From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 27 07:04:01 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A199E16A4E5; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 07:04:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from peterjeremy@optushome.com.au) Received: from mail02.syd.optusnet.com.au (mail02.syd.optusnet.com.au [211.29.132.183]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFCFC43D46; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 07:04:00 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from peterjeremy@optushome.com.au) Received: from turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org (c220-239-19-236.belrs4.nsw.optusnet.com.au [220.239.19.236]) by mail02.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id k7R73wnf028474 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Sun, 27 Aug 2006 17:03:58 +1000 Received: from turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org (localhost.vk2pj.dyndns.org [127.0.0.1]) by turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7R73wqb023472; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 17:03:58 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from peter@turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org) Received: (from peter@localhost) by turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org (8.13.6/8.13.6/Submit) id k7R73wDa023471; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 17:03:58 +1000 (EST) (envelope-from peter) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 17:03:58 +1000 From: Peter Jeremy To: "Marc G. Fournier" Message-ID: <20060827070358.GJ16768@turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060826112115.GG16768@turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <20060826132138.H82634@hub.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="F4+N/OgRSdC8YnqX" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20060826132138.H82634@hub.org> X-PGP-Key: http://members.optusnet.com.au/peterjeremy/pubkey.asc User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.12-2006-07-14 Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 07:04:01 -0000 --F4+N/OgRSdC8YnqX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, 2006-Aug-26 13:31:24 -0300, Marc G. Fournier wrote: >On Sat, 26 Aug 2006, Peter Jeremy wrote: >>I also feel that the existing implementation has a fairly serious >>defect: It only works on systems that have a direct connection to the >>Internet. This means that I can install it on my systems at home >>(where I have a transparent proxy) but not on the twenty (or so) >>systems that I manage at work - which either have no Internet access >>or require an authenticated proxy for Internet access. > >Unfortunately, I have no ideas on how to get around that issue ... for=20 >instance, the authenticated proxy issue, is there an ENV variable that can= =20 >be set in the script, so that we'd have a variable in periodic.conf to=20 >allow for user/pass/host? You can pass proxy and authentication details to fetch via environment variables. At work, we use a common password for purposes with (IMO) radically different security requirements so I'm not willing to put my the proxy authentication details into rc.conf. >But, the 'no Internet access' is very difficult, if not impossible, to=20 >work around, no? Would 'submit by email' work for something like that?=20 >I'm assuming that although those 20 don't have Internet, they are=20 >connected to some sort of network? I have about 8 hosts being used as firewallk on the far end of dial- on-demand links. The have local networks attached to them but effectively the only way out would be e-mail (probably manually forwarded via root). --=20 Peter Jeremy --F4+N/OgRSdC8YnqX Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFE8UPe/opHv/APuIcRAiYdAJ9q/kgLN2wnAqqsl1yLA0iwpaDHdgCfdv5l fQJ61kvXi47Xy8V/v0zxzzU= =TXMH -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --F4+N/OgRSdC8YnqX-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 27 23:00:06 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EE9716A4E7 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 23:00:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from simon@zaphod.nitro.dk) Received: from mx.nitro.dk (zarniwoop.nitro.dk [83.92.207.38]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8005743D45 for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 23:00:04 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from simon@zaphod.nitro.dk) Received: from zaphod.nitro.dk (unknown [192.168.3.39]) by mx.nitro.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F3A532E42B; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 23:00:03 +0000 (UTC) Received: by zaphod.nitro.dk (Postfix, from userid 3000) id 860E311437; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 01:00:03 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 01:00:03 +0200 From: "Simon L. Nielsen" To: "Marc G. Fournier" Message-ID: <20060827230002.GG1149@zaphod.nitro.dk> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11 Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 23:00:06 -0000 On 2006.08.25 23:36:12 -0300, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > In getting this into the base system itself? Opt-in, default turned off, > of course, but maybe as an option in sysinstall to be enabled easily? What is the advantage of having it in the base system compared to ports? -- Simon L. Nielsen From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 00:01:55 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F198416A4E0; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:01:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from hub.org (hub.org [200.46.204.220]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56D0943D46; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:01:55 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from localhost (wm.hub.org [200.46.204.128]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C97D2290C74; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 21:01:43 -0300 (ADT) Received: from hub.org ([200.46.204.220]) by localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.204.128]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 32241-03; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:01:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: by hub.org (Postfix, from userid 1046) id 45404291AFE; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 21:01:43 -0300 (ADT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 402FA290C74; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 21:01:43 -0300 (ADT) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 21:01:43 -0300 (ADT) From: "Marc G. Fournier" X-X-Sender: freebsd@hub.org To: "Simon L. Nielsen" In-Reply-To: <20060827230002.GG1149@zaphod.nitro.dk> Message-ID: <20060827205909.K82634@hub.org> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060827230002.GG1149@zaphod.nitro.dk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:01:56 -0000 On Mon, 28 Aug 2006, Simon L. Nielsen wrote: > On 2006.08.25 23:36:12 -0300, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > >> In getting this into the base system itself? Opt-in, default turned off, >> of course, but maybe as an option in sysinstall to be enabled easily? > > What is the advantage of having it in the base system compared to > ports? IMHO, official recognition ... more ppl will hopefully enable/use it if its part of the system itself, vs a "third party add on", which ports tends to denote ... From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 00:08:33 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6CF616A4DA; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:08:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from max@love2party.net) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.171]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3713043D45; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:08:32 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from max@love2party.net) Received: from [88.64.179.192] (helo=amd64.laiers.local) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu3) with ESMTP (Nemesis), id 0MKxQS-1GHUg33HeX-0002yL; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 02:08:32 +0200 From: Max Laier Organization: FreeBSD To: "Marc G. Fournier" Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 02:08:18 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.3 References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <200608261848.16513.max@love2party.net> <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> In-Reply-To: <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> X-Face: ,,8R(x[kmU]tKN@>gtH1yQE4aslGdu+2]; R]*pL,U>^H?)gW@49@wdJ`H<=?utf-8?q?=25=7D*=5FBD=0A=09U=5For=3D=5CmOZf764=26nYj=3DJYbR1PW0ud?=>|!~,,CPC.1-D$FG@0h3#'5"k{V]a~.<=?utf-8?q?mZ=7D44=23Se=7Em=0A=09Fe=7E=5C=5DX5B=5D=5Fxj?=(ykz9QKMw_l0C2AQ]}Ym8)fU MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart578362751.8647uzHTex"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <200608280208.29733.max@love2party.net> X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de login:61c499deaeeba3ba5be80f48ecc83056 Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:08:33 -0000 --nextPart578362751.8647uzHTex Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On Saturday 26 August 2006 22:08, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > On Sat, 26 Aug 2006, Max Laier wrote: > > fetch(3) makes use of a couple of environment vars to set proxy and > > authentification - this should be reuseable. I haven't looked at > > BSDStats yet, but if you use fetch - just make sure you have the ENV > > and things work. > > Anyone with an Authenticated Proxy able to code up a patch for this? > > > I guess the easiest way, would be an email to root@ which can be > > forwarded to you. This way you can enable it by default and the > > operator can still decide if they want to take part in the process. > > Actually, email would provide no ability to do the 'request-challenge' > that we have currently implemented in an effort to *reduce* (although I > know it won't eliminate) ppl "spamming" the system ...=20 You can do as all the other websites and email a "confirmation link" back=20 to the sender that they have to click on in order to commit the data to=20 the system. > the=20 > authenticated proxy issue, IMHO, doesn't negate the r-c system, since > we aren't basing anything, *except* country, on the IP itself ... > > So, although using http won't allow *all* hosts to participate, our > hope is that it will provide enough numbers with suitable > checks-n-balances as to make the #s viable, and realistic ... =2D-=20 /"\ Best regards, | mlaier@freebsd.org \ / Max Laier | ICQ #67774661 X http://pf4freebsd.love2party.net/ | mlaier@EFnet / \ ASCII Ribbon Campaign | Against HTML Mail and News --nextPart578362751.8647uzHTex Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQBE8jP9XyyEoT62BG0RAtU3AJ4vREY53KEz1xKGhuhnTsDSUJQqHACfdcUH hMfY01Ai0EKDs1RyLNhxPDI= =8eQ7 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart578362751.8647uzHTex-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 00:18:33 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1458316A4DD; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:18:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from hub.org (hub.org [200.46.204.220]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65CBE43D46; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:18:32 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.208.251]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1603B291AFE; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 21:18:21 -0300 (ADT) Received: from hub.org ([200.46.204.220]) by localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.208.251]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 52175-05; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 21:18:31 -0300 (ADT) Received: by hub.org (Postfix, from userid 1046) id E89E0291B01; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 21:18:19 -0300 (ADT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE46F291AFE; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 21:18:19 -0300 (ADT) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 21:18:19 -0300 (ADT) From: "Marc G. Fournier" X-X-Sender: freebsd@hub.org To: Max Laier In-Reply-To: <200608280208.29733.max@love2party.net> Message-ID: <20060827211100.N82634@hub.org> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <200608261848.16513.max@love2party.net> <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> <200608280208.29733.max@love2party.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: "Marc G. Fournier" , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:18:33 -0000 On Mon, 28 Aug 2006, Max Laier wrote: >> Actually, email would provide no ability to do the 'request-challenge' >> that we have currently implemented in an effort to *reduce* (although I >> know it won't eliminate) ppl "spamming" the system ... > > You can do as all the other websites and email a "confirmation link" > back to the sender that they have to click on in order to commit the > data to the system. Hrmmm, that's an idea ... k, it will involve a multie step process per server though ... run script, which sends the IDTOKEN to server ... server sends back email wtih confirmation link, which would return the two lines in /var/db/bsdstats that you'd have to cut-n-paste to the file, and then re-run the script a second time to actually send the data ... the only thing that needs the 'confirmation' step is getting the /var/db/bsdstats populated with valid data ... after that, the data only needs to be sent in, but confirmed, since the data in /var/db/bsdstats is the confirmation ... so subsequent months the data would just need to be 'bounced' through ... Does that sound reasonable? From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 00:49:04 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D05216A4DD; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:49:04 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd-arch@mawer.org) Received: from mail-ihug.icp-qv1-irony4.iinet.net.au (ihug-mail.icp-qv1-irony4.iinet.net.au [203.59.1.198]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C34243D45; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:49:02 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from fbsd-arch@mawer.org) Received: from 203-206-173-235.perm.iinet.net.au (HELO [127.0.0.1]) ([203.206.173.235]) by mail-ihug.icp-qv1-irony4.iinet.net.au with ESMTP; 28 Aug 2006 08:49:00 +0800 X-BrightmailFiltered: true X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== X-IronPort-AV: i="4.08,174,1154880000"; d="scan'208"; a="869939311:sNHT659450798" Message-ID: <44F23D7A.30604@mawer.org> Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 10:48:58 +1000 From: Antony Mawer User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Windows/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Marc G. Fournier" References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060827230002.GG1149@zaphod.nitro.dk> <20060827205909.K82634@hub.org> In-Reply-To: <20060827205909.K82634@hub.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: "Simon L. Nielsen" , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 00:49:04 -0000 On 28/08/2006 10:01 AM, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > On Mon, 28 Aug 2006, Simon L. Nielsen wrote: > >> On 2006.08.25 23:36:12 -0300, Marc G. Fournier wrote: >> >>> In getting this into the base system itself? Opt-in, default turned >>> off, >>> of course, but maybe as an option in sysinstall to be enabled easily? >> >> What is the advantage of having it in the base system compared to >> ports? > > IMHO, official recognition ... more ppl will hopefully enable/use it if > its part of the system itself, vs a "third party add on", which ports > tends to denote ... Not to mention it reduces the barrier to entry. It's a lot easier to drop 2 lines in your periodic.conf and be done than to require someone to update their ports tree, install the port, and then add the two lines. The less steps (and thus effort) required, the more participation we hope to get... -Antony From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 01:15:18 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEA0C16A4E0 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 01:15:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rnsanchez@gmail.com) Received: from py-out-1112.google.com (py-out-1112.google.com [64.233.166.182]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B586943D45 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 01:15:07 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from rnsanchez@gmail.com) Received: by py-out-1112.google.com with SMTP id o67so2097789pye for ; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 18:15:07 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:x-mailer:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=Uxdsbl05Fkial81F9Kfgx762TxfCLKbzApBrdORD6LghIv4vcI8I7aOThYCrKmoDP6IUc4FohrKEVZ1IkSaTgcTp+xzF8gP9+kwbesdkKYDhjh417m9LbkLf/4qaX/Ly5Bdx6uwc81uXqPjoho07HdiEm31hseA7P1T1ia43/jY= Received: by 10.65.114.16 with SMTP id r16mr6108013qbm; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 18:15:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sauron.lan.box ( [200.180.175.19]) by mx.gmail.com with ESMTP id 1sm3983929qbh.2006.08.27.18.15.04; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 18:15:07 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 22:15:02 -0300 From: Ricardo Nabinger Sanchez To: Antony Mawer Message-Id: <20060827221502.56976f1c.rnsanchez@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <44F23D7A.30604@mawer.org> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060827230002.GG1149@zaphod.nitro.dk> <20060827205909.K82634@hub.org> <44F23D7A.30604@mawer.org> X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 2.2.7 (GTK+ 2.8.20; i386-portbld-freebsd6.1) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: "Marc G. Fournier" , "Simon L. Nielsen" , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 01:15:18 -0000 On Mon, 28 Aug 2006 10:48:58 +1000, Antony Mawer wrote: > Not to mention it reduces the barrier to entry. It's a lot easier to > drop 2 lines in your periodic.conf and be done than to require someone > to update their ports tree, install the port, and then add the two lines. That would be even easier if the dropping of 2 lines was carried out automatically. I know people lazy enough to deinstall a port if they must do any post-config for themselves ("make deinstall" is easier than thinking for a few seconds). Just for the records, I'm *not* one of them: % cat /etc/periodic.conf monthly_statistics_enable=yes monthly_statistics_report_devices=yes I can see some of my odd hardware in the stats page! ;) -- Ricardo Nabinger Sanchez Powered by FreeBSD "Left to themselves, things tend to go from bad to worse." From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 01:59:37 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 600BD16A4E0; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 01:59:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from hub.org (hub.org [200.46.204.220]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8B8643D60; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 01:59:33 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from localhost (wm.hub.org [200.46.204.128]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7599A290C74; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 22:59:21 -0300 (ADT) Received: from hub.org ([200.46.204.220]) by localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.204.128]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 69662-04; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 01:59:33 +0000 (UTC) Received: by hub.org (Postfix, from userid 1046) id D0F60291AFE; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 22:59:20 -0300 (ADT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6925290C74; Sun, 27 Aug 2006 22:59:20 -0300 (ADT) Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2006 22:59:20 -0300 (ADT) From: "Marc G. Fournier" X-X-Sender: freebsd@hub.org To: Ricardo Nabinger Sanchez In-Reply-To: <20060827221502.56976f1c.rnsanchez@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20060827225631.K82634@hub.org> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060827230002.GG1149@zaphod.nitro.dk> <20060827205909.K82634@hub.org> <44F23D7A.30604@mawer.org> <20060827221502.56976f1c.rnsanchez@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: "Marc G. Fournier" , Antony Mawer , "Simon L. Nielsen" , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 01:59:37 -0000 On Sun, 27 Aug 2006, Ricardo Nabinger Sanchez wrote: > On Mon, 28 Aug 2006 10:48:58 +1000, Antony Mawer > wrote: > >> Not to mention it reduces the barrier to entry. It's a lot easier to >> drop 2 lines in your periodic.conf and be done than to require someone >> to update their ports tree, install the port, and then add the two lines. > > That would be even easier if the dropping of 2 lines was carried out > automatically. I know people lazy enough to deinstall a port if they must > do any post-config for themselves ("make deinstall" is easier than thinking > for a few seconds). There are several things I want to work on when I get back onto a 'real network' next week ... Matt @ Dragonfly has asked for some 'network detection' code to be added, to check if there is even a network connected, before he'll add it to there base system ... and someone else suggested adding code similar to postfix's port to have *it* prompt and auto-add the appropriate lines to /etc/periodic.conf ... Plus, of course, next phase being to try and get a simple email system in place as described by Max for those 'hard to reach places' ... But, again, those are all extensions to, and don't affect the backend ... the changes discussed as needing to be worked on will not cause problems for v3.x or newer clients ... From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 02:07:56 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3441116A4DF; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 02:07:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd-arch@mawer.org) Received: from mail-ihug.icp-qv1-irony5.iinet.net.au (ihug-mail.icp-qv1-irony5.iinet.net.au [203.59.1.199]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFB5243D45; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 02:07:54 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from fbsd-arch@mawer.org) Received: from 203-206-173-235.perm.iinet.net.au (HELO [127.0.0.1]) ([203.206.173.235]) by mail-ihug.icp-qv1-irony5.iinet.net.au with ESMTP; 28 Aug 2006 10:07:32 +0800 X-BrightmailFiltered: true X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== X-IronPort-AV: i="4.08,174,1154880000"; d="scan'208"; a="893397245:sNHT573896420" Message-ID: <44F24FC0.8010800@mawer.org> Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:06:56 +1000 From: Antony Mawer User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Windows/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Marc G. Fournier" References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060827230002.GG1149@zaphod.nitro.dk> <20060827205909.K82634@hub.org> <44F23D7A.30604@mawer.org> <20060827221502.56976f1c.rnsanchez@gmail.com> <20060827225631.K82634@hub.org> In-Reply-To: <20060827225631.K82634@hub.org> Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------050202080406070405030103" Cc: "Simon L. Nielsen" , Antony Mawer , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 02:07:56 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------050202080406070405030103 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 28/08/2006 11:59 AM, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > On Sun, 27 Aug 2006, Ricardo Nabinger Sanchez wrote: >> That would be even easier if the dropping of 2 lines was carried out >> automatically. I know people lazy enough to deinstall a port if they >> must >> do any post-config for themselves ("make deinstall" is easier than >> thinking >> for a few seconds). > > There are several things I want to work on when I get back onto a 'real > network' next week ... Matt @ Dragonfly has asked for some 'network > detection' code to be added, to check if there is even a network > connected, before he'll add it to there base system ... and someone else > suggested adding code similar to postfix's port to have *it* prompt and > auto-add the appropriate lines to /etc/periodic.conf ... That may have been me :-) Here's a patch that implements something along those lines... anyone care to review/comment on the attached patch? I've only tested it very briefly but it appears to do the desired job... One thing that would be nice to do is to update any existing lines for the stats, rather than always adding new lines if the user answers 'y'... detecting existing lines could easily be done by sourcing the periodic.conf: . /etc/periodic.conf at the top of the file, but I'm not sure the preferred way on how you'd update any existng lines if changes were required... perhaps some grep/sed-foo magic? :-) Cheers Antony --------------050202080406070405030103 Content-Type: text/plain; name="bsdstats.patch" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="bsdstats.patch" diff -Nru bsdstats.old/Makefile bsdstats/Makefile --- bsdstats.old/Makefile Mon Aug 28 11:46:22 2006 +++ bsdstats/Makefile Mon Aug 28 12:01:14 2006 @@ -26,5 +26,14 @@ ${CP} ${FILESDIR}/300.statistics ${LOCALBASE}/etc/periodic/monthly post-install: ${CAT} ${PKGMESSAGE} +.if defined(BATCH) || defined(PACKAGE_BUILDING) + @${ECHO_MSG} " To activate monthly statistics reporting in /etc/periodic.conf," + @${ECHO_MSG} " execute the following as root user:" + @${ECHO_MSG} + @${ECHO_MSG} "PKG_PREFIX=\"${PREFIX}\" ${SH} ${PKGINSTALL} ${PKGNAME} POST-INSTALL" + @${ECHO_MSG} +.else + @PKG_PREFIX="${PREFIX}" ${SH} ${PKGINSTALL} ${PKGNAME} POST-INSTALL +.endif .include diff -Nru bsdstats.old/pkg-install bsdstats/pkg-install --- bsdstats.old/pkg-install Thu Jan 1 10:00:00 1970 +++ bsdstats/pkg-install Mon Aug 28 11:59:55 2006 @@ -0,0 +1,43 @@ +#!