From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 00:01:05 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A5FD24D3A5 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:01:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) Received: from sonic304-23.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (sonic304-23.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com [77.238.179.148]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48KnMN2bmfz3Mfm for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:01:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) X-YMail-OSG: uHpjug0VM1nzpSmzdHjuhADzyBarznN0IcO1M8UzBVD1Sjy0DnCdQMO1.svmRwD BzZANdu.iLnHZg.mRZKAoGgxIbuISHCw25aGOM8QLeS5aY8jgbXjLYxDrYY7XEYgnfI_yrExt4P2 zDg.Q.xi7MVLtbsj9AT.6yVbOT7AoJMeLKXHXoMC.3zx9P1Y5mhkUUvt49R1.GBjI646c8bu.DyE aJrzxKuKddAdMRZ4IJ3jpYLfXavp.Q2VLxCaOcZNlPMFWx7P6G.A.RgENu8NBpNh_KhFWogAdQ3G OQd1IhNU9X_.Xaru8dRAAmLS5WHWNATkTFiPhUNuogIQLoUU4Fo1.dTtVP6fq_DQ5HfFOu68GXYq tS07yaWuLkAY7ri0lzwCIb446NNEt.KNP3n9WeN2VVbRWKPr.Xi3CPDTmqVA9lsnEz89KR3brFDI qhs_EiriuzFsFjaDSHcOl.7EtLvQe9dv5G.VBdWFsD_i9i1fqQrUXDO1kWZTHrXtuczHHwLJrT06 Rlbu8iF7rhMj.6uxD3oKiC00QNJM4MRjr69sx3Jrx5x8P8VM2rbR2K5kfa.0K2sRLBhaoJXh0zaX nkJkCWlZ7u28FWBIDdOOmFkIpKz4Y9hvoGrUILu51AgNW9tvKQ8FCN2fDDF8gsWQ28eKwZJfoJA7 Bfo9bhWrwLn_.El5GLDjBz7c4AmXdCO1Ha8lXAfkFvueegVt3Te6D4156vXOjuoQl6oAsz.7iGrL ZxG5N6Y2ovbva7fgskKQM20L_SENWhGspfTcwpNGIhS0xldbTY54xUNPPQfYpmG2_vUi.waSDiBW tAn4g04Dpn.XaMrh_qhiH1TRMgyG_VCs3H_KOGG9e8t6RfMs220yWSxjku8LB0yyA7V5orViwf00 iCfTcGJjiWNypfM0wE5VxvxL_NnBCvjROUR7ms3Q45OukQpZ0sAakGVyOaFNqs1rrEcMFkialytL MiTU3_1.YwtN22B81xX8EO1VQtrejRFqHCL9UmRz5qTnRqfK_6dpgPtTLIHGWNabgVJNMcf1AwuW iS7Zww4bP3NBC0ekdBh1c4YMFopFpxZaujR.mDteFIa6CTqCysyBTFawJlutadKXUJzyaLQh5PGs FcvIN2csLz8yE1MPoXHIgbZuBMBzZT137MIysV99PgR4U6HVvm2LzrwiPUCqE.hZ2XWW6kmo6QZ6 dxIpZmeLzS36lyj1awfdGDlB4oWZxb7OYFwf0PBYofpQeQdYNMOv_FRiL7ZoxkoIWBhWFvdbBv1I xwUyG_mWFohT4fjYVXsM5vOp4Rulwf0pydLhOnkhGxd0wB4oPQOLvQ_Kp31SSCE4pfudNmy5FM7w 0FRwF6j8U0uYKf.G.RiosaFA227fqSM1rgHcU5ja5trLzRiHEZOZ99pm1uInOjtRIRLe2u4OM8tQ fjMZwVGbDSBNTQQ-- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic304.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:01:01 +0000 Received: by smtp426.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID a9fb926173775aeaf5066eef86c869d9; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:00:59 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:00:58 +0100 From: Ralf Mardorf To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-ID: <20200216010058.73f83086@archlinux> In-Reply-To: <20200215232931.5a9132b2e83daa2d0a06dac8@sohara.org> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215235822.f804ffc6.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215232931.5a9132b2e83daa2d0a06dac8@sohara.org> X-Mailer: Claws Mail (linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48KnMN2bmfz3Mfm X-Spamd-Bar: - X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.17 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[rocketmail.com:s=s2048]; XM_UA_NO_VERSION(0.01)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.69)[-0.685,0]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.00)[0.001,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[rocketmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[rocketmail.com,reject]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[148.179.238.77.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (4.51), ipnet: 77.238.176.0/22(2.16), asn: 34010(1.70), country: GB(-0.07)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:34010, ipnet:77.238.176.0/22, country:GB]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:01:05 -0000 On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 23:29:31 +0000, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: >On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 23:58:22 +0100 >Polytropon wrote: > >> And all of them connect to the Internet, using a device that >> internally uses a BSD or a Linux, and the bowels of the Internet >> consist primarily of BSD and Linux. Add "Linux-like things" to >> the mix, like Android smartphones, or "BSD-like things" like >> Macs, and numbers might look a little different. > > The late Morten Reistad used to post (in > alt.folklore.computers) >about the numbers of processors with memory management being made and >comparing that with Windows licenses, Apple and Android phone >production numbers. Windows, MacOs and commercial unix licenses only >account for a small fraction of the CPUs made - most of them have to >be running something else Linux (Android, routers, TVs, cars ...), BSD >(routers and who knows what else) and Mach (iThingies) being the >obvious available kernels. The "blue screen" I often see, when I take a look at the displays used by public service vehicles, lead to Windows as the used embedded operating system. Apart from this a friend has got some inside regarding specialized embedded systems. There at least was a tendency to migrate from BSD or Linux to Windows. Seriously, when I use the public bus to go to work, I often see a blue screen and some output of error messages, with paths using backslashes. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 00:05:03 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B6CD24DAB2 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:05:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) Received: from mail.covisp.net (mail.covisp.net [65.121.55.42]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48KnRy43gwz3PM0 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:05:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) From: "@lbutlr" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2020 17:05:00 -0700 References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214141600.GA82559@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214150126.GA1219@x1> <20200214113358.225faf5e@scorpio> <20200215060818.GC1482@admin.sibptus.ru> To: FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <20200215060818.GC1482@admin.sibptus.ru> Message-Id: <078C3335-434E-4E96-8D66-28251CA7DDFE@kreme.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48KnRy43gwz3PM0 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kremels@kreme.com designates 65.121.55.42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kremels@kreme.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.40 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.94)[-0.939,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx:c]; MISSING_MIME_VERSION(2.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kreme.com]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.992,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.07)[ip: (-0.25), ipnet: 65.112.0.0/12(-0.00), asn: 209(-0.03), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_ZERO(0.00)[0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:209, ipnet:65.112.0.0/12, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[42.55.121.65.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:05:03 -0000 On 14 Feb 2020, at 23:08, Victor Sudakov wrote: > I skipped 12.0 and am rather happy with 12.1 (both on real hardware = and in VMs). The worst thing about installing 12.1 (well, so far) was getting the = installer to boot, which required DISABLING UEFI for some reason. --=20 Love is like oxygen / You get too much / you get too high / Not enough and you're gonna die From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 00:27:11 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 035A124E378 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:27:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) Received: from s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com (s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com [142.0.176.198]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48KnxV0ZnZz46PQ for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:27:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; 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Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:26:57 +0000 Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:26:56 +0000 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Cc: Ralf Mardorf Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-Id: <20200216002656.83d55598023fed6088fb9a23@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: <20200216010058.73f83086@archlinux> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215235822.f804ffc6.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215232931.5a9132b2e83daa2d0a06dac8@sohara.org> <20200216010058.73f83086@archlinux> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd12.0) X-Clacks-Overhead: "GNU Terry Pratchett" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48KnxV0ZnZz46PQ X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; 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MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7381, ipnet:142.0.176.0/22, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[rocketmail.com] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:27:11 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:00:58 +0100 Ralf Mardorf via freebsd-questions wrote: > The "blue screen" I often see, when I take a look at the displays used > by public service vehicles, lead to Windows as the used embedded > operating system. Apart from this a friend has got some inside > regarding specialized embedded systems. There at least was a tendency > to migrate from BSD or Linux to Windows. Seriously, when I use the > public bus to go to work, I often see a blue screen and some > output of error messages, with paths using backslashes. That's not an embedded system, think engine management controller (and the other dozen or so hidden computers in a modern car), TV, washing machine, fly-by-wire controllers ... Things with no user interface. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 00:28:25 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20AC724E47B for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:28:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kh@panix.com) Received: from mailbackend.panix.com (mailbackend.panix.com [166.84.1.89]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Knyw12vKz46yB for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:28:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kh@panix.com) Received: from rain.home (pool-173-48-64-3.bstnma.fios.verizon.net [173.48.64.3]) by mailbackend.panix.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48Knyt6t1Hz1Prs for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2020 19:28:22 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215235822.f804ffc6.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215232931.5a9132b2e83daa2d0a06dac8@sohara.org> <20200216010058.73f83086@archlinux> From: Kurt Hackenberg Message-ID: <595b0728-0785-4e0c-5433-385457973878@panix.com> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2020 19:28:20 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200216010058.73f83086@archlinux> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Knyw12vKz46yB X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kh@panix.com designates 166.84.1.89 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kh@panix.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.87 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_GOOD(0.00)[89.1.84.166.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.18]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:166.84.0.0/16]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[panix.com]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[89.1.84.166.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.2]; IP_SCORE(-3.37)[ip: (-9.51), ipnet: 166.84.0.0/16(-4.05), asn: 2033(-3.24), country: US(-0.05)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:2033, ipnet:166.84.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:28:25 -0000 On 2020-02-15 19:00, Ralf Mardorf via freebsd-questions wrote: > Seriously, when I use the public bus to go to work, I often see a > blue screen and some output of error messages, with paths using > backslashes. If the bus gets you to work anyway, then I guess that Windows machine doesn't do anything important. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 00:43:32 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FD2724E957 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:43:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) Received: from sonic306-21.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (sonic306-21.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com [77.238.176.207]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48KpJM2QMdz4H2T for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:43:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) X-YMail-OSG: 28lZx3UVM1m9pbmxKxmX.N6MGcYnzBr16IszQEqIdp7YvnqqdAM.2fW412Kx10n Dp4esMbpKY9I5oBrRbsFUMszcabEBSVAmUntkC1aBRKqiR4Vb0WmSVjPzmqzc3wdZYNRnL09eEzx hQ81bSYjX_W_cwnl2Gz_3zkqFhDJC3YS9G3UnIiKWtQXWGxb4uxgYlvhom0UHYepUffvUGz0YnqX eHt4PeHW2KyU9n.RftMDmHH.QqLNw8sV2ZBVFUegQbH0gS8PlowI6F00UFUbXtSn4Sus_d9K8Dun vwW.5vPsUsqxCkM1otANulaa5JLobDxYE_4aOOazzlLPEogXRdtdl9KarQSTO37Uw1tT8jQL2fxw Xk_YpA3Wyro1fGyP1RDPVcn7rnaSwv4sBQ_.m.jP3ODeIdcZgcRBp0pQS0Ypxfo9auebR5Du3Z8r _I3T9.FAt4CvAmXq9JOyksX_QjT2ymSPC.PSjhjUQ5FAQ3fuWHJOzon8_zSYfOrzGLBz3V.FGVRC VA1WXY2eh5Fu2UuKTAwPM6rKotaxr.W8UccYm9hkg2pph1VbXOITxHMeT2V1YZUfKZ7Jg9L7wrkk .RzsaC0ymSmz0LvloxnoVgTSlm2adEWs4nqn8mzF80bt2ku10AJ0lgs7mK9k0kAGxD_AjivQW6VH 3kD.IaEkKjVunb2iYPJU9VoQohgQsLk9w32m0BDcPFfxscGafQZOjHGcQi0RbhfPBcds9J9.DMy3 NIqIR6QTQxMfSRI2APJNnd8B43AYTQMq79fwrVb.iP4s876t1Iqj.n0hJJHLrFe4DQRcgwX.xCu2 Umarq5vqIZRbLOVWuLD6qvT.5cYb.sxVnOsn1Tm3BjwpKsDUVKxdFWxiP98wYptkFBvq2GhOJY5J Bot7uuiTyPx01VHIj6UMRJNYTpCk4j01jy25UmWKIkI4NCeXDreQuX8jJO6UQN1UIh34QKLurnpI yYx366q2.hOF4porA_LEQex7TVjwj5UYOgJ4Jh12zddkuXgrDEF4RCXJ.7v6Ss5WuFewbNtoNN_a 02VdElprwa1ode3KVd6qawWkkI7eYGJGSyySyjD8F8JYwN_DJpBKH6vC_YQ1tsx9cVrxj0u_hzNw Y_HwM3765ZMv86PWmmcRaahWHrNvWAJ.PMQwtMAOIRVSD9wHK.xDd2qC61jz5I.PqFO.nIYt0mfc T4xX91CP69bsJ5_5v8M1xjl5CMk_sWCB3FDdOYIFprmWHiCWGAnFb8FYuVoHMREQ3EDZWaeY6n15 Dc6uJ_fQkSIEs0HXZo3QkG7NU0TFbYX0k5addf3ur8CxnXI.HLWVIh8cQmHA8mjGQx1pHu4LAL5X J73Sf9AO4keIvfImAC8gm10m7Z3Me5.EwxXXjD78JIZu.UTNSdz0ItRZBBlpjsf.CTl00uGKz.SG nS6uLMGjNFtZNAg-- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic306.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:43:28 +0000 Received: by smtp415.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 7600e246f73fb06fe6542c0641db8a62; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:43:25 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:43:25 +0100 From: Ralf Mardorf To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-ID: <20200216014325.130b2b58@archlinux> In-Reply-To: <595b0728-0785-4e0c-5433-385457973878@panix.com> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215235822.f804ffc6.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215232931.5a9132b2e83daa2d0a06dac8@sohara.org> <20200216010058.73f83086@archlinux> <595b0728-0785-4e0c-5433-385457973878@panix.com> X-Mailer: Claws Mail (linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48KpJM2QMdz4H2T X-Spamd-Bar: - X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.57 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.24)[-0.239,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[rocketmail.com:s=s2048]; XM_UA_NO_VERSION(0.01)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.84)[-0.842,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[rocketmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[rocketmail.com,reject]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[207.176.238.77.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (2.82), ipnet: 77.238.176.0/22(2.16), asn: 34010(1.70), country: GB(-0.07)]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[207.176.238.77.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:34010, ipnet:77.238.176.0/22, country:GB]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:43:32 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:26:56 +0000, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: >That's not an embedded system *?* On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 19:28:20 -0500, Kurt Hackenberg wrote: >On 2020-02-15 19:00, Ralf Mardorf via freebsd-questions wrote: > >> Seriously, when I use the public bus to go to work, I often see a >> blue screen and some output of error messages, with paths using >> backslashes. > >If the bus gets you to work anyway, then I guess that Windows machine >doesn't do anything important. I suspect what I often see on the displays is just responsible to show the names of the next stops and to display advertisings, but nothing else. The motor or any other technical system of the buses might be handled by a separated Windows or any other operating system. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 01:11:26 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC6C124F2F5 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:11:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) Received: from sonic312-27.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (sonic312-27.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com [77.238.178.98]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48KpwX4ztMz4bMP for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:11:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) X-YMail-OSG: O5ZjdW4VM1l1V_VyVz8pyw3qqis2OhLpEvm5Bd.VLB162VOaN0AESvKGQSC2iwo b9Nw4p4BSYQ70EwVMtXGBEMfX0wQhjn6LcQr6W6JX6Sh1GEv.CYdOZUT4E2dse3VsEdvhTqYHhy3 7qgAwfCR7.DpBvqPvlvL.GZdgE9nbjefkhyRqsAUKQaj8RL114bRtv7rFFqNr4iHSAb.2IqlcNvi pqMZu6cuKv7BLA1VR00aCN2eYike627sVlo5EahLWcxS6a1zhtdtP148DNyD9Vxlhq.4rGtm5DCa xHGO7O1jV.a37KRe_M.hsfRuWQap8fw4a0knUoiocAOoSHUkwuKfguKAlqtMCaW0zta8KXRhfMCi Orb9W4kt9b3qnMZ45Dl.L2Oe5WQj.oKetK8KT2HkfV1oO21P4Y0dFRGKFVnIVx6UbvvFrA0hammi d545qfEYWLJe6JD242p09dBZz.bXV1C_rABZRR6.t8jtPPFYgMtLvUskXtHtpy9x.y0p7wPox48D h7DBcTY495tkdgBJNzpxvpWAShz_cKz7XUcFmStgbcuB7UoyL1te1_sfy5F19uvzpjHZ1_CSNS1E j3UCYAltl37EapJueGvonC9ci4SH7KPtwS222p7JD7ZU26BAmJiCLAjMEvhDFNErR9aKVcpcvYj9 DGnXFU3SF6lo38y.dJ5QBSIeXztbapo6szW.RiSd5NwB4Uqi.DbbGMv3kPJSbd8RnDrbNTcM_AgY 9ZIN7fBTGYJ18UYllz5rzf0qIxtKd2sMQbiX_TZ5A3NTTMRG.KYte.osrlBG18Ovl0uROF6QN_gO GhGWwDBqsEmPFTPqCZ.XHgdDXMx_m_Q1PZiI4t6iFqc2m6SXs_eHMwsVLF0D39VVM0lSnr21yCR_ sFopx9.dqsKjkNp_yCmZKrf1dH7rEXFA8E7rr6FROwYBlT_.OrAOuMwhb22Ip_fyUln.doefvklX 1wteav5B9TxmZHddYm1Wi6KJbZGbj00x5qfBoCQXsrrro7Fn8Z.MSQk9qcVr2GhLyzZjab74Y8VV Bvto.6d9XbKJSSaz0oI8QdIbZpzBIBtJiQycRR_oRaSR4L0ef.LOT7RyDL3KoCq624M5QkzFNPF2 RKI26k5c8DgzGKt2jRRqW09WNQXe9w2tmZcTJk3Lmtvjn_upHSOb8eTW0OKsz7tHGijOrhbNpeMB l1kQ28Cl5WeuSKm1HqqTzQ4mk7LVOxrKtrG3YhLLvRyBMCB3A86mEgKWn6nsV9dFWfkHmCJ3zgaV FKc5a70Fc3g1MWP27UZQZ8x0XoGnLyOUlXfatsj.O85gqZRWlgB2V0ZVLO0GQxNlSkRWsZFVSqz_ .pttu1VNab8qy4ItQeAYXtyJjLQrijOh.b2DfrNzhr9Gnryhav0e5pHnQ Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic312.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:11:22 +0000 Received: by smtp406.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID a428c5360764dfd569b30c21fef40f22; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:11:19 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 02:11:19 +0100 From: Ralf Mardorf To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-ID: <20200216021119.51833405@archlinux> In-Reply-To: <20200216014325.130b2b58@archlinux> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215235822.f804ffc6.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215232931.5a9132b2e83daa2d0a06dac8@sohara.org> <20200216010058.73f83086@archlinux> <595b0728-0785-4e0c-5433-385457973878@panix.com> <20200216014325.130b2b58@archlinux> X-Mailer: Claws Mail (linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48KpwX4ztMz4bMP X-Spamd-Bar: - X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.43 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.15)[-0.152,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[rocketmail.com:s=s2048]; XM_UA_NO_VERSION(0.01)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.79)[-0.793,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[rocketmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[rocketmail.com,reject]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.178.238.77.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (3.42), ipnet: 77.238.176.0/22(2.15), asn: 34010(1.70), country: GB(-0.07)]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[98.178.238.77.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:34010, ipnet:77.238.176.0/22, country:GB]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:11:26 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:43:25 +0100, Ralf Mardorf via freebsd-questions wrote: >On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:26:56 +0000, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: >>That's not an embedded system =20 > >*?* > >On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 19:28:20 -0500, Kurt Hackenberg wrote: >>On 2020-02-15 19:00, Ralf Mardorf via freebsd-questions wrote: >> =20 >>> Seriously, when I use the public bus to go to work, I often see a >>> blue screen and some output of error messages, with paths using >>> backslashes. =20 >> >>If the bus gets you to work anyway, then I guess that Windows machine=20 >>doesn't do anything important. =20 > >I suspect what I often see on the displays is just responsible to show >the names of the next stops and to display advertisings, but nothing >else. The motor or any other technical system of the buses might be >handled by a separated Windows or any other operating system. PS: =46rom time to time humans manually count getting in and out passengers. I wonder if they verify the computer network or if photoelectric sensor and RFID bus ticket readers etc. aren't connected with a control center. Sometimes displays at the bus stops show exactly when the next bus does arrive and sometimes those time values are completely off. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 02:23:47 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92B62251795 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 02:23:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) Received: from mail.covisp.net (mail.covisp.net [65.121.55.42]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48KrX20fCzz4M1L for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 02:23:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) From: "@lbutlr" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: rsnapshot Message-Id: <3759E97D-0CDA-4503-B585-3DEA8F2E875E@kreme.com> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2020 19:23:44 -0700 To: FreeBSD X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48KrX20fCzz4M1L X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kremels@kreme.com designates 65.121.55.42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kremels@kreme.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.42 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.96)[-0.955,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx:c]; MISSING_MIME_VERSION(2.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kreme.com]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.993,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.07)[ip: (-0.25), ipnet: 65.112.0.0/12(-0.00), asn: 209(-0.03), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_ZERO(0.00)[0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:209, ipnet:65.112.0.0/12, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[42.55.121.65.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 02:23:47 -0000 I=E2=80=99ve looked for a list on rsnapshot, but not found anything. I = am setting a backup from one machine to another. This is brand new = install of Rsnapshot on a brand new install of FreeBSD 12.1, the server = the is being backed up is run-in 11.4. backup backup@mail.covisp.net:/usr/local/ mail.covisp.net/ = exclude=3Dcore This works without errors, but many files are not copied, including none = of the mail (/usr/local/virtual/[user]@[domain]/ and a large chunk of = the web content (28GB versus 3GB). SERVER BACKUP 361M bin 200M bin 44K dcc 5.0K dcc 107M etc 5.3M etc 33M i386-portbld-freebsd11.3 46M i386-portbld-freebsd11.3 55M include 32M include 841M lib 474M lib 744K libdata 814K libdata 176M libexec 311M libexec 35M man 36M man 888K openssl 534K openssl 76M root 37M root 42M sbin 26M sbin 350M share 204M share 20K var 2.5K var 23G virtual 148K virtual 2.6G www 1.6G www rsnapshot runs on the backup machine and logs in to backup@server using = a certificate, the user backup@server is in the server=E2=80=99s sudoers = file with permission to run rsync. backup ALL=3D(root) NOPASSWD: /usr/local/bin/rsync Log: [2020-02-15T19:12:35] /usr/local/bin/rsnapshot hour: started [2020-02-15T19:12:35] echo 41164 > /var/run/rsnapshot.pid [2020-02-15T19:12:35] mkdir -m 0755 -p /zroot/backups/.snapshots/hour.0/ [2020-02-15T19:12:35] /usr/local/bin/rsync -a --delete --numeric-ids = --relative --delete-excluded --exclude=3Dcore --rsh=3D/usr/bin/ssh -i = /root/backup.key backup@mail.covisp.net:/usr/local/ = /zroot/backups/.snapshots/hour.0/mail.covisp.net/ [2020-02-15T19:16:10] /usr/local/bin/rsync -a --delete --numeric-ids = --relative --delete-excluded --exclude=3Dcore --rsh=3D/usr/bin/ssh -i = /root/backup.key backup@mail.covisp.net:/etc/ = /zroot/backups/.snapshots/hour.0/mail.covisp.net/ [2020-02-15T19:16:16] /usr/local/bin/rsync -a --delete --numeric-ids = --relative --delete-excluded --exclude=3Dcore --rsh=3D/usr/bin/ssh -i = /root/backup.key backup@mail.covisp.net:/backup/db/ = /zroot/backups/.snapshots/hour.0/mail.covisp.net/ [2020-02-15T19:16:16] /bin/date "+ backup of mail.covisp.net ended at = %c" backup of mail.covisp.net ended at Sat Feb 15 19:16:16 2020 [2020-02-15T19:16:16] touch /zroot/backups/.snapshots/hour.0/ [2020-02-15T19:16:16] rm -f /var/run/rsnapshot.pid [2020-02-15T19:16:16] WARNING: /usr/local/bin/rsnapshot hour: completed, = but with some warnings --=20 I gotta call my glitter guy From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 03:40:38 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78EEA252EAD for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 03:40:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) Received: from mail.covisp.net (mail.covisp.net [65.121.55.42]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48KtDj5lxqz45GX for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 03:40:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) From: "@lbutlr" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: rsnapshot Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2020 20:40:35 -0700 References: <3759E97D-0CDA-4503-B585-3DEA8F2E875E@kreme.com> To: FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <3759E97D-0CDA-4503-B585-3DEA8F2E875E@kreme.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48KtDj5lxqz45GX X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kremels@kreme.com designates 65.121.55.42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kremels@kreme.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.39 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.94)[-0.936,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx:c]; MISSING_MIME_VERSION(2.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kreme.com]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.991,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.07)[ip: (-0.24), ipnet: 65.112.0.0/12(-0.00), asn: 209(-0.03), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_ZERO(0.00)[0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:209, ipnet:65.112.0.0/12, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[42.55.121.65.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 03:40:38 -0000 On 15 Feb 2020, at 19:23, @lbutlr wrote: > am setting a backup from one machine to another. This is brand new = install of Rsnapshot on a brand new install of FreeBSD 12.1, the server = the is being backed up is run-in 11.4. I think I have solved this one of two possible ways. 1) Write a script on the server that rsnapshot uses instead of rsync to = launch sudo rsync. This requires passing all the usual arguments that = rsnapshot uses for rsync manually. +rsync_long_args=3D--rsync-path=3D/path/to/myrsnapscript --delete = --numeric-ids --relative --delete-excluded --exclude=3Dcore 2) allow root login in sshd.conf (Since logins require a certificate, = this is not as bad as it might seem). I went with option 1, and allow the backup user access to that one line = bash script. --=20 Light thinks it travels faster than anything but it's wrong. No matter how fast light travels it finds the darkness has always got there first, and is waiting for it. --Reaper Man From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 03:56:31 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 793F12533F9 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 03:56:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from roberthuff@rcn.com) Received: from smtp.rcn.com (smtp.rcn.com [69.168.97.78]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Ktb14c0Xz4Dxt for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 03:56:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from roberthuff@rcn.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; d=rcn.com; s=20180516; c=relaxed/simple; q=dns/txt; i=@rcn.com; t=1581825388; h=From:Subject:Date:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; bh=UZp0sm8yfgzZhXpykdhNHXKYt28=; b=I9s/65wfPUP1pV9o+WJ6Uh3wIw0fgUge70cR8ATbHrVZkujY2x/764vmXDINgQba CkbHwb9/dSD7Wf/G0w6vC61rpJLQdB+IrVzJRlsIOMXmaYn8GucGSWizjVkiksV7 N5iIg3xEiOy1g1lbzNcN/onj2pQqAsBTukYwLJDoo8Ye3vjw0yoGx5PbDgQvD/+n GNT2oW61QNYrK4q/bTUE2N/YlS7utXDJfFRTijzMWbhvBNhCDZkYhpETfw58xe/g KG00IOHz3M4Q7DWeqFn4DPm21svlO5ZPwDoOnRB9BC1f0xSoSXNZKlrxv2wR2Wsz Zpl9zV2zwCIUk2/oC33OLw==; X_CMAE_Category: , , X-CNFS-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=bugy+3Si c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=9TgA2UwI6Wy+6BV4wQM/cQ==:117 a=9TgA2UwI6Wy+6BV4wQM/cQ==:17 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=KGjhK52YXX0A:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=XRQyMpdBKAEA:10 a=l697ptgUJYAA:10 a=48faUk6PgeAA:10 a=ssdWhVXTxXt17cDXIeMA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 X-CM-Score: 0 X-Scanned-by: Cloudmark Authority Engine X-Authed-Username: cm9iZXJ0aHVmZkByY24uY29t Received: from [209.6.230.48] ([209.6.230.48:39625] helo=jerusalem.litteratus.org.litteratus.org) by smtp.rcn.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.25.56547 r(Core:3.6.25.0)) with ESMTPSA (cipher=AES256-GCM-SHA384) id 8D/C5-56402-C6DB84E5; Sat, 15 Feb 2020 22:56:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <24136.48491.941840.966697@jerusalem.litteratus.org> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2020 22:56:27 -0500 From: Robert Huff To: "Steve O'Hara-Smith" Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, Ralf Mardorf Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux In-Reply-To: <20200216002656.83d55598023fed6088fb9a23@sohara.org> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215235822.f804ffc6.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215232931.5a9132b2e83daa2d0a06dac8@sohara.org> <20200216010058.73f83086@archlinux> <20200216002656.83d55598023fed6088fb9a23@sohara.org> X-Mailer: VM 8.2.0b under 26.3 (amd64-portbld-freebsd13.0) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Ktb14c0Xz4Dxt X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=rcn.com header.s=20180516 header.b=I9s/65wf; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=rcn.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of roberthuff@rcn.com designates 69.168.97.78 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=roberthuff@rcn.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.59 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[rcn.com:s=20180516]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:69.168.97.0/24]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-1.49)[ip: (-9.31), ipnet: 69.168.97.0/24(1.05), asn: 36271(0.88), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_LOW(-1.00)[rcn.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[rcn.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[rcn.com,none]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[78.97.168.69.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36271, ipnet:69.168.97.0/24, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 03:56:31 -0000 Steve O'Hara-Smith writes: > That's not an embedded system, think engine management controller > (and the other dozen or so hidden computers in a modern car), TV, When setting up my previous TV, I was skimming the manual and saw a copyright notice for NetBSD .... Respectfully, Robert Huff From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 04:16:02 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3609D253A03 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:16:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from wnew3-smtp.messagingengine.com (wnew3-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Kv1Y2gh5z4MLn for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:16:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailnew.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96AEC5DD; Sat, 15 Feb 2020 23:08:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); Sat, 15 Feb 2020 23:08:44 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; 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Sat, 15 Feb 2020 23:08:43 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Update X when laptop lip is closed To: Noah Palmer , freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: From: Yuri Pankov Message-ID: <2061301f-4f78-e50a-1864-f9a608b7c504@yuripv.me> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:08:41 +0300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.5.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Kv1Y2gh5z4MLn X-Spamd-Bar: ++++++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=yuripv.me header.s=fm1 header.b=r7CQ8z/k; dkim=pass header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm2 header.b=VdHvXTjf; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of yuripv@yuripv.me designates 64.147.123.17 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=yuripv@yuripv.me X-Spamd-Result: default: False [10.92 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(0.00)[+ip4:64.147.123.17:c]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yuripv.me:+,messagingengine.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-3.48)[ip: (-9.73), ipnet: 64.147.123.0/24(-4.92), asn: 11403(-2.68), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[17.123.147.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:64.147.123.0/24, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[165.4.155.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_XBL(5.00)[165.4.155.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.4]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(0.00)[yuripv.me:s=fm1,messagingengine.com:s=fm2]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[yuripv.me]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(1.00)[1.000,0]; BAD_REP_POLICIES(0.10)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[1.000,0]; URIBL_BLACK(7.50)[yuripv.me.multi.uribl.com]; GREYLIST(0.00)[pass,body] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:16:02 -0000 Noah Palmer wrote: > is there a way to automatically remove or add the display to X when the > laptop lid is opened or closed. I have been using a script to read > dev.acpi_lid.0.state, but is there better way? Also what is the proper way > to reply to someone while using a mailing list. Do you reply to the person > or freebsd-questions@freebsd.org. If you are polling the dev.acpi_lid.0.state value, see /etc/devd.conf for examples of ACPI events notification, so you could invoke the need actions when lid is open/closed. As for the reply policy, I don't think there's one, so I just press "Reply all" in Thunderbird -- if someone doesn't want to be answered directly, they could (and usually do) set the Reply-To to the list. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 04:21:46 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 310E4253D5C for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:21:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from chris@monochrome.org) Received: from mail.monochrome.org (static-71-163-255-121.washdc.fios.verizon.net [71.163.255.121]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail", Issuer "mail" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Kv891Sfgz4NvN for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:21:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from chris@monochrome.org) Received: from tripel.monochrome.org (tripel.monochrome.org [192.168.1.11]) by mail.monochrome.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 01G4LYfG035120; Sat, 15 Feb 2020 23:21:34 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from chris@monochrome.org) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2020 23:21:34 -0500 (EST) From: Chris Hill To: Yuri Pankov cc: Noah Palmer , freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Update X when laptop lip is closed In-Reply-To: <2061301f-4f78-e50a-1864-f9a608b7c504@yuripv.me> Message-ID: References: <2061301f-4f78-e50a-1864-f9a608b7c504@yuripv.me> User-Agent: Alpine 2.20 (BSF 67 2015-01-07) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Kv891Sfgz4NvN X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of chris@monochrome.org has no SPF policy when checking 71.163.255.121) smtp.mailfrom=chris@monochrome.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.05 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[monochrome.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.04)[0.041,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.01)[-0.012,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:701, ipnet:71.163.0.0/16, country:US]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com]; IP_SCORE(0.12)[asn: 701(0.64), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:21:46 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020, Yuri Pankov wrote: > Noah Palmer wrote: >> is there a way to automatically remove or add the display to X when the >> laptop lid is opened or closed. I have been using a script to read >> dev.acpi_lid.0.state, but is there better way? Also what is the proper way >> to reply to someone while using a mailing list. Do you reply to the person >> or freebsd-questions@freebsd.org. > > If you are polling the dev.acpi_lid.0.state value, see /etc/devd.conf for > examples of ACPI events notification, so you could invoke the need actions > when lid is open/closed. > > As for the reply policy, I don't think there's one, so I just press "Reply > all" in Thunderbird -- if someone doesn't want to be answered directly, they > could (and usually do) set the Reply-To to the list. Historically, the reply policy for freebsd-questions has been to reply to the person and cc the list. Other lists may differ. -- Chris Hill chris@monochrome.org From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 06:34:06 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA514255B00 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 06:34:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from noahpalmerversion1@gmail.com) Received: from mail-lj1-x235.google.com (mail-lj1-x235.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::235]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Ky4s5XqTz4HXw for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 06:34:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from noahpalmerversion1@gmail.com) Received: by mail-lj1-x235.google.com with SMTP id y6so15193919lji.0 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2020 22:34:05 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=LAvFFVozqnIWfwRppjCjL169BHrxdBTlhVAITBny7cY=; b=ShMUbDscfb5C58ZKH3xLBzXHh5sf4dBlMR/NVcFf0vD23WJzFUudQpyZSuCBpYH67C PAAcx2bLA8KGC8UH7471jJtlaEGt+XtZuZ2lcW/paH+QIydJXo/mRWaoFE9W6npcNj6k NjVFcn7P+fnK41RcsWDXlp54S2DfwShdQU6C6PYFO+l69eLos/cHIT9udUeQ1tp1Eh72 JnnwfnYuei6IogHZQuJ7LWiuhhBROFwi6BA6AM8XjbVw6MihQB4Brx4MfCRE6AG3g3rz DTkA4pyefloJtBXxtE/2BdzApToX+XkAQ4h0Te6I4pFCzy53EoLaSKdEGX5TOcaFyxxH EpIg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=LAvFFVozqnIWfwRppjCjL169BHrxdBTlhVAITBny7cY=; b=E9Ew5CQcJVA/AwOd6w4RVYTQrIemv6N2uePRmI83DKVNIDzDMoPWRTNINBlWV27T9y cC/r44oEuwholapJ9bKFH2ujGNggR7CQyG1hjeV4It9aiNIdWR3P0NYetA7RyXV+hvYZ 9vRIq6OW9Gv/XCUjAc8GtCdberGhY1bS3Q3o5RH2Phd9DZk7vBw3GxQSuY2Ydsy6RPFC 4NLDfhX7Jr1KmD6S3Rn4Vto6WVkN4hkWGobDmYyfB1FXOp8PSzqMTWBMIm0gwVFanYsc tLGmRFLCOQWHWX8MdNeRknbIWgD0nT6HOgjBCWVnnT8ELYwAlxslmE4XXHrCJNqDVba3 DmOQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUl+UmU37MS/JPn0M8KUhnm/twxfYJSm5ljCSNnF07tqn9ITl3S IvrumveZLbtVvpH6nPmry0mEklAXbnxTfMIzmh8v7Q== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyUIHhmpyLADjfuSb9O81yIWkZxyhHISacgJdBUdzPsiYCU+hLF+DjzbjkJs5Wp2GtbENuXvaZVS2zwBHkoM+k= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:9e03:: with SMTP id e3mr6494513ljk.186.1581834843137; Sat, 15 Feb 2020 22:34:03 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <2061301f-4f78-e50a-1864-f9a608b7c504@yuripv.me> In-Reply-To: <2061301f-4f78-e50a-1864-f9a608b7c504@yuripv.me> From: Noah Palmer Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 01:33:51 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Update X when laptop lip is closed To: Yuri Pankov Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Ky4s5XqTz4HXw X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=ShMUbDsc; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of noahpalmerversion1@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::235 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=noahpalmerversion1@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[5.3.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.5.4.1.0.0.a.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.40), ipnet: 2a00:1450::/32(-2.42), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 06:34:06 -0000 On Sat, Feb 15, 2020 at 11:08 PM Yuri Pankov wrote: > Noah Palmer wrote: > > is there a way to automatically remove or add the display to X when the > > laptop lid is opened or closed. I have been using a script to read > > dev.acpi_lid.0.state, but is there better way? Also what is the proper > way > > to reply to someone while using a mailing list. Do you reply to the > person > > or freebsd-questions@freebsd.org. > > If you are polling the dev.acpi_lid.0.state value, see /etc/devd.conf > for examples of ACPI events notification, so you could invoke the need > actions when lid is open/closed. > Okay that seems to be the solution. I also have an issue that dev.acpi_lid.0.state is incorrect if the lid was open at boot. you have to close and open the lid for the value to be correct. -- Noah Palmer From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 06:56:15 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0845C256328 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 06:56:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bennett@sdf.org) Received: from mx.sdf.org (mx.sdf.org [205.166.94.20]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mx.sdf.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48KyZQ0NBXz4Rtl for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 06:56:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bennett@sdf.org) Received: from sdf.org (IDENT:bennett@miku.sdf.org [205.166.94.6]) by mx.sdf.org (8.15.2/8.14.5) with ESMTPS id 01G6uBm4004403 (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256 bits) verified NO); Sun, 16 Feb 2020 06:56:12 GMT Received: (from bennett@localhost) by sdf.org (8.15.2/8.12.8/Submit) id 01G6uBYm008146; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:56:11 -0600 (CST) From: Scott Bennett Message-Id: <202002160656.01G6uBYm008146@sdf.org> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:56:11 -0600 To: ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com Subject: Re: terminology and history (was Re: Re updating BIOS) Cc: steve@sohara.org, freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <202002120724.01C7OcSW005991@sdf.org> In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Heirloom mailx 12.5 6/20/10 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48KyZQ0NBXz4Rtl X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of bennett@sdf.org has no SPF policy when checking 205.166.94.20) smtp.mailfrom=bennett@sdf.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.18 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.80)[-0.800,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; IP_SCORE(-0.29)[ip: (-0.92), ipnet: 205.166.94.0/24(-0.46), asn: 14361(-0.03), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[sdf.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.992,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[20.94.166.205.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[yahoo.com]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14361, ipnet:205.166.94.0/24, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 06:56:15 -0000 Ottavio Caruso wrote: > On Wed, 12 Feb 2020 at 07:24, Scott Bennett wrote: > > > > On Sun, 9 Feb 2020 08:41:11 +0000 Steve O'Hara-Smith > > wrote: > > > > >On Sun, 09 Feb 2020 02:09:59 -0600 > > >Scott Bennett wrote: > > > > > >> The first part of the above, mispunctuated pair of sentences is > > >> correct, but the latter part is not. FreeDOS, like PC-DOS and MSDOS > > >> before it, is/was not an operating system, but rather a more primitive > > >> creature known as a monitor system. > > > > > > The DOS part of those names is an abbreviation of 'Disc Operating > > >System' - clearly at the time they were considered operating systems even > > > > They may have been considered that by amateurs from the ham radio > > community > > Stopped reading here. > > The "amateurs from the ham radio community" are (and at least were > back in the 70s) much more skilled than you paint them. The first form Really? That was not my experience in the United States. Here there appeared to be very little overlap between computer programmers and ham radio operators. When CPU chips with word lengths greater than four bits appeared in '75 or '76, both communities began to take interest. Once kits and already built small computers were available on the market, quite a few members of the ham community began learning how to program, but it was several more years before a large percentage knew much about programming. By the same token, it was quite a while before many programmers got into building hardware. I suspect that the electrical engineering community may have had much more overlap with hams and with programmers, but as the mostly distinct groups at that time. By the early 1980s the ham community did include many people with susbstantial programming knowledge. Scott Bennett, Comm. ASMELG, CFIAG ********************************************************************** * Internet: bennett at sdf.org *xor* bennett at freeshell.org * *--------------------------------------------------------------------* * "A well regulated and disciplined militia, is at all times a good * * objection to the introduction of that bane of all free governments * * -- a standing army." * * -- Gov. John Hancock, New York Journal, 28 January 1790 * ********************************************************************** From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 07:51:10 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC69125713F for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:51:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) Received: from sonic312-27.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (sonic312-27.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com [77.238.178.98]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Kznn1NkMz3Q0Z for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:51:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) X-YMail-OSG: ifkkx_IVM1lSTivWdgr4fFfZ0eilWVXyjGQJsucK99CU3oErTygsHd2Crn8rCWY yjOlmS_7tSHy_aTfyCuxHS3D.95LuJ49Ahb6ZTq8_0b5m6CRSD0iwt8wb20Zcu7I8kpYM_TYnpvj t0N3kScU2kzEg_RBOQZG_fYdpv3yyjWvAkLJ9n5TlACCdEHsbZu9GbH6zfzQcf9lSG_O97TKUIV9 7q_zlcoLdMwxAZ5qDmi3SlHCIQlJ2c9RFawJ9IjShzwNgOr5Wt8vChaZxag._610lZYluvQx7Wrn lGeN9v_OmP5SGLyapPcadpIPqnWQhIeeaRbHBB95aSRYgyTAtNy_L_LhT_Edr4T8dJYjrxoaGKjC BSKCCXJLQFu.FPj1ZXQsv5e0cB_n_shM9aLgarQ4MxnTCMng7eq7lB9GyGvmIK.n8387WDjYiB6l MOyc9bK4iTG7QhtiSrXkTd7M2jQ35gGSCutDR3d3I2CjWycjXQY3LMBft8ybkNJicef7Y1fKHbby JSLiMtTBEl9xzyu7GwLUs2yp1GnMVs9YgVB0posqPkM46yCQnfGz5ZDaLxVh6OgPah9wsj.MNiNE uEZMlK.vsDgpb8dloP1SNguGmUTdK5YEYUllbindquFw9U6Lfht9rzlIJOWJyRGjSfzcDgBUrRsg ELLcqvJ3jhc18VaJUk1kFP2VcQs5QNLhEZa5Cmod6eZ6tWhO4RDCnZaIFX31zOtZzt5RnsF67Mh. _KPCD5DFs78_REtLyipQ63vOeLad60AzkORw.7cc3zHYd1h_oxvxrjbD3jZ8gm_XqXX3RpSfP8tJ DOlE3_v1yHTOj8.f8jkZ00nbRV5dUFUItHHG4SFfn4.uqkKRYEl9HXMWw.dWSq74_OrNP2o6d6wo 2xEV_LeQvBfZ5LmMmdlCntcb_vZDIQqtVCUEzpt638bpxEEZgyMWE2s68LZVY35NpEgwPVNkZGZW Z92blKiw7rWgIyrk_QRp95aJPHoaFAv1L3_iaD0ibYKln0lBb5cQWEkLHOSfX8NohSncvg7UNxot FMKs3kYPm22ICAn4kWsCAMfZQNJKqEzH8D74ELI3LGbeSYAlO_U3CV1nFZR9ObkmSMSlsFoidvrx .xiJK.ks8CIJEdLKmyfYtpTD_ajOdGLjgjjTEe8cDwAay9JIv3ZWZuG_HBbGvrC7EdoI6dt_kNT0 twNZz9JUjzcNTbK4tOgEwxv.T5WmnmNlppzGQbOYm4oPSDAqeRhxDWniri43QFvsVuGFR1cG2Sd2 ELaN_1C2QysTDR4Sb6x6iRryuaU1VjeH2S7qYh.0sp_FlwhmZ8MJDJ6IDgbP8jJuqploMkdwIWzA AM5v1Ifqo84TfptrpOrR4zoyT33YCsKfNI0gpOHZsLqP6gAXGLXcKSJ_Wt.HWU6mtf6U3ELqEwCH tSZbhM1xP4I_hlAfEyZ8- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic312.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:51:06 +0000 Received: by smtp417.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 80b1dc72a772e8c7b76ac267364224fc; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:51:02 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:51:03 +0100 From: Ralf Mardorf To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: terminology and history (was Re: Re updating BIOS) Message-ID: <20200216085103.060caf80@archlinux> In-Reply-To: <202002160656.01G6uBYm008146@sdf.org> References: <202002120724.01C7OcSW005991@sdf.org> <202002160656.01G6uBYm008146@sdf.org> X-Mailer: Claws Mail (linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Kznn1NkMz3Q0Z X-Spamd-Bar: - X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.44 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.15)[-0.154,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[rocketmail.com:s=s2048]; XM_UA_NO_VERSION(0.01)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.80)[-0.801,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[rocketmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[rocketmail.com,reject]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.178.238.77.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (3.25), ipnet: 77.238.176.0/22(2.15), asn: 34010(1.70), country: GB(-0.07)]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[98.178.238.77.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:34010, ipnet:77.238.176.0/22, country:GB]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:51:10 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:56:11 -0600, Scott Bennett wrote: >Ottavio Caruso wrote: > >> On Wed, 12 Feb 2020 at 07:24, Scott Bennett wrote: >> >> > >> > On Sun, 9 Feb 2020 08:41:11 +0000 Steve O'Hara-Smith >> > wrote: >> > >> > >On Sun, 09 Feb 2020 02:09:59 -0600 >> > >Scott Bennett wrote: >> > > >> > >> The first part of the above, mispunctuated pair of >> > >> sentences is correct, but the latter part is not. FreeDOS, >> > >> like PC-DOS and MSDOS before it, is/was not an operating >> > >> system, but rather a more primitive creature known as a monitor >> > >> system. >> > > >> > > The DOS part of those names is an abbreviation of 'Disc >> > > Operating >> > >System' - clearly at the time they were considered operating >> > >systems even >> > >> > They may have been considered that by amateurs from the ham >> > radio community >> >> Stopped reading here. >> >> The "amateurs from the ham radio community" are (and at least were >> back in the 70s) much more skilled than you paint them. The first >> form > > Really? That was not my experience in the United States. Here > there >appeared to be very little overlap between computer programmers and >ham radio operators. When CPU chips with word lengths greater than >four bits appeared in '75 or '76, both communities began to take >interest. Once kits and already built small computers were available >on the market, quite a few members of the ham community began learning >how to program, but it was several more years before a large >percentage knew much about programming. By the same token, it was >quite a while before many programmers got into building hardware. I >suspect that the electrical engineering community may have had much >more overlap with hams and with programmers, but as the mostly >distinct groups at that time. By the early 1980s the ham community >did include many people with susbstantial programming knowledge. Really? I can't comment on this from my own experiences, but a Linux pen pal from Virginia between 80 and 90 years old, AFAIK not a ham enthusiast, but an audio and video engineer (as I was myself) started already when transistors didn't exist, probably might proof you wrong. I'm a native 6005/6010 Assembly programmer from the 80th, from Germany and never had to do something related to ham Radio, but a friend of mine, in my age, was radio operator for the Bundeswehr that time. Back to the original topic, the time when *DOS existed (>= 1981), we already had worldwide very skilled people who actually know how to use a soldering station and how to program Assembly and even higher languages. Consider the term "operating system" with common sense and historical reality. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 08:10:12 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58E8425771D for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:10:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) Received: from sonic313-22.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (sonic313-22.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com [77.238.179.189]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48L0Cl3Dnrz43V1 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:10:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) X-YMail-OSG: 5B9CGlIVM1lTieUMZuY4abTlNJTlBKxvDLR_mZvu4tlGrkUwqbTjyyiNbDnLzRs Vuq5_UH_uIZFuND1WPJX1azBkrORiKfMHdGRaOlJyTsfkZIq4WP78SmGg51fICPXg93cLE2dmswp 2FuYiT2Ry_da4.fDfPdWSw3bW3lR096u06StFNZpjh4yn29.XKWqMT1d7JivU1yx5SLuEr1_gNRt Ac6Sd4SayWhdng_BYXPr1w.RSZ2pztwYy7TQhmPRmkNo.MM4ikTZoVO8UPAU9Ji3eqfO_soBPLGD 5RUafToNcBrnVwntXB172lu691WXkyP_J3cuSzhqFpARJ0hQsRMM7bGqEKc9wIxkMtzSsK9phMJE ZezMIteccyPOF0CXfZM6QgGM3YD4Um1HhZNXHk6vcFnHyjNkL5JvS_4TyU.9sfYER_Ny19.YDyX4 ivTazlEt5nqRE2UyWIKHy9fVQ3gV6BqYPzLaMRiQRI4FVOr3mhFqiBzyxFQ5p__7vecvltlUF.jJ eaa9mxGXvpxtXsPCdTv6BtHDhF0eJuS53V9XDJGJRx8N.RSnAzRKLtJyysgukWExMS7.2p9YsL7B ykBhpyg8rhq7IYrq7POcFrcX_tIa_0mZofCD.67cUeAjyVZifycSJiKzjM4mGSythxLI918VUhaa wH3bSqx45TMUIM22b7j.KaLs0jNeUcIPXBWE2_G4MYua7S5.QqygpEvXW62HtQclrg7m61RSQB_G iHwMrvqNH989yPqktAQwPcgmYkb0xc0iH4O5n9gPI9EeId2zCeMe_PFRU1TtsPxaCxB_zF7nrENZ Ta9MBw3oKXyEoDRb7IPGOx91drPS0zde2Sh09JMkUe6KL0LmqTOtprP74sHfrMabgDMuPkOmANY7 t5wz3myERMocgw97eEw0O.N9Xbt7NnB8NmMqwSOPixPXPym0hM0AKEOBwul6nHavy0Pb8ggnDhbF TJ5e0qZZWpHDmmzbxVELAKDmvipUyKWr.yRszvHQKRWAP_OyqG242xyXL5x9CA536AcaVpb3yt9_ sj3V4R8oMlmwJCgsldjT1M1FxE58zVDOIKe.s2T0Evn9HlLSxp0Me9Chz4dM3oPkB_QePQsauzpN pXV4e9B4hwNdaExXimrwpw2G5.XUrUJelAiO7hpoYa9bf4KFDybTDFbUGfhl8T.z4UA3bni9hLS7 useYNzdPoLR65VkurrxRxCWvIk83OPLVBH7uLsK66214qPo013d9n1G7rHQk6x3aJcydirYZaOGN rh.HesRaiWT67hAGHCOhH_2NZd9FULnoY9e5VjErbOHF4HEahWst5i_6xelOCU5dKh6rpe36P4S1 y.kVK3YfbepyKQzm6k0SJ9crQFQ6FAlzh7f02PrgvddzLu0vEiCkdVPO5.9Z64KV.J33q1Tv7Gdc 7pdeOUNTrgLSvkpHV Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic313.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:10:09 +0000 Received: by smtp420.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 13f35b0b70fe2acfd77762c354236544; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:10:04 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:10:06 +0100 From: Ralf Mardorf To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: terminology and history (was Re: Re updating BIOS) Message-ID: <20200216091006.420fc8cc@archlinux> In-Reply-To: <20200216085103.060caf80@archlinux> References: <202002120724.01C7OcSW005991@sdf.org> <202002160656.01G6uBYm008146@sdf.org> <20200216085103.060caf80@archlinux> X-Mailer: Claws Mail (linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L0Cl3Dnrz43V1 X-Spamd-Bar: - X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.72 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.33)[-0.329,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[rocketmail.com:s=s2048]; XM_UA_NO_VERSION(0.01)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.90)[-0.903,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[rocketmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[rocketmail.com,reject]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[189.179.238.77.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (3.86), ipnet: 77.238.176.0/22(2.15), asn: 34010(1.70), country: GB(-0.07)]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[189.179.238.77.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:34010, ipnet:77.238.176.0/22, country:GB]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:10:12 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:51:03 +0100, Ralf Mardorf wrote: >I'm a native 6005/6010 Assembly programmer from the 80th ^^^^^^^^^ sorry, this should read 6502/6510, I was born in 1966 and it's a while ago that I programmed those CPUs. A little mistake I noticed right after sending my original reply. --=20 =E2=80=9CAwards are merely the badges of mediocrity.=E2=80=9D =E2=80=95 Charles Ives=20 From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 08:42:45 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39154258157 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:42:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic309-20.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (sonic309-20.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com [66.163.184.146]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48L0xJ24nXz4LGy for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:42:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com) X-YMail-OSG: ZhU2LDAVM1nMtOghT0XS0AWkJBRxltz8tNefl7pVrsz_f1bZm.2NR1FEXd3Bb.I P33lfEDu2qUa.dMPliuU55aL2LEz_ney6ixXJ4fAL__W2iueihu95ET4WHztCVeA1qHAP2jytUP4 Pc2TsmYpVxtq35O1TOYFqnur17Wh89HiBZDKnsfveFVOrzvLaZfr6TJHgOwwI8ui7jdTOgb99Uli GejDihUkMlm008_dRSRuQY7vfRTx5VFTnRwKnGOah4176f.9qWm2ck7Y1k_bCdYIJCFkbmuRIYua gN3jEMgWu1r_TGEMQbxMMdtkUaaT5BmmOjTFbAYwBeT.oJSYMvUEG0M8lzxHSSYQhiZ37h3qkq3S V7TghUdTFYHDVw_jftjkFiQF3CT3AU20vLnrZRQPZiVNjUA8n.2HJz4KyNZ5VKZFbGbyRRTBtaRY SMp4YcI8KM.QyutQuDT5esd4sTjc1AapiSLrPtjk3MUi3jjfko3gjO1iRrm33BSVBFN89lmmSpeI UeYLcnouBEkXAlHDT3j1esoaTgUyp07wV.iW3odrbqZWpoH5vYhbcksKjbzHwFAfTqanB8gGxmeo DtkhUijSU6reZpxMDY7tQDKCmOyaD3W5HDzzu5GC7Q..2k1a7JYoDY6uACURHDfeq5cqFzILL10O axUy3bSWBkUZYNCUuiRrnirRyWoou1QzOSaA6kDgIfDL2tnHakgp_b176_oQnVg2BsbDQ0AnLO45 tgIaxdSf6yq7nvMf_J6qpMDbbtx8nxlKoZwTi8W51XSF8BRRlOyN0TYM6F8Xq5GRatOM4CRpqxir FtcntR_6rs5VdxU37VIV6F3Dk_5GweTknIJnzxFSIWr0DsJuj6DasA1nzlCYZAZ2BLfAxJj1goBJ L4I7nXhs8C3yZ7WfhzjlLhG2IGohV0Vayio9nK4_6DppKDC0XqqzbpOt9yj7EiBuIKo8dTYFzxlv yUSIxzN25WNLsULrDtv6hcFGEqj5g4fRZbzVdSEwUl6EB5.24pm2Y0T3xiI5rGKzGrUEtd5kkd4B T2EwSFqtB0SFsd7bxFSNZrC_Vje3iP6n32N0UEf68MpqOPnLrj.fmop5PH.v0NXVCNGpEUxvVJiU RBhF12.y446JvkrG8d2Blw0Bvwsawm3bw8oYdUCYAMietBslR6WkadYgyKwSO4HpMyPqyJZ0AS9b oZ3EAolQNFHhKUPonm.b8rtevP9apOJg74uIVr_tsNX0CPzuDsxYbNdnnwYf._Ywonxy9Mn5SHJc nk17egsqUSWwNIROz3KXmrXQ03xxnvg7ekc05WSKn0Wj1AEgG_TjkhOaa6LyN8NrN6zjR1OZ9dtG vCtYm5oYVHONrxNuURjJ5elpAQG1cdA9RZh.I.hOVCj1HY10TAWdtlX2VkNnvERQyXw0CVmLtwh3 GCVLJuryUClyfV0Ai3zwvz_YYwKKvhAs- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic309.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:42:42 +0000 Received: by smtp407.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 3046107ae8921feaa55e54a486245a6d; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:42:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-pj1-f47.google.com with SMTP id fa20so5839958pjb.1 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:42:40 -0800 (PST) X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAX5D+pQlJRLeADQTeE+UJfCBAM3OhDyqxMKJydL6wE0/cmJBpV+ 2FrdlgdUVj7wZEIPw2VRDBcbCloFHwiZoa/oEJI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxYycOhh537QcXvPV1KDy1d3/GBy01y7wt1HM4lGDa/oU3tWyEb3iIagGpGJtHGlw4fqWecRVIEh3tA1BB6Wsc= X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:8a88:: with SMTP id p8mr10819999plo.179.1581842559819; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 00:42:39 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <202002120724.01C7OcSW005991@sdf.org> <202002160656.01G6uBYm008146@sdf.org> In-Reply-To: <202002160656.01G6uBYm008146@sdf.org> From: Ottavio Caruso Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:42:23 +0000 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: terminology and history (was Re: Re updating BIOS) To: Scott Bennett Cc: steve@sohara.org, freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.15199 hermes Apache-HttpAsyncClient/4.1.4 (Java/1.8.0_181) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L0xJ24nXz4LGy X-Spamd-Bar: -- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.31 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.92)[-0.920,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.69)[-0.693,0]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[146.184.163.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36646, ipnet:66.163.184.0/21, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (3.64), ipnet: 66.163.184.0/21(1.15), asn: 36646(0.92), country: US(-0.05)]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:42:45 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 at 06:56, Scott Bennett wrote: > > Ottavio Caruso wrote: > > > > The "amateurs from the ham radio community" are (and at least were > > back in the 70s) much more skilled than you paint them. The first form > > Really? That was not my experience in the United States. Here there > appeared to be very little overlap between computer programmers and ham radio > operators. I'm not surprised that you'have jumped to this conclusion because: 1) Define "computer programmer" in 2010 and in the 70/80s. Back then, computer programmers were an elite that programmed mostly in low level languages. They were a tiny minority in any field of society and they probably were also in the ham community, who, at the time, were mostly ex-military or analogue RF engineers. 2) Like I said before, the first "workable" form or wireless data traffic was AX-25, which was invented by hams for hams, but before that, even in 50s and 60s, hams used old teletypes and protocols like rtty and baudot (still used today), so it's fair to say that their IT knowledge was far superior than the average Joey Bag-of-donuts. I grew up in Italy in the 70s. I wasn't involved with amateur radio (my father was). Hobbyist magazines were full of EPROM projects to build custom TNCs and home-made rudimentary computers based on the Z80. Very few hobbyists could afford the DOS/IBM-PC crap. My schoolmate's father bought one in 1982 for 5M Italian liras; that was basically a year's wage of an office worker. -- Ottavio Caruso From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 08:57:32 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84329258659 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:57:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) Received: from sonic301-21.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (sonic301-21.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com [77.238.176.98]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48L1GL6cmNz4SRp for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:57:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) X-YMail-OSG: n8py0OkVM1lYOR2ib159JEf8jB.YZ5HtcvW3Jmy6Nd5oVHNa3BPrb9rz4LLCTmz etHilZMmY6fb05wIS1IegzyG4EkKKLuIn7qgYbjakOUJp0hWr5XYLGf6DIVVPzFV2rib3npwXvYz V7HpKfI9prQLRNg8I0iJpAcqTNyvpPUYh9P6Wr31vPbBArjNodnYI1wJB9sJdkhn6gt7HS_OoAy. pXFPzbMp1gpXmRQYOnIIFlijK4bll0tnhRp_H1TuEzEtKSHhOn6kLVpgdnSpPTRN8yOXn91qfBN0 M2Y8ubYurr99lEVHhpcl6ZbsuaseGl.7ywOoSSrAhDGePYfF2IsrzPr6cYOTwlJrUMzsjK167tWh AmNGrIfA_r9clYs.b78f6AGH2FqfLJv7QpgFPgceNK3ncC3dNthqeo6UFOX_9G1WaUHDjD_mAhBl cqi7x5vytJKtTvmusHa5JhkvMh5VplzWyZ3WNx9LVLNtNBDVwrPZKE0uj1bQcSCs58fqkX2bf3m2 hk2QVdX9NVLZgqkLplZW_KaWi.adzoq5.q.Rly0M1V7WbZnLVb8TbsLGdYtOHVCb8ksf8iHFpa1_ aYPhmvbdN0QmXsjrM.cqISoEzbxF_tOlaZKh126UZXDBKU0qxYusKpZ3eCDf2Ic3QYtVPErWY4u2 BSlMDTCkBrdJKCEquR8pMnpgj9tF7lEGERX3O0S.R54yqiR7A4smnT9sXR9CUJpPm3ar88e9y66G bEnXr1bQLkdD8Hw854aHjVENjbTIYjnum1z1kVcbuMU4NTRY9_Va4nVmmOPo_R7HBft60AS4g2LU 0UJ0eHD2Qi3Ikx3Ouii73_N.24GYj_hBideHNOOZJCeA6knWk5KoTXX0Y6u6SxK1uM6eO7zB6ShU ou6nWD6yxX6HOCxt5wUHy.tXnFJe4Vka58OQLOdUy7ngbhGzaOZk1YhqSzY_3uulQxdGzttSr9R6 pfO4IhqKQe0uf_aadibvEMc1_AGkolsP_dQFyhskLCXTIQxpn2KXKeBxLDh3AIoT07WD4sPIpKrs Lct5hYBRsdfEgoUXjdkQCb3y7f8ht_xt4weqUhZGS1CxqNAN9qh8GpIcstEZxgyQW2c8jrYH7wlz 78UfrLutYrQxI_YLserU2N0LAglPSH1S7HXz_JFbKrM_hKtQEH_khTy.q6Kd7syJ5JC0iTeEdc3m jv5KeigtmM0syDiNURWoGiiSFDyZdo1v3b_wE0OuRjdDvVa66I7P0Z.MbDPnrs7qfsA8tsn661Nw Msv06.zhFU8oluyN5gRflWgCIpfwTnEaPL8rt_Wf.OZ4Wwo1tBEKdHWYJRHJ.qp.htjDm.Ox6V2j WzzBmQDm1H6oFdXLwSFbG7DF6GE4Bx086A_nBgDKT9JVLyTxH8Kx6Dx8IeWYxu8dt9uiGAodONAY 9xsLvpxEzRh63v8fR1A-- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic301.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:57:28 +0000 Received: by smtp430.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID adbbc2c7926b928fc1b8d21ea1b18cfc; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:57:23 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:57:25 +0100 From: Ralf Mardorf To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: terminology and history (was Re: Re updating BIOS) Message-ID: <20200216095725.2b3921e0@archlinux> In-Reply-To: References: <202002120724.01C7OcSW005991@sdf.org> <202002160656.01G6uBYm008146@sdf.org> X-Mailer: Claws Mail (linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L1GL6cmNz4SRp X-Spamd-Bar: / X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.97 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[rocketmail.com:s=s2048]; XM_UA_NO_VERSION(0.01)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.57)[-0.569,0]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.09)[0.094,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[rocketmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[rocketmail.com,reject]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.176.238.77.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (6.36), ipnet: 77.238.176.0/22(2.15), asn: 34010(1.70), country: GB(-0.07)]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[98.176.238.77.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:34010, ipnet:77.238.176.0/22, country:GB]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:57:32 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:42:23 +0000, Ottavio freebsd-questions wrote: >1) Define "computer programmer" in 2010 and in the 70/80s. Back then, >computer programmers were an elite that programmed mostly in low level >languages. They were a tiny minority in any field of society and they >probably were also in the ham community, who, at the time, were mostly >ex-military or analogue RF engineers. Actually a friend of mine was a radio operator for the Bundeswehr in the 80th. I was an anarchist who neither opt in the Bundeswehr or even opt in alternative services. He and I were indeed low level (Assembly language) programmers. I tested a few higher programming languages that time, but never felt comfortable with higher languages. I can't comment on the 70th, but between the middle or ends of the 80th and the beginning or middle of the 90th, I was a computer programmer myself and soldering stations were not that seldom part of an averaged household. "minority" yes, but not that "tiny". From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 09:00:48 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21294258943 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:00:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from wnew4-smtp.messagingengine.com (wnew4-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.18]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48L1L721GLz4TdG for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:00:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailnew.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD93C647; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:00:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:00:44 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; 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Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:00:43 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Update X when laptop lip is closed To: Noah Palmer Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <2061301f-4f78-e50a-1864-f9a608b7c504@yuripv.me> From: Yuri Pankov Message-ID: <5fe7c2f2-9645-0c13-1878-7bbfa8f33487@yuripv.me> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 12:00:42 +0300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.5.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L1L721GLz4TdG X-Spamd-Bar: ++++++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=yuripv.me header.s=fm1 header.b=lBkgJXP+; dkim=pass header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm2 header.b=XhJQ8YLi; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of yuripv@yuripv.me designates 64.147.123.18 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=yuripv@yuripv.me X-Spamd-Result: default: False [10.92 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(0.00)[+ip4:64.147.123.18]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yuripv.me:+,messagingengine.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-3.48)[ip: (-9.76), ipnet: 64.147.123.0/24(-4.92), asn: 11403(-2.68), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[18.123.147.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:64.147.123.0/24, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[165.4.155.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_XBL(5.00)[165.4.155.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.4]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(0.00)[yuripv.me:s=fm1,messagingengine.com:s=fm2]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[yuripv.me]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(1.00)[1.000,0]; BAD_REP_POLICIES(0.10)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[1.000,0]; URIBL_BLACK(7.50)[yuripv.me.multi.uribl.com]; GREYLIST(0.00)[pass,meta] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:00:48 -0000 Noah Palmer wrote: > On Sat, Feb 15, 2020 at 11:08 PM Yuri Pankov wrote: > >> Noah Palmer wrote: >>> is there a way to automatically remove or add the display to X when the >>> laptop lid is opened or closed. I have been using a script to read >>> dev.acpi_lid.0.state, but is there better way? Also what is the proper >> way >>> to reply to someone while using a mailing list. Do you reply to the >> person >>> or freebsd-questions@freebsd.org. >> >> If you are polling the dev.acpi_lid.0.state value, see /etc/devd.conf >> for examples of ACPI events notification, so you could invoke the need >> actions when lid is open/closed. >> > Okay that seems to be the solution. I also have an issue that > dev.acpi_lid.0.state is incorrect if the lid was open at boot. you have to > close and open the lid for the value to be correct. Interesting, I'm seeing the same on my lenovo laptop, something to look into. BTW, there's somewhat related PR filed: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=240881. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 09:14:47 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F04D2259088 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:14:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) Received: from sonic309-24.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (sonic309-24.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com [77.238.179.82]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48L1fG2X7Vz4bdy for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:14:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ralf.mardorf@rocketmail.com) X-YMail-OSG: 9qAyjeQVM1kWWyb.YvEhvIZEvztED9ewW4W43WWcsCZzLGHX3wpKycQjioyDHl9 _.tQEKO8ZjIYAY_7zfNn7Ma87EF7WgxafeblU1Txzd7pc6mGZ5ravX5ikDxfC8unXLBN79WvClUx qn6zP3RFdRqqI2vfYE7tGb.jYjNUFroSnjk4nc23uImIVhsZZQ2etMld_UFKhhWOmiA9aXoIMPro FQZxF0_zod6CTEHbEDq0uBGUlE1ZdSv5YGK51DnrEgo5iNV0zpKvlyHbekmr6GL7uO_jw82tNCNE bwV38t4ZQQ51ujQrPtbmekRpCbjAldVZuHxocE4dVDJHPuEgTOKeBNzouHX1gZI_kguEXK9rMIsp hrJn0ozOk5VFFaH99MROwQ48wNqgd27S7Kz0Y8FDE6qR4pmzC7faBGFRGj753nCFXWRaS9B.WezD xul4g_Ppe9YDST9WYwqULZnr1q9sVy0n9Tlb9KSqGdFcrZXLtKQYEZOXcBuOmaoHsnR7rsqtDjGc JUQOh4IvUacs8JoywKqhrhkJcbjISYkb9EcQt_Nj6Mk89_vCIQKctjCx4k4Oph.Q7KBiD.Ks1fEy hYcscGqQzohHmkd5hv20cnKdiOwmnz3q4HqeDm52u.zYlj9p9zdsr.Q5W9n.yO1GsdwRmIsWl5U3 79zDbJmwkuUf3Xfvwbue_AmJT2erZ497NOvAorO9ZcF82P.39cpyArLFvmNTb5A8B11tRbvX8Ohh K9LKsDmcNVE0UlnTmjhoojZ9PJS6J0qk90Y1t7TXS2d.n4j5ik6VdCg7h_nGcRPtyvluKCtQP3sR u0q_wnv.Mnf7L0Y3iU.QwZnAL3Z39Zzb6yuvRiZ9GjB_hWBu.9cPxWkgZX0TRdLUifXazaqvKI06 4Uic8xOUsllipcNa0evLcziHwHlJr0xXQ_oKQl3YHlD16VanAJL7e0QPL7U9vf9YJlexd7W3PNCt 2hp5RPWAAK1yJDsPglqLxhyOMXLUYowgp1dU7nYUtCNv0puDKDjNU2hW1nXe.UHegUUV316qoYYV 3YJzvcbDocWelTLDxtwD6awmIhm0svAqNDDwvyvWzMSg6UKTZr.j0cAUFC2GwMZLKiWznU8I9jNn CJ62V14GWqVerMbkkxNWPMsol4XPX2VvGCNj9FbzUHIc5n.6YYCXV6q0r3RXjcKFmFkceqo1N6o_ XyUIp4WBDBNtuQOQw32iftStRv25oevnBnL0Mnp.M2uaxNyvsu2_Xl_l79ZSv6NTXAWf2oI9Rd0A 0qWfvp04DTtFc_zujly.hzjg.Plb8uLtoMU.JDDhQ6b3j.oYrGxKcRpiAo5Di_s62KEY1uaJpVQ1 BOJZPTokE8RsOmJU2INqPPpzO2lK52bFEIflN59c8lykTYw6a Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic309.consmr.mail.ir2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:14:43 +0000 Received: by smtp424.mail.ir2.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 97fa04bf79350f96586d11a1ce5b117c; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:14:41 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 10:14:43 +0100 From: Ralf Mardorf To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: terminology and history (was Re: Re updating BIOS) Message-ID: <20200216101443.16382140@archlinux> In-Reply-To: <20200216095725.2b3921e0@archlinux> References: <202002120724.01C7OcSW005991@sdf.org> <202002160656.01G6uBYm008146@sdf.org> <20200216095725.2b3921e0@archlinux> X-Mailer: Claws Mail (linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L1fG2X7Vz4bdy X-Spamd-Bar: / X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.96 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[rocketmail.com:s=s2048]; XM_UA_NO_VERSION(0.01)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.58)[-0.584,0]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.11)[0.113,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[rocketmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[rocketmail.com,reject]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[82.179.238.77.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (6.21), ipnet: 77.238.176.0/22(2.15), asn: 34010(1.70), country: GB(-0.07)]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[82.179.238.77.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:34010, ipnet:77.238.176.0/22, country:GB]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[rocketmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:14:48 -0000 PS: >RF engineers I was an audio and video engineer. That time just MIDI and time code were digital, anything else in that domain was analog. 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[174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id x184sm4901714ywg.4.2020.02.16.04.01.40 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:01:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48L5Lr24FRz1Z7d for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:01:40 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:01:28 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-ID: <20200216070128.50ad6c0a@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <078C3335-434E-4E96-8D66-28251CA7DDFE@kreme.com> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214141600.GA82559@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214150126.GA1219@x1> <20200214113358.225faf5e@scorpio> <20200215060818.GC1482@admin.sibptus.ru> <078C3335-434E-4E96-8D66-28251CA7DDFE@kreme.com> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; boundary="Sig_/j__WmVhelSemJGyM8b2o6IT"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L5Lw1L9bz4SRV X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=ISYbXyOE; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::b2b as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.73 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.63)[ip: (-9.50), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[b.2.b.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 12:01:45 -0000 --Sig_/j__WmVhelSemJGyM8b2o6IT Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 17:05:00 -0700, @lbutlr stated: >The worst thing about installing 12.1 (well, so far) was getting the >installer to boot, which required DISABLING UEFI for some reason. I had the same problem. Then, once I did get it to boot up, the following bug appeared: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D237666 I am now back at 11.3, and apparently since there has been no movement on the PR, will be stuck here permanently. --=20 Jerry --Sig_/j__WmVhelSemJGyM8b2o6IT Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEIQb/tTwl6I1ueEVtOHMGOIfexWQFAl5JLxgACgkQOHMGOIfe xWQCyQgAwrmVly+He+Apnyi+l4cg4yaAa93BQww9cp4KtCDTYaWNfHyfdw8vLsYw Hjzyvjey6V7fk/uFsorXs2hTugvjdMw//1QVzUt+5ZBGeZQPNp2GFdcTATHqtYCI +CnNQaIm3pnpxZAvpQGdax+FtQVIoIu+qQonVlsiQ8OgK+gnY+JQSVzoC3o4owut k+GGaOHuSrVQh4gLvuqCanNLGftPBcSIdXoCUMWnHRelwVz1X1buQtxLG8FaPhyb kK5M3Km9HaAL1G49wPKPCn0IRN1YkC4sHGZAQexWIJn9viTg+BZ21cTm+afK7krE Wg1vM3dNvcD+rwnbY8rEniuR4incJA== =LVAJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/j__WmVhelSemJGyM8b2o6IT-- From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 12:38:40 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC51F25D2B3 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 12:38:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: from mail-qv1-xf30.google.com (mail-qv1-xf30.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::f30]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48L69W4XHsz3NGv for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 12:38:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: by mail-qv1-xf30.google.com with SMTP id y2so6399623qvu.13 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:38:39 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=seibercom.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:reply-to :organization:face:mime-version; bh=NobsCrvLNqeAmYwSUubjsPlS4cuLQubWV4d3+nDEf3I=; b=SMVoqHBF1xVrOx+B+Tz19g4jQH6V7cCtBH6H6X7f3L3qVWQoGgesDMCpE5D4xSEHyI OSxD6zTeUdmLLR03SEIxWFIsh1SFhvsxEj/lzSfF/DZ524cFRnjDjassr2U6RE5ptvxS QuN746Z3d9lAkHEiSt5eHe1V5VgEdTxNRsIk0= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:reply-to:organization:face:mime-version; bh=NobsCrvLNqeAmYwSUubjsPlS4cuLQubWV4d3+nDEf3I=; b=t7pUj6UwSSS96k4X2lFtgOAhvZYoI9B0T7ek0t0L3lYILTocR9jize4w7GkGxp5E30 LtejF8eT4MO4eDWQCZZkN3puTztff5pnYYNesd++XXluX4Ni59j+ZJgEyEW0v/WI+xj7 6hhLEZLqIbDhP+R48fuz7KCqoX50BeC40m6YSvDlldkwGyT8Iqj1SDaFc2e8nWENI+zS Hp2gUUL4qcL/Sijy5pdK7HGD4nULGEIVop3ZyBj1lLU0ubWXjO8cearoEa3bsbZVFfcO +Nc6ireO1E4KRaeAPEku47ofHRdfZVDVp5MZ4qznGxf0vMDfy2fA1VJZ5tmQpXWtal70 52ig== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVb1FgxE+A68a1gLCJEeeKH5OTnI6d988DV1KaZoQZRf4n3G+6s +k8Wo/XTMYWHfipi8FABwFbVDUY/vJQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwr9eDMd0Dm1HtEuLS3l3dVcAiKm9w+bmkyeGlZ7Je8aUuvJGELtJDAXqcYf5/KCV6VQj4e6A== X-Received: by 2002:ad4:46af:: with SMTP id br15mr9100762qvb.216.1581856712616; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:38:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio.seibercom.net (cpe-174-109-225-250.nc.res.rr.com. [174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id d206sm7220228qke.66.2020.02.16.04.38.31 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 16 Feb 2020 04:38:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48L69L3Z94z1Z94 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:38:30 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:38:23 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-ID: <20200216073823.498be8f2@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <20200215231508.ca17067a03bc9c71840c38ee@sohara.org> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215231508.ca17067a03bc9c71840c38ee@sohara.org> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; boundary="Sig_/ZdJrGIfQirfgk.f3cZHimJM"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L69W4XHsz3NGv X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=SMVoqHBF; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::f30 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.03 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; IP_SCORE(-1.93)[ip: (-6.04), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 12:38:40 -0000 --Sig_/ZdJrGIfQirfgk.f3cZHimJM Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 23:15:08 +0000, Steve O'Hara-Smith stated: > More so in the data centre than on the desktop, but even there > I'd >far rather write a document in troff or LaTeX than do battle with Word. >Back in the mid 1980s I set a thousand page reference book using a >database query feeding troff on an 80286 Xenix machine. Try doing that >with MS Office on a modern desktop that has more than a thousand times >as much memory and processing power as that Xenix machine had. I use LaTeX (MiKTeX + TeXstudio) on a Win 10 machine because I got sick and tired of trying to get my printer to work correctly with FreeBSD. I just gave up completely with the scanner and copy functions. The largest document I have tried using with a current version of MS Word is only approximately 400 pages. Many times I will write documents via LaTeX and create a PDF file. Unfortunately, because so much of my work has to be shared among several users, and LaTeX does not offer a suitable way of having a multitude of users edit a document for review, with each edit being kept isolated from the final document, I usually have to write the document with MS Word. I guess it all depends on your audience. For the record, I know that there are supposed to be packages that allow something similar to the multi-user editing style used in MS Word, but I have not found them practical, especially since the intended audience would also need to have LaTeX installed and that is just not going to happen. For the record, my current version of MS Word is 16.0.x. --=20 Jerry --Sig_/ZdJrGIfQirfgk.f3cZHimJM Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEIQb/tTwl6I1ueEVtOHMGOIfexWQFAl5JN8AACgkQOHMGOIfe xWQjxgf+O/j5Ootk2Q/hfBMuuacEDJbjtawHOF+WwgHQB5ALXqjJ5MLi0EZ0uLtr QOZvbTEszW12EpZmu4BSnClRPzSjFbNjRb+WBDc5JeksgOF+rsjrUKXArUDqXwTL qVkJM2WVeg1e0aknyE9rEvZYZtkA8fMbhLhXeU3pP1RaDSgF2gIScKzFevmoQNG+ LVhcx6RdTe859FN6aGiccLS3cTZmvLZLrXbVTczjuEkR8ZS64DxL/w52LD2Eg3SO 2Os2vdAUTgTbp8lCUGZ3UUZB12oNMqCmXMZ+Sqsei2BLhscFG8d+kahGm8XZ24jF 0xBSvnPkmQMpyZ5G/cCmAPE29t+q5Q== =l9Um -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/ZdJrGIfQirfgk.f3cZHimJM-- From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 13:13:59 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F24C725E232 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:13:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Norman.Gray@glasgow.ac.uk) Received: from hillend.cent.gla.ac.uk (hillend.cent.gla.ac.uk [130.209.16.102]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48L6yH5tTnz4FgX for ; 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Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:13:55 +0000 Received: from CWXP265MB0149.GBRP265.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([fe80::857d:e553:e5c0:ff24]) by CWXP265MB0149.GBRP265.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([fe80::857d:e553:e5c0:ff24%7]) with mapi id 15.20.2729.028; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:13:55 +0000 Received: from [192.168.1.50] (81.2.70.164) by LO2P265CA0301.GBRP265.