From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Sun May 23 06:39:38 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC59016A4CE for ; Sun, 23 May 2004 06:39:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from filer.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu (filer.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu [130.245.126.2]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C34343D1F for ; Sun, 23 May 2004 06:39:38 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from ezk@fsl.cs.sunysb.edu) Received: from agora.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu (IDENT:vJ3vI/f0HmJsk8XPIAdABr3Ua+hoT2oL@agora.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu [130.245.126.12])i4NDdRiM003399; Sun, 23 May 2004 09:39:28 -0400 Received: from agora.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu (IDENT:HRetGS2KFPUFhf2uu9oQApPczFkEbNpz@localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) i4NDdSEU003703; Sun, 23 May 2004 09:39:28 -0400 Received: (from ezk@localhost) by agora.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i4NDdR1L003699; Sun, 23 May 2004 09:39:27 -0400 Date: Sun, 23 May 2004 09:39:27 -0400 Message-Id: <200405231339.i4NDdR1L003699@agora.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu> From: Erez Zadok To: Allan Fields In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 22 May 2004 23:28:07 EDT." <20040523032807.GC17124@afields.ca> X-MailKey: Erez_Zadok cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org cc: fistgen@filesystems.org Subject: Re: [FiST] FreeBSD Cache Coherency X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 23 May 2004 13:39:39 -0000 [I'll CC freebsd-fs on my answer. -ezk] In message <20040523032807.GC17124@afields.ca>, Allan Fields writes: > Hi, > > Recently, the point has been raised while discussing fistgen generated > file systems on FreeBSD: Can you update as to the current status > of the FreeBSD-5 templates and cache coherency issues in stacking > implementation? > > If there are outstanding issues in FreeBSD, what steps should be > taken to address them? Allan, last time we officially checked fist was under 5.1 and 4.9. At that time we essentially rewrote the 4.x templates and wrote new ones for 5.x. Both worked well, and passed a compile benchmark, fsx, and few assorted micro-benchmarks. We haven't tried 5.2/4.10 yet, but usually you guys are very good about keeping kernel code backward compatible, so I'm not expecting much trouble. Now, I'm not sure what you mean by cache coherency problems. There are two possible issues: 1. A while back the fbsd VFS had problems, which were gradually fixed in 4.x and 5.x. We were able to use those updates and ensured that any and all access through our stacked f/s works well: no data corruptions etc. 2. Any stackable f/s, AFAIK, still has a problem wrt cache coherency unless you use overlay mounts. This is true only for file systems that want to modify file data (e.g., cryptfs). Example: I can mount cryptfs over one directory, and access files through the mnt pt, but I could also go to the lower file system's files directly and muck with them. So essentially I'd be modifying two separate pages that really logically belong to one . There is no way to inform an upper f/s of a page that changed in the lower f/s. To resolve this completely, you need a unified cache manager (ala Heidemann's SOSP'95 paper). Now, if there's something new we could use in 5.x that can make it possible for us to write cleaner and safer stacked f/s on fbsd,, we'd love to hear about it. Cheers, Erez. From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Mon May 24 17:57:52 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DDB416A4CE for ; Mon, 24 May 2004 17:57:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gemini.lunarpages.com (gemini.lunarpages.com [64.235.234.128]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08C9C43D45 for ; Mon, 24 May 2004 17:57:52 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from miles@lubin.us) Received: from ool-43566766.dyn.optonline.net ([67.86.103.102] helo=localhost.localdomain) by gemini.lunarpages.com with asmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1BSQG6-0006zR-DT for freebsd-fs@freebsd.org; Mon, 24 May 2004 17:57:34 -0700 Date: Mon, 24 May 2004 20:57:28 -0400 From: Miles Lubin To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-Id: <20040524205728.5bddd122.miles@lubin.us> X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.9.10 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.9) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - gemini.lunarpages.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - freebsd.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [0 0] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - lubin.us X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: Subject: shfs port? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 00:57:52 -0000 The shfs linux kernel module (http://shfs.sourceforge.net/) looks like it would be useful, anyone interested in leading the porting of it? I would gladly help, but I've never ported anything and dont know the FBSD or Linux kernel well. Any ideas? Miles From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Tue May 25 03:08:49 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38A2416A4CE for ; Tue, 25 May 2004 03:08:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huva.hittite.isp.9tel.net (huva.hittite.isp.9tel.net [62.62.156.28]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77E1543D53 for ; Tue, 25 May 2004 03:08:48 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from clefevre-lists@9online.fr) Received: from pc2k (85.228.62.62.9nanterr1-0-ro-bas-1.9tel.net [62.62.228.85]) by huva.hittite.isp.9tel.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 951AD9BB55; Tue, 25 May 2004 12:10:10 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <004701c44240$4009c9e0$7890a8c0@dyndns.org> From: "Cyrille Lefevre" To: "Miles Lubin" , References: <20040524205728.5bddd122.miles@lubin.us> Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 12:08:37 +0200 Organization: ACME MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Subject: Re: shfs port? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 10:08:49 -0000 "Miles Lubin" wrote: > The shfs linux kernel module (http://shfs.sourceforge.net/) looks like it would be useful, > anyone interested in leading the porting of it? I would gladly help, but I've never ported > anything and dont know the FBSD or Linux kernel well. it would be more simple to supply ssh support to ggated/ggatec under -current :) http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=ggated&manpath=FreeBSD+5.2-current http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=ggatec&manpath=FreeBSD+5.2-current Cyrille Lefevre. -- home: mailto:cyrille.lefevre@laposte.net From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Tue May 25 10:07:02 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF37A16A4CE for ; Tue, 25 May 2004 10:07:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (Odin.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.75]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9D1E43D46 for ; Tue, 25 May 2004 10:07:02 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from brdavis@odin.ac.hmc.edu) Received: from odin.ac.hmc.edu (IDENT:brdavis@localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i4PH6iaZ010345; Tue, 25 May 2004 10:06:44 -0700 Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by odin.ac.hmc.edu (8.12.10/8.12.3/Submit) id i4PH6Y2L010341; Tue, 25 May 2004 10:06:34 -0700 Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 10:06:34 -0700 From: Brooks Davis To: Cyrille Lefevre Message-ID: <20040525170632.GB18275@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> References: <20040524205728.5bddd122.miles@lubin.us> <004701c44240$4009c9e0$7890a8c0@dyndns.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="WhfpMioaduB5tiZL" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <004701c44240$4009c9e0$7890a8c0@dyndns.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org cc: Miles Lubin Subject: Re: shfs port? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 25 May 2004 17:07:02 -0000 --WhfpMioaduB5tiZL Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, May 25, 2004 at 12:08:37PM +0200, Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > "Miles Lubin" wrote: > > The shfs linux kernel module (http://shfs.sourceforge.net/) looks like = it > would be useful, > > anyone interested in leading the porting of it? I would gladly help, bu= t I've > never ported > > anything and dont know the FBSD or Linux kernel well. >=20 > it would be more simple to supply ssh support to ggated/ggatec under -cur= rent :) GEOM gate and shfs are unrelated. GEOM gate provides remote access to a GEOM (e.g. a disk object). shfs accesses files remotly via an ssh connection much like an ftp file system. If you wrote an appropriate daemon, it should be straight forward to do this via portalfs. See mount_portalfs(8) for more info. --=20 Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. PGP fingerprint 655D 519C 26A7 82E7 2529 9BF0 5D8E 8BE9 F238 1AD4 --WhfpMioaduB5tiZL Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFAs30XXY6L6fI4GtQRAvGgAKCVwl2yOfAxEgSnpPYcyyhohiDlkQCgpiNj p/DGaVYoQh1wj+NlyAgndjY= =gS4V -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --WhfpMioaduB5tiZL-- From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Wed May 26 15:01:26 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C842C16A4CE for ; Wed, 26 May 2004 15:01:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [204.156.12.50]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7054743D3F for ; Wed, 26 May 2004 15:01:26 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fledge.watson.org (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i4QM0Vl7027109; Wed, 26 May 2004 18:00:31 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Received: from localhost (robert@localhost)i4QM0UoZ027106; Wed, 26 May 2004 18:00:30 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from robert@fledge.watson.org) Date: Wed, 26 May 2004 18:00:30 -0400 (EDT) From: Robert Watson X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: Brooks Davis In-Reply-To: <20040525170632.GB18275@Odin.AC.HMC.Edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org cc: Miles Lubin Subject: Re: shfs port? X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 May 2004 22:01:26 -0000 On Tue, 25 