From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 11: 4:56 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.sentex.ca (smtp1.sentex.ca [199.212.134.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39BC837B71A for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 11:04:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) Received: from chimp.simianscience.com (cage.simianscience.com [64.7.134.1]) by smtp1.sentex.ca (8.11.2/8.11.1) with SMTP id f2BJ3TV07740; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 14:04:50 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) From: Mike Tancsa To: alex@aspenworks.com ("Alex Huppenthal") Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ATM - setting a bit rate Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 14:03:29 -0500 Message-ID: <7sinatgc5hmk7o2oor6tri91q1qal769fu@4ax.com> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On 8 Mar 2001 19:19:27 -0500, in sentex.lists.freebsd.isp you wrote: >has anyone successfully set the ATM bit rate for a specific PVC or for = that >matter the entire ATM PCI card? > >clues appreciated. Have a look at altq. If you are using the Adaptec or Efficient cards, it might be able to help you out. http://www.csl.sony.co.jp/person/kjc/kjc/software.html#ALTQ ---Mike Mike Tancsa (mdtancsa@sentex.net) =09 Sentex Communications Corp, =09 Waterloo, Ontario, Canada "Given enough time, 100 monkeys on 100 routers=20 could setup a national IP network." (KDW2) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 11: 8:32 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from smtp1.sentex.ca (smtp1.sentex.ca [199.212.134.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCEC337B718 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 11:08:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) Received: from chimp.simianscience.com (cage.simianscience.com [64.7.134.1]) by smtp1.sentex.ca (8.11.2/8.11.1) with SMTP id f2BJ8CV08219; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 14:08:14 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from mike@sentex.net) From: Mike Tancsa To: rowan@sensation.net.au (Rowan Crowe) Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD 4.2-RELEASE/PHP 4.04pl1/Apache 1.3.17 problems Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 14:08:12 -0500 Message-ID: <73jnat0bbmf5cj5oi2iu2qk60mc7nrnfbk@4ax.com> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On 9 Mar 2001 14:18:04 -0500, in sentex.lists.freebsd.isp you wrote: >for 30 minutes and what caused it to come good again, it may have been >someone rebooting it. What was the reboot message ? Try and provide as much information as possible... The more info you provide, the better than chances someone = can make useful suggestions. Otherwise, its a total guessing game. i.e. hardware config, output of uname -a, message on the screen when it = reboots etc... > > >Is 4.2-RELEASE considered stable enough for production use? I thought it Yes, very much so. 4.3R is coming out in a few days as well. The main thing to consider for 4.2 is that there are a number of applications that have security advisories such as BIND. ---Mike Mike Tancsa (mdtancsa@sentex.net) =09 Sentex Communications Corp, =09 Waterloo, Ontario, Canada "Given enough time, 100 monkeys on 100 routers=20 could setup a national IP network." (KDW2) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 13:35: 8 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from adsl-63-201-55-220.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net (adsl-63-201-55-220.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.201.55.220]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1A6B37B718 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:35:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jwgray@netbox.com) Received: from localhost (jwgray@localhost) by adsl-63-201-55-220.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA96326; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:32:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jwgray@netbox.com) X-Authentication-Warning: adsl-63-201-55-220.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net: jwgray owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:32:22 -0800 (PST) From: Jeff Gray X-Sender: jwgray@adsl-63-201-55-220.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Cc: Jeff Gray Subject: co-location model Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org In thinking about the co-location model of many machines, whether 1U or bigger, one realizes that lots of space, lots of energy [I am writing from California], lots of iron and other materials are inefficiently consumed. Let alone late night trips to the server farm. Instead of co-location with lots of physical servers if someone were to setup a mainframe that provided, -multiple OS configurations and alternatives -centralized hardware management -centralized security management on the mainframe -flexible, reliable, scalable storage then space, energy, raw materials and I suspect major costs could be minimized. Late night trips to the server could be eliminated! My two questions. -Is this a reasonable long term model for ISPs and or server farms? -Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of physical space? [I say mainframe only to emphasize extreme hardware and software reliability]. Interested to hear what the community thinks. Thanks jeff To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 13:36:28 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from aspenworks.com (aspenworks.com [192.94.236.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59B5237B725 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:36:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from alex@aspenworks.com) Received: from d7k (a-mcg.aspn.net [206.168.156.207]) by aspenworks.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA00510 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 14:36:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from alex@aspenworks.com) Message-ID: <004101c0aa73$4bdefdc0$1800a8c0@d7k> From: "Alex Huppenthal" To: Subject: ATM and traffic shaping Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 14:36:12 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org It turns out that traffic shaping for ATM means being able to delay each cell to a specific egress ('transmit' in english) rate. If anyone knows how to change all packet sizes to be < 48 bytes (cell header takes 5), and delay the delivery of each packet to the HARP / Fore card driver, that would be most miraculous. It would mean that it's possible to setup Classical IP over ATM on FreeBSD and adjust each PVC by associating an IP address with it, (unfortuately, just the destination IP address), and deliver ATM-shaped traffic. This would then conform to the network's expectation for offered traffic, and allow us ATM/IP network designers to use FreeBSD in the design. There's another fix, instead of FreeBSD hosting an ATM port at OC3 rates, it could host some T1 muxed thing which allows the local interface to throttle the emitted cells to some rate. This.. would suck.. since an OC3 card is $800 off the shelf and it plugs and plays nicely on the physical level with Lucent ATM switches. No $2000 DS3 CSU, and no $3000 HSSI card required. If we can't figure out a fix of the FreeBSD Harp stack or add an ioctl to the 'atm' command that would set the Fore card appropriately per PVC.. we may be forced (*choke choke* cough-sputter) to use the working Linux ATM code. I've always wondered what that kernel/environment looked like anyway.. ;-) Cheers! -Alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 13:40:37 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from anaconda.acceleratedweb.net (anaconda.acceleratedweb.net [209.51.164.130]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 0DB1537B718 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:40:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from simon@optinet.com) Received: (qmail 93927 invoked by uid 106); 11 Mar 2001 21:50:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sharky) (66.65.36.21) by anaconda.acceleratedweb.net with SMTP; 11 Mar 2001 21:50:32 -0000 From: "Simon" To: "freebsd-isp@freebsd.org" , "Jeff Gray" Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 16:44:31 -0500 Reply-To: "Simon" X-Mailer: PMMail 2000 Professional (2.10.2010) For Windows 2000 (5.0.2195) In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: co-location model Message-Id: <20010311214033.0DB1537B718@hub.freebsd.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Can you setup a mainframe to run multiple instances of FreeBSD? i really doubt it... and what if that single mainframe fails instead of few standalone servers? i'd probably stay away from something like that. -Simon On Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:32:22 -0800 (PST), Jeff Gray wrote: >In thinking about the co-location model of many machines, whether 1U or >bigger, one realizes that lots of space, lots of energy [I am writing from >California], lots of iron and other materials are inefficiently consumed. >Let alone late night trips to the server farm. > >Instead of co-location with lots of physical servers if someone were to setup >a mainframe that provided, > -multiple OS configurations and alternatives > -centralized hardware management > -centralized security management on the mainframe > -flexible, reliable, scalable storage > >then space, energy, raw materials and I suspect major costs could be >minimized. Late night trips to the server could be eliminated! > >My two questions. >-Is this a reasonable long term model for ISPs and or server farms? > >-Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of >physical space? > > >[I say mainframe only to emphasize extreme hardware and software >reliability]. > >Interested to hear what the community thinks. > >Thanks >jeff > > > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 14:16:33 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from ns.internet.dk (ns.internet.dk [194.19.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CECD37B719 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 14:16:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by ns.internet.dk (8.11.2/8.11.2) id f2BMGSA49679 for freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG.AVP; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 23:16:28 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by ns.internet.dk (8.11.2/8.11.2) with UUCP id f2BMGRT49665; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 23:16:27 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: from gina (dhcp0.neland.dk [192.168.5.100]) by arnold.neland.dk (8.11.2/8.11.0) with SMTP id f2BMFxj80585; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 23:16:03 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Message-ID: <019501c0aa79$0e73aac0$6405a8c0@neland.dk> Reply-To: "Leif Neland" From: "Leif Neland" To: "Simon" , "freebsd-isp@freebsd.org" , "Jeff Gray" References: <20010311214033.0DB1537B718@hub.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: co-location model Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 23:17:19 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from base64 to 8bit by ns.internet.dk id f2BMGRT49665 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I'm afraid to tell that it can be done with Linux... http://slashdot.org/articles/00/08/01/1226247.shtml In the lab, 41500 virtual linux'es has been run simultaneously under VMS on an IBM S/390. And mainframes don't fail. Ever. (Well, almost never (G&S: Pinafore)) Leif ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon" To: "freebsd-isp@freebsd.org" ; "Jeff Gray" Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2001 10:44 PM Subject: Re: co-location model > Can you setup a mainframe to run multiple instances of FreeBSD? i really doubt it... and what if that single mainframe fails > instead of few standalone servers? i'd probably stay away from something like that. > > -Simon > > On Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:32:22 -0800 (PST), Jeff Gray wrote: > > >In thinking about the co-location model of many machines, whether 1U or > >bigger, one realizes that lots of space, lots of energy [I am writing from > >California], lots of iron and other materials are inefficiently consumed. > >Let alone late night trips to the server farm. > > > >Instead of co-location with lots of physical servers if someone were to setup > >a mainframe that provided, > > -multiple OS configurations and alternatives > > -centralized hardware management > > -centralized security management on the mainframe > > -flexible, reliable, scalable storage > > > >then space, energy, raw materials and I suspect major costs could be > >minimized. Late night trips to the server could be eliminated! > > > >My two questions. > >-Is this a reasonable long term model for ISPs and or server farms? > > > >-Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of > >physical space? > > > > > >[I say mainframe only to emphasize extreme hardware and software > >reliability]. > > > >Interested to hear what the community thinks. > > > >Thanks > >jeff > > > > > > > > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > >with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 14:24:24 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from inet03.citec.qld.gov.au (inet03.citec.qld.gov.au [203.5.10.