From owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Jun 13 05:06:05 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2C5116A418 for ; Tue, 13 Jun 2006 05:06:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tedm@toybox.placo.com) Received: from mail.freebsd-corp-net-guide.com (mail.web-strider.com [65.75.192.90]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF27E43D49 for ; Tue, 13 Jun 2006 05:06:04 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from tedm@toybox.placo.com) Received: from tedwin2k (nat-rtr.freebsd-corp-net-guide.com [65.75.197.130]) by mail.freebsd-corp-net-guide.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id k5D54Lx18683; Mon, 12 Jun 2006 22:04:21 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from tedm@toybox.placo.com) From: "Ted Mittelstaedt" To: "Mipam" , "Nikolas Britton" Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2006 22:04:21 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 Importance: Normal X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 11:42:14 +0000 Cc: vmt@menuetos.net, discuss@opendarwin.org, opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org, misc@openbsd.org, freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, =?windows-1250?Q?H=E1morszky_Bal=E1zs?= , freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net, netbsd-users@NetBSD.org, users-request@crater.dragonflybsd.org, geist@newos.org, l4ka@ira.uka.de, digulla@aros.org Subject: RE: wikipedia article X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2006 05:06:05 -0000 >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org >[mailto:owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]On Behalf Of Mipam >Sent: Monday, June 12, 2006 1:45 AM >To: Nikolas Britton >Cc: vmt@menuetos.net; discuss@opendarwin.org; >opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org; misc@openbsd.org; >digulla@aros.org; Hámorszky Balázs; >freedos-user@lists.sourceforge.net; netbsd-users@NetBSD.org; >users-request@crater.dragonflybsd.org; geist@newos.org; >l4ka@ira.uka.de; freebsd-questions@freebsd.org >Subject: Re: wikipedia article > > >On Sun, 11 Jun 2006, Nikolas Britton wrote: > >[SNIP] >> * IIRC NetBSD was a fork of FreeBSD, OpenBSD was a fork of NetBSD. > >Eeh? I believe NetBSD was there half a year before FreeBSD. Eh? http://www.netbsd.org/Misc/history.html "...Frustration at getting patches integrated and releases of 386BSD led to FreeBSD, which concentrated the i386 platform, while NetBSD formed to focus on multi-platform support..." Now, for the references, see: http://wolfram.schneider.org/bsd/ftp/releases/ Let's start with the 386BSD stuff. Unfortunately he doesen't have the release note for 386BSD 0.1, I think I have it I'll have to send it to him. However: http://wolfram.schneider.org/bsd/ftp/releases/386BSD-0.0 "...From wjolitz@cardio.ucsf.EDU Sat Mar 14 21:59:20 1992..." http://wolfram.schneider.org/bsd/ftp/releases/386BSD-1.0 "... Date: 12 Nov 1994 22:50:49 -0800.." "....It shipped November 4..." So you see there was a lot of overlap, here. Both NetBSD and FreeBSD's official first releases fell between the releases of 386BSD. But, that isn't the whole story, read on: http://wolfram.schneider.org/bsd/ftp/releases/NetBSD-0.8 "...The source for NetBSD is derived from 386BSD 0.1, patched with the 0.2.2 patch kit...." "...Thanks go to: All of the people involved in the patch kit, including but not limited to: Terry Lambert Nate Williams Jordan Hubbard Rod Grimes..." http://wolfram.schneider.org/bsd/ftp/releases/FreeBSD-1.0-EPSILON "...much awaited SECOND public release of FreeBSD..." "...From: jkh@whisker.lotus.ie (Jordan K. Hubbard)" Now, here's the kicker. Notice that NetBSD 0.8 thanks Jordan for his work, why? It is because Jordan is the release manager for FreeBSD during that time that NetBSD was released. Yet if NetBSD was 6 months BEFORE FreeBSD as your asserting, why would they be thanking the authors of the patchkit, of which Jordan was one - 386BSD 0.1 as we should all know became FreeBSD, read: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/history.html "...The FreeBSD project had its genesis in the early part of 1993, partially as an outgrowth of the “Unofficial 386BSD Patchkit” by the patchkit's last 3 coordinators: Nate Williams, Rod Grimes and myself...." You see, work on FreeBSD and NetBSD was going on in parallel at the same time, with the same people working on both operating systems. It is a mistake to think that NetBSD was a fork of FreeBSD or vis-versa. Both were "forks" of the 386BSD 0.1 release and as I explained, started out identically. NetBSD was carried on within CSRG initally, that is why you see all the blurbs like "intended as a research tool" and suchlike in the early NetBSD notes. FreeBSD was carried on within Walnut Creek, very much outside of Berkeley. You have to understand that in 1993 the Internet wasn't all over the place, a lot of people had no way of connection to it. Only a fortunate few could do an FTP transfer of anything from Berkeley. That is why Walnut Creek initially was so important. Ted