From owner-freebsd-doc Sun Sep 8 14:38:13 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA26179 for doc-outgoing; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 14:38:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [204.216.27.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA26170 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 14:38:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ux5.cso.uiuc.edu (root@ux5.cso.uiuc.edu [128.174.5.45]) by who.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.11) with ESMTP id OAA02647 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 14:38:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nt01 (nt1.cs.uiuc.edu [128.174.242.41]) by ux5.cso.uiuc.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA03299 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 16:34:47 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <32333C5B.E35@uiuc.edu> Date: Sun, 08 Sep 1996 16:36:27 -0500 From: Dannyman X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: doc@freebsd.org Subject: INN part of FAQ X-URL: http://www.freebsd.org/mailto.html Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk The INN FAQ link on the FreeBSD FAQ re: setting up INN, is bad. From owner-freebsd-doc Sun Sep 8 15:21:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA29107 for doc-outgoing; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 15:21:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA29099 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 15:21:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA00515 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 00:21:40 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id AAA02768 for doc@freebsd.org; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 00:21:18 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Beta.1/keltia-uucp-2.9) id AAA21372; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 00:08:10 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199609082208.AAA21372@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Mon, 9 Sep 1996 00:08:09 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: INN part of FAQ In-Reply-To: <32333C5B.E35@uiuc.edu>; from Dannyman on Sep 8, 1996 16:36:27 -0500 References: <32333C5B.E35@uiuc.edu> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.42 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#2443 Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Dannyman: > The INN FAQ link on the FreeBSD FAQ re: setting up > INN, is bad. Fixed. Thanks. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #21: Sun Sep 8 14:35:00 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-doc Sun Sep 8 16:45:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA03765 for doc-outgoing; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 16:45:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA03757 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 16:45:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA19050 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 18:45:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 18:45:25 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: doc@freebsd.org Subject: New conversion scheme in place. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Thos watching the cvs lists should be aware that instant(1) has now replaced sgmlsasp(1) as the core of the sgml->xxx conversion process. Currently, not too many of instant's capabilities have been exercised, but the changeover has solved a number of longstanding bugs. Most importantly, decent postscript output can be achieved without the use of TeX (which is actually broken at the moment). Both text and postscript output support cross references and you will find a table of contents at the end of the document. The HTML output is basically the same as before--just a few minor glitches have been fixed. I suspect there are still a few cases where invalid HTML is generated but those should be easy to fix now. There are still a number of glitches in the groff generated output (I've developed a healthy disrespect for troff and all its variants with this project). I have some modifications to instant in mind that should help pacify troff's insanely picky parsing conventions (tabs, spaces, and newlines in particular). For people picking pieces of current rather than following it wholesale, you need to grab src/share/sgml, src/usr.bin/sgmls, src/usr.bin/sgmlfmt, and the mm macros from the groff that was just imported (you can get the macros elsewhere too, just be sure and get version 1.27--later versions are pretty buggy). This stuff all works on 2.1[.5] systems. I don't anticipate doing much more than the odd bug fix for the linuxdoc->xxx translations. Instead, I'm going to dust off the docbook translations that I started some time ago. I'll try and bring that in soon so people can start looking at a DTD that was actually designed for computer documentation. Be sure to let me know if you find any notable glitches with the new system. For those curious about how/why instant(1) is better than sgmlsasp(2), the latter is a one-pass event driven filter. The former reads the entire SGML document into an element tree. Each element in the tree is matched with a rule from the transpec(5) file. The matching can be determined by the element name, its relationship to other elements (parent, child, sibling, descendant, ancestor, etc.), a regular expression on the data content, the value of a variable or attributes of the element or its parent. Next, instant(1) begins an in-order traversal of the tree, applying the translation rules just selected as it goes. There are many things a translation rule can do, the most powerful being the ability to take detours from the in-order traversal. You can easily hunt down other elements based on a variety of criteria, execute other arbitrary translation rules (chaining) and otherwize provide the illusion of moving data anywhere you please. For example, if you hit a cross reference, you can easily track down the other end of the reference, then search up the tree until you find the smallest sectioning element, grab the title and insert it where the original reference was. One last thing. The transpec(5) man page needs to be re-written as the file format has changed dramatically. However, clever people can probably figure out what is going on by comparing what the manual page says with actual transpec file. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fallout.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ================ From owner-freebsd-doc Sun Sep 8 21:44:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA28275 for doc-outgoing; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 21:44:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp [202.239.16.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA28267 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 21:44:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from amont.astec.co.jp (amont.astec.co.jp [172.20.10.1]) by tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (8.6.12+2.5Wb7/3.4Wbeta5-astecMX2.3) with ESMTP id NAA15702; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 13:44:10 +0900 Received: from domino.astec.co.jp (domino [172.20.10.12]) by amont.astec.co.jp (8.6.9+2.4W/3.4Wbeta5-astecNoMX2.3) with SMTP id NAA17911; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 13:44:09 +0900 Received: by domino.astec.co.jp (4.1/astec-1.0) id AA05610; Mon, 9 Sep 96 13:44:09 JST Message-Id: <9609090444.AA05610@domino.astec.co.jp> To: doc@freebsd.org Cc: jfieber@indiana.edu Subject: Re: New conversion scheme in place. In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 09 Sep 1996 09:55:00 +0900" References: <199609090055.JAA00272@astec.co.jp> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.28.1, Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 09 Sep 1996 13:44:08 +0900 From: Hanai Hiroyuki Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John said: > For people picking pieces of current rather than following it > wholesale, you need to grab src/share/sgml, src/usr.bin/sgmls, > src/usr.bin/sgmlfmt, and the mm macros from the groff that was > just imported (you can get the macros elsewhere too, just be sure > and get version 1.27--later versions are pretty buggy). This > stuff all works on 2.1[.5] systems. Since I'm not staying -current, I've gotten the new tools from ftp.FreeBSD.ORG and tried to generating HTML version of handbook from our Japanese version. Great! I don't have any problem! Japanese version of Handbook in HTML has been successfully generated with no problem. In practice, I have one problem but it is because our japanese version of SGML files are based on 2.1.5R and sgmls doesn't know 'ero' in the new scheme. # In the old scheme, 'ero' is defined in # /usr/share/sgml/FreeBSD/rep/*.general files Although I've not checked the whole (japanese version of) generated documents, I think it's no problem to manipulate japanese documents with new tools. Next TODO is to discard linuxdoc and to adopt docbook? -----H.Hanai From owner-freebsd-doc Sun Sep 8 22:04:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA00119 for doc-outgoing; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 22:04:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from comm.ctn.co.jp (comm.ctn.co.jp [202.219.38.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA00106 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 22:04:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ppp.ctn.co.jp ([202.219.38.245]) by comm.ctn.co.jp (8.7.5+2.6Wbeta6/3.4W4-960619) with ESMTP id OAA12063 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 14:04:27 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199609090504.OAA12063@comm.ctn.co.jp> From: "Katsuro Miyakoda" To: Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCJE8kOCRhJF4kNyRGGyhK?