From owner-freebsd-stable Sun Aug 3 00:58:08 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA11914 for stable-outgoing; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 00:58:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA11907; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 00:57:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id RAA13291; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:27:04 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199708030757.RAA13291@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: ports-current/packages-current discontinued In-Reply-To: <199708021720.DAA00921@labs.usn.blaze.net.au> from David Nugent at "Aug 3, 97 03:20:12 am" To: davidn@labs.usn.blaze.net.au (David Nugent) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:27:03 +0930 (CST) Cc: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, asami@cs.berkeley.edu, andreas@klemm.gtn.com, ports@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk David Nugent stands accused of saying: > > > > The correct answer to this is, of course, that any port that requires > > a specific Tcl version or range of versions should require one of > > those versions out of the ports collection. A port failing to operate > > regardless of the Tcl version in the base distribution is > > _fundamentally_broken_, and should be fixed. > > This is a gross over-simplification. > > The ports collection cannot ignore the rest of the system on which it is > installed. That's the whole point of this discussion. The whole point I am making is that if the ports collection is to avoid being an unbearable millstone around the neck of any further development, it _must_ survive as a separate entity. How much more plainly must this be put before people get it? > Upgrading the base system's version to an untested beta with some very > significant internal changes, even in -current, is the most stupid move > I have seen in the FreeBSD project since my involvement. ARGH! Why do people _insist_ on treating a moving development snapshot as though it were a production system? If you want or expect something to remain static, _use_a_post-RELEASE_verion. You said it yourself; this is -current, you _must_ expect things to change. Tcl is obviously remaining in the tree because it is or will be fundamental to upcoming system components; this much is obvious. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-stable Sun Aug 3 01:05:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA12390 for stable-outgoing; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 01:05:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA12385; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 01:05:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id RAA13330; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:35:07 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199708030805.RAA13330@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: ports-current/packages-current discontinued In-Reply-To: from Chuck Robey at "Aug 2, 97 01:54:35 pm" To: chuckr@glue.umd.edu (Chuck Robey) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:35:06 +0930 (CST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, ports@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Chuck Robey stands accused of saying: > > Another thing to consider is the basic cleanliness of FreeBSD to tcl > applications that don't arrive via the ports mechanism. Our present > environment is such that even a well written tcl app hasn't the least > chance of configuring itself correctly. In our respect for tcl, we've > constructed a tcl-hostile system. So far, the only problems I've encountered are with extensions which use the usual bogus autoconfigure shared-library searching mechanism and thus can't find the Tcl shared libraries. I'm curious as to what other problems you've seen... -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-stable Sun Aug 3 03:59:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA19409 for stable-outgoing; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 03:59:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news1.gtn.com (news1.gtn.com [194.77.0.15]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA19377; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 03:58:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news1.gtn.com (8.7.2/8.7.2) with UUCP id MAA11940; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 12:45:26 +0200 (MET DST) Received: (from andreas@localhost) by klemm.gtn.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) id MAA19821; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 12:23:21 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <19970803122321.15396@klemm.gtn.com> Date: Sun, 3 Aug 1997 12:23:21 +0200 From: Andreas Klemm To: Chuck Robey Cc: ports@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Make this a relese coordinator decision (was Re: ports-current/packages-current discontinued) References: <15692.870549801@time.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Mutt 0.79 In-Reply-To: ; from Chuck Robey on Sat, Aug 02, 1997 at 11:36:41PM -0400 X-Disclaimer: A free society is one where it is safe to be unpopular X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 3.0-CURRENT SMP Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, Aug 02, 1997 at 11:36:41PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: > > This argument is not really centered on being bloatist, at least not > totally. I would fight taking perl out of the kernel (I want perl5.004 > brought in) but I'll be pleased to see tcl make an exit. Might a > compromise be made, let tcl go away, in exchange for updating perl? The whole thing started with Satoshi´s citicism about the -current "circus". This came up because of great differences between -current and -stable, which makes it nearly impossible, to support a 1028 ports monster. So he wanted only to support -stable in the future. But I think this is a step behind. Ports have to be buildable on -current and -stable, because : a) -current is the next upcoming -stable release b) people like me, who have only one machine, usually run the bleeding edge, c) people who have interest in trying SMP are boud to current Figure out, if ports are only made for stable ... If -current does more and more incompatible changes to -stable ... Who should done the fine work of porting perhaps 1250 ports to -current, which will become 3.0-RELEASE and 3.0-STABLE after that ??? I think the only question is ... what has to be done now, that ports are buildable under -current _AND_ -stable fine without too much problems. So to say .... This is not a decision of dropping a pet toy, it is a decision of a release engineer, who is responsible for the direction of the OS and that a ports collection doesn´t get out of sync with everything other than 2.2-STABLE. Andreas /// -- Andreas Klemm | klemm.gtn.com - powered by Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/benches.html From owner-freebsd-stable Sun Aug 3 04:29:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA20285 for stable-outgoing; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 04:29:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sage.tamis.com (tamis.com [206.24.116.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA20265; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 04:29:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from daveh@localhost) by sage.tamis.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id EAA16394; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 04:28:06 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 1997 04:28:06 -0700 (PDT) From: David Holloway To: ports@FreeBSD.ORG cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Make this a relese coordinator decision (was Re: ports-current/packages-current discontinued) In-Reply-To: <19970803122321.15396@klemm.gtn.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by hub.freebsd.org id EAA20266 Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk maybe I am just being ignorant, but.... just how difficult can this be??? how different do ports-current and ports-stable have to be? (unless 2.x and 3.x are completely non portable between each other, in which case.. that is a mistake) the existence of ports-stable could be considered a walnut-creek-cdrom issue. -------------------------- personally, I think perl sucks, it leads to poor code. but it is deeply accepted that perl4 should be found on all systems, (No we dont have to follow linux junkies and make perl5 default. while doing some porting, I discovered that linux(redhat) has ppmtoxpm and bmptoppm in /usr/bin ?? what is up with that? my point? tcl and perl5 dont belong in the base.) On Sun, 3 Aug 1997, Andreas Klemm wrote: > On Sat, Aug 02, 1997 at 11:36:41PM -0400, Chuck Robey wrote: > > > > This argument is not really centered on being bloatist, at least not > > totally. I would fight taking perl out of the kernel (I want perl5.004 > > brought in) but I'll be pleased to see tcl make an exit. Might a > > compromise be made, let tcl go away, in exchange for updating perl? > > The whole thing started with Satoshi´s citicism about the > -current "circus". > > This came up because of great differences between -current > and -stable, which makes it nearly impossible, to support > a 1028 ports monster. > > So he wanted only to support -stable in the future. But I think > this is a step behind. > Ports have to be buildable on -current and -stable, because : > a) -current is the next upcoming -stable release > b) people like me, who have only one machine, usually > run the bleeding edge, > c) people who have interest in trying SMP are boud to > current > > Figure out, if ports are only made for stable ... If -current > does more and more incompatible changes to -stable ... Who > should done the fine work of porting perhaps 1250 ports > to -current, which will become 3.0-RELEASE and 3.0-STABLE after > that ??? > > I think the only question is ... what has to be done now, > that ports are buildable under -current _AND_ -stable fine > without too much problems. > > So to say .... > > This is not a decision of dropping a pet toy, it is > a decision of a release engineer, who is responsible > for the direction of the OS and that a ports collection > doesn´t get out of sync with everything other than 2.2-STABLE. > > Andreas /// > > -- > Andreas Klemm | klemm.gtn.com - powered by > Symmetric MultiProcessor FreeBSD > http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/SMP.html > http://www.freebsd.org/~fsmp/SMP/benches.html > From owner-freebsd-stable Sun Aug 3 05:06:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id FAA21362 for stable-outgoing; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 05:06:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA21355; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 05:06:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from msmith@localhost) by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id VAA13930; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 21:36:15 +0930 (CST) From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199708031206.VAA13930@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Make this a relese coordinator decision (was Re: ports-current/packages-current discontinued) In-Reply-To: from David Holloway at "Aug 3, 97 04:28:06 am" To: daveh@tamis.com (David Holloway) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 1997 21:36:15 +0930 (CST) Cc: ports@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL28 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk David Holloway stands accused of saying: > > (No we dont have to follow linux junkies and make perl5 default. > while doing some porting, I discovered that linux(redhat) > has ppmtoxpm and bmptoppm in /usr/bin ?? what is up with that? > my point? tcl and perl5 dont belong in the base.) > This is a clear case of confusing perl/tcl-as-system-component with perl/tcl-as-user-convenience. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@gsoft.com.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control. (ph) +61-8-8267-3493 [[ ]] Unix hardware collector. "Where are your PEZ?" The Tick [[ From owner-freebsd-stable Sun Aug 3 17:01:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA27720 for stable-outgoing; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:01:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhost.anasazi.com (mailhost.anasazi.com [138.113.128.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA27609; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:00:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chad.anasazi.com by mailhost.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7b) id AA19587; Sun, 3 Aug 97 17:00:08 -0700 Received: by chad.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7) id AA19952; Sun, 3 Aug 97 17:00:05 -0700 From: chad@anasazi.com (Chad R. Larson) Message-Id: <9708040000.AA19952@chad.anasazi.com> Subject: Re: ports-current/packages-current discontinued To: ade@demon.net Date: Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:00:04 -0700 (MST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, ports@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Ade Lovett" at Aug 2, 97 08:55:03 pm Reply-To: chad@anasazi.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > We then have a situation where both sides of the "bloat" are happy, > those that want a minimalistic approach can install the required > components and leave out the approved integrated packages, others > that prefer a full-featured system, without having to compile/install > anything else, can install both. But that's essentially what we're arguing. If all those Perl and TCL/TK and other packages are removed from the core system, but made available as packages (not just ports), you'd have the condition you describe above. Install a minimalist system, then add the packages you want. -crl -- Chad R. Larson (CRL22) Brother, can you paradigm? 602-870-3330 chad@anasazi.com chad@anasaz.UUCP chad@dcfinc.com Anasazi, Inc. - 7500 North Dreamy Draw Drive, Suite 120, Phoenix, Az 85020 From owner-freebsd-stable Sun Aug 3 17:06:54 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA28326 for stable-outgoing; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:06:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhost.anasazi.com (mailhost.anasazi.com [138.113.128.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA28164; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:05:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chad.anasazi.com by mailhost.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7b) id AA19595; Sun, 3 Aug 97 17:05:10 -0700 Received: by chad.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7) id AA19969; Sun, 3 Aug 97 17:05:04 -0700 From: chad@anasazi.com (Chad R. Larson) Message-Id: <9708040005.AA19969@chad.anasazi.com> Subject: Re: ports-current/packages-current discontinued To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:05:03 -0700 (MST) Cc: davidn@labs.usn.blaze.net.au, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, asami@cs.berkeley.edu, andreas@klemm.gtn.com, ports@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <15386.870546758@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Aug 2, 97 11:32:38 am Reply-To: chad@anasazi.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Once you start with TCL, it will *not* stop there - I can only assure > you of that. Perl will follow immediately behind, as will much other > stuff (yes perl fans, there are many out there who consider your > favorite utility language an evil, bloated monster which should not be > bundled with FreeBSD at all). I understand that there are other candidates for migration from the core system to ports/packages. I think that is a =good= thing. As long as the installation process makes it as easy as it now does (thanks, Jordan) to select a very personal feature set, I'd vote that all the packages/ports that duplicate a core system feature should be removed from the core system. -crl -- Chad R. Larson (CRL22) Brother, can you paradigm? 602-870-3330 chad@anasazi.com chad@anasaz.UUCP chad@dcfinc.com Anasazi, Inc. - 7500 North Dreamy Draw Drive, Suite 120, Phoenix, Az 85020 From owner-freebsd-stable Sun Aug 3 17:08:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA28532 for stable-outgoing; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:08:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhost.anasazi.com (mailhost.anasazi.com [138.113.128.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA28450; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:07:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chad.anasazi.com by mailhost.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7b) id AA19600; Sun, 3 Aug 97 17:06:38 -0700 Received: by chad.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7) id AA19980; Sun, 3 Aug 97 17:06:35 -0700 From: chad@anasazi.com (Chad R. Larson) Message-Id: <9708040006.AA19980@chad.anasazi.com> Subject: Re: ports-current/packages-current discontinued To: phk@dk.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 1997 17:06:35 -0700 (MST) Cc: ade@demon.net, jkh@time.cdrom.com, ports@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <2297.870554943@critter.dk.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Aug 2, 97 10:49:03 pm Reply-To: chad@anasazi.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >Possibly, a somewhat simplistic attitude, but certainly something > >to consider, no? > >-- > >Ade Lovett, Demon Internet Ltd. > > And it has been considered, and as far as I know fell because what > nobody saw any chance of "minimal system" being definable so that > any significant majority would agree to it. Perhaps starting with the POSIX 1003.? documents, or X/Open "Single UNIX" would do. -crl -- Chad R. Larson (CRL22) Brother, can you paradigm? 602-870-3330 chad@anasazi.com chad@anasaz.UUCP chad@dcfinc.com Anasazi, Inc. - 7500 North Dreamy Draw Drive, Suite 120, Phoenix, Az 85020 From owner-freebsd-stable Sun Aug 3 20:57:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA10253 for stable-outgoing; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 20:57:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rocky.mt.sri.com (rocky.mt.sri.com [206.127.76.