From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Oct 21 18:26:59 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8138416A468 for ; Sun, 21 Oct 2007 18:26:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markir@paradise.net.nz) Received: from smtp3.clear.net.nz (smtp3.clear.net.nz [203.97.33.64]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 605E613C4B9 for ; Sun, 21 Oct 2007 18:26:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markir@paradise.net.nz) Received: from zmori.markir.net (121-72-67-238.dsl.telstraclear.net [121.72.67.238]) by smtp3.clear.net.nz (CLEAR Net Mail) with ESMTP id <0JQ800K03MHHS730@smtp3.clear.net.nz> for freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org; Sun, 21 Oct 2007 14:22:29 +1300 (NZDT) Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2007 14:22:28 +1300 From: Mark Kirkwood In-reply-to: <200710191613.18043.achilov-rn@askd.ru> To: "Achilov, Rashid" Message-id: <471AA9D4.8090003@paradise.net.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <200710191613.18043.achilov-rn@askd.ru> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.4 (X11/20070716) Cc: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Support of VIA Apollo Pro in 6.x is completely broken? X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2007 18:26:59 -0000 Rashid N. Achilov wrote: > I have some boxes, built on motherboards Gigabyte GB-6VA+ (VIA Apollo Pro > chipset). Do not say me, that's bullshit, I know :-/ > > Some of these boxes works under 4.5-RELEASE, some under Windows 2000. Sometime > it should be upgraded on to 6.x branch, but I cannot use it - when I install > 6.x on these boxes, I cannot bring up any network interface - link leds on > card brights, but no any traffic can pass, even on neighbour box! I see > > xl0: watchdog timeout > xl0: watchdog timeout > ... > > messages on console. > > Later. When connect HDD to motherboard through ordinary (40-wired) cable, 6.x > says, that HDD is broken! I see endless messages > > DMA_ERROR..., CRC_ERROR... etc > > When I change cable to UDMA (80-wired) - all these messages are disapper > > Later. When I boot box with "ACPI disabled" network cards works! But box hangs > up after about 5-10 minutes of active work. Cooler does not stop but box > hangs completely, only reset works. > Hmm interesting - I couldn't actually find any specs for a G*B*-6VA+ (only a GA-6VA+)... is it a VIA Apollo Pro 133A chipset with slot-1 P-II/III? If so I've run 6.x (a while ago so probably 6.0 or 6.1) on a Tyan Trinity 400 (same chipset and cpu support)... and I used a 3Com office-connect ethernet (xl based) card....without any issues. Maybe see if Gigabyte have a more recent BIOS update for the board and update one of them and re-test! On the ATA cable front, assuming the chipset is as I guessed, the ATA controller is ATA-66 capable, so yeah, best to use an 80-wire cable and get *some* IO speed out of these old things! Cheers Mark From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Oct 22 04:07:25 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10DC416A419 for ; Mon, 22 Oct 2007 04:07:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from achilov-rn@askd.ru) Received: from master.askd.ru (master.askd.ru [80.242.75.6]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 731C913C481 for ; Mon, 22 Oct 2007 04:07:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from achilov-rn@askd.ru) Received: from to-495.askd.gmbh (IDENT:shelton@sentry [192.168.1.94]) by master.askd.ru (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id l9M478l6026149 for ; Mon, 22 Oct 2007 11:07:08 +0700 (NOVST) (envelope-from achilov-rn@askd.ru) From: "Rashid N. Achilov" Organization: =?koi8-r?b?7+/v?= "=?koi8-r?b?4fMt88nT1MXNwQ==?= =?koi8-r?b?IOvPzdDMxcvT?=" To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 11:07:06 +0700 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.7 References: <200710191613.18043.achilov-rn@askd.ru> <471AA9D4.8090003@paradise.net.nz> In-Reply-To: <471AA9D4.8090003@paradise.net.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200710221107.06708.achilov-rn@askd.ru> Subject: Re: Support of VIA Apollo Pro in 6.x is completely broken? X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: "Achilov, Rashid" List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 04:07:25 -0000 On Sunday 21 October 2007, Mark Kirkwood wrote: > Hmm interesting - I couldn't actually find any specs for a G*B*-6VA+ > (only a GA-6VA+)... is it a VIA Apollo Pro 133A chipset with slot-1 > P-II/III? Sorry, of course GA-6VA+. It is VIA Apollo Pro with Socket 370. Description at http://tw.giga-byte.com/Products/Motherboard/Products_Spec.aspx?ProductID=1442 > > If so I've run 6.x (a while ago so probably 6.0 or 6.1) on a Tyan > Trinity 400 (same chipset and cpu support)... and I used a 3Com > office-connect ethernet (xl based) card....without any issues. Maybe see > if Gigabyte have a more recent BIOS update for the board and update one > of them and re-test! Newest BIOS for this mb is F8. These boxes already has F8. Some (at least three) boxes has completely similar troubles - so I think, it in chipset support. 4.5 has not ANY these troubles. > > On the ATA cable front, assuming the chipset is as I guessed, the ATA > controller is ATA-66 capable, so yeah, best to use an 80-wire cable and > get *some* IO speed out of these old things! Of course, best to use speedup. But, wheh I do not use, I shoud receive downgraded ,but working system, not false CRC ERROR! -- With Best Regards. Rashid N. Achilov (RNA1-RIPE), Web: http://www.askd.ru/~shelton OOO "ACK" telecommunications administrator, e-mail: achilov-rn [at] askd.ru PGP: 83 CD E2 A7 37 4A D5 81 D6 D6 52 BF C9 2F 85 AF 97 BE CB 0A From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Oct 22 11:59:18 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BBD516A421 for ; Mon, 22 Oct 2007 11:59:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markir@paradise.net.nz) Received: from smtp3.clear.net.nz (smtp3.clear.net.nz [203.97.33.64]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3435213C4A7 for ; Mon, 22 Oct 2007 11:59:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markir@paradise.net.nz) Received: from zmori.markir.net (121-72-67-238.dsl.telstraclear.net [121.72.67.238]) by smtp3.clear.net.nz (CLEAR Net Mail) with ESMTP id <0JQB00KRMAMC2900@smtp3.clear.net.nz> for freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org; Tue, 23 Oct 2007 00:59:01 +1300 (NZDT) Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 00:58:50 +1300 From: Mark Kirkwood In-reply-to: <200710221107.06708.achilov-rn@askd.ru> To: "Achilov, Rashid" Message-id: <471C907A.8090005@paradise.net.