Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2019 20:57:32 -0700 From: Frank Fenderbender <frankfenderbender@council124.org> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Cc: David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com>, Valeri Galtsev <galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu> Subject: Re: FreeBSD desktop "best-fit" Dell platform suggestions? Message-ID: <85694074-E3B1-4AC3-A742-FEB8BD4BA9B0@council124.org> In-Reply-To: <162715a2-dc44-0555-29b9-50ca75af46e6@kicp.uchicago.edu> References: <CANx7MpfDQJEUsjo_SSYqnExagj30NAAD8cPYiR3mDZq_ztor8Q@mail.gmail.com> <43760917-5FAA-4C75-A4D2-923A5EA0E624@council124.org> <2d7ff5f5-603f-004d-31fc-14eef658997e@holgerdanske.com> <162715a2-dc44-0555-29b9-50ca75af46e6@kicp.uchicago.edu>
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David, Valeri: Thanks for addressing my first email, "FreeBSD desktop "best-fit" Dell = platform suggestions?". It mysteriously took on punctuation & spelling = errors despite passing the spellchecker's "know-how".=20 So much for the AI at the core of the anti-human Transhumanism = movement.... ;-) You were kind to wade through the mistakes. Thanks. I shortened up a second email question, "desktop [install- or = configur-]ation issues on Dell workstations?", to address the same issue = but with less clutter.=20 Here's my response to your response to my first email about the = possibility of installing FreeBSD on a compatibility-tested Dell (or any = system for that matter): --- [cr]Apple, before and after their A.I.M. (Apple-IBM-Motorola) = association, was similar to "on-demand" manufacturing companies like = Dell (who fill their boxes with what is available that meets base = criteria), because they never put in enough or qualified capacitors, and = so, had a rash of supposed circuit board burnouts (which sold more = computers) which would have been alleviated by replacing $19 worth of = over-priced caps, which few these daze could ever troubleshoot, let = alone replace... what with most tech schools buzzing around the iNtel = RISC-free copper-free chipsets. I was lucky and found DT&T in Pleasanton = CA for restoring boards. So, Dell and FreeBSD sound iffy, but then, no list seems to exist = whereupon any standardized test suite has run against any documented = platforms to verify that all modules installed properly and form a = fully-working [thus, "operating"] system afterwards. That would be a = rarity for any OS these daze. [cr]Apple avoids ALL testing so that sales = are not slowed: a marketing-driven company. No class. No quality. Only = fashion walkways and gimmicks. No innovation whatsoever. Colors. Shapes. = An assembly-line of connectors to outdate predecessor systems. Constant = memory leaks. No regression testing at all. No release testing at all.=20= They would be so easy to surpass if everyone here created a = system/driver/configuration spreadsheet with "issue" hyperlinked out to = a database of verified and reproducible solutions. Has anyone seen or attempted such an undertaking. It would be have use very much like a bug-tracking system. And, with a curated list of componentry (hw and sw) it could alleviate = redundant question like my own. I am not prepared to go through another installation debug, esp. when I = have no base with which to compare. I tried and failed at FreeBSD, OpenBSD, and TrueOS server installs on my = dual-NIC, four internal 2TB HDDed server. Maybe luck, experience, or the install procedure, I "got it" with Ubuntu = the first time after trying (and painfully learning what bait not to = bite at) the BSD installs, true, but had to correct the = error-riddled/unedited/visibly-impaired/unverified/untested book by the = need-parasiting Kefa Rabah in his "The Book Everyone Has Been Waiting = For" self-anointed book, "The Ultimate Linux Ubuntu 16.04 Powered Media = Streaming & Storage Servers" (2019; 380pp).=20 I had to go back to the "100 flavors of vanilla" internet to seek a = solution from all those who did not document the systems onto which they = were installing. The sharing is wonderful, however, diseases are also shared, as are bad = science and qualifiable process methodology. The problem I had with the BSD installs was the issue of engaging the = extended installation of add-ons. Next time I shall avoid them all. None = are tested at all. It's like buying a "new" car that needs every part adjusted to all other = parts. A lifetime of tinkering that shouldn't be necessitated at all. The dependencies are never verified and neither are the version = conflicts. For starters, a "BOM" is needed that shows every file, = folder.permission, and link that SHOULD be created at install-time, and = then verifies that they did get created as intended. Secondly, with any add-on, each should also have a BOM of all = requirements and all other modules with which it may conflict. At Intel, our split development team was using two C compilers, Borland = and Microsoft, which used different clocking systems: Microsoft time = started with seconds from at 1900; Borland, like UNIX, began January 1, = 1970. That was an issue which adopted-specs would have defined & prevented (if = followed). As well, when tools were added, a DLL wasn't noticed that conflicted = with our product-defined DLLs. Whenever a feature kicked in that used = the conflicting DLL, the problem would appear. At Analogy we used BOMs and ran test suites in reproducible NT, AIX, = SunOS, Solaris, and HP-UX environments using Norton Ghost (for NT) and = equivalents for UNIX systems. The registry was defaulted after each NT = suite and the user was erased after and recreated before each UNIX run. At Network general Corporation, every install step (and check) was = documented and verified against the documentation and the reality of the = install and tests. We would run (pre-IBM, pre-Rational) versions of = Purify and PureCoverage on every supported system's code, tests, and = installs. Nothing is perfect, esp. software, so we tried to be = consistent in terms of improving the calculus of building-and-releasing. = You know, as quality approaches infinity, bugs approach zero... or so = the theory goes. ;-) Many "tolerated" issues did not exist at Tektronix or Mentor Graphics = Corporation, because they had a process integrated with the whole and = "pieces" of every product release, covering hardware, covering software, = covering partnered-code integration, covering hardware-software = integration, and finally, as a fully-integrated system of modules, = functions, and I/O. It "only" takes that first time to get it into place and then the time = saved easily allows for updates and improvement: build, acceptance, = regression, GUI, button/knob, load, voice recognition, BETA, and release = test suites, made with scripting languages (Expect, Tcl, Perl, Korn, = Bourne, Csh/Tcsh), GPIB, sed/grep/awk/cat/find built-in functions, with = results converted into both email and HTML, so that appropriate = builders, developers, and managers got notified).=20 No one by themselves has that kind of time to, so maybe we can = proactively address the proverbial-"it" as a community rather than = reactively as a list of issues. So, it can be done, and the time "in" saves so much, much time "out" = chasing bugs. The suites can be run via distributed tests run on = "standardized" systems throughout the throughout the [secured] FreeBSD = community. Because it's distributed the tests run concurrently rather = than sequentially.I'm going to be running the same set of tests on all = software I create, and so, would happily work with others to make a set = of suites that is portable for all of us to use, modify (in a = repository) for varied purposes, and document. Anyway, this time I'm installing none of the "add-ons" and following = Michael Bernal's "A Comprehensive Installation & Configuration Guide of = the BSD variants" (2018; 68pp) for its brevity and clean install.=20 Thanks to you both for your comments and suggestions. I appreciate the = effort and will document and report-on the process I use. I'm going to order the Dell tomorrow after adjusting to re-reading your = comments. best wishes, Frank frankfenderbender@council124.org
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