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78D7E37B718 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 14:24:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sgcccdc@citec.qld.gov.au) Received: by inet03.citec.qld.gov.au; id IAA19974; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 08:24:04 +1000 (EST) Received: from guru.citec.qld.gov.au( 147.132.21.132) by inet03.citec.qld.gov.au via smap (V2.0) id xma018960; Mon, 12 Mar 01 08:23:29 +1000 Received: from localhost (sgcccdc@localhost) by guru.citec.qld.gov.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA71070; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 08:23:29 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from sgcccdc@citec.qld.gov.au) X-Authentication-Warning: guru.citec.qld.gov.au: sgcccdc owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 08:23:28 +1000 (EST) From: Colin Campbell To: Simon Cc: "freebsd-isp@freebsd.org" , Jeff Gray Subject: Re: co-location model In-Reply-To: <20010311214033.0DB1537B718@hub.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hi, On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Simon wrote: > Can you setup a mainframe to run multiple instances of FreeBSD? i > really doubt it... and what if that single mainframe fails instead of > few standalone servers? i'd probably stay away from something like > that. IBM claim to have had 90,000+ instances of Linux running under VM on one machine. Whether they were doing anything useful is another matter :-) Don't know how big the machine was either. Colin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 14:57:10 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from bsdie.rwsystems.net (bsdie.rwsystems.net [209.197.223.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 574D437B71A for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 14:57:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jwyatt@rwsystems.net) Received: from bsdie.rwsystems.net([209.197.223.2]) (1585 bytes) by bsdie.rwsystems.net via sendmail with P:esmtp/R:bind_hosts/T:inet_zone_bind_smtp (sender: ) id for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 16:56:44 -0600 (CST) (Smail-3.2.0.111 2000-Feb-17 #1 built 2000-Jun-25) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 16:56:44 -0600 (CST) From: James Wyatt To: Leif Neland Cc: Simon , "freebsd-isp@freebsd.org" , Jeff Gray Subject: Re: co-location model In-Reply-To: <019501c0aa79$0e73aac0$6405a8c0@neland.dk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Leif Neland wrote: > I'm afraid to tell that it can be done with Linux... > > http://slashdot.org/articles/00/08/01/1226247.shtml Sure can and the mainframe systems folks I work with have Linux posters in their cubes now! Some of the NT engineers have been converted as well. > > In the lab, 41500 virtual linux'es has been run simultaneously under VMS on an IBM S/390. > > And mainframes don't fail. Ever. (Well, almost never (G&S: Pinafore)) Anything fails, but most mainframe components can be more easily engineered to provide fault-tolerance. My primary employer has several mainframes "custered" with Sysplex for about a half-dozen large hosts. There have been failures and they have been memorable, but very few. Your largest problem might be keeping your technical talent because you will likely learn critical lessons starting up that others need solving. - Jy@ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 15:13:36 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from bilver.wjv.com (dhcp-1-6.n01.orldfl01.us.ra.verio.net [157.238.210.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DA0637B719 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 15:13:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bill@bilver.wjv.com) Received: (from bill@localhost) by bilver.wjv.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA29314; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:13:21 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from bill) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:13:12 -0500 From: Bill Vermillion To: jwgray@netbox.com Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: co-location model Message-ID: <20010311181311.A29281@wjv.com> Reply-To: bv@bilver.wjv.com References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from jwgray@netbox.com on Sun, Mar 11, 2001 at 01:32:22PM -0800 Organization: W.J.Vermillion / Orlando - Winter Park Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, Mar 11, 2001 at 01:32:22PM -0800, Jeff Gray thus spoke: > In thinking about the co-location model of many machines, whether > 1U or bigger, one realizes that lots of space, lots of energy [I > am writing from California], lots of iron and other materials are > inefficiently consumed. Let alone late night trips to the server > farm. > > Instead of co-location with lots of physical servers if someone > were to setup a mainframe that provided, > -multiple OS configurations and alternatives > -centralized hardware management > -centralized security management on the mainframe > -flexible, reliable, scalable storage > then space, energy, raw materials and I suspect major costs could be > minimized. Late night trips to the server could be eliminated! > My two questions. > -Is this a reasonable long term model for ISPs and or server farms? > -Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of > physical space? IBM is selling a solutions like this for Linux. Their example shows $1.2million for an S390 [some new ??-server name] running and with 2500 instances of Linux. It's a much smaller footprint than 2500 machines and surely a lot less of a hassle to wire up. They advertise at basically five 9s - 5 minutes downtime per year - with onsite service if needed. I beleiver I read that Sendmail, Inc. has one of these installed. > [I say mainframe only to emphasize extreme hardware and software > reliability]. That's how IBM is pushing their iron. Bill -- Bill Vermillion - bv @ wjv . com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 16:17:53 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.213.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E144337B718 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 16:17:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tom@sdf.com) Received: from tom (helo=localhost) by misery.sdf.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14cG0V-0006Ss-00; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 16:16:15 -0800 Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 16:16:01 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Samplonius To: Leif Neland Cc: Simon , "freebsd-isp@freebsd.org" , Jeff Gray Subject: Re: co-location model In-Reply-To: <019501c0aa79$0e73aac0$6405a8c0@neland.dk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Leif Neland wrote: > I'm afraid to tell that it can be done with Linux... > > http://slashdot.org/articles/00/08/01/1226247.shtml > > In the lab, 41500 virtual linux'es has been run simultaneously under > VMS on an IBM S/390. Wrong OS. Probably VM, though many of the OSes for OS390 series machines can support virtualization. VMS is Dec/Compaq's VAX/Alpha OS. Tom To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 16:21:24 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from ns.internet.dk (ns.internet.dk [194.19.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4900E37B718 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 16:21:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by ns.internet.dk (8.11.2/8.11.2) id f2C0LJ916828 for freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG.AVP; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 01:21:19 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by ns.internet.dk (8.11.2/8.11.2) with UUCP id f2C0LJh16822 for freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 01:21:19 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: from gina (dhcp0.neland.dk [192.168.5.100]) by arnold.neland.dk (8.11.2/8.11.0) with SMTP id f2C0KFj80875 for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 01:20:17 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Message-ID: <020101c0aa8a$634a5b00$6405a8c0@neland.dk> Reply-To: "Leif Neland" From: "Leif Neland" To: Subject: OT: Procmail recipy for pgp decoding. Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 01:21:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from base64 to 8bit by ns.internet.dk id f2C0LJh16822 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I often read my mail in Outlook Express from my FreeBSD mailserver. Some messages are pgp-signed: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="tThc/1wpZn/ma/RB" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i Outlook Express shows a blank message, with two attachments: a .txt containing the body of the message and a .dat containing pgp-data. As I don't have the source for Outlook Express online at the moment, is it possible for a procmail recipy to rewrite the message so OE can understand it? Leif To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 16:22:34 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from sasami.jurai.net (sasami.jurai.net [64.0.106.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 078F637B71A for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 16:22:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from scanner@jurai.net) Received: from localhost (scanner@localhost) by sasami.jurai.net (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA08980; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 19:21:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 19:21:35 -0500 (EST) From: To: Tom Samplonius Cc: Leif Neland , Simon , "freebsd-isp@freebsd.org" , Jeff Gray Subject: Re: co-location model In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Tom Samplonius wrote: > > In the lab, 41500 virtual linux'es has been run simultaneously under > > VMS on an IBM S/390. > > Wrong OS. Probably VM, though many of the OSes for OS390 series > machines can support virtualization. VMS is Dec/Compaq's VAX/Alpha OS. Just a curious inquiry. Has anyone done something like this with jail() out of pure boredom to see how many copies of a linux app running under linux compat they could do? :-) It would be kind of neat to see how many linux compat jails one could run. ============================================================================= -Chris Watson (316) 326-3862 | FreeBSD Consultant, FreeBSD Geek Work: scanner@jurai.net | Open Systems Inc., Wellington, Kansas Home: scanner@deceptively.shady.org | http://open-systems.net ============================================================================= WINDOWS: "Where do you want to go today?" LINUX: "Where do you want to go tommorow?" BSD: "Are you guys coming or what?" ============================================================================= irc.openprojects.net #FreeBSD -Join the revolution! ICQ: 20016186 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 18:18:34 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.213.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FB9637B71A for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:18:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tom@sdf.com) Received: from tom (helo=localhost) by misery.sdf.