From owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Sep 17 11:08:13 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B92616A468 for ; Mon, 17 Sep 2007 11:08:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::28]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A86213C48D for ; Mon, 17 Sep 2007 11:08:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (gnats@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id l8HB8Dbo049485 for ; Mon, 17 Sep 2007 11:08:13 GMT (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: (from gnats@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.14.1/8.14.1/Submit) id l8HB8CvF049481 for freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.org; Mon, 17 Sep 2007 11:08:12 GMT (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 11:08:12 GMT Message-Id: <200709171108.l8HB8CvF049481@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: gnats set sender to owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org using -f From: FreeBSD bugmaster To: freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.org Cc: Subject: Current problem reports assigned to you X-BeenThere: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Porting FreeBSD to the PowerPC List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 11:08:13 -0000 Current FreeBSD problem reports Critical problems Serious problems S Tracker Resp. Description -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- o power/93203 ppc FreeBSD PPC Can't Write to Partitions. 1 problem total. Non-critical problems S Tracker Resp. Description -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- o power/111296 ppc [kernel] [patch] Support IMISS, DLMISS an DSMISS inter o power/112435 ppc [nexus] [patch] Update nexus children to use ofw_bus f 2 problems total. 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From owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Sep 21 02:52:31 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C49CA16A418; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 02:52:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sepotvin@videotron.ca) Received: from relais.videotron.ca (relais.videotron.ca [24.201.245.36]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A16A913C4B0; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 02:52:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sepotvin@videotron.ca) Received: from yoda.telcobridges.com ([67.70.237.74]) by VL-MO-MR003.ip.videotron.ca (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.05 (built Apr 28 2005)) with ESMTPA id <0JOO00CV87I9VHC0@VL-MO-MR003.ip.videotron.ca>; Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:13:22 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:13:21 -0400 From: "Stephane E. Potvin" In-reply-to: <46E03D3E.8060504@freebsd.org> To: grehan@freebsd.org Message-id: <46F28001.2030205@videotron.ca> Organization: TelcoBridges Inc. MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT References: <46DCD1DA.5090301@freebsd.org> <42C14314-D3EC-460E-97D9-53830FB9CBF6@decpp.net> <46E03D3E.8060504@freebsd.org> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20070803) Cc: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Cell port X-BeenThere: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Porting FreeBSD to the PowerPC List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 02:52:31 -0000 Peter Grehan wrote: > Hi Décio, > >> If you have the spare time to produce a detailed checklist of what >> needs to be done and provide some guidance as required, I'm willing to >> put the effort to see this port through. > > Here's my thoughts: > > - the Cell CPU is 64-bit whilst FreeBSD/ppc is 32-bit. I don't think > the Cell has the 'bridge mode' features that the G5 (aka 970) has, so > the MMU would have to use a segment table. Doing it this way is probably > a good thing since it would allow ports to other 64-bit PPC's (e.g. the > PA-Semi). > A full 64-bit port of FreeBSD is a large undertaking, and not really > necessary for the PS3 which doesn't have a lot of RAM. > > - the IBM Cell simulator would be the best place to start. It's > OpenFirmware-based so the existing OFW code may be usable. This would > allow the generic PPC code, such as vector and MMU processing, to get > sorted out in an environment that allows easy debug. > > - For the PS3, the first step would be to get the FreeBSD loader > ported, either directly booted from the hypervisor (similar to how kboot > works), or to get kboot to load it using kexec. For the latter, kboot > itself could be modified, or the loader could be built to look like a > linux/ppc kernel. > > - the existing FreeBSD/ppc code is heavily dependent on OpenFirmware. > For running on the PS3, this dependency would have to be removed. > > - the PS3 hypervisor interface would need to be extracted from Linux > source code. I've seen some preliminary attempts at documenting the > hypervisor on a gaming site, but I think you would have to dig through > source. This also brings up the issue of GPL contamination: you DO NOT > want to use Linux source code, but only use it as a reference. > > Probably lots of other things I've forgotten or more likely don't know > about, but that should get you started. > Small comment about the OpenFirmware dependency. Recent Linux kernels started to required that all powerpc platforms provide what they call a "flattened device tree" which is very similar to an OpenFirmware device tree. It enables them