From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 16:26:49 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB68C106566C; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 16:26:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rwatson@FreeBSD.org) Received: from cyrus.watson.org (cyrus.watson.org [209.31.154.42]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFC898FC08; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 16:26:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rwatson@FreeBSD.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [209.31.154.41]) by cyrus.watson.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA20F46B51; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 12:26:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:26:48 +0100 (BST) From: Robert Watson X-X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: net@FreeBSD.org, current@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <20080630091033.P3968@fledge.watson.org> Message-ID: References: <20080524111715.T64552@fledge.watson.org> <20080629180126.F90836@fledge.watson.org> <20080630091033.P3968@fledge.watson.org> User-Agent: Alpine 1.10 (BSF 962 2008-03-14) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: arch@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: HEAD UP: non-MPSAFE network drivers to be disabled (was: 8.0 network stack MPsafety goals (fwd)) X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 16:26:50 -0000 On Mon, 30 Jun 2008, Robert Watson wrote: > On Sun, 29 Jun 2008, Robert Watson wrote: > >> An FYI on the state of things here: in the last month, John has updated a >> number of device drivers to be MPSAFE, and the USB work remains in-flight. >> I'm holding fire a bit on disabling IFF_NEEDSGIANT while things settle and >> I catch up on driver state, and will likely send out an update next week >> regarding which device drivers remain on the kill list, and generally what >> the status of this project is. > > Here's the revised list of drivers that will have their build disabled in > the next week (subject to an appropriate block of time for me): A quick update: I had postponed removing IFF_NEEDSGIANT while awaiting the apparently forthcoming USB stack commit. Since it appears slow in coming, I will move ahead and disconnect non-USB drivers that require IFF_NEEDSGIANT in the coming week, but will leave the IFF_NEEDSGIANT infrastructure there, along with the current USB drivers that depend on it, until the USB merge is done. Robert N M Watson Computer Laboratory University of Cambridge From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 17:32:14 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1210A106566C; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:32:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from harmony.bsdimp.com (bsdimp.com [199.45.160.85]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5E128FC20; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:32:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.bsdimp.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m73HSbGH038491; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 11:28:37 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 11:28:56 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <20080803.112856.35218914.imp@bsdimp.com> To: ed@80386.nl From: "M. Warner Losh" In-Reply-To: <20080801113935.GM99951@hoeg.nl> References: <20080801113935.GM99951@hoeg.nl> X-Mailer: Mew version 5.2 on Emacs 21.3 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: arch@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Reminder: non-mpsafetty drivers to be connected on Sunday X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 17:32:14 -0000 In message: <20080801113935.GM99951@hoeg.nl> Ed Schouten writes: : Hi all, : : One month ago I sent a schedule to the lists about the MPSAFE TTY code : I'm working on. It contained the following: : : * Ed Schouten wrote: : > August 3 2008: : > Disconnect drivers from the build that haven't been patched in : > the MPSAFE TTY branch. : : This means I'm going to disconnect these drivers on Sunday. I posted a : list of drivers some time ago. The list of drivers is a little different : than what I had posted: : : - I omitted ppp(4) and sl(4) on purpose, because I expected they would : already have been disconnected by this time (IFF_NEEDSGIANT). : : - It seems I forgot to mention ucycom(4) and ufoma(4). These have not : been ported to the new TTY layer. : : This means the complete list of drivers is: : : | USB: ubser(4), ucycom(4), ufoma(4) : | ISA/PCI: cx(4), cy(4), digi(4), rc(4), rp(4), si(4), sio(4) : | Line disciplines: ng_h4(4), ng_tty(4), ppp(4), sl(4), snp(4) This is a lot of functionality to remove on such short notice. : There are a couple of important things to mention here: : : - Some line disciplines (ng_h4(4), ng_tty(4) and snp(4)) will be : restored in the future. After the new TTY code has been imported, a : hooks interface shall be developed, which will allow these drivers to : work once again. Can't you push off the import until these things are done. There have been too many empty promises in the past to accept this at face value. : - PC98 still uses the sio(4) driver. I've decided not to touch PC98 at : this moment. I'll contact the PC98 folks one of these days, to see if : we can already perform a partial migration to uart(4). : : Wrapping up, I'd like to say I really hope we can one day see these : drivers reappear in FreeBSD. Fortunately we've still got a long time : before 8.0-RELEASE. You are moving too fast on this. Please slow down. You promised documentation and such, but that hasn't happened, so a slowdown in your timeline is justified. thank you for your consideration. Warner From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 17:32:16 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C7A41065685; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:32:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from harmony.bsdimp.com (bsdimp.com [199.45.160.85]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0EF88FC2B; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:32:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.bsdimp.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m73HTpov038494; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 11:29:52 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 11:30:10 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <20080803.113010.