From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Jul 7 18:15:26 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E1FF37B401 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 18:15:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tin.blazingdot.com (tin.blazingdot.com [207.154.84.81]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 2123543E4A for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 18:15:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from marcus@tin.blazingdot.com) Received: (qmail 10616 invoked by uid 1001); 8 Jul 2002 01:15:23 -0000 Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 18:15:23 -0700 From: Marcus Reid To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Remove UUCP from default install? Message-ID: <20020708011523.GA10512@blazingdot.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.27i Coffee-Level: high Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hello: I don't know if this has been considered recently, but how well liked is the idea of removing UUCP from the default install and putting it into the ports tree? It seems to me that it's probably not very well used, is the source of the occasional security problem, and just adds steps to securing a box. Marcus To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Jul 7 18:22: 4 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBD8A37B400 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 18:22:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from castle.jp.FreeBSD.org (castle.jp.FreeBSD.org [210.226.20.15]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE59143E3B for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 18:22:01 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from matusita@jp.FreeBSD.org) Received: from localhost (localhost [::1]) by castle.jp.FreeBSD.org (8.11.6+3.4W/8.11.3) with ESMTP/inet6 id g681Lvn81238; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 10:21:58 +0900 (JST) (envelope-from matusita@jp.FreeBSD.org) Cc: chat@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <20020708011523.GA10512@blazingdot.com> References: <20020708011523.GA10512@blazingdot.com> X-User-Agent: Mew/1.94.2 XEmacs/21.5 (bamboo) X-FaceAnim: (-O_O-)(O_O- )(_O- )(O- )(- -)( -O)( -O_)( -O_O)(-O_O-) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Dispatcher: imput version 20000228(IM140) Lines: 10 From: Makoto Matsushita To: marcus-freebsd-chat@blazingdot.com Subject: Re: Remove UUCP from default install? Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 10:21:54 +0900 Message-Id: <20020708102154B.matusita@jp.FreeBSD.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org marcus-freebsd-chat> I don't know if this has been considered marcus-freebsd-chat> recently, but how well liked is the idea of marcus-freebsd-chat> removing UUCP from the default install and marcus-freebsd-chat> putting it into the ports tree? Already removed from the base system in 5-current. -- - Makoto `MAR' Matsushita To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Jul 7 18:33:10 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA31D37B400 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 18:33:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tin.blazingdot.com (tin.blazingdot.com [207.154.84.81]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 7CC8643E52 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 18:33:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from marcus@tin.blazingdot.com) Received: (qmail 10662 invoked by uid 1001); 8 Jul 2002 01:33:06 -0000 Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 18:33:06 -0700 From: Marcus Reid To: Francisco Reyes Cc: FreeBSD Chat List Subject: Re: Anyone using/knows of vilitas.com hosting? Message-ID: <20020708013306.GB10512@blazingdot.com> References: <20020705145852.T9374-100000@zoraida.natserv.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20020705145852.T9374-100000@zoraida.natserv.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.27i Coffee-Level: high Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Fri, Jul 05, 2002 at 03:00:41PM -0400, Francisco Reyes wrote: > Today just bumped into vilista.com hosting. > They use FreeBSD and sound very interesting "on paper". > Wondering if anyone knows anything about them or has used them. First impressions: - can do a zone transfer of their domain. Hrm. - They have one MX for the vilitas.com domain. - Both of their nameservers are on the same class c. I'm thinking they're a little green. Marcus To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Jul 7 18:47:37 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B23037B400 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 18:47:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.uninterruptible.net (ns1.uninterruptible.net [216.7.46.11]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6648843E09 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 18:47:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kris@catonic.net) Received: from Spaz.Catonic.NET (tnt6-216-180-5-242.dialup.HiWAAY.net [216.180.5.242]) by mail.uninterruptible.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02F355002F; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 01:47:10 +0000 (GMT) Received: by Spaz.Catonic.NET (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 88BBD3355; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 01:46:40 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Spaz.Catonic.NET (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D8864C54; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 01:46:40 +0000 (GMT) Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 01:46:40 +0000 (GMT) From: Kris Kirby To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: Subject: Re: the incredible shrinking socket In-Reply-To: <20020707083710.GM97638@elvis.mu.org> Message-ID: X-Tech-Support-Email: bofh@catonic.net Organization: Non Illegitemus Carborundum Inc. X-Disclaimer: My opinions are not those of my employer(s). X-Driving-The-Information-Superhighway-Joke: Asleep at the wheel. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > I've taken a stab at unionizing the members and we wind up saving > 28 bytes per socket on i386, and probably nearly double that on > any 64 bit platform. That's ~15%, which isn't too shabby. Ok... did they demand additional vacation days, too? ;-) -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR | TGIFreeBSD... 'Nuff said. | IM: KrisBSD | HSV, AL. ------------------------------------------------------- "Fate, it seems, is not without a sense of irony." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Jul 7 19:24:27 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4339D37B400 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 19:24:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail1.acecape.com (mail1.acecape.com [66.114.74.12]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABA4043E31 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 19:24:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lists@natserv.com) Received: from p65-147.acedsl.com (p65-147.acedsl.com [66.114.65.147]) by mail1.acecape.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g682ONnf021634; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 22:24:23 -0400 Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 22:27:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Francisco Reyes X-X-Sender: fran@zoraida.natserv.net To: Marcus Reid Cc: FreeBSD Chat List Subject: Re: Anyone using/knows of vilitas.com hosting? In-Reply-To: <20020708013306.GB10512@blazingdot.com> Message-ID: <20020707222307.A23497-100000@zoraida.natserv.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Marcus Reid wrote: > First impressions: > - can do a zone transfer of their domain. Hrm. > - They have one MX for the vilitas.com domain. > - Both of their nameservers are on the same class c. > > I'm thinking they're a little green. Thanks for the research. Who do you use/recommend for web hosting? Right now I have a provider, but like to keep my options open. Also for "backup" purposes. I have a system I am doing for a client and I am considering having daily backups restored somewhere else for this client. This way if the primary site is down, the client can access their data from the backup. Depending on how much the client wants to pay I may copy more often than 1 per day. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Jul 7 19:30:22 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11C0737B400 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 19:30:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 12-234-90-219.client.attbi.com (12-234-90-219.client.attbi.com [12.234.90.219]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E9D143E5E for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 19:30:20 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from Master.gorean.org (master.gorean.org [10.0.0.2]) by 12-234-90-219.client.attbi.com (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g682UJBu090155; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 19:30:19 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from localhost (doug@localhost) by Master.gorean.org (8.12.5/8.12.5/Submit) with ESMTP id g68232S3001938; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 19:03:02 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: Master.gorean.org: doug owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 19:03:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Barton To: Marcus Reid Cc: freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Remove UUCP from default install? In-Reply-To: <20020708011523.GA10512@blazingdot.com> Message-ID: <20020707190242.G679-100000@master.gorean.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Marcus Reid wrote: > Hello: > > I don't know if this has been considered recently, but how well liked > is the idea of removing UUCP from the default install and putting it > into the ports tree? Ok, just for you, I'll do it...... There, all done. Enjoy. :) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Jul 7 21: 4: 9 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0514237B400 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:04:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net (scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.49]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB18343E54 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:04:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0280.cvx21-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.193.25] helo=mindspring.com) by scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17RPkr-0002jY-00; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 00:04:06 -0400 Message-ID: <3D290F0B.A5A943AF@mindspring.com> Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2002 21:03:23 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Marcus Reid Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Remove UUCP from default install? References: <20020708011523.GA10512@blazingdot.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Marcus Reid wrote: > I don't know if this has been considered recently, but how well liked > is the idea of removing UUCP from the default install and putting it > into the ports tree? > > It seems to me that it's probably not very well used, is the source of > the occasional security problem, and just adds steps to securing a box. I don't know if this has been considered recently, but how well liked is the ide of removing SSH from the default install and putting it into the ports tree? It seems to me that it's the source of at least one very recent well documented security problem, and just adds steps to being able to use a box in the first place... even UUCP hasn't has a vulnerability announcement as recently as SSH. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Jul 7 21:25:20 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AF7B37B400 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:25:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.uninterruptible.net (ns1.uninterruptible.net [216.7.46.11]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CA6243E65 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:25:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from kris@catonic.net) Received: from Spaz.Catonic.NET (tnt6-216-180-5-242.dialup.HiWAAY.net [216.180.5.242]) by mail.uninterruptible.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 146F45002F; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 04:25:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: by Spaz.Catonic.NET (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 3FC313355; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 04:25:00 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Spaz.Catonic.NET (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23FEC4C54; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 04:25:00 +0000 (GMT) Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 04:25:00 +0000 (GMT) From: Kris Kirby To: Terry Lambert Cc: Marcus Reid , Subject: Re: Remove UUCP from default install? In-Reply-To: <3D290F0B.A5A943AF@mindspring.com> Message-ID: X-Tech-Support-Email: bofh@catonic.net Organization: Non Illegitemus Carborundum Inc. X-Disclaimer: My opinions are not those of my employer(s). X-Driving-The-Information-Superhighway-Joke: Asleep at the wheel. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Terry Lambert wrote: > I don't know if this has been considered recently, but how well liked > is the ide of removing SSH from the default install and putting it > into the ports tree? That's funny, IMNSHO, because it came in from the ports collection to begin with. -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR | TGIFreeBSD... 'Nuff said. | IM: KrisBSD | HSV, AL. ------------------------------------------------------- "Fate, it seems, is not without a sense of irony." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Jul 7 21:28: 3 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C43337B401 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:28:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (genesi.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.161]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B0CF43E3B for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:27:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.12.4/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g684QaZL078183; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 13:56:46 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Subject: Re: Remove UUCP from default install? From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: Terry Lambert Cc: Marcus Reid , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3D290F0B.A5A943AF@mindspring.com> References: <20020708011523.GA10512@blazingdot.com> <3D290F0B.A5A943AF@mindspring.com> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.7 Date: 08 Jul 2002 13:56:36 +0930 Message-Id: <1026102422.1697.9.camel@chowder.gsoft.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.6 (www dot roaringpenguin dot com slash mimedefang) Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Mon, 2002-07-08 at 13:33, Terry Lambert wrote: > It seems to me that it's the source of at least one very recent well > documented security problem, and just adds steps to being able to use > a box in the first place... even UUCP hasn't has a vulnerability > announcement as recently as SSH. More people use SSH than UUCP. We've already had this discussion that's why UUCP isn't in -stable any more. Until FreeBSD's ports structure is properly able to cope with stuff like SSH in the base without hacks then it is probably easier that it remains in CVS. -- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum GPG Fingerprint - 9A8C 569F 685A D928 5140 AE4B 319B 41F4 5D17 FDD5 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Jul 7 21:35:55 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0411637B400 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:35:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net (goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.18]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E38A543E5E for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:33:34 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0280.cvx21-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.193.25] helo=mindspring.com) by goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17RQDK-0005Po-00; Sun, 07 Jul 2002 21:33:30 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2915EF.F0A364B4@mindspring.com> Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2002 21:32:47 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Kris Kirby Cc: Marcus Reid , freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Remove UUCP from default install? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Kris Kirby wrote: > On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Terry Lambert wrote: > > I don't know if this has been considered recently, but how well liked > > is the ide of removing SSH from the default install and putting it > > into the ports tree? > > That's funny, IMNSHO, because it came in from the ports collection to > begin with. It's also funny because we already had the UUCP discussion, and it was already removed from FreeBSD -current, as the original poster would have known, had he checked... In fact, it build strong humor 4 ways... -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Jul 7 21:58:10 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F212837B400 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:58:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.130]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F54B43E4A for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:58:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net (goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.18]) by soulshock.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g684a9R20808 for ; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:36:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pool0280.cvx21-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.193.25] helo=mindspring.com) by goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17RQE5-00063v-00; Sun, 07 Jul 2002 21:34:18 -0700 Message-ID: <3D29161F.78694FA7@mindspring.com> Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2002 21:33:35 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Daniel O'Connor" Cc: Marcus Reid , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Remove UUCP from default install? References: <20020708011523.GA10512@blazingdot.com> <3D290F0B.A5A943AF@mindspring.com> <1026102422.1697.9.camel@chowder.gsoft.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Daniel O'Connor wrote: > On Mon, 2002-07-08 at 13:33, Terry Lambert wrote: > > It seems to me that it's the source of at least one very recent well > > documented security problem, and just adds steps to being able to use > > a box in the first place... even UUCP hasn't has a vulnerability > > announcement as recently as SSH. > > More people use SSH than UUCP. > > We've already had this discussion that's why UUCP isn't in -stable any > more. > > Until FreeBSD's ports structure is properly able to cope with stuff like > SSH in the base without hacks then it is probably easier that it remains > in CVS. OK, 5 ways. ;^). -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 2:20:48 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1512E37B400 for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 02:20:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from atlantis.fukt.bth.se (atlantis.fukt.bth.se [194.47.144.21]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D60A043E09 for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 02:20:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from lonewolf-freebsd@earthmagic.org) Received: (qmail 47286 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 09:20:43 -0000 Received: from 216.a.012.mel.iprimus.net.au (HELO Lara.earthmagic.org) (eo-lonewolf@210.50.248.216) by atlantis.fukt.bth.se with DES-CBC3-SHA encrypted SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 09:20:43 -0000 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20020709191948.02fca8d0@atlantis.fukt.bth.se> X-Sender: eo-lonewolf@atlantis.fukt.bth.se X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 19:20:11 +1000 To: From: "J. 'LoneWolf' Mattsson" Subject: Re: Remove UUCP from default install? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org At 04:25 8/07/2002 +0000, Kris Kirby wrote: >On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Terry Lambert wrote: > > I don't know if this has been considered recently, but how well liked > > is the ide of removing SSH from the default install and putting it > > into the ports tree? > >That's funny, IMNSHO, because it came in from the ports collection to >begin with. *BITE* =) Terry, your subtleness is too great for the majority of us ;) (or should that be "your subtleness is too subtle"?) Cheers, /Johny To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 9:14:37 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E548137B400; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:14:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.centtech.com (moat.centtech.com [206.196.95.10]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D66443E42; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:14:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from sprint.centtech.com (sprint.centtech.com [10.177.173.31]) by proxy.centtech.