= Date: Mon, 9 Sep 1996 14:05:10 +0900 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-doc@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk $B;E;v$G!"2a5n$K!"(JUNIX$B4XO"$NF~Lg=q$d(JSsytemV$B4X78$NJ8=q$J$I$rLu$7$?$3$H(J $B$,$"$j$^$9!#$J$K$+$*; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 22:20:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from amont.astec.co.jp (amont.astec.co.jp [172.20.10.1]) by tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (8.6.12+2.5Wb7/3.4Wbeta5-astecMX2.3) with ESMTP id OAA16678; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 14:20:12 +0900 Received: from domino.astec.co.jp (domino [172.20.10.12]) by amont.astec.co.jp (8.6.9+2.4W/3.4Wbeta5-astecNoMX2.3) with SMTP id OAA18352; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 14:20:11 +0900 Received: by domino.astec.co.jp (4.1/astec-1.0) id AA05670; Mon, 9 Sep 96 14:20:10 JST Message-Id: <9609090520.AA05670@domino.astec.co.jp> To: kmiyakoda@ctn.co.jp Cc: freebsd-doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: $B$O$8$a$^$7$F(B In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 9 Sep 1996 14:05:10 +0900" References: <199609090504.OAA12063@comm.ctn.co.jp> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.28.1, Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=iso-2022-jp Date: Mon, 09 Sep 1996 14:20:10 +0900 From: Hanai Hiroyuki Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk $B$O$J$$$G$9(B > $B;E;v$G!"2a5n$K!"(BUNIX$B4XO"$NF~Lg=q$d(BSsytemV$B4X78$NJ8=q$J$I$rLu$7$?$3$H(B > $B$,$"$j$^$9!#$J$K$+$* > $BETED!!9nO:(B $B$O$8$a$^$7$F!"$O$J$$$G$9!#(B $B$($C$H!":#$N$H$3$m$O!"$=$l$>$l$K%U%!%$%k$KBP$7$F$O$=$l$>$lLu$K$b$=$&$$$&%U%!%$%k$,=P$F$/$k$+$b$7$l$^$;$s!#(B $B$^$?!"::FI$O$?$/$5$s$N?M$,$d$k$K$3$7$?$3$H$O$J$$$N$G$I$s$I$s$d$C$F$/$@$5$l$P!"(B $B$H;W$$$^$9!#(B $B$3$l$+$i!"$h$m$7$/$*4j$$$7$^$9!#(B $B$"!"$=$l$+$i!"(Bhttp://www.astec.co.jp/~hanai/FreeBSD/banquet.html $B$K;22C$7$^$;$s$G$9$+!)(B -----$B$O$J$$(B From owner-freebsd-doc Sun Sep 8 22:30:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA01341 for doc-outgoing; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 22:30:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp [202.239.16.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA01335 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 22:30:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from amont.astec.co.jp (amont.astec.co.jp [172.20.10.1]) by tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (8.6.12+2.5Wb7/3.4Wbeta5-astecMX2.3) with ESMTP id OAA16981 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 14:30:32 +0900 Received: from domino.astec.co.jp (domino [172.20.10.12]) by amont.astec.co.jp (8.6.9+2.4W/3.4Wbeta5-astecNoMX2.3) with SMTP id OAA18478 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 14:30:31 +0900 Received: by domino.astec.co.jp (4.1/astec-1.0) id AA05710; Mon, 9 Sep 96 14:30:31 JST Message-Id: <9609090530.AA05710@domino.astec.co.jp> To: freebsd-doc@FreeBSD.org Subject: I'm very sorry for sending Japanese mail. In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 09 Sep 1996 14:20:10 +0900" References: <9609090520.AA05670@domino.astec.co.jp> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.05+ on Emacs 19.28.1, Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 09 Sep 1996 14:30:30 +0900 From: Hanai Hiroyuki Sender: owner-doc@FreeBSD.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk To FreeBSD-doc@FreeBSD.ORG people I've just send you a mail written in Japanese with accident. If you received the unreadable mails from hanai@astec.co.jp, please discard it. Sorry, again -----H.Hanai From owner-freebsd-doc Sun Sep 8 23:39:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA03746 for doc-outgoing; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 23:39:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [204.216.27.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA03741 for ; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 23:39:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from time.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.7.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA14885; Sun, 8 Sep 1996 23:39:10 -0700 (PDT) To: Hanai Hiroyuki Cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: $B$O$8$a$^$7$F (B In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 09 Sep 1996 14:20:10 +0900." <9609090520.AA05670@domino.astec.co.jp> Date: Sun, 08 Sep 1996 23:39:10 -0700 Message-ID: <14883.842251150@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > $B$O$J$$$G$9(B I'm sorry, but the language of this list is english. Please see http://www.jp.freebsd.org for Japanese-specific FreeBSD resources. Thank you. Jordan From owner-freebsd-doc Mon Sep 9 00:04:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA04379 for doc-outgoing; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 00:04:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (ghpc6.ihf.RWTH-Aachen.DE [134.130.90.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA04371 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 00:04:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from thomas@localhost) by ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id JAA26847; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 09:00:53 +0200 From: Thomas Gellekum Message-Id: <199609090700.JAA26847@ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de> Subject: Re: Default paper size To: jfieber@indiana.edu (John Fieber) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 1996 09:00:53 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: doc@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from John Fieber at "Sep 7, 96 11:41:30 am" Organization: Institut f. Hochfrequenztechnik, RWTH Aachen X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL11 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John Fieber wrote: > I'm thinking of clever ways to set the paper size. Basically > > if (LANG is not set, or LANG == en_US.*) > use US Letter > else > use a4 > > Would this work for most people? Of course, there would be a > manual override. How about $PAPERSIZE? $LANG has too many side effects, IMHO. tg From owner-freebsd-doc Mon Sep 9 06:49:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id GAA21359 for doc-outgoing; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 06:49:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA21354 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 06:49:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA20478; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 08:49:29 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 1996 08:49:28 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: Hanai Hiroyuki cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: New conversion scheme in place. In-Reply-To: <9609090444.AA05610@domino.astec.co.jp> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 9 Sep 1996, Hanai Hiroyuki wrote: > In practice, I have one problem but it is because our japanese version of > SGML files are based on 2.1.5R and sgmls doesn't know 'ero' in the new > scheme. &ero; == & Use & If there is anything I can do that would make the japanese work better, let me know. I've been reading up on the topic in "Understanding Japanese Information Processing" so that I don't accidentally break it in the future, since I have some modification to instant in the pipeline that allow manipulating the data content of elements. I've also been studying various sources on various approaches using EUC, JIS, unicode and friends with SGML. Its all quite exciting and has even sparked an interest in learning some Japanese! -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fallout.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ================ From owner-freebsd-doc Mon Sep 9 07:06:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA22054 for doc-outgoing; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 07:06:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA22048 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 07:05:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA20515; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 09:05:47 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 1996 09:05:47 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: Hanai Hiroyuki cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: New conversion scheme in place. In-Reply-To: <9609090444.AA05610@domino.astec.co.jp> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 9 Sep 1996, Hanai Hiroyuki wrote: [missed this one...] > Next TODO is to discard linuxdoc and to adopt docbook? Ya. I have to go over my docbook->html translation, work out a couple things, then bring it and the DTD in. The docbook->html is almost at the point where it is genuinely useful; I have not begun docbook->troff and after the linuxdoc->troff, I'm not looking forward to it. The major issue left to be worked out with the HTML translation is splitting the document into multiple hypertext pages. With linuxdoc, the splitting is done by sgmlfmt as a post-processing operation. Instant will still require something to split the single output stream into multiple files, but I think I can do much more intelligent splitting in instant, simplifying sgmlfmt a great deal. The current simpleminded splitting mechanism results in some very large nodes, and a bazillion annoyingly small nodes; you spend a lot of time navigating menus before getting at the content. I hope to fix this for docbook. The other part of the equation is making a tranlation spec for instant to map linuxdoc elements to docbook elements. This should be pretty trivial to do. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fallout.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ================ From owner-freebsd-doc Mon Sep 9 08:58:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA27030 for doc-outgoing; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 08:58:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp [202.239.16.