From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 01:33:06 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA23652 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:33:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from salinger.birdbrain.net (c355152-a.frmt1.sfba.home.com [24.1.65.56]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA23647 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:33:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kathey@pobox.com) Received: from maugham (maugham.birdbrain.intnet [192.168.177.2]) by salinger.birdbrain.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id BAA05759; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:32:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kathey@pobox.com) Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> X-Sender: kathey7@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:32:42 -0800 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG From: -kevin- Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-Reply-To: <49859.915950870.1@zippy.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jordan, At 10:47 PM 1/9/99 -0800, you wrote: >What can we do to change this in 1999? Well, I've also heard our >advocate corps calling for logistical support ("Backup! We need some >*backup* here!!") and I've listened to them, part of my project for I know this may sound trite but any time I introduce someone to FreeBSD they inevitably ask, "What's the deal with the demon?" So my suggestion is that we change our mascot to something more benign. -* -kevin- *- -* sick with the good infection *- -* kathey@pobox.com *- -* http://www.pobox.com/~kathey *- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 01:45:16 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA24948 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:45:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from jive.dub.net (jive.dub.net [169.197.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA24943 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:45:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from unfurl@jive.dub.net) Received: (from unfurl@localhost) by jive.dub.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) id CAA05298 for advocacy@freebsd.org; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 02:44:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from unfurl) Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 02:44:37 -0700 From: Unfurl To: FreeBSD Advocacy Subject: Seattle Users Group Message-ID: <19990110024437.A5286@dub.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I recently moved to the Seattle area and I checked out a few of the Linux users groups (due to the lack of a FreeBSD group). I am really excited about starting a Seattle Area FreeBSD Users Group. If anyone is interested please contact me. Thanks! -Bill -- unfurl@dub.net - This is a munition. Fight Back! #!/bin/perl -sp0777i Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA25084 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:47:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from shell6.ba.best.com (shell6.ba.best.com [206.184.139.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA25064 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:47:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkb@shell6.ba.best.com) Received: (from jkb@localhost) by shell6.ba.best.com (8.9.1/8.9.0/best.sh) id BAA20303 for advocacy@freebsd.org; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:46:33 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <19990110014633.A20236@best.com> Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:46:33 -0800 From: "Jan B. Koum " To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: <49859.915950870.1@zippy.cdrom.com> <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com>; from -kevin- on Sun, Jan 10, 1999 at 01:32:42AM -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Jan 10, 1999 at 01:32:42AM -0800, -kevin- wrote: > Jordan, > > At 10:47 PM 1/9/99 -0800, you wrote: > >What can we do to change this in 1999? Well, I've also heard our > >advocate corps calling for logistical support ("Backup! We need some > >*backup* here!!") and I've listened to them, part of my project for > > I know this may sound trite but any time I introduce someone to FreeBSD > they inevitably ask, "What's the deal with the demon?" > So my suggestion is that we change our mascot to something more benign. > Never. -- Yan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 01:52:02 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA25366 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:52:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from orcrist.mediacity.com (orcrist.mediacity.com [208.138.36.146]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA25361 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:52:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gsutter@orcrist.mediacity.com) Received: (from gsutter@localhost) by orcrist.mediacity.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA18285; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:51:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gsutter) Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:51:24 -0800 From: Gregory Sutter To: -kevin- Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Message-ID: <19990110015124.H10346@orcrist.mediacity.com> References: <49859.915950870.1@zippy.cdrom.com> <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com>; from -kevin- on Sun, Jan 10, 1999 at 01:32:42AM -0800 Organization: Zer0 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Jan 10, 1999 at 01:32:42AM -0800, -kevin- wrote: > > At 10:47 PM 1/9/99 -0800, jkh wrote: > >What can we do to change this in 1999? Well, I've also heard our > >advocate corps calling for logistical support ("Backup! We need some > >*backup* here!!") and I've listened to them, part of my project for > > I know this may sound trite but any time I introduce someone to FreeBSD > they inevitably ask, "What's the deal with the demon?" > So my suggestion is that we change our mascot to something more benign. Kevin, It's not really a devil; a daemon is entirely different. The Shorter Oxford English Dictionary contains: Demon Also dæmon. ME [In form, and in sense I, a. L. dæmon (med. L. demon)...] 1. Gr. Myth. A being of a nature intermediate between that of gods and men; an inferior divinity, spirit (including the souls of deceased persons). Often written dæmon for distinction. 1569. Take a look at for the whole story, courtesy of Greg Lehey. Greg -- Gregory S. Sutter Cole's Law: Thinly sliced cabbage. mailto:gsutter@pobox.com http://www.pobox.com/~gsutter/ PGP DSS public key 0x40AE3052 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 01:59:55 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA26271 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:59:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA26266 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:59:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id BAA50756; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:59:09 -0800 (PST) To: -kevin- cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:32:42 PST." <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:59:08 -0800 Message-ID: <50752.915962348@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > I know this may sound trite but any time I introduce someone to FreeBSD > they inevitably ask, "What's the deal with the demon?" > So my suggestion is that we change our mascot to something more benign. Not gonna happen. For every one person you could ever possibly find who thought the "demon" was negative advertising, I could find you ten who thought he was just terrific. Go to Japan, you'll find something approaching a small cult for the little guy - he's wildly popular there. Not everyone has such a limited viewing angle on our little icon, OK? :-) - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 02:01:02 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id CAA26523 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 02:01:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp01.wxs.nl (smtp01.wxs.nl [195.121.6.61]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id CAA26515 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 02:00:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from asmodai@wxs.nl) Received: from daemon.ninth-circle.org ([195.121.56.4]) by smtp01.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with ESMTP id AAA35C; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 11:00:26 +0100 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <19990110015124.H10346@orcrist.mediacity.com> Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 11:07:59 +0100 (CET) Organization: Ninth Circle Enterprises From: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To: Gregory Sutter Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, "Jordan K. Hubbard" , -kevin- Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 10-Jan-99 Gregory Sutter wrote: > On Sun, Jan 10, 1999 at 01:32:42AM -0800, -kevin- wrote: >> >> At 10:47 PM 1/9/99 -0800, jkh wrote: >> >What can we do to change this in 1999? Well, I've also heard our >> >advocate corps calling for logistical support ("Backup! We need some >> >*backup* here!!") and I've listened to them, part of my project for >> >> I know this may sound trite but any time I introduce someone to FreeBSD >> they inevitably ask, "What's the deal with the demon?" >> So my suggestion is that we change our mascot to something more benign. > > It's not really a devil; a daemon is entirely different. The > Shorter Oxford English Dictionary contains: > > Demon Also dæmon. ME [In form, and in sense I, a. L. dæmon > (med. L. demon)...] 1. Gr. Myth. A being of a nature intermediate > between that of gods and men; an inferior divinity, spirit > (including the souls of deceased persons). Often written dæmon > for distinction. 1569. Yup, or as they said `daimon'. The term daemon became evil when Catholics connected daemon to devils and Satan. In general, for someone with a common sense, it's not related to its evil counterpart. Besides you want to change the Daemon? Heh, try that after roughly 8 years of Free/Net/Open existence. Not including the CSRG days before that... And most of the people I speak are quite fond of this cute daemon. (Hey, how could ye not love the guy?) --- Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven A veil of smoke is what I am, asmodai(at)wxs.nl I wait and I wait... Network/Security Specialist BSD & picoBSD: The Power to Serve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 05:36:33 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA21217 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 05:36:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from jason01.u.washington.edu (jason01.u.washington.edu [140.142.70.24]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA21211 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 05:36:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jcwells@u.washington.edu) Received: from saul7.u.washington.edu (root@saul7.u.washington.edu [140.142.82.2]) by jason01.u.washington.edu (8.9.1+UW98.09/8.9.1+UW98.09) with ESMTP id FAA19698; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 05:35:55 -0800 Received: from S8-37-26.student.washington.edu (S8-37-26.student.washington.edu [128.208.37.26]) by saul7.u.washington.edu (8.9.1+UW98.09/8.9.1+UW98.09) with ESMTP id FAA26665; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 05:35:54 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 05:35:37 -0800 (PST) From: "Jason C. Wells" X-Sender: jason@s8-37-26.student.washington.edu Reply-To: "Jason C. Wells" To: Unfurl cc: FreeBSD Advocacy Subject: Re: Seattle Users Group In-Reply-To: <19990110024437.A5286@dub.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 10 Jan 1999, Unfurl wrote: >I recently moved to the Seattle area and I checked out a few of the >Linux users groups (due to the lack of a FreeBSD group). I am really >excited about starting a Seattle Area FreeBSD Users Group. If anyone is >interested please contact me. Thanks! > >-Bill There are three of us on UW campus. I hope they will be in touch. Catchya Later, | UW Mechanical Engineering Jason Wells | http://weber.u.washington.edu/~jcwells/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 06:34:18 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA26005 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 06:34:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from thyme.cisco.com (thyme.cisco.com [171.69.43.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA26000 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 06:34:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shibumi@thyme.cisco.com) Received: from miranda-bsd.cisco.com (khoover-dhcp-171-69-112-70.cisco.com [171.69.112.70]) by thyme.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id GAA16839 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 06:33:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost by miranda-bsd.cisco.com (8.8.8) id GAA06225; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 06:33:43 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199901101433.GAA06225@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: "Freebsd-Advocacy" Subject: Re: this ran through my head yesterday... In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 07 Jan 1999 08:46:48 CST." <000301be3a4c$8df19d60$8301000a@rseals.midwestis.com> Reply-to: shibumi@cisco.com X-Disclaimer: Unless otherwise noted below, this is not a policy statement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 06:33:42 -0800 From: "Kenton A. Hoover" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG To paraphrase: "No one ever got fired for buying Microsoft." At a Fortune 500 technology company that shall remain nameless, an evaluation was done to decide on whether Microsoft Exchange should become the standard MTA/MHA for the company. They actually hired Microsoft to do the evaluation for them. Thats exactly like how people used to use IBM's services. I'd like to be able to say that those were the bad ol' days, but apparently it isn't. On Thu, 07 Jan 1999 08:46:48 CST, Sendmail channeled "Ray Seals" saying: > A guy that I work with/for at my current consulting gig is a Microsoft > zealot. I've known him for a long time and I consider him a friend. He > likes to run up to me and tell me all the cool things that are coming out > for NT. I can reply about 90% of the time "Oh yeah, BSD has had that for a > while....and it's free". I started thinking about the Microsoft > Management/Admin mind set. It's basically that there is nothing out there > any better than MS products. So here is just a little thought to maybe > spark some creative juices... > > Kind of a slogan thing > > FreeBSD > - Free Your Mind | Kenton A. Hoover Network Team Manager | shibumi@cisco.com | | Engineering Computer Services | | | Cisco Systems, Inc. | +1.408.526.5249 | |===================== http://www.shockwave.com/~shibumi ====================| | You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift. | | -- William Boetcker (often attributed to Abraham Lincoln) | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 06:45:12 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA27146 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 06:45:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from thyme.cisco.com (thyme.cisco.com [171.69.43.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA27141 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 06:45:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shibumi@thyme.cisco.com) Received: from miranda-bsd.cisco.com (khoover-dhcp-171-69-112-70.cisco.com [171.69.112.70]) by thyme.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id GAA17114 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 06:44:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost by miranda-bsd.cisco.com (8.8.8) id GAA06307; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 06:44:37 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199901101444.GAA06307@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:32:42 PST." <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> Reply-to: shibumi@cisco.com X-Disclaimer: Unless otherwise noted below, this is not a policy statement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 06:44:36 -0800 From: "Kenton A. Hoover" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Read the licensing agreement carefully: we are required by the University of California to give recognition to The Dark Lord for the souls sold during the development of BSD. Hell's marketing people insisted on this. On Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:32:42 PST, Sendmail channeled -kevin- saying: > I know this may sound trite but any time I introduce someone to FreeBSD > they inevitably ask, "What's the deal with the demon?" > So my suggestion is that we change our mascot to something more benign. | Kenton A. Hoover Network Team Manager | shibumi@cisco.com | | Engineering Computer Services | | | Cisco Systems, Inc. | +1.408.526.5249 | |===================== http://www.shockwave.com/~shibumi ====================| | Do not use while sleeping -- warning label on a hair dryer | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 12:41:54 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA11022 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 12:41:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from lehua.ilhawaii.net (lehua.ilhawaii.net [207.12.19.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA11014 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 12:41:51 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from source@hilo.net) Received: from hilo.net (pm4-21.ilhawaii.net [207.12.20.21]) by lehua.ilhawaii.net (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id KAA16644 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 10:34:28 -1000 (HST) Message-ID: <36990FFE.C5660689@hilo.net> Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 10:39:26 -1000 From: Bruce Meier X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: subscribe Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG subscribe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 13:45:49 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA17623 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:45:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from obie.softweyr.com ([204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA17618 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:45:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA01721; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 14:44:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <36991F59.42E6C2FD@softweyr.com> Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 14:44:57 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr llc X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Jason C. Wells" CC: Unfurl , FreeBSD Advocacy Subject: Re: Seattle Users Group References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Jason C. Wells" wrote: > > On Sun, 10 Jan 1999, Unfurl wrote: > > >I recently moved to the Seattle area and I checked out a few of the > >Linux users groups (due to the lack of a FreeBSD group). I am really > >excited about starting a Seattle Area FreeBSD Users Group. If anyone is > >interested please contact me. Thanks! > > > >-Bill > > There are three of us on UW campus. I hope they will be in touch. I was going to suggest Jason answer this, but he beat me to the punch. I'd love to join you, but haven't (yet) managed to convince my wife to move to Seattle with me. Give me time, I'm working on her. I really miss your city. ;^) (I lived in Bryn Mawr, on the lakeshore, with my little racing sloop for 3.5 years. It was heavenly.) -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 13:49:44 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA17759 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:49:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from obie.softweyr.com ([204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA17753 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:49:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA01732; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 14:49:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <36992054.72E6DE30@softweyr.com> Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 14:49:08 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr llc X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: shibumi@cisco.com CC: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: <199901101444.GAA06307@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Kenton A. Hoover" wrote: > > Read the licensing agreement carefully: we are required by the University of > California to give recognition to The Dark Lord for the souls sold during the > development of BSD. Hell's marketing people insisted on this. THIS isn't going to help the helplessly dunderheaded (im)moral (not) majority types any. Explain to them daemons are halfway between men and gods, rather like angels, and leave it at that. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 13:50:55 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA18172 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:50:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from obie.softweyr.com ([204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA18150 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:50:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA01745; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 14:50:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <3699209A.74C65CF6@softweyr.com> Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 14:50:18 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr llc X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: shibumi@cisco.com CC: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: <199901101444.GAA06307@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Kenton A. Hoover" wrote: > > Read the licensing agreement carefully: we are required by the University of > California to give recognition to The Dark Lord for the souls sold during the > development of BSD. Hell's marketing people insisted on this. And besides, you only have to sell your soul to the devil to get an MCSE, which is *not* required to use FreeBSD. ;^) -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 13:54:39 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA18534 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:54:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from thyme.cisco.com (thyme.cisco.com [171.69.43.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA18525 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:54:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shibumi@thyme.cisco.com) Received: from miranda-bsd.cisco.com (khoover-dhcp-171-69-112-70.cisco.com [171.69.112.70]) by thyme.