From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Apr 4 21:43:18 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E650106564A for ; Sun, 4 Apr 2010 21:43:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fullermd@over-yonder.net) Received: from thyme.infocus-llc.com (server.infocus-llc.com [206.156.254.44]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51A4F8FC0A for ; Sun, 4 Apr 2010 21:43:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: from draco.over-yonder.net (c-75-64-226-141.hsd1.ms.comcast.net [75.64.226.141]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by thyme.infocus-llc.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3A62437B41E; Sun, 4 Apr 2010 16:27:18 -0500 (CDT) Received: by draco.over-yonder.net (Postfix, from userid 100) id 6AFE661C42; Sun, 4 Apr 2010 16:27:17 -0500 (CDT) Date: Sun, 4 Apr 2010 16:27:17 -0500 From: "Matthew D. Fuller" To: Peter Jeremy Message-ID: <20100404212717.GA2420@over-yonder.net> References: <20100402165002.71A8B1CC09@ptavv.es.net> <77FCD9C7615944DBBD3369EC4E5A5C94@rivendell> <2972DD89-7D7D-4869-9280-305BACBFEC5A@bway.net> <20100403135703.GA63262@ei.bzerk.org> <4bb7f310.gIt41bTtJElBEKHS%perryh@pluto.rain.com> <20100404211522.GI86236@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20100404211522.GI86236@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> X-Editor: vi X-OS: FreeBSD User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20-fullermd.4 (2009-06-14) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.95.3 at thyme.infocus-llc.com X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: mail25@bzerk.org, perryh@pluto.rain.com, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Results of BIND RFC X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2010 21:43:18 -0000 [ Way OT for anything but -chat... ] On Mon, Apr 05, 2010 at 07:15:22AM +1000 I heard the voice of Peter Jeremy, and lo! it spake thus: > > Well, that's an excellent topic for another bikeshed - Should X be > made part of the base system? I know it is on OpenBSD. Well, heck, X.org is already pushing more and more into the kernel anyway, right? :p -- Matthew Fuller (MF4839) | fullermd@over-yonder.net Systems/Network Administrator | http://www.over-yonder.net/~fullermd/ On the Internet, nobody can hear you scream. From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Apr 5 17:50:38 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF34A106566B for ; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 17:50:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from deeptech71@gmail.com) Received: from mail-fx0-f209.google.com (mail-fx0-f209.google.com [209.85.220.209]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B3548FC15 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 17:50:37 +0000 (UTC) Received: by fxm1 with SMTP id 1so2843882fxm.13 for ; Mon, 05 Apr 2010 10:50:37 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from :user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=q7B4d7r01VjhslUvsmGPJc0DhULiW4alAmE6DFF061s=; b=x5qY6TYI035gq4+LnZr64/kCdm63dq53XXD3cNEPmEtIRLOwYCw3NbyxsHlVxeQo70 XbtPIc4gy8dY32fcAfL+w46K39GO1OM3GqhZhP1ELQfrggUirsnkHeKez2zdOotzSB9F vsQ6yAC7ge2QN2mr09MEvVmNhFUd5HiVAULpk= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=vcp/TJm1+bW38byGWxvdRsRF58YsoL1xbA7SoUuo9NAQA0znlS1q4RdUrGSdQznIYT B4IkkN6DFabbfAVCd5vmTgoYbShAqKNv1AZWg2S3+0+eJVNhhJNeVdZ1ZWrCCREcTzuy bFPOotCIwNMEZPLMS5bNFkjdzQmnsOCHTd/qs= Received: by 10.223.5.5 with SMTP id 5mr5784940fat.80.1270489836847; Mon, 05 Apr 2010 10:50:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [157.181.97.113] (quark.teteny.elte.hu [157.181.97.113]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 14sm8125433fxm.1.2010.04.05.10.50.35 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Mon, 05 Apr 2010 10:50:35 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <4BBA3264.5050702@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2010 20:56:36 +0200 From: deeptech71@gmail.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.1.9) Gecko/20100317 SeaMonkey/2.0.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: FreeBSD anti-competitive activities X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2010 17:50:38 -0000 deeptech71@gmail.com wrote: > Just as soon as FreeBSD 8.0 came out, I downloaded a boot-only disc > image and went off to reinstall FreeBSD (don't ask why). OK, it worked > whatsoever. But as it turns out, I wasn't able to boot my Windows XP > installation anymore. The system just froze when I tried booting my > Windows XP slice. First I thought that the installation damaged the > other partitions (someone added buggy code in sysinstall lately?). At > that point I didn't dare to boot anything on the disk. I decided to > give a try to Hiren's Boot CD, which has loads of warezed > slicing/partitioning, recovery and backup tools, and also a loadable > Mini Windows XP. I hoped I would be able to find out what happened. > > But guess what? Neither of the Boot CD tools were able to start up, > not even the Mini Windows XP! They all froze just like my Windows XP. > But that's just weird. On a whim, I disabled my disk drive in the BIOS > settings. And guess what? Both the Mini Windows XP and the tools were > able to start because of that. I was able to read the > slices/partitions with them, and noticed that all my files on the > FAT32 and NTFS slices were intact. [...] > sysinstall asked something new when I installed 8.0, something like > "It is safe to use a disk geometry of 123/45/6789 on modern > computers... Would you like to use this disk geometry?", I chose > "Yes". Safe my ass. I guess my computer doesn't fit in sysinstall's > definition of "modern". Reinstalling FreeBSD and chosing "No" seems to have revived the Windows partition. From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Apr 5 18:02:12 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58107106566B for ; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 18:02:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sektie@gmail.com) Received: from mail-pv0-f182.google.com (mail-pv0-f182.google.com [74.125.83.182]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27DE18FC08 for ; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 18:02:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: by pvc7 with SMTP id 7so2018744pvc.13 for ; Mon, 05 Apr 2010 11:02:11 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:received:message-id:subject :from:to:cc:content-type; bh=dtAfx8AoI6/fkhRV0QT1fS6ocW/dQ4Pvolefqxt22BQ=; b=Ia8J3jzAOObDH0rwW6NqAge4LiSAdnfGowqfR+HIyMhCas1nFCV0E3ky6VW6RhRDi4 YIQ+Aip2rsnVgCimb524rfgfhZCJe3ncUyF+fkv4QZ3YH+ebPA+UACr23eMv3SdsE4PG HAAdomgx0xP3tEe/nqBykhQMp/KG3iGS3un9U= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=QC2tCIlaHqdHH1rYL9loa4+KZzNRE+vmyjNHgEFPUR+GmoZP10PcrKOpfvqYXDTTOA Fl/qp+s9mfB3JRZ3D5xdQPRBirCbc4gM8H4xyZzcTFBBXic3X8ZW9PCDVmpyIZHaUxk6 64iIPb2wn33sDQ0Iu9G/DHQF68WbPr8B/IYvU= MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: sektie@gmail.com Received: by 10.140.172.16 with HTTP; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 11:02:00 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4BBA3264.5050702@gmail.com> References: <4BBA3264.5050702@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2010 11:02:00 -0700 X-Google-Sender-Auth: f1486be9cbb6bcf7 Received: by 10.141.15.5 with SMTP id s5mr4171783rvi.177.1270490520274; Mon, 05 Apr 2010 11:02:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: From: Randi Harper To: deeptech71@gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD anti-competitive activities X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2010 18:02:12 -0000 On Mon, Apr 5, 2010 at 11:56 AM, wrote: > deeptech71@gmail.com wrote: >> Just as soon as FreeBSD 8.0 came out, I downloaded a boot-only disc >> image and went off to reinstall FreeBSD (don't ask why). OK, it worked >> whatsoever. But as it turns out, I wasn't able to boot my Windows XP >> installation anymore. The system just froze when I tried booting my >> Windows XP slice. First I thought that the installation damaged the >> other partitions (someone added buggy code in sysinstall lately?). At >> that point I didn't dare to boot anything on the disk. I decided to >> give a try to Hiren's Boot CD, which has loads of warezed >> slicing/partitioning, recovery and backup tools, and also a loadable >> Mini Windows XP. I hoped I would be able to find out what happened. >> >> But guess what? Neither of the Boot CD tools were able to start up, >> not even the Mini Windows XP! They all froze just like my Windows XP. >> But that's just weird. On a whim, I disabled my disk drive in the BIOS >> settings. And guess what? Both the Mini Windows XP and the tools were >> able to start because of that. I was able to read the >> slices/partitions with them, and noticed that all my files on the >> FAT32 and NTFS slices were intact. > [...] >> sysinstall asked something new when I installed 8.0, something like >> "It is safe to use a disk geometry of 123/45/6789 on modern >> computers... Would you like to use this disk geometry?", I chose >> "Yes". Safe my ass. I guess my computer doesn't fit in sysinstall's >> definition of "modern". > > Reinstalling FreeBSD and chosing "No" seems to have revived the Windows > partition. I'm not sure why I didn't see the original email in this thread - maybe I saw the subject and figured it was a troll. Seriously? FreeBSD anti-competitive activities? I suggest you wear your tinfoil hat, because they are all out to get you. It's a problem with sysinstall & libdisk. File a bug. That's generally how problems are handled, not by claiming there's some sort of anti-windows conspiracy. -- randi From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Apr 5 19:33:16 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBBFB106566C for ; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 19:33:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from deeptech71@gmail.com) Received: from mail-fx0-f209.google.com (mail-fx0-f209.google.com [209.85.220.209]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56A308FC1C for ; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 19:33:15 +0000 (UTC) Received: by fxm1 with SMTP id 1so2934250fxm.13 for ; Mon, 05 Apr 2010 12:33:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from :user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=xemKJKFsJQUmgWA4XT/uH3lEqlJ+jjlvrqtDe2NeHmw=; b=vXFCD+jEHYmvjJX3SidXScYxA/pqiPngS0ix74mpOSzKT7SB9/fUaD7WrApEaU6gMP xA2ArCo9+g+AY1LZ5KAw7ZsrffVPmM0MB/t/Ra1cuCzBY1aOVbE2VDFJyyVzXAoOBggq FKQ6oE1FzgQ3Yw27whx2BHrQdcib5+xXrcBX4= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=e+XUKxKTCSIXmhUicHY4tI8yuSJ8Zyw+HaNAEjTqyBliD9BcPohSi5IbztFqIR9DNU BSN2I7uoR7qDadTxMw2ommB1DU+9KidcLNA8u2viFanPDSLdRxNOkgPCyIlyzommyapY bFbSxhDdpdF5bca2rBVGLJ9l0vfJA4YaSzO0g= Received: by 10.223.64.205 with SMTP id f13mr6145349fai.98.1270495993936; Mon, 05 Apr 2010 12:33:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [157.181.97.113] (quark.teteny.elte.hu [157.181.97.113]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 15sm8153423fxm.7.2010.04.05.12.33.12 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Mon, 05 Apr 2010 12:33:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <4BBA4A71.5020707@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2010 22:39:13 +0200 From: deeptech71@gmail.com User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.1.9) Gecko/20100317 SeaMonkey/2.0.