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA10217; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 20:57:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.mt.sri.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA26238; Sun, 3 Aug 1997 21:57:16 -0600 (MDT) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 1997 21:57:16 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199708040357.VAA26238@rocky.mt.sri.com> From: Nate Williams MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: David Nugent , Michael Smith , asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami), andreas@klemm.gtn.com, ports@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org, stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ports-current/packages-current discontinued In-Reply-To: <15386.870546758@time.cdrom.com> References: <199708021720.DAA00921@labs.usn.blaze.net.au> <15386.870546758@time.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.29 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > What most people here don't understand is that there was very fierce > debate about this behind the scenes for some time before it was done, > and what started as a TCL debate blew up into .. Blew up into 'TCL belongs as much as PERL in the base system, and utilities are being written and will be in the tree in the next couple of months which are being asked for.' revision 1.1 date: 1996/06/26 17:48:13; author: phk; state: Exp; Bmaked tcl 7.5 Hmm, it's August (well over a year later), and there are still *NO* programs that use TCL in the base distribution. The big arguement moved into 'should FreeBSD be more modularized', but the anti-bloatist asceded that as long as programs in the base distribution used PERL/TCL/libdialog/etc..., then they should be part of the base system, otherwise they belong outside. TCL should go, and PERL should go *WHEN* those programs in the base distribution are not considered part of the base distribution or are re-written to not use PERL. TCL has no part in the base distribution, and I've heard 'the programs which will use it will be here 'Real Soon Now' for 14 months now. Nate From owner-freebsd-stable Tue Aug 5 18:06:35 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA16971 for stable-outgoing; Tue, 5 Aug 1997 18:06:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [207.170.114.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA16962 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 1997 18:06:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) id UAA03573; Tue, 5 Aug 1997 20:05:59 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <19970805200558.49912@pmr.com> Date: Tue, 5 Aug 1997 20:05:58 -0500 From: Bob Willcox To: Simon Shapiro Cc: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Failure (minor) in make world as of today Reply-To: Bob Willcox References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81 In-Reply-To: ; from Simon Shapiro on Sat, Aug 02, 1997 at 03:53:49PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, Aug 02, 1997 at 03:53:49PM -0700, Simon Shapiro wrote: > Hi Y'all, > > I am getting this when making world on RELENG_2_2, as of today: > > install -c -o bin -g bin -m 444 > /usr/src/2.2/src/lib/libtcl/../../contrib/tcl/library/[a-z]* > /usr/libdata/tcl > install: /usr/src/2.2/src/lib/libtcl/../../contrib/tcl/library/http1.0: > Inappropriate file type or format > *** Error code 71 (continuing) > > It (obviously) repeats itself in two other places. I am getting the same error(s). -- Bob Willcox Deliberation, n.: The act of examining one's bread bob@luke.pmr.com to determine which side it is buttered on. Austin, TX -- Ambrose Bierce, "The Devil's Dictionary" From owner-freebsd-stable Wed Aug 6 09:10:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA04362 for stable-outgoing; Wed, 6 Aug 1997 09:10:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from david.siemens.de (david.siemens.de [139.23.36.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA04339 for ; Wed, 6 Aug 1997 09:10:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from salomon.mchp.siemens.de (salomon.siemens.de [139.23.33.13]) by david.siemens.de (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA18729 for ; Wed, 6 Aug 1997 18:10:30 +0200 (MDT) Received: from curry.mchp.siemens.de (daemon@curry.mchp.siemens.de [146.180.31.23]) by salomon.mchp.siemens.de (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA05551 for ; Wed, 6 Aug 1997 18:10:29 +0200 (MDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by curry.mchp.siemens.de (8.8.6/8.8.6) id SAA28420 for ; Wed, 6 Aug 1997 18:10:26 +0200 (MET DST) From: Andre Albsmeier Message-Id: <199708061610.SAA01377@curry.mchp.siemens.de> Subject: Bug in libg++ Makefile To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 6 Aug 1997 18:10:10 +0200 (CEST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I tried to compile the following program: #include int main(void) { double_complex a(1.0, 0.0),b; b=a+a; printf("b=%f %f\n",real(b),imag(b)); return 0; } It fails during the link stage with the error: /var/tmp/cc0255091.o: Undefined symbol `___pl__FRCt7complex1ZdT0' referenced from text segment However, when I replaced b=a+a with b=a-a everything worked. At least, I found a missing definition in /usr/src/gnu/lib/libstdc++/Makefile: We find SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC defined but only ADDCF ADDFC. After applying the following path everything worked. Is this correct or is there something different wrong (This is the first time I had something to do with g++ :-))? If it is correct, could someone bring it into the STABLE-tree, please? Thanks, Andre *** Makefile.ORI Wed Aug 6 17:41:05 1997 --- Makefile Wed Aug 6 17:39:01 1997 *************** *** 164,170 **** # ======== fcomplex.o ======= FCOMPLEX= -DF ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT FCOMPLEX+= -D${i} --- 164,170 ---- # ======== fcomplex.o ======= FCOMPLEX= -DF ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT FCOMPLEX+= -D${i} *************** *** 206,212 **** # ======== dcomplex.o ======= DCOMPLEX= -DD ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT DCOMPLEX+= -D${i} --- 206,212 ---- # ======== dcomplex.o ======= DCOMPLEX= -DD ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT DCOMPLEX+= -D${i} *************** *** 248,254 **** # ======== ldcomplex.o ======= LDCOMPLEX= -DLD ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT LDCOMPLEX+= -D${i} --- 248,254 ---- # ======== ldcomplex.o ======= LDCOMPLEX= -DLD ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT LDCOMPLEX+= -D${i} From owner-freebsd-stable Wed Aug 6 14:47:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA22087 for stable-outgoing; Wed, 6 Aug 1997 14:47:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gatekeeper.alcatel.com.au (gatekeeper.alcatel.com.au [203.17.66.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA22076 for ; Wed, 6 Aug 1997 14:47:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mfg1.cim.alcatel.com.au ([139.188.23.1]) by gatekeeper.alcatel.com.au (PMDF V5.1-7 #11861) with ESMTP id <01IM5FLO45I8000AOQ@gatekeeper.alcatel.com.au> for freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 07:46:36 +1000 Received: from cbd.alcatel.com.au by cim.alcatel.com.au (PMDF V5.1-7 #9239) with ESMTP id <01IM5FLLB87K8WXQJ1@cim.alcatel.com.au> for freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 07 Aug 1997 07:46:33 +1000 Received: from gsms01.alcatel.com.au by cbd.alcatel.com.au (PMDF V5.1-7 #9241) with ESMTP id <01IM5FLFVY748WWCUB@cbd.alcatel.com.au> for freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 07 Aug 1997 07:46:25 +1100 Received: (from jeremyp@localhost) by gsms01.alcatel.com.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA19510 for freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG; Thu, 07 Aug 1997 07:46:19 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 07 Aug 1997 07:46:19 +1000 (EST) From: Peter Jeremy Subject: Re: Bug in libg++ Makefile To: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Message-id: <199708062146.HAA19510@gsms01.alcatel.com.au> Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 06 Aug 1997 18:10:10 +0200 (CEST), Andre Albsmeier wrote: >At least, I found a missing definition in /usr/src/gnu/lib/libstdc++/Makefile: >We find SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC defined but only ADDCF ADDFC. And a stray "ADD CC". Comparing the FreeBSD makefile with the GNU Makefile, it looks like someone accidently added an unwanted space during the conversion. I suspect the patch should really be: (Note, this was done by editing Andre's patch) *** Makefile.ORI Wed Aug 6 17:41:05 1997 --- Makefile Wed Aug 6 17:39:01 1997 *************** *** 164,170 **** # ======== fcomplex.o ======= FCOMPLEX= -DF ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT FCOMPLEX+= -D${i} --- 164,170 ---- # ======== fcomplex.o ======= FCOMPLEX= -DF ! .for i in MAIN ADDCC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT FCOMPLEX+= -D${i} *************** *** 206,212 **** # ======== dcomplex.o ======= DCOMPLEX= -DD ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT DCOMPLEX+= -D${i} --- 206,212 ---- # ======== dcomplex.o ======= DCOMPLEX= -DD ! .for i in MAIN ADDCC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT DCOMPLEX+= -D${i} *************** *** 248,254 **** # ======== ldcomplex.o ======= LDCOMPLEX= -DLD ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT LDCOMPLEX+= -D${i} --- 248,254 ---- # ======== ldcomplex.o ======= LDCOMPLEX= -DLD ! .for i in MAIN ADDCC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT LDCOMPLEX+= -D${i} Peter -- Peter Jeremy (VK2PJ) peter.jeremy@alcatel.com.au Alcatel Australia Limited 41 Mandible St Phone: +61 2 9690 5019 ALEXANDRIA NSW 2015 Fax: +61 2 9690 5247 From owner-freebsd-stable Wed Aug 6 22:16:34 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA18007 for stable-outgoing; Wed, 6 Aug 1997 22:16:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from david.siemens.de (david.siemens.de [139.23.36.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA18000 for ; Wed, 6 Aug 1997 22:16:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from salomon.mchp.siemens.de (salomon.siemens.de [139.23.33.13]) by david.siemens.de (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA14810 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 07:16:27 +0200 (MDT) Received: from curry.mchp.siemens.de (daemon@curry.mchp.siemens.de [146.180.31.23]) by salomon.mchp.siemens.de (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA12290 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 07:16:26 +0200 (MDT) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by curry.mchp.siemens.de (8.8.6/8.8.6) id HAA23472 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 07:16:25 +0200 (MET DST) From: Andre Albsmeier Message-Id: <199708070516.HAA15796@curry.mchp.siemens.de> Subject: Re: Bug in libg++ Makefile In-Reply-To: <199708062146.HAA19510@gsms01.alcatel.com.au> from Peter Jeremy at "Aug 7, 97 07:46:19 am" To: peter.jeremy@alcatel.com.au (Peter Jeremy) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 1997 07:16:06 +0200 (CEST) Cc: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > On Wed, 06 Aug 1997 18:10:10 +0200 (CEST), Andre Albsmeier wrote: > >At least, I found a missing definition in /usr/src/gnu/lib/libstdc++/Makefile: > >We find SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC defined but only ADDCF ADDFC. > > And a stray "ADD CC". Comparing the FreeBSD makefile with the GNU > Makefile, it looks like someone accidently added an unwanted space > during the conversion. I suspect the patch should really be: > (Note, this was done by editing Andre's patch) Yes, you are right. When searching through the CVS-data on freebsd.org, I found that this had been fixed for -current the same way you did :-). -Andre > *** Makefile.ORI Wed Aug 6 17:41:05 1997 > --- Makefile Wed Aug 6 17:39:01 1997 > *************** > *** 164,170 **** > > # ======== fcomplex.o ======= > FCOMPLEX= -DF > ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ > DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ > CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT > FCOMPLEX+= -D${i} > --- 164,170 ---- > > # ======== fcomplex.o ======= > FCOMPLEX= -DF > ! .for i in MAIN ADDCC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ > DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ > CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT > FCOMPLEX+= -D${i} > *************** > *** 206,212 **** > > # ======== dcomplex.o ======= > DCOMPLEX= -DD > ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ > DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ > CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT > DCOMPLEX+= -D${i} > --- 206,212 ---- > > # ======== dcomplex.o ======= > DCOMPLEX= -DD > ! .for i in MAIN ADDCC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ > DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ > CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT > DCOMPLEX+= -D${i} > *************** > *** 248,254 **** > > # ======== ldcomplex.o ======= > LDCOMPLEX= -DLD > ! .for i in MAIN ADD CC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ > DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ > CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT > LDCOMPLEX+= -D${i} > --- 248,254 ---- > > # ======== ldcomplex.o ======= > LDCOMPLEX= -DLD > ! .for i in MAIN ADDCC ADDCF ADDFC SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC MULCC MULCF MULFC DIVCC \ > DIVCF DIVFC PLUS MINUS EQCC EQCF EQFC NECC NECF NEFC ABS ARG POLAR \ > CONJ NORM COS COSH EXP LOG POWCC POWCF POWCI POWFC SIN SINH SQRT > LDCOMPLEX+= -D${i} > > Peter > -- > Peter Jeremy (VK2PJ) peter.jeremy@alcatel.com.au > Alcatel Australia Limited > 41 Mandible St Phone: +61 2 9690 5019 > ALEXANDRIA NSW 2015 Fax: +61 2 9690 5247 > From owner-freebsd-stable Thu Aug 7 02:29:47 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA29494 for stable-outgoing; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 02:29:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hawk.gnome.co.uk (gnome.gw.cerbernet.co.uk [193.243.224.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA29487 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 02:29:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hawk.gnome.co.uk (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hawk.gnome.co.uk (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id KAA00638 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 10:29:21 +0100 (BST) Message-Id: <199708070929.KAA00638@hawk.gnome.co.uk> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0gamma 1/27/96 To: stable@freebsd.org Subject: /kernel: file: table is full Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 07 Aug 1997 10:29:21 +0100 From: Chris Stenton Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've just been trying the new Netscape 4 for FreeBSD on my 2.2-stable machine and got the following error in the log file. Aug 7 09:41:53 hawk syslogd: /dev/console: Too many open files in system: Too many open files in system Aug 7 09:41:53 hawk syslogd: /var/run/utmp: Too many open files in system Aug 7 09:41:53 hawk syslogd: /var/run/utmp: Too many open files in system Aug 7 09:41:53 hawk /kernel: file: table is full I have the following options set in the kernel options "CHILD_MAX=512" options "OPEN_MAX=512" Its a pretty nasty error as the hard disk sounds like someone got into the system and started doing an rm -r /. This fear is reinforced when you can't run any more processes to find out what is going on. All you can do is hit the reset button and wait to see whats left of your OS. When you find its still there you go and close the curtains and have a lie down :-) Chris From owner-freebsd-stable Thu Aug 7 06:07:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA06689 for stable-outgoing; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 06:07:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA06682 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 06:07:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.5/8.6.9) id WAA31204; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:57:16 +1000 Date: Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:57:16 +1000 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199708071257.WAA31204@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG, peter.jeremy@alcatel.com.au Subject: Re: Bug in libg++ Makefile Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >On Wed, 06 Aug 1997 18:10:10 +0200 (CEST), Andre Albsmeier wrote: >>At least, I found a missing definition in /usr/src/gnu/lib/libstdc++/Makefile: >>We find SUBCC SUBCF SUBFC defined but only ADDCF ADDFC. > >And a stray "ADD CC". Comparing the FreeBSD makefile with the GNU >Makefile, it looks like someone accidently added an unwanted space >during the conversion. I suspect the patch should really be: >(Note, this was done by editing Andre's patch) Fixed. This was fixed long ago in -current. Sigh. Bruce From owner-freebsd-stable Thu Aug 7 22:07:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA22674 for stable-outgoing; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:07:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhost.anasazi.com (mailhost.anasazi.com [138.113.128.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA22666 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:07:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chad.anasazi.com by mailhost.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7b) id AA00989; Thu, 7 Aug 97 22:06:40 -0700 Received: by chad.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7) id AA27349; Thu, 7 Aug 97 22:06:38 -0700 From: chad@anasazi.com (Chad R. Larson) Message-Id: <9708080506.AA27349@chad.anasazi.com> Subject: Netscape native version To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:06:37 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <21563.863844380@time.cdrom.com> from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at May 16, 97 09:46:20 pm Reply-To: chad@anasazi.