From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 00:23:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA18688 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 00:23:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA18682 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 00:23:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA00942; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 00:23:17 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608110723.AAA00942@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: kern_mib.c:int securelevel = -1; In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 11 Aug 1996 08:50:10 +0200." <199608110650.IAA04874@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 00:23:16 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >From The Desk Of J Wunsch : > Alas, this would require to move many chipset-specific hacks into the > kernel, something that doesn't fit in the current model. It's really Yes, it would reguire a bit of work and thats about it . Specially, since the X server already knows the chipset and can pass the information to the driver. Personally, I rather leave things the way they are and if not I can always hack it back to my preference.. Regards, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 03:49:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA04663 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 03:49:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from oyoyo.cs.titech.ac.jp (oyoyo.cs.titech.ac.jp [131.112.18.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA04646 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 03:49:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: by oyoyo.cs.titech.ac.jp (8.6.12+2.4W/3.2W-titmx-2.0g); Sun, 11 Aug 1996 19:49:17 +0900 Message-Id: <199608111049.TAA14107@oyoyo.cs.titech.ac.jp> To: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (Andrey A. Chernov) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, hidekazu@cs.titech.ac.jp Subject: Re: Wrong locale(japanese) ?? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Aug 1996 19:08:59 +0400." <199608091509.TAA00432@nagual.ru> Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 19:49:16 +0900 From: Hidekazu Kuroki Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199608091509.TAA00432@nagual.ru>, =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (Andrey A. Chernov) wrote: > > > When the LANG variable is "ja_JP.EUC", this program return "error!". > > > > But the LANG varieble is other(except "ja*" or "Ja*"), return > > > > "success!". > > > > Why ? > > > > Is the /usr/share/locale/ja_JP.EUC/LC_CTYPE file wrong ? > > EUC encoding not supported unless you specify -lxpg4 > There is no known proper way yet to support EUC in userland programs. > Very thanks!! That program compiled with -lxpg4 return "success", when LANG = "ja_JP.EUC". But, why the EUC encoding isn't supported in the library libc ?? All programs which use a setlocale function without the -lxpg4 link option will cause Error "Cannot set locale.". Do FreeBSD "japanese" packages which need to link a shared libc library or ports without the -lxpg4 link option cause any problem ?? > Andrey A. Chernov > > http://www.nagual.ru/~ache/ > \\\\\\ ( @ @ ) /-------------------oOOo---(_)---oOOo-------------------\ | | | Tokyo Institute of Technology | | Department of Science and Engneering Lab. Yonezaki | | Hidekazu Kuroki (E-Mail : hidekazu@cs.titech.ac.jp) | | .oooO Oooo. | \_____________________( )___( )_____________________/ \ ( ) / \_) (_/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 05:47:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id FAA11458 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 05:47:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [193.125.152.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA11453 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 05:47:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA00537 (5.65.kiae-1 ); Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:45:05 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Sun, 11 Aug 96 15:45:05 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by nagual.ru (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA01124; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 16:40:30 +0400 (MSD) Message-Id: <199608111240.QAA01124@nagual.ru> Subject: Re: Wrong locale(japanese) ?? In-Reply-To: <199608111049.TAA14107@oyoyo.cs.titech.ac.jp> from "Hidekazu Kuroki" at "Aug 11, 96 07:49:16 pm" X-Elm-Osv: (Our standard violations) no-hdr-encoding=1 To: hidekazu@cs.titech.ac.jp (Hidekazu Kuroki) Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 16:40:30 +0400 (MSD) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, hidekazu@cs.titech.ac.jp From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (Andrey A. Chernov) Organization: self X-Class: Fast X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL23 (25)] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Very thanks!! > > That program compiled with -lxpg4 return "success", when LANG = > "ja_JP.EUC". > > > But, why the EUC encoding isn't supported in the library libc ?? Because there is too many places where assumed that characters are one byte width. 99.9% character-oriented functions cant't work with EUC encoding now. -- Andrey A. Chernov http://www.nagual.ru/~ache/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 08:50:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA19139 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 08:50:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA19114 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 08:50:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA01482; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 17:49:35 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id RAA01079; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 17:49:26 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id RAA18506; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 17:48:19 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608111548.RAA18506@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 17:48:19 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Subject: Weird pty problem X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, A strange problem reappeared today. After some time, I can't launch any command that use /dev/[pt]ty8. Only this one is affected but it of course prevent any new tty to be open since /dev/ttyp8 appears free but no process can attach to it. I have icons to launch an xterm that runs Trn or Elm and each time the window appears and disappears. I've tried to ktrace the xterm and its children but I don't understand why this fails. I now have the following xterm in background. It enables me to open new ptys but eats a lot of CPU... 18477 p5 R 3:01.18 xterm -e sleep 10000000 It has taken over /dev/ttyp8 but as soon as the sleep ends, it will be "free" again. pstat -t shows that 64 pty lines LINE RAW CAN OUT HWT LWT COL STATE SESS PGID DISC ttyp0 0 0 0 1296 256 0 OCc ef2c00 11999 term ttyp1 0 0 0 1296 256 0 OCc ef2bc0 12000 term ttyp2 0 0 0 1296 256 0 OCc de12c0 12001 term ttyp3 0 0 0 1296 256 0 OCc 0 0 term ttyp4 0 0 0 1296 256 0 OCc ef2a00 18503 term ttyp5 0 0 0 1296 256 729 OCc de1280 18486 term ttyp6 0 0 0 1296 256 107 OCc ef2a80 12047 term ttyp7 0 0 0 1296 256 42 OCc ef2f00 12089 term ttyp8 0 0 0 1296 256 108 OCZ de1580 12923 term ttyp9 0 0 0 1296 256 0 - 0 0 term ttypa 0 0 0 1296 256 0 - 0 0 term Anyone with an idea about what's going on ? (Bruce ?) CURRENT sources from Aug, 2nd. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 11:21:13 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA01308 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 11:21:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA01296 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 11:21:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (RBI-Z-5/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA01250 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:16:34 +0200 Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA28665 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:29:40 +0200 Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:29:40 +0200 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199608111829.UAA28665@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: SNAP 0801 woes Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I tried to install via NFS in my local network. Said 192.168.0.1:/usr/tmp in the NFS entry, then chose ed0 filled in the IP fields, but host name and IP address only (no domain, no nameserver or gatyeway) came back intp the 'Network interface Information required' window and saw Fatal signal 11 caught! I'm dead.. in the [OK] field (overwritten). That's weird. --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 11:26:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA02088 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 11:26:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.177]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA02073; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 11:26:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA08138; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:26:07 +0200 (MET DST) To: "Christoph P. Kukulies" cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: SNAP 0801 woes In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:29:40 +0200." <199608111829.UAA28665@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:26:06 +0200 Message-ID: <8136.839787966@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199608111829.UAA28665@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de>, "Christoph P >(no domain, no nameserver or gatyeway) >came back intp the 'Network interface Information required' >window and saw >Fatal signal 11 caught! I'm dead.. > >in the [OK] field (overwritten). Fill in name server with any ip# and email jkh when you have found the bug in the source :-) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 11:37:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA03655 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 11:37:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA03648 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 11:37:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA07813; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 11:36:02 -0700 (PDT) To: "Christoph P. Kukulies" cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: SNAP 0801 woes In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:29:40 +0200." <199608111829.UAA28665@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 11:36:02 -0700 Message-ID: <7811.839788562@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk You need to enter the nameserver value - this has been discussed quite a bit over the last week. Jordan > I tried to install via NFS in my local network. > Said 192.168.0.1:/usr/tmp in the NFS entry, > then chose ed0 > filled in the IP fields, but host name and IP address only > (no domain, no nameserver or gatyeway) > came back intp the 'Network interface Information required' > window and saw > > Fatal signal 11 caught! I'm dead.. > > in the [OK] field (overwritten). > > That's weird. > > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 14:38:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA14388 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 14:38:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA14383 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 14:38:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id HAA11914; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 07:31:12 +1000 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 07:31:12 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608112131.HAA11914@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, roberto@keltia.freenix.fr Subject: Re: Weird pty problem Cc: bde@zeta.org.au Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I now have the following xterm in background. It enables me to open new >ptys but eats a lot of CPU... >18477 p5 R 3:01.18 xterm -e sleep 10000000 >It has taken over /dev/ttyp8 but as soon as the sleep ends, it will be >"free" again. pstat -t shows that >64 pty lines > LINE RAW CAN OUT HWT LWT COL STATE SESS PGID DISC > ttyp0 0 0 0 1296 256 0 OCc ef2c00 11999 term > ... > ttyp8 0 0 0 1296 256 108 OCZ de1580 12923 term Is this part of the problem or the solution? The state OCZ can't happen :-) (Z implies !C). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 15:07:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA15492 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:07:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ctasim.com (ctasim.com [206.6.123.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA15487 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:07:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by deepthought.ctasim.com (940816.SGI.8.6.9/920502.SGI.AUTO) id PAA01632; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:21:41 -0600 From: jon@ctasim.com ("Jon Doran" ) Message-Id: <9608111521.ZM1630@deepthought.ctasim.com> Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:21:38 -0600 In-Reply-To: "Marc G. Fournier" "ISDN Recommendations Requested..." (Aug 10, 1:06am) References: X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.0 26oct94 MediaMail) To: "Marc G. Fournier" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I recommend the Ascend Pipeline 25, for about $1000 you can get one with IP routing. Not only does it support a boatload of switch types, but there are no software changes to make. Plug it into a hub and your entire network has access to the remote network. I've been doing this for about a year now with no headaches. Jon Doran From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 15:32:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA16516 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:32:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA16510 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:32:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA02689; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:31:22 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608112231.PAA02689@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: jon@ctasim.com ("Jon Doran" ) cc: "Marc G. Fournier" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested... In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:21:38 MDT." <9608111521.ZM1630@deepthought.ctasim.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:31:21 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk My Ascend Pipeline 50 has been giving headaches lately . 1. It seems that heavy UDP traffic seems to clobber Ascend routers. For instance, mbone traffic . The problem was reported to Ascend and it looks like that they are having buffer management problems . The problem has been alleviated with the latest software release however it is still there with less frequency. 2. On my Ascend Pipeline 50 if I connect a second machine to my network it kills my Ascend Pipeline 50 . I have the single user license model however it should route my packets given that I am talking to the router via one ethernet interface. About a year ago , I asked Ascend if this would work and they said "Yes". Overall, it is a good router and has serve me well for over a year. I am waiting for Whistle.com to release their FreeBSD router which in my opinion is a more suitable router at least for my environment since it can handle mail / ftp / http , etc... Regards, Amancio >From The Desk Of "Jon Doran" : > I recommend the Ascend Pipeline 25, for about $1000 you can get one with > IP routing. Not only does it support a boatload of switch types, but there > are no software changes to make. Plug it into a hub and your entire network > has access to the remote network. > > I've been doing this for about a year now with no headaches. > > Jon Doran > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 15:57:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA17540 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:57:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ctasim.com (ctasim.com [206.6.123.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA17535 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 15:57:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: by deepthought.ctasim.com (940816.SGI.8.6.9/920502.SGI.AUTO) id QAA02001; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 16:53:47 -0600 From: jon@ctasim.com ("Jon Doran" ) Message-Id: <9608111653.ZM1999@deepthought.ctasim.com> Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 16:53:42 -0600 In-Reply-To: Amancio Hasty "Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested..." (Aug 11, 3:31pm) References: <199608112231.PAA02689@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.0 26oct94 MediaMail) To: Amancio Hasty Subject: Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested... Cc: "Marc G. Fournier" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm sorry to hear about Amancio's problems with his 50, but to reiterate, we've been moving large amounts of data over our 25's. If you have the HX version there may be problems, since they assume there is only one machine on the remote end. We have the old 25 (no Px or Fx) and are happily running with about 70 machines on the local network. Unfortunately they have replaced the unit, and the 50's are the way to go. Although... if you are running a firewall the 25Px may work, given that you limit the number of bastion hosts to 4 :-) Jon Doran From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 17:32:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA21271 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 17:32:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA21266 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 17:32:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA00327; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 17:32:13 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608120032.RAA00327@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: jon@ctasim.com ("Jon Doran" ) cc: "Marc G. Fournier" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested... In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 11 Aug 1996 16:53:42 MDT." <9608111653.ZM1999@deepthought.ctasim.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 17:32:13 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >From The Desk Of "Jon Doran" : > I'm sorry to hear about Amancio's problems with his 50, but to reiterate, we' ve > been moving large amounts of data over our 25's. If you have the HX version Well, I send again today a problem report to Ascend and since I think that they are going to support ip multicast on their routers -- they should be more knowledgable about the nature of my problems . I would say that we have to generate a poll so far it looks like the 25's are okay however the Pipeline 50 and the old Pipeline 400 are not reliable with heavy mbone traffic -- whatever that means at 128kbits/sec.. For short talks with Ascend, it seems that they treat udp different than tcp so if you want to crash the Pipelines just send lots of UDP packets thru the routers that is send/receive. Cheers, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 18:52:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA23825 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 18:52:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA23820 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 18:52:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA13535; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:38:13 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608120208.LAA13535@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Building ports and packages? To: karl@mcs.net (Karl Denninger) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:38:13 +0930 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199608110009.TAA05352@Jupiter.mcs.net> from "Karl Denninger" at Aug 10, 96 07:09:07 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Karl Denninger stands accused of saying: > > I have the ports SUP tree here. LOTS of them don't build properly. > > Also, the "package" target appears not to work either. > > Anyone have the proper procedure for a complete ports build under -CURRENT > handy? They should all work. Certainly I build both ports and packages on -current with no drama at all. Is the -current system you're working with a -SNAP virgin install, or did you upgrade over an older (2.0.5, 2.1 etc.) release? Is there a pattern to these failures? Satoshi (ports-meister) builds them on -current regularly as a verification. From whence are you supping them? > Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 19:28:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA25064 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 19:28:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cs.utexas.edu (root@mail.cs.utexas.edu [128.83.139.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA25056 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 19:27:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from babyhuey.cs.utexas.edu (miker@babyhuey.cs.utexas.edu [128.83.143.201]) by mail.cs.utexas.edu (8.7.1/8.7.1) with ESMTP id VAA26885; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 21:27:54 -0500 (CDT) From: Hung Michael Nguyen Received: by babyhuey.cs.utexas.edu (8.7.1/Client-1.4) id VAA09580; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 21:27:53 -0500 Message-Id: <199608120227.VAA09580@babyhuey.cs.utexas.edu> Subject: Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested... To: jon@ctasim.com (Jon Doran) Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 21:27:52 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9608111521.ZM1630@deepthought.ctasim.com> from "Jon Doran" at Aug 11, 96 03:21:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I recommend the Ascend Pipeline 25, for about $1000 you can get one with > IP routing. Not only does it support a boatload of switch types, but there > are no software changes to make. Plug it into a hub and your entire network > has access to the remote network. Actually, buy the Ascend Pipeline 75. A base Pipeline 25 goes for around $600 or so, but once you add up all the options that make it useful, e.g IP routing and compression, it costs more than a Pipeline 75, which can be had for $1000 or so. Also, the current P25 variants being so are cripple in one way or another, unlike the older P25s. Mike. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 19:36:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA25540 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 19:36:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (root@orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.41]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA25533 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 19:36:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (gpalmer@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (8.7.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA28186; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:35:57 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: orion.webspan.net: Host gpalmer@localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Samy Touati cc: hackers@freebsd.org From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: machine crashing, what panic: free means? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Aug 1996 10:44:12 EDT." Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:35:57 -0400 Message-ID: <28182.839817357@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Samy Touati wrote in message ID > Does anybody knows what a free panic means? We didn't charge you for it. :-) Gary From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 19:52:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA26322 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 19:52:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from post.io.org (post.io.org [198.133.36.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA26314 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 19:52:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zap.io.org (taob@zap.io.org [198.133.36.81]) by post.io.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA27091 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:51:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:51:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Tao To: FREEBSD-HACKERS-L Subject: Huuuuuuuuuuuge INN history.pag? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This isn't good, is it? 243448 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 249158785 Aug 11 22:49 history 1 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 123 Aug 11 22:49 history.dir 20696 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 140737509515644 Aug 11 22:49 history.pag I know the file really isn't that large, but I presume the EOF marker has been blown way out for some reason. The news server seems to be running still, but this sort of thing worries me. ;-) inn-1.4unoff3 (no mmap), 2.2-960501-SNAP. Anyone else seen this before? -- Brian Tao (BT300, taob@io.org, taob@ican.net) Senior Systems and Network Administrator, Internet Canada Corp. "Though this be madness, yet there is method in't" From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 20:11:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA27053 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:11:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [204.216.27.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA27045 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:11:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pdx1.world.net (pdx1.world.net [192.243.32.18]) by who.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.11) with ESMTP id UAA02338 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:11:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from suburbia.net (suburbia.net [203.4.184.1]) by pdx1.world.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA29942; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:10:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: (proff@localhost) by suburbia.net (8.7.4/Proff-950810) id NAA31457; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:07:36 +1000 From: Julian Assange Message-Id: <199608120307.NAA31457@suburbia.net> Subject: mmap #2 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:07:36 +1000 (EST) Cc: meditation@gnu.ai.mit.edu X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Here are some other results, which hackers may be interested in. Note that the test code hangs on Sunos 4.1.1 (some signal problem) and apparently also a version OSF/1. If anyone has any ideas as to why, I'd be interested in hearing it. /* $Id: mmap_tests.c,v 1.6 1996/08/11 21:01:45 proff Exp $ * * various mmap() implimentations suck; we attempt to find out just how * hard. * * - Julian Assange (proff@suburbia.net) * * Test results: (please send additions to proff@suburbia.net) * * linux 2.0.0 allows shared mmaps only for files, while 1.2.13 * doesn't permit shared mmaps at all. * * Linux suburbia 2.0.0 #29- Thu Jul 11 18:03:20 EST 1996 i586 * * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * * Linux server 1.2.13 #6 Wed Feb 28 15:45:11 CST 1996 i486 (forget it) * * program output: * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * * Freebsd is purrrrfect. * * FreeBSD profane 2.2-CURRENT #0 Sat Jul 27 19:16:00 EST 1996 * * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * * Suprisingly, AIX is faultless too. * * AIX whisky 2 3 000027477600 * * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * * Shared mmap file writes are screwed under BSDI! * * BSD/OS telepath.com 2.1 BSDI BSD/OS 2.1 Kernel #3: Thu Mar 7 10:47:49 CST 1996 * * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * * SunOS omega.iqm.unicamp.br 5.4 generic i86pc i386 * * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * * SunOS chaos 4.1C 4.1.3 sun4 * * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * * SunOS unix1 5.3 Generic_101318-59 sun4m sparc (no shared file write?) * * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * * SunOS sydney6 5.5 Generic_103093-03 sun4m sparc SUNW,SPARCstation-20 * * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * * Novell Unixware 2.03 (System V Release 4.2MP) UNIX_SV aapo 4.2MP 2.03 i386 x86at * * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_READ * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE * * ULTRIX wolf.cs.washington.edu 4.2 0 RISC (way to go ultrix) * * nothing. zilch. zippo * * OSF1 porky-pig V3.2 214 alpha (unexpected. osf/1 sucks) * * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_CHILD_INHERIT * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE * HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE */ #ifdef HAVE_MMAP #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #define MM_SIZE (100*1024) #define TEST_FILE "mmap_test.tmp" int caught_sigquit; void sigquit (int sig) { caught_sigquit++; signal (SIGQUIT, sigquit); } jmp_buf jmp; void sigsegv (int sig) { signal (SIGSEGV, sigsegv); longjmp (jmp, 1); } /* * TODO: test MAP_INHERIT, MAP_FIXED (can't see that latter being much of an issue) */ void test_child(char *p, char *msg) { char *im = "inherit_magic"; char *pm = "parent_magic"; char *cm = "child_magic"; pid_t pid; int ws; fflush (stdout); if (!setjmp(jmp)) strcpy (p, im); caught_sigquit = 0; signal (SIGQUIT, sigquit); signal (SIGCHLD, SIG_IGN); pid = fork(); if (pid<0) return; if (pid==0) { if (!setjmp(jmp)) if (strcmp(p, im)==0) printf("%s_CHILD_INHERIT\n", msg); kill (getppid(), SIGQUIT); while (!caught_sigquit) pause (); caught_sigquit = 0; if (!setjmp(jmp)) if (strcmp(p, pm)==0) printf("%s_CHILD_READ_PARENT_WRITE\n", msg); if (!setjmp(jmp)) strcpy (p, cm); fflush (stdout); kill (getppid(), SIGQUIT); exit(0); } /* parent */ while (!caught_sigquit) pause (); caught_sigquit = 0; if (!setjmp(jmp)) strcpy (p, pm); kill (pid, SIGQUIT); while (!caught_sigquit) pause (); if (!setjmp(jmp)) if (strcmp(p, cm)==0) printf("%s_PARENT_READ_CHILD_WRITE\n", msg); signal (SIGQUIT, SIG_DFL); wait(&ws); } int main() { volatile int fd; char *m = malloc(MM_SIZE); char buf[1024]; signal (SIGSEGV, sigsegv); #if defined(MAP_PRIVATE) fd = open(TEST_FILE, O_RDWR|O_CREAT|O_TRUNC, 0666); strcpy (m, "mmap magic"); write (fd, m, 11); lseek (fd, 0, SEEK_SET); if (fd>=0) { char *p=(char *)mmap(0, MM_SIZE, PROT_READ | PROT_WRITE, MAP_PRIVATE, fd, 0); if (p!=(char *)-1) { if (!setjmp(jmp)) if (strcmp(p, m)==0) puts("HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_READ"); test_child(p, "HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE"); if (!setjmp(jmp)) { strcpy (p, "mmap magic2"); read (fd, buf, 12); if (strcmp(buf, "mmap magic2")!=0) puts("HAVE_MMAP_FILE_PRIVATE_WRITE"); } munmap (p, MM_SIZE); } close (fd); } #endif #if defined(MAP_SHARED) fd = open(TEST_FILE, O_RDWR|O_CREAT|O_TRUNC, 0666); strcpy (m, "mmap magic"); write (fd, m, 11); lseek (fd, 0, SEEK_SET); if (fd>=0) { char *p=(char *)mmap(0, MM_SIZE, PROT_READ | PROT_WRITE, MAP_SHARED, fd, 0); if (p!=(char *)-1) { if (!setjmp(jmp)) if (strcmp(p, m)==0) puts("HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_READ"); test_child(p, "HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED"); if (!setjmp(jmp)) { strcpy (p, "mmap magic2"); read (fd, buf, 12); if (strcmp(buf, "mmap magic2")==0) puts("HAVE_MMAP_FILE_SHARED_WRITE"); } munmap (p, MM_SIZE); } close (fd); } #endif #if defined(MAP_PRIVATE) fd = open("/dev/zero", O_RDWR, 0666); if (fd>=0) { char *p=(char *)mmap(0, MM_SIZE, PROT_READ | PROT_WRITE, MAP_PRIVATE, fd, 0); if (p!=(char *)-1) { if (!setjmp(jmp)) { strcpy (p, "mmap magic_dev_zero"); if (strcmp (p, "mmap magic_dev_zero")==0) puts("HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE"); } test_child(p, "HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_PRIVATE"); munmap (p, MM_SIZE); } close (fd); } #endif #if defined(MAP_PRIVATE) fd = open("/dev/zero", O_RDWR, 0666); if (fd>=0) { char *p=(char *)mmap(0, MM_SIZE, PROT_READ | PROT_WRITE, MAP_SHARED, fd, 0); if (p!=(char *)-1) { if (!setjmp(jmp)) { strcpy (p, "mmap magic_dev_zero_shared"); if (strcmp (p, "mmap magic_dev_zero_shared")==0) puts("HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED"); } test_child(p, "HAVE_MMAP_DEV_ZERO_SHARED"); munmap (p, MM_SIZE); } close (fd); } #endif #if defined(MAP_ANONYMOUS) && !defined(MAP_ANON) #define MAP_ANON MAP_ANONYMOUS #endif #ifdef MAP_ANON { char *p=(char *)mmap(0, MM_SIZE, PROT_READ | PROT_WRITE, MAP_ANON|MAP_PRIVATE, -1, 0); if (p!=(char *)-1) { if (!setjmp(jmp)) { strcpy (p, "mmap magic_anon"); if (strcmp(p, "mmap magic_anon")==0) puts("HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE"); } test_child(p, "HAVE_MMAP_ANON_PRIVATE"); munmap (p, MM_SIZE); } } #endif #if defined(MAP_ANON) && defined(MAP_SHARED) { char *p=(char *)mmap(0, MM_SIZE, PROT_READ | PROT_WRITE, MAP_ANON|MAP_SHARED, -1, 0); if (p!=(char *)-1) { if (!setjmp(jmp)) { strcpy (p, "mmap magic_shared_anon"); if (strcmp(p, "mmap magic_shared_anon")==0) puts("HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED"); } test_child(p, "HAVE_MMAP_ANON_SHARED"); munmap (p, MM_SIZE); } } #endif unlink(TEST_FILE); exit (0); } #endif /* HAVE_MMAP */ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 20:13:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA27158 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:13:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA27153 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:13:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailbox.mcs.com (Mailbox.mcs.com [192.160.127.87]) by Kitten.mcs.com (8.7.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id WAA10787; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:13:15 -0500 (CDT) Received: by mailbox.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Sun, 11 Aug 96 22:13 CDT Received: (from karl@localhost) by Jupiter.mcs.net (8.7.5/8.7.5) id WAA09821; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:13:13 -0500 (CDT) From: Karl Denninger Message-Id: <199608120313.WAA09821@Jupiter.mcs.net> Subject: Re: Building ports and packages? To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:13:12 -0500 (CDT) Cc: karl@Mcs.Net, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199608120208.LAA13535@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Aug 12, 96 11:38:13 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Karl Denninger stands accused of saying: > > > > I have the ports SUP tree here. LOTS of them don't build properly. > > > > Also, the "package" target appears not to work either. > > > > Anyone have the proper procedure for a complete ports build under -CURRENT > > handy? > > They should all work. Certainly I build both ports and packages on > -current with no drama at all. Hmmm... > Is the -current system you're working with a -SNAP virgin install, or > did you upgrade over an older (2.0.5, 2.1 etc.) release? Its a virgin install off a RELEASE I built from -CURRENT. Nothing special about it. > Is there a pattern to these failures? Satoshi (ports-meister) builds them > on -current regularly as a verification. From whence are you supping them? One thing I have figured out -- I didn't have X11 on there, and that blows up anything X related. Can that be fixed without reinstalling the entire machine? (ie: can I load the X11 release?) -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity http://www.mcs.net/~karl | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available | 23 Chicagoland Prefixes, 13 ISDN, much more Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net/ Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 20:16:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA27309 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:16:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from guardian.fortress.org (fortress.org [199.84.158.128]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA27297 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:16:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from andrew@localhost) by guardian.fortress.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA03775; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:17:38 -0400 Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:17:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Andrew Webster Reply-To: andrew@pubnix.net To: Brian Tao cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Huuuuuuuuuuuge INN history.pag? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 11 Aug 1996, Brian Tao wrote: > This isn't good, is it? > > 243448 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 249158785 Aug 11 22:49 history > 1 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 123 Aug 11 22:49 history.dir > 20696 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 140737509515644 Aug 11 22:49 history.pag > > > I know the file really isn't that large, but I presume the EOF > marker has been blown way out for some reason. The news server seems > to be running still, but this sort of thing worries me. ;-) > inn-1.4unoff3 (no mmap), 2.2-960501-SNAP. Anyone else seen this > before? Yup, lots of times after the system crashes, even though fsck says everything is cool, wierd stuff like this starts popping up here and there. Do ls -lo to see if any flags have popped up. This is usually the result of disk corruption. Regards, Andrew Webster - andrew@pubnix.net - http://www.pubnix.net PubNIX Montreal - Connected to the world - Branche au monde 514-990-5911 - P.O. Box 147, Cote St-Luc, Quebec, H4V 2Y3 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 20:20:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA27487 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:20:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Gatekeeper.Lamb.net (root@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net [206.169.44.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA27482 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:20:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ulf@localhost) by Gatekeeper.Lamb.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA02186; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:20:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Ulf Zimmermann Message-Id: <199608120320.UAA02186@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net> Subject: Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested... To: miker@cs.utexas.edu (Hung Michael Nguyen) Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:20:49 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608120227.VAA09580@babyhuey.cs.utexas.edu> from Hung Michael Nguyen at "Aug 11, 96 09:27:52 pm" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > I recommend the Ascend Pipeline 25, for about $1000 you can get one with > > IP routing. Not only does it support a boatload of switch types, but there > > are no software changes to make. Plug it into a hub and your entire network > > has access to the remote network. > > Actually, buy the Ascend Pipeline 75. A base Pipeline 25 goes for around > $600 or so, but once you add up all the options that make it useful, e.g > IP routing and compression, it costs more than a Pipeline 75, which can > be had for $1000 or so. Also, the current P25 variants being so are > cripple in one way or another, unlike the older P25s. > > Mike. > > I have a P130/T1+ISDN for $1200 for sale :) Ulf. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-865-0204 Lamb Art Internet Services || http://www.Lamb.net/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 20:24:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA27570 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:24:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA27563 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:24:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id NAA13913; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:10:10 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608120340.NAA13913@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Building ports and packages? To: karl@Mcs.Net (Karl Denninger) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:10:09 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, karl@Mcs.Net, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199608120313.WAA09821@Jupiter.mcs.net> from "Karl Denninger" at Aug 11, 96 10:13:12 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Karl Denninger stands accused of saying: > > > Is the -current system you're working with a -SNAP virgin install, or > > did you upgrade over an older (2.0.5, 2.1 etc.) release? > > Its a virgin install off a RELEASE I built from -CURRENT. Nothing special > about it. Can you be more specific about exactly what fails when you try building stuff? Are you getting makefile breakdown, checksum failures, or compile failures? Which /usr/share/mk/bsd.port.mk do you have? Latest is $Id: bsd.port.mk,v 1.218 1996/08/07 08:25:08 asami Exp $ $Id: bsd.port.subdir.mk,v 1.14 1996/04/09 22:54:13 wosch Exp $ > > Is there a pattern to these failures? Satoshi (ports-meister) builds them > > on -current regularly as a verification. From whence are you supping them? > > One thing I have figured out -- I didn't have X11 on there, and that blows > up anything X related. Can that be fixed without reinstalling the entire > machine? (ie: can I load the X11 release?) Yup. You can either bring up sysinstall and just install the X11 stuff (custom/distributions/custom/XFree86, point it at an FTP server with the XFree dists on it), or you can just unpack the relevant tarballs by hand; they're all rooted at /usr, and described in the docco that comes with them from the XFree people. > Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 20:30:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA27845 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:30:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA27840 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:30:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailbox.mcs.com (Mailbox.mcs.com [192.160.127.87]) by Kitten.mcs.com (8.7.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id WAA11328; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:30:22 -0500 (CDT) Received: by mailbox.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Sun, 11 Aug 96 22:30 CDT Received: (from karl@localhost) by Jupiter.mcs.net (8.7.5/8.7.5) id WAA09868; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:30:20 -0500 (CDT) From: Karl Denninger Message-Id: <199608120330.WAA09868@Jupiter.mcs.net> Subject: Re: Building ports and packages? To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:30:20 -0500 (CDT) Cc: karl@Mcs.Net, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199608120340.NAA13913@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Aug 12, 96 01:10:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Karl Denninger stands accused of saying: > > > > > Is the -current system you're working with a -SNAP virgin install, or > > > did you upgrade over an older (2.0.5, 2.1 etc.) release? > > > > Its a virgin install off a RELEASE I built from -CURRENT. Nothing special > > about it. > > Can you be more specific about exactly what fails when you try building > stuff? Are you getting makefile breakdown, checksum failures, or compile > failures? I'm getting checksum failures, failures to get the dist files (I fixed that by SUPping them and the ports list from ftp.freebsd.org) and STILL got checksum failures! So now I'm commenting out specific distributions..... but it appears that about 10% or so are blowing up. And repacking them is basically impossible; "make packages" doesn't do anything other than run through the builds (it makes no .tgz files) > Which /usr/share/mk/bsd.port.mk do you have? Latest is > $Id: bsd.port.mk,v 1.218 1996/08/07 08:25:08 asami Exp $ > $Id: bsd.port.subdir.mk,v 1.14 1996/04/09 22:54:13 wosch Exp $ That's what's in my directory here... # $Id: bsd.port.mk,v 1.216 1996/07/05 06:12:12 jkh Exp $ > > One thing I have figured out -- I didn't have X11 on there, and that blows > > up anything X related. Can that be fixed without reinstalling the entire > > machine? (ie: can I load the X11 release?) > > Yup. You can either bring up sysinstall and just install the X11 stuff > (custom/distributions/custom/XFree86, point it at an FTP server with the > XFree dists on it), or you can just unpack the relevant tarballs by > hand; they're all rooted at /usr, and described in the docco that comes > with them from the XFree people. Ok; I'll go ahead and load that, but the problem is that I'm still hosed on the distributions that fail checksum... -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity http://www.mcs.net/~karl | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available | 23 Chicagoland Prefixes, 13 ISDN, much more Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net/ Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 20:33:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA27965 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:33:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from post.io.org (post.io.org [198.133.36.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA27947 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:33:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zap.io.org (taob@zap.io.org [198.133.36.81]) by post.io.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA27407; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:31:46 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:31:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Tao Reply-To: Brian Tao To: andrew@pubnix.net cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Huuuuuuuuuuuge INN history.pag? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 11 Aug 1996, Andrew Webster wrote: > > Do ls -lo to see if any flags have popped up. This is usually the > result of disk corruption. Nope, no flags have been set. I just mv'd the file out of the way, touched history.pag and restarted innd. Seems to be fine now. BTW, I noticed this about the file size: it is almost exactly 128TB (2^47 bytes) minus the size of the history.pag before this happened. Is the max file size on ffs 128TB or something? 15808 -rw-r--r-- 1 news news 21149848 Aug 11 23:26 history.pag 20696 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 140737509515644 Aug 11 22:52 history.pag2 -- Brian Tao (BT300, taob@io.org, taob@ican.net) Senior Systems and Network Administrator, Internet Canada Corp. "Though this be madness, yet there is method in't" From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 20:54:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA28781 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:54:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from moonpie.w8hd.org (moonpie.w8hd.org [198.252.159.14]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA28774 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 20:54:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (kimc@localhost) by moonpie.w8hd.org (8.7.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA00784; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:54:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: moonpie.w8hd.org: kimc owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:54:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Kim Culhan To: Karl Denninger cc: Michael Smith , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Building ports and packages? In-Reply-To: <199608120313.WAA09821@Jupiter.mcs.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 11 Aug 1996, Karl Denninger wrote: > > Karl Denninger stands accused of saying: > Hmmm... > One thing I have figured out -- I didn't have X11 on there, and that blows > up anything X related. Can that be fixed without reinstalling the entire > machine? (ie: can I load the X11 release?) You could try using your existing ~/ports/x11/XFree86 to build it on the machine, I can verify this works since it built cleanly here 24 hrs ago. kimc -- kimc@w8hd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 21:05:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA29160 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 21:05:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scooter.quickweb.com (scooter.quickweb.com [199.212.134.8]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA29141 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 21:04:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (mark@localhost) by scooter.quickweb.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA00237; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:03:12 -0400 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:03:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Mayo To: Brian Tao cc: FREEBSD-HACKERS-L Subject: Re: Huuuuuuuuuuuge INN history.pag? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 11 Aug 1996, Brian Tao wrote: > This isn't good, is it? > > 243448 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 249158785 Aug 11 22:49 history > 1 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 123 Aug 11 22:49 history.dir > 20696 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 140737509515644 Aug 11 22:49 history.pag > > I know the file really isn't that large, but I presume the EOF > marker has been blown way out for some reason. The news server seems > to be running still, but this sort of thing worries me. ;-) > inn-1.4unoff3 (no mmap), 2.2-960501-SNAP. Anyone else seen this > before? I see that file size (approx.) whenever I NFS mount an AIX 3.2.5 export.. When I write a file to the NFS sever, my FreeBSD client sees that file size, but the AIX server sees the correct file size. I've always assumed it was just a disagreement between NFS implementations. I guess it's the max file size or something.. -Mark ------------------------------------------- | Mark Mayo mark@quickweb.com | | C-Soft www.quickweb.com | ------------------------------------------- "To iterate is human, to recurse divine." - L. Peter Deutsch > -- > Brian Tao (BT300, taob@io.org, taob@ican.net) > Senior Systems and Network Administrator, Internet Canada Corp. > "Though this be madness, yet there is method in't" > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 21:24:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA29658 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 21:24:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from post.io.org (post.io.org [198.133.36.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA29623 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 21:23:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zap.io.org (taob@zap.io.org [198.133.36.81]) by post.io.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA27770; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:22:18 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:22:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Tao To: Mark Mayo cc: FREEBSD-HACKERS-L Subject: Re: Huuuuuuuuuuuge INN history.pag? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Mark Mayo wrote: > > I see that file size (approx.) whenever I NFS mount an AIX 3.2.5 > export.. I can assure you that there are *no* AIX servers anywhere in my network. ;-) However, I didn't notice the same thing about the file size (~128TB, 2^47 bytes). -- Brian Tao (BT300, taob@io.org, taob@ican.net) Senior Systems and Network Administrator, Internet Canada Corp. "Though this be madness, yet there is method in't" From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 21:50:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA00602 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 21:50:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA00593 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 21:50:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id OAA14144; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:36:25 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608120506.OAA14144@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Building ports and packages? To: karl@Mcs.Net (Karl Denninger) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:36:25 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, karl@Mcs.Net, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199608120330.WAA09868@Jupiter.mcs.net> from "Karl Denninger" at Aug 11, 96 10:30:20 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Karl Denninger stands accused of saying: > > > > Can you be more specific about exactly what fails when you try building > > stuff? Are you getting makefile breakdown, checksum failures, or compile > > failures? > > I'm getting checksum failures, failures to get the dist files (I fixed that > by SUPping them and the ports list from ftp.freebsd.org) and STILL got > checksum failures! Hmm. If you're sure your collection is up-to-date (and that you're supping from someone that is), let ports@freebsd.org know about your checksum failures. I'm not so keen on aborting the build just because the checksums don't match, but that's policy 8( Failure fetch the distfiles tends to imply that the new 'fetch' tool doesn't work. I always fetch manually, so I haven't seen that one. > So now I'm commenting out specific distributions..... but it appears that > about 10% or so are blowing up. And repacking them is basically impossible; > "make packages" doesn't do anything other than run through the builds (it > makes no .tgz files) 'make package' requires 'make install' beforehand, so you have to be root to do it. > > Which /usr/share/mk/bsd.port.mk do you have? Latest is > > $Id: bsd.port.mk,v 1.218 1996/08/07 08:25:08 asami Exp $ > > $Id: bsd.port.subdir.mk,v 1.14 1996/04/09 22:54:13 wosch Exp $ > > That's what's in my directory here... > > # $Id: bsd.port.mk,v 1.216 1996/07/05 06:12:12 jkh Exp $ Hmm, that's 1.216, not 1.218. I don't know if the changes are significant. > Ok; I'll go ahead and load that, but the problem is that I'm still hosed on > the distributions that fail checksum... If the checksums are pissing you off (like they do me), then just delete them all in the short term, and complain like hell on freebsd-ports to get something done about them in the long term. If I had the time and the connectivity (ha!) I'd cook up a quick Tcl script to walk the ports tree, retrieve the distfiles and check their checksums. I don't; if you have the bandwidth then perhaps we could collaborate on this - keeping track of 500+ distfiles is an almost impossible task from the manual point of view. At any rate, _please_ advise the freebsd-ports list of the ports that are giving you build trouble so that they can be checked and fixed. > Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 21:56:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA00834 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 21:56:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA00823 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 21:56:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (michaelh@localhost) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.7.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id EAA06988; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 04:56:01 GMT Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:56:00 +0900 (JST) From: Michael Hancock To: Julian Assange cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: mmap #2 In-Reply-To: <199608120307.NAA31457@suburbia.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Julian Assange wrote: > * Freebsd is purrrrfect. > * Cool program! I can see the ear to ear smiles on John and David and company's faces. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 22:07:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA01167 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:07:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA01151 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:06:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA01841; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 07:06:39 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id HAA07724; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 07:06:22 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id GAA29146; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:51:36 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608120451.GAA29146@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:51:36 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Weird pty problem In-Reply-To: <199608112131.HAA11914@godzilla.zeta.org.au>; from Bruce Evans on Aug 12, 1996 7:31:12 +1000 References: <199608112131.HAA11914@godzilla.zeta.org.au> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Bruce Evans: > > ttyp0 0 0 0 1296 256 0 OCc ef2c00 11999 term > > ... > > ttyp8 0 0 0 1296 256 108 OCZ de1580 12923 term > > Is this part of the problem or the solution? The "sleep" is not a good solution of course :-) The problem is that I don't know what happen and I don't know why is this just /dev/ttyp8 that block. > The state OCZ can't happen :-) (Z implies !C). The only way I've found to avoid the problem is to "rm /dev/ttyp8". That way, p8 is unavailable and programs skip it... Now the state is ttyp8 0 0 0 1296 256 108 OZ de1580 12923 term -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 22:10:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA01311 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:10:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA01306 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:10:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (michaelh@localhost) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.7.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id FAA07077 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 05:10:02 GMT Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:10:02 +0900 (JST) From: Michael Hancock To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Load-balancing box In-Reply-To: <199608120307.NAA31457@suburbia.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Cisco has a cool new product called LocalDirector that looks like the perfect load balancing solution. The box has an Intel MB, P133, and 2 Intel 10/100 Ethernet cards. A designated IP number can be setup so that when it hits the box it translates it to one of the IP addresses for the multiple servers sitting behind it. Otherwise it just functions as bridge. When it dispatches the request to one of the servers it starts a timer to measure the response time. It uses the response time statistics to determine which server to dispatch the next request to. If a server goes down then it stops dispatching requests to it. How hard would it be to build something like this with FreeBSD? Regards, Mike Hancock From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 22:52:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA02575 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:52:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA02570 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 22:52:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id HAA28985; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 07:51:08 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id HAA09587; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 07:51:07 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id HAA03495; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 07:31:45 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608120531.HAA03495@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: mmap #2 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 07:31:45 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: proff@suburbia.net Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from Michael Hancock at "Aug 12, 96 01:56:00 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Michael Hancock wrote: > > * Freebsd is purrrrfect. > > * > > Cool program! > > I can see the ear to ear smiles on John and David and company's faces. Wasn't there still our long-suffering problem with INN & mmap()? I forgot what exactly it is, something like extending an mmap'ed file perhaps. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 23:03:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA02845 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:03:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA02839 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:03:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA14393; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:49:09 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608120619.PAA14393@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Mouse.. To: khetan@iafrica.com (Khetan Gajjar) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:49:08 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, 100626.3506@compuserve.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Khetan Gajjar" at Aug 10, 96 06:52:45 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Khetan Gajjar stands accused of saying: > > >I have bad news for you. Moused is the mouse code from XFree86, ripped > >out and stuck on its own. > > Any ideas why it's not working then ? Nope. You could start by supplying the '-d -f' options to moused and watching the debug output to see if it's actually hearing your mouse. > Khetan Gajjar [ http://www.iafrica.com/~khetan ] -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 23:21:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA03279 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:21:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scooter.quickweb.com (scooter.quickweb.com [199.212.134.8]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA03274 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:21:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (mark@localhost) by scooter.quickweb.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA00738 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 02:20:10 -0400 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 02:20:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Mayo To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ifconfig alias with subnet.. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi all, I seem to be having some problems with aliasing 'extra' IP numbers to a single interface (ep0). I think I'm correct in assuming that once I have the first address added to the machine (the non alias - ifconfig ep0 inet 199.212.134.8 netmask 255.255.255.0) that when I add other addresses, the rule is this: If the address is on the same Class C I alis with netmask of 0xffffffff. But if alias with a netmask of 0xffffff00 if it's on a different Class C. My questions is what happens when you are on a net that is subnetted? In my case, I bring the interface up with : root# ifconfig ep0 inet 199.212.134.8 netmask 255.255.255.240 Since the netmask is 240, I want to add the following two subnets: 199.212.134.80 206.248.60.80 For the 199.212.134.80 'group of 16' I just did this: root# ifconfig ep0 alias 199.212.134.81 .. 82 .. 83 .. etc. And I got the file exists error, but things still seems to work. I was concerned, but heh: if it works don't touch it,, no? --> YES Cause now when I tried to add to add the 206.248.60.80 sub, it didn't work. So I tried doing this: root# ifconfig ep0 alias 206.248.60.81 netmask 0xfffffff0 And voila, the .240 netmask worked, I got the .81 number up == but that's all!!! I can only add the first number from this subnet successfully, the rest just won't work - they go on with a file exists error, and the ping gives me ret -1, host is down. So all in all, I'm confused, and I guess I just want to know how to correctly go about aliasing IPs on a subnetted network. I can send along the results of my netstat -in and netstat -rn directly to anyone who thinks thinks they can figure this out.. The results do seem rather odd, which also makes be ask, how do you know which interface link#2 is?? I assumed it was the second available interface, which seems odd cause I've only got one card! But I've convinced myself that link#1 MUST be the loopback.. is this correct or do I have something fundamentally wrong inside this machines config?? Thanks for any help, hopfully I have a little hair left by the time I figure this one out ;-) -Mark ------------------------------------------- | Mark Mayo mark@quickweb.com | | C-Soft www.quickweb.com | ------------------------------------------- "To iterate is human, to recurse divine." - L. Peter Deutsch From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 23:29:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA03564 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:29:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA03559 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:29:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA27707; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 08:28:55 +0200 Message-Id: <199608120628.IAA27707@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: Load-balancing box To: michaelh@cet.co.jp (Michael Hancock) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 08:28:55 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Michael Hancock" at Aug 12, 96 02:10:02 pm From: sos@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-to: sos@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Michael Hancock who wrote: > > Cisco has a cool new product called LocalDirector that looks like the > perfect load balancing solution. > > The box has an Intel MB, P133, and 2 Intel 10/100 Ethernet cards. > > A designated IP number can be setup so that when it hits the box it > translates it to one of the IP addresses for the multiple servers sitting > behind it. Otherwise it just functions as bridge. > > When it dispatches the request to one of the servers it starts a timer to > measure the response time. It uses the response time statistics to > determine which server to dispatch the next request to. > > If a server goes down then it stops dispatching requests to it. Nice idea, I'll give them that... > How hard would it be to build something like this with FreeBSD? Actually I think it would be pretty easy, depending on how familliar one is with the network code. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Aug 11 23:49:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA04364 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:49:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay.hp.com (relay.hp.com [15.255.152.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA04359 for ; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:49:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fakir.india.hp.com by relay.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA271432558; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:49:23 -0700 Received: from localhost by fakir.india.hp.com with SMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA091782688; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:21:28 +0530 Message-Id: <199608120651.AA091782688@fakir.india.hp.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:21:27 +0530 From: A JOSEPH KOSHY Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Sometime back there was a posting comparing the behaviour of FreeBSD and NT wrt a test program that created lots of processes and stressed the OS. (I've unfortunately lost the original mails). It struck me that the NT version of the program was using `CreateThread()' while the Unix (FreeBSD) version was using `fork()'. Now I don't know much about NT internals, but it seems to me that the NT approach wouldn't lead to as many process context switches since the threads would be sharing the same address space. Therefore the load on the VM system would be no different from having 1 process. The poster reported a slowdown on NT with many threads but no crashes, which seems logical since multiple threads would consume CPU time, and not placing a load on the VM would mean it wouldn't crash :-). So my question is: how does NT behave when it has to schedule between a large number of processes each with its own process context, VM, page tables etc? Conversely how does the unix program behave when linked with -lpthreads and with `fork()' replaced with `pthread_create()'? Koshy My personal opinions only. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 00:20:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA05385 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:20:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from MindBender.HeadCandy.com (root@mindbender.headcandy.com [199.238.225.168]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA05380 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:20:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.HeadCandy.com (michaelv@localhost.HeadCandy.com [127.0.0.1]) by MindBender.HeadCandy.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA14917; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:18:01 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608120718.AAA14917@MindBender.HeadCandy.com> X-Authentication-Warning: MindBender.HeadCandy.com: Host michaelv@localhost.HeadCandy.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: A JOSEPH KOSHY cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 12 Aug 96 12:21:27 +0530. <199608120651.AA091782688@fakir.india.hp.com> Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:17:55 -0700 From: "Michael L. VanLoon -- HeadCandy.com" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Sometime back there was a posting comparing the behaviour of FreeBSD and >NT wrt a test program that created lots of processes and stressed the OS. >(I've unfortunately lost the original mails). > >It struck me that the NT version of the program was using `CreateThread()' >while the Unix (FreeBSD) version was using `fork()'. Right... This is The Right Thing To Do on NT. NT has no real equivelant of fork in the Win32 API. (There is a fork in the Posix subsystem, but that's largely for decoration, anyway...) The alternative is to make NT use CreateProcess, which is really clumsy since it's basically the equivelant of the Unix fork/exec. So, in spite of the fact that it's different, remember that it has to be different, since these are two vastly different OS'. >Now I don't know much about NT internals, but it seems to me that the NT >approach wouldn't lead to as many process context switches since the threads >would be sharing the same address space. Therefore the load on the VM system >would be no different from having 1 process. Well, yes and no. If the various threads allocate memory while thrashing, this memory is going to be used in the same way that Unix uses it. Added to the fact that both systems use copy-on-write and shared text segments, so the only thing that will not be shared in the Unix fork method is the freshly allocated/written memory, which isn't shared under NT threads either, and a small amount of additional overhead for each process. On the other hand, context switching among multiple processes is not as efficient as context switching among multiple threads with shared address space. This is where Unix loses. On the other hand, there are threads packages for Unix. I don't know if FreeBSD has explicit kernel support for threads, to make them more efficient, but it might be something worth investigating. And, on a third hand :-), there has been at least one paper written that says NetBSD (and this should also apply to FreeBSD) had a more efficient context switching response than NT (and OS/2, I think), anyway, so it might even out in the end. But this advantage could go away somewhat for two reasons: NT 4.0 is more efficient for several reasons than older versions of NT, and FreeBSD might slow down a little once all the SMP stuff makes it into the main code base. >The poster reported a slowdown on NT with many threads but no crashes, which >seems logical since multiple threads would consume CPU time, and not placing >a load on the VM would mean it wouldn't crash :-). I think "not placing a load" is exagerating. As stated above, the VM usage should be very similar. The context switching overhead, however, might hurt Unix with a ton of processes. >So my question is: how does NT behave when it has to schedule between a >large number of processes each with its own process context, VM, page tables >etc? Conversely how does the unix program behave when linked with -lpthreads >and with `fork()' replaced with `pthread_create()'? Both would be good questions to investigate. But, remember that NT is optimized for threads, and a non-threaded multi-process application on NT is a badly written NT application. So, such findings have to be taken with a grain of salt. But it would be good to compare a _good_ Unix threads implementation running this test against running it on NT Server 4.0, on similar hardware. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael L. VanLoon michaelv@HeadCandy.com --< Free your mind and your machine -- NetBSD free un*x >-- NetBSD working ports: 386+PC, Mac 68k, Amiga, Atari 68k, HP300, Sun3, Sun4/4c/4m, DEC MIPS, DEC Alpha, PC532, VAX, MVME68k, arm32... NetBSD ports in progress: PICA, others... Roll your own Internet access -- Seattle People's Internet cooperative. If you're in the Seattle area, ask me how. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 00:24:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA05519 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:24:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cs.tu-berlin.de (root@mail.cs.tu-berlin.de [130.149.17.13]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA05510; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:24:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from campa.panke.de (anonymous230.ppp.cs.tu-berlin.de [130.149.17.230]) by mail.cs.tu-berlin.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA12368; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 08:57:30 +0200 Received: (from wosch@localhost) by campa.panke.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA03842; Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:35:22 +0200 Date: Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:35:22 +0200 From: Wolfram Schneider Message-Id: <199608112135.XAA03842@campa.panke.de> To: Michael Hancock Cc: dyson@freebsd.org, "Marc G. Fournier" , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested... In-Reply-To: References: <199608100521.AAA03164@dyson.iquest.net> Reply-to: Wolfram Schneider MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Hancock writes: >The BISDN stuff is for a TELES card that seems to only support the German >and maybe other European tel comm interfaces. The Teles company will going public (Nasdaq, New York) last quarter 1996. They wouldn't do that if they don't want sells ISDN cards to the USA market. Wolfram From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 00:27:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA05585 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:27:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from copernicus.iafrica.com (root@copernicus.iafrica.com [196.31.1.15]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA05580 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:27:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from copernicus.iafrica.com (khetan@copernicus.iafrica.com [196.31.1.15]) by copernicus.iafrica.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA08388; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:25:45 +0200 (SAT) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:25:40 +0200 (SAT) From: Khetan Gajjar To: Michael Smith cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Mouse.. In-Reply-To: <199608120619.PAA14393@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Michael Smith wrote: > Nope. You could start by supplying the '-d -f' options to moused and > watching the debug output to see if it's actually hearing your mouse. Tried that - it's not. --- Khetan Gajjar [ http://www.iafrica.com/~khetan ] UUNet Internet Africa [ 0800-030-002 & help@iafrica.com ] Get rid of Telkom.... [ http://www.ispa.org.za ] I'm a FreeBSD User! [ http://www.freebsd.org ] Any opinions stated in this message are personal. UIA's official policy may not be reflected in this message. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 00:35:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA05969 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:35:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA05964 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:35:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id RAA14747; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:19:59 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608120749.RAA14747@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Mouse.. To: khetan@iafrica.com (Khetan Gajjar) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:19:58 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Khetan Gajjar" at Aug 12, 96 09:25:40 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Khetan Gajjar stands accused of saying: > > On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Michael Smith wrote: > > > Nope. You could start by supplying the '-d -f' options to moused and > > watching the debug output to see if it's actually hearing your mouse. > > Tried that - it's not. Ok, well you didn't tell us that before. Are you telling moused what sort of mouse you have & where it is? Have you checked to see what state moused is in? (ps axl) Are you running X at the same time? > Khetan Gajjar [ http://www.iafrica.com/~khetan ] -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 00:49:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA06481 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:49:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA06473; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:49:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA00410; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:49:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608120749.AAA00410@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Wolfram Schneider cc: Michael Hancock , dyson@FreeBSD.ORG, "Marc G. Fournier" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested... In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 11 Aug 1996 23:35:22 +0200." <199608112135.XAA03842@campa.panke.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:49:06 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >From The Desk Of Wolfram Schneider : > Michael Hancock writes: > >The BISDN stuff is for a TELES card that seems to only support the German > >and maybe other European tel comm interfaces. > > The Teles company will going public (Nasdaq, New York) last quarter > 1996. They wouldn't do that if they don't want sells ISDN cards to the > USA market. > And I keep thinking about Intel's ISDN boards with so many hackers here in Silicon Valley I am amazed that we don't support it 8) Regards, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 00:50:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA06561 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:50:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA06554 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:50:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA00372; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:47:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608120747.AAA00372@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: "Michael L. VanLoon -- HeadCandy.com" cc: A JOSEPH KOSHY , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:17:55 PDT." <199608120718.AAA14917@MindBender.HeadCandy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:47:26 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >From The Desk Of "Michael L. VanLoon -- HeadCandy.com" : We don't have kernel level support for threads that means that the processes context switching for threads is handle by the threads package. 2.2-current has support for *user* level threads and it shouldn't be that hard to convert the test program from using fork/exec to threads. On my last contract, I used -current's threads in a rather large large library. Not sure if the current threads package in -current is in sync with the latest from the author so you may find a bug or two which may have been fixed :( Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 00:53:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA06726 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:53:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA06721 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 00:53:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id RAA01049; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:44:17 +1000 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:44:17 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608120744.RAA01049@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, roberto@keltia.freenix.fr Subject: Re: Weird pty problem Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >The only way I've found to avoid the problem is to "rm /dev/ttyp8". That >way, p8 is unavailable and programs skip it... >Now the state is > ttyp8 0 0 0 1296 256 108 OZ de1580 12923 term This is more reasonable. It might be waiting for output to drain, and something bad has happened to ptyp8. Does it really only happen for pty #8? Is ptyp8 open? (Look for it with fstat or lsof.) Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 01:52:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id BAA09319 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 01:52:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.2.144.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA09213; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 01:51:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA01972; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 18:51:39 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 18:51:37 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: sos@FreeBSD.org cc: Michael Hancock , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Load-balancing box In-Reply-To: <199608120628.IAA27707@ra.dkuug.dk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996 sos@FreeBSD.org wrote: > In reply to Michael Hancock who wrote: > > > > A designated IP number can be setup so that when it hits the box it > > translates it to one of the IP addresses for the multiple servers sitting > > behind it. Otherwise it just functions as bridge. > > > > If a server goes down then it stops dispatching requests to it. > > Nice idea, I'll give them that... > > > How hard would it be to build something like this with FreeBSD? > > Actually I think it would be pretty easy, depending on how familliar > one is with the network code. Darren Reed already has working src ip translation. It should not be hard to change it to dest addr translation. See http://coombs.anu.edu.au/~avalon/ Danny From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 02:15:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA10252 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 02:15:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.crl.com (mail.crl.com [165.113.1.22]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA10235 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 02:15:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jabber.paco.odessa.ua by mail.crl.com with SMTP id AA19994 (5.65c/IDA-1.5 for ); Mon, 12 Aug 1996 02:12:20 -0700 Received: (from igor@localhost) by jabber.paco.odessa.ua (8.7.1/8.6.10/01) id MAA21710 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:00:11 +0300 (UKD) From: Igor Khasilev Message-Id: <199608120900.MAA21710@jabber.paco.odessa.ua> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:00:10 +0300 (UKD) In-Reply-To: <199608120747.AAA00372@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty" at Aug 12, 96 00:47:26 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > >From The Desk Of "Michael L. VanLoon -- HeadCandy.com" : > > We don't have kernel level support for threads that means that the > processes context switching for threads is handle by the threads package. > > 2.2-current has support for *user* level threads and it shouldn't be that > hard to convert the test program from using fork/exec to threads. > BTW, is there any person who coordinate works on threads for freebds kernel? Igor From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 02:19:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA10384 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 02:19:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jabber.paco.odessa.ua (jabber.paco.odessa.ua [193.124.52.20]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id CAA10297 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 02:16:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from igor@localhost) by jabber.paco.odessa.ua (8.7.1/8.6.10/01) id MAA21871 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:12:34 +0300 (UKD) From: Igor Khasilev Message-Id: <199608120912.MAA21871@jabber.paco.odessa.ua> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:12:33 +0300 (UKD) In-Reply-To: <199608120651.AA091782688@fakir.india.hp.com> from "A JOSEPH KOSHY" at Aug 12, 96 12:21:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > So my question is: how does NT behave when it has to schedule between a > large number of processes each with its own process context, VM, page tables > etc? Conversely how does the unix program behave when linked with -lpthreads > and with `fork()' replaced with `pthread_create()'? One bad thing with user level threads (actualy pthreads that I used): sheduler which runs on user lever ALWAYS consume processor time (even wnen all threads sleeps), and permanenly keep part of code in memory. If it is true (maybe I misunderstand something), then pthreads is bad solution for heavy loaded systems. Igor From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 03:04:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA11823 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 03:04:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from casparc.ppp.net (casparc.ppp.net [194.64.12.35]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA11761; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 03:03:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ernie by casparc.ppp.net with uucp (Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0uptoy-000I2ZC; Mon, 12 Aug 96 12:02 MET DST Received: by ernie.kts.org (Smail3.1.29.1 #4) id m0upsoU-00001hC; Mon, 12 Aug 96 10:57 MET DST Message-Id: From: hm@kts.org (Hellmuth Michaelis) Subject: Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested... To: wosch@cs.tu-berlin.de Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:57:30 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: michaelh@cet.co.jp, dyson@FreeBSD.ORG, scrappy@ki.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608112135.XAA03842@campa.panke.de> from "Wolfram Schneider" at Aug 11, 96 11:35:22 pm Organization: Kitchen Table Systems Reply-To: hm@kts.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Wolfram Schneider wrote: > > Michael Hancock writes: > >The BISDN stuff is for a TELES card that seems to only support the German > >and maybe other European tel comm interfaces. > > The Teles company will going public (Nasdaq, New York) last quarter > 1996. They wouldn't do that if they don't want sells ISDN cards to the > USA market. And if they eventually have their ISDN line interface ready for the US market, there is still someone needed to write the D channel layer 1, 2 and 3 protocol stack (which is not DSS-1 i suspect). hellmuth -- Hellmuth Michaelis hm@kts.org Hamburg, Europe (A)bort, (R)etry, (I)nstall BSD ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 03:45:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA13173 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 03:45:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.siemens.at (proxy.siemens.at [192.138.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA13162 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 03:45:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sol1.gud.siemens.co.at (sol-f.gud.siemens-austria) by proxy.siemens.at with SMTP id AA08297 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for ); Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:44:28 +0200 Received: from ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at by sol1.gud.siemens.co.at with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #7 for ) id m0upuU0-00025jC; Mon, 12 Aug 96 12:44 MET DST Received: by ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at (1.37.109.16/1.37) id AA063596403; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:40:03 +0200 From: "Hr.Ladavac" Message-Id: <199608121040.AA063596403@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: igor@jabber.paco.odessa.ua (Igor Khasilev) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:40:03 +0200 (MESZ) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608120912.MAA21871@jabber.paco.odessa.ua> from "Igor Khasilev" at Aug 12, 96 12:12:33 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk E-mail message from Igor Khasilev contained: > > > So my question is: how does NT behave when it has to schedule between a > > large number of processes each with its own process context, VM, page tables > > etc? Conversely how does the unix program behave when linked with -lpthreads > > and with `fork()' replaced with `pthread_create()'? > > One bad thing with user level threads (actualy pthreads that I used): > sheduler which runs on user lever ALWAYS consume processor time (even wnen Only when *really* poorly implemented. Otherwise it waits in select(2) to be awaken by the incoming traffic or that the timeout fires (condition timed wait, for instance.) When all threads are blocked, no VTALRM's should be scheduled (I don't know if CAP's pthread implements the last optimization.) > all threads sleeps), and permanenly keep part of code in memory. If it is > true (maybe I misunderstand something), then pthreads is bad solution for > heavy loaded systems. See above. It *is* true, as long as there are threads capable of running (i.e. not blocked), but this is the outcome one desires: runnable threads run. As soon as all threads are blocked, the scheduler goes to sleep, so to say, and is eligible for LRU paging. Naturally, for really heavy bursty I/O, kernel based threads would be better, but there are very many instances of potential threading where kernel based threads are just too heavyweight. The VIPER project for Linux produced some interesting documentation on the matter and contains pointers for further reading, if anyone is interested (it never came to bloom, AFAIK, for political reasons) /Marino > > Igor > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 04:27:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA14477 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 04:27:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA14467 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 04:27:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA00358; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 04:23:24 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608121123.EAA00358@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Igor Khasilev cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:00:10 +0300." <199608120900.MAA21710@jabber.paco.odessa.ua> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 04:23:23 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >From The Desk Of Igor Khasilev : > > BTW, is there any person who coordinate works on threads for freebds kernel? John Birrell is our thread guru ... Cheers, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 04:52:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA15581 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 04:52:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA15557; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 04:52:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA01304; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:51:37 +0200 (MET DST) To: Peter Childs cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ijppp ms client support In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 10 Aug 1996 20:02:05 +0930." <199608101032.UAA07635@al.imforei.apana.org.au> Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:51:36 +0200 Message-ID: <1302.839850696@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199608101032.UAA07635@al.imforei.apana.org.au>, Peter Childs writes > I've got some patches here that I built ontop of > 2.1.5's user ppp code and it patches fine against 2.2-current > code. Please submit this via a send-pr -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 05:01:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id FAA15964 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 05:01:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.76.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id FAA15946; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 05:01:31 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608121201.FAA15946@freefall.freebsd.org> Received: by cheops.anu.edu.au (1.37.109.16/16.2) id AA285191268; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:01:08 +1000 From: Darren Reed Subject: Re: Load-balancing box To: danny@panda.hilink.com.au (Daniel O'Callaghan) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:01:08 +1000 (EST) Cc: sos@freebsd.org, michaelh@cet.co.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, ipfilter@coombs.anu.edu.au In-Reply-To: from "Daniel O'Callaghan" at Aug 12, 96 06:51:37 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In some mail from Daniel O'Callaghan, sie said: > On Mon, 12 Aug 1996 sos@FreeBSD.org wrote: > > > In reply to Michael Hancock who wrote: > > > > > > A designated IP number can be setup so that when it hits the box it > > > translates it to one of the IP addresses for the multiple servers sitting > > > behind it. Otherwise it just functions as bridge. > > > > > > If a server goes down then it stops dispatching requests to it. > > > > Nice idea, I'll give them that... > > > > > How hard would it be to build something like this with FreeBSD? > > > > Actually I think it would be pretty easy, depending on how familliar > > one is with the network code. > > Darren Reed already has working src ip translation. It should not be hard > to change it to dest addr translation. > > See http://coombs.anu.edu.au/~avalon/ Actually, it is almost already part and parcel of the package. As Daniel mentions, it does NAT (forward, output triggered). On the other side, you can redirect packets (input triggered) to an arbitary destination. One use of that solution is for transparent proxying (using ftp-gw from FWTK is an example with patches supplied). TO solve the above, you would simply do something like: rdr ed0 webserver/32 port 80 -> webserver1 port 80 rdr ed0 webserver/32 port 8000 -> webserver2 port 80 rdr ed0 webserver/32 port 8080 -> webserver3 port 80 ...although this isn't programmed for load balancing, it wouldn't be too hard to bring that in under its wing. (The above means packets coming in on interface ed0 to webserver,port are changed to goto the address on the right of the "->"). Darren From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 05:32:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id FAA16976 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 05:32:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id FAA16965 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 05:32:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id FAA00310 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 05:32:01 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608121232.FAA00310@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Dallas Semiconductors RTC? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 05:32:01 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Say does anyone know of motherboards which carries Dallas Semiconductors Real Time Clock module? Tnks, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 06:00:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA17935 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:00:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA17929 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:00:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA07690; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:00:01 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199608121300.GAA07690@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: Dallas Semiconductors RTC? To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:00:01 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608121232.FAA00310@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty" at Aug 12, 96 05:32:01 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Say does anyone know of motherboards which carries Dallas Semiconductors > Real Time Clock module? Hmmm... don't have a Dallas databook handy but my understanding was that this (or at least *one* of their products like this!) fit piggyback (actually, piggybelly) onto an existing ROM... --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 06:19:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA18468 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:19:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from al.imforei.apana.org.au (root@al.imforei.apana.org.au [202.12.89.41]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA18444 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:18:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from pjchilds@localhost) by al.imforei.apana.org.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA26442; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:47:34 +0930 (CST) From: Peter Childs Message-Id: <199608121317.WAA26442@al.imforei.apana.org.au> Subject: Re: ijppp ms client support To: phk@critter.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:47:34 +0930 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <1302.839850696@critter.tfs.com> from Poul-Henning Kamp at "Aug 12, 96 01:51:36 pm" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL13 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > In message <199608101032.UAA07635@al.imforei.apana.org.au>, Peter Childs writes > > I've got some patches here that I built ontop of > > 2.1.5's user ppp code and it patches fine against 2.2-current > > code. > > Please submit this via a send-pr Its on its way... It really needs someone with a bit of experience to take it in hand and sort out the "to be included" stuff etc. My experience in this area is limited, but hopefully this will inspire someone to give this the hour or two of expert attention it needs :) Regards, Peter -- Peter Childs --- http://www.imforei.apana.org.au/~pjchilds Finger pjchilds@al.imforei.apana.org.au for public PGP key From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 06:26:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA18724 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:26:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aida.aida.org (root@codix3.codix.fr [194.98.13.103]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA18686; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:25:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aida.aida.org (didier@aida [128.127.10.1]) by aida.aida.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA00554; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:11:04 GMT Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:11:04 +0200 (MET DST) From: didier@aida.org To: jkh@freebsd.org cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: problems with 960801-SNAP Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi I've had a few problems with this SNAP. - with user PPP the default route is not automaticly added (even after having inserted "add 0 0 ip" in the script file) - with kernel ppp I get the following message. pppd[xxx] ioctl(TIOCSETD) : operation not supported by device. are this problem resolved (I dont want to reinvent the wheel :) ) or do you want me to investigate on one or both of this problems ? the problem with user ppp seems to be linked to routed. it seems that the route is refused because the link is not totally established when user ppp issue the command to add the default route. I have the same problem with the old version of user ppp (May SNAP) Thanks for your help -- Didier Derny | Private FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT Site Email: didier@aida.org | Microsoft Free Computer. Homepage: http://www.codix.fr/~dderny | Pentium 150 on ASUS P/I-P55TP4N From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 06:37:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA19079 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:37:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA19067; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:36:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA01531; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:35:46 +0200 (MET DST) To: didier@aida.org cc: jkh@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: problems with 960801-SNAP In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:11:04 +0200." Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:35:45 +0200 Message-ID: <1529.839856945@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message , didier@aida. org writes: >Hi > >I've had a few problems with this SNAP. > >- with user PPP the default route is not automaticly added > (even after having inserted "add 0 0 ip" in the script file) make sure routed doesn't run. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 08:10:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA23673 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 08:10:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA23666 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 08:10:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (RBI-Z-5/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA11162 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:05:31 +0200 Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA01921 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:18:21 +0200 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:18:21 +0200 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199608121518.RAA01921@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: SNAP 0801 observations Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Wanted to install on sd2 (have sd0, sd1 and sd2). Chose Custom->Partition [ ] sd0 [ ] sd1 [X] sd2 (hitting the blank key throws me into that partition menu) A Q [*] Bootmgr (chose this and get the same [ ] sd0 [ ] sd [ ] sd2 screen) I assume (hope) this refers only to the boot menu being written to the selected drive. But later this menu pops up again with two [X] (one at sd0 and one at sd2). I stopped here and decided to write the Bootmgr later and bailed out. I'd suggest to have a different menu/box asking where the bootmanager should be written or combine it into one. The selection of the distribution, especially X11 is still requiring some getting accustomized. There is an Exit entry and an [OK] button. Hitting OK leaves you into that menu while in other cases you leave it. This is a bit inconsistent. Please, don't take it like nitpicking, the installation menu is very fine already - I tried to install a German Linux (S.u.s.e.) distribution over the weekend, they don't have an install floppy at all. DOS is required to bootstrap yourself, go figure - Anyway, these are the two observations I made and which I found a bit puzzling. One last observation: I tried to use that 0801 boot.flp to do a 2.1.0 installation from CD. I got a warning that the CD is pre-2.1.5 but I chose to continue the installation. After a while I got the messages that bin dist and some other distributions could not be installed and that the installation failed. :-( --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 08:11:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA23729 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 08:11:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA23701 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 08:11:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.7.5/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA28641; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:10:55 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608121510.JAA28641@rover.village.org> To: Don Yuniskis Subject: Re: Dallas Semiconductors RTC? Cc: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 12 Aug 1996 06:00:01 PDT Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:10:54 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk : > Say does anyone know of motherboards which carries Dallas Semiconductors : > Real Time Clock module? : : Hmmm... don't have a Dallas databook handy but my understanding was that : this (or at least *one* of their products like this!) fit piggyback : (actually, piggybelly) onto an existing ROM... They also make plug compatible replaces that usually have a cool new feature or two added in. I have one in a MIPS PC motherboard, for example, that also stores the EISA bus configuration information. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 08:47:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA25103 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 08:47:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aida.aida.org (root@codix6.codix.fr [194.98.13.106]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA25082; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 08:46:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aida.aida.org (didier@aida [128.127.10.1]) by aida.aida.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA00287; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:48:56 GMT Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 19:48:56 +0200 (MET DST) From: didier@aida.org To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: jkh@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: problems with 960801-SNAP In-Reply-To: <1529.839856945@critter.tfs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > In message , didier@aida. > org writes: > >Hi > > > >I've had a few problems with this SNAP. > > > >- with user PPP the default route is not automaticly added > > (even after having inserted "add 0 0 ip" in the script file) > > make sure routed doesn't run. > > -- > Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. > http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. > whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. > Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. > It works since I killed routed thanks for your advice. could you explain ? one of my client is using routed (what can I do to solve the problem for him) -- Didier Derny | Private FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT Site Email: didier@aida.org | Microsoft Free Computer. Homepage: http://www.codix.fr/~dderny | Pentium 150 on ASUS P/I-P55TP4N From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 09:15:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA26584 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:15:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.crl.com (mail.crl.com [165.113.1.22]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA26541; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:15:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Haldjas.folklore.ee by mail.crl.com with SMTP id AA07144 (5.65c/IDA-1.5); Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:07:02 -0700 Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA14039; Fri, 9 Aug 1996 12:40:46 +0300 Date: Fri, 9 Aug 1996 12:40:45 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: HOSOKAWA Tatsumi , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jfieber@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: New L10N boot floppy for 2.1.5-RELEASE In-Reply-To: <28292.839580908@time.cdrom.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 9 Aug 1996, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > I removed some dirty hacks from Makefiles of src/release (you can make > > original English version if you don't define any L10N options in > > src/release/Makafile), and our L10N team finished the extraction of > > "hardcoded" message of sysinstall into external text file. So, this > > version can be easily extended to support other languages. > > Excellent! I've always had something like this on my TODO list, along > with the floppy docs, FAQ and Handbook. > > We still need to work with John Fieber on some scheme of maintaining > multiple parallel language versions of our docs, as well as > eliminating the boot floppy docs and making them subsections of the > handbook instead, or translation work is going to remain brute-force > and overly difficult. > > Please don't misunderstand me, either. I think that the work you and > the L10N team are doing is great, and is something which fills a very > definite short-term need. I'm just somewhat afraid of having another > ``FreeBSD 2.0.5'' where a lot of work was expended in doing > bruce-force translations but almost none at all in implementing the > kind of framework which would have allowed that work to be carried > successfully forward into 2.1 and 2.1.5 (and I blame myself for this > more than anyone else). As a result, we got one version of FreeBSD > I18N'd when we might have gotten 3 for only a little extra effort. > > I will look at your changes to sysinstall and try to merge them back > into -current. For the documentation, I think it's really time to > decide just what needs to be done and do it. We've only talked about > doing something for too long, and the emergence of these floppies a > signal to me that the user base is tired of waiting! :-) > > John, do you have time for this right now? Anyone else interested in > engaging on a little architectural discussion on the side? Is the open to others aswell? It is more of a theoretical question, as there are way to few FreeBSD users around here, but would it generaly be tolerated/accepted that there could be N international versions of FreeBSD that differ in only say documenttion and possibly the output of some programs (I'm *not* talking about the complete rewrite of the output of all programs, not even translating all the man pages). Let's just say somewhere someone crazy and resourceful enough (and that certainly am not I and it is *not* an offence at the Japanese or anyone else) to make a version of FreeBSD suited to that particular language environment. Provided of course that the person(s) will also maintain it. Will it be possible in such case to keep it all in the CVS repository? And if a Japanese (or whatever) friend of mine comes to visit me, will I be able to specify some tag (say JAPANESE), do a cvs checkout using it on my spare computer, build world and - give for the time s/he stays with me to him/her a compurter running Japanese FreeBSD? Sander PS. This all is just a curious question. I am not going to undertake any such project myself and I don't know any who would. Neither do I have Japanese friends :-( (it's always good having friends). > > Jordan > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 09:22:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA26908 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:22:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA26879; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:21:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA25398; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:16:39 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608121616.JAA25398@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: machine crashing, what panic: free means? To: gpalmer@FreeBSD.ORG (Gary Palmer) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:16:39 -0700 (MST) Cc: lmcsato@lmc.ericsson.se, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <28182.839817357@orion.webspan.net> from "Gary Palmer" at Aug 11, 96 10:35:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Samy Touati wrote in message ID > > Does anybody knows what a free panic means? > > We didn't charge you for it. > > :-) 8-). Generally, it means that something was freed twice. THis is a bad thing. Typically, you can get this from reallocating vnodes by rolling off the top of the freelist back to the tail. There is an off-by-1 error that will let this happen. I think newer versions of the OS (you didn't identify your version) had my patch rolled in (it was a kludge in the vfs_subr.c; you can get the patch from the -current list archive on www.freebsd.org -- or update your code). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 09:24:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA27082 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:24:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA27035 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:23:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA25407; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:18:05 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608121618.JAA25407@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Huuuuuuuuuuuge INN history.pag? To: taob@io.org (Brian Tao) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:18:05 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Brian Tao" at Aug 11, 96 10:51:29 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > This isn't good, is it? > > 243448 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 249158785 Aug 11 22:49 history > 1 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 123 Aug 11 22:49 history.dir > 20696 -rw-rw-r-- 1 news news 140737509515644 Aug 11 22:49 history.pag > > > I know the file really isn't that large, but I presume the EOF > marker has been blown way out for some reason. The news server seems > to be running still, but this sort of thing worries me. ;-) > inn-1.4unoff3 (no mmap), 2.2-960501-SNAP. Anyone else seen this > before? I think it's more likely that it's just a sparse file at maxfilesize. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 09:24:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA27145 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:24:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ref.tfs.com ([206.245.251.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA27030 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:23:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by ref.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA09649 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:23:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA13689; Fri, 9 Aug 1996 12:05:40 +0300 Date: Fri, 9 Aug 1996 12:05:39 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: "Hr.Ladavac" , Mark Diekhans , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: What are the plans for ELF support? In-Reply-To: <28158.839579412@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 9 Aug 1996, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > What for? Is there something that the half-assed[1] GNU ELF support gains > > you that the a.out libraries don't have (remember: we're not Linux, a.out > > libs are really dynamically--read PIC--linked)? > > I wouldn't have phrased it quite that way. > > There's been experimental work underway for months to make FreeBSD > generate native ELF binaries, and you can even get a pre-release kit > for it all from John Polstra, there's just no rush to *replace* any of > our a.out based stuff with ELF. As has already been said in this list > many, many times before (and Mark should learn to use the mail archive > search feature at http://www.freebsd.org, using "ELF" as a keyword > ;-), we'll only switch to ELF if and when it demonstrates a set of > advantages which outweigh the disadvantages of changing. > I hope there will remain the compat kit for those who might want to use old programs. Or will FreeBSD be able to "on the fly" mix and match ELF and a.out libs and binaries? Sander > Jordan > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 09:24:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA27088 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:24:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ref.tfs.com ([206.245.251.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA27036 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:23:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by ref.