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id NAA26637 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:54:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost by miranda-bsd.cisco.com (8.8.8) id NAA12646; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:54:03 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199901102154.NAA12646@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Jan 1999 14:49:08 MST." <36992054.72E6DE30@softweyr.com> Reply-to: shibumi@cisco.com X-Disclaimer: Unless otherwise noted below, this is not a policy statement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:54:02 -0800 From: "Kenton A. Hoover" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG You're right; I forgot about those fifteen potential FreeBSD users I just alienated. On Sun, 10 Jan 1999 14:49:08 MST, Sendmail channeled Wes Peters saying: > THIS isn't going to help the helplessly dunderheaded (im)moral (not) > majority types any. Explain to them daemons are halfway between men > and gods, rather like angels, and leave it at that. | Kenton A. Hoover Network Team Manager | shibumi@cisco.com | | Engineering Computer Services | | | Cisco Systems, Inc. | +1.408.526.5249 | |===================== http://www.shockwave.com/~shibumi ====================| | If Barbie is so popular, why do you have to buy her friends? | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 13:58:43 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA19271 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:58:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from thyme.cisco.com (thyme.cisco.com [171.69.43.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA19262 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:58:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shibumi@thyme.cisco.com) Received: from miranda-bsd.cisco.com (khoover-dhcp-171-69-112-70.cisco.com [171.69.112.70]) by thyme.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id NAA26758 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:58:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost by miranda-bsd.cisco.com (8.8.8) id NAA12705; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:58:07 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199901102158.NAA12705@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Jan 1999 14:50:18 MST." <3699209A.74C65CF6@softweyr.com> Reply-to: shibumi@cisco.com X-Disclaimer: Unless otherwise noted below, this is not a policy statement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 13:58:06 -0800 From: "Kenton A. Hoover" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG If you sell your soul to the Devil and all you get is an MCSE from it, you haven't gotten market rate. On Sun, 10 Jan 1999 14:50:18 MST, Sendmail channeled Wes Peters saying: > And besides, you only have to sell your soul to the devil to get an MCSE, > which is *not* required to use FreeBSD. ;^) | Kenton A. Hoover Network Team Manager | shibumi@cisco.com | | Engineering Computer Services | | | Cisco Systems, Inc. | +1.408.526.5249 | |===================== http://www.shockwave.com/~shibumi ====================| | When an actor comes to me and wants to discuss his character, I say, 'It's | | in the script.' If he says, 'But what's my motivation?, ' I say, 'Your | | salary.' -- Alfred Hitchcock | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 16:50:36 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA07863 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 16:50:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from jive.dub.net (jive.dub.net [169.197.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA07857 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 16:50:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from unfurl@jive.dub.net) Received: (from unfurl@localhost) by jive.dub.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA24614 for advocacy@freebsd.org; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:49:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from unfurl) Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:49:55 -0700 From: Unfurl To: FreeBSD Advocacy Subject: Seattle FreeBSD Group mailing list Message-ID: <19990110174955.A24602@dub.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG So for the few ppl who responded to my call for users in the Seattle area I have set up a mailing list. Hopefully this will be a forum that we can start chatting about actually *starting* a group in. The list address is seafug@dub.net. It is a majordomo list so just send the words: subscribe seafug in the body of a message to majordomo@dub.net Thanks for the great response this morning. I'm loooking forward to getting this group going :) -Bill Swingle -- unfurl@dub.net - This is a munition. Fight Back! #!/bin/perl -sp0777i Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA10185 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:13:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from jason04.u.washington.edu (jason04.u.washington.edu [140.142.78.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA10180 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:13:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jcwells@u.washington.edu) Received: from saul7.u.washington.edu (root@saul7.u.washington.edu [140.142.82.2]) by jason04.u.washington.edu (8.9.1+UW98.09/8.9.1+UW98.09) with ESMTP id RAA17736; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:12:47 -0800 Received: from S8-37-26.student.washington.edu (S8-37-26.student.washington.edu [128.208.37.26]) by saul7.u.washington.edu (8.9.1+UW98.09/8.9.1+UW98.09) with ESMTP id RAA28656; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:12:46 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:12:16 -0800 (PST) From: "Jason C. Wells" X-Sender: jason@s8-37-26.student.washington.edu Reply-To: "Jason C. Wells" To: Wes Peters cc: "Jason C. Wells" , Unfurl , FreeBSD Advocacy Subject: Re: Seattle Users Group In-Reply-To: <36991F59.42E6C2FD@softweyr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 10 Jan 1999, Wes Peters wrote: >I was going to suggest Jason answer this, but he beat me to the >punch. I'd love to join you, but haven't (yet) managed to convince >my wife to move to Seattle with me. Give me time, I'm working on >her. I really miss your city. ;^) Mr. Polstra, are you listening? Catchya Later, | UW Mechanical Engineering Jason Wells | http://weber.u.washington.edu/~jcwells/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 17:45:00 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA13115 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:45:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA13108 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:44:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id KAA16219; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 10:44:16 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3699432B.92C2D443@newsguy.com> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 09:17:47 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: -kevin- CC: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG -kevin- wrote: > > I know this may sound trite but any time I introduce someone to FreeBSD > they inevitably ask, "What's the deal with the demon?" > So my suggestion is that we change our mascot to something more benign. WHAT???? Chuck is our only clear advantage over Linux!!!!! -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com "Heart like a Gabriel, pure and white as ivory, soul like a lucifer, black and cold as a piece of lead." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 17:45:06 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA13303 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:45:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA13139 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 17:45:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id KAA16231; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 10:44:25 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3699447C.CE94EFA5@newsguy.com> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 09:23:24 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: shibumi@cisco.com CC: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: <199901101444.GAA06307@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Kenton A. Hoover" wrote: > > Read the licensing agreement carefully: we are required by the University of > California to give recognition to The Dark Lord for the souls sold during the > development of BSD. Hell's marketing people insisted on this. Now, THERE is a reasonable explanation! :-) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com "Heart like a Gabriel, pure and white as ivory, soul like a lucifer, black and cold as a piece of lead." To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 20:39:35 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA00381 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 20:39:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from mail1.its.rpi.edu (mail1.its.rpi.edu [128.113.100.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA00376 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 20:39:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail1.its.rpi.edu (8.8.8/8.8.6) with ESMTP id XAA207504; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 23:40:22 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Sender: drosih@pop1.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <3699432B.92C2D443@newsguy.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 23:38:53 -0500 To: "Daniel C. Sobral" From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 9:17 AM +0900 1/11/99, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: >-kevin- wrote: >> >> I know this may sound trite but any time I introduce someone to >> FreeBSD they inevitably ask, "What's the deal with the demon?" >> So my suggestion is that we change our mascot to something more >> benign. > > WHAT???? Chuck is our only clear advantage over Linux!!!!! > The daemon is supposed to be nameless. not "Chuck"... And as to the original poster, I sometimes wonder too. I do understand that the daemon is not intended as any connection to any real or imaginary devilish being. At the same time, I can't help but think that I'm interested in freebsd for a variety of principles -- such as open source, attention to detail, a divorce between operating-system-releases and application packages, and rock-solid operating systems. Correcting people's understanding of the word "daemon" is not high on my own list of priorities, no matter how entertaining that might be. Still, I do think it's beneficial to have some common link between the three open-source BSD projects, and I can't imagine getting all three groups to agree to some new mascot. Actually, I have a fair amount of trouble imagining even one of the groups agreeing to a new mascot, because we're so amused at having our own little inside joke about "Chuck" (well, if he were to be named Chuck, that is). When it comes right down to it, it's also hard to argue that a penguin portrays all that much more of a serious and committed image than a red daemon does, so I try to advocate FreeBSD based on the principles I'm interested in, and hope I don't waste too much time trying to explain the history of the mascot. --- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.its.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or drosih@rpi.edu Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 21:18:26 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA06355 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:18:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from shell6.ba.best.com (shell6.ba.best.com [206.184.139.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA06350 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:18:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkb@shell6.ba.best.com) Received: (from jkb@localhost) by shell6.ba.best.com (8.9.1/8.9.0/best.sh) id VAA21646; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:17:29 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <19990110211729.A19033@best.com> Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:17:29 -0800 From: "Jan B. Koum " To: "Carlos C. Tapang" , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: <007c01be3d19$ea0315a0$0d787880@apex.tapang> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.93.2i In-Reply-To: <007c01be3d19$ea0315a0$0d787880@apex.tapang>; from Carlos C. Tapang on Sun, Jan 10, 1999 at 08:21:51PM -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Jan 10, 1999 at 08:21:51PM -0800, "Carlos C. Tapang" wrote: > Wow, that was long, but a good read. Some questions/comments below. > > Carlos C. Tapang > http://www.genericwindows.com > > Yes, I myself did not know that Yahoo uses a farm of FreeBSD servers until I > accidentally stumbled into it. This is a big testimonial that needs to be > shouted from the top of mountains. We say that we run FreeBSD in the contributors page: http://www.yahoo.com/info/misc/contributors.html We are also not hiding the fact that we are running on FreeBSD. And yes, there was a testimonial done by Filo a few months back. See: http://www.freebsdmall.com/newsletter1/yahoo_and_freebsd.phtml > > > > >Our users also need to become more involved and I'm hoping that 1999 > >will be the year when a lot more local user groups and other self-help > >type of organizations are formed. The Handbook and FAQ are documents > >which are getting better, hopefully another trend we'll see continue > >into 1999 as Nik Clayton, our fearless new Documentation Project > >leader, continues at the helm. We still have to remember, however, > >that for many users the handbook and FAQ docs are just not enough. > > > Since I am using FreeBSD in Generic Windows, am I allowed to use "Powered by > FreeBSD" in my website (www.genericwindows.com)? Of course. Go slap "Powered by FreeBSD" image on it right now!!! -- Yan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 21:36:03 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA07521 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:27:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from obie.softweyr.com ([204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA07502 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:27:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@obie.softweyr.com) Received: (from wes@localhost) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA00223; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 22:26:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes) From: Wes Peters Message-Id: <199901110526.WAA00223@obie.softweyr.com> Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-Reply-To: <199901102158.NAA12705@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> from "Kenton A. Hoover" at "Jan 10, 99 01:58:06 pm" To: shibumi@cisco.com Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 22:26:27 -0700 (MST) Cc: advocacy@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL40 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > If you sell your soul to the Devil and all you get is an MCSE from it, you > haven't gotten market rate. You seem to vastly overestimate the going rate for souls. It almost makes you wonder if they're worth saving. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 21:50:25 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA10185 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:50:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from obie.softweyr.com ([204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA10178 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:50:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA00275; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 22:49:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <369990FA.7EE542E7@softweyr.com> Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 22:49:46 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr llc X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Unfurl CC: FreeBSD Advocacy Subject: Re: Seattle FreeBSD Group mailing list References: <19990110174955.A24602@dub.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Unfurl wrote: > > So for the few ppl who responded to my call for users in the Seattle > area I have set up a mailing list. Hopefully this will be a forum that > we can start chatting about actually *starting* a group in. > > The list address is seafug@dub.net. > > It is a majordomo list so just send the words: > > subscribe seafug You've got to come up with a synonym for "Users" that starts with "O." ;^) You may attract a somewhat wider audience by addressing BSD in general, rather than just BSD. Your experiences will be close enough to warrant a general users group with {Free,Net,Open}BSD sigs. Best of luck. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 21:55:18 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA10904 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:55:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from thyme.cisco.com (thyme.cisco.com [171.69.43.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA10887 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:55:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shibumi@thyme.cisco.com) Received: from miranda-bsd.cisco.com (khoover-dhcp-171-69-112-70.cisco.com [171.69.112.70]) by thyme.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id VAA09096 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:54:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost by miranda-bsd.cisco.com (8.8.8) id VAA15278; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:54:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199901110554.VAA15278@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 10 Jan 1999 22:26:27 MST." <199901110526.WAA00223@obie.softweyr.com> Reply-to: shibumi@cisco.com X-Disclaimer: Unless otherwise noted below, this is not a policy statement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:54:38 -0800 From: "Kenton A. Hoover" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Soul valuation is a complex art. Ever since Reuters shut down their on-line spot market for souls, its been harder and harder to figure out a price. However, on the five year soul futures market, the rate for the soul of a person who has been cleansed of their sins via baptism is still pretty good. The soul market is related to the price of the heads of Christian missionaries to those who have not heard the word of God. Currently, there are so few missionaries going out into the world that the price of their heads is quite high on the market; if more of them start going out into the world, baptizing residents of the third world, the price of souls will decrease. However, unless the Catholic Church gets their act in gear, and gets more priests into the field, the market will continue to stay in decline. However, this is a list about BSDs, another global conspiracy. I will thus close the chapter on this discussion. On Sun, 10 Jan 1999 22:26:27 MST, Sendmail channeled Wes Peters saying: > > If you sell your soul to the Devil and all you get is an MCSE from it, you > > haven't gotten market rate. > > You seem to vastly overestimate the going rate for souls. It almost > makes you wonder if they're worth saving. | Kenton A. Hoover Network Team Manager | shibumi@cisco.com | | Engineering Computer Services | | | Cisco Systems, Inc. | +1.408.526.5249 | |===================== http://www.shockwave.com/~shibumi ====================| | The Charge of the Light Brigade excuse | | It was an unfortunate lapse by an individual which has now been | | dealt with under internal disciplinary proceedings. | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 22:13:30 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA12731 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 22:13:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp02.wxs.nl (smtp02.wxs.nl [195.121.6.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA12726 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 22:13:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from asmodai@wxs.nl) Received: from daemon.ninth-circle.org ([195.121.56.93]) by smtp02.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with ESMTP id AAA1F85; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 07:12:57 +0100 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <3699447C.CE94EFA5@newsguy.com> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 07:20:29 +0100 (CET) Organization: Ninth Circle Enterprises From: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, shibumi@cisco.com Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 11-Jan-99 Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > "Kenton A. Hoover" wrote: >> >> Read the licensing agreement carefully: we are required by the >> University of California to give recognition to The Dark Lord for the >> souls sold during the development of BSD. Hell's marketing people >> insisted on this. > > Now, THERE is a reasonable explanation! :-) So now BSD falls under Bill Gates? Oh lord, think I'll switch to linux =P --- Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven A veil of smoke is what I am, asmodai(at)wxs.nl I wait and I wait... Network/Security Specialist BSD & picoBSD: The Power to Serve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sun Jan 10 22:19:02 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA13217 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 22:19:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from jive.dub.net (jive.dub.net [169.197.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA13212 for ; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 22:18:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from unfurl@jive.dub.net) Received: (from unfurl@localhost) by jive.dub.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA25958; Sun, 10 Jan 1999 23:18:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from unfurl) Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 23:18:14 -0700 From: Unfurl To: Wes Peters Cc: seafug@dub.net, FreeBSD Advocacy Subject: Re: Seattle FreeBSD Group mailing list Message-ID: <19990110231814.A25911@dub.net> References: <19990110174955.A24602@dub.net> <369990FA.7EE542E7@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <369990FA.7EE542E7@softweyr.com>; from Wes Peters on Sun, Jan 10, 1999 at 10:49:46PM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Jan 10, 1999 at 10:49:46PM -0700, Wes Peters wrote: > Unfurl wrote: > > > > So for the few ppl who responded to my call for users in the Seattle > > area I have set up a mailing list. Hopefully this will be a forum that > > we can start chatting about actually *starting* a group in. > > > > The list address is seafug@dub.net. > > > > It is a majordomo list so just send the words: > > > > subscribe seafug > > You've got to come up with a synonym for "Users" that starts with "O." ;^) > > You may attract a somewhat wider audience by addressing BSD in general, > rather than just BSD. Your experiences will be close enough to warrant > a general users group with {Free,Net,Open}BSD sigs. Maybe a Seattle Free Unix Group is the best idea in this light. Mostly I wanted to focus on FreeBSD because there are already a couple of Linux groups and one generic UNIX group (that I know of) in the area; seemed to me this was what we (Seattle) lacked. So what are some of the other opinions on this matter? Do you guys think it is a better idea for Users Groups to be more broad, e.g. covering *BSD and linux as well or ?? I am open to suggestions and (of course) am in no way the person who must decide this matter. Are any of the ppl on this list part of a sucessful users group? Maybe it would help to define how to start a sucessful users group. -Bill -- unfurl@dub.net - This is a munition. Fight Back! #!