From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Jun 4 12:28:21 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from postfix1-2.free.fr (postfix1-2.free.fr [213.228.0.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C3E337B401 for ; Mon, 4 Jun 2001 12:28:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jpbeconne@free.fr) Received: from free.fr (nas-cbv-4-24-80.dial.proxad.net [213.228.24.80]) by postfix1-2.free.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5F211028D5 for ; Mon, 4 Jun 2001 21:28:18 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3B1BFE74.2C070099@free.fr> Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2001 21:32:36 +0000 From: Jean-Paul Beconne X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 4.0-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: D-Link ethenet card Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi, My computer has a D-Link DFE-530 ethernet card, and I would like to use it with FreeBSD. I use FreeBSD 4.0 release 7. I uncommented miibus and vr lines in the kernel configuration file but the card is not recognized, the vr0 and miibus0 don't appear when the computer boots. I also tried rl driver but the card isn't recognize. I should have missed something. Could anybody help me ? Thanks. J-Paul Beconne To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Mon Jun 4 16:16:19 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from vape.jaster.shoalhaven.net.au (vape.jaster.shoalhaven.net.au [202.139.21.163]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F0ED37B401 for ; Mon, 4 Jun 2001 16:16:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jaster@vape.jaster.shoalhaven.net.au) Received: by vape.jaster.shoalhaven.net.au (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f54NFti01583; Tue, 5 Jun 2001 09:15:55 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from jaster) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Joshua Silver Reply-To: jaster@shoalhaven.net.au To: Jean-Paul Beconne Subject: Re: D-Link ethenet card Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 09:14:40 +1000 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] References: <3B1BFE74.2C070099@free.fr> In-Reply-To: <3B1BFE74.2C070099@free.fr> Cc: freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <01060509144000.01578@vape.jaster.shoalhaven.net.au> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org This line is straight out of LINT from FreeBSD 4.2-RELEASE device ste # Sundance ST201 (D-Link DFE-550TX) Your still going to need the miibus line, so leave it, and try adding this, see what happens ... Josh. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Tue Jun 5 13:20:19 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from icarus.weber.edu (icarus.weber.edu [137.190.16.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 0B4D037B40A for ; Tue, 5 Jun 2001 13:20:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lewis@cs.weber.edu) Received: (qmail 20512 invoked by uid 627); 5 Jun 2001 20:09:04 -0000 Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 14:09:04 -0600 (MDT) From: Jason Lewis X-Sender: lewis@icarus.weber.edu To: Chameleon Cc: freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Microdyne NE2500 Nics In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20001101164242.02d2ddf0@mail.wavefire.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org If it helps, I have the same problem as you. I have recompiled my kernel many time and have come to the following conclusion. Support for the NE2500 network cards have been dropped out of 4.x . My cards work great in 2.2.5 . Jason On Wed, 1 Nov 2000, Chameleon wrote: >Sorry... these are ISA cards... not eisa > >At 09:24 AM 10/31/00 -0800, Chameleon wrote: >>Hi all, >> >>Just got a pair of NE2500 eisa nics that i want to throw in my >>firewall/router, but i can't seem to get them recognized in 4.1.1-RELEASE. >>I tried putting them in as lnc0, but it was a no go. >>Does anyone know what settings to use to make these work? or do i have to >>use them in a window box? >> >>thanks >> >>Swen >> >>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >>Your mouse has moved. >>Windows NT must be restarted >>for the change to take effect. >> >>Reboot now? [ OK ] >> >>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >> >> >> >>To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >>with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message > > >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >Your mouse has moved. >Windows NT must be restarted >for the change to take effect. > >Reboot now? [ OK ] > >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Jun 6 4:13:15 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from sasami.jurai.net (sasami.jurai.net [64.0.106.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53D5437B403 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 04:13:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from winter@jurai.net) Received: from localhost (winter@localhost) by sasami.jurai.net (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA73700; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 07:12:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 07:12:30 -0400 (EDT) From: "Matthew N. Dodd" To: Jason Lewis Cc: Chameleon , freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Microdyne NE2500 Nics In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, 5 Jun 2001, Jason Lewis wrote: > If it helps, I have the same problem as you. I have recompiled my kernel > many time and have come to the following conclusion. Support for the > NE2500 network cards have been dropped out of 4.x . My cards work great > in 2.2.5 . You can probably fake up the correct hints for an ISA attachment by using the ECU to figure out where the cards resources are. > On Wed, 1 Nov 2000, Chameleon wrote: > > >Sorry... these are ISA cards... not eisa > > > >At 09:24 AM 10/31/00 -0800, Chameleon wrote: > >>Hi all, > >> > >>Just got a pair of NE2500 eisa nics that i want to throw in my > >>firewall/router, but i can't seem to get them recognized in 4.1.1-RELEASE. > >>I tried putting them in as lnc0, but