From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Dec 15 21: 1:24 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 836C137B401 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:01:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.uninterruptible.net (mail.uninterruptible.net [64.146.146.13]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25DC743ED8 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:01:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kris@catonic.net) Received: from Spaz.Catonic.NET (tnt6-216-180-4-89.dialup.hiwaay.net [216.180.4.89]) by mail.uninterruptible.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8801C50037; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 05:01:04 +0000 (GMT) Received: by Spaz.Catonic.NET (Postfix, from userid 1002) id D80363260; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 05:00:58 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Spaz.Catonic.NET (Postfix) with ESMTP id B11504C5D; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 05:00:58 +0000 (GMT) Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 05:00:58 +0000 (GMT) From: Kris Kirby To: Rob Cc: Cliff Sarginson , Subject: Re: Mickey Mouse Power Plug In-Reply-To: <3DF21F14.3B4DB370@pythonemproject.com> Message-ID: X-Mailer: !/bin/sh MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sat, 7 Dec 2002, Rob wrote: > Power cords are a symptom of societies ills. "Lets protect everyone > from their own stupidity" And who will do this protection? The Office > of Homeland Safety and Security. They need those cords plugged in so > they can tap our emails and FreeBSD-chat posts. Oops, I'm going into > hiding now. Rob. Yes, the black vans will be around shortly... -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR TGIFreeBSD IM: 'KrisBSD' "BIG BROTHER IS WATCHING YOU!" This message brought to you by the US Department of Homeland Security To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sun Dec 15 21: 7:20 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABAC237B401 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:07:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.uninterruptible.net (mail.uninterruptible.net [64.146.146.13]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58DA443EA9 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:07:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kris@catonic.net) Received: from Spaz.Catonic.NET (tnt6-216-180-4-89.dialup.hiwaay.net [216.180.4.89]) by mail.uninterruptible.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 633FF50037; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 05:07:18 +0000 (GMT) Received: by Spaz.Catonic.NET (Postfix, from userid 1002) id 6071F3260; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 05:07:16 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Spaz.Catonic.NET (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38F064C5D; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 05:07:16 +0000 (GMT) Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 05:07:16 +0000 (GMT) From: Kris Kirby To: David Kelly Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Mickey Mouse Power Plug In-Reply-To: <200212082055.17838.dkelly@HiWAAY.net> Message-ID: X-Mailer: !/bin/sh MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sun, 8 Dec 2002, David Kelly wrote: > Apple chose a Big Enough power connector to fit on the back of the iMac. > At least two other connectors (speaker and VGA) on the back of the iMac > are way more uncommon than the power plug. Its just that I thought the > power plug at the angle shown in the picture was funny. I thought the iBook support kit was pretty nifty; you could pull the plug off and slip an AC cable in between the plug and the brick. A cool toy, for $1300. Don't think I'd take that path, but then again... -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR TGIFreeBSD IM: 'KrisBSD' "BIG BROTHER IS WATCHING YOU!" This message brought to you by the US Department of Homeland Security To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Dec 16 14:15:41 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD39337B401 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 14:15:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from sccrmhc01.attbi.com (sccrmhc01.attbi.com [204.127.202.61]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20BD443ED1 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 14:15:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from safeevent@excite.com) Received: from mickey.sjdarc.org (sjdarc.ne.client2.attbi.com[24.61.213.158]) by sccrmhc01.attbi.com (sccrmhc01) with SMTP id <2002121622153100100pocfie>; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 22:15:32 +0000 Received: from smtp0592.mail.yahoo.com by mickey.sjdarc.org (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 85256C91.0079502C¯P; Wed, 16 Dec 1970 17:05:06 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 16:14:48 -0600 From: safeevent@excite.com X-Priority: 3 To: chaswen@msn.com Subject: Operation KidSafe Host Digital Fingerprinting Program Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20021216221538.20BD443ED1@mx1.FreeBSD.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Operation KidSafe Join over 500 sponsors worldwide and say YES to hosting one of our child safety events! 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To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Dec 16 15:12:49 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33AFF37B401 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:12:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.speakeasy.net (mail16.speakeasy.net [216.254.0.216]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C83243EC5 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:12:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jhb@FreeBSD.org) Received: (qmail 10173 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 23:12:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO server.baldwin.cx) ([216.27.160.63]) (envelope-sender ) by mail16.speakeasy.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with DES-CBC3-SHA encrypted SMTP for ; 16 Dec 2002 23:12:57 -0000 Received: from laptop.baldwin.cx (gw1.twc.weather.com [216.133.140.1]) by server.baldwin.cx (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gBGNCjUT010388 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 18:12:45 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from jhb@FreeBSD.org) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.5.2 on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 18:12:43 -0500 (EST) From: John Baldwin To: chat@FreeBSD.org Subject: RE: I want to apologize [The REAL version] Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org [ moved to chat@ as I think that is the only place even close to appropriate ] On 16-Dec-2002 Matt Dillon wrote: > Hey dudes, I want to apologize for being a total *asshole* > wrt the ipfw thingie. Sorry. I know my patch was shit > anyway, and that ipfw blows dead goats when compared to > ipf, but even with that in mind, I had to pull a deraadt, > sorry. I'm so sorry. I mean, I've had my commit bit taken > away many times already, and yet I'm stupid enough to keep > with the same attitude. Damn, > > Yours, > Matthew. s/ipfw thingie/trolling/ s/patch was/brain is full of/ s/that ipfw blows/I love to blow/ s/ipf, but/being productive, but/ s/commit bit/toy truck/ s/Matthew/Mr. Troll/ and it comes out about right.. -- John Baldwin <>< http://www.FreeBSD.org/~jhb/ "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.FreeBSD.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Dec 16 19: 2: 1 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94F7E37B401 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 19:02:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from pop017.verizon.net (pop017pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.210]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E124C43EE1 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 19:01:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dacut@kanga.org) Received: from kanga.org ([151.201.19.185]) by pop017.