From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Nov 16 21:11:23 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9354B106568D for ; Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:11:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ltning@anduin.net) Received: from mail.anduin.net (mail.anduin.net [213.225.74.249]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 543E88FC18 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:11:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ltning@anduin.net) Received: from [212.62.248.147] (helo=[192.168.2.10]) by mail.anduin.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.69 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1L1oDC-000OI8-KD; Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:27:14 +0100 Message-Id: From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Eirik_=D8verby?= To: fbsd@dannysplace.net In-Reply-To: <491C9535.3030504@dannysplace.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:27:15 +0100 References: <490A782F.9060406@dannysplace.net> <20081031033208.GA21220@icarus.home.lan> <490A849C.7030009@dannysplace.net> <20081031043412.GA22289@icarus.home.lan> <490A8FAD.8060009@dannysplace.net> <491BBF38.9010908@dannysplace.net> <491C5AA7.1030004@samsco.org> <491C9535.3030504@dannysplace.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Areca vs. ZFS performance testing. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:11:23 -0000 On Nov 13, 2008, at 21:59, Danny Carroll wrote: > Scott Long wrote: >> The Areca controller likely doesn't buffer/cache for disks in JBOD >> mode, >> as others in this thread have stated. Without buffering, simple disk >> controllers will almost always be faster than accelerated raid >> controllers because the accelerated controllers add more latency >> between >> the host and the disk. A simple controller will directly funnel data >> from the host to the disk as soon as it receives a command. An >> accelerated controller, however, has a CPU and a mini-OS on it that >> has >> to schedule the work coming from the host and handle its own tasks >> and >> interrupts. This adds latency that quickly adds up under benchmarks. >> Your numbers clearly demonstrate this. > > That's nice to know. I'm not sure it tells us why the Non-Cached > writes > were about 8% faster though. The other thing about the "NoWriteCache" > test I performed that I neglected to mention yesterday is that I > actually panic'd the box (running out of memory). This was the first > time I have had that happen with ZFS even though in previous testing > (with cache enabled) I punished the box for a lot longer. > > Perhaps the ZFS caching took over where the disk caching left off? > Could that explain why I did not see a negative difference in the > numbers between Cache enabled and Cache disabled? > > One of the questions I wanted to answer for myself was just this: > "Does > a battery-backed cache on an Areca card protect me when I am in JBOD > mode." If the Areca does not buffer/cache in JBOD mode then that > means > the answer is no. I have noticed that my 3ware controllers, after updating firmware recently, have removed the JBOD option entirely, classifying it as something you wouldn't want to do with that kind of hardware anyway. I believed then, and even more so now, they are correct. Use the RAID-0 disk trick to be able to utilize the controller cache. And regarding write-back vs write-through; I believe write-through is equvivalent to disabling controller write cache, however it WILL cache the writes in order to respond to future reads of the data being written. I would guess, but I don't know, that this also goes for disk- level caches too, though, so it probably doesn't matter. /Eirik From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 02:53:47 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A61B8106564A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 02:53:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from james-freebsd-fs2@jrv.org) Received: from mail.jrv.org (adsl-70-243-84-13.dsl.austtx.swbell.net [70.243.84.13]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67B488FC12 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 02:53:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from james-freebsd-fs2@jrv.org) Received: from kremvax.housenet.jrv (kremvax.housenet.jrv [192.168.3.124]) by mail.jrv.org (8.14.3/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAH2ZbEq050068; Sun, 16 Nov 2008 20:35:38 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from james-freebsd-fs2@jrv.org) Authentication-Results: mail.jrv.org; domainkeys=pass (testing) header.from=james-freebsd-fs2@jrv.org DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; s=enigma; d=jrv.org; c=nofws; q=dns; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc:subject: references:in-reply-to:x-enigmail-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=tXXuwRTw9JC4BRUW4Dhiip/bHTvwcdh78G8wENwSLTIY8vVJ3GwA8QvV91tnlhl85 5ST7E/a9YBM50FHA7gH9Z5uX5hqBV6LbJde+L5N8w9AnW/U4iLDg+Q2mZhdMZ51DeO9 9JFx7FNtexrt/GXbvpXHVNtCyQEuQODQ6+Ncp+8= Message-ID: <4920D879.3070806@jrv.org> Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2008 20:35:37 -0600 From: "James R. Van Artsdalen" User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (Macintosh/20080914) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Peter Jeremy References: <20081109174303.GA5146@ourbrains.org> <20081109184349.GG51239@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> In-Reply-To: <20081109184349.GG51239@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Will XFS be adopted X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 02:53:47 -0000 Peter Jeremy wrote: > FreeBSD has ZFS - which is a re-sizable FS with an integrated volume > manager. > > ZFS has limitations. It is not appropriate for "appliance" applications such as the Soekris boxes does due to memory consumption. ZFS strongly depends on write-ordering around cache flushes, and a pool can easily be corrupted when this dependency is not met. BTRFS will be another filesystem to watch. Perhaps foreign filesystems could be supported out of ports. But the fundamental limitation, as was said, is that someone has to care enough to do the port. From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 03:15:51 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCC341065670; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 03:15:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@dannysplace.net) Received: from mail.dannysplace.net (mail.dannysplace.net [213.133.54.210]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F2D88FC13; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 03:15:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@dannysplace.net) Received: from 203-206-171-212.perm.iinet.net.au ([203.206.171.212] helo=[192.168.10.10]) by mail.dannysplace.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1L1uaR-0001qd-Da; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 13:15:50 +1000 Message-ID: <4920E1DD.7000101@dannysplace.net> Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 13:15:41 +1000 From: Danny Carroll User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (Windows/20080914) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Eirik_=D8verby?= References: <490A782F.9060406@dannysplace.net> <20081031033208.GA21220@icarus.home.lan> <490A849C.7030009@dannysplace.net> <20081031043412.GA22289@icarus.home.lan> <490A8FAD.8060009@dannysplace.net> <491BBF38.9010908@dannysplace.net> <491C5AA7.1030004@samsco.org> <491C9535.3030504@dannysplace.net> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Authenticated-User: danny X-Authenticator: plain X-Sender-Verify: SUCCEEDED (sender exists & accepts mail) X-Exim-Version: 4.69 (build at 08-Jul-2008 08:59:40) X-Date: 2008-11-17 13:15:39 X-Connected-IP: 203.206.171.212:1568 X-Message-Linecount: 40 X-Body-Linecount: 26 X-Message-Size: 2082 X-Body-Size: 1202 X-Received-Count: 1 X-Recipient-Count: 3 X-Local-Recipient-Count: 3 X-Local-Recipient-Defer-Count: 0 X-Local-Recipient-Fail-Count: 0 X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 203.206.171.212 X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: ltning@anduin.net, freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: fbsd@dannysplace.net X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5 (2008-06-10) on ferrari.dannysplace.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.2 required=8.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,AWL,TVD_RCVD_IP autolearn=disabled version=3.2.5 X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on mail.dannysplace.net) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Areca vs. ZFS performance testing. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: fbsd@dannysplace.net List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 03:15:51 -0000 Eirik Øverby wrote: > I have noticed that my 3ware controllers, after updating firmware > recently, have removed the JBOD option entirely, classifying it as > something you wouldn't want to do with that kind of hardware anyway. I > believed then, and even more so now, they are correct. It kinda depends. If there were a good 8 or 16+ port SATA card out there that *simply* did SATA with no bells and whistles, then there would be no point buying a Raid adaptor when you want to use things like ZFS. But there are no such cards available. > Use the RAID-0 disk trick to be able to utilize the controller cache. > And regarding write-back vs write-through; I believe write-through is > equvivalent to disabling controller write cache, however it WILL cache > the writes in order to respond to future reads of the data being > written. I would guess, but I don't know, that this also goes for > disk-level caches too, though, so it probably doesn't matter. It is interesting to me that the default setting on the Areca card was to have the disk caches turned on. I think that is strange because by default you have a situation that can lead to data loss even if you have a battery backup unit. -D From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 04:50:19 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 952271065674 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 04:50:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: from mail.garage.freebsd.pl (chello087206045082.chello.pl [87.206.45.82]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A7BB8FC1A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 04:50:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix, from userid 65534) id E45884569A; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:31:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (ghf58.internetdsl.tpnet.pl [83.12.187.58]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF53E45683; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:31:37 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:31:30 +0100 From: Pawel Jakub Dawidek To: Andriy Gapon Message-ID: <20081117043042.GA2101@garage.freebsd.pl> References: <491D710A.9090308@icyb.net.ua> <491D8621.40101@icyb.net.ua> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="3uo+9/B/ebqu+fSQ" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <491D8621.40101@icyb.net.ua> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.3i X-PGP-Key-URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~pjd/pjd.asc X-OS: FreeBSD 8.0-CURRENT i386 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.4 (2005-06-05) on mail.garage.freebsd.pl X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.9 required=3.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.4 Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: zfs snapdir: from hidden to visible and back again X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 04:50:19 -0000 --3uo+9/B/ebqu+fSQ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 04:07:29PM +0200, Andriy Gapon wrote: > on 14/11/2008 14:37 Andriy Gapon said the following: > > Also, even with snapdir=3Dhidden, I still can list snapshots (their > > contents) if I ls full path with .zfs in it. > > Is this right? >=20 > And it seems that any snapshot accessed in this way gets automatically > added to mounts. This doesn't seem to be reasonable. >=20 > For example, periodic security script would report suid binaries found > in these snapshots, etc. Everything you described is expected behaviour. --=20 Pawel Jakub Dawidek http://www.wheel.pl pjd@FreeBSD.org http://www.FreeBSD.org FreeBSD committer Am I Evil? Yes, I Am! --3uo+9/B/ebqu+fSQ Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFJIPOgForvXbEpPzQRAnpxAJ0TN4BoVWnNFIBMm46Y5Xy6lE8y1gCgn9Zr Hq0VF6ritGdQGZszCJRNN8k= =NaTT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --3uo+9/B/ebqu+fSQ-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 05:31:02 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 045081065670 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:31:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-questions@ourbrains.org) Received: from ourbrains.org (li48-221.members.linode.com [66.246.76.221]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 8CC4A8FC0A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:31:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-questions@ourbrains.org) Received: (qmail 16867 invoked by uid 1000); 17 Nov 2008 05:04:41 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 00:04:41 -0500 From: Dan To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org References: <20081109174303.GA5146@ourbrains.org> <20081109184349.GG51239@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <4920D879.3070806@jrv.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <4920D879.3070806@jrv.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Subject: Re: Will XFS be adopted X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:31:02 -0000 James R. Van Artsdalen(james-freebsd-fs2@jrv.org)@2008.11.16 20:35:37 -0600: > ZFS has limitations. > > It is not appropriate for "appliance" applications such as the Soekris > boxes does due to memory consumption. YES! In my opinion it's not even appropriate for a machine with 2GB of RAM. Why waste so much RAM on an FS? Does anyone know? Or is this some sort of conspiracy to sell more bgger boxes. It's Sun, afterall.... > BTRFS will be another filesystem to watch. Perhaps foreign filesystems > could be supported out of ports. But the fundamental limitation, as was > said, is that someone has to care enough to do the port. What kinda bugs me is why FreeBSD hasn't adopted a nice journaling FS until now. Look at Linux - Reiser, EXT3 and XFS/JFS have been in it for years. What gives with FreeBSD? From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 05:33:38 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A797106564A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:33:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: from lor.one-eyed-alien.net (cl-162.ewr-01.us.sixxs.net [IPv6:2001:4830:1200:a1::2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E66A98FC17 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:33:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: from lor.one-eyed-alien.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lor.one-eyed-alien.net (8.14.3/8.14.2) with ESMTP id mAH5YNWZ058926 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:34:23 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: (from brooks@localhost) by lor.one-eyed-alien.net (8.14.3/8.14.3/Submit) id mAH5YNss058925 for freebsd-fs@freebsd.org; Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:34:23 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from brooks) Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:34:23 -0600 From: Brooks Davis To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20081117053423.GA58892@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> References: <20081109174303.GA5146@ourbrains.org> <20081109184349.GG51239@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <4920D879.3070806@jrv.org> <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="nFreZHaLTZJo0R7j" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.17 (2007-11-01) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-3.0 (lor.one-eyed-alien.net [127.0.0.1]); Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:34:23 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: Will XFS be adopted X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:33:38 -0000 --nFreZHaLTZJo0R7j Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Nov 17, 2008 at 12:04:41AM -0500, Dan wrote: > James R. Van Artsdalen(james-freebsd-fs2@jrv.org)@2008.11.16 20:35:37 -06= 00: > > ZFS has limitations. > >=20 > > It is not appropriate for "appliance" applications such as the Soekris > > boxes does due to memory consumption. > YES! In my opinion it's not even appropriate for a machine with 2GB of > RAM. Why waste so much RAM on an FS? Does anyone know? Or is this some > sort of conspiracy to sell more bgger boxes. It's Sun, afterall.... >=20 > > BTRFS will be another filesystem to watch. Perhaps foreign filesystems > > could be supported out of ports. But the fundamental limitation, as was > > said, is that someone has to care enough to do the port. >=20 > What kinda bugs me is why FreeBSD hasn't adopted a nice journaling FS > until now. Look at Linux - Reiser, EXT3 and XFS/JFS have been in it for > years. What gives with FreeBSD? Someone needs to actually write one. We don't have all that many file syst= em experts and even a pretty basic file system is a huge undertaking. -- Brooks --nFreZHaLTZJo0R7j Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.8 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFJIQJfXY6L6fI4GtQRAlbzAJ43x7SG6+m6lkcPmtpLV89ULOPxgACgjxBX h6YE90kmLqmzV5eq9ePKt6I= =reBl -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nFreZHaLTZJo0R7j-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 05:43:50 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B271106564A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:43:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jdc@koitsu.dyndns.org) Received: from QMTA07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.64]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6D228FC17 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:43:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jdc@koitsu.dyndns.org) Received: from OMTA14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.60]) by QMTA07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id g4l51a0061HzFnQ575j3av; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:43:03 +0000 Received: from koitsu.dyndns.org ([69.181.141.110]) by OMTA14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id g5jU1a00H2P6wsM3a5jVTh; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:43:29 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=QycZ5dHgAAAA:8 a=-Gcd8YnJejmQ4RLFNSQA:9 a=zpWm4ezJjMoDTnE1CdLwkVdNfU0A:4 a=EoioJ0NPDVgA:10 a=VVm1lkAqD8YA:10 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 Received: by icarus.home.lan (Postfix, from userid 1000) id D65B333C36; Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:43:47 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2008 21:43:47 -0800 From: Jeremy Chadwick To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20081117054347.GA20749@icarus.home.lan> References: <20081109174303.GA5146@ourbrains.org> <20081109184349.GG51239@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <4920D879.3070806@jrv.org> <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Subject: Re: Will XFS be adopted X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:43:50 -0000 On Mon, Nov 17, 2008 at 12:04:41AM -0500, Dan wrote: > James R. Van Artsdalen(james-freebsd-fs2@jrv.org)@2008.11.16 20:35:37 -0600: > > ZFS has limitations. > > > > It is not appropriate for "appliance" applications such as the Soekris > > boxes does due to memory consumption. > YES! In my opinion it's not even appropriate for a machine with 2GB of > RAM. Why waste so much RAM on an FS? Does anyone know? Or is this some > sort of conspiracy to sell more bgger boxes. It's Sun, afterall.... Please. If Sun's sole goal was to "sell bigger boxes", they wouldn't be participating in the open-source world with OpenSolaris and helping other OSes with getting ZFS. None of those things tie you to Sun hardware. The ZFS caching concept as I see it is quite simple to understand: keep as much data as possible in RAM, to decrease overall disk I/O (RAM is significantly faster than disk). There's other reasons (goals) as well, but I'm trying to keep it simple. The reality of the situation is that for most desktops and servers, you can buy 4GB of RAM for something like US$25-30. That's incredibly inexpensive -- were you around back in the mid-90s when 2x4MB SIMMs cost you US$200? Or in the late 80s when a 1MB expansion card for the Apple IIGS cost US$300? I understand (really!) these things can't be compared to an embedded platform, but the entire world does not use embedded hardware. Step back for a moment and reflect. And you do realise that the memory requirements of ZFS can be tuned, yes? You can literally tell it "only use 16MB of memory for the ARC". > > BTRFS will be another filesystem to watch. Perhaps foreign filesystems > > could be supported out of ports. But the fundamental limitation, as was > > said, is that someone has to care enough to do the port. > > What kinda bugs me is why FreeBSD hasn't adopted a nice journaling FS > until now. Look at Linux - Reiser, EXT3 and XFS/JFS have been in it for > years. What gives with FreeBSD? There's gjournal(8), which does journalling on a block level, meaning you can use whatever FS you want atop it. Also: if Linux has the things you want, use it! Pick whichever OS gets the job done for you, and meets your requirements. If FreeBSD lacks something which Linux has, and that something is important to you, going with Linux is the correct choice. The same applies to any OS, not just Linux. Its about having choices, and solving problems -- not about blind OS advocacy. -- | Jeremy Chadwick jdc at parodius.com | | Parodius Networking http://www.parodius.com/ | | UNIX Systems Administrator Mountain View, CA, USA | | Making life hard for others since 1977. PGP: 4BD6C0CB | From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 06:06:47 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2D36106564A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 06:06:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matt@corp.spry.com) Received: from rv-out-0506.google.com (rv-out-0506.google.com [209.85.198.236]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B901B8FC12 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 06:06:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matt@corp.spry.com) Received: by rv-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id b25so2192145rvf.43 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 2008 22:06:47 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.141.172.7 with SMTP id z7mr2054715rvo.128.1226902006022; Sun, 16 Nov 2008 22:06:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from ?10.0.1.193? (c-24-19-46-17.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [24.19.46.17]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id f21sm8614141rvb.5.2008.11.16.22.06.43 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sun, 16 Nov 2008 22:06:44 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <4920E1DD.7000101@dannysplace.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2008 22:06:42 -0800 References: <490A782F.9060406@dannysplace.net> <20081031033208.GA21220@icarus.home.lan> <490A849C.7030009@dannysplace.net> <20081031043412.GA22289@icarus.home.lan> <490A8FAD.8060009@dannysplace.net> <491BBF38.9010908@dannysplace.net> <491C5AA7.1030004@samsco.org> <491C9535.3030504@dannysplace.net> <4920E1DD.7000101@dannysplace.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) From: Matt Simerson Cc: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Areca vs. ZFS performance testing. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 06:06:48 -0000 On Nov 16, 2008, at 7:15 PM, Danny Carroll wrote: > Eirik =D8verby wrote: >> I have noticed that my 3ware controllers, after updating firmware >> recently, have removed the JBOD option entirely, classifying it as >> something you wouldn't want to do with that kind of hardware =20 >> anyway. I >> believed then, and even more so now, they are correct. > > It kinda depends. If there were a good 8 or 16+ port SATA card out > there that *simply* did SATA with no bells and whistles, then there > would be no point buying a Raid adaptor when you want to use things =20= > like > ZFS. > > But there are no such cards available. Allow me to introduce you to Marvell. The sell the SATA controller =20 used in the Sun thumper (X4500). I've used that same SATA controller =20 under OpenSolaris and FreeBSD. Unfortunately, that controller doesn't =20= use multi-lane cables. When you pack in 3 controllers and 24 disks, =20 it's a cabling disaster. http://freebsd.monkey.org/freebsd-fs/200808/msg00027.html >> Use the RAID-0 disk trick to be able to utilize the controller cache. >> And regarding write-back vs write-through; I believe write-through is >> equvivalent to disabling controller write cache, however it WILL =20 >> cache >> the writes in order to respond to future reads of the data being >> written. I would guess, but I don't know, that this also goes for >> disk-level caches too, though, so it probably doesn't matter. > > It is interesting to me that the default setting on the Areca card was > to have the disk caches turned on. I think that is strange because by > default you have a situation that can lead to data loss even if you =20= > have > a battery backup unit. The Areca cards do NOT have the cache enabled by default. I ordered =20 the optional battery and RAM upgrade for my collection of 1231ML =20 cards. Even with the BBWC, the cache is not enabled by default. I had =20= to go out of my way to enable it, on every single controller. Matt From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 07:08:20 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C474106564A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 07:08:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jdc@koitsu.dyndns.org) Received: from QMTA02.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net (qmta02.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net [76.96.30.24]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77D818FC13 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 07:08:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jdc@koitsu.dyndns.org) Received: from OMTA04.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.30.35]) by QMTA02.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id g74q1a0090lTkoCA278L7x; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 07:08:20 +0000 Received: from koitsu.dyndns.org ([69.181.141.110]) by OMTA04.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id g78J1a0072P6wsM8Q78JS2; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 07:08:19 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=aQgbMQmz5TEA:10 a=qMCG-Xc8eBMA:10 a=T-PJXEmqAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=QycZ5dHgAAAA:8 a=sfWry13RMXeAcXv6eTUA:9 a=rTLkSv3ht1IDSaoZn9SVe9PNw80A:4 a=EoioJ0NPDVgA:10 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 Received: by icarus.home.lan (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 716C833C36; Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:08:18 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2008 23:08:18 -0800 From: Jeremy Chadwick To: Matt Simerson Message-ID: <20081117070818.GA22231@icarus.home.lan> References: <20081031033208.GA21220@icarus.home.lan> <490A849C.7030009@dannysplace.net> <20081031043412.GA22289@icarus.home.lan> <490A8FAD.8060009@dannysplace.net> <491BBF38.9010908@dannysplace.net> <491C5AA7.1030004@samsco.org> <491C9535.3030504@dannysplace.net> <4920E1DD.7000101@dannysplace.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Areca vs. ZFS performance testing. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 07:08:20 -0000 On Sun, Nov 16, 2008 at 10:06:42PM -0800, Matt Simerson wrote: > > On Nov 16, 2008, at 7:15 PM, Danny Carroll wrote: > >> Eirik Øverby wrote: >>> I have noticed that my 3ware controllers, after updating firmware >>> recently, have removed the JBOD option entirely, classifying it as >>> something you wouldn't want to do with that kind of hardware anyway. >>> I >>> believed then, and even more so now, they are correct. >> >> It kinda depends. If there were a good 8 or 16+ port SATA card out >> there that *simply* did SATA with no bells and whistles, then there >> would be no point buying a Raid adaptor when you want to use things >> like >> ZFS. >> >> But there are no such cards available. > > Allow me to introduce you to Marvell. The sell the SATA controller used > in the Sun thumper (X4500). I've used that same SATA controller under > OpenSolaris and FreeBSD. Unfortunately, that controller doesn't use > multi-lane cables. When you pack in 3 controllers and 24 disks, it's a > cabling disaster. > > http://freebsd.monkey.org/freebsd-fs/200808/msg00027.html I participated in that thread. http://freebsd.monkey.org/freebsd-fs/200808/msg00028.html The questions I had never got answered. The most important one being: have you actually performed a hard failure or forced disk swap with both the Areca and Marvell controllers? And how does FreeBSD behave when you do this? I've a feeling it works fine on the Areca (since CAM/da(4) are used), but if the Marvell card uses ata(4) (and I'm guessing it does) I'm concerned. Why? For sake of comparison: Promise controllers are considered one of the most well-supported controllers under FreeBSD, mainly due to Soren having access to their documentation; yet, when I attempted to do an actual disk upgrade, the Promise controller did nothing but cause me grief, forcing me to yank the entire card from my system. http://wiki.freebsd.org/JeremyChadwick/ZFS_disk_upgrade_gone_bad Users should read this story and the follow-up. And in my situation, the disk wasn't even bad/failed. What was supposed to be a simple procedure (and it was with Intel AHCI, as you'll read) turned into a complete nightmare. Take my story and apply it to a production datacentre -- but with an 8 or 16-port card and a shelf of disks. What're you going to tell your boss when this stuff fails like how I documented? "Yeah so I need US$600 to replace the card" "Why? We don't have that kind of budget. Is the card bad? Can we RMA it?" "No, the card isn't bad" "Then what is the problem?" "Well you see......" So when I see someone say "Yeah, try the , it works great", my first response is "Just how well have you actually tested failure or upgrade scenarios?" Most don't, and instead just *assume* come fail-time, that everything will "just work" -- and they find out the horrible truth when it's already too late. -- | Jeremy Chadwick jdc at parodius.com | | Parodius Networking http://www.parodius.com/ | | UNIX Systems Administrator Mountain View, CA, USA | | Making life hard for others since 1977. PGP: 4BD6C0CB | From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 08:40:57 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33E82106564A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 08:40:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from andrew@modulus.org) Received: from email.octopus.com.au (email.octopus.com.au [122.100.2.232]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF7AA8FC0A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 08:40:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from andrew@modulus.org) Received: by email.octopus.com.au (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 9CBC0174BC; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 19:40:53 +1100 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.3 (2007-08-08) on email.octopus.com.au X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 required=10.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED, DNS_FROM_SECURITYSAGE autolearn=no version=3.2.3 Received: from [10.20.30.101] (60.218.233.220.exetel.com.au [220.233.218.60]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: admin@email.octopus.com.au) by email.octopus.com.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06E7217323; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 19:40:49 +1100 (EST) Message-ID: <49212E04.9000507@modulus.org> Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 19:40:36 +1100 From: Andrew Snow User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andriy Gapon References: <491D710A.9090308@icyb.net.ua> <491D8621.40101@icyb.net.ua> <20081117043042.GA2101@garage.freebsd.pl> In-Reply-To: <20081117043042.GA2101@garage.freebsd.pl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: zfs snapdir: from hidden to visible and back again X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 08:40:57 -0000 > And it seems that any snapshot accessed in this way gets automatically > added to mounts. This doesn't seem to be reasonable. One workaround I use is to use the "clone" command on any specific snapshots I want to have mounted, and then the rest can be left hidden. When you are finished accessing the snapshot, simply destroy the clone. - Andrew From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 11:06:50 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29B541065670 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:06:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::28]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8E248FC24 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:06:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id mAHB6nVU082513 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:06:49 GMT (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: (from gnats@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.14.3/8.14.3/Submit) id mAHB6ntQ082509 for freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.org; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:06:49 GMT (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:06:49 GMT Message-Id: <200811171106.mAHB6ntQ082509@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: gnats set sender to owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org using -f From: FreeBSD bugmaster To: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.org Cc: Subject: Current problem reports assigned to freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.org X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:06:50 -0000 Note: to view an individual PR, use: http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=(number). The following is a listing of current problems submitted by FreeBSD users. These represent problem reports covering all versions including experimental development code and obsolete releases. S Tracker Resp. Description -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- f kern/128829 fs smbd(8) causes periodic panic on 7-RELEASE o kern/128633 fs [zfs] [lor] lock order reversal in zfs o kern/128514 fs [zfs] [mpt] problems with ZFS and LSILogic SAS/SATA Ad o kern/128173 fs [ext2fs] ls gives "Input/output error" on mounted ext3 o kern/127420 fs [gjournal] [panic] Journal overflow on gmirrored gjour o kern/127213 fs [tmpfs] sendfile on tmpfs data corruption o kern/127029 fs [panic] mount(8): trying to mount a write protected zi o kern/126287 fs [ufs] [panic] Kernel panics while mounting an UFS file o kern/125536 fs [ext2fs] ext 2 mounts cleanly but fails on commands li o kern/125149 fs [nfs][panic] changing into .zfs dir from nfs client ca o kern/124621 fs [ext3] Cannot mount ext2fs partition o kern/122888 fs [zfs] zfs hang w/ prefetch on, zil off while running t o bin/122172 fs [fs]: amd(8) automount daemon dies on 6.3-STABLE i386, o bin/121072 fs [smbfs] mount_smbfs(8) cannot normally convert the cha o bin/118249 fs mv(1): moving a directory changes its mtime o kern/116170 fs [panic] Kernel panic when mounting /tmp o kern/114955 fs [cd9660] [patch] [request] support for mask,dirmask,ui o kern/114847 fs [ntfs] [patch] [request] dirmask support for NTFS ala o kern/114676 fs [ufs] snapshot creation panics: snapacct_ufs2: bad blo o bin/114468 fs [patch] [request] add -d option to umount(8) to detach o bin/113838 fs [patch] [request] mount(8): add support for relative p o bin/113049 fs [patch] [request] make quot(8) use getopt(3) and show o kern/112658 fs [smbfs] [patch] smbfs and caching problems (resolves b o kern/93942 fs [vfs] [patch] panic: ufs_dirbad: bad dir (patch from D 24 problems total. From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 11:42:53 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 341FC1065679; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:42:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from danny@dannysplace.net) Received: from mail.dannysplace.net (mail.dannysplace.net [213.133.54.210]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC8358FC13; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:42:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from danny@dannysplace.net) Received: from 203-206-171-212.perm.iinet.net.au ([203.206.171.212] helo=[192.168.10.10]) by mail.dannysplace.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1L22V6-0005fG-Ol; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 21:42:52 +1000 Message-ID: <492158D2.5020506@dannysplace.net> Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 21:43:14 +1000 From: Danny Carroll User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (Windows/20080914) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Matt Simerson References: <490A782F.9060406@dannysplace.net> <20081031033208.GA21220@icarus.home.lan> <490A849C.7030009@dannysplace.net> <20081031043412.GA22289@icarus.home.lan> <490A8FAD.8060009@dannysplace.net> <491BBF38.9010908@dannysplace.net> <491C5AA7.1030004@samsco.org> <491C9535.3030504@dannysplace.net> <4920E1DD.7000101@dannysplace.net> In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authenticated-User: danny X-Authenticator: plain X-Sender-Verify: SUCCEEDED (sender exists & accepts mail) X-Exim-Version: 4.69 (build at 08-Jul-2008 08:59:40) X-Date: 2008-11-17 21:42:41 X-Connected-IP: 203.206.171.212:3079 X-Message-Linecount: 37 X-Body-Linecount: 23 X-Message-Size: 1908 X-Body-Size: 967 X-Received-Count: 1 X-Recipient-Count: 3 X-Local-Recipient-Count: 3 X-Local-Recipient-Defer-Count: 0 X-Local-Recipient-Fail-Count: 0 X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 203.206.171.212 X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: matt@corp.spry.com, freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: danny@dannysplace.net X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5 (2008-06-10) on ferrari.dannysplace.