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14cHu2-0006ZY-00; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:17:42 -0800 Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:17:20 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Samplonius To: Alex Huppenthal Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: ATM and traffic shaping In-Reply-To: <004101c0aa73$4bdefdc0$1800a8c0@d7k> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Alex Huppenthal wrote: > It turns out that traffic shaping for ATM means being able to delay each > cell to a specific egress ('transmit' in english) rate. Yes, exactly. And many switches are configured to drop non-conforming cells (cells that exceed the allowable cell-per-second rate). I wouldn't recommend that anyone attempt ATM without understanding all the service categories and parameters. However, it somewhat depends on the category of service that you receive. There are lots of possibilities: ubr, cbr, rt-vbr, nrt-vbr, and vbr. The maximum cell rate isn't always a simple thing, as they interact with the mcr, pcr, mbs, and scr parameters. Since you are using your own ATM switch, I'm surprised that you can't let your switch buffer cells for you, rather than discard them. For instance, if your ATM provider has given you a cbr service with 10K cells/second rate, just let FreeBSD run ubr into the switch. But it really depends on your ATM service provider. I have a very expensive switch with an ATM card and multiple ethernet ports. My ATM service provider is providing an abr with a pcr of 10Mbps service. Their switch will buffer and pace out traffic for me, so I have the link setup as ubr on my end. In fact, it was the configuration they recommended. Tom To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 18:28:43 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from dt051n37.san.rr.com (dt051n37.san.rr.com [204.210.32.55]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 123EC37B719 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:28:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from DougB@FreeBSD.org) Received: from FreeBSD.org (Studded@master [10.0.0.2]) by dt051n37.san.rr.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA93033; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:28:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from DougB@FreeBSD.org) Message-ID: <3AAC3451.CC33E3BF@FreeBSD.org> Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:28:33 -0800 From: Doug Barton Organization: Triborough Bridge & Tunnel Authority X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Hyunseog Ryu Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: BIND 9.1.1rc2 and FreeBSD 4.2-stable References: <3A9EDD99.7DC1B1CE@staff.norlight.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org For future reference you'll get better results asking on freebsd-questions. Hyunseog Ryu wrote: > > Hi, folks > > I have questions for BIND version 9.1.1rc2. There are lots of known bugs in 9.1.1rc1,2,3. Please upgrade to rc4 (in the ports) and try again. Good luck, Doug -- Perhaps the greatest damage the American system of education has done to its children is to teach them that their opinions are relevant simply because they are their opinions. Do YOU Yahoo!? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 19:16:32 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from workhorse.iMach.com (workhorse.iMach.com [206.127.77.89]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D09337B719 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 19:16:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from forrestc@imach.com) Received: from localhost (forrestc@localhost) by workhorse.iMach.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA10686; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 20:06:23 -0700 (MST) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 20:06:22 -0700 (MST) From: "Forrest W. Christian" To: Jeff Gray Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: co-location model In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Have you looked at jail? With jail you can effectively create numerous machines in one physical machine. I am planning on doing this as an entry level option in our colo space. man jail On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Jeff Gray wrote: > Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:32:22 -0800 (PST) > From: Jeff Gray > To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG > Cc: Jeff Gray > Subject: co-location model > > In thinking about the co-location model of many machines, whether 1U or > bigger, one realizes that lots of space, lots of energy [I am writing from > California], lots of iron and other materials are inefficiently consumed. > Let alone late night trips to the server farm. > > Instead of co-location with lots of physical servers if someone were to setup > a mainframe that provided, > -multiple OS configurations and alternatives > -centralized hardware management > -centralized security management on the mainframe > -flexible, reliable, scalable storage > > then space, energy, raw materials and I suspect major costs could be > minimized. Late night trips to the server could be eliminated! > > My two questions. > -Is this a reasonable long term model for ISPs and or server farms? > > -Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of > physical space? > > > [I say mainframe only to emphasize extreme hardware and software > reliability]. > > Interested to hear what the community thinks. > > Thanks > jeff > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > - Forrest W. Christian (forrestc@imach.com) AC7DE ---------------------------------------------------------------------- iMach, Ltd., P.O. Box 5749, Helena, MT 59604 http://www.imach.com Solutions for your high-tech problems. (406)-442-6648 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 19:29:50 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from adsl-63-201-55-220.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net (adsl-63-201-55-220.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.201.55.220]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 708F237B719 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 19:29:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jwgray@netbox.com) Received: from localhost (jwgray@localhost) by adsl-63-201-55-220.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA97123; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 19:26:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jwgray@netbox.com) X-Authentication-Warning: adsl-63-201-55-220.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net: jwgray owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 19:26:57 -0800 (PST) From: Jeff Gray X-Sender: jwgray@adsl-63-201-55-220.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net To: "Forrest W. Christian" Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: co-location model In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org jail is a good approach for a different problem. Not sure I would want to run hundreds of virtual jail servers on one intel type box. jail does not solve the opportunity of taking 20 machines from a company and replacing it with a 'better' model and then acting as their co-location service manager. The mainframe suggestion/query is to provide real reliability, real fault tolerance, real hardware efficiency [jail does this], real security by a well designed mainframe OS management system, real scalability of user resources like storage space. Lots of good comments so far but, to date, no direct response to my two questions :-) My two questions. -Is this a reasonable long term model for ISPs and or server farms? -Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of physical space? Jeff On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Forrest W. Christian wrote: > Have you looked at jail? > > With jail you can effectively create numerous machines in one physical > machine. I am planning on doing this as an entry level option in our > colo space. > > man jail > > On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Jeff Gray wrote: > > > Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:32:22 -0800 (PST) > > From: Jeff Gray > > To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG > > Cc: Jeff Gray > > Subject: co-location model > > > > In thinking about the co-location model of many machines, whether 1U or > > bigger, one realizes that lots of space, lots of energy [I am writing from > > California], lots of iron and other materials are inefficiently consumed. > > Let alone late night trips to the server farm. > > > > Instead of co-location with lots of physical servers if someone were to setup > > a mainframe that provided, > > -multiple OS configurations and alternatives > > -centralized hardware management > > -centralized security management on the mainframe > > -flexible, reliable, scalable storage > > > > then space, energy, raw materials and I suspect major costs could be > > minimized. Late night trips to the server could be eliminated! > > > > My two questions. > > -Is this a reasonable long term model for ISPs and or server farms? > > > > -Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of > > physical space? > > > > > > [I say mainframe only to emphasize extreme hardware and software > > reliability]. > > > > Interested to hear what the community thinks. > > > > Thanks > > jeff > > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > > > > - Forrest W. Christian (forrestc@imach.com) AC7DE > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > iMach, Ltd., P.O. Box 5749, Helena, MT 59604 http://www.imach.com > Solutions for your high-tech problems. (406)-442-6648 > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 19:33:25 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from aspenworks.com (aspenworks.com [192.94.236.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD7E237B718 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 19:33:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from alex@aspenworks.com) Received: from ibmxeon (matrix.aspenworks.com [216.38.199.82]) by aspenworks.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA01868; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 20:33:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from alex@aspenworks.com) Message-ID: <002201c0aaa5$2ac56840$1900a8c0@aspenworks.com> From: "alex huppenthal" To: "Tom Samplonius" Cc: References: Subject: Re: ATM and traffic shaping Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 20:33:12 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Tom, Thanks for the response. I have a Lucent PSAX switch. I'll check to see if buffering is available. If it is, then a combination of IP throughput management plus buffering in the PSAX should work. Bursts of max-buf-len bytes will drop into the switch and the switch would pace the outbound cell rate. Just checked.. There is a bit of a problem, the PSAX DS3 card will not do traffic shaping. I'm screwed. I have a channelized DS3 also, but there's no way to configure it to make it clear channel, with traffic shaping. Yikes! I'm going to dump it all and call for IP over Sonet. Anyone know of dark fiber between Glenwood Springs, CO and Denver? :-) oh, there must be a way.. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Samplonius" To: "Alex Huppenthal" Cc: Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2001 7:17 PM Subject: Re: ATM and traffic shaping > > On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Alex Huppenthal wrote: > > > It turns out that traffic shaping for ATM means being able to delay each > > cell to a specific egress ('transmit' in english) rate. > > Yes, exactly. And many switches are configured to drop non-conforming > cells (cells that exceed the allowable cell-per-second rate). I wouldn't > recommend that anyone attempt ATM without understanding all the service > categories and parameters. > > However, it somewhat depends on the category of service that you > receive. There are lots of possibilities: ubr, cbr, rt-vbr, nrt-vbr, and > vbr. The maximum cell rate isn't always a simple thing, as they interact > with the mcr, pcr, mbs, and scr parameters. > > Since you are using your own ATM switch, I'm surprised that you can't > let your switch buffer cells for you, rather than discard them. For > instance, if your ATM provider has given you a cbr service with 10K > cells/second rate, just let FreeBSD run ubr into the switch. > > But it really depends on your ATM service provider. I have a very > expensive switch with an ATM card and multiple ethernet ports. My ATM > service provider is providing an abr with a pcr of 10Mbps service. Their > switch will buffer and pace out traffic for me, so I have the link setup > as ubr on my end. In fact, it was the configuration they recommended. > > Tom > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Sun Mar 11 20: 9:46 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from workhorse.iMach.com (workhorse.iMach.com [206.127.77.89]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7EA137B719 for ; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 20:09:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from forrestc@imach.com) Received: from localhost (forrestc@localhost) by workhorse.iMach.