From owner-freebsd-cluster Sun Jun 16 22: 5: 0 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mgr3.xmission.com (mgr3.xmission.com [198.60.22.203]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7313137B42A for ; Sun, 16 Jun 2002 22:04:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail by mgr3.xmission.com with spam-scanned (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17JohB-0007Gf-00; Sun, 16 Jun 2002 23:04:53 -0600 Received: from [207.135.128.145] (helo=misty.eyesbeyond.com) by mgr3.xmission.com with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17JohA-0007GU-00; Sun, 16 Jun 2002 23:04:52 -0600 Received: (from glewis@localhost) by misty.eyesbeyond.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g5H54ns26818; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 14:34:49 +0930 (CST) (envelope-from glewis) Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 14:34:48 +0930 From: Greg Lewis To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Cc: Alan E Subject: Splitting the OpenPBS port Message-ID: <20020617143448.A26782@misty.eyesbeyond.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.9 required=8.0 tests=X_NOT_PRESENT version=2.30 X-Spam-Level: Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all, Alan Eldridge has an updated port of OpenPBS pretty much ready to go. Since I was interested in this as well we started discussing it after his announcement of this on freebsd-ports. Anyway, one item under discussion is whether to split up the port into a "server" port and a "client" slave port. The server port would install on the cluster host and include all the tools, pbs_server and pbs_sched. The client port would install on nodes and only contain pbs_mom and associated config. Note that one could also install the client port on the host if it was acting as a node as well. What we'd like to know is whether this is useful to people or not. So, we'd like to hear what people are doing (especially) or how they would like the port to operate in this respect. Basically should the port be split or should it be a single port as it is now and pbs_server and pbs_sched just not be started on the nodes? -- Greg Lewis Email : glewis@eyesbeyond.com Eyes Beyond Web : http://www.eyesbeyond.com Information Technology To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Sun Jun 16 22:19:14 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from wwweasel.geeksrus.net (wwweasel.geeksrus.net [64.8.210.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 107FA37B40C for ; Sun, 16 Jun 2002 22:19:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wwweasel.geeksrus.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by wwweasel.geeksrus.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g5H5IZkY060186; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 01:18:35 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from alane@wwweasel.geeksrus.net) Received: (from alane@localhost) by wwweasel.geeksrus.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g5H5IYLI060185; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 01:18:34 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from alane) Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 01:18:34 -0400 From: Alan E To: Greg Lewis Cc: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Splitting the OpenPBS port Message-ID: <20020617051834.GA51767@wwweasel.geeksrus.net> References: <20020617143448.A26782@misty.eyesbeyond.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20020617143448.A26782@misty.eyesbeyond.com> X-message-flag: Magic 8-Ball says "Outlook not so good." I'll ask it about Exchange next. User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.1i Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Jun 17, 2002 at 02:34:48PM +0930, Greg Lewis wrote: >The client >port would install on nodes and only contain pbs_mom and associated >config. Note that one could also install the client port on the host >if it was acting as a node as well. The client port would include all the command line utilities as well, I think. Then there's the issue of X windows. I would suggest that the default configuration on both ports use X and a WITHOUT_XPBS or similar knob be available to disable it. -- AlanE To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Mon Jun 17 0:47:17 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from gate.nentec.de (gate2.nentec.de [194.25.215.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E771437B407 for ; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 00:47:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nenny.nentec.de (root@nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id g5H7lBA03184; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 09:47:11 +0200 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with ESMTP id g5H7l6Z21136; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 09:47:06 +0200 Message-ID: <3D0D93F9.10504@nentec.de> Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 09:47:05 +0200 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; de-AT; rv:0.9.8) Gecko/20020204 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: John Constantine Cc: freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Application cluster References: <20020615214711.A17779@phenix.rootshell.be> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG John Constantine wrote: >Hello, > >I'm planning on building a cluster from a few machines, which are by >todays standards considered to be obsolete, to serve X, mozilla and >open office. > >This cluster would also double up as the main server and web >cache(squid), off of which a bunch of diskless machines would boot. > >Have any of you done something similar ? What software did you use and >why ? Any positive/negative experiences you would like to share ? > >Hope that you can help me. > >Thanks, > Hi John, I have written a failover cluster scheme, unfortunately the FTP site is down for about a week. It allows a group of machines to work together in finding a successor for an application when one of the machines fail. It does not offer filesystem recovery, only starting an "rc" type script for an application. At one point I wanted to make a Hi-Av Samba server in which I had two machines on the same SCSI channel and the startup would mount the FS and take over the IP address. I never had enough time to try it. :-( If you are interested in this, maybe I can mail you a zipped copy of the sources in a day or so (I was looking for an excuse to put more time in that project again and this might be the right thing... ;-)). Andy > >--John > > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Mon Jun 17 1:38:12 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mailout02.sul.t-online.com (mailout02.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.17]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4484737B41D for ; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 01:38:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fwd05.sul.t-online.de by mailout02.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 17Js1S-0000Tt-05; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 10:38:02 +0200 Received: from Magelan.Leidinger.net (520065502893-0001@[217.229.211.44]) by fmrl05.sul.t-online.com with esmtp id 17Js1I-2FAffEC; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 10:37:52 +0200 Received: from Leidinger.net (netchild@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Magelan.Leidinger.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g5H8dVer000719; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 10:39:35 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from netchild@Leidinger.net) Message-Id: <200206170839.g5H8dVer000719@Magelan.Leidinger.net> Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 10:39:31 +0200 (CEST) From: Alexander Leidinger Subject: Re: Splitting the OpenPBS port To: alane@geeksrus.net Cc: glewis@eyesbeyond.com, freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <20020617051834.GA51767@wwweasel.geeksrus.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Sender: 520065502893-0001@t-dialin.net Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 17 Jun, Alan E wrote: > Then there's the issue of X windows. I would suggest that the default > configuration on both ports use X and a WITHOUT_XPBS or similar knob be > available to disable it. WITHOUT_X11 is what you want to use in this case, see "grep -R WITHOUT_X11 /usr/ports". I don't use OpenPBS, but IMHO a client and a slave port seems to be usefull. Bye, Alexander. -- Where do you think you're going today? http://www.Leidinger.net Alexander @ Leidinger.net GPG fingerprint = C518 BC70 E67F 143F BE91 3365 79E2 9C60 B006 3FE7 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Mon Jun 17 11:30:40 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from testdcc.outblaze.com (202-77-223-23.outblaze.com [202.77.223.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7561A37B415 for ; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 11:30:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ws3.hk5.outblaze.com (202-77-181-90.outblaze.com [202.77.181.90]) by testdcc.outblaze.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g5HIRr04008341 for ; Mon, 17 Jun 2002 18:27:53 GMT Received: (qmail 15912 invoked by uid 1001); 17 Jun 2002 18:27:53 -0000 Message-ID: <20020617182753.15911.qmail@graffiti.