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <200710191613.18043.achilov-rn@askd.ru> <471AA9D4.8090003@paradise.net.nz> <200710221107.06708.achilov-rn@askd.ru> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.4 (X11/20070716) Cc: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Support of VIA Apollo Pro in 6.x is completely broken? X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 11:59:18 -0000 Rashid N. Achilov wrote: > On Sunday 21 October 2007, Mark Kirkwood wrote: > > >> Hmm interesting - I couldn't actually find any specs for a G*B*-6VA+ >> (only a GA-6VA+)... is it a VIA Apollo Pro 133A chipset with slot-1 >> P-II/III? >> > Sorry, of course GA-6VA+. It is VIA Apollo Pro with Socket 370. Description at > http://tw.giga-byte.com/Products/Motherboard/Products_Spec.aspx?ProductID=1442 > > >> If so I've run 6.x (a while ago so probably 6.0 or 6.1) on a Tyan >> Trinity 400 (same chipset and cpu support)... and I used a 3Com >> office-connect ethernet (xl based) card....without any issues. Maybe see >> if Gigabyte have a more recent BIOS update for the board and update one >> of them and re-test! >> > Newest BIOS for this mb is F8. These boxes already has F8. Some (at least > three) boxes has completely similar troubles - so I think, it in chipset > support. 4.5 has not ANY these troubles. > > >> On the ATA cable front, assuming the chipset is as I guessed, the ATA >> controller is ATA-66 capable, so yeah, best to use an 80-wire cable and >> get *some* IO speed out of these old things! >> > > Of course, best to use speedup. But, wheh I do not use, I shoud receive > downgraded ,but working system, not false CRC ERROR! > Ah - right... after looking at the manual - your chipset is different from my old Tyan (T82C693 & VT82C596A vs T82C694X & VT82C596B) ... so its possible that there has not been much testing for it on later releases... altho it still seems odd that VIA suport is broken - for instance I'm currently using a VIA Apollo Pro 266T chipset based box right now running 6-STABLE to type this (Supermicro P3TDDE).... Also looks like your south-bridge will only do ATA-33... so I would expect that the 40 wire cable would be ok... so... hmm so not too much help from me... hopefully someone else will have some ideas! Cheers Mark From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Oct 23 21:36:19 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9FE216A418 for ; Tue, 23 Oct 2007 21:36:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from M.S.Powell@salford.ac.uk) Received: from akis.salford.ac.uk (akis.salford.ac.uk [146.87.0.14]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 44FC813C48D for ; Tue, 23 Oct 2007 21:36:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from M.S.Powell@salford.ac.uk) Received: (qmail 55661 invoked by uid 98); 23 Oct 2007 22:09:30 +0100 Received: from 146.87.255.121 by akis.salford.ac.uk (envelope-from , uid 401) with qmail-scanner-2.01 (clamdscan: 0.90/3843. spamassassin: 3.1.8. Clear:RC:1(146.87.255.121):. Processed in 0.044205 secs); 23 Oct 2007 21:09:30 -0000 Received: from rust.salford.ac.uk (HELO rust.salford.ac.uk) (146.87.255.121) by akis.salford.ac.uk (qpsmtpd/0.3x.614) with SMTP; Tue, 23 Oct 2007 22:09:30 +0100 Received: (qmail 59663 invoked by uid 1002); 23 Oct 2007 21:09:28 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 23 Oct 2007 21:09:28 -0000 Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 22:09:28 +0100 (BST) From: "Mark Powell" To: Dmitry Marakasov In-Reply-To: <20071003003329.GA78359@hades.panopticon> Message-ID: <20071023214838.P57575@rust.salford.ac.uk> References: <20071002164246.GA986@hades.panopticon> <20071003003329.GA78359@hades.panopticon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Need motherboard for home fileserver X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 21:36:19 -0000 On Wed, 3 Oct 2007, Dmitry Marakasov wrote: > * Dmitry Marakasov (amdmi3@amdmi3.ru) wrote: > > Thanks for you replies so far. Now after some digging I understand a bit > what I actually need. Probably best combination for cheap low power ZFS server at moment: Gigabyte GA-G33-DSR4 On board VGA Intel GMA 3100 Integrated ALC889A 8-Channel High Definition audio All 8 on-board SATA supported by FreeBSD 7 6xSATA on ICH9 2xSATA on Gigabyte SATA Controller which is really the well supported JMB363 But On-board Realtek GbE, which is a piece of crap, so buy an Intel 1000PT PCI-E gig adapter Couple that with the cheapest, effective, Core2Duo: Intel CPU Pentium DualCore E2140 They are similar price to the cheapest AMD and are really just a Core2Duo with just 1MB cache and offical 800MHz FSB. However, they are the same silicon as C2D. As such these run easily at ~3GHz with 350-400MHz FSB all with no voltage increases, if you're into such things. It's a shame AMD have fallen behind Intel. Corporate crime does pay it seems :( > Well, I hoped to get a SocketAM2 board for AthlonX2, as it is 30-40% > cheaper than Core2Duo with similar performance, but most of AM2 > motherboards use nForce chipset, which is unsupported by CURRENT. > The only solution I've found is M2N32-SLI (thanks Craig), but I'll > need to buy video card and Intel Gbit NIC. > > Though Core 2 Duo CPUs are more expensive, See above. Possibly not as low power as an AMD solution, but a lot more for your money, me thinks. > choice of motherboards is much wider, and they are generally cheaper > than M2N32-SLI, so price of AMD/Intel platforms is nearly equal. I've > found some MB's with integrated video and Intel ethernet: ASUS P5B-VM > DO, Intel DG33BUC, Intel DG33FBC. I think I'll buy one of those, but > just to be sure, are those statements right: - Marvell/NVidia NICs suck, > and I am right that I definitely need Intel. > (what about RealTec, btw?) Only Intel NICs. All those others you mention just don't work properly. Intel will save you headaches. > - ICH8DO should work as well as ICH8 and G33 should work as well as G965 > (didn't find menton of ICH8DO in src/sys/dev/ata/ata-chipset.c) > - ADI*/Realtec(ALC*)/Sigmatel(STAC*) HDA CODECs provide more or less > equal sound quality. And it can be considered `good' to > non-audiophiles. Cheers. -- Mark Powell - UNIX System Administrator - The University of Salford Information Services Division, Clifford Whitworth Building, Salford University, Manchester, M5 4WT, UK. Tel: +44 161 295 4837 Fax: +44 161 295 5888 www.pgp.com for PGP key From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 24 11:20:48 