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA09652 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:23:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA00527; Wed, 7 Aug 1996 19:09:52 +0300 Date: Wed, 7 Aug 1996 19:09:52 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: "Eric L. Hernes" cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: updating mkisofs to 1.05 - thoughts? In-Reply-To: <199608071544.KAA15925@jake.lodgenet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 7 Aug 1996, Eric L. Hernes wrote: > "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: > >I could: > > > >1. Import 1.05 on the `mkisofs' vendor branch and merge, as usual. > > > >or > > > >2. Import anew into /usr/src/contrib/gnu/mkisofs and turn > > /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/mkisofs into a stub. > > > > no real opinions on 1 or 2 here. I'm fixin' to put in the ability > to make bootable CDs, some of which will go here; as soon as I > get hardware that supports booting to CD. > > >or > > > >3. Admit that hardly anyone other than me uses mkisofs and we should > > move it into /usr/ports. :-) > > I suspect that more people are using it than you think. We've got > two burners here hooked up to FBSD machines. It would be nice to have it in the system. Ports are fine but sometimes they just aren't that. It isn't so big after all. Sander > > > > > Jordan > > > eric. > > -- > erich@lodgenet.com > http://rrnet.com/~erich erich@rrnet.com > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 09:31:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA27533 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:31:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA27520 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:31:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA25431; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:26:21 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608121626.JAA25431@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Load-balancing box To: michaelh@cet.co.jp (Michael Hancock) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:26:21 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Michael Hancock" at Aug 12, 96 02:10:02 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Cisco has a cool new product called LocalDirector that looks like the > perfect load balancing solution. > > The box has an Intel MB, P133, and 2 Intel 10/100 Ethernet cards. > > A designated IP number can be setup so that when it hits the box it > translates it to one of the IP addresses for the multiple servers sitting > behind it. Otherwise it just functions as bridge. > > When it dispatches the request to one of the servers it starts a timer to > measure the response time. It uses the response time statistics to > determine which server to dispatch the next request to. > > If a server goes down then it stops dispatching requests to it. > > How hard would it be to build something like this with FreeBSD? I think this is only marginally more useful than using DNS to set up cluster aliases. Specifically, it can react when one of the machines goes down (but how can it know?). The whole problem is that you connect to an address instead of a service in the first place -- this type of load balancing assumes all clients have statistically identical duration, and doesn't truly balance the load between the boxes. For example, if I have 3 boxes, and 300 incoming connections are made, and 200 of them leave, one box can have 100 connections and the other two can be idle. The fix is called "service anonymity" and requires a fundamental change in the way addresses get resolved/routed, and the ability to actively retarget session state (if any) from one server to another through consensus of the servers in the cluster. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 09:41:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA28172 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:41:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA28166 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:40:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA25453; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:31:11 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608121631.JAA25453@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: lada@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at (Hr.Ladavac) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:31:10 -0700 (MST) Cc: igor@jabber.paco.odessa.ua, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608121040.AA063596403@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at> from "Hr.Ladavac" at Aug 12, 96 12:40:03 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The VIPER project for Linux produced some interesting documentation on the > matter and contains pointers for further reading, if anyone is interested > (it never came to bloom, AFAIK, for political reasons) The *Novell* VIPER project? I don't remember you... It's called "Caldera". Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 09:42:15 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA28248 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:42:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from main.gbdata.com (GB2.Brewich.COM [207.90.222.20]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA28219 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:42:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from gclarkii@localhost) by main.gbdata.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) id LAA12241 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:41:49 -0500 (CDT) From: Gary Clark II Message-Id: <199608121641.LAA12241@main.gbdata.com> Subject: MOTIF: combobox? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:41:48 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello, Does anyone know when Combo-boxes went into motif? My libs and includes don't have this (Old Old Old version). Gary -- Gary Clark II (N5VMF) | I speak only for myself and "maybe" my company gclarkii@GBData.COM | Member of the FreeBSD Doc Team Providing Internet and ISP startups mail info@GBData.COM for information FreeBSD FAQ at ftp://ftp.FreeBSD.ORG/pub/FreeBSD/docs/freebsd-faq.ascii From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:07:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA29195 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:07:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA29177 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:07:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA25508; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:54:21 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608121654.JAA25508@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: igor@jabber.paco.odessa.ua (Igor Khasilev) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:54:21 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608120912.MAA21871@jabber.paco.odessa.ua> from "Igor Khasilev" at Aug 12, 96 12:12:33 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> So my question is: how does NT behave when it has to schedule between a >> large number of processes each with its own process context, VM, page tables >> etc? Conversely how does the unix program behave when linked with -lpthreads >> and with `fork()' replaced with `pthread_create()'? > > One bad thing with user level threads (actualy pthreads that I used): > sheduler which runs on user lever ALWAYS consume processor time (even wnen > all threads sleeps), and permanenly keep part of code in memory. If it is > true (maybe I misunderstand something), then pthreads is bad solution for > heavy loaded systems. This should not be true if it is implemented correctly. It is either using signals to switch (like "sigsched" threads) or it is using async I/O and aiowait() when no context is active, using conversion of sync I/O to async I/O + a context switch (like SunOS 4.x LWP), or it is using descriptor hybridization and is using select internally as its "aiowait" async I/O equivalent (where the I/O is not posted until such time as it would not block). In any of these implementations, user space threads do not "ALWAYS consume processor". The *point* of user space threads is to consume as much of your process quantum as you can possibly consume. The idea is that the process quantum is something the system gives a process, and by God, it's the right of that process to consume as much of the quantum as possible. The general problem with kernel threads is that they are typically lazy implementations. In general, a kernel threads implementation takes a blocking I/O, and blocks the context making the call, and switches. On an unloaded machine, it switches to another thread in the same context; on a loaded machine, it's as expensive as the process context switch, because it's statistically unlikely to schedule threads in the same process concurrently (if the scheduler is hacked to allow that, then other processes can dies of starvation). A process using user level threads competes with other processes as if it were one process (ie: it is awarded one quantum). A process using kernel threads competes with other processes as if it were the number of processes equal to the number of kernel threads allocated to the process. A kernel threaded process must allocate as many kernel threads as it has potential simultaneous outstanding blocking calls, or it will suffer quantum starvation on one or more of it's threads. This is evil, because the system gave the quantum to the process, and the kernel thread gave the remainder of the quantum back to the system without giving another kernel thread in the same process the option of using the remainder. Obviously, the ideal mechanism is combined kernel and user threads, with cooperative scheduling of kernel process quantums in user space against the thread contexts that are blocked awaiting quantum. This will result in the best overall utilization with the fewest true context switches. The primary benefit of kernel threads is SMP scalability of parallelizable algorithms. The secondary benefit of kernel threads is in terms of quantum allocability as a gross measure of how zealously you want to let your threads compete with other processes which are also competing for quantum. There are a number of usenet discussions on threading between myself and engineers at Sun and elsewhere; you can look them up on Dejanews. Since kernel threading is heavily related to SMP scalability of processes, the SMP group of FreeBSD has dealt some with the issue. One very good engineer has implemented kernel threading on FreeBSD, and the code has been submitted; from what I understand, the code will be integrated into the final SMP release, with only minor changes. The resoloution of the kernel threading quantum and context switch problems (current problems for both SVR4 and Solaris threading, which are derived from the same Sun code base) will have to wait for better async->sync call conversion. In all likelihood, this will be implemented by adding a system call for a more generic "aiowait/aiocancel" that is not so I/O bound, and an alternate system call vector to allow all potentially blocking system calls to be converted to queued calls plus a user space context switch. In this way, the kernel threading problem of blocking thread execution and throwing away perfectly good quantum on process context switches, can be eliminated. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:10:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA29357 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:10:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA29345 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:10:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA25522; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:58:51 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608121658.JAA25522@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: koshy@india.hp.com (A JOSEPH KOSHY) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 09:58:51 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608120651.AA091782688@fakir.india.hp.com> from "A JOSEPH KOSHY" at Aug 12, 96 12:21:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Sometime back there was a posting comparing the behaviour of FreeBSD and > NT wrt a test program that created lots of processes and stressed the OS. > (I've unfortunately lost the original mails). > > It struck me that the NT version of the program was using `CreateThread()' > while the Unix (FreeBSD) version was using `fork()'. > > Now I don't know much about NT internals, but it seems to me that the NT > approach wouldn't lead to as many process context switches since the threads > would be sharing the same address space. Therefore the load on the VM system > would be no different from having 1 process. Assuming all thread context switches as the result of blocking operations were only to other threads in the same process, this would be true. Unfortuantely (for the process) it is not... a happy thing for the user, who may have other processes he wishes to run instead of starving all but the threaded process for quantum. > The poster reported a slowdown on NT with many threads but no crashes, which > seems logical since multiple threads would consume CPU time, and not placing > a load on the VM would mean it wouldn't crash :-). There are many ways to thrash NT to death. The test program that sparked this debate thrashes the buffer cache significantly because of the lack of per FS object working set restrictions. In VMS, this would be a tunable. > So my question is: how does NT behave when it has to schedule between a > large number of processes each with its own process context, VM, page tables > etc? Conversely how does the unix program behave when linked with -lpthreads > and with `fork()' replaced with `pthread_create()'? I have no relevent data for this question. Please see my other posting inre: threading models to get an idea of what the answer should be on a UP vs. and SMP system. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:11:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA29457 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:11:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA29432 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:11:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA25536; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:03:33 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608121703.KAA25536@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:03:33 -0700 (MST) Cc: michaelv@HeadCandy.com, koshy@india.hp.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608120747.AAA00372@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty" at Aug 12, 96 00:47:26 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > We don't have kernel level support for threads [ ... ] John Dyson has the Inna code for kernel threads in FreeBSD. There are VM issues to resolve before it can be released. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:12:41 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA29600 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:12:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA29582 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:12:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA25549; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:06:31 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608121706.KAA25549@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: MOTIF: combobox? To: gclarkii@main.gbdata.com (Gary Clark II) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:06:31 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608121641.LAA12241@main.gbdata.com> from "Gary Clark II" at Aug 12, 96 11:41:48 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Does anyone know when Combo-boxes went into motif? My libs and includes > don't have this (Old Old Old version). At least 1.2 if not 2.0; I don't remember an XmComboBox in 1.2, though... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:21:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA00324 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:21:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shogun.tdktca.com ([206.26.1.21]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA00308 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:21:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shogun.tdktca.com (daemon@localhost) by shogun.tdktca.com (8.7.2/8.7.2) with ESMTP id MAA08004 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:21:36 -0500 (CDT) Received: from fa.tdktca.com (bsd.fa.tdktca.com [163.49.131.129]) by shogun.tdktca.com (8.7.2/8.7.2) with ESMTP id MAA07997 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:21:36 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from alex@localhost) by fa.tdktca.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id MAA10780; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:29:48 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:29:48 -0500 (CDT) From: Alex Nash To: Terry Lambert cc: "Hr.Ladavac" , igor@jabber.paco.odessa.ua, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: <199608121631.JAA25453@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > > The VIPER project for Linux produced some interesting documentation on the > > matter and contains pointers for further reading, if anyone is interested > > (it never came to bloom, AFAIK, for political reasons) > > The *Novell* VIPER project? I don't remember you... > > It's called "Caldera". If my memory serves me correctly, the (non-Novell) Viper project was an effort to get kernel threads going under Linux. Alex From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:35:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA00996 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:35:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA00991 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:35:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dialup-usr11.etinc.com (dialup-usr11.etinc.com [204.141.95.132]) by etinc.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA16750 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:39:31 -0400 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:39:31 -0400 Message-Id: <199608121739.NAA16750@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: hackers@freebsd.org From: dennis@etinc.com (Dennis) Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >E-mail message from Igor Khasilev contained: >> >> > So my question is: how does NT behave when it has to schedule between a >> > large number of processes each with its own process context, VM, page tables >> > etc? Conversely how does the unix program behave when linked with -lpthreads >> > and with `fork()' replaced with `pthread_create()'? >> >> One bad thing with user level threads (actualy pthreads that I used): >> sheduler which runs on user lever ALWAYS consume processor time (even wnen > >Only when *really* poorly implemented. Otherwise it waits in select(2) to >be awaken by the incoming traffic or that the timeout fires (condition timed >wait, for instance.) When all threads are blocked, no VTALRM's should be >scheduled (I don't know if CAP's pthread implements the last optimization.) This is all very nice, but on a macro level NT has two very obvious problems to consider: 1) Its rather new... 2) It was written by Microsoft Much more significant than the above.... Dennis From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:40:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA01274 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:40:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA01262 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:40:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA11087; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:48:28 +0300 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:48:27 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Terry Lambert cc: Igor Khasilev , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: <199608121654.JAA25508@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > Obviously, the ideal mechanism is combined kernel and user threads, > with cooperative scheduling of kernel process quantums in user space > against the thread contexts that are blocked awaiting quantum. This > will result in the best overall utilization with the fewest true > context switches. > And is FreeBSD going to get this? It would be cool... Multi-threaded servers for different things (http, etc) are becoming to emerge more. > > The primary benefit of kernel threads is SMP scalability of parallelizable > algorithms. The secondary benefit of kernel threads is in terms of > quantum allocability as a gross measure of how zealously you want to > let your threads compete with other processes which are also competing > for quantum. > > > There are a number of usenet discussions on threading between myself > and engineers at Sun and elsewhere; you can look them up on Dejanews. > > > Since kernel threading is heavily related to SMP scalability of > processes, the SMP group of FreeBSD has dealt some with the issue. > One very good engineer has implemented kernel threading on FreeBSD, > and the code has been submitted; from what I understand, the code > will be integrated into the final SMP release, with only minor > changes. > Are there any plans for integration with the user level pthreads implemetation? Sander > > The resoloution of the kernel threading quantum and context switch > problems (current problems for both SVR4 and Solaris threading, which > are derived from the same Sun code base) will have to wait for better > async->sync call conversion. In all likelihood, this will be implemented > by adding a system call for a more generic "aiowait/aiocancel" that > is not so I/O bound, and an alternate system call vector to allow all > potentially blocking system calls to be converted to queued calls > plus a user space context switch. In this way, the kernel threading > problem of blocking thread execution and throwing away perfectly good > quantum on process context switches, can be eliminated. > > > Regards, > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:43:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA01410 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:43:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA01405 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:43:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by mail.cdsnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA25888; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:42:14 -0700 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:42:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen To: Joerg Wunsch cc: FreeBSD hackers , proff@suburbia.net Subject: Re: mmap #2 In-Reply-To: <199608120531.HAA03495@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I think it was the other way around, it was truncating a mmap'd file. Specifically, I had problems when the active file shrunk after an rmgroup, then I would get weird behaviour. John said he saw where that could potentially be problematic, but I never saw any fixes run by that addressed it by name. On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, J Wunsch wrote: > Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 07:31:45 +0200 (MET DST) > From: J Wunsch > Reply-To: Joerg Wunsch > To: FreeBSD hackers > Cc: proff@suburbia.net > Subject: Re: mmap #2 > > As Michael Hancock wrote: > > > > * Freebsd is purrrrfect. > > > * > > > > Cool program! > > > > I can see the ear to ear smiles on John and David and company's faces. > > Wasn't there still our long-suffering problem with INN & mmap()? I > forgot what exactly it is, something like extending an mmap'ed file > perhaps. > > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:51:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA01837 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:51:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA01809; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:51:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id MAA08683; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:50:57 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608121750.MAA08683@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Qpopper 2.2 To: greg@uswest.net (Greg Rowe) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:50:57 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, ports@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9608092147.ZM29253@nevis.oss.uswest.net> from "Greg Rowe" at Aug 9, 96 09:47:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Greetings, > > I'm trying to get the bulletin database(BULLDB) feature in qpopper-2.2 > working. I'm using the 2.1.5 ports version and adding the -DBULLDB entry in the > Makefile. > The pop_bull.c file seems to be missing an include ( ), but other > than that it compiles without error. > > The instructions call for you to create two empty files (bulldb.pag & > bulldb.dir) in the bulletin directory which I did. The first attempt to > retrieve a mail bulletin works fine but creates a zero length 'bulldb.db' file. > Further attempts to check mail fail with the error "Unable to open Bulletin > database". > Permissions don't seem to be the problem. Has anyone used this feature on > FreeBSD or does anyone have any ideas ? Thanks. Your _problem_ is that you are using Berkeley DB - not DBM - and B-DB does not use .pag and .dir files... the instructions aren't helpful for you. :-) If memory serves, there may be a few semantic differences in the C language interface. I think I ran into something similar once when porting a bit of code... I believe, if my flaky memory serves, that there was an argument mismatch of some sort. Sorry that's all I can tell you, ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:54:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA02066 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:54:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from glacier.wise.edt.ericsson.se (glacier-ext.wise.edt.ericsson.se [193.180.251.38]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA02048; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:54:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from egg.lmc.ericsson.se (egg.lmc.ericsson.se [142.133.32.1]) by glacier.wise.edt.ericsson.se (8.7.5/8.7.3/glacier-0.9) with SMTP id TAA23065; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 19:48:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from chicago.lmc.ericsson.se by egg.lmc.ericsson.se (4.1/LME-2.2) id AA11700; Mon, 12 Aug 96 13:47:58 EDT Received: (from lmcsato@localhost) by chicago.lmc.ericsson.se (8.7/8.7) id NAA05254; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:47:33 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:47:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Samy Touati X-Sender: lmcsato@chicago To: Terry Lambert Cc: Gary Palmer , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: machine crashing, what panic: free means? In-Reply-To: <199608121616.JAA25398@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I have version 2.1. I noticed that this happens when a lot of traffic is on the ethernet card, and these packets need to be redirected to the serial port at 115200 bauds. Could this bug be related to the CPU or the board being slow, for the packets throuput. On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > > Samy Touati wrote in message ID > > > Does anybody knows what a free panic means? > > > > We didn't charge you for it. > > > > :-) > > 8-). > > Generally, it means that something was freed twice. THis is a bad thing. > > Typically, you can get this from reallocating vnodes by rolling off the > top of the freelist back to the tail. There is an off-by-1 error that > will let this happen. I think newer versions of the OS (you didn't > identify your version) had my patch rolled in (it was a kludge in the > vfs_subr.c; you can get the patch from the -current list archive on > www.freebsd.org -- or update your code). > > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:54:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA02097 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:54:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA02083 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:54:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id UAA07814; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:04:37 +0200 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199608121804.UAA07814@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Load-balancing box To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:04:37 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: michaelh@cet.co.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608121626.JAA25431@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 12, 96 09:26:02 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > A designated IP number can be setup so that when it hits the box it > > translates it to one of the IP addresses for the multiple servers sitting > > behind it. Otherwise it just functions as bridge. ... > > I think this is only marginally more useful than using DNS to set > up cluster aliases. Agreed. > The whole problem is that you connect to an address instead of a service > in the first place -- this type of load balancing assumes all clients > have statistically identical duration, and doesn't truly balance the > load between the boxes. For example, if I have 3 boxes, and 300 incoming > connections are made, and 200 of them leave, one box can have 100 > connections and the other two can be idle. Statistically this is _very_ unlikely. You will not have perfect balancing, but not this kind of unbalancing. Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 10:57:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA02357 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:57:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA02351 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:57:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA25675; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:47:54 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608121747.KAA25675@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee (Narvi) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:47:54 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, igor@jabber.paco.odessa.ua, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Narvi" at Aug 12, 96 08:48:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Obviously, the ideal mechanism is combined kernel and user threads, > > with cooperative scheduling of kernel process quantums in user space > > against the thread contexts that are blocked awaiting quantum. This > > will result in the best overall utilization with the fewest true > > context switches. > > And is FreeBSD going to get this? It would be cool... Multi-threaded > servers for different things (http, etc) are becoming to emerge more. This will require waiting until kernel threads have been integrated; they are required before the thread scheduler code can be hacked. > > Since kernel threading is heavily related to SMP scalability of > > processes, the SMP group of FreeBSD has dealt some with the issue. > > One very good engineer has implemented kernel threading on FreeBSD, > > and the code has been submitted; from what I understand, the code > > will be integrated into the final SMP release, with only minor > > changes. > > Are there any plans for integration with the user level pthreads > implemetation? Not to my knowledge. The user level pthreads wants an async trap gate (or to be replaced by kernel threads) to be POSIX compliant, anyway. Yes, standards compliance has always been one of the things which decides what gets implemented how. Other than some experimental code that I did which never made it into the UnixWare 2.x release, I don't know of *any* user/kernel hybrid threads implementations, sorry. This is probably something I will hack on (since I feel strongly about it), but like many things, I need to wait for other code integration before I can do anything about it. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 11:01:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA02678 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:01:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pdx1.world.net (pdx1.world.net [192.243.32.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA02669 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:01:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from suburbia.net (suburbia.net [203.4.184.1]) by pdx1.world.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA03040; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:03:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: (proff@localhost) by suburbia.net (8.7.4/Proff-950810) id EAA29489; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:00:42 +1000 From: Julian Assange Message-Id: <199608121800.EAA29489@suburbia.net> Subject: Re: mmap #2 To: mrcpu@cdsnet.net (Jaye Mathisen) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:00:41 +1000 (EST) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, proff@suburbia.net In-Reply-To: from "Jaye Mathisen" at Aug 12, 96 10:42:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > I think it was the other way around, it was truncating a mmap'd file. > > Specifically, I had problems when the active file shrunk after an rmgroup, > then I would get weird behaviour. John said he saw where that could > potentially be problematic, but I never saw any fixes run by that > addressed it by name. Hmm. I only test behavior in the first block. There are a lot of complicated involvements that can happen when you play with the fd and the mmap at the same time. A number of mmap implimentations failed to do shared writes correctly, when "correctly" was defined opening a file, mmaping it, writing something to the mmaped region, lseek()ing back to offset 0, and then using read() to fetch data. -- "Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies, The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis, _God in the Dock_ +---------------------+--------------------+----------------------------------+ |Julian Assange RSO | PO Box 2031 BARKER | Secret Analytic Guy Union | |proff@suburbia.net | VIC 3122 AUSTRALIA | finger for PGP key hash ID = | |proff@gnu.ai.mit.edu | FAX +61-3-98199066 | 0619737CCC143F6DEA73E27378933690 | +---------------------+--------------------+----------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 11:33:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA04401 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:33:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA04389 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:33:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA02681; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:32:43 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id UAA18237; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:32:09 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id TAA01064; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 19:16:00 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608121716.TAA01064@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 19:16:00 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Weird pty problem In-Reply-To: <199608120744.RAA01049@godzilla.zeta.org.au>; from Bruce Evans on Aug 12, 1996 17:44:17 +1000 References: <199608120744.RAA01049@godzilla.zeta.org.au> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Bruce Evans: > This is more reasonable. It might be waiting for output to drain, > and something bad has happened to ptyp8. > > Does it really only happen for pty #8? Yes. > Is ptyp8 open? (Look for it with fstat or lsof.) Before it fails no. I've tried to use it again by launching an xterm with mutt as command. The state is: ttyp8 0 0 0 1296 256 108 OCZ de1580 12923 term 330 [19:10] root@keltia:/dev# lsof /dev/ptyp8 COMMAND PID USER FD TYPE DEVICE SIZE/OFF INODE NAME xterm 1029 root 4u VCHR 6, 8 0t0 3373 /dev/ptyp8 331 [19:10] root@keltia:/dev# lsof /dev/ttyp8 COMMAND PID USER FD TYPE DEVICE SIZE/OFF INODE NAME tcsh 1030 roberto 17u VCHR 5, 8 0t0 4052 /dev/ttyp8 tcsh 1030 roberto 18u VCHR 5, 8 0t0 4052 /dev/ttyp8 tcsh 1030 roberto 19u VCHR 5, 8 0t0 4052 /dev/ttyp8 mutt 1032 roberto 0u VCHR 5, 8 0t0 4052 /dev/ttyp8 mutt 1032 roberto 1u VCHR 5, 8 0t0 4052 /dev/ttyp8 mutt 1032 roberto 2u VCHR 5, 8 0t0 4052 /dev/ttyp8 Processes are: 101 1030 1029 9 18 0 940 640 pause Is ?? 0:00.30 /sbin/tcsh /usr/local/bin/run-mutt -f =lists/trn-test 101 1032 1030 305 104 0 484 964 - R ?? 1:46.47 /usr/local/bin/mutt -f =lists/trn-test I just don't understand why. If I exit X11 and reenter it, it will maybe work the for first command that ook on ttyp8 and then it will be unavailable. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 11:33:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA04408 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:33:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA04391 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:33:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by mail.cdsnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA00639 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:33:41 -0700 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:33:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: BSD/OS webperf notes, anybody want to test FreeBSD? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk http://www.BSDI.COM:81/products/internet-server/benchmarks/webperf.html I would think we could do better. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 11:37:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA04737 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:37:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fyeung5.netific.com (netific.vip.best.com [205.149.182.145]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA04723 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:37:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from fyeung@localhost) by fyeung5.netific.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA29783 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:42:38 GMT From: francis yeung Message-Id: <199608121142.LAA29783@fyeung5.netific.com> Subject: webbox with bsdi To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:42:38 +0000 () X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Greetings, The WebBox is a standalone BSDI system designed for personal web browsiing on TV. It contains no hard disk and has a CD drive. Is there a way that I can generate a standalone FreeBSD without hard disk ? What should I do with the swap space area ? Is there a virtual disk system (memory based) in FreeBSD ? If there is a one, can I assign the swap space to a file which resides in the virtual file system ? I have no intention to build a web box. But I want to create a floppy disk with a very small kernel which will run tcpdump so that I can use it as standalone traffic monitor to be used by the school for monitoring student's network traffic. It has to be standalone system and should NOT be downloaded from the network. Basically, the system gets booted up from the floppy disk and starts traffic monitoring. Thank you for your help. Francis From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 11:51:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA05644 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:51:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA05634 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:51:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id UAA03553; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:51:09 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id UAA21063; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:51:09 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA05396; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:48:05 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608121848.UAA05396@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: problems with 960801-SNAP To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:48:05 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: didier@aida.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from "didier@aida.org" at "Aug 12, 96 07:48:56 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As didier@aida.org wrote: > It works since I killed routed > thanks for your advice. > > could you explain ? > > one of my client is using routed (what can I do to solve the problem for him) Kill routed. ;-) Replace it by GateD or rdisc (whatever he actually needs it for). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 11:51:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA05675 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:51:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA05645 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:51:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id UAA03549; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:51:08 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id UAA21061; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:51:07 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA05368; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:46:55 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608121846.UAA05368@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: machine crashing, what panic: free means? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:46:55 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: lmcsato@lmc.ericsson.se (Samy Touati) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from Samy Touati at "Aug 12, 96 01:47:31 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Samy Touati wrote: > I have version 2.1. > I noticed that this happens when a lot of traffic is on the ethernet > card, and these packets need to be redirected to the serial port at > 115200 bauds. > Could this bug be related to the CPU or the board being slow, for the > packets throuput. All you can do is getting a core dump, and analyzing it. Refer to the section about kernel debugging in the handbook. Of course, you could also upgrade to 2.1.5 in the hope that it is already fixed. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 11:53:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA05819 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:53:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA05788 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:52:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id UAA03544; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:51:06 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id UAA21060; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:51:06 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA05347; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:45:18 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608121845.UAA05347@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: mmap #2 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:45:18 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: proff@suburbia.net Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608121800.EAA29489@suburbia.net> from Julian Assange at "Aug 13, 96 04:00:41 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Julian Assange wrote: > > I think it was the other way around, it was truncating a mmap'd file. > Hmm. I only test behavior in the first block. There are a lot of complicated > involvements that can happen [...] My only concern is that your test program should test this case as well, since it seems to be of practical importance. (The News gurus love it to have mmap() available in INN, and this bug is a show- stopper for them.) It's less scaring to admit that we have a problem in this area, than to release an mmap() test utility that does not test something that is a known bug. The latter will certainly be considered `biased' by the advocates of those operating systems that don't suffer from this problem. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 11:54:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA05935 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:54:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.siemens.at (proxy.siemens.at [192.138.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA05924 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 11:54:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sol1.gud.siemens.co.at (sol-f.gud.siemens-austria) by proxy.siemens.at with SMTP id AA00500 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for ); Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:53:35 +0200 Received: from ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at by sol1.gud.siemens.co.at with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #7 for ) id m0uq27J-000247C; Mon, 12 Aug 96 20:53 MET DST Received: by ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at (1.37.109.16/1.37) id AA164445827; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:50:27 +0200 From: "Hr.Ladavac" Message-Id: <199608121850.AA164445827@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:50:27 +0200 (MESZ) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608121631.JAA25453@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 12, 96 09:31:10 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk E-mail message from Terry Lambert contained: > > The VIPER project for Linux produced some interesting documentation on the > > matter and contains pointers for further reading, if anyone is interested > > (it never came to bloom, AFAIK, for political reasons) > > The *Novell* VIPER project? I don't remember you... Not that one (I don't know it even existed.) No wonder you don't know me :) Another one, it was presented on a symposium in Amsterdam, 1994. I'm pretty certain Jordan was there (we didn't meet, though.) Shortly after I switched to FreeBSD, and did not regret it :) /Marino From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 12:02:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA06537 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:02:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA06526 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:02:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA02701 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:02:12 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id VAA18570 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:01:49 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id UAA02791; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:53:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608121853.UAA02791@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:53:50 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: <199608121739.NAA16750@etinc.com>; from Dennis on Aug 12, 1996 13:39:31 -0400 References: <199608121739.NAA16750@etinc.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Dennis: > 1) Its rather new... > 2) It was written by Microsoft Blind bashing will never make things progress. >From what I've heard, NT is probably the first thing ever written by Microsoft that can be called "Operating System" even if I don't agree with many architectural and protocol choices (but I'm partial to Unix). It has flaws and bugs but which OS doesn't ? -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 12:05:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA06787 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:05:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.siemens.at (proxy.siemens.at [192.138.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA06780 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:05:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sol1.gud.siemens.co.at (sol-f.gud.siemens-austria) by proxy.siemens.at with SMTP id AA00770 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for ); Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:04:53 +0200 Received: from ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at by sol1.gud.siemens.co.at with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #7 for ) id m0uq2IH-000247C; Mon, 12 Aug 96 21:04 MET DST Received: by ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at (1.37.109.16/1.37) id AA164676506; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:01:46 +0200 From: "Hr.Ladavac" Message-Id: <199608121901.AA164676506@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:01:46 +0200 (MESZ) Cc: narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee, terry@lambert.org, igor@jabber.paco.odessa.ua, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608121747.KAA25675@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 12, 96 10:47:54 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk E-mail message from Terry Lambert contained: > > Other than some experimental code that I did which never made it > into the UnixWare 2.x release, I don't know of *any* user/kernel > hybrid threads implementations, sorry. Isn't SunOS 5 threads over LWP's such a hybrid (at least according to a rather ancient documentation which I had in hand.) Linux VIPER was designed as such as well (but I will not talk about long evaporated vaporware any more--sorry to have mentioned it at all, bitter taste lingers pretty long.) > > This is probably something I will hack on (since I feel strongly about > it), but like many things, I need to wait for other code integration > before I can do anything about it. I wish I had the time ... /Marino From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 12:13:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA07315 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:13:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from grumble.grondar.za (root@grumble.grondar.za [196.7.18.130]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA07262; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:12:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from grumble.grondar.za (mark@localhost.grondar.za [127.0.0.1]) by grumble.grondar.za (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA10070; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:12:18 +0200 (SAT) Message-Id: <199608121912.VAA10070@grumble.grondar.za> To: hackers@freebsd.org, scsi@freebsd.org Subject: 2 AHA1542's in one box Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:12:17 +0200 From: Mark Murray Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi Does anyone have any experience in putting 2 AHA1542 cards into one box? I tried this and have had no luck. Here is the saga: The first card is set to factory default and is an AHA1542C. The second has been moved to Port 0x240 DRQ 6 IRQ 9 and is an AHA1542B. After lots of fun-and-games while I actually got the card's strapping right :-), I can get the 1542C ^A-BIOS to do a diagnostic run on both cards and to probe for devices on both cards. Now - the first card works just fine. The second probes OK during FreeBSD boot, but hangs solid during the "waiting for SCSI devices to settle" pause. I have checked _everything_. The terminators are OK, the card works (strapped to factory default) in another machine, There are no DRQ/PORT/IRQ conflicts. The motherboard is a Megabyte G486 with an i486DX/50 and 16MB of RAM. Any clues? M -- Mark Murray 46 Harvey Rd, Claremont, Cape Town 7700, South Africa +27 21 61-3768 GMT+0200 Finger mark@grondar.za for PGP key From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 12:17:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA07556 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:17:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA07551 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:17:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id OAA08871; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:16:32 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608121916.OAA08871@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: webbox with bsdi To: fyeung@netific.com (francis yeung) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:16:32 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608121142.LAA29783@fyeung5.netific.com> from "francis yeung" at Aug 12, 96 11:42:38 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Greetings, > The WebBox is a standalone BSDI system designed for > personal web browsiing on TV. It contains no > hard disk and has a CD drive. So it has a hard disk, just of a different type :-) > Is there a way that I can generate a standalone FreeBSD > without hard disk ? What should I do with the swap space > area ? Is there a virtual disk system (memory based) in FreeBSD ? > If there is a one, can I assign the swap space to a file which > resides in the virtual file system ? No. You wouldn't want to stick swap in a MFS anyways... it would be silly to swap from RAM to RAM when you could have just left it in RAM to begin with. What you _can_ do: design a MFS that fits within the kernel (the way the boot.flp is built) and stick tcpdump in it. Stick it on a floppy. (I make this sound much easier than it is; I once built a router floppy using this technique and jammed _lots_ of utilities on it; it took all night to get it halfway right). Make sure you have the RAM to support the application. > I have no intention to build a web box. But I want to create > a floppy disk with a very small kernel which will run tcpdump > so that I can use it as standalone traffic monitor to be used > by the school for monitoring student's network traffic. > It has to be standalone system and should NOT be downloaded from > the network. Basically, the system gets booted up from the floppy > disk and starts traffic monitoring. Unless you have a compelling reason to make this work off of floppy (i.e. you don't have a dedicated machine which implies that you might be a student who is illicitly spying on others without the consent of the school)... I advise that you just pop for the hard disk and be done with it. Much less effort. On the other hand... Web boxes.. interesting concept. ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 12:22:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA08057 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:22:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.crl.com (mail.crl.com [165.113.1.22]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA08042 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:22:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Haldjas.folklore.ee by mail.crl.com with SMTP id AA16880 (5.65c/IDA-1.5 for ); Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:21:33 -0700 Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA11777; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:27:01 +0300 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:27:00 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Jaye Mathisen Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: BSD/OS webperf notes, anybody want to test FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Jaye Mathisen wrote: > > > http://www.BSDI.COM:81/products/internet-server/benchmarks/webperf.html > > > > I would think we could do better. And this is yet again me. I took a look at the MS supporting performance test and found that, as a matter of fact, even in that damn test, NT running IIS actually lost to BSDI in the CGI tests! And running the Netscape server, it lost around 2x on the light and medium CGI tests. So the test was actually all about comparing the Web servers and showing that Netscape server is certainly not up to the specs. The comparision with BSDI was just evil. The results with Apatche on BSDI vs. IIS on NT are IMHO quite predictable and not suprising at all. Sander > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 12:26:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA08482 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:26:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA08471 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:26:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA11699; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:12:45 +0300 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:12:45 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Jaye Mathisen cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: BSD/OS webperf notes, anybody want to test FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Jaye Mathisen wrote: > > > http://www.BSDI.COM:81/products/internet-server/benchmarks/webperf.html > > > > I would think we could do better. Sure. But we should not compare ourselves with BSDI, but with Microsoft, I think. It would be quite good. There is another way in which we could perhaps do the test - what would the benefit be in the difference in the cost of hardware to serve as well as Microsoft does. A motherboard with a meg of ram is a beast in itself... Sander > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 12:32:41 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA09096 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:32:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA09050 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:32:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA11737; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:17:04 +0300 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:17:03 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Ollivier Robert cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: <199608121853.UAA02791@keltia.freenix.fr> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Ollivier Robert wrote: > According to Dennis: > > 1) Its rather new... > > 2) It was written by Microsoft > > Blind bashing will never make things progress. > > >From what I've heard, NT is probably the first thing ever written by > Microsoft that can be called "Operating System" even if I don't agree with > many architectural and protocol choices (but I'm partial to Unix). > > It has flaws and bugs but which OS doesn't ? OK, how about getting along without another BSD vs. NT flame war? This thread started quite sensibly, for heavens sake, let's have it the favor of also ending so!!! Sander > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr > FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 12:33:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA09251 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:33:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA09077; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 12:32:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA11848; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:35:34 +0300 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:35:34 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Mark Murray cc: hackers@freebsd.org, scsi@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2 AHA1542's in one box In-Reply-To: <199608121912.VAA10070@grumble.grondar.za> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Mark Murray wrote: > Hi > > Does anyone have any experience in putting 2 AHA1542 cards into one > box? > > I tried this and have had no luck. Here is the saga: > > The first card is set to factory default and is an AHA1542C. The > second has been moved to Port 0x240 DRQ 6 IRQ 9 and is an AHA1542B. > After lots of fun-and-games while I actually got the card's strapping > right :-), I can get the 1542C ^A-BIOS to do a diagnostic run on both > cards and to probe for devices on both cards. > > Now - the first card works just fine. The second probes OK during > FreeBSD boot, but hangs solid during the "waiting for SCSI devices > to settle" pause. I have checked _everything_. The terminators are > OK, the card works (strapped to factory default) in another machine, > There are no DRQ/PORT/IRQ conflicts. > > The motherboard is a Megabyte G486 with an i486DX/50 and 16MB of RAM. > > Any clues? Hmm.... I'm not an expert with the Adaptec cards or with the PC bus designs, but wasn't it so that there could be only one bus master on the ISA bus? Sander > > M > -- > Mark Murray > 46 Harvey Rd, Claremont, Cape Town 7700, South Africa > +27 21 61-3768 GMT+0200 > Finger mark@grondar.za for PGP key > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 13:14:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA14369 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:14:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA14331 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:14:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA25950; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:08:58 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608122008.NAA25950@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: webbox with bsdi To: fyeung@netific.com (francis yeung) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:08:58 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608121142.LAA29783@fyeung5.netific.com> from "francis yeung" at Aug 12, 96 11:42:38 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The WebBox is a standalone BSDI system designed for > personal web browsiing on TV. It contains no > hard disk and has a CD drive. > > Is there a way that I can generate a standalone FreeBSD > without hard disk ? Yes; you will need to ROM the text portion of the kernel image, and ROM-with-load-to-RAM-on-startup the data. The kernel load address will need to be the ROM address after the segment register load. This is typical configuration for any ROM'able kernel for any system. > What should I do with the swap space area ? Just don't have one. This will limit your memory the the amount of real memory available. > Is there a virtual disk system (memory based) in FreeBSD ? Yes. > If there is a one, can I assign the swap space to a file which > resides in the virtual file system ? No. The RAM disk is subtracted from the available virtual memory (which is the available real memory + the available swap). In this case, there would be no difference between real memory and the RAM disk. It probably wouldn't work anyway -- it would be recursive. > I have no intention to build a web box. But I want to create > a floppy disk with a very small kernel which will run tcpdump > so that I can use it as standalone traffic monitor to be used > by the school for monitoring student's network traffic. > It has to be standalone system and should NOT be downloaded from > the network. Basically, the system gets booted up from the floppy > disk and starts traffic monitoring. Replace one or more of the utilities on the install disk; this should do what you want. We do this locally, though we use a netboot to do it instead of using a floppy. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 13:22:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA15372 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:22:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA15346; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:22:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id NAA05590; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:17:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma005588; Mon Aug 12 13:17:28 1996 Message-ID: <320F912C.167EB0E7@whistle.com> Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:16:44 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b4 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mark Murray CC: hackers@freebsd.org, scsi@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2 AHA1542's in one box References: <199608121912.VAA10070@grumble.grondar.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Mark Murray wrote: > > Hi > > Does anyone have any experience in putting 2 AHA1542 cards into one > box? > > I tried this and have had no luck. Here is the saga: I've done this occasionally.. it always seemed to work.. sorry that's not much help but at least you should know that it is SUPPOSED to work.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 13:34:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA16846 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:34:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA16818 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:33:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA25973; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:24:13 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608122024.NAA25973@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: lada@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at (Hr.Ladavac) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:24:12 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee, igor@jabber.paco.odessa.ua, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608121901.AA164676506@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at> from "Hr.Ladavac" at Aug 12, 96 09:01:46 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Other than some experimental code that I did which never made it > > into the UnixWare 2.x release, I don't know of *any* user/kernel > > hybrid threads implementations, sorry. > > Isn't SunOS 5 threads over LWP's such a hybrid (at least according to > a rather ancient documentation which I had in hand.) No, it is not. The ability to associate multiple user contexts with a smaller number of shedulable kernel entities is a means of assigning number of quantum to a threaded process. The implementation does *NOT* cooperatively schedule user contexts to run on top of kernel entities based on kernl conversion of a blocking operation to an async operation + a context switch. I've already had this discussion with Bryan O'Sullivan of Sun Microsystems and other at USL... The confusion probably results from the University of Washington's user threads implementation (Paper: SPARC Register Windows and User Space Threading) that was the basis of Sun's LWP (Light Weight Process) user space thread implementation in SunOS 4.x. This is not to be confused with kernel schedulable entities in Solaris (also called LWP's or Light Weight Processes). The name space clash was probably done for the same reasons that Sun calls Solaris SunOS: marketing (Q: Can I buy SunOS? A: Yes, we would love to sell you "SunOS". Q: Does SunOS support LWP's? A: Yes, the "SunOS" you will be buying supports "LWP"'s just fine...). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 13:35:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA17137 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:35:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA17128 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:35:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dialup-usr11.etinc.com (dialup-usr11.etinc.com [204.141.95.132]) by etinc.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA17952; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 16:39:22 -0400 Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 16:39:22 -0400 Message-Id: <199608122039.QAA17952@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) From: dennis@etinc.com (Dennis) Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >According to Dennis: >> 1) Its rather new... >> 2) It was written by Microsoft > >Blind bashing will never make things progress. > >>From what I've heard, NT is probably the first thing ever written by >Microsoft that can be called "Operating System" even if I don't agree with >many architectural and protocol choices (but I'm partial to Unix). > >It has flaws and bugs but which OS doesn't ? Exactly my point. Its a new horizen for a company with a history of a long learning curve. Dennis From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 13:35:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA17177 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:35:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA17168 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:35:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id NAA05677; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:33:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma005675; Mon Aug 12 13:32:51 1996 Message-ID: <320F94C7.2781E494@whistle.com> Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:32:07 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b4 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Terry Lambert CC: francis yeung , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: webbox with bsdi References: <199608122008.NAA25950@phaeton.artisoft.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Is there a virtual disk system (memory based) in FreeBSD ? > > Yes. in -current, look at /usr/src/release/floppies. the boot floppy made there could easily be tailored to contain whatever you require. just duplicate teh 'boot' directory and edit it.. (worked lat time I checked.. Jordan, I went to a lot of trouble to separate out the disk production stuff and it worked fine last I looked. your commnets that it didn't work are a worry.. can you tell me what was wrong? it's a lot simpler than teh current stuff and should be easier to debug... From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 13:36:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA17298 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:36:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA17253; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:35:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailbox.mcs.com (Mailbox.mcs.com [192.160.127.87]) by Kitten.mcs.com (8.7.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id PAA12792; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:30:09 -0500 (CDT) Received: by mailbox.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Mon, 12 Aug 96 15:30 CDT Received: (from karl@localhost) by Jupiter.mcs.net (8.7.5/8.7.5) id PAA13465; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:30:07 -0500 (CDT) From: Karl Denninger Message-Id: <199608122030.PAA13465@Jupiter.mcs.net> Subject: Re: 2 AHA1542's in one box To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:30:07 -0500 (CDT) Cc: mark@grondar.za, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, scsi@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <320F912C.167EB0E7@whistle.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Aug 12, 96 01:16:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Mark Murray wrote: > > > > Hi > > > > Does anyone have any experience in putting 2 AHA1542 cards into one > > box? > > > > I tried this and have had no luck. Here is the saga: > > I've done this occasionally.. > it always seemed to work.. > > sorry that's not much help but at least you should know that > it is SUPPOSED to work.. > > julian I have made this successfully work on both BSDI and SVR4 (!) I've never tried it on FreeBSD, but given the SCSI architecture I can't see why it wouldn't work. However, the ISA interrupts and such have to be correct (and declared correctly in the config). I *do* know that two PCI adapters work properly, as do two EISA adapters; I've done both of those (our news system uses two PCI adapters now). -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity http://www.mcs.net/~karl | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available | 23 Chicagoland Prefixes, 13 ISDN, much more Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net/ Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 13:54:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA19733 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:54:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA19714 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:54:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA26050; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:47:58 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608122047.NAA26050@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: mmap #2 To: mrcpu@cdsnet.net (Jaye Mathisen) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:47:58 -0700 (MST) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, proff@suburbia.net In-Reply-To: from "Jaye Mathisen" at Aug 12, 96 10:42:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I think it was the other way around, it was truncating a mmap'd file. > > Specifically, I had problems when the active file shrunk after an rmgroup, > then I would get weird behaviour. John said he saw where that could > potentially be problematic, but I never saw any fixes run by that > addressed it by name. The question, of course, is what the heck does it mean when you mmap a file. If you interpret it as "provide page mappings into the address space of the process which made the mmap call equivalent to the size of the file at the time of the call", then you are asking for the page references to stay around, regardless of the fd-arbitrated file size. The problem is that if you truncate and automatically crop back the mapping following the truncation, shouldn't you also automatically increase the mapping in the extend case? The manual page is ambiguous as to what should happen to the address space on truncation. The implication of the interface is that the "len" parameter dictates that the size of the mapping object should be independent of the size of the file object. There is also an ambiguity with regard to "offset + len" being in excess of the file size. Finally, the documentation says "at most len bytes" instead of simply "len bytes", which implies that the mapped region is permitted to fall short of the actual mapping request when the file is smaller. Technically, the correct mechanism to eliminate all ambiguity would be to unmap , change the file size, and remap, for each time the file size is to be changed. This is true of Solaris, SunOS, and AIX, as well, where there are version dependencies on degree of VM and buffer cache unification, which can not be accounted for in any other way besides unmap, change, map. I would say that it is probably desirable to truncate the mapping region to the limit of the file length minus offset for the length requested, and adjust it up as the file is modified, until there are offset + len bytes mapped. This would require saving the value of the mapping request (perhaps 0 len should be the same as "dynamic" in this context, or (off_t)-1 (assuming 64 bit values are correctly sign-extended). I reiterate, however: this is not the current documented, nor expected behaviour, and further, you could only expect this behaviour on a machine where the VM and buffer cache were unified. For instance, the "failure" of some systems without a unified VM and buffer cache to do a read via fd of a page written via writing to a mapped page is to be expected when there is no protected mode write fault and a memory object is not being manipulated by a handle in such a way that the kernel can trap the manipulation in software (ie: copyin/copyout). Example: A 386 system will not honor the "Write Protect" bit of the MMU in protected mode, and will not generate a write fault to allow the buffer cache contents to be updated when the VM buffer is written through a valid user addressing. To resolve this, the page would have to be unmapped, generating a segmentation fault when written, and the fault handler would have to determine that it was an attempt to write page that is there, but which needs to generate a write fault call o the cache synchronization handler. It's possible to do this in a split cache environment, but it makes writing to mapped memory prohibitively expensive. In my opinion, it's INN at fault, not the OS's on which it runs; whoever wrote the mmap support didn't understand that they should use an mmap interface completely independent of using the fd insterface, since they could not depend on them being able to interoperate. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 13:57:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA20224 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:57:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA20213; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:57:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA26063; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:50:24 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608122050.NAA26063@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: machine crashing, what panic: free means? To: lmcsato@lmc.ericsson.se (Samy Touati) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:50:23 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, gpalmer@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Samy Touati" at Aug 12, 96 01:47:31 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have version 2.1. > I noticed that this happens when a lot of traffic is on the ethernet > card, and these packets need to be redirected to the serial port at > 115200 bauds. > Could this bug be related to the CPU or the board being slow, for the > packets throuput. It could be. Analyze the crash dump to locate the problem, and you'll be able to tell me. 8-). Otherwise, Joerg suggested that you update to 2.1.5 and hope it's been fixed, either on purpose, or because it was a side effect of something else that was fixed. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 14:01:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA20754 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:01:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA20737 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:01:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA26078; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:56:00 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608122056.NAA26078@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Load-balancing box To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:56:00 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, michaelh@cet.co.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608121804.UAA07814@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Aug 12, 96 08:04:37 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > The whole problem is that you connect to an address instead of a service > > in the first place -- this type of load balancing assumes all clients > > have statistically identical duration, and doesn't truly balance the > > load between the boxes. For example, if I have 3 boxes, and 300 incoming > > connections are made, and 200 of them leave, one box can have 100 > > connections and the other two can be idle. > > Statistically this is _very_ unlikely. You will not have perfect > balancing, but not this kind of unbalancing. Depends. DNS information can be caches (and generally is) despite setting a short expiration (ie: your suggested expiration is overridden). If you live near a terminal branch in the Internet, you are likely to have the remainder of your branch assigned one address and the rest of the Internet assigned another. This is only worse now that Internic is fighting to get address scoping set up so that ISP address ranges can be homogeneously routed without route flopping. Sprint is pretty much the only holdout still having serious route floppage. I would be interested in a monitoring system that would report connections per cluster member -- but, of course, if you had that, you would be able to implement load balancing a better way anyway. 8-(. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 14:08:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA21576 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:08:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA21527; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:08:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA26100; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:00:50 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608122100.OAA26100@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: 2 AHA1542's in one box To: narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee (Narvi) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:00:50 -0700 (MST) Cc: mark@grondar.za, hackers@freebsd.org, scsi@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Narvi" at Aug 12, 96 10:35:34 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hmm.... I'm not an expert with the Adaptec cards or with the PC bus > designs, but wasn't it so that there could be only one bus master on the > ISA bus? You are thinking VESA, I think. It should work fine. He will probably have to lower "bus on" time in both cards, since they both will steal DRAM refresh cycles during DMA. He will also need to make sure that they don't share any settings, and that his non-default setting on one card do not conflict with the other. Finally, he will have to disable the BIOS on one card -- probably the B. The ^A stuff might screw the B card badly... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 14:14:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA22274 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:14:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Gatekeeper.Lamb.net (root@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net [206.169.44.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA22260; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:14:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ulf@localhost) by Gatekeeper.Lamb.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA03983; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:06:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Ulf Zimmermann Message-Id: <199608122106.OAA03983@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net> Subject: Re: 2 AHA1542's in one box To: narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee (Narvi) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:06:08 -0700 (PDT) Cc: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from Narvi at "Aug 12, 96 10:35:34 pm" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Mark Murray wrote: > > > Hi > > > > Does anyone have any experience in putting 2 AHA1542 cards into one > > box? > > > > I tried this and have had no luck. Here is the saga: > > > > The first card is set to factory default and is an AHA1542C. The > > second has been moved to Port 0x240 DRQ 6 IRQ 9 and is an AHA1542B. > > After lots of fun-and-games while I actually got the card's strapping > > right :-), I can get the 1542C ^A-BIOS to do a diagnostic run on both > > cards and to probe for devices on both cards. > > > > Now - the first card works just fine. The second probes OK during > > FreeBSD boot, but hangs solid during the "waiting for SCSI devices > > to settle" pause. I have checked _everything_. The terminators are > > OK, the card works (strapped to factory default) in another machine, > > There are no DRQ/PORT/IRQ conflicts. > > > > The motherboard is a Megabyte G486 with an i486DX/50 and 16MB of RAM. > > > > Any clues? > > Hmm.... I'm not an expert with the Adaptec cards or with the PC bus > designs, but wasn't it so that there could be only one bus master on the > ISA bus? > > Sander > > > > > M > > -- > > Mark Murray > > 46 Harvey Rd, Claremont, Cape Town 7700, South Africa > > +27 21 61-3768 GMT+0200 > > Finger mark@grondar.za for PGP key > > > And another idiotic tale survived. No, it is not true. You can have more then 1 busmaster. To be exact if you have a CPU, a DMA chip and an Adaptec 1542, you already have 3 bus master ;-) Ulf. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-865-0204 Lamb Art Internet Services || http://www.Lamb.net/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 14:27:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA23367 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:27:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA23327; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:27:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA12348; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:33:15 +0300 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:33:14 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Ulf Zimmermann cc: freebsd-scsi@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2 AHA1542's in one box In-Reply-To: <199608122106.OAA03983@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Ulf Zimmermann wrote: > > And another idiotic tale survived. No, it is not true. You can have more then 1 > busmaster. To be exact if you have a CPU, a DMA chip and an Adaptec 1542, you > already have 3 bus master ;-) > > Ulf. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-865-0204 > Lamb Art Internet Services || http://www.Lamb.net/ > OK, OK, MERCY!!! I've been up for much too long... (it's the 13th around here...) - as Terry pointed out, the case for only one bus-master is another. I should look more closely my answeres from time to time... Anyways, I've lived with 3 busmaster cards in a computer (two of them VESA, one PCI) and on another I have not been able to actually get otherwise nonconflicting ISA cards to work. I hope I will be forgiven and the urban legend won't prosper. Sander From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 14:43:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA25607 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:43:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA25600 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:43:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA02773; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:42:39 -0700 (PDT) To: Julian Elischer cc: Terry Lambert , francis yeung , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: webbox with bsdi In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 12 Aug 1996 13:32:07 PDT." <320F94C7.2781E494@whistle.com> Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 14:42:39 -0700 Message-ID: <2771.839886159@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Jordan, I went to a lot of trouble to separate out the disk production > stuff and it worked fine last I looked. > your commnets that it didn't work are a worry.. > can you tell me what was wrong? root@time-> pwd /usr/src/release/floppies/boot root@time-> make .... lots-o-stuff deleted .... cc -O2 -m486 -pipe -DCRUNCHED_BINARY -c crunch.c make: don't know how to make /usr/src/bin/sh/init.o. Stop *** Error code 2 Stop. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 15:01:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA27946 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:01:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from karl@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA27895; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:01:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Karl Strickland Message-Id: <199608122201.PAA27895@freefall.freebsd.org> Subject: Xconfig file for GXE90 & Dell VS17 - help To: questions, hackers Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:01:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm having a problem configuring X11 on my Dell P90. I'm using a Number Nine GXE64 Pro (2Mb) graphics card, and a Dell VS17 monitor. Using the settings in the /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/doc/Monitor file (reproduced below), it almost works; but the display is wrapped off to the left slightly, such that 0,0 - ~20,0 is at the top right corner not the top left! Has anyone made this combination work? Cheers --------------------------------------- >From monitor file: #From: Doug Rabson #Date: Sat, 24 Sep 1994 14:54:58 +0100 #Note: display shifted to the left. #Note: Two submissions by the same author? Be careful. Section "Monitor" Identifier "DELL VS17" VendorName "DELL" ModelName "VS17" Bandwidth 25.2 mhz HorizSync 30-62 VertRefresh 50-90 # Refresh rate = 73.46Hz ; Horizontal Frequency = 59.29KHz Mode "1024x768" DotClock 81 HTimings 1024 1120 1272 1368 VTimings 768 788 801 847 EndMode EndSection From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 15:34:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA00988 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:34:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from peedub.gj.org (newpc.muc.ditec.de [194.120.126.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA00970 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:34:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from peedub.gj.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by peedub.gj.org (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA17465; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:32:53 GMT Message-Id: <199608130032.AAA17465@peedub.gj.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.7 5/3/96 To: "Marc G. Fournier" Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested... Reply-To: Gary Jennejohn In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 10 Aug 1996 01:06:42 -0400." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:32:53 +0000 From: Gary Jennejohn Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk "Marc G. Fournier" writes: > What about ISDN cards? My understanding is that the TA220 >runs about $700CDN...I've been aatching talk about the BISDN support >in FreeBSD...how stable is it? Connection uptime, kernel stability, >etc? > I've been using it for months here in Munich and can attest that it is quite stable with DSS-1 (aka EuroISDN) and the most common passive ISDN cards in use here in Germany. However, it's not at all clear how well it will work outside of Europe. It's pretty much tailored for the european ISDN specs. Since I don't know where ki.net is I can't comment intelligently on any problems you might encounter. Oh , looks like you're in Canada. I have no idea which ISDN spec Canada uses. You'd have to write a driver, of course, if you want to use the TA220. > I presume that since the card is straight on the machine >bus, that throughput would be better? I've always shied away from >internal modems, mainly because an external one you can turn off and >on if it hangs...an internal one you have to reboot the machne...what >about ISDN cards vs modems? > You can easily get the full bandwidth. even with a passive card the interrupt load is low (mainly because the chipset used on the low-cost cards has a 64 byte buffer and it only interrupts the CPU every 32 bytes). Note that BISDN does not support channel bundling, yet. There's also no PPP, just raw HDLC. There's work-in-progress on adding synchronous PPP. Don't ask when it will be finished. I haven't seen any hangs in a long time. We seem to have finally squashed most of the nastiest bugs. --- Gary Jennejohn Home - Gary.Jennejohn@munich.netsurf.de Work - gjennejohn@frt.dec.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 15:38:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA01370 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:38:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cs.tu-berlin.de (root@mail.cs.tu-berlin.de [130.149.17.13]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA01362 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:38:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from campa.panke.de (anonymous213.ppp.cs.tu-berlin.de [130.149.17.213]) by mail.cs.tu-berlin.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id AAA23577; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:24:05 +0200 Received: (from wosch@localhost) by campa.panke.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA01073; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:09:51 +0200 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:09:51 +0200 From: Wolfram Schneider Message-Id: <199608122209.AAA01073@campa.panke.de> To: Amancio Hasty Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ISDN Recommendations Requested... In-Reply-To: <199608120749.AAA00410@rah.star-gate.com> References: <199608112135.XAA03842@campa.panke.de> <199608120749.AAA00410@rah.star-gate.com> Reply-to: Wolfram Schneider MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Amancio Hasty writes: >And I keep thinking about Intel's ISDN boards with so many hackers here >in Silicon Valley I am amazed that we don't support it 8) I am thinking about german digital TV. The decoder (d-box) has a SCSI (sic!) interface and did not use it for Internet access. Available bandwidth for digital TV from Astra satellite is 16 channel x 33Mhz = 528Mhz ;-)) Wolfram From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 15:40:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA01589 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:40:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA01582 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 15:40:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailbox.mcs.com (Mailbox.mcs.com [192.160.127.87]) by Kitten.mcs.com (8.7.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id RAA19350; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:40:31 -0500 (CDT) Received: by mailbox.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Mon, 12 Aug 96 17:40 CDT Received: (from karl@localhost) by Jupiter.mcs.net (8.7.5/8.7.5) id RAA13995; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:40:26 -0500 (CDT) From: Karl Denninger Message-Id: <199608122240.RAA13995@Jupiter.mcs.net> Subject: Re: Building ports and packages? To: kimc@w8hd.org (Kim Culhan) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:40:26 -0500 (CDT) Cc: karl@Mcs.Net, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Kim Culhan" at Aug 11, 96 11:54:11 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Sun, 11 Aug 1996, Karl Denninger wrote: > > > > Karl Denninger stands accused of saying: > > > Hmmm... > > > One thing I have figured out -- I didn't have X11 on there, and that blows > > up anything X related. Can that be fixed without reinstalling the entire > > machine? (ie: can I load the X11 release?) > > You could try using your existing ~/ports/x11/XFree86 to build it on > the machine, I can verify this works since it built cleanly here 24 hrs > ago. > > kimc > > -- > kimc@w8hd.org # cd /usr/ports/x11 # make XFree86 ...... rm -f AuDispose.c ln -s ../../lib/Xau/AuDispose.c AuDispose.c rm -f AuGetBest.c ln -s ../../lib/Xau/AuGetBest.c AuGetBest.c rm -f AuFileName.c ln -s ../../lib/Xau/AuFileName.c AuFileName.c rm -f AuRead.c ln -s ../../lib/Xau/AuRead.c AuRead.c rm -f Wrap.h ln -s ../../lib/Xdmcp/Wrap.h Wrap.h rm -f Wrap.c ln -s ../../lib/Xdmcp/Wrap.c Wrap.c make: don't know how to make ../../lib/Xdmcp/Wraphelp.c. Stop *** Error code 2 Stop. Uh, no. This is a brand-new "cvs co ports" command on the current CVS tree, updated last night. This is exactly the kind of insanity that I'm talking about, and its a problem. -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity http://www.mcs.net/~karl | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available | 23 Chicagoland Prefixes, 13 ISDN, much more Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net/ Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 16:03:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA04770 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 16:03:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gateway.tcsi.com (tcsi.com [137.134.47.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA04757 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 16:03:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from draco.tcs.com (draco.tcs.com [137.134.40.2]) by gateway.tcsi.com (8.7.4/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA06598; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 16:03:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cozumel.tcs.com (cozumel.tcs.com [137.134.104.12]) by draco.tcs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA19451; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 16:04:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Douglas Ambrisko Received: (ambrisko@localhost) by cozumel.tcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) id QAA05587; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 16:02:26 -0700 Message-Id: <199608122302.QAA05587@cozumel.tcs.com> Subject: Re: webbox with bsdi To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 16:02:25 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <320F94C7.2781E494@whistle.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Aug 12, 96 01:32:07 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Julian Elischer writes: | | > > Is there a virtual disk system (memory based) in FreeBSD ? | > | > Yes. | | in -current, | look at /usr/src/release/floppies. | | the boot floppy made there could easily be tailored to contain whatever | you require. | just duplicate teh 'boot' directory and edit it.. | (worked lat time I checked.. | | Jordan, I went to a lot of trouble to separate out the disk production | stuff and it worked fine last I looked. | your commnets that it didn't work are a worry.. | can you tell me what was wrong? | it's a lot simpler than teh current stuff and should be easier to | debug... Over this last weekend I got my serial install floppy working and ran into a bug in the script that makes a tiny file-system. Your new method works great and I made another change to crunch phase to use relative paths instead of absolute. Unfortunately I probably won't be able to get the patches together until Wed. Doug A. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 17:20:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA16061 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:20:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA16053 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:20:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.7.5/8.6.6) with ESMTP id SAA04700; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 18:19:32 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608130019.SAA04700@rover.village.org> To: Terry Lambert Subject: Re: MOTIF: combobox? Cc: gclarkii@main.gbdata.com (Gary Clark II), freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 12 Aug 1996 10:06:31 PDT Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 18:19:32 -0600 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk : At least 1.2 if not 2.0; I don't remember an XmComboBox in 1.2, though... It isn't. That was new with 2.0. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 17:23:13 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA16223 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:23:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail11.digital.com (mail11.digital.com [192.208.46.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA16201 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:23:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from muggsy.lkg.dec.com by mail11.digital.com (8.7.5/UNX 1.2/1.0/WV) id UAA17045; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:16:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from whydos.lkg.dec.com by muggsy.lkg.dec.com (5.65/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) with SMTP id AA11026; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:16:22 -0400 Received: from localhost.lkg.dec.com (localhost.lkg.dec.com [127.0.0.1]) by whydos.lkg.dec.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA16281 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:21:16 GMT Message-Id: <199608122021.UAA16281@whydos.lkg.dec.com> X-Authentication-Warning: whydos.lkg.dec.com: Host localhost.lkg.dec.com didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: New de driver alpha testers wanted Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:21:15 +0000 From: Matt Thomas Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk What's in this driver to be tested? Only one new feature ... Most cards shipped that are based on the 21140 (etc) have enough information encoding in the serial eeprom to that the generic Win96/WNT/Novell drivers can use the card is each of its modes. I'm completing a de driver which will be able to use same information to achieve the same flexibility. Such that it should support new cards automagically. This has caused a significant rewrite of major portions of the configuration logic. Even better, the driver is starting to shrink in size again. I'm specifically looking for those with non-SMC and non-DEC 2114x based cards. Also, the autosense logic for 21040 cards has been enhanced so that it detect a loss of link pulses (or carrier on sends) and try to sense the new media. (ie. it should be able to switch from UTP to BNC and back automatically). Also, if you can test 10baseT full-duplex I'd also be interested in hearing from you. Note that this work is still quite new but it should allow even better support of new cards in the future (note that this will mean that multiport cards will be supported with no extra effort). If you are interested and not concerned about having your system panic, please send me some mail! -- Matt Thomas Internet: matt@3am-software.com 3am Software Foundry WWW URL: http://www.3am-software.com/bio/matt.html Westford, MA Disclaimer: I disavow all knowledge of this message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 17:58:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA21212 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:58:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA21205 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:58:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (michaelh@localhost) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.7.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id AAA13939; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:58:20 GMT Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:58:20 +0900 (JST) From: Michael Hancock To: Terry Lambert cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Load-balancing box In-Reply-To: <199608121626.JAA25431@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > Specifically, it can react when one of the machines goes down (but how > can it know?). It can assign an infinite cost to a server that doesn't respond. The operator can manually reset the server or there can be some kind of cost decay algorithm so that the redirector will try again later. > The whole problem is that you connect to an address instead of a service > in the first place -- this type of load balancing assumes all clients > have statistically identical duration, and doesn't truly balance the > load between the boxes. For example, if I have 3 boxes, and 300 incoming > connections are made, and 200 of them leave, one box can have 100 > connections and the other two can be idle. Doesn't absolute duration only matter anyway? I don't think it matters that a faster server services more requests. > The fix is called "service anonymity" and requires a fundamental change > in the way addresses get resolved/routed, and the ability to actively > retarget session state (if any) from one server to another through > consensus of the servers in the cluster. Different costs can be assigned by ip/port pairs. I'm not sure what exactly the LocalDirector does as there's little information on their pages. I would imagine that the cost determination policy is where most of the experimentation would be needed. Mike Hancock From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 18:40:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA26914 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 18:40:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dyson.iquest.net (dyson.iquest.net [198.70.144.127]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA26871 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 18:39:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA00150; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:35:19 -0500 (EST) From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199608130135.UAA00150@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:35:19 -0500 (EST) Cc: koshy@india.hp.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608121658.JAA25522@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 12, 96 09:58:51 am Reply-To: dyson@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > There are many ways to thrash NT to death. The test program that sparked > this debate thrashes the buffer cache significantly because of the lack > of per FS object working set restrictions. In VMS, this would be a > tunable. > I have some working code for FreeBSD that implements a system-wide quota of per-vnode dirty buffer space (those are the only ones that cannot be reclaimed immediately.). John From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 19:03:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA29447 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 19:03:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA29427; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 19:03:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (michaelh@localhost) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.7.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id CAA14377; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 02:00:44 GMT Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:00:44 +0900 (JST) From: Michael Hancock Reply-To: Michael Hancock To: Darren Reed cc: "Daniel O'Callaghan" , sos@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, ipfilter@coombs.anu.edu.au Subject: Re: Load-balancing box In-Reply-To: <199608121201.FAA15946@freefall.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Darren Reed wrote: > TO solve the above, you would simply do something like: > > rdr ed0 webserver/32 port 80 -> webserver1 port 80 > rdr ed0 webserver/32 port 8000 -> webserver2 port 80 > rdr ed0 webserver/32 port 8080 -> webserver3 port 80 > What's needed is ... > rdr ed0 webserverA/32 port 80 -> webserver1 port 80 > rdr ed0 webserverA/32 port 80 -> webserver2 port 80 > rdr ed0 webserverA/32 port 80 -> webserver3 port 80 webserverA is what DNS advertises. webservers 1 to 3 have mirrored content. When the redirector box starts up all servers are given zero cost requests are redirected on a least cost basis with round-robin on identical costs. (This is just an example of a distribution policy) Servers that don't respond are assigned infinite cost and a back-in-service algorithm can be used to get the rebooted server back in the pool. Regards, Mike Hancock From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 19:45:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA06720 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 19:45:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from glacier.wise.edt.ericsson.se (glacier-ext.wise.edt.ericsson.se [193.180.251.38]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA06698; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 19:45:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from egg.lmc.ericsson.se (egg.lmc.ericsson.se [142.133.32.1]) by glacier.wise.edt.ericsson.se (8.7.5/8.7.3/glacier-0.9) with SMTP id EAA23340; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:41:55 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from chicago.lmc.ericsson.se by egg.lmc.ericsson.se (4.1/LME-2.2) id AA26024; Mon, 12 Aug 96 22:41:53 EDT Received: (from lmcsato@localhost) by chicago.lmc.ericsson.se (8.7/8.7) id WAA06018; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:41:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:41:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Samy Touati X-Sender: lmcsato@chicago To: Terry Lambert Cc: terry@lambert.org, gpalmer@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: machine crashing, what panic: free means? In-Reply-To: <199608122050.NAA26063@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I generated a core and here's the stack: Reading symbols from kernel.debug...done. (kgdb) exec-file /var/crash/kernel.1 (kgdb) core-file /var/crash/vmcore.1 IdlePTD 1c9000 current pcb at 1b5ff8 panic: free: multiple frees #0 boot (howto=256) at ../../i386/i386/machdep.c:892 892 dumppcb.pcb_ptd = rcr3(); (kgdb) where #0 boot (howto=256) at ../../i386/i386/machdep.c:892 #1 0xf0112a73 in panic (fmt=0xf010baa2 "free: multiple frees") at ../../kern/subr_prf.c:124 #2 0xf010bb83 in free (addr=0xf05c4b80, type=1) at ../../kern/kern_malloc.c:337 #3 0xf0138aca in pppstart (tp=0xf01b52e8) at ../../net/if_ppp.c:1042 #4 0xf019ed7b in siopoll () at ../../i386/isa/sio.c:1554 #5 0xf0187067 in doreti_swi () #6 0xf018f25c in cpu_switch () After browsing through the sources, it seems that the problem is related to the sio port being saturated. Right now I'm using a 486DX 33, will a DX66 help? I don't have 2.1.5 yet, does anybody knows if sio.c has been changed to address this problem? I'm going to reduce the spped of the serial port to 112000 bauds and see if this helps. Samy On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > > I have version 2.1. > > I noticed that this happens when a lot of traffic is on the ethernet > > card, and these packets need to be redirected to the serial port at > > 115200 bauds. > > Could this bug be related to the CPU or the board being slow, for the > > packets throuput. > > It could be. Analyze the crash dump to locate the problem, and > you'll be able to tell me. 8-). > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 19:56:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA08389 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 19:56:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tombstone.sunrem.com (tombstone.sunrem.com [206.81.134.54]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA08375; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 19:56:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from brandon@localhost) by tombstone.sunrem.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA12556; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:55:31 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:55:30 -0600 (MDT) From: Brandon Gillespie To: Michael Hancock cc: Darren Reed , "Daniel O'Callaghan" , sos@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, ipfilter@coombs.anu.edu.au Subject: Re: Load-balancing box In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 13 Aug 1996, Michael Hancock wrote: > > webserverA is what DNS advertises. webservers 1 to 3 have mirrored > content. > > When the redirector box starts up all servers are given zero cost requests > are redirected on a least cost basis with round-robin on identical costs. > (This is just an example of a distribution policy) > > Servers that don't respond are assigned infinite cost and a > back-in-service algorithm can be used to get the rebooted server back in > the pool. Wouldn't it be simpler to hack the name daemon to do the load balancing, so when they lookup 'www.xxx.yyy' it picks a machine and directs them to the IP for 'wwwX.xxx.yyy'? From that point on you dont care what they are doing. I know VMS can cluster like this, without a problem (through MultiNet). Sorry if this has already been discussed, I'm jumping into the discussion rather late .. -Brandon Gillespie- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 20:04:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA09346 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:04:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA09333 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:04:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id UAA07249; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:03:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma007247; Mon Aug 12 20:03:52 1996 Message-ID: <320FF06B.15FB7483@whistle.com> Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:03:07 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b4 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org CC: julian@whistle.com Subject: Rebooting and related topics.. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've added a small callout list to the reboot code so that we and other third party types can add modules which require actions at shutdown. looking at the boot code however, I see that about 90% of boot() in machdep.c is in fact NOT mach dependent at all. I'd like to move most of this out to somewhere more generic while I'm adding my callout code.. several questions.. 1/ am I correct? 2/ can anyone suggest the correct place for it? 3/ The callout code has a prototype for the function at_reboot() where should this prototype live? (I've dropped it into systm.h at the moment) the reason for a kerenl based callout list rather than a user-based rc.shutdown is to do with the nature of the modules being added here.. I'd eventually like to add similar callout lists to exit() and fork() but they are not needed for these particular modules. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 20:20:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA10864 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:20:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA10858 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:20:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (michaelh@localhost) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.7.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id DAA15061; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 03:19:55 GMT Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 12:19:55 +0900 (JST) From: Michael Hancock To: Brandon Gillespie cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Load-balancing box In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Brandon Gillespie wrote: > On Tue, 13 Aug 1996, Michael Hancock wrote: > > > > webserverA is what DNS advertises. webservers 1 to 3 have mirrored > > content. > > > > When the redirector box starts up all servers are given zero cost requests > > are redirected on a least cost basis with round-robin on identical costs. > > (This is just an example of a distribution policy) > > > > Servers that don't respond are assigned infinite cost and a > > back-in-service algorithm can be used to get the rebooted server back in > > the pool. > > Wouldn't it be simpler to hack the name daemon to do the load balancing, > so when they lookup 'www.xxx.yyy' it picks a machine and directs them to > the IP for 'wwwX.xxx.yyy'? From that point on you dont care what they are > doing. I know VMS can cluster like this, without a problem (through > MultiNet). Are you talking about round robin DNS? This doesn't work very well. You don't want the IP to be cached. It difficult to load balance thru DNS. How do you deal with servers that go down? Mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 20:29:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA11558 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:29:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA11552 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:29:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (michaelh@localhost) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.7.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id DAA15152 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 03:29:31 GMT Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 12:29:31 +0900 (JST) From: Michael Hancock To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: STREAM benchmark, (not streams) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~mccalpin/ I'm curious to see what others are getting on this memory bandwidth benchmark. I'll post mine when I get a chance to run it again. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 20:39:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA12353 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:39:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA12346; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 20:39:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id NAA19491; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:24:06 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608130354.NAA19491@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: machine crashing, what panic: free means? To: lmcsato@lmc.ericsson.se (Samy Touati) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:24:05 +0930 (CST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, gpalmer@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Samy Touati" at Aug 12, 96 10:41:26 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Samy Touati stands accused of saying: > > Reading symbols from kernel.debug...done. > (kgdb) exec-file /var/crash/kernel.1 > (kgdb) core-file /var/crash/vmcore.1 > IdlePTD 1c9000 > current pcb at 1b5ff8 > panic: free: multiple frees > #0 boot (howto=256) at ../../i386/i386/machdep.c:892 > 892 dumppcb.pcb_ptd = rcr3(); > (kgdb) where > #0 boot (howto=256) at ../../i386/i386/machdep.c:892 > #1 0xf0112a73 in panic (fmt=0xf010baa2 "free: multiple frees") > at ../../kern/subr_prf.c:124 > #2 0xf010bb83 in free (addr=0xf05c4b80, type=1) > at ../../kern/kern_malloc.c:337 > #3 0xf0138aca in pppstart (tp=0xf01b52e8) at ../../net/if_ppp.c:1042 > #4 0xf019ed7b in siopoll () at ../../i386/isa/sio.c:1554 > #5 0xf0187067 in doreti_swi () > #6 0xf018f25c in cpu_switch () > > > After browsing through the sources, it seems that the problem is related > to the sio port being saturated. It has nothing at all to do with that; the problem looks like it's to do with a corrupted mbuf chain. (1042 is near an MFREE() macro). There was a nasty buffer overflow bug in the ppp code in 2.1 that has subsequently been fixed. This may be your culprit. > Right now I'm using a 486DX 33, will a DX66 help? No. > I don't have 2.1.5 yet, does anybody knows if sio.c has been changed to > address this problem? sio.c has nothing to do with this. > I'm going to reduce the spped of the serial port to 112000 bauds and see > if this helps. It won't solve the basic problem. And you can't set a port to 112000. > Samy -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 21:32:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA16204 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:32:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (root@orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.41]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA16197 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:32:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (gpalmer@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (8.7.