0000 > I'm surely too much impatient, but what are those powerful features ? :) Forget this, I read my mails further, I got an answer. Sorry for the noise. Regards, -- Jeremie Le Hen < jeremie at le-hen dot org >< ttz at chchile dot org > From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 14:42:35 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AC0616A41C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 14:42:35 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jilles@stack.nl) Received: from mailhost.stack.nl (vaak.stack.nl [131.155.140.140]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 207DA43D1D; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 14:42:34 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jilles@stack.nl) Received: from turtle.stack.nl (turtle.stack.nl [IPv6:2001:610:1108:5010::132]) by mailhost.stack.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 727A91F057; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 16:42:33 +0200 (CEST) Received: by turtle.stack.nl (Postfix, from userid 1677) id 652CB1CDE3; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 16:42:33 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 16:42:33 +0200 From: Jilles Tjoelker To: Richard Coleman Message-ID: <20050613144233.GE15281@stack.nl> References: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> <42ABAE43.1000704@criticalmagic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <42ABAE43.1000704@criticalmagic.com> X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.4-RELEASE i386 User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.6i Cc: John Baldwin , freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Death to toor X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 14:42:35 -0000 On Sat, Jun 11, 2005 at 11:38:43PM -0400, Richard Coleman wrote: > David O'Brien wrote: > >I wouldn't say we are totally safe changing root's default shell away > >from /bin/csh. We still see people give the advice that one should not > >change root's default shell. > That sounds like old school sysadmin conservatism. I don't think there > is any technical basis for such advice. I'm not suggesting that the > default be changed, since consistency is also a desirable thing (I get > irked when I log into a box as root and suddently find that I'm in > bash). But I doubt it hurts anything to changes root's shell these days. Actually, there is a case where it matters. The following command, executed as root, uses the shell field in the passwd entry "root" (except if getlogin() returns a different username with uid 0): su -m nonrootuserwithinvalidshell -c 'command' I sometimes use this in scripts with more complicated commands and then it's pretty annoying that that depends on root's shell :( -- Jilles Tjoelker From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 16:49:29 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B67C16A41C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 16:49:29 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from tim.des.no (tim.des.no [194.63.250.121]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BFFD43D53; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 16:49:28 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from tim.des.no (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spam.des.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE7B760F7; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:49:19 +0200 (CEST) Received: from xps.des.no (des.no [80.203.228.37]) by tim.des.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DF9760F5; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:49:19 +0200 (CEST) Received: by xps.des.no (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 8B94D33C49; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:49:19 +0200 (CEST) To: Doug Rabson References: <864qc9mgqc.fsf@xps.des.no> <42A75303.2090203@elischer.org> <42A75591.7080502@elischer.org> <200506130849.26026.dfr@nlsystems.com> From: des@des.no (=?iso-8859-1?q?Dag-Erling_Sm=F8rgrav?=) Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:49:19 +0200 In-Reply-To: <200506130849.26026.dfr@nlsystems.com> (Doug Rabson's message of "Mon, 13 Jun 2005 08:49:25 +0100") Message-ID: <86ll5eyzg0.fsf@xps.des.no> User-Agent: Gnus/5.110002 (No Gnus v0.2) Emacs/21.3 (berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Learn: ham X-Spam-Score: -5.2/5.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.2 (2004-11-16) on tim.des.no Cc: arch@freebsd.org, Julian Elischer , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Retiring static libpam support X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 16:49:29 -0000 Doug Rabson writes: > You can link statically to some libraries and dynamically to others > - that might work quite well. You would probably end up linking > dynamically to libc otherwise you might get two copies of libc when > you load a pam module. That won't help. You'll still end up with two copies of *libpam*. DES --=20 Dag-Erling Sm=F8rgrav - des@des.no From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 16:49:29 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B67C16A41C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 16:49:29 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from tim.des.no (tim.des.no [194.63.250.121]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BFFD43D53; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 16:49:28 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from tim.des.no (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spam.des.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE7B760F7; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:49:19 +0200 (CEST) Received: from xps.des.no (des.no [80.203.228.37]) by tim.des.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DF9760F5; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:49:19 +0200 (CEST) Received: by xps.des.no (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 8B94D33C49; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:49:19 +0200 (CEST) To: Doug Rabson References: <864qc9mgqc.fsf@xps.des.no> <42A75303.2090203@elischer.org> <42A75591.7080502@elischer.org> <200506130849.26026.dfr@nlsystems.com> From: des@des.no (=?iso-8859-1?q?Dag-Erling_Sm=F8rgrav?=) Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:49:19 +0200 In-Reply-To: <200506130849.26026.dfr@nlsystems.com> (Doug Rabson's message of "Mon, 13 Jun 2005 08:49:25 +0100") Message-ID: <86ll5eyzg0.fsf@xps.des.no> User-Agent: Gnus/5.110002 (No Gnus v0.2) Emacs/21.3 (berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Learn: ham X-Spam-Score: -5.2/5.