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.41 (Entity 5.404) Received: from [66.51.217.108] by ws3.hk5.outblaze.com with http for derekbarrett@graffiti.net; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 02:27:53 +0800 From: "Derek Barrett" To: , Cc: freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 02:27:53 +0800 Subject: Re: Application cluster X-Originating-Ip: 66.51.217.108 X-Originating-Server: ws3.hk5.outblaze.com X-DCC-Outblaze-Metrics: testdcc.outblaze.com 100; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Guten Tag Andy, I would also love to take a look at this failover script. What types of apps have you used this on so far? Do you use a serial cable for the heartbeat monitor mechanism? Danke, Derek ----- Original Message ----- From: Andy Sporner Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 09:47:05 +0200 To: John Constantine Subject: Re: Application cluster > John Constantine wrote: > > >Hello, > > > >I'm planning on building a cluster from a few machines, which are by > >todays standards considered to be obsolete, to serve X, mozilla and > >open office. > > > >This cluster would also double up as the main server and web > >cache(squid), off of which a bunch of diskless machines would boot. > > > >Have any of you done something similar ? What software did you use and > >why ? Any positive/negative experiences you would like to share ? > > > >Hope that you can help me. > > > >Thanks, > > > > Hi John, > > I have written a failover cluster scheme, unfortunately the FTP site is down > for about a week. It allows a group of machines to work together in finding > a successor for an application when one of the machines fail. It does > not offer > filesystem recovery, only starting an "rc" type script for an application. > > At one point I wanted to make a Hi-Av Samba server in which I had two > machines on the same SCSI channel and the startup would mount the FS and > take over the IP address. I never had enough time to try it. :-( If > you are > interested in this, maybe I can mail you a zipped copy of the sources in > a day > or so (I was looking for an excuse to put more time in that project > again and > this might be the right thing... ;-)). > > > Andy > > > > >--John > > > > > > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > >with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message > > -- _______________________________________________ Get your free email from http://www.graffiti.net Powered by Outblaze To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Tue Jun 18 1: 2:25 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from gate.nentec.de (gate2.nentec.de [194.25.215.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E011937B400 for ; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 01:02:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nenny.nentec.de (root@nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id g5I82IA28195; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 10:02:18 +0200 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with ESMTP id g5I82DZ03702; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 10:02:13 +0200 Message-ID: <3D0EE905.7030608@nentec.de> Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 10:02:13 +0200 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; de-AT; rv:0.9.8) Gecko/20020204 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Derek Barrett , freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Application cluster References: <20020617182753.15911.qmail@graffiti.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Derek, > >I would also love to take a look at this failover script. > It's a daemon and some scripts. > > >What types of apps have you used this on so far? > You will laugh, but simple scripts that say "I am starting, I am stopping" because I never had enough time to get out of the test phase > >Do you use a serial cable for the heartbeat monitor mechanism? > Actually not. It uses network interfaces to send heartbeats. I had up to 6 machines running once (different architectures IE: Sparc, VAX, and I386). But lately I have been only working with two and three machines (all I-386). In the early days it was multi platform (people who used linux was also using it--which was a surprise because I never thought it was that portable). These days I am focusing on FreeBSD only--again because of time--but mostly also because I am starting to use some system specific stuff as it becomes more elaborate. > >Danke, > Thanks for this, but I am an American working in Germany. ;-) I do fool a lot of people though because I have pick up an accent. PS. Do you know a place where I can put the 'tar' file so that people can get to it? My main website is down for about the next two weeks. Andy To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Tue Jun 18 1:13:41 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from gate.nentec.de (gate2.nentec.de [194.25.215.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 389D937B414 for ; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 01:13:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nenny.nentec.de (root@nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id g5I8DZA28280 for ; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 10:13:35 +0200 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with ESMTP id g5I8DTZ04248 for ; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 10:13:29 +0200 Message-ID: <3D0EEBA9.9000003@nentec.de> Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 10:13:29 +0200 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; de-AT; rv:0.9.8) Gecko/20020204 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-cluster Subject: Dead Email address Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I don't know who is responsible for this, but here seems to be a dead email address.... etrifft: Ihre Mail an 'shup@netzmarkt.de' Datum: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 10:02:13 +0200 Ihr Subject: 'Re: Application cluster' Der Account existiert nicht mehr. Ihre Mail wurde ungelesen geloescht. Wenn Sie die aktuelle Emailadresse des von Ihnen angeschriebenen Adressaten erfahren wollen, kontak- tieren Sie bitte die Netzmarkt-Kundenbetreuung unter Tel. +49-9131-974760. Zur Spamvorbeugung sind Antworten an die Absenderadresse dieser Mail nicht moeglich. ------------------------------- Regards: your mail to 'shup@netzmarkt.de' Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 10:02:13 +0200 Your subject: 'Re: Application cluster' This account doesn't exist any more. Your mail has been deleted unread. If you want to know the current EMail address of the recipient you mailed to, please contact us by phone: +49-9131-974760. For spam prevention, answers to the sender of this mail are not possible. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Tue Jun 18 3:38:42 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from gate.nentec.de (gate2.nentec.de [194.25.215.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 902C837B404 for ; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 03:38:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nenny.nentec.de (root@nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id g5IAcIA20255; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 12:38:18 +0200 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with ESMTP id g5IAcDZ10825; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 12:38:13 +0200 Message-ID: <3D0F0D95.7070903@nentec.de> Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 12:38:13 +0200 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; de-AT; rv:0.9.8) Gecko/20020204 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Evgeny Dolgopyat , freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Application cluster References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Evgeny Dolgopyat wrote: >You wrote: > >>If >>you are >>interested in this, maybe I can mail you a zipped copy of the sources in >>a day >>or so (I was looking for an excuse to put more time in that project >>again and >>this might be the right thing... ;-)). >> > >I 'm interested! Can you put me a copy, please? > > OK, In the next day or so (realistically on Monday) I will send it. What I would like to do is get a working group together to really work on this--this is largely because of my lack of time. This has been a rather dead group and since there is interest perhaps this can really start to grow here. This is the third reply I have had in a few days, which I have to say is encouraging... Will anybody interested in helping make this a group (in other words sharing in the development and progress) effort please announce themselves. We can then figure out how to go on with this... Otherwise the risk is that this could end up dying because of my lack of time. Andy To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Tue Jun 18 10:28:21 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mg.hk5.outblaze.com (202-77-181-23.outblaze.com [202.77.181.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A95E37B404 for ; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 10:28:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ws2.hk5.outblaze.com (202-77-181-84.outblaze.com [202.77.181.84]) by mg.hk5.outblaze.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id g5IHS8v16829 for ; Tue, 18 Jun 2002 17:28:08 GMT Received: (qmail 25914 invoked by uid 1001); 18 Jun 2002 17:28:08 -0000 Message-ID: <20020618172808.25913.qmail@graffiti.