-1849554152.imp@bsdimp.com> To: phk@phk.freebsd.dk From: "M. Warner Losh" In-Reply-To: <64491.1217595198@critter.freebsd.dk> References: <20080801124845.GZ1359@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <64491.1217595198@critter.freebsd.dk> X-Mailer: Mew version 5.2 on Emacs 21.3 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: arch@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, ed@80386.nl Subject: Re: Reminder: non-mpsafetty drivers to be connected on Sunday X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 17:32:16 -0000 In message: <64491.1217595198@critter.freebsd.dk> "Poul-Henning Kamp" writes: : In message <20080801124845.GZ1359@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org>, Peter Jeremy writes : : : >On 2008-Aug-01 13:40:53 +0200, Ed Schouten wrote: : >>One of the most important things I forgot to mention: I've attached the : >>patch I'm going to commit. Comments on the patch are very welcome! : > : >This patch just disconnects the majority of the serial drivers from : >the build. Whilst I support the aim of making the TTY subsystem : >MPSAFE, as I've previously stated, IMO, just disconnecting everything : >is not the way forward. : : I got a syntax error on this email Peter, didn't you mean to write: : : "Great work Ed, let me send you some patches" NO HE DID NOT. : A MPSAFE tty subsystem is infinitely more important than any particular : non-console tty driver. : : If FreeBSD should have digi(4) support in the future somebody should : spend some quality with the driver, instead of stopping Ed from : making much necessary progress. THINGS ARE GOING IN TOO FAST. PLEASE SLOW DOWN. This is great work, but it is premature at this time. Warner From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 17:34:56 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8AEF8106566B; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:34:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from harmony.bsdimp.com (bsdimp.com [199.45.160.85]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 322DC8FC1B; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:34:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.bsdimp.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m73HWZg9038531; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 11:32:35 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 11:32:53 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <20080803.113253.-532680110.imp@bsdimp.com> To: ed@80386.nl From: "M. Warner Losh" In-Reply-To: <20080801134435.GQ99951@hoeg.nl> References: <64491.1217595198@critter.freebsd.dk> <20080801132624.GG1359@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <20080801134435.GQ99951@hoeg.nl> X-Mailer: Mew version 5.2 on Emacs 21.3 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: phk@phk.freebsd.dk, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Reminder: non-mpsafetty drivers to be *dis*connected on Sunday X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 17:34:56 -0000 In message: <20080801134435.GQ99951@hoeg.nl> Ed Schouten writes: : Maybe I'm replying to too many messages at the same time, but as John : said, it's a lot easier making the remaining drivers work after the code : has been integrated. It's not like we're permanently carving things into : stone - we've almost got a full year to get it all working again. We've heard this promise before. It rarely has resulted in the promised work. I don't think this is the right way forward. Warner From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 17:38:42 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FE2E1065675; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:38:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rwatson@FreeBSD.org) Received: from cyrus.watson.org (cyrus.watson.org [209.31.154.42]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5329D8FC12; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:38:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rwatson@FreeBSD.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [209.31.154.41]) by cyrus.watson.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0900E46B45; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 13:38:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 18:38:40 +0100 (BST) From: Robert Watson X-X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: "M. Warner Losh" In-Reply-To: <20080803.113253.-532680110.imp@bsdimp.com> Message-ID: References: <64491.1217595198@critter.freebsd.dk> <20080801132624.GG1359@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <20080801134435.GQ99951@hoeg.nl> <20080803.113253.-532680110.imp@bsdimp.com> User-Agent: Alpine 1.10 (BSF 962 2008-03-14) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: arch@freebsd.org, ed@80386.nl, phk@phk.freebsd.dk, freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Reminder: non-mpsafetty drivers to be *dis*connected on Sunday X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 17:38:42 -0000 On Sun, 3 Aug 2008, M. Warner Losh wrote: > In message: <20080801134435.GQ99951@hoeg.nl> > Ed Schouten writes: : Maybe I'm replying to too > many messages at the same time, but as John : said, it's a lot easier making > the remaining drivers work after the code : has been integrated. It's not > like we're permanently carving things into : stone - we've almost got a full > year to get it all working again. > > We've heard this promise before. It rarely has resulted in the promised > work. I don't think this is the right way forward. I have to admit that I was quite pleasantly surprised that so many network drivers became MPSAFE in the last couple of months, and USB will nicely round that out. It may help if Ed could take whatever notes he sent Peter about sio and drop them on the Wiki as the beginning of a howto on adapting drivers to the new tty layer. One thing I would really like to see is us taking this as an opportunity to get more people interested in maintaining the tty drivers we have -- now is a really good opportunity for people do adopt drivers and update them. I fall down a bit more on the Warner side here also: I think posting the docs in advance of removing the drivers, and having a couple of weeks gap between those events, is a much more productive way to achieve the goal of updated drivers. It also means that we don't have timeline gaps when serial drivers for devices are broken: when people are playing the binary search game to find some other problem, the last thing they want is to hit dates where their system consoles don't work. Robert N M Watson Computer Laboratory University of Cambridge From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 17:45:15 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35EA7106564A; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:45:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sam@freebsd.org) Received: from ebb.errno.com (ebb.errno.com [69.12.149.25]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A3248FC25; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:45:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sam@freebsd.org) Received: from Macintosh-4.local ([10.0.0.194]) (authenticated bits=0) by ebb.errno.com (8.13.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id m73HisZS034134 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 3 Aug 2008 10:44:54 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from sam@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <4895EE96.9070404@freebsd.org> Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 10:44:54 -0700 From: Sam Leffler Organization: FreeBSD Project User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.16 (Macintosh/20080707) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "M. Warner Losh" References: <64491.1217595198@critter.freebsd.dk> <20080801132624.GG1359@server.vk2pj.dyndns.org> <20080801134435.GQ99951@hoeg.nl> <20080803.113253.