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA12005; Sun, 11 Mar 2001 20:59:43 -0700 (MST) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 20:59:43 -0700 (MST) From: "Forrest W. Christian" To: Jeff Gray Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: co-location model In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Let me address these points, one by one: > real reliability, If what you mean by this is what basically boils down to server uptime and availability, I think you will run into some difficulty in this group selling the fact that a mainframe is essentially more reliable than a well-designed intel platform running FreeBSD. I think that most of us never have downtime other than that caused by planning (hardware upgrades) or environmental (extended power failures, floods, etc.) causes. I sure can't remember the last time a server rebooted without me forcing it to. Every mainframe installation I've been around is definately subject to the same failures as I've described before. > real fault tolerance I think I probably need to have this better defined. I know of ways to do hot failover, high availibility raid, etc. etc. etc. under FreeBSD. is there anything specific that the mainframe provides which isn't what most of us think as the classic definition of fault tolerance. > real hardware efficiency [jail does this] > real security by a well designed mainframe OS management system, I've lumped these two together for one reason: Under freebsd, jail provides you a level of security. Yes, I realize you can get out of a jail. I think we could argue whether most Mainframe Installations isolate their users more or less than jail does. > real scalability of user resources like storage space. An example: ------------------------------------------------------------------------- 230-Welcome to ftp.cdrom.com, a service of Digital River, Inc. 230-There are currently 528 users out of 3000 possible. 230- 230-This machine is a Xeon/500 with 4GB of memory & 1/2 terabyte of RAID 5. 230-The operating system is FreeBSD. Should you wish to get your own copy of 230-FreeBSD, please visit http://www.freebsd.org for more information. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Define scalability. The above is scaled up there rather high. 4GB is the most we can go memory-wise right now. This is a restriction due to 32 bit addressing in most programs. FreeBSD could very easily access up to 8TB of memory on a 64bit machine, assuming that the hardware was up to the task. The maximum FILESYSTEM limit under freebsd is about 1TB. The filesystem is actually capable of up to 8 or 16TB but there are some internals which cause this to not be availble without some modifications. > -Is this a reasonable long term model for ISPs and or server farms? I think that this MIGHT be marketable to the right people. I know that there are a lot of management types out there which still love to hear the mainframe story line. I'm not sure how this could be marketable to say, the members of this list. > -Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of > physical space? Not aware of any, but who says they don't exist.. - Forrest W. Christian (forrestc@imach.com) AC7DE ---------------------------------------------------------------------- iMach, Ltd., P.O. Box 5749, Helena, MT 59604 http://www.imach.com Solutions for your high-tech problems. (406)-442-6648 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Mar 12 4:49:32 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from hawk-systems.com (hawk-systems.com [161.58.152.235]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0D0937B719 for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 04:49:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dave@hawk-systems.com) Received: from server0 (cr1032856-a.pr1.on.wave.home.com [24.112.146.66]) by hawk-systems.com (8.8.8) id FAA70215 for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 05:49:19 -0700 (MST) From: "Dave VanAuken" To: Subject: RE: co-location model Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 07:59:07 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org My only complaint about jail, is the storage overhead (about 200mb though I havn't really hacked off the non-essentials). i have not had enough "heavy" jails to see what sort of processor drain each causes... if i can get 20 jails per machine it is a profitable venture. that and the lack of real specific control from the host machine on the jail environments... some of these features are "forthcoming" supposidly. Dave -----Original Message----- From: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG [mailto:owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG]On Behalf Of Forrest W. Christian Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2001 10:06 PM To: Jeff Gray Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: co-location model Have you looked at jail? With jail you can effectively create numerous machines in one physical machine. I am planning on doing this as an entry level option in our colo space. man jail On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Jeff Gray wrote: > Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:32:22 -0800 (PST) > From: Jeff Gray > To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG > Cc: Jeff Gray > Subject: co-location model > > In thinking about the co-location model of many machines, whether 1U or > bigger, one realizes that lots of space, lots of energy [I am writing from > California], lots of iron and other materials are inefficiently consumed. > Let alone late night trips to the server farm. > > Instead of co-location with lots of physical servers if someone were to setup > a mainframe that provided, > -multiple OS configurations and alternatives > -centralized hardware management > -centralized security management on the mainframe > -flexible, reliable, scalable storage > > then space, energy, raw materials and I suspect major costs could be > minimized. Late night trips to the server could be eliminated! > > My two questions. > -Is this a reasonable long term model for ISPs and or server farms? > > -Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of > physical space? > > > [I say mainframe only to emphasize extreme hardware and software > reliability]. > > Interested to hear what the community thinks. > > Thanks > jeff > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > - Forrest W. Christian (forrestc@imach.com) AC7DE ---------------------------------------------------------------------- iMach, Ltd., P.O. Box 5749, Helena, MT 59604 http://www.imach.com Solutions for your high-tech problems. (406)-442-6648 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Mar 12 4:53:47 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mail.chartermi.net (060upc075.chartermi.net [24.213.60.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8F6F37B71A for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 04:53:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wrath@shianet.org) Received: from danrc ([24.213.24.167]) by mail.chartermi.net (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-71004U47242L33562S0V35) with SMTP id net for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 07:53:31 -0500 Message-ID: <003b01c0aaf3$7124b5e0$0101a8c0@fear.wrath.net> From: "Brian" To: References: Subject: Re: co-location model Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 07:53:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I'm with you 100%. I see my school buying overpriced Sun pieces of shit just because they don't know any better. They've got an Ultra10 workstation that is used for nonmajor computer science students. My desktop has more horsepower, and it only cost me $900 compared to their $6000. And my machine doesn't puke out when it gets tired. I think the real issue is space among everything else. If you reliable run multiple instances of an operating system on one larger machine instead of multiple machines with a single operating system, it'll save space. Imagine an ISP offering introductory cobalt raq's to their customers. You've got hundreds of these little machines filling up your racks, and most of them aren't even being used at 10%. With a "mainframe" you can have hundreds of "cobalt raqs" running in the space of the hundreds of cobalt raqs, many times over. However, I'd still stick with a bunch of cobalt raqs. When one of them dies, you yank it out of the rack and slap a new one in. Oh yeah, and I don't use any Cobalt machines. I'm just giving an example as to most colocator's suggested option for new customers. I'll be sticking with my P6DBE's and katmai's for a good time to come. brian@wrath.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Forrest W. Christian" To: "Jeff Gray" Cc: Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2001 10:59 PM Subject: Re: co-location model > Let me address these points, one by one: > > > real reliability, > > If what you mean by this is what basically boils down to server uptime and > availability, I think you will run into some difficulty in this group > selling the fact that a mainframe is essentially more reliable than a > well-designed intel platform running FreeBSD. > > I think that most of us never have downtime other than that caused by > planning (hardware upgrades) or environmental (extended power failures, > floods, etc.) causes. I sure can't remember the last time a server > rebooted without me forcing it to. > > Every mainframe installation I've been around is definately subject to the > same failures as I've described before. > > > real fault tolerance > > I think I probably need to have this better defined. I know of ways to > do hot failover, high availibility raid, etc. etc. etc. under FreeBSD. is > there anything specific that the mainframe provides which isn't what most > of us think as the classic definition of fault tolerance. > > > real hardware efficiency [jail does this] > > real security by a well designed mainframe OS management system, > > I've lumped these two together for one reason: > > Under freebsd, jail provides you a level of security. Yes, I realize you > can get out of a jail. I think we could argue whether most Mainframe > Installations isolate their users more or less than jail does. > > > real scalability of user resources like storage space. > > An example: > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > 230-Welcome to ftp.cdrom.com, a service of Digital River, Inc. > 230-There are currently 528 users out of 3000 possible. > 230- > 230-This machine is a Xeon/500 with 4GB of memory & 1/2 terabyte of RAID > 5. > 230-The operating system is FreeBSD. Should you wish to get your own copy > of > 230-FreeBSD, please visit http://www.freebsd.org for more information. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Define scalability. The above is scaled up there rather high. > > 4GB is the most we can go memory-wise right now. This is a restriction > due to 32 bit addressing in most programs. FreeBSD could very easily > access up to 8TB of memory on a 64bit machine, assuming that the hardware > was up to the task. > > The maximum FILESYSTEM limit under freebsd is about 1TB. The filesystem > is actually capable of up to 8 or 16TB but there are some internals which > cause this to not be availble without some modifications. > > > -Is this a reasonable long term model for ISPs and or server farms? > > I think that this MIGHT be marketable to the right people. I know that > there are a lot of management types out there which still love to hear > the mainframe story line. I'm not sure how this could be marketable to > say, the members of this list. > > > -Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of > > physical space? > > Not aware of any, but who says they don't exist.. > > - Forrest W. Christian (forrestc@imach.com) AC7DE > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > iMach, Ltd., P.O. Box 5749, Helena, MT 59604 http://www.imach.com > Solutions for your high-tech problems. (406)-442-6648 > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Mar 12 5:20: 4 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from bigglesworth.mail.be.easynet.net (bigglesworth.mail.be.easynet.net [212.100.160.67]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5B5237B718 for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 05:20:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wim@livens.net) Received: from 213-193-182-13.adsl.easynet.be ([213.193.182.13] helo=livens.net) by bigglesworth.mail.be.easynet.net with esmtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 14cSEn-0006lN-00 for freebsd-isp@freebsd.org; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 14:19:49 +0100 Received: (from wim@localhost) by livens.