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA21008; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:31:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: orion.webspan.net: Host gpalmer@localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Karl Denninger cc: kimc@w8hd.org (Kim Culhan), msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.org From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: Building ports and packages? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 12 Aug 1996 17:40:26 CDT." <199608122240.RAA13995@Jupiter.mcs.net> Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:31:46 -0400 Message-ID: <21005.839910706@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Karl Denninger wrote in message ID <199608122240.RAA13995@Jupiter.mcs.net>: > make: don't know how to make ../../lib/Xdmcp/Wraphelp.c. Stop > *** Error code 2 > This is a brand-new "cvs co ports" command on the current CVS tree, updated > last night. > This is exactly the kind of insanity that I'm talking about, and its a > problem. This is a TOTALLY wild guess, but you haven't stuffed gmake (or some other make variant) in your path BEFORE the ``default'' /usr/bin/make, or replaced /usr/bin/make with something else, have you? Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 21:37:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA16564 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:37:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from post.io.org (post.io.org [198.133.36.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA16554 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:37:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zap.io.org (taob@zap.io.org [198.133.36.81]) by post.io.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA08793; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:35:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:35:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Tao To: Brandon Gillespie cc: FREEBSD-HACKERS-L , ipfilter@postbox.anu.edu.au Subject: Re: Load-balancing box In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Brandon Gillespie wrote: > > Wouldn't it be simpler to hack the name daemon to do the load > balancing, so when they lookup 'www.xxx.yyy' it picks a machine and > directs them to the IP for 'wwwX.xxx.yyy'? You don't have to hack BIND to do that, since it already supports round-robin hostnames with multiple A records. What Cisco's LocalDirector box does (and what others are proposing to do with a FreeBSD box and ipfilter) is forward packets divert packets to different hosts based on a least-recently-used cycle, or least-load cycle, or whatever local policy you have. It will also automatically remove a host from the pool if it is down or doesn't have a server running. It's basically a proxy server with some extra smarts built in. -- Brian Tao (BT300, taob@io.org, taob@ican.net) Senior Systems and Network Administrator, Internet Canada Corp. "Though this be madness, yet there is method in't" From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 21:40:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA16900 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:40:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sumter.awod.com (awod.com [198.81.225.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA16877 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:40:22 -0700 (PDT) From: spr@awod.com Received: from [206.31.146.213] (chsx003.awod.com [206.31.146.213]) by sumter.awod.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id AAA08418 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:40:32 -0400 X-Sender: srob@awod.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:44:32 -0400 To: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Sorry to bother you all again, but I am still trying to install qpop on this machine. Specifically, the error message that I am getting says: popper.o: Undefined symbol '_setprotedtitle' referenced from text segment It says this several times and then dies. SETPROTECTITLE is mentioned in the INSTALL file that can be turned on and off depending on whether you want it or your OS supports it. All I want to know is how to get rid of the error so that I can get this thing running. Any help as to how to get around this proplem would be helpful. Sean P. Robertson From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 22:04:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA18054 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:04:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from MindBender.HeadCandy.com (root@mindbender.headcandy.com [199.238.225.168]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA18044 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:04:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.HeadCandy.com (michaelv@localhost.HeadCandy.com [127.0.0.1]) by MindBender.HeadCandy.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA19610; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:04:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608130504.WAA19610@MindBender.HeadCandy.com> X-Authentication-Warning: MindBender.HeadCandy.com: Host michaelv@localhost.HeadCandy.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: dennis@etinc.com (Dennis) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 12 Aug 96 13:39:31 -0400. <199608121739.NAA16750@etinc.com> Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 22:04:05 -0700 From: "Michael L. VanLoon -- HeadCandy.com" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>> > So my question is: how does NT behave when it has to schedule between a >>> > large number of processes each with its own process context, VM, page >tables >>> > etc? Conversely how does the unix program behave when linked with >-lpthreads >>> > and with `fork()' replaced with `pthread_create()'? >>> One bad thing with user level threads (actualy pthreads that I used): >>> sheduler which runs on user lever ALWAYS consume processor time (even wnen >>Only when *really* poorly implemented. Otherwise it waits in select(2) to [...] >This is all very nice, but on a macro level NT has two very obvious >problems to consider: >1) Its rather new... >2) It was written by Microsoft And, how do these affect NT's performance? (Or, threading vs. process context switching, in general?) ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael L. VanLoon michaelv@HeadCandy.com --< Free your mind and your machine -- NetBSD free un*x >-- NetBSD working ports: 386+PC, Mac 68k, Amiga, Atari 68k, HP300, Sun3, Sun4/4c/4m, DEC MIPS, DEC Alpha, PC532, VAX, MVME68k, arm32... NetBSD ports in progress: PICA, others... Roll your own Internet access -- Seattle People's Internet cooperative. If you're in the Seattle area, ask me how. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 23:08:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA23320 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 23:08:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.210.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA23315 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 23:08:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tom@localhost) by misery.sdf.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA20000; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 23:24:40 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 23:24:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Samplonius To: spr@awod.com cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: your mail In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 13 Aug 1996 spr@awod.com wrote: > Sorry to bother you all again, but I am still trying to install qpop on > this machine. Specifically, the error message that I am getting says: > > popper.o: Undefined symbol '_setprotedtitle' referenced from text segment > > It says this several times and then dies. SETPROTECTITLE is mentioned in > the INSTALL file that can be turned on and off depending on whether you > want it or your OS supports it. All I want to know is how to get rid of > the error so that I can get this thing running. Any help as to how to get > around this proplem would be helpful. > > Sean P. Robertson > > > Qpopper is in the ports section. So, if you can't build it yourself, grab it there. Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 23:22:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA23736 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 23:22:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from main.gbdata.com (GB2.Brewich.COM [207.90.222.20]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA23728; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 23:22:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from gclarkii@localhost) by main.gbdata.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) id BAA17377; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 01:19:05 -0500 (CDT) From: Gary Clark II Message-Id: <199608130619.BAA17377@main.gbdata.com> Subject: Re: Load-balancing box To: brandon@tombstone.sunrem.com (Brandon Gillespie) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 01:19:03 -0500 (CDT) Cc: michaelh@cet.co.jp, avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, danny@panda.hilink.com.au, sos@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, ipfilter@coombs.anu.edu.au In-Reply-To: from Brandon Gillespie at "Aug 12, 96 08:55:30 pm" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Brandon Gillespie wrote: > On Tue, 13 Aug 1996, Michael Hancock wrote: > > > > webserverA is what DNS advertises. webservers 1 to 3 have mirrored > > content. > > > > Wouldn't it be simpler to hack the name daemon to do the load balancing, > so when they lookup 'www.xxx.yyy' it picks a machine and directs them to > the IP for 'wwwX.xxx.yyy'? From that point on you dont care what they are > doing. I know VMS can cluster like this, without a problem (through > MultiNet). Part of the problem is going to be cacheing of ip numbers by systems. Plus older system will only take the first IP address given to them and toss the rest. Both of these can cause one system to get beaten up on. > > Sorry if this has already been discussed, I'm jumping into the discussion > rather late .. > > -Brandon Gillespie- > -- Gary Clark II (N5VMF) | I speak only for myself and "maybe" my company gclarkii@GBData.COM | Member of the FreeBSD Doc Team Providing Internet and ISP startups mail info@GBData.COM for information FreeBSD FAQ at ftp://ftp.FreeBSD.ORG/pub/FreeBSD/docs/freebsd-faq.ascii From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 23:52:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA25623 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 23:52:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA25617 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 23:52:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id IAA22397; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:51:40 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA01594; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:51:40 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id IAA03023; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:35:52 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608130635.IAA03023@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Building ports and packages? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:35:52 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: karl@Mcs.Net Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608122240.RAA13995@Jupiter.mcs.net> from Karl Denninger at "Aug 12, 96 05:40:26 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Karl Denninger wrote: > ln -s ../../lib/Xdmcp/Wrap.c Wrap.c > make: don't know how to make ../../lib/Xdmcp/Wraphelp.c. Stop > *** Error code 2 > This is exactly the kind of insanity that I'm talking about, and its a > problem. As i understand it, Wraphelp.c is ``forbidden'' stuff: #include "Wrap.h" /* des routines for non-usa - eay 10/9/1991 eay@psych.psy.uq.oz.au * These routines were written for speed not size so they are bigger than * needed. I have removed some of the loop unrolling, this will reduce * code size at the expense of some speed. * 25/9/1991 eay - much faster _XdmcpAuthSetup (4 times faster). * 19/9/1991 eay - cleaned up the IP and FP code. * 10/9/1991 eay - first release. * The des routines this file has been made from can be found in * ftp.psy.uq.oz.au /pub/DES */ -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Aug 12 23:53:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA25680 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 23:53:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA25675 for ; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 23:53:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id IAA22401; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:51:41 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA01595; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:51:41 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id IAA03159; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:45:06 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608130645.IAA03159@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: machine crashing, what panic: free means? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:45:06 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: lmcsato@lmc.ericsson.se (Samy Touati) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from Samy Touati at "Aug 12, 96 10:41:26 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Samy Touati wrote: > #0 boot (howto=256) at ../../i386/i386/machdep.c:892 > #1 0xf0112a73 in panic (fmt=0xf010baa2 "free: multiple frees") > at ../../kern/subr_prf.c:124 > #2 0xf010bb83 in free (addr=0xf05c4b80, type=1) > at ../../kern/kern_malloc.c:337 > #3 0xf0138aca in pppstart (tp=0xf01b52e8) at ../../net/if_ppp.c:1042 > #4 0xf019ed7b in siopoll () at ../../i386/isa/sio.c:1554 > #5 0xf0187067 in doreti_swi () > #6 0xf018f25c in cpu_switch () > > > After browsing through the sources, it seems that the problem is related > to the sio port being saturated. No, your conclusion is wrong. It's rather that the code on line 1042 in sys/net/if_ppp.c has called a free() which was a duplicate free. This should not happen, regardless of whether the port is saturated or not. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 00:11:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA26436 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:11:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from MindBender.HeadCandy.com (root@mindbender.headcandy.com [199.238.225.168]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA26426 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:11:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.HeadCandy.com (michaelv@localhost.HeadCandy.com [127.0.0.1]) by MindBender.HeadCandy.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA19854; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:10:23 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608130710.AAA19854@MindBender.HeadCandy.com> X-Authentication-Warning: MindBender.HeadCandy.com: Host michaelv@localhost.HeadCandy.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Narvi cc: Jaye Mathisen , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSD/OS webperf notes, anybody want to test FreeBSD? In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 12 Aug 96 22:12:45 +0300. Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:10:22 -0700 From: "Michael L. VanLoon -- HeadCandy.com" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> http://www.BSDI.COM:81/products/internet-server/benchmarks/webperf.html >> I would think we could do better. >Sure. But we should not compare ourselves with BSDI, but with Microsoft, >I think. It would be quite good. There is another way in which we could >perhaps do the test - what would the benefit be in the difference in the >cost of hardware to serve as well as Microsoft does. A motherboard with a >meg of ram is a beast in itself... If you're going to bring cost into it, just remember that for many big organizations, the cost of the box and the software is one of the smallest parts of the equation of overall ownership cost... ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael L. VanLoon michaelv@HeadCandy.com --< Free your mind and your machine -- NetBSD free un*x >-- NetBSD working ports: 386+PC, Mac 68k, Amiga, Atari 68k, HP300, Sun3, Sun4/4c/4m, DEC MIPS, DEC Alpha, PC532, VAX, MVME68k, arm32... NetBSD ports in progress: PICA, others... Roll your own Internet access -- Seattle People's Internet cooperative. If you're in the Seattle area, ask me how. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 00:35:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA27620 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:35:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ref.tfs.com ([206.245.251.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA27615 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:35:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA10700 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:35:42 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 00:35:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199608130735.AAA10700@ref.tfs.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: help with devfs Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I wonder if there is someone out there with a good understanding of the lifecycle of a vnode, who can go over devfs with me. I am sure I'm being really stupid regarding vnode allocation is some places but I'm not quite sure what the RIGHT thingto be doing is.. it's a simple module really, but I need a guide in this part.. I added SYMLINK support today, which seems to work, except that occasionally I get a panic("cleaned vnode isn't"); Now I can see why this might happen, but U can't see what I need to do to fix it.. +----------------------------------+ ______ _ __ | __--_|\ Julian Elischer | \ U \/ / On assignment | / \ julian@tfs.com +------>x USA \ in a very strange | ( OZ ) 300 lakeside Dr. oakland CA. \___ ___ | country ! +- X_.---._/ USA+(510) 645-3137(wk) \_/ \\ v From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 01:18:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id BAA29456 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 01:18:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fgate.flevel.co.uk (root@fgate.flevel.co.uk [194.6.101.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA29451 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 01:18:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dev@localhost) by fgate.flevel.co.uk (8.7.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA01815; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:20:58 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:20:57 +0100 (BST) From: Developer To: Narvi cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , "Hr.Ladavac" , Mark Diekhans , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: What are the plans for ELF support? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I hope there will remain the compat kit for those who might want to use > old programs. Or will FreeBSD be able to "on the fly" mix and match ELF > and a.out libs and binaries? Well, I hope that in future BSD will support both and we can just compile with --elf :) Regards, Trefor S. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 01:27:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id BAA29954 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 01:27:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fgate.flevel.co.uk (root@fgate.flevel.co.uk [194.6.101.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA29940 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 01:27:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dev@localhost) by fgate.flevel.co.uk (8.7.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA02017; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:28:20 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:28:19 +0100 (BST) From: Developer To: Terry Lambert cc: A JOSEPH KOSHY , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: <199608121658.JAA25522@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > > So my question is: how does NT behave when it has to schedule between a > > large number of processes each with its own process context, VM, page tables > > etc? Conversely how does the unix program behave when linked with -lpthreads > > and with `fork()' replaced with `pthread_create()'? This may be a silly question, but where do I get libpthreads from? Regards, Trefor S. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 02:32:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA03379 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 02:32:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from egeo.unipg.it (egeo.unipg.it [141.250.1.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA03346; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 02:32:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by egeo.unipg.it (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/MH-1.09) id AA08532; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:32:02 +0200 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:32:02 +0200 From: peppe@unipg.it (Giuseppe Vitillaro) Message-Id: <9608130932.AA08532@egeo.unipg.it> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org Subject: AIX/6000 fuser command Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I found particulary useful im my experience the AIX "fuser" command. This little AIX command let to get the PIDs of the processes that are keeping open a file. If you use it for example on a syslog file like: fuser daemon.log daemon.log: 3461 you will get the PID of the syslogd daemon. Two related questions: (1) does an equivalent command exist under FreeBSD? (2) in the case the answer to the first question would be "NO", have the FreeBSD the primitives to build a tools like fuser? Thank in advance, Peppe. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 02:56:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA04396 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 02:56:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA04391; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 02:56:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minnow.render.com (minnow.render.com [193.195.178.1]) by minnow.render.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA11559; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 10:56:30 +0100 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 10:56:30 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Karl Strickland cc: questions@freefall.freebsd.org, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Xconfig file for GXE90 & Dell VS17 - help In-Reply-To: <199608122201.PAA27895@freefall.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Karl Strickland wrote: > I'm having a problem configuring X11 on my Dell P90. I'm using a > Number Nine GXE64 Pro (2Mb) graphics card, and a Dell VS17 monitor. > Using the settings in the /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/doc/Monitor file > (reproduced below), it almost works; but the display is wrapped off > to the left slightly, such that 0,0 - ~20,0 is at the top right corner > not the top left! Has anyone made this combination work? This monitor entry is derived from one which I used a *long* time ago with a much older version of XF86. I no longer use the XF86 server (a happy Xinside customer). I suggest that you try a generic 1024x768x70 entry. -- Doug Rabson, Microsoft RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 171 734 3761 FAX: +44 171 734 6426 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 03:40:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA06166 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 03:40:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA06146; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 03:40:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (michaelh@localhost) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.7.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id KAA00708; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 10:40:01 GMT Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:40:00 +0900 (JST) From: Michael Hancock To: Giuseppe Vitillaro cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: AIX/6000 fuser command In-Reply-To: <9608130932.AA08532@egeo.unipg.it> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Try ... fstat filename Mike On Tue, 13 Aug 1996, Giuseppe Vitillaro wrote: > > I found particulary useful im my experience the AIX > "fuser" command. > > This little AIX command let to get the PIDs of the > processes that are keeping open a file. > > If you use it for example on a syslog file like: > > fuser daemon.log > daemon.log: 3461 > > you will get the PID of the syslogd daemon. > > Two related questions: > > (1) does an equivalent command exist under FreeBSD? > > (2) in the case the answer to the first question would be "NO", > have the FreeBSD the primitives to build a tools like fuser? > > Thank in advance, Peppe. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 03:50:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA06471 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 03:50:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from swissbank.swissbank.com (swissbank.swissbank.com [146.180.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA06464 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 03:50:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by swissbank.swissbank.com with UUCP (4.1/BK-1.9) id AA08538; Tue, 13 Aug 96 05:50:22 CDT Received: from il.us.swissbank.com by keymaster.swissbank.com with SMTP (8.6.12/BK-1.12) id FAA05493; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 05:49:37 -0500 Received: from ln1d273nwk by il.us.swissbank.com (4.1/SBCW oconnor v1.4 96/07/01) id AA18045; Tue, 13 Aug 96 05:49:38 CDT Received: by ln1d273nwk (NX5.67d/NX3.0S) id AA02567; Tue, 13 Aug 96 11:50:05 +0100 Message-Id: <9608131050.AA02567@ln1d273nwk> Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3risc v124) Content-Type: text/plain Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.124) From: Philip Milne Date: Tue, 13 Aug 96 11:49:58 +0100 To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Nightmare. Cc: armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, we are a small ISP running FreeBSD to power our WEB server and mail host. While trying to do a simple exhaustive dump of everything as a crude backup we have brought our system down. Our sysadmin is on holiday and recommended that we write to you for some clues as to what we can do to salvage the situation. As root we did the following: tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / (We know there are better ways to do dumps but we'd done this before and it worked so we thought it would be better than no backup at all - couldn't have been more wrong there). As there were some odd messages appearing in the console this was aborted with: ^C After that, the system crashed and now, when we try to restart the machine, we get the following status report on the console: ***************************************************************************** Boot: - ***************************************************************************** Any help would be very much appreciated. Thanks, Philip From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 04:04:47 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA07204 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:04:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ceylon.informatik.uni-rostock.de (ceylon.informatik.uni-rostock.de [139.30.5.237]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA07197; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:04:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ceylon.informatik.uni-rostock.de id NAA24919; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:04:38 +0200 Received: by donau.informatik.uni-rostock.de id NAA00326; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:04:37 +0200 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:04:37 +0200 From: Gunther Hipper Message-Id: <199608131104.NAA00326@donau.informatik.uni-rostock.de> To: freebsd-smp@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Anyone Experiences with Intel TXC Chipset or GA-586DX/GA-586HX motherboard ?? Cc: gunther@ceylon.informatik.uni-rostock.de X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi to you all ! I've a certain problem because I would like to buy new motherboards which should be albe to run FreeBSD. The boards are Gigabyte GA-586HX and/or GA-586DX both (hopefully) state of the art ... but I don't yet know any guy using them. The Chipset is an Intel TXC 82439HX Rev.01h in both boards. Until now, we always used Gigabyte boards - everything works fine with GA-486DX and GA-486ATE (Triton Chipset). Now my questions: Is anyone using one or both of these boards ? Are there any problems or are certain problems to be expected running FreeBSD ? Mention: I do _not_ explicitly care about SMP on the GA-586DX Dual-CPU-Slot board. If it's running - okay, but for the moment a single processor should be enough. Propably, the board should be Intel-SMP conform. This is an Intel chipset, hell, is'nt it ? I'd be glad if someone could give me some hints. Gunther Gunther Hipper | University of Rostock | Department of Computer Science | Tel +49 381 498 3391 Albert-Einstein-Str. 21 | Fax +49 381 498 3440 18051 Rostock - Germany | Email Gunther.Hipper@informatik.uni-rostock.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 04:27:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA08601 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:27:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from eins.siemens.at (eins.siemens.at [193.81.246.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA08588 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:26:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sol1.gud.siemens.co.at (root@firix [10.1.143.100]) by eins.siemens.at (8.7.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA27683 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:25:48 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at by sol1.gud.siemens.co.at with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #7 for ) id m0uqHbZ-000263C; Tue, 13 Aug 96 13:25 MET DST Received: by ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at (1.37.109.16/1.37) id AA272325361; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:22:41 +0200 From: "Hr.Ladavac" Message-Id: <199608131122.AA272325361@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com (Philip Milne) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:22:41 +0200 (MESZ) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com In-Reply-To: <9608131050.AA02567@ln1d273nwk> from "Philip Milne" at Aug 13, 96 11:49:58 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk E-mail message from Philip Milne contained: > Hi, we are a small ISP running FreeBSD to power our WEB server and mail > host. While trying to do a simple exhaustive dump of everything as a crude > backup we have brought our system down. Our sysadmin is on holiday and > recommended that we write to you for some clues as to what we can do to > salvage the situation. > > As root we did the following: > > tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / This has utterly trashed your boot device (and / lies there.) I seriuosly doubt that you can do anything but reinstall. What happened is that you have overwritten the filesystem layout from the same filesystem you were "backing up" and at that *while* you were backing it up. There shouldn't be anything useful on /dev/rfd0a. You will need to newfs / again and reinstall. With luck your other directories (/usr, /var, ...) are on separate partitions. However, everything that was in /etc is gone. > > (We know there are better ways to do dumps but we'd done this before and it > worked so we thought it would be better than no backup at all - couldn't have ^^^^^^^^ This I doubt. > been more wrong there). > > > Boot: > - Of course, there is no filesystem where /kernel used to be. /Marino From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 04:37:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA09136 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:37:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA09131 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:37:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA04829; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:37:07 -0700 (PDT) To: Philip Milne cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:49:58 BST." <9608131050.AA02567@ln1d273nwk> Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:37:07 -0700 Message-ID: <4826.839936227@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hi, we are a small ISP running FreeBSD to power our WEB server and mail > host. While trying to do a simple exhaustive dump of everything as a crude > backup we have brought our system down. Our sysadmin is on holiday and I'm willing to accept that this was your original intention, yes. It is unfortunate, however, that you did not simply wait for the intervention of qualified personnel (or, ideally, your system administrator to return from vacation) and attempted instead to rectify the situation yourselves. Your crude attempts to formulate a backup procudure could not have worked, even had the system not died in the process, and it's even more than likely that the command you typed wasn't the one you meant to, and the situation you're now in can be blamed on a simple typo (or, as the engineering support folks so charitably put it in their trouble logs, "problem caused by loose nut behind console." :-) I'll explain: > As root we did the following: > > tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / This can't possibly work because: a) Using / will decend through your *entire* filesystem, including any cdroms or NFS mounted media, and is probably the least desirable place to start any sort of dump from. It's also probably a lot more floppies than you own to back up a typical UNIX installation without compression. b) You did not specify the multi-volume flag to tar, and it will write only one floppy's worth of data before hitting rudely against the end. I just tried it, in the spirit of thoroughness, and it indeed wrote out about 1.4MB's worth of tar file before announcing that it couldn't write anymore and stopping. > As there were some odd messages appearing in the console this was aborted wit h: Those "odd messages" are generally the only thing we have to go on in cases like this, and you certainly should have written them down, but to make a total guess here (and that's all I can do) I'd say that what you typed instead was: tar -cvf /dev/rsd0a / Transposing one simple character and turning this command into a killer of typical root filesystems on SCSI boot drives when run as root. You wouldn't happen to have a SCSI drive, would you? One you're booting from? Or were, I guess I should say? > Boot: > - Yep, no kernel. Looks like the root filesystem took a pounding. Either way, it looks like a fixit floppy is in your future and, depending on what information it turns up on how lost your root filesystem is, perhaps a reinstallation. Better page that administrator again, and next time PLEASE keep your sticky fingers out of the machinery! :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 04:49:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA09530 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:49:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA09525 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:49:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA04912; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:47:48 -0700 (PDT) To: "Hr.Ladavac" cc: philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com (Philip Milne), hackers@freebsd.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:22:41 +0200." <199608131122.AA272325361@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at> Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:47:48 -0700 Message-ID: <4910.839936868@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / > > This has utterly trashed your boot device (and / lies there.) I seriuosly > doubt that you can do anything but reinstall. Probably the right conclusion, but for the wrong reasons. >What happened is that you have overwritten the filesystem layout from the >same filesystem you were "backing up" and at that *while* you were backing >it up. There shouldn't be anything useful on /dev/rfd0a. Not unless these systems are running with their root filesystems on floppies, no. :-) That would be possible, of course, but insane as even a stand-alone system would want to use MFS for its root filesystem given that a floppy would be far too unreliable. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 04:57:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA09901 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:57:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from korin.warman.org.pl (korin.warman.org.pl [148.81.160.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA09896 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:57:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from abial@localhost) by korin.warman.org.pl (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA06540; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:59:13 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:59:12 +0200 (MET DST) From: Andrzej Bialecki To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: SYSV IPC (msg, sem, shm)... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi all! Thank all of you who answered my previous post about manpages - I've found sem* and shm* , but msg* are missing. Perhaps they _are_ missing from 2.1.5R (which is the version I run). I'm just writing a few simple programs in order to learn more about SYSV IPC. I'm using FreeBSD, but I managed to have as a tutorial a part of SunOS Answerbook, which describes this subject in details. So, I noticed several differences in implementation (and I wonder if these are ok): * SunOS's defines several structs, among them a template struct ``msgbuf''. __The same__ struct in FreeBSD's msg.h is called ``mymsg'', and the author explains he wasn't sure at the time of writing how to call it. Maybe it should be changed to ``msgbuf'' in order to be "more compatible" ? * In the same msg.h, SunOs's struct msginfo slightly differs from that of FreeBSD, namely, has one member more (msgmap). Frankly, I don't know what this is for, but anyway... * SunOS allows to lock/unlock shared memory segments with command SHM_LOCK/SHM_UNLOCK. I didn't find any mention of this in #defines in FreeBSD's . Does it mean this feature is not implemented? Andy From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 06:07:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA12586 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 06:07:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from w2xo.pgh.pa.us (w2xo.pgh.pa.us [206.210.70.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA12581 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 06:07:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from durham@localhost) by w2xo.pgh.pa.us (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA02659; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:07:30 -0400 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:07:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Jim Durham X-Sender: durham@w2xo.pgh.pa.us To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-Reply-To: <4910.839936868@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 13 Aug 1996, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > > tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / > > > > This has utterly trashed your boot device (and / lies there.) I seriuosly > > doubt that you can do anything but reinstall. > > Probably the right conclusion, but for the wrong reasons. > > >What happened is that you have overwritten the filesystem layout from the > >same filesystem you were "backing up" and at that *while* you were backing > >it up. There shouldn't be anything useful on /dev/rfd0a. > > Not unless these systems are running with their root filesystems on > floppies, no. :-) That would be possible, of course, but insane as > even a stand-alone system would want to use MFS for its root > filesystem given that a floppy would be far too unreliable. > > Jordan > How about: tar -cvf / dev/rfd0a / (while sitting in / ) I'm not sure you can open / as a plain file, but, I'm not prepared to verify... 8-) . -Jim Durham From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 06:14:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA12976 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 06:14:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA12971 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 06:14:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA05659; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 06:13:55 -0700 (PDT) To: Jim Durham cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:07:29 EDT." Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 06:13:55 -0700 Message-ID: <5656.839942035@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > tar -cvf / dev/rfd0a / (while sitting in / ) > > I'm not sure you can open / as a plain file, but, > I'm not prepared to verify... 8-) . You can't write on directories at all. This will fail. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 06:39:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA13814 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 06:39:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [204.216.27.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA13809 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 06:39:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dawn.ww.net (root@dawn.ww.net [193.124.73.50]) by who.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.11) with ESMTP id GAA01850 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 06:38:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from alexis@localhost) by dawn.ww.net (8.7.5/alexis 2.5) id RAA01432; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 17:36:26 +0400 (MSD) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 17:36:26 +0400 (MSD) From: Alexis Yushin Message-Id: <199608131336.RAA01432@dawn.ww.net> To: lada@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at (Hr.Ladavac) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. Newsgroups: wildwind.lists.freebsd-hackers Organization: The Wild Wind Communications X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <4upqdj$g0@sunset.ww.net> you wrote: [...] > > As root we did the following: > > > > tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / > This has utterly trashed your boot device (and / lies there.) I seriuosly > doubt that you can do anything but reinstall. That *EXACT* command could do no harm. alexis -- If a camel flies, no one laughs if it doesn't get very far. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 06:40:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA13914 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 06:40:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA13908 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 06:40:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id XAA25512; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 23:33:08 +1000 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 23:33:08 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608131333.XAA25512@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, julian@whistle.com Subject: Re: Rebooting and related topics.. Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >shutdown. looking at the boot code however, I see that about 90% >of boot() in machdep.c is in fact NOT mach dependent at all. >1/ am I correct? A bit less than 90% is machine-independent. E.g., some of the delays may depend on the machine (they should probably be 0 for a a completely automated system... DELAY() is only declared in a machine-dependent header now). Amyway, there should be a machine-dependent hook, like like md^H^Hcpu_switch() for mi_switch(). >2/ can anyone suggest the correct place for it? Perhaps together with panic(). Not in subr_prf.c :-). >3/ The callout code has a prototype for the function at_reboot() > where should this prototype live? (I've dropped it into > systm.h at the moment) Why not in reboot.h? There is some confusion between booting, shutdown and rebooting. Many of the reboot options are actually only boot options because the i386 port lacks a boot ROM or something to keep control across reboots. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 08:26:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA19376 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:26:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA19369 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:26:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dialup-usr11.etinc.com (dialup-usr11.etinc.com [204.141.95.132]) by etinc.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA24718; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:28:57 -0400 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:28:57 -0400 Message-Id: <199608131528.LAA24718@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Joe Greco From: dennis@etinc.com (Dennis) Subject: Re: gated config for ospf and bgp Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> Hi, >> >> Has anybody got a sample gated config file which shows how >> to configure it for OSPF and BGP? >> >> If anybody replies, could you please also indicate your >> router topology, so I can understand the config file? > >I too would be fascinated in this information. I've been planning >to go this route (no pun intended) but haven't had time to dig through >the gated documentation and somewhat contradictory examples, and I don't >care to make my production networks into a testbed. :-) You might try the "et-users@etinc.com" list....there are several big installations...although I can't promise that they will share. Dennis Emerging Technologies, Inc. www.etinc.com (516) 271-4525 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 08:56:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA20835 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:56:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.ctron.com (ctron.com [134.141.197.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA20824 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 08:56:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from news@localhost) by gatekeeper.ctron.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA10197 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:56:45 -0400 Received: from stealth.ctron.com(134.141.5.107) by gatekeeper via smap (V1.3mjr) id sma010173; Tue Aug 13 11:56:33 1996 Received: from thoth.ctron.com by stealth.ctron.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA12968; Tue, 13 Aug 96 11:54:40 EDT Received: from thoth (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by thoth.ctron.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA00373 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:57:32 -0400 Message-Id: <3210A5EC.60B5@ctron.com> Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:57:32 -0400 From: Alexander Seth Jones Organization: Cabletron Systems, Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b5aGold (X11; I; SunOS 5.4 sun4m) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: and C++ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello, I'm writing a device driver in C++, and have run into a problem with the GENSPL macro in . g++ is croaking on the statement: __asm __volatile("":::"memory"); with the following error: parse error before "::" Without getting into an argument about whether g++ is in error about accepting the code as it is, I'm asking whether or not this code fragment even needs to exist. Now, I just tried an interesting experiment. I generated the assembly code (using init_main.c) with the asm declaration in there. It produced #APP #NO_APP where the asm declaration should be. Then I generated the assembly with the asm declaration removed, and the code was the exact same except the #APP/#NO_APP code was gone. gas also says: If the first line of an input file is `#NO_APP' or if you use the `-f' option, whitespace and comments are not removed from the input file. Within an input file, you can ask for whitespace and comment removal in specific portions of the by putting a line that says `#APP' before the text that may contain whitespace or comments, and putting a line that says `#NO_APP' after this text. This feature is mainly intend to support `asm' statements in compilers whose output is otherwise free of comments and whitespace. So it seems like the asm statement is a no-op. Is this a fair assumption? Can I just safely get rid of it? What are people's thoughts about this? -- Alex Jones | ajones@ctron.com Cabletron Systems, Inc. Durham, NH USA 03824 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 09:40:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA24692 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:40:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from io.keanesea.com (io.keanesea.com [206.213.110.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA24679 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:40:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from FRIDAY (friday.keanesea.com [206.213.110.70]) by io.keanesea.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA22540 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:39:22 -0700 Received: by FRIDAY with Microsoft Mail id <01BB88FB.2E799770@FRIDAY>; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:38:28 -0700 Message-ID: <01BB88FB.2E799770@FRIDAY> From: Cyrus Gray To: "'FreeBSD Hackers'" Subject: sysconfig Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:38:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk When installing FreeBSD you get the sysconfig ? I think. Is there anyway to bring up sysconfig after installing? Cyrus Gray Keane Inc. Thanks ----------------------------------------------------------- Cyrus Gray cyrusgr@keanesea.com Keane Inc. Phone 206.654.7074 Information Systems Fax 206.464.1551 ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 09:52:47 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA26306 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:52:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ntserv.webleicester.co.uk (ntserv.webleicester.co.uk [206.249.75.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA26300 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 09:52:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phil.webleicester.co.uk by ntserv.webleicester.co.uk (NTMail 3.02.07) with ESMTP id va025059 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 17:52:36 +0100 Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Phil E Taylor" Organization: Lan Systems To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 17:42:12 +0000 Subject: Re: BSD/OS webperf notes, anybody want to test FreeBSD? Reply-to: phil@lansystems.co.uk Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.42) Message-Id: <16523614000363@webleicester.co.uk> X-Info: The Web Factory (Leicester) Electronic Mail System Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On 12 Aug 96 at 11:33, Jaye Mathisen wrote: Isn't it amazing how whoever performs/sanctions any benchmarks always comes out on top ?????? Also looking at the microsoft document referred to by the document below, http://www.microsoft.com/infoserv/haynes1.htm I saw an interesting thing in the footnote. I didn't realise that Intel now owns Novell :-) > > > http://www.BSDI.COM:81/products/internet-server/benchmarks/webperf.h > tml > > > > I would think we could do better. > Phil Taylor Business : phil@lansystems.co.uk Personal : phil@taylor.org.uk LAN Systems - LAN/WAN Specialists Tel: (Direct Line) +44 (116) 223 0033 (Main Number) +44 (116) 255 9961 (Facsimile) +44 (116) 255 8861 150 London Road, Leicester, ENGLAND. LE2 1ND From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 10:05:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA27133 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 10:05:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chain.iafrica.com (root@chain.iafrica.com [196.7.74.174]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA27122 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 10:05:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (khetan@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chain.iafrica.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA00237; Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:30:29 +0200 (SAT) Date: Mon, 12 Aug 1996 21:30:29 +0200 (SAT) From: Khetan Gajjar Reply-To: Khetan Gajjar To: Michael Smith cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Mouse.. In-Reply-To: <199608120749.RAA14747@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 12 Aug 1996, Michael Smith wrote: >Ok, well you didn't tell us that before. Sorry :-( >Are you telling moused what sort of mouse you have & where it is? Yes - check this out : [chain] /usr/home/khetan# moused -d -f -p /dev/psm0 -t ps/2 moused: rodent is ps/2 moused: read returned -1 : Resource temporarily unavailable exiting [chain] /usr/home/khetan# ps -uaxwwwww | grep mouse root 228 0.0 2.1 244 624 p1 S+ 9:29PM 0:00.02 grep mouse [chain] /usr/home/khetan# >Have you checked to see what state moused is in? (ps axl) Yes, it's not running. >Are you running X at the same time? Tried it with (and without) X loaded; same thing. --- Khetan Gajjar [ http://www.iafrica.com/~khetan ] UUNet Internet Africa [ 0800-030-002 & help@iafrica.com ] Get rid of Telkom.... [ http://www.ispa.org.za ] I'm a FreeBSD User! [ http://www.freebsd.org ] Any opinions stated in this message are personal. UIA's official policy may not be reflected in this message. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 11:16:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA01270 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:16:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA01265 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:16:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id LAA09670; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:15:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma009668; Tue Aug 13 11:15:25 1996 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:14:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Julian Elischer To: Philip Milne cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-Reply-To: <9608131050.AA02567@ln1d273nwk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk our best be would be to try find someone nearby who can come over and look at it for you.. there are biund to be some FreeBSD people nearby if you let us know WHERE you are.. My guess is that you mistyped the command.. it looks like you typed sd or wd instead of fd it's probably recoverable if we can find the beginning of the partitions other than root. (root may be lost, but that is the easiest to recover.) julian On Tue, 13 Aug 1996, Philip Milne wrote: > Hi, we are a small ISP running FreeBSD to power our WEB server and mail > host. While trying to do a simple exhaustive dump of everything as a crude > backup we have brought our system down. Our sysadmin is on holiday and > recommended that we write to you for some clues as to what we can do to > salvage the situation. > > As root we did the following: > > tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / > > (We know there are better ways to do dumps but we'd done this before and it > worked so we thought it would be better than no backup at all - couldn't have > been more wrong there). > > As there were some odd messages appearing in the console this was aborted with: > > ^C > > After that, the system crashed and now, when we try to restart the machine, > we get the following status report on the console: > > ***************************************************************************** > > Boot: > - > > ***************************************************************************** > > Any help would be very much appreciated. > > Thanks, > Philip > From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 11:19:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA01436 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:19:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA01429 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:19:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA03944 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 20:19:48 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id UAA32435 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 20:19:00 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id TAA14130; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:59:24 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608131759.TAA14130@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:59:24 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: AIX/6000 fuser command In-Reply-To: <9608130932.AA08532@egeo.unipg.it>; from Giuseppe Vitillaro on Aug 13, 1996 11:32:02 +0200 References: <9608130932.AA08532@egeo.unipg.it> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Giuseppe Vitillaro: > (1) does an equivalent command exist under FreeBSD? You have either fstat which is standard with FreeBSD or you can use LSOF which you may find in the ports system (CURRENT only). I don't remember if it has been committed yet. You may use LSOF on 2.2-CURRENT as of 3.66. Last is now 3.69. It has been ported to 2.0.5 and 2.1.0 for a long time. It is much better than fstat. lsof 3.66 usage: [-?abChlnNoOPstUvw] [-c c] [-d s] [-D D] [-F [f]] [-g [s]] [-i i] [-k k] [-m m] [-p s] [-r [t]] [-S [t]] [-u s] [-U] [--] [names] Defaults are enclosed in parentheses. Separate items in a set (s) by commas. -? list help -a AND selections (OR) -b avoid kernel blocks -c c list command c -C ignore kernel's name cache -D D ?|i|b|r|u[path] -d s select by FD set -F [f] select fields (-F? for help) -g [s] select by process group ID set and print process group IDs -h list help -i select Internet files -i i select by Internet address: [protocol][@name|number][:service|port] -k k kernel sym (/kernel) -m m kernel mem (/dev/kmem) -l list UID numbers -n don't list host names -N select NFS files -o always list file offset -O avoid fork overhead *RISKY* -p s select by PID set -P don't list port names -r [t] repeat output time (15) -s always list file size -S [t] readlink/stat timeout (15) -t terse listing -u s exclude(^)/select login/UID set -U select Unix socket files -v display version information -w suppress warning messages names select named files or files on named file systems Only root can list all files. Inaccessible /dev warnings are enabled. /users/staff/roberto/.lsof_keltia is the default device cache file read path. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 11:19:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA01455 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:19:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA01430 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:19:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA03940 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 20:19:47 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id UAA32436 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 20:19:00 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id TAA14096; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:51:39 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608131751.TAA14096@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:51:39 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: ; from spr@awod.com on Aug 13, 1996 0:44:32 -0400 References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to spr@awod.com: > popper.o: Undefined symbol '_setprotedtitle' referenced from text segment > > It says this several times and then dies. SETPROTECTITLE is mentioned in setproctitle has been moved to libutil.{a,so} a while ago. Try adding -lutil if you're compiling. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 11:20:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA01538 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:20:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA01519 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:20:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA03942 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 20:19:47 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id UAA32437 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 20:19:00 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id TAA14120; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:56:09 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608131756.TAA14120@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:56:09 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: ; from Developer on Aug 13, 1996 9:28:19 +0100 References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Developer: > > > and with `fork()' replaced with `pthread_create()'? > > This may be a silly question, but where do I get libpthreads from? In /usr/src/lib/libc_r, you'll find a thread-safe libc with pthreads included in uthread/. 349 [19:55] roberto@keltia:libc_r/uthread> ll libc_r* -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 584862 Aug 12 23:22 libc_r/libc_r.a -rwxr-xr-x 1 root wheel 457166 Aug 12 23:29 libc_r/libc_r.so.3.0 -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 672730 Aug 12 23:29 libc_r/libc_r_pic.a -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 11:27:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA02004 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:27:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA01996 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:27:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA06498; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:26:45 -0700 (PDT) To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: AIX/6000 fuser command In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:59:24 +0200." <199608131759.TAA14130@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:26:45 -0700 Message-ID: <6496.839960805@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > which you may find in the ports system (CURRENT only). I don't remember if > it has been committed yet. Don't think it has - it's not in the latest INDEX file. > coast.cc.purdue.edu? You sure? Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 11:46:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA03040 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:46:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA03032 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:46:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id EAA15809; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 04:44:15 +1000 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 04:44:15 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608131844.EAA15809@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: ajones@ctron.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: and C++ Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I'm writing a device driver in C++, and have run into a problem with >the GENSPL macro in . g++ is croaking on the statement: >__asm __volatile("":::"memory"); >with the following error: >parse error before "::" > Without getting into an argument about whether g++ is in error about >accepting the code as it is, I'm asking whether or not this code >fragment even needs to exist. Yes, it does. It tells gcc that memory may have changed so that gcc is forced to reload cached variables in code like this: extern int glob; int s; /* * Do an cheap although imperfect test of `glob' to minimize * overheads. */ if (glob) { /* * Probably something to do. An interrupt may have * cleared `glob' since we tested it before calling * splfoo(), so we have to test it again to be sure * that there is someting to do. */ s = splfoo(); if (glob) dostuff(glob); splx(s); } Without the dummy memory-accessing asm, `glob' isn't changed by splfoo(). It isn't declared volatile, so the second test of `glob' can be omitted if it really hasn't changed. The asm stops this invalid optimization. The problem could also be avoided by declaring `glob' as volatile. This method isn't used because 1) drivers are generally sloppy about declaring things volatile. 2) declaring things volatile would mainly slow things down. In the above, `glob' is non-volatile iff it is protected by an splfoo(), normal accesses to it are protected, so declaring it as volatile would be wasteful. > Now, I just tried an interesting experiment. I generated the assembly >code (using init_main.c) with the asm declaration in there. It produced >#APP >#NO_APP >where the asm declaration should be. Then I generated the assembly with >the asm declaration removed, and the code was the exact same except the >#APP/#NO_APP code was gone. gas also says: I checked all the spl's in last year's kernel for changes (pessimizations) caused by the asm. There was no significant change in most cases. There were a few small pesimizations (usually for _local_ variables being vulnerable to memory being changed, although it would take very poorly designed assembler to change a local variable), and no cases where the asm fixed a bug. > So it seems like the asm statement is a no-op. Is this a fair >assumption? Can I just safely get rid of it? What are people's >thoughts about this? This was fixed almost a 12 months ago in -current and 8 months ago in -stable. Change `:::' to ` : : : ' and complain to anyone who uses insufficient whitespace between tokens. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 12:10:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA04081 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 12:10:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from helmholtz.salk.edu (helmholtz.salk.edu [198.202.70.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA04074 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 12:10:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pauling.salk.edu (pauling [198.202.70.108]) by helmholtz.salk.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA20051 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 12:10:34 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 12:10:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Bartol To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: lockf() function missing? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi all, I'm trying to compile a large neuron simulation package (appropriately named NEURON) on FreeBSD 2.2-960801-SNAP. The package uses Interviews-3.1 and I've almost got it made except that one of the source files makes reference to the lockf() function. This function appears in SunOS 4.1.3 man pages as being part of the standard C library functions in unistd.h. It also appears here on SGIs, Alphas, and Linux machines but is suspiciously absent from FreeBSD as far as I can tell. Is it really missing? Is there a replacement for lockf that I can cobble together myself using fcntl calls? If so, what refs should I use to do so? Thanks for you advice, Tom From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 12:16:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA04427 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 12:16:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from clem.systemsix.com (clem.systemsix.com [198.99.86.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA04421 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 12:16:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clem.systemsix.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA20143; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:16:29 -0600 Message-Id: <199608131916.NAA20143@clem.systemsix.com> X-Authentication-Warning: clem.systemsix.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 From: Steve Passe To: Alexander Seth Jones cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: hackers-digest V1 #1372 In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:16:26 PDT." <199608131816.LAA01279@freefall.freebsd.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:16:29 -0600 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, > I'm writing a device driver in C++, and have run into a problem with >the GENSPL macro in . g++ is croaking on the statement: > >__asm __volatile("":::"memory"); > >with the following error: > >parse error before "::" This has been fixed in 2.1.5 spl.h: 108c110 < __asm __volatile("":::"memory"); \ --- > __asm __volatile("" : : : "memory"); \ -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 13:34:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA09006 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:34:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA08979 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 13:34:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA02870; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 12:50:08 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608131950.MAA02870@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Philip Milne cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 13 Aug 1996 11:49:58 BST." <9608131050.AA02567@ln1d273nwk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 12:50:07 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >From The Desk Of Philip Milne : > Boot: Can you type "?" and then hit return at the boot prompt? That will tell us if you have any files on your root partition Tnks, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 14:31:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA12735 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:31:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA12714 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:30:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA04123 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 23:30:49 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id XAA01348 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 23:30:25 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id WAA14636; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:44:44 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608132044.WAA14636@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:44:43 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: AIX/6000 fuser command In-Reply-To: <6496.839960805@time.cdrom.com>; from Jordan K. Hubbard on Aug 13, 1996 11:26:45 -0700 References: <6496.839960805@time.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Jordan K. Hubbard: > Don't think it has - it's not in the latest INDEX file. There is a open PR for the port by David O'Brien. >Number: 1476 >Category: ports >Synopsis: new port -- lsof >Confidential: no >Severity: non-critical >Priority: medium >Responsible: freebsd-bugs >State: open >Class: change-request >Submitter-Id: current-users >Arrival-Date: Thu Aug 8 02:00:03 PDT 1996 >Last-Modified: >Originator: David E. O'Brien >Organization: University of California, Davis >Release: FreeBSD 2.1.5-RELEASE i386 >Environment: > > > > coast.cc.purdue.edu? You sure? Sorry, Vic Abel's site is "vic.cc.purdue.edu". The COAST archive is at coast.cs.purdue.edu, not coast.cc. I tend to mix them sometimes :-) -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 14:31:13 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA12773 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:31:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA12757 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:31:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA04121 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 23:30:48 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id XAA01350 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 23:30:25 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id WAA14681; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:52:10 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608132052.WAA14681@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:52:10 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: lockf() function missing? In-Reply-To: ; from Tom Bartol on Aug 13, 1996 12:10:01 -0700 References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Tom Bartol: > reference to the lockf() function. This function appears in SunOS 4.1.3 > man pages as being part of the standard C library functions in unistd.h. > It also appears here on SGIs, Alphas, and Linux machines but is > suspiciously absent from FreeBSD as far as I can tell. Is it really > missing? Is there a replacement for lockf that I can cobble together It is missing because it is supposed to be a System V syscall. You could probably emulate it with either fcntl or flock or better change the program to use fcntl(2). -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 14:52:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA14498 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:52:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA14491 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:52:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA27792; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:41:51 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608132141.OAA27792@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: dev@fgate.flevel.co.uk (Developer) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:41:51 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, koshy@india.hp.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Developer" at Aug 13, 96 09:28:19 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > So my question is: how does NT behave when it has to schedule > > > between a large number of processes each with its own process > > > context, VM, page tables etc? Conversely how does the unix > > > program behave when linked with -lpthreads and with `fork()' > > > replaced with `pthread_create()'? > > This may be a silly question, but where do I get libpthreads from? It is in ports. You will need a thread safe lbc (patched included in the port, I believe). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 14:55:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA14737 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:55:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA14730 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:55:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA27819; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:49:25 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608132149.OAA27819@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Rebooting and related topics.. To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 14:49:25 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, julian@whistle.com In-Reply-To: <320FF06B.15FB7483@whistle.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Aug 12, 96 08:03:07 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I've added a small callout list to the reboot code so that we and > other third party types can add modules which require actions at > shutdown. looking at the boot code however, I see that about 90% > of boot() in machdep.c is in fact NOT mach dependent at all. > I'd like to move most of this out to somewhere more generic > while I'm adding my callout code.. > > several questions.. > > 1/ am I correct? I think so. > 2/ can anyone suggest the correct place for it? kern_sync.c? kern_shutdown.c? (new) > 3/ The callout code has a prototype for the function at_reboot() > where should this prototype live? (I've dropped it into > systm.h at the moment) > > the reason for a kerenl based callout list > rather than a user-based rc.shutdown is to do with the nature > of the modules being added here.. > > I'd eventually like to add similar callout lists to exit() and fork() > but they are not needed for these particular modules. Think about priority based insertion and maintaining a front/end/middle (middle = don't care) insertion order. That way the actual attempts at keyboard reset, etc., can be put into the same list as call-outs. You may also want to add a parameter to the calldowns that supports the type of shutdown (halt/reboot/boot_to_dos, etc.). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 15:20:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA16628 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:20:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA16623 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:20:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA16185; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 18:20:05 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 18:20 EDT Received: from lakes (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id QAA11893 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 16:29:52 -0400 Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes (8.6.12/8.6.9) id QAA02107; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 16:36:03 -0400 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 16:36:03 -0400 From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608132036.QAA02107@lakes> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, lakes!rivers Subject: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Ok - I know it's been some time since 2.1.5 came out; but I'm finally getting to installing it. The main reason I'm getting to this (besides the fact that I have vacation now) is that I'm dying to move up from 2.1.0 to try and fix the locked-up sio problems I'm experiencing. (Details: a 386dx-33 with an AHA1542B; any 38400 connection eventually hangs in ttywait. This is *with* the fix to the spl levels in the VM from last June.) Anyway, after tripping over the "I'm dead.." phenomena and discovering you have to have a nameserver entry, even if you're not using it (I was wondering why I was saving all that old mail...) - I'm now finally on the way to installing 2.1.5 on my Pentium 75 laptop. However, I'm rather distressed to see: sio0: 1 more silo overflow (total n) messages popping out on VTY-2. This is with a 19200 connection, the sending machine (of course, not experiencing any overflows) is a 486dx-66. The receiving machine is a Pentium 75, with 16550a uarts! This is a direct connection through a NULL modem with brand new cables, with '-h' specified on both slattach's, so rts/cts is being used... Seems to me a Pentium 75 should be able to keep up with 19200, and hopefully be able to do much better... am I the only one tripping over these sio issues? Is there some other magic to setting rts/cts that I don't know about? Is there any hope my 386dx with 16550As will be able to handle anything higher than 19200 without locking up? - Thanks - - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 15:30:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA17263 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:30:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA17258 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:30:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id PAA10449; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:28:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma010447; Tue Aug 13 15:28:13 1996 Message-ID: <3211014E.2781E494@whistle.com> Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:27:26 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b4 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Terry Lambert CC: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Rebooting and related topics.. References: <199608132149.OAA27819@phaeton.artisoft.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert wrote: > > > I've added a small callout list to the reboot code so that we and > > other third party types can add modules which require actions at > > shutdown. looking at the boot code however, I see that about 90% > > of boot() in machdep.c is in fact NOT mach dependent at all. > > I'd like to move most of this out to somewhere more generic > > while I'm adding my callout code.. > > > > several questions.. > > > > 1/ am I correct? > > I think so. > > > 2/ can anyone suggest the correct place for it? > > kern_sync.c? > kern_shutdown.c? (new) I'm tempted to crete the new file and possibly move reboot() in there as well. > Think about priority based insertion and maintaining a front/end/middle > (middle = don't care) insertion order. you know, I don't think this is that important.. it complicates things.. I migh tadd 2 calls. at_reboot() and at_reboot_last() but that would be the limit of it I think.. KISS > > That way the actual attempts at keyboard reset, etc., can be put into > the same list as call-outs. why reset a keyboard at reboot? > > You may also want to add a parameter to the calldowns that supports > the type of shutdown (halt/reboot/boot_to_dos, etc.). I already do,, the args to the function are func(arg1,howto) where howto is the usual RB_ flags word.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 15:43:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA17983 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:43:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from viking.ucsalf.ac.uk (viking.ucsalf.ac.uk [192.195.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA17978 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:43:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by viking.ucsalf.ac.uk (Smail3.1.29.1 #4) id m0uqSB7-00036xC; Tue, 13 Aug 96 23:43 BST Message-Id: From: andreas@klemm.gtn.com (Andreas Klemm) Subject: Re: Linux async vs. FreeBSD sync To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: 13 Aug 1996 18:04:46 GMT X-Gated-To-News-By: news@ucsalf.ac.uk X-Newsreader: knews 0.9.7 Xref: viking.ucsalf.ac.uk comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc:24475 list.freebsd.hackers:5523 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <4uc8cv$3ua@plato.ucsalf.ac.uk>, mark@plato.ucsalf.ac.uk (Mark Powell) writes: > Anyway, thought I'd just let you know of my positive experience with > FreeBSD. Keep up the good work. I'll save Linux for play and the FreeBSD > for the serious work. (I was only installing Linux to play xquake. Now > someone tells me FreeBSD-2.2 will run it arrrrgh!!) Hehehe ;-)) -- andreas@klemm.gtn.com /\/\___ Wiechers & Partner Datentechnik GmbH Andreas Klemm ___/\/\/ Support Unix -- andreas.klemm@wup.de pgp p-key http://www-swiss.ai.mit.edu/~bal/pks-toplev.html >>> powered by <<< ftp://sunsite.unc.edu/pub/Linux/system/Printing/aps-491.tgz >>> FreeBSD <<< From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 15:51:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA18428 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:51:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sag.space.lockheed.com (sag.space.lockheed.com [192.68.162.134]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA18421 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:51:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost by sag.space.lockheed.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/21Nov95-0423PM) id AA18945; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:50:47 -0700 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 15:50:47 -0700 (PDT) From: "Brian N. Handy" To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) In-Reply-To: <199608132036.QAA02107@lakes> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >However, I'm rather distressed to see: > > sio0: 1 more silo overflow (total n) > I get this sort of stuff all the time, though it doesn't (in my case) (as far as I can tell) seem to affect anything. I've got it on a 486 with a MOUSE on the serial port and a 586 w/ mouse and modem on the two ports. I don't have the brainpower to understand what it all means though. Brian From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 16:07:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA19112 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 16:07:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA19106 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 16:07:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA27932; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 16:01:27 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608132301.QAA27932@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Rebooting and related topics.. To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 16:01:26 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <3211014E.2781E494@whistle.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Aug 13, 96 03:27:26 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Think about priority based insertion and maintaining a front/end/middle > > (middle = don't care) insertion order. > > you know, I don't think this is that important.. it complicates things.. > > I migh tadd 2 calls. at_reboot() and at_reboot_last() but that would be > the limit of it I think.. KISS I was talking architecture; you are talking implementation. I didn't want to say anthing about implementation, in case I offended you because you already had it all written before you posted. 8-). > > That way the actual attempts at keyboard reset, etc., can be put into > > the same list as call-outs. > > why reset a keyboard at reboot? Reset *using* the keyboard, as opposed to resetting via triple fault. Order: 1) APM interface (shut machine power off -- new Micron boxes and old non-Intel boxes from everyone else support this. 2) Bus-based reset: PCI-specific, EISA specific, MCA specific 3) Keyboard controller based reset attempt 4) Triple fault reset attempt 5) Hang there with pages unmapped looking stupid until a human hits the reset button. 8-). > > You may also want to add a parameter to the calldowns that supports > > the type of shutdown (halt/reboot/boot_to_dos, etc.). > > I already do,, > the args to the function are func(arg1,howto) > where howto is the usual RB_ flags word.. This is good; if you are doing a halt (hard reset required) or a power control (power on required), then you can speed things up by not setting non-FIFO mode on the UART's, etc., so non-BSD OS's can use them safely. Most BIOS' don't implement FIFO reset in their serial port initialization code, and without it, the FIFO mode can remain on and cause problems. The same for ethernet card interrupts, etc. (though most drivers have been hacked to avoid that, already). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 16:38:15 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA20332 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 16:38:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.think.com (Mail1.Think.COM [131.239.33.245]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA20326 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 16:38:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Early-Bird.Think.COM (Early-Bird-1.Think.COM [131.239.146.105]) by mail.think.com (8.7.5/m3) with ESMTP id TAA03344; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:38:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from compound.Think.COM ([206.147.16.34]) by Early-Bird.Think.COM (8.7.5/e1) with ESMTP id TAA04117; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:37:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from alk@localhost) by compound.Think.COM (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA09454; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 18:39:09 -0500 (CDT) Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 18:39:09 -0500 (CDT) From: Tony Kimball Message-Id: <199608132339.SAA09454@compound.Think.COM> To: michaelv@HeadCandy.com Cc: dennis@etinc.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth Michael L. VanLoon on Mon, 12 August: : >This is all very nice, but on a macro level NT has two very obvious : >problems to consider: : >1) Its rather new... : >2) It was written by Microsoft : : And, how do these affect NT's performance? (Or, threading vs. process : context switching, in general?) : Well, it means that you can't run the same benchmarks for one thing: It won't run standard thread code, nor will it run standard multiprocess code. In fact NT's performance metric for most classic benchmarks will be precisely 0. It also means that one is well-justified in inferring that system uptime will be short enough so that many performance measurements (those relating to very long running jobs) will be mooted by stability problems. Actually, my impression is that 4.0 is quite an improvement over past incarnations in terms of both robustness and efficiency, although it does suck memory badly, so the historically justified induction may break down for NT 4.0. Such benchmarks seem of questionable relevance anyhow -- NT is not selected for performance -- or for compatibility in environments where NetWare is absent. NT is selected to run a GUI, and to run specific commercial applications which aren't generally available on unix or bsd systems anyhow, so unix and bsd get a big goose-egg performance metric. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 17:49:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA23782 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 17:49:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA23767; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 17:49:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id KAA27572; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:36:30 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608140106.KAA27572@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) To: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:36:29 +0930 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, lakes!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608132036.QAA02107@lakes> from "Thomas David Rivers" at Aug 13, 96 04:36:03 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Thomas David Rivers stands accused of saying: > > However, I'm rather distressed to see: > > sio0: 1 more silo overflow (total n) > > messages popping out on VTY-2. This is with a 19200 connection, > the sending machine (of course, not experiencing any overflows) > is a 486dx-66. The receiving machine is a Pentium 75, with 16550a > uarts! This is a direct connection through a NULL modem with > brand new cables, with '-h' specified on both slattach's, so rts/cts > is being used... Just FYI, your P75 almost certainly doesn't have 16550A's. What you probably have is a blob from UMC or SMC or Winbond or someone like that that tries to emulate the PC16550 (note the correct part number folks). The 'correctness' of these emulations has been done to death around here; suffice to say that there are a number of possible causes for your problem : - There is a device driver you're using that keeps interrupts turned off for long enough for the sio driver to respond too late. General consensus has it that this is fairly unlikely. - Your UARTs are failing to generate FIFO trigger-level interrupts, or these interrupts are being lost by your hardware. 'silo overflow' errors are symptomatic of delayed or missed interrupts or faulty hardware. They are not (generally) symptomatic of software faults. > - Dave Rivers - -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 17:57:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA24699 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 17:57:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA24692 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 17:57:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id KAA27625; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:44:27 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608140114.KAA27625@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Mouse.. To: khetan@iafrica.com Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:44:27 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Khetan Gajjar" at Aug 12, 96 09:30:29 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Khetan Gajjar stands accused of saying: > > >Are you telling moused what sort of mouse you have & where it is? > > Yes - check this out : > > [chain] /usr/home/khetan# moused -d -f -p /dev/psm0 -t ps/2 > moused: rodent is ps/2 > moused: read returned -1 : Resource temporarily unavailable exiting Ah. Now, if you'd posted this like a week or so ago when you started complaining, we could have solved the problem straight away. When in doubt, go for the factual overload. It's impossible to diagnose a problem from "it doesn't work". The problem is due to the stupid fashion in which the ps/2 mouse driver decides whether it should be read in blocking or nonblocking mode. If the minor number has the LSB set, it's read in nonblocking mode, and the default /dev/psm0 is 21/1. You could try : # mknod /dev/nbpsm0 c 21 0 and then point moused at that, or you could 'fix' the psm driver to the (flag) argument to psmread() properly. > Khetan Gajjar [ http://www.iafrica.com/~khetan ] -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 19:13:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA27501 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:13:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cc-server9.massey.ac.nz (cc-server9.massey.ac.nz [130.123.128.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA27489 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 19:13:04 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608140213.TAA27489@freefall.freebsd.org> Received: from tpc-pc1 by cc-server9 with SMTP(PP); Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:11:23 +1200 X-Sender: CHarding@mail.massey.ac.nz Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:11:22 +1200 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org From: C.R.Harding@massey.ac.nz (Craig Harding) Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) X-Mailer: Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Thomas David Rivers writes: >Seems to me a Pentium 75 should be able to keep up with 19200, and >hopefully be able to do much better... am I the only one tripping >over these sio issues? Is there some other magic to setting rts/cts >that I don't know about? Is there any hope my 386dx with 16550As will >be able to handle anything higher than 19200 without locking up? As a data point: I'm running 2.0.5-RELEASE on a 486SX25 with two serial ports containing real 16550As. Both ports are locked at 57600 and users happily dialin and use one line interactively (on a 14k4 modem) while the other line on the 28k8 modem gets 3400cps receiving approx. 80MB of compressed news per day via Taylor UUCP. No silo overflows. I think the previous message relating to custom single-chip emulation of a 16550A may explain your problems. -- C. ("yes virginia, some of us are still only connected to the Net via UUCP"). -- Craig Harding Editor, Massey University Television Production Centre "I don't know about God, I just think we're handmade" - Polly From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 21:20:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA04316 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 21:20:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA04307 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 21:20:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA21899; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 00:20:06 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 00:20 EDT Received: from lakes (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id XAA18414; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 23:01:00 -0400 Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes (8.6.12/8.6.9) id XAA03390; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 23:07:20 -0400 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 23:07:20 -0400 From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608140307.XAA03390@lakes> To: sag.space.lockheed.com!handy@dg-rtp.dg.com, ponds!rivers Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > >However, I'm rather distressed to see: > > > > sio0: 1 more silo overflow (total n) > > > > I get this sort of stuff all the time, though it doesn't (in my case) (as > far as I can tell) seem to affect anything. I've got it on a 486 with a > MOUSE on the serial port and a 586 w/ mouse and modem on the two ports. I > don't have the brainpower to understand what it all means though. > > Brian > Basically, it means that your machine was not able to service "interrupts" at some level, so that bits were overrun on the serial port. The bits from the 232 hardware come "screaming" into your computer, and if the software doesn't handle them fast enough, you get a "silo overflow" [I have interrupts in quotes there because the sio driver uses two queues for handling hardware interrupts vs. deliverying bytes to the system... The idea is that the driver can take the hardware interrupt and place the bits into the secondary queue without having to handle anything else, making it respond faster to the UART hardware.] Most of the time, with say, kermit/PPP or SL/IP - higher-level protocols detect the transmission error and take the necessary steps to see that the packet is retransmitted. If your packet size is appropriate, and your baud rate is high enough, you don't even notice the retransmissions. With the mouse, I believe, you would notice things like your pointer bouncing madly around, or, if the bit(s) were dropped in just the right way, not moving around at all, then suddenly working again. Your problem is likely that crtscts isn't set on the serial line your mouse are attached to, or can't/shouldn't be set because the mice don't support it. For serial mice, you should be able to set the baud rate way down (e.g. 1200), which should completely avoid the problem. See your XF86Config file (the XF86Config.eg will help) for where to set the baud rate. My issue is that I shouldn't be seeing these at all on a P75. Furthermore, I'm seeing lockups in ttywait on a 386, which shouldn't happen.... after the lockup is resolved (drainwait expires?), I can re-open the serial line, but that doesn't help a SL/IP session, I have to kill the slattach and start a new one. So, I have to be around when this happens (usually very soon...) [Hmmm... I'm seeing these silo overflows during install time, and if crtscts is off by default, then perhaps the -h on the slattach isn't effective? If so, maybe we want to change the install to lock -crtscts on the dialout devices?... just a thought...] - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 22:43:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA09120 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:43:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from viking.ucsalf.ac.uk (viking.ucsalf.ac.uk [192.195.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA09109 for ; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:43:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: by viking.ucsalf.ac.uk (Smail3.1.29.1 #4) id m0uqYk9-00036xC; Wed, 14 Aug 96 06:43 BST Message-Id: From: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) Subject: Re: sio problems with 2.2-960801-SNAP To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: 13 Aug 1996 20:20:28 GMT Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) X-Gated-To-News-By: news@ucsalf.ac.uk X-Newsreader: knews 0.9.6 X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Xref: viking.ucsalf.ac.uk comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc:24494 list.freebsd.hackers:5543 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk mark@plato.ucsalf.ac.uk (Mark Powell) wrote: > Aug 8 11:52:22 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 4 > Aug 8 11:52:41 plato last message repeated 3 times > Aug 8 11:53:55 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 4 > Aug 8 11:53:55 plato /kernel.2.2: too many stray irq 4's; not logging any more > Aug 8 12:15:41 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 3 I've seen this message already, and i'm sure i have answered it. Why are you re-posting instead of reading the answer, or at least, following up to your own article (so to keep it within the same thread)? Basically, there's something screwed with your interrupt configuration. Stray irq's are not supposed to happen for a configured driver, they are generated by catch-all code inside the ISA bus controller driver, thus a strong indication that your IRQs never reach the sio driver. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 22:44:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA09302 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:44:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA09284; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:44:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA29529; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:31:31 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608140601.PAA29529@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) To: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:31:30 +0930 (CST) Cc: sag.space.lockheed.com!handy@dg-rtp.dg.com, ponds!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608140307.XAA03390@lakes> from "Thomas David Rivers" at Aug 13, 96 11:07:20 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Thomas David Rivers stands accused of saying: > > Your problem is likely that crtscts isn't set on the serial > line your mouse are attached to, or can't/shouldn't be set because > the mice don't support it. For serial mice, you should be > able to set the baud rate way down (e.g. 1200), which should completely > avoid the problem. See your XF86Config file (the XF86Config.eg > will help) for where to set the baud rate. Mice do not honour RTS. In fact, they depend on it being set to obtain power. All but a very few mice run at 1200bps; the problem with silo overflows on a mouse port can only attributed to hardware oddities. Furthermore, handshking failures will generally result in the "interrupt buffer overflow" or "tty-level buffer overflow" error messages. Even with handshaking off (CTS clear), the sio drive will still accept data from the UART. > My issue is that I shouldn't be seeing these at all on a P75. The processor has nothing to do with it in your case. > Furthermore, I'm seeing lockups in ttywait on a 386, which shouldn't > happen.... after the lockup is resolved (drainwait expires?), I can > re-open the serial line, but that doesn't help a SL/IP session, > I have to kill the slattach and start a new one. So, I have to > be around when this happens (usually very soon...) If this is bothering you, and you are completely up to date, then I or someone better qualified will be more than happy to help you chase down the problem. If you aren't, come back when you've upgraded to 2.1.5 and are still having the same problem. The fact that you're the only person seeing this makes me wonder whether you have funny serial hardware causing your problems. Note that lots of PC serial hardware is _really_bad_, so this is actually fairly likely. > - Dave Rivers - -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 22:48:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA09548 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:48:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sag.space.lockheed.com (sag.space.lockheed.com [192.68.162.134]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA09542; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:48:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost by sag.space.lockheed.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/21Nov95-0423PM) id AA00531; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:48:44 -0700 Date: Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:48:44 -0700 (PDT) From: "Brian N. Handy" To: Michael Smith Cc: Thomas David Rivers , sag.space.lockheed.com!handy@dg-rtp.dg.com, ponds!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) In-Reply-To: <199608140601.PAA29529@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >The fact that you're the only person seeing this makes me wonder whether >you have funny serial hardware causing your problems. Note that lots of >PC serial hardware is _really_bad_, so this is actually fairly likely. > Now, it's worth noting that before I upgraded the 486 with the errant mouse port to...oh...I think 2.1? (Nate would remember, he sees the same thing) I never got the "sio overflow" message in my syslogs. Something has changed to make this error show up. Again, I've never noticed it affecting anything. I don't remember when it started, so don't quote me on that. It's a new development in the last 1.5 years or so though. Brian From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Aug 13 22:58:42 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA09811 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:58:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA09806; Tue, 13 Aug 1996 22:58:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA29653; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:45:47 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608140615.PAA29653@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) To: handy@sag.space.lockheed.com (Brian N. Handy) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:45:46 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, sag.space.lockheed.com!handy@dg-rtp.dg.com, ponds!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Brian N. Handy" at Aug 13, 96 10:48:44 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Brian N. Handy stands accused of saying: > > > >The fact that you're the only person seeing this makes me wonder whether > >you have funny serial hardware causing your problems. Note that lots of > >PC serial hardware is _really_bad_, so this is actually fairly likely. > > > > Now, it's worth noting that before I upgraded the 486 with the errant > mouse port to...oh...I think 2.1? (Nate would remember, he sees the same > thing) I never got the "sio overflow" message in my syslogs. Something > has changed to make this error show up. Again, I've never noticed it > affecting anything. Hmm, you say Nate sees this error too? Any chance it's on the same hardware? Or on a common-denominator part? In the set of machines that I could be said to 'have a finger in', there are a huge number of different UART parts, but none that seem to generate FIFO overflows without due cause. > I don't remember when it started, so don't quote me on that. It's a new > development in the last 1.5 years or so though. Sheesh, 1.5 years takes us back to 2.0. Ancient history 8) > Brian -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 00:20:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA12262 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 00:20:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA12256 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 00:20:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA11697; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:19:29 +0200 Message-Id: <199608140719.JAA11697@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: sio problems with 2.2-960801-SNAP To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:19:29 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "J Wunsch" at Aug 13, 96 08:20:28 pm From: sos@FreeBSD.org Reply-to: sos@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to J Wunsch who wrote: > > mark@plato.ucsalf.ac.uk (Mark Powell) wrote: > > > Aug 8 11:52:22 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 4 > > Aug 8 11:52:41 plato last message repeated 3 times > > Aug 8 11:53:55 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 4 > > Aug 8 11:53:55 plato /kernel.2.2: too many stray irq 4's; not logging any more > > Aug 8 12:15:41 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 3 > > I've seen this message already, and i'm sure i have answered it. > > Why are you re-posting instead of reading the answer, or at least, > following up to your own article (so to keep it within the same > thread)? > > Basically, there's something screwed with your interrupt > configuration. Stray irq's are not supposed to happen for a > configured driver, they are generated by catch-all code inside > the ISA bus controller driver, thus a strong indication that > your IRQs never reach the sio driver. Or he is using th PCCARD code, that will generate very funny messages if you run a modem on it :), I get both stray IRQ's and silo overflows doing that here :( > > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 00:41:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA13104 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 00:41:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA13095; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 00:41:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id RAA00452; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:29:10 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608140759.RAA00452@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: sio problems with 2.2-960801-SNAP To: sos@FreeBSD.org Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:29:09 +0930 (CST) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199608140719.JAA11697@ra.dkuug.dk> from "sos@FreeBSD.org" at Aug 14, 96 09:19:29 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk sos@FreeBSD.org stands accused of saying: > > Or he is using th PCCARD code, that will generate very funny > messages if you run a modem on it :), I get both stray IRQ's and > silo overflows doing that here :( Weird. I have a _really_cheap_ Xstreama 28k8 PCCard modem here that works just fine. Is your PCIC on the same interrupt as the second serial port in your system? I was really pissed off to discover that the IRDA port on my notebook is on irq3. > Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 00:51:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA13380 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 00:51:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA13375 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 00:51:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chaos (chaos.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.18]) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.7.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id HAA07207; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:51:47 GMT Message-ID: <3211859E.1C4B@cet.co.jp> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:51:58 +0900 From: Michael Hancock Organization: CET X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b6Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc To: FreeBSD-Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG CC: gid@gids-games.com Subject: Re: HP 100VG support References: <4uf9ke$3ri@news.hk.linkage.net> <4ug4nu$ra3@hpindda.cup.hp.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Any volunteers? Tom Gidden wrote: > > Hi, > > I posted here earlier about HP 100VG cards (specifically, J8525A), and got > kind replies about the possibility of writing some drivers. Unfo. I had to > say `Thanks but no thanks', due to our short-term project. > > Now, my supervisor has said that he would be more than happy to test drivers > for these cards... so I'm asking again! > > We've got 8 of these cards (As supplied with the HP Vectra XU 6/150), and a > 100VG hub. We've also got ATM coming into the lab, along with an internal > IEEE 1355 eval net. Hopefully, Firewire's coming soon, too. > > My supervisor's e-mail: neil@pact.srf.ac.uk > > Thanks in advance, > Gid > -- > _____________________________________________________________________________ > /~` ( Tom Gidden Gid's Games: _the_ internet games site > (_,~(| Office: +44 (0) 117 954 5105 E-mail: gid@gids-games.com > ' Mobile: +44 (0) 976 690 578 WWW: http://www.gids-games.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 01:19:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id BAA14517 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 01:19:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fgate.flevel.co.uk (root@fgate.flevel.co.uk [194.6.101.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA14510 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 01:19:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dev@localhost) by fgate.flevel.co.uk (8.7.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA03834; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:25:43 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:25:42 +0100 (BST) From: Developer To: Ollivier Robert cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: <199608131756.TAA14120@keltia.freenix.fr> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 13 Aug 1996, Ollivier Robert wrote: > > > > and with `fork()' replaced with `pthread_create()'? > > > > This may be a silly question, but where do I get libpthreads from? > > In /usr/src/lib/libc_r, you'll find a thread-safe libc with pthreads > included in uthread/. > > 349 [19:55] roberto@keltia:libc_r/uthread> ll libc_r* > -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 584862 Aug 12 23:22 libc_r/libc_r.a > -rwxr-xr-x 1 root wheel 457166 Aug 12 23:29 libc_r/libc_r.so.3.0 > -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 672730 Aug 12 23:29 libc_r/libc_r_pic.a Thanks, I found it:) Is it safe to install on a system that isn`t running threads without causing any harm? Do I just do a make install? Regards, Trefor S. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 01:21:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id BAA14661 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 01:21:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fgate.flevel.co.uk (root@fgate.flevel.co.uk [194.6.101.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA14656 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 01:21:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dev@localhost) by fgate.flevel.co.uk (8.7.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA02511; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:23:11 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:23:10 +0100 (BST) From: Developer To: Terry Lambert cc: koshy@india.hp.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: <199608132141.OAA27792@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 13 Aug 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > > This may be a silly question, but where do I get libpthreads from? > > It is in ports. You will need a thread safe lbc (patched included > in the port, I believe). I understand.. but what is the name of the package in ports that does the threads, I can`t find it??? THanks. Trefor S. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 01:56:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id BAA16759 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 01:56:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA16752 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 01:56:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA00698; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 01:49:58 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608140849.BAA00698@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Developer cc: Terry Lambert , koshy@india.hp.