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD5CF16A41A; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 11:20:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from admin@gyrec.cz) Received: from gate.gyrec.cz (gate.gyrec.cz [195.113.191.162]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BB3613C4B7; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 11:20:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from admin@gyrec.cz) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=ASSP-nospam) by gate.gyrec.cz with esmtp (Exim 4.60 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1IkdPp-000F4J-KN; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:24:45 +0200 Received: from 192.168.1.251 ([192.168.1.251] helo=inf1.gyrec.cz) by ASSP-nospam ; 24 Oct 07 10:24:45 -0000 Message-ID: <471F1D1B.4090007@gyrec.cz> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:23:23 +0200 From: Karel Rous User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.8.1.2) Gecko/20070523 SeaMonkey/1.1.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mark Powell References: <20071002164246.GA986@hades.panopticon> <20071003003329.GA78359@hades.panopticon> <20071023214838.P57575@rust.salford.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: <20071023214838.P57575@rust.salford.ac.uk> Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------030207070707010300020109" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Dmitry Marakasov , freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Need motherboard for home fileserver X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: karelrous@gyrec.cz List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 11:20:48 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------030207070707010300020109 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark Powell wrote: > On Wed, 3 Oct 2007, Dmitry Marakasov wrote: > > Intel CPU Pentium DualCore E2140 > > They are similar price to the cheapest AMD and are really just a > Core2Duo with just 1MB cache and offical 800MHz FSB. However, they are > the same silicon as C2D. As such these run easily at ~3GHz with > 350-400MHz FSB all with no voltage increases, if you're into such things. > It's a shame AMD have fallen behind Intel. Corporate crime does pay > it seems :( Personally I don't see any evidence about this statement in low price solution. I use AMD for a long time and it has never as overclockable as Intel. The first one I have found is A64 3000 which I bought two weeks ago... > >> >> Though Core 2 Duo CPUs are more expensive, > > See above. Possibly not as low power as an AMD solution, but a lot > more for your money, me thinks. I think overclocking shoudn't be understood as a feature you pay for. It's mainly a matter of luck. Reliability (probability of crash) and lifetime of such machines could be worse. Karel --------------030207070707010300020109-- From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 24 12:07:31 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E01B116A494 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:07:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from varga.michal@gmail.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.189]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DC4F13C4A7 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:07:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from varga.michal@gmail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id b2so147514nfb for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 05:07:22 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:subject:from:to:cc:in-reply-to:references:content-type:organization:date:message-id:mime-version:x-mailer:content-transfer-encoding; bh=rzkciXqH/7QbxdWGTj2wj56lz2IL4Rwe89Tn1sCVFTQ=; b=dTVZ6d8IC3JIuCn+UhufQ1mBUxYIovBzsIDupXurO1PCmpStE3O1FIcpvQ2veAbKIYICUTIwttJ+W2wlQ76wBTYERDxeN8Ln3rx76woIfmWTz1GqNMbjNgDaWQyahowVj5FTt2JQjUigky8CwJpyHsvNEdRjaGnncErwlcY/Z20= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:subject:from:to:cc:in-reply-to:references:content-type:organization:date:message-id:mime-version:x-mailer:content-transfer-encoding; b=Y5XX4Yke3r4W4MdBW38IyuX/B7j82SN3M/OJBYcQOPjCSn6GiWb0AsOcc4DO5W4sCTpukglY1h6BEGNlq7I1WKpACJcdHJHSiGbFRqmXgGO5swgs/7ZgfYVV0bJ1MtUhyLDdK0lBwVRDDcNiXq+lfkfHVbOAlkas/r38N7k5RPE= Received: by 10.86.54.3 with SMTP id c3mr395389fga.1193225987641; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 04:39:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?10.0.100.2? ( [89.176.79.57]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id g28sm1175428fkg.2007.10.24.04.39.46 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Wed, 24 Oct 2007 04:39:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Michal Varga To: karelrous@gyrec.cz In-Reply-To: <471F1D1B.4090007@gyrec.cz> References: <20071002164246.GA986@hades.panopticon> <20071003003329.GA78359@hades.panopticon> <20071023214838.P57575@rust.salford.ac.uk> <471F1D1B.4090007@gyrec.cz> Content-Type: text/plain Organization: Stonehenge Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 13:39:45 +0200 Message-Id: <1193225985.981.15.camel@xenon.stonehenge.sk> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.10.3 FreeBSD GNOME Team Port Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, Dmitry Marakasov , Mark Powell , freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Need motherboard for home fileserver X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:07:32 -0000 On Wed, 2007-10-24 at 12:23 +0200, Karel Rous wrote: > Mark Powell wrote: > > On Wed, 3 Oct 2007, Dmitry Marakasov wrote: > > > > Intel CPU Pentium DualCore E2140 > > > > They are similar price to the cheapest AMD and are really just a > > Core2Duo with just 1MB cache and offical 800MHz FSB. However, they are > > the same silicon as C2D. As such these run easily at ~3GHz with > > 350-400MHz FSB all with no voltage increases, if you're into such things. > > It's a shame AMD have fallen behind Intel. Corporate crime does pay > > it seems :( > Personally I don't see any evidence about this statement in low > price solution. I use AMD for a long time and it has never as > overclockable as Intel. The first one I have found is A64 3000 which I > bought two weeks ago... > > > >> > >> Though Core 2 Duo CPUs are more expensive, > > > > See above. Possibly not as low power as an AMD solution, but a lot > > more for your money, me thinks. > I think overclocking shoudn't be understood as a feature you pay > for. It's mainly a matter of luck. Reliability (probability of crash) > and lifetime of such machines could be worse. > > Karel > When someone asks me for differences between Core 2 and AMD/64/FX/etc, I wont bother to argue anymore, I simply link this: http://marc.info/?l=openbsd-misc&m=118296441702631 ..and let them decide on their own. (well, maybe I sometimes add that buying C2D today is a suicide, but *that* is a highly personal opinion). m. From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 24 12:35:28 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AD2816A41A for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:35:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from M.S.Powell@salford.ac.uk) Received: from abbe.salford.ac.uk (abbe.salford.ac.uk [146.87.0.10]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A0D8C13C4A3 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:35:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from M.S.Powell@salford.ac.uk) Received: (qmail 87619 invoked by uid 98); 24 Oct 2007 13:35:06 +0100 Received: from 146.87.255.121 by abbe.salford.ac.uk (envelope-from , uid 401) with qmail-scanner-2.01 (clamdscan: 0.90/3838. spamassassin: 3.1.8. Clear:RC:1(146.87.255.121):. Processed in 0.051919 secs); 24 Oct 2007 12:35:06 -0000 Received: from rust.salford.ac.uk (HELO rust.salford.ac.uk) (146.87.255.121) by abbe.salford.ac.uk (qpsmtpd/0.3x.614) with SMTP; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 13:35:06 +0100 Received: (qmail 65841 invoked by uid 1002); 24 Oct 2007 12:35:04 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 24 Oct 2007 12:35:04 -0000 Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 13:35:04 +0100 (BST) From: "Mark Powell" To: karelrous@gyrec.cz In-Reply-To: <471F1D1B.4090007@gyrec.cz> Message-ID: <20071024131634.M64075@rust.salford.ac.uk> References: <20071002164246.GA986@hades.panopticon> <20071003003329.GA78359@hades.panopticon> <20071023214838.P57575@rust.salford.ac.uk> <471F1D1B.4090007@gyrec.cz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: Dmitry Marakasov , freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Need motherboard for home fileserver X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:35:28 -0000 On Wed, 24 Oct 2007, Karel Rous wrote: > I think overclocking shoudn't be understood as a feature you pay for. Yeah. It's a bonus right? Some of these budget end cpus are clearly underclocked by the manufacturer so that they simply have products which satisify ever price bracket they consider there is a market for. In fact they are often the same silicon. They re-label, lower their price, cutting into the profit, but hope to sell more of them. This is not always the case as the lower end stuff can often be silicon which failed a higher speed test or has a non-functional part e.g. some cache was faulty. However, it still remains true that the practice is in existence. You just need to do enough reading to be aware of which models it is happening on. > It's mainly a matter of luck. Everything is a matter of luck. You can reduce how much you depend on luck by doing some research. Isn't that what is performed when any hardware selection is made? > Reliability (probability of crash) and lifetime of such machines could > be worse. Could be no worse too :) NB I suggested this only in the context of a home server, where the financing is coming solely from one individual's pocket. I would not recommend any of this for a production server e.g. I wouldn't have recommended that motherboard in the production case, etc. Cheers. -- Mark Powell - UNIX System Administrator - The University of Salford Information Services Division, Clifford Whitworth Building, Salford University, Manchester, M5 4WT, UK. Tel: +44 161 295 4837 Fax: +44 161 295 5888 www.pgp.com for PGP key From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 24 14:30:54 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40FF816A47A for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 14:30:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tevans.uk@googlemail.com) Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com (nf-out-0910.google.com [64.233.182.191]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C56BA13C480 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 14:30:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tevans.uk@googlemail.com) Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id b2so184136nfb for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 07:30:45 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:subject:from:to:cc:in-reply-to:references:content-type:date:message-id:mime-version:x-mailer; bh=BnBUgAdLqf9sYqpHidSeQUKrt7WiVsUvUE7aqPreM0I=; b=s9l/hODZUu+BhAPxbpIUh6/o5e4MY9UYTZyJ0z++nXN4ZIDdGWLoIqDZQDj9CC1rd9NnYnXfHWoM5jGleY/bEAZAvRohcbQ6/jDdCfH4YKnDKIUnqFf4hRqUZVYS/fjC+HIHkg7ONeT9/tzZ+N8rW1O7BPyMueJ+Z0Eqbnvyt7I= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlemail.com; s=beta; h=received:subject:from:to:cc:in-reply-to:references:content-type:date:message-id:mime-version:x-mailer; b=b0Eudn05i4TozAPIqhOY0MJAodzqPw0BRpYV1K68eoDzc7M/DodRfEC/y9TcgrDp0p5Cd/j0bNtyz37EgrkY+YyYjH6gxUG3bcA11LsRyVPjA/6lsmvqPaeREuXsxrLi5xProly47QdjoQqCJlXaog121mH0k+7XmZnzfEqtvn4= Received: by 10.78.168.1 with SMTP id q1mr427389hue.1193232838064; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 06:33:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?127.0.0.1? ( [217.206.187.79]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id c4sm97622nfi.2007.10.24.06.33.55 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Wed, 24 Oct 2007 06:33:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Evans To: Michal Varga In-Reply-To: <1193225985.981.15.camel@xenon.stonehenge.sk> References: <20071002164246.GA986@hades.panopticon> <20071003003329.GA78359@hades.panopticon> <20071023214838.P57575@rust.salford.ac.uk> <471F1D1B.4090007@gyrec.cz> <1193225985.981.15.camel@xenon.stonehenge.sk> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-ZTcp6B4/u14+Tw43+PcF" Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 14:33:53 +0100 Message-Id: <1193232833.2001.46.camel@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.10.2 FreeBSD GNOME Team Port Cc: karelrous@gyrec.cz, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, Mark Powell , Dmitry Marakasov , freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Need motherboard for home fileserver X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 14:30:54 -0000 --=-ZTcp6B4/u14+Tw43+PcF Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, 2007-10-24 at 13:39 +0200, Michal Varga wrote: > On Wed, 2007-10-24 at 12:23 +0200, Karel Rous wrote: > > Mark Powell wrote: > > > On Wed, 3 Oct 