From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Sun Oct 5 01:17:10 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EEF191065690 for ; Sun, 5 Oct 2008 01:17:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hentschel@gmail.com) Received: from rv-out-0506.google.com (rv-out-0506.google.com [209.85.198.236]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2A318FC19 for ; Sun, 5 Oct 2008 01:17:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hentschel@gmail.com) Received: by rv-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id b25so2039625rvf.43 for ; Sat, 04 Oct 2008 18:17:10 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:from:to :content-type:x-mailer:mime-version:subject :content-transfer-encoding:date; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; b=lLkNq59DaWc5Y7oAQyK6QZQDBtwrva84h/Tv2PdO62eYMHP35NZoq4ePgjKZ+JNTyD 9+d9D4zeql3tk9sW0hWujvXNeG5kSHddOtnUfsUY3h1Q5g8Ik8iR7xjglEHb8Kx0WJXc 4G1eTqkkNv+BBd1aWp7AoqLJN02RtEU8iEBnk= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:from:to:content-type:x-mailer:mime-version:subject :content-transfer-encoding:date; b=SDQ/0/Mrpk6RKGOqMgC2ZrxHpp2rIk8mXNuTlit9Rx0KeQks3zZURxnxwbPJwqRvFD 6nZx518q9sKnf+1kHmFg5Jk+1f+XfNIeuBGMnskfy7gPHYsYT+LmoJ0N+Yph0oNDcQek SghfgvWHFKKlcEubCi8JoIdTQb48Gdv2P644o= Received: by 10.140.191.14 with SMTP id o14mr1760061rvf.247.1223168044696; Sat, 04 Oct 2008 17:54:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?25.233.247.172? (m7f0e36d0.tmodns.net [208.54.14.127]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id b8sm19518879rvf.4.2008.10.04.17.54.02 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sat, 04 Oct 2008 17:54:03 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: From: Thomas Hentschel To: "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (1C28) Mime-Version: 1.0 (iPhone Mail 1C28) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 17:50:45 -0700 Subject: T X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 01:17:11 -0000 From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Mon Oct 6 11:06:51 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E62F61065693 for ; Mon, 6 Oct 2008 11:06:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (freefall.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::28]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA1198FC23 for ; Mon, 6 Oct 2008 11:06:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: from freefall.freebsd.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m96B6pxF035412 for ; Mon, 6 Oct 2008 11:06:51 GMT (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Received: (from gnats@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.14.2/8.14.1/Submit) id m96B6p2h035408 for freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org; Mon, 6 Oct 2008 11:06:51 GMT (envelope-from owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org) Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 11:06:51 GMT Message-Id: <200810061106.m96B6p2h035408@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: gnats set sender to owner-bugmaster@FreeBSD.org using -f From: FreeBSD bugmaster To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org Cc: Subject: Current problem reports assigned to freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.org X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 11:06:52 -0000 Note: to view an individual PR, use: http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=(number). The following is a listing of current problems submitted by FreeBSD users. These represent problem reports covering all versions including experimental development code and obsolete releases. S Tracker Resp. Description -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- o kern/120749 arch [request] Suggest upping the default kern.ps_arg_cache 1 problem total. From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 8 19:46:00 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD7F3106568A for ; Wed, 8 Oct 2008 19:46:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: from hydrogen.funkthat.com (gate.funkthat.com [69.17.45.168]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9333C8FC14 for ; Wed, 8 Oct 2008 19:46:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: from hydrogen.funkthat.com (afovc3ry8z1iq4hm@localhost.funkthat.com [127.0.0.1]) by hydrogen.funkthat.com (8.13.6/8.13.3) with ESMTP id m98JYfLR045975; Wed, 8 Oct 2008 12:34:41 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmg@hydrogen.funkthat.com) Received: (from jmg@localhost) by hydrogen.funkthat.com (8.13.6/8.13.3/Submit) id m98JYe01045974; Wed, 8 Oct 2008 12:34:40 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from jmg) Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 12:34:40 -0700 From: John-Mark Gurney To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F8ren?