/bin/perl -sp0777i Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA03125 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 01:03:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from post.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA03112 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 01:03:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from marko@uk.radan.com) Received: from [158.152.75.22] (helo=uk.radan.com) by post.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #1) id 0zzdEx-0001t6-00; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 09:02:27 +0000 Organisation: Radan Computational Ltd., Bath, UK. Phone: +44-1225-320320 Fax: +44-1225-320311 Received: from beavis.uk.radan.com (beavis [193.114.228.122]) by uk.radan.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with SMTP id JAA01976; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 09:01:27 GMT Received: from uk.radan.com (gppsun4) by beavis.uk.radan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA02900; Mon, 11 Jan 99 09:01:26 GMT Message-Id: <3699BDDB.A1D1D4D4@uk.radan.com> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 09:01:15 +0000 From: Mark Ovens Organization: Radan Computational Ltd X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 4.1.3_U1 sun4m) X-Accept-Language: en-GB Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Wes Peters Cc: Unfurl , FreeBSD Advocacy Subject: Re: Seattle FreeBSD Group mailing list References: <19990110174955.A24602@dub.net> <369990FA.7EE542E7@softweyr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes Peters wrote: > > Unfurl wrote: > > > > It is a majordomo list so just send the words: > > > > subscribe seafug > > You've got to come up with a synonym for "Users" that starts with "O." ;^) > Operators? > -- > "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" > > Wes Peters Softweyr LLC > http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message -- Trust the computer industry to shorten Year 2000 to Y2K. It was this thinking that caused the problem in the first place. Mark Ovens, CNC Applications Engineer, Radan Computational Ltd. Bath, Avon, England. Sheet Metal CAD/CAM Solutions mailto:marko@uk.radan.com http://www.radan.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 04:12:10 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA24160 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 04:12:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id EAA24150 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 04:12:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id VAA10900; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:11:18 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3699DA38.B034F4C0@newsguy.com> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 20:02:16 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai CC: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, shibumi@cisco.com Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai wrote: > > On 11-Jan-99 Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > > "Kenton A. Hoover" wrote: > >> > >> Read the licensing agreement carefully: we are required by the > >> University of California to give recognition to The Dark Lord for the > >> souls sold during the development of BSD. Hell's marketing people > >> insisted on this. > > > > Now, THERE is a reasonable explanation! :-) > > So now BSD falls under Bill Gates? Oh lord, think I'll switch to linux =P Oh, come on, Bill Gates might be Evil, and might be the Anti-Christ, but do you really think he could qualify as the Lord of Darkness? Gimme a break! Remember, Lucifer used to be a good guy... can BG claim that much? :-) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com If you sell your soul to the Devil and all you get is an MCSE from it, you haven't gotten market rate. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 04:13:04 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA24447 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 04:13:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id EAA24441 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 04:13:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id VAA11023; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:12:15 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3699E9AA.89F93F0F@newsguy.com> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:08:10 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Wes Peters CC: Unfurl , FreeBSD Advocacy Subject: Re: Seattle FreeBSD Group mailing list References: <19990110174955.A24602@dub.net> <369990FA.7EE542E7@softweyr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes Peters wrote: > > > subscribe seafug > > You've got to come up with a synonym for "Users" that starts with "O." ;^) FreeBSD Open Group? ;-) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com If you sell your soul to the Devil and all you get is an MCSE from it, you haven't gotten market rate. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 04:25:55 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA26040 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 04:25:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from shell.monmouth.com (shell.monmouth.com [205.231.236.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id EAA26026 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 04:25:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from pechter@pechter.ddns.org) Received: from pechter.ddns.org (bg-tc-ppp109.monmouth.com [209.191.60.110]) by shell.monmouth.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id HAA20344; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 07:25:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (from pechter@localhost) by pechter.ddns.org (8.9.1/8.9.1) id HAA15179; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 07:24:16 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from pechter) From: Bill Pechter Message-Id: <199901111224.HAA15179@pechter.ddns.org> Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. To: dcs@newsguy.com (Daniel C. Sobral) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 07:24:15 -0500 (EST) Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3699DA38.B034F4C0@newsguy.com> from "Daniel C. Sobral" at "Jan 11, 99 08:02:16 pm" Reply-to: pechter@shell.monmouth.com X-Phone-Number: 908-389-3592 X-OS-Type: FreeBSD 3.0-Stable X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL19 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai wrote: > > > > On 11-Jan-99 Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > > > "Kenton A. Hoover" wrote: > > >> > > >> Read the licensing agreement carefully: we are required by the > > >> University of California to give recognition to The Dark Lord for the > > >> souls sold during the development of BSD. Hell's marketing people > > >> insisted on this. > > > > > > Now, THERE is a reasonable explanation! :-) > > > > So now BSD falls under Bill Gates? Oh lord, think I'll switch to linux =P > > Oh, come on, Bill Gates might be Evil, and might be the Anti-Christ, > but do you really think he could qualify as the Lord of Darkness? > Gimme a break! Remember, Lucifer used to be a good guy... can BG > claim that much? :-) > > -- > Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) > dcs@newsguy.com > > If you sell your soul to the Devil and all you get is an MCSE from Don't forget. Microsoft's original multiuser product was Xenix on PDP11. Then he went to the dark side... Early on he thought he couldn't do an OS alone 8-). Now we all know he was right. --Bill -- " ... Overall we've found FreeBSD to excel in performace, stability, technical support, and of course price. Two years after discovering FreeBSD, we have yet to find a reason why we switch to anything else" -David Filo, Yahoo! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 11:46:24 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA19188 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 11:46:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp01.primenet.com (smtp01.primenet.com [206.165.6.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA19174 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 11:46:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tlambert@usr05.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp01.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA07714; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:45:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr05.primenet.com(206.165.6.205) via SMTP by smtp01.primenet.com, id smtpd007531; Mon Jan 11 12:45:29 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA25075; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:45:13 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199901111945.MAA25075@usr05.primenet.com> Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. To: kathey@pobox.com (-kevin-) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 19:45:13 +0000 (GMT) Cc: jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> from "-kevin-" at Jan 10, 99 01:32:42 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > >What can we do to change this in 1999? Well, I've also heard our > >advocate corps calling for logistical support ("Backup! We need some > >*backup* here!!") and I've listened to them, part of my project for > > I know this may sound trite but any time I introduce someone to FreeBSD > they inevitably ask, "What's the deal with the demon?" > So my suggestion is that we change our mascot to something more benign. I wonder if Scott Adams would license rights to use "Phil, Prince of Insufficient Light". The worst he ever does is "darn" people to "heck" with his "spork". Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 11:48:59 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA19461 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 11:48:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp02.primenet.com (smtp02.primenet.com [206.165.6.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA19453 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 11:48:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tlambert@usr05.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp02.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA27471; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:48:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr05.primenet.com(206.165.6.205) via SMTP by smtp02.primenet.com, id smtpd027084; Mon Jan 11 12:47:51 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA25146; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:47:30 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199901111947.MAA25146@usr05.primenet.com> Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. To: asmodai@wxs.nl (Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 19:47:29 +0000 (GMT) Cc: dcs@newsguy.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, shibumi@cisco.com In-Reply-To: from "Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai" at Jan 11, 99 07:20:29 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > >> Read the licensing agreement carefully: we are required by the > >> University of California to give recognition to The Dark Lord for the > >> souls sold during the development of BSD. Hell's marketing people > >> insisted on this. > > > > Now, THERE is a reasonable explanation! :-) > > So now BSD falls under Bill Gates? Oh lord, think I'll switch to linux =P Because the Emperor is evil, you're going to go work for Lord Vader? ;-). Actually Bill Gates is not the "Dark Lord", he's the Dark Lord's Western Regional Marketing Manager. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 11:51:15 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA20053 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 11:51:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from mail4.aracnet.com (mail4.aracnet.com [205.159.88.46]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA20048 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 11:51:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ctapang@easystreet.com) Received: from apex (216-99-199-226.cust.aracnet.com [216.99.199.226]) by mail4.aracnet.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA27885; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 11:50:34 -0800 Message-ID: <011901be3d9b$c840d5b0$0d787880@apex.tapang> From: "Carlos C. Tapang" To: "Jan B. Koum " , Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 11:51:29 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3155.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3155.0 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thanks. I will put "Powered by FreeBSD" on my website right now. Carlos C. Tapang http://www.genericwindows.com >> >> Yes, I myself did not know that Yahoo uses a farm of FreeBSD servers until I >> accidentally stumbled into it. This is a big testimonial that needs to be >> shouted from the top of mountains. > > We say that we run FreeBSD in the contributors page: > > http://www.yahoo.com/info/misc/contributors.html > > We are also not hiding the fact that we are running on FreeBSD. > And yes, there was a testimonial done by Filo a few months back. See: > > http://www.freebsdmall.com/newsletter1/yahoo_and_freebsd.phtml > >> >> > >> >Our users also need to become more involved and I'm hoping that 1999 >> >will be the year when a lot more local user groups and other self-help >> >type of organizations are formed. The Handbook and FAQ are documents >> >which are getting better, hopefully another trend we'll see continue >> >into 1999 as Nik Clayton, our fearless new Documentation Project >> >leader, continues at the helm. We still have to remember, however, >> >that for many users the handbook and FAQ docs are just not enough. >> > >> Since I am using FreeBSD in Generic Windows, am I allowed to use "Powered by >> FreeBSD" in my website (www.genericwindows.com)? > > Of course. Go slap "Powered by FreeBSD" image on it right now!!! > >-- Yan > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 11:52:40 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA20286 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 11:52:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp04.primenet.com (smtp04.primenet.com [206.165.6.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA20281 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 11:52:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tlambert@usr05.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp04.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA22865; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:51:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr05.primenet.com(206.165.6.205) via SMTP by smtp04.primenet.com, id smtpd022714; Mon Jan 11 12:51:45 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA25319; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:51:33 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199901111951.MAA25319@usr05.primenet.com> Subject: Re: this ran through my head yesterday... To: shibumi@cisco.com Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 19:51:28 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199901101433.GAA06225@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> from "Kenton A. Hoover" at Jan 10, 99 06:33:42 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > To paraphrase: "No one ever got fired for buying Microsoft." > > At a Fortune 500 technology company that shall remain nameless, an > evaluation was done to decide on whether Microsoft Exchange should > become the standard MTA/MHA for the company. They actually hired > Microsoft to do the evaluation for them. Thats exactly like how > people used to use IBM's services. I'd like to be able to say that > those were the bad ol' days, but apparently it isn't. Har. I hope they never hire anyone named O`Grady. I know for a fact that MS Exchange barfs on: Robert_O^x27Grady@somewhere.com 8-). You'd think they'd hire someone who could read ABNF and RFC's... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 12:00:52 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA21318 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:00:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from traveler.uniscape.com ([207.245.48.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA21308 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:00:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from stefanos@traveler.uniscape.com) Received: by traveler.uniscape.com (NX5.67e/NX3.0M) id AA02634; Mon, 11 Jan 99 14:56:27 -0500 Message-Id: <9901111956.AA02634@traveler.uniscape.com> Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3 v118.2) In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 3.3 (Enhance 2.0b5) Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.118.2) From: Kiakas Date: Mon, 11 Jan 99 14:56:25 -0500 To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Cc: -kevin- Reply-To: stefanos@e-scape.net References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kevin, It's not as trite as you might think. A few years ago Procter and Gamble had a PR mess on their hands. There was a rumor going around which said they were devil worshipers, due to their logo ( 13 stars, and a man's faces, maybe a wizard.) I don't have a P&G product nearby so I'm probably not describing the logo exactly as it appears on their products. Anyway, what I am trying to say is, we should not dismiss this without at least thinking about it, even if we, as users of FreeBSD, are mature enough to know the difference between a daemon and a devil. Let's think of this issue from a small business point of view. Does the owner want to deal with the PR mess if some one starts spreading rumors about devil worshipping at the company because they use FreeBSD? Stefanos You wrote: > Jordan, > > At 10:47 PM 1/9/99 -0800, you wrote: > >What can we do to change this in 1999? Well, I've also heard our > >advocate corps calling for logistical support ("Backup! We need some > >*backup* here!!") and I've listened to them, part of my project for > > I know this may sound trite but any time I introduce someone to FreeBSD > they inevitably ask, "What's the deal with the demon?" > So my suggestion is that we change our mascot to something more benign. > > > -* -kevin- *- > -* sick with the good infection *- > -* kathey@pobox.com *- > -* http://www.pobox.com/~kathey *- > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 12:24:26 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA24494 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:24:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp01.wxs.nl (smtp01.wxs.nl [195.121.6.61]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA24486 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:24:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from asmodai@wxs.nl) Received: from daemon.ninth-circle.org ([195.121.57.33]) by smtp01.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with ESMTP id AAA3072; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:23:44 +0100 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199901111947.MAA25146@usr05.primenet.com> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:31:20 +0100 (CET) Organization: Ninth Circle Enterprises From: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To: Terry Lambert Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 11-Jan-99 Terry Lambert wrote: >> >> Read the licensing agreement carefully: we are required by the >> >> University of California to give recognition to The Dark Lord for the >> >> souls sold during the development of BSD. Hell's marketing people >> >> insisted on this. >> > >> > Now, THERE is a reasonable explanation! :-) >> >> So now BSD falls under Bill Gates? Oh lord, think I'll switch to linux >> =P > > Because the Emperor is evil, you're going to go work for Lord Vader? Touche! =) Nah, actually, I got a Unix filesystem explanation today and will be delving more and more into Unix (and in particular BSD) and will bore ye all with my patches Real Soon Now(tm) ;) Anyways, nice to see ye back on the lists Terry... --- Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven A veil of smoke is what I am, asmodai(at)wxs.nl I wait and I wait... Network/Security Specialist BSD & picoBSD: The Power to Serve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 12:41:00 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA26802 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:41:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp03.wxs.nl (smtp03.wxs.nl [195.121.6.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA26793 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:40:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from asmodai@wxs.nl) Received: from daemon.ninth-circle.org ([195.121.57.33]) by smtp03.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with ESMTP id AAA585F; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:40:18 +0100 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199901111945.MAA25075@usr05.primenet.com> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:47:57 +0100 (CET) Organization: Ninth Circle Enterprises From: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To: Terry Lambert Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, (-kevin-) Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 11-Jan-99 Terry Lambert wrote: >> >What can we do to change this in 1999? Well, I've also heard our >> >advocate corps calling for logistical support ("Backup! We need some >> >*backup* here!!") and I've listened to them, part of my project for >> >> I know this may sound trite but any time I introduce someone to FreeBSD >> they inevitably ask, "What's the deal with the demon?" >> So my suggestion is that we change our mascot to something more benign. > > I wonder if Scott Adams would license rights to use "Phil, Prince of > Insufficient Light". Oh come on... Adams is losing his touch... www.userfriendly.org is the way to go! =) --- Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven A veil of smoke is what I am, asmodai(at)wxs.nl I wait and I wait... Network/Security Specialist BSD & picoBSD: The Power to Serve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 12:45:27 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA27279 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:45:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp02.wxs.nl (smtp02.wxs.nl [195.121.6.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA27274 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 12:45:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from asmodai@wxs.nl) Received: from daemon.ninth-circle.org ([195.121.57.33]) by smtp02.