From owner-freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Jan 12 17:25:27 2015 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [8.8.178.115]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 996E0A3 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2015 17:25:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: from udns.ultimatedns.net (ultimatedns.net [209.180.214.225]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 59098BDD for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2015 17:25:27 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ultimatedns.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by udns.ultimatedns.net (8.14.9/8.14.9) with ESMTP id t0CHOLdE049793; Mon, 12 Jan 2015 09:24:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bsd-lists@bsdforge.com) To: Royce Williams In-Reply-To: References: <20150111235449.A14AEF52@hub.freebsd.org> <20150112040129.GA16097@lonesome.com> <20150112122652.GA9472@lonesome.com> <54B3BE2C.6030207@sorbs.net> <20150112123241.GB9472@lonesome.com> <54B3C28C.10605@sorbs.net> <20150112130804.GD44537@home.opsec.eu> , From: "Chris H" Subject: Re: BIND REPLACE_BASE option Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2015 09:24:25 -0800 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=fixed MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-id: <9132c8812ccd3906dd487830a912d00c@ultimatedns.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Cc: Deb Goodkin , ports X-BeenThere: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18-1 Precedence: list List-Id: Porting software to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2015 17:25:27 -0000 On Mon, 12 Jan 2015 07:55:45 -0900 Royce Williams wrote > On Mon, Jan 12, 2015 at 7:38 AM, Chris H wrote: > > > As to the "sysadmin gap" a look to > > the ports tree seems to indicate quite a volume of "sysadmin" > > related ports. Are some missing? > > To the contrary -- there are too many. > > A good project would be to survey which ones people actually use, and > why -- and then bring their best features into base. I agree something like thishas value. But obtaining access to the usage matrix is the key. > > This would be difficult to do as a independent skunkworks project, and > would be better suited as a high-level, Foundation-sponsored one. see above. > > (For example, in the Debian ecosystem, for most people, there is no > reason to use something other than apt-get, because it does what it > should and does it well. Every time I upgrade a port, I have to study > /usr/ports/UPDATING, read multiple mailing lists, and hold my breath. > I cannot remember the last time I worried about running apt-get. > Arguments about flexibility and diversity ecosystem don't hold up well > when the basics fail on a regular basis.) Here is where we will clash; I've been riding *BSD for over 20yrs. It's *biggest* asset has been in it's flexibility -- it wasn't another Linux "dist", that required me to essentially become a "clone" of every other Linux install. The Ports system, and /src allowed one to tailor my build/install to meet *my* needs. I wasn't required, in fact I was *encouraged*, to have a unique system. Frankly the new pkg(8) *requirement* was a complete 180 on this philosophy. It's implementation was also flawed in many respects (which speaks to your point). I have no objection to pkg(8), per se; But it *should* have been optional, it *should* have been better (longer) tested, *before* pushed into the ecosystem, and should *not* have been implemented with a backend with single-point-of-failue (sqlite3(1). Honestly; why did pkg(8) have to be *required*? Is FreeBSD simply hoping to become a new "distro"? But, given it's there, and how it's there. You have/bring up some valid, points; it *is* a bit of a game of roulette. I *too* get a knot in my stomach even at the *thought* of an upgrade. Sure there are plenty of choices in an upgrade path/implementation. But, as it sits now, I'm not sure I can say it's gotten any easier, or "trouble free", as a result of pkg(8). --Chris > > Royce > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-ports@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-ports > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-ports-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" --Chris ---