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <4BBA3264.5050702@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: FreeBSD anti-competitive activities X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2010 19:33:16 -0000 Randi Harper wrote: > Seriously? FreeBSD anti-competitive activities? I suggest you wear > your tinfoil hat, because they are all out to get you. > > It's a problem with sysinstall& libdisk. File a bug. That's generally > how problems are handled, not by claiming there's some sort of > anti-windows conspiracy. You'll need one of these: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=sarcasm+detector (in other words, http://www.sarcasmdetector.com/). FreeBSD works fine. Windows borks. Maybe the issue can be alleviated for Windows without affecting FreeBSD. But who will track this "bug" down and do the hardware testing? I don't feel like doing it. I did not file any reports because I felt like it would be another idle bug report to be suspended around 2020. From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Apr 6 03:04:29 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E96D1065675 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 03:04:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kayve@sfsu.edu) Received: from iron3-mailrl.sfsu.edu (iron3-mailrl.sfsu.edu [130.212.10.122]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C7938FC15 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 03:04:28 +0000 (UTC) X-Inbound-SFSU: False X-onepass: IPPSC X-From-SFSU: True X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AvsEAFc8ukuC1B9b/2dsb2JhbACbS3GvS4hbgnCCFwSDJIEmgVuFMg Received: from edg04.sfsu.edu ([130.212.31.91]) by iron3.sfsu.edu with ESMTP; 05 Apr 2010 20:04:28 -0700 Received: from EHB03.ad.sfsu.edu (130.212.31.27) by edg04.sfsu.edu (130.212.31.91) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.0.689.0; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 20:01:54 -0700 Received: from smtp01.sfsu.edu (130.212.10.100) by ehb.ad.sfsu.edu (130.212.31.27) with Microsoft SMTP Server id 14.0.689.0; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 20:04:28 -0700 Received: from libra.sfsu.edu ([130.212.10.238]) by mail05a.sfsu.edu (Lotus Domino Release 7.0.4HF59) with ESMTP id 2010040520042636-32 ; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 20:04:26 -0700 Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2010 20:04:26 -0700 From: KAYVEN RIESE To: Randi Harper In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <4BBA3264.5050702@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MIMETrack: Itemize by SMTP Server on MAIL05a/SERVERS/SFSU(Release 7.0.4HF59 | August 11, 2009) at 04/05/2010 20:04:26, Serialize by Router on SMTP01/SERVERS/SFSU(Release 7.0.4|March 23, 2009) at 04/05/2010 20:04:27, Serialize complete at 04/05/2010 20:04:27 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"; format=flowed Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD anti-competitive activities X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Apr 2010 03:04:29 -0000 On Mon, 5 Apr 2010, Randi Harper wrote: > On Mon, Apr 5, 2010 at 11:56 AM, wrote: >> deeptech71@gmail.com wrote: >>> Just as soon as FreeBSD 8.0 came out, I downloaded a boot-only disc . . . . . >>> slicing/partitioning, recovery and backup tools, and also a loadable >>> Mini Windows XP. I hoped I would be able to find out what happened. >>> >>> But guess what? Neither of the Boot CD tools were able to start up, >> [...] >>> sysinstall asked something new when I installed 8.0, something like >>> "It is safe to use a disk geometry of 123/45/6789 on modern >>> computers... Would you like to use this disk geometry?", I chose >>> "Yes". Safe my ass. I guess my computer doesn't fit in sysinstall's >>> definition of "modern". >> >> Reinstalling FreeBSD and chosing "No" seems to have revived the Windows >> partition. > > > I'm not sure why I didn't see the original email in this thread - > maybe I saw the subject and figured it was a troll. > > Seriously? FreeBSD anti-competitive activities? I suggest you wear > your tinfoil hat, because they are all out to get you. > > It's a problem with sysinstall & libdisk. File a bug. That's generally > how problems are handled, not by claiming there's some sort of > anti-windows conspiracy. How does it go? Attribute to incompetence, not malice? I forget. Don't really mean to call you FreeBSD guys incompetent. Maybe just a little 300 Spartans fighting off a million Persians. Somebody made a boo boo-- oh wait.. was it the guy trying to use sysinstall and not the folks who wrote it? Either way.. > > -- randi > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-chat@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-chat > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-chat-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > *----------------------------------------------------------* Kayven Riese, BSCS, MS (Physiology and Biophysics) (415) 902 5513 cellular http://kayve.net Webmaster http://ChessYoga.org *----------------------------------------------------------* From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Apr 6 03:14:11 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 097B4106564A for ; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 03:14:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us) Received: from outbound-mail-01.bluehost.com (outbound-mail-01.bluehost.com [69.89.21.11]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CA03C8FC16 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 03:14:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 11158 invoked by uid 0); 6 Apr 2010 03:14:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box264.bluehost.com) (69.89.31.64) by cpoproxy1.bluehost.com with SMTP; 6 Apr 2010 03:14:10 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=joseph-a-nagy-jr.us; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:CC:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:X-Enigmail-Version:Content-Type:X-Identified-User; b=SIgV4Rk2O1wmGmywgltXrJuT2UT+ZrWIpupTKLjZKYGRpKPPvwIAHVUlDQ2MqKYeReNuUKU6+lMe/3XCFQtTBN2CVjE/hcqXXrQigKDj7rJiU695rxtkbdDqhHYP+VQJ; Received: from [206.74.86.236] (helo=[192.168.1.101]) by box264.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NyzEs-0006rm-Ie; Mon, 05 Apr 2010 21:14:10 -0600 Message-ID: <4BBAA6E0.2020702@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2010 22:13:36 -0500 From: Programmer In Training User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100324 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: KAYVEN RIESE References: <4BBA3264.5050702@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enig5BC6090E36ACBA9D07547C41" X-Identified-User: {2250:box264.bluehost.com:ameliora:joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} {sentby:smtp auth 206.74.86.236 authed with pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org, Randi Harper Subject: Re: FreeBSD anti-competitive activities X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Apr 2010 03:14:11 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enig5BC6090E36ACBA9D07547C41 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 04/05/10 22:04, KAYVEN RIESE wrote: > boo boo-- oh wait.. was it the guy trying to use sysinstall and not the= > folks who wrote it? Either way.. I don't know. I had problems with booting without the boot manager (it wouldn't) and I followed the directions step by step as they were wrote in the hand book. It took a thread I found in Questions (I think) to alert me that the problem wasn't me. Other users are having a similar issue. A boot manager needs to be installed for the time being. It doesn't bother me. I don't reboot often anymore. When I do, I just wait for the selection time out to reach 0 so the boot process can continue. Search the archives. I forget what the title of the post I found was (it's somewhere on my machine, I'm too lazy to look as I'm heading to bed right now but a bit of searching won't hurt you). I say neither malice nor incompetence. Despite my own n00bish problems, FreeBSD is a wonderful, wonderful system to use and manage. There are some things here and there that I wish were different, but that's with everything else. No one is content with what they have and always have a critique for something. There is no such thing as 100% bug-free software and there is no such thing as a test condition that accurately reflects the real world when humans get involved. Good night. --=20 Yours In Christ, PIT Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscrib= ed. --------------enig5BC6090E36ACBA9D07547C41 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLuqbnAAoJEENZQ8DH7rW0LA0IAJPG/FxYcLJ5qxLP9LMYcG78 2N2kduYmv7YpCFh7YnfBZTNCrFNgnJCnPBnvrp57tC43Raol6MQzzfHNV3uIOQop AQ0AEXZ6ieTuo7oGIJtQyvwo+BS2g3RnsKoO54HxhlMkt5pubSm3tTuyrVkeR7l0 33/cK3XxzA39J7mDsx/t/fz8Ktg+eFiTD98h/OFlaJWvCGtLq6spvseubnYGH+KK +OlSXHEJTBQT/HpCcEdbHhbfruMa2eqbgjC/YIeglkkhGXTolCLSajgIUwDfJ1xh OgU0cfhV5Jg8QUkC7LgncZ3HW3rkAPi+FZBI9nJf2zUg8gXfm+Abin5kdRv7zK4= =oaTC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enig5BC6090E36ACBA9D07547C41-- From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Apr 6 05:30:32 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A221106566C; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 05:30:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kayve@sfsu.edu) Received: from iron1-mailrl.sfsu.edu (iron1-mailrl.sfsu.edu [130.212.10.121]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 662C58FC15; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 05:30:32 +0000 (UTC) X-Inbound-SFSU: False X-onepass: IPPSC X-From-SFSU: True X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AvsEAEljukuC1B9b/2dsb2JhbACbTXGvIIhbgnCCFwSDJIEmhxI Received: from edg04.sfsu.edu ([130.212.31.91]) by iron1.sfsu.edu with ESMTP; 05 Apr 2010 22:30:32 -0700 Received: from EHB04.ad.sfsu.edu (130.212.31.28) by edg04.sfsu.edu (130.212.31.91) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.0.689.0; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 22:27:57 -0700 Received: from smtp01.sfsu.edu (130.212.10.100) by ehb.ad.sfsu.edu (130.212.31.28) with Microsoft SMTP Server id 14.0.689.0; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 22:30:31 -0700 Received: from libra.sfsu.edu ([130.212.10.238]) by mail05a.sfsu.edu (Lotus Domino Release 7.0.4HF59) with ESMTP id 2010040522302972-42 ; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 22:30:29 -0700 Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2010 22:30:29 -0700 From: KAYVEN RIESE To: Programmer In Training In-Reply-To: <4BBAA6E0.2020702@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Message-ID: References: <4BBA3264.5050702@gmail.com> <4BBAA6E0.2020702@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MIMETrack: Itemize by SMTP Server on MAIL05a/SERVERS/SFSU(Release 7.0.4HF59 | August 11, 2009) at 04/05/2010 22:30:29, Serialize by Router on SMTP01/SERVERS/SFSU(Release 7.0.4|March 23, 2009) at 04/05/2010 22:30:30, Serialize complete at 04/05/2010 22:30:30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"; format=flowed Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org, Randi Harper Subject: Re: FreeBSD anti-competitive activities X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Apr 2010 05:30:32 -0000 On Mon, 5 Apr 2010, Programmer In Training wrote: > On 04/05/10 22:04, KAYVEN RIESE wrote: > > > I say neither malice nor incompetence. Despite my own n00bish problems, I was only attempting to quote a saying. The saying talks about incompetence. Somebody made a boo boo there is no conspiracy. > > -- > Yours In Christ, > > PIT > Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. > Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org > Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscribed. > > *----------------------------------------------------------* Kayven Riese, BSCS, MS (Physiology and Biophysics) (415) 902 5513 cellular http://kayve.net Webmaster http://ChessYoga.org *----------------------------------------------------------* From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Apr 6 05:34:05 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABF5F106566C; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 05:34:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kayve@sfsu.edu) Received: from iron1-mailrl.sfsu.edu (iron1-mailrl.sfsu.edu [130.212.10.121]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 883A78FC1A; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 05:34:05 +0000 (UTC) X-Inbound-SFSU: False X-onepass: IPPSC X-From-SFSU: True X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AvsEAGxkukuC1B9b/2dsb2JhbACbTXGvKIhbgnCCFwSDJIEmhxI Received: from edg04.sfsu.edu ([130.212.31.91]) by iron1.sfsu.edu with ESMTP; 05 Apr 2010 22:34:05 -0700 Received: from EHB04.ad.sfsu.edu (130.212.31.28) by edg04.sfsu.edu (130.212.31.91) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.0.689.0; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 22:31:31 -0700 Received: from smtp01.sfsu.edu (130.212.10.100) by ehb.ad.sfsu.edu (130.212.31.28) with Microsoft SMTP Server id 14.0.689.0; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 22:34:04 -0700 Received: from libra.sfsu.edu ([130.212.10.238]) by mail05a.sfsu.edu (Lotus Domino Release 7.0.4HF59) with ESMTP id 2010040522340274-43 ; Mon, 5 Apr 2010 22:34:02 -0700 Date: Mon, 5 Apr 2010 22:34:02 -0700 From: KAYVEN RIESE To: Programmer In Training In-Reply-To: <4BBAA6E0.2020702@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Message-ID: References: <4BBA3264.5050702@gmail.com> <4BBAA6E0.2020702@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MIMETrack: Itemize by SMTP Server on MAIL05a/SERVERS/SFSU(Release 7.0.4HF59 | August 11, 2009) at 04/05/2010 22:34:03, Serialize by Router on SMTP01/SERVERS/SFSU(Release 7.0.4|March 23, 2009) at 04/05/2010 22:34:04, Serialize complete at 04/05/2010 22:34:04 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"; format=flowed Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org, Randi Harper Subject: Re: FreeBSD anti-competitive activities X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Apr 2010 05:34:05 -0000 On Mon, 5 Apr 2010, Programmer In Training wrote: > On 04/05/10 22:04, KAYVEN RIESE wrote: > > > I say neither malice nor incompetence. Despite my own n00bish problems, I think I remember now.. "Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by incompetence." Somebody here knows that saying. I didn't mean to be a meanie. > > Good night. > > -- > Yours In Christ, > > PIT > Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. > Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org > Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscribed. > > *----------------------------------------------------------* Kayven Riese, BSCS, MS (Physiology and Biophysics) (415) 902 5513 cellular http://kayve.net Webmaster http://ChessYoga.org *----------------------------------------------------------* From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Apr 6 12:07:27 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE3E8106564A for ; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 12:07:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ekerberos@web.de) Received: from fmmailgate01.web.de (fmmailgate01.web.de [217.72.192.221]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DE5F8FC08 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 12:07:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mwmweb081 (mwmweb081.dlan.cinetic.de [172.20.18.74]) by fmmailgate01.web.