2007, Dmitry Marakasov wrote: > > > > > > Intel CPU Pentium DualCore E2140 > > > > > > They are similar price to the cheapest AMD and are really just a=20 > > > Core2Duo with just 1MB cache and offical 800MHz FSB. However, they ar= e=20 > > > the same silicon as C2D. As such these run easily at ~3GHz with=20 > > > 350-400MHz FSB all with no voltage increases, if you're into such thi= ngs. > > > It's a shame AMD have fallen behind Intel. Corporate crime does pay= =20 > > > it seems :( > > Personally I don't see any evidence about this statement in low=20 > > price solution. I use AMD for a long time and it has never as=20 > > overclockable as Intel. The first one I have found is A64 3000 which I=20 > > bought two weeks ago... > > > > > >> > > >> Though Core 2 Duo CPUs are more expensive, > > > > > > See above. Possibly not as low power as an AMD solution, but a lot=20 > > > more for your money, me thinks. > > I think overclocking shoudn't be understood as a feature you pay=20 > > for. It's mainly a matter of luck. Reliability (probability of crash)=20 > > and lifetime of such machines could be worse. > >=20 > > Karel > >=20 > When someone asks me for differences between Core 2 and AMD/64/FX/etc, I > wont bother to argue anymore, I simply link this: > http://marc.info/?l=3Dopenbsd-misc&m=3D118296441702631 >=20 > ..and let them decide on their own. (well, maybe I sometimes add that > buying C2D today is a suicide, but *that* is a highly personal opinion). >=20 >=20 > m. >=20 Sigh. Yes, lets all be scared by Theo de Raadt's scaremongering and over exaggeration. See the original thread on current@ for full explanations of why everything he says in that email is largely irrelevant. Tom --=-ZTcp6B4/u14+Tw43+PcF Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQBHH0nBlcRvFfyds/cRAlhYAJ4y7NMn8/5I/PnfBLl/yPU1wEDOawCdH/Cu mJLxJzDS4XE1s8A+8P9WqfM= =WmBH -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-ZTcp6B4/u14+Tw43+PcF-- From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 24 14:32:56 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C73B16A421 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 14:32:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olivier@gautherot.net) Received: from wx-out-0506.google.com (wx-out-0506.google.com [66.249.82.225]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 09DB513C48A for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 14:32:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from olivier@gautherot.net) Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i29so185865wxd for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 07:32:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.90.93.6 with SMTP id q6mr544373agb.1193234794717; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 07:06:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.90.81.6 with HTTP; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 07:06:34 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 11:06:34 -0300 From: "Olivier Gautherot" To: "Mark Powell" In-Reply-To: <20071024131634.M64075@rust.salford.ac.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <20071002164246.GA986@hades.panopticon> <20071003003329.GA78359@hades.panopticon> <20071023214838.P57575@rust.salford.ac.uk> <471F1D1B.4090007@gyrec.cz> <20071024131634.M64075@rust.salford.ac.uk> Cc: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Need motherboard for home fileserver X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 14:32:56 -0000 Hi Mark! On 10/24/07, Mark Powell wrote: > On Wed, 24 Oct 2007, Karel Rous wrote: > > > I think overclocking shoudn't be understood as a feature you pay for. > > Yeah. It's a bonus right? > Some of these budget end cpus are clearly underclocked by the > manufacturer so that they simply have products which satisify ever price > bracket they consider there is a market for. In fact they are often the > same silicon. They re-label, lower their price, cutting into the profit, > but hope to sell more of them [....] It is indeed the same silicon. They test it with the lower-grade first and increase the speed gradually to fill the pending orders. If a part is specified for 1.8GHz for instance, it will never run faster before leaving the factory. That's why you're very likely to be fine at higher speeds but can't complain if the processor smokes :-) > > It's mainly a matter of luck. > > Everything is a matter of luck. You can reduce how much you depend on luck > by doing some research. Isn't that what is performed when any hardware > selection is made? Not in an industrial context. The point is not only **IF** a processor works at higher speed but ***FOR HOW LONG***. If it runs faster, it runs hotter and, therefore, will age faster (we're still missing the right glue to stick the ions in the substrate :-) ). Your server may be fine for 2 years instead of 5 - you won't know in advance. Make sure you have a good air-flow in the chassis and keep the machine in the cellar (or the coolest place in your home). Running slower, in the same conditions, will definitely increase the lifespan. > NB I suggested this only in the context of a home server, where the > financing is coming solely from one individual's pocket. I would not > recommend any of this for a production server e.g. I wouldn't have > recommended that motherboard in the production case, etc. If cost is an issue, you may consider electricity bill too in the balance: you may find that the power consumed by the processor alone would cost you the price of a brand new CPU every year! For a home server, do you really need a fast, dual-core machine? What is the speed of your network? How big is your repository? How many clients do you have? How many hours do you actually use it per day? What apps do you plan to run? My home-based web server and file server runs off a 400MHz, 4W PPC-based motherboard (with Linux, shame on me :-) ). As was mentioned before, VIA has great boards with low power consumption (below 20W), which could probably fulfill your needs. They are relatively cheap too. I've been using one happily for the last couple of years, doing some occasional, heavy stuff (like "make buidlworld installworld" ... although I would not do it every day :-) ) Building OpenOffice, for instance, takes 2 days (my other Athlon does it in less than 8 hours...) On the other hand, I can have the VIA board running day and night for a week without sensitive increase of the electricity bill. If I run the Athlon for 3 days in a row, my wife starts complaining about the cost... My cent worth :-) Have a nice day -- Olivier Gautherot