-532680110.imp@bsdimp.com> In-Reply-To: <20080803.113253.-532680110.imp@bsdimp.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-DCC-sonic.net-Metrics: ebb.errno.com; whitelist Cc: ed@80386.nl, phk@phk.freebsd.dk, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Reminder: non-mpsafetty drivers to be *dis*connected on Sunday X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 17:45:15 -0000 M. Warner Losh wrote: > In message: <20080801134435.GQ99951@hoeg.nl> > Ed Schouten writes: > : Maybe I'm replying to too many messages at the same time, but as John > : said, it's a lot easier making the remaining drivers work after the code > : has been integrated. It's not like we're permanently carving things into > : stone - we've almost got a full year to get it all working again. > > We've heard this promise before. It rarely has resulted in the > promised work. I don't think this is the right way forward. I'll point out that my vap work languished for almost 3 years waiting for help to convert drivers. That help never really came; people did pitch in towards the end (not to belittle the help I received) but in the end it took sponsorship to see it into the tree. Even now there are drivers that are unfinished (ipw comes to mind) and much work still remains. I am solidly behind Ed and believe his plan is the correct one. Sam From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 17:47:39 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DAFC81065670; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:47:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from harmony.bsdimp.com (bsdimp.com [199.45.160.85]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7ABEE8FC1E; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:47:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.bsdimp.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m73HiJmB038782; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 11:44:19 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 11:44:38 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <20080803.114438.2086213408.imp@bsdimp.com> To: rwatson@freebsd.org From: "M. Warner Losh" In-Reply-To: References: <20080801134435.GQ99951@hoeg.nl> <20080803.113253.-532680110.imp@bsdimp.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 5.2 on Emacs 21.3 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: arch@freebsd.org, ed@80386.nl, phk@phk.freebsd.dk, freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Reminder: non-mpsafetty drivers to be *dis*connected on Sunday X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 17:47:40 -0000 In message: Robert Watson writes: : On Sun, 3 Aug 2008, M. Warner Losh wrote: : : > In message: <20080801134435.GQ99951@hoeg.nl> : > Ed Schouten writes: : Maybe I'm replying to too : > many messages at the same time, but as John : said, it's a lot easier making : > the remaining drivers work after the code : has been integrated. It's not : > like we're permanently carving things into : stone - we've almost got a full : > year to get it all working again. : > : > We've heard this promise before. It rarely has resulted in the promised : > work. I don't think this is the right way forward. : : I have to admit that I was quite pleasantly surprised that so many : network drivers became MPSAFE in the last couple of months, and USB : will nicely round that out. It may help if Ed could take whatever : notes he sent Peter about sio and drop them on the Wiki as the : beginning of a howto on adapting drivers to the new tty layer. One : thing I would really like to see is us taking this as an opportunity : to get more people interested in maintaining the tty drivers we have : -- now is a really good opportunity for people do adopt drivers and : update them. : : I fall down a bit more on the Warner side here also: I think posting : the docs in advance of removing the drivers, and having a couple of : weeks gap between those events, is a much more productive way to : achieve the goal of updated drivers. It also means that we don't : have timeline gaps when serial drivers for devices are broken: when : people are playing the binary search game to find some other : problem, the last thing they want is to hit dates where their system : consoles don't work. Yes. It wouldn't kill us to push this out 4-6 weeks. Having the docs available, even in the wiki form, would help quite a bit. We want to harvest the enthusiasm people like Peter and Peter are showing to convert their drivers. Warner From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 19:48:47 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5AFA1065671; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 19:48:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ed@hoeg.nl) Received: from palm.hoeg.nl (mx0.hoeg.nl [IPv6:2001:610:652::211]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A78538FC14; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 19:48:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ed@hoeg.nl) Received: by palm.hoeg.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id D75221CE93; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 21:48:44 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 21:48:44 +0200 From: Ed Schouten To: "M. Warner Losh" Message-ID: <20080803194844.GA99951@hoeg.nl> References: <20080801113935.GM99951@hoeg.nl> <20080803.112856.35218914.imp@bsdimp.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="Qtzb1h6tVL0ohdDu" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20080803.112856.35218914.imp@bsdimp.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Cc: arch@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current Subject: Re: Reminder: non-mpsafetty drivers to be connected on Sunday X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 19:48:48 -0000 --Qtzb1h6tVL0ohdDu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable * M. Warner Losh wrote: > You are moving too fast on this. Please slow down. You promised > documentation and such, but that hasn't happened, so a slowdown in > your timeline is justified. It's really unfortunate you happen to mention this issue right now. After the message by Peter two days ago, I think I sent him enough documentation to get him started. As discussed with scottl and rwatson, I extended this documentation to something more usable: http://wiki.freebsd.org/TTYRedesign But indeed, this doesn't justify that I haven't written this earlier on. --=20 Ed Schouten WWW: http://80386.nl/ --Qtzb1h6tVL0ohdDu Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (FreeBSD) iEYEARECAAYFAkiWC5wACgkQ52SDGA2eCwX0lgCfRN81IAi/qtQp9CYeTlO55akO WzsAnRBhepEmL49sV8ct3PU5+iStR0SV =rNHx -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Qtzb1h6tVL0ohdDu-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 20:19:35 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D5761065684; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 20:19:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from harmony.bsdimp.com (bsdimp.com [199.45.160.85]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A8B18FC08; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 20:19:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.bsdimp.com (8.14.2/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m73KHPit040347; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 14:17:25 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from imp@bsdimp.com) Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 14:17:44 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <20080803.141744.