= Schmidt Message-ID: <20081008193440.GR783@funkthat.com> Mail-Followup-To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F8ren?= Schmidt , Oleksandr Tymoshenko , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org References: <48E6D21E.8040808@bluezbox.com> <0D306A28-85B2-413D-8A28-862C3C2CE18E@FreeBSD.ORG> <48E7AE7D.6020709@bluezbox.com> <8C0B1202-5DF8-45CF-82EA-03367BFABAE7@FreeBSD.ORG> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <8C0B1202-5DF8-45CF-82EA-03367BFABAE7@FreeBSD.ORG> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 5.4-RELEASE-p6 i386 X-Files: The truth is out there X-URL: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/ X-Resume: http://resnet.uoregon.edu/~gurney_j/resume.html X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-3.0 (hydrogen.funkthat.com [127.0.0.1]); Wed, 08 Oct 2008 12:34:41 -0700 (PDT) Cc: Oleksandr Tymoshenko , freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Modular ata chipsets data X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 19:46:00 -0000 Sren Schmidt wrote this message on Sat, Oct 04, 2008 at 20:31 +0200: > How to select the proper modules at config/compile time without > drowning in "option ATA_BLA_BLA" in the config. Possibly use an include file that lists all of the options/devices, and then people who want to reduce it can remove it and put the respective lines in their config file directly, or turn them off through no prefix... -- John-Mark Gurney Voice: +1 415 225 5579 "All that I will do, has been done, All that I have, has not." From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Wed Oct 8 21:45:17 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 292511065687; Wed, 8 Oct 2008 21:45:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) Received: from server.baldwin.cx (bigknife-pt.tunnel.tserv9.chi1.ipv6.he.net [IPv6:2001:470:1f10:75::2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C5D18FC16; Wed, 8 Oct 2008 21:45:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) Received: from localhost.corp.yahoo.com (john@localhost [IPv6:::1]) (authenticated bits=0) by server.baldwin.cx (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m98Lj5u2059033; Wed, 8 Oct 2008 17:45:05 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from jhb@freebsd.org) From: John Baldwin To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 17:43:44 -0400 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.7 References: <48E6D21E.8040808@bluezbox.com> <48E7AE7D.6020709@bluezbox.com> <8C0B1202-5DF8-45CF-82EA-03367BFABAE7@FreeBSD.ORG> In-Reply-To: <8C0B1202-5DF8-45CF-82EA-03367BFABAE7@FreeBSD.ORG> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200810081743.45011.jhb@freebsd.org> X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH authentication, not delayed by milter-greylist-2.0.2 (server.baldwin.cx [IPv6:::1]); Wed, 08 Oct 2008 17:45:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.93.1/8396/Wed Oct 8 14:48:47 2008 on server.baldwin.cx X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=4.2 tests=BAYES_00,NO_RELAYS autolearn=ham version=3.1.3 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.3 (2006-06-01) on server.baldwin.cx Cc: Oleksandr Tymoshenko , =?iso-8859-1?q?S=F8ren_Schmidt?= Subject: Re: Modular ata chipsets data X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 21:45:17 -0000 On Saturday 04 October 2008 02:31:35 pm S=F8ren Schmidt wrote: > I found the devel tree with a modulerized ATA subsystem in it, and =20 > just upgraded it to the latest greatest from -current. > It can be found on http://deepcore.dk/pub/ATA as two files, ata-=20 > modules-diff that contains a diff for /sys/conf/files and ata-=20 > modules.tgz that is a replacement for /sys/dev/ata. > This turns the chipset parts into a module for each vendor, and they =20 > are all compiled in as is, however they can be left out on a pr vendor =20 > basis (there are a few interdependencies though). > I havn't written all the /sys/modules/ata/*/Makefiles that it would =20 > take to make it into loadable modules, but thats trivial todo. >=20 > Now what I'd like to find good generic solutions to is: >=20 > How to select the proper modules at config/compile time without =20 > drowning in "option ATA_BLA_BLA" in the config. What happens with mii is that you have a choice, you can either use 'device= =20 miibus' in which case you get all of the various drivers and the=20 infrastructure, or you can use 'device mii', 'device rlphy', etc. if you wi= sh=20 to take a more fine-grained approach. Similarly, there is a miibus.ko that= =20 just depends on all the sub-drivers so you