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:10a6:600:a5::25) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.2729.23 via Frontend Transport; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:13:55 +0000 From: Norman Gray To: "freebsd-questions@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Thread-Topic: Technological advantages over Linux Thread-Index: AQHV4zC4rtMJhfJhzkWU8IoZUeC+gKga4OUAgABlaoCAAVWcgIAAGHOAgAAKlICAAATUAIAABViAgAAAj4CAAA3ZgIAADZ8AgADgbYCAAAnagA== Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:13:55 +0000 Message-ID: <1952483A-3C1F-44C6-A558-311699E06D02@glasgow.ac.uk> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215231508.ca17067a03bc9c71840c38ee@sohara.org> <20200216073823.498be8f2@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <20200216073823.498be8f2@scorpio> Accept-Language: en-GB, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [81.2.70.164] x-clientproxiedby: LO2P265CA0301.GBRP265.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:10a6:600:a5::25) To CWXP265MB0149.GBRP265.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:10a6:401:8::19) x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-mailer: MailMate (1.13.1r5671) x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: edb3a1ce-b67b-482f-3fe2-08d7b2e21349 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: CWXP265MB1173: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:9508; 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charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: edb3a1ce-b67b-482f-3fe2-08d7b2e21349 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 16 Feb 2020 13:13:55.4213 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 6e725c29-763a-4f50-81f2-2e254f0133c8 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: zCJaPFavrYUkyTOrYYgSpZMrqeuP9qVd+xFSNVLfzTxf/Fg2A3aHq8GicfyQUfrvh6RZyDsqPm2rt+UaBZSJxmKDsBgyGkX4mOtcSYBjf+U= X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: CWXP265MB1173 X-OriginatorOrg: glasgow.ac.uk X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L6yH5tTnz4FgX X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:14:00 -0000 Jerry and all, hello. On 16 Feb 2020, at 12:38, Jerry wrote: > The largest document I have tried using with a current version of MS > Word is only approximately 400 pages. Many times I will write > documents via LaTeX and create a PDF file. Unfortunately, because so > much of my work has to be shared among several users, and LaTeX does > not offer a suitable way of having a multitude of users edit a=20 > document > for review, with each edit being kept isolated from the final > document, I usually have to write the document with MS Word. I guess=20 > it > all depends on your audience. It's a tangent to this tangent, but depending on that audience it might=20 be worth at least a glance at , which is a=20 collaborative hosted LaTeX environment. Overleaf handles the=20 collaboration and change-tracking part, and means that collaborators=20 don't have to have LaTeX installed locally. They have to have some=20 awareness of LaTeX syntax; but if they're contributing text rather than=20 structure that may not be a huge problem. I've only used Overleaf very lightly myself, but I have colleagues in=20 highly collaborative environments who swear by it, using both the free=20 and paid-for plans (both personal and site-licence accounts, in the=20 latter case). Best wishes, Norman --=20 Norman Gray : https://nxg.me.uk SUPA School of Physics and Astronomy, University of Glasgow, UK From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 13:45:54 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E34C725EBA7 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:45:54 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wattersm@watters.ws) Received: from linux1.tor1.watters.ws (linux1.tor1.watters.ws [165.227.44.84]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48L7g55k6zz4c8P for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:45:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wattersm@watters.ws) Received: from [192.168.0.3] (d53-147-217.nap.wideopenwest.com [64.53.217.147]) by linux1.tor1.watters.ws (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E2400C4F7C3 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:45:46 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214141600.GA82559@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214204838.360c8f624397c659946bd764@sohara.org> <20200215063818.GE1482@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200215083359.367d8a3e9ddb4942df67d5b5@sohara.org> From: Michael Watters Autocrypt: addr=wattersm@watters.ws; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQINBFayHsoBEADQIhLWXAoE6StYIQIqct6xXwy7s37/u62G0V7PSdc3W4/AoSdC+ZvAXnn/ C8TfbP3VqtVty2DhUVpqUkyOUqeKV0OmSFwAeH/YROr3Rha3VNyUalpFGbDtYRSns8qjFGUj YhLxx6xCQLCiq3+YqUYK0hTIhJCn5zHMzFdp+TPz046LR3qA4OdaWtGZklUfeGys6kCWVAQG Vxx9+humCfWBjn9ANuNqiOmcjNomhGuQ8kCsvcdn3vAelwEyk6fkqLI8uw9kWyZeQ/RURyuW qKriujz0odrQf6MMUwMJ5zIFyLe7wuQxSDApeZXZ8eP6R73Ic+tcqQC4+RvIf5f6PnJhOpKJ d5TDcO6YsqKTc27XzHdx3LUEHEaNrD30TLmXytBNccuW+QOfXQtXh2oKpRRt5qyzGG384r25 7yND1ta1HPM5amgMq8YsbZTnqQHl6NG5WgGBt3jiRUnPXyINrUCy79l51EP8JJiC3qtQPufj nWtGCmovr5ZWeKIpk3s2elkk+zRUb4UViuvEX+qweMRu2R8uIfPpWG7UFQ/et7BFkfMl1O+t M+DFdNVaYtfgHICwyLoTGIDFDv4W3dqISTsU+z/YzSiGCH3rFqdabJfF3no0nyUAqkb5Yn+X 2X22JAq/N7LKrDf3uLy+sMVGHwoQI9T0WkyMpkkBYT777cAaBQARAQABtCNNYWNpbnRvc2gg S2V5IDx3YXR0ZXJzbUB3YXR0ZXJzLndzPokCPQQTAQoAJwIbAwULCQgHAwUVCgkICwUWAgMB AAIeAQIXgAUCXhCt4QUJCyD2FwAKCRAFjwxRWGyoxgHFEACi0g4rpqfD6vJy3j9L7Xa3vEWR 1o27goTsPGbTETo2xT2RshG2mmmpDF/gxXUR7mUziiYNGynrOf1Rx05QhrrHYB6lTOPxlAVT ce5jJ24+WH3Mpy0eYtB2m6JgoVZtjYN9E7Wbvj2rYLlxQqlC5vzcXsLd5fsP+GeZnRwY3OIv WAk7cszx/QPmDFgSa7zF3JCT63yGutX8g+alKPAM92oy99KtjtO6ZpV7k/niwBE0QFTvCNZa kEdaAIFXJ8F7oc50KDowWpSP6zu8MkkCccPNAwM8VtZ21648yIvbtVo16KSxcWSR8DiGuqYz wPorqf3FQzpI4g8bfQUoezIJLus0slkIE0Nn3P1RKxKxcU3ehauPEcqJIowmdpeY7qsYB4Im G9ckIjBZXaKnifg73IB+bJlFY/pOR3c57xsYmzLujAvCsCDvKUENJ84aA/7AQWQjXUGelbQE 3Iqy32D9hOr0loSQWvDcT3yUovOaCykmiOl7I3bCV52kRXAiOVcEXtPdempVY309bq8RovFN pKVfxrkvEfZ8+1+C8xB9c4lpcDjOQ/5vbteSUEVK+blgX/6y4oDus3CphbmyaawAiKfykZJb EQjwhBuRdG9ytpdjdWC4H0ZgEyua4xFVeSy9jZopttya4r5JmLd2vzEkyOxTxGQcC80x57ia MmjK4ZR7Kw== Message-ID: <58202623-bbf7-eda0-5cb5-fb4749e91e20@watters.ws> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:45:44 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200215083359.367d8a3e9ddb4942df67d5b5@sohara.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L7g55k6zz4c8P X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of wattersm@watters.ws designates 165.227.44.84 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=wattersm@watters.ws X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.57 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.79)[-0.786,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.993,0]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[watters.ws]; IP_SCORE(0.41)[ipnet: 165.227.32.0/20(0.65), asn: 14061(1.47), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14061, ipnet:165.227.32.0/20, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:45:55 -0000 On 2/15/2020 3:33 AM, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: > Quite so, FreeBSD has all the bits to do it and has had for some > time, but nobody wanted a repository of pre-built jails enough to make one. Personally I find the idea of downloading and running random container images from a 3rd party site to be kind of crazy.  You have no idea what is inside those images until you run them. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 13:54:20 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64C4725EE81 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:54:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wattersm@watters.ws) Received: from linux1.tor1.watters.ws (linux1.tor1.watters.ws [165.227.44.84]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48L7rq1nVkz3FCC for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:54:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wattersm@watters.ws) Received: from [192.168.0.3] (d53-147-217.nap.wideopenwest.com [64.53.217.147]) by linux1.tor1.watters.ws (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 24B77C4F7C3 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:54:18 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214195430.25365f87@moonstudio> <7371554e-82a3-a7aa-b764-ae2627e241d3@kicp.uchicago.edu> <20200214203134.17f6d4bd@moonstudio> <20200215064911.GF1482@admin.sibptus.ru> From: Michael Watters Autocrypt: addr=wattersm@watters.ws; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQINBFayHsoBEADQIhLWXAoE6StYIQIqct6xXwy7s37/u62G0V7PSdc3W4/AoSdC+ZvAXnn/ C8TfbP3VqtVty2DhUVpqUkyOUqeKV0OmSFwAeH/YROr3Rha3VNyUalpFGbDtYRSns8qjFGUj YhLxx6xCQLCiq3+YqUYK0hTIhJCn5zHMzFdp+TPz046LR3qA4OdaWtGZklUfeGys6kCWVAQG Vxx9+humCfWBjn9ANuNqiOmcjNomhGuQ8kCsvcdn3vAelwEyk6fkqLI8uw9kWyZeQ/RURyuW qKriujz0odrQf6MMUwMJ5zIFyLe7wuQxSDApeZXZ8eP6R73Ic+tcqQC4+RvIf5f6PnJhOpKJ d5TDcO6YsqKTc27XzHdx3LUEHEaNrD30TLmXytBNccuW+QOfXQtXh2oKpRRt5qyzGG384r25 7yND1ta1HPM5amgMq8YsbZTnqQHl6NG5WgGBt3jiRUnPXyINrUCy79l51EP8JJiC3qtQPufj nWtGCmovr5ZWeKIpk3s2elkk+zRUb4UViuvEX+qweMRu2R8uIfPpWG7UFQ/et7BFkfMl1O+t M+DFdNVaYtfgHICwyLoTGIDFDv4W3dqISTsU+z/YzSiGCH3rFqdabJfF3no0nyUAqkb5Yn+X 2X22JAq/N7LKrDf3uLy+sMVGHwoQI9T0WkyMpkkBYT777cAaBQARAQABtCNNYWNpbnRvc2gg S2V5IDx3YXR0ZXJzbUB3YXR0ZXJzLndzPokCPQQTAQoAJwIbAwULCQgHAwUVCgkICwUWAgMB AAIeAQIXgAUCXhCt4QUJCyD2FwAKCRAFjwxRWGyoxgHFEACi0g4rpqfD6vJy3j9L7Xa3vEWR 1o27goTsPGbTETo2xT2RshG2mmmpDF/gxXUR7mUziiYNGynrOf1Rx05QhrrHYB6lTOPxlAVT ce5jJ24+WH3Mpy0eYtB2m6JgoVZtjYN9E7Wbvj2rYLlxQqlC5vzcXsLd5fsP+GeZnRwY3OIv WAk7cszx/QPmDFgSa7zF3JCT63yGutX8g+alKPAM92oy99KtjtO6ZpV7k/niwBE0QFTvCNZa kEdaAIFXJ8F7oc50KDowWpSP6zu8MkkCccPNAwM8VtZ21648yIvbtVo16KSxcWSR8DiGuqYz wPorqf3FQzpI4g8bfQUoezIJLus0slkIE0Nn3P1RKxKxcU3ehauPEcqJIowmdpeY7qsYB4Im G9ckIjBZXaKnifg73IB+bJlFY/pOR3c57xsYmzLujAvCsCDvKUENJ84aA/7AQWQjXUGelbQE 3Iqy32D9hOr0loSQWvDcT3yUovOaCykmiOl7I3bCV52kRXAiOVcEXtPdempVY309bq8RovFN pKVfxrkvEfZ8+1+C8xB9c4lpcDjOQ/5vbteSUEVK+blgX/6y4oDus3CphbmyaawAiKfykZJb EQjwhBuRdG9ytpdjdWC4H0ZgEyua4xFVeSy9jZopttya4r5JmLd2vzEkyOxTxGQcC80x57ia MmjK4ZR7Kw== Message-ID: <34c12aae-1855-3837-209d-03bfc422a6bd@watters.ws> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:54:16 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200215064911.GF1482@admin.sibptus.ru> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L7rq1nVkz3FCC X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of wattersm@watters.ws designates 165.227.44.84 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=wattersm@watters.ws X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.63 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.81)[-0.807,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx:c]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.996,0]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[watters.ws]; IP_SCORE(0.38)[ipnet: 165.227.32.0/20(0.46), asn: 14061(1.47), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14061, ipnet:165.227.32.0/20, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:54:20 -0000 On 2/15/2020 1:49 AM, Victor Sudakov wrote: > Ralf Mardorf via freebsd-questions wrote: >> Another PITA on Linux machines are drop directories, overriding sane >> configs, providing everything in one place. >> >> IOW a user might rely on /etc/foo.conf , but an update despotic instal= ls >> >> /etc/foo.d/10-bar.conf >> >> and >> >> /etc/foo.d/20-bra.conf >> >> overriding all the values chosen for bar and bra by the admin, stored >> in /etc/foo.conf . >> >> An update never ever would replace /etc/foo.conf . On Arch Linux it >> would be stored as /etc/foo.conf.pacnew , almost all Linux distros >> provide such a solution, but the admin is screwed, if an update does >> add a file to /etc/foo.d/ . > FreeBSD has taken this path too (looking at /etc/rc.conf.d/, /etc/cron.= d > and numerous others). > > FreeBSD's config merging solutions (mergemaster for src updates and > freebsd-update calling sdiff) are pretty good IMHO. Drop directories are actually a good thing and make managing a system using configuration tools like puppet and ansible much easier.=A0 Want to= add a cron job?=A0 Just drop a file in /usr/local/etc/cron.d.=A0 To disab= le the job just remove the file.=A0 You don't have to worry about conflictin= g with other job definitions or mess around with the user's crontab.=A0 From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 14:01:03 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D899B25F112 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:01:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: from mail-qk1-x735.google.com (mail-qk1-x735.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::735]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48L80Z5yhrz3KG4 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:01:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: by mail-qk1-x735.google.com with SMTP id a2so13737055qko.12 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 06:01:02 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=seibercom.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:reply-to :organization:face:mime-version; bh=8MQvJV2iCKDXsJYp9ya2xl1oqPx/I9zT5Fh24P4Vjw4=; b=dQ0HKLGf0gSDreT/r+H8jsCuRZt5kO+gZLj5nE4HWFfzRdxC5jh5nDNFFmpgcg4sZY eaCKAcas1KCSHcvwjSQE2D/ZkMLJjHQVvG8V3sgzYR0cKAlaOQ74mKrN00fyBuESaRGS vo/bxifhj32kmZtH4K00qSlSh73hjIbVGUrsE= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:reply-to:organization:face:mime-version; bh=8MQvJV2iCKDXsJYp9ya2xl1oqPx/I9zT5Fh24P4Vjw4=; b=ChuuggtoACZ5IcoTTBJFZ/3sn2rZWi8I2pPAPDww9gvCiiUR+iZpsv3l9/If7WZpEu wmNGkakEYRJ3pkkiR3+h2DqkboSwHf5mIIqaYeO/PDSOzpQ4TQzOjYuaCJd9NvrQ/dZz 5i+LolrmMOAgfZcYit2HdMvxXpqjSPjYrdOXuXKN4GzB8hNqUESzRuLiZv0NQZBlOdDr 1ByK1c/C0AK4vEZvdX57zSGwnZ+jhVHtwPN+MLYgTj/dHOai5nwlz5ByLzIe1EJQSWlC fhqSgcJAO7LijjbLES4wFob36thy9oVnY1zhzLpIF5YPzKpwUDrjEjqCu+pTwxgkBPXk T7Rw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXaYTbnax7zDbCstxpYaEMOMdBXFMkVzXxSSpZeehHfO/hOJi71 RWnIySavPgbaDP/55bSzWEgxvGNWRKI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzf2De3VVsMov5vOj8MYIKIUGDJRB8EjovF05hIEHBNU+6Qt/ROiRTxOapJ3AaxtQGdFdwiVQ== X-Received: by 2002:a37:c20c:: with SMTP id i12mr10901444qkm.369.1581861661465; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 06:01:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio.seibercom.net (cpe-174-109-225-250.nc.res.rr.com. [174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id n32sm7624204qtk.66.2020.02.16.06.01.00 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 16 Feb 2020 06:01:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48L80W5hPsz1ZBg for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:00:59 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:00:53 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-ID: <20200216090053.56eec838@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <1952483A-3C1F-44C6-A558-311699E06D02@glasgow.ac.uk> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215231508.ca17067a03bc9c71840c38ee@sohara.org> <20200216073823.498be8f2@scorpio> <1952483A-3C1F-44C6-A558-311699E06D02@glasgow.ac.uk> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; boundary="Sig_/8v2HxshEy5ib0K4a8VvOIG/"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L80Z5yhrz3KG4 X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=dQ0HKLGf; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::735 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.67 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.57)[ip: (-9.24), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[5.3.7.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:01:03 -0000 --Sig_/8v2HxshEy5ib0K4a8VvOIG/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:13:55 +0000, Norman Gray stated: >Jerry and all, hello. > >On 16 Feb 2020, at 12:38, Jerry wrote: > >> The largest document I have tried using with a current version of MS >> Word is only approximately 400 pages. Many times I will write >> documents via LaTeX and create a PDF file. Unfortunately, because so >> much of my work has to be shared among several users, and LaTeX does >> not offer a suitable way of having a multitude of users edit a=20 >> document >> for review, with each edit being kept isolated from the final >> document, I usually have to write the document with MS Word. I guess=20 >> it >> all depends on your audience. =20 > >It's a tangent to this tangent, but depending on that audience it >might be worth at least a glance at , which >is a collaborative hosted LaTeX environment. Overleaf handles the=20 >collaboration and change-tracking part, and means that collaborators=20 >don't have to have LaTeX installed locally. They have to have some=20 >awareness of LaTeX syntax; but if they're contributing text rather >than structure that may not be a huge problem. > >I've only used Overleaf very lightly myself, but I have colleagues in=20 >highly collaborative environments who swear by it, using both the free=20 >and paid-for plans (both personal and site-licence accounts, in the=20 >latter case). > >Best wishes, > >Norman Thanks for the heads-up, Norman. I will have to give it a thorough inspection when I get some free time. --=20 Jerry --Sig_/8v2HxshEy5ib0K4a8VvOIG/ Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEIQb/tTwl6I1ueEVtOHMGOIfexWQFAl5JSxUACgkQOHMGOIfe xWRA8wf/XRFAZbxZRC6n2SwDkws/S/gpsDW0JqWepmZp/9FvDYrVuSyxTOEqb51R U5iLDU0Y8ixCgONBoIkMnWfBuNPJe2DPJaWZYn89WKuOJLuPZCCYRIQGmqn5bZp9 tRN37PqSNdjYmaYke081/ANySGX8cZSR2wsap3kijNUwM1G2d8vSoM+5RA/f00Ta r1cszsBk5wIDP/7y6RlfZ0QSZ9SzH01gdCf8vk4jv9edPzjkX3VUr3I5SKlsyLOr wrt/zVQfOWMTBXwNrh8CZobDKaPDE5R60XcnsWno+BexKQjPRh9jzoWBSfi+YeTf UldfnDeyfDueEEmfh1ToViAKufpufg== =NpSM -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/8v2HxshEy5ib0K4a8VvOIG/-- From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 14:49:02 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D31BB25FE37 for ; 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Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:48:51 -0500 Received: from smtp.lan.sohara.org (EMTPY [185.202.17.215]) by r2.sg.in.socketlabs.com with ESMTP(version=Tls12 cipher=Aes256 bits=256); Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:48:50 -0500 Received: from [192.168.63.1] (helo=steve.lan.sohara.org) by smtp.lan.sohara.org with smtp (Exim 4.92.3 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1j3LE1-000Kz7-3P for freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:48:49 +0000 Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:48:48 +0000 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-Id: <20200216144848.e05ae69764d362ca90c9546e@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: <58202623-bbf7-eda0-5cb5-fb4749e91e20@watters.ws> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214141600.GA82559@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214204838.360c8f624397c659946bd764@sohara.org> <20200215063818.GE1482@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200215083359.367d8a3e9ddb4942df67d5b5@sohara.org> <58202623-bbf7-eda0-5cb5-fb4749e91e20@watters.ws> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; 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MV_CASE(0.50)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[email-od.com:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[198.176.0.142.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.15.0]; ENVFROM_VERP(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7381, ipnet:142.0.176.0/22, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:49:02 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 08:45:44 -0500 Michael Watters wrote: > On 2/15/2020 3:33 AM, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: > > Quite so, FreeBSD has all the bits to do it and has had for some > > time, but nobody wanted a repository of pre-built jails enough to make > > one. > > Personally I find the idea of downloading and running random container > images from a 3rd party site to be kind of crazy.  You have no idea what > is inside those images until you run them. That is of course one reason. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 14:51:50 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE3BC25FFEF for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:51:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) Received: from s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com (s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com [142.0.176.198]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48L97B45c5z4SKd for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:51:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=email-od.com;i=@email-od.com;s=dkim; c=relaxed/relaxed; q=dns/txt; t=1581864711; x=1584456711; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:message-id:subject:cc:to:from:date:x-thread-info; 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amd64-portbld-freebsd12.0) X-Clacks-Overhead: "GNU Terry Pratchett" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L97B45c5z4SKd X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:51:50 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:38:23 -0500 Jerry wrote: > Unfortunately, because so > much of my work has to be shared among several users, and LaTeX does > not offer a suitable way of having a multitude of users edit a document > for review, with each edit being kept isolated from the final > document LaTeX plus git plus GitHub/Lab achieves that result rather well. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 15:07:42 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 733BA238746 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 15:07:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48L9TT2KwNz4cc8 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 15:07:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from [IPv6:2607:fb90:2a4:edfd:a538:7cd1:2679:e8a5] (unknown [172.58.139.152]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 443A64E67D; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:07:40 -0600 (CST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.5\)) Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux From: Valeri Galtsev In-Reply-To: <20200216145147.2235135b70d9f45f6203af05@sohara.org> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:07:38 -0600 Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, Jerry Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215231508.ca17067a03bc9c71840c38ee@sohara.org> <20200216073823.498be8f2@scorpio> <20200216145147.2235135b70d9f45f6203af05@sohara.org> To: Steve O'Hara-Smith X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48L9TT2KwNz4cc8 X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=uchicago.edu (policy=none); spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu has no SPF policy when checking 128.135.20.70) smtp.mailfrom=galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.13 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[uchicago.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[152.139.58.172.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(0.13)[ip: (0.37), ipnet: 128.135.0.0/16(0.18), asn: 160(0.15), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.98)[-0.983,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[70.20.135.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.87)[-0.873,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:160, ipnet:128.135.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 15:07:42 -0000 > On Feb 16, 2020, at 8:51 AM, Steve O'Hara-Smith = wrote: >=20 > On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 07:38:23 -0500 > Jerry wrote: >=20 >> Unfortunately, because so >> much of my work has to be shared among several users, and LaTeX does >> not offer a suitable way of having a multitude of users edit a = document >> for review, with each edit being kept isolated from the final >> document >=20 > LaTeX plus git plus GitHub/Lab achieves that result rather well. >=20 We had locally subversion + LaTeX. But commercial service overleaf.com = which was mentioned on this thread beats it. Also, new generation of = scientists are less keen about "programming style=E2=80=9D TeX = (incidentally, TeX was created as programming language to program = typesetting machines), and prefer GUI style everything, like kids = playing cubes=E2=80=A6 Still, whatever helps them to be productive is = the best tools to use. Valeri > --=20 > Steve O'Hara-Smith > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 17:55:50 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2E0F23BBA4 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 17:55:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic301-32.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (sonic301-32.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com [66.163.184.201]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LFCS304rz3D4G for ; 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Sun, 16 Feb 2020 17:55:47 +0000 Received: by smtp404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID cd4ab189b434ba7665274e5eee1a8234; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 17:55:45 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-pl1-f174.google.com with SMTP id ay11so5794084plb.0 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:55:45 -0800 (PST) X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUFFunvfQqdZUI/LibhAMJtLOT6zFGIFyTinAcnoMrrdjL0ysUr pFPzpbf/LTB2jQcgrl5tExpBK6y/f0BLXWRGhl0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxI+dLZzxWm2lEGs+r37pFx8F6xtDNeBEoLTAUdYzfJS3JeqbjE16frqbHnoWd6GJhxb4ZuWBeOdxovHm99uNQ= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90a:b386:: with SMTP id e6mr15332982pjr.106.1581875744307; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 09:55:44 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214141600.GA82559@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214204838.360c8f624397c659946bd764@sohara.org> <20200215063818.GE1482@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200215083359.367d8a3e9ddb4942df67d5b5@sohara.org> <58202623-bbf7-eda0-5cb5-fb4749e91e20@watters.ws> In-Reply-To: <58202623-bbf7-eda0-5cb5-fb4749e91e20@watters.ws> From: Ottavio Caruso Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 17:55:26 +0000 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux To: Michael Watters Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.15199 hermes Apache-HttpAsyncClient/4.1.4 (Java/1.8.0_181) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LFCS304rz3D4G X-Spamd-Bar: -- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.36 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.92)[-0.921,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.74)[-0.744,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[201.184.163.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36646, ipnet:66.163.184.0/21, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (4.15), ipnet: 66.163.184.0/21(1.15), asn: 36646(0.92), country: US(-0.05)]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 17:55:50 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 at 13:45, Michael Watters wrote: > > On 2/15/2020 3:33 AM, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: > > Quite so, FreeBSD has all the bits to do it and has had for some > > time, but nobody wanted a repository of pre-built jails enough to make one. > > Personally I find the idea of downloading and running random container > images from a 3rd party site to be kind of crazy. You have no idea what > is inside those images until you run them. I hate being the guy that defends Linux here, but, at least with Linuxcontainers.org, the images are built using publicly available scripts: https://github.com/lxc/lxc-ci Then one could build their own containers from a script. The images: https://us.images.linuxcontainers.org/images/ can be used as jails or chroots, provided there is some level of binary compatibility. Major Linux distros offer their own docker/containers images. I wouldn't knock dockers/containers, granted that FreeBSD was there first with jails. -- Ottavio Caruso From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 18:00:31 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED75C23BE70 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:00:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wattersm@watters.ws) Received: from linux1.tor1.watters.ws (linux1.tor1.watters.ws [165.227.44.84]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48LFJv0d4wz3HmQ for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:00:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wattersm@watters.ws) Received: from [192.168.0.3] (d53-147-217.nap.wideopenwest.com [64.53.217.147]) by linux1.tor1.watters.ws (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B959BC4F7C3 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:00:29 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215235822.f804ffc6.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215232931.5a9132b2e83daa2d0a06dac8@sohara.org> <20200216010058.73f83086@archlinux> <20200216002656.83d55598023fed6088fb9a23@sohara.org> From: Michael Watters Autocrypt: addr=wattersm@watters.ws; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQINBFayHsoBEADQIhLWXAoE6StYIQIqct6xXwy7s37/u62G0V7PSdc3W4/AoSdC+ZvAXnn/ C8TfbP3VqtVty2DhUVpqUkyOUqeKV0OmSFwAeH/YROr3Rha3VNyUalpFGbDtYRSns8qjFGUj YhLxx6xCQLCiq3+YqUYK0hTIhJCn5zHMzFdp+TPz046LR3qA4OdaWtGZklUfeGys6kCWVAQG Vxx9+humCfWBjn9ANuNqiOmcjNomhGuQ8kCsvcdn3vAelwEyk6fkqLI8uw9kWyZeQ/RURyuW qKriujz0odrQf6MMUwMJ5zIFyLe7wuQxSDApeZXZ8eP6R73Ic+tcqQC4+RvIf5f6PnJhOpKJ d5TDcO6YsqKTc27XzHdx3LUEHEaNrD30TLmXytBNccuW+QOfXQtXh2oKpRRt5qyzGG384r25 7yND1ta1HPM5amgMq8YsbZTnqQHl6NG5WgGBt3jiRUnPXyINrUCy79l51EP8JJiC3qtQPufj nWtGCmovr5ZWeKIpk3s2elkk+zRUb4UViuvEX+qweMRu2R8uIfPpWG7UFQ/et7BFkfMl1O+t M+DFdNVaYtfgHICwyLoTGIDFDv4W3dqISTsU+z/YzSiGCH3rFqdabJfF3no0nyUAqkb5Yn+X 2X22JAq/N7LKrDf3uLy+sMVGHwoQI9T0WkyMpkkBYT777cAaBQARAQABtCNNYWNpbnRvc2gg S2V5IDx3YXR0ZXJzbUB3YXR0ZXJzLndzPokCPQQTAQoAJwIbAwULCQgHAwUVCgkICwUWAgMB AAIeAQIXgAUCXhCt4QUJCyD2FwAKCRAFjwxRWGyoxgHFEACi0g4rpqfD6vJy3j9L7Xa3vEWR 1o27goTsPGbTETo2xT2RshG2mmmpDF/gxXUR7mUziiYNGynrOf1Rx05QhrrHYB6lTOPxlAVT ce5jJ24+WH3Mpy0eYtB2m6JgoVZtjYN9E7Wbvj2rYLlxQqlC5vzcXsLd5fsP+GeZnRwY3OIv WAk7cszx/QPmDFgSa7zF3JCT63yGutX8g+alKPAM92oy99KtjtO6ZpV7k/niwBE0QFTvCNZa kEdaAIFXJ8F7oc50KDowWpSP6zu8MkkCccPNAwM8VtZ21648yIvbtVo16KSxcWSR8DiGuqYz wPorqf3FQzpI4g8bfQUoezIJLus0slkIE0Nn3P1RKxKxcU3ehauPEcqJIowmdpeY7qsYB4Im G9ckIjBZXaKnifg73IB+bJlFY/pOR3c57xsYmzLujAvCsCDvKUENJ84aA/7AQWQjXUGelbQE 3Iqy32D9hOr0loSQWvDcT3yUovOaCykmiOl7I3bCV52kRXAiOVcEXtPdempVY309bq8RovFN pKVfxrkvEfZ8+1+C8xB9c4lpcDjOQ/5vbteSUEVK+blgX/6y4oDus3CphbmyaawAiKfykZJb EQjwhBuRdG9ytpdjdWC4H0ZgEyua4xFVeSy9jZopttya4r5JmLd2vzEkyOxTxGQcC80x57ia MmjK4ZR7Kw== Message-ID: <3e7a9cfc-1570-7fc7-5e36-6e63f124568b@watters.ws> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:00:27 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200216002656.83d55598023fed6088fb9a23@sohara.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LFJv0d4wz3HmQ X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of wattersm@watters.ws designates 165.227.44.84 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=wattersm@watters.ws X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.71 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.85)[-0.851,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.997,0]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[watters.ws]; IP_SCORE(0.34)[ipnet: 165.227.32.0/20(0.27), asn: 14061(1.47), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14061, ipnet:165.227.32.0/20, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:00:32 -0000 On 2/15/2020 7:26 PM, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: > That's not an embedded system, think engine management controller > (and the other dozen or so hidden computers in a modern car), TV, washing > machine, fly-by-wire controllers ... Things with no user interface. There's also millions of PLCs out in the world running some type of networked OS. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 18:03:05 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2BD823C747 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:03:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wattersm@watters.ws) Received: from linux1.tor1.watters.ws (linux1.tor1.watters.ws [165.227.44.84]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48LFMs3wZvz3M7m for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:03:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wattersm@watters.ws) Received: from [192.168.0.3] (d53-147-217.nap.wideopenwest.com [64.53.217.147]) by linux1.tor1.watters.ws (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0C875C4F7C3 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:03:04 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215231508.ca17067a03bc9c71840c38ee@sohara.org> <20200216073823.498be8f2@scorpio> From: Michael Watters Autocrypt: addr=wattersm@watters.ws; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQINBFayHsoBEADQIhLWXAoE6StYIQIqct6xXwy7s37/u62G0V7PSdc3W4/AoSdC+ZvAXnn/ C8TfbP3VqtVty2DhUVpqUkyOUqeKV0OmSFwAeH/YROr3Rha3VNyUalpFGbDtYRSns8qjFGUj YhLxx6xCQLCiq3+YqUYK0hTIhJCn5zHMzFdp+TPz046LR3qA4OdaWtGZklUfeGys6kCWVAQG Vxx9+humCfWBjn9ANuNqiOmcjNomhGuQ8kCsvcdn3vAelwEyk6fkqLI8uw9kWyZeQ/RURyuW qKriujz0odrQf6MMUwMJ5zIFyLe7wuQxSDApeZXZ8eP6R73Ic+tcqQC4+RvIf5f6PnJhOpKJ d5TDcO6YsqKTc27XzHdx3LUEHEaNrD30TLmXytBNccuW+QOfXQtXh2oKpRRt5qyzGG384r25 7yND1ta1HPM5amgMq8YsbZTnqQHl6NG5WgGBt3jiRUnPXyINrUCy79l51EP8JJiC3qtQPufj nWtGCmovr5ZWeKIpk3s2elkk+zRUb4UViuvEX+qweMRu2R8uIfPpWG7UFQ/et7BFkfMl1O+t M+DFdNVaYtfgHICwyLoTGIDFDv4W3dqISTsU+z/YzSiGCH3rFqdabJfF3no0nyUAqkb5Yn+X 2X22JAq/N7LKrDf3uLy+sMVGHwoQI9T0WkyMpkkBYT777cAaBQARAQABtCNNYWNpbnRvc2gg S2V5IDx3YXR0ZXJzbUB3YXR0ZXJzLndzPokCPQQTAQoAJwIbAwULCQgHAwUVCgkICwUWAgMB AAIeAQIXgAUCXhCt4QUJCyD2FwAKCRAFjwxRWGyoxgHFEACi0g4rpqfD6vJy3j9L7Xa3vEWR 1o27goTsPGbTETo2xT2RshG2mmmpDF/gxXUR7mUziiYNGynrOf1Rx05QhrrHYB6lTOPxlAVT ce5jJ24+WH3Mpy0eYtB2m6JgoVZtjYN9E7Wbvj2rYLlxQqlC5vzcXsLd5fsP+GeZnRwY3OIv WAk7cszx/QPmDFgSa7zF3JCT63yGutX8g+alKPAM92oy99KtjtO6ZpV7k/niwBE0QFTvCNZa kEdaAIFXJ8F7oc50KDowWpSP6zu8MkkCccPNAwM8VtZ21648yIvbtVo16KSxcWSR8DiGuqYz wPorqf3FQzpI4g8bfQUoezIJLus0slkIE0Nn3P1RKxKxcU3ehauPEcqJIowmdpeY7qsYB4Im G9ckIjBZXaKnifg73IB+bJlFY/pOR3c57xsYmzLujAvCsCDvKUENJ84aA/7AQWQjXUGelbQE 3Iqy32D9hOr0loSQWvDcT3yUovOaCykmiOl7I3bCV52kRXAiOVcEXtPdempVY309bq8RovFN pKVfxrkvEfZ8+1+C8xB9c4lpcDjOQ/5vbteSUEVK+blgX/6y4oDus3CphbmyaawAiKfykZJb EQjwhBuRdG9ytpdjdWC4H0ZgEyua4xFVeSy9jZopttya4r5JmLd2vzEkyOxTxGQcC80x57ia MmjK4ZR7Kw== Message-ID: <094428da-a842-7390-23a4-0bd5266e6589@watters.ws> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:03:02 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200216073823.498be8f2@scorpio> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LFMs3wZvz3M7m X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.998,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:03:05 -0000 On 2/16/2020 7:38 AM, Jerry wrote: > Unfortunately, because so > much of my work has to be shared among several users, and LaTeX does > not offer a suitable way of having a multitude of users edit a document= > for review, with each edit being kept isolated from the final > document, I usually have to write the document with MS Word. I guess it= > all depends on your audience. Isn't LaTeX just text files?=C2=A0 Why not use something like git? From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 18:29:39 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14F3C23D9AC for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:29:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: from mail-yb1-xb35.google.com (mail-yb1-xb35.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b35]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LFyT4q4qz48Tq for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:29:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: by mail-yb1-xb35.google.com with SMTP id u26so4029516ybd.3 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 10:29:37 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=seibercom.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:reply-to :organization:face:mime-version; bh=uAzI9Bg+nQuexTLc3NdwiV3fCKYyDXVSR6sLDMIQfVs=; b=dojLVwRwReELKuca8mI/8EYy3h5KuMnBynBW5oxWqBDOjZRkRulud1qUgF0khg8J5+ +AE6dKO8GpoSfYHQ61waFC8AVzxcIsoIM8oC3Gwao8yU63XqLVaf07+SAADm7mDGpfGs w3Qhyho61MQemmyaR2MDhL3FR/2Si56idWVxU= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:reply-to:organization:face:mime-version; bh=uAzI9Bg+nQuexTLc3NdwiV3fCKYyDXVSR6sLDMIQfVs=; b=orf64rGGbZwY+ItrVsAIHAddZics5WF9+PG2//igZXrQ49s998IBHHpe/D2J3EuzOj QVUx+Z7ZKs1YTAVJgOLavn/zx7dcFShDp1vTgUeAe7xuvBtzVtJ1qDcW+CC+/QYUiTC6 cLAy5QDnTA2cwaBvHqpbJvJsp4VOoAPKnRYMBnBuuMuRLlmSr9CDQoKPH1dNjVZs1ouh +G7UpnJxTG7AWXWrjzevww9MLRdtNKLbKxaLBzQZC6asNLDS12YsxdHv1YUZcCnopfmH VcveoAjPjAyRmkAgPL6xVEs97IQMejVYNTnsA57GxWw1lh6SRmAgaS6I7M2ynBBjIZKm mPYQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUC+gLrFhrMfpWEqTvHwcsmWqQ23atSPv1rauGkPbSldARaddXE sYbXjvoUBR2JbNZrXa/wK5QJ+u9kMZg= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxywqzSRsIxys3wb5v3ajiBOblUul6LTZHT2Lyb2OaY3xxR+p6hzP+Hui/4HuELKBj+qDxTlQ== X-Received: by 2002:a25:9192:: with SMTP id w18mr10857387ybl.189.1581877775734; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 10:29:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio.seibercom.net (cpe-174-109-225-250.nc.res.rr.com. [174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id y129sm5349490ywd.40.2020.02.16.10.29.34 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 16 Feb 2020 10:29:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48LFyP4Nmqz1ZKt for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:29:33 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:29:27 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-ID: <20200216132927.31ef61c8@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <094428da-a842-7390-23a4-0bd5266e6589@watters.ws> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215231508.ca17067a03bc9c71840c38ee@sohara.org> <20200216073823.498be8f2@scorpio> <094428da-a842-7390-23a4-0bd5266e6589@watters.ws> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; boundary="Sig_/U=HGXNX8Aq=E3gt3k3UVZI/"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LFyT4q4qz48Tq X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=dojLVwRw; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::b35 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.70 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.60)[ip: (-9.38), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[5.3.b.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:29:39 -0000 --Sig_/U=HGXNX8Aq=E3gt3k3UVZI/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:03:02 -0500, Michael Watters stated: >On 2/16/2020 7:38 AM, Jerry wrote: >> Unfortunately, because so >> much of my work has to be shared among several users, and LaTeX does >> not offer a suitable way of having a multitude of users edit a >> document for review, with each edit being kept isolated from the >> final document, I usually have to write the document with MS Word. I >> guess it all depends on your audience. =20 > >Isn't LaTeX just text files?=C2=A0 Why not use something like git? I have no idea how that would work and it certainly would not allow for the fine grained multi-user editing ability that I would require, plus it adds another layer of complexity that my audience would certainly not appreciate. Actually, the ability to share a document with multiple users, each having the ability to edit a document, and share that document with other users but with only myself or someone I designate having the ability to produce the final document is one of the features I most like about MS Word. I have yet to find anything that 'just works' that effortlessly. However, I am always open to suggestions. --=20 Jerry --Sig_/U=HGXNX8Aq=E3gt3k3UVZI/ Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEIQb/tTwl6I1ueEVtOHMGOIfexWQFAl5JigcACgkQOHMGOIfe xWTZ6AgAl0HYwdMhYsg+yBoUKisZ3g8fmHJ5eBdjpt0cClI1k505r57/kikSJeqM dv8gXC27Y7eGfZB+BZLBcHmU/S4KHn5jMsPbkxGi/anRWQbFRJYAh49frpgNYOX8 wJElH8a5seGH1qFYlLR8Qk/13obG4ehFTR9wWFuAcJChqDiqtNsMEruPkgf8Sx3o Q4g4VK6SAXIPdfza5jO+teb17XRrWOCBEnmHS+HMDhUn5eoBYZps/w3n9UYx7xLd sQEFfMberQcLgiQNEY2W//1OLqxamRE3ipFnwYyjQ9QRiapntZ+YFL6OIvf9bSbx mmiLaNVILAV8qGpcUwYgRqB2hgUoyg== =N0t8 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/U=HGXNX8Aq=E3gt3k3UVZI/-- From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 18:31:51 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FEA723DCCB for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:31:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bourne.identity@hotmail.com) Received: from EUR04-HE1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-oln040092073012.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.92.73.12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.protection.outlook.com", Issuer "GlobalSign Organization Validation CA - SHA256 - G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LG1112krz49t0 for ; 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Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:48:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48LGMs3pPBz4NsJ for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:48:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from [IPv6:2607:fb90:2a4:edfd:a538:7cd1:2679:e8a5] (unknown [172.58.139.152]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D50A44E65F; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 12:48:08 -0600 (CST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.5\)) Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux From: Valeri Galtsev In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 12:48:07 -0600 Cc: Michael Watters , freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <6318251A-973A-4DEC-9271-12333EB11F7B@kicp.uchicago.edu> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214141600.GA82559@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214204838.360c8f624397c659946bd764@sohara.org> <20200215063818.GE1482@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200215083359.367d8a3e9ddb4942df67d5b5@sohara.org> <58202623-bbf7-eda0-5cb5-fb4749e91e20@watters.ws> To: Ottavio Caruso X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LGMs3pPBz4NsJ X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=uchicago.edu (policy=none); spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu has no SPF policy when checking 128.135.20.70) smtp.mailfrom=galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.12 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[uchicago.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[152.139.58.172.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(0.13)[ip: (0.37), ipnet: 128.135.0.0/16(0.18), asn: 160(0.14), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.98)[-0.982,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[70.20.135.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.86)[-0.863,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[yahoo.com]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:160, ipnet:128.135.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 18:48:10 -0000 > On Feb 16, 2020, at 11:55 AM, Ottavio Caruso via freebsd-questions = wrote: >=20 > On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 at 13:45, Michael Watters = wrote: >>=20 >> On 2/15/2020 3:33 AM, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: >>> Quite so, FreeBSD has all the bits to do it and has had for some >>> time, but nobody wanted a repository of pre-built jails enough to = make one. >>=20 >> Personally I find the idea of downloading and running random = container >> images from a 3rd party site to be kind of crazy. You have no idea = what >> is inside those images until you run them. >=20 I can see two opposite attitudes here locally. Being sysadmin I am 100% = with Michael: I do not want/trust to run something created by somebody = else and not necessarily thoroughly audited. I do feel fully responsible = for whatever happens because of my actions/choices. So, I build BreeBSD = jails, not even using ezjail, just =E2=80=9Cby the book=E2=80=9D, and = install/configure inside what is necessary. Majority of scientists I work for here are more or less with Ottavio: = they will run everything that they find lying there on the Internet what = is said doing what they need done. And they are entitled to that = attitude, in a sense that they have better things to do: their science, = and spending time on anything else just steals time from doing science. My apologies for this crude division, no offense intended. Valeri > I hate being the guy that defends Linux here, but, at least with > Linuxcontainers.org, the images are built using publicly available > scripts: > https://github.com/lxc/lxc-ci >=20 > Then one could build their own containers from a script. The images: > https://us.images.linuxcontainers.org/images/ >=20 > can be used as jails or chroots, provided there is some level of > binary compatibility. Major Linux distros offer their own > docker/containers images. >=20 > I wouldn't knock dockers/containers, granted that FreeBSD was there > first with jails. >=20 > --=20 > Ottavio Caruso > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 19:35:30 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EF1B23FCC6 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 19:35:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from noahpalmerversion1@gmail.com) Received: from mail-lj1-x22d.google.com (mail-lj1-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::22d]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LHQT0bzfz3yXd for ; 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Sun, 16 Feb 2020 11:35:26 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <2061301f-4f78-e50a-1864-f9a608b7c504@yuripv.me> <5fe7c2f2-9645-0c13-1878-7bbfa8f33487@yuripv.me> In-Reply-To: <5fe7c2f2-9645-0c13-1878-7bbfa8f33487@yuripv.me> From: Noah Palmer Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:35:15 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Update X when laptop lip is closed To: Yuri Pankov Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LHQT0bzfz3yXd X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=S5RH1lJD; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of noahpalmerversion1@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::22d as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=noahpalmerversion1@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[d.2.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.5.4.1.0.0.a.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.07), ipnet: 2a00:1450::/32(-2.42), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 19:35:30 -0000 On Sun, Feb 16, 2020 at 4:00 AM Yuri Pankov wrote: > Noah Palmer wrote: > > On Sat, Feb 15, 2020 at 11:08 PM Yuri Pankov wrote: > > > >> Noah Palmer wrote: > >>> is there a way to automatically remove or add the display to X when the > >>> laptop lid is opened or closed. I have been using a script to read > >>> dev.acpi_lid.0.state, but is there better way? > >> > >> If you are polling the dev.acpi_lid.0.state value, see /etc/devd.conf > >> for examples of ACPI events notification, so you could invoke the need > >> actions when lid is open/closed. > >> > > Okay that seems to be the solution. I also have an issue that > > dev.acpi_lid.0.state is incorrect if the lid was open at boot. you have > to > > close and open the lid for the value to be correct. > > Interesting, I'm seeing the same on my lenovo laptop, something to look > into. BTW, there's somewhat related PR filed: > https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=240881. > Okay, I can use devd to run commands when the lid is opened and closed, but they don't trigger if the laptop starts open or closed, there has to be a change in state when the laptop is running. -- Noah Palmer From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 19:42:30 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9942123FFB7 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 19:42:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) Received: from s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com (s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com [142.0.176.198]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LHZX3xdzz43LC for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 19:42:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=email-od.com;i=@email-od.com;s=dkim; c=relaxed/relaxed; q=dns/txt; t=1581882149; x=1584474149; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:message-id:subject:to:from:date:x-thread-info; bh=tafyB7NHoCViBNcBCdxI5vKNBkO0VYk+EmfRenL1rY4=; b=mZdNYrT50ssLwOniOPGhHrIMx7BUc1eidxBAP4FnoOb9JrZOXQhb3GYEYQmLTVg5wMZt16uhHGOCBJhZxoJCTbifl3kFdf2r1LRXyeOwweWZPNGrhsjKYWz9pTXX77qM2yaFxYwvRdEjACFtg69QKbCDXU4Ef1IaMdaVlOuv38A= X-Thread-Info: NDI1MC4xMi43NDAwMDAwMDY3ZDcxYS5mcmVlYnNkLXF1ZXN0aW9ucz1mcmVlYnNkLm9yZw== Received: from r3.h.in.socketlabs.com (r3.h.in.socketlabs.com [142.0.180.13]) by mxsg2.email-od.com with ESMTP(version=Tls12 cipher=Aes256 bits=256); Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:42:24 -0500 Received: from smtp.lan.sohara.org (EMTPY [185.202.17.215]) by r3.h.in.socketlabs.com with ESMTP(version=Tls12 cipher=Aes256 bits=256); Sun, 16 Feb 2020 14:42:24 -0500 Received: from [192.168.63.1] (helo=steve.lan.sohara.org) by smtp.lan.sohara.org with smtp (Exim 4.92.3 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1j3Po6-000Lpd-L2 for freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 19:42:22 +0000 Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 19:42:22 +0000 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-Id: <20200216194222.59ea533d0408d4409823bcb6@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: <6318251A-973A-4DEC-9271-12333EB11F7B@kicp.uchicago.edu> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214141600.GA82559@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214204838.360c8f624397c659946bd764@sohara.org> <20200215063818.GE1482@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200215083359.367d8a3e9ddb4942df67d5b5@sohara.org> <58202623-bbf7-eda0-5cb5-fb4749e91e20@watters.ws> <6318251A-973A-4DEC-9271-12333EB11F7B@kicp.uchicago.edu> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd12.0) X-Clacks-Overhead: "GNU Terry Pratchett" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LHZX3xdzz43LC X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=email-od.com header.s=dkim header.b=mZdNYrT5; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com designates 142.0.176.198 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.90 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.99)[-0.991,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[email-od.com:s=dkim]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:142.0.176.0/20]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[sohara.org]; FORGED_SENDER_VERP_SRS(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; IP_SCORE(0.09)[ip: (-0.26), ipnet: 142.0.176.0/22(0.52), asn: 7381(0.26), country: US(-0.05)]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[email-od.com:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[198.176.0.142.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.15.0]; ENVFROM_VERP(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7381, ipnet:142.0.176.0/22, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 19:42:30 -0000 On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 12:48:07 -0600 Valeri Galtsev wrote: > I can see two opposite attitudes here locally. Being sysadmin I am 100% > with Michael: I do not want/trust to run something created by somebody > else and not necessarily thoroughly audited. I do feel fully responsible > for whatever happens because of my actions/choices. So, I build BreeBSD > jails, not even using ezjail, just “by the book”, and install/configure > inside what is necessary. Yep the typical good sysadmins view. > Majority of scientists I work for here are more or less with Ottavio: s/scientists/users/ and you'll be good almost anywhere. > they will run everything that they find lying there on the Internet what > is said doing what they need done. And they are entitled to that They'd all be happier with a well curated set of handy tools - if somebody finds one for them and makes it easy to use. > attitude, in a sense that they have better things to do: their science, > and spending time on anything else just steals time from doing science. Quite right too. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sun Feb 16 21:32:40 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA789243912 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 21:32:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ihor@antonovs.family) Received: from mail.antonovs.family (mail.antonovs.family [100.25.240.195]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LL1g6Dn2z4Tmw for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 21:32:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ihor@antonovs.family) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19E78138BA0; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 21:32:33 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail.antonovs.family ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.antonovs.family [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id HI9r7Mn4kbx8; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 21:32:32 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CE27138BC6; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 21:32:32 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 mail.antonovs.family 9CE27138BC6 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=antonovs.family; s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77; t=1581888752; bh=Sg1Z/SZjAEvdlge2yPALHUREFEsMrw0tYnix3cD+hfQ=; h=Date:From:To:Message-ID:MIME-Version; b=lV761yqCOa41jItY3Ui76Ou7c4u4nOEZ9j6CpbyVIE0Dk7T8mIIbhUiuOywWMdnfY ZXdhr405fOLq/dQ2mdAQ19tUePGZCgMHY4ywfHoMzQs2YeIyS23ELw042wX1XDIBCK gZZOv3kzDm/g0HUiw037S0ZPDOESbo6GPADgPe5WFuAwCz3+oJ+4FzGTqmS5HWHQmr ohvEwL8uvLWvM/j/NI4PZepLB0C+cUjExmgDO5hIXk5UQvrkDr3HjqkKh9Zd4sC/JH EPQzXCVEVaciU8knrTZbxDn/3NhTxNv3vkY5RhsmoxvTm1vrlMr/PfqoCHEs+Ol03R Tg1nflvqPkOnA== X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at antonovs.family Received: from mail.antonovs.family ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.antonovs.family [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id DtUVFA8BxMlQ; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 21:32:32 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (c-73-83-210-79.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [73.83.210.79]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 44ECC138BA0; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 21:32:32 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:32:29 -0800 From: Ihor Antonov To: "@lbutlr" Cc: FreeBSD Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-ID: <20200216213229.syxeeerzcrvekj3t@sea-ll-10936> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214141600.GA82559@admin.sibptus.ru> <1eb61cba-5e28-e8ea-c418-a06f0f94ec86@kicp.uchicago.edu> <1F2DC40A-8C43-43DF-9168-661FDEC32989@kreme.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1F2DC40A-8C43-43DF-9168-661FDEC32989@kreme.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LL1g6Dn2z4Tmw X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=antonovs.family header.s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77 header.b=lV761yqC; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=antonovs.family; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ihor@antonovs.family designates 100.25.240.195 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ihor@antonovs.family X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.78 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[antonovs.family:s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-3.28)[ip: (-9.05), ipnet: 100.24.0.0/13(-4.30), asn: 14618(-3.01), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[antonovs.family:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[antonovs.family,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14618, ipnet:100.24.0.0/13, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[79.210.83.73.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 21:32:40 -0000 On 2020-02-14 13:23, @lbutlr wrote: > On 14 Feb 2020, at 09:00, Valeri Galtsev wr= ote: > > In my book docker is really a disadvantage, not advantage, compared t= o FreeBSD jails >=20 > Dicker has the advantage of convenience and ease of installing/removing= dockers, but you trade that for not only poor security, but another appl= ication layer between you and the service which itself has had numerous s= ecurity issues. =20 I've been reading this tread for a while, and now I can't help but to add my 2 cents: I am long-time Linux sysadmin/devops and I work with "docker" on a daily basis. Reading this thread I got an impression that a lot of folks on BSD side have vague/wrong/incomplete understanding of Linux containers so I want to introduce more structure into this topic. First off, "docker" is really a misnomer. Nowadays linux world has a whole bunch of container tools: moby (former docker), podman, kata containers, cri-o etc. Not all of them are equal, some of them are comple= te user ecosystems, and some are just "bare" runtimes. There was a tool named "docker" once with that name and the name really stuck, so people call things "docker" left and right.=20 Second, there is no such thing as "linux containers" per se. There are 2 kernel mechanisms: namespaces(allow isolating a process from a the rest of the system, like network namespace, user namespace, pid namespace etc) and cgroups(allow limit resource usage, like cpu, ram, bandwitdh). Combing various combinations of namespaces and cgroups you get "containers". On a low level tools like docker et al do is manipulate=20 namespaces and cgroups. The design of namespaces is really the opposite to jails. With jails you start with a completely isolated environment and then you can add different capabilites if necessary. With namespaces you start with non-isolated process (process that shares namespaces with rest of the system) and you unshare namespaces one by one. (I can't compare resource limiiting part as I am not familiar with how it is done on FreeBSD) It does not mean that namespaces are less secure than jails, it is a diff= erent design, more involved, probably harder to get righ, but also more flexible.=20 Before docker it was very hard to use namespaces and cgroups for a regular linux user. There was no one "jail" command. There were only some system calls and scattered docs.(Well there was LXC, but not the point) What docker did(and was first to do it) is provided a very convenient and pretty complete ecosystem to manage namespaces and cgroups, including features like: - scripting container creation (aka Dockerfile) and sharing it as code - sharing compiled images=20 - Dockerhub is a centralized location for sharing images( it is just glorified fileserver that hosts a lot of tar.gz + some indexing ) - sharing/re-using iamges ( FROM clasue in Dockerfile ) - nice CLI tool to manage containers and images And it hid deeply notion of namespaces and cgroups, so regular joes were able to use it without learning what kernel mechanisms make it possible. Writing a dockerfile is not very different from writing a shell script really. It helped widespread adoption of the tool, but with this also created a lot of misconceptions too. One can argue that "docker" is too bloated and is not really secure. Yes, it is partially true:=20 - it makes some choices about how namespaces and cgroups are used, maybe not the way YOU want.=20 - It is also a pretty big codebase in golang, that YOU did not audit and which is not really necessary if you want to manage things manually and customize to you needs.=20 - Yes, re-using images from the internet also introduces lots of risks.=20 - And yes, big army of regular joes who don't know how the tool works allows misuse, miscofiguration etc. But if you understand how it kerlnel works and when you understand your requirements it is becomes pretty easy to find a proper solutoin.=20 Now coming to jails. jail is pretty low level tool. It should not be compared to "docker". It can be compared to namespaces though. I think it would be more productive to compare capabilities of ecosystems= .=20 - Can you securely sandbox the process with jails or namespaces? - Can you easily script sanbox creation? - Can you share/re-use recepies or built images? - What tools provides more control and what provides more productivity insread? - etc... Where FreeBSD can improve IMHO is building ecosystem tools around jails. = IOCage and Bastile are good projects, doing the right thing. But there are still little to none ways to re-use/share images and build recepies (AFAIK BasitleBSD is working in that direction). Some might argue that=20 BSD community does not need those - could be. > I use docker for things that are not very important on machines that > are (relatively) unimportant. I would never use it on something like a > mail server or web server that has other people=E2=80=99s data on it. Yes, use bubblewrap instead - really inspired by jails, minimal, oriented for maximum security. https://github.com/containers/bubblewrap=20 ------------ Ihor Antonov From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 00:04:39 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63233246E03 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 00:04:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from wnew1-smtp.messagingengine.com (wnew1-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.26]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LPP230pgz4Wnr for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 00:04:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailnew.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5B1947A; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 19:04:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailfrontend2 ([10.202.2.163]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); 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Sun, 16 Feb 2020 19:04:33 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Update X when laptop lip is closed To: Noah Palmer Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <2061301f-4f78-e50a-1864-f9a608b7c504@yuripv.me> <5fe7c2f2-9645-0c13-1878-7bbfa8f33487@yuripv.me> From: Yuri Pankov Message-ID: Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 03:04:32 +0300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.5.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------48B82A192E22BF770C9228B6" Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LPP230pgz4Wnr X-Spamd-Bar: +++++++++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=yuripv.me header.s=fm1 header.b=IcuaUPpd; dkim=pass header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm2 header.b=LlT+TeRw; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of yuripv@yuripv.me designates 64.147.123.26 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=yuripv@yuripv.me X-Spamd-Result: default: False [13.39 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; 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GREYLIST(0.00)[pass,meta]; IP_SCORE(-2.11)[ip: (-2.92), ipnet: 64.147.123.0/24(-4.92), asn: 11403(-2.68), country: US(-0.05)] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 00:04:39 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------48B82A192E22BF770C9228B6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Noah Palmer wrote: > On Sun, Feb 16, 2020 at 4:00 AM Yuri Pankov wrote: > >> Noah Palmer wrote: >>> On Sat, Feb 15, 2020 at 11:08 PM Yuri Pankov wrote: >>> >>>> Noah Palmer wrote: >>>>> is there a way to automatically remove or add the display to X when the >>>>> laptop lid is opened or closed. I have been using a script to read >>>>> dev.acpi_lid.0.state, but is there better way? >>>> >>>> If you are polling the dev.acpi_lid.0.state value, see /etc/devd.conf >>>> for examples of ACPI events notification, so you could invoke the need >>>> actions when lid is open/closed. >>>> >>> Okay that seems to be the solution. I also have an issue that >>> dev.acpi_lid.0.state is incorrect if the lid was open at boot. you have >> to >>> close and open the lid for the value to be correct. >> >> Interesting, I'm seeing the same on my lenovo laptop, something to look >> into. BTW, there's somewhat related PR filed: >> https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=240881. >> > Okay, I can use devd to run commands when the lid is opened and closed, but > they don't trigger if the laptop starts open or closed, there has to be a > change in state when the laptop is running. Just tried that with a simple /etc/devd/lid.conf file: notify 10 { match "system" "ACPI"; match "subsystem" "Lid"; action "logger Lid $notify"; }; I seem to be getting the event right after the first state change, booting both open and closed. For the initial lid state, please try the attached patch (if possible). --------------48B82A192E22BF770C9228B6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; name="acpi_lid.diff" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="acpi_lid.diff" Y29tbWl0IDQ5ZTU3MTMyZGM4YjhkMmU1MTJjN2ZhNWVkNDI3ZTgzNDY4NzhkMmUKQXV0aG9y OiBZdXJpIFBhbmtvdiA8eXVyaXB2QEZyZWVCU0Qub3JnPgpEYXRlOiAgIE1vbiBGZWIgMTcg MDI6NDk6MjggMjAyMCArMDMwMAoKICAgIGFjcGlfbGlkOiBwcm92aWRlIGluaXRpYWwgTElE IHN0YXRlCgpkaWZmIC0tZ2l0IGEvc3lzL2Rldi9hY3BpY2EvYWNwaV9saWQuYyBiL3N5cy9k ZXYvYWNwaWNhL2FjcGlfbGlkLmMKaW5kZXggODBiYzM0NGQ2MDZkLi40MGZmMjU2Njg4OWIg MTAwNjQ0Ci0tLSBhL3N5cy9kZXYvYWNwaWNhL2FjcGlfbGlkLmMKKysrIGIvc3lzL2Rldi9h Y3BpY2EvYWNwaV9saWQuYwpAQCAtMTI0LDYgKzEyNCw5IEBAIGFjcGlfbGlkX2F0dGFjaChk ZXZpY2VfdCBkZXYpCiAgICAgaWYgKGFjcGlfcGFyc2VfcHJ3KHNjLT5saWRfaGFuZGxlLCAm cHJ3KSA9PSAwKQogCUFjcGlFbmFibGVHcGUocHJ3LmdwZV9oYW5kbGUsIHBydy5ncGVfYml0 KTsKIAorICAgIC8qIEdldCB0aGUgaW5pdGlhbCBsaWQgc3RhdHVzLCBpZ25vcmUgZmFpbHVy ZXMgKi8KKyAgICAodm9pZCkgYWNwaV9HZXRJbnRlZ2VyKHNjLT5saWRfaGFuZGxlLCAiX0xJ RCIsICZzYy0+bGlkX3N0YXR1cyk7CisKICAgICAvKgogICAgICAqIEV4cG9ydCB0aGUgbGlk IHN0YXR1cwogICAgICAqLwo= --------------48B82A192E22BF770C9228B6-- From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 02:52:30 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB25524A807 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 02:52:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48LT6k2RzFz42Kc for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 02:52:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from [192.168.43.231] (unknown [172.58.139.142]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 437814E65B; Sun, 16 Feb 2020 20:46:41 -0600 (CST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.5\)) Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux From: Valeri Galtsev In-Reply-To: <20200216213229.syxeeerzcrvekj3t@sea-ll-10936> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 20:46:39 -0600 Cc: "@lbutlr" , FreeBSD Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <20200214141600.GA82559@admin.sibptus.ru> <1eb61cba-5e28-e8ea-c418-a06f0f94ec86@kicp.uchicago.edu> <1F2DC40A-8C43-43DF-9168-661FDEC32989@kreme.com> <20200216213229.syxeeerzcrvekj3t@sea-ll-10936> To: Ihor Antonov X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LT6k2RzFz42Kc X-Spamd-Bar: +++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=uchicago.edu (policy=none); spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu has no SPF policy when checking 128.135.20.70) smtp.mailfrom=galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [7.72 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[uchicago.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[142.139.58.172.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_XBL(5.00)[142.139.58.172.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.4]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(0.12)[ip: (0.36), ipnet: 128.135.0.0/16(0.18), asn: 160(0.14), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(1.00)[0.999,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[1.000,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[70.20.135.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:160, ipnet:128.135.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; GREYLIST(0.00)[pass,body]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 02:52:30 -0000 > On Feb 16, 2020, at 3:32 PM, Ihor Antonov = wrote: >=20 Thanks a lot, Ihor, for nice write-up! Gives those of us who are = ignorant about Linux Docker as I am general view of things, and = incentive to do our own reading. Valeri > On 2020-02-14 13:23, @lbutlr wrote: >> On 14 Feb 2020, at 09:00, Valeri Galtsev = wrote: >>> In my book docker is really a disadvantage, not advantage, compared = to FreeBSD jails >>=20 >> Dicker has the advantage of convenience and ease of = installing/removing dockers, but you trade that for not only poor = security, but another application layer between you and the service = which itself has had numerous security issues. >=20 >=20 > I've been reading this tread for a while, and now I can't help but to > add my 2 cents: >=20 > I am long-time Linux sysadmin/devops and I work with "docker" on a = daily > basis. Reading this thread I got an impression that a lot of folks on > BSD side have vague/wrong/incomplete understanding of Linux containers > so I want to introduce more structure into this topic. >=20 > First off, "docker" is really a misnomer. Nowadays linux world has a > whole bunch of container tools: moby (former docker), podman, kata > containers, cri-o etc. Not all of them are equal, some of them are = complete > user ecosystems, and some are just "bare" runtimes. There was a tool > named "docker" once with that name and the name really stuck, so = people > call things "docker" left and right.=20 >=20 > Second, there is no such thing as "linux containers" per se. There are = 2 > kernel mechanisms: namespaces(allow isolating a process from a the = rest > of the system, like network namespace, user namespace, pid namespace > etc) and cgroups(allow limit resource usage, like cpu, ram, = bandwitdh). > Combing various combinations of namespaces and cgroups you get > "containers". On a low level tools like docker et al do is manipulate=20= > namespaces and cgroups. >=20 > The design of namespaces is really the opposite to jails. With > jails you start with a completely isolated environment and then you = can > add different capabilites if necessary. With namespaces you start with > non-isolated process (process that shares namespaces with rest of the > system) and you unshare namespaces one by one. (I can't compare = resource > limiiting part as I am not familiar with how it is done on FreeBSD) >=20 > It does not mean that namespaces are less secure than jails, it is a = different > design, more involved, probably harder to get righ, but also more > flexible.=20 >=20 > Before docker it was very hard to use namespaces and cgroups for a > regular linux user. There was no one "jail" command. There were only > some system calls and scattered docs.(Well there was LXC, but not the > point) > What docker did(and was first to do it) is > provided a very convenient and pretty complete ecosystem to manage > namespaces and cgroups, including features like: > - scripting container creation (aka Dockerfile) and sharing it as code > - sharing compiled images=20 > - Dockerhub is a centralized location for sharing images( it is just > glorified fileserver that hosts a lot of tar.gz + some indexing ) > - sharing/re-using iamges ( FROM clasue in Dockerfile ) > - nice CLI tool to manage containers and images >=20 > And it hid deeply notion of namespaces and cgroups, so regular joes = were > able to use it without learning what kernel mechanisms make it = possible. > Writing a dockerfile is not very different from writing a shell script > really. It helped widespread adoption of the tool, but with this also > created a lot of misconceptions too. >=20 > One can argue that "docker" is too bloated and is not really secure. >=20 > Yes, it is partially true:=20 > - it makes some choices about how namespaces and cgroups are used, = maybe > not the way YOU want.=20 > - It is also a pretty big codebase in golang, that YOU did not audit = and > which is not really necessary if you want to manage things manually > and customize to you needs.=20 > - Yes, re-using images from the internet also introduces lots of = risks.=20 > - And yes, big army of regular joes who don't know how the tool works > allows misuse, miscofiguration etc. >=20 > But if you understand how it kerlnel works and when you understand = your > requirements it is becomes pretty easy to find a proper solutoin.=20 >=20 >=20 > Now coming to jails. jail is pretty low level tool. It should not be > compared to "docker". It can be compared to namespaces though. >=20 > I think it would be more productive to compare capabilities of = ecosystems.=20 > - Can you securely sandbox the process with jails or namespaces? > - Can you easily script sanbox creation? > - Can you share/re-use recepies or built images? > - What tools provides more control and what provides more productivity > insread? > - etc... >=20 > Where FreeBSD can improve IMHO is building ecosystem tools around = jails. IOCage and > Bastile are good projects, doing the right thing. But there are still > little to none ways to re-use/share images and build recepies > (AFAIK BasitleBSD is working in that direction). Some might argue that=20= > BSD community does not need those - could be. >=20 >> I use docker for things that are not very important on machines that >> are (relatively) unimportant. I would never use it on something like = a >> mail server or web server that has other people=E2=80=99s data on it. >=20 > Yes, use bubblewrap instead - really inspired by jails, minimal, > oriented for maximum security. = https://github.com/containers/bubblewrap=20 >=20 >=20 > ------------ > Ihor Antonov > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 07:26:51 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 993A62502E9 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 07:26:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 20.100@defert.com) Received: from 5.mo4.mail-out.ovh.net (5.mo4.mail-out.ovh.net [188.165.44.50]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LbCG4vlFz44FT for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 07:26:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 20.100@defert.com) Received: from player760.ha.ovh.net (unknown [10.110.115.173]) by mo4.mail-out.ovh.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2588A223F36 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 08:17:47 +0100 (CET) Received: from defert.com (ip-195-46-244-219.static.dia.pt.lu [195.46.244.219]) (Authenticated sender: 20.100@defert.com) by player760.ha.ovh.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id CBB7AF701B42 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 07:17:46 +0000 (UTC) Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: From: Vincent DEFERT <20.100@defert.com> Message-ID: Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 08:17:45 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; 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FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_GOOD(0.00)[28.4.111.66.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.18]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:66.111.4.28]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[timpreston.net]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[timpreston.net:+,messagingengine.com:+]; IP_SCORE(-3.49)[ip: (-9.85), ipnet: 66.111.4.0/24(-4.89), asn: 11403(-2.68), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[28.4.111.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:66.111.4.0/24, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_WWW(0.50)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 08:47:35 -0000 Thank you Ihor, this is a great summary. On thing I'd like to mention regarding Docker is the inherent abstraction leakage around pre-built images as they tend to be tied to the host they were built on. For example, I've seen quite a few images in Docker Hub with a hardcoded UID which causes file permissions issue when mounting a volume from the host. Or often authors just assume you'll run the container as root. Another is a mismatch of kernel versions or capabilities between image build host and your host, for example, Redis usually needs Transparent Huge Pages to be turned off in the kernel. It's for these reasons (and the previously mentioned security risks) I'd hope that an 'image' model isn't implemented for FreeBSD jails. Recipes to build jails are a much better idea, as per iocage and Bastille. On Sun, 16 Feb 2020 13:32:29 -0800, Ihor Antonov wrote: > > > I've been reading this tread for a while, and now I can't help but to > add my 2 cents: > > I am long-time Linux sysadmin/devops and I work with "docker" on a daily > basis. Reading this thread I got an impression that a lot of folks on > BSD side have vague/wrong/incomplete understanding of Linux containers > so I want to introduce more structure into this topic. > > First off, "docker" is really a misnomer. Nowadays linux world has a > whole bunch of container tools: moby (former docker), podman, kata > containers, cri-o etc. Not all of them are equal, some of them are complete > user ecosystems, and some are just "bare" runtimes. There was a tool > named "docker" once with that name and the name really stuck, so people > call things "docker" left and right. > > Second, there is no such thing as "linux containers" per se. There are 2 > kernel mechanisms: namespaces(allow isolating a process from a the rest > of the system, like network namespace, user namespace, pid namespace > etc) and cgroups(allow limit resource usage, like cpu, ram, bandwitdh). > Combing various combinations of namespaces and cgroups you get > "containers". On a low level tools like docker et al do is manipulate > namespaces and cgroups. > > The design of namespaces is really the opposite to jails. With > jails you start with a completely isolated environment and then you can > add different capabilites if necessary. With namespaces you start with > non-isolated process (process that shares namespaces with rest of the > system) and you unshare namespaces one by one. (I can't compare resource > limiiting part as I am not familiar with how it is done on FreeBSD) > > It does not mean that namespaces are less secure than jails, it is a different > design, more involved, probably harder to get righ, but also more > flexible. > > Before docker it was very hard to use namespaces and cgroups for a > regular linux user. There was no one "jail" command. There were only > some system calls and scattered docs.(Well there was LXC, but not the > point) > What docker did(and was first to do it) is > provided a very convenient and pretty complete ecosystem to manage > namespaces and cgroups, including features like: > - scripting container creation (aka Dockerfile) and sharing it as code > - sharing compiled images > - Dockerhub is a centralized location for sharing images( it is just > glorified fileserver that hosts a lot of tar.gz + some indexing ) > - sharing/re-using iamges ( FROM clasue in Dockerfile ) > - nice CLI tool to manage containers and images > > And it hid deeply notion of namespaces and cgroups, so regular joes were > able to use it without learning what kernel mechanisms make it possible. > Writing a dockerfile is not very different from writing a shell script > really. It helped widespread adoption of the tool, but with this also > created a lot of misconceptions too. > > One can argue that "docker" is too bloated and is not really secure. > > Yes, it is partially true: > - it makes some choices about how namespaces and cgroups are used, maybe > not the way YOU want. > - It is also a pretty big codebase in golang, that YOU did not audit and > which is not really necessary if you want to manage things manually > and customize to you needs. > - Yes, re-using images from the internet also introduces lots of risks. > - And yes, big army of regular joes who don't know how the tool works > allows misuse, miscofiguration etc. > > But if you understand how it kerlnel works and when you understand your > requirements it is becomes pretty easy to find a proper solutoin. > > > Now coming to jails. jail is pretty low level tool. It should not be > compared to "docker". It can be compared to namespaces though. > > I think it would be more productive to compare capabilities of ecosystems. > - Can you securely sandbox the process with jails or namespaces? > - Can you easily script sanbox creation? > - Can you share/re-use recepies or built images? > - What tools provides more control and what provides more productivity > insread? > - etc... > > Where FreeBSD can improve IMHO is building ecosystem tools around > jails. IOCage and > Bastile are good projects, doing the right thing. But there are still > little to none ways to re-use/share images and build recepies > (AFAIK BasitleBSD is working in that direction). Some might argue that > BSD community does not need those - could be. > > > I use docker for things that are not very important on machines that > > are (relatively) unimportant. I would never use it on something like a > > mail server or web server that has other people?s data on it. > > Yes, use bubblewrap instead - really inspired by jails, minimal, > oriented for maximum security. https://github.com/containers/bubblewrap > > > ------------ > Ihor Antonov From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 12:47:36 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D0242382F2 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 12:47:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) Received: from mail.covisp.net (mail.covisp.net [65.121.55.42]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LkKL5n1jz3MLV for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 12:47:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) From: "@lbutlr" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Cannot boot isntaller Message-Id: <41B5B7D9-D132-404B-A1E0-64D2039CA1FD@kreme.com> Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 05:47:31 -0700 To: FreeBSD X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LkKL5n1jz3MLV X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kremels@kreme.com designates 65.121.55.42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kremels@kreme.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.27 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.81)[-0.813,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; MISSING_MIME_VERSION(2.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kreme.com]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.992,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.07)[ip: (-0.24), ipnet: 65.112.0.0/12(-0.00), asn: 209(-0.04), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_ZERO(0.00)[0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[42.55.121.65.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:209, ipnet:65.112.0.0/12, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 12:47:36 -0000 I tried booting the 12.1 amd64 installer on a HP Compaq 8300 SSF (small = Form Factor) computer. I could get as far as the boot selector, but = after booting it reboots before getting to the login prompt. I can boot the i386 installer fine, but I want to go to 64-bit. There is no UEFI setting I can find in the EFI settings. Any chance anyone has experience with this model computer? The CPU is a core i5-3470. Definitely 64-bit. In fact. sysinfo -a says: WARNING: Your CPU supports amd64 architecture, however you are running = i386. WARNING: You may want to switch to amd64 to get a better performance. --=20 The cat turned and tried to find a place of safety in the suit's breastplate. He was beginning to doubt he'd make it through the knight. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 14:36:51 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CC1423AC08 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 14:36:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: from mail-vs1-xe2c.google.com (mail-vs1-xe2c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e2c]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LmlP4NW1z4dT9 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 14:36:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: by mail-vs1-xe2c.google.com with SMTP id t12so10457857vso.13 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 06:36:49 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=WQ6UEGAiOZHXnQ+Vksp/9er3iaRuoC2Lx5cRD7QtIAg=; b=iPjdVwms5dxyOT/sNn5D6cHEFwcQB+VNLL6WFzJdNXZS3ajACvSJ/cniIFHPDEq+D9 4Bz4q86Qe+y3UrFGOtn+8eo7S6xOO4x3JoHlYBzFcgHgjCLI/f/VnFM9wX8V6BJB3tXu FyoC6E7RPbIzTuES9i2ZolTb4QJw8K3/8pVKwNL/71BhZ6K6+TaB5l6E5m9T4FUYponk f89xmqF4HySgNISnGUf4ZNTcdW1OQNM0OL6qwH849WwjrxKJB0ZIFbs4wQgks025A2lk Ppm+WY9DVCcQZ08WlTnTFVg6+eFjivJdLEWKOG1bKIszOzgmLQgIl4bqSu/TRKrAn7wY pSoA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=WQ6UEGAiOZHXnQ+Vksp/9er3iaRuoC2Lx5cRD7QtIAg=; b=VREn0zBkTGaOdpRYu1OCQOcGJ/3ZlD+AVWY5kCZx3BVAm5F2i1H2QzVWyGyWPY4057 luKud7aIWL8mB5CF6bR32AdGg4NhBy+DRFUcURTiXXXOG/5cwLsmMNV+YrMPenjDL7gE tSUnvxblEuiUMDQci6Ut2v1G8pIDKoIGYhYlAObUywL/kSNx3lYSA7tRHfKc0rZkJ3N0 lTdA+IxHyCyKuP7R46lOHms8myzIPR0EnwSKYr69uRaAn5CRbs9YJt/R7NRXP04IHR5Y Wi6oMtN8hQskIT735cHzv8hsxvZJBZvf72J7vMkoszKJhJ+e/r848rUsroS88BBq8kRG EeWw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXRzAhKM5jMqW1Pfmx4IC15XflDNl7Xayz9YEysgw+YQ7W1lDfX pu5TCyKka1QdAEzzoBQB5tXDQ4K2KEHyRtj1t48VWHu1 X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyx/GF+471LTLZQoDw0AmH6EH2j2KLgIEEXhJusPvBHgzWhad6ClvYOQTVGzVqdlUebaJ4yc7j8W0C/tUlpNAI= X-Received: by 2002:a67:fd0d:: with SMTP id f13mr7883203vsr.125.1581950207807; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 06:36:47 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Andreas X Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:36:36 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LmlP4NW1z4dT9 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=iPjdVwms; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of hamdi20193d@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::e2c as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=hamdi20193d@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.90 / 15.00]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; MIME_BASE64_TEXT(0.10)[]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.67), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[c.2.e.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; HTTP_TO_IP(1.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 14:36:51 -0000 My /etc/rc.firewall file contains the following additional lines created by me, for purpose of banning attacker's DDoSers IP: ${fwcmd} add deny ip from 122.228.19.80/24,\ 185.234.219.65/24,\ 92.118.38.57/24,\ 185.36.81.143/24,\ 141.98.10.137/24,\ 45.125.66.144/24,\ 185.100.87.190/24,\ 45.142.195.6/24,\ 45.143.223.52/24,\ 103.7.10.131/24,\ 52.178.192.68/24,\ 80.82.77.33/24,\ 164.68.112.178/24,\ 81.95.5.34/24 to any The list dramatically grows each week. How may I create a text file so that IPFW would fetch these IPs from there directly? What's the simplest way to do this please? P.S: I found no reason to *hide*/mask those IPs above, because they're truly and randomly filling log files, not regular users at all! It'd be useful for anyone else to know about them to block them too :) Thank you all, so much! From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 14:51:13 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32E3D23B211 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 14:51:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tundra@tundraware.com) Received: from oceanview.tundraware.com (oceanview.tundraware.com [45.55.60.57]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mailman.tundraware.com", Issuer "mailman.tundraware.com" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Ln3z3tYvz3xD0 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 14:51:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tundra@tundraware.com) Received: from chimpchange.tundraware.com (75-146-98-62-Illinnois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net [75.146.98.62]) (authenticated bits=0) by oceanview.tundraware.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id 01HEnkf0086831 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 08:49:47 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from tundra@tundraware.com) Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? To: FreeBSD Mailing List References: From: Tim Daneliuk Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Message-ID: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 08:49:41 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.6.2 (oceanview.tundraware.com [45.55.60.57]); Mon, 17 Feb 2020 08:49:47 -0600 (CST) X-TundraWare-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information X-TundraWare-MailScanner-ID: 01HEnkf0086831 X-TundraWare-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-TundraWare-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam (whitelisted), SpamAssassin (not cached, timed out) X-TundraWare-MailScanner-From: tundra@tundraware.com X-Spam-Status: No X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Ln3z3tYvz3xD0 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tundra@tundraware.com designates 45.55.60.57 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=tundra@tundraware.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.71 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+a]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.34)[0.335,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.96)[-0.957,0]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[tundraware.com]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.63)[ip: (-2.08), ipnet: 45.55.32.0/19(3.84), asn: 14061(1.47), country: US(-0.05)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14061, ipnet:45.55.32.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 14:51:13 -0000 On 2/17/20 8:36 AM, Andreas X wrote: > The list dramatically grows each week. How may I create a text file so that > IPFW would fetch these IPs from there directly? What's the simplest way to > do this please? Looping through a file and running an ipfw command each time gets super slow as the list gets long. ipfw tables are the better way to do this: FWCMD="ipfw -q" # Firewall command OIF=em0 # NIC to outside world # Address spaces we want blocked entirely are listed in this file NAUGHTYFILE=/usr/local/etc/firewall/naughtyIPs # Use ipfw tables for efficiency ipfw table 10 flush for addr in `cat ${NAUGHTYFILE}` do ${FWCMD} table 10 add ${addr} done ${FWCMD} add deny all from table\(10\) to any via ${OIF} The "naughty" file can have specific IPs or CIDR blocks in it, one per line: 95.87.0.0/18 95.87.192.0/18 96.246.220.34 96.30.64.0/18 98.143.148.107 HTH, ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tim Daneliuk tundra@tundraware.com PGP Key: http://www.tundraware.com/PGP/ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 15:09:17 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D08823B8ED for ; 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dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=UmwKA8qK; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of shamimshahriar@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::731 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=shamimshahriar@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.16), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[1.3.7.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:09:17 -0000 Good afternoon all I had been googling for quite some time and so far came up empty, maybe someone can shed some light or point me to the correct direction. I have introduced a bunch of servers into an infrastructure that previously had zero FreeBSD system. They make use of Tenable Security Centre ( tenable.com) which I believe used Nessus in the backend to identify vulnerabilities. Amongst other things, it is picking up on (tenable/nessus plugin ID 90317) "SSH Weak Algorithms Supported) because the server allows "none" algorithms. Is there any way to "select" or "selectively disable" algorithms and hashes from sshd? According to various web sources, certain implementation on certain distributions might have options to amend the list, but none of the examples I have found worked on my FreeBSD system. Would appreciate if someone could please point me to the correct direction. Kind regards SK From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 15:27:46 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48D0C23C1C8 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:27:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ua1-x92e.google.com (mail-ua1-x92e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::92e]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Lnt917g0z4Xf4 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:27:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ua1-x92e.google.com with SMTP id a33so6261192uad.11 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 07:27:45 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=lqMTb5PP0Yfo5WdyCoZxfxZuLyKPzcUOPtEioSpR2DU=; b=iBZ2myJqnfhzn5BqjtszSqHcnocet/O9Ho2x6w3ye67s2kmFD6VFBMuo5m7QfwI83I 6CECBgl0Xh6Zm/B6P4xUDLXRKCLFlPzHhuMq+Eb90MZo/9IhGnuGkK2xuu3LsSTq6UCL 7xUleULS0p4aFNaOCFcFWw5MwARl9tGM2yebQv4kbA08tR3ILOP9yFg/bnbZ7q+q0zMC oReT64h8hnv6yKtx8o1buBVhiF9v+PhJc/scxcICUI4fVk6ls7uwCNn6VZVoctkhQh40 HLfRvAV7jm3Oia0WInrpBW1m/A6Xw8vetFXvIUzML8gsExxzHwWqjyn0dVnjJAVGpxDr QjFg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=lqMTb5PP0Yfo5WdyCoZxfxZuLyKPzcUOPtEioSpR2DU=; b=SKlNeIZXduTMN4xX4YqGVCpN6cq11oaHYxrx7yB5irRDLQEP3YUEPBeizs6S38XBrq jrKfvQZ1hvc3UwyWOr3jc49f/KwdQTTYDxiiPC5eQSb5us5qXMnnd/E6u2Gwr5VNXMY9 hzOlIbu29BqGI+vt1iMPncd0rRaWq2Y3JakXnJxQ7A3WDJmBuJSfJndI+C9HzyBjyVW2 cYBXlr/fEXvTYJTvJK++pPU5y1N4WnMwF+vTFO7Fs6NTfSwF8jkqPDC0/N5uVtaJ/qYD 7K6CxRLOxam1SYrlTMUUDKs6+qHWDxM5dbD0lL9+Cg+XXYKf7TZg6t252CmcNj2fTIuM aY1g== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAU3X2nJ5AuDJCH9X783/N6o8d7rEEUusNNOmSshY+YWDeTSVKeS 0AuQdOHu7f6j3XnqwoxmmSrnSTI881v34TlZPeKh6Q== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyUZop8EzC4n0ulj69PbPtd4TBXXU30dsip/Ec9Szg6C5K4zFR8sWUzkqkzcTkH1dpeSjxoMNZomrQq07DPzrY= X-Received: by 2002:a9f:2635:: with SMTP id 50mr8271320uag.2.1581953264010; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 07:27:44 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> In-Reply-To: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> From: Andreas X Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 18:27:32 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? To: Tim Daneliuk Cc: FreeBSD Mailing List X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Lnt917g0z4Xf4 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=iBZ2myJq; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of hamdi20193d@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::92e as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=hamdi20193d@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.00 / 15.00]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; URI_COUNT_ODD(1.00)[9]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.26), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[e.2.9.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; HTTP_TO_IP(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:27:46 -0000 Great answer! Thank you so much, Tim! That's what I wanted to do. Last question: Would /etc/rc.local be the best choice to run these (at startup)? Or you'd perhaps have an another startup file, as suggestion.. Thank you once again, Tim Daneliuk , 17 =C5=9Eub 2020 Pzt, 17:51 tarihinde= =C5=9Funu yazd=C4=B1: > On 2/17/20 8:36 AM, Andreas X wrote: > > > > The list dramatically grows each week. How may I create a text file so > that > > IPFW would fetch these IPs from there directly? What's the simplest way > to > > do this please? > > > Looping through a file and running an ipfw command each time gets super > slow as > the list gets long. ipfw tables are the better way to do this: > > FWCMD=3D"ipfw -q" # Firewall command > OIF=3Dem0 # NIC to outside world > > # Address spaces we want blocked entirely are listed in this file > NAUGHTYFILE=3D/usr/local/etc/firewall/naughtyIPs > > # Use ipfw tables for efficiency > > ipfw table 10 flush > for addr in `cat ${NAUGHTYFILE}` > do > ${FWCMD} table 10 add ${addr} > done > > ${FWCMD} add deny all from table\(10\) to any via ${OIF} > > The "naughty" file can have specific IPs or CIDR blocks in it, one > per line: > > 95.87.0.0/18 > 95.87.192.0/18 > 96.246.220.34 > 96.30.64.0/18 > 98.143.148.107 > > > > > HTH, > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- > Tim Daneliuk tundra@tundraware.com > PGP Key: http://www.tundraware.com/PGP/ > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to " > freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 15:46:53 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F72623C835 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:46:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from earlaramirez@gmail.com) Received: from mail-lj1-x22e.google.com (mail-lj1-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::22e]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LpJD3CBRz3P8F for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:46:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from earlaramirez@gmail.com) Received: by mail-lj1-x22e.google.com with SMTP id r19so19389337ljg.3 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 07:46:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=ubE2HRv2FbHRnDcFZV035j8ZdBQn3nzPvP6n63ao/gw=; b=okreeUsIXs5H6zhE5dprs21yUBkbso4WuVmhOaXj8rwPkQCpkH2/HYXMfC9SloYmFq /Uq9rzt3mSxEOlpTe1RFi7h8JQhxSmWesh/42zqCWw7IQ4MICJd8VV4UL/Xted7mDL5s ydoF/K1WgJljlQSpNajQggFofONiSzsQ7hsTMhxQ4tnPBPKv5euuq5J9Q1IohV2NJV39 UDxBWsm4/AT7IiVtlhGM0lxdt8slrcCgvfdAXidcLpTgkPbpIBQNqmleLQ0PKQAJ6EiY ml+1fUYvDtxXdV5b2MDh1+V8Zd3qBxVU0bxEtvAbE6RNqMXIQXcxMeEFquxVp3V6gMPN 8T5A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ubE2HRv2FbHRnDcFZV035j8ZdBQn3nzPvP6n63ao/gw=; b=eqNu+ibUrjBBAj84/mIFt1iAPhTWNZMe+ovrW3h72DCNOQDxbG3nXzyfT0tUVMc53a U4janxW84cezeYYXDZhYmTOd+y3ytEswAFzyXWClbvZkOguQOOYFRVwXunagpOThRytX 8V42co4QYjmY1r07tLXcFQiu1q/3N58V02f1fuw/KbBahZfQxEceYsAwBbPnz1BwhC7X RYlpb7Ia0QdwxLryp4NqnjuBreyyCNt7Wcx1dRWerXyTREaY4VoWV/m4FgYidRbwXoyP 21e1KlJcQcPD3TEUg6KPZ1aePWzlCliKjuTXeOV25x1APstltGjLOf/q9G03gWa1LhoK 8XPg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUsQTKTN+7GEQ8m0Hk0nmVFpt2O2DStmaoK7PiDK2x3NCaChv30 H8TngYs4POYv/ooQvd2854WZ1Poj+C/G5SxK7Fk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqylevYudFSu12wKv8b/VegiNKNRl2tPk5yVmwvEVWB6JSbEPxEAjpf+sH5KHQLX4N5pLuTD7zUv4I4NlrhRfwc= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:8952:: with SMTP id b18mr9986925ljk.280.1581954409463; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 07:46:49 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Earl A Ramirez Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:46:38 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: disabling "weak" algorithms in sshd To: Shamim Shahriar Cc: "freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LpJD3CBRz3P8F X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=okreeUsI; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of earlaramirez@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::22e as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=earlaramirez@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.29), ipnet: 2a00:1450::/32(-2.42), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; TAGGED_RCPT(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[e.2.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.5.4.1.0.0.a.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:46:53 -0000 On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 at 15:09, Shamim Shahriar wrote: > Good afternoon all > > I had been googling for quite some time and so far came up empty, maybe > someone can shed some light or point me to the correct direction. > > I have introduced a bunch of servers into an infrastructure that previously > had zero FreeBSD system. They make use of Tenable Security Centre ( > tenable.com) which I believe used Nessus in the backend to identify > vulnerabilities. Amongst other things, it is picking up on (tenable/nessus > plugin ID 90317) "SSH Weak Algorithms Supported) because the server allows > "none" algorithms. > > Is there any way to "select" or "selectively disable" algorithms and hashes > from sshd? According to various web sources, certain implementation on > certain distributions might have options to amend the list, but none of the > examples I have found worked on my FreeBSD system. > > Would appreciate if someone could please point me to the correct direction. > > I have been using the following lines to get mitigate Nessus findings in the sshd_config # Permit supported Ciphers, MAC and Algorithms Ciphers chacha20-poly1305@openssh.com,aes256-gcm@openssh.com, aes128-gcm@openssh.com,aes256-ctr,aes192-ctr,aes128-ctr MACs hmac-sha2-256-etm@openssh.com,hmac-sha2-512-etm@openssh.com, umac-128-etm@openssh.com KexAlgorithms curve25519-sha256@libssh.org,diffie-hellman-group18-sha512,diffie-hellman-group16-sha512,diffie-hellman-group14-sha256 -- Kind Regards Earl Ramirez From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 15:47:11 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 993E123C86C; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:47:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ozgur@kazancci.com) Received: from relay9-d.mail.gandi.net (relay9-d.mail.gandi.net [217.70.183.199]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LpJZ0hkbz3PV5; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:47:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ozgur@kazancci.com) Received: from webmail.gandi.net (webmail14.sd4.0x35.net [10.200.201.14]) (Authenticated sender: ozgur@kazancci.com) by relay9-d.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id DAFFFFF80E; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:47:06 +0000 (UTC) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 18:47:06 +0300 From: =?UTF-8?Q?=C3=96zg=C3=BCr_Kazancci?= To: Shamim Shahriar Cc: "freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org" , owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: disabling "weak" algorithms in sshd In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9c582a48795d9d91f62878ee1070e7e7@kazancci.com> X-Sender: ozgur@kazancci.com User-Agent: Roundcube Webmail/1.3.8 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LpJZ0hkbz3PV5 X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ozgur@kazancci.com designates 217.70.183.199 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ozgur@kazancci.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.82 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:217.70.183.192/28]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; TAGGED_RCPT(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kazancci.com]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[199.183.70.217.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:29169, ipnet:217.70.176.0/20, country:FR]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-1.42)[ip: (-4.24), ipnet: 217.70.176.0/20(-1.57), asn: 29169(-1.28), country: FR(0.00)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:47:11 -0000 Hello. I usually use: https://www.sshaudit.com - great tool&recommendations! First, check your sshd IP/port via sshaudit.com, note your "score", afterwards apply the suggestions listed, and re-check your server again: https://www.sshaudit.com/hardening_guides.html Best, Özgür On 17/02/2020 18:09, Shamim Shahriar wrote: > Good afternoon all > > I had been googling for quite some time and so far came up empty, maybe > someone can shed some light or point me to the correct direction. > > I have introduced a bunch of servers into an infrastructure that > previously > had zero FreeBSD system. They make use of Tenable Security Centre ( > tenable.com) which I believe used Nessus in the backend to identify > vulnerabilities. Amongst other things, it is picking up on > (tenable/nessus > plugin ID 90317) "SSH Weak Algorithms Supported) because the server > allows > "none" algorithms. > > Is there any way to "select" or "selectively disable" algorithms and > hashes > from sshd? According to various web sources, certain implementation on > certain distributions might have options to amend the list, but none of > the > examples I have found worked on my FreeBSD system. > > Would appreciate if someone could please point me to the correct > direction. > > Kind regards > SK > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to > "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 15:49:48 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB6E523CA67 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:49:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) Received: from s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com (s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com [142.0.176.198]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LpMb0z5qz3x40 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:49:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=email-od.com;i=@email-od.com;s=dkim; c=relaxed/relaxed; q=dns/txt; t=1581954587; x=1584546587; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:message-id:subject:to:from:date:x-thread-info; bh=wwHMNCoTLNJhfP9o94wVuCmrjbLIZ6OieX41tZGWW04=; b=MX49dX0xMtWM5uq4xjdrBP4beu+TFIpyWh1hg2T2I9lsN4u+dh5PqIangqTEG9keYCgsE1vy1/0PkpFpcWQtxEorOTF/0XUWDFLxtVAOa2hWMh8TSSYhl9aie8j08hA+NY1f1O2hNDRpC81DVffIdrHQWAc14p5Vj115GBHj0/k= X-Thread-Info: NDI1MC4xMi43NDAwMDAwMDc2MWU4ZC5mcmVlYnNkLXF1ZXN0aW9ucz1mcmVlYnNkLm9yZw== Received: from r3.sg.in.socketlabs.com (r3.sg.in.socketlabs.com [142.0.179.13]) by mxsg2.email-od.com with ESMTP; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 10:49:44 -0500 Received: from smtp.lan.sohara.org (EMTPY [185.202.17.215]) by r3.sg.in.socketlabs.com with ESMTP(version=Tls12 cipher=Aes256 bits=256); Mon, 17 Feb 2020 10:49:43 -0500 Received: from [192.168.63.1] (helo=steve.lan.sohara.org) by smtp.lan.sohara.org with smtp (Exim 4.92.3 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1j3ieT-0000ry-7w for freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:49:41 +0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:49:41 +0000 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: disabling "weak" algorithms in sshd Message-Id: <20200217154941.59beeadf22c5100ad2e5c41c@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd12.0) X-Clacks-Overhead: "GNU Terry Pratchett" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LpMb0z5qz3x40 X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=email-od.com header.s=dkim header.b=MX49dX0x; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com designates 142.0.176.198 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.89 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.98)[-0.980,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[email-od.com:s=dkim]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:142.0.176.0/20]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[sohara.org]; FORGED_SENDER_VERP_SRS(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; IP_SCORE(0.09)[ip: (-0.25), ipnet: 142.0.176.0/22(0.52), asn: 7381(0.26), country: US(-0.05)]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[email-od.com:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[198.176.0.142.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.15.0]; ENVFROM_VERP(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7381, ipnet:142.0.176.0/22, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:49:48 -0000 On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:09:04 +0000 Shamim Shahriar wrote: > Is there any way to "select" or "selectively disable" algorithms and > hashes from sshd? According to various web sources, certain > implementation on certain distributions might have options to amend the > list, but none of the examples I have found worked on my FreeBSD system. Try. man sshd_config It should tell you everything you can do by way of configuring the ssh server. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 15:51:37 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A80823CBAD for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:51:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vikashb@where-ever.za.net) Received: from mail.where-ever.net (mail.where-ever.net [196.26.208.224]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mail.where-ever.net", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LpPg4Dvzz3yk4 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:51:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vikashb@where-ever.za.net) Received: from l5580.where-ever.za.net (196-209-218-116.dynamic.isadsl.co.za [196.209.218.116]) by mail.where-ever.net (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 859798ed (TLSv1.3:TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256:NO) for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:51:11 +0200 (SAST) Subject: Re: disabling "weak" algorithms in sshd To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: From: Vikashb Badal Message-ID: <79ccdac5-a26b-7a21-5ecb-014d526265c6@where-ever.za.net> Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:48:39 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Language: en-US X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LpPg4Dvzz3yk4 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of vikashb@where-ever.za.net designates 196.26.208.224 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=vikashb@where-ever.za.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.97 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.31)[-0.313,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.98)[-0.980,0]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[where-ever.za.net]; IP_SCORE(0.62)[asn: 3741(3.09), country: ZA(0.00)]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[116.218.209.196.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:3741, ipnet:196.26.0.0/16, country:ZA]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:51:37 -0000 On 17/02/2020 17:09, Shamim Shahriar wrote: > Good afternoon all > > I had been googling for quite some time and so far came up empty, maybe i don't know if there is a best practice for these atm, i usually update /etc/ssh/shd_config and add/replace: Ciphers aes128-ctr,aes192-ctr,aes256-ctr,arcfour256,arcfour128 MACs hmac-sha1,umac-64@openssh.com,hmac-ripemd160 https://man.openbsd.org/sshd_config#Ciphers https://man.openbsd.org/sshd_config#MACs "ssh -Q cipher" and "ssh -Q mac" will provide you a list of ciphers currently allowed, > someone can shed some light or point me to the correct direction. > > I have introduced a bunch of servers into an infrastructure that previously > had zero FreeBSD system. They make use of Tenable Security Centre ( > tenable.com) which I believe used Nessus in the backend to identify > vulnerabilities. Amongst other things, it is picking up on (tenable/nessus > plugin ID 90317) "SSH Weak Algorithms Supported) because the server allows > "none" algorithms. > > Is there any way to "select" or "selectively disable" algorithms and hashes > from sshd? According to various web sources, certain implementation on > certain distributions might have options to amend the list, but none of the > examples I have found worked on my FreeBSD system. > > Would appreciate if someone could please point me to the correct direction. > > Kind regards > SK > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 15:55:09 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6A2D23CEC0 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:55:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ua1-x931.google.com (mail-ua1-x931.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::931]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LpTm0vvrz43C8 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:55:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ua1-x931.google.com with SMTP id o42so6292102uad.10 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 07:55:07 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=+Pwn0xfGhAlDZJyHpkELV9+n+55yh1kHj4iY/Iey/uE=; b=h/eYIhYLcYU9E0zV2UjHCsN0ydi9cLxJDNq6kO8gGBV+02zd4Fbuq8ljNqUJmc0rDP fK+0FuBIvvuaaYGerC/ShAWlNRda/EzmhHM44/6FatmJwGNsJ/UKyEcT/NsW6+V4noWf yetWlUdQv4w/l62Q+z7gkXkoWutTBZLTjSMDqcOqAmp6jkp76aP888P9PSx/8nNHcHZY dD5Hjurr32qQRR6D5SxqxVcb4gYizoaY3fw4ql6Qa3xJplAg/hErQLjllT8V+2g90sfW noyLR2avlN1KkkTZcrk6iOGLOCeYJQNwTuKQwWJD7FyDluxeexxaTxbiMJZzI5ThP3OW R85A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=+Pwn0xfGhAlDZJyHpkELV9+n+55yh1kHj4iY/Iey/uE=; b=X8pDmHz6Ups5HN6qxSee95RDRVisZGemjQwDK2iKH6pEhIyKVDlLODtaQlYM9tYqdz 2znqImoyVM20rHftv9qhxG1JLYZ1MsjsTUDJs+7VCLQHwyXkpNKKC8pzQ7r5LmhZZDAX 3R6QMjjPd3uGUUIhH9ohiK5ReqiuldmZsGHbS9qJUDKAHZv2fCKStgrdUeYZXSjFzgqc caOK58FeBjQRMMXAooJRsSqXZfz5yY5SVEvYqKz7vxQFRPCq22sIGvDp5ki3jdCxpi6V z8q5TldeKH9w21ElpcZ9sykrsSGHD0CC02ROT0pe0QSWln7OApelpiCGNwuA7YaMa9JF rPFw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVWciRzETD/CTFP7E8tbhvCjZsgK8vlS+dYGcdJSgZ/d5IUdJzl EeQhQn+tasSXuAPPPXTIcHew6yr8DB6RJn3CBlrbY9ZM X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzkVswiPkzoyV9vCPapN6QL68FUvOF97N1TFqpZeZZjMIT7pYmCVv3kdkDizUgRIUReH466RWSlllQRqx6dH3U= X-Received: by 2002:ab0:3415:: with SMTP id z21mr8346413uap.9.1581954906896; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 07:55:06 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> In-Reply-To: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> From: Andreas X Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 18:54:55 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? To: Tim Daneliuk , FreeBSD Mailing List X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LpTm0vvrz43C8 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=h/eYIhYL; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of hamdi20193d@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::931 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=hamdi20193d@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.00 / 15.00]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; URI_COUNT_ODD(1.00)[9]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-8.73), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[1.3.9.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; HTTP_TO_IP(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 15:55:09 -0000 Dear Tim, I applied your suggestion, however it seems IPFW doesn't ban the IP addresses in the list. (I've added a useless VPS IP of mine in the list, to test it, but I could still ping the server from that IP) Here's my script as per your suggestion: #!/bin/sh FWCMD=3D"ipfw -q" LISTX=3D/usr/local/etc/fw/banlist.txt ipfw table 10 create ipfw table 10 flush for addr in `cat ${LISTX}` do ${FWCMD} table 10 add ${addr} done ${FWCMD} add deny all from table\(10\) to any And ipfw show | grep "table" command outputs: "65500 0 0 deny ip from table(10) to any" so it seems the IPs are added. But none of them are blocked. I restarted IPFW too, and re-run the script again, no solution. Any idea? Thank you. Tim Daneliuk , 17 =C5=9Eub 2020 Pzt, 17:51 tarihinde= =C5=9Funu yazd=C4=B1: > On 2/17/20 8:36 AM, Andreas X wrote: > > > > The list dramatically grows each week. How may I create a text file so > that > > IPFW would fetch these IPs from there directly? What's the simplest way > to > > do this please? > > > Looping through a file and running an ipfw command each time gets super > slow as > the list gets long. ipfw tables are the better way to do this: > > FWCMD=3D"ipfw -q" # Firewall command > OIF=3Dem0 # NIC to outside world > > # Address spaces we want blocked entirely are listed in this file > NAUGHTYFILE=3D/usr/local/etc/firewall/naughtyIPs > > # Use ipfw tables for efficiency > > ipfw table 10 flush > for addr in `cat ${NAUGHTYFILE}` > do > ${FWCMD} table 10 add ${addr} > done > > ${FWCMD} add deny all from table\(10\) to any via ${OIF} > > The "naughty" file can have specific IPs or CIDR blocks in it, one > per line: > > 95.87.0.0/18 > 95.87.192.0/18 > 96.246.220.34 > 96.30.64.0/18 > 98.143.148.107 > > > > > HTH, > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- > Tim Daneliuk tundra@tundraware.com > PGP Key: http://www.tundraware.com/PGP/ > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to " > freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 16:01:21 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 527B323D264 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:01:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-questions-local@be-well.ilk.org) Received: from be-well.ilk.org (be-well.ilk.org [23.30.133.173]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48Lpcw2NRTz48FG for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:01:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-questions-local@be-well.ilk.org) Received: from lowell-desk.be-well.ilk.org (router.lan [172.30.250.2]) by be-well.ilk.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7B2733C0C; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 11:01:08 -0500 (EST) Received: by lowell-desk.be-well.ilk.org (Postfix, from userid 1147) id 51A4121FBA04; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 11:01:07 -0500 (EST) From: Lowell Gilbert To: Steve O'Hara-Smith Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, Polytropon Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215235822.f804ffc6.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215232931.5a9132b2e83daa2d0a06dac8@sohara.org> Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 11:01:06 -0500 In-Reply-To: <20200215232931.5a9132b2e83daa2d0a06dac8@sohara.org> (Steve O'Hara-Smith's message of "Sat, 15 Feb 2020 23:29:31 +0000") Message-ID: <44y2t1td8d.fsf@be-well.ilk.org> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/26.3 (berkeley-unix) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Lpcw2NRTz48FG X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd-questions-local@be-well.ilk.org has no SPF policy when checking 23.30.133.173) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd-questions-local@be-well.ilk.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.80 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[ilk.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.42)[0.415,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.25)[0.253,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7922, ipnet:23.30.0.0/15, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.13)[ip: (0.15), ipnet: 23.30.0.0/15(1.21), asn: 7922(-0.66), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:01:21 -0000 Steve O'Hara-Smith writes: > On Sat, 15 Feb 2020 23:58:22 +0100 > Polytropon wrote: > >> And all of them connect to the Internet, using a device that >> internally uses a BSD or a Linux, and the bowels of the Internet >> consist primarily of BSD and Linux. Add "Linux-like things" to >> the mix, like Android smartphones, or "BSD-like things" like >> Macs, and numbers might look a little different. > > The late Morten Reistad used to post (in alt.folklore.computers) > about the numbers of processors with memory management being made and > comparing that with Windows licenses, Apple and Android phone production > numbers. Windows, MacOs and commercial unix licenses only account for a > small fraction of the CPUs made - most of them have to be running something > else Linux (Android, routers, TVs, cars ...), BSD (routers and who knows > what else) and Mach (iThingies) being the obvious available kernels. Back then, having memory management implied having virtual memory. These days, some fairly low-end CPUs have MMUs. Furthermore, memory management is very useful for implementing process privileges, even on an OS that does not use virtual memory; again, something that wasn't relevant back in the day. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 16:40:38 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B06C23E484 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:40:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from shamim.shahriar@gmail.com) Received: from mail-qt1-x831.google.com (mail-qt1-x831.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::831]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LqVF2C4cz3Hpk for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:40:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from shamim.shahriar@gmail.com) Received: by mail-qt1-x831.google.com with SMTP id t13so12466385qto.3 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 08:40:37 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=CnsN3DayxzZPzNU2sJUQT3ThOI3EF3ZYqaC1A7+3pJ0=; b=MY6Q9P1mnj4lRaKfg+lPh/YvsY/nt6BG2kYR/tlItgLIxUnnKTm0phgH8OC7IGgK07 W6HUOWaTAAKMLvmDbtQwfxYxYbCPv5lkICDGWuBOMqHMBDqeI6UQVGVJ2UMkAVeYvfqM e6nePYTlvYIFjXVG5/CJ9ul1r8dqRQsPEUqTInlcPgJOzyaklMcXin176SQPbV4iyzAR XSnflTSHeRgrDQ1K15gPbFLA2dDc/2b9NWjaPki43YgimqBOJZqf+8C7PD64YU0wSKib XuF3TLQ9wM+/B1qceSQWCIoqoDOq/03pUcg4LK1uAw9AvfkbEqPsn3mUnrlrZy00Ee6x 8u2g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=CnsN3DayxzZPzNU2sJUQT3ThOI3EF3ZYqaC1A7+3pJ0=; b=rbN5cIbbUe7amhyOY5J4HQDQc0IZbGFMibD/PpdpAeqygw803VmlReVkHnLrnAitUG uqGZhmeQGUzSUzs7dwR6Cg+dlkE17oD4J0MzHSYQ7wgGZOcZ7VNhAn+bR5D5jfJ2jiU1 dm21ETV+eQwhbLZtFZXUD6Avz+XXj7eaedthzQmAxG6nec9C4b9y+ukZZCN27ucvXitw YNngGj9qMdqwj1TGrUqFbyS7382pXk5XeGnnCpG55P6pJkY2BCPdyTG52smLrRiKFcIr NDJ6oP4KpxXNe3ONYCxs5WTtKWQGQotWGOA6cCmexvQ7m3R1Cx5cWcwCymzGIl6qUUFy YWBg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAV1Kt55pOwwZjhzixWAmR4RAnToCzomMiNEPufXvlj+MKHEISTv Yt8VVDpl6dEq95wZgahJNoz3shm+C8+vMFgQxSf3 X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyPR1A3E/V6RyTwgcnsrMD2G92ELTuhUl4dlsxQOaNsegJtee0oR/7z0ht4yhVEFgVupcRzUUEcJJ59wu3iNX4= X-Received: by 2002:aed:2510:: with SMTP id v16mr14034675qtc.306.1581957636066; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 08:40:36 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <79ccdac5-a26b-7a21-5ecb-014d526265c6@where-ever.za.net> In-Reply-To: <79ccdac5-a26b-7a21-5ecb-014d526265c6@where-ever.za.net> From: Shamim Shahriar Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:40:24 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: disabling "weak" algorithms in sshd To: Vikashb Badal Cc: "freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LqVF2C4cz3Hpk X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=MY6Q9P1m; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of shamimshahriar@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::831 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=shamimshahriar@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.21), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[1.3.8.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:40:38 -0000 Thank you all for your suggestions, very much appreciated. I did put in the cipher list, but not the MAC or KexAlgorithms, maybe that will make some change to the report. I will put it in and in case the vulnerability pops up again, I'll get back to you. Kind regards SK On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 at 15:51, Vikashb Badal wrote: > > On 17/02/2020 17:09, Shamim Shahriar wrote: > > Good afternoon all > > > > I had been googling for quite some time and so far came up empty, maybe > > i don't know if there is a best practice for these atm, i usually update > /etc/ssh/shd_config and add/replace: > > Ciphers aes128-ctr,aes192-ctr,aes256-ctr,arcfour256,arcfour128 > MACs hmac-sha1,umac-64@openssh.com,hmac-ripemd160 > > https://man.openbsd.org/sshd_config#Ciphers > > https://man.openbsd.org/sshd_config#MACs > > > "ssh -Q cipher" and "ssh -Q mac" will provide you a list of ciphers > currently > allowed, > > > > someone can shed some light or point me to the correct direction. > > > > I have introduced a bunch of servers into an infrastructure that > previously > > had zero FreeBSD system. They make use of Tenable Security Centre ( > > tenable.com) which I believe used Nessus in the backend to identify > > vulnerabilities. Amongst other things, it is picking up on > (tenable/nessus > > plugin ID 90317) "SSH Weak Algorithms Supported) because the server > allows > > "none" algorithms. > > > > Is there any way to "select" or "selectively disable" algorithms and > hashes > > from sshd? According to various web sources, certain implementation on > > certain distributions might have options to amend the list, but none of > the > > examples I have found worked on my FreeBSD system. > > > > Would appreciate if someone could please point me to the correct > direction. > > > > Kind regards > > SK > > _______________________________________________ > > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to " > freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to " > freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 16:47:45 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CE9623E840 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:47:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: from mail-vs1-xe32.google.com (mail-vs1-xe32.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e32]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LqfR1TZVz3QFB for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:47:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: by mail-vs1-xe32.google.com with SMTP id k188so10759437vsc.8 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 08:47:42 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=zCV2vD1Ml8oYmBAjDe2SBU+MblNQQMzfC0C8iseKkLA=; b=qPydNSnZdtmBdzSNEXnZZaWZzeOGp8ZzBxdFGEJjsn1rMbp/EOQQRv6ItdHSTJvNzb bMUCE8X8I4hIVtj2PQO8xZHJz/zKFsPFyUUgKEjHi3oMnQw2eQUM9YB+4XdDQkMRDKc2 k6AiAy4AllNEoCJzZhuVuZyziy7BjqpfdNPowfHmxG81YJQyf/3q/Dj/K7hd1hFhLXxI QtvIe2DSRlB9zLxCybhhQd6X4ji9uGJup9BzP/W+5KBza6vvX0PuqKa9a4osas2rywNj 68o2BPMaI9I1GFCMLg9BufNeeOriutsGrTkpOY4UcdA32YRw2eOwAbX9uxn0n8DhQ6ls fCmg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=zCV2vD1Ml8oYmBAjDe2SBU+MblNQQMzfC0C8iseKkLA=; b=j1JYep4mQWw/xljtT1OigLZKoc/yB3xYmupgCT3cdDeoNpRWDHvsau33gPkfScVs4R /2aCfmgZQI9rgaMZcNHvqhTJrUpOkq5jR/6DBIixMnEgtbzjaY4rjP+w4sh/6capoBkW 25th5r7LWj91hoFJb8ZCf6AK+AeY0upBMcPnYbCD2yeIYKmBH8DaIp93mWOHpsTM6pKc KiXP8x4fEaQYmmRZH9gSOW71jI5cS9tclNb7KisEj0xmQXrO5FL5oOWuDdURr2zmx9b6 dbHBdfsgCeRwJ+tXuJEN6x5xkydv1sY3rpsBG/ljiPDmYs5PB6e+oeo91726mxZA9qqJ 9QIQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWtb0QkSogDrKgKkj+mFcez1oYPuDIRgEonFhZSFx/Ekl1tsAXi BSjgoN1su200brwpqQ8YCVqfDVg30USPjlLXjSw0z8P3 X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyKXIKpvjgT8LcDMLEPjkpw3rLhll0RAkTjofHtvo/Pf7lbGpYZT2lTDxIOw88A1nXvcdwKyztA0IzMnfHhDh4= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6102:3105:: with SMTP id e5mr8777965vsh.133.1581958061980; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 08:47:41 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> In-Reply-To: From: Andreas X Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:47:30 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? To: Tim Daneliuk , FreeBSD Mailing List X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LqfR1TZVz3QFB X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=qPydNSnZ; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of hamdi20193d@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::e32 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=hamdi20193d@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.00 / 15.00]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; URI_COUNT_ODD(1.00)[9]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.43), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2.3.e.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; HTTP_TO_IP(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:47:45 -0000 Hi again, The rule: "65500 0 0 deny ip from table(10) to any" was almost the last rule and I suspected it, therefore I wanted to move the rule upper, changed the command: ${FWCMD} 00350 add deny all from table\(10\) to any (adding rule number 00350), now ipfw successfully blocks the IPs in the table. My question is, why it didn't block the IPs when it had rule number 65500? (It might be the last rules, but still, it has "deny" command..shouldn't it do the job?) Thank you. Andreas X , 17 =C5=9Eub 2020 Pzt, 18:54 tarihinde = =C5=9Funu yazd=C4=B1: > Dear Tim, > > I applied your suggestion, however it seems IPFW doesn't ban the IP > addresses in the list. (I've added a useless VPS IP of mine in the list, = to > test it, but I could still ping the server from that IP) > > Here's my script as per your suggestion: > > #!/bin/sh > FWCMD=3D"ipfw -q" > > LISTX=3D/usr/local/etc/fw/banlist.txt > > ipfw table 10 create > ipfw table 10 flush > > for addr in `cat ${LISTX}` > do > ${FWCMD} table 10 add ${addr} > done > > ${FWCMD} add deny all from table\(10\) to any > > > And ipfw show | grep "table" command outputs: > "65500 0 0 deny ip from table(10) to any" so it seems the IPs are > added. But none of them are blocked. > > I restarted IPFW too, and re-run the script again, no solution. > > Any idea? > > Thank you. > > > Tim Daneliuk , 17 =C5=9Eub 2020 Pzt, 17:51 tarihin= de > =C5=9Funu yazd=C4=B1: > >> On 2/17/20 8:36 AM, Andreas X wrote: >> >> >> > The list dramatically grows each week. How may I create a text file so >> that >> > IPFW would fetch these IPs from there directly? What's the simplest wa= y >> to >> > do this please? >> >> >> Looping through a file and running an ipfw command each time gets super >> slow as >> the list gets long. ipfw tables are the better way to do this: >> >> FWCMD=3D"ipfw -q" # Firewall command >> OIF=3Dem0 # NIC to outside world >> >> # Address spaces we want blocked entirely are listed in this file >> NAUGHTYFILE=3D/usr/local/etc/firewall/naughtyIPs >> >> # Use ipfw tables for efficiency >> >> ipfw table 10 flush >> for addr in `cat ${NAUGHTYFILE}` >> do >> ${FWCMD} table 10 add ${addr} >> done >> >> ${FWCMD} add deny all from table\(10\) to any via ${OIF} >> >> The "naughty" file can have specific IPs or CIDR blocks in it, one >> per line: >> >> 95.87.0.0/18 >> 95.87.192.0/18 >> 96.246.220.34 >> 96.30.64.0/18 >> 98.143.148.107 >> >> >> >> >> HTH, >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---- >> Tim Daneliuk tundra@tundraware.com >> PGP Key: http://www.tundraware.com/PGP/ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list >> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions >> To unsubscribe, send any mail to " >> freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >> > From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 16:53:56 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E17F23EB81 for ; 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RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[9.2.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.5.4.1.0.0.a.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:53:56 -0000 Hello, I'm running FreeBSD 12.0. I'm atempting to tighten up my sshd configuration. I've got things where I want them, except for the connecting banner. I'm using sshaudit.com to test things and this is what it's saying for the banner setting: Banner:SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.8 FreeBSD-20180909 I would rather this be set to nothing or at most very minimal. Google and the sshd_config man page reveals the Banner and VersionAdendum options. I've set both to none. PrintMotd no #PrintLastLog yes #VersionAddendum none #Banner none Can anyone tell me how to get the results I am looking for? Thanks. Dave. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 16:58:14 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 877CE23EE86; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:58:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ozgur@kazancci.com) Received: from relay3-d.mail.gandi.net (relay3-d.mail.gandi.net [217.70.183.195]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LqtX40klz47TB; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:58:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ozgur@kazancci.com) Received: from webmail.gandi.net (webmail14.sd4.0x35.net [10.200.201.14]) (Authenticated sender: ozgur@kazancci.com) by relay3-d.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id AC0A860007; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:58:08 +0000 (UTC) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:58:08 +0300 From: =?UTF-8?Q?=C3=96zg=C3=BCr_Kazancci?= To: David Mehler Cc: freebsd-questions , owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: tightening sshd, removing server identification banner In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <036b6d54c51d5d7ae9934415b60369f8@kazancci.com> X-Sender: ozgur@kazancci.com User-Agent: Roundcube Webmail/1.3.8 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48LqtX40klz47TB X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ozgur@kazancci.com designates 217.70.183.195 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ozgur@kazancci.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.42 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_GOOD(0.00)[195.183.70.217.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.18]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:217.70.183.192/28]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TAGGED_RCPT(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kazancci.com]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[195.183.70.217.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:29169, ipnet:217.70.176.0/20, country:FR]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-1.02)[ip: (-2.26), ipnet: 217.70.176.0/20(-1.58), asn: 29169(-1.28), country: FR(0.00)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:58:14 -0000 Hello David, If you're sure you uncommented these lines, #VersionAddendum none #Banner none and restarted the sshd, then there is no much else left -imho-. A complete removal of SSHD banner (if that's what you're trying to do) requires a manual edit of OpenSSH(d) files&complete complication of it from scratch. Best, Özgür. On 17/02/2020 19:53, David Mehler wrote: > Hello, > > I'm running FreeBSD 12.0. I'm atempting to tighten up my sshd > configuration. I've got things where I want them, except for the > connecting banner. I'm using sshaudit.com to test things and this is > what it's saying for the banner setting: > > Banner:SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.8 FreeBSD-20180909 > > I would rather this be set to nothing or at most very minimal. Google > and the sshd_config man page reveals the Banner and VersionAdendum > options. I've set both to none. > > PrintMotd no > #PrintLastLog yes > #VersionAddendum none > #Banner none > > Can anyone tell me how to get the results I am looking for? > > Thanks. > Dave. > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to > "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 16:59:32 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A4FA23EF84 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:59:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48Lqw31g0bz48YQ for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:59:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from [128.135.52.252] (unknown [128.135.52.252]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3B4904E620; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 10:59:30 -0600 (CST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.5\)) Subject: Re: tightening sshd, removing server identification banner From: Valeri Galtsev In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 10:59:30 -0600 Cc: freebsd-questions Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <2357421B-1522-4ECF-A9BA-3396C2357B57@kicp.uchicago.edu> References: To: David Mehler X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Lqw31g0bz48YQ X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=uchicago.edu (policy=none); spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu has no SPF policy when checking 128.135.20.70) smtp.mailfrom=galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.04 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[uchicago.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.78)[-0.776,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.991,0]; TAGGED_RCPT(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[70.20.135.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:160, ipnet:128.135.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.12)[ip: (0.35), ipnet: 128.135.0.0/16(0.18), asn: 160(0.14), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:59:32 -0000 > On Feb 17, 2020, at 10:53 AM, David Mehler = wrote: >=20 > Hello, >=20 > I'm running FreeBSD 12.0. I'm atempting to tighten up my sshd > configuration. I've got things where I want them, except for the > connecting banner. I'm using sshaudit.com to test things and this is > what it's saying for the banner setting: >=20 > Banner:SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.8 FreeBSD-20180909 >=20 > I would rather this be set to nothing or at most very minimal. Google > and the sshd_config man page reveals the Banner and VersionAdendum > options. I've set both to none. >=20 > PrintMotd no > #PrintLastLog yes > #VersionAddendum none > #Banner none >=20 My sshd_config file has: Banner /etc/some_file and /etc/some_file contains the text which is being put as banner (Like = =E2=80=9CThis is [my organization name] system. Unauthorized use is = prohibited=E2=80=9D) and whatever else I feel necessary to greet users = witrh on particular box. I hope this helps. Valeri > Can anyone tell me how to get the results I am looking for? >=20 > Thanks. > Dave. > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 17:02:11 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9397B23F131 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:02:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from shamim.shahriar@gmail.com) Received: from mail-qk1-x735.google.com (mail-qk1-x735.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::735]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Lqz63j0Tz4BGg for ; 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Mon, 17 Feb 2020 09:02:08 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <79ccdac5-a26b-7a21-5ecb-014d526265c6@where-ever.za.net> In-Reply-To: From: Shamim Shahriar Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:01:57 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: disabling "weak" algorithms in sshd To: "freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Lqz63j0Tz4BGg X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=NbqR3VLD; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of shamimshahriar@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::735 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=shamimshahriar@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.25), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[5.3.7.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:02:11 -0000 Okay, I added the following changes to /etc/ssh/sshd_config Ciphers chacha20-poly1305@openssh.com,aes256-gcm@openssh.com, aes128-gcm@openssh.com,aes256-ctr,aes192-ctr,aes128-ctr MACs hmac-sha2-256-etm@openssh.com,hmac-sha2-512-etm@openssh.com, umac-128-etm@openssh.com KexAlgorithms curve25519-sha256@libssh.org ,diffie-hellman-group18-sha512,diffie-hellman-group16-sha512,diffie-hellman-group14-sha256 and then restarted the ssh daemon The output for ssh -Q ciphers or ssh -Q mac was identical before and after. Also, Nessus/Tenable is still complaining. Nessus negotiated the following encryption algorithm with the server : The server supports the following options for kex_algorithms : curve25519-sha256@libssh.org diffie-hellman-group14-sha256 diffie-hellman-group16-sha512 diffie-hellman-group18-sha512 The server supports the following options for server_host_key_algorithms : ecdsa-sha2-nistp256 rsa-sha2-256 rsa-sha2-512 ssh-ed25519 ssh-rsa The server supports the following options for encryption_algorithms_client_to_server : aes128-ctr aes128-gcm@openssh.com aes192-ctr aes256-ctr aes256-gcm@openssh.com chacha20-poly1305@openssh.com none The server supports the following options for encryption_algorithms_server_to_client : aes128-ctr aes128-gcm@openssh.com aes192-ctr aes256-ctr aes256-gcm@openssh.com chacha20-poly1305@openssh.com none The server supports the following options for mac_algorithms_client_to_server : hmac-sha2-256-etm@openssh.com hmac-sha2-512-etm@openssh.com umac-128-etm@openssh.com The server supports the following options for mac_algorithms_server_to_client : hmac-sha2-256-etm@openssh.com hmac-sha2-512-etm@openssh.com umac-128-etm@openssh.com The server supports the following options for compression_algorithms_client_to_server : none zlib@openssh.com The server supports the following options for compression_algorithms_server_to_client : none zlib@openssh.com Based on that, I can only assume either the sshd_config file I am updating is not the one in use, or I am doing something wrong. Thanks for your suggestions and recommendations Kind regards SK On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 at 16:40, Shamim Shahriar wrote: > Thank you all for your suggestions, very much appreciated. > > I did put in the cipher list, but not the MAC or KexAlgorithms, maybe that > will make some change to the report. I will put it in and in case the > vulnerability pops up again, I'll get back to you. > > Kind regards > SK > > On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 at 15:51, Vikashb Badal > wrote: > >> >> On 17/02/2020 17:09, Shamim Shahriar wrote: >> > Good afternoon all >> > >> > I had been googling for quite some time and so far came up empty, maybe >> >> i don't know if there is a best practice for these atm, i usually update >> /etc/ssh/shd_config and add/replace: >> >> Ciphers aes128-ctr,aes192-ctr,aes256-ctr,arcfour256,arcfour128 >> MACs hmac-sha1,umac-64@openssh.com,hmac-ripemd160 >> >> https://man.openbsd.org/sshd_config#Ciphers >> >> https://man.openbsd.org/sshd_config#MACs >> >> >> "ssh -Q cipher" and "ssh -Q mac" will provide you a list of ciphers >> currently >> allowed, >> >> >> > someone can shed some light or point me to the correct direction. >> > >> > I have introduced a bunch of servers into an infrastructure that >> previously >> > had zero FreeBSD system. They make use of Tenable Security Centre ( >> > tenable.com) which I believe used Nessus in the backend to identify >> > vulnerabilities. Amongst other things, it is picking up on >> (tenable/nessus >> > plugin ID 90317) "SSH Weak Algorithms Supported) because the server >> allows >> > "none" algorithms. >> > >> > Is there any way to "select" or "selectively disable" algorithms and >> hashes >> > from sshd? According to various web sources, certain implementation on >> > certain distributions might have options to amend the list, but none of >> the >> > examples I have found worked on my FreeBSD system. >> > >> > Would appreciate if someone could please point me to the correct >> direction. >> > >> > Kind regards >> > SK >> > _______________________________________________ >> > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list >> > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions >> > To unsubscribe, send any mail to " >> freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >> _______________________________________________ >> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list >> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions >> To unsubscribe, send any mail to " >> freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >> > From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 17:02:57 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E0DA23F35B; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:02:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48Lr005WdNz4Bgv; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:02:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from [128.135.52.252] (unknown [128.135.52.252]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D8AC54E67D; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 11:02:55 -0600 (CST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.5\)) Subject: Re: tightening sshd, removing server identification banner From: Valeri Galtsev In-Reply-To: <036b6d54c51d5d7ae9934415b60369f8@kazancci.com> Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 11:02:55 -0600 Cc: David Mehler , freebsd-questions , owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <0E539BE9-C479-4374-8568-5FDA5A910F3C@kicp.uchicago.edu> References: <036b6d54c51d5d7ae9934415b60369f8@kazancci.com> To: =?utf-8?Q?=C3=96zg=C3=BCr_Kazancci?= X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Lr005WdNz4Bgv X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=uchicago.edu (policy=none); spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu has no SPF policy when checking 128.135.20.70) smtp.mailfrom=galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.82 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[uchicago.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.58)[-0.585,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; TAGGED_RCPT(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.96)[-0.957,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.12)[ip: (0.35), ipnet: 128.135.0.0/16(0.17), asn: 160(0.14), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[70.20.135.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:160, ipnet:128.135.0.0/16, country:US]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:02:57 -0000 > On Feb 17, 2020, at 10:58 AM, =C3=96zg=C3=BCr Kazancci = wrote: >=20 > Hello David, >=20 > If you're sure you uncommented these lines, > #VersionAddendum none > #Banner none >=20 As far as I know, uncommenting lines in sshd_config is unnecessary. = These are put there as commented lines to indicate defaults which sshd = was build with, so they are already in effect. That is why good practice = is when changing something to keep commented line as it is, and add next = to it yours not commented different setting. Valeri > and restarted the sshd, then there is no much else left -imho-. A = complete removal of SSHD banner (if that's what you're trying to do) = requires a manual edit of OpenSSH(d) files&complete complication of it = from scratch. >=20 > Best, > =C3=96zg=C3=BCr. >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > On 17/02/2020 19:53, David Mehler wrote: >> Hello, >> I'm running FreeBSD 12.0. I'm atempting to tighten up my sshd >> configuration. I've got things where I want them, except for the >> connecting banner. I'm using sshaudit.com to test things and this is >> what it's saying for the banner setting: >> Banner:SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.8 FreeBSD-20180909 >> I would rather this be set to nothing or at most very minimal. Google >> and the sshd_config man page reveals the Banner and VersionAdendum >> options. I've set both to none. >> PrintMotd no >> #PrintLastLog yes >> #VersionAddendum none >> #Banner none >> Can anyone tell me how to get the results I am looking for? >> Thanks. >> Dave. >> _______________________________________________ >> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list >> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions >> To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 17:07:30 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9057F23F590 for ; 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a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=kBhMmu0l9ShI6jNCTYqUNeizGb5wwjdjSL3mZjpGOVg=; b=LLfteIofw2o42eS7rIxIkwz7Kj1pNgXe35zNM4xzn4sdHxYoFv3Go5A9J7F/O9pWh2 6Hhi7khVcIyulKYh29rrqVD8G2fMsEODinEKe7roHCkZ7E2SKgyYzw/93QUaAzpCY8DB xWsQX95NkT6j9VxUOQHGbIeLICOo9gHDJOwJ1dQLK+nK1WXEmUsgDTNFmQYJYNuCxpxz RrzQuICYMhN0gbLwjvAEnMc5QDJ+c9cGvtIi51giMnVld7+dG/+v7Pu+rFlzjqQdJMgj 0LTEebeSRb6VnBH/Ym5ikwJhuN022nHvTz1eO7PH+jqmHyBHFqOd7XFZ4eH3IdSjAZ/V zRLg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXDyegs/KNtkK4PQjckvJhHj3jy9U97LNL5pBTG0aFg2nUHwtL7 e8Z4BIFq/jizYIZv61stPIQ0Q7k+TrSKH0ICiAuJ X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwyEIQArpa89R9k3RNdI6JP3oQMYfQ5M9NEcw6mrRznQn2F3ffFr50rooKNx5ulvWhSHcrUhvLoVSoBecBT5UQ= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6214:17cd:: with SMTP id cu13mr12812038qvb.192.1581959243467; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 09:07:23 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <79ccdac5-a26b-7a21-5ecb-014d526265c6@where-ever.za.net> In-Reply-To: From: Shamim Shahriar Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:07:12 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: disabling "weak" algorithms in sshd To: "freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Lr5F4BbWz4FFS X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=N7kcQL3/; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of shamimshahriar@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::f32 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=shamimshahriar@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-7.81), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; TAGGED_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:07:30 -0000 Hello again I put the modifications to another system, and this one is giving me the correct result (no further reference to the "none" encryption algorithm. This implies there may be a problem with the other server that I will need to look into. Fortunately it is NOT connected to the internet. Thank you all once again for your help and the pointers. Best regards SK On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 at 17:01, Shamim Shahriar wrote: > Okay, I added the following changes to /etc/ssh/sshd_config > Ciphers chacha20-poly1305@openssh.com,aes256-gcm@openssh.com, > aes128-gcm@openssh.com,aes256-ctr,aes192-ctr,aes128-ctr > MACs hmac-sha2-256-etm@openssh.com,hmac-sha2-512-etm@openssh.com, > umac-128-etm@openssh.com > KexAlgorithms curve25519-sha256@libssh.org > ,diffie-hellman-group18-sha512,diffie-hellman-group16-sha512,diffie-hellman-group14-sha256 > > and then restarted the ssh daemon > > The output for ssh -Q ciphers or ssh -Q mac was identical before and after. > > Also, Nessus/Tenable is still complaining. > > Nessus negotiated the following encryption algorithm with the server : > > The server supports the following options for kex_algorithms : > > curve25519-sha256@libssh.org > diffie-hellman-group14-sha256 > diffie-hellman-group16-sha512 > diffie-hellman-group18-sha512 > > The server supports the following options for server_host_key_algorithms : > > ecdsa-sha2-nistp256 > rsa-sha2-256 > rsa-sha2-512 > ssh-ed25519 > ssh-rsa > > The server supports the following options for > encryption_algorithms_client_to_server : > > aes128-ctr > aes128-gcm@openssh.com > aes192-ctr > aes256-ctr > aes256-gcm@openssh.com > chacha20-poly1305@openssh.com > none > > The server supports the following options for > encryption_algorithms_server_to_client : > > aes128-ctr > aes128-gcm@openssh.com > aes192-ctr > aes256-ctr > aes256-gcm@openssh.com > chacha20-poly1305@openssh.com > none > > The server supports the following options for > mac_algorithms_client_to_server : > > hmac-sha2-256-etm@openssh.com > hmac-sha2-512-etm@openssh.com > umac-128-etm@openssh.com > > The server supports the following options for > mac_algorithms_server_to_client : > > hmac-sha2-256-etm@openssh.com > hmac-sha2-512-etm@openssh.com > umac-128-etm@openssh.com > > The server supports the following options for > compression_algorithms_client_to_server : > > none > zlib@openssh.com > > The server supports the following options for > compression_algorithms_server_to_client : > > none > zlib@openssh.com > > Based on that, I can only assume either the sshd_config file I am updating > is not the one in use, or I am doing something wrong. > > Thanks for your suggestions and recommendations > > Kind regards > SK > > > On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 at 16:40, Shamim Shahriar > wrote: > >> Thank you all for your suggestions, very much appreciated. >> >> I did put in the cipher list, but not the MAC or KexAlgorithms, maybe >> that will make some change to the report. I will put it in and in case the >> vulnerability pops up again, I'll get back to you. >> >> Kind regards >> SK >> >> On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 at 15:51, Vikashb Badal >> wrote: >> >>> >>> On 17/02/2020 17:09, Shamim Shahriar wrote: >>> > Good afternoon all >>> > >>> > I had been googling for quite some time and so far came up empty, maybe >>> >>> i don't know if there is a best practice for these atm, i usually update >>> /etc/ssh/shd_config and add/replace: >>> >>> Ciphers aes128-ctr,aes192-ctr,aes256-ctr,arcfour256,arcfour128 >>> MACs hmac-sha1,umac-64@openssh.com,hmac-ripemd160 >>> >>> https://man.openbsd.org/sshd_config#Ciphers >>> >>> https://man.openbsd.org/sshd_config#MACs >>> >>> >>> "ssh -Q cipher" and "ssh -Q mac" will provide you a list of ciphers >>> currently >>> allowed, >>> >>> >>> > someone can shed some light or point me to the correct direction. >>> > >>> > I have introduced a bunch of servers into an infrastructure that >>> previously >>> > had zero FreeBSD system. They make use of Tenable Security Centre ( >>> > tenable.com) which I believe used Nessus in the backend to identify >>> > vulnerabilities. Amongst other things, it is picking up on >>> (tenable/nessus >>> > plugin ID 90317) "SSH Weak Algorithms Supported) because the server >>> allows >>> > "none" algorithms. >>> > >>> > Is there any way to "select" or "selectively disable" algorithms and >>> hashes >>> > from sshd? According to various web sources, certain implementation on >>> > certain distributions might have options to amend the list, but none >>> of the >>> > examples I have found worked on my FreeBSD system. >>> > >>> > Would appreciate if someone could please point me to the correct >>> direction. >>> > >>> > Kind regards >>> > SK >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list >>> > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions >>> > To unsubscribe, send any mail to " >>> freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >>> _______________________________________________ >>> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list >>> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions >>> To unsubscribe, send any mail to " >>> freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >>> >> From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 17:38:27 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EDE82407E7 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:38:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from mailout.easydns.com (mailout.easydns.com [64.68.202.10]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Lrmx5NFTz3DyN for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:38:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BC68A0169; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:38:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mailout.easydns.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (emo13-pco.easydns.vpn [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Hcavvj04bJyQ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:38:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: from hedeland.org (81-228-157-209-no289.tbcn.telia.com [81.228.157.209]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B185A9FDE5; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:38:19 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pluto.hedeland.org (pluto.hedeland.org [10.1.1.5]) by tellus.hedeland.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id 01HHcHaB023175 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO); Mon, 17 Feb 2020 18:38:17 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Subject: Re: tightening sshd, removing server identification banner To: Valeri Galtsev , =?UTF-8?Q?=c3=96zg=c3=bcr_Kazancci?= Cc: David Mehler , freebsd-questions References: <036b6d54c51d5d7ae9934415b60369f8@kazancci.com> <0E539BE9-C479-4374-8568-5FDA5A910F3C@kicp.uchicago.edu> From: Per Hedeland Message-ID: <3ef7eb70-8b38-332a-1276-9170e2480f0e@hedeland.org> Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 18:38:17 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <0E539BE9-C479-4374-8568-5FDA5A910F3C@kicp.uchicago.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Lrmx5NFTz3DyN X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of per@hedeland.org has no SPF policy when checking 64.68.202.10) smtp.mailfrom=per@hedeland.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.06 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[209.157.228.81.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TAGGED_RCPT(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[hedeland.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.55)[0.553,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.47)[ip: (0.60), ipnet: 64.68.200.0/22(0.12), asn: 16686(1.74), country: CA(-0.09)]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.23)[0.234,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[10.202.68.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16686, ipnet:64.68.200.0/22, country:CA]; FREEMAIL_CC(0.00)[gmail.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:38:27 -0000 On 2020-02-17 18:02, Valeri Galtsev wrote: > > >> On Feb 17, 2020, at 10:58 AM, zgr Kazancci wrote: >> >> Hello David, >> >> If you're sure you uncommented these lines, >> #VersionAddendum none >> #Banner none >> > > As far as I know, uncommenting lines in sshd_config is unnecessary. These are put there as commented lines to indicate defaults which sshd was build with, so they are already in effect. That is why good practice is when changing something to keep commented line as it is, and add next to it yours not commented different setting. Agreed, but changing the commented value without uncommenting does (obviously) not have any effect. The default sshd_config in 12.1-RELEASE has #VersionAddendum FreeBSD-20180909 #Banner none I.e. an uncommented VersionAddendum none is needed to remove the above text. > Valeri > >> and restarted the sshd, then there is no much else left -imho-. A complete removal of SSHD banner (if that's what you're trying to do) requires a manual edit of OpenSSH(d) files&complete complication of it from scratch. I think the "SSH-2.0" part should be considered mandatory, it's part of the protocol. --Per >> Best, >> zgr. >> >> >> >> >> On 17/02/2020 19:53, David Mehler wrote: >>> Hello, >>> I'm running FreeBSD 12.0. I'm atempting to tighten up my sshd >>> configuration. I've got things where I want them, except for the >>> connecting banner. I'm using sshaudit.com to test things and this is >>> what it's saying for the banner setting: >>> Banner:SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.8 FreeBSD-20180909 >>> I would rather this be set to nothing or at most very minimal. Google >>> and the sshd_config man page reveals the Banner and VersionAdendum >>> options. I've set both to none. >>> PrintMotd no >>> #PrintLastLog yes >>> #VersionAddendum none >>> #Banner none >>> Can anyone tell me how to get the results I am looking for? >>> Thanks. >>> Dave. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list >>> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions >>> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >> _______________________________________________ >> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list >> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions >> To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Valeri Galtsev > Sr System Administrator > Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics > Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics > University of Chicago > Phone: 773-702-4247 > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 19:42:16 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC33B2445E5 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:42:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ihor@antonovs.family) Received: from mail.antonovs.family (mail.antonovs.family [100.25.240.195]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LvWn25S7z3JH6 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:42:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ihor@antonovs.family) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6680138B96; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:42:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail.antonovs.family ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.antonovs.family [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id oDuiAQUhgtrl; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:42:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35EBC138BD6; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:42:10 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 mail.antonovs.family 35EBC138BD6 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=antonovs.family; s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77; t=1581968530; bh=gn3MUWicFUyjTdwuuTHcnspvvVVljGz8ZLs5ikYkO9w=; h=Date:From:To:Message-ID:MIME-Version; b=IIt4ogsMG1QU0WzlicUdFF8SFO666dSdUhyWdzIiai8vV1j1h85kX5urGlYoqhHyx vViYj25Cc7nuIqaDc2SLBPRxkYsIkZaW1jhrSOs8geQxKEs2TBFjEPDgRef++AwF46 8WjVO6aatHNi/2wIN5yCaSVZZVt8/gpe5/69kHzJriQ01usrWvYVdB4NiTBJDqNud/ 2Uo+K181KT6vAJFWkrVE+uDRDNpZWpwxj+d54afGGuBveLcU1S6T3pXIM+76rm0/0p 5DCTQop32iO8O/4YQwaJyMbBEMPpLP15PpCv5xdcJLvUSZJbqqDFikbEgunHJFJO1j nM77Xl4FhXXog== X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at antonovs.family Received: from mail.antonovs.family ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.antonovs.family [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id DBJiiqN04fwT; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:42:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (unknown [74.85.93.130]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id E4506138B96; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:42:09 +0000 (UTC) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 11:42:07 -0800 From: Ihor Antonov To: Tim Preston Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-ID: <20200217194207.rxmcomsn4jvmoc7c@sea-ll-10936> References: <8a9a33b3-4eb1-419c-a9e3-fca4db430619@www.fastmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; 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RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[antonovs.family,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14618, ipnet:100.24.0.0/13, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:42:17 -0000 On 2020-02-17 09:47, Tim Preston wrote: > Thank you Ihor, this is a great summary. > > On thing I'd like to mention regarding Docker is the inherent > abstraction leakage around pre-built images as they tend to be tied to > the host they were built on. > For example, I've seen quite a few images in Docker Hub with a > hardcoded UID which causes file permissions issue when mounting a > volume from the host. Or often authors just assume you'll run the > container as root. Yes, this is a known problem. For reasons unknow to me (could be technical limitation back when docker started) docker daemon was not performing UID mapping, so that root UID inside container (0) was also same UID outside containers, which created all sorts of problems. Docker now allow to do that, but the feature is not default https://docs.docker.com/engine/security/userns-remap/ Newer tool - podman - offers rootless containers feature and perform this by default. Podman got rit of privileged daemon process, so that now entire container tooling runs in user namespace. And so it has to do UID/GID mapping between parent/child namespaces, This is a step in right direction since now joes don't need root privileges to work with container tooling. Can you create jails in FreeBSD as non-root user and have root inside jail? Initial design of docker has a flaw, that was necessary back then, but not anymore - it has a privileged daemon running, listening on a socket for commands from CLI tool. > Another is a mismatch of kernel versions or capabilities between image > build host and your host, for example, Redis usually needs Transparent > Huge Pages to be turned off in the kernel. While this is probably true, I never encountered this issue myslef. And if software requires specific kernel settings - does jail solve this problem better? (I don't know if there are per-jail sysctl configs..) > It's for these reasons (and the previously mentioned security risks) > I'd hope that an 'image' model isn't implemented for FreeBSD jails. > Recipes to build jails are a much better idea, as per iocage and > Bastille. Pre-build images can emerge as inevitable need to speed up build process. If your recepie(dockerfile) relies on another recipie and that one relies on another - it could take A LOT of time to build all the layers you rely on. Basically docker "image" is just collection of layers. When you work on the dockerfile and rebuild it regularly - you don't want to rebuild parts that have not changed. And so docker came up with the idea of image layers. Each command in Dockerfile creates a layer. And if you did not touch that specific line in dockerfile - layer will be re-used When you are finished - your "image" is just a resulting set of layers. (overly simplified, but the gist of it) And since linux folks did not have proper COW file system(ZFS) they had to invent things like overlayfs to quickly take snapshots of the image - because simply gziping the image every time somethig chages there was VERY SLOW. Dockerhub also stores all the layers, because it appers to be storage-efficient, since many images can have shared layers. So as much as I am with you on > hope that an 'image' model isn't implemented I see it as inevitable result of ecosystem development... unless a radically different approach is taken towards solving "long build times" problem. ------------ Ihor Antonov > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 22:00:09 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4CB3248502 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 22:00:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) Received: from s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com (s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com [142.0.176.198]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LyZw4Lvtz3HVQ for ; 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Mon, 17 Feb 2020 17:00:03 -0500 Received: from [192.168.63.1] (helo=steve.lan.sohara.org) by smtp.lan.sohara.org with smtp (Exim 4.92.3 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1j3oQr-0001zY-OK for freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 22:00:01 +0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 22:00:01 +0000 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Message-Id: <20200217220001.c87e2f2f844f7c45faf712a1@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: <44y2t1td8d.fsf@be-well.ilk.org> References: <20200214121620.GA80657@admin.sibptus.ru> <1848571509.3253011.1581719423989@mail.yahoo.com> <20200215195303.464e585a.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215202033.6c856b8f7639b304d96e68ce@sohara.org> <20200215215825.5d3c9a1a@archlinux> <20200215211542.e8cc2827fc4664ea4bcad918@sohara.org> <20200215223449.355a9ac9@archlinux> <20200215223649.40196f37@archlinux> <20200215232623.7995b06e@archlinux> <20200215235822.f804ffc6.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200215232931.5a9132b2e83daa2d0a06dac8@sohara.org> <44y2t1td8d.fsf@be-well.ilk.org> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; 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MV_CASE(0.50)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[email-od.com:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[198.176.0.142.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.15.0]; ENVFROM_VERP(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7381, ipnet:142.0.176.0/22, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 22:00:09 -0000 On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 11:01:06 -0500 Lowell Gilbert wrote: > Steve O'Hara-Smith writes: > > > The late Morten Reistad used to post (in alt.folklore.computers) > > about the numbers of processors with memory management being made and > > comparing that with Windows licenses, Apple and Android phone production > > numbers. Windows, MacOs and commercial unix licenses only account for a > > small fraction of the CPUs made - most of them have to be running > > something else Linux (Android, routers, TVs, cars ...), BSD (routers > > and who knows what else) and Mach (iThingies) being the obvious > > available kernels. > > Back then, having memory management implied having virtual memory. These Back then was a couple of years ago. > days, some fairly low-end CPUs have MMUs. Furthermore, memory management Low end CPUs that are a lot more powerful than a PDP-11. > is very useful for implementing process privileges, even on an OS that > does not use virtual memory; again, something that wasn't relevant back > in the ay. Having an MMU is a pre-requisite for running a multi-user OS, that was why he picked that feature. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Mon Feb 17 22:43:33 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B149249466 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 22:43:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tundra@tundraware.com) Received: from oceanview.tundraware.com (oceanview.tundraware.com [45.55.60.57]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mailman.tundraware.com", Issuer "mailman.tundraware.com" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48LzXz5dyRz4Rf5 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 22:43:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tundra@tundraware.com) Received: from [192.168.0.2] (ozzie.tundraware.com [75.145.138.73]) (authenticated bits=0) by oceanview.tundraware.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id 01HMgCEP009405 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:42:12 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from tundra@tundraware.com) Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? To: FreeBSD Mailing List References: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> From: Tim Daneliuk Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=tundra@tundraware.com; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQINBFlVgYoBEADIYD9W4mbKz5cEleX923hagDWkxyJl4kRiMJnz+dNAH71MItSdErMb0cFt CPxVncb4dR4R2ec0c0MjPcgVINNtbY1DMWsF7t31TKD8NG9ZjLqF6fZDFjgkRejqHytgjmCI UejrMSCf0UJsLtg+I3N1ZVVxd7ALj2bCvC/uc5S7j+YbNnhQvSoBbdFj/xOTjyOGGpk7WfB7 e42PGKq1NSgnI7tcY6HSaSH+LHeoc0yUpBb5A1ge+RhR1N9JTniEFe0qvOBi+HgUltEoxsk4 xb6IhpkDOTsxHvEg5h0ukfl8kG9cu+LrEBqwPaC8lPw3UmoTEAU+lXHanPE12JCF/54EtVCc rb4W0vqgGmLJzn5dRU/fWkar0FKPq4eoV0XMbGZKIC6pWQnMEsxEMpNvh7oefK6Kyn+LO+59 +sNYHbv1RImDJccmfHTOA6/jHdwOcnYy37U8UF7e+mGrwNs8GsMQx2AaQbR6VErakH3GBgft bMFOGQxiaRBkbzba7BZCQ060yhiC3/Mb/xHoVi7PBEmKig1SErTMA7Fh3CYPYIRDphNs6OSr tf9O4hbzUAsjbU3rxOfiWQjP3fSOM0KUBj4wpIWZlMrjAGnMIz2wHb211wsBiLqSaGiiO1LR 7RrcvbIFZvHQHiWe2tdRyuH3N/h7A316yoLfx+yy1gyP5weWsQARAQABtCRUaW0gRGFuZWxp dWsgPHR1bmRyYUB0dW5kcmF3YXJlLmNvbT6JAjcEEwEIACEFAllVgYoCGyMFCwkIBwIGFQgJ CgsCBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQdoOXo5EJFKntcA/9F9ags9Ik5C49N39iRq+yqBdn/Lr75rqv +Yg7JkjeVlwHpnQt1S6orTC7EaJc+AqY3szCEmhfuT0+E96Bw2k+G/XRnaedZ9SHSdImlmq0 RmOFpWLr67ScvlA9YG1tyR+QYraEFqK5EB6qhOWRJoz1BYtAAntK9b9gUTXt/277sT7lAWaj oPi4CDd4DofHc4E9VRsniMQNMLCWqc/ygAK07cWbK2Rh90tS2C4nK6OHFkNkK94zDilfxod1 NBFTUPPYfEU2CSa3eLlpfhYY3/2X7zNvmmCt+chHUnAhQLhldQ3WlqmTKP+ZK9LX002/bY1O M8Zk76WyA/A3EfsIUbnXBQvFyjwX6W4QEytlZWtp/yRIe64JOa3dZ8rkhragb2N4VgVLBVe3 jtZgfQ72pHrfNk/T0uT+hjFqInvIYiXkhxB2GiD7Ga28VuXojTmeoaW3GKcvoVxONSju7WzD XgyxWRmNpd5uifJcC3YU3tNNAosnQ0/5FW4wkducSEVwwqnAiSMQEMDDa/e6oP6GyOzes5SV LTNCRYdHWVKbxjetYU4SKm5RdLx9XuJo0qL9vO97mCNwdNkTM7gO2ycQ49qUiGbCZJOh2gpP ZRFrpJDxbloosAfOEB6IYjhb38u6jvbScJKK3bWA+a8TK4SrQpdRd1cAnW9sA8jCTV8ejZq0 CHm5Ag0EWVWBigEQAJYuihAOOOe/kAn045Ayn+3is3S+6eV4IAgL6lJhoChkgUJJuFoRX9BY rd35z29+q2/UCoProzd4Mk66wXeWv6n4s5R79OUzjgMLCTVlVaMy4gjPL9NRDwMt7KYRF56g mnoKZwfPDi/oJ5toPPboW94FrMwonqbdqYM2Pyi/HPMe4e396WQ4TaA1CdhyzKHoFSpkGcjX zIQ5yQ5aaGS7wonRu/pg15dbu+8QOgxRNFa0bO+ntz/30u+VmxFqFVbExjuy3Or8fSBhJgx4 cfyrrunKLclpZ/52VeK3l53yWYpR8RaTZfzpu8Ih+ijAY4XLO5F8P1T6sEviMaTY2F0sbFRx ZJXsgFpiKeWPHUn7/LX7qcoFJYoFqG6b3n5km+qy39x6lMgJDuxKpeN6lYj//LB6xVzn0JI+ 4ZHPrEkFqxu8VkL7deCPTI67ZJik18jXjTH9sha1YBvgvxIPFMA7ZwXX2AwNu7PzdcCpWarS usOAHbjQBUsQ+ZPpI1oeFnsCPZ+8/mMcTjVRZyJxOPs3KnXZv2cXNuaa7lwkWS366gHzQI7O l6WdC8TyNjiOzR654cL8BgYQ/xNSW1vTXqPWSRU8/b/5IueY2tQJh0CKIvfoP0rk8976wa1R 8SRi08mwHX7+F5oSeXLRNHicQGpS1f0DywdRcQ0MFHyq/CV4dTltABEBAAGJAh8EGAEIAAkF AllVgYoCGwwACgkQdoOXo5EJFKkDNw//c8nailIVOV72l7Lze+2AuK9MYUCFb1i4qI1WTnG0 OHQlCAltPhdwZPAozJw/eNqIcuWQh8rZspve9ipj589wLSsVyaFRsuYXTiYZ9RlRsnJYa36h 2JML3ZGrRsSxaUEAggbiOKbwmw27JuOIPmC3Gln4tJuZ+nw6cfCgMI45bIzinVanxHwPLeLp BZKpaEYzAwtBykUfAXn3jDwrI95UlMJvhHDFuRgvb6uSyJIqmp5aR/BjnlSdEwICyWpRAVSt yqZeBMeHbCr1B97PIRzk/q0eHm9T+AoiZWwz1iVGGgkYdAaCfs2PBlNHmRm93cfgoEcaGvNb RbTXOe28niMJeYMQsnjOTy5AQIrhVKeP5E+qVs/oPK/inmLiTbjZcnrO2wR+uxpPGgmR6M/3 p8qyRdaOvT87HZXO+Wr+r9A4UnwhCPsfELwPlEo+TJQ/oE71Mlkx/ddQCWELcHjXrQF9YbzA Ml7g0zTkgHysh4DNkV5iYteOcmCwsWdOwn0H0yZfz6weyr8nEdPngyOjFNKMIpcTbeg8866c GxXAJj46dub4VdVwfvMRHfmmRJkjdId7YHWMgz2Kf7S7KPCROLis7WjlOdSS0q2m/7qy9WL/ ZW50YLS8ZZLMrnari5JxCyJX+8n6ZASo2AA93iTbKmYegK2LDwW1QLU1iAF3GyGOnSE= Message-ID: Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:42:06 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; 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FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+a]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.44)[0.442,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.94)[-0.945,0]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[tundraware.com]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.64)[ip: (-2.05), ipnet: 45.55.32.0/19(3.82), asn: 14061(1.47), country: US(-0.05)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14061, ipnet:45.55.32.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2020 22:43:33 -0000 On 2/17/20 10:47 AM, Andreas X wrote: > Hi again, > > The rule:  "65500   0     0 deny ip from table(10) to any"  was almost the last rule and I suspected it, therefore I wanted to move the rule upper, changed the command: > > ${FWCMD} 00350 add deny all from table\(10\) to any > > (adding rule number 00350), now ipfw successfully blocks the IPs in the table.  > My question is, why it didn't block the IPs when it had rule number 65500? (It might be the last rules, but still, it has "deny" command..shouldn't it do the job?) > > Thank you. I'm not sure, but you're using two different rules: deny ip from table(10) to any vs. add deny all from table\(10\) to any For sure, the first form is broken because you have to escape the parenthesis. Also, you 1st rule only blocks IP traffic, not ICMP like ping (I think, not sure). Any ipfw experts care to weigh in on this? -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tim Daneliuk tundra@tundraware.com PGP Key: http://www.tundraware.com/PGP/ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 01:15:50 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06CBE24C80E for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 01:15:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yasu@utahime.org) Received: from gate.utahime.jp (gate.utahime.jp [183.180.29.210]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48M2wg4n65z444W for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 01:15:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yasu@utahime.org) Received: from eastasia.home.utahime.org (eastasia.home.utahime.org [192.168.174.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by gate.utahime.jp (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 09057529F9 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 10:15:38 +0900 (JST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=utahime.org; s=maybe2019112701; t=1581988538; bh=U1AilB8a2V0guO+LO44Vr+kUQ46ckWZxxqgimNdGM5Y=; h=Date:To:Subject:From; b=SHrjujskhCryaOr8a4ICw4qZd/zYXVU/mCG2gKloR/FG3FJ+iNWo6glZxTMCIrnFF SVnHBe0tD4ZwCCjvww4G/6psc2jwrUjlHJ2VwJVUvJTq4+OqAHOsRyTFBLWw1sd8Tk llcwQr3jLyHwivtMTitVDX/q/QU5gtRJ21A8RCfOok1M5bMv6+yOtSZJx9/K2Tj8nU WBaRS92PAQqEpPnK+GKWFs2ElDqUPqdzTvri6qUl5jH5QdPBG67K2sTA5DGJ1TRZX+ oTNXgneLeAMmvJiy3HB8Rw88/BkeTBLYGao91kERFIEysetCqgPfyafbpJLmlBNUfJ BlHnlHk0ZpK9g== Received: from localhost (rolling.home.utahime.org [192.168.174.11]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by eastasia.home.utahime.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id DC7CCF23F; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 10:15:36 +0900 (JST) X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.102.2 at eastasia.home.utahime.org Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 10:14:20 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20200218.101420.353584891979293358.yasu@utahime.org> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: How to build and install only part of base source tree From: Yasuhiro KIMURA X-Mailer: Mew version 6.8 on Emacs 26.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48M2wg4n65z444W X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=utahime.org header.s=maybe2019112701 header.b=SHrjujsk; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of yasu@utahime.org designates 183.180.29.210 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=yasu@utahime.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.28 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[utahime.org:s=maybe2019112701]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.21)[-0.211,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+a:spf-authorized.utahime.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.89)[-0.890,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[utahime.org]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[utahime.org:+]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(0.38)[ip: (0.21), ipnet: 183.180.0.0/16(0.10), asn: 2519(1.53), country: JP(0.04)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:2519, ipnet:183.180.0.0/16, country:JP]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 01:15:50 -0000 Hello, I would like to add new feature to base system. My idea is simple but I'm not sure if it can be implemented as is expected. Therefore I think some trial and error will be necessary. To test it I need to (1) Edit some C source files. (2) Build and install one command and some library files. And doing buildworld and installworld each time I change source files is too heavy to repeat. Then are there any way to build and install only part of base source tree? Best Regards. --- Yasuhiro KIMURA From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 03:23:53 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42805251ADA for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 03:23:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-ot1-x333.google.com (mail-ot1-x333.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::333]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48M5mQ6vyyz4L5Q for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 03:23:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-ot1-x333.google.com with SMTP id z9so18170852oth.5 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:23:50 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=SmmrkeFr2UH+V1XVupfPyMbWkCiTdh7jfbBq76v+4q4=; b=M9Qy84pcUmvv8s2IRVNQuB+GRSKP4NKHEKhFj/p1PZI96UwB399hgPCRzj7KehvFNa /aOmJ+VFJVHLDdJEdiP6FR72kCM/QoFsl5l463fIJWWY4bA8kT83TBNp6oZUD40SCBmh /w5Ju4nFXPyKm3KCcd6Mkti1IaFm5oSAFVi//IlltfZ6WLCD/hDqeORNyAPKLqXP2I7+ DPTnKJF1M91BizGXF4esP9z8lzaABQ0udKqQiHx9cgpQzCVhOax43DwolT18oBEH+Z6/ koFnT9OsC1xSd3ZI4Ir6lXc3jF+8snVk85AAED3ZS4gjJGhAOzz+5kZcZZFIpVkp89cB 5rFA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=SmmrkeFr2UH+V1XVupfPyMbWkCiTdh7jfbBq76v+4q4=; b=Z4SUjIGd6wZdaIKn38TnEK7WOlvbbwT0oC6c2jPE8U7wS/vTnHvnJVbbR+pm2gU4BY Uui+Q+y/FxDtWXh63sDDhNwE1hKDEfaVXXyP6NG70QJ78+OPtrkI6LYFPXPqwt64rhHG 0zlo68XqwxXYcVmo2RSGxWkr4SyhfLzlOETKagCj0yxpZSIv7wD/1rotZBFpABctvlWI KLML71bJTOdY2pzeKhuNsO5MPPrOS+MlxRYNFQVDyZXtBmzl8jnUmCUoNZ0LzXgXM3gY MCz2BWre7XigK0UDAF87z3smdlmUXFq+q96uQHI6iWkohyoV9qxcaIhr73K0DEv/cyLV ffFA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXBBx43MJLvC04Kr44SOoPLoFCt/r58FrpDC03ZZaRq3Qyy2EZL oZzW2ZdclWaBdbp2yaTcORLkRhNkhms= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxRq6WgRK60WGPh9MACvCJCKr4RudrLOGpHXSd2ndAki1YDgf8gLzfuinugPV0fzJ/KYcRUYA== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6830:88:: with SMTP id a8mr1179572oto.177.1581996228702; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:23:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-oi1-f169.google.com (mail-oi1-f169.google.com. [209.85.167.169]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id w8sm886829ote.80.2020.02.17.19.23.48 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:23:48 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-oi1-f169.google.com with SMTP id q84so18759711oic.4; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:23:48 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:aca:d5d3:: with SMTP id m202mr11342oig.161.1581996227644; Mon, 17 Feb 2020 19:23:47 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 04:23:35 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List , FreeBSD Stable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48M5mQ6vyyz4L5Q X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=M9Qy84pc; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::333) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.48 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.3.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(-2.18)[ip: (-7.30), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 03:23:53 -0000 Why so short End-Of-Life? Why so many fast and short releases? What for? Why pushing problems to production? What was wrong with having one well tested stable system for a long time? 12.0 was a problematic release. 12.1 brings even more problems. To be honest X11 Video Acceleration DRM mess and dramatic Virtualization with VirtualBox brings back my MacBook to the desk because FreeBSD does not seem to be reliable desktop environment anymore even on a decent modern machine :-( Is it really necessary? What happened to FreeBSD? :-( Tomek On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 12:14 AM FreeBSD Security Officer wrote: > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA512 > > Dear FreeBSD community, > > As of February 29, 2020, FreeBSD 12.0 will reach end-of-life and will no longer > be supported by the FreeBSD Security Team. Users of FreeBSD 12.0 are strongly > encouraged to upgrade to a newer release as soon as possible. > > The currently supported branches and releases and their expected end-of-life > dates are: > > +--------------------------------------------------------------------------+ > | Branch | Release | Release Date | Estimated EoL | > +-------------+--------------+-------------------+-------------------------+ > | stable/12 | N/A | N/A | June 30, 2024 | > +-------------+--------------+-------------------+-------------------------+ > | releng/12.1 | 12.1-RELEASE | November 4, 2019 | 12.2-RELEASE + 3 months | > +-------------+--------------+-------------------+-------------------------+ > | stable/11 | N/A | N/A | September 30, 2021 | > +-------------+--------------+-------------------+-------------------------+ > | releng/11.3 | 11.3-RELEASE | July 9, 2019 | 11.4-RELEASE + 3 months | > +--------------------------------------------------------------------------+ > > Please refer to https://security.freebsd.org/ for an up-to-date list of > supported releases and the latest security advisories. > > - -- > The FreeBSD Security Team > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > > iQKTBAEBCgB9FiEE/A6HiuWv54gCjWNV05eS9J6n5cIFAl5LHZNfFIAAAAAALgAo > aXNzdWVyLWZwckBub3RhdGlvbnMub3BlbnBncC5maWZ0aGhvcnNlbWFuLm5ldEZD > MEU4NzhBRTVBRkU3ODgwMjhENjM1NUQzOTc5MkY0OUVBN0U1QzIACgkQ05eS9J6n > 5cIqyA//ROIFtIsEDV5p02FnWClgWu3qxZ4uRyA0usM1DtZPBYjtfsFGdAU+9NvY > EsUB3rVjWx2HNoHKySFgjLbtGdCNoae45pjLe3UiKgrbQZwXCdUl0d1y+4ZcoR0D > cdtEY6YWio4kBHTWxd0cgCpe+Cmk3nQRB005qgvMkkCBNBGuZQcQS62CMMis3IWC > paMcRBmzkh9HMW8e9XN2mFjGJbT2HKzY+y/Qvj3NhxenYgTzQbVwRDz4JPKz7Al+ > aVq2gLEuEgRWNFG+fBnk7qikzmV7JaXI+j/ImZnrMFBDC/ymiQMbQdt0Kxv0TsZF > ajR18pQyoAONXoJs875HD54/Rj0rQNkKwyZNKuka5+NWR/6d9H52+iytkGqn2DLR > Jp9slPHBW5ofC7WlgAAeV+S1Et7fWeV96hqDVRUXZstir6hM3hYEdwnQP8aFaYO9 > No+uLd6IAKBtBCK9hxOv6O6lmWjNk4LWQb6keG+zwFDCfnILdfwVE+eML7GqLzQ1 > 5s40M7gZsB//1S27WQOhKS4Vea+68meGOzGv0KkMd4gNuV/cBqVoCj52Muu3O0gK > nbMuFHptQbL0qhFGzho4chg4TsuXs0lf28BsHYYFeEewEce7gIwCgPLQPIwLQG4h > cv7KkgwEetngUUlyMaeKu2xCUXTaDJ3KpFkwEcol1oezaWkduwg= > =viBR > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-announce@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-announce > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-announce-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 05:19:06 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35440254CC8; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 05:19:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ozgur@kazancci.com) Received: from relay10.mail.gandi.net (relay10.mail.gandi.net [217.70.178.230]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48M8KM3mytz3L9F; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 05:19:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ozgur@kazancci.com) Received: from sogo15.sd4.0x35.net (sogo15.sd4.0x35.net [10.200.201.65]) (Authenticated sender: ozgur@kazancci.com) by relay10.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 7EF97240005; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 05:19:00 +0000 (UTC) From: =?utf-8?q?ozgur=40kazancci=2Ecom?= In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" X-Forward: 127.0.0.1 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 06:19:00 +0100 Cc: "FreeBSD Questions Mailing List" , "FreeBSD Stable" To: "Tomasz CEDRO" MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <7264-5e4b7400-b-26698180@122867346> Subject: =?utf-8?q?Re=3A?==?utf-8?q?_=5BFreeBSD-Announce=5D?= FreeBSD =?utf-8?q?12=2E0?= end-of-life User-Agent: SOGoMail 4.3.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48M8KM3mytz3L9F X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ozgur@kazancci.com designates 217.70.178.230 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ozgur@kazancci.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.04 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.83)[-0.832,0]; FROM_DN_EQ_ADDR(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:217.70.178.192/26]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kazancci.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; SUBJ_EXCESS_QP(1.20)[]; FROM_EXCESS_QP(1.20)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[230.178.70.217.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:29169, ipnet:217.70.176.0/20, country:FR]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; IP_SCORE(-1.63)[ip: (-5.29), ipnet: 217.70.176.0/20(-1.58), asn: 29169(-1.28), country: FR(0.00)]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[230.178.70.217.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 05:19:06 -0000 "Why so short End-Of-Life? Why so many fast and short releases? What fo= r?" That's the question of the century. I got the very same question as abo= ve. I hate bitchin' about Open-Source free stuff, but that's really too= much. Very short EoL - so many releases, it's head-aching (a.k.a. shak= ing). --- =C3=96zg=C3=BCr Kazancci, https://ozgur.kazancci.com On 18 February, 2020 06:23 +03, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: = > Why so short End-Of-Life? Why so many fast and short releases? What f= or? > > Why pushing problems to production? What was wrong with having one > well tested stable system for a long time? > > 12.0 was a problematic release. 12.1 brings even more problems. > > To be honest X11 Video Acceleration DRM mess and dramatic > Virtualization with VirtualBox brings back my MacBook to the desk > because FreeBSD does not seem to be reliable desktop environment > anymore even on a decent modern machine :-( > > Is it really necessary? What happened to FreeBSD? :-( > > Tomek > > > On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 12:14 AM FreeBSD Security Officer wrote: > > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > > Hash: SHA512 > > > > Dear FreeBSD community, > > > > As of February 29, 2020, FreeBSD 12.0 will reach end-of-life and wi= ll no longer > > be supported by the FreeBSD Security Team. Users of FreeBSD 12.0 a= re strongly > > encouraged to upgrade to a newer release as soon as possible. > > > > The currently supported branches and releases and their expected en= d-of-life > > dates are: > > > > +-----------------------------------------------------------------= ---------+ > > | Branch | Release | Release Date | Estimated = EoL | > > +-------------+--------------+-------------------+----------------= ---------+ > > | stable/12 | N/A | N/A | June 30, 2024 = | > > +-------------+--------------+-------------------+----------------= ---------+ > > | releng/12.1 | 12.1-RELEASE | November 4, 2019 | 12.2-RELEASE + = 3 months | > > +-------------+--------------+-------------------+----------------= ---------+ > > | stable/11 | N/A | N/A | September 30, 2= 021 | > > +-------------+--------------+-------------------+----------------= ---------+ > > | releng/11.3 | 11.3-RELEASE | July 9, 2019 | 11.4-RELEASE + = 3 months | > > +-----------------------------------------------------------------= ---------+ > > > > Please refer to https://security.freebsd.org/ for an up-to-date lis= t of > > supported releases and the latest security advisories. > > > > - -- > > The FreeBSD Security Team > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > > > > iQKTBAEBCgB9FiEE/A6HiuWv54gCjWNV05eS9J6n5cIFAl5LHZNfFIAAAAAALgAo > > aXNzdWVyLWZwckBub3RhdGlvbnMub3BlbnBncC5maWZ0aGhvcnNlbWFuLm5ldEZD > > MEU4NzhBRTVBRkU3ODgwMjhENjM1NUQzOTc5MkY0OUVBN0U1QzIACgkQ05eS9J6n > > 5cIqyA//ROIFtIsEDV5p02FnWClgWu3qxZ4uRyA0usM1DtZPBYjtfsFGdAU+9NvY > > EsUB3rVjWx2HNoHKySFgjLbtGdCNoae45pjLe3UiKgrbQZwXCdUl0d1y+4ZcoR0D > > cdtEY6YWio4kBHTWxd0cgCpe+Cmk3nQRB005qgvMkkCBNBGuZQcQS62CMMis3IWC > > paMcRBmzkh9HMW8e9XN2mFjGJbT2HKzY+y/Qvj3NhxenYgTzQbVwRDz4JPKz7Al+ > > aVq2gLEuEgRWNFG+fBnk7qikzmV7JaXI+j/ImZnrMFBDC/ymiQMbQdt0Kxv0TsZF > > ajR18pQyoAONXoJs875HD54/Rj0rQNkKwyZNKuka5+NWR/6d9H52+iytkGqn2DLR > > Jp9slPHBW5ofC7WlgAAeV+S1Et7fWeV96hqDVRUXZstir6hM3hYEdwnQP8aFaYO9 > > No+uLd6IAKBtBCK9hxOv6O6lmWjNk4LWQb6keG+zwFDCfnILdfwVE+eML7GqLzQ1 > > 5s40M7gZsB//1S27WQOhKS4Vea+68meGOzGv0KkMd4gNuV/cBqVoCj52Muu3O0gK > > nbMuFHptQbL0qhFGzho4chg4TsuXs0lf28BsHYYFeEewEce7gIwCgPLQPIwLQG4h > > cv7KkgwEetngUUlyMaeKu2xCUXTaDJ3KpFkwEcol1oezaWkduwg=3D > > =3DviBR > > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= > > freebsd-announce@freebsd.org mailing list > > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-announce > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-announce-unsubscribe@free= bsd.org" > > > > -- > CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freeb= sd.org" From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 07:12:56 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A65062572E9; 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NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.95)[-0.953,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[web.de]; DWL_DNSWL_LOW(-1.00)[web.de.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; FROM_NO_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_HTML_ONLY(0.20)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 07:12:56 -0000 From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 07:34:50 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 602B525773D for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 07:34:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from trond.endrestol@ximalas.info) Received: from enterprise.ximalas.info (enterprise.ximalas.info [IPv6:2001:700:1100:1::8]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "ximalas.info", Issuer "Hostmaster ximalas.info" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MCL04Nhdz4HXK for ; 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Tue, 18 Feb 2020 08:34:34 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from trond.endrestol@ximalas.info) X-Authentication-Warning: enterprise.ximalas.info: trond owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 08:34:34 +0100 (CET) From: =?UTF-8?Q?Trond_Endrest=C3=B8l?= Sender: Trond.Endrestol@ximalas.info To: Tim Daneliuk cc: FreeBSD Mailing List Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> User-Agent: Alpine 2.22 (BSF 395 2020-01-19) OpenPGP: url=http://ximalas.info/about/tronds-openpgp-public-key MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.2 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,DKIM_VALID_EF autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on enterprise.ximalas.info X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MCL04Nhdz4HXK X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=ximalas.info header.s=default header.b=bRZHP8G4; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=ximalas.info; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of trond.endrestol@ximalas.info designates 2001:700:1100:1::8 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=trond.endrestol@ximalas.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.02 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.998,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[ximalas.info:s=default]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+a]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/mixed,text/plain]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[ximalas.info:+]; CTYPE_MIXED_BOGUS(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[ximalas.info,none]; IP_SCORE(-2.02)[ip: (-8.02), ipnet: 2001:700::/32(-1.36), asn: 224(-0.73), country: NO(-0.01)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:224, ipnet:2001:700::/32, country:NO]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 07:34:50 -0000 On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:42-0600, Tim Daneliuk wrote: > On 2/17/20 10:47 AM, Andreas X wrote: > > Hi again, > > > > The rule:  "65500   0     0 deny ip from table(10) to any"  was almost the last rule and I suspected it, therefore I wanted to move the rule upper, changed the command: > > > > ${FWCMD} 00350 add deny all from table\(10\) to any > > > > (adding rule number 00350), now ipfw successfully blocks the IPs in the table.  > > My question is, why it didn't block the IPs when it had rule number 65500? (It might be the last rules, but still, it has "deny" command..shouldn't it do the job?) > > > > Thank you. > > I'm not sure, but you're using two different rules: > > deny ip from table(10) to any > > vs. > > add deny all from table\(10\) to any > > For sure, the first form is broken because you have to escape the parenthesis. True. > Also, you 1st rule only blocks IP traffic, not ICMP like ping (I think, not sure). "ip" or "all" matches both IPv4 and IPv6, regardless of the protocols higher up. Thus, these two rules are equivalent: deny all from table\(10\) to any deny ip from table\(10\) to any Escaping the parenthesis is still required. > Any ipfw experts care to weigh in on this? ipfw(8) sure is handy. -- Trond. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 09:20:14 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 010D32597E4 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:20:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) Received: from s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com (s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com [142.0.176.198]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MFgd08Hlz4GJF for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:20:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=email-od.com;i=@email-od.com;s=dkim; c=relaxed/relaxed; q=dns/txt; t=1582017613; x=1584609613; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:message-id:subject:cc:to:from:date:x-thread-info; bh=D3UVGxC9v1aF4cYqlsNFjykT0vrA8sAj49SSadnj1p8=; b=Q8sLvYhXruEsaECWVyIIjHTJ252ph+GLhO0ZMNhAHIoDfxS5POsqwDkg9RkHK3Nbwm9NGf0ci4VrJ40Jg9SCpYVIyRxJiAK67MM1lCUfidiHjBbDQxc+mPg2kXWBEM++wuYvp3VUYsylFlfwliaZBp3Rjr7/UnRvfDZ/M1qLuAw= X-Thread-Info: NDI1MC4xMi43NDAwMDAwMDg4Yjc5NC5mcmVlYnNkLXF1ZXN0aW9ucz1mcmVlYnNkLm9yZw== Received: from r3.us-east-2.aws.in.socketlabs.com (r3.us-east-2.aws.in.socketlabs.com [142.0.189.3]) by mxsg2.email-od.com with ESMTP(version=Tls12 cipher=Aes256 bits=256); Tue, 18 Feb 2020 04:20:02 -0500 Received: from smtp.lan.sohara.org (EMTPY [185.202.17.215]) by r3.us-east-2.aws.in.socketlabs.com with ESMTP(version=Tls12 cipher=Aes256 bits=256); Tue, 18 Feb 2020 04:20:01 -0500 Received: from [192.168.63.1] (helo=steve.lan.sohara.org) by smtp.lan.sohara.org with smtp (Exim 4.92.3 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1j3z2t-0005TR-N4; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:19:59 +0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:19:59 +0000 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith To: Tomasz CEDRO Cc: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List , FreeBSD Stable Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-Id: <20200218091959.b0220ac75bcfbbced91a5708@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd12.0) X-Clacks-Overhead: "GNU Terry Pratchett" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MFgd08Hlz4GJF X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=email-od.com header.s=dkim header.b=Q8sLvYhX; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com designates 142.0.176.198 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.89 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.99)[-0.987,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[email-od.com:s=dkim]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:142.0.176.0/20]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[sohara.org]; FORGED_SENDER_VERP_SRS(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[email-od.com:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[198.176.0.142.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.15.0]; ENVFROM_VERP(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.09)[ip: (-0.25), ipnet: 142.0.176.0/22(0.52), asn: 7381(0.26), country: US(-0.05)]; FORGED_SENDER(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7381, ipnet:142.0.176.0/22, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:20:14 -0000 On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 04:23:35 +0100 Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > Why so short End-Of-Life? Why so many fast and short releases? What for? The new(ish) release and support policy has been announced and well documented, this should come as no surprise to anyone. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 10:36:57 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3A4D25B342 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 10:36:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-oi1-x241.google.com (mail-oi1-x241.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::241]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MHN82Tj6z41GT for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 10:36:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-oi1-x241.google.com with SMTP id d62so19572793oia.11 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 02:36:56 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=4mYI+Hdpz75qL0D13rLlhJlYghal2gJGoBMyuEFLvh4=; b=Wv3KWlCWpUDkcm+xNVIiZbOsyzopk3+GnWN4CHdhiEf95bfILf4EN7k1NUIhNTYKR1 jgsE7zDk2d4qoASZIH3OEkiSMkuRhoForXzn+m8qFzU5ld8uxAaWPd+x2KYKdw+yZGUN 0sShtBzQxEhMspOVUyPW20gKiVQ89igbMb+zy5N1LDfHQzsOoD8takjLcWYATz7jpd4K ICfuJrP1NT9PVVOjvpGfl/DD1EWASweeR2x8gwHJC0TyXUFLXqxLPT04l6ps/9CuPkdk JZ6bxv7r+MnqUzlaiGpYHU6oh8BWSwHkq5RFeV0sHSv70TJJJs3wTcn6Deou69xLhf9+ 8oxw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=4mYI+Hdpz75qL0D13rLlhJlYghal2gJGoBMyuEFLvh4=; b=ghdWgFXu+8xsHgszy7q9Wsz1CDSoVf6mHS+0upzk0s+KiGlAqol2grYdjVL3vu+uKL NIw7cVimek8FxHLDxAqk/0XqN4jDs8hKoE7izOBIRxZVYD/gfBTaB+zXJGVV0KZ6YoMT 1UvqJ3V29SYFK2pJqr1ZujyRST+VT20cZ2mtv9SWJOIlSKeC+8G3W19Tl9O1S9fFRODi az7MyNLxo6ecrGfNQk+totLD53RruHE6wSRJCdUfcBeBwp9y5zy1lXCU1Fe5tQcjyAGC zKqefUHMD7rqwy1TecPB7ib7efvMsPEp+y1MrieeYjt0Q0YjXIHdLc1DcXi9FGfNxIru l2lw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWfrccwZPL7JM0TxA9Y0TRjGH2gwLP67N3QmFtRSzW00b63XM2E yygqaMznrMkrS1HLegbtkznYZFh5Ftw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqz3btvkh60PANrp175xJWHs9o+Rr/RhPeaf2VQZwM4II4mS0PIOUhUqeh6sA1WiJHeAC0un0A== X-Received: by 2002:aca:cc07:: with SMTP id c7mr743180oig.165.1582022214715; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 02:36:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ot1-f50.google.com (mail-ot1-f50.google.com. [209.85.210.50]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id j24sm1233149otk.7.2020.02.18.02.36.53 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 18 Feb 2020 02:36:54 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ot1-f50.google.com with SMTP id w6so9847282otk.0; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 02:36:53 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a9d:7d87:: with SMTP id j7mr14616219otn.159.1582022213314; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 02:36:53 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200218091959.b0220ac75bcfbbced91a5708@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: <20200218091959.b0220ac75bcfbbced91a5708@sohara.org> From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 11:36:43 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: "Steve O'Hara-Smith" Cc: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List , FreeBSD Stable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MHN82Tj6z41GT X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=Wv3KWlCW; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::241) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.59 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; URI_COUNT_ODD(1.00)[3]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[1.4.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; IP_SCORE(-0.29)[ip: (2.15), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 10:36:57 -0000 wt., 18 lut 2020, 10:20 u=C5=BCytkownik Steve O'Hara-Smith napisa=C5=82: > On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 04:23:35 +0100 > Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > > Why so short End-Of-Life? Why so many fast and short releases? What for= ? > > The new(ish) release and support policy has been announced and we= ll > documented, this should come as no surprise to anyone. > > -- > Steve O'Hara-Smith > True.. but the surprise is the Linux like bleeding edge in BSD and the quality degradation at a degree that I have just replaced my FreeBSD laptop with a MacBook :-( Maybe its a time to give OpenBSD a try.. -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 11:00:22 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8354025BDE7 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 11:00:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) Received: from mail.covisp.net (mail.covisp.net [65.121.55.42]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MHv94fW9z4bKk for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 11:00:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) From: "@lbutlr" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 04:00:18 -0700 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> To: FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MHv94fW9z4bKk X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kremels@kreme.com designates 65.121.55.42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kremels@kreme.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.26 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.80)[-0.803,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; MISSING_MIME_VERSION(2.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kreme.com]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.992,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.07)[ip: (-0.24), ipnet: 65.112.0.0/12(-0.00), asn: 209(-0.04), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_ZERO(0.00)[0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[42.55.121.65.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:209, ipnet:65.112.0.0/12, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 11:00:22 -0000 On 17 Feb 2020, at 20:23, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > Why so short End-Of-Life? Why so many fast and short releases? What = for? This was vcovered a few years ago (well, =E2=80=9Cfew=E2=80=9D when the = new timelines were being discussed. > What was wrong with having one well tested stable system for a long = time? The need to ensure systems are running secure software and are not = trivially exploitable. > FreeBSD does not seem to be reliable desktop environment True for ever non-Apple Unix variant. Most (that is to say nearly all) = FreeBSD installs are non0desktop servers. --=20 I WILL NOT CARVE GODS Bart chalkboard Ep. 8F11 From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 12:45:52 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA7D125F78F for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 12:45:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: from mail-vs1-xe36.google.com (mail-vs1-xe36.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e36]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MLDt305Rz3Gtt for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 12:45:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: by mail-vs1-xe36.google.com with SMTP id t12so12540553vso.13 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 04:45:49 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=ktzbNxiTiFRNMWlIFSkiZlzEEDk6w3lwD64I75zDR20=; b=nIIEMrQ75yC5j0LOPcBP6Wi02MtBWv0bGSRL8pYQ5n7ZJ/74wasfpKsZS6FgOQkulh GkWwsn3Nc9p59MCsua75lMmPAWoqDi3IQt6wJ8TitRCJpagl2FPp8r4IWBsVA31czUog E+bPsD4m0h9X0xdth9gD5rSbc3QEHXFAuvTcgAJ8vC8Dt9UNd4VBPhVBM0Q5W/XRcu9w s89iOjtpQAnO7IOO6m46cO3u7GHBIiao82bJ6UWadQJdxI2Z2PV5VEV8hCrBa00FGqqP 6BpDaByRxfpl488Y8zp6X69h/u+owH3tjKWA51JE/aLatfGVrN1NZp5uOLtDAvtbHlYu qjKQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ktzbNxiTiFRNMWlIFSkiZlzEEDk6w3lwD64I75zDR20=; b=NCGYkyWLo4d7s0eqrQUHEqXq4FS0+4coL8dHlZ+f5YI57HJ4bqoU4vplCl/J1+kwhD OlGi8SaUSMSTJoPGrnmgdp/Pa54WxkJ27rBaITKCZ1FxCg3Z+j37aANbu6wbK2Bgd949 MADXtzv0MOjGGN4f+sbwF9kE9+hG5cjf86otigTZ+qWG1xg5rY/7F4YlxPNWmrsGslbF zrw9qLWllHQnKFHqfww7MyyV3Qx6zXnCr23+ln8JjIi8N0rljEG7P7NUxTpFtF1E0iOi samnvZvcI75ESUgmP9lI1TXuyMCt2n8EHY9wQQi1mBel4243lD/Ub+Er5FeN+v8XU8ya dtaw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXBqx1wsKR//pAWKbsf28nuEpHXjHEN7UHwKIbcl5L5K6nkRJs9 12GndWWfH1OpHv/Qr3MW+93pUh7L9GQCb7E6Dcp7zaRK X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyq0Qagtz48DiVOu8SfjJCf9OwD/FMPoUjp4SZzh9TftTLxy6HIQX1aD9lbWbi8Wg+8Y7b5fdn/+aRjdi1VZFo= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6102:485:: with SMTP id n5mr10689045vsa.149.1582029948590; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 04:45:48 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> In-Reply-To: From: Andreas X Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 15:45:38 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? To: =?UTF-8?Q?Trond_Endrest=C3=B8l?= Cc: Tim Daneliuk , FreeBSD Mailing List X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MLDt305Rz3Gtt X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=nIIEMrQ7; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of hamdi20193d@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::e36 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=hamdi20193d@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.00 / 15.00]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; URI_COUNT_ODD(1.00)[3]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.58), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[6.3.e.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 12:45:52 -0000 Thank you all for your replies, "For sure, the first form is broken because you have to escape the parenthesis." As I stated earlier, that was just the output of: ipfw show | grep "table" command. root@test:~ # ipfw show | grep "table" 00350 17065 1026829 deny ip from table(10) to any My script blocks the IPs I wanted to, ONLY if I set the rule number to *earlier* numbers, such as: ${FWCMD} 00350 add deny all from table\(10\) to any Question is: If I don't add the rule number 00350 to that command, that rule gets located to 65000s, and ipfw doesn't block the IPs in table, at all. I wanted to ask why such react, shouldn't IPFW still do the job (deny) even if the rule number belongs to last ones? Thank you! Trond Endrest=C3=B8l , 18 =C5=9Eub 2020 Sal, = 10:35 tarihinde =C5=9Funu yazd=C4=B1: > On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 16:42-0600, Tim Daneliuk wrote: > > > On 2/17/20 10:47 AM, Andreas X wrote: > > > Hi again, > > > > > > The rule: "65500 0 0 deny ip from table(10) to any" was > almost the last rule and I suspected it, therefore I wanted to move the > rule upper, changed the command: > > > > > > ${FWCMD} 00350 add deny all from table\(10\) to any > > > > > > (adding rule number 00350), now ipfw successfully blocks the IPs in > the table. > > > My question is, why it didn't block the IPs when it had rule number > 65500? (It might be the last rules, but still, it has "deny" > command..shouldn't it do the job?) > > > > > > Thank you. > > > > I'm not sure, but you're using two different rules: > > > > deny ip from table(10) to any > > > > vs. > > > > add deny all from table\(10\) to any > > > > For sure, the first form is broken because you have to escape the > parenthesis. > > True. > > > Also, you 1st rule only blocks IP traffic, not ICMP like ping (I think, > not sure). > > "ip" or "all" matches both IPv4 and IPv6, regardless of the protocols > higher up. Thus, these two rules are equivalent: > > deny all from table\(10\) to any > deny ip from table\(10\) to any > > Escaping the parenthesis is still required. > > > Any ipfw experts care to weigh in on this? > > ipfw(8) sure is handy. > > -- > Trond. > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to " > freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 13:27:20 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D877B239134 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 13:27:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from roberthuff@rcn.com) Received: from smtp.rcn.com (smtp.rcn.com [69.168.97.78]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MM8l1grmz4Xkl for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 13:27:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from roberthuff@rcn.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; d=rcn.com; s=20180516; c=relaxed/simple; q=dns/txt; i=@rcn.com; t=1582032438; h=From:Subject:Date:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; bh=EBkb5TQBgtK5/ndf4tj8pGXHpVA=; b=QedL047AREFTFoCYV0u6ObGTF0i9uq3Bh/i8k4K/qnsOowsDT07eRBgfbwKf97u3 12Yv4ZY5DisznsueNe8IcwmeXNSd8xVwzOk3V6StJKjj+ESwC/Fy1kRciVZxAT54 3PJD3CeqoNQnUBV63o7s4pNS9FB5sVZLX2+hQ2YGDa5+gw0a2tYTKyIUbdepOcAj sy4OAJaVTfUD/jSU+k0iXDzPfoIIiHFZ32XbhGQY0ItYt6Jgnua6YBYDYHMUfsHY bcvoiMD3mFjO/8Iuz9l2cyOFB0ofN9JX2xvUD5IVXGDGWKXaB03i91/qAXlI9gGY NaqK+ZSgUHLYj5zcqGNeYQ==; X_CMAE_Category: , , X-CNFS-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=bugy+3Si c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=9TgA2UwI6Wy+6BV4wQM/cQ==:117 a=9TgA2UwI6Wy+6BV4wQM/cQ==:17 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=KGjhK52YXX0A:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=XRQyMpdBKAEA:10 a=l697ptgUJYAA:10 a=48faUk6PgeAA:10 a=cl4OvlJKoLT-LbJWh84A:9 a=uJqDaDxzHuFOSMNw:21 a=5N4oX0JsD_lUJjDJ:21 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 X-CM-Score: 0 X-Scanned-by: Cloudmark Authority Engine X-Authed-Username: cm9iZXJ0aHVmZkByY24uY29t Received: from [209.6.230.48] ([209.6.230.48:12105] helo=jerusalem.litteratus.org.litteratus.org) by smtp.rcn.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.25.56547 r(Core:3.6.25.0)) with ESMTPSA (cipher=AES256-GCM-SHA384) id E8/69-56402-536EB4E5; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 08:27:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <24139.58932.915276.752500@jerusalem.litteratus.org> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 08:27:16 -0500 From: Robert Huff To: Andreas X Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?Trond_Endrest=C3=B8l?= , Tim Daneliuk , FreeBSD Mailing List Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? In-Reply-To: References: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> X-Mailer: VM 8.2.0b under 26.3 (amd64-portbld-freebsd13.0) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MM8l1grmz4Xkl X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=rcn.com header.s=20180516 header.b=QedL047A; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=rcn.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of roberthuff@rcn.com designates 69.168.97.78 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=roberthuff@rcn.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.59 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[rcn.com:s=20180516]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:69.168.97.0/24]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-1.49)[ip: (-9.27), ipnet: 69.168.97.0/24(1.02), asn: 36271(0.87), country: US(-0.05)]; DWL_DNSWL_LOW(-1.00)[rcn.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[rcn.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[rcn.com,none]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[78.97.168.69.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36271, ipnet:69.168.97.0/24, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 13:27:20 -0000 Andreas X writes: > Question is: If I don't add the rule number 00350 to that command, > that rule gets located to 65000s, and ipfw doesn't block the IPs in > table, at all. I wanted to ask why such react, shouldn't IPFW still > do the job (deny) even if the rule number belongs to last ones? I am not an IPFW expert ... but: It is my understanding IPFW stops processing a packet after the first rule that matches that packet. Am I wrong? If not, this suggests somewhere between rule 351 and rule 650000(-ish) is a rule that matches the packet and keeps it from getting processed by anything lower in the list. Would you be willing to publish your entire IPFW ruleset? Respectfully, Robert Huff From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 13:36:44 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 699B523974D for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 13:36:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) Received: from mail.covisp.net (mail.covisp.net [65.121.55.42]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MMMb2pPnz3KKW for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 13:36:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) From: "@lbutlr" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 06:36:40 -0700 References: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> To: FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MMMb2pPnz3KKW X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kremels@kreme.com designates 65.121.55.42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kremels@kreme.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.44 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.98)[-0.977,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kreme.com]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.07)[ip: (-0.24), ipnet: 65.112.0.0/12(-0.00), asn: 209(-0.04), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_ZERO(0.00)[0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[42.55.121.65.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:209, ipnet:65.112.0.0/12, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 13:36:44 -0000 On 18 Feb 2020, at 05:45, Andreas X wrote: > Question is: If I don't add the rule number 00350 to that command, that > rule gets located to 65000s, and ipfw doesn't block the IPs in table, at > all. I wanted to ask why such react, shouldn't IPFW still do the job (deny) > even if the rule number belongs to last ones? Depends on all the other rules. -- 'You're wizards!' she [Esk] screamed. 'Bloody well wizz!' --Equal Rites From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 14:00:39 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11E2B23A40C for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:00:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: from mail-vs1-xe29.google.com (mail-vs1-xe29.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e29]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MMvB1LYDz4FQQ for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:00:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from hamdi20193d@gmail.com) Received: by mail-vs1-xe29.google.com with SMTP id r18so13028759vso.5 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 06:00:37 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=4c/AEo5qAtZmpuJjj0fH1qDhbkmesTH2MsNx/uKxXYo=; b=rRoaZMf5oJYtITrgUjgz/nPm7O6h5kDzZSiryxkEklgJuW6l/GjYy5Ba605cfWp0kA QW3dVkJUP93stQTM6Tx3hfHdOMKlLeS8I0AwMK2j3svA5wFw9dgN+LgGIGhcpP8KW2He EtAUWN/L06r2d2qMxbR21VsCNKpJLPgG+Irlh3Brebn1XmtvJTpR3kGP12KM5oe7XZM2 N1Nt8lbMa8PNteZ72G2ZD/QgH6wBk+oD0vAR3DboVO5lGqmWrxvJuqdQ4fcY+tgYbHdH j5T8gutX51TbPtoAjG85YB0DiOafx4ys0bMHB9gCsaG+fQ24RQUYhlsZvV+TDDSqoCKI cyYA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=4c/AEo5qAtZmpuJjj0fH1qDhbkmesTH2MsNx/uKxXYo=; b=qiiLFcMA41ZuFDb79El5Zq8AH8uGb7MYBNfGKn8H1KONrP/ss34g/ELxjtCGSCbWEb 8RRN2TYBoBGmMaqotQJfk7YZyXgll44yL268t1lTOWaV82G9ipM713WLNohIHqS5cbIk QBfu4tBk4HOzKQEGy6Co6JvvECz7/hufCQ05c4eSVaWxcnQmncdUIL+Bg6P3KALSHw0N wCjfAgI20XnRpgawuFooLCuZT4fisBSIQ6gNXCcyG1krSBLm+zFw1DFGSNNCvjTMFb75 tKBf4IsQV5zdjpuPfh7fBnTZcLoENF8faSesotcyzhJCUls+X0neYJ2Lw3P88tcCprJE Hhkg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUt+6KAGPKy+zIA0GvE+m/EbaMkcAUoeZDXsdVrJfCgi8G6/Ii0 KMOz6ivKNxrLLIkEFBhYBQAliqg/0gxo7CepeUE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqx9lxPRsXUSkl0cJXt4haaKd3akNpjMq/42NCKH3ggYE8szqqvp3Zyy/bgO1WHxjxeL5n8FVr9kWh6nUUXTOLI= X-Received: by 2002:a67:2f06:: with SMTP id v6mr10674188vsv.12.1582034436888; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 06:00:36 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> <24139.58932.915276.752500@jerusalem.litteratus.org> In-Reply-To: <24139.58932.915276.752500@jerusalem.litteratus.org> From: Andreas X Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:00:25 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? To: Robert Huff Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?Trond_Endrest=C3=B8l?= , Tim Daneliuk , FreeBSD Mailing List X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MMvB1LYDz4FQQ X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=rRoaZMf5; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of hamdi20193d@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::e29 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=hamdi20193d@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.00 / 15.00]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; URI_COUNT_ODD(1.00)[3]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.50), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[9.2.e.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:00:39 -0000 Hello Robert, Thanks for your reply. Sure, here's the entire IPFW ruleset: https://hastepaste.com/view/PqDX5sl (allow IPs are just Cloudflare's IPs) Please see the line: 00350 15 882 deny ip from table(1) to any (BANS the IPs from table 1 successfully) BUT if that line would be: 65500 15 882 deny ip from table(1) to any (It doesn't ban anything) Thank you all, Regards. Robert Huff , 18 =C5=9Eub 2020 Sal, 16:27 tarihinde =C5= =9Funu yazd=C4=B1: > > Andreas X writes: > > > Question is: If I don't add the rule number 00350 to that command, > > that rule gets located to 65000s, and ipfw doesn't block the IPs in > > table, at all. I wanted to ask why such react, shouldn't IPFW still > > do the job (deny) even if the rule number belongs to last ones? > > I am not an IPFW expert ... but: > It is my understanding IPFW stops processing a packet after the > first rule that matches that packet. Am I wrong? > If not, this suggests somewhere between rule 351 and rule > 650000(-ish) is a rule that matches the packet and keeps it from > getting processed by anything lower in the list. > Would you be willing to publish your entire IPFW ruleset? > > > > Respectfully, > > > Robert Huff > > From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 14:27:51 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 313A923B1C0 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:27:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48MNVY4tkgz4s7b for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:27:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from [192.168.43.231] (unknown [172.58.139.22]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 2A72E4E620; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 08:08:21 -0600 (CST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.5\)) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life From: Valeri Galtsev In-Reply-To: <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 08:08:19 -0600 Cc: FreeBSD Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <05112EEC-7FA3-4E18-974B-263A58058E01@kicp.uchicago.edu> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> To: "@lbutlr" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MNVY4tkgz4s7b X-Spamd-Bar: +++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=uchicago.edu (policy=none); spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu has no SPF policy when checking 128.135.20.70) smtp.mailfrom=galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [7.72 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[uchicago.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[22.139.58.172.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_XBL(5.00)[22.139.58.172.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.4]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(0.12)[ip: (0.34), ipnet: 128.135.0.0/16(0.17), asn: 160(0.13), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(1.00)[0.999,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[70.20.135.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[1.000,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:160, ipnet:128.135.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; GREYLIST(0.00)[pass,body]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:27:51 -0000 > On Feb 18, 2020, at 5:00 AM, @lbutlr wrote: >=20 > On 17 Feb 2020, at 20:23, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: >> Why so short End-Of-Life? Why so many fast and short releases? What = for? >=20 > This was vcovered a few years ago (well, =E2=80=9Cfew=E2=80=9D when = the new timelines were being discussed. >=20 >> What was wrong with having one well tested stable system for a long = time? >=20 > The need to ensure systems are running secure software and are not = trivially exploitable. >=20 >> FreeBSD does not seem to be reliable desktop environment >=20 > True for ever non-Apple Unix variant. Most (that is to say nearly all) = FreeBSD installs are non0desktop servers. >=20 I have workstation (desktop) running FreeBSD. One of the systems my = Laptop runs is FreeBSD as well. Nothing unreliable about both. And from = what is said on this list, I=E2=80=99m not the only one. Valeri >=20 >=20 > --=20 > I WILL NOT CARVE GODS Bart chalkboard Ep. 8F11 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 14:27:51 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 307CD23B1BF; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:27:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48MNVY4tlgz4s7c; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:27:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from [IPv6:2607:fb90:a22d:23:403c:a547:a7e:3e7e] (unknown [172.58.139.100]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id F03254E6BE; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 08:12:41 -0600 (CST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.5\)) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life From: Valeri Galtsev In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 08:12:40 -0600 Cc: Steve O'Hara-Smith , FreeBSD Stable , FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <2DF2C96F-6292-434E-AC89-8FAEDF5FA93D@kicp.uchicago.edu> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200218091959.b0220ac75bcfbbced91a5708@sohara.org> To: Tomasz CEDRO X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MNVY4tlgz4s7c X-Spamd-Bar: +++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=uchicago.edu (policy=none); spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu has no SPF policy when checking 128.135.20.70) smtp.mailfrom=galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [7.72 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[uchicago.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[100.139.58.172.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_XBL(5.00)[100.139.58.172.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.4]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(0.12)[ip: (0.34), ipnet: 128.135.0.0/16(0.17), asn: 160(0.13), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(1.00)[1.000,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[1.000,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[70.20.135.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:160, ipnet:128.135.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; GREYLIST(0.00)[pass,body]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:27:51 -0000 > On Feb 18, 2020, at 4:36 AM, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: >=20 > wt., 18 lut 2020, 10:20 u=C5=BCytkownik Steve O'Hara-Smith = > napisa=C5=82: >=20 >> On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 04:23:35 +0100 >> Tomasz CEDRO wrote: >>=20 >>> Why so short End-Of-Life? Why so many fast and short releases? What = for? >>=20 >> The new(ish) release and support policy has been announced and = well >> documented, this should come as no surprise to anyone. >>=20 >> -- >> Steve O'Hara-Smith >>=20 >=20 > True.. but the surprise is the Linux like bleeding edge in BSD and the > quality degradation at a degree that I have just replaced my FreeBSD = laptop > with a MacBook :-( >=20 > Maybe its a time to give OpenBSD a try.. >=20 I for one am staying away from OpenBSD since the moment I learned one of = the former developers was also receiving payments from one of three = letter agencies. The above shouldn=E2=80=99t be considered as = accusation, but I=E2=80=99m staying away, just in case.=20 Valeri > -- > CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 14:46:56 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF1F523BBDD; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:46:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-il1-f193.google.com (mail-il1-f193.google.com [209.85.166.193]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MNwb58dHz48Zw; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:46:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: by mail-il1-f193.google.com with SMTP id v13so17531415iln.4; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 06:46:55 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=v9pbhOfUrY0FT6v3hgvZMJy10YWcyRjJZnu2UCwfbQ0=; b=Ham8h2mHEtYx/O1irJoCdxZW02REj2btwQjAe9LZYmuOdpG5uNfAsN+vix/Iaz+jzz X4gWo1d2jSd6dNLS5rt5VuQjujvwB5ogjWHdzsbDwZS85ffPG69m+Bxsav8P38azrRlq J07DrW4nd8I+QeDubKp3MBn/TJxA74zUF8IR7SLmYjM2X8R+QthXHALu7sZ1agSUSFHJ LUg0wRlvJqre7Oyt6fD2rXeu0/VuxLkT6k3Q1qjs/fGry2S+f3HZrzqmly21wzXfHEdj +er7Ahs/hNpgzhhJ+6e/kTBySBstL4TsAT54NLbJ+5Co+EhukFG7kBaNOjLHMe8RrjJ/ L6eQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXgdf9b0pgbk8s2YfLg4UU5pgZ3fGEud2X5Oui7fQLJ8R1qAUP3 +DLSsPYNhKojOpG8tSUw6TFPRsOcN/ABHndCiKkpbukH X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxwbFOQrypSyjjlKO9ojw3oY0H1FvV+g7eLJEuRtTqL66s8oD7eHQHWkE01Yv9LAMU1JauMZr7nO0eZJjJmGR0= X-Received: by 2002:a92:db4f:: with SMTP id w15mr18393106ilq.182.1582037214588; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 06:46:54 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: From: Ed Maste Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:46:44 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Tomasz CEDRO Cc: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List , FreeBSD Stable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MNwb58dHz48Zw X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of carpeddiem@gmail.com designates 209.85.166.193 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=carpeddiem@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.04 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:209.85.128.0/17:c]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[freebsd.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[193.166.85.209.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(-1.04)[ip: (-0.49), ipnet: 209.85.128.0/17(-3.00), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[emaste@freebsd.org,carpeddiem@gmail.com]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[193.166.85.209.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[emaste@freebsd.org,carpeddiem@gmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:46:56 -0000 On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 at 22:24, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > Why so short End-Of-Life? Why so many fast and short releases? What for? > > Why pushing problems to production? What was wrong with having one > well tested stable system for a long time? I really don't understand this - FreeBSD 12 is supported for 5 years. 12.0 was released at the end of 2018. I've heard many complaints that minor releases from stable branches are not frequent enough. > 12.0 was a problematic release. 12.1 brings even more problems. The major issue with 12.1 is a problem with the Intel graphics kernel module, and fixing that was held up by both 12.0 and 12.1 being supported. The problem will automatically resolve once 12.0 is no longer supported. (Yes, I wish we were able to address this issue in a way other than waiting for 12.0's EOL, but nobody in the FreeBSD development community was able to find the time to do so.) From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 14:51:34 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE74C23BF90; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:51:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-il1-f194.google.com (mail-il1-f194.google.com [209.85.166.194]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MP1w58WNz4F93; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:51:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: by mail-il1-f194.google.com with SMTP id o13so8646496ilg.10; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 06:51:32 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=FDfSBWLpaQ+Sidh4Ar0U9H03lvhm39n94zYfyy09eZk=; b=IGNXfMyUlm1zm1RLslBxRl4+OTg9w//nveuA3fQkY7go8uIWV/RUNf90Vbx6tKIyLL /yFqGEBYD4mp1KhgBblS/D+q+CtFtrW9tLrPIT7jXAem9kD5kqLzoLcKH7qGwjbPdLLw IAQ9O1u9xhWWABUCYVx7qSBmOUIr3ekfYX/IuPAdNKqvLISv+uw22Ch2jKMSZMFgm/Lz FlEkC37z9hawvGq6ONix6fWvALxnIL43iwjhstOQLyq9e8kai07T0Ejiqi9YcWRWCUZb nwrRSHclCJy2l5A/CpDJHRqzSdw5aF5zmIdVrMyJVQLcXkissqD30b9vffDEsbAJik7e YThg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWnXmnW6LONLF7Fcs7ycWb6c12RvF5JR/J3hZ+xogOUaRkYmjrY 20FPtwbr/HBXUfQYJKYd06jh4IWXoskcrUcmjgM= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzbPDiKx7i/Q555iJEqZts4F/coTR72e/C9TbDpSJ8HT9TW+TEppGEO1wfUg2/xvMAToMobSwBx3cQtRwdP5Io= X-Received: by 2002:a92:4448:: with SMTP id a8mr19873498ilm.256.1582037490969; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 06:51:30 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200218091959.b0220ac75bcfbbced91a5708@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: From: Ed Maste Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:51:20 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Tomasz CEDRO Cc: "Steve O'Hara-Smith" , FreeBSD Stable , FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MP1w58WNz4F93 X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of carpeddiem@gmail.com designates 209.85.166.194 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=carpeddiem@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.06 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:209.85.128.0/17:c]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[freebsd.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[194.166.85.209.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(-1.06)[ip: (-0.58), ipnet: 209.85.128.0/17(-3.00), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[emaste@freebsd.org,carpeddiem@gmail.com]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[194.166.85.209.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[emaste@freebsd.org,carpeddiem@gmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:51:35 -0000 On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 at 05:37, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > Maybe its a time to give OpenBSD a try.. I really don't understand this comment, either. Certainly give OpenBSD a try and if it fits your needs better that's great. As far as I'm aware OpenBSD issues a release every six months and supports the most recent two releases, so it seems odd to me to complain about FreeBSD's ~1 year minor release support lifetime and 5 year stable branch support lifetime in that context. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 16:08:55 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E442D23EA9F for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 16:08:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from starikarp@dismail.de) Received: from mx1.dismail.de (mx1.dismail.de [78.46.223.134]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mx1.dismail.de", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MQlB4JHfz3P9G for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 16:08:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from starikarp@dismail.de) Received: from mx1.dismail.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mx1.dismail.de (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id b966e6f3 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:08:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp1.dismail.de ( [10.240.26.11]) by mx1.dismail.de (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 08afae2c for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:08:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from smtp1.dismail.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp1.dismail.de (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id a67047d4 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:08:51 +0100 (CET) Received: by dismail.de (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id c0b50458 (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256:NO) for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:08:50 +0100 (CET) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 11:08:47 -0500 From: ajtiM To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? Message-ID: <20200218110847.57d10344@dismail.de> In-Reply-To: References: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> <24139.58932.915276.752500@jerusalem.litteratus.org> X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd12.1) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MQlB4JHfz3P9G X-Spamd-Bar: ------ X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.86 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[dismail.de:s=20190914]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_MED(-2.00)[dismail.de.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.2]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:78.46.223.134]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_DKIM_ARC_DNSWL_MED(-0.50)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[134.223.46.78.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.2]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[dismail.de:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[dismail.de,reject]; IP_SCORE(-2.16)[ip: (-9.91), ipnet: 78.46.0.0/15(0.69), asn: 24940(-1.55), country: DE(-0.02)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:24940, ipnet:78.46.0.0/15, country:DE]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 16:08:56 -0000 On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:00:25 +0300 I am starting with: ipfw table 1 create cat /etc/bogons | xargs -n1 ipfw table 1 add ipfw table 2 create cat /etc/mine | xargs -n1 ipfw table 2 add .... .... and than I have $cmd 00600 deny ip from 'table(1)' to any $cmd 00650 deny log ip from 'table(2)' to any I did use script before: #!/bin/csh ipfw table 1 create fetch -o /tmp/drop.txt http://www.spamhaus.org/drop/drop.txt sed -i '' "s/;.*//" /tmp/drop.txt ipfw table 1 flush foreach IP ( `cat /tmp/drop.txt` ) ipfw table 1 add $IP end and I have in ipf.rules: # Get ip's from Spamhaus # /etc/tables.sh -- "The only difference between a beggar and a Duke was the amount of money they possess". George Orwell From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 16:25:26 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58ACF23F37D for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 16:25:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pathiaki2@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic303-21.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (sonic303-21.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com [66.163.188.147]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MR6D71wRz4GBx for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 16:25:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pathiaki2@yahoo.com) X-YMail-OSG: KjjP0b4VM1lDoRL.77CnXq.VrAQH.wGRENafxWrjNdhr_Chjll.Arr83393_e5y Xp8MkgWveSIvOyljVfm.QpFFzxs0n93bsCKHG3XPY9B9k2LnzeW7jtMaf.1i8m9RyMH.0pqaQpoT v2dcWildcA.J_cdFxWDCqRa8M4PihD2o3geEisKmq6jqc7tA6l3pg.uopE9kbSFWuKJM6Y_2X4fp gxldWdSxAu7.w4ggMfi8aginLPcRChqKivZQpxXabVXDZlaAP_JhpbJ46APrISHQ7EdMKRawnKz6 jd8Gi_gwzhBhkYfsGJUSU0Y8DzZLgJm.39xcYs3bU7msXEtRDxWaOkVNIPkbmgpxCYz6OwH.uJVe 1i4fe4Q7lzhnbP4x9a7ctXaL_.oWv3Qn14ulbTX_rlAFdYBNJ1uC13rZnpgjRAhzBLpYq.gB2f7c ShL8kBvVKSPDc0CwACsSfodd0qSOU.3WrKOnG8CpT0TF30EDhUBXUKZ9nHbiDfzNKD7CdHDQqJq0 GVVfivcsCSdoNtZMW8oi13ParU4u0XE2TI4RPK_8c5gdP03Hic.8uXwMdQjnsNH9r8Bf55A.Y3kL fg2iEbHcVuQuUmNtxRVX4Oa9zyvg7PF.ADVOqujYZDebY3K9KN8viEKXqClZz3DbJbSn1rr51nwO .hpyw9h0xojVNBwZ6iQ50xG4ycOuIypDVF5E5H1kIn6uMDJX5Jq3a4fS9oYXjGoMEZpFnS_Cx0wK PWd3uf5WTVADwCX9n0izQk4nsYcSGnyMqC_NHc45RINwgcJkBuqaxh.gxPlkI8M5G6lu8crfpGUM M4mNFr99NyzrjA6.nAYmuCSj4VkgunKwyyNF.0jXDYQSWN.j9SjxqppgJnWqXeRkccmfZNL3._9b c8TJ7EodNJuxZWPeWuAUW_dU6f54S7Sx6Xp7CSlUc3Us_SW7yHJhBJmDl_54LQqoxKaub1R_alk7 ERAfvndeDu.ygfLLQX4K1QoHbJk0ReTOz1uEwUAtK3z2EKrxxlIQTStjZs1zJZOYqUrlj445g2yF bPGjHKUJkrnvBYNwMUD2gtbOKFNltXYGlXVsmAaoGXPlhFtP7NP6BKF146JbuwvRW6q6erxjXWCJ XHj3FxQgssytwiFrGUjTpsih9eij7K1nx3SV5BRqn5RW.bJF02OZULDEOS7bEdogT1537AyNjrdr DwqN1dP7PY.7M2nB0BGytdaW1FeFhu1SSGULsGV.mOHDtzi4YQLx801.M8gLLo3WNtje6Oojumrr XfkBKVKs5hybRMOmP5R9G0rt2XY5Z009yUZgnUM8uangKyVIFFKXR6R6ViMQBf5TmwY7ZAnu0nJY RTk6qbamy2z3hZFBzFNPHxBUqA_KJ1.SXtWlHN5az.0It.g-- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic303.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 16:25:22 +0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 16:25:17 +0000 (UTC) From: Paul Pathiakis To: "@lbutlr" , Valeri Galtsev Cc: FreeBSD Message-ID: <1272310515.4633961.1582043117362@mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <05112EEC-7FA3-4E18-974B-263A58058E01@kicp.uchicago.edu> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> <05112EEC-7FA3-4E18-974B-263A58058E01@kicp.uchicago.edu> Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.15199 YMailNorrin Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:73.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/73.0 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MR6D71wRz4GBx X-Spamd-Bar: ++ X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.60 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(0.00)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; R_SPF_ALLOW(0.00)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.63)[0.631,0]; BAD_REP_POLICIES(0.10)[]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(0.00)[yahoo.com,reject]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[147.188.163.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RBL_MAILSPIKE_BAD(1.00)[147.188.163.66.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.12]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (4.47), ipnet: 66.163.184.0/21(1.17), asn: 36646(0.94), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.97)[0.965,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36646, ipnet:66.163.184.0/21, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 16:25:26 -0000 Hi, And, as an alternative to my personal workstations running FreeBSD with KDE= , my middle-aged gf and her 85 yo mother are running GhostBSD which are rea= lly quite nice. Also, I'm someone who fully supports the 4 minor rev (please can we stop th= e .4 release on a major rev?) on a version.=C2=A0 It is the only way to kee= p moving forward with the speed of things being developed in the industry.= =C2=A0 Although I totally disagree with Agile (as do its authors), I do bel= ieve that the traditional, software engineering practice of project plan, p= roject items, engineering, qa/test, and release works quite well. It allows to have a major underpinning, version like 12, and go forward wit= h stable, incremental enhancements and bug-fixes.=C2=A0 Personally, all the= crazy things like Waterfall, Agile etc are just bandages for lack of commu= nication between engineering and operations in most corporations.=C2=A0 I'v= e always been amazed that I can take a .0 and run it.=C2=A0 I've n= ever seen anything like that in the Linux Kernel or a MS Windows release. I tend to think of a Version from start to finish to be .0 to .{3,4}..... In FreeBSD, that's upwards of 4-5 years.=C2=A0 To not upgr= ade from a minor version to the next is to say "I'm not going to do mainten= ance and you can't make me".=C2=A0 It's shortsighted and not proper system = administration. My $0.02, Paul On Tuesday, February 18, 2020, 9:27:59 AM EST, Valeri Galtsev wrote: =20 =20 =20 > On Feb 18, 2020, at 5:00 AM, @lbutlr wrote: >=20 > On 17 Feb 2020, at 20:23, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: >> Why so short End-Of-Life? Why so many fast and short releases? What for? >=20 > This was vcovered a few years ago (well, =E2=80=9Cfew=E2=80=9D when the n= ew timelines were being discussed. >=20 >> What was wrong with having one well tested stable system for a long time= ? >=20 > The need to ensure systems are running secure software and are not trivia= lly exploitable. >=20 >> FreeBSD does not seem to be reliable desktop environment >=20 > True for ever non-Apple Unix variant. Most (that is to say nearly all) Fr= eeBSD installs are non0desktop servers. >=20 I have workstation (desktop) running FreeBSD. One of the systems my Laptop = runs is FreeBSD as well. Nothing unreliable about both. And from what is sa= id on this list, I=E2=80=99m not the only one. Valeri >=20 >=20 > --=20 > I WILL NOT CARVE GODS Bart chalkboard Ep. 8F11 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.o= rg" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ _______________________________________________ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org= " =20 From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 17:19:00 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F40C32407F4 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:18:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from mout.kundenserver.de (mout.kundenserver.de [212.227.17.24]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "mout.kundenserver.de", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass Class 2 CA" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MSJ23wBtz4TZp for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:18:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from r56.edvax.de ([178.8.36.223]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (mreue106 [212.227.15.183]) with ESMTPA (Nemesis) id 1MK3iK-1ijoTg15Li-00LZVe; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 18:18:54 +0100 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 18:18:53 +0100 From: Polytropon To: Yasuhiro KIMURA Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: How to build and install only part of base source tree Message-Id: <20200218181853.846d2e1a.freebsd@edvax.de> In-Reply-To: <20200218.101420.353584891979293358.yasu@utahime.org> References: <20200218.101420.353584891979293358.yasu@utahime.org> Reply-To: Polytropon Organization: EDVAX X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.1.1 (GTK+ 2.24.5; 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dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@edvax.de has no SPF policy when checking 212.227.17.24) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@edvax.de X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.48 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd@edvax.de]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8560, ipnet:212.227.0.0/16, country:DE]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[223.36.8.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[edvax.de]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.97)[0.969,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.95)[0.951,0]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[24.17.227.212.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(0.16)[ip: (-0.24), ipnet: 212.227.0.0/16(-1.12), asn: 8560(2.19), country: DE(-0.02)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:19:00 -0000 On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 10:14:20 +0900 (JST), Yasuhiro KIMURA wrote: > I would like to add new feature to base system. My idea is simple but > I'm not sure if it can be implemented as is expected. Therefore I > think some trial and error will be necessary. To test it I need to > > (1) Edit some C source files. > (2) Build and install one command and some library files. > > And doing buildworld and installworld each time I change source files > is too heavy to repeat. > > Then are there any way to build and install only part of base source > tree? First of all, there's /etc/src.conf to control aspects of the whole build process (see "man 5 src.conf"). Additionally, you can change into a specific program's directory within the source tree, then build and install it from there, for example: # /usr/src/usr.bin/mt [... you change mt.c ...] # make # make install However be careful that, depending on the kind of changes you make, it's possible that you need to rebuild other programs or libraries, too. While "make buildworld" and "make installworld" will handle such changes in an optimal manner (also see the comment header of /usr/src/Makefile), the manual approach is quite convenient for smaller changes, and in case of user programs, can often be tested immediately. Note: The build process itself will take place in /usr/obj (if you're not changing this default), so always have a look at what happens over there. ;-) PS. I've done the same in /usr/src/sbin/fsck_ffs while trying to debug and finally solving a very rare data recovery problem. -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 17:19:47 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F1C6240887 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:19:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-oi1-x243.google.com (mail-oi1-x243.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::243]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MSJx2p8pz4V16 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:19:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-oi1-x243.google.com with SMTP id v19so20843770oic.12 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:19:44 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=REjymbnTxQRaFSYrzMJHzXr6OqwQidSxLAIjYGmpJoM=; b=Npd/G7l/qxI1IMYPhdh3uP101LO0+Md6D36Czb6m/B1D83T2kO3calTr/Sm/lSXO+1 lLdCae4qzpwD/dBO50HuUr9Jw2VdaL6JZQ+rJy3++53ZQy1eeytUS0Ytup8AfezqmOOg wfGm4pTokbYKV5G7c9g3VeIT+CPbHdvWGyu9WvwozKwCNcZnO9BxCpZbN0uP8itcFOnO shm1Hyx/d/2eptoSx+pHozO/7CE+vsba305JFpgzsjUUB+8mE3MbvPE0FrKNzcsN2PUB ZWVpRUjwui3fsWFEnbeoGEK90EdiV2wMhWysHHx9rb6Pc9DQggM+iobAIdLDvu9EfFt5 r4dA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=REjymbnTxQRaFSYrzMJHzXr6OqwQidSxLAIjYGmpJoM=; b=bDPXYJ9d6H68TzhUS4JNRBk4lpbjrMNjikzBvKqiSccOQB6CLvTIcEXgYd4OJJ8V66 1zhzjcXrgUD7V3F3c2KQS5Bg9Sk23NvugBP+yZrCnWyDWWQZ63vEuZuj2niVJrLTF8j6 ZQIvUQQCexA/kpTSP2Y1ZowEXUxDTuB42/KMAEfLvqdo/q0TMkI9jLzHczbxIiR/AAl3 H9VKi+JmbWkDxxiaZojh2rL/liwqKXcXS1d76joUFe5PnJSdiW9a9CCZ+MC7gZoVBmph oNHBuhrklSh/e0DVPEUJkmn9DpC0afv/UznUL7l1fgp6IDAB7dBQA2Q1sK05cmUoDAFN iFDw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUZ4P+r1YFcoIMxgmq3jSArtKdrYD5slEUFMFo2K8L6kiiuut8j aPe7XVCzKUt23bgDJZfWe/vvrRTJGTw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyv77vLhTvHB7rQtpkLz23muTQvOQSVCgsFLrSTIClWxoMEmuGDBGZ3jQie9E8/6RScWQJQGg== X-Received: by 2002:aca:37c3:: with SMTP id e186mr1991955oia.155.1582046382818; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:19:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-oi1-f182.google.com (mail-oi1-f182.google.com. [209.85.167.182]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id j140sm1382623oib.46.2020.02.18.09.19.41 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:19:42 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-oi1-f182.google.com with SMTP id a142so20845588oii.7; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:19:41 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:350:: with SMTP id j16mr1857061oie.168.1582046381155; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:19:41 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 18:19:29 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Ed Maste Cc: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List , FreeBSD Stable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MSJx2p8pz4V16 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=Npd/G7l/; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::243) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.55 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.4.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(-0.25)[ip: (2.37), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:19:47 -0000 Hello Ed, thanks for your input :-) On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 3:46 PM Ed Maste wrote: > > 12.0 was a problematic release. 12.1 brings even more problems. > > The major issue with 12.1 is a problem with the Intel graphics kernel > module, and fixing that was held up by both 12.0 and 12.1 being > supported. The problem will automatically resolve once 12.0 is no > longer supported. > > (Yes, I wish we were able to address this issue in a way other than > waiting for 12.0's EOL, but nobody in the FreeBSD development > community was able to find the time to do so.) Ah, in this case 12.0 EoL is highly desired. Now I understand. Thank you :-) But also as this DRM user (for Intel and AMD) I have experienced the related hiccups, problems, and problems solutions. It does not look like a FreeBSD way, but more like Linux way. I never noticed anything like this before. Sure, I can see this only as the end-user, maybe tester, I did no commits, so in theory I cannot complain, but it seems like more experienced kernel people could take part in this kind of solution architecture and design right from start in order to prevent avalanche of future problems and problematic solutions that will generate more problems. Another problem is the VirtualBox virtualization that is not really usable anymore. I am aware of closed-source VBox Guest Additions problem. My VM works fine for a first minute or two but then it stops when I start working on it. With DRM and Framebuffer X11 drivers so it does not seem related. It can consume all resources and/or break graphics (i.e. Enlightenment WM). I have tried various permutations of configuration and operating systems (mostly Windoze, but also Linux). I am not sure if I am the only person having this problem as I have asked some questions before. I know there is BHYVE but its not really that easy to use as VBox (to be honest I did not manage to run anything beyond examples). Simple and efficient hypervisor is a must have nowadays in productivity work. For a modern workstation a fairly good GPU driver and Virtualization seems mandatory. Not to mention input devices like Trackpad. I cannot use them reliably at this time anymore. It worked well in the past. Thus my question - why create a new release with new features when there are still basic features missing or incomplete.. I would really care for productivity in the first place even if its 9.12 release :-) I really love FreeBSD!! I advocate it in my every project and every project I am part of. I use it as a base on my servers. It worked really nice on my desktop, but it does not anymore. I am not really comfortable to switch to macOS BSD but time is precious and clients are waiting for the results.. I just wonder: 1. Maybe if Sony uses FreeBSD on their PlayStation with AMD GPU - could they share back the solution? 