-552483469.imp@bsdimp.com> To: ed@80386.nl From: "M. Warner Losh" In-Reply-To: <20080803194844.GA99951@hoeg.nl> References: <20080801113935.GM99951@hoeg.nl> <20080803.112856.35218914.imp@bsdimp.com> <20080803194844.GA99951@hoeg.nl> X-Mailer: Mew version 5.2 on Emacs 21.3 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: arch@freebsd.org, freebsd-current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Reminder: non-mpsafetty drivers to be connected on Sunday X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 20:19:35 -0000 In message: <20080803194844.GA99951@hoeg.nl> Ed Schouten writes: : * M. Warner Losh wrote: : > You are moving too fast on this. Please slow down. You promised : > documentation and such, but that hasn't happened, so a slowdown in : > your timeline is justified. : : It's really unfortunate you happen to mention this issue right now. : After the message by Peter two days ago, I think I sent him enough : documentation to get him started. As discussed with scottl and rwatson, : I extended this documentation to something more usable: : : http://wiki.freebsd.org/TTYRedesign : : But indeed, this doesn't justify that I haven't written this earlier on. Yes, it is unfortunate that I mention it now. I should have said something sooner too. However, I'm not saying anything that hasn't been said by others in the past few days and weeks. I'm just yelling it more loudly than they chose to. I saw the earlier discussions, and thought things were going well, but haven't had the time to pay attention in the last couple of weeks. Still, please don't shoot the messenger too much. Warner From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 20:36:23 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 121BE106564A; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 20:36:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rwatson@FreeBSD.org) Received: from cyrus.watson.org (cyrus.watson.org [209.31.154.42]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90B498FC1E; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 20:36:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rwatson@FreeBSD.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [209.31.154.41]) by cyrus.watson.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BE8446B66; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 16:36:17 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 21:36:17 +0100 (BST) From: Robert Watson X-X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: "M. Warner Losh" In-Reply-To: <20080803.141744.-552483469.imp@bsdimp.com> Message-ID: References: <20080801113935.GM99951@hoeg.nl> <20080803.112856.35218914.imp@bsdimp.com> <20080803194844.GA99951@hoeg.nl> <20080803.141744.-552483469.imp@bsdimp.com> User-Agent: Alpine 1.10 (BSF 962 2008-03-14) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: ed@80386.nl, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Reminder: non-mpsafetty drivers to be connected on Sunday X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 20:36:23 -0000 On Sun, 3 Aug 2008, M. Warner Losh wrote: > In message: <20080803194844.GA99951@hoeg.nl> > Ed Schouten writes: > : * M. Warner Losh wrote: > : > You are moving too fast on this. Please slow down. You promised > : > documentation and such, but that hasn't happened, so a slowdown in > : > your timeline is justified. > : > : It's really unfortunate you happen to mention this issue right now. > : After the message by Peter two days ago, I think I sent him enough > : documentation to get him started. As discussed with scottl and rwatson, > : I extended this documentation to something more usable: > : > : http://wiki.freebsd.org/TTYRedesign > : > : But indeed, this doesn't justify that I haven't written this earlier on. > > Yes, it is unfortunate that I mention it now. I should have said something > sooner too. However, I'm not saying anything that hasn't been said by > others in the past few days and weeks. I'm just yelling it more loudly than > they chose to. I saw the earlier discussions, and thought things were going > well, but haven't had the time to pay attention in the last couple of weeks. > Still, please don't shoot the messenger too much. I'm a fan of giving it a week or two breather and focusing on updating drivers, documentation, etc, and then merging it all in mid-august. I don't think there's any need to delay things a month, but if we have eager hands (Peter Jeremy, Peter Wemm?) waiting to update drivers given a bit of documentation, now is the time for them to start looking at the wiki and figuring out what they're missing. BTW, what do you (Ed) think of uploading the patch for one of the drivers to the wiki and annotating the diffs? Robert N M Watson Computer Laboratory University of Cambridge From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 20:46:46 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8B00106564A; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 20:46:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ed@hoeg.nl) Received: from palm.hoeg.nl (mx0.hoeg.nl [IPv6:2001:610:652::211]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94FC88FC0A; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 20:46:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ed@hoeg.nl) Received: by palm.hoeg.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id C313C1CDAA; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 22:46:45 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 22:46:45 +0200 From: Ed Schouten To: Robert Watson Message-ID: <20080803204645.GD99951@hoeg.nl> References: <20080801113935.GM99951@hoeg.nl> <20080803.112856.35218914.imp@bsdimp.com> <20080803194844.GA99951@hoeg.nl> <20080803.141744.-552483469.imp@bsdimp.