From owner-freebsd-www Sun Apr 13 13:50:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA23536 for www-outgoing; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 13:50:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from boober.lineone.net (boober-be.lineone.net [194.75.152.84]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA23527 for ; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 13:50:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from unknown ([195.99.45.6]) by boober.lineone.net (8.8.5/8.8.0) with SMTP id VAA32507 for ; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 21:52:26 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: Read-Receipt-To: "Benn Horton" Priority: Normal X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 To: www@FreeBSD.ORG MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Benn Horton" Subject: BSD Books link is out of date Date: Sun, 13 Apr 97 21:52:45 PDT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; X-MAPIextension=".TXT" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-www@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, The hyperlink on your Books FAQ page is out of date for gnn.com. From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 04:14:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA04631 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 04:14:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de [160.45.24.21]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id EAA04620; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 04:14:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (Smail3.1.28.1) from mail.hanse.de (193.174.9.9) with smtp id ; Mon, 14 Apr 97 13:14 MEST Received: from wavehh.UUCP by mail.hanse.de with UUCP for jfieber@freebsd.org id ; Mon, 14 Apr 97 13:14 MET DST Received: by wavehh.hanse.de (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA02461; Mon, 14 Apr 97 13:07:13 +0200 From: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) Message-Id: <9704141107.AA02461@wavehh.hanse.de> Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 13:07:13 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: jfieber@freebsd.org, www@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199704121435.HAA17981@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Apr 12, 97 07:35:16 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > http://www.freebsd.org/search.html is nice - I like the consolidation > of search features! > > However, what's not so nice is how it's currently implemented. > I click on GNATs and go to www.freebsd.org (fine and expected), > I click on "Manual Pages" or "Ports Changes" and go to Germany > (uhhh... say what?!), I click on "The Source Code" and I go to > Australia (though more often than not, like right now for example) > it's just too crazed and unpredictable an experience to be that > useful (connectivity from California to Germany or OZ is unusably > slow or even non-existant during most parts of the business day now). I've been talking to Wolfram, who does the new-ports and man CGIs and want to move them to freefall. However, what is nice about Wolframs own machine is that be has put together a collection of manpages from various Unix derivates. If it is not too slow, it may not be the worst idea to keep the collection on a machine where it gets maintained. Regarding the ports interface, I didn't hear anything from the HPUX folks yet. Will try again. > We've been talking about bringing Warren Toomey's indexed source page > for awhile now, As soon as I find some time, I want to implement quite a bit cross-referencing between various WWW parts that relate to source code and programs. > though at this point we could just as well substitute > in GLOBAL indexed pages (and I will probably bring in the tags support > for that soon) and I see no reason why the German stuff could be > brought a little closer to home. Sorry, I didn't get this sentense. What exactly do you want to do? I planned to add links from the GLOBAL-generated pages to CVSweb (and reverse) and possibly add a search function to find GNATS reports that releate to those files. A GNATs report put out via HTML could have links to GLOBAL and CVSweb pages as well. And yes, I have a perspective to find the time :-) Martin -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Martin Cracauer http://cracauer.cons.org Fax +49 40 522 85 36 From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 04:14:11 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA04633 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 04:14:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de [160.45.24.21]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id EAA04623 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 04:14:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (Smail3.1.28.1) from mail.hanse.de (193.174.9.9) with smtp id ; Mon, 14 Apr 97 13:14 MEST Received: from wavehh.UUCP by mail.hanse.de with UUCP for www@freebsd.org id ; Mon, 14 Apr 97 13:14 MET DST Received: by wavehh.hanse.de (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA02483; Mon, 14 Apr 97 13:09:15 +0200 From: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) Message-Id: <9704141109.AA02483@wavehh.hanse.de> Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 13:09:15 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: jfieber@indiana.edu, www@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <15504.860857472@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Apr 12, 97 08:04:32 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > A "mirror inspector" is one of the web support positions that I > > haven't seen much of any action on. :( > > I think this one's Ulf. Ulf! Wache auf! :-) As a reminder, I have a testing framework that could automatically check for up-to-date WWW pages on host collections from a cron job. I announced it here some time ago, let me know if someone wants it again. Martin -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Martin Cracauer http://cracauer.cons.org Fax +49 40 522 85 36 From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 04:58:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA07019 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 04:58:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gea.fri.uni-lj.si (gea.fri.uni-lj.si [193.2.72.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA07013 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 04:58:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gea.fri.uni-lj.si ([127.0.0.1]) by gea.fri.uni-lj.si (Netscape Mail Server v2.02) with SMTP id AAA4244 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:00:01 +0200 Subject: Another FreeBSD mirror To: www@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:00:00 +0200 (MDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME5a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: matija.marolt@snet.fri.uni-lj.si (Matija Marolt) Message-ID: <19970414120001.AAA4244@gea.fri.uni-lj.si> Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello. We have established a FreeBSD mirror on our machine. The URL is: ftp://sunsite.fri.uni-lj.si/pub/FreeBSD/ Could you please add us to your mirror-list? The machine is located in Slovenia and the contact person's mail is: sunsite@snet.fri.uni-lj.si Thanks, Matija Marolt. -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Matija Marolt e-mail: matija.marolt@fri.uni-lj.si Laboratory of Computer Graphics and Multimedia Faculty of Computer and Information Science Tel: +386 61 1768-483 University of Ljubljana, Slovenia Fax: +386 61 1264-647 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 06:00:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA09756 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 06:00:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA09749; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 06:00:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA03995; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 05:59:59 -0700 (PDT) To: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) cc: jfieber@freebsd.org, www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 14 Apr 1997 13:07:13 +0200." <9704141107.AA02461@wavehh.hanse.de> Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 05:59:59 -0700 Message-ID: <3991.861022799@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I've been talking to Wolfram, who does the new-ports and man CGIs and > want to move them to freefall. > > However, what is nice about Wolframs own machine is that be has put > together a collection of manpages from various Unix derivates. If it > is not too slow, it may not be the worst idea to keep the collection > on a machine where it gets maintained. Hmph. Well, I think having just the FreeBSD man pages be searchable (locally) from any of the mirrors is still a worthy goal. If Wolfram wants to provide man page indexes for every other UNIX on the planet, we can point to his site as an "extra." And the more I think about "raising the bar" for www mirror participation, the more I'm in favor of it. I think we've played to the lowest common denominator for long enough and it's only hurt us. The real problem, however, is that even if we were to contemplate doing this, there's no "cookbook" for setting up a web mirror in the approved fashion, so the web mirrors would understandably balk at being asked to do something that's thoroughly undocumented and close to black magic. I can't imagine a better use of John Fieber's (or Ade Barkah's) extremely limited spare time than to spec out and develop a "mirror kit" with full instructions and all the bits you need for becoming a "full" FreeBSD www mirror. Without that, we're screwed and won't ever advance beyond the current state of the art. How 'bout it guys? :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 07:11:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA15964 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 07:11:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA15959 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 07:11:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA07405; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 09:10:52 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 09:10:52 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: Martin Cracauer , www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. In-Reply-To: <3991.861022799@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 14 Apr 1997, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > to black magic. I can't imagine a better use of John Fieber's (or Ade > Barkah's) extremely limited spare time than to spec out and develop a > "mirror kit" with full instructions and all the bits you need for > becoming a "full" FreeBSD www mirror. Without that, we're screwed and > won't ever advance beyond the current state of the art. Before raising the bar, we should survey the mirrors and figure out how far the bar can be raised before too many drop out. For example, with the mailing list archives approaching 700 megabytes, I'm sure mirroring those would kill off almost all! Also to be considered is shifting from distributing the built pages, to distributing the web source and having mirrors build on site. This would make it easier to make local variations, such as the "about this server" page, primary ftp site used and the like. To do this, the web source needs to be more self contained. Currently, as Paul Richards recently reminded me, building it depends on thing neither in FreeBSD or the web tree. It also depends on having access to a cvs repository to get at the handbook, faq and (currently) the index file from the ports collection. Generally, the build procedure has a lot of rough edges to be smoothed. Since I built the build procedure, I take full credit for those edges. It was my first attempt at crafting a build procedure emulating the slick one used for the rest of the FreeBSD system. I've definately got a bit to learn! Another important thing is to keep web and ftp mirrors in sync such that a web mirror can reliably point to its corresponding ftp mirror, rather than pointing to wcarchive. About improving the ports interface, a lot could be done easier and cleaner (from the user perspective) if we just served the ports collection direct from the web server rather than linking to wcarchive. What sort of a load would this generate? Are wcarchive stats for ports handy? -john From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 08:39:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA21451 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 08:39:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA21446 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 08:39:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA04723; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 08:39:22 -0700 (PDT) To: John Fieber cc: Martin Cracauer , www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 14 Apr 1997 09:10:52 CDT." Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 08:39:22 -0700 Message-ID: <4719.861032362@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Before raising the bar, we should survey the mirrors and figure > out how far the bar can be raised before too many drop out. For > example, with the mailing list archives approaching 700 > megabytes, I'm sure mirroring those would kill off almost all! Well, a local user has offered to donate a slew of 2GB disks that he formerly used in RAID applications so if we had an important strategic mirror in some location who's only reservation was disk space, I think I could help out. I think we have too many mirrors as it is right now, however, so a little "thinning of the herd" probably wouldn't hurt either. > Also to be considered is shifting from distributing the built > pages, to distributing the web source and having mirrors build on > site. This would make it easier to make local variations, such > as the "about this server" page, primary ftp site used and the > like. To do this, the web source needs to be more self I like that idea.. > Generally, the build procedure has a lot of rough edges to be > smoothed. Since I built the build procedure, I take full credit > for those edges. It was my first attempt at crafting a build > procedure emulating the slick one used for the rest of the > FreeBSD system. I've definately got a bit to learn! :-) > About improving the ports interface, a lot could be done easier > and cleaner (from the user perspective) if we just served the > ports collection direct from the web server rather than linking > to wcarchive. What sort of a load would this generate? Are > wcarchive stats for ports handy? For www or FTP? Jordan From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 10:18:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA29966 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 10:18:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pillar.elsevier.co.uk (root@pillar.elsevier.co.uk [193.131.222.35]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA29960 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 10:18:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from snowdon.elsevier.co.uk (snowdon.elsevier.co.uk [193.131.197.164]) by pillar.elsevier.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA00381 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 18:15:43 +0100 (BST) Received: from cadair.elsevier.co.uk by snowdon.elsevier.co.uk with SMTP (PP); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 18:18:06 +0100 Received: from tees.elsevier.co.uk (tees.elsevier.co.uk [193.131.197.60]) by cadair.elsevier.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA23574; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 18:17:53 +0100 (BST) Received: (from dpr@localhost) by tees.elsevier.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA02024; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 18:17:56 +0100 (BST) To: John Fieber Cc: www@freebsd.org Reply-To: paul@originat.demon.co.uk Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. References: From: Paul Richards Date: 14 Apr 1997 18:17:55 +0100 In-Reply-To: John Fieber's message of Mon, 14 Apr 1997 09:10:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <573estplq4.fsf@tees.elsevier.co.uk> Lines: 97 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.4.37/Emacs 19.30 Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John Fieber writes: > Before raising the bar, we should survey the mirrors and figure > out how far the bar can be raised before too many drop out. For > example, with the mailing list archives approaching 700 > megabytes, I'm sure mirroring those would kill off almost all! This is certainly a consideration but if we work this out carefully we should be able to modularise what is local and what is remote. The first step though will have to be a self contained distribution that can build a web site. With a local config file and a build system it will be possible to build a site that has some local parts and some remote parts and local admins can tailor the config to suit the amount of resources they have. > like. To do this, the web source needs to be more self > contained. Currently, as Paul Richards recently reminded me, > building it depends on thing neither in FreeBSD or the web tree. > It also depends on having access to a cvs repository to get at > the handbook, faq and (currently) the index file from the ports > collection. I've finally got my life to the point where I'm hacking again (getting my Phd and meeting my future wife has put me out of the picture for quite some time but I've finally collected all my computers together into an office area at home and started playing again :-)) and this looks like my field of work at the moment (and it's what I'm signed up to do) so.... At work we have something like the following /tool/{bin,lib,src} The tools area is where the tools for the web site live. These are things like sgmlnorm, perl and so on. This is just like /usr/local but is tailored to the web site i.e. if you want to build a new web site you distribute the /tool area. We use it as a distributed tool server i.e. /tool is an NFS export to the build server and internal web server (there's an external web server as well outside the firewall which obviously has a copy rather than an NFS mount). /product/FreeBSD (project root) /build/ bin lib /content/ bin lib data htdocs ( these two are were the cgi-bin ( server points /data The idea is that the product is totally self contained and that it builds the site into a single area (content) which is also self-contained and can be exported to the web server which may be a different machine to the build server. ./data is where the raw data lives. The build process does two things, it processes the raw data in some way and installs the processed data either into content/htdocs or content/data depending on what the output is and it also builds the executables into ./content/{cgi-bin,bin.lib}. cgi-bin contains only those parts of the code that are called from URLs. Any libs etc that are included, or other executables that are run are put into content/{bin,lib}. This is for extra security. ./content/data is where non-html online data is stored, e.g. databases, or other data that must be further processed on the fly. It would take some effort to move to this but it would solve a lot of problems. If the build process has the right knobs then the amount of data required/processed can be site dependant and the "built" site will either have local or remote links to particular elements depending on the configuration e.g. some sites will have the whole lot (Freefall), some will have everything except the mail archive with a link to Freefall's instead etc. The master site can also distribute different "built" components as well since the whole thing is self-contained both at build time and delivery time. The raw data area would contain links or copies to sources for cvs, gnats, ports etc and different parts of the build procedure would do whatever's best for that data source to create content/data (maybe nothing more than a copy but it's best to do as much processing as possible at build time rather than at delivery time). As a first step we need a self-contained build environment so I can actually build a FreeBSD site without installing a lot of bits by hand. I suggest we create a www/tool area in cvs and put John's SP port into it as a starting point and see where we go from there. This isn't a complete document of how this would work but it's probably enough to start the discussion :-) -- Dr Paul Richards. [p.richards@elsevier.co.uk] Originative Solutions Ltd. [paul@originat.demon.co.uk] Phone: 0370 462071 (Mobile), +44 (0)1865 843155 (Elsevier) From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 11:35:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA04902 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 11:35:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de [160.45.24.21]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA04893 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 11:35:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (Smail3.1.28.1) from mail.hanse.de (193.174.9.9) with smtp id ; Mon, 14 Apr 97 20:35 MEST Received: from wavehh.UUCP by mail.hanse.de with UUCP for www@freebsd.org id ; Mon, 14 Apr 97 20:35 MET DST Received: by wavehh.hanse.de (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA05465; Mon, 14 Apr 97 19:57:12 +0200 From: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) Message-Id: <9704141757.AA05465@wavehh.hanse.de> Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. To: paul@originat.demon.co.uk Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 19:57:11 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: jfieber@indiana.edu, www@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <573estplq4.fsf@tees.elsevier.co.uk> from "Paul Richards" at Apr 14, 97 06:17:55 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [full quote, my comments at end] > John Fieber writes: > > > Before raising the bar, we should survey the mirrors and figure > > out how far the bar can be raised before too many drop out. For > > example, with the mailing list archives approaching 700 > > megabytes, I'm sure mirroring those would kill off almost all! > > This is certainly a consideration but if we work this out carefully we > should be able to modularise what is local and what is remote. The > first step though will have to be a self contained distribution that > can build a web site. With a local config file and a build system it > will be possible to build a site that has some local parts and some > remote parts and local admins can tailor the config to suit the amount > of resources they have. > > > like. To do this, the web source needs to be more self > > contained. Currently, as Paul Richards recently reminded me, > > building it depends on thing neither in FreeBSD or the web tree. > > It also depends on having access to a cvs repository to get at > > the handbook, faq and (currently) the index file from the ports > > collection. > > I've finally got my life to the point where I'm hacking again (getting > my Phd and meeting my future wife has put me out of the picture for > quite some time but I've finally collected all my computers together > into an office area at home and started playing again :-)) and this > looks like my field of work at the moment (and it's what I'm signed up > to do) so.... > > At work we have something like the following > > /tool/{bin,lib,src} > > The tools area is where the tools for the web site live. These are > things like sgmlnorm, perl and so on. This is just like /usr/local but > is tailored to the web site i.e. if you want to build a new web site > you distribute the /tool area. We use it as a distributed tool server > i.e. /tool is an NFS export to the build server and internal web server > (there's an external web server as well outside the firewall which > obviously has a copy rather than an NFS mount). > > /product/FreeBSD (project root) > /build/ > bin > lib > /content/ > bin > lib > data > htdocs ( these two are were the > cgi-bin ( server points > /data > > The idea is that the product is totally self contained and that it > builds the site into a single area (content) which is also > self-contained and can be exported to the web server which may be a > different machine to the build server. ./data is where the raw data > lives. The build process does two things, it processes the raw data in > some way and installs the processed data either into content/htdocs or > content/data depending on what the output is and it also builds the > executables into ./content/{cgi-bin,bin.lib}. > > cgi-bin contains only those parts of the code that are called from > URLs. Any libs etc that are included, or other executables that are run > are put into content/{bin,lib}. This is for extra security. > ./content/data is where non-html online data is stored, e.g. databases, > or other data that must be further processed on the fly. > > It would take some effort to move to this but it would solve a lot of > problems. If the build process has the right knobs then the amount of > data required/processed can be site dependant and the "built" site > will either have local or remote links to particular elements > depending on the configuration e.g. some sites will have the whole lot > (Freefall), some will have everything except the mail archive with a > link to Freefall's instead etc. > > The master site can also distribute different "built" components as > well since the whole thing is self-contained both at build time and > delivery time. The raw data area would contain links or copies to > sources for cvs, gnats, ports etc and different parts of the build > procedure would do whatever's best for that data source to create > content/data (maybe nothing more than a copy but it's best to do as > much processing as possible at build time rather than at delivery > time). > > As a first step we need a self-contained build environment so I can > actually build a FreeBSD site without installing a lot of bits by > hand. I suggest we create a www/tool area in cvs and put John's SP > port into it as a starting point and see where we go from there. A few comments: 1) We should not copy tools that are in src/ to www/ as well. CVS doesn't support a concept like symbolic links, so we can't have both without a maintainace nightmare and we can't have just www/ , because the normal FreeBSD src/ build should install those tols as before. This doesn't mean we should have no programs in www/ at all. Programs that are needed by the HTML build process, but that should not be parts of a normally installed FreeBSD system goes into www/. Programs for all FreeBSD installations go into src/. A third category are ports, but I think we can require having the newest version of a