From owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Jan 27 18:33:46 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6739E16A417 for ; Sun, 27 Jan 2008 18:33:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mwm-keyword-freebsdhackers2.e313df@mired.org) Received: from mired.org (bhuda.mired.org [66.92.153.74]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id F1DA613C4CE for ; Sun, 27 Jan 2008 18:33:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from mwm-keyword-freebsdhackers2.e313df@mired.org) Received: (qmail 53508 invoked by uid 1001); 27 Jan 2008 18:33:43 -0000 Received: from bhuda.mired.org (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by bhuda.mired.org (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Sun, 27 Jan 2008 13:33:42 -0500 Date: Sun, 27 Jan 2008 13:33:41 -0500 To: KAYVEN RIESE Message-ID: <20080127133341.0f5e3f5f@bhuda.mired.org> In-Reply-To: References: <84a208a0801232306k6a34134aqd549a1ba2160fe41@mail.gmail.com> <4798479B.9030406@delphij.net> <20080124185522.23ca743f@bhuda.mired.org> <864pd15163.fsf@ds4.des.no> <86hch0pqhl.fsf@ds4.des.no> <20080126183449.5086079e@bhuda.mired.org> Organization: Meyer Consulting X-Mailer: Claws Mail 2.9.1 (GTK+ 2.10.12; amd64-portbld-freebsd6.2) Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAAG1BMVEXguIzRkGnhyaz069mXhW0WHRnbrnR9WCQ6LB0CchNMAAACSUlEQVQ4jV2TQW7jMAxFGaPQOgQEdZaGMsgBrAvUA03dCxj1Uu4U2gfwQD7AGNax51NK07RcxXz6/CSl0Ij450vkPG1jzpIZM1UwDCl/xB14TWnNX8A00Qj5a0mnVFVbVUz4MeErea2HikSRqZzY894zwg9p2+/AtO8LzxFED+tNAUFeU29iFOLRxlZAcdo9A8wi8ZBMV4BKPde82Oxrvs6BTkulQIClte0DLFzzsKk9j1MBex8iUaP00Bd78S/muyFScrTXz6zLkEUxJp+SabQfNOs4f4Jpx5qSZ/304PWwlEWP1cOn/mJQR7EOD+uKhjcBLziuL7xoY5Xm+VFAUSw/LwwwsHEHxihpwV4EJH0xXRkbw1PkRw+X4pEuSJwBggqk+HEYKkiL5/74/nQkogigzQsAFrakxZyfw3wMIEEZPv4AWMfxwqE5GNxGaERjmH+PG8AE0L4/w9g0lsp1raLYAN5azQa+AOoO9NwcpFkTrG2VKNMNEL5UKUUAw34tha0z7onUG0oBoNtczE04GwFE3wCHc0ChezAJ6A1WMV81AtY7wDAJSlXwV+4cwBvsOsrQMRawfQEBz0deEZ7WNpV2szckIKo5VpDHDSDvF1GItwqqAlG01Hh50BGtVhuUkjkasg/14bYFGCgWg1fSWHvmOoJck2xdp9ZvZBHzDVTzX23TkrOn7qe5U2COEw5D4Vx3qEQpFY2Z/3QFnJxzp7YCmSMG19nOUoe869zZfOQb5ywQuWu0yCn5+8gxZz+BE7vG3j4/wbf4D/sXN9Wug1s7AAAAAElFTkSuQmCC Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.1.11 (Ladyburn) From: Mike Meyer Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD hacker 101 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 27 Jan 2008 18:33:46 -0000 On Sat, 26 Jan 2008 15:55:53 -0800 (PST) KAYVEN RIESE wro= te: >=20 >=20 > On Sat, 26 Jan 2008, Mike Meyer wrote: > > On Sat, 26 Jan 2008 12:24:36 -0800 (PST) KAYVEN RIESE = wrote: > >> On Sat, 26 Jan 2008, Dag-Erling Sm=C3=B8rgrav wrote: > >>> KAYVEN RIESE writes: > > .rpm is a package format, and comes with a tool set for using it. Most > > (all?) GNU/Linux systems come with tools for dealing with it, but they > > all also come with tools for dealing with .tgz. Some GNU/Linux distros > > use .rpm to distribute their software, but not all do. I don't think > > any Unix systems have adopted it; most of them have packaging systems > > that predate .rpm, and they're all different. Different package > > formats for vendor software isn't a GNU/Linux vs. FreeBSD or Unix > > thing, it's a fact of line in a multi-platform Unix environment. > my reason for bringing the whole thing up was based on the idea > that this person might be used to using *.rpm all the time Well, maybe. But consider the context: they're looking at moving from GNU/Linux to FreeBSD, so they're probably familiar with more than one GNU/Linux distro, so there's a good chance they'ev seen more than just rpms for system software distribution. Further, they're looking at working on the FreeBSD code base, so they're a programmer, so there's a good chance they've gone to the source sites for the packages included in those distros, where they almost certainly would have noticed that the binaries for other platforms weren't in rpms. Since they're programmers, they've probably downloaded source distributions, which are almost invariable tarballs of some sort or another. In other words, the chances that they've only seen rpm file distributions would seem to be vanishingly small, so there are things that are far more likely to disrupt them - like the difference in which system calls will work properly between fork() and exec() that Posix() doesn't require to do so - that are still so unlikely to do so to be worth mentioning in this context. If you feel you have to mention it, then you should really talk about the tools, not the formats: GNU/Linux distros tend to use rpm* or apt* tools for installing and managing software packages, whereas FreeBSD uses the pkg* tools. > and this > would be a difference he would experience moving to=20 freeBSD, if > this was the case. if this is not the case for him, as you seem > to be implying, then.. well.. still.. he must know to avoid > *.rpm distributions in any case unless he installs a *.rpm compatibility > tool. is that part of the linux-compat stuff that freeBSD has? Just out of curiosity, where do you expect to find software for FreeBSD in an rpm format? I don't think they exist, so *avoiding* them wont' be a problem. Possibly wasting time looking for them might be, but again, that seems really unlikely given the context, so there are more important things to suggest they not waste time on, like wandering how they upgrade just part of the base system. http://www.mired.org/consulting.html Independent Network/Unix/Perforce consultant, email for more information.