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="5PPnVwj6ulmYFu5t" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Cc: arch@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current Subject: Re: Reminder: non-mpsafetty drivers to be connected on Sunday X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 20:46:47 -0000 --5PPnVwj6ulmYFu5t Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello Robert, * Robert Watson wrote: > I'm a fan of giving it a week or two breather and focusing on updating = =20 > drivers, documentation, etc, and then merging it all in mid-august. I=20 > don't think there's any need to delay things a month, My thoughts exactly. I also mentioned this in a private message to Warner. I'm sure we'll talk about this at the DevSummit, which is a good thing. As I once mentioned, it would be rather painful for me if we would delay it too long, because now is my summer break and in September it is not. > but if we have eager hands (Peter Jeremy, Peter Wemm?) waiting to > update drivers given a bit of documentation, now is the time for them > to start looking at the wiki and figuring out what they're missing. Yes. Peter Wemm already mentioned he doesn't mind fixing up si(4) after the import, which also removes some of the pressure. As mentioned on the Wiki page: don't be shy to poke me if you have any questions/comments! > BTW, what do you (Ed) think of uploading the patch for one of the > drivers to the wiki and annotating the diffs? That sounds like a good idea. I think I'll annotate /sys/ia64/ia64/ssc.c, which has become really simple after it had been ported to mpsafetty. --=20 Ed Schouten WWW: http://80386.nl/ --5PPnVwj6ulmYFu5t Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (FreeBSD) iEYEARECAAYFAkiWGTUACgkQ52SDGA2eCwWTfgCdFVbUV3v+iFbK2uIDTp1GOzkz KC8AmQGDz+Yd0PX2eERFRJ8FuKMX5+pr =Khn6 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --5PPnVwj6ulmYFu5t-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Aug 3 21:26:59 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64755106568C; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 21:26:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rwatson@FreeBSD.org) Received: from cyrus.watson.org (cyrus.watson.org [209.31.154.42]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0D9E8FC1C; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 21:26:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rwatson@FreeBSD.org) Received: from fledge.watson.org (fledge.watson.org [209.31.154.41]) by cyrus.watson.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FB6846B42; Sun, 3 Aug 2008 17:26:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 3 Aug 2008 22:26:57 +0100 (BST) From: Robert Watson X-X-Sender: robert@fledge.watson.org To: Ed Schouten In-Reply-To: <20080803204645.GD99951@hoeg.nl> Message-ID: References: <20080801113935.GM99951@hoeg.nl> <20080803.112856.35218914.imp@bsdimp.com> <20080803194844.GA99951@hoeg.nl> <20080803.141744.-552483469.imp@bsdimp.com> <20080803204645.GD99951@hoeg.nl> User-Agent: Alpine 1.10 (BSF 962 2008-03-14) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Cc: arch@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current Subject: Re: Reminder: non-mpsafetty drivers to be connected on Sunday X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 03 Aug 2008 21:26:59 -0000 On Sun, 3 Aug 2008, Ed Schouten wrote: > * Robert Watson wrote: >> I'm a fan of giving it a week or two breather and focusing on updating >> drivers, documentation, etc, and then merging it all in mid-august. I >> don't think there's any need to delay things a month, > > My thoughts exactly. I also mentioned this in a private message to Warner. > I'm sure we'll talk about this at the DevSummit, which is a good thing. As I > once mentioned, it would be rather painful for me if we would delay it too > long, because now is my summer break and in September it is not. I think this sounds fine. My big concern, btw, is not in any way with the shape/quality of the work you've done --- rather, it's that I want to avoid, as much as possible, knocking people off the head of 8.x as developers or users. Experience suggests that the more rough bumps people get on the development head, the more likely they are to fall back to some or another -stable, or try to "wait out" the problem by going away for a month or two. This has a negative impact on testing, since it means fewer users, and it has a negative impact on overall development rate. It's not that that any particular breakage is the end of the world, it's just that as people bump along, they eventually hit a bump there they could spend four more hours trying to figure out why the box appears not to boot, or they could just fall back and get work done, and you get a gradual attrition. This is, btw, one reason why using Perforce has actually significant accelerated development: projects are more mature before they are merged, so are less likely to knock people off. Which doesn't mean we don't need occasional breakage, it just means we have to moderate it, give people plenty of warning, etc. This avoids cascading and cyclic development failures along the lines of "I'll wait until bgfsck is stable before trying HEAD and fixing KSE", "I'll wait until KSE is stable before trying HEAD and fixing SMP", etc. :-) Robert N M Watson Computer Laboratory University of Cambridge From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Aug 4 11:06:52 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D40AC106564A for ; Mon, 4 Aug 2008 11:06:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::28]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA8878FC1F for ; Mon, 4 Aug 2008 11:06:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m74B6qB0082009 for ; Mon, 4 Aug 2008 11:06:52 GMT (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: (from gnats@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.14.2/8.14.1/Submit) id m74B6qNV082005 for freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org; Mon, 4 Aug 2008 11:06:52 GMT (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2008 11:06:52 GMT Message-Id: <200808041106.m74B6qNV082005@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: gnats set sender to owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org using -f From: FreeBSD bugmaster To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Cc: Subject: Current problem reports assigned to freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 Aug 2008 11:06:52 -0000 Current FreeBSD problem reports Critical problems Serious problems Non-critical problems S Tracker Resp. Description -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- o kern/120749 arch [request] Suggest upping the default kern.ps_arg_cache 1 problem total. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 5 09:42:06 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6305110656A4 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 09:42:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from nwhitehorn@freebsd.org) Received: from mail.icecube.wisc.edu (ice.icecube.wisc.edu [128.104.255.119]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C0D88FC22 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 09:42:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from nwhitehorn@freebsd.org) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mail.icecube.wisc.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3649686B19 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 04:23:39 -0500 (CDT) Received: from mail.icecube.wisc.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (ice.icecube.wisc.