From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 03:01:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id DAA22111 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 03:01:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA22086 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 03:00:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id VAA26451; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 21:55:59 +1100 Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 21:55:59 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199602041055.VAA26451@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, j@uriah.heep.sax.de Subject: Re: And the winner is! Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> The sed command and `auto' do the same fixups for the incomplete label >> on /dev/rsdX. >What about the chances to make it also work for sliced disks? No chance, since if disklabel works for sliced unlabeled disks then `auto' will go away :-). Perhaps it should work for unlabelled BSD slices (those with partition type 0xA5). Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 03:45:41 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id DAA25258 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 03:45:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA25250 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 03:45:29 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id GAA10931; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 06:47:10 -0500 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199602041147.GAA10931@hda.com> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: scrappy@ki.net (Marc G. Fournier) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 06:47:09 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Marc G. Fournier" at Feb 3, 96 11:55:01 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > Hi... > > I'm attempting to install a new Connor drive onto a -current > system, and after four attempts using a boot disk (was trying to make > it a "root" system disk), I think its time to ask for help. > > The system is only a 386DX40 w/8Meg of RAM, as I'm using a spare > system to do the installation, so that the system its going into doesn't > have too much downtime. > > I'm using an Adaptec 1542CF controller, and the drive is, as shown > below, a Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F. > > When booted from floppy, and trying to install that way, I get > errors as follows on VTY2: > > sd0(aha0:0:0): NOT READY asc:4,0 > sd0(aha0:0:0): Logical unit not ready, cause not reportable field replaceable > unit: 15 Maybe it was never properly formatted? I'd do this - Hook it up to a running system; Run the "scsiformat" script on it; See if you can label it and do raw I/O to it. If you can't get this far let us know what happens. (...) > If I run 'disklabel sd0', I get the "allocation failed" errors that > you see below...can someone explain that error? My current is not too current. I don't see that message - maybe it is coming from the devfs code? Hackers: when we do kernel printfs we should give some sort of identity string that narrows it down to a corner of the kernel. -- Peter Dufault Real-Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 04:21:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA27783 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 04:21:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA27768 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 04:21:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id NAA27024 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:21:23 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id NAA08153 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:21:22 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id MAA00617 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 12:39:09 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602041139.MAA00617@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: And the winner is! To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 12:39:09 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602041055.VAA26451@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Feb 4, 96 09:55:59 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Bruce Evans wrote: (disklabel auto) > >What about the chances to make it also work for sliced disks? > > No chance, since if disklabel works for sliced unlabeled disks then > `auto' will go away :-). Perhaps it should work for unlabelled BSD > slices (those with partition type 0xA5). Yes, that's what it would be interesting for. I don't intend to ``disklabel auto'' a Linux slice. ;-) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 04:23:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA27851 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 04:23:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA27844 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 04:23:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id NAA27076 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:23:09 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id NAA08250 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:23:08 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id NAA00800 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:02:05 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602041202.NAA00800@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:02:04 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from "Marc G. Fournier" at Feb 3, 96 11:55:01 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Marc G. Fournier wrote: > > When booted from floppy, and trying to install that way, I get > errors as follows on VTY2: > > sd0(aha0:0:0): NOT READY asc:4,0 > sd0(aha0:0:0): Logical unit not ready, cause not reportable field replaceable > unit: 15 > > Now, this might be what should be my first clue, in that the drive > is bad? It can also be bad cabling, termination problem, ambiguous term power supplied to the SCSI bus, or a weak power connector that causes the drive to become NOT READY. (I've all of this alredy seen myself. :) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 06:10:41 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA04313 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 06:10:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA04304 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 06:10:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id PAA18920 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:10:53 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602041410.PAA18920@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: FAT filesystem performance To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:10:53 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Some time ago there was a discussion on the performance of FAT filesystems. I think the conclusion was that it is not intrinsically slow, it is just a problem of non optimal implementations which tend not to keep the FAT in memory, and perhaps use synchronous writes. Additionally, performance might probably benefit by an allocation policy which privileges contiguity and locality for the blocks belonging to the same file. We use FAT filesystems both in the kernel, and in mtools. For the latter, I thought there was a quick fix to the problem of caching the FAT: just mmap the device, and the kernel will do caching for you. Well, it does not look that simple, as the vast majority of raw devices does not support mmap. I am wondering: how hard would it be to add mmap() to, say, wd.c ? Would it have other useful applications ? Thanks Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 06:45:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA05761 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 06:45:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from hauki.clinet.fi (root@hauki.clinet.fi [194.100.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA05742 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 06:44:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from newzetor.clinet.fi (root@newzetor.clinet.fi [194.100.0.11]) by hauki.clinet.fi (8.7.3/8.6.4) with ESMTP id QAA19099; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:44:16 +0200 (EET) Received: (hsu@localhost) by newzetor.clinet.fi (8.7.3/8.6.4) id QAA22995; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:44:16 +0200 (EET) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:44:16 +0200 (EET) Message-Id: <199602041444.QAA22995@newzetor.clinet.fi> From: Heikki Suonsivu To: Warner Losh Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Warner Losh's message of 2 Feb 1996 20:38:22 +0200 Subject: Re: Another Pentium gcc patch, -D__FreeBSD__=2 -Dbsd4_4 Organization: Clinet Ltd, Espoo, Finland References: <199602021439.HAA24937@rover.village.org> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In article <199602021439.HAA24937@rover.village.org> Warner Losh writes: If you want bsd4_4, then you can just as easily include: #ifdef HAVE_SYS_PARAMS #include #endif #ifdef BSD4_4 #define bsd4_4 #endif since params.h is the *STANDARD* bsd way of figuring out if you are ^^^ running on a BSD system. ^^^ This is a chicken-before-egg problem. To utilize this, you first need a *STANDARD* way of determining if you are running on a BSD system. To date, I have never needed __FreeBSD__ as a define. The BSD Because you only use BSD systems. Even though it might become as a surprise to you, there are other widely-used Unix-originating operating systems which are not BSD, and they do not have "BSD" or anything like that in param.h. Don't tell me use configure, its medicating cancer with painkillers. Apparenltly configure won't go away, but at least we should do everything possible to make its work as simple as possible. All this is completely broken, BSD systems should converge, not further split up, as splitting up means disappearing into noise generated by Linux and big commercial ones. -- Heikki Suonsivu, T{ysikuu 10 C 83/02210 Espoo/FINLAND, hsu@clinet.fi work +358-0-4375209 fax -4555276 home -8031121 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 06:52:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA06037 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 06:52:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from hauki.clinet.fi (root@hauki.clinet.fi [194.100.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA05939 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 06:50:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from newzetor.clinet.fi (root@newzetor.clinet.fi [194.100.0.11]) by hauki.clinet.fi (8.7.3/8.6.4) with ESMTP id QAA19257; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:48:43 +0200 (EET) Received: (hsu@localhost) by newzetor.clinet.fi (8.7.3/8.6.4) id QAA23064; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:48:44 +0200 (EET) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:48:44 +0200 (EET) Message-Id: <199602041448.QAA23064@newzetor.clinet.fi> From: Heikki Suonsivu To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: J Wunsch's message of 2 Feb 1996 23:43:36 +0200 Subject: Re: Watchdog timers Organization: Clinet Ltd, Espoo, Finland References: <199602021020.LAA04930@uriah.heep.sax.de> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In article <199602021020.LAA04930@uriah.heep.sax.de> J Wunsch writes: Idea stolen from Linux: create a /dev/watchdog for this purpose. Once it is held open by a process, the kernel resets the CPU if it doesn't get a response on a device after a certain time. The idea behind this is that most of the hanging systems have still a running async portion of the kernel, i.e. things like interrupt handling continue to work, but the process context switching hangs for some reason (e.g. SCSI bus hangs etc.). The chances are good that the kernel could still kill itself. Metoo, would save a lot of trouble for us. We try to use FreeBSD on big servers, and it seems hopeless, the more load the more it locks up (daily for the most loaded server)! -- Heikki Suonsivu, T{ysikuu 10 C 83/02210 Espoo/FINLAND, hsu@clinet.fi work +358-0-4375209 fax -4555276 home -8031121 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 07:13:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA07259 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 07:13:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA07250 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 07:13:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from venus.mcs.com (root@Venus.mcs.com [192.160.127.92]) by kitten.mcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA26058 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:13:11 -0600 Received: by venus.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Sun, 4 Feb 96 09:12 CST Message-Id: Subject: Hmmm. what happened to STABLE? To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:12:49 -0600 (CST) From: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I just supped a current -STABLE tree, and lookee what a kernel build does: cc -O -W -Wreturn-type -Wcomment -Wredundant-decls -Wimplicit -nostdinc -I. -I. ./.. -I../../sys -I../../../include -DMCS_ELP -DI586_CPU -DI486_CPU -DI386_CPU - DUCONSOLE -DBOUNCE_BUFFERS -DSCSI_DELAY=15 -DCOMPAT_43 -DPROCFS -DCD9660 -DMSDOS FS -DNFS -DFFS -DINET -DMATH_EMULATE -DSYSVMSG -DSYSVSEM -DSYSVSHM -DKMAPENTRIES =1000 -DNKMEMCLUSTERS=2048 -DNMBCLUSTERS=2048 -DIPFORWARDSRCRT=0 -DIPFORWARDING= 0 -DMAXMEM=131072 -DKKEEPALIVE -DMAXSYSGID=200 -DMAXSYSUID=200 -DGR_INET=600 -DM CSNET -DKERNEL -Di386 -DLOAD_ADDRESS=0xF0100000 -c vers.c loading kernel aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_match_dev' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_add_iospace' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_add_intr' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_registerdev' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_reg_start' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_reg_iospace' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_reg_end' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_reg_end' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_reg_intr' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_reg_end' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_reg_end' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_enable_intr' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_release_intr' referenced from text segment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_generic_externalize' referenced from data seg ment aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_kdc_eisa0' referenced from data segment ioconf.o: Undefined symbol `_btintr' referenced from data segment ioconf.o: Undefined symbol `_ahcdriver' referenced from data segment ioconf.o: Undefined symbol `_ahbdriver' referenced from data segment ioconf.o: Undefined symbol `_ahbintr' referenced from data segment *** Error code 1 Stop. You have mail in /var/mail/karl make depend was run, and I cleared the entire /usr/src/sys tree before SUPPing the sources. Is something missing here? -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | 21 Chicagoland POPs, ISDN, 28.8, much more Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net/ ISDN - Get it here TODAY! | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 07:36:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA10248 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 07:36:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA10213 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 07:36:26 -0800 (PST) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id CAA02747; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:32:57 +1100 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:32:57 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199602041532.CAA02747@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: curt@emergent.com, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com Subject: Re: Watchdog timers (was: Re: Multi-Port Async Cards) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >I have yet to see any software-only mechanism (such as Sun's Online >DiskSuite) keep pace with a PrestoServe. I would like very much to see a >software-only mechanism that could. My 1991 version of Minix beats it easily. Yes, it uses async metadata writes. Don't complain. Minix 1.6.25++ - 486DX/33 - 8MB RAM (slow IDE drive, fresh 137MB fs) (2MB buffer cache) 10000 files in 17 seconds - first run 18.00 real 1.36 user 15.43 sys (time /tmp/prog) 3.00 real 0.00 user 0.80 sys (time sync) 10000 files in 11 seconds - second run 11.00 real 1.48 user 9.25 sys (time /tmp/prog) 0.00 real 0.00 user 0.03 sys (time sync) >ODS manages about 60% of the throughput allowed by a PrestoServe, by my >not-very-fair-or-impartial-just-off-the-top-of-my-head benchmarks. Looking >back a half a year, we had the following benchmarks... >Slowaris 5.4 - SS10/30 - 64MB RAM (SCSI II, Barracuda drive) >10000 files in 249 seconds - first run >10000 files in 13 !!! seconds - second run >Slowaris 5.4 - SS10/30 - 64MB RAM - PrestoServe (SCSI II, Barracuda drive) >10000 files in 76 seconds - first run >10000 files in 12 seconds - second run >... >To be fair let's re-examine those benchmarks of a half year ago on a >FreeBSD-2.1.0R system... >FreeBSD 2.1.0R - ASUS P54XE4??? Intel P100 + NCR810 + 96MB (SCSI II, Barracuda drive) >10000 files in 540 seconds - first run >10000 files in 98 seconds - second run, improvement! >Okay, let's mount -o async and repeat.. >10000 files in 257 seconds - first run >10000 files in 97 seconds - second run >Wellll. Interpretation: even with -o async we're as slow as molasses I thought -current would be much better with -o async. However: FreeBSD-current - 486DX2/66 - 16MB RAM (BT445C Quantum Grand Prix drive, 1/3 full 1G fs) (too-small buffer cache (nbuf = 247) + vm buffers that I don't understand) 10000 files in 468 seconds - first run 467.76 real 0.87 user 17.19 sys (time /tmp/prog) 0.33 real 0.01 user 0.03 sys (time sync) 10000 files in 295 seconds - second run 295.34 real 0.87 user 12.86 sys (time /tmp/prog) 0.33 real 0.02 user 0.02 sys (time sync) >compared to at least one other contemporary OS. And -o async doesn't buy us >anything apparent for the second run, as opposed to a sync mount... now of >course my benchmarks may still unintentionally be a FreeBSD worst-case, so >I'll invert the ordering so that it is more "system friendly": >... I don't think I have the benchmark with the inverted order. Under Minix, the 10000 inodes and directory entries occupy about (64 + 16) * 10000 = 800000 bytes = about 800 1K buffers. The disk isn't touched for the rerun. Under FreeBSD, the cache(s) thrash despite the system having twice as much RAM. time find . >/dev/null # second run Minix: 3.00 real 0.71 user 2.58 sys FreeBSD: 18.80 real 0.54 user 1.33 sys time du >/dev/null # second run Minix: 8.00 real 0.88 user 7.20 sys FreeBSD: 42.25 real 0.78 user 4.89 sys No async metadata updates are involved here. Access timestamps are delayed until the next sync for both fs's. FreeBSD is slower because it has to physically reread all the metadata. time rm -r *; time sync Minix: 23.00 real 1.51 user 17.81 sys 3.00 real 0.00 user 0.60 sys FreeBSD: 38.39 real 1.08 user 13.03 sys 0.86 real 0.00 user 0.03 sys Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 08:27:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA13636 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 08:27:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA13627 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 08:26:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA14717; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:25:20 -0700 Message-Id: <199602041625.JAA14717@rover.village.org> To: Heikki Suonsivu Subject: Re: Another Pentium gcc patch, -D__FreeBSD__=2 -Dbsd4_4 Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of Sun, 04 Feb 1996 16:44:16 +0200 Date: Sun, 04 Feb 1996 09:25:20 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk : This is a chicken-before-egg problem. To utilize this, you first need a : *STANDARD* way of determining if you are running on a BSD system. That's why you use autoconfig. BTW, sys/param.h exists on almost all UNIX systems. : To date, I have never needed __FreeBSD__ as a define. The BSD : : Because you only use BSD systems. Even though it might become as a : surprise to you, there are other widely-used Unix-originating operating : systems which are not BSD, and they do not have "BSD" or anything like that : in param.h. Don't tell me use configure, its medicating cancer with : painkillers. Apparenltly configure won't go away, but at least we should : do everything possible to make its work as simple as possible. Bullshit. In my past job I ported OI to about 20 different unix systems and Windows NT. I never needed it. And I never used configure. *ALL* the unix systems that I used had sys/param.h on them. : All this is completely broken, BSD systems should converge, not further : split up, as splitting up means disappearing into noise generated by Linux : and big commercial ones. FreeBSD can't do it alone. Not can we do it w/o the cooperation of all the BSD systems out there. Cope. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 09:15:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA15369 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:15:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from news1.gtn.com (news1.gtn.com [192.109.159.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA15363 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:15:19 -0800 (PST) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news1.gtn.com (8.7.2/8.7.2) id SAA23109; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 18:00:14 +0100 (MET) Received: from knobel.gun.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by knobel.gun.de (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA05169; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:53:54 +0100 (MET) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:53:54 +0100 (MET) From: Andreas Klemm To: Warner Losh cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Another Pentium gcc patch, -D__FreeBSD__=2 -Dbsd4_4 In-Reply-To: <199602032042.NAA12992@rover.village.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 3 Feb 1996, Warner Losh wrote: > : Ok, maybe one should remove __386BSD__ and not include bsd4_4.... > : but add -D__FreeBSD__=2 > : > : Would that be okay ? May I say that officially to the pgcc > : developers ?! > > That would make it consistant with the GCC as shipped by FSF and as > shipped by FreeBSD in 2.0R (and 2.1R). I think that to be a good > thing. Ok, I told the pgcc developers so. andreas@knobel.gun.de /\/\___ Wiechers & Partner Datentechnik GmbH Andreas Klemm ___/\/\/ - Support Unix - aklemm@wup.de - \/ ftp://sunsite.unc.edu/pub/Linux/system/Printing/aps-491.tgz apsfilter - magic print filter 4lpd >>> knobel is powered by FreeBSD <<< From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 09:39:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA16603 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:39:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA16596 Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:39:25 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602041739.JAA16596@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Hmmm. what happened to STABLE? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 04 Feb 1996 09:12:49 CST." Date: Sun, 04 Feb 1996 09:39:24 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >I just supped a current -STABLE tree, and lookee what a kernel build does: > ... >*** Error code 1 > >Stop. >You have mail in /var/mail/karl The eisaconf stuff has been in there for days.... Did you run config on your kernel config file after supping? Do you have the "controller eisa0" in your kernel config file. Did you look in the LINT config file to see how the ahb controller is supposed to be specified now that it is registered as an EISA device? Inquiring minds want to know... :) >make depend was run, and I cleared the entire /usr/src/sys tree before >SUPPing the sources. > >Is something missing here? > >-- >-- >Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity >Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available >Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | 21 Chicagoland POPs, ISDN, 28.8, much more >Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net >/ >ISDN - Get it here TODAY! | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 09:43:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA17050 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:43:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA17042 Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:43:33 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602041743.JAA17042@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Bruce Evans cc: curt@emergent.com, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Watchdog timers (was: Re: Multi-Port Async Cards) In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 02:32:57 +1100." <199602041532.CAA02747@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Date: Sun, 04 Feb 1996 09:43:33 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >I thought -current would be much better with -o async. However: > >FreeBSD-current - 486DX2/66 - 16MB RAM (BT445C Quantum Grand Prix drive, >1/3 full 1G fs) >(too-small buffer cache (nbuf = 247) + vm buffers that I don't understand) > >10000 files in 468 seconds - first run > 467.76 real 0.87 user 17.19 sys (time /tmp/prog) > 0.33 real 0.01 user 0.03 sys (time sync) >10000 files in 295 seconds - second run > 295.34 real 0.87 user 12.86 sys (time /tmp/prog) > 0.33 real 0.02 user 0.02 sys (time sync) Yes, but this is not exactly fair. Your SCSI controller only has 5 times the command overhead as your IDE card (because you have a very poor SCSI controller). I'd like to see the performance difference on the same hardware. >Bruce -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 09:52:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA17454 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:52:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA17444 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:52:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from venus.mcs.com (root@Venus.mcs.com [192.160.127.92]) by kitten.mcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA29586; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 11:52:00 -0600 Received: by venus.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Sun, 4 Feb 96 11:51 CST Message-Id: Subject: Re: Hmmm. what happened to STABLE? To: gibbs@freefall.freebsd.org (Justin T. Gibbs) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 11:51:37 -0600 (CST) From: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602041739.JAA16596@freefall.freebsd.org> from "Justin T. Gibbs" at Feb 4, 96 09:39:24 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >I just supped a current -STABLE tree, and lookee what a kernel build does: > > > > ... > > >*** Error code 1 > > > >Stop. > >You have mail in /var/mail/karl > > The eisaconf stuff has been in there for days.... Did you run config on > your kernel config file after supping? Yes. > Do you have the "controller eisa0" > in your kernel config file. Aha. I will check; I don't think that had to be there before, right? > Did you look in the LINT config file to see > how the ahb controller is supposed to be specified now that it is > registered as an EISA device? Inquiring minds want to know... :) I'll check into this stuff... Thanks! -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | 21 Chicagoland POPs, ISDN, 28.8, much more Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net/ ISDN - Get it here TODAY! | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 10:52:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA22480 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 10:52:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA22459 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 10:52:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id TAA06305 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:52:23 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA01665 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:52:23 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id TAA01613 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:22:14 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602041822.TAA01613@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:22:13 +0100 (MET) In-Reply-To: <199602041410.PAA18920@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 4, 96 03:10:53 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Luigi Rizzo wrote: > I am wondering: how hard would it be to add mmap() to, say, wd.c ? > Would it have other useful applications ? This would only shift the problem from the msdosfs code into the various device drivers. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 10:52:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA22484 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 10:52:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA22462 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 10:52:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id TAA06313; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:52:26 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA01668; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:52:25 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id TAA01645; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:24:30 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602041824.TAA01645@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Hmmm. what happened to STABLE? To: karl@mcs.com (Karl Denninger MCSNet) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:24:29 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" at Feb 4, 96 09:12:49 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Karl Denninger, MCSNet wrote: > > > I just supped a current -STABLE tree, and lookee what a kernel build does: > aha1742.o: Undefined symbol `_eisa_match_dev' referenced from text segment [more undefs] > Is something missing here? Yup. Add this to your config file: controller eisa0 -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 10:53:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA22597 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 10:53:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA22586 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 10:53:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id TAA06288; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:52:16 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id TAA01656; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:52:15 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id TAA01498; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:09:01 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602041809.TAA01498@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:09:01 +0100 (MET) Cc: scrappy@ki.net In-Reply-To: <199602041147.GAA10931@hda.com> from "Peter Dufault" at Feb 4, 96 06:47:09 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Peter Dufault wrote: > > > sd0(aha0:0:0): NOT READY asc:4,0 > > sd0(aha0:0:0): Logical unit not ready, cause not reportable field replaceable > > unit: 15 > > Maybe it was never properly formatted? My experience was that this condition results in a ``Medium format incomplete'' error. For all cases i've seen by now, ``Logical unit not ready'' meant the drive wasn't spinning (or not at full speed). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 10:56:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA22865 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 10:56:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from asgard.bga.com (asgard.bga.com [198.3.117.20]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA22849 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 10:55:58 -0800 (PST) Received: (from faulkner@localhost) by asgard.bga.com (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA07227; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 12:54:52 -0600 (CST) From: Boyd Faulkner Message-Id: <199602041854.MAA07227@asgard.bga.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 12:54:52 -0559 (CST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602041410.PAA18920@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 4, 96 03:10:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Before Terry has a fit :-) , let me tell you what he once told me. One of the problems of implementing someone else's file system is error recovery. If you cache FAT and your power goes out, for example, the FAT on the disk is not consistent. Aside from there being no fsck_msdos, if you then booted up in DOS, your filesystem would be inconsistent, and DOS doesn't like or expect that. You can write a fast read-only FAT FS but you have to fail as FAT would fail, to be truly compatible. Did I get that right, Terry? :-) Boyd According to Luigi Rizzo: > > > Some time ago there was a discussion on the performance of FAT > filesystems. I think the conclusion was that it is not intrinsically > slow, it is just a problem of non optimal implementations which > tend not to keep the FAT in memory, and perhaps use synchronous writes. > > Additionally, performance might probably benefit by an allocation > policy which privileges contiguity and locality for the blocks > belonging to the same file. > > We use FAT filesystems both in the kernel, and in mtools. > For the latter, I thought there was a quick fix to the problem of > caching the FAT: just mmap the device, and the kernel will do caching > for you. Well, it does not look that simple, as the vast majority of > raw devices does not support mmap. > > I am wondering: how hard would it be to add mmap() to, say, wd.c ? > Would it have other useful applications ? > > Thanks > Luigi > ==================================================================== > Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione > email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa > tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) > fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ > ==================================================================== > > -- _____________________________________________________________________________ Boyd Faulkner "The fates lead him who will; faulkner@asgard.bga.com Him who won't, they drag." http://asgard.bga.com/~faulkner Old Roman Saying -- Source: Joseph Campbell _____________________________________________________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 11:11:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA24171 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 11:11:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from ki.net (root@ki.net [142.77.249.8]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA24142 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 11:10:57 -0800 (PST) Received: (from scrappy@localhost) by ki.net (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA09854; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:08:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:08:12 -0500 (EST) From: "Marc G. Fournier" To: J Wunsch cc: FreeBSD hackers Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) In-Reply-To: <199602041809.TAA01498@uriah.heep.sax.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 4 Feb 1996, J Wunsch wrote: > As Peter Dufault wrote: > > > > > sd0(aha0:0:0): NOT READY asc:4,0 > > > sd0(aha0:0:0): Logical unit not ready, cause not reportable field replaceable > > > unit: 15 > > > > Maybe it was never properly formatted? > > My experience was that this condition results in a ``Medium format > incomplete'' error. > > For all cases i've seen by now, ``Logical unit not ready'' meant the > drive wasn't spinning (or not at full speed). > Okay, from Peter's suggestion, I've scsiformat'd the drive, which seems to get around the errors I was getting with disklabel, and I've finally got that drive up and running...but... When I tried to install, it newfs'd 3 partitions, then got the above error on the 4th (you could hear the drive powerdown) and then when it went to the 5th, you could hear it power up again, and it newfs'd it and the 6th properly again. Now, this is meant to be my new root drive on ki.net, but I'm nervous about putting it in there. I have it running right now on the 386, and I manually newfs'd /dev/sd0s1h after the machine came up "live", but the "power down" problem really has me worried. The drive is: (aha0:0:0): "CONNER CFP1060S 1.05GB 243F" type 0 fixed SCSI 2 sd0(aha0:0:0): Direct-Access 1013MB (2074880 512 byte sectors) Are there any known problems with this drive? Anything I should have jumpered that isn't? Settings on the controller that I've missed? The Controller is terminated, the drive is terminated, its a 230Watt power supply with only that drive and a 3.5" floppy running off of it, so I don't *think* its a power supply or termination proplem, and the cable has connectors for two drives on it and is short. Recommendations? Marc G. Fournier | POP Mail Telnet Acct DNS Hosting System | WWW Services Database Services | Knowledge, Administrator | | Information and scrappy@ki.net | WWW: http://www.ki.net | Communications, Inc From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 11:55:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA28865 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 11:55:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from eel.dataplex.net (EEL.DATAPLEX.NET [199.183.109.245]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA28858 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 11:55:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from [199.183.109.242] (cod [199.183.109.242]) by eel.dataplex.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA02276; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:52:22 -0600 X-Sender: rkw@shark.dataplex.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:52:24 -0600 To: dirk@hal.in-berlin.de (Dirk Froemberg) From: Richard Wackerbarth Subject: Re: Missing CTM-pieces Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk One of my ctm users noticed that the top level Makefile was deleted from the tree on the CD when I made the initial update. I have tracked this to the fact that the cvs tree (as I get it from sup2) does not have the Makefile,v at the top level. Any idea where it is getting lost? I would have expected to find it as a part of src-base, but it is not there. dirk@hal.in-berlin.de (Dirk Froemberg) writes: >BTW: The top-level Makefile disappeared "somehow": > > % zgrep "^CTM.. Makefile" src-2.1.*.gz > src-2.1.0015C.gz:CTMFR Makefile 1ffe7e0f83d174d7704b6548de332375 > >Was it intended? ---- Richard Wackerbarth rkw@dataplex.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 12:01:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA29608 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 12:01:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw.ast.com (fw.ast.com [165.164.6.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA29595 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 12:01:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from nemesis by fw.ast.com with uucp (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tjAAg-000858C; Sun, 4 Feb 96 13:32 CST Received: by nemesis.lonestar.org (Smail3.1.27.1 #20) id m0tjA3e-000CN8C; Sun, 4 Feb 96 13:25 WET Message-Id: Date: Sun, 4 Feb 96 13:25 WET To: hackers@freebsd.org From: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Sent: Sun Feb 4 1996, 13:25:06 CST Subject: Re: Watchdog timer Cc: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk [14]Terry Lambert writes... [14]** ISA MUST DIE. THIS IS NON-NEGOTIABLE. ** I have been reading the "build a watchdog timer board" thread with detached interest, and I thought this statement was extremely funny, and made me decide to respond. By going to PCI, you will ADD for a small-volume board (<1K units) roughly $40 per board JUST for the PCI, both for fabrication, electronics and mechanical packaging. Those PCI chipsets aren't cheap in low volumes, and the packges they come in eliminate do-it-yourself manufacturing. Also, if you want to go commercial and get a FCC Part 15 approval (technically you are supposed to do this for any volume of digital boards if they are sold as something other than educational, experimental or "kits"), a PCI board will cost even more to get certified since not all certification shops handle PCI and so there is less competition. If you go back to the original task of this "device", which was to somehow monitor the lifesigns of a PC and if there are none for a certain amount of time, RESET the machine, and perhaps if that doesn't work, cycle power on the machine too, a board (even an external box) could be built in small volumes (100 to 500 pieces) to do this job and sold for a reasonable return for around $30US. ($50 for power cycling) If you wanted a board/box that could be optionally stuffed to monitor up to three other computers and reset them independently, then you are probably talking about a $60US box. ($100 for power cycling) As an example for a simple system: in the external model, you would simply provide a chassis spine (those metal things on the ends of cards) with two plugs. Inside, you would connect one cable to the RESET connector on the MLB, and the other to either the SCSI activity light or the IDE activity light connector on the MLB or SCSI/IDE card. Externally, the cables (shielded) would be run to the monitoring box, where a couple of properly tuned NE555 timers would do an excellent job of monitoring dead time by looking for disk access. To ensure delayed writes idle times, and other stuff don't nail us, the system would be required to run a daemon that wakes up every so often and reads one block from a raw device on the SCSI/IDE being monitored. Such a simple external device would probably be exempt from Part 15 testing because it has no oscillator. Power would come from a wall adapter. If one timer expires and generates a RESET and things go dead again, a second and much longer timer (five to ten minutes) could cycle a relay and kill power to the computer chassis for ten seconds or so, and then let things reboot. In an internal board that did the same thing (minus the hard power cycle which must be done externally for UL/CSA approval), you would save on cable costs external box costs, and you would probably just stick the board somewhere inside, ie, not in a PC slot since it doesn't need access to the bus. Power would come via one of the drive connectors. Now, if you start getting fancy and want a ISA card that you can program how long "dead" is with something fancier than a potentiometer and have it accurate down to the microsecond, then your costs start going up and you are obliged to obtain FCC certification since you now have a clock present in your design. And if you don't want it stopped and seized at foreign customs, don't forget the international approvals, CSA, VDE, CISPR, etc. I have designed, prototyped and built several different ISA and non-ISA boards that became retail products for various things over the years and so I am fully aware of the issues involved. It's messy, expensive and slow. My point is that you should really decide exactly what is needed and what is nice and try to control the leaping elegance demonstrated in this thread. I can't believe anyone would want to waste a precious PCI slot on something like this, but then I guess it depends on how much other stuff you are willing to add (and pay for) on the board. You also limit your potential buying audience for what is already a low-volume device, since a lot of new machines only come with one or two PCI slots, and it seems we can demonstrate that a lot of FreeBSD users (and potential buyers of this gadget) don't have PCI slots at all or they are full. I'd be happy to create a design (analog or digital) and even prototype one of these "whatever it becomes" boards, and even know someone who does PCB layout who has done contract work for me in the past, but all of these "add-ons" are really going to drive up the cost, increase the complexity, and delay delivery of the gadget. If it is simple and affordable enough, I would even handle having the boards made, stuffed, and retailed since I have channels for doing that. But I have to see a design that has plenty of interest first, since past experience has shown me that only 10% of the people who say they really want something actually buy it. Frank Durda IV |"The Knights who say "LETNi" or uhclem%nemesis@rwsystr.nkn.net | demand... A SEGMENT REGISTER!!!" ^------(this is the fastest route)|"A what?" or ...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem |"LETNi! LETNi! LETNi!" - 1983 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 12:05:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA00170 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 12:05:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from main.statsci.com (main.statsci.com [198.145.127.110]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA00134 Sun, 4 Feb 1996 12:05:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from block.statsci.com by main.statsci.com with smtp (Smail3.1.29.1 #3) id m0tjAfU-000r3yC; Sun, 4 Feb 96 12:04 PST Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by block.statsci.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA19180; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 12:04:11 -0800 Message-Id: <199602042004.MAA19180@block.statsci.com> To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, doc@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Any perl maniacs out there have a desire to improve our mail robot? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 02 Feb 1996 15:31:46 -0800." <6938.823303906@time.cdrom.com> Reply-to: scott@statsci.com Date: Sun, 04 Feb 1996 12:04:11 -0800 From: Scott Blachowicz Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk "Jordan K. Hubbard" wrote: > The biggest problem the info robot service has right now is stale > information brought about by the fact that the info robot has its own > copies of everything. There are no links into our other docs, nor are > any search services offered (which limits its utility somewhat). So, would it make any sense to use something like an 'ftpmail' (I think I've seen one that'll retrive WWW links too) server for this? Or maybe build something on top of such a server so the components of your '%filelist' can be URLs to the real handbook from www.freebsd.org? Then, set it up so you can send various format incarnations of the information back as different MIME content types. Sounds like a fun project, but I can't volunteer ("real work" keeps getting in the way). Scott Blachowicz Ph: 206/283-8802x240 Mathsoft (Data Analysis Products Div) 1700 Westlake Ave N #500 scott@statsci.com Seattle, WA USA 98109 Scott.Blachowicz@seaslug.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 13:03:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA06496 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:03:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA06419 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:02:33 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA12434; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:03:29 -0500 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199602042103.QAA12434@hda.com> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: scrappy@ki.net (Marc G. Fournier) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:03:28 -0500 (EST) Cc: j@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Marc G. Fournier" at Feb 4, 96 02:08:12 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > On Sun, 4 Feb 1996, J Wunsch wrote: > > > As Peter Dufault wrote: > > > > > > > sd0(aha0:0:0): NOT READY asc:4,0 > > > > sd0(aha0:0:0): Logical unit not ready, cause not reportable field replaceable > > > > unit: 15 > > > > > > Maybe it was never properly formatted? > > > > My experience was that this condition results in a ``Medium format > > incomplete'' error. > > > > For all cases i've seen by now, ``Logical unit not ready'' meant the > > drive wasn't spinning (or not at full speed). > > > > Okay, from Peter's suggestion, I've scsiformat'd the drive, which seems to > get around the errors I was getting with disklabel, and I've finally got that > drive up and running...but... > > When I tried to install, it newfs'd 3 partitions, then got the above error > on the 4th (you could hear the drive powerdown) and then when it went to > the 5th, you could hear it power up again, and it newfs'd it and the 6th > properly again. It looks like Joerg is closer than me on this one. It managed to format the drive fine yet sometimes spins down when fully closed? I don't suppose the "allow removal" in the driver is causing this think to spin down? I appears the "start unit" is getting it to spin up again. 1. (I don't know if this will work) As an information point, keep the drive open so it is never fully closed and see what happens: > sleep 100000 < /dev/rsd0c & 2. Look for a jumper that makes the drive spin up when power is applied. -- Peter Dufault Real-Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 13:10:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA07059 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:10:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA07053 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:10:25 -0800 (PST) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id PAA14260; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:09:02 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199602042109.PAA14260@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Multi-Port Async Cards To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:09:02 -0600 (CST) Cc: gerg@stallion.oz.au, terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602032130.OAA04350@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 3, 96 02:30:58 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > So, anybody is free to use them and redistribute them, but no support is > > provided by Stallion. > > Hot damn. This is the right answer. 8-). > > Don't need the "alternately" if the image can go on the CDROM and > the FTP site without problems. 8-). Companies like this encourage us mad hackers to buy products from them :-) I visited your Web site briefly, I don't recall seeing any "list" prices, etc., however. It would not be too hard to beat your competition (i.e. Specialix) by providing this sort of information - I had asked for product info and pricing via their snazzy Web site, never got anything but a followup asking how the service was, wrote back and told them their service stank because I never got any information, and they actually sent me a MOUSE PAD and a nice apologetic non-form-letter - but they STILL didn't include the originally requested information. Duh. I for one would really be interested in seeing some price info. :-) An intelligent card and a FreeBSD box could make a killer terminal server. ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/546-7968 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 13:28:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA08039 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:28:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (rocky.sri.MT.net [204.182.243.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA08034 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:28:32 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA29569; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:31:00 -0700 Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:31:00 -0700 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199602042131.OAA29569@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: Richard Wackerbarth Cc: dirk@hal.in-berlin.de (Dirk Froemberg), hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Missing CTM-pieces In-Reply-To: References: Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > One of my ctm users noticed that the top level Makefile was deleted from > the tree on the CD when I made the initial update. I have tracked this to > the fact that the cvs tree (as I get it from sup2) does not have the > Makefile,v at the top level. Any idea where it is getting lost? I would > have expected to find it as a part of src-base, but it is not there. Hmm, $CVSROOT/src/Makefile,v exists on freefall, so I'm not sure what's up. I've got it on my system, but I've been supping from freefall since day one, so I can't answer that question very well. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 13:33:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA08323 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:33:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from ra.dkuug.dk (ra.dkuug.dk [193.88.44.193]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA08312 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:33:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from critter.tfs.com ([193.88.44.194]) by ra.dkuug.dk (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA02882 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 22:21:18 +0100 Received: from localhost.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA06842 for ; Sat, 3 Feb 1996 22:14:55 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost.tfs.com didn't use HELO protocol To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Zyxel 2864I ISDN, any interest ? Date: Sat, 03 Feb 1996 22:14:55 +0100 Message-ID: <6840.823382095@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Anybody interested in the Zyxel 2864I ISDN "modem" ? I hope we could get support for multiplexed DTE's working. If interested send email to phk@FreeBSD.org Poul-Henning From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 13:36:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA08627 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:36:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA08614 Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:36:31 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602042136.NAA08614@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Hmmm. what happened to STABLE? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 04 Feb 1996 11:51:37 CST." Date: Sun, 04 Feb 1996 13:36:31 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> Do you have the "controller eisa0" >> in your kernel config file. > >Aha. I will check; I don't think that had to be there before, right? Correct. Are you tracking the commit list now that you are using -stable again? The eisaconf changes went in around the first of the year. They allow us to treat EISA devices as EISA devices instead of as ISA devices with really funky probe code. >I'll check into this stuff... Thanks! Sure. >-- >-- >Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity >Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available >Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | 21 Chicagoland POPs, ISDN, 28.8, much more >Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net >/ >ISDN - Get it here TODAY! | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 13:45:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA09122 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:45:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA09113 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:45:01 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA06130; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:42:23 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602042142.OAA06130@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Watchdog timers (was: Re: Multi-Port Async Cards) To: dennis@etinc.com (dennis) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:42:23 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602040332.WAA26253@etinc.com> from "dennis" at Feb 3, 96 10:32:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > >It's idiotic to pay for things you'll never use. The "average" user > >never opens his box to install anything he didn't buy with the machine > >in the package offered by the dealer anyway, so he doesn't give a > >*damn* what bus he has, as long as it works. > > except that with your box the customer will be paying for lots of things > they don't want or need. They'll have fewer choices without ISA or IDE > and therefore everything will cost more. Only if card manufacturers don't jump on the PCI wagon. If they do, then economies of scale will kick in. That's something I'd be willing to pay a little to promote -- how about you? The fact that no one needs any type of empty slot, even an ISA slot, seems to be lost on you. There's no difference between empty ISA nad empty PCI slots from a user perspective, is there? > contrast J. Greco's argument last week for building "cheap" routers with $20 > isa cards and small IDEs....cost is king. I have 35 machines in my lab > and your MB is a replacement for exactly zero of them. That's right: my suggestion is for a consumer machine that actually delivers on the "Plug-N-Play" promise that is undeliverable (period) on an ISA machine (you may not have noticed, but there are still ISA cards that can't be passively probed... PCI cards which are in spec can all be passively probed). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 13:50:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA09451 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:50:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA09446 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:50:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA06143; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:48:27 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602042148.OAA06143@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:48:27 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602041410.PAA18920@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 4, 96 03:10:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Some time ago there was a discussion on the performance of FAT > filesystems. I think the conclusion was that it is not intrinsically > slow, it is just a problem of non optimal implementations which > tend not to keep the FAT in memory, and perhaps use synchronous writes. My conclusion has always been that it is intrinsically slow. The big "wins" on the MACH FAT implementation come from intentionally crippling UFS (disabling caching, etc.) and then caching the whole FS and directory structure for FAT. And even then, FAT doesn't do that well. > Additionally, performance might probably benefit by an allocation > policy which privileges contiguity and locality for the blocks > belonging to the same file. This is a tradeoff between read speed and write speed whenever you implement it. > We use FAT filesystems both in the kernel, and in mtools. > For the latter, I thought there was a quick fix to the problem of > caching the FAT: just mmap the device, and the kernel will do caching > for you. Well, it does not look that simple, as the vast majority of > raw devices does not support mmap. > > I am wondering: how hard would it be to add mmap() to, say, wd.c ? > Would it have other useful applications ? This would be useful for mtools, but not for the kernel version of FAT. The FAT-caching in the MACH implementation (you *could* just port the MACH code...) takes a significant amount of memory, IMO. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 13:52:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA09595 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:52:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from gatekeeper.mcimail.com (gatekeeper.mcimail.com [192.147.45.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA09589 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:52:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailgate.mcimail.com (mailgate.mcimail.com [166.38.40.3]) by gatekeeper.mcimail.com (8.6.12/8.6.10) with SMTP id VAA13863; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 21:49:48 GMT Received: from mcimail.com by mailgate.mcimail.com id at00483; 4 Feb 96 21:52 WET Date: Sun, 4 Feb 96 03:32 EST From: "MCI Mail X.400 Service" To: hackers Subject: Message Status Message-Id: <42960204083224/POSTMASTERD49X4@MCIMAIL.COM> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk DELIVERY NOTICE Referencing: Message id: 31960204053613/0003765414DC6EM Subject: hackers-digest V Your Message To: C=IN A=VSNL P=XEEMAIL O=XEEDEL OU1=XEENET S=vivekp could not be delivered to this recipient. Reason: Unable to transfer. Diagnostic: IPM expired. This non-delivery notice generated: SUN FEB 04, 1996 8:32 am GMT From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 13:58:41 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA09839 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:58:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from eel.dataplex.net (EEL.DATAPLEX.NET [199.183.109.245]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA09834 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 13:58:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from [199.183.109.242] (cod [199.183.109.242]) by eel.dataplex.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA02750; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:58:31 -0600 X-Sender: rkw@shark.dataplex.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:58:31 -0600 To: Nate Williams From: Richard Wackerbarth Subject: Re: Missing CTM-pieces Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> One of my ctm users noticed that the top level Makefile was deleted from >> the tree on the CD when I made the initial update. I have tracked this to >> the fact that the cvs tree (as I get it from sup2) does not have the >> Makefile,v at the top level. Any idea where it is getting lost? I would >> have expected to find it as a part of src-base, but it is not there. > >Hmm, $CVSROOT/src/Makefile,v exists on freefall, so I'm not sure what's >up. I've got it on my system, but I've been supping from freefall since >day one, so I can't answer that question very well. Thanks, Nate. I presumed that it was on the master cvs tree or it would not have appeared on the CD. Can somebody see if it is: a) on sup2.freebsd.org b) which supfile subset is supposed to contain it ---- Richard Wackerbarth rkw@dataplex.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 14:16:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA10892 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:16:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail12.digital.com (mail12.digital.com [192.208.46.20]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA10886 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:16:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from muggsy.lkg.dec.com by mail12.digital.com (5.65v3.2/1.0/WV) id AA23232; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:10:49 -0500 Received: from whydos.lkg.dec.com by muggsy.lkg.dec.com (5.65/DEC-Ultrix/4.3) with SMTP id AA04324; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:10:48 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by whydos.lkg.dec.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA06856; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 22:25:49 GMT Message-Id: <199602042225.WAA06856@whydos.lkg.dec.com> X-Authentication-Warning: whydos.lkg.dec.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Peter Berger Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: High speed Routing (was Re: Multi-Port Async Cards) In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 02 Feb 1996 12:11:55 EST." X-Mailer: exmh version 1.5omega 10/6/94 Date: Sun, 04 Feb 1996 22:25:48 +0000 From: Matt Thomas Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In , you wrote: > That's right; and you can't add a 100Mbp/s port to a PC that will > actually route that many packets for $134, or for any price. Reference > the very interesting TCP performance tests at Usenix which showed that at > Ethernet MTUs, Pentium boxes running TCP/IP over the loopback interface > could only reach about 40Mb/s (this number went up if you increased the > MTU ... the cost is in the packet processing, not the raw byte speed). # ifconfig lo0 mtu 1536 # ./ttcp -f m -t -s -n 8192 0 ttcp-t: buflen=8192, nbuf=8192, align=16384/0, port=5001 tcp -> 0 ttcp-t: socket ttcp-t: connect ttcp-t: 67108864 bytes in 7.61 real seconds = 67.24 Mbit/sec +++ ttcp-t: 8192 I/O calls, msec/call = 0.95, calls/sec = 1075.83 ttcp-t: 0.0user 4.1sys 0:07real 55% 26i+263d 250maxrss 0+2pf 1330+4920csw I just did that on my P90 (running 2.1.0-RELEASE) using the loopback device and an Ethernet MTU. That seems to be a bit more that 40Mb/s. However, I do agree that FreeBSD as it is today is not suitable as a high speed router. While the system does have the raw processing power to do high-speed routing, the network infrastructure is not up to the task. Not surprisingly (given its history), the IP networking code is heavily oriented to being a host, not a router. Just consider for a momemt that want to be a 100baseT router between 2 LANs. That means you should be able to gracefully receive ~150,000 packets per interface per second (if you are being flooded with tinygrams). No matter you do, you will not be able to handle 300,000 interrupts per second. You need to switch to polling (even better would be to switch to polling when the interrupt rate reaches some threshold of interrupts per clock tick) however this does a pose a problem in getting user space applications time to execute. Let's assume you can deal a 1ms of delay so you queue, say, 3 ms of buffers at each interface (1000 buffers). You don't want to queue 1.5MB of buffer space since if they really are full size packets, they only consume 30 buffers (45KB). So you need to queue smaller buffers and use intelligent buffer management and scatter/gather to brind the amount of space used. Let's use 320 byte buffers (since 5*320 > 1518) and that will bring the amount of memory to 320KB per interface. Now you to have process those 300 packets. You get 3us per packet to do all the processing for that packet. Good luck. One of the major changes I would make would be to move the netisr's to the drivers and make almost all packet receive and transmit processing in device drivers run at splnet. Only the few places where you have to twiddle the device would you need to run at splimp. ether_input (or ppp_input or ...) would call the protocol input routine directly (one could even have a inline version of ether_input which just checked for IPv4 and quickly called ip_input). The only receive queue would be the receive buffers on the device itself. Another change would be add an mbuf flag which tells the driver whether the mbuf should be immediately freed or whether it can "linger" around. This would allow the transmit code to be able not be interrupt driven (unless you dealing with, for example, NFS buffers). When you start a transmit (and there's no room), call your transmit done to free any stale buffers. Another is to code a "fast" ip_input routine specially that is tuned for the 99% case of forwarding a packet. I think I've rambled on enough for now... Matt Thomas Internet: matt@3am-software.com 3am Software Foundry WWW URL: http://www.3am-software.com/bio/matt.html Westford, MA Disclaimer: I disavow all knowledge of this message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 14:18:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA10964 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:18:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA10955 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:18:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id XAA19281; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 23:18:18 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602042218.XAA19281@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: j@uriah.heep.sax.de (J Wunsch) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 23:18:18 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602041822.TAA01613@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Feb 4, 96 07:21:54 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > As Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > I am wondering: how hard would it be to add mmap() to, say, wd.c ? > > Would it have other useful applications ? > > This would only shift the problem from the msdosfs code into the > various device drivers. Well, let me first say that I don't know exactly how mmapping files works internally. But what I expect is to have the kernel do its best to keep blocks in core and write them back (if necessary) when the file is unmapped. Now assume for a moment the existence of a Very Simple File System (VSFS), which always contains a single file spanning the whole partition. mmapping the unique file of this VSFS should do exactly what I want, and the VSFS is device independant (it's a file system!). This VSFS is logically above the device driver, but it might just be a standard piece of the system which all device drivers invoke to implement mmap(). Does the above sound reasonable ? I have no idea on how complex would it be to implement this, but the feeling is that it is more of a design problem rather than a coding problem (for those who know how to write such code, of course :)) Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 14:42:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA12226 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:42:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA12221 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:42:17 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA08330; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:39:18 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602042239.PAA08330@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: faulkner@asgard.bga.com (Boyd Faulkner) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:39:17 -0700 (MST) Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602041854.MAA07227@asgard.bga.com> from "Boyd Faulkner" at Feb 4, 96 12:54:52 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Before Terry has a fit :-) , let me tell you what he once told me. > One of the problems of implementing someone else's file system is > error recovery. If you cache FAT and your power goes out, for example, > the FAT on the disk is not consistent. Aside from there being no fsck_msdos, > if you then booted up in DOS, your filesystem would be inconsistent, and > DOS doesn't like or expect that. You can write a fast read-only FAT > FS but you have to fail as FAT would fail, to be truly compatible. > > Did I get that right, Terry? :-) Mostly. If you had delayed ordered writes, the cache could be write-through, so it would work. Then the problems become "no msdos_fsck" and "must order regular I/O" and "cache in MACH is too large". Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 14:58:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA13117 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:58:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA13108 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 14:58:53 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA08359; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:56:29 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602042256.PAA08359@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Watchdog timer To: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:56:29 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org In-Reply-To: from "Frank Durda IV" at Feb 4, 96 01:25:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > [14]Terry Lambert writes... > [14]** ISA MUST DIE. THIS IS NON-NEGOTIABLE. ** > > I have been reading the "build a watchdog timer board" thread with detached > interest, and I thought this statement was extremely funny, and made > me decide to respond. > > By going to PCI, you will ADD for a small-volume board (<1K units) > roughly $40 per board JUST for the PCI, both for fabrication, electronics > and mechanical packaging. Those PCI chipsets aren't cheap in low > volumes, and the packges they come in eliminate do-it-yourself > manufacturing. So let's all chip in $40 toward the death of PCI. 8-). I note that you assume small scale manufacturing in the PCI numbers, but: > If you go back to the original task of this "device", which was to somehow > monitor the lifesigns of a PC and if there are none for a certain > amount of time, RESET the machine, and perhaps if that doesn't work, > cycle power on the machine too, a board (even an external box) could be > built in small volumes (100 to 500 pieces) to do this job and sold for a > reasonable return for around $30US. ($50 for power cycling) You assume large scale manufacturing in the reset board numbers. ... I really find the idea of using the controller activity light as a timer reset mechanism *very* interesting. I also really, really like the idea of a card edge connector with (for instance) a phone jack externally and two cable and two replacement cables for the disk activity lights, and presumably, two connectors for the existing disk activity lights to connect to. I agree that you don't need an ISA slot for this type of thing. Actually, you should be able to use a riser socket, like the original 8086 "clocks" used and plug into the CPU slot or something else as a molded plastic part with a socket on top and a male counterpart on the bottom (my riser idea). > I can't believe anyone would want to waste a precious PCI slot on something > like this, but then I guess it depends on how much other stuff you are > willing to add (and pay for) on the board. I perfer a non-card method (yours or mine) for implementing the circuit anyway; I never seriously suggested a PCI card based soloution. I did suggest a potential direction for those people who have gone board design-happy, however. 8-). > buying audience for what is already a low-volume device, since a lot of new > machines only come with one or two PCI slots, and it seems we can demonstrate > that a lot of FreeBSD users (and potential buyers of this gadget) don't have > PCI slots at all or they are full. Actually, most machines are 3 slots, and that's because of line driver limitations in the early chips. There are many boards in Computer Shopper now that are 4 slot boards (and have been since October 1995). > I would even handle having the boards made, stuffed, and retailed since > I have channels for doing that. But I have to see a design that has > plenty of interest first, since past experience has shown me that only > 10% of the people who say they really want something actually buy it. I don't run any large service sites, which I see as your primary market. But I do know people who do run large service sites, and they would be interested in the tiny board with the reset button and disk activity light -- it would be damn cheap, and it would be applicable across a wide variety of hardware. The biggest win is that there is no real device driver work, so it's applicable to any OS: BSD, Linux, SCO, UbixWare, Solaris, etc.. If you could package it in such a way as to not have it "floating around" in the case, I think you have a winner. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 15:34:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA14933 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:34:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from r2d2.fdn.org (r2d2.fdn.org [193.55.4.56]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA14926 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:34:23 -0800 (PST) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by r2d2.fdn.org (8.7.1/8.6.9) with UUCP id AAA12678; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:34:06 +0100 (MET) Received: (from caussep@localhost) by sphynx.fdn.fr (8.6.12/8.6.9) id AAA01120; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:29:29 +0100 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:29:27 +0100 (MET) From: Philippe Causse To: hackers@freebsd.org cc: FreeBSD-users-france , John Polstra , Thierry Delaitre Subject: Patches from 2.1-RELEASE Message-ID: X-Mailer: PINE-3.91/i386/FreeBSD MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi all ! This is a set of patches (from 2.1-RELEASE) I submit in the hope they will be useful to someone else but me ;-) Some are very useful, some aren't... See the description below. *** CONTENTS *** # ls -1sF 33 floppy-patch - Patch regarding the floppy 1 makediffs.sh - My shell script to generate these diffs 17 tape-patch - Patch regarding the SCSI-tape 3 xditview-patch - Patch regarding gxditview *** DESCRIPTION *** These patches are described in order of importance, but that's only my humble opinion, you may think the other way... 1] tape-patch: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Some SCSI-1 tape drives like Archive 2150S, Tandberg-??? _DO_ implement a mode called QFA (Quick File Access) which allow quick positionning on a given block number (counted 1 from the begining of tape). This feature was available when I ran Linux two years ago. An equivalent set of commands also exist on SCSI-2 tape drives but I don't have any hardware to test it on. Before releasing this patch, I grabbed the 2.2-current "st.c", so this patch also adds the retension command. HOW IT WORKS: This patch adds two new IOCTLS: on to get the current block number (MTIOCPOS) and one to go to a given position (MTSEEK). The MTIOCPOS ioctl returns a value in the mtpos structure. eg: /* reading tape position */ struct ntpos pos; status = ioctl(device, MTIOCPOS, &pos); if(status < 0) perror("IOCTL/MTIOCPOS"); else printf("At block %ld\n", pos.mt_pos); /* seeking to a block number */ daddr_t where = ???; status = ioctl(device, MTSEEK, where); if(status < 0) perror("IOCTL/MTSEEK"); The `mt' program has been modified accordingly to provide user-level "seek" and "tell" (tell the current head position) commands. CAVEATS: I don't know if these commands are specific to the Archive Viper-150 (aka 2150S). If so, they should probably go to the rogues gallery; anyhow they have a SCSI-2 equivalent (but with different encoding). NOTES: This patch is _really_ useful in conjunction with "tar Rcv" since the 'R' option of tar displays the record number (== block_number - 1). It allows retrieval of files in a very short time: less than two minutes on a 250Mb tape, even when the file is at the end of the tape! ----- 2] floppy-patch: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The floppy patch gives access to 1600 Kb formatted floppies with a high throughput (up to 49K/s instead of the regular 32K/s). 2-a) High-capacity: The 1.6Mb format is physically possible with no interleave on 3"1/2 floppies but it is not the possible with the 1.7Mb format: one must use interleave. This 1.6Mb format has the advantage of not requiring interleaved sectors. 2-b) High-speed: The speed increase comes from two changes: the increased number of sectors (since the rotational speed is the same) and spiral formatting with a cylinder skew of 2 to compensate the head switching time. These little enhancements are fine when doing tar/pax/dump or even mwrite/mcopy so I thought these changes may be worth adding to the floppy driver. HOW IT WORKS: I had to modify `fd.c' in two places: the array describing the different densities & gaps and the line controlling the head settle time. In previous versions of FreeBSD, there was an option called FDSEEKWAIT but it has been removed. Sorry, I had to put it back!!! (this is used for spiral formatting). The default head settle time is "hz/16" which is far too big to get the benefit of spiral formatting. I replaced it with "hz/FDSEEKWAIT". A good value of FDSEEKWAIT is 64, though it runs okay with 128 but 64 is safer :-) The fdformat program has been changed to do spiral formatting. It accepts two new parameters: track and cylinder skew. Track skew (defaults to zero) is almost useless since the head switching time is neglectable . Cylinder skew is sensitive: I obtained the best performances with a value of 2 (the default) on an unloaded system. CAVEATS: 1.6Mb formatting is not possible on 5"1/4 floppies since the track length is too short. NOTES: It is possible to use spiral formatting on regular 1.44Mb floppies. The speedup is smaller but you can feel it, even under M$-DOG. As well, spiral formatting doesn't hurt M$-DOG machines ;-). I also had to shift the floppy minor device numbers, so a patch to MAKEDEV is supplied in this patch-file to fix it. ----- 3] xditview-patch: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ This patch allows the user to scroll the page up and down using the arrows instead of the scrollbar. This makes gxditview behave closer to xdvi. I found this patch quite useful since I make a daily use of gxditview and displaying a full page is not possible on a 14" monitor! I'm writing a thesis using "groff -TX100 -me" and enjoy the key bindings to scroll, it's quicker than dragging the scrollbar. HOW IT WORKS: I just installed an X11 accelerator to redirect events from the Dvi widget into the vertical scrollbar. NOTES: The same could stand for horizontal motion but I prefered assigning the and keys to "next-page" and "previous-page" actions. CAVEATS: This version of groff is out of date. It may not be possible to apply the patch straightforward. ----- That's all folks ! I hope you'll make something good out of them, and I certainly would be proud to see them integrated in 2.2-RELEASE 8) -- at least the QFA scsi-tape support (please!). Cheers, Philippe. ------------------------------[CUT HERE]------------------------------ begin 644 my_patches.tar.gz M'XL(`````````^P\:7?;MK+]*O\*9&E"6;3,3=3B.N^YMGRO&V_74MK>T_3H M4B1H,:9(E:2\-,U_OS,`N$BBJ*1Y:=+7ZM@B"6`6S`P&,P`HUP]GLX>=F978 MDZ\^T4=5%-,PR%<$/\K2E1B*T3((,56EI6GM5KM%B*J:1OLKHGPJAHJ?>9Q8 M$2%?16&85+6[FU#J_Q$,_;&?[>UM0A-[%_Z;GMXQ=\\.7O:/^M\WP\B[K@WF M`3FF8U`2T=2>IO<4E:C=KKFUL[-3"K8`H?5:W9YN?HVL*;TW=.W\\!+WC75MJ8LE:EZ:Q)K:@X2E<%$ZX"V'@'<]"8( MG15:1DCOT;\A]Z/XO(4ZPAS[>?$],@#:+]IP"]0A;!;?+4GD1KH==V M$V%+.%8[%=U$F+)N%H$VT^F:'TXF@ZD2IK%!F'JU,(UJ8>I5PC1*A%G50Z-, MD!^(WT&)X,A@=JUK!.YWO@R[-I6/LFL$WV#7C]9U$V'+.%9RD%)ZI=U$H(\9 MOALL;L/PK;2XO][P-3YJ^!I?Y/`MG::T+@QG<\,TM8JS:SH;%+/*=@93H1AM MTV"N5HRV83!7*49;&`29=)=W\&2R'()8B,%)I`/(Y&!K!>A;FX0 M8:=*A`A=)<+.>A$BZ&*143&-8.MH??/WP(V"8!.=`=E#>]-$]R6YU&I?L,&( MJWS!7\NE5OJ"32ZUPA?\Q5QJI3_8Y%(K_,%?R*5V/\:E=K\LEXI1ZCR.FO'8 M"W9=QPVCJ95D-TV;KW0.YY2<60]$5XC2ZAGMGM[%=4N>>E2!+ZUXZEK/4->O M>+84VB^1:'&232WD>0( MV1@3=P]+(WKMQ="6@7ORFSTDQ.[]GXZ/1F<'/X[.!_U#4+OZ\Q[O4VU*IS%- M),^7%1EIARZTKC-T@%IZ0_:)`OS`1=V#RS?[C$FX;33JP(OHR=W$\RD@^4EZ M\S76UQOJSW7RIM'82ULLU@$ZC]'`JC>DL5_H)"M_)]ASFT+.MS2*O3``0.C) M\<75V<%P]'W_:G!R<\P20'_M;CHS?Q'Z6X0$0E[@T&@4W]`[ M#L.X8<__-ZK>J.8&0+E2SB%Y!(I&VL7/>QI";<4*"C90*Q9GZJ^5Z1Z4#VQ1 M/Z:U6FUWNU"-Q,G^"QCCE*"0O.":;.]B:\XDP2H[K2)%Y-D0LF8QHD@DP+E>@(("4#@HL&X0D.IY^B_%D)B M!5PZ6/P-4>J,ET8J1*`WM6XH`=<\"V,O\:"O842"N>^GE$%^'@J.P:$.``;N M$]9L.J81"@/WQY*86`G(*14,2A/%^C'#JO\*ZWNO@=9+.M.2GG5]^AJ^`_$9V;O'.)4_P8O-+S"\3 MN+P.'O/9)L7V.GF-\!%OS!.P[[I7@W_GE M=1+/9Q&-8:0$#R1`GGT2SI/9/)&)$P;/$V+%-^A2B!T&KH=]`FQEN*#7'`!& ME.<^$)?MT1/+1>?,I9'`R"P#O4U!>3,Y11$&_D-9>Y`A,#ZC-C9R:.Q%U$GI MV=;,LKWD`:<11_-H4;JWEN\YQ)Z$GDU!`A$E$([)!,)3F4"< M#U]XAPDH?!L&^^[@-[0HX2O50(*^TD6/A8\$9AC!&S0`2NC/@+=X$D:\QS"E M`5+745=U-X[M.;`55NC0+@J#.T`DF7ISF+@-!4EVREA&`RR#YOXT)C-X9"Y> M)EWH-_:]A5F M/(LY/'HEM67(:K[P\(G'9V-E?`YYD\._A_"?:@B;RI]]("^8(MK?ZR1MRV+" M_W_#O71Z!G6K9HM/S\P?M,$?=)0L3BE0'!0IBI"1IRG*OJIU@-E]K64"!_LM M52/,ZLH8/RZBP>2&-2UKF6#+@I@3.BL(N4R-0X1@M3L+.J3W7B)I[)YEA*6B MZ'1ER.&S2)3E7MS-[9,=5493BL4M!DGBEBE*W`-(FE_LJ'LI$M2+:,"3O`(2 M$%_ZQ'JW`,B$`R'BO0M2_67NT80G3\(Y0!*3WH_04;!H,H.%8,V64W.D411& MXBD>@0A'3@A>ANF(/>;M8H8"?!TD*_;$BLBV&,\RV8[GKNO=[RVFD\G##(:Y MD^R)Y2>>GTB8(5W3!(:L9$77P`I\W\KDL=NS>W%OTHMZU[U![[B7]+S>+[>@ MJ#KFC#LL:82LY\Y+[(EDI^&P;4&J]MQ]WL-$3FBEZ-XP2\%VM4QC5A)Z$E`' MLF*JTQ1#UF!$IJ;])U5P@\,NYIO[1).+V>2?PA0.>\/>YS&'LO&O*;JL*9W< M%6IJ5]:T3KXG4Q,&LHB+U8PC:MVP;CT_$-!2G&7AM676+^!H%?#SC M%OCB`CYFGYDKS+HKS'8]@Z4=UU592X^ZL(ZWH,!4"AU/;?<]>S[DG"XY[*S_ M"W;ZGIWWGO?$*M+B2HYKL7DH%4!A@'Z@$,RVK+6U@A"Z((1N.Q,"8P,CH1[A MM@\D'K/MM<=[)!.":`:ATF(S*"AKUEENUBDT:Z3-S&6B9BE1B,86FT'!0K.U M4Q\[T&$8^8$.SR72HX+G2<==;6&U$QT+U^PNCOJFB%GP%L,#J)$Y%-MDZYI(A6/@P05;_Q1MF.)3;7JN](@[S6?/R"-)XD0:1*T#I47_ M5L\Z4(/`'GV9]/SX>8JHYKK^/)Y(,03A\T3,%KJ).[*%0?!%RR1MM;067%@' M_N1"VZ[>K1L]0>YJ9GRZO`E_:<]%:/:6U?L\%8KFND0]F?#13539/ M$G+LDP$YB)@?G;A)7GJ,I2A>G$?RXH0U1G^6SY$P0$7M$&OSL#.O.,2*5">\ MCI"#@%@^Z"S`L&%*DTGHD"0D:4B,6=,U#:$B$H$]5-Y%'C2&&Y93B33*BV^: MR&+?7QO3JJ:L:FHAO%<[LIH?J%-Q;3JBR3P*(($,`Y8$LP@A)LZ<+04+8GG^ M"M-WX,`_P:":;8;,8T`%DY(&J%P?K#P&#\U32W"^\RD-H.3:NX7`2/1@%H77 MD34EDN6'0`-F]PE@!"S6#*H@H$?1>`$GBNO+V/^$PSN>=1V$,6[!\#R]WD2! 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You can get worse, but it's more expensive... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 15:42:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA15190 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:42:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from easy.stallion.com (easy.stallion.com [204.31.184.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA15185 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 15:42:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from cluster.stallion.oz.au by easy.stallion.com id aa28498; 4 Feb 96 15:41 PST Subject: Re: Multi-Port Async Cards To: Joe Greco Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:35:15 +1000 (AEST) From: Greg Ungerer Cc: terry@lambert.org, gerg@stallion.oz.