port installed normally on a WWW mirror (if it build on older releases, that is :-) 2) I think your setup require one installation procedure more than needed. /product/FreeBSD/build is not needed. I like my idea of fully relative build more (obviously :-) and to have just an install target that puts the WWW things (but not tools to build these) where the httpd expects it. The only problem I see is with libraries needed by tools. If we have a C program that links to a non-standard library, we need to set up an additional Makefile target so that it is linked to ../lib/whatever.a instead of /usr/lib/whatever.a. Maybe it is acceptable to do this by the standard FreeBSD build process as well. Same applies for perl modules, but those need to be current in the base system anyway when CGI scripts are to be supported. I'm not a perl expert, can one change the place perl looks for modules in by environment variables? Martin -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Martin Cracauer http://cracauer.cons.org Fax +49 40 522 85 36 From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 11:35:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA04906 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 11:35:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de [160.45.24.21]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA04899 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 11:35:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (Smail3.1.28.1) from mail.hanse.de (193.174.9.9) with smtp id ; Mon, 14 Apr 97 20:35 MEST Received: from wavehh.UUCP by mail.hanse.de with UUCP for www@freebsd.org id ; Mon, 14 Apr 97 20:35 MET DST Received: by wavehh.hanse.de (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA05329; Mon, 14 Apr 97 19:42:15 +0200 From: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) Message-Id: <9704141742.AA05329@wavehh.hanse.de> Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. To: jfieber@indiana.edu (John Fieber) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 19:42:15 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de, www@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "John Fieber" at Apr 14, 97 09:10:52 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk A few thoughts on the issue: I like the idea to use the usual CVS tree to transport WWW pages to mirrors. We have several working distribution mechanims and they are well-watched by the source users. Additionally, when installing the WWW pages is done by 'make install' instead of a passive transfer, we could have some scripts that do local modifications on the WWW pages, (possible taks are adding local resources like native-language pages, making cgi links relative or pointing to freefall). I don't think we should depend on mirrors doing a full build from sgml files for now. - Not all tools are in the CVS tree. - People can't be expected to update all related tools on their WWW servers just for WWW purposes. That may break things for them at various places. What about addressing all tools we need to build WWW stuff relative to the CVS tree, not using tools from $PATH or /usr/share at all? My current idea is to make all Makefile actions for html generation and whatever is needed for a WWW mirror relative to the current directory, so that no tools of the installed FreeBSD version are used. I.e. "www/data/Makefile" would call. "../../src/usr.bin/sgmlfmt" instead of "sgmlfmt". That way, people can keep their older FreeBSD releases untouched and just let the www/ tree keep what it needs by itself. The www/data/Makefile targets should depend on the needed tools in ../src/. Programs should be build there, but no 'make install' in a tool directory should be neccessary. We could easily build new cvsup and CTM distributions with just www/ src/share/handbook and those parts from src/*bin that are needed. Regarding the CGI scripts, we could then support various Makefile targets of different kinds of WWW servers. `make install` just build html and moves the "passive" parts (HTML pages. GIFs) into place. Links to CGI scripts in these HTML pages should then point to freefall. If a mirror supports -say- cvsweb.cgi, he/she could do an additional `make install-cgi-cvsweb`. Our Makefile targets then examine whether a CVS tree is where cvsweb expects it (or inserts the right place using sed/perl) and edits the HTML pages that point to these CGI scripts to be a host-relative url. We have to be careful not to overlook relative Urls in CGIs. If we crosslink from gnats to cvsweb and only one is local, we need to edit urls there as well. The user is required to set up his/her target directory for data/gifs and cgis. We could include "/etc/freebsd-www-setup.mk" or such and if it exists, use the locations named or else fall back to a default (i.e. the place when our apache port puts things). This defaults file could also contain a list of CGI resources that are to be installed and linked to locally. Additional local resources like native language urls could be configured that way, too and inserted into index.html automatically. Same applies for a related ftp site which could be pointed to by HTML pages. Martin -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Martin Cracauer http://cracauer.cons.org Fax +49 40 522 85 36 From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 13:44:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA13187 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 13:44:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from originat.demon.co.uk (originat.demon.co.uk [158.152.220.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA13154 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 13:43:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from paul@localhost) by originat.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.6.9) id VAA23835 for www@freebsd.org; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 21:47:50 +0100 (BST) Resent-Message-Id: <199704142047.VAA23835@originat.demon.co.uk> Resent-To: www@freebsd.org Resent-From: Paul Richards Resent-Date: 14 Apr 1997 21:47:50 +0100 X-From-Line: nobody Mon Apr 14 21:46:04 1997 To: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. References: <9704141757.AA05465@wavehh.hanse.de> From: Paul Richards Date: 14 Apr 1997 21:46:01 +0100 In-Reply-To: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de's message of Mon, 14 Apr 1997 19:57:11 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <87ragd2v06.fsf@originat.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 Lines: 95 Xref: originat.demon.co.uk sent-1997-04:4 X-Gnus-Article-Number: 4 Mon Apr 14 21:46:04 1997 Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) writes: > A few comments: > > 1) We should not copy tools that are in src/ to www/ as well. CVS > doesn't support a concept like symbolic links, so we can't have both > without a maintainace nightmare and we can't have just www/ , because > the normal FreeBSD src/ build should install those tols as before. Maybe, maybe not. Not quite a directly related question but are all the mirrors FreeBSD boxes? I'd guess so but it's not necessarily the case. > This doesn't mean we should have no programs in www/ at all. Programs > that are needed by the HTML build process, but that should not be > parts of a normally installed FreeBSD system goes into www/. Programs > for all FreeBSD installations go into src/. A third category are > ports, but I think we can require having the newest version of a port > installed normally on a WWW mirror (if it build on older releases, > that is :-) We should think a bit about this. As far as possible it would be nice to not have to duplicate source trees but we also need to detach the www area from dependance on FreeBSD itself because the needs of www will move much faster than those of FreeBSD. It's essential that we have Perl5 for instance. If we're sure of the FreeBSD version that the mirror runs on then, yes, we can use the system binaries when possible, but in a heterogenous environment my experiences of doing this are all bad and it's much better to build the environment of the web product along with the product. This imposes constraints on the cgi scripts, not in what they can do but in how they should be written. As far as possible they should *not* use system binaries but rely on Perl functionality. It's rare that you need to use a system binary (in a complex journal delivery product in work I've not had one single need to use a system binary). This is true regardless of whether Perl5 is used but I'd hope that mainly that's what would be used. > 2) I think your setup require one installation procedure more than > needed. /product/FreeBSD/build is not needed. > > I like my idea of fully relative build more (obviously :-) and to have > just an install target that puts the WWW things (but not tools to > build these) where the httpd expects it. You don't install the tools on the web server. Only what's under ./content/ is installed on the web server. You have to create a build environment though in order to "build" the content. I think you may be confused by my use of the word build. In my example the build area is where the scripts used to build the site are placed. These are, for example, perl scripts for converting man pages into html. These never get installed on the web server (the web server is coceptually a different environment even if it's the same hardware). It's akin to the two steps of building the FreeBSD documentation. You first have to build the tools that are needed to "build" the documents. > The only problem I see is with libraries needed by tools. If we have a > C program that links to a non-standard library, we need to set up an > additional Makefile target so that it is linked to ../lib/whatever.a > instead of /usr/lib/whatever.a. Maybe it is acceptable to do this by > the standard FreeBSD build process as well. A web site that relies on relative links to make it portable are a nightmare to maintain. You can't easily restructure the site without a lot of effort. It's a much better paradigm to build a web site specifically for a target area and build it absolute. If you need to install it somewhere else you rebuild it for that target. > Same applies for perl modules, but those need to be current in the > base system anyway when CGI scripts are to be supported. I'm not a > perl expert, can one change the place perl looks for modules in by > environment variables? You can manipulate Perl's search path. The common trick is to set up the path in a BEGIN block e.g. BEGIN { push(@INC, "/www/FreeBSD/content/libs"); } -- Dr Paul Richards, Originative Solutions Ltd. Internet: paul@originat.demon.co.uk Phone: 0370 462071 (UK Mobile) From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 15:18:24 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA18884 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 15:18:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from originat.demon.co.uk (originat.demon.co.uk [158.152.220.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA18877 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 15:18:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from paul@localhost) by originat.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.6.9) id XAA24309; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 23:22:04 +0100 (BST) To: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) Cc: jfieber@indiana.edu (John Fieber), jkh@time.cdrom.com, www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. References: <9704141742.AA05329@wavehh.hanse.de> From: Paul Richards Date: 14 Apr 1997 23:22:03 +0100 In-Reply-To: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de's message of Mon, 14 Apr 1997 19:42:15 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <87208dfdo4.fsf@originat.demon.co.uk> Lines: 17 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) writes: > If a mirror supports -say- cvsweb.cgi, he/she could do an additional > `make install-cgi-cvsweb`. Our Makefile targets then examine whether a > CVS tree is where cvsweb expects it (or inserts the right place using > sed/perl) and edits the HTML pages that point to these CGI scripts to > be a host-relative url. We have to be careful not to overlook relative > Urls in CGIs. If we crosslink from gnats to cvsweb and only one is > local, we need to edit urls there as well. All the site content should be built during the "site-build" step so there'd be no need to do any fixing up of URL's later. -- Dr Paul Richards, Originative Solutions Ltd. Internet: paul@originat.demon.co.uk Phone: 0370 462071 (UK Mobile) From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 16:21:18 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA22872 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 16:21:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de [160.45.24.21]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA22859 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 16:21:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ki1.chemie.fu-berlin.de (Smail3.1.28.1) from mail.hanse.de (193.174.9.9) with smtp id ; Tue, 15 Apr 97 01:21 MEST Received: from wavehh.UUCP by mail.hanse.de with UUCP for www@freebsd.org id ; Tue, 15 Apr 97 01:21 MET DST Received: by wavehh.hanse.de (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA25408; Tue, 15 Apr 97 01:19:40 +0200 From: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) Message-Id: <9704142319.AA25408@wavehh.hanse.de> Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. To: paul@originat.demon.co.uk (Paul Richards) Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 01:19:39 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: www@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <87ragd2v06.fsf@originat.demon.co.uk> from "Paul Richards" at Apr 14, 97 09:46:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [It's late, please excuse me for some bad english] We should keep in mind that we have a manpower problem. It is not the actual hours/month that the doc team spends, but the fact that too few people have the full idea how things work together. This is not going to change. We need an easy solution that does not rely one someone keeping details in mind. It should be as intuitive as possible. Let's look over the three ways to adress the problem again: 1) We require mirrors to have all WWW-building tools up-to-date. 2) We build in www/ with relative program targets like ../../src/usr.bin/sgmlfmt/sgmlfmt. We perform a 'make', but no 'make install' in these program directories. If the program needs additional steps after 'make all' to be operational in this directory, an additional target 'make for-www' can be added, which sets things up, but does not copy anything out of the src/ build directory. 