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jordan recently sent e-mail announcing that Netscape has a native implementation of Navigator. Actually, it was of Communicator. And, perhaps he should have mentioned it needs to run under 2.2 as it was linked dynamically and has VD (Version Discrepency) on the g++, c and stdc shared libraries. -crl -- Chad R. Larson (CRL22) Brother, can you paradigm? 602-870-3330 chad@anasazi.com chad@anasaz.UUCP chad@dcfinc.com Anasazi, Inc. - 7500 North Dreamy Draw Drive, Suite 120, Phoenix, Az 85020 From owner-freebsd-stable Thu Aug 7 22:17:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA23365 for stable-outgoing; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:17:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from acromail.ml.org (acroal.vip.best.com [206.86.222.181]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA23360 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:16:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (root@localhost) by acromail.ml.org (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA00958 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:17:28 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:17:28 -0700 (PDT) From: 0000-Administrator To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Why is the stable tree not make worlding? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:00:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Cron Daemon To: root@acromail.ml.org Subject: Cron /etc/nightly 2>&1 /var/log/lastbuild.log -------------------------------------------------------------- make world started on Thu Aug 7 22:02:09 PDT 1997 -------------------------------------------------------------- cd /usr/src && /usr/bin/make buildworld -------------------------------------------------------------- Cleaning up the temporary build tree -------------------------------------------------------------- mkdir -p /usr/obj/usr/src/tmp chflags -R noschg /usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/ rm -rf /usr/obj/usr/src/tmp -------------------------------------------------------------- Making make -------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------- Making hierarchy -------------------------------------------------------------- cd /usr/src && PATH=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/sbin:/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/sbin:/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/bin:/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/bin:/etc:/bin:/sbin:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin BISON_SIMPLE=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/share/misc/bison.simple COMPILER_PATH=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/libexec:/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/bin GCC_EXEC_PREFIX=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/lib/ LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/lib LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/lib:/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/lib NOEXTRADEPEND=t /usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/bin//usr/bin/make DESTDIR=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp hierarchy /usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/bin//usr/bin/make: not found *** Error code 2 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. From owner-freebsd-stable Thu Aug 7 22:47:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA24515 for stable-outgoing; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:47:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vinyl.quickweb.com (vinyl.quickweb.com [206.222.77.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA24508 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:47:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mark@localhost) by vinyl.quickweb.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id BAA25399; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 01:43:56 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970808014355.44693@vinyl.quickweb.com> Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 01:43:55 -0400 From: Mark Mayo To: chad@anasazi.com Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version References: <21563.863844380@time.cdrom.com> <9708080506.AA27349@chad.anasazi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <9708080506.AA27349@chad.anasazi.com>; from Chad R. Larson on Thu, Aug 07, 1997 at 10:06:37PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, Aug 07, 1997 at 10:06:37PM -0700, Chad R. Larson wrote: > Jordan recently sent e-mail announcing that Netscape has a native > implementation of Navigator. > > Actually, it was of Communicator. And, perhaps he should have mentioned > it needs to run under 2.2 as it was linked dynamically and has VD > (Version Discrepency) on the g++, c and stdc shared libraries. Anyone else notice that it often just refuses to die?? I'd say about 60% of the time for me, when I close it by selecting "Exit" from the menu, or close the window using the window manager, Netscape disapears from the screen, but a process list shows me it's still there, eating up 20MB or RAM and burning away my CPU. 'kill -9' is your friend.. Also, the java performance just seems HORRIBLE with the FReeBSD version.. Idon't know what they're doing, but for some reason the FreeBSD version runs about 1000% slower than the Linux version of Communicator (and the BSDI 3.0 series). Finally, Communicator locked up on me last night - actuallly it locked up and took out my system with it.. complete freeze. X was still "displaying", but the keyboard and mouse were dead. The machine wouldn't even answer pings... complete freeze. Needless to say, since I've been running FreeBSD (almost 2 years) this is the first time this has ever happened to me. Lock up. Not even a crash. Nothing is worse, and horrible images of win95 were filling my head. Solution: rm -rf /usr/local/netscape mount /cdrom pkg_add /cdrom/packages/All/slynx-2.7.tgz Communicator may have a pretty interface, but it's a behemouth, resource eating, system crashing, poor performing monster. Surely they can do better... -Mark > > -crl > -- > Chad R. Larson (CRL22) Brother, can you paradigm? > 602-870-3330 chad@anasazi.com chad@anasaz.UUCP chad@dcfinc.com > Anasazi, Inc. - 7500 North Dreamy Draw Drive, Suite 120, Phoenix, Az 85020 -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Mayo mark@quickweb.com RingZero Comp. http://vinyl.quickweb.com/mark finger mark@quickweb.com for my PGP key and GCS code ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- University degrees are a bit like adultery: you may not want to get involved with that sort of thing, but you don't want to be thought incapable. -Sir Peter Imbert From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 02:08:55 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA04769 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 02:08:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from foo.primenet.com (ip212.sjc.primenet.com [206.165.96.212]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA04764 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 02:08:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bkogawa@localhost) by foo.primenet.com (8.8.6/8.6.12) id CAA05820; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 02:13:41 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 02:13:41 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708080913.CAA05820@foo.primenet.com> To: mark@quickweb.com Subject: Re: Netscape native version Newsgroups: localhost.freebsd.stable References: <21563.863844380@time.cdrom.com> <9708080506.AA27349@chad.anasazi.com> <19970808014355.44693@vinyl.quickweb.com> From: "Bryan K. Ogawa" Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG, chad@anasazi.com X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 #1 (NOV) Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In localhost.freebsd.stable you write: >Finally, Communicator locked up on me last night - actuallly it locked >up and took out my system with it.. complete freeze. X was still >"displaying", but the keyboard and mouse were dead. The machine wouldn't >even answer pings... complete freeze. Needless to say, since I've been >running FreeBSD (almost 2 years) this is the first time this has ever >happened to me. Lock up. Not even a crash. Nothing is worse, and horrible >images of win95 were filling my head. I'm very interested in information on this bug (which I think I've ironed out of my system). 1. What bpp are you running? 2. Are you running Xaccel or XFree? 3. Which video card are you running? 4. Are you running with Backing Store and/or SaveUnders? 5. How much swap/memory do you have? 6. Do you have a large bookmarks.html ? If anyone else sees this problem (total freeze under X), I'm interested in hearing about it! Thanks. -- bryan k ogawa http://www.primenet.com/~bkogawa/ From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 02:23:52 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA05423 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 02:23:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from terror.hungry.com (fn@terror.hungry.com [169.131.1.215]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA05418 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 02:23:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from fn@localhost) by terror.hungry.com (8.8.6/8.8.4) id CAA08109; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 02:23:46 -0700 (PDT) To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape native version References: <21563.863844380@time.cdrom.com> <19970808014355.44693@vinyl.quickweb.com> From: Faried Nawaz Date: 08 Aug 1997 02:23:46 -0700 In-Reply-To: mark@quickweb.com's message of 7 Aug 1997 23:26:05 -0700 Message-ID: Lines: 30 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk mark@quickweb.com (Mark Mayo) writes: Anyone else notice that it often just refuses to die?? I'd say about 60% of the time for me, when I close it by selecting "Exit" from the menu, or close the window using the window manager, Netscape disapears from the screen, but a process list shows me it's still there, eating up 20MB or RAM and burning away my CPU. 'kill -9' is your friend.. It dies for me -- you just have to wait a few seconds or so. It takes about 15-20 seconds to go away on my machine (486-100, 48mb ram, 2.2-STABLE). Finally, Communicator locked up on me last night - actuallly it locked up and took out my system with it.. complete freeze. X was still "displaying", but the keyboard and mouse were dead. The machine wouldn't even answer pings... complete freeze. Needless to say, since I've been running FreeBSD (almost 2 years) this is the first time this has ever happened to me. Lock up. Not even a crash. Nothing is worse, and horrible images of win95 were filling my head. I've had this happen on rare occasions in the past two years. Also, at least twice, I've gone away for a while, come back, hit some key to turn off the X screensaver (the 'blank' screen xset gives you), and the machine's rebooted. This was usually after a make world or some other long-running, vm-intensive process (hasn't happened recently). I don't think you can explicitly blame Communicator here. From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 03:25:22 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA07376 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 03:25:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (wck-ca7-13.ix.netcom.com [204.31.231.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA07370 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 03:25:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.8.6/8.6.9) id DAA15117; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 03:24:00 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 03:24:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708081024.DAA15117@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: root@acromail.ml.org CC: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org In-reply-to: (message from 0000-Administrator on Thu, 7 Aug 1997 22:17:28 -0700 (PDT)) Subject: Re: Why is the stable tree not make worlding? From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * -------------------------------------------------------------- * Making make * -------------------------------------------------------------- * -------------------------------------------------------------- * Making hierarchy * -------------------------------------------------------------- Well, here is the problem. That part of src/Makefile looks like this: === @echo @echo "--------------------------------------------------------------" @echo " Making make" @echo "--------------------------------------------------------------" mkdir -p ${WORLDTMP}/usr/bin cd ${.CURDIR}/usr.bin/make && \ ${IBMAKE} -I${.CURDIR}/share/mk ${OBJDIR} clean cleandepend depend && \ ${IBMAKE} -I${.CURDIR}/share/mk ${MK_FLAGS} all install clean cleandepend @echo @echo "--------------------------------------------------------------" @echo " Making hierarchy" @echo "--------------------------------------------------------------" === You should at least see the commands in between the @echo's. Are you sure your whole tree is up to date, as there were lots of related changes that went in during a short period of time? Satoshi From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 06:26:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA13774 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 06:26:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pegasus.com (pegasus.com [206.127.225.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA13767 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 06:26:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pegasus.com (8.6.8/PEGASUS-2.2) id DAA28863; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 03:26:05 -1000 Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 03:26:05 -1000 From: richard@pegasus.com (Richard Foulk) Message-Id: <199708081326.DAA28863@pegasus.com> In-Reply-To: Mark Mayo "Re: Netscape native version" (Aug 8, 1:43am) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk } On Thu, Aug 07, 1997 at 10:06:37PM -0700, Chad R. Larson wrote: } > Jordan recently sent e-mail announcing that Netscape has a native } > implementation of Navigator. } > } > Actually, it was of Communicator. And, perhaps he should have mentioned } > it needs to run under 2.2 as it was linked dynamically and has VD } > (Version Discrepency) on the g++, c and stdc shared libraries. } } Anyone else notice that it often just refuses to die?? I'd say about 60% } of the time for me, when I close it by selecting "Exit" from the menu, } or close the window using the window manager, Netscape disapears from } the screen, but a process list shows me it's still there, eating up } 20MB or RAM and burning away my CPU. 'kill -9' is your friend.. Dies just fine for me. } Also, the java performance just seems HORRIBLE with the FReeBSD version.. } Idon't know what they're doing, but for some reason the FreeBSD version } runs about 1000% slower than the Linux version of Communicator (and the } BSDI 3.0 series). My Java performance seems okay. Haven't tried the other versions yet to compare. } Finally, Communicator locked up on me last night - actuallly it locked } up and took out my system with it.. complete freeze. X was still } "displaying", but the keyboard and mouse were dead. The machine wouldn't } even answer pings... complete freeze. Needless to say, since I've been } running FreeBSD (almost 2 years) this is the first time this has ever } happened to me. Lock up. Not even a crash. Nothing is worse, and horrible } images of win95 were filling my head. } } Solution: } rm -rf /usr/local/netscape } mount /cdrom } pkg_add /cdrom/packages/All/slynx-2.7.tgz } } Communicator may have a pretty interface, but it's a behemouth, } resource eating, system crashing, poor performing monster. Surely they } can do better... Communicator is a fairly important product. That Netscape is now apparently supporting FreeBSD is a *very* important development! It raises the status of FreeBSD considerably. It works reasonably well considering that it's in beta right now. Please lighten up. Richard From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 07:06:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA19677 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 07:06:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vinyl.quickweb.com (vinyl.quickweb.com [206.222.77.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA19654 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 07:06:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mark@localhost) by vinyl.quickweb.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id KAA27603; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:02:31 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970808100231.50593@vinyl.quickweb.com> Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:02:31 -0400 From: Mark Mayo To: "Bryan K. Ogawa" Cc: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version References: <21563.863844380@time.cdrom.com> <9708080506.AA27349@chad.anasazi.com> <19970808014355.44693@vinyl.quickweb.com> <199708080913.CAA05820@foo.primenet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199708080913.CAA05820@foo.primenet.com>; from Bryan K. Ogawa on Fri, Aug 08, 1997 at 02:13:41AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Aug 08, 1997 at 02:13:41AM -0700, Bryan K. Ogawa wrote: > In localhost.freebsd.stable you write: > > >Finally, Communicator locked up on me last night - actuallly it locked > >up and took out my system with it.. complete freeze. X was still > >"displaying", but the keyboard and mouse were dead. The machine wouldn't > >even answer pings... complete freeze. Needless to say, since I've been > >running FreeBSD (almost 2 years) this is the first time this has ever > >happened to me. Lock up. Not even a crash. Nothing is worse, and horrible > >images of win95 were filling my head. > > I'm very interested in information on this bug (which I think I've > ironed out of my system). > > 1. What bpp are you running? 