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with ESMTP id AAA145; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:44:50 +0100 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199901111224.HAA15179@pechter.ddns.org> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:52:28 +0100 (CET) Organization: Ninth Circle Enterprises From: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To: pechter@shell.monmouth.com Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, (Daniel C. Sobral) Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 11-Jan-99 Bill Pechter wrote: >> Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai wrote: >> > >> > On 11-Jan-99 Daniel C. Sobral wrote: >> > > "Kenton A. Hoover" wrote: >> > >> >> > >> Read the licensing agreement carefully: we are required by the >> > >> University of California to give recognition to The Dark Lord for >> > >> the >> > >> souls sold during the development of BSD. Hell's marketing people >> > >> insisted on this. >> > > >> > > Now, THERE is a reasonable explanation! :-) >> > >> > So now BSD falls under Bill Gates? Oh lord, think I'll switch to linux >> > =P >> >> Oh, come on, Bill Gates might be Evil, and might be the Anti-Christ, >> but do you really think he could qualify as the Lord of Darkness? >> Gimme a break! Remember, Lucifer used to be a good guy... can BG >> claim that much? :-) > Don't forget. Microsoft's original multiuser product was Xenix on > PDP11. Then he went to the dark side... > > Early on he thought he couldn't do an OS alone 8-). > Now we all know he was right. Well at least he `sold' it to SCO... Ehm, that's mayhaps not a great answer as well =P I wonder btw, how did they ever manage to breed Xenix and UnixWare into SCO UnixWare? Or was that Xenix -> OpenServer (heh, who'd known MS would be contributing to the `Open' name ;) ) and Novell UnixWare -> SCO UnixWare? Minix^H^H^H^H^HLinux then? they keep telling that Linux' the answer... What was the question anyways? 4th best OS? (hey, Free, Open and Net have to be 1,2,3... pick any order ye like though) --- Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven A veil of smoke is what I am, asmodai(at)wxs.nl I wait and I wait... Network/Security Specialist BSD & picoBSD: The Power to Serve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 15:07:31 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA15735 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 15:07:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.36.247]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA15710; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 15:07:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kkennawa@physics.adelaide.edu.au) Received: from bragg (bragg [129.127.36.34]) by adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8/UofA-1.5) with SMTP id JAA12450; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:36:48 +1030 (CST) Received: from localhost by bragg; (5.65/1.1.8.2/05Aug95-0227PM) id AA13210; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:36:47 +1030 Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:36:46 +1030 (CST) From: Kris Kennaway X-Sender: kkennawa@bragg To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: Mike Smith , Drew Derbyshire , chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-Reply-To: <57689.916090235@zippy.cdrom.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 11 Jan 1999, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > 3.0 was not meant to be evangelised. Read the release materials. > > Yes, just to clarify this, we were indeed very much worried about the > stability of 3.0 and were more concerned about compromising our > reputation for robust behavior than we were about getting PR for 3.0. Once 3.1-stable comes along in a month, is it presumably now considered mature/stable enough to start shouting that fact from the rooftops.. Most people have short memories; they're probably not likely to notice if we just focus on the features of 3.1, and add something like "FreeBSD 3.1 is the newest release along the 3.x branch. New features in FreeBSD 3 include [...]" and basically use all the feature-hype which would have gone out in the 3.0 press releases. FWIW, I agree with the somewhat low-key release of 3.0 - as it turns out there probably weren't any show-stopping problems, but it could have turned into a real PR disaster for us (if you take a chance on something, perhaps by convincing your pointy-haired boss that it's a good thing, and it royally screws up on you, well, you're not likely to go back, are you? :) Kris ----- (ASP) Microsoft Corporation (MSFT) announced today that the release of its productivity suite, Office 2000, will be delayed until the first quarter of 1901. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 18:01:48 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA07485 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 18:01:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smarter.than.nu (thought.calbbs.com [207.71.213.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA07480 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 18:01:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brian@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smarter.than.nu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA07144 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 18:01:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brian@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 18:01:09 -0800 (PST) From: "Brian W. Buchanan" X-Sender: brian@smarter.than.nu To: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: open-source/Linux article in Jan 18th Newsweek Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Newsweek ran a 2 page article on open-source software in the Jan 18th issue, primarily focusing on Linux. The article reads like most of the other "mainstream" press Linux has been getting in recent months, and the word 'arcane' is abused at least once. Yahoo is mentioned in passing, but not in the context of free software, and, as expected, FreeBSD is nowhere to be seen. A half-page anecdote by Andrew Leonard of Salon magazine describing his experience with Linux follows, abusing 'arcane' once again as he describes how one actually has to *gasp* configure a Linux box. Still, it's good to see that free software is getting mainstream attention, and has been said before, what's good for Linux is good for us. BTW, FreeBSD advocates who'd like to help alleviate this "UNIX is scary!" mentality are invited to contribute to my project to create a unified GUI configuration frontend. See http://www.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU/~brian/freebsd-admin/ -- Brian Buchanan brian@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU -------------------------------------------------------------------------- FreeBSD - The Power to Serve! http://www.freebsd.org daemon(n): 1. an attendant power or spirit: GENIUS 2. the cute little mascot of the FreeBSD operating system To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 21:24:54 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA28084 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:24:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from obie.softweyr.com ([204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA28077 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:24:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA02654; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 22:24:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 22:24:10 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr llc X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: stefanos@e-scape.net CC: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, -kevin- Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> <9901111956.AA02634@traveler.uniscape.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kiakas wrote: > > Let's think of this issue from a small business point of view. > Does the owner want to deal with the PR mess if some one starts spreading > rumors about devil worshipping at the company because they use FreeBSD? I've got a better idea. Let's look at this from the point of view that it has been discussed over and over again before, long before you crowd of newbies ever flocked in here, and WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! If a company doesn't want to use the most stable, reliable operating system on the planet because they're afraid someone might call them a devil-worshipper, they're just going to have to live with that decision. WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! Any of you who really don't like this are perfectly free to take the FreeBSD source tree and go off and start your own AngelOS project. Adopt whatever you want for a mascot, attempt whatever feats of marketing and engineering prowess you feel are necessary, do whatever you want with your distributions. The BSD license allows you to do this. To get some glimmer of how important this point is, consider the fact that ALL THREE free BSD projects use various forms of the daemon as their logo. So, to sum it all up, WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! If anyone has any questions, I first want you to carefully consider which part of WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! didn't you understand? -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Mon Jan 11 23:18:05 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA09219 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 23:18:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from orcrist.mediacity.com (orcrist.mediacity.com [208.138.36.146]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA09213 for ; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 23:18:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gsutter@orcrist.mediacity.com) Received: (from gsutter@localhost) by orcrist.mediacity.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA19229; Mon, 11 Jan 1999 23:16:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gsutter) Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 23:16:12 -0800 From: Gregory Sutter To: Wes Peters Cc: stefanos@e-scape.net, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, -kevin- Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Message-ID: <19990111231612.C18768@orcrist.mediacity.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> <9901111956.AA02634@traveler.uniscape.com> <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com>; from Wes Peters on Mon, Jan 11, 1999 at 10:24:10PM -0700 Organization: Zer0 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Jan 11, 1999 at 10:24:10PM -0700, Wes Peters wrote: > Kiakas wrote: > > > > Let's think of this issue from a small business point of view. > > Does the owner want to deal with the PR mess if some one starts spreading > > rumors about devil worshipping at the company because they use FreeBSD? > > I've got a better idea. Let's look at this from the point of view > that it has been discussed over and over again before, long before > you crowd of newbies ever flocked in here, and > > WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! > > If a company doesn't want to use the most stable, reliable operating > system on the planet because they're afraid someone might call them > a devil-worshipper, they're just going to have to live with that > decision. > > WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! And if anybody didn't quite get it, Chuck is here to stay. Sheesh, the next thing the B.T.s will try is to ban all names related to Damon, Damien, etc... Greg, self-appointed B.T.T. -- Gregory S. Sutter "How do I read this file?" mailto:gsutter@pobox.com "You uudecode it." http://www.pobox.com/~gsutter/ "I I I decode it?" PGP DSS public key 0x40AE3052 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 00:25:58 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA15455 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 00:25:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from calvin.saturn-tech.com (calvin.saturn-tech.com [207.229.19.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA15450 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 00:25:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from drussell@saturn-tech.com) Received: from localhost (drussell@localhost) by calvin.saturn-tech.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id BAA15876; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:25:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drussell@saturn-tech.com) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:25:14 -0700 (MST) From: Doug Russell Reply-To: Doug Russell To: Wes Peters cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-Reply-To: <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 11 Jan 1999, Wes Peters wrote: > WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! I was getting ready to say something like that. :) Listen folks... Like it or not, there is no way anyone will ever be able to dislodge the daemon. (Except perhaps, Mr. McKusick. :) ) Consider it written in stone. :) Later...... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 00:49:48 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA18168 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 00:49:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from post.ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk (fw128.nhs.uk [194.6.81.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA18163 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 00:49:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rich@ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk) Received: by post.ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) id ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:48:42 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Wood, Richard" To: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: this ran through my head yesterday... Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:48:41 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 11 January 1999 19:51, Terry Lambert[SMTP:tlambert@primenet.com] wrote: > I hope they never hire anyone named O`Grady. I know for a fact that > MS Exchange barfs on: > > Robert_O^x27Grady@somewhere.com We did, we just renamed them OGrady, solved a lot of problems :-) Rich -- Rich Wood Systems Manager, Royal United Hospital, Bath. rich@ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 00:58:13 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA19289 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 00:58:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA19278 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 00:58:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id TAA20425; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 19:27:22 +1030 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) id TAA36073; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 19:27:17 +1030 (CST) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 19:27:17 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: Gregory Sutter Cc: Wes Peters , stefanos@e-scape.net, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, -kevin- Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Message-ID: <19990112192717.Y8886@freebie.lemis.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> <9901111956.AA02634@traveler.uniscape.com> <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> <19990111231612.C18768@orcrist.mediacity.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <19990111231612.C18768@orcrist.mediacity.com>; from Gregory Sutter on Mon, Jan 11, 1999 at 11:16:12PM -0800 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Monday, 11 January 1999 at 23:16:12 -0800, Gregory Sutter wrote: > On Mon, Jan 11, 1999 at 10:24:10PM -0700, Wes Peters wrote: >> Kiakas wrote: >>> >>> Let's think of this issue from a small business point of view. >>> Does the owner want to deal with the PR mess if some one starts spreading >>> rumors about devil worshipping at the company because they use FreeBSD? >> >> I've got a better idea. Let's look at this from the point of view >> that it has been discussed over and over again before, long before >> you crowd of newbies ever flocked in here, and >> >> WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! >> >> If a company doesn't want to use the most stable, reliable operating >> system on the planet because they're afraid someone might call them >> a devil-worshipper, they're just going to have to live with that >> decision. >> >> WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! > > And if anybody didn't quite get it, Chuck is here to stay. Who's Chuck? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 01:02:14 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA19798 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:02:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from orcrist.mediacity.com (orcrist.mediacity.com [208.138.36.146]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA19793 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:02:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gsutter@orcrist.mediacity.com) Received: (from gsutter@localhost) by orcrist.mediacity.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA20664; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:01:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gsutter) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:01:24 -0800 From: Gregory Sutter To: Greg Lehey Cc: Wes Peters , stefanos@e-scape.net, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, -kevin- Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Message-ID: <19990112010123.B20503@orcrist.mediacity.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> <9901111956.AA02634@traveler.uniscape.com> <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> <19990111231612.C18768@orcrist.mediacity.com> <19990112192717.Y8886@freebie.lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <19990112192717.Y8886@freebie.lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Tue, Jan 12, 1999 at 07:27:17PM +1030 Organization: Zer0 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Jan 12, 1999 at 07:27:17PM +1030, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Monday, 11 January 1999 at 23:16:12 -0800, Gregory Sutter wrote: > > On Mon, Jan 11, 1999 at 10:24:10PM -0700, Wes Peters wrote: > >> > >> WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! > > > > And if anybody didn't quite get it, Chuck is here to stay. > > Who's Chuck? You know, Chuck, that horny red guy, always just hanging around forking. Greg -- Gregory S. Sutter "I think not," said Descartes... mailto:gsutter@pobox.com and promptly disappeared. http://www.pobox.com/~gsutter/ PGP DSS public key 0x40AE3052 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 01:04:39 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA20131 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:04:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA20126 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:04:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id TAA20469; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 19:33:16 +1030 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) id TAA36144; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 19:33:13 +1030 (CST) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 19:33:13 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: Gregory Sutter Cc: Wes Peters , stefanos@e-scape.net, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, -kevin- Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Message-ID: <19990112193313.A8886@freebie.lemis.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> <9901111956.AA02634@traveler.uniscape.com> <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> <19990111231612.C18768@orcrist.mediacity.com> <19990112192717.Y8886@freebie.lemis.com> <19990112010123.B20503@orcrist.mediacity.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <19990112010123.B20503@orcrist.mediacity.com>; from Gregory Sutter on Tue, Jan 12, 1999 at 01:01:24AM -0800 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tuesday, 12 January 1999 at 1:01:24 -0800, Gregory Sutter wrote: > On Tue, Jan 12, 1999 at 07:27:17PM +1030, Greg Lehey wrote: >> On Monday, 11 January 1999 at 23:16:12 -0800, Gregory Sutter wrote: >>> On Mon, Jan 11, 1999 at 10:24:10PM -0700, Wes Peters wrote: >>>> >>>> WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! >>> >>> And if anybody didn't quite get it, Chuck is here to stay. >> >> Who's Chuck? > > You know, Chuck, that horny red guy, always just hanging around forking. Oh, you mean the BSD daemon? You know he's not licensed to be called Chuck? Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 01:50:12 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA24696 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:50:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from orcrist.mediacity.com (orcrist.mediacity.com [208.138.36.146]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA24690 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:50:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gsutter@orcrist.mediacity.com) Received: (from gsutter@localhost) by orcrist.mediacity.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA21063; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:49:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gsutter) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:49:33 -0800 From: Gregory Sutter To: Greg Lehey Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Message-ID: <19990112014933.A20733@orcrist.mediacity.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> <9901111956.AA02634@traveler.uniscape.com> <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> <19990111231612.C18768@orcrist.mediacity.com> <19990112192717.Y8886@freebie.lemis.com> <19990112010123.B20503@orcrist.mediacity.com> <19990112193313.A8886@freebie.lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i In-Reply-To: <19990112193313.A8886@freebie.lemis.com>; from Greg Lehey on Tue, Jan 12, 1999 at 07:33:13PM +1030 Organization: Zer0 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Jan 12, 1999 at 07:33:13PM +1030, Greg Lehey wrote: > On Tuesday, 12 January 1999 at 1:01:24 -0800, Gregory Sutter wrote: > > On Tue, Jan 12, 1999 at 07:27:17PM +1030, Greg Lehey wrote: > >> On Monday, 11 January 1999 at 23:16:12 -0800, Gregory Sutter wrote: > >>> On Mon, Jan 11, 1999 at 10:24:10PM -0700, Wes Peters wrote: > >>>> > >>>> WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! > >>> > >>> And if anybody didn't quite get it, Chuck is here to stay. > >> > >> Who's Chuck? > > > > You know, Chuck, that horny red guy, always just hanging around forking. > > Oh, you mean the BSD daemon? You know he's not licensed to be called > Chuck? Yes, and as a young child, I was arrested and jailed three times for aggravated naming of stuffed animals. I also, once dared to refer to the camel from the O'Reilly book "Programming Perl" as Joe, in the same paragraph that I called the Taco Bell chihuahua[1] Pacito. That one cost me all my cigarette rations while I was in the pen. Guess I just don't learn, though, cause I still name all my computers, and one of these days, Apple, Dell, Compaq, or Maple Street Compushack is going to sue me, I just know. Greg [1] If you don't ever see these commercials on television, consider yourself extremely lucky. I don't own a TV and still can't escape. -- Gregory S. Sutter I'm not a COMPLETE idiot! mailto:gsutter@pobox.com Some parts are missing. http://www.pobox.com/~gsutter/ PGP DSS public key 0x40AE3052 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 02:49:15 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id CAA00786 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 02:49:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id CAA00780 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 02:49:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id TAA24711; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 19:48:13 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <369B1929.E3F72CCC@newsguy.