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 4.104 (Entity 4.117) Received: from [66.51.217.108] by ws2.hk5.outblaze.com with http for derekbarrett@graffiti.net; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 01:28:07 +0800 From: "Derek Barrett" To: , Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 01:28:07 +0800 Subject: Re: Application cluster X-Originating-Ip: 66.51.217.108 X-Originating-Server: ws2.hk5.outblaze.com Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hahahahaha well as a fellow American then I should have replied, "Thanks partner! USA!" I don't think you should dismiss your scripts that "only start and stop" as being laughable. To me, that's 75% of the battle. I know I've spent hours at times just getting my startup scripts to work properly, missing a switch here or there, the trial and error involved in that is alot sometimes. And getting a RELIABLE method of monitoring the other servers has still been a challenge for everyone. Truly, getting a failover server to successfully take over means: 1) Reduced late night phone calls 2) Not having to make as many late night phone calls :-D And most of these types of scripts depend on having a second network card and a serial cable as well. The Linux HA servers even have a controlling server for the entire cluster called a Director. That your mechanism goes across a network card is nice, the less overhead, the better. I mean, a couple thousand dollar hardware failover solution is nice, but so would a Ferrari as a company car. I recently worked in a high uptime enviornment, and every single server there had an identical backup, run by a hardware failover switch, and let me tell you, I got really SPOILED. The amount of stress relief that those failover switches provided made troubleshooting and maintenance a breeze. Let me see what I can come up with for a place for you to post your file. Derek ----- Original Message ----- From: Andy Sporner Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 10:02:13 +0200 To: Derek Barrett , freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Application cluster > Hi Derek, > > > > >I would also love to take a look at this failover script. > > > It's a daemon and some scripts. > > > > > > >What types of apps have you used this on so far? > > > You will laugh, but simple scripts that say "I am starting, I am stopping" > because I never had enough time to get out of the test phase > > > > >Do you use a serial cable for the heartbeat monitor mechanism? > > > Actually not. It uses network interfaces to send heartbeats. I had up to > 6 machines running once (different architectures IE: Sparc, VAX, and I386). > But lately I have been only working with two and three machines (all I-386). > In the early days it was multi platform (people who used linux was also > using it--which was a surprise because I never thought it was that > portable). > These days I am focusing on FreeBSD only--again because of time--but > mostly also because I am starting to use some system specific stuff as it > becomes more elaborate. > > > > >Danke, > > > Thanks for this, but I am an American working in Germany. ;-) > I do fool a lot of people though because I have pick up an accent. > > PS. Do you know a place where I can put the 'tar' file so that > people can get to it? My main website is down for about the > next two weeks. > > Andy > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message > > -- _______________________________________________ Get your free email from http://www.graffiti.net Powered by Outblaze To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Wed Jun 19 1:59:41 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from gate.nentec.de (gate2.nentec.de [194.25.215.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DAC437B401 for ; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 01:59:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nenny.nentec.de (root@nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id g5J8xWA21336; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 10:59:32 +0200 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with ESMTP id g5J8xQZ02048; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 10:59:27 +0200 Message-ID: <3D1047EE.4000505@nentec.de> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 10:59:26 +0200 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; de-AT; rv:0.9.8) Gecko/20020204 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Derek Barrett , freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Application cluster References: <20020618172808.25913.qmail@graffiti.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Derek, >hahahahaha well as a fellow American then I should >have replied, "Thanks partner! USA!" > Well I am relieved to see that this is still something that exists! Today I just left the main FreeBSD hackers list because I found it to be just a margin too cut-throat. These days with what little time I have the last thing I want is not to be taken seriously. I regard email as a primary communications method and for some to just pretend the mail never got there is hard to tolerate (especially when I send it directly to the individual--2-3 times). I have the feeling that people are too childish to face things directly. Which is one of the reasons I am working here--better environment. -- but enough flaming for the moment ;-) > >I don't think you should dismiss your scripts that >"only start and stop" as being laughable. To me, >that's 75% of the battle. I know I've spent hours >at times just getting my startup scripts to work >properly, missing a switch here or there, the trial >and error involved in that is alot sometimes. And >getting a RELIABLE method of monitoring the other >servers has still been a challenge for everyone. > Thanks for your complement... > >Truly, getting a failover >server to successfully take over means: > >1) Reduced late night phone calls >2) Not having to make as many late night phone calls :-D > I used to work at Hyatt's central computer division in Chicago and I had many times "pager duty" and, yes I can sympathize with you! > >And most of these types >of scripts depend on having a second network card >and a serial cable as well. The Linux HA >servers even have a controlling server for the entire >cluster called a Director. That your mechanism goes >across a network card is nice, the less overhead, the better. > I allow the configuration of network addresses for each node. A heartbeat message is sent out over any and all links that are present for the server. The whole thing with the serial cable seems rather archeaic. I mean if the networking layer has failed, the server is probably not that usefull anyways! > >I mean, a couple thousand dollar hardware failover solution >is nice, but so would a Ferrari as a company car. I recently worked >in a high uptime enviornment, and every single server there had >an identical backup, run by a hardware failover switch, and >let me tell you, I got really SPOILED. The amount of >stress relief that those failover switches provided made troubleshooting >and maintenance a breeze. > Funny thing, I worked for about 5 years with Sequent clusters and in their earlier versions (< 2.0) the stand-alone machine was more reliable that the same machine in a cluster. At that time they really never got more than 2 nodes working right. That was why I started with 3 nodes in the beginning as it changes the dynamics remarkably and these same dynamics work very well on 2 nodes too. > > >Let me see what I can come up with for a place for you to post your file. > Meanwhile I need to dust off the work I was doing (I had modularized it with DSO support and added some process statis collecting so that you can from one point monitor processes on any node of the cluster). I also improved the build environment--it was previously very rickety. Andy To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Wed Jun 19 5:54:24 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from freebsdcluster.org (freebsdcluster.dk [195.184.98.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 662F937B40A for ; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 05:54:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by freebsdcluster.org (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 732D8AC703; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 14:54:18 +0200 (CEST) Received: from 217.134.227.199 ( [217.134.227.199]) as user lasse@freebsdcluster.org by www.freebsdcluster.dk with HTTP; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 14:54:17 +0200 Message-ID: <1024491257.3d107ef9f02b9@www.freebsdcluster.dk> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 14:54:17 +0200 From: "Lasse L. Johnsen" To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org, sporner@nentec.de Subject: Re: Application cluster MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Andy, I'd like to help in the development effort. Br, Lasse L. Johnsen -- Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 12:38:13 +0200 From: Andy Sporner To: Evgeny Dolgopyat , freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Application cluster Message-ID: <3D0F0D95.7070903@nentec.de> References: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- - Next in thread | Previous in thread | Raw E-Mail | Index | Archive | Help ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- - Evgeny Dolgopyat wrote: >You wrote: > >>If >>you are >>interested in this, maybe I can mail you a zipped copy of the sources in >>a day >>or so (I was looking for an excuse to put more time in that project >>again and >>this might be the right thing... ;-)). >> > >I 'm interested! Can you put me a copy, please? > > OK, In the next day or so (realistically on Monday) I will send it. What I would like to do is get a working group together to really work on this--this is largely because of my lack of time. This has been a rather dead group and since there is interest perhaps this can really start to grow here. This is the third reply I have had in a few days, which I have to say is encouraging... Will anybody interested in helping make this a group (in other words sharing in the development and progress) effort please announce themselves. We can then figure out how to go on with this... Otherwise the risk is that this could end up dying because of my lack of time. Andy To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Wed Jun 19 6:10:54 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from gate.nentec.de (gate2.nentec.de [194.25.215.