From owner-freebsd-arch Sun Dec 22 23: 5:42 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E34B037B419 for ; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 23:05:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from marvin.bsdng.org (24-159-239-62.jvl.wi.charter.com [24.159.239.62]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2818543ED8 for ; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 23:05:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mkm@ieee.org) Received: from marvin.bsdng.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by marvin.bsdng.org (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gBN11LGs007007; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 01:01:44 GMT (envelope-from mkm@ieee.org) Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 11:12:35 -0600 From: Kyle Martin To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Shared-memory version of macros Message-ID: <20021111171235.GA15329@marvin.bsdng.org> References: <200211101732.gAAHWZ59035339@beastie.mckusick.com> <20021111034357.GC39178@elvis.mu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20021111034357.GC39178@elvis.mu.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Lines: 14 Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Nov 10, 2002 at 07:43:57PM -0800, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > Dr. McKusick, if you have an "in" with any of the standards bodies > it would be really, _Really_, _REALLY_ nice to see some form of > the BSD queue macros become part of the standard such that they > will be named and behave consitantly across Unix/all platforms. its not that hard to get your "in", simply join the IEEE-SA, itll cost you about $35 iirc. then sign up to vote on the standards, joining PASC and proposing standards is free. -- Kyle Martin mkm@ieee.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-arch Sun Dec 22 23: 5:51 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB2FF37B4B6 for ; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 23:05:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from marvin.bsdng.org (24-159-239-62.jvl.wi.charter.com [24.159.239.62]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6A2F43EEC for ; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 23:05:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mkm@ieee.org) Received: from marvin.bsdng.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by marvin.bsdng.org (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gBN11LGq007007; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 01:01:40 GMT (envelope-from mkm@ieee.org) Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 11:21:52 -0600 From: Kyle Martin To: Kirk McKusick Cc: arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Shared-memory version of macros Message-ID: <20021112172152.GC15329@marvin.bsdng.org> References: <200211112232.gABMW459037409@beastie.mckusick.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200211112232.gABMW459037409@beastie.mckusick.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Lines: 28 Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Nov 11, 2002 at 02:32:04PM -0800, Kirk McKusick wrote: > > Historically /usr/include/sys was used to include files that > provided headers that included interfaces between the kernel > and userland. For example, describes that > stat structure which is filled in by the kernel and used > by userland applications. Since the queue macros do not > describe any kernel/userland shared structures, they belong > in /usr/include. They are much more like which > describes purely userland structures like FILE *. However, > we canot move from the /sys/sys directory as > it is needed by the kernel (indeed was originally developed > for the kernel) as there is another rule which says that > the kernel headers need to be self contained (that is the > kernel cannot depend on anything in /usr/include). So, there > is the dilemma of duplicating the queue macros used in the > kernel in a /usr/include file, or trying to avoid divergence > by pulling in the kernel macros from /usr/include/sys. As > for what userland applications should do, once > exists, they should always use that file. > perhaps "#include" could appear in /usr/include/queue.h with some typical #ifdef glue in -- Kyle Martin mkm@ieee.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-arch Sun Dec 22 23: 5:54 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E234737B4B7 for ; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 23:05:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from marvin.bsdng.org (24-159-239-62.jvl.wi.charter.com [24.159.239.62]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2387C43ED8 for ; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 23:05:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mkm@ieee.org) Received: from marvin.bsdng.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by marvin.bsdng.org (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gBN11LGp007007; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 01:01:40 GMT (envelope-from mkm@ieee.org) Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 17:23:34 -0600 From: Kyle Martin To: Kirk McKusick Cc: arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Shared-memory version of macros Message-ID: <20021112232334.GA20358@marvin.bsdng.org> References: <20021112172152.GC15329@marvin.bsdng.org> <200211122310.gACNA159039354@beastie.mckusick.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200211122310.gACNA159039354@beastie.mckusick.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Lines: 38 Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Nov 12, 2002 at 03:10:01PM -0800, Kirk McKusick wrote: > > On Mon, Nov 11, 2002 at 02:32:04PM -0800, Kirk McKusick wrote: > > Historically /usr/include/sys was used to include files that > > provided headers that included interfaces between the kernel > > and userland. For example, describes that > > stat structure which is filled in by the kernel and used > > by userland applications. Since the queue macros do not > > describe any kernel/userland shared structures, they belong > > in /usr/include. They are much more like which > > describes purely userland structures like FILE *. However, > > we canot move from the /sys/sys directory as > > it is needed by the kernel (indeed was originally developed > > for the kernel) as there is another rule which says that > > the kernel headers need to be self contained (that is the > > kernel cannot depend on anything in /usr/include). So, there > > is the dilemma of duplicating the queue macros used in the > > kernel in a /usr/include file, or trying to avoid divergence > > by pulling in the kernel macros from /usr/include/sys. As > > for what userland applications should do, once > > exists, they should always use that file. > > > > perhaps "#include" could appear in > /usr/include/queue.h with some typical #ifdef > glue in > > > I am not sure what you mean by the above. The > file is already protected with #ifndef _SYS_QUEUE_H_ against > multiple inclusion. Did you have something else in mind? > The #ifdef I was referring to was _KERNEL, which is already there :) -- Kyle Martin mkm@ieee.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-arch Mon Dec 23 2:21:15 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D841337B401 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 02:21:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from vbook.express.ru (asplinux.ru [195.133.213.194]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E80B43ED8 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 02:21:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from vova@sw.ru) Received: from vova by vbook.express.ru with local (Exim 4.10) id 18QPhx-0000Lm-00 for arch@freebsd.org; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 13:21:13 +0300 Subject: usbd and devd From: "Vladimir B. " Grebenschikov To: arch@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Organization: SWsoft Inc. Message-Id: <1040638871.1205.1.camel@vbook> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.2.0 Date: 23 Dec 2002 13:21:12 +0300 Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Will functionality of usbd eventually merged into devd ? -- Vladimir B. Grebenschikov SWsoft Inc. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-arch Mon Dec 23 5: 9: 9 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EAF937B401 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 05:09:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from harmony.village.org (rover.bsdimp.com [204.144.255.66]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E6E843ED8 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 05:09:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from localhost (warner@rover2.village.org [10.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.12.6/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBND95uB075254; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 06:09:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 06:08:09 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <20021223.060809.06253817.imp@bsdimp.com> To: vova@sw.ru Cc: arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: usbd and devd From: "M. Warner Losh" In-Reply-To: <1040638871.1205.1.camel@vbook> References: <1040638871.1205.1.camel@vbook> X-Mailer: Mew version 2.1 on Emacs 21.2 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message: <1040638871.1205.1.camel@vbook> "Vladimir B. " Grebenschikov writes: : Will functionality of usbd eventually merged into devd ? Yes. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-arch" in the body of the message