to share the same code for standard Apple computers providing an OpenFirmware and small embedded processors (like the 8349e from FSL) that do not usually have OpenFirmware. It might be worthwhile for anybody attempting to port to a new architecture to look into adding support for something similar instead of removing the OF dependency. Just $0.02 ;) Ignore if it doesn't make any sense... Steph From owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Sep 21 10:29:11 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01F1216A417; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 10:29:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from raj@semihalf.com) Received: from mail.semihalf.com (mail.semihalf.com [83.12.36.68]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6680213C457; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 10:29:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from raj@semihalf.com) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mail.semihalf.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C100143AD; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 12:08:24 +0200 (CEST) Received: from mail.semihalf.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.semihalf.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10089-10; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 12:08:23 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <46F39815.6060507@semihalf.com> Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 12:08:21 +0200 From: Rafal Jaworowski MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Stephane E. Potvin" References: <46DCD1DA.5090301@freebsd.org> <42C14314-D3EC-460E-97D9-53830FB9CBF6@decpp.net> <46E03D3E.8060504@freebsd.org> <46F28001.2030205@videotron.ca> In-Reply-To: <46F28001.2030205@videotron.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at semihalf.com Cc: grehan@freebsd.org, freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Cell port X-BeenThere: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Porting FreeBSD to the PowerPC List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 10:29:11 -0000 Stephane E. Potvin wrote: > > Small comment about the OpenFirmware dependency. Recent Linux kernels > started to required that all powerpc platforms provide what they call a > "flattened device tree" which is very similar to an OpenFirmware device > tree. It enables them to share the same code for standard Apple > computers providing an OpenFirmware and small embedded processors (like > the 8349e from FSL) that do not usually have OpenFirmware. > > It might be worthwhile for anybody attempting to port to a new > architecture to look into adding support for something similar instead > of removing the OF dependency. > Having the flat device tree is not cheap, as one has to provide the whole infrastructure, which is currently non-existent: - the dtc 'compiler' to produce binary out of textual description of the device tree (the existing GPL-licensed could be used for quick start) - in-kernel library of routines processing the device tree blob (node, properties etc.) - loader(8) would need to be involved too (at least to pass the blob as part of metadata or so). Introducing this is quite a big project for its own, and requires dealing with OpenFirmware internals, binding definitions etc. as FDT essentially mimics some part of it. Rafal From owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Sep 21 11:38:14 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32A4116A41B; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 11:38:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matt@genesi-usa.com) Received: from mail.genesi-usa.com (mithrandir.softwarenexus.net [66.98.186.96]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12DB513C4A3; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 11:38:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matt@genesi-usa.com) Received: from 82-46-178-156.cable.ubr06.king.blueyonder.co.uk ([82.46.178.156] helo=[192.168.2.228]) by mail.genesi-usa.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.66 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1IYfxL-0001Zd-FE; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 10:41:55 +0000 Message-ID: <46F3A4BF.7000705@genesi-usa.com> Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 12:02:23 +0100 From: Matt Sealey User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (Windows/20070728) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Rafal Jaworowski References: <46DCD1DA.5090301@freebsd.org> <42C14314-D3EC-460E-97D9-53830FB9CBF6@decpp.net> <46E03D3E.8060504@freebsd.org> <46F28001.2030205@videotron.ca> <46F39815.6060507@semihalf.com> In-Reply-To: <46F39815.6060507@semihalf.