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7890154F5F75 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 14:07:25 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [87.79.200.199] by mwmweb081.dlan.cinetic.de with HTTP; Tue Apr 06 14:07:25 CEST 2010 From: Sisantha Godawela-Ohle To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <26040679.3232962.1270555645917.JavaMail.fmail@mwmweb081> Date: Tue, 6 Apr 2010 14:07:25 +0200 (CEST) X-UI-Message-Type: mail In-Reply-To: <20100405120023.BF82D1065700@hub.freebsd.org> References: <20100405120023.BF82D1065700@hub.freebsd.org> X-UI-ATTACHMENT-ID-POSTFIX: 4125e6ac-c98a-4d39-a79c-7fc6a5ae34cc Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 Importance: normal Sensitivity: Normal X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1+PsYnHPMn8bnm+NF5FsziY+u8i6DX1adtVXwfuc9SdQE9PDaC30VgU 069H6/ZMcAXoZdhh7QmDx1lKyG7e8Uq2fTeG6p320AiaKEcEv0EZLadpUyTn2mPG uuSiul5RuSRg40j9ipibcVv4zuAC+XE1CwtLOOp8KAA= Subject: Re: freebsd-chat Digest, Vol 345, Issue 1 X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Apr 2010 12:07:27 -0000 would like to add this Topic ; FreeBSD on IBM POWER Series. is it possible = to install FreeBSD on IBM POWER 5+ ? what is the different to FreeBSD PPC v= ersion to it? appreciate for an constructive answer! Regards an FreeBSD Pow= er USER on (i386, Sparc64, AMD64) -----Urspr=C3=BCngliche Nachricht----- Vo= n: freebsd-chat-request@freebsd.org Gesendet: 05.04.2010 14:00:23 An: freeb= sd-chat@freebsd.org Betreff: freebsd-chat Digest, Vol 345, Issue 1 >Send fr= eebsd-chat mailing list submissions to > freebsd-chat@freebsd.org > >To sub= scribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.freebsd.= org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-chat >or, via email, send a message with subje= ct or body 'help' to > freebsd-chat-request@freebsd.org > >You can reach th= e person managing the list at > freebsd-chat-owner@freebsd.org > >When repl= ying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >than "Re: Conte= nts of freebsd-chat digest..." > > >Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Results of B= IND RFC (Matthew D. Fuller) > > >------------------------------------------= ---------------------------- > >Message: 1 >Date: Sun, 4 Apr 2010 16:27:17 = -0500 >From: "Matthew D. Fuller" >Subject: Re: Results of BIND RFC >To: Pet= er Jeremy >Cc: mail25@bzerk.org, perryh@pluto.rain.com, freebsd-chat@freebs= d.org >Message-ID: >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii > >[ Way O= T for anything but -chat... ] > >On Mon, Apr 05, 2010 at 07:15:22AM +1000 I= heard the voice of >Peter Jeremy, and lo! it spake thus: >> >> Well, that'= s an excellent topic for another bikeshed - Should X be >> made part of the= base system? I know it is on OpenBSD. > >Well, heck, X.org is already push= ing more and more into the kernel >anyway, right? :p > > >-- >Matthew Fulle= r (MF4839) | fullermd@over-yonder.net >Systems/Network Administrator | http= ://www.over-yonder.net/~fullermd/ > On the Internet, nobody can hear you sc= ream. > > >------------------------------ > >______________________________= _________________ >freebsd-chat@freebsd.org mailing list >http://lists.free= bsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-chat >To unsubscribe, send any mail to "fr= eebsd-chat-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > >End of freebsd-chat Digest, Vol 345,= Issue 1 >******************************************** ___________________________________________________________ GRATIS f=C3=BCr alle WEB.DE-Nutzer: Die maxdome Movie-FLAT! Jetzt freischalten unter http://movieflat.web.de From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Apr 6 19:37:47 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DA731065672 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 19:37:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vikammwatkinsbwq@hotmail.com) Received: from col0-omc3-s17.col0.hotmail.com (col0-omc3-s17.col0.hotmail.com [65.55.34.156]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80AA08FC22 for ; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 19:37:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: from COL116-DS10 ([65.55.34.135]) by col0-omc3-s17.col0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Tue, 6 Apr 2010 12:24:14 -0700 X-Originating-IP: [86.107.100.79] X-Originating-Email: [vikammwatkinsbwq@hotmail.com] Message-ID: From: Huff, Lawrence J. To: Date: Tue, 06 Apr 2010 23:22:04 +0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 14.0.8064.206 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V14.0.8064.206 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: binary X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Apr 2010 19:24:14.0878 (UTC) FILETIME=[BE6CBBE0:01CAD5BE] Subject: High yield Opportunity of the year. X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Apr 2010 19:37:47 -0000 Greetings freebsd-chat@freebsd.org, I would like to inform you about a very professional investment I take part in since seven month. I made 560% profit by now. This is a Hong Kong traders group, working on stock, derivatives, and Forex markets. 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Check them out: http://texugauto.com/mqqg7ks From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Apr 7 17:25:09 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45E81106566C for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 17:25:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us) Received: from outbound-mail-313.bluehost.com (cpoproxy3-pub.bluehost.com [67.222.54.6]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 11C478FC20 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 17:25:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 22430 invoked by uid 0); 7 Apr 2010 17:25:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box264.bluehost.com) (69.89.31.64) by cpoproxy3.bluehost.com with SMTP; 7 Apr 2010 17:25:08 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=joseph-a-nagy-jr.us; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:X-Enigmail-Version:Content-Type:X-Identified-User; b=qtwmFF9JBr9L4XqnTsXVCEEeMgq387fX5cd9YJwFaUHd4bJCrtqOWTji5gEtNrA/lXH8ZEudP2PPO/hkM44qsTTf36HxosqGJd4qK1nzGCiKFRf7Z0Z6YvKicyoMz2TD; Received: from [206.74.86.236] (helo=[192.168.1.101]) by box264.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NzYzz-00088E-S8 for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Wed, 07 Apr 2010 11:25:08 -0600 Message-ID: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 12:24:42 -0500 From: Programmer In Training User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100324 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: FreeBSD Chat X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enig55AEBA15F3F801FB4E5EC5EC" X-Identified-User: {2250:box264.bluehost.com:ameliora:joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} {sentby:smtp auth 206.74.86.236 authed with pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} Subject: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 17:25:09 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enig55AEBA15F3F801FB4E5EC5EC Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I would go to questions, but I'm not sure it's relevant there so I thought I'd ask here. I just received a new, never been unwrapped before I touched it, audio CD (Santcus Real, Pieces of a Real Heart). I can play it via 'cdcontrol play' but it won't play in VLC, Audacious won't recognize it, and Asunder can't rip it (for my fair use copy). Is this a problem with copy protection? If so, how would I verify that (I don't think that such information would be printed anywhere). I would ask how to bypass that, but I fully understand that because it is illegal (via the DMCA) to bypass any copy protection (even to exercise fair use rights), that such a question would probably be ignored and not responded to on list. I understand that, so I would never think of asking such a question despite rejecting the idea of intellect as property and also reject that the concept of copying as somehow depriving the artist of revenue (despite first sale doctrine). Just an FYI, I do not download torrents of music (owned or otherwise, if I own it why do I need to torrent it), and this won't change that fact. It will, however, color future ideas about purchasing from this artist. --=20 Yours In Christ, PIT Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscrib= ed. --------------enig55AEBA15F3F801FB4E5EC5EC Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLvL/uAAoJEENZQ8DH7rW0U/IIAIy4mF9qVvAXdTuusb6gGssx BE3QE7r5+SPSxtQUPawTqDUk50c9aTs0AehOGrR6ru2iJOpyBrXYa0orjrQSifcv LHU/iIKwueVNABIMC1Sc/wu0IpSmDnpgHidhsD2KD5M8Q3f3ka7blCUREiYJyqGy mtYyr2uyxzlt24x3+RTRxliKPk06koVcCDRC0b++7VSJEdjKBXnrD6rRcYYFBDrf RyrCydvf/edeQNpUUkBbeRhz/27Mu9Y314sh+hnbyVgYm5Ye68GkhPWqzPCZwAWr UUPhxgmdlACi89eJhsbekzposWic54lxzFcqnH+ZbBQw9Ix4l6iP+McdYPl07+8= =JUNU -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enig55AEBA15F3F801FB4E5EC5EC-- From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Apr 7 17:42:14 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD7771065674 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 17:42:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kdk@daleco.biz) Received: from ezekiel.daleco.biz (southernuniform.com [66.76.92.18]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 633B58FC0C for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 17:42:13 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ezekiel.daleco.biz (8.14.3/8.14.2) with ESMTP id o37HgCJG058533; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 12:42:12 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from kdk@daleco.biz) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at daleco.biz Received: from ezekiel.daleco.biz ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (ezekiel.daleco.biz [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 3PoZTqKnokSt; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 12:42:10 -0500 (CDT) Received: from archangel.daleco.biz (ezekiel.daleco.biz [66.76.92.18]) by ezekiel.daleco.biz (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id o37Hg4Fj058523; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 12:42:05 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from kdk@daleco.biz) Message-ID: <4BBCC3EC.7030805@daleco.biz> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 12:42:04 -0500 From: Kevin Kinsey User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.23 (X11/20090929) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Programmer In Training References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> In-Reply-To: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: FreeBSD Chat Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 17:42:14 -0000 Programmer In Training wrote: > I would go to questions, but I'm not sure it's relevant there so I > thought I'd ask here. > > I just received a new, never been unwrapped before I touched it, audio > CD (Santcus Real, Pieces of a Real Heart). I can play it via 'cdcontrol > play' but it won't play in VLC, Audacious won't recognize it, and > Asunder can't rip it (for my