can still do 'kldload miibus.ko'= =20 to load all of them. I think this is probably a fine model as it will stil= l=20 load everything by default, but people who care about the space savings can= =20 trim things down as desired. =2D-=20 John Baldwin From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Oct 9 07:44:29 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 226B8106568C; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 07:44:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sos@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from deepcore.dk (adsl.deepcore.dk [87.63.29.106]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 846C58FC18; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 07:44:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from sos@FreeBSD.ORG) Received: from [192.168.0.138] ([192.168.0.138]) by deepcore.dk (8.14.3/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m997iGqT033826; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 09:44:16 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from sos@FreeBSD.ORG) Message-Id: <60D39D64-FBE6-4646-AFEA-8AE8E5CE9E83@FreeBSD.ORG> From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?S=F8ren_Schmidt?= To: John Baldwin In-Reply-To: <200810081743.45011.jhb@freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 09:44:15 +0200 References: <48E6D21E.8040808@bluezbox.com> <48E7AE7D.6020709@bluezbox.com> <8C0B1202-5DF8-45CF-82EA-03367BFABAE7@FreeBSD.ORG> <200810081743.45011.jhb@freebsd.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.0 (deepcore.dk [217.20.59.72]); Thu, 09 Oct 2008 09:44:16 +0200 (CEST) Cc: Oleksandr Tymoshenko , freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Modular ata chipsets data X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 07:44:29 -0000 On 8Oct, 2008, at 23:43 , John Baldwin wrote: > On Saturday 04 October 2008 02:31:35 pm S=F8ren Schmidt wrote: >> I found the devel tree with a modulerized ATA subsystem in it, and >> just upgraded it to the latest greatest from -current. >> It can be found on http://deepcore.dk/pub/ATA as two files, ata- >> modules-diff that contains a diff for /sys/conf/files and ata- >> modules.tgz that is a replacement for /sys/dev/ata. >> This turns the chipset parts into a module for each vendor, and they >> are all compiled in as is, however they can be left out on a pr =20 >> vendor >> basis (there are a few interdependencies though). >> I havn't written all the /sys/modules/ata/*/Makefiles that it would >> take to make it into loadable modules, but thats trivial todo. >> >> Now what I'd like to find good generic solutions to is: >> >> How to select the proper modules at config/compile time without >> drowning in "option ATA_BLA_BLA" in the config. > > What happens with mii is that you have a choice, you can either use =20= > 'device > miibus' in which case you get all of the various drivers and the > infrastructure, or you can use 'dvice mii', 'device rlphy', etc. if =20= > you wish > to take a more fine-grained approach. Similarly, there is a =20 > miibus.ko that > just depends on all the sub-drivers so you can still do 'kldload =20 > miibus.ko' > to load all of them. I think this is probably a fine model as it =20 > will still > load everything by default, but people who care about the space =20 > savings can > trim things down as desired. Yep, I thought about that one too and I like the idea. I'm close to =20 having it all sorted out and ready to commit, just need to polish =20 things up a bit. I should make no functional changes just restructure =20= chipset code into seperate files. -S=F8ren From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Oct 9 12:09:12 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53C8F10656A6; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 12:09:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from avg@icyb.net.ua) Received: from falcon.cybervisiontech.com (falcon.cybervisiontech.com [217.20.163.9]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0292E8FC23; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 12:09:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from avg@icyb.net.ua) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by falcon.cybervisiontech.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62B1743C504; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:51:36 +0300 (EEST) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at falcon.cybervisiontech.com Received: from falcon.cybervisiontech.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (falcon.cybervisiontech.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HFUGC1IIxb6V; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:51:36 +0300 (EEST) Received: from [10.2.1.87] (gateway.cybervisiontech.com.ua [91.198.50.114]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by falcon.cybervisiontech.