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g69GEW129853; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:14:32 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id g69GEVp06332; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:14:31 -0500 (CDT) Received: from centtech.com (proton [10.177.173.77]) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g69GES506325; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:14:28 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:14:28 -0500 From: Eric Anderson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.2 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-doc@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Beta FreeBSD search engine Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS perl-11 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Ok, my pre-alpha super beta version of the new FreeBSD search engine can be found here: http://www.sprawler.com/ I have only indexed the /usr/share/doc and /usr/local/share directories on a 4.6-RELEASE machine for now. After more tweaking is done, I'll increase the index to cover more area, and add things like searching through mailing lists, man pages, etc. Please, please, send comments and suggestions. (go easy on me) Eric -- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Systems Administrator Centaur Technology He who laughs last didn't get the joke. ------------------------------------------------------------------ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 9:38: 9 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8096337B400; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:38:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx1.eskimo.com (mx1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.48]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 615FB43E42; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:38:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ripper@eskimo.com) Received: from eskimo.com (ripper@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA21925; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:37:58 -0700 Received: (from ripper@localhost) by eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id JAA25232; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:37:58 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:37:58 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200207091637.JAA25232@eskimo.com> From: Ross Lippert To: anderson@centtech.com Cc: freebsd-doc@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> (message from Eric Anderson on Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:14:28 -0500) Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Pretty cool. What are you going to do about language? Right now, I see answers coming up in all sorts of languages I do not speak. Then again, maybe I should learn. -r To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 10:26:40 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8545237B400; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:26:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pebkac.owp.csus.edu (pebkac.owp.csus.edu [130.86.232.245]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B890A43E54; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:26:35 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from joseph.scott@owp.csus.edu) Received: (from root@localhost) by pebkac.owp.csus.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA02117; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:31:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from joseph.scott@owp.csus.edu) Received: from localhost (scottj@localhost) by pebkac.owp.csus.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3av) with ESMTP id KAA02110; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:31:14 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from joseph.scott@owp.csus.edu) Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:31:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Joseph Scott X-Sender: scottj@pebkac.owp.csus.edu To: Eric Anderson Cc: freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine In-Reply-To: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS perl-10 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, 9 Jul 2002, Eric Anderson wrote: # Ok, my pre-alpha super beta version of the new FreeBSD search engine can be # found here: # # http://www.sprawler.com/ # # I have only indexed the /usr/share/doc and /usr/local/share directories on a # 4.6-RELEASE machine for now. After more tweaking is done, I'll increase the # index to cover more area, and add things like searching through mailing lists, # man pages, etc. # # Please, please, send comments and suggestions. (go easy on me) Someone already mentioned an issue with language. Perhaps a selection box along with the words to be searched for. Looks like a good start, I look forward to seeing the email archives imported in to this. -Joseph To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 10:47: 1 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3EE137B400; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:46:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.centtech.com (moat.centtech.com [206.196.95.10]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B64C43E3B; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:46:56 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from sprint.centtech.com (sprint.centtech.com [10.177.173.31]) by proxy.centtech.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g69Hkr102214; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:46:53 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id g69Hkrw12960; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:46:53 -0500 (CDT) Received: from centtech.com (proton [10.177.173.77]) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g69Hko512953; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:46:50 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3D2B218A.828433E4@centtech.com> Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 12:46:50 -0500 From: Eric Anderson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.2 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ross Lippert Cc: freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine References: <200207091637.JAA25232@eskimo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS perl-11 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I've been thinking about that.. Here's my two options (so far): 1. Have the indexer try to detect which page the language falls (mostly) into, and sort it that way. 2. Have separate indexes for separate langauges - which would mean it's simpler to implement, but not as seamless for use. Any thoughts? Eric Ross Lippert wrote: > > Pretty cool. What are you going to do about language? > > Right now, I see answers coming up in all sorts of languages I do > not speak. Then again, maybe I should learn. > > -r -- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Systems Administrator Centaur Technology He who laughs last didn't get the joke. ------------------------------------------------------------------ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 11:54:35 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC0BE37B401 for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:54:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from amsfep15-int.chello.nl (amsfep15-int.chello.nl [213.46.243.27]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84F5343E3B for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:54:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from wouter@pair.com) Received: from hibernate.cryolabs.net ([213.132.151.88]) by amsfep15-int.chello.nl (InterMail vM.5.01.03.06 201-253-122-118-106-20010523) with SMTP id <20020709185428.IICC14519.amsfep15-int.chello.nl@hibernate.cryolabs.net> for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 20:54:28 +0200 Received: (qmail 8571 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 20:54:13 +0200 Received: from unknown (HELO cocaine.cryolabs.net) (192.168.196.5) by hibernate.cryolabs.net with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 20:54:13 +0200 Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine From: Wouter Van Hemel To: Eric Anderson Cc: Ross Lippert , freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <3D2B218A.828433E4@centtech.com> References: <200207091637.JAA25232@eskimo.com> <3D2B218A.828433E4@centtech.com> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.0.7 Date: 09 Jul 2002 20:55:02 +0200 Message-Id: <1026240902.250.135.camel@cocaine> Mime-Version: 1.0 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, 2002-07-09 at 19:46, Eric Anderson wrote: > I've been thinking about that.. Here's my two options (so far): > > 1. Have the indexer try to detect which page the language falls (mostly) into, > and sort it that way. > If you would include the language in the index, you could give back all languages for a given document, e.g. Manual Vinum Bootstrapping ... sd name home.p.s drive YouCrazy plex home.p len hl driveoffset ho ... http://www.sprawler.com/doc1/en_US.ISO8859-1/articles/vinum/manualboot.html - 12k - [HIGHLIGHTED] (de . en . fr . gr . etc) ... This way you would have a truly international search-engine that allows people to pick their own language if the translation exists, or choose another language if it doesn't. The main link could go to the English version, since most of the documentation exists in that language, I guess. I'm just thinking out loud about the possibilities... rather than about the time you have available. Great job so far! ;) > 2. Have separate indexes for separate langauges - which would mean it's simpler > to implement, but not as seamless for use. > The problem with a drop-down box with the available languages or something along those lines is that the documentation in other languages isn't always complete. If people select some obsure language that has only a few documents translated, it's likely their search won't turn up any results. So to be sure they get all relevant information, they will only use English. Or possibly complain about the lack of information, if they don't. > Any thoughts? > Many, though most are not relevant here. Good job... > Eric > > > Ross Lippert wrote: > > > > Pretty cool. What are you going to do about language? > > > > Right now, I see answers coming up in all sorts of languages I do > > not speak. Then again, maybe I should learn. > > > > -r > > -- > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > Eric Anderson Systems Administrator Centaur Technology > He who laughs last didn't get the joke. > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-doc" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 12:37:45 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 925F537B400; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:37:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from spork.pantherdragon.org (spork.pantherdragon.org [206.29.168.146]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C4F843E31; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:37:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dmp@pantherdragon.org) Received: from spark.techno.pagans (spark.techno.pagans [4.61.202.145]) by spork.pantherdragon.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96D89471DA; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:37:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pantherdragon.org (speck.techno.pagans [172.21.42.2]) by spark.techno.pagans (Postfix) with ESMTP id 773D6FEBE; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:37:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3D2B3B82.C50A263F@pantherdragon.org> Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 12:37:38 -0700 From: Darren Pilgrim X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Eric Anderson Cc: freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine References: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Eric Anderson wrote: > > Ok, my pre-alpha super beta version of the new FreeBSD search engine can be > found here: > > http://www.sprawler.com/ > > I have only indexed the /usr/share/doc and /usr/local/share directories on a > 4.6-RELEASE machine for now. After more tweaking is done, I'll increase the > index to cover more area, and add things like searching through mailing lists, > man pages, etc. /usr/src/* and /usr/ports/*/*/pkg-{comment,descr} would be good to have searchable as well, if you're aiming for completeness. An option to select which trees to search would be a good idea as well. For example, four checkboxes: source, ports, man pages, and misc docs. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 12:46:21 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EA6A37B409; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:46:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx1.eskimo.com (mx1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.48]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B73E43E67; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:46:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ripper@eskimo.com) Received: from eskimo.com (ripper@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA01365; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:44:32 -0700 Received: (from ripper@localhost) by eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id MAA05507; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:44:32 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:44:32 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200207091944.MAA05507@eskimo.com> From: Ross Lippert To: joseph@randomnetworks.com Cc: anderson@centtech.com, freebsd-doc@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: (message from Joseph Scott on Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:31:14 -0700 (PDT)) Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Actually, I think I am backpeddling, because it would be a shame not to have alternative languages present. Sometimes, when I am desparate for answers I find myself reading japanese just for the command lines which are in them, and yes, sometimes that does the trick; and I certainly have no problem grokking german or spanish when within the limited domain that is Unix. Perhaps just check boxes for languages, so that one can check off all responses with which one is comfortable? Another possibility is to use language as a MSB for ranking. That is, all pages in the native or checked languages sort higher than the other ones, with "relevance" or whatever being the lesser sort. That way, if I speak Basque, and do a search, if any basque document is a good hit, it comes first, but as I scroll down, I will also see hits in the other languages? Hmmm and while we are shooting for the moon, I wonder if little flags could not appear by the pages, or maybe just the two-letter language code? BTW I just ran a couple searches on things I was just curious about like 'dhcp' and 'ports' to see what came up, and it looks like it has done a good job of finding a good "spread" of pages on the subject, with different themes than just many pages talking about all the same stuff. It reminds me of teoma. Oh, and how about a second search entry box at the bottom of the page like google does it? -r To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 12:52:31 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 492BE37B400; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:52:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.centtech.com (moat.centtech.com [206.196.95.10]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EF8943E09; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:52:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from sprint.centtech.com (sprint.centtech.com [10.177.173.31]) by proxy.centtech.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g69JqM105362; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 14:52:22 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id g69JqLj21213; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 14:52:21 -0500 (CDT) Received: from centtech.com (proton [10.177.173.77]) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g69JqJ521206; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 14:52:19 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3D2B3EF3.D2B1E72B@centtech.com> Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 14:52:19 -0500 From: Eric Anderson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.2 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Wouter Van Hemel Cc: freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine References: <200207091637.JAA25232@eskimo.com> <3D2B218A.828433E4@centtech.com> <1026240902.250.135.camel@cocaine> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS perl-11 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Wouter Van Hemel wrote: > If you would include the language in the index, you could give back all > languages for a given document, e.g. > > Manual Vinum Bootstrapping > ... sd name home.p.s drive YouCrazy plex home.p len hl driveoffset ho ... > http://www.sprawler.com/doc1/en_US.ISO8859-1/articles/vinum/manualboot.html - 12k - [HIGHLIGHTED] > (de . en . fr . gr . etc) I like this - good idea.. Now, to try to implement it.. :) I'll try to come up with something along this line.. > I'm just thinking out loud about the possibilities... rather than about > the time you have available. Great job so far! ;) Thanks! Thinking out loud is good - even if I can't implement everything right now, I'll eventually get it in there (hopefully). > The problem with a drop-down box with the available languages or something > along those lines is that the documentation in other languages isn't > always complete. If people select some obsure language that has only a few > documents translated, it's likely their search won't turn up any results. > So to be sure they get all relevant information, they will only use > English. Or possibly complain about the lack of information, if they > don't. Good point.. I think most people ignore search options for the most part anyhow, and use default most of the time. Eric -- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Systems Administrator Centaur Technology He who laughs last didn't get the joke. ------------------------------------------------------------------ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 13:13:49 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62FF637B400; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 13:13:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.centtech.com (moat.centtech.com [206.196.95.10]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59AAF43E3B; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 13:13:42 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from sprint.centtech.com (sprint.centtech.com [10.177.173.31]) by proxy.centtech.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g69KDc105843; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:13:38 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id g69KDcn22296; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:13:38 -0500 (CDT) Received: from centtech.com (proton [10.177.173.77]) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g69KDZ522281; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:13:35 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3D2B43EF.955661FC@centtech.com> Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:13:35 -0500 From: Eric Anderson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.2 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ross Lippert Cc: joseph@randomnetworks.com, freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine References: <200207091944.MAA05507@eskimo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS perl-11 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Ok, all good thoughts.. One question: How can I determine a language for a page by looking at it? Eric Ross Lippert wrote: > > Actually, I think I am backpeddling, because it would be a shame not > to have alternative languages present. Sometimes, when I am desparate > for answers I find myself reading japanese just for the command lines > which are in them, and yes, sometimes that does the trick; and I > certainly have no problem grokking german or spanish when within the > limited domain that is Unix. > > Perhaps just check boxes for languages, so that one can check off all > responses with which one is comfortable? > > Another possibility is to use language as a MSB for ranking. That > is, all pages in the native or checked languages sort higher than > the other ones, with "relevance" or whatever being the lesser sort. > > That way, if I speak Basque, and do a search, if any basque document > is a good hit, it comes first, but as I scroll down, I will also see > hits in the other languages? > > Hmmm and while we are shooting for the moon, I wonder if little flags > could not appear by the pages, or maybe just the two-letter language > code? > > BTW I just ran a couple searches on things I was just curious about > like 'dhcp' and 'ports' to see what came up, and it looks like it has > done a good job of finding a good "spread" of pages on the subject, > with different themes than just many pages talking about all the same > stuff. It reminds me of teoma. > > Oh, and how about a second search entry box at the bottom of the page > like google does it? > > -r -- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Systems Administrator Centaur Technology He who laughs last didn't get the joke. ------------------------------------------------------------------ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 15: 5:28 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 042B937B405; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:05:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mrout2.yahoo.com (mrout2.yahoo.com [216.145.54.172]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B819D43E09; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:05:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from DougB@FreeBSD.org) Received: from zoot.corp.yahoo.com (zoot.corp.yahoo.com [216.145.52.89]) by mrout2.yahoo.com (8.11.6/8.11.6/y.out) with ESMTP id g69M58R60463; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:05:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (dougb@localhost) by zoot.corp.yahoo.com (8.12.5/8.12.5/Submit) with ESMTP id g69M57iu025904; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:05:07 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:05:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Barton To: Eric Anderson Cc: Wouter Van Hemel , , Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine In-Reply-To: <3D2B3EF3.D2B1E72B@centtech.com> Message-ID: <20020709150414.F24728-100000@zoot.corp.