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.2 (2004-11-16) on tim.des.no Cc: arch@freebsd.org, Julian Elischer , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Retiring static libpam support X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 16:49:29 -0000 Doug Rabson writes: > You can link statically to some libraries and dynamically to others > - that might work quite well. You would probably end up linking > dynamically to libc otherwise you might get two copies of libc when > you load a pam module. That won't help. You'll still end up with two copies of *libpam*. DES --=20 Dag-Erling Sm=F8rgrav - des@des.no From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 17:10:54 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 416F116A41C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:10:54 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from mail.qubesoft.com (gate.qubesoft.com [217.169.36.34]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4A8C43D48; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:10:53 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from [192.168.1.254] (dhcp254.qubesoft.com [192.168.1.254]) by mail.qubesoft.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j5DHAYjf013371; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:10:35 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) In-Reply-To: <86ll5eyzg0.fsf@xps.des.no> References: <864qc9mgqc.fsf@xps.des.no> <42A75303.2090203@elischer.org> <42A75591.7080502@elischer.org> <200506130849.26026.dfr@nlsystems.com> <86ll5eyzg0.fsf@xps.des.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v622) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Message-Id: <8510490ff3a56e4ffcc127064b260caf@nlsystems.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Doug Rabson Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:10:34 +0100 To: des@des.no (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=F8rgrav?=) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.8 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED autolearn=failed version=3.0.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.1 (2004-10-22) on mail.qubesoft.com Cc: arch@freebsd.org, Julian Elischer , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Retiring static libpam support X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:10:54 -0000 On 13 Jun 2005, at 17:49, Dag-Erling Sm=F8rgrav wrote: > Doug Rabson writes: >> You can link statically to some libraries and dynamically to others >> - that might work quite well. You would probably end up linking >> dynamically to libc otherwise you might get two copies of libc when >> you load a pam module. > > That won't help. You'll still end up with two copies of *libpam*. It depends exactly what Julian needs to link with statically - it=20 wasn't clear. When I build my own software 'statically' I tend to still=20= link to the system libraries dynamically. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 17:10:54 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 416F116A41C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:10:54 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from mail.qubesoft.com (gate.qubesoft.com [217.169.36.34]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4A8C43D48; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:10:53 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) Received: from [192.168.1.254] (dhcp254.qubesoft.com [192.168.1.254]) by mail.qubesoft.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j5DHAYjf013371; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:10:35 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from dfr@nlsystems.com) In-Reply-To: <86ll5eyzg0.fsf@xps.des.no> References: <864qc9mgqc.fsf@xps.des.no> <42A75303.2090203@elischer.org> <42A75591.7080502@elischer.org> <200506130849.26026.dfr@nlsystems.com> <86ll5eyzg0.fsf@xps.des.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v622) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Message-Id: <8510490ff3a56e4ffcc127064b260caf@nlsystems.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Doug Rabson Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 18:10:34 +0100 To: des@des.no (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=F8rgrav?=) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.622) X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.8 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED autolearn=failed version=3.0.1 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.1 (2004-10-22) on mail.qubesoft.com Cc: arch@freebsd.org, Julian Elischer , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Retiring static libpam support X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:10:54 -0000 On 13 Jun 2005, at 17:49, Dag-Erling Sm=F8rgrav wrote: > Doug Rabson writes: >> You can link statically to some libraries and dynamically to others >> - that might work quite well. You would probably end up linking >> dynamically to libc otherwise you might get two copies of libc when >> you load a pam module. > > That won't help. You'll still end up with two copies of *libpam*. It depends exactly what Julian needs to link with statically - it=20 wasn't clear. When I build my own software 'statically' I tend to still=20= link to the system libraries dynamically. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 17:34:11 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90AAC16A420; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:34:11 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from julian@elischer.org) Received: from bigwoop.vicor-nb.com (bigwoop.vicor-nb.com [208.206.78.2]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4026143D5C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:34:11 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from julian@elischer.org) Received: from [208.206.78.97] (julian.vicor-nb.com [208.206.78.97]) by bigwoop.vicor-nb.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 222807A403; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 10:34:11 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <42ADC393.5080706@elischer.org> Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 10:34:11 -0700 From: Julian Elischer User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.7.7) Gecko/20050423 X-Accept-Language: en, hu MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Doug Rabson References: <864qc9mgqc.fsf@xps.des.no> <42A75303.2090203@elischer.org> <42A75591.7080502@elischer.org> <200506130849.26026.dfr@nlsystems.com> <86ll5eyzg0.fsf@xps.des.no> <8510490ff3a56e4ffcc127064b260caf@nlsystems.com> In-Reply-To: <8510490ff3a56e4ffcc127064b260caf@nlsystems.