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA27008 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 08:58:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from amont.astec.co.jp (amont.astec.co.jp [172.20.10.1]) by tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (8.6.12+2.5Wb7/3.4Wbeta5-astecMX2.3) with ESMTP id AAA02227; Tue, 10 Sep 1996 00:58:23 +0900 Received: from astec.co.jp (hanaigw [192.168.23.1]) by amont.astec.co.jp (8.6.9+2.4W/3.4Wbeta5-astecNoMX2.3) with ESMTP id AAA26859; Tue, 10 Sep 1996 00:58:21 +0900 Received: from tau (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by astec.co.jp (8.7.5/3.5Wbeta-ppp) with ESMTP id AAA00307; Tue, 10 Sep 1996 00:42:06 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199609091542.AAA00307@astec.co.jp> To: jfieber@indiana.edu Cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: New conversion scheme in place. In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 9 Sep 1996 08:49:28 -0500 (EST)" References: X-Mailer: Mew version 1.06 on Emacs 19.28.1, Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 10 Sep 1996 00:42:06 +0900 From: Hiroyuki Hanai Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John Fieber wrote: > > In practice, I have one problem but it is because our japanese version of > > SGML files are based on 2.1.5R and sgmls doesn't know 'ero' in the new > > scheme. > > &ero; == & > > Use & Yes, I know. We've just finished the translation of 2.1.5R-based handbook into Japanese and next our TODO is to catch up the -current version of handbook. When we finish it, the above will not be a problem automatically. Next TODO is on FAQ and some documents. One or two weeks before, I found the 'tutorial' on the FreeBSD Web and I searched the source tree to find the source(SGML) files of 'tutorial' but I could not. Are they available? If so, we want to work on them because it is good document for beginners and usable to increase the FreeBSD users in Japan! We also have big TODO!, which is to include our Japanese version of handbook in the FreeBSD source tree but we don't have clear vision to do it. We are thinking where should the SGML files placed? or where the japanese version of groff should be placed? and so on. Do you have any idea? Anyway, I'm so poor at English to discuss about this issue ;-) but I think Satoshi(asami@FreeBSD.ORG) will help us and negotiate with CoreTeam about it. > If there is anything I can do that would make the japanese work > better, let me know. I've been reading up on the topic in > "Understanding Japanese Information Processing" so that I don't > accidentally break it in the future, since I have some > modification to instant in the pipeline that allow manipulating > the data content of elements. I've also been studying various Thank you very much for you cooperation!! It sounds great! Actually, we have no problem so far if we use EUC and I think it'll be no problem as long as you don't drop the 8th bit of the data content. > sources on various approaches using EUC, JIS, unicode and friends > with SGML. Its all quite exciting and has even sparked an > interest in learning some Japanese! Really? but I think there are serious problems when you want to support JIS code, isn't it? ;-( By the way, I wrote about SGML declaration for EUC a few days ago, how do you think of it? OK, I don't want to bother you and there is no problem in the current(sgmls+instant) sheme. So, please don't be nervous about it. -----H.Hanai P.S. Is there any plan to discard sgmls and use nsgmls for parsing? From owner-freebsd-doc Mon Sep 9 09:41:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA01687 for doc-outgoing; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 09:41:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA01676 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 09:41:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA20825; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 11:41:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 1996 11:41:14 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: Hiroyuki Hanai cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: New conversion scheme in place. In-Reply-To: <199609091542.AAA00307@astec.co.jp> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Tue, 10 Sep 1996, Hiroyuki Hanai wrote: > One or two weeks before, I found the 'tutorial' on the FreeBSD Web and > I searched the source tree to find the source(SGML) files of 'tutorial' > but I could not. > Are they available? Yes, from the web server. For each http://www.freebsd.org/tutorials/foo/foo.html, there is an http://www.freebsd.org/tutorials/foo/foo.sgml. Part of converting to docbook will involve re-evaluating the overall structure of the handbook, and possibly breaking it into a couple more distinct pieces. At that time, we can evaluate the best way to integrate these standalone tutorial type documents. > We also have big TODO!, which is to include our Japanese version of > handbook in the FreeBSD source tree but we don't have clear vision > to do it. I've been thinking about this too. I've got some ideas, but am open to suggestions. I gather the Japanese groff is distributed as patches against groff 1.10. Groff 1.10 which was just brought into current. I'd personally rather not take on the task of bringing the patches into -current. Would anyone like to take responsibility for investigating and ultimately implementing this? Regardless, we can still generate html for Japanese documents with or without j-groff. > Actually, we have no problem so far if we use EUC and I think it'll > be no problem as long as you don't drop the 8th bit of the data content. Dropping the 8th bit is no longer Politically Correct. ;-) > Really? but I think there are serious problems when you want to support > JIS code, isn't it? ;-( It seems like EUC is the path of least resistance so I don't think JIS will be necessary unless there is a particular demand. If I understand correctly, [shift-]JIS <--> EUC conversion is a fairly simple algorithm that could be bolted on the input and output of whatever tools need such conversion. Unicode requires a giant mapping table. > By the way, I wrote about SGML declaration for EUC a few days ago, > how do you think of it? I have not investigated it yet. > P.S. Is there any plan to discard sgmls and use nsgmls for parsing? One reason for sticking with sgmls: ~ $ size `which sgmls` text data bss dec hex 159744 24576 11544 195864 2fd18 ~ $ size `which nsgmls` text data bss dec hex 1089536 12288 8872 1110696 10f2a8 Also, compiling nsgmls on a 16meg or less machine causes pretty intense thrashing. Until we need something that sgmls just can't do (such as unicode), I'd prefer to stick with the old, compact sgmls. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fallout.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ================ From owner-freebsd-doc Mon Sep 9 11:16:41 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA09209 for doc-outgoing; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 11:16:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (root@mexico.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.253]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA09200 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 11:16:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (brasil.brainstorm.eu.org [193.56.58.33]) by mexico.brainstorm.eu.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA02359 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 20:16:28 +0200 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by brasil.brainstorm.eu.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with UUCP id UAA05470 for doc@freebsd.org; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 20:16:11 +0200 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.8.Beta.1/keltia-uucp-2.9) id UAA24375; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 20:10:55 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199609091810.UAA24375@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Mon, 9 Sep 1996 20:10:55 +0200 From: roberto@keltia.freenix.fr (Ollivier Robert) To: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: New conversion scheme in place. In-Reply-To: <199609091542.AAA00307@astec.co.jp>; from Hiroyuki Hanai on Sep 10, 1996 0:42:06 +0900 References: <199609091542.AAA00307@astec.co.jp> X-Mailer: Mutt 0.42 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#2443 Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk According to Hiroyuki Hanai: > -----H.Hanai > P.S. Is there any plan to discard sgmls and use nsgmls for parsing? nsgmls, while newer and probably better than sgmls, is also far bigger, requires C++ and so take an awful time to compile (and eats a lot of swap...). -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.freenix.fr FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #21: Sun Sep 8 14:35:00 MET DST 1996 From owner-freebsd-doc Mon Sep 9 19:14:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA06569 for doc-outgoing; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 19:14:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA06561 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 19:14:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA22243; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 21:14:11 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 1996 21:14:10 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: Thomas Gellekum cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Default paper size In-Reply-To: <199609090700.JAA26847@ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 9 Sep 1996, Thomas Gellekum wrote: > John Fieber wrote: > > I'm thinking of clever ways to set the paper size. Basically > > > > if (LANG is not set, or LANG == en_US.