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:23:10 BST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 01:49:57 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It is called freebsd-current 8) Try to do a netscape search on what pthreads are , write a short pthreads program and link it against "-lc_r". Forget about the "ports" bits... Have fun, Amancio >From The Desk Of Developer : > > > On Tue, 13 Aug 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > > This may be a silly question, but where do I get libpthreads from? > > > > It is in ports. You will need a thread safe lbc (patched included > > in the port, I believe). > > I understand.. but what is the name of the package in ports that does the > threads, I can`t find it??? > > THanks. > > Trefor S. > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 02:05:41 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA17453 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 02:05:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA17443; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 02:05:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA12063; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:05:12 +0200 Message-Id: <199608140905.LAA12063@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: sio problems with 2.2-960801-SNAP To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:05:12 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: sos@FreeBSD.org, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199608140759.RAA00452@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Aug 14, 96 05:29:09 pm From: sos@FreeBSD.org Reply-to: sos@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Michael Smith who wrote: > > sos@FreeBSD.org stands accused of saying: > > > > Or he is using th PCCARD code, that will generate very funny > > messages if you run a modem on it :), I get both stray IRQ's and > > silo overflows doing that here :( > > Weird. I have a _really_cheap_ Xstreama 28k8 PCCard modem here that works > just fine. > > Is your PCIC on the same interrupt as the second serial port in your system? > I was really pissed off to discover that the IRDA port on my notebook is > on irq3. Ha, ha, ha, you've been bitten by that too :) :) I have "fixed" that portion of code, so it doesn't trash sio1, I have hardwired it to int 15 :) The more I look into the PCCARD stuff, the more I get the feeling that it shouldn't be in there at all, its not even alpha quality code, its rare spaghetti !! :( :( At least something VERY strange is going on with interrupts, they are not allways delivered where they ought to, and sometimes they are completely lost.. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 02:19:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA18078 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 02:19:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from skiddaw.elsevier.co.uk (root@skiddaw.elsevier.co.uk [193.131.222.60]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA18073 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 02:19:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from snowdon.elsevier.co.uk (snowdon.elsevier.co.uk [193.131.197.164]) by skiddaw.elsevier.co.uk (8.6.13/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA10445 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:18:45 +0100 Received: from tees.elsevier.co.uk (actually host tees) by snowdon with SMTP (PP); Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:18:22 +0100 Received: (from dpr@localhost) by tees.elsevier.co.uk (8.6.13/8.6.12) id KAA01820; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:17:33 +0100 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: "Hr.Ladavac" , philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com (Philip Milne), hackers@freebsd.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. References: <4910.839936868@time.cdrom.com> From: Paul Richards Date: 14 Aug 1996 10:17:33 +0100 In-Reply-To: "Jordan K. Hubbard"'s message of Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:47:48 -0700 Message-ID: <57g25q9vf6.fsf@elsevier.co.uk> Lines: 27 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.30 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: > > > > tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / > > > > This has utterly trashed your boot device (and / lies there.) I seriuosly > > doubt that you can do anything but reinstall. > > Probably the right conclusion, but for the wrong reasons. Ehh, either I'm missing something really stupid or everyone else is :-) tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / is going to backup the / partition onto a floppy, what's wrong with that? About the worst that could happen is that rfd0a doesn't exist and you create a tar archive, at which point tar will say something like "/usr/bin/tar: /dev/rfd0 is the archive; not dumped" or you fill a floppy (doesn't gnu tar prompt for new floppies anyway). I certainly wouldn't expect this command to trash my / partition. -- Paul Richards. Originative Solutions Ltd. (Netcraft Ltd. contractor) Elsevier Science TIS online journal project. Email: p.richards@elsevier.co.uk Phone: 0370 462071 (Mobile), +44 (0)1865 843155 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 02:20:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA18178 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 02:20:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id CAA18172; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 02:20:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id TAA01441; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 19:07:34 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608140937.TAA01441@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: sio problems with 2.2-960801-SNAP To: sos@FreeBSD.org Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 19:07:34 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199608140905.LAA12063@ra.dkuug.dk> from "sos@FreeBSD.org" at Aug 14, 96 11:05:12 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk sos@FreeBSD.org stands accused of saying: > Ha, ha, ha, you've been bitten by that too :) :) > I have "fixed" that portion of code, so it doesn't trash sio1, I have > hardwired it to int 15 :) Hmm, no good for me; that's my CDrom 8( > The more I look into the PCCARD stuff, the more I get the feeling that it > shouldn't be in there at all, its not even alpha quality code, > its rare spaghetti !! :( :( Well, what it needs is a severe microwaving, that's for sure. Nate's done an amazing job cleaning bits of it up; hopefully we can find a few more hands and help out. > At least something VERY strange is going on with interrupts, they are not > allways delivered where they ought to, and sometimes they are > completely lost.. You're the first I've heard complain about this one though. > Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 03:03:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA19775 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:03:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA19768; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:02:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA12339; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:02:46 +0200 Message-Id: <199608141002.MAA12339@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: sio problems with 2.2-960801-SNAP To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:02:45 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: sos@FreeBSD.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199608140937.TAA01441@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Aug 14, 96 07:07:34 pm From: sos@FreeBSD.org Reply-to: sos@FreeBSD.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Michael Smith who wrote: > > sos@FreeBSD.org stands accused of saying: > > Ha, ha, ha, you've been bitten by that too :) :) > > I have "fixed" that portion of code, so it doesn't trash sio1, I have > > hardwired it to int 15 :) > > Hmm, no good for me; that's my CDrom 8( > > > The more I look into the PCCARD stuff, the more I get the feeling that it > > shouldn't be in there at all, its not even alpha quality code, > > its rare spaghetti !! :( :( > > Well, what it needs is a severe microwaving, that's for sure. Nate's done > an amazing job cleaning bits of it up; hopefully we can find a few more > hands and help out. > > > At least something VERY strange is going on with interrupts, they are not > > allways delivered where they ought to, and sometimes they are > > completely lost.. > > You're the first I've heard complain about this one though. I know that Poul-Henning (phk) has the problem as well, so I'm not alone.. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 03:13:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA20683 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:13:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA20677 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:13:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA13901 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:13:11 -0700 (PDT) Prev-Resent: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:13:10 -0700 Prev-Resent: "hackers@freebsd.org " Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (jkh-sl0-o.cdrom.com [204.216.27.193]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA13864 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:04:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cygnus.com (cygnus.com [140.174.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA19883 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:04:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tweedledumb.cygnus.com (tweedledumb.cygnus.com [192.80.44.1]) by cygnus.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id DAA22242 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:04:35 -0700 Received: from kechara.flame.org by tweedledumb.cygnus.com (4.1/4.7) id AA02920; Wed, 14 Aug 96 06:04:32 EDT Received: (from root@localhost) by kechara.flame.org (8.7.5/8.6.9) id GAA10224 for jkh@freebsd.org; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:04:22 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:04:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael Graff Message-Id: <199608141004.GAA10224@kechara.flame.org> To: jkh@freebsd.org Subject: bsd lkm's and you. Resent-To: hackers@freebsd.org Resent-Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:13:11 -0700 Resent-Message-ID: <13899.840017591@time.cdrom.com> Resent-From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk If you or anyone else from FreeBSD would like to work on a common interface for *BSD lkm's, I have made a mailing list, bsd-lkm@flame.org. And, for that matter, the other ones I made so long ago but never announced are still there, too... bsd-arch, bsd-chat, and bsd-install. If the lkm portion works well, perhaps those could get some use, too... Pass this along to anyone interested, including mailing lists and such. --Michael From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 03:16:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA21027 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:16:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA21018 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:16:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id UAA01998; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:01:56 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608141031.UAA01998@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: p.richards@elsevier.co.uk (Paul Richards) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:01:55 +0930 (CST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, lada@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at, philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com, hackers@freebsd.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com In-Reply-To: <57g25q9vf6.fsf@elsevier.co.uk> from "Paul Richards" at Aug 14, 96 10:17:33 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Paul Richards stands accused of saying: > > Ehh, either I'm missing something really stupid or everyone else is :-) > > tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / > > is going to backup the / partition onto a floppy, what's wrong with > that? About the worst that could happen is that rfd0a doesn't exist > and you create a tar archive, at which point tar will say something > like "/usr/bin/tar: /dev/rfd0 is the archive; not dumped" or you fill > a floppy (doesn't gnu tar prompt for new floppies anyway). > > I certainly wouldn't expect this command to trash my / partition. You obviously don't deal much with nontechnical types 8) The key concepts were : "our admin is on holidays" "we thought we would do xxx" "this is exactly what we did" (not) "everything is broken and we want you to fix it" The problem is that they are intentionally or otherwise _not_ telling us what they really did. Some people have assumed that they typoed the tar command; this is certainly a good place to start, but there are other obvious possibilities beyond this. FWIW, gnu tar will only prompt for new floppies if specifically warned in advance that it's doing a multivolume dump (at least that's what I found last time I was stupid enough to backup anything to floppy). > Paul Richards. Originative Solutions Ltd. (Netcraft Ltd. contractor) -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 03:23:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA21486 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:23:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA21465 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:23:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA00349; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:21:13 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608141021.DAA00349@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Paul Richards cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , "Hr.Ladavac" , philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com (Philip Milne), hackers@FreeBSD.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "14 Aug 1996 10:17:33 BST." <57g25q9vf6.fsf@elsevier.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:21:13 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >From The Desk Of Paul Richards : > I certainly wouldn't expect this command to trash my / partition. The command shouldn't trash / unless it is a tar file of an old system. I really would have like to see the output "?" :( Cheers, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 03:35:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA21901 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:35:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA21896 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:35:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.star-gate.com [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA00503; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:33:50 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608141033.DAA00503@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Michael Smith cc: p.richards@elsevier.co.uk (Paul Richards), jkh@time.cdrom.com, lada@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at, philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com, hackers@freebsd.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:01:55 +0930." <199608141031.UAA01998@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:33:49 -0700 From: Amancio Hasty Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >From The Desk Of Michael Smith : > Paul Richards stands accused of saying: > "our admin is on holidays" > "we thought we would do xxx" > "this is exactly what we did" (not) > "everything is broken and we want you to fix it" Or he had hardware problems which cause his disk to get wiped out ... From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 03:51:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA22270 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:51:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fgate.flevel.co.uk (root@fgate.flevel.co.uk [194.6.101.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA22264 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:51:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dev@localhost) by fgate.flevel.co.uk (8.7.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA18885; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:52:51 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:52:49 +0100 (BST) From: Developer To: Amancio Hasty cc: Terry Lambert , koshy@india.hp.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: <199608140849.BAA00698@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 14 Aug 1996, Amancio Hasty wrote: > It is called freebsd-current 8) > > Try to do a netscape search on what pthreads are , write a short pthreads > program and link it against "-lc_r". Forget about the "ports" bits... Thanks, I will do. Regards, Trefor S. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 03:56:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA22404 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:56:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.siemens.at (proxy.siemens.at [192.138.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA22399 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:56:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sol1.gud.siemens.co.at (sol-f.gud.siemens-austria) by proxy.siemens.at with SMTP id AA08249 (5.67a/IDA-1.5 for ); Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:55:44 +0200 Received: from ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at by sol1.gud.siemens.co.at with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #7 for ) id m0uqdbx-00026RC; Wed, 14 Aug 96 12:55 MET DST Received: by ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at (1.37.109.16/1.37) id AA215289952; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:52:32 +0200 From: "Hr.Ladavac" Message-Id: <199608141052.AA215289952@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:52:32 +0200 (MESZ) Cc: p.richards@elsevier.co.uk, jkh@time.cdrom.com, lada@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at, philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com, hackers@freebsd.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com In-Reply-To: <199608141031.UAA01998@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Aug 14, 96 08:01:55 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk E-mail message from Michael Smith contained: > > The problem is that they are intentionally or otherwise _not_ telling us > what they really did. Some people have assumed that they typoed the > tar command; this is certainly a good place to start, but there are other > obvious possibilities beyond this. They did typo the tar command. The problem is being solved. Can we drop the thread? Please? /Marino From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 03:58:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA22532 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:58:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA22527 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:58:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA14041; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:56:53 -0700 (PDT) To: Michael Smith cc: p.richards@elsevier.co.uk (Paul Richards), lada@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at, philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com, hackers@freebsd.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:01:55 +0930." <199608141031.UAA01998@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:56:53 -0700 Message-ID: <14039.840020213@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The problem is that they are intentionally or otherwise _not_ telling us > what they really did. Some people have assumed that they typoed the > tar command; this is certainly a good place to start, but there are other > obvious possibilities beyond this. Actually, they've already admitted full guilt in email to myself and the guy in Austria, they probably just forgot to cc this list. They did indeed make a typo and it was indeed /dev/rsd0a that they backed their root partition onto, sort of a recursive backup with on-the-fly format conversion, of sorts. A novel idea, and I've never heard of anyone trying to do before. Having, however, now seen where one definitely *might* want to do something like this if feeling especially depressed or bored, it occurs to me that we should try to better facilitate our users' needs by implementing the following support features in 2.2: a) Write a filesystem which understands tar files natively. Note: there may be a slight performance penalty for folks running with their root partitions mounted on a TARFS - perhaps we could note this somewhere. b) Add special code to tar which detects that it's writing on the same filesystem(s) it's dumping from, something which shouldn't require much more than a full mark & sweep pass over all files on the system first to figure out where they all reside. Once you've identified the files most immediately in jeopardy of having their inodes or blocks overwritten by tar, you put them first into the backup list and buffer up the output going to the tarfile (the filesystem in this case) until you're sure they've been sucessfully read in - this is your "window". Continue this process, shrinking or growing the window as needed, until the entire filesystem is converted. Note: This may require some use of memory but will otherwise be trivial to implement. c) Tweaks to the kernel so that as soon as it notices that a root filesystem is in the process of being "converted" this way, all processes except for tar are suspended until the operation completes. The root filesystem could then be umounted from UFS and remounted onto the TARFS using the same block device. There will be some kernel and process state to adjust, of course, and all processes with vnodes open on the old root fs will need their file tables adjusted to point to new vnodes which duplicate the exact state of the old ones, but that's just the details. We can probably get a summer student to hack all this out in a weekend if we agree to buy the Jolt. Any volunteers? :-) :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 04:41:13 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA24721 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 04:41:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA24695; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 04:40:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA00455; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:40:10 +0200 (MET DST) To: sos@FreeBSD.org cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith), joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: sio problems with 2.2-960801-SNAP In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:05:12 +0200." <199608140905.LAA12063@ra.dkuug.dk> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:40:09 +0200 Message-ID: <453.840022809@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk For anybody who looks at the code for the pccard support, and thinks they can do better, please send email to Nate and tell him that you will be helping. For anybody who think it is trivial: You're wrong. The very idea of hardware that comes and goes is so alien to UNIX as you could possibly make it. This is not simple at all. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 04:49:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA24960 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 04:49:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA24955 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 04:49:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA14395 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 04:49:30 -0700 (PDT) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: ipfw vs ipfilter? Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 04:49:30 -0700 Message-ID: <14393.840023370@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've been trying to implement a firewall for the past couple of days, and over the course of same have come to realize a few interesting things I didn't know (at least from direct experience) before: 1. ipfw is klunky. klunky interface, klunky syntax, klunky code. 2. ipfw has changed so much, and with so little regard for backwards-compatible command syntax, that many of the docs floating around for it do not even apply. 3. I've tried to implement a firewall with it using the available directions and so far I've sucessfully implemented the wall portion, it's just getting legitimate traffic through it that's not working. :-) This thing's ease-of-use factor could stand some real improvement. 4. Darren Reed's ipfilter software is well documented, supported, and runs on everything from Solaris to Linux to *BSD. It also has some interesting looking tools which have been written for it. 5. ipfilter's license is very relaxed. There's no reason we couldn't bundle it. 6. If I get this firewall up and running easily with ipfilter (and the Jury's still out on that), you can expect to hear me chanting "down with ipfw! up with ipfilter!" in the near future. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 04:50:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA25060 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 04:50:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA25044 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 04:50:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA14619; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:50:01 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:50 EDT Received: from lakes (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id HAA01442 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:40:22 -0400 Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes (8.6.12/8.6.9) id HAA04041; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:46:55 -0400 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:46:55 -0400 From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608141146.HAA04041@lakes> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org, lakes!rivers Subject: Recap of sio weirdness, where to go from here... Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Ok - just so everyone is one the same wavelength, I'd like to summarize what I'm hearing from several people regarding sio problems and figure out where to go from here. Mike Smith has made several good points - notably that most "modern" 16550s, are, in fact, not 16550s - but some clone chip. That could be the situation in my P75 laptop (actually, kinda likely since it is a laptop...) However, the 386 and 486 I have which demonstrate the problem have *actual* 16550s in them. I know because I replaced the 8250s in the serial cards myself... [My point being that while it's certainly possible I have faulty hardware on one machine; the likelyhood of that decreases when you consider that I can reproduce this symptom on two other, disparit, machines...] Mike also wonders if I'm the only one experiencing the lock-up problem. I believe if you'll scan the logs, you'll find that helg@tav.kiev.ua reported almost exactly the same problem about two months ago (with 2.1R.) Mike then asks about how current I am - I've just completed the 2.1.5 install on the P75 laptop. It still displays the silo overflow problem. Craig Harding and Brian Handy have echoed my experience, that these problems didn't seem to exist in 2.0.5 (the lock-up problem in particular.) It appears to be something that happened with 2.1. [I did report that I began seeing these problems shortly after 2.1 was installed. Bruce and several others have made several fixs that made things much better... (at least, I don't have to reboot now to regain control over the sio driver)] So, if nothing else, I would say we have strong anectodotal evidence of something being amiss. I don't want to spend time examining the issue at 2.1 - I'm hoping the lock-up problems will have been solved by something else (maybe another missing spl0() in some driver...) My current plan is to proceed with the upgrade to 2.1.5 and report my findings. If I still continue to get the lock-up problems, I'll let everyone know. - Dave Rivers - p.s. Bruce - if you want to chime in here with your usual wonderful evaluation and suggested fix, feel free :-) Usually by the time I get around to examining these types of problems, you've already seen it, and I get a message like "Oh, yeah,... we found that - do XXX and it will be repaired..." :-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 05:30:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id FAA26577 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 05:30:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pdx1.world.net (pdx1.world.net [192.243.32.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id FAA26572 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 05:30:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from suburbia.net (suburbia.net [203.4.184.1]) by pdx1.world.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id FAA28756; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 05:31:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (proff@localhost) by suburbia.net (8.7.4/Proff-950810) id WAA13269; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 22:29:19 +1000 From: Julian Assange Message-Id: <199608141229.WAA13269@suburbia.net> Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 22:29:17 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <14393.840023370@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 14, 96 04:49:30 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > 6. If I get this firewall up and running easily with ipfilter (and the Jury's > still out on that), you can expect to hear me chanting "down with ipfw! > up with ipfilter!" in the near future. :-) I agree. Darren's code is neat. But then, he is from Melbourne ;) -- "Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies, The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis, _God in the Dock_ +---------------------+--------------------+----------------------------------+ |Julian Assange RSO | PO Box 2031 BARKER | Secret Analytic Guy Union | |proff@suburbia.net | VIC 3122 AUSTRALIA | finger for PGP key hash ID = | |proff@gnu.ai.mit.edu | FAX +61-3-98199066 | 0619737CCC143F6DEA73E27378933690 | +---------------------+--------------------+----------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 05:30:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id FAA26606 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 05:30:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id FAA26600; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 05:30:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id WAA02817; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 22:17:43 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608141247.WAA02817@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Recap of sio weirdness, where to go from here... To: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 22:17:42 +0930 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, lakes!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608141146.HAA04041@lakes> from "Thomas David Rivers" at Aug 14, 96 07:46:55 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Thomas David Rivers stands accused of saying: > > Mike Smith has made several good points - notably that most "modern" > 16550s, are, in fact, not 16550s - but some clone chip. That could > be the situation in my P75 laptop (actually, kinda likely since it > is a laptop...) However, the 386 and 486 I have which demonstrate > the problem have *actual* 16550s in them. I know because I replaced > the 8250s in the serial cards myself... Unless these parts are marked "PC16550DN" they are _not_ *actual* 16550's. They may be a clone produced by another manufacturer, but as has also been discussed here at great length (Where's Frank D. these days?), this is _no_ guarantee that the part doesn't do something funny. Have you tried using 'lptest' and a loopback cable to ascertain whether these FIFO overflows are real or imaginary? > [My point being that while it's certainly possible I have faulty hardware > on one machine; the likelyhood of that decreases when you consider that > I can reproduce this symptom on two other, disparit, machines...] If you installed the same part in these machines, then the problem may well still be hardware-related. Please note that I am not trying to suggest that the fix to your solution cannot possibly lie with a change to the sio driver, merely that there are a plethora of systems out there using the sio driver that do _not_ exhibit the problem that you are seeing. > - Dave Rivers - -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 06:03:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA27934 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:03:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA27929 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:03:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from sos@localhost) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA13221; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:03:18 +0200 Message-Id: <199608141303.PAA13221@ra.dkuug.dk> Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:03:18 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <14393.840023370@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 14, 96 04:49:30 am From: sos@freebsd.org Reply-to: sos@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who wrote: > > I've been trying to implement a firewall for the past couple of days, > and over the course of same have come to realize a few interesting > things I didn't know (at least from direct experience) before: > > 1. ipfw is klunky. klunky interface, klunky syntax, klunky code. You got that right :) > 2. ipfw has changed so much, and with so little regard for > backwards-compatible command syntax, that many of the docs > floating around for it do not even apply. Exactly. > 4. Darren Reed's ipfilter software is well documented, supported, and runs > on everything from Solaris to Linux to *BSD. It also has some interesting > looking tools which have been written for it. > > 5. ipfilter's license is very relaxed. There's no reason we couldn't > bundle it. > > 6. If I get this firewall up and running easily with ipfilter (and the Jury's > still out on that), you can expect to hear me chanting "down with ipfw! > up with ipfilter!" in the near future. :-) I'm all for it !! It leaves the question what to do with julian's redirect code ?? It shares much of the same "features" that ipfw does, and for all I care it can go as well.. Most of the features with it is now in ipfilter... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 06:15:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA28545 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:15:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay6.UU.NET (relay6.UU.NET [192.48.96.16]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA28536 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:15:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ugen-tr by relay6.UU.NET with SMTP (peer crosschecked as: ugen-tr.worldbank.org [138.220.101.58]) id QQbcsr16749; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:15:45 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 96 09:13:59 From: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" Subject: RE: ipfw vs ipfilter To: hackers@freebsd.org X-PRIORITY: 3 (Normal) X-Mailer: Chameleon 5.0.1, TCP/IP for Windows, NetManage Inc. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Heh:) Well..intresting enough it always works this way - first ppl take it, then they screw it and then they say it's bad and take something else. Thanx guys... G'luck... --Ugen From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 06:20:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA28903 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:20:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA28898 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:20:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA19206; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:20:01 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:20 EDT Received: from lakes (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id IAA04480 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:51:44 -0400 Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes (8.6.12/8.6.9) id IAA04184; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:58:18 -0400 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:58:18 -0400 From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608141258.IAA04184@lakes> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, lakes!rivers Subject: Re: Recap of sio weirdness, where to go from here... Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Thomas David Rivers stands accused of saying: > > > > Mike Smith has made several good points - notably that most "modern" > > 16550s, are, in fact, not 16550s - but some clone chip. That could > > be the situation in my P75 laptop (actually, kinda likely since it > > is a laptop...) However, the 386 and 486 I have which demonstrate > > the problem have *actual* 16550s in them. I know because I replaced > > the 8250s in the serial cards myself... > > Unless these parts are marked "PC16550DN" they are _not_ *actual* > 16550's. They may be a clone produced by another manufacturer, but as > has also been discussed here at great length (Where's Frank D. these > days?), this is _no_ guarantee that the part doesn't do something > funny. Really good point... ummm... let's see here... boy, who ever thought of putting computers on the floor must be.... OK - I'm staring at the part number now... it's a PC16550CN (not DN) - I've had it in service now for almost 5 years... Looks like it's the "real thing". [I'm only looking at the 386dx that locks up... not the other machines, that get silo overflows, I'll get to taking one of those apart today for a memory upgrade...] The total markings on the chip (well, there are two actually) are: 8921B PC16550CN NS16550AFN PATENTED > > Have you tried using 'lptest' and a loopback cable to ascertain whether > these FIFO overflows are real or imaginary? Nope - sounds like a good idea... "lptest"? Are you suggesting that as just something that can generate some data... I usually just cat /etc/passwd :-) I don't have a loopback cable lying around, I'll run out and buy one today. > > > [My point being that while it's certainly possible I have faulty hardware > > on one machine; the likelyhood of that decreases when you consider that > > I can reproduce this symptom on two other, disparit, machines...] > > If you installed the same part in these machines, then the problem may well > still be hardware-related. Please note that I am not trying to suggest > that the fix to your solution cannot possibly lie with a change to the > sio driver, merely that there are a plethora of systems out there using > the sio driver that do _not_ exhibit the problem that you are seeing. That would certainly seem to be the case. I'm wondering if there are also a lot of systems seeing the problem, with just very few reports of it. Also, I'd lay dollars (US ones) to donuts that the lock-up is timing related, and is affected by the fact that the 386 in question also has a 1542B, which could be hogging the bus just a little too long... Maybe I can adjust the 1542B bus timings down a little and solve this problem... - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 06:32:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA29366 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:32:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mole.mole.org (marmot.mole.org [204.216.57.191]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA29361; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:32:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mail@localhost) by mole.mole.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA10819; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:32:07 GMT Received: from meerkat.mole.org(206.197.192.110) by mole.mole.org via smap (V1.3) id sma010817; Wed Aug 14 13:32:00 1996 Received: (from mrm@localhost) by meerkat.mole.org (8.6.11/8.6.9) id GAA22170; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:32:00 -0700 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:32:00 -0700 From: "M.R.Murphy" Message-Id: <199608141332.GAA22170@meerkat.mole.org> To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com Subject: Re: Recap of sio weirdness, where to go from here... Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, lakes!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Unless these parts are marked "PC16550DN" they are _not_ *actual* > 16550's. They may be a clone produced by another manufacturer, but as > has also been discussed here at great length (Where's Frank D. these > days?), this is _no_ guarantee that the part doesn't do something > funny. Close, no cigar. I have about 60 in Digiboards, HUB6's, and 2-port boards, all from National Semiconductor and all are marked "NS16550AFN" and "NS16550AN". No _silo_ interrupts from any of them, but I changed the FIFO_TRIGGER from FIFO_TRIGGER_14 to FIFO_TRIGGER_8 in sio.c. I wanted more time to service the interrupt and clear the FIFO at the expense of more interrupts. I think it works out to 8 character times plus 1/2 bit time rather than two character times plus 1/2 bit time. I think if they don't say "NS" and don't have the little squiggly logo, they're clones. I have 2 clone ports on a cheap IDE controller. They report that they are 16550's, but they'll only do 56KB. Not quite 16550's. -- Mike Murphy mrm@Mole.ORG +1 619 598 5874 Better is the enemy of Good From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 06:45:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA29854 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:45:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.ts.kiev.ua (smtp.ts.kiev.ua [193.124.229.195]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA29828 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:44:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from unicorn.ww.net by smtp.ts.kiev.ua with ESMTP id QAA03715; (8.6.11/zah/2.1) Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:38:49 +0300 Received: from dawn.ww.net (root@dawn.ww.net [193.124.73.50]) by unicorn.ww.net (8.7.5/alexis 2.5) with ESMTP id RAA08834 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:27:22 +0400 (MSD) Received: (from alexis@localhost) by dawn.ww.net (8.7.5/alexis 2.5) id RAA13746 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:22:18 +0400 (MSD) Message-Id: <199608141322.RAA13746@dawn.ww.net> Subject: permission control tool To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:22:18 +0400 (MSD) From: Alexis Yushin Reply-To: alexis@ww.net (Alexis Yushin) X-Office-Phone: +380 65 2 26.1410 X-Home-Phone: +380 65 2 27.0747 X-NIC-Handle: AY23 X-RIPE-Handle: AY6-RIPE X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Midday, The software is written but releasing it as is would be kind of releasing of a trojan horse for many regular users. I am looking for your comments and opinions about this kind of software and how we would modify it to easy permissions control keeping security level sufficient. Thanks, alexis ------------------------------------------------------------------------ DOAS Utility LYRIC ----- First I wanted it as sophisticated as possible. I wrote tons of yacc grammar for every situation. Then I realized that I never need anything except real user id and real group id, and in the most rare cases login name. Well, except of remote host and line, of course. So I have erased much of the code in order to make it lighter and more simple. The grammar now includes no keywords. I think it is for good. I realized that with the current grammar I have very doubtful need in aliases so I removed them from the sources too. In fact in my TODO there is an item to rewrite the parser in pure C code. Mail me if you want anything from the list above back :-) OVERVIEW -------- ``doas'' stands for ``do as'' -- that is do something as somebody. In other words the program lets you execute permitted commands with permitted user and group IDs. USAGE ----- doas user[.group] command Is there anything else to tell about it? CONFIGURATION ------------- The configuration file is a set of permissions and usually resides in /etc called permissions. # This is a single line comment. Every comment starts with '#' sign. Every permission is specified as follows: username1 [(login1)] [.group1] [,username2 ...] [@host1 [,host2 ...]] [:line1 [,line2 ...]] { username[.group] [,username ...] : [ flag [, flag ] : [command path][,command ...] ; username[.group] [,username ...] : [ flag [, flag ] : [command path] [,command ...] ; } If no ``(login)'' specified the loginname check is disabled. When no ``.group'' specified the group id is assumed to be the default login group of the user specified. Empty hostname when '@' sign is there stands for only the local host. Empty line as well as ':' absense stands for any line. Every string or word which is not [*?\[\]!/A-Za-z0-9]* needs to be enclosed into double quotes. Basically these are host names which could contain dots. Everything except of login names and numbers (IDs) is treated as a shell file patterns. Backslash disables the special meaning (if any) of the following character. Commands should be given as absolute pathnames with possible shell patterns. FLAGS ----- Currently flags control environment passing into child process. Initially there is no environment at all and if none is made with flags a standard minimal one supplied. Being processed from left to right the flags do: + (Plus sign by itself) Copies (not overwriting) entire preserved environment to the target process +NAME The same as just plus but only copies variable which NAME is given +NAME=VALUE Overwrites variable NAME with VALUE -NAME Removes variable NAME from target environment vector. PATTERNS -------- Patterns used in doas are sh(1) like. The metacharacters are: '*' -- matches any arbitrary string '?' -- matches any single character '[' -- introduces and matches a class of characters until the subsequent ']' character or single '[' if there is no ']' following. An exclamation sign in the first position of the class complements the whole class. A minus sign not in the first or the last position of the class introduces an interval of characters. An exclaimation sign in the first position of the whole pattern inverses the result of the search. EXAMPLE ------- alexis(alexis).wildwind,ann,anton.300 @,"eddy.ww.net","sunset.ww.net" :* { root.wheel:+PATH,+USER="shut":/sbin/reboot,/sbin/halt,/sbin/fastboot; bin.bin::/usr/bin/install; uucp::/usr/libexec/uucp/uuxqt; } The permission above says that user ``alexis'' with login name ``alexis'' and group id ``wildwind'', user ``ann'' with any login name and any group id, and user ``anton'' with any login name and group id equal to ``300'' from local host and from hosts ``eddy.ww.net'' and ``sunset.ww.net'' being logged in on any (``*'') terminal line can execute: a) as user ``root'', group ``wheel'' /sbin/reboot, /sbin/halt ... b) as user ``bin'', group ``bin'' with their environment not modified (that trailing plus sign) /usr/bin/install c) as user ``uucp'', group equal to the login group of ``uucp'' /usr/libexec/uucp/uuxqt The first line (a) lets a user keep his/her PATH environmental variable and sets USER variable to "shut" value. -- If a camel flies, no one laughs if it doesn't get very far. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 07:15:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA01042 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:15:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA01030; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:14:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id AAA03456; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 00:02:04 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608141432.AAA03456@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Recap of sio weirdness, where to go from here... To: mrm@Mole.ORG (M.R.Murphy) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 00:02:03 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, lakes!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608141332.GAA22170@meerkat.mole.org> from "M.R.Murphy" at Aug 14, 96 06:32:00 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk M.R.Murphy stands accused of saying: > > Close, no cigar. I have about 60 in Digiboards, HUB6's, and 2-port > boards, all from National Semiconductor and all are marked "NS16550AFN" > and "NS16550AN". No _silo_ interrupts from any of them, but I changed These are old NMOS parts, which haven't been available from NS for many years. They have been superseded by the PC16550D which is a CMOS part. Regardless, I believe their functionality is fine. > I think if they don't say "NS" and don't have the little squiggly > logo, they're clones. No. NS stopped using the squiggly logo and just used a solid white vertical line for a while, and are now using the funny rounded N on some parts. > Mike Murphy mrm@Mole.ORG +1 619 598 5874 -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 07:20:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA01368 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:20:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA01363 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:20:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA23747; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:20:02 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:20 EDT Received: from lakes (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id JAA06607 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:50:54 -0400 Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA04256 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:57:31 -0400 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:57:31 -0400 From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608141357.JAA04256@lakes> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: root's .xsession invalid after a clean install (2.1.5) Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've discovered that, after a clean install, root's home directory has a .xsession in it. That's all well and good. Unfortunately, the last line of this .xsession is: exec fvwm Well... fvwm isn't installed yet (it's a package, I suppose). So, you can't log on as root if your running xdm. Perhaps, for the released root directory this should be simply twm, or you shouldn't have a .xsession at all. - Just an observation - - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 07:21:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA01428 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:21:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA01420; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:21:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id AAA03516; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 00:08:31 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608141438.AAA03516@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Recap of sio weirdness, where to go from here... To: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 00:08:31 +0930 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, lakes!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608141258.IAA04184@lakes> from "Thomas David Rivers" at Aug 14, 96 08:58:18 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Thomas David Rivers stands accused of saying: > > OK - I'm staring at the part number now... it's a PC16550CN (not DN) - > I've had it in service now for almost 5 years... Looks like it's > the "real thing". I believe the C revision parts are OK. Unless anyone can come forward and offer contradicting advice then it looks like you are either losing serial interrupts, or are tickling a bug somewhere in the sio driver or tty stack. So much for the easy answer 8) > Nope - sounds like a good idea... "lptest"? Are you suggesting that > as just something that can generate some data... I usually just > cat /etc/passwd :-) I don't have a loopback cable lying around, > I'll run out and buy one today. /etc/passwd isn't big enough. 'lptest' is good at generating lots of data with an easily visible pattern. You might not see one character dropped from your password file, but it stands out like a sore thumb in the lptest output. > - Dave Rivers - -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 07:35:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA02232 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:35:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA02224 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:35:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA14776; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:35:28 -0700 (PDT) To: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:13:59." Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:35:27 -0700 Message-ID: <14773.840033327@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Heh:) > Well..intresting enough it always works this way - first ppl take it, then > they screw it and then they say it's bad and take something else. > Thanx guys... With all due respect, Ugen, the code was a filthy mess when you gave it to us and was in absolutely no shape to continue using in that way. It was bad to start with and nobody needed to "screw" anything. If anything it's been substantially improved over the last 6 months or so, but dressing a pig in tuxedo still doesn't change him from being a pig. My advice to you would be that rather than damaging your credibility and reputation by defending it, you should more reasonably be admitting that this code was horrible and yes, it needs a rewrite badly. There's no crime in that, Ugen! Yes, I've written some terrible code myself from time to time, usually in response to an urgent need which required a quick solution, and I've never been shy about admitting it when pointed out to me - in fact, I can generally out-do the complainer in citing exactly how and why it sucks large, deceased rodent carcasses through miles of steel conduit. The work you did on ipfw was very valuable, and many people are very happy that you did it, but was it good, quality work? No, it was not. Did you do a good job of maintaining and improving it? No, you didn't do that, either. In fact you didn't even come close in either category, to be honest. I'm sure that you're a skilled programmer, Ugen, and I'm also sure that some of your best work lies ahead of you, assuming that you get some time and energy to devote to more interesting projects than hacking financial software on the east coast, and there's absolutely no good reason for you to get all defensive about the ipfw code. There are a number of tools of my own which I'd *love* to see replaced, if I or anyone else had the time, and you should not take your software so personally that you're unable to see its failings - you'll never advance as a programmer that way. This is good advice, so please take it. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 07:55:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA03493 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:55:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA03484; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:55:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA00714; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:55:00 +0200 (MET DST) To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 14 Aug 1996 07:35:27 PDT." <14773.840033327@time.cdrom.com> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:54:59 +0200 Message-ID: <710.840034499@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <14773.840033327@time.cdrom.com>, "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: >> Heh:) >> Well..intresting enough it always works this way - first ppl take it, then >> they screw it and then they say it's bad and take something else. >> Thanx guys... > >With all due respect, Ugen, the code was a filthy mess when you gave >it to us and was in absolutely no shape to continue using in that way. Not to mention that it didn't work as it gave impression of doing. The only think I have against ditching ipfw and replacing with ipfilter is that the later is getting to big for comfort. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 08:12:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA04463 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:12:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.barrnet.net (mail.barrnet.net [131.119.246.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA04458; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:12:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by mail.barrnet.net (8.7.5/MAIL-RELAY-LEN) with ESMTP id IAA26786; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:12:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA27060; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:04:31 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:04:31 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608141504.JAA27060@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams To: Michael Smith Cc: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers), sag.space.lockheed.com!handy@dg-rtp.dg.com, ponds!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) In-Reply-To: <199608140601.PAA29529@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> References: <199608140307.XAA03390@lakes> <199608140601.PAA29529@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > If this is bothering you, and you are completely up to date, then > I or someone better qualified will be more than happy to help you > chase down the problem. If you aren't, come back when you've upgraded > to 2.1.5 and are still having the same problem. I'm using *stock* National 16550A UARTS on my 486/66, and when I upgraded to 2.1.5 I started seeing them and I *NEVER* saw them before on any previous release of FreeBSD. These are not clones, these are actual National parts bought a long time ago, and up till recently I never saw any overflows with them. Now, why I'm seeing this I don't know, but I think I remember Bruce mentioning that there were changes made to the driver to actually do better reporting, so in the past I may have had overflows but they weren't reported. What I did last night was change my trigger level on my UART from 14 -> 8, but I haven't tried out the new kernel to see if that helps. > The fact that you're the only person seeing this makes me wonder whether > you have funny serial hardware causing your problems. Note that lots of > PC serial hardware is _really_bad_, so this is actually fairly likely. He's not the only one seeing it. Lots of other folks see it as well, but since it doesn't affect anything they ignore it like I do. BTW, I'm getting 11K/sec using modem compression on text files, and around 3.4K/sec on compressed files SLIP host<-> SLIP host, so I really don't see the overflows affecting me much. The funny thing is I don't see overflows on the SLIP server box which is also running 16550A UARTS and is running multiple sessions, but it's not running X and never touches the hard disk. (Basically it's the same hardware on both boxes, 486/66 with 16MB, although my box has an Adaptec 1542B and the server box is IDE). Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 08:17:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA04679 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:17:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.fsl.noaa.gov (gatekeeper.fsl.noaa.gov [137.75.131.181]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA04672 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:16:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from emu.fsl.noaa.gov (kelly@emu.fsl.noaa.gov [137.75.60.32]) by gatekeeper.fsl.noaa.gov (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA10867; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:03:52 GMT Message-Id: <199608141503.PAA10867@gatekeeper.fsl.noaa.gov> Received: by emu.fsl.noaa.gov (1.40.112.4/16.2) id AA149335102; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:05:02 -0600 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:05:02 -0600 From: Sean Kelly To: Alexis Yushin , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: permission control tool Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Why no support for netgroups? They're a perfect way to put together combinations of users, hosts, and users and hosts; they're distributable via NIS; and there are library calls to query them. You could integrate them into grammar you've already made by using a convention like @ refers to the netgroup . Or, you could make your grammar even simpler by using only netgroups as specifiers (losing the benefit of .group part of user.group identification). What do you think? -- Sean Kelly NOAA Forecast Systems Laboratory kelly@fsl.noaa.gov Boulder Colorado USA http://www-sdd.fsl.noaa.gov/~kelly/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 08:17:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA04712 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:17:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [204.216.27.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA04705 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:17:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by who.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.11) with ESMTP id IAA00252 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:17:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA27096; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:13:18 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:13:18 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608141513.JAA27096@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams To: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: RE: ipfw vs ipfilter In-Reply-To: References: Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Heh:) > > Well..intresting enough it always works this way - first ppl take it, > then they screw it and then they say it's bad and take something else. None of that from you young man. I *specifically* hounded you in D.C. to pickup your code and do it better, and you turned me down saying that work was too boring and slow for you to feel like hacking anymore. Complaining that folks 'wrecked' your code when you weren't willing to fix known bugs in it is bad codesmanship. However, if you were willing to 'fix' the outstanding bugs in it all would be forgiven. :) Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 08:21:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA05069 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:21:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA05046 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:21:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA24636; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:24:13 +0300 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:24:12 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: Michael Smith , Paul Richards , lada@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at, philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-Reply-To: <14039.840020213@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 14 Aug 1996, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > The problem is that they are intentionally or otherwise _not_ telling us > > what they really did. Some people have assumed that they typoed the > > tar command; this is certainly a good place to start, but there are other > > obvious possibilities beyond this. > > Actually, they've already admitted full guilt in email to myself and > the guy in Austria, they probably just forgot to cc this list. They > did indeed make a typo and it was indeed /dev/rsd0a that they backed > their root partition onto, sort of a recursive backup with on-the-fly > format conversion, of sorts. A novel idea, and I've never heard of > anyone trying to do before. Having, however, now seen where one > definitely *might* want to do something like this if feeling > especially depressed or bored, it occurs to me that we should try to > better facilitate our users' needs by implementing the following > support features in 2.2: > > a) Write a filesystem which understands tar files natively. Note: there may > be a slight performance penalty for folks running with their root > partitions mounted on a TARFS - perhaps we could note this somewhere. > > b) Add special code to tar which detects that it's writing on the same > filesystem(s) it's dumping from, something which shouldn't require > much more than a full mark & sweep pass over all files on the system first > to figure out where they all reside. Once you've identified the files > most immediately in jeopardy of having their inodes or blocks overwritten > by tar, you put them first into the backup list and buffer up the output > going to the tarfile (the filesystem in this case) until you're sure > they've been sucessfully read in - this is your "window". Continue > this process, shrinking or growing the window as needed, until the entire > filesystem is converted. Note: This may require some use of memory > but will otherwise be trivial to implement. > > c) Tweaks to the kernel so that as soon as it notices that a root filesystem > is in the process of being "converted" this way, all processes > except for tar are suspended until the operation completes. The root > filesystem could then be umounted from UFS and remounted onto the TARFS > using the same block device. There will be some kernel and process state > to adjust, of course, and all processes with vnodes open on the old root > fs will need their file tables adjusted to point to new vnodes which > duplicate the exact state of the old ones, but that's just the details. > We can probably get a summer student to hack all this out in a weekend > if we agree to buy the Jolt. > > Any volunteers? :-) :-) Ok, how about just some additional code to tar and dump to check against overwriting mounted file systems? For it seems probable that the root file system was mounted (and perhaps also double check if the file system is mounted root). Sander > > Jordan > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 08:24:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA05243 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:24:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from acca.nmsu.edu (sven@acca.NMSU.Edu [128.123.3.58]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA05225 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:24:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: by acca.nmsu.edu (8.6.12/acca-1.0) id JAA13087; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:24:09 -0600 Message-Id: <199608141524.JAA13087@acca.nmsu.edu> From: sven@acca.nmsu.edu (Ian Logan) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:24:08 -0600 In-Reply-To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" "ipfw vs ipfilter?" (Aug 14, 4:49am) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well I've always been a bit of lurker in the past, but I've got to agree than ipfw is really really klunky. If ipfilter is better, I definately say go for it! Ian From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 08:27:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA05542 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:27:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from THOR.INNOSOFT.COM (THOR.INNOSOFT.COM [192.160.253.66]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA05537 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:27:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from INNOSOFT.COM by INNOSOFT.COM (PMDF V5.0-7 #8694) id <01I89COB184G8Y4ZFL@INNOSOFT.COM>; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:26:21 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:26:21 -0700 (PDT) From: zounds@INNOSOFT.COM Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) In-reply-to: <199608140213.TAA27489@freefall.freebsd.org> To: Craig Harding Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 14 Aug 1996, Craig Harding wrote: > Thomas David Rivers writes: > > >Seems to me a Pentium 75 should be able to keep up with 19200, and > >hopefully be able to do much better... am I the only one tripping > >over these sio issues? Is there some other magic to setting rts/cts > >that I don't know about? Is there any hope my 386dx with 16550As will > >be able to handle anything higher than 19200 without locking up? > > As a data point: I'm running 2.0.5-RELEASE on a 486SX25 with two serial > ports containing real 16550As. Both ports are locked at 57600 and users > happily dialin and use one line interactively (on a 14k4 modem) while the > other line on the 28k8 modem gets 3400cps receiving approx. 80MB of > compressed news per day via Taylor UUCP. No silo overflows. > > I think the previous message relating to custom single-chip emulation of a > 16550A may explain your problems. > I am wondering if the 19200 speed is because of the lack of hardware handshaking cables. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 08:32:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA05847 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:32:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA05829 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:32:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA24736; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:39:42 +0300 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:39:41 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Alexis Yushin cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: permission control tool In-Reply-To: <199608141322.RAA13746@dawn.ww.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems fine. Check also out a tool called osh. It is a setuid shell which allows it to be specified who may execute which commands. One place it is available from is ftp.sunet.se under /pub/security. Sander On Wed, 14 Aug 1996, Alexis Yushin wrote: > Midday, > > The software is written but releasing it as is would be kind of > releasing of a trojan horse for many regular users. I am looking for > your comments and opinions about this kind of software and how we would > modify it to easy permissions control keeping security level sufficient. > Thanks, > alexis > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > DOAS Utility > > LYRIC > ----- > > First I wanted it as sophisticated as possible. I wrote > tons of yacc grammar for every situation. Then I realized that I > never need anything except real user id and real group id, and in > the most rare cases login name. Well, except of remote host and > line, of course. So I have erased much of the code in order to make > it lighter and more simple. The grammar now includes no keywords. > I think it is for good. I realized that with the current grammar > I have very doubtful need in aliases so I removed them from the > sources too. In fact in my TODO there is an item to rewrite the > parser in pure C code. Mail me if you want anything from the list > above back :-) > > OVERVIEW > -------- > ``doas'' stands for ``do as'' -- that is do something as > somebody. In other words the program lets you execute permitted > commands with permitted user and group IDs. > > USAGE > ----- > doas user[.group] command > > Is there anything else to tell about it? > > CONFIGURATION > ------------- > > The configuration file is a set of permissions and usually > resides in /etc called permissions. > > # This is a single line comment. Every comment starts with '#' sign. > > Every permission is specified as follows: > > username1 [(login1)] [.group1] [,username2 ...] [@host1 [,host2 ...]] > [:line1 [,line2 ...]] { > > username[.group] [,username ...] : [ flag [, flag ] : > [command path][,command ...] ; > username[.group] [,username ...] : [ flag [, flag ] : > [command path] [,command ...] ; > } > > If no ``(login)'' specified the loginname check is disabled. > When no ``.group'' specified the group id is assumed to be the > default login group of the user specified. > > Empty hostname when '@' sign is there stands for only the > local host. > > Empty line as well as ':' absense stands for any line. > > Every string or word which is not [*?\[\]!/A-Za-z0-9]* needs > to be enclosed into double quotes. Basically these are host names > which could contain dots. > > Everything except of login names and numbers (IDs) is > treated as a shell file patterns. > > Backslash disables the special meaning (if any) of the > following character. > > Commands should be given as absolute pathnames with > possible shell patterns. > > FLAGS > ----- > Currently flags control environment passing into child > process. Initially there is no environment at all and if none is > made with flags a standard minimal one supplied. Being processed > from left to right the flags do: > > + (Plus sign by itself) Copies (not overwriting) > entire preserved environment to the target > process > > +NAME The same as just plus but only copies > variable which NAME is given > > +NAME=VALUE Overwrites variable NAME with VALUE > > -NAME Removes variable NAME from target environment > vector. > > PATTERNS > -------- > Patterns used in doas are sh(1) like. The metacharacters > are: > > '*' -- matches any arbitrary string > '?' -- matches any single character > '[' -- introduces and matches a class of characters until the > subsequent ']' character or single '[' if there is > no ']' following. An exclamation sign in the first > position of the class complements the whole class. > A minus sign not in the first or the last position > of the class introduces an interval of characters. > > An exclaimation sign in the first position of the whole > pattern inverses the result of the search. > > > EXAMPLE > ------- > > alexis(alexis).wildwind,ann,anton.300 @,"eddy.ww.net","sunset.ww.net" :* { > root.wheel:+PATH,+USER="shut":/sbin/reboot,/sbin/halt,/sbin/fastboot; > bin.bin::/usr/bin/install; > uucp::/usr/libexec/uucp/uuxqt; > } > > The permission above says that user ``alexis'' with login name ``alexis'' > and group id ``wildwind'', user ``ann'' with any login name and any group > id, and user ``anton'' with any login name and group id equal to ``300'' > from local host and from hosts ``eddy.ww.net'' and ``sunset.ww.net'' > being logged in on any (``*'') terminal line can execute: > > a) as user ``root'', group ``wheel'' /sbin/reboot, /sbin/halt ... > b) as user ``bin'', group ``bin'' with their environment not > modified (that trailing plus sign) /usr/bin/install > c) as user ``uucp'', group equal to the login group of ``uucp'' > /usr/libexec/uucp/uuxqt > > The first line (a) lets a user keep his/her PATH environmental > variable and sets USER variable to "shut" value. > > > -- > If a camel flies, no one laughs if it doesn't get very far. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 08:45:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA09258 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:45:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mole.mole.org (marmot.mole.org [204.216.57.191]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA09126 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:45:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mail@localhost) by mole.mole.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA11718; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:45:06 GMT Received: from meerkat.mole.org(206.197.192.110) by mole.mole.org via smap (V1.3) id sma011716; Wed Aug 14 15:45:02 1996 Received: (from mrm@localhost) by meerkat.mole.org (8.6.11/8.6.9) id IAA22737; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:45:02 -0700 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 08:45:02 -0700 From: "M.R.Murphy" Message-Id: <199608141545.IAA22737@meerkat.mole.org> To: nate@mt.sri.com Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > the hard disk. (Basically it's the same hardware on both boxes, 486/66 > with 16MB, although my box has an Adaptec 1542B and the server box is > IDE). The 1542B is showing up in these reports enough to notice. Hmmm. How much of the bus is it taking? Shouldn't be enough to interfere with sio, I'd think, though. Hmmm. I'm still having problems with sio1: 182 more interrupt-level buffer overflows (total 883) Each one causes an Ierr visible with netstat -ai. The system recovers and keeps going, so I can't complain (too much :-). The system is a 2.1R 16MB 486DX2/50 with 16550 _clones_ on a cheap IDE, a 1542B, and I've added options "TTYHOG=4096" # to fix buffer overflows in sio.c options "RS_IBUF_SIZE=1024" # to fix buffer overflows in sio.c to the config and made sio.c pay attention to the options. The serial port used for kernel PPP is cuaa1, since it has a 25-pin connector, and its locked at 57600 with a 28.8K modem. The serial ports on the clone 16550 won't do 115200. They just lock up. This machine is still running FTL 14. I don't get any silo overflows. Adding those options really cut down on the interrupt-buffer overflows. Looks like about 10-15% of what I was getting before. Still there, though. More information for those who might have a better grasp of what's going on... bde? -- Mike Murphy mrm@Mole.ORG +1 619 598 5874 Better is the enemy of Good From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 09:02:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA10507 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:02:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Gatekeeper.Lamb.net (root@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net [206.169.44.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA10502 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:02:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ulf@localhost) by Gatekeeper.Lamb.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA07816; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:02:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Ulf Zimmermann Message-Id: <199608141602.JAA07816@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:02:28 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <14039.840020213@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at "Aug 14, 96 03:56:53 am" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > The problem is that they are intentionally or otherwise _not_ telling us > > what they really did. Some people have assumed that they typoed the > > tar command; this is certainly a good place to start, but there are other > > obvious possibilities beyond this. > > Actually, they've already admitted full guilt in email to myself and > the guy in Austria, they probably just forgot to cc this list. They > did indeed make a typo and it was indeed /dev/rsd0a that they backed > their root partition onto, sort of a recursive backup with on-the-fly > format conversion, of sorts. A novel idea, and I've never heard of > anyone trying to do before. Having, however, now seen where one > definitely *might* want to do something like this if feeling > especially depressed or bored, it occurs to me that we should try to > better facilitate our users' needs by implementing the following > support features in 2.2: > > a) Write a filesystem which understands tar files natively. Note: there may > be a slight performance penalty for folks running with their root > partitions mounted on a TARFS - perhaps we could note this somewhere. > > b) Add special code to tar which detects that it's writing on the same > filesystem(s) it's dumping from, something which shouldn't require > much more than a full mark & sweep pass over all files on the system first > to figure out where they all reside. Once you've identified the files > most immediately in jeopardy of having their inodes or blocks overwritten > by tar, you put them first into the backup list and buffer up the output > going to the tarfile (the filesystem in this case) until you're sure > they've been sucessfully read in - this is your "window". Continue > this process, shrinking or growing the window as needed, until the entire > filesystem is converted. Note: This may require some use of memory > but will otherwise be trivial to implement. I would go more into the direction of checking if the dump device is a mounted file system. Easy check. > > c) Tweaks to the kernel so that as soon as it notices that a root filesystem > is in the process of being "converted" this way, all processes > except for tar are suspended until the operation completes. The root > filesystem could then be umounted from UFS and remounted onto the TARFS > using the same block device. There will be some kernel and process state > to adjust, of course, and all processes with vnodes open on the old root > fs will need their file tables adjusted to point to new vnodes which > duplicate the exact state of the old ones, but that's just the details. > We can probably get a summer student to hack all this out in a weekend > if we agree to buy the Jolt. > > Any volunteers? :-) :-) > > Jordan > Ulf. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-865-0204 Lamb Art Internet Services || http://www.Lamb.net/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 09:03:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA10653 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:03:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA10646 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:03:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA15090; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:03:05 -0700 (PDT) To: Ulf Zimmermann cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:02:28 PDT." <199608141602.JAA07816@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:03:05 -0700 Message-ID: <15087.840038585@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I would go more into the direction of checking if the dump device is a > mounted file system. Easy check. I think some people failed to see my tongue stuck so firmly in my cheek on this one. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 09:26:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA11788 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:26:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cronus.oanet.com (richmond@cronus.oanet.com [204.209.13.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA11781 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:26:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (richmond@localhost) by cronus.oanet.com (8.7.3/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA17439; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:26:25 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:26:25 -0600 (MDT) From: Raymond Richmond Reply-To: Raymond Richmond To: bsdi-users@bsdi.com cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Popper errors. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Recently we moved our mail from the var partition to a new one to accomodate our space needs. After the move a great many of our users recieve the following error. Aug 10 06:30:59 cronus popper[12883]: -ERR Unable to copy mail spool file to temp pop dropbox /var/mail/.username.pop Any ideas? The mail was moved with a tar preserving user info. -- __^__ __^__ ( ___ )------------------------------------------------------( ___ ) | / |---Raymond Richmond---Question Man-------(403)430-0811 -| \ | | / |---------OA Internet----------Technical Support---------| \ | |_*_| |_*_| (_____)----------------richmond@oanet.com--------------------(_____) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 09:32:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA12059 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:32:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA12030 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:31:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA00214 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:31:52 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id SAA11497 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:31:10 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id GAA15959; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:43:15 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608140443.GAA15959@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 06:43:14 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: <199608132141.OAA27792@phaeton.artisoft.com>; from Terry Lambert on Aug 13, 1996 14:41:51 -0700 References: <199608132141.OAA27792@phaeton.artisoft.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Terry Lambert: > It is in ports. You will need a thread safe lbc (patched included > in the port, I believe). pthreads is included in /usr/src/lib/libc_r, not in ports. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 09:39:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA12480 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:39:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA12472 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:38:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA27477; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:38:43 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:38:43 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608141638.KAA27477@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams To: "M.R.Murphy" Cc: nate@mt.sri.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) In-Reply-To: <199608141545.IAA22737@meerkat.mole.org> References: <199608141545.IAA22737@meerkat.mole.org> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk M. R. Murphy writes: > > the hard disk. (Basically it's the same hardware on both boxes, 486/66 > > with 16MB, although my box has an Adaptec 1542B and the server box is > > IDE). > > The 1542B is showing up in these reports enough to notice. Hmmm. How much > of the bus is it taking? Shouldn't be enough to interfere with sio, I'd > think, though. Hmmm. > > I'm still having problems with > > sio1: 182 more interrupt-level buffer overflows (total 883) Hmm, those are different from mine. Mine are obviously a FIFO overflow. sio1: 1 more silo overflow (total 7) They don't happen alot, but when I do a remote CVS and/or CVSup update from my mirrored repository over the 28.8K link to a box at work they tend to show up. Again, I've got NS16550AFN parts on my box, which are the old but very real good National parts, bought by my good buddy Jaye Mathisen at MSU a *long* time ago. > serial port used for kernel PPP is cuaa1, since it has a 25-pin > connector, and its locked at 57600 with a 28.8K modem. The serial > ports on the clone 16550 won't do 115200. They just lock up. :( Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 09:39:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA12553 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:39:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tav.kiev.ua (tav-sita.sita.kiev.ua [193.124.50.39]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA12538 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:39:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by tav.kiev.ua (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA01369; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 19:38:29 +0300 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 19:38:29 +0300 From: Oleg N Panashchenko Message-Id: <199608141638.TAA01369@tav.kiev.ua> To: philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com (Philip Milne) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. Organization: Maxis Labs X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <9608131050.AA02567@ln1d273nwk> you wrote: : Hi, we are a small ISP running FreeBSD to power our WEB server and mail : host. While trying to do a simple exhaustive dump of everything as a crude : backup we have brought our system down. Our sysadmin is on holiday and : recommended that we write to you for some clues as to what we can do to : salvage the situation. : As root we did the following: : tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / About a week ago I have accidentally wiped start of FreeBSD patrition too. Fortunately I was able to recover /usr and /var partitions and had a backup of /etc, so I did not loose too much. First of all, I had a tiny FreeBSD partition at another HDD. All other disk space was used for Dos/Windows at that machine. I was able to connect HDD with broken start of FreeBSD partition to this machine. With DOS diskedit.exe I was able to find where /usr and /var partitions start by seraching for "/usr\0" and "/var\0" through whole HDD. Then I calculated sizes of / /swap /usr and /var partitions. Fortunately I remembered that sizes of all but last partitions were set to integer number of megabytes. Then I booted tiny FreeBSD, ran /stand/sysinstall, created / /swap /usr and /var subsystems with calculated/remembered size at broken FreeBSD partition (via menu custom->label) and "Toggle NewFS" option there to "No" - to preserve wiping data. After writing changes to disk and rebooting, I was able to mount /usr and /var, say newfs to / and restore /etc. Then I made a total system backup :) Oleg : (We know there are better ways to do dumps but we'd done this before and it : worked so we thought it would be better than no backup at all - couldn't have : been more wrong there). : As there were some odd messages appearing in the console this was aborted with: : ^C : After that, the system crashed and now, when we try to restart the machine, : we get the following status report on the console: : ***************************************************************************** : Boot: : - : ***************************************************************************** : Any help would be very much appreciated. : Thanks, : Philip From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 09:47:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA13027 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:47:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA13022 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:47:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id LAA12047; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:45:36 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608141645.LAA12047@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: ulf@lamb.net (Ulf Zimmermann) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:45:36 -0500 (CDT) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608141602.JAA07816@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net> from "Ulf Zimmermann" at Aug 14, 96 09:02:28 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I would go more into the direction of checking if the dump device is a > mounted file system. Easy check. I tend to agree, but wonder if it would not make more sense to tackle this from a different angle. Consider all the programs that could clobber a mounted file system. Would it make more sense if we somehow protected a mounted disk device from being clobbered? I am sort of thinking of the way amd mounts its disk devices exclusively, makes it difficult to get a dump, but effectively protects the device (well, at least the normal device, not the raw device). OTOH, this is a can of worms, no matter how you do it. ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:00:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA13880 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:00:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from render.gu.kiev.ua (render.gu.kiev.ua [193.124.51.65]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA13839 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:59:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from creator.gu.kiev.ua (root@creator.gu.kiev.ua [193.124.51.73]) by render.gu.kiev.ua with ESMTP id TAA06248; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 19:14:36 +0300 Received: (from stesin@localhost) by creator.gu.kiev.ua id TAA18844; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 19:12:53 +0300 From: Andrew Stesin Message-Id: <199608141612.TAA18844@creator.gu.kiev.ua> Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: sven@acca.nmsu.edu (Ian Logan) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 19:12:52 +0300 (EET DST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: stesin@gu.kiev.ua In-Reply-To: <199608141524.JAA13087@acca.nmsu.edu> from "Ian Logan" at Aug 14, 96 09:24:08 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, | Well I've always been a bit of lurker in the past, but I've got to agree | than ipfw is really really klunky. If ipfilter is better, I definately | say go for it! | Ian I tried ipfw back in the past, found it unacceptable for my brains, went IPfilter way and had a success with only minor troubles and a _big_ win in functionality. I'm recommending IPfilter to FreeBSD people since long ago. Andrew Stesin -- nic-hdl: ST73-RIPE From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:02:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA13985 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:02:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA13979; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:02:29 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199608141702.KAA13979@freefall.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: bsd lkm's and you. To: explorer@flame.org (Michael Graff) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:02:29 -0700 (PDT) Cc: jkh@freebsd.org, hackers In-Reply-To: <199608141004.GAA10224@kechara.flame.org> from "Michael Graff" at Aug 14, 96 06:04:22 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Graff wrote: > > > If you or anyone else from FreeBSD would like to work on a common interface > for *BSD lkm's, I have made a mailing list, bsd-lkm@flame.org. And, > for that matter, the other ones I made so long ago but never announced > are still there, too... bsd-arch, bsd-chat, and bsd-install. If the > lkm portion works well, perhaps those could get some use, too... > > Pass this along to anyone interested, including mailing lists and such. gentlemen, i dont wish to sound a discordant note her, but am obliged to ask you to fix your mail system first. everyone at flame.org has been removed from the FreeBSD mailing lists: you all are bouncing 100+ messages a day ;( *each* subscriber. >-( jmb -- Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD--4.4BSD Unix for PC clones, source included. http://www.freebsd.org/ PGP 2.6.2 Fingerprint: 31 57 41 56 06 C1 40 13 C5 1C E3 E5 DC 62 0E FB From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:04:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA14155 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:04:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA14150 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:04:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id MAA12125; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:03:00 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608141703.MAA12125@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Popper errors. To: richmond@cronus.oanet.com Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:02:59 -0500 (CDT) Cc: bsdi-users@bsdi.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Raymond Richmond" at Aug 14, 96 10:26:25 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Recently we moved our mail from the var partition to a new > one to accomodate our space needs. After the move a great many of our > users recieve the following error. > > Aug 10 06:30:59 cronus popper[12883]: -ERR Unable to copy mail spool file > to temp pop dropbox /var/mail/.username.pop > > Any ideas? The mail was moved with a tar preserving user info. Wrong permissions on the new spool directory? You did symlink /var/mail to the new location, yes? Your POP mail server looks like it's already configured to use /var/mail for temp files, that's good. (typically it is easier to mount a new disk as /var/mail than it is to play games and dink with symlinks). ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:07:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA14363 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:07:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from swissbank.swissbank.com (swissbank.swissbank.com [146.180.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA14358 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:07:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by swissbank.swissbank.com with UUCP (4.1/BK-1.9) id AA27346; Wed, 14 Aug 96 12:05:44 CDT Received: from il.us.swissbank.com by keymaster.swissbank.com with SMTP (8.6.12/BK-1.12) id EAA05141; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 04:42:29 -0500 Received: from ln1d278nwk by il.us.swissbank.com (4.1/SBCW oconnor v1.4 96/07/01) id AA20561; Wed, 14 Aug 96 04:42:26 CDT Received: by ln1d278nwk (NX5.67d/NX3.0S) id AA00451; Wed, 14 Aug 96 10:42:55 +0100 Message-Id: <9608140942.AA00451@ln1d278nwk> Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3risc v124) Content-Type: text/plain Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.124.RR) From: Armando Ferreira Date: Wed, 14 Aug 96 10:42:48 +0100 To: Paul Richards Subject: Re: Nightmare. Cc: Philip Milne , hackers@FreeBSD.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com References: <4826.839936227@time.cdrom.com> Reply-To: armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, The command that I actually used was tar -cvf /dev/rsd0a / I have since built FreeBSD on a different disk which is working fine. What I need to do now, is to check that the /usr partition of the old disk was not damaged. I don't know how to mount the /usr partition of the old disk because I expect it to have the same device name as /usr in the new disk. Is there a way I can distinguish them ? Thanks for your help, Armando Begin forwarded message: To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: "Hr.Ladavac" , philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com (Philip Milne), hackers@freebsd.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. From: Paul Richards Date: 14 Aug 1996 10:17:33 +0100 In-Reply-To: "Jordan K. Hubbard"'s message of Tue, 13 Aug 1996 04:47:48 -0700 Lines: 27 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.30 "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: > > > > tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / > > > > This has utterly trashed your boot device (and / lies there.) I seriuosly > > doubt that you can do anything but reinstall. > > Probably the right conclusion, but for the wrong reasons. Ehh, either I'm missing something really stupid or everyone else is :-) tar -cvf /dev/rfd0a / is going to backup the / partition onto a floppy, what's wrong with that? About the worst that could happen is that rfd0a doesn't exist and you create a tar archive, at which point tar will say something like "/usr/bin/tar: /dev/rfd0 is the archive; not dumped" or you fill a floppy (doesn't gnu tar prompt for new floppies anyway). I certainly wouldn't expect this command to trash my / partition. -- Paul Richards. Originative Solutions Ltd. (Netcraft Ltd. contractor) Elsevier Science TIS online journal project. Email: p.richards@elsevier.co.uk Phone: 0370 462071 (Mobile), +44 (0)1865 843155 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:08:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA14488 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:08:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA14480 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:08:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA29244; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:03:02 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608141703.KAA29244@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:03:02 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608140443.GAA15959@keltia.freenix.fr> from "Ollivier Robert" at Aug 14, 96 06:43:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > According to Terry Lambert: > > It is in ports. You will need a thread safe lbc (patched included > > in the port, I believe). > > pthreads is included in /usr/src/lib/libc_r, not in ports. In -current, right? What about before -current? Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:09:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA14519 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:09:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA14510 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:09:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA29213; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:59:57 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608141659.JAA29213@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: dev@fgate.flevel.co.uk (Developer) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 09:59:57 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, koshy@india.hp.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Developer" at Aug 14, 96 09:23:10 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Tue, 13 Aug 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > > This may be a silly question, but where do I get libpthreads from? > > > > It is in ports. You will need a thread safe lbc (patched included > > in the port, I believe). > > I understand.. but what is the name of the package in ports that does the > threads, I can`t find it??? libc_r. build libc_r, and you will have a reentrant (hence the "_r") libc. The POSIX threading is build into the library (under uthread or something, I think; you will need to look at the sources to be sure). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:13:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA14787 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:13:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cronus.oanet.com (richmond@cronus.oanet.com [204.209.13.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA14780 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:12:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (richmond@localhost) by cronus.oanet.com (8.7.3/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA20179; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:12:34 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:12:33 -0600 (MDT) From: Raymond Richmond To: Joe Greco cc: bsdi-users@bsdi.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Popper errors. In-Reply-To: <199608141703.MAA12125@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It is symlinked actually, I was planning on changing the partition to /var/mail but at this time it is not an option for me. The only thing I noticed was that the group for the mail files in question were sometimes different than that of the pop file. This hsould not matter however as the file permissions are set on the user, not group. On Wed, 14 Aug 1996, Joe Greco wrote: > > Recently we moved our mail from the var partition to a new > > one to accomodate our space needs. After the move a great many of our > > users recieve the following error. > > > > Aug 10 06:30:59 cronus popper[12883]: -ERR Unable to copy mail spool file > > Wrong permissions on the new spool directory? You did symlink /var/mail to > the new location, yes? Your POP mail server looks like it's already > configured to use /var/mail for temp files, that's good. > > (typically it is easier to mount a new disk as /var/mail than it is to > play games and dink with symlinks). > > ... JG > -- __^__ __^__ ( ___ )------------------------------------------------------( ___ ) | / |---Raymond Richmond---Question Man-------(403)430-0811 -| \ | | / |---------OA Internet----------Technical Support---------| \ | |_*_| |_*_| (_____)----------------richmond@oanet.com--------------------(_____) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:19:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA15236 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:19:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA15230 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:19:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA29273; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:10:48 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608141710.KAA29273@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:10:48 -0700 (MST) Cc: ulf@lamb.net, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608141645.LAA12047@brasil.moneng.mei.com> from "Joe Greco" at Aug 14, 96 11:45:36 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I would go more into the direction of checking if the dump device is a > > mounted file system. Easy check. > > I tend to agree, but wonder if it would not make more sense to tackle this > from a different angle. > > Consider all the programs that could clobber a mounted file system. Would > it make more sense if we somehow protected a mounted disk device from > being clobbered? Yes. Disable the raw device for mounted disks. The stacking architecture disallows (since it internall references the vnodes) a device level soloution that does anything to the non-raw device. If we can get past the point where devfs is a mandatory item, then we can fix all of this without breaking FS stacking. There is no soloution otherwise that could not be broken by a clever idiot. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:19:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA15264 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:19:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA15258; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:19:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id KAA13898; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:19:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma013896; Wed Aug 14 10:19:13 1996 Message-ID: <32120A61.31DFF4F5@whistle.com> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:18:25 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b4 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: sos@freebsd.org CC: "archie Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? References: <199608141303.PAA13221@ra.dkuug.dk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk sos@freebsd.org wrote: > > In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who wrote: > I'm all for it !! > It leaves the question what to do with julian's redirect code ?? > It shares much of the same "features" that ipfw does, and for all I care > it can go as well.. Most of the features with it is now in ipfilter... > Actually it's archie's code, but we really need it.. and I think I can make a good argument for giving the capacity to use user-land agents for complicated packet processing. Possibly we can add a "divert' to ipfilter and get darren to accept it back.. > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > So much code to hack -- so little time. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:24:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA15652 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:24:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA15647 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:24:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id MAA12196; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:21:10 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608141721.MAA12196@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:21:10 -0500 (CDT) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, ulf@lamb.net, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608141710.KAA29273@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 14, 96 10:10:48 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > I would go more into the direction of checking if the dump device is a > > > mounted file system. Easy check. > > > > I tend to agree, but wonder if it would not make more sense to tackle this > > from a different angle. > > > > Consider all the programs that could clobber a mounted file system. Would > > it make more sense if we somehow protected a mounted disk device from > > being clobbered? > > Yes. Disable the raw device for mounted disks. The stacking > architecture disallows (since it internall references the vnodes) a > device level soloution that does anything to the non-raw device. > > If we can get past the point where devfs is a mandatory item, then we > can fix all of this without breaking FS stacking. There is no soloution > otherwise that could not be broken by a clever idiot. Would it make more sense to just disable _writes_ to raw devices for mounted disks? (probably writes to both devices, for that matter) I am thinking specifically of using dump,dd,etc to read a mounted file system for some useful purpose. ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:32:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA16048 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:32:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from swissbank.swissbank.com (swissbank.swissbank.com [146.180.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA16043 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:32:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: by swissbank.swissbank.com with UUCP (4.1/BK-1.9) id AA28441; Wed, 14 Aug 96 12:32:01 CDT Received: from il.us.swissbank.com by keymaster.swissbank.com with SMTP (8.6.12/BK-1.12) id FAA07871; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 05:35:07 -0500 Received: from ln1d273nwk by il.us.swissbank.com (4.1/SBCW oconnor v1.4 96/07/01) id AA22574; Wed, 14 Aug 96 05:35:08 CDT Received: by ln1d273nwk (NX5.67d/NX3.0S) id AA06211; Wed, 14 Aug 96 11:35:36 +0100 Message-Id: <9608141035.AA06211@ln1d273nwk> Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3risc v124) Content-Type: text/plain Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.124) From: Philip Milne Date: Wed, 14 Aug 96 11:35:30 +0100 To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. References: <199608141021.DAA00349@rah.star-gate.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk We know what we did wrong now and have rebuilt FreeBSD on a separate disk to get some rudimentary services going. Jordan has advised us to wait until our sysadmin gets back to recover the part of the other disk that was not trashed by the erroneous tar command - and this is what we are going to do. Thank you all for your help. Philip From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:35:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA16230 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:35:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA16223; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:35:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA29330; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:29:47 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608141729.KAA29330@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: sio problems with 2.2-960801-SNAP To: phk@critter.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:29:47 -0700 (MST) Cc: sos@FreeBSD.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <453.840022809@critter.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Aug 14, 96 01:40:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > For anybody who looks at the code for the pccard support, and thinks > they can do better, please send email to Nate and tell him that you > will be helping. > > For anybody who think it is trivial: You're wrong. > > The very idea of hardware that comes and goes is so alien to UNIX > as you could possibly make it. This is not simple at all. I agree with Poul. Consider the following: For file system hardware (NFS or real FS via pluggable controller, or floppy disk, etc.), it requires moving to a device notification model for mounts, since the devices are transient, and may come and go -- and not under software control. The software must *react* rather than *initiating* the plug events. This requires handling physical-to-logical and logical-to-logical device mapping as a hierarchy in a devfs style implementation, which triggers on "device arrival" events. The completion of a successful probe for a statically configured device is considered an arrival event for the purposes of this discussion. There are implications for the mount code, which must seperate the concept of volume mounting from the concept of mapping a mounted volume into the existing FS hierarcy, either as an inferior device to the root device, or some subbordinate devie at an even lower level. The concept of volume table management, where a device is the result of a partititoning schema of one kind (DOS partition table) or another (BSD disklabel) or yet another (DOS exetended partition, etc.) fits nicely into this model. So does the concept of volume spanning, whether it consists of mirroring, striping, or simple volume concatentation (everything the CCD driver now does, not quite adequately: an obvious fact to anyone who has tried to use a ccd device for root). There's a significant amount of work simply to support file system hardware, and almost all of it depends on a working devfs as a mandatory system foundation on which to build everything else. And the vast majority of the hardware falls into the category of "typical ISA hardware unrelated to FS operations"... it has it's own set of quirks. Now add to that that the ENPIC hardware (of which there are five popular chip register interfaces currently in use for PCMCIA->ISA bridging), and making the code robust becomes a nightmare. The different chipsets do not all support mapping the same dynamic configuration range of ports and interrupts in the ISA space. I suggest that anyone complaining about the PCMCIA (PCCARD) support code get copies of the PCMCIA documentation from the SIG. This will only cost you as much as a 1G hard drive, like it cost the rest of us, after shipping, etc. is figured in. Then if, after reading that, you are still interested, I will send you a list of the chip interface literature you will need to buy to support the bridge chipsets in common use. Nate and the Nomads (still a good name for a band ;)) have been doing an *excellent* job of abstracting the interfaces at several of the *few* available common abstraction levels which could possible be used to implement a modular architecture at all. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:38:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA16360 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:38:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns2.harborcom.net (root@ns2.harborcom.net [206.158.4.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA16355 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:38:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from swoosh.dunn.org (swoosh.dunn.org [206.158.7.243]) by ns2.harborcom.net (8.7.4/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA10403; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:37:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199608141737.NAA10403@ns2.harborcom.net> From: "Bradley Dunn" To: "Raymond Richmond" , Cc: Subject: Re: Popper errors. Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:29:38 -0400 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk What are your permissions on /var/mail? Popper runs as the user retrieving mail, and needs sufficient permissions to write a temporary file. What I do is use Qualcomm's popper, and before compilation I specified the temp. dir. to be /var/mail/poptemp and made that directory mode 1777. Sure it's another directory that is world writable, but I figure your /var partition should be designed to handle big fluctuations in size. I suppose you could also just specify /tmp as the place to make the temporary file. Bradley Dunn Harbor Communications ---------- > From: Raymond Richmond > To: bsdi-users@bsdi.com > Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: Popper errors. > Date: Wednesday, August 14, 1996 12:26 PM > > Recently we moved our mail from the var partition to a new > one to accomodate our space needs. After the move a great many of our > users recieve the following error. > > Aug 10 06:30:59 cronus popper[12883]: -ERR Unable to copy mail spool file > to temp pop dropbox /var/mail/.username.pop > > Any ideas? The mail was moved with a tar preserving user info. > > -- > > __^__ __^__ > ( ___ )------------------------------------------------------( ___ ) > | / |---Raymond Richmond---Question Man-------(403)430-0811 -| \ | > | / |---------OA Internet----------Technical Support---------| \ | > |_*_| |_*_| > (_____)----------------richmond@oanet.com--------------------(_____) > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:40:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA16540 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:40:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA16498 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:39:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id KAA14023; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:38:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma014021; Wed Aug 14 10:38:16 1996 Message-ID: <32120ED8.237C228A@whistle.com> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:37:28 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b4 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" CC: "archie Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter References: <14773.840033327@time.cdrom.