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=F8rgrav?= , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Retiring static libpam support X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:34:11 -0000 Doug Rabson wrote: > > On 13 Jun 2005, at 17:49, Dag-Erling Smørgrav wrote: > >> Doug Rabson writes: >> >>> You can link statically to some libraries and dynamically to others >>> - that might work quite well. You would probably end up linking >>> dynamically to libc otherwise you might get two copies of libc when >>> you load a pam module. >> >> >> That won't help. You'll still end up with two copies of *libpam*. > > > It depends exactly what Julian needs to link with statically - it > wasn't clear. When I build my own software 'statically' I tend to > still link to the system libraries dynamically. We tend to try build fully static binaries as that reduces the number of support calls we get due to mismatched libraries. the answer may be to staticaly link 90%.. i.e everything except libc or something similar. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 17:34:11 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90AAC16A420; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:34:11 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from julian@elischer.org) Received: from bigwoop.vicor-nb.com (bigwoop.vicor-nb.com [208.206.78.2]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4026143D5C; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:34:11 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from julian@elischer.org) Received: from [208.206.78.97] (julian.vicor-nb.com [208.206.78.97]) by bigwoop.vicor-nb.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 222807A403; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 10:34:11 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <42ADC393.5080706@elischer.org> Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 10:34:11 -0700 From: Julian Elischer User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.7.7) Gecko/20050423 X-Accept-Language: en, hu MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Doug Rabson References: <864qc9mgqc.fsf@xps.des.no> <42A75303.2090203@elischer.org> <42A75591.7080502@elischer.org> <200506130849.26026.dfr@nlsystems.com> <86ll5eyzg0.fsf@xps.des.no> <8510490ff3a56e4ffcc127064b260caf@nlsystems.com> In-Reply-To: <8510490ff3a56e4ffcc127064b260caf@nlsystems.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=F8rgrav?= , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org, arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Retiring static libpam support X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 17:34:11 -0000 Doug Rabson wrote: > > On 13 Jun 2005, at 17:49, Dag-Erling Smørgrav wrote: > >> Doug Rabson writes: >> >>> You can link statically to some libraries and dynamically to others >>> - that might work quite well. You would probably end up linking >>> dynamically to libc otherwise you might get two copies of libc when >>> you load a pam module. >> >> >> That won't help. You'll still end up with two copies of *libpam*. > > > It depends exactly what Julian needs to link with statically - it > wasn't clear. When I build my own software 'statically' I tend to > still link to the system libraries dynamically. We tend to try build fully static binaries as that reduces the number of support calls we get due to mismatched libraries. the answer may be to staticaly link 90%.. i.e everything except libc or something similar. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 19:36:47 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1E9516A41C for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 19:36:47 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jroberson@chesapeake.net) Received: from mail.chesapeake.net (chesapeake.net [208.142.252.6]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CA8E43D49 for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 19:36:47 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jroberson@chesapeake.net) Received: from mail.chesapeake.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.chesapeake.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j5DJajk9057541; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 15:36:45 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from jroberson@chesapeake.net) Received: from localhost (jroberson@localhost) by mail.chesapeake.net (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) with ESMTP id j5DJajjX057536; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 15:36:45 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from jroberson@chesapeake.net) X-Authentication-Warning: mail.chesapeake.net: jroberson owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 15:36:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Jeff Roberson To: Antoine Brodin In-Reply-To: <20050613132621.310a3deb.antoine.brodin@laposte.net> Message-ID: <20050613153625.N16943@mail.chesapeake.net> References: <20050608162637.U16943@mail.chesapeake.net> <20050613132621.310a3deb.antoine.brodin@laposte.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: simplify disksort, please review. X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 19:36:48 -0000 On Mon, 13 Jun 2005, Antoine Brodin wrote: > Jeff Roberson wrote: > > http://www.chesapeake.net/~jroberson/disksort.diff > > > > Our disksort algorithm used to be complicated by the BIO_ORDERED flag, > > which could cause us to make some exceptions in the sorting. When the > > ordered support was removed we never simplified the algorithm. The patch > > above gets rid of the switch point and associated logic. It's now a > > simple hinted insertion sort with a one way scan. Since it's a fairly > > central algorithm, I'd appreciate a review. > > Sorry for the late review, but there's perhaps a problem: You are correct. What do you think of this: 10# cvs diff -u subr_disk.c Index: subr_disk.