From owner-freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Apr 24 03:44:06 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF2C416A4D0 for ; Sat, 24 Apr 2004 03:44:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from abigail.blackend.org (blackend.org [212.11.35.229]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0807343D54 for ; Sat, 24 Apr 2004 03:44:05 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from marc@blackend.org) Received: from abigail.blackend.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by abigail.blackend.org (8.12.9/8.12.3) with ESMTP id i3OAi2ui077141; Sat, 24 Apr 2004 12:44:02 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from marc@abigail.blackend.org) Received: (from marc@localhost) by abigail.blackend.org (8.12.9/8.12.3/Submit) id i3OAi1b3077140; Sat, 24 Apr 2004 12:44:01 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from marc) Date: Sat, 24 Apr 2004 12:44:00 +0200 From: Marc Fonvieille To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20040424104400.GA76752@abigail.blackend.org> References: <20040423193700.GA5329@isite.net> <20040423203646.GA35640@abigail.blackend.org> <20040424031048.GA9858@isite.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20040424031048.GA9858@isite.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Useless-Header: blackend.org X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.8-STABLE cc: Joe Rhett Subject: Re: Items missing from the handbook and/or FAQs. X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 24 Apr 2004 10:44:06 -0000 On Fri, Apr 23, 2004 at 08:10:48PM -0700, Joe Rhett wrote: > On Fri, Apr 23, 2004 at 10:36:46PM +0200, Marc Fonvieille wrote: > > > get rid of the ppp0 and sl0 interfaces. The answer was to copy related > > > parameters from /etc/defaults/rc.conf to /etc/rc.conf and change them. > > > > > > (The handbook actually does say "modify rc.conf" but it doesn't say what > > > items should be modified!) > > > > > > > Wrong, read > > http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/kernelconfig-config.html > > about sl and ppp > > Maybe it's just me, but would you look for bathroom cleaning information > in a manual about your oven? Neither would I. If you need to edit the > kernel to disable PPP, then this should be noted in the PPP configuration > documentation. > Hmm be careful with the term you use: "to disable PPP" having an interface available does not mean the pppd deamon (aka kernel PPP) is running. Having the pseudo-device ppp support in your kernel does not change anything in a day-to-day use. Well it's true no doc, beside the kernel config ones, mentions the pseudo-device support, I'll fix it. But I just gave a shot at: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/slip.html the "sl" page and the information is there for the sl pseudo-device, it seems you did not read that page. > > > Also a note to create /etc/start_if.{ifname} to put the wireless options in > > > would also have saved me reading through the rc scripts. I asusme that's a > > > general case for all interfaces, but it could bear repeating in the wireless > > > documentation. (when there is some...) > > > > > > > http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/network-wireless.html > > http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/network-bluetooth.html > > I'm not certain what you are trying to say here, since both of these > links fail to mention what I stated above. They give you the basic > commands, but leave you with the impression that you'll have to type > these every time you want to configure the interface. Even just a few > links to other relevant documentation would greatly improve these > sections. > Please, please and please: when you quote people "do not remove things". You just removed a revelant part: it was a part of your question in your original mail. And of course without this part my answer seems weird. > > > 3. Choosing filesystem types > > > > > > During setup you can create filesystems other than FreeBSD, but you are > > > supposed to magickally know their filesystem type numbers. The setup > > > documenation and the fdisk tools only tell you the filesystem numbers for > > > freebsd, linux and dos. An option to get a list would be nice. > > > Documentation of the filesystem types would be nice too. (I had to use > > > fdisk on a linux system to get the filesystem numbers I needed) > > > > http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/install-pre.html > > especially 2.2.3.1 Disk Layouts for the i386 > > Naturally, I can browse the freebsd website while I'm partitioning the > disk... makes sense to me. > Well I think, and I'm sure I'm not alone in this case, an installation documentation must be read/printed before installation. Another thing, sysinstall comes with an help, and you can read it from sysinstall. For example I let you read /stand/help/partition.hlp > Now how about the real question I raised, which is integrated > documentation? An option to see a list of disk types...? > By default you are given the FreeBSD type, well FreeBSD installation system aims the installation of FreeBSD, I mean people hardly need to create DOS, or other filesystem slices during FreeBSD installation. > > > Suggestion: put a gdm configuration script there right next to the xdm > > > configuration. The people who love twm know what to do to make it happy. > > > Forcing people who aren't in love with twm and startx to hack at and make > > > their own gdm startup scripts doesn't make much sense. > > > > > > (yes, there is an example gdm startup script, but it won't work be default > > > and you have to search for it, edit it, move it to the proper directory, > > > etc....) > > > > Well XDM and KDM are covered in the Handbook, we can't cover everything. > > I'm not talking about documentation, I'm talking about sensible defaults. > It's not a lack of documentation, it's a lack of useful setup scripts. > I can't comment since I don't use GDM, but as I said in my previous message, but *once again* you removed that part, you can contact the FreeBSD GNOME team. > Straight up: I'm building this system to set up a test environment for a > client. When I got done with the installation and there was no usable > windows environment and no usable mail client, and no usable network > interface ... I was pretty much ready to tell the client to find a modern > OS. > Well :(( sorry to say that but it sounds like a troll... > I mean, hello, Unix systems came better working out the box in the > mid-80s. Why are we going backwards? > When I install an application, the application is usable, I'm maybe very lucky... :) > > > 1. How to put DHCP on the wireless card? > > > > > > I still haven't figured this out. I run dhclient on the interface by hand > > > after every reboot and it works fine, but I'm assuming there is some > > > standard method of telling the system that wi0 should be a dhcp-managed, right? > > > > http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/network-dhcp.html > > Alright, on this one when I re-read it I found what I was looking for. > It could be more clear, but it is there. > > > > 2. What is interface faith0 ? > > > > > > It took a ridiculous amount of searching to determine that faith0 was an > > > ipv4 -> ipv6 interface. And I can find nothing about how to disable it. > > > (and if you say compile a new kernel and make world, excuse me while I puke) > > > > > > > man faith > > man faith returns information on what it is, with nothing at all about > how to enable or disable it. > Well, let's stop this talk... Anyway I'm waiting for your doc PRs, you could even add a Cc to me. Marc