/bin/sh +# +# pkg-install : based off /usr/ports/mail/courier/files/pkg-install.in +# + +ask() { + local question default answer + + question=$1 + default=$2 + if [ -z "${PACKAGE_BUILDING}" ]; then + read -p "${question} [${default}]? " answer + fi + if [ -z "${answer}" ]; then + answer=${default} + fi + echo ${answer} +} + +yesno() { + local question default answer + + question=$1 + default=$2 + while :; do + answer=$(ask "${question}" "${default}") + case "${answer}" in + [Yy]*) return 0;; + [Nn]*) return 1;; + esac + echo "Please answer yes or no." + done +} + +if [ ":$2" = ":POST-INSTALL" ]; then + if yesno "Would you like to activate monthly reporting in /etc/periodic.conf" n; then + echo "monthly_statistics_enable=\"YES\"" >> /etc/periodic.conf + if yesno "Would you like to send a list of installed hardware as well" n; then + echo "monthly_statistics_report_devices=\"YES\"" >> /etc/periodic.conf + fi + fi +fi + --------------050202080406070405030103-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 13:03:02 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC34716A4DA; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:03:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: from sccmmhc91.asp.att.net (sccmmhc91.asp.att.net [204.127.203.211]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01BCC43D6B; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:03:01 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: from lor.one-eyed-alien.net ([12.207.12.9]) by sccmmhc91.asp.att.net (sccmmhc91) with ESMTP id <20060828130300m910087ah4e>; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:03:00 +0000 Received: from lor.one-eyed-alien.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lor.one-eyed-alien.net (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SD2pIf078052; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 08:02:51 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: (from brooks@localhost) by lor.one-eyed-alien.net (8.13.6/8.13.6/Submit) id k7SD2l2f078051; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 08:02:47 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from brooks) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 08:02:47 -0500 From: Brooks Davis To: "Marc G. Fournier" Message-ID: <20060828130247.GA77702@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060826112115.GG16768@turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <20060826132138.H82634@hub.org> <200608261848.16513.max@love2party.net> <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="k1lZvvs/B4yU6o8G" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11 Cc: Max Laier , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:03:02 -0000 --k1lZvvs/B4yU6o8G Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, Aug 26, 2006 at 05:08:57PM -0300, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > On Sat, 26 Aug 2006, Max Laier wrote: >=20 > >fetch(3) makes use of a couple of environment vars to set proxy and=20 > >authentification - this should be reuseable. I haven't looked at=20 > >BSDStats yet, but if you use fetch - just make sure you have the ENV and= =20 > >things work. >=20 > Anyone with an Authenticated Proxy able to code up a patch for this? >=20 > >I guess the easiest way, would be an email to root@ which can be=20 > >forwarded to you. This way you can enable it by default and the=20 > >operator can still decide if they want to take part in the process. >=20 > Actually, email would provide no ability to do the 'request-challenge'=20 > that we have currently implemented in an effort to *reduce* (although I= =20 > know it won't eliminate) ppl "spamming" the system ... the authenticated= =20 > proxy issue, IMHO, doesn't negate the r-c system, since we aren't basing= =20 > anything, *except* country, on the IP itself ... >=20 > So, although using http won't allow *all* hosts to participate, our hope= =20 > is that it will provide enough numbers with suitable checks-n-balances as= =20 > to make the #s viable, and realistic ... While I understand (or think I understand) the motivations for this design goal, it's contrary to allowing collection of statistics from many people. I'd love to be able to publish data from the FreeBSD systems (300+) at work, but unless I can do it in an anonymized aggregate form it's not going to happen. I just can't justify leaking that much internal configuration information given a policy of hiding it (right or wrong and not subject to debate). If I could run my own stats server and publish from it that might be possible. -- Brooks --k1lZvvs/B4yU6o8G Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFE8ul2XY6L6fI4GtQRAly/AJ9XzZJ8kPsQaXa7vOaNuUrlAVAcjgCeJdE5 jNedijNYyEEEY/nmapDubQ4= =LHlg -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --k1lZvvs/B4yU6o8G-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 16:16:42 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1843916A4DD for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:16:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from darren@nighttide.net) Received: from olmec.nighttide.net (jasper.nighttide.net [207.5.141.146]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2A9843D67 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:16:37 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from darren@nighttide.net) Received: from olmec.nighttide.net (darren@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by olmec.nighttide.net (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7SGGa5G020060 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:16:36 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from darren@nighttide.net) Received: from localhost (darren@localhost) by olmec.nighttide.net (8.13.6/8.13.6/Submit) with ESMTP id k7SGGamU020057 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:16:36 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from darren@nighttide.net) X-Authentication-Warning: olmec.nighttide.net: darren owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 12:16:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Darren Henderson To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <20060827225631.K82634@hub.org> Message-ID: <20060828120755.R19342@olmec> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060827230002.GG1149@zaphod.nitro.dk> <20060827205909.K82634@hub.org> <44F23D7A.30604@mawer.org> <20060827221502.56976f1c.rnsanchez@gmail.com> <20060827225631.K82634@hub.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 16:16:42 -0000 My unsolicited opinion on this would be that anything vaguely "phone home"'ish should only be done through the ports mechanism regardless of whether it is opt-in or not. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 17:27:45 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B898516A4FD for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:27:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gad@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp6.server.rpi.edu (smtp6.server.rpi.edu [128.113.2.226]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 922E343D55 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:27:31 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from gad@FreeBSD.org) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.netel.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by smtp6.server.rpi.edu (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7SHRTrY004891; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:27:30 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:27:28 -0400 To: "Marc G. Fournier" , freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org From: Garance A Drosehn Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-CanItPRO-Stream: default X-RPI-SA-Score: undef - spam-scanning disabled X-Scanned-By: CanIt (www . canit . ca) Cc: Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:27:45 -0000 At 11:36 PM -0300 8/25/06, Marc G. Fournier wrote: >In getting this into the base system itself? Opt-in, >default turned off, of course, but maybe as an option >in sysinstall to be enabled easily? I think it should be like perl or X11. Have it available on the first installation CD, and easily selectable, but not in the freebsd base system. I think it would be best for it to remain a separate port. -- Garance Alistair Drosehn = drosehn@rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or gad@FreeBSD.org Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute; Troy, NY; USA From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 20:03:50 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CCE416A4DD; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:03:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from hub.org (hub.org [200.46.204.220]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5117743D4C; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:03:42 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from localhost (wm.hub.org [200.46.204.128]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82C9D291B01; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:03:39 -0300 (ADT) Received: from hub.org ([200.46.204.220]) by localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.204.128]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 77754-02; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:03:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: by hub.org (Postfix, from userid 1046) id D609A291B06; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:03:38 -0300 (ADT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC50E291B01; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:03:38 -0300 (ADT) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:03:38 -0300 (ADT) From: "Marc G. Fournier" X-X-Sender: freebsd@hub.org To: Garance A Drosehn In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20060828170232.Q82634@hub.org> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:03:50 -0000 On Mon, 28 Aug 2006, Garance A Drosehn wrote: > At 11:36 PM -0300 8/25/06, Marc G. Fournier wrote: >> In getting this into the base system itself? Opt-in, >> default turned off, of course, but maybe as an option >> in sysinstall to be enabled easily? > > I think it should be like perl or X11. Have it available > on the first installation CD, and easily selectable, but > not in the freebsd base system. I think it would be best > for it to remain a separate port. That works too ... all I'm looking for is high enough visibility that ppl know its there ... this is something meant to benefit us all in the long term, but the faster / easier it can be deployed, the sooner useful numbers will be generated ... From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 20:07:53 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64DCD16A4DF; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:07:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from hub.org (hub.org [200.46.204.220]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4377043D46; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:07:51 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.208.251]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1958291B01; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:07:47 -0300 (ADT) Received: from hub.org ([200.46.204.220]) by localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.208.251]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 86158-08; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:07:49 -0300 (ADT) Received: by hub.org (Postfix, from userid 1046) id DB8B5291B06; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:07:46 -0300 (ADT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB565291B01; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:07:46 -0300 (ADT) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:07:46 -0300 (ADT) From: "Marc G. Fournier" X-X-Sender: freebsd@hub.org To: Brooks Davis In-Reply-To: <20060828130247.GA77702@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> Message-ID: <20060828170450.M82634@hub.org> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060826112115.GG16768@turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <20060826132138.H82634@hub.org> <200608261848.16513.max@love2party.net> <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> <20060828130247.GA77702@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: Max Laier , "Marc G. Fournier" , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:07:53 -0000 On Mon, 28 Aug 2006, Brooks Davis wrote: > While I understand (or think I understand) the motivations for this > design goal, it's contrary to allowing collection of statistics from > many people. I'd love to be able to publish data from the FreeBSD > systems (300+) at work, but unless I can do it in an anonymized > aggregate form it's not going to happen. I just can't justify leaking > that much internal configuration information given a policy of hiding it > (right or wrong and not subject to debate). If I could run my own stats > server and publish from it that might be possible. Agreggate submissions will never be possible, as it will definitely break any attempts at keeping the data 'clean' :( I do understand that we will never be able to get *everyone* reporting, but we will try as much as possible to make it easy for as many as possible to report *within* limits ... I'm going to work on an 'email submission' method in September, that would allow repoting to go *thru* one mailbox, and will include a confirmation/challenge stage *per* server though ... From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 20:49:29 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D60916A4DF for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:49:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: from hydrogen.funkthat.com (gate.funkthat.com [69.17.45.168]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8BF343DAB for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:49:09 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: from hydrogen.funkthat.com (kjxi0oarywzqthid@localhost.funkthat.com [127.0.0.1]) by hydrogen.funkthat.com (8.13.6/8.13.3) with ESMTP id k7SKn9dt013850 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:49:09 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.funkthat.com (8.13.6/8.13.3/Submit) id k7SKn8GO013849 for freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:49:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmg) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:49:08 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Message-ID: <20060828204908.GI37035@funkthat.com> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.4-RELEASE-p6 i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ X-Resume: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/resume.html Cc: Subject: msgbuf default size... X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:49:29 -0000 Well, today w/ PCIe around the corner (or in some cases already here), and some relatively complex PCI debug output, normal dmesg when booted -v is now well over the default of 32k meaning that basic info such as memory size and processor type are no longer stored in /var/run/dmesg.boot if booted -v... Already amd64 has acknoledged the issue and defaults to 64k... I believe we should make the default 64k, and let other platforms, like arm, use DEFAULTS to change it to smaller values if necessary... Anyone have any objections to this? On my recent box I built (AMD X2 3800+ w/ Gigabyte mobo), the /var/run/dmesg.boot starts w/: pci_link19: Links after initial validation: Index IRQ Rtd Ref IRQs 0 255 N 0 5 7 9 10 11 14 15 w/ a larger msgbuf size I end up w/: -bash-2.05b$ wc -c dmesg.boot 46362 dmesg.boot -bash-2.05b$ head -n 3 dmesg.boot Copyright (c) 1992-2006 The FreeBSD Project. Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994 The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved. -bash-2.05b$ grep -n '^pci_link19: Links after initial validation' dmesg.boot 381:pci_link19: Links after initial validation: -- John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 415 225 5579 "All that I will do, has been done, All that I have, has not." From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 21:33:37 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D75516A4ED for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:33:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from phk@phk.freebsd.dk) Received: from phk.freebsd.dk (phk.freebsd.dk [130.225.244.222]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E3C843D79 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:33:32 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from phk@phk.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (critter.freebsd.dk [192.168.48.2]) by phk.freebsd.dk (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD40C170C5; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:33:31 +0000 (UTC) To: John-Mark Gurney From: "Poul-Henning Kamp" In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 28 Aug 2006 13:49:08 MST." <20060828204908.GI37035@funkthat.com> Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:33:31 +0000 Message-ID: <7781.1156800811@critter.freebsd.dk> Cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: msgbuf default size... X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:33:37 -0000 In message <20060828204908.GI37035@funkthat.com>, John-Mark Gurney writes: >I believe we should make the default 64k, and let other platforms, >like arm, use DEFAULTS to change it to smaller values if necessary... Better idea: if (ram <= 16MB) msgbuf_size = 8k else if (ram <= 64MB) msgbuf_size = 16k else if (ram <= 512MB) msgbuf_size = 32k else msgbuf_size = 64k -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 phk@FreeBSD.ORG | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 28 21:47:15 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75AFB16A4DE for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:47:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: from hydrogen.funkthat.com (gate.funkthat.com [69.17.45.168]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85D2C43D53 for ; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:47:14 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: from hydrogen.funkthat.com (51o04epte4o9go2z@localhost.funkthat.com [127.0.0.1]) by hydrogen.funkthat.com (8.13.6/8.13.3) with ESMTP id k7SLlD9b014874; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:47:13 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.funkthat.com (8.13.6/8.13.3/Submit) id k7SLlCSu014873; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:47:12 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmg) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 14:47:12 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: Poul-Henning Kamp Message-ID: <20060828214712.GJ37035@funkthat.com> Mail-Followup-To: Poul-Henning Kamp , freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org References: <20060828204908.GI37035@funkthat.com> <7781.1156800811@critter.freebsd.dk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <7781.1156800811@critter.freebsd.dk> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.4-RELEASE-p6 i386 X-PGP-Fingerprint: B7 EC EF F8 AE ED A7 31 96 7A 22 B3 D8 56 36 F4 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ X-Resume: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/resume.html Cc: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: msgbuf default size... X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:47:15 -0000 Poul-Henning Kamp wrote this message on Mon, Aug 28, 2006 at 21:33 +0000: > In message <20060828204908.GI37035@funkthat.com>, John-Mark Gurney writes: > > >I believe we should make the default 64k, and let other platforms, > >like arm, use DEFAULTS to change it to smaller values if necessary... > > Better idea: I'd give you: > if (ram <= 64MB) > msgbuf_size = 8k > else > msgbuf_size = 64k But anyone who is installing -current on a low memory system these days are going to be tweaking and building custom kernels already... why can't they tweak this option along w/ the rest? (look at Warner's work to break out the PHY's) Currently, this is a compile time only option, so changing this based upon memory will be a bit more complicated than just adding the pseudo code above... -- John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 415 225 5579 "All that I will do, has been done, All that I have, has not." From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 29 01:40:24 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2866A16A4DE; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 01:40:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd-arch@mawer.org) Received: from mail-ihug.icp-qv1-irony6.iinet.net.au (ihug-mail.icp-qv1-irony6.iinet.net.au [203.59.1.224]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9BAE43D46; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 01:40:22 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from fbsd-arch@mawer.org) Received: from 203-206-173-235.perm.iinet.net.au (HELO [127.0.0.1]) ([203.206.173.235]) by mail-ihug.icp-qv1-irony6.iinet.net.au with ESMTP; 29 Aug 2006 09:40:21 +0800 X-BrightmailFiltered: true X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== X-IronPort-AV: i="4.08,177,1154880000"; d="scan'208"; a="432546790:sNHT14961892" Message-ID: <44F39ACB.6090703@mawer.org> Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 11:39:23 +1000 From: Antony Mawer User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Windows/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Marc G. Fournier" References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060826112115.GG16768@turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <20060826132138.H82634@hub.org> <200608261848.16513.max@love2party.net> <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> <20060828130247.GA77702@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> <20060828170450.M82634@hub.org> In-Reply-To: <20060828170450.M82634@hub.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Max Laier , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 01:40:24 -0000 On 29/08/2006 6:07 AM, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > On Mon, 28 Aug 2006, Brooks Davis wrote: > >> While I understand (or think I understand) the motivations for this >> design goal, it's contrary to allowing collection of statistics from >> many people. I'd love to be able to publish data from the FreeBSD >> systems (300+) at work, but unless I can do it in an anonymized >> aggregate form it's not going to happen. I just can't justify leaking >> that much internal configuration information given a policy of hiding >> it (right or wrong and not subject to debate). If I could run my own >> stats server and publish from it that might be possible. > > Agreggate submissions will never be possible, as it will definitely > break any attempts at keeping the data 'clean' :( I do understand that > we will never be able to get *everyone* reporting, but we will try as > much as possible to make it easy for as many as possible to report > *within* limits ... > > I'm going to work on an 'email submission' method in September, that > would allow repoting to go *thru* one mailbox, and will include a > confirmation/challenge stage *per* server though ... Brooks, what sort of information are you looking to "anonymise" before sending it out? Aggregating to say that I have X of this kind of CPU, Y of this IDE chipset, etc, rather than linking it specifically to each machine? Where would you feel a comfortable balance lay? Obviously some effort needs to be made to minimise fraudulent entries Perhaps aggregate submissions could be conducted using a registration mechanism... Other thoughts would be having a local stats aggregation server that pushes summaries up to the master server... the aggregation server keeps the individual details, and some sort of challenge mechanism could be randomly selected by the master server to reduce the ease with which the numbers can be 'faked'? ... just rambling as I thought of potential ways around this ... From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 29 01:53:34 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E857B16A4DA; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 01:53:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: from sccmmhc92.asp.att.net (sccmmhc92.asp.att.net [204.127.203.212]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49A8143D45; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 01:53:33 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: from lor.one-eyed-alien.net ([12.207.12.9]) by sccmmhc92.asp.att.net (sccmmhc92) with ESMTP id <20060829015321m92000vrd1e>; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 01:53:32 +0000 Received: from lor.one-eyed-alien.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lor.one-eyed-alien.net (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T1rHb3006856; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:53:17 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: (from brooks@localhost) by lor.one-eyed-alien.net (8.13.6/8.13.6/Submit) id k7T1r7p0006855; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:53:07 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from brooks) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 20:53:06 -0500 From: Brooks Davis To: Antony Mawer Message-ID: <20060829015306.GA6722@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060826112115.GG16768@turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <20060826132138.H82634@hub.org> <200608261848.16513.max@love2party.net> <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> <20060828130247.GA77702@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> <20060828170450.M82634@hub.org> <44F39ACB.6090703@mawer.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="CE+1k2dSO48ffgeK" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <44F39ACB.6090703@mawer.