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/kern/subr_disk.c,v retrieving revision 1.84 diff -u -r1.84 subr_disk.c --- subr_disk.c 12 Jun 2005 22:32:29 -0000 1.84 +++ subr_disk.c 13 Jun 2005 19:35:35 -0000 @@ -182,15 +182,12 @@ } } else bq = TAILQ_FIRST(&bioq->queue); - + if (bp->bio_offset < bq->bio_offset) { + TAILQ_INSERT_BEFORE(bq, bp, bio_queue); + return; + } /* Insertion sort */ while ((bn = TAILQ_NEXT(bq, bio_queue)) != NULL) { - - /* - * We want to go after the current request if it is the end - * of the first request list, or if the next request is a - * larger cylinder than our request. - */ if (bp->bio_offset < bn->bio_offset) break; bq = bn; > > If you have this situation: > > queue:------------ 5 - 6 - 7 > last_offset: 4 | > insert_point:------+ > > And you bioq_disksort a bio with an offset of 1: > > queue:------------ 5 - 1 - 6 - 7 > last_offset: 4 | > insert_point:------+ > > It looks weirdly sorted. > > IIRC, the previous algorithm gave: > > queue:------------ 5 - 6 - 7 - 1 > > Looking at revision 1.83, it looks like insert_point was useless, not > switch_point. > > I can't test this change since disksort doesn't seem to be used by > ata(4) anymore (is there any reason ?). > > Cheers, > > Antoine > From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 20:08:04 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 033BC16A439 for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 20:08:04 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from antoine@madhouse.dreadbsd.org) Received: from barton.dreadbsd.org (madhouse.dreadbsd.org [82.67.196.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 588FC43D4C for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 20:08:03 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from antoine@madhouse.dreadbsd.org) Received: from barton.dreadbsd.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by barton.dreadbsd.org (8.13.4/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j5DK7w0B051733; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 22:07:58 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from antoine@madhouse.dreadbsd.org) Received: (from antoine@localhost) by barton.dreadbsd.org (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id j5DK7vcD051732; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 22:07:57 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from antoine) Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 22:07:57 +0200 From: Antoine Brodin To: Jeff Roberson Message-Id: <20050613220757.1063996b.antoine.brodin@laposte.net> In-Reply-To: <20050613153625.N16943@mail.chesapeake.net> References: <20050608162637.U16943@mail.chesapeake.net> <20050613132621.310a3deb.antoine.brodin@laposte.net> <20050613153625.N16943@mail.chesapeake.net> X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 1.9.12 (GTK+ 2.6.7; i386-portbld-freebsd6.0) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: simplify disksort, please review. X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 20:08:04 -0000 Jeff Roberson wrote: > On Mon, 13 Jun 2005, Antoine Brodin wrote: > > > Jeff Roberson wrote: > > > http://www.chesapeake.net/~jroberson/disksort.diff > > > > > > Our disksort algorithm used to be complicated by the BIO_ORDERED flag, > > > which could cause us to make some exceptions in the sorting. When the > > > ordered support was removed we never simplified the algorithm. The patch > > > above gets rid of the switch point and associated logic. It's now a > > > simple hinted insertion sort with a one way scan. Since it's a fairly > > > central algorithm, I'd appreciate a review. > > > > Sorry for the late review, but there's perhaps a problem: > > You are correct. What do you think of this: > > 10# cvs diff -u subr_disk.c > Index: subr_disk.c > =================================================================== > RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/sys/kern/subr_disk.c,v > retrieving revision 1.84 > diff -u -r1.84 subr_disk.c > --- subr_disk.c 12 Jun 2005 22:32:29 -0000 1.84 > +++ subr_disk.c 13 Jun 2005 19:35:35 -0000 > @@ -182,15 +182,12 @@ > } > } else > bq = TAILQ_FIRST(&bioq->queue); > - > + if (bp->bio_offset < bq->bio_offset) { > + TAILQ_INSERT_BEFORE(bq, bp, bio_queue); > + return; > + } > /* Insertion sort */ > while ((bn = TAILQ_NEXT(bq, bio_queue)) != NULL) { > - > - /* > - * We want to go after the current request if it is the > end > - * of the first request list, or if the next request is a > - * larger cylinder than our request. > - */ > if (bp->bio_offset < bn->bio_offset) > break; > bq = bn; This looks good. I think bioq_first and bioq_takefirst should be modified to take head->insert_point instead of TAILQ_FIRST(&head->queue). bioq_insert_head and bioq_insert_tail should perhaps be modified when they're called from outside of subr_disk.c too, to insert just before insert_point and replace it in the head case... but this probably affects sorting of later bios... Cheers, Antoine From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jun 13 20:11:18 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D5BC16A41C for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 20:11:18 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from pasmtp.tele.dk (pasmtp.tele.dk [193.162.159.95]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38D2D43D4C for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 20:11:18 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (0x535c0e2a.sgnxx1.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk [83.92.14.42]) by pasmtp.tele.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id A93D21EC32B for ; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 22:11:12 +0200 (CEST) Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.freebsd.dk (8.13.4/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j5DKB3Sk014712; Mon, 13 Jun 2005 22:11:03 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) To: Antoine Brodin From: "Poul-Henning Kamp" In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 13 Jun 2005 22:07:57 +0200." <20050613220757.1063996b.antoine.brodin@laposte.net> Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 22:11:03 +0200 Message-ID: <14711.1118693463@critter.freebsd.dk> Sender: phk@critter.freebsd.dk Cc: arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: simplify disksort, please review. X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 13 Jun 2005 20:11:18 -0000 In message <20050613220757.1063996b.antoine.brodin@laposte.net>, Antoine Brodin writes: >bioq_insert_head and bioq_insert_tail should perhaps be modified when >they're called from outside of subr_disk.c too, to insert just before >insert_point and replace it in the head case... but this probably >affects sorting of later bios... I think that would be a pointless complication of the code... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jun 14 11:33:03 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5508216A41C for ; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 11:33:03 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from howardsue@gmail.com) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.192]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C70E43D1D for ; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 11:33:02 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from howardsue@gmail.com) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 67so153345wri for ; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 04:33:02 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=d8EushZ1OH/zppXQntm42TG8LVECsyfbxrFY8r6TkCnPW8cf52G17SJIqR1YWXAL+Jw0PmWXRX+dgt+Dt1vmgFWiBcoF7w5Yzxe+ukOzJNOkLToNfvygh7+iVU1qvF6ZIpa8gs4/6seog25KdXmFfgGjXNLubSY04f6lOqHLalI= Received: by 10.54.57.2 with SMTP id f2mr2867242wra; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 04:33:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.54.124.4 with HTTP; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 04:33:01 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1e89cd510506140433437f7b7@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 19:33:01 +0800 From: Sue Howard To: arch@freebsd.org, ken@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Cc: Subject: [DCR] Remove devstat X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sue Howard List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 11:33:03 -0000 Hi, I found devstat is not widely used in the device drivers. Based the grep result of 'devstat_new_entry', it shows only cam, ata, fd, geom_disk are using it. In my workstation, the output of 'sysctl kern.devstat' shows: kern.devstat.version: 6 kern.devstat.generation: 229 kern.devstat.numdevs: 2 I am wondering if devstat can be replaced by the sysctl nodes %desc, %pnpinfo etc that jhb introduced. Almost all the information devstat can provide can be also exposed by such sysctl node. I have plan to introduce a new node named status so that userland can disable on individual device. Before that, I want to understand some related stuffs. Any comments about this? Howard Sue From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jun 14 11:44:08 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B53116A41C; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 11:44:08 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from pasmtp.tele.dk (pasmtp.tele.dk [193.162.159.95]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E57C543D1D; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 11:44:07 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (0x535c0e2a.sgnxx1.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk [83.92.14.42]) by pasmtp.tele.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E5A91EC35D; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 13:44:06 +0200 (CEST) Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.freebsd.dk (8.13.4/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j5EBi2St036766; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 13:44:03 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) To: Sue Howard From: "Poul-Henning Kamp" In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 14 Jun 2005 19:33:01 +0800." <1e89cd510506140433437f7b7@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 13:44:02 +0200 Message-ID: <36765.1118749442@critter.freebsd.dk> Sender: phk@critter.freebsd.dk Cc: arch@freebsd.org, ken@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [DCR] Remove devstat X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 11:44:08 -0000 In message <1e89cd510506140433437f7b7@mail.gmail.com>, Sue Howard writes: >Hi, > >I found devstat is not widely used in the device drivers. Based the >grep result of 'devstat_new_entry', it shows only cam, ata, fd, >geom_disk are using it. In my workstation, the output of 'sysctl >kern.devstat' shows: >I am wondering if devstat can be replaced by the sysctl nodes %desc, >%pnpinfo etc that jhb introduced. Almost all the information devstat >can provide can be also exposed by such sysctl node. Uhm, are we confused here ? Devstat is what is used for collecting transaction statistics for disks and scsi general devices in general. Programs like iostat and gstat uses it. The old access path (iostat) uses sysctls, but the new and practically overhead free access path is mmap(2) which gstat uses. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jun 14 12:30:59 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8564D16A41C for ; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 12:30:59 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from howardsue@gmail.com) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.197]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34B0443D55 for ; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 12:30:59 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from howardsue@gmail.com) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 67so163873wri for ; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 05:30:58 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=qmpNrUzL18gM4LvGc+GShK5pgO+/iGAhhyP0guvnUjxFskTzZixF6tzqsOwKj0xDG0tkeIJgixXGtSmyB7eifRsI7N7Uk/1PX64YmnkSIzMThHTOUu6FZZklyxce8aVqt9I+yaL+86smHMPGhRX8blTyRhNA+6fvSj2xCZvXZKU= Received: by 10.54.25.52 with SMTP id 52mr3431722wry; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 05:30:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.54.124.4 with HTTP; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 05:30:58 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1e89cd51050614053073cd94cd@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 20:30:58 +0800 From: Sue Howard To: arch@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <1e89cd51050614050373dca5af@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline References: <1e89cd510506140433437f7b7@mail.gmail.com> <36765.1118749442@critter.freebsd.dk> <1e89cd51050614050373dca5af@mail.gmail.com> Cc: Subject: Fwd: [DCR] Remove devstat X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sue Howard List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 12:30:59 -0000 2005/6/14, Poul-Henning Kamp : > In message <1e89cd510506140433437f7b7@mail.gmail.com>, Sue Howard writes: > >Hi, > > > >I found devstat is not widely used in the device drivers. Based the > >grep result of 'devstat_new_entry', it shows only cam, ata, fd, > >geom_disk are using it. In my workstation, the output of 'sysctl > >kern.devstat' shows: > > >I am wondering if devstat can be replaced by the sysctl nodes %desc, > >%pnpinfo etc that jhb introduced. Almost all the information devstat > >can provide can be also exposed by such sysctl node. > > Uhm, are we confused here ? > > Devstat is