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.09 201-253-122-126-109-20020611) with ESMTP id <20021217030154.QJDI10203.pop017.verizon.net@kanga.org> for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:01:54 -0600 Message-ID: <3DFE93C5.1020000@kanga.org> Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 22:02:29 -0500 From: David Cuthbert Organization: Kanga International User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-au, en-nz, en-us, en- MIME-Version: 1.0 To: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Mickey Mouse Power Plug Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH PLAIN at pop017.verizon.net from [151.201.19.185] at Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:01:52 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Benjamin Krueger wrote: > I want to like Apple. Really I do. But come on, a non-standard *power cord*? > Are they really that desperate to be the only game in town you can buy a > power cord from? Turns out that the "Mickey Mouse" style power plug is in the same family as the plugs we usually see on the backs of our computers, but rated for a lower amperage. It is IEC-320 style C5/C6, whereas the "normal" business equipment connector is IEC-320 style C13/C14. http://www.qualtekusa.com/catalog/ac_recept/PDFs/connector.pdf for pretty pictures of all of these. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Dec 16 20: 2:29 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 885) id 119B537B414; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:02:29 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:02:29 -0800 From: Eric Melville To: Kris Kirby Cc: David Kelly , chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Mickey Mouse Power Plug Message-ID: <20021216200229.A64928@FreeBSD.org> References: <200212082055.17838.dkelly@HiWAAY.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5.1i In-Reply-To: ; from kris@catonic.net on Mon, Dec 16, 2002 at 05:07:16AM +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > I thought the iBook support kit was pretty nifty; you could pull the plug > off and slip an AC cable in between the plug and the brick. > > A cool toy, for $1300. Don't think I'd take that path, but then again... The plain iBook is down to $999, which I think is quite nice. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Dec 16 20:28:25 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A538737B401 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:28:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from 1nova.com (heorot.1nova.com [63.105.24.23]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29F6D43EC2 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:28:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hamellr@heorot.1nova.com) Received: by 1nova.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 7C28B18FB; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:32:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by 1nova.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74DAA18FA for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:32:08 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:32:08 -0800 (PST) From: Rick Hamell Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Mickey Mouse Power Plug In-Reply-To: <20021216200229.A64928@FreeBSD.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org > > A cool toy, for $1300. Don't think I'd take that path, but then again... > > The plain iBook is down to $999, which I think is quite nice. Plus you get a free color printer! (At least at the local Apple Store..) Rick To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Mon Dec 16 21:42:48 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0102D37B401 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:42:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from post-21.mail.nl.demon.net (post-21.mail.nl.demon.net [194.159.73.20]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 678DE43EC5 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:42:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from cls@raggedclown.net) Received: from [212.238.197.102] (helo=mailhost.raggedclown.net) by post-21.mail.nl.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 18OAVC-000Pfl-00 for chat@freebsd.org; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 05:42:46 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailhost.raggedclown.net (Ragged Clown Mail Gateway [dawn]) with ESMTP id BCA2C1002 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 06:42:45 +0100 (CET) Received: from willow.raggedclown.net (willow.raggedclown.intra [192.168.1.10]) by mailhost.raggedclown.net (Ragged Clown Mail Gateway [dawn]) with ESMTP id 9CD4EB6F for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 06:42:29 +0100 (CET) Received: by willow.raggedclown.net (Ragged Clown Host [willow], from userid 1009) id 91DE3225D9; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 06:42:29 +0100 (CET) Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 06:42:29 +0100 From: Cliff Sarginson To: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Mickey Mouse Power Plug Message-ID: <20021217054229.GB56632@raggedclown.net> References: <3DFE93C5.1020000@kanga.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3DFE93C5.1020000@kanga.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.1i X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS 0.3.12pre8 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Mon, Dec 16, 2002 at 10:02:29PM -0500, David Cuthbert wrote: > Benjamin Krueger wrote: > >I want to like Apple. Really I do. But come on, a non-standard *power > >cord*? > >Are they really that desperate to be the only game in town you can buy a > >power cord from? > Mmm. I am using an old Apple LaserWriter. It has a non-standard network connector in it, but then it does have an external transceiver, so I suppose that is ok. -- Regards Cliff Sarginson The Netherlands [ This mail has been checked as virus-free ] To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Dec 17 10: 1:38 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9801637B401 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 10:01:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from patrocles.silby.com (d127.as13.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net [169.207.136.193]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AF9C43ED1 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 10:01:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from silby@silby.com) Received: from patrocles.silby.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by patrocles.silby.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gBHI9lsQ009338; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 12:09:47 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from silby@silby.com) Received: from localhost (silby@localhost) by patrocles.silby.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) with ESMTP id gBHI9jdE009335; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 12:09:45 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: patrocles.silby.com: silby owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 12:09:44 -0600 (CST) From: Mike Silbersack To: Sam Leffler Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Recursive encapsulation could panic the Kernel In-Reply-To: <050301c2a5f2$fc52aae0$52557f42@errno.com> Message-ID: <20021217120429.N8688-100000@patrocles.silby.com> References: <3DF62DBD0032C2ED@mel-rta6.wanadoo.fr> (added by postmaster@wanadoo.fr) <050301c2a5f2$fc52aae0$52557f42@errno.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Tue, 17 Dec 2002, Sam Leffler wrote: > > On Mon, 16 Dec 2002, John Ashcroft wrote: > > > > I'm looking for a way to track the network traffic of al Qaeda members > > and their supporters. Is there a way to do this with the FreeBSD > > operating system? > > > > John > > In -current mbufs can be tagged (see m_tag* in sys/mbuf.h); this'll let you > do what you want. I've been slow to MFC them to -stable because there are > some issues with copying packet headers that I want to resolve first. > > Sam Damn, I must be getting behind on my commit mail. I hadn't even realized that 5.0 had such a feature! Mike "Silby" Silbersack. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Dec 17 10:33: 4 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40D7137B401 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 10:32:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from yahoo.com (pcp950316pcs.bechgr01.in.comcast.net [68.57.226.76]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id DB4B443EA9 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 10:32:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from MarketingProducts1215@yahoo.com) From: [ToolsForMarketing] To: Reply-To: Subject: 50% off All Lists: Publicity - Libraries - Bookstores - Film Producers - Art Galleries - Record Stores - Custom (more) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20021217183243.DB4B443EA9@mx1.FreeBSD.org> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 10:32:43 -0800 (PST) Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org ***LIMITED TIME SALE - ALL LISTS 50% OFF MUST MENTION SALE WHEN ORDERING*** -------------------------------------------------------------- UNLIMITED USE LISTS . . .DOWNLOAD WITHIN MINUTES. -------------------------------------------------------------- NEW LISTS: TRAVEL MEDIA, SCIENCE PROFESSORS, SCIENCE CLUBS, PASTORS & CHURCHES, BIBLE COLLEGE & SEMINARY PROFESSORS, PET MEDIA, POLITICAL MEDIA, NEW AGE MEDIA, SCIENTIFIC JOURNALS, -------------------------------------------------------------- IF WE DO NOT HAVE THE LIST YOU NEED, WE WILL COMPILE A CUSTOM LIST ACCORDING TO YOUR SPECIFICATIONS -------------------------------------------------------------- Call to place your order or for more information. 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AVAILABLE FORMATS: Excel Spreadsheets & Text Databases 1,900+ Independent Bookstores WITH EMAIL ADDRESSES - $149 - NOW $74.50 1,900+ Independent Bookstores - $129 - NOW $64.50 1,900+ College Bookstores WITH EMAIL ADDRESSES - $149 - NOW $74.50 1,900+ College Bookstores - $129 - NOW $64.50 3,000+ Christian Bookstores WITH EMAIL ADDRESSES - $169 - NOW $84.50 3,000+ Christian Bookstores - $149 - NOW $74.50 2,200+ Chain Bookstores - $129 - NOW $64.50 575+ Book Distributors & Chain HQs - WITH EMAIL ADDRESSES - $59 - NOW $29.50 575+ Book Distributors & Chain HQs - $49 - NOW $24.50 675 Canadian General Bookstores WITH EMAIL ADDRESSES - $69 - NOW $34.50 675 Canadian General Bookstores - $59 - NOW $29.50 175 Canadian University Bookstores - WITH EMAIL ADDRESSES - $39 175 Canadian University Bookstores - $29 - NOW $14.50 550+ New Age Bookstores - WITH EMAIL ADDRESSES - $59 - NOW $29.50 550+ New Age Bookstores - $49 - NOW $24.50 125 African-American Bookstores - $29 - NOW $14.50 You will be able to download your lists WITHIN MINUTES. ----------------------------------------------- MEDIA LISTS LISTS INCLUDE: Contact Name, Title/Position, Company, Address, Phone, Fax and Email Address (when available) AVAILABLE FORMATS: Excel Spreadsheet and Microsoft Word U.S. National Media List (1000+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Includes national business, consumer, and entertainment magazine contacts, syndicated talk shows, Newswire contacts, network news, cable news and entertainment programs." Australian National Media LisT (360+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Australia's finest newspapers, magazines and television news and entertainment contacts are included in this list." Canadian National Media (590+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Provides quality contacts from diverse Canadian TV, Magazine, and Newspaper outlets." UK Media List (500 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Contact reporters, editors, writers and producers from the UK's best media outlets. PBS Stations (800+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Local and national contacts are featured in this extensive public television database." National Public Radio - NPR (265 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Features program directors and producers at local public radio stations as well as contacts at national syndicated shows including Diane Rehm and Fresh Air with Terry Gross." Drive Time Radio - Top 100 Markets (600 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Reach millions of people during drive-time shows at top stations." Newspapers - Top 100 Papers (1,100+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 Pitch story ideas to editors and reporters at the top 100 newspapers throughout America. Local TV News (North Region) (840+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 Local TV News (Midwest Region) (870+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 Local TV News (West Region) (890+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 Local TV News (South Region) (1,100+ Contacts) - $129 - NOW $64.50 Local TV News (All Regions) (3,700+ Contacts) - $249 - NOW $124.50 "Contact the people who can present your idea or work to a very large audience. Individual contacts include: news editors, assignment editors, producers, segment producers, weekend editors, and public affairs directors. Mens Interest Media (400 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Connect with contacts at publications like Esquire, GQ, Maxim, Men's Health and more." Womens Interest Media (1,350+ Contacts) - $149 - NOW $74.50 "Editorial contacts at major women's consumer magazines, women's editors at major newspapers and other publications, and producers at broadcast outlets are included in this comprehensive list." Teen Interest Media (216 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Reporters and editors at publications like Seventeen, Teen People, and CosmoGIRL! are now at your fingertips." Family & Parenting Media List (789 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "This list reaches the media that cover child and parenting issues, including contacts at the major dailies, newsweeklies and parenting segment producers at major broadcast networks." Eclectic Newsweeklies (575+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Reach a diverse group of non-daily free-circulation papers distributed in all of the major metropolitan areas of North America. Each paper has a distinct, local identity that sets it apart from the mainstream press in its market." College Radio Stations (520+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Individual contacts include station manager, music director, program director, news director, among others." College Newspaper Contacts (1,400+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Reach Generation X through over 1,400 college newspapers. Don't overlook this lucrative market." Travel Media (2,600+ Contacts) - $199 - NOW $99.50 "The mother of all travel media lists." Pet Media (435 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Covers every aspect of all things pet-related." Fashion & Beauty List (1,400 Contacts) - $149 - NOW $74.50 "You'll reach editors at major fashion publications including Cosmo, Elle, Glamour and InStyle. Men's fashion contacts include Esquire, FHM, GQ. and Stuff. There are also fashion and beauty editors at major dailies and major national magazines." Sex & Relationships Media List (402 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "The most comprehensive list available of editors, reporters and producers covering every aspect of sex and relationships." Gay and Lesbian Media List (260 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Reach media contacts at national gay and lesbian publications including, The Advocate, Planet Out and Out. Local publications include the Houston Voice, San Francisco Frontiers and Seattle Gay News." Book Industry Media List (502 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Includes book reviewers from major newspapers, consumer magazines, trade publications and producers from shows that schedule authors, including Good Morning America, 20/20 and Nightline." Music Industry Media List (1,142 Contacts) - $149 - NOW $74.50 "Reach reporters, critics and producers at newspapers, magazines and television shows covering the music industry. There are contacts at internet publications that focus on music." Motion Picture, Film & Video (695 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Includes movie critics, entertainment editors and reporters at the top industry publications, major newspapers, consumer magazines and television programs." Sports Media List (427 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 includes contacts at national sports magazines, sports networks, newspapers, as well as television and radio stations. Political Media List (1,100+ Contacts) - $149 - NOW $74.50 "This list covers every aspect of the political debate whether in print or broadcast. This list is a must for those with serious issues to publicize." African American Media List (1500 Contacts) - $149 - NOW $74.50 "Contacts at national black consumer and business publications, regional newspapers and television stations." Environmental Media List (763 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Reach numerous environmental