olivier@gautherot.net www.gautherot.net From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 24 19:06:01 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1E1616A418 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 19:06:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from whizzter@gmail.com) Received: from el-out-1112.google.com (el-out-1112.google.com [209.85.162.183]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40FCF13C4C6 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 19:06:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from whizzter@gmail.com) Received: by el-out-1112.google.com with SMTP id s27so125278ele for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:05:49 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; bh=bdBXsPsM2b/0VmCHQ3oAOXc7ulcds+Je81yDaWoRB34=; b=VMHYYv9ix9A14xnjmWMsyAkZMQs6cCIaan+zDW+uW1fLo/Ooc4Xumn2TYlvlRhfRVxBQbxFXb519BrwFd+CBE3Y4Hx6vyRAjePx3LkjY9cI10nSRVLi4SdZMsMZ0E8buJvdSfdEp2YDAhKArDJ/jnPVwlAmsDDWSeVGqb8XgDdM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=tGooBjKDnJsHzlhQRx8wLqBkQ8HUxrYZv5h0jUlS5T9ROR3QtZk9QyCxDPS6cmSOpH49WKRnjPhb05KUyMlPyLcOCLhnvU+e9XK+LZFiL/9SR985oxiUi5ZVWtLLz7S9zN+ujTdnMNle0+0xCiGUNQDnRyjM3y0UIwh3sDtwR04= Received: by 10.142.237.20 with SMTP id k20mr322688wfh.1193251100479; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 11:38:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.142.98.15 with HTTP; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 11:38:20 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <436c7eda0710241138m46839017t77081954a83b4620@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 20:38:20 +0200 From: "Jonas Lund" To: "Olivier Gautherot" In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20071002164246.GA986@hades.panopticon> <20071003003329.GA78359@hades.panopticon> <20071023214838.P57575@rust.salford.ac.uk> <471F1D1B.4090007@gyrec.cz> <20071024131634.M64075@rust.salford.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Mark Powell , freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Need motherboard for home fileserver X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 19:06:01 -0000 Now that via got mentioned. i just built a via based server. i went with this because my girlfriend wants to sleep in silence (we only have a 1 room apt) and to keep the bill low. fanless epia 1.2ghz (has sse instr,etc) 1 gb of memory fanless power supply 2x 500gb sata disks with software raid-1 1 120mm fan revved down Positivie Silent (If i put on a silencer on the fan i actually have to Cool - cpu is only 7 degrees hotter than the ambient temp in the room WITHOUT the fan turned on) - cooling the harddrives is actually the problem, going with 2.5" drives could help here - Gigabit eth - The motherboard manual says it can be pinned and connected to do 5.1output, apart from supporting a number of output channels. Is there a huge difference in sound chips these days unless you want professional quality? Negative - Apperantly Epia boards doesn't support more memory than 1gb - .... and watch out to make sure that the memory you buy doesn't have individual memory chips larger than 64mb. The board will fail to use anything above 64mb so a 8x128mb memory stick will give 512 mb because of this limit, beware! I had to buy a 16x64mb chip - The board only has 2 SATA connectors (maybe 4 with some settings and extra connectors) - SATA -1 not 2 - Only one PCI connector, no PCI-E . so attaching more drives ? might not yield top perf. - My board had some problems with a Rocketraid SATA card (that i later learned to be somekinda software hack, hopefully the problem was due to bios incompabilities in SW). / Jonas Lund 2007/10/24, Olivier Gautherot : > > Hi Mark! > > On 10/24/07, Mark Powell wrote: > > On Wed, 24 Oct 2007, Karel Rous wrote: > > > > > I think overclocking shoudn't be understood as a feature you pay for. > > > > Yeah. It's a bonus right? > > Some of these budget end cpus are clearly underclocked by the > > manufacturer so that they simply have products which satisify ever price > > bracket they consider there is a market for. In fact they are often the > > same silicon. They re-label, lower their price, cutting into the profit, > > but hope to sell more of them [....] > > It is indeed the same silicon. They test it with the lower-grade first and > increase the speed gradually to fill the pending orders. If a part is > specified > for 1.8GHz for instance, it will never run faster before leaving the > factory. > That's why you're very likely to be fine at higher speeds but can't > complain > if the processor smokes :-) > > > > It's mainly a matter of luck. > > > > Everything is a matter of luck. You can reduce how much you depend on > luck > > by doing some research. Isn't that what is performed when any hardware > > selection is made? > > Not in an industrial context. The point is not only **IF** a processor > works > at higher speed but ***FOR HOW LONG***. If it runs faster, it runs hotter > and, > therefore, will age faster (we're still missing the right glue to stick > the ions > in the substrate :-) ). Your server may be fine for 2 years instead of 5 - > you > won't know in advance. Make sure you have a good air-flow in the chassis > and > keep the machine in the cellar (or the coolest place in your home). > Running > slower, in the same conditions, will definitely increase the lifespan. > > > > NB I suggested this only in the context of a home server, where the > > financing is coming solely from one individual's pocket. I would not > > recommend any of this for a production server e.g. I wouldn't have > > recommended that motherboard in the production case, etc. > > If cost is an issue, you may consider electricity bill too in the balance: > you > may find that the power consumed by the processor alone would cost you > the price of a brand new CPU every year! For a home server, do you really > need a fast, dual-core machine? What is the speed of your network? How > big is your repository? How many clients do you have? How many hours > do you actually use it per day? What apps do you plan to run? > > My home-based web server and file server runs off a 400MHz, 4W PPC-based > motherboard (with Linux, shame on me :-) ). As was mentioned before, VIA > has great boards with low power consumption (below 20W), which could > probably fulfill your needs. They are relatively cheap too. I've been > using one > happily for the last couple of years, doing some occasional, heavy stuff > (like > "make buidlworld installworld" ... although I would not do it every day > :-) ) > Building