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11 Cc: Max Laier , "Marc G. Fournier" , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 01:53:34 -0000 --CE+1k2dSO48ffgeK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Aug 29, 2006 at 11:39:23AM +1000, Antony Mawer wrote: > On 29/08/2006 6:07 AM, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > >On Mon, 28 Aug 2006, Brooks Davis wrote: > > > >>While I understand (or think I understand) the motivations for this=20 > >>design goal, it's contrary to allowing collection of statistics from=20 > >>many people. I'd love to be able to publish data from the FreeBSD=20 > >>systems (300+) at work, but unless I can do it in an anonymized=20 > >>aggregate form it's not going to happen. I just can't justify leaking= =20 > >>that much internal configuration information given a policy of hiding= =20 > >>it (right or wrong and not subject to debate). If I could run my own= =20 > >>stats server and publish from it that might be possible. > > > >Agreggate submissions will never be possible, as it will definitely=20 > >break any attempts at keeping the data 'clean' :( I do understand that= =20 > >we will never be able to get *everyone* reporting, but we will try as=20 > >much as possible to make it easy for as many as possible to report=20 > >*within* limits ... > > > >I'm going to work on an 'email submission' method in September, that=20 > >would allow repoting to go *thru* one mailbox, and will include a=20 > >confirmation/challenge stage *per* server though ... >=20 > Brooks, what sort of information are you looking to "anonymise" before=20 > sending it out? Aggregating to say that I have X of this kind of CPU, Y= =20 > of this IDE chipset, etc, rather than linking it specifically to each=20 > machine? Where would you feel a comfortable balance lay? Obviously some= =20 > effort needs to be made to minimise fraudulent entries >=20 > Perhaps aggregate submissions could be conducted using a registration=20 > mechanism... >=20 > Other thoughts would be having a local stats aggregation server that=20 > pushes summaries up to the master server... the aggregation server keeps= =20 > the individual details, and some sort of challenge mechanism could be=20 > randomly selected by the master server to reduce the ease with which the= =20 > numbers can be 'faked'? >=20 > ... just rambling as I thought of potential ways around this ... I'd prefer not to expose host names or IP addresses, hardware information and OS version aren't really a problem if they can't be traced to a host name. The requirement to register an aggregation server would be fine with me. A challenge mechanism would be tricky because it would have to occur during a push to the central server since connects back are not really possible. -- Brooks --CE+1k2dSO48ffgeK Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFE854CXY6L6fI4GtQRAiNjAJ95+utUg1oue72f4HEnOiPQlIZFsACg10m6 0gnnrstXwO/iHCBcl/zqHKE= =N1rs -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --CE+1k2dSO48ffgeK-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 29 02:20:57 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98DCC16A4DF; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 02:20:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fbsd-arch@mawer.org) Received: from mail-ihug.icp-qv1-irony4.iinet.net.au (ihug-mail.icp-qv1-irony4.iinet.net.au [203.59.1.198]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB46743D76; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 02:20:52 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from fbsd-arch@mawer.org) Received: from 203-206-173-235.perm.iinet.net.au (HELO [127.0.0.1]) ([203.206.173.235]) by mail-ihug.icp-qv1-irony4.iinet.net.au with ESMTP; 29 Aug 2006 10:20:51 +0800 X-BrightmailFiltered: true X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== X-IronPort-AV: i="4.08,177,1154880000"; d="scan'208"; a="871623152:sNHT87786908" Message-ID: <44F3A44C.8050401@mawer.org> Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:19:56 +1000 From: Antony Mawer User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Windows/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brooks Davis References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060826112115.GG16768@turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <20060826132138.H82634@hub.org> <200608261848.16513.max@love2party.net> <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> <20060828130247.GA77702@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> <20060828170450.M82634@hub.org> <44F39ACB.6090703@mawer.org> <20060829015306.GA6722@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> In-Reply-To: <20060829015306.GA6722@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Max Laier , "Marc G. Fournier" , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 02:20:57 -0000 On 29/08/2006 11:53 AM, Brooks Davis wrote: > On Tue, Aug 29, 2006 at 11:39:23AM +1000, Antony Mawer wrote: >> Perhaps aggregate submissions could be conducted using a registration >> mechanism... >> >> Other thoughts would be having a local stats aggregation server that >> pushes summaries up to the master server... the aggregation server keeps >> the individual details, and some sort of challenge mechanism could be >> randomly selected by the master server to reduce the ease with which the >> numbers can be 'faked'? > > I'd prefer not to expose host names or IP addresses, hardware > information and OS version aren't really a problem if they can't be > traced to a host name. The requirement to register an aggregation > server would be fine with me. A challenge mechanism would be tricky > because it would have to occur during a push to the central server since > connects back are not really possible. The version 3 update did away with the storing of hostnames and IP addresses on the server side, as well as the submission of them by the client. So you're only exposing the public Internet address of the system during the submission of data, which is not stored in the database. The client "push" mechanism would have to know how to handle any challenges it received from the server and submit the appropriate response. Perhaps a new port, sysutils/bsdstats-relay/, could allow easy installation of some sort of aggregation server... but then you have the issue of requiring things like a web server, some form of database, etc -- vs the simple nature of the client itself that is just a shell script... Marc -- I just noticed the client script still retrieves the hostname and stores it in a local variable, although it is never transmitted. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 29 02:44:43 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F54416A4DD; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 02:44:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: from sccmmhc91.asp.att.net (sccmmhc91.asp.att.net [204.127.203.211]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCDF143D58; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 02:44:42 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: from lor.one-eyed-alien.net ([12.207.12.9]) by sccmmhc91.asp.att.net (sccmmhc91) with ESMTP id <20060829024431m9100h5e9se>; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 02:44:41 +0000 Received: from lor.one-eyed-alien.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lor.one-eyed-alien.net (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7T2iR0Q007199; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:44:28 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: (from brooks@localhost) by lor.one-eyed-alien.net (8.13.6/8.13.6/Submit) id k7T2iLUu007198; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:44:21 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from brooks) Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 21:44:20 -0500 From: Brooks Davis To: Antony Mawer Message-ID: <20060829024420.GA7169@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060826112115.GG16768@turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <20060826132138.H82634@hub.org> <200608261848.16513.max@love2party.net> <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> <20060828130247.GA77702@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> <20060828170450.M82634@hub.org> <44F39ACB.6090703@mawer.org> <20060829015306.GA6722@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> <44F3A44C.8050401@mawer.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="sdtB3X0nJg68CQEu" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <44F3A44C.8050401@mawer.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11 Cc: Max Laier , "Marc G. Fournier" , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 02:44:43 -0000 --sdtB3X0nJg68CQEu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Aug 29, 2006 at 12:19:56PM +1000, Antony Mawer wrote: > On 29/08/2006 11:53 AM, Brooks Davis wrote: > >On Tue, Aug 29, 2006 at 11:39:23AM +1000, Antony Mawer wrote: > >>Perhaps aggregate submissions could be conducted using a registration= =20 > >>mechanism... > >> > >>Other thoughts would be having a local stats aggregation server that=20 > >>pushes summaries up to the master server... the aggregation server keep= s=20 > >>the individual details, and some sort of challenge mechanism could be= =20 > >>randomly selected by the master server to reduce the ease with which th= e=20 > >>numbers can be 'faked'? > > > >I'd prefer not to expose host names or IP addresses, hardware > >information and OS version aren't really a problem if they can't be > >traced to a host name. The requirement to register an aggregation > >server would be fine with me. A challenge mechanism would be tricky > >because it would have to occur during a push to the central server since > >connects back are not really possible. >=20 > The version 3 update did away with the storing of hostnames and IP=20 > addresses on the server side, as well as the submission of them by the=20 > client. So you're only exposing the public Internet address of the=20 > system during the submission of data, which is not stored in the database. >=20 > The client "push" mechanism would have to know how to handle any=20 > challenges it received from the server and submit the appropriate respons= e. >=20 > Perhaps a new port, sysutils/bsdstats-relay/, could allow easy=20 > installation of some sort of aggregation server... but then you have the= =20 > issue of requiring things like a web server, some form of database, etc= =20 > -- vs the simple nature of the client itself that is just a shell script.= =2E. That wouldn't be a big deal. We've got lots of B(L)AMP applications running and plenty of FreeBSD servers to run them on. That might be an option for me. -- Brooks --sdtB3X0nJg68CQEu Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFE86oEXY6L6fI4GtQRAi9bAJsE1hZEBzSY1MLNUgcDd+z1+RdXugCfQp3y PozKKAs2KbEguKw9+Uk2aPk= =W2Rs -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --sdtB3X0nJg68CQEu-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 29 06:22:37 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80DAA16A4DD for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 06:22:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from badaei@yahoo.com) Received: from web55202.mail.re4.yahoo.com (web55202.mail.re4.yahoo.com [206.190.58.166]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with SMTP id E2FED43D58 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 06:22:32 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from badaei@yahoo.com) Received: (qmail 4448 invoked by uid 60001); 29 Aug 2006 06:22:32 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=oOnZZImi1iWQ5W/B6c7zXKcay4GxVvpslpdfGtKVRZWfEpE5rMtTmQtEEFFFSv/TXubG09GVjxa/1FvxpwzCFKkZqHYIaEMPTCR19BVi004E2a9v0qp7ILK0gUQJIUUVQz8GqtBTZ7ijGpeLCFnqVF87YBIA6UW+Buqv1lFBMq0= ; Message-ID: <20060829062232.4446.qmail@web55202.mail.re4.yahoo.com> Received: from [72.134.0.217] by web55202.mail.re4.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 28 Aug 2006 23:22:32 PDT Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2006 23:22:32 -0700 (PDT) From: babak badaei To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: What could cause /DEV to clear out? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: babak badaei List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 06:22:37 -0000 Hello, Today I was not able to log into my machine using SSH. I got this following message "Server refused to allocate pty". I was, somewhat fortunately, able to log using SCP. So SCP works. The file system looked good for the most part; until I checked out "/DEV". Almost everything was GONE! Including MAKEDEV. Not sure what to do. Possible clue: Before this happened, last time I was actually logged in via SSH, I ran a dropdb command on one of my postgres databases and got an error message saying I did not have permission to "/DEV/NULL". Not sure what to do, I set permissions to allow write on "NULL". I have done "dropdb" many times before and had never seen that message. I hope this is in the right forum. This is the closest thing to right place for this question in my mind but if this is in the wrong place please direct me to the right forum. I appreciate your insights and wisdom. Thanks! From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 29 10:14:48 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B1DF16A4DF; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 10:14:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FF8443D53; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 10:14:46 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (sxeryj@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k7TAEe0M008050; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:14:45 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id k7TAEerO008049; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:14:40 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from olli) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:14:40 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <200608291014.k7TAEerO008049@lurza.secnetix.de> From: Oliver Fromme To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG, babak badaei In-Reply-To: <20060829062232.4446.qmail@web55202.mail.re4.yahoo.com> X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd-arch User-Agent: tin/1.8.0-20051224 ("Ronay") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.11-STABLE (i386)) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:14:45 +0200 (CEST) Cc: Subject: Re: What could cause /DEV to clear out? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG, babak badaei List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 10:14:48 -0000 babak badaei wrote: > Today I was not able to log into my machine using SSH. I got this > following message "Server refused to allocate pty". I was, somewhat > fortunately, able to log using SCP. So SCP works. You can use "ssh -T" which disables allocation of a pty (pseudo tty). You probably won't be able to use full- screen programs (such as vi), and maybe your shell's editing functions won't work (depending on the shell), but at least you will get a shell prompt. See the ssh(1) manual page for details. > The file system > looked good for the most part; until I checked out "/DEV". Almost > everything was GONE! Including MAKEDEV. Not sure what to do. What version of FreeBSD are you running? FreeBSD 5 and 6 use DEVFS, so MAKEDEV isn't required anymore (it wouldn't work anyway). If you're still running FreeBSD 4, then there should be /dev/MAKEDEV. > Possible clue: Before this happened, last time I was actually > logged in via SSH, I ran a dropdb command on one of my postgres > databases and got an error message saying I did not have permission > to "/DEV/NULL". Not sure what to do, I set permissions to allow write > on "NULL". I have done "dropdb" many times before and had never seen > that message. Please give the output from these commands: uname -a ls -al /dev mount | grep dev > I hope this is in the right forum. This is the closest thing to right > place for this question in my mind but if this is in the wrong place > please direct me to the right forum. Why do you think -arch would be the most appropriate place? This should rather go to -questions (I've redirected it). Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing Dienstleistungen mit Schwerpunkt FreeBSD: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd Any opinions expressed in this message may be personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix in any way. "anyone new to programming should be kept as far from C++ as possible; actually showing the stuff should be considered a criminal offence" -- Jacek Generowicz From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 29 10:35:42 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA87616A4DA for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 10:35:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (lurza.secnetix.de [83.120.8.8]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 058FD43D5A for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 10:35:41 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from olli@lurza.secnetix.de) Received: from lurza.secnetix.de (fgjajc@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k7TAZZkW008821; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:35:40 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from oliver.fromme@secnetix.de) Received: (from olli@localhost) by lurza.secnetix.de (8.13.4/8.13.1/Submit) id k7TAZTiZ008820; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:35:29 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from olli) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:35:29 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <200608291035.k7TAZTiZ008820@lurza.secnetix.de> From: Oliver Fromme To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG, John-Mark Gurney In-Reply-To: <20060828214712.GJ37035@funkthat.com> X-Newsgroups: list.freebsd-arch User-Agent: tin/1.8.0-20051224 ("Ronay") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.11-STABLE (i386)) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.1.2 (lurza.secnetix.de [127.0.0.1]); Tue, 29 Aug 2006 12:35:40 +0200 (CEST) Cc: Subject: Re: msgbuf default size... X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 10:35:42 -0000 John-Mark Gurney wrote: > Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > John-Mark Gurney wrote: > > > > > I believe we should make the default 64k, and let other platforms, > > > like arm, use DEFAULTS to change it to smaller values if necessary... > > > > Better idea: > > I'd give you: > > > if (ram <= 64MB) > > msgbuf_size = 8k > > else > > msgbuf_size = 64k > > But anyone who is installing -current on a low memory system these days > are going to be tweaking and building custom kernels already... why > can't they tweak this option along w/ the rest? (look at Warner's work > to break out the PHY's) I noticed that AHC_REG_PRETTY_PRINT and AHD_REG_PRETTY_PRINT (which increase kernel size by 400 KB!) are also in GENERIC. Someone who builds a kernel for a small system will have to remove those anyway, so tuning MSGBUF_SIZE is probably not a big deal for him either. Therefore I also vote for increasing the default from 32 KB to 64 KB. It makes bug reports more useful if they include output from a verbose boot of GENERIC, which can easily exceed 32 KB these days. For similar reasons, I would like to ask for including the option INCLUDE_CONFIG_FILE by default in GENERIC. It only requires about 10 KB of space, but it can be extremely helful. I've quite often seen people asking how to recover their kernel configuration (e.g. lost during an update). INCLUDE_CONFIG_FILE would have saved their day ... It's probably a good idea to add a section to the tuning(7) manual page describing how to tune a kernel for systems with small memory. I might give it a try when I have a bit of spare time. Best regards Oliver -- Oliver Fromme, secnetix GmbH & Co. KG, Marktplatz 29, 85567 Grafing Dienstleistungen mit Schwerpunkt FreeBSD: http://www.secnetix.de/bsd Any opinions expressed in this message may be personal to the author and may not necessarily reflect the opinions of secnetix in any way. "I learned Java 3 years before Python. It was my language of choice. It took me two weekends with Python before I was more productive with it than with Java." -- Anthony Roberts From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 29 10:46:07 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A5B516A4DE for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 10:46:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from maxim@macomnet.ru) Received: from mp2.macomnet.net (mp2.macomnet.net [195.128.64.6]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6A1043D4C for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 10:46:06 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from maxim@macomnet.ru) Received: from localhost (localhost.int.ru [127.0.0.1] (may be forged)) by mp2.macomnet.net (8.13.7/8.13.3) with ESMTP id k7TAk4X5088758; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 14:46:04 +0400 (MSD) (envelope-from maxim@macomnet.ru) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 14:46:04 +0400 (MSD) From: Maxim Konovalov To: Oliver Fromme In-Reply-To: <200608291035.k7TAZTiZ008820@lurza.secnetix.de> Message-ID: <20060829144457.P88708@mp2.macomnet.net> References: <200608291035.k7TAZTiZ008820@lurza.secnetix.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Cc: John-Mark Gurney , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: INCLUDE_CONFIG_FILE in GENERIC (Was: msgbuf default size...) X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 10:46:07 -0000 [...] > For similar reasons, I would like to ask for including the > option INCLUDE_CONFIG_FILE by default in GENERIC. It only > requires about 10 KB of space, but it can be extremely > helful. I've quite often seen people asking how to recover > their kernel configuration (e.g. lost during an update). > INCLUDE_CONFIG_FILE would have saved their day ... Seconded. Was about to propose that myself. -- Maxim Konovalov From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 29 15:18:07 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5228116A4DF for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 15:18:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from delphij@delphij.net) Received: from tarsier.geekcn.org (tarsier.geekcn.org [210.51.165.229]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B31F43D79 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 15:17:55 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from delphij@delphij.net) Received: from localhost (tarsier.geekcn.org [210.51.165.229]) by tarsier.geekcn.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73B72EB38F0; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:17:54 +0800 (CST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at geekcn.org Received: from tarsier.geekcn.org ([210.51.165.229]) by localhost (mail.geekcn.org [210.51.165.229]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IhpR7P-4P+r8; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:17:48 +0800 (CST) Received: from [192.168.1.32] (unknown [61.49.107.159]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tarsier.geekcn.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20054EB34C3; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:17:47 +0800 (CST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; s=default; d=delphij.net; c=nofws; q=dns; h=message-id:date:from:organization:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc: subject:references:in-reply-to:x-enigmail-version:content-type; b=Wv6NAvxARB1sjn7aOzGAkrop09ErnTX+S5NoqIeL8odtPLmu5SExWseh0bkSDpPIx OrzNn1KjJph8LZXdfYnAw== Message-ID: <44F45A96.5030405@delphij.net> Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 23:17:42 +0800 From: LI Xin Organization: The FreeBSD Project User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.5 (Macintosh/20060719) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Maxim Konovalov References: <200608291035.k7TAZTiZ008820@lurza.secnetix.de> <20060829144457.P88708@mp2.macomnet.net> In-Reply-To: <20060829144457.P88708@mp2.macomnet.net> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.94.1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-ripemd160; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enig34FB1504A812C1E3EEA89147" Cc: John-Mark Gurney , Oliver Fromme , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: INCLUDE_CONFIG_FILE in GENERIC (Was: msgbuf default size...) X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 15:18:07 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enig34FB1504A812C1E3EEA89147 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Maxim Konovalov wrote: > [...] >> For similar reasons, I would like to ask for including the >> option INCLUDE_CONFIG_FILE by default in GENERIC. It only >> requires about 10 KB of space, but it can be extremely >> helful. I've quite often seen people asking how to recover >> their kernel configuration (e.g. lost during an update). >> INCLUDE_CONFIG_FILE would have saved their day ... >=20 > Seconded. Was about to propose that myself. Thirded =3D-) I add this on almost every boxes I own. Cheers, --=20 Xin LI http://www.delphij.net/ FreeBSD - The Power to Serve! --------------enig34FB1504A812C1E3EEA89147 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.3 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFE9FqWOfuToMruuMARA979AJ9yiEN2HreE8dbWrsQY0HCcXSmYKQCeP8or /GDv3T7HbZDz8r9O+YmNI1U= =Sheh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enig34FB1504A812C1E3EEA89147-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 29 17:19:24 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D561416A50B for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 17:19:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from fb-arch@psconsult.nl) Received: from ps226.psconsult.nl (ps226.psconsult.nl [213.222.19.226]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2166B43EB5 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 17:16:12 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from fb-arch@psconsult.nl) Received: from phuket.psconsult.nl (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by phuket.psconsult.nl (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id k7THEPad052118 for ; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 19:14:25 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from fb-arch@psconsult.nl) Received: (from paul@localhost) by phuket.psconsult.nl (8.13.1/8.13.1/Submit) id k7THEPZf052117 for freebsd-arch@freebsd.org; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 19:14:25 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from fb-arch@psconsult.nl) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 19:14:25 +0200 From: Paul Schenkeveld To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20060829171425.GA48783@psconsult.nl> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org References: <200608291035.k7TAZTiZ008820@lurza.secnetix.de> <20060829144457.P88708@mp2.macomnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20060829144457.P88708@mp2.macomnet.