it was a no go. > >>Does anyone know what settings to use to make these work? or do i have to > >>use them in a window box? > >> > >>thanks > >> > >>Swen > >> > >>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > >>Your mouse has moved. > >>Windows NT must be restarted > >>for the change to take effect. > >> > >>Reboot now? [ OK ] > >> > >>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > >> > >> > >> > >>To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > >>with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message > > > > > >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > >Your mouse has moved. > >Windows NT must be restarted > >for the change to take effect. > > > >Reboot now? [ OK ] > > > >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > > > > > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > >with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message > -- | Matthew N. Dodd | '78 Datsun 280Z | '75 Volvo 164E | FreeBSD/NetBSD | | winter@jurai.net | 2 x '84 Volvo 245DL | ix86,sparc,pmax | | http://www.jurai.net/~winter | For Great Justice! | ISO8802.5 4ever | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Jun 6 4:33:20 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from gemini.bnc.net (gemini.bnc.net [62.225.99.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B14F37B405 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 04:33:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from noses@bnc.net) Received: from entity (entity.bnc.net [62.225.99.68]) by gemini.bnc.net (8.11.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id f56BXEV51813 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 13:33:15 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from noses@noses.com) From: "Noses" To: Subject: Casing wanted Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 13:35:09 +0200 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Disposition-Notification-To: "Noses" Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org ... dead or alive (although alive seems to be the better deal). I've got to build (as proof of concept) a server with nine (_9_) UDMA IDE disks (eight of them connected to a 2ware RAID controller) and now the fact that U-IDE cables mustn't be longer than 45 cm is biting my ass. Does anybody know a casing fitting an ATX board with a 3ware 6800 controller and space for all those disks? I took a look at the Chenbro Net and Echo series but no matter what I'm going to do no more than five disks will be connected. 3ware of course is pretty un-helpful (basically telling me that they're happy that it is my problem and not theirs). Noses. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Jun 6 7: 5:28 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from djl01.djl.co.uk (djl01.djl.co.uk [195.58.135.195]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6361F37B401; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 07:05:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from David.Larkin@djl.co.uk) Received: from DJL.co.uk (djl03 [195.58.135.197]) by djl01.djl.co.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f56E5i618521; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 15:05:45 +0100 (BST) (envelope-from David.Larkin@DJL.co.uk) Message-ID: <3B1E3AC6.4CAA45A3@DJL.co.uk> Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 15:14:30 +0100 From: David Larkin X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.74 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 2.2.8-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: questions@freebsd.org, hardware@freebsd.org, dirkx@covalent.net, david.larkin@DJL.co.uk Subject: Re: No disk found ! Hitachi DK23AA-90 References: <3B15392D.DCF7EC59@DJL.co.uk> <3B165362.DF3B2D85@DJL.co.uk> <3B16847F.E26417C5@DJL.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi, Following up from my query of last week. I'm trying to boot my laptop from 4.3 floppies. I've been rumnning 2.2.8 on the same machine for over 2 years. I'm now tryiing to install 4.3 on a new hard disk. When I get to the 'disk partitioning' page it says No disk found ! Please verify that your disk controller is being properly probed at boot time. See the hardware guide on the Documentation Menu I tried booting from 4.3 floppies but with the disk on which I have 2.2.8 installed. The intention being to abort installation before formatting the disk. Again, it tells me 'No Disks found', and this disk happilly boots 2.2.8 without using boot floppies. I then blew the dust of an old floppy labelled PAO 2.2.8 and booted that with the new disk and this worked, allowing me to set disk partitions. Clearly I have no intention of installing 2.2.8, but I think this indicates that the hardware is OK. boot -s reports ... isa0: on isab0 atapci0: port 0xfcd0-0xfcdf at device 3.1 on pci0 ata0: at 0x1f0 irq 14 on atapci0 uhci0 ..... etc. further down it reports .... pccard: card inserted, slot 1 ata0-master: ata_command: timeout waiting for intr ata0-master: identity failed Can anyone suggest a way forward ? Is it the 4.3 floppies ? Can I get 4.2 floppies ? When will 4.4 be coming out ? Thanks Dave To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Jun 6 10: 8: 8 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6D9037B403 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 10:08:03 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f56H7nq12323; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 10:07:49 -0700 Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 10:07:49 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Noses Cc: hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Casing wanted Message-ID: <20010606100749.A5681@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="82I3+IH0IqGh5yIs" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from noses@bnc.net on Wed, Jun 06, 2001 at 01:35:09PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org --82I3+IH0IqGh5yIs Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Jun 06, 2001 at 01:35:09PM +0200, Noses wrote: > ... dead or alive (although alive seems to be the better deal). >=20 > I've got to build (as proof of concept) a server with nine (_9_) > UDMA IDE disks (eight of them connected to a 2ware RAID controller) > and now the fact that U-IDE cables mustn't be longer than 45 cm is > biting my ass. Does anybody know a casing fitting an ATX board with > a 3ware 6800 controller and space for all those disks? I took a look > at the Chenbro Net and Echo series but no matter what I'm going to do > no more than five disks will be connected. 