May 2004, Brooks Davis wrote: > On Tue, May 25, 2004 at 12:08:37PM +0200, Cyrille Lefevre wrote: > > "Miles Lubin" wrote: > > > The shfs linux kernel module (http://shfs.sourceforge.net/) looks like it > > would be useful, > > > anyone interested in leading the porting of it? I would gladly help, but I've > > never ported > > > anything and dont know the FBSD or Linux kernel well. > > > > it would be more simple to supply ssh support to ggated/ggatec under -current :) > > GEOM gate and shfs are unrelated. GEOM gate provides remote access to a > GEOM (e.g. a disk object). shfs accesses files remotly via an ssh > connection much like an ftp file system. If you wrote an appropriate > daemon, it should be straight forward to do this via portalfs. See > mount_portalfs(8) for more info. It would actually be tempting to use something like Arla's XFS or the Coda stubs in the kernel to implement it via a userland daemon, since they make it a lot easier to write a distributed file system, especially if that file system transfers only whole files rather than blocks. Robert N M Watson FreeBSD Core Team, TrustedBSD Projects robert@fledge.watson.org Senior Research Scientist, McAfee Research From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu May 27 10:26:59 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87FF416A4CE for ; Thu, 27 May 2004 10:26:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kurush.osdn.org.ua (external.osdn.org.ua [212.40.34.156]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0589343D39 for ; Thu, 27 May 2004 10:26:43 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from never@kurush.osdn.org.ua) Received: from kurush.osdn.org.ua (never@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by kurush.osdn.org.ua (8.12.8p2/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i4RHPUoX042137 for ; Thu, 27 May 2004 20:25:30 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from never@kurush.osdn.org.ua) Received: (from never@localhost) by kurush.osdn.org.ua (8.12.8p2/8.12.8/Submit) id i4RHPUf7042134 for freebsd-fs@freebsd.org; Thu, 27 May 2004 20:25:30 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from never) Date: Thu, 27 May 2004 20:25:29 +0300 From: Alexandr Kovalenko To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20040527172529.GA40822@nevermind.kiev.ua> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new Subject: Inode clearing/freeing X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 27 May 2004 17:26:59 -0000 I have one simple question: 1. UFS1 2. Sequence: $ mkdir a $ mkdir a/b $ touch a/b/c $ rm -rf a/b The question is: does inode of file 'c' being cleared (e.g. filled with zeros or something like that) or not? -- NEVE-RIPE, will build world for food Ukrainian FreeBSD User Group http://uafug.org.ua/ From owner-freebsd-fs@FreeBSD.ORG Thu May 27 10:35:25 2004 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 341D216A4CE for ; Thu, 27 May 2004 10:35:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-svr1.cs.utah.edu (brahma.cs.utah.edu [155.99.198.200]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E30D443D2F for ; Thu, 27 May 2004 10:35:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from saggarwa@cs.utah.edu) Received: from faith.cs.utah.edu (faith.cs.utah.edu [155.99.198.108]) by mail-svr1.cs.utah.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id E088A34708; Thu, 27 May 2004 11:35:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: by faith.cs.utah.edu (Postfix, from userid 4973) id DCC672EC21; Thu, 27 May 2004 11:35:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by faith.cs.utah.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id D194534406; Thu, 27 May 2004 17:35:04 +0000 (UTC) Date: Thu, 27 May 2004 11:35:04 -0600 (MDT) From: Siddharth Aggarwal To: Alexandr Kovalenko In-Reply-To: <20040527172529.GA40822@nevermind.kiev.ua> Message-ID: References: <20040527172529.GA40822@nevermind.kiev.ua> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII cc: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Inode clearing/freeing X-BeenThere: freebsd-fs@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Filesystems List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 27 May 2004 17:35:25 -0000 I'm not sure but I would imagine that the inode isn't filled with zeroes. The directory entry in a/b for 'c' is removed and the inode is deallocated (in-core copy and disk copy) along with any blocks (which I assume in this case are none). The list of free inodes and blocks is then updated. So my guess is that the inode isn't cleared to zero, the reference to it is simply deleted so that it can be re-used by another file. -Sid. On Thu, 27 May 2004, Alexandr Kovalenko wrote: > I have one simple question: > > 1. UFS1 > > 2. Sequence: > > $ mkdir a > $ mkdir a/b > $ touch a/b/c > $ rm -rf a/b > > The question is: does inode of file 'c' being cleared (e.g. filled with > zeros or something like that) or not? > > -- > NEVE-RIPE, will build world for food > Ukrainian FreeBSD User Group > http://uafug.org.ua/ > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-fs@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-fs > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-fs-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >