From owner-freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Feb 14 14:40:24 2012 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B8E0A106566C; Tue, 14 Feb 2012 14:40:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 000.fbsd@quip.cz) Received: from elsa.codelab.cz (elsa.codelab.cz [94.124.105.4]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42B538FC1B; Tue, 14 Feb 2012 14:40:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: from elsa.codelab.cz (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by elsa.codelab.cz (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8B4D2842D; Tue, 14 Feb 2012 15:40:21 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.1.2] (ip-86-49-61-235.net.upcbroadband.cz [86.49.61.235]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by elsa.codelab.cz (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 163F928423; Tue, 14 Feb 2012 15:40:19 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <4F3A7252.9090802@quip.cz> Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2012 15:40:18 +0100 From: Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz> User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.9.1.19) Gecko/20110420 Lightning/1.0b1 SeaMonkey/2.0.14 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Eitan Adler References: <1328887627.38277.68.camel@buffy.york.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Chris Rees , freebsd-current Current , Astrodog , "Wojciech A. Koszek" , Colin Percival Subject: Re: Enhancing the user experience with tcsh X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 14 Feb 2012 14:40:24 -0000 Eitan Adler wrote: > On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 8:19 AM, Astrodog wrote: >> Personally, I pay very little attention to the prompt. That being said... >> Plenty of people prefer widely different configurations for the prompt. >> I think everyone agrees that the default prompt isn't particularly >> informative, however, achieving consensus here is going to be almost >> impossible. I suggest that it be handled as a seperate discussion, >> perhaps? > > That would result in even more of a bikeshed than this thread. I'm > pretty sure I'm going to go with one of the prompts posted to this > thread after a bit of experimentation. > Remember that the prompts are for inexperienced users and those of you > with awesome prompts are not the target audience for the change. Not just prompts, but everything in default .cshrc / .tcshrc should be targeted to inexperienced new users and we should look at it from this point of view. Not from "our personal preferences". The current and future changes in .cshrc is not targeted to us - readers of freebsd-current@, but to new users comming from the world of windows and penguins. I still remember those days when I came from Win95 to FreeBSD 4.x and didn't know anything about shell's possibilities. Somebody recommends me bash and I used it as my default shell for a couple of years - until I realized, that same or better prompt, completion and history search can be achieved with already installed csh / tcsh. Just by few modifications in .cshrc. I don't think readers of this mailing list are using default unmodified .cshrc. So the question is not "what is good to me" (or to you), but "what is good for new users?". What can we serve them to make their life easier and show them the power and possibilities of tcsh. We all can still use our good old .cshrc modifications, our own prompt, colors, etc. as we already do. That's why I am proposing as much "Good features (TM)" enabled by default as possible. Because we others can easily disabled them if we don't like them. But new users can't enabled them, because they don't know about them. Miroslav Lachman