From owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jul 21 18:49:10 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E47F106566B for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:49:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) Received: from hub.org (hub.org [200.46.204.220]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BBBA8FC0A for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:49:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from maia.hub.org (maia-5.hub.org [200.46.204.29]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 147DA34559A5 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 15:49:09 -0300 (ADT) Received: from hub.org ([200.46.204.220]) by maia.hub.org (mx1.hub.org [200.46.204.29]) (amavisd-maia, port 10024) with ESMTP id 20324-08 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:49:08 +0000 (UTC) Received: by hub.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id A3F1A34559A2; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 15:49:07 -0300 (ADT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3950345593B for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 15:49:07 -0300 (ADT) Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 15:49:07 -0300 (ADT) From: "Marc G. Fournier" To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Message-ID: User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (BSF 1167 2008-08-23) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII Subject: OSS Control Panel to manage FreeBSD jails ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Services Providers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:49:10 -0000 About 6 years ago or so, we wrote an inhouse control panel to allow us to manage freebsd jails from a central gui ... although it works, its neither intuitive or pretty ... and is a nightmare to change ... The features it does have is: each client has 1 or more login ideas tot heir account a client can have multiple jails assigned to them - front page has a summary of memory, storage and bandwidth usage - each VPS has their own detail screen that includes the above, as well as any virtual hosts that are running on it - new virtual machines can be requesetd - new virtual hosts can be added - mysql/pgsql databases can be added / deleted all invoicing is performed automatically through the system there is a support center for clients to post problems what it doesn't do is dns or email management ... dns is modified 'by request', and email is a totally seperate, unintegrated inferface ... I've tried DTC, and its a nice interface, but its more a 'seperate instance per VPS' vs centralized solution ... I don't want to have to log into multiple interfaces to deal with support issues, for instance .. but, at the same time, don't want to force a client to have two different interfaces to handle things ... Does anyone have any suggestions on software that could replace this? I don't want ot run VMWare, or any of the other virtualization software packages, I would like to stick, as much as possible, to a nice, clean, jail environment ... Thoughts? ---- Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Hosting Solutions S.A. scrappy@hub.org http://www.hub.org Yahoo:yscrappy Skype: hub.org ICQ:7615664 MSN:scrappy@hub.org From owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jul 21 19:37:11 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2350C1065689 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 19:37:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jack@crepinc.com) Received: from mail-fx0-f54.google.com (mail-fx0-f54.google.com [209.85.161.54]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A66A8FC1E for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 19:37:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: by fxm13 with SMTP id 13so4260010fxm.13 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 12:37:09 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.216.90.3 with SMTP id d3mr563175wef.99.1279739144469; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 12:05:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.216.17.213 with HTTP; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 12:05:44 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 15:05:44 -0400 Message-ID: From: Jack Carrozzo To: "Marc G. Fournier" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OSS Control Panel to manage FreeBSD jails ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Services Providers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 19:37:11 -0000 While this admittedly doesn't help your issue much, I wrote one also a while back and use MyDNS to manage PTRs and such. I had a MyDNS master, whose DB was updated by the webfront end, and 4 BIND slaves who yoinked zones off the master (I didn't trust MyDNS to be public). http://mydns.bboy.net/ For what it's worth, I couldn't find a handy solution either (hence writing things). Cheers, -Jack On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > > About 6 years ago or so, we wrote an inhouse control panel to allow us to > manage freebsd jails from a central gui ... although it works, its neither > intuitive or pretty ... and is a nightmare to change ... > > The features it does have is: > > each client has 1 or more login ideas tot heir account > a client can have multiple jails assigned to them > - front page has a summary of memory, storage and bandwidth usage > - each VPS