3ware of course is pretty > un-helpful (basically telling me that they're happy that it is my > problem and not theirs). The PC Power & Cooling Solid Steel Tower has 10 bays, 8 external. If you pick up one of their 500W or redundent 420W power supplies and a couple of drive Y-s you should be able to connect everything. You'll also have to buy mounting kits for all the drives as well since all the bays are are 5.25". I haven't used those systems, but I own one of the mid towers and I'm quite happy with it. It's really solid with no rough edges or anything. http://www.pcpowercooling.com/products/enclosures/professional/pro_towers/i= ndex.htm -- Brooks --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --82I3+IH0IqGh5yIs Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7HmNlXY6L6fI4GtQRAprIAKDZH7n7nl7Sbe/oGzVHBg1DGqRNrQCePWxU eDfpf51nvcW9FoH1fmHMA4g= =PlQD -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --82I3+IH0IqGh5yIs-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Jun 6 14:26:22 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from proxon.bnc.net (proxon.bnc.net [62.225.99.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F8A037B401 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 14:26:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from noses@proxon.bnc.net) Received: (from noses@localhost) by proxon.bnc.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f56LQ4U25867; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 23:26:04 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from noses) Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 23:26:04 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <200106062126.f56LQ4U25867@proxon.bnc.net> From: Noses To: hardware@freebsd.org, brooks@one-eyed-alien.net (Brooks Davis) Subject: Re: Casing wanted Organization: Noses' cave In-Reply-To: <20010606100749.A5681@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> User-Agent: tin/1.5.6-20000803 ("Dust") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.3-STABLE (i386)) Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org In article <20010606100749.A5681@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> brooks@one-eyed-alien.net (Brooks Davis) wrote: > The PC Power & Cooling Solid Steel Tower has 10 bays, 8 external. > If you pick up one of their 500W or redundent 420W power supplies > and a couple of drive Y-s you should be able to connect everything. Not quite; I've spent a few minutes with paper and pencil and the experience of putting my head into a number of casings and my first guess is six drives connected. > You'll also have to buy mounting kits for all the drives as well since > all the bays are are 5.25". I haven't used those systems, but I own > one of the mid towers and I'm quite happy with it. It's really solid > with no rough edges or anything. Someone else also recommended these; they seem to be well worth the money spent on them and I'll probably take one for the twin machine (which will have - I'm mean 8-) a SCSI controller and disks for comparison just to see if it got enough cooling for 10000 rpm IBM egg frying equipment. Noses. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Jun 6 14:38:46 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E9B237B401 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 14:38:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f56LcZ922303; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 14:38:35 -0700 Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 14:38:35 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Noses Cc: hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Casing wanted Message-ID: <20010606143835.B13639@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <20010606100749.A5681@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> <200106062126.f56LQ4U25867@proxon.bnc.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="Pd0ReVV5GZGQvF3a" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <200106062126.f56LQ4U25867@proxon.bnc.net>; from noses@noses.com on Wed, Jun 06, 2001 at 11:26:04PM +0200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org --Pd0ReVV5GZGQvF3a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Jun 06, 2001 at 11:26:04PM +0200, Noses wrote: > In article <20010606100749.A5681@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> brooks@one-eyed-alien.n= et (Brooks Davis) wrote: > > The PC Power & Cooling Solid Steel Tower has 10 bays, 8 external. > > If you pick up one of their 500W or redundent 420W power supplies > > and a couple of drive Y-s you should be able to connect everything. >=20 > Not quite; I've spent a few minutes with paper and pencil and the experie= nce > of putting my head into a number of casings and my first guess is six dri= ves > connected. Given that the 500W supply has a peak output of 700W, you've got plenty of headroom for the startup power (216W for 9 60GXPs) unless you need tons of CPU to go with the disk. With a nice modest 1GHz PIII or Athlon system, you won't even be close to your power budget. -- Brooks --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --Pd0ReVV5GZGQvF3a Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7HqLaXY6L6fI4GtQRAhdSAJ9lM/pkCDPJtnnamXkD5LumJ2l48gCdHBKP v4ney4vMKBZco5y4ies9KKk= =E7aM -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Pd0ReVV5GZGQvF3a-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Jun 6 15:20:30 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mail.libam.com (094.dsl108154.surewest.net [63.108.154.94]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 859B037B401 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 15:20:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from MichaelV@EDIFECS.COM) Received: from ecx1.edifecs.com (mail.edifecs.com [207.153.149.131]) by mail.libam.