From owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Jan 29 12:46:30 2009 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F41C01065674 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 2009 12:46:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from alex-goncharov@comcast.net) Received: from QMTA07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.64]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DF208FC19 for ; Thu, 29 Jan 2009 12:46:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from alex-goncharov@comcast.net) Received: from OMTA13.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.52]) by QMTA07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id 9PVa1b00B17dt5G57QmWuy; Thu, 29 Jan 2009 12:46:30 +0000 Received: from daland.home ([24.34.211.11]) by OMTA13.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id 9QmV1b0040FJTGg3ZQmVaC; Thu, 29 Jan 2009 12:46:30 +0000 Received: from algo by daland.home with local (Exim 4.69 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1LSWHr-0009TS-P7; Thu, 29 Jan 2009 07:46:27 -0500 From: Alex Goncharov To: "Bruce M. Simpson" In-reply-to: <49819BD5.5040709@FreeBSD.org> (bms@FreeBSD.org) References: <6B7ABE80-35AB-4C44-B5A4-200E10DCC3AC@airwired.net> <49819BD5.5040709@FreeBSD.org> Message-Id: Sender: Alex Goncharov Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 07:46:27 -0500 Cc: danallen46@airwired.net, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, alex-goncharov@comcast.net Subject: Re: Unhappy Xorg upgrade X-BeenThere: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Alex Goncharov List-Id: Production branch of FreeBSD source code List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2009 12:46:30 -0000 ,--- You/Bruce (Thu, 29 Jan 2009 12:06:45 +0000) ----* | One theory is that somehow the mouse driver ioctls which are passed | to ums, are somehow hosing USB, although why that would be, I don't | understand. ums currently doesn't have driver instrumentation in that path. | | I pulled a fairly detailed IRC log of my collaborative debugging | session with Robert, please ping me if you need details of this. `----------------------------------------------------* Thank you for the detailed write up! No help to me, though -- on my Latitude laptop, there was no problem with any mouse: USB or the built-in "pointing device". It was the keyboard -- and, trust me, I did try many variations of the machine configuration, and I did do a lot of reading on various relevant topics (writing, too, as you have seen :-() As I mentioned elsewhere, my way of resolving the problem after a one-and-a-half day's of struggle was to revert to the old X (on that laptop). On the topic of how this upgrade was introduced, I can't help but refer to my recent experience helping to fix TWM: ,--- Eeri Kask (Mon, 29 Sep 2008 12:21:17 +0200) ----* | > I have used the new version of TWM for five days, using it less | > intensively than usual. No problems in seen during my (light) use. | | Hello Alex, no problem at all! Improved solutions have priority over | promised deadlines. | | Thank you for your time helping to improve TWM, :-) | `----------------------------------------------------* Eeri Kask and I worked together all past September on fixing TWM crashes: I was willingly trying his multiple versions of the code, but I knew what I was risking, could choose convenient times for building and trying every new version (we tried about 30 of them) -- and I could always go back to the previous version (or the original TWM from ports). I would be happy to try a new X on my machines, if it were labeled as experimental, with an easy way to revert to the old X (while being in the testing stage). As it is, this upgrade brought a lot of problems to unsuspecting people, at the time they don't quite choose, with potential dangers not disclosed. In honesty, this upgrade should have been presented this way, way before the code was placed in the ports source tree: * We'll have a new X in ports soon -- there are multiple reports of problems with it on Linux. * We want to try it on FreeBSD -- but nobody is forcing you to do the upgrade. * If you, of your own free will, choose to upgrade, you may have hours and days of problems -- but heck, it was your choice. * If your problems cannot be fixed, you'll have to figure out something yourself. * If you choose not to upgrade, you are frozen with the pre-existing ports collection: there may be no automated ways to upgrade your packages, with the old X in place. Of course, you can somehow get pieces on new ports, unrelated to X. * The choice is totally yours. -- Alex -- alex-goncharov@comcast.net --