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 18:43:05 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Doug Russell CC: Wes Peters , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Doug Russell wrote: > > On Mon, 11 Jan 1999, Wes Peters wrote: > > > WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! > > I was getting ready to say something like that. :) > > Listen folks... Like it or not, there is no way anyone will ever be able > to dislodge the daemon. (Except perhaps, Mr. McKusick. :) ) > > Consider it written in stone. :) Yeah, we'll soon see jhk and Dyson running TerryBSD than FreeBSD using anything else but the don't-call-it-Chuck daemon. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com If you sell your soul to the Devil and all you get is an MCSE from it, you haven't gotten market rate. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 06:16:41 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA24480 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 06:16:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from flood.ping.uio.no (flood.ping.uio.no [129.240.78.31]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA24456; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 06:16:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from des@flood.ping.uio.no) Received: (from des@localhost) by flood.ping.uio.no (8.9.1/8.9.1) id PAA68380; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 15:15:30 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from des) To: Kris Kennaway Cc: "Jordan K. Hubbard" , Mike Smith , Drew Derbyshire , chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: From: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Date: 12 Jan 1999 15:15:29 +0100 In-Reply-To: Kris Kennaway's message of "Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:36:46 +1030 (CST)" Message-ID: Lines: 23 X-Mailer: Gnus v5.5/Emacs 19.34 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kris Kennaway writes: > FWIW, I agree with the somewhat low-key release of 3.0 - as it turns > out there probably weren't any show-stopping problems, but it could > have turned into a real PR disaster for us 3.0 had at least two show-stopper bugs which would have made it worse than useless in a development environment, namely the dying daemons bug and the inetd signal bug. Add to that the fact that the Elf transition was not complete yet and that largish parts of the system were too new to trust (remember, 3.0 was released a very short time after E-day, C-day and P-day) and that we still had lots of code in that were due for a bobitt (re. the danish raiding expedition). All in all, 3.0 was not ready for deployment in a production environment, and to advertise it would have been to shoot ourselves in the foot. ISTR that Jordan had to obfuscate 3.0 on ftp.cdrom.com because too many people were installing it when they didn't have the competence to run 3.0... then we started getting complaints that it was too hard to find... I guess you can't make everybody happy :) DES -- Dag-Erling Smorgrav - des@flood.ping.uio.no To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 06:58:29 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA28638 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 06:58:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from gw.start.nl (gw.start.nl [193.67.139.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA28572 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 06:57:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ruigrjer@start.nl) Received: from start.nl (mail.start.nl [172.16.0.32]) by gw.start.nl (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA04405 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 15:52:19 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from ruigrjer@start.nl) Received: from HOOFDKANTOOR_START-Message_Server by start.nl with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 15:54:32 +0100 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 5.2 Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 15:46:36 +0100 From: "Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven" To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Was this known? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by hub.freebsd.org id GAA28634 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi guys, found an interesting link regarding FreeBSD and Rhapsody/MacOS X http://rhapsodyos.com/editorial/stone/ST00014.html Quote from aforementioned article: If you need a real firewall, forget NT! If you want the best, get FreeBSD with its ability to make files immutable (I hope Apple's Core OS group is listening!). It's free, it's easy to install, and you get the complete source code. FreeBSD also features one of the coolest things I have seen lately: "ports". When you start a compile going in any number of hundreds of software directories, the latest package will automatically be downloaded from the internet, its checksum will be tested, and it gets unpacked, compiled, installed and configured. Talking about User Experience! regards, Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven Infrastructure & Networks Start Holding B.V. tel: +31 - (0) 182 - 695 895 email: jeroen.ruigrok@start.nl To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 07:25:21 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA02082 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 07:25:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from obie.softweyr.com ([204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA02076 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 07:25:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA03576; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:24:39 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <369B6937.7B0417B1@softweyr.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:24:39 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr llc X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Wood, Richard" CC: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: this ran through my head yesterday... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Wood, Richard" wrote: > > On 11 January 1999 19:51, Terry Lambert[SMTP:tlambert@primenet.com] wrote: > > I hope they never hire anyone named O`Grady. I know for a fact that > > MS Exchange barfs on: > > > > Robert_O^x27Grady@somewhere.com > > We did, we just renamed them OGrady, solved a lot of problems :-) Dumping ex-Change would have solved even more, and Mr. O'Grady could've remained O'Grady. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 07:33:31 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA02666 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 07:33:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from post.ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk (fw128.nhs.uk [194.6.81.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA02658 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 07:33:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rich@ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk) Received: by post.ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) id ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 15:32:29 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Wood, Richard" To: "'freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: RE: this ran through my head yesterday... Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 15:32:29 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 January 1999 15:24, Woes Peters[SMTP:wes@softweyr.com] wrote: > Dumping ex-Change would have solved even more, and Mr. O'Grady could've > remained O'Grady. True, but the bureaucracy which surrounds what we can and can't connect to the NHS networks makes it difficult to use anything other than Exchange. The chances of the powers-that-be type-testing a FreeBSD based solution are best described as zero. Also, to quote an ex-manager of mine "UNIX isn't strategic, NT is". Now consider why he is an ex-manager :-) Rich (who spends too much time swearing at NT boxes) -- Rich Wood Systems Manager, Royal United Hospital, Bath. rich@ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 07:43:57 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA03681 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 07:43:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from apollo.sitaranetworks.com (apollo.sitaranetworks.com [199.103.141.105]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id HAA03675 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 07:43:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from loverso@sitara.net) Received: from sitara.net (jamaica.sitaranetworks.com [199.103.141.147]) by apollo.sitaranetworks.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA05147 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:38:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <369B6D5C.EA09AEB2@sitara.net> Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:42:20 -0500 From: "John R. LoVerso" Reply-To: loverso@sitaranetworks.com Organization: Sitara Networks, http://surf.to/loverso/ X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: FreeBSD advocacy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I just saw these "Linux Penguin badges" for PCs. Anyone consider having them make FreeBSD daemons? http://www.scotgold.com/Linux.htm John To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 07:51:16 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA04675 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 07:51:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from post.ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk (fw128.nhs.uk [194.6.81.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA04659 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 07:51:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rich@ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk) Received: by post.ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) id ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 15:50:17 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Wood, Richard" To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, "'loverso@sitaranetworks.com'" Subject: RE: FreeBSD advocacy Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 15:50:16 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On loverso@sitaranetworks.com, John R. LoVerso[SMTP:loverso@sitaranetworks.com] wrote: > I just saw these "Linux Penguin badges" for PCs. Anyone consider > having them make FreeBSD daemons? I thought there were some.... ahh yes, try http://www.freebsdmall.com/promotional/ where you will find some. Rich -- Rich Wood Systems Manager, Royal United Hospital, Bath. rich@ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 08:15:43 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA07419 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:15:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from thyme.cisco.com (thyme.cisco.com [171.69.43.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA07414 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:15:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shibumi@thyme.cisco.com) Received: from miranda-bsd.cisco.com (khoover-dhcp-171-69-112-70.cisco.com [171.69.112.70]) by thyme.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id IAA13870 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:15:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost by miranda-bsd.cisco.com (8.8.8) id IAA29379; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:15:06 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199901121615.IAA29379@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD advocacy In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:42:20 EST." <369B6D5C.EA09AEB2@sitara.net> Reply-to: shibumi@cisco.com X-Disclaimer: Unless otherwise noted below, this is not a policy statement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:15:06 -0800 From: "Kenton A. Hoover" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Walnut Creek CD-ROM: http://www.freebsdmall.com/promotional/ Scroll down for "Plate Logos". I got one at LISA with my 3.0 CD-ROM. Its on my ThinkPad right now as I type. On Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:42:20 EST, Sendmail channeled "John R. LoVerso" saying: > I just saw these "Linux Penguin badges" for PCs. Anyone consider > having them make FreeBSD daemons? > > http://www.scotgold.com/Linux.htm | Kenton A. Hoover Network Team Manager | shibumi@cisco.com | | Engineering Computer Services | | | Cisco Systems, Inc. | +1.408.526.5249 | |===================== http://www.shockwave.com/~shibumi ====================| | [Saying grace at Thanksgiving] | | Wendy Hood: Thanks for letting us white people kill all the Indians | | and steal all their stuff. | | -- The Ice Storm (1997) | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 08:21:21 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA07992 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:21:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from isinet.com (mail.isinet.com [199.4.155.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA07985 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:21:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from aturoff@isinet.com) Received: by pandora.isinet.com id <113794>; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 11:09:18 -0500 Message-Id: <99Jan12.110918est.113794@pandora.isinet.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 11:22:54 -0500 From: Adam Turoff Reply-To: aturoff@isinet.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.34 i686) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Wood, Richard" CC: "'freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: Re: this ran through my head yesterday... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wood, Richard wrote: > The chances of the powers-that-be type-testing a FreeBSD based solution > are best described as zero. ...today. Has anyone forwarded a first-hand story of the O'Grady mess to John Kirch? Is anyone keeping track of the laundry list of instances where MS does not follow RFCs (to illustrate their policy of de-commoditizing)? > Also, to quote an ex-manager of mine "UNIX isn't strategic, NT is". Now > consider why he is an ex-manager :-) > > Rich (who spends too much time swearing at NT boxes) Pity that your friendly network-neighborhood NT box can be recommissioned as a better-performing FreeBSD box. :-) Not last year, maybe not this year, but next year or the year after we should see the [re-]entry of "Strategic UNIX" in these organizations. Eyes on the prize and all that. -- Adam To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 08:25:05 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA08180 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:25:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from post.mail.demon.net (post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.40]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA08175 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 08:25:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from marko@uk.radan.com) Received: from [158.152.75.22] (helo=uk.radan.com) by post.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.10 #2) id 1006c7-0005iM-00; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 16:24:19 +0000 Organisation: Radan Computational Ltd., Bath, UK. Phone: +44-1225-320320 Fax: +44-1225-320311 Received: from beavis.uk.radan.com (beavis [193.114.228.122]) by uk.radan.com (8.6.10/8.6.10) with SMTP id QAA04258; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 16:24:10 GMT Received: from uk.radan.com (gppsun4) by beavis.uk.radan.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA13345; Tue, 12 Jan 99 16:24:08 GMT Message-Id: <369B771C.3E08079D@uk.radan.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 16:23:56 +0000 From: Mark Ovens Organization: Radan Computational Ltd X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 4.1.3_U1 sun4m) X-Accept-Language: en-GB Mime-Version: 1.0 To: "Wood, Richard" Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, "'loverso@sitaranetworks.com'" Subject: Re: FreeBSD advocacy References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Wood, Richard" wrote: > > On loverso@sitaranetworks.com, John R. > LoVerso[SMTP:loverso@sitaranetworks.com] wrote: > > I just saw these "Linux Penguin badges" for PCs. Anyone consider > > having them make FreeBSD daemons? > > I thought there were some.... > > > > ahh yes, try http://www.freebsdmall.com/promotional/ where you will find > some. > I'd forgotten about these. IIRC when jkh announced them he said WC were going to ship one with every CD set. I got another sheet of stickers with 2.2.8, but no case badge :-(. > Rich > > -- > Rich Wood > Systems Manager, Royal United Hospital, Bath. > rich@ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message -- Trust the computer industry to shorten Year 2000 to Y2K. It was this thinking that caused the problem in the first place. Mark Ovens, CNC Applications Engineer, Radan Computational Ltd. Bath, Avon, England. Sheet Metal CAD/CAM Solutions mailto:marko@uk.radan.com http://www.radan.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 09:20:20 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA14079 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:20:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from traveler.uniscape.com ([207.245.48.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA14069 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:20:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from stefanos@traveler.uniscape.com) Received: by traveler.uniscape.com (NX5.67e/NX3.0M) id AA02978; Tue, 12 Jan 99 12:15:20 -0500 Message-Id: <9901121715.AA02978@traveler.uniscape.com> Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3 v118.2) In-Reply-To: <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 3.3 (Enhance 2.0b5) Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.118.2) From: Kiakas Date: Tue, 12 Jan 99 12:15:19 -0500 To: Wes Peters Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: stefanos@e-scape.net References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> <9901111956.AA02634@traveler.uniscape.com> <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG You wrote: > I've got a better idea. Let's look at this from the point of view > that it has been discussed over and over again before, long before > you crowd of newbies ever flocked in here, and > > WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! I wasn't around back then, so stop yelling! Everything changes the source code, the algorithms, the ports collection, etc. Why? How about marketing? What is so sacred about the marketing material that it cannot change? Should we not try and improve everything about FreeBSD? Should we just worry about the technical aspects, and then wonder why FreeBSD is not getting the recognition it deserves. Just like the code and technical aspects of FreeBSD are upgraded, so should the marketing material. Atter all, excelence is not being perfect at only fifty percent of a task. > > If a company doesn't want to use the most stable, reliable operating > system on the planet because they're afraid someone might call them > a devil-worshipper, they're just going to have to live with that > decision. > This is not a technical, but a marketing consideration. Why do you want to put obstacles in the way of promoting FreeBSD? > Any of you who really don't like this are perfectly free to take the > FreeBSD source tree and go off and start your own AngelOS project. > Adopt whatever you want for a mascot, attempt whatever feats of > marketing and engineering prowess you feel are necessary, do whatever > you want with your distributions. The BSD license allows you to do > this. To get some glimmer of how important this point is, consider > the fact that ALL THREE free BSD projects use various forms of the > daemon as their logo. > I thought the point here, on FreeBSD advocacy, was to make FreeBSD much more sucessful, not "10 easy ways to start a new UNIX distribution." Please explain how starting a new distribution will make FreeBSD better. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 09:50:14 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA17866 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:50:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from xylan.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA17838 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:50:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com by xylan.com (8.8.7/SMI-SVR4 (xylan-mgw 2.2 [OUT])) id JAA00428; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:48:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from utah.XYLAN.COM by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id JAA21577; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:48:47 -0800 Received: from softweyr.com by utah.XYLAN.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (xylan utah [SPOOL])) id KAA14257; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:48:45 -0700 Message-ID: <369B8AFD.23822B2D@softweyr.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:48:45 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 2.2.7-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: stefanos@e-scape.net CC: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> <9901111956.AA02634@traveler.uniscape.com> <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> <9901121715.AA02978@traveler.uniscape.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kiakas wrote: > > You wrote: > > I've got a better idea. Let's look at this from the point of view > > that it has been discussed over and over again before, long before > > you crowd of newbies ever flocked in here, and > > > > WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! > > I wasn't around back then, so stop yelling! Precisely my point. You weren't around back then, so someone needs to yell it loud enough it'll sink in. > Everything changes the source code, the algorithms, the ports > collection, etc. Why? How about marketing? What is so sacred about the > marketing material that it cannot change? Should we not try and improve > everything about FreeBSD? Should we just worry about the technical > aspects, and then wonder why FreeBSD is not getting the recognition it > deserves. > > Just like the code and technical aspects of FreeBSD are > upgraded, so should the marketing material. Atter all, excelence is not > being perfect at only fifty percent of a task. This statement serves to illustrate only that you have a profound lack of understanding of what FreeBSD is. It is not just an operating system, or even just a "project." It is a community, and a part of an even larger BSD community of people who give their time and talents for something they believe in. The Daemon isn't just "marketing material," he's a mascot, an essential piece of what BSD is about. Until you understand this, you will NOT make a good spokesman for this community. -- Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket? Wes Peters +1.801.915.2061 Softweyr LLC wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 09:54:20 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA18363 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:54:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA18355 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 09:54:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id CAA06385; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 02:53:19 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <369B8B4D.5480BAFB@newsguy.com> Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 02:50:05 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: stefanos@e-scape.net CC: Wes Peters , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> <9901111956.AA02634@traveler.uniscape.com> <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> <9901121715.AA02978@traveler.uniscape.