has their own detail screen that includes the above, as well > as any virtual hosts that are running on it > - new virtual machines can be requesetd > - new virtual hosts can be added > - mysql/pgsql databases can be added / deleted > all invoicing is performed automatically through the system > there is a support center for clients to post problems > > what it doesn't do is dns or email management ... dns is modified 'by > request', and email is a totally seperate, unintegrated inferface ... > > I've tried DTC, and its a nice interface, but its more a 'seperate instance > per VPS' vs centralized solution ... I don't want to have to log into > multiple interfaces to deal with support issues, for instance .. but, at the > same time, don't want to force a client to have two different interfaces to > handle things ... > > Does anyone have any suggestions on software that could replace this? I > don't want ot run VMWare, or any of the other virtualization software > packages, I would like to stick, as much as possible, to a nice, clean, jail > environment ... > > Thoughts? > > ---- > Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Hosting Solutions S.A. > scrappy@hub.org http://www.hub.org > > Yahoo:yscrappy Skype: hub.org ICQ:7615664 MSN:scrappy@hub.org > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-isp@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-isp > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-isp-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > From owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jul 21 20:13:58 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A17E9106564A for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:13:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tom@tomjudge.com) Received: from eu1sys200aog114.obsmtp.com (eu1sys200aog114.obsmtp.com [207.126.144.137]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CE8898FC1A for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:13:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: from source ([63.174.175.251]) by eu1sys200aob114.postini.com ([207.126.147.11]) with SMTP ID DSNKTEdVBPpJLkC26i+b6BYwQ/L/5kRaS0Vh@postini.com; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:13:58 UTC Received: from [172.17.10.53] (unknown [172.17.10.53]) by bbbx3.usdmm.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F33E4FD01C; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 19:56:38 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <4C4750A6.30005@tomjudge.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 19:55:18 +0000 From: Tom Judge User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.9.1.10) Gecko/20100527 Lightning/1.0b1 Thunderbird/3.0.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Marc G. Fournier" References: In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 1.0.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OSS Control Panel to manage FreeBSD jails ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Services Providers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:13:58 -0000 On 07/21/2010 06:49 PM, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > > About 6 years ago or so, we wrote an inhouse control panel to allow us > to manage freebsd jails from a central gui ... although it works, its > neither intuitive or pretty ... and is a nightmare to change ... > At $work use a heavily customized version of RackTables with support for managing FreeBSD Jails across all of our sites (200+ hosts, 570+ jails). The backend management is driven by cfengine with a custom module that leverages ezjail to the actual jail management. You can find the backend details here: http://www.tomjudge.com/index.php/CFEngine/Managing_FreeBSD_Jails Our full modifications to RackTables include role based package management and automated package building using tinderbox nodes, which I have yet to completely write up. > The features it does have is: > > each client has 1 or more login ideas tot heir account > a client can have multiple jails assigned to them > - front page has a summary of memory, storage and bandwidth usage > - each VPS has their own detail screen that includes the above, as well > as any virtual hosts that are running on it > - new virtual machines can be requesetd > - new virtual hosts can be added > - mysql/pgsql databases can be added / deleted > all invoicing is performed automatically through the system > there is a support center for clients to post problems > The system is not any where near this advanced, it does however work quite nicely for us. To distribute the configuration data across our 7 sites we use MySQL replication and each node uses a local replica of the configuration database. Most of the monitoring functions we use cacti and nagios to perform but they are not integrated into the user interface in a nice/useful way. For us the way forward is looking to be openQRM and adding jail support to it. > what it doesn't do is dns or email management ... dns is modified 'by > request', and email is a totally seperate, unintegrated inferface ... > For DNS management we use Bind with the ldap backend as a master, then 2 slaves at each site. To push out changes we have a collection of scripts that send SOA notifications out on different IP addresses. This is needed as a number of zones are split horizon and all updates originate from our internal network. > I've tried DTC, and its a nice interface, but its more a 'seperate > instance per VPS' vs centralized solution ... I don't want to have to > log into multiple interfaces to deal with support issues, for instance > .. but, at the same time, don't want to force a client to have two > different interfaces to handle things ... > > Does anyone have any suggestions on software that could replace this? > I don't want ot run VMWare, or any of the other virtualization > software packages, I would like to stick, as much as possible, to a > nice, clean, jail environment ... > Not sure if any of the info I have provided is useful to you, but someone may find it useful. Tom -- TJU13-ARIN From owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jul 21 20:33:25 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F5A31065672 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:33:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from outbackdingo@gmail.com) Received: from mail-fx0-f54.google.com (mail-fx0-f54.google.com [209.85.161.54]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16DFC8FC17 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:33:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: by fxm13 with SMTP id 13so4313910fxm.13 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 13:33:23 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:received:in-reply-to :references:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=+v49KsZwm6TFXPJC41pI9Z+egxCBt4kge7EvG3shPgY=; b=bxWinA/LUSnC0+Wg9EgxNk5c4ltHAS0sXDg3QSi12WQZ4sduL44tl/iM9fvJNnM/VW P73iAd86P4xDbqv5qtIKpMqRceL7Zss/vx/biCj0v+FMBQcG+hcfid9xhXWU6dtHMH+e SlG285vly8tJJ8kT0b8E9M/iQati24HLi/OKE= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; b=u8bdRPqtzi1g9ML7ryOoeg/vRtTm01cx3FVCjEabLdJmF3ojrHG+rcsazsyCZO0GXw PkNhZJKSaa1j5MQJdW1fN4OAyFhpgZWoDEAivl1gmPKEI5cJ3d1uXzZcMnT+Mk/aJN8e SUG3wRISfYthx+BMsDk+fJwG6BmbH8OLrigy8= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.239.185.199 with SMTP id d7mr70584hbh.59.1279742626802; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 13:03:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.239.145.81 with HTTP; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 13:03:46 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 16:03:46 -0400 Message-ID: From: Outback Dingo To: "Marc G. Fournier" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OSS Control Panel to manage FreeBSD jails ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Services Providers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:33:25 -0000 Marc, I think ISPControl will with a minor path modifications, to reach into jails, might be worth taking a look at http://isp-control.net/ On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 2:49 PM, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > > About 6 years ago or so, we wrote an inhouse control panel to allow us to > manage freebsd jails from a central gui ... although it works, its neither > intuitive or pretty ... and is a nightmare to change ... > > The features it does have is: > > each client has 1 or more login ideas tot heir account > a client can have multiple jails assigned to them > - front page has a summary of memory, storage and bandwidth usage > - each VPS has their own detail screen that includes the above, as well > as any virtual hosts that are running on it > - new virtual machines can be requesetd > - new virtual hosts can be added > - mysql/pgsql databases can be added / deleted > all invoicing is performed automatically through the system > there is a support center for clients to post problems > > what it doesn't do is dns or email management ... dns is modified 'by > request', and email is a totally seperate, unintegrated inferface ... > > I've tried DTC, and its a nice interface, but its more a 'seperate instance > per VPS' vs centralized solution ... I don't want to have to log into > multiple interfaces to deal with support issues, for instance .. but, at the > same time, don't want to force a client to have two different interfaces to > handle things ... > > Does anyone have any suggestions on software that could replace this? I > don't want ot run VMWare, or any of the other virtualization software > packages, I would like to stick, as much as possible, to a nice, clean, jail > environment ... > > Thoughts? > > ---- > Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Hosting Solutions S.A. > scrappy@hub.org http://www.hub.org > > Yahoo:yscrappy Skype: hub.org ICQ:7615664 MSN:scrappy@hub.org > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-isp@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-isp > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-isp-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > From owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jul 21 20:49:28 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27502106564A for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:49:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from adam@hendricks.amyl.org.uk) Received: from hendricks.amyl.org.uk (hendricks.amyl.org.uk [93.93.129.13]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E483D8FC17 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:49:26 +0000 (UTC) Received: from adam by hendricks.amyl.org.uk with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ObfyH-0002dz-MD; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:32:53 +0100 Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:32:53 +0100 From: Adam McGreggor To: "Marc