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.2 required=8.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,AWL,TVD_RCVD_IP autolearn=disabled version=3.2.5 X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on mail.dannysplace.net) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Areca vs. ZFS performance testing. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:42:53 -0000 Matt Simerson wrote: > Allow me to introduce you to Marvell. The sell the SATA controller used > in the Sun thumper (X4500). I've used that same SATA controller under > OpenSolaris and FreeBSD. Unfortunately, that controller doesn't use > multi-lane cables. When you pack in 3 controllers and 24 disks, it's a > cabling disaster. > > http://freebsd.monkey.org/freebsd-fs/200808/msg00027.html Interesting. Wish I had seen it before. To be honest I did consider this board but I was really in favour of PCIe over PCIX. That might have been a mistake :-) > The Areca cards do NOT have the cache enabled by default. I ordered the > optional battery and RAM upgrade for my collection of 1231ML cards. Even > with the BBWC, the cache is not enabled by default. I had to go out of > my way to enable it, on every single controller. Are you talking about the Areca cache or the disks own caches? On my board it was enabled. But maybe mine was the exception. -D From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 11:44:50 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 057ED1065675; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:44:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from morganw@chemikals.org) Received: from warped.bluecherry.net (warped.bluecherry.net [66.138.159.247]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B89D08FC21; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:44:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from morganw@chemikals.org) Received: from volatile.chemikals.org (unknown [74.193.170.223]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by warped.bluecherry.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id DE0D1A1FD217; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:26:33 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (morganw@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by volatile.chemikals.org (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id mAHBQUV5001612; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:26:31 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from morganw@chemikals.org) Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 05:26:30 -0600 (CST) From: Wes Morgan To: Matt Simerson In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <490A782F.9060406@dannysplace.net> <20081031033208.GA21220@icarus.home.lan> <490A849C.7030009@dannysplace.net> <20081031043412.GA22289@icarus.home.lan> <490A8FAD.8060009@dannysplace.net> <491BBF38.9010908@dannysplace.net> <491C5AA7.1030004@samsco.org> <491C9535.3030504@dannysplace.net> <4920E1DD.7000101@dannysplace.net> User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (BSF 1167 2008-08-23) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="3265970123-550298141-1226921191=:1488" Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Areca vs. ZFS performance testing. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:44:50 -0000 This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. --3265970123-550298141-1226921191=:1488 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT On Sun, 16 Nov 2008, Matt Simerson wrote: > > On Nov 16, 2008, at 7:15 PM, Danny Carroll wrote: > >> Eirik Øverby wrote: >>> I have noticed that my 3ware controllers, after updating firmware >>> recently, have removed the JBOD option entirely, classifying it as >>> something you wouldn't want to do with that kind of hardware anyway. I >>> believed then, and even more so now, they are correct. >> >> It kinda depends. If there were a good 8 or 16+ port SATA card out >> there that *simply* did SATA with no bells and whistles, then there >> would be no point buying a Raid adaptor when you want to use things like >> ZFS. >> >> But there are no such cards available. > > Allow me to introduce you to Marvell. The sell the SATA controller used in > the Sun thumper (X4500). I've used that same SATA controller under > OpenSolaris and FreeBSD. Unfortunately, that controller doesn't use > multi-lane cables. When you pack in 3 controllers and 24 disks, it's a > cabling disaster. > > http://freebsd.monkey.org/freebsd-fs/200808/msg00027.html > >>> Use the RAID-0 disk trick to be able to utilize the controller cache. >>> And regarding write-back vs write-through; I believe write-through is >>> equvivalent to disabling controller write cache, however it WILL cache >>> the writes in order to respond to future reads of the data being >>> written. I would guess, but I don't know, that this also goes for >>> disk-level caches too, though, so it probably doesn't matter. >> >> It is interesting to me that the default setting on the Areca card was >> to have the disk caches turned on. I think that is strange because by >> default you have a situation that can lead to data loss even if you have >> a battery backup unit. > > The Areca cards do NOT have the cache enabled by default. I ordered the > optional battery and RAM upgrade for my collection of 1231ML cards. Even with > the BBWC, the cache is not enabled by default. I had to go out of my way to > enable it, on every single controller. Are you using these areca cards successfully with large arrays? I found a 1680i card for a decent price and installed it this weekend, but since then I'm seeing the raidz2 pool that it's running hang so frequently that I can't even trust using it. The hangs occur in both 7-stable and 8-current with the new ZFS patch. Same exact settings that have been rock solid for me before now don't want to work at all. The drives are just set as JBOD -- the controller actually defaulted to this, so I didn't have to make any real changes in the BIOS. Any tips on your setup? Did you have any similar problems? --3265970123-550298141-1226921191=:1488-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 11:57:33 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1FA7106564A; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:57:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from avg@icyb.net.ua) Received: from citadel.icyb.net.ua (citadel.icyb.net.ua [212.40.38.140]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B57078FC16; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:57:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from avg@icyb.net.ua) Received: from odyssey.starpoint.kiev.ua (alpha-e.starpoint.kiev.ua [212.40.38.101]) by citadel.icyb.net.ua (8.8.8p3/ICyb-2.3exp) with ESMTP id NAA17587; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 13:57:29 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from avg@icyb.net.ua) Message-ID: <49215C28.1020405@icyb.net.ua> Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 13:57:28 +0200 From: Andriy Gapon User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (X11/20081106) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Pawel Jakub Dawidek References: <491D710A.9090308@icyb.net.ua> <491D8621.40101@icyb.net.ua> <20081117043042.GA2101@garage.freebsd.pl> In-Reply-To: <20081117043042.GA2101@garage.freebsd.pl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-U Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: zfs snapdir: from hidden to visible and back again X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 11:57:33 -0000 on 17/11/2008 06:31 Pawel Jakub Dawidek said the following: > On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 04:07:29PM +0200, Andriy Gapon wrote: >> on 14/11/2008 14:37 Andriy Gapon said the following: >>> Also, even with snapdir=hidden, I still can list snapshots (their >>> contents) if I ls full path with .zfs in it. >>> Is this right? >> And it seems that any snapshot accessed in this way gets automatically >> added to mounts. This doesn't seem to be reasonable. >> >> For example, periodic security script would report suid binaries found >> in these snapshots, etc. > > Everything you described is expected behaviour. > I see. I guess there is no way to access something without mounting and no way to auto-unmount after use. Thanks. -- Andriy Gapon From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 14:15:46 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1831F106567A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 14:15:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: from mail.garage.freebsd.pl (chello087206045082.chello.pl [87.206.45.82]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B22D8FC12 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 14:15:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 4AF394569A; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:15:43 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (ghf58.internetdsl.tpnet.pl [83.12.187.58]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AA2B45684; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:15:34 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 15:15:23 +0100 From: Pawel Jakub Dawidek To: Andriy Gapon Message-ID: <20081117141523.GB2101@garage.freebsd.pl> References: <491D710A.9090308@icyb.net.ua> <491D8621.40101@icyb.net.ua> <20081117043042.GA2101@garage.freebsd.pl> <49215C28.1020405@icyb.net.ua> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="PuGuTyElPB9bOcsM" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <49215C28.1020405@icyb.net.ua> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.3i X-PGP-Key-URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~pjd/pjd.asc X-OS: FreeBSD 8.0-CURRENT i386 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.4 (2005-06-05) on mail.garage.freebsd.pl X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.9 required=3.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.4 Cc: freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: zfs snapdir: from hidden to visible and back again X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 14:15:46 -0000 --PuGuTyElPB9bOcsM Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Nov 17, 2008 at 01:57:28PM +0200, Andriy Gapon wrote: > on 17/11/2008 06:31 Pawel Jakub Dawidek said the following: > > On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 04:07:29PM +0200, Andriy Gapon wrote: > >> on 14/11/2008 14:37 Andriy Gapon said the following: > >>> Also, even with snapdir=3Dhidden, I still can list snapshots (their > >>> contents) if I ls full path with .zfs in it. > >>> Is this right? > >> And it seems that any snapshot accessed in this way gets automatically > >> added to mounts. This doesn't seem to be reasonable. > >> > >> For example, periodic security script would report suid binaries found > >> in these snapshots, etc. > >=20 > > Everything you described is expected behaviour. > >=20 >=20 > I see. I guess there is no way to access something without mounting and > no way to auto-unmount after use. > Thanks. You can setup a cron job which will try to unmount all the snapshots every few minutes. If something is using the snapshot, unmount should fail. --=20 Pawel Jakub Dawidek http://www.wheel.pl pjd@FreeBSD.org http://www.FreeBSD.org FreeBSD committer Am I Evil? Yes, I Am! --PuGuTyElPB9bOcsM Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFJIXx6ForvXbEpPzQRArpvAJ9WK5J5WTZtlqAeWJUWiJO2jgjYigCgpJ2R Z4YyBMC/P1emLEi462ZO6QI= =yFXy -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --PuGuTyElPB9bOcsM-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 21:05:00 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60FA41065670 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 21:05:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matt@corp.spry.com) Received: from yw-out-2324.google.com (yw-out-2324.google.com [74.125.46.30]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 146F58FC1A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 21:04:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matt@corp.spry.com) Received: by yw-out-2324.google.com with SMTP id 9so1097174ywe.13 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 13:04:59 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.207.8 with SMTP id e8mr2175076wfg.30.1226955898312; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 13:04:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from mattintosh.spry.com (207-178-4-6.wia.com [207.178.4.6]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 28sm5223751wfg.48.2008.11.17.13.04.56 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Mon, 17 Nov 2008 13:04:57 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: From: Matt Simerson To: Danny Carroll In-Reply-To: <492158D2.5020506@dannysplace.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 13:04:54 -0800 References: <490A782F.9060406@dannysplace.net> <20081031033208.GA21220@icarus.home.lan> <490A849C.7030009@dannysplace.net> <20081031043412.GA22289@icarus.home.lan> <490A8FAD.8060009@dannysplace.net> <491BBF38.9010908@dannysplace.net> <491C5AA7.1030004@samsco.org> <491C9535.3030504@dannysplace.net> <4920E1DD.7000101@dannysplace.net> <492158D2.5020506@dannysplace.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Areca vs. ZFS performance testing. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 21:05:00 -0000 On Nov 17, 2008, at 3:43 AM, Danny Carroll wrote: > Matt Simerson wrote: >> Allow me to introduce you to Marvell. The sell the SATA controller >> used >> in the Sun thumper (X4500). I've used that same SATA controller under >> OpenSolaris and FreeBSD. Unfortunately, that controller doesn't use >> multi-lane cables. When you pack in 3 controllers and 24 disks, >> it's a >> cabling disaster. >> >> http://freebsd.monkey.org/freebsd-fs/200808/msg00027.html > > Interesting. Wish I had seen it before. To be honest I did consider > this board but I was really in favour of PCIe over PCIX. That might > have been a mistake :-) > >> The Areca cards do NOT have the cache enabled by default. I ordered >> the >> optional battery and RAM upgrade for my collection of 1231ML cards. >> Even >> with the BBWC, the cache is not enabled by default. I had to go out >> of >> my way to enable it, on every single controller. > > Are you talking about the Areca cache or the disks own caches? Disk caching is a completely different animal, and one which I didn't mention. I'm spoke only about the write cache on the controller. Mine all arrived off by default, which is a VERY reasonable default configuration. Page 97 of the manual says about it: >>> 3.7.5.12 Disk Write Cache Mode >>> User can set the "Disk Write Cache Mode" to Auto, Enabled, or >>> Disabled. Enabled increases speed, Disabled increases reliability. > On my board it was enabled. But maybe mine was the exception. Perhaps it's model specific, or your vendor configured it that way. Or you got a return that someone else monkeyed with. I'm not going to speak for Areca but it seems quite odd that Areca would ship them with the cache enabled. I've used many hundreds of RAID controllers over the years and without exception, every single one with a write cache had it disabled by default. Matt From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 22:07:55 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67191106564A for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 22:07:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matt@corp.spry.com) Received: from yx-out-2324.google.com (yx-out-2324.google.com [74.125.44.30]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B5E58FC0C for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 22:07:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matt@corp.spry.com) Received: by yx-out-2324.google.com with SMTP id 8so1111226yxb.13 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 14:07:54 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.143.1.12 with SMTP id d12mr2195453wfi.189.1226959673677; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 14:07:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from mattintosh.spry.com (207-178-4-6.wia.com [207.178.4.6]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 32sm2151855wfa.20.2008.11.17.14.07.51 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Mon, 17 Nov 2008 14:07:52 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <8B620677-C2CA-4408-A0B1-AACC23FD0FF1@corp.spry.com> From: Matt Simerson To: Wes Morgan In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 14:07:49 -0800 References: <490A782F.9060406@dannysplace.net> <20081031033208.GA21220@icarus.home.lan> <490A849C.7030009@dannysplace.net> <20081031043412.GA22289@icarus.home.lan> <490A8FAD.8060009@dannysplace.net> <491BBF38.9010908@dannysplace.net> <491C5AA7.1030004@samsco.org> <491C9535.3030504@dannysplace.net> <4920E1DD.7000101@dannysplace.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Areca vs. ZFS performance testing. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 22:07:55 -0000 On Nov 17, 2008, at 3:26 AM, Wes Morgan wrote: >>> The Areca cards do NOT have the cache enabled by default. I >>> ordered the optional battery and RAM upgrade for my collection of >>> 1231ML cards. Even with the BBWC, the cache is not enabled by >>> default. I had to go out of my way to enable it, on every single >>> controller. > > Are you using these areca cards successfully with large arrays? Yes, if you consider 24 x 1TB large. > I found a 1680i card for a decent price and installed it this > weekend, but since then I'm seeing the raidz2 pool that it's running > hang so frequently that I can't even trust using it. The hangs occur > in both 7-stable and 8-current with the new ZFS patch. Same exact > settings that have been rock solid for me before now don't want to > work at all. The drives are just set as JBOD -- the controller > actually defaulted to this, so I didn't have to make any real > changes in the BIOS. > > Any tips on your setup? Did you have any similar problems? I talked to a storage vendor of ours that has sold several SuperMicro systems like ours where the client was using OpenSolaris and having similar stability issues to what we see on FreeBSD. It seems to be a lack of maturity in ZFS that underlies these problems. It appears that running ZFS on FreeBSD will either thrill or horrify. When I tested with modest I/O requirements, it worked great and I was tickled. But when I build these new systems as backup servers, I was generating immensely more disk I/O. I started with 7.0 release and saw crashes hourly. With tuning, I was only crashing once or twice a day (always memory related). With 16GB of RAM. I ran for a month with one server on JBOD with RAIDZ2 and another with RAIDZ across two RAID 5 arrays. Then I lost a disk and consequently the array on the JBOD server. Since RAID 5 had proved to run so much faster, I ditched the Marvell cards, installed a pair of 1231MLs and reformatted it with RAID 5. Both 24 disk systems have been ZFS RAIDZ across two RAID 5 hardware arrays for months since. If I build another system tomorrow, that's exactly how I'd do it. After upgrading to 8-HEAD and applying The Great ZFS Patch, I am content with only having to reboot the systems once every 7-12 days. I have another system with only 8 disks and 4GB of RAM with ZFS running on a single RAID 5 array. Under the same workload as the 24 disk systems, it was crashing at least once a day. This was existing hardware, so we were confident it wasn't hardware issues. I finally resolved it by wiping the disks clean, creating a GPT partition on the array and using UFS. The system hasn't crashed once since and is far more responsive under heavy load than my ZFS systems. Of course, all of this might get a fair bit better soon: http://svn.freebsd.org/viewvc/base?view=revision&revision=185029 Matt From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Nov 17 23:46:17 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EE2D1065672; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 23:46:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from danny@dannysplace.net) Received: from mail.dannysplace.net (mail.dannysplace.net [213.133.54.210]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BBF58FC08; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 23:46:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from danny@dannysplace.net) Received: from 203-206-171-212.perm.iinet.net.au ([203.206.171.212] helo=[192.168.10.10]) by mail.dannysplace.