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kiakas wrote: > > You wrote: > > I've got a better idea. Let's look at this from the point of view > > that it has been discussed over and over again before, long before > > you crowd of newbies ever flocked in here, and > > > > WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! > > I wasn't around back then, so stop yelling! > > Everything changes the source code, the algorithms, the ports > collection, etc. Why? How about marketing? What is so sacred about the > marketing material that it cannot change? Should we not try and improve > everything about FreeBSD? Should we just worry about the technical > aspects, and then wonder why FreeBSD is not getting the recognition it > deserves. Chuck is not a technical aspect. Is a personal one. We *love* Chuck. Changing it to something else sounds like giving up things we like because of commercial reasons, and this is *not* a commercial os. Like it was said, if you want to go commercial, go commercial and use FreeBSD under another name and with another mascot. The license allows you to do so. -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com If you sell your soul to the Devil and all you get is an MCSE from it, you haven't gotten market rate. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 10:01:44 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA19007 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:01:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from mail1.WorldMediaCo.com ([207.252.121.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA19002 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:01:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from opsys@open-systems.net) Received: from freebsd.omaha.com ([207.252.122.237]) by mail1.WorldMediaCo.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-55573U2500L250S0V35) with SMTP id com; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 11:56:13 -0600 Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 12:01:05 -0600 (CST) From: "Open Systems Inc." X-Sender: opsys@freebsd.omaha.com To: "Daniel C. Sobral" cc: stefanos@e-scape.net, Wes Peters , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-Reply-To: <369B8B4D.5480BAFB@newsguy.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 13 Jan 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Chuck is not a technical aspect. Is a personal one. We *love* Chuck. > Changing it to something else sounds like giving up things we like DO NOT let kirk hear you wisper 'chuck'. His name is the BSD Daemon :-) Chris -- "Join Team-FreeBSD on cracking RC5-64! grab you client now and HELP OUT! http://www.distributed.net/cgi/select.cgi" ===================================| Open Systems FreeBSD Consulting. FreeBSD 2.2.8 is available now! | Phone: 402-573-9124 -----------------------------------| 3335 N. 103 Plaza #14, Omaha, NE 68134 FreeBSD: The power to serve! | E-Mail: opsys@open-systems.net http://www.freebsd.org | Consulting, Network Engineering, Security ===================================| http://open-systems.net -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- Version: 2.6.2 mQENAzPemUsAAAEH/06iF0BU8pMtdLJrxp/lLk3vg9QJCHajsd25gYtR8X1Px1Te gWU0C4EwMh4seDIgK9bzFmjjlZOEgS9zEgia28xDgeluQjuuMyUFJ58MzRlC2ONC foYIZsFyIqdjEOCBdfhH5bmgB5/+L5bjDK6lNdqD8OAhtC4Xnc1UxAKq3oUgVD/Z d5UJXU2xm+f08WwGZIUcbGcaonRC/6Z/5o8YpLVBpcFeLtKW5WwGhEMxl9WDZ3Kb NZH6bx15WiB2Q/gZQib3ZXhe1xEgRP+p6BnvF364I/To9kMduHpJKU97PH3dU7Mv CXk2NG3rtOgLTEwLyvtBPqLnbx35E0JnZc0k5YkABRO0JU9wZW4gU3lzdGVtcyA8 b3BzeXNAb3Blbi1zeXN0ZW1zLm5ldD4= =BBjp -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 10:04:53 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA19209 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:04:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from sss00205.schwab.com (sss00205.schwab.com [162.93.15.188]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA19204 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:04:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Laura.Hudson@Schwab.COM) Received: (from root@localhost) by fire sf id NAA12992 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:00:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from s0001asf.schwab.com(162.93.32.201) by sss00205 via smap (V2.1/2.1+anti-relay+anti-spam) id xma012950; Tue, 12 Jan 99 13:00:42 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by ihop sf id MAA08919 for advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 12:53:37 -0500 (EST) Received: ( Schwab Email ) by copymail sf with ESMTP id MAA08887 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 12:53:35 -0500 (EST) Received: by N2101PMX.nt.schwab.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) id ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:01:46 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Hudson, Laura" To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: State of the union, 1999. Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:01:02 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > DO NOT let kirk hear you wisper 'chuck'. His name is the BSD > Daemon :-) > > Chris Chuck Chuck Chuck Chuck Chuck Chuck, dammit!!!! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 10:45:55 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA23743 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:45:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from traveler.uniscape.com ([207.245.48.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA23737 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 10:45:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from stefanos@traveler.uniscape.com) Received: by traveler.uniscape.com (NX5.67e/NX3.0M) id AA03093; Tue, 12 Jan 99 13:40:56 -0500 Message-Id: <9901121840.AA03093@traveler.uniscape.com> Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3 v118.2) In-Reply-To: <369B8AFD.23822B2D@softweyr.com> X-Nextstep-Mailer: Mail 3.3 (Enhance 2.0b5) Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.118.2) From: Kiakas Date: Tue, 12 Jan 99 13:40:55 -0500 To: Wes Peters Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: stefanos@e-scape.net References: <3.0.5.32.19990110013242.0094db10@mail.frmt1.sfba.home.com> <9901111956.AA02634@traveler.uniscape.com> <369ADC7A.96FB883B@softweyr.com> <9901121715.AA02978@traveler.uniscape.com> <369B8AFD.23822B2D@softweyr.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Wes Peters wrote: > This statement serves to illustrate only that you have a profound lack Maybe I do have "a profound lack of understanding of what FreeBSD is". > of understanding of what FreeBSD is. It is not just an operating > system, or even just a "project." It is a community, and a part of > an even larger BSD community of people who give their time and talents > for something they believe in. The Daemon isn't just "marketing > material," he's a mascot, an essential piece of what BSD is about. Until > you understand this, you will NOT make a good spokesman for this > community. I have never tried to be a spokesman for this community, nor do I represent myself as such. Due to my lack of understanding, I though financial resources were important to the success of this project ("community"). I guess I was wrong. If it really is a community "who give their talents to something they believe in", why are there so many people here concerned how well Linux does? After all, even if Linux becomes a million times more accepted than FreeBSD, it doesn't matter and won't affect our community in any way. Thank you for enlightening me. Stefanos To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 12:38:31 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA07958 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 12:38:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp03.wxs.nl (smtp03.wxs.nl [195.121.6.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA07949 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 12:38:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from asmodai@wxs.nl) Received: from daemon.ninth-circle.org ([195.121.57.64]) by smtp03.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with ESMTP id AAA6B9A; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 21:37:38 +0100 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <369B1929.E3F72CCC@newsguy.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 21:45:27 +0100 (CET) Organization: Ninth Circle Enterprises From: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, Wes Peters , Doug Russell Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12-Jan-99 Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Doug Russell wrote: >> On Mon, 11 Jan 1999, Wes Peters wrote: >> >> > WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! >> >> I was getting ready to say something like that. :) >> >> Listen folks... Like it or not, there is no way anyone will ever be >> able >> to dislodge the daemon. (Except perhaps, Mr. McKusick. :) ) > Yeah, we'll soon see jhk and Dyson running TerryBSD than FreeBSD > using anything else but the don't-call-it-Chuck daemon. Thanks Daniel, that was another cup of tea lost over my monitor ;) TerryBSD, *chuckles*, it does have a ring to it... MUHAHAHA =) --- Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven A veil of smoke is what I am, asmodai(at)wxs.nl I wait and I wait... Network/Security Specialist BSD & picoBSD: The Power to Serve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 13:42:42 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA14972 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:42:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA14937 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:42:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA45467; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:41:16 -0800 (PST) To: stefanos@e-scape.net cc: Wes Peters , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:40:55 EST." <9901121840.AA03093@traveler.uniscape.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:41:14 -0800 Message-ID: <45429.916177274@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Due to my lack of understanding, I though financial resources > were important to the success of this project ("community"). I guess I > was wrong. They are important, but let's not throw out all of our traditions in some misguided effort to adopt a new look which offends no one but pleases no one either. Would you dress Donald Duck in pants just because he offends the moral majority by not having any? I don't think so. :-) - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 13:52:11 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA15976 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:52:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp04.primenet.com (smtp04.primenet.com [206.165.6.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA15969 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:52:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tlambert@usr09.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp04.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA24095; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 14:51:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr09.primenet.com(206.165.6.209) via SMTP by smtp04.primenet.com, id smtpd023908; Tue Jan 12 14:51:28 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA04881; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 14:51:12 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199901122151.OAA04881@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: this ran through my head yesterday... To: rich@ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk (Wood, Richard) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 21:51:12 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Wood, Richard" at Jan 12, 99 08:48:41 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > I hope they never hire anyone named O`Grady. I know for a fact that > > MS Exchange barfs on: > > > > Robert_O^x27Grady@somewhere.com > > We did, we just renamed them OGrady, solved a lot of problems :-) You'd think the paperwork involved in an involuntary name change would pretty much outwiegh the effort involved in just fixing the problem... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 14:07:58 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA17806 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 14:07:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp02.primenet.com (smtp02.primenet.com [206.165.6.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA17787; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 14:07:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tlambert@usr09.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp02.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA11417; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 15:07:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr09.primenet.com(206.165.6.209) via SMTP by smtp02.primenet.com, id smtpd011157; Tue Jan 12 15:06:58 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr09.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA05758; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 15:06:29 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199901122206.PAA05758@usr09.primenet.com> Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. To: des@flood.ping.uio.no (Dag-Erling Smorgrav) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 22:06:29 +0000 (GMT) Cc: kkennawa@physics.adelaide.edu.au, jkh@zippy.cdrom.com, mike@smith.net.au, software@kew.com, chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Dag-Erling Smorgrav" at Jan 12, 99 03:15:29 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > 3.0 had at least two show-stopper bugs which would have made it worse > than useless in a development environment, namely the dying daemons > bug and the inetd signal bug. FWIW, 2.2.8 has these same bugs. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 14:31:52 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA20960 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 14:31:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.36.247]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA20933; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 14:31:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kkennawa@physics.adelaide.edu.au) Received: from bragg (bragg [129.127.36.34]) by adelphi.physics.adelaide.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8/UofA-1.5) with SMTP id JAA22798; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 09:01:10 +1030 (CST) Received: from localhost by bragg; (5.65/1.1.8.2/05Aug95-0227PM) id AA28268; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 09:00:52 +1030 Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 09:00:52 +1030 (CST) From: Kris Kennaway X-Sender: kkennawa@bragg To: Dag-Erling Smorgrav Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 12 Jan 1999, Dag-Erling Smorgrav wrote: > Kris Kennaway writes: > > FWIW, I agree with the somewhat low-key release of 3.0 - as it turns > > out there probably weren't any show-stopping problems, but it could > > have turned into a real PR disaster for us > > 3.0 had at least two show-stopper bugs which would have made it worse > than useless in a development environment, namely the dying daemons > bug and the inetd signal bug. Add to that the fact that the Elf Oh yeah, I'd forgotten about those. Here's hoping that 3.1 proves to be a success! Kris ----- (ASP) Microsoft Corporation (MSFT) announced today that the release of its productivity suite, Office 2000, will be delayed until the first quarter of 1901. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 17:18:02 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA24971 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:18:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA24949; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:18:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jmb) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:18:00 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199901130118.RAA24949@hub.freebsd.org> From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" To: brian@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU CC: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: (brian@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Subject: Re: open-source/Linux article in Jan 18th Newsweek References: Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 18:01:09 -0800 (PST) > From: "Brian W. Buchanan" > > BTW, FreeBSD advocates who'd like to help alleviate this "UNIX is scary!" > mentality are invited to contribute to my project to create a unified GUI > configuration frontend. > See http://www.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU/~brian/freebsd-admin/ Brian, this looks beautiful. its enough to force me to load up Qt and take a better look. ;) jmb To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 17:29:32 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA28590 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:29:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA28566; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:29:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jmb) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:29:28 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199901130129.RAA28566@hub.freebsd.org> From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" To: drussell@saturn-tech.com CC: wes@softweyr.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: (message from Doug Russell on Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:25:14 -0700 (MST)) Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 01:25:14 -0700 (MST) > From: Doug Russell > > On Mon, 11 Jan 1999, Wes Peters wrote: > > > WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET RID OF THE DAEMON! > > I was getting ready to say something like that. :) > > Listen folks... Like it or not, there is no way anyone will ever be able > to dislodge the daemon. (Except perhaps, Mr. McKusick. :) ) > > Consider it written in stone. :) the daemon is our totem to ward off those can not deal with the difference between a demon and a daemon. you should consider him our guardian angel ;P jmb To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 17:33:14 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA29692 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:33:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA29679 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:33:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id KAA24845; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 10:32:20 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <369BF791.5F7AC9B3@newsguy.com> Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 10:32:01 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Open Systems Inc." CC: stefanos@e-scape.net, Wes Peters , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Open Systems Inc." wrote: > > On Wed, 13 Jan 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > > > Chuck is not a technical aspect. Is a personal one. We *love* Chuck. > > Changing it to something else sounds like giving up things we like > > DO NOT let kirk hear you wisper 'chuck'. His name is the BSD Daemon :-) Well, that's why I ducked when I first mentioned it. :-) This is advocacy, we are allowed some maneuvering room here! :-) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com If you sell your soul to the Devil and all you get is an MCSE from it, you haven't gotten market rate. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 17:47:09 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA03742 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:47:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smarter.than.nu (thought.calbbs.com [207.71.213.16]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA03731 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:47:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brian@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smarter.than.nu (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA15020 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:46:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brian@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU) Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 17:46:25 -0800 (PST) From: "Brian W. Buchanan" X-Sender: brian@smarter.than.nu To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-Reply-To: <199901130129.RAA28566@hub.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 12 Jan 1999, Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > the daemon is our totem to ward off those can not deal with the > difference between a demon and a daemon. you should consider him > our guardian angel ;P I was affraid my mom was going to freak out and think I was some kind of devil-worshiper when she saw me wearing my FreeBSD shirt. Luckily, her reaction was, "Aww, how cute!". Hmm. Maybe now I can get away with installing FreeBSD on her computer to save me the hassle of having to maintain a Windows machine every time I come home and her the expense of buying Microsoft products. I'll bet that XFree86, KDE, and WordPerfect 8 work better, too. :) -- Brian Buchanan brian@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU -------------------------------------------------------------------------- FreeBSD - The Power to Serve! http://www.freebsd.org daemon(n): 1. an attendant power or spirit : GENIUS 2. the cute little mascot of the FreeBSD operating system To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 18:16:05 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA09869 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 18:16:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA09864 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 18:16:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id LAA04149; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 11:15:25 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <369BF9C7.9DB85A67@newsguy.com> Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 10:41:27 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai CC: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, Wes Peters , Doug Russell Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai wrote: > > > Yeah, we'll soon see jhk and Dyson running TerryBSD than FreeBSD > > using anything else but the don't-call-it-Chuck daemon. > > Thanks Daniel, > > that was another cup of tea lost over my monitor ;) > > TerryBSD, *chuckles*, it does have a ring to it... MUHAHAHA =) You're welcome. I stole it myself... :-) (was it Jordan who first came up with it?) -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com If you sell your soul to the Devil and all you get is an MCSE from it, you haven't gotten market rate. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 18:38:11 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA15093 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 18:38:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA15002 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 18:37:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id MAA25687; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 12:41:45 +1030 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) id MAA40952; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 12:41:04 +1030 (CST) Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 12:41:04 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: Wes Peters Cc: "Wood, Richard" , freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: this ran through my head yesterday... Message-ID: <19990113124104.Y8886@freebie.lemis.com> References: <369B6937.7B0417B1@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <369B6937.7B0417B1@softweyr.com>; from Wes Peters on Tue, Jan 12, 1999 at 08:24:39AM -0700 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tuesday, 12 January 1999 at 8:24:39 -0700, Wes Peters wrote: > "Wood, Richard" wrote: >> >> On 11 January 1999 19:51, Terry Lambert[SMTP:tlambert@primenet.com] wrote: >>> I hope they never hire anyone named O`Grady. I know for a fact that >>> MS Exchange barfs on: >>> >>> Robert_O^x27Grady@somewhere.com >> >> We did, we just renamed them OGrady, solved a lot of problems :-) > > Dumping ex-Change would have solved even more, and Mr. O'Grady could've > remained O'Grady. Agreed, but Mr. O'Grady causes all sorts of problems when I save mail from him and later try to grep through my mail folder. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Tue Jan 12 19:41:15 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA04558 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 19:41:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp01.primenet.com (smtp01.primenet.com [206.165.6.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA04544 for ; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 19:41:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tlambert@usr06.primenet.com) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp01.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA12600; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 20:40:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from usr06.primenet.com(206.165.6.206) via SMTP by smtp01.primenet.com, id smtpd012473; Tue Jan 12 20:40:25 1999 Received: (from tlambert@localhost) by usr06.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA06432; Tue, 12 Jan 1999 20:40:14 -0700 (MST) From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199901130340.UAA06432@usr06.primenet.com> Subject: Re: open-source/Linux article in Jan 18th Newsweek To: brian@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (Brian W. Buchanan) Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 03:40:12 +0000 (GMT) Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Brian W. Buchanan" at Jan 11, 99 06:01:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Newsweek ran a 2 page article on open-source software in the Jan 18th > issue, primarily focusing on Linux. The article reads like most of the > other "mainstream" press Linux has been getting in recent months, and the > word 'arcane' is abused at least once. It's available in the online edition: http://www.newsweek.com/nw-srv/printed/us/st/front.htm Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 00:28:59 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA26792 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 00:28:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from post.ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk (fw128.nhs.uk [194.6.81.9]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA26777 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 00:28:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rich@ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk) Received: by post.ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) id ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 08:28:10 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Wood, Richard" To: "'freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG'" Subject: RE: this ran through my head yesterday... Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 08:28:01 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2232.9) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On aturoff@isinet.com, Adam Turoff[SMTP:aturoff@isinet.com] wrote: > Pity that your friendly network-neighborhood NT box can be > recommissioned as a better-performing FreeBSD box. :-) Once Token Ring support is working, it might just stand a chance. Rich -- Rich Wood Systems Manager, Royal United Hospital, Bath. rich@ruh-bath.swest.nhs.uk To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 00:57:45 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA06405 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 00:57:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from calvin.saturn-tech.com (calvin.saturn-tech.com [207.229.19.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA06250 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 00:57:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from drussell@saturn-tech.com) Received: from localhost (drussell@localhost) by calvin.saturn-tech.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id BAA19184; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 01:57:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drussell@saturn-tech.com) Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 01:57:21 -0700 (MST) From: Doug Russell To: "Daniel C. Sobral" cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-Reply-To: <369B8B4D.5480BAFB@newsguy.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 13 Jan 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Chuck is not a technical aspect. Is a personal one. We *love* Chuck. Gak! What is with all this Chuck? His name is NOT CHUCK! We do love him, but he is not Chuck. :) Later...... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 02:12:27 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id CAA00197 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 02:12:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ns.wan (trltech.demon.co.uk [194.222.7.191]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id CAA00163 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 02:12:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rsmith@trltech.co.uk) Received: from trltech.co.uk (rdls.dhcp.sw.wan [192.9.201.75]) by ns.wan (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA13270; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 10:09:59 GMT (envelope-from rsmith@trltech.co.uk) Message-ID: <369C7151.2BA88449@trltech.co.uk> Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 10:11:29 +0000 From: Richard Smith Reply-To: richard@jezebel.demon.co.uk Organization: http://www.trltech.co.uk X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Doug Russell CC: "Daniel C. Sobral" , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Doug Russell wrote: > > On Wed, 13 Jan 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > > > Chuck is not a technical aspect. Is a personal one. We *love* Chuck. > > Gak! What is with all this Chuck? His name is NOT CHUCK! >From http://www.freebsd.org/copyright/daemon.html click plushies, and you get "chuck" in your face! > We do love him, but he is not Chuck. :) BTW, AFAIK it's not male either :-) > > Later...... > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 10:59:34 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA00654 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 10:59:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from gateway.ruraltel.com (mail.ruraltel.com [24.225.0.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA00603 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 10:59:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dbeams@ssikan.com) From: dbeams@ssikan.com Received: from gateway.ruraltel.com (root@localhost) by gateway.ruraltel.com with ESMTP id MAA06916 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 12:39:28 -0600 (CST) Received: from notes.ssikan.com ([10.10.18.250]) by gateway.ruraltel.com with SMTP id MAA06912 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 12:39:27 -0600 (CST) Received: by notes.ssikan.com(Lotus SMTP MTA v1.06 (346.4 3-18-1997)) id 862566F8.0066182F ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 12:35:08 -0500 X-Lotus-FromDomain: SSI To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Message-ID: <862566F8.0066083E.00@notes.ssikan.com> Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 12:35:02 -0500 Subject: subscribe Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG subscribe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 11:10:42 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA03556 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 11:10:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from mail.intercom.com (mail.intercom.com [206.98.165.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA03495; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 11:10:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jason@intercom.com) Received: from mail.intercom.com (mail.intercom.com [206.98.165.10]) by mail.intercom.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with SMTP id LAA26083; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 11:18:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 11:18:58 -0500 (EST) From: "Jason J. Horton" To: Pascal Hofstee cc: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Chuck Badges for computer cases ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG http://www.freebsdmall.com/promotional/ sold here for US$1.00, not bad Promotional doesn't seem like that noticable a section. Any ideas on how to bring more attention to it? -J On Wed, 13 Jan 1999, Pascal Hofstee wrote: > A friend of mine just pointed me towards the following URL ... > > http://www.scotgold.com/Linux.htm > > I think I would Rock to also have those badges with Chuck on them ;-)) > > I would definately Love to have one of those (with Chuck then of course) > on my computer case .... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 11:20:02 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA06348 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 11:20:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from ninbox.freebsd.nws.net ([209.64.77.217]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA06255 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 11:19:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kris@airnet.net) Received: from airnet.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ninbox.freebsd.nws.net (8.9.1/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA01811; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 13:18:33 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <369CF189.BD1189CF@airnet.net> Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 13:18:33 -0600 From: Kris Kirby Organization: Absolutely None! X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Brian W. Buchanan" CC: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Brian W. Buchanan wrote: > I was affraid my mom was going to freak out and think I was some kind of > devil-worshiper when she saw me wearing my FreeBSD shirt. Luckily, her > reaction was, "Aww, how cute!". Hmm. Maybe now I can get away with The Daemon console saver gets interesting results from pseudo-goths. A devout christian friend had me change it in short order as his mother didn't even let him get a word in edgewise about it. Everyone else is usually "Hey. Cool screensaver." -- Kris Kirby UAH Mail UAH CS Home WWW ------------------------------------------- TGIFreeBSD... 'Nuff said. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 11:52:11 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA15348 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 11:52:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from peach.ocn.ne.jp (peach.ocn.ne.jp [210.145.254.87]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA15338 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 11:52:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dcs@newsguy.com) Received: from newsguy.com by peach.ocn.ne.jp (8.9.1a/OCN) id AAA19612; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 00:40:50 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <369CBE72.7A95F015@newsguy.com> Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 00:40:34 +0900 From: "Daniel C. Sobral" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: pt-BR,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Doug Russell CC: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Doug Russell wrote: > > On Wed, 13 Jan 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > > > Chuck is not a technical aspect. Is a personal one. We *love* Chuck. > > Gak! What is with all this Chuck? His name is NOT CHUCK! > > We do love him, but he is not Chuck. :) Yeah, yeah, but, really, how would you call him: 1) Not Chuck. 2) Not. 3) Mr. Chuck. 4) Mr. N. Chuck. 5) Chuck, Not Chuck. 6) Chuck, Not. 7) Chuck. ??? -- Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) dcs@newsguy.com If you sell your soul to the Devil and all you get is an MCSE from it, you haven't gotten market rate. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 14:00:28 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA08885 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 14:00:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from schuimpje.snt.utwente.nl (schuimpje.snt.utwente.nl [130.89.238.4]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA08864; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 14:00:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gelderen@mediaport.org) Received: from wit395301.student.utwente.nl ([130.89.235.121]:7684 "HELO deskfix" ident: "NO-IDENT-SERVICE[2]") by schuimpje.snt.utwente.nl with SMTP id <8076-23388>; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 22:59:03 +0100 Message-ID: <005b01be3f3f$d33e0820$1400000a@deskfix.local> From: "Jeroen C. van Gelderen" To: "Jason J. Horton" , "Pascal Hofstee" Cc: , Subject: Re: Chuck Badges for computer cases ? Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 22:58:16 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From: Jason J. Horton >http://www.freebsdmall.com/promotional/ >sold here for US$1.00, not bad > >Promotional doesn't seem like that noticable a section. >Any ideas on how to bring more attention to it? It's cool stuff. Name the section 'Cool Stuff'... Cheers, Jeroen -- Jeroen C. van Gelderen -- gelderen@mediaport.org -- &[8-D}~<= To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 14:42:25 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA14968 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 14:42:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from apollo.sitaranetworks.com (apollo.sitaranetworks.com [199.103.141.105]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA14693 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 14:40:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from loverso@sitara.net) Received: from sitara.net (jamaica.sitaranetworks.com [199.103.141.147]) by apollo.sitaranetworks.com (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA24749; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 17:21:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <369D1D6C.23F1B7B6@sitara.net> Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 17:25:48 -0500 From: "John R. LoVerso" Reply-To: loverso@sitaranetworks.com Organization: Sitara Networks, http://surf.to/loverso/ X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Jeroen C. van Gelderen" , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Chuck Badges for computer cases ? References: <005b01be3f3f$d33e0820$1400000a@deskfix.local> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > It's cool stuff. Name the section 'Cool Stuff'... and make a big obvious link to it from www.freebsd.org! John To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 15:14:49 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA18923 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 15:14:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from calvin.saturn-tech.com (calvin.saturn-tech.com [207.229.19.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA18918 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 15:14:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from drussell@saturn-tech.com) Received: from localhost (drussell@localhost) by calvin.saturn-tech.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA20949; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 16:14:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from drussell@saturn-tech.com) Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 16:14:01 -0700 (MST) From: Doug Russell To: richard@jezebel.demon.co.uk cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-Reply-To: <369C7151.2BA88449@trltech.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 13 Jan 1999, Richard Smith wrote: > > We do love him, but he is not Chuck. :) > > BTW, AFAIK it's not male either :-) Hahah! Good point! I never thought of that. :) Heheheh... :) rotfl... Later...... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 16:00:42 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA23012 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 16:00:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA22995 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 16:00:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) with ESMTP id KAA00107; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 10:29:23 +1030 (CST) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.1/8.9.0) id KAA54794; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 10:29:23 +1030 (CST) Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 10:29:23 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: "Daniel C. Sobral" Cc: Doug Russell , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Message-ID: <19990114102922.H8886@freebie.lemis.com> References: <369CBE72.7A95F015@newsguy.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.1i In-Reply-To: <369CBE72.7A95F015@newsguy.com>; from Daniel C. Sobral on Thu, Jan 14, 1999 at 12:40:34AM +0900 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thursday, 14 January 1999 at 0:40:34 +0900, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Doug Russell wrote: >> >> On Wed, 13 Jan 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: >> >>> Chuck is not a technical aspect. Is a personal one. We *love* Chuck. >> >> Gak! What is with all this Chuck? His name is NOT CHUCK! >> >> We do love him, but he is not Chuck. :) > > Yeah, yeah, but, really, how would you call him: > > 1) Not Chuck. > 2) Not. > 3) Mr. Chuck. > 4) Mr. N. Chuck. > 5) Chuck, Not Chuck. > 6) Chuck, Not. > 7) Chuck. > > ??? bsdd. Greg -- See complete headers for address, home page and phone numbers finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 17:14:32 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA03750 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 17:14:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (zippy.cdrom.com [204.216.27.228]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA03745 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 17:14:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jkh@zippy.cdrom.com) Received: from zippy.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by zippy.cdrom.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA90687; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 17:09:37 -0800 (PST) To: Greg Lehey cc: "Daniel C. Sobral" , Doug Russell , advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 14 Jan 1999 10:29:23 +1030." <19990114102922.H8886@freebie.lemis.com> Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 17:09:37 -0800 Message-ID: <90683.916276177@zippy.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kirk calls him "beastie", FWIW. - Jordan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 18:33:31 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA01416 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 18:33:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from thyme.cisco.com (thyme.cisco.com [171.69.43.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA01391 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 18:33:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shibumi@thyme.cisco.com) Received: from miranda-bsd.cisco.com (dhcp-sjc5-107-185.cisco.com [171.71.107.185]) by thyme.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id SAA20715 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 18:32:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost by miranda-bsd.cisco.com (8.8.8) id SAA11184; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 18:32:07 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199901140232.SAA11184@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:41:14 PST." <45429.916177274@zippy.cdrom.com> Reply-to: shibumi@cisco.com X-Disclaimer: Unless otherwise noted below, this is not a policy statement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 18:32:06 -0800 From: "Kenton A. Hoover" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Strangely enough, that is the reason that Tweety Bird has feathers. Tweety was originally flesh colored, as in a featherless bird. However, no one ever noticed that Porky doesn't have pants on. On Tue, 12 Jan 1999 13:41:14 PST, Sendmail channeled "Jordan K. Hubbard" saying: > Would you dress Donald Duck in pants just because he offends the moral > majority by not having any? I don't think so. :-) | Kenton A. Hoover Network Team Manager | shibumi@cisco.com | | Engineering Computer Services | | | Cisco Systems, Inc. | +1.408.526.5249 | |===================== http://www.shockwave.com/~shibumi ====================| | And when I asked for a separate room | | It was late at night | | And we'd been driving since noon. | | But if I'd known how that would sound to you | | I would have stayed in your bed | | For the rest of my life | | Just to prove I was right. | | That its harder to be friends than lovers | | And you shouldn't try to mix the two. | | Cause you do it and you're still unhappy | | Then you know that the problem is you. | | -- "Divorce Song" | | Liz Phair | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 22:14:14 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA24401 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 22:14:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from smtp02.wxs.nl (smtp02.wxs.nl [195.121.6.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA24396 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 22:14:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from asmodai@wxs.nl) Received: from daemon.ninth-circle.org ([195.121.56.84]) by smtp02.