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA73679 for freebsd-isp@freebsd.org; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 14:19:46 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from wim) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 14:19:46 +0100 From: Wim Livens To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: RE: co-location model Message-ID: <20010312141946.A73536@krijt.livens.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.4i Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > -Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of > physical space? I know of one provider doing this. http://www.ispserver.com/ They seem to use their own developed extensions to FreeBSD jail. -- Wim Livens mailto:wim@livens.net http://wim.livens.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Mar 12 14:33:17 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from ns.internet.dk (ns.internet.dk [194.19.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C96D237B719 for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 14:33:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by ns.internet.dk (8.11.2/8.11.2) id f2CMXAq92134 for freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG.AVP; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 23:33:10 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by ns.internet.dk (8.11.2/8.11.2) with UUCP id f2CMX8r92112; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 23:33:08 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: from gina (dhcp0.neland.dk [192.168.5.100]) by arnold.neland.dk (8.11.3/8.11.0) with SMTP id f2CMWql18085; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 23:32:53 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Message-ID: <00b201c0ab44$a22da4c0$6405a8c0@neland.dk> Reply-To: "Leif Neland" From: "Leif Neland" To: "Jeff Gray" , "Forrest W. Christian" Cc: References: Subject: Re: co-location model Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 23:34:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from base64 to 8bit by ns.internet.dk id f2CMX8r92112 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > The mainframe suggestion/query is to provide real reliability, real fault > tolerance, real hardware efficiency [jail does this], real security by a > well designed mainframe OS management system, real scalability of user > resources like storage space. > > > -Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of > physical space? Rumours are that Telia in Scandinavia are doing this. Leif > > > Jeff > > > On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Forrest W. Christian wrote: > > > Have you looked at jail? > > > > With jail you can effectively create numerous machines in one physical > > machine. I am planning on doing this as an entry level option in our > > colo space. > > > > man jail > > > > On Sun, 11 Mar 2001, Jeff Gray wrote: > > > > > Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 13:32:22 -0800 (PST) > > > From: Jeff Gray > > > To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG > > > Cc: Jeff Gray > > > Subject: co-location model > > > > > > In thinking about the co-location model of many machines, whether 1U or > > > bigger, one realizes that lots of space, lots of energy [I am writing from > > > California], lots of iron and other materials are inefficiently consumed. > > > Let alone late night trips to the server farm. > > > > > > Instead of co-location with lots of physical servers if someone were to setup > > > a mainframe that provided, > > > -multiple OS configurations and alternatives > > > -centralized hardware management > > > -centralized security management on the mainframe > > > -flexible, reliable, scalable storage > > > > > > then space, energy, raw materials and I suspect major costs could be > > > minimized. Late night trips to the server could be eliminated! > > > > > > My two questions. > > > -Is this a reasonable long term model for ISPs and or server farms? > > > > > > -Does anyone offer this today at the scale of rack size bites of > > > physical space? > > > > > > > > > [I say mainframe only to emphasize extreme hardware and software > > > reliability]. > > > > > > Interested to hear what the community thinks. > > > > > > Thanks > > > jeff > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > > > > > > > - Forrest W. Christian (forrestc@imach.com) AC7DE > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > iMach, Ltd., P.O. Box 5749, Helena, MT 59604 http://www.imach.com > > Solutions for your high-tech problems. (406)-442-6648 > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Mar 12 19:51:43 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from spooky.eis.net.au (spooky.eis.net.au [203.12.171.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38BFA37B719 for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 19:51:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ernie@spooky.eis.net.au) Received: (from ernie@localhost) by spooky.eis.net.au (8.11.2/8.9.3) id f2D3pZI02375 for freebsd-isp@freebsd.org; Tue, 13 Mar 2001 13:51:35 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from ernie) From: Ernie Elu Message-Id: <200103130351.f2D3pZI02375@spooky.eis.net.au> Subject: SMTP mail interception To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 13:51:34 +1000 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Is there anyway of getting sendmail to make an archive copy of all smtp emails in and out of a FreeBSD server, or do I have to run some other interception program on port 25? - Ernie. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Mar 12 21:31:52 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mgw1.MEIway.com (mgw1.meiway.com [212.73.210.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C01C37B71A for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 21:31:51 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from LConrad@Go2France.com) Received: from sv.Go2France.com (sv.meiway.com [212.73.210.79]) by mgw1.MEIway.com (Postfix Relay Hub) with ESMTP id C243916B16 for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2001 06:43:47 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <5.0.0.25.0.20010313062831.05cb31c0@mail.Go2France.com> X-Sender: lconrad%Go2France.com@mail.Go2France.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0 Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 06:29:48 +0100 To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org From: Len Conrad Subject: Re: SMTP mail interception In-Reply-To: <200103130351.f2D3pZI02375@spooky.eis.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org >Is there anyway of getting sendmail to make an archive copy of all smtp >emails in and out of a FreeBSD server, or do I have to run some other >interception program on port 25? The postfix MTA has a global bcc parameter to copy all mail to a mail address. Len http://MenAndMice.com/DNS-training : DNS training for USA and Europe http://BIND8NT.MEIway.com : Binary for ISC BIND 8.2.3 for NT4 & W2K http://IMGate.MEIway.com : Build free, hi-perf, anti-spam mail gateways To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Mon Mar 12 22:30:40 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from net2.dinoex.sub.org (net2.dinoex.de [212.184.201.182]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E538F37B718 for ; Mon, 12 Mar 2001 22:30:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dirk.meyer@dinoex.sub.org) Received: from gate.dinoex.sub.org (dinoex@localhost) by net2.dinoex.sub.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with BSMTP id f2D6U4H15879 for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2001 07:30:04 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from dirk.meyer@dinoex.sub.org) X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: To: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Message-ID: From: dirk.meyer@dinoex.sub.org (Dirk Meyer) Organization: privat Subject: Re: SMTP mail interception Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 07:24:22 +0100 X-Mailer: Dinoex 1.77 References: <200103130351.f2D3pZI02375@spooky.eis.net.au> X-Gateway: ZCONNECT gate.dinoex.sub.org [UNIX/Connect 0.90] X-Accept-Language: de,en X-PGP-Fingerprint: 44 16 EC 0A D3 3A 4F 28 8A 8A 47 93 F1 CF 2F 12 X-Noad: Please don't send me ad's by mail. I'm bored by this type of mail. X-Copyright: (C) Copyright 1999 by Dirk Meyer -- All rights reserved. X-Note: sending SPAM is a violation of both german and US law and will at least trigger a complaint at your provider's postmaster. X-PGP-Key-Avail: mailto:pgp-public-keys@keys.de.pgp.net Subject:GET 0x331CDA5D X-ZC-VIA: 20010313000000W+1@dinoex.sub.org Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Ernie Elu wrote, > Is there anyway of getting sendmail to make an archive copy of all smtp > emails in and out of a FreeBSD server, or do I have to run some other > interception program on port 25? There are diffrent ways to archive this. a) use the sample filer in "libmilter/README" +--------------------------+ | SOURCE FOR SAMPLE FILTER | +--------------------------+ Note that the filter below may not be thread safe on some operating systems. You should check your system man pages for the functions used below to verify the functions are thread safe. /* A trivial filter that logs all email to a file. */ [....] b) define new mailers, for input and oputput (LOCAL/RELAY/SMPTP). There are some shell scrips or C-Programs that can do this. I used one of the "bsmpt/rsmpt" packages to save a mail with the full envelope into a quue. Mostly used for uucp-sites with high traffic. Mbsmtp, P=/usr/bin/bsmtp, F=0, # no MX lookup for destination F=DFMx, # Need Date,From,Message-Id,Full-Name F=m, # Multiple receipients F=u, # Preserve uppercase for username F=S, # Assume specified uid and gid F=n, # Don't use Unix-Style From in header F=C, # Add domainame to all local Users F=X, # Add extra dots in Body (BSMTP) S=EnvFromSMTP/HdrFromSMTP, R=ifdef(`_ALL_MASQUERADE_', `EnvToSMTP/HdrFromSMTP', `EnvToSMTP') E=\r\n, M=10000000, T=X-UUCP/X-UUCP/X-Unix, U=uucp:uucp, A=bsmtp -spool /var/spool/bsmtp/$h $f $u kind regards Dirk - Dirk Meyer, Im Grund 4, 34317 Habichtswald, Germany To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Mar 13 7:45:10 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from bugs.elitsat.net (bugs.elitsat.net [209.239.78.230]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 837E437B722; Tue, 13 Mar 2001 07:45:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from amour@bugs.elitsat.net) Received: from localhost (amour@localhost) by bugs.elitsat.net (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f2DFjL614319; Tue, 13 Mar 2001 17:45:22 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from amour@bugs.elitsat.net) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 17:45:20 +0200 (EET) From: Alexander To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: 3 Routing Questions Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I have 3 routing questions, any help will be great. 1) How can I create source based routing. Like if there are few networks behind my router and I want them to be routed with different default gateways. 2) How can I do the following situation: If I have 2 different connections to 1 server , let's say the one is leased line and the other is ip tunnel, and I want it to use by default the leased line, but when the leased line is lagged too much or there isn't any kind of connection through it the routing should be going using the ip tunnel. 3) Why when my server is booting and if someone try to do any kind of connection to it or just ping it and it adds his address to the routing table. And since the address is not on the same interface, the address is not available since the route for it expires. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Mar 13 8:51:23 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from misery.sdf.com (misery.sdf.com [204.244.213.