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602042109.PAA14260@brasil.moneng.mei.com> from "Joe Greco" at Feb 4, 96 03:09:02 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <9602050935.aa29018@cluster.stallion.oz.au> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Joe Greco writes: > Companies like this encourage us mad hackers to buy products from them :-) > > I visited your Web site briefly, I don't recall seeing any "list" prices, > etc., however. It would not be too hard to beat your competition (i.e. Well, oddly enough Stallion used to have price info in the web site. But the sales folk removed it... The main reason is that it only listed US prices, and this is not very useful for people outside of the US. > Specialix) by providing this sort of information - I had asked for product > info and pricing via their snazzy Web site, never got anything but a > followup asking how the service was, wrote back and told them their service > stank because I never got any information, and they actually sent me a MOUSE > PAD and a nice apologetic non-form-letter - but they STILL didn't include > the originally requested information. Duh. > > I for one would really be interested in seeing some price info. :-) An > intelligent card and a FreeBSD box could make a killer terminal server. OK, I'll send you some price info, off-line. I don't have US pricing at hand, so it may be a day or two... Seeya Gerg --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Greg Ungerer EMAIL: gerg@stallion.com Stallion Technologies Pty Ltd PHONE: +61 7 3270 4271 33 Woodstock Rd, Toowong, QLD 4066, Australia FAX: +61 7 3270 4245 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 16:15:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA16651 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:15:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA16642 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:15:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA05403; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 11:01:55 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602050031.LAA05403@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Watchdog timer To: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 11:01:55 +1030 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org In-Reply-To: from "Frank Durda IV" at Feb 4, 96 01:25:00 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Frank Durda IV stands accused of saying: > > By going to PCI, you will ADD for a small-volume board (<1K units) > roughly $40 per board JUST for the PCI, both for fabrication, electronics > and mechanical packaging. Those PCI chipsets aren't cheap in low > volumes, and the packges they come in eliminate do-it-yourself > manufacturing. One can only hope that this will change; certainly for the nonce it makes PCI card design impractical for small players. (It's also conceivable that this was a consideration in the development of the spec 8( ) > As an example for a simple system: in the external model, you would simply > provide a chassis spine (those metal things on the ends of cards) with > two plugs. Inside, you would connect one cable to the RESET connector on > the MLB, and the other to either the SCSI activity light or the IDE > activity light connector on the MLB or SCSI/IDE card. Dang. This is a very neat idea (hits self). > Externally, the cables (shielded) would be run to the monitoring box, where > a couple of properly tuned NE555 timers would do an excellent job of Hmm. I'd do this internally, presuming that resetting would be enough. It's not actually as simple as you make it sound though; you need a missing-pulse detector (consider the situation where the disk light stays on) and a timer that runs for longer than the 100-second maximum for the 555. Even so, you can do the pulse detection with a capacitor and a diode, and the long-delay timer can be done with an XR2206 which is still dirt cheap. > Power would come from a wall adapter. If one timer expires and generates > a RESET and things go dead again, a second and much longer timer (five > to ten minutes) could cycle a relay and kill power to the computer chassis > for ten seconds or so, and then let things reboot. This (the power cycling) would add significantly to the cost of the unit; consider a 15A relay and the extra wiring involved in terms of assembly cost. > My point is that you should really decide exactly what is needed and > what is nice and try to control the leaping elegance demonstrated > in this thread. Feeping creaturism. Yes 8) The clock would still be a nice toy, but I'll stick on PHK's NVconsole 8) > Frank Durda IV |"The Knights who say "LETNi" -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 16:20:47 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA17008 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:20:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA17003 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:20:44 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA08837; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:16:58 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602050016.RAA08837@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Multi-Port Async Cards To: gerg@stallion.oz.au (Greg Ungerer) Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:16:58 -0700 (MST) Cc: jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com, terry@lambert.org, gerg@stallion.oz.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9602050935.aa29018@cluster.stallion.oz.au> from "Greg Ungerer" at Feb 5, 96 09:35:15 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Well, oddly enough Stallion used to have price info in the web site. But the > sales folk removed it... The main reason is that it only listed US prices, > and this is not very useful for people outside of the US. Actually, it causes them to ask embarrasing questions, like "why does it cost more outside the US", to which there are no good answers. So it's easier to dodge the questions. 8-). Back when I was involved in the running of a small ($2M-$3M/year) software company, we had a continual "problem" of companies in the UK buying directly from distributors in the US after their quantity price break and selling directly in the UK (bypassing our signed distributors). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 16:51:42 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA18284 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:51:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from rlb.mindspring.com (rlb.mindspring.com [168.121.25.139]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA18279 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 16:51:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by rlb.mindspring.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #1) id m0tjF9u-00031oC; Sun, 4 Feb 96 19:51 EST Message-Id: From: rlb@rlb.mindspring.com (Ron Bolin) Subject: SMC8416BT Support To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:51:54 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Reply-To: rlb@mindspring.com I installed FBSD 2.01 ans am using an SMC 8416BT MIC. I get a ed0: device timeout when the system comes up. Got andy ideas as to weterh this card should work. I ahve a Wt0 device at int 5 and 300h. I placed the SMC8416BT on int 10 and 340h in the kernel conf gen file. This card is listed in the source code and the /var/log/message file shows that it recongizes the card (by signature). Any thoughts would be appreciated. -Ron rlb@mindspring.com Atlanta, GA From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 17:32:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA20873 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:32:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from eac.iafrica.com (slipper101152.iafrica.com [196.7.101.152]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA20815 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:32:01 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rnordier@localhost) by eac.iafrica.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id DAA02768 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:30:53 +0200 From: Robert Nordier Message-Id: <199602050130.DAA02768@eac.iafrica.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:30:51 +0200 (SAT) In-Reply-To: <199602041854.MAA07227@asgard.bga.com> from "Boyd Faulkner" at Feb 4, 96 12:54:52 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 4 Feb 1996, Boyd Faulkner wrote: > One of the problems of implementing someone else's file system is > error recovery. If you cache FAT and your power goes out, for example, > the FAT on the disk is not consistent. Aside from there being no fsck_msdos, > if you then booted up in DOS, your filesystem would be inconsistent, and > DOS doesn't like or expect that. You can write a fast read-only FAT > FS but you have to fail as FAT would fail, to be truly compatible. The bottom line is that a FAT fs should cache in such a way that the tradeoff between performance and safety is acceptable. But this is a matter of dealing sensibly and appropriately with the data structures, not of imitating the worst aspects of another implementation. If you (potentially) make certain messes, then you ensure they can be cleaned up to the extent that redundancy in the structures permits this. (If they don't permit this very well, you may have made a bad tradeoff.) If existing recovery tools are partially inadequate, you supplement them. The aim isn't to ape DOS, make the same mistakes as DOS, or fail like DOS. The aim is good design; and the same considerations apply whether the fs is shared with DOS or not. If the algorithms end up similar for the same structures, that should be due to similar design tradeoffs, not DOS copying or emulation. DOS FAT failures (in totality) are not idiosyncratic; and even if they were, the "fix" is in supplementing recovery tools, not in a crippled fs design. -- Robert Nordier From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 17:42:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA21279 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:42:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [165.254.13.209]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA21272 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:42:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from ppp-082.etinc.com (ppp-082.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA27888; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:40:54 -0500 Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:40:54 -0500 Message-Id: <199602050140.UAA27888@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Matt Thomas From: dennis@etinc.com (dennis) Subject: Re: High speed Routing (was Re: Multi-Port Async Cards) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >In , you wrote: > >> That's right; and you can't add a 100Mbp/s port to a PC that will >> actually route that many packets for $134, or for any price. Reference >> the very interesting TCP performance tests at Usenix which showed that at >> Ethernet MTUs, Pentium boxes running TCP/IP over the loopback interface >> could only reach about 40Mb/s (this number went up if you increased the >> MTU ... the cost is in the packet processing, not the raw byte speed). > ># ifconfig lo0 mtu 1536 ># ./ttcp -f m -t -s -n 8192 0 >ttcp-t: buflen=8192, nbuf=8192, align=16384/0, port=5001 tcp -> 0 >ttcp-t: socket >ttcp-t: connect >ttcp-t: 67108864 bytes in 7.61 real seconds = 67.24 Mbit/sec +++ >ttcp-t: 8192 I/O calls, msec/call = 0.95, calls/sec = 1075.83 >ttcp-t: 0.0user 4.1sys 0:07real 55% 26i+263d 250maxrss 0+2pf 1330+4920csw > >I just did that on my P90 (running 2.1.0-RELEASE) using the loopback device >and an Ethernet MTU. That seems to be a bit more that 40Mb/s. > >However, I do agree that FreeBSD as it is today is not suitable as a high >speed router. While the system does have the raw processing power to do >high-speed routing, the network infrastructure is not up to the task. >Not surprisingly (given its history), the IP networking code is heavily >oriented to being a host, not a router. Depends on what you mean by "high speed routing". When you figure the cost of a Cisco 4500 with 4 or 6 T1 ports and a lot of ram and a 10 or 100Mbs interface....freebsd boxes do just fine in this scenario. As with most hardware architectures, there is a point of density where is become unsuitable. But its at a point that is higher than the majority of requirements. For T1 to T1 or T1 to LAN switching it is just fine. As fast or faster than much of what is being used. Certainly it can't compete with "backplane optimized routers"....but there are a few million routers out there that are not as fast as FreeBSD can be. dennis ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Emerging Technologies, Inc. http://www.etinc.com Synchronous Communications Cards and Routers For Discriminating Tastes. 56k to T1 and beyond. Frame Relay, PPP, HDLC, and X.25 for BSD/OS, FreeBSD and LINUX From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 17:43:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA21381 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:43:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [165.254.13.209]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA21371 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:43:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from ppp-082.etinc.com (ppp-082.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA27896 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:44:04 -0500 Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:44:04 -0500 Message-Id: <199602050144.UAA27896@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: hackers@freebsd.org From: dennis@etinc.com (dennis) Subject: Re: Watchdog timer Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> [14]Terry Lambert writes... >> [14]** ISA MUST DIE. THIS IS NON-NEGOTIABLE. ** >> >> I have been reading the "build a watchdog timer board" thread with detached >> interest, and I thought this statement was extremely funny, and made >> me decide to respond. >> >> By going to PCI, you will ADD for a small-volume board (<1K units) >> roughly $40 per board JUST for the PCI, both for fabrication, electronics >> and mechanical packaging. Those PCI chipsets aren't cheap in low >> volumes, and the packges they come in eliminate do-it-yourself >> manufacturing. > >So let's all chip in $40 toward the death of PCI. 8-). boy is this a typo or what! db ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Emerging Technologies, Inc. http://www.etinc.com Synchronous Communications Cards and Routers For Discriminating Tastes. 56k to T1 and beyond. Frame Relay, PPP, HDLC, and X.25 for BSD/OS, FreeBSD and LINUX From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 17:49:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA21670 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:49:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA21662 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:49:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id CAA12912; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:49:39 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id CAA05223; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:49:39 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id CAA02607; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:23:55 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602050123.CAA02607@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: scrappy@ki.net (Marc G. Fournier) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:23:55 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from "Marc G. Fournier" at Feb 4, 96 02:08:12 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk As Marc G. Fournier wrote: > > When I tried to install, it newfs'd 3 partitions, then got the above error > on the 4th (you could hear the drive powerdown) and then when it went to > the 5th, you could hear it power up again, and it newfs'd it and the 6th > properly again. > The drive is: > > (aha0:0:0): "CONNER CFP1060S 1.05GB 243F" type 0 fixed SCSI 2 > sd0(aha0:0:0): Direct-Access 1013MB (2074880 512 byte sectors) > > Are there any known problems with this drive? Anything I should > have jumpered that isn't? Settings on the controller that I've missed? The problems you are describing are of some other nature, trust me. I've also got this kind of problems occasionally, and last time, i've been suspicous about the drive, too. It turned out to be a weak power connector, my box is full of Y-cables... <:) Try the drive with a totally different power supply. Maybe your power supply has too many spikes on the DC (possibly even R.F. spikes, use an oscilloscope if you can). Make absolutely sure that your drive does _NOT_ supply term power to the bus. Let the controller do this, not the drive. (Normally, the only problem with this is if a controller supplies +5 V for passive termination, and a drive supplies +2.85 V for active termination, but you never know for sure. Remove the jumper if there is any.) Some drives don't like to be grounded. Try it without connecting the metallic case to ground. Finally, if the drive overheats, it usually also turns down. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 17:49:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA21710 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:49:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA21680 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:49:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id CAA12920 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:49:42 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id CAA05225 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:49:42 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id CAA02662 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:30:52 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602050130.CAA02662@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:30:51 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602042103.QAA12434@hda.com> from "Peter Dufault" at Feb 4, 96 04:03:28 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Peter Dufault wrote: > It looks like Joerg is closer than me on this one. It managed to format > the drive fine yet sometimes spins down when fully closed? > > I don't suppose the "allow removal" in the driver is causing this think to > spin down? I appears the "start unit" is getting it to spin up again. I still believe this is a hardware problem, not software. If the drive would support automatic powerdown, it could respond with ``Logical unit is in the process of becoming ready'', and the normal retries should suffice. ``Not ready'' usually means the drive doesn't even think about turning up again. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 17:50:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA21774 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:50:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA21730 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:49:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id CAA12933 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:49:50 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id CAA05229 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:49:49 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id CAA02717 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:35:36 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602050135.CAA02717@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:35:35 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602042218.XAA19281@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 4, 96 11:18:18 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > This would only shift the problem from the msdosfs code into the > > various device drivers. > > Well, let me first say that I don't know exactly how mmapping files > works internally. But what I expect is to have the kernel do its > best to keep blocks in core and write them back (if necessary) when > the file is unmapped. That is also true for any regular file. If you wanna improve the FAT file system implementation, first study its bottlenecks. The msdosfs code could certainly be improved in terms of robustness and performance. Since it's kernel-level, it has full control over what kind of buffers it will allocate, either pageable or non-pageable. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 18:18:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA22885 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 18:18:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA22879 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 18:17:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id MAA14828; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 12:59:04 -0700 Message-Id: <199602041959.MAA14828@rover.village.org> Subject: Re: Another Pentium gcc patch, -D__FreeBSD__=2 -Dbsd4_4 To: Heikki Suonsivu , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Sun, 04 Feb 1996 09:25:20 MST Date: Sun, 04 Feb 1996 12:59:04 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : : All this is completely broken, BSD systems should converge, not further : : split up, as splitting up means disappearing into noise generated by Linux : : and big commercial ones. : : FreeBSD can't do it alone. Not can we do it w/o the cooperation of : all the BSD systems out there. I was a bit harsh on my initial reply. I found the wording incredibaly offensive to me because I have spent the last several years porting different software to different platforms. I found it insanely arrogant for you to presume to know what platforms that I have used, so I reacted with much bile. My applogies if it was a bit much. BSD does have a standard way of doing things. It is relatively easy to do. Most, if not all, of the Unix platforms provide sys/param.h. It is easy to have code that looks like #ifdef unix #include #endif #ifdef BSD4_4 /* Do blah #endif "unix" is defined on all the BSD systems that I'm aware of. In the commercial porting I've done (both OI and later TIA), on all systems where it is defined, sys/param.h was present. We were able to use this to bring OI to the Windows NT API (well, the Win32 flavour de jour) because it didn't define unix. Unix typically isn't defined on platforms that aren't unixlike enough to have sys/param.h. Heck, VMS even has this include (but it doesn't define unix, typically). If you want, I'll give you a list of all the platforms that OI and/or TIA has been ported to, and they both use this trick. It is too late to do anything "standard" with "one true define" for BSD systems because there are too many of them. There are those built by Sun, HP (kinda), FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, Digitial, etc. Most of them are, at this point, legacy systems that cannot change. Unless/until you can get a consensus amount the various flavors of BSD that exist today, a single "one true flag" will not happen. Also, all of the *BSD people don't have congruent goals. The {Net,Open}BSD people want to have their system on as many different disparate platforms as possible and have gone to great lengths to do that. FreeBSD has traditionally been a i386 only platform. Over time, the goals of the groups are changing... It is likely too late to get all of these folk, plus BSDi, to agree to something that isn't in BSD 4.4 lite. bsd4_4 is defined, in gcc at least, only on the mips-dec-bsd platform and nowhere else. Since there are some FreeBSD isms that do need the __FreeBSD__ for various things, it is the right way to do this. Again, sorry for the excess bile in hackers... Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 19:11:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA25346 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:11:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw.ast.com (fw.ast.com [165.164.6.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA25339 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:11:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from nemesis by fw.ast.com with uucp (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tjHIo-000859C; Sun, 4 Feb 96 21:09 CST Received: by nemesis.lonestar.org (Smail3.1.27.1 #20) id m0tjHBc-000CEsC; Sun, 4 Feb 96 21:01 WET Message-Id: Date: Sun, 4 Feb 96 21:01 WET To: hackers@freebsd.org From: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Sent: Sun Feb 4 1996, 21:01:48 CST Subject: Re: Watchdog timer Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk [15]By going to PCI, you will ADD for a small-volume board (<1K units) [15]roughly $40 per board JUST for the PCI, both for fabrication, electronics [15]and mechanical packaging. Those PCI chipsets aren't cheap in low [15]volumes, and the packges they come in eliminate do-it-yourself [15]manufacturing. [16]I note that you assume small scale manufacturing in the PCI numbers, but: [15]If you go back to the original task of this "device", which was to somehow [15]monitor the lifesigns of a PC and if there are none for a certain [15]amount of time, RESET the machine, and perhaps if that doesn't work, [15]cycle power on the machine too, a board (even an external box) could be [15]built in small volumes (100 to 500 pieces) to do this job and sold for a [15]reasonable return for around $30US. ($50 for power cycling) [16]You assume large scale manufacturing in the reset board numbers. Uh, less than 1K pieces is "small" and 100 to 500 pieces is also "small". I see no large scale manufacturing here. [16]I really find the idea of using the controller activity light as a [16]timer reset mechanism *very* interesting. Thanks. It is the way I visually check for local systems being down. It seems the IDE light is on solid when several of the machines just decide to lock up. The device would be looking for transitions on these lines, so if it was stuck on or off, it would still trigger a reset. The point of this simple testing mechanism was to provide the necessary functionality at a price that would generate enough volumes to have the board designed and do enough panels to pay for the drill programming and other associated charges in making the actual PCBs. The first five hundred or so are the most expensive. I have done a "100" unit build before and a run that short is really expensive. It hard to recover the board manufacturing costs. [16]I also really, really like the idea of a card edge connector with [16](for instance) a phone jack externally and two cable and two [16]replacement cables for the disk activity lights, and presumably, [16]two connectors for the existing disk activity lights to connect [16]to. I would not use a RJ11 to avoid running into Part 68 issues (and the extremely dreaded German telephone rules which hate RJ11 connectors used for anything other than telephones. I felt that two 1/8" stereo headphone jacks would be best. The main reason is that the RESET cable must be shielded. Too many main logic chip sets (particularly some from Intel such as Neptune and early Triton) are extremely sensitive to noise on the RESET line and I don't want it to trigger just because of what someone wraps the cable around something bad on the inside or the outside of the computer chassis. A second reason for using stereo jacks is that they can be mounted to a metal spine without a supporting circuit board, unlike a RJ11 jack which must be mounted to something. I'd also use only Tip and Ring (not sleeve) so that there would be no potential for shorting RESET or the activity light to the frame at the spine/connector. The Frame/spine would provide the sleeve/shield ground and be unterminated at the external box. I'd probably use a dual-polarity opto for the RESET line, or a low-noise relay, since some PC designs use pull-down and others use pull-up reset controls. We need to keep that circuit isolated and polarity independent. Same with the signal from the drive activity light. It must be isolated since there is no guarantee that we have common ground references between the light and reset signals and our power source. Even with an internal solution, I would still put a stereo jack on the back of the chassis that could trigger an external relay for cutting power to the computer for forced power resets. Again, only tip and ring would be used to maintain isolation. A small battery would be required on internal solutions that cycle power. [16]Actually, you should be able to use a riser socket, like the original [16]8086 "clocks" used and plug into the CPU slot or something else as [16]a molded plastic part with a socket on top and a male counterpart [16]on the bottom (my riser idea). Risers/pass-thrus on BIOS ROM sockets are completely evil for several reasons and I can speak with complete authority on this, having tried to sell products that relied on these little suckers. 1. Some systems do not have the vertical clearance, even if the lowest-profile components are used. 2. Male DIP socket pins are expensive and have to be manually soldered. Thus two-passes of solder work. 3. Not every MLB has the same BIOS package: DIP, PLCC, LCC, etc. 4. Some systems have BIOS ROMs with 16 bit organizations rather then 8. 5. New MLBs even solder the flash part to the board. 6. People get the things plugged-in off position in any of the package types and blow things out. They can't see under the board to get good alignment. 7. Unless you happen to know that the designer or the MLB brought more address lines than needed to the package, you have no additional address space decoding, so you must do something messy such as what SmartWatch does: look for a sequence of accesses on the address lines, and when you get a match, take over all or part of the address space. This adds a lot of complexity to the pass-thru design. If the reason for using one of these is to provide replacement BIOS routines then why not do it by having a plug-in board with BIOS mapped on a 2K boundary somewhere betwen 640K and 1Meg and get it over with? This will be a lot cheaper to make and you can guarantee that it will actually plug into any PC computer you come across. Riser cards will never reach this level of compatibility. [15]buying audience for what is already a low-volume device, since a lot of new [15]machines only come with one or two PCI slots, and it seems we can [15]demonstrate that a lot of FreeBSD users (and potential buyers of this [15]gadget) don't have PCI slots at all or they are full. [16]Actually, most machines are 3 slots, and that's because of line driver [16]limitations in the early chips. Look at any of the "consumer" or "SOHO" grade computers on the market today from any of the top ten makers. You will find 2 PCI the norm and 3 to be almost unheard of except at the very high-end. If you limit yourself to only systems that people put together themselves or the highest of the high-end, the volume for such a product falls too low. [16]There are many boards in Computer Shopper now that are 4 slot boards [16](and have been since October 1995). I agree, but most pre-built machines in the retail channel have two slots or less. [16]I don't run any large service sites, which I see as your primary [16]market. But I do know people who do run large service sites, and [16]they would be interested in the tiny board with the reset button and [16]disk activity light -- it would be damn cheap, and it would be [16]applicable across a wide variety of hardware. The biggest win is that [16]there is no real device driver work, so it's applicable to any OS: [16]BSD, Linux, SCO, UbixWare, Solaris, etc.. Well, that was the idea. (Attention, this publication should be considered to be Prior Art, so no naughty patenting this technique, OK?) The moment you clog a design up with a bunch of extra things that only a few people want, no one is interested in it anymore. You can make the design so that the extras can be optionally stuffed, but that increases the basic design and board drill cost. Each hole and via in the board increases the cost. [16]If you could package it in such a way as to not have it "floating around" [16]in the case, I think you have a winner. Probably a patch of 3M double-stick pad, the thing they used to use to stick AUI converters or AppleTalk interfaces to the back of the computer would be the easiest way to do it for most computers. Cable ties would be needed for use in internal chassis solutions where the design is wire-frame and there are no solid surfaces to stick the thing to. Personally, the better solution is external since out there you can control power and that would be helpful for "extremely stuck" systems, and would let you leverage the ability to control power on more than one computer or external modems, etc. Frank Durda IV |"I'll huff and I'll puff or uhclem%nemesis@rwsystr.nkn.net | and I'll get promoted." ^------(this is the fastest route)| - Old management saying. or ...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem | (C) 1984 FDIV. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 19:30:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA26724 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:30:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from hq.icb.chel.su (icb-rich-gw.icb.chel.su [193.125.10.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA26668 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:29:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (babkin@localhost) by hq.icb.chel.su (8.6.5/8.6.5) id IAA23078; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:28:43 +0500 From: "Serge A. Babkin" Message-Id: <199602050328.IAA23078@hq.icb.chel.su> Subject: Re: ep driver To: alexis@unicorn.ww.net (Alexis Yushin) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:28:42 +0500 (GMT+0500) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602021211.PAA04848@unicorn.ww.net> from "Alexis Yushin" at Feb 2, 96 03:11:18 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Salut, > > Could someone explain when a message like 'ep0: Status: 2002' > occurs, that is what the status 2002 means for 3COM 3c5x9 means? It means "input buffer overflow". There exists a patch that changes this message with more meaningful one (along with other improvements :-) ) but it's still not commited. -SB From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 19:34:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA27072 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:34:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA27060 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:34:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id NAA05913; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:16:01 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602050246.NAA05913@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: scrappy@ki.net (Marc G. Fournier) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:16:00 +1030 (CST) Cc: j@uriah.heep.sax.de, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Marc G. Fournier" at Feb 4, 96 02:08:12 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Marc G. Fournier stands accused of saying: > > When I tried to install, it newfs'd 3 partitions, then got the above error > on the 4th (you could hear the drive powerdown) and then when it went to > the 5th, you could hear it power up again, and it newfs'd it and the 6th > properly again. Aiee! Unless you have a faulty power connector, _send_it_back_ right now. If it's spinning down the drive is sure it has a _serious_ problem. > (aha0:0:0): "CONNER CFP1060S 1.05GB 243F" type 0 fixed SCSI 2 > sd0(aha0:0:0): Direct-Access 1013MB (2074880 512 byte sectors) > > Are there any known problems with this drive? Anything I should > have jumpered that isn't? Settings on the controller that I've missed? Some firmware revisions of this drive have problems with large read/write operations. I'd suggest searching the list archives... > Marc G. Fournier | POP Mail Telnet Acct DNS Hosting -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 19:59:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA28289 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:59:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw.ast.com (fw.ast.com [165.164.6.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA28280 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 19:59:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from nemesis by fw.ast.com with uucp (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tjI0Q-000859C; Sun, 4 Feb 96 21:54 CST Received: by nemesis.lonestar.org (Smail3.1.27.1 #20) id m0tjHnY-000CFIC; Sun, 4 Feb 96 21:41 WET Message-Id: Date: Sun, 4 Feb 96 21:41 WET To: hackers@freebsd.org From: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Sent: Sun Feb 4 1996, 21:41:00 CST Subject: Re: Watchdog timer Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk [15]As an example for a simple system: in the external model, you would simply [15]provide a chassis spine (those metal things on the ends of cards) with [15]two plugs. Inside, you would connect one cable to the RESET connector on [15]the MLB, and the other to either the SCSI activity light or the IDE [15]activity light connector on the MLB or SCSI/IDE card. [18]Michael Smith writes: [18]Dang. This is a very neat idea (hits self). Thank you. (Takes an Asparagus bow.) [15]Externally, the cables (shielded) would be run to the monitoring box, where [15]a couple of properly tuned NE555 timers would do an excellent job of [18]Hmm. I'd do this internally, presuming that resetting would be enough. [18]It's not actually as simple as you make it sound though; you need a [18]missing-pulse detector (consider the situation where the disk light stays [18]on) and a timer that runs for longer than the 100-second maximum for the [18]555. Two things: first, you must assume that if the activity light stays on for the maximum amount of time, this is a crash. I have several systems that crash from time to time and they can be spotted visually because the IDE access light is stuck on. No panic, just off in la-la land but the IDE light is on solid. The timer, however implemented, must re-arm on rising or falling edge transitions (doesn't have to be both), not on levels to avoid ignoring crashes while disk access was still in progress and not completed. Note that on the IDE interfaces and Adaptec SCSI interfaces I have used, the activity light is illuminated and then de-illuminated for each access although it may appear to be constantly on. The circuit will be fast enough to spot these transitions. Someone should check NCR and other SCSI brands to see if they have similar behavior. Another way to use the same technique is to access a particular drives' activity light, since most large 3.5" drives provide a header for an external LED, in case the one on the drive will not be visible, ie it is installed in a 5.25" bracket. This would let you see the "blinks" for that one drive. Of course, you would have to make sure the daemon tickled that particular drive, but the rest of the principle is the same. [15]Power would come from a wall adapter. If one timer expires and generates [15]a RESET and things go dead again, a second and much longer timer (five [15]to ten minutes) could cycle a relay and kill power to the computer chassis [15]for ten seconds or so, and then let things reboot. [18]This (the power cycling) would add significantly to the cost of the unit; [18]consider a 15A relay and the extra wiring involved in terms of assembly [18]cost. No doubt, and the pricing I mentioned reflects this. Probably I would simply buy load control modules which several companies make. They are meant for traffic control signal applications. They just look for 5V and activate a load, usually using a 10A solid state relay which will handle the inductive load of a switching power supply just fine. Controlling power is clearly not a feature for everybody, but is something that can be easily added or not added since there are so few components and drill-outs involved in the delta. I would probably use it in important systems that aren't staffed 24 hours a day. Frank Durda IV |"If you say bad things about or uhclem%nemesis@rwsystr.nkn.net | them, they will try to get ^------(this is the fastest route)| you. They come from the or ...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem | Death Star." From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 20:11:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA28710 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:11:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from hq.icb.chel.su (icb-rich-gw.icb.chel.su [193.125.10.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA28647 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:09:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (babkin@localhost) by hq.icb.chel.su (8.6.5/8.6.5) id IAA24118; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:50:20 +0500 From: "Serge A. Babkin" Message-Id: <199602050350.IAA24118@hq.icb.chel.su> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:50:19 +0500 (GMT+0500) Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602042148.OAA06143@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 4, 96 02:48:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > We use FAT filesystems both in the kernel, and in mtools. > > For the latter, I thought there was a quick fix to the problem of > > caching the FAT: just mmap the device, and the kernel will do caching > > for you. Well, it does not look that simple, as the vast majority of > > raw devices does not support mmap. > > > > I am wondering: how hard would it be to add mmap() to, say, wd.c ? > > Would it have other useful applications ? > > This would be useful for mtools, but not for the kernel version of FAT. > > The FAT-caching in the MACH implementation (you *could* just port the > MACH code...) takes a significant amount of memory, IMO. Hmm... FAT can contain at most 64K of entries, each 2 bytes long, so the needed amount of memory (if you cache raw FAT and don't try to make any ``cooked'' version) must be at most 128Kbytes long. IMHO the raw FAT is enough convenient ant takes not very much of memory. -SB From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 20:22:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA29125 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:22:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from nightflight.com (nightflight.com [205.162.141.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA29120 Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:22:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from laptop.nightflight (laptop [205.162.141.3]) by nightflight.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA04885; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:28:27 -0800 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19960205042455.0067d3fc@nightflight.com> X-Sender: gcrutchr@nightflight.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 04 Feb 1996 20:24:55 -0800 To: questions@freebsd.org From: Gary Crutcher Subject: telnet question Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I have occasionally have a telnet session stop displaying characters. It only occurs if I do man , and while viewing the manpages, press CTRL-C to exit. From that point on telnet works, but no chars display. Any ideas of what the problem might be? Gary ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Gary Crutcher email: gcrutchr@nightflight.com Webmaster URL: http://www.nightflight.com 'Flights throughout the Internet' Voice/FAX: 619-631-7885 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 20:28:42 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA29485 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:28:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA29480 Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:28:38 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602050428.UAA29480@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: "Serge A. Babkin" cc: alexis@unicorn.ww.net (Alexis Yushin), hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ep driver In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 08:28:42 +0500." <199602050328.IAA23078@hq.icb.chel.su> Date: Sun, 04 Feb 1996 20:28:37 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> >> >> Salut, >> >> Could someone explain when a message like 'ep0: Status: 2002' >> occurs, that is what the status 2002 means for 3COM 3c5x9 means? > >It means "input buffer overflow". There exists a patch that changes this >message with more meaningful one (along with other improvements :-) ) but it's >still not commited. > >-SB It went into -current a week ago. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 20:33:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA29717 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:33:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA29710 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:33:14 -0800 (PST) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id PAA27801; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:26:18 +1100 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:26:18 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199602050426.PAA27801@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: bde@zeta.org.au, gibbs@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Watchdog timers (was: Re: Multi-Port Async Cards) Cc: curt@emergent.com, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, jgreco@brasil.moneng.mei.com Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>I thought -current would be much better with -o async. However: >> >>FreeBSD-current - 486DX2/66 - 16MB RAM (BT445C Quantum Grand Prix drive, >>1/3 full 1G fs) >>(too-small buffer cache (nbuf = 247) + vm buffers that I don't understand) >> >>10000 files in 468 seconds - first run >> 467.76 real 0.87 user 17.19 sys (time /tmp/prog) >> 0.33 real 0.01 user 0.03 sys (time sync) >>10000 files in 295 seconds - second run >> 295.34 real 0.87 user 12.86 sys (time /tmp/prog) >> 0.33 real 0.02 user 0.02 sys (time sync) >Yes, but this is not exactly fair. Your SCSI controller only has 5 times >the command overhead as your IDE card (because you have a very poor SCSI >controller). [The Minix-1.6.25++ - 486DX/33 - 8MB RAM (slow IDE controller, slow IDE drive, fresh 137MB fs) are about 17 seconds for the first run and 12 seconds for the second run.] Should I upgrade to a ST01 controller? ;-) The controller overhead was almost irrelevant for the Minix-IDE setup because the disk activity LED only blinked on for a second or two out of the 17 seconds. For FreeBSD the disk LED was on for about 468 seconds out of 468. Joe's time of "only" a couple of hundred seconds for the first run may be due to lower command overhead. >I'd like to see the performance difference on the same >hardware. FreeBSD-current - 486DX/33 - 8MB RAM (slow IDE controller, slow IDE drive, fresh 137MB fs in same partition as for Minix): -o async: 10000 files in 662 seconds - first run 662.13 real 1.60 user 24.56 sys 0.56 real 0.01 user 0.05 sys 10000 files in 407 seconds - second run 406.91 real 1.38 user 17.39 sys 0.26 real 0.01 user 0.03 sys $ time find . >/dev/null 18.07 real 0.86 user 1.81 sys $ time find . >/dev/null 19.62 real 0.87 user 1.85 sys $ time du >/dev/null 39.35 real 1.22 user 6.50 sys $ time du >/dev/null 38.16 real 1.11 user 6.48 sys $ time rm -rf * 45.27 real 0.81 user 10.41 sys sync: 10000 files in 939 seconds - first run 939.37 real 1.50 user 33.07 sys 0.39 real 0.02 user 0.03 sys `find .' and `du': similar to above. $ time rm -rf * 256.36 real 0.93 user 16.43 sys It's surprising how many sync writes there are for async mounted file systems. I zapped the one that seemed to be the most common: --- *** /sys/ufs/ufs/ufs_readwrite.c~ Sat Jan 20 06:57:41 1996 --- /sys/ufs/ufs/ufs_readwrite.c Mon Feb 5 14:10:03 1996 *************** *** 284,288 **** if (ioflag & IO_SYNC) { ! (void)bwrite(bp); } else if (xfersize + blkoffset == fs->fs_bsize) { if (doclusterwrite) { --- 287,295 ---- if (ioflag & IO_SYNC) { ! if (vp->v_mount->mnt_flag & MNT_ASYNC) ! bdwrite(bp); ! else ! (void)bwrite(bp); ! /* XXX write-through when the block fills up is sloooow. */ } else if (xfersize + blkoffset == fs->fs_bsize) { if (doclusterwrite) { --- but this only improved the time from 662 seconds to 633 seconds. Don't try this change if you value your async mounted file systems - it's too late to check the MNT_ASYNC flag here since i/o to async-mounted file systems must be synchronous for at least the fsync() system call. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 20:42:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA00261 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:42:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA00256 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:42:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id UAA01155 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 20:42:30 -0800 Message-Id: <199602050442.UAA01155@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FreeBSD Infomercial ? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 04 Feb 1996 20:42:29 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, Now that we have cool video on Freebsd. I was thinking that it is time to put together a nice plain ol' fun movie. By any stretch of the imagination am I director;however, I am very certain that some in the group either have access to such talents or by themselves are talented. Maybe some cool shots of one your activities. I know for instance, that some you jump of airplanes . I would love to have a shot of someone jumping out with a parachute as the introduction 8) The final cut of the movie we will probably turn into an mpeg movie. Tnks! Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 21:12:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA01955 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 21:12:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA01714 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 21:10:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA06529; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:52:27 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602050522.PAA06529@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Watchdog timer To: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:52:26 +1030 (CST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Frank Durda IV" at Feb 4, 96 09:41:00 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Frank Durda IV stands accused of saying: > [18]Hmm. I'd do this internally, presuming that resetting would be enough. > [18]It's not actually as simple as you make it sound though; you need a > [18]missing-pulse detector (consider the situation where the disk light stays > [18]on) and a timer that runs for longer than the 100-second maximum for the > [18]555. > > Two things: first, you must assume that if the activity light stays > on for the maximum amount of time, this is a crash. I have several > systems that crash from time to time and they can be spotted visually > because the IDE access light is stuck on. No panic, just off in la-la > land but the IDE light is on solid. The timer, however implemented, > must re-arm on rising or falling edge transitions (doesn't have to be both), > not on levels to avoid ignoring crashes while disk access was > still in progress and not completed. Assuming you're using an opto for the input (common sense), this requires two resistors, a capacitor and a diode. A nuisance to load, admittedly, but not hard to implement, and an absolute must. (Really an edge detector rather than a missing-pulse detector) > [18]This (the power cycling) would add significantly to the cost of the unit; > [18]consider a 15A relay and the extra wiring involved in terms of assembly > [18]cost. > > No doubt, and the pricing I mentioned reflects this. Probably I would > simply buy load control modules which several companies make. They are > meant for traffic control signal applications. They just look for 5V > and activate a load, usually using a 10A solid state relay which will > handle the inductive load of a switching power supply just fine. Er, I beg to vary, if not differ here. Switching power supplies have very nasty dV/dt characteristics, which quickly runs you into the more expensive SSRs. These don't compare terribly favourably cost-wise with 12V coil DPST 15A line relays, but do have the advantage of requiring less in the way of support parts. > Controlling power is clearly not a feature for everybody, but is something > that can be easily added or not added since there are so few components > and drill-outs involved in the delta. I would probably use it in > important systems that aren't staffed 24 hours a day. Certainly supporting an external power-tripping relay would be desirable. You mentioned FCC rules regarding oscillators; how fast does the osc. have to be before they get in a tizz? (eg. consider a 74HC4060 at 5Hz or so) > Frank Durda IV |"If you say bad things about -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 21:39:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA03461 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 21:39:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from hq.icb.chel.su (icb-rich-gw.icb.chel.su [193.125.10.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA03437 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 21:38:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (babkin@localhost) by hq.icb.chel.su (8.6.5/8.6.5) id KAA29528; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:34:48 +0500 From: "Serge A. Babkin" Message-Id: <199602050534.KAA29528@hq.icb.chel.su> Subject: Re: ep driver To: gibbs@freefall.FreeBSD.ORG (Justin T. Gibbs) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:34:48 +0500 (GMT+0500) Cc: alexis@unicorn.ww.net, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602050428.UAA29480@freefall.freebsd.org> from "Justin T. Gibbs" at Feb 4, 96 08:28:37 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > >> > >> > >> Salut, > >> > >> Could someone explain when a message like 'ep0: Status: 2002' > >> occurs, that is what the status 2002 means for 3COM 3c5x9 means? > > > >It means "input buffer overflow". There exists a patch that changes this > >message with more meaningful one (along with other improvements :-) ) but it's > >still not commited. > > > >-SB > > It went into -current a week ago. It's GREAT !!! :-) Thanks ! The only thing to make ep driver from -current working is to enable its epwatchdog() routine: add "ifp->if_timer = 1;" after " "ifp->if_watchdog = epwatchdog;" The reason why David Greenman has disabled it is that he throught that epwarchdog() restes the card. But really it does not reset it. -SB From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 22:17:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA05148 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 22:17:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from eac.iafrica.com (slipper119226.iafrica.com [196.7.119.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA05141 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 22:17:42 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rnordier@localhost) by eac.iafrica.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA03554 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:16:28 +0200 From: Robert Nordier Message-Id: <199602050616.IAA03554@eac.iafrica.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:16:27 +0200 (SAT) In-Reply-To: <199602050350.IAA24118@hq.icb.chel.su> from "Serge A. Babkin" at Feb 5, 96 08:50:19 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Jan 1996, Serge A. Babkin wrote: > > The FAT-caching in the MACH implementation (you *could* just port the > > MACH code...) takes a significant amount of memory, IMO. > > Hmm... FAT can contain at most 64K of entries, each 2 bytes long, so > the needed amount of memory (if you cache raw FAT and don't try to make > any ``cooked'' version) must be at most 128Kbytes long. IMHO the raw FAT > is enough convenient ant takes not very much of memory. Agreed. This is what the original author of the MS-DOS filesystem had to say on the subject of caching: The new MS-DOS [ie. DOS 2.0] does not keep the file allocation tables in memory at all times. Instead the tables share the use of sector buffers.... This change in the DOS goes completely against my original design principles.... Now we're back to doing disk reads just to find out where the data is. -- Tim Paterson, Byte, June 1983. -- Robert Nordier From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 22:27:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA05704 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 22:27:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA05698 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 22:27:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA01976 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 22:27:26 -0800 Message-Id: <199602050627.WAA01976@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: cyberspace 24 and FreeBSD Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 04 Feb 1996 22:27:25 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello, This is a cool opportunity to let people know about FreeBSD . For more information , see: http://www.cyber24.com/ Enjoy, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 22:42:15 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA06364 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 22:42:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA06352 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 22:42:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id HAA14085 ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:42:03 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id HAA15363 ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:41:56 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.3/keltia-uucp-2.7) id BAA02626; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:35:15 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199602050035.BAA02626@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: Missing CTM-pieces To: nate@sri.MT.net (Nate Williams) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:35:15 +0100 (MET) Cc: rkw@dataplex.net, dirk@hal.in-berlin.de, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602042131.OAA29569@rocky.sri.MT.net> from "Nate Williams" at "Feb 4, 96 02:31:00 pm" X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1630 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL3 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Nate Williams said: > > One of my ctm users noticed that the top level Makefile was deleted from > > the tree on the CD when I made the initial update. I have tracked this to > > the fact that the cvs tree (as I get it from sup2) does not have the > > Hmm, $CVSROOT/src/Makefile,v exists on freefall, so I'm not sure what's > up. I've got it on my system, but I've been supping from freefall since > day one, so I can't answer that question very well. I have the CVS tree from day one also by the way of CTM and I still have the src/Makefile,v here. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #5: Sun Feb 4 03:11:17 MET 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 23:05:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA07517 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 23:05:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from unicorn.ww.net (crimea-gw.ww.net [193.124.73.254]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA07496 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 23:04:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (from alexis@localhost) by unicorn.ww.net (8.6.12/alexis 2.5) id KAA00381 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:04:49 +0300 Message-Id: <199602050704.KAA00381@unicorn.ww.net> Subject: Making serious use of FreeBSD... To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:04:48 +0300 (MSK) From: "Alexis Yushin" Reply-To: alexis@ww.net (Alexis Yushin) X-Office-Phone: +380 65 2 26.1410 X-Home-Phone: +380 65 2 27.0747 X-NIC-Handle: AY23 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Greetins, We currently run one of the major ISP for the Crimean peninsula on FreeBSD-2.1-RELEASE machines only and feel confident in this operating system. Still stability problems occurs sometimes and I would like to get freebsd-hackers input and suggestion on how to avoid them. The primary question is a FAQ, still not solved for sure: ``What FreeBSD version do I run and maintain to achieve maximal stability?'' Actually this is what -stable for, but it is not sufficient sometimes... As Jordan wrote one should have -current and -stable branches (ok, I already have them) to take the best parts from both of them. As far as I see -current is 2.2 already and -stable is 2.1. I expirienced much of the troubles with DigiBoard driver which handles all of my slip, ppp, uucp and terminal connections. (PLEASE don't tell me I need a hardware router, better buy me it on my birthday :-) There are a lot of problems in it, because of closed polici of Digi etc, along with incompatibility between -current and -stable. Do I switch my router to -current? Is -current expected to run more stable than -stable? Guess not, but I cannot see an easy way out... Another question is just estetical and almost of ``Is it ok?'' kind. We spoke of -stable and -current supporting, and what I have done: In the /src filesystem (1G) I made the following tree: /src/FreeBSD /src/FreeBSD/current /src/FreeBSD/stable /src/FreeBSD/sup The appropriate sup instances gets appropriate version into appropriate directories. :-) How do I have more than one version compiled simultaneously on one machine (one filesystem)? I could make current/obj and stable/obj directories but how do I tell each collection to compile into the appropriate places? And the last one is how do I determine where the most stable part is without experiencing myself on a hard-working system? alexis P.S. I reread this message I found it rather lamish... :-) Sorry, it must be too early in the morning... -- The more experienced you are the less people you can get advice from. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 23:30:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA08715 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 23:30:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA08709 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 23:30:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id IAA20098; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:30:27 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602050730.IAA20098@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:30:26 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602050135.CAA02717@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Feb 5, 96 02:35:16 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Well, let me first say that I don't know exactly how mmapping files > > works internally. But what I expect is to have the kernel do its > > best to keep blocks in core and write them back (if necessary) when > > the file is unmapped. > > That is also true for any regular file. I was talking about regular files. > If you wanna improve the FAT file system implementation, first study > its bottlenecks. The msdosfs code could certainly be improved in > terms of robustness and performance. Since it's kernel-level, it has > full control over what kind of buffers it will allocate, either > pageable or non-pageable. A high performance FAT filesystem is certainly useful, but it might require a lot of work. Given that some people is now looking at the stability of the FAT filesystem, I was trying to understand if there is something simple that can be done to improve performance at a reasonable cost. More thoughts on high performance FAT will follow in a separate message. Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 23:39:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA09214 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 23:39:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA09207 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 23:39:14 -0800 (PST) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id SAA02716; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 18:34:42 +1100 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 18:34:42 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199602050734.SAA02716@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hackers@freebsd.org, rnordier@iafrica.com Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> > The FAT-caching in the MACH implementation (you *could* just port the >> > MACH code...) takes a significant amount of memory, IMO. >> >> Hmm... FAT can contain at most 64K of entries, each 2 bytes long, so >> the needed amount of memory (if you cache raw FAT and don't try to make >> any ``cooked'' version) must be at most 128Kbytes long. IMHO the raw FAT >> is enough convenient ant takes not very much of memory. >Agreed. >This is what the original author of the MS-DOS filesystem had to say on >the subject of caching: > The new MS-DOS [ie. DOS 2.0] does not keep the file > allocation tables in memory at all times. Instead the > tables share the use of sector buffers.... This change > in the DOS goes completely against my original design > principles.... Now we're back to doing disk reads just > to find out where the data is. > -- Tim Paterson, Byte, June 1983. I wonder if he thought about maximal FATs with 64K * 1.5 byte entries. They would barely fit on a 160K floppy :-). 128K is quite small now, but it still isn't necessary to lock it into memory. Caching it in a normal LRU way should work reasonably well. Perhaps FAT buffers should have a higher priority than other buffers for msdosfs, but they probably shouldn't have higher priority than buffers for other file systems. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 4 23:41:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA09369 for hackers-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 23:41:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from sunset.ww.net (sunset.ww.net [193.124.73.41]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA09348 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 1996 23:41:41 -0800 (PST) Received: (from alexis@localhost) by sunset.ww.net (8.6.12/alexis 2.5) id KAA00529 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:40:16 +0300 Message-Id: <199602050740.KAA00529@sunset.ww.net> Subject: Can I run 2.2 kernel with 2.1-stable? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:40:16 +0300 (MSK) From: "Alexis Yushin" Reply-To: alexis@ww.net (Alexis Yushin) X-Office-Phone: +380 65 2 26.1410 X-Home-Phone: +380 65 2 27.0747 X-NIC-Handle: AY23 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Greetings, Will I get any prolem if I run kernel from 2.2 with 2.1 binaries? alexis -- The more experienced you are the less people you can get advice from. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 00:16:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA10602 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:16:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA10597 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:16:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id SAA07131; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 18:55:15 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602050825.SAA07131@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Making serious use of FreeBSD... To: alexis@ww.net Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 18:55:15 +1030 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602050704.KAA00381@unicorn.ww.net> from "Alexis Yushin" at Feb 5, 96 10:04:48 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Alexis Yushin stands accused of saying: > > The primary question is a FAQ, still not solved for sure: > ``What FreeBSD version do I run and maintain to achieve maximal > stability?'' Actually this is what -stable for, but it is not That's a tough one. I'd say 'take a release and patch it until it works for you' 8) Not so easy, I know. > Another question is just estetical and almost of ``Is it > ok?'' kind. We spoke of -stable and -current supporting, and what > I have done: > In the /src filesystem (1G) I made the following tree: > /src/FreeBSD > /src/FreeBSD/current > /src/FreeBSD/stable > /src/FreeBSD/sup > > The appropriate sup instances gets appropriate version into > appropriate directories. :-) How do I have more than one version > compiled simultaneously on one machine (one filesystem)? I could > make current/obj and stable/obj directories but how do I tell > each collection to compile into the appropriate places? Not easily. Whilst the directory structures keep out of each other's way, a world build will still clobber your standard libraries and includes. You really need two machines 8( > alexis -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 00:24:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA11045 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:24:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA11033 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:24:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id JAA20270 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:24:40 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602050824.JAA20270@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Some thoughts on FAT filesystems To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:24:40 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Since some people is now looking at the msdosfs, it is nice that the discussion on FAT has progressed a little bit. I'd like to contribute some more thoughts. In the following I assume that there are no concurrent accesses to the FAT partition. I believe that the performance of msdosfs can benefit from some caching of the FAT area. The FAT16 is by definition <= 128KB in size, which is not much if we want to keep it in memory. Avoiding synchronous writes to the FAT can also give some advantages, at the price of the ease of recovery in case of power failures. One performance problem with FAT filesystems is that the copies of the FAT all reside at the beginning of the partition, thus potentially far away from the data. Updating a file, and then the FAT, might require long seeks. FFS solves this problem by defining cyclinder groups, so that inodes and data blocks are not too far away. For a FAT filesystem, the only viable solution to this is to avoid synchronous writes to the FAT. This poses a recovery problem which can be solved in various ways, essentially by adding redundant information to the filesystem. In designing a high performance FAT one might try to use the same layout policies of the FFS, i.e divide the FAT partition into a number of logical "cylinder groups" (CG). Clusters in the CG are physically contiguous, and even the corresponding entries in the FAT are contiguous. Assuming a cluster size of 4K (which is nice because it has the same size as a page), then a 4K portion of the FAT suffices for 8MB of data. For efficiency, when the FS loads this FAT portion in memory (or at the first write) it could also build a "free list" of clusters in the CG, so as to speed up allocations. Also for efficiency, writes to the FAT should not be done too frequently, because of their cost. When creating new files, one should privilege locality within the CG, much like it is done in the FFS. Of course, when the CG fills up, or the disk is heavily fragmented (read: has been written by DOS) one might have to use blocks in different CGs. CACHING and WRITES: The caching policy might not be much different from that of FFS: try to keep in memory the FAT copies first, do not immediately go to the disk for data blocks as they might have a short lifetime, etc. RECOVERY: using delayed writes to the FAT might lead to bad inconsistencies to the filesystem in case of power failures. One possible approach could be the following: 1) create a "special" file in the root directory, with fixed size and structure. This file uses exactly one cluster per CG, say at the beginning of the CG, where the portion of the FAT for that CG is saved. Writing to this cluster is cheaper than writing to the FAT because of physical contiguity. Also, there is no risk of corruption of this file because its structure does not change, hence modifications to its content do not require changing the FAT or the directory entry (unless one wants to update the modification times; but this is not very important). 2) When the FS is updated, modifications to the FAT are written to this local FAT first, and then, at a convenient time, dumped to the ordinary FAT. 3) Recovery after a crash: first check for the existence of the "special" file, then look for inconsistencies between the regular FAT and this special file, and try to reconstruct things. Not many new ideas, as you can see, just trying to see if known technology can be reused. Luigi From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 00:39:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA11664 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:39:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA11657 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:39:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id JAA20312; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:37:22 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602050837.JAA20312@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:37:21 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, rnordier@iafrica.com In-Reply-To: <199602050734.SAA02716@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Feb 5, 96 06:34:23 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > 128K is quite small now, but it still isn't necessary to lock it into > memory. Caching it in a normal LRU way should work reasonably well. > Perhaps FAT buffers should have a higher priority than other buffers > for msdosfs, but they probably shouldn't have higher priority than > buffers for other file systems. agreed. That's why I thought not to develop a special purpose caching policy and try to rely on what is already available. Especally in FreeBSD, where the FS & VM caches are merged, and the system should be quite flexible. Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 00:45:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA11924 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:45:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA11919 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:45:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id AAA02771; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 00:44:34 -0800 Message-Id: <199602050844.AAA02771@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Marc van Kempen cc: Terry Lambert , jmb@freebsd.org (Jonathan M. Bresler), jkh@time.cdrom.com, dglo@SSEC.WISC.EDU, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Willows In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 03 Feb 1996 00:54:22 +0100." <199602022354.AAA18723@nietzsche.bowtie.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 00:44:30 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Any progress on Willows ?? Tnks, Amancio >>> Marc van Kempen said: > ... > > > > > > ya nearly got me there, terry. a mailing list for 3 soon to 5 > > > people, yuck, yuck, yuck. > > > > > > how about using chat till the list grows? seriously....chat is > > > very low volume. > > > > Or big CC lines, like this one... > > > > I just downloaded the sources, it compiles pretty far with some > more or less trivial patches. But I haven't looked at the hard > stuff yet. For example now it falls over ExecUtl.S, but I'm > not much of an assembler guy. Did anyone get any further? > > > Regards, > Marc. > > ---------------------------------------------------- > Marc van Kempen BowTie Technology > Email: marc@bowtie.nl WWW & Databases > tel. +31 40 2 43 20 65 > fax. +31 40 2 44 21 86 http://www.bowtie.nl > ---------------------------------------------------- > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 01:15:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA13209 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:15:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA13197 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:14:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tjMzn-0003wWC; Mon, 5 Feb 96 01:13 PST Received: from localhost.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA00346; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:12:40 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost.tfs.com didn't use HELO protocol To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: Marc van Kempen , Terry Lambert , jmb@freebsd.org (Jonathan M. Bresler), jkh@time.cdrom.com, dglo@SSEC.WISC.EDU, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Willows In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 00:44:30 PST." <199602050844.AAA02771@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 10:12:39 +0100 Message-ID: <344.823511559@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Any progress on Willows ?? What >IS< Willows ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 01:21:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA13664 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:21:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA13649 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:21:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id KAA22201 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:21:21 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA07717 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:21:20 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id KAA04319 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:10:33 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602050910.KAA04319@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:10:32 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602050246.NAA05913@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Feb 5, 96 01:16:00 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Michael Smith wrote: > > > Are there any known problems with this drive? Anything I should > > have jumpered that isn't? Settings on the controller that I've missed? > > Some firmware revisions of this drive have problems with large read/write > operations. I'd suggest searching the list archives... But at any rate, this should not cause the drive to spin down, don't you think? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 01:22:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA13691 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:22:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA13657 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:21:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id KAA22211; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:21:31 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA07726; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:21:30 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id KAA04348; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:14:21 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602050914.KAA04348@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: ep driver To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:14:20 +0100 (MET) Cc: babkin@hq.icb.chel.su (Serge A. Babkin), phk@freebsd.org (Poul-Henning Kamp) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602050328.IAA23078@hq.icb.chel.su> from "Serge A. Babkin" at Feb 5, 96 08:28:42 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Serge A. Babkin wrote: > > > Could someone explain when a message like 'ep0: Status: 2002' > > occurs, that is what the status 2002 means for 3COM 3c5x9 means? > > It means "input buffer overflow". Then, why don't you write this? ;) Magic numbers instead of error messages are confusing. We once also decided to put the SCSI sense information messages into the kernel (though it's #ifdef'ed for those picky enough about space -- hey Poul, yet another thing to spare for your 4 MB kernel!). I don't think this has been a mistake, the messages proved invaluable when answering sever people's questions (including my own :). -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 01:30:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA14092 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:30:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA14049 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:29:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id UAA07349; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:16:31 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602050946.UAA07349@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Willows To: phk@critter.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:16:31 +1030 (CST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <344.823511559@critter.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Feb 5, 96 10:12:39 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Poul-Henning Kamp stands accused of saying: > > > Any progress on Willows ?? > > What >IS< Willows ? Actually, it's "Willows' TWIN XPDK". It's a cross-development environment for porting Windows applications to Unix/X that just happens to offer ABI compatability. > Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 01:31:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA14168 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:31:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA14019 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:28:27 -0800 (PST) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA13670 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:30:17 +0100 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:30:17 +0100 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199602050930.KAA13670@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: xdm+X (2.1R) leaks? Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk I upgraded a 1.1.5.1R machine here over the weekend to 2.1.0-R (486/40, 8MB, IDE ,XF86/312/S3,20 MB root/27MB swap) and I put xdm into rc.local to start X automatically. This was on saturday noon. When I wanted to telnet/ftp into the machine 24 hours later I got connection (ping also worked) but the system was nearly unusable, that is, telnet and ftp never got to the login prompt. I tried to login at the local console to no avail. It seemed the machine was heavily paging out during my attempts to login. I did a hard reset after a couple of minutes. I suspect there being some memory leak either with X alone or when being running via xdm. Is that a known problem? --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 01:35:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA14384 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:35:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA14368 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:35:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id UAA07332; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:14:56 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602050944.UAA07332@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Willows To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty Jr.) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:14:55 +1030 (CST) Cc: marc@bowtie.nl, terry@lambert.org, jmb@freebsd.org, jkh@time.cdrom.com, dglo@SSEC.WISC.EDU, msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au, chuck@fang.cs.sunyit.edu, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602050844.AAA02771@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr." at Feb 5, 96 00:44:30 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Amancio Hasty Jr. stands accused of saying: > > > Any progress on Willows ?? There are some patches to make it compile (but not work yet 8) on time.throck.com; I believe we're waiting for the x86 gurus to solve the sysi86() issues before it will run native. > Amancio -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 01:50:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA15115 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:50:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA15106 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:49:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id EAA13984; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:44:38 -0500 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199602050944.EAA13984@hda.com> Subject: Re: Watchdog timer To: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:44:37 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Frank Durda IV" at Feb 4, 96 09:41:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > [18]This (the power cycling) would add significantly to the cost of the unit; > [18]consider a 15A relay and the extra wiring involved in terms of assembly > [18]cost. > Do any of the UPS vendors have auxiliary ports that will power cycle the unit? It seems as if they should. This would be appropriate for a small site with one critical machine on an UPS, and anyone needing this watch dog board will also have an UPS. For that matter, do any of the UPS vendors have a watchdog? That would make even more sense. Unimportant side note - the LED signal on a SCSI system will typically be SCSI busy, so a user daemon sending "test unit ready" will blink the light without reading off the disk . I missed a lot of this and started paying attention with Frank's clever idea, so this may already have been brought up and you are looking for low cost solutions: You can buy off the shelf watchdog boards. The only one I found in 5 minutes of looking is in Industrial Computer Supplies catalog: Software selectable timer watchdog with TTL out, adjustable temperature alarm, and optically isolated RS485/RS422 for $245.00. Add a relay for $295.00. Evidently the board dates back to before everything had COM ports on the motherboard. Let's pass on the price - if I actually need one right away for a project I'm glad I can just order it from an established vendor, and Packard Bell doesn't want this in their system. There is probably a cheaper one somewhere if you hunt around. Order 100 from Frank. -- Peter Dufault Real-Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 01:54:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA15438 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:54:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA15415 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:53:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id KAA23641; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:53:02 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA07834; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:53:01 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id KAA04620; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:45:21 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602050945.KAA04620@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: ep driver To: babkin@hq.icb.chel.su (Serge A. Babkin) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:45:20 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602050534.KAA29528@hq.icb.chel.su> from "Serge A. Babkin" at Feb 5, 96 10:34:48 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Serge A. Babkin wrote: > > >It means "input buffer overflow". There exists a patch that changes this ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > >message with more meaningful one ... ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > It went into -current a week ago. > > It's GREAT !!! :-) Sorry for my previous reply, i should not post too early in the morning. <:) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 01:55:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA15496 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:55:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA15460 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:54:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id KAA23632 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:53:00 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA07833 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:53:00 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id KAA04667 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:50:33 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602050950.KAA04667@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:50:32 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602050730.IAA20098@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 5, 96 08:30:26 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > That is also true for any regular file. > > I was talking about regular files. Sorry, it was too late in the night / too early in the morning... I meant that there's no big difference between read/write and mmap, except that you need one extra copy operation for read/write. The caching should be about the same. > A high performance FAT filesystem is certainly useful, but it might > require a lot of work. Yes, but we hardly need it. (Both, stability and performance improvement.) If the caching situation can cause errors, perhaps write an dosfsck(8) as well. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 01:55:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA15552 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:55:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA15538 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:55:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id KAA23196; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:51:39 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA07821; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:51:38 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id KAA04598; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:43:48 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602050943.KAA04598@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Watchdog timers (was: Re: Multi-Port Async Cards) To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:43:48 +0100 (MET) Cc: gibbs@freefall.freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602050426.PAA27801@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Feb 5, 96 03:26:18 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Bruce Evans wrote: > > >Yes, but this is not exactly fair. Your SCSI controller only has 5 times > >the command overhead as your IDE card (because you have a very poor SCSI > >controller). > Should I upgrade to a ST01 controller? ;-) The controller overhead was > almost irrelevant for the Minix-IDE setup because the disk activity LED > only blinked on for a second or two out of the 17 seconds. Jumping in a bit late here. I've got some piece of obsolete hardware where i can make a fair comparision if you want. (386/16, 5-year old ST1144A IDE drive vs. a nifty but flakey MXT-1280 SCSI drive hanging on an AHA-1540A.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 01:59:47 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA15751 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:59:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from sun4nl.NL.net (sun4nl.NL.net [193.78.240.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA15742 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 01:59:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from spase1 by sun4nl.NL.net via EUnet id AA19956 (5.65b/CWI-3.3); Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:59:38 +0100 Received: from phobos.spase.nl by spase.nl (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA26624; Mon, 5 Feb 96 10:50:38 GMT From: dutchman@spase.nl (Kees Jan Koster) Received: (dutchman@localhost) by phobos.spase.nl (8.6.11/8.6.11) id KAA00543 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:50:40 +0100 Message-Id: <199602050950.KAA00543@phobos.spase.nl> Subject: Solaris CacheFS for FreeBSD? To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD hackers Mailing list) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:50:39 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hoi, Some time ago I installed a sun workstation with a friend of mine. We found that sun has a special filesystem called CacheFS. It can cache remote filesystems (and CD-ROMS too, I think) on a local disk, thus reducing network load and increasing performance. Is there something like it under FreeBSD? Is there a quick-'n-dirty way to try it out and make some performance measurements? With the results I might persuade our sysop to trash linux and use FreeBSD instead ;) Groetjes, Kees Jan ======================================================================v== Kees Jan Koster e-mail: dutchman@spase.nl Van Somerenstraat 50 tel: NL-24-3234708 6521 BS Nijmegen the Netherlands ========================================================================= Who is this general Failure and why is he reading my disk? (anonymous) ========================================================================= From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 02:01:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA16008 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:01:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from sting.artisoft.com (sting.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA16003 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:01:50 -0800 (PST) Received: (from mday@localhost) by sting.artisoft.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) id DAA26813; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:01:28 -0700 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:01:28 -0700 From: Matt Day Message-Id: <199602051001.DAA26813@sting.artisoft.com> To: freebsd-bugs@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Bad bug in ffs_sync() & friends Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I think there is a very rare, yet fatal, bug in ffs_sync() in the -CURRENT code (and the -STABLE code, and NetBSD 1.1, etc...). This bug has occured twice on my system in the past 6 months. Consider this scenario: ffs_vget() calls getnewvnode(), and then calls MALLOC() to allocate memory for the incore inode. That MALLOC() blocks. While that MALLOC() is blocked, ffs_sync() gets called. ffs_sync() finds the vnode just set up by that getnewvnode() on the mnt_vnodelist (because getnewvnode() put it there) and proceeds to dereference vp->v_data by calling VOP_ISLOCKED(), but v_data is still zero because that MALLOC() blocked. It looks like this bug is lurking in many other routines as well -- pretty much any routine that runs down the mnt_vnodelist. What do you think? Please e-mail me directly, as I do not subscribe to these mailing lists. Thanks, Matt Day From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 02:06:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA16238 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:06:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA16233 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:06:06 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id CAA25087; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:02:07 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602051002.CAA25087@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Making serious use of FreeBSD... To: msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au (Michael Smith) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:02:06 -0800 (PST) Cc: alexis@ww.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602050825.SAA07131@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> from "Michael Smith" at Feb 5, 96 06:55:15 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > /src/FreeBSD > > /src/FreeBSD/current > > /src/FreeBSD/stable > > /src/FreeBSD/sup > > > > The appropriate sup instances gets appropriate version into > > appropriate directories. :-) How do I have more than one version > > compiled simultaneously on one machine (one filesystem)? I could > > make current/obj and stable/obj directories but how do I tell > > each collection to compile into the appropriate places? > > Not easily. Whilst the directory structures keep out of each other's way, > a world build will still clobber your standard libraries and includes. > You really need two machines 8( Well you can do what I do and have a separate sub-tree to which I chroot, after populating it with the appropriate utilities then I upgrade within that sub-tree by doing "make world". seems to work ok.. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 02:22:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA17081 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:22:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA17072 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:22:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id LAA25619; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 11:21:33 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id LAA07933; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 11:21:32 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id KAA04719; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:53:28 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602050953.KAA04719@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Can I run 2.2 kernel with 2.1-stable? To: alexis@ww.net Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:53:27 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602050740.KAA00529@sunset.ww.net> from "Alexis Yushin" at Feb 5, 96 10:40:16 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Alexis Yushin wrote: > Will I get any prolem if I run kernel from 2.2 with 2.1 > binaries? Certain system-related binaries (ps, w) won't work. Even top(1) from the ports needs to be rebuilt, it segfaults otherwise. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 02:27:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA17264 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:27:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id CAA17257 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:27:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id VAA07534; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:05:32 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602051035.VAA07534@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:05:32 +1030 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602050910.KAA04319@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Feb 5, 96 10:10:32 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk J Wunsch stands accused of saying: > > > Are there any known problems with this drive? Anything I should > > > have jumpered that isn't? Settings on the controller that I've missed? > > > > Some firmware revisions of this drive have problems with large read/write > > operations. I'd suggest searching the list archives... > > But at any rate, this should not cause the drive to spin down, don't > you think? I don't recall spindowns being a symptom of that problem, no. I'm just suggesting that even if the spin problem is a fauly power connector, the drive's firmware may still be problematic. I should have been a bit clearer about that I guess; my call is still to ditch the disk ASAP. > cheers, J"org -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 02:36:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA17895 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:36:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA17887 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:36:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id CAA00604; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:35:57 -0800 Message-Id: <199602051035.CAA00604@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Michael Smith cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Willows In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 20:14:55 +1030." <199602050944.UAA07332@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 02:35:56 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk What is the sysi386 issue? Amancio >>> Michael Smith said: > Amancio Hasty Jr. stands accused of saying: > > > > > > Any progress on Willows ?? > > There are some patches to make it compile (but not work yet 8) on > time.throck.com; I believe we're waiting for the x86 gurus to solve the > sysi86() issues before it will run native. > > > Amancio > > -- > ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ > ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ > ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ > ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ > ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 02:37:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA17945 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:37:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA17940 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:37:15 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id CAA25250 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:36:23 -0800 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:36:23 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602051036.CAA25250@ref.tfs.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: some puzzlers for you all: Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk 1/ any idea why, when I make in -current in a system which is about 2 months out of date, install tries to install everything in /? is it because the source is in ~julian/src/usr.bin and not in /usr/src? (that's my guess) julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 02:40:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA18101 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:40:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA18057 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:39:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id CAA00665; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:39:24 -0800 Message-Id: <199602051039.CAA00665@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Michael Smith cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Willows In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 20:14:55 +1030." <199602050944.UAA07332@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 02:39:23 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hmm... I just took a quick look at the diffs and I didn't see anything for ExecUtl.S?? Amancio >>> Michael Smith said: > Amancio Hasty Jr. stands accused of saying: > > > > > > Any progress on Willows ?? > > There are some patches to make it compile (but not work yet 8) on > time.throck.com; I believe we're waiting for the x86 gurus to solve the > sysi86() issues before it will run native. > > > Amancio > > -- > ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ > ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ > ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ > ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ > ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 02:47:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA18448 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:47:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id CAA18434 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 02:47:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from exalt.x.org by expo.x.org id AA20764; Mon, 5 Feb 96 05:46:15 -0500 Received: from localhost by exalt.x.org id KAA20613; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:46:13 GMT Message-Id: <199602051046.KAA20613@exalt.x.org> To: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Cc: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: xdm+X (2.1R) leaks? In-Reply-To: Your message of Mon, 05 Feb 1996 10:30:17 EDT. <199602050930.KAA13670@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Organization: X Consortium Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 05:46:13 EDT From: "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I upgraded a 1.1.5.1R machine here over the weekend to 2.1.0-R > (486/40, 8MB, IDE ,XF86/312/S3,20 MB root/27MB swap) and I put > xdm into rc.local to start X automatically. This was on saturday noon. > When I wanted to telnet/ftp into the machine 24 hours later I got connection > (ping also worked) but the system was nearly unusable, that is, > telnet and ftp never got to the login prompt. I tried to login > at the local console to no avail. It seemed the machine was heavily > paging out during my attempts to login. I did a hard reset after a > couple of minutes. > > I suspect there being some memory leak either with X alone or > when being running via xdm. > > Is that a known problem? > Is this a loaded question? :-) malloc in 2.1R is notorious for fragmenting the heap. Two things you can do to improve the situation are: rebuild X with libgnumalloc, get phk's new malloc from -current and rebuild your libc, or build gnumalloc into libc. -- Kaleb KEITHLEY From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 03:14:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id DAA19715 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:14:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA19710 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:14:02 -0800 (PST) From: garyj@frt.dec.com Received: from cssmuc.frt.dec.com by mail1.digital.com (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA29516; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:05:23 -0800 Received: from localhost by cssmuc.frt.dec.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/14Nov95-0232PM) id AA04577; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:04:55 +0100 Message-Id: <9602051104.AA04577@cssmuc.frt.dec.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com In-Reply-To: Message from Poul-Henning Kamp of Mon, 05 Feb 96 10:12:39 +0100. Reply-To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Subject: Re: Willows Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Feb 96 12:04:54 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk phk@critter.tfs.com writes: > > Any progress on Willows ?? > > What >IS< Willows ? > the best thing is to look at http://www.willows.com. As far as I can tell, it lets you run windows apps under U**X. But willows.com has a different definition, which is clearly given in their WEB page. I played with it a little on the weekend. What I'm currently trying to complete is an ExecFBSD.c. This is where the LDT stuff is handled. I started with the ExecLinux.c as an example. Linux' handling of the LDTs is completely different from the way FBSD does it. So basically I (or someone) need(s) to write it from scratch. Other than that I got everything to compile. It just won't link because of the missing LDT stuff. BTW, is there going to be a willows mail list or should the willows discussions be moved to chat ? --- Gary Jennejohn (work) gjennejohn@frt.dec.com (home) Gary.Jennejohn@munich.netsurf.de (play) gj@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 03:23:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id DAA20244 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:23:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from eac.iafrica.com (slipper101147.iafrica.com [196.7.101.147]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA20238 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:22:57 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rnordier@localhost) by eac.iafrica.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id MAA04211; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:51:14 +0200 From: Robert Nordier Message-Id: <199602051051.MAA04211@eac.iafrica.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:51:12 +0200 (SAT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602050734.SAA02716@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Feb 5, 96 06:34:42 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > The new MS-DOS [ie. DOS 2.0] does not keep the file > > allocation tables in memory at all times. Instead the > > tables share the use of sector buffers.... This change > > in the DOS goes completely against my original design > > principles.... Now we're back to doing disk reads just > > to find out where the data is. > > -- Tim Paterson, Byte, June 1983. > > I wonder if he thought about maximal FATs with 64K * 1.5 byte entries. > They would barely fit on a 160K floppy :-). That's true. I think if he'd been writing a few years later -- and not so much in the context of floppies and 10M/20M MFM drives -- he might even have decided differently.... And if he'd been writing now, maybe differently again. :-) Point is, though, historically the DOS file system implementation developed under one set of constraints; I think an efficient implementation on *BSD needs to (at least) consider a different set. IMO, an attempt to merely "do as DOS does" (for better or for worse) is not a workable design principle for re-implementing the msdosfs. Though I also guess that this sort of intentional hair-splitting -- while it seems useful to me -- is of really minimal interest, so I'll drop it here. > 128K is quite small now, but it still isn't necessary to lock it into > memory. Caching it in a normal LRU way should work reasonably well. > Perhaps FAT buffers should have a higher priority than other buffers > for msdosfs, but they probably shouldn't have higher priority than > buffers for other file systems. I'd go along with that: and certainly not the msdosfs at the expense of other fs-es. One thing they did find with the MS-DOS LRU scheme was that FAT sectors tended to "un-cache" too readily. Different prioritization could resolve that. In practice, though, it always seems comparatively hard to predict just how any optimization strategy is going to pan out. Ideally I'd vote to keep the stuff generally very configurable, and then vote again finally from the numbers. If benchmarks ceased entirely to be surprises, people would mostly stop running them. :-) -- Robert Nordier From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 03:31:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id DAA20594 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:31:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA20585 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:31:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id MAA20777; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:28:30 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602051128.MAA20777@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:28:29 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602050950.KAA04667@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Feb 5, 96 10:50:13 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > A high performance FAT filesystem is certainly useful, but it might > > require a lot of work. > > Yes, but we hardly need it. (Both, stability and performance > improvement.) If the caching situation can cause errors, perhaps > write an dosfsck(8) as well. It's a tradeoff. FAT is not our primarily FS, we just need it for compatibility (or for special situations, e.g. when someone wants to run FreeBSD within the MSDOS slice. But as someone suggested, there are better ways to achieve this, e.g. build a large contiguous file and fake a disklabel which spans all the blocks within the file). Stability problems can probably be fixed with relatively little effort. If we can get performance at low price (by recycling some piece of code already in the system, e.g. the VM cache) fine. If someone then wants to do more serious work on performance improvement, it's all up to them. Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 03:39:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id DAA20798 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:39:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA20793 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:39:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com by mail1.digital.com (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA31091; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:34:13 -0800 Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id DAA00604; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:32:13 -0800 Message-Id: <199602051132.DAA00604@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Cc: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com Subject: Re: Willows In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 12:04:54 +0100." <9602051104.AA04577@cssmuc.frt.dec.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 03:32:12 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >>> garyj@frt.dec.com said: > > I played with it a little on the weekend. What I'm currently trying > to complete is an ExecFBSD.c. This is where the LDT stuff is handled. > I started with the ExecLinux.c as an example. Linux' handling of the > LDTs is completely different from the way FBSD does it. So basically > I (or someone) need(s) to write it from scratch. > I thought that something like wine has examples on how to that sort of things (LDT) for FreeBSD... Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 03:55:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id DAA21369 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:55:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA21364 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:55:14 -0800 (PST) From: garyj@frt.dec.com Received: from cssmuc.frt.dec.com by mail1.digital.com (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA31291; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 03:47:29 -0800 Received: from localhost by cssmuc.frt.dec.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/14Nov95-0232PM) id AA25141; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:47:16 +0100 Message-Id: <9602051147.AA25141@cssmuc.frt.dec.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com In-Reply-To: Message from "Amancio Hasty Jr." of Mon, 05 Feb 96 03:32:12 PST. Reply-To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Subject: Re: Willows Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Feb 96 12:47:16 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk hasty@rah.star-gate.com writes: > >>> garyj@frt.dec.com said: > > > > I played with it a little on the weekend. What I'm currently trying > > to complete is an ExecFBSD.c. This is where the LDT stuff is handled. > > I started with the ExecLinux.c as an example. Linux' handling of the > > LDTs is completely different from the way FBSD does it. So basically > > I (or someone) need(s) to write it from scratch. > > > > I thought that something like wine has examples on how to that sort > of things (LDT) for FreeBSD... > > Amancio > > > I didn't think of looking there. I think that the X server uses LDTs, and I wanted to look at that, but I don't have the X sources on line. If wine does use LDTs then it should be fairly simple to cobble an ExecFBSD.c together. --- Gary Jennejohn (work) gjennejohn@frt.dec.com (home) Gary.Jennejohn@munich.netsurf.de (play) gj@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 04:19:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA22723 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:19:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA22711 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:19:06 -0800 (PST) From: garyj@frt.dec.com Received: from cssmuc.frt.dec.com by mail1.digital.com (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA31823; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:12:29 -0800 Received: from localhost by cssmuc.frt.dec.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/14Nov95-0232PM) id AA30436; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:12:22 +0100 Message-Id: <9602051212.AA30436@cssmuc.frt.dec.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com In-Reply-To: Message from Julian Elischer of Mon, 05 Feb 96 02:36:23 PST. Reply-To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Subject: Re: some puzzlers for you all: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Feb 96 13:12:21 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk julian@ref.tfs.com writes: > 1/ > any idea why, when I make in -current in a system which is about 2 months > out of date, install tries to install everything in /? > is it because the source is in ~julian/src/usr.bin > and not in /usr/src? > (that's my guess) > > julian > my -current source is in /u2/src, but I've never seen the problem you describe. One difference is that I'm not 2 months out of date. Did you try making a new install beforehand ? --- Gary Jennejohn (work) gjennejohn@frt.dec.com (home) Gary.Jennejohn@munich.netsurf.de (play) gj@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 04:19:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA22778 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:19:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA22765 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:19:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tjPt1-0003viC; Mon, 5 Feb 96 04:19 PST Received: from localhost.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA01782; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:18:20 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost.tfs.com didn't use HELO protocol To: haury@sagem.fr cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CTM: evolutions of ctm In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 02 Feb 1996 09:31:17 +0100." <199602020831.JAA02040@sagem.fr> Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 13:18:19 +0100 Message-ID: <1780.823522699@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi Christian, I applied your patch and merged it with my own patches, here is the resulting patch, could you take a look ? I change "#ctm" to ".ctm" and ".ctm" to ".ctmtmp", that should make it easier for make I belive ? If this patch is OK for you, I will commit it to the source. Poul-Henning Index: ctm.1 =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm.1,v retrieving revision 1.3 diff -u -r1.3 ctm.1 --- ctm.1 1996/01/31 01:58:29 1.3 +++ ctm.1 1996/02/02 07:11:22 @@ -21,7 +21,9 @@ .Sh SYNOPSIS .Nm ctm .Op Fl cFpPqv +.Op Fl b Ar basedir .Op Fl T Ar tmpdir +.Op Fl V Ar level .Ar file Op ... .Sh DESCRIPTION .Nm Ctm @@ -53,6 +55,15 @@ command runs in a number of passes. It will process the entire input file in each pass, before commencing with the next pass. +Before working one a file +.Ar name +.Nm ctm +first checks for the existence of the file +.Ar name#ctm . +If this file exists, +.Nm ctm +works on it instead. + Pass 1 will validate that the input file is OK. The syntax, the data and the global MD5 checksum will be checked. If any of these fail, .Nm ctm @@ -77,6 +88,11 @@ .Bl -tag -width indent -compact +.It Fl b Ar basedir +Prepend the path +.Ar basedir +on every filename. + .It Fl c Check it out, don't do anything. @@ -98,6 +114,11 @@ .It Fl v Tell us more. + +.It Fl V Ar level +Tell us more. +.Ar Level +is the level of verbosity. .El Index: ctm.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm.c,v retrieving revision 1.11 diff -u -r1.11 ctm.c --- ctm.c 1995/05/30 03:47:19 1.11 +++ ctm.c 1996/02/02 07:19:07 @@ -14,7 +14,6 @@ * Options we'd like to see: * * -a Attempt best effort. - * -b Base-dir * -B Backup to tar-file. * -d Debug TBD. * -m Email me instead. @@ -22,6 +21,7 @@ * -R Read list of files to reconstruct. * * Options we have: + * -b Base-dir * -c Check it out, don't do anything. * -F Force * -p Less paranoid. @@ -29,6 +29,7 @@ * -q Tell us less. * -T . Temporary files. * -v Tell us more. + * -V Tell us more level = number of -v * */ @@ -46,16 +47,19 @@ int c; extern int optopt,optind; extern char * optarg; - FILE *statfile; unsigned applied = 0; + FILE *statfile; + u_char * basedir; + basedir = NULL; Verbose = 1; Paranoid = 1; setbuf(stderr,0); setbuf(stdout,0); - while((c=getopt(argc,argv,"ab:B:cd:Fm:pPqr:R:T:Vv")) != -1) { + while((c=getopt(argc,argv,"ab:B:cd:Fm:pPqr:R:T:V:v")) != -1) { switch (c) { + case 'b': basedir = optarg; break; /* Base Directory */ case 'c': CheckIt++; break; /* Only check it */ case 'p': Paranoid--; break; /* Less Paranoid */ case 'P': Paranoid++; break; /* More Paranoid */ @@ -63,6 +67,9 @@ case 'v': Verbose++; break; /* Verbose */ case 'T': TmpDir = optarg; break; case 'F': Force = 1; break; + case 'V': sscanf(optarg,"%d", &c); /* Verbose */ + Verbose += c; + break; case ':': fprintf(stderr,"Option '%c' requires an argument.\n",optopt); stat++; @@ -85,8 +92,23 @@ argc -= optind; argv += optind; - if((statfile = fopen(CTM_STATUS, "r")) == NULL) - fprintf(stderr, "Warning: " CTM_STATUS " not found.\n"); + if (basedir == NULL) { + Buffer = (u_char *)Malloc(BUFSIZ + strlen(SUBSUFF) +1); + CatPtr = Buffer; + *Buffer = '\0'; + } else { + Buffer = (u_char *)Malloc(strlen(basedir)+ BUFSIZ + strlen(SUBSUFF) +1); + strcpy(Buffer, basedir); + CatPtr = Buffer + strlen(basedir); + if (CatPtr[-1] != '/') { + strcat(Buffer, "/"); + CatPtr++; + } + } + strcat(Buffer, CTM_STATUS); + + if((statfile = fopen(Buffer, "r")) == NULL) + fprintf(stderr, "Warning: %s not found.\n", Buffer); else { fscanf(statfile, "%*s %u", &applied); fclose(statfile); @@ -119,7 +141,7 @@ p = 0; f = stdin; } else if(p && (!strcmp(p,".gz") || !strcmp(p,".Z"))) { - p = Malloc(100); + p = alloca(20 + strlen(filename)); strcpy(p,"gunzip < "); strcat(p,filename); f = popen(p,"r"); @@ -136,7 +158,7 @@ if(Verbose > 1) fprintf(stderr,"Working on <%s>\n",filename); - if(FileName) Free(FileName); + Delete(FileName); FileName = String(filename); /* If we cannot seek, we're doomed, so copy to a tmp-file in that case */ @@ -199,12 +221,11 @@ i=Pass3(f); exit_and_close: - if(!p) { + if(!p) fclose(f); - } else { + else pclose(f); - Free(p); - } + if(i) return i; Index: ctm.h =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm.h,v retrieving revision 1.7 diff -u -r1.7 ctm.h --- ctm.h 1995/05/30 03:47:21 1.7 +++ ctm.h 1996/02/02 07:29:14 @@ -24,6 +24,9 @@ #define VERSION "2.0" #define MAXSIZE (1024*1024*10) +#define SUBSUFF "#ctm" +#define TMPSUFF ".ctm" + /* The fields... */ #define CTM_F_MASK 0xff #define CTM_F_Name 0x01 @@ -39,6 +42,7 @@ #define CTM_Q_Name_File 0x0100 #define CTM_Q_Name_Dir 0x0200 #define CTM_Q_Name_New 0x0400 +#define CTM_Q_Name_Subst 0x0800 #define CTM_Q_MD5_After 0x0100 #define CTM_Q_MD5_Before 0x0200 #define CTM_Q_MD5_Chunk 0x0400 @@ -53,6 +57,8 @@ #define Malloc malloc #define Free free +#define Delete(foo) if (!foo) ; else {Free(foo); foo = 0; } +#define String(foo) strdup(foo) #ifndef EXTERN # define EXTERN extern @@ -63,8 +69,9 @@ EXTERN u_char *TimeStamp; EXTERN u_char *Prefix; EXTERN u_char *FileName; -EXTERN u_char *BaseDir; EXTERN u_char *TmpDir; +EXTERN u_char *CatPtr; +EXTERN u_char *Buffer; /* * Paranoid -- Just in case they should be after us... @@ -108,13 +115,13 @@ #define Exit_Done 64 #define Exit_Version 128 -char * String(char *s); void Fatal_(int ln, char *fn, char *kind); #define Fatal(foo) Fatal_(__LINE__,__FILE__,foo) #define Assert() Fatal_(__LINE__,__FILE__,"Assert failed.") #define WRONG {Assert(); return Exit_Mess;} u_char * Ffield(FILE *fd, MD5_CTX *ctx,u_char term); +u_char * Fname(FILE *fd, MD5_CTX *ctx,u_char term,int qual, int verbose); int Fbytecnt(FILE *fd, MD5_CTX *ctx, u_char term); @@ -124,6 +131,7 @@ #define GETFIELDCOPY(p,q) if(!((p)=Ffield(fd,&ctx,(q)))) return BADREAD; else p=String(p) #define GETBYTECNT(p,q) if(0 >((p)= Fbytecnt(fd,&ctx,(q)))) return BADREAD #define GETDATA(p,q) if(!((p) = Fdata(fd,(q),&ctx))) return BADREAD +#define GETNAMECOPY(p,q,r,v) if(!((p)=Fname(fd,&ctx,(q),(r),(v)))) return BADREAD; else p=String(p) int Pass1(FILE *fd, unsigned applied); int Pass2(FILE *fd); Index: ctm_input.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm_input.c,v retrieving revision 1.4 diff -u -r1.4 ctm_input.c --- ctm_input.c 1994/09/22 02:49:18 1.4 +++ ctm_input.c 1996/02/02 07:29:41 @@ -13,14 +13,6 @@ #include "ctm.h" /*---------------------------------------------------------------------------*/ -char * -String(char *s) -{ - char *p = malloc(strlen(s) + 1); - strcpy(p,s); - return p; -} -/*---------------------------------------------------------------------------*/ void Fatal_(int ln, char *fn, char *kind) { @@ -110,4 +102,37 @@ } p[u_chars] = '\0'; return p; +} + +/*---------------------------------------------------------------------------*/ +/* get the filename in the next field, prepend BaseDir and give back the result + strings. The sustitute filename is return (the one with the suffix SUBSUFF) + if it exists and the qualifier contains CTM_Q_Name_Subst + NOTA: Buffer is already initialize with BaseDir, CatPtr is the insertion + point on this buffer + the length test in Ffield() is enough for Fname() */ + +u_char * +Fname(FILE *fd, MD5_CTX *ctx,u_char term,int qual, int verbose) +{ + u_char * p; + struct stat st; + + if ((p = Ffield(fd,ctx,term)) == NULL) return(NULL); + + strcpy(CatPtr, p); + + if (!(qual & CTM_Q_Name_Subst)) return(Buffer); + + p = Buffer + strlen(Buffer); + + strcat(Buffer, SUBSUFF); + + if ( -1 == stat(Buffer, &st) ) { + *p = '\0'; + } else { + if(verbose > 2) + fprintf(stderr,"Using %s as substitute file\n", Buffer); + } + + return (Buffer); } Index: ctm_pass1.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm_pass1.c,v retrieving revision 1.11 diff -u -r1.11 ctm_pass1.c --- ctm_pass1.c 1995/07/12 09:16:08 1.11 +++ ctm_pass1.c 1996/02/02 07:24:06 @@ -63,8 +63,8 @@ } for(;;) { - if(md5) {Free(md5), md5 = 0;} - if(trash) {Free(trash), trash = 0;} + Delete(md5); + Delete(trash); cnt = -1; GETFIELD(p,' '); /* CTM_something */ @@ -184,6 +184,10 @@ putc('\n',stderr); continue; } + + Delete(md5); + Delete(trash); + q = MD5End (&ctx,md5_1); if(Verbose > 2) printf("Expecting Global MD5 <%s>\n",q); Index: ctm_pass2.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm_pass2.c,v retrieving revision 1.10 diff -u -r1.10 ctm_pass2.c --- ctm_pass2.c 1995/11/10 12:17:23 1.10 +++ ctm_pass2.c 1996/02/02 07:19:46 @@ -44,9 +44,9 @@ /* XXX drop or use ? */ for(;;) { - if(trash) {Free(trash), trash = 0;} - if(name) {Free(name), name = 0;} - if(md5) {Free(md5), md5 = 0;} + Delete(trash); + Delete(name); + Delete(md5); cnt = -1; GETFIELD(p,' '); @@ -69,7 +69,7 @@ switch (j & CTM_F_MASK) { case CTM_F_Name: - GETFIELDCOPY(name,sep); + GETNAMECOPY(name,sep,j,0); /* XXX Check DR DM rec's for parent-dir */ if(j & CTM_Q_Name_New) { /* XXX Check DR FR rec's for item */ @@ -163,7 +163,7 @@ return ret; } unlink(p); - free(p); + Free(p); } break; @@ -171,6 +171,11 @@ } } } + + Delete(trash); + Delete(name); + Delete(md5); + q = MD5End (&ctx,md5_1); GETFIELD(p,'\n'); /* */ if(strcmp(q,p)) WRONG Index: ctm_pass3.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm_pass3.c,v retrieving revision 1.11 diff -u -r1.11 ctm_pass3.c --- ctm_pass3.c 1995/07/12 09:16:13 1.11 +++ ctm_pass3.c 1996/02/02 07:16:02 @@ -41,13 +41,13 @@ GETFIELD(p,'\n'); if(strcmp(Prefix,p)) WRONG for(;;) { - if(md5) {Free(md5), md5 = 0;} - if(uid) {Free(uid), uid = 0;} - if(gid) {Free(gid), gid = 0;} - if(mode) {Free(mode), mode = 0;} - if(md5before) {Free(md5before), md5before = 0;} - if(trash) {Free(trash), trash = 0;} - if(name) {Free(name), name = 0;} + Delete(md5); + Delete(uid); + Delete(gid); + Delete(mode); + Delete(md5before); + Delete(trash); + Delete(name); cnt = -1; GETFIELD(p,' '); @@ -69,7 +69,7 @@ sep = '\n'; switch (j & CTM_F_MASK) { - case CTM_F_Name: GETFIELDCOPY(name,sep); break; + case CTM_F_Name: GETNAMECOPY(name,sep,j, Verbose); break; case CTM_F_Uid: GETFIELDCOPY(uid,sep); break; case CTM_F_Gid: GETFIELDCOPY(gid,sep); break; case CTM_F_Mode: GETFIELDCOPY(mode,sep); break; @@ -132,7 +132,7 @@ } if(!strcmp(sp->Key,"FN")) { strcpy(buf,name); - strcat(buf,".ctm"); + strcat(buf,TMPSUFF); i = ctm_edit(trash,cnt,name,buf); if(i) { fprintf(stderr," %s %s Edit failed with code %d.\n", @@ -177,6 +177,15 @@ } WRONG } + + Delete(md5); + Delete(uid); + Delete(gid); + Delete(mode); + Delete(md5before); + Delete(trash); + Delete(name); + q = MD5End (&ctx,md5_1); GETFIELD(p,'\n'); if(strcmp(q,p)) WRONG Index: ctm_syntax.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.sbin/ctm/ctm/ctm_syntax.c,v retrieving revision 1.5 diff -u -r1.5 ctm_syntax.c --- ctm_syntax.c 1995/05/30 03:47:28 1.5 +++ ctm_syntax.c 1996/02/02 07:11:24 @@ -25,28 +25,29 @@ #define File CTM_Q_Name_File #define Dir CTM_Q_Name_Dir #define New CTM_Q_Name_New +#define Subst CTM_Q_Name_Subst #define After CTM_Q_MD5_After #define Before CTM_Q_MD5_Before #define Chunk CTM_Q_MD5_Chunk #define Force CTM_Q_MD5_Force static int ctmFM[] = /* File Make */ - { Name|File|New, Uid, Gid, Mode, + { Name|File|New|Subst, Uid, Gid, Mode, MD5|After|Chunk, Count, Bytes,0 }; static int ctmFS[] = /* File Substitute */ - { Name|File, Uid, Gid, Mode, + { Name|File|Subst, Uid, Gid, Mode, MD5|Before|Force, MD5|After|Chunk, Count, Bytes,0 }; static int ctmFE[] = /* File Edit */ - { Name|File, Uid, Gid, Mode, + { Name|File|Subst, Uid, Gid, Mode, MD5|Before, MD5|After, Count, Bytes,0 }; static int ctmFR[] = /* File Remove */ - { Name|File, MD5|Before, 0 }; + { Name|File|Subst, MD5|Before, 0 }; static int ctmAS[] = /* Attribute Substitute */ - { Name, Uid, Gid, Mode, 0 }; + { Name|Subst, Uid, Gid, Mode, 0 }; static int ctmDM[] = /* Directory Make */ { Name|Dir|New , Uid, Gid, Mode, 0 }; -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 04:23:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA23229 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:23:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA23222 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:23:57 -0800 (PST) From: garyj@frt.dec.com Received: from cssmuc.frt.dec.com by mail1.digital.com (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA32004; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:15:28 -0800 Received: from localhost by cssmuc.frt.dec.com; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/14Nov95-0232PM) id AA32235; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:15:21 +0100 Message-Id: <9602051215.AA32235@cssmuc.frt.dec.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com In-Reply-To: Message from "Amancio Hasty Jr." of Mon, 05 Feb 96 02:35:56 PST. Reply-To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Subject: Re: Willows Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Feb 96 13:15:21 +0100 X-Mts: smtp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk hasty@rah.star-gate.com writes: > What is the sysi386 issue? > Amancio > that's where (among other things) the LDT stuff gets handled. Willows uses a sysi86 syscall from SCO which has to be emulated under Linux and FBSD. --- Gary Jennejohn (work) gjennejohn@frt.dec.com (home) Gary.Jennejohn@munich.netsurf.de (play) gj@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 04:27:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA23606 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:27:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from minnow.render.com (render.demon.co.uk [158.152.30.118]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA23151 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:22:51 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dfr@localhost) by minnow.render.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id MAA13243; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:22:21 GMT Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:22:18 +0000 (GMT) From: Doug Rabson To: Andrew Heybey cc: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: And the winner is! In-Reply-To: <199602031414.JAA01796@grapenuts.bellcore.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 3 Feb 1996, Andrew Heybey wrote: > [Please excuse the preceding fumble-fingered screw-up sent to the > list. C-c C-c (mh-send-letter) is very close to C-x C-x on the > keyboard.] > > karl> No, we want to be able to have a "code server" which can load, > karl> and keep updated, multiple machines. That is, when I have > karl> system #15 to load, I want to plug in the Ethernet, point the > karl> new box at the server, and say "go fetch your load, kid". > > karl> Also, the ability to somehow have this update process > karl> automated (so that I only have to make a code change on *ONE* > karl> machine) would be nice. > > When I was running 1.1.5.1, I had something like this set up using a > program called reconcile (ftp://mercury.lcs.mit.edu/pub/shep/reconcile-*). > > Reconcile is sort of like rdist in reverse (client pull instead of > server push) only better (IMHO). I hacked the boot floppy to (after > newfs'ing the disk(s)) ask for enough information to configure the > network interface then NFS mount the server and build the file system. > [BTW I can't take any credit for this idea--Tim Shepard wrote > reconcile and he and several others set up a network full of uVaxen > this way at LCS.] > > This is all broken now that I'm running 2.something, but I'll be > getting a few new machines soon so I might be motivated to resurrect > it. If anyone is interested (and if I actually do it) I would be > willing to give away the reconcile config files and boot floppy hacks > that I do. It seems like one could use sup to keep systems in sync. Basically, you would run a supserver on the 'code server' and regularly sup the client systems against it. The sup config files allow you to do stuff like run ranlib on /usr/lib/lib*.a, execute newaliases when /etc/aliases changes, don't take specific files from /etc/ which are per-system. -- Doug Rabson, Microsoft RenderMorphics Ltd. Mail: dfr@render.com Phone: +44 171 251 4411 FAX: +44 171 251 0939 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 04:40:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA24419 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:40:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA24362 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:39:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id NAA20897; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:31:51 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602051231.NAA20897@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: rnordier@iafrica.com (Robert Nordier) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:31:51 +0100 (MET) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602051051.MAA04211@eac.iafrica.com> from "Robert Nordier" at Feb 5, 96 12:50:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > I wonder if he thought about maximal FATs with 64K * 1.5 byte entries. > > They would barely fit on a 160K floppy :-). Pardon me, 1.5 byte entries mean by defiitiion at most 4K entries, i.e. 12K total per two FATs. Fits nicely on a disk! > I'd go along with that: and certainly not the msdosfs at the expense of > other fs-es. One thing they did find with the MS-DOS LRU scheme was that > FAT sectors tended to "un-cache" too readily. Different prioritization > could resolve that. All the above is correct, but keep in mind that it depends a lot on how many BUFFERS=xxx you declare in your config files. And this is often a small number, which explains the poor performance of the cache. Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 04:48:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA24692 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:48:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA24686 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:48:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from hda.com by mail1.digital.com (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA00020; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:40:58 -0800 Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id HAA14759; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:42:58 -0500 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199602051242.HAA14759@hda.com> Subject: Re: Willows To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:42:57 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com In-Reply-To: <9602051104.AA04577@cssmuc.frt.dec.com> from "garyj@frt.dec.com" at Feb 5, 96 12:04:54 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > BTW, is there going to be a willows mail list or should the willows > discussions be moved to chat ? Not -chat (where the ages of everyone discussion belongs). You'd be violating the charter of -chat... IMO it belongs here in -hackers until it builds to the point that it goes into its own mailing list, dies off, or stays here at a low level. Peter -- Peter Dufault Real-Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 04:49:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA24738 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:49:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from relay.hp.com (relay.hp.com [15.255.152.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA24732 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:49:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from fakir.india.hp.com by relay.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA299074496; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:48:21 -0800 Received: from localhost by fakir.india.hp.com with SMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA155974303; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 18:15:03 +0530 Message-Id: <199602051245.AA155974303@fakir.india.hp.com> To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Willows In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 12:47:16 +0100." <9602051147.AA25141@cssmuc.frt.dec.com> Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 18:15:02 +0530 From: A JOSEPH KOSHY Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk gj> I didn't think of looking there. I think that the X server uses LDTs, I'm curious about this. Does the X server really need specific LDT support on FreeBSD? AFAIK we need access to the ioports on the machine (thus an IOPL change is in order) and mmaping of framebuffer memory on some of the cards (which is standard, taking care to make the FB non-cacheable). However there shouldn't be a need for anything more machine specific than that. On this topic; do we support the P5's 1MB page size? This could reduce the number of TLB misses when mmaping the video framebuffer (1-4MB typ) and when the CPU does typical drawing (bresenham lines get hit particularly by tlb stepping). Even the accelarators which use sparse addressing of their registers (Mach64, P9000, P9100 etc) this could be a win. Koshy From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 04:57:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA25037 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:57:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from eac.iafrica.com (slipper101153.iafrica.com [196.7.101.153]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA25030 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:57:50 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rnordier@localhost) by eac.iafrica.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA00269; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:54:26 +0200 From: Robert Nordier Message-Id: <199602051254.OAA00269@eac.iafrica.com> Subject: Re: Some thoughts on FAT filesystems To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:54:24 +0200 (SAT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602050824.JAA20270@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 5, 96 09:24:40 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > Since some people is now looking at the msdosfs, it is nice that > the discussion on FAT has progressed a little bit. > > I'd like to contribute some more thoughts. In the following I assume > that there are no concurrent accesses to the FAT partition. New ideas, or combinations of ideas, are always interesting. :-) As the new kid on the block, I think the filesystem you describe would have to show how it is superior to two existing, FAT-incompatible contenders for the title of Improved FAT FS: the HPFS (OS/2) and NTFS (Windows NT). The HPFS makes use of a banding system similar to the one you describe. Both HPFS and NTFS also make use B-Trees in place of unsorted directories. NTFS features transaction logging to support better filesystem recovery, and both support hot-fixing (transparent recovery from media errors). Etc.... Of course, what we really need is a vastly improved FAT filesystem that makes use of FAT-identical data structures, and also is algorithmically similar to all MS-DOS versions in every respect. :-) -- Robert Nordier From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 05:04:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA25260 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 05:04:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA25255 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 05:03:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com by mail1.digital.com (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA00924; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:58:23 -0800 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id EAA23950; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 04:56:52 -0800 To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Cc: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com Subject: Re: Willows In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 12:04:54 +0100." <9602051104.AA04577@cssmuc.frt.dec.com> Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 04:56:50 -0800 Message-Id: <23948.823525010@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > BTW, is there going to be a willows mail list or should the willows > discussions be moved to chat ? A temporary one has been set up at: willows@throck.com You're on it. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 05:22:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA26047 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 05:22:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from sivka.carrier.kiev.ua (root@sivka.carrier.kiev.ua [193.125.68.130]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA25977 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 05:19:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from elvisti.kiev.ua (uucp@localhost) by sivka.carrier.kiev.ua (Sendmail 8.who.cares/5) with UUCP id PAA18711 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:19:13 +0200 Received: from office.elvisti.kiev.ua (office.elvisti.kiev.ua [193.125.28.33]) by spider2.elvisti.kiev.ua (8.6.12/8.ElVisti) with ESMTP id OAA24222 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:52:11 +0200 Received: (from stesin@localhost) by office.elvisti.kiev.ua (8.6.12/8.ElVisti) id OAA05742 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:52:10 +0200 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:52:10 +0200 From: "Andrew V. Stesin" Message-Id: <199602051252.OAA05742@office.elvisti.kiev.ua> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) Organization: Electronni Visti InformAgency (ElVisti) X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2+] Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Michael Smith wrote: : Marc G. Fournier stands accused of saying: : > : > When I tried to install, it newfs'd 3 partitions, then got the above error : > on the 4th (you could hear the drive powerdown) and then when it went to : > the 5th, you could hear it power up again, and it newfs'd it and the 6th : > properly again. : Aiee! Unless you have a faulty power connector, _send_it_back_ right now. : If it's spinning down the drive is sure it has a _serious_ problem. I STRONGLY second this. We had this same drive model died recently. Two last days before final death it was stinking with the messages "not ready" to the console... : > (aha0:0:0): "CONNER CFP1060S 1.05GB 243F" type 0 fixed SCSI 2 : > sd0(aha0:0:0): Direct-Access 1013MB (2074880 512 byte sectors) : Some firmware revisions of this drive have problems with large read/write : operations. I'd suggest searching the list archives... That's not the issue. Faulty drives were _before_ 203C firmware revision, this one is 243F; and two older drives which were upgraded to 203C are still Ok here. -- With best regards -- Andrew Stesin. +380 (44) 2760188 +380 (44) 2713457 +380 (44) 2713560 "You may delegate authority, but not responsibility." Frank's Management Rule #1. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 05:23:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA26105 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 05:23:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from nixpbe.pdb.sni.de (mail.sni.de [192.109.2.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id FAA26100 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 05:23:45 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nerv@localhost) by nixpbe.pdb.sni.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA26908 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:23:31 +0100 Message-Id: <199602051323.OAA26908@nixpbe.pdb.sni.de> Subject: Re: telnet question To: gcrutchr@nightflight.com (Gary Crutcher) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 96 14:19:23 MET From: Greg Lehey Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (Hackers; FreeBSD) In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19960205042455.0067d3fc@nightflight.com>; from "Gary Crutcher" at Feb 04, 96 8:24 pm X-Mailer: xmail 2.4 (based on ELM 2.2 PL16) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I have occasionally have a telnet session stop displaying characters. It > only occurs if I do man , and while viewing the manpages, press > CTRL-C to exit. From that point on telnet works, but no chars display. > > Any ideas of what the problem might be? Sounds like your terminal settings are left screwed up. You shouldn't be able to exit man with Ctrl-C: what pager are you using? In any case, this is almost certainly not a telnet problem, though possibly it happens during telnet sessions because you have your termcaps set up incorrectly. Try: stty sane and see if the echo comes on again for the next input. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 05:34:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA26449 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 05:34:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA26444 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 05:34:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au by mail1.digital.com (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA32592; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 05:28:07 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id AAA07871; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:11:38 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602051341.AAA07871@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Willows To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:11:37 +1030 (CST) Cc: hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com In-Reply-To: <9602051104.AA04577@cssmuc.frt.dec.com> from "garyj@frt.dec.com" at Feb 5, 96 12:04:54 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk garyj@frt.dec.com stands accused of saying: > I played with it a little on the weekend. What I'm currently trying > to complete is an ExecFBSD.c. This is where the LDT stuff is handled. > I started with the ExecLinux.c as an example. Linux' handling of the > LDTs is completely different from the way FBSD does it. So basically > I (or someone) need(s) to write it from scratch. Please, people 8) Send some mail to Jordan, and get yourselves on the alias at throck. The patches I put there were just the trivial stuff so that you didn't have to chase them down. There's already an ExecFreeBSD been written (Sujal Patel if memory serves), and a call out for an i386 assembly guru to work on ExecUtl.S >From what I understand, TWIN's LDT requirements are significantly different from Wine's, and there are some known bugs in the BSD LDT code that are also being worked on. > Gary Jennejohn (work) gjennejohn@frt.dec.com -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 06:12:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA28273 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 06:12:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za [146.64.24.58]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA27995 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 06:08:03 -0800 (PST) Received: (from bertus@localhost) by zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za (8.6.12/8.6.9) id QAA15465; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:06:01 +0200 From: Bertus Pretorius Message-Id: <199602051406.QAA15465@zibbi.mikom.csir.co.za> Subject: Re: telnet question To: gcrutchr@nightflight.com (Gary Crutcher) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:06:01 +0200 (SAT) Cc: questions@FreeBSD.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19960205042455.0067d3fc@nightflight.com> from "Gary Crutcher" at Feb 4, 96 08:24:55 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Gary writes > I have occasionally have a telnet session stop displaying characters. It > only occurs if I do man , and while viewing the manpages, press > CTRL-C to exit. From that point on telnet works, but no chars display. > > Any ideas of what the problem might be? Yes, we have seen and discuss the problem and agreed to disagree about the problem. Here a description what happens: It is all about out_of_band data (claimed not to exist in TCP/IP) or urgent data. The idea of OOB (I use the for short hand) are suppose to do queue hopping to send a signal to the other side to stop it doing something - most often sending data. The problem is that the current implementations only marks a single OOB character on the recieve side while typically more than one byte is send, which work fine when your data stream is a single TCP connection. However, the moment you go through a proxie you have more than one TCP connection (it happens in al sorts of connection relaying) whith the result that the OOB get stuck, or lost or incomplete because the relay can only get one charackter. Both the transmitting and recieving sides are behaving "wrong" - the quotes indicates that some believe it is right - when handling OOB or urgent data. The specs are however unclear and will most likely remain so:). The full behaviour can easily be detected when you run a simple telnet or ftp relay with tcpdump on both sides. When you pres CNTL-C a chunck, more than one byte (see note), is send while only one is relayed - that is with the trivial implementation. Telnet uses an escape character and a control character and this pair is often split with the result that the one side goes out of sync and wait forever. ftp does it in a more spectacular manner:). note: The TCP packet format contains a field Urgent pointer that points to the fitst octet following urgent data..."and allows the receiver to determine how much urgent data is coming". This can be interpret in two ways: urgent pointer = amount of urgent data or (1) urgent data <= amount of urgent data (2) Case one is the case I make, case to leaves the implementation of OOB or urgent data in TCP at the mercy of the applications:(. Sorry to say a stalemate :( I hope to fix it one day:) -- +-Bertus Pretorius-------- (O) (O) -----------bertus@mikom.csir.co.za-+ | mikomtek ^ +27 12 841-3001 (Voice) | | CSIR \___/ +27 12 841-4720 (FAX) | +-------------A smile is the same in all languages--------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 06:25:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA29035 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 06:25:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from nixpbe.pdb.sni.de (mail.sni.de [192.109.2.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA29029 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 06:25:15 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nerv@localhost) by nixpbe.pdb.sni.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA00835 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:25:04 +0100 Message-Id: <199602051425.PAA00835@nixpbe.pdb.sni.de> Subject: Re: Willows To: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com Date: Mon, 5 Feb 96 15:20:55 MET From: Greg Lehey Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (Hackers; FreeBSD) In-Reply-To: <9602051147.AA25141@cssmuc.frt.dec.com>; from "garyj@frt.dec.com" at Feb 05, 96 12:47 pm X-Mailer: xmail 2.4 (based on ELM 2.2 PL16) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > I didn't think of looking there. I think that the X server uses LDTs, > and I wanted to look at that, but I don't have the X sources on line. > > If wine does use LDTs then it should be fairly simple to cobble an > ExecFBSD.c together. Wine may not use LDTs, but if you don't set the appropriate option (USER_LDT, from memory) in the kernel config, wine refuses to try to work. Nothing else does, so I suppose it doesn't use user LDTs. Of course, if you *do* set USER_LDT in the kernel config, wine just dies with some other error... or it did last time I tried running it. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 06:27:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA29135 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 06:27:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from relay1.fnet.fr (relay1.fnet.fr [192.134.192.129]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA29126 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 06:27:40 -0800 (PST) From: haury@sagem.fr Received: from sagem.UUCP by relay1.fnet.fr (5.65c8d/92.02.29) via Fnet/EUnet-France id AA23880; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:27:34 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199602051420.PAA23016@sagem.fr> Subject: Re: CTM: evolutions of ctm To: phk@critter.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:20:03 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <1780.823522699@critter.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Feb 5, 96 01:18:19 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > >Hi Christian, > >I applied your patch and merged it with my own patches, here is the resulting >patch, could you take a look ? > >I change "#ctm" to ".ctm" and ".ctm" to ".ctmtmp", that should make it >easier for make I belive ? > >If this patch is OK for you, I will commit it to the source. > >Poul-Henning > Your patches work well : the encapsulation of Malloc/Free generate a nice code (IMHO). WARNING : in this patch release, SUBSUFF and TMPSUFF are not modified in ctm.h : #define SUBSUFF "#ctm" #define TMPSUFF ".ctm" According to your mail, these should be changes as : #define SUBSUFF ".ctm" #define TMPSUFF ".ctmtmp" -- =Christian Haury (Christian.Haury@sagem.fr) --------------------------------------------------------- | SAGEM Eragny - Avenue du Gros Chene - Eragny BP 51 | | 95612 Cergy Pontoise Cedex - France | | phone : +33 (1) 34 30 53 93 | telex : 607387F | | fax : +33 (1) 34 30 50 28 | teletex : 933-130731770 | --------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 06:31:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA29366 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 06:31:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA29360 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 06:31:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tjRwp-0003x0C; Mon, 5 Feb 96 06:31 PST Received: from localhost.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA02003; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:31:14 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost.tfs.com didn't use HELO protocol To: haury@sagem.fr cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CTM: evolutions of ctm In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 15:20:03 +0100." <199602051420.PAA23016@sagem.fr> Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 15:31:13 +0100 Message-ID: <2001.823530673@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > WARNING : in this patch release, SUBSUFF and TMPSUFF are not modified in ctm. h : > > #define SUBSUFF "#ctm" > #define TMPSUFF ".ctm" > > According to your mail, these should be changes as : > > #define SUBSUFF ".ctm" > #define TMPSUFF ".ctmtmp" > Yes, I did that on purpose. Didn't you say that it would be easier to write make rules if we used ".ctm" instead of "#ctm" ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 06:45:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA00662 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 06:45:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA00656 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 06:45:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id PAA21079; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:34:24 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602051434.PAA21079@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Some thoughts on FAT filesystems To: rnordier@iafrica.com (Robert Nordier) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:34:24 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602051254.OAA00269@eac.iafrica.com> from "Robert Nordier" at Feb 5, 96 02:54:05 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > Since some people is now looking at the msdosfs, it is nice that > > the discussion on FAT has progressed a little bit. > > > > I'd like to contribute some more thoughts. In the following I assume > > that there are no concurrent accesses to the FAT partition. > > New ideas, or combinations of ideas, are always interesting. :-) > > As the new kid on the block, I think the filesystem you describe would > have to show how it is superior to two existing, FAT-incompatible contenders > for the title of Improved FAT FS: the HPFS (OS/2) and NTFS (Windows NT). > > The HPFS makes use of a banding system similar to the one you describe. > Both HPFS and NTFS also make use B-Trees in place of unsorted directories. this is a nice idea, I didn't go this far... > NTFS features transaction logging to support better filesystem recovery, > and both support hot-fixing (transparent recovery from media errors). > Etc.... > > Of course, what we really need is a vastly improved FAT filesystem that > makes use of FAT-identical data structures, and also is algorithmically > similar to all MS-DOS versions in every respect. :-) All the suggested changes can be done by keeping the FAT as the raw data, and adding structure info within files. If they exist, you just go faster. If they don't, you go slower and probably ought to get some nice reminder at mount time that suggests you to run "mkImprovedFATFS" next time... Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 07:12:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA02121 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:12:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from relay1.fnet.fr (relay1.fnet.fr [192.134.192.129]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA02115 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:12:50 -0800 (PST) From: haury@sagem.fr Received: from sagem.UUCP by relay1.fnet.fr (5.65c8d/92.02.29) via Fnet/EUnet-France id AA27023; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:12:46 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199602051456.PAA00351@sagem.fr> Subject: Re: CTM: evolutions of ctm To: phk@critter.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:56:27 +0100 (MET) Cc: haury@sagem.fr, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <2001.823530673@critter.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Feb 5, 96 03:31:13 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: >Yes, I did that on purpose. Didn't you say that it would be easier to >write make rules if we used ".ctm" instead of "#ctm" ? > Yes, what's easier since you don't need to escape the # on your file so the makefile is a little bit more readable ... and using '#' in filenames can sometimes be a bit tricky under shell ... So, I agree with this modification. -- =Christian Haury (Christian.Haury@sagem.fr) --------------------------------------------------------- | SAGEM Eragny - Avenue du Gros Chene - Eragny BP 51 | | 95612 Cergy Pontoise Cedex - France | | phone : +33 (1) 34 30 53 93 | telex : 607387F | | fax : +33 (1) 34 30 50 28 | teletex : 933-130731770 | --------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 07:26:42 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA02812 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:26:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA02804 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:26:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id HAA02821; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:22:50 -0800 Message-Id: <199602051522.HAA02821@Root.COM> X-Authentication-Warning: implode.Root.COM: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: A JOSEPH KOSHY cc: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Willows In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 18:15:02 +0530." <199602051245.AA155974303@fakir.india.hp.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 07:22:49 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >On this topic; do we support the P5's 1MB page size? This could reduce No, we don't support variable page sizes and we're not likely ever going to support them due to architectural constraints in the VM system (and I'm not interested in changing this because of performance considerations). >by tlb stepping). Even the accelarators which use sparse addressing >of their registers (Mach64, P9000, P9100 etc) this could be a win. Perhaps. The general decrease in performance and overall munging of the VM code to handle variable page sizes would negate any benefit, IMO. -DG David Greenman Core Team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 07:36:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA03547 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:36:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA03535 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:36:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id HAA02845; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:27:42 -0800 Message-Id: <199602051527.HAA02845@Root.COM> X-Authentication-Warning: implode.Root.COM: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: "Serge A. Babkin" cc: alexis@unicorn.ww.net, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: ep driver In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 10:34:48 +0500." <199602050534.KAA29528@hq.icb.chel.su> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 07:27:42 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >working is to enable its epwatchdog() routine: > >add "ifp->if_timer = 1;" after " "ifp->if_watchdog = epwatchdog;" > >The reason why David Greenman has disabled it is that he throught that >epwarchdog() restes the card. But really it does not reset it. Actually, what I objected to was the general use of the watchdog routine to cover up what is clearly one or more serious bugs in the driver. The watchdog routine in this case is being used in a way that is entirely inappropriate and if removing the kludge causes the driver to occasionally hang, then someone should go find out why and fix it! -DG David Greenman Core Team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 07:44:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA03947 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:44:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA03938 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:44:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tjT5K-0003vxC; Mon, 5 Feb 96 07:44 PST Received: from localhost.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id QAA02081; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:44:06 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost.tfs.com didn't use HELO protocol To: haury@sagem.fr cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CTM: evolutions of ctm In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 15:56:27 +0100." <199602051456.PAA00351@sagem.fr> Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 16:44:05 +0100 Message-ID: <2079.823535045@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >Yes, I did that on purpose. Didn't you say that it would be easier to > >write make rules if we used ".ctm" instead of "#ctm" ? > > > > Yes, what's easier since you don't need to escape the # on your file > so the makefile is a little bit more readable ... > > and using '#' in filenames can sometimes be a bit tricky under shell ... > > So, I agree with this modification. Thank you Sir! I will commit this change then. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 07:56:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA04585 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:56:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from nixpbe.pdb.sni.de (mail.sni.de [192.109.2.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA04578 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:56:24 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nerv@localhost) by nixpbe.pdb.sni.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA07474 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:56:15 +0100 Message-Id: <199602051556.QAA07474@nixpbe.pdb.sni.de> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: stesin@elvisti.kiev.ua (Andrew V. Stesin) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 96 16:52:07 MET From: Greg Lehey Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (Hackers; FreeBSD) In-Reply-To: <199602051252.OAA05742@office.elvisti.kiev.ua>; from "Andrew V. Stesin" at Feb 5, 96 2:52 pm X-Mailer: xmail 2.4 (based on ELM 2.2 PL16) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >: Marc G. Fournier stands accused of saying: >:> >:> When I tried to install, it newfs'd 3 partitions, then got the above error >:> on the 4th (you could hear the drive powerdown) and then when it went to >:> the 5th, you could hear it power up again, and it newfs'd it and the 6th >:> properly again. > >: Aiee! Unless you have a faulty power connector, _send_it_back_ right now. >: If it's spinning down the drive is sure it has a _serious_ problem. > > I STRONGLY second this. We had this same drive model died recently. > Two last days before final death it was stinking with the > messages "not ready" to the console... I've missed the beginning of this story, but can't spinning down also mean that the drive is overheating? I recently bought a Maxtor 1.2 GB EIDE drive (which installed with *no* problems), and it started doing this. I had it in a drawer between two 5 1/4" drives (tape, floppy), and I found it was running really hot, almost too hot to touch. I removed it from the drawer and put it where it got enough air flow, with the result that it now runs barely warm, and it hasn't spun down yet. Comments? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 07:57:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA04613 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:57:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from grapenuts.bellcore.com (grapenuts.bellcore.com [192.4.4.35]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA04598 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 07:56:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by grapenuts.bellcore.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA02892; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:22:06 -0500 Message-Id: <199602051522.KAA02892@grapenuts.bellcore.com> X-Authentication-Warning: grapenuts.bellcore.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol From: Andrew Heybey To: Doug Rabson cc: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: And the winner is! In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 05 Feb 1996 12:22:18 +0000. Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 10:22:05 -0500 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk dfr> It seems like one could use sup to keep systems in sync. dfr> Basically, you would run a supserver on the 'code server' and dfr> regularly sup the client systems against it. The sup config dfr> files allow you to do stuff like run ranlib on /usr/lib/lib*.a, dfr> execute newaliases when /etc/aliases changes, don't take dfr> specific files from /etc/ which are per-system. Yes, sup would work and has some advantages (for one thing reconcile needs the server to be NFS mounted). For me it was a matter of being familiar with reconcile. Also, reconcile does several things that I don't know if sup can do: 1. Map from one file name to another. For example, one could have /etc/sysconfig.CLIENT (since the server probably wants a different configuration in its /etc/sysconfig) which gets copied to /etc/sysconfig on the clients. [Speaking of which, if one wants to set up several machines, it is somewhat obnoxious that the hostname and interfaces are hard-wired in sysconfig. I like hostname.* files better instead of running sed on sysconfig. Just MHO.] 2. Reconcile won't touch files on the client that have changed. Not just files that are newer on the client (which is what I gather sup can do (from a cursory inspection of the man page)). Reconcile keeps a database of the mtimes (or ctimes, I'm not sure) of the files so as tell if the file has changed on the client. I happen to like this feature--if something changes on the client it is probably for a reason and one doesn't want the change wiped out just because the rest of the client's file system is being kept up to date. 3. Reconcile can automatically create symlinks to the server instead of copying if you want to save disk space on the client. (Again, this assumes a LAN and NFS mounting of the server.) For example on the machines I set up, /usr/src -> /server/user/src. andrew From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 08:08:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA05517 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:08:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA05507 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:08:37 -0800 (PST) Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA01465 (5.65.kiae-1 for hackers@freebsd.org); Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:06:45 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Mon, 5 Feb 96 19:06:45 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by ache.dialup.ru (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA00519; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:05:10 +0300 (MSK) To: hackers@freebsd.org, "Andrew V. Stesin" References: <199602051252.OAA05742@office.elvisti.kiev.ua> In-Reply-To: <199602051252.OAA05742@office.elvisti.kiev.ua>; from "Andrew V. Stesin" at Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:52:10 +0200 Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:05:10 +0300 (MSK) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.42 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) Lines: 42 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199602051252.OAA05742@office.elvisti.kiev.ua> Andrew V. Stesin writes: >Michael Smith wrote: >: Marc G. Fournier stands accused of saying: >: > >: > When I tried to install, it newfs'd 3 partitions, then got the above error >: > on the 4th (you could hear the drive powerdown) and then when it went to >: > the 5th, you could hear it power up again, and it newfs'd it and the 6th >: > properly again. >: Aiee! Unless you have a faulty power connector, _send_it_back_ right now. >: If it's spinning down the drive is sure it has a _serious_ problem. > I STRONGLY second this. We had this same drive model died recently. > Two last days before final death it was stinking with the > messages "not ready" to the console... >: > (aha0:0:0): "CONNER CFP1060S 1.05GB 243F" type 0 fixed SCSI 2 >: > sd0(aha0:0:0): Direct-Access 1013MB (2074880 512 byte sectors) >: Some firmware revisions of this drive have problems with large read/write >: operations. I'd suggest searching the list archives... > That's not the issue. Faulty drives were _before_ 203C > firmware revision, this one is 243F; > and two older drives which were upgraded to 203C are still Ok > here. I have (ahc0:0:0): "CONNER CFP1060S 1.05GB 2135" type 0 fixed SCSI 2 ^^^^ wich works well for me several months. -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 08:09:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA05541 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:09:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from eac.iafrica.com (slipper119221.iafrica.com [196.7.119.221]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA05525 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:08:58 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rnordier@localhost) by eac.iafrica.