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E65F37B40A for ; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 06:10:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nenny.nentec.de (root@nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id g5JDACA00371; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 15:10:12 +0200 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with ESMTP id g5JDA6Z13977; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 15:10:06 +0200 Message-ID: <3D1082AE.1030003@nentec.de> Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 15:10:06 +0200 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; de-AT; rv:0.9.8) Gecko/20020204 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Lasse L. Johnsen" Cc: freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Application cluster References: <1024491257.3d107ef9f02b9@www.freebsdcluster.dk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Lasse L. Johnsen wrote: >Andy, > >I'd like to help in the development effort. > My suggestion would be then that I will spend the next day or so cleaning up obvious problems and post the sources somewhere and then you can try it and give me some feedback... Andy > >Br, > >Lasse L. Johnsen >-- >Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 12:38:13 +0200 >From: Andy Sporner >To: Evgeny Dolgopyat , freebsd-cluster cluster@FreeBSD.ORG> >Subject: Re: Application cluster >Message-ID: <3D0F0D95.7070903@nentec.de> >References: > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >- >Next in thread | Previous in thread | Raw E-Mail | Index | Archive | Help >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >- > > >Evgeny Dolgopyat wrote: > >>You wrote: >> >>>If >>>you are >>>interested in this, maybe I can mail you a zipped copy of the sources in >>>a day >>>or so (I was looking for an excuse to put more time in that project >>>again and >>>this might be the right thing... ;-)). >>> >>I 'm interested! Can you put me a copy, please? >> >> >OK, In the next day or so (realistically on Monday) I will send it. > What I would >like to do is get a working group together to really work on this--this >is largely >because of my lack of time. > >This has been a rather dead group and since there is interest perhaps >this can >really start to grow here. This is the third reply I have had in a few >days, which >I have to say is encouraging... > >Will anybody interested in helping make this a group (in other words sharing >in the development and progress) effort please announce themselves. We can >then figure out how to go on with this... Otherwise the risk is that >this could >end up dying because of my lack of time. > >Andy > > > > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Wed Jun 19 11:29:18 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from testdcc.outblaze.com (202-77-223-23.outblaze.com [202.77.223.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BB8E37B400 for ; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 11:29:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ws3.hk5.outblaze.com (202-77-181-90.outblaze.com [202.77.181.90]) by testdcc.outblaze.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g5JISu04031177 for ; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 18:28:56 GMT Received: (qmail 30993 invoked by uid 1001); 19 Jun 2002 18:28:56 -0000 Message-ID: <20020619182856.30992.qmail@graffiti.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.41 (Entity 5.404) Received: from [66.51.217.108] by ws3.hk5.outblaze.com with http for derekbarrett@graffiti.net; Thu, 20 Jun 2002 02:28:56 +0800 From: "Derek Barrett" To: , Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 02:28:56 +0800 Subject: Re: Application cluster X-Originating-Ip: 66.51.217.108 X-Originating-Server: ws3.hk5.outblaze.com X-DCC-Outblaze-Metrics: testdcc.outblaze.com 100; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Glad to see you are enthusiatic about this, and it looks like you have some possible help too. One of the weaknesses of the freebsd community as I have seen, and some of the guys who left the core have commented on, is that the community seems to spend MORE time on debating theory and shooting each other down rathar than actually going out and prototyping something. I mean there have been some really great ideas that in theory probably sounded foolish, but somebody went out and didn't listen to the naysayers and did the work anyway and got the work done. I mean look at Google. Those guys started their engine right in the middle of the dot com peak. There were far more companies out there with way more resources and alot more branding power, but those 2 stuck with it and now Google has become the standard for search engines. I didn't even start using it until late last year, and like many other people, it has mad everything else obsolete. Anyway enough of the aside! I am going to contact the owner of a freebsd related site and see if he's willing to host your source. If not, I know it sounds a little cheesy, but my Graffiti.net account also has 20MB of HTTP storage, I'll have to check the bandwidth, but I'm sure it's more than enough to accomodate many downloads. It's not spartan, like Geocities or anything, they are pretty generous with resources. I'll let you know! Derek ----- Original Message ----- From: Andy Sporner Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 10:59:26 +0200 To: Derek Barrett , freebsd-cluster Subject: Re: Application cluster > Hi Derek, > > >hahahahaha well as a fellow American then I should > >have replied, "Thanks partner! USA!" > > > Well I am relieved to see that this is still something that > exists! Today I just left the main FreeBSD hackers list > because I found it to be just a margin too cut-throat. These > days with what little time I have the last thing I want is > not to be taken seriously. I regard email as a primary > communications method and for some to just pretend > the mail never got there is hard to tolerate (especially > when I send it directly to the individual--2-3 times). > I have the feeling that people are too childish to face > things directly. Which is one of the reasons I am working > here--better environment. -- but enough flaming for > the moment ;-) > > > > >I don't think you should dismiss your scripts that > >"only start and stop" as being laughable. To me, > >that's 75% of the battle. I know I've spent hours > >at times just getting my startup scripts to work > >properly, missing a switch here or there, the trial > >and error involved in that is alot sometimes. And > >getting a RELIABLE method of monitoring the other > >servers has still been a challenge for everyone. > > > Thanks for your complement... > > > > >Truly, getting a failover > >server to successfully take over means: > > > >1) Reduced late night phone calls > >2) Not having to make as many late night phone calls :-D > > > > I used to work at Hyatt's central computer division in > Chicago and I had many times "pager duty" and, yes I > can sympathize with you! > > > > >And most of these types > >of scripts depend on having a second network card > >and a serial cable as well. The Linux HA > >servers even have a controlling server for the entire > >cluster called a Director. That your mechanism goes > >across a network card is nice, the less overhead, the better. > > > I allow the configuration of network addresses for each > node. A heartbeat message is sent out over any and all > links that are present for the server. The whole thing with > the serial cable seems rather archeaic. I mean if the > networking layer has failed, the server is probably not > that usefull anyways! > > > > >I mean, a couple thousand dollar hardware failover solution > >is nice, but so would a Ferrari as a company car. I recently worked > >in a high uptime enviornment, and every single server there had > >an identical backup, run by a hardware failover switch, and > >let me tell you, I got really SPOILED. The amount of > >stress relief that those failover switches provided made troubleshooting > >and maintenance a breeze. > > > Funny thing, I worked for about 5 years with Sequent clusters and in > their earlier versions (< 2.0) the stand-alone machine was more reliable > that the same machine in a cluster. At that time they really never got > more > than 2 nodes working right. That was why I started with 3 nodes in the > beginning > as it changes the dynamics remarkably and these same dynamics work very > well on 2 nodes too. > > > > > > >Let me see what I can come up with for a place for you to post your file. > > > Meanwhile I need to dust off the work I was doing (I had modularized it with > DSO support and added some process statis collecting so that you can > from one > point monitor processes on any node of the cluster). I also improved > the build > environment--it was previously very rickety. > > Andy > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message > > -- _______________________________________________ Get your free email from http://www.graffiti.net Powered by Outblaze To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Wed Jun 19 12:35:18 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mg.hk5.outblaze.com (202-77-181-23.outblaze.com [202.77.181.