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, 9 Jul 2002, Eric Anderson wrote: > Wouter Van Hemel wrote: > > If you would include the language in the index, you could give back all > > languages for a given document, e.g. > > > > Manual Vinum Bootstrapping > > ... sd name home.p.s drive YouCrazy plex home.p len hl driveoffset ho ... > > http://www.sprawler.com/doc1/en_US.ISO8859-1/articles/vinum/manualboot.html - 12k - [HIGHLIGHTED] > > (de . en . fr . gr . etc) > > I like this - good idea.. Now, to try to implement it.. :) One thing we could do to make this kind of stuff easier to deal with is judicious use of meta tags in the generated html code. Doug -- "We have known freedom's price. We have shown freedom's power. And in this great conflict, ... we will see freedom's victory." - George W. Bush, President of the United States State of the Union, January 28, 2002 Do YOU Yahoo!? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 15:25:48 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 522F037B400 for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:25:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rwcrmhc52.attbi.com (rwcrmhc52.attbi.com [216.148.227.88]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E47A443E4A for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:25:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crist.clark@attbi.com) Received: from blossom.cjclark.org ([12.234.91.48]) by rwcrmhc52.attbi.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with ESMTP id <20020709222545.GLNV8262.rwcrmhc52.attbi.com@blossom.cjclark.org> for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 22:25:45 +0000 Received: from blossom.cjclark.org (localhost. [127.0.0.1]) by blossom.cjclark.org (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g69MPjJK040361 for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:25:45 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from crist.clark@attbi.com) Received: (from cjc@localhost) by blossom.cjclark.org (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g69MPipD040360 for chat@freebsd.org; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:25:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: blossom.cjclark.org: cjc set sender to crist.clark@attbi.com using -f Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:25:44 -0700 From: "Crist J. Clark" To: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Mail Software Used by ISPs Message-ID: <20020709152544.B40078@blossom.cjclark.org> Reply-To: cjclark@alum.mit.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5.1i X-URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~cjc/ Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I am interested in information on what software small, medium, and large ISPs use for email services. When I refer to "email services" I mean SMTP, POP, IMAP, web mail interfaces, and the back-end administrative tools. Do many/most ISPs use big, expensive enterprise tools for this? Piece their own systems together using various commerical/free tools for the different parts? Or do they roll their own almost top to bottom? I have experience doing email for small and medium corporate sites (in the 100's of internal users), but the particular project I am working on is for customers, not internal users, and could quickly balloon from the few dozen on the current demonstration system to a few thousand. Any firsthand info or pointers to more information would be greatly appreciated. -- Crist J. Clark | cjclark@alum.mit.edu | cjclark@jhu.edu http://people.freebsd.org/~cjc/ | cjc@freebsd.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 15:42:54 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6D0437B400 for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:42:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net (hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.22]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9883943E42 for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:42:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0275.cvx22-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.199.20] helo=mindspring.com) by hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17S3h3-0000rI-00; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 18:42:49 -0400 Message-ID: <3D2B66BE.771B9B49@mindspring.com> Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:42:06 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "J. 'LoneWolf' Mattsson" Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Remove UUCP from default install? References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020709191948.02fca8d0@atlantis.fukt.bth.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org "J. 'LoneWolf' Mattsson" wrote: > At 04:25 8/07/2002 +0000, Kris Kirby wrote: > >On Sun, 7 Jul 2002, Terry Lambert wrote: > > > I don't know if this has been considered recently, but how well liked > > > is the ide of removing SSH from the default install and putting it > > > into the ports tree? > > > >That's funny, IMNSHO, because it came in from the ports collection to > >begin with. > > *BITE* =) > > Terry, your subtleness is too great for the majority of us ;) > (or should that be "your subtleness is too subtle"?) I try to subtlefy things when I can... subtle is as subtle does, after all. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 16:39:43 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6295237B400; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 16:39:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vienna9.his.com (vienna9.his.com [216.200.68.14]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81DC343E09; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 16:39:39 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brad.knowles@skynet.be) Received: from [10.0.1.15] (root@[127.0.0.1]) by vienna9.his.com (8.11.6/8.10.1) with ESMTP id g69KGbO08675; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 16:16:37 -0400 (EDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: bs663385@pop.skynet.be Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3D2B43EF.955661FC@centtech.com> References: <200207091944.MAA05507@eskimo.com> <3D2B43EF.955661FC@centtech.com> Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 22:16:42 +0200 To: Eric Anderson , Ross Lippert From: Brad Knowles Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Cc: joseph@randomnetworks.com, freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org At 3:13 PM -0500 2002/07/09, Eric Anderson wrote: > Ok, all good thoughts.. One question: > > How can I determine a language for a page by looking at it? You need dictionaries of words in various languages, then you do a sort | uniq of all words in the document and compare it against the language dictionaries. The language dictionary with the highest number of hits is most likely to be the one in which the document is written. -- Brad Knowles, "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 17:35:34 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4C0337B401; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:35:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx1.eskimo.com (mx1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.48]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E99343E3B; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:35:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ripper@eskimo.com) Received: from eskimo.com (ripper@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA22098; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:35:27 -0700 Received: (from ripper@localhost) by eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id RAA19820; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:35:27 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:35:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200207100035.RAA19820@eskimo.com> From: Ross Lippert To: anderson@centtech.com Cc: joseph@randomnetworks.com, freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <3D2B43EF.955661FC@centtech.com> (message from Eric Anderson on Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:13:35 -0500) Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Well, isn't the freeBSD documentation at least under directories which have 2-letter codes? Alternatively, if you clustered documents by common word count, the various corpi for the different languages should show up as distinct clusters. If you are doing any word co-occurrence calculations, I'm sure they could be modified to produce a language classification. -r To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Jul 9 20: 8:31 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E191337B407 for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 20:08:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vienna9.his.com (vienna9.his.com [216.200.68.14]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 142A343E5E for ; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 20:08:25 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brad.knowles@skynet.be) Received: from [10.0.1.15] (root@[127.0.0.1]) by vienna9.his.com (8.11.6/8.10.1) with ESMTP id g6A05DO13446; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 20:05:15 -0400 (EDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: bs663385@pop.skynet.be Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20020709152544.B40078@blossom.cjclark.org> References: <20020709152544.B40078@blossom.cjclark.org> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:26:56 +0200 To: cjclark@alum.mit.edu, chat@freebsd.org From: Brad Knowles Subject: Re: Mail Software Used by ISPs Cc: "Crist J. Clark" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org At 3:25 PM -0700 2002/07/09, Crist J. Clark wrote: > I am interested in information on what software small, medium, and > large ISPs use for email services. When I refer to "email services" I > mean SMTP, POP, IMAP, web mail interfaces, and the back-end > administrative tools. Do many/most ISPs use big, expensive enterprise > tools for this? Piece their own systems together using various > commerical/free tools for the different parts? Or do they roll their > own almost top to bottom? The folks at companies like Software.com will try to convince you that the largest ISPs in the world use their systems. That's not true. You can throw dozens of Sun E4500s at something like Software.com and serve only about 100k users. At Belgacom Skynet, we served almost a million users with sendmail and a modified local delivery agent (to handle hashed directories), a modified version of QPopper (matching the hashing algorithm used in the local delivery agent) or a modified version of Cyrus. This was running on a pair of Sun E420Rs, each configured with four 450Mhz UltraSPARC II processors each, 4GB of RAM, and connected via FibreChannel to an external dishwasher-size RAID array (re-badged Hitachi DF400s). You can read more about the architecture that I recommended we replace this with at ("Design and Implementation of Highly Scalable Mail Systems", presented at LISA 2000), based on front-end SMTP servers running the commercial Sendmail MTA (with anti-virus scanning and anti-spam provisions via the Milter interface), back-end Sendmail Advanced Message Servers, webmail systems, etc.... This architecture should easily scale to handling at least a million users (larger than any other IMAP mail system in the world that I know of), and should scale to handle at least ten million users or more. I was interested to find that this architecture was implemented almost verbatim by a very large mail outsourcing company in Scotland, down to the recommendation of a particular family of Hitachi FibreChannel disk storage devices. For POP3-based sites, the largest mail systems in the world that I know of are running an architecture along the lines laid out by Nick Christenson in his paper "A Highly Scalable Electronic Mail Service Using Open Systems" at . Note that Nick was my co-author for the paper I presented at LISA 2000. > I have experience doing email for small and medium corporate sites (in > the 100's of internal users), but the particular project I am working > on is for customers, not internal users, and could quickly balloon > from the few dozen on the current demonstration system to a few > thousand. Any firsthand info or pointers to more information would be > greatly appreciated. A few thousand users is no problem. See Nick's page at and my page at . We've both been professional consultants in this business for a long time, and if we can't help you, we should be able to point you at people who can. You may also be interested in Nick's book _sendmail Performance Tuning_ (Addison Wesley Professional, ISBN: 0321115708), to be published in September. -- Brad Knowles, "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 6:14:16 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDC9C37B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 06:14:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from parmenides.zen.co.uk (parmenides.zen.co.uk [212.23.8.69]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8F79443E31 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 06:14:11 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tom@FreeBSD.org) Received: (qmail 28102 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 13:14:09 -0000 Received: from protagoras.zen.co.uk (212.23.8.61) by parmenides.zen.co.uk with QMQP; 10 Jul 2002 13:14:09 -0000 Received: from dsl-62-3-122-102.zen.co.uk (HELO eborcom.com) (62.3.122.102) by protagoras.zen.co.uk with SMTP for ; 10 Jul 2002 13:14:09 -0000 X-Envelope-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: (qmail 7289 invoked by uid 1001); 10 Jul 2002 13:14:17 -0000 Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:14:17 +0100 From: Tom Hukins To: Eric Anderson Cc: freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Message-ID: <20020710141417.A7232@eborcom.com> Mail-Followup-To: Tom Hukins , Eric Anderson , freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <200207091944.MAA05507@eskimo.com> <3D2B43EF.955661FC@centtech.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5.1i In-Reply-To: <3D2B43EF.955661FC@centtech.com>; from anderson@centtech.com on Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 03:13:35PM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 03:13:35PM -0500, Eric Anderson wrote: > > How can I determine a language for a page by looking at it? Would /usr/ports/textproc/mguesser be any use to you? Tom To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 6:27: 7 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE16637B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 06:27:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bast.unixathome.org (bast.unixathome.org [216.187.105.150]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A40843E42 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 06:27:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dan@langille.org) Received: from wocker (wocker.unixathome.org [192.168.0.99]) by bast.unixathome.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CB503F28; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:27:00 -0400 (EDT) From: "Dan Langille" To: Eric Anderson Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:27:04 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Message-ID: <3D2BFDE8.98.46933A1@localhost> In-reply-to: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On 9 Jul 2002 at 11:14, Eric Anderson wrote: > Ok, my pre-alpha super beta version of the new FreeBSD search engine > can be found here: > > http://www.sprawler.com/ Very cool. I searched for my own name and found references I did not know existed. What tool are you using for creating your index? For what it's worth, I've been using htDig (http://www.htdig.org) for years and found that the flexibility is quite useful. For determining language, perhaps this URL might help: http://www.htdig.org/cgi- bin/htsearch?words=determining+language&method=and&config=htdig -- Dan Langille To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 7: 0:35 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C09737B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 07:00:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.centtech.com (moat.centtech.com [206.196.95.10]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3010643E3B for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 07:00:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from sprint.centtech.com (sprint.centtech.com [10.177.173.31]) by proxy.centtech.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6AE0J127956; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:00:19 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id g6AE0IQ03020; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:00:18 -0500 (CDT) Received: from centtech.com (proton [10.177.173.77]) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6AE0G503013; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:00:16 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3D2C3DF0.341BABA9@centtech.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:00:16 -0500 From: Eric Anderson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.2 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dan Langille Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine References: <3D2BFDE8.98.46933A1@localhost> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS perl-11 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Dan Langille wrote: > Very cool. I searched for my own name and found references I did not > know existed. > > What tool are you using for creating your index? For what it's > worth, I've been using htDig (http://www.htdig.org) for years and > found that the flexibility is quite useful. Thanks.. I wrote my own stuff for building the indexes. > For determining language, perhaps this URL might help: > > http://www.htdig.org/cgi- > bin/htsearch?words=determining+language&method=and&config=htdig I'll check that out.. Thanks for the pointer. Eric -- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Systems Administrator Centaur Technology He who laughs last didn't get the joke. ------------------------------------------------------------------ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 8:50:11 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6296D37B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 08:50:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from malkavian.org (malkavian.org [206.136.132.23]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9827443E4A for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 08:50:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-chat@aard.org) Received: from malkavian.org (aard@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by malkavian.org (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6AFo32F053727 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 11:50:03 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from freebsd-chat@aard.org) Received: (from aard@localhost) by malkavian.org (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6AFo3vQ053726 for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 11:50:03 -0400 (EDT) X-Authentication-Warning: malkavian.org: aard set sender to freebsd-chat@aard.org using -f Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 11:50:03 -0400 From: a clever sheep To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers Message-ID: <20020710155003.GC500@malkavian.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-URL: http://aard.org/ X-Ending-World: everything stays the same Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org i'm looking to move one (or more) of my freebsd boxes to 2u rack-mount cases. in some cases i have on-board lan, in others i need both a lan card and a video card. a lot of these cheap-o 2u cases look like they require drivers for the pci riser cards. is this the case? is it universal or is it dependant on the brand of riser card? -- dreams and belief have gone; time, life itself goes on To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 8:58:43 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 552D137B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 08:58:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.centtech.com (moat.centtech.com [206.196.95.10]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92D6943E31 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 08:58:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from sprint.centtech.com (sprint.centtech.com [10.177.173.31]) by proxy.centtech.