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA10271; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 15:28:50 -0700 Received: by ecx1.edifecs.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 15:24:53 -0700 Message-ID: <36F7B20351634E4FBFFE6C6A216B30D54C1F@ecx1.edifecs.com> From: Michael VanLoon To: "'Noses'" , hardware@freebsd.org Subject: RE: Casing wanted Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 15:24:50 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > From: Noses [mailto:noses@bnc.net] > Sent: Wednesday, June 06, 2001 4:35 AM > > ... dead or alive (although alive seems to be the better deal). > > I've got to build (as proof of concept) a server with nine (_9_) > UDMA IDE disks (eight of them connected to a 2ware RAID controller) > and now the fact that U-IDE cables mustn't be longer than 45 cm is > biting my ass. Does anybody know a casing fitting an ATX board with > a 3ware 6800 controller and space for all those disks? I took a look > at the Chenbro Net and Echo series but no matter what I'm going to do > no more than five disks will be connected. 3ware of course is pretty > un-helpful (basically telling me that they're happy that it is my > problem and not theirs). Hmmm... Are you sure just biting the bullet and going SCSI raid wouldn't be a better solution in this case? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Jun 6 15:56:11 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from www1.asacomputers.com (gw1.asacomputers.com [209.10.224.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B94B037B405 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 15:56:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kedar@asacomputers.com) Received: from kedar (empire.asacomputers.com [209.10.224.3]) by www1.asacomputers.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with SMTP id f56NIPw27635; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 16:18:26 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <4.1.20010606155252.0323d630@gw1.asacomputers.com> X-Sender: rajadnya@gw1.asacomputers.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 15:56:31 -0700 To: "Noses" , From: Kedar Rajadnya Subject: Re: Casing wanted In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org At 01:35 PM 6/6/01 +0200, Noses wrote: >... dead or alive (although alive seems to be the better deal). > >I've got to build (as proof of concept) a server with nine (_9_) >UDMA IDE disks (eight of them connected to a 2ware RAID controller) >and now the fact that U-IDE cables mustn't be longer than 45 cm is >biting my ass. Does anybody know a casing fitting an ATX board with Hi, 3Ware has validated some longer cables for their controllers. In fact, they also sell some under their own brand. That might solve your problem? Kedar. Take care, Kedar Rajadnya, . ASA Computers, Inc. 2354 Calle Del Mundo. Santa Clara, CA 95054. Tel: (408)654-2901 ext201 Cell: (408)799-7263 Toll Free: (877)538-1272 Fax: (408)654-2910 ===================================== To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Wed Jun 6 18:47:11 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mafalda.univalle.edu.co (mafalda.univalle.edu.co [200.24.102.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5957137B407 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 18:47:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gstgnzgr@libertad.univalle.edu.co) Received: from libertad.univalle.edu.co (libertad.univalle.edu.co [216.6.69.11]) by mafalda.univalle.edu.co (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f571kk000828 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 20:46:46 -0500 (GMT) Received: from localhost (gstgnzgr@localhost) by libertad.univalle.edu.co (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f571pHb75759 for ; Wed, 6 Jun 2001 20:51:18 -0500 (COT) Date: Wed, 6 Jun 2001 20:51:17 -0500 (COT) From: 9ustavo 9onzalez 9iron To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Bizarre Sound Card Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Some days ago... i write to this list with one question about a sound card (SoundBlaster PCI). I re-compile my kernel adding this line on my config file: device pcm Now, the sound card is working... but in some strange way... I mean, it can not work if i log-in from console. But if i use another server and i do something like: %play something.wav or %x11amp something.mp3 The musik starts... and i dont know why??? I just can use the sound card, if i log-in on the server from another machine... when i do it from console, i get this message: "Unable to open device" I ask: What is going on??? Thanks for any help. ========================================================================= xxx-00/-xx xx-0 /-xxx UNIVERSIDAD DEL VALLE 0 / 0 CENTRO DE SERVICIOS DE INFORMACION 0/ 0 SEDE MELENDEZ /0 0 e-mail: gstgnzgr@calvin.univalle.edu.co ____00____ Telefonos: 3336450 ********** ICQ : 95848099 ========================================================================= To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Thu Jun 7 0: 0:20 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from proxon.bnc.net (proxon.bnc.net [62.225.99.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D32B537B406 for ; Thu, 7 Jun 2001 00:00:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from noses@proxon.bnc.net) Received: (from noses@localhost) by proxon.bnc.net (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f57709A28169; Thu, 7 Jun 2001 09:00:09 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from noses) Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 09:00:09 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <200106070700.f57709A28169@proxon.bnc.net> From: Noses To: kedar@asacomputers.com (Kedar Rajadnya), hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Casing wanted Organization: Noses' cave In-Reply-To: <4.1.20010606155252.0323d630@gw1.asacomputers.com> X-Newsgroups: muc.lists.freebsd.hardware,mpc.lists.freebsd.hardware User-Agent: tin/1.5.6-20000803 ("Dust") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.3-STABLE (i386)) Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org In article <4.1.20010606155252.0323d630@gw1.asacomputers.com> kedar@asacomputers.com (Kedar Rajadnya) wrote: > > 3Ware has validated some longer cables for their controllers. In fact, > they also sell some under their own brand. That might solve your problem? I just *love* this business. Why didn't the guys at 3ware tell me about this? Thank you for your help! Noses. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Thu Jun 7 1:22: 1 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from gemini.bnc.net (gemini.bnc.net [62.225.99.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FF4637B401 for ; Thu, 7 Jun 2001 01:21:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ap@bnc.net) Received: from entity (entity.bnc.net [62.225.99.68]) by gemini.bnc.net (8.11.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id f578LdV65759; Thu, 7 Jun 2001 10:21:39 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from ap@bnc.net) From: "Achim Patzner" To: "Michael VanLoon" Cc: Subject: RE: Casing wanted Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 10:23:37 +0200 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 In-Reply-To: <36F7B20351634E4FBFFE6C6A216B30D54C20@ecx1.edifecs.com> Disposition-Notification-To: "Achim Patzner" Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > The gods decided that the customer wants to know just how much these > > 3ware controllers will do for them; currently they are in love with an > > MSI dual P3 mainboard, 4 GB of RAM and a Chenbro casing filled with 16 > > RAID disks on two 3ware controllers (80 GB Maxtor giving them about > > 600 GB of mirrored and striped disk space) at a price they wouldn't > > even get half of that space in SCSI disks. Just keep in mind that a > > hardware RAID SCSI controller with 8 channels is _quite_ expensive. > > Agreed it's quite expensive but... with hardware SCSI RAID you get: > > - You don't have all these squirrelly issues you just brought up (cable lengths, etc.) Which is about the only problem I encountered and 3ware just told me (after a direct hit on their long term memory with a hard object) that there are cables up to 70 cm. > - Automatic unattended hardware failover to hot-spare(s) > - Automatic unattended background fill-in of data on failed-in hot spares > while server is live > - Caching controller that does delayed elevator-sorted write-backs, and > read-ahead This is nothing the 3ware controller won't do. > - Better reliability (yes SCSI drives really ARE built better) No. I had 15 IBM DDYS (of 35) failing after less than 12 months and didn't lose a single Maxtor. > - Higher performance (though yes, IDE performance is pretty good) Hm. I've seen people getting 95 MB/s through a 3ware RAID. Don't forget that it got a single channel per disk. All in all this is a reason why they want this machine - they want to compare performance... > - Depending on the controller from 15 to 60 drives per controller Not really. I'm a strong believer in one channel per disk. > - Higher quality cases, hot-swap cartridges, etc. on the market Definitely not. The best hot swap cartridge I've ever seen was an IDE cartridge. I thought someone mixed Dark Vader and the Cylons and turned them into a status display > So it's not like you're paying more for nothing. There are some very > substantial benefits, especially in the reliability/uptime > department when a disk fails -- no need to bring the server down, or > even be there when it swaps in a hot spare and starts using it. Nothing I wouldn't get wit IDE too... > Admittedly the price-per-gigabyte for IDE disks is much better. > But there's a reason they're so cheap. Yes. There are too many people thinking paying the SCSI-fine is a good thing. The IDE disks we're going to use aren't trash. They showed less failures under heavier load and their performance isn't that bad either. The driver won't see single disks, it will see one large volume. > Just some food for thought... I don't have anything against IDE raid, but > when the problem keeps screaming out that it doesn't want you to do that, > then maybe you shouldn't do that. :-) The problem stopped screaming and actually the problem would have been nearly the same with SCSI: Cabling. Although there is a way around that by using FC-AL disks. Noses. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Thu Jun 7 13:51:16 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mail.libam.com (094.dsl108154.surewest.net [63.108.154.94]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D04D37B405 for ; Thu, 7 Jun 2001 13:51:10 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from MichaelV@EDIFECS.COM) Received: from ecx1.edifecs.com (mail.edifecs.com [207.153.149.131]) by mail.libam.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA19158; Thu, 7 Jun 2001 13:59:53 -0700 Received: by ecx1.edifecs.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 7 Jun 2001 13:55:52 -0700 Message-ID: <36F7B20351634E4FBFFE6C6A216B30D54C24@ecx1.edifecs.com> From: Michael VanLoon To: "'Achim Patzner'" Cc: hardware@freebsd.org Subject: RE: Casing wanted Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 13:55:52 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Proof of concept is fine. I wish you luck on building this server and its long-term reliability. So with that, I'm not trying to convince you not to build it, but I figure I should address the points I already brought up. > From: Achim Patzner [mailto:ap@bnc.net] > Sent: Thursday, June 07, 2001 1:24 AM > > > Agreed it's quite expensive but... with hardware SCSI RAID you get: > > - You don't have all these squirrelly issues you just > brought up (cable > lengths, etc.) > > Which is about the only problem I encountered and 3ware just > told me (after > a direct hit on their long term memory with a hard object) > that there are > cables > up to 70 cm. Yes but as far as I know these are outside the ATA100 spec, and are not guaranteed to work in all cases. It's kinda hit-and-miss. If it works, you're good (unless it starts acting strange). If it doesn't work, oh well. Correct me if I'm wrong on this