2. Maybe Intel could help in development of the DRM architecture? They have really nice R&D in Poland.. Did anyone try that? :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 17:30:28 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9ECCA240E65 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:30:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from mout.kundenserver.de (mout.kundenserver.de [217.72.192.75]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "mout.kundenserver.de", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass Class 2 CA" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MSYG5X0qz4dWj for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:30:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from r56.edvax.de ([178.8.36.223]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (mreue106 [212.227.15.183]) with ESMTPA (Nemesis) id 1MBDzc-1jAAxs2Qec-00CfU1; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 18:30:14 +0100 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 18:30:10 +0100 From: Polytropon To: "@lbutlr" Cc: FreeBSD Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-Id: <20200218183010.5a52441f.freebsd@edvax.de> In-Reply-To: <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> Reply-To: Polytropon Organization: EDVAX X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.1.1 (GTK+ 2.24.5; i386-portbld-freebsd8.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:71q1JAcjUTB67+oS+jznlz+KZkfUUECr6nPtKIHXs8yxkOVGx7u PA3q5qmzWsUrXI9muLfW1EuWaVImor8ZWPc2jQ7TSwHKS3NX5oJ4IwhVUkftTvn6By6XMrw i4ZXTmlj0TULdZv9C0qxFoRhaPbKV6k8yjF/PQZK5ZK68t9hPM00W2Tftsic+UldQjoGU0o tkj7BgMIUDhc1QUQoBLIg== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:fHF3TfkeT2s=:Syf8Ml5KH9SC6qwGb2Vake CupxNGW6cHuoDmQ1CnrLT68EO8M42iK174B93j9GjYtnHAp7M+NJSRY6jh6ZjybJUT8g3xT8j 19GfRfQF2mJmPfGMbLG/TJ60ZtW8BXVDuarEOjWg0TKxSDz10G6fF3Kj8ox36S8TLewWtg7Eu se/4YTTqWrePfepAfG9p65VhgE8ZfyN2WOyVgRqSvEcUFCjhr2DNoZmR6MONuwtx3Zujruolh m1jesLl9Zbp5g0q6yanv62nRm66nQO/G/2hhJrTBJ6gpyfYp5hBdSOLciu2brRxhVvzm7eGBG 58kFr2Z103/TZQo2qrlahcc2MKsCKUM5mp/Q3ptRmyhIvAwHVAJ9sm2TegOQytEgo58ITEjKq BnqIm/V9SR6DMgTqajwqwFSWH8lweR0pLNZTTWcpDVPtoHzRbDuFjpIeBuA28piCZEewgfFnF P00qi4dQE/+FCj9Z+xUGiQnxSfL8mBib8Wla+nm9w2TpbMC1cTX1Ss03WFI/hFVpz8qVeRaZy bdPimutJsEp8Ds6QfliwWuIf04zQsJHQkR1KD+LweXX11tICte08B36lobge0BoBKFTCKC8tT WTZ4m1Ndu2ChFlknCihWWv9Ua54fzDskaqlsq3eVYewbEIm5JVfH8GTYpTEanLp5qd0nLkgzH arMf+6de6pejS/1PckdaQCnwfu7SzjkkcnUFaa7kfhwJPvzwqwhtSPtBMUIEDm3NxuR0g6UCt U9Gr+0Gc/mNg3pL7Gkxw8+uH2CMLzBtpk4YKx5PRrzthzQJaZSH3oBjG+d559mdvF4DEJqM7F 4azv9tW1q1nsmTK1pwQwMfd/ifwKELxDIRk9gR2/80vOLA0KEdMXYcC3g4TyoeB6OpE9GGD X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MSYG5X0qz4dWj X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@edvax.de has no SPF policy when checking 217.72.192.75) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@edvax.de X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.75 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd@edvax.de]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8560, ipnet:217.72.192.0/20, country:DE]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[223.36.8.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[edvax.de]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.99)[0.990,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.99)[0.994,0]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[75.192.72.217.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(0.36)[ip: (-0.68), ipnet: 217.72.192.0/20(0.33), asn: 8560(2.19), country: DE(-0.02)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:30:28 -0000 On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 04:00:18 -0700, @lbutlr wrote: > On 17 Feb 2020, at 20:23, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > [...] > > FreeBSD does not seem to be reliable desktop environment > > True for ever non-Apple Unix variant. Most (that is to say > nearly all) FreeBSD installs are non0desktop servers. I'm using FreeBSD since 4.0 as my primary desktop. While 12.0 and 12.1 definitely had issues, it never impacted me (or my clients or family), so it's still here as a desktop solution that works. Of course I can understand the "never touch a running system". As an illustration, I still support one special customer who has a FreeBSD 4.4 Or was it 4.10?) system still running (XFree86, _not_ X.org!). There is a replacement ready, but the customer just doesn't want to replace this airgapped and isolated system, because whenever we discuss the options, he tells me: "Never touch a running system. As long as it works, no need to 'fix' something." On desktop systems, especially those including web browsers and so-called "productivity software" (i. e., office suites), security is far more important, as new approaches to broken software concepts and flaky hardware (yes, I'm looking at you, Mister Intelprocessor!) and their exploitation are being invented very quickly. So the OS has to provide the optimal solutions for mitigation. A faster release cycle surely helps a lot. Newer security flaws probably require methods of dealing with them that cannot be easily ported to older releases, so that's probably the reason why they are not supported that long. -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... 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[209.85.210.54]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 17sm1565319oty.48.2020.02.18.09.40.01 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:40:01 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ot1-f54.google.com with SMTP id r27so20291823otc.8; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:40:01 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a9d:865:: with SMTP id 92mr3972426oty.6.1582047600455; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 09:40:00 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200218091959.b0220ac75bcfbbced91a5708@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 18:39:49 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Ed Maste Cc: "Steve O'Hara-Smith" , FreeBSD Stable , FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MSmM3QYTz3K7F X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=fX6tlpsm; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::343) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.44 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.4.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(-0.15)[ip: (2.90), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:40:04 -0000 On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 3:51 PM Ed Maste wrote: > > On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 at 05:37, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > > > Maybe its a time to give OpenBSD a try.. > > I really don't understand this comment, either. Certainly give OpenBSD > a try and if it fits your needs better that's great. > > As far as I'm aware OpenBSD issues a release every six months and > supports the most recent two releases, so it seems odd to me to > complain about FreeBSD's ~1 year minor release support lifetime and 5 > year stable branch support lifetime in that context. Its more like "lets try if what I need works better over there". Not really the release timeline. The release timeline problem is more related with pushing untested features (and possible avalanche of solutions that introduce yet another complications that we observe right now). "The BSD Way", for me, was always about "it works solid or its not there". Like macOS / iOS. Unlike "The Linux Way" where things changes upside down from release to release and each one of them has its own universe of variants. Like Android. I am not sure if it is that important if there is a release in 6 month or 2 years. Not a problem at all. If in two years I get a 5 new features that work rock solid then it seems a better choice than getting new features every six months and have more problems on a production because of that. If I need to experiment there is a CURRENT branch. For well tested features I have STABLE. For rock solid "I bet my money on that" I have a RELEASE. Right? I did miss the 12.0 EoL kind of fix for DRM, sorry, it seems reasonable. I am just worried that 12.2-RELEASE will have the same problems, if not more new problems. Maybe I should go back to 11 and see how things work over there :-P Tomek -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 18:49:13 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52A83242D4A for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 18:49:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ozgur@kazancci.com) Received: from relay4-d.mail.gandi.net (relay4-d.mail.gandi.net [217.70.183.196]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MVJ64czgz4Q31 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 18:49:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ozgur@kazancci.com) Received: from sogo15.sd4.0x35.net (sogo15.sd4.0x35.net [10.200.201.65]) (Authenticated sender: ozgur@kazancci.com) by relay4-d.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 39648E0009; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 18:49:06 +0000 (UTC) From: =?utf-8?q?ozgur=40kazancci=2Ecom?= In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" X-Forward: 127.0.0.1 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 19:49:06 +0100 Cc: "FreeBSD Questions Mailing List" To: "Tomasz CEDRO" MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <1aaf-5e4c3180-19-32bea140@106400311> Subject: =?utf-8?q?Re=3A?==?utf-8?q?_=5BFreeBSD-Announce=5D?= FreeBSD =?utf-8?q?12=2E0?= end-of-life User-Agent: SOGoMail 4.3.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MVJ64czgz4Q31 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ozgur@kazancci.com designates 217.70.183.196 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ozgur@kazancci.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.02 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.93)[-0.930,0]; FROM_DN_EQ_ADDR(1.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_GOOD(0.00)[196.183.70.217.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.18]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:217.70.183.192/28]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kazancci.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; SUBJ_EXCESS_QP(1.20)[]; FROM_EXCESS_QP(1.20)[]; IP_SCORE(-1.58)[ip: (-5.07), ipnet: 217.70.176.0/20(-1.58), asn: 29169(-1.28), country: FR(0.00)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[196.183.70.217.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:29169, ipnet:217.70.176.0/20, country:FR]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 18:49:13 -0000 > I am not sure if it is that important if there is a release in 6 mont= h or 2 years. Not a problem at all. If in two years I get a 5 new > features that work rock solid then it seems a better choice than > getting new features every six months and have more problems on a > production because of that. Totally agree that. ^^ People usually move from Linux distros to OpenBSD/FreeBSD to....calm do= wn a little&focus on system management/usage/administration and feel tr= ue UNIX stability. Having brand new (and untested) fancy features&grabbing an upper OS ver= sion/release number is -imvho- the last choice of *BSD users/sys.admins= . Best, =C3=96zg=C3=BCr Kazancci On 18 February, 2020 20:39 +03, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: = > On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 3:51 PM Ed Maste wrote: > > > > On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 at 05:37, Tomasz CEDRO wrote= : > > > > > > Maybe its a time to give OpenBSD a try.. > > > > I really don't understand this comment, either. Certainly give Open= BSD > > a try and if it fits your needs better that's great. > > > > As far as I'm aware OpenBSD issues a release every six months and > > supports the most recent two releases, so it seems odd to me to > > complain about FreeBSD's ~1 year minor release support lifetime and= 5 > > year stable branch support lifetime in that context. > > Its more like "lets try if what I need works better over there". Not > really the release timeline. > > The release timeline problem is more related with pushing untested > features (and possible avalanche of solutions that introduce yet > another complications that we observe right now). > > "The BSD Way", for me, was always about "it works solid or its not > there". Like macOS / iOS. > > Unlike "The Linux Way" where things changes upside down from release > to release and each one of them has its own universe of variants. Lik= e > Android. > > I am not sure if it is that important if there is a release in 6 mont= h > or 2 years. Not a problem at all. If in two years I get a 5 new > features that work rock solid then it seems a better choice than > getting new features every six months and have more problems on a > production because of that. > > If I need to experiment there is a CURRENT branch. For well tested > features I have STABLE. For rock solid "I bet my money on that" I hav= e > a RELEASE. Right? > > I did miss the 12.0 EoL kind of fix for DRM, sorry, it seems > reasonable. I am just worried that 12.2-RELEASE will have the same > problems, if not more new problems. > > Maybe I should go back to 11 and see how things work over there :-P > > Tomek > > -- > CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freeb= sd.org" From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 19:49:08 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AFED24476C for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 19:49:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-oi1-x244.google.com (mail-oi1-x244.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::244]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MWdH2HPPz4g4q for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 19:49:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-oi1-x244.google.com with SMTP id d62so21310759oia.11 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 11:49:06 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=o8Ls1uA4xjkuU8mnefRbx1gn7tOh7hjsAsQk2tpBbBQ=; b=b/e/GfG2EQXXXDsYQEzyKLjCkbKGfUD4IQzu/UomKC0Mo3//fBCLn8yBEDizlf+zSs evj91jhbAwNwWtRs3nRwUkBSUhFhYKQ1T8FYly4dHZb4kWO4Bos5hUFeSspEl1GNEJm0 0mxAkXs1TQEQ6/M4DUNF6O1HuPxOSaLMUz1aLNJDtr+r4CgcWnOiqB1hxufJsRomoy4A CAXJG6+Ni/AjAUdQ+mubv3m9yArkXUVRfuLPWD0tchcu9EtHh0jbIkdaZKW7O4C0evDH AADPpVdSq4Q+vwY1odFjPifjq80FYH8JS5P34HL4PomHbntl5ze5xe3yXuWN4YeqfOw3 AiPA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=o8Ls1uA4xjkuU8mnefRbx1gn7tOh7hjsAsQk2tpBbBQ=; b=nnhkUXJNRQpRRzVLB0lqNrRbAp75V/JUmbaNC83dJN8KfQ6yZioJ6tZQahbjsj9kw/ HIBChPfiUXp9RB8y0uqAS7iSLw1pH8xSl9ld3ORpuyvWOI7H2QSpp2RMnnxmvEs9creb CV7DbQYyP7q9K1HMZBlPr1F3Qetjrb1hls5KI/dD2n1zr70tud5Bh2oxX1/P6o8wd03K UpsN2MYi4twwEJ1ZT0ytEuIxWGhVUHtf9Ff57Xk36tX1slL/RjWHmGXXVvsN3xIXlxWa 6CAO2Sr7sX5f6YOk0A3Nq4ONWPFnexzMYjc2WvVP6JeIPMrAsEKyNl+6FFDltb5bDkP6 HJ2g== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUmhmskC2vMa4zBNVhebFudBYLgYl2ahIlFjA7E+VaeBeJhpF/7 VYA0v4AVRrTVEO7EBrlW4Kjd6mbXxFU= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwHb1xSSdGJ1T6A6XpFuToYHBtoVg8GhaaBbEq7Z2kdTJsCMcri+wGtA9CR7P2I5Fi7Hq8NYQ== X-Received: by 2002:aca:503:: with SMTP id 3mr2371090oif.106.1582055344628; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 11:49:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ot1-f46.google.com (mail-ot1-f46.google.com. [209.85.210.46]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a14sm1682326otr.54.2020.02.18.11.49.03 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 18 Feb 2020 11:49:03 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ot1-f46.google.com with SMTP id j16so20770404otl.1 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 11:49:03 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a9d:7342:: with SMTP id l2mr17222788otk.98.1582055343104; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 11:49:03 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> <20200218183010.5a52441f.freebsd@edvax.de> In-Reply-To: <20200218183010.5a52441f.freebsd@edvax.de> From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:48:51 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Polytropon Cc: "@lbutlr" , FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MWdH2HPPz4g4q X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=b/e/GfG2; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::244) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.53 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[4.4.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(-0.23)[ip: (2.45), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 19:49:08 -0000 Hello Poly :-) On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 6:31 PM Polytropon wrote: > On desktop systems, especially those including web browsers > and so-called "productivity software" (i. e., office suites), > security is far more important, as new approaches to broken > software concepts and flaky hardware (yes, I'm looking at > you, Mister Intelprocessor!) and their exploitation are > being invented very quickly. So the OS has to provide the > optimal solutions for mitigation. A faster release cycle > surely helps a lot. Newer security flaws probably require > methods of dealing with them that cannot be easily ported > to older releases, so that's probably the reason why they > are not supported that long. Sure thing, this is why there are PATCH updates every time they are important for kernel and base security / stability / other fixes reasons.. also ports provide their own "on demand" updates that are separate from base :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 19:59:58 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64795244D17 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 19:59:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from mout.kundenserver.de (mout.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.187]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "mout.kundenserver.de", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass Class 2 CA" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MWsm5wrRz3MjM for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 19:59:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from r56.edvax.de ([178.8.36.223]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (mreue011 [212.227.15.167]) with ESMTPA (Nemesis) id 1MpD39-1joGg33d55-00qi3q; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:59:45 +0100 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:59:40 +0100 From: Polytropon To: Tomasz CEDRO Cc: FreeBSD , "@lbutlr" Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-Id: <20200218205940.04917783.freebsd@edvax.de> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> <20200218183010.5a52441f.freebsd@edvax.de> Reply-To: Polytropon Organization: EDVAX X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.1.1 (GTK+ 2.24.5; i386-portbld-freebsd8.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:hp3FkArtb7/CCXLIHEhPpWxHARSBINT4QRQqSiqNkEcUzafF8Ys 3jiSVXYUVKpPGhx29Cy3+zzIOnh3wStbtKYmxdP+WbmSRE2ILnvG7vVdMMT58XStRk+VwQ2 XEGMC4PfI0CSqKtRPGRwGS8cBlP3znLrG+GjQ/kLwBcDfcaehhdVosqzGAvLKVg496DFopP oYqMu1OofU1CAMcyt8s9Q== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:UtdlKBtseMU=:mE+IcQklQhgvgwqLekd/U8 ebXSqR2wTXPPTAW4W6Rhpbq5dwOcq9+BNLMn0a0QFEd96Sq6S7JnUCFtwsy9B7YUzsEdIunur TtgGTxzlCT/e8Uw8cJ6JUaF/idJeZqW7nUUTfsBWvYUdLsaUrNtf4S7GOEgF78Z+us7hANBA7 N42LvudabHN/Als/obolelEHQQ/Ny/yMzz6TacfXRvk8GpINC/9a3L9ckvy0ic3kWbGBrxRAz haghJuCRzu1r90Zd9IG0ZCFqJOkNonmTYuflLOu2NuIEimdXufzzqRlP+z/oyDUE67mcE21Qt 6ZZqBjCSAzW461kgwosWibReR3OWi4df5D300LxlWLq/Zx/Z8q8lMgliU4X6ap0tvpQs8VP/R QQoONOVmg3J8fdeEdIrHr6ZcawuHzHjxS6ucWM3sWSCU03LT07Wl1OAmnp9erjmSsozqqf5Da KGb1t4IVsNH9+9ll+vWhFYBu5S+Z3fSmTuf5bm88xD7Hz7Y5EiX7QS+ENOwKI7juS37SlWN4q jfJoH8t1qGTtFdxBd0KToND1GJlMzwrrLcvUG/MGcUa3Jyjnmb6Y48KBGaIE3EMYvZo+FNUZz QOO98dTe4FVQPYUATixCyh65doGn7Ny7WD1JF8Mxm2c3sTUJ4v2ofAF+yPgOhtr6qDEjLQELm mK51Rys9kc/hRVCbbKsmoTIB4yPxdDmYZ6whf2Z9fBtZw0wq5P2kvxQe2xrZ/aRcI9LSD0j87 g+IMeQt4Nz8QrzICzijeOSB36l0RAMhaBA+3YR+/HO1tp8dWtOC65+9kOKouTx+i0ny+0RYJ1 A8xRmAePT0kHCYnOpma9QyTKxfWhGi/+mSm5W7RKU4u5fJdA4/1wqLx7QL2ccte6H628D2P X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MWsm5wrRz3MjM X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@edvax.de has no SPF policy when checking 212.227.126.187) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@edvax.de X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.69 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd@edvax.de]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[223.36.8.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8560, ipnet:212.227.0.0/16, country:DE]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[edvax.de]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.99)[0.987,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.99)[0.993,0]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[187.126.227.212.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[187.126.227.212.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(0.31)[ip: (0.48), ipnet: 212.227.0.0/16(-1.12), asn: 8560(2.19), country: DE(-0.02)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 19:59:58 -0000 On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:48:51 +0100, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > Hello Poly :-) > > On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 6:31 PM Polytropon wrote: > > On desktop systems, especially those including web browsers > > and so-called "productivity software" (i. e., office suites), > > security is far more important, as new approaches to broken > > software concepts and flaky hardware (yes, I'm looking at > > you, Mister Intelprocessor!) and their exploitation are > > being invented very quickly. So the OS has to provide the > > optimal solutions for mitigation. A faster release cycle > > surely helps a lot. Newer security flaws probably require > > methods of dealing with them that cannot be easily ported > > to older releases, so that's probably the reason why they > > are not supported that long. > > Sure thing, this is why there are PATCH updates every time they are > important for kernel and base security / stability / other fixes > reasons.. also ports provide their own "on demand" updates that are > separate from base :-) Exactly! This, in combination with the "testing and refinement" process HEAD -> STABLE -> RELEASE, allows FreeBSD to be such a versatile operating system: Not only is it _not_ tied to a specific kidn of use (a desktop, a server, an appliance), but one OS can be used for all those cases, and even for "mixed forms", such as a desktop machine providing server functions; it also allows you to have _one_ OS and still choose if you want to follow an experimental, a bleeding-edge, or a rock solid state of the system. And whatever you choose, you get the full power of all the applications in the ports collection (wuth a few restrictions). Maybe I'm just stupid and ignorant, but what other OS families can offer all this? :-) -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 20:19:58 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBF5E245264 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:19:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=aCFo=4G=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info) Received: from mail.sermon-archive.info (sermon-archive.info [71.177.216.148]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48MXJs6JL4z4KZM for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:19:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=aCFo=4G=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info) Received: from [10.0.1.251] (mini [10.0.1.251]) by mail.sermon-archive.info (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48MXJr081Yz2fjQV for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 12:19:56 -0800 (PST) From: Doug Hardie Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) Subject: Switching to backup Network Message-Id: <64F39D12-E061-4726-B58E-943D61963944@mail.sermon-archive.info> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 12:19:55 -0800 To: FreeBSD X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.101.4 at mail X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MXJs6JL4z4KZM X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of SRS0=aCFo=4G=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info designates 71.177.216.148 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=SRS0=aCFo=4G=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.24 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.79)[-0.794,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:71.177.216.148]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.997,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(-0.05)[asn: 5650(-0.21), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[148.216.177.71.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[bc979@lafn.org,SRS0=aCFo=4G=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:5650, ipnet:71.177.216.0/23, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[bc979@lafn.org,SRS0=aCFo=4G=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:19:59 -0000 One of my clients has a machine running 12.1 that is connected via two = different NICs to two different WANs. He has drops from 2 different = ISPs to provide redundancy. I have configured each of the DNS names with = both IP addresses so that web access will switch over to the backup when = the primary is down. Setfib and pf are used to make that work. That = works fine (although there is a DNS timeout involved). The problem is = that all the servers on the machine talk out via the primary IP address. = While web access continues, the server initiated functions fail because = the next hop is down. Is there a way to switch everything over to the = backup network in this case? I don't find anything that enables = automatic changes to the default network. Also, when the backup network goes down, the default network entry for = setfib 1 route is deleted. I have to manually enter that when it comes = backup. I am initially setting that in /etc/rc.local. Is there a way = to make it either remain, or be restored? -- Doug From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 20:25:50 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BAAD245597 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:25:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48MXRc547xz4Tgw for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:25:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from point.uchicago.edu (point.uchicago.edu [128.135.52.6]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D44A84E684; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:25:47 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: Switching to backup Network To: Doug Hardie , FreeBSD References: <64F39D12-E061-4726-B58E-943D61963944@mail.sermon-archive.info> From: Valeri Galtsev Message-ID: <50d6c0e2-8e70-0743-1e9c-f4c36847a015@kicp.uchicago.edu> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:25:47 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <64F39D12-E061-4726-B58E-943D61963944@mail.sermon-archive.info> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MXRc547xz4Tgw X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=uchicago.edu (policy=none); spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu has no SPF policy when checking 128.135.20.70) smtp.mailfrom=galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.66 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[uchicago.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.89)[-0.887,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.995,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(0.12)[ip: (0.34), ipnet: 128.135.0.0/16(0.17), asn: 160(0.13), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[70.20.135.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:160, ipnet:128.135.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:25:50 -0000 On 2020-02-18 14:19, Doug Hardie wrote: > One of my clients has a machine running 12.1 that is connected via two different NICs to two different WANs. He has drops from 2 different ISPs to provide redundancy. I have configured each of the DNS names with both IP addresses so that web access will switch over to the backup when the primary is down. Setfib and pf are used to make that work. That works fine (although there is a DNS timeout involved). The problem is that all the servers on the machine talk out via the primary IP address. While web access continues, the server initiated functions fail because the next hop is down. Is there a way to switch everything over to the backup network in this case? I don't find anything that enables automatic changes to the default network. > > Also, when the backup network goes down, the default network entry for setfib 1 route is deleted. I have to manually enter that when it comes backup. I am initially setting that in /etc/rc.local. Is there a way to make it either remain, or be restored? > I would look into link aggregation (lagg): https://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/handbook/network-aggregation.html I used that to make my FreeBSD laptop switch over from WiFi to ethernet interface when the last link is available. Worked neat for me. Valeri > -- Doug > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > -- ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Feb 18 21:04:14 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AFA12464D6 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 21:04:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) Received: from mail.covisp.net (mail.covisp.net [65.121.55.42]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MYHw6M0qz48wr for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 21:04:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) From: "@lbutlr" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: Blacklist IP file for IPFW? Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 14:04:10 -0700 References: <9585fce4-b48d-a210-d62f-a2100c0cf929@tundraware.com> <24139.58932.915276.752500@jerusalem.litteratus.org> To: FreeBSD In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MYHw6M0qz48wr X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kremels@kreme.com designates 65.121.55.42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kremels@kreme.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.45 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.98)[-0.980,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx:c]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kreme.com]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.07)[ip: (-0.24), ipnet: 65.112.0.0/12(-0.00), asn: 209(-0.04), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_ZERO(0.00)[0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:209, ipnet:65.112.0.0/12, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[42.55.121.65.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 21:04:14 -0000 On 18 Feb 2020, at 07:00, Andreas X wrote: > Please see the line: 00350 15 882 deny ip from table(1) to any (BANS > the IPs from table 1 successfully) > BUT if that line would be: 65500 15 882 deny ip from table(1) to any > (It doesn't ban anything) Because one of those Allow lines from 00600 to 04100 is matching. -- Nothing gold can stay -- Robert Frost Stay gold -- Johnny Cade From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 00:03:14 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E891249903 for ; 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Wed, 19 Feb 2020 09:03:07 +0900 (JST) X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.102.2 at eastasia.home.utahime.org Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 09:01:12 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20200219.090112.524844276878963955.yasu@utahime.org> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: How to build and install only part of base source tree From: Yasuhiro KIMURA In-Reply-To: <20200218181853.846d2e1a.freebsd@edvax.de> References: <20200218.101420.353584891979293358.yasu@utahime.org> <20200218181853.846d2e1a.freebsd@edvax.de> X-Mailer: Mew version 6.8 on Emacs 26.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MdGS49rrz3yll X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=utahime.org header.s=maybe2019112701 header.b=RvYZeeNp; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of yasu@utahime.org designates 183.180.29.210 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=yasu@utahime.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.27 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[utahime.org:s=maybe2019112701]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.34)[-0.344,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+a:spf-authorized.utahime.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.77)[-0.767,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[utahime.org]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[utahime.org:+]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(0.38)[ip: (0.21), ipnet: 183.180.0.0/16(0.10), asn: 2519(1.53), country: JP(0.04)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:2519, ipnet:183.180.0.0/16, country:JP]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 00:03:14 -0000 From: Polytropon Subject: Re: How to build and install only part of base source tree Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 18:18:53 +0100 > First of all, there's /etc/src.conf to control aspects of the > whole build process (see "man 5 src.conf"). Additionally, you > can change into a specific program's directory within the source > tree, then build and install it from there, for example: > > # /usr/src/usr.bin/mt > [... you change mt.c ...] > # make > # make install > > However be careful that, depending on the kind of changes you > make, it's possible that you need to rebuild other programs or > libraries, too. While "make buildworld" and "make installworld" > will handle such changes in an optimal manner (also see the > comment header of /usr/src/Makefile), the manual approach is > quite convenient for smaller changes, and in case of user > programs, can often be tested immediately. I'm a bit surprised because I didn't expect this simplest way works fine. But I should have tried it before asking here;-). > PS. I've done the same in /usr/src/sbin/fsck_ffs while trying > to debug and finally solving a very rare data recovery > problem. At first I intended to add support of new envirionment varialbe to libfetch. But while investigating source code I suspect libfetch doesn't work as is documented under some conditions. So now I switched to check if the problem actually happens. And if I'm convinced I'll also debug the problem in a same way. --- Yasuhiro KIMURA From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 00:50:25 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72B8524AC26; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 00:50:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from new1-smtp.messagingengine.com (new1-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.221]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MfJv717Fz3KD1; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 00:50:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailnew.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id D840675C2; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 19:50:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); 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Tue, 18 Feb 2020 19:50:21 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.5\)) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life From: Yuri Pankov In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 03:49:49 +0300 Cc: Ed Maste , Steve O'Hara-Smith , FreeBSD Stable , FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200218091959.b0220ac75bcfbbced91a5708@sohara.org> To: Tomasz CEDRO X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MfJv717Fz3KD1 X-Spamd-Bar: +++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=yuripv.me header.s=fm1 header.b=Cj9C1wOW; dkim=pass header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm2 header.b=C6JfsCrv; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of yuripv@yuripv.me designates 66.111.4.221 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=yuripv@yuripv.me X-Spamd-Result: default: False [3.33 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_GOOD(0.00)[221.4.111.66.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.18]; R_SPF_ALLOW(0.00)[+ip4:66.111.4.221]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yuripv.me:+,messagingengine.com:+]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-3.48)[ip: (-9.78), ipnet: 66.111.4.0/24(-4.89), asn: 11403(-2.68), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[221.4.111.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:66.111.4.0/24, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[112.4.155.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_XBL(5.00)[112.4.155.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.4]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(0.00)[yuripv.me:s=fm1,messagingengine.com:s=fm2]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[yuripv.me]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.52)[0.522,0]; BAD_REP_POLICIES(0.10)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.89)[0.895,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 00:50:25 -0000 On 18 Feb 2020, at 20:39, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: >=20 > On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 3:51 PM Ed Maste wrote: >>=20 >> On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 at 05:37, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: >>>=20 >>> Maybe its a time to give OpenBSD a try.. >>=20 >> I really don't understand this comment, either. Certainly give = OpenBSD >> a try and if it fits your needs better that's great. >>=20 >> As far as I'm aware OpenBSD issues a release every six months and >> supports the most recent two releases, so it seems odd to me to >> complain about FreeBSD's ~1 year minor release support lifetime and 5 >> year stable branch support lifetime in that context. >=20 > Its more like "lets try if what I need works better over there". Not > really the release timeline. >=20 > The release timeline problem is more related with pushing untested > features (and possible avalanche of solutions that introduce yet > another complications that we observe right now). >=20 > "The BSD Way", for me, was always about "it works solid or its not > there". Like macOS / iOS. >=20 > Unlike "The Linux Way" where things changes upside down from release > to release and each one of them has its own universe of variants. Like > Android. >=20 > I am not sure if it is that important if there is a release in 6 month > or 2 years. Not a problem at all. If in two years I get a 5 new > features that work rock solid then it seems a better choice than > getting new features every six months and have more problems on a > production because of that. >=20 > If I need to experiment there is a CURRENT branch. For well tested > features I have STABLE. For rock solid "I bet my money on that" I have > a RELEASE. Right? >=20 > I did miss the 12.0 EoL kind of fix for DRM, sorry, it seems > reasonable. I am just worried that 12.2-RELEASE will have the same > problems, if not more new problems. It is something you can help with, run 12.2-STABLE on some spare = equipment and report problems that affect *your* environment.= From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 01:29:08 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B98D24B6D9 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 01:29:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info) Received: from mail.sermon-archive.info (sermon-archive.info [71.177.216.148]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48Mg9Z6N3Rz4g8f for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 01:29:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info) Received: from [10.0.1.251] (mini [10.0.1.251]) by mail.sermon-archive.info (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48Mg9X6KPwz2fjWF; Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:29:04 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) Subject: Re: Switching to backup Network From: Doug Hardie In-Reply-To: <50d6c0e2-8e70-0743-1e9c-f4c36847a015@kicp.uchicago.edu> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 17:29:04 -0800 Cc: FreeBSD Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <64F39D12-E061-4726-B58E-943D61963944@mail.sermon-archive.info> <50d6c0e2-8e70-0743-1e9c-f4c36847a015@kicp.uchicago.edu> To: Valeri Galtsev X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.101.4 at mail X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Mg9Z6N3Rz4g8f X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info designates 71.177.216.148 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.34 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.90)[-0.898,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:71.177.216.148]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-0.05)[asn: 5650(-0.21), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.992,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[148.216.177.71.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[bc979@lafn.org,SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:5650, ipnet:71.177.216.0/23, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[bc979@lafn.org,SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 01:29:08 -0000 > On 18 February 2020, at 12:25, Valeri Galtsev = wrote: >=20 >=20 >=20 > On 2020-02-18 14:19, Doug Hardie wrote: >> One of my clients has a machine running 12.1 that is connected via = two different NICs to two different WANs. He has drops from 2 different = ISPs to provide redundancy. I have configured each of the DNS names with = both IP addresses so that web access will switch over to the backup when = the primary is down. Setfib and pf are used to make that work. That = works fine (although there is a DNS timeout involved). The problem is = that all the servers on the machine talk out via the primary IP address. = While web access continues, the server initiated functions fail because = the next hop is down. Is there a way to switch everything over to the = backup network in this case? I don't find anything that enables = automatic changes to the default network. >> Also, when the backup network goes down, the default network entry = for setfib 1 route is deleted. I have to manually enter that when it = comes backup. I am initially setting that in /etc/rc.local. Is there a = way to make it either remain, or be restored? >>=20 >=20 > I would look into link aggregation (lagg): >=20 > https://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/handbook/network-aggregation.html >=20 > I used that to make my FreeBSD laptop switch over from WiFi to = ethernet interface when the last link is available. Worked neat for me. >=20 > Valeri >=20 Lagg looks neat, but my first setup didn't work. I suspect the issue is = the IP addresses. Each of the two networks have quite different IPs. = Both are fixed IP addresses but from different allocations. It appears = that lagg requires the use of one IP for both networks. All the = examples use just one IP address for both networks. -- Doug From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 04:47:26 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0B0524EEDE for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 04:47:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) Received: from mail.covisp.net (mail.covisp.net [65.121.55.42]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MlZM6cQHz4Fvh for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 04:47:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) From: "@lbutlr" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: Switching to backup Network Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2020 21:47:19 -0700 References: <64F39D12-E061-4726-B58E-943D61963944@mail.sermon-archive.info> To: FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <64F39D12-E061-4726-B58E-943D61963944@mail.sermon-archive.info> Message-Id: <44376A6C-558A-4399-A64E-4007612997B4@kreme.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MlZM6cQHz4Fvh X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kremels@kreme.com designates 65.121.55.42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kremels@kreme.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.25 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.80)[-0.796,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx:c]; MISSING_MIME_VERSION(2.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kreme.com]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.990,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.07)[ip: (-0.24), ipnet: 65.112.0.0/12(-0.00), asn: 209(-0.04), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_ZERO(0.00)[0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:209, ipnet:65.112.0.0/12, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[42.55.121.65.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 04:47:26 -0000 On 18 Feb 2020, at 13:19, Doug Hardie wrote: > One of my clients has a machine running 12.1 that is connected via two = different NICs to two different WANs. He has drops from 2 different = ISPs to provide redundancy. I have configured each of the DNS names with = both IP addresses so that web access will switch over to the backup when = the primary is down. Setfib and pf are used to make that work. That = works fine (although there is a DNS timeout involved). The problem is = that all the servers on the machine talk out via the primary IP address. = While web access continues, the server initiated functions fail because = the next hop is down. Is there a way to switch everything over to the = backup network in this case? I don't find anything that enables = automatic changes to the default network. When we had dual drops, we had a router/switch that managed the link = bonding, including routing when one connection went down. This seems the = best way to do this, but then again we had multiple machines. --=20 "Are you pondering what I'm pondering?" "I think so, Brain, but instant karma's always so lumpy.=E2=80=9D From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 08:44:03 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA44D25333E; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:44:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from babupalit@gmail.com) Received: from mail-ot1-x32f.google.com (mail-ot1-x32f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::32f]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MrqP5NsQz44Ff; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:44:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from babupalit@gmail.com) Received: by mail-ot1-x32f.google.com with SMTP id 59so22374795otp.12; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 00:44:01 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=dAD/IkF8ebZ665SDZJVBjGrvclsHc0hA8qyeedckxmI=; b=Ts4WnTO/uLgrZSc+g6SBsVmqtYppMUCtlPGEhaY9PK3NRk/Mh0EGUuYrloZI0/3DJ/ eJ+NHlmA1353snO+6g2ezKOuVhU8YWssmrOl8y7ADcAK+AcD0G276+lukVklNkRASGge Xzj/F9X8l5tCgEeH16Zw93qSJCWGat0HUe4+lbL/dV6cEDmr1sA6LeHFJHD7ivJaDC+y NH6SEp866kxDXVvhQi3+Ewd357gexT43ADe+4wa+e+tAvecenm1NbASnWMgO6x8WxjWN M0pfD+iPl+gux2HEyvVq39+HF4ZBcJo7nSmNx90k5ovWHMijv94H2+VemtWe+t3u5E89 yTGw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=dAD/IkF8ebZ665SDZJVBjGrvclsHc0hA8qyeedckxmI=; b=SJ49Z3/b2wWVDKzQPdc7ZsIB37jT2/lf2LhBUv2/9m8cYohlZrxg6tBJw8LUtnfVB7 XOVni4HOYWrKS1pxDU0vb7Lg2UxzbrcpVunl/3DFSE+MmwD2/kSSTG8xjQ88NKVOU17V /ULuxa/xWXFCvxFp7ZCzFwdcZqo1MUahQhWPQs5qfEsCJKAGDP9CG8yvNzGadoJMzyjE CtM2GttkOvxgaaU2HzImdq2RUC5sTPxRv7qRqnBrrCS73idPKSzIvzYinzoa6VMfhkML Oatmog/FEuUXZnrIf7ZUZlNW0zaN9u3frc0bpYhlVV44r2kUlZouRKhWI+pQBH7uF1// yY4A== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUHunk3U0YVBOfurzqzflEd9Ea4DGVrfE5LjAG3pzJ9H6pCKM1J /s7yqcQdvrN62nZG+1EksL6m0cevGL9cvwV+FOqbgZYP X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzGQczGEAQqIWJvqfw7Jap9mmygdGCgPKR5XN3xLEoFQYTWT13dQilWFfYiQ38f9dgcnG5JahYJuxDvd8cEO38= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6830:139a:: with SMTP id d26mr19542074otq.75.1582101839884; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 00:43:59 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Arpan Palit Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 14:13:48 +0530 Message-ID: Subject: msleep_spin is failed to waken up even after wakeup routine is invoked for the same. To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MrqP5NsQz44Ff X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=Ts4WnTO/; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of babupalit@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::32f as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=babupalit@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-7.81), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[f.2.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:44:03 -0000 Hi, I am facing one issue where wakeup rountine call is unable to waken up a msleep_spin routine call with a timeout value of 10 Seconds. The real scenario is as follows: post a hardware command and sleep using msleep_spin routine till interrupt comes, After getting the interrupt waken up the sleeping process using wakeup_one/wakeup routine call. As there are more than 2048 command and 16 parallel threads are running, observed randomly *one or two of the posted command* is *timing out* for which the *interrupt has came and also wakeup routine is invoked *after getting the interrupt for the same command. Note: *The issue is not seen when number of commands are less than 2048 with timeout of 10 seconds. *The issue can be seen with less number of commands also when timeout value 1 second. Can anyone please provide me an optimized way to schedule the process or a better way to do the scheduling. Thanks, Arpan Palit From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 08:52:59 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B139F253791 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:52:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic309-20.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (sonic309-20.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com [66.163.184.146]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Ms1j2mwbz4CM5 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:52:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com) X-YMail-OSG: tn0fomIVM1kcI9u3ofYccoPsNE1A2i5E5SlJ21FIguPzvozUZi1zhw1JX2ehB.j EN4L508nJEHj0eKxAMdo65HjjEKKk64cDZrxfgRJ9Px9CfiDU4FowW2m1lkWffxOQbEpt7Ww_vH8 jFSUb_DbFDmsukSTY5v5OumpvBIFF493YOYpd7iytmN22LLnx.NmAY7EJam0LjPb8EamM8e20eIl YQWB1ISpYF5jdbJgjoBZ0cI.v6uIxLoc8LJ39Mg39xzDTO9fy9DnNRytwOunrhabrnZBShHfytSn ec8VyzCtTXb6H158tPYuNehATozNnxq5MgRoewwxo.r5ZqDoDPnY8bdEZuvR0Dbg1faZ8ctgf2U4 H4YAa0TTsBd9c0l_DOC3Zs21FnRafrr3S76hatRtaNKpL8ewTCm4a53bCfwXj0_..NN__Z0Scie_ _9W1mdbyFIgCKDWgcWYFKx_2u4antWkB7sQuK1kjodddCxjm3BacFsu5vWFZ4WFlSyFuge7uMXak 5.pYBJpzJrBHJT_byAoMAz.lqQhVaTTZyMZkBLkjrwxVmP1TZRpb5vVC4KXU1h6F.9115kioJ1Mt RU76eKRazTLtpflyZmWKbqGLPFaNpNVz_tTMepILNnxjWB7risJkpjLCSJG39QeQkuhb36clXajT joQOlhIyyX5Lnxuj3Ynks2HrbtMN4DERgakKQCG_85mSNnJJz.AcWTwFRfeMPUHk8BX59KsoMwJk g4GEB1n2nVptPNpVbHlsKVEbUmxHN8lKuLJfn5JVaK0APk.gVLOQgVRrHl5YZpZxKWgzqAlnjHJi Vq_99gA5Dni1RsNT.1ApvweEHf8UnKSa7jMLAfU5nTGklkzKLCZ5FAa97tdvcbDEmgAHfLDOekiF V_AI_IKl2Q8ZWld6vpmHCP1uQbxAMkN0shaZe9aK1vJ2P9KEUF_B94mZFh_dW_6lX5LMkmQi5nV9 qRDdi1hnSm8UEA9qAs8aXSvY_DE0X_z6LMSZTY.NlCH6U6Xi7nkSbYcykt7aUaR_CXT5mT70HZqZ QkOc0mIf7fmXvhgnMWy2RLXRVrQ9qi3TTUNbVk6IEJKd2QqCzOrBTh0AKdBb.kUktRZkhn2Kyiqv Y409jDqlMmYwx2UqI6jnIfwYcR4BiKflUxyihBr7lhrUqNY28AP_z9k0w8qtdlATwoxwg2aw6d_o pTgvBIYqGBboAD2.0AyMqbwsTQCBED74fniuC7vZoLIb48.24eBKXu0gC96zrjc1nXwzC4isOjOt jYX6fsPRyV71HfGczeLye.sZkncTjDrXd8lwI.tXpdpewZO_VJSXSEzRcXRDamw4bollVOaV0FvE pVisuco7pF3j3TA2hOBDC8C1z7gbpL39bADz6uKPYjKpu5vRrLoqq6WzITiA2sSlq81fBuePHtOD BIPtYE3j70G4gtcG0_H3J72gU Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic309.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:52:55 +0000 Received: by smtp424.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 714e5cda267a7fbac13774c5e6a56353; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:52:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-pg1-f182.google.com with SMTP id z7so12376687pgk.7 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 00:52:52 -0800 (PST) X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUYaRLOtMhAFCUzUAQFTjqy36dQJbF1rqGQ2Zo3ONMwIR7zIP+e d7rU91XfHKjB9Zms8m58QmKlYYz4rrr2VJH1Zrs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwZSH9apGHwYKXW7cMFBAIntS77oSEDoFVTnzLMzpvb/rwVsa5r+hqZbcKLIMHVLZGUGaB2yiVgLwylfEOK0MQ= X-Received: by 2002:a65:6718:: with SMTP id u24mr27390604pgf.289.1582102371269; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 00:52:51 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200218091959.b0220ac75bcfbbced91a5708@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: From: Ottavio Caruso Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:52:33 +0000 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.15199 hermes Apache-HttpAsyncClient/4.1.4 (Java/1.8.0_181) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Ms1j2mwbz4CM5 X-Spamd-Bar: -- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.46 / 15.00]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36646, ipnet:66.163.184.0/21, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.81)[-0.811,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.95)[-0.952,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (3.72), ipnet: 66.163.184.0/21(1.17), asn: 36646(0.94), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[146.184.163.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[146.184.163.66.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:52:59 -0000 On Wed, 19 Feb 2020 at 00:49, Yuri Pankov wrote: > > On 18 Feb 2020, at 20:39, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > > > On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 3:51 PM Ed Maste wrote: > >> > >> On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 at 05:37, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > >>> > >>> Maybe its a time to give OpenBSD a try.. > >> > >> I really don't understand this comment, either. Certainly give OpenBSD > >> a try and if it fits your needs better that's great. > >> > >> As far as I'm aware OpenBSD issues a release every six months and > >> supports the most recent two releases, so it seems odd to me to > >> complain about FreeBSD's ~1 year minor release support lifetime and 5 > >> year stable branch support lifetime in that context. > > > > Its more like "lets try if what I need works better over there". Not > > really the release timeline. > > > > The release timeline problem is more related with pushing untested > > features (and possible avalanche of solutions that introduce yet > > another complications that we observe right now). > > > > "The BSD Way", for me, was always about "it works solid or its not > > there". Like macOS / iOS. > > > > Unlike "The Linux Way" where things changes upside down from release > > to release and each one of them has its own universe of variants. Like > > Android. > > > > I am not sure if it is that important if there is a release in 6 month > > or 2 years. Not a problem at all. If in two years I get a 5 new > > features that work rock solid then it seems a better choice than > > getting new features every six months and have more problems on a > > production because of that. > > > > If I need to experiment there is a CURRENT branch. For well tested > > features I have STABLE. For rock solid "I bet my money on that" I have > > a RELEASE. Right? > > > > I did miss the 12.0 EoL kind of fix for DRM, sorry, it seems > > reasonable. I am just worried that 12.2-RELEASE will have the same > > problems, if not more new problems. > > It is something you can help with, run 12.2-STABLE on some spare equipment and report problems that affect *your* environment. To a beginner and uninitiated like me, the way FreeBSD labels "stable", "release", "releng" and "current" is, at the very least, confusing. -- Ottavio Caruso From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 08:57:52 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 558A9253921 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:57:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from new1-smtp.messagingengine.com (new1-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.221]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Ms7M0YVhz4Gs5 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:57:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailnew.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 205E433C2; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 03:57:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); 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Wed, 19 Feb 2020 03:57:48 -0500 (EST) From: Yuri Pankov Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.5\)) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 11:57:47 +0300 In-Reply-To: Cc: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List To: Ottavio Caruso References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200218091959.b0220ac75bcfbbced91a5708@sohara.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Ms7M0YVhz4Gs5 X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=yuripv.me header.s=fm1 header.b=QzyVUTLG; dkim=pass header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm2 header.b=ZfHKnrWl; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of yuripv@yuripv.me designates 66.111.4.221 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=yuripv@yuripv.me X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.87 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_GOOD(0.00)[221.4.111.66.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.18]; R_SPF_ALLOW(0.00)[+ip4:66.111.4.221]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; 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charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:57:52 -0000 On 19 Feb 2020, at 11:52, Ottavio Caruso via freebsd-questions = wrote: >=20 > On Wed, 19 Feb 2020 at 00:49, Yuri Pankov wrote: >>=20 >> On 18 Feb 2020, at 20:39, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: >>>=20 >>> On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 3:51 PM Ed Maste wrote: >>>>=20 >>>> On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 at 05:37, Tomasz CEDRO = wrote: >>>>>=20 >>>>> Maybe its a time to give OpenBSD a try.. >>>>=20 >>>> I really don't understand this comment, either. Certainly give = OpenBSD >>>> a try and if it fits your needs better that's great. >>>>=20 >>>> As far as I'm aware OpenBSD issues a release every six months and >>>> supports the most recent two releases, so it seems odd to me to >>>> complain about FreeBSD's ~1 year minor release support lifetime and = 5 >>>> year stable branch support lifetime in that context. >>>=20 >>> Its more like "lets try if what I need works better over there". Not >>> really the release timeline. >>>=20 >>> The release timeline problem is more related with pushing untested >>> features (and possible avalanche of solutions that introduce yet >>> another complications that we observe right now). >>>=20 >>> "The BSD Way", for me, was always about "it works solid or its not >>> there". Like macOS / iOS. >>>=20 >>> Unlike "The Linux Way" where things changes upside down from release >>> to release and each one of them has its own universe of variants. = Like >>> Android. >>>=20 >>> I am not sure if it is that important if there is a release in 6 = month >>> or 2 years. Not a problem at all. If in two years I get a 5 new >>> features that work rock solid then it seems a better choice than >>> getting new features every six months and have more problems on a >>> production because of that. >>>=20 >>> If I need to experiment there is a CURRENT branch. For well tested >>> features I have STABLE. For rock solid "I bet my money on that" I = have >>> a RELEASE. Right? >>>=20 >>> I did miss the 12.0 EoL kind of fix for DRM, sorry, it seems >>> reasonable. I am just worried that 12.2-RELEASE will have the same >>> problems, if not more new problems. >>=20 >> It is something you can help with, run 12.2-STABLE on some spare = equipment and report problems that affect *your* environment. >=20 > To a beginner and uninitiated like me, the way FreeBSD labels > "stable", "release", "releng" and "current" is, at the very least, > confusing. Thankfully, it is documented: = https://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/current-stable.= html = .= From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 10:26:49 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51B6225518E for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 10:26:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: from mail-qk1-x735.google.com (mail-qk1-x735.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::735]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Mv5z4vJ2z4HtV for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 10:26:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: by mail-qk1-x735.google.com with SMTP id z19so22488901qkj.5 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 02:26:47 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=seibercom.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:reply-to :organization:face:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=z3nwCDYOro8cfrUY5KTF29WXolXtlLOmIiK4BH1nUiQ=; b=bedWZAVVObIWVid8LhiHv3jilrX96wxDpLhh4jMfZna1usrhpGQGFO4ksNT3gK2QXS rlKgYQopRJD+WAj0lIm8EcjIYGHq8OFRnANwW1Xl8nnIQ9YAKf4DiGIXkE8oivxXSa+a SH6zHxLX+1teQJNdRlO5SDVUNgongw1uicP3w= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:reply-to:organization:face:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=z3nwCDYOro8cfrUY5KTF29WXolXtlLOmIiK4BH1nUiQ=; b=LH98Svaf4sTh7fVti9U33dzGm0hudGXF01S1u6yWkNdzORsxFMYBsbaJDEg/ICwSDf Yz6Eqmmu1qOsnguS8K0UnqXQaaNqZKWAN1nHvAxwHObd43GLG/lIp27JO/WQlZ+YHtZU BMaWb4SIgpbcCzFgi4AJ9yiJ6l9X8TKazK5Znih76FUpwLyhdVnjwkQXIPbeFWm2YzwQ zojlM+N/0rGfkVPXgV2G1aDMvtlNKPZ0coZgRXFLTp0Wf9JJ6WJTi0gGXXElS3QBbgPl JMqrfuvhytRwhiZ+K0JvFpDi0Gm4WnhYPNNVu4Opc5ZsHjj1vBcfmy0MYBA8h4G5IdU1 nFAw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAW2Ox4oNwU8vjBQ38Zg7TksDnk/sHZFCFCSBAp5QURsPth4hYEy 1QVY+iBYdLPt03DU49HQKSHYdmyexaw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqw3jIFBclh/cfXxcrdPZCv6UanYvJaCQJQIlZ8zi82hCzCl8S/7fvYxXbVsDp4VEkIYS7f6sw== X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:a46:: with SMTP id j6mr2591242qka.109.1582108006336; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 02:26:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio.seibercom.net (cpe-174-109-225-250.nc.res.rr.com. [174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id l6sm728648qti.10.2020.02.19.02.26.45 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Wed, 19 Feb 2020 02:26:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48Mv5w2YZwz1VJZ for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 05:26:44 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 05:26:43 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200219052643.7bd90d3c@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <20200218205940.04917783.freebsd@edvax.de> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> <20200218183010.5a52441f.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200218205940.04917783.freebsd@edvax.de> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Mv5z4vJ2z4HtV X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=bedWZAVV; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::735 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.43 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.57)[ip: (-9.24), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[5.3.7.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 10:26:49 -0000 On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 20:59:40 +0100, Polytropon stated: >Exactly! This, in combination with the "testing and refinement" >process HEAD -> STABLE -> RELEASE, allows FreeBSD to be such a >versatile operating system: Not only is it _not_ tied to a >specific kidn of use (a desktop, a server, an appliance), but >one OS can be used for all those cases, and even for "mixed >forms", such as a desktop machine providing server functions; >it also allows you to have _one_ OS and still choose if you >want to follow an experimental, a bleeding-edge, or a rock solid >state of the system. And whatever you choose, you get the full >power of all the applications in the ports collection (wuth a >few restrictions). Maybe I'm just stupid and ignorant, but >what other OS families can offer all this? :-) That is, of course, based on the assumption that you can even get the OS to install and run. -- Jerry From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 12:07:23 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF08A23812F for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 12:07:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic311-23.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (sonic311-23.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com [66.163.188.204]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MxL209X1z3GMk for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 12:07:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com) X-YMail-OSG: eDV8NSwVM1kVfFU4ByBXeXB7xSAFi65KEMlyn4q3b6Kc8Dqo81awwfS0OxjnKj8 ijBYqA2XiyYjaZnjZZkeWjn9WhXifEvIauKsxfZkFfiHVIS5X4c6wehnu0pM4zugJc6pZB.JP765 y33rE9gWN_LCMUN5MReIfkHKAhx866bAoXCZYL7N7KY2uxsRzQ9f0CQwRx4gaUXL0guPBzlK4fs. 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O.mu5yunMHXAAOsROETsfreLD1Lgbxu4W61nf5MhNE.w_XWt2viSmc8vvWoMbCSmd2A2E8CHHZOR enqWSEuCPLvz9vyC88DnlN52KJWhm4s4bpJVzEyl7KelcpLdRDxgKc.SWPSTuy6oFDKv.NzpNjVa Im0pUXFbp7qwm6WKGqIDTWtwkhqkhWd6I4oG4xL6YhVbaJvObE10yFt5s8o45MxtfnGDhxz0wdnH W85xIRM85nDQU6pn16FY4RZduPCInW8ijPKEzGdSbKoSLZM_gadf9bk7HPZMShWfl9Kkx3P4DSXh rPtCuSIHNItdTl77KJ0Rp Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic311.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 12:07:20 +0000 Received: by smtp418.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID bbf9a48895008c0f40873896068b8bbb; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 12:07:14 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-pj1-f53.google.com with SMTP id dw13so5343pjb.4 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 04:07:14 -0800 (PST) X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUKk1kqkrTBmyT4ONhT6t49Z42+8KeEWlna/+/rR6BnfNjmHbxy oqOzyzKf46xrdBPNFIsmitHP1gnrf/mmqXjLTE0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyDN17AMcVeTEotIq7zu7HnC4Qk4GhsLaSDt2yyIIrw67QHJ9MoUVpPG8mpo8opYy5IcMyc7XBIza5PedK6veM= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90b:1256:: with SMTP id gx22mr8692438pjb.94.1582114034084; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 04:07:14 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200218091959.b0220ac75bcfbbced91a5708@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: From: Ottavio Caruso Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 12:06:57 +0000 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.15199 hermes Apache-HttpAsyncClient/4.1.4 (Java/1.8.0_181) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MxL209X1z3GMk X-Spamd-Bar: -- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.53 / 15.00]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36646, ipnet:66.163.184.0/21, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.87)[-0.872,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_NEUTRAL(0.00)[204.188.163.66.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.13]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.96)[-0.960,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (3.87), ipnet: 66.163.184.0/21(1.17), asn: 36646(0.94), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[204.188.163.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 12:07:23 -0000 On Wed, 19 Feb 2020 at 08:57, Yuri Pankov wrote: > > On 19 Feb 2020, at 11:52, Ottavio Caruso via freebsd-questions wrote: > > To a beginner and uninitiated like me, the way FreeBSD labels > "stable", "release", "releng" and "current" is, at the very least, > confusing. > > > Thankfully, it is documented: https://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/current-stable.html. Yes, it is, but one has to go to chapter 24 of the handbook to understand how it works. This should be at the very beginning and explained in simpler terms. Of course, based on the assumption that you want to new users to use FreeBSD, but if you want to keep the base small, it's fine just like that. -- Ottavio Caruso From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 12:49:18 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5C8F2392F1 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 12:49:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from roberthuff@rcn.com) Received: from smtp.rcn.com (smtp.rcn.com [69.168.97.78]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48MyGQ0Zrnz3MsL for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 12:49:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from roberthuff@rcn.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; d=rcn.com; s=20180516; c=relaxed/simple; q=dns/txt; i=@rcn.com; t=1582116556; h=From:Subject:Date:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; bh=MLt4lXTZ9eK0t6UXiNr0HoyGnbg=; b=o/MifdHyAeCUYkktUJ9OKfKB8oFGr4PrHhdULDmG1T1zOfK86tOLuVPg/XGwe48g NGSPPHqGey852Wd0Wb79AQGxvQDOwjuREA6JCxKFRtu7Wq4VnLotWVkaFcwigX+h +UWnGax5TfKqy3AGtvQWbruxlfRQmnNoAOLt8y9vsYiZ0Dy0S3vrmMe6JhIioDn/ NFK6WadQ+qe5CTIo7F2cRg2ylded+hNarfOIwXjfOaXdXEi9hcakKPa55JtPPnUZ V82Qtm5+uE/SvPGmUpcJOP1QlXWpLj+rP8b7X93MJC9ShSJqBwcqWPOhBoDMr6zi 3hNolzL5dWEpXCT628T1QA==; X_CMAE_Category: , , X-CNFS-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=bugy+3Si c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=9TgA2UwI6Wy+6BV4wQM/cQ==:117 a=9TgA2UwI6Wy+6BV4wQM/cQ==:17 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=KGjhK52YXX0A:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=XRQyMpdBKAEA:10 a=l697ptgUJYAA:10 a=48faUk6PgeAA:10 a=eCWpaoDoM_3XyCLIQUAA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 X-CM-Score: 0 X-Scanned-by: Cloudmark Authority Engine X-Authed-Username: cm9iZXJ0aHVmZkByY24uY29t Received: from [209.6.230.48] ([209.6.230.48:39984] helo=jerusalem.litteratus.org.litteratus.org) by smtp.rcn.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.25.56547 r(Core:3.6.25.0)) with ESMTPSA (cipher=AES256-GCM-SHA384) id 4E/88-56402-CCE2D4E5; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 07:49:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <24141.11979.227202.33463@jerusalem.litteratus.org> Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 07:49:15 -0500 From: Robert Huff To: "\@lbutlr" Cc: FreeBSD Subject: Re: Switching to backup Network In-Reply-To: <44376A6C-558A-4399-A64E-4007612997B4@kreme.com> References: <64F39D12-E061-4726-B58E-943D61963944@mail.sermon-archive.info> <44376A6C-558A-4399-A64E-4007612997B4@kreme.com> X-Mailer: VM 8.2.0b under 26.3 (amd64-portbld-freebsd13.0) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48MyGQ0Zrnz3MsL X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=rcn.com header.s=20180516 header.b=o/MifdHy; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=rcn.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of roberthuff@rcn.com designates 69.168.97.78 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=roberthuff@rcn.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.59 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[rcn.com:s=20180516]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:69.168.97.0/24]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-1.49)[ip: (-9.27), ipnet: 69.168.97.0/24(1.02), asn: 36271(0.86), country: US(-0.05)]; DWL_DNSWL_LOW(-1.00)[rcn.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[rcn.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[rcn.com,none]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[78.97.168.69.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36271, ipnet:69.168.97.0/24, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 12:49:18 -0000 @lbutlr writes: > When we had dual drops, we had a router/switch that managed the link > bonding, including routing when one connection went down. This seems > the best way to do this, but then again we had multiple machines. Unless one has other constraints ... surely there is something that does this available second-hand, possibly for quite cheap. Respectfully, Robert Huff From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 14:32:37 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FB3023BFF3 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 14:32:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48N0Yb57GJz4HSp for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 14:32:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from [IPv6:2607:fb90:17ca:898e:e9f4:b239:49fb:8d23] (unknown [172.58.139.203]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id ACCC74E6B9; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:32:34 -0600 (CST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.5\)) Subject: Re: Switching to backup Network From: Valeri Galtsev In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:32:33 -0600 Cc: FreeBSD Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <64F39D12-E061-4726-B58E-943D61963944@mail.sermon-archive.info> <50d6c0e2-8e70-0743-1e9c-f4c36847a015@kicp.uchicago.edu> To: Doug Hardie X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48N0Yb57GJz4HSp X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=uchicago.edu (policy=none); spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu has no SPF policy when checking 128.135.20.70) smtp.mailfrom=galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.03 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[uchicago.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[203.139.58.172.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.990,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(0.12)[ip: (0.34), ipnet: 128.135.0.0/16(0.17), asn: 160(0.13), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.75)[-0.754,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[70.20.135.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:160, ipnet:128.135.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 14:32:37 -0000 > On Feb 18, 2020, at 7:29 PM, Doug Hardie wrote: >=20 >> On 18 February 2020, at 12:25, Valeri Galtsev = wrote: >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> On 2020-02-18 14:19, Doug Hardie wrote: >>> One of my clients has a machine running 12.1 that is connected via = two different NICs to two different WANs. He has drops from 2 different = ISPs to provide redundancy. I have configured each of the DNS names with = both IP addresses so that web access will switch over to the backup when = the primary is down. Setfib and pf are used to make that work. That = works fine (although there is a DNS timeout involved). The problem is = that all the servers on the machine talk out via the primary IP address. = While web access continues, the server initiated functions fail because = the next hop is down. Is there a way to switch everything over to the = backup network in this case? I don't find anything that enables = automatic changes to the default network. >>> Also, when the backup network goes down, the default network entry = for setfib 1 route is deleted. I have to manually enter that when it = comes backup. I am initially setting that in /etc/rc.local. Is there a = way to make it either remain, or be restored? >>>=20 >>=20 >> I would look into link aggregation (lagg): >>=20 >> = https://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/handbook/network-aggregation.html >>=20 >> I used that to make my FreeBSD laptop switch over from WiFi to = ethernet interface when the last link is available. Worked neat for me. >>=20 >> Valeri >>=20 >=20 > Lagg looks neat, but my first setup didn't work. I suspect the issue = is the IP addresses. Each of the two networks have quite different IPs. = Both are fixed IP addresses but from different allocations. It appears = that lagg requires the use of one IP for both networks. All the = examples use just one IP address for both networks. >=20 I did not look into setting lagg for two ethernet interfaces, mine was = for ethernet + WiFi. But they were definitely on different networks. = Additional simplicity of my case was: both interfaces were DHCP clients = (that took care of routing auto-magically). There was one =E2=80=9Chack=E2= =80=9D I did in my case: I have a vague recollection I made both = adapters under lagg have the same MAC address (by changing one of them), = but that likely was due to my insufficient knowledge or laziness when I = was setting it up. Expert probably will do it without that hack. I still = have a feeling, one can do it for static IPs (my laptop configuration = does work for interfaces on different networks), that=E2=80=99s why I = suggested to look into that. Hopefully, some lagg expert will offer you help. It may make sense to = ask on freebsd-net list. Valeri > -- Doug >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 16:02:09 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EB5E23E73C for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 16:02:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tim@timpreston.net) Received: from out5-smtp.messagingengine.com (out5-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.29]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48N2Xw4DgMz4bMs for ; 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Wed, 19 Feb 2020 11:02:07 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.1.7-802-g7a41c81-fmstable-20200203v1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <20aa26cd-4b39-4724-a444-30b902dfadd4@www.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: <20200217194207.rxmcomsn4jvmoc7c@sea-ll-10936> References: <8a9a33b3-4eb1-419c-a9e3-fca4db430619@www.fastmail.com> <20200217194207.rxmcomsn4jvmoc7c@sea-ll-10936> Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 17:00:58 +0100 From: "Tim Preston" To: "Ihor Antonov" Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Technological advantages over Linux Content-Type: text/plain;charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48N2Xw4DgMz4bMs X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=timpreston.net header.s=mesmtp header.b=kOjHIJSS; dkim=pass header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm2 header.b=orj4Upi5; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tim@timpreston.net designates 66.111.4.29 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=tim@timpreston.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.08 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[timpreston.net:s=mesmtp,messagingengine.com:s=fm2]; XM_UA_NO_VERSION(0.01)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:66.111.4.29]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[timpreston.net]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[timpreston.net:+,messagingengine.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(-3.49)[ip: (-9.84), ipnet: 66.111.4.0/24(-4.89), asn: 11403(-2.68), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[29.4.111.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:66.111.4.0/24, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_WWW(0.50)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 16:02:09 -0000 I apologize for the slow reply. Responses inline: On Mon, 17 Feb 2020, at 8:42 PM, Ihor Antonov wrote: > On 2020-02-17 09:47, Tim Preston wrote: > > Thank you Ihor, this is a great summary. > >=20 > > On thing I'd like to mention regarding Docker is the inherent > > abstraction leakage around pre-built images as they tend to be tied = to > > the host they were built on. >=20 > > For example, I've seen quite a few images in Docker Hub with a > > hardcoded UID which causes file permissions issue when mounting a > > volume from the host. Or often authors just assume you'll run the > > container as root. >=20 > Yes, this is a known problem. For reasons unknow to me (could be > technical limitation back when docker started) docker daemon was not > performing UID mapping, so that root > UID inside container (0) was also same UID outside containers, which > created all sorts of problems. Docker now allow to do that, but the > feature is not default >=20 > https://docs.docker.com/engine/security/userns-remap/ >=20 > Newer tool - podman - offers rootless containers feature and perform t= his > by default. Podman got rit of privileged daemon process, so that now > entire container tooling runs in user namespace. And so it has to do > UID/GID mapping between parent/child namespaces, >=20 > This is a step in right direction since now joes don't need root > privileges to work with container tooling.=20 >=20 > Can you create jails in FreeBSD as non-root user and have root inside > jail? >=20 That=E2=80=99s a good question. I haven=E2=80=99t looked into it, maybe = someone else knows? >=20 > Initial design of docker has a flaw, that > was necessary back then, but not anymore - it has a privileged daemon > running, listening on a socket for commands from CLI tool. >=20 >=20 > > Another is a mismatch of kernel versions or capabilities between ima= ge > > build host and your host, for example, Redis usually needs Transpare= nt > > Huge Pages to be turned off in the kernel. >=20 > While this is probably true, I never encountered this issue myslef. An= d > if software requires specific kernel settings - does jail solve this > problem better? (I don't know if there are per-jail sysctl configs..) >=20 I don=E2=80=99t think this is a container problem, but rather a problem = of running images created on a different host. > > It's for these reasons (and the previously mentioned security risks)= > > I'd hope that an 'image' model isn't implemented for FreeBSD jails. > > Recipes to build jails are a much better idea, as per iocage and > > Bastille. >=20 > Pre-build images can emerge as inevitable need to speed up build > process. If your recepie(dockerfile) relies on another recipie and tha= t > one relies on another - it could take A LOT of time to build all the > layers you rely on.=20 >=20 > Basically docker "image" is just collection of layers.=20 > When you work on the dockerfile and > rebuild it regularly - you don't want to rebuild parts that have not > changed. And so docker came up with the idea of image layers. Each > command in Dockerfile creates a layer. And if you did not touch that > specific line in dockerfile - layer will be re-used > When you are finished - your "image" is just a resulting set of layers= . > (overly simplified, but the gist of it)=20 >=20 > And since linux folks did not have proper COW file system(ZFS) they ha= d=20 > to > invent things like overlayfs to quickly take snapshots of the image -=20= > because simply > gziping the image every time somethig chages there was VERY SLOW. >=20 > Dockerhub also stores all the layers, because it appers to be > storage-efficient, since many images can have shared layers. >=20 > So as much as I am with you on=20 > > hope that an 'image' model isn't implemented=20 > I see it as inevitable result of ecosystem development... unless a > radically different approach is taken towards solving "long build time= s" > problem. >=20 I wonder how much of the long build time problem was created by introduc= ing images and layers? I=E2=80=99ve only just started using jails but I = haven=E2=80=99t seen this problem in FreeBSD. As far as I know the longe= st step is downloading a release to base your containers on.=20 In ezjail, for example, you can update all dependent jails by updating t= he base jail once. In Docker, updating the base image would mean rebuild= ing all dependent images, since a change in one layer means rebuilding a= ll higher layers. Docker was important because it paved the way for wide scale kubernetes = adoption. But to answer the original question, no I don=E2=80=99t think = Linux has any technological advantages over FreeBSD in regard to contain= erization. Outside of the ephemeral, horizontally scalable container use= -case I think that jails are more useful. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 16:31:33 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E48CE23F3A4 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 16:31:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-io1-f52.google.com (mail-io1-f52.google.com [209.85.166.52]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48N3Bs1KCHz4SSF for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 16:31:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: by mail-io1-f52.google.com with SMTP id t26so1181287ioi.13 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:31:33 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=rGGEWPbyP4dgoYi/XdqHqGCpoze5q8jPjmdnusMDzsc=; b=MuC+UPwZweWlcSx1n5YoRbhuTxeQv9VhEhrVIp9m3ku4iRtCSJJuHGZQOfJCGH2tvz 2miTa8Ob/LrFSYW7/WBMzbQF3fBuYWg2rq5+iQ/wlSfdcKapj5Fk0+PBkFwjUeTi0Kvt /43u7H7v5ZriRs9DlszUOMDxWFGYa174Qw7G9hunbeKpQz4Kfsh7ix0xuXp85Y86cdBJ J17Zx5XVJ/LHP4bt4HbTkOa/FYEGl2dgz2a0rCtORpeOqZ/kVdL5QhxjlKHBoUofKl/9 aG9cb6Nsa+XE4722zsnMEE/y02dUwHNPxc5z3ixFYg/RaXeu9sTwhTidYSyp89a3nAaS yB0Q== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWr25aqjkz08IjboLoYhmurs5yzSdCn7rANpVKKmP5MGDjWeXvt TO4jDyqrnxbGaIaFm9A4NWlvX+wR6olLwHnVEWuIuH94 X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzGNP6DEOveXsoouebeHK1AmdIolFmLEx8B0Qoksh1Kce3StFmDndpff6wYWo9DTUO3jVpuIRkZHjTkKHQo/6g= X-Received: by 2002:a02:7092:: with SMTP id f140mr21750736jac.128.1582129891122; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:31:31 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> <20200218183010.5a52441f.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200218205940.04917783.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200219052643.7bd90d3c@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <20200219052643.7bd90d3c@scorpio> From: Ed Maste Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 11:31:18 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: FreeBSD Questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48N3Bs1KCHz4SSF X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 16:31:34 -0000 On Wed, 19 Feb 2020 at 05:26, Jerry wrote: > > That is, of course, based on the assumption that you can even get > the OS to install and run. > That's an unfortunate issue, but it's very hard to make progress without getting an affected machine to an appropriate developer. 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[174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id o189sm336316ywe.15.2020.02.19.10.06.30 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Wed, 19 Feb 2020 10:06:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48N5JQ0hZBz1Vbh for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 13:06:30 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 13:06:28 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200219130628.457f8953@scorpio> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> <20200218183010.5a52441f.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200218205940.04917783.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200219052643.7bd90d3c@scorpio> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48N5JV4lGMz3Lh6 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=CGHBlXOB; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::c31 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.50 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.50)[ip: (-8.86), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[1.3.c.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 18:06:35 -0000 On Wed, 19 Feb 2020 11:31:18 -0500, Ed Maste stated: >That's an unfortunate issue, but it's very hard to make progress >without getting an affected machine to an appropriate developer. Personally, Ed, I think your suggestion is absurd. For years I heard the often-repeated statement, “Lock-In,” when referring to MS Products. The far more common, though less mentioned statement of, “Locked Out” was conveniently bypassed. I cannot begin to tell you how many times I wanted to use a piece of equipment or advanced technology but was not able to do so when outside an MS environment. Now, I find that FBSD 12.x will not even install and run on my PC. This cannot be because the technology is too new. 11.x runs just fine. This is obviously a problem with the programming. I have been told by you and others that they need a machine to work on to discover the problem. Seriously, that is BS. It worked before; they broke it when updating. If it had never worked, I might have considered donating a piece of equipment to assist them, but this is obviously not that sort of problem. I have consulted Dell, including a voice conversation with a technician. He, himself, said that he uses Linux on one of his machines. They have never received a problem like I am experiencing on any other OS other then FBSD. I have confidence that the problem will be fixed eventually, either when the problem has evolved to be a nuisance to a much larger audience or by dumb luck. In either case, since it did once work, it is obviously not beyond the scope of the engineers to correct the problem. -- Jerry From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 18:22:13 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 486AF24182A for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 18:22:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-io1-f43.google.com (mail-io1-f43.google.com [209.85.166.43]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48N5fX2mwhz44f2 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 18:22:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: by mail-io1-f43.google.com with SMTP id z193so1655509iof.1 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 10:22:11 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=3rDMgueLfXO3F1Wkfn9e6sq3+47L+a3YaobgRvwCsY0=; b=SlwKk5TFtPWTa9Ardn3gHcEyOKL+HXx+DaKEk8iwwjVpYWduE+koh31gcMvUZTs33m 0uFHMl0tgb/vH3hhQIHB6I1Dq8YVHzvpYKXLF52gTNXehQTZurljUkNYCenljy4ipkwL mJccLTxAMMeTqQGpTUEsqiXV9xlRCzSnpbQGh0Tjn3x0UL5adhkD1PQNi1oxo989WKs0 K4cmTYW9h0hyKc6V9qcunCcWJ7FOtN/CNwn/W0YTnWGGAjGGVPSYnRrF1u4YHpobGBdY hVpNHwksnpOQUHnjnRCWLE4MyRJu+UxlgB6LbAMLHD0h9Nrsks0mz0AxfT4m196k1SRJ KYVg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVm05C7D36/Leu6PhPI0bNqdIXbkKwED0sqb7XNV3uTL3sAbFD/ bIGqaW5tcExaplSA1eeD3u4YilC5kzJdYHKTv1k2W5TQ X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxAYz80lMMLqrScxnHzmS/O6TwfIWAkpe4RWcOhI4KXlj4HlE0D3gZcYG0UQTe89zmLUQ61T7xn4UFtnQD15no= X-Received: by 2002:a6b:400b:: with SMTP id k11mr20928498ioa.256.1582136529768; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 10:22:09 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> <20200218183010.5a52441f.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200218205940.04917783.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200219052643.7bd90d3c@scorpio> <20200219130628.457f8953@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <20200219130628.457f8953@scorpio> From: Ed Maste Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 13:21:56 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: FreeBSD Questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48N5fX2mwhz44f2 X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 18:22:13 -0000 On Wed, 19 Feb 2020 at 13:06, Jerry wrote: > > On Wed, 19 Feb 2020 11:31:18 -0500, Ed Maste stated: > >That's an unfortunate issue, but it's very hard to make progress > >without getting an affected machine to an appropriate developer. > > =EF=BB=BFPersonally, Ed, I think your suggestion is absurd. If getting a machine to a developer into the hands of a developer who can investigate and fix the issue is absurd, what would you suggest instead? From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 18:47:46 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E300241DCD for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 18:47:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: from mail-yb1-xb34.google.com (mail-yb1-xb34.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b34]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48N6D13yK8z3DkC for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 18:47:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: by mail-yb1-xb34.google.com with SMTP id z125so809674ybf.9 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 10:47:45 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=seibercom.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:reply-to :organization:face:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=1FH2lWjxUrG0iWYnNvoEyKxoMuEFTPk1GY4tSzkdkxk=; b=RN47Fky+FpVUkAJbEEVgu2cWgiUL1EW1cy14QUlA0E/9CUxrWbJrKSD8eZieu5tYR6 sNBpW4Hw6Bq7ABme7avkPIuowIc8ka3DUL8gBbhvxzrOR/AGmLWcXon+ON+4H9T8L0oQ ZzGdEbGt8EQ0zDvGQXgksPmZKsXxe+2osyRC8= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:reply-to:organization:face:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=1FH2lWjxUrG0iWYnNvoEyKxoMuEFTPk1GY4tSzkdkxk=; b=AqNebh0pxCMxrdOwoHjbMmZ5FYu6mZ4k1Kyz0bABeUgbzXg6MvXpBsJhH9J5KW8+RW A8SzbH9oJCPxtC8foLLyRpqywLEXQCrmF3Nbpp4V8BUEN1PNvy8rTXvT+KGiLCqA8APL NmtFwFVr2AWpi/7MqbRrGkrU7JyNjQe6Dg2VkqtQr8waWw1a4Y9H7brAbTrsvW5/6iFC WjmNY9pbf5EA5g+kguQvWqiO2/x6Xv5V8xOdwHYRby0/024fcyLH72rtDNRYskJsYJP8 OebpeQBge5jsG8QS7Phg9FT26b5vmzBzU3WrwpRokMmVQzQAQp0Z1QCjmMUua4jplq+W eHFA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWqTcIn2O+LJG04QSzqG8RaH2chbyEpwn9/t/3vG7h8CDJ8bVGt DymGSgGokfE9Ftii8jKpU7mof3Ap5VE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwS9tNdxwv+8da25m1na1sFWPF52jrHBggsdckvAiz408jmzP43wSBVwocC5JvuUOMRZ/gw+g== X-Received: by 2002:a25:8810:: with SMTP id c16mr7839613ybl.270.1582138063378; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 10:47:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio.seibercom.net (cpe-174-109-225-250.nc.res.rr.com. [174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id i2sm322119ywm.17.2020.02.19.10.47.41 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Wed, 19 Feb 2020 10:47:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48N6Cx24LZz1VdW for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 13:47:41 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 13:47:40 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200219134740.0df09817@scorpio> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> <20200218183010.5a52441f.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200218205940.04917783.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200219052643.7bd90d3c@scorpio> <20200219130628.457f8953@scorpio> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48N6D13yK8z3DkC X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=RN47Fky+; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::b34 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.40 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.60)[ip: (-9.37), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.68), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[4.3.b.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 18:47:46 -0000 On Wed, 19 Feb 2020 13:21:56 -0500, Ed Maste stated: >If getting a machine to a developer into the hands of a developer who >can investigate and fix the issue is absurd, what would you suggest >instead? You have no doubt heard the say, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." Now, I am 100% in favor of product improvement. I fully understand and can accept that an improvement may not be backwards compatible. However, this does not fit into that scenario. The change they made is not compatible with newer, not older or obsolete products. Obviously, the product was not properly beta tested. I have beta tested things for several companies, including Microsoft. If something goes really wrong, I have a phone number to call for assistance. That doesn't exist with FBSD, which is why I NRVER user version X.0 of any of their releases. I did feel that by the tine they got to X.1 they would have ironed out the major bugs. Obviously, not true in this case. So, to answer your question, what I suggest is to wait until 13.1 is released. If that doesn't work, I will just wait until 11.x is put out to pasture and then move onto a new OS. Life is simple, why complicate it. -- Jerry From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 18:59:52 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C15D24225A for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 18:59:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from mout.kundenserver.de (mout.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.131]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "mout.kundenserver.de", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass Class 2 CA" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48N6Ty5nS7z48TV for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 18:59:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from r56.edvax.de ([94.222.29.196]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (mreue010 [212.227.15.167]) with ESMTPA (Nemesis) id 1N79dk-1jVyeA0V24-017RfE; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 19:59:42 +0100 Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 19:59:40 +0100 From: Polytropon To: Ottavio Caruso Cc: Ottavio Caruso via freebsd-questions Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-Id: <20200219195940.0e252745.freebsd@edvax.de> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200218091959.b0220ac75bcfbbced91a5708@sohara.org> Reply-To: Polytropon Organization: EDVAX X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.1.1 (GTK+ 2.24.5; i386-portbld-freebsd8.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:MDlOGISodXE/UKU8M+OfUOMq1w4Shs4fzLAk91AyyApo6foWcam FWn+fbVpguEqhAvK3ixFIfkoVaGUBlOoN7WbsTBV/351shnKuP5DCyNCjolGePsV1ewkWVV uwd9LjXxotERMA3fpQhXRTAyj7pUMo+zH4Xbs3jgx6uUfEBT0r653A9/zMXj+OhsI/oIau9 9sTjJ8H8gPkYC/CkDQTiw== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:h+EieJ9AiV4=:FSxwsWACeBGErBgaXh0RjI jreLFzSFQTljDa562URZi9/QnO02JEjgem37cAyv43SVTH2fcsO6Y7rIArn+YsrWPnMmpXd47 5a4YRnY61SSiKGxGZEucWwHjLoleT4e8H0iHzpKy9qcDH2CoaFx9vpfZrrDsMmeyRkjOHxuE6 w96xBPkx9sACY4Dyh0yAeknt5ZnOsOvoJg4tsaBCYA/K77MuLm5VrMjbwPgA5B/jdmn1Gh4N8 l6HIZZNsnCNj/vTNwZdLZEJyDwHdO0GglrVPXBbwh7FpvpBPUt55g7SsJ/gmyNspNFeRnW+S0 ov/fN+CdLyDOvWlNpUWqXRnQuzsFbVq9ZPE+PVekkkiwG+aGpuZiV0LBkuW6KGHhemtWtKCKM c29X0ShSkaIK6OsN87klnauq3j93PrO26btkd5/hctyVYIJg04JitKbJ4Qt+5MaUlPYjonmLI C22tMQNq7HBy93nX5x9SvgGRUztV4p8a+pNfQSeVRsYcMd2lTBBtS9zDv8Vqzs24dkYYUB5UG /GoWoCqvW2Qx8u4DHGvwwvrp0bCTvil396HxtV+2QCaDkCoLcjBsb5W0/bs85xpJyJaK/Pz0D eKQtQmNvY42fD1CNMCsKyI95pGjWoVB0ldBsSWDlgEL5FBNcJv6skIludwS8kAHfGrAExVHH/ 04vRdMunuPonLIbzJVVHGR6r9yQH881JND+M3FNZVvz0kOBrqUAj4Ee/c+XJM9v8kw994cSIe PRV58Ak5h5RzpkW01Pt3Pk2WoAh0WLlJfeJ00NYPzNXSQQNPWp1sLK2nna4mHI269ZYfDn+MC TFUosZRhAAcnBlxry0UAJAOs8vNcvnZM+mdW/5iLuciCd1KSXGxyIWRuuNojQLsFHlI64wZ X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48N6Ty5nS7z48TV X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@edvax.de has no SPF policy when checking 212.227.126.131) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@edvax.de X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.86 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd@edvax.de]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[yahoo.com]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8560, ipnet:212.227.0.0/16, country:DE]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[196.29.222.94.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[edvax.de]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.99)[0.995,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[0.997,0]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[131.126.227.212.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(0.47)[ip: (1.30), ipnet: 212.227.0.0/16(-1.12), asn: 8560(2.19), country: DE(-0.02)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 18:59:52 -0000 On Wed, 19 Feb 2020 08:52:33 +0000, Ottavio Caruso via freebsd-questions wrote: > On Wed, 19 Feb 2020 at 00:49, Yuri Pankov wrote: > > > > On 18 Feb 2020, at 20:39, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > > > > > On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 3:51 PM Ed Maste wrote: > > >> > > >> On Tue, 18 Feb 2020 at 05:37, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > >>> > > >>> Maybe its a time to give OpenBSD a try.. > > >> > > >> I really don't understand this comment, either. Certainly give OpenBSD > > >> a try and if it fits your needs better that's great. > > >> > > >> As far as I'm aware OpenBSD issues a release every six months and > > >> supports the most recent two releases, so it seems odd to me to > > >> complain about FreeBSD's ~1 year minor release support lifetime and 5 > > >> year stable branch support lifetime in that context. > > > > > > Its more like "lets try if what I need works better over there". Not > > > really the release timeline. > > > > > > The release timeline problem is more related with pushing untested > > > features (and possible avalanche of solutions that introduce yet > > > another complications that we observe right now). > > > > > > "The BSD Way", for me, was always about "it works solid or its not > > > there". Like macOS / iOS. > > > > > > Unlike "The Linux Way" where things changes upside down from release > > > to release and each one of them has its own universe of variants. Like > > > Android. > > > > > > I am not sure if it is that important if there is a release in 6 month > > > or 2 years. Not a problem at all. If in two years I get a 5 new > > > features that work rock solid then it seems a better choice than > > > getting new features every six months and have more problems on a > > > production because of that. > > > > > > If I need to experiment there is a CURRENT branch. For well tested > > > features I have STABLE. For rock solid "I bet my money on that" I have > > > a RELEASE. Right? > > > > > > I did miss the 12.0 EoL kind of fix for DRM, sorry, it seems > > > reasonable. I am just worried that 12.2-RELEASE will have the same > > > problems, if not more new problems. > > > > It is something you can help with, run 12.2-STABLE on some > > spare equipment and report problems that affect *your* environment. > > To a beginner and uninitiated like me, the way FreeBSD labels > "stable", "release", "releng" and "current" is, at the very least, > confusing. That is true. If you look at the FreeBSD website, you'll quickly find documentation that explains "which is for whom". Basically, it's a kind of "refinement process" that has the following habits: HEAD / CURRENT: Active development takes place here. It's updated quite quickly, sometimes several times a day. Such a snapshot might build, but not run, but might fail to build, too. Features can be tested, can disappear, or change. STABLE: Everything that's considered to stay in FreeBSD will be kept here. It is usually tested, and such a snapshot will build and boot. Thw word "stable" refers to the ABI being stable. Both -HEAD and -STABLE can only be tracked via source control (here: svn). RELEASE: This is the snapshot that contains what is on the installation media: tested and verified. Stages up to this point can include -BETA, -ALPHA, -RC, (release candidate), -PRERELEASE or such kinds of snapshots. RELEASE-pX: WHen development moves on, security patches will be made available. They can be "added" to already installed release versions. Both -RELEASE and RELEASE-pX can be obtained in a binary way (here: freebsd-update). That is just a rough outline, but I believe it's fully clear now what the different names refer to. :-) -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Wed Feb 19 19:35:03 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 273F42432EA for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 19:35:03 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info) Received: from mail.sermon-archive.info (sermon-archive.info [71.177.216.148]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48N7GX45mSz3DkC for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 19:34:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info) Received: from [10.0.1.251] (mini [10.0.1.251]) by mail.sermon-archive.info (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48N7GT1wHZz2fjVJ; Wed, 19 Feb 2020 11:34:57 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) Subject: Re: Switching to backup Network From: Doug Hardie In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 11:34:56 -0800 Cc: FreeBSD Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <64F39D12-E061-4726-B58E-943D61963944@mail.sermon-archive.info> <50d6c0e2-8e70-0743-1e9c-f4c36847a015@kicp.uchicago.edu> To: Valeri Galtsev X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.101.4 at mail X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48N7GX45mSz3DkC X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info designates 71.177.216.148 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.33 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.89)[-0.888,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:71.177.216.148]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-0.05)[asn: 5650(-0.20), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.993,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[148.216.177.71.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[bc979@lafn.org,SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:5650, ipnet:71.177.216.0/23, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[bc979@lafn.org,SRS0=Oc3R=4H=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2020 19:35:03 -0000 > On 19 February 2020, at 06:32, Valeri Galtsev = wrote: >=20 >=20 >=20 >> On Feb 18, 2020, at 7:29 PM, Doug Hardie wrote: >>=20 >>> On 18 February 2020, at 12:25, Valeri Galtsev = wrote: >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> On 2020-02-18 14:19, Doug Hardie wrote: >>>> One of my clients has a machine running 12.1 that is connected via = two different NICs to two different WANs. He has drops from 2 different = ISPs to provide redundancy. I have configured each of the DNS names with = both IP addresses so that web access will switch over to the backup when = the primary is down. Setfib and pf are used to make that work. That = works fine (although there is a DNS timeout involved). The problem is = that all the servers on the machine talk out via the primary IP address. = While web access continues, the server initiated functions fail because = the next hop is down. Is there a way to switch everything over to the = backup network in this case? I don't find anything that enables = automatic changes to the default network. >>>> Also, when the backup network goes down, the default network entry = for setfib 1 route is deleted. I have to manually enter that when it = comes backup. I am initially setting that in /etc/rc.local. Is there a = way to make it either remain, or be restored? >>>>=20 >>>=20 >>> I would look into link aggregation (lagg): >>>=20 >>> = https://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/books/handbook/network-aggregation.html >>>=20 >>> I used that to make my FreeBSD laptop switch over from WiFi to = ethernet interface when the last link is available. Worked neat for me. >>>=20 >>> Valeri >>>=20 >>=20 >> Lagg looks neat, but my first setup didn't work. I suspect the issue = is the IP addresses. Each of the two networks have quite different IPs. = Both are fixed IP addresses but from different allocations. It appears = that lagg requires the use of one IP for both networks. All the = examples use just one IP address for both networks. >>=20 >=20 > I did not look into setting lagg for two ethernet interfaces, mine was = for ethernet + WiFi. But they were definitely on different networks. = Additional simplicity of my case was: both interfaces were DHCP clients = (that took care of routing auto-magically). There was one =E2=80=9Chack=E2= =80=9D I did in my case: I have a vague recollection I made both = adapters under lagg have the same MAC address (by changing one of them), = but that likely was due to my insufficient knowledge or laziness when I = was setting it up. Expert probably will do it without that hack. I still = have a feeling, one can do it for static IPs (my laptop configuration = does work for interfaces on different networks), that=E2=80=99s why I = suggested to look into that. >=20 > Hopefully, some lagg expert will offer you help. It may make sense to = ask on freebsd-net list. >=20 > Valeri >=20 I discovered there are three things you lose when you get older. The = first is your memory. I've forgotten the other two. Apparently I had started a development earlier and actually got a = solution working, but never included it in my client's system. I = encountered it, by accident, last night and included it. This only = applies to the code I developed for the client, but I replaced the = connect and tcp_connect calls with new modules that test the returns = from those and then use setfib to try the backup if the primary is not = available. This solves the big issue for my client as his faxes now are = being delivered using the backup network when the primary is down. It = doesn't solve the problem for things like email, but the client usually = uses his PCs for that. I just lose things like the periodic emails = (they aren't lost, but significantly delayed as postfix is being used). The primary benefit of this is my client's customers are not affected by = the down time. My client now reports that he thinks the problem is = caused by the cable from the NIC to the router being too short and = having too much stress. This is a remote location so I have no idea = what it looks like. However, it is interesting to note that my client = did the physical setup and is a Microsoft Certified Network Engineer ;-) -- Doug From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 09:04:47 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 789C3259275 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 09:04:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-ot1-x336.google.com (mail-ot1-x336.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::336]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NTDt2y4Sz4FPy for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 09:04:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-ot1-x336.google.com with SMTP id w6so3008666otk.0 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 01:04:46 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=AaHsEiwO397Tyhj0bO3SdEKMgvksycGG9zt/T+bcy+w=; b=EqHH/J8K9ucXh5YHOgwX1cA9eqlp+5WU4oTkt0qOKwJPHUd05JHw7c7sdYa7yNBl5r XTvdAECBeHuFC2zNsQJ5vqVPNehwCMTOhxJTyzKs6mO2wQYHnRZCXEJDREDTJrhR2SUi ei39TejCEwZBbNytBWo3BJpKTxXGe/kjcNuzIXAOPMGlJYmtvbQ0CsbMWTCdhCd6GYIz BLa8MU3/D+h/zz/Qo/OQN9if0++5UoXluvoqbHerId2m5PLQ6R1fk6P0OZ+D5cnr7hdz HE1wBoUEvcD1cKKefsWYv2kJJwyg4Y8ajfxUA7REqzZ0cV4zi2+dW/E+WQ8FGeoAionK xzyw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=AaHsEiwO397Tyhj0bO3SdEKMgvksycGG9zt/T+bcy+w=; b=qsnAEu4itTVH7tiuX2DLTfNe1aOkoNpT4fuXEPBuDrOrQL4/9pqzyDWJLzAzgCwKgu mQsSqZppgR2Gmp0whneKx5XpYQRipCDHMaFJlsDR6nunBBu5s804RAyp6AL8IPI06w86 IR26nZT3/UQ3626URKjLvEJ3uViNh5EVnlVGwPF4aAmyNBiWW3fFlzrx25C5tWCTrAWS DgP645cj6K9qke+yYnFYVX24ffAMQDZnf7iBJ96f0p8jVn7EBKwCBcY9WsMkUqHjewbs RkpoNKFqEJNgh1KbQQPH5YOioCrdfrXakltn9eGsV8uzr8k22JjLc7pCcul1aeDHxHUG OWFw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAU5ayIuCnWAeFbyejW3AhhfhorPSw/FkQszKfcGE31QyRvoz2v6 qZTLqI6S/AgxtDAvbRlaY/vx1EWZmZw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzJUWVqezR5XlIw1mD85hF7BDdaclpSBNUnjZ0JrWn0cplCG46MnGz7Mvwz2PRfFCfNXRjM/w== X-Received: by 2002:a9d:7607:: with SMTP id k7mr22484653otl.205.1582189484743; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 01:04:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ot1-f53.google.com (mail-ot1-f53.google.com. [209.85.210.53]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a30sm932087otc.79.2020.02.20.01.04.43 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 20 Feb 2020 01:04:44 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ot1-f53.google.com with SMTP id i6so2965003otr.7; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 01:04:43 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a9d:1c9c:: with SMTP id l28mr22183872ota.210.1582189482939; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 01:04:42 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 10:04:31 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Bengt Ahlgren Cc: Ed Maste , FreeBSD Stable , FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NTDt2y4Sz4FPy X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=EqHH/J8K; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::336) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.70 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[6.3.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(-2.40)[ip: (-8.38), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 09:04:47 -0000 On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 8:24 PM Bengt Ahlgren wrote: > Tomasz CEDRO writes: > > Another problem is the VirtualBox virtualization that is not really > > usable anymore. I am aware of closed-source VBox Guest Additions > > problem. My VM works fine for a first minute or two but then it stops > > when I start working on it. With DRM and Framebuffer X11 drivers so it > > My experience is that you have to enable "Use Host I/O Cache" for the > SATA storage controller, otherwise it will lock up sooner or later. It > seems to not be the default. With it enabled, I don't have any issues. Nooo way.. that seems to help! Works slow but it works :-) I have M2 2TB SSD using encrypted ZFS on my FreeBSD laptop.. so clearly a VirtualBox drivers / config issue not the OS..? Thank you Bengt for the hint! Trust in FreeBSD restored :-) :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 12:17:08 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 743BD25F983 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 12:17:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markand@malikania.fr) Received: from smtp.smtpout.orange.fr (smtp04.smtpout.orange.fr [80.12.242.126]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "Bizanga Labs SMTP Client Certificate", Issuer "Bizanga Labs CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NYVp3b56z46SY for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 12:17:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markand@malikania.fr) Received: from postfix.malikania.fr ([5.135.187.121]) by mwinf5d27 with ME id 50H12200c2dbEiD030H1VR; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:17:03 +0100 X-ME-Helo: postfix.malikania.fr X-ME-Auth: ZGVtZWxpZXIuZGF2aWRAb3JhbmdlLmZy X-ME-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:17:03 +0100 X-ME-IP: 5.135.187.121 Received: from [167.3.108.158] (unknown [77.159.242.250]) by postfix.malikania.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id AE9CE1CFA8 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:17:01 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> From: David Demelier Message-ID: Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:17:01 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.5.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: fr Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NYVp3b56z46SY X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of markand@malikania.fr has no SPF policy when checking 80.12.242.126) smtp.mailfrom=markand@malikania.fr X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.06 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.98)[0.980,0]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.97)[0.971,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[126.242.12.80.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[malikania.fr]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:3215, ipnet:80.12.240.0/20, country:FR]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(1.21)[ip: (2.80), ipnet: 80.12.240.0/20(1.59), asn: 3215(1.68), country: FR(0.00)]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[126.242.12.80.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 12:17:08 -0000 Le 18/02/2020 à 04:23, Tomasz CEDRO a écrit : > To be honest X11 Video Acceleration DRM mess and dramatic > Virtualization with VirtualBox brings back my MacBook to the desk > because FreeBSD does not seem to be reliable desktop environment > anymore even on a decent modern machine :-( > > Is it really necessary? What happened to FreeBSD? :-( FreeBSD for desktop is still not a thing. It won't change anytime soon because lacks of manpower and less interest into porting things to FreeBSD. That's why DRM, bluetooth, wireless, ACPI and wayland terribly lag behind Linux. Unfortunately this won't change anytime soon because there are much more people involved in Linux on the desktop (and has large manpower because of android as well) rather than FreeBSD. To me FreeBSD stays a server OS (even though rolling-releases ports are not appropriate). -- David From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 14:57:33 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED14923B337 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 14:57:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) Received: from s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com (s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com [142.0.176.198]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Nd3w1z8qz4b2y for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 14:57:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=email-od.com;i=@email-od.com;s=dkim; c=relaxed/relaxed; q=dns/txt; t=1582210652; x=1584802652; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:message-id:subject:to:from:date:x-thread-info; bh=Qoc898mZNAsupQRKbUj6dR35dwLa+zOJ4zu9LjU6oyk=; b=WkOb/3lRK+liZyaorzbAEIEawK39I8StvyKmA3vpUq2x99nS4MeWzGTPkHNDlJ5hvWt06GpVSJcr1S+qTlPS3HatiQX0BbA/5lKZCkU/C9Rc9FNf8VqYo7YhXxgpuJcMNxK2HGm9YtjGsJKFLS87Kf/0SKxOIktdZ0EYtyoAARQ= X-Thread-Info: NDI1MC4xMi43NDAwMDAwMGQxZGE5ZS5mcmVlYnNkLXF1ZXN0aW9ucz1mcmVlYnNkLm9yZw== Received: from r2.sg.in.socketlabs.com (r2.sg.in.socketlabs.com [142.0.179.12]) by mxsg2.email-od.com with ESMTP(version=Tls12 cipher=Aes256 bits=256); Thu, 20 Feb 2020 09:57:19 -0500 Received: from smtp.lan.sohara.org (EMTPY [185.202.17.215]) by r2.sg.in.socketlabs.com with ESMTP(version=Tls12 cipher=Aes256 bits=256); Thu, 20 Feb 2020 09:57:19 -0500 Received: from [192.168.63.1] (helo=steve.lan.sohara.org) by smtp.lan.sohara.org with smtp (Exim 4.92.3 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1j4nGP-000H7p-DP for freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 14:57:17 +0000 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 14:57:17 +0000 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-Id: <20200220145717.21f436275de8bef7116c2da6@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd12.0) X-Clacks-Overhead: "GNU Terry Pratchett" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Nd3w1z8qz4b2y X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=email-od.com header.s=dkim header.b=WkOb/3lR; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com designates 142.0.176.198 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.89 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.98)[-0.984,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[email-od.com:s=dkim]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:142.0.176.0/20]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[sohara.org]; FORGED_SENDER_VERP_SRS(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; IP_SCORE(0.09)[ip: (-0.25), ipnet: 142.0.176.0/22(0.52), asn: 7381(0.26), country: US(-0.05)]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[email-od.com:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[198.176.0.142.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.15.0]; ENVFROM_VERP(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7381, ipnet:142.0.176.0/22, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 14:57:34 -0000 On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:17:01 +0100 David Demelier wrote: > FreeBSD for desktop is still not a thing. It's been my desktop for decades. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 15:07:09 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFA5C23B94A for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:07:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from darcy@druid.net) Received: from mail.vex.net (mail.vex.net [IPv6:2605:2600:1001::44]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48NdH04c20z3GSn for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:07:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from darcy@druid.net) Received: from dilbert.druid.net (unknown [98.160.82.51]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: darcy) by mail.vex.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0617D6A2D8 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 10:07:00 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> From: D'Arcy Cain Autocrypt: addr=darcy@druid.net; 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FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NdH04c20z3GSn X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of darcy@druid.net has no SPF policy when checking 2605:2600:1001::44) smtp.mailfrom=darcy@druid.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.84 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.85)[-0.851,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.54)[0.537,0]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[druid.net]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:19842, ipnet:2605:2600::/32, country:CA]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.15)[asn: 19842(0.83), country: CA(-0.09)]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:07:10 -0000 On 2020-02-20 06:17, David Demelier wrote: > FreeBSD for desktop is still not a thing. It won't change anytime soon > because lacks of manpower and less interest into porting things to > FreeBSD. That's why DRM, bluetooth, wireless, ACPI and wayland terribly > lag behind Linux. It may not have all the bells and whistles that Linux has but it works just fine as a basic office desktop. I set them up with Firefox, Thunderbird, Libreoffice and a few other basic things and it works just fine. It also allows for one system across all of my servers and desktops for easy management. -- D'Arcy J.M. Cain | Democracy is three wolves http://www.druid.net/darcy/ | and a sheep voting on +1 416 788 2246 (DoD#0082) (eNTP) | what's for dinner. IM: darcy@VybeNetworks.com, VoIP: sip:darcy@druid.net From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 15:20:16 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5C6B23C102 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:20:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from news@mips.inka.de) Received: from mail.inka.de (mail.inka.de [IPv6:2a04:c9c7:0:1073:217:a4ff:fe3b:e77c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NdZ72HcJz4D5N for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:20:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from news@mips.inka.de) Received: from mips.inka.de (news@[127.0.0.1]) by mail.inka.de with uucp (rmailwrap 0.5) id 1j4ncU-0004i9-Bm; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 16:20:06 +0100 Received: from lorvorc.mips.inka.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by lorvorc.mips.inka.de (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 01KFJhbN023863 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 16:19:43 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from news@lorvorc.mips.inka.de) Received: (from news@localhost) by lorvorc.mips.inka.de (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id 01KFJhkL023862 for freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 16:19:43 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from news) To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org From: Christian Weisgerber Newsgroups: list.freebsd.questions Subject: Re: tightening sshd, removing server identification banner Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:19:43 -0000 (UTC) Message-ID: References: User-Agent: slrn/1.0.3 (FreeBSD) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NdZ72HcJz4D5N X-Spamd-Bar: +++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of news@mips.inka.de has no SPF policy when checking 2a04:c9c7:0:1073:217:a4ff:fe3b:e77c) smtp.mailfrom=news@mips.inka.de X-Spamd-Result: default: False [3.37 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.87)[0.872,0]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.85)[0.850,0]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[inka.de]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[naddy@mips.inka.de,news@mips.inka.de]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:202113, ipnet:2a04:c9c7::/32, country:DE]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[naddy@mips.inka.de,news@mips.inka.de]; IP_SCORE(0.45)[ip: (1.19), ipnet: 2a04:c9c7::/32(0.60), asn: 202113(0.48), country: DE(-0.02)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:20:16 -0000 On 2020-02-17, David Mehler wrote: > I'm running FreeBSD 12.0. I'm atempting to tighten up my sshd > configuration. I've got things where I want them, except for the > connecting banner. I'm using sshaudit.com to test things and this is > what it's saying for the banner setting: > > Banner:SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.8 FreeBSD-20180909 > > I would rather this be set to nothing or at most very minimal. RFC4253 says the identification string MUST be SSH-protoversion-softwareversion SP comments CR LF where only "comments" is optional. I also recommend a look at src/crypto/openssh/compat.c to gain some appreciation that "softwareversion" is important. -- Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 15:25:13 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F291723C5BE for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:25:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-ot1-x32b.google.com (mail-ot1-x32b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::32b]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Ndgr66KTz4MgV for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:25:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-ot1-x32b.google.com with SMTP id p8so3958773oth.10 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 07:25:12 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=w4wCCr+9u5vyrh5YtRQ6ZShd09YUxmN8srs9Av+BcaU=; b=LvMiKB6e9bBjrmhB9B+EXHgwpq7TqVzGYO40D+RPeUXmcIIu5YrNl8+/DcPklslcXB ZIrhTBhpW5x/NvB34fK5r3MH8ASkN7MCSRG7AYjKmxBh9vmP+rl5kLRxO26O46U9IVXQ QE++QgbZ/n0xCv7nHKRCRTO5Ela2FSmzF2uxv0txkJYxVj92xjcHiLmPnNeQePQV8eKW SDg0S5FK3jt0SSCI0kTg5cqwd8qBBwQSbVoFzLQoV8veehWRsY8NYERu1/tOlW5q7e2D b8lxgw9Y3+EHj4GVaITg1eUm/MXW7Jge6wiIOzkacfmhlXiUCfppnbUxt0JO2q/pdR1v d2eg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=w4wCCr+9u5vyrh5YtRQ6ZShd09YUxmN8srs9Av+BcaU=; b=DFrMrM8GFx+CYpL0nQgz8bsVrHpc9Fm+qdrbqfL98yrxBuzxu7bkGTEJ9KdD2JR6F1 NEHtpZyt+AEPBKL3O4dP466Sr5OXgGBncglFCXVxpYLMMLfUx6IgmH+2/n3Jp6KHO2Ip hMfnv90p14GJNtWY6glKSlxXrcA0JfidHwJZV/CCrZvfFxlz4INP53t4+E6VzobSxYt1 KoO8mZmC2i8Vm0vMh4LBulpxHkx+qNbvbcbO5gvA79VfxSPwf4EdDbCBulSPsMESpLBP Hy0M+ICa1arnJ8ulnl20LyMz3l44x3VL5L8KgUDiupkPQnW5k5MaTybRHwT9lYutr/jp vtnA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUB1aD0YlPna1oMlSJdzgGsEOi/nrCYq5N2T24NTdj54mxEHZue CvI4Ja18p61iMAkhYqWILwepeW/lP3M= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyDIW8UhqFZa0o/ahbwoTTlQzJblGNVIbacxXvZJ37ByYiaaPy6unAR74PObRu2Z7q6jIIh5w== X-Received: by 2002:a9d:7842:: with SMTP id c2mr22376917otm.252.1582212310978; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 07:25:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-oi1-f170.google.com (mail-oi1-f170.google.com. [209.85.167.170]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id t22sm1256722otq.18.2020.02.20.07.25.10 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 20 Feb 2020 07:25:10 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-oi1-f170.google.com with SMTP id z2so27899387oih.6 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 07:25:10 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:350:: with SMTP id j16mr2370061oie.168.1582212309770; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 07:25:09 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220145717.21f436275de8bef7116c2da6@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: <20200220145717.21f436275de8bef7116c2da6@sohara.org> From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 16:24:57 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: "Steve O'Hara-Smith" Cc: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Ndgr66KTz4MgV X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=LvMiKB6e; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::32b) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.64 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; URI_COUNT_ODD(1.00)[3]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[b.2.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; IP_SCORE(-2.34)[ip: (-8.08), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:25:14 -0000 czw., 20 lut 2020, 15:57 u=C5=BCytkownik Steve O'Hara-Smith napisa=C5=82: > On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:17:01 +0100 > David Demelier wrote: > > > FreeBSD for desktop is still not a thing. > > It's been my desktop for decades. > Here as well :-) Randomly since 1999 and the only one since around 2009 (?) when stable USB was introduced :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info > From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 15:41:07 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43AF323D152 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:41:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@chthonixia.net) Received: from mail1.g14.pair.com (mail1.g14.pair.com [66.39.4.16]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Nf295qsZz3HJ8 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:41:05 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@chthonixia.net) Received: from mail1.g14.pair.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail1.g14.pair.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 277AAA6DA3 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 10:41:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from ghostyhead.chthonixia.net (cpe-108-176-147-163.nyc.res.rr.com [108.176.147.163]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail1.g14.pair.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0D2B1A6D4C for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 10:41:04 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 10:41:01 -0500 From: "Joe A." To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Nf295qsZz3HJ8 X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@chthonixia.net has no SPF policy when checking 66.39.4.16) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@chthonixia.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.22 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.77)[-0.773,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[chthonixia.net]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[16.4.39.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7859, ipnet:66.39.0.0/17, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.24)[asn: 7859(-1.17), country: US(-0.05)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:41:07 -0000 On Thu, Feb 20, 2020 at 01:17:01PM +0100, David Demelier wrote: > Le 18/02/2020 ?? 04:23, Tomasz CEDRO a ??crit??: >> > > because FreeBSD does not seem to be reliable desktop environment > > anymore even on a decent modern machine :-( As to this: AMD Ryzen 3 2200G with Radeon Vega Graphics (3500.09-MHz K8-class CPU) real memory = 34359738368 (32768 MB) nvidia-modeset: Loading NVIDIA Kernel Mode Setting Driver for UNIX platforms 440.31 Sun Oct 27 02:07:28 UTC 2019 NVIDIA Corporation device = GP107 [GeForce GTX 1050 Ti] etcetera.... > FreeBSD for desktop is still not a thing. And then this: Desktop user since 1999, no sysadmining here. In fact, in 1999 Linux was inestimably harder to use for a desktop than FreeBSD. -- a lot of nopes to nope. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 15:43:33 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6410923D33E for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:43:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from luciano@vespaperitivo.it) Received: from baobab.bilink.net (baobab.bilink.net [212.45.144.44]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48Nf4z0Y7cz3Kr8 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:43:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from luciano@vespaperitivo.it) Received: from baobab.bilink.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by baobab.bilink.it (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48Nf4x309Lz1ftWg for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 16:43:29 +0100 (CET) Received: from hermes.mcs.it (hermes.mcs.it [192.168.132.21]) by baobab.bilink.it (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48Nf4x2F5Wz1ftWh for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 16:43:29 +0100 (CET) Received: from mordeus (unknown [192.168.45.6]) by hermes.mcs.it (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11C344D5AFC for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 16:43:29 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 16:43:20 +0100 From: Luciano Mannucci To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd12.0) X-Face: 4qPv4GNcD; h<7Q/sK>+GqF4=CR@KmnPkSmwd+#%\F`4yjKO3"C]p'z=(oWRnsYBQGM\5g:4skqQY0NnV'dM:Mm:^/_+I@a"; [-s=ogufdF"9ggQ'=y MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <48Nf4x2F5Wz1ftWh@baobab.bilink.it> X-Virus-Scanned: PippoLillo, ClamAV using ClamSMTP X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Nf4z0Y7cz3Kr8 X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of luciano@vespaperitivo.it designates 212.45.144.44 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=luciano@vespaperitivo.it X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.01 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:212.45.144.0/24]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[vespaperitivo.it]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[44.144.45.212.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8816, ipnet:212.45.128.0/19, country:IT]; IP_SCORE(-2.81)[ip: (-8.07), ipnet: 212.45.128.0/19(-4.03), asn: 8816(-1.96), country: IT(0.03)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:43:33 -0000 On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:17:01 +0100 David Demelier wrote: > FreeBSD for desktop is still not a thing. True. It's getting better all the time, tough... :) Of course it works on many platforms. I use it everyday, I admit I seldom use DRI and I had problems with machines having AMD APU+GPU wich is still not supported AFAIK, while it works with linux. As with lot of other things, it will take a while to get fixed on FreeBSD... Maybe because of the high quality of the fixes we are used to. I can wait... Luciano. -- /"\ /Via A. Salaino, 7 - 20144 Milano (Italy) \ / ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGN / PHONE : +39 2 485781 FAX: +39 2 48578250 X AGAINST HTML MAIL / E-MAIL: posthamster@sublink.sublink.ORG / \ AND POSTINGS / WWW: http://www.lesassaie.IT/ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 15:53:56 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56CF423D815 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:53:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com) Received: from sonic308-9.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (sonic308-9.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com [66.163.187.32]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NfJz4MkFz46Vq for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:53:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com) X-YMail-OSG: a2V.u78VM1nhxUWjjjOGqyY2Y_o.35z2p6a12_u7Y2Z8L7USREJ0QWCjV7p7Epc X8Q0lrGb5QHw22z7Jd.6aWDWv.z_MuiqCuqUd_CEGvOWx6sKxr3BSl0ArP7yLfBcOoKkULfxXmNk MEdOx89IZPG39y.qUj4zzfLucZKANUWx4sxdPwKD_ei7kw1jB8yrOZy8.vxFOWj6iqgHcGnhuCH2 FU7FNHrHsj50hpWxgvvlKnISg7dACzolLZ13f9rJE3Dwx1ptGF57ICTUVy.6GM8dBm1yrv._o30m CWK_Cu9tjkjLcE9aION6k0k.btHtVluBG_xvHCHc08QyImCBBTWsH6yQE0KuKCZxNvC2BcN3nGbv KfI4X4KH6lj.DpVZwJ9I5ypXKDWauqo4HZSPi.iUcU5_lgU8c2ZBfas0P5X2cBnIw9ALmBF2sA_l efQq.Lr208TPdxCwach7vXERQTLsgDpk3hevBLDR43In.xNr0W8ezYOICKdQyTed.UTy4yvbmoZM QuoNybJnj3GRl6rw8Lc9IFdNhuY7KjH5xpTO4RRDVLjtWebbqGMZDAYWWsiv0fGw5F5mA4xdg9rG T1wM39X5LeFFBiRxtxcVzMpK6yaObOjRyZOWR39QZq3qsrfifG6k6IawyxT6_9cPihqtpMnIISGA pQBSpLzCddlRQ4imsP3NELFmaIsRUNM44T9GYUfuH52ql4rxF2L9Ca9vXwQCWpaKGR2svYYJdfuh 3Zsz1LVCjSv5h4xQrO7FobH19NFViwG.9HbX6kB2htCZcMemQytYM8RF37ZKRG2lDVro.tO3eFKt Uf8u0YPglvo.F7i84hMG2lKBeB0rFdC3x5Vw1ny569BCjMzLFPPv44KJ99.YFUtVdK0PBoRFwkE_ U5Uot66T3zgirkm63icFw5wJX1hENUfbXG6scwWHE7cuOsr5O2YK1if3rFRyo4J_mMiAAEopRIYm yXu.2nfkGktv7mc4Yi.h2UeoFFFtwxx6Qn0HI2XP7ZHaOsJUgaGRWrWBN6mLnK1kiYYIU_5uZUYo DfN2QAynX7rMLvsR_yMtTxM.EgtusUnkilt0.XShQMY3TdwONC8.vVg1qZQOqsgySB_zQVzzuVFx URTWEG65mthCl2VGFihXBtAN1vzUkWsUx01NvN2OTUelLG_RrX2y7SfcLOvXFBsvjZxTf4OHrset YqpakH1HGPhIC4JCanQlDEXBhfaXclR846squY4D2etLmRkl_wNFbXvBZkXxNI6UIFf3U9d16jUT qD9MW7dAnGvnu40AZen1nQp.o4yuuwjoddY6r.WcKKIBaoTn_LtFEthOe.7WhYbPyqJLu2ZyJj_R roN5gj51W29trjUK6nOg6VmNa.1wQCjL_kQYlmW6IZKlch7f3HTKBDP_8Ych8TU1bgE5tFswjMBz 1lDBPUs19DwbI29daiFTumi5tzg-- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic308.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:53:54 +0000 Received: by smtp404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 3fc4717e0e1708c9d9d8946c4e49ef7a; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:53:53 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-pg1-f169.google.com with SMTP id j15so2136374pgm.6 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 07:53:52 -0800 (PST) X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVXNHjw+cXg7sHd8u4TQOKen8qFLdtjvArk7xauawDw0q8JTHe0 Ya4SK4BGJeRJJfUF6YRVrwuBwt5nDZUsy8vL+Vk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyAhwCSEo4jdaPeSNCSs7fkTQaUGm/Kj14zLuNgsQRgQMCSKfDRw9J3WmaavxvXE2jw0DsV/lrrDSNiFMfFuyw= X-Received: by 2002:a63:8743:: with SMTP id i64mr32764579pge.243.1582214032326; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 07:53:52 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: From: Ottavio Caruso Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:53:35 +0000 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: FreeBSD for the desktop/laptop, was: FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.15199 hermes Apache-HttpAsyncClient/4.1.4 (Java/1.8.0_181) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NfJz4MkFz46Vq X-Spamd-Bar: -- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.49 / 15.00]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36646, ipnet:66.163.184.0/21, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[ottavio2006-usenet2012@yahoo.com,pr0f3ss0r1492@yahoo.com]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.87)[-0.869,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.92)[-0.917,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (4.32), ipnet: 66.163.184.0/21(1.17), asn: 36646(0.94), country: US(-0.05)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[32.187.163.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[32.187.163.66.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 15:53:56 -0000 On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 at 12:17, David Demelier wrote: > > FreeBSD for desktop is still not a thing. It won't change anytime soon > because lacks of manpower and less interest into porting things to > FreeBSD. That's why DRM, bluetooth, wireless, ACPI and wayland terribly > lag behind Linux. > My day-to-day system is Linux Mint Debian Edition 3 on a Thinkpad. I'd gladly ditch Linux for good on my laptop for FreeBSD or indeed any *BSD if battery charge thresholds and re-calibration for the Thinkpad were available [1]. I know that FreeBSD has something similar but I wouldn't know how to make it work and there are no official docs. [1] https://linrunner.de/en/tlp/docs/tlp-linux-advanced-power-management.html -- Ottavio Caruso From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 16:36:27 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 818D023E70A for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 16:36:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markand@malikania.fr) Received: from smtp.smtpout.orange.fr (smtp04.smtpout.orange.fr [80.12.242.126]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "Bizanga Labs SMTP Client Certificate", Issuer "Bizanga Labs CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NgG16HvRz42wx for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 16:36:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from markand@malikania.fr) Received: from postfix.malikania.fr ([5.135.187.121]) by mwinf5d27 with ME id 54cM220032dbEiD034cMMb; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 17:36:21 +0100 X-ME-Helo: postfix.malikania.fr X-ME-Auth: ZGVtZWxpZXIuZGF2aWRAb3JhbmdlLmZy X-ME-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 17:36:21 +0100 X-ME-IP: 5.135.187.121 Received: from [167.3.108.158] (unknown [77.159.242.250]) by postfix.malikania.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 2EA101E54F for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 17:36:21 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> From: David Demelier Message-ID: <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 17:36:20 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.5.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: fr Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NgG16HvRz42wx X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of markand@malikania.fr has no SPF policy when checking 80.12.242.126) smtp.mailfrom=markand@malikania.fr X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.04 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.98)[0.983,0]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.95)[0.947,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[126.242.12.80.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[malikania.fr]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[126.242.12.80.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:3215, ipnet:80.12.240.0/20, country:FR]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(1.21)[ip: (2.78), ipnet: 80.12.240.0/20(1.58), asn: 3215(1.68), country: FR(0.00)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 16:36:27 -0000 Le 20/02/2020 à 16:41, Joe A. a écrit : > Desktop user since 1999, no sysadmining here. In fact, in 1999 Linux was > inestimably harder to use for a desktop than FreeBSD. Nice to hear, personally I'm unable to setup bluetooth (every hcccontrol request end in a timeout) nor I'm unable to use two finger scroll on my touchpad which literally work out of the box on Linux. I've used FreeBSD on my laptop a while back, it was a better experience. Using on a simple workstation is quite convenient though. But on laptop, it's huge nightmare (not mentioning ACPI). -- David From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 17:35:15 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01E84240201 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 17:35:15 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-ot1-x343.google.com (mail-ot1-x343.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::343]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NhYs6Yrdz3FXr for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 17:35:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-ot1-x343.google.com with SMTP id j16so4465219otl.1 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 09:35:13 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=qPRc6zlrWo1IizTe03Z4bLK/QPO637Hgix92oa0oD2o=; b=RKGKk77a8Xx+I3hCmNmnlFsWc9S2inV9uDJ2xWmM+mS9FiVhfXFb34cRgp6pXk6NZg 8WloJ5DnscgOAYAowHR1Q/bkA8zsDj0rhCDe5WbmwnjL9IDccdA3ZqEKanDb3a5oOKfT D0/K566xxrUD8miznYpfG4rj/bOHpPENPXYcEgQO7RatAUZ+xrZmxE6x4CbF+IEAaTJW JB5HxceAvXFgKorWPfTXyRwgJ3ooiLGTLxUZXHWR3idjuiUB9xnuIijSRR3wZmY+Ik4c Vt9jektO68vH9jemdCLpwoZqwtlxSLl2+iauV2sw5FEgCnFTSf8Y8KdyKXGBtzbxiLfG cMjw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=qPRc6zlrWo1IizTe03Z4bLK/QPO637Hgix92oa0oD2o=; b=oAOileNoxHTOcCS25mrhhDBa1VlKGVa+Tz38Sdx7JbPVKJW5VXrXRBDtcmUPq8uSqe r9zNpvGLi15kWD6MJOVEblWHZvqQyFwILTiw2al7XvI60RbwNfEAEIakXr3hZch2y/Ym 2uthMmugOFHX9NO0DejaLpJOdwX2QpDpM6Gwlp3Dhv3Ynrj1fSDtsDRKd2jnS/GAZcyn UFFuhIZB27JMc06BTGcQtphMGLoH3oR4a2zbtrVR8KrmJ8Q8g/y73Z07185XbAcEzlTD d+nNwccEeRF8xeaI4megpcTggutB+Gk4KPix+RSuGdgBYzqoOhe7a8pPOpkp4FnI5i9h nsdQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAU3zytDoY/T+iVaf2roHBRyLg+QYJE8nLk+SlwTXNg3hO+HVhsa Kvg5GaVBqG0EPO+DxCil9Z6ciqT6Jjs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxmCAQuJCmlVjFJUyrqBJfHtsXEfvCXQG9DNweYTydoZ33Am2K+FRpCIbllaKRH/Df7ahtYGw== X-Received: by 2002:a9d:6a53:: with SMTP id h19mr25455103otn.120.1582220112080; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 09:35:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ot1-f48.google.com (mail-ot1-f48.google.com. [209.85.210.48]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id x135sm1324375oix.20.2020.02.20.09.35.10 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 20 Feb 2020 09:35:11 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ot1-f48.google.com with SMTP id p8so4400034oth.10 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 09:35:10 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a9d:1c9c:: with SMTP id l28mr23959857ota.210.1582220110291; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 09:35:10 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> In-Reply-To: <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 18:34:58 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: "Joe A." Cc: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NhYs6Yrdz3FXr X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=RKGKk77a; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::343) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.44 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.4.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(-0.15)[ip: (2.89), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 17:35:15 -0000 On Thu, Feb 20, 2020 at 4:41 PM Joe A. wrote: > On Thu, Feb 20, 2020 at 01:17:01PM +0100, David Demelier wrote: > > Le 18/02/2020 ?? 04:23, Tomasz CEDRO a ??crit??: > > > because FreeBSD does not seem to be reliable desktop environment > > > anymore even on a decent modern machine :-( > > As to this: > AMD Ryzen 3 2200G with Radeon Vega Graphics (3500.09-MHz K8-class CPU) > real memory = 34359738368 (32768 MB) > nvidia-modeset: Loading NVIDIA Kernel Mode Setting Driver for UNIX platforms 440.31 Sun Oct 27 02:07:28 UTC 2019 > NVIDIA Corporation device = GP107 [GeForce GTX 1050 Ti] Looks like amazing setup! Can you use it to OpenCL (i.e. John CL)? Does `clinfo` return without Core Dump? Do you have any RADEON GPU to compare? :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 18:50:46 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 932F0241772 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 18:50:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-io1-f54.google.com (mail-io1-f54.google.com [209.85.166.54]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NkF13XNsz41qF for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 18:50:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: by mail-io1-f54.google.com with SMTP id z16so5823310iod.11 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 10:50:45 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=p5Nm9AOTXXCMIgeREgS29CKOJkDG35Ri60PBEh9//dU=; b=qi9z/lE5ELj5i+y3OMWpzdojNS+0mxRkXxj99fY2jnfz7zfS7pBMkOxUAx5E6bRRn5 X/b4jzs9LVcXyb2JdXgY1Mn5NTMvLAfWdL/8KKh6NDFOn21KrwDqHq06jTTU3QbrUsgX mgQYKv3tHQ6B+r0RKyK3+V5YNCE6ElvuQxSCyKUYLfkrKo/GCHjS69sXChdfmfLUJ9GB MJE2EC/DsaxoQAx7n1QSQmKXN0i/VlFfdOQ5NFRayocDrgxfgAyeJnN/JRl+Nsd4rrLz dvBgcBBZSrbPYdWhaK0rpkYDTVEuhVP2LOBtl1cAWLXZGXZHixLBPP6T5b2rYbi2A8nm L7FA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXK5/fPlzq68crItMWjDPmgdt2NmbkZUPRwGWet9xcXJAUcRLEz QY06ZIWg1iCDNn4dETbVvj6gUA+bgBY18UBBftSsNpSU X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqz5Pm4IfM3dzUB0tnHST9jyYpiXYk5sRAugY8yoT/gSqMMHEmcrSoW+f4cDFwalhekS+aHdm0yD2siyf6W2jIo= X-Received: by 2002:a6b:a13:: with SMTP id z19mr7090611ioi.182.1582224644560; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 10:50:44 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> In-Reply-To: <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> From: Ed Maste Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:50:32 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: David Demelier Cc: FreeBSD Questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NkF13XNsz41qF X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of carpeddiem@gmail.com designates 209.85.166.54 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=carpeddiem@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.92 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:209.85.128.0/17:c]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[freebsd.org]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[54.166.85.209.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-1.92)[ip: (-4.90), ipnet: 209.85.128.0/17(-2.99), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[emaste@freebsd.org,carpeddiem@gmail.com]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[emaste@freebsd.org,carpeddiem@gmail.com]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 18:50:46 -0000 On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 at 11:36, David Demelier wrote: > > Nice to hear, personally I'm unable to setup bluetooth (every hcccontrol > request end in a timeout) nor I'm unable to use two finger scroll on my > touchpad which literally work out of the box on Linux. Modern laptops need an I2C touchpad driver, which isn't in the base system yet. It's now available in the ports collection and can be built standalone fairly easily; it works fine on my Lenovo X1 Carbon 7th generation. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 18:52:43 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A4AC241AE1 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 18:52:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: from mail-yb1-xb29.google.com (mail-yb1-xb29.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b29]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NkHF6qklz452b for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 18:52:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: by mail-yb1-xb29.google.com with SMTP id u47so1694302ybi.1 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 10:52:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=seibercom.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:reply-to :organization:face:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=gCAMLsyFmStPntgmde74LN+gx7K4gnsSVQjmekc03Y0=; b=BgVb7PFUWsB6aw7F6yHe2BXGJu54cG5A2+XjOIvja7D4uiryHIIbp/z1ul4U29bSsw a2SCujSDmt7wcJ8FL775NA6fpMMN2a1YeirXbLyR2fIRv9J3DkIQKT/9NwKOZAZJgqdk S75ayksX+ixDa/0qJ4tAxl9Qy0I08d1cnnuAc= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:reply-to:organization:face:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=gCAMLsyFmStPntgmde74LN+gx7K4gnsSVQjmekc03Y0=; b=psS2w090EHVVV1bJMiY+J40f10wWnxjfrwClockRB5udZ30dlVox2LK5FFzzsBe4hL uYkoT8KkS7kJ3vp2KNGZcyRyxk+qNq+1WJqL1MlizJvnIYHEd7OwT1P1gCU3DnZnHzdP IkqD8U9n8QcxCIHoaf8z4wc8uCuzS3SVz4ZrPkjsGZJAH5FQCAakDL+O81FrZTQhOQaF +k8hxX/vORRlbCRmoviLH6o8uDfVvtIGnMvJdFAMzzItDLUJ282jYpe5G2yVorLTFcvB xuNMGq8jRcyH7uGGNn3xWWeHlfA68gKWbabtiwU+DHe9GJjffhFrb0b4pDPgUKwZCrRb 3cyw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWDq93+lqrQB8k91SZfyPoVSkzYdp1eDz9hdmpHTE+G0SIcguQo K+fsAQAvNDoWV9aZtbpB8IlMD8o1dcc= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwp2J5Y0N/ZO32t8K/maihzGbiAvQ3VKLqbiJCv19vgcj9oNCprhRtiJF6wcPlX0M2G2+Fdcg== X-Received: by 2002:a5b:992:: with SMTP id c18mr8512375ybq.515.1582224759760; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 10:52:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio.seibercom.net (cpe-174-109-225-250.nc.res.rr.com. [174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g190sm183956ywd.85.2020.02.20.10.52.38 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Thu, 20 Feb 2020 10:52:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48NkH92ldsz1X0s for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:52:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:52:36 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200220135236.1cfc4c74@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NkHF6qklz452b X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=BgVb7PFU; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::b29 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.49 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.51)[ip: (-8.93), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[9.2.b.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 18:52:43 -0000 On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 17:36:20 +0100, David Demelier stated: >Nice to hear, personally I'm unable to setup bluetooth (every >hcccontrol request end in a timeout) nor I'm unable to use two finger >scroll on my touchpad which literally work out of the box on Linux. I have never gotten bluetooth to work either. It should 'just work' without having to go through hoops to even begin to get it up and running. -- Jerry From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 20:29:25 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEF75244989 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:29:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from mailout.easydns.com (mailout.easydns.com [64.68.202.10]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NmQr2dK1z3Fgk; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:29:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43DC2A1549; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:29:23 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mailout.easydns.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (emo13-pco.easydns.vpn [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id c-wL7x6qy9rH; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:29:23 +0000 (UTC) Received: from hedeland.org (81-228-157-209-no289.tbcn.telia.com [81.228.157.209]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9F414A14A6; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:29:21 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pluto.hedeland.org (pluto.hedeland.org [10.1.1.5]) by tellus.hedeland.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id 01KKTJZM037170 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO); Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:29:19 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Ed Maste Cc: FreeBSD Questions References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> From: Per Hedeland Message-ID: Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:29:19 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NmQr2dK1z3Fgk X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of per@hedeland.org has no SPF policy when checking 64.68.202.10) smtp.mailfrom=per@hedeland.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.57 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[209.157.228.81.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[hedeland.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.83)[0.826,0]; IP_SCORE(0.47)[ip: (0.58), ipnet: 64.68.200.0/22(0.12), asn: 16686(1.73), country: CA(-0.09)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.47)[0.472,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[10.202.68.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16686, ipnet:64.68.200.0/22, country:CA]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:29:25 -0000 On 2020-02-20 19:50, Ed Maste wrote: > > Modern laptops need an I2C touchpad driver, which isn't in the base > system yet. It's now available in the ports collection and can be > built standalone fairly easily; it works fine on my Lenovo X1 Carbon > 7th generation. I'd be very interested in that - can you provide a more specific pointer than "in the ports collection"?:-) --Per From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 21:38:45 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F317124707A for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:38:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-oi1-x241.google.com (mail-oi1-x241.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::241]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Nnyq4lXRz3H8B for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:38:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-oi1-x241.google.com with SMTP id c16so29136472oic.3 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:38:43 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=jJ5REsUnbaONnLrg8ufk9dDsq8ZWSmcT1FUR76TeZ70=; b=J7NN2CQTkgOfVO4c3UUFHGwDyKeQN+cd1/EsVf42k1VCbSxyKsBILjsG8MAJ7AbtH9 zZIuH49GSfLMxQAIt1RwHTPgrJmAUw+S0vCOjun1mcVLA0Gk8+O13OZXsr1TCO012y3u h74DsQE0KMc/Lhn/LBJSs+7VOeSBz5RNbEaPCxJvuBvMbfoVSvblv8OWuDJBzFwlhj3e LHh6y9K1S5Pf0faWGm+4nmaKDzKE/fdFyP/SxKoWgui6JaGWhe3iU/nXGbvO+e/9IjuK B7/kZxfCGcpb8hDRiu9LS7BWp7pSBl02X23iWlH7GGxqMOfYFGvczE5GeoovYKQk3r9n r3cA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=jJ5REsUnbaONnLrg8ufk9dDsq8ZWSmcT1FUR76TeZ70=; b=eJG8ncmV8u6sZGHp+2nD3QRHCN5bTSJVbsKrr6UNDKyVanjqDIAa6dBlsaY4s09Axz w+xhXIt+pEUTXOoU6tsxCwddzEMfirXi2898lD4hMnADx/ws24PZmeuYFAwuxYbKURZC tIoNweA0gdo44kUK34KySrREgkiSyoIfUaAVUimcPOI54bNdyJj2RgEQdzT3gkmtNul9 EQT21s1Q+T4Cmn3dSLAOddXJ7LDhjrKXcolF65ifPv+9zOM7c4JQlfGVw4EiIEEgHdEW yY+DycnV7Shf0vzYlrG7t2oC+KL40M96Ii2D3HfqyN2i+eMez9NWOX0w86+lH1hW5voq 9e3Q== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXQmBtqobsCk1SlvyfBzBm51ypcFRExYS88VnzbdsDoEP6Es3BR EjKF6sERdfCrpGYbNRshTRdUsoLND8I= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqz4pvx8H0YuPUne0leadgBsPLxvvZWZFxHQn9F12gmtU0lzPAbf30UVucSQ5C0yhYgv4JyCwg== X-Received: by 2002:aca:5083:: with SMTP id e125mr3724648oib.96.1582234721754; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:38:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ot1-f47.google.com (mail-ot1-f47.google.com. [209.85.210.47]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id s128sm196222oia.4.2020.02.20.13.38.40 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:38:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ot1-f47.google.com with SMTP id i6so109804otr.7; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:38:40 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a05:6830:13ca:: with SMTP id e10mr25690238otq.267.1582234719808; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:38:39 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> In-Reply-To: From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 22:38:27 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Per Hedeland Cc: Ed Maste , FreeBSD Questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Nnyq4lXRz3H8B X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=J7NN2CQT; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::241) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.59 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[1.4.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(-0.29)[ip: (2.14), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:38:45 -0000 On Thu, Feb 20, 2020 at 9:30 PM Per Hedeland wrote: > On 2020-02-20 19:50, Ed Maste wrote: > > Modern laptops need an I2C touchpad driver, which isn't in the base > > system yet. It's now available in the ports collection and can be > > built standalone fairly easily; it works fine on my Lenovo X1 Carbon > > 7th generation. > > I'd be very interested in that - can you provide a more specific > pointer than "in the ports collection"?:-) +1 for Touchpad / Trackpad support hint.. in a perfect world I would love to see this working out of the box :-) I have a Panasonic Toughbook CF-MX4 with Synaptics Touchpad. Various gestures works out of the box on Linux and Windoze (including two finger scroll horizontal and vertical, pan, zoom, rotate, etc). On FreeBSD I did not manage to make it work neither with hw.psm.synaptics (seems like protocol out-of-sync), x11-drivers/xf86-input-synaptics (the same problem as with psm protocol error), nor x11-drivers/xf86-input-evdev :-( After working on MacBookPro Trackpad I do not imagine working without trackpad gestures anymore. Scrollbars are auto-hiding now and it really distracts to search and click-to-scroll (its so 90's). I only use mouse for CAD when really necessary.. I did not have this problem on any other laptop, usually at least two finger scroll worked with psm (but still not with the Apple's Trackpad quality). Best regards :-) Tomek ps/2: +1 for Bluetooth connectivity, preferably A2DP sound streaming to a bluetooth speaker, I saw other folks also find it useful :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Thu Feb 20 22:48:37 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 022EC2494D7 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 22:48:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ihor@antonovs.family) Received: from mail.antonovs.family (mail.antonovs.family [100.25.240.195]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NqWR38HMz4N80 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 22:48:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ihor@antonovs.family) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94F05138B96 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 22:48:29 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail.antonovs.family ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.antonovs.family [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id ojTv_FX5J-GL for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 22:48:29 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DB59138B97 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 22:48:29 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 mail.antonovs.family 4DB59138B97 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=antonovs.family; s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77; t=1582238909; bh=TyVSXv+digBrXadt0NNyFQrqtVyXf21JjWEqP2Vqqjc=; h=Date:From:To:Message-ID:MIME-Version; b=IV7G0TUPRMNPMQAV9XutbK4M6oObB38zai4bjrglUlbnemT8fSPVeVlHAmgUVsB4B 8Lis4uEm6yjNDNUmCL67wJ16U7iQsJzdj0BI18GPUy11C+BfJBFBHDBO8kUByH8Aej M5gVRLhi2QiXF3VMdgj/z7xGGfQmJ83cGroxxVa0DaSWrmpchA5gQYBBlMPXYQeggd KeQgESEB2VYZeEa85L9SfeD+eezYLLuWgLIjdwVs6OQm77d3QoxhAYJFt06R8ORxDm GCIq3Cxn3ivNb+LKYjk2S0AO2+JgwV7GM6IuqprmCK1CQYRFAnHmPeTEJOWY10ZQ4Q 7gvHHZrN6nlEg== X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at antonovs.family Received: from mail.antonovs.family ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.antonovs.family [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id R-9il42bXVOf for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 22:48:29 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (c-73-83-210-79.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [73.83.210.79]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id E5E35138B96 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 22:48:28 +0000 (UTC) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 14:48:21 -0800 From: Ihor Antonov To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200220224821.hi7n3n7wdd6d4ali@sea-ll-10936> References: <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> <20200218183010.5a52441f.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200218205940.04917783.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200219052643.7bd90d3c@scorpio> <20200219130628.457f8953@scorpio> <20200219134740.0df09817@scorpio> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20200219134740.0df09817@scorpio> X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NqWR38HMz4N80 X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=antonovs.family header.s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77 header.b=IV7G0TUP; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=antonovs.family; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ihor@antonovs.family designates 100.25.240.195 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ihor@antonovs.family X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.81 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[antonovs.family:s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE(-3.31)[ip: (-9.12), ipnet: 100.24.0.0/13(-4.36), asn: 14618(-3.00), country: US(-0.05)]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[antonovs.family:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[antonovs.family,none]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14618, ipnet:100.24.0.0/13, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[79.210.83.73.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 22:48:37 -0000 > On 2020-02-19 13:47, Jerry wrote: > It worked before; they broke it when updating. > If it had never worked, I might have considered donating a piece of > equipment to assist them, but this is obviously not that sort of > problem. Do you assume that developers have access to all possible hardware? Is it possible that it worked on your hardware before accidentally, wihout ever being tested explicitly? Secondly, do you assume that developers have time/possibility to test all possible configurations? (Not even talking about "Works on my machine" scenarios") > Obviously, the product was not properly beta tested. I have beta tested > things for several companies, including Microsoft. If something goes > really wrong, I have a phone number to call for assistance. That > doesn't exist with FBSD, which is why I NRVER user version X.0 of any > of their releases. I did feel that by the tine they got to X.1 they > would have ironed out the major bugs. Obviously, not true in this case. Do you think that someone else has to beta-test the release for you? > So, to answer your question, what I suggest is to wait until 13.1 is > released. If that doesn't work, I will just wait until 11.x is put out > to pasture and then move onto a new OS. I am sorry, I might be misreading this, and correct me if I am wrong, but all this screams entiteled attitude to me and is deeply wrong. If nobody tries X.0 release X.1 will never get stable. Your hardware does not work? Fix it or help someone fix it. You want a stable OS release? Use CURRENT, then STABLE, then X.0 release and fix/report bugs, only then you will get a good X.1 release. Or pay someone to do it for you. In community project the least everybody can do is be a tester. Waiting for someone to do all the hard work and then just hop on X.1 release and then complain that your hardware does not work is simply selfish. And in that context calling "absurd" the idea to let a developer have access to hardware that you need to work is... ugh.. I have no words for it... Ihor Antonov ------------- > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 00:52:51 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 89A8C24BEBB for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:52:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from mailout.easydns.com (mailout.easydns.com [64.68.202.10]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NtGn5FFFz3F9Q; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:52:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76B32A17D3; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:52:48 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mailout.easydns.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (emo13-pco.easydns.vpn [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lBYOo-yhjfPT; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:52:48 +0000 (UTC) Received: from hedeland.org (81-228-157-209-no289.tbcn.telia.com [81.228.157.209]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 825B5A04FD; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:52:45 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pluto.hedeland.org (pluto.hedeland.org [10.1.1.5]) by tellus.hedeland.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id 01L0qgQk037737 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:52:42 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Tomasz CEDRO , Ed Maste Cc: FreeBSD Questions References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> From: Per Hedeland Message-ID: <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:52:42 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NtGn5FFFz3F9Q X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of per@hedeland.org has no SPF policy when checking 64.68.202.10) smtp.mailfrom=per@hedeland.