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6AFwc100951; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 10:58:38 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id g6AFwcp10610; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 10:58:38 -0500 (CDT) Received: from centtech.com (proton [10.177.173.77]) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6AFwZ510603; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 10:58:35 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3D2C59AB.6010805@centtech.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 10:58:35 -0500 From: Eric Anderson Reply-To: anderson@centtech.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i386; en-US; rv:1.0rc2) Gecko/20020513 Netscape/7.0b1 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: a clever sheep Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers References: <20020710155003.GC500@malkavian.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS perl-11 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I have a bunch of these 2u boxes, and the risers are bascially pci/agp bus extensions, with no need for any drivers (nothing to drive). Eric a clever sheep wrote: > i'm looking to move one (or more) of my freebsd boxes to 2u rack-mount > cases. in some cases i have on-board lan, in others i need both a lan > card and a video card. > > a lot of these cheap-o 2u cases look like they require drivers for the > pci riser cards. is this the case? is it universal or is it dependant > on the brand of riser card? > -- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Systems Administrator Centaur Technology He who laughs last didn't get the joke. ------------------------------------------------------------------ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 13:43:20 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5389E37B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:43:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net (swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.123]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E06E443E52 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:43:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0451.cvx22-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.199.196] helo=mindspring.com) by swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SOIl-0001hc-00; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:43:08 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2C9C2F.91398132@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:42:23 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: a clever sheep Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers References: <20020710155003.GC500@malkavian.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org a clever sheep wrote: > i'm looking to move one (or more) of my freebsd boxes to 2u rack-mount > cases. in some cases i have on-board lan, in others i need both a lan > card and a video card. > > a lot of these cheap-o 2u cases look like they require drivers for the > pci riser cards. is this the case? is it universal or is it dependant > on the brand of riser card? They are just wires and connectors to extend the wires and connectors already there. No drivers necessary. On a related note, I've been looking for a 1U case and riser that can handle 2 cards (one right-side-up, the other up-side-down), i.e. the cards go on opposite sides of the riser, with their connectors facing each other: riser card 1 ---. ,--- card 2 --------------- |-+-| --------------- ---' | `--- | | | | | | motherboard ----------------+---+------------------------------ Anyone seen something like this? Preferrably, both 32 and 64 bit versions... -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 13:58:20 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DB7837B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:58:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from spork.pantherdragon.org (spork.pantherdragon.org [206.29.168.146]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5A4543E31 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:58:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dmp@pantherdragon.org) Received: from spark.techno.pagans (spark.techno.pagans [4.61.202.145]) by spork.pantherdragon.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95063471DA; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:53:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pantherdragon.org (speck.techno.pagans [172.21.42.2]) by spark.techno.pagans (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1FE5FF8F; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:52:35 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3D2C9E93.A8EBBD81@pantherdragon.org> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:52:35 -0700 From: Darren Pilgrim X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Terry Lambert Cc: a clever sheep , freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers References: <20020710155003.GC500@malkavian.org> <3D2C9C2F.91398132@mindspring.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Terry Lambert wrote: > a clever sheep wrote: > > i'm looking to move one (or more) of my freebsd boxes to 2u rack-mount > > cases. in some cases i have on-board lan, in others i need both a lan > > card and a video card. > > > > a lot of these cheap-o 2u cases look like they require drivers for the > > pci riser cards. is this the case? is it universal or is it dependant > > on the brand of riser card? > > They are just wires and connectors to extend the wires and connectors > already there. No drivers necessary. > > On a related note, I've been looking for a 1U case and riser that can > handle 2 cards (one right-side-up, the other up-side-down), i.e. the > cards go on opposite sides of the riser, with their connectors facing > each other: Would the connectors being that close to each other impact signal timing? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 14:11:37 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CD3037B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:11:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net (scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.49]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA57743E42 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:11:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0451.cvx22-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.199.196] helo=mindspring.com) by scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SOkE-0006zr-00; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:11:30 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2CA2D6.E387A2D@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:10:46 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Darren Pilgrim Cc: a clever sheep , freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers References: <20020710155003.GC500@malkavian.org> <3D2C9C2F.91398132@mindspring.com> <3D2C9E93.A8EBBD81@pantherdragon.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Darren Pilgrim wrote: > > They are just wires and connectors to extend the wires and connectors > > already there. No drivers necessary. > > > > On a related note, I've been looking for a 1U case and riser that can > > handle 2 cards (one right-side-up, the other up-side-down), i.e. the > > cards go on opposite sides of the riser, with their connectors facing > > each other: > > Would the connectors being that close to each other impact signal > timing? Does having adjacent connectors that close together on the motherboard impact signal timing? 8-). If you don't like the idea on that basis, then I could live with right-hand riser to go with a seperately purchased left-hand riser; I can get a left-hand riser anywhere... I think the biggest issue will be that the card will end up facing chip-side-down rather than chip-side-up, as for most cards, so the heat disapation will be towards motherboard components that may also want to be disapating heat into the same small areas there, between-card-and-motherboard. I think you can make the argument, though, that you will have that same problem with any card, even if it's right-side-up, because of it being parallel to the motherboard and the case top. Now to find a motherboard that can handle 1G SIMMs, where the SIMM connector hardware is at a steeper angle than normal so that you can fit 4G in a 1U case... ;^). -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 14:45:45 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 392D337B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:45:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agamemnon.cnchost.com (agamemnon.cnchost.com [207.155.252.31]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1ADD43E31 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:45:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bakul@bitblocks.com) Received: from bitblocks.com (adsl-209-204-185-216.sonic.net [209.204.185.216]) by agamemnon.cnchost.com id RAA18392; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:45:30 -0400 (EDT) [ConcentricHost SMTP Relay 1.14] Message-ID: <200207102145.RAA18392@agamemnon.cnchost.com> To: Terry Lambert Cc: a clever sheep , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:42:23 PDT." <3D2C9C2F.91398132@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:45:29 -0700 From: Bakul Shah Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > On a related note, I've been looking for a 1U case and riser that can > handle 2 cards (one right-side-up, the other up-side-down), i.e. the > cards go on opposite sides of the riser, with their connectors facing > each other: Check out http://www.adexelec.com/pci32.htm#PCITX4-1 You can specify which side the connector is mounted on. You'd probably want to either use a low power dissipating card in the "component side down" position or use a higher height riser. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 16: 7:20 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E5C837B401 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:07:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from postfix2-2.free.fr (postfix2-2.free.fr [213.228.0.140]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A79A343E31 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:07:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rsidd@lpt.ens.fr) Received: from bluerondo.a.la.turk (nas-cbv-6-62-147-149-102.dial.proxad.net [62.147.149.102]) by postfix2-2.free.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54D345F91B for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:07:16 +0200 (CEST) Received: (qmail 1560 invoked by uid 1001); 10 Jul 2002 23:07:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:07:10 +0200 From: Rahul Siddharthan To: Terry Lambert Cc: Alexey Dokuchaev , Cy Schubert - CITS Open Systems Group , chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Package system wishlist Message-ID: <20020710230709.GA1512@lpt.ens.fr> References: <20020710210509.GA686@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CA535.EC11BDA1@mindspring.com> <20020710213619.GA882@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CBAC4.6AC3CAC9@mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3D2CBAC4.6AC3CAC9@mindspring.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.27i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.6-PRERELEASE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org [moved to -chat] Terry Lambert wrote: > "The most recent updates" are only appropriate if I am keeping my > base OS version updated as well. I don't want to have to do that. > I want to install a version that works and never update it ever > again, except for security patches, until I have to face the 2038 > UNIX 32 bit seconds rollover problem. > > We Fear Change(tm). [snip] > I am refusing to go from 4.x to 5.x; or from 4.4 to 4.6. Whichever. > The important part is my refusal to change for the sake of change. Then you'd have to convince the FreeBSD security people to issue fixes for all branches, back to 1.0 or earlier, no? (Equivalently, to support version 4.4 until the year 2038.) I still don't see your argument for packaging components of the base system. A binary from FreeBSD 7.3 in 2006 is unlikely to work on your FreeBSD 4.4 system. Microsoft did support Windows 95 for a long time, but they have a rather less aggressive release schedule. - Rahul To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 16:32:33 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A00E37B405 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:32:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from spork.pantherdragon.org (spork.pantherdragon.org [206.29.168.146]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F27E43E52 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:32:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dmp@pantherdragon.org) Received: from spark.techno.pagans (spark.techno.pagans [4.61.202.145]) by spork.pantherdragon.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EED20471DA; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:32:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pantherdragon.org (speck.techno.pagans [172.21.42.2]) by spark.techno.pagans (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DEC3FF8B; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:32:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3D2CC40B.AAB21291@pantherdragon.org> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:32:27 -0700 From: Darren Pilgrim X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Terry Lambert Cc: a clever sheep , freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers References: <20020710155003.GC500@malkavian.org> <3D2C9C2F.91398132@mindspring.com> <3D2C9E93.A8EBBD81@pantherdragon.org> <3D2CA2D6.E387A2D@mindspring.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Terry Lambert wrote: > > Darren Pilgrim wrote: > > > They are just wires and connectors to extend the wires and connectors > > > already there. No drivers necessary. > > > > > > On a related note, I've been looking for a 1U case and riser that can > > > handle 2 cards (one right-side-up, the other up-side-down), i.e. the > > > cards go on opposite sides of the riser, with their connectors facing > > > each other: > > > > Would the connectors being that close to each other impact signal > > timing? > > Does having adjacent connectors that close together on the motherboard > impact signal timing? 8-). > > If you don't like the idea on that basis, then I could live with > right-hand riser to go with a seperately purchased left-hand riser; > I can get a left-hand riser anywhere... I didn't say I didn't like the idea, I just know that trace lengths affect timing and that on a bus-type interface, timing is important. Perhaps at 33/66MHz it doesn't really make a difference. > I think the biggest issue will be that the card will end up facing > chip-side-down rather than chip-side-up, as for most cards, so the > heat disapation will be towards motherboard components that may > also want to be disapating heat into the same small areas there, > between-card-and-motherboard. > > I think you can make the argument, though, that you will have that > same problem with any card, even if it's right-side-up, because of > it being parallel to the motherboard and the case top. I would have thought that putting the cards chip-side down would allow for simpler cooling as all the hot components would sit more or less in the same air path. In a thin, wide space like a 1U, more air along one would probably be easier to do than adding seperate air paths. > Now to find a motherboard that can handle 1G SIMMs, where the SIMM > connector hardware is at a steeper angle than normal so that you > can fit 4G in a 1U case... ;^). You know, there's a point at which all this extra hardware will demand a 2U case just so you can use larger fans. :) Or have you found a company that will make small electric turbofans at a reasonable price? I've seen 1-inch turbofans that pull no more juice than the average 80mm case fan and can move 170CFM when unobstructed and running at nominal speed. I just wouldn't want to put one in my desktop. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 16:37: 3 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B7D237B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:37:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net (avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8605143E3B for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:36:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0451.cvx22-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.199.196] helo=mindspring.com) by avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SR0y-0002DD-00; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:36:56 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2CC4D8.C3D5A9ED@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:35:52 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rsi@panix.com Cc: Thierry Herbelot , chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Listening to users [was Re: Package system wishlist] References: <3D2BE142.E25CA9BC@mindspring.com> <3D2CAAC1.5CF66C96@herbelot.com> <200207102204.g6AM4UD11370@panix1.panix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Redirected from -arch... Rajappa Iyer wrote: > Also note that FreeBSD, by and large, does not have > nearly as many incompatible changes to the device driver interface. You haven't tried to write a PCI card driver lately, have you? "It's still quite opaque to me" What's the matter with the card I'm using? "Can't you tell we changed the A-P-I?" Maybe I should build some old scratch boxes? "Welcome back to Rel 4 point 5. Where have you been running lately, honey? You can't run current till you spend a lot of money." Everybody's talkin' 'bout the new bus Funny, but it's still quite opaque to me What's the matter with the code I'm writing? "Can't you tell that it's out of style(9)?" Should I get a set of programming manuals? "Do you think that your code will compile? Nowadays you can't be too sentimental Your best bet's the new stuff, or your're gonna' go mental." CAM stuff, new bus, even if it's old bus It's still quite opaque to me Oh, it doesn't matter what they say in the papers 'Cause it's always been the same old scene. There's a new devfs in town But you can't get the code to run clean... Especially on your old machine How about a pair of 17-40 Controllers Does the EISA driver even have a chance? "You could really be a real hacker, baby If you rewrote it all from scratch. Don't waste your money on a new bunch of hardware, You get more mileage digging up an old box somewhere." Next phase, new wave, release delays, anyways It's still quite opaque to me What's the matter with the list I'm posting to? "Don't you know that they're out of touch?" Should I try to install the latest -current? "If you do then you'll crash too much. Don't you know about the new approach honey? All you need are docs and a whole lotta money." It's the next phase, new wave, release delays, anyways It's still quite opaque to me Everybody's talkin' 'bout the new code Funny, but it's still quite opaque to me -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 16:40:17 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C34D737B401 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:40:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net (avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5343443E65 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:40:15 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0451.cvx22-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.199.196] helo=mindspring.com) by avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SR3C-0005A7-00; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:39:14 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2CC561.44CE994B@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:38:09 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bakul Shah Cc: a clever sheep , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers References: <200207102145.RAA18392@agamemnon.cnchost.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Bakul Shah wrote: > > On a related note, I've been looking for a 1U case and riser that can > > handle 2 cards (one right-side-up, the other up-side-down), i.e. the > > cards go on opposite sides of the riser, with their connectors facing > > each other: > > Check out > http://www.adexelec.com/pci32.htm#PCITX4-1 > You can specify which side the connector is mounted on. > You'd probably want to either use a low power dissipating > card in the "component side down" position or use a higher > height riser. Pretty cool. Now I need a case with the proper metal work to match it so that I can screw in cards from both sides of the riser... too bad it's only 32 bit, though. 8-(. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 16:43:15 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A717C37B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:43:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29BD343E52 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:43:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (IDENT:brdavis@localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6ANggri023979; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:42:42 -0700 Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6ANggnU023978; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:42:42 -0700 Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:42:42 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Terry Lambert Cc: Bakul Shah , a clever sheep , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers Message-ID: <20020710164242.A23510@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <200207102145.RAA18392@agamemnon.cnchost.com> <3D2CC561.44CE994B@mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="UugvWAfsgieZRqgk" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5.1i In-Reply-To: <3D2CC561.44CE994B@mindspring.com>; from tlambert2@mindspring.com on Wed, Jul 10, 2002 at 04:38:09PM -0700 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) on odin.ac.hmc.edu Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org --UugvWAfsgieZRqgk Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Jul 10, 2002 at 04:38:09PM -0700, Terry Lambert wrote: > Bakul Shah wrote: > > > On a related note, I've been looking for a 1U case and riser that can > > > handle 2 cards (one right-side-up, the other up-side-down), i.e. the > > > cards go on opposite sides of the riser, with their connectors facing > > > each other: > >=20 > > Check out > > http://www.adexelec.com/pci32.htm#PCITX4-1 > > You can specify which side the connector is mounted on. > > You'd probably want to either use a low power dissipating > > card in the "component side down" position or use a higher > > height riser. >=20 > Pretty cool. Now I need a case with the proper metal work to > match it so that I can screw in cards from both sides of the riser... > too bad it's only 32 bit, though. 8-(. http://www.adexelec.com/pci64.htm#PCITX8-1 -- Brooks --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --UugvWAfsgieZRqgk Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE9LMZxXY6L6fI4GtQRAo8cAKCPagtyet4ck7EfdmeEs+lrR5yYUACgpcN4 4Tvm8YgDevSyO8h0ALGcaHE= =QG6x -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --UugvWAfsgieZRqgk-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 16:44:59 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC17537B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:44:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net (avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17E2E43E64 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:44:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0451.cvx22-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.199.196] helo=mindspring.com) by avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SR8W-0004FY-00; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:44:45 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2CC6A9.EB0F7995@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:43:37 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Rahul Siddharthan Cc: Alexey Dokuchaev , Cy Schubert - CITS Open Systems Group , chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Package system wishlist References: <20020710210509.GA686@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CA535.EC11BDA1@mindspring.com> <20020710213619.GA882@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CBAC4.6AC3CAC9@mindspring.com> <20020710230709.GA1512@lpt.ens.fr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Rahul Siddharthan wrote: > > I am refusing to go from 4.x to 5.x; or from 4.4 to 4.6. Whichever. > > The important part is my refusal to change for the sake of change. > > Then you'd have to convince the FreeBSD security people to issue fixes > for all branches, back to 1.0 or earlier, no? (Equivalently, to > support version 4.4 until the year 2038.) I still don't see your > argument for packaging components of the base system. A binary from > FreeBSD 7.3 in 2006 is unlikely to work on your FreeBSD 4.4 system. > > Microsoft did support Windows 95 for a long time, but they have a > rather less aggressive release schedule. No, all I'd have to convince them to do is release fixes for the varios packages. I can install a different OpenSSH in my system, if OpenSSH is just another component. All I have to care about is binary backward compatability, and that's taken care of by the dependency tracking. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 17: 4: 0 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E877137B406 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:03:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net (avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6391743E54 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:03:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0451.cvx22-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.199.196] helo=mindspring.com) by avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SRR2-0005JH-00; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:03:52 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2CCB20.FC148BA1@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:02:40 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Darren Pilgrim Cc: a clever sheep , freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers References: <20020710155003.GC500@malkavian.org> <3D2C9C2F.91398132@mindspring.com> <3D2C9E93.A8EBBD81@pantherdragon.org> <3D2CA2D6.E387A2D@mindspring.com> <3D2CC40B.AAB21291@pantherdragon.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Darren Pilgrim wrote: > > Now to find a motherboard that can handle 1G SIMMs, where the SIMM > > connector hardware is at a steeper angle than normal so that you > > can fit 4G in a 1U case... ;^). > > You know, there's a point at which all this extra hardware will demand > a 2U case just so you can use larger fans. :) Or have you found a > company that will make small electric turbofans at a reasonable price? > I've seen 1-inch turbofans that pull no more juice than the average > 80mm case fan and can move 170CFM when unobstructed and running at > nominal speed. I just wouldn't want to put one in my desktop. OK, here are some dirty little form-factor secrets that everyone should know... There are three overwhelming arguments in favor of 1U: o Psychological: smaller == more technically advanced. o Economic: Over the amortizable lifetime of a product (3 years for computer equipment, according to the IRS), rack space rental is a more significant portion of TCO than the price of the box itself. o Economic: A small box costs less to ship than a big box There are four overwhelming arguments in favor of 4/5U: o Psychological: I flat out disbelieve your ability to make something that can do what you say it can do fit in a space that small o Psychological: Something should weigh proportional to what it costs to buy. Put a cinderblock retaining bracket in the thing to bring up weight, if you have to. o Practical: The bigger it is, the more connectors, knobs, and indicators I can jam onto the front of the thing o Ability to read the name/logo through the chain link by the people in the colocation case next door to your customer's. Rarely is 2/3U a good thing, unless you are aiming to be a plug-in replacement for a product that is already 2/3U. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 17:15:27 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDE8D37B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:15:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net (avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A93E143E58 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:15:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0451.cvx22-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.199.196] helo=mindspring.com) by avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SRbt-0003jo-00; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:15:06 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2CCDBC.40429B06@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:13:48 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brooks Davis Cc: Bakul Shah , a clever sheep , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers References: <200207102145.RAA18392@agamemnon.cnchost.com> <3D2CC561.44CE994B@mindspring.com> <20020710164242.A23510@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Brooks Davis wrote: > > > Check out > > > http://www.adexelec.com/pci32.htm#PCITX4-1 > > > You can specify which side the connector is mounted on. > > > You'd probably want to either use a low power dissipating > > > card in the "component side down" position or use a higher > > > height riser. > > > > Pretty cool. Now I need a case with the proper metal work to > > match it so that I can screw in cards from both sides of the riser... > > too bad it's only 32 bit, though. 8-(. > > http://www.adexelec.com/pci64.htm#PCITX8-1 Very cool! Now I need a case with the proper metal work to match it so that I can screw in cards from both sides of the riser... (Maybe if I keep asking, all my wishes will be granted, but just in case it's only the last one...) I'd still like to find an 8-port hub on a PCI card... -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 17:34:54 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DA4E37B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:34:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E6A343E42 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:34:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (IDENT:brdavis@localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6B0Yeri031221; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:34:41 -0700 Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6B0Yeoa031220; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:34:40 -0700 Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:34:40 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Terry Lambert Cc: Brooks Davis , Bakul Shah , a clever sheep , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers Message-ID: <20020710173440.A29963@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <200207102145.RAA18392@agamemnon.cnchost.com> <3D2CC561.44CE994B@mindspring.com> <20020710164242.A23510@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> <3D2CCDBC.40429B06@mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="EVF5PPMfhYS0aIcm" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5.1i In-Reply-To: <3D2CCDBC.40429B06@mindspring.com>; from tlambert2@mindspring.com on Wed, Jul 10, 2002 at 05:13:48PM -0700 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) on odin.ac.hmc.edu Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org --EVF5PPMfhYS0aIcm Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Jul 10, 2002 at 05:13:48PM -0700, Terry Lambert wrote: > Very cool! Now I need a case with the proper metal work to match it > so that I can screw in cards from both sides of the riser... If you just want two PCI cards in a 1U case, the iXsystems 1390 has one normal and one low-profile PCI slot. Since most gigabit ethernet cards are low-profile except for the standard bracket, that might work. http://makeashorterlink.com/?J48A23C31 > I'd still like to find an 8-port hub on a PCI card... I think Broadcom makes the chips, but I don't know of any cards. -- Brooks --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --EVF5PPMfhYS0aIcm Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE9LNKgXY6L6fI4GtQRAinQAJ4kfhWZfJBg1heGXWMFxh6xKvuF2ACeMLyp JsTxu9NKXvr7/kuWJDPwKMQ= =Jjb5 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --EVF5PPMfhYS0aIcm-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 18: 3: 6 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF3AB37B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:03:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net (pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.122]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63EB443E5E for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:03:04 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0451.cvx22-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.199.196] helo=mindspring.com) by pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SSMC-00074x-00; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:02:57 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2CD8D7.9BC57E20@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:01:11 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brooks Davis Cc: Bakul Shah , a clever sheep , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers References: <200207102145.RAA18392@agamemnon.cnchost.com> <3D2CC561.44CE994B@mindspring.com> <20020710164242.A23510@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> <3D2CCDBC.40429B06@mindspring.com> <20020710173440.A29963@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Brooks Davis wrote: > If you just want two PCI cards in a 1U case, the iXsystems 1390 has one > normal and one low-profile PCI slot. Since most gigabit ethernet cards > are low-profile except for the standard bracket, that might work. > > http://makeashorterlink.com/?J48A23C31 Thanks! > > I'd still like to find an 8-port hub on a PCI card... > > I think Broadcom makes the chips, but I don't know of any cards. Everyone builds chips, no one builds cards using the chips... 8-(. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 18:20:39 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20A4C37B407 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:20:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.noos.fr (camus.noos.net [212.198.2.70]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A74F43E70 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:20:30 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@gits.dyndns.org) Received: (qmail 39761373 invoked by uid 0); 11 Jul 2002 01:20:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.229.153]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.70 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 11 Jul 2002 01:20:28 -0000 Received: from gits.gits.dyndns.org (e2epfxapzitoueop@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gits.gits.dyndns.org (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id g6B1KCTT083194; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 03:20:27 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from root@gits.dyndns.org) Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.gits.dyndns.org (8.12.5/8.12.5/Submit) id g6B0rKMo082878; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:53:20 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from root) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:53:20 +0200 From: Cyrille Lefevre To: Darren Pilgrim , Eric Anderson , freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Message-ID: <20020711005320.GG82744@gits.dyndns.org> Mail-Followup-To: Cyrille Lefevre , Darren Pilgrim , Eric Anderson , freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> <3D2B3B82.C50A263F@pantherdragon.org> <20020710233143.GA77112@gits.dyndns.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20020710233143.GA77112@gits.dyndns.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.99i Organization: ACME X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[< List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org message resent due to mta misconfigation. On Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 01:31:44AM +0200, Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 12:37:38PM -0700, Darren Pilgrim wrote: > > Eric Anderson wrote: > > > I have only indexed the /usr/share/doc and /usr/local/share directories on a > > > 4.6-RELEASE machine for now. After more tweaking is done, I'll increase the > > > index to cover more area, and add things like searching through mailing lists, > > > man pages, etc. > > > > /usr/src/* and /usr/ports/*/*/pkg-{comment,descr} would be good to have > ^^^^^^^^^^ http://lxr.linux.no/freebsd/source > also, in the past, there was htags/gtags somewhere in the base distro > but don't nkow where they gone ? Cyrille. -- Cyrille Lefevre mailto:cyrille.lefevre@laposte.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 21:40:34 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1756537B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:40:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail1.zer0.org (klapaucius.zer0.org [204.152.186.45]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B550243E4A for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:40:29 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gsutter@daemonnews.org) Received: by mail1.zer0.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id A1EF3239A05; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:40:29 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:40:29 -0700 From: Gregory Sutter To: Terry Lambert Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers Message-ID: <20020711044029.GB973@klapaucius.zer0.org> References: <20020710155003.GC500@malkavian.org> <3D2C9C2F.91398132@mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="S1BNGpv0yoYahz37" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3D2C9C2F.91398132@mindspring.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i Organization: daemonnews X-Purpose: For great justice! Mail-Copies-To: poster X-Message-Flag: Ditch this virus-ridden Outlook crap and get a real mailer! Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org --S1BNGpv0yoYahz37 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 2002-07-10 13:42 -0700, Terry Lambert wrote: >=20 > On a related note, I've been looking for a 1U case and riser that can > handle 2 cards (one right-side-up, the other up-side-down), i.e. the > cards go on opposite sides of the riser, with their connectors facing > each other: >=20 > riser > card 1 ---. ,--- card 2 > --------------- |-+-| --------------- > ---' | `--- > | > | | | > | | motherboard > ----------------+---+------------------------------ >=20 > Anyone seen something like this? Preferrably, both 32 and 64 bit > versions... The only one I've ever seen is this (see last item): http://bsdmall.eracks.com/eRacks/chassis I can vouch for the vendor, too. eRacks is a BSD friendly vendor and a hardware partner of Daemon News. They build excellent systems in any configuration you want, and also have a whole line of preinstalled, preconfigured servers for www service, firewalls, storage servers, database servers... I imagine in many cases the servers could be racked and ready with very little configuration. They get very specific; the web category, for example, has a zope server, a store server with ecommerce software, an ssl server with hardware crypto card, and a standard web server with webmin and webalizer preinstalled. When you use the above URL, bsdmall.eracks.com, rather than eRacks' base URL when you make a purchase, Daemon News gets credit for the referral. Greg --=20 Gregory S. Sutter mailto:gsutter@daemonnews.org Cheap Technologist http://daemonnews.org/ Daemon News, Inc. http://BSDmall.com/ --S1BNGpv0yoYahz37 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iD8DBQE9LQw9IBUx1YRd/t0RApm/AJ4jSzlsaa6Bm1+QNmpUdXxyR6Q+IACfQbtv O6OdwfzEIstHGjR+yi0E6ts= =xMop -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --S1BNGpv0yoYahz37-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 21:50:16 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50E6E37B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:50:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail1.zer0.org (klapaucius.zer0.org [204.152.186.45]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F18A43E8A for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:49:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gsutter@zer0.org) Received: by mail1.zer0.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 7CC74239A05; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:49:45 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:49:45 -0700 From: Gregory Sutter To: Brooks Davis Cc: Terry Lambert , Bakul Shah , a clever sheep , freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers Message-ID: <20020711044945.GC973@klapaucius.zer0.org> References: <200207102145.RAA18392@agamemnon.cnchost.com> <3D2CC561.44CE994B@mindspring.com> <20020710164242.A23510@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="RYJh/3oyKhIjGcML" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20020710164242.A23510@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i Organization: Zer0 X-Purpose: For great justice! Mail-Copies-To: poster X-Message-Flag: Ditch this virus-ridden Outlook crap and get a real mailer! Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org --RYJh/3oyKhIjGcML Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 2002-07-10 16:42 -0700, Brooks Davis wrote: > On Wed, Jul 10, 2002 at 04:38:09PM -0700, Terry Lambert wrote: > > Bakul Shah wrote: > > > > On a related note, I've been looking for a 1U case and riser that c= an > > > > handle 2 cards (one right-side-up, the other up-side-down), i.e. the > > > > cards go on opposite sides of the riser, with their connectors faci= ng > > > > each other: > > >=20 > > > Check out > > > http://www.adexelec.com/pci32.htm#PCITX4-1 > > > You can specify which side the connector is mounted on. > > > You'd probably want to either use a low power dissipating > > > card in the "component side down" position or use a higher > > > height riser. > >=20 > > Pretty cool. Now I need a case with the proper metal work to > > match it so that I can screw in cards from both sides of the riser... > > too bad it's only 32 bit, though. 