what is used for collecting transaction statistics for > disks and scsi general devices in general. > > Programs like iostat and gstat uses it. > > The old access path (iostat) uses sysctls, but the new and practically > overhead free access path is mmap(2) which gstat uses. I am confused because, in the devstat.h file, it defines an enum devstat_type_flags that I am interested in. This enum defines the devices type(catalog). I think this type should be a general property of a device driver. So I think devstat is a general framework to collect all types of the information related to a device. Anyway, since devicestat is only used for collect statistics, I'd like to remove the this type from the devstat. And we can implement this type into devclass(device_t?? maybe). This is what I proposed. It will bring some benifits like remove the long regex to match NIC interface in devd.conf, etc. Howard From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jun 14 13:55:07 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC6E016A41C for ; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 13:55:07 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from pasmtp.tele.dk (pasmtp.tele.dk [193.162.159.95]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2E9E43D53 for ; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 13:55:05 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (0x535c0e2a.sgnxx1.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk [83.92.14.42]) by pasmtp.tele.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA1001EC35E for ; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 15:55:03 +0200 (CEST) Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by critter.freebsd.dk (8.13.4/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j5EDssg6037088; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 15:54:56 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) To: Sue Howard From: "Poul-Henning Kamp" In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 14 Jun 2005 20:30:58 +0800." <1e89cd51050614053073cd94cd@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 15:54:54 +0200 Message-ID: <37087.1118757294@critter.freebsd.dk> Sender: phk@critter.freebsd.dk Cc: arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Fwd: [DCR] Remove devstat X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 13:55:08 -0000 In message <1e89cd51050614053073cd94cd@mail.gmail.com>, Sue Howard writes: >2005/6/14, Poul-Henning Kamp : >I am confused because, in the devstat.h file, it defines an enum >devstat_type_flags that I am interested in. This is a muddled area. We also have 4 type bits in the cdevsw. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jun 15 02:37:32 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FD6C16A41C; Wed, 15 Jun 2005 02:37:32 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from gad@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp2.server.rpi.edu (smtp2.server.rpi.edu [128.113.2.2]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD97A43D1F; Wed, 15 Jun 2005 02:37:31 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from gad@FreeBSD.org) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.netel.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by smtp2.server.rpi.edu (8.13.0/8.13.0) with ESMTP id j5F2bTeB010545; Tue, 14 Jun 2005 22:37:30 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 22:37:28 -0400 To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.org From: Garance A Drosehn Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-CanItPRO-Stream: default X-RPI-SA-Score: undef - spam-scanning disabled X-Scanned-By: CanIt (www . canit . ca) on 128.113.2.2 Cc: Subject: Re: Changes to `env' command - Bug in #! processing... X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 02:37:32 -0000 Amusingly enough, I had originally posted this as "Changes to the `arg' command". That might be a very popular command, if implemented right. Anyway, an update on proposed changes to `env': At 3:37 PM -0400 6/10/05, Garance A Drosehn wrote: >As most people are probably tired of hearing, I recently changed >the way the kernel parses #!-lines in shell scripts. > >I now propose to re-implement that flexibility (and more!) via some >changes to the `env' command. The changes add three new (non-standard) >options to `env'. > >I'd like to commit these changes to 6.0, and they should also be fine >to MFC to 5.x. They do not depend on the change in kernel-parsing > >The three new options are: > -v -- Turns up a verbosity setting, useful for seeing > what `env' is doing. Particularly useful for > debugging the following options. > -S string -- "split string on spaces". The idea is to take > a single string, split it into separate arguments, > and then process those arguments. This supports > single-quoted strings, double-quoted strings, and > a few other features that the previous parsing > code was never going to support. > -P altpath -- specify a path list to use when searching for the > 'utility' (program to execute). `env' does the > search itself, without checking or changing the > present value of PATH. This was implemented by > copying a few routines from the `which' command. > >Note that due to the parsing-change in 6.0, the -P option is >pretty much worthless for scripts in 6.0 without the -S option. > >These options would then let you have a script start with: > > #!/usr/bin/env -S /usr/local/bin/php -n -q -dsafe_mode=0 > >which would work exactly the way that: > > #!/usr/local/bin/php -n -q -dsafe_mode=0 > >does in 5.x-stable. They would also let you have a script which >starts with: > > #!/usr/bin/env -S -P/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin perl > >and the script will execute /usr/local/bin/perl or /usr/bin/perl, >without caring about the present setting for PATH=, and without >changing what value the script will see for PATH= when it executes. I have worked on it some more, and the -S processing now also supports ${SOMEVAR} references. The ${}-format is required, and all it supports is environment variables. This gives users even more flexibility that they did not have with the previous kernel- parsing of options. I also wrote up some regression tests for all these changes. Right now I have 27 tests, but I intend to have several more by the time I'm ready to commit it. >The actual update is presently over 300 lines, so I'll just >include a pointer to it: >http://people.freebsd.org/~gad/env-rel6.diff The update is now 486 lines, and has moved to: http://people.freebsd.org/~gad/env/env-rel6.diff The resulting source file is also available at: http://people.freebsd.org/~gad/env/env.c Scream now, or, well, scream later... -- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@gilead.netel.