*) > > use US Letter > > else > > use a4 > > > > Would this work for most people? Of course, there would be a > > manual override. > > How about $PAPERSIZE? $LANG has too many side effects, IMHO. Is PAPERSIZE a commonly used environment variable? More common than LANG or LC_*? My goal is to make an intelligent guess about the default in the *absence* of an *explicit* statement on the part of the user. I thought that LANG, although imperfect, might provide the best guess. It also strikes me that knowing which timezone file is in use could be even more accurate. Is there a big penalty for having LANG set if you don't really need it? If not, maybe the installation procedure should prompt for a default, then the LANG variable would be a more reliable indication. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fallout.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ================ From owner-freebsd-doc Mon Sep 9 23:29:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id XAA19039 for doc-outgoing; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 23:29:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (ghpc6.ihf.RWTH-Aachen.DE [134.130.90.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA19033 for ; Mon, 9 Sep 1996 23:29:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from thomas@localhost) by ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.12/8.6.9) id IAA28595; Tue, 10 Sep 1996 08:28:52 +0200 From: Thomas Gellekum Message-Id: <199609100628.IAA28595@ghpc6.ihf.rwth-aachen.de> Subject: Re: Default paper size To: jfieber@indiana.edu (John Fieber) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 1996 08:28:51 +0200 (MET DST) Cc: thomas@ghpc8.ihf.rwth-aachen.de, doc@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from John Fieber at "Sep 9, 96 09:14:10 pm" Organization: Institut f. Hochfrequenztechnik, RWTH Aachen X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL11 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John Fieber wrote: > On Mon, 9 Sep 1996, Thomas Gellekum wrote: > > > John Fieber wrote: > > > I'm thinking of clever ways to set the paper size. Basically > > > > How about $PAPERSIZE? $LANG has too many side effects, IMHO. > > Is PAPERSIZE a commonly used environment variable? More common > than LANG or LC_*? No; I made it up. Define it in /etc/{profile,csh.login} and it's there. > My goal is to make an intelligent guess about the default in the > *absence* of an *explicit* statement on the part of the user. I > thought that LANG, although imperfect, might provide the best > guess. Oh. I misunderstood you. In this case, I agree. But defining a variable like PAPERSIZE as an explicit statement on part of the user could still be checked and override the LANG variable. Some of our ports could also benefit from it. E. g., some drivers in ghostscript can be compiled for a default papersize of A4. > Is there a big penalty for having LANG set if you don't really > need it? If not, maybe the installation procedure should prompt > for a default, then the LANG variable would be a more reliable > indication. I do remember tcsh spitting out german messages when LANG was set and I didn't like it. LANG would affect all the LC_* variables and I prefer to set only LC_CTYPE and leave the rest alone. tg From owner-freebsd-doc Wed Sep 11 00:57:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id AAA19377 for doc-outgoing; Wed, 11 Sep 1996 00:57:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from spsgate.sps.mot.com (spsgate.sps.mot.com [192.70.231.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA19370 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 1996 00:57:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mogate.sps.mot.com by spsgate.sps.mot.com (4.1/SMI-4.1/Email 2.1 10/25/93) id AA16102 for doc@freebsd.org; Wed, 11 Sep 96 00:56:56 MST Received: from emailsps (emailsps.sps.mot.com) by mogate.sps.mot.com (4.1/SMI-4.1/Email-2.0) id AA24849 for doc@freebsd.org; Wed, 11 Sep 96 00:56:56 MST Received: from 223.15.100.51 (yakushima [223.15.100.51]) by mdo.sps.mot.com (8.7.5/3.4W_mdo.server1.1-96030617) with SMTP id QAA23019 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 1996 16:56:51 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <32367162.7695@mdo.sps.mot.com> Date: Wed, 11 Sep 1996 16:59:30 +0900 From: Utsumi Syunichi X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01I [ja] (Macintosh; I; 68K) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Question about 5.3.4 in FreeBSD Handbook! X-Url: http://www.freebsd.org/docs.html Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-2022-jp Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello,I'm a novice user of FreeBSD. Following document is a portion of handbook40.html -------------------------------------------------------
controller wcd0

This device provides IDE CD-ROM support. Be sure to leave wdc1 uncommented if your CD-ROM is on its own controller card. To use this, you must also include the line options ATAPI.

------------------------------------------------------- I think 1st line is not correct. 'wcd0' is device so 1st line is 'device wcd0',I think. Is it correct? Utsumi Syunichi From owner-freebsd-doc Wed Sep 11 09:12:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA11787 for doc-outgoing; Wed, 11 Sep 1996 09:12:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA11781 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 1996 09:12:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA27064; Wed, 11 Sep 1996 11:12:26 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 1996 11:12:25 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: Utsumi Syunichi cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Question about 5.3.4 in FreeBSD Handbook! In-Reply-To: <32367162.7695@mdo.sps.mot.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 11 Sep 1996, Utsumi Syunichi wrote: > I think 1st line is not correct. 'wcd0' is device > so 1st line is 'device wcd0',I think. Is it correct? According to the LINT config file, you are correct. I've made the change in the handbook, thanks. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fallout.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ================ From owner-freebsd-doc Wed Sep 11 21:55:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id VAA05539 for doc-outgoing; Wed, 11 Sep 1996 21:55:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA05534 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 1996 21:55:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA28823 for ; Wed, 11 Sep 1996 23:55:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 1996 23:55:33 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: doc@freebsd.org Subject: localizing sgmls Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Would bi-lingual types be interested in localizing sgmls (the sgml parser)? The binary is all wired for message catalogs already. I extracted all the default strings and built an english catalog file. If anyone is up to translation, I'll send it out. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fallout.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ================ From owner-freebsd-doc Thu Sep 12 03:29:41 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA26925 for doc-outgoing; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 03:29:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.64.181]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA26919 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 03:29:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA01831; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 03:29:34 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 1996 03:29:34 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199609121029.DAA01831@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: doc@freebsd.org Subject: language-specific manuals From: asami@freebsd.org (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John, What do you think is the right place to put localized man pages? /usr/share/man/man?/${LANG} /usr/share/man/${LANG}/man? /usr/share/${LANG}/man/man? /usr/${LANG}/share/man/man? My guess would be the second, since that way you can just stick in the value of ${LANG} between the manpath component and the section subdirectories. The first is too fragmented, and the last two will require slicing something inside a manpath component. Also, how hard do you think it will be to add support for this to man? There are actually a few X ports that install manuals in /usr/X11R6/man/ja_JP.EUC/man?, it will be great if the Japanese people actually get to read it. (Of course there is an issue of groff not groking 2-byte charsets, but we'll get to that later.) Satoshi From owner-freebsd-doc Thu Sep 12 08:14:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA10235 for doc-outgoing; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 08:14:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp [202.239.16.