8-(. >=20 > http://www.adexelec.com/pci64.htm#PCITX8-1 There are some cool risers on that site. Thanks for the references. I could have used some of these a year ago when I stupidly specified Intel EEAL motherboards in 1U cases for three systems and had to eat the cost of three cabled PCI risers to move the PCI slot over where it belonged. Also stupid are Intel for purposely making sure none of their "desktop series" boards will fit in 1U cases for one reason or another. The EPFV has that super-tall sound riser, EEAL the misplaced PCI slot... now I use Tyan (or eRacks) and everything just works. Well, except Intel heat sinks. :) Greg --=20 Gregory S. Sutter Only two things are infinite, the mailto:gsutter@zer0.org universe and human stupidity, and I'm http://www.zer0.org/~gsutter/ not sure about the former. hkp://wwwkeys.pgp.net/0x845DFEDD - Albert Einstein --RYJh/3oyKhIjGcML Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iD8DBQE9LQ5pIBUx1YRd/t0RAqUIAJ9/gIZEa8rPc5ONcTvNf/t+hEPkogCeKP1r IpeEyHYjkBF7NfDZbZNRNXE= =N/SE -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --RYJh/3oyKhIjGcML-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 21:57:20 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFA2937B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:57:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lariat.org (lariat.org [63.229.157.2]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1276D43E42 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:57:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brett@lariat.org) Received: from mustang.lariat.org (IDENT:ppp1000.lariat.org@lariat.org [63.229.157.2]) by lariat.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA00112; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:56:54 -0600 (MDT) X-message-flag: Warning! Use of Microsoft Outlook is dangerous and makes your system susceptible to Internet worms. Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20020710224442.030d2ba0@localhost> X-Sender: brett@localhost X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:56:49 -0600 To: Terry Lambert , From: Brett Glass Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers Cc: freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3D2C9C2F.91398132@mindspring.com> References: <20020710155003.GC500@malkavian.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org At 02:42 PM 7/10/2002, Terry Lambert wrote: >On a related note, I've been looking for a 1U case and riser that can >handle 2 cards (one right-side-up, the other up-side-down), i.e. the >cards go on opposite sides of the riser, with their connectors facing >each other: > > riser > card 1 ---. ,--- card 2 >--------------- |-+-| --------------- > ---' | `--- > | > | | | > | | motherboard >----------------+---+------------------------------ > >Anyone seen something like this? Preferrably, both 32 and 64 bit >versions... The Intel ISP1100 would fill the bill. Fits in 1U (though it's a DEEP 1U). You can find them on eBay or at Weird Stuff if you're in the Bay Area (which, as I recall, you are). Try to get one with at least a 700 MHz Pentium III. Works well with ECC DIMMs. Only catch is that one of the cards must be a "mini" PCI card. (The interface to the card is the same as PCI, but the bracket is shorter.) The BX chipset only supports UDMA-33, so you'll want to install a fast EIDE or SCSI card. I built one up recently.... Put a Promise Ultra100 into the full-sized slot (with Granite Digital Teflon cables -- they're the best!) and an Intel EtherExpress 100 card into the mini slot. I could have bought a short bracket for the NIC, but since they're hard to get (the form factor never caught on as a standard) I just used pliers and a nibbling tool to bend and cut the bracket that was already attached. System has worked perfectly 24x7 ever since. --Brett To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 22: 6:42 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1517D37B400; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:06:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from spork.pantherdragon.org (spork.pantherdragon.org [206.29.168.146]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9861F43E4A; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:06:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dmp@pantherdragon.org) Received: from spark.techno.pagans (spark.techno.pagans [4.61.202.145]) by spork.pantherdragon.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5159471DA; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:06:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pantherdragon.org (speck.techno.pagans [172.21.42.2]) by spark.techno.pagans (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD67AFDA0; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:06:36 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3D2D125C.16549995@pantherdragon.org> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:06:36 -0700 From: Darren Pilgrim X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Cyrille Lefevre Cc: Eric Anderson , freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine References: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> <3D2B3B82.C50A263F@pantherdragon.org> <20020710233143.GA77112@gits.dyndns.org> <20020711005320.GG82744@gits.dyndns.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > > message resent due to mta misconfigation. > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 01:31:44AM +0200, Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > > On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 12:37:38PM -0700, Darren Pilgrim wrote: > > > Eric Anderson wrote: > > > > I have only indexed the /usr/share/doc and /usr/local/share directories on a > > > > 4.6-RELEASE machine for now. After more tweaking is done, I'll increase the > > > > index to cover more area, and add things like searching through mailing lists, > > > > man pages, etc. > > > > > > /usr/src/* and /usr/ports/*/*/pkg-{comment,descr} would be good to have > > ^^^^^^^^^^ http://lxr.linux.no/freebsd/source That site only seems to have /usr/src/sys, not the full /usr/src, and is sorely outdated. My best guess, based on comparing $Id tags to cvsweb, is a cvs pull sometime between 4.0-R and 4.1-R. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Jul 10 22:24: 9 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E7B937B400 for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:24:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net (goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.18]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1586943E3B for ; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:24:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0153.cvx22-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.198.153] helo=mindspring.com) by goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SWQu-0001Y9-00; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:24:04 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2D1648.873FD0BA@mindspring.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:23:20 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Gregory Sutter Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2u freebsd box and riser card drivers References: <20020710155003.GC500@malkavian.org> <3D2C9C2F.91398132@mindspring.com> <20020711044029.GB973@klapaucius.zer0.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Gregory Sutter wrote: > The only one I've ever seen is this (see last item): > > http://bsdmall.eracks.com/eRacks/chassis > > I can vouch for the vendor, too. eRacks is a BSD friendly vendor > and a hardware partner of Daemon News. They build excellent > systems in any configuration you want, and also have a whole > line of preinstalled, preconfigured servers for www service, > firewalls, storage servers, database servers... I imagine in > many cases the servers could be racked and ready with very > little configuration. They get very specific; the web category, > for example, has a zope server, a store server with ecommerce > software, an ssl server with hardware crypto card, and a standard > web server with webmin and webalizer preinstalled. > > When you use the above URL, bsdmall.eracks.com, rather than > eRacks' base URL when you make a purchase, Daemon News gets > credit for the referral. THis would be incredibly cool... if the link were clickable so that it was possible to see what it would cost to buy the things. 8-). Thanks for the pointer! -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 0:13:19 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCB7B37B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:13:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from postfix3-2.free.fr (postfix3-2.free.fr [213.228.0.169]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B84F143E52 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:13:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rsidd@lpt.ens.fr) Received: from bluerondo.a.la.turk (nas-cbv-5-62-147-145-119.dial.proxad.net [62.147.145.119]) by postfix3-2.free.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1721618000 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 09:12:58 +0200 (CEST) Received: (qmail 437 invoked by uid 1001); 11 Jul 2002 07:12:55 -0000 Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 09:12:55 +0200 From: Rahul Siddharthan To: Terry Lambert Cc: Alexey Dokuchaev , Cy Schubert - CITS Open Systems Group , chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Package system wishlist Message-ID: <20020711071255.GA264@lpt.ens.fr> References: <20020710210509.GA686@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CA535.EC11BDA1@mindspring.com> <20020710213619.GA882@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CBAC4.6AC3CAC9@mindspring.com> <20020710230709.GA1512@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CC6A9.EB0F7995@mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3D2CC6A9.EB0F7995@mindspring.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.27i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.6-PRERELEASE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Terry Lambert said on Jul 10, 2002 at 16:43:37: > Rahul Siddharthan wrote: > > > I am refusing to go from 4.x to 5.x; or from 4.4 to 4.6. Whichever. > > > The important part is my refusal to change for the sake of change. > > > > Then you'd have to convince the FreeBSD security people to issue fixes > > for all branches, back to 1.0 or earlier, no? (Equivalently, to > > support version 4.4 until the year 2038.) I still don't see your > > argument for packaging components of the base system. A binary from > > FreeBSD 7.3 in 2006 is unlikely to work on your FreeBSD 4.4 system. > > > > Microsoft did support Windows 95 for a long time, but they have a > > rather less aggressive release schedule. > > No, all I'd have to convince them to do is release fixes for the > varios packages. I can install a different OpenSSH in my system, > if OpenSSH is just another component. All I have to care about is > binary backward compatability, and that's taken care of by the > dependency tracking. (a) You're still bitten by major incompatible changes in OpenSSH which could screw up your setup (config files etc, as you pointed out). (b) What about the C library, the toolkit, the rest of the "base" system? Would you like those to be packages too? In that case, I think gentoo linux's "portage" setup is just for you. The entire system is a collection of "ports" (or, to use their terminology, "ebuilds"), plus the kernel. I like it, but it's clear to me that I wouldn't trust such a thing on a server. It's for people who like the "bleeding edge" and such a terminology as "gentoo 1.2 + bugfixes" has no meaning: each component is upgraded separately to the point where it becomes gentoo 1.3, etc. Either you have nondisruptive bugfixes, or you have potentially disruptive upgrades. You can't have guaranteed-nondisruptive upgrades. And nondisruptive bugfixes are typically not supplied for outdated packages, so eventually you have to upgrade. In your example, you're at the mercy of not only the FreeBSD team but also the OpenSSH team. As of now, at least, we only depend on the FreeBSD team. - Rahul To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 1:41:34 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E75437B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:41:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net (harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.12]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97FB443E31 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:41:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0074.cvx22-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.198.74] helo=mindspring.com) by harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SZUU-0003qV-00; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:39:59 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2D4434.F96E2BD3@mindspring.com> Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:39:16 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Rahul Siddharthan Cc: Alexey Dokuchaev , Cy Schubert - CITS Open Systems Group , chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Package system wishlist References: <20020710210509.GA686@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CA535.EC11BDA1@mindspring.com> <20020710213619.GA882@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CBAC4.6AC3CAC9@mindspring.com> <20020710230709.GA1512@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CC6A9.EB0F7995@mindspring.com> <20020711071255.GA264@lpt.ens.fr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Rahul Siddharthan wrote: > > No, all I'd have to convince them to do is release fixes for the > > varios packages. I can install a different OpenSSH in my system, > > if OpenSSH is just another component. All I have to care about is > > binary backward compatability, and that's taken care of by the > > dependency tracking. > > (a) You're still bitten by major incompatible changes in OpenSSH which > could screw up your setup (config files etc, as you pointed out). Depends on how you handle configuration data. > (b) What about the C library, the toolkit, the rest of the "base" system? > Would you like those to be packages too? Yes. > In that case, I think gentoo linux's "portage" setup is just for you. > The entire system is a collection of "ports" (or, to use their > terminology, "ebuilds"), plus the kernel. I like it, but it's clear > to me that I wouldn't trust such a thing on a server. It's for people > who like the "bleeding edge" and such a terminology as "gentoo 1.2 + > bugfixes" has no meaning: each component is upgraded separately to the > point where it becomes gentoo 1.3, etc. I'm not talking about building, and I'm not talking about mismatching binaries, except as required for security/bug fixes (I'd rather have a mismatched OpenSSH than a broken OpenSSH). > Either you have nondisruptive bugfixes, or you have potentially > disruptive upgrades. For an Indian guy, you certainly have that Aristotilian mean of "IF A THEN NOT B" down for dividing the world into "all A or all B". ;^). > You can't have guaranteed-nondisruptive upgrades. Why not? You're forbidding it? Forgive me if I "disobey" you... 8-). > And nondisruptive bugfixes are typically not supplied for > outdated packages, so eventually you have to upgrade. In your > example, you're at the mercy of not only the FreeBSD team but also the > OpenSSH team. As of now, at least, we only depend on the FreeBSD > team. A bugfix for an "outdated package" is a "non-outdated package", not "A new version of the outdated package". We're already "at the mercy" of the third party software suppliers, as the recent OpenSSH vulnerability demonstrates. Just because something is a package doesn't remove it from the FreeBSD source tree, or maintenance by the FreeBSD team. Things don't have to live in binary floppy-sized lumps for them to be under CVS control in the FreeBSD CVS tree. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 2:35:11 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 241D237B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:35:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from postfix3-2.free.fr (postfix3-2.free.fr [213.228.0.169]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29F5843E64 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:35:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from rsidd@lpt.ens.fr) Received: from bluerondo.a.la.turk (nas-cbv-4-62-147-142-38.dial.proxad.net [62.147.142.38]) by postfix3-2.free.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 416DF18089 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:35:07 +0200 (CEST) Received: (qmail 2246 invoked by uid 1001); 11 Jul 2002 09:35:01 -0000 Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:35:01 +0200 From: Rahul Siddharthan To: Terry Lambert Cc: Alexey Dokuchaev , Cy Schubert - CITS Open Systems Group , chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Package system wishlist Message-ID: <20020711093501.GA2212@lpt.ens.fr> References: <20020710210509.GA686@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CA535.EC11BDA1@mindspring.com> <20020710213619.GA882@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CBAC4.6AC3CAC9@mindspring.com> <20020710230709.GA1512@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CC6A9.EB0F7995@mindspring.com> <20020711071255.GA264@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2D4434.F96E2BD3@mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3D2D4434.F96E2BD3@mindspring.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.27i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.6-PRERELEASE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Terry Lambert said on Jul 11, 2002 at 01:39:16: > > You can't have guaranteed-nondisruptive upgrades. > > Why not? You're forbidding it? Forgive me if I "disobey" you... Feel free - I'm sure users everywhere would be overjoyed :) R To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 3:47:46 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD65637B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 03:47:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from HAL9000.wox.org (12-233-156-170.client.attbi.com [12.233.156.170]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0395343E31 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 03:47:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dschultz@uclink.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from HAL9000.wox.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by HAL9000.wox.org (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6BAltUi002529; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 03:47:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dschultz@uclink.Berkeley.EDU) Received: (from das@localhost) by HAL9000.wox.org (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6BAlsIm002528; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 03:47:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dschultz@uclink.Berkeley.EDU) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 03:47:53 -0700 From: David Schultz To: Rahul Siddharthan Cc: Terry Lambert , Alexey Dokuchaev , Cy Schubert - CITS Open Systems Group , chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Package system wishlist Message-ID: <20020711104753.GA2428@HAL9000.wox.org> Mail-Followup-To: Rahul Siddharthan , Terry Lambert , Alexey Dokuchaev , Cy Schubert - CITS Open Systems Group , chat@FreeBSD.ORG References: <20020710210509.GA686@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CA535.EC11BDA1@mindspring.com> <20020710213619.GA882@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CBAC4.6AC3CAC9@mindspring.com> <20020710230709.GA1512@lpt.ens.fr> <3D2CC6A9.EB0F7995@mindspring.com> <20020711071255.GA264@lpt.ens.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20020711071255.GA264@lpt.ens.fr> Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Thus spake Rahul Siddharthan : > In that case, I think gentoo linux's "portage" setup is just for you. > The entire system is a collection of "ports" (or, to use their > terminology, "ebuilds"), plus the kernel. I like it, but it's clear > to me that I wouldn't trust such a thing on a server. It's for people > who like the "bleeding edge" and such a terminology as "gentoo 1.2 + > bugfixes" has no meaning: each component is upgraded separately to the > point where it becomes gentoo 1.3, etc. This is one of the things that most annoys me about most Linux distributions. You often have to specify the distribution and version you're running, the kernel version, the kernel patches you happen to be using, the glibc version(s) you have, and the versions of the relevant chunks of userland. (What did I miss?) With FreeBSD, you get The Operating System, version $foo.$bar. It is an excellent development environment because the components are well-integrated and well-documented, and you don't have to hunt for third-party software that may not work as expected straight out of the box. For this reason, I value having most of the software I use included in the base system. If I had religious beliefs about qmail, for example, I would still support keeping sendmail in the base system for the sake of that principle. The downside to an integrated userland is elucidated in this thread. People are always bitching about the colors of various bike sheds and screaming `POLA!' every time something is changed. The fact of the matter is that it's possible to upgrade across several releases with few surprises, and that's pretty damn good. I imagine this list would be much quieter if the folks who expect every software change to be agreeable to them stopped upgrading or switched to Linux. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 6:13:22 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8413B37B400; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 06:13:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy.centtech.com (moat.centtech.com [206.196.95.10]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF95843E09; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 06:13:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from anderson@centtech.com) Received: from sprint.centtech.com (sprint.centtech.com [10.177.173.31]) by proxy.centtech.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6BD9T127890; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:09:29 -0500 (CDT) Received: (from root@localhost) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) id g6BD9Tp05188; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:09:29 -0500 (CDT) Received: from centtech.com (proton [10.177.173.77]) by sprint.centtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6BD9Q905181; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:09:26 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3D2D8386.5533CAE3@centtech.com> Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:09:26 -0500 From: Eric Anderson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.2 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Cyrille Lefevre Cc: Darren Pilgrim , freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine References: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> <3D2B3B82.C50A263F@pantherdragon.org> <20020710233143.GA77112@gits.dyndns.org> <20020711005320.GG82744@gits.dyndns.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS perl-11 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > > > /usr/src/* and /usr/ports/*/*/pkg-{comment,descr} would be good to have > > ^^^^^^^^^^ http://lxr.linux.no/freebsd/source > > also, in the past, there was htags/gtags somewhere in the base distro > > but don't nkow where they gone ? Why would you want /usr/src/* indexed? What would you be looking for? Eric -- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Eric Anderson Systems Administrator Centaur Technology He who laughs last didn't get the joke. ------------------------------------------------------------------ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 8:11:37 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79F9837B400; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:11:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pilchuck.reedmedia.net (pilchuck.reedmedia.net [209.166.74.74]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF45143E52; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:11:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from reed@reedmedia.net) Received: from reed by pilchuck.reedmedia.net with local-esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17SfbG-00038R-00; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:11:22 -0700 Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:11:22 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jeremy C. Reed" To: Eric Anderson Cc: freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine In-Reply-To: <3D2D8386.5533CAE3@centtech.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > Why would you want /usr/src/* indexed? What would you be looking for? This reminds me of Rich Morin's Meta Project. It indexes man pages, source, and other "metadata" that can be browsed, searched with keywords, regular expression searches(?). But the demo seems broken at this moment. http://www.cfcl.com/Meta/mdinfo.html Jeremy C. Reed ------------------------------------------------------------------- BSD news and BSD info and BSD links http://www.bsdnewsletter.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 10:43:40 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E93337B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:43:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from duey.wolves.k12.mo.us (duey.wolves.k12.mo.us [207.160.214.9]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AC7643E3B for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:43:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us) Received: from duey.wolves.k12.mo.us (cdillon@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by duey.wolves.k12.mo.us (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id g6BHhZTn012597; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:43:35 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us) Received: from localhost (cdillon@localhost) by duey.wolves.k12.mo.us (8.12.5/8.12.5/Submit) with ESMTP id g6BHhZu6012594; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:43:35 -0500 (CDT) X-Authentication-Warning: duey.wolves.k12.mo.us: cdillon owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:43:35 -0500 (CDT) From: Chris Dillon To: Terry Lambert Cc: rsi@panix.com, Thierry Herbelot , Subject: Re: Listening to users [was Re: Package system wishlist] In-Reply-To: <3D2CC4D8.C3D5A9ED@mindspring.com> Message-ID: <20020711123833.D11681-100000@duey.wolves.k12.mo.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Wed, 10 Jul 2002, Terry Lambert wrote: > Redirected from -arch... > > Rajappa Iyer wrote: > > Also note that FreeBSD, by and large, does not have > > nearly as many incompatible changes to the device driver interface. > > You haven't tried to write a PCI card driver lately, have you? > > "It's still quite opaque to me" [...snip...] ROFL. You should have mentioned this is sung to the tune of Billy Joel's "It's Still Rock And Roll To Me". Hopefully enough people will figure it out. Did you write that yourself? :-) -- Chris Dillon - cdillon(at)wolves.k12.mo.us - cdillon(at)inter-linc.net FreeBSD: The fastest and most stable server OS on the planet - Available for IA32 (Intel x86) and Alpha architectures - IA64, PowerPC, UltraSPARC, ARM, and S/390 under development - http://www.freebsd.org No trees were harmed in the composition of this message, although some electrons were mildly inconvenienced. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 10:51:40 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4C3E37B400; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:51:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from HAL9000.wox.org (12-233-156-170.client.attbi.com [12.233.156.170]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AE8D43E58; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:51:37 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dschultz@uclink.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from HAL9000.wox.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by HAL9000.wox.org (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6BHplGR000676; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:51:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dschultz@uclink.Berkeley.EDU) Received: (from das@localhost) by HAL9000.wox.org (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6BHpkLi000675; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:51:46 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dschultz@uclink.Berkeley.EDU) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:51:46 -0700 From: David Schultz To: "Jeremy C. Reed" Cc: Eric Anderson , freebsd-doc@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Message-ID: <20020711175145.GA638@HAL9000.wox.org> Mail-Followup-To: "Jeremy C. Reed" , Eric Anderson , freebsd-doc@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG References: <3D2D8386.5533CAE3@centtech.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Thus spake Jeremy C. Reed : > > Why would you want /usr/src/* indexed? What would you be looking for? > > This reminds me of Rich Morin's Meta Project. It indexes man pages, > source, and other "metadata" that can be browsed, searched with keywords, > regular expression searches(?). But the demo seems broken at this > moment. > > http://www.cfcl.com/Meta/mdinfo.html I think a special-purpose search engine would be better suited for indexing source code. There are different considerations for how queries ought to be matched, and other important differences between C and English. For example, if I entered `mmap', the most relevant result ought to be the implementation of mmap(), not the dozens of uses of it. And of course, cross-referencing would be a boon. Then again, just about anything is better than the way I presently search /usr/src, namely recursive grep. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 11: 7:53 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A82137B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:07:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.noos.fr (camus.noos.net [212.198.2.70]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 375B943E09 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:07:47 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@gits.dyndns.org) Received: (qmail 40100347 invoked by uid 0); 11 Jul 2002 18:07:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.229.153]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.70 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 11 Jul 2002 18:07:45 -0000 Received: from gits.gits.dyndns.org (i85tz2v33npwh1ex@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gits.gits.dyndns.org (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id g6BI7eTL020538; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 20:07:40 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from root@gits.dyndns.org) Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.gits.dyndns.org (8.12.5/8.12.5/Submit) id g6BI7eYF020537; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 20:07:40 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from root) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 20:07:39 +0200 From: Cyrille Lefevre To: Darren Pilgrim Cc: Eric Anderson , freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Message-ID: <20020711180739.GB12246@gits.dyndns.org> Mail-Followup-To: Cyrille Lefevre , Darren Pilgrim , Eric Anderson , freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> <3D2B3B82.C50A263F@pantherdragon.org> <20020710233143.GA77112@gits.dyndns.org> <20020711005320.GG82744@gits.dyndns.org> <3D2D125C.16549995@pantherdragon.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3D2D125C.16549995@pantherdragon.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.99i Organization: ACME X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[< List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Wed, Jul 10, 2002 at 10:06:36PM -0700, Darren Pilgrim wrote: > On Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 01:31:44AM +0200, Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > > On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 12:37:38PM -0700, Darren Pilgrim wrote: > > > Eric Anderson wrote: > > > > I have only indexed the /usr/share/doc and /usr/local/share directories on a > > > > 4.6-RELEASE machine for now. After more tweaking is done, I'll increase the > > > > index to cover more area, and add things like searching through mailing lists, > > > > man pages, etc. > > > > > > /usr/src/* and /usr/ports/*/*/pkg-{comment,descr} would be good to have > > ^^^^^^^^^^ http://lxr.linux.no/freebsd/source > > That site only seems to have /usr/src/sys, not the full /usr/src, and > is sorely outdated. My best guess, based on comparing $Id tags to > cvsweb, is a cvs pull sometime between 4.0-R and 4.1-R. maybe the site is obsolete, but not the `lrx' project as well as the `bonsai' project which may be linked to. http://cvs.gnome.org/ http://www.mozilla.org/tools.html the advantage of `lrx' over `cvsweb' is the indexation. Cyrille. -- Cyrille Lefevre mailto:cyrille.lefevre@laposte.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 11:10: 4 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4740D37B401 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:09:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.noos.fr (racine.noos.net [212.198.2.71]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF54343E31 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:09:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@gits.dyndns.org) Received: (qmail 24994143 invoked by uid 0); 11 Jul 2002 18:09:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.229.153]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.71 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 11 Jul 2002 18:09:56 -0000 Received: from gits.gits.dyndns.org (2uurjx9uje5ewhqv@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gits.gits.dyndns.org (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id g6BI9tTL020554; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 20:09:55 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from root@gits.dyndns.org) Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.gits.dyndns.org (8.12.5/8.12.5/Submit) id g6BI9sIX020553; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 20:09:54 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from root) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 20:09:54 +0200 From: Cyrille Lefevre To: Eric Anderson Cc: Darren Pilgrim , freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Message-ID: <20020711180954.GC12246@gits.dyndns.org> Mail-Followup-To: Cyrille Lefevre , Eric Anderson , Darren Pilgrim , freebsd-doc@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> <3D2B3B82.C50A263F@pantherdragon.org> <20020710233143.GA77112@gits.dyndns.org> <20020711005320.GG82744@gits.dyndns.org> <3D2D8386.5533CAE3@centtech.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3D2D8386.5533CAE3@centtech.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.99i Organization: ACME X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[< List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 08:09:26AM -0500, Eric Anderson wrote: > Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > > > > /usr/src/* and /usr/ports/*/*/pkg-{comment,descr} would be good to have > > > ^^^^^^^^^^ http://lxr.linux.no/freebsd/source > > > also, in the past, there was htags/gtags somewhere in the base distro > > > but don't nkow where they gone ? > > Why would you want /usr/src/* indexed? What would you be looking for? I don't, but sometime, it would be interresting to have them indexed. Cyrille. -- Cyrille Lefevre mailto:cyrille.lefevre@laposte.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 12:24:41 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FCE637B400; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:24:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from columbus.cris.net (columbus.cris.net [212.110.128.65]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDC5343E09; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:24:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from phantom@ark.cris.net) Received: from ark.cris.net (root@ark.cris.net [212.110.128.68]) by columbus.cris.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA02003; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:24:27 +0300 (EEST) Received: (from phantom@localhost) by ark.cris.net (8.11.1/8.11.1) id g6BJORC78845; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:24:27 +0300 (EEST) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:24:27 +0300 From: Alexey Zelkin To: Cyrille Lefevre Cc: Darren Pilgrim , Eric Anderson , freebsd-doc@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Message-ID: <20020711222427.A78724@ark.cris.net> References: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> <3D2B3B82.C50A263F@pantherdragon.org> <20020710233143.GA77112@gits.dyndns.org> <20020711005320.GG82744@gits.dyndns.org> <3D2D125C.16549995@pantherdragon.org> <20020711180739.GB12246@gits.dyndns.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: <20020711180739.GB12246@gits.dyndns.org>; from cyrille.lefevre@laposte.net on Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 08:07:39PM +0200 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.5-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org hi, On Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 08:07:39PM +0200, Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > On Wed, Jul 10, 2002 at 10:06:36PM -0700, Darren Pilgrim wrote: > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 01:31:44AM +0200, Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > > > On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 12:37:38PM -0700, Darren Pilgrim wrote: > > > > Eric Anderson wrote: > > > > > I have only indexed the /usr/share/doc and /usr/local/share directories on a > > > > > 4.6-RELEASE machine for now. After more tweaking is done, I'll increase the > > > > > index to cover more area, and add things like searching through mailing lists, > > > > > man pages, etc. > > > > > > > > /usr/src/* and /usr/ports/*/*/pkg-{comment,descr} would be good to have > > > ^^^^^^^^^^ http://lxr.linux.no/freebsd/source > > > > That site only seems to have /usr/src/sys, not the full /usr/src, and > > is sorely outdated. My best guess, based on comparing $Id tags to > > cvsweb, is a cvs pull sometime between 4.0-R and 4.1-R. > > maybe the site is obsolete, but not the `lrx' project as well as > the `bonsai' project which may be linked to. > > http://cvs.gnome.org/ > http://www.mozilla.org/tools.html > > the advantage of `lrx' over `cvsweb' is the indexation. Take a look to http://snapshots.jp.freebsd.org/tour/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 13:15:21 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6AF037B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 13:15:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp05.wxs.nl (smtp05.wxs.nl [195.121.6.57]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA6E643E5E for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 13:15:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-reply@akruijff.dds.nl) Received: from cybertron.kruijff ([213.10.151.186]) by smtp05.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 4.15) with ESMTP id GZ3PLF02.39C; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:15:15 +0200 Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:14:59 +0200 From: Alex X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.53d) Reply-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <12439696180.20020711221459@dds.nl> To: "sagacious" Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re[2]: Next problem. In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Thursday, July 11, 2002, 9:55:21 PM, you wrote: >> -get your cable box descrambler at unixhideout for a competitive price! >> http://www.unixhideout.com/pub/shop/index.php s> It's best not to include things like that in your .sig. s> 1: Other people do it, when i see it in the rules, ill stop, when i see s> other people not do it, i'll stop. It's not like im spamming, You are the s> first to complain. And FYI the cable boxes are not illegal, what you do with s> them is your business. I am making a absolute killing on them, so it cant be s> all wrong. It's just two lines letting people know about my site which FYI s> is 95% dedicated to FreeBSD. s> 2: Can you help me with my problem i posted? or did you just rip that out of s> the email and whine about my sig before even reading my problem. =[ s> To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org s> with "unsubscribe freebsd-questions" in the body of the message Dear sagacious, I agree with you. Its a small link which doesn't take up much space. I would feel different when it was something large. This conversation, however, is better at home at freebsd-chat. -- Best regards, Alex The FreeBSD handbook http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/index.html To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 13:52: 2 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B79837B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 13:51:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from shale.csir.co.za (shale.csir.co.za [146.64.46.5]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A707043E09 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 13:51:55 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from reg@shale.csir.co.za) Received: (from reg@localhost) by shale.csir.co.za (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g6BKpn700109 for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:51:50 +0200 (SAT) (envelope-from reg) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:51:49 +0200 From: Jeremy Lea To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Value of chocolate wrappers... Message-ID: <20020711225149.B89014@shale.csir.co.za> Mail-Followup-To: Jeremy Lea , freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5.1i Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi, My VAIO decided a few days ago that it was tired of seeing mains power, and would rather use my battery... All the signs pointed to a loose connection somewhere in the power line (intermittent fault, works if you jiggle things, etc.). While I've got a nice big battery, you really need to see power once in a while, so I rushed the machine off to Sony to have a look. They phoned me a day later, with a quote for just under $1000 to replace the mainboard. The machine (a 505TR) only cost $1400, and second hand ones sell for ~$600 on eBay... So I fetched the machine back, but was feeling rather down, because I don't want to have to buy a new laptop at the moment. Still thinking it was a loose connection, and having $1000 to gain, I stuffed a bit of foil from a choclate wrapper into the central hole on the power plug... So far so good :-) Tomorrow I will seek a more long term solution. As one of the girls I work with is fond of saying: "If chocolate is the answer the problem is irrelevant!" Regards, -Jeremy -- FreeBSD - Because the best things in life are free... http://www.freebsd.