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.6i Subject: Re: INCLUDE_CONFIG_FILE in GENERIC (Was: msgbuf default size...) X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 17:19:25 -0000 On Tue, Aug 29, 2006 at 02:46:04PM +0400, Maxim Konovalov wrote: > [...] > > For similar reasons, I would like to ask for including the > > option INCLUDE_CONFIG_FILE by default in GENERIC. It only > > requires about 10 KB of space, but it can be extremely > > helful. I've quite often seen people asking how to recover > > their kernel configuration (e.g. lost during an update). > > INCLUDE_CONFIG_FILE would have saved their day ... > > Seconded. Was about to propose that myself. All (about 100) FreeBSD machines I manage have a custom kernel with this option always added. So please add my Yeah vote to the list. -- Paul Schenkeveld From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 31 02:44:51 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 990E616A4DF; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 02:44:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from hub.org (hub.org [200.46.204.220]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7361843D60; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 02:44:27 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from scrappy@freebsd.org) Received: from localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.208.251]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FFA6291B0B; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 23:44:20 -0300 (ADT) Received: from hub.org ([200.46.204.220]) by localhost (mx1.hub.org [200.46.208.251]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 00873-04; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 23:44:26 -0300 (ADT) Received: by hub.org (Postfix, from userid 1046) id D3623291B0C; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 23:44:19 -0300 (ADT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9668291B0B; Wed, 30 Aug 2006 23:44:19 -0300 (ADT) Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2006 23:44:19 -0300 (ADT) From: "Marc G. Fournier" X-X-Sender: freebsd@hub.org To: Brooks Davis In-Reply-To: <20060829024420.GA7169@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> Message-ID: <20060830234108.N82634@hub.org> References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060826112115.GG16768@turion.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <20060826132138.H82634@hub.org> <200608261848.16513.max@love2party.net> <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> <20060828130247.GA77702@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> <20060828170450.M82634@hub.org> <44F39ACB.6090703@mawer.org> <20060829015306.GA6722@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> <44F3A44C.8050401@mawer.org> <20060829024420.GA7169@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: Max Laier , "Marc G. Fournier" , Antony Mawer , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 02:44:51 -0000 On Mon, 28 Aug 2006, Brooks Davis wrote: > That wouldn't be a big deal. We've got lots of B(L)AMP applications > running and plenty of FreeBSD servers to run them on. That might be an > option for me. What about the email system that has been discussed already? On the first run only: HostA emails root, root forwards that to rpt@bsdstats.org, rpt@bsdstats.org sends back text to be added to /var/db/bsdstats ... Subsequent runs use the information in /var/db/bsdstats, emails the repot itself to root who then forwards *that* to rpt@bsdstats.org ... We're also going to be working on AUTH Proxy, for those that need that ... As Antony stated, we no longer store IP/hostname, but the reporting does require the information to get back into /var/db/bsdstats to be used for reporting, so the "non-fetch version" would defintely be a bit more involved for the admin ... From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 31 12:14:51 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EAEB16A4DD; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 12:14:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lulf@stud.ntnu.no) Received: from signal.itea.ntnu.no (signal.itea.ntnu.no [129.241.190.231]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D44B443D45; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 12:14:50 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from lulf@stud.ntnu.no) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by signal.itea.ntnu.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52CEC33A76; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:14:27 +0200 (CEST) Received: from gaupe.stud.ntnu.no (gaupe.stud.ntnu.no [129.241.56.184]) by signal.itea.ntnu.no (Postfix) with ESMTP; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:14:27 +0200 (CEST) Received: by gaupe.stud.ntnu.no (Postfix, from userid 2312) id 11FFED0003; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:14:27 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:14:26 +0200 From: Ulf Lilleengen To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20060831121426.GA27060@stud.ntnu.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Content-Scanned: with sophos and spamassassin at mailgw.ntnu.no. Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Improvements to gvinum and it's future X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 12:14:51 -0000 Hi, I've been working this summer to improve gvinum, and add features from old vinum into the geom version of vinum. Lukas Ertl have done a fantastic amount of work on it (and Chris Jones) since it started, but it's not complete. So far, I've completed many of the missing commands such as attach/detach, setstate stop, and other commands (The manpage lists most of them). I've also implemented basic functionality of drivegroups, which provides grouping of drives with the same configuration, and sort of acts as a drivepool that abstract drives further, and it can simplify volume management for larger systems. However, although many of these features maybe needs more testing, some of them also belongs in HEAD, but since I am not a committer, I need someone to help me get these changes into the tree. The reason for this is largely that le@ has not been visible for a couple of months, so the one person actually maintaining gvinum is not available. So therefore I ask for someone else to help me with this. Now, one could ask why I bother doing work on gvinum now, since we have gmirror, gconcat, graid3 and all that. The reason is that gvinum is important as a volume manager. Ivan Voras' work on gvirstor seems very promising as a foundation of a new volume manager, and I've been planning to start working on utilities (fvm, freebsd volume manager) that utilize these new geom classes instead of having to maintain a separate RAID implementations, but that will take time, and meanwhile we need gvinum up to speed. Perhaps can a lot of the concepts of gvinum be reused in a better volume manager for FreeBSD. At least this is how I see the future. My first set of patches are available in PR 99183, 99186 and more is coming from the perforce repository as soon as I'm able to split them up. All suggestions to me are welcome! I posted this on -current and -arch, and I'm sorry if this bothers some people, but it's not just a post of my patches to current and to get attention of some committers. It is also an appeal to further discussion on this subject. -- Ulf Lilleengen From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 31 12:42:57 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C8C416A4DE for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 12:42:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-arch@m.gmane.org) Received: from ciao.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.229.2]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29E8A43D77 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 12:42:55 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from freebsd-arch@m.gmane.org) Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1GIlse-0004rp-1R for freebsd-arch@freebsd.org; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:42:48 +0200 Received: from lara.cc.fer.hr ([161.53.72.113]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:42:48 +0200 Received: from ivoras by lara.cc.fer.hr with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:42:48 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org From: Ivan Voras Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:42:10 +0200 Lines: 25 Message-ID: References: <20060831121426.GA27060@stud.ntnu.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: lara.cc.fer.hr User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (X11/20050921) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en In-Reply-To: <20060831121426.GA27060@stud.ntnu.no> Sender: news Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Improvements to gvinum and it's future X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 12:42:57 -0000 Ulf Lilleengen wrote: > Now, one could ask why I bother doing work on gvinum now, since we have gmirror, > gconcat, graid3 and all that. The reason is that gvinum is important as a volume > manager. Ivan Voras' work on gvirstor seems very promising as a foundation of a > new volume manager, and I've been planning to start working on utilities (fvm, > freebsd volume manager) that utilize these new geom classes instead of having to > maintain a separate RAID implementations, but that will take time, and meanwhile I'm not the one with power-of-decision here, but I think this would be very counter-productive. I'd suggest a different approach, of which I had plans on actually doing, but got sidetracked - to build a userland utility that would use existing GEOM classes in more-or-less opaque way to the user (meaning: users don't have to be aware of actual kernel classes to do the job). The idea was to build a curses terminal interface application (actually, the Original plan was to do it as a part of a new X11 installer that would be able to run standalone) which would allow users to graphically (or at least - visually) draw the graph of classes they want (e.g. RAID 1+0, etc.) and the utility would generate the correct sequence of commands to load and configure the classes, and also write a config file of sorts (or maybe a runnable shell script) that can replicate that configuration, for purpose of repeating in case of disaster or on another machine. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 31 13:11:45 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B95616A4DA for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:11:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lulf@stud.ntnu.no) Received: from fri.itea.ntnu.no (fri.itea.ntnu.no [129.241.7.60]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46EB443D55 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:11:43 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from lulf@stud.ntnu.no) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fri.itea.ntnu.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FF808B6D for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:11:41 +0200 (CEST) Received: from gaupe.stud.ntnu.no (gaupe.stud.ntnu.no [129.241.56.184]) by fri.itea.ntnu.no (Postfix) with ESMTP for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:11:41 +0200 (CEST) Received: by gaupe.stud.ntnu.no (Postfix, from userid 2312) id 41602D0003; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:11:41 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:11:41 +0200 From: Ulf Lilleengen To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Message-ID: <20060831131140.GA2955@stud.ntnu.no> References: <20060831121426.GA27060@stud.ntnu.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Content-Scanned: with sophos and spamassassin at mailgw.ntnu.no. Subject: Re: Improvements to gvinum and it's future X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:11:45 -0000 On tor, aug 31, 2006 at 02:42:10 +0200, Ivan Voras wrote: > > I'm not the one with power-of-decision here, but I think this would be > very counter-productive. I'd suggest a different approach, of which I > had plans on actually doing, but got sidetracked - to build a userland > utility that would use existing GEOM classes in more-or-less opaque way > to the user (meaning: users don't have to be aware of actual kernel > classes to do the job). > I'm not with some power-of-decision either, but I think we all would like suggestions :) And yours look interesting, and maybe I was not very clear on this, but what you describe is pretty much - if I understand you correctly - what I had in mind. Hiding these details are important, but the question was really what the "foundation" for this would be, and gvirstor and similar classes seems to be good for that. I apologize for the confusion. Still, IMHO, it's important to keep gvinum and update it. -- Mvh Ulf Lilleengen From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 31 13:37:16 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81BCC16A4DD for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:37:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-arch@m.gmane.org) Received: from ciao.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.229.2]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10CA943D4C for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:37:16 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from freebsd-arch@m.gmane.org) Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1GImj9-0000je-61 for freebsd-arch@freebsd.org; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:37:04 +0200 Received: from lara.cc.fer.hr ([161.53.72.113]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:37:03 +0200 Received: from ivoras by lara.cc.fer.hr with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:37:03 +0200 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org From: Ivan Voras Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 15:34:43 +0200 Lines: 8 Message-ID: References: <20060831121426.GA27060@stud.ntnu.no> <20060831131140.GA2955@stud.ntnu.