editors, writers and reporters at major newspapers, national magazines, environmental publications, and television networks." Scientific Journals (500 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Reach editors at journals covering Biology, Chemistry, Genetics, Astronomy and everything in between." New Age Media (250+ Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Reach contacts at media outlets that specialize in Astrology, psychic phenomena, angels, near death experiences and everything in between." Christian Media List (370 Contacts) - $99 - NOW $49.50 "Reach top contacts at the largest Christian broadcasting outlets, religion editors and reporters at the top dailies and newsweeklies, and editors at the top Christian publications." ------------------------------------------------- TV & FILM PRODUCERS, DIRECTORS, DEVELOPMENT EXECS, (MORE) 3,000+ Contacts - $149 (Entire List) - NOW $74.50 800+ Producers Only - $99 - NOW $49.50 650+ Development, Creative & Acquisitions Contacts Only - $89 - NOW $44.50 Lists Include: Contact Name, Title, Company, Address, Phone and Fax Number Available Formats: Excel Spreadsheet and Text Database PUBLISHING COMPANY CONTACTS 1,700+ U.S. Publishing Contacts - $99 - NOW $49.50 300 Art Publishing Contacts - $49 - NOW $24.50 List Includes: Contact Name, Title, Company, Address, Phone, Number, Fax Number and Email Address (when available) Available Formats: Excel Spreadsheet and Text Database LITERARY AGENTS 300+ Contacts - $49 - NOW $24.50 List Includes: Contact Name, Title, Company, Address, Phone, Number, Fax Number and Email Address (when available) Available Formats: Excel Spreadsheet and Text Database MUSIC AGENTS/MANAGERS 150+ Contacts - $29 - NOW $14.50 List Includes: Contact Name, Title, Company, Address, Phone, Fax Number and Email Address (when available) Available Formats: Excel Spreadsheet and Text Database SCIENCE PROFESSORS 3,500 Contacts - $149 - NOW $74.50 Departments Included: Biology, Chemistry, Astronomy, Anthropolgy, Physics, Geology, Mathematics, more. List Includes: Contact Name, Department, University, Address, Phone, Fax and Email Available Formats: Excel Spreadsheet and Text Database SCIENCE CLUBS 1,000 Contacts - $99 - NOW $49.50 List Includes: Contact Name, Club Name, Email address, (Address & Phone when available) Available Formats: Excel Spreadsheet and Text Database PASTORS & CHURCHES 2,000 Contacts - $129 - NOW $64.50 (Various Denominations) List Includes: Pastors Name, Church, Address, Phone, Fax and Email. Available Formats: Excel Spreadsheet and Text Database BIBLE COLLEGE & SEMINARY PROFESSORS 2,000 Contacts - $129 - NOW $64.50 List Includes: Contact Name, Department, School, Address, Phone, Fax and Email. Available Formats: Excel Spreadsheet and Text Database VIDEO STORE LISTS 1573 Independent Video Stores (West) - $79 - NOW $34.50 2556 Independent Video Stores (Midwest) - $99 - NOW $49.50 2037 Independent Video Stores (East) - $99 - NOW $49.50 2987 Independent Video Stores (South) - $129- NOW $64.50 9150 Independent Video Stores (National)- $199- NOW $99.50 Lists Include: Store Name, Address and Phone Number Available Formats: Excel Spreadsheet and Text Database MUSIC STORE LISTS 997 Independent Music Stores (Midwest) - $79 - NOW $34.50 1215 Independent Music Stores (South) - $89 - NOW $44.50 1444 Independent Music Stores (East) - $89 - NOW $44.50 1355 Independent Music Stores (West) - $89 - NOW $44.50 5008 Independent Music Stores (National)- $249- NOW $124.50 Lists Include: Store Name, Address and Phone Number Available Formats: Excel Spreadsheet and Text Database ART GALLERY LISTS US National List WITH EMAIL ADDRESSES: $169 (1090 Galleries) US National List: $149 (1090 Galleries) - NOW $74.50 Southern US: $39 (140 Galleries) - NOW $19.50 Central US: $39 (150 Galleries) - NOW $19.50 Western US: $69 (272 Galleries) - NOW $34.50 Eastern US: $89 (530 Galleries) - NOW $44.50 United Kingdom: $69 (230 Galleries) - NOW $34.50 Canada: $49 (165 Galleries) - NOW $24.50 Australia: $29 (50 Galleries) - NOW $19.50 Lists Include: Gallery Name, Address, Phone Number and Fax Number Available Formats: Excel Spreadsheet and Text Database OUR GUARANTEE: We will refund postage (up to 34 cents per item) for any undeliverable addresses over 5% of the total list. We will also correct the undeliverable contacts and issue you an updated list. ------------------------ You will be able to download your lists WITHIN MINUTES. Call to place your order or for more information. US & CANADA TOLL-FREE NUMBER: 888 330 4919 (24/7) If you would like more information via email, please write us at sendlistinfo@netscape.net - Thank you. ------------------------------------------------------------------- To be removed from any future mailings, please send a message with your email address in the subject line to PublicityRemoval@netscape.net. Requests will be processed within 48 hours at that address only. Apologies for any inconvience. Thank you. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Dec 17 19:26: 4 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3D3137B401; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 19:26:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net (bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.218]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74B5843EC5; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 19:26:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tlambert2@mindspring.com) Received: from [216.20.231.174] (helo=mindspring.com) by bluejay.mail.pas.earthlink.net with asmtp (SSLv3:RC4-MD5:128) (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18OUqI-0003gI-00; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 19:25:54 -0800 Message-ID: <3DFFEA74.8D1ED0AF@mindspring.com> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 19:24:36 -0800 From: Terry Lambert X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "M. Warner Losh" Cc: grog@FreeBSD.ORG, chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: 80386 out of GENERIC References: <9710634521.20021214232526@dds.nl> <3DFC0AB1.D60AAF66@mindspring.com> <20021215223540.GB97271@wantadilla.lemis.com> <20021216.120210.113562538.imp@bsdimp.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ELNK-Trace: b1a02af9316fbb217a47c185c03b154d40683398e744b8a4c58809bcc1920bb8862f58d0a06b99b8a7ce0e8f8d31aa3f350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org "M. Warner Losh" wrote: > 12MB? The last time I tried on a 16MB machine, it core dumped because > it ran out of memory. I had to put 24MB in the machine before it > would work (I couldn't try 20MB due to onhand SIMMs). Didn't you get the memo? Memory is free, and all the world's a VAX. 8-) 8-) -- Terry To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Dec 18 0: 2: 4 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 024E437B401 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:02:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from arbornet.org (m-net.arbornet.org [209.142.209.161]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FF3B43ED1 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:02:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from plongeur@m-net.arbornet.org) Received: from m-net.arbornet.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by arbornet.org (8.12.3/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gBH2vp4l077191 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:57:51 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from plongeur@m-net.arbornet.org) Received: from localhost (plongeur@localhost) by m-net.arbornet.org (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) with ESMTP id gBH2vpcQ077188 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:57:51 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:57:50 -0500 (EST) From: Mario To: chat@freebsd.org Subject: test Message-ID: <20021216215742.V77150-100000@m-net.arbornet.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org test To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Dec 18 12:13:18 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFA7137B401 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 12:13:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from pohaku.hi.net (pohaku.hi.net [63.173.193.2]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CF3E43EC5 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 12:13:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ken@pohaku.hi.net) Received: from lihing ([63.173.194.243]) by pohaku.hi.