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1L2DnK-000BND-3e; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 09:46:16 +1000 Message-ID: <49220238.2040507@dannysplace.net> Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 09:46:00 +1000 From: Danny Carroll User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (Windows/20080914) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Matt Simerson References: <490A782F.9060406@dannysplace.net> <20081031033208.GA21220@icarus.home.lan> <490A849C.7030009@dannysplace.net> <20081031043412.GA22289@icarus.home.lan> <490A8FAD.8060009@dannysplace.net> <491BBF38.9010908@dannysplace.net> <491C5AA7.1030004@samsco.org> <491C9535.3030504@dannysplace.net> <4920E1DD.7000101@dannysplace.net> <492158D2.5020506@dannysplace.net> In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authenticated-User: danny X-Authenticator: plain X-Sender-Verify: SUCCEEDED (sender exists & accepts mail) X-Exim-Version: 4.69 (build at 08-Jul-2008 08:59:40) X-Date: 2008-11-18 09:46:14 X-Connected-IP: 203.206.171.212:1113 X-Message-Linecount: 36 X-Body-Linecount: 22 X-Message-Size: 1993 X-Body-Size: 959 X-Received-Count: 1 X-Recipient-Count: 3 X-Local-Recipient-Count: 3 X-Local-Recipient-Defer-Count: 0 X-Local-Recipient-Fail-Count: 0 X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 203.206.171.212 X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: matt@corp.spry.com, freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: danny@dannysplace.net X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5 (2008-06-10) on ferrari.dannysplace.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.2 required=8.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,AWL,TVD_RCVD_IP autolearn=disabled version=3.2.5 X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on mail.dannysplace.net) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Areca vs. ZFS performance testing. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 23:46:17 -0000 Matt Simerson wrote: > Disk caching is a completely different animal, and one which I didn't > mention. I'm spoke only about the write cache on the controller. Mine > all arrived off by default, which is a VERY reasonable default > configuration. Page 97 of the manual says about it: Ahhh, no I was talking about the disk cache setting. That is the one that is set to on by default (at least for me). I find it strange that this is the case. IMHO it makes the idea of a Battery backed cache redundant. > Perhaps it's model specific, or your vendor configured it that way. Or > you got a return that someone else monkeyed with. I'm not going to speak > for Areca but it seems quite odd that Areca would ship them with the > cache enabled. I've used many hundreds of RAID controllers over the > years and without exception, every single one with a write cache had it > disabled by default. I guess I had a return model. It's not really a big deal. -D From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Nov 18 06:27:20 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 537F4106564A for ; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 06:27:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from xcllnt@mac.com) Received: from asmtpout021.mac.com (asmtpout021.mac.com [17.148.16.96]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EB648FC13 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 06:27:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from xcllnt@mac.com) MIME-version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Received: from [192.168.1.95] (209-128-86-226.BAYAREA.NET [209.128.86.226]) by asmtp021.mac.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 6.3-7.03 (built Aug 7 2008; 32bit)) with ESMTPSA id <0KAI00EI3KHJZ390@asmtp021.mac.com>; Mon, 17 Nov 2008 21:27:20 -0800 (PST) Message-id: From: Marcel Moolenaar To: Andriy Gapon In-reply-to: <49198A1A.3080600@icyb.net.ua> Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 21:27:18 -0800 References: <4911C3E9.405@icyb.net.ua> <49198A1A.3080600@icyb.net.ua> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: zfs: affected by geom_(mbr|bsd) => geom_part_(mbr|bsd) ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 06:27:20 -0000 [sorry for the delay] On Nov 11, 2008, at 5:35 AM, Andriy Gapon wrote: > on 05/11/2008 18:03 Andriy Gapon said the following: >> Using GENERIC amd64 7-BETA2 system (installed from "official" ISO) I *snip* >> Then I built a custom kernel with nooptions for GEOM_(BSD|MBR) and >> options for GEOM_PART_(BSD|MBR). When I tried to boot this kernel it >> couldn't mount ZFS root and I simply rebooted my machine when I >> stuck at >> mountroot prompt (I couldn't enter UFS2 root because of unrelated >> keyboard problem). >> The boot was verbose and I didn't see any peculiar GEOM or GEOM_PART >> messages (errors, warnings). The problem is very likely related to change 184204. This change fixes a conflict between MBR and BSD. Unfortunately this fix wasn't in 7.1-BETA2. You should not have a problem with 7.1-RELEASE (nor 7-STABLE). FYI, -- Marcel Moolenaar xcllnt@mac.com From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Nov 18 08:10:30 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFC03106564A; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 08:10:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from avg@icyb.net.ua) Received: from hosted.kievnet.com (hosted.kievnet.com [193.138.144.10]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 892A48FC0A; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 08:10:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from avg@icyb.net.ua) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=edge.pp.kiev.ua) by hosted.kievnet.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.62) (envelope-from ) id 1L2LfJ-0000lE-OP; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 10:10:29 +0200 Message-ID: <49227875.6090902@icyb.net.ua> Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 10:10:29 +0200 From: Andriy Gapon User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (X11/20081005) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Marcel Moolenaar References: <4911C3E9.405@icyb.net.ua> <49198A1A.3080600@icyb.net.ua> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: zfs: affected by geom_(mbr|bsd) => geom_part_(mbr|bsd) ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 08:10:30 -0000 on 18/11/2008 07:27 Marcel Moolenaar said the following: > [sorry for the delay] > > On Nov 11, 2008, at 5:35 AM, Andriy Gapon wrote: > >> on 05/11/2008 18:03 Andriy Gapon said the following: >>> Using GENERIC amd64 7-BETA2 system (installed from "official" ISO) I > *snip* >>> Then I built a custom kernel with nooptions for GEOM_(BSD|MBR) and >>> options for GEOM_PART_(BSD|MBR). When I tried to boot this kernel it >>> couldn't mount ZFS root and I simply rebooted my machine when I stuck at >>> mountroot prompt (I couldn't enter UFS2 root because of unrelated >>> keyboard problem). >>> The boot was verbose and I didn't see any peculiar GEOM or GEOM_PART >>> messages (errors, warnings). > > The problem is very likely related to change 184204. This > change fixes a conflict between MBR and BSD. Unfortunately > this fix wasn't in 7.1-BETA2. You should not have a problem > with 7.1-RELEASE (nor 7-STABLE). Marcel, this particular change was definitely in kernel. As I reported in subsequent posts gpart show reported everything correctly and device node existed in dev, etc. UFS was happy about all its partitions, only ZFS had trouble. I think that this was something different, more subtle. -- Andriy Gapon From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Nov 18 16:45:39 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3ABDE1065673; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 16:45:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from xcllnt@mac.com) Received: from asmtpout020.mac.com (asmtpout020.mac.com [17.148.16.95]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27D7C8FC1E; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 16:45:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from xcllnt@mac.com) MIME-version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Received: from [192.168.1.95] (209-128-86-226.BAYAREA.NET [209.128.86.226]) by asmtp020.mac.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 6.3-7.03 (built Aug 7 2008; 32bit)) with ESMTPSA id <0KAJ00EGAFW19P20@asmtp020.mac.com>; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 08:45:38 -0800 (PST) Message-id: <93FC5F5D-91CD-450B-B08D-5C5EC5A1C880@mac.com> From: Marcel Moolenaar To: Andriy Gapon In-reply-to: <49227875.6090902@icyb.net.ua> Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 08:45:36 -0800 References: <4911C3E9.405@icyb.net.ua> <49198A1A.3080600@icyb.net.ua> <49227875.6090902@icyb.net.ua> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: zfs: affected by geom_(mbr|bsd) => geom_part_(mbr|bsd) ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 16:45:39 -0000 On Nov 18, 2008, at 12:10 AM, Andriy Gapon wrote: > on 18/11/2008 07:27 Marcel Moolenaar said the following: >> [sorry for the delay] >> On Nov 11, 2008, at 5:35 AM, Andriy Gapon wrote: >>> on 05/11/2008 18:03 Andriy Gapon said the following: >>>> Using GENERIC amd64 7-BETA2 system (installed from "official" >>>> ISO) I >> *snip* >>>> Then I built a custom kernel with nooptions for GEOM_(BSD|MBR) and >>>> options for GEOM_PART_(BSD|MBR). When I tried to boot this kernel >>>> it >>>> couldn't mount ZFS root and I simply rebooted my machine when I >>>> stuck at >>>> mountroot prompt (I couldn't enter UFS2 root because of unrelated >>>> keyboard problem). >>>> The boot was verbose and I didn't see any peculiar GEOM or >>>> GEOM_PART >>>> messages (errors, warnings). >> The problem is very likely related to change 184204. This >> change fixes a conflict between MBR and BSD. Unfortunately >> this fix wasn't in 7.1-BETA2. You should not have a problem >> with 7.1-RELEASE (nor 7-STABLE). > > Marcel, > > this particular change was definitely in kernel. > As I reported in subsequent posts gpart show reported everything > correctly and device node existed in dev, etc. UFS was happy about > all its partitions, only ZFS had trouble. I think that this was > something different, more subtle. Hmmm... this goes over my head. Some ZFS guru needs to tell us what criteria are being checked exactly before a disk/provider is considered the one recorded in the meta-data. -- Marcel Moolenaar xcllnt@mac.com From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Nov 18 17:29:45 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D828D106564A; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 17:29:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from avg@icyb.net.ua) Received: from citadel.icyb.net.ua (citadel.icyb.net.ua [212.40.38.140]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA2D68FC14; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 17:29:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from avg@icyb.net.ua) Received: from odyssey.starpoint.kiev.ua (alpha-e.starpoint.kiev.ua [212.40.38.101]) by citadel.icyb.net.ua (8.8.8p3/ICyb-2.3exp) with ESMTP id TAA28886; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 19:29:38 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from avg@icyb.net.ua) Message-ID: <4922FB81.50608@icyb.net.ua> Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 19:29:37 +0200 From: Andriy Gapon User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (X11/20081106) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Marcel Moolenaar References: <4911C3E9.405@icyb.net.ua> <49198A1A.3080600@icyb.net.ua> <49227875.6090902@icyb.net.ua> <93FC5F5D-91CD-450B-B08D-5C5EC5A1C880@mac.com> In-Reply-To: <93FC5F5D-91CD-450B-B08D-5C5EC5A1C880@mac.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: zfs: affected by geom_(mbr|bsd) => geom_part_(mbr|bsd) ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 17:29:46 -0000 I just remembered that I saved old zpool.cache file before "migrating" the pool. I looked at the diff of hexdumps and there are a number of differences, it's hard to understand them because the file is binary (actually it seems to contain serialized name-value pairs), but one difference is prominent: ... 00000260 64 65 76 69 64 00 00 00 00 00 00 09 00 00 00 01 |devid...........| ... -00000270 00 00 00 15 61 64 3a 47 45 41 35 33 34 52 46 30 |....ad:GEA534RF0| -00000280 54 4b 33 35 41 73 31 73 33 00 00 00 00 00 00 28 |TK35As1s3......(| ... +00000270 00 00 00 11 61 64 3a 47 45 41 35 33 34 52 46 30 |....ad:GEA534RF0| +00000280 54 4b 33 35 41 00 00 00 00 00 00 28 00 00 00 28 |TK35A......(...(| ... It looks like old "devid" value is "ad:GEA534RF0TK35As1s3" and new one is "ad:GEA534RF0TK35A". Just a reminder: actual zpool device is ad6s2d. The new value is what is reported by diskinfo: $ diskinfo -v ad6 ad6 ... ad:GEA534RF0TK35A # Disk ident. $ diskinfo -v ad6s2 ad6s2 ... ad:GEA534RF0TK35A # Disk ident. $ diskinfo -v ad6s2d ad6s2d ... ad:GEA534RF0TK35A # Disk ident. Hmm, "indent" is reported to be the same for all three entities. I don't remember what diskinfo reported with pre-gpart kernel, but I suspect that it was something different. Could anybody please check this? (on 7.X machine without GEOM_PART). I quickly glimpsed through sources and it seems that this comes from DIOCGIDENT GEOM ioctl i.e. "GEOM::ident" attribute. It seems that geom_slice.c code has some special handling for that. -- Andriy Gapon From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Nov 18 17:52:12 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3F881065670 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 17:52:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scode@hyperion.scode.org) Received: from hyperion.scode.org (cl-1361.ams-04.nl.sixxs.net [IPv6:2001:960:2:550::2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A21B8FC16 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 17:52:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scode@hyperion.scode.org) Received: by hyperion.scode.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id CA7B123C44D; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 18:52:10 +0100 (CET) Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 18:52:10 +0100 From: Peter Schuller To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20081118175210.GA3753@hyperion.scode.org> References: <20081109174303.GA5146@ourbrains.org> <20081109184349.GG51239@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <4920D879.3070806@jrv.org> <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="7JfCtLOvnd9MIVvH" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Subject: Re: Will XFS be adopted X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 17:52:12 -0000 --7JfCtLOvnd9MIVvH Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > YES! In my opinion it's not even appropriate for a machine with 2GB of > RAM. Why waste so much RAM on an FS? Does anyone know? Or is this some > sort of conspiracy to sell more bgger boxes. It's Sun, afterall.... I don't know whether, when people say this, they are just trying to spew FUD or they really don't realize the distinction. But regardless, please note that ZFS does not "waste" 2 GBs of memory. The memory it "uses" has to do with the fact that it has a dedicated cache - the ARC - that is distinct from the otherwise operating system integrated buffer cache. Now I *fully* realize that this sucks for some use cases (I have such use cases myself) where you simply do not want to reserve a portion of memory to file system caching. I also realize that the issues people have in terms of forcing the ARC to be really small can be a problem. However, the implication when people say that ZFS "wastes" a bunch of memory, seems to be that it somehow just uses up a bunch of memory for no good reason other than some kind of bloat. This is not the case. --=20 / Peter Schuller PGP userID: 0xE9758B7D or 'Peter Schuller ' Key retrieval: Send an E-Mail to getpgpkey@scode.org E-Mail: peter.schuller@infidyne.com Web: http://www.scode.org --7JfCtLOvnd9MIVvH Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (FreeBSD) iEYEARECAAYFAkkjAMoACgkQDNor2+l1i32YxQCgj1i2zdgOaUecXjoLqeYXGEXo Da8AnRllaDWtO0DXL1FuLr6GVU8HBXIT =lV54 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --7JfCtLOvnd9MIVvH-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Nov 18 19:50:01 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0BD7106564A; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 19:50:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from xcllnt@mac.com) Received: from asmtpout015.mac.com (asmtpout015.mac.com [17.148.16.90]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B938C8FC16; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 19:50:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from xcllnt@mac.com) MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_Q/RDFC20R9f2Fuvk1My3VQ)" Received: from mverma-lt.jnpr.net (natint3.juniper.net [66.129.224.36]) by asmtp015.mac.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 6.3-7.03 (built Aug 7 2008; 32bit)) with ESMTPSA id <0KAJ00G9MOFC1K40@asmtp015.mac.com>; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 11:50:01 -0800 (PST) Message-id: <022C4222-63B2-4535-8B7E-0426E9CE2BEA@mac.com> From: Marcel Moolenaar To: Andriy Gapon In-reply-to: <4922FB81.50608@icyb.net.ua> Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 11:49:59 -0800 References: <4911C3E9.405@icyb.net.ua> <49198A1A.3080600@icyb.net.ua> <49227875.6090902@icyb.net.ua> <93FC5F5D-91CD-450B-B08D-5C5EC5A1C880@mac.com> <4922FB81.50608@icyb.net.ua> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, freebsd-geom@freebsd.org Subject: Re: zfs: affected by geom_(mbr|bsd) => geom_part_(mbr|bsd) ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 19:50:01 -0000 --Boundary_(ID_Q/RDFC20R9f2Fuvk1My3VQ) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT On Nov 18, 2008, at 9:29 AM, Andriy Gapon wrote: > I just remembered that I saved old zpool.cache file before "migrating" > the pool. > I looked at the diff of hexdumps and there are a number of > differences, > it's hard to understand them because the file is binary (actually it > seems to contain serialized name-value pairs), but one difference is > prominent: > ... > 00000260 64 65 76 69 64 00 00 00 00 00 00 09 00 00 00 01 > |devid...........