16bpp. > 2. Are you running Xaccel or XFree? AccelX v1.3 > 3. Which video card are you running? Matrox Millenium > 4. Are you running with Backing Store and/or SaveUnders? Backing Store turned off (to fix a bug in AccelX), SaveUnders still turned on. FWIW, when I did have Backing Store on it would be fairly nornal to see the Netscape/AccelX combined memory usage grow to between 40 and 50MB... with Backing Store off, Netscape usually hovers in the 16-20MB range, with AccelX weighing in at about 8MB. Certainly heavyweights by anybody's standards! :-) > 5. How much swap/memory do you have? 95MB swap, 48MB RAM. PPro 166, full NCR SCSI. > 6. Do you have a large bookmarks.html ? Yes, actually! If you have any clues, I'd love to here about them. FWIW, when I was running 4.0b6 (the Linux binaries) I didn't have these problems. It will still a memory pig, but it didn't crash out. The FreeBSD version misbehaves all the time, from not returning the cursor to an arrow after it was the "busy watch", to just plain crashing (often when I hit the back button). -Mark > > If anyone else sees this problem (total freeze under X), I'm > interested in hearing about it! > > Thanks. > > -- > bryan k ogawa http://www.primenet.com/~bkogawa/ -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Mayo mark@quickweb.com RingZero Comp. http://vinyl.quickweb.com/mark finger mark@quickweb.com for my PGP key and GCS code ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- University degrees are a bit like adultery: you may not want to get involved with that sort of thing, but you don't want to be thought incapable. -Sir Peter Imbert From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 07:18:18 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA20577 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 07:18:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vinyl.quickweb.com (vinyl.quickweb.com [206.222.77.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA20571 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 07:18:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mark@localhost) by vinyl.quickweb.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id KAA27675; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:14:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970808101443.50002@vinyl.quickweb.com> Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:14:43 -0400 From: Mark Mayo To: Faried Nawaz Cc: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version References: <21563.863844380@time.cdrom.com> <19970808014355.44693@vinyl.quickweb.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: ; from Faried Nawaz on Fri, Aug 08, 1997 at 02:23:46AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Aug 08, 1997 at 02:23:46AM -0700, Faried Nawaz wrote: > mark@quickweb.com (Mark Mayo) writes: > > Anyone else notice that it often just refuses to die?? I'd say about 60% > of the time for me, when I close it by selecting "Exit" from the menu, > or close the window using the window manager, Netscape disapears from > the screen, but a process list shows me it's still there, eating up > 20MB or RAM and burning away my CPU. 'kill -9' is your friend.. > > It dies for me -- you just have to wait a few seconds or so. > It takes about 15-20 seconds to go away on my machine (486-100, 48mb ram, > 2.2-STABLE). I've typically been waiting over a minute to see if it's really die'ing or not. If it doesn't shut down in 1 minute on a PPro with 48MB or RAM something is wrong. > Finally, Communicator locked up on me last night - actuallly it locked > up and took out my system with it.. complete freeze. X was still > "displaying", but the keyboard and mouse were dead. The machine wouldn't > even answer pings... complete freeze. Needless to say, since I've been > running FreeBSD (almost 2 years) this is the first time this has ever > happened to me. Lock up. Not even a crash. Nothing is worse, and horrible > images of win95 were filling my head. > > I've had this happen on rare occasions in the past two years. > > Also, at least twice, I've gone away for a while, come back, hit some > key to turn off the X screensaver (the 'blank' screen xset gives you), > and the machine's rebooted. This was usually after a make world or > some other long-running, vm-intensive process (hasn't happened > recently). > > I don't think you can explicitly blame Communicator here. It might very well be a vm problem, but I've just never had a VM crash myself, so naturally I'm suspicious of what Communicator is up to! I wouldn't even bring it up if it weren't for all the strange problems I've been having with Communicator since I've installed the freebsd version. It often crashes (which is somewhat normal for a beta product, although 4.0b6 of the linux distribution running through the linux emulator was very solid), doesn't return the mouse pointer from "the busy watch icon" to an arrow, and really sucks for Java performance. And lets face it, a 20MB resident memory size is pretty wild! The browsers are geting so gigantic these days that I really do find myself using lynx more and more. I re-installed Netscape 2.0 last night, and it seems to work just fine. I wish they'd offer a version without the mail and newsgroup and composer tools, or offer them as separate programs or something. Maybe then it wouldn't take all day just to start the darned thing up (I don't even want to try on my 486 with 16MB..) -mark -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Mayo mark@quickweb.com RingZero Comp. http://vinyl.quickweb.com/mark finger mark@quickweb.com for my PGP key and GCS code ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- University degrees are a bit like adultery: you may not want to get involved with that sort of thing, but you don't want to be thought incapable. -Sir Peter Imbert From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 07:19:02 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA20633 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 07:19:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.mexcom.net (mail.mexcom.net [206.103.64.97]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA20627 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 07:18:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sunix (eculp@sunix.mexcom.net [206.103.64.3]) by mail.mexcom.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA19081; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:18:51 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <33EB2AC1.173B1CC@mexcom.net> Date: Fri, 08 Aug 1997 09:18:41 -0500 From: Edwin Culp Organization: Mexico Communicates, S.C. X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; Linux 2.0.14 i586) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Richard Foulk CC: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version References: <199708081326.DAA28863@pegasus.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Richard Foulk wrote: > > } On Thu, Aug 07, 1997 at 10:06:37PM -0700, Chad R. Larson wrote: > } > Jordan recently sent e-mail announcing that Netscape has a native > } > implementation of Navigator. > } > > } > Actually, it was of Communicator. And, perhaps he should have mentioned > } > it needs to run under 2.2 as it was linked dynamically and has VD > } > (Version Discrepency) on the g++, c and stdc shared libraries. > } > } Anyone else notice that it often just refuses to die?? I'd say about 60% > } of the time for me, when I close it by selecting "Exit" from the menu, > } or close the window using the window manager, Netscape disapears from > } the screen, but a process list shows me it's still there, eating up > } 20MB or RAM and burning away my CPU. 'kill -9' is your friend.. > > Dies just fine for me. > > } Also, the java performance just seems HORRIBLE with the FReeBSD version.. > } Idon't know what they're doing, but for some reason the FreeBSD version > } runs about 1000% slower than the Linux version of Communicator (and the > } BSDI 3.0 series). > > My Java performance seems okay. Haven't tried the other versions yet > to compare. > > } Finally, Communicator locked up on me last night - actuallly it locked > } up and took out my system with it.. complete freeze. X was still > } "displaying", but the keyboard and mouse were dead. The machine wouldn't > } even answer pings... complete freeze. Needless to say, since I've been > } running FreeBSD (almost 2 years) this is the first time this has ever > } happened to me. Lock up. Not even a crash. Nothing is worse, and horrible > } images of win95 were filling my head. > } > } Solution: > } rm -rf /usr/local/netscape > } mount /cdrom > } pkg_add /cdrom/packages/All/slynx-2.7.tgz > } > } Communicator may have a pretty interface, but it's a behemouth, > } resource eating, system crashing, poor performing monster. Surely they > } can do better... > > Communicator is a fairly important product. That Netscape is now apparently > supporting FreeBSD is a *very* important development! It raises the status > of FreeBSD considerably. > > It works reasonably well considering that it's in beta right now. > > Please lighten up. > > Richard Has anyone noticed that JavaScripts work "differently" or not at all. Neat bells and whistles, bottons that change colors, etc??? Maybe it's better :-) From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 07:56:32 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA22579 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 07:56:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from helium.vapornet.com (root@helium.vapornet.com [208.202.126.112]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA22573 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 07:56:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from argon.vapornet.com (oakbrook1-23.ebs.net [207.19.130.55]) by helium.vapornet.com (8.8.6/VaporServer-2.5+SpamNot) with ESMTP id JAA05572 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:56:33 -0500 (CDT) Received: by argon.vapornet.com (8.8.6/VaporClient-1.1.1) id JAA14434; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:56:29 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:56:29 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199708081456.JAA14434@argon.vapornet.com> From: John Preisler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: broked stable X-Mailer: VM 6.22 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk recent changes to gun/usr.bin/ld break -stable. world is current as of yesterday. ===> ld/rtld cc -O -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/.. -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/../i386 -fpic -fno-function-cse -DRTLD -c /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/../i386/mdprologue.S cc -O -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/.. -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/../i386 -fpic -fno-function-cse -DRTLD -c /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:211: warning: excess elements in struct initializer after `ld_entry' /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c: In function `rtld': /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:415: `LDSO_VERSION_HAS_DLSYM3' undeclared (first use this function) /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:415: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:415: for each function it appears in.) /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c: In function `__dlsym': /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:1910: `RTLD_NEXT' undeclared (first use this function) /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c: In function `__dlsym3': /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:1929: `RTLD_NEXT' undeclared (first use this function) *** Error code 1 -jrp From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 07:57:04 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA22629 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 07:57:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cs.ru.ac.za (omega.ru.ac.za [146.231.24.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA22503 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 07:55:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by cs.ru.ac.za (Smail3.1.29.1 #11) id m0wwqPs-001ZFyC; Fri, 8 Aug 97 16:53 GMT Message-Id: Subject: Re: Netscape native version To: mark@quickweb.com (Mark Mayo) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 16:53:24 +0200 (GMT) From: Rory Freeman Cc: chad@anasazi.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: rory@omega.ru.ac.za (Rory Freeman) In-Reply-To: <19970808014355.44693@vinyl.quickweb.com> from Mark Mayo at "Aug 8, 97 01:43:55 am" From: Rory Freeman X-Confirm-Reading-To: "Rory Freeman" X-Organization: Rhodes University - Computer Science Department X-Phone: +27 461 318291; Fax: +27 461 311915 X-URL: http://cs.ru.ac.za/rory/ X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL15 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Mark Mayo spake thusly: > Anyone else notice that it often just refuses to die?? I'd say about 60% > of the time for me, when I close it by selecting "Exit" from the menu, > or close the window using the window manager, Netscape disapears from > the screen, but a process list shows me it's still there, eating up > 20MB or RAM and burning away my CPU. 'kill -9' is your friend.. I've noticed this as well. Running FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE, 16MB, Pentium-133. PLUR Rory ____ ------------------------love more, fear less------------------------ \ / Rory Freeman Rhodes University \/ mailto:rory@cs.ru.ac.za Grahamstown, South Africa http://cs.ru.ac.za/rory/ ...surf's up! ------------------------------------------------------------------------- The bongos. The bongos and the cowbells. Yes. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- The above represents my own ideas and not those of Rhodes University. Help fight crime in South Africa - http://www.robkaplan.org.za From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 09:03:36 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA25854 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:03:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (austin.polstra.com [206.213.73.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA25845; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:03:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (jdp@localhost) by austin.polstra.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA00660; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:03:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708081603.JAA00660@austin.polstra.com> To: stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Why is the stable tree not make worlding? In-Reply-To: References: Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: asami@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 08 Aug 1997 09:03:27 -0700 From: John Polstra Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > -------------------------------------------------------------- > Making hierarchy > -------------------------------------------------------------- > cd /usr/src && PATH=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/sbin:/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/sbin:/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/bin:/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/bin:/etc:/bin:/sbin:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin BISON_SIMPLE=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/share/misc/bison.simple COMPILER_PATH=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/libexec:/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/bin GCC_EXEC_PREFIX=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/lib/ LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/lib LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/lib:/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/lib NOEXTRADEPEND=t /usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/bin//usr/bin/make DESTDIR=/usr/obj/usr/src/tmp hierarchy > /usr/obj/usr/src/tmp/usr/bin//usr/bin/make: not found > *** Error code 2 > > Stop. > *** Error code 1 > > Stop. The same thing happened to me last night. I didn't have time to analyze it, so I just did an "rm -rf /usr/obj/*" and tried again. It worked fine after that. This was my first make world on that machine since Satoshi's restructuring of the Makefile. John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 09:12:44 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA26418 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:12:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (austin.polstra.com [206.213.73.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA26412 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:12:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (jdp@localhost) by austin.polstra.