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > > Heh:) > > Well..intresting enough it always works this way - first ppl take it, then > > they screw it and then they say it's bad and take something else. > > Thanx guys... > > With all due respect, Ugen, the code was a filthy mess when you gave > it to us and was in absolutely no shape to continue using in that way. > It was bad to start with and nobody needed to "screw" anything. If > anything it's been substantially improved over the last 6 months or > so, but dressing a pig in tuxedo still doesn't change him from being a > pig. Ungen, I think that Jordan is overstating things whenn he says it is a pig.. When it came out, it was a great step forward. The main point is that Darren is very actively maintaining and improving his code. He admits that he looked at your code amongst others to ensure that his code has all the functionality needed. I have written several modules for 386BSD/FreeBSD/NetBSD that were originally hailed , then eventually replaced.. That's nature Notice that We have quite an investment in the IPFW package, as we are using it together with the divert additions as the basis for soem quite important features of a product. We do appreciate it.. as to ipfilter, It is possible that darren's active partitcipation in the ongoing improvement of this package makes it a good replacement for ipfw. if this is true, (which is unproven at this time) then there is nothing that should be taken personally about it.. You have to admit that you haven't had the time to spend on continuously turning out new versions of ipfw. most of the new features have come from other people.. I personally don't mind ipfw but ipfilter does have the advantage of giving a common interface to this functionality on NetBSd, Sunos and FreeBSD. Believe me that we would have been very happy to HAVE ipfw. but you can' take away from teh hard work that Darren has been doing to make his product better and better. It shows in the product.. IPFW works but is largely un-cared-for.. ipfilter shows the touches of a loving parent.. If we go to ipfilter, I will need ipfw to still be present until (if ever) ipfilter can do teh same divert socket work that we put into ipfw. I'm not looking forward to the work, but..... Ungen.. don't take it so personally.. those of us out here REALLY APPRECIATE the ifw code and teh work you did to give it to us.. but you in turn must appresciate teh work that daren is doing.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:44:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA16788 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:44:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA16765 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:43:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA29366; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:37:18 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608141737.KAA29366@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:37:18 -0700 (MST) Cc: ugen@latte.worldbank.org, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <14773.840033327@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 14, 96 07:35:27 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Heh:) > > Well..intresting enough it always works this way - first ppl take it, then > > they screw it and then they say it's bad and take something else. > > Thanx guys... > > With all due respect, Ugen, the code was a filthy mess when you gave > it to us and was in absolutely no shape to continue using in that way. > It was bad to start with and nobody needed to "screw" anything. If > anything it's been substantially improved over the last 6 months or > so, but dressing a pig in tuxedo still doesn't change him from being a > pig. Not to defend the code, but this is the same tuxedo/pig argument I get when I suggest UNIX instead of a Microsoft OS (UNIX being the pig in the aphorism). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:46:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA16973 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:46:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA16962 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:46:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id KAA14082; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:45:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma014080; Wed Aug 14 10:45:00 1996 Message-ID: <3212106D.2F1CF0FB@whistle.com> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:44:13 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b4 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Poul-Henning Kamp CC: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter References: <710.840034499@critter.tfs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > In message <14773.840033327@time.cdrom.com>, "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: > >> Heh:) > >> Well..intresting enough it always works this way - first ppl take it, then > >> they screw it and then they say it's bad and take something else. > >> Thanx guys... > > > >With all due respect, Ugen, the code was a filthy mess when you gave > >it to us and was in absolutely no shape to continue using in that way. Jordan, sometimes you need to take lessons in diplomacy :-) let's be quite clear about this.. IPFW when it cam in was a young and imature product.. it had good ideas, but it was obviously an early version of what it might become. it had all the failings of early versions.. hacks and shortcuts biung two of them. This is expected in early revision software.. The only thing that was wrong with ipfw is that Ungen ran out of time to keep cleaning and improving it.. Darren on the other hand has kept improving ipfilter. > > Not to mention that it didn't work as it gave impression of doing. > > The only think I have against ditching ipfw and replacing with ipfilter > is that the later is getting to big for comfort. this is truely a problem.. Daren wants to keep improving it with new features etc.. > > -- > Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. > http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. > whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. > Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:52:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA17511 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:52:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA17506 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:52:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA29411; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:44:14 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608141744.KAA29411@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:44:14 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, ulf@lamb.net, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608141721.MAA12196@brasil.moneng.mei.com> from "Joe Greco" at Aug 14, 96 12:21:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > Consider all the programs that could clobber a mounted file system. Would > > > it make more sense if we somehow protected a mounted disk device from > > > being clobbered? > > > > Yes. Disable the raw device for mounted disks. The stacking > > architecture disallows (since it internall references the vnodes) a > > device level soloution that does anything to the non-raw device. > > > > If we can get past the point where devfs is a mandatory item, then we > > can fix all of this without breaking FS stacking. There is no soloution > > otherwise that could not be broken by a clever idiot. > > Would it make more sense to just disable _writes_ to raw devices for mounted > disks? (probably writes to both devices, for that matter) > > I am thinking specifically of using dump,dd,etc to read a mounted file > system for some useful purpose. Doesn't dump take the mount point name, not the device, as an argument? It doesn't document which device it needs in the man page very well, but the exmaple clear shows "/usr/src" as the "[filesystem]" reference. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:57:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA17724 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:57:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA17719 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:57:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id MAA12315; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:53:58 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608141753.MAA12315@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:53:57 -0500 (CDT) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, terry@lambert.org, ulf@lamb.net, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608141744.KAA29411@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 14, 96 10:44:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I am thinking specifically of using dump,dd,etc to read a mounted file > > system for some useful purpose. > > Doesn't dump take the mount point name, not the device, as an argument? > > It doesn't document which device it needs in the man page very well, but > the exmaple clear shows "/usr/src" as the "[filesystem]" reference. dump works either way. The manual is poor. :-) Some things, including amanda, require this to work. dd, incidentally, doesn't take a mount point name as an argument (well it may, but it doesn't do what you would expect to happen when you use the device name). ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:58:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA17789 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:58:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from post.vale.com (post.vale.com [204.117.217.66]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA17783 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:58:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jaguar.vale.com by post.vale.com id aa06200; 14 Aug 96 12:57 CDT Received: by jaguar.vale.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BB89E1.3762F660@jaguar.vale.com>; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:05:07 -0500 Message-ID: <01BB89E1.3762F660@jaguar.vale.com> From: Hal Snyder To: "hackers@FreeBSD.ORG" Subject: ipfw considered harmful (not?) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:05:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've used ipfw in past with very satisfactory results, protecting small corporation from the Internet. Don't know ipfilter for comparison. What made ipfw bearable was an rc.ipfw script, beginning with environmental variables for major addresses, and the line ipfw flush as the first real ipfw command. I don't think it would be too hard to graft an HTML/CGI front-end onto ipfw (anyone seen Checkpoint?). Does ipfilter do this? On the downside - I found the code for ipfw to be unreadable, mainly due to lack of comments in key areas. That always makes me suspicious the writer started with "int i;" rather than a design for the code. [Nothing personal against the original author - just that I spent over a decade reading student programming efforts and eventually lost all patience with puzzling over needlessly undocumented code.] From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 10:58:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA17853 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:58:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns2.clever.net (qmailr@[208.5.0.252]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA17843 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:58:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail-queue invoked by uid 0); 14 Aug 1996 18:11:53 -0000 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:11:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Sam Brown To: Raymond Richmond cc: bsdi-users@bsdi.com, hackers@freebsd.org To: Undisclosed recipients: ; Subject: Re: Popper errors. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Did you umask 000 and use the preserve ownership of the dir and its files? Sounds like the perms on the file are wrong. Best check it out. rm .*.pop if nothing else , but also check the ownership/group/perms on the dir itself. On Wed, 14 Aug 1996, Raymond Richmond wrote: > Recently we moved our mail from the var partition to a new > one to accomodate our space needs. After the move a great many of our > users recieve the following error. > > Aug 10 06:30:59 cronus popper[12883]: -ERR Unable to copy mail spool file > to temp pop dropbox /var/mail/.username.pop > > Any ideas? The mail was moved with a tar preserving user info. > > -- > > __^__ __^__ > ( ___ )------------------------------------------------------( ___ ) > | / |---Raymond Richmond---Question Man-------(403)430-0811 -| \ | > | / |---------OA Internet----------Technical Support---------| \ | > |_*_| |_*_| > (_____)----------------richmond@oanet.com--------------------(_____) > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 11:25:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA19021 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:25:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA19015 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:25:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id LAA14277; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:24:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma014275; Wed Aug 14 11:24:18 1996 Message-ID: <321219A2.63DECDAD@whistle.com> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:23:30 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b4 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Garrett Wollman CC: Julian@whistle.com, Elischer@whistle.com, archie@whistle.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/sbin/route keywords route.8 route.c References: <199608132220.PAA16569@freefall.freebsd.org> <9608141629.AA29997@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Garrett Wollman wrote: > > < said: > > > julian 96/08/13 15:20:22 > > Modified: sbin/route keywords route.8 route.c > > Log: > > Submitted by: Archie@whistle.com > > if making a interface route, and it's a P2P link, > > then also automatically lable it as an llinfo entry so that > > gated and friends don't clobber it.. > > No, wrong. IFF_LLINFO means that rt->rt_llinfo points to something > useful. Back this out. Not by my reading of the code.. the way I read it, the RTF_LLINFO (not IFF_LLINFO) simply says that it is "generated by ARP or ESIS" (as the .h file indicates.. I genmeralise that to "created by some module that knows about the linklevel of that interface" Now, it is upto whoever generated it to know what is in the rt_llinfo field.. it is defined as a caddr_t for this reason (should be a A(void *)) All cases of code that I have seen look first to see that this is NOT a NULL before dereferencing it. I put it to you that the NULLNESS of the pointer indicates that there is nothing there, and that the llinfo says that it is a link level routing entry and nothing more. By my reading of the code and the stevend book your definition is not correct. A compromise would be to make the user manually set the llinfo bit, but we are only setting it automatically in the case where not setting it makes no sense. We are not setting it unless the user is setting a interface level routing entry to a P2P link, in which case there is no llinfo anyhow. I'm not saying that we can't be convinced, but that the argument you have just given isn't the one to convince us.. > -GAWollman > > -- > Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same > wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom > Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame > MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 11:35:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA19521 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:35:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA19513 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:35:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id LAA14343; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:32:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma014341; Wed Aug 14 11:32:15 1996 Message-ID: <32121B80.695678E2@whistle.com> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:31:28 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b4 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com CC: Paul Richards , Philip Milne , hackers@FreeBSD.org, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. References: <4826.839936227@time.cdrom.com> <9608140942.AA00451@ln1d278nwk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Armando Ferreira wrote: > > Hi, > > The command that I actually used was tar -cvf /dev/rsd0a / this is good because it limitted teh damage. ONLY the root partition will be damaged (excep maybe small things elsewhere due to the system being brought down suddenly). > > I have since built FreeBSD on a different disk which is working fine. What I > need to do now, is to check that the /usr partition of the old disk was not > damaged. you can find out which is which by running fsck on the subdevices.. /dev/rsd0[defgh] (unless it's now sd1 :-) fsck will tell you where the filesystem was last mounted.. > > I don't know how to mount the /usr partition of the old disk because I expect > it to have the same device name as /usr in the new disk. > > Is there a way I can distinguish them ? > > Thanks for your help, > Armando From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 11:39:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA19677 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:39:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay3.UU.NET (relay3.UU.NET [192.48.96.8]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA19672 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:39:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ugen-tr by relay3.UU.NET with SMTP (peer crosschecked as: ugen-tr.worldbank.org [138.220.101.58]) id QQbctm22722; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:39:34 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 96 14:23:46 From: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" Subject: WOW: ipfw vs ipfilter To: hackers@freebsd.org X-PRIORITY: 3 (Normal) X-Mailer: Chameleon 5.0.1, TCP/IP for Windows, NetManage Inc. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hmm..That was fun..i actually unsubscribed from all the FreeBSD groups recently as i am planning a trip abroad and don't want my mailbox to explode while i am gone, so i wasn't reading FreeBSd lists for a while, and i sent this note thinking pretty much i am sending it back to Jordan , my friend Gena forwarded the mail to me..:) Well anyway, interestingly enough how two lines can produce such a reaction... Yes, i know i haven't been working on this for a long time, and i don't think i will ever, i am at 20% (which as all you know is nothing in normal terms) of writing completely new conceptually different firewall (well that means i worked last week for 3 hours). As to the pig and such - i don't think the firewall code was messy, in fact it was pretty normally writen, not worse then any other part and no matter what ppl say i can compare - i know when i write good code and when it is bad myself. Besides a lot of it was derived from another guy and nobody blamed him before:) Put aside the quality of code at the time i put it in the system it included everything ipfilter does, but the actual problem is not that - i beleive ipfilter is better now as time goes and it doesn't stands in place. >From what i figured over this year ppl started doing something whih an old russian Aesopus style tale says: There was a donkey once who drew a picture and it was ok, then came a bear and tald him that picture is good but to make it better it needs some honey, then a pig came along(another one) and sayd that the picture's missing beans, then a rabbit asked for carrots and a horse for an oat or something and so on.So the donkey-artist added it all and then when all the bunch of suggesting dudes came to see it they all agreed - this picture is ugly and disgusting. And then they gave up on it:) Now don't nobody get offended cuz i didn't mean to call nobody pigs and horses, it's how a story goes but the main idea is that a bunch of good small changes having no system and nobody to bring them to common interface makes something rather bad and hard to understand. As to keeping or removing IPFW from the system i personally do not really care, it was nice having my name there but that's all. If sometime i finish my work you will be welcome to check it out, as for now thank you for attention and sorry about making such a fuss:) --Ugen From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 11:48:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA19922 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:48:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from relay3.UU.NET (relay3.UU.NET [192.48.96.8]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA19913 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 11:48:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ugen-tr by relay3.UU.NET with SMTP (peer crosschecked as: ugen-tr.worldbank.org [138.220.101.58]) id QQbctn24916; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:48:05 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 96 14:40:03 From: "Ugen J.S.Antsilevich" Subject: WOW: ipfw vs ipfilter (part II) To: hackers@freebsd.org X-PRIORITY: 3 (Normal) X-Mailer: Chameleon 5.0.1, TCP/IP for Windows, NetManage Inc. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I missed the point i actually wanted to bring so probably all i wrote is not really understoodable without this: In the last year i received lots of problem reports about IPFW, of them most were because of misunderstanding of the command line interface. As i researched the topic (installed it and played for 10 minutes) i realised that the interface is obviously rather different then what i had in place and (per my statistics) all the problems reported to me were because only of this reason. ipfw itself is a rather primitive and straightforward ipfilter and hardly has place for bugs. What kind of set me off this time is that Jordan just tried to install it first time AFAIS, most certainly (and tell me if i am wrong) stumped upon misconfiguration (some keyword which acts differently than it has to or some undocumented stuff or what not) and because of this he actually says that ipfw is bad. To my defence i can say only - i am sure if you tell me what do you wan tto do and i use my original version it is a matter of 1-2 lines of config. I hope it clears the issue of fairy tales and such:) Thanx! --Ugen From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 12:26:15 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA21312 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:26:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA21306; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:26:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id FAA00909; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 05:21:28 +1000 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 05:21:28 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608141921.FAA00909@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: handy@sag.space.lockheed.com, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, ponds!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Now, it's worth noting that before I upgraded the 486 with the errant >mouse port to...oh...I think 2.1? (Nate would remember, he sees the same >thing) I never got the "sio overflow" message in my syslogs. Something silo (no relation) >has changed to make this error show up. Again, I've never noticed it >affecting anything. >I don't remember when it started, so don't quote me on that. It's a new >development in the last 1.5 years or so though. It didn't show up because of a bug in the error reporting. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 12:31:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA21523 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:31:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA21511 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:31:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id FAA01058; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 05:27:27 +1000 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 05:27:27 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608141927.FAA01058@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, j@uriah.heep.sax.de Subject: Re: sio problems with 2.2-960801-SNAP Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> Aug 8 11:52:22 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 4 >> Aug 8 11:52:41 plato last message repeated 3 times >> Aug 8 11:53:55 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 4 >> Aug 8 11:53:55 plato /kernel.2.2: too many stray irq 4's; not logging any more >> Aug 8 12:15:41 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 3 >Basically, there's something screwed with your interrupt >configuration. Stray irq's are not supposed to happen for a >configured driver, they are generated by catch-all code inside >the ISA bus controller driver, thus a strong indication that >your IRQs never reach the sio driver. The catch-all code delivers stray IRQs to IRQ7 (and maybe to IRQ15). `stray irq 4' simply means that an IRQ4 occurred but no driver is attached to IRQ4. I don't know how this can happen. If there is no driver attached to an IRQ, then that IRQ is masked, except for the catch-all IRQ7. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 12:31:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA21561 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:31:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA21548; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:31:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by mail.cdsnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA05494; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:31:12 -0700 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 12:31:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen To: current@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Anybody make worlding -current? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I supped this morning (8/14/96), and it dies: cmp -s /usr/src/lib/libpcap/pcap-namedb.h /usr/include/pcap-namedb.h || ( install -c -o bin -g bin -m 444 /usr/src/lib/libpcap/pcap-namedb.h /usr/include; ) cd /usr/src/lib/librpcsvc && make beforeinstall cd /usr/src/lib/libskey && make beforeinstall cd /usr/src/lib/libskey; cmp -s skey.h /usr/include/skey.h || install -c -o bin -g bin -m 444 skey.h /usr/include cd /usr/src/lib/libtcl && make beforeinstall make: don't know how to make /usr/src/lib/libtcl/../../contrib/tcl/generic/tcl.h. Stop *** Error code 2 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 13:25:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA23709 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:25:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cygnus.com (cygnus.com [140.174.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA23704; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:25:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tweedledumb.cygnus.com (tweedledumb.cygnus.com [192.80.44.1]) by cygnus.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA08551; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:25:08 -0700 Received: from kechara.flame.org by tweedledumb.cygnus.com (4.1/4.7) id AA14802; Wed, 14 Aug 96 16:24:53 EDT Received: (from explorer@localhost) by kechara.flame.org (8.7.5/8.6.9) id QAA11316; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:24:45 -0400 (EDT) To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Cc: jkh@freebsd.org, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: bsd lkm's and you. References: <199608141702.KAA13979@freefall.freebsd.org> From: Michael Graff Date: 14 Aug 1996 16:24:44 -0400 In-Reply-To: "Jonathan M. Bresler"'s message of Wed, 14 Aug 1996 10:02:29 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: Lines: 16 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.2.36/Emacs 19.31 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk "Jonathan M. Bresler" writes: > gentlemen, i dont wish to sound a discordant note her, but > am obliged to ask you to fix your mail system first. > > everyone at flame.org has been removed from the FreeBSD > mailing lists: you all are bouncing 100+ messages a day ;( > *each* subscriber. >-( Well, I'm the only one at flame.org... Can you send me a bounce message please? I appologise, but I wasn't even aware things were bouncing. I'll recheck the logs when I appear in the office. --M From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 13:25:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA23736 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:25:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA23718; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:25:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from venus.mcs.com (root@Venus.mcs.com [192.160.127.92]) by Kitten.mcs.com (8.7.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id PAA23068; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:25:12 -0500 (CDT) Received: by venus.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.13) id ; Wed, 14 Aug 96 15:25 CDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: Anybody make worlding -current? To: mrcpu@cdsnet.net (Jaye Mathisen) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:25:11 -0500 (CDT) From: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" Cc: current@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Jaye Mathisen" at Aug 14, 96 12:31:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I supped this morning (8/14/96), and it dies: > > cmp -s /usr/src/lib/libpcap/pcap-namedb.h /usr/include/pcap-namedb.h || ( > install -c -o bin -g bin -m 444 /usr/src/lib/libpcap/pcap-namedb.h > /usr/include; ) > cd /usr/src/lib/librpcsvc && make beforeinstall > cd /usr/src/lib/libskey && make beforeinstall > cd /usr/src/lib/libskey; cmp -s skey.h /usr/include/skey.h || install -c > -o bin -g bin -m 444 skey.h /usr/include > cd /usr/src/lib/libtcl && make beforeinstall > make: don't know how to make > /usr/src/lib/libtcl/../../contrib/tcl/generic/tcl.h. Stop > *** Error code 2 > > Stop. > *** Error code 1 > > Stop. You've got the same problem I've seen. Your SUP files are old. Update them and the TCL stuff will come across. -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity http://www.mcs.net/~karl | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available | 23 Chicagoland Prefixes, 13 ISDN, much more Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net/ Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 13:56:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA25429 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:56:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA25424 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 13:56:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id GAA03505; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 06:51:14 +1000 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 06:51:14 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608142051.GAA03505@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: mrm@Mole.ORG, nate@mt.sri.com Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I'm still having problems with > sio1: 182 more interrupt-level buffer overflows (total 883) >Each one causes an Ierr visible with netstat -ai. The system >recovers and keeps going, so I can't complain (too much :-). Interrupt-level buffer overflows are caused by something masking softtty interrupts for too long. The buffer has space for about 196 extra characters at your speed of 57600 bps and overrunning it by 182 characters at 57600 bps means that something has disabled softty interrupts for more than 65 ms. softty interrupts are disabled mainly when hard tty interrupts are disabled - i.e., for critical clock, vm, network and tty processing (net_imask includes tty_imask if splip or ppp is configured). >The system is a 2.1R 16MB 486DX2/50 with 16550 _clones_ on a cheap IDE, >a 1542B, and I've added >options "TTYHOG=4096" # to fix buffer overflows in sio.c >options "RS_IBUF_SIZE=1024" # to fix buffer overflows in sio.c >... >This machine is still running FTL 14. I don't get any silo overflows. >Adding those options really cut down on the interrupt-buffer overflows. >Looks like about 10-15% of what I was getting before. Still there, though. If you still get them with an RS_IBUFSIZE of 1024, then something must be disabling softtty interrupts for more than 199 ms :-(. Perhaps there is a missing splx(). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 14:16:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA26513 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:16:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA26508; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:16:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id HAA04204; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:13:54 +1000 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:13:54 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608142113.HAA04204@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, nate@mt.sri.com Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, ponds!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org, sag.space.lockheed.com!handy@dg-rtp.dg.com Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >see the overflows affecting me much. The funny thing is I don't see >overflows on the SLIP server box which is also running 16550A UARTS and >is running multiple sessions, but it's not running X and never touches >the hard disk. (Basically it's the same hardware on both boxes, 486/66 >with 16MB, although my box has an Adaptec 1542B and the server box is >IDE). Upgrade everything to IDE :-). Some busmastering SCSI controllers hog the bus for too long (e.g., Ultrastor U34Fs sometimes hog it for 160 us so they are unusable with single 8250s at speeds > 57600, unusable with single 16550s at speeds > 115200, and barely usable with single UARTS at exactly these speeds. The aha driver sets the bus on/off times to 7/4, so there should be no problems with single UARTs. Here is my throwaway lkm and auxiliarly program for testing bus hogging. Usage: make and load the lkm. Run modstat to see what its syscall number is. It will be 210 if there are no other syscall-lkms. If the number isn't 210, then change 210 in hogtime.c to the number. Compile and run the hogtime utility. Start processes to exercise the bus hog(s), e.g., `dd bs=1024k /dev/null'. Watch the output from hogtime. Bruce --- lkm/hogtime/Makefile --- BINDIR= /tmp SRCS= mycall.c KMOD= newsyscall_mod NOMAN= none CLEANFILES+= ${KMOD} .include --- lkm/hogtime/mycall.c --- #include #include #include #include #include #include #define mycall hogtime static int mycall(struct proc *p, void *uap, int *retval); static struct sysent newent = { 0, mycall, }; MOD_SYSCALL("newsyscall_mod", -1, &newent); extern int newsyscall_mod(struct lkm_table *lkmtp, int cmd, int ver); int newsyscall_mod(struct lkm_table *lkmtp, int cmd, int ver) { DISPATCH(lkmtp, cmd, ver, lkm_nullcmd, lkm_nullcmd, lkm_nullcmd) } #ifdef MEMTEST #define ADDR 0xf00d4000 #endif static int hogtime(struct proc *p, void *uap, int *retval) { int i, j, start, finish, delta; #ifdef MADDR volatile u_char *maddr; #endif long usec; disable_intr(); for (i = 0; i < 2; ++i) { /* * i = 0: load cache, if any. i = 1: calibrate and count. * Calibration must be combined with counting so that the * same i/o wait states apply to both. */ #ifdef MEMTEST maddr = (volatile u_char *)ADDR; #endif outb(0x43, 0x00); start = inb(0x40); start |= inb(0x40) << 8; #ifndef MEMTEST inb(0x43); /* 7 dummy i/o's to get 10 altogether */ inb(0x43); inb(0x43); inb(0x43); inb(0x43); inb(0x43); inb(0x43); for (j = 0; j < 100; ++j) ; #else for (j = 0; j < 0x100; j += 2) *(maddr + j); #endif outb(0x43, 0x00); finish = inb(0x40); finish |= inb(0x40) << 8; } enable_intr(); delta = start - finish; #define TIMER_FREQ 1193182 #define LATCH ((TIMER_FREQ + hz / 2) / hz) if (delta < 0) delta += LATCH; usec = (delta * tick + LATCH / 2) / LATCH; *retval = usec; return 0; } static long microtime_buf[4096]; static int microtime_test(struct proc *p, void *uap, int *retval) { int i; struct timeval tv; struct timeval tvp; microtime(&tvp); for (i = 0; i < 4096; ++i) { microtime(&tv); microtime_buf[i] = tv.tv_usec - tvp.tv_usec + 1000000 * (tv.tv_sec - tvp.tv_sec); tvp = tv; } return 0; } --- bin/hogtime.c --- #include #include #include int main(void) { for (;;) { int i; long max = 0; long min = LONG_MAX; long tot = 0; int val; for (i = 0; i < 10000; ++i) { val = syscall(210); if (val == -1) { perror("syscall"); exit(1); } if (max < val) max = val; if (min > val) min = val; tot += val; } printf("min = %ld, av = %ld, max = %ld\n", min, tot / i, max); } return 0; } From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 14:22:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA26772 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:22:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-hub.interpath.net (mail-hub.interpath.net [199.72.1.13]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA26765 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:21:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bogus.interpath.net (raleigh-037.interpath.net [207.59.1.37]) by mail-hub.interpath.net (8.6.12/8.6.14) with SMTP id RAA26966; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:19:07 -0400 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19960814212017.0074c684@interpath.com> X-Sender: kpneal@interpath.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:20:17 -0400 To: Joe Greco From: "Kevin P. Neal" Subject: Re: Nightmare. Cc: ulf@lamb.net (Ulf Zimmermann), jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 11:45 AM 8/14/96 -0500, Joe Greco wrote: >> I would go more into the direction of checking if the dump device is a >> mounted file system. Easy check. > >I tend to agree, but wonder if it would not make more sense to tackle this >from a different angle. > >Consider all the programs that could clobber a mounted file system. Would >it make more sense if we somehow protected a mounted disk device from >being clobbered? Isn't this one of the things that secure_level > 0 protects you from? In fact, yes it is. (reference: page 263, 4.4BSD daemon book). >OTOH, this is a can of worms, no matter how you do it. -- XCOMM Kevin P. Neal, Sophomore, Comp. Sci. \ kpneal@interpath.com XCOMM "Corrected!" -- Old Amiga tips file \ kpneal@eos.ncsu.edu XCOMM Visit the House of Retrocomputing: / Perm. Email: XCOMM http://www4.ncsu.edu/~kpneal/www/ / kevinneal@bix.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 14:25:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA26898 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:25:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA26892; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:25:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA28941; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:25:32 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:25:32 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608142125.PAA28941@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams To: Bruce Evans Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, nate@mt.sri.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, ponds!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org, sag.space.lockheed.com!handy@dg-rtp.dg.com Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) In-Reply-To: <199608142113.HAA04204@godzilla.zeta.org.au> References: <199608142113.HAA04204@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The aha driver sets the bus on/off times to 7/4, > so there should be no problems with single UARTs. Well, I've only got a single UART on my box (other than the mouse, but it's not used at all when the overflows occur). > Here is my throwaway lkm and auxiliarly program for testing bus hogging. > Usage: make and load the lkm. This doesn't compile under 2.1.5R. :( Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 14:31:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA27192 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:31:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA27174 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:31:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id HAA04653; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:29:21 +1000 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:29:21 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608142129.HAA04653@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, ulf@lamb.net Subject: Re: Nightmare. Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jkh@time.cdrom.com Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> I would go more into the direction of checking if the dump device is a >> mounted file system. Easy check. >I tend to agree, but wonder if it would not make more sense to tackle this >from a different angle. >Consider all the programs that could clobber a mounted file system. Would >it make more sense if we somehow protected a mounted disk device from >being clobbered? It is already protected. Even root can't even open a mounted disk device. However, mounted disk devices can easiliy be clobbered using an alias. There are about 2^(1+5+3) = 512 possible aliases (raw/buffered, 2^5 slices, 2^3 partitions). This is useful for things like installing new bootblocks on the root partition without having to reboot with a different root partition. Don't fix it. Root knows all about this problem, and never makes mistakes :-). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 14:39:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA27554 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:39:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from guardian.fortress.org (fortress.org [199.84.158.128]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA27545 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:39:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from andrew@localhost) by guardian.fortress.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA13264; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:40:44 -0400 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:40:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Andrew Webster Reply-To: andrew@pubnix.net To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Win95 keyboard Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quick question, What would be involved to make the extra keys on the win95 keyboard behave like real compose keys found on VT220s? This would be really handy, as in this neck of the woods, french is used on a daily basis, and although in X, you can use ALT key to get characters, it doesn't work like a real compose key. Or has this already been done? Regards, Andrew Webster - andrew@pubnix.net - http://www.pubnix.net PubNIX Montreal - Connected to the world - Branche au monde 514-990-5911 - P.O. Box 147, Cote St-Luc, Quebec, H4V 2Y3 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 14:42:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA27711 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:42:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA27704; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:42:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id HAA04949; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:38:12 +1000 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:38:12 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608142138.HAA04949@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, nate@mt.sri.com Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, ponds!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org, sag.space.lockheed.com!handy@dg-rtp.dg.com Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> Here is my throwaway lkm and auxiliarly program for testing bus hogging. >> Usage: make and load the lkm. >This doesn't compile under 2.1.5R. :( It should be easy to fix: cd /usr/src/share/examples/lkm/syscall/module cvs diff -c -r RELENG_2_1_5_RELEASE >/tmp/fixes ... Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 14:47:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA28035 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:47:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA28030 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:47:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id QAA12769; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:30:51 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608142130.QAA12769@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: kpneal@interpath.com (Kevin P. Neal) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:30:50 -0500 (CDT) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, ulf@lamb.net, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19960814212017.0074c684@interpath.com> from "Kevin P. Neal" at Aug 14, 96 05:20:17 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >I tend to agree, but wonder if it would not make more sense to tackle this > >from a different angle. > > > >Consider all the programs that could clobber a mounted file system. Would > >it make more sense if we somehow protected a mounted disk device from > >being clobbered? > > Isn't this one of the things that secure_level > 0 protects you from? > > In fact, yes it is. (reference: page 263, 4.4BSD daemon book). > > >OTOH, this is a can of worms, no matter how you do it. Maybe I don't need to point this out, but... The thread started with some beginners who made a sad mistake. It seems to me that in order to set securelevel > 0, you need to know what you are doing. How do you protect the newbies who are not used to UNIX/FreeBSD and who therefore would not have any idea to set securelevel > 0.. We don't default to a securelevel > 0. ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 14:53:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA28476 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:53:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ginger.vnet.net (root@ginger.vnet.net [166.82.1.69]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA28469 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:53:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vnet.net (elvis.vnet.net [166.82.1.5]) by ginger.vnet.net (8.6.13/8.6.12) with SMTP id QAA14870; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:58:56 -0400 Received: from artist.vnet.net by vnet.net with SMTP id AA20859 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:53:41 -0400 Message-Id: X-Mailer: XFMail 0.4 [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <01BB88FB.2E799770@FRIDAY> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:49:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Edwin Burley To: Cyrus Gray Subject: RE: sysconfig Cc: "'FreeBSD Hackers'" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On 13-Aug-96 Cyrus Gray wrote: >>When installing FreeBSD you get the sysconfig ? I think. >Is there anyway to bring up sysconfig after installing? > --- You can go to /etc and open it up to change something but take care.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 15:04:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA28883 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:04:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-hub.interpath.net (mail-hub.interpath.net [199.72.1.13]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA28864 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:04:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bogus.interpath.net (raleigh-037.interpath.net [207.59.1.37]) by mail-hub.interpath.net (8.6.12/8.6.14) with SMTP id SAA01332; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:02:09 -0400 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19960814220314.0074ba08@interpath.com> X-Sender: kpneal@interpath.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:03:14 -0400 To: Joe Greco From: "Kevin P. Neal" Subject: Re: Nightmare. Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, ulf@lamb.net, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 04:30 PM 8/14/96 -0500, Joe Greco wrote: >> >I tend to agree, but wonder if it would not make more sense to tackle this >> >from a different angle. >> > >> >Consider all the programs that could clobber a mounted file system. Would >> >it make more sense if we somehow protected a mounted disk device from >> >being clobbered? >> >> Isn't this one of the things that secure_level > 0 protects you from? >> >> In fact, yes it is. (reference: page 263, 4.4BSD daemon book). >> >> >OTOH, this is a can of worms, no matter how you do it. > >Maybe I don't need to point this out, but... > >The thread started with some beginners who made a sad mistake. It seems to >me that in order to set securelevel > 0, you need to know what you are >doing. How do you protect the newbies who are not used to UNIX/FreeBSD >and who therefore would not have any idea to set securelevel > 0.. Set it to default with securelevel > 0, but you can't....... >We don't default to a securelevel > 0. .....because of another can of worms that gets opened by securelevel > 0. >> >OTOH, this is a can of worms, no matter how you do it. ^^ pretty much. -- XCOMM Kevin P. Neal, Sophomore, Comp. Sci. \ kpneal@interpath.com XCOMM "Corrected!" -- Old Amiga tips file \ kpneal@eos.ncsu.edu XCOMM Visit the House of Retrocomputing: / Perm. Email: XCOMM http://www4.ncsu.edu/~kpneal/www/ / kevinneal@bix.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 15:31:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA00116 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:31:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from melb.werple.net.au (melb.werple.net.au [203.9.190.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA29989 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:30:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cimaxp1.UUCP (uucp@localhost) by melb.werple.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3/2) with UUCP id HAA00843 for mira!FreeBSD.ORG!freebsd-hackers; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:53:16 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199608142153.HAA00843@melb.werple.net.au> Received: by cimaxp1.cimlogic.com.au; (5.65/1.1.8.2/10Sep95-0953AM) id AA09595; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:54:10 +1000 From: John Birrell Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: lambert.org!terry@melb.werple.net.au (Terry Lambert) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:54:10 +1000 (EST) Cc: fgate.flevel.co.uk!dev@melb.werple.net.au, lambert.org!terry@melb.werple.net.au, india.hp.com!koshy@melb.werple.net.au, FreeBSD.ORG!freebsd-hackers@melb.werple.net.au In-Reply-To: <199608141659.JAA29213@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 14, 96 09:59:57 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > libc_r. build libc_r, and you will have a reentrant (hence the "_r") > libc. The POSIX threading is build into the library (under uthread or > something, I think; you will need to look at the sources to be sure). No. libc_r builds like libc. The directories below /usr/src/lib/libc_r should _not_ be built on their own. Do this.... cd /usr/src/lib/libc_r make depend && make all && make install The resulting libc_r includes all the libc functions, _plus_ the POSIX thread functions. As Amancio said, link to -lc_r (and use -nostdlib to leave out libc). FWIW, libc_r is not fully reentrant (yet) -- the code in libc needs a *lot* of work for this. The commonly used functions are OK (i.e. all the file, memory allocation, socket ones). Things that aren't reentrant are those (like gethostbyname) that don't have arguments that allow them to be made reentrant. For these, *_r functions need to be added to libc_r, but this is best done by rewriting the underlying functions (in libc) so that they do not use static storage and making the traditional function a wrapper with static storage. [I still hold out hope that this work could be shared between FreeBSD and NetBSD (& OpenBSD?) -- I don't see why the libc implementations have to differ. And before Terry (8-)>) starts a whole new thread, the standard libc really should have thread stubs (with weak symbols) to avoid having much of libc mapped into memory a second time in the form of libc_r. Then a standard program would just link against libc as normal. A threaded program would link against libc and then against libpthread which would contain just POSIX thread functions that are linked instead of the stubs. AFAIK, FreeBSD doesn't support weak symbols.] > > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org Regards, -- John Birrell CIMlogic Pty Ltd jb@cimlogic.com.au 119 Cecil Street Ph +61 3 9690 6900 South Melbourne Vic 3205 Fax +61 3 9690 6650 Australia Mob +61 18 353 137 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 15:31:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA00165 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:31:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.76.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA00154; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:31:30 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608142231.PAA00154@freefall.freebsd.org> Received: by cheops.anu.edu.au (1.37.109.16/16.2) id AA202441880; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:31:20 +1000 From: Darren Reed Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:31:20 +1000 (EST) Cc: sos@freebsd.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <32120A61.31DFF4F5@whistle.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Aug 14, 96 10:18:25 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In some mail from Julian Elischer, sie said: > > sos@freebsd.org wrote: > > > > In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who wrote: > > > I'm all for it !! > > It leaves the question what to do with julian's redirect code ?? > > It shares much of the same "features" that ipfw does, and for all I care > > it can go as well.. Most of the features with it is now in ipfilter... > > > Actually it's archie's code, but we really need it.. > and I think I can make a good argument for giving the capacity to > use user-land agents for complicated packet processing. > Possibly we can add a "divert' to ipfilter and get darren to accept it > back.. I've been unwilling to join this conversation, but here I have to ask; what does "divert" do ? btw, on size, it is a very sensitive thing, as there are ongoing ideas and requirements for the code (not the least of which is getting it right and correct and bug-free) to match with the continually evolving field, which is (maybe now) just starting to mature. Some parts of IP Filter are "bare-bones" ish - I provide support in the filter for the person using it to supply their own hooks/patches to make fuller use of it. The .tar.gz for IP Filter includes several other programs, which whilst not directly a part of it, do I feel complement it (others also agree on this) and are thus included. Darren p.s. has anyone ever thought about having a licence which said "this code may not be GPL'd or put under any similar license" ? ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 15:48:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA01287 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:48:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA01273 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:48:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id IAA07377; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:39:14 +1000 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:39:14 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608142239.IAA07377@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, kpneal@interpath.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, ulf@lamb.net Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>Consider all the programs that could clobber a mounted file system. Would >>it make more sense if we somehow protected a mounted disk device from >>being clobbered? >Isn't this one of the things that secure_level > 0 protects you from? >In fact, yes it is. (reference: page 263, 4.4BSD daemon book). No, it is still easy to clobber the disk using an alias. The whole-disk devices (raw and buffered) are the easiest to abuse. Secure_level = 2 of course protects you by preventing all writes to disks. Half baked write protection can cause obscure errors. FreeBSD implements write protection of labels (and also conversion of labels as they are read and written). This works right iff the disk is accessed through the "right" devices (i.e., through all devices except the whole disk devices). Even then it can cause obscure errors: (1) dd if=/dev/rsd0c of=/dev/rsd1c count=64k (2) dd if=/dev/rsd0c of=/dev/rsd1c (3) dd if=/dev/sd0c of=/dev/sd1c count=64k # don't use (4) dd if=/dev/sd0c of=/dev/sd1c # don't use (1) should fail if sd1 is already labeled (unless the write protection is removed using disklabel -W sd1 or equivalent, of course). This is harmless because the copy will abort on the first block before any data is copied. (2) should fail in the same cases as (1), but it will abort on the second block after copying the first block. (3) should fail in the same cases as (1), but the error won't be reported to the application so the copy won't be aborted. Everything except the second block will be copied and the error won't be reported by dd. (4) is like (3) except the damage is smaller since the second block is smaller. The label blocks should be write protected (and converted) at all levels. On "i386" systems, the MBR should also be write protected. Perhaps other blocks should be write protected on other systems. Errors when a write protected block is hit after copying several GB would be very annoying. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 15:51:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA01476 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:51:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA01471; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:51:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA29332; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:51:31 -0600 (MDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:51:31 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608142251.QAA29332@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams To: Bruce Evans Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, nate@mt.sri.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, ponds!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org, sag.space.lockheed.com!handy@dg-rtp.dg.com Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) In-Reply-To: <199608142113.HAA04204@godzilla.zeta.org.au> References: <199608142113.HAA04204@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Here is my throwaway lkm and auxiliarly program for testing bus hogging. .. OK, after doing s/lkm_nullcmd/nosys/, and changing the include files to be the same as the example lkm, it works. > Compile and run the hogtime utility. Start processes to exercise the > bus hog(s), e.g., `dd bs=1024k /dev/null'. Watch the > output from hogtime. For my main disk, here are typical #'s: min = 23, av = 38, max = 58 And for the second disk, which is an old 40M SCSI disk which is only used for swap. min = 23, av = 25, max = 59 Are these #'s in ms? Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 15:52:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA01549 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:52:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.2.144.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA01540; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:52:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA06591; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:51:51 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:51:50 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: Darren Reed cc: Julian Elischer , sos@freebsd.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? In-Reply-To: <199608142231.PAA00154@freefall.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Darren Reed wrote: > In some mail from Julian Elischer, sie said: > > > > sos@freebsd.org wrote: > > > > > > In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who wrote: > > > > > I'm all for it !! > > > It leaves the question what to do with julian's redirect code ?? > > I've been unwilling to join this conversation, but here I have to ask; > what does "divert" do ? In fact the divert functionality is already in ipfilter. It simply takes a packet and diverts it to a nominated interface (e.g. tun0) rather than allowing it to pass through the normal routing tables. Danny From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 16:02:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA01990 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:02:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.2.144.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA01978 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:02:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA06607; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:02:34 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:02:33 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? In-Reply-To: <199608142231.PAA00154@freefall.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well, it looks like I'm the lone voice in favour of ipfw, for a specific purpose, anyway. I much prefer Poul-Henning's (partial)rewrite of ipfw over Ugen's syntax, but am in the process of converting a firewall to ipfilter from Ugen's ipfw (FreeBSD 2.1.0). There are a couple of things which I prefer in ipfw-current over ipfilter: * The ability to number each rule and insert rules into the middle of the rule table without the need for flush/re-install. * The clear accounting details available which are listed by rule number. I'm currently using the latter to do accounting for my ISP business. Because each rule is numbered, it is easy (in perl) to relate rule numbers to customers. I'll confess that I have not investigated the ipfilter accounting yet, but I *do* like Poul-Henning's rule numbers in ipfw. Any chance of having numbered rules, Darren? Danny From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 16:35:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA03015 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:35:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pdx1.world.net (pdx1.world.net [192.243.32.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA03009 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:35:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from suburbia.net (suburbia.net [203.4.184.1]) by pdx1.world.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA13292; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:37:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (proff@localhost) by suburbia.net (8.7.4/Proff-950810) id JAA22052; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:34:44 +1000 From: Julian Assange Message-Id: <199608142334.JAA22052@suburbia.net> Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: danny@panda.hilink.com.au (Daniel O'Callaghan) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:34:44 +1000 (EST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Daniel O'Callaghan" at Aug 15, 96 09:02:33 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I'll confess that I have not investigated the ipfilter accounting yet, > but I *do* like Poul-Henning's rule numbers in ipfw. Any chance of > having numbered rules, Darren? > > Danny I agree. I think the rule numbers are a great asset. Asside from flushing /accounting issues, it makes insertion of rules and rule flow very clear. -- "Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies, The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis, _God in the Dock_ +---------------------+--------------------+----------------------------------+ |Julian Assange RSO | PO Box 2031 BARKER | Secret Analytic Guy Union | |proff@suburbia.net | VIC 3122 AUSTRALIA | finger for PGP key hash ID = | |proff@gnu.ai.mit.edu | FAX +61-3-98199066 | 0619737CCC143F6DEA73E27378933690 | +---------------------+--------------------+----------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 16:50:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA03505 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:50:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.76.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA03500 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:50:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608142350.QAA03500@freefall.freebsd.org> Received: by cheops.anu.edu.au (1.37.109.16/16.2) id AA239006612; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:50:12 +1000 From: Darren Reed Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: danny@panda.hilink.com.au (Daniel O'Callaghan) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:50:12 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Daniel O'Callaghan" at Aug 15, 96 09:02:33 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In some mail from Daniel O'Callaghan, sie said: [...] > There are a couple of things which I prefer in ipfw-current over ipfilter: > * The ability to number each rule and insert rules into the middle of the > rule table without the need for flush/re-install. This is possible (and has been for some time), but perhaps not clearly documented. For example, assuming you had (say) 30 or 40 rules for each of input & output and wanted to add one for NTP at a particular point, you can use a rule of the form: @23 pass in on ed0 proto tcp/udp from any to any port = 123 to insert a new rule at position 23 for the input list of filters. Or you might add it to your IP Filter configuration file and load it like this: ipf -If new.conf -s where it loads the new configuration into the "inactive" list and then switches the active list to the new set. If you're making permanent changes, then I'd recommend the later (you do want to be sure you get the same ruleset when you reboot, right ?) and use the former for the dynamic type thing. [...] > but I *do* like Poul-Henning's rule numbers in ipfw. Any chance of > having numbered rules, Darren? This reminds me of programming in BASIC, way back, when you needed to use line numbers for GOTO's, etc, and eventually, you will run into the same "problem" and need to renumber. I really don't see a win from this feature. Darren From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 17:37:42 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA05465 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:37:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA05460; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:37:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id KAA11973; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:28:58 +1000 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:28:58 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608150028.KAA11973@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, nate@mt.sri.com Subject: Re: sio issues (silo overflows on a pentium, locked in ttywait, etc...) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, ponds!rivers@freefall.freebsd.org, sag.space.lockheed.com!handy@dg-rtp.dg.com Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> Here is my throwaway lkm and auxiliarly program for testing bus hogging. >.. >> Compile and run the hogtime utility. Start processes to exercise the >> bus hog(s), e.g., `dd bs=1024k /dev/null'. Watch the >> output from hogtime. >For my main disk, here are typical #'s: >min = 23, av = 38, max = 58 >And for the second disk, which is an old 40M SCSI disk which is only >used for swap. >min = 23, av = 25, max = 59 >Are these #'s in ms? us. 1 ms is a long time. They are fairly large (I guess they are typical for ISA), but not a problem. Only the DMA burst timing should matter. It accumulates for multiple DMA devices. On my ASUS-P133 NCR'810 system: idle: 13, 13, 16 reading rsd0 (bs=64k) 13, 14, 19-21 reading rsd0 && active de21040 13, 14, 20-22 reading rsd0 && rfd1 13, 15, 22-24 Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 17:56:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA06158 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:56:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA06150 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:56:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA16929; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:55:09 -0700 (PDT) To: Darren Reed cc: danny@panda.hilink.com.au (Daniel O'Callaghan), hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:50:12 +1000." <199608142350.QAA03500@freefall.freebsd.org> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:55:08 -0700 Message-ID: <16927.840070508@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > This reminds me of programming in BASIC, way back, when you needed to > use line numbers for GOTO's, etc, and eventually, you will run into > the same "problem" and need to renumber. I really don't see a win Ah, but then all good basics eventually had a RENUMBER command (even if hacked out by some 3rd party) for handling this for you. If you want to implement it in a compatible fashion, I seem to remember that it generally took base and increment arguments. :-) :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 18:12:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA07021 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:12:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pinky.junction.net (pinky.junction.net [199.166.227.12]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA07005 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:12:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sidhe.memra.com (sidhe.memra.com [199.166.227.105]) by pinky.junction.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA11967 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 17:24:26 -0700 Received: from localhost (michael@localhost) by sidhe.memra.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA10073 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:08:20 -0700 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:08:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Dillon To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: L2TP [Was: Re: What do I want?] (fwd) Message-ID: Organization: Memra Software Inc. - Internet consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 16:31:26 -0400 From: Paul Ferguson Reply-To: inet-access@earth.com To: francis yeung Cc: inet-access@earth.com Subject: Re: L2TP [Was: Re: What do I want?] Resent-Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 14:32:11 -0600 (MDT) Resent-From: inet-access@earth.com At 11:39 PM 8/13/96 +0000, francis yeung wrote: > > Did Cisco release a public domain port of L2F for FreeBSD? Not to my knowledge. > Or port of L2F for any OS platform ? Nope. > What can I locate more info about L2F and Cisco's > venture with Microsoft on Mr. Gate's pptp ? > No idea about any venture with Microsloth, but the L2F specification is located at: http://www.internic.net/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-pppext-l2f-02.txt There's also more information on L2F contained in the `Cisco IOS Software Release 11.2' (Product Bulletin #487) bulletin: http://www.cisco.com/warp/public/732/112/487_pp.htm - paul > Thanks. > > Francis -- Paul Ferguson || || Consulting Engineering || || Reston, Virginia USA |||| |||| tel: +1.703.716.9538 ..:||||||:..:||||||:.. e-mail: pferguso@cisco.com c i s c o S y s t e m s ============================== ISP Mailing List ============================== Email ``unsubscribe'' to inet-access-request@earth.com to be removed. Only quote enough text in your message to give proper context. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 18:17:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA07506 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:17:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA07495 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:17:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by mail.cdsnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA06011 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:17:13 -0700 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:17:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: New routed weirdness. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Witness the following netstat -r output from a 8/14 sup system. med-pm4-017 med-pm4 UGH 0 7 ep1 med-pm4-018/31 med-pm4 UGc 0 953 ep1 med-pm5-000/31 med-pm5 UGc 0 25 ep1 med-pm5-002/29 med-pm5 UGc 0 22 ep1 med-pm5-008 0:c0:5:1:3c:1f UHLW 0 86 ep1 836 med-pm5-009 0:c0:5:1:3c:1f UHLW 0 23 ep1 838 med-pm5-010/31 med-pm5 UGc 0 0 ep1 med-pm5-013 med-pm5 UGH 0 428 ep1 med-pm5-014/31 med-pm5 UGc 0 0 ep1 med-pm5-015 chop UGH 0 0 vx0 med-pm5-016 chop UGH 0 0 vx0 The med-pm? boxes are Livingston PM's, the med-pm?-??? are PPP dialin users. The PM's run RIP V1. But if I read this correctly, somehow I'm picking up RIP packets where the host is advertised as having a netmask of 29 bits or 31 bits, rather than 32 bits. However, I don't see how this is possible. I guess I need some suggestions on how to track down specifically what's wrong. has anybody else running the new routed seen this? Heck, I'm not even sure if the netstat output even makes sense, since it seems to be showing a mix of proxy arp and routes, when the machines are all set up identically, and the users are all configured identically, it seems like it should be one or the other. Anyway, I guess I can tcpdump some data, and muck around with rtquery, but I'm curious if anybody's seen this behaviour with the PM's. It only seems to show up on routes to PM connected users, everything else seems to putt along just fine. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 18:35:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA09257 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:35:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.2.144.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA09245 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:35:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA06886; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:34:58 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:34:56 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: Darren Reed cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? In-Reply-To: <199608142350.JAA06711@panda.hilink.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Darren Reed wrote: > In some mail from Daniel O'Callaghan, sie said: > @23 pass in on ed0 proto tcp/udp from any to any port = 123 > > to insert a new rule at position 23 for the input list of filters. Yes, I just noticed a reference to this. > [...] > > but I *do* like Poul-Henning's rule numbers in ipfw. Any chance of > > having numbered rules, Darren? > > This reminds me of programming in BASIC, way back, when you needed to > use line numbers for GOTO's, etc, and eventually, you will run into > the same "problem" and need to renumber. I really don't see a win > from this feature. Well, yes, it is a bit like programming in BASIC, which is why I've spread the rule numbers out in my use of them. I guess my rule-generating perl script could use the rules themselves to match my reporting rules, rather than using rule numbers. Danny From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 18:43:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA10222 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:43:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA10212 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:43:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <15219(7)>; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:43:01 PDT Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177517>; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:42:50 -0700 X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.7 5/3/96 To: Jaye Mathisen cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: New routed weirdness. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:17:12 PDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:42:36 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <96Aug14.184250pdt.177517@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message you write: >However, I don't see how this is possible. I guess I need some >suggestions on how to track down specifically what's wrong. Try running routed with "-T /tmp/routed.trace -t"? Add another "-t" or kill -USR1 routed to up the trace level. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 18:57:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA11327 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:57:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from arl-img-3.compuserve.com (arl-img-3.compuserve.com [149.174.217.133]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA11322 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:57:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by arl-img-3.compuserve.com (8.6.10/5.950515) id VAA01491; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 21:56:48 -0400 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 21:49:35 -0400 From: Jan Knepper <106030.3360@compuserve.com> Subject: Re: HP 100VG support To: Michael Hancock , "[FreeBSD Hackers]" Message-ID: <199608142156_MC1-877-70C9@compuserve.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Hancock stand accused for writing: /* Any volunteers? Tom Gidden wrote: > > Hi, > > I posted here earlier about HP 100VG cards (specifically, J8525A), and got > kind replies about the possibility of writing some drivers. Unfo. I had to > say `Thanks but no thanks', due to our short-term project. > > Now, my supervisor has said that he would be more than happy to test drivers > for these cards... so I'm asking again! > > We've got 8 of these cards (As supplied with the HP Vectra XU 6/150), and a > 100VG hub. We've also got ATM coming into the lab, along with an internal > IEEE 1355 eval net. Hopefully, Firewire's coming soon, too. */ The following is a little of the conversation between Koshy and me: /* > Sorry for dropping in on you like this, but Michael Hancock mentioned you (I > guess) while he was talking about getting a driver for the HP 100 VG PCI Lan > Adapter for FreeBSD. I was able to get hold of a J2585 card and was thinking of putting in the effort to port the freely available CRYNWR packet driver to FreeBSD as there seemed to some degree of interest for this card on the list. Now I'll have to do this on my own time and also I don't have access to any official programming information about the chipset and card. I was planning to reconstruct it from the dos assembler sources in the CRYNWR packet collection. Further we don't have a 100VG network here anyway, so those parts would need help to test/develop. So thats where I am at the moment. If you are willing to help out it would be great. If you are in a better position to contribute than I am, please feel free to take the baton. I'm in the middle of a time crunch at the moment! Koshy My personal opinions only! */ So, I am certainly interrested in building a driver for a J2585A or HP 100 VG. The thing is that I will need a few pointers to get started. I was hoping to get these from Koshy, but I have not heard from him yet. I might as well have lost some e-mail. Anyone that know about writing ethernet drivers that could give me a hit to get started? Thanks! Jan Knepper From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 19:58:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA17450 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 19:58:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA17442 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 19:58:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (michaelh@localhost) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.7.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id CAA13881; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 02:58:03 GMT Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:58:03 +0900 (JST) From: Michael Hancock Reply-To: Michael Hancock To: Jan Knepper <106030.3360@compuserve.com> cc: "[FreeBSD Hackers]" Subject: Re: HP 100VG support In-Reply-To: <199608142156_MC1-877-70C9@compuserve.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 14 Aug 1996, Jan Knepper wrote: > I was able to get hold of a J2585 card and was thinking of putting in the > effort to port the freely available CRYNWR packet driver to FreeBSD as > there seemed to some degree of interest for this card on the list. [snip] > So, I am certainly interrested in building a driver for a J2585A or HP 100 > VG. The thing is that I will need a few pointers to get started. I was > hoping to get these from Koshy, but I have not heard from him yet. I might > as well have lost some e-mail. > > Anyone that know about writing ethernet drivers that could give me a hit to > get started? I haven't written an ethernet driver, but if were to do one I'd start with a driver such as if_ep.c and if_vx.c for an example and then track down the CRYNWR HP 100VG driver to figure out what it does. There is support for HP Lan+ in if_ed.c and this might also help. I'm assuming specs for the card are not easy to obtain. Regards, Mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 20:47:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA21973 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:47:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA21961; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:47:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id UAA16618; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:45:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma016612; Wed Aug 14 20:45:22 1996 Message-ID: <32129D22.2C67412E@whistle.com> Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:44:34 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b4 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Daniel O'Callaghan" CC: Darren Reed , sos@freebsd.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Daniel O'Callaghan wrote: > > On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Darren Reed wrote: > > > In some mail from Julian Elischer, sie said: > > > > > > sos@freebsd.org wrote: > > > > > > > > In reply to Jordan K. Hubbard who wrote: > > > > > > > I'm all for it !! > > > > It leaves the question what to do with julian's redirect code ?? > > > > I've been unwilling to join this conversation, but here I have to ask; > > what does "divert" do ? > > In fact the divert functionality is already in ipfilter. It simply takes > a packet and diverts it to a nominated interface (e.g. tun0) rather than > allowing it to pass through the normal routing tables. No, that isn't quite what divert does.. divert is a bit more powerful than that it uses a divert socket type to pass the packets up to the user. this allows other info to be passed as well.. the main difference is that you can using the divert socket, re-inject the packet back at the point that it was taken out, and control to a greater extent what happens to it.. divert sockets are an experiment which may or may not survive but we have found that they allow us to do things that we couldn't do using the tunnel interface. firstly sockets are inherrently packet oriented, so you can do 'sendto' on them for example to give different sematics to what happens to the packet after re-injection. there are other problems that are solved by this approach. we looked at tun interfaces and decided that it was banging a square peg into a round hole. each divert socket can be bound to a differnt port, so you can divert different packets to different sockets (with tun, how do you do that?) the man page follows: DIVERT(4) FreeBSD Programmer's Manual DIVERT(4) NAME divert - kernel packet diversion mechanism SYNOPSIS #include #include int socket(PF_INET, SOCK_RAW, IPPROTO_DIVERT) DESCRIPTION Divert sockets are similar to raw IP sockets, except that they can be bound to a specific divert port via the bind(2) system call. The IP ad- dress in the bind is ignored; only the port number is significant. A di- vert socket bound to a divert port will receive all packets diverted to that port by some (here unspecified) kernel mechanism(s). Packets may also be written to a divert port, in which case they re-enter kernel IP packet processing. Divert sockets are normally used in conjunction with FreeBSD's packet filtering implementation and the ipfw(8) program. By reading from and writing to a divert socket, matching packets can be passed through an ar- bitrary ``filter'' as they travel through the host machine, special rout- ing tricks can be done, etc. READING PACKETS Packets are diverted either as they are ``incoming'' or ``outgoing.'' Incoming packets are diverted after reception on an IP interface, whereas outgoing packets are diverted before next hop forwarding. Diverted packets may be read unaltered via read(2), recv(2), or recvfrom(2). In the latter case, the address returned will have its port set to the divert port and the IP address set to the (first) address of the interface on which the packet was recieved if the packet was incom- ing, or INADDR_ANY if the packet was outgoing. WRITING PACKETS Writing to a divert socket is similar to writing to a raw IP socket; the packet is injected ``as is'' into the normal kernel IP packet processing and minimal error checking is done. Packets are written as either incom- ing or outgoing: if write(2) or send(2) is used to deliver the packet, or if sendto(2) is used with a destination IP address of INADDR_ANY, then the packet is treated as if it were outgoing, i.e., destined for a non- local address. Otherwise, the packet is assumed to be incoming and full packet routing is done. In the latter case, the IP address specified must match the address of some local interface. This is to indicate on which interface the packet ``arrived.'' Normally, packets read as incoming should be written as incoming; simi- larly for outgoing packets. When reading and then writing back packets, passing the same socket address supplied by recvfrom(2) unmodified to sendto(2) simplifies things. LOOP AVOIDANCE To avoid having a packet sent from a divert socket rediverted back to the same socket, use the sendto(2) system call supplying any non-zero desti- nation port number. This indicates to ipfw(8) and other diverting mecha- nisms to not divert the packet back to the same socket it was written from. Since ipfw checks incoming as well as outgoing packets, a packet written as incoming may get checked twice. Loop avoidance will be enabled for both checks. DETAILS To enable divert sockets, your kernel must be compiled with the option IPDIVERT. If a packet is diverted but no socket is bound to the port, or if IPDIVERT is not enabled in the kernel, the packet is dropped. Incoming packet fragments which get diverted are fully reassembled before delivery; the diversion of any one fragment causes the entire packet to get diverted. If different fragments divert to different ports, then which port ultimately gets chosen is unpredictable. Packets are recieved and sent unchanged, so all header fields are in net- work order. Minimal sanity checking of transmitted packets is done so length and checksum fields should be pre-computed, with the exception that packets written as outgoing will have their IP header checksums overwritten with the correct value. Packets written as incoming and hav- ing incorrect checksums will be dropped. Binding to port numbers less than 1024 requires super-user access. ERRORS Writing to a divert socket can return these errors, along with the usual errors possible when writing raw packets: [EINVAL] The packet had an invalid header, or the IP options in the packet and the socket options set were incompatible. [EADDRNOTAVAIL] The destination address contained an IP address not equal to INADDR_ANY that was not associated with any interface. SEE ALSO ipfw(8), socket(2), bind(2), sendto(2). recvfrom(2), BUGS This is an attempt to provide a clean way for user mode processes to im- plement things like address translation, but it's not that clean and it's too dependent on ipfw(8). It's questionable whether incoming fragments should be reassembled before being diverted. If some fragments don't get routed through the local ma- chine, the packet is lost. AUTHOR Archie Cobbs , Whistle Communications Corp. BSD June 18, 1996 2 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 20:47:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA21985 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:47:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from post.io.org (post.io.org [198.133.36.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA21969 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:47:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zap.io.org (taob@zap.io.org [198.133.36.81]) by post.io.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA02932; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:46:50 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:46:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Brian Tao To: Phil E Taylor cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSD/OS webperf notes, anybody want to test FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <16523614000363@webleicester.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 13 Aug 1996, Phil E Taylor wrote: > > Also looking at the microsoft document referred to by the document below, > http://www.microsoft.com/infoserv/haynes1.htm I saw an interesting > thing in the footnote. Feh, I got this trying to check out the above URL: Too many users There are too many connected users. Please try again later. -- Brian Tao (BT300, taob@io.org, taob@ican.net) Senior Systems and Network Administrator, Internet Canada Corp. "Though this be madness, yet there is method in't" From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 20:55:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA22843 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:55:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (root@orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.41]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA22825 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:54:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (gpalmer@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (8.7.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA02578; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:53:32 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: orion.webspan.net: Host gpalmer@localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Michael Hancock cc: Jan Knepper <106030.3360@compuserve.com>, "[FreeBSD Hackers]" From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: HP 100VG support In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:58:03 +0900." Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:53:31 -0400 Message-ID: <2574.840081211@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Hancock wrote in message ID : > I'm assuming specs for the card are not easy to obtain. Maybe Jordan will remember better, but I think we spoke to someone from HP at CeBIT 95 who indicated that they would supply spec's... Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 21:31:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA27848 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 21:31:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA27835 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 21:31:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA00734 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 06:31:25 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id GAA17720 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 06:30:44 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id AAA18576; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 00:53:45 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608142253.AAA18576@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 00:53:44 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: ; from Developer on Aug 14, 1996 9:25:42 +0100 References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Developer: > Is it safe to install on a system that isn`t running threads without > causing any harm? Do I just do a make install? A "make install" will put them in /usr/lib that's all. As long as you don't link with one of them, your system should behave as it has always been... -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 21:31:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA27904 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 21:31:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA27888 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 21:31:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA00732 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 06:31:25 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id GAA17722 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 06:30:45 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id AAA18601; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 00:56:22 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608142256.AAA18601@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 00:56:22 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: <199608141703.KAA29244@phaeton.artisoft.com>; from Terry Lambert on Aug 14, 1996 10:03:02 -0700 References: <199608141703.KAA29244@phaeton.artisoft.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Terry Lambert: > > pthreads is included in /usr/src/lib/libc_r, not in ports. > > In -current, right? What about before -current? Before -current, you'd have to get pthread by yourself and worry about some functions in libc not aware about threads... -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 22:06:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA02997 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 22:06:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pinky.junction.net (pinky.junction.net [199.166.227.12]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA02990 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 22:06:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sidhe.memra.com (sidhe.memra.com [199.166.227.105]) by pinky.junction.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id VAA14899 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 21:18:47 -0700 Received: from localhost (michael@localhost) by sidhe.memra.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA12238 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 22:02:39 -0700 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 22:02:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Dillon To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: [fwd] Re: L2TP [Was: Re: What do I want?] (fwd) Message-ID: Organization: Memra Software Inc. - Internet consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 20:39:34 -0400 From: Paul Ferguson Reply-To: inet-access@earth.com To: inet-access@earth.com Subject: [fwd] Re: L2TP [Was: Re: What do I want?] Resent-Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:40:12 -0600 (MDT) Resent-From: inet-access@earth.com Andy couldn't post to the list, so I've forwarded this for him. - paul >X-Authentication-Warning: vandys-lap.cisco.com: Host localhost.cisco.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol >To: Paul Ferguson >cc: francis yeung , inet-access@earth.com >Subject: Re: L2TP [Was: Re: What do I want?] >Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 15:16:00 -0700 >From: Andy Valencia > >[Paul Ferguson writes:] > >>> Did Cisco release a public domain port of L2F for FreeBSD? >>Not to my knowledge. >>> Or port of L2F for any OS platform ? >>Nope. > >I have a consultant writing an unencumbered version of L2F NAS side running on >Linux (using termios and sockets). We will make this available to help people >jump start any L2F activities (or just better understand the protocol). I don't >know exactly when the code will be available, but will certainly post a note to >comp.dcom.sys.cisco. > >>> What can I locate more info about L2F and Cisco's >>> venture with Microsoft on Mr. Gate's pptp ? >>No idea about any venture with Microsloth, but the L2F specification >>is located at: >> http://www.internic.net/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-pppext-l2f-02.txt > >The merging of L2F and PPTP is being done under the auspices of the IETF; the >mailing list for this is l2tp-request@newbridge.com. > > Regards, > Andy Valencia > ============================== ISP Mailing List ============================== Email ``unsubscribe'' to inet-access-request@earth.com to be removed. Changed email addresses? Use the ``unsubscribe '' form. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 23:12:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA09681 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:12:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pinky.junction.net (pinky.junction.net [199.166.227.12]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA09674 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:12:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sidhe.memra.com (sidhe.memra.com [199.166.227.105]) by pinky.junction.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA15710 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 22:25:15 -0700 Received: from localhost (michael@localhost) by sidhe.memra.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA12882 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:09:09 -0700 Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:09:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Dillon To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: RE: What do I want? PPTP (fwd) Message-ID: Organization: Memra Software Inc. - Internet consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 21:33:59 -0500 From: Sunny Vanderbeck Reply-To: inet-access@earth.com To: "'inet-access@earth.com'" Subject: RE: What do I want? Resent-Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 21:33:55 -0600 (MDT) Resent-From: inet-access@earth.com Where can I locate the sample source implementation for PPTP ? http://www.datareturn.com/techfocus/ has a link to it from the 'resources page' (don't remember it offhand) -Sunny ============================== ISP Mailing List ============================== Email ``unsubscribe'' to inet-access-request@earth.com to be removed. Think carefully about your reply -- is private email more approriate? From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 23:33:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA11665 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:33:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from teil.soft.net (tata_elxsi.soft.net [164.164.10.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA11648 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:33:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by teil.soft.net (920330.SGI/920502.SGI.JF) for hackers@freebsd.org id AA29969; Thu, 15 Aug 96 12:01:26 -0800 From: pcn@teil.soft.net (P.C.Narasimha Reddy) Message-Id: <9608152001.AA29969@teil.soft.net> Subject: 3com Eterlink III To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 12:01:26 -0800 (PST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk hi I am having problems in using a 3Com EtherLink III 3C509B card with FreeBSD. when the card is being probed by the "ep" device driver, the following messages are being printed at boot time: one card found card in test mode Erase the Pencil mark eeprom failed ep0 not found at 0x300 i had configured the card using the software provided along with the card with IRQ 10 and address 0x300, and am using the same values in my config file. i have another Dlink Ethernet card already in my system using the following configuration: "ed0" IRQ "5" address "0x320" and its working fine. I want to put the 3Com card also so that i can have two cards on the system. can anyone please help me by advising how to go about with this problem? thanx in advance regards -- )---, , * / )---, .---- \|\|| / / ,--, @_ /( ; )--,--, /--, ,--, / / / -- ||||/ / (_(__(_/ (/ )/|/ / (_/ (_(__(_ /---' (____ /7 |||||/ / |||||||/`-.---- home work (SENIOR ENGINEER D&D) \-' ||||||||| c/o C.K.Puri TATA ELXSI (I) LTD -/||||||||\ 81F,17E Main Rd., Whitefield Road, /||||||\ Koramangala 6th Block, Mahadevapura Post, //|||\|--------- Bangalore 95.INDIA Hoody, Bangalore 48.INDIA || | \ Phone 553 1917 Phone 8452016/84522017/8452185 / | |\ \ __/ / / _| ) email: pcn@teil.soft.net ## NO POLITICS PLEASE ## /,_/,__/_/,__/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Aug 14 23:59:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA14100 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:59:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from paloalto.access.hp.com (daemon@paloalto.access.hp.com [15.254.56.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA14091 for ; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:59:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from srmail.sr.hp.com by paloalto.access.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA293272353; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:59:13 -0700 Received: from hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com by srmail.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA098202347; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:59:08 -0700 Received: from mina.sr.hp.com by hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com with SMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA203732347; Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:59:07 -0700 Message-Id: <199608150659.AA203732347@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com> To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 14 Aug 1996 03:56:53 PDT." Date: Wed, 14 Aug 1996 23:59:06 -0700 From: Darryl Okahata Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > a) Write a filesystem which understands tar files natively. Note: there may > be a slight performance penalty for folks running with their root > partitions mounted on a TARFS - perhaps we could note this somewhere. While you're at it, how about tar-on-a-tape-FS? There's an MSDOS driver that makes a tape drive look like a disk drive. Why not have something similar for FreeBSD? People can then use their tape drive as a disk. Imagine having the root disk on tape! "Infinite storage!" (1001 evil ;-}) What about ZIPFS, or CPIOFS? ZOOFS? ARCFS? LBRFS? Punch-tape-FS is possible, but it wouldn't be politically correct -- too many trees would get cut down. ;-} -- Darryl Okahata Internet: darrylo@sr.hp.com DISCLAIMER: this message is the author's personal opinion and does not constitute the support, opinion, or policy of Hewlett-Packard, or of the little green men that have been following him all day. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 00:53:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA19887 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 00:53:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA19877 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 00:53:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA28551; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:03:08 +0300 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:03:08 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Ollivier Robert cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability In-Reply-To: <199608142256.AAA18601@keltia.freenix.fr> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Ollivier Robert wrote: > According to Terry Lambert: > > > pthreads is included in /usr/src/lib/libc_r, not in ports. > > > > In -current, right? What about before -current? > > Before -current, you'd have to get pthread by yourself and worry about some > functions in libc not aware about threads... Hmmm... I do not speak for anyone but myself but weren't they eing developed on a 2.1.0 or -stable box? They work (at least worked) with stable for me. Sander > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr > FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 02:33:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA27481 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 02:33:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE [137.226.225.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA27472 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 02:32:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by Campino.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.DE (RBI-Z-5/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA07887 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:28:25 +0200 Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA14164 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:41:22 +0200 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:41:22 +0200 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199608150941.LAA14164@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: sysinstall Q wrt disk geometry Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I installed (tried to) 0801-SNAP on a 1 GB Fujitsu (1033 64 32) recently and since it's the third drive I have problem booting it from a bootmanager. I seems that OSBS20B8 sees the partition but doesn't find an operating system when booting it. (OSBS20B8 writes a drive number in front of the partition found and it sees any partition on all three drives). What I wonder is if sysinstall (fdisk) has changed policy recently wrt disk geometry. Does it now silently use 'faked' geometry figures instead of the 'true' geometry? In former sysinstalls I can remeber that I got a warning to use the 'G' option but this time (I may be wrong) I don't remeber having seen this warning. Instead it seemed to me that fdisk silently assumed 1033 64 32 instead of leaving me a chance to decide which geometry to use. As a result of this it looks like OSBS20B8 assuming the 'true' geometry it obtained from the adaptec bios while the disk is fdisked with the faked geometry. --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 02:52:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA28240 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 02:52:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA28233 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 02:52:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minnow.render.com (minnow.render.com [193.195.178.1]) by minnow.render.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA20241; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:47:35 +0100 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:47:35 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Darryl Okahata cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-Reply-To: <199608150659.AA203732347@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 14 Aug 1996, Darryl Okahata wrote: > > a) Write a filesystem which understands tar files natively. Note: there may > > be a slight performance penalty for folks running with their root > > partitions mounted on a TARFS - perhaps we could note this somewhere. > > While you're at it, how about tar-on-a-tape-FS? There's an MSDOS > driver that makes a tape drive look like a disk drive. Why not have > something similar for FreeBSD? People can then use their tape drive as > a disk. Imagine having the root disk on tape! "Infinite storage!" > (1001 evil ;-}) > > What about ZIPFS, or CPIOFS? ZOOFS? ARCFS? LBRFS? Punch-tape-FS > is possible, but it wouldn't be politically correct -- too many trees > would get cut down. ;-} More seriously, all these and more could be easily implemented using a decent USERFS which would allow a simple filesystem to be implemented in usermode. -- Doug Rabson, Microsoft RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 171 734 3761 FAX: +44 171 734 6426 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 02:54:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA28306 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 02:54:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.76.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id CAA28301 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 02:53:57 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608150953.CAA28301@freefall.freebsd.org> Received: by cheops.anu.edu.au (1.37.109.16/16.2) id AA214482828; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 19:53:48 +1000 From: Darren Reed Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 19:53:48 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <16927.840070508@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 14, 96 05:55:08 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In some mail from Jordan K. Hubbard, sie said: > > > This reminds me of programming in BASIC, way back, when you needed to > > use line numbers for GOTO's, etc, and eventually, you will run into > > the same "problem" and need to renumber. I really don't see a win > > Ah, but then all good basics eventually had a RENUMBER command (even > if hacked out by some 3rd party) for handling this for you. If you > want to implement it in a compatible fashion, I seem to remember that > it generally took base and increment arguments. :-) :-) Are you suggesting a "renumber" option for ipfw might be a good idea ? :-) Darren (do we have to continue to embaress ourselves about how well we know how to program in real BASIC ?:-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 02:57:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA28553 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 02:57:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fgate.flevel.co.uk (root@fgate.flevel.co.uk [194.6.101.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id CAA28548 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 02:57:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dev@localhost) by fgate.flevel.co.uk (8.7.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA09437; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:02:27 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:02:27 +0100 (BST) From: Developer To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: Michael Smith , Paul Richards , lada@ws2301.gud.siemens.co.at, philip_milne@il.us.swissbank.com, hackers@freebsd.org, armando_ferreira@il.us.swissbank.com, charlie_conklin@il.us.swissbank.com Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-Reply-To: <14039.840020213@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 14 Aug 1996, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > a) Write a filesystem which understands tar files natively. Note: there may > be a slight performance penalty for folks running with their root > partitions mounted on a TARFS - perhaps we could note this somewhere. Well, this would be handy, but what would be really useful is making ufs understand both tar and tar.gz files, so we could do things like:- cd fred.tar.gz ls file1 file2 file3 cp file1 /tmp cp /tmp/file1b file1 Etc.. I remember a similar thing on the Amiga that handled lha files in this way.. but lha compressed each file in the archive seperatley so the whole archive did not need to be de-compressed to get to a single file. Regards, Trefor S. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 03:24:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA29743 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 03:24:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.76.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA29735 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 03:24:05 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608151024.DAA29735@freefall.freebsd.org> Received: by cheops.anu.edu.au (1.37.109.16/16.2) id AA220094637; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:23:57 +1000 From: Darren Reed Subject: DIVERT To: julian@whistle.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:23:57 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <32129D22.2C67412E@whistle.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Aug 14, 96 08:44:34 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In some mail from Julian Elischer, sie said: > > No, that isn't quite what divert does.. > divert is a bit more powerful than that > it uses a divert socket type to pass the packets up to the user. > this allows other info to be passed as well.. > the main difference is that you can using the divert socket, re-inject the > packet back at the point that it was taken out, and control to a greater > extent what happens to it.. > > divert sockets are an experiment which may or may not survive > but we have found that they allow us to do things that we couldn't do > using the tunnel interface. > > firstly sockets are inherrently packet oriented, so you can do > 'sendto' on them for example to give different sematics to what > happens to the packet after re-injection. > > there are other problems that are solved by this approach. > we looked at tun interfaces and decided that it was banging a square > peg into a round hole. What was/is the aim of it ? To me it sounds a lot like what screend does, except there is a way to open multiple instances for intercepting packets. Although, I don't quite see how they fit in to the operational scheme of things. > each divert socket can be bound to a differnt port, so you can divert > different packets to different sockets (with tun, how do you do that?) Multiple tun devices ? Darren From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 04:36:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA03446 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 04:36:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from panda.hilink.com.au (panda.hilink.com.au [203.2.144.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA03439 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 04:36:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from danny@localhost) by panda.hilink.com.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA07475; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 21:35:53 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 21:35:51 +1000 (EST) From: "Daniel O'Callaghan" To: Darren Reed cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? In-Reply-To: <199608150953.CAA28301@freefall.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Darren Reed wrote: > > (do we have to continue to embaress ourselves about how well we know how > to program in real BASIC ?:-) > Didn't all real hackers start out by programming TRS-80's and Apple IIe's back in '78/'79? I've still got some of my Applesoft and 6502 programs. I just don't have a computer to run them on. Danny From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 06:02:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA06338 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 06:02:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from casparc.ppp.net (casparc.ppp.net [194.64.12.35]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA06333 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 06:02:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ernie by casparc.ppp.net with uucp (Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0ur23n-000I38C; Thu, 15 Aug 96 15:02 MET DST Received: by ernie.kts.org (Smail3.1.29.1 #4) id m0ur1NX-000010C; Thu, 15 Aug 96 14:18 MET DST Message-Id: From: hm@kts.org (Hellmuth Michaelis) Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: danny@panda.hilink.com.au (Daniel O'Callaghan) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:18:22 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Daniel O'Callaghan" at Aug 15, 96 09:35:51 pm Organization: Kitchen Table Systems Reply-To: hm@kts.