| > ... > -00000270 00 00 00 15 61 64 3a 47 45 41 35 33 34 52 46 30 > |....ad:GEA534RF0| > -00000280 54 4b 33 35 41 73 31 73 33 00 00 00 00 00 00 28 > |TK35As1s3......(| > ... > +00000270 00 00 00 11 61 64 3a 47 45 41 35 33 34 52 46 30 > |....ad:GEA534RF0| > +00000280 54 4b 33 35 41 00 00 00 00 00 00 28 00 00 00 28 > |TK35A......(...(| > ... > > It looks like old "devid" value is "ad:GEA534RF0TK35As1s3" and new one > is "ad:GEA534RF0TK35A". Just a reminder: actual zpool device is > ad6s2d. > > The new value is what is reported by diskinfo: > $ diskinfo -v ad6 > ad6 > ... > ad:GEA534RF0TK35A # Disk ident. > > $ diskinfo -v ad6s2 > ad6s2 > ... > ad:GEA534RF0TK35A # Disk ident. > > $ diskinfo -v ad6s2d > ad6s2d > ... > ad:GEA534RF0TK35A # Disk ident. > > Hmm, "indent" is reported to be the same for all three entities. > > I don't remember what diskinfo reported with pre-gpart kernel, but I > suspect that it was something different. > Could anybody please check this? (on 7.X machine without GEOM_PART). > > I quickly glimpsed through sources and it seems that this comes from > DIOCGIDENT GEOM ioctl i.e. "GEOM::ident" attribute. It seems that > geom_slice.c code has some special handling for that. Interesting. Can you try the attached patch to GPart: -- Marcel Moolenaar xcllnt@mac.com --Boundary_(ID_Q/RDFC20R9f2Fuvk1My3VQ) Content-type: application/octet-stream; x-unix-mode=0644; name=gpart.diff Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: attachment; filename=gpart.diff Index: part/g_part.c =================================================================== --- part/g_part.c (revision 185030) +++ part/g_part.c (working copy) @@ -1632,6 +1632,32 @@ } static void +g_part_done(struct bio *bp) +{ + char idx[8]; + struct g_part_entry *entry; + struct g_provider *pp; + size_t sz; + + /* + * Add partition index to the ident received from the + * underlying provider. This makes GPart compatible + * with partitioning schemes using geom_slice. ZFS, + * for example, compares the ident with on-disk meta- + * data and a mismatch causes the slice to be rejected. + */ + if (bp->bio_error == 0 && bp->bio_data[0] != '\0') { + pp = bp->bio_to; + entry = pp->private; + snprintf(idx, sizeof(idx), "s%d", entry->gpe_index); + sz = strlcat(bp->bio_data, idx, bp->bio_length); + if (sz >= bp->bio_length) + bp->bio_error = ENOSPC; + } + g_std_done(bp); +} + +static void g_part_start(struct bio *bp) { struct bio *bp2; @@ -1641,6 +1667,7 @@ struct g_part_table *table; struct g_kerneldump *gkd; struct g_provider *pp; + void (*bio_done)(struct bio *); pp = bp->bio_to; gp = pp->geom; @@ -1656,6 +1683,8 @@ return; } + bio_done = g_std_done; + switch(bp->bio_cmd) { case BIO_DELETE: case BIO_READ: @@ -1689,6 +1718,10 @@ if (g_handleattr_int(bp, "PART::offset", table->gpt_offset + entry->gpe_start)) return; + if (!strcmp("GEOM::ident", bp->bio_attribute)) { + bio_done = g_part_done; + break; + } if (!strcmp("GEOM::kerneldump", bp->bio_attribute)) { /* * Check that the partition is suitable for kernel @@ -1719,7 +1752,7 @@ g_io_deliver(bp, ENOMEM); return; } - bp2->bio_done = g_std_done; + bp2->bio_done = bio_done; g_io_request(bp2, cp); } --Boundary_(ID_Q/RDFC20R9f2Fuvk1My3VQ)-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 00:17:21 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4202F106568F for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 00:17:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org) Received: from ourbrains.org (li48-221.members.linode.com [66.246.76.221]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C9A0A8FC24 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 00:17:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org) Received: (qmail 21888 invoked by uid 1000); 19 Nov 2008 00:17:42 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 19:17:42 -0500 From: Dan To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20081119001742.GA21835@ourbrains.org> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org References: <20081109174303.GA5146@ourbrains.org> <20081109184349.GG51239@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <4920D879.3070806@jrv.org> <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> <20081118175210.GA3753@hyperion.scode.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20081118175210.GA3753@hyperion.scode.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Subject: Re: Will XFS be adopted X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 00:17:21 -0000 Peter Schuller(peter.schuller@infidyne.com)@2008.11.18 18:52:10 +0100: > However, the implication when people say that ZFS "wastes" a bunch of > memory, seems to be that it somehow just uses up a bunch of memory for > no good reason other than some kind of bloat. This is not the case. Has anyone done any bechmarks? Is the cache really helping that much? If it doesn't, and it performs similarly to other journaling FSes that do not use this much RAM, well, if it's not waste then what? Does it guarantee the same atomicity that UFS does? Is it OK to run an email server on it? Will I lose messages in cases of powerfail/crash? From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 00:48:55 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB7A11065672 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 00:48:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from andrew@modulus.org) Received: from secure.kgpl.com (secure.kgpl.com [58.96.21.131]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 925EE8FC16 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 00:48:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from andrew@modulus.org) Received: from secure.kgpl.com (secure.kgpl.com [58.96.21.131]) by localhost.kgpl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00AB737424BD; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 11:30:14 +1100 (EST) X-vFilter: This message has been scanned for viruses by ranger.kgpl.com Received: from [10.1.50.60] (10-1-50-60.admins.kgpn [10.1.50.60]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by secure.kgpl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 072CC3742492; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 11:30:12 +1100 (EST) Message-ID: <49235D86.4050106@modulus.org> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 11:27:50 +1100 From: Andrew Snow User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (X11/20080523) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dan , freebsd-fs@freebsd.org References: <20081109174303.GA5146@ourbrains.org> <20081109184349.GG51239@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <4920D879.3070806@jrv.org> <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> <20081118175210.GA3753@hyperion.scode.org> <20081119001742.GA21835@ourbrains.org> In-Reply-To: <20081119001742.GA21835@ourbrains.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: Re: Will XFS be adopted X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 00:48:55 -0000 Dan wrote: > Has anyone done any bechmarks? Is the cache really helping that much? 1. The downside to the ZFS benefits of instantaneous snapshots, clones, and filesystem-level RAID, is that it has to go through its metadata when you want to search directories or read files. A big cache helps make that faster as the commonly loaded tree nodes are pre-fetched and cached. File data is also pre-fetched, ZFS can handle multiple forward or backward reading streams per open file. 2. Much of the cache is used for writing cache, the more memory that can be thrown at that the more optimised the writing to disk can be. > If > it doesn't, and it performs similarly to other journaling FSes that do > not use this much RAM, well, if it's not waste then what? As I said above, the other filesystems don't give you built-in instant snapshotting and RAID. > Does it guarantee the same atomicity that UFS does? Yes. > Is it OK to run an email server on it? Will I lose messages in cases of powerfail/crash? It is perfect for running email because the transparent compression saves you space and I/O time. However, I would wait until it has been considered stable and moved into the 7-STABLE tree before deploying a production server. - Andrew From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 05:24:08 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1869E1065670 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:24:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org) Received: from ourbrains.org (li48-221.members.linode.com [66.246.76.221]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A24C08FC14 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:24:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org) Received: (qmail 4368 invoked by uid 1000); 19 Nov 2008 05:24:28 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 00:24:28 -0500 From: Dan To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20081119052428.GC4136@ourbrains.org> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Subject: (no subject) X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:24:08 -0000 A recent question came up about huge numbers of files in one directory. Well, some people actually have to deal with it on the job: http://leaf.dragonflybsd.org/mailarchive/kernel/2008-11/msg00070.html An FS doesn't have to be designed such that file look-ups take a very long time to search when directories are large. When a nice hash is used as part of the FS design, the time to search for 1 in a 100 files or 2 billion is the same. I view it as a feature. I can imagine a few cases where a large, non-human-readable directory is used to store many files. When developers know they have this feature at hand, they might as well use it. FS-based databases, image/sound editing, etc. From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 08:44:40 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03534106564A for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:44:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from tim.des.no (tim.des.no [194.63.250.121]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3F5C8FC2D for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:44:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from ds4.des.no (des.no [84.49.246.2]) by smtp.des.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C89B6D43F; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:27:00 +0000 (UTC) Received: by ds4.des.no (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 3775684490; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:27:00 +0100 (CET) From: =?utf-8?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=C3=B8rgrav?= To: Andrew Snow References: <20081109174303.GA5146@ourbrains.org> <20081109184349.GG51239@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <4920D879.3070806@jrv.org> <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> <20081118175210.GA3753@hyperion.scode.org> <20081119001742.GA21835@ourbrains.org> <49235D86.4050106@modulus.org> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:26:59 +0100 In-Reply-To: <49235D86.4050106@modulus.org> (Andrew Snow's message of "Wed, 19 Nov 2008 11:27:50 +1100") Message-ID: <86bpwcp1d8.fsf@ds4.des.no> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.60 (berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Will XFS be adopted X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:44:40 -0000 Andrew Snow writes: > [...] I would wait until it has been considered stable and moved into > the 7-STABLE tree before deploying a production server. ZFS has been in 7 for over a year. DES --=20 Dag-Erling Sm=C3=B8rgrav - des@des.no From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 12:46:23 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36DA7106564A for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:46:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@dannysplace.net) Received: from mail.dannysplace.net (mail.dannysplace.net [213.133.54.210]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2FCE8FC16 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:46:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@dannysplace.net) Received: from 203-206-171-212.perm.iinet.net.au ([203.206.171.212] helo=[192.168.10.10]) by mail.dannysplace.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1L2mRo-000105-0T for freebsd-fs@freebsd.org; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:46:22 +1000 Message-ID: <49240A80.5010106@dannysplace.net> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:45:52 +1000 From: Danny Carroll User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (Windows/20080914) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authenticated-User: danny X-Authenticator: plain X-Sender-Verify: SUCCEEDED (sender exists & accepts mail) X-Exim-Version: 4.69 (build at 08-Jul-2008 08:59:40) X-Date: 2008-11-19 22:46:20 X-Connected-IP: 203.206.171.212:3051 X-Message-Linecount: 21 X-Body-Linecount: 10 X-Message-Size: 707 X-Body-Size: 332 X-Received-Count: 1 X-Recipient-Count: 1 X-Local-Recipient-Count: 1 X-Local-Recipient-Defer-Count: 0 X-Local-Recipient-Fail-Count: 0 X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 203.206.171.212 X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: fbsd@dannysplace.net X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5 (2008-06-10) on ferrari.dannysplace.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.2 required=8.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,TVD_RCVD_IP autolearn=disabled version=3.2.5 X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on mail.dannysplace.net) Subject: ZFS Drive change best practice. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: fbsd@dannysplace.net List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:46:23 -0000 I need to migrate my ZFS drives from one bus to another. As such they will be getting new device names. I am pretty sure that if I do this with an export/import then it will just get the job done. Does anyone know if there I need to take anything special into consideration, like perhaps maintaining the order of the drives? -D From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 12:51:45 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E443106564A for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:51:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jdc@koitsu.dyndns.org) Received: from QMTA03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.32]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 957668FC1C for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:51:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jdc@koitsu.dyndns.org) Received: from OMTA05.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.43]) by QMTA03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id h0qe1a0020vyq2s530qjFK; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:50:43 +0000 Received: from koitsu.dyndns.org ([69.181.141.110]) by OMTA05.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id h0re1a00H2P6wsM3R0rft3; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:51:39 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=ZDbTLsK2zeAA:10 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=QycZ5dHgAAAA:8 a=lI5SyYldkA6oxCDDcbYA:9 a=UHlqQEGcnTMlUOZxGMIA:7 a=B0S5JKfQq4riN8V5Odwcgych630A:4 a=EoioJ0NPDVgA:10 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 Received: by icarus.home.lan (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 883EB33C36; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 04:51:38 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 04:51:38 -0800 From: Jeremy Chadwick To: Danny Carroll Message-ID: <20081119125138.GA86942@icarus.home.lan> References: <49240A80.5010106@dannysplace.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <49240A80.5010106@dannysplace.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ZFS Drive change best practice. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:51:45 -0000 On Wed, Nov 19, 2008 at 10:45:52PM +1000, Danny Carroll wrote: > I need to migrate my ZFS drives from one bus to another. As such they > will be getting new device names. > > I am pretty sure that if I do this with an export/import then it will > just get the job done. > > Does anyone know if there I need to take anything special into > consideration, like perhaps maintaining the order of the drives? Drive order does not matter, and drive label (e.g. adX or daX) does not matter; "zpool import -a" will figure it out. HOWEVER, there is a problem where ZFS can list the same drive label twice or more in the members list. Take a look at the last part of my Wiki here -- you'll see two members with the same name. This was induced by moving cables between two different controllers: http://wiki.freebsd.org/JeremyChadwick/ZFS_disk_upgrade_gone_bad I sent mail to pjd@ about this, but didn't receive a response (which is understandable given how busy he is). I have no idea if the latest ZFS commit on CURRENT fixes this problem. Just something to keep in mind. -- | Jeremy Chadwick jdc at parodius.com | | Parodius Networking http://www.parodius.com/ | | UNIX Systems Administrator Mountain View, CA, USA | | Making life hard for others since 1977. PGP: 4BD6C0CB | From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 13:55:46 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB3431065670 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 13:55:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from nick.barkas@gmail.com) Received: from yw-out-2324.google.com (yw-out-2324.google.com [74.125.46.29]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A8698FC1C for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 13:55:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from nick.barkas@gmail.com) Received: by yw-out-2324.google.com with SMTP id 9so1431251ywe.13 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:55:45 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to :subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=cOOv2Kwj3+6bygRPaoKmiWz29tlgFmEfye4tu/nXeaM=; b=Twep4ZPOavFyURVzsg42jilelJU6yqvI02iaQCyOJrbPXBbaKpPxOdoQPYvbBF4em+ N/XN/Dj/5yt3KMfjXW0nSAB9qrU0doAwtpPTFyPrsYUoccBmQPQKpqcrTQbe3VW/+WfT dvjWyVGfybF7elD/+V6apxIt6I/mPITuYonPY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition :references; b=cBVP/mu1e0wVazspHKMbDzlxE4HpY9bIu6LTrx3AyBlpN28NgFtHN/xHZrbAz7vRmQ AKvmxw7+ASi0jZXdYAOkw/TMRalrP1062XQ/lG8J+8HuK2sxLQBJEo4VKKx7nQvQyMlM V2rnamD1ZertwwZfcx7dbuxDwXu37V5HZiXxE= Received: by 10.90.93.8 with SMTP id q8mr753746agb.83.1227101364442; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:29:24 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.90.74.10 with HTTP; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:29:24 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:29:24 +0100 From: "Nick Barkas" To: dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org In-Reply-To: <20081119052428.GC4136@ourbrains.