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA00183; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:53:49 +0200 From: Robert Nordier Message-Id: <199602051553.RAA00183@eac.iafrica.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:53:48 +0200 (SAT) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602051231.NAA20897@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 5, 96 01:31:51 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > I wonder if he thought about maximal FATs with 64K * 1.5 byte entries. > > > They would barely fit on a 160K floppy :-). > > Pardon me, 1.5 byte entries mean by defiitiion at most 4K entries, > i.e. 12K total per two FATs. Fits nicely on a disk! Well, to get _really_ technical a 160K floppy only requires 1K of FAT space (313 clusters). And the 12-bit maximum is less than 4K due to reserved values, but I think this all misses the point of the remark. > > I'd go along with that: and certainly not the msdosfs at the expense of > > other fs-es. One thing they did find with the MS-DOS LRU scheme was that > > FAT sectors tended to "un-cache" too readily. Different prioritization > > could resolve that. > All the above is correct, but keep in mind that it depends a lot > on how many BUFFERS=xxx you declare in your config files. Changing your 'buffers' setting isn't going to specifically affect the problem of dropping FAT sectors from the cache. You need weighted LRU for that. > And this is > often a small number, which explains the poor performance of the cache. Sometimes small numbers are bad; sometimes small numbers are good -- when running smartdrive, for instance. :-) -- Robert Nordier From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 08:12:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA05832 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:12:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from eac.iafrica.com (slipper119221.iafrica.com [196.7.119.221]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA05723 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:11:57 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rnordier@localhost) by eac.iafrica.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA00587; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:56:29 +0200 From: Robert Nordier Message-Id: <199602051456.QAA00587@eac.iafrica.com> Subject: Re: Some thoughts on FAT filesystems To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:56:28 +0200 (SAT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602050824.JAA20270@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 5, 96 09:24:40 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > In designing a high performance FAT one might try to use the same > layout policies of the FFS, i.e divide the FAT partition into a > number of logical "cylinder groups" (CG). Clusters in the CG are > physically contiguous, and even the corresponding entries in the > FAT are contiguous. Yes, they would have to be. > Assuming a cluster size of 4K (which is nice > because it has the same size as a page), then a 4K portion of the > FAT suffices for 8MB of data. OK. Giving 2048 clusters per group and one 16-bit (presumably) FAT portion per CG. But where is the FAT located: next to the CG, or at the start of the partition? (Apparently next to the CG -- see below.) > For efficiency, when the FS loads this FAT portion in memory (or > at the first write) it could also build a "free list" of clusters > in the CG, so as to speed up allocations. Would a free list hold any advantage? Why not just scan your FAT copy for the next 0 (ie. free cluster)? This could be handled using a single 80x86 'scas' op. > Also for efficiency, > writes to the FAT should not be done too frequently, because of > their cost. Write to disk, presumably. So are we controlling caching ourselves? > When creating new files, one should privilege locality within the > CG, much like it is done in the FFS. Of course, when the CG fills > up, or the disk is heavily fragmented (read: has been written by > DOS) one might have to use blocks in different CGs. How are you planning to link the CG chain from one FAT to another? > CACHING and WRITES: > The caching policy might not be much different from that of FFS: try to > keep in memory the FAT copies first, do not immediately go to the disk > for data blocks as they might have a short lifetime, etc. > RECOVERY: > using delayed writes to the FAT might lead to bad inconsistencies to > the filesystem in case of power failures. One possible approach could > be the following: > 1) create a "special" file in the root directory, with fixed size and > structure. This file uses exactly one cluster per CG, say at the > beginning of the CG, where the portion of the FAT for that CG is > saved. Is this (effectively) the second copy of the FAT? Next to the first? > Writing to this cluster is cheaper than writing to the FAT > because of physical contiguity. I don't get it. Aren't they next to each other? > Also, there is no risk of corruption > of this file because its structure does not change, hence > modifications to its content do not require changing the FAT or the > directory entry (unless one wants to update the modification times; > but this is not very important). I still don't see what this file gets you that a FAT copy doesn't. (How is a file of unchanging structure/size any different from a FAT?) You could just as well say, "No risk of corruption to the FAT, because modifications do not require changing the FAT." Or not? > 2) When the FS is updated, modifications to the FAT are written to this > local FAT first, and then, at a convenient time, dumped to the > ordinary FAT. Do the FAT portions (collectively) constitute the ordinary FAT? > 3) Recovery after a crash: first check for the existence of the > "special" file, then look for inconsistencies between the regular > FAT and this special file, and try to reconstruct things. Still seems just like two FAT copies to me. > Not many new ideas, as you can see, just trying to see if known > technology can be reused. I'm probably missing something obvious, but I don't quite see how it all ties together.... -- Robert Nordier From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 08:37:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA07224 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:37:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from xi.dorm.umd.edu (xi.dorm.umd.edu [129.2.152.45]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA07219 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:36:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from xi.dorm.umd.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by xi.dorm.umd.edu (8.7.3/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA01819; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 11:35:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 11:35:32 -0500 (EST) From: Sujal Patel X-Sender: smpatel@xi.dorm.umd.edu To: Ron Bolin cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: SMC8416BT Support In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sun, 4 Feb 1996, Ron Bolin wrote: > I installed FBSD 2.01 ans am using an SMC 8416BT MIC. > I get a ed0: device timeout when the system comes up. > Got andy ideas as to weterh this card should work. > I ahve a Wt0 device at int 5 and 300h. I placed the SMC8416BT > on int 10 and 340h in the kernel conf gen file. > This card is listed in the source code and the /var/log/message > file shows that it recongizes the card (by signature). I'm running the Plug-n-Play version of the 8416 without any problems. Make sure that your interrupt and iomem are correct & non-conflicting (Also run ezstart.exe in DOS to make sure your card is configured for shared memory mode, not IO Port mode). device ed0 at isa? port 0x240 net irq 11 iomem 0xd0000 vector edintr Sujal From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 08:49:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA08157 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:49:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA08139 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:48:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id RAA21430; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:47:48 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602051647.RAA21430@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Some thoughts on FAT filesystems To: rnordier@iafrica.com (Robert Nordier) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:47:48 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602051456.QAA00587@eac.iafrica.com> from "Robert Nordier" at Feb 5, 96 04:56:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > > Assuming a cluster size of 4K (which is nice > > because it has the same size as a page), then a 4K portion of the > > FAT suffices for 8MB of data. > > OK. Giving 2048 clusters per group and one 16-bit (presumably) FAT > portion per CG. But where is the FAT located: next to the CG, or at > the start of the partition? the real FAT must be at the beginning of the partition. A copy can be located next to the CG. > > (Apparently next to the CG -- see below.) > > > For efficiency, when the FS loads this FAT portion in memory (or > > at the first write) it could also build a "free list" of clusters > > in the CG, so as to speed up allocations. > > Would a free list hold any advantage? Why not just scan your FAT > copy for the next 0 (ie. free cluster)? This could be handled using > a single 80x86 'scas' op. Don't event think about it: non portable machine code, trashing the cache with many useless memory accessess... :) The free list gives you constant time access to a free block. > > Also for efficiency, > > writes to the FAT should not be done too frequently, because of > > their cost. > > Write to disk, presumably. So are we controlling caching ourselves? yes if we can. Otherwise, resort to the LRU cache of memory pages. > > When creating new files, one should privilege locality within the > > CG, much like it is done in the FFS. Of course, when the CG fills > > up, or the disk is heavily fragmented (read: has been written by > > DOS) one might have to use blocks in different CGs. > > How are you planning to link the CG chain from one FAT to another? they are part of a same file, see the description under "RECOVERY" > > CACHING and WRITES: > > The caching policy might not be much different from that of FFS: try to > > keep in memory the FAT copies first, do not immediately go to the disk > > for data blocks as they might have a short lifetime, etc. > > > RECOVERY: > > using delayed writes to the FAT might lead to bad inconsistencies to > > the filesystem in case of power failures. One possible approach could > > be the following: > > 1) create a "special" file in the root directory, with fixed size and > > structure. This file uses exactly one cluster per CG, say at the > > beginning of the CG, where the portion of the FAT for that CG is > > saved. > > Is this (effectively) the second copy of the FAT? Next to the first? > > > Writing to this cluster is cheaper than writing to the FAT > > because of physical contiguity. > > I don't get it. Aren't they next to each other? > > > Also, there is no risk of corruption > > of this file because its structure does not change, hence > > modifications to its content do not require changing the FAT or the > > directory entry (unless one wants to update the modification times; > > but this is not very important). > > I still don't see what this file gets you that a FAT copy doesn't. (How > is a file of unchanging structure/size any different from a FAT?) You > could just as well say, "No risk of corruption to the FAT, because > modifications do not require changing the FAT." Or not? > > > 2) When the FS is updated, modifications to the FAT are written to this > > local FAT first, and then, at a convenient time, dumped to the > > ordinary FAT. > > Do the FAT portions (collectively) constitute the ordinary FAT? > > > 3) Recovery after a crash: first check for the existence of the > > "special" file, then look for inconsistencies between the regular > > FAT and this special file, and try to reconstruct things. > > Still seems just like two FAT copies to me. > > > Not many new ideas, as you can see, just trying to see if known > > technology can be reused. > > I'm probably missing something obvious, but I don't quite see how it all > ties together.... I'll try to rephrase it: some utility program creates a special file, called "C:\FASTFAT" with the following features: + same size as a single FAT; + its clusters are spread in the disk, one at the beginning of each CG + its size does not change with time. C:\FASTFAT contains a verbatim copy of the FAT. The fast FAT filesystem tries to keep FAT blocks in memory, writes critical things to C:\FASTFAT (of use during recoveries) and updates the standard FATs (those at the beginning of the disk) every 30 seconds or whenever a sync() is requested. If the system does not crash, C:\FASTFAT for an umounted filesystem contains the same data of the two FATs on the disk. If there is a crash, C:\FASTFAT, if it exists, should contain more up-to-date information (there is no danger to loose C:\FASTFAT because it is at fixed locations and its structure does not change with time). Did I make it sufficiently clear now ? Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 08:59:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA08732 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:59:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from alfa.ist.utl.pt (alfa.ist.utl.pt [193.136.132.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA08710 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 08:58:24 -0800 (PST) Received: (from l41407@localhost) by alfa.ist.utl.pt (8.7.1/8.7.1) id RAA22860; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:54:50 GMT Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:54:50 +0000 (GMT) From: Nuno Jose Simoes Goncalves Pedro To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk unsubscribe freebsd-hackers-digest unsubscribe chat From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 09:23:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA11058 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:23:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from nixpbe.pdb.sni.de (mail.sni.de [192.109.2.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA11049 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:23:33 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nerv@localhost) by nixpbe.pdb.sni.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA12423 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 18:22:51 +0100 Message-Id: <199602051722.SAA12423@nixpbe.pdb.sni.de> Subject: Re: Q: why install -d dir missing ? To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Mon, 5 Feb 96 18:18:43 MET From: Greg Lehey Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (Hackers; FreeBSD) In-Reply-To: <199602031524.QAA11526@uriah.heep.sax.de>; from "J Wunsch" at Feb 3, 96 4:24 pm X-Mailer: xmail 2.4 (based on ELM 2.2 PL16) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > As haury@sagem.fr wrote: >> >> I am wondering why the well known option '-d' is missing in current install >> program. Since I am a newbie in FreeBSD, I hope it's not an old war :-) > > It is. :-) > > Directories are to be created via the /etc/mtrees/* templates, not via > some hack in install(1). OK, let me open up old wounds. What does /etc/mtrees have to do with the latest version of xfoo that I found on the net? Unfortunately, xfoo's Makefile uses install -d. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 09:31:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA11756 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:31:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA11751 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:31:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from gemini.sdsp.mc.xerox.com ([13.231.132.20]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <14823(2)>; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:30:48 PST Received: from gnu.mc.xerox.com (gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com) by gemini.sdsp.mc.xerox.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA07450; Mon, 5 Feb 96 12:30:33 EST Received: by gnu.mc.xerox.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA00291; Mon, 5 Feb 96 12:30:33 EST Message-Id: <9602051730.AA00291@gnu.mc.xerox.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: passings fds Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 09:30:32 PST From: "Marty Leisner" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I'm not sure I understand send/recv over Unix domain stream sockets (is this possible?) Also, aren't writes less than a PIPEBUF (i.e atomic?) Also, I see msg_accrights/msg_accrightslen was changed to msg_control/msg_controllen...was this a change from 4.3 to 4.4? Can the receive tell how many fd's were passed? I assume you need to fill the fd array with -1 to tell what got changed... What happens if the receiver doesn't provide space for the fds? marty leisner@sdsp.mc.xerox.com Member of the League for Programming Freedom (http://www.lpf.org) Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic Arthur C. Clarke, The Lost Worlds of 2001 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 10:02:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA13919 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:02:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from austin.polstra.com (austin.polstra.com [206.213.73.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA13902 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:02:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from austin.polstra.com (jdp@localhost) by austin.polstra.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA05372; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:01:57 -0800 Message-Id: <199602051801.KAA05372@austin.polstra.com> To: jkh@time.cdrom.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup is broken? In-reply-to: <26947.823390500@time.cdrom.com> Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 10:01:57 -0800 From: John Polstra Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Jordan wrote: > PLEASE DON'T USE SUP.FREEBSD.ORG TO UPDATE YOURSELF! Good evening, my name is John, and I use sup.freebsd.org to update myself. [ embarrassed applause from the other supaholics in the audience ] Wow, I feel better already! Jordan, I would be more than happy to switch to an alternate sup server, if only the other ones would work worth a sh*t! I have tried several times to use sup2 and other servers. Each time, it has caused me nothing but trouble. Am I just lucky? Last night, after reading your latest admonition against using sup.freebsd.org, I tried again to use sup2. As soon as it connected up, it began systematically deleting the files in my sup tree, shamelessly announcing each deletion as it went about its sordid business. To all appearances, it had the intention of deleting my entire tree. So I killed it, and once again went back to sup.freebsd.org, which always works just fine for me, thank you. When I try an experiment, and that experiment attempts to delete 220 MB of my files, I lose my thirst for adventure very quickly. Nevertheless, if you or somebody else can give me some clue about how to switch to a different sup server without losing all my perfectly good files, I'll try again. -- John Polstra jdp@polstra.com John D. Polstra & Co., Inc. Seattle, Washington USA "Self-knowledge is always bad news." -- John Barth From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 10:27:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA15282 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:27:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA15277 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:27:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <14971(3)>; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:26:43 PST Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177478>; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:26:33 -0800 X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: Richard Wackerbarth , Kim Culhan , hackers@freebsd.org, stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup is broken? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 03 Feb 1996 15:35:00 PST." <26947.823390500@time.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:26:31 PST From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <96Feb5.102633pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <26947.823390500@time.cdrom.com>you write: >That's one option, or as I also told Kim - PLEASE DON'T USE SUP.FREEBSD.ORG >TO UPDATE YOURSELF! Has anyone thought of not calling it sup.freebsd.org any more? Call it sup-master.freebsd.org, instead, and give sup.freebsd.org 3 A records, those of sup1, sup2, and sup3. That way, if someone doesn't know what they are doing, they will get a random one of sup1, sup2 or sup3; if they know what they are doing they will use sup[123] directly, and it would be really hard to hit freefall by accident. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 10:32:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA15637 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:32:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from eac.iafrica.com (slipper101157.iafrica.com [196.7.101.157]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA15598 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:31:46 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rnordier@localhost) by eac.iafrica.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA01047; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:29:48 +0200 From: Robert Nordier Message-Id: <199602051829.UAA01047@eac.iafrica.com> Subject: Re: Some thoughts on FAT filesystems To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:29:47 +0200 (SAT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602051647.RAA21430@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 5, 96 05:47:48 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > I'll try to rephrase it: some utility program creates a special file, > called "C:\FASTFAT" with the following features: > > + same size as a single FAT; > + its clusters are spread in the disk, one at the beginning of each CG > + its size does not change with time. > . . . . . Yes, that's clear. :-) It's a shame, but I guess ingenuity spent on the FAT fs may well just be ingenuity wasted.... The FAT3 approach seems too prone to get out of sync, anytime anyone does anything in DOS. It needs setting up; and it's just too _exposed_. Because it's non-standard, users will complain bitterly when it bombs out; because it is visible, it'll be an endless minor source of controversy.... If people really want the extra performance, I'd suggest the option of doing as Windows NT does and writing the FAT asynchronously. At least people are used to that, or used to the partial equivalent of running smartdrv without a write-through cache. And at least that would be a Microsoft-approved mess. :-) -- Robert Nordier From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 10:39:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA16185 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:39:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA16180 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 10:39:27 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602051839.KAA16180@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Andrew Heybey cc: Doug Rabson , "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" , "Jordan K. Hubbard" , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: And the winner is! In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 10:22:05 EST." <199602051522.KAA02892@grapenuts.bellcore.com> Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 10:39:27 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > dfr> It seems like one could use sup to keep systems in sync. > dfr> Basically, you would run a supserver on the 'code server' and > dfr> regularly sup the client systems against it. The sup config > dfr> files allow you to do stuff like run ranlib on /usr/lib/lib*.a, > dfr> execute newaliases when /etc/aliases changes, don't take > dfr> specific files from /etc/ which are per-system. > >Yes, sup would work and has some advantages (for one thing reconcile >needs the server to be NFS mounted). For me it was a matter of being >familiar with reconcile. Also, reconcile does several things that I >don't know if sup can do: > >1. Map from one file name to another. For example, one could have >/etc/sysconfig.CLIENT (since the server probably wants a different >configuration in its /etc/sysconfig) which gets copied to >/etc/sysconfig on the clients. [Speaking of which, if one wants to >set up several machines, it is somewhat obnoxious that the hostname >and interfaces are hard-wired in sysconfig. I like hostname.* files >better instead of running sed on sysconfig. Just MHO.] SUP handles this with the "rename" command. >2. Reconcile won't touch files on the client that have changed. Not >just files that are newer on the client (which is what I gather sup >can do (from a cursory inspection of the man page)). Reconcile keeps >a database of the mtimes (or ctimes, I'm not sure) of the files so as >tell if the file has changed on the client. I happen to like this >feature--if something changes on the client it is probably for a >reason and one doesn't want the change wiped out just because the rest >of the client's file system is being kept up to date. Depends on the application, but I can see where this could be useful. >3. Reconcile can automatically create symlinks to the server instead >of copying if you want to save disk space on the client. (Again, this >assumes a LAN and NFS mounting of the server.) For example on the >machines I set up, /usr/src -> /server/user/src. I just put symlinks into the SUP collection. >andrew -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 11:59:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA19165 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 11:59:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from border.com (janus.border.com [199.71.190.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA19160 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 11:59:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by janus.border.com id <20481>; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:08:03 -0500 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:58:47 -0500 From: Jerry Kendall To: FreeBSD Hackers Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Message-Id: <96Feb5.150803est.20481@janus.border.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk OK all you hackers out there, this is your chance to boast about how well(or not) something works... I am asking the hackers list because my FIRST and FOREMOST OS is FreeBSD. I would like to purchase a sound card for my system... Sound Blaster is my preference.... Now then, I would like to mention, that I would like to use this card with EF2000, a futuristic Jet Fighter simulation type game... It MUST work with FreeBSD 2.1R AND any newer version of FreeBSD yet to come. Although, there are times when I would like to kick some futuristic butt. My primary use will be for developing 'games' on FreeBSD that contain sound... Not to mention, mixing it with 'QuickCam' or similar video systems to do IP audio/video messages and the like. Any comments or suggestions??? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Any comments or opinions in this message are my own and may or may not reflect the comments or opinions of my present or previous employers. Jerry Kendall Border Network Technologies Inc. System Software Engineer Tel +1-416-368-7157 ext 303 jerry@border.com Fax +1-416-368-7178 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 12:19:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA20443 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:19:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA20438 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:19:37 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA13616; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:16:54 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602052016.NAA13616@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Watchdog timer To: dennis@etinc.com (dennis) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:16:53 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602050144.UAA27896@etinc.com> from "dennis" at Feb 4, 96 08:44:04 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > >So let's all chip in $40 toward the death of PCI. 8-). > > boy is this a typo or what! Uh... ISA! I MEANT ISA! Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 12:25:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA20809 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:25:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA20804 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:25:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA14247; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:22:59 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602052022.NAA14247@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:22:59 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602050135.CAA02717@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Feb 5, 96 02:35:35 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > If you wanna improve the FAT file system implementation, first study > its bottlenecks. The msdosfs code could certainly be improved in > terms of robustness and performance. Since it's kernel-level, it has > full control over what kind of buffers it will allocate, either > pageable or non-pageable. I think the biggest win would be a 512b buffer validity granularity. That is, an 8 bit bitmap for pages indicating which disk blocks in a given page are in fact valid. This would save significantly in read overhead for sequential rewrite of an existing file, or random write of records of less than half the page size. The VM modifications would not be insignificant. One of the biggest bottlenecks in the Linux MSDOSFS was the 1k read granularity in the disk driver causing significant read overhead for the actual on disk block/cluster I/O. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 12:28:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA21035 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:28:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA21030 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:28:42 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA14850; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:26:30 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602052026.NAA14850@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: rnordier@iafrica.com (Robert Nordier) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:26:30 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602050616.IAA03554@eac.iafrica.com> from "Robert Nordier" at Feb 5, 96 08:16:27 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Hmm... FAT can contain at most 64K of entries, each 2 bytes long, so > > the needed amount of memory (if you cache raw FAT and don't try to make > > any ``cooked'' version) must be at most 128Kbytes long. IMHO the raw FAT > > is enough convenient ant takes not very much of memory. > > Agreed. > > This is what the original author of the MS-DOS filesystem had to say on > the subject of caching: > > The new MS-DOS [ie. DOS 2.0] does not keep the file > allocation tables in memory at all times. Instead the > tables share the use of sector buffers.... This change > in the DOS goes completely against my original design > principles.... Now we're back to doing disk reads just > to find out where the data is. > -- Tim Paterson, Byte, June 1983. That's because Tim didn't turn around and add a sector buffer cache. Probably because DOS 2.0 was still fighting the 640k limit. Let's not limit ourselves because of absurd design decisions on the part of DOS weenies... if they knew how to design an OS, we wouldn't need FreeBSD. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 12:30:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA21139 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:30:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA21134 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:30:07 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA14425; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:24:10 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602052024.NAA14425@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: babkin@hq.icb.chel.su (Serge A. Babkin) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:24:10 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602050350.IAA24118@hq.icb.chel.su> from "Serge A. Babkin" at Feb 5, 96 08:50:19 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > The FAT-caching in the MACH implementation (you *could* just port the > > MACH code...) takes a significant amount of memory, IMO. > > Hmm... FAT can contain at most 64K of entries, each 2 bytes long, so > the needed amount of memory (if you cache raw FAT and don't try to make > any ``cooked'' version) must be at most 128Kbytes long. IMHO the raw FAT > is enough convenient ant takes not very much of memory. I guess this is true, unless you consider what preferential caching does to the locality of reference model in the rest of BSD. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 12:35:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA21463 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:35:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA21453 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:35:31 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA15459; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:31:54 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602052031.NAA15459@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:31:54 -0700 (MST) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, hackers@FreeBSD.org, rnordier@iafrica.com In-Reply-To: <199602050837.JAA20312@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 5, 96 09:37:21 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > 128K is quite small now, but it still isn't necessary to lock it into > > memory. Caching it in a normal LRU way should work reasonably well. > > Perhaps FAT buffers should have a higher priority than other buffers > > for msdosfs, but they probably shouldn't have higher priority than > > buffers for other file systems. > > agreed. That's why I thought not to develop a special purpose caching > policy and try to rely on what is already available. Especally in > FreeBSD, where the FS & VM caches are merged, and the system should be > quite flexible. The problem with doing this is the mmap problem. That is, buffers are cached on the basis of vnode + offset instead of device + offset. Basically, this means that when you recycle vnodes, you must invalidate perfectly good data in the cache because there is no longer a vnode to point to it. This is critically bogus, IMO (do a find from / and listen to the "tick tick tick..." of the disk on a 16M machine, knowing less than 8M of blocks are being accessed, and the noise is unnecessary disk access from vnode recycling -- now you know why I wanted to move the VOP_LOCK code out of the per-FS and why I think dissociating a vnode with a seperate ihashget in ufs is >*BOGUS*<). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 12:41:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA22067 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:41:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA22053 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:41:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA02903; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 12:40:17 -0800 Message-Id: <199602052040.MAA02903@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Jerry Kendall cc: FreeBSD Hackers In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 14:58:47 EST." <96Feb5.150803est.20481@janus.border.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 12:40:17 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >>> Jerry Kendall said: > > > OK all you hackers out there, this is your chance to > boast about how well(or not) something works... > > I am asking the hackers list because my FIRST and FOREMOST OS is FreeBSD. > > > I would like to purchase a sound card for my system... > > Sound Blaster is my preference.... Well, you can always subscribe to : mail majordomo@star-gate.com subscribe multimedia where all the sound/video/conferencing guys hang out. For starters, I would never get a SB . I would get something like a GUS PnP specially for doing audio/video conferencing. Just join the list and we can explain in gory detail if you like. In the game and "demo" arena, the GUS is very , very popular. In FreeBSD the choice of the sound card is not that critical because we have one API. The problem comes in when one wants to take advantage of special features in the sound card . If you do then your application is limited to that sound card. Enjoy, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 13:03:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA23486 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:03:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA23481 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:03:46 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA16844; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:01:33 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602052101.OAA16844@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Solaris CacheFS for FreeBSD? To: dutchman@spase.nl (Kees Jan Koster) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:01:32 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602050950.KAA00543@phobos.spase.nl> from "Kees Jan Koster" at Feb 5, 96 10:50:39 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Some time ago I installed a sun workstation with a friend of mine. We > found that sun has a special filesystem called CacheFS. It can cache > remote filesystems (and CD-ROMS too, I think) on a local disk, thus > reducing network load and increasing performance. > > Is there something like it under FreeBSD? Is there a quick-'n-dirty way > to try it out and make some performance measurements? With the results > I might persuade our sysop to trash linux and use FreeBSD instead ;) This is actually a special case of a replicating FS, as opposed to a true cache. This would be relatively trivial to implement using the unionfs code as a base and working from there; many of the problems are similar in nature, and the additional piece you would need to supply is the replication from the "search second" to the "search first" FS when a "search first" fails. I would say that this would have limited utility on CDROM's, but could be very useful for local replication of NFS data on a "dataless" machine. The vnode would have to be map-directed -- that is, for a vnode that was being used as a swap store, you would have to be using the upper layer, not the lower layer vnode, if you expected the swapping to move from the remote file to the locally replicated copy. It might be more interesting to do a more comprehensive/predictive network replication for nomadic systems, since on a fast net, the benefits of replication should be marginal. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 13:05:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA23686 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:05:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA23678 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:05:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA03155 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:04:53 -0800 Message-Id: <199602052104.NAA03155@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Web and Watchdog Timer??? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 13:04:52 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > > > > > Three chips were announced today. URL is : www.sun.com/sparc/java. See > > below for Sun's press release. > > regards, > > Lin Chao > > > > ------------------ > > Three chip are ( and Sun's positioning): > > 1. UltraJAVA: > > Industry's fastest JAVA processors (3-5X microJAVA performance) > > Leverages VIS technology > > Targets "network computers," 3D graphics, & multimedia applications > > Product sampling: Q4'97 > > Target price: $100 > > Markets: "network computers," entertainment, 3D > > graphics/imaging applications > > > > 2. microJAVA: > > Based on picoJAVA core with application-specific I/O, memory, > > communications and control functions > > Product sampling: Q1'97 > > Target price: $25 - $50 > > Markets: consumer service stations, printers, controllers, > > telecom equipment, low-end games > > > > 3. picoJAVA: > > Low-cost core optimized for JAVA price/performance > > Targeted for industry-wide licensing > > Licensing availability: mid '96 > > Enables < $25 > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > > SUN UNVEILS JAVA PROCESSORS > > Java Internet technology cast in low-cost processors and embedded > > microcontrollers. > > > > SUNNYVALE, CA -- February 2, 1996 -- In a sweeping move designed to > > reshape the economics of the microprocessor market, Sun Microelectronics > > (formerly SPARC Technology Business), a division of Sun Microsystems, > > Inc., unveiled today the industry's first microprocessor family > > optimized for Java. The initial Java processor offering includes a > > three-member product family, a core licensing program, and an upcoming > > reference platform program. With estimated application performance many > > times that of general purpose processors at a fraction of the cost, Sun > > Microelectronics officials estimate that the new class of low-cost Java > > processors will lead to a networked microprocessor market topping $15 > > billion by the year 2000. > > > > "Java presents the microprocessor world with a new product paradigm - > > simple, secure and small," stated Chet Silvestri, president of Sun > > Microelectronics. "And our Java processors cast this paradigm in > > silicon." > > > > "Java software, Java processors and Java systems are central to Sun's > > inter- and intranet strategy," stated Scott McNealy, chairman and CEO of > > Sun Microsystems, Inc. "Creating low-cost Java processors will take this > > powerful technology directly to the consumer, and takes the consumer > > directly into the new paradigm of network computing." > > > > Silvestri continued, "Java processors extend our reach into the low-cost > > consumer and enterprise marketplace. Sun Microelectronics will not only > > offer a full range of Java-optimized component- and board-level > > products, we'll also license these designs to third parties who can > > embed the technology into the wide range of products that will be > > enabled by the rapid growth of the Internet and Java." > > > > "Industry analysts estimate that the overall microprocessor and > > microcontroller market will top $60B by the year 1999," stated Rajesh > > Parekh, Sun Microelectronics' Embedded Products Group vice president and > > general manager. "Today the average business person harbours more than > > 10 microcontrollers. By 1999, the average home will contain between 50 > > and 100 microcontrollers. And worldwide there will be more than 145 > > million cellular phone users -- each with at least one microcontroller. > > The result? Millions of cellular phones, security systems, entertainment > > systems, low-cost network terminals, and other internet appliances > > operating within a network and highly optimized for small applications > > or applets running at top speed. We believe that our Java processors can > > provide a more optimum solution in a quarter of these applications." > > > > "Java opens new doors for processor architecture. Our Java processors > > capitalize on this opportunity by streamlining the architecture, > > increasing parallelism and providing advanced 3D graphics operations," > > noted Anant Agrawal, Sun Microelectronics' vice president of > > engineering. "And our architectural strategy allows us to offer > > processors at price and performance points for high-volume consumer and > > enterprise applications." > > > > About picoJAVA, microJAVA, and UltraJAVA > > > > The Java processor family consists of three lines of microprocessors - > > picoJAVA, microJAVA and UltraJAVA - that vary in price, performance and > > application. The picoJAVA core is designed to be the industry's best > > price/performance silicon design supporting the Java Virtual Machine > > specification. Licensing of the low-cost core will enable sub $25 > > Java-optimized processors for cellular phones, printers and other > > consumer and peripheral markets. The first picoJAVA core is expected to > > be available in mid-1996 for industry wide licensing. > > > > The microJAVA chip-level products are based upon the picoJAVA core and > > add application-specific I/O, memory, communications and control > > functions. Targeted at both general-purpose and industry-specific > > markets, microJAVA processors will range in price from $25 to $100. > > These chips will be ideal for a broad range of network-based devices > > such as controllers and telcom carrier equipment, as well as consumer > > products such as low-end games and service stations > > (print/reservation/directory/mail centers). The first microJAVA > > processors are expected to sample in the first quarter of 1997. > > > > The UltraJAVA processor line will include the industry's fastest > > Java processors. This line leverages advanced graphics circuits and > > features next-generation enhancements of Sun Microelectronics' VIS > > instruction set. UltraJAVA processors will target advanced 3D graphics > > and other multimedia-intensive applications. Starting at $100, the first > > UltraJAVA processors are expected to sample in late 1997. > > > > About Java > > > > The Java language is the result of several years of research and > > development at Sun Microsystems, Inc. It is the first language to > > provide a comprehensive, robust, platform-independent solution to the > > challenges of programming for the Internet and other complex networks. > > Java features portability, security and advanced networking without > > compromising performance. Sun Microelectronics' traditional family of > > SPARC processors, as well as processors of other architectures, will run > > Java software. By optimizing the new Java processor family for Java-only > > applications, an unprecedented level of price/performance will be > > reached. > > > > Sun Microelectronics (formerly SPARC Technology Business), a division of > > Sun Microsystems, Inc., was formed in April 1993 to develop, design > > and distribute SPARC and related technologies and products worldwide. > > The division's portfolio includes microprocessors, chipsets, modules, > > boards, technology licenses, silicon and systems packages and consulting > > services. Currently, the division has more than 500 employees working in > > product development, engineering, marketing and worldwide sales and > > support. Complete information on Sun Microelectronics is available via > > the World Wide Web at http://www.sun.com/sparc/. Information on the > > SPARC architecture, including a complete list of its supporters is > > available at http://www.sparc.com/. > > > > News Release #95-042 > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 13:06:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA23738 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:06:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA23726 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:06:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <15995(4)>; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:05:15 PST Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177478>; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:05:03 -0800 X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: Terry Lambert cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: List Duplicates In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 03 Feb 1996 13:44:43 PST." <199602032144.OAA04394@phaeton.artisoft.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:04:58 PST From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <96Feb5.130503pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199602032144.OAA04394@phaeton.artisoft.com>you write: >The list handler needs to write a reply-to that only includes the list >and rewrite the cc line to remove people on the list (potentially >removing the cc line entirely). No! Argh! Lists that include Reply-To: headers are *evil*, because it then generally gets hard to reply just to the original author privately -- which one might think would be good to encourage. People should just learn to trim their headers. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 13:26:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA25945 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:26:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA25933 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:26:19 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id NAA26300; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:20:37 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602052120.NAA26300@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: And the winner is! To: ath@bellcore.com (Andrew Heybey) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:20:36 -0800 (PST) Cc: dfr@render.com, karl@mcs.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602051522.KAA02892@grapenuts.bellcore.com> from "Andrew Heybey" at Feb 5, 96 10:22:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk We do this on our production sites at TFS (not at pouls's site though :) All machines SUP everything at boot and applications are SUP'd on operator sign-on in some cases as well. (e.g. keing stateions.. log off and log on to get newer versions of the app. (naturally there is USUALLY nothing to get) > > dfr> It seems like one could use sup to keep systems in sync. > dfr> Basically, you would run a supserver on the 'code server' and > dfr> regularly sup the client systems against it. The sup config > dfr> files allow you to do stuff like run ranlib on /usr/lib/lib*.a, > dfr> execute newaliases when /etc/aliases changes, don't take > dfr> specific files from /etc/ which are per-system. > > Yes, sup would work and has some advantages (for one thing reconcile > needs the server to be NFS mounted). For me it was a matter of being > familiar with reconcile. Also, reconcile does several things that I > don't know if sup can do: > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 13:28:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA26228 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:28:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from sivka.carrier.kiev.ua (root@sivka.carrier.kiev.ua [193.125.68.130]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA26111 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:27:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from elvisti.kiev.ua (uucp@localhost) by sivka.carrier.kiev.ua (Sendmail 8.who.cares/5) with UUCP id XAA26780 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:27:02 +0200 Received: from office.elvisti.kiev.ua (office.elvisti.kiev.ua [193.125.28.33]) by spider2.elvisti.kiev.ua (8.6.12/8.ElVisti) with ESMTP id WAA02977 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:45:27 +0200 Received: (from stesin@localhost) by office.elvisti.kiev.ua (8.6.12/8.ElVisti) id WAA25198; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:45:25 +0200 From: "Andrew V. Stesin" Message-Id: <199602052045.WAA25198@office.elvisti.kiev.ua> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: lehey.pad@sni.de (Greg Lehey) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:45:24 +0200 (EET) Cc: stesin@elvisti.kiev.ua, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602051556.QAA07468@nixpbe.pdb.sni.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Feb 5, 96 04:52:07 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24alpha5] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk About Conner CFP1060S drives: # >: Aiee! Unless you have a faulty power connector, _send_it_back_ right now. # >: If it's spinning down the drive is sure it has a _serious_ problem. # > # > I STRONGLY second this. We had this same drive model died recently. # > Two last days before final death it was stinking with the # > messages "not ready" to the console... # Greg wrote: # I've missed the beginning of this story, but can't spinning down also # mean that the drive is overheating? In our case it wasn't. The temperature was Ok, ventilation too. BUT. The drive which died was not really a CPF1060S. That was CFP1080S with a "small" (or "Sun-style") interface connector, and an additional part which had a usual 50-pin SCSI connector. Maybe one of those disks left when Sun refused to buy Conners any more. # # Greg # -- With best regards -- Andrew Stesin. +380 (44) 2760188 +380 (44) 2713457 +380 (44) 2713560 "You may delegate authority, but not responsibility." Frank's Management Rule #1. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 13:40:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA27690 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:40:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from eac.iafrica.com (slipper101152.iafrica.com [196.7.101.152]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA27682 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:40:43 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rnordier@localhost) by eac.iafrica.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA00586; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:17:00 +0200 From: Robert Nordier Message-Id: <199602052117.XAA00586@eac.iafrica.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:16:58 +0200 (SAT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602052026.NAA14850@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 5, 96 01:26:30 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > > The new MS-DOS [ie. DOS 2.0] does not keep the file > > allocation tables in memory at all times. Instead the > > tables share the use of sector buffers.... This change > > in the DOS goes completely against my original design > > principles.... Now we're back to doing disk reads just > > to find out where the data is. > > -- Tim Paterson, Byte, June 1983. > > That's because Tim didn't turn around and add a sector buffer cache. > > Probably because DOS 2.0 was still fighting the 640k limit. Let's > not limit ourselves because of absurd design decisions on the part > of DOS weenies... if they knew how to design an OS, we wouldn't > need FreeBSD. No arguments here. The implementation needs to be idiomatic *BSD. A point I was making is that the current DOS way of implementing the VATFS isn't the only acceptable way. -- Robert Nordier From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 13:41:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA27761 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:41:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from eac.iafrica.com (slipper101152.iafrica.com [196.7.101.152]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA27728 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:41:15 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rnordier@localhost) by eac.iafrica.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id XAA00613; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:37:02 +0200 From: Robert Nordier Message-Id: <199602052137.XAA00613@eac.iafrica.com> Subject: Re: Some thoughts on FAT filesystems To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:37:01 +0200 (SAT) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602051948.UAA21768@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 5, 96 08:48:16 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Luigi Rizzo wrote: > > of sync, anytime anyone does anything in DOS. It needs setting up; > > and it's just too _exposed_. Because it's non-standard, users will > > complain bitterly when it bombs out; because it is visible, it'll > > be an endless minor source of controversy.... > > Sorry but it is completely standard. Well, perhaps I should have said "`non-standard'": meaning non-standard to DOS users, as a way of dealing with the DOS FS. > Yes, you are organizing data on the disk in a smarter way, > but that's completely compatible with standard FAT. > Only at runtime under FreeBSD you > have additional live structures that are only helpful if your system > crashes. And when your system crashes in the middle of a disk write, do > you complain because you have to use a non-standard utility to recover > your data instead of loosing them ? Oh, they're _transient_ structures? I understood them to be fixed. > > And about visibility: anything you install to improve performance > becomes visible, either in the form of a file containing a device > driver, a few lines in CONFIG.SYS (or a few hundreds of line in > SYSTEM.INI...) etc. > > And, in the end, should we really care about all this ? > > > If people really want the extra performance, I'd suggest the option of > > doing as Windows NT does and writing the FAT asynchronously. At least > > people are used to that, or used to the partial equivalent of running > > smartdrv without a write-through cache. And at least that would be a > > Microsoft-approved mess. :-) > > but we don't have this under FreeBSD. > I'm certainly not knocking the thought that went into this.... However, doing like NT will be _much_ easier, a bit quicker, and it will implement a way of living dangerously that DOS users completely understand (maybe even expect). So they've got a safe mode and a fast mode. Surely that's enough? -- Robert Nordier From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 13:49:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA28478 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:49:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from eel.dataplex.net (EEL.DATAPLEX.NET [199.183.109.245]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA28452 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 13:49:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from [199.183.109.242] (cod [199.183.109.242]) by eel.dataplex.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA07099; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:48:55 -0600 X-Sender: rkw@shark.dataplex.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:48:59 -0600 To: John Polstra From: Richard Wackerbarth Subject: Re: sup is broken? Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, stable@FreeBSD.org Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jordan wrote: >> PLEASE DON'T USE SUP.FREEBSD.ORG TO UPDATE YOURSELF! John Polstra replied: >Last night, after reading your latest admonition against using >sup.freebsd.org, I tried again to use sup2. As soon as it connected >up, it began systematically deleting the files in my sup tree, >shamelessly announcing each deletion as it went about its sordid >business. To all appearances, it had the intention of deleting my >entire tree. So I killed it, and once again went back to >sup.freebsd.org, which always works just fine for me, thank you. > >When I try an experiment, and that experiment attempts to delete >220 MB of my files, I lose my thirst for adventure very quickly. >Nevertheless, if you or somebody else can give me some clue about >how to switch to a different sup server without losing all my >perfectly good files, I'll try again. As I have pointed out, the cvs tree that I am getting from sup2 also seems to have problems. As a result, my distribution in the name of -stable, reflects the same condition. We MUST get these problems fixed or we all will be forced to "look to the source" for correct data. ---- Richard Wackerbarth rkw@dataplex.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 14:22:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA00872 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:22:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from main (tty11.com5.houston.net [198.66.103.108]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA00864 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:22:03 -0800 (PST) Received: (from gclarkii@localhost) by main (8.6.12/8.6.9) id QAA10190 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:22:37 -0600 From: Gary Clark II Message-Id: <199602052222.QAA10190@main> Subject: New perl module To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:21:21 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I've got a perl module I would like to inport to current and wanted to know the PROPER way to get it into /usr/src/gnu/usr.bin/perl/modules(??). It is about 200k, GPLed and would make nice looking apps alot easier. Gary P.S. If someone wanted to import it real quick...:) P.P.S It is a menu/template module Gary Clark II (N5VMF) gclarkii@FreeBSD.ORG From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 14:45:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA02487 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:45:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA02481 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:45:25 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA00505; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:43:42 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602052243.PAA00505@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: List Duplicates To: fenner@parc.xerox.com (Bill Fenner) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:43:42 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <96Feb5.130503pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> from "Bill Fenner" at Feb 5, 96 01:04:58 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > In message <199602032144.OAA04394@phaeton.artisoft.com>you write: > >The list handler needs to write a reply-to that only includes the list > >and rewrite the cc line to remove people on the list (potentially > >removing the cc line entirely). > > No! Argh! Lists that include Reply-To: headers are *evil*, because it then > generally gets hard to reply just to the original author privately -- which > one might think would be good to encourage. > > People should just learn to trim their headers. Point of order: how do I tell which individual addresses in the current headers are or are not in the list addresses also in the current headers? Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 14:49:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA02708 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:49:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA02675 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:48:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by Sysiphos id AA28166 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:48:46 +0100 Message-Id: <199602052248.AA28166@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:48:46 +0100 X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org, stable@freebsd.org Subject: Lost some mail ... Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi all! Just in case you sent some NCR or PCI driver related message within the last 24 hours: We had major reliability problems with our central file server, and it managed to crash (again) while I was just updating my mail inbox. This made me loose soem 30 messages I intended to reply to later ... So in case you don't hear from me within for more than a day after sending mail of some kind, please resend your message, since it most probably was lost. Regards, STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 15:00:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA03381 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:00:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA03373 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:00:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <14569(1)>; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:59:43 PST Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177478>; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:59:41 -0800 To: Terry Lambert cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: List Duplicates In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 96 14:43:42 PST." <199602052243.PAA00505@phaeton.artisoft.com> Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 14:59:40 PST From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <96Feb5.145941pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199602052243.PAA00505@phaeton.artisoft.com> you write: >Point of order: how do I tell which individual addresses in the current >headers are or are not in the list addresses also in the current headers? I will concede the potential of it being nice to have the To: or cc: lines trimmed by the mail server, although it is a relatively expensive operation, won't help people for whom multiple addresses map to one, and I sometimes *like* to be able to have a conversation "outside" the list using cc:'s; list mail comes really slowly for me. Just pointing out that different people use mailing lists differently, I guess. But if the FreeBSD lists start using Reply-To: then I will have to write some code to remove it, or something, so that I can still bear to be subscribed to them. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 15:16:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA04532 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:16:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA04524 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:16:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA25577; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:15:02 -0800 To: Greg Lehey cc: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com, hackers@freebsd.org (Hackers; FreeBSD) Subject: Re: Willows In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 15:20:55 +0700." <199602051425.PAA00835@nixpbe.pdb.sni.de> Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 15:15:01 -0800 Message-ID: <25575.823562101@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Wine may not use LDTs, but if you don't set the appropriate option > (USER_LDT, from memory) in the kernel config, wine refuses to try to > work. Nothing else does, so I suppose it doesn't use user LDTs. Huh? Wine most definitely DOES use USER_LDTs. I don't know how you manage to come to the conclusion above - UTSL! :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 15:22:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA04948 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:22:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA04927 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:22:00 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id PAA26558; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:19:20 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602052319.PAA26558@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: sup is broken? To: fenner@parc.xerox.com (Bill Fenner) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:19:20 -0800 (PST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, rkw@dataplex.net, kimc@w8hd.org, hackers@freebsd.org, stable@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <96Feb5.102633pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> from "Bill Fenner" at Feb 5, 96 10:26:31 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk make it so.. > > In message <26947.823390500@time.cdrom.com>you write: > >That's one option, or as I also told Kim - PLEASE DON'T USE SUP.FREEBSD.ORG > >TO UPDATE YOURSELF! > > Has anyone thought of not calling it sup.freebsd.org any more? Call it > sup-master.freebsd.org, instead, and give sup.freebsd.org 3 A records, those > of sup1, sup2, and sup3. That way, if someone doesn't know what they are > doing, they will get a random one of sup1, sup2 or sup3; if they know what > they are doing they will use sup[123] directly, and it would be really hard to > hit freefall by accident. > > Bill > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 15:50:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA07067 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:50:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA07026 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:49:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id PAA03904; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:48:55 -0800 Message-Id: <199602052348.PAA03904@Root.COM> X-Authentication-Warning: implode.Root.COM: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Julian Elischer cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com (Bill Fenner), jkh@time.cdrom.com, rkw@dataplex.net, kimc@w8hd.org, hackers@freebsd.org, stable@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup is broken? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 15:19:20 PST." <199602052319.PAA26558@ref.tfs.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 15:48:55 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >make it so.. Not until someone goes and verifies that all of the sup*.freebsd.org targets are working correctly. Also, my experiance with multiple A records is that it always comes up with them same one (not random). -DG David Greenman Core Team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project >> In message <26947.823390500@time.cdrom.com>you write: >> >That's one option, or as I also told Kim - PLEASE DON'T USE SUP.FREEBSD.ORG >> >TO UPDATE YOURSELF! >> >> Has anyone thought of not calling it sup.freebsd.org any more? Call it >> sup-master.freebsd.org, instead, and give sup.freebsd.org 3 A records, those >> of sup1, sup2, and sup3. That way, if someone doesn't know what they are >> doing, they will get a random one of sup1, sup2 or sup3; if they know what >> they are doing they will use sup[123] directly, and it would be really hard to >> hit freefall by accident. >> >> Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 15:58:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA07731 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:58:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA07725 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:58:20 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/1.2) id QAA09358; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:58:11 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199602052358.QAA09358@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Re: motion detection? To: langfod@maui.com (David Langford) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:58:11 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199602052300.NAA12351@ maui.com> from "David Langford" at Feb 5, 96 01:00:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > >Does anyone have a program to detect motion and then take a snapshot > >of the scene? > > A cheap way (computation wise) would be to have a microwave or infrared > detector trigger a signal for the sytem to take snapshot(s). > > If you want to do it in software the simplest way would be to hack > something like what MPEG uses to find differences between frames. > > True motion detection of course would require you to find object boundaries. > > I wonder if you used edge detection and check if the edges themselves > changed... > > So lets see, Your watching TV on your monitor, someone walks down the driveway > an X-window pops up to alert you to the fact and turns on the X-10 light > switch by the front door. You notice its your wife (etc..) and you click the > little icon labeled stereo and the classical CD starts playing and the lights > dim. Or am I reading too much into all this :) If you are looking for really *gross* triggers, just look at average light level changes over the entire frame. And, since the number of samples (i.e. pixels) is constant, this would just be a sum of all dots. This needs a tiny filter on the average to ignore small changes as would be evident from quantization and then a discriminator to trip your alarm. hey, I *said* it would be gross but I imagine you could implement this in an hour and test it just as quick. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 15:59:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA07807 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:59:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from seagull.rtd.com (root@seagull.rtd.com [198.102.68.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA07800 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:59:16 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dgy@localhost) by seagull.rtd.com (8.6.12/1.2) id QAA09381 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:59:14 -0700 From: Don Yuniskis Message-Id: <199602052359.QAA09381@seagull.rtd.com> Subject: Apologies... To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:59:14 -0700 (MST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Sorry, that last post was supposed to go to multimedia list... Guess I need to pause before hitting "SEND"... <:-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 16:00:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA08040 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:00:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA08033 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:00:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <16057(1)>; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:59:48 PST Received: by crevenia.parc.xerox.com id <177478>; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:59:45 -0800 From: Bill Fenner To: davidg@root.com Subject: Re: sup is broken? Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, stable@freebsd.org Message-Id: <96Feb5.155945pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:59:44 PST Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Also, my experiance with multiple A records is that it always comes >up with them same one (not random). Recent BIND's will round-robin multiple A records; you should get them from the name server in a pseudo-random order. Try "dig @uucp-gw-1.pa.dec.com a tbfddi1.gw.psu.edu | head -15" several times in a row, you will get different answers. (Of course, if you ask your local caching server, then you will keep getting the same answers -- but we are talking about widely seperated people doing their own individual queries, and everyone is not likely to be talking to the same caching server.) Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 16:12:15 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA08804 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:12:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA08795 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:12:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA26090; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:11:48 -0800 To: John Polstra cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup is broken? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 10:01:57 PST." <199602051801.KAA05372@austin.polstra.com> Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 16:11:47 -0800 Message-ID: <26087.823565507@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Jordan wrote: > > > PLEASE DON'T USE SUP.FREEBSD.ORG TO UPDATE YOURSELF! > > Good evening, my name is John, and I use sup.freebsd.org to update > myself. > > [ embarrassed applause from the other supaholics in the audience ] Hey, OK, let's be honest here - *I* use sup.freebsd.org to update myself (it would be silly otherwise, given that my SLIP line goes directly into that machine, but that's another matter) and a number of other core team people do as well. I didn't mean to imply that using sup.freebsd.org was a mark of shame, simply that the "mainstream" should no longer consider it the one and only place to come for their bits. We've gotten too big for that scheme to work any longer.. :-( That said: > Jordan, I would be more than happy to switch to an alternate sup > server, if only the other ones would work worth a sh*t! I know that there are still some problems with the other sup sites, and it's more than likely that some additional shuffling of the servers and name space will be required until we have fairly beefy and reliable machines serving sup2.freebsd.org and sup3.freebsd.org at a minimum. We're just starting out with this here, more in panic reaction to freefall melting down than anything else, and it's going to take a little longer to work the bugs out. I didn't say that this was all going to work right away! :-) Nonetheless, even without fully functional backup, it's clear that sup.freebsd.org is now too overloaded to even use for most people and we have to do the best we can with the alternative resources available. We have no other choice! On the brighter side, someone just volunteered to create a sup server at a fairly well-connected spot (and I'll be coy about it for now to avoid potentially jeopardizing these arrangements during their vulnerable boost phase) and that may go a fair ways towards solving these problems. Not that more sup servers aren't needed! They are. We could easily use *3 times* the number of sup sites we currently have since freefall clearly turns away more people than it's able to service these days, and even Paul Traina's sup2.freebsd.org has been full on more than one occasion. Even with a well-distributed load we'll still have more than we can handle, so if you'd like to create a sup server at your regional NAP (dream :) or well-connected ISP as a public service then please, by all means do so! How does it work? At the risk of repeating myself, here are the basic details: 1. You need to be willing to host at least 10 bandwidth-sucking connections from your machine. Sup is not a "light" service, and it would be dishonest of me not to point that out in advance to prospective server volunteers. You also need about 300-600MB of disk space, depending on how many of the collections you intend to offer. If you've got the CPU power and bandwidth to spare and this still doesn't scare you off, then your next step is: 2. Grab the following tarball: ftp://freefall.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD/sup-server-kit.tar.gz Unpacked, this will contain some instructions on setting up a sup server and preparing the "collections" that it provides to its clients. You should also mirror your own trees from sup.freebsd.org, and at some point we'll be restricting access to ONLY sup mirrors so that they can get in reliably. Part of the problem we have now is a chicken-and-egg transition problem: Most people want to use the sup mirrors but they're often incomplete, a result of the mirror site not being able to update itself. It can't update itself because there are too many users using the primary site due to the incomplete nature of the mirrors! :-) 3. Once your site is up and passing its initial client tests, send details to myself and Justin Gibbs , the supmeister. We'll figure out what "class" of site it is (based on which collections it provides and number of simultaneous users allowed) and then send a request to David Greenman who manages the name space for freebsd.org. He'll add in a new sup.freebsd.org entry pointing to the new sup site, with the lower numbers being allocated to the higher-bandwidth servers. We're also especially interested in foreign sup sites, since they prevent an otherwise expensive and slow hop across the pond to the U.S. sites. I believe we have sup.de.freebsd.org and sup.au.freebsd.org in operation now, though there's a conspicuous lack of entries for: sup.br.freebsd.org sup.ca.freebsd.org sup.dk.freebsd.org sup.fi.freebsd.org (*) sup.fr.freebsd.org sup.hk.freebsd.org sup.jp.freebsd.org (**) sup.nl.freebsd.org sup.ru.freebsd.org sup.uk.freebsd.org * May already have nic.funet.fi, but the DNS primary for fi.freebsd.org hasn't added this. ** These folks actually need at least 2 or 3 servers to start with. You'll note that I also haven't mentioned every major country here - no offense to those countries intended! :-) I'm merely pointing out the "higher traffic" countries here and suggesting that they could most immediately benefit from having a local sup server. Finally, a note to existing sup server maintainers: I have noticed myself that sup3.freebsd.org and sup4.freebsd.org have incomplete or small collections. I think that we should try and get everyone to offer at least -stable and -current now, especially since the CVS tree has been opened up and it's actually quite easy to offer multiple collections now. Simply sup only one tree, the CVS tree, and then use it locally from cron to check out your own -stable and -current trees. You don't have to sup all 3 trees from freefall! :-) Ideally, if we could get everyone to look and work identically to sup.freebsd.org then John wouldn't have his gripes at all - it would be transparent. Ideally.. :-) Volunteers? This is your resource, constructed for your benefit, after all! :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 16:30:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA11183 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:30:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from w8hd2.w8hd.org (w8hd2.w8hd.org [198.252.159.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA11174 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:30:24 -0800 (PST) Received: (from kimc@localhost) by w8hd2.w8hd.org (8.7.1/w8hd2) with id AAA28662 ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:30:15 GMT Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:30:14 -0500 (EST) From: Kim Culhan To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: devs hosed can't get up Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I 'accidently' executed MAKEDEV with no arguments and this appears to have hosed the devices for sd* -I can't boot the machine. Is there any way to recover from this? dead in water kim -- kimc@w8hd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 16:43:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA12129 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:43:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA12124 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:43:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA26268; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:39:50 -0800 To: Julian Elischer cc: ath@bellcore.com (Andrew Heybey), dfr@render.com, karl@mcs.