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 14:20: 3 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D8CC37B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 14:19:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net (goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.18]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A864643E09 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 14:19:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0622.cvx40-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([216.244.44.112] helo=mindspring.com) by goose.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SlLo-0005H5-00; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 14:19:48 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2DF648.4B2C7769@mindspring.com> Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 14:19:04 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Chris Dillon Cc: rsi@panix.com, Thierry Herbelot , chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Listening to users [was Re: Package system wishlist] References: <20020711123833.D11681-100000@duey.wolves.k12.mo.us> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Chris Dillon wrote: > On Wed, 10 Jul 2002, Terry Lambert wrote: > > Redirected from -arch... > > > > Rajappa Iyer wrote: > > > Also note that FreeBSD, by and large, does not have > > > nearly as many incompatible changes to the device driver interface. > > > > You haven't tried to write a PCI card driver lately, have you? > > > > "It's still quite opaque to me" > [...snip...] > > ROFL. You should have mentioned this is sung to the tune of Billy > Joel's "It's Still Rock And Roll To Me". Hopefully enough people will > figure it out. Did you write that yourself? :-) Yes, I wrote it myself. I didn't get to cover ACPI or anything, though. Took me about 10 minutes, total (I always "hear" alternate versions of all songs anyway. 8-)). I didn't mention that it was a Billy Joel, because anyone who hadn't heard the Billy Joel wouldn't find it funny, I think; they'd just look at me like I was insane.... uh, *more* insane... -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 17: 8: 1 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A0B737B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 17:07:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from duey.wolves.k12.mo.us (duey.wolves.k12.mo.us [207.160.214.9]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBFE643E54 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 17:07:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us) Received: from duey.wolves.k12.mo.us (cdillon@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by duey.wolves.k12.mo.us (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id g6C07vTn013812; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 19:07:57 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us) Received: from localhost (cdillon@localhost) by duey.wolves.k12.mo.us (8.12.5/8.12.5/Submit) with ESMTP id g6C07uF2013809; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 19:07:56 -0500 (CDT) X-Authentication-Warning: duey.wolves.k12.mo.us: cdillon owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 19:07:56 -0500 (CDT) From: Chris Dillon To: Terry Lambert Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Listening to users [was Re: Package system wishlist] In-Reply-To: <3D2DF648.4B2C7769@mindspring.com> Message-ID: <20020711190542.D13803-100000@duey.wolves.k12.mo.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Thu, 11 Jul 2002, Terry Lambert wrote: > Yes, I wrote it myself. I didn't get to cover ACPI or anything, > though. Took me about 10 minutes, total (I always "hear" alternate > versions of all songs anyway. 8-)). > > I didn't mention that it was a Billy Joel, because anyone who hadn't > heard the Billy Joel wouldn't find it funny, I think; they'd just > look at me like I was insane.... uh, *more* insane... As always, this kind of thing is a fortune(6) candidate. :-) -- Chris Dillon - cdillon(at)wolves.k12.mo.us - cdillon(at)inter-linc.net FreeBSD: The fastest and most stable server OS on the planet - Available for IA32 (Intel x86) and Alpha architectures - IA64, PowerPC, UltraSPARC, ARM, and S/390 under development - http://www.freebsd.org No trees were harmed in the composition of this message, although some electrons were mildly inconvenienced. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 17:28:54 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF31037B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 17:28:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.noos.fr (lafontaine.noos.net [212.198.2.72]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BDDF43E64 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 17:28:50 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from root@gits.dyndns.org) Received: (qmail 14555319 invoked by uid 0); 12 Jul 2002 00:28:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gits.gits.dyndns.org) ([212.198.229.153]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.72 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 12 Jul 2002 00:28:48 -0000 Received: from gits.gits.dyndns.org (4yko9f2ug957b5gb@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gits.gits.dyndns.org (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id g6C0SlTL026114; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 02:28:48 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from root@gits.dyndns.org) Received: (from root@localhost) by gits.gits.dyndns.org (8.12.5/8.12.5/Submit) id g6C0Slus026113; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 02:28:47 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from root) Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 02:28:47 +0200 From: Cyrille Lefevre To: Alexey Zelkin Cc: Darren Pilgrim , Eric Anderson , freebsd-doc@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine Message-ID: <20020712002847.GN21234@gits.dyndns.org> Mail-Followup-To: Cyrille Lefevre , Alexey Zelkin , Darren Pilgrim , Eric Anderson , freebsd-doc@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG References: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> <3D2B3B82.C50A263F@pantherdragon.org> <20020710233143.GA77112@gits.dyndns.org> <20020711005320.GG82744@gits.dyndns.org> <3D2D125C.16549995@pantherdragon.org> <20020711180739.GB12246@gits.dyndns.org> <20020711222427.A78724@ark.cris.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20020711222427.A78724@ark.cris.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.99i Organization: ACME X-Face: V|+c;4!|B?E%BE^{E6);aI.[< List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 10:24:27PM +0300, Alexey Zelkin wrote: [snip] > Take a look to http://snapshots.jp.freebsd.org/tour/ that's it, thanks. doesn't devel/global part of FreeBSD for some times in the past ? I'm asking since references to g/htags exists in sys.mk since 2.2.2... Cyrille. -- Cyrille Lefevre mailto:cyrille.lefevre@laposte.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 17:57:14 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5D2437B40F for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 17:56:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net (avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 701F343E3B for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 17:56:57 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0622.cvx40-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([216.244.44.112] helo=mindspring.com) by avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17Sojs-0001iO-00; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 17:56:53 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2E28D6.A944F294@mindspring.com> Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 17:54:46 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Chris Dillon Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Listening to users [was Re: Package system wishlist] References: <20020711190542.D13803-100000@duey.wolves.k12.mo.us> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Chris Dillon wrote: > As always, this kind of thing is a fortune(6) candidate. :-) Gee, if you're going to be all appreciative and all... "EarthLink Thumping" Terry Lambert (to the tune of "Tub Thumping" by Chumbawumba) We'll be clicking When we're surfing We'll be clicking I get logged out But I log in again You're never going to keep me out Pissing my time away He clicks an eBay link He clicks a Slashdot link He clicks a Yahoo link He clicks a Hotmail link He surfs the sites that remind him of the good times He surfs the sites that remind him he's got not T1 line: "Oh SPAM me more, SPAM me more..." I get logged out But I log in again You're never going to keep me out Pissing my time away He clicks an eBay link He clicks a Slashdot link He clicks a Yahoo link He clicks a Hotmail link He surfs the sites that remind him of the good times He surfs the sites that remind him he's got no T1 line: "Don't cry for me, EarthLink owns me..." I get logged out But I log in again You're never going to keep me out We'll be clicking When we're surfing We'll be clicking -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 18:28: 1 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6F2437B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 18:27:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fep3.cogeco.net (smtp.cogeco.net [216.221.81.25]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2727B43E42 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 18:27:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from dan@scoobysnax.jaded.net) Received: from scoobysnax.jaded.net (d141-7-230.home.cgocable.net [24.141.7.230]) by fep3.cogeco.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BDC52278; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 21:27:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from scoobysnax.jaded.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by scoobysnax.jaded.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6C1RtFa002895; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 21:27:56 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from dan@scoobysnax.jaded.net) Received: (from dan@localhost) by scoobysnax.jaded.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6C1Rrbm002894; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 21:27:53 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from dan) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Dan Moschuk To: Terry Lambert Subject: Re: Listening to users [was Re: Package system wishlist] Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 21:27:53 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.4.2 References: <20020711190542.D13803-100000@duey.wolves.k12.mo.us> <3D2E28D6.A944F294@mindspring.com> In-Reply-To: <3D2E28D6.A944F294@mindspring.com> Cc: chat@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <200207112127.53246.dan@FreeBSD.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On July 11, 2002 08:54 pm, Terry Lambert wrote: | Chris Dillon wrote: | > As always, this kind of thing is a fortune(6) candidate. :-) | | Gee, if you're going to be all appreciative and all... Terry if I had your freetime I would have taken over the world by now. :-) -Dan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 18:31:11 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AE2C37B400; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 18:31:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net (avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B011343E54; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 18:31:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from pool0483.cvx21-bradley.dialup.earthlink.net ([209.179.193.228] helo=mindspring.com) by avocet.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17SpH2-0004GE-00; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 18:31:08 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2E30CE.2E23F7A0@mindspring.com> Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 18:28:46 -0700 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Sony} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dan Moschuk Cc: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Listening to users [was Re: Package system wishlist] References: <20020711190542.D13803-100000@duey.wolves.k12.mo.us> <3D2E28D6.A944F294@mindspring.com> <200207112127.53246.dan@FreeBSD.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Dan Moschuk wrote: > On July 11, 2002 08:54 pm, Terry Lambert wrote: > | Chris Dillon wrote: > | > As always, this kind of thing is a fortune(6) candidate. :-) > | > | Gee, if you're going to be all appreciative and all... > > Terry if I had your freetime I would have taken over the world by > now. :-) Less than 10 minutes. Honest. -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Jul 11 20:37:32 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0B2837B400 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 20:37:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.57.11]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A672143E09 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 20:37:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ackohno@mail.ru) Received: from rhhe-91.cablemd.2w.s11.int1.comporium.net ([204.116.8.91] helo=mail.ru) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp (Exim SMTP.1) id 17SrFG-000OBy-00; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:37:27 +0400 Message-ID: <3D2E4F53.4030201@mail.ru> Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 23:38:59 -0400 From: Stephen James User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020702 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Terry Lambert Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Listening to users [was Re: Package system wishlist] References: <20020711190542.D13803-100000@duey.wolves.k12.mo.us> <3D2E28D6.A944F294@mindspring.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Terry Lambert wrote: >Chris Dillon wrote: > > >>As always, this kind of thing is a fortune(6) candidate. :-) >> >> > >Gee, if you're going to be all appreciative and all... > > "EarthLink Thumping" > Terry Lambert > (to the tune of "Tub Thumping" by Chumbawumba) > > We'll be clicking > When we're surfing > We'll be clicking > > I get logged out > But I log in again > You're never going to keep me out > > Pissing my time away > > He clicks an eBay link > He clicks a Slashdot link > He clicks a Yahoo link > He clicks a Hotmail link > He surfs the sites that remind him of the good times > He surfs the sites that remind him he's got not T1 line: > > "Oh SPAM me more, SPAM me more..." > > I get logged out > But I log in again > You're never going to keep me out > > Pissing my time away > > He clicks an eBay link > He clicks a Slashdot link > He clicks a Yahoo link > He clicks a Hotmail link > He surfs the sites that remind him of the good times > He surfs the sites that remind him he's got no T1 line: > > "Don't cry for me, EarthLink owns me..." > > I get logged out > But I log in again > You're never going to keep me out > > We'll be clicking > When we're surfing > We'll be clicking > >-- Terry > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message > > > > Hehehe! I love it, I used to be on Earthlink, I know what you're saying; got cut off every ten minutes it seemed like. Cable has saved me though :o) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Fri Jul 12 6:56:55 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5596F37B401 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:56:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from minix.nailed.org (syr-66-67-110-226.twcny.rr.com [66.67.110.226]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDBBE43E42 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:56:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jontow@minix.nailed.org) Received: by minix.nailed.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 0B7AF7526; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 09:56:51 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 09:56:51 -0400 From: Jonathan Towne To: "Dmitriy M. Reznitskiy" Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD 1.1.5.1-Release Message-ID: <20020712095651.C1529@bd.local> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: ; from rezdm@cyber.miem.edu.ru on Tue, Jul 02, 2002 at 12:59:02PM +0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, Jul 02, 2002 at 12:59:02PM +0400, Dmitriy M. Reznitskiy scribbled: # # Hello. # # If someone wants to download this first release, # http://cyber.miem.edu.ru/~rezdm/disk2/1.1.5.1-RELEASE.tgz Just out of curiosity, did anyone grab this, while it was up? The host seems to be down now; I've been trying off and on for around 3-4 days, and I'd like this for archival reasons :) - Jonathan Towne To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Fri Jul 12 8:28:19 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C061037B400 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:28:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gldis.ca (constans.gldis.ca [216.187.105.233]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DD8E43E65 for ; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:28:17 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gldisater@gldis.ca) Received: from gldis.ca (gldisater@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gldis.ca (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6CFS5L3000430; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:28:05 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from gldisater@gldis.ca) Received: (from gldisater@localhost) by gldis.ca (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6CFS5e1000429; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:28:05 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:28:05 -0400 From: Jeremy Faulkner To: Jonathan Towne Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD 1.1.5.1-Release Message-ID: <20020712112805.A417@constans.gldis.ca> References: <20020712095651.C1529@bd.local> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20020712095651.C1529@bd.local>; from jontow@twcny.rr.com on Fri, Jul 12, 2002 at 09:56:51AM -0400 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Fri, Jul 12, 2002 at 09:56:51AM -0400, Jonathan Towne wrote: > On Tue, Jul 02, 2002 at 12:59:02PM +0400, Dmitriy M. Reznitskiy scribbled: > # > # Hello. > # > # If someone wants to download this first release, > # http://cyber.miem.edu.ru/~rezdm/disk2/1.1.5.1-RELEASE.tgz > > Just out of curiosity, did anyone grab this, while it was up? > > The host seems to be down now; I've been trying off and on for > around 3-4 days, and I'd like this for archival reasons :) > > - Jonathan Towne http://www.gldis.ca/gldisater/oldnix/1.1.5.1-RELEASE.tgz -- Jeremy Faulkner http://www.gldis.ca To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Jul 13 23:49:19 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE59737B405 for ; Sat, 13 Jul 2002 23:49:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail501.nifty.com (mail501.nifty.com [202.248.37.209]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06FBA43E42 for ; Sat, 13 Jul 2002 23:49:16 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from hiroo@oikumene.gcd.org) Received: from chrysanthe.oikumene.gcd.org by mail501.nifty.com (8.12.4/3.7W-02/25/02) with SMTP id g6E6lBE2013039 for ; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 15:47:11 +0900 Received: (qmail 3034 invoked from network); 14 Jul 2002 06:47:10 -0000 Received: from barleycoren.oikumene.gcd.org (hiroo@192.168.0.11) by mail.oikumene.gcd.org with SMTP; 14 Jul 2002 06:47:10 -0000 Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 15:47:10 +0900 Message-ID: <86fzymajrl.wl@barleycoren.oikumene.gcd.org> From: Hiroo Ono To: Cyrille Lefevre Cc: freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Beta FreeBSD search engine In-Reply-To: <20020712002847.GN21234@gits.dyndns.org> References: <3D2B0BE4.89600B8B@centtech.com> <3D2B3B82.C50A263F@pantherdragon.org> <20020710233143.GA77112@gits.dyndns.org> <20020711005320.GG82744@gits.dyndns.org> <3D2D125C.16549995@pantherdragon.org> <20020711180739.GB12246@gits.dyndns.org> <20020711222427.A78724@ark.cris.net> <20020712002847.GN21234@gits.dyndns.org> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.8.1 (Something) SEMI/1.14.3 (Ushinoya) FLIM/1.14.3 (=?ISO-8859-4?Q?Unebigory=F2mae?=) APEL/10.3 Emacs/21.2 (i386--freebsd) MULE/5.0 (SAKAKI) MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.3 - "Ushinoya") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org At Fri, 12 Jul 2002 02:28:47 +0200, Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > doesn't devel/global part of FreeBSD for some times in the past ? > I'm asking since references to g/htags exists in sys.mk since 2.2.2... Yes, it was. See, http://www.FreeBSD.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/contrib/global/Attic/ seems to have been removed from the base system 20 months ago. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message