From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Nov 18 19:08:26 2003 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0251116A4CE; Tue, 18 Nov 2003 19:08:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [216.240.41.2]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B8F443F93; Tue, 18 Nov 2003 19:08:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: from apollo.backplane.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) hAJ38OiF096364; Tue, 18 Nov 2003 19:08:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.12.9p2/8.12.9/Submit) id hAJ38OPd096363; Tue, 18 Nov 2003 19:08:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 19:08:24 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <200311190308.hAJ38OPd096363@apollo.backplane.com> To: Garance A Drosihn References: <200311182307.hAIN7Wpm000717@dyson.jdyson.com> <20031118182148.P35215@pooker.samsco.home> cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Unfortunate dynamic linking for everything X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 03:08:26 -0000 :Many freebsd users (me for one) are still living on a modem, :where even one bump of 1.5 meg is a significant issue... : :Remember that the issue we're talking about is security :updates, not full system upgrades. "Everyone" would want :the security updates, even if they're on a slow link. : :-- :Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@gilead.netel.rpi.edu I really have to disagree with this comment. By your reasoning saving a few bytes could be argued as being 'significant'. I've done net installs over slow modems before.. hell, I ran cvsup over a slow modem for over a year! My problem was never / or /bin. Not once. Not ever. I really don't care about a measily few megabytes relative to the size of the whole dist, and I doubt modem users of today care much either when you put it in that perspective. Sure, if you could save 50% of the bandwidth over the whole dist it would be significant. But 12 MBytes? No. The reason your argument make little sense is that there are plenty of OTHER ways you can make modem user's lives easier that have not been implemented. We aren't talking about a few measily megabytes here, we are talking about not making modem users have to wait sitting in front of their terminal staring at a slow download for hours before they even know whether their system will boot the dist! A two-stage install... basic kernel and /, reboot, then install the rest, would have a major impact on modem users. A thousand times greater impact then the few measily megabytes. Modem users don't mind waiting as long as they don't have to sit in front of the terminal while doing so. Once a basic dist is up and running on a modem user's machine believe me, they will happily go off and do something else while waiting for the rest of the bits to download and install because they know if something blows up they won't have to start all over again. -Matt