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA00716; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:12:11 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708081612.JAA00716@austin.polstra.com> To: john@helium.vapornet.com Subject: Re: broked stable In-Reply-To: <199708081456.JAA14434@argon.vapornet.com> References: <199708081456.JAA14434@argon.vapornet.com> Organization: Polstra & Co., Seattle, WA Cc: stable@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 08 Aug 1997 09:12:11 -0700 From: John Polstra Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <199708081456.JAA14434@argon.vapornet.com>, John Preisler wrote: > > recent changes to gun/usr.bin/ld break -stable. world is current as of yesterday. > > > > ===> ld/rtld > cc -O -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/.. -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/../i386 -fpic -fno-function-cse -DRTLD -c /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/../i386/mdprologue.S > cc -O -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/.. -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld -I/usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/../i386 -fpic -fno-function-cse -DRTLD -c /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c > /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:211: warning: excess elements in struct initializer after `ld_entry' > /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c: In function `rtld': > /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:415: `LDSO_VERSION_HAS_DLSYM3' undeclared (first use this function) > /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:415: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once > /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:415: for each function it appears in.) > /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c: In function `__dlsym': > /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:1910: `RTLD_NEXT' undeclared (first use this function) > /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c: In function `__dlsym3': > /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/ld/rtld/rtld.c:1929: `RTLD_NEXT' undeclared (first use this function) > *** Error code 1 Hmm ... your "cc" lines _should_ contain "-I/usr/obj/.../tmp/usr/include". Why don't they?? Are you sure you did a full make world without cheating in any way? I tried it here and didn't have any problems. Perhaps you have some stale dependencies? LDSO_VERSION_HAS_DLSYM3 is defined by . RTLD_NEXT is defined by . Both of these should have gotten installed by the "includes" target, long before rtld was built. John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 09:31:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA27196 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:31:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pooh.cdrom.com (pooh.cdrom.com [204.216.28.222]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA27191 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:31:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (murray@localhost) by pooh.cdrom.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA15979; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:29:50 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:29:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Murray Stokely To: Mark Mayo cc: Faried Nawaz , freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version In-Reply-To: <19970808101443.50002@vinyl.quickweb.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk % The browsers are geting so gigantic these days that I really do find myself % using lynx more and more. I re-installed Netscape 2.0 last night, and it % seems to work just fine. I wish they'd offer a version without the mail and % newsgroup and composer tools, or offer them as separate programs or something. They are. I read on pcweek.com a few days ago that Netscape is going to release a 4.x version of JUST navigator.. none of the groupware, messaging, etc.. Murray Stokely From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 09:56:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA28668 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:56:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from helium.vapornet.com (root@helium.vapornet.com [208.202.126.112]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA28661 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 09:56:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from argon.vapornet.com (oakbrook1-23.ebs.net [207.19.130.55]) by helium.vapornet.com (8.8.6/VaporServer-2.5+SpamNot) with ESMTP id LAA05970; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 11:56:36 -0500 (CDT) Received: by argon.vapornet.com (8.8.6/VaporClient-1.1.1) id LAA14999; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 11:56:31 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 11:56:31 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199708081656.LAA14999@argon.vapornet.com> From: John Preisler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: John Polstra Cc: stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: broked stable In-Reply-To: <199708081612.JAA00716@austin.polstra.com> References: <199708081456.JAA14434@argon.vapornet.com> <199708081612.JAA00716@austin.polstra.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.22 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk nope, ya caught me. I didnt make includes from the top level. Works fine when I follow directions... -j > > *** Error code 1 > > Hmm ... your "cc" lines _should_ contain "-I/usr/obj/.../tmp/usr/include". > Why don't they?? > > Are you sure you did a full make world without cheating in any way? > I tried it here and didn't have any problems. Perhaps you have some > stale dependencies? > > LDSO_VERSION_HAS_DLSYM3 is defined by . RTLD_NEXT is > defined by . Both of these should have gotten installed > by the "includes" target, long before rtld was built. > > John > -- > John Polstra jdp@polstra.com > John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA > "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth > From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 10:46:59 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA01443 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:46:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from acromail.ml.org (acroal.vip.best.com [206.86.222.181]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA01438 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:46:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (root@localhost) by acromail.ml.org (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA01241; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:47:00 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:47:00 -0700 (PDT) From: 0000-Administrator To: Satoshi Asami cc: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Why is the stable tree not make worlding? In-Reply-To: <199708081024.DAA15117@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Yep i did a successful make world a few days ago (and update) I cut out some of the parts so that the mail was not too long.... sorry, I will try again and send the whole thing if you want. On Fri, 8 Aug 1997, Satoshi Asami wrote: > * -------------------------------------------------------------- > * Making make > * -------------------------------------------------------------- > * -------------------------------------------------------------- > * Making hierarchy > * -------------------------------------------------------------- > > Well, here is the problem. That part of src/Makefile looks like this: > > === > @echo > @echo "--------------------------------------------------------------" > @echo " Making make" > @echo "--------------------------------------------------------------" > mkdir -p ${WORLDTMP}/usr/bin > cd ${.CURDIR}/usr.bin/make && \ > ${IBMAKE} -I${.CURDIR}/share/mk ${OBJDIR} clean cleandepend depend && \ > ${IBMAKE} -I${.CURDIR}/share/mk ${MK_FLAGS} all install clean cleandepend > @echo > @echo "--------------------------------------------------------------" > @echo " Making hierarchy" > @echo "--------------------------------------------------------------" > === > > You should at least see the commands in between the @echo's. Are you > sure your whole tree is up to date, as there were lots of related > changes that went in during a short period of time? > > Satoshi > From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 10:47:25 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA01487 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:47:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from acromail.ml.org (acroal.vip.best.com [206.86.222.181]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA01480 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:47:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (root@localhost) by acromail.ml.org (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA01246; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:47:47 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:47:47 -0700 (PDT) From: 0000-Administrator To: Satoshi Asami cc: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Why is the stable tree not make worlding? In-Reply-To: <199708081024.DAA15117@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Might it have anything to do woth the fact that I am running the cvsup/make world from a cron job? From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 10:48:39 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA01553 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:48:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA01546 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:48:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rover.village.org [127.0.0.1] by rover.village.org with esmtp (Exim 1.60 #1) id 0wwt95-0007lV-00; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 11:48:15 -0600 To: richard@pegasus.com (Richard Foulk) Subject: Re: Netscape native version Cc: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 08 Aug 1997 03:26:05 -1000." <199708081326.DAA28863@pegasus.com> References: <199708081326.DAA28863@pegasus.com> Date: Fri, 08 Aug 1997 11:48:15 -0600 From: Warner Losh Message-Id: Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In message <199708081326.DAA28863@pegasus.com> Richard Foulk writes: : It works reasonably well considering that it's in beta right now. Is there a non-export version available? Will one be available on a cdrom from netscape? Warner From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 10:57:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA02089 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:57:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from acromail.ml.org (acroal.vip.best.com [206.86.222.181]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA02042 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:57:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (root@localhost) by acromail.ml.org (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA01280 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:57:22 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:57:22 -0700 (PDT) From: 0000-Administrator To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: sessreg program with X11 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Does anyone either have sessreg working correctly -- or know of a replacement I can use with freebsd. Sessreg is a program that you put in a couple of your xdm files so that when someone logs in through the xlogin widget they show up in utmp/wtmp/lastlogin via the who and finger command etc. I have multiple X terminals connected to my freebsd box so this is quite necessary. I've tried using all the command line parameters to specify the correct files (i.e -u -x -w) but I have not been able to get it to work. Is there an replacement program that would handle this? From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 12:24:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA07317 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:24:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from foo.primenet.com (ip206.sjc.primenet.com [206.165.96.206]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA07305 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:24:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (bkogawa@localhost) by foo.primenet.com (8.8.6/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA11861; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:29:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Authentication-Warning: foo.primenet.com: bkogawa owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:29:30 -0700 (PDT) From: "Bryan K. Ogawa" To: Mark Mayo cc: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version In-Reply-To: <19970808100231.50593@vinyl.quickweb.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 8 Aug 1997, Mark Mayo wrote: > On Fri, Aug 08, 1997 at 02:13:41AM -0700, Bryan K. Ogawa wrote: > > In localhost.freebsd.stable you write: > > > > >Finally, Communicator locked up on me last night - actuallly it locked > > >up and took out my system with it.. complete freeze. X was still > > >"displaying", but the keyboard and mouse were dead. The machine wouldn't > > >even answer pings... complete freeze. Needless to say, since I've been > > >running FreeBSD (almost 2 years) this is the first time this has ever > > >happened to me. Lock up. Not even a crash. Nothing is worse, and horrible > > >images of win95 were filling my head. > > > > I'm very interested in information on this bug (which I think I've > > ironed out of my system). Looks like we have a winner. (1/2 a :), 1/2 a :( ) > 16bpp. > AccelX v1.3 > Matrox Millenium > > 4. Are you running with Backing Store and/or SaveUnders? > > Backing Store turned off (to fix a bug in AccelX), SaveUnders still turned on. > FWIW, when I did have Backing Store on it would be fairly nornal to see the > Netscape/AccelX combined memory usage grow to between 40 and 50MB... with > Backing Store off, Netscape usually hovers in the 16-20MB range, with AccelX > weighing in at about 8MB. Certainly heavyweights by anybody's standards! :-) Try turning off SaveUnders. It's worked for me under Xaccel 3.1. > > 5. How much swap/memory do you have? > > 95MB swap, 48MB RAM. PPro 166, full NCR SCSI. I also doubled my swap (on a second drive) to 180M. I don't know if it helped anything else, but it seemed to speed things up (I only have 32M, and splitting it over two drives seems a fair bit quicker). > > 6. Do you have a large bookmarks.html ? > > Yes, actually! Just curious, but how big? Mine is 88K. > If you have any clues, I'd love to here about them. FWIW, when I was running > 4.0b6 (the Linux binaries) I didn't have these problems. It will still > a memory pig, but it didn't crash out. The FreeBSD version misbehaves all the > time, from not returning the cursor to an arrow after it was the "busy watch", > to just plain crashing (often when I hit the back button). I was able to get this problem to happen with the BSDI binaries (consistently) and even 3.01. The #1 way for me to trigger the bug is to open the bookmarks menu, and, holding down the mouse, scroll up and down over the sub-menus for a few seconds to a few minutes. This would lock my system pretty consistenly, but I haven't had an X-related lockup that I can think of since I turned off SaveUnders and added the swap (although it was grim for a while there--I would lock up 3 times in a night, and things like that). Not pretty. bryan k ogawa http://www.primenet.com/~bkogawa/ From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 12:46:13 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA08252 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:46:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhost.anasazi.com (mailhost.anasazi.com [138.113.128.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA08247 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:46:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chad.anasazi.com by mailhost.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7b) id AA24199; Fri, 8 Aug 97 12:45:31 -0700 Received: by chad.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7) id AA28697; Fri, 8 Aug 97 12:45:28 -0700 From: chad@anasazi.com (Chad R. Larson) Message-Id: <9708081945.AA28697@chad.anasazi.com> Subject: Re: Netscape native version To: richard@pegasus.com (Richard Foulk) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:45:27 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199708081326.DAA28863@pegasus.com> from "Richard Foulk" at Aug 8, 97 03:26:05 am Reply-To: chad@anasazi.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Communicator is a fairly important product. That Netscape is now apparently > supporting FreeBSD is a *very* important development! It raises the status > of FreeBSD considerably. > > It works reasonably well considering that it's in beta right now. And, let's all download a copy to prove to their statistics gathering that FreeBSD is a platform with wide-spread usage. Anybody got numbers on how many FreeBSD systems are out there compared with BSDI? > Richard -crl -- Chad R. Larson (CRL22) Brother, can you paradigm? 602-870-3330 chad@anasazi.com chad@anasaz.UUCP chad@dcfinc.com Anasazi, Inc. - 7500 North Dreamy Draw Drive, Suite 120, Phoenix, Az 85020 From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 12:51:19 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA08565 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:51:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vinyl.quickweb.com (vinyl.quickweb.com [206.222.77.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA08558 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:51:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mark@localhost) by vinyl.quickweb.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id PAA00624; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 15:47:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970808154737.07005@vinyl.quickweb.com> Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 15:47:37 -0400 From: Mark Mayo To: Murray Stokely Cc: Mark Mayo , Faried Nawaz , freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version References: <19970808101443.50002@vinyl.quickweb.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: ; from Murray Stokely on Fri, Aug 08, 1997 at 09:29:50AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Aug 08, 1997 at 09:29:50AM -0700, Murray Stokely wrote: > % The browsers are geting so gigantic these days that I really do find myself > % using lynx more and more. I re-installed Netscape 2.0 last night, and it > % seems to work just fine. I wish they'd offer a version without the mail and > % newsgroup and composer tools, or offer them as separate programs or something. > > They are. I read on pcweek.com a few days ago that Netscape is going > to release a 4.x version of JUST navigator.. none of the groupware, > messaging, etc.. Cool! Now that will work well I think, especially in the Unix community, where many users are already comfortable and happy with their traditional tools and I would suspect rarely use Commmunicator for anything but web browsing anyhow. Good news for sure! -Mark > > Murray Stokely -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Mayo mark@quickweb.com RingZero Comp. http://vinyl.quickweb.com/mark finger mark@quickweb.com for my PGP key and GCS code ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- University degrees are a bit like adultery: you may not want to get involved with that sort of thing, but you don't want to be thought incapable. -Sir Peter Imbert From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 12:53:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA08779 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:53:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhost.anasazi.com (mailhost.anasazi.com [138.113.128.