From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Oct 15 09:00:57 1995 Return-Path: owner-isp Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id JAA00122 for isp-outgoing; Sun, 15 Oct 1995 09:00:57 -0700 Received: from rustic (newt3.planet.net [204.117.105.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA29986 for ; Sun, 15 Oct 1995 09:00:51 -0700 Received: (from jlc@localhost) by rustic (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA00388; Sun, 15 Oct 1995 12:03:45 -0400 Date: Sun, 15 Oct 1995 12:03:45 -0400 Message-Id: <199510151603.MAA00388@rustic> From: "Johanan L. Codona" To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.org In-reply-to: <199510150420.XAA01503@praline.no.NeoSoft.com> (seiffert@neosoft.com) Subject: Re: Starting an ISP! Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 14 Oct 1995 23:20:25 -0500, seiffert@neosoft.com (Mark Seiffert) wrote: >* Is FreeBSD a good choice for our OS? (As opposed to BSDI, our second > choice.) The nice thing about BSDI is the available support, but the cost for the first copy is high (for me), subsequent copies for other machines is low ($200?) I agree. But the support for FreeBSD is quite good also. As long as we don't run -current (which occasionally gets itself in real trouble) and don't do anything really offbeat, we should be okay. If we have a problem using 2.0.5 or the -stable version, I think support would be pretty fast. Also, 2.1.0-release should be pretty soon, -stable should be converging. > >* What version of FreeBSD should we use? (We are looking to go > "on-the-air" in about 4-6 weeks.) Well you can use the 2.0.5-Release, or you can use a pre-Release version and fight the bugs. I did not want the hassle of a Beta version and possible bugs and so i opted for 2.0.5-release, which is also being sold for $20 from Surplus Software (can't find the ad right now.) I get the CD-ROMs from Walnut Creek on subscription for about $25 a release. > - memory per user This will depend on what users will be doing, if the just run PPP, then 512K per user should be plenty, if they will be running elm, and compiling programs, thent he sky is the limit. I think Walnut Creek has 128M of RAM. As far as I know, the Walnut Creek server isn't an ISP but rather an FTP (etc.) server. They have a current limit of 300 users which is on the order of half a meg per user. I figure that for 16 or 24 modems (to start with) the memory ought to be at least 64 Meg. I think cheap shell-only accounts will be driven out of existence with the advent of programs like TIA and Linux's term. If a user can get the functionality of full ppp on a shell-only account, why price them differently? > - networking cards This will depend on how many machines you have and whether you have a router or terminal server on ethernet. Only one CPU to start with, but we are still undecided on the terminal server question. For 16-24 modems, it would be possible to do it with multiport serial cards. Is this a misguided option? Obviously, it doesn't scale to many more modems than that. > - other hardware? How about a tape backup and a UPS? Definitely! > >* What about software? > - Accounting, etc. > - Misc Monitoring > - Backup software There's tar, and I saw a program that would do backups of remote machines to a single tape, I think I saw it in one of the linux groups. Anyone have it? I was thinking more in terms of backup and restore. Tar has some less-than-optimal aspects that I don't like. Of course, using gpio with the tar option fixes those, so it's not all bad. Why not use some flavor of [gc]pio? > - Security > - User services Check out www.neosoft.com, (my current ISP), they have al kinds of services available for their users, I think they have an IRC channel, a mud, www (of course), and I think something to do with an audio or video server. I think all those things are good. I also think that multicast routing needs to be enabled so our customers can join the bandwidth-hog generation! :-) > >* Do people have any FreeBSD lessons-learned they would like to share? Only lesson I have learned is that there is a steep learning curve. I am working on getting a number of computers setup like an ISP would, then I will make the decision of whether to devote more money, and lots of time. I already see that. I have climbed many learning curves already, but there are always countless more! -- Johanan L. Codona The Stekas Group codona@planet.net From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Oct 18 15:46:46 1995 Return-Path: owner-isp Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id PAA26459 for isp-outgoing; Wed, 18 Oct 1995 15:46:46 -0700 Received: from actcom.co.il (andi@actcom.co.il [192.114.47.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA26340 for ; Wed, 18 Oct 1995 15:46:21 -0700 Received: by actcom.co.il (8.6.12/actcom-0.1) id AAA08761; Thu, 19 Oct 1995 00:46:36 +0200 (rfc931-sender: andi@localhost) Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 00:46:35 +0200 (EET) From: Andi Gutmans To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Prioritizing ports Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Does anyone have any idea if it's possible to make FreeBSD put priorities on outgoing tcp/ip packages? for example putting up the priority for any telnet packages (assuming they use port 23 of course) Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Andi Gutmans E-mail: andi@actcom.co.il From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Oct 20 01:54:53 1995 Return-Path: owner-isp Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id BAA21464 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 01:54:53 -0700 Received: from phoenix.isn.net (root@NS1.ISN.NET [199.45.127.