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or gad@FreeBSD.org Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute; Troy, NY; USA From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jun 15 21:44:12 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2E2D16A41C; Wed, 15 Jun 2005 21:44:12 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jhb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from mv.twc.weather.com (mv.twc.weather.com [65.212.71.225]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 558C243D49; Wed, 15 Jun 2005 21:44:12 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jhb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from [10.50.41.231] (Not Verified[216.133.140.1]) by mv.twc.weather.com with NetIQ MailMarshal (v6, 0, 3, 8) id ; Wed, 15 Jun 2005 17:57:35 -0400 From: John Baldwin To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 16:55:52 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.8 References: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> In-Reply-To: <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200506151655.52894.jhb@FreeBSD.org> Cc: Subject: Re: Death to toor X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 21:44:13 -0000 On Saturday 11 June 2005 10:54 pm, David O'Brien wrote: > On Thu, Jun 09, 2005 at 04:40:19PM -0700, John Baldwin wrote: > > Is there any good reason to keep the toor account around nowadays? > > Yes. Some of us use it. Well, that's why I asked. > > vipw has existed since 4.0BSD and chsh and friends have existed since > > 4.3BSD-Reno so I think that it's safe to say that folks are more than > > capable nowadays of changing root's default shell if desired. > > I wouldn't say we are totally safe changing root's default shell away > from /bin/csh. We still see people give the advice that one should not > change root's default shell. I never mentioned that FreeBSD would change root's default shell. All I said is that people have had tools available to them to easily change root's shell on their boxes since at least the early 1990s if they don't want to use /bin/csh on a particular box. Stop putting words in my mouth please. > > Also, > > '/bin/csh' and '/bin/sh' aren't very hard to type once you are logged > > in as root whatever the default shell may be. > > We could default to only /bin/sh as the login shell globally. > 'csh', 'zsh', 'bash' aren't very hard to type once you are logged in. *sigh* EOFFINWEEDS. To twist this another way, when we create user accounts with adduser, we don't add 4 different variations of every user account so that everyone can pick a different user name to get sh, csh, zsh, or bash for their shell. The fact that we do this for root and no one else is inconsistent. The fact that it uses UID 0 also means that it's always showing up in people's security run checks as a non-root user with a UID of 0. Maybe that security check should be dumped instead. Also, note that according to the FAQ, toor exists for bash support, not /bin/sh and apparently used to be installed by the bash port as part of its install. CVS says it has been around since 386BSD though, so I'm guessing that it wasn't ever a feature of the bash port per se, but maybe bash's own install scripts. -- John Baldwin <>< http://www.FreeBSD.org/~jhb/ "Power Users Use the Power to Serve" = http://www.FreeBSD.org From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jun 16 00:59:30 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E1D316A41C; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 00:59:30 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: from dragon.NUXI.org (trang.nuxi.com [66.93.134.19]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DED9443D53; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 00:59:29 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from obrien@NUXI.com) Received: from dragon.NUXI.org (obrien@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dragon.NUXI.org (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j5G0xTgc011945; Wed, 15 Jun 2005 17:59:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien@dragon.NUXI.org) Received: (from obrien@localhost) by dragon.NUXI.org (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id j5G0xTgW011944; Wed, 15 Jun 2005 17:59:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from obrien) Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 17:59:29 -0700 From: "David O'Brien" To: John Baldwin Message-ID: <20050616005929.GB6841@dragon.NUXI.org> Mail-Followup-To: obrien@freebsd.org, John Baldwin , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org References: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> <200506151655.52894.jhb@FreeBSD.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200506151655.52894.jhb@FreeBSD.org> X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 6.0-CURRENT Organization: The NUXI BSD Group X-Pgp-Rsa-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Rsa-Keyid: 1024/34F9F9D5 User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i Cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Death to toor X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: obrien@FreeBSD.org List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 16 Jun 2005 00:59:30 -0000 On Wed, Jun 15, 2005 at 04:55:52PM -0400, John Baldwin wrote: > Also, note that according to the FAQ, toor exists for bash support, > not /bin/sh and apparently used to be installed by the bash port as part of > its install. CVS says it has been around since 386BSD though, so I'm > guessing that it wasn't ever a feature of the bash port per se, but maybe > bash's own install scripts. The FAQ is wrong. 'toor' is in the earliest CSRG master.passwd in Kirk McKusick's SCCS archive (5.1 bostic 25-Jan-88). Its original form was: root::0:10:Charlie &:/:/bin/csh toor::0:10:Bourne-again Superuser:/: -- -- David (obrien@FreeBSD.org) From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jun 16 01:06:29 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 664) id 688F216A41F; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 01:06:29 +0000 (GMT) Date: Thu, 16 Jun 2005 01:06:29 +0000 From: David O'Brien To: John Baldwin Message-ID: <20050616010629.GA3554@hub.freebsd.org> References: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> <200506151655.52894.jhb@FreeBSD.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200506151655.52894.jhb@FreeBSD.