fair use copy). Tried lame? KDK > > Is this a problem with copy protection? If so, how would I verify that > (I don't think that such information would be printed anywhere). I would > ask how to bypass that, but I fully understand that because it is > illegal (via the DMCA) to bypass any copy protection (even to exercise > fair use rights), that such a question would probably be ignored and not > responded to on list. I understand that, so I would never think of > asking such a question despite rejecting the idea of intellect as > property and also reject that the concept of copying as somehow > depriving the artist of revenue (despite first sale doctrine). > > Just an FYI, I do not download torrents of music (owned or otherwise, if > I own it why do I need to torrent it), and this won't change that fact. > It will, however, color future ideas about purchasing from this artist. From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Apr 7 18:27:31 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D696B106566C for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 18:27:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us) Received: from outbound-mail-313.bluehost.com (cpoproxy3-pub.bluehost.com [67.222.54.6]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A5D108FC0A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 18:27:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 5811 invoked by uid 0); 7 Apr 2010 18:27:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box264.bluehost.com) (69.89.31.64) by cpoproxy3.bluehost.com with SMTP; 7 Apr 2010 18:27:31 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=joseph-a-nagy-jr.us; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:CC:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:X-Enigmail-Version:Content-Type:X-Identified-User; b=MNdzAxuSTiJ4heiPHYUCaLc6t1+ccqmrK39BYEzVmZmYeQz8zIOcpujPkIOIi2zS7Du0DYvbGYSzaK2bmib9hiJ9/X36fGZ2sAIxsB+ruIudflp+71JvcSDG3bQUPNvS; Received: from [206.74.86.236] (helo=[192.168.1.101]) by box264.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NzZyM-0008WE-I1; Wed, 07 Apr 2010 12:27:31 -0600 Message-ID: <4BBCCE85.1010108@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 13:27:17 -0500 From: Programmer In Training User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100324 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Kevin Kinsey References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> <4BBCC3EC.7030805@daleco.biz> In-Reply-To: <4BBCC3EC.7030805@daleco.biz> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigFBEA1C6E5F62C340FF84C64F" X-Identified-User: {2250:box264.bluehost.com:ameliora:joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} {sentby:smtp auth 206.74.86.236 authed with pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} Cc: FreeBSD Chat Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 18:27:32 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigFBEA1C6E5F62C340FF84C64F Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 04/07/10 12:42, Kevin Kinsey wrote: > Programmer In Training wrote: >> I would go to questions, but I'm not sure it's relevant there so I >> thought I'd ask here. >> >> I just received a new, never been unwrapped before I touched it, audio= >> CD (Santcus Real, Pieces of a Real Heart). I can play it via 'cdcontro= l >> play' but it won't play in VLC, Audacious won't recognize it, and >> Asunder can't rip it (for my fair use copy). >=20 > Tried lame? lame is an encoder, so no, I haven't tried using it to rip the cd. Here is the output from cdparanoia though: cdparanoia -B -d /dev/cd0 cdparanoia III release 9.8 (March 23, 2001) (C) 2001 Monty and Xiphophorus FreeBSD porting (c) 2003 Simon 'corecode' Schubert Report bugs to paranoia@xiph.org http://www.xiph.org/paranoia/ 006: Could not read any data from drive Cdparanoia could not find a way to read audio from this drive. So ripping seems to be out, as does playing unless I want to use 'cdcontrol' (which is an option, but highly annoying). --=20 Yours In Christ, PIT Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscrib= ed. --------------enigFBEA1C6E5F62C340FF84C64F Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLvM6MAAoJEENZQ8DH7rW0/VEH/juGN2Uafxj7gZW01EQ7/IFf sBPiAkzOmCdAEidesEaCZRlZkBW0BLT6U3CtPfacvnOxmI69BTmKCA6LfvvvxZlT s//+/TP/dCZZTriQ+9pOhiHBiSl+W/9+KGAPAZMR8XR7XPnVgCHIV30VQTGHhhEM JICI+uOSI7/xba8PFU5vLeVqPV/lVjcTGViKUgL26brPEiilF2IKtEFVh3QB4zzy kIOBxwJMn8Epn6Rci3O2rB/PdYiGY0VCsJUK2tF/2odXJc+kFNINyHCzFvXGmVog E1h92G2P+lM4fzCKw/V2CrUgRkQ+FTCWd0VCdM+eQ1XELyG4zXeTpVCbFIi9LN4= =a07e -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigFBEA1C6E5F62C340FF84C64F-- From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Apr 7 19:45:29 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55BD91065670 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 19:45:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kdk@daleco.biz) Received: from ezekiel.daleco.biz (southernuniform.com [66.76.92.18]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BE748FC1C for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 19:45:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ezekiel.daleco.biz (8.14.3/8.14.2) with ESMTP id o37JjScQ061440; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 14:45:28 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from kdk@daleco.biz) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at daleco.biz Received: from ezekiel.daleco.biz ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (ezekiel.daleco.biz [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id ZJXJ5b6NYvSb; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 14:45:26 -0500 (CDT) Received: from archangel.daleco.biz (ezekiel.daleco.biz [66.76.92.18]) by ezekiel.daleco.biz (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id o37JjNJR061434; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 14:45:24 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from kdk@daleco.biz) Message-ID: <4BBCE0D3.7080001@daleco.biz> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 14:45:23 -0500 From: Kevin Kinsey User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.23 (X11/20090929) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Programmer In Training References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> <4BBCC3EC.7030805@daleco.biz> In-Reply-To: <4BBCC3EC.7030805@daleco.biz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: FreeBSD Chat Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 19:45:29 -0000 Kevin Kinsey wrote: > Programmer In Training wrote: >> I would go to questions, but I'm not sure it's relevant there so I >> thought I'd ask here. >> >> I just received a new, never been unwrapped before I touched it, audio >> CD (Santcus Real, Pieces of a Real Heart). I can play it via 'cdcontrol >> play' but it won't play in VLC, Audacious won't recognize it, and >> Asunder can't rip it (for my fair use copy). > > Tried lame? Ok, so you don't wanna rip it. You can't "mount" an audio CD. As a non-root user, you can't access the CD directly. You can't run vlc by itself as the superuser, so you're stuck? Is this correct? Try "sudo vlc-wrapper", then try "Open Disc", pick CD, and Track 0. Does that work? HTH, KDK From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Apr 7 19:58:07 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E56F106564A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 19:58:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from onemda@gmail.com) Received: from mail-yx0-f175.google.com (mail-yx0-f175.google.com [209.85.210.175]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 588EA8FC15 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 19:58:07 +0000 (UTC) Received: by yxe5 with SMTP id 5so687248yxe.3 for ; Wed, 07 Apr 2010 12:58:06 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:received:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=Hqz2UV7P6wLDRQqGxLhlPCe/j1qulQ6+0Wj0bLDhJzc=; b=JUqb83WvEibZz0k3GuyZ/WUvZugTMC4wwCsbdGcVr0H+ORqGQaVOx9tz3duM/MzdKC y7Y5/8/XtElZLUE6VTtjSTMMwONQVWRVZnEDfrVlD3hc8bHp7LKzB0bj4x2dV3Lu8x+D dTQSMdUTSoKu1DITJF2Axl8wmi3UN6uALfEkY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; b=Rto1VAkyUJTlBSJ3hva/8OtwFcgcSr9WDY4MAtGSpnAfaIAN52h6JzZ+wjAWdINF0L 8/Gkv3wMQCTrcC6ka7exavvFgrubePI1NJ6jZKDGuM+9u961r494YJb1ruvY8SvhDr2O sI3pI/FAvQFd44WC1CzB1CvrJmNxEJvZWyuQI= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.150.124.17 with HTTP; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 12:31:02 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4BBCCE85.1010108@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> <4BBCC3EC.7030805@daleco.biz> <4BBCCE85.1010108@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2010 19:31:02 +0000 Received: by 10.150.243.5 with SMTP id q5mr9648892ybh.109.1270668662703; Wed, 07 Apr 2010 12:31:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: From: Paul B Mahol To: Programmer In Training Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: FreeBSD Chat Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 19:58:07 -0000 On 4/7/10, Programmer In Training wrote: > On 04/07/10 12:42, Kevin Kinsey wrote: >> Programmer In Training wrote: >>> I would go to questions, but I'm not sure it's relevant there so I >>> thought I'd ask here. >>> >>> I just received a new, never been unwrapped before I touched it, audio >>> CD (Santcus Real, Pieces of a Real Heart). I can play it via 'cdcontrol >>> play' but it won't play in VLC, Audacious won't recognize it, and >>> Asunder can't rip it (for my fair use copy). >> >> Tried lame? > > > lame is an encoder, so no, I haven't tried using it to rip the cd. > > Here is the output from cdparanoia though: > > cdparanoia -B -d /dev/cd0 > cdparanoia III release 9.8 (March 23, 2001) > (C) 2001 Monty and Xiphophorus > FreeBSD porting (c) 2003 > Simon 'corecode' Schubert > > Report bugs to paranoia@xiph.org > http://www.xiph.org/paranoia/ > > 006: Could not read any data from drive > > Cdparanoia could not find a way to read audio from this drive. > > So ripping seems to be out, as does playing unless I want to use > 'cdcontrol' (which is an option, but highly annoying). Perhaps it is DRM protected? From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Apr 7 20:40:14 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 256A7106566B for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 20:40:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us) Received: from outbound-mail-01.bluehost.com (cpoproxy1-pub.bluehost.com [69.89.21.11]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id DFB1C8FC13 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 20:40:13 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 30044 invoked by uid 0); 7 Apr 2010 20:40:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box264.bluehost.com) (69.89.31.64) by cpoproxy1.bluehost.com with SMTP; 7 Apr 2010 20:40:13 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=joseph-a-nagy-jr.us; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:X-Enigmail-Version:Content-Type:X-Identified-User; b=ggjN0j/KMTTi8LfDBbt5N1cVJqoe0HUEs3WtEBz8FCTG1s6bfRI/CfCH4PD8wzmVtWZyDCRjze6fZuxFZnrrrkDlh1/C4KobgIlxcVx7EE7IA0uveFvQQ3egI7si7wyw; Received: from [206.74.86.236] (helo=[192.168.1.101]) by box264.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Nzc2m-0006yy-Es for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Wed, 07 Apr 2010 14:40:13 -0600 Message-ID: <4BBCED9C.1060101@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 15:39:56 -0500 From: Programmer In Training User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100324 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> <4BBCC3EC.7030805@daleco.biz> <4BBCE0D3.7080001@daleco.biz> In-Reply-To: <4BBCE0D3.7080001@daleco.biz> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enig21E5FC46F227E34422901F73" X-Identified-User: {2250:box264.bluehost.com:ameliora:joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} {sentby:smtp auth 206.74.86.236 authed with pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 20:40:14 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enig21E5FC46F227E34422901F73 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 04/07/10 14:45, Kevin Kinsey wrote: > Kevin Kinsey wrote: >> Programmer In Training wrote: >>> I would go to questions, but I'm not sure it's relevant there so I >>> thought I'd ask here. >>> >>> I just received a new, never been unwrapped before I touched it, audi= o >>> CD (Santcus Real, Pieces of a Real Heart). I can play it via 'cdcontr= ol >>> play' but it won't play in VLC, Audacious won't recognize it, and >>> Asunder can't rip it (for my fair use copy). >> >> Tried lame? >=20 > Ok, so you don't wanna rip it. You can't "mount" an audio CD. > As a non-root user, you can't access the CD directly. You can't > run vlc by itself as the superuser, so you're stuck? Is this > correct? >=20 > Try "sudo vlc-wrapper", then try "Open Disc", pick CD, and > Track 0. Does that work? No, it doesn't. Good idea though (and I've been meaning to install sudo).= So it's safe to assume this CD is copy protected. Thanks for the help guys and again, sorry if this was the wrong list to post to. --=20 Yours In Christ, PIT Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscrib= ed. --------------enig21E5FC46F227E34422901F73 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLvO2jAAoJEENZQ8DH7rW0xOEH/2FsVmdLa2m/LKj7dHbcrNiD G9CN/Q/lR5Q7asCAsjNoJ1Te383HvW74x4nU+c/ZRmt7jAi/1WeGeiavGsfeY6NK Kpc+vZaag6XGCNecY5O+oBfaTlw351vZqoNTKmGM1hABbOHhOncNa2gFG92/gzzD hVZdCnkzqkelKS9iRDzw/v/m8aGlMvwNhRMVl5H7iDEcStm8hRRrRPgyk1oIDomZ aS2s0JYKQzekEZgDhtu11FCSEFvbkcQd0gy27Y5BXlDtH9XybuGr0F7mhT+FjA/a my0KuBeAcL0ez8gx/ZePblqcF5RX+v+7GfGeXDSQybdRJ86OrvAGS/wGPNPFFD4= =jO6K -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enig21E5FC46F227E34422901F73-- From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Apr 7 21:09:06 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 533341065672 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 21:09:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-chat-local@be-well.ilk.org) Received: from mail2.sea5.speakeasy.net (mail2.sea5.speakeasy.net [69.17.117.4]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C6ED8FC13 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 21:09:05 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 1444 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2010 21:09:05 -0000 Received: from dsl092-078-145.bos1.dsl.speakeasy.net (HELO be-well.ilk.org) ([66.92.78.145]) (envelope-sender ) by mail2.sea5.speakeasy.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 7 Apr 2010 21:09:05 -0000 Received: by be-well.ilk.org (Postfix, from userid 1147) id 116E850852; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 17:09:04 -0400 (EDT) From: Lowell Gilbert To: Programmer In Training References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 17:09:03 -0400 In-Reply-To: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> (Programmer In Training's message of "Wed, 07 Apr 2010 12:24:42 -0500") Message-ID: <44iq83m0ls.fsf@be-well.ilk.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.1 (berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cc: FreeBSD Chat Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 21:09:06 -0000 Programmer In Training writes: > I would go to questions, but I'm not sure it's relevant there so I > thought I'd ask here. > > I just received a new, never been unwrapped before I touched it, audio > CD (Santcus Real, Pieces of a Real Heart). I can play it via 'cdcontrol > play' but it won't play in VLC, Audacious won't recognize it, and > Asunder can't rip it (for my fair use copy). Return it as defective. Even if this is a case of copy protection, that makes it defective. To be honest, I doubt that it's intentional copy protection, but I don't see why it matters anyway. > Just an FYI, I do not download torrents of music (owned or otherwise, if > I own it why do I need to torrent it), and this won't change that fact. > It will, however, color future ideas about purchasing from this artist. Don't blame the artist; blame the record label. If they *own* the record label, then go ahead and put the blame anywhere you like. From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Apr 7 21:33:37 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39FD01065672 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 21:33:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from smtp.des.no (smtp.des.no [194.63.250.102]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B945A8FC0A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 21:33:36 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ds4.des.no (des.no [84.49.246.2]) by smtp.des.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CC801FFC22; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 21:33:35 +0000 (UTC) Received: by ds4.des.no (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 6343284509; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 23:33:35 +0200 (CEST) From: =?utf-8?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=C3=B8rgrav?= To: Programmer In Training References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> <4BBCC3EC.7030805@daleco.biz> <4BBCE0D3.7080001@daleco.biz> <4BBCED9C.1060101@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 23:33:34 +0200 In-Reply-To: <4BBCED9C.1060101@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> (Programmer In Training's message of "Wed, 07 Apr 2010 15:39:56 -0500") Message-ID: <86bpdv3q35.fsf@ds4.des.no> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.95 (berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 21:33:37 -0000 Programmer In Training writes: > So it's safe to assume this CD is copy protected. I have a couple of "copy-protected" CDs here that I bought by accident (I wouldn't have bought them if I knew they were "protected"). They have two things in common: 1) They won't play in my HiFi DVD player 2) I had zero trouble ripping them (using iTunes on Windows XP) I don't remember if I ever tried to rip them using FreeBSD or Linux. So copy protection does not, in fact, prevent copying, but it does prevent some legitimate use cases, even the kind of use cases that the labels *do* want to allow. DES --=20 Dag-Erling Sm=C3=B8rgrav - des@des.no From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Apr 7 21:38:54 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FF311065680 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 21:38:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us) Received: from outbound-mail-313.bluehost.com (cpoproxy3-pub.bluehost.com [67.222.54.6]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id E18908FC22 for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 21:38:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 27674 invoked by uid 0); 7 Apr 2010 21:38:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box264.bluehost.com) (69.89.31.64) by cpoproxy3.bluehost.com with SMTP; 7 Apr 2010 21:38:53 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=joseph-a-nagy-jr.us; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:X-Enigmail-Version:Content-Type:X-Identified-User; b=Tk5hi6pVcZZmO09ZzGdy2J8eW9uLABbf9vq2Fqcg9ShRG88UGI5Q2oaFZN7bET96sz1xRQ6tK75nRRdsjEwvcCqr6Xd+7Ppt9ZZ9nABi5+lDRWxP3rrblaxlJZQJTc4b; Received: from [206.74.86.236] (helo=[192.168.1.101]) by box264.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NzcxY-0007JG-Nm for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Wed, 07 Apr 2010 15:38:53 -0600 Message-ID: <4BBCFB53.603@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 16:38:27 -0500 From: Programmer In Training User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100324 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> <44iq83m0ls.fsf@be-well.ilk.org> In-Reply-To: <44iq83m0ls.fsf@be-well.ilk.org> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigB556303C5865C0BA082379FA" X-Identified-User: {2250:box264.bluehost.com:ameliora:joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} {sentby:smtp auth 206.74.86.236 authed with pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 21:38:54 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigB556303C5865C0BA082379FA Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Please folks, quit CCing me. I'm subscribed to the list. I even state as much in my sig. All this extra mail is just clutter. On 04/07/10 16:09, Lowell Gilbert wrote: > Programmer In Training writes: >=20 >> I would go to questions, but I'm not sure it's relevant there so I >> thought I'd ask here. >> >> I just received a new, never been unwrapped before I touched it, audio= >> CD (Santcus Real, Pieces of a Real Heart). I can play it via 'cdcontro= l >> play' but it won't play in VLC, Audacious won't recognize it, and >> Asunder can't rip it (for my fair use copy). >=20 > Return it as defective. Even if this is a case of copy protection, tha= t > makes it defective. To be honest, I doubt that it's intentional copy > protection, but I don't see why it matters anyway. It's not a matter of money and even if it were, I won the CD in a legal contest. >> Just an FYI, I do not download torrents of music (owned or otherwise, = if >> I own it why do I need to torrent it), and this won't change that fact= =2E >> It will, however, color future ideas about purchasing from this artist= =2E >=20 > Don't blame the artist; blame the record label. If they *own* the > record label, then go ahead and put the blame anywhere you like. Then the artists, if they are opposed to such measures, should seek a different label. I can't hurt the label directly without hurting the artist, too. In war the artists would be termed collateral damage. This is a war. One the RIAA and artists like Metallica started (though I will admit that bootleggers had a big hand in making it a war). I'm firing back full bore. I will not sit idly by and be treated as if I'm a criminal. --=20 Yours In Christ, PIT Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscrib= ed. --------------enigB556303C5865C0BA082379FA Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLvPtnAAoJEENZQ8DH7rW08MQH/3e7WabEXjZAEtiSBzjzhn5g EcLly03tO0eJz+QAlXKAg/IZQzRnxqlWv132129kaI7JZ8+4xT2U4xQrUCG8MsIv WHPl4Og2I3RAQ8xtY4OUDJ7SqBprHbJr5SyM1FKo8mLha1XGPz9gcoMHyMljk52a t80pyIqqwECXjmEhWmj1c6uvFv+rLOx/q8nuwx0t+SP+P0VHuSDef2N3anGUrtf8 QIeFeAh4HrUkg8nO3NtbwBz59qK+rbdTCg2vD69PzLwq7xB9jsRYQWBBjNsGEwwW fm61e717ixvJM+COKPhJ6JUInWGXpgxyKApvnh7rTcPOrkrNAKnS9PCex5bL+XQ= =Tvo8 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigB556303C5865C0BA082379FA-- From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Apr 7 22:09:03 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DFDB106564A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 22:09:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us) Received: from outbound-mail-158.bluehost.com (cpoproxy2-pub.bluehost.com [67.222.39.38]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C00998FC0A for ; Wed, 7 Apr 2010 22:09:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 10335 invoked by uid 0); 7 Apr 2010 22:09:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box264.bluehost.com) (69.89.31.64) by cpoproxy2.bluehost.com with SMTP; 7 Apr 2010 22:09:02 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=joseph-a-nagy-jr.us; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:X-Enigmail-Version:Content-Type:X-Identified-User; b=AAoPMaURSQLgp8jL4Z8unrNUyPz6hzo58C5DLeTHHW+435YWkTdSeUjEP7be3yObqi3B3fH665MR7ITmQ6qpj/hIxnC3gH8jEsgOlEBN7kZMvZPsSVJ7buo14pd1qxvf; Received: from [206.74.86.236] (helo=[192.168.1.101]) by box264.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NzdQg-0001at-Vu for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Wed, 07 Apr 2010 16:09:01 -0600 Message-ID: <4BBD025F.4040902@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 17:08:31 -0500 From: Programmer In Training User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100324 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> <4BBCC3EC.7030805@daleco.biz> <4BBCE0D3.7080001@daleco.biz> <4BBCED9C.1060101@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> <86bpdv3q35.fsf@ds4.des.no> In-Reply-To: <86bpdv3q35.fsf@ds4.des.no> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enig8C38ABE410BFF22EAE91754D" X-Identified-User: {2250:box264.bluehost.com:ameliora:joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} {sentby:smtp auth 206.74.86.236 authed with pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2010 22:09:03 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enig8C38ABE410BFF22EAE91754D Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 04/07/10 16:33, Dag-Erling Sm=C3=B8rgrav wrote: > Programmer In Training writes: >> So it's safe to assume this CD is copy protected. >=20 > I have a couple of "copy-protected" CDs here that I bought by accident = (I > wouldn't have bought them if I knew they were "protected"). >=20 > They have two things in common: >=20 > 1) They won't play in my HiFi DVD player > 2) I had zero trouble ripping them (using iTunes on Windows XP) >=20 > I don't remember if I ever tried to rip them using FreeBSD or Linux. >=20 > So copy protection does not, in fact, prevent copying, but it does > prevent some legitimate use cases, even the kind of use cases that the > labels *do* want to allow. >=20 > DES I don't use iTunes (and refuse to do so for various reasons, mostly having to do with my opinion of Jobs and Apple in general). I'm going to try Winamp on XP tonight. --=20 Yours In Christ, PIT Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscrib= ed. --------------enig8C38ABE410BFF22EAE91754D Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLvQJxAAoJEENZQ8DH7rW0rjsH/Rvov952UdNTVH//n3plkApx t2xrhs05IOc660ue/Q4kLkbsaLe88DHpXSE1LEADIlkRHHPqgMR/43+ZCE9pvwQJ 00vP9CGTHvx3u9AOkbfVqYCGzuekWadWDJLMw4slIyVTZT7wwpB8k8hdl2n2Wuv/ qHGL4azNo6MdO++N2qr1LjFvtZLgUb30MJ1OidPxlLzHTz5L687LM2NIHx7uH/Ow bjUtjxe4IvwRD8B/T00rl/04y8qMYhO5FtbQbkXNAUhQZ1ysQnAXtM3Wec1mkIST MWJXCdwOp2kwP3DcddrnjG28DQvoPwJMWLKe5T/s91zDDex2rJdKiglfSjk4KE0= =KLQM -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enig8C38ABE410BFF22EAE91754D-- From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Apr 8 14:48:30 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C7D4106567A for ; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 14:48:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-listen@fabiankeil.de) Received: from smtprelay01.ispgateway.de (smtprelay01.ispgateway.de [80.67.31.39]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F13068FC18 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 14:48:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [78.34.174.32] (helo=r500.local) by smtprelay01.ispgateway.de with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1Nzspf-0005rc-Vw for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 16:35:48 +0200 Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2010 16:35:44 +0200 From: Fabian Keil To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20100408163544.450ff66b@r500.local> In-Reply-To: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.7.5 (GTK+ 2.18.7; amd64-portbld-freebsd9.0) X-PGP-KEY-URL: http://www.fabiankeil.de/gpg-keys/freebsd-listen-2008-08-18.asc Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=PGP-SHA1; boundary="Sig_/QMscOzvNDVg0/ehEM3DwyuM"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Df-Sender: 775067 Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2010 14:48:30 -0000 --Sig_/QMscOzvNDVg0/ehEM3DwyuM Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Programmer In Training wrote: > I just received a new, never been unwrapped before I touched it, audio > CD (Santcus Real, Pieces of a Real Heart). I can play it via 'cdcontrol > play' but it won't play in VLC, Audacious won't recognize it, and > Asunder can't rip it (for my fair use copy). If you can play the disc with cdcontrol I would expect that you can also rip it without problems using cdda2wav, which is part of the port sysutils/cdrtools-devel. > Is this a problem with copy protection? If so, how would I verify that > (I don't think that such information would be printed anywhere). At least in Germany audio discs with intentional defects are usually marked as "copy protected" (or similar sounding nonsense) on the back and additionally lack the CDDA logo (as they don't comply with the standard). Fabian --Sig_/QMscOzvNDVg0/ehEM3DwyuM Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iEYEARECAAYFAku96cQACgkQBYqIVf93VJ0gDQCfQRsSJ4Z9sfq+9w0kjbm8/i7w 5XUAnAkT5n4VNTwBpVczoVz60rwvBTL4 =/wCw -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/QMscOzvNDVg0/ehEM3DwyuM-- From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Apr 8 15:09:42 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1054D106564A for ; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 15:09:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us) Received: from outbound-mail-01.bluehost.com (cpoproxy1-pub.bluehost.com [69.89.21.11]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CDDD58FC08 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 15:09:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 30008 invoked by uid 0); 8 Apr 2010 15:09:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box264.bluehost.com) (69.89.31.64) by cpoproxy1.bluehost.com with SMTP; 8 Apr 2010 15:09:40 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=joseph-a-nagy-jr.us; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:X-Enigmail-Version:Content-Type:X-Identified-User; b=EpbrhFkpgSoBHZ373616ELV+RGdFvY2/dKwPkcdw9Doi5xMsP8L4rkk+2uPcpjBczRg/CHvQrAIUneZLm6PH0fW+Jd8M+Vkj1m+jy+hMtsGDr6utFPV3gcF5qa8dkD6G; Received: from [206.74.86.236] (helo=[192.168.1.101]) by box264.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NztMR-00085s-Pj for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 09:09:40 -0600 Message-ID: <4BBDF197.2070807@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2010 10:09:11 -0500 From: Programmer In Training User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100324 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> <20100408163544.450ff66b@r500.local> In-Reply-To: <20100408163544.450ff66b@r500.local> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigC3454385EFE2B7AEBC94915E" X-Identified-User: {2250:box264.bluehost.com:ameliora:joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} {sentby:smtp auth 206.74.86.236 authed with pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2010 15:09:42 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigC3454385EFE2B7AEBC94915E Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 04/08/10 09:35, Fabian Keil wrote: > Programmer In Training wrote: >=20 >> I just received a new, never been unwrapped before I touched it, audio= >> CD (Santcus Real, Pieces of a Real Heart). I can play it via 'cdcontro= l >> play' but it won't play in VLC, Audacious won't recognize it, and >> Asunder can't rip it (for my fair use copy). >=20 > If you can play the disc with cdcontrol I would expect > that you can also rip it without problems using cdda2wav, > which is part of the port sysutils/cdrtools-devel. That seems to be working, thanks. I still won't be buying any CDs from this group. >> Is this a problem with copy protection? If so, how would I verify that= >> (I don't think that such information would be printed anywhere). >=20 > At least in Germany audio discs with intentional defects are > usually marked as "copy protected" (or similar sounding nonsense) > on the back and additionally lack the CDDA logo (as they don't > comply with the standard). >=20 > Fabian Well, I don't see the CDDA logo anywhere on the printed material that came with the disk and jewel case. Going to verify with another group's CD just to be sure that such is printed on discs here. --=20 Yours In Christ, PIT Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscrib= ed. --------------enigC3454385EFE2B7AEBC94915E Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLvfGuAAoJEENZQ8DH7rW06tsH/14F44LhvHFbjy5Z4y/FMVYa D4mzwPmK1REGlDCDLUxLF1tR5i8seIM6MmjfqPFOOamec2u20uSh5N1WDRr0J0MX pVwuTfbPXEN7bjH39kGRyQIWjRxBzcCwxpast4H0R/3Sl3JlpGWs4r1/nCAqVrpZ C4rISCFpyDvNdRia+jFcJ/91Lpe1XCWPLOgFqUVk8P11kbT2guwIUq6+D9we1uhv rYngfbo+RUH0O2CvRzAYzXFVshvau9zn53UITRSAysUKgJ3v5DVKjyIBqlkSgGdg NjWLcOCFJcp3K803u6wX7g1wCfnSurPBeSVzikvhkByfSsRGtvCitPM0quhtDPk= =bkra -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigC3454385EFE2B7AEBC94915E-- From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Apr 8 16:03:19 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28E4D1065674 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 16:03:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from frank@esperance-linux.co.uk) Received: from atmail-10.bnguk.net (atmail-10.bnguk.net [80.74.253.10]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC8D78FC16 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 16:03:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: from 77-44-105-82.xdsl.murphx.net ([77.44.105.82] helo=orange.esperance-linux.co.uk) by atmail-10.bnguk.net with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NztW2-0000mm-Tz; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 16:19:35 +0100 Received: by orange.esperance-linux.co.uk (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 5EA1133C36; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 16:19:34 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2010 16:19:34 +0100 From: Frank Shute To: Programmer In Training Message-ID: <20100408151934.GA1217@orange.esperance-linux.co.uk> Mail-Followup-To: Programmer In Training , freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> <44iq83m0ls.fsf@be-well.ilk.org> <4BBCFB53.603@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <4BBCFB53.603@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.3i X-Face: *}~{PHnDTzvXPe'wl_-f%!@+r5; VLhb':*DsX%wEOPg\fDrXWQJf|2\,92"DdS%63t*BHDyQ|OWo@Gfjcd72eaN!4%NE{0]p)ihQ1MyFNtWL X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 8.0-RELEASE amd64 X-Organisation: 'shute.org.uk' Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Frank Shute List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2010 16:03:19 -0000 On Wed, Apr 07, 2010 at 04:38:27PM -0500, Programmer In Training wrote: > > Please folks, quit CCing me. I'm subscribed to the list. I even state as > much in my sig. All this extra mail is just clutter. FYI, it's standard netiquette to cc people on a mailing list aswell as usenet. If you don't like it set up mail/procmail or unsubscribe from the list. My email client, Mutt, has a group reply feature specifically for replying to mailing list post which involves it cc'ing the OP. Don't expect the users of this list to change their habits to save you work. [snip] > -- > Yours In Christ, Being an atheist, I also find this offensive and I suspect I'm not the only one it offends. After all, this is a multi-faith, multi-denominational list. I don't feel the need to advertise my religious beliefs, why do you? Regards, -- Frank Contact info: http://www.shute.org.uk/misc/contact.html From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Apr 8 18:06:54 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22DF9106566C for ; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 18:06:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bill_henderson@hotmail.fr) Received: from snt0-omc1-s7.snt0.hotmail.com (snt0-omc1-s7.snt0.hotmail.com [65.55.90.18]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB38D8FC16 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 18:06:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: from SNT127-W35 ([65.55.90.8]) by snt0-omc1-s7.snt0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Thu, 8 Apr 2010 10:54:52 -0700 Message-ID: X-Originating-IP: [82.242.109.147] From: William Henderson To: , Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2010 19:54:52 +0200 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20100408151934.GA1217@orange.esperance-linux.co.uk> References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us>, <44iq83m0ls.fsf@be-well.ilk.org> <4BBCFB53.603@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us>, <20100408151934.GA1217@orange.esperance-linux.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Apr 2010 17:54:52.0187 (UTC) FILETIME=[96D686B0:01CAD744] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: RE: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2010 18:06:54 -0000 Please just get me off this list I never asked to be put on it in the first place =20 _________________________________________________________________ D=E9couvrez comment SURFER DISCRETEMENT sur un site de rencontres ! http://clk.atdmt.com/FRM/go/206608211/direct/01/= From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Apr 8 18:10:07 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61326106566B for ; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 18:10:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us) Received: from outbound-mail-158.bluehost.com (cpoproxy2-pub.bluehost.com [67.222.39.38]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 275FB8FC14 for ; Thu, 8 Apr 2010 18:10:06 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 10767 invoked by uid 0); 8 Apr 2010 18:10:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box264.bluehost.com) (69.89.31.64) by cpoproxy2.bluehost.com with SMTP; 8 Apr 2010 18:10:06 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=joseph-a-nagy-jr.us; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:X-Enigmail-Version:Content-Type:X-Identified-User; b=AJDUO8zOTcYaWuYr4Vk3HXBm2XmZAGMzpuzjAf5+XZRd1KQBltFc4CEkVnV5El4ZNl3bnpIiceJUqSfnq94Pu39/G3ducRHVQQK6sx7Z+SEJISAUMT12+p4J/JI9Sgmq; Received: from [206.74.86.236] (helo=[192.168.1.101]) by box264.