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A28A37B407 for ; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 12:35:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ws2.hk5.outblaze.com (202-77-181-84.outblaze.com [202.77.181.84]) by mg.hk5.outblaze.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id g5JJZ6g09128 for ; Wed, 19 Jun 2002 19:35:06 GMT Received: (qmail 454 invoked by uid 1001); 19 Jun 2002 19:35:05 -0000 Message-ID: <20020619193505.453.qmail@graffiti.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 4.104 (Entity 4.117) Received: from [66.51.217.108] by ws2.hk5.outblaze.com with http for derekbarrett@graffiti.net; Thu, 20 Jun 2002 03:35:05 +0800 From: "Derek Barrett" To: , "Lasse L. Johnsen" Cc: freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 03:35:05 +0800 Subject: Potential Code Host X-Originating-Ip: 66.51.217.108 X-Originating-Server: ws2.hk5.outblaze.com Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Andy, I have heard back from a potential host. He needs to know how big your code is, in KB or MB. Thanks, Derek ----- Original Message ----- From: Andy Sporner Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 15:10:06 +0200 To: "Lasse L. Johnsen" Subject: Re: Application cluster > Lasse L. Johnsen wrote: > > >Andy, > > > >I'd like to help in the development effort. > > > > My suggestion would be then that I will spend the next day or so > cleaning up obvious problems and post the sources somewhere > and then you can try it and give me some feedback... > > > Andy > > > > >Br, > > > >Lasse L. Johnsen > >-- > >Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 12:38:13 +0200 > >From: Andy Sporner > >To: Evgeny Dolgopyat , freebsd-cluster >cluster@FreeBSD.ORG> > >Subject: Re: Application cluster > >Message-ID: <3D0F0D95.7070903@nentec.de> > >References: > > > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >- > >Next in thread | Previous in thread | Raw E-Mail | Index | Archive | Help > >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >- > > > > > >Evgeny Dolgopyat wrote: > > > >>You wrote: > >> > >>>If > >>>you are > >>>interested in this, maybe I can mail you a zipped copy of the sources in > >>>a day > >>>or so (I was looking for an excuse to put more time in that project > >>>again and > >>>this might be the right thing... ;-)). > >>> > >>I 'm interested! Can you put me a copy, please? > >> > >> > >OK, In the next day or so (realistically on Monday) I will send it. > > What I would > >like to do is get a working group together to really work on this--this > >is largely > >because of my lack of time. > > > >This has been a rather dead group and since there is interest perhaps > >this can > >really start to grow here. This is the third reply I have had in a few > >days, which > >I have to say is encouraging... > > > >Will anybody interested in helping make this a group (in other words sharing > >in the development and progress) effort please announce themselves. We can > >then figure out how to go on with this... Otherwise the risk is that > >this could > >end up dying because of my lack of time. > > > >Andy > > > > > > > > > > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > >with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message > > -- _______________________________________________ Get your free email from http://www.graffiti.net Powered by Outblaze To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Thu Jun 20 2:34:57 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from freebsdcluster.org (freebsdcluster.dk [195.184.98.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86AA737B404 for ; Thu, 20 Jun 2002 02:34:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: by freebsdcluster.org (Postfix, from userid 65534) id 39BCEAC703; Thu, 20 Jun 2002 11:34:48 +0200 (CEST) Received: from 217.134.224.58 ( [217.134.224.58]) as user lasse@freebsdcluster.org by www.freebsdcluster.dk with HTTP; Thu, 20 Jun 2002 11:34:47 +0200 Message-ID: <1024565687.3d11a1b7978f1@www.freebsdcluster.dk> Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2002 11:34:47 +0200 From: "Lasse L. Johnsen" To: Amar Takhar , freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Subject: Re: State of the project. References: <20020619222751.GA72945@drunkmonk.net> In-Reply-To: <20020619222751.GA72945@drunkmonk.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Amar, Actually until now, there has been no relation between the FreeBSDCluster.org group of people and a FreeBSD cluster project. Andy Sporner has produced some code that will form the basic for a project. Andy has promissed to circulate the code in a few days. /Lasse Quoting Amar Takhar : > Hey, just curious, what's the current state of the freebsd cluster > project? I have some free time, and i'd be willing to contribute. What > exactly > is needed as far as help goes? > > amar. > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Fri Jun 21 2: 4:35 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from gate.nentec.de (gate2.nentec.de [194.25.215.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0D6237B403 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 02:04:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nenny.nentec.de (root@nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id g5L94PA01564; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:04:25 +0200 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with ESMTP id g5L94EZ31231; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:04:15 +0200 Message-ID: <3D12EC0E.1000501@nentec.de> Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:04:14 +0200 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; de-AT; rv:0.9.8) Gecko/20020204 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Derek Barrett Cc: "Lasse L. Johnsen" , freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Potential Code Host References: <20020619193505.453.qmail@graffiti.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Derek Barrett wrote: >Hi Andy, > >I have heard back from a potential host. > >He needs to know how big your code is, in KB or MB. > >Thanks, > >Derek > In the moment it is about 1.44 mb compressed. There is another patch that helps to track processes that I will also post (after I apply some very helpful suggestions by Terry Lambert). > > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Andy Sporner >Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 15:10:06 +0200 >To: "Lasse L. Johnsen" >Subject: Re: Application cluster > > >>Lasse L. Johnsen wrote: >> >>>Andy, >>> >>>I'd like to help in the development effort. >>> >>My suggestion would be then that I will spend the next day or so >>cleaning up obvious problems and post the sources somewhere >>and then you can try it and give me some feedback... >> >> >>Andy >> >>>Br, >>> >>>Lasse L. Johnsen >>>-- >>>Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 12:38:13 +0200 >>>From: Andy Sporner >>>To: Evgeny Dolgopyat , freebsd-cluster >>cluster@FreeBSD.ORG> >>>Subject: Re: Application cluster >>>Message-ID: <3D0F0D95.7070903@nentec.de> >>>References: >>> >>> >>>------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>- >>>Next in thread | Previous in thread | Raw E-Mail | Index | Archive | Help >>>------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>- >>> >>> >>>Evgeny Dolgopyat wrote: >>> >>>>You wrote: >>>> >>>>>If >>>>>you are >>>>>interested in this, maybe I can mail you a zipped copy of the sources in >>>>>a day >>>>>or so (I was looking for an excuse to put more time in that project >>>>>again and >>>>>this might be the right thing... ;-)). >>>>> >>>>I 'm interested! Can you put me a copy, please? >>>> >>>> >>>OK, In the next day or so (realistically on Monday) I will send it. >>>What I would >>>like to do is get a working group together to really work on this--this >>>is largely >>>because of my lack of time. >>> >>>This has been a rather dead group and since there is interest perhaps >>>this can >>>really start to grow here. This is the third reply I have had in a few >>>days, which >>>I have to say is encouraging... >>> >>>Will anybody interested in helping make this a group (in other words sharing >>>in the development and progress) effort please announce themselves. We can >>>then figure out how to go on with this... Otherwise the risk is that >>>this could >>>end up dying because of my lack of time. >>> >>>Andy >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >>>with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message >>> >>> >> >> >> >>To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >>with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message >> >> > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Fri Jun 21 2:33:39 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from gate.nentec.de (gate2.nentec.de [194.25.215.