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7872E43C555; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:51:34 +0300 (EEST) Message-ID: <48EDF045.8030604@icyb.net.ua> Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 14:51:33 +0300 From: Andriy Gapon User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (X11/20080929) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: John Baldwin References: <48E6D21E.8040808@bluezbox.com> <48E7AE7D.6020709@bluezbox.com> <8C0B1202-5DF8-45CF-82EA-03367BFABAE7@FreeBSD.ORG> <200810081743.45011.jhb@freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: <200810081743.45011.jhb@freebsd.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Modular ata chipsets data X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 12:09:12 -0000 on 09/10/2008 00:43 John Baldwin said the following: > What happens with mii is that you have a choice, you can either use 'device > miibus' in which case you get all of the various drivers and the > infrastructure, or you can use 'device mii', 'device rlphy', etc. if you wish > to take a more fine-grained approach. Similarly, there is a miibus.ko that > just depends on all the sub-drivers so you can still do 'kldload miibus.ko' > to load all of them. I think this is probably a fine model as it will still > load everything by default, but people who care about the space savings can > trim things down as desired. Sorry for hijacking the thread but is this documented anywhere? On RELENG_7 system I couldn't find the above info in NOTES and miibus(4), only device miibus is referred to. -- Andriy Gapon From owner-freebsd-arch@FreeBSD.ORG Thu Oct 9 12:39:55 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CA01106569F for ; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 12:39:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rink@rink.nu) Received: from mx1.rink.nu (gloom.rink.nu [213.34.49.2]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFA788FC16 for ; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 12:39:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from rink@rink.nu) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mx1.rink.nu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BE516D423; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:23:00 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rink.nu Received: from mx1.rink.nu ([213.34.49.2]) by localhost (gloom.rink.nu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id skojld8sIshr; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:22:51 +0200 (CEST) Received: by mx1.rink.nu (Postfix, from userid 1000) id DDCD06D41E; Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:22:51 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:22:51 +0200 From: Rink Springer To: Andriy Gapon Message-ID: <20081009122251.GB89052@rink.nu> References: <48E6D21E.8040808@bluezbox.com> <48E7AE7D.6020709@bluezbox.com> <8C0B1202-5DF8-45CF-82EA-03367BFABAE7@FreeBSD.ORG> <200810081743.45011.jhb@freebsd.org> <48EDF045.8030604@icyb.net.ua> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <48EDF045.8030604@icyb.net.ua> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.18 (2008-05-17) Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Modular ata chipsets data X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 12:39:55 -0000 On Thu, Oct 09, 2008 at 02:51:33PM +0300, Andriy Gapon wrote: > on 09/10/2008 00:43 John Baldwin said the following: > > What happens with mii is that you have a choice, you can either use 'device > > miibus' in which case you get all of the various drivers and the > > infrastructure, or you can use 'device mii', 'device rlphy', etc. if you wish > > to take a more fine-grained approach. Similarly, there is a miibus.ko that > > just depends on all the sub-drivers so you can still do 'kldload miibus.ko' > > to load all of them. I think this is probably a fine model as it will still > > load everything by default, but people who care about the space savings can > > trim things down as desired. > > Sorry for hijacking the thread but is this documented anywhere? > On RELENG_7 system I couldn't find the above info in NOTES and > miibus(4), only device miibus is referred to. I've once tried this. Adding modules for xxxphy is easy, but I found it rather difficult to isolate which NIC needs to depend on which phy (for example, you'll want if_rl to depend on rlphy - but this isn't obvious for all NIC/PHY combinations) Regards, -- Rink P.W. Springer - http://rink.nu "Anyway boys, this is America. Just because you get more votes doesn't mean you win." - Fox Mulder