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id 25495-07 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 04:23:37 -0500 (CDT) Received: from wanderer.tachypleus.net (natr.physik.hu-berlin.de [141.20.47.46]) by mail.icecube.wisc.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 691BC86AF7 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 04:23:37 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <48981C19.8060009@freebsd.org> Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2008 11:23:37 +0200 From: Nathan Whitehorn User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.16 (X11/20080804) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at ice.icecube.wisc.edu Subject: UMA MD Small Allocator Runtime Switching X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2008 09:42:06 -0000 I'm working on the PowerPC G5 port right now, and have run into a problem with the way the UMA small allocator works. On G3/G4 systems, there is a direct physical->virtual mapping, and on G5s there isn't. All of the infrastructure is in place to support both types of system with a single kernel image, except that UMA_MD_SMALL_ALLOC must be switched on/off at runtime. One solution is to put if (direct_map) use_nonsmall_case() into the MD small_alloc/free() routines and define UMA_MD_SMALL_ALLOC everywhere. This works well, except that the MI UMA code then sets booted = 1 too early in the boot process, before the kmem_alloc*() routines are available. Basically, I need to find a way have an MD UMA allocator without the MI UMA code assuming anything about how it works internally. Maybe adding a UMA_MD_ALLOC_LATE define to prevent setting booted=1 early on? -Nathan From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 5 14:52:58 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04EB9106568A for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 14:52:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from asmrookie@gmail.com) Received: from fg-out-1718.google.com (fg-out-1718.google.com [72.14.220.157]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 095398FC1C for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 14:52:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from asmrookie@gmail.com) Received: by fg-out-1718.google.com with SMTP id l26so3442330fgb.35 for ; Tue, 05 Aug 2008 07:52:55 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:sender :to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type :content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references :x-google-sender-auth; bh=UDLhpwt/PbU+zqcaW3d2G2EGwJL2GHGGrwMNmHqT0Vw=; b=MaPnTTwpQ5gnJKj+gYqa/lMa0H72h6HMZIT5vY8Vv1COlKEfuw0bxvk6jIIL1ZvPEr ef5NNPGWLAJ7NhlJIxALnVxMxAT4dA6nNZfV/L+qp5FvAgA/P8VaS9PS/+4P0ORFnxDJ jftmYozRj8yILA54agZMbNbW3VXpiQFM01VHw= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:sender:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition :references:x-google-sender-auth; b=UOV4Aut+EPg4It84AUHoUShKMD0xTQMIVOQgrAgWd/gMB4NnQoqrH0nLSoyCwClAZv JGn9N5zafO/JFUWjxXKPZ8cn4DRtgOYFxNXeUDAvGyLvEaLGjfPS4DUBRaragRuH4D8p XU3bQzq+h3NTESLF237iP5yWiA9LLdWNCbqmg= Received: by 10.86.95.20 with SMTP id s20mr11738278fgb.65.1217947975367; Tue, 05 Aug 2008 07:52:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.86.78.14 with HTTP; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 07:52:55 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3bbf2fe10808050752ra9bf259x45627660245d3ad9@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 16:52:55 +0200 From: "Attilio Rao" Sender: asmrookie@gmail.com To: "Jeff Roberson" In-Reply-To: <20080718163231.B954@desktop> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <20080718163231.B954@desktop> X-Google-Sender-Auth: c961740b98a5b2e8 Cc: arch@freebsd.org, ivmaykov@gmail.com Subject: Re: witness performance improvements X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2008 14:52:58 -0000 2008/7/19, Jeff Roberson : > Hello, > > I have a patch that improves witness performance available at: > > http://people.freebsd.org/~jeff/witness.diff > > This improvement comes at the cost of some significant space overhead. It > changes the witness graph from a linked tree to a matrix based approach. > Relationships can be quickly resolved with a table lookup. The table size > is WITNESS_COUNT^2, or 1MB with the current count of 1024. > > This patch also makes struct witness objects persistent even after the last > lock using this name has been removed. This is helpful for short lived > objects which may be created frequently. > > To reduce lock contention on SMP witness_checkorder() now runs without the > w_mtx when there are no lock violations. I also cache a lock_list_entry in > each thread as allocating these requires the w_mtx. The entry is disposed > of at thread_exit(). > > There is also a new sysctl that produces dot output which graphs lock order > relationships with the graphviz program. > > Most of this work was done by Ilya Maykov while he was at Isilon systems. > The locking work and some cleanup/porting/refinement was done by me on > behalf of Nokia. > > The performance improvement can be significant. It is only on the order of > 10-20% for buildkernel but on a packet forwarding test at nokia it sped > things up by 5x putting a witness enabled kernel within about 50% of the > performance of a kernel without. I believe buildworld isn't helped as much > because forking and exiting a lot would then contend on the witness lock. Hello, here there is a fixed version of the Jeff's patch: http://community.gufi.org/~rookie/witness_fast.diff It fixes some bugs, imports the "comma serparated" approach for fullgraph and drops the cyclegraph (which can be now evicted by the fullgraph through handy scripts). I'd like people test this "final" version before it hits the tree and give feedbacks. Thanks, Attilio PS: consider this patch not exactly to be set as an example in regard of "diff reduction against head" :) -- Peace can only be achieved by understanding - A. Einstein From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Tue Aug 5 18:58:20 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7A6E10656A1; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 18:58:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) Received: from server.baldwin.cx (bigknife-pt.tunnel.tserv9.chi1.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f10:75::2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FCB48FC23; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 18:58:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) Received: from localhost.corp.yahoo.com (john@localhost [IPv6:::1]) (authenticated bits=0) by server.baldwin.cx (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m75IwA2U094551; Tue, 5 Aug 2008 14:58:11 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) From: John Baldwin To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2008 10:24:25 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.7 References: <48981C19.8060009@freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: <48981C19.8060009@freebsd.