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA08769 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:53:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chad.anasazi.com by mailhost.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7b) id AA24319; Fri, 8 Aug 97 12:52:31 -0700 Received: by chad.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7) id AA28752; Fri, 8 Aug 97 12:52:28 -0700 From: chad@anasazi.com (Chad R. Larson) Message-Id: <9708081952.AA28752@chad.anasazi.com> Subject: Re: Netscape native version To: mark@quickweb.com (Mark Mayo) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 12:52:27 -0700 (MST) Cc: fn@Hungry.COM, freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <19970808101443.50002@vinyl.quickweb.com> from "Mark Mayo" at Aug 8, 97 10:14:43 am Reply-To: chad@anasazi.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > The browsers are geting so gigantic these days that I really do find > myself using lynx more and more. I re-installed Netscape 2.0 last > night, and it seems to work just fine. I wish they'd offer a version > without the mail and newsgroup and composer tools, or offer them as > separate programs or something. Maybe then it wouldn't take all day > just to start the darned thing up (I don't even want to try on my 486 > with 16MB..) They announced a plan to do just that. I think Communicator is the first step along that road. Eventually the Navigator portion is supposed to be just an operating environment, and all that mail/news/groupware/broadcasting stuff will be plug-ins. You could construct your own browser feature set. -crl -- Chad R. Larson (CRL22) Brother, can you paradigm? 602-870-3330 chad@anasazi.com chad@anasaz.UUCP chad@dcfinc.com Anasazi, Inc. - 7500 North Dreamy Draw Drive, Suite 120, Phoenix, Az 85020 From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 13:07:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA09732 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:07:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vader.cs.berkeley.edu (vader.CS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.38.234]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA09719 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:07:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by vader.cs.berkeley.edu (8.8.6/8.7.3) id NAA20162; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:07:06 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:07:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708082007.NAA20162@vader.cs.berkeley.edu> To: john@helium.vapornet.com CC: jdp@polstra.com, stable@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <199708081656.LAA14999@argon.vapornet.com> (message from John Preisler on Fri, 8 Aug 1997 11:56:31 -0500 (CDT)) Subject: Re: broked stable From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * nope, ya caught me. I didnt make includes from the top level. Works * fine when I follow directions... That is not the problem. "make includes" is NOT necessary any more, as long as you run "make world" (or "buildworld"). Either your source is not really up to date, or I'm a complete idiot. * > Hmm ... your "cc" lines _should_ contain "-I/usr/obj/.../tmp/usr/include". * > Why don't they?? Please check these. Satoshi P.S. By the way, I did a make world last night after the ld update, it worked fine for me. From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 13:10:33 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA10041 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:10:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailhost.anasazi.com (mailhost.anasazi.com [138.113.128.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA10008 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:10:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chad.anasazi.com by mailhost.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7b) id AA24697; Fri, 8 Aug 97 13:09:46 -0700 Received: by chad.anasazi.com (5.65/3.7) id AA28896; Fri, 8 Aug 97 13:09:43 -0700 From: chad@anasazi.com (Chad R. Larson) Message-Id: <9708082009.AA28896@chad.anasazi.com> Subject: Re: broked stable To: john@helium.vapornet.com (John Preisler) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:09:42 -0700 (MST) Cc: jdp@polstra.com, stable@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199708081656.LAA14999@argon.vapornet.com> from "John Preisler" at Aug 8, 97 11:56:31 am Reply-To: chad@anasazi.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > nope, ya caught me. I didnt make includes from the top level. Works > fine when I follow directions... This seems to catch someone about once a week, from reading this list. If "includes" has to be made, why doesn't "world" have them as a dependency? -crl -- Chad R. Larson (CRL22) Brother, can you paradigm? 602-870-3330 chad@anasazi.com chad@anasaz.UUCP chad@dcfinc.com Anasazi, Inc. - 7500 North Dreamy Draw Drive, Suite 120, Phoenix, Az 85020 From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 13:11:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA10158 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:11:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vader.cs.berkeley.edu (vader.CS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.38.234]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA10153 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:11:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by vader.cs.berkeley.edu (8.8.6/8.7.3) id NAA20173; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:11:33 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:11:33 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708082011.NAA20173@vader.cs.berkeley.edu> To: jdp@polstra.com CC: stable@freebsd.org In-reply-to: <199708081603.JAA00660@austin.polstra.com> (message from John Polstra on Fri, 08 Aug 1997 09:03:27 -0700) Subject: Re: Why is the stable tree not make worlding? From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * The same thing happened to me last night. I didn't have time to * analyze it, so I just did an "rm -rf /usr/obj/*" and tried again. * It worked fine after that. * * This was my first make world on that machine since Satoshi's * restructuring of the Makefile. It's quite possible that there is something that confuses the compilation/installation in usr.bin/make. I thought the first "clean" and "cleandepend" in === cd ${.CURDIR}/usr.bin/make && \ ${IBMAKE} -I${.CURDIR}/share/mk ${OBJDIR} clean cleandepend depend && \ ${IBMAKE} -I${.CURDIR}/share/mk ${MK_FLAGS} all install clean cleandepend === will delete anything that's left behind but I haven't tried building world on a system with an old (i.e., pre-newworldpatch) /usr/obj so I could very well be wrong. Satoshi From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 13:19:30 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA10564 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:19:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (austin.polstra.com [206.213.73.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA10559 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:19:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (jdp@localhost) by austin.polstra.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA04079; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:19:20 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708082019.NAA04079@austin.polstra.com> To: chad@anasazi.com cc: stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: broked stable In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 08 Aug 1997 13:09:42 PDT." <9708082009.AA28896@chad.anasazi.com> Date: Fri, 08 Aug 1997 13:19:19 -0700 From: John Polstra Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > nope, ya caught me. I didnt make includes from the top level. Works > > fine when I follow directions... > > This seems to catch someone about once a week, from reading this list. That's because people *cheat* and try to skip steps, instead of typing "make world". > If "includes" has to be made, why doesn't "world" have them as a > dependency? It does. If you type "make world" everything works fine. You don't have to do anything extra, except in rare situations involving bootstrapping past circular dependencies. This wasn't one of those cases. This problem was caused by a mistake on the part of the user, not by anything wrong in the source tree. -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 13:22:15 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA10753 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:22:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vinyl.quickweb.com (vinyl.quickweb.com [206.222.77.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA10302 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:13:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mark@localhost) by vinyl.quickweb.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id QAA00781; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 16:06:40 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970808160639.60094@vinyl.quickweb.com> Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 16:06:39 -0400 From: Mark Mayo To: Richard Foulk Cc: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version References: <199708081326.DAA28863@pegasus.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <199708081326.DAA28863@pegasus.com>; from Richard Foulk on Fri, Aug 08, 1997 at 03:26:05AM -1000 Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, Aug 08, 1997 at 03:26:05AM -1000, Richard Foulk wrote: > } On Thu, Aug 07, 1997 at 10:06:37PM -0700, Chad R. Larson wrote: > } Anyone else notice that it often just refuses to die?? I'd say about 60% > } of the time for me, when I close it by selecting "Exit" from the menu, > } or close the window using the window manager, Netscape disapears from > } the screen, but a process list shows me it's still there, eating up > } 20MB or RAM and burning away my CPU. 'kill -9' is your friend.. > > Dies just fine for me. > > } Also, the java performance just seems HORRIBLE with the FReeBSD version.. > } Idon't know what they're doing, but for some reason the FreeBSD version > } runs about 1000% slower than the Linux version of Communicator (and the > } BSDI 3.0 series). > > My Java performance seems okay. Haven't tried the other versions yet > to compare. Try the Linux version, or a version from 3.0 -- I'd really like to know if it's just something with my setup, or if it's freebsd commuicator barfing. For example, on my web page: http://vinyl.quickweb.com/mark/ There is an applet that renders a reflection of a sunset onto a rippling lake. On every Java browser I've used on every platform (including by *old* 486 running oth FreeBSD and now Win95 - don't ask..) the appplet runs fine and is very smooth. And generally the CPU usage is quite low. Running Linux Communicator 4.0b6 on my FreeBSD machine (a PPro 166) is fine as well. The FreeBSD native version, however, can't even smoothly render the image, uses up 100% of the CPU, and even makes the mouse jittery. Hmm. Something is definately wrong. > > } Finally, Communicator locked up on me last night - actuallly it locked > } up and took out my system with it.. complete freeze. X was still > } "displaying", but the keyboard and mouse were dead. The machine wouldn't > } even answer pings... complete freeze. Needless to say, since I've been > } running FreeBSD (almost 2 years) this is the first time this has ever > } happened to me. Lock up. Not even a crash. Nothing is worse, and horrible > } images of win95 were filling my head. > } > } Solution: > } rm -rf /usr/local/netscape > } mount /cdrom > } pkg_add /cdrom/packages/All/slynx-2.7.tgz > } > } Communicator may have a pretty interface, but it's a behemouth, > } resource eating, system crashing, poor performing monster. Surely they > } can do better... > > Communicator is a fairly important product. That Netscape is now apparently > supporting FreeBSD is a *very* important development! It raises the status > of FreeBSD considerably. > > It works reasonably well considering that it's in beta right now. > > Please lighten up. Yeah yeah yeah... Fine it's an important product, I'm just expressing my disgust over the gigantic resources that Netscape seems to require these days just to browse the web. Netscape and Microsoft are battling over stupid technologies just to outdo each other, and the end result is that this garbage is being pushed down the users' throats. My major concern is that while it may be a FreeBSD native version, and it may work "reasonably well", every other platform's version is working much, much better. It may give FreeBSD some 'status', but how happy are new users going to be when they fire up Netscape on their new FreeBSD install and it doesn't perform like they expect? Hopefully Netscape will get their act together and give us a good version, and since I can't figure out how to mail them bug reports directly, I'm hoping maybe they read this list and will get them this way! This list also give me a chance to see if others are having the same problems. cya, -mark > > > Richard -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Mayo mark@quickweb.com RingZero Comp. http://vinyl.quickweb.com/mark finger mark@quickweb.com for my PGP key and GCS code ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- University degrees are a bit like adultery: you may not want to get involved with that sort of thing, but you don't want to be thought incapable. -Sir Peter Imbert From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 13:22:50 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA10812 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:22:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vader.cs.berkeley.edu (vader.CS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.38.234]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA10807 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:22:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by vader.cs.berkeley.edu (8.8.6/8.7.3) id NAA20188; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:21:26 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 13:21:26 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708082021.NAA20188@vader.cs.berkeley.edu> To: root@acromail.ml.org CC: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org In-reply-to: (message from 0000-Administrator on Fri, 8 Aug 1997 10:47:00 -0700 (PDT)) Subject: Re: Why is the stable tree not make worlding? From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * Yep i did a successful make world a few days ago (and update) I cut out * some of the parts so that the mail was not too long.... sorry, I will try * again and send the whole thing if you want. Well, you cut out the only part (that's supposed to be building and installing "make" in the temporary build tree) that could offer a clue. ;) Yes, please resend. Thanks. Satoshi From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 14:07:41 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA14166 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 14:07:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vader.cs.berkeley.edu (vader.CS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.38.234]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA14158 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 14:07:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by vader.cs.berkeley.edu (8.8.6/8.7.3) id OAA20899; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 14:07:33 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 14:07:33 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708082107.OAA20899@vader.cs.berkeley.edu> To: jdp@polstra.com CC: chad@anasazi.com, stable@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: <199708082019.NAA04079@austin.polstra.com> (message from John Polstra on Fri, 08 Aug 1997 13:19:19 -0700) Subject: Re: broked stable From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * > This seems to catch someone about once a week, from reading this list. * * That's because people *cheat* and try to skip steps, instead of * typing "make world". Note that what John is saying is true now, but not before. The old "world" target often died before even getting to the "includes" stage because tools required to build includes required new include files (the prototypical chicken-and-egg problem :). The new Makefile gets around this problem by doing a crude copy and symlinking at the beginning of "bootstrap" target to set up a minimal include environment, so this should no longer be the case. (Unless someone has a reeeeeeeeealy old system with incompatible cpio or something...but then I'm sure something else will fail anyway....) Satoshi From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 14:44:05 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA16511 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 14:44:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from helium.vapornet.com (root@helium.vapornet.com [208.202.126.112]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA16450 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 14:43:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from argon.vapornet.com (oakbrook1-25.ebs.net [207.19.130.57]) by helium.vapornet.com (8.8.6/VaporServer-2.5+SpamNot) with ESMTP id QAA01128; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 16:43:50 -0500 (CDT) Received: by argon.vapornet.com (8.8.6/VaporClient-1.1.1) id QAA00685; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 