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA10216 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 08:13:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from amont.astec.co.jp (amont.astec.co.jp [172.20.10.1]) by tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (8.6.12+2.5Wb7/3.4Wbeta5-astecMX2.3) with ESMTP id AAA12027; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 00:13:52 +0900 Received: from astec.co.jp (hanaigw [192.168.23.1]) by amont.astec.co.jp (8.6.9+2.4W/3.4Wbeta5-astecNoMX2.3) with ESMTP id AAA21427; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 00:13:50 +0900 Received: from tau (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by astec.co.jp (8.7.5/3.5Wbeta-ppp) with ESMTP id AAA01303; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 00:11:49 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199609121511.AAA01303@astec.co.jp> To: jfieber@indiana.edu Cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: New conversion scheme in place. In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 9 Sep 1996 11:41:14 -0500 (EST)" References: X-Mailer: Mew version 1.06 on Emacs 19.28.1, Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 13 Sep 1996 00:11:49 +0900 From: Hiroyuki Hanai Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Sorry to be late... John Fieber wrote: > Yes, from the web server. For each > http://www.freebsd.org/tutorials/foo/foo.html, there is an > http://www.freebsd.org/tutorials/foo/foo.sgml. Thank you. I've gotten them. > > We also have big TODO!, which is to include our Japanese version of > > handbook in the FreeBSD source tree but we don't have clear vision > > to do it. > > I've been thinking about this too. I've got some ideas, but am > open to suggestions. We(Japanese Documentation team) are discussing about this and I can send you our proposal in a few days. > groff 1.10. Groff 1.10 which was just brought into current. I'd > personally rather not take on the task of bringing the patches > into -current. Would anyone like to take responsibility for > investigating and ultimately implementing this? I'm looking for but so far I cannot find the person who can maintain and be responsible for (j)groff. If I cannot find in a few weeks, I'm going to try reading the source codes and the japanization patch, and I will tell you whether we can be responsible for groff. > Regardless, we can still generate html for Japanese documents > with or without j-groff. Yes!! > Dropping the 8th bit is no longer Politically Correct. ;-) (^_^) -----H.Hanai From owner-freebsd-doc Thu Sep 12 08:14:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA10244 for doc-outgoing; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 08:14:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp [202.239.16.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA10215 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 08:13:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from amont.astec.co.jp (amont.astec.co.jp [172.20.10.1]) by tokyonet-entrance.astec.co.jp (8.6.12+2.5Wb7/3.4Wbeta5-astecMX2.3) with ESMTP id AAA12023; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 00:13:50 +0900 Received: from astec.co.jp (hanaigw [192.168.23.1]) by amont.astec.co.jp (8.6.9+2.4W/3.4Wbeta5-astecNoMX2.3) with ESMTP id AAA21424; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 00:13:48 +0900 Received: from tau (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by astec.co.jp (8.7.5/3.5Wbeta-ppp) with ESMTP id XAA01286; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 23:58:50 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <199609121458.XAA01286@astec.co.jp> To: jfieber@indiana.edu Cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: localizing sgmls In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 11 Sep 1996 23:55:33 -0500 (EST)" References: X-Mailer: Mew version 1.06 on Emacs 19.28.1, Mule 2.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 12 Sep 1996 23:58:50 +0900 From: Hiroyuki Hanai Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk John Fieber wrote: > Would bi-lingual types be interested in localizing sgmls (the > sgml parser)? The binary is all wired for message catalogs > already. I extracted all the default strings and built an english > catalog file. If anyone is up to translation, I'll send it out. I want to translate it into Japanese. To tell the truth, a few employees of Fujitsu built japanese catalog file for sgmls two years ago. So, if I could work based on it, it will be very easy to build japanese catalog file. I'm now asking them whether I can use theirjapanese catalog file for FreeBSD. Anyway, could you please send me the english catalog file? -----H.Hanai From owner-freebsd-doc Thu Sep 12 15:42:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA08844 for doc-outgoing; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 15:42:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from novell.com (prv-mail20.Provo.Novell.COM [137.65.40.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA08839 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 15:41:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from INET-PRV-Message_Server by novell.com with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 16:42:27 -0600 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 4.1 Date: Thu, 12 Sep 1996 16:50:02 -0600 From: Darren Davis To: doc@freebsd.org Subject: SGML and HTML grammar verification. Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk What tools do you use to validate your SGML or HTML grammar (pages)? I see that there is weblint in the ports area, but it does not seem as strong as say the validator from University of Utah (ftp://ftp.math.utah.edu/pub/sgml). I have seen some tools out on the net that will peruse an HTML web structure and validate the grammar as well as the links. Any thoughts? Darren R. Davis Senior Software Engineer Novell, Inc. From owner-freebsd-doc Thu Sep 12 16:01:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA09941 for doc-outgoing; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 16:01:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cs.tu-berlin.de (root@mail.cs.tu-berlin.de [130.149.17.13]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA09932; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 16:00:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from campa.panke.de (anonymous213.ppp.cs.tu-berlin.de [130.149.17.213]) by mail.cs.tu-berlin.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id AAA27986; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 00:59:39 +0200 Received: (from wosch@localhost) by campa.panke.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA01805; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 00:59:20 +0200 Date: Fri, 13 Sep 1996 00:59:20 +0200 From: Wolfram Schneider Message-Id: <199609122259.AAA01805@campa.panke.de> To: asami@freebsd.org (Satoshi Asami) Cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: language-specific manuals In-Reply-To: <199609121029.DAA01831@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> References: <199609121029.DAA01831@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> Reply-to: Wolfram Schneider MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Satoshi Asami writes: >What do you think is the right place to put localized man pages? > >Also, how hard do you think it will be to add support for this to >man? It is already done in man-1.3. Should be available on any good Linux mirror. Wolfram From owner-freebsd-doc Thu Sep 12 17:25:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id RAA15200 for doc-outgoing; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 17:25:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA15193 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 17:25:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA01454; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 19:25:40 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 1996 19:25:40 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber To: Darren Davis cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: SGML and HTML grammar verification. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 12 Sep 1996, Darren Davis wrote: > What tools do you use to validate your SGML or HTML grammar (pages)? I > see that there is weblint in the ports area, but it does not seem as strong > as say the validator from University of Utah (ftp://ftp.math.utah.edu/pub/sgml). > I have seen some tools out on the net that will peruse an HTML web structure > and validate the grammar as well as the links. Any thoughts? The One True Way to validate the markup of a web page (or any SGML) is with a validating SGML parser and a DTD. FreeBSD includes the parser (sgmls) and HTML DTDs are available from http://www.w3.org/pub/WWW/MarkUp/. HOWEVER, just because a page passes validation, doesn't mean a browser will be happy with it. In particular, SGML (and HTML) offer a bunch of markup minimization techniques that are technically correct, but will confuse most browsers. I've found various forms of attribute minimization to be particularly problematic. A good way to combat this problem is with an SGML normalizer which expands all markup minimization to its fully qualified form. For example, <HEAD> <TITLE>This is the title

This is the title