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200808051024.27043.jhb@freebsd.org> X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH authentication, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (server.baldwin.cx [IPv6:::1]); Tue, 05 Aug 2008 14:58:11 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.93.1/7946/Tue Aug 5 13:44:22 2008 on server.baldwin.cx X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.3 required=4.2 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, DATE_IN_PAST_03_06,NO_RELAYS autolearn=ham version=3.1.3 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.3 (2006-06-01) on server.baldwin.cx Cc: Nathan Whitehorn Subject: Re: UMA MD Small Allocator Runtime Switching X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2008 18:58:20 -0000 On Tuesday 05 August 2008 05:23:37 am Nathan Whitehorn wrote: > I'm working on the PowerPC G5 port right now, and have run into a > problem with the way the UMA small allocator works. On G3/G4 systems, > there is a direct physical->virtual mapping, and on G5s there isn't. All > of the infrastructure is in place to support both types of system with a > single kernel image, except that UMA_MD_SMALL_ALLOC must be switched > on/off at runtime. > > One solution is to put if (direct_map) use_nonsmall_case() into the MD > small_alloc/free() routines and define UMA_MD_SMALL_ALLOC everywhere. > This works well, except that the MI UMA code then sets booted = 1 too > early in the boot process, before the kmem_alloc*() routines are available. > > Basically, I need to find a way have an MD UMA allocator without the MI > UMA code assuming anything about how it works internally. Maybe adding a > UMA_MD_ALLOC_LATE define to prevent setting booted=1 early on? > -Nathan Have you considered creating an artificial direct map region in the address space on the G5? Some of the other 64-bit ports (amd64 and sparc64) do this to gain the benefits of the direct map even though it isn't a mandated part of the architecture like it is on some other platforms (alpha and mips). -- John Baldwin From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 7 14:59:32 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CD81106567E; Thu, 7 Aug 2008 14:59:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gonzo@freebsd.org) Received: from luidgi.portaone.com (luidgi.portaone.com [195.138.219.143]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E3218FC19; Thu, 7 Aug 2008 14:59:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gonzo@freebsd.org) Received: from mail.pbxpress.com ([65.61.203.142] helo=leaf.pbxpress.com) by luidgi.portaone.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256)id 1KR6dh-0003aU-2Y; Thu, 07 Aug 2008 07:38:53 -0700 Received: from jeeves.bluezbox.com (k3-gw.portaone.com [193.28.87.193]) (authenticated bits=0) by leaf.pbxpress.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id m77Efxn5019985 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 7 Aug 2008 07:42:06 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gonzo@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <489B08F6.8060605@freebsd.org> Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2008 17:38:46 +0300 From: Oleksandr Tymoshenko User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (X11/20080704) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=F8rgrav?= References: <20080729.161303.709402272.imp@bsdimp.com> <86r69buar0.fsf@ds4.des.no> In-Reply-To: <86r69buar0.fsf@ds4.des.no> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, recieved from trusted server Cc: kan@freebsd.org, arch@freebsd.org, pjd@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Need a code review X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2008 14:59:32 -0000 Dag-Erling Smørgrav wrote: > "M. Warner Losh" writes: >> http://people.freebsd.org/~gonzo/mips2/libpam.diff > > This won't work. Your patch unconditionally sets NO_STATIC_MODULES > which will result in a non-functional libpam.a (the modules will be > built into the library, but without any of the glue that allows the > library to find them) not just on mips, but on all other platforms. openpam detects static modules build using cpp(1) condition: #if defined(__GNUC__) && !defined(__PIC__) && !defined(NO_STATIC_MODULES) The problem is that gcc MIPS option -mabi-calls assumes -fpic for both static and dynamic builds. So the question is: would defining NO_STATIC_MODULES for MIPS be enough or it should be addressed upstream? PS NetBSD stumbled upon it too: http://mail-index.netbsd.org/port-sgimips/2008/01/29/msg000058.html -- gonzo From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 7 17:36:56 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F066106566C; Thu, 7 Aug 2008 17:36:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gonzo@freebsd.org) Received: from luidgi.portaone.com (luidgi.portaone.com [195.138.219.143]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BCDE8FC26; Thu, 7 Aug 2008 17:36:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gonzo@freebsd.org) Received: from mail.pbxpress.com ([65.61.203.142] helo=leaf.pbxpress.com) by luidgi.portaone.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256)id 1KR9Pz-000OFW-IU; Thu, 07 Aug 2008 10:36:55 -0700 Received: from jeeves.bluezbox.com (82.193.112.144.ipnet.kiev.ua [82.193.112.144]) (authenticated bits=0) by leaf.pbxpress.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id m77HdpiM022795 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 7 Aug 2008 10:40:08 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from gonzo@freebsd.org) Message-ID: <489B32A2.1090302@freebsd.org> Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2008 20:36:34 +0300 From: Oleksandr Tymoshenko User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (X11/20080704) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Oleksandr Tymoshenko References: <20080729.161303.709402272.imp@bsdimp.com> <86r69buar0.fsf@ds4.des.no> <489B08F6.8060605@freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: <489B08F6.8060605@freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Status: No, recieved from trusted server Cc: kan@freebsd.org, =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=F8rgrav?