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Daniel O'Callaghan wrote: > Didn't all real hackers start out by programming TRS-80's and Apple IIe's > back in '78/'79? No, some started by soldering together 6800/6821/6850/2708/2114 chips because they did'n like 6502's and 8080's :-) hellmuth -- Hellmuth Michaelis hm@kts.org Hamburg, Europe (A)bort, (R)etry, (I)nstall BSD ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 06:29:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA07268 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 06:29:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from terra.Sarnoff.COM (terra.sarnoff.com [130.33.11.203]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA07261 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 06:29:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from rminnich@localhost) by terra.Sarnoff.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA13116; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:28:36 -0400 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:28:36 -0400 (EDT) From: "Ron G. Minnich" X-Sender: rminnich@terra To: "P.C.Narasimha Reddy" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 3com Eterlink III In-Reply-To: <9608152001.AA29969@teil.soft.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk 1) get the 3com disk 2) turn of plug and pray ron Ron Minnich |"If you leave out all the killings, D.C. has as rminnich@sarnoff.com | low a crime rate as many cities" -- (609)-734-3120 | D.C. Mayor Marion Barry ftp://ftp.sarnoff.com/pub/mnfs/www/docs/cluster.html From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 07:09:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA09036 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:09:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA09029 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:09:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id JAA13554; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:04:43 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608151404.JAA13554@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: darrylo@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com (Darryl Okahata) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:04:43 -0500 (CDT) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608150659.AA203732347@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com> from "Darryl Okahata" at Aug 14, 96 11:59:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > a) Write a filesystem which understands tar files natively. Note: there may > > be a slight performance penalty for folks running with their root > > partitions mounted on a TARFS - perhaps we could note this somewhere. > > While you're at it, how about tar-on-a-tape-FS? There's an MSDOS > driver that makes a tape drive look like a disk drive. Why not have > something similar for FreeBSD? People can then use their tape drive as > a disk. Imagine having the root disk on tape! "Infinite storage!" > (1001 evil ;-}) > > What about ZIPFS, or CPIOFS? ZOOFS? ARCFS? LBRFS? Punch-tape-FS > is possible, but it wouldn't be politically correct -- too many trees > would get cut down. ;-} How about UFS-on-a-tape :-) Never forget the obvious ones. # newfs /dev/rst0 /dev/rst0: 8257536 sectors in 2016 cylinders of 1 tracks, 4096 sectors 4032.0MB in 126 cyl groups (16 c/g, 32.00MB/g, 7680 i/g) super-block backups (for fsck -b #) at: 32, 65568, 131104, 196640, 262176, 327712, 393248, 458784, 524320, 589856, 655392, 720928, 786464, 852000, 917536, 983072, 1048608, 1114144, 1179680, 1245216, 1310752, 1376288, 1441824, 1507360, 1572896, 1638432, 1703968, 1769504, 1835040, 1900576, 1966112, 2031648, 2097184, 2162720, 2228256, 2293792, 2359328, 2424864, 2490400, 2555936, 2621472, 2687008, 2752544, 2818080, 2883616, 2949152, 3014688, 3080224, 3145760, 3211296, 3276832, 3342368, 3407904, 3473440, 3538976, 3604512, 3670048, 3735584, 3801120, 3866656, 3932192, 3997728, 4063264, 4128800, 4194336, 4259872, 4325408, 4390944, 4456480, 4522016, 4587552, 4653088, 4718624, 4784160, 4849696, 4915232, 4980768, 5046304, 5111840, 5177376, 5242912, 5308448, 5373984, 5439520, 5505056, 5570592, 5636128, 5701664, 5767200, 5832736, 5898272, 5963808, 6029344, 6094880, 6160416, 6225952, 6291488, 6357024, 6422560, 6488096, 6553632, 6619168, 6684704, 6750240, 6815776, 6881312, 6946848, 7012384, 7077920, 7143456, 7208992, 7274528, 7340064, 7405600, 7471136, 7536672, 7602208, 7667744, 7733280, 7798816, 7864352, 7929888, 7995424, 8060960, 8126496, 8192032, # mount /dev/st0 /mnt # cd /mnt (whirrrr chug) # (cd /usr; tar cvf - .) | tar xf - (whirrrr chug whirrrr chug whirrr chug for several years) ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 07:10:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA09101 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:10:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zappa.cs.uncc.edu (zappa.cs.uncc.edu [152.15.35.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA09092 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:10:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: by zappa.cs.uncc.edu (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA22571; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:57:36 -0400 From: jlrobins@zappa.cs.uncc.edu (James Robinson) Message-Id: <9608151357.AA22571@zappa.cs.uncc.edu> Subject: Handy wish script to aid netscape To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:57:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Ever wanted netscape to automatically open up the URL in the main selection without having to drop it into the net:open dialog box? Also tired of loosing your netscape instance on one of your 15 fvwm pages only to start up a new copy only to be met with the "instance running already" dialog and the obtuse pw.db errors in /dev/console? Here's a wish script that takes care of both. Drop it into your goodstuff bar! ftp://ftp.cs.uncc.edu/pub/FreeBSD/contrib/Netscape James From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 07:15:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA09486 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:15:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA09480 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:15:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id JAA13565; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:14:22 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608151414.JAA13565@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:14:22 -0500 (CDT) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, ulf@lamb.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jkh@time.cdrom.com In-Reply-To: <199608142129.HAA04653@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 15, 96 07:29:21 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >> I would go more into the direction of checking if the dump device is a > >> mounted file system. Easy check. > > >I tend to agree, but wonder if it would not make more sense to tackle this > >from a different angle. > > >Consider all the programs that could clobber a mounted file system. Would > >it make more sense if we somehow protected a mounted disk device from > >being clobbered? > > It is already protected. Even root can't even open a mounted disk device. Root can open (and write to) a raw disk device that has its counterpart mounted, however. I think the "and write to" part is much more of a liability than simply being able to open and read the device. As we saw from the message that started this thread. ;-) > However, mounted disk devices can easiliy be clobbered using an alias. > There are about 2^(1+5+3) = 512 possible aliases (raw/buffered, 2^5 > slices, 2^3 partitions). This is useful for things like installing > new bootblocks on the root partition without having to reboot with a > different root partition. Don't fix it. Root knows all about this > problem, and never makes mistakes :-). As we saw from the message that started this thread. ;-) In general I don't think it's a solvable problem. I'm willing to live with that personally, I think that the current state of affairs is a good compromise, but I think it's really a good idea to toss around ideas anyways to see if there isn't a better general solution of some sort waiting out there to be found. ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 07:37:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA10939 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:37:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA10925 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:37:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id JAA13614; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:36:11 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608151436.JAA13614@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:36:11 -0500 (CDT) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, kpneal@interpath.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, ulf@lamb.net In-Reply-To: <199608142239.IAA07377@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Aug 15, 96 08:39:14 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > No, it is still easy to clobber the disk using an alias. The whole-disk > devices (raw and buffered) are the easiest to abuse. Secure_level = 2 > of course protects you by preventing all writes to disks. True, very true. And sometimes there ARE valid reasons to access a mounted file system - consider things like Sun's horrible installboot.. I suspect tunefs also plays these games but maybe not anymore. > Half baked write protection can cause obscure errors. FreeBSD implements > write protection of labels (and also conversion of labels as they are > read and written). This works right iff the disk is accessed through the > "right" devices (i.e., through all devices except the whole disk devices). > Even then it can cause obscure errors: > > (1) dd if=/dev/rsd0c of=/dev/rsd1c count=64k > (2) dd if=/dev/rsd0c of=/dev/rsd1c > (3) dd if=/dev/sd0c of=/dev/sd1c count=64k # don't use > (4) dd if=/dev/sd0c of=/dev/sd1c # don't use I think you mean bs=64k...? (I assume you do) > (1) should fail if sd1 is already labeled (unless the write protection > is removed using disklabel -W sd1 or equivalent, of course). > This is harmless because the copy will abort on the first block > before any data is copied. > (2) should fail in the same cases as (1), but it will abort on the > second block after copying the first block. > (3) should fail in the same cases as (1), but the error won't be > reported to the application so the copy won't be aborted. > Everything except the second block will be copied and the error > won't be reported by dd. > (4) is like (3) except the damage is smaller since the second block > is smaller. > > The label blocks should be write protected (and converted) at all levels. > On "i386" systems, the MBR should also be write protected. Perhaps other > blocks should be write protected on other systems. Errors when a write > protected block is hit after copying several GB would be very annoying. Oh please tell me about it >:-( I set up ccd once and managed to make a minor goof and a whole range of blocks in the middle of my fs became "unusable"... it was particularly annoying because UNIX assumed that the blocks were written OK but they never made it past the FS layers... leading to all sorts of bizarro-ness. My goof, oh well. ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 07:45:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA11442 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:45:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA11433; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:45:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA03505; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 16:45:03 +0200 (MET DST) To: Joe Greco cc: darrylo@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com (Darryl Okahata), jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:04:43 CDT." <199608151404.JAA13554@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 16:45:03 +0200 Message-ID: <3503.840120303@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk ># mount /dev/st0 /mnt ># cd /mnt >(whirrrr chug) ># (cd /usr; tar cvf - .) | tar xf - >(whirrrr chug whirrrr chug whirrr chug for several years) Remember Pyramids install procedure ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 07:55:47 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA12050 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:55:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA12045 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 07:55:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id JAA13662; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:50:07 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608151450.JAA13662@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: phk@critter.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:50:06 -0500 (CDT) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, darrylo@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <3503.840120303@critter.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Aug 15, 96 04:45:03 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > ># mount /dev/st0 /mnt > ># cd /mnt > >(whirrrr chug) > ># (cd /usr; tar cvf - .) | tar xf - > >(whirrrr chug whirrrr chug whirrr chug for several years) > > Remember Pyramids install procedure ? You aren't serious...? I am assuming that they _read_ from the tape, probably as a -ro filesystem..? Good lord. ;-) ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:00:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA12437 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:00:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.barrnet.net (mail.barrnet.net [131.119.246.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA12429 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:00:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by mail.barrnet.net (8.7.5/MAIL-RELAY-LEN) with SMTP id IAA06656 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:00:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA00368; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:06:47 +0300 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:06:47 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Joe Greco cc: Darryl Okahata , jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-Reply-To: <199608151404.JAA13554@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Joe Greco wrote: > > > a) Write a filesystem which understands tar files natively. Note: there may > > > be a slight performance penalty for folks running with their root > > > partitions mounted on a TARFS - perhaps we could note this somewhere. > > > > While you're at it, how about tar-on-a-tape-FS? There's an MSDOS > > driver that makes a tape drive look like a disk drive. Why not have > > something similar for FreeBSD? People can then use their tape drive as > > a disk. Imagine having the root disk on tape! "Infinite storage!" > > (1001 evil ;-}) > > > > What about ZIPFS, or CPIOFS? ZOOFS? ARCFS? LBRFS? Punch-tape-FS > > is possible, but it wouldn't be politically correct -- too many trees > > would get cut down. ;-} > > How about UFS-on-a-tape :-) Never forget the obvious ones. > > # newfs /dev/rst0 > /dev/rst0: 8257536 sectors in 2016 cylinders of 1 tracks, 4096 sectors > 4032.0MB in 126 cyl groups (16 c/g, 32.00MB/g, 7680 i/g) > super-block backups (for fsck -b #) at: > 32, 65568, 131104, 196640, 262176, 327712, 393248, 458784, 524320, 589856, > 655392, 720928, 786464, 852000, 917536, 983072, 1048608, 1114144, 1179680, > 1245216, 1310752, 1376288, 1441824, 1507360, 1572896, 1638432, 1703968, > 1769504, 1835040, 1900576, 1966112, 2031648, 2097184, 2162720, 2228256, > 2293792, 2359328, 2424864, 2490400, 2555936, 2621472, 2687008, 2752544, > 2818080, 2883616, 2949152, 3014688, 3080224, 3145760, 3211296, 3276832, > 3342368, 3407904, 3473440, 3538976, 3604512, 3670048, 3735584, 3801120, > 3866656, 3932192, 3997728, 4063264, 4128800, 4194336, 4259872, 4325408, > 4390944, 4456480, 4522016, 4587552, 4653088, 4718624, 4784160, 4849696, > 4915232, 4980768, 5046304, 5111840, 5177376, 5242912, 5308448, 5373984, > 5439520, 5505056, 5570592, 5636128, 5701664, 5767200, 5832736, 5898272, > 5963808, 6029344, 6094880, 6160416, 6225952, 6291488, 6357024, 6422560, > 6488096, 6553632, 6619168, 6684704, 6750240, 6815776, 6881312, 6946848, > 7012384, 7077920, 7143456, 7208992, 7274528, 7340064, 7405600, 7471136, > 7536672, 7602208, 7667744, 7733280, 7798816, 7864352, 7929888, 7995424, > 8060960, 8126496, 8192032, > # mount /dev/st0 /mnt > # cd /mnt > (whirrrr chug) > # (cd /usr; tar cvf - .) | tar xf - > (whirrrr chug whirrrr chug whirrr chug for several years) Got to try out. What a pitty I have only 2GB DAT.... But I think I can copy many small-sized files to it, if it works, of course. Sander > > ... JG > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:03:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA12708 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:03:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from io.keanesea.com (io.keanesea.com [206.213.110.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA12697 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:03:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from FRIDAY (friday.keanesea.com [206.213.110.70]) by io.keanesea.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA05696 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:02:16 -0700 Received: by FRIDAY with Microsoft Mail id <01BB8A7F.F4E68B90@FRIDAY>; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:01:25 -0700 Message-ID: <01BB8A7F.F4E68B90@FRIDAY> From: Cyrus Gray To: "'FreeBSD Hackers'" Subject: imagemap for apache 1.1.1 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:01:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I converted all of our Linux servers to FreeBSD and have been very impressed with the increase in performance. However since converting I can no longer run the server side Imagemap's. Because Apache didn't come with a /cgi-bin/imagemap like it did with RedHat Linux. I can't seem to find the imagemap source code anywhere does anyone know were I can find it (or binaries)? Thank you Cyrus Gray ----------------------------------------------------------- Cyrus Gray cyrusgr@keanesea.com Keane Inc. Phone 206.654.7074 Information Systems Fax 206.464.1551 ----------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:04:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA12812 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:04:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-1.mail.demon.net (mail-1.mail.demon.net [158.152.1.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA12805 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:04:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from post.demon.co.uk ([158.152.1.72]) by mail-1.mail.demon.net id ar08998; 15 Aug 96 15:50 BST Received: from longacre.demon.co.uk ([158.152.156.24]) by relay-3.mail.demon.net id aa04513; 15 Aug 96 15:21 +0100 From: Michael Searle Message-ID: To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare References: <199608150957.CAA28563@freefall.freebsd.org> Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:37:39 BST X-Mailer: Offlite 0.09 / Termite Internet for Acorn RISC OS Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk owner-hackers-digest@freefall.freebsd.org wrote: > On Wed, 14 Aug 1996, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: >> a) Write a filesystem which understands tar files natively. Note: >> there may be a slight performance penalty for folks running with their >> root partitions mounted on a TARFS - perhaps we could note this >> somewhere. > Well, this would be handy, but what would be really useful is making ufs > understand both tar and tar.gz files, so we could do things like:- > cd fred.tar.gz ls file1 file2 file3 cp file1 /tmp cp /tmp/file1b file1 > Etc.. > I remember a similar thing on the Amiga that handled lha files in this > way.. but lha compressed each file in the archive seperatley so the > whole archive did not need to be de-compressed to get to a single file. There are similar things on the Acorn that can handle arc files and tar.gz files, but it is very slow for tar.gz as the whole archive has to be read or written at any access. You could get around this by using a gz.tar file (with tar's blocksize changed to the disk's frag size), but a whole compressed FS (like Doublespace etc. for DOS) would be better than either. -- Michael Searle - searle@longacre.demon.co.uk From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:22:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA14617 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:22:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA14577 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:22:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA00336; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:58:58 +0300 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:58:57 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: James Robinson cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Handy wish script to aid netscape In-Reply-To: <9608151357.AA22571@zappa.cs.uncc.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, James Robinson wrote: > Ever wanted netscape to automatically open up the URL in the main selection > without having to drop it into the net:open dialog box? > > Also tired of loosing your netscape instance on one of your 15 fvwm pages > only to start up a new copy only to be met with the "instance running already" > dialog and the obtuse pw.db errors in /dev/console? > > Here's a wish script that takes care of both. Drop it into your goodstuff bar! There is a thing called tkgoodstuff.... If I am going to have time (and no-one sends me a bomb or a can of snakes) I will make a port of it. It has other features aswell (and these can be added using tcl/tk). If you want, you may do the port yourself. Or alternatively - ignore it. Sander > > ftp://ftp.cs.uncc.edu/pub/FreeBSD/contrib/Netscape > > > James > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:27:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA15193 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:27:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orion.webspan.net (root@orion.webspan.net [206.154.70.41]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA15188 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:26:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (gpalmer@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by orion.webspan.net (8.7.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA04835; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:26:34 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: orion.webspan.net: Host gpalmer@localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Michael Searle cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org From: "Gary Palmer" Subject: Re: Nightmare In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:37:39 -0000." Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:26:34 -0400 Message-ID: <4832.840122794@orion.webspan.net> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Searle wrote in message ID : > There are similar things on the Acorn that can handle arc files and tar.gz > files, but it is very slow for tar.gz as the whole archive has to be read or > written at any access. You could get around this by using a gz.tar file > (with tar's blocksize changed to the disk's frag size), but a whole > compressed FS (like Doublespace etc. for DOS) would be better than either. Theoretically, if you handled large files in the archive, it would be possible to compress the individual files rather than the entire archive (and not loose too much in terms of compression, and gain a lot in terms of access). ArcFS *MAY* have done something like this for some of it's compression. I know that using tar for a read-write archive is MURDER :-( (Yes, I own an Arc :-) ) Gary -- Gary Palmer FreeBSD Core Team Member FreeBSD: Turning PC's into workstations. See http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/ for info From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:32:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA15846 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:32:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA15829; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:32:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA03584; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:31:58 +0200 (MET DST) To: Joe Greco cc: darrylo@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:50:06 CDT." <199608151450.JAA13662@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:31:57 +0200 Message-ID: <3582.840123117@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199608151450.JAA13662@brasil.moneng.mei.com>, Joe Greco writes: >> ># mount /dev/st0 /mnt >> ># cd /mnt >> >(whirrrr chug) >> ># (cd /usr; tar cvf - .) | tar xf - >> >(whirrrr chug whirrrr chug whirrr chug for several years) >> >> Remember Pyramids install procedure ? > >You aren't serious...? > >I am assuming that they _read_ from the tape, probably as a -ro >filesystem..? > >Good lord. ;-) Plenty of time to read coffee... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:33:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA16034 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:33:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA16025 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:33:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dialup-usr11.etinc.com (dialup-usr11.etinc.com [204.141.95.132]) by etinc.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA14121 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:37:49 -0400 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:37:49 -0400 Message-Id: <199608151537.LAA14121@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: hackers@freebsd.org From: dennis@etinc.com (Dennis) Subject: (annoying) Arplookup message Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I have a net with 2 different net addresses an whenever an arp request on the seconary net is issued, my freebsd machine on the other address complains as follows arplookup: host is not on local network it happens a few hundred times a day.....it there an elegant way to stop it from doing this (without chopping it out of the arplookup routine in the source)? Thanks, Dennis ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Emerging Technologies, Inc. http://www.etinc.com Synchronous Communications Cards and Routers For Discriminating Tastes. 56k to T1 and beyond. Frame Relay, PPP, HDLC, and X.25 for BSD/OS, FreeBSD and LINUX From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:33:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA16115 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:33:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA16094; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:33:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA03599; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:33:17 +0200 (MET DST) To: Narvi cc: Joe Greco , Darryl Okahata , jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:06:47 +0300." Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:33:17 +0200 Message-ID: <3597.840123197@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> # mount /dev/st0 /mnt >> # cd /mnt >> (whirrrr chug) >> # (cd /usr; tar cvf - .) | tar xf - >> (whirrrr chug whirrrr chug whirrr chug for several years) > >Got to try out. What a pitty I have only 2GB DAT.... But I think I >can copy many small-sized files to it, if it works, of course. I tried it, it doesn't. Please fix it if you have time. It is a usefull feature, in particular for a dat that can do moderately fast positioning. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:41:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA17136 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:41:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from horst.bfd.com (horst.bfd.com [204.160.242.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA17124 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:41:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from harlie (bastion.bfd.com [204.160.242.2]) by horst.bfd.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA20942; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:41:29 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:41:38 -0700 (PDT) From: "Eric J. Schwertfeger" X-Sender: ejs@harlie To: Hellmuth Michaelis cc: "Daniel O'Callaghan" , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Hellmuth Michaelis wrote: > Daniel O'Callaghan wrote: > > > Didn't all real hackers start out by programming TRS-80's and Apple IIe's > > back in '78/'79? > > No, some started by soldering together 6800/6821/6850/2708/2114 chips because > they did'n like 6502's and 8080's :-) Then I probably wasn't the only one so thouroughly put off by the 8086 that I started working on my own bitslice design? :-) (For those that are wondering, the Z8000 and the 68000 came out before I even came close to finishing the design, and those I was almost happy with.) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:42:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA17200 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:42:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA17191 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:42:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.7.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA00980; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:35:36 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608151535.IAA00980@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: lestat.nas.nasa.gov: Host localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: "Daniel O'Callaghan" Cc: Darren Reed , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:35:35 -0700 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996 21:35:51 +1000 (EST) "Daniel O'Callaghan" wrote: > Didn't all real hackers start out by programming TRS-80's and Apple IIe's > back in '78/'79? I've still got some of my Applesoft and 6502 programs. > I just don't have a computer to run them on. A friend recently gave me a TRS-80 Model I with Level-II BASIC and a Fortran compiler. "Memmmoreees..." Now, I need to piece together the two incomplete Apple ][s (a ][+ and a ][e) into something that works... Now, those were _REAL_ machines :-) -- save the ancient forests - http://www.bayarea.net/~thorpej/forest/ -- Jason R. Thorpe thorpej@nas.nasa.gov NASA Ames Research Center Home: 408.866.1912 NAS: M/S 258-6 Work: 415.604.0935 Moffett Field, CA 94035 Pager: 415.428.6939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:47:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA17783 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:47:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA17774 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:47:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id KAA13861; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:41:43 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608151541.KAA13861@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: phk@critter.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:41:43 -0500 (CDT) Cc: narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, darrylo@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <3597.840123197@critter.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Aug 15, 96 05:33:17 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >> # mount /dev/st0 /mnt > >> # cd /mnt > >> (whirrrr chug) > >> # (cd /usr; tar cvf - .) | tar xf - > >> (whirrrr chug whirrrr chug whirrr chug for several years) > > > >Got to try out. What a pitty I have only 2GB DAT.... But I think I > >can copy many small-sized files to it, if it works, of course. > > I tried it, it doesn't. > > Please fix it if you have time. It is a usefull feature, in particular > for a dat that can do moderately fast positioning. I don't have a DAT handy to try this with, actually (not here at least), does anybody know what problems might prevent this? I am 99% positive that newfs just won't work on a tape :-) But I suspect it might be possible to hack it to work with creative use of dd off a formatted hard disk..? (i.e. newfs the hard disk, dd to tape, maybe then mount the tape?) Could be cool, even useful. Very strange too. ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 08:52:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA18223 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:52:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scooter.quickweb.com (scooter.quickweb.com [199.212.134.8]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA18195 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:51:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (mark@localhost) by scooter.quickweb.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA06881; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:50:47 -0400 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:50:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Mark Mayo To: Cyrus Gray cc: "'FreeBSD Hackers'" Subject: Re: imagemap for apache 1.1.1 In-Reply-To: <01BB8A7F.F4E68B90@FRIDAY> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Cyrus Gray wrote: > I converted all of our Linux servers to FreeBSD and have > been very impressed with the increase in performance. > However since converting I can no longer run the server > side Imagemap's. Because Apache didn't come with > a /cgi-bin/imagemap like it did with RedHat Linux. > > I can't seem to find the imagemap source code anywhere > does anyone know were I can find it (or binaries)? You shouled ask this on freebsd-isp@freebsd.org. But here's the answer: imagemapes are handled naitively by apache (so it doesn't have to fork cgi processed every time..). Look for AddType .map in srm.conf, or in mime-types. Basically, get rid of "cgi-bin/imagemap" in your URL's, and the maps will work.. BTW, this is in the apache FAQ... -mark ------------------------------------------- | Mark Mayo mark@quickweb.com | | C-Soft www.quickweb.com | ------------------------------------------- "To iterate is human, to recurse divine." - L. Peter Deutsch > > > Thank you > Cyrus Gray > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Cyrus Gray cyrusgr@keanesea.com > Keane Inc. Phone 206.654.7074 > Information Systems Fax 206.464.1551 > ----------------------------------------------------------- > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 09:00:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA19010 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:00:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA19004; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:00:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA03643; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:59:43 +0200 (MET DST) cc: Joe Greco , darrylo@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:31:57 +0200." <3582.840123117@critter.tfs.com> Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:59:43 +0200 Message-ID: <3641.840124783@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>> Remember Pyramids install procedure ? >> >>You aren't serious...? >> >>I am assuming that they _read_ from the tape, probably as a -ro >>filesystem..? >> >>Good lord. ;-) > >Plenty of time to read coffee... Before anybody starts to wonder: s/read/read,/ :-) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 09:02:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA19135 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:02:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com ([140.145.230.252]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA19130; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:02:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from critter.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA03669; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:02:02 +0200 (MET DST) To: Jason Thorpe cc: "Daniel O'Callaghan" , Darren Reed , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? Reply-to: chat@freensd.org Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:02:01 +0200 Message-ID: <3667.840124921@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Now, I need to piece together the two incomplete Apple ][s (a ][+ and a >][e) into something that works... > >Now, those were _REAL_ machines :-) ha! Some of us thinks all those new-fangeled chip-thingies are only for toys. (Nice toys, allright, but toys!) :-) Computers are built from transistors. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 09:06:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA19339 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:06:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from al.imforei.apana.org.au (root@al.imforei.apana.org.au [202.12.89.41]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA19326 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:06:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from pjchilds@localhost) by al.imforei.apana.org.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id BAA14337; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 01:35:51 +0930 (CST) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 01:35:51 +0930 (CST) From: Peter Childs Message-Id: <199608151605.BAA14337@al.imforei.apana.org.au> To: cgray@keanesea.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: imagemap for apache 1.1.1 X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <01BB8A7F.F4E68B90@FRIDAY> you wrote: : I converted all of our Linux servers to FreeBSD and have : been very impressed with the increase in performance. : However since converting I can no longer run the server : side Imagemap's. Because Apache didn't come with : a /cgi-bin/imagemap like it did with RedHat Linux. : I can't seem to find the imagemap source code anywhere : does anyone know were I can find it (or binaries)? Check the configuration files in the apache-1.1.1 source. You'll note some module options that do imagemaps. Peter -- Peter Childs --- http://www.imforei.apana.org.au/~pjchilds Finger pjchilds@al.imforei.apana.org.au for public PGP key From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 09:14:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA19822 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:14:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from premise.CS.Berkeley.EDU (root@premise.CS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.33.172]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA19817 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:14:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from premise.CS.Berkeley.EDU (localhost.Berkeley.EDU [127.0.0.1]) by premise.CS.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA32056; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:14:17 -0700 Message-Id: <199608151614.JAA32056@premise.CS.Berkeley.EDU> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.7 5/3/96 To: Jaye Mathisen cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: New routed weirdness. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 14 Aug 1996 18:17:12 PDT." From: bmah@cs.berkeley.edu (Bruce A. Mah) Reply-to: bmah@cs.berkeley.edu X-Face: g~c`.{#4q0"(V*b#g[i~rXgm*w;:nMfz%_RZLma)UgGN&=j`5vXoU^@n5v4:OO)c["!w)nD/!!~e4Sj7LiT'6*wZ83454H""lb{CC%T37O!!'S$S&D}sem7I[A 2V%N&+ Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:14:15 -0700 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jaye Mathisen writes: > The PM's run RIP V1. But if I read this correctly, somehow I'm picking up > RIP packets where the host is advertised as having a netmask of 29 bits or > 31 bits, rather than 32 bits. > > However, I don't see how this is possible. I guess I need some > suggestions on how to track down specifically what's wrong. Jaye-- My memory is a bit hazy, but I don't think this is a FreeBSD problem. I seem to remember that Livingston PortMasters can aggregate route advertisements for their PPP/SLIP dialups. Instead of advertising a large number of host routes, they can send out an advertisement for a subnet prefix that contains all of the IP addresses for their set of PPP/SLIP lines. This option is configurable on the PM. The catch is that RIP V1 doesn't have any way to express the length of this routing prefix (RIP V2 does), so the PM actually ends up generating funny routing updates. How these gets interpreted seems to be implementation-dependent. This happened at an ISP I helped set up, and it confused the heck out of a Solaris fileserver. Eventually we decided to turn off aggregation (not Livingston's term for this concept but you get my drift). My suggestion would be to do a tcpdump for routing updates and look carefully at the IP address in each advertisement. You might need to reconfigure the PMs to advertise individual host routes for the dialups (buys you correctness at the expense of larger routing updates). Hope this helps... Bruce. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 09:47:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA21572 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:47:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tdc.on.ca (tdc.on.ca [204.92.242.39]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA21559 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:47:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from martin@localhost) by tdc.on.ca (8.7.5/8.6.6) id MAA18692; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 12:40:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Martin Renters Message-Id: <199608151640.MAA18692@tdc.on.ca> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 12:40:55 -0400 (EDT) Cc: phk@critter.tfs.com, narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, darrylo@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608151541.KAA13861@brasil.moneng.mei.com> from "Joe Greco" at Aug 15, 96 10:41:43 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > >> # mount /dev/st0 /mnt > > >> # cd /mnt > > >> (whirrrr chug) > > >> # (cd /usr; tar cvf - .) | tar xf - > > >> (whirrrr chug whirrrr chug whirrr chug for several years) > > > > I am 99% positive that newfs just won't work on a tape :-) But I suspect > it might be possible to hack it to work with creative use of dd off a > formatted hard disk..? (i.e. newfs the hard disk, dd to tape, maybe then > mount the tape?) HP used to do install tapes like this too. They had a block tape device which worked on 9-track tape devices. I guess they counted record marks to determine what block they were on and then issues FSR and BSR commands to the drive to position the tape. I suspect they also laid files out on the tape in the order in which the install program was going to use them. I don't know whether the UFS file layout algorithms help or hinder a filesystem on a sequential device.... :-) Martin From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 10:04:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA22603 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:04:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.barrnet.net (mail.barrnet.net [131.119.246.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA22523 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:02:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from apollo.it.hq.nasa.gov ([131.182.119.87]) by mail.barrnet.net (8.7.5/MAIL-RELAY-LEN) with SMTP id KAA07872 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:02:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov (wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov [131.182.119.88]) by apollo.it.hq.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA08119 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:00:25 GMT Received: from localhost (cshenton@localhost) by wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id QAA10487 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 16:57:53 GMT Message-Id: <199608151657.QAA10487@wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov: cshenton owned process doing -bs X-Authentication-Warning: wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:42:25 -0700 (PDT)" References: <199608151542.IAA17219@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.03 on Emacs 19.31.8 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 12:57:53 -0400 From: Chris Shenton Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm setting up a box as a pppd server, with /30 masks on the ppp endpoints, and /28 masks on the remote's ethernet. I'm having some routing weirdness and was wondering if routed supports these different-length netmasks? What version of RIP is it? If not, would gated do the trick? Thanks. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 10:19:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA23401 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:19:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA23390 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:19:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA01038; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:29:08 +0300 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:29:07 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: Joe Greco , Darryl Okahata , jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-Reply-To: <3597.840123197@critter.tfs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > >> # mount /dev/st0 /mnt > >> # cd /mnt > >> (whirrrr chug) > >> # (cd /usr; tar cvf - .) | tar xf - > >> (whirrrr chug whirrrr chug whirrr chug for several years) > > > >Got to try out. What a pitty I have only 2GB DAT.... But I think I > >can copy many small-sized files to it, if it works, of course. > > I tried it, it doesn't. Which part of it didn't work? All or some specific? Sander > > Please fix it if you have time. It is a usefull feature, in particular > for a dat that can do moderately fast positioning. I'll try to see what I can do. The feature would actually be really usefull, even with the perhormance penalties. The 2G replaceable file partitions would come at totally killer price! And it could actually avoid having to pack away - just copy them over, if you need them again, replace the cassett in the drive copy stuff over, later copy changed stuff back. Heh... Much too good to be possible... Sander > > -- > Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. > http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. > whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. > Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 10:39:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA24795 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:39:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA24790 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:39:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id MAA14144; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 12:38:10 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608151738.MAA14144@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? To: cshenton@it.hq.nasa.gov (Chris Shenton) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 12:38:10 -0500 (CDT) Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608151657.QAA10487@wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov> from "Chris Shenton" at Aug 15, 96 12:57:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I'm setting up a box as a pppd server, with /30 masks on the ppp > endpoints, and /28 masks on the remote's ethernet. > > I'm having some routing weirdness and was wondering if routed supports > these different-length netmasks? What version of RIP is it? > > If not, would gated do the trick? routed is evil, particularly for varying masks, even more so for busy dial-up connections where routing updates may be dropped. gated is somewhat better and if you must have dynamic routing, is probably the way to go. I use static routing around here with no problems. ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 10:49:41 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA26398 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:49:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA26385 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:49:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA01199; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:59:46 +0300 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:59:45 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Chris Shenton cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: <199608151657.QAA10487@wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Chris Shenton wrote: > I'm setting up a box as a pppd server, with /30 masks on the ppp > endpoints, and /28 masks on the remote's ethernet. > > I'm having some routing weirdness and was wondering if routed supports > these different-length netmasks? What version of RIP is it? As far as I understand it, you need RIPv2. > > If not, would gated do the trick? If you can, use gated. BTW, is the current package/port of installing the documentation for gated? Once I tried, it didn't, or at least so it seemed. Sander > > Thanks. > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 11:04:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA28360 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:04:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Gatekeeper.Lamb.net (root@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net [206.169.44.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA28354 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:04:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ulf@localhost) by Gatekeeper.Lamb.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA10438; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:04:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Ulf Zimmermann Message-Id: <199608151804.LAA10438@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net> Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? To: cshenton@it.hq.nasa.gov (Chris Shenton) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:04:51 -0700 (PDT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608151657.QAA10487@wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov> from Chris Shenton at "Aug 15, 96 12:57:53 pm" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I'm setting up a box as a pppd server, with /30 masks on the ppp > endpoints, and /28 masks on the remote's ethernet. > > I'm having some routing weirdness and was wondering if routed supports > these different-length netmasks? What version of RIP is it? > > If not, would gated do the trick? > > Thanks. > > RIP-v2 should support netmasks. And I had the same problems with routed. Haven't found a way, so I use static routes right now. And will use gated with some other routing protocol later. Ulf. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-865-0204 Lamb Art Internet Services || http://www.Lamb.net/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 11:12:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA29440 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:12:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA29433 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:12:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id LAA19955; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:11:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bubba.whistle.com(207.76.205.7) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma019953; Thu Aug 15 11:11:55 1996 Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA14400; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:11:55 -0700 From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199608151811.LAA14400@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: DIVERT To: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au (Darren Reed) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:11:54 -0700 (PDT) Cc: julian@whistle.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608151024.DAA29735@freefall.freebsd.org> from "Darren Reed" at Aug 15, 96 08:23:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > In some mail from Julian Elischer, sie said: > > > > No, that isn't quite what divert does.. > > divert is a bit more powerful than that > > it uses a divert socket type to pass the packets up to the user. > > this allows other info to be passed as well.. > > the main difference is that you can using the divert socket, re-inject the > > packet back at the point that it was taken out, and control to a greater > > extent what happens to it.. > > > > divert sockets are an experiment which may or may not survive > > but we have found that they allow us to do things that we couldn't do > > using the tunnel interface. > > > > firstly sockets are inherrently packet oriented, so you can do > > 'sendto' on them for example to give different sematics to what > > happens to the packet after re-injection. > > > > there are other problems that are solved by this approach. > > we looked at tun interfaces and decided that it was banging a square > > peg into a round hole. > > What was/is the aim of it ? > > To me it sounds a lot like what screend does, except there is a way to > open multiple instances for intercepting packets. > > Although, I don't quite see how they fit in to the operational scheme of > things. > > > each divert socket can be bound to a differnt port, so you can divert > > different packets to different sockets (with tun, how do you do that?) > > Multiple tun devices ? The idea behind divert is pretty simple.. it just adds another possible "action" that an ipfw rule can have, which is "send this packet to the user-land process listening on this socket". It also allows the reverse, that is, the user process can re-inject the packet (possibly modified) back into the system exactly at the point where it was diverted. Divert sockets were motivated by a discussion about how one would implement something like address translation (or packet encryption) under FreeBSD. Lots of people commented that more kernel bloat is a hated thing. I happened to agree strongly with this sentiment. The logical observation (to me, anyway) was that there needed to be some way to easily and efficiently redirect chosen packets out of the kernel and to some user process, and then get them back in where they left off. Hence divert sockets. Now with what language do you specify what packets to divert? Well, the ipfw packet selection language seemed a good fit. Another possibility was the BPF stuff (which I'm not that familiar with to be honest). The problem with using tunnel interfaces is that packets written to them are subject to routing. This would make doing something like address translation difficult, where you're changing the IP addresses in the packet header (but you don't want to change where the packet is going). The problem with BPF is that it doesn't divert packets, it just copies them. And again, it's based on interfaces. By the way, there is a man page.. divert(4). -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie L. Cobbs, archie@whistle.com * Whistle Communications Corporation From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 11:35:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA02110 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:35:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA02105 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:35:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cdsnet.net (mail.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.5]) by mail.cdsnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA11897 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:34:56 -0700 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:34:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Jaye Mathisen To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: OK, one more routed thing. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Is there some way to stop routed from broadcasting a default route, but advertising all the other routes? Unfortunately, I am limited to RIP. I'm not using the -g option, although the machine does have 2 cards, with forwarding on. Specifically, a bunch of web server IP's are bound to the second card, but it has no physical connection to anything else. However, I need to route to it to reach those IP's, but routed is also broadcasting the default route, which some of the other hosts are picking up. The -F option lets me set the metric for the default route, but that seems kind of cheesy, I don't want it going out at all. gated is currently not an option. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 11:39:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA02504 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:39:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA02497 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:39:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA22748; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:38:19 -0700 (PDT) To: Jason Thorpe cc: "Daniel O'Callaghan" , Darren Reed , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:35:35 PDT." <199608151535.IAA00980@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:38:19 -0700 Message-ID: <22746.840134299@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > A friend recently gave me a TRS-80 Model I with Level-II BASIC and a > Fortran compiler. "Memmmoreees..." Shouldn't that be "An ex-friend recently gave me..?" :-) Jordan P.S. At least you won't need a sound card for it, just locate an old FM radio you're not using and set it about 2 feet away... :) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 11:48:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA03845 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:48:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA03839 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:48:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA22781; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:43:19 -0700 (PDT) To: Poul-Henning Kamp cc: Joe Greco , darrylo@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:59:43 +0200." <3641.840124783@critter.tfs.com> Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:43:19 -0700 Message-ID: <22779.840134599@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >Plenty of time to read coffee... > > Before anybody starts to wonder: > s/read/read,/ Naw, I just figured it was some superstitious thing, like reading tea leaves. I've learned to expect some strange things from you Old World types, and the sight of a Dane tossing the contents of his coffee cup on the floor, gazing at it intently for a moment and then screaming "Herrje! This install will NOT be succcessful! Hit the BREAK key now! Quick!!" wouldn't even faze me. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 12:04:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA04786 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 12:04:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from walkabout.asstdc.com.au (imb@walkabout.asstdc.com.au [202.12.127.73]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA04739 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 12:03:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from imb@localhost) by walkabout.asstdc.com.au (8.7.5/BSD4.4) id FAA00889 Fri, 16 Aug 1996 05:03:15 +1000 (EST) From: michael butler Message-Id: <199608151903.FAA00889@walkabout.asstdc.com.au> Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? To: cshenton@it.hq.nasa.gov (Chris Shenton) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 05:03:14 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608151657.QAA10487@wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov> from Chris Shenton at "Aug 15, 96 12:57:53 pm" X-Comment: Phone 0419-240-180, International +61-419-240-180 X-Comment: finger imb@asstdc.com.au for PGP public key X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I'm having some routing weirdness and was wondering if routed supports > these different-length netmasks? What version of RIP is it? > If not, would gated do the trick? Scrub using routed - as you've already gathered, it won't do VLSM. RIP-II will but, really, OSPF is a far better way to go - faster convergence, classless .. the whole kit .. gated will do either or both and even propagate into RIP-I where "legacy support" is required for Livingston or Cisco 100x boxes with a little care, michael From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 13:12:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA14114 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:12:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA14060 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:11:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA21661; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:15:11 +0200 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA28532 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:14:49 +0200 Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA20111 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Thu, 15 Aug 1996 21:36:00 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA01048; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:26:06 +0200 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199608151826.UAA01048@yedi.iaf.nl> X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: hm@kts.org Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:26:06 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: danny@panda.hilink.com.au, avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Hellmuth Michaelis" at Aug 15, 96 02:18:22 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Hellmuth Michaelis wrote... > Daniel O'Callaghan wrote: > > > Didn't all real hackers start out by programming TRS-80's and Apple IIe's > > back in '78/'79? > > No, some started by soldering together 6800/6821/6850/2708/2114 chips because > they did'n like 6502's and 8080's :-) But of course. I still have my 6809 with mem-mapped 1Mbyte RAM. Runs Uniflex (by TSC) a Unix V7 alike. Those were the times we queued and marked our names on the blackboard for some computertime. > > hellmuth Wilko _ ____________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 13:12:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA14116 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:12:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA14064 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:12:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA21653; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:15:04 +0200 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA28505 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:14:41 +0200 Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA20099 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Thu, 15 Aug 1996 21:35:54 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA01011; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:22:35 +0200 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199608151822.UAA01011@yedi.iaf.nl> X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: chat@freensd.org.gn.iaf.nl Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:22:35 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: thorpej@nas.nasa.gov, danny@panda.hilink.com.au, avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3667.840124921@critter.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Aug 15, 96 06:02:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Poul-Henning Kamp wrote... > >Now, I need to piece together the two incomplete Apple ][s (a ][+ and a > >][e) into something that works... > > > >Now, those were _REAL_ machines :-) > > ha! Some of us thinks all those new-fangeled chip-thingies are only > for toys. (Nice toys, allright, but toys!) :-) > > Computers are built from transistors. > Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. Pah! Mercury delay lines and relays! You ought to be able to read the missing page from the MMU's relays... In case you wondered: that's what Chuck's trident is for: bending relay contacts back into shape ;) Wilko _ ____________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 13:42:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA18318 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:42:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cruz.isle.net (root@cruz.isle.net [204.140.227.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA18302 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:42:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from john (port060.vta.fishnet.net [205.216.133.209]) by cruz.isle.net (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA20668 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:29:33 -0700 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19960815204400.006d268c@isle.net> X-Sender: johns@isle.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:44:00 -0700 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: John Scharles Subject: UPS for FreeBSD Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I'm looking to purchase an ups for my freebsd box, but there seems to be a dearth of shutdown programs available. I've found upsd for the APC but nothing else. Does anyone have any recommendations for either hardware or software? Thanks John Scharles From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 13:44:13 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA18562 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:44:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pinky.junction.net (pinky.junction.net [199.166.227.12]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA18544 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:44:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sidhe.memra.com (sidhe.memra.com [199.166.227.105]) by pinky.junction.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA26029 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 12:56:32 -0700 Received: from localhost (michael@localhost) by sidhe.memra.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA20266 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:40:26 -0700 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:40:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Dillon To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: L2TP [Was: Re: What do I want?] (fwd) Message-ID: Organization: Memra Software Inc. - Internet consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 10:15:18 -0400 From: "Hascall \"Chip\" Sharp" Reply-To: inet-access@earth.com To: inet-access@earth.com Cc: francis yeung , inet-access@earth.com Subject: Re: L2TP [Was: Re: What do I want?] Resent-Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 08:20:05 -0600 (MDT) Resent-From: inet-access@earth.com At 04:31 PM 8/14/96 -0400, Paul Ferguson wrote: >At 11:39 PM 8/13/96 +0000, francis yeung wrote: ...snip... > http://www.internic.net/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-pppext-l2f-02.txt > > >There's also more information on L2F contained in the `Cisco IOS Software >Release 11.2' (Product Bulletin #487) bulletin: > > http://www.cisco.com/warp/public/732/112/487_pp.htm > ...snip... The L2TP draft is located (via ftp) at ftp.crystald.com:pub/vandys/l2tp.rfc-0.0 Chip --------------------------------------------------------- Hascall H. ("Chip") Sharp voice: (919) 408-0808 Consulting Engineer fax: Cisco Systems email: chsharp@cisco.com http://www.cisco.com/ --------------------------------------------------------- ============================== ISP Mailing List ============================== Email ``unsubscribe'' to inet-access-request@earth.com to be removed. Don't post very large messages, post a pointer to an ftp or web site. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 13:44:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA18628 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:44:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [204.216.27.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA18610 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:44:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from peedub.gj.org (newpc.muc.ditec.de [194.120.126.33]) by who.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.11) with ESMTP id NAA02667 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:41:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from peedub.gj.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by peedub.gj.org (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA27250 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:29:32 GMT Message-Id: <199608152229.WAA27250@peedub.gj.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.7 5/3/96 To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? Reply-To: Gary Jennejohn In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 11:38:19 MST." <22746.840134299@time.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:29:32 +0000 From: Gary Jennejohn Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: >> A friend recently gave me a TRS-80 Model I with Level-II BASIC and a >> Fortran compiler. "Memmmoreees..." > >Shouldn't that be "An ex-friend recently gave me..?" :-) > > Jordan > >P.S. At least you won't need a sound card for it, just locate an old >FM radio you're not using and set it about 2 feet away... :) > Ah! The game that came with the Sol 20 by Steven Domptier ! What was it called ? It was a shoot-em-up using the Sol's graphics character set. You used a radio to hear the sound effects (explosions, etc.). Really rather amazing. --- Gary Jennejohn Home - Gary.Jennejohn@munich.netsurf.de Work - gjennejohn@frt.dec.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 13:49:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA19604 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:49:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA19588; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:49:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA03955; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:49:49 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA06630; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:49:48 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id UAA01372; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:52:51 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608151852.UAA01372@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: locking up To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:52:51 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: sos@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608140700.JAA11609@ra.dkuug.dk> from "sos@freebsd.org" at "Aug 14, 96 09:00:35 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As sos@freebsd.org wrote: > Hmm, this one I know about, the suggested fix is to disable the > LED update sequence (or get another KBD controller)... > This will hang the keyboard both under X and in text mode... I don't think that's a keyboard _controller_ problem, it's merely a problem in handling the keyboard bus. Basically, the keyboard bus has been designed in the IBM PC era to be a uni-directional serial bus. There's a simple `clock' line where the initial signal slope indicates the start of a character transmission. When going to the AT however, IBM decided to abuse this bus for bi- directional transfer, e.g. in order to update the keyboard LEDs, and a few other functions. Of course, the hardware remained the same, and no method of bus arbitration has been added. Thus, if both sides assert the keyboard clock simultaneously, they start sending data then, and will eventually time out in getting no further response. The `Update LEDs' command is the most obvious offender, since it often happens together with scan codes being sent by the keyboard. Even systems like SCO suffer from this problem, i could reproducibly hang the latest SCO on one of the newer (supported!) HP Vectra machines we have been setting up on behalf of a customer. I'm not sure offhand, but there must be a possible recovery strategy in trying to abort the pending transfers, and re-initializing every- thing (the keyboard controller _and_ the keyboard). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 13:50:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA19775 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:50:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA19762 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:50:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA04066 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:50:31 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA06658 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:50:30 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA01747 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 21:38:30 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608151938.VAA01747@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Tape file systems (Was: Nightmare.) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 21:38:30 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608151541.KAA13861@brasil.moneng.mei.com> from Joe Greco at "Aug 15, 96 10:41:43 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Joe Greco wrote: (file system on tape) > > Please fix it if you have time. It is a usefull feature, in particular > > for a dat that can do moderately fast positioning. > > I don't have a DAT handy to try this with, actually (not here at least), > does anybody know what problems might prevent this? Writes won't work at all, since all our `streamer' drives do not support writing in the middle of a tape, they only allow appending. This is different with 9-track reel-to-reel tapes which are random access media. Read/only mounting should work on the (almost forgotten, but basically supported) block device, but all i get when trying it are IO errors. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 13:52:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA20108 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:52:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA20078 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 13:52:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA04165; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:51:41 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA06682; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:51:32 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA02096; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:03:53 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608152003.WAA02096@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: sysconfig To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:03:53 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: cgray@keanesea.com Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from Edwin Burley at "Aug 14, 96 05:49:51 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Edwin Burley wrote: > >>When installing FreeBSD you get the sysconfig ? I think. > >Is there anyway to bring up sysconfig after installing? > You can go to /etc and open it up to change something but take care.... I merely assume he means /stand/sysinstall. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 14:21:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA24280 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:21:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA24242 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:21:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA05775; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 23:21:23 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA07350; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 23:21:23 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA02573; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:58:35 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608152058.WAA02573@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: UPS for FreeBSD To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:58:35 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: johns@cruz.isle.net (John Scharles) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19960815204400.006d268c@isle.net> from John Scharles at "Aug 15, 96 01:44:00 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As John Scharles wrote: > I'm looking to purchase an ups for my freebsd box, but there seems to be a > dearth of shutdown programs available. I've found upsd for the APC but > nothing else. Does anyone have any recommendations for either hardware or > software? What's wrong with upsd? Btw., it's intended to be extensible to other UPS types, and still being under development. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 14:31:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA25424 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:31:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fullfeed.msn.fullfeed.com (fullfeed.msn.fullfeed.com [199.184.182.42]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA25412; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:31:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sumatra.americantv.com by fullfeed.msn.fullfeed.com (8.6.9/FF-1.1) id QAA16613; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 16:30:45 -0500 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sumatra.americantv.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id QAA08160; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 16:02:15 -0500 Received: (jlemon@localhost) by right.PCS (8.6.12/8.6.4) id QAA24642; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 16:28:13 -0500 From: Jonathan Lemon Message-Id: <199608152128.QAA24642@right.PCS> Subject: Re: locking up To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 16:28:13 -0500 (CDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, sos@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608151852.UAA01372@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Aug 15, 96 08:52:51 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > As sos@freebsd.org wrote: > > > Hmm, this one I know about, the suggested fix is to disable the > > LED update sequence (or get another KBD controller)... > > This will hang the keyboard both under X and in text mode... > > I don't think that's a keyboard _controller_ problem, it's merely a > problem in handling the keyboard bus. I don't think that it is a LED-related problem. In my syscons keyboard map, I've changed all instances of Caps-lock (clock) to Control (lctrl). Thus, the LEDs never light up on my keyboard, and I don't think that it ever touches the 'turn LED on' case in syscons. Yet I still get random lockups. :-( -- Jonathan From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 14:33:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA25649 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:33:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA25639 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:33:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <14753(1)>; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:32:50 PDT Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177517>; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:32:46 -0700 X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.7 5/3/96 To: michael butler cc: cshenton@it.hq.nasa.gov (Chris Shenton), hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 12:03:14 PDT." <199608151903.FAA00889@walkabout.asstdc.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:32:32 PDT From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <96Aug15.143246pdt.177517@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199608151903.FAA00889@walkabout.asstdc.com.au>you write: >Scrub using routed - as you've already gathered, it won't do VLSM. The routed in -current will. Maybe add "ripv2_out" to /etc/gateways to make sure you're using only ripv2. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 14:55:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA26972 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:55:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA26966 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:55:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA01492; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:43:17 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608152143.OAA01492@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: darrylo@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com (Darryl Okahata) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:43:16 -0700 (MST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608150659.AA203732347@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com> from "Darryl Okahata" at Aug 14, 96 11:59:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > a) Write a filesystem which understands tar files natively. Note: there may > > be a slight performance penalty for folks running with their root > > partitions mounted on a TARFS - perhaps we could note this somewhere. Tar fs's have a problem: O_APPEND. > While you're at it, how about tar-on-a-tape-FS? There's an MSDOS > driver that makes a tape drive look like a disk drive. Why not have > something similar for FreeBSD? People can then use their tape drive as > a disk. Imagine having the root disk on tape! "Infinite storage!" > (1001 evil ;-}) Tape-as-mountable-FS requires a block addressable tape. Most QIC tapes do not qualify; most non-QIC helical scan tapes do not qualify. If you have a TK50 or 9track or other DEC SCSI tape drive, this is a possiblity (although remote). But how useful would it be? > What about ZIPFS, or CPIOFS? ZOOFS? ARCFS? LBRFS? ZIPFS (a per file compression layer that uses gzip compression) already exists as a senior project of two of John Heidemann's students at UCLA. This, of course, assumes we fix our stacking vnode implementation to better resemeble the FICUS design documents from which it was derived. > Punch-tape-FS > is possible, but it wouldn't be politically correct -- too many trees > would get cut down. ;-} You can use mylar for punch tape. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 14:57:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA27165 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:57:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA27150 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:57:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA01513; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:49:35 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608152149.OAA01513@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: danny@panda.hilink.com.au (Daniel O'Callaghan) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:49:35 -0700 (MST) Cc: avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Daniel O'Callaghan" at Aug 15, 96 09:35:51 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > (do we have to continue to embaress ourselves about how well we know how > > to program in real BASIC ?:-) > > Didn't all real hackers start out by programming TRS-80's and Apple IIe's > back in '78/'79? I've still got some of my Applesoft and 6502 programs. > I just don't have a computer to run them on. Commodore PET and Ohio Scientific computers with chicklet keyboards and no more than 4k of RAM, and only those after their South-West Technical Products 6800's with S100 busses finally gave up the ghost. You can run your Apple programs on one of the 30 or so emulators, some of which run under X. I'm told that a 200MHz P6 can run 1MHz 6502 code at almost full speed... And this belongs on chat. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 15:00:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA27351 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:00:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA27330 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:00:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA01504; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:45:32 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608152145.OAA01504@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Nightmare. To: dfr@render.com (Doug Rabson) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:45:32 -0700 (MST) Cc: darrylo@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Doug Rabson" at Aug 15, 96 10:47:35 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > What about ZIPFS, or CPIOFS? ZOOFS? ARCFS? LBRFS? Punch-tape-FS > > is possible, but it wouldn't be politically correct -- too many trees > > would get cut down. ;-} > > More seriously, all these and more could be easily implemented using a > decent USERFS which would allow a simple filesystem to be implemented in > usermode. Simple == single threaded. I believe John Heidemann had one of these as well and used it for source level debugging of FS implementations. Again, this assumes that the FS architecture is changed slightly to more closely resemble FICUS, the design document from which it is supposedly derived. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 15:03:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA27664 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:03:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA27652 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:03:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA01529; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:54:10 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608152154.OAA01529@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: thorpej@nas.nasa.gov Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:54:10 -0700 (MST) Cc: danny@panda.hilink.com.au, avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608151535.IAA00980@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> from "Jason Thorpe" at Aug 15, 96 08:35:35 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > A friend recently gave me a TRS-80 Model I with Level-II BASIC and a > Fortran compiler. "Memmmoreees..." > > Now, I need to piece together the two incomplete Apple ][s (a ][+ and a > ][e) into something that works... Building a FreeBSD cluster, are we? 8-) 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 15:13:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA28742 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:13:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA28725 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:13:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA01564; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:05:27 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608152205.PAA01564@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? To: chat@freensd.org Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:05:27 -0700 (MST) Cc: thorpej@nas.nasa.gov, danny@panda.hilink.com.au, avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3667.840124921@critter.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Aug 15, 96 06:02:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > ha! Some of us thinks all those new-fangeled chip-thingies are only > for toys. (Nice toys, allright, but toys!) :-) > > Computers are built from transistors. Clear off that table corner, grab that thing in the box with the crank, and hand me that C clamp... I need to load BASIC. click click click click click click >tock< click click click click >tock< click click click click click >tock< click click click click click >tock< click click click click click >tock< click click click click click >tock< click click click click >tock< click click click >tock< click click click click click click click >tock< click click click >tock< ... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 15:15:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA29023 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:15:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ginger.vnet.net (root@ginger.vnet.net [166.82.1.69]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA29018 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:15:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vnet.net (elvis.vnet.net [166.82.1.5]) by ginger.vnet.net (8.6.13/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA08864; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:21:03 -0400 Received: from artist.vnet.net by vnet.net with SMTP id AA05121 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:15:09 -0400 Message-Id: X-Mailer: XFMail 0.4 [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199608152003.WAA02096@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:09:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Edwin Burley To: (Joerg Wunsch) Subject: Re: sysconfig Cc: J Wunsch Cc: J Wunsch , (FreeBSD hackers) , cgray@keanesea.com Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On 16-Aug-96 J Wunsch wrote: >>As Edwin Burley wrote: > >> >>When installing FreeBSD you get the sysconfig ? I think. >> >Is there anyway to bring up sysconfig after installing? > >> You can go to /etc and open it up to change something but take care.... > >I merely assume he means /stand/sysinstall. > >-- >cheers, J"org > NO..I said goto /etc and open it with jove/xemacs/vi etc... and edit the file by hand.... this way he/his does not have to run /stand/sysinstall again...because you can over write very easy with the sysinstall..... From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 15:17:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA29188 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:17:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from melb.werple.net.au (melb.werple.net.au [203.9.190.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA29181 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:17:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cimaxp1.UUCP (uucp@localhost) by melb.werple.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3/2) with UUCP id IAA08384 for mira!FreeBSD.org!freebsd-hackers; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:00:04 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199608152200.IAA08384@melb.werple.net.au> Received: by cimaxp1.cimlogic.com.au; (5.65/1.1.8.2/10Sep95-0953AM) id AA23483; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:00:44 +1000 From: John Birrell Subject: Re: FreeBSD vs. NT Stability To: haldjas.folklore.ee!narvi@melb.werple.net.au (Narvi) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:00:43 +1000 (EST) Cc: keltia.freenix.fr!roberto@melb.werple.net.au, FreeBSD.org!freebsd-hackers@melb.werple.net.au In-Reply-To: from "Narvi" at Aug 15, 96 11:03:08 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Before -current, you'd have to get pthread by yourself and worry about some > > functions in libc not aware about threads... > > Hmmm... I do not speak for anyone but myself but weren't they eing > developed on a 2.1.0 or -stable box? They work (at least worked) with > stable for me. I normally run libc_r from -current on 2.1.0R (haven't received a 2.1.5R subscription CD from WC). I doubt there were any syscall interface changes from 2.1.0R to 2.2-current that would affect libc. > > Sander > -- John Birrell CIMlogic Pty Ltd jb@cimlogic.com.au 119 Cecil Street Ph +61 3 9690 6900 South Melbourne Vic 3205 Fax +61 3 9690 6650 Australia Mob +61 18 353 137 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 15:38:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA01184 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:38:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA01171 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:38:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA01685 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:38:29 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id AAA27565 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:37:47 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id AAA22296; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:03:57 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608152203.AAA22296@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:03:56 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nightmare. In-Reply-To: ; from Developer on Aug 15, 1996 11:02:27 +0100 References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Developer: > Well, this would be handy, but what would be really useful is making ufs > understand both tar and tar.gz files, so we could do things like:- > > cd fred.tar.gz Midnight Commander (mc), a clone of Norton Commander, does exactly this. You "enter" a .tar.gz as if you were going into a directory. Really easy. Even easier than Emacs+dired+jka-compr... -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 15:38:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA01226 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:38:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA01179 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:38:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA01687 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:38:29 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id AAA27566 for hackers@freefall.freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:37:47 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id AAA22326; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:12:10 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608152212.AAA22326@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:12:10 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: <199608151657.QAA10487@wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov>; from Chris Shenton on Aug 15, 1996 12:57:53 -0400 References: <199608151657.QAA10487@wirehead.it.hq.nasa.gov> <199608151542.IAA17219@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Chris Shenton: > I'm having some routing weirdness and was wondering if routed supports > these different-length netmasks? What version of RIP is it? You need RIPv2 as others said. The 2.2-CURRENT routed is able to use RIPv2 (in addition to RIPv1 and RDISC). DESCRIPTION Routed is a dameon invoked at boot time to manage the network routing ta- bles. It uses Routing Information Protocol, RIPv1 (RFC 1058), RIPv2 (RFC 1723), and Internet Router Discovery Protocol (RFC 1256) to maintain the kernel routing table. The RIPv1 protocol is based on the reference 4.3BSD daemon. > If not, would gated do the trick? Yes of course. The main advantage of gated is that configuration is more complete (and somewhat harder too). -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 16:09:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA02752 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 16:09:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [204.216.27.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA02721 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 16:09:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.think.com (Mail1.Think.COM [131.239.33.245]) by who.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.11) with ESMTP id PAA02896 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 15:50:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Early-Bird.Think.COM (Early-Bird-1.Think.COM [131.239.146.105]) by mail.think.com (8.7.5/m3) with ESMTP id SAA18040; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:50:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from compound.Think.COM ([206.147.16.34]) by Early-Bird.Think.COM (8.7.5/e1) with ESMTP id SAA07439; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:50:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from alk@localhost) by compound.Think.COM (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA17158; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:50:56 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:50:56 -0500 (CDT) From: Tony Kimball Message-Id: <199608152250.RAA17158@compound.Think.COM> To: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth Wilko Bulte on Thu, 15 August: : : Pah! Mercury delay lines and relays! Where I come from it was once considered gauche to use electronics for the occasional one-off. Tinkertoys are good. Ropes are better. I kid you not. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 17:15:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA11637 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:15:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA11620 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:15:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dialup-usr11.etinc.com (dialup-usr11.etinc.com [204.141.95.132]) by etinc.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA17731; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:19:11 -0400 Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:19:11 -0400 Message-Id: <199608160019.UAA17731@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Julian Elischer From: dennis@etinc.com (Dennis) Subject: Re: (annoying) Arplookup message Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >Dennis wrote: >> >> I have a net with 2 different net addresses an whenever an arp request >> on the seconary net is issued, my freebsd machine on the other address >> complains as follows > >give the freebsd machine an alias on the 2nd net Well...the whole point is that its on a "hidden" net...... Dennis ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Emerging Technologies, Inc. http://www.etinc.com Synchronous Communications Cards and Routers For Discriminating Tastes. 56k to T1 and beyond. Frame Relay, PPP, HDLC, and X.25 for BSD/OS, FreeBSD and LINUX From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 17:38:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA15316 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:38:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from netgate.qcworld.com (netgate.qcworld.com [204.217.252.254]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA15309 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:38:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rigel.qcworld.com ([198.62.199.40]) by netgate.qcworld.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA16392 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:41:09 -0700 Received: from tailspin.qcworld.com (root@tailspin.qcworld.com [198.62.199.77]) by rigel.qcworld.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id RAA02930 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:37:17 -0700 Received: (from frf@localhost) by tailspin.qcworld.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id RAA12933 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:37:49 -0700 (PDT) From: frf Message-Id: <199608160037.RAA12933@tailspin.qcworld.com> Subject: KerberosIV question. To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:37:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk After setting up kerberos following the directions from the handbook, I'm getting this error when running kinit. I grep'd the mail archives but have only found similar questions. No answers seem to be present. frf@tailspin: 16 > uname -a FreeBSD tailspin.qcworld.com 2.1-STABLE FreeBSD 2.1-STABLE #1: Wed Aug 14 15:54:44 PDT 1996 frf@tailspin:/usr/src/sys/compile/TAILSPIN i386 frf@tailspin: 17 > kinit frf MIT Project Athena (tailspin.qcworld.com) Kerberos Initialization for "frf" kinit: Retry count exceeded (send_to_kdc) I suspect a simple config error, perhaps in services or inet.conf. Any suggestions? Robert Faulds ps. Any hope of a Yamaha CDR driver on the horizon? -- frf@qcworld.com frf@xocolatl.com "In every work of genius we recognize our own rejected thoughts: they come back to us with a certain alienated majesty." - Ralph Waldo Emerson From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 18:22:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA17803 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:22:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA17798 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:22:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA01816; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:14:57 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608160114.SAA01816@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: (annoying) Arplookup message To: dennis@etinc.com (Dennis) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:14:57 -0700 (MST) Cc: julian@whistle.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608160019.UAA17731@etinc.com> from "Dennis" at Aug 15, 96 08:19:11 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >> I have a net with 2 different net addresses an whenever an arp request > >> on the seconary net is issued, my freebsd machine on the other address > >> complains as follows > > > >give the freebsd machine an alias on the 2nd net > > Well...the whole point is that its on a "hidden" net...... What's the exact message? I can send you a patch to change it to: "I can't look that up, it's on a hidden net!". 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 18:25:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA18002 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:25:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ginger.vnet.net (root@ginger.vnet.net [166.82.1.69]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA17997 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:25:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vnet.net (elvis.vnet.net [166.82.1.5]) by ginger.vnet.net (8.6.13/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA12340; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 20:30:52 -0400 Received: from artist.vnet.net by vnet.net with SMTP id AA20657 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Thu, 15 Aug 1996 21:25:20 -0400 Message-Id: X-Mailer: XFMail 0.4 [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <01BB88FB.2E799770@FRIDAY> Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 21:15:16 -0400 (EDT) From: Edwin Burley To: Cyrus Gray Subject: RE: sysconfig Cc: "'FreeBSD Hackers'" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On 13-Aug-96 Cyrus Gray wrote: >>When installing FreeBSD you get the sysconfig ? I think. >Is there anyway to bring up sysconfig after installing? > You can goto etc and edit the file sysconfig by hand or if you wish to rerun the install program from /stand/sysinstall the last one will restart the install program you saw at the beginning for me I goto the /etc dir and edit what I wish to the sysconfig and reboot for it to work .....but take care you can lose something if you are not careful p.s. J Wunsch : is this more understandable /clear ..,in what I was trying to say..... From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 18:38:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA18674 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:38:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA18669; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:38:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA16474; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:25:53 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608160155.LAA16474@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: locking up To: jlemon@americantv.com (Jonathan Lemon) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:25:53 +0930 (CST) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, sos@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608152128.QAA24642@right.PCS> from "Jonathan Lemon" at Aug 15, 96 04:28:13 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jonathan Lemon stands accused of saying: > > I don't think that it is a LED-related problem. In my syscons keyboard > map, I've changed all instances of Caps-lock (clock) to Control (lctrl). > Thus, the LEDs never light up on my keyboard, and I don't think that it > ever touches the 'turn LED on' case in syscons. > > Yet I still get random lockups. :-( LED state is updated at every VC switch, even if the LEDs are all off. The biggest problem with automating a recovery from the hung state is that it's almost impossible for the keyboard driver to tell the difference between a hung keyboard and a user off making a coffee. None of the reset methods that I know of are safe enough to run on a regular basis - you'd have too many people complaining about losing keystrokes. I guess you could have a 'no LEDs' option for syscons for people who lock up too regularly... > Jonathan -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 19:05:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA20234 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 19:05:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA20214; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 19:05:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA01893; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:56:43 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608160156.SAA01893@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: locking up To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 18:56:43 -0700 (MST) Cc: jlemon@americantv.com, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, sos@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608160155.LAA16474@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Aug 16, 96 11:25:53 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Yet I still get random lockups. :-( > > LED state is updated at every VC switch, even if the LEDs are all off. > > The biggest problem with automating a recovery from the hung state is that > it's almost impossible for the keyboard driver to tell the difference > between a hung keyboard and a user off making a coffee. > > None of the reset methods that I know of are safe enough to run on a > regular basis - you'd have too many people complaining about losing > keystrokes. I guess you could have a 'no LEDs' option for syscons > for people who lock up too regularly... Yet, DOS does it. I suspect that it would be a good idea to disassemble the ROMs for the keyboard handling code on machines which misbehave. This will tell you once and for all what the problem is for that machine. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 19:10:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA20641 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 19:10:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA20634; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 19:10:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA16667; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:55:04 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608160225.LAA16667@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: locking up To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:55:03 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, jlemon@americantv.com, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, sos@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608160156.SAA01893@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 15, 96 06:56:43 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert stands accused of saying: > > > > Yet I still get random lockups. :-( > > > > LED state is updated at every VC switch, even if the LEDs are all off. > > > > The biggest problem with automating a recovery from the hung state is that > > it's almost impossible for the keyboard driver to tell the difference > > between a hung keyboard and a user off making a coffee. > > > > None of the reset methods that I know of are safe enough to run on a > > regular basis - you'd have too many people complaining about losing > > keystrokes. I guess you could have a 'no LEDs' option for syscons > > for people who lock up too regularly... > > Yet, DOS does it. DOS doesn't VC switch. The keyboard code I've worked on (at the keyboard end), _specifically_ hangs around after a key that it thinks will generate a LED update has been pressed, waiting for the update so that it doesn't collide. (Mind you, this code also snooped for collisions and generally did a fairly good job of avoiding them). > Terry Lambert -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 22:41:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA08400 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:41:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA08395 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 22:41:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (michaelh@localhost) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.7.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id FAA23802 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 05:41:14 GMT Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:41:13 +0900 (JST) From: Michael Hancock To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: STREAM benchmark, (not streams) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk This site has the benchmark, http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~mccalpin/ Here's what I got on the following hardware: Tyan Tempest II MB (Neptune based and slow) 32MB 60ns parity RAM 2 x 16MB simms P166 ------------------------------------------------------------- This system uses 8 bytes per DOUBLE PRECISION word. ------------------------------------------------------------- Array size = 1000000, Offset = 0 Total memory required = 22.9 MB. Each test is run 10 times, but only the *best* time for each is used. ------------------------------------------------------------- Your clock granularity/precision appears to be 7812 microseconds. Each test below will take on the order of 250000 microseconds. (= 32 clock ticks) Increase the size of the arrays if this shows that you are not getting at least 20 clock ticks per test. ------------------------------------------------------------- WARNING: The above is only a rough guideline. For best results, please be sure you know the precision of your system timer. ------------------------------------------------------------- Function Rate (MB/s) RMS time Min time Max time Assignment: 40.1569 0.4073 0.3984 0.4453 Scaling : 40.1569 0.4228 0.3984 0.5156 Summing : 49.5484 0.5183 0.4844 0.6094 SAXPYing : 49.5484 0.5247 0.4844 0.6328 I compiled it on FreeBSD Current. cc -O stream_d.c second_cpu.c -o stream_d -lm I'm curious to see some numbers from others, especially from people with Tyan Tomcat I or II motherboards. The Tomcat I was used in the recent BSDI web benchmarks. Regards, Mike Hancock From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Aug 15 23:21:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA09961 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 23:21:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA09949 for ; Thu, 15 Aug 1996 23:21:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id IAA23454 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:21:19 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA13947 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:21:18 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id IAA04906 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:09:48 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608160609.IAA04906@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: sysconfig To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:09:48 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from Edwin Burley at "Aug 15, 96 06:09:24 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Edwin Burley wrote: > NO..I said goto /etc and open it with jove/xemacs/vi etc... Yep, i can read. :-) > and edit the file by hand.... this way he/his does not have to run > /stand/sysinstall again...because you can over write very easy with > the sysinstall..... However, editing /etc/sysconfig is only a minor piece of work that /stand/sysinstall does. For example, you can also use the latter now to integrate a new disk, or to manage ports and package installation. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 00:35:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA14891 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:35:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lestat.nas.nasa.gov (lestat.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.50.29]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA14882 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:35:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lestat.nas.nasa.gov (8.7.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA10529; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:27:34 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608160727.AAA10529@lestat.nas.nasa.gov> X-Authentication-Warning: lestat.nas.nasa.gov: Host localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Terry Lambert Cc: danny@panda.hilink.com.au, avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? Reply-To: Jason Thorpe From: Jason Thorpe Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:27:34 -0700 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996 14:54:10 -0700 (MST) Terry Lambert wrote: > Building a FreeBSD cluster, are we? > > 8-) 8-). Errr, uhh... I thought FreeBSD only ran on PCs... DOH! :-) -- Jason R. Thorpe (NetBSD/hp300 guy) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 00:46:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA15728 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:46:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nike.efn.org (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.28]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA15723 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:45:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.efn.org [127.0.0.1]) by nike.efn.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA08006; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:45:34 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:45:33 -0700 (PDT) From: John-Mark Gurney Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney To: Bruce Evans cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sio problems with 2.2-960801-SNAP In-Reply-To: <199608141927.FAA01058@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Bruce Evans wrote: > >> Aug 8 11:52:22 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 4 > >> Aug 8 11:52:41 plato last message repeated 3 times > >> Aug 8 11:53:55 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 4 > >> Aug 8 11:53:55 plato /kernel.2.2: too many stray irq 4's; not logging any more > >> Aug 8 12:15:41 plato /kernel.2.2: stray irq 3 > > >Basically, there's something screwed with your interrupt > >configuration. Stray irq's are not supposed to happen for a > >configured driver, they are generated by catch-all code inside > >the ISA bus controller driver, thus a strong indication that > >your IRQs never reach the sio driver. > > The catch-all code delivers stray IRQs to IRQ7 (and maybe to > IRQ15). `stray irq 4' simply means that an IRQ4 occurred > but no driver is attached to IRQ4. I don't know how this can > happen. If there is no driver attached to an IRQ, then that > IRQ is masked, except for the catch-all IRQ7. so... if I get a Stray irq 7 it could be from another device? also... is a simple fix to put something on irq7? or just let them happen? thanks for the info.. TTYL.. John-Mark gurney_j@efn.org http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ Modem/FAX: (541) 683-6954 (FreeBSD Box) Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD (unix) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 01:28:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id BAA17980 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 01:28:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from toplink1.toplink.net (toplink1.toplink.net [194.163.120.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA17969 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 01:28:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from freebsd@localhost) by toplink1.toplink.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA04015; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:27:07 +0200 From: FreeBSD Mailing List Message-Id: <199608160827.KAA04015@toplink1.toplink.net> Subject: Re: (annoying) Arplookup message To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:27:07 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608160114.SAA01816@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 15, 96 06:14:57 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi > > > >> I have a net with 2 different net addresses an whenever an arp request > > >> on the seconary net is issued, my freebsd machine on the other address > > >> complains as follows > > > > > >give the freebsd machine an alias on the 2nd net > > > > Well...the whole point is that its on a "hidden" net...... > > What's the exact message? I can send you a patch to change it to: > > "I can't look that up, it's on a hidden net!". You need to patch if_ether.c in /usr/src/sys/netinet. This thing can get very annoying when you have more than one subnet routed to one ethernet. ;( Greetings Christian --------------------------------- ck@toplink1: {29} pwd /usr/src/sys/netinet ck@toplink1: {30} diff if_ether.c.dist if_ether.c 577c577,581 < why = "host is not on local network"; --- > /* > * CK 27.7.1996: get rid of pesky arp messeages on console ;-) > */ > /* why = "host is not on local network"; */ > why = NULL; ck@toplink1: {31} --------------------------------- -- TopLink GbR, Internet Services ck@toplink.net Christian Kratzer http://www.toplink.net/ Phone: +49 7452 885-0 Fax: +49 7452 885-199 FreeBSD spoken here! From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 02:44:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA22625 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 02:44:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA22598 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 02:44:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minnow.render.com (minnow.render.com [193.195.178.1]) by minnow.render.