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F127E37B407 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 02:33:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nenny.nentec.de (root@nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id g5L9XVA06467; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:33:31 +0200 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with ESMTP id g5L9XKZ32596; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:33:21 +0200 Message-ID: <3D12F2E0.4080506@nentec.de> Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:33:20 +0200 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; de-AT; rv:0.9.8) Gecko/20020204 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Derek Barrett Cc: freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Application cluster (long post sorry). References: <20020619182856.30992.qmail@graffiti.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Derek Barrett wrote: >Glad to see you are enthusiatic about this, and it looks like >you have some possible help too. > >One of the weaknesses of the freebsd community as I have seen, >and some of the guys who left the core have commented on, >is that the community seems to spend MORE time on debating >theory and shooting each other down rathar than actually >going out and prototyping something. > I agree, but I have come to the basic understanding that most of the main posters are not really very nice people. There are a few exceptions, but I wrote to about a dozen of the "big wigs" and to date have recieved no replies after a retrying many times. I was so frustrated that I even wrote to Jordan Hubbard (and I did get a response--though it was more or less a justification of the way things were). My basic conclusion is that the people making the decisions seem to want to deal with the same community of people that they always have and that new people are relegated as "kids" no matter how long they might have been in the Corporate world (where such participation is nearly impossible because of Intellectual Property agreements) doing more advanced things. It seems that the only way to "rock your way" onto the stage is to do something really big. I don't see much of that kind of thing left anymore in the mainstream that these people don't already have ownership of. I realize there *ARE* a lot of newcomers (real newbies) --but if the project is to have some merit and grow--one *MUST* welcome new blood and only in these situations can a project leap forward as I hope this effort will. New people are valuable because they question the authority and cause people to think in ways they never thought before and sometimes this causes a watershed effect that makes possible major leaps forward. They have a cost--certainly, but overall, I think it is very much a worthwhile expense. I have absolutely no problem with the basic concept of anarchy, as long as teamwork is preserved. I don't consider my work the "holy grail" but instead material for discussion and a starting point. The problem I see is that people don't want to discuss on the main list--at least with me. One of the things I have come to really appreciate working abroad is the whole awareness of "Mobbing". It isn't the same meaning as we had in the USA where you see a famous person and suddenly they are surrounded--but quite the opposite. It is when people are systematically stripped of ability to impact their place in their working situation--they get excluded because they didn't play the office politics correctly. Having a heart problem with high blood pressure, I decided that it wasn't worth my time and frustration any longer to remain in anything that causes stress levels to rise. Leaving the main list has satisfied this. One can only change what is within ones reach. Happily this situation seems like the way things *should* be and yes I am eagerly looking forward to see how things progress. It might take the little splinters of small groups to reinstate the values that made such projects as FreeBSD fun in the first place. So perhaps all this being said, "Let's really rock this place". Look for a post of code in the Monday timeframe (no internet at home in the moment--and this account is at work). For backup purposes I can also be reached at 'asporner@yahoo.com' I realize that some people might consider at least part of my name as grounds to eliminate it from their reading list (for those not as alert 'porn'). I even read that a 'sporner' is one who distributes spam porn! If I were motivated I think this might make a very good court case and I might even be able to retire. I had a fight with espn sports over my login name (the same is true with grafiti) because it was considered illegal. I was told to change my name--which sounds an awefull lot like discrimination. If computers are to save us from ourselves --they should be flexible. I told the systems people to look at 'www.switchboard.com' and put the name in-- it's legal. OK I guess starting next week we can get this thing off. I will post separately what is missing and what should probably be added. Sorry for the long post To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Fri Jun 21 2:57:26 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from postoffice.aims.com.au (eth0.lnk.aims.com.au [203.31.73.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BB8737B4C7 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 02:56:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from postoffice.aims.com.au (nts-ts1.aims.private [192.168.10.2]) by postoffice.aims.com.au with ESMTP id g5L9thm83713 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 19:55:43 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from chris@aims.com.au) Received: from ntsts1 by aims.com.au with SMTP (MDaemon.v3.5.3.R) for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 19:55:16 +1000 Reply-To: From: "Chris Knight" To: Cc: Subject: RE: Potential Code Host Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 19:55:15 +1000 Message-ID: <00e501c21909$be819a80$020aa8c0@aims.private> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 In-reply-to: <3D12EC0E.1000501@nentec.de> X-Return-Path: chris@aims.com.au X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Howdy, > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG > [mailto:owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG]On Behalf Of Andy Sporner > Sent: Friday, 21 June 2002 19:04 > To: Derek Barrett > Cc: Lasse L. Johnsen; freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG > Subject: Re: Potential Code Host > > [snip] > > In the moment it is about 1.44 mb compressed. There is another > patch that helps to track processes that I will also post > (after I apply some very helpful suggestions by Terry Lambert). > Got a 2Mbit link sitting here mostly idle, so I'm more than happy to host it for you. Regards, Chris Knight Systems Administrator AIMS Independent Computer Professionals Tel: +61 3 6334 6664 Fax: +61 3 6331 7032 Mob: +61 419 528 795 Web: http://www.aims.com.au To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Fri Jun 21 3: 0: 5 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from gate.nentec.de (gate2.nentec.de [194.25.215.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 09D4837B4E4 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 02:59:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nenny.nentec.de (root@nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id g5L9wvA06640; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:58:57 +0200 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with ESMTP id g5L9wmZ01317; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:58:48 +0200 Message-ID: <3D12F8D7.3020002@nentec.de> Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:58:47 +0200 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; de-AT; rv:0.9.8) Gecko/20020204 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: chris@aims.com.au Cc: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Potential Code Host References: <00e501c21909$be819a80$020aa8c0@aims.private> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG So be it then! Today I will sent a "Little tested" and ungaranteed version for the weekend reading of those interested. It will be updated on Monday with what it took to make it right. This goes as a reward to those who are so interested. Andy Chris Knight wrote: >Howdy, > >>-----Original Message----- >>From: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG >>[mailto:owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG]On Behalf Of Andy Sporner >>Sent: Friday, 21 June 2002 19:04 >>To: Derek Barrett >>Cc: Lasse L. Johnsen; freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG >>Subject: Re: Potential Code Host >> >>[snip] >> >>In the moment it is about 1.44 mb compressed. There is another >>patch that helps to track processes that I will also post >>(after I apply some very helpful suggestions by Terry Lambert). >> >Got a 2Mbit link sitting here mostly idle, so I'm more than happy to >host it for you. > >Regards, >Chris Knight >Systems Administrator >AIMS Independent Computer Professionals >Tel: +61 3 6334 6664 Fax: +61 3 6331 7032 Mob: +61 419 528 795 >Web: http://www.aims.com.au > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Fri Jun 21 3:58:54 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from postoffice.aims.com.au (eth0.lnk.aims.com.au [203.31.73.