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C80337B71A; Tue, 13 Mar 2001 08:51:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tom@sdf.com) Received: from tom (helo=localhost) by misery.sdf.com with local-esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14crzy-0001z8-00; Tue, 13 Mar 2001 08:50:14 -0800 Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 08:50:10 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Samplonius To: Alexander Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 3 Routing Questions In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, 13 Mar 2001, Alexander wrote: > I have 3 routing questions, any help will be great. > > 1) How can I create source based routing. Like if there are few > networks behind my router and I want them to be routed with different > default gateways. Policy based routing can be done with "ipfw fwd" directives. > 2) How can I do the following situation: > If I have 2 different connections to 1 server , let's say the one is > leased line and the other is ip tunnel, and I want it to use by default > the leased line, but when the leased line is lagged too much or there > isn't any kind of connection through it the routing should be going using > the ip tunnel. Quite difficult. Depends on the products that you are using for the lease line router, and tunnel. You will probably have to do this with a script that changes the default route. > 3) Why when my server is booting and if someone try to do any kind > of connection to it or just ping it and it adds his address to the routing > table. And since the address is not on the same interface, the address is > not available since the route for it expires. I don't understand this at all. The first sentence seems to refer to how MAC addresses are stored in the routing table. That happens all the time, not just during booting. Tom To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Mar 13 11:36:28 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from Gloria.CAM.ORG (Gloria.CAM.ORG [205.151.116.34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5ABA737B726; Tue, 13 Mar 2001 11:36:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from intmktg@CAM.ORG) Received: from localhost (intmktg@localhost) by Gloria.CAM.ORG (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA08660; Tue, 13 Mar 2001 14:28:47 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 14:28:47 -0500 (EST) From: Marc Tardif To: mikey@kappaisle.com Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Subject: Re: pam_ldap status? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > Thanks alot Jacques, it really gives me a much more > clear view on the differences. > > I'm looking forward to integrating LDAP authentication > for our shell/pop/imap/ftp/web/ssh users. > Any success? I'm trying the same and failing miserably no matter what I try. Simply getting pam_ldap to work is proving to be a challenge. In pam.conf, I have: login auth required pam_ldap.so debug When trying to log in, I get this in /var/log/messages: Mar 13 14:28:07 nine login: unable to dlopen(/usr/lib/pam_ldap.so) Mar 13 14:28:07 nine login: [dlerror: /usr/lib/pam_ldap.so: invalid file format] Mar 13 14:28:07 nine login: adding faulty module: /usr/lib/pam_ldap.so Mar 13 14:28:07 nine login: auth_pam: Module is unknown If I should be providing more status information about my configurations files and such, please let me know. Thanks, Marc To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Mar 13 12: 7:28 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from atlas.rccn.net (atlas.rccn.net [193.136.7.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4D54437B718 for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2001 12:07:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jpsp@fccn.pt) Received: (qmail 27561 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2001 20:07:21 -0000 Received: from dhcp20.fccn.pt (HELO jpsp) (193.136.7.220) by atlas.rccn.net with SMTP; 13 Mar 2001 20:07:20 -0000 Message-ID: <02db01c0abf9$3a7caeb0$dc0788c1@jpsp> From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jo=E3o_Pagaime?= To: Subject: Redundant NIC - preserve IP address in case of failure Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 20:07:28 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hello all, I was planning to use 2 NICs on one server and have routed deal with gateway acquisition through IRDP ou RIP, however, if the NIC itself fails, I would like to preserve that NIC's IP address, because there are some well knowed services using that address. Is this possible? How? Thanks, jp To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Tue Mar 13 16:47:25 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from ns.internet.dk (ns.internet.dk [194.19.140.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 169DB37B718 for ; Tue, 13 Mar 2001 16:47:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by ns.internet.dk (8.11.2/8.11.2) id f2E0lKX41013 for freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG.AVP; Wed, 14 Mar 2001 01:47:20 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by ns.internet.dk (8.11.2/8.11.2) with UUCP id f2E0lK541005 for freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 14 Mar 2001 01:47:20 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Received: from gina (dhcp0.neland.dk [192.168.5.100]) by arnold.neland.dk (8.11.3/8.11.0) with SMTP id f2E0ktl30933 for ; Wed, 14 Mar 2001 01:46:56 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from leifn@neland.dk) Message-ID: <024001c0ac20$828a3340$6405a8c0@neland.dk> Reply-To: "Leif Neland" From: "Leif Neland" To: Subject: avpkeeper-users mailinglist Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 01:48:37 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from base64 to 8bit by ns.internet.dk id f2E0lK541005 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org The avpkeeper-users mailinglist has now matured to a Mailman-managed mailinglist at http://lists.internet.dk/cgi-bin/listinfo/avpkeeper-users Or you can subscribe by sending a message to avpkeeper-users-request@lists.internet.dk with subject "subscribe" Leif To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Mar 14 1:25: 6 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from relay.tecc.co.uk (luggage.tecc.co.uk [193.128.6.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 959D437B718 for ; Wed, 14 Mar 2001 01:25:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from andy@tecc.co.uk) Received: from fw-smtp.tecc.co.uk [195.217.37.39] by relay.tecc.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 1.70 #1) id 14d7We-00016Q-00; Wed, 14 Mar 2001 09:25:00 +0000 Received: from [195.217.37.155] (helo=southampton) by fw-smtp.tecc.co.uk with smtp (Exim 2.12 #3) id 14d7UZ-0004aR-00; Wed, 14 Mar 2001 09:22:51 +0000 From: "Andy [TECC NOPS]" To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jo=E3o_Pagaime?= , Subject: RE: Redundant NIC - preserve IP address in case of failure Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 09:29:58 -0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <02db01c0abf9$3a7caeb0$dc0788c1@jpsp> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org VRRP maybe able to help you out, although it was really designed to allow two nics on different servers to share a "virtual" ip address. If one nic (or server) fails, the second nic (server) takes over the IP address and serves it. However, I have two machines here, both with 2 nics in and vrrpd seems to work just fine in swapping ip addresses over. Is that what you want? Regards Ak > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG > [mailto:owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG]On Behalf Of Joćo Pagaime > Sent: 13 March 2001 20:07 > To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org > Subject: Redundant NIC - preserve IP address in case of failure > > > Hello all, > > I was planning to use 2 NICs on one server and have routed > deal with gateway acquisition through IRDP ou RIP, however, > if the NIC itself fails, I would like to preserve that NIC's > IP address, because there are some well knowed services > using that address. > > Is this possible? How? > > Thanks, > jp > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Mar 14 1:46:18 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from hitline.ch (mail.hitline.ch [195.129.74.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86BF737B718 for ; Wed, 14 Mar 2001 01:46:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from micheal@com4u.ch) Received: from [195.129.74.2] (account micheal@com4u.ch HELO [10.10.14.46]) by hitline.ch (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 3.4) with ESMTP id 3740848 for freebsd-isp@freebsd.org; Wed, 14 Mar 2001 10:46:08 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: micheal%com4u.ch@mail.com4u.ch Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 10:45:22 +0100 To: From: Michael O Shea Subject: RE: Redundant NIC - preserve IP address in case of failure Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ; format="flowed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org At 9:29 AM +0000 3/14/01, Andy [TECC NOPS] wrote: >VRRP maybe able to help you out, although it >was really designed to allow two nics on >different servers to share a "virtual" ip >address. If one nic (or server) fails, the >second nic (server) takes over the IP address >and serves it. > >However, I have two machines here, both with >2 nics in and vrrpd seems to work just fine >in swapping ip addresses over. Is that what you >want? > >Regards >Ak Hi Andy. Do you have a url for VRRP or is it in the ports ? -- Micheal O Shea ----------------------------------------------------- com-o-tronic ag Micheal O Shea, Systems Engineer Gewerbepark CH-5506 M=E4genwil E-Mail micheal@com4u.ch Voice: +41 62 887 3734 =46ax: +41 62 896 1133 Internet: http://www.com4u.ch http://www.ehitline.ch To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Wed Mar 14 2: 0:41 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from relay.tecc.co.uk (luggage.tecc.co.uk [193.128.6.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D21A237B71B for ; Wed, 14 Mar 2001 02:00:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from andy@tecc.co.uk) Received: from fw-smtp.tecc.co.uk [195.217.37.39] by relay.tecc.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 1.70 #1) id 14d855-0001Nr-00; Wed, 14 Mar 2001 10:00:35 +0000 Received: from [195.217.37.155] (helo=southampton) by fw-smtp.tecc.co.uk with smtp (Exim 2.12 #3) id 14d831-0004l0-00; Wed, 14 Mar 2001 09:58:27 +0000 From: "Andy [TECC NOPS]" To: "Michael O Shea" , Subject: RE: Redundant NIC - preserve IP address in case of failure Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 10:05:34 -0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I submitted the linux port I did to -ports but seems no committers picked it up, so it's still out in the cold at the mo. You can get the tar from : ftp://ftp.vrrp.net/pub/vrrpd/vrrpd-0.1.tar.gz btw, I maintain vrrp.net but haven't got around to doing the web page docs for it yet. There is some txt files in the tar (mainly rfc). If you have any questions regarding it drop me a line. Anyone want to offer doc time for the web page then also drop me a line. Regards Andy > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG > [mailto:owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG]On Behalf Of Michael O Shea > Sent: 14 March 2001 09:45 > To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org > Subject: RE: Redundant NIC - preserve IP address in case of failure > > > At 9:29 AM +0000 3/14/01, Andy [TECC NOPS] wrote: > >VRRP maybe able to help you out, although it > >was really designed to allow two nics on > >different servers to share a "virtual" ip > >address. If one nic (or server) fails, the > >second nic (server) takes over the IP address > >and serves it. > > > >However, I have two machines here, both with > >2 nics in and vrrpd seems to work just fine > >in swapping ip addresses over. Is that what you > >want? > > > >Regards > >Ak > > Hi Andy. Do you have a url for VRRP or is it in the ports ? > -- > > Micheal O Shea > > ----------------------------------------------------- > com-o-tronic ag > Micheal O Shea, Systems Engineer > Gewerbepark > CH-5506 Mägenwil > > E-Mail micheal@com4u.ch > > Voice: +41 62 887 3734 > Fax: +41 62 896 1133 > > Internet: http://www.com4u.ch http://www.ehitline.ch > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Mar 15 6:34:34 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from aspenworks.com (aspenworks.com [192.94.236.