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org, grehan@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Cell port X-BeenThere: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Porting FreeBSD to the PowerPC List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 11:38:14 -0000 Rafal Jaworowski wrote: > Stephane E. Potvin wrote: >> >> It might be worthwhile for anybody attempting to port to a new >> architecture to look into adding support for something similar instead >> of removing the OF dependency. > > Having the flat device tree is not cheap, as one has to provide the > whole infrastructure, which is currently non-existent: > > - the dtc 'compiler' to produce binary out of textual description of the > device tree (the existing GPL-licensed could be used for quick start) Well, it's not exactly non-existent then is it? :) There would be a worry about introducing a GPL dependency in BSD code (after the Atheros stuff last month, even moreso) but in the end, the flattened device tree and the tool that generates it are not required for operation of the Operating System - the FDT should be presented by the firmware, and not ingrained into the OS tools. Consider the FDT/DTC a U-Boot problem and not a FreeBSD problem. > - in-kernel library of routines processing the device tree blob (node, > properties etc.) Since parsing a device tree is the same thing, regardless, and the specs for the Linux FDT are purposefully derived from the Open Firmware ones, there isn't much change here other than to be able to parse a FDT blob rather than using the Open Firmware Client Interface. > - loader(8) would need to be involved too (at least to pass the blob as > part of metadata or so). A curious question, how is this metadata structured? Can a binary blob be easily passed with few changes? Is anything even passed on OF platforms considering all the metadata (apart from the loader flags which would be required) is in fact in the device tree? > Introducing this is quite a big project for its own, and requires > dealing with OpenFirmware internals, binding definitions etc. as FDT > essentially mimics some part of it. Like I said above, leeching off the Linux device tree project is not a bad idea if you consider it more of a firmware issue than a Linux issue. Just what IS the licensing on a binary blob passed by firmware? If you create a device tree from GPLv2 code in the Linux tree and put it into your GPL U-Boot, does passing that code to FreeBSD cause a problem? By implementing a "new device tree standard" you completely throw away the advantages of a firmware device tree. Linux already made that stupid mistake by reimplementing a device tree and making it dependant on the Linux kernel and tools.. -- Matt Sealey Genesi, Manager, Developer Relations From owner-freebsd-ppc@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Sep 21 17:20:18 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A64716A41A; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 17:20:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sepotvin@videotron.ca) Received: from relais.videotron.ca (relais.videotron.ca [24.201.245.36]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C89913C44B; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 17:20:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sepotvin@videotron.ca) Received: from [10.0.0.168] ([67.70.237.74]) by VL-MH-MR001.ip.videotron.ca (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-2.05 (built Apr 28 2005)) with ESMTPA id <0JOQ00K8VATSITY0@VL-MH-MR001.ip.videotron.ca>; Fri, 21 Sep 2007 13:20:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 13:20:16 -0400 From: "Stephane E. Potvin" In-reply-to: <46F39815.6060507@semihalf.com> To: Rafal Jaworowski Message-id: <46F3FD50.6030409@videotron.ca> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <46DCD1DA.5090301@freebsd.org> <42C14314-D3EC-460E-97D9-53830FB9CBF6@decpp.net> <46E03D3E.8060504@freebsd.org> <46F28001.2030205@videotron.ca> <46F39815.6060507@semihalf.com> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (Windows/20070728) Cc: grehan@freebsd.org, freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Cell port X-BeenThere: freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Porting FreeBSD to the PowerPC List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 17:20:18 -0000 Rafal Jaworowski wrote: > Stephane E. Potvin wrote: >> >> Small comment about the OpenFirmware dependency. Recent Linux kernels >> started to required that all powerpc platforms provide what they call >> a "flattened device tree" which is very similar to an OpenFirmware >> device tree. It enables them to share the same code for standard Apple >> computers providing an OpenFirmware and small embedded processors >> (like the 8349e from FSL) that do not usually have OpenFirmware. >> >> It might be worthwhile for anybody attempting to port to a new >> architecture to look into adding support for something similar instead >> of removing the OF dependency. >> > > Having the flat device tree is not cheap, as one has to provide the > whole infrastructure, which is currently non-existent: > > - the dtc 'compiler' to produce binary out of textual description of the > device tree (the existing GPL-licensed could be used for quick start) > > - in-kernel library of routines processing the device tree blob (node, > properties etc.) > > - loader(8) would need to be involved too (at least to pass the blob as > part of metadata or so). > > Introducing this is quite a big project for its own, and requires > dealing with OpenFirmware internals, binding definitions etc. as FDT > essentially mimics some part of it. > I admit that I might be confused but I thought that the ppc port already had the infrastructure to deal with OF. As the FDT is a simplified OF tree (flattened), once you have the blob parser it should be pretty straightforward. At least not much more complicated than to rip out the OF dependency and have to maintain two different ways of probing the HW. This being said, even if I have a very strong interest in this area I don't have enough resources at this time to work on this, so I'll leave those who work on this decide which way is better. Regards, Steph