3) We build all the tools from src/ and install them to a non-default target where only the WWW build process will find and use them. Every such tool then has two install targets, 'make install' will install to where the FreeBSD release expects it and 'make www-install' will install to wherever the WWW tools tree is. (Or two copies of the program are in the CVS tree, see below). I think that 1) is out of question and that 2) is better than 3). It is easier, the mirror maintainer will not have to set up a place where to install the tools to, he will not have to tell the build process where this place is. Using this place will mean that we need to have Makefiles in www/ that get their tools from a location only known at run time, maybe using the $PATH variable. In comparision, the full relative build of 2) uses a hardcoded location ../../src/some/thing. I think people are much more likely to understand what 2) does than what 3) does. The Makefile will simply be easier and it is obvious what it does, while the solution with the different tools tree will have to maintain a moving target. 2) is much easier to maintain once the architects of the build process lost interest :-) The advantage of 2) becomes evern bigger when we take into account that the number of tools - namly languages - that are using during the build procress might include a complete zoo of solutions how to tell them what library to use if not in /usr/local. Setting this up is much more easy using relative - but fixed for every machine - location than to parametrsize on a absolute directory that will vary from mirror to mirror. 2) und 3) come in two variations a) For all programs that are needed for the WWW build process we have copies in src/ and www/ so the src/ is never needed. That way, people that modify these tools don't have to care whether they affect the general FreeBSD release. b) We keep the tools in src/. We have to trust those who work on WWW and make modifications that they don't break the src/ tree. In both cases will tools that are *only* for www and never for a release be added to www/ In pratice, I think that b) should be done. With the exception of perl, I think there are not many tools where www/ and the general release will conflict. I think it should be a much bigger concern for us to keep the source tree in a maintainable manner and that having two versions of a program in different places in the CVS tree should be avoided. > cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) writes: > > > A few comments: > > > > 1) We should not copy tools that are in src/ to www/ as well. CVS > > doesn't support a concept like symbolic links, so we can't have both > > without a maintainace nightmare and we can't have just www/ , because > > the normal FreeBSD src/ build should install those tols as before. > > Maybe, maybe not. > > Not quite a directly related question but are all the mirrors > FreeBSD boxes? I'd guess so but it's not necessarily the case. > > > This doesn't mean we should have no programs in www/ at all. Programs > > that are needed by the HTML build process, but that should not be > > parts of a normally installed FreeBSD system goes into www/. Programs > > for all FreeBSD installations go into src/. A third category are > > ports, but I think we can require having the newest version of a port > > installed normally on a WWW mirror (if it build on older releases, > > that is :-) > > We should think a bit about this. As far as possible it would be nice > to not have to duplicate source trees but we also need to detach the > www area from dependance on FreeBSD itself because the needs of www > will move much faster than those of FreeBSD. It's essential that we > have Perl5 for instance. I doubt that will be case for much more than perl. For any other tool I can think of, either WWW or the normal FreeBSD system can use whatever that other needs. The disadvantages of maintaining two copies are far greater, IMHO. > If we're sure of the FreeBSD version that the mirror runs on then, > yes, we can use the system binaries when possible, but in a > heterogenous environment my experiences of doing this are all bad and > it's much better to build the environment of the web product along > with the product. I think you didn't really understand what I'm proposing. I want a WWW mirror to check out the whole www/ directory of the CVS tree and parts of src/ (using a CVS module, this is trivial). The WWW build process then uses the programs it relies on from the src/ directory, i.e. ../../src/usr.bin/smglfmt/sgmlfmt or ../../src/share/mk/whtever.mk. Programs from this src. tree are not installed to the base system. That way, we transport versions of the tools along with the www pages and keep them in sync, but we don;t touch a user's machine. > This imposes constraints on the cgi scripts, not in what they can do > but in how they should be written. As far as possible they should > *not* use system binaries but rely on Perl functionality. It's rare > that you need to use a system binary (in a complex journal delivery > product in work I've not had one single need to use a system binary). > > This is true regardless of whether Perl5 is used but I'd hope that > mainly that's what would be used. I agree that perl is a problem, but perl5 is required anyway for some cgi stuff (I think), we could require that mirrors have /usr/local/bin/perl == perl5. Have to think over it. > > 2) I think your setup require one installation procedure more than > > needed. /product/FreeBSD/build is not needed. > > > > I like my idea of fully relative build more (obviously :-) and to have > > just an install target that puts the WWW things (but not tools to > > build these) where the httpd expects it. > > You don't install the tools on the web server. Only what's under > ./content/ is installed on the web server. You have to create a build > environment though in order to "build" the content. Yes, but this build environment needs to be set up. writeable Space must be there, in an absolutly addressed location and since it can vary (we can't push mirros to use a fixed location), you need to have a build rocedure that will accept some way to tell it where to find the stuff. In my solution, the tool location is always fixed and you don't need an extra place besides the CVS checkout tree and the target for the built www pages. > I think you may be confused by my use of the word build. In my example > the build area is where the scripts used to build the site are > placed. These are, for example, perl scripts for converting man pages > into html. These never get installed on the web server (the web server > is coceptually a different environment even if it's the same > hardware). OK, but I imagine that the usual way to set up a mirror i to run the build process on the same machine that is the http server. We need this for example to take care of local specialities like CGIs to run locally and local additions. > It's akin to the two steps of building the FreeBSD documentation. You > first have to build the tools that are needed to "build" the > documents. The tools need to be built somehow, but I think they don't need to be installed anywhere. > > The only problem I see is with libraries needed by tools. If we have a > > C program that links to a non-standard library, we need to set up an > > additional Makefile target so that it is linked to ../lib/whatever.a > > instead of /usr/lib/whatever.a. Maybe it is acceptable to do this by > > the standard FreeBSD build process as well. > > A web site that relies on relative links to make it portable are a > nightmare to maintain. You can't easily restructure the site without a > lot of effort. It's a much better paradigm to build a web site > specifically for a target area and build it absolute. If you need to > install it somewhere else you rebuild it for that target. I didn't talk about relative links in WWW pages, only relative locations of tools during the build process. Martin -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Martin Cracauer http://cracauer.cons.org Fax +49 40 522 85 36 From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 17:54:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA29446 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 17:54:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA29435 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 17:54:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA09855; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 19:53:52 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 19:53:52 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: paul@originat.demon.co.uk cc: www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. In-Reply-To: <573estplq4.fsf@tees.elsevier.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [trying to catch up here...] On 14 Apr 1997, Paul Richards wrote: > At work we have something like the following > > /tool/{bin,lib,src} [...] > /product/FreeBSD (project root) > /build/ > bin > lib > /content/ > bin > lib > data > htdocs ( these two are were the > cgi-bin ( server points > /data [...] I think I've got a handle on how this works, and like it pretty well. I started a little inventory of things as they currently are. I'm sure I've left plenty of things out here, but it is a start. Thoughts and additions appreciated. -john **** WHAT WE CURRENTLY NEED TO BUILD (port = ports collection) What Where we get it TOOLS: cvs FreeBSD BSD make FreeBSD waisindex port (tweaked) sgmlfmt FreeBSD sgmls FreeBSD or port instant FreeBSD groff FreeBSD perl FreeBSD or port sgmlnorm port analog port DATA: CVS tree freefall **** WHAT WE CURRENTLY NEED TO RUN What Where we get it TOOLS: apache port (tweaked) perl FreeBSD or port waisq port cvs FreeBSD gnats FreeBSD DATA: CVS tree freefall mail archives freefall gnats freefall NOTES: * Even though many of the tools are in FreeBSD, they must be of 2.2 or current vintage. * SP isn't currently in the ports collection, but I have a port (ftp://fallout.campusview.indiana.edu/pub/sp) * The data used in the build process comes from the CVS tree, but not all the same place. Some comes from src/share/doc, some from www and some from ports. * Waisq will soon be replaced by a perl5 module. * Instant will have to get a new set of makefiles and some testing before we can run on non (Free|Net|Open)BSD platforms. **** SERVICES WE OFFER (This list is more a reflection of what ought to be than what is.) Service Mirrors "Static" HTML pages all (including all /usr/share/doc?) Searching static HTML all "Utility" cgi scripts all Mail archives freefall CVSweb freefall + any willing Man pages (searchable) freefall + any willing GNATS freefall Ports freefall + any willing NOTES: * By "static" I mean generated (and indexed) as the build process. * Ports are currently static, but that may change. If we start serving it out via http, that becomes a big pile of data to mirror. From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 21:37:53 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA13949 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 21:37:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from meshsv309.tk.mesh.ad.jp (meshsv309.tk.mesh.ad.jp [133.205.11.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA13944 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 21:37:45 -0700 (PDT) From: web-dir@bcs.biglobe.ne.jp Received: (from www@localhost) by meshsv309.tk.mesh.ad.jp (8.7.5+2.6Wbeta7/3.4W5-) id NAA07264; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:37:43 +0900 (JST) Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:37:43 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199704150437.NAA07264@meshsv309.tk.mesh.ad.jp> X-Authentication-Warning: meshsv309.tk.mesh.ad.jp: www set sender to web-dir@bcs.biglobe.ne.jp using -f To: www@freebsd.org Cc: web-dir@bcs.biglobe.ne.jp Reply-To: web-dir@bcs.biglobe.ne.jp Subject: NETPLAZA Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk 　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　ＮＥＣ　ＮＥＴＰＬＡＺＡ事務局 「FreeBSDハンドブック」の管理者殿 　平素より当社の活動にご理解とご協力を賜り誠にありがとうございます。 　NEC では、国内のWWWサーバ(Web)を中心としたWeb ディレクトリサービス NETPLAZAを運営しております。NETPLAZAでは、国内のWeb の業種やコンテン ツで分類し、検索や登録などのサービスを行っております。 　