G. Fournier" Message-ID: <20100721203253.GK28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Sender: Adam McGreggor Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OSS Control Panel to manage FreeBSD jails ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Services Providers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:49:28 -0000 On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 03:49:07PM -0300, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > what it doesn't do is dns or email management ... dns is modified 'by > request', and email is a totally seperate, unintegrated inferface ... If you've got moderately technically competent users, you may find Jonathan McDowell's AutoDNS http://www.earth.li/projectpurple/progs/autodns.html useful (at least, if users run their own DNS servers). (Or indeed, use some of that/the idea to allow zonefile updates by gpg-signed email) Last time I looked at this (letting end-users faff with DNS zones) -- a few years back -- there were a couple of not-so-sucky options available of freshmeat. As for managing email, hum. That's where it gets complicated. Presumably your MTA handles database-lookup/backends (or indeed, flatfiles for each domain), so why not build a quick and dirty $language-of-choice script to pull known domains (to the account), and let them run wild, obviously, with syntax checking. http://www.ex-parrot.com/~chris/vmail-sql/ may be worth a look, if you've not seen it already, and don't want to completely write something yourself. (although, note http://www.ex-parrot.com/~chris/wwwitter/20070305-chris_lightfoot_1978-2007.html ) > I don't want to have to log > into multiple interfaces to deal with support issues, for instance .. > but, at the same time, don't want to force a client to have two different > interfaces to handle things ... > > Does anyone have any suggestions on software that could replace this? Presumably you're not talking about using RT (or similar) here, as the software used to store/process the support requests, but something to manage them. I think the short answer is, none of us will ever be completely content with stuff other people have written, so, erm, it's best to roll our own, for our own needs, and hope it works/doesn't break. -- ''meetings, n.: A place where minutes are kept and hours are lost.'' From owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jul 21 21:04:30 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C671F106566B for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:04:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) Received: from hub.org (hub.org [200.46.204.220]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 251578FC18 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:04:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: from maia.hub.org (maia-3.hub.org [200.46.204.243]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1B1634559A2; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:04:27 -0300 (ADT) Received: from hub.org ([200.46.204.220]) by maia.hub.org (mx1.hub.org [200.46.204.243]) (amavisd-maia, port 10024) with ESMTP id 04823-03; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:04:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: by hub.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id A865D345593B; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:04:27 -0300 (ADT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7FF734558D5; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:04:27 -0300 (ADT) Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:04:27 -0300 (ADT) From: "Marc G. Fournier" To: Adam McGreggor In-Reply-To: <20100721203253.GK28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> Message-ID: References: <20100721203253.GK28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (BSF 1167 2008-08-23) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OSS Control Panel to manage FreeBSD jails ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Services Providers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:04:31 -0000 Actually, the big issue(s) that I'm facing are non-tech users that are fearful of non-cpanel, and the lack of any truely integrated OSS solution ... >From what I've read so far, what I have almost appears to be the closest integrated solution that focuses on FreeBSD jails ... I'm going to open up our code base in CVS so that others can look at it ... worst case, ppl say it sucks and is useless ... best case, maybe it gives a foundation to expand upon ... *shrug* Will post an announce later this week, including screen shots .... On Wed, 21 Jul 2010, Adam McGreggor wrote: > On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 03:49:07PM -0300, Marc G. Fournier wrote: >> what it doesn't do is dns or email management ... dns is modified 'by >> request', and email is a totally seperate, unintegrated inferface ... > > If you've got moderately technically competent users, you may find > Jonathan McDowell's AutoDNS > > http://www.earth.li/projectpurple/progs/autodns.html > > useful (at least, if users run their own DNS servers). > > (Or indeed, use some of that/the idea to allow zonefile updates by > gpg-signed email) > > Last time I looked at this (letting end-users faff with DNS zones) -- > a few years back -- there were a couple of not-so-sucky options > available of freshmeat. > > As for managing email, hum. That's where it gets complicated. Presumably > your MTA handles database-lookup/backends (or indeed, flatfiles for > each domain), so why not build a quick and dirty $language-of-choice > script to pull known domains (to the account), and let them run wild, > obviously, with syntax checking. > > http://www.ex-parrot.com/~chris/vmail-sql/ > > may be worth a look, if you've not seen it already, and don't want to > completely write something yourself. > > (although, note > http://www.ex-parrot.com/~chris/wwwitter/20070305-chris_lightfoot_1978-2007.html ) > >> I don't want to have to log >> into multiple interfaces to deal with support issues, for instance .. >> but, at the same time, don't want to force a client to have two different >> interfaces to handle things ... >> >> Does anyone have any suggestions on software that could replace this? > > Presumably you're not talking about using RT (or similar) here, as the > software used to store/process the support requests, but something to > manage them. > > I think the short answer is, none of us will ever be completely > content with stuff other people have written, so, erm, it's best to > roll our own, for our own needs, and hope it works/doesn't break. > > -- > ''meetings, n.: > A place where minutes are kept and hours are lost.'' > ---- Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Hosting Solutions S.A. scrappy@hub.org http://www.hub.org Yahoo:yscrappy Skype: hub.org ICQ:7615664 MSN:scrappy@hub.org From owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jul 21 21:15:54 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46522106566B for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:15:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cswiger@mac.com) Received: from asmtpout026.mac.com (asmtpout026.mac.com [17.148.16.101]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C8F38FC14 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:15:53 +0000 (UTC) MIME-version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Received: from cswiger1.apple.com ([17.209.4.71]) by asmtp026.mac.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 6.3-8.01 (built Dec 16 2008; 32bit)) with ESMTPSA id <0L5X00551F27TSA0@asmtp026.mac.com> for freebsd-isp@freebsd.org; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 14:15:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 spamscore=0 ipscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx engine=6.0.2-1004200000 definitions=main-1007210093 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10432:5.0.10011,1.0.148,0.0.0000 definitions=2010-07-21_08:2010-07-21, 2010-07-21, 1970-01-01 signatures=0 From: Chuck Swiger In-reply-to: Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 14:15:43 -0700 Message-id: References: <20100721203253.GK28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> To: "Marc G. Fournier" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1081) Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org, Adam McGreggor Subject: Re: OSS Control Panel to manage FreeBSD jails ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Services Providers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:15:54 -0000 On Jul 21, 2010, at 2:04 PM, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > Actually, the big issue(s) that I'm facing are non-tech users that are fearful of non-cpanel, and the lack of any truely integrated OSS solution ... Was there something wrong with webmin? http://www.webmin.com/support.html Regards, -- -Chuck From owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jul 21 21:25:18 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C51E1065674 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:25:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from adam@hendricks.amyl.org.uk) Received: from hendricks.amyl.org.uk (hendricks.amyl.org.uk [93.93.129.13]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61CF28FC14 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:25:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: from adam by hendricks.amyl.org.uk with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Obgmx-0003El-3b; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 22:25:15 +0100 Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 22:25:15 +0100 From: Adam McGreggor To: Chuck Swiger Message-ID: <20100721212515.GL28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> References: <20100721203253.GK28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Sender: Adam McGreggor Cc: "Marc G. Fournier" , freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OSS Control Panel to manage FreeBSD jails ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Services Providers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:25:18 -0000 On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 02:15:43PM -0700, Chuck Swiger wrote: > Was there something wrong with webmin? I'd rephrase that to is there anything *right* about webmin. *hate*, *hate*, *hate*. no histories/versioning, straight edits, often-run-on-default-port, lets-one-change-things-without-understanding-why-it's-a-bad-thing, and so on. -- "If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world" -- J. R. R. Tolkien From owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Jul 21 21:34:22 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6CE79106564A for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:34:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cswiger@mac.com) Received: from asmtpout024.mac.com (asmtpout024.mac.com [17.148.16.99]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 516BA8FC12 for ; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:34:22 +0000 (UTC) MIME-version: 1.0 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Received: from cswiger1.apple.com ([17.209.4.71]) by asmtp024.mac.com (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 6.3-8.01 (built Dec 16 2008; 32bit)) with ESMTPSA id <0L5X00BVYFX9JF90@asmtp024.mac.com> for freebsd-isp@freebsd.org; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 14:34:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 spamscore=0 ipscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx engine=6.0.2-1004200000 definitions=main-1007210095 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10432:5.0.10011,1.0.148,0.0.0000 definitions=2010-07-21_08:2010-07-21, 2010-07-21, 1970-01-01 signatures=0 From: Chuck Swiger In-reply-to: <20100721212515.GL28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 14:34:21 -0700 Message-id: References: <20100721203253.GK28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> <20100721212515.GL28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> To: Adam McGreggor X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1081) Cc: "Marc G. Fournier" , freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OSS Control Panel to manage FreeBSD jails ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Services Providers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:34:22 -0000 On Jul 21, 2010, at 2:25 PM, Adam McGreggor wrote: > On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 02:15:43PM -0700, Chuck Swiger wrote: >> Was there something wrong with webmin? > > I'd rephrase that to is there anything *right* about webmin. > > *hate*, *hate*, *hate*. > > no histories/versioning, straight edits, often-run-on-default-port, > lets-one-change-things-without-understanding-why-it's-a-bad-thing, and > so on. While I have some gripes of my own about Webmin, it was also a significant or even the primary factor in my being able to place FreeBSD fileservers running Samba, LDAP, dhcpd, etc as replacement boxes for Windows PDC/ADC boxes at various client sites over the years, since the locals could do web-based administration of a system without needing to be a Unix sysadmin. Regards, -- -Chuck From owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jul 22 02:00:25 2010 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D03CE1065687 for ; Thu, 22 Jul 2010 02:00:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) Received: from hub.org (hub.org [200.46.204.220]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 992AB8FC2B for ; Thu, 22 Jul 2010 02:00:25 +0000 (UTC) Received: from maia.hub.org (maia-3.hub.org [200.46.204.243]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4D0034559B2; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 23:00:23 -0300 (ADT) Received: from hub.org ([200.46.204.220]) by maia.hub.org (mx1.hub.org [200.46.204.243]) (amavisd-maia, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02214-03; Thu, 22 Jul 2010 02:00:23 +0000 (UTC) Received: by hub.org (Postfix, from userid 1002) id B752434559A5; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 23:00:23 -0300 (ADT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6E7434559A2; Wed, 21 Jul 2010 23:00:23 -0300 (ADT) Date: Wed, 21 Jul 2010 23:00:23 -0300 (ADT) From: "Marc G. Fournier" To: Adam McGreggor In-Reply-To: <20100721212515.GL28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> Message-ID: References: <20100721203253.GK28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> <20100721212515.GL28385@hendricks.amyl.org.uk> User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (BSF 1167 2008-08-23) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OSS Control Panel to manage FreeBSD jails ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Internet Services Providers List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Jul 2010 02:00:25 -0000 On Wed, 21 Jul 2010, Adam McGreggor wrote: > On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 02:15:43PM -0700, Chuck Swiger wrote: >> Was there something wrong with webmin? > > I'd rephrase that to is there anything *right* about webmin. > > *hate*, *hate*, *hate*. > > no histories/versioning, straight edits, often-run-on-default-port, > lets-one-change-things-without-understanding-why-it's-a-bad-thing, and > so on. 'k, I wouldn't go to the extent of 'hate', but, at least when I looked at it way back when, there is no concept of a 'central console' ... or has that changed? Right now, I have one console that everyone logs into to do things (and one to maintain / upgrade / debug), while with webmin, I would have hundreds of them ... and I'd still need seperate solutions for, say, support tickets ... If that is a solution for you, then something like DTC will far blow away webmin ... its a nice clean interface, includes billing, etc, etc ... ... but again, you are talking about hundreds of installs that need to be maintained / upgraded / debugged ... With my current system, although it doesn't have all the features that I'd like, if I fix a bug that one client reports with the system, I fix *all* clients ... Here is some screenshots of what I mean: http://www.hub.org/~scrappy/ams/ ---- Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Hosting Solutions S.A. scrappy@hub.org http://www.hub.org Yahoo:yscrappy Skype: hub.org ICQ:7615664 MSN:scrappy@hub.org