point -- I don't have an ATA100 spec in front of me. > > - Automatic unattended hardware failover to hot-spare(s) > > - Automatic unattended background fill-in of data on > failed-in hot spares > > while server is live > > - Caching controller that does delayed elevator-sorted > write-backs, and > > read-ahead > > This is nothing the 3ware controller won't do. Well that hasn't been proven to me. 3ware's specs and white-papers are unfortunately alarmingly light on the actual details of how complete their live hot-spare support actually is. Although this doesn't confirm that they don't do it as well, it's at least noting that they don't spend any time saying more than a bullet point "hot-spare". A good hardware SCSI RAID controller will fill in the hot-spare while the server is up and live. Without the server even realizing anything happened (aside from reduced disc performance) it will back-fill the redundant data onto the new drive and bring it into the array. Once the new drive is filled, it is a full member of the array and the machine is running exactly as it was before the failure. All this without a reboot, and without any downtime. One other thing I forgot to mention is dynamic expansion of arrays. If you need to add more drives, it will use the same technology to expand the size of the array without having to actually move any data (it will redistribute the data on the disks for optimal striping, but that is invisible to the user or OS). Then if you're running NT you just tell it to expand the Volume, and if you're running FreeBSD you just run growfs. Or make a new partition there if that suits you. Without detailed white-papers it's hard to claim the 3ware controller can do all this. Maybe it can but I don't see any proof of it in their documentation. > > - Better reliability (yes SCSI drives really ARE built better) > > No. I had 15 IBM DDYS (of 35) failing after less than 12 > months and didn't > lose > a single Maxtor. Everybody is going to have wildly varying accounts of this over such a small sample size. I had 6 of 8 Western Digital IDE drives fail within 3 days of buying them. But I realize this is just an anomaly and we got a bad batch. Over the span of several years and hundreds or thousands of drives, I think you will find the results generally go in SCSI's favor. > > - Higher performance (though yes, IDE performance is pretty good) > > Hm. I've seen people getting 95 MB/s through a 3ware RAID. > Don't forget that > it got a single channel per disk. > > All in all this is a reason why they want this machine - they want to > compare > performance... Fine, I'm all for comparing performance. Competition is good! However keep in mind that modern SCSI controllers are 160MB/s per channel. With four channels that's 740MB/s. And that's just standard Ultra3 LVD, not fiber-channel. > > - Depending on the controller from 15 to 60 drives per controller > > Not really. I'm a strong believer in one channel per disk. Well you're looking at it from an IDE point of view. IDE drives REQUIRE one drive per controller to get decent performance, because IDE is a much simpler protocol. And four channels gives you fine fault tolerance, especially if you're using a technology like RAID-10 (also called 0+1), where you spread your mirror drives over multiple busses. With tagged-command-queuing, disconnect/reconnect, etc. SCSI drives can share a bus without stealing all the bandwidth. A modern drive can't do any more than around 40MB/s sustained in optimal conditions anyway (and that drops significantly if any seeking is involved). 4 drives per channel = 160. 4 channels X 4 drives = 16 drives = 740MB/s. That adds up to higher performance on my calculator. Of course these numbers are totally theoretical, and you will get nowhere near that performance in the real world, on a production filesystem, whether it be on SCSI or IDE. > > - Higher quality cases, hot-swap cartridges, etc. on the market > > Definitely not. The best hot swap cartridge I've ever seen was > an IDE cartridge. I thought someone mixed Dark Vader and the Cylons > and turned them into a status display Status displays don't equal high-quality hot-swap equipment. > > So it's not like you're paying more for nothing. There are > some very > > substantial benefits, especially in the reliability/uptime > > department when a disk fails -- no need to bring the server down, or > > even be there when it swaps in a hot spare and starts using it. > > Nothing I wouldn't get wit IDE too... Once again the documentation is too light on all the details to confirm this. It may be true but their documentation doesn't give me enough details to confirm it. Just a counter-point. :-) I'm not trying to dissuade you from building this and verifying it works. However if you want a true and fair comparison, you need to open-mindedly compare it with all that SCSI RAID has to offer and judge the plusses and minuses of each platform. If you're really interested in comparing, I'd suggest starting your SCSI research here: http://www.adaptec.com/worldwide/product/prodfulldesc.html?prodkey=ASR-3400S &cat=%2fTechnology%2fRAID%2fRAID+for+Mid-Range+Servers There are lots of other good SCSI RAID also, this is just one of several. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Thu Jun 7 15: 0: 7 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mail.libam.com (094.dsl108154.surewest.net [63.108.154.94]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 793ED37B401 for ; Thu, 7 Jun 2001 14:59:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from MichaelV@EDIFECS.COM) Received: from ecx1.edifecs.com (mail.edifecs.com [207.153.149.131]) by mail.libam.com (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA20274; Thu, 7 Jun 2001 15:08:40 -0700 Received: by ecx1.edifecs.