つきましては、貴組織のWeb をNETPLAZA DBに登録させていただきたいと考 えております。ご理解の上、ご了承いただきたくお願い申し上げます。 　貴組織のWeb をNETPLAZAに掲載させていただくことに問題がありましたら、 web-dir@bcs.biglobe.ne.jpまでご連絡ください。 　以下にリンク情報を示します。なおリンク情報の掲載、利用は無料です。 ・掲載日　　　：1997/4/16 ・HP タイトル ：FreeBSDハンドブック ・HP URL　　　：http://www.daihal.co.jp/ ・NETPLAZA URL：http://netplaza.biglobe.ne.jp/ 　今回登録させていただいた内容は、NETPLAZA事務局の方でジャンルと簡単な コメントを付けさせて頂いております。下記のＵＲＬにて登録情報の参照、及 び更新ができます。なお検索キーワードは設定しておりませんので、お手数で はございますがどうぞご設定ください。 ・http://tool.netplaza.biglobe.ne.jp/cgi-bin/NETPLAZA/ul_main.pl 　（ＵＲＬ更新操作を行ってください） 　今度とも、ご指導、ご鞭撻のほど、よろしくお願いいたします。 ＮＥＣ　ＮＥＴＰＬＡＺＡ事務局 ＮＥＣ　ＢＩＧＬＯＢＥパーソナル販売本部　下島健彦 e-mail : web-dir@bcs.biglobe.ne.jp From owner-freebsd-www Mon Apr 14 21:54:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA15179 for www-outgoing; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 21:54:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp [202.239.16.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA15173 for ; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 21:54:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from amont.astec.co.jp (amont.astec.co.jp [172.20.10.1]) by tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (8.6.12+2.5Wb7/3.4Wbeta5-astecMX2.3) with ESMTP id NAA04802 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:54:45 +0900 Received: from lepton (lepton.astec.co.jp [172.20.12.27]) by amont.astec.co.jp (8.7.6/3.5Wbeta-astecMX2.4) with ESMTP id NAA27625 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:54:44 +0900 (JST) To: www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: NETPLAZA From: Hiroyuki HANAI In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:37:43 +0900 (JST)" References: <199704150437.NAA07264@meshsv309.tk.mesh.ad.jp> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.68 on Emacs 19.34.1 / Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19970415135455J.hanai@astec.co.jp> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:54:55 +0900 X-Dispatcher: impost version 0.99h (Apr. 2, 1997) Lines: 11 Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Sorry, www@FreeBSD.org people. I think you've received a mail from web-dir@bcs.biglobe.ne.jp whose subject is "NETPLAZA" a few minutes before. The content body are written in Japanese with ISO-2022-JP encoding and if your MUA crashed, please don't angry. I am sending a caution to web-dir@bcs.biglobe.ne.jp. -- Hiroyuki HANAI / ASTEC Inc. / hanai@astec.co.jp From owner-freebsd-www Tue Apr 15 00:22:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA22239 for www-outgoing; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 00:22:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from FreeBSD.riubon.ac.th ([203.150.180.23]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA22229 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 00:22:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from jojo@localhost) by FreeBSD.riubon.ac.th (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA00162 for webmaster@freebsd.org; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 22:08:02 +0700 (ICT) Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 22:08:02 +0700 (ICT) From: Prayong Thitithananon Message-Id: <199704151508.WAA00162@FreeBSD.riubon.ac.th> To: webmaster@freebsd.org Subject: I want to work as mirror site of FreeBSD Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I use FreeBSD in north-east of thailand Now, I want to promote FreeBSD in North-East of Thailand Plase mail to me about the way to getting Software Thank. From owner-freebsd-www Tue Apr 15 02:26:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA28711 for www-outgoing; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 02:26:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pillar.elsevier.co.uk (root@pillar.elsevier.co.uk [193.131.222.35]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA28704 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 02:26:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from snowdon.elsevier.co.uk (snowdon.elsevier.co.uk [193.131.197.164]) by pillar.elsevier.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA16878 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:23:35 +0100 (BST) Received: from cadair.elsevier.co.uk by snowdon.elsevier.co.uk with SMTP (PP); Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:25:53 +0100 Received: from tees.elsevier.co.uk (tees.elsevier.co.uk [193.131.197.60]) by cadair.elsevier.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA26819; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:25:44 +0100 (BST) Received: (from dpr@localhost) by tees.elsevier.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA02194; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:25:44 +0100 (BST) To: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) Cc: paul@originat.demon.co.uk (Paul Richards), www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. References: <9704142319.AA25408@wavehh.hanse.de> From: Paul Richards Date: 15 Apr 1997 10:25:42 +0100 In-Reply-To: cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de's message of Tue, 15 Apr 1997 01:19:39 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <57g1wsbpt5.fsf@tees.elsevier.co.uk> Lines: 236 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.4.37/Emacs 19.30 Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de (Martin Cracauer) writes: Getting into the detail like this makes it all sound much more complicated than it is when in fact it's a very straightforward setup. Is there consensus to make a start on this? We're not fundamentally disagreeing and the detail can fall out from an initial implementation. The existing /www/data area should be able to continue as it does while we build the new environment around it. i.e. we start with a /www/src /www/tool/{bin,lib} /www/build areas and start populating them since at the end of it all there will still be a /www/data with most of what is currently in it still there, only the cgi scripts and some other bits will migrate out. As a first phase we can start on /www/build without doing any of the rest as long as all the requisite tools make it into the main tree or ports so that in a FreeBSD environment you have everything you need. I'd phase it like this: 1) Develop /www/build This is the development of a build environment that relies on all the tools being available and takes data from /www/data and builds a site in /www/content. 2) Develop /www/tool This phase works on developing a bootstrap stage where you can start from nothing and build all your tools from /www/src into /www/tool from scratch without depending on anything from the local environment. I'll start working on /www/build as soon as John puts SP in FreeBSD somewhere if no-one raises any objections? > Let's look over the three ways to adress the problem again: > 1) We require mirrors to have all WWW-building tools up-to-date. This is a requirement but I think we agree on that but not on how it's achieved (although actually I think we do for the most part, see below). > 2) We build in www/ with relative program targets like > ../../src/usr.bin/sgmlfmt/sgmlfmt. We perform a 'make', but no > 'make install' in these program directories. If the program > needs additional steps after 'make all' to be operational in this > directory, an additional target 'make for-www' can be added, which > sets things up, but does not copy anything out of the src/ build > directory. I don't like the idea of running programs from their compilation area for many reasons, see later. > 3) We build all the tools from src/ and install them to a non-default > target where only the WWW build process will find and use > them. Every such tool then has two install targets, 'make install' > will install to where the FreeBSD release expects it and 'make > www-install' will install to wherever the WWW tools tree is. > (Or two copies of the program are in the CVS tree, see below). You seem to be suggesting that we utilise the normal /usr/src build mechanism and add new targets for /www. This isn't really acceptable either since /www isn't something that should be integrated into the OS. > 2) und 3) come in two variations > a) For all programs that are needed for the WWW build process we have > copies in src/ and www/ so the src/ is never needed. That way, > people that modify these tools don't have to care whether they > affect the general FreeBSD release. > b) We keep the tools in src/. We have to trust those who work on WWW > and make modifications that they don't break the src/ tree. There should never be any changes made to /usr/src purely because of /www needs. The base OS should not have to be modified in any way. > In both cases will tools that are *only* for www and never for a > release be added to www/ Agreed, I'm actually beginning to think that they could go in ports or we have something akin to the contrib area but the other way around i.e. /www/src/groff would be a wrapper that uses /usr/src/.../groff in the same way that /usr/src has wrappers for the contrib area. Both the contrib and ports mechanisms offer solutions to utilising the main /usr/src area without having to actually make /www specific changes to the main tree. > > We should think a bit about this. As far as possible it would be nice > > to not have to duplicate source trees but we also need to detach the > > www area from dependance on FreeBSD itself because the needs of www > > will move much faster than those of FreeBSD. It's essential that we > > have Perl5 for instance. > > I doubt that will be case for much more than perl. For any other tool > I can think of, either WWW or the normal FreeBSD system can use > whatever that other needs. The disadvantages of maintaining two copies > are far greater, IMHO. For a FreeBSD site that would be true but for non-FreeBSD sites you'd need to have standalone make build environments. Not an immediate goal (we should aim for a self-contained FreeBSD based system first) but the solution should not make a portable system impossible by requiring FreeBSD specific resources (such as the main source tree). > I think you didn't really understand what I'm proposing. I didn't entirely though I still disagree with a few things. > I want a WWW mirror to check out the whole www/ directory of the CVS > tree and parts of src/ (using a CVS module, this is trivial). Agreed. > The WWW build process then uses the programs it relies on from the > src/ directory, i.e. ../../src/usr.bin/smglfmt/sgmlfmt or > ../../src/share/mk/whtever.mk. Programs from this src. tree are not > installed to the base system. > > That way, we transport versions of the tools along with the www pages > and keep them in sync, but we don;t touch a user's machine. We had a misunderstanding here. My example of /tool was too specific. Although that's what we do in work in this situation I was intending to do as you suggested and have the tools under /www. My goal is definately to be able to tar up www, ship it to a mirror site and be able to type make to have a mirror built (obviously some local configuration may be necessary). > I agree that perl is a problem, but perl5 is required anyway for some > cgi stuff (I think), we could require that mirrors have > /usr/local/bin/perl == perl5. Have to think over it. No, I'm still not in favour of this. Any www code should not refer to anything outside of /www. As I said before, it's bad programming practice to have cgi scripts that use things like 'ls' so there shouln't ever be any reason to have to run system binaries. It's simply not possible to rely on the mirror sites having a setup that's totally compatible with the www system. The ports build system offers us a lot here. We don't have to require that mirrors take a complete /www/tool area, the ports mechanism can be used to build those parts that the local site doesn't have but this mechanism must first do the checking to see if the local environment is compatible and build the replacements if necessary. What this mechanism does during this process is setup the www environment appropriately. This can be done with symlinks from /www/tool/bin so that the scripts can always reference /www/tool/bin regardless of whether the local binaries are used or not. This is icing though, initially I'd recommend building all the tools we need into /www/tool/bin. > Yes, but this build environment needs to be set up. writeable Space > must be there, in an absolutly addressed location and since it can > vary (we can't push mirros to use a fixed location), you need to have > a build rocedure that will accept some way to tell it where to find > the stuff. But that build environment is within the /www area, this is internal to the product and has nothing to do with the local site. The local site would have to decide where www/ is to be put but they wouldn't have any control over what's under www/. > In my solution, the tool location is always fixed and you don't need > an extra place besides the CVS checkout tree and the target for the > built www pages. This is where there seems to be some confusion. Forget the /tool bit, it should have been /www/tool for this project since there's no requirement to share the tools amongst different projects. This is part of the way towards what you say since all the tools are now within /www/tool. I disagree though with running tools from the directories that they are built into for a number of reasons. 1) It's untidy, I don't like the idea of running programs from their object directory so there has to be a make install step. 2) You may not want to distribute the sources of the tools. I can see a need to distribute the "site build" environment, that is all the pre-built tools and all the site data so that mirrors can build the site but not have to build all the tools. 3) You can't rebuild the tools without clobbering the build environment. You should be able to make changes to a tool and compile it without having it appear in the runtime environment. This is why there's a make install step after all, otherwise we could run FreeBSD out of /usr/{src.obj}. 4) I think using a cvs distribution mechanism is in the back of your mind. I don't the the web site should rely on that. It'd be a nice option for mirrors but you shouldn't require that they mirror cvs areas in order to build a mirror web site. > > I think you may be confused by my use of the word build. In my example > > the build area is where the scripts used to build the site are > > placed. These are, for example, perl scripts for converting man pages > > into html. These never get installed on the web server (the web server > > is coceptually a different environment even if it's the same > > hardware). > > OK, but I imagine that the usual way to set up a mirror i to run the > build process on the same machine that is the http server. > > We need this for example to take care of local specialities like CGIs > to run locally and local additions. Not really. You set up the configuration for your target, you don't have to build the site on the machine that has the web server. In work we build the site inside the firewall and distribute the built site to the web server when it's all checked and ready. You should never build a site into a live area. There should always be a make install (or for this bit of the process a make publish) step that puts the built content live. Incidentally, all this talk of make. I suspect that the site build mechanism is more likely to be a perl script, quite possibly with a nice tk front end. > > It's akin to the two steps of building the FreeBSD documentation. You > > first have to build the tools that are needed to "build" the > > documents. > > The tools need to be built somehow, but I think they don't need to be > installed anywhere. See above. -- Dr Paul Richards. [p.richards@elsevier.co.uk] Originative Solutions Ltd. [paul@originat.demon.co.uk] Phone: 0370 462071 (Mobile), +44 (0)1865 843155 (Elsevier) From owner-freebsd-www Tue Apr 15 06:43:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA10079 for www-outgoing; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 06:43:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA10074 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 06:43:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA12528; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 08:42:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 08:42:24 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: Paul Richards cc: Martin Cracauer , Paul Richards , www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. In-Reply-To: <57g1wsbpt5.fsf@tees.elsevier.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On 15 Apr 1997, Paul Richards wrote: > Is there consensus to make a start on this? We're not fundamentally > disagreeing and the detail can fall out from an initial > implementation. > > The existing /www/data area should be able to continue as it does > while we build the new environment around it. i.e. we start with a > > /www/src > /www/tool/{bin,lib} > /www/build > > areas and start populating them since at the end of it all there will > still be a /www/data with most of what is currently in it still there, > only the cgi scripts and some other bits will migrate out. A definate approval from me, but I've demoted myself from webmaster (still working on the phd) and Ade Barkah should thus have a say, as the official one in charge here. So long as nothing inside www/data changes (yet), nothing in the existing web build procedure should break. When we start re-configuring www/data, would could make a (short-lived) "www-stable" cvs branch off so as not to disrupt the live web page production during final testing of the new procedure. -john From owner-freebsd-www Tue Apr 15 10:35:23 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA23883 for www-outgoing; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:35:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from plato.dayna.com (PLATO.DAYNA.COM [192.206.100.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA23861 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:35:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from salty (salty.dayna.com) by plato.dayna.com (4.1/25-eef) id AA07829; Tue, 15 Apr 97 11:34:50 MDT Message-Id: <3353CA4A.3927@dayna.com> Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:34:50 -0600 From: Wes Peters Reply-To: wes@dayna.com Organization: Dayna Communications X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: www@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: FreeBSD Gallery submissions... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-www@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk To the Webmaster: I have submitted a link for my company to the FreeBSD Gallery twice since last fall, it has still not appeared in the Gallery. Am I to take this as a rejection? If so, I would like to know why my entry has been excluded. If this is an oversight, and the Gallery submissions have not been posted due to overwork, I completely understand, but remain curious. Thank you for your support. -- Wes Peters It was a diamond as big as the Ritz Software Engineer What you gonna do with this, tell me Dayna Communications Who's gonna save you when you're a slave to A diamond as big as the Ritz From owner-freebsd-www Tue Apr 15 12:56:40 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA06786 for www-outgoing; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:56:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ibm02-1111jordan.pams.ncsu.edu (ibm02-1111jordan.pams.ncsu.edu [152.1.159.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA06774 for ; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:56:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ibm02-1111jordan.pams.ncsu.edu (8.6.11/PC06jan95) id PAA12295; Tue, 15 Apr 1997 15:56:15 -0400 Message-Id: <199704151956.PAA12295@ibm02-1111jordan.pams.ncsu.edu> Subject: Re: FreeBSD Gallery submissions... To: wes@dayna.com Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 15:56:14 -0400 (EDT) Cc: www@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3353CA4A.3927@dayna.com> from "Wes Peters" at Apr 15, 97 12:34:50 pm Reply-To: nsj@ncsu.edu From: nsj@ncsu.edu (Nate Johnson) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24/POP] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-www@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk %I have submitted a link for my company to the FreeBSD Gallery twice %since last fall, it has still not appeared in the Gallery. Am I %to take this as a rejection? If so, I would like to know why my %entry has been excluded. If this is an oversight, and the Gallery %submissions have not been posted due to overwork, I completely %understand, but remain curious. Thank you for your support. Mr. Peters, I apologize for the delay in this. We've had some personnel problems as of late, and some of the Gallery entries got lost in the shuffle. As far as I know, we haven't turned anyone away. =) If you could resend your Gallery entry to this address, I will add it to the Gallery ASAP. Sorry again for the confusion, nsj -- Nate Johnson / nsj@ncsu.edu / nsj@catt.ncsu.edu / nsj@FreeBSD.org Head Systems Administrator, Computer and Technologies Theme Program North Carolina State University, Raleigh, North Carolina From owner-freebsd-www Wed Apr 16 05:41:49 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA24733 for www-outgoing; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 05:41:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bsd.fs.bauing.th-darmstadt.de (bsd.fs.bauing.th-darmstadt.de [130.83.63.241]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA24719 for ; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 05:41:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from campa.panke.de (anonymous225.ppp.cs.tu-berlin.de [130.149.17.225]) by bsd.fs.bauing.th-darmstadt.de (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA14994; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:41:25 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wosch@localhost) by campa.panke.de (8.8.5/8.6.12) id OAA00747; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:19:27 +0200 (MET DST) To: John Fieber Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Comments on new search page.. References: From: Wolfram Schneider Date: 16 Apr 1997 14:19:25 +0200 In-Reply-To: John Fieber's message of Sat, 12 Apr 1997 09:50:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Lines: 14 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John Fieber writes: > > useful (connectivity from California to Germany or OZ is unusably > > slow or even non-existant during most parts of the business day now). > > Indiana seems to have a pretty decent German link, often better > than to California! I think the problem is at YOUR end Jordan. :) The german universities have a 90Mbit/s ATM link to MCI (Washington DC) and a 34Mbit/s (or 45Mbit/s?) link to other european countries. I had 50KB/s transfers from ftp.freebsd.org at daytime. Bandwidth should not be a problem any more. -- Wolfram Schneider http://www.apfel.de/~wosch/ From owner-freebsd-www Wed Apr 16 11:55:14 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA04249 for www-outgoing; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 11:55:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dino.conicit.ve (dino.conicit.ve [150.188.1.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA04233 for ; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 11:55:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nyctea.ciens.ucv.ve by dino.conicit.ve (4.1/SMI-4.1/RP-1.2) id AA27839; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:55:13 -0400 Received: from euler.ciens.ucv.ve by nyctea.ciens.ucv.ve; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/07Dec95-0547PM) id AA02074; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:47:55 -0400 Received: from pascal (pascal.ciens.ucv.ve) by euler.ciens.ucv.ve.ciens.ucv.ve (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA07838; Wed, 16 Apr 97 15:03:44-040 Message-Id: <33552091.41C67EA6@euler.ciens.ucv.ve> Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:55:13 -0400 From: Luis Morales Organization: Departamento Matematicas U.C.V X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (X11; I; SunOS 4.1.4 sun4m) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: www@freebsd.org Subject: proform Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, mi name in Luis Morales. I'm a system administrator of Departament o f mathematic in Central Univeristy in Venezuela and SAGI-UCV. We are interest in adquire the last version of freebsd and his tutorials and books. Please send me the proform of your product. My system (SAGI-UCV) have about 10,000 users distributed in three machines with Linux, but a want migrate to freebsd. The services that we provide is: acces to internet, email, ftp, gopher, remote acces (via terminal), navegate whith lynx, netscape, etc. So we have the principal page of Central University on Venezuela (www.ucv.edu.ve). If we adquire your product, how i can do to actualize the system?. I have pay for they. Well send all information. I have a credit card for the pay the so. If you have institutional prices, send me the requierement. if you suministrate the product via institucional help, i will give yours advertaicement about your product. Thank you for your time... -- Nonbre y Apellidos: Luis Manuel Morales C Cargo: Administrador de la red de SAGI Administrador de la red del Dpto. de Matematica U.C.V telefono: 014-154812 email : lmorales@server1.ucv.edu.ve lmorales@euler.ciens.ucv.ve lmorales@anubis.ciens.ucv.ve From owner-freebsd-www Wed Apr 16 12:49:57 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA18890 for www-outgoing; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 12:49:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from duke.neuronet.com.my (neuronet.com.my [202.184.153.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA18863 for ; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 12:49:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from love.com.my by duke.neuronet.com.my; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/25Jul96-0519PM) id AA08287; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 03:49:36 +0800 Message-Id: <33552BF0.3609@neuronet.com.my> Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 03:43:44 +0800 From: chas Reply-To: sweeting@neuronet.com.my X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (WinNT; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: webmaster@freebsd.org Subject: server error Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk getting errors on the archive : typed in ERR POP EOF for the mailing lists received a long list of posts regarding this. and got a SERVER ERROR hth chas From owner-freebsd-www Wed Apr 16 12:57:45 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA21064 for www-outgoing; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 12:57:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from duke.neuronet.com.my (neuronet.com.my [202.184.153.