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.70 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[209.157.228.81.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[hedeland.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.82)[0.821,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.61)[0.615,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[10.202.68.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16686, ipnet:64.68.200.0/22, country:CA]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.47)[ip: (0.58), ipnet: 64.68.200.0/22(0.12), asn: 16686(1.73), country: CA(-0.09)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:52:51 -0000 On 2020-02-20 22:38, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > On Thu, Feb 20, 2020 at 9:30 PM Per Hedeland wrote: >> On 2020-02-20 19:50, Ed Maste wrote: >>> Modern laptops need an I2C touchpad driver, which isn't in the base >>> system yet. It's now available in the ports collection and can be >>> built standalone fairly easily; it works fine on my Lenovo X1 Carbon >>> 7th generation. >> >> I'd be very interested in that - can you provide a more specific >> pointer than "in the ports collection"?:-) > > +1 for Touchpad / Trackpad support hint.. in a perfect world I would > love to see this working out of the box :-) [snip complaints about touchpad not working] Sorry, but I asked a specific question due to Ed's report that an I2C touchpad driver was available "in the ports collection", and hoped to get an answer since I have such a touchpad (on a cheap-o Lenovo ideapad 320). This is not detected at all by 12.1-RELEASE out-of-box. Anyway, a bit of searching in the ports tree indicated that it was sysutils/iichid, and after building/installing/loading it, plus loading ig4, installing x11-drivers/xf86-input-libinput, and adding the suggested xorg.conf snippet (adjusted per output from 'libinput list-devices') - the touchpad works! (At least to the extent that I care to use it.) It has a kind of strange behavior though, might be a feature:-) - if I move the cursor and let go of the touchpad without first stopping the motion, the cursor continues to move on its own... Thanks a lot for the info, Ed! --Per From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 01:04:27 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5418724C613 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:04:27 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@chthonixia.net) Received: from mail1.g14.pair.com (mail1.g14.pair.com [66.39.4.16]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48NtXB0RSfz3N5g for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:04:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@chthonixia.net) Received: from mail1.g14.pair.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail1.g14.pair.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 193AEA6D2B for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:04:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from ghostyhead.chthonixia.net (cpe-108-176-147-163.nyc.res.rr.com [108.176.147.163]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail1.g14.pair.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0097BA6D22 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:04:24 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:04:21 -0500 From: "Joe A." To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48NtXB0RSfz3N5g X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@chthonixia.net has no SPF policy when checking 66.39.4.16) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@chthonixia.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.28 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.84)[-0.837,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.996,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[chthonixia.net]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[16.4.39.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7859, ipnet:66.39.0.0/17, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.24)[asn: 7859(-1.16), country: US(-0.05)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:04:27 -0000 On Thu, Feb 20, 2020 at 06:34:58PM +0100, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > Looks like amazing setup! Can you use it to OpenCL (i.e. John CL)? > Does `clinfo` return without Core Dump? Do you have any RADEON GPU to > compare? :-) I was aiming at the 'decent, modern' aspect; and a working desktop. So, probably no to your questions. That said, I run the things I need; from sigil to darktable to inkscape, etcetera. WRT to the Radeon: no, the CPU is actually an APU: 2200G with Radeon Vega Graphic and no, I've never gotten it to run. But that's no barrier; I can use the Nvidia. -- More of a point-and-click user, honestly. Though I can set up SSH for incoming! Yay me! From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 01:07:34 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEEC124C782 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:07:34 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@chthonixia.net) Received: from mail1.g14.pair.com (mail1.g14.pair.com [66.39.4.16]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Ntbp1kx9z3QF9 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:07:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@chthonixia.net) Received: from mail1.g14.pair.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail1.g14.pair.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 468BEA6D1F for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:07:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from ghostyhead.chthonixia.net (cpe-108-176-147-163.nyc.res.rr.com [108.176.147.163]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail1.g14.pair.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 2D01AA6D14 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:07:33 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2020 20:07:29 -0500 From: "Joe A." To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200221010729.GB54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Ntbp1kx9z3QF9 X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@chthonixia.net has no SPF policy when checking 66.39.4.16) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@chthonixia.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.16 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.72)[-0.723,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[chthonixia.net]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[16.4.39.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7859, ipnet:66.39.0.0/17, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.24)[asn: 7859(-1.16), country: US(-0.05)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:07:35 -0000 On Thu, Feb 20, 2020 at 05:36:20PM +0100, David Demelier wrote: > > Nice to hear, personally I'm unable to setup bluetooth (every hcccontrol > request end in a timeout) nor I'm unable to use two finger scroll on my > touchpad which literally work out of the box on Linux. > > I've used FreeBSD on my laptop a while back, it was a better experience. > Using on a simple workstation is quite convenient though. But on laptop, > it's huge nightmare (not mentioning ACPI). Ah...yes, I can tend toward agreeing on that. But a laptop and a desktop are different beasts. Also, I do use Mint Linux on laptops. So there is that. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 05:08:43 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67C07252608 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 05:08:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-oi1-x22a.google.com (mail-oi1-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::22a]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Nzy13KVrz411w for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 05:08:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-oi1-x22a.google.com with SMTP id c16so452491oic.3 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:08:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=XqxCiwKaugwqTqhFnlx1KHWGSQgJsfaYP7sr0Y/t38Q=; b=UVJQTA+73pIgLFxGz8Kmp8zzJb2MFjx3UoWXj3sIuEwUTb+0AV2zfvH9Nz63brGE+P u8iinIWy9hnuMnAJgK2M93m0yutcCLIwu3vxMEsF+tHh6t8AmDLsOmW3+XvWFTgTtjti 7fAGSxnIPaThFpbogQ2Zu2ubhjFjzNwu/wW2NtC5HCTf1o0+vUgIJdy0HdjovWBInbC1 kFk/HqmEbkAH0x8qUZBXJTonI35+6odiIIx/PmBOWrx09vWntYf9IsY79GLs/X3OBKAP Vv1QB7MczFdyW0QhfhuteYO2fAYTwwMoe70kDKlnY21HK0F5i2vfHFfO6xB+UJfReupx Qw5Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=XqxCiwKaugwqTqhFnlx1KHWGSQgJsfaYP7sr0Y/t38Q=; b=PSEqtzh/TrmimH2Eo2hfXm3UZCMmM5dpyZoIhKDDmvTUkXph0y+QUgE6FKZ205KeOs Qj0G6g3XQpcy3HXTVuiPCxnoiQuMaBl9jNbRE++4Q4qVFVXqKWc+h3rDwJZH7BhRU47u /D/eTKN94qwGJ/VdmY+Rc+mFMA6ahtxu9gTj637BKpFb697eWisG5gnM9RLEoXQNf264 eJMhe45Vjq3RWZs/Uk5y9Jq4VNM0p1hYLP53qJjDJ4crpvcc0ZsJaCQjX8yASKRS4WAk pR4NkflpRMCAWlqbIJTxJHtUp430/qfgQPr4ZXKYEDDvZUIUMsGv8TVNs+a474Ru3lu+ C3Ng== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWQ514y2S7/hBhfxBgz8uD7Wb7+FX8gnajucadnSARfX6LXe0tu ppdGq5ClLBZ7SSq8kLW6TIthTXiCSck= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqw/gWwAtpQa/JtE/fY3sqPagVrMN0hjcYUD2TsyaSlaedgCidV3r7wV6BEOwvFiPuPr/p8gqA== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:487:: with SMTP id z7mr554014oid.59.1582261719682; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:08:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-oi1-f170.google.com (mail-oi1-f170.google.com. [209.85.167.170]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id q9sm555870oij.38.2020.02.20.21.08.37 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:08:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-oi1-f170.google.com with SMTP id v19so416989oic.12; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:08:37 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:3b4:: with SMTP id n20mr551251oie.78.1582261717466; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:08:37 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> In-Reply-To: <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:08:23 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Per Hedeland Cc: Ed Maste , FreeBSD Questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Nzy13KVrz411w X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=UVJQTA+7; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::22a) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.47 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[a.2.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(-2.17)[ip: (-7.24), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 05:08:43 -0000 On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 1:52 AM Per Hedeland wrote: > Anyway, a bit of searching in the ports tree indicated that it was > sysutils/iichid, and after building/installing/loading it, plus > loading ig4, installing x11-drivers/xf86-input-libinput, and adding > the suggested xorg.conf snippet (adjusted per output from 'libinput > list-devices') - the touchpad works! (At least to the extent that I > care to use it.) This is clearly something that is very missing in the Handbook / WIKI / synaptics manpages! I always gave FreeBSD as an example of perfectly documented project. Does not seem applicable anymore. Documentation is out of sync and "works for me" solutions are so Linux :-( On the other hand IICHID was released 9 days ago - and finally brings standard to USB and I2C HID layer on FreeBSD serving as input for evdev and libinput - THANK YOU WULF7 :-) > It has a kind of strange behavior though, might be a feature:-) - > if I move the cursor and let go of the touchpad without first stopping > the motion, the cursor continues to move on its own... This is a feature not a bug ;-) However, there should be a decay in the scroll speed when you let go scrolling ;-) You may want to try sysctl, xmodmap, xinput, or gsettings to change / tune Touchpad parameters. -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 05:21:08 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06E11252A82 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 05:21:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-oi1-x230.google.com (mail-oi1-x230.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::230]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48P0DL6D9wz4M1Z for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 05:21:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-oi1-x230.google.com with SMTP id c16so475005oic.3 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:21:06 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=a7X9QKAfjmkR+s7JCwDBlQK+tsxQSAJdEf5zpi6KpyM=; b=iA+47DkgtEGcXU6v3y4mooULeQYcVUjVx1j1nQ3T3+B6yUMa0HO2YotB2MfZ2VImaX ULUde1ov4/2Fh2/S8+73M9kH70O7OwPYuvtFxWvHV+scOvJuJgx7pbf0U6/TSSvEuB/S HN/O+VbEczaBW7EOFjSqGxbulVN3w/iWs5SZbprMxeIXnFTfNhHKna0lwUXK7xcxhAUE iyUCrcBszqMkpF9lM2BqRdacsmfo7+Fdg5kvRLRrvgWcmR9gonYonB2gBFUjB25dXcDx O+j4Um+ermiEyXVB/PrSNgld2BoDVpmHdmqV4eRV+93h+sp8qor7UbJkxvbDb7i/gd0E i14Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=a7X9QKAfjmkR+s7JCwDBlQK+tsxQSAJdEf5zpi6KpyM=; b=p4eyoXoDNfQRD6blKzmLTajy+XodNyAeuJvP6etogxk3c6SGUtQJ66z/2GPunjN7zy WApI2W0czYirXxJS0xyvQBmnlCv/Zetcmdx/aw676dI8jEqtINLjX3RcDsNUtQeE0QLF zI36C+nZ/PAja3oCXxbu5r5EBNrQhPduLRNgnYivJ+VncXD303fgaxq8Wp1YB0pqhkKQ nEtTzrS7RQ0o+REbz5N7t597kcN1AoTQaX9LDN0Rg+sUNLQKdlTIUAvMOOV1p0b6UNwk gCJxAeEHlq+4tXJEmCao/xB6xa7nd+7mfBezisyc2uB/qLMsiFX1Vcmd+4QO5YYLFwn7 mROA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVUp/4nMSFsBgXaFANHqup0TpcNv8gysbBnowiTC41KBrQdZCy1 //Ggd65ONe0rf9lmJZEdySzjlvHYG5M= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzEOMg7UzppKRUn5fKaHkvL5WDcfcQnfxttXgQfCZnlTtcbzJbOEnVBX/IjObusxUtKP/2ptA== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:4d3:: with SMTP id a19mr532577oie.119.1582262464879; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:21:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-oi1-f182.google.com (mail-oi1-f182.google.com. [209.85.167.182]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id j140sm571527oib.46.2020.02.20.21.21.03 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:21:04 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-oi1-f182.google.com with SMTP id a142so456271oii.7 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:21:03 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:aca:d5d3:: with SMTP id m202mr538169oig.161.1582262463263; Thu, 20 Feb 2020 21:21:03 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> In-Reply-To: <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:20:50 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: "Joe A." Cc: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48P0DL6D9wz4M1Z X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=iA+47Dkg; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::230) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.61 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[0.3.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(-2.31)[ip: (-7.93), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 05:21:08 -0000 On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 2:04 AM Joe A. wrote: > I was aiming at the 'decent, modern' aspect; and a working desktop. So, > probably no to your questions. That said, I run the things I need; from sigil > to darktable to inkscape, etcetera. > > WRT to the Radeon: no, the CPU is actually an APU: 2200G with Radeon Vega Graphic > and no, I've never gotten it to run. But that's no barrier; I can use the Nvidia. I was also big fan of nVidia for about 20 years.. until I wanted to use it for OpenCL on BSD and found out they dont give a sh$^ about supporting Open-Source (see famous Linus middle finger scene, also note that nvidia drivers are binary blobs) so I switched to AMD RADEON :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 05:51:43 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E75E925345E for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 05:51:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@chthonixia.net) Received: from mail1.g14.pair.com (mail1.g14.pair.com [66.39.4.16]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48P0vf6mbRz4BbX for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 05:51:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@chthonixia.net) Received: from mail1.g14.pair.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail1.g14.pair.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C836A6D3D for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:51:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ghostyhead.chthonixia.net (cpe-108-176-147-163.nyc.res.rr.com [108.176.147.163]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mail1.g14.pair.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3BAFCA6D3C for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:51:41 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:51:39 -0500 From: "Joe A." To: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48P0vf6mbRz4BbX X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@chthonixia.net has no SPF policy when checking 66.39.4.16) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@chthonixia.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.14 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.70)[-0.696,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[chthonixia.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; IP_SCORE(-0.24)[asn: 7859(-1.16), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[16.4.39.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7859, ipnet:66.39.0.0/17, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 05:51:44 -0000 On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 06:20:50AM +0100, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > I was also big fan of nVidia for about 20 years.. until I wanted to > use it for OpenCL on BSD and found out they dont give a sh$^ about > supporting Open-Source (see famous Linus middle finger scene, also > note that nvidia drivers are binary blobs) so I switched to AMD RADEON Had I my preferences, I'd run AMD Radeon also. But I had such issues with the Radeon APUs that I just decided to go with the Nvidia, at least until things sorted between AMD and FreeBSD. Not that anyone is at fault nor that the volunteers don't do what is needed; it's just that many things are changing. For instance, it wasn't that long ago that I couldn't even find (let alone afford) a GPU for a PCI slot...remember how bitcoin miners were purchasing everything in sight and driving prices way up[1]? It's only been the in the last year or so that I began seeing GPUs for a PCI slot on the shelves. So at the time, I had no choice but to purchase an AMD APU. It's a good thing there were volunteers for FreeBSD that worked on those. -- [1] Well, there was an old-power-wasting-runs-hot-card. But who wants that? From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 07:40:11 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDE292550D4 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 07:40:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) Received: from s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com (s1-b0c6.socketlabs.email-od.com [142.0.176.198]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48P3Jp5hpLz43ln for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 07:40:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=email-od.com;i=@email-od.com;s=dkim; c=relaxed/relaxed; q=dns/txt; t=1582270811; x=1584862811; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:message-id:subject:to:from:date:x-thread-info; bh=G88riKHIxi8PVbXhHlVgdzRixqy7KSaFebZQ+QChPVM=; b=cjwgx6AzjJR6G48L1f3vXT0EW94Yv4G8D9w1orMIMNm5jh/V/JmwuXhhqA2iepw+lfrN/unQjgj8eN6+RFTWD44KSZv8DJ5nt34cm7K4p+Ej9pV18fUwnm7dSSkhomLCMFBulkCR7P1QaVnB3W3ZVLERwDeHWWrPzReng8c/UL4= X-Thread-Info: NDI1MC4xMi43NDAwMDAwMGU3MzliMy5mcmVlYnNkLXF1ZXN0aW9ucz1mcmVlYnNkLm9yZw== Received: from r4.h.in.socketlabs.com (s1-b40f.socketlabs.email-od.com [142.0.180.15]) by mxsg2.email-od.com with ESMTP(version=Tls12 cipher=Aes256 bits=256); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 02:40:05 -0500 Received: from smtp.lan.sohara.org (EMTPY [185.202.17.215]) by r4.h.in.socketlabs.com with ESMTP(version=Tls12 cipher=Aes256 bits=256); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 02:40:04 -0500 Received: from [192.168.63.1] (helo=steve.lan.sohara.org) by smtp.lan.sohara.org with smtp (Exim 4.92.3 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1j52up-000Lm6-Ms for freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 07:40:03 +0000 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 07:40:03 +0000 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-Id: <20200221074003.ac92947e587090803bd4d6da@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd12.0) X-Clacks-Overhead: "GNU Terry Pratchett" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48P3Jp5hpLz43ln X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=email-od.com header.s=dkim header.b=cjwgx6Az; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of 4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com designates 142.0.176.198 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.89 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.98)[-0.982,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[email-od.com:s=dkim]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:142.0.176.0/20]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[sohara.org]; FORGED_SENDER_VERP_SRS(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; IP_SCORE(0.09)[ip: (-0.25), ipnet: 142.0.176.0/22(0.52), asn: 7381(0.26), country: US(-0.05)]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[email-od.com:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[198.176.0.142.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.15.0]; ENVFROM_VERP(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7381, ipnet:142.0.176.0/22, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[steve@sohara.org,4250.10.freebsd-questions=freebsd.org@email-od.com]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 07:40:11 -0000 On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:08:23 +0100 Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 1:52 AM Per Hedeland wrote: > > Anyway, a bit of searching in the ports tree indicated that it was > > sysutils/iichid, and after building/installing/loading it, plus > > loading ig4, installing x11-drivers/xf86-input-libinput, and adding > > the suggested xorg.conf snippet (adjusted per output from 'libinput > > list-devices') - the touchpad works! (At least to the extent that I > > care to use it.) > > This is clearly something that is very missing in the Handbook / WIKI > / synaptics manpages! Perfect opportunity to submit a documentation patch. > I always gave FreeBSD as an example of perfectly documented project. How do you think it got that way ? -- Steve O'Hara-Smith From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 08:51:37 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5C66256ECF for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:51:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-oi1-x22f.google.com (mail-oi1-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::22f]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48P4vD1nVZz44q6 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:51:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-oi1-x22f.google.com with SMTP id d62so858931oia.11 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:51:35 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=KLL/s584YiAT3f+qHJYK4FFuS3NF1cnp+F4Z0DJdKDI=; b=Fzxcj9SXmvYbalot3VoKiYi6SsTmGlGMH4buQNXGQ6EZ80eKXvC+hrIOEaPrtDZixo J9mqQ90MPUUQ/vV5kvmYigcf50i7pEN+AE6MV9tTi5HpbSeBFCP5zbfM+rSyyxgMNc6g P2Xqghe8zwSx3F6amo2962ZGLL6MbGZkqWY7KmR+tm/um1Nn+/w/Hya3F3XvV0k6MiAN EWHjIcAXbrxSRZEMs2QvDykZx0DtQ9o/jACoGX+fnNU7Ak1qP8RCxnan/j0NqxiaIS1V 4kJPkshiFBRdeo8ivL67BghJyZM1wiJBmNL5AldDA0AyjHqyEsP9vHogaalM4XnkXr9q yeuQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=KLL/s584YiAT3f+qHJYK4FFuS3NF1cnp+F4Z0DJdKDI=; b=rbRBsoE6iK86nj+OX5Q3YUWI/3oBz1TRtk4seluc0ZR9RC7fYTw7En8Vc5SIHn1p9p jcvwYdgnz8Yj57rUFC8MW7ggyTUrsV9iI11S6rlrp3QD3YgVz0/1DBiWx1firpdUa42M pUgl/0Ep37SBNRLGJmXBRxYXwNmCQuX0t1rtPK2iAES3kXKRLJnHFvhSQ1vHEIqXGcH3 W0BtjUjQDQlqx84fkRC3Gtl80feUAs12WIEOl940CDaKRz+siIJigANksEmCiLdroVTE d6TRyNHb+WdlSgVFc0M+ogqoSYCPkAoMQ1ldn+vImWUQu/K4Us3hpCvVpB+6B1E1JIen RwnQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXmW3Ziy8QW5qqz0Evg8OFg5NmFbOjAiRIqNIbXfUCyYH2Eiqtx 5a4eY3UJEvpRLN/+cP5Fucp2Ze9w79Y= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxqV6PZJI4+napB5AkOAkh406lE8cg4UXL9Hp/sqLI5dIbdIOb/rBFesAZPw1un8mc9V2Pa3w== X-Received: by 2002:aca:b183:: with SMTP id a125mr1086721oif.83.1582275093736; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:51:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-oi1-f173.google.com (mail-oi1-f173.google.com. [209.85.167.173]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id s128sm721295oia.4.2020.02.21.00.51.32 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:51:32 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-oi1-f173.google.com with SMTP id b18so889600oie.2 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:51:32 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:aca:1b11:: with SMTP id b17mr1105210oib.45.1582275092392; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 00:51:32 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> <20200221074003.ac92947e587090803bd4d6da@sohara.org> In-Reply-To: <20200221074003.ac92947e587090803bd4d6da@sohara.org> From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 09:51:19 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: "Steve O'Hara-Smith" Cc: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48P4vD1nVZz44q6 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=Fzxcj9SX; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::22f) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.66 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[f.2.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(-2.36)[ip: (-8.17), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:51:37 -0000 On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:40 AM Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: > On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:08:23 +0100 > Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > This is clearly something that is very missing in the Handbook / WIKI > > / synaptics manpages! > Perfect opportunity to submit a documentation patch. Indeed! :-) https://github.com/wulf7/iichid/issues/18 This IICHID is a total fresh thing (and still experimental)! It had initial release just 9 days ago and I did not head about this project before. So nice to talk with smart people, thank you! :-) -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 09:14:28 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52F91257BC3 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 09:14:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: from mail-ot1-x334.google.com (mail-ot1-x334.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::334]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48P5PZ26mkz4Ww5 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 09:14:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from tomek@cedro.info) Received: by mail-ot1-x334.google.com with SMTP id 77so1397355oty.6 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:14:25 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cedro.info; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=jibY79TAvhfj7/moDvKLJSdX/8utJnzZXALjYer++B0=; b=dnZ8HjyfyjVKRQYrp+OXpw65q+EJoibs6XuvglTYPbnre3XccVvETNlNkrFPFR8yGq BMG+ZMSKuXAXk+5qFV6/OD3E5GMqLdZ7P2IL8mBSALvrRRZhjeqXZTDB9F0N8ncHBoFb 4QJaLnwuq9R2Pcu3c8mZ/TkM7MM/8UysBknqr8JE3rC05MDpsLzfssFZpo3wa6WXssLY rZR+whgP1WfsVBD+97XCgHC83qhXF6xDUDQkZW0mHnF3wZtFgii28N6h8l4zGru8pISy 1ttxoi14sVac4eLW3UA4RrBtG1sd2x2/hnEoT3KJEyT4FaQmlal70HUyuxhy1NG+cHOJ Nc6A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=jibY79TAvhfj7/moDvKLJSdX/8utJnzZXALjYer++B0=; b=rC6a8PfWVX4YDDauaNbwSJ6KSrV58RrWGBGltOKswCYWvX/+OpbYoi1xjkLs4NOtju 3xuDkh6Px6Ec8FUPV4gPcv3PdRvltwhCAx6H5fGqiP5/pzYuSNc1bLAeHAYwyZ2NGYJr ccSzOH8i58FWv5tyMPsuo3hg83Z1CfSzlMTJceIZmMcngeoBBAa9GL+CrQOJGPXcPSoc X1dnbVZyJ/knjjSRHikwg6PBMxy2BZXEXZvpFcwSDy6gdPK7tRcMmj135lsb5IL5Ln9n 3o7YBolBPfNmfTru/Vmr7B0xLvAKGyx9DL1MWbgHT6Q8HfTez25KhQsNJkwU6Y1lmnJS N+ag== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVAAh87lFD+rZxt0ibTT7mvJVuQJWEGLSihP5VET0GY/mEXryhR VGzoX3+u1hYKoqQTcINxSkalWCCp/W4= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqynnIvhW5Mc8qnXqzeVFVlxvVwmajoMNh/jZe0K93bZZTMPIr+XBuR6TJOWo+Ni9ArCTkhqhw== X-Received: by 2002:a9d:600e:: with SMTP id h14mr26180190otj.113.1582276464162; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:14:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ot1-f54.google.com (mail-ot1-f54.google.com. [209.85.210.54]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c36sm826804otb.55.2020.02.21.01.14.23 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:14:23 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ot1-f54.google.com with SMTP id j20so1419963otq.3 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:14:23 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a05:6830:13ca:: with SMTP id e10mr27698363otq.267.1582276462834; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 01:14:22 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> In-Reply-To: <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> From: Tomasz CEDRO Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:14:09 +0100 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: "Joe A." Cc: FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48P5PZ26mkz4Ww5 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=cedro.info header.s=google header.b=dnZ8Hjyf; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tomek@cedro.info has no SPF policy when checking 2607:f8b0:4864:20::334) smtp.mailfrom=tomek@cedro.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.47 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[cedro.info:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[cedro.info]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[cedro.info:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[4.3.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(-2.17)[ip: (-7.26), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 09:14:28 -0000 On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 6:52 AM Joe A. wrote: > Had I my preferences, I'd run AMD Radeon also. But I had such issues with > the Radeon APUs that I just decided to go with the Nvidia, at least until > things sorted between AMD and FreeBSD. Not that anyone is at fault nor that > the volunteers don't do what is needed; it's just that many things are > changing. This is exactly the reason why I have switched from nVidia to AMD RADEON and planning no return!! Because nVidia does not provide documentation nor support to Open-Source, only binary blobs, you start to think that their drivers are the best because "they just work"^TM. Nothing more misleading! nVidia seems to have no respect in the Open-Source community. I was also astonished with that being their 20 years long loyal customer. When you look at the true Open-Source drivers, you will notice they are poor and you cannot really do anything more with nVidia than just display. While GPU nowadays is the most powerful computation unit out there you can get for the money you can afford.. and you can make no use of it :-( Open-Source RADEON drivers in general are by some considered even better than binary blobs provided by AMD. Here comes the development of DRM layer that is something brand new in FreeBSD that will support all new GPU in a truly Open-Source fashion (but hey where does that firmware comes from??). This will also provide OpenCL access. This is _very_ important and worth the price to wait/help/test :-) I am just really scared that DRM here in FreeBSD may be implemented in a "Linux way" where its API/ABI changes from release to release. This already happened and touched the surface during 12.0 -> 12.1 switch. I truly hope it will never happen again. I remember this situation in Linux back then around 2.4.10 kernel and that was the definitive moment when I totally stopped using Linux and started deliberately avoiding it. -- CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 09:18:22 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48BCF257D81 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 09:18:22 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from new1-smtp.messagingengine.com (new1-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.221]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48P5V451qcz4bQ9 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 09:18:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from yuripv@yuripv.me) Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailnew.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D0FF4120; 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charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.60.0.2.5\)) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life From: Yuri Pankov In-Reply-To: <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 12:18:17 +0300 Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <565C8E52-00C6-47B2-B211-F573391D086B@yuripv.me> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> To: David Demelier X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48P5V451qcz4bQ9 X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=yuripv.me header.s=fm1 header.b=aTPs/890; dkim=pass header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm2 header.b=2jc5gihz; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of yuripv@yuripv.me designates 66.111.4.221 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=yuripv@yuripv.me X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.84 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(0.00)[+ip4:66.111.4.221:c]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_GOOD(0.00)[221.4.111.66.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.18]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yuripv.me:+,messagingengine.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[68.4.155.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:66.111.4.0/24, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[221.4.111.66.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_XBL(5.00)[68.4.155.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.4]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(0.00)[yuripv.me:s=fm1,messagingengine.com:s=fm2]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[yuripv.me]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.20)[0.198,0]; BAD_REP_POLICIES(0.10)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.72)[0.722,0]; IP_SCORE(-3.48)[ip: (-9.78), ipnet: 66.111.4.0/24(-4.89), asn: 11403(-2.68), country: US(-0.05)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 09:18:22 -0000 On 20 Feb 2020, at 19:36, David Demelier wrote: >=20 > Le 20/02/2020 =C3=A0 16:41, Joe A. a =C3=A9crit : >> Desktop user since 1999, no sysadmining here. In fact, in 1999 Linux = was >> inestimably harder to use for a desktop than FreeBSD. >=20 > Nice to hear, personally I'm unable to setup bluetooth (every = hcccontrol request end in a timeout) nor I'm unable to use two finger = scroll on my touchpad which literally work out of the box on Linux. >=20 > I've used FreeBSD on my laptop a while back, it was a better = experience. Using on a simple workstation is quite convenient though. = But on laptop, it's huge nightmare (not mentioning ACPI). It=E2=80=99s yet another thread that compares FreeBSD against Linux, and = does mention =E2=80=9CACPI=E2=80=9D without any related information, so = I simply *have* to ask =E2=80=94 ACPI what?= From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 11:34:08 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CAED25A6B7 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 11:34:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=UNXr=4J=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info) Received: from mail.sermon-archive.info (sermon-archive.info [71.177.216.148]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48P8Vk5JB4z4BdK for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 11:34:06 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=UNXr=4J=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info) Received: from [10.0.1.251] (mini [10.0.1.251]) by mail.sermon-archive.info (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48P8Vh6bxyz2fjWP for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 03:34:04 -0800 (PST) From: Doug Hardie Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) Subject: Ethernet Driver Message-Id: <6181B1C2-D46F-493F-9AAB-394DC9D45ADA@mail.sermon-archive.info> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 03:34:04 -0800 To: FreeBSD X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.101.4 at mail X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48P8Vk5JB4z4BdK X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of SRS0=UNXr=4J=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info designates 71.177.216.148 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=SRS0=UNXr=4J=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.25 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.80)[-0.797,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:71.177.216.148]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.998,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(-0.05)[asn: 5650(-0.20), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[148.216.177.71.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[bc979@lafn.org,SRS0=UNXr=4J=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:5650, ipnet:71.177.216.0/23, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[bc979@lafn.org,SRS0=UNXr=4J=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 11:34:08 -0000 I just plugged in an Insignia USB to ethernet adapter into FreeBSD 12.1. = ifconfig shows it as ue0. I find no information on a ue driver in the = code or man pages. Yet it appears to work. I can assign it an address = and it tries to send on that link (there is only a switch at the other = end). ifconfig is the only thing that shows it. pciconf and usbconfig do not = seem to show it. -- Doug From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 11:58:30 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A68D25AEA4 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 11:58:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bsdlisten@gmail.com) Received: from mail-wm1-x32c.google.com (mail-wm1-x32c.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::32c]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48P92s1BhKz40tT for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 11:58:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from bsdlisten@gmail.com) Received: by mail-wm1-x32c.google.com with SMTP id p9so1482934wmc.2 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 03:58:28 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=wYON7bM96bHTntvmRHWRmcBiobcJv35ilmR1ZttaHfA=; b=BV3zLa51WsdkggIys/7gnnUmQb8RD3fCsnZIgJaou9gL6KEZ9sA72WuedLihPh+ky+ FgqH5MCkOCLl4W0mJVXmXlhOd8rGX+teUGp1wGkPG20IXpxzR1BKL1/hVajSocbD8j5P /7426Pk+5sUI3y2MKGIng+qHBMfCXgns2XSWzHBYxLS8feekcz80LJMaqTwmV4rG8z6W /QC1inKocZuHZDxzr1DcGfKdUQKIB7iwN1rHjyGSfTEQlhRov6goc+H698FTaK6IYRqN 0/6Oa5NRRmR1FsVgqSZbd7a3mL8uEJi9GTilZtGXzGIzoqKf+Y73/NBYVHa1F9zxUN3q ysxg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-disposition:in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=wYON7bM96bHTntvmRHWRmcBiobcJv35ilmR1ZttaHfA=; b=r8PKeI3RpcqzrgpVqLMp6ddZfoSm4OXiKno0SjwK1+OgNXfr0rmzEn+pueaxUKEFzA emRKr8uCRYvQSPxuzkUIQpZGLLA0jkaqt6XLxMSCKiubeAjNKb//n+rWiwPhYoEwprXm G96BPrVm4IwXDVoEHYHY7rEsrjULmS3Guh8NXWn8I0dgggJ3m1D9JwzGuDmoEkyDjZQS /EeEW+s0IvjXrXhoxN4iQb6Z9urtVMputWL2sAmRHucbvBmS52xfCwAXCEJYuaOar7vV wg8bmenMqJFQ0dDxqaIC3+a+isTskNIS/Vg1U+QuSJQk44KnDRmHVNCbbPMwFkltfnOK iaEA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWl5T3W5utXm3ciJxWou5+KfjinTPOy/V/iaF2n/qWaMMvNFRnn x5zfNh26GEoF1qfnZOk7tfKuV9KV X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzJBkc1zhV9wpJWZ18Pmqg11dDU3XsXYTTF2ogjE3rV1HrZHTmRTxfFIrQ3x1hdVYY7m6u6UA== X-Received: by 2002:a1c:44d:: with SMTP id 74mr3540820wme.53.1582286307055; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 03:58:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from SVROLP00901 (91.209.45.19.dmz.softvision.ro. [91.209.45.19]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id s139sm3603030wme.35.2020.02.21.03.58.26 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 03:58:26 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 13:58:19 +0200 From: Rares Aioanei To: Doug Hardie Cc: FreeBSD Subject: Re: Ethernet Driver Message-ID: <20200221115819.GA5590@SVROLP00901> References: <6181B1C2-D46F-493F-9AAB-394DC9D45ADA@mail.sermon-archive.info> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <6181B1C2-D46F-493F-9AAB-394DC9D45ADA@mail.sermon-archive.info> User-Agent: Mutt/1.9.4 (2018-02-28) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48P92s1BhKz40tT X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=BV3zLa51; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of bsdlisten@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::32c as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=bsdlisten@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.50 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2a00:1450:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.38), ipnet: 2a00:1450::/32(-2.42), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2a00:1450::/32, country:US]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[c.2.3.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.5.4.1.0.0.a.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 11:58:30 -0000 On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 03:34:04AM -0800, Doug Hardie wrote: > I just plugged in an Insignia USB to ethernet adapter into FreeBSD 12.1. ifconfig shows it as ue0. I find no information on a ue driver in the code or man pages. Yet it appears to work. I can assign it an address and it tries to send on that link (there is only a switch at the other end). > > ifconfig is the only thing that shows it. pciconf and usbconfig do not seem to show it. > > -- Doug > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" So does it actually work? As in, can you use ping with it, or wget, etc.? -- Best, Rares From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 12:33:30 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C97CC25C780 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 12:33:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@qeng-ho.org) Received: from bede.qeng-ho.org (bede.qeng-ho.org [217.155.128.241]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48P9qF4nkrz3KwQ for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 12:33:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@qeng-ho.org) Received: from arthur.home.qeng-ho.org (arthur.home.qeng-ho.org [172.23.1.2]) by bede.qeng-ho.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D07110669; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 12:33:22 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: Ethernet Driver To: Doug Hardie , FreeBSD References: <6181B1C2-D46F-493F-9AAB-394DC9D45ADA@mail.sermon-archive.info> From: Arthur Chance Message-ID: Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 12:33:21 +0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <6181B1C2-D46F-493F-9AAB-394DC9D45ADA@mail.sermon-archive.info> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48P9qF4nkrz3KwQ X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@qeng-ho.org designates 217.155.128.241 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@qeng-ho.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.75 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:217.155.128.240/29]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[qeng-ho.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(-2.45)[ip: (-7.61), ipnet: 217.155.0.0/16(-3.80), asn: 13037(-0.74), country: GB(-0.07)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13037, ipnet:217.155.0.0/16, country:GB]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 12:33:30 -0000 On 21/02/2020 11:34, Doug Hardie wrote: > I just plugged in an Insignia USB to ethernet adapter into FreeBSD 12.1. ifconfig shows it as ue0. I find no information on a ue driver in the code or man pages. Yet it appears to work. I can assign it an address and it tries to send on that link (there is only a switch at the other end). > > ifconfig is the only thing that shows it. pciconf and usbconfig do not seem to show it. The source appears to be in /usr/src/sys/dev/usb/net/usb_ethernet.[ch] I know nothing further about it. -- Violets are red And roses are blue When metamaterials Alter their hue. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 13:37:45 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 30F2225DE2B for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 13:37:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from mailout.easydns.com (mailout.easydns.com [64.68.202.10]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PCFN0XBpz4YD5; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 13:37:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83B1CC4296; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 13:37:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mailout.easydns.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (emo12-pco.easydns.vpn [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id l2mIHPJz7tI8; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 13:37:41 +0000 (UTC) Received: from hedeland.org (81-228-157-209-no289.tbcn.telia.com [81.228.157.209]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4AA0CC1277; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 13:37:37 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pluto.hedeland.org (pluto.hedeland.org [10.1.1.5]) by tellus.hedeland.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id 01LDbZwp039795 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:37:35 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Tomasz CEDRO Cc: Ed Maste , FreeBSD Questions References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> From: Per Hedeland Message-ID: <2ab81e7d-6f31-517c-ab7b-4646b18ce225@hedeland.org> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:37:35 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PCFN0XBpz4YD5 X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of per@hedeland.org has no SPF policy when checking 64.68.202.10) smtp.mailfrom=per@hedeland.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.57 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[209.157.228.81.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[hedeland.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.74)[0.744,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.56)[0.559,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[10.202.68.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16686, ipnet:64.68.200.0/22, country:CA]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.46)[ip: (0.57), ipnet: 64.68.200.0/22(0.11), asn: 16686(1.72), country: CA(-0.09)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 13:37:45 -0000 On 2020-02-21 06:08, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 1:52 AM Per Hedeland wrote: >> Anyway, a bit of searching in the ports tree indicated that it was >> sysutils/iichid, and after building/installing/loading it, plus >> loading ig4, installing x11-drivers/xf86-input-libinput, and adding >> the suggested xorg.conf snippet (adjusted per output from 'libinput >> list-devices') - the touchpad works! (At least to the extent that I >> care to use it.) > > This is clearly something that is very missing in the Handbook / WIKI > / synaptics manpages! > > I always gave FreeBSD as an example of perfectly documented project. > > Does not seem applicable anymore. Documentation is out of sync and > "works for me" solutions are so Linux :-( Well, as you note below (and also clear from Ed's message), this is brand new stuff - not handbook material just yet IMHO. But once I was made aware of the port, it was really quite straightforward to get it going - I got all the info except the need for xf86-input-libinput (which wasn't very hard to infer) from the links in the pkg-descr, in particular the README.md in wulf7's repo. And I prefer to take the positivie view - this touchpad was completely dead until I learned of the port, now it works, even though it requires a bit of tinkering to set up. This is *progress* and *good* in my book, and I'm sure it will get better/simpler over time. The same goes for the "new drm" that has seen so much criticism - without that, X on this laptop (with Intel Kaby Lake something) was completely impossible, with the "new drm" it pretty much "just worked". I don't know about the synaptics part - in fact I'm pretty ignorant in general about the hardware involved.:-) The touchpad is (now) identified as ELAN0608, is this related to synaptics in any way? > On the other hand IICHID was released 9 days ago - and finally brings > standard to USB and I2C HID layer on FreeBSD serving as input for > evdev and libinput - THANK YOU WULF7 :-) > > >> It has a kind of strange behavior though, might be a feature:-) - >> if I move the cursor and let go of the touchpad without first stopping >> the motion, the cursor continues to move on its own... > > This is a feature not a bug ;-) However, there should be a decay in > the scroll speed when you let go scrolling ;-) This is not scrolling, just moving the cursor/pointer across the screen - and there is absolutely no decay in the speed, it continues at the same speed (at least:-) in the direction of the move until it hits the closest edge of the screen (also continues along that edge until it reaches a corner). Per above it's pretty easy to avoid by stopping the motion before letting go of the touchpad, but it does seem weird... > You may want to try sysctl, xmodmap, xinput, or gsettings to change / > tune Touchpad parameters. I played a bit with the acceleration parameters via 'xinput --set-ptr-feedback', no effect on this. Do you have any more specific tips? --Per From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 14:08:14 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2FEE25EA79 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:08:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-il1-f179.google.com (mail-il1-f179.google.com [209.85.166.179]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PCwY3cPrz4HfM for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:08:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: by mail-il1-f179.google.com with SMTP id x2so1697698ila.9 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:08:13 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SF4QkF7MrZjclLsNnqoHOXlG04x6KdRts4fTbeQND44=; b=ARSH/1KoD+w+mJBudzurgQUc+vfjBW3J3SP4a7qoBUKlHGYL104Z2rvXJCQ6iY1p45 lChyCb6locsAEBqEuwD8utkCA4NOljDSZTIm+AfP+v++sRvoSR/R1tqHPfLnQC2lYAIn U66NAQ53majevGdjeCBeTPeWWJs8S62JoSFBMKGfRSpmrGqHy0/bhwSvuzCANG7J7JYZ bCFSDWkhSYO/fMKrR7Jg9q2sLVxHLi9V3Hfdk5YkAi7/Fyg528zRcClrKx/ruAGSawRO wIKUHa6IuBX5wpgadP86qgTNUT7s/1ig6thr6S/GNdDFAO+b4RuPZjciwXV0bKuB+TQm OeqA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXLrqgTR4Mx0ldTY2kky7HR/yQPGkklcrWLn4AiDfXLOXv2breZ KaltB9y9TrVVOoFBhSRZXYUm0FbudagEp+5Zzkl5iMRi5qs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqy89Jmb1lKDGwM5UXiq+sG9yu8V/yIfA3JycEc3uLl1SicTYSvjD/OCRKvBaLM3esVUXuim7kFObKYUe/tHYcg= X-Received: by 2002:a92:5cda:: with SMTP id d87mr37733058ilg.100.1582294092384; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:08:12 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> In-Reply-To: From: Ed Maste Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 09:07:57 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Per Hedeland Cc: FreeBSD Questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PCwY3cPrz4HfM X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of carpeddiem@gmail.com designates 209.85.166.179 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=carpeddiem@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.27 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:209.85.128.0/17]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[freebsd.org]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[179.166.85.209.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.27)[ip: (-6.62), ipnet: 209.85.128.0/17(-2.99), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[emaste@freebsd.org,carpeddiem@gmail.com]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[emaste@freebsd.org,carpeddiem@gmail.com]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:08:15 -0000 On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 at 15:29, Per Hedeland wrote: > > On 2020-02-20 19:50, Ed Maste wrote: > > > > Modern laptops need an I2C touchpad driver, which isn't in the base > > system yet. It's now available in the ports collection and can be > > built standalone fairly easily; it works fine on my Lenovo X1 Carbon > > 7th generation. > > I'd be very interested in that - can you provide a more specific > pointer than "in the ports collection"?:-) It's sysutils/iichid, added quite recently https://www.freshports.org/sysutils/iichid/ I hope it is added to the base system soon; the port was created to make it easier for folks to install/test the work in progress. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 14:11:21 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D2E025EBA9 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:11:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: from mail-io1-f50.google.com (mail-io1-f50.google.com [209.85.166.50]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PD082cQCz4PLr for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:11:20 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from carpeddiem@gmail.com) Received: by mail-io1-f50.google.com with SMTP id z16so2456775iod.11 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:11:20 -0800 (PST) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=vKz53FJoe/ibHPMN7b8V6fbh6K0mBGywMkdchfWCWHg=; b=qCK6Io+lCB2oGUpBSA6c1xN398hpUkQg3A7K9CniCwk2X6D1v+LfmMWeKNJlYYKyZo dH7MYNbH4ejAX5qbFcQvc4UG2nsZxfH+na0ST6kVPGEsmSwGeim7/dLXyhKhAKHyrnFK 8d2mHw+0FHFjJvAYT8DxGskdzDm7hjjNwregXCgFYB2F70f8nEF6tedU/rjIsqbp2Duf IwtV+nzkTkZ0Xgg5bPOuhDfpx/GqjtgxxBdJX58/UdvmOi32Ni5s3bCgNlIqnZeoMAzk qyfBk1mZsz/rS0InXkUAOL2aCZYp5k0O8tg8hCUBCLjsjN9kAcs+TwqsX6uLbVN5BVdj AgxQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVh2y60inSZbRsa59K6Wne6heHfbq0YbGBlS4OFe9Z8QJledTl9 e+XaFwSH1PKjbGOXuQrynpZcDHdfuSS5vTYGw9cXMbYm X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqw4/YaTnNkYWlHVSpuum9plxavO+26ZU5Lw85LAIMfOdPDxiVAdmvAjQYGPZrlkRzEHml46KmKTyShKnRWMPyU= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6638:72c:: with SMTP id j12mr32833277jad.136.1582294278854; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:11:18 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> In-Reply-To: <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> From: Ed Maste Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 09:11:06 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Per Hedeland Cc: Tomasz CEDRO , FreeBSD Questions Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PD082cQCz4PLr X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of carpeddiem@gmail.com designates 209.85.166.50 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=carpeddiem@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.93 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:209.85.128.0/17:c]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[freebsd.org]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[50.166.85.209.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(-1.93)[ip: (-4.93), ipnet: 209.85.128.0/17(-2.99), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[emaste@freebsd.org,carpeddiem@gmail.com]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[50.166.85.209.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[emaste@freebsd.org,carpeddiem@gmail.com]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:11:21 -0000 On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 at 19:52, Per Hedeland wrote: > > It has a kind of strange behavior though, might be a feature:-) - > if I move the cursor and let go of the touchpad without first stopping > the motion, the cursor continues to move on its own... This might be part of the reason it's still experimental :) I'm not sure where the developers working on this are collecting feedback / bug reports but I'll make note of this thread to them. From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 14:12:31 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E939025EDAF for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:12:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48PD1W5t1wz4RK3; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:12:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from localhost (unknown [172.58.139.70]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id F38324E689; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:12:30 -0600 (CST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:12:28 -0600 In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, Ed Maste , Per Hedeland CC: FreeBSD Questions From: Valeri Galtsev Message-ID: <53C308C2-3537-45B5-A1A4-7945DA603852@kicp.uchicago.edu> X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PD1W5t1wz4RK3 X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.996,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:12:32 -0000 On February 21, 2020 8:07:57 AM CST, Ed Maste wrote= : >On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 at 15:29, Per Hedeland wrote: >> >> On 2020-02-20 19:50, Ed Maste wrote: >> > >> > Modern laptops need an I2C touchpad driver, which isn't in the base >> > system yet=2E It's now available in the ports collection and can be >> > built standalone fairly easily; it works fine on my Lenovo X1 >Carbon >> > 7th generation=2E >> >> I'd be very interested in that - can you provide a more specific >> pointer than "in the ports collection"?:-) > >It's sysutils/iichid, added quite recently >https://www=2Efreshports=2Eorg/sysutils/iichid/ > >I hope it is added to the base system soon; Not to the base system, please=2E Valeri the port was created to >make it easier for folks to install/test the work in progress=2E >_______________________________________________ >freebsd-questions@freebsd=2Eorg mailing list >https://lists=2Efreebsd=2Eorg/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions >To unsubscribe, send any mail to >"freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd=2Eorg" ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 14:37:21 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2123E25F8C5 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:37:21 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ozgur@kazancci.com) Received: from relay12.mail.gandi.net (relay12.mail.gandi.net [217.70.178.232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PDZ75jLgz4L26 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:37:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ozgur@kazancci.com) Received: from webmail.gandi.net (webmail21.sd4.0x35.net [10.200.201.21]) (Authenticated sender: ozgur@kazancci.com) by relay12.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id BACEC20000D for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:37:15 +0000 (UTC) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:37:15 +0300 From: =?UTF-8?Q?=C3=96zg=C3=BCr_Kazancci?= To: FreeBSD Subject: FreeBSD equivalent of LMD/Linux Malware Detect? Message-ID: <7e2b46d9fd477722ae145abda20ce4e9@kazancci.com> X-Sender: ozgur@kazancci.com User-Agent: Roundcube Webmail/1.3.8 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PDZ75jLgz4L26 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ozgur@kazancci.com designates 217.70.178.232 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ozgur@kazancci.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.49 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.998,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:217.70.178.192/26]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kazancci.com]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[232.178.70.217.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:29169, ipnet:217.70.176.0/20, country:FR]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-1.10)[ip: (-2.64), ipnet: 217.70.176.0/20(-1.57), asn: 29169(-1.27), country: FR(0.00)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:37:21 -0000 Has anyone ever come across a FreeBSD equivalent of (or any similar tool to) Linux Malware Detect, a.k.a. lmd? https://www.rfxn.com/projects/linux-malware-detect/ https://github.com/rfxn/linux-malware-detect It *somehow* works on FreeBSD 10/11, but not on 12 at all. I need to scan *regularly* php-shell scripts/php malwares (and any other skript-kiddies stuff) on a public web server. I'd be much grateful to any related suggestions as well. Thanks in advance for any ideas, Özgür Kazancci From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 14:56:44 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6271238206 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:56:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from mout.kundenserver.de (mout.kundenserver.de [212.227.17.10]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "mout.kundenserver.de", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass Class 2 CA" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PF0W3GZQz3Pgc for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:56:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from r56.edvax.de ([178.12.117.217]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (mreue108 [212.227.15.183]) with ESMTPA (Nemesis) id 1N2m3G-1jS0600C7A-0138MS; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:56:40 +0100 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:56:38 +0100 From: Polytropon To: David Demelier Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-Id: <20200221155638.5ac76845.freebsd@edvax.de> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> Reply-To: Polytropon Organization: EDVAX X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.1.1 (GTK+ 2.24.5; i386-portbld-freebsd8.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:eJsC3cSYVHHjS7YfpG+qkr7UEu0mBiVuWve9GeGFxJhRSRAUVUS 7XMamVpLj7CsXvPv++6joxnQcczmPfSynBG1mXjiOVsKZiT+8IJKVv8sSF/mmNbrt9ZCR4j y7rdpOUdVWQlUGXXRAlYXbgME8clTqr0t5q8ZK+eIstZv/lK/OOE/pEkelT/kaSmfUKw1Qg 0uJh9bdCWIasTCZLXYoEw== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:ekKrfl+L7JU=:yVE/Quu3JIeTwUxFBwQzvt I7q46uFT+rQ+Z3jDcZLI3Z5/Q9A06F5hMcUhofqU47oOAqHmJkEs6Sles8InohE+pGSOXwI0a M6+bHwYpAV37pFFif0N76FssoA2tEC3/eJFy1t4ByRHZgElvRpGniBpt3iczN4+cEm9E0ggBA fHB50q3Wpuo2ud6ar17L4R4gu0DnkZRsX2rmAI6y6PejufmQHwzEVVSFd1knnoYaclKYYPBnZ m2bfJTGoY7zH/hZyjTc74YUUuoKgH+zz/M76mjW/mYerKBfvihgHZI14YfrXdX+OCxxKrl5rw gO3COHzl3Sto77p3SgFUkdQWkC98zIvH8XQZW0T2pzXrkAvYbTI7zY0UbXTG4TnD+maSiF2/0 qeBFy2fEicpoOYH2jG49m2bllGGxwnk3mK+KtiWzCFo+KqOb0HRQVX4UNK1UuNh1+onTSusjB XStjJF1ERbeJ6MCzmRDavFJvVFFwfQuky6DjdXOWCBMam3N3TlAny6QbJC/r2bRCVTzpnmAuR p1pGmi4JiF1vTsmtjaB7UJFmiWPwkQBpUPqZfEyR2NOJultm0j9u+MsCuZ2FWyL+dLoGS+49+ CCzQIIqmFlyfbNgHAbSlkx3aYcZKPJi2NunqvHfdRLE913SUfwepcOgEqbfmuw23StxBmhTRA w2kzVP175U84j5cBYpdNVywlr5D2CNqJ8rllVQ6zNmJdsS3TzlLIKtCD6MJsK0vawe30if6Fn 7ShBDTdIAq65OuFunBhZLNl2CxX1EQWmcyulrLZyeR+OFQJeWJFz5WhHq6kb/F3tcHnyYsoHg 4O39HxdJFv7atzoGhSD1+BjVI7TuQGAq2jSH4qjfJIhgsfQnwD3qSnspMKDXslImEd0YaTu X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PF0W3GZQz3Pgc X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@edvax.de has no SPF policy when checking 212.227.17.10) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@edvax.de X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.35 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd@edvax.de]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[217.117.12.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8560, ipnet:212.227.0.0/16, country:DE]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[edvax.de]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.96)[0.958,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.90)[0.899,0]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[10.17.227.212.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[10.17.227.212.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.17]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(0.09)[ip: (-0.61), ipnet: 212.227.0.0/16(-1.12), asn: 8560(2.19), country: DE(-0.02)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 14:56:44 -0000 On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 13:17:01 +0100, David Demelier wrote: > FreeBSD for desktop is still not a thing. So I'm obviously doing something wrong. :-) FreeBSD is my _primary_ desktop since version 4.0. This desktop achieves the following abilities for decades now: 1. I can do what the "cool kids" can do before they can do it. 2. I can do it better / faster / more reliable / ... 3. I can keep doing it when the "cool kids" have become unable to do it. This is of course specific to _my_ needs, which may be totally different from what everyone else does with a desktop. In my case, I use it for web browsing, multimedia, and gaming, as well as for programming and what they call "web development" today. :-) > It won't change anytime soon > because lacks of manpower and less interest into porting things to > FreeBSD. While I disagree with your first statement, I fully agree with this one. But you need to acknowledge that most desktop software is not directly written for FreeBSD ("native solution"), but instead ported over from Linux. Linux, as a "moving target" kind of platform, makes it hard to follow and port. We are still stuck with stuff like HAL and DBus, things already abandoned in Linux and replaced with functionally equivalent solutions in the lower levels of the OS (system libraries and kernel), which are _not_ compatible to FreeBSD, so workarounds need to be created, or those things need to be implemented from scratch. And that of course is not a trivial task. > That's why DRM, bluetooth, wireless, ACPI and wayland terribly > lag behind Linux. As far as I know, Wayland is a Linux-only thing. ACPI - look at the implementations, not at the standards. In many cases, you can blame the manufacturers deviating from the standard, doing their own strange thing, and supplying a "Windows" driver to compensate what they did wrong. Wireless - yes, fully agree. While it is not a problem with older chipsets, it sometimes is with newer ones. Bluetooth - no idea, I'm not using that. And DRM (digital restriction management) - if you want that, just go to jail. ;-) > To me FreeBSD stays a server OS (even though rolling-releases ports are > not appropriate). FreeBSD's big advantage, as I already wrote, is its ability to be _one_ OS for many things: for servers, for desktops, for appliances, and for "mixed forms" (which you cannot easily put in one of the three big groups, i. e., a desktop workstation offering local server functionality). Everything comes from the same codebase, and has, with a few limitations, the same pool to source 3rd party applications from (the Ports colleciton). In my opinion, this makes FreeBSD much more than "just" a server OS. -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 15:09:52 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE3562387C7 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:09:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from mout.kundenserver.de (mout.kundenserver.de [217.72.192.73]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "mout.kundenserver.de", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass Class 2 CA" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PFHg1sfLz48Z3 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:09:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from r56.edvax.de ([178.12.117.217]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (mreue106 [212.227.15.183]) with ESMTPA (Nemesis) id 1MqJZl-1jqXYm0MxH-00nNHJ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:09:39 +0100 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:09:38 +0100 From: Polytropon To: Tomasz CEDRO Cc: "Joe A." , FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-Id: <20200221160938.e35b4ca4.freebsd@edvax.de> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> Reply-To: Polytropon Organization: EDVAX X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.1.1 (GTK+ 2.24.5; i386-portbld-freebsd8.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:rqq1qIMR+hpmyHU0hif7p7qOmR4FQOsIEU7NX6EBjQiINYve3jt qnW2WObD7ZqTBRjDypuND6Pxa5pNo83dxCFG6PinHjE4QrmHDPKd2VRzIYacw+YdFIdNvwY vmmIG/VKy6KtPVRpJXDpHJgD0zxmjpprwC0CxdOUoJ759oySJv9KN+cEluTdZK3LP3MpNi8 S0kWstVGywYxxsaThf0WA== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:BWpBh2kRAHk=:bx5E0bSLnKCDIRj7Q8ZVGI xQ/1wSsuYqcNRj/YVGjoPBGmGGx8+VGt1qw+PXXkflY6xzyc3CnR+peSvLHf0r4+4DbnGfzXk Ven4w38Vy4C+p91sJPq9IOGGF6nwj/EGiXDHxsPUlC/DZ3dselRtRjPT6xWF5Qd15IALSLIUS L7nAf+34LQ7jgHTzilnFbQDZs6Q3xg87b8EQuR894fLrjjxuBgvwj1NzCgPEGoqbaMlM4wR2L 6rFlbhxcW+40784N4AZQ3G0GYCbltO/UFEIJys4Vdu6ZDNzw195enT1a+GkH4o0XCdwHlDbw6 F+xhKGtnfKq7Z7WJzkrxktVapcXhj/aWLUrYa6LE3HyiOSLNwq+KdnEOURFAGL0yALVsV1ph+ 1X5paBKVfl2d5gIAy+h5pczd6SqFM11gZ/jTVbKc7fm4d/1MAV3MIDvHXUXDBALu3NpeQALhl BD0colgQHFCfLuifiNNe4WIQQXwys4UJA942CR9+NtYvsa64kTAyMF2jpB9Gph4Q9NmyrAcza gg4cnMr2sT7p505TEAYh03HpmNSlYTG0Yozu0bL+JJZVYn2BjdSehtR7h+pJ2CjavNBjOEPVy duMpdyYv0vipBbtm+aq1htP97HPfN59MkGu1Renkegwt3YtxiWD2Yi8gWMmqO8fWL70XWPB5a +BgxicKXwZmihEseLXoc+QIhz6G/E9oSBjQNwlQzNLSiulJmHVchwSZiY38b4QQx+1UGuCBEw g+JKzpAmhMQpwddjwREBOc8TuHOHndd2wZMrf7lDD7nZW7NoeMnJdY2LjdE2vAshDxKgAt2vI 6LvnFdJUPW8ypR5PXQ7jRukkYI9jnbHWijhfzxmRYVniPUKogswHAulHLWnvjE2x3UJyyZw X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PFHg1sfLz48Z3 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@edvax.de has no SPF policy when checking 217.72.192.73) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@edvax.de X-Spamd-Result: default: False [4.93 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd@edvax.de]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8560, ipnet:217.72.192.0/20, country:DE]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[217.117.12.178.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[edvax.de]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(1.00)[0.996,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[0.999,0]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[73.192.72.217.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(0.54)[ip: (0.18), ipnet: 217.72.192.0/20(0.34), asn: 8560(2.19), country: DE(-0.02)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:09:52 -0000 On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:14:09 +0100, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > This is exactly the reason why I have switched from nVidia to AMD > RADEON and planning no return!! > > Because nVidia does not provide documentation nor support to > Open-Source, only binary blobs, you start to think that their drivers > are the best because "they just work"^TM. Nothing more misleading! > > nVidia seems to have no respect in the Open-Source community. I was > also astonished with that being their 20 years long loyal customer. > > When you look at the true Open-Source drivers, you will notice they > are poor and you cannot really do anything more with nVidia than just > display. Exactly my impression. While there are several (I think, 3) open source nVidia drivers, all of them have problems. Some just offer 3D graphics, others won't work in 64 bit OS mode, and others just freeze when being loaded. The binary blob is the only way to get proper 3D support. > Open-Source RADEON drivers in general are by some considered even > better than binary blobs provided by AMD. Interesting. This seems to be a "ride back to the past" where ATI (which was the typical brand name of the Radeon-type GPUs at that time) was always superior to nVidia: 3D support out of the box, with the standard drivers included with X. Then there was a time where nVidia was considered better than ATI / AMD (again, judging from the binary blob driver!), and today, AMD using the open source drivers seems to be the way to go. > Here comes the development of DRM layer that is something brand new in > FreeBSD that will support all new GPU in a truly Open-Source fashion > (but hey where does that firmware comes from??). Don't ask the firmware question. Don't ask _any_ questions going below the visibility level. ;-) -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ... From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 15:15:19 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A80A2238B34 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:15:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from odhiambo@gmail.com) Received: from mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (unknown [127.0.1.3]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48PFPz0z6yz4L4c for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:15:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from odhiambo@gmail.com) Received: by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) id EC02B238B32; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:15:18 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB975238B31 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:15:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from odhiambo@gmail.com) Received: from mail-oi1-x235.google.com (mail-oi1-x235.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::235]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PFPx3Rzwz4L2J for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:15:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from odhiambo@gmail.com) Received: by mail-oi1-x235.google.com with SMTP id i1so1872671oie.8 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 07:15:16 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=zL5bNFV+08Lg0fKEwmoa4YuF0W/3COhmaSPbCXkgqXY=; b=FcPdf02bPny0M2YQ3iA7i1plQzqJyF6A06LAX+J9u+wUoKmG78K+H+xO/WafCPMJP2 4eFVqDLSuS+GTkVNh7V4soszlJjX70h7fFz9qeLCPpdAPXfPrjVtYg7basmY72k0sUr2 UKHiNJ26pT+sLrCTMcaBvYijd279/MvEoAgwpc7p/WXhxp1qGDpuMbfHa5mVm7PURtIi gkvV5+hE8UYzb5O3H2OZNSwlw7DcuMjHkVYh2oXqc6zsRJoBO4P8eY83HvFHI7GaVO4a hrdBtblETYluabw+/p/vydiC85akNEDm2itJJTxil0+8/itMyRVxRWD/KcaqFRt+071q bq+w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=zL5bNFV+08Lg0fKEwmoa4YuF0W/3COhmaSPbCXkgqXY=; b=eEbFuyh5OlmP/QC3c5uSyg9F0OpO9OITgE+qhspYyuDeaCefTQyHlVs7Nkif7jCcyo LW71/TnTA1XeV/4hKwY+LUIjN44rIjKwrSBwhc8oP6KZqURMFyVgW1pY5LnsnqSHe5Mt rgVORIRsEqnBOQ1plwKh4NE63MxL8KOiqqu/pPJHuU12SrNTaihFNiFB3SzHqjt2VjEk 9t5SDXnzzrionJE58ZuxSseGvrVnOUizu8h17irnfCvbj9EckMQ84bdQwinvJ6qYQ7fR H64KZrfDACdSe0+6Q5wbNau5JfAv1/wV+ozn6RWy4K9aPjSN8k8cjqQMpbnfhxAoJ9rU Mn6A== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVqYoot5MdpxAeaaKsqf2gpi5DDtz5haKtebNBhGeaZkz80dHwx KSrOs4BdHzrWYODf1MJau+HTCyMrr0HaJYWhCIHcbZ+B X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzC/KfwkqCvkU4e4NM5DyaSlnk6DFYrJ6Smpj926M/52RKcjeH/Rw/U55kTOcE+Cji2hDWOEJbRKHpu9QYKTYo= X-Received: by 2002:aca:2210:: with SMTP id b16mr2308904oic.32.1582298114433; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 07:15:14 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Odhiambo Washington Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 18:14:38 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: SOGO-4.3 on FreeBSD 12.1 To: questions X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PFPx3Rzwz4L2J X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=FcPdf02b; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of odhiambo@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::235 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=odhiambo@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-8.99), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[5.3.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:15:19 -0000 Hello, Has anyone been able to compile SOGo-4.3 on FreeBSD 12.1? Mine fails like below: 1 warning generated. clang WOResponse+SOGo.m -c \ -MMD -MP -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\"root@waridi.kihingovillage.com 202002211812\"" -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\" root@waridi.kihingovillage.com 202002211812\"" -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\" root@waridi.kihingovillage.com 202002211812\"" -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DGNUSTEP -DGNUSTEP_BASE_LIBRARY=1 -DGNUSTEP_RUNTIME=1 -D_NONFRAGILE_ABI=1 -DGNUSTEP_BASE_LIBRARY=1 -fno-strict-aliasing -fexceptions -fobjc-exceptions -D_NATIVE_OBJC_EXCEPTIONS -pthread -fPIC -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -O2 -pipe -fstack-protector-strong -fno-strict-aliasing -O2 -pipe -fstack-protector-strong -fno-strict-aliasing -Wno-import -I/usr/local/include -fobjc-runtime=gnustep-1.8 -fblocks -Wuninitialized -g -frecord-gcc-switches -fconstant-string-class=NSConstantString -I../../SOPE/ -I../../SOPE/ -I.. -I../../UI -I../../SOPE/ -I.. -I../../UI -I./derived_src -I. -I/usr/ports/www/sogo4/work/GNUstep/Library/Headers -I/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/Headers -I/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Headers -I/usr/local/include \ -o obj/SOGo.obj/WOResponse+SOGo.m.o WORequest+SOGo.m:35:2: warning: this should be changed someday [-W#warnings] #warning this should be changed someday ^ 1 warning generated. clang WOContext+SOGo.m -c \ -MMD -MP -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\"root@waridi.kihingovillage.com 202002211812\"" -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\" root@waridi.kihingovillage.com 202002211812\"" -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\" root@waridi.kihingovillage.com 202002211812\"" -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DGNUSTEP -DGNUSTEP_BASE_LIBRARY=1 -DGNUSTEP_RUNTIME=1 -D_NONFRAGILE_ABI=1 -DGNUSTEP_BASE_LIBRARY=1 -fno-strict-aliasing -fexceptions -fobjc-exceptions -D_NATIVE_OBJC_EXCEPTIONS -pthread -fPIC -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -O2 -pipe -fstack-protector-strong -fno-strict-aliasing -O2 -pipe -fstack-protector-strong -fno-strict-aliasing -Wno-import -I/usr/local/include -fobjc-runtime=gnustep-1.8 -fblocks -Wuninitialized -g -frecord-gcc-switches -fconstant-string-class=NSConstantString -I../../SOPE/ -I../../SOPE/ -I.. -I../../UI -I../../SOPE/ -I.. -I../../UI -I./derived_src -I. -I/usr/ports/www/sogo4/work/GNUstep/Library/Headers -I/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/Headers -I/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Headers -I/usr/local/include \ -o obj/SOGo.obj/WOContext+SOGo.m.o NSData+Crypto.m:314:21: error: use of undeclared identifier 'MD4_DIGEST_LENGTH' unsigned char md4[MD4_DIGEST_LENGTH]; ^ NSData+Crypto.m:315:18: error: use of undeclared identifier 'MD4_DIGEST_LENGTH' memset(md4, 0, MD4_DIGEST_LENGTH); ^ NSData+Crypto.m:323:3: warning: implicit declaration of function 'MD4' is invalid in C99 [-Wimplicit-function-declaration] MD4([self bytes], [self length], md4); ^ 1 warning and 2 errors generated. gmake[6]: *** [/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Makefiles/rules.make:479: obj/SOGo.obj/NSData+Crypto.m.o] Error 1 gmake[6]: *** Waiting for unfinished jobs.... gmake[5]: *** [/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Makefiles/Instance/framework.make:612: internal-framework-run-compile-submake] Error 2 gmake[4]: *** [/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Makefiles/Master/rules.make:297: SOGo.all.framework.variables] Error 2 gmake[4]: Leaving directory '/usr/ports/www/sogo4/work/SOGo-4.3.0/SoObjects/SOGo' gmake[3]: *** [/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Makefiles/Master/serial-subdirectories.make:53: internal-all] Error 2 gmake[3]: Leaving directory '/usr/ports/www/sogo4/work/SOGo-4.3.0/SoObjects' gmake[2]: *** [/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Makefiles/Master/serial-subdirectories.make:53: internal-all] Error 2 gmake[2]: Leaving directory '/usr/ports/www/sogo4/work/SOGo-4.3.0' ===> Compilation failed unexpectedly. Try to set MAKE_JOBS_UNSAFE=yes and rebuild before reporting the failure to the maintainer. *** Error code 1 Stop. make[1]: stopped in /usr/ports/www/sogo4 *** Error code 1 Stop. make: stopped in /usr/ports/www/sogo4 -- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254 7 3200 0004/+254 7 2274 3223 "Oh, the cruft.", grep ^[^#] :-) From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 16:10:47 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 471DF239CE3 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:10:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48PGdy1yfmz43Cx for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:10:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from point.uchicago.edu (point.uchicago.edu [128.135.52.6]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 6CA854E679; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Polytropon , Tomasz CEDRO Cc: "Joe A." , FreeBSD Questions Mailing List References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221160938.e35b4ca4.freebsd@edvax.de> From: Valeri Galtsev Message-ID: Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200221160938.e35b4ca4.freebsd@edvax.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PGdy1yfmz43Cx X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=uchicago.edu (policy=none); spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu has no SPF policy when checking 128.135.20.70) smtp.mailfrom=galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.64 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[uchicago.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.86)[-0.863,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.990,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(0.12)[ip: (0.34), ipnet: 128.135.0.0/16(0.17), asn: 160(0.13), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[70.20.135.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:160, ipnet:128.135.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:10:47 -0000 On 2020-02-21 09:09, Polytropon wrote: > On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:14:09 +0100, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: >> This is exactly the reason why I have switched from nVidia to AMD >> RADEON and planning no return!! >> >> Because nVidia does not provide documentation nor support to >> Open-Source, only binary blobs, you start to think that their drivers >> are the best because "they just work"^TM. Nothing more misleading! >> >> nVidia seems to have no respect in the Open-Source community. Indeed, Timasz, and the don't deserve any respect, see my comment below. >> I was >> also astonished with that being their 20 years long loyal customer. >> >> When you look at the true Open-Source drivers, you will notice they >> are poor and you cannot really do anything more with nVidia than just >> display. There is fundamental reason for that. Nvidia does not disclose/publish sufficient information about their chipsets. Therefore, there is no decent way for open source programmers to write good driver (that will account for framebuffer layout and variety of other internal things). Hence, crappy open source drivers covering only generic functionality. To the contrary (in the past at least), ATI (bough out by AMD, and still continuing similar attitude under the hood of AMD as I observe) was publishing sufficient information about their cipsets. Hence, great open source drivers were always available for ATI video chips. And no matter how much the main Linux crowd was praising Nvidia, I always was a rebel praising my lifesaver: ATI (and disliking Nvidia to tell it in the mildest words). To mention one more thing about Nvidia, just in general, not related to anything here. Macbook Pro 15 inch by Apple at some point was coming with discrete Nvidia chip. There were was at least one model that had these Nvidia chips with the bug in silicon, which was discovered with release of next MacOS version. All those machines with bad Nvidia chips were stuck with older system, and Apple (there they deserved my extra respect!) started program to replace all these machines with bad Nvidia chip for free. But the program was stopped really quick, and my guess is: because Nvidia (the guilty party in my book) refused to carry their share of financial burden in replacing bad hardware. Right there Apple switched away from Nvidia, to ATI (AMD) video chips. For good, at least as I observe so far. > > Exactly my impression. While there are several (I think, 3) > open source nVidia drivers, all of them have problems. Some > just offer 3D graphics, others won't work in 64 bit OS mode, > and others just freeze when being loaded. The binary blob is > the only way to get proper 3D support. > > > >> Open-Source RADEON drivers in general are by some considered even >> better than binary blobs provided by AMD. > > Interesting. This seems to be a "ride back to the past" where > ATI (which was the typical brand name of the Radeon-type GPUs > at that time) was always superior to nVidia: 3D support out of > the box, with the standard drivers included with X. Then there > was a time where nVidia was considered better than ATI / AMD > (again, judging from the binary blob driver!), and today, AMD > using the open source drivers seems to be the way to go. > ATI was always the way to go for me. Valeri > > >> Here comes the development of DRM layer that is something brand new in >> FreeBSD that will support all new GPU in a truly Open-Source fashion >> (but hey where does that firmware comes from??). > > Don't ask the firmware question. Don't ask _any_ questions > going below the visibility level. ;-) > > > > > -- ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 16:30:43 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D06A723A43D for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:30:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: from mail-qv1-xf42.google.com (mail-qv1-xf42.