I assure you that many more browsers will correctly render the normalized version than the un-normalized, even though both are structurally identical! James Clark's excellent SP package (http://www.jclark.com/) includes an SGML normalizer. For validating links, MOMspider is pretty good. I don't have a URL handy though. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fallout.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ================ From owner-freebsd-doc Thu Sep 12 18:29:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id SAA18879 for doc-outgoing; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 18:29:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA18874 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 18:28:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA01588 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 20:28:55 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 1996 20:28:54 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber Reply-To: John Fieber To: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: localizing sgmls In-Reply-To: <199609121458.XAA01286@astec.co.jp> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 12 Sep 1996, Hiroyuki Hanai wrote: > Anyway, could you please send me the english catalog file? Mail to hanai@hanaigw.astec.co.jp is bouncing with a "host unknown" message. Well, for anyone who wants it, here is the english catalog for sgmls. Happy translating! -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fallout.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ================ $quote " $ $set 1 TEXT_SET $ 1 "%s element not allowed at this point in %s element" 2 "%s markup declaration not permitted here; declaration ended" 3 "Length of name, number, or token exceeded NAMELEN or LITLEN limit" 4 "Non-SGML character ignored" 5 "%s end-tag ignored: doesn't end any open element (current is %s)" 6 "%s start-tag exceeds open element limit; possible lies from %s on" 7 "Start-tag omitted from %s with empty content" 8 "Illegal entity end in markup or delimited text" 9 "Incorrect character in markup; markup terminated" 10 "Data not allowed at this point in %s element" 11 "No element declaration for %s end-tag GI; end-tag ignored" 12 "%s name ignored: not a syntactically valid SGML name" 13 "%s = \"%s\" attribute ignored: not defined for this element" 14 "%s = \"%s\" attribute value defaulted: invalid character" 15 "%s = \"%s\" attribute value defaulted: token too long" 16 "%s = \"%s\" attribute value defaulted: too many tokens" 17 "%s = \"%s\" attribute value defaulted: wrong token type" 18 "%s = \"%s\" attribute value defaulted: token not in group" 19 "Required %s attribute was not specified; may affect processing" 20 "%s end-tag implied by %s end-tag; not minimizable" 21 "%s start-tag implied by %s start-tag; not minimizable" 22 "Possible attributes treated as data because none were defined" 23 "Duplicate specification occurred for \"%s\"; may affect processing" 24 "\"%s\" keyword invalid; declaration terminated" 25 "%s = \"%s\" attribute defaulted: empty string not allowed for token" 26 "Marked section end ignored; not in a marked section" 27 "Marked section start ignored; %s marked sections open already" 28 "One or more parameters missing; declaration ignored" 29 "\"PUBLIC\" or \"SYSTEM\" required; declaration terminated" 30 "%s element ended prematurely; required %s omitted" 31 "Entity \"%s\" terminated: could not read file" 32 "Could not open file for entity \"%s\"; entity reference ignored" 33 "Insufficient main memory; unable to continue parsing" 34 "%s entity reference ignored; exceeded open entity limit (%s)" 35 "No declaration for entity \"%s\"; reference ignored" 36 "%s entity reference occurred within own text; reference ignored" 37 "Entity nesting level out of sync" 38 "Parameter entity text cannot have %s keyword; keyword ignored" 39 "%s end-tag implied by %s start-tag; not minimizable" 40 "Start-tag minimization ignored; element has required attribute" 41 "Required %s element cannot be excluded from %s element" 42 "No DOCTYPE declaration; document type is unknown" 43 "Undefined %1$s start-tag GI was used in DTD; \"%1$s O O ANY\" assumed" 44 "Invalid character(s) ignored; attempting to resume DOCTYPE subset" 45 "No declaration for entity \"%s\"; default definition used" 46 "%s end-tag implied by NET delimiter; not minimizable" 47 "%s end-tag implied by data; not minimizable" 48 "%s end-tag implied by short start-tag (no GI); not minimizable" 49 "%s start-tag implied by data; not minimizable" 50 "%s start-tag implied by short start-tag (no GI); not minimizable" 51 "Short end-tag (no GI) ignored: no open elements" 52 "No definition for %1$s document type; \"%1$s O O ANY\" assumed" 53 "No definition for %1$s implied start-tag; \"%1$s O O ANY\" assumed" 54 "%s element ended prematurely; required subelement omitted" 55 "Content model token %s: connectors conflict; first was used" 56 "Duplicate specification occurred for \"%s\"; duplicate ignored" 57 "Bad end-tag in R/CDATA element; treated as short (no GI) end-tag" 58 "Start-tag minimization should be \"-\" for element with declared content" 59 "Reference to PI entity not permitted here; reference ignored" 60 "Non-SGML character found; should have been character reference" 61 "Numeric character reference exceeds 255; reference ignored" 62 "Invalid alphabetic character reference ignored" 63 "Invalid character in minimum literal; character ignored" 64 "Keyword %s ignored; \"%s\" is not a valid marked section keyword" 65 "Parameter entity name longer than (NAMELEN-1); truncated" 66 "Start-tag length exceeds TAGLEN limit; parsed correctly" 67 "%s attribute defaulted: FIXED attribute must equal default" 68 "Duplicate specification occurred for \"%s\"; duplicate ignored" 69 "%s = \"%s\" IDREF attribute ignored: referenced ID does not exist" 70 "%s = \"%s\" IDREF attribute ignored: number of IDs in list exceeds GRPCNT limit" 71 "%s = \"%s\" ID attribute ignored: ID in use for another element" 72 "%s = \"%s\" ENTITY attribute not general entity; may affect processing" 73 "%s = \"%s\" attribute ignored: previously specified in same list" 74 "\"?\" = \"%s\" name token ignored: not in any group in this list" 75 "Normalized attribute specification length over ATTSPLEN limit" 76 "%s = \"%s\" NOTATION ignored: element content is empty" 77 "%s = \"%s\" NOTATION undefined: may affect processing" 78 "Entity \"%2$s\" has undefined notation \"%1$s\"" 79 "%s = \"%s\" default attribute value not in group; #IMPLIED used" 80 "#CURRENT default value treated as #IMPLIED for %s ID attribute" 81 "ID attribute %s cannot have a default value; treated as #IMPLIED" 82 "%s attribute must be token, not empty string; treated as #IMPLIED" 83 "NOTATION attribute ignored for EMPTY element" 84 "%s = \"%s\" NOTATION ignored: content reference specified" 85 "#CONREF default value treated as #IMPLIED for EMPTY element" 86 "%s = \"%s\" entity not data entity; may affect processing" 87 "End-tag minimization should be \"O\" for EMPTY element" 88 "Formal public identifier \"%s\" invalid; treated as informal" 89 "Out-of-context %2$s start-tag ended %1$s document element (and parse)" 90 "\"%s\" keyword is for unsupported feature; declaration terminated" 91 "Attribute specification list in prolog cannot be empty" 92 "Document ended invalidly within a literal; parsing ended" 93 "General entity \"%s\" in short reference map \"%s\" undeclared" 94 "Could not reopen file to continue entity \"%s\"; entity terminated" 95 "Out-of-context data ended %s document element (and parse)" 96 "Short start-tag (no GI) ended %s document element (and parse)" 97 "DSO delimiter (%s) omitted from marked section declaration" 98 "Group token %s: duplicate name or name token \"%s\" ignored" 99 "Attempt to redefine %s attribute ignored" 100 "%s definition ignored: %s is not a valid declared value keyword" 101 "%s definition ignored: NOTATION attribute already defined" 102 "%s definition ignored: ID attribute already defined" 103 "%s definition ignored: no declared value specified" 104 "%s definition ignored: invalid declared value specified" 105 "%s definition ignored: number of names or name tokens in group exceeded GRPCNT limit" 106 "%s definition ignored: name group omitted for NOTATION attribute" 107 "#CONREF default value treated as #IMPLIED for %s ID attribute" 108 "%s definition ignored: %s is not a valid default value keyword" 109 "%s definition ignored: no default value specified" 110 "%s definition ignored: invalid default value specified" 111 "More than ATTCNT attribute names and/or name (token) values; terminated" 112 "Attempted redefinition of attribute definition list ignored" 113 "Content model token %s: more than GRPCNT model group tokens; terminated" 114 "Content model token %s: more than GRPGTCNT content model tokens; terminated" 115 "Content model token %s: more than GRPLVL nested model groups; terminated" 116 "Content model token %s: %s invalid; declaration terminated" 117 "\"PUBLIC\" specified without public ID; declaration terminated" 118 "\"%s\" keyword invalid (only %s permitted); declaration terminated" 119 "\"%s\" specified without notation name; declaration terminated" 120 "Parameter must be a name; declaration terminated" 121 "Parameter must be a GI or a group of them; declaration terminated" 122 "Parameter must be a name or PERO (%%); declaration terminated" 123 "Parameter must be a literal; declaration terminated" 124 "\"%s\" not valid short reference delimiter; declaration terminated" 125 "Map does not exist; declaration ignored" 126 "MDC delimiter (>) expected; following text may be misinterpreted" 127 "Document ended invalidly within prolog; parsing ended" 128 "\"PUBLIC\" or \"SYSTEM\" or DSO ([) required; declaration terminated" 129 "Minimization must be \"-\" or \"O\" (not \"%s\"); declaration terminated" 130 "Content model or keyword expected; declaration terminated" 131 "Rank stem \"%s\" + suffix \"%s\" more than NAMELEN characters; not defined" 132 "Undefined %s start-tag GI ignored; not used in DTD" 133 "Document ended invalidly within a markup declaration; parsing ended" 134 "Normalized length of literal exceeded %s; markup terminated" 135 "R/CDATA marked section in declaration subset; prolog terminated" 136 "%s = \"%s\" ENTITIES attribute ignored: more than GRPCNT in list" 137 "Content model is ambiguous" 138 "Invalid parameter entity name \"%s\"" 139 "Document ended invalidly within a marked section; parsing ended" 140 "Element \"%s\" used in DTD but not defined" 141 "Invalid NDATA or SUBDOC entity reference occurred; ignored" 142 "Associated element type not allowed in document instance" 143 "Illegal DSC character; in different entity from DSO" 144 "Declared value of data attribute cannot be ID" 145 "Invalid reference to external CDATA or SDATA entity; ignored" 146 "Could not find external document type \"%s\"" 147 "Could not find external general entity \"%s\"" 148 "Could not find external parameter entity \"%s\"" 149 "Reference to non-existent general entity \"%s\" ignored" 150 "Could not find entity \"%s\" using default declaration" 151 "Could not find entity \"%2$s\" in attribute %1$s using default declaration" 152 "Short reference map \"%s\" used in USEMAP declaration but not defined; declaration will be ignored" 153 "End-tag minimization should be \"O\" for element with CONREF attribute" 154 "Declared value of data attribute cannot be ENTITY or ENTITIES" 155 "Declared value of data attribute cannot be IDREF or IDREFS" 156 "Declared value of data attribute cannot be NOTATION" 157 "CURRENT cannot be specified for a data attribute" 158 "CONREF cannot be specified for a data attribute" 159 "Parameter must be a number or CONTROLS or NONE" 160 "Cannot create temporary file" 161 "Document ended invalidly within SGML declaration" 162 "Capacity limit %s exceeded by %s points" 163 "Amendment 1 requires \"ISO 8879:1986\" instead of \"ISO 8879-1986\"" 164 "Non-markup, non-minimum data character in SGML declaration" 165 "Parameter cannot be a literal" 166 "Invalid concrete syntax scope \"%s\"" 167 "Parameter must be a number" 168 "\"%s\" should have been \"%s\"" 169 "Character number %s is not supported as an additional name character" 170 "Parameter must be a literal or \"%s\"" 171 "Bad character description for character %s" 172 "Character number %s is described more than once" 173 "Character number plus number of characters exceeds 256" 174 "No description for upper half of character set: assuming \"128 128 UNUSED\"" 175 "Character number %s was not described; assuming UNUSED" 176 "Non-significant shunned character number %s not declared UNUSED" 177 "Significant character \"%s\" cannot be non-SGML" 178 "Unknown capacity set \"%s\"" 179 "No capacities specified." 