= , pjd@freebsd.org, arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Need a code review X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2008 17:36:56 -0000 Oleksandr Tymoshenko wrote: > Dag-Erling Smørgrav wrote: >> "M. Warner Losh" writes: >>> http://people.freebsd.org/~gonzo/mips2/libpam.diff >> >> This won't work. Your patch unconditionally sets NO_STATIC_MODULES >> which will result in a non-functional libpam.a (the modules will be >> built into the library, but without any of the glue that allows the >> library to find them) not just on mips, but on all other platforms. > > openpam detects static modules build using cpp(1) condition: > #if defined(__GNUC__) && !defined(__PIC__) && !defined(NO_STATIC_MODULES) > The problem is that gcc MIPS option -mabi-calls assumes -fpic for both > static and dynamic builds. So the question is: would defining > NO_STATIC_MODULES for MIPS be enough or it should be addressed > upstream? And diff in question is *completely* wrong. NO_STATIC_MODULES should be added to flags when compiling objects for shlib, not to PICFLAGS Actual "fix" passed unnoticed by me in contrib/openpam, sorry for misguiding. -- gonzo From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Aug 7 23:06:43 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7E841065675; Thu, 7 Aug 2008 23:06:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from tim.des.no (tim.des.no [194.63.250.121]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53BE28FC15; Thu, 7 Aug 2008 23:06:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from des@des.no) Received: from ds4.des.no (des.no [84.49.246.2]) by smtp.des.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62431207E; Fri, 8 Aug 2008 01:06:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: by ds4.des.no (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 39E2184497; Fri, 8 Aug 2008 01:06:42 +0200 (CEST) From: =?utf-8?Q?Dag-Erling_Sm=C3=B8rgrav?= To: Oleksandr Tymoshenko References: <20080729.161303.709402272.imp@bsdimp.com> <86r69buar0.fsf@ds4.des.no> <489B08F6.8060605@freebsd.org> Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2008 01:06:42 +0200 In-Reply-To: <489B08F6.8060605@freebsd.org> (Oleksandr Tymoshenko's message of "Thu, 07 Aug 2008 17:38:46 +0300") Message-ID: <867iasfmrh.fsf@ds4.des.no> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/23.0.60 (berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cc: kan@freebsd.org, arch@freebsd.org, pjd@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Need a code review X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2008 23:06:43 -0000 Oleksandr Tymoshenko writes: > openpam detects static modules build using cpp(1) condition: > #if defined(__GNUC__) && !defined(__PIC__) && !defined(NO_STATIC_MODULES) > The problem is that gcc MIPS option -mabi-calls assumes -fpic for both > static and dynamic builds. So the question is: would defining > NO_STATIC_MODULES for MIPS be enough or it should be addressed > upstream? "upstream" in this case means me. DES --=20 Dag-Erling Sm=C3=B8rgrav - des@des.no From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Fri Aug 8 10:56:06 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEB14106567C; Fri, 8 Aug 2008 10:56:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ed@hoeg.nl) Received: from palm.hoeg.nl (mx0.hoeg.nl [IPv6:2001:610:652::211]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F8078FC17; Fri, 8 Aug 2008 10:56:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ed@hoeg.nl) Received: by palm.hoeg.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 6E9CD1CFED; Fri, 8 Aug 2008 12:56:05 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 12:56:05 +0200 From: Ed Schouten To: FreeBSD Current , FreeBSD Arch Message-ID: <20080808105605.GN99951@hoeg.nl> References: <20080702190901.GS14567@hoeg.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="N709L9vpgywc1qLv" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20080702190901.GS14567@hoeg.nl> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Cc: Subject: MPSAFE TTY schedule delay: 10 days X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2008 10:56:06 -0000 --N709L9vpgywc1qLv Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello everyone, Today it's August 8, which means I should have sent you the following: * Ed Schouten wrote: > August 8 2008: > Send the last heads-up to the lists, to warn people about the > big commit. >=20 > August 10 2008: > Commit the new MPSAFE TTY driver in several commits (first > commit the layer itself, then commit changes to drivers one by > one). After some discussion, I decided to delay the import of the MPSAFE TTY code 10 days. This means I'm going to send the big heads-up on August 18 (last day of the DevSummit). As usual, I should point people to the following URL: > Please, make sure we can make this a smooth transition by > testing/reviewing my code. I tend to generate diffs very often. They can > be downloaded here: >=20 > http://www.il.fontys.nl/~ed/projects/mpsafetty/patches/ It would be really nice if I could get some more reviews on the MPSAFE TTY code. Thanks! --=20 Ed Schouten WWW: http://80386.nl/ --N709L9vpgywc1qLv Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (FreeBSD) iEYEARECAAYFAkicJkUACgkQ52SDGA2eCwXbagCfc0ny7UxxeCyEwIo21daBaZC6 4n0AnAkClX1f5cD9cWcqnDdJ4JSOBYv1 =Uu1v -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --N709L9vpgywc1qLv-- From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Aug 9 21:02:33 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68DA6106568D for ; Sat, 9 Aug 2008 21:02:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) Received: from server.baldwin.cx (bigknife-pt.tunnel.tserv9.chi1.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f10:75::2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 085DB8FC21 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 2008 21:02:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) Received: from zion.baldwin.cx (zion.baldwin.cx [IPv6:2001:470:1f11:75:2a0:d2ff:fe18:8b38]) (authenticated bits=0) by server.baldwin.cx (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m79L1w7O043547 for ; Sat, 9 Aug 2008 17:02:26 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) From: John Baldwin To: arch@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 9 Aug 2008 16:37:33 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200808091637.33820.jhb@freebsd.org> X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH authentication, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (server.baldwin.cx [IPv6:2001:470:1f11:75::1]); Sat, 09 Aug 2008 17:02:26 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.93.1/7995/Sat Aug 9 14:55:20 2008 on server.baldwin.cx X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=4.2 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,NO_RELAYS autolearn=ham version=3.1.3 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.3 (2006-06-01) on server.baldwin.cx Cc: Subject: Make MOD_QUIESCE a bit more useful.. X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 09 Aug 2008 21:02:33 -0000 So currently the MOD_QUIESCE event is posted to a module when unloading a kld so it can veto non-forced unloads. However, the current implementation in the kernel linker is to run through all the modules in a file, posting MOD_QUIESCE followed by MOD_UNLOAD on each module serially. Thus, if you have multiple modules in a single kld and one of the modules veto's an unload request via MOD_QUIESCE, you don't know as the module author if any of your modules were unloaded via MOD_UNLOAD or not. I think a better approach would be to change the kernel linker to invoke MOD_QUIESCE on all modules in a single pass first. If none of those fail (or it's a forced unload), then it can do a second pass invoking MOD_UNLOAD on all the modules. -- John Baldwin