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 7 Jun 2001 15:04:39 -0700 Message-ID: <36F7B20351634E4FBFFE6C6A216B30D54C26@ecx1.edifecs.com> From: Michael VanLoon To: Michael VanLoon , "'Achim Patzner'" Cc: hardware@freebsd.org Subject: RE: Casing wanted Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 15:04:38 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org OK so I can't do math when in a hurry... heh. 4 x 160 = 640, not 740MB/s... > From: Michael VanLoon > Sent: Thursday, June 07, 2001 1:56 PM > > Proof of concept is fine. I wish you luck on building this > server and its > long-term reliability. So with that, I'm not trying to > convince you not to > build it, but I figure I should address the points I already > brought up. > > > From: Achim Patzner [mailto:ap@bnc.net] > > Sent: Thursday, June 07, 2001 1:24 AM > > > > > Agreed it's quite expensive but... with hardware SCSI > RAID you get: > > > - You don't have all these squirrelly issues you just > > brought up (cable > > lengths, etc.) > > > > Which is about the only problem I encountered and 3ware just > > told me (after > > a direct hit on their long term memory with a hard object) > > that there are > > cables > > up to 70 cm. > > Yes but as far as I know these are outside the ATA100 spec, > and are not > guaranteed to work in all cases. It's kinda hit-and-miss. > If it works, > you're good (unless it starts acting strange). If it doesn't > work, oh well. > Correct me if I'm wrong on this point -- I don't have an > ATA100 spec in > front of me. > > > > - Automatic unattended hardware failover to hot-spare(s) > > > - Automatic unattended background fill-in of data on > > failed-in hot spares > > > while server is live > > > - Caching controller that does delayed elevator-sorted > > write-backs, and > > > read-ahead > > > > This is nothing the 3ware controller won't do. > > Well that hasn't been proven to me. 3ware's specs and > white-papers are > unfortunately alarmingly light on the actual details of how > complete their > live hot-spare support actually is. Although this doesn't > confirm that they > don't do it as well, it's at least noting that they don't > spend any time > saying more than a bullet point "hot-spare". > > A good hardware SCSI RAID controller will fill in the > hot-spare while the > server is up and live. Without the server even realizing > anything happened > (aside from reduced disc performance) it will back-fill the > redundant data > onto the new drive and bring it into the array. Once the new drive is > filled, it is a full member of the array and the machine is > running exactly > as it was before the failure. All this without a reboot, and > without any > downtime. > > One other thing I forgot to mention is dynamic expansion of > arrays. If you > need to add more drives, it will use the same technology to > expand the size > of the array without having to actually move any data (it > will redistribute > the data on the disks for optimal striping, but that is > invisible to the > user or OS). Then if you're running NT you just tell it to expand the > Volume, and if you're running FreeBSD you just run growfs. > Or make a new > partition there if that suits you. > > Without detailed white-papers it's hard to claim the 3ware > controller can do > all this. Maybe it can but I don't see any proof of it in their > documentation. > > > > - Better reliability (yes SCSI drives really ARE built better) > > > > No. I had 15 IBM DDYS (of 35) failing after less than 12 > > months and didn't > > lose > > a single Maxtor. > > Everybody is going to have wildly varying accounts of this > over such a small > sample size. I had 6 of 8 Western Digital IDE drives fail > within 3 days of > buying them. But I realize this is just an anomaly and we > got a bad batch. > > Over the span of several years and hundreds or thousands of > drives, I think > you will find the results generally go in SCSI's favor. > > > > - Higher performance (though yes, IDE performance is pretty good) > > > > Hm. I've seen people getting 95 MB/s through a 3ware RAID. > > Don't forget that > > it got a single channel per disk. > > > > All in all this is a reason why they want this machine - > they want to > > compare > > performance... > > Fine, I'm all for comparing performance. Competition is good! > > However keep in mind that modern SCSI controllers are 160MB/s > per channel. > With four channels that's 740MB/s. And that's just standard > Ultra3 LVD, not > fiber-channel. > > > > - Depending on the controller from 15 to 60 drives per controller > > > > Not really. I'm a strong believer in one channel per disk. > > Well you're looking at it from an IDE point of view. IDE > drives REQUIRE one > drive per controller to get decent performance, because IDE is a much > simpler protocol. And four channels gives you fine fault tolerance, > especially if you're using a technology like RAID-10 (also > called 0+1), > where you spread your mirror drives over multiple busses. > > With tagged-command-queuing, disconnect/reconnect, etc. SCSI > drives can > share a bus without stealing all the bandwidth. A modern > drive can't do any > more than around 40MB/s sustained in optimal conditions > anyway (and that > drops significantly if any seeking is involved). 4 drives > per channel = > 160. 4 channels X 4 drives = 16 drives = 740MB/s. That adds > up to higher > performance on my calculator. Of course these numbers are totally > theoretical, and you will get nowhere near that performance > in the real > world, on a production filesystem, whether it be on SCSI or IDE. > > > > - Higher quality cases, hot-swap cartridges, etc. on the market > > > > Definitely not. The best hot swap cartridge I've ever seen was > > an IDE cartridge. I thought someone mixed Dark Vader and the Cylons > > and turned them into a status display > > Status displays don't equal high-quality hot-swap equipment. > > > > So it's not like you're paying more for nothing. There are > > some very > > > substantial benefits, especially in the reliability/uptime > > > department when a disk fails -- no need to bring the > server down, or > > > even be there when it swaps in a hot spare and starts using it. > > > > Nothing I wouldn't get wit IDE too... > > Once again the documentation is too light on all the details > to confirm > this. It may be true but their documentation doesn't give me > enough details > to confirm it. > > Just a counter-point. :-) > > I'm not trying to dissuade you from building this and > verifying it works. > However if you want a true and fair comparison, you need to > open-mindedly > compare it with all that SCSI RAID has to offer and judge the > plusses and > minuses of each platform. > > If you're really interested in comparing, I'd suggest > starting your SCSI > research here: > http://www.adaptec.com/worldwide/product/prodfulldesc.html?prodkey=ASR-3400S &cat=%2fTechnology%2fRAID%2fRAID+for+Mid-Range+Servers > > There are lots of other good SCSI RAID also, this is just one of several. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Jun 8 14:57: 8 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from puke.reno.oemsupport.com (64-42-17-172.atgi.net [64.42.17.172]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 800FB37B403 for ; Fri, 8 Jun 2001 14:57:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pcalkins@oemsupport.com) Received: by puke.reno.oemsupport.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 8 Jun 2001 14:57:07 -0700 Message-ID: <9B9CB6555E6BA049BC2B857E7711C24F023A7F@puke.reno.oemsupport.com> From: Patrick Calkins To: "Freebsd-Hardware (E-mail)" Subject: Athlon MP Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 14:57:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Do we have support for the Athlon MP with the 760MP chipset? Has anyone tested it yet?? Comments / benchmarks would be appreciated as it looks to beat even the Xeon 1.7Ghz!! Patrick To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Jun 8 15: 1:54 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DB8B37B403 for ; Fri, 8 Jun 2001 15:01:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) id f58M1oA26188; Fri, 8 Jun 2001 15:01:50 -0700 Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 15:01:50 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Patrick Calkins Cc: "Freebsd-Hardware (E-mail)" Subject: Re: Athlon MP Message-ID: <20010608150150.A26014@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <9B9CB6555E6BA049BC2B857E7711C24F023A7F@puke.reno.oemsupport.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="M9NhX3UHpAaciwkO" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <9B9CB6555E6BA049BC2B857E7711C24F023A7F@puke.reno.oemsupport.com>; from pcalkins@oemsupport.com on Fri, Jun 08, 2001 at 02:57:03PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org --M9NhX3UHpAaciwkO Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Jun 08, 2001 at 02:57:03PM -0700, Patrick Calkins wrote: > Do we have support for the Athlon MP with the 760MP chipset? Has anyone > tested it yet?? Comments / benchmarks would be appreciated as it looks to > beat even the Xeon 1.7Ghz!! Yes, it works out of the box with 4.2+ and 5.x. -- Brooks --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --M9NhX3UHpAaciwkO Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE7IUtNXY6L6fI4GtQRAuBAAJ44yoWG6qeT0tjR+mfQBD4B7wNHNACgtig9 N/JmfnYrlOYkQWTq1+c5Msg= =Rcyt -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --M9NhX3UHpAaciwkO-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Jun 8 15:27:19 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from puke.reno.oemsupport.com (64-42-17-172.atgi.net [64.42.17.172]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 885BD37B403 for ; Fri, 8 Jun 2001 15:27:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from pcalkins@oemsupport.com) Received: by puke.reno.oemsupport.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 8 Jun 2001 15:27:17 -0700 Message-ID: <9B9CB6555E6BA049BC2B857E7711C24F023A80@puke.reno.oemsupport.com> From: Patrick Calkins To: 'Simon' , "Freebsd-Hardware (E-mail)" Subject: RE: Athlon MP Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 15:27:09 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Ya know, I'm not really sure - that would make a HUGE difference since you can get up to 2MB of L2 - but check out the (rather extensive) review at: http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1483 also of interesting reading is this: http://www.emulators.com/pentium4.htm Patrick # -----Original Message----- # From: Simon [mailto:simon@optinet.com] # Sent: Friday, June 08, 2001 3:11 PM # To: Patrick Calkins # Subject: Re: Athlon MP # # # # Beat Xeon? how much cache did this Xeon have? # # Thanks, # Simon # # On Fri, 8 Jun 2001 14:57:03 -0700, Patrick Calkins wrote: # # >Do we have support for the Athlon MP with the 760MP chipset? # Has anyone # >tested it yet?? Comments / benchmarks would be appreciated # as it looks to # >beat even the Xeon 1.7Ghz!! # > # >Patrick # > # >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org # >with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message # > # # # To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hardware Fri Jun 8 17:38: 3 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from titan.golden.net (titan.golden.net [199.166.210.90]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5658B37B403 for ; Fri, 8 Jun 2001 17:38:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gldis@cyberbeach.net) Received: from papasmurf (pyjsba@AS53-02-02.cas-kit.golden.net [209.226.152.2]) by titan.golden.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA14126; Fri, 8 Jun 2001 20:37:58 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <010f01c0f07d$b3915bc0$0201a8c0@my.domain> From: "GldisAter" To: "Patrick Calkins" , "Freebsd-Hardware (E-mail)" References: <9B9CB6555E6BA049BC2B857E7711C24F023A7F@puke.reno.oemsupport.com> Subject: Re: Athlon MP Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2001 20:47:02 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org The mailing list archives are your friend. http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/getmsg.cgi?fetch=72297+0+/usr/local/www/db/text/2 001/freebsd-smp/20010422.freebsd-smp ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick Calkins" To: "Freebsd-Hardware (E-mail)" Sent: Friday, June 08, 2001 5:57 PM Subject: Athlon MP > Do we have support for the Athlon MP with the 760MP chipset? Has anyone > tested it yet?? Comments / benchmarks would be appreciated as it looks to > beat even the Xeon 1.7Ghz!! > > Patrick > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hardware" in the body of the message