180 "Unknown concrete syntax \"%s\"" 181 "Character number exceeds 255" 182 "Concrete syntax SWITCHES not supported" 183 "\"INSTANCE\" scope not supported" 184 "Value of \"%s\" feature must be one or more" 185 "\"%s\" invalid; must be \"YES\" or \"NO\"" 186 "\"%s\" invalid; must be \"PUBLIC\" or \"SGMLREF\"" 187 "Feature \"%s\" is not supported" 188 "Too many open subdocument entities" 189 "Invalid formal public identifier" 190 "Public text class must be \"%s\"" 191 "Use of character number %s as an SGML character is not supported" 192 "Notation \"%s\" not defined in DTD" 193 "Unclosed start or end tag requires \"SHORTTAG YES\"" 194 "Net-enabling start tag requires \"SHORTTAG YES\"" 195 "Attribute name omission requires \"SHORTTAG YES\"" 196 "Undelimited attribute value requires \"SHORTTAG YES\"" 197 "Attribute specification omitted for \"%s\": requires markup minimization" 198 "Concrete syntax does not have any short reference delimiters" 199 "Character number %s not in the base character set; assuming UNUSED" 200 "Character number %s is UNUSED in the syntax reference character set" 201 "Character number %s was not described in the syntax reference character set" 202 "Character number %s in the syntax reference character set has no corresponding character in the system character set" 203 "Character number %s was described using an unknown base set" 204 "Duplication specification for added function \"%s\"" 205 "Added function character cannot be \"%s\"" 206 "Only reference concrete syntax function characters supported" 207 "Only reference concrete syntax general delimiters supported" 208 "Only reference concrete syntax short reference delimiters supported" 209 "Unrecognized keyword \"%s\"" 210 "Unrecognized quantity name \"%s\"" 211 "Interpretation of \"%s\" is not a valid name in the declared concrete syntax" 212 "Replacement reserved name \"%s\" cannot be reference reserved name" 213 "Duplicate replacement reserved name \"%s\"" 214 "Quantity \"%s\" must not be less than %s" 215 "Only values up to %2$s are supported for quantity \"%1$s\"" 216 "%s element cannot be excluded from %s element because it is neither inherently optional nor a member of an or group" 217 "Marked section not allowed in other prolog" 218 "Required %s attribute was not specified for entity %s" 219 "UCNMSTRT must have the same number of characters as LCNMSTRT" 220 "UCNMCHAR must have the same number of characters as LCNMCHAR" 221 "Character number %s assigned to both LCNMSTRT or UCNMSTRT and LCNMCHAR or UCNMCHAR" 222 "Character number %s cannot be an additional name character" 223 "It is unsupported for \"-\" not to be assigned to UCNMCHAR or LCNMCHAR" 224 "Normalized length of value of attribute \"%s\" exceeded LITLEN" 225 "Length of interpreted parameter literal exceeds LITLEN less the length of the bracketing delimiters" 226 "Start tag of document element omitted; not minimizable" 227 "Unrecognized designating escape sequence \"%s\"" 228 "Earlier reference to entity \"%s\" used default entity" 229 "Reference to non-existent parameter entity \"%s\" ignored" 230 "DSC within marked section; marked section terminated" 231 "Document element end tag can only occur in document element because entity end not allowed in other prolog" 232 "Character reference not allowed in other prolog" 233 "USEMAP declaration not allowed in other prolog" 234 "Entity reference not allowed in other prolog" 235 "Value assigned to capacity %s exceeds value assigned to TOTALCAP" $ $set 2 HEADER_SET $ 1 "In file included" 2 "SGML error" 3 "Unsupported feature" 4 "Error" 5 "Warning" 6 " at %s, %.0sline %lu" 7 " at entity %s, line %lu" 8 "%.0s%.0s in declaration parameter %d" 9 "%.0s in declaration parameter %d" 10 "%.0s" 11 " at end of file" 12 " at end of entity" 13 " at record start" 14 " at record end" 15 " at \"%c\"" 16 " at \"\\%03o\"" 17 " accessing \"%s\"" 18 "Element structure:" $ $ PARAM_SET $ $set 3 1 "character data" 2 "element content" 3 "mixed content" 4 "replaceable character data" 5 "tag close" 6 "content model group" 7 "content model occurrence indicator" 8 "name group" 9 "name token group" 10 "system data" 11 "parameter literal" 12 "attribute value literal" 13 "tokenized attribute value literal" 14 "minimum literal" 15 "markup declaration" 16 "markup declaration comment" 17 "ignored markup declaration" 18 "declaration subset" 19 "CDATA marked section" 20 "IGNORE marked section" 21 "RCDATA marked section" 22 "prolog" 23 "reference" 24 "attribute specification list" 25 "tokenized attribute value" 26 "attribute specification list close" 27 "SGML declaration" 28 "attribute definition list" 29 "document type" 30 "element" 31 "entity" 32 "link type" 33 "link set" 34 "notation" 35 "SGML" 36 "short reference mapping" 37 "link set use" 38 "short reference use" $ $set 4 APP_SET $ 1 "Out of memory" 2 "Cannot open SGML document entity" 3 "Cannot exec `%s': %s" 4 "Cannot fork: %s" 5 "Error waiting for process: %s" 6 "Program %s got fatal signal %d" 7 "Cannot open `%s': %s" 8 "Subdocument capacity botch" 9 "Non-existent subdocument entity `%s' not processed" $ $set 5 CAT_SET $ 1 "Name expected" 2 "Literal expected" 3 "Missing argument" 4 "Only minimum data characters allowed in a public identifier" 5 "End of file in comment" 6 "End of file in literal" 7 "Nul character is not allowed" 8 "Cannot open `%s': %s" 9 "Error reading `%s': %s" 10 "Error closing `%s': %s" From owner-freebsd-doc Thu Sep 12 19:34:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id TAA21509 for doc-outgoing; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 19:34:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (fallout.campusview.indiana.edu [149.159.1.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA21502; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 19:34:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jfieber@localhost) by fallout.campusview.indiana.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA01758; Thu, 12 Sep 1996 21:34:20 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 1996 21:34:19 -0500 (EST) From: John Fieber Reply-To: John Fieber To: Satoshi Asami cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: language-specific manuals In-Reply-To: <199609121029.DAA01831@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 12 Sep 1996, Satoshi Asami wrote: > What do you think is the right place to put localized man pages? You must be reading my mind! I was just thinking about this. > /usr/share/man/man?/${LANG} > /usr/share/man/${LANG}/man? > /usr/share/${LANG}/man/man? > /usr/${LANG}/share/man/man? > > My guess would be the second, since that way you can just stick in the > value of ${LANG} between the manpath component and the section > subdirectories. In the latest version of man(1) that Wolfram mentioned, the second is implemented. It seems reasonable to me. What I'm not so sure on is how they should be laid out in the source tree. For the message catalogs, I looked at how ee was laid out: ee/ nls/ de_DE.ISO_8859-1/ ee.msg en_US.ISO_8859-1/ ee.msg fr_FR.ISO_8859-1/ ee.msg Which amounts to more directories than files. On the other hand, it does nicely mirror the installed state. The top level makefile runs gencat as part of the installation process, depositing the output directly in the install directory. This, of course, opens possibilties for build errors occuring during an install which isn't aesthetically pleasing. It would be nice if they were built in the all target, but dealing with obj directories could get messy when all subdirs are done with a single makefile. Adding makefiles to the above directories would create more makefiles than files to make! For man pages, one approach would be to use a similar scheme, slightly modified to infer the man? layer of directories from the filename extension: ee/ man/ de_DE.ISO_8859-1/ ee.1 en_US.ISO_8859-1/ ee.1 fr_FR.ISO_8859-1/ ee.1 Also note that this puts the english man page on a level with the other languages. Some might appreciate this turn of events. Of course, if they were actually installed that way, man(1) would have to know which language to fall back on if no page was found in the directory indicated by $LANG. If the layout is standardized enough, then populating the nls and man directories with Makefiles could probably be avoided. Or, we could cut out the man an nls directory layer entirely and merge the two, but then you have files in a single directory being installed in different places in the system (assuming both catalogs and man pages). Finally, how about selective building and installing? Japanese man pages, for example, wouldn't be very helpful to me. I can imagine the binary distribution having optional "language packs" including any localized man pages and message catalogs. But then how about installing a hybrid including localized man pages, and a subset of english man pages to fill in where the localized ones are not present... (Having a panic attack yet Jordan?) With the handbook, the problem arises of having multiple translations of some files, but not others, yet *a* version of each is needed to build the whole handbook, regardless of language. Consequently, some files may be shared between different versions. Actually, this isn't a difficult problem to solve, but should the english version be installed in /usr/share/doc/handbook, or /usr/share/doc/handbook/en_US.ISO_8859-1? There are a lot of logistical details once you start thinking about it. -john == jfieber@indiana.edu =========================================== == http://fallout.campusview.indiana.edu/~jfieber ================ From owner-freebsd-doc Fri Sep 13 07:57:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA25109 for doc-outgoing; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 07:57:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from novell.com (prv-mail20.Provo.Novell.COM [137.65.40.