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7466A37B41B for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 03:58:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from postoffice.aims.com.au (nts-ts1.aims.private [192.168.10.2]) by postoffice.aims.com.au with ESMTP id g5LAwkm88710 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 20:58:46 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from chris@aims.com.au) Received: from ntsts1 by aims.com.au with SMTP (MDaemon.v3.5.3.R) for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 20:57:57 +1000 Reply-To: From: "Chris Knight" To: Cc: Subject: RE: Potential Code Host Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 20:57:55 +1000 Message-ID: <00eb01c21912$80582040$020aa8c0@aims.private> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 In-reply-to: <3D12F8D7.3020002@nentec.de> X-Return-Path: chris@aims.com.au X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Howdy, No problems. I'll post the URL on receipt of the file(s). Regards, Chris Knight Systems Administrator AIMS Independent Computer Professionals Tel: +61 3 6334 6664 Fax: +61 3 6331 7032 Mob: +61 419 528 795 Web: http://www.aims.com.au > -----Original Message----- > From: Andy Sporner [mailto:sporner@nentec.de] > Sent: Friday, 21 June 2002 19:59 > To: chris@aims.com.au > Cc: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org > Subject: Re: Potential Code Host > > > So be it then! Today I will sent a "Little tested" and > ungaranteed version for the weekend reading of those interested. > It will be updated on Monday with what it took to make it right. > This goes as a reward to those who are so interested. > > Andy To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Fri Jun 21 5:29:59 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from postoffice.aims.com.au (eth0.lnk.aims.com.au [203.31.73.253]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF01337B410 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 05:29:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from postoffice.aims.com.au (nts-ts1.aims.private [192.168.10.2]) by postoffice.aims.com.au with ESMTP id g5LCTNm89277 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 22:29:24 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from chris@aims.com.au) Received: from ntsts1 by aims.com.au with SMTP (MDaemon.v3.5.3.R) for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 22:28:30 +1000 Reply-To: From: "Chris Knight" To: , Cc: Subject: Andy's Clustering Code Now Available (was RE: Potential Code Host) Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 22:28:28 +1000 Message-ID: <00f701c2191f$265217b0$020aa8c0@aims.private> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 In-reply-to: <00eb01c21912$80582040$020aa8c0@aims.private> X-Return-Path: chris@aims.com.au X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Howdy, I've put Andy Sporner's clustering code up at: http://www.aims.com.au/chris/cluster Please excuse the crappy page - it's getting late and I wanted to get this up. I'll put updates up as they get sent to me. Thanks for the code Andy. I'll try some testing over the weekend. Regards, Chris Knight Systems Administrator AIMS Independent Computer Professionals Tel: +61 3 6334 6664 Fax: +61 3 6331 7032 Mob: +61 419 528 795 Web: http://www.aims.com.au To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Fri Jun 21 6:10: 1 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from gate.nentec.de (gate2.nentec.de [194.25.215.66]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE6B737B442 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 06:07:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nenny.nentec.de (root@nenny.nentec.de [153.92.64.1]) by gate.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id g5LD77A08384; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 15:07:07 +0200 Received: from nentec.de (andromeda.nentec.de [153.92.64.34]) by nenny.nentec.de (8.11.3/8.11.3/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) with ESMTP id g5LD6uZ10238; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 15:06:56 +0200 Message-ID: <3D1324F0.60308@nentec.de> Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 15:06:56 +0200 From: Andy Sporner User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; de-AT; rv:0.9.8) Gecko/20020204 X-Accept-Language: de-at, de, en, en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: chris@aims.com.au Cc: freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Andy's Clustering Code Now Available (was RE: Potential Code Host) References: <00f701c2191f$265217b0$020aa8c0@aims.private> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS-perl11-milter (http://amavis.org/) Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Once again, thanks for helping by posting this code... The code is really very "green" in the sense that a lot of features were added, but were not very well tested. Around version 189 it was pretty stable, unfortunately I had a system crash and lost that version. I can look again for it on backup, but I don't have much hope. In any case this is the version we should work forward on. The important points that I see need to be done (outside of testing this code and hardening it) is to port the CSE patch (CSE =Clustered Server Environment) to 5.0 FreeBSD. I have some work done on the KVM stuff on the modules for 5.0 as I was working on a graphical "TOP" knockoff. You might notice that I am using a VERY old version of TK/TCL. It was the last version that I knew working well with the BLT (drag and drop) extentions. So here are some major tasks and perhaps somebody might want to take these up: 1. Port of CSE to FreeBSD 5.0 (current) 2. Documentation. 3. Conversion of GUI away from TCL/TK to perhaps Qt. 4. Work on shared disk devices (either SCSI or Firewire). There are probably other things too, that I haven't thought about so if somebody sees something, we should get it out into the open. Thanks again for everybody's effort. Andy Chris Knight wrote: >Howdy, > >I've put Andy Sporner's clustering code up at: > >http://www.aims.com.au/chris/cluster > >Please excuse the crappy page - it's getting late and I wanted to >get this up. I'll put updates up as they get sent to me. >Thanks for the code Andy. I'll try some testing over the weekend. > >Regards, >Chris Knight >Systems Administrator >AIMS Independent Computer Professionals >Tel: +61 3 6334 6664 Fax: +61 3 6331 7032 Mob: +61 419 528 795 >Web: http://www.aims.com.au > > >To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org >with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Fri Jun 21 6:30:59 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from cassandra.coredump.at (cassandra.coredump.at [194.235.142.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 21F4E37B408 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 06:30:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 2890 invoked by uid 1007); 21 Jun 2002 13:36:36 -0000 Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 15:36:36 +0200 From: rupp@coredump.at To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Subject: subscribe freebsd-cluster Message-ID: <20020621153636.A2885@cassandra.coredump.at> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG subscribe freebsd-cluster To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Fri Jun 21 11:18:42 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from testdcc.outblaze.com (202-77-223-23.outblaze.com [202.77.223.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 271A237B40B for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:18:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ws3.hk5.outblaze.com (202-77-181-90.outblaze.com [202.77.181.90]) by testdcc.outblaze.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g5LIIV04011680 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 18:18:31 GMT Received: (qmail 17573 invoked by uid 1001); 21 Jun 2002 18:18:30 -0000 Message-ID: <20020621181830.17572.qmail@graffiti.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.41 (Entity 5.404) Received: from [66.51.217.108] by ws3.hk5.outblaze.com with http for derekbarrett@graffiti.net; Sat, 22 Jun 2002 02:18:30 +0800 From: "Derek Barrett" To: chris@aims.com.au, sporner@nentec.de Cc: freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2002 02:18:30 +0800 Subject: Re: Andy's Clustering Code Now Available (was RE: Potential Code Host) X-Originating-Ip: 66.51.217.108 X-Originating-Server: ws3.hk5.outblaze.com X-DCC-Outblaze-Metrics: testdcc.outblaze.com 100; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Excellent work guys. I'm going to make a post on that freebsd related bulletin board regarding this project, with the code location. Maybe we can get a couple of more people on this list. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Knight" Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 22:28:28 +1000 To: , Subject: Andy's Clustering Code Now Available (was RE: Potential Code Host) > Howdy, > > I've put Andy Sporner's clustering code up at: > > http://www.aims.com.au/chris/cluster > > Please excuse the crappy page - it's getting late and I wanted to > get this up. I'll put updates up as they get sent to me. > Thanks for the code Andy. I'll try some testing over the weekend. > > Regards, > Chris Knight > Systems Administrator > AIMS Independent Computer Professionals > Tel: +61 3 6334 6664 Fax: +61 3 6331 7032 Mob: +61 419 528 795 > Web: http://www.aims.com.au > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message > > -- _______________________________________________ Get your free email from http://www.graffiti.net Powered by Outblaze To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Fri Jun 21 11:26:47 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mail2.itxmarket.com (fw.itxmarket.com [213.11.40.