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id gBIKD7qu018789 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 10:13:07 -1000 From: ken@hi.net To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 10:08:00 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: sms email alerts for freshports Message-ID: <3E004900.20614.18C2362B@localhost> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Freshports is a great tool that dvl created. I was able to get a quick notification via email of this last mysql security issue. I was very surprised that a security-notification never got sent out, and happy that dvl's tool was there. As soon as the port got updated, I was also happily sent another email and promptly updated that port. That got me thinking along another line. Wouldn't it be great if that same email (but shortened) was sent as a text message to my cell phone? I asked dvl about it, and this was his response: " ... essentially a new piece of code is needed which will take a list of ports and commit messages and trim them down to something useful. I suggest you advocate your suggestion in -chat and see how many people bite." Anyone think this would be useful? Essentially, I was thinking that an email alert via sms aka text messenging (http://www.vtext.com for an idea) might be useful for the administrator on the road. Thanks! ken To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Wed Dec 18 13:40:50 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66C0237B401; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 13:40:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from hotmail.com (f111.pav2.hotmail.com [64.4.37.111]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05FD943EA9; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 13:40:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bbfst4wtsf253@hotmail.com) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 13:38:13 -0800 Received: from 203.227.236.216 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 21:38:13 GMT X-Originating-IP: [203.227.236.216] From: =?ks_c_5601-1987?B?xMnGwyC4tg==?= To: freebsd-alpha@freebsd.org Subject: =?ks_c_5601-1987?B?oaG6/LG4uK4gwfGwzLDUIMfRufggx8/A2i4uLiEh?= Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 21:38:13 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ks_c_5601-1987; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Dec 2002 21:38:13.0330 (UTC) FILETIME=[C46DAB20:01C2A6DD] Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org live10girls

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MSN ·¯ºê http://www.msn.co.kr/love/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Dec 19 13: 6:30 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2999037B401; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:06:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from omta02.mta.everyone.net (sitemail3.everyone.net [216.200.145.37]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6B4143EB2; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:06:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@tiggerfan.com) Received: from sitemail.everyone.net (dsnat [216.200.145.62]) by omta02.mta.everyone.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DB561C379B; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:05:03 -0800 (PST) Received: by sitemail.everyone.net (Postfix, from userid 99) id D728D3DD8; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:05:02 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.41 (Entity 5.404) Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:05:02 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon To: chat@freebsd.org Cc: dillon@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: IN SOVIET RUSSIA Reply-To: dillon@tiggerfan.com X-Originating-Ip: [63.242.157.226] Message-Id: <20021219210502.D728D3DD8@sitemail.everyone.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org In soviet Russia... Dillon trolls YOU!!! _____________________________________________________________ Get your own free tiggerfan.com email address!! DisneySites!! - http://www.disneysites.com/webmail/tiggerfan _____________________________________________________________ Select your own custom email address for FREE! Get you@yourchoice.com w/No Ads, 6MB, POP & more! http://www.everyone.net/selectmail?campaign=tag To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Thu Dec 19 13:59:28 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FE1C37B401; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:59:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from arbornet.org (m-net.arbornet.org [209.142.209.161]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2B1D43EDC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:59:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from plongeur@m-net.arbornet.org) Received: from m-net.arbornet.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by arbornet.org (8.12.3/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gBJM124l038270; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 17:01:02 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from plongeur@m-net.arbornet.org) Received: from localhost (plongeur@localhost) by m-net.arbornet.org (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) with ESMTP id gBJM11He038267; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 17:01:01 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 17:01:01 -0500 (EST) From: Mario To: Matthew Dillon Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG, , Subject: Re: IN SOVIET RUSSIA In-Reply-To: <20021219210502.D728D3DD8@sitemail.everyone.net> Message-ID: <20021219170050.C38206-100000@m-net.arbornet.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Take ten years! On Thu, 19 Dec 2002, Matthew Dillon wrote: > In soviet Russia... Dillon trolls YOU!!! > > _____________________________________________________________ > Get your own free tiggerfan.com email address!! > DisneySites!! - http://www.disneysites.com/webmail/tiggerfan > > _____________________________________________________________ > Select your own custom email address for FREE! Get you@yourchoice.com w/No Ads, 6MB, POP & more! http://www.everyone.net/selectmail?campaign=tag > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Dec 21 5:42:48 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6A5C37B401 for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 05:42:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp2.info.com.ph (www.visatech.com.pe [200.10.75.6]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id CB8B243ED8 for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 05:42:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from pnstarlite@starband.net) Received: from unknown (156.54.224.23) by a231242.upc-a.chello.nl with local; Dec, 21 2002 8:27:24 AM -0700 Received: from smtp-server1.cfl.rr.com ([5.151.138.187]) by rly-xl04.mx.aol.com with esmtp; Dec, 21 2002 7:38:34 AM +1200 Received: from unknown (170.127.231.172) by smtp013.mail.yahoo.com with local; Dec, 21 2002 6:29:34 AM -0300 From: jjraIsakman@FreeBSD.ORG, Isidoro To: Philippa@FreeBSD.ORG, Jane@FreeBSD.ORG, Greenfield@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: Subject: Do you have a good clean list of E-MAiL AddREssES? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 08:49:20 -0500 X-Mailer: eGroups Message Poster Message-Id: <20021221134237.CB8B243ED8@mx1.FreeBSD.org> Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org You want email addresses; we've got lots of fresh ones. Face it, there's no way you're going to extract 400 million email addresses with some flimsy email extractor program you downloaded from the web. You're lucky if you can extract 2 million in a year! Our email addresses are even targeted in 34 different categories to help you reach only the market you want. No need to buy any more directories from the web. We've bought almost all of them for you, cleaned them up including removal of duplicates and flamers, and compiled them into a 4 disk volume for only $139.00 Now you can send emails to millions of people worldwide. 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To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Dec 21 15:14:24 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7AC2237B401; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 15:14:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from serenity.mcc.ac.uk (serenity.mcc.ac.uk [130.88.200.93]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A080843EDA; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 15:14:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jcm@FreeBSD-uk.eu.org) Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org ([130.88.200.97]) by serenity.mcc.