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NzwB3-000770-SF for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Thu, 08 Apr 2010 12:10:06 -0600 Message-ID: <4BBE1BEB.6080503@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2010 13:09:47 -0500 From: Programmer In Training User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100324 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <4BBCBFDA.5060904@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us>, <44iq83m0ls.fsf@be-well.ilk.org> <4BBCFB53.603@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us>, <20100408151934.GA1217@orange.esperance-linux.co.uk> In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigEAD6F762FA3E4D97C6A051F5" X-Identified-User: {2250:box264.bluehost.com:ameliora:joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} {sentby:smtp auth 206.74.86.236 authed with pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} Subject: Re: Problems With New Audio CD X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Apr 2010 18:10:07 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigEAD6F762FA3E4D97C6A051F5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 04/08/10 12:54, William Henderson wrote: > Please just get me off this list >=20 >=20 > I never asked to be put on it in the first place You should find unsubscribe instructions at the end of every list email. Just in case you don't see them: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org mailing list <--- Mailing list you are subscribed to (and you would have had to manually subscribe and then confirm said subscription before you receive list email) http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-chat <--- List info, including unsubscribe instructions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-chat-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<----- Instructions included in ever email from the list on how to unsubscribe. Good luck! --=20 Yours In Christ, PIT Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscrib= ed. --------------enigEAD6F762FA3E4D97C6A051F5 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLvhv4AAoJEENZQ8DH7rW0r40IAJF65WqBW1X4oWxLu1rtweTt ZtZdfe0dobK+NB8r+dw9J5qNNEnneIpMYg+x8Lj2CrZaeKl7yDSaDBXPFZR1xviq wa1YoNEF5UMMMlUZ53yOC7dGow/xK9y6dcPoUAYoX/uLiYC5JN3H4fg6n1zMfc3v M46Lu2btWusF/duRpZ4fBEh8hdb8ItcslaZVA0LI6cigaq66fneBce3ctYInbNko 6zq6NII0K7eVUjE3gT5+jua5XwXwISgtFK7HR0IOhjVH4ETC+cw59rMN+PlXLLj+ CW7COPMXbHrIhKG+z9+QoSEz+uAAgwUkALkklRqiYC9YBgZEeZzbfgS/5ahPQDs= =j1hU -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigEAD6F762FA3E4D97C6A051F5-- From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Apr 10 01:27:53 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 777991065670 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 01:27:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from reed@reedmedia.net) Received: from c-0500.emailmediator.com (c-0500.emailmediator.com [64.85.162.118]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 561D08FC15 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 01:27:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pool-173-74-33-121.dllstx.fios.verizon.net ([173.74.33.121] helo=reedmedia.net) by c-0500.emailmediator.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1O0PUH-0007MB-Nz for chat@freebsd.org; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 21:27:53 -0400 Received: from reed@reedmedia.net by reedmedia.net with local (mailout 0.17) id 7037-1270862875; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 20:27:56 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 20:27:55 -0500 (CDT) From: "Jeremy C. Reed" X-X-Sender: reed@t1.m.reedmedia.net To: chat@freebsd.org Message-ID: User-Agent: Alpine 2.01 (NEB 1266 2009-07-14) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: Subject: "app store" for open source Unix? X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 01:27:53 -0000 (I am not an iphone user. I did have a sidekick 2 which had a small store to browse and install software applications with. And I have a Nokia phone. But I installed third-party software manually by searching for software via google.) My nine-year-old asks me if I have some software to install ... I understand iphones have hundreds of thousands to millions of "apps" and google-based phones have tens of thousands of applications. (Note that "google apps" has different meaning, so I mean like the Android Market.) Samsung and others have "apps stores" too. Apparently, the software choices can easily be browsed, selected, (purchased if needed), and installed (including fetching). They suggest what it is cool and interesting. Examples: simple keyboard to play music, stopwatch, pacman game, calculator, and other widgets. Full size desktop screen is not needed for me, just a small area. I have no ideas about "dependencies" for these. I assume that most if not all are standalone. Other than being designed for a particular API defined by the vendor. Well why can't we have this for open source Unix for desktop users? I assume all these apps are designed to fit a certain mold, are based on a consistent API, maybe using common templates, most have a standard interface, etc. The only thing that comes to mind for me now are old Window Maker Dock Apps: http://web.cs.mun.ca/~gstarkes/wmaker/dockapps/ http://www.dockapps.org/ But selection is way too small. A quick search today took me to http://qt-apps.org/ which looks like a fine way to browse, but not the quickest way. And when I click to download I was taken to a sourceforge site. So no timesaver for me. Now I just found http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applet_Gallery http://wiki.awn-project.org/Awn-extras But it is a wiki and doesn't really let you click to install. The wiki is mostly a deadend. But the docs (on http://wiki.awn-project.org/Applets) do point out some things I want: - press install and select applet - or grag to some area in the window manager - you can activate, deactivate, delete applets (but doesn't seem to offer a download mechanism) Why can't I go to some website, quickly find apps (including showing screenshots or video), and install and run with one click (once I find it)? How can apple and google create these "app" markets so fast? (On that note, often when I need a quick software tool, I search the web for a website that has a javascript or CGI backend to do what I want -- since it is so much faster than downloading a package.) I do understand the problem. The open source Unix community is so diverse -- so many platforms, so many APIs, so many different developer environments, so many opinions, and little money incentive. Using FreeBSD as an example: does FreeBSD currently solve any of this problem for me? Front website doesn't have "software" or "package" or "app". It does have "ports" but not highlighted at the top. (At least I know what "ports" means.) Ports page doesn't excite me. I am bored, what do I want to install? Or I need this, where do I find it? I want a simple weather widget... I type "weather" in the search textbox. So I get a long webpage (long because it lists the many "Requires" -- that already scares me). No long descriptions on same page. Short descriptions don't help me much. No pictures. The order is alphabetical by category and within category. No opinions, no rankings. Not sure what to click on. So I will click on the first one. Ooops. Takes me to cvsweb. I click browser back arrow and read some more. So many links. I click "Download". And I download. How does it know what platform I am using (hoping it detected it for me). It is a tarball. I look at it. Oh, it is only individual ports directory -- the build specifications -- for the single package. (Can that individual tarball really be used standalone by anyone without ports tree?) Well I know about freshports. I use it often. (I interviewed its webmaster in New Zealand? and wrote an article about it about 10 years ago.) Front page shows latest updates, latest vulnerabilities. No suggestions to tell me what I should try today. I type "weather" in the small search box, No click to install, but at least it gives me some good advice "To add the package: pkg_add -r ..." -- assuming packages are really available for my -r detection and that I don't have any old or conflicting dependencies already installed. Plus I don't even know yet if the "app" will startup and appear on my desktop and show me what I want. Okay. PCBSD. Your turn. Can't find "software" or "package", but I do see a good hint buried in some release notes on same page: "Updated Software Manager, allows browsing and installing applications directly" (but that is only by coincidence). That is what I want! Still on frontpage, I als see "Store" and "Download". Well "Download" is for installing entire operating system. "Store" ... maybe an "App Store"? Nope. I stop here -- but I am encouraged to try the "Updated Software Manager" to see if it shows highlights of new "apps" to try when I am bored or makes it easy to start a "weather" app. I should have picked on NetBSD or Debian instead :) But same problems. It would be awesome to have: - defined desktop "API" that includes consistent way to start, define in menu, advertise itself, provide demos, etc. - provided in portable format, like some scripting language or portable dynamic language (like parrot virtual machine) that is consistent from system to system - all dependencies must by bundled in same download -- or be able to installed easily and if a conflict is there, still install to alternative place (and used from there). - IDE that attracts these "app" developers - easy for app developers to publish/distribute their application to the "market" - website (and applications) that make it simple to find new applications. What's popular? Ranked? Reviews? See demo. Make it easy to know it is what you want. One click install which downloads and the gives you choice to run right then. - be able to see all my installed apps and manage them. Does anything like this exist? Since I don't use any modern app stores, please share your thoughts about them and how they compare with what is available now? (I noticed with adroidapps.com no way to download and android.com/market/ says need to view "on a handset".) By the way, can you use any of these phone apps on regular desktop computers? Also if a different open source Unix system already provides this, please let me know. From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Apr 10 02:17:19 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 555811065670 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 02:17:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jamie@geniegate.com) Received: from geniegate.com (geniegate.com [65.18.174.84]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0086E8FC1B for ; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 02:17:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: from geniegate.com (geniegate.com [65.18.174.84]) by geniegate.com (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id o3A2Kep2017621 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 02:20:40 GMT (envelope-from jamie@geniegate.com) Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by geniegate.com (8.14.2/8.14.2/Submit) id o3A2Kdta017620 for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 02:20:39 GMT (envelope-from jamie@geniegate.com) X-Authentication-Warning: geniegate.com: joe set sender to jamie@geniegate.com using -f Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 16:16:12 -0500 From: Jamie To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20100409211612.GB6032@apollo.podro.com> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20 (2009-06-14) Subject: Re: "app store" for open source Unix? X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 02:17:19 -0000 On Fri, Apr 09, 2010 at 08:27:55PM -0500, Jeremy C. Reed wrote: > Well why can't we have this for open source Unix for desktop users? > > I assume all these apps are designed to fit a certain mold, are based on > a consistent API, maybe using common templates, most have a standard > interface, etc. Well, different distributions have different "app stores" they're not web based (and IMO, hopefully never will be! it's a PAIN to install stuff like that on remote servers) I know you're already aware of "ports" so I won't go there. > I do understand the problem. The open source Unix community is so > diverse -- so many platforms, so many APIs, so many different developer > environments, so many opinions, and little money incentive. For cross platform, there is "pkgsrc" you might look into it, NetBSD, DragonFlyBSD and rumors... some linux's can use pkgsrc. We have the technology to do all this, but, not everyone uses a unix desktop. I for one would be disgusted if I needed a gui or a browser to install something. Browsing them is a bit of a hassle, I use 'grep' for that, but I guess there's something like: make search keyword="blah" (I never use that) Most of the apps have some kind of URL you can load for more info if you need it. I do wish there were a safe way to run the make config-recursive and have it "really" do it recursively, I wish