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with ESMTP id AAA6ED0; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 07:13:04 +0100 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <90683.916276177@zippy.cdrom.com> Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 07:20:45 +0100 (CET) Organization: Ninth Circle Enterprises From: Jeroen Ruigrok/Asmodai To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. Cc: advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG, Doug Russell , "Daniel C. Sobral" , Greg Lehey Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 14-Jan-99 Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > Kirk calls him "beastie", FWIW. That would be more in line with the term: "Djeez man, what a funky killer OS is that!" (when a non-believer (e.g. the average NT nitwit) sees FreeBSD in action). Beastie... Sounds better than Chuck =) --- Jeroen Ruigrok van der Werven A veil of smoke is what I am, asmodai(at)wxs.nl I wait and I wait... Network/Security Specialist BSD & picoBSD: The Power to Serve To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Wed Jan 13 23:16:12 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA00961 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 23:16:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from obie.softweyr.com ([204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA00956 for ; Wed, 13 Jan 1999 23:16:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA07112 for ; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 00:15:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <369D9976.EE53D4E8@softweyr.com> Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 00:15:02 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr llc X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: FreeBSD mentioned in SRO Update Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >5. The Cheapest Route: A Tale Of Linux Vs. Cisco http://chkpt.zdnet.com/chkpt/srou990114/www.zdnet.com/sr/stories/column/0,4712,381687,00.html There's not a single long-haul packet on the Net that doesn't pass through at least one Cisco router on its way from hither to yon. But there's just one little problem: It's expensive--very expensive. So why not try Linux instead? Does actually mention FreeBSD, without really calling attention to it. A few replies have pointed out the overall superiority, though. ;^) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Thu Jan 14 08:57:48 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA29025 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 08:57:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from DegNet.de (degnet.de [194.95.214.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA29018 for ; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 08:57:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from malte.lance@gmx.net) Received: from neuron.webmore.prv (GateWay [192.168.168.1]) by DegNet.de (8.8.8/8.8.8/Debian/GNU) with ESMTP id RAA29498; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 17:56:02 +0100 Received: from neuron.webmore.prv (neuron.webmore.prv "Malte Lance") by neuron.webmore.prv (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA05160; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 17:54:20 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <199901141654.RAA05160@neuron.webmore.prv> Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 17:54:18 +0100 (CET) From: Malte Lance Reply-To: malte.lance@gmx.net Subject: Re: State of the union, 1999. To: dcs@newsguy.com cc: drussell@saturn-tech.com, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <369CBE72.7A95F015@newsguy.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 14 Jan, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: > Doug Russell wrote: >> >> On Wed, 13 Jan 1999, Daniel C. Sobral wrote: >> >> > Chuck is not a technical aspect. Is a personal one. We *love* Chuck. >> >> Gak! What is with all this Chuck? His name is NOT CHUCK! >> >> We do love him, but he is not Chuck. :) > > Yeah, yeah, but, really, how would you call him: > > 1) Not Chuck. > 2) Not. > 3) Mr. Chuck. > 4) Mr. N. Chuck. > 5) Chuck, Not Chuck. > 6) Chuck, Not. > 7) Chuck. > > ??? "D. Mon" Malte. > > -- > Daniel C. Sobral (8-DCS) > dcs@newsguy.com > -- Malte Lance. --- composed with TkRat To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Thu Jan 14 23:51:52 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA06837 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 23:51:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk [193.237.89.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA06827 for ; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 23:51:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nik@nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk) Received: (from nik@localhost) by nothing-going-on.demon.co.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA23367; Thu, 14 Jan 1999 20:39:44 GMT (envelope-from nik) Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 20:39:44 +0000 From: Nik Clayton To: freebsd-users@freebsd-uk.eu.org, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Eric the Evangelist comes to town Message-ID: <19990114203944.C23674@catkin.nothing-going-on.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95i Organization: Nik at home, where there's nothing going on Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [ Sent to the FreeBSD UK mailing list, and the FreeBSD advocacy mailing list ] This was forwarded to my by someone on the Greater London Linux User Group. Anyone else interested in going along? I have one or two questions to ask Mr Raymond. . . N > The LUUG Lectures > > UKUUG - London Unix User Group > > > WEDNESDAY 20th January 1999, 19:15 > Commonwealth Conference and Events Centre, > Kensington High Street, London W8 6NQ > > Eric Raymond > > Eric is well-known in the Open Source community as the author of > The Cathedral And The Bazaar, a thought-provoking paper on > different approaches to software release engineering. His numerous > other projects include The New Hacker's Dictionary, many original > Open Source items, and contributions to many more (GNU Emacs, > ncurses, fetchmail, NetHack, Linux etc). > > There is no fixed title for this talk, but you can get a flavour > of its likely contents from Eric's homepage: > > http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/ > > Informal discussions will continue after the talk at a nearby > restaurant. Kensington is not LUUG's normal stamping-ground, so > suggestions of a suitable venue would be very welcome. > > > Eric Raymond is in the UK to speak at the Netproject conference on > Linux and Open Source Software: http://www.netproject.com/ > > The LUUG lectures are sponsored by the UK Unix systems User Group. > http://www.ukuug.org/ > > For further information on LUUG Lectures, contact Andrew Findlay. > Phone: 01895 203066 E-mail: Andrew.Findlay@brunel.ac.uk > > Here's a rough map of the Kensington area: > > | | |P | > | | |h | > | | |i | > | | |l | > | | |l | N > | | |i | _ > | | |m | /| > | | |o | / > | | Commonwealth |r | / > | | Institute |e | > | | | | > | | |G | > | | -------- |d | > | | ----- \ |n | > | | | | |s | | | | | | | > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > Kensington High Street A315 > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > | | | | | | | | | | | | High St > |W | |E | |A | > Kensington > |a | |a | |b | Tube Stn > |r | |r | |i | > |w | |l | |n | > |i | |s | |g | > |c | | | |d | > |k | |C | |o | > | | |o | |n | > |G | |u | | | > |d | |r | |R | > |n | |t | |d | > |s | | | | | > | | |R | | | > | | |d | | | > > > For more detailed map, see: > http://uk.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?pc=W86NQ > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > - > | From Andrew Findlay at Brunel University, Uxbridge, UB8 3PH, UK > | > | Andrew.Findlay@brunel.ac.uk +44 1895 203066 or +44 1895 274000 x2512 > | > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- End forwarded message ----- -- subterra superque womblia liber To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Fri Jan 15 03:30:18 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id DAA26507 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Fri, 15 Jan 1999 03:30:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from chiark.greenend.org.uk (chiark.greenend.org.uk [195.224.76.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id DAA26494 for ; Fri, 15 Jan 1999 03:30:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from fanf@chiark.greenend.org.uk) Received: from fanf by chiark.greenend.org.uk with local (Exim 2.02 #1) id 1017Qm-0002Ef-00 (Debian); Fri, 15 Jan 1999 11:28:48 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <13983.9839.853078.67397@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 11:28:47 +0000 (GMT) From: Tony Finch To: Nik Clayton Cc: freebsd-users@freebsd-uk.eu.org, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Eric the Evangelist comes to town In-Reply-To: <19990114203944.C23674@catkin.nothing-going-on.org> References: <19990114203944.C23674@catkin.nothing-going-on.org> X-Mailer: VM 6.47 under Emacs 19.34.1 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Nik Clayton writes: > [ Sent to the FreeBSD UK mailing list, and the FreeBSD advocacy mailing list ] > > This was forwarded to my by someone on the Greater London Linux User > Group. > > Anyone else interested in going along? I have one or two questions to ask > Mr Raymond. . . I was planning to go. I might even drag along a cow-orker or two... Tony. > > The LUUG Lectures > > UKUUG - London Unix User Group > > > > WEDNESDAY 20th January 1999, 19:15 > > Commonwealth Conference and Events Centre, > > Kensington High Street, London W8 6NQ > > > > Eric Raymond -- f.a.n.finch fanf@demon.net dot@dotat.at To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Fri Jan 15 08:05:53 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA04091 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Fri, 15 Jan 1999 08:05:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from obie.softweyr.com ([204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA04070 for ; Fri, 15 Jan 1999 08:05:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA09833; Fri, 15 Jan 1999 09:02:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <369F667E.4BE37FF6@softweyr.com> Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 09:02:06 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr llc X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.0-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Nik Clayton CC: freebsd-users@freebsd-uk.eu.org, advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Eric the Evangelist comes to town References: <19990114203944.C23674@catkin.nothing-going-on.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Nik Clayton wrote: > > [ Sent to the FreeBSD UK mailing list, and the FreeBSD advocacy mailing list ] > > This was forwarded to my by someone on the Greater London Linux User > Group. > > Anyone else interested in going along? I have one or two questions to ask > Mr Raymond. . . He's coming here to my home town in April. Does anyone have some Daemon suits I can borrow, along with pitchforks? I'd like to get a couple of pokes in myself. ;^) (I've heard vicious rumors of another group planning to dress up like Saint RMS and chant "Free the Source" throughout the meeting. We're a weird lot here in Utah. ;^) -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sat Jan 16 08:30:37 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA27365 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 08:30:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from macaleesent.safezonesys.com (mail.safezonesys.com [207.201.204.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA27357 for ; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 08:30:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from DonWilde@safezonesys.com) Received: by MACALEESENT with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) id ; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 09:30:48 -0700 Message-ID: From: Don Wilde To: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: 2B is going 2Bcome irrelevant Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 09:30:47 -0700 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Thought you all'd enjoy this. Reference the Editorial by Jonathan Erickson of Doctor Dobb's Journal, January '99 issue pg. 8, probably also on their ddj.com website. The OpEd discusses the implications and slanting of the proposed Uniform Commercial Code Article 2B, which is designed to bless the 'you open it, you agree' payware licenses and all their legalistic theft. Dear Jonathan - I appreciated your editorial pointing out the questionable worth of the new UCC Article 2B. Your worry is well founded, but I'd like to point out a growing counter-force to the payware dinosaurs and their legions of lawyers. I have eliminated most of my payware-licensed programs and use only freely-distributable open source programs like FreeBSD and XFree86. Now that people are reverse engineering Micros**t's proprietary data formats such as Word6 .DOC and Excel5 .XLS, I no longer need those monstrosities. We small furry mammals may occasionally be squashed by the behemoths, but we're breeding like you-know-what, and now we're starting to get corporate and media recognition. I realize that your audience is mostly professional software engineers paid to create software -- I am one -- but we all know that open source (by virtue of its open inspection by the internet community) is far more robust than most payware. Most of us are forced by Windows-centric managers to use Windows-based tools, or -- worse! -- pirated copies of such. It is true that there is a broader base of desktop and specialty packages available for NT and W9x -- now -- but that is changing as the perceptual sea-change sweeps the commercial marketplace. It doesn't take many defections from the Microsoft-oriented community to create a massive multiplication of our freeware developer resources. Even if only one percent of the Windows people switch, and one percent of those contribute to the FreeBSD source base, that's still a tripling (at least!) of our developer community. We already have a robust, commercial-grade operating system, and all of the internet-developed programs out there have been ported in complete packages to FreeBSD and are available on the distribution disks. This includes all the tools that NASA and the National Labs used in the 70's and 80's on their early Sun workstations to develop all their esoteric toys, and today's commodity PC's are so much more powerful than Sun 3's that we can take it so much farther. FreeBSD PC's are not PC's any more. We shouldn't compare them to Windoze word processors and spreadsheet calculators. They are inexpensive and powerful personal graphics workstations, complete with networking, mail services and web-in-a-box, and they scare the bejesus out of Bill Gates because he then becomes an irrelevance. We are more of a threat to him than Scott McNealy or Ray Noorda ever will be. We people have more sense than either Wall Street or Washington give us credit for. 2B will only accelerate the acceptance and further development of open source software. Don Wilde donwilde@safezonesys.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sat Jan 16 08:51:02 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA28947 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 08:51:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from macaleesent.safezonesys.com (mail.safezonesys.com [207.201.204.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA28941 for ; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 08:51:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from DonWilde@safezonesys.com) Received: by MACALEESENT with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) id ; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 09:51:15 -0700 Message-ID: From: Don Wilde To: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: 2B is going 2Bcome irrelevant Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 09:51:11 -0700 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG http://www.ddj.com/articles/1999/9901/9901q/9901q.htm is the URL of the JE editorial. Thanks, Wes. I was in the middle of loading Bison and Flex on my NT system to get some semblance of a working environment at work when I happened to flip to the editorial. Gotta get SOME FreeBSD advocacy in whilest I'm forced to work. I even had to write the e-mail from Internet ExploDer... :( PLUG: I'm wearing one of Marshall Kirk's t-shirts with Beastie on the front. mckusick.com is the source, they're great shirts to complement the FreeBSD Daemon shirts from freebsdmall.com... -----Original Message----- From: Wes Peters [mailto:wes@softweyr.com] Sent: Saturday, January 16, 1999 9:44 AM To: Don Wilde Subject: Re: 2B is going 2Bcome irrelevant Don Wilde wrote: > > We people have more sense than either Wall Street or Washington > give us credit for. 2B will only accelerate the acceptance and further > development of open source software. An excellent letter, Don. Thank you for writing it. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sat Jan 16 14:11:55 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA28223 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 14:11:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from server1.cyberix.com (server1.cyberix.com [207.106.53.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA28216 for ; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 14:11:52 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bradley@softhome.net) Received: from billyjoebob (max1-ppp-21.cyberix.com [207.106.53.200]) by server1.cyberix.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA10073 for ; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 17:06:34 -0500 (EST) From: "Brad Benson" To: Subject: subscribe freebsd-advocacy Date: Sun, 17 Jan 1999 05:11:50 -0500 Message-ID: <000101be4201$cc70d620$0a00a8c0@billyjoebob> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0002_01BE41D7.E39ACE20" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01BE41D7.E39ACE20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit subscribe freebsd-advocacy ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01BE41D7.E39ACE20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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 ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01BE41D7.E39ACE20-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sat Jan 16 17:33:23 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA18193 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 17:33:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from thyme.cisco.com (thyme.cisco.com [171.69.43.12]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA18188 for ; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 17:33:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from shibumi@thyme.cisco.com) Received: from miranda-bsd.cisco.com (khoover-dhcp-171-69-112-70.cisco.com [171.69.112.70]) by thyme.cisco.com (8.8.5-Cisco.1/8.6.5) with ESMTP id RAA01247 for ; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 17:33:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost by miranda-bsd.cisco.com (8.8.8) id RAA03310; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 17:33:17 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199901170133.RAA03310@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.2 2/24/98 To: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD mentioned in SRO Update In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 14 Jan 1999 00:15:02 MST." <369D9976.EE53D4E8@softweyr.com> Reply-to: shibumi@cisco.com X-Disclaimer: Unless otherwise noted below, this is not a policy statement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 17:33:16 -0800 From: "Kenton A. Hoover" Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 14 Jan 1999 00:15:02 MST, Sendmail channeled Wes Peters saying: > >5. The Cheapest Route: A Tale Of Linux Vs. Cisco > http://chkpt.zdnet.com/chkpt/srou990114/www.zdnet.com/sr/stories/column/0,471 2,381687,00.html > > There's not a single long-haul packet on the Net that doesn't pass through at > least one Cisco router on its way from hither to yon. But there's just one > little problem: It's expensive--very expensive. So why not try Linux instead? You have a Linux box that will switch at OC-12 speeds available? (I do not speak for my employer...) | Kenton A. Hoover Network Team Manager | shibumi@cisco.com | | Engineering Computer Services | | | Cisco Systems, Inc. | +1.408.526.5249 | |===================== http://www.shockwave.com/~shibumi ====================| | And the American left's infatuation with thrifty socialized medicine | | is made possible by their never having to deal with it. The Japs and the | | Brits are a stoic bunch, suffering in silence, blaming themselves for | | any illness, apologizing for any sort of dependence on the health | | system, probably never reporting many deadly illnesses for fear of | | cultural shame. I'll never forget having my front teeth removed by the | | wonderful National Health Service: nurse's foot on my chest (I kid you | | not), dentist's pliers in my mouth, blood everywhere, no gas, and when I | | screamed, I was accused of not being a grown-up. I was eight. Still, | | really cheap. 6 percent of GNP on health in Britain, and all those | | lovely physiques and smiles to show for it. | | -- Andrew Sullivan | To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-advocacy Sat Jan 16 23:02:16 1999 Return-Path: Received: (from majordom@localhost) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA11550 for freebsd-advocacy-outgoing; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 23:02:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from obie.softweyr.com ([204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA11542 for ; Sat, 16 Jan 1999 23:02:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from zaphod.softweyr.com (zaphod.softweyr.com [204.68.178.35]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA03700; Sun, 17 Jan 1999 00:02:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199901170133.RAA03310@miranda-bsd.cisco.com> Date: Sun, 17 Jan 1999 00:02:03 -0700 (MST) Organization: Softweyr LLC From: Wes Peters To: "Kenton A. Hoover" Subject: Re: FreeBSD mentioned in SRO Update Cc: freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-advocacy@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 17-Jan-99 Kenton A. Hoover wrote: > On Thu, 14 Jan 1999 00:15:02 MST, Sendmail channeled Wes Peters saying: >> >5. The Cheapest Route: A Tale Of Linux Vs. Cisco >> http://chkpt.zdnet.com/chkpt/srou990114/www.zdnet.com/sr/stories/column/0,471 > 2,381687,00.html >> >> There's not a single long-haul packet on the Net that doesn't pass through at >> least one Cisco router on its way from hither to yon. But there's just one >> little problem: It's expensive--very expensive. So why not try Linux instead? > > You have a Linux box that will switch at OC-12 speeds available? At the moment? No. Could I build one given a couple of months? You bet. I'll just stick an assortment of the Xylan ASICs lying around on my desk onto a card, load the ASX driver onto it, and write a virtual router port driver for FreeBSD. You'd be amazed what you can do with a little board space, a Mammoth, and a Whistler. Actually, you'd probably be amazed what I can do with just a Mammoth, or perhaps shocked and dismayed... ;^) I can certainly build a FreeBSD box that will kick living hell out of a 2500 for far less money, and run a web server, nntp cache, mail server, and ftp server all on it at the same time. > (I do not speak for my employer...) Nor I mine, that's why I don't participate in these mailing lists from their computers. But trust me, we build stuff that will switch at OC-12 speeds and WAY beyond. Our engineering network consists of switched OC-12 links; you should see NFS fly in that environment. ;^) -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC http://www.softweyr.com/~softweyr wes@softweyr.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message