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18Psp0-0003B0-00; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:14:18 +0000 Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.12.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id gBLNEIPe032219; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:14:18 GMT (envelope-from jcm@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org) Received: (from jcm@localhost) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id gBLNEHMk032218; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:14:17 GMT Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:14:17 +0000 From: Jonathon McKitrick To: freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD's momentum and future prospects Message-ID: <20021221231417.GB32071@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Scanner: exiscan for exim4 (http://duncanthrax.net/exiscan/) *18Psp0-0003B0-00*t0UZgbShimw* Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I like to ask this question every once in a while, since the scene is always changing and there are different people reading the various lists. How do YOU personally think the BSD's are doing as far as developer momentum, innovation, and other forms of progress that will continue to attract the needed attention to keep moving forward and keep BSD in the spotlight as a valid alternative OS? Do you think 5.0 will be a great leap forward in this regard? It seems like it will be, but Linux is also moving forward, from what I have heard, its networking is continuing to improve with every release, and it has also garnered commercial interest. Just thought I'd collect the latest opinions, news, rants, and flames on where we're going. :-) NOTE: Please CC me, as I am not currently subscribed. Thanks. jm -- My other computer is your windows box. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Dec 21 15:25:24 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 468C537B401; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 15:25:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from priv-edtnes10-hme0.telusplanet.net (outbound02.telus.net [199.185.220.221]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F4DA43EE6; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 15:25:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from pfak@telus.net) Received: from silverdollar ([216.232.36.68]) by priv-edtnes10-hme0.telusplanet.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.17 201-253-122-126-117-20021021) with SMTP id <20021221232437.XUUF12989.priv-edtnes10-hme0.telusplanet.net@silverdollar>; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 16:24:37 -0700 Message-ID: <001101c2a948$2034b5e0$c601a8c0@silverdollar> From: "Peter Kieser" To: "Jonathon McKitrick" Cc: , References: <20021221231417.GB32071@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> Subject: Re: FreeBSD's momentum and future prospects Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 15:24:35 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org In my opinion FreeBSD is doing good, really good. We currently have a more organised outlook on the project, then any of the Linux distros will ever have or do, there is also the advantages of our FreeBSD Handbook - which is your (almost) one stop place to find information about FreeBSD related issues, although I would like to see it get better, and bigger. On other issues, FreeBSD 5.0 should be a great milestone for BSD, and the FreeBSD community it has alot of features that were lacking to make it the leader in UNIX os'es, which have now been added. I believe that once 5.0 hits STABLE, it should be excellent. Even though at the current moment FreeBSD beats Linux hands on in maturity. Put it this way, I use FreeBSD because of the code base, and the maturity of it, also the fact that it's easier to find documentation, and there is no in-kernel httpd "accelator", such as there is on Linux, it is also easier to update the system, etc -- and theres one source for information. On another note, the only reason Linux is getting commerical interest is because people don't know about FreeBSD, they also don't know about the goods of the BSD license, if corporations were made aware of how the BSD license can be used, I gaurntee you we would have more people jumping on the band wagon for FreeBSD development and such. I just don't think BSD in general gets enough publicity. Also, on another note. There is really no BSD "desktop" distro, where everything is configured automatically for you, this would help for newbie users to pick FreeBSD over Linux. -- Peter Kieser pfak@telus.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jonathon McKitrick" To: ; Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2002 3:14 PM Subject: FreeBSD's momentum and future prospects > > I like to ask this question every once in a while, since the scene is always > changing and there are different people reading the various lists. > > How do YOU personally think the BSD's are doing as far as developer > momentum, innovation, and other forms of progress that will continue to > attract the needed attention to keep moving forward and keep BSD in the > spotlight as a valid alternative OS? Do you think 5.0 will be a great leap > forward in this regard? It seems like it will be, but Linux is also moving > forward, from what I have heard, its networking is continuing to improve > with every release, and it has also garnered commercial interest. > > Just thought I'd collect the latest opinions, news, rants, and flames on > where we're going. :-) > > NOTE: Please CC me, as I am not currently subscribed. Thanks. > > jm > -- > My other computer is your windows box. > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-advocacy" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Dec 21 15:39: 9 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F89737B405 for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 15:39:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from probity.mcc.ac.uk (probity.mcc.ac.uk [130.88.200.94]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A253B43EEA for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 15:39:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jcm@FreeBSD-uk.eu.org) Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org ([130.88.200.97]) by probity.mcc.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18PtD0-000B9q-00 for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:39:06 +0000 Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.12.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id gBLNd5Pe032549 for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:39:05 GMT (envelope-from jcm@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org) Received: (from jcm@localhost) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id gBLNd5M6032548 for freebsd-chat@freebsd.org; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:39:05 GMT Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:39:05 +0000 From: Jonathon McKitrick To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Practical distributed apps for BSD? Message-ID: <20021221233905.GD32071@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Scanner: exiscan for exim4 (http://duncanthrax.net/exiscan/) *18PtD0-000B9q-00*5CWdoRwEmUs* Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I'm looking for some examples of distributed apps (remote components, RPC, and so on) on FreeBSD. I know they are used a lot in ecommerce and for grid computing, but I have been intrigued be the .Net concept of software components all over the net and clients that can use them. Other than simple Java applets that call home for data, are there any other examples of useful apps on FreeBSD that can use remote components in an interesting way to improve the useability of a program? NOTE: Please CC me, as I am not currently subscribed. Thanks. jm -- My other computer is your windows box. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Dec 21 19:48:11 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8647D37B401; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 19:48:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from probity.mcc.ac.uk (probity.mcc.ac.uk [130.88.200.94]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E05543EE6; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 19:48:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jcm@FreeBSD-uk.eu.org) Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org ([130.88.200.97]) by probity.mcc.