From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Nov 16 0:48: 1 1999 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from taurus.oursc.k12.ar.us (taurus.oursc.k12.ar.us [165.29.134.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5F9114EC6 for ; Tue, 16 Nov 1999 00:47:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from erickw@taurus.oursc.k12.ar.us) Received: from localhost (erickw@localhost) by taurus.oursc.k12.ar.us (8.9.0/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA27208; Tue, 16 Nov 1999 03:53:49 -0600 Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 03:53:49 -0600 (CST) From: Erick White To: David Schwartz Cc: Joseph Scott , walton@nordicrecords.com, freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: Judge: "Gates Was Main Culprit" In-Reply-To: <000001bf3004$979c2b60$021d85d1@youwant.to> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Let me explain this to you yet again. I am not saying people are stupid. Once again I say people are Miss-Informed. The do not know all the facts. People in general that is. I dont know how much plainer I can be on these issues, or how any one else can be. Me, no I am not going to save the world from their stupidity, I dont think anyone can do that. The world of mankind is after all in the process of killing itself despite information of what it is doing. I am not saying that FreeBSD is the answer, or Linux , I am saying that Microsoft is wrong. You attempt to draw away from my reasoning by attacking my character. I am not saying that I and I emphasize NOT SAYING I am going to save people from their stupidity. For the last several days we have been beating our heads against the proverbial brick wall in trying to reason with someone who refuses to see reason. It is not just I that has seen through Microsofts sham! We are not saying we are smarter than the rest of you. What others here, and I myself, are trying to do is get you to open your eyes to what they have truly been doing. Those here are not saying were smarter, we are as a whole saying that we see the truth what is going on which anyone can see, not that their stupid, just that they dont have all the facts. You however, sir, seem to be ignoring the facts presented before you and still fight against the truths. I admit that I dont always choose the right words in order to bring my point across. I might not always be the most tactful person, but I do know what is there, and when someone is being misled. > >Research? The field test their products not even fully finish the > >job to begin with in the programming department. Their not spending their > money by and large on research, their using it to cannibalize other > >threats to their products, and then crush them into powder as the company > >throws its money behind it. Their letting other companies do the research > >for them, then they try to crush them once they see what they need for a > >bare minimum to drive out the competition with a cat o nine tails. What > >they have been doing, and doing for YEARS is letting the competition test > >the waters, once it realizes that it is a threat it comes up with a >> "solution" for what it did not think up did not create, and then continues >> on its merry way.. Nuh Uh.. not good.... Reread your facts. > Yes, that's extremely efficient. That way they (and their customers) get >the benefit of the innovations without having to pay for them. That's great. >That's extreme market efficiency. No, getting someone elses innovations and Ideas from them without paying for them, that is what is defined in the dictionary as stealing, as plagiarism at the least. You see by doing this they are in effect making themselves crooks. > A company can have all the ideas in the world, but if they can't turn it >into a product that consumers actually want to buy, it won't amount to a >hill of beans. Microsoft excels at turning ideas into marketable products. >And that's what the market wants -- products, not ideas. The reason why Microsoft cannibalized them to begin with is because the company had turned it into a product customers actually wanted to buy. That is why the price raised and they were inculcated into the distribution or another product. When you make something included and jack up the price so to speak, then you are in fact making people pay for a product you made even if they would rather have someone elses, and when they are ran out of business by Microsoft because the those using their version begin to believe it is their only option because the other business can no longer survive under Microsofts heavy hand and racketeering then you are stuck with an inferior product. In todays world money is what runs everything. The golden rule of arts and sciences I reiterate, He Who Has the Gold Makes the Rules. That means that if you can crush another companies income, it doesnt mater if it is a better product, if they have been crushed, or overflowed by someone with a stronger power base does that make them any more right? If someone had a animal that was dear to them, and another man with more power took it away from them, and had power to forcefully take it from him, even though he already had plenty, and the one man with only the one animal that was dear to that man. Does it make it right just because the man with plenty had enough men, or power, or strength to take it from the poorer man? Does that make it right, just because one has the ability to take from another and ruin their ability at future development? I am sorry sir, but I think