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA23778; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:42:12 +0100 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:42:10 +0100 (BST) From: Doug Rabson To: Terry Lambert cc: "Daniel O'Callaghan" , avalon@coombs.anu.edu.au, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ipfw vs ipfilter? In-Reply-To: <199608152149.OAA01513@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > (do we have to continue to embaress ourselves about how well we know how > > > to program in real BASIC ?:-) > > > > Didn't all real hackers start out by programming TRS-80's and Apple IIe's > > back in '78/'79? I've still got some of my Applesoft and 6502 programs. > > I just don't have a computer to run them on. > > Commodore PET and Ohio Scientific computers with chicklet keyboards and > no more than 4k of RAM, and only those after their South-West Technical > Products 6800's with S100 busses finally gave up the ghost. > > You can run your Apple programs on one of the 30 or so emulators, some > of which run under X. > > I'm told that a 200MHz P6 can run 1MHz 6502 code at almost full speed... I bet it can emulate a 6502 much faster than that. I used to have a 68k emulator which was faster than an Amiga 500 when running on a 486/66 and a P6 is a tad faster than that... -- Doug Rabson, Microsoft RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 171 734 3761 FAX: +44 171 734 6426 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 04:37:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA26674 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 04:37:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tick.ssec.wisc.edu (tick.ssec.wisc.edu [144.92.108.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA26669 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 04:37:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tick.ssec.wisc.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tick.ssec.wisc.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA28295; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:37:42 -0500 (CDT) From: Dave Glowacki Message-Id: <199608161137.GAA28295@tick.ssec.wisc.edu> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: frf cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: KerberosIV question. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 15 Aug 1996 17:37:49 PDT." <199608160037.RAA12933@tailspin.qcworld.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:37:36 -0500 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > After setting up kerberos following the directions from the handbook, > I'm getting this error when running kinit. I grep'd the mail archives > but have only found similar questions. No answers seem to be present. > > frf@tailspin: 17 > kinit frf > MIT Project Athena (tailspin.qcworld.com) > Kerberos Initialization for "frf" > kinit: Retry count exceeded (send_to_kdc) > > I suspect a simple config error, perhaps in services or inet.conf. > Any suggestions? I'm pretty sure this means kinit can't contact your main server. Make sure the Kerberos domain in your krb.conf file is set correctly and that the server associated with it is up and running. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 04:52:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA27154 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 04:52:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA27145 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 04:52:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id VAA20062; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 21:49:45 +1000 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 21:49:45 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608161149.VAA20062@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, gurney_j@nike.efn.org Subject: Re: sio problems with 2.2-960801-SNAP Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >so... if I get a Stray irq 7 it could be from another device? also... is It's guaranteed to be from a device that isn't configured to use IRQ7. >a simple fix to put something on irq7? or just let them happen? thanks Configuring a device to use IRQ7 just breaks the reporting of stray interrupts. Just let them happen. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 05:08:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id FAA27723 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 05:08:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.monmouth.com (pechter@shell.monmouth.com [205.164.220.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id FAA27714 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 05:08:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from pechter@localhost) by shell.monmouth.com (8.7.4/8.7.3) id IAA01360 for FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:05:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill/Carolyn Pechter Message-Id: <199608161205.IAA01360@shell.monmouth.com> Subject: File System on a tape To: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD-hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:05:23 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > From: Joe Greco > Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 09:04:43 -0500 (CDT) > Subject: Re: Nightmare. > > How about UFS-on-a-tape :-) Never forget the obvious ones. > > # newfs /dev/rst0 > /dev/rst0: 8257536 sectors in 2016 cylinders of 1 tracks, 4096 sectors > 4032.0MB in 126 cyl groups (16 c/g, 32.00MB/g, 7680 i/g) > super-block backups (for fsck -b #) at: > 32, 65568, 131104, 196640, 262176, 327712, 393248, 458784, 524320, 589856, [superblocks deleted --ed ] > # cd /mnt > (whirrrr chug) > # (cd /usr; tar cvf - .) | tar xf - > (whirrrr chug whirrrr chug whirrr chug for several years) > > ... JG Pyramid did this with OS/x and a program called mkrofs (make read-only file system) which built a file system and dd'd it to the disk. It booted like a disk and was used for installation and emergency recovery. It worked with all 9track and 1/4 inch tapes they used for distribution. Seek time sucked -- to optimize you needed to put the common files up front on the file list -- but it was customizable. Mkrofs had a file list that you could use to add local customizations (password files, fstabs, disktabs) so you could build a Rofs tape for installs that served as an emergency recovery tape or a customized install tape. I think it built the file system in /tmp or in a memory based file system and dd to disk. The only problem was limiting the stuff to 1 tape and the size of free space you had to create the stuff. (I seem to remember it used tmp). We could sure use something like this. Some kind of program would be needed to boot the tape, though. A modified FreeBSD program loader that would load from tape... Could something like this be done under dos for recovery and installation? Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Pechter/Carolyn Pechter | 17 Meredith Drive, Tinton Falls, NJ 07724, 908-389-3592 | pechter@shell.monmouth.com I'll run Win95 on my box when you pry the keyboard from my cold, dead hands. FreeBSD, OS/2, CP/M, RT11, spoken here. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 05:36:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id FAA28811 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 05:36:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dada.kaizen.net (dada.kaizen.net [206.27.236.38]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id FAA28803 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 05:36:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (mnewell@localhost) by dada.kaizen.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA11326; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:32:44 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: dada.kaizen.net: mnewell owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:32:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Mike Newell To: Joe Greco cc: Chris Shenton , hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: <199608151738.MAA14144@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 15 Aug 1996, Joe Greco wrote: > I use static routing around here with no problems. I found static routes to be a problem. If the ppp link goes down and a packet arrives it redirects the route out throught he default; when the link comes back up it doesn't get re-re-directed. :-( What we were trying to do is use the /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down to install static routes, but route won't work for non-root logins. :-( I remember something about this on the list, but I've not had a chance to research it. :-(!! But gated is clearly the way to go. I don't know if it's all that important to run OSPF, but certainly RIPv2 is basic. Thanks, Mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 05:41:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id FAA28979 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 05:41:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whizzo.transsys.com (whizzo.TransSys.COM [144.202.42.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id FAA28971 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 05:41:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.transsys.com (localhost.transsys.com [127.0.0.1]) by whizzo.transsys.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA04574; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:41:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199608161241.IAA04574@whizzo.transsys.com> X-Authentication-Warning: whizzo.transsys.com: Host localhost.transsys.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Bill/Carolyn Pechter cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD-hackers) From: "Louis A. Mamakos" Subject: Re: File System on a tape References: <199608161205.IAA01360@shell.monmouth.com> In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:05:23 EDT." <199608161205.IAA01360@shell.monmouth.com> Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:41:17 -0400 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > We could sure use something like this. Some kind of program would be needed > to boot the tape, though. A modified FreeBSD program loader that would load > from tape... Could something like this be done under dos for recovery and > installation? While it's an interesting novelty, how is this better than booting/loading something off a floppy? Pretty much everyone will have a floppy on their system (or perhaps a CDROM drive), but how many have a tape drive? I think that a floppy disk bootstrap for a "full-feature" read-only CDROM filesystem would be considerably more useful. Though not quite as good a hack, I'll grant you. louie From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 06:20:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA00758 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:20:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA00719 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:20:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA09069; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20:08 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA00317 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:01:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id JAA00489 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:08:00 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:08:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161308.JAA00489@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Subject: panic during 2.1.5 install... Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I reported this problem at 2.1, and I've gotten it again when installing 2.1.5 on the same machine. After the install does the dislable, it begins to do the newfs on the root partition, I get: panic: ffs_valloc: dup alloc which, of course, doesn't get anything installed :-) I think it has something to do with the 8192 block size, if I alter this parameter, things work out better. Also, judicious selection of the cyl/h/sector sizes seem to repair the problem as well... - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 06:20:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA00752 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:20:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA00720 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:20:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA09074; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20:09 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA00322 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:02:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id JAA00494 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:08:44 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:08:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161308.JAA00494@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Subject: netdb.h and -traditional... Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk While building some older (non-ANSI) sources with the -traditional flag, I ran into the following (on 2.1.5) on line 139 of netdb.h: const char *hstrerror __P((int)); which, of course, breaks because 'const' is ANSI. I did a quick grep(1) of /usr/include and didn't see any other uses of 'const' for a return type... but, it was a really quick scan... I did see other files that were missing the __P and made similar ANSI assumptions; but they were new files that wouldn't be #include'd by older code... Although, looking at cdefs.h - I see you should be able to define NO_ANSI_KEYWORDS to get the behaviour I'm after. It just seems to me that 'const' as part of a visible type declaration should be defined away for the same reason that function prototypes are, at the same time they are. Opinions? - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 06:20:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA00754 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:20:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA00721 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:20:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA09079; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20:09 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA00327 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:02:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id JAA00498 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:09:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:09:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161309.JAA00498@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Subject: netdb.h and -traditional (more....) Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well - I added -DNO_ANSI_KEYWORDS - which, examining cdefs.h, should have "removed" 'const' by #define'ing it away... Didn't work. So, I made the following change to netdb.h - it's ugly, but it does the job (recall that the job is I'd like to compile some ancient pre-ANSI code, so I don't have the luxury of not using -traditional): *** netdb.h.ori Tue Jul 16 22:10:41 1996 --- netdb.h Thu Aug 15 13:04:22 1996 *************** *** 136,142 **** --- 136,146 ---- struct servent *getservbyport __P((int, const char *)); struct servent *getservent __P((void)); void herror __P((const char *)); + #ifdef __STDC__ const char *hstrerror __P((int)); + #else + char *hstrerror __P((int)); + #endif void sethostent __P((int)); /* void sethostfile __P((const char *)); */ void setnetent __P((int)); - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 06:26:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA01295 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:26:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA01290 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:26:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA08422; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:26:13 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199608161326.GAA08422@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: File System on a tape To: louie@TransSys.COM (Louis A. Mamakos) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:26:13 -0700 (MST) Cc: pechter@shell.monmouth.com, FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608161241.IAA04574@whizzo.transsys.com> from "Louis A. Mamakos" at Aug 16, 96 08:41:17 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > We could sure use something like this. Some kind of program would be needed > > to boot the tape, though. A modified FreeBSD program loader that would load > > from tape... Could something like this be done under dos for recovery and > > installation? > > While it's an interesting novelty, how is this better than > booting/loading something off a floppy? Pretty much everyone will Surely you jest? Have you ever tried to *load* FBSD off of floppies? With a file system on tape, you can boot and then just mount the tape and 'cp /tape/what/ever/you/want /wherever/you/want/it'. With floppies, you'd have to have explicitly prepared individual little filesystems to be able to recover anything at whill. Or, play with all the little furrballs, etc. > have a floppy on their system (or perhaps a CDROM drive), but how many > have a tape drive? I suspect anyone who take this stuff halfway serious has *some* form of tape -- even a little cartridge tape! > I think that a floppy disk bootstrap for a "full-feature" read-only > CDROM filesystem would be considerably more useful. I thought we already have that? And, it doesn't help you with anything *else* you've added to the file hierarchy -- e.g., ports! > Though not quite as good a hack, I'll grant you. My mt driver should be able to do this -- it was one of the criteria I used when writing it (and Joerg and I had a few chuckles over the silliness of it!) but I haven't gotten off my butt and ported it to 2.1R (from 1.1.5.1R). Also, I doubt it would help anyone *else* (since every query I posted to the list failed to produce any other folks with similar devices) :> I'm curious as to whether or not my DLT would work in a block mode. Or, is the limitation solely in the st device??? --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 06:34:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA02158 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:34:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from falcon.tioga.com (root@falcon.tioga.com [205.146.65.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA02143 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 06:34:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from tbalfe@localhost) by falcon.tioga.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id JAA13055; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:35:36 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:35:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas J Balfe To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: /kernel messages Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I was wondering what this means, it's from my primary nameserver. Aug 16 08:54:18 falcon /kernel: in_rtqtimo: adjusted rtq_reallyold to 2400 Aug 16 09:04:18 falcon /kernel: in_rtqtimo: adjusted rtq_reallyold to 1600 Aug 16 09:19:09 falcon /kernel: in_rtqtimo: adjusted rtq_reallyold to 1066 Aug 16 09:29:09 falcon /kernel: in_rtqtimo: adjusted rtq_reallyold to 710 ======================================================================== Thomas J Balfe tbalfe@tioga.com President http://www.tioga.com/ Tioga Communications, Inc 814-867-4770 ======================================================================== "Humanity has been compared...to a sleeper who handles matches in his sleep and wakes to find himself in flames." - H.G. Wells The World Set Free 1914 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 07:05:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA04533 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:05:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.monmouth.com (pechter@shell.monmouth.com [205.164.220.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA04527 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:05:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from pechter@localhost) by shell.monmouth.com (8.7.4/8.7.3) id KAA07940; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:02:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill/Carolyn Pechter Message-Id: <199608161402.KAA07940@shell.monmouth.com> Subject: Re: File System on a tape To: dgy@rtd.com, FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD-hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:02:07 -0400 (EDT) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD-hackers) In-Reply-To: <199608161326.GAA08422@seagull.rtd.com> from "Don Yuniskis" at Aug 16, 96 06:26:13 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > While it's an interesting novelty, how is this better than > > booting/loading something off a floppy? Pretty much everyone will > > Surely you jest? Have you ever tried to *load* FBSD off of floppies? > With a file system on tape, you can boot and then just mount the tape > and 'cp /tape/what/ever/you/want /wherever/you/want/it'. With floppies, > you'd have to have explicitly prepared individual little filesystems > to be able to recover anything at whill. Or, play with all the > little furrballs, etc. > > > have a floppy on their system (or perhaps a CDROM drive), but how many > > have a tape drive? Folks, it also is kind of nice for those folks who have access to some kind of tape drive and no CDROM -- or (more common) an Unsupported CDROM. Imagine if the folks with wierd IDE CD's could cut a tape and install from that before having to get hacked kernels. I've had to make the floppy sets at times because of not enough DOS partition space to put the distribution. If I could dd or tar to tape and install from tape it would be a great ease of installation issue at times. Also, sooner or later we're going to go multiplatform (I hope) and one day we may need the capability. Bill Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Pechter/Carolyn Pechter | 17 Meredith Drive, Tinton Falls, NJ 07724, 908-389-3592 | pechter@shell.monmouth.com I'll run Win95 on my box when you pry the keyboard from my cold, dead hands. FreeBSD, OS/2, CP/M, RT11, spoken here. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 07:06:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA04596 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:06:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.monmouth.com (pechter@shell.monmouth.com [205.164.220.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA04586 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:06:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from pechter@localhost) by shell.monmouth.com (8.7.4/8.7.3) id KAA07992; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:02:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill/Carolyn Pechter Message-Id: <199608161402.KAA07992@shell.monmouth.com> Subject: Re: File System on a tape To: louie@TransSys.COM (Louis A. Mamakos) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:02:57 -0400 (EDT) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD-hackers) In-Reply-To: <199608161241.IAA04574@whizzo.transsys.com> from "Louis A. Mamakos" at Aug 16, 96 08:41:17 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > > We could sure use something like this. Some kind of program would be needed > > to boot the tape, though. A modified FreeBSD program loader that would load > > from tape... Could something like this be done under dos for recovery and > > installation? > > While it's an interesting novelty, how is this better than > booting/loading something off a floppy? Pretty much everyone will > have a floppy on their system (or perhaps a CDROM drive), but how many > have a tape drive? > > I think that a floppy disk bootstrap for a "full-feature" read-only > CDROM filesystem would be considerably more useful. > > Though not quite as good a hack, I'll grant you. > > louie > > agreed... but there's so many CDROMS (IDE) giving us problems this makes some sense. Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Pechter/Carolyn Pechter | 17 Meredith Drive, Tinton Falls, NJ 07724, 908-389-3592 | pechter@shell.monmouth.com I'll run Win95 on my box when you pry the keyboard from my cold, dead hands. FreeBSD, OS/2, CP/M, RT11, spoken here. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 07:19:13 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA05479 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:19:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA05364 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:19:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA11671; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:19:04 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199608161419.HAA11671@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: File System on a tape To: pechter@shell.monmouth.com (Bill/Carolyn Pechter) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:19:04 -0700 (MST) Cc: dgy@rtd.com, FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608161402.KAA07940@shell.monmouth.com> from "Bill/Carolyn Pechter" at Aug 16, 96 10:02:07 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > have a floppy on their system (or perhaps a CDROM drive), but how many > > > have a tape drive? > > Folks, it also is kind of nice for those folks who have access to some > kind of tape drive and no CDROM -- or (more common) an Unsupported > CDROM. > > Imagine if the folks with wierd IDE CD's could cut a tape and install > from that before having to get hacked kernels. I've had to make the > floppy sets at times because of not enough DOS partition space > to put the distribution. If I could dd or tar to tape and install from tape > it would be a great ease of installation issue at times. I *thought* installing from tape *was* supported?? Or, is this broke? > Also, sooner or later we're going to go multiplatform (I hope) and one > day we may need the capability. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 07:20:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA05907 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:20:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA05892 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:20:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA13116; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:20:03 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA00426 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:01:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id KAA00576 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:08:13 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:08:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161408.KAA00576@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Subject: SIO problem updates... it's not pretty... Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well - You may have noticed my other mail regarding converting to 2.1.5. Here's the scoop on what I've discovered with sio. At 2.1.5 - I can lock up a real 16550 on a 386DX-33 at 19200. (Before it would only be at 38400.) Something has changed for the worse here. I'd hate to have to drop down to 9600 just to stay connected... Does anyone have suggestions as to how to proceed... I'm willing to start hacking at this point... - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 07:20:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA05926 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:20:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA05890 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:20:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA13102; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:20:01 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA00353 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:10:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id JAA00514 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:16:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:16:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161316.JAA00514@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Subject: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well - I've completed the upgrade of my mail server to 2.1.5. What did I discover? There's no way to tell sendmail to not use DNS (it will be fixed in a "future" version.) So, after setting up DNS, I found out it still didn't work the way I expected. I wanted items whose name was not resolved to go to the smart-host; but apparently, no matter what you do; in 8.7.5, (rule 3?) if it can't find the name it queues it for later... So, even though my name server doesn't know about "test@foo.bar", after the timeout, sendmail simply dropped the mail in the mailq. The only option is to recompile sendmail with the option: -DNAMED_BIND=0 to disable using DNS... (If you see this mail; then I was successfull in setting this up...) Just an F.Y.I - perhaps it should go somewhere in the handbook until a newer version of sendmail is put into FreeBSD... - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 07:20:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA05905 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:20:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA05891 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:20:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA13111; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:20:02 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA00391 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:25:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id JAA00547; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:31:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:31:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161331.JAA00547@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers, ponds!lakes.water.net!rivers Subject: Nameserver and 'rlogin' in 2.1.5. Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk You may have read my recent sendmail findings - where I related a different DNS problem... This has to do with rlogin. I have two machines handling my non-internet domain "water.net". One of them is named 'ponds' (the primary nameserver - 10.0.0.1) the other 'lakes' (the secondry nameserver 10.0.0.3). /etc/resolv.conf on both of these machines looks like: domain water.net nameserver 10.0.0.1 nameserver 10.0.0.3 Now, if I'm on lakes and issue: rlogin ponds I have to wait for a nameserver timeout before the rlogin completes. (Of course, since I can't contact the top domain servers - this takes a *long* time to timeout... I'm not connected to the "real" internet very often.) But, if I'm on ponds and say: rlogin ponds or rlogin lakes I get no problems (real fast - no waiting on DNS.) Also, if I'm on lakes and say: rlogin lakes I have to similarly wait for a nameserver timeout before completing the login... logging into the same machine? I'm betting its a nameserver issue because I can delete /etc/resolv.conf on both machines and things complete in their usual timely fashion... I'm not sure what's going on here, especially since it's not symmetric... does anyone have a clue (I thought that maybe I had a typo in the reverse IP-> name mappings... but I can't see it...) I've included my named.boot and the other files for the primary server... hints/suggestions would be *very* welcome :-) Other than the rlogin problem - DNS seems to work very well... - Thanks - - Dave Rivers - -------------------- named.boot --------------------------------------- directory /etc/namedb primary water.net db.water primary 0.0.10.in-addr.arpa db.10.0.0 primary 0.0.127.in-addr.arpa db.127.0.0 cache . db.cache -------------------- db.water --------------------------------------- water.net. IN SOA ponds.water.net. lakes.water.net. ( 1 ; Serial 10800 ; Refresh after 3 hours 3600 ; Retry after 1 hour 604800 ; Expire after 1 week 86400 ) ; Minimum TTL of 1 day ; ; Name servers ; water.net. IN NS ponds.water.net. water.net. IN NS lakes.water.net. ; ; Addresses for the canonical names ; localhost.water.net. IN A 127.0.0.1 ponds.water.net. IN A 10.0.0.1 streams.water.net. IN A 10.0.0.2 lakes.water.net. IN A 10.0.0.3 ponds-slip.water.net. IN A 10.0.0.4 rivulet.water.net. IN A 10.0.0.5 trickle.water.net. IN A 10.0.0.6 -------------------- db.10.0.0 --------------------------------------- 0.0.10.in-addr.arpa. IN SOA ponds.water.net. lakes.water.net. ( 1 ; Serial 10800 ; Refresh after 3 hours 3600 ; Retry after 1 hour 604800 ; Expire after 1 week 86400 ) ; Minimum TTL of 1 day ; ; Name servers ; 0.0.10.in-addr.arpa. IN NS ponds.water.net. 0.0.10.in-addr.arpa. IN NS lakes.water.net. ; ; Addresses point to the canonical name 1.0.0.10.in-addr.arpa. IN PTR ponds.water.net. 2.0.0.10.in-addr.arpa. IN PTR streams.water.net. 3.0.0.10.in-addr.arpa. IN PTR lakes.water.net. 4.0.0.10.in-addr.arpa. IN PTR ponds-slip.water.net. 5.0.0.10.in-addr.arpa. IN PTR rivulet.water.net. 6.0.0.10.in-addr.arpa. IN PTR trickle.water.net. -------------------- db.127.0.0 --------------------------------------- 0.0.127.in-addr.arpa. IN SOA ponds.water.net. lakes.water.net. ( 1 ; Serial 10800 ; Refresh after 3 hours 3600 ; Retry after 1 hour 604800 ; Expire after 1 week 86400 ) ; Minimum TTL of 1 day 0.0.127.in-addr.arpa. IN NS ponds.water.net. 0.0.127.in-addr.arpa. IN NS lakes.water.net. 1.0.0.127.in-addr.arpa. IN PTR localhost. -------------------- db.cache --------------------------------------- . 99999999 IN NS a.root-servers.net. . 99999999 IN NS b.root-servers.net. . 99999999 IN NS c.root-servers.net. . 99999999 IN NS d.root-servers.net. . 99999999 IN NS e.root-servers.net. . 99999999 IN NS f.root-servers.net. . 99999999 IN NS g.root-servers.net. . 99999999 IN NS h.root-servers.net. . 99999999 IN NS i.root-servers.net. a.root-servers.net. 99999999 IN A 198.41.0.4 b.root-servers.net. 99999999 IN A 128.9.0.107 c.root-servers.net. 99999999 IN A 192.33.4.12 d.root-servers.net. 99999999 IN A 128.8.10.90 e.root-servers.net. 99999999 IN A 192.203.230.10 f.root-servers.net. 99999999 IN A 192.5.5.241 g.root-servers.net. 99999999 IN A 192.112.36.4 h.root-servers.net. 99999999 IN A 128.63.2.53 i.root-servers.net. 99999999 IN A 192.36.148.17 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 07:50:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA07903 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:50:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA07875 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:50:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA15446; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:50:06 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:50 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA02094 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:27:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id KAA01375 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:33:52 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:33:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161433.KAA01375@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Subject: more general info on SIO problems in 2.1.5. Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Just to let everyone know what I have eliminated... 1) I have replaced the cables - the problem's not there. 2) I've used two different modems (thinking the problem might be the Pratical Peripherals PC288LCD.) nope - I get it *very* quickly with a Micrcom DeskPorte FAST. 3) I have eliminted the specific device - I can reproduce the problem on either cuaa1 or cuaa0. I'm going to pull the machine apart and make sure everything is well connected... but other than that, it seems I'm missing something. Let me describe the problem a little more... maybe that will help narrow it down. I can reproduce this easily with kermit - the particular status of it right now (in reproduction) is (output of /bin/ps -gaxl): UID PID PPID CPU PRI NI VSZ RSS WCHAN STAT TT TIME COMMAND 0 1647 1459 15 3 0 744 104 ttyin I+ p0 0:00.64 kermit kermit is connected to /dev/cuaa0 - whose tty settings are: ponds# stty -f /dev/cuaa0 -a speed 38400 baud; 0 rows; 0 columns; lflags: -icanon -isig -iexten -echo -echoe -echok -echoke -echonl -echoctl -echoprt -altwerase -noflsh -tostop -flusho -pendin -nokerninfo -extproc iflags: -istrip -icrnl -inlcr -igncr ixon ixoff -ixany -imaxbel ignbrk -brkint -inpck ignpar -parmrk oflags: -opost -onlcr -oxtabs cflags: cread cs8 -parenb -parodd hupcl clocal -cstopb crtscts -dsrflow -dtrflow -mdmbuf cchars: discard = ^O; dsusp = ^Y; eof = ^D; eol = ; eol2 = ; erase = ^?; intr = ^C; kill = ^U; lnext = ^V; min = 1; quit = ^\; reprint = ^R; start = ^Q; status = ; stop = ^S; susp = ^Z; time = 0; werase = ^W; The behaviour I get is that when large amounts of data are generated at the other end (after dialing a remote system) - I get several screen-fulls of output, then everything stops.. *However* from the modem lights, I see that the modem is still receiving data... it's just not getting to the kermit process to be written out. That is, it would appear that the process has going into ttywait (for some reason) and can't get out, even though the modem itself thinks things are just fine. - Ideas? - - Dave R. - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 07:50:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA07911 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:50:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA07878 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:50:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA15466; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:50:09 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:50 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA00168 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:37:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id KAA01427 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:44:01 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:44:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161444.KAA01427@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Subject: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk After a 2.1.5 install, you'll find in sysconfig a line to initialize the loopback interface: ifconfig_lo0="inet localhost" Well - if your using a nameserver, and the machine booting happens to *be* the nameserver, this won't work. Since named isn't up yet (how could it be before the interfaces are configured?), you can't resolve the name "localhost" This should probably change to: ifconfig_lo0="inet 127.0.0.1" - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 07:50:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA07927 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:50:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA07887 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:50:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA15460; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:50:08 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:50 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA00163 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:35:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id KAA01421 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:41:38 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:41:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161441.KAA01421@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Subject: NFS and the nameserver... Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Ok - We need a small change to /etc/rc. I discovered this when I set up a primary nameserver on a machine that also wanted to mount NFS mount points. If you have an /etc/resolv.conf, and you are the primary name server. The mount -a -t nfs in /etc/rc happens _before_ named is started. This means that the mounts fail (timing out eventually). I think it would be prudent to move the mount -a -t -nfs command until after all the networking deamons have begun, but particularly after named has started. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 07:55:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA08245 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:55:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ns.ge.com (ns.ge.com [192.35.39.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA08237 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:54:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from combs.salem.ge.com ([3.29.5.200]) by ns.ge.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA12908; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:55:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (steve@localhost) by combs.salem.ge.com (8.7.5/8.6.11) with SMTP id KAA00769; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:53:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:53:17 -0400 (EDT) From: "Stephen F. Combs" Reply-To: CombsSF@Salem.GE.COM To: Don Yuniskis cc: Bill/Carolyn Pechter , FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: File System on a tape In-Reply-To: <199608161419.HAA11671@seagull.rtd.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk The Pechter(s) are speaking of having a BOOTABLE Tape system. I'd Love to have one! While CDROMs are great, there are times when I don't have a CDROM system available and 'twould be nice to be able to boot from tape and do a 'fbsdinstall' (ala, suninstall) I've got fbsd systems in Puerto Rico, Mebane, NC, Ft. Wayne, IN and Shanghi, China (as well as here!) I've got QIC-250 tape drives on All of them, but a CDROM on none!:-< (I'm trying to get them all upgraded to DDS-2 4mm DAT's). ---- Stephen F. Combs Internet: CombsSF@Salem.GE.COM GE Industrial Systems Voice: 540.387.8828 Network Services Home: CombsSF-Home@Salem.GE.COM 1501 Roanoke Blvd FAX: 540.387.7106 Salem, VA 24153 LapTop: CombsSF-Mobile@Salem.GE.COM On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Don Yuniskis wrote: > Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:19:04 -0700 (MST) > From: Don Yuniskis > To: Bill/Carolyn Pechter > Cc: dgy@rtd.com, FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.org > Subject: Re: File System on a tape > > > > > have a floppy on their system (or perhaps a CDROM drive), but how many > > > > have a tape drive? > > > > Folks, it also is kind of nice for those folks who have access to some > > kind of tape drive and no CDROM -- or (more common) an Unsupported > > CDROM. > > > > Imagine if the folks with wierd IDE CD's could cut a tape and install > > from that before having to get hacked kernels. I've had to make the > > floppy sets at times because of not enough DOS partition space > > to put the distribution. If I could dd or tar to tape and install from tape > > it would be a great ease of installation issue at times. > > I *thought* installing from tape *was* supported?? Or, is this broke? > > > Also, sooner or later we're going to go multiplatform (I hope) and one > > day we may need the capability. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 07:55:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA08284 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:55:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agora.rdrop.com (root@agora.rdrop.com [199.2.210.241]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA08275 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:55:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by agora.rdrop.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #17) id m0urQJ0-0008rKC; Fri, 16 Aug 96 07:55 PDT Message-Id: From: batie@agora.rdrop.com (Alan Batie) Subject: Re: File System on a tape To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:55:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > With a file system on tape, you can boot and then just mount the tape > and 'cp /tape/what/ever/you/want /wherever/you/want/it'. What's wrong with 'tar xvf /dev/rst0' for an installation? Now for a restore, it might be a useful model, but even there, it's just about as fast to 'tar tvf /dev/rst0 > tape.list', and you can go watch a movie in the meantime instead of waiting a few minutes to go to this directory, a few minutes to that directory, etc. It would be almost as bad as navigating the web :-) I'm surprised I haven't yet heard mention of the DEC tape system. I seem to recall that they had a system (PDP-8 version?) that ran solely off tape. -- Alan Batie ______ We're Starfleet officers: batie@agora.rdrop.com \ / Weird is part of the job. +1 503 452-0960 \ / --Captain Janeway DE 3C 29 17 C0 49 7A 27 \/ 40 A5 3C 37 4A DA 52 B9 It is my policy to avoid purchase of any products from companies which use unrequested email advertisements or telephone solicitation. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 08:18:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA09391 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:18:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [204.216.27.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA09383 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:18:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by who.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.11) with ESMTP id IAA04199 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:18:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA15847; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:16:42 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199608161516.IAA15847@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: File System on a tape To: CombsSF@Salem.GE.COM Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:16:42 -0700 (MST) Cc: dgy@rtd.com, pechter@shell.monmouth.com, FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Stephen F. Combs" at Aug 16, 96 10:53:17 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Stephen F. Combs said: > > The Pechter(s) are speaking of having a BOOTABLE Tape system. I'd Love to I don't see that mentioned in any of the messages thus far -- including the one you cc'ed below. I don't think anyone is asking for the ability to type "mt0" at the FBSD boot prompt (though it *would* be nice!) Rather, I think a single boot floppy that brings in the required device drivers and kernel could be used with a tape based filesystem: mount /dev/mt0 /mnt chroot /mnt twiddle with bare essentials of fsck'ing disk, etc. ^D (out of /mnt) tar cf - /mnt | tar xf - /disk > have one! While CDROMs are great, there are times when I don't have a > CDROM system available and 'twould be nice to be able to boot from tape > and do a 'fbsdinstall' (ala, suninstall) I've got fbsd systems in Puerto > Rico, Mebane, NC, Ft. Wayne, IN and Shanghi, China (as well as here!) > I've got QIC-250 tape drives on All of them, but a CDROM on none!:-< (I'm > trying to get them all upgraded to DDS-2 4mm DAT's). Being able to support *all* of the many tape devices in the bootstrap loader I think would be ridiculous. Rather, getting a kernel up and running with a floppy and letting that kernel carry the device drivers (including a block tape device) is the WIN. --don > On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Don Yuniskis wrote: > > > Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 07:19:04 -0700 (MST) > > From: Don Yuniskis > > To: Bill/Carolyn Pechter > > Cc: dgy@rtd.com, FreeBSD-hackers@FreeBSD.org > > Subject: Re: File System on a tape > > > > > > > have a floppy on their system (or perhaps a CDROM drive), but how many > > > > > have a tape drive? > > > > > > Folks, it also is kind of nice for those folks who have access to some > > > kind of tape drive and no CDROM -- or (more common) an Unsupported > > > CDROM. > > > > > > Imagine if the folks with wierd IDE CD's could cut a tape and install > > > from that before having to get hacked kernels. I've had to make the > > > floppy sets at times because of not enough DOS partition space > > > to put the distribution. If I could dd or tar to tape and install from tape > > > it would be a great ease of installation issue at times. > > > > I *thought* installing from tape *was* supported?? Or, is this broke? > > > > > Also, sooner or later we're going to go multiplatform (I hope) and one > > > day we may need the capability. > > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 08:32:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA10352 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:32:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from guardian.fortress.org (fortress.org [199.84.158.128]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA10326 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:31:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from andrew@localhost) by guardian.fortress.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA02189; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:30:08 -0400 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:30:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Andrew Webster Reply-To: andrew@pubnix.net To: Thomas David Rivers cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: more general info on SIO problems in 2.1.5. In-Reply-To: <199608161433.KAA01375@lakes.water.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Thomas David Rivers wrote: > > The behaviour I get is that when large amounts of data are generated > at the other end (after dialing a remote system) - I get several > screen-fulls of output, then everything stops.. *However* from the > modem lights, I see that the modem is still receiving data... it's just > not getting to the kermit process to be written out. > > That is, it would appear that the process has going into ttywait > (for some reason) and can't get out, even though the modem itself > thinks things are just fine. This may be only a coincidence, however, this is the exact same behaviour exhibited by the Digiboard intelligent driver (dgb) when using a PC/4e card. This was on 2.1.0. I wonder if some things were cross pollinated along the way. Regards, Andrew Webster - andrew@pubnix.net - http://www.pubnix.net PubNIX Montreal - Connected to the world - Branche au monde 514-990-5911 - P.O. Box 147, Cote St-Luc, Quebec, H4V 2Y3 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 08:32:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA10402 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:32:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA10395 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:32:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA06486; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:32:15 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:32:15 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608161532.JAA06486@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams To: Mike Newell Cc: Joe Greco , hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: References: <199608151738.MAA14144@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > I use static routing around here with no problems. > > I found static routes to be a problem. If the ppp link goes down and a > packet arrives it redirects the route out throught he default; when the > link comes back up it doesn't get re-re-directed. :-( > > What we were trying to do is use the /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down > to install static routes, but route won't work for non-root logins. :-( > I remember something about this on the list, but I've not had a chance to > research it. :-(!! /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down are run as root, no matter who the login user is. This also means you must be careful what you put in there, but since the environment is safeguarded pretty well it would be hard to break into a system via them. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 08:47:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA18927 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:47:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dada.kaizen.net (dada.kaizen.net [206.27.236.38]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA18896 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:47:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (mnewell@localhost) by dada.kaizen.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA12220; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:43:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: dada.kaizen.net: mnewell owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:43:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Mike Newell To: Nate Williams cc: Joe Greco , hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: <199608161532.JAA06486@rocky.mt.sri.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Nate Williams wrote: > /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down are run as root, no matter who the > login user is. This also means you must be careful what you put in > there, but since the environment is safeguarded pretty well it would be > hard to break into a system via them. Well, in my case they didn't work. So I added lines of the form: route add ...... >> /var/log/ip-up.log 2>&1 and found routed was complaining that routes can only be changed by root. Reading the man page for pppd is specifically says: /etc/ppp/ip-up ... snip ... This program or script is executed with the same real and effective user-ID as pppd, that is, at least the effective user-ID and possibly the real user-ID will be root. This is so that it can be used to manipulate routes, run privileged daemons (e.g. sendmail), etc. Be careful that the con- tents of the /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down scripts do not compromise your system's security. I'm not clear on how to interpret this, but apparently the _real_ UID is root, but the _effective_ UID is that of the account used to invoke pppd. Route appears to check the effective UID, so it refuses to do its thing. Setting the script SUID has no effect. Neither does adding the ppp login account to the "wheel" group. :-( As a workaround I log into our box as root [ugh!] to invoke pppd, but clearly that's not the answer. I'm running 2.1-RELEASE; maybe things changed in 2.1.5? Thanks! Mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 08:57:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA24803 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:57:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA24798 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:57:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA19105; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:57:12 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199608161557.IAA19105@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: File System on a tape To: batie@agora.rdrop.com (Alan Batie) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:57:12 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Alan Batie" at Aug 16, 96 07:55:22 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Alan Batie said: > > > With a file system on tape, you can boot and then just mount the tape > > and 'cp /tape/what/ever/you/want /wherever/you/want/it'. > > What's wrong with 'tar xvf /dev/rst0' for an installation? Now for a Nothing! *But* if you want to extract one *file*, tar sucks eggs. Also, you can't *run* a system off of a tar image (whereas you *could* mount a tape filesystem and execute whatever is on the tape!) > restore, it might be a useful model, but even there, it's just about > as fast to 'tar tvf /dev/rst0 > tape.list', and you can go watch a movie > in the meantime instead of waiting a few minutes to go to this directory, > a few minutes to that directory, etc. It would be almost as bad as > navigating the web :-) > > I'm surprised I haven't yet heard mention of the DEC tape system. I seem > to recall that they had a system (PDP-8 version?) that ran solely off tape. TU58's? --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:12:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA25650 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:12:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA25644 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:12:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id LAA15418; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:10:53 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608161610.LAA15418@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:10:53 -0500 (CDT) Cc: mnewell@kaizen.net, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608161532.JAA06486@rocky.mt.sri.com> from "Nate Williams" at Aug 16, 96 09:32:15 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > I use static routing around here with no problems. > > > > I found static routes to be a problem. If the ppp link goes down and a > > packet arrives it redirects the route out throught he default; when the > > link comes back up it doesn't get re-re-directed. :-( > > > > What we were trying to do is use the /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down > > to install static routes, but route won't work for non-root logins. :-( > > I remember something about this on the list, but I've not had a chance to > > research it. :-(!! > > /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down are run as root, no matter who the > login user is. This also means you must be careful what you put in > there, but since the environment is safeguarded pretty well it would be > hard to break into a system via them. I found under FreeBSD, um, I think 2.0.5R that this didn't work real well because route did additional checks for root permissions (I believe I got around it by forcing the uid and euid to 0, or something like that). It was a tad ugly. I don't do this anymore anyways - I use SLIP for any situations requiring routing. ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:18:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA26042 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:18:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA26035 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:18:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA06691; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:18:42 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:18:42 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608161618.KAA06691@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams To: Mike Newell Cc: Nate Williams , hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: References: <199608161532.JAA06486@rocky.mt.sri.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Mike Newell writes: > On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Nate Williams wrote: > > > /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down are run as root, no matter who the > > login user is. This also means you must be careful what you put in > > there, but since the environment is safeguarded pretty well it would be > > hard to break into a system via them. > > Well, in my case they didn't work. So I added lines of the form: > > route add ...... >> /var/log/ip-up.log 2>&1 > > and found routed was complaining that routes can only be changed by root. > Reading the man page for pppd is specifically says: > > /etc/ppp/ip-up > > ... snip ... > > This program or script is executed with the same > real and effective user-ID as pppd, that is, at > least the effective user-ID and possibly the real > user-ID will be root. This is so that it can be > used to manipulate routes, run privileged daemons > (e.g. sendmail), etc. Be careful that the con- > tents of the /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down > scripts do not compromise your system's security. > > > I'm not clear on how to interpret this, but apparently the _real_ UID is > root, but the _effective_ UID is that of the account used to invoke pppd. > Route appears to check the effective UID, so it refuses to do its thing. > Setting the script SUID has no effect. Neither does adding the ppp login > account to the "wheel" group. :-( Hmm, pppd on my box is as follows, which may be a security problem. ns:/usr/src/sbin/ipfw # ls -al /usr/sbin/pppd -r-sr-xr-x 1 root bin 69632 Jun 27 18:45 /usr/sbin/pppd* This is the same as I was doing in 2.1. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:20:47 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA26221 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA26205 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA20808; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:20:07 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA01435 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 01:57:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id MAA03787 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:03:49 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:03:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161603.MAA03787@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Subject: Re: more general info on SIO problems in 2.1.5. Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Andrew writes: > > > > > The behaviour I get is that when large amounts of data are generated > > at the other end (after dialing a remote system) - I get several > > screen-fulls of output, then everything stops.. *However* from the > > modem lights, I see that the modem is still receiving data... it's just > > not getting to the kermit process to be written out. > > > > That is, it would appear that the process has going into ttywait > > (for some reason) and can't get out, even though the modem itself > > thinks things are just fine. > > This may be only a coincidence, however, this is the exact same behaviour > exhibited by the Digiboard intelligent driver (dgb) when using a PC/4e card. > This was on 2.1.0. I wonder if some things were cross pollinated along > the way. > Yes - it is exactly the behaviour I was seeing in 2.1R. I was hoping it was improved in 2.1.5... perhaps it says a lot about the idea of "stable" that it wasn't (i.e. 2.1.5 isn't that different than 2.1R.) - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:20:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA26228 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA26210 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA20799; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:20:06 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA01334; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 01:53:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id LAA03770; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:59:53 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:59:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161559.LAA03770@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.freebsd.org!freebsd-hackers, ponds!mt.sri.com!nate Subject: Re: more general info on SIO problems in 2.1.5. Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > 2) I've used two different modems (thinking the problem might be > > the Pratical Peripherals PC288LCD.) nope - I get it *very* > > quickly with a Micrcom DeskPorte FAST. > > Are these internal or external modems? > > > > Nate > These were two external modems, tested with several cables and on com0 and com1 (just to ensure no wiring problems.) - Dave R. - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:20:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA26235 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA26208 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:20:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA20777; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:20:04 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.UUCP (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA01328; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 01:52:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id LAA03762; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:58:32 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:58:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161558.LAA03762@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!mt.sri.com!nate Subject: Re: NFS and the nameserver... Cc: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > We need a small change to /etc/rc. > > And I assume you've made that change. :) > > > I discovered this when I set up a primary nameserver on a machine > > that also wanted to mount NFS mount points. > > > > If you have an /etc/resolv.conf, and you are the primary name > > server. The > > > > mount -a -t nfs > > > > in /etc/rc happens _before_ named is started. This means that > > the mounts fail (timing out eventually). > > > > I think it would be prudent to move the > > > > mount -a -t -nfs > > > > command until after all the networking deamons have begun, but > > particularly after named has started. > > Except that some of the networking daemons live in /usr, which must > mounted on many boxes which boot diskless and/or mount /usr alone. > > There is no 'perfect' solution to where the NFS mount commands go, and > it was determined that the current position is the 'best' for most > people. If it doesn't work for your installation, move it (which you've > done already). > > > > Nate > Well - yes, err..., umm... I made that change. Seems like a simple 'if' is appropriate here. You could set up a sysconfig parm, i.e. "diskless" and do the NFS mounts early if this is a diskless machine. if [ ! X"$diskless" = X"NO" ] then mount -a -t nfs NFS_mounted=yes fi .... after named, etc... if [ ! "NFS_mounted" = "yes" ] then mount -a -t nfs fi also - another clever trick is to put the mount command early in /etc/rc and simply run it in the background. Then, it's likely that the nameserver will get "cranked up" before the timeout and the mounts will succeed... - Just a thought - - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:25:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA26602 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:25:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from walkabout.asstdc.com.au (imb@walkabout.asstdc.com.au [202.12.127.73]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA26588 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:25:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from imb@localhost) by walkabout.asstdc.com.au (8.7.5/BSD4.4) id CAA00640 Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:25:11 +1000 (EST) From: michael butler Message-Id: <199608161625.CAA00640@walkabout.asstdc.com.au> Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. To: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:25:10 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608161444.KAA01427@lakes.water.net> from Thomas David Rivers at "Aug 16, 96 10:44:01 am" X-Comment: Phone 0419-240-180, International +61-419-240-180 X-Comment: finger imb@asstdc.com.au for PGP public key X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > After a 2.1.5 install, you'll find in sysconfig a line > to initialize the loopback interface: > ifconfig_lo0="inet localhost" > Well - if your using a nameserver, and the machine booting happens > to *be* the nameserver, this won't work. Since named isn't > up yet (how could it be before the interfaces are configured?), > you can't resolve the name "localhost" .. man 5 hosts .. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:26:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA26754 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:26:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA26746 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:26:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id LAA15564; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:25:21 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608161625.LAA15564@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? To: mnewell@kaizen.net (Mike Newell) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:25:21 -0500 (CDT) Cc: nate@mt.sri.com, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Mike Newell" at Aug 16, 96 11:43:53 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Nate Williams wrote: > > > /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down are run as root, no matter who the > > login user is. This also means you must be careful what you put in > > there, but since the environment is safeguarded pretty well it would be > > hard to break into a system via them. > > Well, in my case they didn't work. So I added lines of the form: > > route add ...... >> /var/log/ip-up.log 2>&1 > > and found routed was complaining that routes can only be changed by root. > Reading the man page for pppd is specifically says: > > /etc/ppp/ip-up > > ... snip ... > > This program or script is executed with the same > real and effective user-ID as pppd, that is, at > least the effective user-ID and possibly the real > user-ID will be root. This is so that it can be > used to manipulate routes, run privileged daemons > (e.g. sendmail), etc. Be careful that the con- > tents of the /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down > scripts do not compromise your system's security. > > > I'm not clear on how to interpret this, but apparently the _real_ UID is > root, but the _effective_ UID is that of the account used to invoke pppd. > Route appears to check the effective UID, so it refuses to do its thing. > Setting the script SUID has no effect. Neither does adding the ppp login > account to the "wheel" group. :-( > > As a workaround I log into our box as root [ugh!] to invoke pppd, but > clearly that's not the answer. I'm running 2.1-RELEASE; maybe things > changed in 2.1.5? Yeah yeah that's the ticket. Verrrry familiar problem. I believe I hacked a copy of route to fix this problem and installed it as /etc/ppp/route... ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:31:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA27170 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:31:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from walkabout.asstdc.com.au (imb@walkabout.asstdc.com.au [202.12.127.73]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA27160 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:31:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from imb@localhost) by walkabout.asstdc.com.au (8.7.5/BSD4.4) id CAA00665 Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:31:13 +1000 (EST) From: michael butler Message-Id: <199608161631.CAA00665@walkabout.asstdc.com.au> Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? To: nate@mt.sri.com (Nate Williams) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:31:13 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608161532.JAA06486@rocky.mt.sri.com> from Nate Williams at "Aug 16, 96 09:32:15 am" X-Comment: Phone 0419-240-180, International +61-419-240-180 X-Comment: finger imb@asstdc.com.au for PGP public key X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > /etc/ppp/ip-up and /etc/ppp/ip-down are run as root, no matter who the > login user is. This also means you must be careful what you put in > there, but since the environment is safeguarded pretty well it would be > hard to break into a system via them. It would be much better if .. i) pppd refused to run any 'world' writable script and .. ii) syslogged the reason for not running it, michael From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:31:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA27218 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:31:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA27207 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:31:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA06788; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:28:52 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:28:52 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608161628.KAA06788@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams To: Joe Greco Cc: mnewell@kaizen.net (Mike Newell), nate@mt.sri.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: <199608161625.LAA15564@brasil.moneng.mei.com> References: <199608161625.LAA15564@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > As a workaround I log into our box as root [ugh!] to invoke pppd, but > > clearly that's not the answer. I'm running 2.1-RELEASE; maybe things > > changed in 2.1.5? > > Yeah yeah that's the ticket. Verrrry familiar problem. > > I believe I hacked a copy of route to fix this problem and installed it as > /etc/ppp/route... *Wow* I completely forgot about that it was so long ago. I did the *exact* same thing, as a matter of fact I may still have the old binary sitting in my ppp directory. :) I needed to do this in order to get things working right, but then changed from using 'route' to do the routing to ARP routing once the route bug got fixed. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:33:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA27367 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:33:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dada.kaizen.net (dada.kaizen.net [206.27.236.38]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA27355 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:33:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (mnewell@localhost) by dada.kaizen.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA12466; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:30:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: dada.kaizen.net: mnewell owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:30:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Mike Newell To: Nate Williams cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: <199608161618.KAA06691@rocky.mt.sri.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Nate Williams wrote: > Hmm, pppd on my box is as follows, which may be a security problem. > > ns:/usr/src/sbin/ipfw # ls -al /usr/sbin/pppd > -r-sr-xr-x 1 root bin 69632 Jun 27 18:45 /usr/sbin/pppd* > > This is the same as I was doing in 2.1. Yeah, it runs wit "root.bin", but if I put "route" commands in the scripts it SAYS that only root can do route commands. In fact, when it creates the log files it creates them owned by "root". Don't understand why "route" whines but nothing else does. :-( Thanks, Mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:35:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA27653 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:35:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dada.kaizen.net (dada.kaizen.net [206.27.236.38]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA27648 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:35:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (mnewell@localhost) by dada.kaizen.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA12470; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:32:07 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: dada.kaizen.net: mnewell owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:32:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Mike Newell To: Joe Greco cc: nate@mt.sri.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: <199608161625.LAA15564@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Joe Greco wrote: > Yeah yeah that's the ticket. Verrrry familiar problem. > > I believe I hacked a copy of route to fix this problem and installed it as > /etc/ppp/route... That's what I had planned to do, but I wasn't sure if something else would break if I just took out the UID checks. If it works for you, I'll start hack'n tonight. :-) Thanks, Mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 09:59:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA29331 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:59:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA29322 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 09:59:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id LAA15649; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:58:33 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608161658.LAA15649@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? To: mnewell@kaizen.net (Mike Newell) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:58:32 -0500 (CDT) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, nate@mt.sri.com, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Mike Newell" at Aug 16, 96 12:32:07 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Joe Greco wrote: > > > Yeah yeah that's the ticket. Verrrry familiar problem. > > > > I believe I hacked a copy of route to fix this problem and installed it as > > /etc/ppp/route... > > That's what I had planned to do, but I wasn't sure if something else would > break if I just took out the UID checks. If it works for you, I'll start > hack'n tonight. :-) I _believe_ that that was my fix - I think the kernel routing code works correctly and it was just a problem with the userland program. If not, try adding a "seteuid(0,0)" call in there somewhere. ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 10:01:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA29633 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:01:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA29602 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:01:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA02572 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:01:03 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id TAA05278 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:00:11 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id SAA25421; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 18:57:35 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608161657.SAA25421@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 18:57:35 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) In-Reply-To: <199608161316.JAA00514@lakes.water.net>; from Thomas David Rivers on Aug 16, 1996 9:16:56 -0400 References: <199608161316.JAA00514@lakes.water.net> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Thomas David Rivers: > What did I discover? There's no way to tell sendmail to not use > DNS (it will be fixed in a "future" version.) There is. Use FEATURE(nocanonify) FEATURE(nodns) That will prevent sendmail from looking at the envelope headers and resolve any CNAME it may found. > (If you see this mail; then I was successfull in setting this up...) Except your using these ~@#{^@~ bang paths and you shouldn't. Our rmail (and most of the other) supports FQDN. At least, use the uucp-uudom mailer which use a bang envelope and FQDN headers. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 10:38:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA02476 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:38:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA02463 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:38:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA02610 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:37:34 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id TAA05606 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:36:32 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id TAA25462; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:02:32 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608161702.TAA25462@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:02:32 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. In-Reply-To: <199608161444.KAA01427@lakes.water.net>; from Thomas David Rivers on Aug 16, 1996 10:44:01 -0400 References: <199608161444.KAA01427@lakes.water.net> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Thomas David Rivers: > Well - if your using a nameserver, and the machine booting happens > to *be* the nameserver, this won't work. Since named isn't > up yet (how could it be before the interfaces are configured?), > you can't resolve the name "localhost" > > This should probably change to: > > ifconfig_lo0="inet 127.0.0.1" You should use "hosts, bind" in /etc/host.conf and populate /etc/hosts with some important values like localhost and your primary interfaces. That way, you don't need a DNS for booting. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 10:48:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id KAA02998 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:48:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA02993 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:48:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id MAA15848; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:46:57 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608161746.MAA15848@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. To: imb@asstdc.com.au (michael butler) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:46:57 -0500 (CDT) Cc: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199608161625.CAA00640@walkabout.asstdc.com.au> from "michael butler" at Aug 17, 96 02:25:10 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > After a 2.1.5 install, you'll find in sysconfig a line > > to initialize the loopback interface: > > > ifconfig_lo0="inet localhost" > > > Well - if your using a nameserver, and the machine booting happens > > to *be* the nameserver, this won't work. Since named isn't > > up yet (how could it be before the interfaces are configured?), > > you can't resolve the name "localhost" > > .. man 5 hosts .. ... which doesn't work very well unless you twiddle host.conf to check hosts before the resolver (something I always do anyways). ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 11:04:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA03798 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:04:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dada.kaizen.net (dada.kaizen.net [206.27.236.38]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA03793 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:04:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (mnewell@localhost) by dada.kaizen.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA12894; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:01:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: dada.kaizen.net: mnewell owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:01:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Mike Newell To: michael butler cc: Nate Williams , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: <199608161631.CAA00665@walkabout.asstdc.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 17 Aug 1996, michael butler wrote: > It would be much better if .. > > i) pppd refused to run any 'world' writable script and .. > ii) syslogged the reason for not running it, and/or c) pppd could read a file that contained a set of routes which it installs on startup and uninstalls at shutdown. :-) Mike From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 11:19:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA04631 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:19:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cedb.dpcsys.com (cedb.DPCSYS.COM [165.90.143.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA04625 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:19:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cedb (cedb.DPCSYS.COM [165.90.143.3]) by cedb.dpcsys.com (8.6.10/DPC-1.0) with SMTP id LAA22367; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:05:37 -0700 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:05:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Dan Busarow X-Sender: dan@cedb To: Thomas David Rivers cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Nameserver and 'rlogin' in 2.1.5. In-Reply-To: <199608161331.JAA00547@lakes.water.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Thomas David Rivers wrote: > You may have read my recent sendmail findings - where I related > a different DNS problem... > > This has to do with rlogin. Change your db.cache. Listing the real root servers doesn't buy you anything but trouble if your not connected. Take out the real roots and put in pointers to your own name servers. According to DNS & BIND you should set up your own internal root server which is only slightly more work, but I did it via db.cache when I was UUCP connected and it seemed to work fine. However, that was several years and revisions of named ago so the cache trick may no longer work. Worst case, make yourself primary for . and add a db.root that looks a whole lot like db.water (see Internal Roots in DNS & BIND for details). Dan -- Dan Busarow 714 443 4172 DPC Systems dan@dpcsys.com Dana Point, California 83 09 EF 59 E0 11 89 B4 8D 09 DB FD E1 DD 0C 82 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 11:21:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA04911 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:21:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA04900 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:21:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA29525; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:20:05 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.water.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA00915; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:03:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA04488; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:10:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:10:12 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161810.OAA04488@lakes.water.net> To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr, ponds!FreeBSD.ORG!freebsd-hackers Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > According to Thomas David Rivers: > > What did I discover? There's no way to tell sendmail to not use > > DNS (it will be fixed in a "future" version.) > > There is. > > Use > > FEATURE(nocanonify) > FEATURE(nodns) Aha! Yep - that's what I used to do - but, if you look in the READ_ME for this version of sendmail, under "Non-DNS based sites" you find: Non-DNS based sites This version of sendmail always tries to connect to the Domain Name System (DNS) to resolve names, regardless of the setting of the `I' option. On most systems that are not running DNS, this will fail quickly and sendmail will continue, but on some systems it has a long timeout. If you have this problem, you will have to recompile without NAMED_BIND. Some people have claimed that they have successfully used "OI+USEVC" to force sendmail to use a virtual circuit -- this will always time out quickly, but also tells sendmail that a failed connection should requeue the message (probably not what you intended). A future release of sendmail will correct this problem. and, after a quick perusal of the m4 files, you see that nodns doesn't actually do anything anymore... and there is no way to have sendmail not do DNS... in my situation, it always failed talking to the name server, and then simply queued the mail. (Exactly what is described in that paragraph....) - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 11:22:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA04992 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:22:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA04975 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:22:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id NAA16102; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:21:52 -0500 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199608161821.NAA16102@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:21:52 -0500 (CDT) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608161702.TAA25462@keltia.freenix.fr> from "Ollivier Robert" at Aug 16, 96 07:02:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > According to Thomas David Rivers: > > Well - if your using a nameserver, and the machine booting happens > > to *be* the nameserver, this won't work. Since named isn't > > up yet (how could it be before the interfaces are configured?), > > you can't resolve the name "localhost" > > > > This should probably change to: > > > > ifconfig_lo0="inet 127.0.0.1" > > You should use "hosts, bind" in /etc/host.conf and populate /etc/hosts with > some important values like localhost and your primary interfaces. That way, > you don't need a DNS for booting. So I am NOT the only person who feels this way :-) Can anybody explain the reason that it is done the other way around right now? It seems to me that if you specify something in /etc/hosts, there must be a really freakin' good reason for it, so why not have the system abide by your wishes? ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 11:22:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA04994 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:22:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA04972 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:22:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA29503; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:20:03 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.water.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA00906; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:55:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA04416; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:02:11 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:02:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608161802.OAA04416@lakes.water.net> To: imb@asstdc.com.au, ponds!ponds!rivers Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. Cc: ponds!freebsd.org!hackers Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > After a 2.1.5 install, you'll find in sysconfig a line > > to initialize the loopback interface: > > > ifconfig_lo0="inet localhost" > > > Well - if your using a nameserver, and the machine booting happens > > to *be* the nameserver, this won't work. Since named isn't > > up yet (how could it be before the interfaces are configured?), > > you can't resolve the name "localhost" > > .. man 5 hosts .. > > Hmmm, let me restate this then... That is, if you are a nameserver, and you are also a name client (i.e. you have an /etc/resolv.conf) you should use the IP address when configuring your interfaces, since you: 1) Are a client so /etc/hosts isn't examined until after a _long_ time out. 2) Are the server the client needs to contact and named isn't running yet. I see that the man page says: When using the name server named(8), this file provides a backup when the name server is not running. For the name server, it is suggested that only a few addresses be included in this file. These include ad- dress for the local interfaces that ifconfig(8) needs at boot time and a few machines on the local network. It's not that it won't work, it's just that we have to wait for a long time for the gethostbyname() request to time out before proceeding... if we used 127.0.0.1 we can avoid that wait... It was just a little spooky when I was setting up the nameserver, the machine would just sit there for awhile during boot-up and then proceed. - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 11:23:15 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA05065 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:23:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA05059 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:23:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA03019; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:15:45 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608161815.LAA03019@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: File System on a tape To: dgy@rtd.com (Don Yuniskis) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:15:44 -0700 (MST) Cc: batie@agora.rdrop.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608161557.IAA19105@seagull.rtd.com> from "Don Yuniskis" at Aug 16, 96 08:57:12 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Also, you can't *run* a system off of a tar image (whereas you > *could* mount a tape filesystem and execute whatever is on the > tape!) Uh... I would have to insist on copying the entire image into core for that one. 8-). 1: "What's your tape drive doing?" 2: "Paging from an executable image..." Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 11:42:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA06253 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:42:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA06234 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:42:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id LAA03620; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:39:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma003618; Fri Aug 16 11:39:08 1996 Message-ID: <3214C01B.41C67EA6@whistle.com> Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:38:19 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b6 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Joe Greco CC: Ollivier Robert , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. References: <199608161821.NAA16102@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Joe Greco wrote: > > > So I am NOT the only person who feels this way :-) > > Can anybody explain the reason that it is done the other way around right > now? It seems to me that if you specify something in /etc/hosts, there must > be a really freakin' good reason for it, so why not have the system abide by > your wishes? I agree.. the first thing I always do on a new freeBSD machine is reverse the bind/hosts entries in /etc/host.conf.. I believe phk found an instance where some broken program didn't like that (was it sendmail?) but overall, I make /etc/hosts small (strip the comments out) and always read it first.. I think hosts should be an over-ride and it should be used when DNS is going to give the wrong answer for some entries so we have to correct it in hosts. especially name servers should do this.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 11:45:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA06559 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:45:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA06549 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:45:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA07487; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:41:58 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:41:58 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608161841.MAA07487@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams To: Joe Greco Cc: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert), freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. In-Reply-To: <199608161821.NAA16102@brasil.moneng.mei.com> References: <199608161702.TAA25462@keltia.freenix.fr> <199608161821.NAA16102@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Joe Greco writes: > > According to Thomas David Rivers: > > > Well - if your using a nameserver, and the machine booting happens > > > to *be* the nameserver, this won't work. Since named isn't > > > up yet (how could it be before the interfaces are configured?), > > > you can't resolve the name "localhost" > > > > > > This should probably change to: > > > > > > ifconfig_lo0="inet 127.0.0.1" > > > > You should use "hosts, bind" in /etc/host.conf and populate /etc/hosts with > > some important values like localhost and your primary interfaces. That way, > > you don't need a DNS for booting. > > So I am NOT the only person who feels this way :-) > > Can anybody explain the reason that it is done the other way around right > now? It seems to me that if you specify something in /etc/hosts, there must > be a really freakin' good reason for it, so why not have the system abide by > your wishes? One of the network RFC's. Also, in the 'olden days', you specified all of your hosts in /etc/hosts, and when a machine changed it's address you couldn't get to it. By forcing it to use BIND, you make sure this doesn't happen. The worst that can happen is that things take a bit longer to occur, where with the default behavior reversed it can really hose people up. Anyone with half a clue can change the default behavior if they have 'special' circumstances. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 11:48:47 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA06802 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:48:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA06797 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:48:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA07518; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:48:35 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:48:35 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608161848.MAA07518@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams To: Thomas David Rivers Cc: imb@asstdc.com.au, hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. In-Reply-To: <199608161802.OAA04416@lakes.water.net> References: <199608161802.OAA04416@lakes.water.net> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ Your mailer is destroying email addresses. I'm not even sure if I can send to you directly, and I have to edit the To and Cc lines to avoid bounces. ] > Hmmm, let me restate this then... > > That is, if you are a nameserver, and you are also a name client > (i.e. you have an /etc/resolv.conf) you should use the IP address > when configuring your interfaces, since you: > > 1) Are a client so /etc/hosts isn't examined until after > a _long_ time out. Unless you tell it to use /etc/hosts first. Look at /etc/host.conf. > 2) Are the server the client needs to contact and > named isn't running yet. See #1. > I see that the man page says: > > When using the name server named(8), this file provides a backup when > the name server is not running. For the name server, it is suggested > that only a few addresses be included in this file. These include ad- > dress for the local interfaces that ifconfig(8) needs at boot time and a > few machines on the local network. > > It's not that it won't work, it's just that we have to wait for > a long time for the gethostbyname() request to time out before > proceeding... if we used 127.0.0.1 we can avoid that wait... True. In any case, on my nameserver box I use *only* IP addresses for configuration, since it avoids lots of problems with the whole hosts vs. nameserver issue. > It was just a little spooky when I was setting up the nameserver, > the machine would just sit there for awhile during boot-up > and then proceed. Modifying /etc/host.conf and putting in those names/addresses necessary to boot your system should be adequate, but using IP addresses is a better solution IMHO. In my /etc/sysconfig on my DNS box, I add a field 'hostip' which is used in place of 'hostname'. # Set to the name of your host - this is pretty important! hostname=ns.mt.sri.com hostip=206.127.76.97 .... network_interfaces="lo0 ed0 ppp0" ifconfig_lo0="inet localhost" ifconfig_ed0="inet ${hostip} netmask 0xffffffe0" Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 11:53:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA07140 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:53:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shell.monmouth.com (pechter@shell.monmouth.com [205.164.220.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA07131 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 11:53:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from pechter@localhost) by shell.monmouth.com (8.7.4/8.7.3) id OAA27138; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:49:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill/Carolyn Pechter Message-Id: <199608161849.OAA27138@shell.monmouth.com> Subject: Re: hackers-digest V1 #1386 To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, dgy@rtd.com Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:49:35 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <199608161822.LAA05013@freefall.freebsd.org> from "owner-hackers-digest@freefall.freebsd.org" at Aug 16, 96 11:22:33 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > From: Don Yuniskis > Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 08:57:12 -0700 (MST) > Subject: Re: File System on a tape > > It seems that Alan Batie said: > > > > > With a file system on tape, you can boot and then just mount the tape > > > and 'cp /tape/what/ever/you/want /wherever/you/want/it'. > > > > What's wrong with 'tar xvf /dev/rst0' for an installation? Now for a > > Nothing! *But* if you want to extract one *file*, tar sucks eggs. > Also, you can't *run* a system off of a tar image (whereas you > *could* mount a tape filesystem and execute whatever is on the > tape!) > > > restore, it might be a useful model, but even there, it's just about > > as fast to 'tar tvf /dev/rst0 > tape.list', and you can go watch a movie > > in the meantime instead of waiting a few minutes to go to this directory, > > a few minutes to that directory, etc. It would be almost as bad as > > navigating the web :-) > > > > I'm surprised I haven't yet heard mention of the DEC tape system. I seem > > to recall that they had a system (PDP-8 version?) that ran solely off tape. > > TU58's? > > - --don Well, er TU55/56's were kind of reel-to-reel floppies. 512 byte sectors... seeking, a kind of 8 inch floppy on a 3/4 tape reel. DECtapeII was something else. Imagine the slowest seral storage device running over a 9600 baud serial line. The TU58 was an RS232 controlled QIC80 sized cartridge (preformatted only) with the same sectoring as the DECtape and floppy drives. It was designed as a load media for diags, microcode, standalone embedded systems etc. Think SLOW... Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Pechter/Carolyn Pechter | 17 Meredith Drive, Tinton Falls, NJ 07724, 908-389-3592 | pechter@shell.monmouth.com I'll run Win95 on my box when you pry the keyboard from my cold, dead hands. FreeBSD, OS/2, CP/M, RT11, spoken here. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 12:03:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA07883 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:03:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whistle.com (s205m131.whistle.com [207.76.205.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA07878 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:03:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by whistle.com (8.7.5/8.6.12) id MAA03745 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:03:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from current1.whistle.com(207.76.205.22) by whistle.com via smap (V1.3) id sma003743; Fri Aug 16 12:02:49 1996 Message-ID: <3214C5A9.2781E494@whistle.com> Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:02:01 -0700 From: Julian Elischer Organization: Whistle Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0b6 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: MAIL archive not archiving? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk AI've been trying to look up recent mail items inteh mail archive search engine.. but they aren't there.. le latest items I've seen are from June... I thing something's broke.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 12:04:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA08017 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:04:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cmr.kiev.ua (cmr.kiev.ua [193.193.193.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA07873 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:03:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: (archer@localhost) by cmr.kiev.ua (Sendmail 8.who.cares/5) id TAA26640; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:43:08 GMT Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:43:07 +0300 (EET DST) From: "Litvin Alexander B. " To: Joe Greco cc: michael butler , ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. In-Reply-To: <199608161746.MAA15848@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Joe Greco wrote: > > > After a 2.1.5 install, you'll find in sysconfig a line > > > to initialize the loopback interface: > > > > > ifconfig_lo0="inet localhost" > > > > > Well - if your using a nameserver, and the machine booting happens > > > to *be* the nameserver, this won't work. Since named isn't > > > up yet (how could it be before the interfaces are configured?), > > > you can't resolve the name "localhost" > > > > .. man 5 hosts .. I'd say man ifconfig - you don't even need to scroll the page to see reference to /etc/hosts. > > ... which doesn't work very well unless you twiddle host.conf to check hosts > before the resolver (something I always do anyways). > So how does my standalone FBSD box, where I run named - just for fun - is able to boot? ;-) -- Litvin Alexander From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 12:08:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA08260 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:08:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cmr.kiev.ua (archer@cmr.kiev.ua [193.193.193.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA08177 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:07:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (archer@localhost) by cmr.kiev.ua (Sendmail 8.who.cares/5) id TAA26746; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:59:03 GMT Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:59:02 +0300 (EET DST) From: "Litvin Alexander B. " To: Joe Greco cc: Ollivier Robert , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. In-Reply-To: <199608161821.NAA16102@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Joe Greco wrote: > > According to Thomas David Rivers: > > > > You should use "hosts, bind" in /etc/host.conf and populate /etc/hosts with > > some important values like localhost and your primary interfaces. That way, > > you don't need a DNS for booting. > > So I am NOT the only person who feels this way :-) > > Can anybody explain the reason that it is done the other way around right > now? It seems to me that if you specify something in /etc/hosts, there must > be a really freakin' good reason for it, so why not have the system abide by > your wishes? > Because DNS is for centrilized administration. If some host on the net changes address, with DNS you won't even notice it, but with hosts you'll have to ask around what happened. -- Litvin Alexander From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 12:21:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA09245 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:21:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA09236 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:21:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA05544; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:19:12 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199608161919.MAA05544@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: File System on a tape To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:19:11 -0700 (MST) Cc: dgy@rtd.com, batie@agora.rdrop.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199608161815.LAA03019@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Aug 16, 96 11:15:44 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Terry Lambert said: > > > Also, you can't *run* a system off of a tar image (whereas you > > *could* mount a tape filesystem and execute whatever is on the > > tape!) > > Uh... I would have to insist on copying the entire image into core > for that one. 8-). But, that's "free"... assuming, of course, you have enough RAM for the executable in question! Once it's read from the tape, you're limited only by the rest of the system iron... Just think v-e-r-y---s-l-o-w :> But, then again, so isn't running/installing from a floppy *or* a (QIC style) tape... > 1: "What's your tape drive doing?" > 2: "Paging from an executable image..." This is what made it such an amusing concept when I was writing it! Wondering just how long it would take for the transport to give up the ghost... --don From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 12:23:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA09478 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:23:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA09469 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:23:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA05975; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:23:27 -0700 (MST) From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199608161923.MAA05975@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: hackers-digest V1 #1386 To: pechter@shell.monmouth.com (Bill/Carolyn Pechter) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:23:27 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, dgy@rtd.com In-Reply-To: <199608161849.OAA27138@shell.monmouth.com> from "Bill/Carolyn Pechter" at Aug 16, 96 02:49:35 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > From: Don Yuniskis > > > > It seems that Alan Batie said: > > > > > > I'm surprised I haven't yet heard mention of the DEC tape system. I seem > > > to recall that they had a system (PDP-8 version?) that ran solely off tape. > > > > TU58's? > > Well, er TU55/56's were kind of reel-to-reel floppies. 512 byte sectors... > seeking, a kind of 8 inch floppy on a 3/4 tape reel. DECtapeII *This* is what I was thinking of! (can never remember all of DEC's nonsensical naming system). But, I thought they were *1"* ??? Of course, it's been 20+ years so I doubt I'd correctly remember the dimensions of the media... > was something else. Imagine the slowest seral storage device running > over a 9600 baud serial line. The TU58 was an RS232 controlled QIC80 > sized cartridge (preformatted only) with the same sectoring as the DECtape > and floppy drives. It was designed as a load media for diags, microcode, > standalone embedded systems etc. > > Think SLOW... ... Think DEC! :-/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 12:25:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA09638 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:25:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from paloalto.access.hp.com (daemon@paloalto.access.hp.com [15.254.56.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA09633 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:25:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from srmail.sr.hp.com by paloalto.access.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA256613466; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:24:26 -0700 Received: from hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com by srmail.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA219793465; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:24:25 -0700 Received: from mina.sr.hp.com by hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com with SMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA122223464; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:24:24 -0700 Message-Id: <199608161924.AA122223464@hpnmhjw.sr.hp.com> To: Bill/Carolyn Pechter Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: File System on a tape In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 16 Aug 1996 10:02:07 EDT." Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:24:24 -0700 From: Darryl Okahata Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Imagine if the folks with wierd IDE CD's could cut a tape and install > from that before having to get hacked kernels. I've had to make the > floppy sets at times because of not enough DOS partition space > to put the distribution. If I could dd or tar to tape and install from tape > it would be a great ease of installation issue at times. For the unsupported IDE CDROM case, it's easier to just provide a way of making tar tapes from DOS, than it would be to support some form of "TAPE-FS". For SCSI tape drives, it's real easy to make tar tapes from DOS, if you have a SCSI controller that supports ASPI (DOS) drivers. Just grab "gtar-exe.zip" from: ftp://ftp.mcs.com/mcsnet.users/les/dos-gnutar/ All you need are a SCSI tape drive and ASPI drivers for your SCSI controller (the drivers are optional with Adaptec controllers, and available from the Symbios ftp site for NCR/Symbios-based controllers). -- Darryl Okahata Internet: darrylo@sr.hp.com DISCLAIMER: this message is the author's personal opinion and does not constitute the support, opinion, or policy of Hewlett-Packard, or of the little green men that have been following him all day. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 12:27:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA09837 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:27:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lobster.wellfleet.com (lobster.corpeast.baynetworks.com [192.32.253.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA09830 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:27:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pobox.BayNetworks.com by lobster.wellfleet.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-4.1) id PAA20970; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:29:17 -0400 Received: from tuva.engeast.baynetworks.com by pobox.BayNetworks.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA26697; Fri, 16 Aug 96 15:26:11 EDT Received: from tuva.engeast.baynetworks.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuva.engeast.baynetworks.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA07167; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:26:05 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199608161926.PAA07167@tuva.engeast.baynetworks.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.7 5/3/96 To: xmcd@amb.org Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: XMCD problem on FreeBSD 2.1.5 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:26:04 -0400 From: Robert Withrow Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I am unable to run xmcd on the following configuration; any help would be appreciated. Xmcd version 2.0p2 on FreeBSD 2.1.5-RELEASE for an ATAPI cdrom drive detected as follows: wdc1 at 0x170-0x177 irq 15 on isa wdc1: unit 1 (atapi): , removable, intr, dma, iordy wcd0: 1377Kb/sec, 256Kb cache, audio play, 255 volume levels, ejectable tray wcd0: 120mm audio disc loaded, unlocked I've tried both the package on the FreeBSD CDROM and the package from: ftp://ftp.netcom.com/pub/tk/tkan/xmcd-2.0/freebsd/xmcdbin.tar.gz When I run xmcd every attempt to access the cdrom yields: CD audio: ioctl error on /dev/rwcd0c: cmd=CDIOREADTOCENTRYS errno=22 This is how the cdrom device is protected: crw-rw-rw- 1 root operator 69, 0 Jul 25 05:27 /dev/rwcd0c brw-rw-rw- 1 root operator 19, 0 Jul 25 05:27 /dev/wcd0c And this is how xmcd is installed: -rws--x--x 1 root bin 1508034 Jul 10 05:26 /usr/X11R6/bin/xmcd -- Robert Withrow -- (+1 508 436 8256) BWithrow@BayNetworks.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 12:31:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA10081 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:31:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fang.cs.sunyit.edu (fang.cs.sunyit.edu [192.52.220.66]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA10038; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:30:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from chuck@localhost) by fang.cs.sunyit.