16:43:46 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 16:43:46 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199708082143.QAA00685@argon.vapornet.com> From: John Preisler MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Cc: jdp@polstra.com, stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: broked stable In-Reply-To: <199708082007.NAA20162@vader.cs.berkeley.edu> References: <199708081656.LAA14999@argon.vapornet.com> <199708082007.NAA20162@vader.cs.berkeley.edu> X-Mailer: VM 6.22 under 19.15 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk actually, i wasnt making the whole world this morning, just the part that changed overnight, which was where I had the problem. I tried to recompile just what changed since the previous day since i didnt think it warranted a complete build of the world. My normal routine is to make clean && make depend && make in whatever the cvsup log says has been updated. in this section of the tree, the makefiles dont have anything regarding depend or includes so none were built. Running a make includes from /usr/src built the necessary includes and it compiled fine. Im sorry for the confusion I've caused. -j Satoshi Asami writes: > * nope, ya caught me. I didnt make includes from the top level. Works > * fine when I follow directions... > > That is not the problem. "make includes" is NOT necessary any more, > as long as you run "make world" (or "buildworld"). Either your source > is not really up to date, or I'm a complete idiot. > > * > Hmm ... your "cc" lines _should_ contain "-I/usr/obj/.../tmp/usr/include". > * > Why don't they?? > > Please check these. > > Satoshi > > P.S. By the way, I did a make world last night after the ld update, it > worked fine for me. > From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 15:50:01 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA19915 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 15:50:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bofh.noc.best.net (rone@ennui.org [205.149.163.54]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA19906 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 15:49:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from rone@localhost) by bofh.noc.best.net (8.8.6/8.7.3) id PAA04380 for stable@freebsd.org; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 15:49:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Ron Echeverri Message-Id: <199708082249.PAA04380@bofh.noc.best.net> Subject: Re: Netscape native version In-Reply-To: <9708080506.AA27349@chad.anasazi.com> from "Chad R. Larson" at "Aug 7, 97 10:06:37 pm" To: stable@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 15:49:49 -0700 (PDT) X-GmbH: Gesellschaft mit beschränkter Haftung X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL31 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Chad R. Larson writes: Jordan recently sent e-mail announcing that Netscape has a native implementation of Navigator. Actually, it was of Communicator. And, perhaps he should have mentioned it needs to run under 2.2 as it was linked dynamically and has VD (Version Discrepency) on the g++, c and stdc shared libraries. In the older betas the README mentioned that to run Java, the display should have at least 16-bit depth. Is this still true? rone -- rone's rules: Ron Echeverri - I don't care. Systems/Usenet Administration - It's not important. Best Internet Communications - Leave me alone. rone@best.net From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 21:43:09 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA06730 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 21:43:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA06725 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 21:43:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA02438; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 21:42:13 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 21:42:12 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Faried Nawaz cc: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk What I want to know is why it takes so damn long (30+) seconds to startup on my PPro-180/64MB? What is it doing all that time (only using 2% cpu during startup) From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 21:51:20 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA07042 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 21:51:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from counterintelligence.ml.org (mdean.vip.best.com [206.86.94.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA07037 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 21:51:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jamil@localhost) by counterintelligence.ml.org (8.8.6/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA02463; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 21:50:38 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 21:50:37 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" To: Richard Foulk cc: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Netscape: Here's how to fix it. In-Reply-To: <199708081326.DAA28863@pegasus.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Tell netscape to give the freebsd community the source code and we will tighten it up for the and make it lighting fast, efficient, and bulletproof. On Fri, 8 Aug 1997, Richard Foulk wrote: > } On Thu, Aug 07, 1997 at 10:06:37PM -0700, Chad R. Larson wrote: > } > Jordan recently sent e-mail announcing that Netscape has a native > } > implementation of Navigator. > } > > } > Actually, it was of Communicator. And, perhaps he should have mentioned > } > it needs to run under 2.2 as it was linked dynamically and has VD > } > (Version Discrepency) on the g++, c and stdc shared libraries. > } > } Anyone else notice that it often just refuses to die?? I'd say about 60% > } of the time for me, when I close it by selecting "Exit" from the menu, > } or close the window using the window manager, Netscape disapears from > } the screen, but a process list shows me it's still there, eating up > } 20MB or RAM and burning away my CPU. 'kill -9' is your friend.. > > Dies just fine for me. > > } Also, the java performance just seems HORRIBLE with the FReeBSD version.. > } Idon't know what they're doing, but for some reason the FreeBSD version > } runs about 1000% slower than the Linux version of Communicator (and the > } BSDI 3.0 series). > > My Java performance seems okay. Haven't tried the other versions yet > to compare. > > } Finally, Communicator locked up on me last night - actuallly it locked > } up and took out my system with it.. complete freeze. X was still > } "displaying", but the keyboard and mouse were dead. The machine wouldn't > } even answer pings... complete freeze. Needless to say, since I've been > } running FreeBSD (almost 2 years) this is the first time this has ever > } happened to me. Lock up. Not even a crash. Nothing is worse, and horrible > } images of win95 were filling my head. > } > } Solution: > } rm -rf /usr/local/netscape > } mount /cdrom > } pkg_add /cdrom/packages/All/slynx-2.7.tgz > } > } Communicator may have a pretty interface, but it's a behemouth, > } resource eating, system crashing, poor performing monster. Surely they > } can do better... > > Communicator is a fairly important product. That Netscape is now apparently > supporting FreeBSD is a *very* important development! It raises the status > of FreeBSD considerably. > > It works reasonably well considering that it's in beta right now. > > Please lighten up. > > > Richard > From owner-freebsd-stable Fri Aug 8 23:16:56 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA10031 for stable-outgoing; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 23:16:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from crh.cl.msu.edu (crh.cl.msu.edu [35.8.1.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA10026 for ; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 23:16:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from henrich@localhost) by crh.cl.msu.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA29862; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 02:16:50 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970809021650.54520@crh.cl.msu.edu> Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 02:16:50 -0400 From: Charles Henrich To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape native version Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.80 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2.2-RELEASE X-PGP-Fingerprint: 1024/F7 FD C7 3A F5 6A 23 BF 76 C4 B8 C9 6E 41 A4 4F Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In lists.freebsd.stable you write: >What I want to know is why it takes so damn long (30+) seconds to startup >on my PPro-180/64MB? What is it doing all that time (only using 2% cpu >during startup) Probably malloc() :) The native freebsd binary is 10mb! I might say it runs extrodinarily faster than the linux or BSDI versions on my P-II/300, mucho thanks to the Netscape folks for producing this! Also of note in last weeks' PC-WEEK, Netscape was mentioned as saying they will be shipping thin versions of netscape soon (Just the browser like in the good ole days, minus email/news/whateverelse) which should be even faster and smaller.. I cant wait! -Crh Charles Henrich Michigan State University henrich@msu.edu http://pilot.msu.edu/~henrich From owner-freebsd-stable Sat Aug 9 00:10:43 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA11886 for stable-outgoing; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 00:10:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from news.IAEhv.nl (root@news.IAEhv.nl [194.151.64.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA11881 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 00:10:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from LOCAL (uucp@localhost) by news.IAEhv.nl (8.6.13/1.63) with IAEhv.nl; pid 8340 on Sat, 9 Aug 1997 07:10:36 GMT; id HAA08340 efrom: devet@adv.IAEhv.nl; eto: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Received: (from devet@localhost) by adv.IAEhv.nl (8.8.5/8.8.6) id BAA00648; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 01:31:47 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 01:31:47 +0200 (CEST) From: Arjan de Vet Message-Id: <199708082331.BAA00648@adv.IAEhv.nl> To: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Netscape native version X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd.stable In-Reply-To: <19970808014355.44693@vinyl.quickweb.com> References: <21563.863844380@time.cdrom.com> Organization: Internet Access Eindhoven, the Netherlands Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk In article <19970808014355.44693@vinyl.quickweb.com> you write: >> Actually, it was of Communicator. And, perhaps he should have mentioned >> it needs to run under 2.2 as it was linked dynamically and has VD >> (Version Discrepency) on the g++, c and stdc shared libraries. > >Anyone else notice that it often just refuses to die?? I'd say about 60% >of the time for me, when I close it by selecting "Exit" from the menu, >or close the window using the window manager, Netscape disapears from >the screen, but a process list shows me it's still there, eating up >20MB or RAM and burning away my CPU. 'kill -9' is your friend.. I have another strange problem. When I start Netscape 4.02b7 for the first time and accept the license everything goes fine. When I exit Netscape and restart it again it starts burning away the CPU. The 'solution' I found was to remove the license line in preferences.js and then it works again. Arjan From owner-freebsd-stable Sat Aug 9 01:08:07 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA13557 for stable-outgoing; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 01:08:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from www2.shoppersnet.com (shoppersnet.com [204.156.152.112]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA13548 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 01:08:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from hlew@localhost) by www2.shoppersnet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA28129; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 01:12:19 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 01:12:19 -0700 (PDT) From: Howard Lew To: Mark Mayo cc: Richard Foulk , freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version In-Reply-To: <19970808160639.60094@vinyl.quickweb.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 8 Aug 1997, Mark Mayo wrote: > On Fri, Aug 08, 1997 at 03:26:05AM -1000, Richard Foulk wrote: > > } On Thu, Aug 07, 1997 at 10:06:37PM -0700, Chad R. Larson wrote: > > > } Anyone else notice that it often just refuses to die?? I'd say about 60% > > } of the time for me, when I close it by selecting "Exit" from the menu, > > } or close the window using the window manager, Netscape disapears from > > } the screen, but a process list shows me it's still there, eating up > > } 20MB or RAM and burning away my CPU. 'kill -9' is your friend.. > > > > Dies just fine for me. > > > > } Also, the java performance just seems HORRIBLE with the FReeBSD version.. > > } Idon't know what they're doing, but for some reason the FreeBSD version > > } runs about 1000% slower than the Linux version of Communicator (and the > > } BSDI 3.0 series). > > > > My Java performance seems okay. Haven't tried the other versions yet > > to compare. > > Try the Linux version, or a version from 3.0 -- I'd really like to > know if it's just something with my setup, or if it's freebsd > commuicator barfing. For example, on my web page: > http://vinyl.quickweb.com/mark/ > > There is an applet that renders a reflection of a sunset onto a rippling > lake. On every Java browser I've used on every platform (including > by *old* 486 running oth FreeBSD and now Win95 - don't ask..) the appplet > runs fine and is very smooth. And generally the CPU usage is quite low. > Running Linux Communicator 4.0b6 on my FreeBSD machine (a PPro 166) > is fine as well. The FreeBSD native version, however, can't even smoothly > render the image, uses up 100% of the CPU, and even makes the mouse > jittery. Hmm. Something is definately wrong. > Hmmm... the video does look jittery... I wonder if it has to do with the XFree86 driver or just code in FreeBSD. Maybe this is why we do not have RealPlayer 4.0... :-( From owner-freebsd-stable Sat Aug 9 01:09:31 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA13586 for stable-outgoing; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 01:09:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pegasus.com (pegasus.com [206.127.225.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA13581 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 01:09:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pegasus.com (8.6.8/PEGASUS-2.2) id WAA10464; Fri, 8 Aug 1997 22:08:59 -1001 Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 22:08:59 -1001 From: richard@pegasus.com (Richard Foulk) Message-Id: <199708090809.WAA10464@pegasus.com> In-Reply-To: "Jamil J. Weatherbee" "Re: Netscape native version" (Aug 8, 9:42pm) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk } } What I want to know is why it takes so damn long (30+) seconds to startup } on my PPro-180/64MB? What is it doing all that time (only using 2% cpu } during startup) } On my AMD 133Mhz 486/64MB it starts in less than 20. Richard From owner-freebsd-stable Sat Aug 9 02:07:06 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA15581 for stable-outgoing; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 02:07:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (root@time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA15575 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 02:07:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (jkh@localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.8.6/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA29024; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 02:04:34 -0700 (PDT) To: Mark Mayo cc: chad@anasazi.com, freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 08 Aug 1997 01:43:55 EDT." <19970808014355.44693@vinyl.quickweb.com> Date: Sat, 09 Aug 1997 02:04:33 -0700 Message-ID: <29020.871117473@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Communicator may have a pretty interface, but it's a behemouth, > resource eating, system crashing, poor performing monster. Surely they > can do better... Yeah, but why complain to us? We can't do anything about it! :-) Seriously, this all looks like material which ought to be directed at Netscape tech support if it's to have any effect. Chris McAffee is, I believe, the contact guy there for the FreeBSD port. Jordan From owner-freebsd-stable Sat Aug 9 02:43:51 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA16545 for stable-outgoing; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 02:43:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (sendero-ppp.