not. >> It is monopoly harm, because what >> their taking credit for was actually researched, updated, run, and >> designed by someone else's brain. > > *sigh* What the hell does credit have to do with anything? Who designed >Windows? What does credit have to with anything? I am sure that if you created something you would want credit for it. If you created something and someone took it away from you and made money on it and did nothing to give you credit or money, You must admit you would be incensed. You want to know who originally designed Windows? Try Xerox. If you Mean MS Windows, then it is nothing that has been taken from one company, they have taken it from many peoples, and companies that no longer exist because they were crushed with a mailed hand on soft skulls so to speak sir! Also here is something else for you to consider. Until recently you were forced to buy Windows if you bought a new PC unless you custom built it and put it together yourself. You had no choice. IE has had more effort put into it recently to crush Netscape. I will admit I like the integration of IE so that I can type in a command line on a windows box window and shortcut all the point and clicking. He, however makes people buy something they dont want every time they buy windows with something packaged in that has contributed to a higher price that they dont want, need, or desire. > They read reviews, they consider other products, they look at what other people >are buying, they look at what might become available in the future, and they >make the best decision they know how to. Why do you think you know better >than they do? The sad truth is most people dont read reviews. They usually dont consider what you and I might do and consider in such a situation, as you stated above. They key point you make there however is the best decision THEY KNOW HOW TO. Without having all the information, can they make an informed decision? I dont say I know better than a well informed person, I am saying I am looking at it from an informed point of view on both sides. I am also not bitching. I am not paying for an upgrade. Windows right now has the support of the gaming industry and that is something that has driven the computer industry for many years as far as development. They buy Windows because it does what most people want yes, but so do other OSs, other programs, and other companies that although they make a superior product get crushed by the heavy hand of Microsoft. The finding of fact points this out. > If the competing technologies are truly better, than they should be able to >find better financing. If you can't convince an investor that they're >better, they probably really aren't. I tell Engineers that investors are the >litmus test of how good their ideas are, since investors specialize in >knowing what ideas really are good enough to work. > > If you had an idea that was really better than Microsoft's, that should >give you enough of an advantage to take a sizeable market share. If the >better idea isn't winning, look long and hard at whether it's really better. No, not a sizeable market share for your ideas when it is being blocked by a larger power base. By someone who already has the money to make you go away, or make your company enough problems that it cant bust through the "Superior Money" of Microsoft. It could very well be a better product. > Ask people why they use Windows instead of FreeBSD. I guarantee you one >thing they won't say is because Microsoft is so powerful and impressive that >they have to buy Windows even though it doesn't do what they want. Think >about it - that's really what you're trying to convince me of. No, they will say Free what? Believe me I have asked those kind of questions. Only those well in the know, and in the computer technical fields know about such systems in general. I use to get angry at Microsoft all the time for many things, that is before I found UNIX, this is although I was good in computers, I did not know anything but Windows existed. Taking the different path so to speak "Has made all the difference" I still use windows for things that programmers havent released a version for UNIX for. Their is measure to my madness, and it is this: People are not foolish in general, they are not stupid, and given enough information and support without a heavy domineering hand, are capable of making the right choice, when they know all their options. > Yes, but a company with superior technology wouldn't need to brainwash >anyone. If it really had a better product, it would eventually take over the >marketplace. Really. In an Ideal world yes. However without resources thousands of well thought out, working ideas or inventions are lost because they cant get through the initial, our name is what you know buy us phase of the market. Most things are bought on name value these days. Once again, I reiterate. He who has the gold, makes the rules. My attitude isnt superior to everyone, and it isnt insulting. I am not insulting anyone, only trying to make you see reason. What do you think everyone else has been trying to do? I am only pointing to certain facts although I may have come off in a little more upset matter. I have been feeling under the weather lately and when you got a class in College in the morning, and its already 3:00 am, and your not feeling very well, sometimes you lack a little of the tact that you could use instead. Your Friendly, if sometimes cranky UNIX Advocate: Erick To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message