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C23FF37B71A for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 06:34:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from alex@aspenworks.com) Received: from d7k (matrix.aspenworks.com [216.38.199.82]) by aspenworks.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA19755 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 07:34:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from alex@aspenworks.com) Message-ID: <002c01c0ad5d$07f7fbb0$1800a8c0@d7k> From: "Alex Huppenthal" To: Subject: ATM update Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 07:34:23 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Well, I've found ATM is pretty well supported in other OS's Also Linux as a stack that has CBR support. I've asked the Fore / Marconi to send docs on their drivers, if anyone wants to participate in trying a hack of the ATM command or adding a CBR feature for PVCs on FreeBSD, let me know. As I have time, I'll be working to make FreeBSD more robust with ATM. (yea, I know the argument about why ATM, but it's hear for a while, and we have 60 locations to interface to ATM) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Mar 15 6:35:41 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from aspenworks.com (aspenworks.com [192.94.236.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7030637B71A for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 06:35:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from alex@aspenworks.com) Received: from d7k (matrix.aspenworks.com [216.38.199.82]) by aspenworks.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id HAA19775 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 07:35:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from alex@aspenworks.com) Message-ID: <003401c0ad5d$2fda8df0$1800a8c0@d7k> From: "Alex Huppenthal" To: Subject: Email Junk mail filtering Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 07:35:30 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Anyone have an adventure with Postini? It's a spam filtering service. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Mar 15 10:11:14 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from atlas.rccn.net (atlas.rccn.net [193.136.7.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id BED1D37B719 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:11:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jpsp@fccn.pt) Received: (qmail 64027 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2001 18:11:08 -0000 Received: from dhcp20.fccn.pt (HELO jpsp) (193.136.7.220) by atlas.rccn.net with SMTP; 15 Mar 2001 18:11:08 -0000 Message-ID: <015601c0ad7b$54f63c60$dc0788c1@jpsp> From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jo=E3o_Pagaime?= To: References: Subject: Re: Redundant NIC - preserve IP address in case of failure Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 18:11:18 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Thanks for the various answers. I think VRRP or some dual, redundant, port NIC with the same funcionality is the answer for me. (although I can't think of one, but I know they're out there). I don't think I can convince the router people to talk OSPF with the servers (that was one good, clean way of doing it, as someone suggested) --jp ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy [TECC NOPS]" To: "Joćo Pagaime" ; Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2001 9:29 AM Subject: RE: Redundant NIC - preserve IP address in case of failure > VRRP maybe able to help you out, although it > was really designed to allow two nics on > different servers to share a "virtual" ip > address. If one nic (or server) fails, the > second nic (server) takes over the IP address > and serves it. > > However, I have two machines here, both with > 2 nics in and vrrpd seems to work just fine > in swapping ip addresses over. Is that what you > want? > > Regards > Ak > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG > > [mailto:owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG]On Behalf Of Joćo Pagaime > > Sent: 13 March 2001 20:07 > > To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org > > Subject: Redundant NIC - preserve IP address in case of failure > > > > > > Hello all, > > > > I was planning to use 2 NICs on one server and have routed > > deal with gateway acquisition through IRDP ou RIP, however, > > if the NIC itself fails, I would like to preserve that NIC's > > IP address, because there are some well knowed services > > using that address. > > > > Is this possible? How? > > > > Thanks, > > jp > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Mar 15 10:24:13 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mgw1.MEIway.com (mgw1.meiway.com [212.73.210.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2DBD37B718 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:24:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from LConrad@Go2France.com) Received: from sv.Go2France.com (sv.meiway.com [212.73.210.79]) by mgw1.MEIway.com (Postfix Relay Hub) with ESMTP id 7022816B16 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 19:36:20 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <5.0.0.25.0.20010315154256.04febb80@mail.Go2France.com> X-Sender: lconrad%Go2France.com@mail.Go2France.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0 Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 19:21:48 +0100 To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org From: Len Conrad Subject: Email Junk mail filtering In-Reply-To: <003401c0ad5d$2fda8df0$1800a8c0@d7k> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org >Anyone have an adventure with Postini? It's a spam filtering service. Can't you get 95% of Postini's anti-abuse benefit from an MTA like postfix in a mail hub in front of your mailbox sever, for free? For us, the last 5%, or less, just isn't worth any expense. Len http://MenAndMice.com/DNS-training : DNS training for USA and Europe http://BIND8NT.MEIway.com : Binary for ISC BIND 8.2.3 for NT4 & W2K http://IMGate.MEIway.com : Build free, hi-perf, anti-spam mail gateways To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Mar 15 10:43:49 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from aspenworks.com (aspenworks.com [192.94.236.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C552837B719 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:43:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from alex@aspenworks.com) Received: from d7k (matrix.aspenworks.com [216.38.199.82]) by aspenworks.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA01572; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 11:43:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from alex@aspenworks.com) Message-ID: <01e701c0ad7f$d1a1d630$1800a8c0@d7k> From: "Alex Huppenthal" To: , "Len Conrad" References: <5.0.0.25.0.20010315154256.04febb80@mail.Go2France.com> Subject: Re: Email Junk mail filtering Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 11:43:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Doesn't Postini offer a seperate mailbox with a link to it when there's 'detected spam' ? That's a nice touch, if you're customers want filtered email to their main mailbox, and a seperate junk mail location. Good question about Postfix.. I'd noticed HP's move to Postfix. If Postfix can scan incoming email for subjust lines, like "xxx", or "get rich today", or "special offer" or any number of keywords, it might do really well. The novelty of Postini is that it shows you a seperate mailbox which collects all the detected SPAM. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Len Conrad" To: Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2001 11:21 AM Subject: Email Junk mail filtering > > >Anyone have an adventure with Postini? It's a spam filtering service. > > Can't you get 95% of Postini's anti-abuse benefit from an MTA like > postfix in a mail hub in front of your mailbox sever, for free? > > For us, the last 5%, or less, just isn't worth any expense. > > Len > > http://MenAndMice.com/DNS-training : DNS training for USA and > Europe > http://BIND8NT.MEIway.com : Binary for ISC BIND 8.2.3 for NT4 & W2K > http://IMGate.MEIway.com : Build free, hi-perf, anti-spam mail gateways > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Mar 15 10:51:54 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from mgw1.MEIway.com (mgw1.meiway.com [212.73.210.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDD8C37B718 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:51:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from LConrad@Go2France.com) Received: from sv.Go2France.com (sv.meiway.com [212.73.210.79]) by mgw1.MEIway.com (Postfix Relay Hub) with ESMTP id E2AB716B1E for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 20:04:06 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <5.0.0.25.0.20010315194607.028554f0@mail.Go2France.com> X-Sender: lconrad%Go2France.com@mail.Go2France.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0 Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 19:49:34 +0100 To: From: Len Conrad Subject: Re: Email Junk mail filtering In-Reply-To: <01e701c0ad7f$d1a1d630$1800a8c0@d7k> References: <5.0.0.25.0.20010315154256.04febb80@mail.Go2France.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org >Good question about Postfix.. I'd noticed HP's move to Postfix. If Postfix >can scan incoming email for subjust lines, like "xxx", or "get rich today", >or "special offer" or any number of keywords, it might do really well. posix or perl RegEx expressions can be applied to header or body. http://www.postfix.org/uce.html >The novelty of Postini is that it shows you a seperate mailbox which >collects all the detected SPAM. Who has time to read SPAM? Just reject it. Len http://MenAndMice.com/DNS-training : DNS training for USA and Europe http://BIND8NT.MEIway.com : Binary for ISC BIND 8.2.3 for NT4 & W2K http://IMGate.MEIway.com : Build free, hi-perf, anti-spam mail gateways To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Mar 15 10:56:15 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from cx175057-a.ocnsd1.sdca.home.com (cx175057-a.ocnsd1.sdca.home.com [24.13.23.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2319937B718 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:56:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bri@sonicboom.org) Received: from localhost (bri@localhost) by cx175057-a.ocnsd1.sdca.home.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f2FIt4X02489; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:55:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bri@sonicboom.org) Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:55:04 -0800 (PST) From: Brian X-X-Sender: To: Len Conrad Cc: Subject: Re: Email Junk mail filtering In-Reply-To: <5.0.0.25.0.20010315194607.028554f0@mail.Go2France.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Problem with the below idea of just blowing it away is that any approach to reduce spam will also block some legit mail. So, as a result, at least giving the customer a choice of separate folder saving seems good. Brian On Thu, 15 Mar 2001, Len Conrad wrote: > > >Good question about Postfix.. I'd noticed HP's move to Postfix. If Postfix > >can scan incoming email for subjust lines, like "xxx", or "get rich today", > >or "special offer" or any number of keywords, it might do really well. > > posix or perl RegEx expressions can be applied to header or body. > > http://www.postfix.org/uce.html > > >The novelty of Postini is that it shows you a seperate mailbox which > >collects all the detected SPAM. > > Who has time to read SPAM? Just reject it. > > Len > > http://MenAndMice.com/DNS-training : DNS training for USA and > Europe > http://BIND8NT.MEIway.com : Binary for ISC BIND 8.2.3 for NT4 & W2K > http://IMGate.MEIway.com : Build free, hi-perf, anti-spam mail gateways > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Mar 15 11:22:28 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from cody.jharris.com (cody.jharris.com [205.238.128.83]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE1C837B719 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 11:22:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nick@rogness.net) Received: from localhost (nick@localhost) by cody.jharris.com (8.11.1/8.9.3) with ESMTP id f2FJQ9405555; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 13:26:10 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from nick@rogness.net) Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 13:26:09 -0600 (CST) From: Nick Rogness X-Sender: nick@cody.jharris.com To: Alex Huppenthal Cc: freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, Len Conrad Subject: Re: Email Junk mail filtering In-Reply-To: <01e701c0ad7f$d1a1d630$1800a8c0@d7k> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Thu, 15 Mar 2001, Alex Huppenthal wrote: > > Doesn't Postini offer a seperate mailbox with a link to it when there's > 'detected spam' ? That's a nice touch, if you're customers want filtered > email to their main mailbox, and a seperate junk mail location. procmail is another solution. > > Good question about Postfix.. I'd noticed HP's move to Postfix. If Postfix > can scan incoming email for subjust lines, like "xxx", or "get rich today", > or "special offer" or any number of keywords, it might do really well. > > The novelty of Postini is that it shows you a seperate mailbox which > collects all the detected SPAM. > procmail has this capability. It's in the ports. Nick Rogness - Keep on routing in a Free World... "FreeBSD: The Power to Serve!" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Mar 15 11:28: 5 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C72B037B719 for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 11:28:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shovey@buffnet.net) Received: from buffnet11.buffnet.net (buffnet11.buffnet.net [205.246.19.55]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA02526; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 14:27:48 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from shovey@buffnet.net) Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 14:27:37 -0500 (EST) From: Stephen Hovey To: Nick Rogness Cc: Alex Huppenthal , freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, Len Conrad Subject: Re: Email Junk mail filtering In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I just hacked mail.local so that I could get fancy with my detection algorythms On Thu, 15 Mar 2001, Nick Rogness wrote: > On Thu, 15 Mar 2001, Alex Huppenthal wrote: > > > > > Doesn't Postini offer a seperate mailbox with a link to it when there's > > 'detected spam' ? That's a nice touch, if you're customers want filtered > > email to their main mailbox, and a seperate junk mail location. > > procmail is another solution. > > > > > Good question about Postfix.. I'd noticed HP's move to Postfix. If Postfix > > can scan incoming email for subjust lines, like "xxx", or "get rich today", > > or "special offer" or any number of keywords, it might do really well. > > > > The novelty of Postini is that it shows you a seperate mailbox which > > collects all the detected SPAM. > > > > procmail has this capability. It's in the ports. > > > Nick Rogness > - Keep on routing in a Free World... > "FreeBSD: The Power to Serve!" > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Thu Mar 15 22:42:20 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from klapaucius.zer0.org (klapaucius.zer0.org [204.152.186.45]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8073337B71C for ; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 22:42:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gsutter@zer0.org) Received: by klapaucius.zer0.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 64F56239A54; Thu, 15 Mar 2001 22:42:18 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 22:42:18 -0800 From: Gregory Sutter To: Nick Rogness Cc: Alex Huppenthal , freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, Len Conrad Subject: Re: Email Junk mail filtering Message-ID: <20010315224218.Q9369@klapaucius.zer0.org> References: <01e701c0ad7f$d1a1d630$1800a8c0@d7k> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from nick@rogness.net on Thu, Mar 15, 2001 at 01:26:09PM -0600 Organization: Zer0 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On 2001-03-15 13:26 -0600, Nick Rogness wrote: > On Thu, 15 Mar 2001, Alex Huppenthal wrote: > > > Doesn't Postini offer a seperate mailbox with a link to it when there's > > 'detected spam' ? That's a nice touch, if you're customers want filtered > > email to their main mailbox, and a seperate junk mail location. > > procmail is another solution. > > > Good question about Postfix.. I'd noticed HP's move to Postfix. If Postfix > > can scan incoming email for subjust lines, like "xxx", or "get rich today", > > or "special offer" or any number of keywords, it might do really well. > > > > The novelty of Postini is that it shows you a seperate mailbox which > > collects all the detected SPAM. > > procmail has this capability. It's in the ports. So is /usr/ports/mail/junkfilter, which is built out on top of procmail. Greg -- Gregory S. Sutter If ignorance is bliss, you must be orgasmic. mailto:gsutter@zer0.org http://www.zer0.org/~gsutter/ hkp://wwwkeys.pgp.net/0x845DFEDD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Mar 16 5:26: 6 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from genesis.tao.org.uk (genesis.tao.org.uk [212.135.162.62]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3AF9337B73B for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 05:25:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from joe@tao.org.uk) Received: from tao.org.uk (unknown [194.242.131.94]) by genesis.tao.org.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF9E24B14; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 13:25:53 +0000 (GMT) Received: by tao.org.uk (Postfix, from userid 100) id C198F3147; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 12:48:20 +0000 (GMT) Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 12:48:20 +0000 From: Josef Karthauser To: Nick Rogness Cc: Alex Huppenthal , freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, Len Conrad Subject: Re: Email Junk mail filtering Message-ID: <20010316124820.B2277@tao.org.uk> Mail-Followup-To: Josef Karthauser , Nick Rogness , Alex Huppenthal , freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG, Len Conrad References: <01e701c0ad7f$d1a1d630$1800a8c0@d7k> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="z6Eq5LdranGa6ru8" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: ; from nick@rogness.net on Thu, Mar 15, 2001 at 01:26:09PM -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org --z6Eq5LdranGa6ru8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Mar 15, 2001 at 01:26:09PM -0600, Nick Rogness wrote: > On Thu, 15 Mar 2001, Alex Huppenthal wrote: >=20 > >=20 > > Doesn't Postini offer a seperate mailbox with a link to it when there's > > 'detected spam' ? That's a nice touch, if you're customers want filtered > > email to their main mailbox, and a seperate junk mail location. >=20 > procmail is another solution. Yes, and there's a prebuilt procmail ruleset in ports that works really. It's in mail/junkmail. Joe --z6Eq5LdranGa6ru8 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (FreeBSD) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iEYEARECAAYFAjqyC5MACgkQXVIcjOaxUBZQ3QCg2/NLMLcuy00JFdwrXhC13ZpS f+QAoOK+2BCb1j/Xk2WIyPJJ8Ut18QiE =aNBY -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --z6Eq5LdranGa6ru8-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Mar 16 6:52:34 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from hotmail.com (f70.law14.hotmail.com [64.4.21.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 883ED37B71C; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 06:52:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jefffbsd@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 06:52:30 -0800 Received: from 161.184.39.167 by lw14fd.law14.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 14:52:30 GMT X-Originating-IP: [161.184.39.167] From: "Jeffrey Sewell" To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Cc: freebsd-stable@freebsd.org Subject: Get out of Jail Free Card-No really I need help with Jail :) Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 14:52:30 -0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Mar 2001 14:52:30.0501 (UTC) FILETIME=[B9C53D50:01C0AE28] Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Are there patches that one can use for Jail to bind to /29? Guy on IRC said if you want proftpd running on all 5 ips you need 5 proftpds running all in their own jail session. Seems rediculous to me, is there a way around it? (What do people do with a full class c)? _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Mar 16 8:25:29 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from sunny.fishnet.com (sunny.fishnet.com [209.150.200.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF71737B719 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 08:25:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hhudson@eschelon.com) Received: from walleye.corp.fishnet.com (209.150.192.114) by sunny.fishnet.com (5.0.048) id 3AA5BD700007DBA6 for freebsd-isp@freebsd.org; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 10:25:45 -0600 Message-ID: <2FA3BA0C7551724CA6DDF4E3453605050AF442@walleye.corp.fishnet.com> From: "Hudson, Henrik H." To: "'freebsd-isp@freebsd.org'" Subject: PAM and MySQL Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 10:28:51 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Hello List- I tried this on questions, but didn't hear anything back so I will try it over here :) I am working through some theoretical setups in my mind and I have come to a stumbling block. Of course, I might just be missing something. We are an ISP which offers web hosting on FreeBSD and Debian boxes and some Windows2000 boxes. For the most part it is FTP access only with a few shell accounts creeping in here and there. I know ProFTPD has a mySQL plugin to handle authentication and I am fairly confident that I could figure out the PAM authentication to a mySQL database but this only handles shell (telnet and ssh) login authentication, right? The stumbling block is that we run Apache in suEXEC mode and would like to continue doing this. If I have, let's say, 5 servers mounting webfiles to a central location how do those files know who their owner is for suEXEC purposes? Does PAM handle the UID and GID lookups too? For example, when you do a "ls -l" in a directory? or do we have to go to a NIS/NIS+ environment for this? I am an empty fountian, fill me with knowledge ;) Thanks in advance! --- Henrik Hudson Senior Systems Administrator -IP Services Eschelon Telecom, Inc. Phone: 612/436-6477 E-Mail: hhudson@eschelon.com General Help or Questions: sysadmin@eschelon.com Microsoft: "Where would you like to go to today" Linux: "Where would you like to go tomorrow" FreeBSD: "Hey, when are you guys going to catch up" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Mar 16 16:12:41 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from home.certto.com.br (home.certto.com.br [200.250.15.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 446A537B719 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 16:12:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from lfenciso@certto.com.br) Received: from micro11 (micro2.certto.com.br [200.250.15.11]) by home.certto.com.br (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id f2H0Cu228480 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 21:12:57 -0300 Message-ID: <00ca01c0c6d3$28eb9220$0b0ffac8@certto.com.br> From: "Luis Fernando Enciso" To: Subject: Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 21:12:58 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org unsubscribe freebsd-isp lfenciso@certto.com.br To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-isp Fri Mar 16 16:16: 4 2001 Delivered-To: freebsd-isp@freebsd.org Received: from home.certto.com.br (home.certto.com.br [200.250.15.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64B1737B718 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 16:16:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from lfenciso@certto.com.br) Received: from micro11 (micro2.certto.com.br [200.250.15.11]) by home.certto.com.br (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id f2H0GS228580 for ; Fri, 16 Mar 2001 21:16:28 -0300 Message-ID: <00f201c0c6d3$a63eb360$0b0ffac8@certto.com.br> From: "Luis Fernando Enciso" To: Subject: Sorry Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 21:16:29 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: owner-freebsd-isp@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Sorry. I'm mistake... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-isp" in the body of the message