OpenOffice, for instance, takes 2 days (my other Athlon does it > in > less than 8 hours...) On the other hand, I can have the VIA board running > day and night for a week without sensitive increase of the electricity > bill. > If I run the Athlon for 3 days in a row, my wife starts complaining about > the > cost... > > My cent worth :-) > Have a nice day > -- > Olivier Gautherot > olivier@gautherot.net > www.gautherot.net > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org mailing list > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hardware > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hardware-unsubscribe@freebsd.org > " > From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 24 22:36:33 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF21616A421 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 22:36:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sean@farley.org) Received: from mail.farley.org (farley.org [67.64.95.201]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A53E313C4BC for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 22:36:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sean@farley.org) Received: from thor.farley.org (thor.farley.org [192.168.1.5]) by mail.farley.org (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id l9OMMlh2029851 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 17:22:47 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from sean@farley.org) Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 17:22:47 -0500 (CDT) From: Sean Farley To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="56599777-2066053823-1193264567=:39560" X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.9 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.2.3 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.3 (2007-08-08) on mail.farley.org Subject: RELENG_7 DVD drive access in AHCI/SATA mode X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 22:36:34 -0000 This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. --56599777-2066053823-1193264567=:39560 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; format=flowed; charset=ISO-8859-15 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT I have recently assembled a new system with a SATA DVD drive. Unfortunately, it seems to not be supported FreeBSD 7: ata7: on atapci0 ata7: SATA ATAPI devices not supported yet ata7: [ITHREAD] I am using software (BIOS) RAID on a P5K-E/WiFi (Intel P35 chipset) board. Sadly, the option to manually configure the DVD drive is only available when in IDE mode. In the interim, is it possible to force the drive to IDE (really UDMA) mode? I tried a few attempts at the kernel source to force it to UDMA33 at the point of the warning in ata-chipset.c, but these resulted in panics. On a related note, I wrote a tiny patch[1] to add ICH9R detection. Functionally, this does not change anything since the board was being detected as ICH8 which has the same functionality (SATA300). I sent this to Søren, but I think he is probably busy at this time. Sean 1. http://www.farley.org/freebsd/tmp/ata-chipset.c.diff -- sean@farley.org --56599777-2066053823-1193264567=:39560-- From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 24 23:10:11 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8287A16A417 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 23:10:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from aryeh.friedman@gmail.com) Received: from wx-out-0506.google.com (wx-out-0506.google.com [66.249.82.232]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 389E013C48A for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 23:10:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from aryeh.friedman@gmail.com) Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i29so301225wxd for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 16:10:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc:subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=3sUTD8nbUt2YcbM/3LxX9gheNvhTXGvewfQHiAMAcXs=; b=YkaS2zhecZQqxC2Cq3ApdsX0BYoWSCjYrnowChu/GM6J1zOXfprBpgp7XiIHqCedJ8QHlTFatOUQuUw9NoSf67GErSJVlDh9mqZfrDP4XNC/jV7/Rp/7QoxBNYaFDSMcksQjK1+KtdolvLgq+ZVeplvKq2z4qpDQMfj/YMg6CPM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc:subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=MByOktBk0Omnj35NmEZcgzTN8yBPhaL9K4ceT0k34MynYvVtlRqrohSoNvLAAIqKLcTxqAW7ZiLFfZlA3ujuOXvYxnhUbQDuchEz5mcUY0wnVPKlZMO2uy8zmcLCtXF5GE/fffMayHHRo1usf/28rQ9UvHKePfs7XHcUxXwXZiU= Received: by 10.70.18.11 with SMTP id 11mr1784024wxr.1193265818909; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 15:43:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?192.168.2.2? ( [67.85.89.184]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id m33sm2005326ele.2007.10.24.15.43.37 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Wed, 24 Oct 2007 15:43:37 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <471FC99B.1030704@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 18:39:23 -0400 From: "Aryeh M. Friedman" User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (X11/20071016) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Sean Farley References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Subject: Re: RELENG_7 DVD drive access in AHCI/SATA mode X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 23:10:11 -0000 Sean Farley wrote: > I have recently assembled a new system with a SATA DVD drive. > Unfortunately, it seems to not be supported FreeBSD 7: > > ata7: on atapci0 > ata7: SATA ATAPI devices not supported yet > ata7: [ITHREAD] This is (semi-) fixed in 8-Current (reports sata/300 as sata/150 on actual storage devices) > > > I am using software (BIOS) RAID on a P5K-E/WiFi (Intel P35 chipset) > board. Sadly, the option to manually configure the DVD drive is only > available when in IDE mode. P35's in general have some issues. For example I am still totally unable to see my PATA drives if I have SATA drive(s) installed. > > In the interim, is it possible to force the drive to IDE (really UDMA) > mode? I tried a few attempts at the kernel source to force it to UDMA33 > at the point of the warning in ata-chipset.c, but these resulted in > panics. I have an old 7 patch if you want it. From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 24 23:36:42 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 616E416A418 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 23:36:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scf@FreeBSD.org) Received: from mail.farley.org (farley.org [67.64.95.201]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16EAA13C4A5 for ; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 23:36:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from scf@FreeBSD.org) Received: from thor.farley.org (thor.farley.org [192.168.1.5]) by mail.farley.org (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id l9ONLRKJ030694; Wed, 24 Oct 2007 18:21:27 -0500 (CDT) (envelope-from scf@FreeBSD.org) Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 18:21:27 -0500 (CDT) From: Sean Farley To: "Aryeh M. Friedman" In-Reply-To: <471FC99B.1030704@gmail.com> Message-ID: References: <471FC99B.1030704@gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.4 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,AWL,BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.2.3 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.2.3 (2007-08-08) on mail.farley.org Cc: freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: RELENG_7 DVD drive access in AHCI/SATA mode X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 23:36:42 -0000 On Wed, 24 Oct 2007, Aryeh M. Friedman wrote: > Sean Farley wrote: >> I have recently assembled a new system with a SATA DVD drive. >> Unfortunately, it seems to not be supported FreeBSD 7: >> >> ata7: on atapci0 >> ata7: SATA ATAPI devices not supported yet >> ata7: [ITHREAD] > > This is (semi-) fixed in 8-Current (reports sata/300 as sata/150 on > actual storage devices) That would we be good enough for me. >> I am using software (BIOS) RAID on a P5K-E/WiFi (Intel P35 chipset) >> board. Sadly, the option to manually configure the DVD drive is only >> available when in IDE mode. > > P35's in general have some issues. For example I am still totally > unable to see my PATA drives if I have SATA drive(s) installed. I remember reading about that on various web sites, and that it effected various OS's. This is why I went with all SATA devices. >> In the interim, is it possible to force the drive to IDE (really >> UDMA) mode? I tried a few attempts at the kernel source to force it >> to UDMA33 at the point of the warning in ata-chipset.c, but these >> resulted in panics. > > I have an old 7 patch if you want it. Yes, I would. Thank you. Do you know if it will be MFC'd before release? I can see some frustration for people that try to install FreeBSD 7 from a SATA DVD drive. Sean -- scf@FreeBSD.org From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Oct 25 04:41:09 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A2CF16A418 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 04:41:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-hardware@m.gmane.org) Received: from ciao.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.229.2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A7D213C4A8 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 04:41:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-hardware@m.gmane.org) Received: from list by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1IkuWf-0004Le-Ts for freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 04:40:58 +0000 Received: from brist1-dhcp-137.greenmountainaccess.net ([69.54.15.137]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 04:40:57 +0000 Received: from scott by brist1-dhcp-137.greenmountainaccess.net with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 04:40:57 +0000 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org From: "Scott I. Remick" Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 04:40:48 +0000 (UTC) Lines: 12 Message-ID: References: <471FC99B.1030704@gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: brist1-dhcp-137.greenmountainaccess.net X-Archive: encrypt User-Agent: Pan/0.132 (Waxed in Black) Sender: news Subject: Re: RELENG_7 DVD drive access in AHCI/SATA mode X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 04:41:09 -0000 Might any of this also affect 6.2-STABLE at the moment? I have an all- SATA Asus P5B Deluxe system, and haven't had much luck with my CDRW/DVD drive. If I have SATA set to "IDE" mode, data CDs seem to work but I get issues with audio CDs. If I set the SATA to "AHCI", my hard drives work but my CDRW/DVD drive isn't seen at all (and kicks an error on POST before FreeBSD even loads). See kern/117215 I have everything on the Intel ICH8R controller... I'm thinking maybe moving the CD drive to the JMicron controller if support for that has improved. From owner-freebsd-hardware@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Oct 25 19:10:13 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D7C916A417 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 19:10:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from whizzter@gmail.com) Received: from an-out-0708.google.com (an-out-0708.google.com [209.85.132.242]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 165B713C4A8 for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 19:10:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from whizzter@gmail.com) Received: by an-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id c24so111219ana for ; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 12:10:11 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; bh=REmUX165qeW/Ki3lyEvM4UObR8jzSC4id/TXBVBZfpM=; b=WjdWA1TMlkOdfgwmdfCAM4k/BClsXt3YEuJiGyWG7qJVrexZfW5NTHPWSdsNgZOHj/Gx8L2ojFWyhiy5TLZfAWPpkaJJDJWcuB7o/J6z4Ui47xoO1irVUGE63ppbj4mCqqeUHsF+DU7AXXl1KW8dIq2qfiSlFgcIgAFwAhNYXfo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=FZV8TOxq2xwpArJ/JveUOHqQ+/Y0dOs6cDKpxmRB+gdAuqs1GPm3ZlmyRb99M/tWEmdVgSBJ20YY5W4DaOR8mNS8TqkgvezHsnPb3TkK6o4caybmeyiQYS+slsQp0wKLoZFE/EkN2EWpvJhhpB6xpCl7xxvFnqcXnPX5Bgnwdi8= Received: by 10.142.239.11 with SMTP id m11mr712928wfh.1193339410532; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 12:10:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.142.98.15 with HTTP; Thu, 25 Oct 2007 12:10:10 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <436c7eda0710251210h1a9c59bdq455336c5f0b6661d@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 21:10:10 +0200 From: "Jonas Lund" To: "Bill Paul" , FreeBSD-Hardware MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.5 Cc: Subject: New revision of Linksys X-BeenThere: freebsd-hardware@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: General discussion of FreeBSD hardware List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 19:10:13 -0000 (Someone forward this to current/stable and/or kernel developers) The LinkSys USB200M (usb ethernet interface) has gotten a new revision. vendor 0x13b1 product 0x0018 The vendor ID matches LINKSYS4 , The linux kernel apperantly handles it as a 88772 chip. / Jonas Lund