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.11-STABLE Organization: The NUXI BSD group X-Pgp-Rsa-Fingerprint: B7 4D 3E E9 11 39 5F A3 90 76 5D 69 58 D9 98 7A X-Pgp-Rsa-Keyid: 1024/34F9F9D5 Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Death to toor X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: obrien@freebsd.org List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 16 Jun 2005 01:06:29 -0000 On Wed, Jun 15, 2005 at 04:55:52PM -0400, John Baldwin wrote: > On Saturday 11 June 2005 10:54 pm, David O'Brien wrote: > > On Thu, Jun 09, 2005 at 04:40:19PM -0700, John Baldwin wrote: > > > Is there any good reason to keep the toor account around nowadays? > > > > Yes. Some of us use it. > > Well, that's why I asked. > > > > vipw has existed since 4.0BSD and chsh and friends have existed since > > > 4.3BSD-Reno so I think that it's safe to say that folks are more than > > > capable nowadays of changing root's default shell if desired. > > > > I wouldn't say we are totally safe changing root's default shell away > > from /bin/csh. We still see people give the advice that one should not > > change root's default shell. > > I never mentioned that FreeBSD would change root's default shell. All I said > is that people have had tools available to them to easily change root's shell > on their boxes since at least the early 1990s if they don't want to > use /bin/csh on a particular box. Stop putting words in my mouth please. Please, stop putting words in my mouth. You said toor wasn't needed because people can change the root shell. No where did I say the FreeBSD stock default shell should be changed. I'm saying there are reasons one wants to keep the root shell identical to that what comes from the vendor. -- -- David (obrien@FreeBSD.org) From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jun 16 12:01:52 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 019D516A491; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 12:01:52 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from tim.des.no (tim.des.no [194.63.250.121]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FAB943D5D; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 12:01:51 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from tim.des.no (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spam.des.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5322D60FB; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 14:01:46 +0200 (CEST) Received: from xps.des.no (des.no [80.203.228.37]) by tim.des.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4089D60FA; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 14:01:46 +0200 (CEST) Received: by xps.des.no (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 29F3933C52; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 14:01:46 +0200 (CEST) To: obrien@freebsd.org References: <53d4293a37f280317d52338c2fc6fc6d@FreeBSD.org> <20050612025402.GD67746@dragon.NUXI.org> <200506151655.52894.jhb@FreeBSD.org> <20050616005929.GB6841@dragon.NUXI.org> From: des@des.no (=?iso-8859-1?q?Dag-Erling_Sm=F8rgrav?=) Date: Thu, 16 Jun 2005 14:01:46 +0200 In-Reply-To: <20050616005929.GB6841@dragon.NUXI.org> (David O'Brien's message of "Wed, 15 Jun 2005 17:59:29 -0700") Message-ID: <86ekb25x3p.fsf@xps.des.no> User-Agent: Gnus/5.110002 (No Gnus v0.2) Emacs/21.3 (berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Learn: ham X-Spam-Score: -5.2/5.0 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.2 (2004-11-16) on tim.des.no Cc: John Baldwin , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Death to toor X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 16 Jun 2005 12:01:52 -0000 "David O'Brien" writes: > On Wed, Jun 15, 2005 at 04:55:52PM -0400, John Baldwin wrote: > > Also, note that according to the FAQ, toor exists for bash support [...] > The FAQ is wrong. > > 'toor' is in the earliest CSRG master.passwd in Kirk McKusick's SCCS > archive (5.1 bostic 25-Jan-88). Its original form was: > root::0:10:Charlie &:/:/bin/csh > toor::0:10:Bourne-again Superuser:/: "bourne-again" is precisely what the "ba" in "bash" means. As far as I can determine, bash dates back to at least 1987, so it is not at all unlikely that it was in widespread use at the CSRG in 1988. DES --=20 Dag-Erling Sm=F8rgrav - des@des.no From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jun 16 13:22:57 2005 Return-Path: X-Original-To: arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E3DD16A41C for ; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 13:22:57 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from howardsue@gmail.com) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.204]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA10643D48 for ; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 13:22:56 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from howardsue@gmail.com) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so288555wri for ; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 06:22:56 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=nk3euspW0LqiuP2AIgwBgVSpCyhDsV7mOqsp2XIeF+fjp9PrUE+BZaz7opRX4NbATVoW1LlLnz+W+DkAXvZBQ6nnOqfuilxLmnq8G5vJ4lGjZzAiPQ7yemQFXhgL/tBN+B/ZtHD6WMa4SY8pBR4zcNOMfIs1DUP2QDl/emBPWps= Received: by 10.54.53.15 with SMTP id b15mr463608wra; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 06:22:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.54.124.4 with HTTP; Thu, 16 Jun 2005 06:22:56 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1e89cd51050616062241e9e201@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 16 Jun 2005 21:22:56 +0800 From: Sue Howard To: arch@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Cc: Subject: Kernel Dump X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sue Howard List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 16 Jun 2005 13:22:57 -0000 Hi, I find there are three states of kernel dump support currently. 1. ARM and PowerPC.=20 Not supported yet. 2. I386, AMD64, Alpha.=20 The dump file contains dump header plus the raw physical memory image. The code in dump_machdep.c is almost same. 3. IA64, SPARC The dump file has private header besides dump header and raw physical memory image. The code is ready for importing a MI dump interface. I want to understand what IA64 and SPARC are different than i386. What is the private header is for? Is it tech problem or historic problem? Is it possible to remove the private header in order to make IA64 and SPARC share the dump code of i386? In my understanding, it should be possible. Since /dev/mem should be a physic memory image. Howard