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <20081119052428.GC4136@ourbrains.org> Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: (no subject) X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 13:55:46 -0000 On Wed, Nov 19, 2008 at 06:24, Dan wrote: > A recent question came up about huge numbers of files in one directory. > Well, some people actually have to deal with it on the job: > > http://leaf.dragonflybsd.org/mailarchive/kernel/2008-11/msg00070.html > > An FS doesn't have to be designed such that file look-ups take a very > long time to search when directories are large. When a nice hash is used > as part of the FS design, the time to search for 1 in a 100 files or 2 > billion is the same. I view it as a feature. I can imagine a few cases > where a large, non-human-readable directory is used to store many files. > When developers know they have this feature at hand, they might as well > use it. FS-based databases, image/sound editing, etc. I'm not sure if this is what you're looking for, but FreeBSD's does have some provisions to avoid too much performance degradation with large directories. The VFS name cache will speed up look-up operations on specific individual files in any size directory that are repeatedly searched for, and it is filesystem independent. Specific to UFS2 there is dirhash, which was implemented by Ian Dowse and David Malone. It speeds up more types of operations involving large directories. They wrote a paper about it you can find here: http://www.usenix.org/events/usenix02/tech/freenix/dowse.html More recently I've done a little bit of work on dirhash as well that might further speed things up. It's not committed to SVN yet, but is in Perforce. I sent out patches to this list a little while back but have not received any reports from testers. My patches might need to be updated to apply on the latest -CURRENT, and I'll try to update the wiki page (http://wiki.freebsd.org/DirhashDynamicMemory) if I find out that that is the case. I am hoping to find the time in the next few months to start working on on-disk directory indexing for UFS2 so that linear searching through directory entries is never necessary. You are correct in that filesystems don't have to be designed such that searches are slow for large directories, but UFS was designed quite a long time ago. It is not trivial to change disk formats for directories now, especially given that we want to remain backwards compatible and be able to work properly with softupdates. I hope I can help make it happen though :) Nick From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 14:38:51 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6664106564A for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:38:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org) Received: from ourbrains.org (li48-221.members.linode.com [66.246.76.221]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A9CC28FC18 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:38:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org) Received: (qmail 6093 invoked by uid 1000); 19 Nov 2008 14:39:13 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:39:13 -0500 From: Dan To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20081119143913.GA6058@ourbrains.org> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org References: <20081119052428.GC4136@ourbrains.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Subject: Re: Large Directories X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:38:52 -0000 Nick Barkas(nick.barkas@gmail.com)@2008.11.19 14:29:24 +0100: I know about dirhash, but it blows out at a few dozen thousand files. There's is a nice discussion here: http://leaf.dragonflybsd.org/mailarchive/kernel/2008-11/msg00055.html From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 21:12:58 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 060D41065674 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 21:12:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: from mail.garage.freebsd.pl (chello087206045082.chello.pl [87.206.45.82]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A4698FC0C for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 21:12:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix, from userid 65534) id C9F8245685; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:12:54 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (ghf58.internetdsl.tpnet.pl [83.12.187.58]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix) with ESMTP id DAE4A45683; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:12:49 +0100 (CET) Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:12:47 +0100 From: Pawel Jakub Dawidek To: Jeremy Chadwick Message-ID: <20081119211227.GA2553@garage.freebsd.pl> References: <49240A80.5010106@dannysplace.net> <20081119125138.GA86942@icarus.home.lan> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="5/uDoXvLw7AC5HRs" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20081119125138.GA86942@icarus.home.lan> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.3i X-PGP-Key-URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~pjd/pjd.asc X-OS: FreeBSD 8.0-CURRENT i386 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.4 (2005-06-05) on mail.garage.freebsd.pl X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.9 required=3.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.4 Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ZFS Drive change best practice. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 21:12:58 -0000 --5/uDoXvLw7AC5HRs Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Nov 19, 2008 at 04:51:38AM -0800, Jeremy Chadwick wrote: > On Wed, Nov 19, 2008 at 10:45:52PM +1000, Danny Carroll wrote: > > I need to migrate my ZFS drives from one bus to another. As such they > > will be getting new device names. > >=20 > > I am pretty sure that if I do this with an export/import then it will > > just get the job done. > >=20 > > Does anyone know if there I need to take anything special into > > consideration, like perhaps maintaining the order of the drives? >=20 > Drive order does not matter, and drive label (e.g. adX or daX) does > not matter; "zpool import -a" will figure it out. >=20 > HOWEVER, there is a problem where ZFS can list the same drive label > twice or more in the members list. Take a look at the last part of my > Wiki here -- you'll see two members with the same name. This was > induced by moving cables between two different controllers: >=20 > http://wiki.freebsd.org/JeremyChadwick/ZFS_disk_upgrade_gone_bad >=20 > I sent mail to pjd@ about this, but didn't receive a response (which is > understandable given how busy he is). I have no idea if the latest ZFS > commit on CURRENT fixes this problem. >=20 > Just something to keep in mind. Sorry about lack of response. The situation should improve with recent ZFS, although at the end I decided to give up on disks IDs, as they only work with ATA disks and nobody implemented this functionality for SCSI disks. After some more tests I'll commit changes that make ZFS to always depend on metadata only. --=20 Pawel Jakub Dawidek http://www.wheel.pl pjd@FreeBSD.org http://www.FreeBSD.org FreeBSD committer Am I Evil? Yes, I Am! --5/uDoXvLw7AC5HRs Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFJJIFOForvXbEpPzQRAm6EAJ46SAyDN/xmm30uFsU2UUk7SxcMXwCfcnT5 BRcPuhWh7puRHPI+mc2VCwg= =61rx -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --5/uDoXvLw7AC5HRs-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 22:22:05 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00268106564A; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:22:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@dannysplace.net) Received: from mail.dannysplace.net (mail.dannysplace.net [213.133.54.210]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A35EE8FC16; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:22:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd@dannysplace.net) Received: from 203-206-171-212.perm.iinet.net.au ([203.206.171.212] helo=[192.168.10.10]) by mail.dannysplace.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.69 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1L2vQv-0005sl-Pr; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 08:22:03 +1000 Message-ID: <49249169.9010406@dannysplace.net> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 08:21:29 +1000 From: Danny Carroll User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (Windows/20080914) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Pawel Jakub Dawidek References: <49240A80.5010106@dannysplace.net> <20081119125138.GA86942@icarus.home.lan> <20081119211227.GA2553@garage.freebsd.pl> In-Reply-To: <20081119211227.GA2553@garage.freebsd.pl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authenticated-User: danny X-Authenticator: plain X-Sender-Verify: SUCCEEDED (sender exists & accepts mail) X-Exim-Version: 4.69 (build at 08-Jul-2008 08:59:40) X-Date: 2008-11-20 08:22:02 X-Connected-IP: 203.206.171.212:1163 X-Message-Linecount: 27 X-Body-Linecount: 13 X-Message-Size: 1033 X-Body-Size: 389 X-Received-Count: 1 X-Recipient-Count: 3 X-Local-Recipient-Count: 3 X-Local-Recipient-Defer-Count: 0 X-Local-Recipient-Fail-Count: 0 X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 203.206.171.212 X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: pjd@FreeBSD.org, koitsu@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: fbsd@dannysplace.net X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.5 (2008-06-10) on ferrari.dannysplace.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.2 required=8.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,AWL,TVD_RCVD_IP autolearn=disabled version=3.2.5 X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2 X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on mail.dannysplace.net) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, Jeremy Chadwick Subject: Re: ZFS Drive change best practice. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: fbsd@dannysplace.net List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:22:05 -0000 Pawel Jakub Dawidek wrote: > After some more tests I'll commit changes that make ZFS to always depend > on metadata only. > So I guess that means in the future, you could power down a system, re-arrange the disk positions and when you powered back up ZFS would just work? Could I also ask what the usual lead time is for ZFS changes to go from current -> stable? I'm just curious. -D From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 22:35:28 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F7641065670 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:35:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olivier@gid0.org) Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.175]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54C9B8FC19 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:35:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olivier@gid0.org) Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 24so186173wfg.7 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:35:27 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.143.4.16 with SMTP id g16mr768126wfi.124.1227132729114; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:12:09 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.179.14 with HTTP; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 14:12:09 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <367b2c980811191412h5e0af470k165b37edc2fc5853@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 23:12:09 +0100 From: "Olivier SMEDTS" To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Subject: ZFSBoot try and bsdlabel bootstrap code X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:35:28 -0000 Hello, I want to boot off a ZFS pool (version 13) on an USB stick for testing purposes. But I'm stuck with the bsdlabel bootstrap code size... I'm using a 2 hours old CURRENT. # kldload usb2_storage_mass # kldload zfs # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0 bs=512 count=32 # fdisk -BI da0 # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0s1 bs=512 count=32 # bsdlabel -wB -b /boot/zfsboot da0s1 bsdlabel: boot code /boot/zfsboot is wrong size Is what I'm trying to do with bsdlabel wrong ? I previously tried with the default bootstrap code but I had an (expected) "boot: Not ufs" error at boot. PS : I'm not subscribed to this list. Cheers, Olivier -- Olivier Smedts _ ASCII ribbon campaign ( ) e-mail: olivier@gid0.org - against HTML email & vCards X www: http://www.gid0.org - against proprietary attachments / \ "Il y a seulement 10 sortes de gens dans le monde : ceux qui comprennent le binaire, et ceux qui ne le comprennent pas." From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 23:15:23 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E74D1065672 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 23:15:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org) Received: from ourbrains.org (li48-221.members.linode.com [66.246.76.221]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id EE4C98FC13 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 23:15:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org) Received: (qmail 7667 invoked by uid 1000); 19 Nov 2008 23:15:43 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 18:15:43 -0500 From: Dan To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20081119231543.GA7659@ourbrains.org> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org References: <20081119052428.GC4136@ourbrains.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Subject: Re: (no subject) X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 23:15:23 -0000 Nick Barkas(nick.barkas@gmail.com)@2008.11.19 14:29:24 +0100: > I'm not sure if this is what you're looking for, but FreeBSD's does > have some provisions to avoid too much performance degradation with > large directories. The VFS name cache will speed up look-up operations > on specific individual files in any size directory that are repeatedly > searched for, and it is filesystem independent. Specific to UFS2 there > is dirhash, which was implemented by Ian Dowse and David Malone. It > speeds up more types of operations involving large directories. They I know. dirhash on only great until a few dozen thousand files, then it blows out. You might be interested in the dicussion here: http://leaf.dragonflybsd.org/mailarchive/kernel/2008-11/msg00055.html From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Nov 19 23:50:51 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D884106567B; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 23:50:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scode@hyperion.scode.org) Received: from hyperion.scode.org (cl-1361.ams-04.nl.sixxs.net [IPv6:2001:960:2:550::2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E84B8FC1E; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 23:50:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scode@hyperion.scode.org) Received: by hyperion.scode.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id A9DE623C4AA; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 00:50:49 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 00:50:49 +0100 From: Peter Schuller To: Danny Carroll Message-ID: <20081119235049.GA61843@hyperion.scode.org> References: <49240A80.5010106@dannysplace.net> <20081119125138.GA86942@icarus.home.lan> <20081119211227.GA2553@garage.freebsd.pl> <49249169.9010406@dannysplace.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="RnlQjJ0d97Da+TV1" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <49249169.9010406@dannysplace.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, Jeremy Chadwick , Pawel Jakub Dawidek Subject: Re: ZFS Drive change best practice. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 23:50:51 -0000 --RnlQjJ0d97Da+TV1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > So I guess that means in the future, you could power down a system, > re-arrange the disk positions and when you powered back up ZFS would > just work? FWIW, if glabel is used for all constituent drives this is already the case. --=20 / Peter Schuller PGP userID: 0xE9758B7D or 'Peter Schuller ' Key retrieval: Send an E-Mail to getpgpkey@scode.org E-Mail: peter.schuller@infidyne.com Web: http://www.scode.org --RnlQjJ0d97Da+TV1 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.9 (FreeBSD) iEYEARECAAYFAkkkplgACgkQDNor2+l1i33R9wCeNMCp3tnhVZDZURq+4L/KBSp8 RJsAn00LJTtaKLZ3dhqtNvyrWpNHmHpV =WjTY -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --RnlQjJ0d97Da+TV1-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Nov 20 02:26:45 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A7F1106564A for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 02:26:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (cain.gsoft.com.au [203.31.81.10]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC21E8FC0A for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 02:26:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from inchoate.gsoft.com.au (Inchoate.gsoft.com.au [203.31.81.30]) (authenticated bits=0) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id mAK1jhsx024673 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 20 Nov 2008 12:15:43 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 12:15:34 +1030 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.10 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart1821339.squO475khB"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <200811201215.42008.doconnor@gsoft.com.au> X-Spam-Score: -3.977 () ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.63 on 203.31.81.10 Subject: Unique ID for UFS? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 02:26:45 -0000 --nextPart1821339.squO475khB Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Hi, I am wondering if there is a unique ID generated for each UFS already? If n= ot=20 would it be possible to add one somehow? There is glabel, but I think having a UUID embedded in the FS would be very= =20 handy for automation andwould prevent accidents that glabel can cause. So, there could be a gfsid module that reads IDs from the FS (NTFS, ext2/3,= =20 UFS) and creates device nodes to allow access. Linux has something like this (or rather ext2/xfs do) and NTFS appears to h= ave=20 a unique ID (or at least Linux thinks so :) Thanks. PS please CC me as I'm not on the list. =2D-=20 Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum GPG Fingerprint - 5596 B766 97C0 0E94 4347 295E E593 DC20 7B3F CE8C --nextPart1821339.squO475khB Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQBJJMFF5ZPcIHs/zowRAh/dAJ0RNJQQ5JQZcmO7LW9u37QxVk83GACgl1mp SWaYB0iUjrLlqmb8/Iz1qLY= =EcTT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart1821339.squO475khB-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Nov 20 09:01:13 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7039B1065672 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:01:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from nick.barkas@gmail.com) Received: from yw-out-2324.google.com (yw-out-2324.google.com [74.125.46.28]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DC218FC19 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:01:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from nick.barkas@gmail.com) Received: by yw-out-2324.google.com with SMTP id 9so171950ywe.13 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:01:12 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to :subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=bZMlwshOsP4QULme7V5LphFtA3w5aaNpjzdPyokU/yM=; b=v7G8SkKeDvM+BqEw8dC9gNMJNdc0/qw2Ax5U9SmYr+j61MLTeBCZUtC8MLxVsXJTz0 +c+nIOHWr0Kp2pZWnCkytl7566rgoxEY2oUj8dGSAcP8msdruFnY5WOkY9PcUuvf35ny z30GaI+1WEpL5HGQez2Ntl7UtHYRQpVU+78mM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition :references; b=R6FX3Ci1coTwHyikLYGJdaJQfaI9/49TLHBKf/L6/htXVk8NIr9plYyC5uNO+v53w7 Z+JjrRMv/ZzsmsVi939Yn0GrG5MWWwI4Uep82kQ8Yjm5ZEJk0PsPw6YbniyGoBez8E6Y fhFKi/qoBsGQkDGpA8MAetel7GXVsNP8k8l5M= Received: by 10.90.86.10 with SMTP id j10mr1491991agb.6.1227171672061; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:01:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.90.74.10 with HTTP; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:01:12 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:01:12 +0100 From: "Nick Barkas" To: dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org In-Reply-To: <20081119143913.GA6058@ourbrains.