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id BAA21458 for ; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 01:54:50 -0700 Received: from phoenix.isn.net (eriecanal.isn.net [199.45.127.115]) by phoenix.isn.net (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA00085 for < freebsd-isp@freebsd.org>; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 05:54:45 +1030 Message-Id: <199510191924.FAA00085@phoenix.isn.net> Date: Fri, 20 Oct 95 05:49:18 EDT From: ctassell@isn.net (Charles Tassell) Reply-To: ctassell@isn.net (Charles Tassell) To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailer: Charles Tassell's PMMail v1.1 Subject: Starting Out Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I'm just starting out on setting up a provider using FreeBSD and would like some "specifics" on what I need in the line of hardware. What I mean by specifics are what network interfaces, do I need a seperate machine for a router, what brand of multi-port serial card will work best with FreeBSD and support around 10 modems (or what would be a better alternative to a multi-port serial card) A pointer to a FAQ would be much appretiated, as I have never set up a network from scratch... BTW: Here are the particulars of the provider: 560K line to the internet Starting with 5-10 dial in PPP lines and a couple of direct 56K feeds to customers Limited host access (shell style accounts) Thanks! Charles Tassell - ctassell@isn.net http://www.isn.net/~ctassell/index.html Of all the things I've lost I miss my mind the least.... From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Oct 20 07:24:22 1995 Return-Path: owner-isp Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id HAA05567 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 07:24:22 -0700 Received: from irbs.irbs.com (irbs.com [199.182.75.129]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id HAA05551 for ; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 07:24:18 -0700 Received: (from jc@localhost) by irbs.irbs.com (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA19792; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 10:23:21 -0400 From: John Capo Message-Id: <199510201423.KAA19792@irbs.irbs.com> Subject: Re: Starting Out To: ctassell@isn.net Date: Fri, 20 Oct 1995 10:23:20 -0400 (EDT) Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199510191924.FAA00085@phoenix.isn.net> from "Charles Tassell" at Oct 20, 95 05:49:18 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1615 Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Charles Tassell writes: > > I'm just starting out on setting up a provider using FreeBSD and would like > some "specifics" on what I need in the line of hardware. > > What I mean by specifics are what network interfaces, do I need a seperate > machine for a router, what brand of multi-port serial card will work best with > FreeBSD and support around 10 modems (or what would be a better alternative to > a multi-port serial card) A pointer to a FAQ would be much appretiated, as I > have never set up a network from scratch... > > BTW: Here are the particulars of the provider: > 560K line to the internet > Starting with 5-10 dial in PPP lines and a couple of direct > 56K feeds to customers > Limited host access (shell style accounts) > If you haven't read David's FAQ, you should do so immediately. http://www.amazing.com/internet/faq.html http://www.amazing.com/internet/faq.txt Emerging Technologies has sync serial cards and drivers for FreeBSD. http://www.etinc.com FreeBSD supports several async serial cards. I have one client using Riscom 8 port cards and I know they work well. They use it on a freenet box with Livingston PM2E-30s for the real dial-ups. You should seriously consider using a terminal server, Livingston PM2E-10 for instance. Visit http://www.livingston.com for info and http://www.whnet.com/wolfgang for pricing. Router, modems, shell acounts, all on one machine is a bit much. A router, shell/mail/www machine, and a terminal server is a typical configuration. John Capo IRBS Engineering High performance FreeBSD systems From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Oct 20 08:47:26 1995 Return-Path: owner-isp Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id IAA08469 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 08:47:26 -0700 Received: from blob.best.net (blob.best.net [204.156.128.88]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id IAA08462 for ; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 08:47:18 -0700 Received: from geli.clusternet (rcarter.vip.best.com [204.156.137.2]) by blob.best.net (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id IAA12330; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 08:45:19 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by geli.clusternet (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA10177; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 08:41:17 -0700 Message-Id: <199510201541.IAA10177@geli.clusternet> X-Authentication-Warning: geli.clusternet: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: John Capo cc: ctassell@isn.net, freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Starting Out In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 20 Oct 1995 10:23:20 EDT." <199510201423.KAA19792@irbs.irbs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 20 Oct 1995 08:41:16 -0700 From: "Russell L. Carter" Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Charles Tassell writes: > > > > I'm just starting out on setting up a provider using FreeBSD and would like > > some "specifics" on what I need in the line of hardware. > > You should seriously consider using a terminal server, Livingston > PM2E-10 for instance. Visit http://www.livingston.com for info > and http://www.whnet.com/wolfgang for pricing. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This one is very nice! > > Router, modems, shell acounts, all on one machine is a bit much. > A router, shell/mail/www machine, and a terminal server is a > typical configuration. > > John Capo > IRBS Engineering High performance FreeBSD systems > Here's another: http://www.bsdi.com/info/becoming-an-isp-kolstad.html Cheers, Russell From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Oct 20 10:18:23 1995 Return-Path: owner-isp Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id KAA11184 for isp-outgoing; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 10:18:23 -0700 Received: from blob.best.net (blob.best.net [204.156.128.88]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id KAA11174 for ; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 10:18:14 -0700 Received: from geli.clusternet (rcarter.vip.best.com [204.156.137.2]) by blob.best.net (8.6.12/8.6.5) with ESMTP id IAA12330; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 08:45:19 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by geli.clusternet (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA10177; Fri, 20 Oct 1995 08:41:17 -0700 Message-Id: <199510201541.IAA10177@geli.clusternet> X-Authentication-Warning: geli.clusternet: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: John Capo cc: ctassell@isn.net, freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Starting Out In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 20 Oct 1995 10:23:20 EDT." <199510201423.KAA19792@irbs.irbs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 20 Oct 1995 08:41:16 -0700 From: "Russell L. Carter" Sender: owner-isp@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Charles Tassell writes: > > > > I'm just starting out on setting up a provider using FreeBSD and would like > > some "specifics" on what I need in the line of hardware. > > You should seriously consider using a terminal server, Livingston > PM2E-10 for instance. Visit http://www.livingston.com for info > and http://www.whnet.com/wolfgang for pricing. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This one is very nice! > > Router, modems, shell acounts, all on one machine is a bit much. > A router, shell/mail/www machine, and a terminal server is a > typical configuration. > > John Capo > IRBS Engineering High performance FreeBSD systems > Here's another: http://www.bsdi.com/info/becoming-an-isp-kolstad.html Cheers, Russell From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Oct 21 20:36:05 1995 Return-Path: owner-isp Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id UAA23473 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 21 Oct 1995 20:36:05 -0700 Received: from gateway.net.hk (root@gateway.hk.linkage.net [202.76.7.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id UAA23461 for ; Sat, 21 Oct 1995 20:36:00 -0700 Received: (from root@localhost) by gateway.net.hk (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA20552; Sun, 22 Oct 1995 11:33:13 +0800 Date: Sun, 22 Oct 1995 11:33:13 +0800 (HKT) From: System Administrator To: FreeBSD ISP Group Subject: Firewalls for FBSD Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I am interested in using FreeBSD as a firewall between out service and a corporated customer next door (ethernet connection) on a 386- 40 machine with 8 megs of RAM and 100 megs of disk. 1. Will it have enough power to do the job? 2. What software should I install for the firewall? Any pointers appreciated. jbeukema From owner-freebsd-isp Sat Oct 21 21:18:25 1995 Return-Path: owner-isp Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) id VAA24875 for isp-outgoing; Sat, 21 Oct 1995 21:18:25 -0700 Received: from kryten.atinc.com (kryten.Atinc.COM [198.138.38.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.6.12/8.6.6) with ESMTP id VAA24862 for ; Sat, 21 Oct 1995 21:18:21 -0700 Received: (jmb@localhost) by kryten.atinc.com (8.6.9/8.3) id AAA26401; Sun, 22 Oct 1995 00:10:59 -0400 Date: Sun, 22 Oct 1995 00:10:56 -0400 (EDT) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Subject: Re: Firewalls for FBSD To: System Administrator cc: FreeBSD ISP Group In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-isp@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 22 Oct 1995, System Administrator wrote: > I am interested in using FreeBSD as a firewall between out service and a > corporated customer next door (ethernet connection) on a 386- 40 machine > with 8 megs of RAM and 100 megs of disk. depends upon what has to pass thru and what has to be supported. mind i have a 386dx40 with 16mb taking all the mail for this site, anon-ftp server and news...as well as 40 peoples email accounts. gets slow at times, but it works. > 1. Will it have enough power to do the job? > > 2. What software should I install for the firewall? fwtk, available from www.tis.com. read _building_internet_firewalls_ by bretn chapman and elizabeth zwicky. excelletn practical source of how-to and why-for information. > > Any pointers appreciated. > jbeukema > > > Jonathan M. Bresler jmb@kryten.atinc.com | Analysis & Technology, Inc. FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.Org | 2341 Jeff Davis Hwy play go. | Arlington, VA 22202 ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life | 703-418-2800 x346