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18Px5z-000M36-00; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 03:48:07 +0000 Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.12.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id gBM3m7Pe034579; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 03:48:07 GMT (envelope-from jcm@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org) Received: (from jcm@localhost) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id gBM3m678034578; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 03:48:07 GMT Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 03:48:06 +0000 From: Jonathon McKitrick To: Peter Kieser Cc: freebsd-advocay@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD's momentum and future prospects Message-ID: <20021222034806.GA34537@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> References: <20021221231417.GB32071@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> <001101c2a948$2034b5e0$c601a8c0@silverdollar> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <001101c2a948$2034b5e0$c601a8c0@silverdollar> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Scanner: exiscan for exim4 (http://duncanthrax.net/exiscan/) *18Px5z-000M36-00*XaophLsmRpg* Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sat, Dec 21, 2002 at 03:24:35PM -0800, Peter Kieser wrote: | On another note, the only reason Linux is getting commerical interest is | because people don't know about FreeBSD, they also don't know about the | goods of the BSD license, if corporations were made aware of how the BSD | license can be used, I gaurntee you we would have more people jumping on the | band wagon for FreeBSD development and such. I just don't think BSD in | general gets enough publicity. I recently read that the new Mandrake licensing plans for commercial will allow modification of the source without requiring they be released. The article remarks how much that is like the BSD license. | Also, on another note. There is really no BSD "desktop" distro, where | everything is configured automatically for you, this would help for newbie | users to pick FreeBSD over Linux. What about drivers? Does Linux still have the advantage they had before of far more drivers? I haven't booted Linux in 3 years or so. ;-) jm -- My other computer is your Windows box. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Dec 21 19:52:58 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 821FD37B401; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 19:52:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from probity.mcc.ac.uk (probity.mcc.ac.uk [130.88.200.94]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9E6543EDA; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 19:52:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jcm@FreeBSD-uk.eu.org) Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org ([130.88.200.97]) by probity.mcc.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.10) id 18PxAe-000MSc-00; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 03:52:56 +0000 Received: from dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.12.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id gBM3qtPe034627; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 03:52:55 GMT (envelope-from jcm@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org) Received: (from jcm@localhost) by dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id gBM3qtKm034626; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 03:52:55 GMT Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 03:48:06 +0000 From: Jonathon McKitrick To: Peter Kieser Cc: freebsd-advocay@freebsd.org, freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD's momentum and future prospects Message-ID: <20021222034806.GA34537@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> References: <20021221231417.GB32071@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> <001101c2a948$2034b5e0$c601a8c0@silverdollar> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <001101c2a948$2034b5e0$c601a8c0@silverdollar> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Scanner: exiscan for exim4 (http://duncanthrax.net/exiscan/) *18PxAe-000MSc-00*nARcCX5zlqQ* Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org On Sat, Dec 21, 2002 at 03:24:35PM -0800, Peter Kieser wrote: | On another note, the only reason Linux is getting commerical interest is | because people don't know about FreeBSD, they also don't know about the | goods of the BSD license, if corporations were made aware of how the BSD | license can be used, I gaurntee you we would have more people jumping on the | band wagon for FreeBSD development and such. I just don't think BSD in | general gets enough publicity. I recently read that the new Mandrake licensing plans for commercial will allow modification of the source without requiring they be released. The article remarks how much that is like the BSD license. | Also, on another note. There is really no BSD "desktop" distro, where | everything is configured automatically for you, this would help for newbie | users to pick FreeBSD over Linux. What about drivers? Does Linux still have the advantage they had before of far more drivers? I haven't booted Linux in 3 years or so. ;-) jm -- My other computer is your Windows box. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Dec 21 21:26:58 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F4C237B406 for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 21:26:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from out006.verizon.net (out006pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.106]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF78743EDC for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 21:26:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dacut@kanga.org) Received: from kanga.org ([151.201.19.185]) by out006.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.20 201-253-122-126-120-20021101) with ESMTP id <20021222052650.UYCN19982.out006.verizon.net@kanga.org> for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:26:50 -0600 Message-ID: <3E054D2B.9010300@kanga.org> Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 00:27:07 -0500 From: David Cuthbert Organization: Kanga International User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20021130 X-Accept-Language: en-gb, en-au, en-nz, en-us, en- MIME-Version: 1.0 To: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD's momentum and future prospects References: <20021221231417.GB32071@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> <001101c2a948$2034b5e0$c601a8c0@silverdollar> In-Reply-To: <001101c2a948$2034b5e0$c601a8c0@silverdollar> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH PLAIN at out006.verizon.net from [151.201.19.185] at Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:26:48 -0600 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Peter Kieser wrote: > On another note, the only reason Linux is getting commerical interest is > because people don't know about FreeBSD, they also don't know about the > goods of the BSD license, if corporations were made aware of how the BSD > license can be used, I gaurntee you we would have more people jumping on the > band wagon for FreeBSD development and such. I just don't think BSD in > general gets enough publicity. Yes, as a commercial developer, Linux is beginning to frighten me with their sudden declaration that binary-only device drivers are illegal. The rationale used (by Linus, at least) makes me wonder if they will try to apply it to anything that links with their headers. Unfortunately, Linux is the "hot" item at the moment in the industry (EDA, electronic design automation). > Also, on another note. There is really no BSD "desktop" distro, where > everything is configured automatically for you, this would help for newbie > users to pick FreeBSD over Linux. As maligned as it is, RedHat's graphical configuration is rather easy to use; I found it much easier to configure a RAID desktop there than using Vinum (which sysinstall doesn't grok). The one thing I have yet to see anywhere is a system that does a good job with package dependencies. For instance, I usually want to install "everything that doesn't depend on Qt or KDE". Most package managers are good at making sure that the dependencies get installed; none (that I know of, at least) will warn you that a package you don't want is about to be installed. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Dec 21 22:40:32 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF03E37B401 for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 22:40:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net (scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.49]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84BD143EE5 for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 22:40:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rsidd@papagena.rockefeller.edu) Received: from user-0cev11k.cable.mindspring.com ([24.239.132.52] helo=bluerondo.a.la.turk) by scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18Pzmn-0004aX-00 for chat@freebsd.org; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 22:40:30 -0800 Received: (qmail 454 invoked by uid 1001); 22 Dec 2002 06:40:26 -0000 Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 01:40:26 -0500 From: Rahul Siddharthan To: Jonathon McKitrick Cc: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD's momentum and future prospects Message-ID: <20021222064026.GA421@papagena.rockefeller.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20021222034806.GA34537@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.27i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.7-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org Jonathon McKitrick wrote: > I recently read that the new Mandrake licensing plans for commercial will > allow modification of the source without requiring they be released. The > article remarks how much that is like the BSD license. ITYM this issue: http://www.ofb.biz/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=186 If so, (a) it's not about linux itself, (b) even so, you totally misunderstood him. The licensing for linux (the kernel) and other GPL software can't be changed. Once GPL, always GPL, unless you buy out the copyright holder, which in this is case is impossible (far too many copyright holders). As an aside, I think this topic is about as useful as an argument on "Linux's momentum and future prospects" (vis-a-vis, say, Microsoft) -- that is, not useful at all. From an end-user viewpoint, BSD vs GPL flamewars are equally useless. FreeBSD will survive. Linux will survive. Use what you like... R To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Dec 21 22:52:21 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 089BB37B401 for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 22:52:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.84]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4B3243EDE for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 22:52:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rsidd@papagena.rockefeller.edu) Received: from user-0cev11k.cable.mindspring.com ([24.239.132.52] helo=bluerondo.a.la.turk) by gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18PzyF-00029I-00 for chat@freebsd.org; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 22:52:19 -0800 Received: (qmail 573 invoked by uid 1001); 22 Dec 2002 06:52:16 -0000 Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 01:52:16 -0500 From: Rahul Siddharthan To: Jonathon McKitrick Cc: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD's momentum and future prospects Message-ID: <20021222065216.GA468@papagena.rockefeller.edu> References: <20021222034806.GA34537@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> <20021222064026.GA421@papagena.rockefeller.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20021222064026.GA421@papagena.rockefeller.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.27i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.7-STABLE i386 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I wrote: > As an aside, I think this topic is about as useful as an argument on > "Linux's momentum and future prospects" (vis-a-vis, say, Microsoft) -- > that is, not useful at all. However, here's one concrete reaction I did recently get in reaction to attempted FreeBSD advocacy: a sysadmin of my acquaintance was complaining about the instability of linux's VM under load, apparently there were machines which would reboot if stressed too much, etc. (Known problem in early 2.4.x kernels, apparently things haven't improved too much since then.) I asked, well, why not use FreeBSD then? Answer -- but these are dual-processor machines, and FreeBSD's SMP sucks. I don't know enough to answer that. Hopefully 5.0 will be an answer. Meanwhile, stability under extreme loads (which may occur 0.1% of the time) may be a priority for servers, but for desktop machines and "numbercrunching" machines, raw performance the remaining 99.9% of the time is far more important. Even on uniprocessor machines, linux sometimes "feels" faster, if (or because?) it's somewhat less solid (eg the async-mounted filesystem, etc), and these perceptions eventually do influence user choice... Rahul To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-chat Sat Dec 21 23:52: 0 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C978E37B401; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:51:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from priv-edtnes40.telusplanet.net (defout.telus.net [199.185.220.240]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECCDE43EE8; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:51:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from pfak@telus.net) Received: from silverdollar ([216.232.36.68]) by priv-edtnes40.telusplanet.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.17 201-253-122-126-117-20021021) with SMTP id <20021222075157.EYYR10819.priv-edtnes40.telusplanet.net@silverdollar>; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 00:51:57 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01c2a98e$fcd590a0$c601a8c0@silverdollar> From: "Peter Kieser" To: "Jonathon McKitrick" Cc: , References: <20021221231417.GB32071@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> <001101c2a948$2034b5e0$c601a8c0@silverdollar> <20021222034806.GA34537@dogma.freebsd-uk.eu.org> Subject: Re: FreeBSD's momentum and future prospects Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:51:50 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org I still find that FreeBSD has more _useful_ drivers then Linux, I have yet to find a device that isn't detected by FreeBSD, except some USB stuff such as my Logitech Webcam, and other "cheap" hardware that isn't of real use to anyone that is running FreeBSD in the first place, still it would be nice to see some of those drivers supported by FreeBSD, but this would lead to the bloat of the kernel. On the other hand, my favourite feature of FreeBSD is the Kernel Configuration, it has a nice GENERIC kernel, as Linux does not.. where all the hardware you would probably need is in the configuration file already, also even if you have everything in the kernel is really not all that bloated. -- Peter Kieser pfak@telus.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jonathon McKitrick" To: "Peter Kieser" Cc: ; Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2002 7:48 PM Subject: Re: FreeBSD's momentum and future prospects > On Sat, Dec 21, 2002 at 03:24:35PM -0800, Peter Kieser wrote: > | On another note, the only reason Linux is getting commerical interest is > | because people don't know about FreeBSD, they also don't know about the > | goods of the BSD license, if corporations were made aware of how the BSD > | license can be used, I gaurntee you we would have more people jumping on the > | band wagon for FreeBSD development and such. I just don't think BSD in > | general gets enough publicity. > > I recently read that the new Mandrake licensing plans for commercial will > allow modification of the source without requiring they be released. The > article remarks how much that is like the BSD license. > > | Also, on another note. There is really no BSD "desktop" distro, where > | everything is configured automatically for you, this would help for newbie > | users to pick FreeBSD over Linux. > > What about drivers? Does Linux still have the advantage they had before of > far more drivers? I haven't booted Linux in 3 years or so. ;-) > > jm > -- > My other computer is your Windows box. > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message