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <20081119052428.GC4136@ourbrains.org> <20081119143913.GA6058@ourbrains.org> Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Large Directories X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:01:13 -0000 On Wed, Nov 19, 2008 at 15:39, Dan wrote: > Nick Barkas(nick.barkas@gmail.com)@2008.11.19 14:29:24 +0100: > I know about dirhash, but it blows out at a few dozen thousand files. This is because the default maximum amount of memory dirhash is allowed to use is only 2MB. Try increasing vfs.ufs.dirhash_maxmem. Of course, if you do have a directory larger than the amount of memory you can allow dirhash (e.g. millions of files in a directory on a system that doesn't have tens or hundreds of MB of memory to spare), dirhash can't help you. I just did a test creating ten million fake email messages in a maildir, and dirhash needed about 260MB of memory for it. Nick From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Nov 20 10:27:42 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 494641065673 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:27:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-fs@m.gmane.org) Received: from ciao.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.229.2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5D298FC16 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:27:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-fs@m.gmane.org) Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1L36l5-0003O3-VZ for freebsd-fs@freebsd.org; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:27:35 +0000 Received: from lara.cc.fer.hr ([161.53.72.113]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:27:35 +0000 Received: from ivoras by lara.cc.fer.hr with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:27:35 +0000 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org From: Ivan Voras Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 11:28:25 +0100 Lines: 47 Message-ID: References: <200811201215.42008.doconnor@gsoft.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enig4D8E240A529F9DB6FD347171" X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: lara.cc.fer.hr User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (X11/20080925) In-Reply-To: <200811201215.42008.doconnor@gsoft.com.au> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.0 Sender: news Subject: Re: Unique ID for UFS? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:27:42 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enig4D8E240A529F9DB6FD347171 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Daniel O'Connor wrote: > Hi, > I am wondering if there is a unique ID generated for each UFS already? = If not=20 > would it be possible to add one somehow? >=20 > There is glabel, but I think having a UUID embedded in the FS would be = very=20 > handy for automation andwould prevent accidents that glabel can cause. >=20 > So, there could be a gfsid module that reads IDs from the FS (NTFS, ext= 2/3,=20 > UFS) and creates device nodes to allow access. Looking at the output of dumpfs, there is an 64-bit numeric "id" field that changes from file system to file system so this might it: magic 19540119 (UFS2) time Sat Nov 15 04:16:42 2008 superblock location 65536 id [ 46ea67b4 178d71a1 ] (but judging from how the value changes on my file systems it might be related to the timestamp). If this is a usable ID, it should be trivial to make glabel create IDs nodes (i.e. /dev/ufs/46ea67b4178d71a1). --------------enig4D8E240A529F9DB6FD347171 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFJJTvJldnAQVacBcgRAvNpAJ0eFZo6kBsVCbpJV7q7PPMfdmXFdQCdH+tb pih+tyrDzy7Lzon82qxvHD4= =UOKJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enig4D8E240A529F9DB6FD347171-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Nov 20 10:33:48 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04D721065670 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:33:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-fs@m.gmane.org) Received: from ciao.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.229.2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE99F8FC14 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:33:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-fs@m.gmane.org) Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1L36r3-0003aQ-Vp for freebsd-fs@freebsd.org; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:33:45 +0000 Received: from lara.cc.fer.hr ([161.53.72.113]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:33:45 +0000 Received: from ivoras by lara.cc.fer.hr with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:33:45 +0000 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org From: Ivan Voras Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 11:34:36 +0100 Lines: 32 Message-ID: References: <200811201215.42008.doconnor@gsoft.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigDF7D00D4E1523340BA086339" X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: lara.cc.fer.hr User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (X11/20080925) In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.0 Sender: news Subject: Re: Unique ID for UFS? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:33:48 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigDF7D00D4E1523340BA086339 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ivan Voras wrote: > magic 19540119 (UFS2) time Sat Nov 15 04:16:42 2008 > superblock location 65536 id [ 46ea67b4 178d71a1 ] >=20 > (but judging from how the value changes on my file systems it might be > related to the timestamp). ^^^^ File system *CREATION* file stamp that is. --------------enigDF7D00D4E1523340BA086339 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFJJT08ldnAQVacBcgRAqDUAKCqvXLWuRd5KPQ9vQxH7GKqZH4X/QCgpF5z VPShORAQte7qY+6mSwyyQvo= =AUlQ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigDF7D00D4E1523340BA086339-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Nov 20 16:07:52 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C8AF1065670 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:07:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dfr@rabson.org) Received: from itchy.rabson.org (unknown [IPv6:2002:50b1:e8f2:1::143]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3357B8FC16 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:07:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dfr@rabson.org) Received: from [IPv6:2001:470:909f:1:21b:63ff:feb8:5abc] (unknown [IPv6:2001:470:909f:1:21b:63ff:feb8:5abc]) by itchy.rabson.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C1583FAA; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:06:37 +0000 (GMT) Message-Id: <16C31872-6A83-4FAB-AC85-213D604CDDE4@rabson.org> From: Doug Rabson To: Olivier SMEDTS In-Reply-To: <367b2c980811191412h5e0af470k165b37edc2fc5853@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:07:50 +0000 References: <367b2c980811191412h5e0af470k165b37edc2fc5853@mail.gmail.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.92/8653/Thu Nov 20 09:04:07 2008 on itchy.rabson.org X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ZFSBoot try and bsdlabel bootstrap code X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:07:52 -0000 On 19 Nov 2008, at 22:12, Olivier SMEDTS wrote: > Hello, > > I want to boot off a ZFS pool (version 13) on an USB stick for testing > purposes. But I'm stuck with the bsdlabel bootstrap code size... > I'm using a 2 hours old CURRENT. > > # kldload usb2_storage_mass > # kldload zfs > # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0 bs=512 count=32 > # fdisk -BI da0 > # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0s1 bs=512 count=32 > # bsdlabel -wB -b /boot/zfsboot da0s1 > bsdlabel: boot code /boot/zfsboot is wrong size > > Is what I'm trying to do with bsdlabel wrong ? > I previously tried with the default bootstrap code but I had an > (expected) "boot: Not ufs" error at boot. > > PS : I'm not subscribed to this list. The process for install zfsboot is a bit manual (and undocumented). Try something like this: # dd if=/boot/zfsboot of=/dev/da0s1 count=1 # dd if=/boot/zfsboot of=/dev/ds0s1 skip=1 seek=1024 Alternatively, you might try using the brand new support for GPT that I committed yesterday: # gpt create -f da0 # gpt boot -b /boot/pmbr -g /boot/gptzfsboot da0 # gpt add -t freebsd-zfs da0 # zpool create mypool da0p2 From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Nov 20 16:20:28 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F5E61065673 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:20:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olivier@gid0.org) Received: from an-out-0708.google.com (an-out-0708.google.com [209.85.132.248]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF8B18FC19 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:20:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olivier@gid0.org) Received: by an-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id b6so238693ana.13 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 08:20:27 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.170.16 with SMTP id s16mr1205738wfe.216.1227198026237; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 08:20:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.179.14 with HTTP; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 08:20:26 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <367b2c980811200820h5d1a058ax48cceb26d0c48137@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 17:20:26 +0100 From: "Olivier SMEDTS" To: "Doug Rabson" In-Reply-To: <16C31872-6A83-4FAB-AC85-213D604CDDE4@rabson.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <367b2c980811191412h5e0af470k165b37edc2fc5853@mail.gmail.com> <16C31872-6A83-4FAB-AC85-213D604CDDE4@rabson.org> Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ZFSBoot try and bsdlabel bootstrap code X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:20:28 -0000 2008/11/20 Doug Rabson : > > The process for install zfsboot is a bit manual (and undocumented). Try > something like this: > > # dd if=/boot/zfsboot of=/dev/da0s1 count=1 > # dd if=/boot/zfsboot of=/dev/ds0s1 skip=1 seek=1024 Great, I'm going to try that. Thanks ! > Alternatively, you might try using the brand new support for GPT that I > committed yesterday: > > # gpt create -f da0 > # gpt boot -b /boot/pmbr -g /boot/gptzfsboot da0 > # gpt add -t freebsd-zfs da0 > # zpool create mypool da0p2 I like testing brand new FreeBSD features on my brand old boxes. I'm going to have fun this weekend :) Cheers, Olivier -- Olivier Smedts _ ASCII ribbon campaign ( ) e-mail: olivier@gid0.org - against HTML email & vCards X www: http://www.gid0.org - against proprietary attachments / \ "Il y a seulement 10 sortes de gens dans le monde : ceux qui comprennent le binaire, et ceux qui ne le comprennent pas." From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Nov 20 16:26:07 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B743106564A for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:26:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lulf@stud.ntnu.no) Received: from bene2.itea.ntnu.no (bene2.itea.ntnu.no [IPv6:2001:700:300:3::57]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE1F98FC08 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:26:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lulf@stud.ntnu.no) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bene2.itea.ntnu.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11CAF90002; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 17:26:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from carrot.studby.ntnu.no (unknown [IPv6:2001:700:300:3::184]) by bene2.itea.ntnu.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id B95F090001; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 17:26:04 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 18:26:34 +0100 From: Ulf Lilleengen To: Doug Rabson Message-ID: <20081120172634.GA1438@carrot.studby.ntnu.no> References: <367b2c980811191412h5e0af470k165b37edc2fc5853@mail.gmail.com> <16C31872-6A83-4FAB-AC85-213D604CDDE4@rabson.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <16C31872-6A83-4FAB-AC85-213D604CDDE4@rabson.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at bene2.itea.ntnu.no Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ZFSBoot try and bsdlabel bootstrap code X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:26:07 -0000 On Thu, Nov 20, 2008 at 04:07:50PM +0000, Doug Rabson wrote: > > On 19 Nov 2008, at 22:12, Olivier SMEDTS wrote: > > > Hello, > > > > I want to boot off a ZFS pool (version 13) on an USB stick for testing > > purposes. But I'm stuck with the bsdlabel bootstrap code size... > > I'm using a 2 hours old CURRENT. > > > > # kldload usb2_storage_mass > > # kldload zfs > > # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0 bs=512 count=32 > > # fdisk -BI da0 > > # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0s1 bs=512 count=32 > > # bsdlabel -wB -b /boot/zfsboot da0s1 > > bsdlabel: boot code /boot/zfsboot is wrong size > > > > Is what I'm trying to do with bsdlabel wrong ? > > I previously tried with the default bootstrap code but I had an > > (expected) "boot: Not ufs" error at boot. > > > > PS : I'm not subscribed to this list. > > The process for install zfsboot is a bit manual (and undocumented). I see bsdlabel is restricted by BBSIZE. Could we perhaps increase it? or is this something that will break everything? I suspect it might be hard to maintain bsdlabel backwards compability with such a change. As an alternative, adding a flag for extended block size might be an option. -- Ulf Lilleengen From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Nov 20 16:40:25 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE5AA106564A for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:40:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dfr@rabson.org) Received: from itchy.rabson.org (unknown [IPv6:2002:50b1:e8f2:1::143]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6319F8FC1B for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:40:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dfr@rabson.org) Received: from [IPv6:2001:470:909f:1:21b:63ff:feb8:5abc] (unknown [IPv6:2001:470:909f:1:21b:63ff:feb8:5abc]) by itchy.rabson.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6E4E3F8F; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:39:10 +0000 (GMT) Message-Id: <81FBD67A-6908-4416-822D-CF943CDD50CF@rabson.org> From: Doug Rabson To: Ulf Lilleengen In-Reply-To: <20081120172634.GA1438@carrot.studby.ntnu.no> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:40:23 +0000 References: <367b2c980811191412h5e0af470k165b37edc2fc5853@mail.gmail.com> <16C31872-6A83-4FAB-AC85-213D604CDDE4@rabson.org> <20081120172634.GA1438@carrot.studby.ntnu.no> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.92/8653/Thu Nov 20 09:04:07 2008 on itchy.rabson.org X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ZFSBoot try and bsdlabel bootstrap code X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:40:25 -0000 On 20 Nov 2008, at 17:26, Ulf Lilleengen wrote: > On Thu, Nov 20, 2008 at 04:07:50PM +0000, Doug Rabson wrote: >> >> On 19 Nov 2008, at 22:12, Olivier SMEDTS wrote: >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> I want to boot off a ZFS pool (version 13) on an USB stick for >>> testing >>> purposes. But I'm stuck with the bsdlabel bootstrap code size... >>> I'm using a 2 hours old CURRENT. >>> >>> # kldload usb2_storage_mass >>> # kldload zfs >>> # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0 bs=512 count=32 >>> # fdisk -BI da0 >>> # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0s1 bs=512 count=32 >>> # bsdlabel -wB -b /boot/zfsboot da0s1 >>> bsdlabel: boot code /boot/zfsboot is wrong size >>> >>> Is what I'm trying to do with bsdlabel wrong ? >>> I previously tried with the default bootstrap code but I had an >>> (expected) "boot: Not ufs" error at boot. >>> >>> PS : I'm not subscribed to this list. >> >> The process for install zfsboot is a bit manual (and undocumented). > I see bsdlabel is restricted by BBSIZE. Could we perhaps increase > it? or is > this something that will break everything? I suspect it might be > hard to > maintain bsdlabel backwards compability with such a change. As an > alternative, adding a flag for extended block size might be an option. That won't help much - bsdlabel understands how to install bootcode for UFS only. The boot process for ZFS is a bit different. From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Nov 20 16:48:03 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A9091065670 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:48:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org) Received: from ourbrains.org (li48-221.members.linode.com [66.246.76.221]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 0F16C8FC1F for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:48:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dan-freebsd-fs@ourbrains.org) Received: (qmail 8521 invoked by uid 1000); 20 Nov 2008 16:48:23 -0000 Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 11:48:23 -0500 From: Dan To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20081120164823.GA8513@ourbrains.org> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org References: <20081109174303.GA5146@ourbrains.org> <20081109184349.GG51239@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <4920D879.3070806@jrv.org> <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> <20081118175210.GA3753@hyperion.scode.org> <20081119001742.GA21835@ourbrains.org> <49235D86.4050106@modulus.org> <86bpwcp1d8.fsf@ds4.des.no> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <86bpwcp1d8.fsf@ds4.des.no> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Subject: Re: Will XFS be adopted X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:48:03 -0000 Dag-Erling Sm??rgrav(des@des.no)@2008.11.19 09:26:59 +0100: > Andrew Snow writes: > > [...] I would wait until it has been considered stable and moved into > > the 7-STABLE tree before deploying a production server. > > ZFS has been in 7 for over a year. > > DES > -- > Dag-Erling Sm??rgrav - des@des.no But is it considered stable? :) From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Nov 21 00:48:15 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5E8F106564A for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 00:48:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsdlists@bsdunix.ch) Received: from conversation.bsdunix.ch (ns1.bsdunix.ch [82.220.1.90]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58BB18FC16 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 00:48:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsdlists@bsdunix.ch) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by conversation.bsdunix.ch (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5C445D56; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 01:32:15 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mail.bsdunix.ch Received: from conversation.bsdunix.ch ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (conversation.bsdunix.ch [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 9L8GWAo4uwVi; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 01:32:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.1.101] (home.bsdunix.ch [82.220.17.23]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by conversation.bsdunix.ch (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C3865D4A; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 01:32:13 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <18070C72-6354-43B4-9F36-7E1BE41DDA0A@bsdunix.ch> From: Thomas Vogt To: Dan In-Reply-To: <20081120164823.GA8513@ourbrains.