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA25104 for ; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 07:57:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from INET-PRV-Message_Server by novell.com with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 08:57:10 -0600 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 4.1 Date: Fri, 13 Sep 1996 09:05:14 -0600 From: Darren Davis To: jfieber@indiana.edu Cc: doc@freebsd.org Subject: Re: SGML and HTML grammar verification. - Reply Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Thanks, just the info I was looking for. I allready looked at the 'sgmls' command, it seemed to do some of the things I needed but not all. Mainly, my problem is I am responsible for a departmental Web page. Everybody in the group has access and ability to make links. What I have found is a large amount of "trash" in the Web directory structure with many files not linked at all. I want a tool that can start at the top with the index.html file and tell me what is and is not linked. That way I can throw out the trash. Also, I am looking into the best way to manage the documents through some revision control system. Thanks again, Darren From owner-freebsd-doc Fri Sep 13 14:24:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA18400 for doc-outgoing; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 14:24:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from servidor.dgsca.unam.mx (redvax1.dgsca.unam.mx [132.248.104.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA18392 for ; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 14:24:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from guerrero ([200.4.130.210]) by servidor.dgsca.unam.mx (5.0/SMI-SVR4) id AA07061; Fri, 13 Sep 1996 16:25:55 +0600 Message-Id: <30CF5218.766@servidor.unam.mx> Date: Wed, 13 Dec 1995 16:22:16 -0600 From: "Jos\i Antonio Nava V\ilez" Organization: Aproceg, A.C. X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-doc@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: (no subject) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-doc@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk subscribe From owner-freebsd-doc Sat Sep 14 03:03:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id DAA29215 for doc-outgoing; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 03:03:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.64.181]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA29209 for ; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 03:03:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.7.5/8.6.9) id DAA06402; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 03:02:15 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 14 Sep 1996 03:02:15 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199609141002.DAA06402@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: jfieber@indiana.edu CC: doc@freebsd.org In-reply-to: (message from John Fieber on Thu, 12 Sep 1996 21:34:19 -0500 (EST)) Subject: Re: language-specific manuals From: asami@freebsd.org (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-doc@freebsd.org X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk * > What do you think is the right place to put localized man pages? * * You must be reading my mind! I was just thinking about this. Yeah, I got that tingle behind my ears saying "John is thinking about this, John is thinking about this" so I decided to prod you! Yay! * > /usr/share/man/man?/${LANG} * > /usr/share/man/${LANG}/man? * > /usr/share/${LANG}/man/man? * > /usr/${LANG}/share/man/man? * In the latest version of man(1) that Wolfram mentioned, the second * is implemented. It seems reasonable to me. Ok. So, when are we going to pull in that wonderful upgrade? :) * What I'm not so sure on is how they should be laid out in the source * tree. For the message catalogs, I looked at how ee was laid out: Aahh. You're right, I totally forgot that man pages are scattered all over the place (unlike the handbook).... * ee/ * man/ * de_DE.ISO_8859-1/ * ee.1 * en_US.ISO_8859-1/ * ee.1 * fr_FR.ISO_8859-1/ * ee.1 * * Also note that this puts the english man page on a level with the * other languages. Some might appreciate this turn of events. Of I'm not so sure about that. For one thing, citizens of Canada/UK may be greatly offended with the implication that they somehow have to piggyback on a certain country.... :> * course, if they were actually installed that way, man(1) would have * to know which language to fall back on if no page was found in the * directory indicated by $LANG. Yes, that too. * If the layout is standardized enough, then populating the nls and man * directories with Makefiles could probably be avoided. Absolutely. * Or, we could cut out the man an nls directory layer entirely and * merge the two, but then you have files in a single directory being * installed in different places in the system (assuming both catalogs * and man pages). Many programs don't have message catalogs anyway, so I don't think we should worry too much about merging the two. I'd just put nls man pages in man/${LANG}, and leave the English version upstairs (where it is now, or in man/). * Finally, how about selective building and installing? Japanese man * pages, for example, wouldn't be very helpful to me. I can imagine * the binary distribution having optional "language packs" including * any localized man pages and message catalogs. But then how about * installing a hybrid including localized man pages, and a subset * of english man pages to fill in where the localized ones are not * present... (Having a panic attack yet Jordan?) To make Jordan's life easier later, I suggest we use a new variable for building options (build all, build only one specified in ${LANG}, build English only, loop through building one language at a time...). * With the handbook, the problem arises of having multiple translations * of some files, but not others, yet *a* version of each is needed to * build the whole handbook, regardless of language. Consequently, some * files may be shared between different versions. For the handbook, I'd say keep it inside each directory. This is a "book", and has to be updated coherently as such. I don't think sharing anything (other than Makefiles) between languages is a good idea, even things like lists.sgml need to be translated. * Actually, this isn't * a difficult problem to solve, but should the english version be * installed in /usr/share/doc/handbook, or * /usr/share/doc/handbook/en_US.ISO_8859-1? (I think bsd.sgml.mk requires the last path component of the source to be "handbook", but I digress. :) I prefer /usr/share/doc/${LANG}/handbook. If we are going to default to English when ${LANG} is not set, then the English version should stay where it is now (just take out ${LANG} from the above pathname and see where it points to :). * There are a lot of logistical details once you start thinking about * it. Yep.... Satoshi From owner-freebsd-doc Sat Sep 14 22:27:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-doc Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id WAA04479 for doc-outgoing; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 22:27:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ferrari.top.ca ([198.168.83.228]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA04474 for ; Sat, 14 Sep 1996 22:27:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ATM.top.ca ([205.205.81.3]) by ferrari.top.ca (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-11475) with SMTP id AAA232 for ; Sun, 15 Sep 1996 01:24:42 -0400 Message-ID: <323B94BE.2100@top.ca> Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1996 01:31:42 -0400 From: atm@top.ca (ATM Services) Organization: ATM Services inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-doc@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Logging on to a server FREEBSD with PPP connection X-URL: http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/handbook18.html Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-doc@FreeBSD.ORG X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi to someone who read this, In the documentation you said: You also need to know how to use the various ``AT commands'' to dial the ISP with your particular modem as the PPP dialer provides only a very simple terminal emulator. I want to know how I can easely connect to my provider whit this terminal emulator. Do I have to write some script to dial. My provider server run on Windows NT. Can you help me caus ive read everything in documentation but still stock. Thanks folks. Jean-René from Montreal