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA01810; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:30:43 -0400 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:30:43 -0400 From: Charles Green Message-Id: <199608161930.PAA01810@fang.cs.sunyit.edu> X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: hackers@freebsd.org, chat@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD mention in SunExpert Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk August 1996 issue of SunExpert, "Ask Mr. Protocol", page 18 "Three different, fully runnabel versions of 4.4BSD are now available. NetBSD runs on multiple platforms, FreeBSD runs on Intel platforms and provides what is probably the most robust and capable TCP/IP stack in existence, and BSD/OS, also for Intel platforms, represents a vendor-supported commercial version of the system." Mr. Info. -- Charles Green, PRC Inc. Rome Laboratory, NY From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 12:39:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA10499 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:39:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.think.com (Mail1.Think.COM [131.239.33.245]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA10488 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:38:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Early-Bird.Think.COM (Early-Bird-1.Think.COM [131.239.146.105]) by mail.think.com (8.7.5/m3) with ESMTP id PAA23102; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:38:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from compound.Think.COM (fergus-2.dialup.prtel.com [206.10.99.132]) by Early-Bird.Think.COM (8.7.5/e1) with ESMTP id PAA23441; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:38:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from alk@localhost) by compound.Think.COM (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA20379; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:39:13 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:39:13 -0500 (CDT) From: Tony Kimball Message-Id: <199608161939.OAA20379@compound.Think.COM> To: mnewell@kaizen.net Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Quoth Mike Newell on Fri, 16 August: : On Sat, 17 Aug 1996, michael butler wrote: : : > It would be much better if .. : > : > i) pppd refused to run any 'world' writable script and .. : > ii) syslogged the reason for not running it, : : and/or : : c) pppd could read a file that contained a set of routes which : it installs on startup and uninstalls at shutdown. :-) : I suspect this was a goal of the pppd authorship, but the scripts were an expedient. The problem now is that the scripts are used for much more, so that adding such a feature would not permit one to remove the script execution, making the feature superfluous for the general case -- although still desirable for some subset of pppd users who would then be able to eliminate their own use of the scripts. An interesting case study, that. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 12:46:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA10921 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:46:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA10902 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:46:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id WAA00774; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:49:08 +0300 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:49:07 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Hang in the sc0 probe... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk HI! I have a problem with one of our machines. It used to be a FreeBSD file/printer server with uptimes ~ several months (all terminated by typing reboot). Now today I had a real sever need for a graphics card (actually, not me, but that changes nothing) and silly me! I shut it down, powered it down and took the card from it for ~ 1/2 hour. After putting the card back, it no longer boots up - it hangs after the line probing sc0... Everything else is probed OK, hard discs are found, etc. When booting from the 2.1.0-RELEASE boot.flp, it starts to look for the sc0 in the beginning and also hangs. What thing on the earth could be causing such a pehaviour? Thnx for listening, Sander From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 12:59:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA11449 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:59:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA11443 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:59:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA03216; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:52:12 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199608161952.MAA03216@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Nameserver and 'rlogin' in 2.1.5. To: dan@dpcsys.com (Dan Busarow) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 12:52:12 -0700 (MST) Cc: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Dan Busarow" at Aug 16, 96 11:05:36 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Change your db.cache. Listing the real root servers doesn't buy you > anything but trouble if your not connected. Take out the real roots > and put in pointers to your own name servers. > > According to DNS & BIND you should set up your own internal root server > which is only slightly more work, but I did it via db.cache when I was > UUCP connected and it seemed to work fine. > > However, that was several years and revisions of named ago so the cache > trick may no longer work. Worst case, make yourself primary for . and > add a db.root that looks a whole lot like db.water (see Internal Roots in > DNS & BIND for details). config_net? Partial decision tree: START ASK "Do you have an internet connection?" YES -> YES_IC NO -> NO_IC YES_IC ASK "Is your connection up all the time?" YES -> PERM_IC NO -> TRAN_IC PERM_IC TRAN_IC . NO_IC ASK "Do you have a local network?" YES -> CFG_LC NO -> END_A CFG_LC ASK "Are you going to centrally administer host/address assignment?" YES -> CFG_LC1 NO -> CFG_EH CFG_LC1 ASK "Is this machine going to be the primary administrator?" YES -> CFG_DNS ( primary ) NO -> CFG_LC2 CFG_LC2 ASK "Is this machine going to be a backup for the primary?" YES -> CFG_DNS ( secondary ) NO -> CFG_DNS ( client ) CFG_EH // configure /etc/hosts... END_A SAY "You should not to run config_net" STOP From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 13:48:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA16435 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:48:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA16413 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:47:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA24853 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:47:56 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA27177 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:47:55 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA07032 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:12:06 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162012.WAA07032@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: File System on a tape To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:12:06 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from Alan Batie at "Aug 16, 96 07:55:22 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Alan Batie wrote: > What's wrong with 'tar xvf /dev/rst0' for an installation? You never know the contents of a tar tape beforehand, you always have to read the entire tape first, and store the TOC somewhere else. Thus, the current installation reads the tape into a temporary location on the disk, and continues to act as in a UFS installation. Naturally, this wastes much space temporarily. A tape file system would give you a directory, so you could (in theory :) first have a look there, and decide which block number to go to. OTOH, compatible tape file systems can only be dumped off a little- endian 4.4BSD UFS file system image, while a compatible tar tape can probably be created on anything running at least V7 UNIX. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 13:49:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA16556 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:49:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA16546 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:49:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA24949; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:49:14 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA27219; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:49:14 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA07230; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:40:18 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162040.WAA07230@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:40:18 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com (Joe Greco) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608161610.LAA15418@brasil.moneng.mei.com> from Joe Greco at "Aug 16, 96 11:10:53 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Joe Greco wrote: > I found under FreeBSD, um, I think 2.0.5R that this didn't work real well > because route did additional checks for root permissions (I believe I got > around it by forcing the uid and euid to 0, or something like that). I've also noticed this, and even intended to ``fix'' it some day. Anyway, when i was ready with the ``fix'', i noticed that i was just about to actually break it... route does already run setuid root, in order to work with the routing socket. So it tests for the real UID of superuser to decide whether it is allowed to _manipulate_ routes. So everybody can do a ``route get'', but only processes with a real UID of 0 can ``route add''. If the calling processes effective UID is already 0, it is free to also change the real UID to 0 before calling `route' -- much unlike a regular user, who is not allowed to do this. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 13:50:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA16637 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:50:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA16630 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:50:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA24944; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:49:13 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA27218; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:49:12 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA07148; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:31:14 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162031.WAA07148@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: netdb.h and -traditional... To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:31:14 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608161308.JAA00494@lakes.water.net> from Thomas David Rivers at "Aug 16, 96 09:08:44 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Thomas David Rivers wrote: > While building some older (non-ANSI) sources with the -traditional > flag, I ran into the following (on 2.1.5) on line 139 of netdb.h: > > const char *hstrerror __P((int)); > > which, of course, breaks because 'const' is ANSI. It is, of course :), supposed to work, since #define's const to nothing when working on a non-ANSI compiler. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 13:51:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA16756 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:51:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA16735 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:51:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA24938; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:49:11 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA27217; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:49:11 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA07117; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:27:58 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162027.WAA07117@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Nameserver and 'rlogin' in 2.1.5. To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:27:58 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608161331.JAA00547@lakes.water.net> from Thomas David Rivers at "Aug 16, 96 09:31:41 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Thomas David Rivers wrote: > Now, if I'm on lakes and issue: > > rlogin ponds > > I have to wait for a nameserver timeout before the rlogin completes. > (Of course, since I can't contact the top domain servers - this takes > a *long* time to timeout... I'm not connected to the "real" internet > very often.) > > But, if I'm on ponds and say: > > rlogin ponds > or > rlogin lakes > > I get no problems (real fast - no waiting on DNS.) Make your secondary a slave server that forwards all requests to the primary. There's no reason why a nameserver needs to get access to the root servers every hour or so, and as you can see on your primary, it works fine with the cached data from the Internet. I'm using a very similar setup (except, i don't have a secondary name server, since i don't need it), and i've made my name server a secondary for many zones i used to contact fairly often (e.g., including the zone of my employer, and the freebsd.org zone), so queries for these zones can be answered authoritatively. Queries for all other zones will be cached as well (but time out quickly, compared to the secondary zones). Now, your secondary tries to start lookups on its own behalf, since it has been told to be a full-featured server. Since its traffic is not and cannot be routed, it eventually times out. However, if you make it a slave server that benefits from the cache of the primary server, it won't ever start queries to outside on its own, and forward all queries to the primary instead. Since you know that the primary usually works well (as long as you're connected to the net at least about once per week), this should do the trick. Ah, here's the trick: forwarders 10.0.0.1 slave (in named.boot) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 13:52:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA16958 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:52:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA16939 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 13:52:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA24954; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:49:16 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA27221; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:49:16 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA07309; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:45:15 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162045.WAA07309@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:45:15 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608161316.JAA00514@lakes.water.net> from Thomas David Rivers at "Aug 16, 96 09:16:56 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Thomas David Rivers wrote: > What did I discover? There's no way to tell sendmail to not use > DNS (it will be fixed in a "future" version.) That's wrong. It's sometimes useful to read FAQs. ;-) You've already noticed that i'm using a fairly similar setup like you (mail via UUCP, though in my case without the ugly bang :), dialup IP connection occasionally, local DNS). So it's not surprising that i've been confrontated with a similar set of problems once. How do I use sendmail for mail delivery with UUCP? (p1 of 8) 10.16. How do I use sendmail for mail delivery with UUCP? The sendmail configuration that ships with FreeBSD is suited for sites that connect directly to the Internet. Sites that wish to exchange their mail via UUCP must install another sendmail configuration file. (I skip the remainder of that section here, you can read it locally on file:/usr/share/doc/FAQ/freebsd-faq.html.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 14:17:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA18691 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:17:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from etinc.com (etinc.com [204.141.244.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA18673 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:17:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ppp-089.etinc.com (ppp-089.etinc.com [204.141.95.148]) by etinc.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id RAA24840; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:21:33 -0400 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:21:33 -0400 Message-Id: <199608162121.RAA24840@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Narvi From: dennis@etinc.com (Dennis) Subject: Re: Hang in the sc0 probe... Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > HI! > >I have a problem with one of our machines. It used to be a FreeBSD >file/printer server with uptimes ~ several months (all terminated by >typing reboot). Now today I had a real sever need for a graphics card >(actually, not me, but that changes nothing) and silly me! I shut it >down, powered it down and took the card from it for ~ 1/2 hour. After >putting the card back, it no longer boots up - it hangs after the line >probing sc0... Everything else is probed OK, hard discs are found, etc. > >When booting from the 2.1.0-RELEASE boot.flp, it starts to look for the >sc0 in the beginning and also hangs. > >What thing on the earth could be causing such a pehaviour? Is there a keyboard in the machine? I've sent the fix for that in a few times... and eventually gave up. Dennis ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Emerging Technologies, Inc. http://www.etinc.com Synchronous Communications Cards and Routers For Discriminating Tastes. 56k to T1 and beyond. Frame Relay, PPP, HDLC, and X.25 for BSD/OS, FreeBSD and LINUX From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 14:21:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA18994 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:21:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA18964 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:21:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA25996; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:21:43 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA27635; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:21:43 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA07834; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:17:57 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162117.XAA07834@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: XMCD problem on FreeBSD 2.1.5 To: bwithrow@BayNetworks.com (Robert Withrow) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:17:57 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: xmcd@amb.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608161926.PAA07167@tuva.engeast.baynetworks.com> from Robert Withrow at "Aug 16, 96 03:26:04 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Robert Withrow wrote: > When I run xmcd every attempt to access the cdrom yields: > > CD audio: ioctl error on /dev/rwcd0c: cmd=CDIOREADTOCENTRYS errno=22 That's ``invalid argument''. Check the arguments to the ioctl call, or better, check the ioctl implementation in the wcd driver. > And this is how xmcd is installed: > > -rws--x--x 1 root bin 1508034 Jul 10 05:26 /usr/X11R6/bin/xmcd It's a potential security hole. Since xmcd doesn't have to use raw SCSI commands in FreeBSD, but can get at the CD-ROM device with comfortable ioctl's, there's no need for running it setuid. As you can see, its suidness won't help for broken drivers either. :) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 14:21:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA19021 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:21:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA19000 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:21:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA26019 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:21:50 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA27640 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:21:50 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA07650 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:00:18 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162100.XAA07650@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:00:18 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608161657.SAA25421@keltia.freenix.fr> from Ollivier Robert at "Aug 16, 96 06:57:35 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Ollivier Robert wrote: > > (If you see this mail; then I was successfull in setting this up...) > > Except your using these ~@#{^@~ bang paths and you shouldn't. Our rmail > (and most of the other) supports FQDN. At least, use the uucp-uudom mailer > which use a bang envelope and FQDN headers. I think Data General's mail gateway is too stupid to handle the rivers%ponds@dg-rtp.dg.com form. I once tried to convert Thomas' address into this form, and got a bounce. (``There's no employee of this name at Data General...'') -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 14:22:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA19054 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:22:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA19016 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:21:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA26010; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:21:48 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA27638; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:21:47 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA07613; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:55:44 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162055.WAA07613@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:55:44 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: mnewell@kaizen.net (Mike Newell) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from Mike Newell at "Aug 16, 96 12:32:07 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Mike Newell wrote: > > I believe I hacked a copy of route to fix this problem and installed it as > > /etc/ppp/route... > > That's what I had planned to do, but I wasn't sure if something else would > break if I just took out the UID checks. If it works for you, I'll start > hack'n tonight. :-) NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! Don't do it. You're going to let everybody who has execute permission to this script manipulate your routing tables. Read my other followup... You're better doing: su root -c 'route add ...' Since you're already running with EUID == 0 in the scripts, you should be able to `su' without a password, in order to execute the route command. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 14:22:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA19077 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:22:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA19043 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:22:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA26002; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:21:45 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA27636; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:21:44 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA07885; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:20:16 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162120.XAA07885@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Hang in the sc0 probe... To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:20:16 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee (Narvi) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from Narvi at "Aug 16, 96 10:49:07 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Narvi wrote: > typing reboot). Now today I had a real sever need for a graphics card > (actually, not me, but that changes nothing) and silly me! I shut it > down, powered it down and took the card from it for ~ 1/2 hour. After > putting the card back, it no longer boots up - it hangs after the line > probing sc0... What card? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 14:28:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA19525 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:28:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA19452 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:27:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA01213; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 00:30:14 +0300 Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 00:30:14 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Joerg Wunsch cc: FreeBSD hackers Subject: Re: Hang in the sc0 probe... In-Reply-To: <199608162120.XAA07885@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, J Wunsch wrote: > As Narvi wrote: > > > typing reboot). Now today I had a real sever need for a graphics card > > (actually, not me, but that changes nothing) and silly me! I shut it > > down, powered it down and took the card from it for ~ 1/2 hour. After > > putting the card back, it no longer boots up - it hangs after the line > > probing sc0... > > What card? A cirrus logic (some PCI 5440 or 54436), not much used. Works in another computer with Windows, also, at least in text mode on the given computer. Sander > > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 14:32:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA19755 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:32:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA19746 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:32:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA26262 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:32:11 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA27743 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:32:10 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA07700 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:04:49 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162104.XAA07700@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:04:48 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608161821.NAA16102@brasil.moneng.mei.com> from Joe Greco at "Aug 16, 96 01:21:52 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Joe Greco wrote: > Can anybody explain the reason that it is done the other way around right > now? Because it's the default (traditionally, or in absence of host.conf)? > It seems to me that if you specify something in /etc/hosts, there must > be a really freakin' good reason for it, so why not have the system abide by > your wishes? Well, it gives the local system administrator precedence over the network administrator, but the matter of concern is rather a matter of the network. In other words: you can easily put a bogus or obsolete address there, and it will be happily used instead of the correct one. I think if you don't have /etc/resolv.conf, it will fall back to /etc/hosts quickly, even if the machine is otherwise acting as a name server. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 14:50:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA21021 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:50:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA21012 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:50:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA13626; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:50:01 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:50 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.water.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA00231 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:14:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id RAA06286; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:21:05 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:21:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608162121.RAA06286@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers, ponds!lakes.water.net!rivers Subject: sio "weirdness" solved... Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Ok - I finally got something reliably working (on a 386dx-33 at 2.1.5.) The problem was I was using an AST4port clone card in "compatibility" mode. (Compatibility was supposed to deliver interrupts correctly; bet it didn't :-) ). This was a card I bought in 1990... Anyway, when I dug up an *ancient* serial card, replaced the 8250 with a 16550 (one that I ripped off of the 4-port clone), everything worked *beautifully*! Also, when I used the AST 4-port clone card the way it was designed (not in "compatibility" mode, but with the COM_MULTIPORT driver configured properly) - things worked there just fine as well (not a single lock-up.) Thanks for all the suggestions! - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 14:50:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA21063 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:50:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA21055 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:50:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA26832 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:50:52 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA27997 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:50:51 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA08039 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:36:26 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162136.XAA08039@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Hang in the sc0 probe... To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:36:26 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608162121.RAA24840@etinc.com> from Dennis at "Aug 16, 96 05:21:33 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Dennis wrote: > Is there a keyboard in the machine? I've sent the fix for that in a > few times... and eventually gave up. You mean this? ---------------------------- revision 1.149 date: 1996/05/12 12:36:59; author: joerg; state: Exp; lines: +2 -2 Fix the "well-known retries bug" (a logic-o). ---------------------------- I doubt this is Sander's problem, since he would have had the same problem without the graphics card then. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 14:51:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA21095 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:51:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA21074 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:51:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA26827; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:50:50 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA27993; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:50:50 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id XAA08021; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:34:05 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608162134.XAA08021@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Hang in the sc0 probe... To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 23:34:05 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee (Narvi) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from Narvi at "Aug 17, 96 00:30:14 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Narvi wrote: > > What card? > > A cirrus logic (some PCI 5440 or 54436), not much used. Works in another > computer with Windows, also, at least in text mode on the given computer. Never heard of this, sorry, no clue. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 15:03:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA22299 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:03:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA22281 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:03:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA08601; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 16:02:20 -0600 (MDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 16:02:20 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199608162202.QAA08601@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers), mnewell@kaizen.net (Mike Newell) Subject: Re: Routed supports variable-length netmasks? In-Reply-To: <199608162055.WAA07613@uriah.heep.sax.de> References: <199608162055.WAA07613@uriah.heep.sax.de> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk J. Wunsch writes: > As Mike Newell wrote: > > > > I believe I hacked a copy of route to fix this problem and installed it as > > > /etc/ppp/route... > > > > That's what I had planned to do, but I wasn't sure if something else would > > break if I just took out the UID checks. If it works for you, I'll start > > hack'n tonight. :-) > > NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! > > Don't do it. You're going to let everybody who has execute permission > to this script manipulate your routing tables. Read my other > followup... The hacked program doesn't have to be setuid, so it's no security violation. And, you can mess with the execute bits on it if you're really paranoid. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 15:09:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA23186 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:09:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA23161 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:09:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id BAA01447; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 01:12:23 +0300 Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 01:12:22 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Dennis cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Hang in the sc0 probe... In-Reply-To: <199608162121.RAA24840@etinc.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Dennis wrote: > > > > HI! > > > >I have a problem with one of our machines. It used to be a FreeBSD > >file/printer server with uptimes ~ several months (all terminated by > >typing reboot). Now today I had a real sever need for a graphics card > >(actually, not me, but that changes nothing) and silly me! I shut it > >down, powered it down and took the card from it for ~ 1/2 hour. After > >putting the card back, it no longer boots up - it hangs after the line > >probing sc0... Everything else is probed OK, hard discs are found, etc. > > > >When booting from the 2.1.0-RELEASE boot.flp, it starts to look for the > >sc0 in the beginning and also hangs. > > > >What thing on the earth could be causing such a pehaviour? > > Is there a keyboard in the machine? I've sent the fix for that in a few times... > and eventually gave up. The presence of keyboard/absence of keyboard doesn't change anything. No matter whetever the keyboard is pluuged in or not, it just displays the line sc0: VGA color, <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x0> and just dies. If I disable that line, it displays sco: disbaled and dies aswell. Perhaps it is not something in the sc0 probe that kills it but something emmediately after that? What comes after the sc0 probe? Sander > > Dennis > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Emerging Technologies, Inc. http://www.etinc.com > > Synchronous Communications Cards and Routers For > Discriminating Tastes. 56k to T1 and beyond. Frame > Relay, PPP, HDLC, and X.25 for BSD/OS, FreeBSD > and LINUX > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 15:26:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA24446 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:26:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA24437 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:26:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id IAA05464; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 08:25:04 +1000 Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 08:25:04 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608162225.IAA05464@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, j@uriah.heep.sax.de Subject: Re: netdb.h and -traditional... Cc: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >> While building some older (non-ANSI) sources with the -traditional >> flag, I ran into the following (on 2.1.5) on line 139 of netdb.h: >> >> const char *hstrerror __P((int)); >> >> which, of course, breaks because 'const' is ANSI. >It is, of course :), supposed to work, since #define's >const to nothing when working on a non-ANSI compiler. This is broken for gcc -traditional. It works for non-gcc non-ANSI compilers. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 15:43:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA25432 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:43:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from red.jnx.com (ppp-206-170-2-4.sntc01.pacbell.net [206.170.2.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA25427; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:43:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from base.jnx.com (base.jnx.com [208.197.169.238]) by red.jnx.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA25063; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:43:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from base.jnx.com (localhost.jnx.com [127.0.0.1]) by base.jnx.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA11091; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:43:07 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608162243.PAA11091@base.jnx.com> To: wollman@freebsd.org cc: candy@fct.kgc.co.jp, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, olah@freebsd.org Subject: bin/649 - fix questions (tcpdump / print-atalk.c) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:43:06 -0700 From: Paul Traina Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Back in September, you made a change to tcpdump's print-atalk.c code to fix PR # 649. One of the changes was to print appletalk addresses in hex. This is not, to the best of my knowledge, correct. Every network monitor or router that I've seen (cisco, gatorbox, et al) use decimal for the network number and node address. I'd like to back this change out as part of the upgrade to the current tcpdump so that we return to canonical address displays. Objections? From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 16:40:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA29255 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 16:40:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA29243 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 16:40:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA07420; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:34:19 +1000 Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:34:19 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199608162334.JAA07420@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com Subject: Re: more general info on SIO problems in 2.1.5. Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Originally-To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com >I can reproduce this easily with kermit - the particular status >of it right now (in reproduction) is (output of /bin/ps -gaxl): > UID PID PPID CPU PRI NI VSZ RSS WCHAN STAT TT TIME COMMAND > 0 1647 1459 15 3 0 744 104 ttyin I+ p0 0:00.64 kermit Use pstat to debug tty hangs. >kermit is connected to /dev/cuaa0 - whose tty settings are: >ponds# stty -f /dev/cuaa0 -a >speed 38400 baud; 0 rows; 0 columns; >lflags: -icanon -isig -iexten -echo -echoe -echok -echoke -echonl > -echoctl -echoprt -altwerase -noflsh -tostop -flusho -pendin > -nokerninfo -extproc >iflags: -istrip -icrnl -inlcr -igncr ixon ixoff -ixany -imaxbel ignbrk > -brkint -inpck ignpar -parmrk >oflags: -opost -onlcr -oxtabs >cflags: cread cs8 -parenb -parodd hupcl clocal -cstopb crtscts -dsrflow > -dtrflow -mdmbuf >... The flow control settings are unusual and bad. Why use both crtscts and ixon/ixoff flow control? ixoff (aka TANDEM) flow control is broken as designed and might cause hangs if the flow control characters are not sent or received properly. There are a couple of races in the driver that might cause the characters to be dropped even when the line is perfect. ixon flow control (ordinary ^S/^Q flow control of output, which is what is needed to honor the other side's using ixoff flow control) works fine (provided the ^S/^Q are received), but is very inefficient. On a 486/33, it costs 50% overhead per line at 115200 bps, limiting you to at most one line at this speed. On a P133, it costs 6% overhead at 115200 bps. > The behaviour I get is that when large amounts of data are generated >at the other end (after dialing a remote system) - I get several >screen-fulls of output, then everything stops.. *However* from the >modem lights, I see that the modem is still receiving data... it's just >not getting to the kermit process to be written out. This probably isn't directly caused by the flow control problems - everything would probably stop if flow control gets stuck off. It might be caused by the extra overheads swamping the machine and hitting bugs in the boundary cases, but the overheads are probably small enough not to matter at a low speed like 38400. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 16:43:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA29481 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 16:43:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hauki.clinet.fi (hauki.clinet.fi [194.100.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA29298 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 16:41:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cantina.clinet.fi (root@cantina.clinet.fi [194.100.0.15]) by hauki.clinet.fi (8.7.5/8.6.4) with ESMTP id CAA04958; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:39:58 +0300 (EET DST) Received: (hsu@localhost) by cantina.clinet.fi (8.7.5/8.6.4) id CAA06997; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:39:57 +0300 (EET DST) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:39:57 +0300 (EET DST) Message-Id: <199608162339.CAA06997@cantina.clinet.fi> From: Heikki Suonsivu To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: J Wunsch's message of 12 Aug 1996 09:10:43 +0300 Subject: Re: mmap #2 Organization: Clinet Ltd, Espoo, Finland References: <199608120531.HAA03495@uriah.heep.sax.de> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <199608120531.HAA03495@uriah.heep.sax.de> J Wunsch writes: Wasn't there still our long-suffering problem with INN & mmap()? I forgot what exactly it is, something like extending an mmap'ed file perhaps. One bug seems to be that mmapped news active file gets a bunch of nulls appended into it, and newsgroups created after corruption are not accessible. -- Heikki Suonsivu, T{ysikuu 10 C 83/02210 Espoo/FINLAND, hsu@clinet.fi mobile +358-40-5519679 work +358-0-43542270 fax -4555276 home -8031121 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 17:02:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA01346 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:02:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from loopback.ottawa.net (ppp-64.ottawa.net [205.211.4.64]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA01314 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:01:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from brianc@localhost) by loopback.ottawa.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) id UAA00485; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 20:00:07 GMT From: Brian Campbell Message-Id: <199608162000.UAA00485@loopback.ottawa.net> Subject: Re: STREAM benchmark, (not streams) To: michaelh@cet.co.jp (Michael Hancock) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 20:00:07 +0000 () Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from Michael Hancock at "Aug 16, 96 02:41:13 pm" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Tyan Tempest II MB (Neptune based and slow) > 32MB 60ns parity RAM 2 x 16MB simms > P166 Mine's a Dell Dimension (Triton II) 32MB SDRAM 1 x 16MB DIMM P166 > ------------------------------------------------------------- > This system uses 8 bytes per DOUBLE PRECISION word. > ------------------------------------------------------------- > Array size = 1000000, Offset = 0 > Total memory required = 22.9 MB. > Each test is run 10 times, but only > the *best* time for each is used. > ------------------------------------------------------------- > Your clock granularity/precision appears to be 7812 microseconds. > Each test below will take on the order of 250000 microseconds. > (= 32 clock ticks) > Increase the size of the arrays if this shows that > you are not getting at least 20 clock ticks per test. > ------------------------------------------------------------- > WARNING: The above is only a rough guideline. > For best results, please be sure you know the > precision of your system timer. > ------------------------------------------------------------- > Function Rate (MB/s) RMS time Min time Max time > Assignment: 40.1569 0.4073 0.3984 0.4453 > Scaling : 40.1569 0.4228 0.3984 0.5156 > Summing : 49.5484 0.5183 0.4844 0.6094 > SAXPYing : 49.5484 0.5247 0.4844 0.6328 ------------------------------------------------------------- This system uses 8 bytes per DOUBLE PRECISION word. ------------------------------------------------------------- Array size = 1050000, Offset = 0 Total memory required = 24.0 MB. Each test is run 10 times, but only the *best* time for each is used. ------------------------------------------------------------- Your clock granularity/precision appears to be 7812 microseconds. Each test below will take on the order of 164062 microseconds. (= 21 clock ticks) Increase the size of the arrays if this shows that you are not getting at least 20 clock ticks per test. ------------------------------------------------------------- WARNING: The above is only a rough guideline. For best results, please be sure you know the precision of your system timer. ------------------------------------------------------------- Function Rate (MB/s) RMS time Min time Max time Assignment: 119.4667 0.1540 0.1406 0.1641 Scaling : 102.4000 0.1673 0.1641 0.1875 Summing : 107.5200 0.2438 0.2344 0.2578 SAXPYing : 104.0516 0.2494 0.2422 0.2734 > I compiled it on FreeBSD Current. > > cc -O stream_d.c second_cpu.c -o stream_d -lm Mine was compiled under FreeBSD-2.1.5R, with pgcc-2.7.2 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 17:24:42 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA03472 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:24:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail0.iij.ad.jp (root@mail0.iij.ad.jp [192.244.176.61]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA03465; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:24:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uucp1.iij.ad.jp (uucp1.iij.ad.jp [192.244.176.73]) by mail0.iij.ad.jp (8.6.12+2.4W/3.3W9-MAIL) with ESMTP id JAA01268; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:24:31 +0900 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by uucp1.iij.ad.jp (8.6.12+2.4W/3.3W9-UUCP) with UUCP id JAA08862; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:24:31 +0900 Received: from xxx.fct.kgc.co.jp by yyy.kgc.co.jp (8.7.5/3.4W4:96080715) id IAA17868; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 08:54:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from localhost by xxx.fct.kgc.co.jp (8.6.12/3.3W8:95062916) id IAA11402; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 08:53:59 +0900 Message-Id: <199608162353.IAA11402@xxx.fct.kgc.co.jp> To: pst@jnx.com Cc: wollman@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, olah@freebsd.org, candy@fct.kgc.co.jp Subject: Re: bin/649 - fix questions (tcpdump / print-atalk.c) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:43:06 -0700" References: <199608162243.PAA11091@base.jnx.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.06 on Emacs 19.28.2, Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 08:53:58 +0900 From: Toshihiro Kanda Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk From: Paul Traina Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 15:43:06 -0700 > Back in September, you made a change to tcpdump's print-atalk.c code to > fix PR # 649. One of the changes was to print appletalk addresses in hex. > This is not, to the best of my knowledge, correct. Every network monitor or > router that I've seen (cisco, gatorbox, et al) use decimal for the network > number and node address. > > I'd like to back this change out as part of the upgrade to the current tcpdump > so that we return to canonical address displays. > > Objections? No problem. There are always confusion printing network number in decimal, i.e. 0xfffe is printed as 255.254 or 65534. I just disliked this. By the way, print-atalk.c is still buggy in handling aarp packet. I'd like to send a patch to fix it. I diff(1)'ed print-atalk.c of 2.1.5R and mine. Please check and merge below. Thank you. candy@fct.kgc.co.jp (Toshihiro Kanda) ------8<------------8<------------8<------------8<------------8<------ *** print-atalk.orig.c Sat Aug 17 08:47:16 1996 --- print-atalk.c Sat Jan 27 15:30:47 1996 *************** *** 167,175 **** printf("aarp "); ap = (const struct aarp *)bp; ! if (ap->htype == 1 && ap->ptype == ETHERTYPE_ATALK && ap->halen == 6 && ap->palen == 4 ) ! switch (ap->op) { case 1: /* request */ (void)printf("who-has %s tell %s", --- 167,175 ---- printf("aarp "); ap = (const struct aarp *)bp; ! if (ntohs(ap->htype) == 1 && ntohs(ap->ptype) == ETHERTYPE_ATALK && ap->halen == 6 && ap->palen == 4 ) ! switch (ntohs(ap->op)) { case 1: /* request */ (void)printf("who-has %s tell %s", *************** *** 178,184 **** case 2: /* response */ (void)printf("reply %s is-at %s", ! AT(pdaddr), etheraddr_string(ap->hdaddr)); return; case 3: /* probe (oy!) */ --- 178,184 ---- case 2: /* response */ (void)printf("reply %s is-at %s", ! AT(psaddr), etheraddr_string(ap->hsaddr)); return; case 3: /* probe (oy!) */ ------8<------------8<------------8<------------8<------------8<------ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 17:25:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA03518 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:25:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cedb.dpcsys.com (cedb.DPCSYS.COM [165.90.143.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA03510 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:25:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cedb (cedb.DPCSYS.COM [165.90.143.3]) by cedb.dpcsys.com (8.6.10/DPC-1.0) with SMTP id RAA24041; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:11:36 -0700 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:11:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Dan Busarow X-Sender: dan@cedb To: Terry Lambert cc: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Nameserver and 'rlogin' in 2.1.5. In-Reply-To: <199608161952.MAA03216@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 16 Aug 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > Partial decision tree: > > START ASK "Do you have an internet connection?" > YES -> YES_IC > NO -> NO_IC No argument that /etc/hosts is the easiest, and usually the correct way to go if you don't have a full time connection. But, if you have a large internal network, or simply want to learn about DNS, there is absolutely no reason not to use DNS. It works, and it ain't that hard to setup. But I certainly wouldn't expect the installation program to help me do it. Dan -- Dan Busarow 714 443 4172 DPC Systems dan@dpcsys.com Dana Point, California 83 09 EF 59 E0 11 89 B4 8D 09 DB FD E1 DD 0C 82 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 17:31:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA03901 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:31:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dub-img-5.compuserve.com (dub-img-5.compuserve.com [149.174.206.135]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA03890 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 17:31:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dub-img-5.compuserve.com (8.6.10/5.950515) id UAA26808; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 20:30:32 -0400 Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 20:29:27 -0400 From: Jan Knepper <106030.3360@compuserve.com> Subject: Re: HP 100VG support To: A JOSEPH KOSHY , Russ Nelson , "[FreeBSD Hackers]" Message-ID: <199608162030_MC1-865-4AD4@compuserve.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Koshy is accused of writing: /* Russ Nelson who is the official source of the CRYNWR packet collection. The driver for the J2585A card is in BETA apparently and wasn't part of the last release I saw, so you may have to ask him for the sources. */ Sounds good. Russ, are you listening? I hope it is no problem sending the sources for the HP 100 VG card to me? Thanks in advance, Jan Knepper PS: I would like to thank everybody for the great reponse on the Matrox Millennium Video Adapter. I ordered the drivers from xinside Friday last week and received them last Monday. They are working great! From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 19:46:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA08979 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:46:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from whizzo.transsys.com (whizzo.TransSys.COM [144.202.42.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA08971 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:46:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost.transsys.com (localhost.transsys.com [127.0.0.1]) by whizzo.transsys.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA06741; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:46:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199608170246.WAA06741@whizzo.transsys.com> X-Authentication-Warning: whizzo.transsys.com: Host localhost.transsys.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Bill/Carolyn Pechter cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org, dgy@rtd.com From: "Louis A. Mamakos" Subject: Re: hackers-digest V1 #1386 References: <199608161849.OAA27138@shell.monmouth.com> In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 16 Aug 1996 14:49:35 EDT." <199608161849.OAA27138@shell.monmouth.com> Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:45:59 -0400 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk We had some RT11 systems (really Fuzzballs for those who know what they are) kicking around a few years back with TU58's. A buddy had a system with an RK05 disk clone which blew chunks and needed to be formatted. Lacking any working boot media... we changed the speed of the serial interface on the TU58, plugged it into a 2400 bps modem, and had him call it. He booted RT11 over all this mess, reformatted the disks, and loaded a minimal system. It did take a while, but the alternative was unracking the drive from a rack, putting it into a car, and driving 35 miles. > Well, er TU55/56's were kind of reel-to-reel floppies. 512 byte sectors... > seeking, a kind of 8 inch floppy on a 3/4 tape reel. DECtapeII > was something else. Imagine the slowest seral storage device running > over a 9600 baud serial line. The TU58 was an RS232 controlled QIC80 > sized cartridge (preformatted only) with the same sectoring as the DECtape > and floppy drives. It was designed as a load media for diags, microcode, > standalone embedded systems etc. > > Think SLOW... Yeah. Another buddy of mine built an TU58 emulator that ran on his CP/M system, and used an 8" floppy drive as a virtual tape. Sort of the inverse of what started this discussion. It ran *much* faster. louie From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 19:55:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA09465 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:55:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA09460 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 19:55:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id MAA28609; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:43:00 +0930 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199608170313.MAA28609@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Hang in the sc0 probe... To: narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee (Narvi) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:42:59 +0930 (CST) Cc: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Narvi" at Aug 17, 96 00:30:14 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Narvi stands accused of saying: > > A cirrus logic (some PCI 5440 or 54436), not much used. Works in another > computer with Windows, also, at least in text mode on the given computer. You didn't, by any chance, happen to take the opportunity to rearrange the other cards in the system while the video card was out and the machine down?? I ask just because some old motherboards are touchy about where you put video cards. Also make sure the BIOS config is correctly set for the VGA card (ie. not set for mono). It's possible that you've just picked up some dust from the inside of the machine and stuffed it into the PCI socket too. > Sander -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] Collector of old Unix hardware. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 21:31:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA14391 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 21:31:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA14380 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 21:31:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA03068; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 06:31:36 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id GAA11613; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 06:30:37 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id BAA26558; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 01:29:34 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608162329.BAA26558@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 01:29:34 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) In-Reply-To: <199608161810.OAA04488@lakes.water.net>; from Thomas David Rivers on Aug 16, 1996 14:10:12 -0400 References: <199608161810.OAA04488@lakes.water.net> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Thomas David Rivers: > and, after a quick perusal of the m4 files, you see that nodns > doesn't actually do anything anymore... and there is no I wasn't sure and included it anyway. You'll see I don't even use anymore :-) > way to have sendmail not do DNS... in my situation, it always > failed talking to the name server, and then simply queued the > mail. (Exactly what is described in that paragraph....) Explain to why I don't have a problem on my machine ? I use exclusively UUCP, even when I'm PPP connected. Here is my .mc file: divert(-1) # # 2.1 30/05/95 roberto new configuration file for 8.7 # 2.2 08/06/95 roberto use procmail as local mailer # 2.3 17/07/95 roberto set confMAX_MESSAGE_SIZE to 1000000 # 2.4 13/08/95 roberto add nocanonify to shut off DNS # 2.5 18/09/95 roberto add use_ct_file feature # 2.6 02/10/95 roberto move files into /etc/mail # 2.7 03/12/95 roberto put back MIME error messages for DSN. # 2.8 27/05/96 roberto brasil is now SMART_HOST # # NOTE: default is to pass 8bit data directly without the dreaded # QP conversion. We keep that behaviour of course. # include(`../m4/cf.m4') VERSIONID(`@(#)keltia-uucp.mc 2.8 (roberto) 08/03/96') OSTYPE(bsd4.4) FEATURE(nocanonify) FEATURE(mailertable, hash /etc/mail/mailertable.db) FEATURE(redirect) FEATURE(use_ct_file) FEATURE(use_cw_file) FEATURE(local_procmail) FEATURE(always_add_domain) FEATURE(uucpdomain, hash /etc/mail/domaintable.db) FEATURE(domaintable, hash /etc/mail/domaintable.db) dnl # Even if it is generally too late :-) define(`UUCP_MAX_SIZE', `1000000')dnl dnl # Everything that is not in mailertable goes here define(`SMART_HOST', `uucp-dom:brasil')dnl dnl # I want them there define(`ALIAS_FILE', `/etc/mail/aliases')dnl dnl # We generally don't use SMTP but define(`confMAX_MESSAGE_SIZE', `1000000')dnl dnl # I know others' sendmail are nice ones define(`confSMTP_MAILER', `smtp8')dnl dnl # For username rewriting define(`confUSERDB_SPEC', `/etc/mail/userdb.db')dnl dnl # For userdb define(`confDOMAIN_NAME', `$w.$m')dnl dnl # Logical define(`confCOPY_ERRORS_TO', `Postmaster')dnl dnl # For aliases define(`confME_TOO', `True')dnl dnl # Be a little paranoid define(`confPRIVACY_FLAGS', `noexpn,noreceipts')dnl dnl # For MIME define(`confDEF_CHAR_SET', `ISO-8859-1')dnl dnl # I want it there define(`confCT_FILE', `/etc/mail/sendmail.ct')dnl dnl # I want it there define(`confCW_FILE', `/etc/mail/sendmail.cw')dnl dnl # I want this configuration version define(`confCF_VERSION', `keltia-uucp-2.8')dnl MAILER(local) MAILER(smtp) MAILER(uucp) -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 21:31:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA14400 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 21:31:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA14376 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 21:31:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA03066 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 06:31:36 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id GAA11614 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 06:30:37 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id BAA26572; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 01:33:27 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608162333.BAA26572@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 01:33:27 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Problem in 2.1.5 install and loopback interface. In-Reply-To: ; from Litvin Alexander B. on Aug 16, 1996 22:59:02 +0300 References: X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Litvin Alexander B. : > Because DNS is for centrilized administration. If some host on the > net changes address, with DNS you won't even notice it, but with > hosts you'll have to ask around what happened. Come on. No one is speaking about populating its /etc/hosts with the entire Internet. I am talking about putting only localhost and your fixed (i.e. ethernet) interfaces so you can boot even if you don't have a DNS nearby. If you change your interfaces' addresses, you're bound to change /etc/sysconfig anyway so changing /etc/hosts in the process isn't too hard. Security-minded people generally use /etc/host.conf that way too. You don't want to rely on the DNS for booting your firewall. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 22:20:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA17189 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:20:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.76.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA17184 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:20:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608170520.WAA17184@freefall.freebsd.org> Received: by cheops.anu.edu.au (1.37.109.16/16.2) id AA037259220; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 15:20:20 +1000 From: Darren Reed Subject: ipfw/ipfilter - what will it be? To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 15:20:20 +1000 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Well, the discussion went a long way and ended up in a "when I was a lad...". For those wondering, IP filter is my pet project and although I try to keep up with what other similar products do, just because someone else implements a feature in a certain way, does not mean I'll match it. I don't believe that adding "line numbers" is a "forward step" for such a product. The reference to BASIC was to show where that style of thinking has gone to today: tools such as Visual BASIC no longer have line numbers, C doesn't, etc. If a "tag" is desired such that it represents a grouping of related objects (such as used by Cisco's IOS for ACL's or as people have done with in ipfw & taken it further), then they should be just that - arbitary tags. In the context of IP filter, I don't see what that does for the performance or usefulness of a packet filter which resides in the kernel. IMHO, those are the sort of things you want in your rule file, which you edit and then load into the kernel and comments fill that role quite well, I believe. For DIVERT, at present this remains a FreeBSD only feature, at present, but sounds a lot like something I was thinking of some time ago. However, if the purpose is for NAT and how it can be implemented in userland, c.f. screend vs ipfw (need I say more ?). Reading Linux's IP source code, you can see some of the flunky things they've done (reassembling all packets going through the box on a routing box, assuming all TCP/IP packets are destined for the host - regardless of IP#). Flunky features are easy to add if that becomes the priority. In summary, I'm not about to add things just so the FreeBSD team will add it to their release, which may or may not be the same as I distribute. Darren From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Aug 16 22:55:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA20272 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:55:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scruz.net (nic.scruz.net [165.227.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA20267 for ; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:55:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from osprey.grizzly.com by scruz.net (8.7.3/1.34) id WAA24224; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:55:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from markd@localhost) by osprey.grizzly.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA00451; Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:55:53 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 22:55:53 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608170555.WAA00451@osprey.grizzly.com> From: Mark Diekhans To: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr CC: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <199608162329.BAA26558@keltia.freenix.fr> (roberto@keltia.freenix.fr) Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >According to Thomas David Rivers: >> and, after a quick perusal of the m4 files, you see that nodns >> doesn't actually do anything anymore... and there is no > >I wasn't sure and included it anyway. You'll see I don't even use anymore >:-) > >> way to have sendmail not do DNS... in my situation, it always >> failed talking to the name server, and then simply queued the >> mail. (Exactly what is described in that paragraph....) I had a similar problem with sendmail when I upgraded, the solution is to create a file /etc/service.switch that has the line: hosts files Don't ask me where this is documented, I don't think it is. I got the answer straight from Eric Allman. Mark From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 01:51:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id BAA04451 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 01:51:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA04431 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 01:51:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id KAA08853; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:51:33 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA06635; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:51:32 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id KAA10671; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:47:21 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608170847.KAA10671@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Hang in the sc0 probe... To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:47:21 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee (Narvi) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from Narvi at "Aug 17, 96 01:12:22 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Narvi wrote: > sco: disbaled and dies aswell. Perhaps it is not something in the sc0 > probe that kills it but something emmediately after that? What comes > after the sc0 probe? Depends on your config file. Normally, the sio probes follow. I would have immediately pointed this out if your card was one of the newer Mach64 boards which are known to suffer from an early dead when being touched during the 2.1R sio probe. Perhaps the CL boards are behaving similarly? Disable _all_ sio's to verify this. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 02:10:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA06299 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:10:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA06283 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:10:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA29035; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 11:14:30 +0200 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA21151 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Sat, 17 Aug 1996 11:13:39 +0200 Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA22824 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:38:51 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA19395; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:30:31 +0200 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199608170830.KAA19395@yedi.iaf.nl> X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:30:31 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, rivers%ponds@dg-rtp.dg.com In-Reply-To: <199608162045.WAA07309@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Aug 16, 96 10:45:15 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As J Wunsch wrote... > > As Thomas David Rivers wrote: > > > What did I discover? There's no way to tell sendmail to not use > > DNS (it will be fixed in a "future" version.) > > That's wrong. It's sometimes useful to read FAQs. ;-) > > You've already noticed that i'm using a fairly similar setup like you > (mail via UUCP, though in my case without the ugly bang :), dialup IP > connection occasionally, local DNS). So it's not surprising that i've > been confrontated with a similar set of problems once. I also use UUCP. But: when I'm occasionally connected using PPP then you *do* see a DNS lookup and a direct SMTP to the outside world when sending mail. If PPP is down everything goes into the uucp queue as planned. The FEATURE(nodns) therefore does not eliminate DNS lookups altogether which is probably what Thomas expects (and I agree I suppose) > > > How do I use sendmail for mail delivery with UUCP? (p1 of 8) > 10.16. How do I use sendmail for mail delivery with UUCP? Wilko _ ____________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 02:45:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA10060 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:45:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA10019 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:45:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA05367; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:49:03 +0300 Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:49:03 +0300 (EET DST) From: Narvi To: Joerg Wunsch cc: FreeBSD hackers Subject: Re: Hang in the sc0 probe... In-Reply-To: <199608170847.KAA10671@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 17 Aug 1996, J Wunsch wrote: > As Narvi wrote: > > > sco: disbaled and dies aswell. Perhaps it is not something in the sc0 > > probe that kills it but something emmediately after that? What comes > > after the sc0 probe? > > Depends on your config file. Normally, the sio probes follow. I > would have immediately pointed this out if your card was one of the > newer Mach64 boards which are known to suffer from an early dead when > being touched during the 2.1R sio probe. Perhaps the CL boards are > behaving similarly? > > Disable _all_ sio's to verify this. I just solved the problem by a left shift. That is I shifted all the PCI cards one slot to the left from the position they used to be. I had previously tried to put the graphics card in any possible slot, but to no difference. But once I moved all (incl. Adaptec AHA2940 which I had previously not touched) the problem disappared. It seems it was Adaptec that was offending it in some way - it made past the probe, all information about the two disks and a DAT was displayed and then just a hang... It works now again. The sc0 probe seems to have been the last, after it came init and mounting disks (once it made to it). Thanx to all who responded. Sander > > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 02:52:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA10632 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:52:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA10610 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:52:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id LAA25112 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 11:51:05 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id LAA07307 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 11:51:04 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id LAA11024 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 11:22:35 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608170922.LAA11024@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 11:22:35 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199608170830.KAA19395@yedi.iaf.nl> from Wilko Bulte at "Aug 17, 96 10:30:31 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Wilko Bulte wrote: > planned. The FEATURE(nodns) therefore does not eliminate DNS lookups > altogether which is probably what Thomas expects (and I agree I suppose) This is known. You also need FEATURE(nocanonify). However, i've explained this in the FAQ. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 02:52:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id CAA10644 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:52:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dawn.ww.net (dawn.ww.net [193.124.73.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id CAA10531 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 02:51:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from alexis@localhost) by dawn.ww.net (8.7.5/alexis 2.5) id NAA05034; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:50:46 +0400 (MSD) Message-Id: <199608170950.NAA05034@dawn.ww.net> Subject: FreeBSD as a NAS supporting RADIUS? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:50:45 +0400 (MSD) From: Alexis Yushin Reply-To: alexis@ww.net (Alexis Yushin) X-Office-Phone: +380 65 2 26.1410 X-Home-Phone: +380 65 2 27.0747 X-NIC-Handle: AY23 X-RIPE-Handle: AY6-RIPE X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Salut, I just thought it would be fantastic to have kind of RADIUS client built into sort of getty utility (or generic init-independent terminal serving daemon) in order to built fully functional scalable and cheap network access servers based on FreeBSD and PC boxes. Has someone heard anything about such a client and if no what hackers think whether such a client worth implementing? alexis From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 04:04:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA16439 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 04:04:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA16415 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 04:04:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA03225 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:04:08 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id NAA15110 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:03:11 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id MAA27741; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:27:25 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608171027.MAA27741@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:27:25 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) In-Reply-To: <199608162100.XAA07650@uriah.heep.sax.de>; from J Wunsch on Aug 16, 1996 23:00:18 +0200 References: <199608162100.XAA07650@uriah.heep.sax.de> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to J Wunsch: > I think Data General's mail gateway is too stupid to handle the > rivers%ponds@dg-rtp.dg.com form. I once tried to convert Thomas' > address into this form, and got a bounce. (``There's no employee of > this name at Data General...'') It should be able to at least source routed addresses. Try <@dg-rtp.dg.com:rivers@ponds> -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 04:04:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA16488 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 04:04:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA16455 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 04:04:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA03223 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:04:07 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id NAA15109 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:03:11 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id MAA27704; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:17:32 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608171017.MAA27704@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:17:32 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) In-Reply-To: <199608170555.WAA00451@osprey.grizzly.com>; from Mark Diekhans on Aug 16, 1996 22:55:53 -0700 References: <199608170555.WAA00451@osprey.grizzly.com> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Mark Diekhans: > I had a similar problem with sendmail when I upgraded, the solution is > to create a file /etc/service.switch that has the line: > > hosts files It serves the same purpose as /etc/host.conf... This is for systems (like SunOS) that don't have a modern resolver. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 04:56:13 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id EAA20770 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 04:56:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pcnet1.pcnet.com (eischen@pcnet1.pcnet.com [204.213.232.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA20765 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 04:56:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pcnet1.pcnet.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA29949; Sat, 17 Aug 96 07:52:03 EDT Date: Sat, 17 Aug 96 07:52:03 EDT From: eischen@vigrid.com (Daniel Eischen) Message-Id: <9608171152.AA29949@pcnet1.pcnet.com> To: bwithrow@BayNetworks.com, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Subject: Re: XMCD problem on FreeBSD 2.1.5 Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, xmcd@amb.org Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk J Wunsch wrote: > As Robert Withrow wrote: > > > When I run xmcd every attempt to access the cdrom yields: > > > > CD audio: ioctl error on /dev/rwcd0c: cmd=CDIOREADTOCENTRYS errno=22 > > That's ``invalid argument''. Check the arguments to the ioctl call, > or better, check the ioctl implementation in the wcd driver. > > > And this is how xmcd is installed: > > > > -rws--x--x 1 root bin 1508034 Jul 10 05:26 /usr/X11R6/bin/xmcd > > It's a potential security hole. Since xmcd doesn't have to use raw > SCSI commands in FreeBSD, but can get at the CD-ROM device with > comfortable ioctl's, there's no need for running it setuid. As you > can see, its suidness won't help for broken drivers either. :) Maybe we should change the port to use the ioctl method instead of the SCSI pass-thru method? Then we can install it without setuid... Dan Eischen eischen@pcnet.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 06:20:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA24561 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 06:20:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA24552 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 06:20:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA20664; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:20:04 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.water.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA02344; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 07:58:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id IAA08980; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 08:05:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 08:05:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608171205.IAA08980@lakes.water.net> To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Subject: Re: netdb.h and -traditional... Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > As Thomas David Rivers wrote: > > > While building some older (non-ANSI) sources with the -traditional > > flag, I ran into the following (on 2.1.5) on line 139 of netdb.h: > > > > const char *hstrerror __P((int)); > > > > which, of course, breaks because 'const' is ANSI. > > It is, of course :), supposed to work, since #define's > const to nothing when working on a non-ANSI compiler. Yep - it's supposed to do that, but doesn't... A couple of whacks at should fix it. I played around with it a little, but when cdefs.h didn't appear to #define const (and the other keywords) away, I just quickly punted to my other fix. - Dave R. - From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 07:20:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA27467 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 07:20:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA27448 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 07:20:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA23105; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:20:03 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.water.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA17854; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:43:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id JAA09539; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:50:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:50:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608171350.JAA09539@lakes.water.net> To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) Cc: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > As Ollivier Robert wrote: > > > > (If you see this mail; then I was successfull in setting this up...) > > > > Except your using these ~@#{^@~ bang paths and you shouldn't. Our rmail > > (and most of the other) supports FQDN. At least, use the uucp-uudom mailer > > which use a bang envelope and FQDN headers. > > I think Data General's mail gateway is too stupid to handle the > rivers%ponds@dg-rtp.dg.com form. I once tried to convert Thomas' > address into this form, and got a bounce. (``There's no employee of > this name at Data General...'') > Bing! You hit the nail right on the head... Unfortunately, Data General is in serious flux right now, the original network administrator who gave me (and several other people in the area) UUCP accounts has long since left. His replacement announced his resignation a few of weeks ago, and I have yet to meet *his* replacement.... Also, I've been given the word that this service may soon disappear (along with the rest of Data General), so I'm investigating ISPs in the area... when I get that all set up, this problem may simply vanish. I've noticed that Data General's machine now wants to put a return path to 'nuucp' in the header in mail coming from 'ponds'... I'd say their sendmail.cf needs some help. A path of ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com should get to me just fine. Also, simply ponds!rivers should work, if your mailer is smart enough to send all UUCP mail to uunet (or some equivalent.) After seeing your suggestion of examing the FAQ for how to set up a UUCP account, I plan on hacking this some more at my end... - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 07:20:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA27468 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 07:20:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA27451 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 07:20:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA23166; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:20:09 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.water.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA18809; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:59:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id KAA09635; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:06:22 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:06:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608171406.KAA09635@lakes.water.net> To: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl, ponds!uriah.heep.sax.de!joerg_wunsch Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) Cc: ponds!FreeBSD.org!freebsd-hackers, ponds!rivers Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > As J Wunsch wrote... > > > > As Thomas David Rivers wrote: > > > > > What did I discover? There's no way to tell sendmail to not use > > > DNS (it will be fixed in a "future" version.) > > > > That's wrong. It's sometimes useful to read FAQs. ;-) > > > > You've already noticed that i'm using a fairly similar setup like you > > (mail via UUCP, though in my case without the ugly bang :), dialup IP > > connection occasionally, local DNS). So it's not surprising that i've > > been confrontated with a similar set of problems once. > > I also use UUCP. But: when I'm occasionally connected using PPP then > you *do* see a DNS lookup and a direct SMTP to the outside world when > sending mail. If PPP is down everything goes into the uucp queue as > planned. The FEATURE(nodns) therefore does not eliminate DNS lookups > altogether which is probably what Thomas expects (and I agree I suppose) > Well - that's very similar to my situation, but not quite... What I have is a small network of 5 machines which I would like to direct mail to a mail router. The mail router (or smart-host) needs to use SMTP to talk to the local network, and UUCP for everything else. Also, the mail router will sometimes be connected to the internet (which is what motivated the DNS work), so it would be nice if the router could deliver things via the internet "when it could", as you suggest above. So, when I installed the new version of sendmail, and I sent mail on one of the interiour nodes - I discovered that no matter what I did, the interiour node always queued the mail it was to send to the router, waiting on DNS. The only way I found to fix it (I believe now we have determined others) was to rebuild sendmail with DNS look-ups disabled. Prior to this version of sendmail, the absence of the 'I' option caused it to not use DNS. I'm continuing to look into exactly how to set this up... - Dave Rivers - p.s. As an aside - my account says "Thomas David Rivers" - but it's a Southern U.S. tradition to use your middle name, please call me "Dave" :-) Now, your first question should be "Why did that fool put his entire name in the gecos field if he wants us to call him 'Dave'?" Good question! It goes back to the legal issues, problems with banks, etc... so, I always use my full name in anything remotely "official." From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 07:20:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA27481 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 07:20:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA27450 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 07:20:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA23120; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:20:05 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 10:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.water.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA17932; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:45:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id JAA09556; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:52:24 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 09:52:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608171352.JAA09556@lakes.water.net> To: bde@zeta.org.au, ponds!freebsd.org!freebsd-hackers, ponds!uriah.heep.sax.de!j Subject: Re: netdb.h and -traditional... Cc: ponds!ponds!rivers Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > >> While building some older (non-ANSI) sources with the -traditional > >> flag, I ran into the following (on 2.1.5) on line 139 of netdb.h: > >> > >> const char *hstrerror __P((int)); > >> > >> which, of course, breaks because 'const' is ANSI. > > >It is, of course :), supposed to work, since #define's > >const to nothing when working on a non-ANSI compiler. > > This is broken for gcc -traditional. It works for non-gcc non-ANSI > compilers. > > Bruce > So - should someone fix cdefs for GCC, or simply fix netdb.h? - Dave R. - From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 11:17:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA06887 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 11:17:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA06881 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 11:17:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA28023 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 11:17:42 -0700 (PDT) To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Anyone care to set up a firewall in exchange for CDs? :-) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 11:17:42 -0700 Message-ID: <28021.840305862@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I could probably also toss in a couple of FreeBSD T-shirts. :-) WC has no budget right now for paying consultants, so this would have to be a trade of sorts, but we really need someone to set up a new firewall here using FreeBSD (what else? :). Any firewall experts willing to do a little work in exchange for the aformentioned merchandise and/or credit in WC's good will bank? I've taken a couple of stabs at this myself, but I'm a *lousy* person for doing firewalls as my entire career has been devoted to the science of delivering data, not blocking it, and I have never really given the science of computer security much thought - there has always been someone else around who cared easily twice as much as I did about it, so I haven't had to. :-) Anyway, if this sounds like it's of potential interest to you and you've experience in setting up firewalls, please contact me directly. If you're in the California Bay Area, even better! Thanks! Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 12:20:47 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA09146 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:20:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA09136 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:20:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA06088; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 15:20:10 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 15:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.water.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA00152 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 14:30:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA10246; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 14:37:44 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 14:37:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608171837.OAA10246@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers, ponds!lakes.water.net!rivers Subject: Ok - riddle me this oh Sendmail gurus... Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk If you look at the return address for this, you'll find it says something like "nuucp@dg-rtp.dg.com". Here's my .mc file - I've set up a mailertable as the FAQ suggests. The things I've done different than what the FAQ suggests is to set "masquerade as", so things look right, and, I'm not using uucp-dom, just uucp. I found that when I used uucp-dom, the uuxqt commands indicate the sender's machine is ponds.water.net, which isn't valid because I don't have a registered domain or any MX records floating around for ponds.water.net. What I need to have happen is for it to say "ponds" (e.g. ponds!rivers, not ponds.water.net!rivers.) - Thanks for your input - - Dave Rivers - p.s. a return path to me should be "ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com", since replying directly to this won't work... ---------------------------- ponds.mc -------------------------------- Divert(-1) # yada... yada... yada.. (copyright clipped for brevity.) VERSIONID(`ponds version 2') OSTYPE(bsd4.4)dnl MASQUERADE_AS(ponds.UUCP) FEATURE(nodns) FEATURE(nocanonify) FEATURE(mailertable) define(`UUCP_RELAY', uucp:dg-rtp)dnl define(`BITNET_RELAY', uucp:dg-rtp)dnl define(`CSNET_RELAY', uucp:dg-rtp)dnl define(`SMART_HOST', uucp:dg-rtp)dnl MAILER(local) MAILER(smtp) MAILER(uucp) # # Fix up the headers a little.. # Djponds.UUCP # # Some local aliases... # Cwponds.water.net Cwponds.UUCP Cwponds.vnet.net Cwponds.pdial.interpath.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 12:20:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA09153 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:20:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dg-rtp.dg.com (dg-rtp.rtp.dg.com [128.222.1.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA09137 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:20:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by dg-rtp.dg.com (5.4R3.10/dg-rtp-v02) id AA06093; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 15:20:11 -0400 Received: from ponds by dg-rtp.dg.com.rtp.dg.com; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 15:20 EDT Received: from lakes.water.net (lakes [10.0.0.3]) by ponds.water.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA00411 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 14:41:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.water.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) id OAA10270; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 14:48:31 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 14:48:31 -0400 (EDT) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <199608171848.OAA10270@lakes.water.net> To: ponds!freefall.cdrom.com!freebsd-hackers, ponds!lakes.water.net!rivers Subject: Determined what's wrong with this return address (sendmail cont.) Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Ok - I've determined what's wrong with the return address you have for this message (it should be something ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com, but it's mostly likely nuucp@dg-rtp.dg.com.) The UUCP 'rmail' system I'm connecting to _requires_ the first line be: From user remote from machine instead of the more modern form of: From user@system (it's quite common for SysVR3 based UUCPs to require this, even older HDB versions.) So, what do I need to hack into my sendmail.cf to get it to do that? Ideas? - Dave Rivers - From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 12:51:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA10218 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:51:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA10202 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:51:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id VAA02882 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 21:51:05 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id VAA16264 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 21:51:04 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA16983 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 21:27:24 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608171927.VAA16983@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: netdb.h and -traditional... To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 21:27:23 +0200 (MET DST) In-Reply-To: <199608171352.JAA09556@lakes.water.net> from Thomas David Rivers at "Aug 17, 96 09:52:24 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Thomas David Rivers wrote: > > This is broken for gcc -traditional. It works for non-gcc non-ANSI > > compilers. > So - should someone fix cdefs for GCC, or simply fix netdb.h? You should perhaps not ask this kind of questions. ;-) Of course, fix , not the symptoms. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 12:51:13 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA10245 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:51:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA10212 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 12:51:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id VAA02898 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 21:51:06 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id VAA16265 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 21:51:06 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id VAA20967 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 21:32:12 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608171932.VAA20967@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 21:32:11 +0200 (MET DST) In-Reply-To: <199608171406.KAA09635@lakes.water.net> from Thomas David Rivers at "Aug 17, 96 10:06:22 am" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Thomas David Rivers wrote: > What I have is a small network of 5 machines which I would > like to direct mail to a mail router. The mail router (or > smart-host) needs to use SMTP to talk to the local network, > and UUCP for everything else. Also, the mail router will > sometimes be connected to the internet (which is what motivated > the DNS work), so it would be nice if the router could > deliver things via the internet "when it could", as you suggest > above. Better, make it always queue up the outgoing mails for UUCP, but run UUCP over TCP if you are connected to the Internet, and ``classic'' UUCP while you are not connected. That's what i do, works flawlessly, and it's basically what i've been describing in the quoted FAQ entry. Well, i didn't describe the UUCP setup for UUCP over TCP, but that's simple. Simply add alternate port type tcp phone dg-rtp.dg.com ...as the last alternate for your remote system in the /etc/uucp/sys file. p.s.: It would be fine if you could convince DG to accept %@ style addressing (and generate it automatically for your outgoing mails). The bangified addresses look really terrible after the third group reply. I'm thus deleting the entire Cc list now. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 13:03:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA11787 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:03:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA11772 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:02:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA30950; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 22:06:20 +0200 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA10060 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Sat, 17 Aug 1996 22:05:58 +0200 Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA05852 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Sat, 17 Aug 1996 19:42:45 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA23229; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 19:16:07 +0200 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199608171716.TAA23229@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 19:16:07 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608170922.LAA11024@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Aug 17, 96 11:22:35 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As J Wunsch wrote... > As Wilko Bulte wrote: > > > planned. The FEATURE(nodns) therefore does not eliminate DNS lookups > > altogether which is probably what Thomas expects (and I agree I suppose) > > This is known. You also need FEATURE(nocanonify). However, i've > explained this in the FAQ. I know. But why (I know, I should USTSL) is it needed? One would (from de name of FEATURE(nodns)) expect that this was sufficient. If I consult O'Reilly's sendmail the description of FEATURE(nocanonify) is not very extensive (IMHO). But FEATURE(nocanonify) really helps. I'm currently building a weird config with 5 Sun Sparcs and a FreeBSD gateway machine in which I use this setup. Wilko _ ____________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 13:03:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA11870 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:03:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA11857 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:03:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA30967; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 22:06:44 +0200 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA10088 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Sat, 17 Aug 1996 22:06:08 +0200 Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA05859 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Sat, 17 Aug 1996 19:42:50 +0200 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA23496; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 19:37:08 +0200 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199608171737.TAA23496@yedi.iaf.nl> Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 19:37:08 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199608170922.LAA11024@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Aug 17, 96 11:22:35 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As J Wunsch wrote... > > As Wilko Bulte wrote: > > > planned. The FEATURE(nodns) therefore does not eliminate DNS lookups > > altogether which is probably what Thomas expects (and I agree I suppose) > > This is known. You also need FEATURE(nocanonify). However, i've > explained this in the FAQ. Just did a bit USTSL. It's pretty obvious looking at it... Wilko _ ____________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 13:50:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA17744 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:50:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA17731 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 13:50:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id WAA18308 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 22:50:40 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id WAA17217 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 22:50:40 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA08326 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 22:14:22 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608172014.WAA08326@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Ok - riddle me this oh Sendmail gurus... To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 22:14:22 +0200 (MET DST) In-Reply-To: <199608171837.OAA10246@lakes.water.net> from Thomas David Rivers at "Aug 17, 96 02:37:44 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Thomas David Rivers wrote: > The things I've done different than what the FAQ suggests > is to set "masquerade as", so things look right, and, I'm > not using uucp-dom, just uucp. I found that when I used > define(`UUCP_RELAY', uucp:dg-rtp)dnl > define(`BITNET_RELAY', uucp:dg-rtp)dnl > define(`CSNET_RELAY', uucp:dg-rtp)dnl > define(`SMART_HOST', uucp:dg-rtp)dnl I'm not sure whether SMART_HOST and UUCP_RELAY are compatible. Basically (based on my experience), you only need UUCP_RELAY, while the final `.' in the mailtertable effectively acts as the smarthost. (See the setup files i've sent you in private mail.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 14:21:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA21122 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 14:21:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA21107 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 14:21:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sax.sax.de (sax.sax.de [193.175.26.33]) by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA25981; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 23:21:02 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sax.sax.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA17545; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 23:21:02 +0200 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.5/8.6.9) id WAA03585; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 22:53:54 +0200 (MET DST) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199608172053.WAA03585@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Sendmail 8.7.5 issues (the sendmail in FreeBSD 2.1.5.) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 22:53:53 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl (Wilko Bulte) In-Reply-To: <199608171716.TAA23229@yedi.iaf.nl> from Wilko Bulte at "Aug 17, 96 07:16:07 pm" X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL17 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As Wilko Bulte wrote: > > This is known. You also need FEATURE(nocanonify). However, i've > > explained this in the FAQ. > > I know. But why (I know, I should USTSL) is it needed? Because name canonicalization is done using DNS, too. ``nodns'' is a misnomer, it should be named ``nomx''. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 14:29:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA21919 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 14:29:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA21904 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 14:29:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA03542; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 23:29:41 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id XAA20602; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 23:29:15 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Alpha.7/keltia-uucp-2.9) id XAA29902; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 23:10:49 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199608172110.XAA29902@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 23:10:49 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: ponds!rivers@dg-rtp.dg.com (Thomas David Rivers) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' list) Subject: Re: Ok - riddle me this oh Sendmail gurus... In-Reply-To: <199608171837.OAA10246@lakes.water.net>; from Thomas David Rivers on Aug 17, 1996 14:37:44 -0400 References: <199608171837.OAA10246@lakes.water.net> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.39 Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Thomas David Rivers: > Here's my .mc file - I've set up a mailertable as the FAQ > suggests. You need a mailertable only if you expect to do routing between UUCP sites. > The things I've done different than what the FAQ suggests > is to set "masquerade as", so things look right, and, I'm > not using uucp-dom, just uucp. I found that when I used > uucp-dom, the uuxqt commands indicate the sender's machine > is ponds.water.net, which isn't valid because I don't have > a registered domain or any MX records floating around for > ponds.water.net. What I need to have happen is for it to > say "ponds" (e.g. ponds!rivers, not ponds.water.net!rivers.) Can't you just register water.net and get a MX record pointing to dg-rtp whouch would then route it for you thru UUCP ? > ---------------------------- ponds.mc -------------------------------- > Divert(-1) > # > yada... yada... yada.. (copyright clipped for brevity.) > > VERSIONID(`ponds version 2') > OSTYPE(bsd4.4)dnl > MASQUERADE_AS(ponds.UUCP) It is not valid. If you want to masquerade, it is supposed to be a valid FQDN. > FEATURE(nodns) > FEATURE(nocanonify) > FEATURE(mailertable) -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #17: Fri Aug 2 20:40:17 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 18:19:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA03167 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 18:19:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sgiblab.sgi.com (sgiblab.SGI.COM [192.82.208.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA03158 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 18:19:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bazooka.amb.org by sgiblab.sgi.com via UUCP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/911001.SGI) id SAA02525; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 18:19:04 -0700 Received: by bazooka.amb.org (Sendmail 5.65/AMB-1.4) id AA20324; Sat, 17 Aug 96 17:50:20 -0700 From: xmcd@bazooka.amb.org (Xmcd Admin) Message-Id: <9608180050.AA20324@bazooka.amb.org> Subject: Re: XMCD problem on FreeBSD 2.1.5 To: eischen@vigrid.com (Daniel Eischen) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 1996 17:50:19 -0700 (PDT) Cc: bwithrow@BayNetworks.com, joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de, hackers@FreeBSD.org, xmcd@bazooka.amb.org In-Reply-To: <9608171152.AA29949@pcnet1.pcnet.com> from "Daniel Eischen" at Aug 17, 96 07:52:03 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Daniel Eischen writes: > J Wunsch wrote: > > As Robert Withrow wrote: > > > > > When I run xmcd every attempt to access the cdrom yields: > > > > > > CD audio: ioctl error on /dev/rwcd0c: cmd=CDIOREADTOCENTRYS errno=22 > > > > That's ``invalid argument''. Check the arguments to the ioctl call, > > or better, check the ioctl implementation in the wcd driver. > > > > > And this is how xmcd is installed: > > > > > > -rws--x--x 1 root bin 1508034 Jul 10 05:26 /usr/X11R6/bin/xmcd > > > > It's a potential security hole. Since xmcd doesn't have to use raw > > SCSI commands in FreeBSD, but can get at the CD-ROM device with > > comfortable ioctl's, there's no need for running it setuid. As you > > can see, its suidness won't help for broken drivers either. :) > > Maybe we should change the port to use the ioctl method instead > of the SCSI pass-thru method? > > Then we can install it without setuid... Xmcd should be quite secure even when the setuid root. I have made sure of it. People usually have uncomfortable reactions when dealing with a setuid program, and I can understand that, but xmcd will revert the uid back to the original user before accessing any files or running any commands. There is a discussion of this in the xmcd README file. Also, since xmcd sources are freely available, you can examine it and see if you can find any potential security holes. I'd be happy to hear any suggestions. While xmcd does support using the CD-audio ioctls under FreeBSD, if you have a SCSI CD-ROM drive you lose a couple of features when running in that mode. Namely, the SCSI pass-through method gives you channel routing and caddy lock/unlock capabilities. You are correct, though, that xmcd does not need to be setuid root if running in the ioctl method. I don't have an explanation for the EINVAL error from the CDIOREADTOCENTRYS ioctl. I don't currently have a FreeBSD system to play with, but Robert Withrow is apparently running in the ioctl method and presumably using a non-SCSI CD-ROM drive. I am not familiar with the wcd driver but if you have the source code you can check the wcdioctl() routine to see why it is choking on the CDIOREADTOCENTRYS ioctl... -Ti -- \\ // XMCD - Motif CD player / CDA - Command line CD player \\/ Ti Kan / AMB Research Laboratories //\ E-mail: xmcd@amb.org // \\ URL: http://sunsite.unc.edu/~cddb/xmcd/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 18:20:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA03343 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 18:20:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parkplace.cet.co.jp (parkplace.cet.co.jp [202.32.64.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA03331 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 18:20:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (michaelh@localhost) by parkplace.cet.co.jp (8.7.5/CET-v2.1) with SMTP id BAA04792 for ; Sun, 18 Aug 1996 01:19:59 GMT Date: Sun, 18 Aug 1996 10:19:59 +0900 (JST) From: Michael Hancock Reply-To: Michael Hancock To: FreeBSD Hackers Subject: STREAM benchmark (not streams) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It looks like my P166 is spinning it's wheels in the Neptune based mother board. Does anyone have figures for newer model ASUS or Tyan boards? I'm looking for a more balanced PC. I also have numbers for a Dell PC, does anyone have numbers for HP or other brands? http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~mccalpin ftp://ftp.cs.virginia.edu/pub/stream/Code/stream_d.c ftp://ftp.cs.virginia.edu/pub/stream/Code/second_cpu.c Please compile with cc. cc -O stream_d.c second_cpu.c -o stream_d -lm Current results ------------------------------------------------------------- Tyan Tempest II MB (Neptune based and slow) 32MB 60ns parity RAM 2 x 16MB simms P166 FreeBSD-current, cc ------------------------------------------------------------- Function Rate (MB/s) RMS time Min time Max time Assignment: 40.1569 0.4073 0.3984 0.4453 Scaling : 40.1569 0.4228 0.3984 0.5156 Summing : 49.5484 0.5183 0.4844 0.6094 SAXPYing : 49.5484 0.5247 0.4844 0.6328 ------------------------------------------------------------- Brand names ------------------------------------------------------------- Dell Dimension (Triton II) 32MB SDRAM 1 x 16MB DIMM P166 FreeBSD-2.1.5R, with pgcc-2.7.2 ------------------------------------------------------------- Function Rate (MB/s) RMS time Min time Max time Assignment: 119.4667 0.1540 0.1406 0.1641 Scaling : 102.4000 0.1673 0.1641 0.1875 Summing : 107.5200 0.2438 0.2344 0.2578 SAXPYing : 104.0516 0.2494 0.2422 0.2734 ------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 18:40:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA05246 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 18:40:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cheops.anu.edu.au (avalon@cheops.anu.edu.au [150.203.76.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA05233 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 18:40:08 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199608180140.SAA05233@freefall.freebsd.org> Received: by cheops.anu.edu.au (1.37.109.16/16.2) id AA007542400; Sun, 18 Aug 1996 11:40:00 +1000 From: Darren Reed Subject: Re: DIVERT To: archie@whistle.com (Archie Cobbs) Date: Sun, 18 Aug 1996 11:39:59 +1000 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199608151811.LAA14400@bubba.whistle.com> from "Archie Cobbs" at Aug 15, 96 11:11:54 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [Just going through old mail not yet deleted...] In some mail from Archie Cobbs, sie said: > Divert sockets were motivated by a discussion about how one would > implement something like address translation (or packet encryption) > under FreeBSD. Lots of people commented that more kernel bloat is > a hated thing. I happened to agree strongly with this sentiment. You should be aware of the NRL project to do IPsec (for NetBSD) as well as ENskip (SKIP compatible code, written in Switzerland, also for NetBSD). I suspect that there are a number of requirements in the various encryption protocols for IP which will make kernel bloat (either via LKM's or direct) inevitable. I don't imagine either of those would be too hard to port to FreeBSD. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Aug 17 21:52:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA16041 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 21:52:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wwwserver.cqi.com (www.sevenlocks.com [205.252.44.167]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA16036 for ; Sat, 17 Aug 1996 21:52:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: by wwwserver.cqi.com from localhost (router,SLmailNT V2.0); Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:02:58 Eastern Daylight Time Date: Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:01:50 Eastern Daylight Time From: distribution-request@sevenlocks.com Reply-To: "Distribution List" Subject: distribution Digest - V01 #02 To: "Distribution List" Message-Id: <19960816000258.a29add4e.in@wwwserver.cqi.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk distribution Digest Fri, 16 Aug 1996 00:01:50 Eastern Daylight Time V01 #02 Today's topics: 'new security information available' 'new security information available' ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 21:19:11 Eastern Daylight Time From: "Dstang" Subject: new security information available Dear Security Colleague: I would like to invite you to subscribe to SecurityDigest, a new, free bi-monthly electronic newsletter, devoted to security news, issues and trends. Every issue of SecurityDigest is delivered to your desktop (or laptop) with the latest security news and information you need, in a clear and concise e-mail format. Subscribe now by sending an e-mail message to listserver@sevenlocks.com containing the string "subscribe securitydigest." Or view the charter issue of SecurityDigest on Safe@Home, Seven Locks Software's Web site (http://www.sevenlocks.com/SecurityDigest.htm), where you can also secure your free subscription. Sincerely, David J. Stang President and CEO Seven Locks Software, Inc.  ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Aug 1996 21:19:26 Eastern Daylight Time From: "Dstang" Subject: new security information available Dear Security Colleague: I would like to invite you to subscribe to SecurityDigest, a new, free bi-monthly electronic newsletter, devoted to security news, issues and trends. Every issue of SecurityDigest is delivered to your desktop (or laptop) with the latest security news and information you need, in a clear and concise e-mail format. Subscribe now by sending an e-mail message to listserver@sevenlocks.com containing the string "subscribe securitydigest." Or view the charter issue of SecurityDigest on Safe@Home, Seven Locks Software's Web site (http://www.sevenlocks.com/SecurityDigest.htm), where you can also secure your free subscription. Sincerely, David J. Stang President and CEO Seven Locks Software, Inc.  ------------------------------ End of distribution Digest V01 #02 **********************************