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2008 01:32:13 +0100 References: <20081109174303.GA5146@ourbrains.org> <20081109184349.GG51239@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <4920D879.3070806@jrv.org> <20081117050441.GA16855@ourbrains.org> <20081118175210.GA3753@hyperion.scode.org> <20081119001742.GA21835@ourbrains.org> <49235D86.4050106@modulus.org> <86bpwcp1d8.fsf@ds4.des.no> <20081120164823.GA8513@ourbrains.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Will XFS be adopted X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2008 00:48:15 -0000 Helo Am 20.11.2008 um 17:48 schrieb Dan: > Dag-Erling Sm??rgrav(des@des.no)@2008.11.19 09:26:59 +0100: >> Andrew Snow writes: >>> [...] I would wait until it has been considered stable and moved >>> into >>> the 7-STABLE tree before deploying a production server. >> >> ZFS has been in 7 for over a year. >> >> DES >> -- >> Dag-Erling Sm??rgrav - des@des.no > > But is it considered stable? :) I can share my experiance: We run an official mirror server for many opensource projects. We use FreeBSD 7 including ZFS as the storage server. The system is mirroring a lot of data every day via rsync to the local zfs pool and offering all data via ftp/rsync and http to the end user. We have a few terabyte traffic every week and a lot of i/o load. After a few tweaks (vfs.zfs.arc_max etc) FreeBSD 7.x is running without any problems since a few months. Even with a few crashes at the beginning, we never encountered any data loss with zfs. I'm just talking about FreeBSD 7.x and not FreeBSD current. But current is not considered as production ready. Regards Thomas From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Nov 21 21:31:32 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D3F71065674 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 21:31:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olivier@gid0.org) Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.168]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8367C8FC16 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 21:31:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olivier@gid0.org) Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 24so1191710wfg.7 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 13:31:32 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.193.13 with SMTP id q13mr466770wff.265.1227303091174; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 13:31:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.142.179.14 with HTTP; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 13:31:31 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <367b2c980811211331v551893a8sde2231c3bc65468c@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2008 22:31:31 +0100 From: "Olivier SMEDTS" To: "Doug Rabson" In-Reply-To: <16C31872-6A83-4FAB-AC85-213D604CDDE4@rabson.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <367b2c980811191412h5e0af470k165b37edc2fc5853@mail.gmail.com> <16C31872-6A83-4FAB-AC85-213D604CDDE4@rabson.org> Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ZFSBoot try and bsdlabel bootstrap code X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2008 21:31:32 -0000 2008/11/20 Doug Rabson : > > On 19 Nov 2008, at 22:12, Olivier SMEDTS wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> I want to boot off a ZFS pool (version 13) on an USB stick for testing >> purposes. But I'm stuck with the bsdlabel bootstrap code size... >> I'm using a 2 hours old CURRENT. >> >> # kldload usb2_storage_mass >> # kldload zfs >> # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0 bs=512 count=32 >> # fdisk -BI da0 >> # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0s1 bs=512 count=32 >> # bsdlabel -wB -b /boot/zfsboot da0s1 >> bsdlabel: boot code /boot/zfsboot is wrong size >> >> Is what I'm trying to do with bsdlabel wrong ? >> I previously tried with the default bootstrap code but I had an >> (expected) "boot: Not ufs" error at boot. >> >> PS : I'm not subscribed to this list. > > The process for install zfsboot is a bit manual (and undocumented). Try > something like this: > > # dd if=/boot/zfsboot of=/dev/da0s1 count=1 > # dd if=/boot/zfsboot of=/dev/ds0s1 skip=1 seek=1024 It works ! Now I'm stuck at loader(8) prompt. After having a look at your patch, I tried building world with "LOADER_ZFS_SUPPORT=yes". And it seems broken, at least on amd64 : # cd /usr/src # make buildworld LOADER_ZFS_SUPPORT=yes [...] ===> sys (all) ===> sys/boot (all) ===> sys/boot/ficl (all) ===> sys/boot/efi (all) ===> sys/boot/efi/libefi (all) ===> sys/boot/zfs (all) ln -sf /work/src/sys/boot/zfs/../../../i386/include machine cc -O2 -pipe -march=native -I/work/src/sys/boot/zfs/../common -I/work/src/sys/boot/zfs/../.. -I. -I/work/src/sys/boot/zfs/../../../lib/libstand -I/work/src/sys/boot/zfs/../../cddl/boot/zfs -ffreestanding -mpreferred-stack-boundary=2 -mno-mmx -mno-3dnow -mno-sse -mno-sse2 -mno-sse3 -Wformat -Wall -c /work/src/sys/boot/zfs/zfs.c /work/src/sys/boot/zfs/zfs.c:1: error: -mpreferred-stack-boundary=2 is not between 4 and 12 *** Error code 1 Stop in /work/src/sys/boot/zfs. *** Error code 1 Stop in /work/src/sys/boot. *** Error code 1 Stop in /work/src/sys. *** Error code 1 Stop in /work/src. *** Error code 1 Stop in /work/src. *** Error code 1 Stop in /work/src. > Alternatively, you might try using the brand new support for GPT that I > committed yesterday: Well, this one was broken on amd64 and is now disconnected from the build. Any advice ? Olivier -- Olivier Smedts _ ASCII ribbon campaign ( ) e-mail: olivier@gid0.org - against HTML email & vCards X www: http://www.gid0.org - against proprietary attachments / \ "Il y a seulement 10 sortes de gens dans le monde : ceux qui comprennent le binaire, et ceux qui ne le comprennent pas." From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Nov 22 00:37:19 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38CFD1065672 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 00:37:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from zozo@q.gid0.org) Received: from postfix2-g20.free.fr (postfix2-g20.free.fr [212.27.60.43]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B98C48FC14 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 00:37:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from zozo@q.gid0.org) Received: from smtp8-g19.free.fr (smtp8-g19.free.fr [212.27.42.65]) by postfix2-g20.free.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 390CF2D0D3CE for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 23:12:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp8-g19.free.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp8-g19.free.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A0C332A7A7 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 01:12:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from q.gid0.org (s.gid0.org [88.163.116.140]) by smtp8-g19.free.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 486D432A6F5 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 01:12:59 +0100 (CET) Received: (from zozo@localhost) by q.gid0.org (8.14.3/8.14.3/Submit) id mAM0CvWP038070 for freebsd-fs@freebsd.org; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 01:12:57 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from zozo) Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2008 01:12:57 +0100 From: Olivier SMEDTS To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20081122001256.GA16276@q.gid0.org> References: <367b2c980811191412h5e0af470k165b37edc2fc5853@mail.gmail.com> <16C31872-6A83-4FAB-AC85-213D604CDDE4@rabson.org> <367b2c980811211331v551893a8sde2231c3bc65468c@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="M9NhX3UHpAaciwkO" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <367b2c980811211331v551893a8sde2231c3bc65468c@mail.gmail.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Subject: Re: ZFSBoot try and bsdlabel bootstrap code X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2008 00:37:19 -0000 --M9NhX3UHpAaciwkO Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline On Fri, Nov 21, 2008 at 10:31:31PM +0100, Olivier SMEDTS wrote: > 2008/11/20 Doug Rabson : > > > > On 19 Nov 2008, at 22:12, Olivier SMEDTS wrote: > > > >> Hello, > >> > >> I want to boot off a ZFS pool (version 13) on an USB stick for testing > >> purposes. But I'm stuck with the bsdlabel bootstrap code size... > >> I'm using a 2 hours old CURRENT. > >> > >> # kldload usb2_storage_mass > >> # kldload zfs > >> # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0 bs=512 count=32 > >> # fdisk -BI da0 > >> # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0s1 bs=512 count=32 > >> # bsdlabel -wB -b /boot/zfsboot da0s1 > >> bsdlabel: boot code /boot/zfsboot is wrong size > >> > >> Is what I'm trying to do with bsdlabel wrong ? > >> I previously tried with the default bootstrap code but I had an > >> (expected) "boot: Not ufs" error at boot. > >> > >> PS : I'm not subscribed to this list. > > > > The process for install zfsboot is a bit manual (and undocumented). Try > > something like this: > > > > # dd if=/boot/zfsboot of=/dev/da0s1 count=1 > > # dd if=/boot/zfsboot of=/dev/ds0s1 skip=1 seek=1024 > > It works ! > > Now I'm stuck at loader(8) prompt. > After having a look at your patch, I tried building world with > "LOADER_ZFS_SUPPORT=yes". And it seems broken, at least on amd64 : I managed to complete a fresh "buildworld LOADER_ZFS_SUPPORT=yes" with the attached patch. I took flags from sys/boot/i386/Makefile.inc without trying to really understand what was needed. Loader seems to recognize the zpool but can't "ls". I'll investigate that later. > # cd /usr/src > # make buildworld LOADER_ZFS_SUPPORT=yes > [...] > ===> sys (all) > ===> sys/boot (all) > ===> sys/boot/ficl (all) > ===> sys/boot/efi (all) > ===> sys/boot/efi/libefi (all) > ===> sys/boot/zfs (all) > ln -sf /work/src/sys/boot/zfs/../../../i386/include machine > cc -O2 -pipe -march=native -I/work/src/sys/boot/zfs/../common > -I/work/src/sys/boot/zfs/../.. -I. > -I/work/src/sys/boot/zfs/../../../lib/libstand > -I/work/src/sys/boot/zfs/../../cddl/boot/zfs -ffreestanding > -mpreferred-stack-boundary=2 -mno-mmx -mno-3dnow -mno-sse -mno-sse2 > -mno-sse3 -Wformat -Wall -c /work/src/sys/boot/zfs/zfs.c > /work/src/sys/boot/zfs/zfs.c:1: error: -mpreferred-stack-boundary=2 is > not between 4 and 12 > *** Error code 1 > > Stop in /work/src/sys/boot/zfs. > *** Error code 1 > > Stop in /work/src/sys/boot. > *** Error code 1 > > Stop in /work/src/sys. > *** Error code 1 > > Stop in /work/src. > *** Error code 1 > > Stop in /work/src. > *** Error code 1 > > Stop in /work/src. > > > > Alternatively, you might try using the brand new support for GPT that I > > committed yesterday: > > Well, this one was broken on amd64 and is now disconnected from the build. > > Any advice ? > > Olivier > > > -- > Olivier Smedts _ > ASCII ribbon campaign ( ) > e-mail: olivier@gid0.org - against HTML email & vCards X > www: http://www.gid0.org - against proprietary attachments / \ > > "Il y a seulement 10 sortes de gens dans le monde : > ceux qui comprennent le binaire, > et ceux qui ne le comprennent pas." -- Olivier Smedts _ ASCII ribbon campaign ( ) e-mail: olivier@gid0.org - against HTML email & vCards X www: http://www.gid0.org - against proprietary attachments / \ "Il y a seulement 10 sortes de gens dans le monde : ceux qui comprennent le binaire, et ceux qui ne le comprennent pas." --M9NhX3UHpAaciwkO Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline; filename=HEADpatch1 --- sys/boot/zfs/Makefile.orig 2008-11-22 00:15:42.000000000 +0100 +++ sys/boot/zfs/Makefile 2008-11-22 00:16:22.000000000 +0100 @@ -17,6 +17,9 @@ CFLAGS+= -Wformat -Wall .if ${MACHINE_ARCH} == "amd64" +CFLAGS+= -m32 -march=i386 +LDFLAGS+= -m elf_i386_fbsd +AFLAGS+= --32 CLEANFILES+= machine machine: ln -sf ${.CURDIR}/../../../i386/include machine --M9NhX3UHpAaciwkO-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Nov 22 09:27:37 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1364D106564A for ; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 09:27:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dfr@rabson.org) Received: from itchy.rabson.org (unknown [IPv6:2002:50b1:e8f2:1::143]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B808F8FC14 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 09:27:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from dfr@rabson.org) Received: from [IPv6:2001:470:909f:1:21b:63ff:feb8:5abc] (unknown [IPv6:2001:470:909f:1:21b:63ff:feb8:5abc]) by itchy.rabson.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B97593FAD; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 09:26:22 +0000 (GMT) Message-Id: <111E2DF2-62A3-40E7-96D3-A59BFDF2910C@rabson.org> From: Doug Rabson To: "Olivier SMEDTS" In-Reply-To: <367b2c980811211331v551893a8sde2231c3bc65468c@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2008 09:27:35 +0000 References: <367b2c980811191412h5e0af470k165b37edc2fc5853@mail.gmail.com> <16C31872-6A83-4FAB-AC85-213D604CDDE4@rabson.org> <367b2c980811211331v551893a8sde2231c3bc65468c@mail.gmail.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.92/8662/Sat Nov 22 07:12:04 2008 on itchy.rabson.org X-Virus-Status: Clean Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ZFSBoot try and bsdlabel bootstrap code X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2008 09:27:37 -0000 On 21 Nov 2008, at 21:31, Olivier SMEDTS wrote: > 2008/11/20 Doug Rabson : >> >> On 19 Nov 2008, at 22:12, Olivier SMEDTS wrote: >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> I want to boot off a ZFS pool (version 13) on an USB stick for >>> testing >>> purposes. But I'm stuck with the bsdlabel bootstrap code size... >>> I'm using a 2 hours old CURRENT. >>> >>> # kldload usb2_storage_mass >>> # kldload zfs >>> # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0 bs=512 count=32 >>> # fdisk -BI da0 >>> # dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/da0s1 bs=512 count=32 >>> # bsdlabel -wB -b /boot/zfsboot da0s1 >>> bsdlabel: boot code /boot/zfsboot is wrong size >>> >>> Is what I'm trying to do with bsdlabel wrong ? >>> I previously tried with the default bootstrap code but I had an >>> (expected) "boot: Not ufs" error at boot. >>> >>> PS : I'm not subscribed to this list. >> >> The process for install zfsboot is a bit manual (and undocumented). >> Try >> something like this: >> >> # dd if=/boot/zfsboot of=/dev/da0s1 count=1 >> # dd if=/boot/zfsboot of=/dev/ds0s1 skip=1 seek=1024 > > It works ! > > Now I'm stuck at loader(8) prompt. > After having a look at your patch, I tried building world with > "LOADER_ZFS_SUPPORT=yes". And it seems broken, at least on amd64 : > > # cd /usr/src > # make buildworld LOADER_ZFS_SUPPORT=yes > [...] > > >> Alternatively, you might try using the brand new support for GPT >> that I >> committed yesterday: > > Well, this one was broken on amd64 and is now disconnected from the > build. > > Any advice ? I will sort out the amd64 build problems. My test machine was i386 so I missed it. From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Nov 22 23:01:57 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53A60106564A; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 23:01:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: from mail.garage.freebsd.pl (chello087206045082.chello.pl [87.206.45.82]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FDB38FC17; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 23:01:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pjd@garage.freebsd.pl) Received: by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 5520E45685; Sun, 23 Nov 2008 00:01:55 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (chello087206045082.chello.pl [87.206.45.82]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail.garage.freebsd.pl (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBAD645683; Sun, 23 Nov 2008 00:01:49 +0100 (CET) Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2008 00:01:51 +0100 From: Pawel Jakub Dawidek To: Danny Carroll Message-ID: <20081122230151.GB2016@garage.freebsd.pl> References: <49240A80.5010106@dannysplace.net> <20081119125138.GA86942@icarus.home.lan> <20081119211227.GA2553@garage.freebsd.pl> <49249169.9010406@dannysplace.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="GID0FwUMdk1T2AWN" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <49249169.9010406@dannysplace.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.3i X-PGP-Key-URL: http://people.freebsd.org/~pjd/pjd.asc X-OS: FreeBSD 8.0-CURRENT i386 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.4 (2005-06-05) on mail.garage.freebsd.pl X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.0.4 Cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org, Jeremy Chadwick Subject: Re: ZFS Drive change best practice. X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2008 23:01:57 -0000 --GID0FwUMdk1T2AWN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Nov 20, 2008 at 08:21:29AM +1000, Danny Carroll wrote: > Pawel Jakub Dawidek wrote: > > After some more tests I'll commit changes that make ZFS to always depend > > on metadata only. > >=20 >=20 > So I guess that means in the future, you could power down a system, > re-arrange the disk positions and when you powered back up ZFS would > just work? Yes. I committed needed changes earlier today. > Could I also ask what the usual lead time is for ZFS changes to go from > current -> stable? I'm just curious. There is no fixed time, it all depends on much testing will it receive and how many bugs will be there plus when *at() syscalls will be MFCed. --=20 Pawel Jakub Dawidek http://www.wheel.pl pjd@FreeBSD.org http://www.FreeBSD.org FreeBSD committer Am I Evil? Yes, I Am! --GID0FwUMdk1T2AWN Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.4 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFJKI9fForvXbEpPzQRAmTYAKCH/+MPWuzjNRxu+3LJLlWLtXnF1QCfYcU1 JbCfvHf8H0YCwrq1k0gOZyw= =eFEU -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --GID0FwUMdk1T2AWN--