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA21037 for ; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 12:57:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from love.com.my by duke.neuronet.com.my; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/25Jul96-0519PM) id AA08327; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 03:57:02 +0800 Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 03:57:02 +0800 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970417035110.00dadf28@neuronet.com.my> X-Sender: sweeting@neuronet.com.my X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) To: webmaster@freebsd.org From: chas Subject: forget the server error Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk think your server must be getting hammered at the moment ... the server errors happen inconsistently, suggesting its just due to heavy traffic chas From owner-freebsd-www Wed Apr 16 19:38:38 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA01216 for www-outgoing; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 19:38:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA01209 for ; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 19:38:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA03644; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 19:38:13 -0700 (PDT) To: Luis Morales cc: www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: proform In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:55:13 EDT." <33552091.41C67EA6@euler.ciens.ucv.ve> Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 19:38:13 -0700 Message-ID: <3642.861244693@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hi, mi name in Luis Morales. I'm a system administrator of Departament o > f mathematic in Central Univeristy in Venezuela and SAGI-UCV. We are > interest in adquire the last version of freebsd and his tutorials and > books. Please send me the proform of your product. My system (SAGI-UCV) All of our information is provided online - please see http://www.freebsd.org for our full documentation set. There's really not much more that we could say over what's covered there. As to purchasing FreeBSD on CD, that can be done from Walnut Creek CDROM - please see http://www.cdrom.com Thanks! Jordan From owner-freebsd-www Thu Apr 17 02:07:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA21089 for www-outgoing; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 02:07:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gndsys.demon.co.uk (gndsys.demon.co.uk [158.152.38.24]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA21079 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 02:07:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from petrus ([192.168.0.15]) by gndsys.demon.co.uk (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 245-13894) with ESMTP id AAA79 for ; Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:38:25 +0100 Message-ID: <3354F9E8.5D33@gnd.com> Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:10:17 +0100 From: kmc@gnd.com (Kevin McKeown) Reply-To: kmc@gnd.com Organization: GND Distribution Ltd X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0b2 (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: www@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD Hardware - Commercial Vendors X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello, GND, based in London's Docklands, build custom computer systems configured for and installed with FreeBSD. We currently sell a range of systems and components that work very well with FreeBSD and many of our customers are running FreeBSD on GND hardware as web servers, firewalls etc. in a commercial environment. We are big fans of FreeBSD and use it to test all our systems before delivery to the customer (even if they eventually run Windows 95, nothing beats a 'make world' to ensure the correct operation of a system box!) GND are also the biggest retailers of ASUSTeK mainboards in the UK - a very popular manufacturer with the FreeBSD and Linux community. We use ASUSTeK products in most of our systems. Would it be possible to include our company details in the Commercial Vendors - Hardware section of the FreeBSD www site? Prehaps we could donate a Dual Pentium mainboard (ASUS T2P4D) to aid the FreeBSD SMP effort? More information about GND can be found at our www site - http://www.gnd.com Regards, Kevin -- Kevin McKeown, Technical Director, GND Distribution Ltd 10 Indescon Court, Millharbour, London, E14 9TN, UK Tel: +44 171 515 0100 Fax: +44 171 515 4404 Email: kmc@gnd.com WWW: http://www.gnd.com From owner-freebsd-www Thu Apr 17 05:15:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA27893 for www-outgoing; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 05:15:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA27887 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 05:15:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA05741; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 05:15:07 -0700 (PDT) To: kmc@gnd.com cc: www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD Hardware - Commercial Vendors In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:10:17 BST." <3354F9E8.5D33@gnd.com> Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 05:15:07 -0700 Message-ID: <5739.861279307@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Would it be possible to include our company details in the Commercial > Vendors - Hardware section of the FreeBSD www site? Prehaps we could Not a problem, though if you'd be so kind as to furnish a short paragraph of HTML for the purpose, it would happen a lot faster. :-) Thanks! Jordan From owner-freebsd-www Thu Apr 17 15:33:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA11185 for www-outgoing; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 15:33:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from originat.demon.co.uk (originat.demon.co.uk [158.152.220.9]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA11168 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 15:33:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from paul@localhost) by originat.demon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.6.9) id XAA00291; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 23:36:39 +0100 (BST) To: www@freebsd.org Subject: Restructure of web site - progress report From: Paul Richards Date: 17 Apr 1997 23:36:38 +0100 Message-ID: <87pvvts2dl.fsf@originat.demon.co.uk> Lines: 23 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk So far I've chased up the following odd bits I grabbed SP from John's freefall directory, it should be checked in as a port, it works fine as one, I just dropped it in place. The sgml files (the catalog, entities etc) which I copied from /usr/local on Freefall. Where's the source of these? analog which I got from the ports collection. It didn't actually compile, I had to move an "include " line in one of the files, who's maintaining it? The current setup is *very* freefall specific, trying to find the server logs and ports area and cvs and everything. I'm slowly unravelling it and creating a new build process. Just to keep everyone informed so you know something is in the works. -- Dr Paul Richards, Originative Solutions Ltd. Internet: paul@originat.demon.co.uk Phone: 0370 462071 (UK Mobile) From owner-freebsd-www Thu Apr 17 19:52:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA27046 for www-outgoing; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 19:52:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from emout14.mail.aol.com (emout14.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.40]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA27031 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 19:52:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Slimin@aol.com Received: (from root@localhost) by emout14.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id WAA21010 for www@freebsd.org; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 22:51:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 22:51:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970417225128_2049182962@emout14.mail.aol.com> To: www@freebsd.org Subject: Im Looking for Lunix (FreeBBSD) Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Im looking in the FTP site and I dont knwo were to go. Please help me... Will you attach the files I need to download. Thanks :-) , Slimin From owner-freebsd-www Thu Apr 17 21:35:10 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA01659 for www-outgoing; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 21:35:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA01654 for ; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 21:35:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA08339; Thu, 17 Apr 1997 23:35:03 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 23:35:02 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: Paul Richards cc: www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Restructure of web site - progress report In-Reply-To: <87pvvts2dl.fsf@originat.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On 17 Apr 1997, Paul Richards wrote: > The sgml files (the catalog, entities etc) which I copied from > /usr/local on Freefall. Where's the source of these? Originally from webtechs, but the authoritative source for the HTML DTD, ISO latin 1 entities, and a suitable catalog are (respectively): http://www.w3.org/pub/WWW/MarkUp/Wilbur/HTML32.dtd http://www.w3.org/pub/WWW/MarkUp/Wilbur/ISOlat1.ent http://www.tecc.co.uk/bmj/archive/7072ww5.htm We don't currently use any of the other HTML variants. > analog which I got from the ports collection. It didn't actually > compile, I had to move an "include " line in one of the > files, who's maintaining it? Beats me! -john From owner-freebsd-www Fri Apr 18 00:20:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA16129 for www-outgoing; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 00:20:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.illumen.net ([209.38.6.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA16089 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 00:19:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from barney.du.edu (SL-30.ducomm.du.edu [130.253.6.30]) by mail.illumen.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA00342 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 15:11:59 GMT Message-ID: <3357200E.1F52@illumen.net> Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 01:17:34 -0600 From: "David A. Richards" Reply-To: dar@illumen.net Organization: The Illumen Group X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: www@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-www@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi there! Great job on the FreeBSD web pages! I have just a brief question... I'm building a FreeBSD box as my web server, and want to get proven hardware for it.. no messin' around. What kind of SCSI controller, hard drives, and motherboard is in www.freebsd.org? Thanks, Dave ****************************************************** * David A Richards Systems Integrator * * The illumen Group, Inc. www.illumen.com * * Email dar@illumen.com * * Personal Web www.illumen.com/~dar * ****************************************************** From owner-freebsd-www Fri Apr 18 01:52:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA19581 for www-outgoing; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 01:52:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from DNS.Lamb.net (root@DNS.Lamb.net [207.90.181.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA19576 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 01:52:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Gatekeeper.Lamb.net (ulf@gatekeeper.Lamb.net [207.90.181.2]) by DNS.Lamb.net (8.8.5/20.74.3.14) with ESMTP id BAA28894; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 01:52:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from ulf@localhost) by Gatekeeper.Lamb.net (8.8.5/8.7.6) id BAA03841; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 01:52:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Ulf Zimmermann Message-Id: <199704180852.BAA03841@Gatekeeper.Lamb.net> Subject: Re: Question In-Reply-To: <3357200E.1F52@illumen.net> from "David A. Richards" at "Apr 18, 97 01:17:34 am" To: dar@illumen.net Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 01:52:24 -0700 (PDT) Cc: www@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-www@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hi there! > Great job on the FreeBSD web pages! I have just a brief question... > I'm building a FreeBSD box as my web server, and want to get proven > hardware for it.. no messin' around. > > What kind of SCSI controller, hard drives, and motherboard is in > www.freebsd.org? > Thanks, > Dave > > ****************************************************** > * David A Richards Systems Integrator * > * The illumen Group, Inc. www.illumen.com * > * Email dar@illumen.com * > * Personal Web www.illumen.com/~dar * > ****************************************************** > Take a look at this page: http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/handbook101.html#159 It has also a point of Jordans pick, which is a good collection of hardware choices. Ulf. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-769-2936 Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: 510-521-5073 From owner-freebsd-www Fri Apr 18 02:48:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA21825 for www-outgoing; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 02:48:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from schubert.promo.de (schubert.Promo.DE [194.45.188.65]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA21810 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 02:48:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [194.45.188.81] (stefan.Promo.DE [194.45.188.81]) by schubert.promo.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA27263; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 11:43:47 +0200 X-Sender: stefan@mail.promo.de Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <87pvvts2dl.fsf@originat.demon.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 11:46:01 +0200 To: John Fieber , Paul Richards From: Stefan Bethke Subject: Re: Restructure of web site - progress report Cc: www@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 6:35 Uhr +0200 18.04.1997, John Fieber wrote: >http://www.tecc.co.uk/bmj/archive/7072ww5.htm Very interesting. Especially the references are quite helpful :-) Stefan -- Stefan Bethke Promo Datentechnik | Tel. +49-40-851744-0 + Systemberatung GmbH | Fax. +49-40-851744-44 Eduardstrasse 46-48 | e-mail: stefan@Promo.DE D-20257 Hamburg | http://www.Promo.DE/ From owner-freebsd-www Fri Apr 18 03:46:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA23813 for www-outgoing; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 03:46:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pillar.elsevier.co.uk (root@pillar.elsevier.co.uk [193.131.222.35]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA23808 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 03:46:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from snowdon.elsevier.co.uk (snowdon.elsevier.co.uk [193.131.197.164]) by pillar.elsevier.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA20379 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 11:43:31 +0100 (BST) Received: from cadair.elsevier.co.uk by snowdon.elsevier.co.uk with SMTP (PP); Fri, 18 Apr 1997 11:46:20 +0100 Received: from tees.elsevier.co.uk (tees.elsevier.co.uk [193.131.197.60]) by cadair.elsevier.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA24912; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 11:45:36 +0100 (BST) Received: (from dpr@localhost) by tees.elsevier.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA03259; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 11:45:38 +0100 (BST) To: John Fieber Cc: Paul Richards , www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Restructure of web site - progress report References: From: Paul Richards Date: 18 Apr 1997 11:43:03 +0100 In-Reply-To: John Fieber's message of Thu, 17 Apr 1997 23:35:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <57wwq0zk5k.fsf@tees.elsevier.co.uk> Lines: 36 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.4.37/Emacs 19.30 Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John Fieber writes: > Originally from webtechs, but the authoritative source for the > HTML DTD, ISO latin 1 entities, and a suitable catalog are > (respectively): > > http://www.w3.org/pub/WWW/MarkUp/Wilbur/HTML32.dtd > http://www.w3.org/pub/WWW/MarkUp/Wilbur/ISOlat1.ent > http://www.tecc.co.uk/bmj/archive/7072ww5.htm They're not in cvs anywhere? Should I grab an authoritative copy then and put it in my new area as the original source? Can I commit your SP port into the ports area? Anything else I'm going to trip over that you can warn me about before hand :-) I got stuck because of the vfork bug (sgmlnorm wouldn't run) so progress has been slower than I hoped this week. The way things are looking there will now be a three stage build. 1) Populate /www/{src,data} with all that's needed out of our cvs tree (either the main OS or the ports area) 2) Build the environment needed to build a site. 3) Build the site. Either the result of stage 1 or stage 2 will be distributable as a src distribution or a binary distribution respectively. -- Dr Paul Richards. [p.richards@elsevier.co.uk] Originative Solutions Ltd. [paul@originat.demon.co.uk] Phone: 0370 462071 (Mobile), +44 (0)1865 843155 (Elsevier) From owner-freebsd-www Fri Apr 18 07:25:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA09074 for www-outgoing; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 07:25:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA09066 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 07:25:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA29632; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 07:24:53 -0700 (PDT) To: dar@illumen.net cc: www@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Question In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 18 Apr 1997 01:17:34 MDT." <3357200E.1F52@illumen.net> Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 07:24:52 -0700 Message-ID: <29629.861373492@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-www@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Great job on the FreeBSD web pages! I have just a brief question... > I'm building a FreeBSD box as my web server, and want to get proven > hardware for it.. no messin' around. See http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/hw.html - everything on that list is approved. > What kind of SCSI controller, hard drives, and motherboard is in > www.freebsd.org? Adaptec 2940, a mixture of Barracudas and Atlas I & II drives and an ASUS P55TP4 motherboard. Jordan From owner-freebsd-www Fri Apr 18 10:29:42 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA19882 for www-outgoing; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 10:29:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hemi.com (hemi.com [204.132.158.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA19874 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 10:29:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mbarkah@localhost) by hemi.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) id LAA28462 for www@freebsd.org; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 11:29:36 -0600 (MDT) From: Ade Barkah Message-Id: <199704181729.LAA28462@hemi.com> Subject: Hello... To: www@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 11:29:36 -0600 (MDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi all, Sorry I've been gone for awhile. I'm still in southeast asia, and i pretty much can't do any web work from here. =-( I'll be back in the United States this coming Tuesday (the 22nd) so I'll promise to clear all the backlog shortly (especially the gallery entries.) Thanks! -Ade ------------------------------------------------------------------- Inet: mbarkah@hemi.com - HEMISPHERE ONLINE - ------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-www Fri Apr 18 15:46:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA09492 for www-outgoing; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 15:46:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gdi.uoregon.edu (gdi.uoregon.edu [128.223.170.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA09484 for ; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 15:46:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dwhite@localhost) by gdi.uoregon.edu (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA14764; Fri, 18 Apr 1997 15:46:34 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 15:46:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug White X-Sender: dwhite@localhost Reply-To: Doug White To: Slimin@aol.com cc: www@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Im Looking for Lunix (FreeBBSD) In-Reply-To: <970417225128_2049182962@emout14.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 17 Apr 1997 Slimin@aol.com wrote: > Im looking in the FTP site and I dont knwo were to go. > > Please help me... > > Will you attach the files I need to download. I won't attach them since they are gigantic, but reference http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/install.html Doug White | University of Oregon Internet: dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | Residence Networking Assistant http://gladstone.uoregon.edu/~dwhite | Computer Science Major From owner-freebsd-www Sat Apr 19 10:25:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA27173 for www-outgoing; Sat, 19 Apr 1997 10:25:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bsd.fs.bauing.th-darmstadt.de (bsd.fs.bauing.th-darmstadt.de [130.83.63.241]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA27137; Sat, 19 Apr 1997 10:24:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from campa.panke.de (anonymous226.ppp.cs.tu-berlin.de [130.149.17.226]) by bsd.fs.bauing.th-darmstadt.de (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA13234; Sat, 19 Apr 1997 19:24:31 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from wosch@localhost) by campa.panke.de (8.8.5/8.6.12) id RAA01345; Sat, 19 Apr 1997 17:15:35 +0200 (MET DST) To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: jfieber@FreeBSD.ORG, www@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Speaking about the countries menu - ahem ahem! ;) References: <199704060547.VAA00794@time.cdrom.com> From: Wolfram Schneider Date: 19 Apr 1997 17:15:33 +0200 In-Reply-To: "Jordan K. Hubbard"'s message of Sat, 5 Apr 1997 21:47:55 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Lines: 13 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-www@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: > Is there any movement afoot to change it? No. > It's just too damn big, and > another couple of countries added and it's going to take a 1600x1200 screen > to see the whole thing. :-) It works with lynx on a 80x24 screen. It works with Netscape on my 14 inch monitor with 1024x768. Wolfram From owner-freebsd-www Sat Apr 19 13:07:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA06532 for www-outgoing; Sat, 19 Apr 1997 13:07:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gw1.asacomputers.com (root@gw1.asacomputers.com [204.69.220.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA06526 for ; Sat, 19 Apr 1997 13:07:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by gw1.asacomputers.com id KAA01310; Sat, 19 Apr 1997 10:08:30 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970419201217.009a62e0@gw1> X-Sender: rajadnya@gw1 X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 19 Apr 1997 13:12:17 -0700 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" From: Kedar Subject: Re: P.S. [Re: http://www.freebsd.org/commercial/hardware.html] Cc: www@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk At 07:28 AM 4/19/97 -0700, you wrote: >You should send the entry to www@freebsd.org when you're ready to have >it listed and Nate Johnson, our commercial gallery editor, will add it. Hello, Please let me know if the following is good enough or you need me to attach a document. ************************************************************************** ASA Computers offers a wide range of performance oriented servers/workstations and networking products. We are experienced in quality FreeBSD and Linux (along with other OS's) configuration and support. Multiple OS experience and knowledge are our strengths. Some of the communication and networking products we resell are those from 3COM, Cisco, Cyclades, DIGI, Livingston, U.S. Robotics etc. Please take a look at some pre-configured systems on our web-page and contact us at "unix@asacomputers.com" to configure them your own way and if you have questions/comments. ***************************************************************************** Obliged, Kedar. From owner-freebsd-www Sat Apr 19 21:08:21 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA02641 for www-outgoing; Sat, 19 Apr 1997 21:08:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dont-care.csc.ncsu.edu (dont-care.csc.ncsu.edu [152.1.57.42]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA02635 for ; Sat, 19 Apr 1997 21:08:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nsj@localhost) by dont-care.csc.ncsu.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA06525; Sun, 20 Apr 1997 00:07:24 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199704200407.AAA06525@dont-care.csc.ncsu.edu> Subject: Re: P.S. [Re: http://www.freebsd.org/commercial/hardware.html] To: kedar@asacomputers.com (Kedar) Date: Sun, 20 Apr 1997 00:07:24 -0400 (EDT) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, www@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19970419201217.009a62e0@gw1> from "Kedar" at Apr 19, 97 01:12:17 pm Reply-To: nsj@ncsu.edu From: nsj@ncsu.edu (Nate Johnson) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24/POP] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-www@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk % Please let me know if the following is good enough or you need me to %attach a document. [ snippet deleted ] I added your entry to our Commercial Vendors:Hardware Services page, . It should be posted in the early morning. If you have any problems or questions, please do not hesitate to let us know. Cheers, nsj -- Nate Johnson / nsj@ncsu.edu / nsj@catt.ncsu.edu / nsj@FreeBSD.org Head Systems Administrator, Computer and Technologies Theme Program North Carolina State University, Raleigh, North Carolina