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E54B037B403 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:26:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from freebsdcluster.net (mich2.itxmarket.com [192.168.2.26]) by mail2.itxmarket.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6EDA37C8F; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 20:26:02 +0200 (CEST) Received: by freebsdcluster.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 950263B94BB; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 20:26:28 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 20:26:28 +0200 From: Michael Hostbaek To: Derek Barrett Cc: chris@aims.com.au, sporner@nentec.de, freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Andy's Clustering Code Now Available (was RE: Potential Code Host) Message-ID: <20020621182628.GA49820@mich2.itxmarket.com> References: <20020621181830.17572.qmail@graffiti.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20020621181830.17572.qmail@graffiti.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.99i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.5-STABLE i386 X-PGP-Key: http://www.freebsdcluster.org/~mich/ Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I will see if I can try the code out next week.. I will keep you posted. Best regards, /mich Derek Barrett (derekbarrett) writes: > Excellent work guys. > > I'm going to make a post on that freebsd related bulletin board > regarding this project, with the code location. > > Maybe we can get a couple of more people on this list. > -- Best Regards, Michael Landin Hostbaek FreeBSDCluster.org - an International Community */ PGP-key available upon request /* To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-cluster Fri Jun 21 12:12: 4 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-cluster@freebsd.org Received: from mg.hk5.outblaze.com (202-77-181-23.outblaze.com [202.77.181.23]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4000937B47E for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 12:11:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ws2.hk5.outblaze.com (202-77-181-84.outblaze.com [202.77.181.84]) by mg.hk5.outblaze.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id g5LJBCJ07527 for ; Fri, 21 Jun 2002 19:11:12 GMT Received: (qmail 18719 invoked by uid 1001); 21 Jun 2002 19:11:11 -0000 Message-ID: <20020621191111.18718.qmail@graffiti.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 4.104 (Entity 4.117) Received: from [66.51.217.108] by ws2.hk5.outblaze.com with http for derekbarrett@graffiti.net; Sat, 22 Jun 2002 03:11:11 +0800 From: "Derek Barrett" To: Cc: freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2002 03:11:11 +0800 Subject: Another long post sorry! X-Originating-Ip: 66.51.217.108 X-Originating-Server: ws2.hk5.outblaze.com Sender: owner-freebsd-cluster@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Andy, I like your style, and I agree with most of what you have said. You seem determined to make a difference, and that's what is needed on this project, since as you say, getting the approval of the higher ups just isn't possible. One thing I've learned quickly in my young life is sometimes it's better not to ask, and just do it. Seems like that's where you are going on this one. And what boggles me is that this is a feature that alot of people would really kill for. I am so surprised there is nothing in place to date! At my first job, we would get angry calls from clients, because the documentation they were using was over 3 years old! So their client software wasn't working. We were server guys, and this was taking us away from handling server issues, and making clients really angry because they had no direction for installing (what should have been) a simple Windows client! I hounded my boss so many times that we had an updated document to send out, if we could just send it out, that would cut down our calls by 90%. My boss would not do it because of politics, he didn't want to upset the department that had written that document 3 years ago. (And wouldn't even ask them if we could help update it). We gave him the nickname, "blocker." After a while I just stopped asking, and started emailing the thing out anyway! You know what? Clients stopped calling us with problems! I think you have chosen the right place for your project, because I think I've seen maybe 2 posts last month, none the month before that. So this place is ripe for leadership and initiative, without too many overlords and naysayers to shoot it down before it gets started. I've been hoping to help out on freebsd for some time now, maybe this can be a good project. I'm especially interested in the documentation side. Good job Andy! Derek ----- Original Message ----- From: Andy Sporner Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2002 11:33:20 +0200 To: Derek Barrett Subject: Re: Application cluster (long post sorry). > Derek Barrett wrote: > > >Glad to see you are enthusiatic about this, and it looks like > >you have some possible help too. > > > >One of the weaknesses of the freebsd community as I have seen, > >and some of the guys who left the core have commented on, > >is that the community seems to spend MORE time on debating > >theory and shooting each other down rathar than actually > >going out and prototyping something. > > > I agree, but I have come to the basic understanding that most of the > main posters are not really very nice people. There are a few > exceptions, but I wrote to about a dozen of the "big wigs" and to > date have recieved no replies after a retrying many times. I was > so frustrated that I even wrote to Jordan Hubbard (and I did get > a response--though it was more or less a justification of the way > things were). My basic conclusion is that the people making the > decisions seem to want to deal with the same community of people > that they always have and that new people are relegated as "kids" > no matter how long they might have been in the Corporate world > (where such participation is nearly impossible because of > Intellectual Property agreements) doing more advanced things. > It seems that the only way to "rock your way" onto the stage is > to do something really big. I don't see much of that kind of thing > left anymore in the mainstream that these people don't already > have ownership of. > > I realize there *ARE* a lot of newcomers (real newbies) > --but if the project is to have some merit and grow--one > *MUST* welcome new blood and only in these situations can > a project leap forward as I hope this effort will. New people > are valuable because they question the authority and cause > people to think in ways they never thought before and sometimes > this causes a watershed effect that makes possible major leaps > forward. They have a cost--certainly, but overall, I think it > is very much a worthwhile expense. > > I have absolutely no problem with the basic concept of anarchy, > as long as teamwork is preserved. I don't consider my work > the "holy grail" but instead material for discussion and a starting > point. The problem I see is that people don't want to discuss > on the main list--at least with me. > > One of the things I have come to really appreciate working > abroad is the whole awareness of "Mobbing". It isn't the same > meaning as we had in the USA where you see a famous person > and suddenly they are surrounded--but quite the opposite. It > is when people are systematically stripped of ability to impact > their place in their working situation--they get excluded > because they didn't play the office politics correctly. > > Having a heart problem with high blood pressure, I decided that > it wasn't worth my time and frustration any longer to remain > in anything that causes stress levels to rise. Leaving the main > list has satisfied this. One can only change what is within ones > reach. > > Happily this situation seems like the way things *should* be and > yes I am eagerly looking forward to see how things progress. It > might take the little splinters of small groups to reinstate the values > that made such projects as FreeBSD fun in the first place. > > So perhaps all this being said, "Let's really rock this place". Look > for a post of code in the Monday timeframe (no internet at home > in the moment--and this account is at work). > > For backup purposes I can also be reached at 'asporner@yahoo.com' > > I realize that some people might consider at least part of my name > as grounds to eliminate it from their reading list (for those not as > alert 'porn'). I even read that a 'sporner' is one who distributes > spam porn! If I were motivated I think this might make a very > good court case and I might even be able to retire. I had a fight with > espn sports over my login name (the same is true with grafiti) because > it was considered illegal. I was told to change my name--which > sounds an awefull lot like discrimination. If computers are to save > us from ourselves --they should be flexible. I told the systems > people to look at 'www.switchboard.com' and put the name in-- > it's legal. > > OK I guess starting next week we can get this thing off. I will > post separately what is missing and what should probably be > added. > > Sorry for the long post > > -- _______________________________________________ Get your free email from http://www.graffiti.net Powered by Outblaze To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-cluster" in the body of the message