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: lara.cc.fer.hr User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (X11/20050921) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en In-Reply-To: <20060831131140.GA2955@stud.ntnu.no> Sender: news Subject: Re: Improvements to gvinum and it's future X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 13:37:16 -0000 Ulf Lilleengen wrote: > what I had in mind. Hiding these details are important, but the question was > really what the "foundation" for this would be, and gvirstor and similar classes > seems to be good for that. I apologize for the confusion. No problem, I though you wanted to replicate existing GEOM classes in one big kernel module :) From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 31 14:48:55 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF7B016A4E5; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:48:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: from sccmmhc92.asp.att.net (sccmmhc92.asp.att.net [204.127.203.212]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39D8943DB1; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:48:26 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: from lor.one-eyed-alien.net ([12.207.12.9]) by sccmmhc92.asp.att.net (sccmmhc92) with ESMTP id <20060831144814m92000uaahe>; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:48:25 +0000 Received: from lor.one-eyed-alien.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lor.one-eyed-alien.net (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k7VEm0KQ034505; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:48:00 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from brooks@lor.one-eyed-alien.net) Received: (from brooks@localhost) by lor.one-eyed-alien.net (8.13.6/8.13.6/Submit) id k7VElprA034496; Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:47:51 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from brooks) Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 09:47:50 -0500 From: Brooks Davis To: "Marc G. Fournier" Message-ID: <20060831144750.GA34402@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> References: <20060826132138.H82634@hub.org> <200608261848.16513.max@love2party.net> <20060826165209.V82634@hub.org> <20060828130247.GA77702@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> <20060828170450.M82634@hub.org> <44F39ACB.6090703@mawer.org> <20060829015306.GA6722@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> <44F3A44C.8050401@mawer.org> <20060829024420.GA7169@lor.one-eyed-alien.net> <20060830234108.N82634@hub.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="Dxnq1zWXvFF0Q93v" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20060830234108.N82634@hub.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11 Cc: Max Laier , Antony Mawer , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:48:56 -0000 --Dxnq1zWXvFF0Q93v Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Aug 30, 2006 at 11:44:19PM -0300, Marc G. Fournier wrote: > On Mon, 28 Aug 2006, Brooks Davis wrote: >=20 > >That wouldn't be a big deal. We've got lots of B(L)AMP applications=20 > >running and plenty of FreeBSD servers to run them on. That might be an= =20 > >option for me. >=20 > What about the email system that has been discussed already? >=20 > On the first run only: >=20 > HostA emails root, root forwards that to rpt@bsdstats.org,=20 > rpt@bsdstats.org sends back text to be added to /var/db/bsdstats ... >=20 > Subsequent runs use the information in /var/db/bsdstats, emails the repot= =20 > itself to root who then forwards *that* to rpt@bsdstats.org ... >=20 > We're also going to be working on AUTH Proxy, for those that need that ... >=20 > As Antony stated, we no longer store IP/hostname, but the reporting does= =20 > require the information to get back into /var/db/bsdstats to be used for= =20 > reporting, so the "non-fetch version" would defintely be a bit more=20 > involved for the admin ... I don't understand the proposed data flow well enough to say. Unless the operation is easily automated, an action per-machine isn't going to happen. -- Brooks --Dxnq1zWXvFF0Q93v Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFE9vaWXY6L6fI4GtQRAvDRAKDRZdIVqABXe56veFU4R8UR4zNuzwCfbMy4 O18JjDEXRf7ShETJUQXjGtA= =cWDQ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Dxnq1zWXvFF0Q93v-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Sep 1 01:48:56 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 306F716A4DE; Fri, 1 Sep 2006 01:48:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from grog@lemis.com) Received: from wantadilla.lemis.com (wantadilla.lemis.com [192.109.197.135]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95D8543D5C; Fri, 1 Sep 2006 01:48:55 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from grog@lemis.com) Received: by wantadilla.lemis.com (Postfix, from userid 1004) id 930F79BDB7; Fri, 1 Sep 2006 11:18:54 +0930 (CST) Date: Fri, 1 Sep 2006 11:18:54 +0930 From: Greg 'groggy' Lehey To: Ulf Lilleengen Message-ID: <20060901014854.GF25190@wantadilla.lemis.com> References: <20060831121426.GA27060@stud.ntnu.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="Pgaa2uWPnPrfixyx" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20060831121426.GA27060@stud.ntnu.no> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i Organization: The FreeBSD Project Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-418-838-708 VoIP: sip:0871270137@sip.internode.on.net WWW-Home-Page: http://www.FreeBSD.org/ X-PGP-Fingerprint: 9A1B 8202 BCCE B846 F92F 09AC 22E6 F290 507A 4223 Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Improvements to gvinum and it's future X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 01 Sep 2006 01:48:56 -0000 --Pgaa2uWPnPrfixyx Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline On Thursday, 31 August 2006 at 14:14:26 +0200, Ulf Lilleengen wrote: > Hi, > > I've been working this summer to improve gvinum, and add features from old vinum > into the geom version of vinum. Lukas Ertl have done a fantastic amount of work > on it (and Chris Jones) since it started, but it's not complete. So far, I've > completed many of the missing commands such as attach/detach, setstate stop, and > other commands (The manpage lists most of them). I've also implemented basic > functionality of drivegroups, which provides grouping of drives with the same > configuration, and sort of acts as a drivepool that abstract drives further, and > it can simplify volume management for larger systems. This all sounds very good. > However, although many of these features maybe needs more testing, > some of them also belongs in HEAD, but since I am not a committer, I > need someone to help me get these changes into the tree. The reason > for this is largely that le@ has not been visible for a couple of > months, so the one person actually maintaining gvinum is not > available. So therefore I ask for someone else to help me with this. OK, I'll do what I can. We can take this offline, I think. > My first set of patches are available in PR 99183, 99186 and more is > coming from the perforce repository as soon as I'm able to split > them up. The web site is currently so broken that I don't use it. Also, freefall has just been rebooted, and for some reason Emacs is missing, so I can't look at the files there either. Could you send me the patches, please? Greg -- See complete headers for address and phone numbers. --Pgaa2uWPnPrfixyx Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.3 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFE95GGIubykFB6QiMRAmW8AJwJMRHpcRlyi278qMpXiG5bHoBeugCfQRrf XHHcZNY4vQ8bhw+By0qYZAI= =1+bC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Pgaa2uWPnPrfixyx-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Sep 1 19:26:35 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AD8016A4E0; Fri, 1 Sep 2006 19:26:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from www.ebusiness-leidinger.de (jojo.ms-net.de [84.16.236.246]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C4E843DCC; Fri, 1 Sep 2006 19:26:12 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from Andro-Beta.Leidinger.net (p54A5FC22.dip.t-dialin.net [84.165.252.34]) (authenticated bits=0) by www.ebusiness-leidinger.de (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k81J5NqK085199; Fri, 1 Sep 2006 21:06:29 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from localhost (webmail.Leidinger.net [192.168.1.102]) by Andro-Beta.Leidinger.net (8.13.4/8.13.3) with ESMTP id k7T9GoKd022547; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 11:16:50 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from psbru.cec.eu.int (psbru.cec.eu.int [158.169.131.14]) by webmail.leidinger.net (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Tue, 29 Aug 2006 11:15:52 +0200 Message-ID: <20060829111552.88jj91evrc4wkow0@webmail.leidinger.net> X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2006 11:15:52 +0200 From: Alexander Leidinger To: "Marc G. Fournier" References: <20060825233420.V82634@hub.org> <20060828170232.Q82634@hub.org> In-Reply-To: <20060828170232.Q82634@hub.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.3) / FreeBSD-7.0 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 01 Sep 2006 23:54:35 +0000 Cc: Garance A Drosehn , freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: BSDStats - What is involved ... ? X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 01 Sep 2006 19:26:35 -0000 Quoting "Marc G. Fournier" (from Mon, 28 Aug =20 2006 17:03:38 -0300 (ADT)): > On Mon, 28 Aug 2006, Garance A Drosehn wrote: > >> At 11:36 PM -0300 8/25/06, Marc G. Fournier wrote: >>> In getting this into the base system itself? Opt-in, >>> default turned off, of course, but maybe as an option >>> in sysinstall to be enabled easily? >> >> I think it should be like perl or X11. Have it available >> on the first installation CD, and easily selectable, but >> not in the freebsd base system. I think it would be best >> for it to remain a separate port. > > That works too ... all I'm looking for is high enough visibility that > ppl know its there ... this is something meant to benefit us all in the > long term, but the faster / easier it can be deployed, the sooner > useful numbers will be generated ... Just having it on CD1 doesn't result in people seeing it. You would =20 have to change the installation mechanism to check if bsdstats is =20 available and to pop up a dialog which explains it's purpose, what it =20 sends and asks if it should be installed or not. Bye, Alexander. --=20 Don't put off for tomorrow what you can do today because if you do it today, you can do it again tomorrow. http://www.Leidinger.net Alexander @ Leidinger.net: PGP ID =3D B0063FE7 http://www.FreeBSD.org netchild @ FreeBSD.org : PGP ID =3D 72077137 From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Sep 1 19:26:46 2006 Return-Path: X-Original-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D530216A51B; Fri, 1 Sep 2006 19:26:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from www.ebusiness-leidinger.de (jojo.ms-net.de [84.16.236.246]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35C7343DDB; Fri, 1 Sep 2006 19:26:20 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from Andro-Beta.Leidinger.net (p54A5FC22.dip.t-dialin.net [84.165.252.34]) (authenticated bits=0) by www.ebusiness-leidinger.de (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id k81J5NqI085199; Fri, 1 Sep 2006 21:06:28 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from localhost (webmail.Leidinger.net [192.168.1.102]) by Andro-Beta.Leidinger.net (8.13.4/8.13.3) with ESMTP id k8197ft1029099; Fri, 1 Sep 2006 11:07:41 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from Alexander@Leidinger.net) Received: from psbru.cec.eu.int (psbru.cec.eu.int [158.169.131.14]) by webmail.leidinger.net (Horde MIME library) with HTTP; Fri, 01 Sep 2006 11:07:41 +0200 Message-ID: <20060901110741.szps9tr98gs484ow@webmail.leidinger.net> X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Date: Fri, 01 Sep 2006 11:07:41 +0200 From: Alexander Leidinger To: Ivan Voras References: <20060831121426.GA27060@stud.ntnu.no> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) H3 (4.1.3) / FreeBSD-7.0 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 01 Sep 2006 23:54:47 +0000 Cc: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Improvements to gvinum and it's future X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 01 Sep 2006 19:26:46 -0000 Quoting Ivan Voras (from Thu, 31 Aug 2006 14:42:10 +0200): > Ulf Lilleengen wrote: > >> Now, one could ask why I bother doing work on gvinum now, since we =20 >> have gmirror, >> gconcat, graid3 and all that. The reason is that gvinum is =20 >> important as a volume >> manager. Ivan Voras' work on gvirstor seems very promising as a =20 >> foundation of a >> new volume manager, and I've been planning to start working on =20 >> utilities (fvm, >> freebsd volume manager) that utilize these new geom classes instead =20 >> of having to >> maintain a separate RAID implementations, but that will take time, =20 >> and meanwhile > > I'm not the one with power-of-decision here, but I think this would be > very counter-productive. I'd suggest a different approach, of which I > had plans on actually doing, but got sidetracked - to build a userland > utility that would use existing GEOM classes in more-or-less opaque way > to the user (meaning: users don't have to be aware of actual kernel > classes to do the job). > > The idea was to build a curses terminal interface application May I direct your eyes to our now tool "sade" in -current? Bye, Alexander. --=20 If truth is beauty, how come no one has their hair done in the library? =09=09-- Lily Tomlin http://www.Leidinger.net Alexander @ Leidinger.net: PGP ID =3D B0063FE7 http://www.FreeBSD.org netchild @ FreeBSD.org : PGP ID =3D 72077137