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA16513 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 02:43:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 17359 invoked by uid 1000); 9 Aug 1997 09:43:52 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.2-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199708082007.NAA20162@vader.cs.berkeley.edu> Date: Sat, 09 Aug 1997 02:43:52 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Atlas Telecom From: Simon Shapiro To: (Satoshi Asami) Subject: Re: broked stable Cc: stable@FreeBSD.ORG, jdp@polstra.com, john@helium.vapornet.com Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi Satoshi Asami; On 08-Aug-97 you wrote: > * nope, ya caught me. I didnt make includes from the top level. Works > * fine when I follow directions... > > That is not the problem. "make includes" is NOT necessary any more, > as long as you run "make world" (or "buildworld"). Either your source > is not really up to date, or I'm a complete idiot. Third possibility: Something IS wrong. I do not have this problem, but please point to me (yes, again...) the flaw in my procedure: My cvsup file: *default base=/usr/local/etc/cvsup *default prefix=/Archives/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-CVS *default release=cvs *default host=sup.FreeBSD.org *default hostbase=/home *default delete *default old *default use-rel-suffix *default compress ## Main Source Tree src-all src-eBones src-secure ports-all doc-all src-sys release=smp prefix=/home/smp My cvsup command line: cd /usr/local/etc/cvsup rm -rf sup cvsup -L2 -z Sendero.cvsup Then I do : rm -rf /usr/src/2.2/src rm -rf /usr/obj/usr cd /usr/src/2.2 cvs checkout -rRELENG_2_2 src cd .. ln -s /usr/src/2.2/src/* . cd /usr/src/2.2/src make world > ../world.out 2>&1 It must be a flawed procedure because it works only 60% of the time. Different days produce different errors (no joke). Monday, it was an html file with the wrong format. Turns out to be a 3.0 file that somehow ended up in the 2.2 tree. Today, the make depend part of make world blows up because the tty command does not get built/installed in /usr/obj/usr/src.2.2/src/tmp/usr/bin. Yes, I started the build, and then snuck it in. It is still running but seems much better. BTW, on normal days, I do not destroy the whole world. I just run cvsup a couple of times to make sure I am current, do cvs update -P -d and make world. The difference in reliability and predictability of the process is not very visible to me. Please help me learn how to do it correctly. Simon From owner-freebsd-stable Sat Aug 9 02:59:48 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA17215 for stable-outgoing; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 02:59:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vinyl.quickweb.com (vinyl.quickweb.com [206.222.77.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA17210 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 02:59:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from mark@localhost) by vinyl.quickweb.com (8.8.5/8.6.12) id FAA07297; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 05:59:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19970809055943.03838@vinyl.quickweb.com> Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 05:59:43 -0400 From: Mark Mayo To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Mark Mayo , freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version References: <19970808014355.44693@vinyl.quickweb.com> <29020.871117473@time.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.81e In-Reply-To: <29020.871117473@time.cdrom.com>; from Jordan K. Hubbard on Sat, Aug 09, 1997 at 02:04:33AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, Aug 09, 1997 at 02:04:33AM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > Communicator may have a pretty interface, but it's a behemouth, > > resource eating, system crashing, poor performing monster. Surely they > > can do better... > > Yeah, but why complain to us? We can't do anything about it! :-) > > Seriously, this all looks like material which ought to be directed at > Netscape tech support if it's to have any effect. Chris McAffee is, I > believe, the contact guy there for the FreeBSD port. Ahh!! A name! Great! I've been mailing all the addresses I could find at Netscape asking who to send FreeBSD bug reports to. So far no-one has been able to point me in the right direction (although I was warned by one kind sole at Netscape that "BSD is not for free" and I should not be pirating software and mailing them to complain! Wow.) FWIW, even when I was a DevEdge member for 2 years, getting feedback from Netscape about a bug report I sent in never happened. They just seemed to get sucked into a great void, whether or not anybody ever read them I never know (there was even a huge flame like uproar on the Netscape private developers newgroups at the time about the lack of response..). I'll see if I can track down Chris McAffee's email address and send all my bitching and complaing to him. ;-) -Mark > > Jordan -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mark Mayo mark@quickweb.com RingZero Comp. http://vinyl.quickweb.com/mark finger mark@quickweb.com for my PGP key and GCS code ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- University degrees are a bit like adultery: you may not want to get involved with that sort of thing, but you don't want to be thought incapable. -Sir Peter Imbert From owner-freebsd-stable Sat Aug 9 04:05:16 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id EAA20524 for stable-outgoing; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 04:05:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pegasus.com (pegasus.com [206.127.225.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id EAA20517 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 04:05:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pegasus.com (8.6.8/PEGASUS-2.2) id BAA09230; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 01:04:33 -1000 Date: Sat, 9 Aug 1997 01:04:33 -1000 From: richard@pegasus.com (Richard Foulk) Message-Id: <199708091104.BAA09230@pegasus.com> In-Reply-To: Arjan de Vet "Re: Netscape native version" (Aug 9, 1:31am) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92) To: Arjan de Vet , freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netscape native version Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk } } I have another strange problem. When I start Netscape 4.02b7 for the first } time and accept the license everything goes fine. When I exit Netscape and } restart it again it starts burning away the CPU. The 'solution' I found was } to remove the license line in preferences.js and then it works again. } Check out Netscape's Beta Central to report bugs and help them turn this thing into a solid product. http://home.netscape.com/eng/beta_central/index.html Richard From owner-freebsd-stable Sat Aug 9 10:07:18 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA02434 for stable-outgoing; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 10:07:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from as5200-port-254.no.neosoft.com (as5200-port-254.no.neosoft.com [206.27.167.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA02426 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 10:07:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from conrads@localhost) by as5200-port-254.no.neosoft.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) id MAA02489; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 12:03:56 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.2-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199708070929.KAA00638@hawk.gnome.co.uk> Date: Sat, 09 Aug 1997 12:03:51 -0500 (CDT) Organization: NeoSoft, Inc. From: Conrad Sabatier To: Chris Stenton Subject: Re: /kernel: file: table is full Cc: stable@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Have you tried increasing maxusers? On 07-Aug-97 Chris Stenton wrote: > >I've just been trying the new Netscape 4 for FreeBSD on my 2.2-stable >machine >and >got the following error in the log file. > >Aug 7 09:41:53 hawk syslogd: /dev/console: Too many open files in system: >Too >many open files in system >Aug 7 09:41:53 hawk syslogd: /var/run/utmp: Too many open files in system >Aug 7 09:41:53 hawk syslogd: /var/run/utmp: Too many open files in system >Aug 7 09:41:53 hawk /kernel: file: table is full > >I have the following options set in the kernel > >options "CHILD_MAX=512" >options "OPEN_MAX=512" > > >Its a pretty nasty error as the hard disk sounds like someone got into the >system and started doing an rm -r /. This fear is reinforced when you >can't >run >any more processes to find out what is going on. All you can do is hit the >reset button and wait to see whats left of your OS. When you find its >still >there you go and close the curtains and have a lie down :-) > > >Chris -- Conrad Sabatier http://www.neosoft.com/~conrads/ From owner-freebsd-stable Sat Aug 9 10:10:17 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA02654 for stable-outgoing; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 10:10:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (austin.polstra.com [206.213.73.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA02649 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 10:10:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from austin.polstra.com (jdp@localhost) by austin.polstra.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA12784; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 10:10:11 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199708091710.KAA12784@austin.polstra.com> To: Simon Shapiro cc: stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: broked stable In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 09 Aug 1997 02:43:52 PDT." Date: Sat, 09 Aug 1997 10:10:11 -0700 From: John Polstra Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > please point to me (yes, again...) the flaw in my procedure: > > > My cvsup file: > > *default base=/usr/local/etc/cvsup > *default prefix=/Archives/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-CVS > *default release=cvs > *default host=sup.FreeBSD.org "sup.freebsd.org" works currently, but it's an obsolescent hostname. I'd suggest using the equivalent "cvsup2.freebsd.org" instead. > *default hostbase=/home This line is waaaaay obsolete. It's ignored, so you might as well get rid of it. I also noticed from the server logs that you're 1 revision behind in your CVSup client. Generally I try to make new revisions better in some way than old ones. :-) > My cvsup command line: > > cd /usr/local/etc/cvsup > rm -rf sup WHOA! Why on earth are you doing that?! You are _guaranteeing_ that files removed from the repository won't get removed on your own system. There's no telling how much extra cruft you have lying around as a result. > Then I do : > > rm -rf /usr/src/2.2/src > rm -rf /usr/obj/usr > cd /usr/src/2.2 > cvs checkout -rRELENG_2_2 src > cd .. > ln -s /usr/src/2.2/src/* . What's the point of creating all those links in the parent directory? Never mind, I probably don't want to know. :-) > It must be a flawed procedure because it works only 60% of the > time. Different days produce different errors (no joke). Monday, > it was an html file with the wrong format. Turns out to be a 3.0 > file that somehow ended up in the 2.2 tree. Erm ... have you run fsck lately? Have you been mounting your disks async? > Today, the make depend part of make world blows up because the tty > command does not get built/installed in > /usr/obj/usr/src.2.2/src/tmp/usr/bin. Yes, I started the build, > and then snuck it in. You can "sneak things in" and get away with it sometimes, but it makes it virtually impossible for anybody else to help with whatever mysterious problems crop up. > BTW, on normal days, I do not destroy the whole world. I just run > cvsup a couple of times to make sure I am current, do cvs update > -P -d and make world. I would also add "-r RELENG_2_2" even though the manual says you don't have to. There have been credible reports that it makes a difference. > The difference in reliability and predictability of the process is > not very visible to me. Right. You shouldn't ever have to destroy your src tree and do a full checkout. A cvs update should be all you need. I don't know what's causing your problems, but your repository almost certainly has some extra files in it, because of your "rm -rf sup" command. There is no easy way to get rid of them or find out what they are except by running find|sort on a good repository and on your own, and comparing the lists. Or delete your whole repository and fetch it again. :-O There is also some possibility that your problems could be explained by corrupted filesystems. Sorry, that's all I have to offer. John -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth From owner-freebsd-stable Sat Aug 9 20:00:26 1997 Return-Path: Received: (from root@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA28611 for stable-outgoing; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 20:00:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sendero-ppp.i-connect.net (sendero-ppp.i-Connect.Net [206.190.143.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA28601 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 1997 20:00:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 5483 invoked by uid 1000); 10 Aug 1997 03:00:12 -0000 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.2-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199708091710.KAA12784@austin.polstra.com> Date: Sat, 09 Aug 1997 20:00:12 -0700 (PDT) Organization: Atlas Telecom From: Simon Shapiro To: John Polstra Subject: Re: broked stable Cc: stable@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-stable@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi John Polstra; On 09-Aug-97 you wrote: > > please point to me (yes, again...) the flaw in my procedure: > > > > > > My cvsup file: > > > > *default base=/usr/local/etc/cvsup > > *default prefix=/Archives/FreeBSD/FreeBSD-CVS > > *default release=cvs > > *default host=sup.FreeBSD.org > > "sup.freebsd.org" works currently, but it's an obsolescent hostname. > I'd suggest using the equivalent "cvsup2.freebsd.org" instead. Changed. Will that change the contents of the archive? :-) Do you want another mirror? I have a host I could put to the task, on a T1 with excellent connectivity. > > *default hostbase=/home > > This line is waaaaay obsolete. It's ignored, so you might as well > get rid of it. Gone. > I also noticed from the server logs that you're 1 revision behind in > your CVSup client. Generally I try to make new revisions better in > some way than old ones. :-) Done. Trying to track all these pieces is a full time job. > > My cvsup command line: > > > > cd /usr/local/etc/cvsup > > rm -rf sup > > WHOA! Why on earth are you doing that?! You are _guaranteeing_ > that files removed from the repository won't get removed on your own > system. There's no telling how much extra cruft you have lying > around as a result. I forgot to add a rm -rf on the archive itself. This is my version of a reset button. When things go crazy and all i get is ``doesn't happen to me, must be you'', I believe that and make shure that my ``me'' is as pristine as possible. I know it is destructive and wasteful. but three repeated failure indicate a problem. > > Then I do : > > > > rm -rf /usr/src/2.2/src > > rm -rf /usr/obj/usr > > cd /usr/src/2.2 > > cvs checkout -rRELENG_2_2 src > > cd .. > > ln -s /usr/src/2.2/src/* . > > What's the point of creating all those links in the parent > directory? Never mind, I probably don't want to know. :-) Simple. I can have multiple trees compiled this way. I have a FreeBSD tree which produces a ``stock'' release. An Atlas tree that contains local, employer's configuration, a Test tree that includes recent checkouts, a Development tree that contains all my, unchecked-in changes, etc. ``cd /usr/src; rm *; ln -s ProperTree/* .'' allows us to build any tree we want. Having /usr/src on a Raid5 filesystem, and /usr/obj on a RAID-0 also speeds things up nicely while providing a very safe and reproducable environment. BTW, the CVS tree is on another filesystem. So is the local RCS, so is the local CVS. All we backup is the RCS, and the CVS. The entire system is easily reprodcable this way. SysV was easier in that regard. All pathnames have ${ROOT} prefixing them, along with ${CPU} and ${ARCH} where appropriate. Quick change to these would build almost any release on any platform. > > It must be a flawed procedure because it works only 60% of the > > time. Different days produce different errors (no joke). Monday, > > it was an html file with the wrong format. Turns out to be a 3.0 > > file that somehow ended up in the 2.2 tree. > > Erm ... have you run fsck lately? Have you been mounting your disks > async? Yup. Clean as a whistle. Never. I am stupid, not sucidal :-) > > Today, the make depend part of make world blows up because the tty > > command does not get built/installed in > > /usr/obj/usr/src.2.2/src/tmp/usr/bin. Yes, I started the build, > > and then snuck it in. > > You can "sneak things in" and get away with it sometimes, but it > makes it virtually impossible for anybody else to help with whatever > mysterious problems crop up. I know that. I was faced with a broken process and wanted to verify that the ``tty: not found'' is the ONLY problem. It is. The PATH is set to a number of /usr/obj/where_the_source_tree_is/tmp places which get populated. The tty command is NOT shown to be made anywhere in the make output and therefore not installed there. It broke the build. Sneaking it in (which IS adirty trick) both confirmed it and allowed the build to complete. > > BTW, on normal days, I do not destroy the whole world. I just run > > cvsup a couple of times to make sure I am current, do cvs update > > -P -d and make world. > > I would also add "-r RELENG_2_2" even though the manual says you > don't have to. There have been credible reports that it makes a > difference. Yes it makes a difference. Not all the time. Sometimes. The source tree is too complex for me to try and decypher, but you are welcome to login and brouse. > > The difference in reliability and predictability of the process is > > not very visible to me. > > Right. You shouldn't ever have to destroy your src tree and do a > full checkout. A cvs update should be all you need. I agree with ``should not '' and have to sadly report that it sometimes ``does''. This time it did not, but twice before, this was all that worked. > I don't know what's causing your problems, but your repository > almost certainly has some extra files in it, because of your "rm -rf > sup" command. There is no easy way to get rid of them or find out > what they are except by running find|sort on a good repository and on > your own, and comparing the lists. Or delete your whole repository > and fetch it again. :-O I did, yesterday. Also deleted the entire 2.2 source tree. The tty problem is still there. Not on current though. Current missed a file that showed up later. > There is also some possibility that your problems could be explained > by corrupted filesystems. Nothing fsck can tell me. There is no detected corruption from access or use, either. > Sorry, that's all I have to offer. Which is a lot. Thanx! Simon