the build system would test for a tty and if no tty, go into batch mode, and I wish it'd email me if it needed more from me. (and give me the chance to conf later one) Something like this: # echo "cd app/app ; make install clean" | batch batch runs the install, (I always use batch, it's well suited to this) Later on, it needs me to specify something, so, it detects no TTY, and instead sends me an email "Hey, I need some info!" (perhaps with an email attachment that I can "launch" and mail back) it sits there, in a frozen state, waiting for info (perhaps reading config from a unique named pipe) In any event, it should give me a unique ID (example: 1234) which might be a named pipe called /tmp/pkg-conf-1235.pipe Then, (if I can't do it via email), I simply login and run something like: # config-running-port 1234 Which fires up a gadget for me to supply additional info to the package being built, and things continue... (I suppose this stage could have a web based gadget, but security would be an issue, one would hope the web part would be a lower priority... I'd much rather be able to simply forward the config via email to an alias and have it fed into the pipe after being verified) Jamie -- http://www.geniegate.com Custom web programming Perl * Java * UNIX User Management Solutions From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Apr 10 03:32:52 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF398106564A for ; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 03:32:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from reed@reedmedia.net) Received: from c-0500.emailmediator.com (c-0500.emailmediator.com [64.85.162.118]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A53408FC1A for ; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 03:32:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pool-173-74-33-121.dllstx.fios.verizon.net ([173.74.33.121] helo=reedmedia.net) by c-0500.emailmediator.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1O0QqE-0004DS-A9; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 22:54:38 -0400 Received: from reed@reedmedia.net by reedmedia.net with local (mailout 0.17) id 3067-1270868080; Fri, 09 Apr 2010 21:54:41 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Apr 2010 21:54:40 -0500 (CDT) From: "Jeremy C. Reed" X-X-Sender: reed@t1.m.reedmedia.net To: Jamie In-Reply-To: <20100409211612.GB6032@apollo.podro.com> Message-ID: References: <20100409211612.GB6032@apollo.podro.com> User-Agent: Alpine 2.01 (NEB 1266 2009-07-14) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: "app store" for open source Unix? X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 03:32:53 -0000 On Fri, 9 Apr 2010, Jamie wrote: > > I do understand the problem. The open source Unix community is so > > diverse -- so many platforms, so many APIs, so many different developer > > environments, so many opinions, and little money incentive. > > For cross platform, there is "pkgsrc" you might look into it, NetBSD, > DragonFlyBSD and rumors... some linux's can use pkgsrc. :) (Yes, I KNOW pkgsrc. I ported it to BSD/OS, I helped port it to DragonFly. And I have an entire Linux distro based on pkgsrc which I means a pkgsrc-ized glibc, linux the kernel, modutils, netkit, vixie-cron, etc ...) > We have the technology to do all this, but, not everyone uses a unix > desktop. I for one would be disgusted if I needed a gui or a browser > to install something. > > Browsing them is a bit of a hassle, I use 'grep' for that, but I guess > there's something like: > > make search keyword="blah" s/keyword/key/ > (I never use that) > > Most of the apps have some kind of URL you can load for more info if you > need it. Building from ports (or pkgsrc) is too slow. So I will stop there. Reading pkg-descr usually doesn't provide enough detail to know if it provides what I want. Visiting each website adds more time (especially since websites vary in quality of explanation. For example, when my wife wanted a calculator, I ended up installing around seven and when I wanted an image viewer I installed over ten. Too much wasted time. > I do wish there were a safe way to run the make config-recursive and > have it "really" do it recursively, I wish the build system would test > for a tty and if no tty, go into batch mode, and I wish it'd email me > if it needed more from me. (and give me the chance to conf later one) I haven't tried it, but what about the BATCH setting used for skipping interactive ports? > Which fires up a gadget for me to supply additional info to the package > being built, and things continue... Now ... that is just way too much time for me. If I want an application, I want to find it and install it within a minute. Jeremy C. Reed echo 'EhZ[h ^jjf0%%h[[Zc[Z_W$d[j%Xeeai%ZW[ced#]dk#f[d]k_d%' | \ tr '#-~' '\-.-{' From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Apr 10 10:51:27 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5567C106566B for ; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 10:51:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us) Received: from outbound-mail-158.bluehost.com (cpoproxy2-pub.bluehost.com [67.222.39.38]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 151A38FC28 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 10:51:26 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 26791 invoked by uid 0); 10 Apr 2010 10:51:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box264.bluehost.com) (69.89.31.64) by cpoproxy2.bluehost.com with SMTP; 10 Apr 2010 10:51:26 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=joseph-a-nagy-jr.us; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:X-Enigmail-Version:Content-Type:X-Identified-User; b=oiRQSyrQg//mNd4EP3plFJsKhcV0F6pntk2YGSegvmT7oGRTUJ+K9899u0CjnGm/m8ZKPqMGBDlRLe+PtZJP+CJDFFFGC0bl+1+DrwZos0lWiNBXV574Ay68Fx5izs44; Received: from [206.74.86.236] (helo=[192.168.1.102]) by box264.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1O0YHd-0001G4-GC for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 04:51:26 -0600 Message-ID: <4BC05814.7000309@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 05:51:00 -0500 From: Programmer In Training User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100324 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <20100409211612.GB6032@apollo.podro.com> In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigB9A89CDB13E835486919C957" X-Identified-User: {2250:box264.bluehost.com:ameliora:joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} {sentby:smtp auth 206.74.86.236 authed with pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} Subject: Re: "app store" for open source Unix? X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 10:51:27 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigB9A89CDB13E835486919C957 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 04/09/10 21:54, Jeremy C. Reed wrote: > Now ... that is just way too much time for me. If I want an application= ,=20 > I want to find it and install it within a minute. I really think that's asking for a lot. Phones and desktop computers are two totally different platforms. To expect the same behavior out of both is ludicrous. IME, most phones seem to run off some form of Java (I can't speak for the smart phones, I've never had one). Even my LG CU515's took upwards of two-three minutes to have an app installed (not including time to browse AT&T's app store for that model phone, time to purchase, and then downloading it). --=20 Yours In Christ, PIT Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscrib= ed. --------------enigB9A89CDB13E835486919C957 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLwFgfAAoJEENZQ8DH7rW0QKEH/i+B2hacshU4kYMZmAtR3mDO GrImokRl+o4PfjEnSqqQYakm96eNRfjQ0eSV+Pm5CeuRsOd0/5zgK9RtThmdVrbD 6Ags86UyTvo3KvZ2HD7J60Bt/N2tZ3vjd5OwS3XWpUL8gJkh+rZgY0+vppsMYpFj GKEQPrlMQrOKtgGynxcWV2/96z7eyW3jkF3/KxRNQLuoE7BNXn2P9GULk3NRGNvh 8DxLleag1i7oXOS3SlEV8sXs8y2zriYNXO1qMaV789RbgfMifH/mezTbUp2YDRTx LL8pWQvKykD3gkVskQITOBa879sGZXC3r5vfXv0h7qX9YDMwGdB7yewb5bfzzug= =BhEs -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigB9A89CDB13E835486919C957-- From owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Apr 10 11:41:55 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF2101065670 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 11:41:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us) Received: from outbound-mail-158.bluehost.com (cpoproxy2-pub.bluehost.com [67.222.39.38]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9C5BD8FC08 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 11:41:55 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 2543 invoked by uid 0); 10 Apr 2010 11:41:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO box264.bluehost.com) (69.89.31.64) by cpoproxy2.bluehost.com with SMTP; 10 Apr 2010 11:41:55 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=joseph-a-nagy-jr.us; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:X-Enigmail-Version:Content-Type:X-Identified-User; b=qNGHEhVeVRkX5Tcrt1OB6hat63vKCq8MHM6ob8YuecdxNGkyxfpo2POWpL0A3IK6OH64ITclFnpza8TMg/ibwWudRZXrRwiI7ZS+PjUkxb+PSiXbxf0LAjbTpBMGg+xf; Received: from [206.74.86.236] (helo=[192.168.1.102]) by box264.bluehost.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1O0Z4Q-0004Yh-Vi for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Sat, 10 Apr 2010 05:41:55 -0600 Message-ID: <4BC063DE.3050003@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 06:41:18 -0500 From: Programmer In Training User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.9.1.8) Gecko/20100324 Thunderbird/3.0.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org References: <20100409211612.GB6032@apollo.podro.com> <4BC05814.7000309@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> In-Reply-To: <4BC05814.7000309@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us> X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enig48D084A0BF2568A2E330A1EB" X-Identified-User: {2250:box264.bluehost.com:ameliora:joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} {sentby:smtp auth 206.74.86.236 authed with pit@joseph-a-nagy-jr.us} Subject: Re: "app store" for open source Unix? X-BeenThere: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Non technical items related to the community List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 10 Apr 2010 11:41:56 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enig48D084A0BF2568A2E330A1EB Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 04/10/10 05:51, Programmer In Training wrote: > On 04/09/10 21:54, Jeremy C. Reed wrote: > >> Now ... that is just way too much time for me. If I want an applicatio= n,=20 >> I want to find it and install it within a minute. > >=20 > I really think that's asking for a lot. Phones and desktop computers ar= e > two totally different platforms. To expect the same behavior out of bot= h > is ludicrous. >=20 > IME, most phones seem to run off some form of Java (I can't speak for > the smart phones, I've never had one). Even my LG CU515's took upwards > of two-three minutes to have an app installed (not including time to > browse AT&T's app store for that model phone, time to purchase, and the= n > downloading it). >=20 I would like to note, though, that I wouldn't mind the other aspect of this idea, though. A friendlier UI that at least provided a snapshot of the site (and perhaps of the program in action) with a better description would be nice. Especially if there was a search function (think of Snaptic or RH's old RPM package manager from the 6.2 days). With such a comprehensive list of ports, it would be nice. And since you can apparently bring in non-ports sources via pkgsrc perhaps an option to add even individual program pages that would automatically find the package source (tarball'd, of course) so if you wanted to download it, it would be as close to one-click as you would be able to get. Just a thought. --=20 Yours In Christ, PIT Emails are not formal business letters, whatever businesses may want. Original content copyright under the OWL http://owl.apotheon.org Please do not CC me. If I'm posting to a list it is because I am subscrib= ed. --------------enig48D084A0BF2568A2E330A1EB Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.14 (FreeBSD) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLwGPkAAoJEENZQ8DH7rW06FYIAKDd4VodGPMBh3whE85ukcIj 1IbYwcBEh87OKE0e1Vim/2axg0O4iGcgYM5pJV/FjkxQRihcyBIoePk9kL42qUsY q0X8ewOtCGfOxxxCUXWnkuFiL1f8TaogrqpEgwRxF0GP7jP59YLXqUPfbPfFIneh YZaki9cC7dpTEyBShaFCjvOgTCxorO5CN8Y8pfcF87qXlm54vn9elP2fLNf1qa4E 0RyNAnpbO6MYl/p9N5lJruXWbSr4pIvKNjNPXuTDWqUjTsqnpaSUtuUEA7mphpAR lBCB4G95+ZypOwzrpcXARjOyKoY+O5g1Vdv6HyEYA3X1Kv1oYj2E+SceqzP9M9c= =Mpkv -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enig48D084A0BF2568A2E330A1EB--