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::f42]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PH4x42Z8z4kjV for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:30:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: by mail-qv1-xf42.google.com with SMTP id q9so1228693qvu.7 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:30:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=seibercom.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:reply-to :organization:face:mime-version; bh=G22OwxPc0zExdAyf8jPvUwj/9X3LxJvzhaHf/aHET54=; b=T4fzUpw3aNEcjwbf7GFR8uUvD8TugD/UQVQbesZGKZ/udNMEpENWXxuDf5wZQ4JBiq kA695Bl2N4Bmb5kjNGSOVUsHrLhmSRAff9mhv6MME8RUvb4fwuLRQBD0aezxzpxl5PwH 9w5DccycmHxY7N02BFC3Nl5uzdytW2EdzrX6c= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:reply-to:organization:face:mime-version; bh=G22OwxPc0zExdAyf8jPvUwj/9X3LxJvzhaHf/aHET54=; b=I4a90rivAM5WgpQ5Dwzv0ZbEhSFzdZC6MKLzKz7KCsrPFmxk32fLRbwiGO3JJd00C5 0EK/1aJha8Eln1CE5iaDhGbIR9fChCuIudNo3DrEwUnb9F1F8VF/2i4b1a9ZXGByUMWu akGl2a6dLk1WS9cNcUsWsnSrfIoDTGNjivSFpYMp56yz1UZ/PjwLnjv01mSGD4PuqQ/8 Jt3nvhrQG3Wzb4hU6QI1gjAyh17oEftyK7kN8kIfy16t6KFIHtnBCXRdb6qsbQBBTmMJ 7ssAyqy11qbq4yNDyrhpgUavPDnNoNq4YfIQtwVLBVMQRt2Si9mFbc2/wX4R9I9qszIr Ydrw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUwguB5DTC6x2lUZ7RJpTEx+dOWlQp9IDXYoe3Gsh8jVPYo7zCG 2fUGziVl6PeAIwAJrewhEb3mMNw8ZcE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyh1Y0z5OaJw1YXJZXJVLpNvBFjOIX6wWKnjMttVRlAOo0ajZirDCgBkSEWQrpWnZ+HlNMu0w== X-Received: by 2002:ad4:458e:: with SMTP id x14mr16777843qvu.96.1582302639985; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:30:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio.seibercom.net (cpe-174-109-225-250.nc.res.rr.com. [174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id m27sm1840997qta.21.2020.02.21.08.30.38 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:30:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48PH4s4mjMz1TbV for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 11:30:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 11:30:30 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200221113030.700642ac@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <20200221160938.e35b4ca4.freebsd@edvax.de> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221160938.e35b4ca4.freebsd@edvax.de> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; boundary="Sig_/SDnRydXyCKPrauRKjh3OBTC"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PH4x42Z8z4kjV X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=T4fzUpw3; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::f42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.32 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; IP_SCORE(-0.58)[ip: (0.71), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:30:43 -0000 --Sig_/SDnRydXyCKPrauRKjh3OBTC Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:09:38 +0100, Polytropon stated: >On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:14:09 +0100, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: >> This is exactly the reason why I have switched from nVidia to AMD >> RADEON and planning no return!! >>=20 >> Because nVidia does not provide documentation nor support to >> Open-Source, only binary blobs, you start to think that their drivers >> are the best because "they just work"^TM. Nothing more misleading! >>=20 >> nVidia seems to have no respect in the Open-Source community. I was >> also astonished with that being their 20 years long loyal customer. >>=20 >> When you look at the true Open-Source drivers, you will notice they >> are poor and you cannot really do anything more with nVidia than just >> display. =20 > >Exactly my impression. While there are several (I think, 3) >open source nVidia drivers, all of them have problems. Some >just offer 3D graphics, others won't work in 64 bit OS mode, >and others just freeze when being loaded. The binary blob is >the only way to get proper 3D support. > >> Open-Source RADEON drivers in general are by some considered even >> better than binary blobs provided by AMD. =20 > >Interesting. This seems to be a "ride back to the past" where >ATI (which was the typical brand name of the Radeon-type GPUs >at that time) was always superior to nVidia: 3D support out of >the box, with the standard drivers included with X. Then there >was a time where nVidia was considered better than ATI / AMD >(again, judging from the binary blob driver!), and today, AMD >using the open source drivers seems to be the way to go. > >> Here comes the development of DRM layer that is something brand new >> in FreeBSD that will support all new GPU in a truly Open-Source >> fashion (but hey where does that firmware comes from??). =20 > >Don't ask the firmware question. Don't ask _any_ questions >going below the visibility level. ;-) Interestingly enough, nVidia is the only card/driver combination that I have ever gotten good results with. Part of the problem might be that the version of the nVidia driver offered in the ports system is rarely current, For instance, right now the port version is nvidia-driver-440.31_1, while the latest version available for FreeBSD -x64 is version 440.59. The port version was released 11/04/2019. Plus, I wonder how many users actually download and use the utilities for nVidia that are available in the ports system. Also, I would be interested in what 'card' the end used is employing and supposedly not receiving optimal results. --=20 Jerry --Sig_/SDnRydXyCKPrauRKjh3OBTC Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEIQb/tTwl6I1ueEVtOHMGOIfexWQFAl5QBacACgkQOHMGOIfe xWTIAQf8Df8niV2748KGrwT4M5RCg3wTzIk/ld4KdS/0+g+b4by/zpq2bEiVhceB tnpo3B/wNnZ21W4W9hHiY/aFtiS3yDO9O3mgMExuJgZe/daJN710Hzhhx5fd519b OEIpTfvmAf43RNR3szDR8yj8MtyysVyb2y6H6RC9TxEf+a/2zY5koj+qyi07lNTY eFYgPEGrs75HEfBDqgJPqruysIMZ1LMCDFnuRcXv9hrK54iDKm7SDgER1toAo9+Z FvXsVCM0UkEMujI7WsS595LJZ22KYZGvceLlN8qZnQJDdPEk7oHFZ2P8f9Z7sfn1 vz2ArrWgmd/5PFp0oX4Bd3qTn9ekAA== =1YsM -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/SDnRydXyCKPrauRKjh3OBTC-- From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 16:31:35 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77E9A23A6E7 for ; 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Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:31:32 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Odhiambo Washington Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 19:30:57 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: SOGO-4.3 on FreeBSD 12.1 - SOLVED To: questions X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PH5y2lwKz4mRl X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=hCIdtNnc; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of odhiambo@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::232 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=odhiambo@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[questions@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-8.93), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2.3.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:31:35 -0000 On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 at 18:14, Odhiambo Washington wrote: > Hello, > > Has anyone been able to compile SOGo-4.3 on FreeBSD 12.1? Mine fails like > below: > > 1 warning generated. > clang WOResponse+SOGo.m -c \ > -MMD -MP -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\"root@waridi.kihingovillage.com > 202002211812\"" -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" > -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" > -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\" > root@waridi.kihingovillage.com 202002211812\"" > -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" > -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" > -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\" > root@waridi.kihingovillage.com 202002211812\"" > -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" > -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" > -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DGNUSTEP > -DGNUSTEP_BASE_LIBRARY=1 -DGNUSTEP_RUNTIME=1 -D_NONFRAGILE_ABI=1 > -DGNUSTEP_BASE_LIBRARY=1 -fno-strict-aliasing -fexceptions > -fobjc-exceptions -D_NATIVE_OBJC_EXCEPTIONS -pthread -fPIC -Wall -DGSWARN > -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall > -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import > -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -O2 -pipe -fstack-protector-strong > -fno-strict-aliasing -O2 -pipe -fstack-protector-strong > -fno-strict-aliasing -Wno-import -I/usr/local/include > -fobjc-runtime=gnustep-1.8 -fblocks -Wuninitialized -g > -frecord-gcc-switches -fconstant-string-class=NSConstantString > -I../../SOPE/ -I../../SOPE/ -I.. -I../../UI -I../../SOPE/ -I.. -I../../UI > -I./derived_src -I. -I/usr/ports/www/sogo4/work/GNUstep/Library/Headers > -I/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/Headers > -I/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Headers -I/usr/local/include \ > -o obj/SOGo.obj/WOResponse+SOGo.m.o > WORequest+SOGo.m:35:2: warning: this should be changed someday > [-W#warnings] > #warning this should be changed someday > ^ > 1 warning generated. > clang WOContext+SOGo.m -c \ > -MMD -MP -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\"root@waridi.kihingovillage.com > 202002211812\"" -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" > -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" > -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\" > root@waridi.kihingovillage.com 202002211812\"" > -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" > -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" > -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DSOGO_BUILD_DATE="@\" > root@waridi.kihingovillage.com 202002211812\"" > -DSOGO_LIBDIR="\"/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/SOGo\"" > -DSOGO_MAJOR_VERSION="@\"4\"" -DSOGO_MINOR_VERSION="@\"3\"" > -DSOGO_SUBMINOR_VERSION="@\"0\"" -DHAVE_OPENSSL=1 -DGNUSTEP > -DGNUSTEP_BASE_LIBRARY=1 -DGNUSTEP_RUNTIME=1 -D_NONFRAGILE_ABI=1 > -DGNUSTEP_BASE_LIBRARY=1 -fno-strict-aliasing -fexceptions > -fobjc-exceptions -D_NATIVE_OBJC_EXCEPTIONS -pthread -fPIC -Wall -DGSWARN > -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall > -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import > -Wall -DGSWARN -DGSDIAGNOSE -Wno-import -O2 -pipe -fstack-protector-strong > -fno-strict-aliasing -O2 -pipe -fstack-protector-strong > -fno-strict-aliasing -Wno-import -I/usr/local/include > -fobjc-runtime=gnustep-1.8 -fblocks -Wuninitialized -g > -frecord-gcc-switches -fconstant-string-class=NSConstantString > -I../../SOPE/ -I../../SOPE/ -I.. -I../../UI -I../../SOPE/ -I.. -I../../UI > -I./derived_src -I. -I/usr/ports/www/sogo4/work/GNUstep/Library/Headers > -I/usr/local/GNUstep/Local/Library/Headers > -I/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Headers -I/usr/local/include \ > -o obj/SOGo.obj/WOContext+SOGo.m.o > NSData+Crypto.m:314:21: error: use of undeclared identifier > 'MD4_DIGEST_LENGTH' > unsigned char md4[MD4_DIGEST_LENGTH]; > ^ > NSData+Crypto.m:315:18: error: use of undeclared identifier > 'MD4_DIGEST_LENGTH' > memset(md4, 0, MD4_DIGEST_LENGTH); > ^ > NSData+Crypto.m:323:3: warning: implicit declaration of function 'MD4' is > invalid in C99 [-Wimplicit-function-declaration] > MD4([self bytes], [self length], md4); > ^ > 1 warning and 2 errors generated. > gmake[6]: *** [/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Makefiles/rules.make:479: > obj/SOGo.obj/NSData+Crypto.m.o] Error 1 > gmake[6]: *** Waiting for unfinished jobs.... > gmake[5]: *** > [/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Makefiles/Instance/framework.make:612: > internal-framework-run-compile-submake] Error 2 > gmake[4]: *** > [/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Makefiles/Master/rules.make:297: > SOGo.all.framework.variables] Error 2 > gmake[4]: Leaving directory > '/usr/ports/www/sogo4/work/SOGo-4.3.0/SoObjects/SOGo' > gmake[3]: *** > [/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Makefiles/Master/serial-subdirectories.make:53: > internal-all] Error 2 > gmake[3]: Leaving directory > '/usr/ports/www/sogo4/work/SOGo-4.3.0/SoObjects' > gmake[2]: *** > [/usr/local/GNUstep/System/Library/Makefiles/Master/serial-subdirectories.make:53: > internal-all] Error 2 > gmake[2]: Leaving directory '/usr/ports/www/sogo4/work/SOGo-4.3.0' > ===> Compilation failed unexpectedly. > Try to set MAKE_JOBS_UNSAFE=yes and rebuild before reporting the failure to > the maintainer. > *** Error code 1 > > Stop. > make[1]: stopped in /usr/ports/www/sogo4 > *** Error code 1 > > Stop. > make: stopped in /usr/ports/www/sogo4 > Thanks to a list member who contacted me offlist, I managed to solve this by MD4=ON in security/openssl The problem started because I did "portupgrade -a", but apparently it's not always gonna go the way you think :-) -- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254 7 3200 0004/+254 7 2274 3223 "Oh, the cruft.", grep ^[^#] :-) From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 16:36:36 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C076923A99A for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:36:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from phascolarctos@protonmail.ch) Received: from mail-40131.protonmail.ch (mail-40131.protonmail.ch [185.70.40.131]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "protonmail.com", Issuer "SwissSign Server Gold CA 2014 - G22" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PHCm4XSfz3D4y for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:36:36 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from phascolarctos@protonmail.ch) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:36:28 +0000 To: "freebsd-questions@freebsd.org" From: Lorenzo Salvadore Reply-To: Lorenzo Salvadore Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20200221113030.700642ac@scorpio> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221160938.e35b4ca4.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200221113030.700642ac@scorpio> Feedback-ID: X6az_D2smWSR8MT5MHqXnWF0upxehDyHia7Id1cbayHNBUkRu3CIeusDsZHiivIIjmaKB1_OofpALrRUYjNz3w==:Ext:ProtonMail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.2 required=7.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,DKIM_VALID_EF,FREEMAIL_FROM shortcircuit=no autolearn=disabled version=3.4.4 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on mail.protonmail.ch X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PHCm4XSfz3D4y X-Spamd-Bar: ----- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:36:36 -0000 =E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90 Original Me= ssage =E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90 On Friday 21 February 2020 17:30, Jerry wrote: > On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:09:38 +0100, Polytropon stated: > > > On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:14:09 +0100, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > > > > This is exactly the reason why I have switched from nVidia to AMD > > > RADEON and planning no return!! > > > Because nVidia does not provide documentation nor support to > > > Open-Source, only binary blobs, you start to think that their drivers > > > are the best because "they just work"^TM. Nothing more misleading! > > > nVidia seems to have no respect in the Open-Source community. I was > > > also astonished with that being their 20 years long loyal customer. > > > When you look at the true Open-Source drivers, you will notice they > > > are poor and you cannot really do anything more with nVidia than just > > > display. > > > > Exactly my impression. While there are several (I think, 3) > > open source nVidia drivers, all of them have problems. Some > > just offer 3D graphics, others won't work in 64 bit OS mode, > > and others just freeze when being loaded. The binary blob is > > the only way to get proper 3D support. > > > > > Open-Source RADEON drivers in general are by some considered even > > > better than binary blobs provided by AMD. > > > > Interesting. This seems to be a "ride back to the past" where > > ATI (which was the typical brand name of the Radeon-type GPUs > > at that time) was always superior to nVidia: 3D support out of > > the box, with the standard drivers included with X. Then there > > was a time where nVidia was considered better than ATI / AMD > > (again, judging from the binary blob driver!), and today, AMD > > using the open source drivers seems to be the way to go. > > > > > Here comes the development of DRM layer that is something brand new > > > in FreeBSD that will support all new GPU in a truly Open-Source > > > fashion (but hey where does that firmware comes from??). > > > > Don't ask the firmware question. Don't ask any questions > > going below the visibility level. ;-) > > Interestingly enough, nVidia is the only card/driver combination that I > have ever gotten good results with. Part of the problem might be that > the version of the nVidia driver offered in the ports system is rarely > current, For instance, right now the port version is > nvidia-driver-440.31_1, while the latest version available for FreeBSD > -x64 is version 440.59. The port version was released 11/04/2019. Plus, > I wonder how many users actually download and use > the utilities for nVidia that are available in the ports system. Also, > I would be interested in what 'card' the end used is employing and > supposedly not receiving optimal results. If someone wants to test it we have a patch to update nvidia-driver to latest version: https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D242177 Lorenzo Salvadore From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 16:37:35 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AE0823AAC1 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:37:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: from mail-qk1-x72a.google.com (mail-qk1-x72a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::72a]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PHDs5wPLz3FW2 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:37:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: by mail-qk1-x72a.google.com with SMTP id t83so2376537qke.3 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:37:33 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=seibercom.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:reply-to :organization:face:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=RIK1poMqp5vtYYwZ2IJ+YqlfXHj3cNAkIj2gJWj/d+8=; b=Mt6V4bHV1L01+VxA2qulIKLGiRKbcdc3piWBJ+jO0bOfB8dS9M189w7yN02MH9mpVh UhAATldOUFUKyw8ntjnxyk+DWHvH9prVz1B92dYnIEinOxt8Xfl/SP7pZpl0Eq8us+EH Rc0s3AFb2xDfbd0NKJxARg3y1cdkBF7VyVMzE= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:reply-to:organization:face:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=RIK1poMqp5vtYYwZ2IJ+YqlfXHj3cNAkIj2gJWj/d+8=; b=Ez/+mjh7hKVDe5n0dGRUgHZ3+Q66J4gnDCfghGiLiNvGFfqTXVcwFggkhXUE71pk88 BCF4RL9gJrkVI1iMg8xzHFWJxcQZNSV2yrfi/3IYAtkVgnJFugR5Oo5JtVGHUgaHfk9g KDw3TCD6uCFeyNvdeuZxKzRm6BJPdBvXZZ8QsS8Y8z18Qglpyp72llYqTBdRatfweT9/ z3gpaN8l0tmMJlo+einLi6g2KA+Ypl9ODdr39u/kboG+QIwiB5+ia1V5myoWfo+MU2ow tXh9fU7oSIBqQ9HM7KSg6MqImesBwnEqh8Sg4VdEI3RB28V+QUAMj+yKBvmBmLTiTlPx zdqA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXq8THpgx4NIOwLbKMi0nqD680PM8TMKeStZsdInQZO1FtsX0Tx UZkgTQ7Oku4bMPsywNgaFNBQQYW5Am0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzguOU6eCMItN2tJkfiBUPnYl6I47MpsTWyASDgbM/Y5IOnQWSvx4ThiIoCQwgxpbt8QECt6w== X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:7eb:: with SMTP id k11mr33318798qkk.486.1582303052615; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:37:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio.seibercom.net (cpe-174-109-225-250.nc.res.rr.com. [174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c73sm1773118qkg.86.2020.02.21.08.37.32 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 08:37:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48PHDq1wSBz1TbY for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 11:37:31 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 11:37:30 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200221113730.7c5a3d3e@scorpio> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221160938.e35b4ca4.freebsd@edvax.de> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PHDs5wPLz3FW2 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=Mt6V4bHV; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::72a as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.43 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.57)[ip: (-9.23), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.89), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[a.2.7.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:37:35 -0000 On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:10:44 -0600, Valeri Galtsev stated: > >To mention one more thing about Nvidia, just in general, not related >to anything here. Macbook Pro 15 inch by Apple at some point was >coming with discrete Nvidia chip. There were was at least one model >that had these Nvidia chips with the bug in silicon, which was >discovered with release of next MacOS version. All those machines with >bad Nvidia chips were stuck with older system, and Apple (there they >deserved my extra respect!) started program to replace all these >machines with bad Nvidia chip for free. But the program was stopped >really quick, and my guess is: because Nvidia (the guilty party in my >book) refused to carry their share of financial burden in replacing >bad hardware. Right there Apple switched away from Nvidia, to ATI >(AMD) video chips. For good, at least as I observe so far. > Not totally accurate. You are misstating or distorting facts. https://www.cnet.com/news/nvidia-chip-settlement-lists-dell-hp-apple-laptops/ https://www.macobserver.com/tmo/article/Apple_to_Replace_Defective_MacBook_Pro_Video_Chips -- Jerry From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 17:06:02 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBC0023C497 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:06:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) Received: from mail.covisp.net (mail.covisp.net [65.121.55.42]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PHsh6zpHz4Yk5 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:06:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kremels@kreme.com) From: "@lbutlr" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: FreeBSD equivalent of LMD/Linux Malware Detect? Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:05:59 -0700 References: <7e2b46d9fd477722ae145abda20ce4e9@kazancci.com> To: FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <7e2b46d9fd477722ae145abda20ce4e9@kazancci.com> Message-Id: <1795D726-491A-475B-810E-067776D22B1F@kreme.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.60.0.2.5) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PHsh6zpHz4Yk5 X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kremels@kreme.com designates 65.121.55.42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kremels@kreme.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.16 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.39)[-0.387,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; MISSING_MIME_VERSION(2.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[kreme.com]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.98)[-0.981,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.07)[ip: (-0.24), ipnet: 65.112.0.0/12(-0.00), asn: 209(-0.04), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_ZERO(0.00)[0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[42.55.121.65.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:209, ipnet:65.112.0.0/12, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:06:02 -0000 On 21 Feb 2020, at 07:37, =C3=96zg=C3=BCr Kazancci = wrote: > It *somehow* works on FreeBSD 10/11, but not on 12 at all. How does it not work? It installs just fine under 12.1 and the scripts = execute. =EF=A3=BF root@mail ./install.sh ./install.sh: line 48: chattr: command not found Linux Malware Detect v1.6.4 (C) 2002-2019, R-fx Networks (C) 2019, Ryan MacDonald This program may be freely redistributed under the terms of the GNU GPL installation completed to /usr/local/maldetect config file: /usr/local/maldetect/conf.maldet exec file: /usr/local/maldetect/maldet exec link: /usr/local/sbin/maldet exec link: /usr/local/sbin/lmd cron.daily: /etc/cron.daily/maldet imported config options from /usr/local/maldetect.last/conf.maldet maldet(22068): {sigup} performing signature update check... maldet(22068): {sigup} could not determine signature version maldet(22068): {sigup} signature files missing or corrupted, forcing = update... maldet(22068): {sigup} new signature set 202002198018 available maldet(22068): {sigup} downloading = https://cdn.rfxn.com/downloads/maldet-sigpack.tgz maldet(22068): {sigup} downloading = https://cdn.rfxn.com/downloads/maldet-cleanv2.tgz maldet(22068): {sigup} verified md5sum of maldet-sigpack.tgz maldet(22068): {sigup} unpacked and installed maldet-sigpack.tgz maldet(22068): {sigup} verified md5sum of maldet-clean.tgz maldet(22068): {sigup} unpacked and installed maldet-clean.tgz maldet(22068): {sigup} signature set update completed maldet(22068): {sigup} 17027 signatures (14207 MD5 | 2035 HEX | 785 YARA = | 0 USER) =EF=A3=BF root@mail # /usr/local/maldetect/maldet Linux Malware Detect v1.6.4 (C) 2002-2019, R-fx Networks (C) 2019, Ryan MacDonald This program may be freely redistributed under the terms of the GNU GPL = v2 signature set: 202002198018 usage maldet [-h|--help] [-a|--scan-all PATH] [-r|--scan-recent PATH = DAYS] [-f|--file-list PATH] [-i|--include-regex] [-x|--exclude-regex] [-b|--background] [-m|--monitor] [-k|--kill-monitor] = [-c|--checkout] [-q|--quarantine] [-s|--restore] [-n|--clean] [-l|--log] = [-e|--report] [-u|--update-sigs] [-d|--update-ver] From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 17:09:35 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B777223C6F0 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:09:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ihor@antonovs.family) Received: from mail.antonovs.family (mail.antonovs.family [100.25.240.195]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PHxn5Rrqz4cg3 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:09:33 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ihor@antonovs.family) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTP id 214AB138B96; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:09:32 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail.antonovs.family ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.antonovs.family [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id y9o0yNIEWZ3k; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:09:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8761138B97; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:09:31 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 mail.antonovs.family A8761138B97 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=antonovs.family; s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77; t=1582304971; bh=i6fTgnm8tdhPHOPr4Odp/NiY3WCRdiZHRD7pT0rhwG4=; h=Date:From:To:Message-ID:MIME-Version; b=hX1T1PDv8fb3rPYB98tPDL5Yw0S8kWom6LTiI7iHHfDWbbpd0HhGM6h9agEoEm4ce 19mrdLENGVA5ZHPHQEDQv1TrQfzNizsFWzrjFmK1FumGm/Ye0IAegfK3MnRPn+yzWV PaBeqpsBkFe1aM5bQYI9rTcITqXFp2+pyEDy9JS5vtwNBx3bfVAKut1a4kJqkByXwX EX4MVJ0xeZWg/ldFp6NdZ8jF5H1u95JXb4pw261bJaaU5o42D7zoQHt37tGWBwfoVX jsfOdZEJFnFIZk+G3xztVLHBzI+TlRkGm1qGqK4N3SIQQPlyJHUgGdVs3mbbxFDlwK mQ0upFdeKlVMw== X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at antonovs.family Received: from mail.antonovs.family ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.antonovs.family [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id r4hXk0eQ9Dnt; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:09:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (c-73-83-210-79.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [73.83.210.79]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 52BCA138B96; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:09:31 +0000 (UTC) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 09:09:29 -0800 From: Ihor Antonov To: Tomasz CEDRO Cc: Steve O'Hara-Smith , FreeBSD Questions Mailing List Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200221170929.ih2dqgmgb5fa3i2k@sea-ll-10936> References: <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> <20200221074003.ac92947e587090803bd4d6da@sohara.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PHxn5Rrqz4cg3 X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=antonovs.family header.s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77 header.b=hX1T1PDv; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=antonovs.family; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ihor@antonovs.family designates 100.25.240.195 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ihor@antonovs.family X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.85 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[antonovs.family:s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-3.35)[ip: (-9.24), ipnet: 100.24.0.0/13(-4.46), asn: 14618(-3.00), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[antonovs.family:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[antonovs.family,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14618, ipnet:100.24.0.0/13, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:09:35 -0000 On 2020-02-21 09:51, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:40 AM Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: > > On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:08:23 +0100 > > Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > > > This is clearly something that is very missing in the Handbook / WIKI > > > / synaptics manpages! > > Perfect opportunity to submit a documentation patch. > > Indeed! :-) https://github.com/wulf7/iichid/issues/18 > > This IICHID is a total fresh thing (and still experimental)! It had > initial release just 9 days ago and I did not head about this project > before. So nice to talk with smart people, thank you! :-) > iichid looks very similar in purpose to libinput [1]. What are similarities/differences? I wonoder what is the motivation for the project? [1] https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/libinput/libinput > -- > CeDeROM, SQ7MHZ, http://www.tomek.cedro.info > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 18:23:09 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5480923E1B0 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 18:23:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: from mail-qk1-x733.google.com (mail-qk1-x733.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::733]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PKZg5HSgz3K6p for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 18:23:07 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: by mail-qk1-x733.google.com with SMTP id v2so2708485qkj.2 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:23:07 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=seibercom.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:reply-to :organization:face:mime-version; bh=8SxcdesVgeI/H6TZc/ZYwF70QzbaA9VzCwtVE2eK4Kw=; b=kBnk8mA4jzxCQJwBjJQb2hzdAf3vZExH04YsfIHPL7ozoo+XKxr4tDPoDu1jA+jVBa h8Jk9GsKDhH23IEK2WOYONlGDY619cC6je2sH5wrhOxdW4r8RpFPESpX9PxmvuKeHfCQ Fi6ruuAeEcDTS5A2cjhB1KaIf0z/twQSYKqvs= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:reply-to:organization:face:mime-version; bh=8SxcdesVgeI/H6TZc/ZYwF70QzbaA9VzCwtVE2eK4Kw=; b=e7VBCt7zi9F2UOOuq1MKOdEk8fOmvlfiKddgTlpZYmbMvTZ9QNVnMzbZLtmgzoPD+s lrMwy5+nEw+HgtqcmXhovFdmt6OwkxsvBO3l9mhIWZVd9UUGXQtBgY2eNYaVLS2NmK7E C8liI8tcKc59x34XaY0JcU0AFMruhSupN1y87RSp7wm2XuRvPt5RoXf9TDvGa/WU2zIq gGfCDa6EQqXeotBWiLDgriV5zBTPUQzZbOlXCzq240QcTSmnRa+0R7UJngbXgrXdw/CA ezectKu7y4UyuBSyVOrXur6m/XTeTdGeRLpSJ/4n5QK5apveFCc7gIBhbucWc4Vy5S4r B3tw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUp0KwEf59og7EIlLYhdljSiy/C5B77km5iHPZ21x8DQ7YY/sPv I9QcmuccrFt9eagWh43oZ8MTMlksU/w= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzUlQELn16tLTX/zEORlG8yx/HqhNldew6urOiwQyni/+kOzWkFHiA7iUnrZSsxq5A/hz89Eg== X-Received: by 2002:a37:4dc6:: with SMTP id a189mr34466186qkb.122.1582309386586; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:23:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio.seibercom.net (cpe-174-109-225-250.nc.res.rr.com. [174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 13sm1904054qkk.136.2020.02.21.10.23.05 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 10:23:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48PKZc4vjyz1Tgg; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 13:23:04 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 13:22:56 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200221132204.077bf8c0@scorpio> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221160938.e35b4ca4.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200221113030.700642ac@scorpio> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; boundary="Sig_/jT2=.82xDQoQ_glsLQh+u0N"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PKZg5HSgz3K6p X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=kBnk8mA4; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::733 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.65 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.55)[ip: (-9.15), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.88), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.3.7.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 18:23:09 -0000 --Sig_/jT2=.82xDQoQ_glsLQh+u0N Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:36:28 +0000, Lorenzo Salvadore via freebsd-questions stated: >If someone wants to test it we have a patch to update >nvidia-driver to latest version: >https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D242177 > >Lorenzo Salvadore I use poudriere to build my ports. I'll have to download the diff, patch the port and then build and test it. I am assuming (potential serious mistake) that you have actually tested this yourself. Has the port maintainer, "danfe@FreeBSD.org" shown any interest in the patch? --=20 Jerry --Sig_/jT2=.82xDQoQ_glsLQh+u0N Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEIQb/tTwl6I1ueEVtOHMGOIfexWQFAl5QIAAACgkQOHMGOIfe xWSaogf9EnTDHQT//070dQ2FnmUCi3A33Ztg30cGv8vLuORvsB7HPpWBP+/vatsL /ZdzNjq7C0aqvB6rwTcLLCtuxry+1vEaiR7pRE3AjRR6CNc78St1kv7mWfWkkSQR neOQnE+gvzXthvsOhPBtimZYpYJSojSk3LuRP6P4biW3hoHd7LBAwfN1YwsIK/MO gH1ubjSBGZFTFMaAnjbyEZoHYgSRQiI955kgBpYjv/jcY56Xx4PThoZx9uuW9Ja/ tDuPq+Ivhxa0i/1QKiIe3wXZ5jmCy3mTdcNO/JDHAfIImqcnjKqnPP0mG5MivO11 QWXSIyJylVMrldZoxG/PvUIiNLVK9g== =z71n -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/jT2=.82xDQoQ_glsLQh+u0N-- From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 18:38:49 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11B7E23E8CA for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 18:38:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from phascolarctos@protonmail.ch) Received: from mail1.protonmail.ch (mail1.protonmail.ch [185.70.40.18]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "protonmail.com", Issuer "SwissSign Server Gold CA 2014 - G22" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PKwm6q8xz4MDT for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 18:38:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from phascolarctos@protonmail.ch) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 18:38:44 +0000 To: "freebsd-questions@freebsd.org" From: Lorenzo Salvadore Cc: "danfe@FreeBSD.org" Reply-To: Lorenzo Salvadore Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20200221132204.077bf8c0@scorpio> References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221160938.e35b4ca4.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200221113030.700642ac@scorpio> <20200221132204.077bf8c0@scorpio> Feedback-ID: X6az_D2smWSR8MT5MHqXnWF0upxehDyHia7Id1cbayHNBUkRu3CIeusDsZHiivIIjmaKB1_OofpALrRUYjNz3w==:Ext:ProtonMail MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.2 required=7.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,DKIM_VALID_EF,FREEMAIL_FROM shortcircuit=no autolearn=disabled version=3.4.4 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on mail.protonmail.ch X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PKwm6q8xz4MDT X-Spamd-Bar: ----- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 18:38:49 -0000 =E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90 Original Me= ssage =E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90 On Friday 21 February 2020 19:22, Jerry wrote: > On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:36:28 +0000, Lorenzo Salvadore via > freebsd-questions stated: > > > If someone wants to test it we have a patch to update > > nvidia-driver to latest version: > > https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D242177 > > Lorenzo Salvadore > > I use poudriere to build my ports. I'll have to download the diff, > patch the port and then build and test it. I am assuming (potential > serious mistake) that you have actually tested this yourself. Has the > port maintainer, "danfe@FreeBSD.org" shown any interest in the patch? I could only verify that the port builds and installs successfully, but I d= o not have an nvidia card. I only know what is in the bug report, so I guess danfe@ could not look at it yet. I CC him in this mail, maybe he is busy, he lost track of this bug = and this mail could help. Otherwise, sooner or later, we will declare maintainer timeout and deal wit= h the PR. Still, if someone with a nvidia card could confirm that the patch works it = would be great. Lorenzo Salvadore From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 21:19:01 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 220662437F5 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:19:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from mailout.easydns.com (mailout.easydns.com [64.68.202.10]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PPTb3Vtxz4QPQ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:18:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A03CC4446; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:18:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mailout.easydns.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (emo12-pco.easydns.vpn [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GvkRgG7XQVp6; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:18:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: from hedeland.org (81-228-157-209-no289.tbcn.telia.com [81.228.157.209]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3D656C08CA; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:18:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pluto.hedeland.org (pluto.hedeland.org [10.1.1.5]) by tellus.hedeland.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id 01LLIqDY040776 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 22:18:52 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Valeri Galtsev References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <53C308C2-3537-45B5-A1A4-7945DA603852@kicp.uchicago.edu> Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, Ed Maste From: Per Hedeland Message-ID: Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 22:18:52 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <53C308C2-3537-45B5-A1A4-7945DA603852@kicp.uchicago.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PPTb3Vtxz4QPQ X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of per@hedeland.org has no SPF policy when checking 64.68.202.10) smtp.mailfrom=per@hedeland.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.53 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[209.157.228.81.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[hedeland.org]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.71)[0.707,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.56)[0.557,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[10.202.68.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16686, ipnet:64.68.200.0/22, country:CA]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.46)[ip: (0.57), ipnet: 64.68.200.0/22(0.11), asn: 16686(1.72), country: CA(-0.09)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:19:01 -0000 On 2020-02-21 15:12, Valeri Galtsev wrote: > > > On February 21, 2020 8:07:57 AM CST, Ed Maste wrote: >> On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 at 15:29, Per Hedeland wrote: >>> >>> On 2020-02-20 19:50, Ed Maste wrote: >>>> >>>> Modern laptops need an I2C touchpad driver, which isn't in the base >>>> system yet. It's now available in the ports collection and can be >>>> built standalone fairly easily; it works fine on my Lenovo X1 >> Carbon >>>> 7th generation. >>> >>> I'd be very interested in that - can you provide a more specific >>> pointer than "in the ports collection"?:-) >> >> It's sysutils/iichid, added quite recently >> https://www.freshports.org/sysutils/iichid/ >> >> I hope it is added to the base system soon; > > Not to the base system, please. Could you elaborate on that? I.e. do you not want the FreeBSD kernel to support modern hardware, or do you not want the FreeBSD kernel to support hardware that is only relevant for laptops/desktops, or...? Having kernel modules in ports is problematic, I don't think anyone can disagree about that (but of course I may be wrong). There may be reasons to do it anyway, here it seems that it's due to code that needs more testing/experience and perhaps improvement before adding it to the base system / standard kernel - seems eminently reasonable to me. --Per From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 21:21:10 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 948F6243961 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:21:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from kicp.uchicago.edu (kicp.uchicago.edu [128.135.20.70]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48PPX50LZYz4Vmr; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:21:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu) Received: from point.uchicago.edu (point.uchicago.edu [128.135.52.6]) (Authenticated sender: galtsev) by kicp.uchicago.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 697D44E689; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:21:08 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Per Hedeland Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org, Ed Maste References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <53C308C2-3537-45B5-A1A4-7945DA603852@kicp.uchicago.edu> From: Valeri Galtsev Message-ID: <061d7c2a-102c-795f-5258-c56d30f6bcaf@kicp.uchicago.edu> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:21:08 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PPX50LZYz4Vmr X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=fail reason="No valid SPF, No valid DKIM" header.from=uchicago.edu (policy=none); spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu has no SPF policy when checking 128.135.20.70) smtp.mailfrom=galtsev@kicp.uchicago.edu X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.60 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[uchicago.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.83)[-0.834,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.986,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(0.12)[ip: (0.34), ipnet: 128.135.0.0/16(0.17), asn: 160(0.13), country: US(-0.05)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[70.20.135.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:160, ipnet:128.135.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:21:10 -0000 On 2020-02-21 15:18, Per Hedeland wrote: > On 2020-02-21 15:12, Valeri Galtsev wrote: >> >> >> On February 21, 2020 8:07:57 AM CST, Ed Maste wrote: >>> On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 at 15:29, Per Hedeland wrote: >>>> >>>> On 2020-02-20 19:50, Ed Maste wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Modern laptops need an I2C touchpad driver, which isn't in the base >>>>> system yet. It's now available in the ports collection and can be >>>>> built standalone fairly easily; it works fine on my Lenovo X1 >>> Carbon >>>>> 7th generation. >>>> >>>> I'd be very interested in that - can you provide a more specific >>>> pointer than "in the ports collection"?:-) >>> >>> It's sysutils/iichid, added quite recently >>> https://www.freshports.org/sysutils/iichid/ >>> >>> I hope it is added to the base system soon; >> >> Not to the base system, please. > > Could you elaborate on that? I.e. do you not want the FreeBSD kernel > to support modern hardware, or do you not want the FreeBSD kernel to > support hardware that is only relevant for laptops/desktops, or...? > > Having kernel modules in ports is problematic, I don't think anyone > can disagree about that (but of course I may be wrong). There may be > reasons to do it anyway, here it seems that it's due to code that > needs more testing/experience and perhaps improvement before adding it > to the base system / standard kernel - seems eminently reasonable to > me. You are right and I am wrong. I stand corrected. Valeri > > --Per > -- ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 21:28:14 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0361243C42 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:28:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from mailout.easydns.com (mailout.easydns.com [64.68.202.10]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PPhF2Cd7z3HYc for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:28:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21555C44E2 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:28:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mailout.easydns.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (emo12-pco.easydns.vpn [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Wva9jHoLyohR for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:28:11 +0000 (UTC) Received: from hedeland.org (81-228-157-209-no289.tbcn.telia.com [81.228.157.209]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D976AC43BF for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:28:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pluto.hedeland.org (pluto.hedeland.org [10.1.1.5]) by tellus.hedeland.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id 01LLS8Dt040809 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 22:28:09 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> <20200221074003.ac92947e587090803bd4d6da@sohara.org> <20200221170929.ih2dqgmgb5fa3i2k@sea-ll-10936> From: Per Hedeland Message-ID: <6ab5505c-27e5-53e1-cc5b-9061684ccb9e@hedeland.org> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 22:28:08 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200221170929.ih2dqgmgb5fa3i2k@sea-ll-10936> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PPhF2Cd7z3HYc X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of per@hedeland.org has no SPF policy when checking 64.68.202.10) smtp.mailfrom=per@hedeland.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.33 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[209.157.228.81.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.42)[-0.421,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.49)[0.492,0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[hedeland.org]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[10.202.68.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16686, ipnet:64.68.200.0/22, country:CA]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.46)[ip: (0.57), ipnet: 64.68.200.0/22(0.11), asn: 16686(1.72), country: CA(-0.09)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:28:14 -0000 On 2020-02-21 18:09, Ihor Antonov wrote: > On 2020-02-21 09:51, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: >> On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:40 AM Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: >>> On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:08:23 +0100 >>> Tomasz CEDRO wrote: >>>> This is clearly something that is very missing in the Handbook / WIKI >>>> / synaptics manpages! >>> Perfect opportunity to submit a documentation patch. >> >> Indeed! :-) https://github.com/wulf7/iichid/issues/18 >> >> This IICHID is a total fresh thing (and still experimental)! It had >> initial release just 9 days ago and I did not head about this project >> before. So nice to talk with smart people, thank you! :-) >> > > iichid looks very similar in purpose to libinput [1]. What are > similarities/differences? I wonoder what is the motivation for the > project? Well, my limited understanding (I haven't looked at the code for either iichid or libinput) is that this module gives libinput something to use for a certain class of hardware - it's not an *alternative*. How could libinput use hardware that isn't supported by the OS kernel? If you read my writeup earlier in the thread, I needed both this driver and x11-drivers/xf86-input-libinput to get my touchpad to work. --Per From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 21:47:55 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2E6124448D for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:47:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from mailout.easydns.com (mailout.easydns.com [64.68.202.10]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PQ6z3407z4THR; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:47:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83291A372F; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:47:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mailout.easydns.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (emo13-pco.easydns.vpn [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ablMQ3yZBxpE; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:47:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: from hedeland.org (81-228-157-209-no289.tbcn.telia.com [81.228.157.209]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mailout.easydns.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3576EA372D; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:47:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pluto.hedeland.org (pluto.hedeland.org [10.1.1.5]) by tellus.hedeland.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id 01LLlm2D040860 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 22:47:48 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: Ed Maste Cc: Tomasz CEDRO , FreeBSD Questions References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> From: Per Hedeland Message-ID: <5f72ee24-c807-e0f4-d776-e3f5a0116c61@hedeland.org> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 22:47:48 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PQ6z3407z4THR X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.998,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; REPLY(-4.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 21:47:56 -0000 On 2020-02-21 15:11, Ed Maste wrote: > On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 at 19:52, Per Hedeland wrote: >> >> It has a kind of strange behavior though, might be a feature:-) - >> if I move the cursor and let go of the touchpad without first stopping >> the motion, the cursor continues to move on its own... > > This might be part of the reason it's still experimental :) > > I'm not sure where the developers working on this are collecting > feedback / bug reports but I'll make note of this thread to them. Thanks - this thread is very long and a partially depressing read though, perhaps I should have posted my findings to e.g. x11@ instead. Anyway, I added https://github.com/wulf7/iichid/issues/20 for my problem. --Per From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Fri Feb 21 23:42:39 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA423247272 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 23:42:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gldisater@gmail.com) Received: from mail-qk1-x72e.google.com (mail-qk1-x72e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::72e]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PSgL2Xk4z3D87 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 23:42:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from gldisater@gmail.com) Received: by mail-qk1-x72e.google.com with SMTP id d11so3503447qko.8 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:42:38 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=sE9ANSUY4IUo08mjdWpmz7GRZ02VkfP7qlf3weXMUTA=; b=e3NF8aPCwhUNJZcX/6s8A3+JtSx50eCyaYW805RyYhpiJjgv2nMOcxikjPm8NmvkC7 wS97CCqq5KHtd+gyCXE/4LByBO8oaqGk4Po5q3D+4SDP2rdkZ71f7votdX6n0z96gM6G 0rnHM4g3lEiTC3we09AZxtdKjDhClWFAbia/GJV9GKrOqbXSL1K7W6nqm1g1aQ75fG1z MUTyb891xFkrHdS9nuknfEfPc1NPJsj76tc0rjL/4guHaORs4m5GrsZPBpz80MA+BG3G d7xZVfs21zx9nP1nHt3dbn1MYARbSKLqfYS+ssCsHkaQsyT8dMK24hRVS+XKaumoy5Ef fchw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language :content-transfer-encoding; bh=sE9ANSUY4IUo08mjdWpmz7GRZ02VkfP7qlf3weXMUTA=; b=dFCC65QzyWKZA0ZLvb+lUA/gkExch16xNJRxaBnE5MVjbjoTJXpUF+ESex9MSYQvdg ipDXme4pz5fV1Jtfpnkw07ZsWhOrboUBXv10aPYoLqi2WzXcTnq7qNthKkyf6C+GsiBQ YuXBpZoonXQSjFe+I0tHZv4Z0OE6L5u1VDx8gUZRiG3bZIm3NPb33adUndA2P6TnWeB6 FKMbYYUA6mKt+TCncAfS/iBskcEd2Y40K4fRma+8gBQ8SsYScgjkMLAVcG4DJXFrzSSP kd0uskjkmtEsSqr4bWGXPKeO53o7UpFdQSXFW2nRuyYovhAttUY3ZNw2hNbhDetjUpab S+hg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXlLumfiePTpcAV4SmwpUEC6bLMjpKgdHUzPUrhvDDhWVTimvX/ SQMp+wTB/wiOZGV2QEpqJt4bqTQh X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqysdcBICfR2CglBw3MzrgJhT98v2ZP/jzgJbJ+FO0qGBG9bfUROq9rJGCjzG6VbwuJcVg3QCA== X-Received: by 2002:a37:444f:: with SMTP id r76mr1049469qka.237.1582328556721; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:42:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.148] (dhcp-198-2-91-142.cable.user.start.ca. [198.2.91.142]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id t187sm2274393qke.85.2020.02.21.15.42.35 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 21 Feb 2020 15:42:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <85E7C97E-EF8B-4FC7-8EF1-758B7BCBAE90@kreme.com> <20200218183010.5a52441f.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200218205940.04917783.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200219052643.7bd90d3c@scorpio> <20200219130628.457f8953@scorpio> From: Jeremy Faulkner Message-ID: Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 18:42:34 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200219130628.457f8953@scorpio> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PSgL2Xk4z3D87 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=e3NF8aPC; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of gldisater@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::72e as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=gldisater@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.00 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36:c]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[ip: (-9.13), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.88), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; IP_SCORE_FREEMAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[e.2.7.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 23:42:40 -0000 On 2020-02-19 1:06 p.m., Jerry wrote: > On Wed, 19 Feb 2020 11:31:18 -0500, Ed Maste stated: >> That's an unfortunate issue, but it's very hard to make progress >> without getting an affected machine to an appropriate developer. > > Personally, Ed, I think your suggestion is absurd. > > Now, I find that FBSD 12.x will not even install and run on my PC. This > cannot be because the technology is too new. 11.x runs just fine. This > is obviously a problem with the programming. I have been told by you > and others that they need a machine to work on to discover the problem. > Seriously, that is BS. It worked before; they broke it when updating. > If it had never worked, I might have considered donating a piece of > equipment to assist them, but this is obviously not that sort of > problem. > An option other than getting an affected machine to a developer is for you to bisect the commits between the branch of 12-CURRENT and release of 12.0-RELEASE until you find the exact commit that broke the existing support. Then a developer would know where to start. -- Jeremy Faulkner From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sat Feb 22 01:17:17 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DD50249ADC for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 01:17:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=pfHb=4K=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info) Received: from mail.sermon-archive.info (sermon-archive.info [71.177.216.148]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48PVmX3bTBz46mc for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 01:17:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=pfHb=4K=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info) Received: from [10.0.1.251] (mini [10.0.1.251]) by mail.sermon-archive.info (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48PVmV4LDjz2fjRv; Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:17:14 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) Subject: Re: Ethernet Driver From: Doug Hardie In-Reply-To: <20200221115819.GA5590@SVROLP00901> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2020 17:17:14 -0800 Cc: FreeBSD Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <6181B1C2-D46F-493F-9AAB-394DC9D45ADA@mail.sermon-archive.info> <20200221115819.GA5590@SVROLP00901> To: Rares Aioanei X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.101.4 at mail X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PVmX3bTBz46mc X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of SRS0=pfHb=4K=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info designates 71.177.216.148 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=SRS0=pfHb=4K=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.35 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.91)[-0.910,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:71.177.216.148]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-0.05)[asn: 5650(-0.20), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.993,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[148.216.177.71.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[bc979@lafn.org,SRS0=pfHb=4K=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[gmail.com]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:5650, ipnet:71.177.216.0/23, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[bc979@lafn.org,SRS0=pfHb=4K=mail.sermon-archive.info=doug@sermon-archive.info]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2020 01:17:17 -0000 > On 21 February 2020, at 03:58, Rares Aioanei = wrote: >=20 > On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 03:34:04AM -0800, Doug Hardie wrote: >> I just plugged in an Insignia USB to ethernet adapter into FreeBSD = 12.1. ifconfig shows it as ue0. I find no information on a ue driver = in the code or man pages. Yet it appears to work. I can assign it an = address and it tries to send on that link (there is only a switch at the = other end). >>=20 >> ifconfig is the only thing that shows it. pciconf and usbconfig do = not seem to show it. >>=20 >> -- Doug >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list >> https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions >> To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" >=20 > So does it actually work? As in, can you use ping with it, or wget, = etc.? I finally setup a test network. Ping works fine. I had ping running in = both directions and 0.0% packet loss. sftp worked fine. -- Doug From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sat Feb 22 11:19:19 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5863238E8F for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 11:19:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: from mail-qt1-x844.google.com (mail-qt1-x844.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::844]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Pm7B6MBSz3N6R for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 11:19:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: by mail-qt1-x844.google.com with SMTP id v25so3246818qto.7 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 03:19:18 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=seibercom.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:reply-to :organization:face:mime-version; bh=84qRpkKgVI8QCgGy57MLyh5Sqx6QzzmzDoGCzIA38D4=; b=N1QoFEIgRTzg5BhJq2ilXogN9vw6hguADLACgkgOwJLAepoOn/hFoK2QIHhzqKVn2s dLxyru4hJeYdGbyqsbAKrrJhNuFoeZacPtDqK2/j+jbHX72PXciAUXZCguVEedfBViJ/ QdlWjHqO0icuqIXT91rcR+1e4qUkpWcKB1l9c= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:reply-to:organization:face:mime-version; bh=84qRpkKgVI8QCgGy57MLyh5Sqx6QzzmzDoGCzIA38D4=; b=fS38jyHQHBGlV//CT0/WZeY031MMTebHPzYEM8xmqS/CXpK4rSNND12aP2n0Kpvarg injr/25pJMmXcERAtHaayfXljvdHEE8ix+/cDoxJDbg9w6tkipGqk9Bk4ADh07f2jcjw srXNFHXvF3uhossWzUukaFsWPYWZnpOoEyTTptXAY7//2UpJVUO2c5GwDY8lAGvOOPae KUrpmpJ32SBSTv6YR+99YlVZBQ93XF2wtD0eBKeUw9lg8vWsDndPovo8IRBZJrtuhGA/ Cywis9BcRG9tPdxEVM/aNonx4+Tqn+o+C8twhF6bLkr8nqsQKQ4riz8ZPAr65OFQYM3j TVEg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVIvN72dHtZixWL8fVL3zBC3ZygqFbNARXugSdP8es1de95h7UY NZ1wJGcr6LwPjNR3Z38vyGNktnnm6Uo= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyoFzOXBdQEgN5cDaa/tG9vZPNxpkMIazI4n/75qOvJHyTYUvrxI4Wt92AuSEF/J6X5a5g1Nw== X-Received: by 2002:ac8:3602:: with SMTP id m2mr35625793qtb.356.1582370357997; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 03:19:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio.seibercom.net (cpe-174-109-225-250.nc.res.rr.com. [174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id h6sm3064050qtr.33.2020.02.22.03.19.16 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 22 Feb 2020 03:19:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48Pm78081Yz1V8B; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 06:19:16 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2020 06:19:08 -0500 From: Jerry To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Cc: danfe@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200222061908.25b6ea13@scorpio> In-Reply-To: References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221160938.e35b4ca4.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200221113030.700642ac@scorpio> <20200221132204.077bf8c0@scorpio> Reply-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAADAAAAAwBAMAAAClLOS0AAAAD1BMVEXHx8eCek7////4+fjWs03LZvEkAAAB+UlEQVQ4jY2UC5LbIAyGhfEB0JoDULgAAR8ANrr/mfpL2Em2087UExyiT+hNKJfesVrGB99ri0UvkAtW73+CnBPZs90AL0U5V5N7FXcsuvQBfIFYt3bGQFNQaMaWdVsu0Jd8Hy5+J/G6h5BWRDlJFOLj5OiziWh5SCwcHYd9MnvzQmapxglJFBFmlqC2zLmTCLkKOeprtAWciOlOFcoUFvEALScXI9Gc0ezsItEXRJVXSrlUyMMVU84L2JMADiitXx9gV98tcUs0EG675QWZcPz+xUd1+ygfQGNin+I4Q5APcIqFS1F2IYClXSkh7/NZKSBb4bGcI/XgEL+MTo5kRtSYlhyV1UqhhS5ECbTCPSF7EE4MbSTvomkqqFGGg+3J2nW83JcB9EK+gu/nII/WuYq+GHBwvYWGpmtFs2uPOBQU1JMqB3WM9hK3Mp8KEu2TKNh4IDCPlEu+wPAhbBcY7qouaumcR/gakYbMqxbUCwUZNL21BDkeq3XUs+mJnSB5uu0CeYHdbGEaub06SFalGjDoCTnmF6haV9oe6AVrzhfo/bFAJ23TZcgGrqqtuT3Uya2/JtHiPyrOHT8AjpANqczL0H0/eg0WmTxf+vet7YT5jiF/gt6vy1Zuz8VEdF//91Pet/bfoN8zrsPeF3j/yXT1+pc/mf8FvwFLRp5BkxdhkQAAAABJRU5ErkJggg== MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; boundary="Sig_/Cndy_4IbKyIKIyI78w7UKIL"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Pm7B6MBSz3N6R X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=N1QoFEIg; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::844 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.59 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; IP_SCORE(-0.31)[ip: (2.05), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.88), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; REPLYTO_EQ_TO_ADDR(5.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[4.4.8.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2020 11:19:19 -0000 --Sig_/Cndy_4IbKyIKIyI78w7UKIL Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 18:38:44 +0000, Lorenzo Salvadore via freebsd-questions stated: >=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90 Original M= essage =E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90 >On Friday 21 February 2020 19:22, Jerry wrote: > >> On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 16:36:28 +0000, Lorenzo Salvadore via >> freebsd-questions stated: >> =20 >> > If someone wants to test it we have a patch to update >> > nvidia-driver to latest version: >> > https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D242177 >> > Lorenzo Salvadore =20 >> >> I use poudriere to build my ports. I'll have to download the diff, >> patch the port and then build and test it. I am assuming (potential >> serious mistake) that you have actually tested this yourself. Has the >> port maintainer, "danfe@FreeBSD.org" shown any interest in the >> patch? =20 > >I could only verify that the port builds and installs successfully, >but I do not have an nvidia card. >I only know what is in the bug report, so I guess danfe@ could not >look at it yet. I CC him in this mail, maybe he is busy, he lost track >of this bug and this mail could help. >Otherwise, sooner or later, we will declare maintainer timeout and >deal with the PR. Still, if someone with a nvidia card could confirm >that the patch works it would be great. > >Lorenzo Salvadore I just read Alex S comment on the patch . I am willing to give it a try once everyone agrees that the patch is sound. I am running FreeBSD 11.3-RELEASE-p6 64bit, mainly because the 12.x version of FBSD will not run on this machine. --=20 Jerry --Sig_/Cndy_4IbKyIKIyI78w7UKIL Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEIQb/tTwl6I1ueEVtOHMGOIfexWQFAl5RDiwACgkQOHMGOIfe xWSGXggAvx5a/8MDdQToKCtB+0RQVaFr7bwa4Us8uhogdiWX75b4X+tGDzQKyozN RQu6tasyF7wG3ncfhNSecQC+TA9flrqdbTc0S/2UJemwiaUk1saSI7aoYqQMlL8J hELM6dpP2lXqnmJqH3tW91BVc2+/WYMYuPlQlqdVcUPfS/scZDIUQw8hr3EptYim 6ykp/1Rln5VVqKiD8EFgJcZ08HgC6sKGRe14nqqM4rUo/cC6xCy0adspO5ldWyu2 WEJRnBgAdLz6Nyw5pv6xeAiUY7PAcYhUnPKHpD4l3aUMIDR+nesej7oq0k6H8D+H 6g+kedku5iWQiF4jIMHkPeg/jxzN4w== =3kK2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/Cndy_4IbKyIKIyI78w7UKIL-- From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sat Feb 22 13:22:09 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD06A23D658 for ; 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Sat, 22 Feb 2020 14:21:54 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from per@hedeland.org) Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org References: <20200217231452.717FA1E820@freefall.freebsd.org> <20200220154101.GA53326@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> <5f72ee24-c807-e0f4-d776-e3f5a0116c61@hedeland.org> From: Per Hedeland Message-ID: <82b81b58-5e46-b23b-4a65-f8b6a218e70c@hedeland.org> Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2020 14:21:54 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.3.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <5f72ee24-c807-e0f4-d776-e3f5a0116c61@hedeland.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Pprw2wgNz4Pns X-Spamd-Bar: + Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of per@hedeland.org has no SPF policy when checking 64.68.202.10) smtp.mailfrom=per@hedeland.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [1.19 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[209.157.228.81.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.64)[-0.637,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.57)[0.567,0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[hedeland.org]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[10.202.68.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:16686, ipnet:64.68.200.0/22, country:CA]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.46)[ip: (0.55), ipnet: 64.68.200.0/22(0.11), asn: 16686(1.72), country: CA(-0.09)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2020 13:22:09 -0000 On 2020-02-21 22:47, Per Hedeland wrote: > On 2020-02-21 15:11, Ed Maste wrote: >> On Thu, 20 Feb 2020 at 19:52, Per Hedeland wrote: >>> >>> It has a kind of strange behavior though, might be a feature:-) - >>> if I move the cursor and let go of the touchpad without first stopping >>> the motion, the cursor continues to move on its own... >> >> This might be part of the reason it's still experimental :) >> >> I'm not sure where the developers working on this are collecting >> feedback / bug reports but I'll make note of this thread to them. > > Thanks - this thread is very long and a partially depressing read > though, perhaps I should have posted my findings to e.g. x11@ instead. > Anyway, I added https://github.com/wulf7/iichid/issues/20 for my > problem. JFYI, this was resolved by upgrading to a recent 12.1-STABLE kernel (r358121) as recommended by "wulf7" in the issue thread - ultra-fast response there! --Per From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sat Feb 22 15:17:17 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDF3B240E27 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:17:17 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ihor@antonovs.family) Received: from mail.antonovs.family (mail.antonovs.family [100.25.240.195]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48PsPm6fZ3z3Jnj for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:17:16 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ihor@antonovs.family) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B860138B96; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:17:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail.antonovs.family ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.antonovs.family [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id WmcYcLSJM5sr; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:17:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CA45138B97; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:17:09 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 mail.antonovs.family 9CA45138B97 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=antonovs.family; s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77; t=1582384629; bh=So5j67HjVd2IfoERUo4HaodlmH32v2+zkoibSvLeNjs=; h=Date:From:To:Message-ID:MIME-Version; b=gAGcG8ieAiNDer7CfG9CkeCmAchFgH03ZeNzVWaD8Ap46JO/R7XyqBP/LCwyrioTA zACHL1QuCJscfX3rBy3hjky6sP0TUs17w+yG/AHld8XhO4CyLtLBZoeOupYFX3UKH7 LSrYu270TN59AnEvick3LnYdj4TPiiTosoeg06fk1RktplRFOlqR3Jq6II4SfuAgIK n8JhAKhT0g0Hy85AihHwcYOSr3Aoo0vYrnxOuM7rZcWZOLi3kzcYcUa8II7TpCQcYQ ybx4pxbMff/BViPtNwyXPNXMgjZCMqqugtsP2hqedJA1CosGt6NM1sPtjHL8Kyyu8d xvo5nQWsj654g== X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at antonovs.family Received: from mail.antonovs.family ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.antonovs.family [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id HUgOiueteotf; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:17:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from localhost (c-73-83-210-79.hsd1.wa.comcast.net [73.83.210.79]) by mail.antonovs.family (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 354E4138B96; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:17:09 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2020 07:17:06 -0800 From: Ihor Antonov To: Per Hedeland Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200222151706.4urojtjcjtaqsezs@sea-ll-10936> References: <1d1cb3e8-ee64-41a7-ac5c-919d3985bd57@malikania.fr> <5d661e60-c767-d03f-4882-75d4a7010924@hedeland.org> <20200221074003.ac92947e587090803bd4d6da@sohara.org> <20200221170929.ih2dqgmgb5fa3i2k@sea-ll-10936> <6ab5505c-27e5-53e1-cc5b-9061684ccb9e@hedeland.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <6ab5505c-27e5-53e1-cc5b-9061684ccb9e@hedeland.org> X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PsPm6fZ3z3Jnj X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=antonovs.family header.s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77 header.b=gAGcG8ie; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=antonovs.family; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ihor@antonovs.family designates 100.25.240.195 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ihor@antonovs.family X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.85 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[antonovs.family:s=D65AA412-CB7F-11E9-A561-802C9D403B77]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-3.35)[ip: (-9.24), ipnet: 100.24.0.0/13(-4.46), asn: 14618(-3.00), country: US(-0.05)]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[antonovs.family:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[antonovs.family,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:14618, ipnet:100.24.0.0/13, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[79.210.83.73.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:17:18 -0000 On 2020-02-21 22:28, Per Hedeland wrote: > On 2020-02-21 18:09, Ihor Antonov wrote: > > On 2020-02-21 09:51, Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > >> On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 8:40 AM Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: > >>> On Fri, 21 Feb 2020 06:08:23 +0100 > >>> Tomasz CEDRO wrote: > >>>> This is clearly something that is very missing in the Handbook / WIKI > >>>> / synaptics manpages! > >>> Perfect opportunity to submit a documentation patch. > >> > >> Indeed! :-) https://github.com/wulf7/iichid/issues/18 > >> > >> This IICHID is a total fresh thing (and still experimental)! It had > >> initial release just 9 days ago and I did not head about this project > >> before. So nice to talk with smart people, thank you! :-) > >> > > > > iichid looks very similar in purpose to libinput [1]. What are > > similarities/differences? I wonoder what is the motivation for the > > project? > > Well, my limited understanding (I haven't looked at the code for > either iichid or libinput) is that this module gives libinput > something to use for a certain class of hardware - it's not an > *alternative*. How could libinput use hardware that isn't supported by > the OS kernel? If you read my writeup earlier in the thread, I needed > both this driver and x11-drivers/xf86-input-libinput to get my > touchpad to work. Thanks for the clarification! > --Per > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-questions-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sat Feb 22 15:45:47 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26B57241873 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:45:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: from mail-qk1-x741.google.com (mail-qk1-x741.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::741]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48Pt2d5c5wz4rtP for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:45:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jerry@seibercom.net) Received: by mail-qk1-x741.google.com with SMTP id c188so4833225qkg.4 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 07:45:45 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=seibercom.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references:organization :face:mime-version; bh=1kJ/o2cvL9hIpnYhwYg3Er2KlSqKEYsku+JU5FTe+zw=; b=T/NGl3X+GbNgYe+oFMjMq5sDP64F/K4n3kcc4KpKXtMTKEggXUJXVLzW/cmZEh6LcV H0DyFv+wuxR+MT0e/5yQwEWwAxBYsEdlhw3o0TF49phFEephK3l+KxXMXs0FUFLwzNyX GePIbAwxzexWHlFOmuYewrGz1D0rLOTKwF4rI= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:subject:message-id:in-reply-to :references:organization:face:mime-version; bh=1kJ/o2cvL9hIpnYhwYg3Er2KlSqKEYsku+JU5FTe+zw=; b=VjRgVU6L55ObhtiU45ZYtqwLDIZmudFVFnCaUKuzT+17BajEnvD97X2fspPQf1MLpR 14L6XDIavnq7xmmN+/KRgUp+NeZXFp8OJvV0EDJEFowH1P1HTkZTW9/+aAIBEu2Cb8lA Y4mAHiZzhc7TSwIZO3m1s0wGzwr1OLFNiFIyAjl/2yauZzIP0D6kvWcPIdcO5yJidD+I dzoUHx5FWDhmxy9s4ER3XbmmBdgQLfBFOd8MAvOGGEguJqdbj/kR3l80lkXNgJQANPMI PdbCW263Yq+ecyN9fcS6UtIF9ENp0hQ5LBUeaGzR1CwD/qG+5UB1vsYbW9JM2ppVcZpx aGYw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVrwv8Nf7Vp469tdR5I4FSZ7gyOooM7SeEKxo2QGSFEUW3sZoRL zENJv485DETL0tU9W6UcJjeG8DApDgw= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqy8J5O57G/wwsJyE5o8huuhM0faoRLDEEWjYudhDw/CsgxxQfXXon1+ey18hHJPgknMmt4LfA== X-Received: by 2002:a37:e507:: with SMTP id e7mr23398044qkg.358.1582386344424; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 07:45:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio.seibercom.net (cpe-174-109-225-250.nc.res.rr.com. [174.109.225.250]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id z21sm3269399qka.122.2020.02.22.07.45.42 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 22 Feb 2020 07:45:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from scorpio (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jerry@seibercom.net) by scorpio.seibercom.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 48Pt2Y5P3cz1Vcl; Sat, 22 Feb 2020 10:45:41 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2020 10:45:35 -0500 From: Jerry To: Alexey Dokuchaev , freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [FreeBSD-Announce] FreeBSD 12.0 end-of-life Message-ID: <20200222104535.270a1129@scorpio> In-Reply-To: <20200222144716.GA18576@FreeBSD.org> References: <20200221010421.GA54290@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221055139.GA969@ghostyhead.chthonixia.net> <20200221160938.e35b4ca4.freebsd@edvax.de> <20200221113030.700642ac@scorpio> <20200221132204.077bf8c0@scorpio> <20200222061908.25b6ea13@scorpio> <20200222144716.GA18576@FreeBSD.org> Organization: seibercom.net X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.4 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd11.3) Face: 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 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; boundary="Sig_/wk_mR9K14QUFuB7uNW65n5z"; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48Pt2d5c5wz4rtP X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=seibercom.net header.s=google header.b=T/NGl3X+; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jerry@seibercom.net designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::741 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jerry@seibercom.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.50 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[seibercom.net:s=google]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[seibercom.net]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[seibercom.net:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[1.4.7.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+,2:~]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.40)[ip: (1.60), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-1.88), asn: 15169(-1.67), country: US(-0.05)]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[250.225.109.174.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.10] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:45:47 -0000 --Sig_/wk_mR9K14QUFuB7uNW65n5z Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, 22 Feb 2020 14:47:16 +0000, Alexey Dokuchaev stated: >On Sat, Feb 22, 2020 at 06:19:08AM -0500, Jerry wrote: >> ... >> I am willing to give it a try once everyone agrees that the patch is >> sound. I am running FreeBSD 11.3-RELEASE-p6 64bit, mainly because the >> 12.x version of FBSD will not run on this machine. =20 > >If this is a regression (as it sounds), then it should be investigated >and fixed. Could you file a PR and describe the problem in detail >(that is, how exactly FreeBSD does "not run on this machine")? > >./danfe That was done awhile ago. https://bugs.freebsd.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=3D237666 --=20 Jerry --Sig_/wk_mR9K14QUFuB7uNW65n5z Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEIQb/tTwl6I1ueEVtOHMGOIfexWQFAl5RTJ8ACgkQOHMGOIfe xWQjmgf9EY0S5Uc8Q6YpsLqN5+XSMAC1wLpRdmXqwcyZCYN565pT54j76X+Cn6Zh gZ/PsrHhFwYXwW79Nnn89veG9/vLp57bkteRUGpN2fFshdx0zt8gwDmq/UEaHgMQ IKvruL+OkUFy7E68w4IXKRX3ds76+sqClY27lLYdeRfJCppWdl3yAOwxS7RRrs8/ u9gDvnvUVTC6S2MsudiBl7g/BPNd2XiOZOglYUrfr1EzUBkiT2mT8/lr9BpoD62p 8yobCMTFVUM1tP6vgPEEtd5Y48DggIgZCQGsNI20uOrPJWyJDGqaZuBTLuJblCuJ uv7hx6ZLFZMmao1VHaDVXIHqAZMEOA== =eWwZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_/wk_mR9K14QUFuB7uNW65n5z-- From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Sat Feb 22 15:59:53 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15FF02427DD for ; 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Sat, 22 Feb 2020 10:59:49 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2020 15:59:20 +0000 From: tech-lists To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: console warnings in messages Message-ID: <20200222155920.GA87156@bastion.zyxst.net> Mail-Followup-To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="qDbXVdCdHGoSgWSk" Content-Disposition: inline X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 48PtLv4MwJz46pf X-Spamd-Bar: -------- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=zyxst.net header.s=fm1 header.b=JCw7gr8l; dkim=pass header.d=messagingengine.com header.s=fm2 header.b=MaLTqeX2; dmarc=none; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of tech-lists@zyxst.net designates 66.111.4.25 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=tech-lists@zyxst.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-8.19 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[zyxst.net:s=fm1,messagingengine.com:s=fm2]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; 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charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, system: 12.1-stable r357613 I get these warnings in /var/log/messages when starting a virtual console terminal (by this I mean logging in): Feb 22 15:48:34 [REDACTED] console-kit-daemon[1392]: WARNING: Error waiting= for native console 1 activation: Inappropriate ioctl for device = =20 Feb 22 15:48:34 [REDACTED] console-kit-daemon[1392]: WARNING: Error waiting= for native console 2 activation: Inappropriate ioctl for device How can I fix this? thanks, --=20 J. --qDbXVdCdHGoSgWSk Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCAAdFiEE8n3tWhxW11Ccvv9/s8o7QhFzNAUFAl5RT+sACgkQs8o7QhFz NAU0nRAApXGUYjEwLO+mQwtDMIu6QQTBR2S42kl9qrvAe34lVAJeMB2YGa/08dOA Mbm+X7b7VAlYeZBYGiAa5oiE5VnyDLf8yRWI7q3MByxz8sy8DC6ooFxcIWkrFQhD 5E5S1RUNqdsFojuSQq/qc2VuQ0IDjmeroHab3Ap6giLCou5TL873kb5ZqeDtfIog 4tMru5FOsdK1LQeRxxKgwDpifNSMxSY4qkNUAimbX3Ef1D7EiS58jYIQ9z2ebQsW 0cikZ2x5nUurjnxj6yJ41YzrF5Yh904ToyBoINJ57kljbgpfzeiUiTGutxQgfEN7 0qK89Sdg4H7GMlXUwmzIrERIr3NUNkkafDeILmz4WQZhxN1OoVQ4WI8vbiS6SeXB 4TGQwTtyMCtswVc8vaUbZ7J6iY5vDtNYXjRSEOoYo8HYXT3dw/c5lE2BQzteXfJK +yu61nOQm/OOpWIZWuhiPOXIT4IbXXpSu8PaGyRdPjJ3guPRo9GMkEfIS80503Ks QvdBY9VYsHObh7ZmyKLtOhKqKppLS9rxjeiqWsfCiBs1KJUrdMXeOl71PVLqBJay o74ICQNgv1WQy8APt11y2Jx2LGHw9dXPtM41IS/X/xXCuu0eapdzmv5ga4RT+Jpp f+Ov7NRktY4q6niWZ4G0M648AKIRQkmgiec9onXMj5MIhfCIhhk= =Zm8b -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --qDbXVdCdHGoSgWSk--