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: And the winner is! In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 13:20:36 PST." <199602052120.NAA26300@ref.tfs.com> Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 16:39:49 -0800 Message-ID: <26266.823567189@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > All machines SUP everything at boot > and applications are SUP'd on operator sign-on in some > cases as well. (e.g. keing stateions.. log off and log on > to get newer versions of the app. (naturally > there is USUALLY nothing to get) Uh.. Are you *serious*? :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 16:46:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA12537 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:46:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from troutmask.apl.washington.edu (troutmask.apl.washington.edu [128.95.76.54]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA12513 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:46:25 -0800 (PST) Received: (from sgk@localhost) by troutmask.apl.washington.edu (8.6.12/8.6.9) id QAA01579; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:43:38 -0800 From: "Steven G. Kargl" Message-Id: <199602060043.QAA01579@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Subject: Re: sup is broken? To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:43:38 -0800 (PST) Cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, rkw@dataplex.net, kimc@w8hd.org, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602052319.PAA26558@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Feb 5, 96 03:19:20 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk According to Julian Elischer: > > make it so.. > >> >> In message <26947.823390500@time.cdrom.com>you write: >> >That's one option, or as I also told Kim - PLEASE DON'T USE SUP.FREEBSD.ORG >> >TO UPDATE YOURSELF! >> >> Has anyone thought of not calling it sup.freebsd.org any more? Call it >> sup-master.freebsd.org, instead, and give sup.freebsd.org 3 A records, those >> of sup1, sup2, and sup3. That way, if someone doesn't know what they are >> doing, they will get a random one of sup1, sup2 or sup3; if they know what >> they are doing they will use sup[123] directly, and it would be really >> hard to hit freefall by accident. >> >> Bill >> >> Nice idea, but you have to do more work than that. Sup3 seems to disallow the supping of the export restricted parts of the tree. My supfile works fine with sup.freebsd.org (when I can get a connection). SUP Upgrade of src-secure-stable at Mon Feb 5 16:27:51 1996 SUP Fileserver 9.13 (4.3 BSD) 7891 on lucus.fsl.orst.edu at 16:27:51 SUP Fileserver supports compression. SUP: Invalid release stable for collection src-secure SUP: Upgrade of src-secure-stable aborted at Feb 5 16:27:52 1996 SUP Upgrade of src-eBones-stable at Mon Feb 5 16:27:52 1996 SUP Fileserver 9.13 (4.3 BSD) 7892 on lucus.fsl.orst.edu at 16:27:52 SUP Fileserver supports compression. SUP: Invalid release stable for collection src-eBones SUP: Upgrade of src-eBones-stable aborted at Feb 5 16:27:52 1996 -- Steven G. Kargl | Phone: 206-685-4677 | Applied Physics Lab | Fax: 206-543-6785 | Univ. of Washington |---------------------| 1013 NE 40th St | FreeBSD 2.x-stable | Seattle, WA 98105 |---------------------| From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 16:49:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA12761 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:49:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA12756 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:49:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA09981; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:33:14 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602060103.LAA09981@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Problem with new drive (Connor CFP1060S 1.05GD 243F) To: lehey.pad@sni.de (Greg Lehey) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:33:13 +1030 (CST) Cc: stesin@elvisti.kiev.ua, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602051556.QAA07474@nixpbe.pdb.sni.de> from "Greg Lehey" at Feb 5, 96 04:52:07 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Greg Lehey stands accused of saying: > >:> When I tried to install, it newfs'd 3 partitions, then got the above error > >:> on the 4th (you could hear the drive powerdown) and then when it went to > >:> the 5th, you could hear it power up again, and it newfs'd it and the 6th > >:> properly again. > > > >: Aiee! Unless you have a faulty power connector, _send_it_back_ right now. > >: If it's spinning down the drive is sure it has a _serious_ problem. > > > > I STRONGLY second this. We had this same drive model died recently. > > Two last days before final death it was stinking with the > > messages "not ready" to the console... > > I've missed the beginning of this story, but can't spinning down also > mean that the drive is overheating? I recently bought a Maxtor 1.2 GB Certainly; but if it's only been running long enough to get to the newfs stage of an install, it's unlikely to be that hot. > Greg -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 16:50:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA12838 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:50:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from conch.vast.unsw.edu.au (conch.vast.unsw.edu.au [149.171.224.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA12831 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 16:50:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from mucket.vast.unsw.edu.au by conch.vast.unsw.edu.au with SMTP id AA27061 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:50:20 +1100 Received: by mucket.vast.unsw.edu.au (5.65c/client-1.3) id AA22899; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:50:19 +1100 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:50:18 +1100 (EST) From: Julian Jenkins X-Sender: julianj@mucket To: Bill Fenner Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: List Duplicates In-Reply-To: <96Feb5.145941pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Bill Fenner wrote: > In message <199602052243.PAA00505@phaeton.artisoft.com> you write: > >Point of order: how do I tell which individual addresses in the current > >headers are or are not in the list addresses also in the current headers? > > I will concede the potential of it being nice to have the To: or cc: lines > trimmed by the mail server, although it is a relatively expensive operation, > won't help people for whom multiple addresses map to one, and I sometimes > *like* to be able to have a conversation "outside" the list using cc:'s; > list mail comes really slowly for me. > > Just pointing out that different people use mailing lists differently, I > guess. But if the FreeBSD lists start using Reply-To: then I will have > to write some code to remove it, or something, so that I can still bear > to be subscribed to them. Is it not possible for the list server to scan the list of To: and CC: and not resend to these who have already recieved a copy of the message independantly? Sorry if this has already been suggested but i missed the beginning of this discussion. Julian Jenkins julianj@vast.unsw.edu.au kaveman@magna.com.au From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 17:19:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA14986 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:19:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail1.digital.com (mail1.digital.com [204.123.2.50]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA14981 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:19:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from [198.138.38.205] by mail1.digital.com (5.65 EXP 4/12/95 for V3.2/1.0/WV) id AA30042; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:13:49 -0800 Received: (from jmb@localhost) by Aspen.Woc.Atinc.COM (8.6.12/8.6.9) id UAA14736; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:11:51 -0500 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:11:50 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" X-Sender: jmb@Aspen.Woc.Atinc.COM To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Cc: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com, hackers%freebsd.org@inet-gw-1.pa.dec.com Subject: Re: Willows In-Reply-To: <23948.823525010@time.cdrom.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > BTW, is there going to be a willows mail list or should the willows > > discussions be moved to chat ? > > A temporary one has been set up at: willows@throck.com > > You're on it. :-) jordan, you are suffering from over-exposure???? what's this "throcking"? curiouser and curiouser Aspen:[1] whois throck.com The Throcking Institute (THROCK-DOM) 246 Park St. Clyde, CA 94520 USA Domain Name: THROCK.COM Administrative Contact, Technical Contact, Zone Contact: Hubbard, Jordan K. (JKH8) jkh@FREEBSD.ORG 510-682-7859 Record last updated on 31-Dec-95. Record created on 31-Dec-95. Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG play go. ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life i am moving to a new job. PLEASE USE: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 17:45:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA16670 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:45:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from w8hd2.w8hd.org (w8hd2.w8hd.org [198.252.159.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA16657 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 17:45:00 -0800 (PST) Received: (from kimc@localhost) by w8hd2.w8hd.org (8.7.1/w8hd2) with id BAA28832 ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 01:44:59 GMT Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:44:58 -0500 (EST) From: Kim Culhan To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Devices hosed -how to recover? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Looks like the network went down when I posted the first time, again: I ran MAKEDEV with no arguments by 'accident' and now the devs are hosed: swapon: /dev/sd0s1b: No such file or directory automatic reboot in progress /dev/rsd0a: clean (etc...) /dev/sd0s1g: No such file or directory cant stat /dev/sd0s1g automatic file system check failed... help! I cant seem to use MAKEDEV to make a working /dev/sd0s1 so how can I recover? dead in water.. kim -- kimc@w8hd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 18:54:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA20047 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 18:54:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA20039 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 18:54:38 -0800 (PST) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id NAA16062; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:47:33 +1100 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:47:33 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199602060247.NAA16062@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: davidg@Root.COM, koshy@india.hp.com Subject: Re: Willows Cc: gjennejohn@frt.dec.com, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >>On this topic; do we support the P5's 1MB page size? This could reduce > No, we don't support variable page sizes and we're not likely ever going to >support them due to architectural constraints in the VM system (and I'm not >interested in changing this because of performance considerations). I think Linux supports them, and that they are good for mapping the kernel. Can the FreeBSD kernel (text and statically allocated data) be specially mapped without interfering with the general VM code? Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 19:18:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA21441 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:18:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from GndRsh.aac.dev.com (GndRsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA21421 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:17:53 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by GndRsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA24389; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:16:12 -0800 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199602060316.TAA24389@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: sup is broken? To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:16:12 -0800 (PST) Cc: fenner@parc.xerox.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, rkw@dataplex.net, kimc@w8hd.org, hackers@freebsd.org, stable@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602052319.PAA26558@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Feb 5, 96 03:19:20 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > make it so.. Please do not make it so unless these things are updated in a syncronous maner, otherwise strange results could happen due to sup1 != sup2 != sup3 as far as the state of the collection. It would very likely cause src-base to come from one machine, src-bin from another, and src-eBones from the third. This could be very very evil... > > In message <26947.823390500@time.cdrom.com>you write: > > >That's one option, or as I also told Kim - PLEASE DON'T USE SUP.FREEBSD.ORG > > >TO UPDATE YOURSELF! > > > > Has anyone thought of not calling it sup.freebsd.org any more? Call it > > sup-master.freebsd.org, instead, and give sup.freebsd.org 3 A records, those > > of sup1, sup2, and sup3. That way, if someone doesn't know what they are > > doing, they will get a random one of sup1, sup2 or sup3; if they know what > > they are doing they will use sup[123] directly, and it would be really hard to > > hit freefall by accident. > > > > Bill > > > > > > -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 19:21:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA21697 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:21:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA21689 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:20:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA00899; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:20:51 -0800 To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Willows In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 20:11:50 EST." Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 19:20:51 -0800 Message-ID: <897.823576851@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > jordan, you are suffering from over-exposure???? > > what's this "throcking"? curiouser and curiouser Not telling. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 19:22:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA21781 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:22:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from Glock.COM (glock.com [198.82.228.165]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA21756 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:22:13 -0800 (PST) Received: (from mmead@localhost) by Glock.COM (8.7.1/8.7.1) id WAA11344 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:19:54 -0500 (EST) From: "matthew c. mead" Message-Id: <199602060319.WAA11344@Glock.COM> Subject: hotjava To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:19:53 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Well, due to Netscape's inability to get Java support out the door for BSDI with their 2.0 release, I was thinking of looking into JDK source code and porting, and I remembered something about this. Has anyone gotten this working, and/or gotten pthreads fully working? Are we going to have a multithreading kernel soon? Just curious about some of these issues... -matt -- Matthew C. Mead mmead@Glock.COM http://www.Glock.COM/~mmead/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 19:31:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA22565 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:31:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from asgard.bga.com (asgard.bga.com [198.3.117.20]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA22539 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:31:04 -0800 (PST) Received: (from faulkner@localhost) by asgard.bga.com (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA00592; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:25:26 -0600 (CST) From: Boyd Faulkner Message-Id: <199602060325.VAA00592@asgard.bga.com> Subject: Re: sup is broken? To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:25:26 -0559 (CST) Cc: julian@ref.tfs.com, fenner@parc.xerox.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, rkw@dataplex.net, kimc@w8hd.org, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602052348.PAA03904@Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Feb 5, 96 03:48:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk According to David Greenman: > > >make it so.. > > Not until someone goes and verifies that all of the sup*.freebsd.org > targets are working correctly. Also, my experiance with multiple A records > is that it always comes up with them same one (not random). > > -DG And hopefully, there will be some guarantee that they will update at the same time. I would hate to sup once, change servers and actually go backwards because the new server was behind the old one. Boyd > > >> > >> Has anyone thought of not calling it sup.freebsd.org any more? Call it > >> sup-master.freebsd.org, instead, and give sup.freebsd.org 3 A records, those > >> of sup1, sup2, and sup3. That way, if someone doesn't know what they are > >> doing, they will get a random one of sup1, sup2 or sup3; if they know what > >> they are doing they will use sup[123] directly, and it would be really hard to > >> hit freefall by accident. > >> -- _____________________________________________________________________________ Boyd Faulkner "The fates lead him who will; faulkner@asgard.bga.com Him who won't, they drag." http://asgard.bga.com/~faulkner Old Roman Saying -- Source: Joseph Campbell _____________________________________________________________________________ From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 19:38:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA23298 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:38:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from haywire.DIALix.COM (haywire.DIALix.COM [192.203.228.65]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA23249 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:37:45 -0800 (PST) Received: (from news@localhost) by haywire.DIALix.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA18079 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:37:02 +0800 Received: from GATEWAY by haywire.DIALix.COM with netnews for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (problems to: usenet@haywire.dialix.com) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: 6 Feb 96 02:01:31 GMT From: peter@jhome.DIALix.COM (Peter Wemm) Message-ID: Organization: DIALix Services, Perth, Australia. References: <199602021216.GAA15425@solaria.sol.net> Subject: Re: Time travelling news server Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk jgreco@solaria.sol.net (Joe Greco) writes: >Okay, I just had my "what the F***" experience of the week. >I noticed some strangeness on my news server "news.sol.net". While >examining it, I typed "date" and got >hummin# date >Sun Jan 15 02:51:14 CST 1928 >WHAT????????? >I quickly compiled a printf("%ld\n", time(NULL)) and got: >-1324220930 >Now, xntpdc was happily chugging along on the system. Matter of fact, when >I killed it and did an "ntpdate ntp2.sol.net", it claimed a very small >offset from ntp2.sol.net.... maybe a complete (or half, negative) wrap-around? I saw this behavior on -current a month or so ago about when PHK was doing the bcd stuff.. If I remember rightly, the spammed date got written into my CMOS. >It's been a week for problems with my news box. :-/ Are you running -current or -stable on it? My news box has been doing wonderfully well under a new -current kernel (from Jan 11). It's currently got an uptime of 24 days (which is a record for the -current FreeBSD machines here). This machine used to crash every few days before that last update. It's only a garden-variety hardware box though.. (486, ISA, AHA1542CF) It's keeping up with it's load but has no spare disk bandwidth at all - it's running at near 100% head seek saturation 24 hours a day and is going to need an upgrade (more disk, more RAM) soon. -Peter >... Joe >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net >Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 19:51:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA24335 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:51:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from ki.net (root@ki.net [142.77.249.8]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA24323 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:51:13 -0800 (PST) Received: (from scrappy@localhost) by ki.net (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA04300; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:50:31 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:50:30 -0500 (EST) From: "Marc G. Fournier" To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup is broken? In-Reply-To: <26087.823565507@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > Jordan, I would be more than happy to switch to an alternate sup > > server, if only the other ones would work worth a sh*t! > > I know that there are still some problems with the other sup sites, > and it's more than likely that some additional shuffling of the > servers and name space will be required until we have fairly beefy and > reliable machines serving sup2.freebsd.org and sup3.freebsd.org at a > minimum. We're just starting out with this here, more in panic > reaction to freefall melting down than anything else, and it's going > to take a little longer to work the bugs out. I didn't say that this > was all going to work right away! :-) > I just added on a new drive to the system, and have dedicated part of it to maintaining a sup server, but I have to concerns that I need addressed first: Is there a way of "logging" connections? I don't want to know *what* ppl are taking, I'd just like to keep track of number of connections and from where and stuff like that. I'm trying to keep my machines in line with -current...but if I compile in ~supfiles/current/sys/.., then someone coming in to sup files is going to get my .o files too, right? Is this what ctm is for, or is it something altogether different that I must do so that I can do this? *or* does sup ignore .o files? > 1. You need to be willing to host at least 10 bandwidth-sucking connections Working on it... > collections now. Simply sup only one tree, the CVS tree, and then use > it locally from cron to check out your own -stable and -current trees. > You don't have to sup all 3 trees from freefall! :-) > Hmmm, this might answer my one question...if I sup CVS instead of -current/-ports, I'll get what, exactly? -current/-stable/-ports/?? I'm going to look at that sup-servers file again, in case I missed something :( > Volunteers? This is your resource, constructed for your benefit, > after all! :-) > I'm slow, but am working on it...back to the manuals :( Marc G. Fournier | POP Mail Telnet Acct DNS Hosting System | WWW Services Database Services | Knowledge, Administrator | | Information and scrappy@ki.net | WWW: http://www.ki.net | Communications, Inc From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 19:54:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA24618 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:54:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA24611 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:54:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA01049; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:54:11 -0800 To: Kim Culhan cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Devices hosed -how to recover? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 20:44:58 EST." Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 19:54:10 -0800 Message-ID: <1047.823578850@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk ./MAKEDEV sd0s1a All slice entries will be made for sd0s1. > > Looks like the network went down when I posted the first time, again: > > I ran MAKEDEV with no arguments by 'accident' and now the devs are hosed: > > swapon: /dev/sd0s1b: No such file or directory > automatic reboot in progress > /dev/rsd0a: clean (etc...) > /dev/sd0s1g: No such file or directory > cant stat /dev/sd0s1g > automatic file system check failed... help! > > > I cant seem to use MAKEDEV to make a working /dev/sd0s1 so how can > I recover? > > dead in water.. > > kim > > -- > kimc@w8hd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 20:00:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA24997 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:00:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from Aspen.Woc.Atinc.COM (aspen.woc.atinc.com [198.138.38.205]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA24873 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 19:59:58 -0800 (PST) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by Aspen.Woc.Atinc.COM (8.6.12/8.6.9) id WAA15076; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:58:36 -0500 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:58:35 -0500 (EST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" X-Sender: jmb@Aspen.Woc.Atinc.COM To: David Greenman cc: Julian Elischer , Bill Fenner , jkh@time.cdrom.com, rkw@dataplex.net, kimc@w8hd.org, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: sup is broken? In-Reply-To: <199602052348.PAA03904@Root.COM> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, David Greenman wrote: > >make it so.. > > Not until someone goes and verifies that all of the sup*.freebsd.org > targets are working correctly. Also, my experiance with multiple A records > is that it always comes up with them same one (not random). sup2.freebsd.org is working better than reported. when i supped from sup2.freebsd.org this evening, my local copies of the commitlogs were deleted and replaced. the rest of the src was treated normally--selected files replaced as needed. Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG play go. ride bike. hack FreeBSD.--ah the good life i am moving to a new job. PLEASE USE: jmb@FreeBSD.ORG From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 20:04:42 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA25308 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:04:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA25301 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:04:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id UAA01123; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:04:16 -0800 To: "Marc G. Fournier" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup is broken? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 22:50:30 EST." Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 20:04:16 -0800 Message-ID: <1120.823579456@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Is there a way of "logging" connections? I don't want to know > *what* ppl are taking, I'd just like to keep track of number of connections > and from where and stuff like that. I'm not sure - I'll let Justin answer this one. > I'm trying to keep my machines in line with -current...but if > I compile in ~supfiles/current/sys/.., then someone coming in to sup > files is going to get my .o files too, right? Is this what ctm is Huh? You should not point your sup collections at an active directory. We made this mistake on freefall for a long time, regretted it all the way, and *finally* switched over to having our checked-out current and stable trees pristine. You definitely don't want either of them pointing at the same place your /usr/src points! /usr/src should be private to the machine hosting the sup server. > Hmmm, this might answer my one question...if I sup CVS instead > of -current/-ports, I'll get what, exactly? -current/-stable/-ports/?? Right. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 20:05:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA25394 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:05:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA25307 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:04:41 -0800 (PST) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id OAA19150; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:57:46 +1100 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:57:46 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199602060357.OAA19150@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: caussep@sphynx.fdn.fr, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Patches from 2.1-RELEASE Cc: delaitt@cpc.wmin.ac.uk, jdp@polstra.com, tb@idefix.fdn.fr Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >1] tape-patch: >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Some SCSI-1 tape drives like Archive 2150S, Tandberg-??? _DO_ >implement a mode called QFA (Quick File Access) which allow quick >positionning on a given block number (counted 1 from the begining of >tape). This feature was available when I ran Linux two years ago. An >equivalent set of commands also exist on SCSI-2 tape drives but I >don't have any hardware to test it on. Before releasing this patch, I >grabbed the 2.2-current "st.c", so this patch also adds the retension >command. The `tell' command but not the `seek' command worked on my WangDat 3100 SCSI-2 DAT tape under Linux a couple of years ago. >CAVEATS: I don't know if these commands are specific to the Archive >Viper-150 (aka 2150S). If so, they should probably go to the rogues >gallery; anyhow they have a SCSI-2 equivalent (but with different >encoding). Where can I find the different encoding? >2] floppy-patch: >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > ... >2-b) High-speed: > The speed increase comes from two changes: the increased number of >sectors (since the rotational speed is the same) and spiral formatting >with a cylinder skew of 2 to compensate the head switching time. I don't like cylinder skew or interleave for floppies. The driver should keep track of the next (accessible) sector and schedule i/o's to access the sectors in the best possible order. If the skews and interleaves are nonstandard, then the driver has to do extra work to detect and adjust for them. Skew and interleave helps for dumb drivers of course. >it back!!! (this is used for spiral formatting). The default head >settle time is "hz/16" which is far too big to get the benefit of >spiral formatting. I replaced it with "hz/FDSEEKWAIT". A good value hz/16 is 6 (giving a timeout of 50+ to 60 msec). This is much too large. It was hz/50 in rev.1.1 of fd.c (giving a timeout of (10+ to 20 msec). This may be too small. I think the standard is 15 msec. The kernel has poor support for timeouts this small. The timeout has to be 3 ticks to guarantee that it is > 15 msec. I made it hz/32 in rev.1.30 to get this. Then someone made it hz/16 in rev.1.43 "to avoid annoying messages". >of FDSEEKWAIT is 64, though it runs okay with 128 but 64 is safer :-) hz/64 is 1 (0+ to 10 msec timeout) while hz/128 is 0 (also 0+ to 10 msec timeout because timeout() doesn't believe that you want a timeout of 0 ticks and increases it to 1 tick :-). I've worked on floppy drivers that didn't worry about head settle. This is usually OK on old, slow systems. It is safer if the driver schedules i/o. Then the driver never should never attempt to access a sector too soon after seeking because the access would usually fail and a whole disk revolution would be wasted. >The fdformat program has been changed to do spiral formatting. It >accepts two new parameters: track and cylinder skew. Track skew >(defaults to zero) is almost useless since the head switching time is >neglectable . Cylinder skew is sensitive: I obtained the best >performances with a value of 2 (the default) on an unloaded system. The best skew is probably drive-dependent. On one of my floppy drives (a 5.25 inch TEAC (?) drive bought in 1988) with standard 1.2MB formatting, it is possible to read sector N on one cylinder, then seek to the next cylinder and read sector N+2, except when N is the last or the second last sector, it is possible to read the first sector on the next track! On all my other PC floppy drives (a couple of 5.25 inch ones and a couple of 3.5 inch ones), it is only possible to read sector N+3 or N+4 after seeking. This is easy to compensate for in drivers that schedule the i/o, but it costs a sector time or 3 per revolution, as would uncompensated for cylinder skew. In dumb drivers it can waste a lot of time, e.g., under DOG copying a bunch of small files to an uncached floppy took about a minute with the fast drive and about 8 minutes with a slow drive. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 20:27:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA26771 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:27:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from ki.net (root@ki.net [142.77.249.8]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA26766 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:27:47 -0800 (PST) Received: (from scrappy@localhost) by ki.net (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA08152; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:27:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:27:30 -0500 (EST) From: "Marc G. Fournier" To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup is broken? In-Reply-To: <1120.823579456@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > Huh? You should not point your sup collections at an active > directory. We made this mistake on freefall for a long time, > regretted it all the way, and *finally* switched over to having our > checked-out current and stable trees pristine. You definitely don't > want either of them pointing at the same place your /usr/src points! > /usr/src should be private to the machine hosting the sup server. > Okay, let me reword the question, since you kinda answer it... If I sup to /usr/sup, how do I get those sources to /usr/src so that I can compile? I've tried a straight "sup", but it tells me that its the same machine. ... oh, found the answer i was looking for, I think. I want to use 'sup -l' for this? Just to confirm that this is in fact how its to be done? > > Hmmm, this might answer my one question...if I sup CVS instead > > of -current/-ports, I'll get what, exactly? -current/-stable/-ports/?? > > Right. > Great...now where did I put all that extra disk space :( Marc G. Fournier | POP Mail Telnet Acct DNS Hosting System | WWW Services Database Services | Knowledge, Administrator | | Information and scrappy@ki.net | WWW: http://www.ki.net | Communications, Inc From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 20:42:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA27448 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:42:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw.ast.com (fw.ast.com [165.164.6.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA27443 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:42:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from nemesis by fw.ast.com with uucp (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tjfC8-000858C; Mon, 5 Feb 96 22:39 CST Received: by nemesis.lonestar.org (Smail3.1.27.1 #20) id m0tjf8T-000COKC; Mon, 5 Feb 96 22:36 WET Message-Id: Date: Mon, 5 Feb 96 22:36 WET To: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org From: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Sent: Mon Feb 5 1996, 22:36:09 CST Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk [0]Jordan wrote: [0]PLEASE DON'T USE SUP.FREEBSD.ORG TO UPDATE YOURSELF! [1]John Polstra replied: [1]When I try an experiment, and that experiment attempts to delete [1]220 MB of my files, I lose my thirst for adventure very quickly. [1]Nevertheless, if you or somebody else can give me some clue about [1]how to switch to a different sup server without losing all my [1]perfectly good files, I'll try again. [3]Richard Wackerbarth says: [3]As I have pointed out, the cvs tree that I am getting from sup2 also seems [3]to have problems. As a result, my distribution in the name of -stable, [3]reflects the same condition. [3] [3]We MUST get these problems fixed or we all will be forced to "look to the [3]source" for correct data. I must also report similar problems: Sup from sup2 either hangs for hours on end for no apparent reason (no Busy message) and when it does wake up, it starts deleting entire -current trees like mad. Sup from sup3 delivers a corrupted tree where make world fails within ten to forty minutes (sometimes it doesn't get finished cleaning stuff before something goes wrong!) and the kernel will not compile because files are missing, zero-length or truncated. Sup from Sup3 also repeatedly reports that the KerberosIV collection was "invalid" and aborts the sup. I was unwilling to see what sup4 would do to my system. Following these unpleasant experiences, I accessed the "forbidden" sup.freebsd.org and now have a -current kernel that actually links and a make world that has run far longer than in recent memory. (If it makes it beyond building libc it will be a record.) An associate at work has run into the same sort of problems and he was using sup3. Part of his problems were caused by running an outdated config, but with that fixed the kernel would still refuse to compile or link for strange reasons. Make world also failed for him, but in different places than where it dies for me. As the folks in Tuna Texas would say: "It's broke." "Yep, it's broke allright." "No question. More broke than the Piggly Wiggly after that there tornado." I know the updates for recently changed files are present on sup3 as I verified some based on recent -cvs mail, although I don't know if their contents are valid. I also know that files that should be static with relatively old dates seem to be botched so that compiles fail. I have no idea what is wrong with sup2 unless the entire tree is missing or something isn't looking in the right place. I wasn't willing to see if sup2 would delete everything locally before I stopped the carnage. Frank Durda IV |"The Knights who say "LETNi" or uhclem%nemesis@rwsystr.nkn.net | demand... A SEGMENT REGISTER!!!" ^------(this is the fastest route)|"A what?" or ...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem |"LETNi! LETNi! LETNi!" - 1983 From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 20:53:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA27791 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:53:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from tiny.mcs.usu.edu (tiny.mcs.usu.edu [129.123.15.8]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA27786 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 20:53:47 -0800 (PST) Received: (from kurto@localhost) by tiny.mcs.usu.edu (8.6.11/8.6.9) id VAA05705 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:53:42 -0700 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:53:42 -0700 From: Kurt Olsen Message-Id: <199602060453.VAA05705@tiny.mcs.usu.edu> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: silo overflows Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hello, I recently installed a machine with a BOCA 2016 multiport serial card in it and have been seeing the occasional (several times a day) silo overflow. The board has 16 16550A's on it (as reported during boot up.) Looking in a manual I have here, it indicates that it's possible to set the receive trigger level to 1, 4, 8, or 14. Would there be any chance of clearing up the problem by moving down to 8 or 4? I'm not really concerned about too much cpu load, but data loss is kind of a problem since it leaves the modems in a bit of a state. If this seems reasonable what would be the best place to adjust it at? Obviously in sio.c, I suspect in the probe routine after determining the UART type, and setting ftl_init to FIFO_TRIGGER_8 or _4. Is that correct? Thanks a bunch, Kurt Olsen kurto@tiny.mcs.usu.edu From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 21:50:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA00237 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:50:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from precipice.shockwave.com (precipice.shockwave.com [171.69.108.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA00214 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:50:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.shockwave.com (localhost.shockwave.com [127.0.0.1]) by precipice.shockwave.com (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA10847; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:44:13 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602060544.VAA10847@precipice.shockwave.com> To: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) cc: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 22:36:00 +0700." Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 21:44:11 -0800 From: Paul Traina Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk From: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree [0]Jordan wrote: [0]PLEASE DON'T USE SUP.FREEBSD.ORG TO UPDATE YOURSELF! [1]John Polstra replied: [1]When I try an experiment, and that experiment attempts to delete [1]220 MB of my files, I lose my thirst for adventure very quickly. [1]Nevertheless, if you or somebody else can give me some clue about [1]how to switch to a different sup server without losing all my [1]perfectly good files, I'll try again. [3]Richard Wackerbarth says: [3]As I have pointed out, the cvs tree that I am getting from sup2 also seems [3]to have problems. As a result, my distribution in the name of -stable, [3]reflects the same condition. [3] [3]We MUST get these problems fixed or we all will be forced to "look to the [3]source" for correct data. I must also report similar problems: Sup from sup2 either hangs for hours on end for no apparent reason (no Busy message) and when it does wake up, it starts deleting entire -current trees like mad. I use sup2 almost daily and have never had any problems like this since it got into operation. I _use_ this sup server constantly to upgrade my -current sources at home and have done so for the past 2 months. What speed link are you suping over? The kerberosIV collection *IS* invalid. Remove it from your supfile. From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 21:51:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA00311 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:51:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from haywire.DIALix.COM (root@haywire.DIALix.COM [192.203.228.65]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA00302 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:51:01 -0800 (PST) Received: (from news@localhost) by haywire.DIALix.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA25031 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:50:55 +0800 Received: from GATEWAY by haywire.DIALix.COM with netnews for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (problems to: usenet@haywire.dialix.com) To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: 6 Feb 96 05:49:30 GMT From: peter@jhome.DIALix.COM (Peter Wemm) Message-ID: Organization: DIALix Services, Perth, Australia. References: , <897.823576851@time.cdrom.com> Subject: Re: Willows Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) writes: >> jordan, you are suffering from over-exposure???? >> >> what's this "throcking"? curiouser and curiouser >Not telling. > Jordan Is this based on the "Douglas Adams" definition? ie: related to a poor Yate? Cheers, -Peter From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 21:51:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA00331 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:51:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from eel.dataplex.net (EEL.DATAPLEX.NET [199.183.109.245]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA00326 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 21:51:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from [199.183.109.242] (cod [199.183.109.242]) by eel.dataplex.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id XAA08610 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:51:20 -0600 X-Sender: rkw@shark.dataplex.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:51:20 -0600 To: hackers@freebsd.org From: Richard Wackerbarth Subject: On keeping a src tree Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk "Jordan K. Hubbard" writes: >/usr/src should be private to the machine ... FOLKS. This is EXCELLENT ADVISE. I suggest that you should never store the source code obtained from any FreeBSD source in /usr/src. Move it somewhere else! I would go so far as to suggest that you make it ReadOnly with respect to the account that you use to modify things. Then "clone" it into /usr/src using the lndir command. You can then use this tree just as you would have originally. (Except that you have to copy a source before you alter it) That way you will not polute the reference tree with your own stuff. It doesn't really take much additional space and I guarantee that it will make life much easier. ---- Richard Wackerbarth rkw@dataplex.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 22:05:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA01038 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:05:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from hq.icb.chel.su (icb-rich-gw.icb.chel.su [193.125.10.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA01021 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:04:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (babkin@localhost) by hq.icb.chel.su (8.6.5/8.6.5) id KAA02691; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:29:33 +0500 From: "Serge A. Babkin" Message-Id: <199602060529.KAA02691@hq.icb.chel.su> Subject: Re: ep driver To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:29:32 +0500 (GMT+0500) Cc: alexis@unicorn.ww.net, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602051527.HAA02845@Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Feb 5, 96 07:27:42 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > >working is to enable its epwatchdog() routine: > > > >add "ifp->if_timer = 1;" after " "ifp->if_watchdog = epwatchdog;" > > > >The reason why David Greenman has disabled it is that he throught that > >epwarchdog() restes the card. But really it does not reset it. > > Actually, what I objected to was the general use of the watchdog routine > to cover up what is clearly one or more serious bugs in the driver. The > watchdog routine in this case is being used in a way that is entirely > inappropriate and if removing the kludge causes the driver to occasionally > hang, then someone should go find out why and fix it! Okay, I think I understand you now. This patch must help. The card looks to be working with it. *** if_ep.c Fri Feb 2 08:42:17 1996 --- if_ep.c Tue Feb 6 10:20:23 1996 *************** *** 764,769 **** --- 764,770 ---- } #endif + ifp->if_timer=2; sc->arpcom.ac_if.if_opackets++; m_freem(top); /* *************** *** 819,830 **** --- 820,833 ---- } if (status & S_TX_AVAIL) { /* we need ACK */ + ifp->if_timer=0; sc->arpcom.ac_if.if_flags &= ~IFF_OACTIVE; GO_WINDOW(1); inw(BASE + EP_W1_FREE_TX); epstart(&sc->arpcom.ac_if); } if (status & S_CARD_FAILURE) { + ifp->if_timer=0; #ifdef EP_LOCAL_STATS printf("\nep%d:\n\tStatus: %x\n", unit, status); GO_WINDOW(4); *************** *** 849,854 **** --- 852,858 ---- return; } if (status & S_TX_COMPLETE) { + ifp->if_timer=0; /* we need ACK. we do it at the end */ /* * We need to read TX_STATUS until we get a 0 status in order to From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 22:10:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA01315 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:10:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from luke.pmr.com (luke.pmr.com [199.98.84.132]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA01310 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:10:18 -0800 (PST) Received: (from bob@localhost) by luke.pmr.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id AAA18043 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:10:18 -0600 From: Bob Willcox Message-Id: <199602060610.AAA18043@luke.pmr.com> Subject: /kernel: arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo ?? To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org (freebsd-hackers) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:10:18 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk What is the meaning/significance of the message: /kernel: arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo I have seen this on a couple of my 2.1R FreeBSD systems now. One of them became progressively more reluctanct to talk to other systems till I finally had to reboot it. Is there some configuration thing that I can do to prevent these errors? Thanks, -- Bob Willcox bob@luke.pmr.com (or obiwan%bob@uunet.uu.net) Austin, TX From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 22:23:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA02025 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:23:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA02020 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:23:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA01584; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:22:56 -0800 To: "Marc G. Fournier" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup is broken? In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 23:27:30 EST." Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 22:22:55 -0800 Message-ID: <1582.823587775@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > If I sup to /usr/sup, how do I get those sources to /usr/src > so that I can compile? I've tried a straight "sup", but it tells me > that its the same machine. ... oh, found the answer i was looking for, > I think. I'm still not sure if I understand the question since the answer seems rather obvious, otherwise. You sup some stuff. You either put it somewhere for others to sup in turn or you use it for development. If you want to do both, you copy it before you change it. > Great...now where did I put all that extra disk space :( Disk space is actually pretty cheap these days.. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 22:39:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA03120 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:39:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from okjunc.junction.net (michael@okjunc.junction.net [199.166.227.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA03115 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:39:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (from michael@localhost) by okjunc.junction.net (8.6.11/8.6.11) id WAA16062; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:46:58 -0800 Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:46:57 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Dillon X-Sender: michael@okjunc.junction.net To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Is this security hole being fixed?? Message-ID: Organization: Memra Software Inc. - Internet consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 11:04:32 GMT From: Alan Cox To: Multiple recipients of list BIG-LINUX Subject: Linux as a production system [ irrelevant details deleted ] Some of the other things are very questionable. I can break a standard Sun Solaris 2 machine in about 2 minutes from a shell prompt and about 10 otherwise unless the user is applying patchkits very fast. Currently I can break almost any BSD derived system because of a bug CERT haven't yet even published. [ note above reference to a bug in *ALL* BSD derived systems ] From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 22:59:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA03679 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:59:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA03660 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 22:59:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id XAA02048; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:59:34 -0700 Message-Id: <199602060659.XAA02048@rover.village.org> To: Michael Dillon Subject: Re: Is this security hole being fixed?? Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-security@FreeBSD.org In-reply-to: Your message of Mon, 05 Feb 1996 22:46:57 PST Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 23:59:33 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk : Some of the other things are very questionable. I can break a standard : Sun Solaris 2 machine in about 2 minutes from a shell prompt and about 10 : otherwise unless the user is applying patchkits very fast. Currently I can : break almost any BSD derived system because of a bug CERT haven't yet : even published. This would be the "you can bind to a specific port that has a IN_ADDR_ANY binding already" bug? That is a "feature" of the OS that is designed to override generic daemons with specific ones. To make this change would be to change the way that sockets work. Not that this is a bad thing, but everyone should know this is a design change. The other way to fix it is to have your daemons that run as root bind to all the interfaces, like newer named daemons do. You *ESPECIALLY* want to do this for all daemons that run on ports > 1023, since you don't have to be root to bind to those sockets. In the case of NFS it is rather, well, a large gaping hole for reasons that should be obvious to most people... Or is this some other problem? Warner P.S. Is freebsd-security still active? Should this go there? From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 23:01:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA03826 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:01:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA03806 Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:01:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id XAA01709; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:01:18 -0800 To: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) cc: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 22:36:00 +0700." Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 23:01:17 -0800 Message-ID: <1707.823590077@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I must also report similar problems: > [details of sup2..supn dysfunction elided] Well, I'm glad you're reporting them, that's all I can really say. Truly! I think that central resources should be flagged ASAP when broken and people should take Extra Special Care in making sure they run right, just as we jump up and down and run around in paniced circles whenever freefall starts having problems. We might not fix things right away, but we certainly manage to look busy! :-) Any suggestions on promoting and facilitating this level of reliability? Would an `admin' mailing list for all FreeBSD.ORG related resources help, or would it merely turn into a source of unwanted messages for admins who already get too much mail? It certainly doesn't seem like such reports should be sent to hackers, anyway. There's too much traffic there. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 5 23:47:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA05580 for hackers-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:47:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from nixpbe.pdb.sni.de (mail.sni.de [192.109.2.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA05572 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 1996 23:46:46 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nerv@localhost) by nixpbe.pdb.sni.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA24405 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:44:11 +0100 Message-Id: <199602060744.IAA24405@nixpbe.pdb.sni.de> Subject: Re: Willows To: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 96 8:39:59 MET From: Greg Lehey Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (Hackers; FreeBSD) In-Reply-To: <25575.823562101@time.cdrom.com>; from "Jordan K. Hubbard" at Feb 05, 96 3:15 pm X-Mailer: xmail 2.4 (based on ELM 2.2 PL16) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >> Wine may not use LDTs, but if you don't set the appropriate option >> (USER_LDT, from memory) in the kernel config, wine refuses to try to >> work. Nothing else does, so I suppose it doesn't use user LDTs. > > Huh? Wine most definitely DOES use USER_LDTs. I don't know how you > manage to come to the conclusion above - UTSL! :-) Sorry, I wasn't being quite serious. I'm quite convinced that it does use user LDTs. But I can't prove it: thus "Wine may not use LDTs". "I suppose it doesn't use user LDTs" refers to "Nothing else does". UTSL? Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 00:02:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA06369 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:02:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA06364 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:02:19 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id AAA27742; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:01:12 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602060801.AAA27742@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: motion detection? To: dgy@rtd.com (Don Yuniskis) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:01:12 -0800 (PST) Cc: langfod@maui.com, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602052358.QAA09358@seagull.rtd.com> from "Don Yuniskis" at Feb 5, 96 04:58:11 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > >Does anyone have a program to detect motion and then take a snapshot > > >of the scene? > > > hey, I *said* it would be gross but I imagine you could implement this > in an hour and test it just as quick. > just look at he size of an mpeg frame.. the larger the more changes.... From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 00:02:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA06389 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:02:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from casparc.ppp.net (casparc.ppp.net [194.64.12.35]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA06380 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:02:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from ernie by casparc.ppp.net with uucp (Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0tjiLh-000I2cC; Tue, 6 Feb 96 09:02 MET Received: by ernie.altona.hamburg.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #4) id m0tjhLn-00000kC; Tue, 6 Feb 96 07:58 MET Message-Id: From: hm@altona.hamburg.com (Hellmuth Michaelis) Subject: Re: Web and Watchdog Timer??? To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty Jr.) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:58:03 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602052104.NAA03155@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr." at Feb 5, 96 01:04:52 pm Reply-To: hm@altona.hamburg.com X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >From the keyboard of Amancio Hasty Jr.: > > > 1. UltraJAVA: > > > Industry's fastest JAVA processors (3-5X microJAVA performance) Ohhh - is it already April, 1st ??? hellmuth -- Hellmuth Michaelis hm@altona.hamburg.com Hamburg, Europe (A)bort, (R)etry, (I)nstall BSD ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 00:06:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA06760 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:06:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA06754 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:06:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id AAA02104; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:06:16 -0800 Message-Id: <199602060806.AAA02104@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: hm@altona.hamburg.com cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Web and Watchdog Timer??? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 07:58:03 +0100." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 00:06:15 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Don't forget that Java was originally designed for micro controllers. As to the performance claim , I have no clue if it is true or not but I got to admit is probably more hype than fact 8) Cheers, Amancio >>> Hellmuth Michaelis said: > >From the keyboard of Amancio Hasty Jr.: > > > > > 1. UltraJAVA: > > > > Industry's fastest JAVA processors (3-5X microJAVA performance) > > Ohhh - is it already April, 1st ??? > > hellmuth > -- > Hellmuth Michaelis hm@altona.hamburg.com Hamburg, Eur ope > (A)bort, (R)etry, (I)nstall BS D ? From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 00:07:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA06787 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:07:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA06776 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:07:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id AAA02049; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:02:49 -0800 Message-Id: <199602060802.AAA02049@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Greg Lehey cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com (Jordan K. Hubbard), hackers@freebsd.org (Hackers; FreeBSD) Subject: Re: Willows In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 08:39:59 +0700." <199602060744.IAA24405@nixpbe.pdb.sni.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 00:02:48 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Greg Lehey said: > UTSL? jkh's humor UTSL --- Use The Source Luke Actually , it should have been MTSBWY May The Source Be With You AH From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 00:13:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA07265 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:13:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA07248 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:13:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id SAA02468; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:39:27 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602060809.SAA02468@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Is this security hole being fixed?? To: michael@memra.com (Michael Dillon) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:39:27 +1030 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, security@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Michael Dillon" at Feb 5, 96 10:46:57 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Michael Dillon stands accused of saying: > From: Alan Cox > To: Multiple recipients of list BIG-LINUX > Subject: Linux as a production system > > [ irrelevant details deleted ] > > Some of the other things are very questionable. I can break a standard > Sun Solaris 2 machine in about 2 minutes from a shell prompt and about 10 > otherwise unless the user is applying patchkits very fast. Currently I can > break almost any BSD derived system because of a bug CERT haven't yet > even published. Alan's good at this sort of bragging, in my (limited) experience. Unless he's willing to expose his techniques to scrutiny, I'm happy to scoff. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 00:21:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA07833 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:21:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from precipice.shockwave.com (precipice.shockwave.com [171.69.108.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA07820 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:20:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.shockwave.com (localhost.shockwave.com [127.0.0.1]) by precipice.shockwave.com (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA00413 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:19:14 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602060819.AAA00413@precipice.shockwave.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Paul is manual-less tonight... inw() instruction? Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 00:19:13 -0800 From: Paul Traina Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Can anyone give me a quick description of how the i386 inw (in word) i/o instructions is suppoed to work? does foo = inw(port) read low byte from port and high byte from port+1, or two sequential byte reads of port? Thanks, Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 00:28:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA08514 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:28:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from precipice.shockwave.com (precipice.shockwave.com [171.69.108.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA08488 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:28:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.shockwave.com (localhost.shockwave.com [127.0.0.1]) by precipice.shockwave.com (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA00439; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:27:00 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602060827.AAA00439@precipice.shockwave.com> To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV), hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 23:01:17 PST." <1707.823590077@time.cdrom.com> Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 00:27:00 -0800 From: Paul Traina Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Let's set up conventions like: freebsd-sup-admin@ freebsd-www-admin@ freebsd-ftp-admin@ and document them in addition to a "mirror-admin@freebsd.org" mailing list. The point being, I don't care if sup3 is broken, but I *do* care violently if sup2 is broken. I also want to get important notifications from you about changes at freefall (which I rarely if ever get now). If something's wrong with sup2, www2, et al, I want to know about it asap. Paul From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree > I must also report similar problems: > [details of sup2..supn dysfunction elided] Well, I'm glad you're reporting them, that's all I can really say. Truly! I think that central resources should be flagged ASAP when broken and people should take Extra Special Care in making sure they run right, just as we jump up and down and run around in paniced circles whenever freefall starts having problems. We might not fix things right away, but we certainly manage to look busy! :-) Any suggestions on promoting and facilitating this level of reliability? Would an `admin' mailing list for all FreeBSD.ORG related resources help, or would it merely turn into a source of unwanted messages for admins who already get too much mail? It certainly doesn't seem like such reports should be sent to hackers, anyway. There's too much traffic there. Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 00:56:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA09862 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:56:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from ns.pa-consulting.com (ns.pa-consulting.com [193.118.224.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA09855 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 00:56:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from SMTPGATE.PA-CONSULTING.COM by ns.pa-consulting.com (8.6.4) id JAA17374; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:03:36 GMT Received: by SMTPGATE.PA-CONSULTING.COM with Microsoft Mail id <31178897@SMTPGATE.PA-CONSULTING.COM>; Tue, 06 Feb 96 08:57:59 PST From: Duncan Barclay To: freebsd-hackers Date: Tue, 06 Feb 96 08:47:00 PST Message-ID: <31178897@SMTPGATE.PA-CONSULTING.COM> Encoding: 38 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi I had this idea over the weekend whilst I was slowly running out of swap on my machine at home and not noticing. I am going to write a daemon to keep an eye on the ammount of swap used and add extra to the system using the vn driver. if a threshold is crossed. I ensivige this to be useful to people with home machines which are rebooted most days and dont always need loads of swap space. The swap files created would be deleted on the next reboot by rc or as part of the daemon configuration. Questions: Has anyone done it before. Would a fstab like config script be better than automatically finding spare vnodes in /dev and allocating space. ie. #file vnode size threshold # to create on /usr/tmp/swapfile1 /dev/vn0a 12M 80% /usr/tmp/swapfile2 /dev/vn0b 12M 80% /disk2/tmp/swapfile /dev/vn0c 24M 90% where the threshold is the percentage of currently used swap. Should the swap usage be looked at over a long time to determine threshold or be faily reactive? Would it be useful to others? Any thoughts would be helpful. Thanks Duncan Barclay duncan.barclay@pa-consulting.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 01:10:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA10530 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 01:10:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.Germany.EU.net (mail.germany.eu.net [192.76.144.65]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA10522 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 01:10:45 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail.Germany.EU.net with ESMTP (5.59:15/EUnetD-2.5.3.d) via EUnet id JAA00603; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:01:53 +0100 Received: (from nerv@localhost) by nixpbe.pdb.sni.de (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA25087 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:59:18 +0100 Message-Id: <199602060759.IAA25087@nixpbe.pdb.sni.de> Subject: Re: Converting from Linux to FreeBSD To: dennis@etinc.com (dennis) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 96 8:55:06 MET From: Greg Lehey Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (Hackers; FreeBSD) In-Reply-To: <199602011715.MAA19747@etinc.com>; from "dennis" at Feb 1, 96 12:15 pm X-Mailer: xmail 2.4 (based on ELM 2.2 PL16) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >>>> My questions... >>>> >>>> can linux be 'upgraded' in place to freeBSD? >>> >>> Probably not. Certainly, in view of the requirement that you don't go >>> down for long, you'd be better off installing FreeBSD on separate >>> disks. That way, if you *do* experience problems, you can fall back >>> to Linux quickly and painlessly. >> >> In particular, the Linux second stage boot code will not work for >> FreeBSD, which expects the second stage boot code to pass it much >> information from BIOS space that is unavailable in protected mode. >> >> In addition, using the FreeBSD second stage boot will not by default >> recognize the unsliced partitions Linux uses as mountable as root, >> nor will the kernel recognize ext2fs by default (variant root FS >> types is one argument pro a bootfs). > > Its taking more time to discuss this issue than simply build a new system and > copy stuff over! There's no contradiction in that. The discussion is not so time-critical, and the results can be used in multiple situations. The last thing the original poster wants is to run into problems in mid-migration. Greg From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 01:40:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA12077 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 01:40:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA12062 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 01:40:28 -0800 (PST) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA17404 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:43:08 +0100 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:43:08 +0100 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199602060943.KAA17404@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: does phkmalloc check bounds? Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Without having looked at phkmalloc - where is it hidden in the source tree BTW - I wonder if it does bounds checking, that is allocate a bit more on every malloc, initialize the extra bytes with a magic pattern and see if it is invalidated next time an alloc routine is entered. --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 01:49:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA12489 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 01:49:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA12460 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 01:48:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id KAA06179 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:47:06 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA19378 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:47:06 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id KAA00413 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:37:27 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602060937.KAA00413@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: List Duplicates To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:37:27 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from "Julian Jenkins" at Feb 6, 96 11:50:18 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Julian Jenkins wrote: > Is it not possible for the list server to scan the list of To: and CC: > and not resend to these who have already recieved a copy of the message > independantly? It's almost impossible. For example, if somebody g)roup replies to a message i've sent to -hackers, the message will go to hackers and to joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (my default reply-to address), whereas the list server would notice that only freebsd-hackers@ uriah.heep.sax.de is subscribed to the hackers list, and therefore still send a message back to me. The only chance is that people start editing their Cc lines before sending out a message. Alas, this is also impossible due to the general laziness of man. The xfree86-beta list solves this by the general policy that each *sender* of a message (not the list daemon) sets the reply-to field to the list himself. This seems to work. It's admittedly easier for them since xfree86-beta is a closed list, i.e. you can expect the authors of any mail to the list being on the list himself. But this is still no excuse for people on the freebsd lists to always keep everyone in the Cc, even in case this is already the umpteenth reply, and they would have known quite well that all the Cc'ed persons *are* on the list. I usually remove the Cc manually, and set the To field to the list (by an alias in the mailer), as long as i'm sure that the poster is also listening. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 01:55:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA12710 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 01:55:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA12705 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 01:55:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with ESMTP id BAA01023 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 01:54:49 -0800 Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id KAA06172; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:47:05 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA19377; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:47:04 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id KAA00368; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:27:09 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602060927.KAA00368@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: devs hosed can't get up To: kimc@w8hd.org (Kim Culhan) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:27:09 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from "Kim Culhan" at Feb 5, 96 07:30:14 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk As Kim Culhan wrote: > I 'accidently' executed MAKEDEV with no arguments and this appears > to have hosed the devices for sd* -I can't boot the machine. > Is there any way to recover from this? sh MAKEDEV sd0s1 Then mount /usr, so you've got the chown etc. binaries available, rerun the MAKEDEV, and reboot so the mounted devices and /dev nodes are in sync again. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 02:29:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA14251 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 02:29:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA14246 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 02:29:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tjkeG-0003vqC; Tue, 6 Feb 96 02:29 PST Received: from localhost.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA00881; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:28:07 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost.tfs.com didn't use HELO protocol To: "Christoph P. Kukulies" cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: does phkmalloc check bounds? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 10:43:08 +0100." <199602060943.KAA17404@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 10:28:06 +0100 Message-ID: <879.823598886@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Without having looked at phkmalloc - where is it hidden in the > source tree BTW - I wonder if it does bounds checking, that is src/lib/libc/stdlib/malloc.c > allocate a bit more on every malloc, initialize the extra bytes > with a magic pattern and see if it is invalidated next time > an alloc routine is entered. No presently not. If you want to add this, make it an option you enable with the MALLOC_OPTIONS, and we can merge it into the mainline code... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 02:36:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA14653 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 02:36:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from r2d2.fdn.org (r2d2.fdn.org [193.55.4.56]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id CAA14388 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 02:31:52 -0800 (PST) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by r2d2.fdn.org (8.7.1/8.6.9) with UUCP id LAA24169; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:20:25 +0100 (MET) Received: (from caussep@localhost) by sphynx.fdn.fr (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA00461; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:15:08 +0100 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:15:07 +0100 (MET) From: Philippe Causse To: Bruce Evans cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, delaitt@cpc.wmin.ac.uk, jdp@polstra.com Subject: Re: Patches from 2.1-RELEASE In-Reply-To: <199602060357.OAA19150@godzilla.zeta.org.au> Message-ID: X-Mailer: PINE-3.91/i386/FreeBSD MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello Bruce ! Glad you replied :-) Here are the answers to your questions. (I left the original quote for people reading new to this discussion) On Tue, 6 Feb 1996, Bruce Evans wrote: > >1] tape-patch: > >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > Some SCSI-1 tape drives like Archive 2150S, Tandberg-??? _DO_ > >implement a mode called QFA (Quick File Access) which allow quick > >positionning on a given block number (counted 1 from the begining of > >tape). This feature was available when I ran Linux two years ago. An > >equivalent set of commands also exist on SCSI-2 tape drives but I > >don't have any hardware to test it on. Before releasing this patch, I > >grabbed the 2.2-current "st.c", so this patch also adds the retension > >command. > > The `tell' command but not the `seek' command worked on my WangDat 3100 > SCSI-2 DAT tape under Linux a couple of years ago. Linux used (and implemented only) QFA commands in its tape driver. It should probably have used the SCSI-2 command set to control your DAT. > > >CAVEATS: I don't know if these commands are specific to the Archive > >Viper-150 (aka 2150S). If so, they should probably go to the rogues > >gallery; anyhow they have a SCSI-2 equivalent (but with different > >encoding). > > Where can I find the different encoding? By encoding I meant different command codes & different command block structures (not the old classic SCSI-1 24bits addressing scheme). I found the SCSI-1 and SCSI-2 (text only) documentation on the net using Archie. To avoid flooding you mailbox, I'll just quote a part of it in this mail. If you want the full text, I can e-mail it to you as a MIME attachment. Please, don't hesitate to ask! (300K for SCSI-2, 84K for SCSI-1) The commands we are interested in are "LOCATE" and "READ POSITION". Both are optional commands, so they may not be supported by your DAT either! ------------------[ EXTRACT FROM THE SCSI-2 SPECS ]------------------- 10.2 Command descriptions for sequential-access devices The commands for sequential-access devices shall be as shown in table 174. Table 174 - Commands for sequential-access devices +=====================================-============-======-============+ | Command name | Operation | Type | Subclause | | | code | | | |-------------------------------------+------------+------+------------| | CHANGE DEFINITION | 40h | O | 8.2.1 | | COMPARE | 39h | O | 8.2.2 | | COPY | 18h | O | 8.2.3 | | COPY AND VERIFY | 3Ah | O | 8.2.4 | | ERASE | 19h | M | 10.2.1 | | INQUIRY | 12h | M | 8.2.5 | | LOAD UNLOAD | 1Bh | O | 10.2.2 | | LOCATE | 2Bh | O | 10.2.3 | | LOG SELECT | 4Ch | O | 8.2.6 | | LOG SENSE | 4Dh | O | 8.2.7 | | MODE SELECT(6) | 15h | M | 8.2.8 | | MODE SELECT(10) | 55h | O | 8.2.9 | | MODE SENSE(6) | 1Ah | M | 8.2.10 | | MODE SENSE(10) | 5Ah | O | 8.2.11 | | PREVENT ALLOW MEDIUM REMOVAL | 1Eh | O | 9.2.4 | | READ | 08h | M | 10.2.4 | | READ BLOCK LIMITS | 05h | M | 10.2.5 | | READ BUFFER | 3Ch | O | 8.2.12 | | READ POSITION | 34h | O | 10.2.6 | | READ REVERSE | 0Fh | O | 10.2.7 | | RECEIVE DIAGNOSTIC RESULTS | 1Ch | O | 8.2.13 | | RECOVER BUFFERED DATA | 14h | O | 10.2.8 | | RELEASE UNIT | 17h | M | 10.2.9 | | REQUEST SENSE | 03h | M | 8.2.14 | | RESERVE UNIT | 16h | M | 10.2.10 | | REWIND | 01h | M | 10.2.11 | | SEND DIAGNOSTIC | 1Dh | M | 8.2.15 | | SPACE | 11h | M | 10.2.12 | | TEST UNIT READY | 00h | M | 8.2.16 | | VERIFY | 13h | O | 10.2.13 | | WRITE | 0Ah | M | 10.2.14 | | WRITE BUFFER | 3Bh | O | 8.2.17 | | WRITE FILEMARKS | 10h | M | 10.2.15 | |----------------------------------------------------------------------| |Key: M = command implementation is mandatory. | | O = command implementation is optional. | +======================================================================+ The following command codes are vendor-specific: 02h, 06h, 07h, 09h, 0Ch, and 0Eh. All other command codes for sequential-access devices are reserved for future standardization. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- NB: QFA_SEEK_BLOCK = 0x0C, QFA_REQUEST_BLOCK = 0x02 -> Vendor specific! Now, the encoding (aka command format) for LOCATE and READ POSITION: ------------------[ EXTRACT FROM THE SCSI-2 SPECS ]------------------- 10.2.3 LOCATE command LOCATE command (see table 177) causes the target to position the logical unit to the specified block address in a specified partition. Upon completion, the logical position shall be before the specified location. Prior to performing the locate operation, the target shall ensure that all buffered data, filemarks, and setmarks have been transferred to the medium. Table 177 - LOCATE command +=====-========-========-========-========-========-========-========-========+ | Bit| 7 | 6 | 5 | 4 | 3 | 2 | 1 | 0 | |Byte | | | | | | | | | |=====+=======================================================================| | 0 | Operation code (2Bh) | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 1 | Logical unit number | Reserved | BT | CP | Immed | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 2 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 3 | (MSB) | |-----+--- ---| | 4 | | |-----+--- Block address ---| | 5 | | |-----+--- ---| | 6 | (LSB) | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 7 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 8 | Partition | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 9 | Control | +=============================================================================+ A block address type (BT) bit of one indicates the value in the block address field shall be interpreted as a device-specific value. A BT bit of zero indicates the value in the block address field shall be interpreted as an SCSI logical block address. A change partition (CP) bit of one indicates that a change to the partition specified in the partition field is to occur prior to positioning to the block specified in the block address field. A CP bit of zero indicates no partition change is to be made and the partition field is to be ignored. An immediate (Immed) bit of zero indicates that the target shall not return status until the locate operation has completed. An Immed bit of one indicates that the target shall return status as soon as all buffered commands have completed execution and the command descriptor block of the LOCATE command has been validated. If CHECK CONDITION status is returned for a LOCATE command with an Immed bit of one, the locate operation shall not be performed. The block address field (see 10.1.6) specifies the block address to which the target shall position the medium based on the current setting of the BT bit. The partition field specifies which partition to select if the CP bit is one. Refer to the sequential-access device model (see 10.1.3) and the medium partition pages (see 10.3.3.2 and 10.3.3.3) for additional information about partitioning. 10.2.6 READ POSITION command The READ POSITION command (see table 181) reports the current position of the logical unit and any data blocks in the buffer. No medium movement shall occur as a result of the command. Table 181 - READ POSITION command +=====-========-========-========-========-========-========-========-========+ | Bit| 7 | 6 | 5 | 4 | 3 | 2 | 1 | 0 | |Byte | | | | | | | | | |=====+=======================================================================| | 0 | Operation code (34h) | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 1 | Logical unit number | Reserved | BT | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 2 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 3 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 4 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 5 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 6 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 7 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 8 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 9 | Control | +=============================================================================+ A block address type (BT) bit of one requests the target to return its current first block location and last block location as a device- specific value. A BT bit of zero requests the target to return the first block location and the last block location as an SCSI logical block address (relative to a partition). If the logical unit is not capable of reporting block locations, the BPU bit shall be set to one in the returned data. Support for this option of the READ POSITION command is indicated by a BIS bit set to one in the device configuration page (see 10.3.3.1). The READ POSITION data shown in table 182 shall be returned. Table 182 - READ POSITION data format +=====-========-========-========-========-========-========-========-========+ | Bit| 7 | 6 | 5 | 4 | 3 | 2 | 1 | 0 | |Byte | | | | | | | | | |=====+========+========+==========================+========+=================| | 0 | BOP | EOP | Reserved | BPU | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 1 | Partition number | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 2 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 3 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 4 | (MSB) | |- - -+--- First block location ---| | 7 | (LSB) | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 8 | (MSB) | |- - -+--- Last block location ---| | 11 | (LSB) | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 12 | Reserved | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 13 | (MSB) | |- - -+--- Number of blocks in buffer ---| | 15 | (LSB) | |-----+-----------------------------------------------------------------------| | 16 | (MSB) | |- - -+--- Number of bytes in buffer ---| | 19 | (LSB) | +=============================================================================+ A beginning of partition (BOP) bit of one indicates that the logical unit is at the beginning-of-partition in the current partition. A BOP bit of zero indicates that the current logical position is not at the beginning-of-partition. An end of partition (EOP) bit of one indicates that the logical unit is positioned between early-warning and end-of-partition in the current partition. An EOP bit of zero indicates that the current logical position is not between early-warning and end-of-partition. NOTE 143 The BOP and EOP indications are not necessarily a result of a physical tape marker (e.g. reflective marker). A block position unknown (BPU) bit of one indicates that the first and last block locations are not known or cannot be obtained. A BPU bit of zero indicates that the first and last block location fields contain valid position information. The partition number field reports the partition number for the current logical position. If the logical unit only supports one partition for the medium, this field shall be set to zero. The first block location field indicates the block address associated with the current logical position. The value shall indicate the block address of the next data block to be transferred between the initiator and the target if a READ or WRITE command is issued. The last block location field indicates the block address (see 10.1.6) associated with the next block to be transferred from the buffer to the medium. The value shall indicate the block address of the next data block to be transferred between the buffer and the medium. If the buffer does not contain a whole block of data or is empty, the value reported for the last block location shall be equal to the value reported for the first block location. NOTE 144 The information provided by the first and last block location fields can be used in conjunction with the LOCATE command to position the medium at the appropriate logical block on another device in the case of unrecoverable errors on the first device. The number of blocks in buffer field indicates the number of data blocks in the target's buffer that have not been written to the medium. The number of bytes in buffer field indicates the total number of data bytes in the target's buffer that have not been written to the medium. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Sorry, I don't remember excatly where I grabbed the SCSI-2 specs, but it's available somewhere on the net. Anyway, I send you a copy of it. Now, the floppy stuff... > > >2] floppy-patch: > >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > ... > >2-b) High-speed: > > The speed increase comes from two changes: the increased number of > >sectors (since the rotational speed is the same) and spiral formatting > >with a cylinder skew of 2 to compensate the head switching time. > > I don't like cylinder skew or interleave for floppies. The driver > should keep track of the next (accessible) sector and schedule i/o's to > access the sectors in the best possible order. If the skews and > interleaves are nonstandard, then the driver has to do extra work to > detect and adjust for them. Well, I don't really understand the point here... This patch is essentially for tar/pax/dump/mcopy, not for using a floppy filesystem Although I _did_ make a UFS floppy, it works pretty well. Just add the proper values in the floppy disk's label before news'ing. If cylinder-skew were not physically implemented (using a spiral formatting), then speedup on linear access would be possible only by changing the sector access order when writing to the floppy. This would make the floppy incompatible with other systems. > Skew and interleave helps for dumb drivers of course. I mean the raw floppy device, since performing linear access on a floppy is best done with the /dev/rfd[0-1] interface. Using the block device in that context is nonsense. > > >it back!!! (this is used for spiral formatting). The default head > >settle time is "hz/16" which is far too big to get the benefit of > >spiral formatting. I replaced it with "hz/FDSEEKWAIT". A good value > > hz/16 is 6 (giving a timeout of 50+ to 60 msec). This is much too large. > It was hz/50 in rev.1.1 of fd.c (giving a timeout of (10+ to 20 msec). > This may be too small. I think the standard is 15 msec. The kernel ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ That's right indeed but for 5"1/4. (According to an old tech-manual of a 360K TEAC floppy drive). 3"1/2 drives are quicker to settle, probably due to a smaller inertia in their stepping motor / head motion system. Old 5"1/4 used a steal belt for head motion but smart 3"1/2 now use an endless screw attached to the stepping motor plus a lot of lightweight (nylon) mechanical parts to reduce inertia. > has poor support for timeouts this small. The timeout has to be 3 ticks > to guarantee that it is > 15 msec. I made it hz/32 in rev.1.30 to get > this. Then someone made it hz/16 in rev.1.43 "to avoid annoying messages". And miss a whole revolution at the same time... :( considerably degrading performance. > > >of FDSEEKWAIT is 64, though it runs okay with 128 but 64 is safer :-) > > hz/64 is 1 (0+ to 10 msec timeout) while hz/128 is 0 (also 0+ to 10 > msec timeout because timeout() doesn't believe that you want a timeout > of 0 ticks and increases it to 1 tick :-). Well.. it worked indeed !!! Lucky am I ? But I admit I stuck to hz/64 since it's enough to keep up with track stepping. > > I've worked on floppy drivers that didn't worry about head settle. This > is usually OK on old, slow systems. It is safer if the driver schedules Do you mean 486DX2-66 is an "old slow system" ??? > i/o. Then the driver never should never attempt to access a sector too > soon after seeking because the access would usually fail and a whole > disk revolution would be wasted. Sure, but waiting too much before writing misses the expected sector and a whole revolution is wasted as well. That's why standard floppies have a rate of 32K/s instead of the 49K/s peak performance. Note that the theoretical performance is (for a drive 3"1/2 HD, with 1.6Mb formatting) 50K/s. 300 RPM = 5 RPS, 1 track of 20 sectors = 10K 10K * 5 -> 50 K/S : That's FDC_500KBPS in fd.c This does not take any track/cylinder skewing into account. So 32K/s is only 64% efficient :( > > >The fdformat program has been changed to do spiral formatting. It > >accepts two new parameters: track and cylinder skew. Track skew > >(defaults to zero) is almost useless since the head switching time is > >neglectable . Cylinder skew is sensitive: I obtained the best > >performances with a value of 2 (the default) on an unloaded system. > > The best skew is probably drive-dependent. On one of my floppy drives > (a 5.25 inch TEAC (?) drive bought in 1988) with standard 1.2MB > formatting, it is possible to read sector N on one cylinder, then seek > to the next cylinder and read sector N+2, except when N is the last or > the second last sector, it is possible to read the first sector on the > next track! On all my other PC floppy drives (a couple of 5.25 inch > ones and a couple of 3.5 inch ones), it is only possible to read > sector N+3 or N+4 after seeking. This is easy to compensate for in That's why I added an option to specify the skew. 2 is the best value for my 3"1/4 drive (3 seems more suitable to my 1.2M 5"1/4). It may be a good idea to let fdformat guess the best cylinder-skew parameter. One important thing: before I changed hz/16 to hz/FDSEEKWAIT with FDSEEKWAIT=64, I couldn't increase performances and the best skew was arround 7. Transfer rate was near 42K/s. Still over M$-DOG performance but far from the 49K/s... > drivers that schedule the i/o, but it costs a sector time or 3 per > revolution, as would uncompensated for cylinder skew. In dumb drivers > it can waste a lot of time, e.g., under DOG copying a bunch of small > files to an uncached floppy took about a minute with the fast drive > and about 8 minutes with a slow drive. It depends also on the disk controller's type. Mine is a stock NEC 765 but new 82077 (with FIFO) are really faster. Spiral formatting doesn't affect M$-DOG copying. When copying small files, there's no time penality. When copying large files, it's really faster... You didn't tell me what you think about adding the 1.6Mb format in the format table & device list. Is it worth doing it ? BTW, since spiral formatting is handled entirely in the fdformat program, I could just leave cylinder_skey=0; as the default and let the user's supply the parameter, or make the program guess the `best' value. > > Bruce > Regards, Philippe. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- FreeBSD, NetBSD, Linux: Il y a moins bien, mais c'est plus cher... You can get worse, but it's more expensive... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 02:41:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA14913 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 02:41:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA14624 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 02:34:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id LAA06818; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:04:41 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id LAA19416; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:04:40 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id KAA00771; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:57:13 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602060957.KAA00771@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Is this security hole being fixed?? To: michael@memra.com (Michael Dillon) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:57:12 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from "Michael Dillon" at Feb 5, 96 10:46:57 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Michael Dillon wrote: > > Currently I can > break almost any BSD derived system because of a bug CERT haven't yet > even published. This is hard to tell unless he says us what he means. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 02:59:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA15527 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 02:59:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au [129.78.129.109]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA15522 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 02:59:13 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dawes@localhost) by rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au (8.6.11/8.6.9) id VAA17109 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 21:59:07 +1100 From: David Dawes Message-Id: <199602061059.VAA17109@rf900.physics.usyd.edu.au> Subject: Re: List Duplicates To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 21:59:06 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199602060937.KAA00413@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Feb 6, 96 10:37:27 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >The xfree86-beta list solves this by the general policy that each >*sender* of a message (not the list daemon) sets the reply-to field to >the list himself. This seems to work. It's admittedly easier for Actually, the list daemon does set the reply-to field for that list, but it won't override a reply-to set by the sender. Some people love it, and some hate it. David From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 03:22:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id DAA16399 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 03:22:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id DAA16394 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 03:22:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id VAA02850; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 21:46:43 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602061116.VAA02850@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: does phkmalloc check bounds? To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (Christoph P. Kukulies) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 21:46:43 +1030 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602060943.KAA17404@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph P. Kukulies" at Feb 6, 96 10:43:08 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Christoph P. Kukulies stands accused of saying: > > Without having looked at phkmalloc - where is it hidden in the > source tree BTW - I wonder if it does bounds checking, that is > allocate a bit more on every malloc, initialize the extra bytes > with a magic pattern and see if it is invalidated next time > an alloc routine is entered. Read the code; it's pretty easy to follow. I've retrofitted it into libc on all our -stable systems here; it's great for catching _stupid_ programming mistakes! > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de Performance be damned, it's saved me more time in bugfixing than any performance gain could; hat off to phk. -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 05:02:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA19917 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 05:02:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from eel.dataplex.net (EEL.DATAPLEX.NET [199.183.109.245]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA19891 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 05:02:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from [199.183.109.242] (cod [199.183.109.242]) by eel.dataplex.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id HAA09503; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:02:12 -0600 X-Sender: rkw@shark.dataplex.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:02:12 -0600 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" From: Richard Wackerbarth Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >> I must also report similar problems: >> [details of sup2..supn dysfunction elided] >Any suggestions on promoting and facilitating this level of >reliability? Would an `admin' mailing list for all FreeBSD.ORG >related resources help, or would it merely turn into a source of >unwanted messages for admins who already get too much mail? It >certainly doesn't seem like such reports should be sent to hackers, >anyway. There's too much traffic there. I concur. If we can direct the issues of distribution and coordination to a subset, it would help cut down on the traffic for those who have nothing to do with it. OTOH, there is some value in having the existance of a problem more generally known. All in all, I vote for a specialized list. If we set it up, then everyone needs to help in directing each discussion thread to the appropriate focused group. ---- Richard Wackerbarth rkw@dataplex.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 05:05:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA20729 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 05:05:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from hq.icb.chel.su (icb-rich-gw.icb.chel.su [193.125.10.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA20684 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 05:05:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (babkin@localhost) by hq.icb.chel.su (8.6.5/8.6.5) id SAA17283; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:03:27 +0500 From: "Serge A. Babkin" Message-Id: <199602061303.SAA17283@hq.icb.chel.su> Subject: Re: Paul is manual-less tonight... inw() instruction? To: pst@shockwave.com (Paul Traina) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:03:27 +0500 (GMT+0500) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602060819.AAA00413@precipice.shockwave.com> from "Paul Traina" at Feb 6, 96 00:19:13 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Can anyone give me a quick description of how the i386 inw (in word) > i/o instructions is suppoed to work? > > does foo = inw(port) > > read low byte from port and high byte from port+1, or two sequential byte > reads of port? As far as I know it depends on hardware you are fetching bytes from. If it supports 16-bit mode then one word read is done. If not then two sequential byte reads are done. -SB From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 06:37:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA09065 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 06:37:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from moonpie.w8hd.org (moonpie.w8hd.org [198.252.159.14]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA09054 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 06:37:21 -0800 (PST) Received: (from kimc@localhost) by moonpie.w8hd.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA01294; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:46:07 -0500 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:46:06 -0500 (EST) From: Kim Culhan To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Devices hosed -how to recover? In-Reply-To: <1047.823578850@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > ./MAKEDEV sd0s1a Thanks muchly. kim From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 06:44:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA10323 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 06:44:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw.ast.com (fw.ast.com [165.164.6.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA10316 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 06:44:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from nemesis by fw.ast.com with uucp (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tjnZp-000858C; Tue, 6 Feb 96 07:36 CST Received: by nemesis.lonestar.org (Smail3.1.27.1 #20) id m0tjnRf-000CniC; Tue, 6 Feb 96 07:28 WET Message-Id: Date: Tue, 6 Feb 96 07:28 WET To: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org From: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Sent: Tue Feb 6 1996, 07:28:30 CST Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk [5]From: Paul Traina [5]What speed link are you suping over? A T1. Frank Durda IV |"The Knights who say "LETNi" or uhclem%nemesis@rwsystr.nkn.net | demand... A SEGMENT REGISTER!!!" ^------(this is the fastest route)|"A what?" or ...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem |"LETNi! LETNi! LETNi!" - 1983 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 06:50:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA11352 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 06:50:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA11186 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 06:49:36 -0800 (PST) Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA14809 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:34:01 +0300 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Tue, 6 Feb 96 17:34:00 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by ache.dialup.ru (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA00878; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:33:14 +0300 (MSK) To: Kai.Vorma@hut.fi, hackers@freebsd.org References: <199511181559.RAA18772@lk-hp-5.hut.fi> In-Reply-To: <199511181559.RAA18772@lk-hp-5.hut.fi>; from Kai Vorma at Sat, 18 Nov 1995 17:59:48 +0200 Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:33:14 +0300 (MSK) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.42 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Sup server at nic.funet.fi Lines: 15 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199511181559.RAA18772@lk-hp-5.hut.fi> Kai Vorma writes: >Collections are updated twice a day (currently at 0230 and 1430 GMT) >and current client limit is 50. All European users and especially >users from the Nordic countries are welcome. Could you please update it at least 3 times? Due to interference with sleep period I forced to wait much more than 12h for next update :-( -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 07:26:42 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA16523 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:26:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA16514 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:26:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from venus.mcs.com (root@Venus.mcs.com [192.160.127.92]) by kitten.mcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA07843 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:26:36 -0600 Received: by venus.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Tue, 6 Feb 96 09:26 CST Message-Id: Subject: Hmmmm... STABLE tree has interesting panic for EISA 2742s... To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:26:11 -0600 (CST) From: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Any ideas on this one? ahc0: brkadrint illegal host access at seqaddr 0x0 Comes up right after the probe completes, and that's it. System is an EISA/PCI ASUS board, P100, with Twinchannel 2742 SCSI adapter. Runs an October build of the STABLE tree ok (this one appears to have a kernel memory leak; it eventually runs out of free page space and dies) . The supped tree of STABLE I built this kernel on is two days old. Ideas? -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | 21 Chicagoland POPs, ISDN, 28.8, much more Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net/ ISDN - Get it here TODAY! | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 07:48:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA19370 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:48:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from FSL.ORST.EDU (root@FSL.ORST.EDU [128.193.112.105]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA19353 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:48:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from picea.FSL.ORST.EDU (hernanw@picea.FSL.ORST.EDU [128.193.112.3]) by FSL.ORST.EDU (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA19501; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:48:07 -0800 Received: (from hernanw@localhost) by picea.FSL.ORST.EDU (8.6.9/8.6.9) id HAA21530; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:48:05 -0800 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:48:04 -0800 (PST) From: Wayne Hernandez To: "Steven G. Kargl" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, stable@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: sup is broken? In-Reply-To: <199602060043.QAA01579@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Steven G. Kargl wrote: > SUP: Invalid release stable for collection src-secure > SUP: Invalid release stable for collection src-eBones These two directories needed hand fixing, which have now been accomplished. Please give it a try to make sure it worked. I don't have logging enabled to know what kind of traffic I'm getting, and no one has mentioned these directories being a problem until now. Wayne From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 07:50:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA19535 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:50:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from zappa.cs.uncc.edu (zappa.cs.uncc.edu [152.15.35.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA19530 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:50:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by zappa.cs.uncc.edu (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA13100; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:40:28 -0500 From: jlrobins@zappa.cs.uncc.edu (James Robinson) Message-Id: <9602061540.AA13100@zappa.cs.uncc.edu> Subject: Re: Swap adding daemon To: Duncan.Barclay@pa-consulting.com (Duncan Barclay) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:40:27 -0500 (EST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <31178897@SMTPGATE.PA-CONSULTING.COM> from "Duncan Barclay" at Feb 6, 96 08:47:00 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I am going to write a daemon to keep an eye on the ammount of swap used > and add extra to the system using the vn driver. if a threshold is crossed. > I ensivige this to be useful to people with home machines which are rebooted > most days and dont always need loads of swap space. The swap files > created would be deleted on the next reboot by rc or as part of the daemon > configuration. Good idea! And if the ability comes to unswap from a device, then it could do that too! Sortof of an amd for swap. > > Questions: > Has anyone done it before. > > Would a fstab like config script be better than > automatically finding spare vnodes in /dev and > allocating space. > ie. > #file vnode size threshold > # to create on > /usr/tmp/swapfile1 /dev/vn0a 12M 80% > /usr/tmp/swapfile2 /dev/vn0b 12M 80% > /disk2/tmp/swapfile /dev/vn0c 24M 90% > where the threshold is the percentage of currently used swap. Hmm. fstab syntax is the way to go. I assume that the system, in this case, would add /usr/tmp/swapfile1, after creating it to be 12M, first, once the system exceeds 80% swap capacity. Then, after some time, swapfile2 is joined in after the previously augmented swap space exceeds 80%. Etc. > > Should the swap usage be looked at over a long time to determine > threshold or be faily reactive? Hmm, since we can't remove swap at this moment in time, I'd lean towards the more conversative. What two threshold fields, one to specify 5 minute avg swap usage, and the other to specify one minute swap usage? So, it would add that space if the one minute swap load reading exceeded 95%, or add it if the 5 min swap load average exceeded 75%. This would handle a heavy swap hog (netscape, anyone?), or a general increase in load over time. Just my $.02 -- good idea! Heck, you could prototype it in a script language. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 07:57:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA20179 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:57:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from cwbone.bsi.com.br ([200.250.250.14]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA20156 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 07:57:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from cwbtwo (cwbtwo [200.250.250.2]) by cwbone.bsi.com.br (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA02566 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:55:47 GMT Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:53:38 +0000 () From: Sergio Lenzi To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: What a OS!! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi. Folks, I have just received the 2.1 cd rom fro Walnut Creek, and find it wondefull. I have showed the system to some enterprises, all running several windows machines using pc/tcp or some sort of tcp stack runing in windows. They find the system very good, and plan to migrate to FreeBSD All of those windows machines that are used to access RISC databases. They apreciate the X interface with Xdm and Xfm (the new version) and the ease of use and instalation (compared with windows 95 or 3.1). I installed in one machine on the network and the other machines I showed then how to install via FTP. Conclusion: GREAT sofware, ease of use, Good GUI interface, secure,Fast, and Reliable. Thanks a lot. PS: Now my custumers is asking for word processor.... Is there any in sight? Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 08:23:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA21714 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:23:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA21707 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:23:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tjqAe-0003vsC; Tue, 6 Feb 96 08:23 PST Received: from localhost.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id QAA01433; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:21:57 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost.tfs.com didn't use HELO protocol To: jlrobins@zappa.cs.uncc.edu (James Robinson) cc: Duncan.Barclay@pa-consulting.com (Duncan Barclay), freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Swap adding daemon In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 10:40:27 EST." <9602061540.AA13100@zappa.cs.uncc.edu> Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 16:21:56 +0100 Message-ID: <1431.823620116@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > I am going to write a daemon to keep an eye on the ammount of swap used > > and add extra to the system using the vn driver. if a threshold is crossed. > > I ensivige this to be useful to people with home machines which are reboote d > > most days and dont always need loads of swap space. The swap files > > created would be deleted on the next reboot by rc or as part of the daemon > > configuration. Be sure to make sufficient slots for swap-devs in the kernel. The default is 4. > Good idea! And if the ability comes to unswap from a device, then it could > do that too! Sortof of an amd for swap. Don't hold your breath for this. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 08:25:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA21948 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:25:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from terra.Sarnoff.COM (terra.sarnoff.com [130.33.11.203]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA21939 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:25:27 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rminnich@localhost) by terra.Sarnoff.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA01008; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:19:05 -0500 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:19:04 -0500 (EST) From: "Ron G. Minnich" To: Kees Jan Koster cc: FreeBSD hackers Mailing list Subject: Re: Solaris CacheFS for FreeBSD? In-Reply-To: <199602050950.KAA00543@phobos.spase.nl> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk w.r.t. cachefs: > Is there something like it under FreeBSD? Is there a quick-'n-dirty way > to try it out and make some performance measurements? With the results > I might persuade our sysop to trash linux and use FreeBSD instead ;) six years ago i modified sun's automounter to perform as an autocacher. The way i made it work was a whole lot simpler than sun: i shadowed the file tree on the local node from the remote node. Our observed cache usage was that given about 2 gbytes of remote /usr/local, typically 40 mbytes of files needed to be cached locally. I did not do this to save net bandwidth, it was more of a management thing: when i upgraded /usr/local, files got updated at the remote host automagically, but only if referenced. You could run cache prune program, but rarely needed to since the caches were so small. [See usenix winter 1991, "The autocacher: ..." by Minnich. ] More important if they were running an x server or whatever out of their local cache there was no problem with unlinking it since it was ufs-based, and the server would continue to run. Overwriting nfs-based executables is hazardous on servers with many clients ... lots of fireworks, and there is really NO safe time to overwrite an nfs-based executable. i also modified amd to do the same thing. The mods are not well done, as i was writing a thesis at the time and the overload showed in the quality of my code. But if you want the amd version you can have it; it might be a starting point for doing it right. another option: i have a user-level nfs server that runs with a tcl interpreter built in. looks like this: Client -> tclfs -> remote servers | | v TCL command interface. This has been used to do a user-level union file system, but could easily be used as a caching file system or whatever, depending on the tcl code. Most of this code was written by gene kim with me kibitzing. It is all available. Contact me if interested. ron From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 08:48:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA23269 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:48:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA23263 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:48:24 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602061648.IAA23263@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV), hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 23:01:17 PST." <1707.823590077@time.cdrom.com> Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 08:48:23 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Any suggestions on promoting and facilitating this level of >reliability? Would an `admin' mailing list for all FreeBSD.ORG >related resources help, or would it merely turn into a source of >unwanted messages for admins who already get too much mail? It >certainly doesn't seem like such reports should be sent to hackers, >anyway. There's too much traffic there. > > Jordan I think that a method of reliably replicating the collections between servers is in order. I'm not positive that all our servers are using the same lists and even if they are, there's no guarantee that a change to the collections on Freefall will propogate. I'll set something up later this week that will make the whole process automatic for the "child" sup sites. The supserver kit will become four files: supfile, supfile.conf, customize.sh, README. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 08:56:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA23557 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:56:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA23551 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:56:17 -0800 (PST) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id KAA16332; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:54:53 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199602061654.KAA16332@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: Time travelling news server To: peter@jhome.DIALix.COM (Peter Wemm) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:54:53 -0600 (CST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Peter Wemm" at Feb 6, 96 02:01:31 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I saw this behavior on -current a month or so ago about when PHK was doing > the bcd stuff.. If I remember rightly, the spammed date got written into > my CMOS. Running 2.1R-almost (i.e. one of the SNAP's that was essentially 2.1R with a loose end or two). > >It's been a week for problems with my news box. :-/ > Are you running -current or -stable on it? My news box has been doing > wonderfully well under a new -current kernel (from Jan 11). It's currently > got an uptime of 24 days (which is a record for the -current FreeBSD > machines here). This machine used to crash every few days before that last > update. It's only a garden-variety hardware box though.. (486, ISA, > AHA1542CF) It's keeping up with it's load but has no spare disk bandwidth at > all - it's running at near 100% head seek saturation 24 hours a day and is > going to need an upgrade (more disk, more RAM) soon. No, the problems are hardware related, I'm going to replace the power harnesses on my drive arrays ... hooking up a slew of drives is never fun. However, I had been thinking about upgrading to -stable.. heard some good things about it. ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 09:05:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA24021 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:05:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA24012 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:05:03 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602061705.JAA24012@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Hmmmm... STABLE tree has interesting panic for EISA 2742s... In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 09:26:11 CST." Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 09:05:02 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >Any ideas on this one? > >ahc0: brkadrint illegal host access at seqaddr 0x0 What other cards are you running in that system? It looks like some driver is stepping on the Adaptec's address space. One big difference in -stable of recent is that it probes the EISA bus before the ISA bus, so a malicious ISA driver could be at fault. Try disabling driver probes and see if it starts working. >-- >-- >Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity >Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available >Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | 21 Chicagoland POPs, ISDN, 28.8, much more >Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net >/ >ISDN - Get it here TODAY! | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 09:09:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA24198 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:09:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA24193 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:09:09 -0800 (PST) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA18516; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:11:10 +0100 Message-Id: <199602061711.SAA18516@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Subject: Re: Sup server at nic.funet.fi To: ache@astral.msk.su (=?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?=) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:11:09 +0100 (MET) Cc: Kai.Vorma@hut.fi, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "=?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?=" at Feb 6, 96 05:33:14 pm From: Christoph Kukulies Reply-To: Christoph Kukulies X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > In message <199511181559.RAA18772@lk-hp-5.hut.fi> Kai Vorma writes: > > >Collections are updated twice a day (currently at 0230 and 1430 GMT) > >and current client limit is 50. All European users and especially > >users from the Nordic countries are welcome. > > Could you please update it at least 3 times? Due to interference > with sleep period I forced to wait much more than 12h for > next update :-( Updating during our European daytime periods is pretty useless due to totally overloaded transatlantic lines during business hours. sup.de.freebsd.org sups after the following scheme: /etc/crontab: 17 0-5,18-23 * * * root /root/supper supper checks that sups don't stomp on their heels :-) (sample supfiles are on ftp://gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de/pub/FreeBSD/sup/) > > -- > Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, > ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - > http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. > RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 09:25:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA24809 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:25:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from ki.net (root@ki.net [142.77.249.8]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA24802 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:25:52 -0800 (PST) Received: (from scrappy@localhost) by ki.net (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA15440; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:25:23 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:25:22 -0500 (EST) From: "Marc G. Fournier" To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup is broken? In-Reply-To: <1582.823587775@time.cdrom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Mon, 5 Feb 1996, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > I'm still not sure if I understand the question since the answer seems > rather obvious, otherwise. You sup some stuff. You either put it > somewhere for others to sup in turn or you use it for development. If > you want to do both, you copy it before you change it. > This was actually the question, but I think I answered it myself already...what is the easiest way to copy it from the "reference tree" to the "live tree". What I was looking for was some way of using SUP for it (ie. sup -l), but even using cpio to copy over the "new" files would do it too. > Disk space is actually pretty cheap these days.. :-) > Ya, but we're a new company and getting new drives for my "toys" (ie. -current) is a tug of war :) Slow I'm building up what I require to play. Marc G. Fournier | POP Mail Telnet Acct DNS Hosting System | WWW Services Database Services | Knowledge, Administrator | | Information and scrappy@ki.net | WWW: http://www.ki.net | Communications, Inc From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 09:30:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA25004 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:30:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from rk.ios.com (rk.ios.com [198.4.75.55]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA24995 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 09:30:22 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rashid@localhost) by rk.ios.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA26089 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:24:48 -0500 From: Rashid Karimov Message-Id: <199602061724.MAA26089@rk.ios.com> Subject: mSQL 1.0.9 - mmap() problems To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:24:47 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi there folx, Does some1 here have any luck with compiling/installing mSQL 1.0.9 ? It compiles just fine , run sample.msql w/o any problems, but fails on ****/tests/killer with sporadic messages: mmap: invalid arguments I've looked thru the source - it looks kosher to me, probably something happens there at the run time ? Rashid From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 10:13:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA27707 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:13:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA27699 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:13:09 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA02630; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:09:56 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602061809.LAA02630@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: hotjava To: mmead@Glock.COM (matthew c. mead) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:09:56 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602060319.WAA11344@Glock.COM> from "matthew c. mead" at Feb 5, 96 10:19:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Well, due to Netscape's inability to get Java support out the door for BSDI > with their 2.0 release, I was thinking of looking into JDK source code and > porting, and I remembered something about this. Has anyone gotten this > working, and/or gotten pthreads fully working? Are we going to have a > multithreading kernel soon? Just curious about some of these issues... A multithreading kernel isn't strictly necessary. There is an alpha versio of a Linux and NetBSD port that the authors won't (can't?) distribute because of the licensing. Did you get the "Kaffe" announcement of a JAVA replacement with some interesting translate-to-machine-code-on-the-fly features? It was on the -announce list today. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 10:19:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA28058 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:19:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA28053 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:19:53 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA02651; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:18:30 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602061818.LAA02651@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: On keeping a src tree To: rkw@dataplex.net (Richard Wackerbarth) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:18:30 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Richard Wackerbarth" at Feb 5, 96 11:51:20 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > FOLKS. This is EXCELLENT ADVISE. > > I suggest that you should never store the source code obtained from any > FreeBSD source in /usr/src. > > Move it somewhere else! I would go so far as to suggest that you make it > ReadOnly with respect to the account that you use to modify things. > > Then "clone" it into /usr/src using the lndir command. You can then use > this tree just as you would have originally. (Except that you have to copy > a source before you alter it) > > That way you will not polute the reference tree with your own stuff. How do you handle "config", since it is still (improperly, IMO) not built as part of the kernel build tree and wants to be installed? How do you generate diffs? For those of us without commit priviledges, we can't check into the main tree and have the code show up in our next SUP. I use "cvs diff" (I admit that this has only recently worked; I had to update my CVS to keep it from bombing out on my changed files on a "cvs update", and I had to disable the client and server code, since I did not want to install the new headers on my host system and code is still being built relative to the installed header files instead of the header files in the source tree, like you'd expect). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 10:29:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA28650 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:29:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA28637 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:29:14 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA02677; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:27:02 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602061827.LAA02677@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: What a OS!! To: lenzi@cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (Sergio Lenzi) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:27:01 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Sergio Lenzi" at Feb 6, 96 01:53:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I have just received the 2.1 cd rom fro Walnut Creek, > and find it wondefull. I have showed the system to some enterprises, > all running several windows machines using pc/tcp or some sort of tcp > stack runing in windows. They find the system very good, and plan to > migrate to FreeBSD All of those windows machines that are used to access > RISC databases. They apreciate the X interface with Xdm and Xfm (the new > version) and the ease of use and instalation (compared with windows 95 or > 3.1). I installed in one machine on the network and the other machines I > showed then how to install via FTP. > > Conclusion: GREAT sofware, ease of use, Good GUI interface, secure,Fast, > and Reliable. Thanks a lot. > > PS: Now my custumers is asking for word processor.... Is there any in sight? The Willows code will be running soon. It will allow you to run MS-Word. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 11:02:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA01573 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:02:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from sequent.kiae.su (sequent.kiae.su [144.206.136.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA01546 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:02:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by sequent.kiae.su id AA03784 (5.65.kiae-2 ); Tue, 6 Feb 1996 21:55:00 +0300 Received: by sequent.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Tue, 6 Feb 96 21:55:00 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by ache.dialup.ru (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA00643; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 21:51:11 +0300 (MSK) To: Christoph Kukulies Cc: Kai.Vorma@hut.fi, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <199602061711.SAA18516@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> In-Reply-To: <199602061711.SAA18516@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de>; from Christoph Kukulies at Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:11:09 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 21:51:11 +0300 (MSK) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.42 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Sup server at nic.funet.fi Lines: 16 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In message <199602061711.SAA18516@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Christoph Kukulies writes: >Updating during our European daytime periods is pretty useless due to totally >overloaded transatlantic lines during business hours. sup.de.freebsd.org >sups after the following scheme: Maybe, but I remember good old days when freefall SUP was working... I can successfully run SUP in _any_ time. BTW, my ISP works via Finland channels in those days. -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 11:04:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA01802 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:04:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA01791 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:04:16 -0800 (PST) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA18858; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:06:05 +0100 Message-Id: <199602061906.UAA18858@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Subject: Re: What a OS!! To: lenzi@cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (Sergio Lenzi) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:06:04 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Sergio Lenzi" at Feb 6, 96 01:53:38 pm From: Christoph Kukulies Reply-To: Christoph Kukulies X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Hi. Folks, > > I have just received the 2.1 cd rom fro Walnut Creek, > and find it wondefull. I have showed the system to some enterprises, > all running several windows machines using pc/tcp or some sort of tcp > stack runing in windows. They find the system very good, and plan to > migrate to FreeBSD All of those windows machines that are used to access > RISC databases. They apreciate the X interface with Xdm and Xfm (the new > version) and the ease of use and instalation (compared with windows 95 or > 3.1). I installed in one machine on the network and the other machines I > showed then how to install via FTP. > > Conclusion: GREAT sofware, ease of use, Good GUI interface, secure,Fast, > and Reliable. Thanks a lot. > > PS: Now my custumers is asking for word processor.... Is there any in sight? :-) :-) These guys - you give him a finger and they want to grab the whole hand (german saying - humbly translated). Tell him he cannot have everything. Period. :-) > > > Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. > > --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 11:05:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA01992 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:05:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from salmon.maths.tcd.ie (salmon.maths.tcd.ie [134.226.81.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA01984 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:05:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from bell.maths.tcd.ie by salmon.maths.tcd.ie with SMTP id aa14289; 6 Feb 96 19:04 GMT To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: How would I find out the ethernet address of an interface? X-Address: School Of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland. X-Phone: (Home)+353-(0)1-8204643 (College)+353-(0)1-7022280 X-PGP: Public Key on Request MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <22037.823633494.1@maths.tcd.ie> Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 19:04:54 +0000 From: Colman Reilly Message-ID: <9602061904.aa14289@salmon.maths.tcd.ie> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I need a way of finding the ethernet address of the interface associated with a socket in an LKM. Any pointers to where I'd start looking? Thanks, Colman From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 11:18:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA02919 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:18:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhost.tue.nl (mailhost.tue.nl [131.155.2.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA02895 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 11:18:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from asterix.urc.tue.nl [131.155.5.10] by mailhost.tue.nl (8.7.1) id UAA09805 (ESMTP). Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:17:28 +0100 (MET) Received: from wmbfmk@localhost by asterix.urc.tue.nl (8.7.1) id UAA21931. Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:17:27 +0100 (MET) From: Marc van Kempen Message-Id: <199602061917.UAA21931@asterix.urc.tue.nl> Subject: Re: What a OS!! To: lenzi@cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (Sergio Lenzi) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:17:27 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Sergio Lenzi" at Feb 6, 96 01:53:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Hi. Folks, > > I have just received the 2.1 cd rom fro Walnut Creek, > and find it wondefull. I have showed the system to some enterprises, > all running several windows machines using pc/tcp or some sort of tcp > stack runing in windows. They find the system very good, and plan to > migrate to FreeBSD All of those windows machines that are used to access > RISC databases. They apreciate the X interface with Xdm and Xfm (the new > version) and the ease of use and instalation (compared with windows 95 or > 3.1). I installed in one machine on the network and the other machines I > showed then how to install via FTP. > > Conclusion: GREAT sofware, ease of use, Good GUI interface, secure,Fast, > and Reliable. Thanks a lot. > > PS: Now my custumers is asking for word processor.... Is there any in sight? > There are several really! Look at lyx, this is a wysiawyg front-end to latex, ftp.via.ecp.fr/pub/lyx Thot, this is a linuxbinary http://hatutu.imag.fr/thot cicero, (alpha state) http://www.uni-frankfurt.de/(tilde)weis Regards, Marc. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 12:01:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA06392 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:01:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from kitten.mcs.com (Kitten.mcs.com [192.160.127.90]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA06385 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:01:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from venus.mcs.com (root@Venus.mcs.com [192.160.127.92]) by kitten.mcs.com (8.6.10/8.6.9) with SMTP id OAA23119; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:01:46 -0600 Received: by venus.mcs.com (/\==/\ Smail3.1.28.1 #28.5) id ; Tue, 6 Feb 96 14:01 CST Message-Id: Subject: Re: Hmmmm... STABLE tree has interesting panic for EISA 2742s... To: gibbs@freefall.freebsd.org (Justin T. Gibbs) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:01:20 -0600 (CST) From: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602061705.JAA24012@freefall.freebsd.org> from "Justin T. Gibbs" at Feb 6, 96 09:05:02 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > > >Any ideas on this one? > > > >ahc0: brkadrint illegal host access at seqaddr 0x0 > > What other cards are you running in that system? It looks like > some driver is stepping on the Adaptec's address space. One > big difference in -stable of recent is that it probes the > EISA bus before the ISA bus, so a malicious ISA driver could > be at fault. Try disabling driver probes and see if it starts > working. > The following is in that box: EISA 2742 Twinchannel disk SMC Elite Ultra SMC PCI Ethernet VGA Video (PCI board) That's it. There isn't much that COULD be stomping on it. The kernel config is the same one I've built and used before. Are you suggesting that I start turning off devices in the configuration file? How does one disable probes? -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | 21 Chicagoland POPs, ISDN, 28.8, much more Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net/ ISDN - Get it here TODAY! | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 12:03:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA06563 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:03:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from austin.polstra.com (austin.polstra.com [206.213.73.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA06532 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:03:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from austin.polstra.com (jdp@localhost) by austin.polstra.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA14626; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:03:25 -0800 Message-Id: <199602062003.MAA14626@austin.polstra.com> To: pst@shockwave.com Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, current@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 12:03:25 -0800 From: John Polstra Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Paul Traina wrote: > If something's wrong with sup2, www2, et al, I want to know about it asap. *Great!* One thing I should have mentioned in my original tirade, but forgot: I sup the CVS tree (src and ports), not the -current tree or anything else. I'm just mentioning it now because it could be germane to the problem of my files getting deleted, if, for example, that tree doesn't exist on sup2. Although there are clearly some problems on the auxiliary sup servers, I really view a lot of this as bugs in the sup software itself. It should be _much_ more reluctant to delete existing files on the client machine. It should be _absolutely_ sure it knows what it's doing before that happens. Anyway, Paul, if you'd like me to help you try some experiments, I'd be willing to back up my sup tree and go for it. -- John PS - Since you were asking about link speeds, mine's a 56K frame relay. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 12:22:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA08030 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:22:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA08025 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:22:52 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA03106; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:21:34 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602062021.NAA03106@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: FS PATCHES: THE NEXT GENERATION To: current@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:21:33 -0700 (MST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Well, I now have a working spu2/CVS synchronization mechanism, so I guess it's time to try again... Here is yet another revision of my FS patches, this time as full source files against a -current checked out source tree from a daily SUP update. These changes *WILL* go in cleanly. I believe they are ready to go into the main source tree following normal review. I believe the path buffer processing changes (the majority of the code changes result from this) to be especially important in light of the recent interest in support for VFAT. VFAT, as you may or may not know, has two name spaces: and 8.3 namespace in the DOS code page, and a 255 Unicode name space for VFAT "long names". In light of the desire to support VFAT, NTFS, and HPFS file systems, it will be necessary to further modiy the path processing algorithms to operate on a component basis, and (potentially) to support multiple down-components (Unicode vs. non-Unicode vs. "short name", etc.). I already have some of these changes (I have a UFS with a modified directory structure, the ability to do case-insensitve lookup via flag, and the ability to store both Unicode and shortname data), but since they are somewhat more controversial they are not included in this patch set. The README uploaded with the patch set follows the signature. If anyone has a problem using these patches, please contact me directly. I am especially interested in NFS client/server effects, since I've only been able to try the server code locally (the NFS patches have not change significantly in two months, at which time I *did* do extensive bidirectional testing -- I don't believe that this will be a significan problem). If you can beat on a system with several "make world"'s and then use "vmstat -m" to verify there are no memory leaks in the path buffers: namei 0 0K 4K 8892K 172739 0 0 1K ^ ^ then I would appreciate it. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. ============================================================================= This is the README for the file ftp://freefall.freebsd.org/FS_PATCHES.tar.gz, my latest FS patches as replacement files against -current as of 4am sup2 SUP on 06 Feb 96. There are 22 modified files in FS_PATCHES.tar.gz: i386/ibcs2/imgact_coff.c isofs/cd9660/cd9660_vnops.c kern/kern_exec.c kern/uipc_usrreq.c kern/vfs_init.c kern/vfs_lookup.c kern/vfs_syscalls.c kern/vfs_vnops.c kern/vnode_if.sh miscfs/devfs/devfs_vnops.c miscfs/procfs/procfs_vnops.c miscfs/union/union_subr.c msdosfs/msdosfs_vnops.c nfs/nfs.h nfs/nfs_node.c nfs/nfs_nqlease.c nfs/nfs_serv.c nfs/nfs_subs.c nfs/nfs_vnops.c nfs/nfsm_subs.h sys/namei.h ufs/ufs/ufs_vnops.c The patches: o Abstract the path processing. The underlying FS is no longer responsible for freeing cn_pnbuf buffers. o Fix some minor nits in NFS o Get rid of the goto's in vfs_syscalls.c. o Reorder a number of functions to cause them to be single entry/exit. o Add an EXCLUDE flag to CN_FLAGS to force CREATE ops to fail with EEXIST. This allows the removal of a lot of bogus and duplicate error handling code in the namei( CREATE, ...) case. o Move the definition vfs_opv_numops to node_if.c. This is a necessary change to allow the creation of kernels with zero default file systems. The previous code required that at least one file system exist to correctly do initialization. This change is also necessary to allow the addition of ops to the vector tables for new file systems with the recreation of vnode_if.c instead of recompilation of a number of kernel pieces in addition to that (like vfs_init.c, which no longer requires recompilation when the number of ops changes). This undoes some of the bogosity introduced when the Heidemann framework was pounded into BSD 4.4 with a blunt instrument. Since these are full modified files, installing them, followed by a CVS update, followed by a CVS checkin should be sufficient to put them in the current source tree. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. ============================================================================= From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 12:35:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA08902 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:35:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from clem.systemsix.com (clem.systemsix.com [198.99.86.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA08895 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:35:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clem.systemsix.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA15319 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:35:06 -0700 Message-Id: <199602062035.NAA15319@clem.systemsix.com> X-Authentication-Warning: clem.systemsix.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 From: Steve Passe To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: motion detection? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 13:35:04 -0700 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hi, >> So lets see, Your watching TV on your monitor, someone walks down the driveway >> an X-window pops up to alert you to the fact and turns on the X-10 light radio-shack sells an X-10 infrared motion detector/floodlight that works fairly well. this device can send up to 4 different X-10 codes when triggered. right now I have it rigged to notice anyone in the front of the house, at which point it: System: - echo someone is on the front porch > /dev/voice -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 12:35:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA08933 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:35:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from border.com (janus.border.com [199.71.190.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA08901 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 12:35:28 -0800 (PST) Received: by janus.border.com id <20483>; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:44:25 -0500 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:34:34 -0500 From: Jerry Kendall To: Colman Reilly Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How would I find out the ethernet address of an interface? In-Reply-To: <9602061904.aa14289@salmon.maths.tcd.ie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Message-Id: <96Feb6.154425est.20483@janus.border.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk 'ifconfig -a' will tell you the address for all interfaces... 'ifconfig ep0' will tell you the address of the ep0 interface... Get the picture?? On Tue, 6 Feb 1996, Colman Reilly wrote: > > I need a way of finding the ethernet address of the interface associated with > a socket in an LKM. Any pointers to where I'd start looking? > > Thanks, > > Colman > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Any comments or opinions in this message are my own and may or may not reflect the comments or opinions of my present or previous employers. Jerry Kendall Border Network Technologies Inc. System Software Engineer Tel +1-416-368-7157 ext 303 jerry@border.com Fax +1-416-368-7178 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 13:02:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA11600 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:02:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from netmail1.austin.ibm.com (netmail1.austin.ibm.com [129.35.208.96]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA11571 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:01:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from vikings.austin.ibm.com (vikings.austin.ibm.com [129.35.130.98]) by netmail1.austin.ibm.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with SMTP id PAA174986 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:01:46 -0600 Received: by vikings.austin.ibm.com (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03-client-2.6) for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org at austin.ibm.com; id AA30435; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:01:44 -0600 From: swise@austin.ibm.com (Jean-Steveau Wise) Message-Id: <9602062101.AA30435@vikings.austin.ibm.com> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: assertions Date: Tue, 06 Feb 96 15:01:43 -0600 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I'm debugging a problem with 2.1 FreeBSD where my ATAPI cdrom hangs the system entirely (cannot ping via ethernet, cannot invoke the debugger, etc etc). I'm a kernel hacker but my expertise is in AIX/RS-6K SW/HW. I want to put assertions into the ATAPI driver code and the kernel to assert that the ATAPI code doesn't leave a system call or interrupt with interrupts disabled. Can anyone help me code this assertion? My thoughts are that the ATAPI code is possibly disabling ints, then failing under some cases to re-enable them. I'd like to catch this somehow. So, if this assertion fails, I'd like to jump into the kernel debugger. Anyone else have thoughts on how I might debug this problem? Thanx in advance, ******** Steve Wise IBM RISC System/6000 Division - Austin, TX. Internet: swise@austin.ibm.com VNET: AUSTIN(SWISE) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 13:25:38 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA13983 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:25:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA13956 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:25:31 -0800 (PST) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id PAA16641 for hackers@freebsd.org; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:24:58 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199602062124.PAA16641@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: What was THAT crash? :-) To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:24:58 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk hummin# dmesg ed from SPACE to TIME /news/.1: optimization changed from TIME to SPACE /news/.1: optimization changed from SPACE to TIME /news/.0: optimization changed from TIME to SPACE panic: vm_page_activate: already active syncing disks... 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 13 giv ing up Automatic reboot in 15 seconds - press a key on the console to abort Rebooting... FreeBSD 2.1.0-951026-SNAP #0: Fri Jan 19 14:06:56 CST 1996 jgreco@hummin.sol.net:/usr/src/sys/compile/HUMMIN_CCD CPU: i486DX (486-class CPU) ...etc Fascinating. ;-) ... JG From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 13:26:13 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA14060 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:26:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA14052 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:26:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA00383; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:25:37 -0800 Message-Id: <199602062125.NAA00383@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: fwmiller@cs.UMD.EDU (Frank Miller) cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: PCI programming In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 14:15:39 EST." <199602061915.OAA22707@yangtze.cs.UMD.EDU> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 13:25:36 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, We have been successfull in transferring video straight into the video frame buffer of my PCI graphic card. The end result is a cool tv 8) There is not much to do in terms of PCI-TO-PCI transfer. In my case, I just loaded up the physical address of the video frame buffer to the video capture board registers. I am not familiar with PCI ethernet cards so I am CCing hackers. Cheers, Amancio >>> Frank Miller said: > Hello! > > I was given your name by a Peter Dufault. He told me that you had been > doing some work with PCI-to-PCI data transfers. I am interested in > streaming some data from an Adaptec AHA-2940 PCI SCSI adapter directly > to a PCI Ethernet card. I wonder if you might help me with a couple of > questions? > > Is there a particular Ethernet card I should get, e. g. one of the DEC > Tulip based cards perhaps? > > Where's the best place to look for documentation on how to do this sort > of thing? > > Peter said you had been trying to move data to or from a frame buffer? > Could you describe the work you've been up to? > > Any help you could give me would be great. > > Later, > FM > > -- > Frank W. Miller Department of Computer Scien ce > fwmiller@cs.umd.edu University of Maryland, College Pa rk > http://www.cs.umd.edu/~fwmiller College Park, Maryland 207 42 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 13:59:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA16687 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:59:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA16680 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:59:28 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA01076; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:59:25 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602062159.NAA01076@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: FS PATCHES: THE NEXT GENERATION To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 13:59:24 -0800 (PST) Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602062021.NAA03106@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 6, 96 01:21:33 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Well, I now have a working spu2/CVS synchronization mechanism, so I > guess it's time to try again... > I guess i'll try look at it again too :) > > > > o Move the definition vfs_opv_numops to node_if.c. This is a > necessary change to allow the creation of kernels with zero > default file systems. The previous code required that at > least one file system exist to correctly do initialization. hmm but devfs might be compulsory :) > > > Since these are full modified files, installing them, followed by a > CVS update, followed by a CVS checkin should be sufficient to put > them in the current source tree. This is not a good idea terry you should do a "cvs diff -c" or similar on the source tree to get diffs the trouble with full files is it's TOO EASY to spam someone else's patches when you over-write the file. With Patches, you get a .rej file in this case so you can merge the two changes.. I think it might be an idea to supply your changes in that form.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 14:35:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA19136 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:35:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA19131 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:35:25 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602062235.OAA19131@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Hmmmm... STABLE tree has interesting panic for EISA 2742s... In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 14:01:20 CST." Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 14:35:24 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I think that david is helping you with this, but just in case... >The following is in that box: > >EISA 2742 Twinchannel disk >SMC Elite Ultra >SMC PCI Ethernet >VGA Video (PCI board) > >That's it. > >There isn't much that COULD be stomping on it. The kernel config is the >same one I've built and used before. Depends on the drivers enabled in the kernel, not your actual hardware. Sorry if I made it sound otherwise, but most production systems have a confi file that matches there hardware setup exactly. >Are you suggesting that I start turning off devices in the configuration >file? How does one disable probes? Yes. Boot with the '-c' argument and disable all the probes for devices you don't have. If that works, enable them one by one again until it breaks. Then tell me which driver it is so I can go fix it. :) >-- >Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity >Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | T1 from $600 monthly; speeds to DS-3 available >Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1] | 21 Chicagoland POPs, ISDN, 28.8, much more >Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" WWW: http://www.mcs.net >/ >ISDN - Get it here TODAY! | Home of Chicago's only FULL Clarinet feed! -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 14:48:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA20178 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:48:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (rocky.sri.MT.net [204.182.243.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA20172 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:48:31 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA05166; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:50:54 -0700 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:50:54 -0700 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199602062250.PAA05166@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: Terry Lambert Cc: rkw@dataplex.net (Richard Wackerbarth), hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: On keeping a src tree In-Reply-To: <199602061818.LAA02651@phaeton.artisoft.com> References: <199602061818.LAA02651@phaeton.artisoft.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk [ Keeping a separate locally hacked src tree from the 'reference' tree ] > How do you handle "config", since it is still (improperly, IMO) not > built as part of the kernel build tree and wants to be installed? You install the old binary (which works in your tree as 'config.old' and hope that you remember it whenever you build your local kernels. :) > How do you generate diffs? For those of us without commit priviledges, > we can't check into the main tree and have the code show up in our > next SUP. CVS is really the only easy way of doing this and staying current. > I use "cvs diff" (I admit that this has only recently worked; Hmm, it's worked since day one for me. >I had to > update my CVS to keep it from bombing out on my changed files on a > "cvs update", This was due to the 'death-state' support I suspect. > and I had to disable the client and server code, since > I did not want to install the new headers on my host system and code > is still being built relative to the installed header files instead > of the header files in the source tree, like you'd expect). Huh? When you run things locally, you shouldn't have to modify anything on your system. Why would you have to install new header files because of the CVS client-server code? Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 14:58:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA20813 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:58:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU [136.152.64.181]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA20804 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:58:01 -0800 (PST) Received: (from asami@localhost) by silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU (8.7.3/8.6.9) id OAA07912; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:57:37 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:57:37 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602062257.OAA07912@silvia.HIP.Berkeley.EDU> To: rkw@dataplex.net CC: jdp@polstra.com, hackers@freebsd.org, stable@freebsd.org In-reply-to: (message from Richard Wackerbarth on Mon, 5 Feb 1996 15:48:59 -0600) Subject: Re: sup is broken? From: asami@cs.berkeley.edu (Satoshi Asami) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk * From: Richard Wackerbarth * John Polstra replied: * >When I try an experiment, and that experiment attempts to delete * >220 MB of my files, I lose my thirst for adventure very quickly. * >Nevertheless, if you or somebody else can give me some clue about * >how to switch to a different sup server without losing all my * >perfectly good files, I'll try again. * * As I have pointed out, the cvs tree that I am getting from sup2 also seems * to have problems. As a result, my distribution in the name of -stable, * reflects the same condition. I saw the same thing until yesterday, except the problem seemed to have been fixed today. Satoshi From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 15:04:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA21494 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:04:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from gsfc.nasa.gov (gsfc.nasa.gov [128.183.7.22]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA21489 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:04:55 -0800 (PST) From: Edward_Pease_at_FS550@cscgt.gsfc.nasa.gov Received: from cscgt.gsfc.nasa.gov by gsfc.nasa.gov (5.65/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA10661; Tue, 6 Feb 96 18:03:51 -0500 Received: from cc:Mail by cscgt.gsfc.nasa.govid AA823643709; Tue, 06 Feb 96 12:55:40 PST Date: Tue, 06 Feb 96 12:55:40 PST Message-Id: <9601068236.AA823643709@cscgt.gsfc.nasa.gov> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Writing FreeBSD Device Drivers info needed. Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I've been tasked to port some SCO drivers to either Linux or FreeBSD. I was able to get "Writing Linux Device Drivers" by Michael K. Johnson & "Device Driver Basics(Linux)" off the net. Does any similar Documentation exist for FreeBSD? The FreeBSD Handbook didn't seem to include the specific details for writing/configuring your own driver into the kernel. Thanks, Ed Pease ed_pease@cscgt.gsfc.nasa.gov From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 15:12:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA22003 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:12:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from DeepCore.dk (aalb17.pip.dknet.dk [194.192.0.177]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA21994 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:12:19 -0800 (PST) Received: (from sos@localhost) by DeepCore.dk (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA00523; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:11:40 +0100 (MET) From: S鷨en Schmidt Message-Id: <199602062311.AAA00523@DeepCore.dk> Subject: Patches for lcc-3.5 uploaded... To: sysseh@devetir.qld.gov.au (Stephen Hocking) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:11:40 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) In-Reply-To: <199601300349.DAA07167@netfl15a.devetir.qld.gov.au> from "Stephen Hocking" at Jan 30, 96 01:49:04 pm Reply-to: sos@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I've uploaded patches to the new lcc-3.5 on ftp://ra.dkuug.dk/pub/LCC/* There is now support for debug information and static & shared libs. More on the 64bit front later... -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Soren Schmidt (sos@FreeBSD.org) FreeBSD Core Team Even more code to hack -- will it ever end .. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 15:13:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA22074 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:13:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA22069 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:13:20 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA03559; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:10:54 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602062310.QAA03559@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FS PATCHES: THE NEXT GENERATION To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:10:54 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602062159.NAA01076@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Feb 6, 96 01:59:24 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > o Move the definition vfs_opv_numops to node_if.c. This is a > > necessary change to allow the creation of kernels with zero > > default file systems. The previous code required that at > > least one file system exist to correctly do initialization. > > hmm but devfs might be compulsory :) "Allow", not "require". DEVFS might be hooked in above the Heidemann framework. 8-). > > Since these are full modified files, installing them, followed by a > > CVS update, followed by a CVS checkin should be sufficient to put > > them in the current source tree. > > This is not a good idea terry > you should do a "cvs diff -c" or similar > on the source tree to get diffs > > the trouble with full files is it's TOO EASY to spam > someone else's patches when you over-write the file. > > With Patches, you get a .rej file in this case so you can merge the two > changes.. > > I think it might be an idea to supply your changes in that form.. Well, the idea is to do a fresh checkout and spam the checked out files and then "cvs update" in case I did spam some changes. I can provide the changes as diffs if you need them that way; I'll warn you that you'll be in exactly the same boat applying them as the original diff sets I sent (that's why I went to the trouble of sup + cvs + ...). In particular, the vfs_syscalls.c changes will be hard to cope with as diffs. Will the local spam + "cvs diff" not work for you? Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 15:21:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA22709 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:21:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA22698 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:21:01 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA03592; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:18:53 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602062318.QAA03592@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: On keeping a src tree To: nate@sri.MT.net (Nate Williams) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:18:53 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, rkw@dataplex.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602062250.PAA05166@rocky.sri.MT.net> from "Nate Williams" at Feb 6, 96 03:50:54 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > I use "cvs diff" (I admit that this has only recently worked; > > Hmm, it's worked since day one for me. It's failed since day one for me. Of course I started at 2.0.5 and I don't "make world" often because I am a kernel hacker, not a utility hacker. 8-). Specifically, a CVS update with a changed tree failed when the rev on the checked-out, changed file was not the same as the updated rev of the same file in the tree. I had to awk "tags" onto the CVS/Entries lines for each file I changed to make it work. Gross, disgusting, and time consuming. > >I had to > > update my CVS to keep it from bombing out on my changed files on a > > "cvs update", > > This was due to the 'death-state' support I suspect. I went from a 2.0.5-Release CVS to -current and it fixed it; whatever. > > and I had to disable the client and server code, since > > I did not want to install the new headers on my host system and code > > is still being built relative to the installed header files instead > > of the header files in the source tree, like you'd expect). > > Huh? When you run things locally, you shouldn't have to modify anything > on your system. Why would you have to install new header files because > of the CVS client-server code? It wants me to install the new headers for the MD5 stuff that the client and server use to validate. Specifically, it wants "struct MD5Context", which I don't have one of, not having rebuilt the world. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 15:21:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA22793 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:21:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA22786 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:21:42 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id PAA01295; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:21:39 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602062321.PAA01295@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: FS PATCHES: THE NEXT GENERATION To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:21:38 -0800 (PST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602062310.QAA03559@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 6, 96 04:10:54 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > the trouble with full files is it's TOO EASY to spam > > someone else's patches when you over-write the file. > > > > With Patches, you get a .rej file in this case so you can merge the two > > changes.. > > > > I think it might be an idea to supply your changes in that form.. that won't work, because if there are changes in the files that you checkout that were not in the versions you used to generate your new files, then those changes are effectively lost. > > Well, the idea is to do a fresh checkout and spam the checked out > files and then "cvs update" in case I did spam some changes. > Ah yes but: now that you have a sup+cvs setup, you can keep your diff sets up-to date relatively easily, and if you send them as diffs then there is a good chance that even if there is a time-lag induced collision, it will be caught and fixed, also many files get changes that are automatically resolved.. as long as you don't check in your changes in your cvs tree, it's much more resistant to spamming, to do it this way.. > I can provide the changes as diffs if you need them that way; I'll warn > you that you'll be in exactly the same boat applying them as the original > diff sets I sent (that's why I went to the trouble of sup + cvs + ...). err why? > > Will the local spam + "cvs diff" not work for you? > From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 15:30:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA23440 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:30:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (rocky.sri.MT.net [204.182.243.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA23426 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:30:16 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA05267; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:32:53 -0700 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:32:53 -0700 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199602062332.QAA05267@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: Terry Lambert Cc: nate@sri.MT.net (Nate Williams), rkw@dataplex.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: On keeping a src tree In-Reply-To: <199602062318.QAA03592@phaeton.artisoft.com> References: <199602062250.PAA05166@rocky.sri.MT.net> <199602062318.QAA03592@phaeton.artisoft.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > I use "cvs diff" (I admit that this has only recently worked; > > > > Hmm, it's worked since day one for me. > > It's failed since day one for me. Of course I started at 2.0.5 and I > don't "make world" often because I am a kernel hacker, not a utility > hacker. 8-). Hmm, I started with FreeBSD 0.9, and it's always worked for me. But, I also am a utility hacker and realize when certain things must be updated in order to keep my tools working. :) > Specifically, a CVS update with a changed tree failed when the rev on > the checked-out, changed file was not the same as the updated rev of > the same file in the tree. How can this happen? When you modify a file, neither the CVS entry nor the ID changes, so they should be in sync. When an update occurs, CVS attempts to 'patch' the modified file with the changes that were made in the baseline tree. If that patch fails to apply cleanly, then cvs doesn't fail but informs you the user that you must manually fix the problems since it can't be done automatically. Is this the 'failure' you speak of? > Gross, disgusting, and time consuming. Necessary to keep things in sync, since it can't be automated. > I went from a 2.0.5-Release CVS to -current and it fixed it; whatever. > > It wants me to install the new headers for the MD5 stuff that the client > and server use to validate. Specifically, it wants "struct MD5Context", > which I don't have one of, not having rebuilt the world. I thought you went to -current? In any case, in the same manner that you must libkvm when the kernel changes to have working tools, you must also rebuild libraries such a libmd when the tools which need them are modified. Even kernel hackers should be able to do this. :) Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 15:35:15 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA24035 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:35:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA24012 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:35:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id AAA06650; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:35:04 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id AAA26810; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:35:02 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id XAA02341; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 23:01:12 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602062201.XAA02341@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: What a OS!! To: wmbfmk@urc.tue.nl (Marc van Kempen) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 23:01:11 +0100 (MET) Cc: lenzi@cwbtwo.bsi.com.br, hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602061917.UAA21931@asterix.urc.tue.nl> from "Marc van Kempen" at Feb 6, 96 08:17:27 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Marc van Kempen wrote: > > cicero, (alpha state) http://www.uni-frankfurt.de/(tilde)weis Hmm, cicero is evolving... I've once taken part in the basic design discussions, but later gave up due to an imminent lack of time. Has anyone tried it yet? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 15:35:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA24087 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:35:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA24048 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:35:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id AAA06668 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:35:07 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id AAA26812 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:35:07 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id AAA02669 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:29:18 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602062329.AAA02669@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: On keeping a src tree To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:29:18 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602061818.LAA02651@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 6, 96 11:18:30 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > > > I suggest that you should never store the source code obtained from any > > FreeBSD source in /usr/src. > How do you handle "config", since it is still (improperly, IMO) not > built as part of the kernel build tree and wants to be installed? Me, for example, i generally build a kernel from ~bin/sys, and have a recent config(8) inside ~bin/config. So instead of saying ``config FOO'', all i have to do is ``~/config/config FOO''. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 15:36:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA24324 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:36:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA24302 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:36:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id AAA06693; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:35:25 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id AAA26822; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:35:20 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id XAA02458; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 23:36:20 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602062236.XAA02458@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Patches from 2.1-RELEASE To: caussep@sphynx.fdn.fr (Philippe Causse) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 23:36:20 +0100 (MET) Cc: bde@zeta.org.au, hackers@freebsd.org, delaitt@cpc.wmin.ac.uk, jdp@polstra.com Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: from "Philippe Causse" at Feb 6, 96 11:15:07 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Philippe Causse wrote: > > I found the SCSI-1 and SCSI-2 (text only) documentation on the net using > Archie. To avoid flooding you mailbox, I'll just quote a part of it in > this mail. If you want the full text, I can e-mail it to you as a MIME > attachment. Please, don't hesitate to ask! (300K for SCSI-2, 84K for SCSI-1) Ugh. Can we please move this discussion into freebsd-scsi instead? There is no use to quote several hundred lines from the SCSI spec into the high-volume hackers list. In order to use the SCSI specs, one needs a printed copy of larger portions anyway... (Sorry for not being constructive here, i simply didn't have the time yet to look after all this stuff, and it's unlikely that i will have it within the next couple of weeks. Alas.) -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 15:48:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA25448 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:48:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from tanelorn.netural.com (root@tanelorn.NETural.com [206.54.248.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA25405 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:47:40 -0800 (PST) Received: (from thekind@localhost) by tanelorn.netural.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA00297; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:47:22 -0600 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:47:22 -0600 (CST) From: "Adam W. Dace" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Connectix Quickcam patches? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hey all, now that I'm finally on this list I can keep up with things better, but I was wondering if anyone out there has patches/source available that even sort-of-works for the Connectix Quickcam. I corresponded briefly with a gentleman (I'm sorry I don't remember your name offhand, and I've got more e-mail here than you can shake a fish at), who said he'd be finishing up the FreeBSD driver soon... anyone know what's up with that? sincerely, | Adam W. Dace | NETural Communications, Inc. | | Webmaster | Paying too much for your Net access? | | http://www.NETural.com/ | NETural Voice: (312) 819-2231 | From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 16:23:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA27846 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:23:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA27841 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:22:59 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA03904; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:20:25 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602070020.RAA03904@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: On keeping a src tree To: nate@sri.MT.net (Nate Williams) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:20:25 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, nate@sri.MT.net, rkw@dataplex.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602062332.QAA05267@rocky.sri.MT.net> from "Nate Williams" at Feb 6, 96 04:32:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > It's failed since day one for me. Of course I started at 2.0.5 and I > > don't "make world" often because I am a kernel hacker, not a utility > > hacker. 8-). > > Hmm, I started with FreeBSD 0.9, and it's always worked for me. But, I > also am a utility hacker and realize when certain things must be updated > in order to keep my tools working. :) Ah. That must be my problem. As a kernel hacker, I live by the premise that "software doesn't mutate". Clearly, I'm being bitten by mutant software ("Fleshy-headed mutant, are you friendly?" "No way, Eh? Radiation has made me the enemy of all mankind"). 8-). > > Specifically, a CVS update with a changed tree failed when the rev on > > the checked-out, changed file was not the same as the updated rev of > > the same file in the tree. > > How can this happen? When you modify a file, neither the CVS entry nor > the ID changes, so they should be in sync. When an update occurs, CVS > attempts to 'patch' the modified file with the changes that were made in > the baseline tree. If that patch fails to apply cleanly, then cvs > doesn't fail but informs you the user that you must manually fix the > problems since it can't be done automatically. Is this the 'failure' > you speak of? No. 1) SUP a CVS tree on a 2.0.5 system using 2.0.5's CVS. 2) check out a source tree. 3) edit a file that you know will change the next time a SUP is done. 4) Do the next SUP, replacing the old file. 5) Attempt a "cvs update" of the tree containing the modified file. 6) Watch CVS puke its guts out because the rev on the line in the CVS/Entries file for the file you changed is less than the rev in the CVS tree, and the file is modified. 7) Update CVS. 8) Disable the client and server code, since 2.0.5 systems don't have "struct MD5Context". 9) Build a new cvs. 10) Attempt a "cvs update" of the tree containing the modified file, this time using the new CVS. 11) Watch it work like it should have worked before. 12) Get in a long discussion about mutating software with Nate. 8-). > > Gross, disgusting, and time consuming. > > Necessary to keep things in sync, since it can't be automated. Why the heck not? We used exactly this procedure with the older version of CVS at Novell without incident. > > I went from a 2.0.5-Release CVS to -current and it fixed it; whatever. > > > > It wants me to install the new headers for the MD5 stuff that the client > > and server use to validate. Specifically, it wants "struct MD5Context", > > which I don't have one of, not having rebuilt the world. > > I thought you went to -current? No. I am running a -current kernel, minimal updated utilities, and I *did not* go to -current on my entire machine. So I don't have the updated header files installed. You see, this is an SMP machine, and most of the time I am running an out of date kernel so that I can use both processors. Not that the source tree should be building using installed header files anyway; it should be using the header files from the source tree. Installed header files are useful only to provide a third-party with a developement environment. > In any case, in the same manner that you must libkvm when the kernel > changes to have working tools, you must also rebuild libraries such > a libmd when the tools which need them are modified. > > Even kernel hackers should be able to do this. :) With respect, this is why "make" has the ability to resolve dependencies; it should be possible for me to not give a damn what has changed beyond the changes I personally cause. When I type "make" it should rebuild everything that needs to be rebuilt, and *only* everything that needs to be rebuilt. Then it should be possible for me to specify an install target other than my important OS, union mount the shadow tree with the modified utils over the unmodified tree (which might be a CDROM) onto /altroot or some other mount point, and then boot the new kernel and chroot to /altroot to test the new stuff out. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 16:28:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA28211 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:28:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA28206 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:28:57 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA03938; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:26:27 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602070026.RAA03938@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FS PATCHES: THE NEXT GENERATION To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:26:27 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602062321.PAA01295@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Feb 6, 96 03:21:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Ah yes but: > now that you have a sup+cvs setup, you can keep your diff sets up-to date > relatively easily, and if you send them as diffs > then there is a good chance that even if there is a time-lag induced > collision, it will be caught and fixed, > also many files get changes that are automatically resolved.. I have uploaded a FS_PATCHED.diff.gz to incoming on freefall. This was generated with "cvs diff -c" in /sys. The output doesn't look particularly useful as input to "patch", unless you write an awk/perl script to reformat the "cvs diff" file information (this seems to be more work than checking out a spamable tree). > as long as you don't check in your changes in your cvs tree, it's much > more resistant to spamming, to do it this way.. I don't check in my changes to my CVS tree. > > I can provide the changes as diffs if you need them that way; I'll warn > > you that you'll be in exactly the same boat applying them as the original > > diff sets I sent (that's why I went to the trouble of sup + cvs + ...). > > err why? See above. "cvs diff -c" does not result in a file that can be used as input to "patch" without some post-processing. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 16:33:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA28540 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:33:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from eel.dataplex.net (EEL.DATAPLEX.NET [199.183.109.245]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA28534 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 16:32:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from [199.183.109.242] (cod [199.183.109.242]) by eel.dataplex.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA12075; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:31:27 -0600 X-Sender: rkw@shark.dataplex.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:31:29 -0600 To: Terry Lambert From: Richard Wackerbarth Subject: Re: On keeping a src tree Cc: nate@sri.MT.net, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Terry Lambert writes: >Not that the source tree should be building using installed header files >anyway; it should be using the header files from the source tree. >Installed header files are useful only to provide a third-party with a >developement environment. >With respect, this is why "make" has the ability to resolve dependencies; >it should be possible for me to not give a damn what has changed beyond >the changes I personally cause. When I type "make" it should rebuild >everything that needs to be rebuilt, and *only* everything that needs >to be rebuilt. > >Then it should be possible for me to specify an install target other >than my important OS, union mount the shadow tree with the modified >utils over the unmodified tree (which might be a CDROM) onto /altroot >or some other mount point, and then boot the new kernel and chroot to >/altroot to test the new stuff out. All I can say is "AMEN, BROTHER!" When will they ever learn? When? Will they ever learn? ---- Richard Wackerbarth rkw@dataplex.net From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 17:44:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA02703 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:44:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA02697 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:44:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id MAA06379; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 12:11:54 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602070141.MAA06379@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Solaris CacheFS for FreeBSD? To: rminnich@Sarnoff.COM (Ron G. Minnich) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 12:11:54 +1030 (CST) Cc: dutchman@spase.nl, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Ron G. Minnich" at Feb 6, 96 11:19:04 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Ron G. Minnich stands accused of saying: > > This has been used to do a user-level union file system, but could easily > be used as a caching file system or whatever, depending on the tcl code. > Most of this code was written by gene kim with me kibitzing. It is all > available. Contact me if interested. I'm sure I speak for many people in saying that this sort of thing would be an _ideal_ candidate for the 'experimental' distribution; things that people can tinker with and maybe use, but which aren't part of the mainstream or in the scope of a port... > ron -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 17:59:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA03143 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:59:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA03137 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:59:09 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA01737; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:59:07 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602070159.RAA01737@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: FS PATCHES: THE NEXT GENERATION To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 17:59:06 -0800 (PST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602070026.RAA03938@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 6, 96 05:26:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > The output doesn't look particularly useful as input to "patch", unless > you write an awk/perl script to reformat the "cvs diff" file information > (this seems to be more work than checking out a spamable tree). > it always works for me... Patch is very good about knowing which bits of the patch file are CVS guff, and tends to ignore that.. I've done 150 file patches with a simple "cvs diff -c sys" > See above. "cvs diff -c" does not result in a file that can be used as > input to "patch" without some post-processing. I bet you'd be surprised.. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 18:00:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA03288 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:00:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA03283 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:00:32 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA04253; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:59:06 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602070159.SAA04253@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Writing FreeBSD Device Drivers info needed. To: Edward_Pease_at_FS550@cscgt.gsfc.nasa.gov Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:59:06 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9601068236.AA823643709@cscgt.gsfc.nasa.gov> from "Edward_Pease_at_FS550@cscgt.gsfc.nasa.gov" at Feb 6, 96 12:55:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I've been tasked to port some SCO drivers to either Linux or > FreeBSD. I was able to get "Writing Linux Device Drivers" by > Michael K. Johnson & "Device Driver Basics(Linux)" off the net. > Does any similar Documentation exist for FreeBSD? The FreeBSD > Handbook didn't seem to include the specific details for > writing/configuring your own driver into the kernel. 1) Kernel Debugging reference http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/handbook217.html 2) Configuring the FreeBSD Kernel http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/handbook39.html 3) FreeBSD Device Driver Writer's Guide http://freefall.freebsd.org/~erich/ddwg/ddwg.html 4) Cross-references for FreeBSD (a hyperlinked source tree) http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/FreeBSD-srctree/FreeBSD.html Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 18:04:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA03601 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:04:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA03595 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:04:53 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA04270; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 19:02:20 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602070202.TAA04270@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FS PATCHES: THE NEXT GENERATION To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 19:02:20 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, current@FreeBSD.ORG, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602070159.RAA01737@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Feb 6, 96 05:59:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > See above. "cvs diff -c" does not result in a file that can be used as > > input to "patch" without some post-processing. > > I bet you'd be surprised.. Well, I'd be *happily* suprised, then... Have you applied the patches yet? I have lots more, but those need to go in first. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 18:12:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA03980 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:12:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA03940 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:12:01 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id SAA01772; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:11:24 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602070211.SAA01772@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: PCI programming To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty Jr.) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:11:24 -0800 (PST) Cc: fwmiller@cs.UMD.EDU, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602062125.NAA00383@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr." at Feb 6, 96 01:25:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Unfortunatly you can't do this per-se. > > > Hello! > > > > I was given your name by a Peter Dufault. He told me that you had been > > doing some work with PCI-to-PCI data transfers. I am interested in > > streaming some data from an Adaptec AHA-2940 PCI SCSI adapter directly > > to a PCI Ethernet card. I wonder if you might help me with a couple of > > questions? > > > > Is there a particular Ethernet card I should get, e. g. one of the DEC > > Tulip based cards perhaps? Both these devices are Bus Masters.. neither contains accessible ram. you can't really pass data directly from one master to another. you need a RAM scratch pad that both devices can access. instead of asking how a particular solution can be inplimented.. I would ask you to actually state the original problem you are trying to solve.. (video server?) Unfortunatly You can't just 'Pipe" data into an ethernet card. each packet has to be 'bracketted' by control (source and destination) information, and such things as IP headers etc. I've done quite a bit in this field.. My employer here produces systems that use Direct Disk-to-Net technologies, but we use our own hardware. The ethernet cards have 4MB of RAM on them (up to 16MB) and the SCSI drivers DMA directly into that ram. We then send the data one packet at a time.. (you can see some fractions of the disk part in bt.c, in #ifdef TFS :) I have some definite ideas in how to do this better but it's about iten 4356 on my list of things to do. summary: You need the data to land on some RAM somewhere, in between the two DMA masters.. the problem is in knowing when that ram is free and can be re-used.. +----------------------------------+ ______ _ __ | __--_|\ Julian Elischer | \ U \/ / On assignment | / \ julian@ref.tfs.com +------>x USA \ in a very strange | ( OZ ) 300 lakeside Dr. oakland CA. \___ ___ | country ! +- X_.---._/ USA+(510) 645-3137(wk) \_/ \\ v From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 18:42:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA06597 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:42:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw.ast.com (fw.ast.com [165.164.6.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA06592 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:42:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from nemesis by fw.ast.com with uucp (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tjz8g-00087AC; Tue, 6 Feb 96 19:57 CST Received: by nemesis.lonestar.org (Smail3.1.27.1 #20) id m0tjz3q-000CCzC; Tue, 6 Feb 96 19:52 WET Message-Id: Date: Tue, 6 Feb 96 19:52 WET To: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org From: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Sent: Tue Feb 6 1996, 19:52:42 CST Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk [9]From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" [9]Any suggestions on promoting and facilitating this level of [9]reliability? Would an `admin' mailing list for all FreeBSD.ORG [9]related resources help, or would it merely turn into a source of [9]unwanted messages for admins who already get too much mail? It [9]certainly doesn't seem like such reports should be sent to hackers, [9]anyway. There's too much traffic there. Since your assumption that problems getting into sup.freebsd.org is one cause of sup2-n being "strange", why not do the following: 1. Limit sup.freebsd.org to some reduced number of connections (5?). AND 2. Have a second sup daemon running on an undisclosed port number on sup.freebsd.org that only the mirrors sites are told about. Limit that second daemon to the remainder of ten sessions so that the load on sup.freebsd.org won't be any worse than it is now. AND 3. Give the systems on the "approved" mirror list the magic port number. They will have plenty of incentive to switch to the limited access port. (Change the port number once in a while if you feel the load creeping back up.) This should give the mirrors their own personal door to get data from, leaves sup.freebsd.org accessible to the truely desperate (or untrusting) and this should be amazingly easy to set up and see instant benefit. Then after it has been in place for a few weeks, we can see if the other sup sites become less strange. If they don't, there are different problems to be addressed. Frank Durda IV |"The Knights who say "LETNi" or uhclem%nemesis@rwsystr.nkn.net | demand... A SEGMENT REGISTER!!!" ^------(this is the fastest route)|"A what?" or ...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem |"LETNi! LETNi! LETNi!" - 1983 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 18:43:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA06651 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:43:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from fw.ast.com (fw.ast.com [165.164.6.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA06646 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:43:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from nemesis by fw.ast.com with uucp (Smail3.1.29.1 #2) id m0tjzJs-00087BC; Tue, 6 Feb 96 20:09 CST Received: by nemesis.lonestar.org (Smail3.1.27.1 #20) id m0tjzAx-000CCzC; Tue, 6 Feb 96 20:00 WET Message-Id: Date: Tue, 6 Feb 96 20:00 WET To: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org From: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Sent: Tue Feb 6 1996, 20:00:03 CST Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk [11]"Justin T. Gibbs" [11]I think that a method of reliably replicating the collections between [11]servers is in order. I'm not positive that all our servers are using the [11]same lists and even if they are, there's no guarantee that a change to the [11]collections on Freefall will propogate. I'll set something up later this [11]week that will make the whole process automatic for the "child" sup sites. [11]The supserver kit will become four files: supfile, supfile.conf, [11]customize.sh, README. As I understand sup, it doesn't look for changes the instant you pull stuff down, but does a scan at regular intervals. If that is true, read on. I remember a tool that would cut a snapshot of a directory structure and a file of checksums that could be used to make sure the tree is intact. (It may have been an alias for a "find | sum" combination, I don't recall.) Why not have some other app generate a sanity file just prior to sup synchronizing itself? The file would contain the "correct" tree structure, along with checksums of the files. Then the file would be available to both the mirrors (and mortals), would get sup'ed down as any other file, and could be used for detecting incomplete, corrupted, absent and extra files in their local trees by running a similar scan locally. Frank Durda IV |"The Knights who say "LETNi" or uhclem%nemesis@rwsystr.nkn.net | demand... A SEGMENT REGISTER!!!" ^------(this is the fastest route)|"A what?" or ...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem |"LETNi! LETNi! LETNi!" - 1983 From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 18:50:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA07208 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:50:23 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dima@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA07201 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:50:22 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602070250.SAA07201@freefall.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: sup is broken? To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 18:50:22 -0800 (PST) Cc: julian@ref.tfs.com, fenner@parc.xerox.com, jkh@time.cdrom.com, rkw@dataplex.net, kimc@w8hd.org, hackers@freebsd.org, stable@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602052348.PAA03904@Root.COM> from "David Greenman" at Feb 5, 96 03:48:55 pm From: dima@freebsd.org (Dima Ruban) X-Class: Fast Organization: HackerDome X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk David Greenman writes: > > >make it so.. > > Not until someone goes and verifies that all of the sup*.freebsd.org > targets are working correctly. Also, my experiance with multiple A records > is that it always comes up with them same one (not random). Not all of them ... [burka]-p1:62> telnet sup2.freebsd.org supfilesrv Trying 171.69.60.233... telnet: Unable to connect to remote host: Connection refused [burka]-p1:63> > > -DG > > David Greenman > Core Team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project > -- dima From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 20:40:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA21259 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:40:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from nervosa.com (nervosa.com [192.187.228.86]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA21253 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:40:45 -0800 (PST) Received: (from coredump@localhost) by nervosa.com (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA03815; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:36:50 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:36:50 -0800 (PST) From: invalid opcode To: Frank Durda IV cc: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I agree, a method of checksums (filesize, crc, etc.) should be used in order to find the latest copy. I thought sup already did this? Or does it only check dates? Chris Layne, coredump@nervosa.com. > As I understand sup, it doesn't look for changes the instant you pull > stuff down, but does a scan at regular intervals. If that is true, > read on. > > I remember a tool that would cut a snapshot of a directory structure and > a file of checksums that could be used to make sure the tree is intact. > (It may have been an alias for a "find | sum" combination, I don't recall.) > > Why not have some other app generate a sanity file just prior to sup > synchronizing itself? The file would contain the "correct" tree > structure, along with checksums of the files. Then the file would be > available to both the mirrors (and mortals), would get sup'ed down as > any other file, and could be used for detecting incomplete, corrupted, > absent and extra files in their local trees by running a similar > scan locally. > > > Frank Durda IV |"The Knights who say "LETNi" > or uhclem%nemesis@rwsystr.nkn.net | demand... A SEGMENT REGISTER!!!" > ^------(this is the fastest route)|"A what?" > or ...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem |"LETNi! LETNi! LETNi!" - 1983 > From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 20:45:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA21560 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:45:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from GndRsh.aac.dev.com (GndRsh.aac.dev.com [198.145.92.241]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA21545 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:45:38 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rgrimes@localhost) by GndRsh.aac.dev.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA25414; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:45:04 -0800 From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <199602070445.UAA25414@GndRsh.aac.dev.com> Subject: Re: FS PATCHES: THE NEXT GENERATION To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:45:04 -0800 (PST) Cc: julian@ref.tfs.com, terry@lambert.org, current@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602070026.RAA03938@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 6, 96 05:26:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Ah yes but: > > now that you have a sup+cvs setup, you can keep your diff sets up-to date > > relatively easily, and if you send them as diffs > > then there is a good chance that even if there is a time-lag induced > > collision, it will be caught and fixed, > > also many files get changes that are automatically resolved.. > > I have uploaded a FS_PATCHED.diff.gz to incoming on freefall. > > This was generated with "cvs diff -c" in /sys. > > The output doesn't look particularly useful as input to "patch", unless > you write an awk/perl script to reformat the "cvs diff" file information > (this seems to be more work than checking out a spamable tree). The output of cvs diff -c should be very usable by patch, that is what the Index lines are added for. There use to be problems in that patch would pick the wrong path to the file, this has been fixed in a recent version of patch that gives the Index line higher precedence than the other pathnames. > > > I can provide the changes as diffs if you need them that way; I'll warn > > > you that you'll be in exactly the same boat applying them as the original > > > diff sets I sent (that's why I went to the trouble of sup + cvs + ...). > > > > err why? > > See above. "cvs diff -c" does not result in a file that can be used as > input to "patch" without some post-processing. If this is true again then either cvs or patch needs some work. -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com Accurate Automation Company Reliable computers for FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 22:21:16 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA28945 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 22:21:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from argus.flash.net (root@argus.flash.net [206.149.25.12]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA28939 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 22:21:13 -0800 (PST) Received: (from lists@localhost) by argus.flash.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA06187; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:19:08 -0600 From: mailing list account Message-Id: <199602070619.AAA06187@argus.flash.net> Subject: Re: What a OS!! To: lenzi@cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (Sergio Lenzi) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:19:07 -0600 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Sergio Lenzi" at Feb 6, 96 01:53:38 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In reply: > PS: Now my custumers is asking for word processor.... Is there any in sight? only the BEST! emacs! Jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" jbryant@argus.flash.net - FlashNet Communications - Ft. Worth, Texas From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 22:34:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA00422 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 22:34:26 -0800 (PST) Received: (from hsu@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA00414 for hackers; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 22:34:23 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 22:34:23 -0800 (PST) From: Jeffrey Hsu Message-Id: <199602070634.WAA00414@freefall.freebsd.org> To: hackers Subject: Apple and OSF Announce Linux for Power Macintosh Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Argh! -----------------http://www.mklinux.apple.com/linux.html------------------- Apple Computer, Inc. Press Release Apple and Open Software Foundation Announce Linux for Power Macintosh Leading User-Supported Version of UNIX to be Available to Power Macintosh Users CAMBRIDGE, Massachusetts-February 5, 1996-Apple Computer, Inc. announced today that it is supporting a project with the Open Software Foundation (OSF) to port Linux, a freely distributed version of UNIX(tm), to a variety of Power Macintosh(tm) products. This version of Linux operates on the OSF Mach microkernel which will be running natively on the PowerPC microprocessor. The announcement was made at the Conference on Freely Redistributable Software held in Cambridge. A demo of an early prototype was shown as part of the announcement. "This is part of Apple's overall effort to embrace more open industry standards, particularly those popular in the Internet community," said Ike Nassi, vice president of Apple system software technologies. "This software will be particularly popular with Mac users in higher education as well as the scientific research communities who have asked for our support of Linux." "We are pleased to be working with Apple on this important new port of the Mach microkernel, now hosting the popular Linux environment," said Ira Goldstein, executive vice president and chief scientist of the Open Software Foundation. "We have a strong working relationship with Apple and this is an important result of our cooperation." Linux is a broadly used version of UNIX supported by a wide community of programmers. Linux provides UNIX features such as true multitasking, virtual memory, shared libraries, demand loading, TCP/IP networking and many other advanced features. Versions of Linux are being ported to a wide variety of platforms, including other PowerPC-based computers. This effort marks the first time that Linux will be hosted on the Mach microkernel. (For more information, visit the Linux Web site.) Linux on Power Macintosh will be especially significant in several of Apple's key markets, particularly the higher education and scientific communities. With Linux a student will have an extremely low-cost, yet high-performance PowerPC-based UNIX system for personal use. Advanced research that requires UNIX applications will now be possible on an engineer's personal Macintosh(tm). "As a long time Linux user, I am absolutely delighted about the announcement of Linux on Power Macintosh," said Professor George Blumenthal, chair of the astronomy & astrophysics department at Lick Observatory, University of California, Santa Cruz. "Now Macs will have a dual personality, in the best sense of the word; on the one hand they will allow users to exploit the ever popular and easy to use Macintosh software, while on the other hand, they now provide a platform that appears virtually identical to the UNIX machines that many of us use daily in our work." Linux for Power Macintosh adds a new UNIX alternative for PowerPC systems to existing products such as AIX from IBM and MachTen from Tenon Intersystems. This gives Macintosh users a range of options from a free, user supported UNIX implementation up to commercial, mission critical solutions for large enterprises. In keeping with the spirit of the Linux community, Apple and OSF will make the source code for this Linux port freely available. This includes source code to the Mach microkernel and the required Macintosh platform driver support. Linux is distributed throughout the world over the Internet and other means, generally through the GNU General Public License, which allows people to use it and change it so long as no further restrictions are imposed and that the source code is made available. Apple and OSF expect that the first port of Linux for Power Macintosh will be available this summer. The system will initially support the first generation of Power Macintosh computers based on NuBus expansion, and will later be extended to PCI-based Power Macs as well as the upcoming PowerPC Platform (formerly CHRP.) Information regarding this version of Linux is available on the Linux on Power Macintosh web site. Apple expects to make the software available at this location as well. This project is an outcome of Apple's ongoing relationship with OSF, which includes consulting work for Copland, the next major release of the Mac OS. The Linux port provides Apple an open environment for OS research work, as well as enabling an exciting new opportunity for Power Macintosh users. This port delivers both the Mach 3.0 microkernel (developed by the OSF Research Institute) and Linux as an OS "personality" on Mach. The OSF microkernel was originally developed at Carnegie Mellon as Mach and subsequently enhanced extensively by the OSF Research Institute. Additional Related World Wide Web Sites: Tenon Intersystems http://www.tenon.com IBM http://www.ibm.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Apple Computer, Inc., a recognized innovator in the information industry and leader in multimedia technologies, creates powerful solutions based on easy-to-use personal computers, servers, peripherals, software, online services, and personal digital assistants. Headquartered in Cupertino, California, Apple (NASDAQ: AAPL) develops, manufactures, licenses and markets solutions, products, technologies and services for business, education, consumer, entertainment, scientific & engineering and government customers in over 140 countries. Laurence Clavere Apple Computer, Inc. (408) 974-8643 email: clavere1@applelink.apple.com NOTE TO EDITORS: If you are interested in receiving Apple press releases by fax, call 1-800-AAPL-FAX (1-800-227-5329) and enter your PIN number. If you do not have a PIN, please call the Public Relations Hotline at (408) 974-2042. Customer Information Contact: If you are considering the purchase of an Apple product and would like to have product information faxed to you, please call 1-800-462-4396 in the U.S. or 1-800-263-3394 in Canada. If you do not have a fax machine or would like to locate an Apple authorized reseller near you, please call 1-800-538-9696. Customers outside the U.S. should contact their local Apple representatives for information. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Apple's home page on the World Wide Web: http://www.apple.com/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Apple, the Apple logo, Power Macintosh, and Macintosh are registered trademarks, and Mac, Mac OS, and PowerMac are trademarks of Apple Computer, Inc. UNIX is a registered trademark of Novell, Inc. in the United States and other countries, licensed exclusively through X/Open Company, Ltd. PowerPC is a trademark of the International Business Machines Corporation, used under license therefrom. NuBus is a trademark of Texas Instruments. All other brand names mentioned are registered trademarks or trademarks of their respective holders, and are hereby acknowledged. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 22:59:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA02500 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 22:59:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA02495 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 22:59:34 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602070659.WAA02495@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) cc: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 20:00:00 +0700." Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 22:59:33 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >[11]"Justin T. Gibbs" >[11]I think that a method of reliably replicating the collections between >[11]servers is in order. I'm not positive that all our servers are using the >[11]same lists and even if they are, there's no guarantee that a change to the >[11]collections on Freefall will propogate. I'll set something up later this >[11]week that will make the whole process automatic for the "child" sup sites. >[11]The supserver kit will become four files: supfile, supfile.conf, >[11]customize.sh, README. > >As I understand sup, it doesn't look for changes the instant you pull >stuff down, but does a scan at regular intervals. If that is true, >read on. You have the option for caching inode information for the collection to improve scalability. In the case of serving these types of collections, there won't be a cached scan file, and the scan will happen at the time a client connects. >Frank Durda IV |"The Knights who say "LETNi" >or uhclem%nemesis@rwsystr.nkn.net | demand... A SEGMENT REGISTER!!! >" > ^------(this is the fastest route)|"A what?" >or ...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem |"LETNi! LETNi! LETNi!" - 1983 > -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 23:17:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA04093 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 23:17:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA04088 Tue, 6 Feb 1996 23:17:48 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602070717.XAA04088@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, current@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 19:52:00 +0700." Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 23:17:48 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >2. Have a second sup daemon running on an undisclosed port number > on sup.freebsd.org that only the mirrors sites are told about. > Limit that second daemon to the remainder of ten sessions so that > the load on sup.freebsd.org won't be any worse than it is now. >AND >3. Give the systems on the "approved" mirror list the magic port number. > They will have plenty of incentive to switch to the limited access > port. (Change the port number once in a while if you feel the load > creeping back up.) SUP has access lists for just this purpose. You can designate friends, enemies and wildcards for generic access. Friends have there own access limit that is different than anyone else. The mirror sites are already friends of sup.FreeBSD.org. >Frank Durda IV |"The Knights who say "LETNi" >or uhclem%nemesis@rwsystr.nkn.net | demand... A SEGMENT REGISTER!!! >" > ^------(this is the fastest route)|"A what?" >or ...letni!rwsys!nemesis!uhclem |"LETNi! LETNi! LETNi!" - 1983 > -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 6 23:42:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA06727 for hackers-outgoing; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 23:42:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from xi.dorm.umd.edu (xi.dorm.umd.edu [129.2.152.45]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA06722 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 1996 23:42:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from xi.dorm.umd.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by xi.dorm.umd.edu (8.7.3/8.6.12) with SMTP id CAA04469; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 02:41:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 02:41:53 -0500 (EST) From: Sujal Patel X-Sender: smpatel@xi.dorm.umd.edu To: willows@throck.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Emulated x86 - FreeBSD Willows Twin Running In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I'm happy to announce that the EMULATED x86 version of the Willows Twin package is now running properly on FreeBSD. The software runs slow as molasses, but this will improve dramatically once we fold in the User LDT and interrupt stuff for FreeBSD. I was able to successfully run many Windows applets and also run MS PowerPoint 4.0 (it's actually useable too). The FreeBSD port isn't really ready for the mainstream, so be prepared for hacking if you want to try using it (though it should work without any problems). Note: The binary requires FreeBSD-current from Jan. 21 or later (2.1R users will need to recompile the whole mess). The patches and a binary will be made available by Willows soon (I'll upload them tonight). You'll need probably need to be registered with Willows to gain access to the FTP site (see www.willows.com). Please send bug reports/problems with the FreeBSD port to willows@throck.com Just remember that this TWIN doesn't work with nearly all Windows software yet. Here is what you need to follow to compile the binary from the source: patch -p0 < freebsd.x86emul.twin.patch setenv TARGET freebsd cd src/win ./configure touch DrvSystem_freebsd.s [Edit the paths in makeinclude/*freebsd*] [Make the tools in winsdk] gmake xwin Here is the way I run it: setenv WINDOWS /mnt/dos/windows setenv TWINDIR /xi2/smpatel/twin/src/win setenv TWINRC /xi2/smpatel/twinrc setenv LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/xi2/smpatel/twin/src/win cd /mnt/dos/windows /xi2/smpatel/twin/src/win/xwin Thanks to Jordan Hubbard, Michael Smith, Gary Jennejohn, Brian Smith, and Rob Farnum for their work in get this port working. Sujal --- sample twinrc, referenced by the TWINRC variable [see above] --- ############################################################################## # # Configuration Guide # --------------------- # win.ini Definitions of entries in win.ini # system.ini Definitions supported by system.ini # ############################################################################## # # WIN.INI # ############################################################################## # # The following entries in the [windows] section # are supported: # CursorBlinkRate the rate at which to blink the caret # DoubleClickRate how fast to recognize a doubleclick # FontFace alternate system typeface name, helvetica # FontSize alternate system point size, 14 # IconFontFace alternate typeface for MDI icons windows # IconFontSize alternate pointsize for MDI icons windows # FontAspect to specifically choose 75 vs. 100dpi fonts # Device what is the default printer... # [windows] CursorBlinkRate=530 DoubleClickRate=452 Device=Apple LaserWriter,PSCRIPT,LPT1: # # The following are pseudo entries. They describe # what printers are configured. # The entries here are those supported by the # binary printer driver. # # This printer will write to a file, specifically printout.ps [Apple LaserWriter,LPT2:] CtrlD=0 feed1=1 feed4=1 EPS=1 EpsFile=printout.ps # This printer will write to the file specified in [portalias] for LPT1: [Apple LaserWriter,LPT1:] CtrlD=0 feed1=1 feed4=1 EPS=0 # # The following give aliases for devices. The # device alias may start with | to signify that # output from the device will be piped to the # specified command. The entries here can be # set by the Device Manager, which emulates the # devices section of the control panel. # [PortAliases] LPT1:=| rsh daffy "lpr -h" LPT2:=lastfile.ps COM2:=/dev/cua2 COM1:=/dev/cua1 # This is read by some applications, and so is # turned off to disable truetype. The library # DOES NOT use this entry. # [TrueType] TTEnable=0 # This is only maintained for applications, and # is not used by the library. # [intl] sLanguage=English (American) sCountry=United States iCountry=1 iDate=0 iTime=1 iTLZero=1 iCurrency=0 iCurrDigits=2 iNegCurr=0 iLzero=1 iMeasure=1 s1159= s2359= sCurrency=$ sThousand=, sDecimal=. sDate=/ sTime=: sList=, sShortDate=M/d/yy sLongDate=dddd, MMMM dd, yyyy # # This table provides the font alias to use for the # given typeface. The alias represents a font that # is supported by the system. # [FontSubstitutes] Helv = helvetica Symbol = symbol Arial = charter Arial = new century schoolbook courier = courier Times New Roman = times Times New Roman Bold = times Tms Rmn = times MS Sans Serif = helvetica MS Serif = charter ################################################################## # # This [colors] section describes the color mapping for # built in controls, and MDI windows. # # format: # color = blue green red 0 - 255 # = #hex 0 - ffffff # # red|green|blue = #hex 0 - ff # = decimal 0 - 255 # # keywords: # # Scrollbar # Background # ActiveTitle # InactiveTitle # Menu # Window # WindowFrame # MenuText # WindowText # TitleText # ActiveBorder # InactiveBorder # AppWorkspace # Hilight # HilightText # ButtonFace # ButtonShadow # GrayText # ButtonText # InactiveTitleText # ################################################################ [colors] #Hilight=0 0 255 #HilightText=255 255 255 ################################################################ # # These sections is used by the Print Manager and Control Panel # Printer.cpl. These describe the configured printers. # [PrinterPorts] Apple LaserWriter=pscript,LPT1:,15,45 [devices] Apple LaserWriter=pscript,LPT1: ################################################################## # # This is the mapping of devices to devices... # Aliases are kept in [PortAlias] above. # [ports] ; A line with [filename].PRN followed by an equal sign causes ; [filename] to appear in the Control Panel's Printer Configuration dialog ; box. A printer connected to [filename] directs its output into this file. COM2:=9600,n,8,1 LPT1:= EPT:= FILE:= ;LPT1.OS2= ;LPT2.OS2= FAXMODEM= ############################################################################## # # SYSTEM.INI # ############################################################################## # # In the [boot] section, the following keywords are recognized # compatibility see below for detailed explanation # screenwidth override the actual screen width # screenheight override the actual screen height # minwidth a minimum window width # minheight a minimum window height # directories well known directory locations... # it is a semi-colon separated list of # directories, they are list in the drop # down list box, instead of drives... # # The following two are examples of how you may override a builtin # library DLL, by specifying it in the [boot] section. # # COMMDLG.DRV = COMMGLG.DRV # VER.DLL = VER.DLL # SHELL.DLL = SHELL.DLL # ####################################################################### [boot] directories=/mnt;/usr/lib/X11;/etc;.;/xi2/smpatel/windows;/xi2/smpatel/windows/system ####################################################################### # # # this can be any value, some programs do read it, and display it # [boot.description] display.drv=XFree86 3.1 ####################################################################### # # Drive mapping table... # ####################################################################### # # The following are drive mappings, which means that all references to # a given drive letter are mapped to the following directory. # (This is currently only supported in the binary interface) # [xdos] C=/xi2/smpatel/windows D=/xi2/smpatel ####################################################################### # # The logic of reading profile strings has been extended # as follows.o: # # If $WINDIR is defined and set, it becomes the Windows # Directory. # # /usr/lib/X11/xwin is the default global windows directory # # If a .ini file can not be found in the Windows Directory, # we look in the current directory, and then in the users # home directory. # ####################################################################### # # The following discusses the process of LoadLibrary and LoadModule. # According to documentatio, when loading a DLL,... # If we have a fully qualified name, then load it, otherwise... # # We first look in the current directory, then # We look in the WindowsDirectory, then # We look in the WindowsSystemDirectory, then # We look in the directory containing the current executable, then # We look in the $PATH, then # We look in directories mapped in a network # ####################################################################### From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 00:14:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA09097 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:14:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from asstdc.scgt.oz.au (root@asstdc.scgt.oz.au [202.14.234.65]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA09077 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:13:54 -0800 (PST) Received: (from imb@localhost) by asstdc.scgt.oz.au (8.6.12/BSD4.4) id TAA21647; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 19:12:46 +1100 From: michael butler Message-Id: <199602070812.TAA21647@asstdc.scgt.oz.au> Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree To: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 19:12:45 +1100 (EST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Frank Durda IV" at Feb 6, 96 07:52:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24beta] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Frank Durda IV writes: > Since your assumption that problems getting into sup.freebsd.org is one > cause of sup2-n being "strange", .. This is probably a symptom of the disease itself .. the more heavily loaded freefall becomes, the less likely it is that mirrors will be able to get in and out quickly with coherent source trees. Then, as people realise the inconsistencies, they come back again (and again) to get the bits they think are wrong .. the problem just exponentiates. > why not do the following: [ .. lots of constructive suggestions .. ] It depends on where the load is .. if it's CPU and network related rather than disk, is it not possible to (NQ?)NFS-mount the relevant pieces of freefall's file structure and offer it to the mirrors via a separate interface and IP number or is the load of running an NFS server worse than the original disease ? michael From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 00:23:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA09666 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:23:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA09610 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:22:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id JAA16558 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:21:24 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA00647 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:21:23 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id JAA04677 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:09:30 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602070809.JAA04677@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: How would I find out the ethernet address of an interface? To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:09:29 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <96Feb6.154425est.20483@janus.border.com> from "Jerry Kendall" at Feb 6, 96 03:34:34 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Jerry Kendall wrote: > 'ifconfig -a' will tell you the address for all interfaces... > 'ifconfig ep0' will tell you the address of the ep0 interface... > > Get the picture?? > > I need a way of finding the ethernet address of the interface > associated with > a socket in an LKM. Any pointers to where I'd > start looking? I thought he was rather asking how to obtain the address from inside the kernel?! -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 00:26:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA09896 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:26:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA09778 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:24:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id JAA16554; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:21:22 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA00646; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:21:17 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id JAA04661; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:07:44 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602070807.JAA04661@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: assertions To: swise@austin.ibm.com (Jean-Steveau Wise) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:07:43 +0100 (MET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <9602062101.AA30435@vikings.austin.ibm.com> from "Jean-Steveau Wise" at Feb 6, 96 03:01:43 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Jean-Steveau Wise wrote: > > I want to put assertions into the ATAPI driver code and the kernel to > assert that the ATAPI code doesn't leave a system call or interrupt > with interrupts disabled. Can anyone help me code this assertion? My It doesn't look that it would completely disable interrupts, from a quick glance over the code. One oddity that caught my eye: wcd_strategy() finally calls wcd_start(), still at splbio. wcd_start() in turn branches to atapi_request_wait(), which is enbracketed in a pair of splbio/splx. I wouldn't expect this to hang the system, but it looks strange. Have you turned on the atapi debug information? It seems to print lotsa stuff with debug on. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 00:57:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA11249 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:57:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA11107 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 00:53:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id JAA18131; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:52:01 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id JAA00846; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:52:01 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id JAA05102; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:32:58 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602070832.JAA05102@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Writing FreeBSD Device Drivers info needed. To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers), doc@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:32:57 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602070159.SAA04253@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 6, 96 06:59:06 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Terry Lambert wrote: > 3) FreeBSD Device Driver Writer's Guide > > http://freefall.freebsd.org/~erich/ddwg/ddwg.html Ah, any chance to get this into the handbook? -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 01:48:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA14913 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 01:48:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA14906 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 01:48:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id BAA01414; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 01:47:54 -0800 Message-Id: <199602070947.BAA01414@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Sujal Patel cc: willows@throck.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Emulated x86 - FreeBSD Willows Twin Running In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Feb 1996 02:41:53 EST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 01:47:53 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> Sujal Patel said: > I'm happy to announce that the EMULATED x86 version of the Willows Twin > package is now running properly on FreeBSD. The software runs slow as Cool we got a hacker in the list 8) Great , got a quick question how does the package run on a P100 or better and how much memory is required ? Congrats! Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 01:55:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA15496 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 01:55:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from risc6.unisa.ac.za (risc6.unisa.ac.za [163.200.97.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA15483 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 01:55:17 -0800 (PST) Received: by risc6.unisa.ac.za (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA30339; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:50:11 +0200 From: radova@risc6.unisa.ac.za (A. Radovanovic) Message-Id: <9602070950.AA30339@risc6.unisa.ac.za> Subject: ttys problem To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:50:11 +0200 (USAST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I have Boca 6 port board and version 2. From time to time, systems forgets tty configuration, e.g. tip cua04 gives: dev/cua04: Device not configured link down This is the case for 5 ports - master port doesn't have this problem. After I reboot the machine it works fine again, but just for a while. My kernel config is: #COM ports device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" tty irq 4 vector siointr device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 vector siointr #boca MULTIPORT device sio4 at isa? port 0x220 tty flags 0x985 device sio5 at isa? port 0x228 tty flags 0x985 device sio6 at isa? port 0x240 tty flags 0x985 device sio7 at isa? port 0x248 tty flags 0x985 device sio8 at isa? port 0x260 tty flags 0x985 device sio9 at isa? port 0x268 tty flags 0x985 irq 5 vector siointr Is there anything wrong with the config, or it is just a bug in FreeBSD 2? Regards, Alex From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 02:31:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA17843 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 02:31:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id CAA17798 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 02:30:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id UAA10368; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:56:01 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602071026.UAA10368@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Emulated x86 - FreeBSD Willows Twin Running To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty Jr.) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:56:01 +1030 (CST) Cc: smpatel@wam.umd.edu, willows@throck.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602070947.BAA01414@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr." at Feb 7, 96 01:47:53 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Amancio Hasty Jr. stands accused of saying: > > >>> Sujal Patel said: > > I'm happy to announce that the EMULATED x86 version of the Willows Twin > > package is now running properly on FreeBSD. The software runs slow as > > Great , got a quick question how does the package run on a P100 or better > and how much memory is required ? Horribly slowly, and still many issues to be covered. (Anything that does FP dies, etc.) Memory usage is hard to measure until more apps run. > Amancio -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 02:52:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA19176 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 02:52:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from sun4nl.NL.net (sun4nl.NL.net [193.78.240.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA19170 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 02:52:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from spase1 by sun4nl.NL.net via EUnet id AA07832 (5.65b/CWI-3.3); Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:52:19 +0100 Received: from phobos.spase.nl by spase.nl (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA03068; Wed, 7 Feb 96 11:46:10 GMT From: dutchman@spase.nl (Kees Jan Koster) Received: (dutchman@localhost) by phobos.spase.nl (8.6.11/8.6.11) id LAA01529 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:45:47 +0100 Message-Id: <199602071045.LAA01529@phobos.spase.nl> Subject: Is there a FreeBSD automounter? To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD hackers Mailing list) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:45:45 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hoi Hackers, Well, I guess the says it all. Does FreeBSD have an automounter? If not, is anyone working on one? Groetjes, Kees Jan ======================================================================v== Kees Jan Koster e-mail: dutchman@spase.nl Van Somerenstraat 50 tel: NL-24-3234708 6521 BS Nijmegen the Netherlands ========================================================================= Who is this general Failure and why is he reading my disk? (anonymous) ========================================================================= From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 03:18:15 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id DAA20409 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:18:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA20402 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:18:03 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id DAA00521 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:18:02 -0800 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:18:02 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602071118.DAA00521@ref.tfs.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: TERRY patches.. Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Terry: regarding your patches.. Your changes accidentally SPAMMed some bde patches.. I've sent you a reverse patch to apply to your tree to UNSPAM the changes having applied that patch.. here are comments. I like the namei/lookup addition of the EXCLUDE flag. Seems good to me.. the moving of some functionality from filesystems to common code is a good idea. The changes in vfs_init seem properly implimented, but I haven't looked at the full impact of what they mean yet in terms of how the structures are controlled etc... later The reworking of mount() is ingenious, but I think we should not impliment much of it. I find it is harder to follow the nested if else constructions than it is to see return EINVAL; or even error = EINVAL; goto leave; We also lose the ability to get easy diffs from 4.4lite2 and NetBSD (who we may want to campare code with at times) I think we would gain more by leaving the existing code "As IS" and inserting 4-line comment groups every clause, explaining what's going on.. I think 'cosmetic reworks' should be avoided, as it tends to: 1/ make it harder to merge/compare code 2/ obfuscate the real nature of the change. Admittedly I do prefer mp->mnt_flag |= uap->flags & (MNT_NOSUID | ! MNT_NOEXEC | ! MNT_NODEV | ! MNT_SYNCHRONOUS | ! MNT_UNION | ! MNT_ASYNC | ! MNT_FORCE); to ! mp->mnt_flag |= uap->flags & (MNT_NOSUID | MNT_NOEXEC | MNT_NODEV | ! MNT_SYNCHRONOUS | MNT_UNION | MNT_ASYNC | MNT_FORCE); The changes to vfs_syscalls seem to be largely cosmetic or changes to lead to single-exit-point structuring of functions. some of them look good but.. In some cases it actually complicates the code to come out through a single exit point: wittness: /* only set *retval if loop above completed successfully*/ you needed extra code to use the break; Once again, is it worth breaking 'compatibility' to get the meger benefites.. Whether the new format of the code is more maintainable is open to debate.. I might find it harder to maintain because I could get the 'else' clauses wrong and also sometimes it requires some extra work as it assignes a value to the variable 'error' rather than just returning it as a value, not to mention just returning.. (I seem to remember that sometimes the C compiler will notice that you are 'jumping' to a return, and will do a return(value) anyhow..) around line..--- 813,829 ---- a whole NDINIT(&nd, CREATE, LOCKPARENT, UIO_USERSPACE, uap->path, p); ! error = namei(&nd); seems to have dissappeared.. is that right? Is that the same namei moved down 23 lines or so? That at least uses the EXCLUDE flag and is more than a cosmetic change.... It's a pitty you couldn't submit the cosmetic changes as a separate packege because they Hide the extent of REAL changes.. It's make it a much easier job to go over the actual functional changes.. I wanted the namebuffer freeing to be moved out as you have done. it seemed to be in the wrong place when I did devfs.. but about 60% of this patch is cosmetic.. (single-exit-point stuff) I f I could get the real changes separated from this stuff it's be a lot easier. the nfs_nameifree() changes look ok, but I really need to spend more time.. why is it different to nameifree() julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 03:25:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id DAA21191 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:25:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA21169 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:25:04 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id DAA00534; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:23:24 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602071123.DAA00534@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Writing FreeBSD Device Drivers info needed. To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:23:24 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, doc@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602070832.JAA05102@uriah.heep.sax.de> from "J Wunsch" at Feb 7, 96 09:32:57 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > As Terry Lambert wrote: > > > 3) FreeBSD Device Driver Writer's Guide > > > > http://freefall.freebsd.org/~erich/ddwg/ddwg.html > > Ah, any chance to get this into the handbook? It's a bit sparse as yet.. I guess I should submit something to it.. (item 56457 on list of things to do) > > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 03:43:15 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id DAA22439 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:43:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id DAA22426 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:42:35 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id DAA00568; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:42:29 -0800 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 03:42:29 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602071142.DAA00568@ref.tfs.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: corrected context diffs of terries patches Cc: terry@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I've been through his patches. I would really like someone ELSE so go through them too. I didn't see any problems, and I did like the restructuring of who frees what with regards to the namei name buffer it was definitly broken before.. I've placed a file in ftp::/freefall.cdrom.com:/incoming/context-diffs-terry with a slightly fixed up version of his diffs. (fixed a spammed file) comments. The first HALF (actually 60%) is MOSTLY cosmetic changes terry re-wrote almost all of vfs_syscalls.c so that all functions have a single exit point. My guess is that he plans to be able to do somethig at this exit point at some point in the future. (?) I am in two minds about this.. 1/ I think it's slightly cleaner code 2/ it might be a few cycles slower in places 3/ It makes it harder to merge in 4.4lite2 patches 4/ It's not ALWAYS easier to read, and is often harder to read because you have to find the end of the nested if'else'if sets to figure out where the code goes, while 'return EINVAL;' is pretty bloody obvious. 5/ It's easier to have leaks of things with many exit points 6/ it obfuscates any REAL changes he's made in the area and might intruduce new bugs for little gain. I'm kinda against these cosmetic patches.. unless terry can give a good reason. Terry, if you could extract the REAL changes from this stuff and submit that I'd be pretty happy with the patch. the last 40% of the context diff is real changes to do with the re-assigning of responsibility for freeing the name buffer in the namei code. This is a good idea, though I haven't checked 100% of the change yet. I think this part should be applied.. Any one Else care to look at it and comment? especially on the last 40%? If I can get terry to undo the cosmetic changes and submit them totally separatly the first 60% of the patch would shrink to about 10%.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 04:00:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA23353 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 04:00:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from expo.x.org (expo.x.org [198.112.45.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id EAA23346 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 04:00:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from exalt.x.org by expo.x.org id AA06784; Wed, 7 Feb 96 07:00:15 -0500 Received: from localhost by exalt.x.org id MAA29144; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 12:00:09 GMT Message-Id: <199602071200.MAA29144@exalt.x.org> To: hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Apple and OSF Announce Linux for Power Macintosh In-Reply-To: Your message of Tue, 06 Feb 1996 22:34:23 EDT. <199602070634.WAA00414@freefall.freebsd.org> Organization: X Consortium Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 07:00:09 EDT From: "Kaleb S. KEITHLEY" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Argh! > > -----------------http://www.mklinux.apple.com/linux.html------------------- > > Apple Computer, Inc. > Press Release > > Apple and Open Software Foundation Announce Linux for Power Macintosh > > Leading User-Supported Version of UNIX to be Available to > Power Macintosh Users > > CAMBRIDGE, Massachusetts-February 5, 1996-Apple Computer, > Inc. announced today that it is supporting a project with the Open > Software Foundation (OSF) to port Linux, a freely distributed version > of UNIX(tm), to a variety of Power Macintosh(tm) products. This > version of Linux operates on the OSF Mach microkernel which will be > running natively on the PowerPC microprocessor. The announcement was > made at the Conference on Freely Redistributable Software held in > Cambridge. A demo of an early prototype was shown as part of the > announcement. So it's not really Linux then, it's OSF/1 with Linux emulation. > In keeping with the spirit of the Linux community, More like keeping with the terms of the GPL. :-) > Apple and OSF will > make the source code for this Linux port freely available. This > includes source code to the Mach microkernel and the required > Macintosh platform driver support. Linux is distributed throughout > the world over the Internet and other means, generally through the GNU > General Public License, which allows people to use it and change it so > long as no further restrictions are imposed and that the source code > is made available. So, since the source code will be available, it'll be a piece of cake to build "FreeBSD" for PowerMac on the same basis. -- Kaleb KEITHLEY From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 05:36:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA28804 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 05:36:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail06.mail.aol.com (mail06.mail.aol.com [152.163.172.108]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA28798 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 05:36:48 -0800 (PST) From: NIMALIN@aol.com Received: by mail06.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id IAA23753 for hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:36:11 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:36:11 -0500 Message-ID: <960207083610_315073440@mail06.mail.aol.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: freebsd doesnt boot from second (hard disk)drive! Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I use a 486/sx with adirve C of 80MB and a drive D of 500 MB,and installed freebsd 2.0.5 succesfully to 300MB of drive D (inDOS terms).But when I boot the system it directly goes to DOS as it knows nothing about my BSD.during the installation ichose the easy boot option.Even when I tried to boot with boot floppy with wd(1,a)/kernel command it didn't change.Please help me. I'm very sad! Writing to hackers after "Rroberto@keltia.freenix.fr'S" advice. please reply as soon as possibe to my email:NIMALIN@aol.com thanks. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 05:38:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA28911 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 05:38:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA28898 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 05:38:43 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id FAA00820; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 05:38:16 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602071338.FAA00820@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: Is there a FreeBSD automounter? To: dutchman@spase.nl (Kees Jan Koster) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 05:38:16 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602071045.LAA01529@phobos.spase.nl> from "Kees Jan Koster" at Feb 7, 96 11:45:45 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk yes, it's called 'amd' and is part of the standard distribution. there is a man page, but that doesn't help much.. there is documantation with the source that is a lot better.. > > Hoi Hackers, > > Well, I guess the says it all. Does FreeBSD have an automounter? > If not, is anyone working on one? > > Groetjes, > Kees Jan > > ======================================================================v== > Kees Jan Koster e-mail: dutchman@spase.nl > Van Somerenstraat 50 tel: NL-24-3234708 > 6521 BS Nijmegen > the Netherlands > ========================================================================= > Who is this general Failure and why is he reading my disk? (anonymous) > ========================================================================= > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 05:58:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA00196 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 05:58:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from hda.hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA00179 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 05:57:35 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id JAA25789; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:00:14 -0500 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199602071400.JAA25789@hda.hda.com> Subject: Re: PCI programming To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:00:13 -0500 (EST) Cc: hasty@rah.star-gate.com, fwmiller@cs.UMD.EDU, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602070211.SAA01772@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Feb 6, 96 06:11:24 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk We forwarded this gentleman's private e-mail to the list. In general we ought to avoid this, and invite the originator to send to the list himself. > Both these devices are Bus Masters.. > neither contains accessible ram. > you can't really pass data directly from one master to another. > > you need a RAM scratch pad that both devices can access. A while back I set it up to DMA directly from a VME disk array controller directly out a high speed multidrop card to an HDTV frame buffer. The disk array controller was set up to generate non-ascending addresses. I suspect the NCR PCI SCSI controller can do the same sort of thing since the NCR 725 can be set up that way, and a network card with a PCI visible FIFO could be the DMA target. However, I know beans about network protocols, whether either card exists, or how you'd want to hook the disk data in through the file system - you'd want direct I/O. -- Peter Dufault Real-Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 06:20:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA01229 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:20:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from xi.dorm.umd.edu (xi.dorm.umd.edu [129.2.152.45]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA01224 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:20:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from xi.dorm.umd.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by xi.dorm.umd.edu (8.7.3/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA05631; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:18:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:18:53 -0500 (EST) From: Sujal Patel X-Sender: smpatel@xi.dorm.umd.edu To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Emulated x86 - FreeBSD Willows Twin Running In-Reply-To: <199602070947.BAA01414@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 7 Feb 1996, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > Great , got a quick question how does the package run on a P100 or better > and how much memory is required ? It will run decently on P100 with 16Megs once we get the native x86 mode working. Right now, it moves pretty slowly on my 486/50-- But it's still very impessive. Sujal From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 06:27:47 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA01581 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:27:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from netmail.austin.ibm.com (netmail.austin.ibm.com [129.35.208.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA01576 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:27:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from vikings.austin.ibm.com (vikings.austin.ibm.com [129.35.130.98]) by netmail.austin.ibm.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with SMTP id IAA252943; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:27:43 -0600 Received: by vikings.austin.ibm.com (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03-client-2.6) for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org at austin.ibm.com; id AA17662; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:27:33 -0600 From: swise@austin.ibm.com (Jean-Steveau Wise) Message-Id: <9602071427.AA17662@vikings.austin.ibm.com> To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, swise@austin.ibm.com Subject: Re: assertions In-Reply-To: (Your message of Wed, 07 Feb 96 09:07:43 N.) <199602070807.JAA04661@uriah.heep.sax.de> Date: Wed, 07 Feb 96 08:27:32 -0600 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk j@uriah.heep.sax.de says: | As Jean-Steveau Wise wrote: | > | > I want to put assertions into the ATAPI driver code and the kernel to | > assert that the ATAPI code doesn't leave a system call or interrupt | > with interrupts disabled. Can anyone help me code this assertion? My | | It doesn't look that it would completely disable interrupts, from a | quick glance over the code. One oddity that caught my eye: | wcd_strategy() finally calls wcd_start(), still at splbio. | wcd_start() in turn branches to atapi_request_wait(), which is | enbracketed in a pair of splbio/splx. I wouldn't expect this to hang | the system, but it looks strange. spl's can be recursive, I think, as long as you keep saving the old value returned from the spl*() calls and restore things correctly... | Have you turned on the atapi debug information? It seems to print | lotsa stuff with debug on. Yes, and it does print lot's o' stuff. It seems to get an interrupt, then print out the interrupt type and other junk. The info printed all seems ok from a non-atapi-literate person's point of view. Then it just hangs. I cannot tell whether I'm dealing with a software hang or a hardware hang. I'll keep hackin' Thanx, Stevo. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 06:37:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA02569 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:37:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA02562 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:37:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id GAA09119; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:37:35 -0800 Message-Id: <199602071437.GAA09119@Root.COM> X-Authentication-Warning: implode.Root.COM: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Julian Elischer cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: TERRY patches.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Feb 1996 03:18:02 PST." <199602071118.DAA00521@ref.tfs.com> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 06:37:35 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >I think we would gain more by leaving the existing code "As IS" >and inserting 4-line comment groups every clause, explaining what's going on.. >I think 'cosmetic reworks' should be avoided, as it tends to: >1/ make it harder to merge/compare code >2/ obfuscate the real nature of the change. Please _don't_ commit the changes in their current form. At this particular point in time, cosmetic changes in the FS area must be avoided at all costs. >From a purely architectural standpoint, many of Terry's personal-taste/style changes are very inappropriate. After all, it is us (me in particular :-)) that will have to maintain this stuff in the years ahead. I'm not interested in debating this. I don't have any time to review the changes right now. I'm headed to the airport shortly for a meeting in San Francisco and I might be gone for several days if we decide to move wcarchive to a new location. -DG David Greenman Core Team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 06:49:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA03450 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:49:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from border.com (ns.border.com [199.71.190.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA03445 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:49:35 -0800 (PST) Received: by janus.border.com id <20488>; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:59:26 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:49:14 -0500 From: Jerry Kendall To: J Wunsch Cc: FreeBSD hackers Subject: Re: How would I find out the ethernet address of an interface? In-Reply-To: <199602070809.JAA04677@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Message-Id: <96Feb7.095926est.20488@janus.border.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Sorry, did'nt see the LKM below.... I must have been asleep.... On Wed, 7 Feb 1996, J Wunsch wrote: > > As Jerry Kendall wrote: > > > 'ifconfig -a' will tell you the address for all interfaces... > > 'ifconfig ep0' will tell you the address of the ep0 interface... > > > > Get the picture?? > > > > I need a way of finding the ethernet address of the interface > > associated with > a socket in an LKM. Any pointers to where I'd > > start looking? > > I thought he was rather asking how to obtain the address from inside > the kernel?! > > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Any comments or opinions in this message are my own and may or may not reflect the comments or opinions of my present or previous employers. Jerry Kendall Border Network Technologies Inc. System Software Engineer Tel +1-416-368-7157 ext 303 jerry@border.com Fax +1-416-368-7178 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 06:51:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA03569 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:51:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from spot.lodgenet.com (lodgenet.iw.net [204.157.148.88]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA03563 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:51:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from jake.lodgenet.com (jake.lodgenet.com [204.124.120.30]) by spot.lodgenet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id IAA01768; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:51:58 -0600 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by jake.lodgenet.com (8.7.3/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA06519; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:03:08 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199602071503.JAA06519@jake.lodgenet.com> X-Authentication-Warning: jake.lodgenet.com: Host localhost [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org (FreeBSD hackers), doc@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Writing FreeBSD Device Drivers info needed. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Feb 1996 09:32:57 +0100." <199602070832.JAA05102@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 09:03:07 -0600 From: "Eric L. Hernes" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > As Terry Lambert wrote: > > > 3) FreeBSD Device Driver Writer's Guide > > > > http://freefall.freebsd.org/~erich/ddwg/ddwg.html > > Ah, any chance to get this into the handbook? Yes, It's very sparse. The stuff that's there is probably enough to get started, and at least looking in the kernel sources for examples. Last I heard, John was fixin' to review it and integrate it into the handbook and I'd work on it from there. But I haven't heard since. > > -- > cheers, J"org > > joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE > Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) > eric. -- erich@lodgenet.com erich@rrnet.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 06:52:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA03715 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:52:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from border.com (ns.border.com [199.71.190.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id GAA03710 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 06:52:15 -0800 (PST) Received: by janus.border.com id <20488>; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:02:09 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:52:08 -0500 From: Jerry Kendall To: Kees Jan Koster Cc: FreeBSD hackers Mailing list Subject: Re: Is there a FreeBSD automounter? In-Reply-To: <199602071045.LAA01529@phobos.spase.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Message-Id: <96Feb7.100209est.20488@janus.border.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Try 'man amd'..... AutoMounter Daemon.... On Wed, 7 Feb 1996, Kees Jan Koster wrote: > > Hoi Hackers, > > Well, I guess the says it all. Does FreeBSD have an automounter? > If not, is anyone working on one? > > Groetjes, > Kees Jan > > ======================================================================v== > Kees Jan Koster e-mail: dutchman@spase.nl > Van Somerenstraat 50 tel: NL-24-3234708 > 6521 BS Nijmegen > the Netherlands > ========================================================================= > Who is this general Failure and why is he reading my disk? (anonymous) > ========================================================================= > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Any comments or opinions in this message are my own and may or may not reflect the comments or opinions of my present or previous employers. Jerry Kendall Border Network Technologies Inc. System Software Engineer Tel +1-416-368-7157 ext 303 jerry@border.com Fax +1-416-368-7178 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 07:08:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA04812 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:08:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu (halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.0.159]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA04807 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:08:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu; (5.65/1.1.8.2/19Aug95-0530PM) id AA19245; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:08:00 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:08:00 -0500 From: "Garrett A. Wollman" Message-Id: <9602071508.AA19245@halloran-eldar.lcs.mit.edu> To: uhclem@nemesis.lonestar.org (Frank Durda IV) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org, current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree In-Reply-To: References: Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk < Why not have some other app generate a sanity file just prior to sup > synchronizing itself? This is trivial to do with mtree(8). `mtree -c -k type,size,md5digest' will generate a file such as the following: # user: wollman # machine: khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu # tree: /homes/www/fccdb/tv # date: Wed Feb 7 10:07:00 1996 # . /set type=file . type=dir size=512 dadb.dat size=2185146 md5digest=308569da7ad8edeaf6c091c220e79dcc dadiction.txt \ size=20260 md5digest=86157fa1ba227d1b354eca408d5ee062 dadiction.txt.bak \ size=22952 md5digest=49146ae1f7dc7c0f2fbc6d4d0269c2a5 dadiction.txt~ \ size=20708 md5digest=594ed1815da95bf7c5b5388b633fe53d tvdadb.dat size=2354271 md5digest=a988653e01e540d6064038f978b7c7a0 tvdadiction.txt \ size=22952 md5digest=49146ae1f7dc7c0f2fbc6d4d0269c2a5 tvdadiction.txt~ \ size=22952 md5digest=49146ae1f7dc7c0f2fbc6d4d0269c2a5 tvdb.dat size=5134864 md5digest=cac9bbf8490171606a6f1ad343e07752 tvdiction.txt \ size=25955 md5digest=3ca56d717d0b84aa0f36a390601ab1a7 tvdiction.txt.bak \ size=25955 md5digest=3ca56d717d0b84aa0f36a390601ab1a7 tvdiction.txt~ \ size=25955 md5digest=3ca56d717d0b84aa0f36a390601ab1a7 .. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@lcs.mit.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. Opinions not those of| It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people MIT, LCS, ANA, or NSA| who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 07:16:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA05538 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:16:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA05528 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:16:48 -0800 (PST) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id CAA05403; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 02:11:48 +1100 Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 02:11:48 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199602071511.CAA05403@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org, radova@risc6.unisa.ac.za Subject: Re: ttys problem Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk >I have Boca 6 port board and version 2. From time to time, systems >forgets tty configuration, e.g. tip cua04 gives: >dev/cua04: Device not configured >link down >This is the case for 5 ports - master port doesn't have this problem. >After I reboot the machine it works fine again, but just for a while. This has been reported before. The cause is unknown. The error message is bogus - standard sio ports can't become unconfigured while the system is running. A better program than tip (e.g., cat) might give a better error message. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 07:20:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA05816 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:20:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA05806 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:20:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from gemini.sdsp.mc.xerox.com ([13.231.132.20]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <15388(11)>; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:19:55 PST Received: from gnu.mc.xerox.com (gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com) by gemini.sdsp.mc.xerox.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA28376; Wed, 7 Feb 96 10:19:41 EST Received: by gnu.mc.xerox.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA04858; Wed, 7 Feb 96 10:19:40 EST Message-Id: <9602071519.AA04858@gnu.mc.xerox.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: NIMALIN@aol.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: freebsd doesnt boot from second (hard disk)drive! In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 07 Feb 1996 05:36:11 PST." <960207083610_315073440@mail06.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:19:39 PST From: "Marty Leisner" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I use a 486/sx with adirve C of 80MB and a drive D of 500 MB,and installed > freebsd 2.0.5 succesfully to 300MB of drive D (inDOS terms).But when I boot > the system it directly goes to DOS as it knows nothing about my BSD.during > the installation ichose the easy boot option.Even when I tried to boot with > boot floppy with wd(1,a)/kernel command it didn't change.Please help me. > I'm very sad! > Writing to hackers after "Rroberto@keltia.freenix.fr'S" advice. > please reply as soon as possibe to my email:NIMALIN@aol.com > thanks. > I had the same problem...since I was running on another machine: 1) Build a kernel was root device wd1 2) ran fbsdboot with the option "compiled in rdev" (-r?) and booted from dos >From experience, I saw it worked better on wd0 (I had slices on wd0 and wd1... Before, with the boot loader I could boot from wd(1,a)/kernel, I changed things, reinstalled and now I can't... Hint:::: I've found Linux much easier to get running on a wide variety of machines than freebsd.... I'm using about 10 machines in different configurations...I'm running freebsd on about 3 of them...with linix I have a strategy which always works even on multiple hard disks (loadlin kernel with a dos based kernel). Also, utilties like ps and the like can get important information from /proc/ksyms...this works much better than having to specify the kernel, especially when you boot from dos... -- marty leisner@sdsp.mc.xerox.com Member of the League for Programming Freedom From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 07:34:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA06876 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:34:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from cat.syr.edu (cat.syr.edu [128.230.32.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA06866 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:34:46 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 96 10:34:10 EST From: jsharris@cat.syr.edu (J. Stuart Harris) Received: by cat.syr.edu (4.1/1.0-6/5/90) id AA06449; Wed, 7 Feb 96 10:34:10 EST Message-Id: <9602071534.AA06449@cat.syr.edu> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: cdrom Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I just got FreeBSD 2.0.5 on a Walnut Creek CDROM. I have had lots of problems using the CDROM drive (SCSI 4x cdrom, Toshiba via an Adaptec 2940W controller) If the cd is mounted during boot, and ls of /cdrom hangs the computer. I got around this by commenting out the fstab entry and manually mounting it using /sbin/mount_cd9660 -r -o rdonly /dev/cd0a /cdrom. There are still problems, however. If I cd to /cdrom and 'more' a file, the system hangs. If I 'lndir' and then 'ls' a directory 'ls utils/*', the computer hangs. I'm a computer engineer (finishing dissertation), and although I don't know all the in's and out's of Unix or the PC's, I do have a reasonable background. I have also done device driver programming, etc. If there is a fix, I would be interested in it. If there is work that needs to be done to fix it, I would be willing to help. Second, I have an Intel Etherexpress PRO 100. It appears that there is no driver for it in FreeBSD. If there is and I missed it, please let me know. Otherwise, if there is additional info you have available and I could help write the driver for it, I would be willing to work on that as well. Thanks, Stuart Harris From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 07:42:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA07465 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:42:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from terra.Sarnoff.COM (terra.sarnoff.com [130.33.11.203]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA07460 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:42:01 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rminnich@localhost) by terra.Sarnoff.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA06289; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:39:05 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:39:04 -0500 (EST) From: "Ron G. Minnich" To: Jeffrey Hsu cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: Apple and OSF Announce Linux for Power Macintosh In-Reply-To: <199602070634.WAA00414@freefall.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk This is not even worth worrying about. OSF has an os no one wants. Apple needs to stay alive somehow. One way to think of this is to imagine two drowning men offering to toss each other a life saver. ron Ron Minnich |" XNFPREP: ERROR 4007: rminnich@sarnoff.com | Everything in the design was deleted." (609)-734-3120 |Was it something I said? ftp://ftp.sarnoff.com/pub/mnfs/www/docs/cluster.html From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 07:48:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA08051 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:48:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from terra.Sarnoff.COM (terra.sarnoff.com [130.33.11.203]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA08046 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:48:25 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rminnich@localhost) by terra.Sarnoff.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA06333; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:44:59 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:44:58 -0500 (EST) From: "Ron G. Minnich" To: Julian Elischer cc: Kees Jan Koster , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Is there a FreeBSD automounter? In-Reply-To: <199602071338.FAA00820@ref.tfs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk One of the handy things is to have a /net/hostname/filesyste/blah blah here's how i do it: /etc/sysconfig: amdflags="-l /var/log/amd -r -a /amd -p > /var/run/amd.pid /net /etc/amd-n" and here is /etc/amd-n # map for /n /defaults opts:=rw,intr;fs:=${autodir}/${rhost} * rhost:=${key};type:=host;rfs:=/ Ron Minnich |" XNFPREP: ERROR 4007: rminnich@sarnoff.com | Everything in the design was deleted." (609)-734-3120 |Was it something I said? ftp://ftp.sarnoff.com/pub/mnfs/www/docs/cluster.html From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 07:50:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA08195 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:50:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from xi.dorm.umd.edu (xi.dorm.umd.edu [129.2.152.45]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA08180 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 07:50:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from xi.dorm.umd.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by xi.dorm.umd.edu (8.7.3/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA07001; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:50:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:50:34 -0500 (EST) From: Sujal Patel X-Sender: smpatel@xi.dorm.umd.edu To: willows@throck.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: More on x86 Emulated Willows Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I found out this morning that, a static 'xwin' binary is MUCH more succesful then the dynamic one. The static one runs charmap, terminal, clock, and even gets much farther on WinWord.. Anyone have any idea what could be causing this? Current problems are: 1- Calc, Excel, and others FPE in fp87.c-- This bug is FreeBSD specific(?) 2- WinWord complains about SHARE.EXE not being loaded... Any ideas? Sujal From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 08:12:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA09584 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:12:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from snake.hut.fi (root@snake.hut.fi [193.167.6.99]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA09573 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:12:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from epsilon.hut.fi (epsilon.hut.fi [130.233.224.54]) by snake.hut.fi (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA08219; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:12:14 +0200 (EET) Received: (vode@localhost) by epsilon.hut.fi (8.6.11/8.6.7) id SAA20304; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:12:14 +0200 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:12:14 +0200 Message-Id: <199602071612.SAA20304@epsilon.hut.fi> From: Kai Vorma To: ache@astral.msk.su Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Sup server at nic.funet.fi In-Reply-To: References: <199511181559.RAA18772@lk-hp-5.hut.fi> Reply-To: Kai.Vorma@hut.fi Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Could you please update it at least 3 times? Due to interference > with sleep period I forced to wait much more than 12h for > next update :-( Mirroring freefall too often generates heavy load because of the sup protocol. I think I could arrange things so that -stable is mirrored once a day and -current more often, but just now I don't have to time to do anything (the whole supping system at nic needs some minor modifications). Our (FUNET - the Finnish University Network) lines to USA are quite good (8MB to Stockholm and from there a shared 24MB + 4 MB to USA) so supping at day times makes sense (just now (16:00 GMT) ftp transfer speed from ftp.cdrom.com was 50 KB/s :-) Btw, I don't think that rotating sup servers using name server is a good idea, because every sup server has different set of file ctimes and sup would update (not receive, though) every file every time the server changes.. ..vode From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 08:25:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA10282 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:25:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from crlabs.com (CRLABS.COM [146.99.201.129]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA10276 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:25:29 -0800 (PST) Received: (from cwiener@localhost) by crlabs.com (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA14750 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:25:27 -0500 (EST) From: Chris Wiener Message-Id: <199602071625.LAA14750@crlabs.com> Subject: Re: Connectix Quickcam patches? To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:25:27 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk In datatec.freebsd.hackers you write: >From: "Adam W. Dace" >Hey all, now that I'm finally on this list I can keep up with things >better, but I was wondering if anyone out there has patches/source >available that even sort-of-works for the Connectix Quickcam. A reference-only kernel driver is now in -current. If you are looking for a user-level program, patches for xfqcam are on freebsd.cdrom.com in the /incoming directory. Chris -- Christopher Wiener N2CR CR Labs, Morris Plains, NJ DOMAIN: cwiener@CRLABS.COM "Live music is better ... bumper stickers should be issued." - Neil Young From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 08:46:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA11298 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:46:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA11293 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:46:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from gemini.sdsp.mc.xerox.com ([13.231.132.20]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <15115(15)>; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:45:24 PST Received: from gnu.mc.xerox.com (gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com) by gemini.sdsp.mc.xerox.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA29614; Wed, 7 Feb 96 11:45:10 EST Received: by gnu.mc.xerox.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA04991; Wed, 7 Feb 96 11:45:08 EST Message-Id: <9602071645.AA04991@gnu.mc.xerox.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: Robert Nordier Cc: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert), hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 05 Feb 1996 13:16:58 PST." <199602052117.XAA00586@eac.iafrica.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:45:06 PST From: "Marty Leisner" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Maybe caching is a big win... It can't hurt with readonly file systems... I found (on linux) doing iozone I got about the same performance from msdos and ext2, doing an ls on ghostscript gave me time for a coffee break on msdos... -- marty leisner@sdsp.mc.xerox.com Member of the League for Programming Freedom From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 08:46:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA11357 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:46:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from frig.mt.cs.keio.ac.jp (frig.mt.cs.keio.ac.jp [131.113.32.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA11340 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:46:28 -0800 (PST) Received: (from hosokawa@localhost) by frig.mt.cs.keio.ac.jp (8.6.12+2.4W/3.4Wbeta3) id BAA21085; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 01:46:15 +0900 Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 01:46:15 +0900 Message-Id: <199602071646.BAA21085@frig.mt.cs.keio.ac.jp> To: announce@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org, hardware@freebsd.org Reply-To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: [PCMCIA] pccard-test 960207 is now available From: hosokawa@mt.cs.keio.ac.jp (HOSOKAWA Tatsumi) X-Mailer: mnews [version 1.18PL3] 1994-08/01(Mon) Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk We announce the release newest alpha-test version (960207) of our "pccard-test" package. It enables FreeBSD-2.1.0 to drive many PCMCIA cards (Ethernet, FAX/Modem, ISDN, Digital Cellular, SCSI, Flash ATA, ATA HDD) and provides you "hotplug" PCMCIA feature on your laptop machines running FreeBSD-2.1.0. This work is based on Andrew McRae's sys/pccard stuffs. -------------------------------------------------------------- Caution!: This package is the alpha-test version. Please backup your important data before installing this package. We are not responsible for the proper functioning of it, and we are not responsible for damages incurred with its use. -------------------------------------------------------------- You can get it from ftp://bash.cc.keio.ac.jp/pub/os/FreeBSD/alpha-test/pccard/pccard-test-960207.tar.gz Improvements upon last release: Too much. It says all :-). # ls -l -rw-r--r-- 1 root bin 95465 Jan 23 02:05 pccard-test-960123.tar.gz -rw-r--r-- 1 root bin 170917 Feb 8 00:47 pccard-test-960207.tar.gz If you want to know the latest information of this package, please open this URL. http://www.mt.cs.keio.ac.jp/person/hosokawa/freebsd-pcmcia/ Enjoy ! HOSOKAWA, Tatsumi BSD-nomads Mailing List, Japan FreeBSD daemon artworks hosokawa@mt.cs.keio.ac.jp ----------------------------------------------------------------------- The Current Status of "pccard-test" Package for FreeBSD ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Type Card Status Driver ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ethernet 3Com Etherlink III 3C589B OK nep 3Com Etherlink III 3C589C OK nep Accton? UE2212 SLOW ed Accton EN2212 SLOW ed Farallon EtherMac OK nep Fujitsu FMV-J181 OK fe IBM Creditcard Ethernet I OK ed IBM Creditcard Ethernet II OK ed NextCom J Link NC5310 OK fe FAX/Modem APEX DATA Mobile Plus V.34 OK sio Fujitsu FMV-JMD712 OK sio GATEWAY2000 MODEM OK sio Hayes OPTIMA 288 V.34 NG sio Megahertz XJ1144 OK sio Megahertz XJ2144 OK sio Megahertz XJ2144J OK sio Megahertz XJ2288 OK sio Megahertz XJ3288J OK sio NewMedia FAX/Modem 14.4K OK sio OMRON ME2814 Fax/Modem OK sio OMRON MD24XCA Fax/Modem OK sio PREMAX FM288 OK sio Panasonic TO-706C NG sio TDK DF1414 OK sio TDK DF1414EX OK sio US Robotics Sportster PCMCIA V.34 OK sio US Robotics COURIER PCMCIA V.34 OK sio Xircom CreditCard Ethernet+Modem (Modem only) OK sio *1 ISDN BUG Linkboy D64K OK sio Digital Cellular NTT DoCoMo DATA/FAX Adapter OK sio IRDA IBM PCMCIA Serial IR Adapter Card NG sio SCSI Adaptec SlimSCSI APM-1460 OK aic NewMedia BusToaster OK aic *2 RATOC REX-5535AC OK spc RATOC REX-5535AMC OK spc RATOC REX-5535X OK spc Flash ATA SunDisk SPD5-5 (OEM: Epson Flash Packer 5MB) OK wdc SunDisk SPD5-20 (OEM: Epson Flash Packer 20MB) OK wdc SunDisk SPD-40 (OEM: Epson Flash Packer 40MB) OK wdc ATA HDD Maxtor MobileMax MXL131 OK wdc Mitsubishi M6887-3 170MB OK wdc ----------------------------------------------------------------------- *1 We don't want to support any Xircom PCMCIA cards because of their harsh policy against free software. It only means a Xircom card works with this driver. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- -- HOSOKAWA, Tatsumi E-mail: hosokawa@mt.cs.keio.ac.jp WWW homepage: http://www.mt.cs.keio.ac.jp/person/hosokawa.html Department of Computer Science, Keio University, Yokohama, Japan From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 08:48:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA11528 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:48:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from Root.COM (implode.Root.COM [198.145.90.17]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA11523 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:48:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by Root.COM (8.6.12/8.6.5) with SMTP id IAA09356; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:48:32 -0800 Message-Id: <199602071648.IAA09356@Root.COM> X-Authentication-Warning: implode.Root.COM: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: jsharris@cat.syr.edu (J. Stuart Harris) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: cdrom In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Feb 1996 10:34:10 EST." <9602071534.AA06449@cat.syr.edu> From: David Greenman Reply-To: davidg@Root.COM Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 08:48:32 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >Second, I have an Intel Etherexpress PRO 100. It appears that there is no driver >for it in FreeBSD. If there is and I missed it, please let me know. Otherwise, >if there is additional info you have available and I could help write the >driver for it, I would be willing to work on that as well. If your Pro/100 is the newer Pro/100B (look for an 82557 chip [as opposed to an 82556]), then there will be support for it in the next release of FreeBSD via the 'fxp' driver. -DG David Greenman Core Team/Principal Architect, The FreeBSD Project From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 09:07:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA12333 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:07:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA12328 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:07:49 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602071707.JAA12328@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: jsharris@cat.syr.edu (J. Stuart Harris) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: cdrom In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Feb 1996 10:34:10 EST." <9602071534.AA06449@cat.syr.edu> Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 09:07:49 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >I just got FreeBSD 2.0.5 on a Walnut Creek CDROM. I have had lots of problems >using the CDROM drive (SCSI 4x cdrom, Toshiba via an Adaptec 2940W >controller) Upgrade to 2.1-STABLE. It should fix your 2940 problem. >Second, I have an Intel Etherexpress PRO 100. It appears that there is no dri >ver >for it in FreeBSD. If there is and I missed it, please let me know. Otherwis >e, >if there is additional info you have available and I could help write the >driver for it, I would be willing to work on that as well. There is a driver in 2.2-current for the 100B. I don't know when support for the straight 100 will be added to the driver. > >Thanks, >Stuart Harris -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 09:13:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA12587 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:13:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA12581 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:13:27 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602071713.JAA12581@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Kai.Vorma@hut.fi cc: ache@astral.msk.su, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Sup server at nic.funet.fi In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Feb 1996 18:12:14 +0200." <199602071612.SAA20304@epsilon.hut.fi> Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 09:13:27 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > Could you please update it at least 3 times? Due to interference > > with sleep period I forced to wait much more than 12h for > > next update :-( > >Mirroring freefall too often generates heavy load because of the sup >protocol. I think I could arrange things so that -stable is mirrored >once a day and -current more often, but just now I don't have to time >to do anything (the whole supping system at nic needs some minor >modifications). Do you not have sufficient disk space to mirror the cvs tree? Then you could simply run a CVS update on the two areas instead of impacting Freefall with two separate SUPs. >..vode > -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 09:33:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA13872 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:33:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from devel-1.ibe.net (devel-1.ibe.net [194.179.129.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA13865 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:33:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (from piero@localhost) by devel-1.ibe.net (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA18185 for Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:33:11 +0100 (MET) From: Piero Serini Message-Id: <199602071733.SAA18185@devel-1.ibe.net> Subject: Classless in-addr.arpa delegation (fwd) To: Hackers@FreeBSD.ORG (FreeBSD Hackers' List) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:33:11 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: piero@IBENet.IT Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.0.5 X-Phone-Number: +39 (2) 5811 3562 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hello. This e-mail came from the mailing list for local registries in Europe. I thought you would find it interesting. Quoting from Andres Bauman: > From owner-local-ir@ripe.net Wed Feb 7 18:27 MET 1996 > Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 17:38:28 +0200 (EET) > From: Andres Bauman > X-Sender: andresb@horos.kbfi.ee > To: local-ir@ripe.net > Subject: Classless in-addr.arpa delegation > Message-Id: > Mime-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > Content-Length: 713 > > Hi > > There is at least one operating system, where this method described in > draft-degroot-classless-inaddr-00.txt, and supposed by RIPE, does not > work. It is FreeBSD. Their resolver libarary cannot handle CNAME answers > for PTR queries. In their case you just see on console something like: > > Feb 7 16:53:00 cache traceroute: gethostby*.gethostanswer: asked for > "177.96.40.193.in-addr.arpa", got "177.128.96.40.193.in-addr.arpa" > > > Regards, > ANdres > > > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Andres Bauman | Internet: andresb@uninet.ee > AS Nosper Ltd. | Phone: +372 6308858 > Ravala pst. 10 | Fax: +372 6317984 > EE0001, Tallinn, Estonia | > Bye, -- # $Id: .signature,v 1.13 1996/01/10 14:18:23 piero Exp $ Piero Serini Via Panzeri, 15 I 20123 Milano - ITALY From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 10:13:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA16098 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:13:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from eac.iafrica.com (slipper101143.iafrica.com [196.7.101.143]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA16090 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:13:29 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rnordier@localhost) by eac.iafrica.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id UAA00245; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:10:10 +0200 From: Robert Nordier Message-Id: <199602071810.UAA00245@eac.iafrica.com> Subject: Re: FAT filesystem performance To: leisner@sdsp.mc.xerox.com (Marty Leisner) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:10:08 +0200 (SAT) Cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9602071645.AA04991@gnu.mc.xerox.com> from "Marty Leisner" at Feb 7, 96 08:45:06 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 7 Feb 1996, Marty Leisner wrote: > Maybe caching is a big win... > > It can't hurt with readonly file systems... > > I found (on linux) doing iozone I got about the same > performance from msdos and ext2, doing an ls on ghostscript gave > me time for a coffee break on msdos... Thanks for that thought. It's worth generating some statistics as a help in deciding the caching issue, and I've been meaning to set something up. On MS-DOS, it's possible to determine buffer contents in terms of FAT/DIR/DATA sectors, so it shouldn't be too hard to find out what exactly is happening there. -- Robert Nordier From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 10:27:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA16934 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:27:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from mpp.minn.net (root@mpp.Minn.Net [204.157.201.242]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA16929 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:27:13 -0800 (PST) Received: (from mpp@localhost) by mpp.minn.net (8.7.3/8.6.9) id MAA03921; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 12:26:54 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199602071826.MAA03921@mpp.minn.net> Subject: Re: Sup server at nic.funet.fi To: Kai.Vorma@hut.fi Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 12:26:54 -0600 (CST) From: "Mike Pritchard" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602071612.SAA20304@epsilon.hut.fi> from "Kai Vorma" at Feb 7, 96 06:12:14 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25 ME8b] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Kai Vorma wrote: > > Could you please update it at least 3 times? Due to interference > > with sleep period I forced to wait much more than 12h for > > next update :-( > > Mirroring freefall too often generates heavy load because of the sup > protocol. I think I could arrange things so that -stable is mirrored > once a day and -current more often, but just now I don't have to time > to do anything (the whole supping system at nic needs some minor > modifications). Why not just sup the cvs files and simply checkout -current & -stable sources from those? -- Mike Pritchard mpp@minn.net "Go that way. Really fast. If something gets in your way, turn" From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 10:41:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA18163 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:41:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from shell.monmouth.com (pechter@shell.monmouth.com [205.164.220.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA18151 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:41:12 -0800 (PST) Received: (from pechter@localhost) by shell.monmouth.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA02734; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:38:57 -0500 From: Bill/Carolyn Pechter Message-Id: <199602071838.NAA02734@shell.monmouth.com> Subject: Re: reading ufs from OS/2 To: peters@staidan.qld.edu.au (Peter Stubbs) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:38:55 -0500 (EST) Cc: FreeBSD-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD-hackers) In-Reply-To: <4C7B802361D@aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au> from "Peter Stubbs" at Feb 7, 96 11:08:16 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Hi all, > > I've just seen an announcement in comp.os2.announce of a free .ifs for > OS/2 to be able to read & write to linux partitions. > > QUOTE > --------- > ext2-os2.ifs is a file system driver that allows OS/2 to seamlessly > access Linux native partitions (ext2fs partitions) in both read and > write modes. Once installed, Linux partitions appear as standard OS/2 > drive letters, one per Linux partition. > ---------- > ENDQUOTE > > How alien is the linux file system from the FBSD one? Would it work? > It would be nice if it did! > Boy I wish someone would write this for FreeBSD (or hpfs for FreeBSD). It's the one reason I'm considering Linux on my laptop... Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bill Pechter/Carolyn Pechter | The postmaster always pings twice. Lakewood MicroSystems | 17 Meredith Drive, 908-389-3592 | Tinton Falls, NJ 07724 pechter@shell.monmouth.com | From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 11:55:13 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA22750 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:55:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA22730 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:55:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <15772(14)>; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:51:06 PST Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]) by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177478>; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:18:19 -0800 X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: Terry Lambert cc: current@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FS PATCHES: THE NEXT GENERATION In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 16:26:27 PST." <199602070026.RAA03938@phaeton.artisoft.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:18:06 PST From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <96Feb7.111819pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199602070026.RAA03938@phaeton.artisoft.com>you write: >The output doesn't look particularly useful as input to "patch" You missed the "Index:" lines that cvs diff generates; they tell patch which file to patch. (The FS_PATCHES.diff.gz that exists on freefall right now is not a context diff, btw) Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 12:32:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA24976 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 12:32:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA24967 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 12:32:01 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA06238; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:29:43 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602072029.NAA06238@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: FS PATCHES: THE NEXT GENERATION To: fenner@parc.xerox.com (Bill Fenner) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:29:43 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, current@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <96Feb7.111819pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> from "Bill Fenner" at Feb 7, 96 11:18:06 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > In message <199602070026.RAA03938@phaeton.artisoft.com>you write: > >The output doesn't look particularly useful as input to "patch" > > You missed the "Index:" lines that cvs diff generates; they tell patch which > file to patch. (The FS_PATCHES.diff.gz that exists on freefall right now is > not a context diff, btw) I know. That was the source of my consternation. I specified a comamnd line of "cvs diff -c" and that is what came out. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 13:14:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA26988 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:14:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA26976 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:14:46 -0800 (PST) Received: by Sysiphos id AA22888 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG); Wed, 7 Feb 1996 22:14:14 +0100 Message-Id: <199602072114.AA22888@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 22:14:14 +0100 In-Reply-To: Peter Dufault "Re: PCI programming" (Feb 7, 9:00) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: Peter Dufault Subject: Re: PCI programming Cc: hasty@rah.star-gate.com, fwmiller@cs.umd.edu, hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Feb 7, 9:00, Peter Dufault wrote: } Subject: Re: PCI programming } We forwarded this gentleman's private e-mail to the list. } In general we ought to avoid this, and invite the originator to } send to the list himself. } } > Both these devices are Bus Masters.. } > neither contains accessible ram. } > you can't really pass data directly from one master to another. } > } > you need a RAM scratch pad that both devices can access. } } A while back I set it up to DMA directly from a VME disk array } controller directly out a high speed multidrop card to an HDTV } frame buffer. The disk array controller was set up to generate } non-ascending addresses. } } I suspect the NCR PCI SCSI controller can do the same sort of thing } since the NCR 725 can be set up that way, and a network card with } a PCI visible FIFO could be the DMA target. The NCR 53c8xx can do SCSI bus to memory block moves. But it can't do DMA port writes to some Ethernet chip, since it actively generates only memory accesses (it can rrespond to memory mapped or port I/O accesses to its registers). But since bus-master PCI Ethernet chips have identical DMA capabilities, you'll be able to have the NCR fill a sector buffer in DRAM and the Ethernet chip send it as soon as it is complete. Neither chip has FIFOs that could hold a maximum size Ethernet packet, and the speeds aren't matched well enough to directly connect one chip's output with the other chip's input ... Regards, STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 13:16:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA27113 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:16:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.jrihealth.com (mail.jrihealth.com [204.249.32.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA27098 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:15:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from library.pride.net (danp@library.pride.net [204.249.32.4]) by mail.jrihealth.com (8.3/8.6.6.Beta9) with SMTP id QAA01391; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:17:01 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:17:13 -0500 (EST) From: Dan Polivy To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: hardware probe? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I was wondering if there is a program that will probe through an entire system and return all the hardware it can find? Is there a way to do this without having a driver for the hardware in the kernel? I have an IDE cdrom and I cannot figure out the correct address for the IDE card on the motherboard. and I would also like to know what type of video capture board is in the computer, which is impossible to tell from looking at it. Thanks! Dan +=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-+ | JRI HIS MIS Systems Administrator/Tech Support | |////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////| | danp@busstop.org dpolivy@jri.org danp@library.pride.net | |\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\| | Check out JRI's Homepage at http://www.jri.org | |////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////| | For More Info about JRI Health, call 617.457.8150, | | EMail health@jri.org or check out http://www.jri.org/jrihealth | |\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\| | Check out my NEW [Moving] WWW page (still under construction) | | currently located at: http://server1.pride.net/~danp | +-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 13:18:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA27311 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:18:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA27302 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:18:25 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id OAA06400; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 14:16:36 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602072116.OAA06400@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: reading ufs from OS/2 To: peters@staidan.qld.edu.au (Peter Stubbs) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 14:16:36 -0700 (MST) Cc: questions@FreeBSD.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <4C7B802361D@aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au> from "Peter Stubbs" at Feb 7, 96 11:08:16 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I've just seen an announcement in comp.os2.announce of a free .ifs for > OS/2 to be able to read & write to linux partitions. > > QUOTE > --------- > ext2-os2.ifs is a file system driver that allows OS/2 to seamlessly > access Linux native partitions (ext2fs partitions) in both read and > write modes. Once installed, Linux partitions appear as standard OS/2 > drive letters, one per Linux partition. > ---------- > ENDQUOTE > > How alien is the linux file system from the FBSD one? Would it work? > It would be nice if it did! This is an interesting application. To accomplish this with the BSD code, you would need to: 1) Abstract the BSD dependencies from the file system interface (I have submitted some patches to do this). Such an abstraction makes the BSD code more closely resemble the Heideman Thesis description: integration of the UCLA FIcus code into the 4.4BSD code was, at beast, a hack-job. 2) Abstract the mount process from the BSD hierachy model (I have submitted some patches to do this). Such an abstration is very useful for implementation of transient resources for mobile computing even in a BSD environment: Syquest, ZIP, and other removable media which may "arrive", floppies and CDROM, PCMCIA FlashRAM and disks, docking stations, and intermittent network links (IR/WaveLAN/Etc.), and so on. 3) Port the Heidemann framework and BSD kernel environemnt support to the target OS (a team of three of us has ported the Heidemann framework, after the BSD architectural patches to Windows 95 -- OS/2 would be less difficult since this has been done, but also less lucrative; we consider the port of the framework to be proprietary, but are considering exposing the interface to allow you to provide your own VPE's [Heidemann file systems] for Windows 95). You could probably do the port to OS/2 in 2-3 man months (assuming you have my patches and noting that the OS/2 documentation is both more complete and more correct than the Windows 95 documentation). 4) Compile and load modules. In Windows94, this is accomplished by building the modules as VPE's and using the PELDR interface to load them into a framework consisting of the modified Heidemann code and a BSD kernel emulation environment (mostly VMM.VXD consumer code providing a BSD VM consumer interface for the file system "bottom end"). With appropriate changes to path disoloution code (also part of the patches I have submitted: changes are made to each FS regarding cn_pnbuf), this would immediately buy you FFS, LFS, CD9660, VFATFS, NFS clint, SMBFS client (when it is released), NetWare client (when it is released), BSD EXT2FS, UNION, LOOPBACK, and read-only NTFS support for your OS/2 box. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 13:20:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA27631 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:20:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA27625 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:20:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA01022; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:18:16 -0800 Message-Id: <199602072118.NAA01022@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: multimedia@star-gate.com cc: hackers@freebsd.org, sandy@media.mit.edu Subject: Re: pfinder source code... In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 14:22:06 EST." <199602061922.OAA12062@westminster.media.mit.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 13:18:15 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Say anyone interested in having a cool person/gesture recognition system for FreeBSD? Here is an http pointer which describes pfinder, person finder, currenty the system runs on SGI boxes. http://www-white.media.mit.edu/vismod/ My main interest is mostly for audio/video conferencing so I don't have to stand up in attention in front of my camera. Also it would be cool to control a ccd camera with a robotic arm with gestures 8) To accomplish the above further research will have to be done in the area of non-stationary cameras because pfinders works in real-time however with a stationary camera. As for company affinity for doing FreeBSD related reasearch/work , this is it Sandy, a world-wide volunteer cooperative effort. Amancio >>> Sandy Pentland said: > Hi, > > Normally we don't give pfinder to companies without a license. > Often there isn't a if it is to be used for research only. > > Can you tell me about your company and what you intend to do with the > code? > > Sandy From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 13:23:47 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA27785 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:23:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA27772 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:23:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA01129; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:22:51 -0800 Message-Id: <199602072122.NAA01129@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Peter Dufault cc: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer), fwmiller@cs.UMD.EDU, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: PCI programming In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Feb 1996 09:00:13 EST." <199602071400.JAA25789@hda.hda.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 13:22:50 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >>> Peter Dufault said: > We forwarded this gentleman's private e-mail to the list. > In general we ought to avoid this, and invite the originator to > send to the list himself. Sorry about that , I shall know better. Is just at least sometimes people like to send me e-mail because they don't like to post on the mailing lists and most cases is because they are a bit intimidated and want to know if it is a reasonable question or that I just simply have the answer. Regards, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 13:47:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA29688 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:47:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA29682 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:47:48 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA00355; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:46:48 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602072146.NAA00355@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: PCI programming To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty Jr.) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:46:47 -0800 (PST) Cc: dufault@hda.com, fwmiller@cs.UMD.EDU, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602072122.NAA01129@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr." at Feb 7, 96 01:22:50 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk I've been coresponding with him.. it happens to fit in with what we did here at TFS a while ago. (the physmem stuff) hopefully this time we can get it right because we won't have to be worried about backwards compatibility with an older version. > > >>> Peter Dufault said: > > We forwarded this gentleman's private e-mail to the list. > > In general we ought to avoid this, and invite the originator to > > send to the list himself. > > Sorry about that , I shall know better. Is just at least sometimes > people like to send me e-mail because they don't like to post on > the mailing lists and most cases is because they are a bit intimidated > and want to know if it is a reasonable question or that I just > simply have the answer. > > Regards, > Amancio > > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 14:13:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA01992 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 14:13:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA01986 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 14:12:56 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA06511; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 15:10:40 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602072210.PAA06511@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: TERRY patches.. To: julian@ref.tfs.com (Julian Elischer) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 15:10:40 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602071118.DAA00521@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Feb 7, 96 03:18:02 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk I responded to this via email; I was unaware that it had been repeated here. I will respond in detail for the benefit of other readers; I believe I can justify all of my coding decisions, if that's required. > Terry: > regarding your patches.. > > Your changes accidentally SPAMMed some bde patches.. > I've sent you a reverse patch to apply to your tree to UNSPAM the changes > having applied that patch.. here are comments. This is (apparently) a result of a bad interaction with SUP and CVS with regard to the ability to do a "cvs update" to a locally modified tree and have the changes correctly merged. ("M" logging case). Anyone who does not have tree commit priviledges and is using SUP+CVS with the SUP firing off on a regular basis should be aware of potential problems here. For those of you with commit priviledges who commit to the main tree priort to doing another local SUP, this will not be a problem, and can be safely ignored. > I like the namei/lookup addition of the EXCLUDE > flag. Seems good to me.. the moving of some functionality from filesystems > to common code is a good idea. The EXCLUDE chnages are to handle the cache of a CREATE op used when the code issuing the namei() expect the file to not exist. This is a logical interface push-down. from the vfs_syscalls.c code into the vfs_lookup.c code to maximize code reuse. It incidently cleans up about 50 lines of garbage in the vfs_syscalls.c for backing out operations that "shouldn't have succeeded for an existing file". > The changes in vfs_init seem properly implimented, but I haven't looked > at the full impact of what they mean yet in terms of how the structures are > controlled etc... later These changes get the number of elements in the opv descriptor vectors to be uniformly allocated for all file system instantiations from the vnode_if.c file, which has an agregate initialized "complete" structure for the value of vfs_opv_numops. Previously, the value of vfs_opv_numops was calculated during initialization of the first static file system that was declared in the agregate linker set for static file systems. This was incorrect for several reasons: 1) In order to add ops to the operation vector, all file systems were required to be rebuilt. This is because the operation vector list must be at least as large (and a full intesection set) of the total number of available operation vectors for correct initialization by iterating the first list. 2) The use of a static list during the initialization assumes the existance of statically linked file systems. This is a bad assumption. In vfs_vnops.c, it is possible to provide an overide for the entire VFS system (in fact, this is done [and done incorrectly] for sockets and pipes). That means that it is theoretically possible to produce a working kernel with no VFS (Heidemann framework) file systems at all. This may, in fact, be desirable. It would allow (with segment ID tagging) the temporary use of a "boot FS" type different from the root FS type. Consider NFS, RAMdisk via Novell and Microsoft remote boot facilities, and "hosted" (DOS partition) based boots. Also consider "drop-in" replacement of other UNIX and UNIX-clone system kernels (SCO, UnixWare, etc.). 3) The information was already available without the extra code for the calculation. As far as the other implications, it is now possible to call-back register and deregister file system types and FS mount operations. This paves the way for demand-loading of FS kernel modules as a result of file system "arrival" rather than an explicit user-initiate mount request. > The reworking of mount() is ingenious, but I think we should not > impliment much of it. The intention here is to allow "device arrival" trigger mounts. Consider a portable computer with intermittent NFS connectivity, intermittent instertion of FlashRAM or PCMCIA Type II and Type III storage device and controller interfaces, and intermittent connectivity to a docking station. Consider also the desktop system with the intermittent insertion of removable media: Syquest, ZIP, CDROM, Floppy, or other media. The changes also remove the dependency on root heirarchy. The final intent is to mount as volumes and insert the volumes into a framework hierarchy by sorted order from the mount-list. The reasoning here is that you may wish to have automounting, but you may not want auto-coverage of mount points. The specific example I had in mind for this was the devfs during boot-stage before root remount. > I find it is harder to follow the nested if else > constructions than it is to see > > return EINVAL; > > or even > > error = EINVAL; > goto leave; > > We also lose the ability to get easy diffs from 4.4lite2 > and NetBSD (who we may want to campare code with at times) I agree with this. I frequently find a "goto" clearer than a nested control structure with a break. There are three "obfuscated" cases in the vfs_syscalls.c file: open, rename, and ogetdirentries. The open and rename code have always been obfuscated. The open code wants t be croken out into seperately handled "open" and "create" cases, and the rename code wants to be broken on the basis of source directory vs. non-directory and target. The ogetdirentries is just plain ugly, mostly as a result of the compatability with the "old" vs. "new" file system formats and the "endianess" dependencies in the directory tagging. The correct way to handle this is to use bit-fields in the structure that are endian-dependent instead of all the crap-cases in the code where endianess is tested and swapping done. The ogetdirentries code wants a rewrite, but I should not be faulted for this: I did not cause it to need a rewrite in the first place, CSRG did. With no further work occuring on the Lite2 code (CSRG is not doing another release), the major compatability concern is NetBSD. > I think we would gain more by leaving the existing code "As IS" > and inserting 4-line comment groups every clause, explaining what's going on.. This is should happen in any case. Much of the kernel code is poorly documented. > I think 'cosmetic reworks' should be avoided, as it tends to: > 1/ make it harder to merge/compare code > 2/ obfuscate the real nature of the change. I agree. I would argue the percentages re: the "cosemetic effect" of the changes to functions not calling namei() with an op or flag causing the path buffer to be returned instead of freed or the 5 cases where the EXCLUDE flag actually provides a real code simplification. I would put therese changes at 20-25% (not the 60% you quote) and I would say that they are necessary for future work in SMP and kernel multithreading with the least impact to the code (by allowing conditional exclusion of the synchronication primiteives, per Garrett Wollman and other core team members requests). I would also note that with the changes I have introduced, along with existing divergence from the 4.4BSD code already in that file, I believe we are close to the point where it is legally allowable to remove the USL copyright on the file (this is a bonus benefit of not inconsiderable value). As I stated in provate emil, I would be happy to work with you on removing the 20-25% of the "cosmetic" changes, either replacing code reordering with "goto error" clauses, or otherwise addressing the reentrancy syncronization for the SMP/multithreading case in the "offending" functions. > The changes to vfs_syscalls seem to be largely cosmetic or > changes to lead to single-exit-point structuring of functions. The "or" is the intended case. 8-). > some of them look good but.. > > In some cases it actually complicates the code to come out through a > single exit point: > wittness: > /* only set *retval if loop above completed successfully*/ > > you needed extra code to use the break; I agree here. This particular case (I remember debating the comment) was because of ethnic purity for the getfsstat() callers. This is technically an unnecessary change, but I don't like modifying return values if I don't have to. Really, this should be reworked, probably as a "goto error" in place of the "break" + "if( ...". Or the "if" should be "if( !error". > a whole > NDINIT(&nd, CREATE, LOCKPARENT, UIO_USERSPACE, uap->path, p); > ! error = namei(&nd); > > > seems to have dissappeared.. > is that right? > Is that the same namei moved down 23 lines or so? Yes. > the nfs_nameifree() changes look ok, but I > really need to spend more time.. > > why is it different to nameifree() Than to free the cn_pnbuf directly via a free? Aside from the fact that "free" and "FREE" were used interchangably, and the header files make them non-interchangeable in the presence of certain compilation options? Because it makes the buffer an opaque object. It means I can have as many versions of the buffer and pointers in the structure as I want without compromising the code that calls it. For instance, I might add a terminal path component buffer to the structure (which is also allocated in namei and freed in nameifree) to supply an 8.3 name to the underlying FS for VFAT. So I pass down a vreate request for "LongFileName.txt" and a terminal component of "LongFi~1.txt" (matching the VFAT collision semantics) and run the collision resoloution code in the VFAT FS instead of having to do it by multiple additional VOP calls to the underlying FS in vfs_lookup. And that's one example, not even touching the issue of Unicode or a Samba server that serves Win3.11 and Win95 clients and wants to give both sets of names back to the clients, or an API allowing system calls to take Unicode and 8 bit file names both (translation is necessary for both NFS clients and servers). Etc., etc. Let me know what I need to do to work out the "cosmetic" changes to your satisfaction. Regards, Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 14:37:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA03621 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 14:37:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from plato.algonet.se (mail.algonet.se [193.12.207.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA03616 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 14:37:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from sophocles.algonet.se (mal@sophocles.algonet.se [193.12.207.10]) by plato.algonet.se (8.6.12/hdw.1.0) with ESMTP id XAA03892 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:37:12 +0100 Received: (from mal@localhost) by sophocles.algonet.se (8.6.12/hdw.1.0) id XAA14275; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:36:20 +0100 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:36:20 +0100 Message-Id: <199602072236.XAA14275@sophocles.algonet.se> From: Mats Lofkvist To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: socket.h, struct msghdr (in 2.1) Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk The last three entrys in this one differs from at least SunOS 4 and 5. Is this a 4.4 BSD or a FreeBSD thing? I.e. what should I #ifdef on to catch it (I'm using #ifdef __FreeBSD__ right now). Thanks _ Mats Lofkvist mal@algonet.se PS Is this struct defined in any standards? From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 14:52:41 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA04494 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 14:52:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA04485 Wed, 7 Feb 1996 14:52:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id XAA18040; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:52:01 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id XAA08521; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:52:00 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id XAA06853; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:29:09 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602072229.XAA06853@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Writing FreeBSD Device Drivers info needed. To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, doc@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:29:09 +0100 (MET) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602071123.DAA00534@ref.tfs.com> from "Julian Elischer" at Feb 7, 96 03:23:24 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk As Julian Elischer wrote: > > > > 3) FreeBSD Device Driver Writer's Guide > > > > > > http://freefall.freebsd.org/~erich/ddwg/ddwg.html > > > > Ah, any chance to get this into the handbook? > It's a bit sparse as yet.. > I guess I should submit something to it.. Well, it should go in, perhaps marked as ``still incomplete'' or so. Makes it easier to contribute more, once the framework is there. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 15:03:41 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA05189 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 15:03:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA05180 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 15:03:38 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA06682; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:00:47 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602072300.QAA06682@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: More on x86 Emulated Willows To: smpatel@wam.umd.edu (Sujal Patel) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:00:46 -0700 (MST) Cc: willows@throck.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Sujal Patel" at Feb 7, 96 10:50:34 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I found out this morning that, a static 'xwin' binary is MUCH more > succesful then the dynamic one. The static one runs charmap, terminal, > clock, and even gets much farther on WinWord.. Anyone have any idea what > could be causing this? > > Current problems are: > > 1- Calc, Excel, and others FPE in fp87.c-- This bug is FreeBSD specific(?) > 2- WinWord complains about SHARE.EXE not being loaded... Any ideas? SHARE.EXE prevents the enforcement of file locks when the locks are enforced. I suspect an error in the mapping of locks which are advisory (BSD) vs. those that are mandatory (DOS). Most likely this is the "attrib" INT 21 call. Typically, an "attrib" on an open file will fail only on the "set" case, and then only if "a deny write" mode is present. It could fail in the read case if internally they were using an "open" that imposed access conflict checking to actually implement the function. If you could get a trace, this would be helpful. I just finished up a lot of work in Windows95's IFS Manager, where the share mode and locking/access conflicts are involved, so this is all very fresh for me. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 15:28:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA07273 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 15:28:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from seraglio.staidan.qld.edu.au (staidans.client.uq.edu.au [130.102.39.106]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA07262 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 15:28:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au (aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au [203.12.39.2]) by seraglio.staidan.qld.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA19282 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:28:14 +1000 Received: from AIDAN/SpoolDir by aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au (Mercury 1.21); 8 Feb 96 09:28:14 -1000 Received: from SpoolDir by AIDAN (Mercury 1.21); 8 Feb 96 09:28:02 -1000 From: "Peter Stubbs" Organization: St Aidan's A.G.S. To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:27:56 -1000 Subject: load balancing modems / mslip Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Message-ID: <4DE116C490F@aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk You may remember a thread a few weeks ago about load balancing ppp / slip across two modems. Someone said that netbsd had mslip for just this purpose. I've been looking ever since. The only replies I get from the netbsd lists are things like "Gee that sounds great, give me a copy when you get it working". I did find an MSLiP for Stochastic Linear Programming, but that's not what we want! Any ideas / info? Cheers, Peter Peter Stubbs, St Aidan's AGS. ph +61-07-3379-9911, fax +61-07-3379-9432 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 16:22:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA11488 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:22:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from bubba.tribe.com ([205.184.207.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA11483 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:22:52 -0800 (PST) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.tribe.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id QAA04064 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:22:17 -0800 From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199602080022.QAA04064@bubba.tribe.com> Subject: pwd_mkdb question To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:22:17 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello hackers... got a question regarding UID's. In the file /usr/src/usr.sbin/pwd_mkdb/pw_scan.c, you'll find these lines: struct passwd *pw; [...] if (id > USHRT_MAX) { warnx("%s > max uid value (%d)", p, USHRT_MAX); return (0); } pw->pw_uid = id; However, /usr/include/pwd.h defines the "pw_uid" field of "struct passwd" to have type "int". In other words, according to the header file, UID's ought to be able to be 32 bits long. So is there some reason why UID's are limited to 16 bits here? I have a need for big UID's ... (don't ask :-) Thanks, -Archie _______________________________________________________________________________ Archie L. Cobbs, archie@tribe.com * Tribe Computer Works http://www.tribe.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 16:31:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA12459 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:31:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from ntanet.net (pluto.ntanet.net [199.171.28.225]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA12449 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:31:10 -0800 (PST) Received: (from daveh@localhost) by ntanet.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) id QAA05990 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:47:53 -0800 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:47:53 -0800 From: David Holloway Message-Id: <199602080047.QAA05990@ntanet.net> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Is there a FreeBSD automounter? Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Would this be an ideal to use with something like the Nakamichia 7 disc cd changer? (sp is bad due to bad net.) > Hoi Hackers, > > Well, I guess the says it all. Does FreeBSD have an automounter? > If not, is anyone working on one? > > Groetjes, > Kees Jan > > ======================================================================v== > Kees Jan Koster e-mail: dutchman@spase.nl > Van Somerenstraat 50 tel: NL-24-3234708 From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 17:22:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA18433 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 17:22:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA18422 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 17:22:24 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA06975; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:19:49 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602080119.SAA06975@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: load balancing modems / mslip To: peters@staidan.qld.edu.au (Peter Stubbs) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:19:49 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <4DE116C490F@aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au> from "Peter Stubbs" at Feb 8, 96 09:27:56 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > You may remember a thread a few weeks ago about load balancing ppp / > slip across two modems. > > Someone said that netbsd had mslip for just this purpose. I've been > looking ever since. The only replies I get from the netbsd lists are > things like "Gee that sounds great, give me a copy when you get it > working". [ ... ] > Any ideas / info? ftp.bsd.com Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 17:59:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA22969 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 17:59:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA22960 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 17:59:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with ESMTP id RAA01997 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 17:59:38 -0800 Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id MAA13901; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 12:25:35 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602080155.MAA13901@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: More on x86 Emulated Willows To: smpatel@wam.umd.edu (Sujal Patel) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 12:25:35 +1030 (CST) Cc: willows@throck.com, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from "Sujal Patel" at Feb 7, 96 10:50:34 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Sujal Patel stands accused of saying: > > I found out this morning that, a static 'xwin' binary is MUCH more > succesful then the dynamic one. The static one runs charmap, terminal, > clock, and even gets much farther on WinWord.. Anyone have any idea what > could be causing this? Eww. Sounds like a linking problem, though Rob was talking about a fairly magic library-loading scheme that they use so there may be something odd we haven't found yet. > Current problems are: > > 1- Calc, Excel, and others FPE in fp87.c-- This bug is FreeBSD specific(?) Yup. I suspect the judicious application of fpsetmask() and friends will help with this one. With native x87 usage, this shouldn't be so bad. > 2- WinWord complains about SHARE.EXE not being loaded... Any ideas? Rob suggested that this may have been because your TEMP environment variable wasn't set. Apparently there are a few other problems there too. > Sujal -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 18:00:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA23193 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:00:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA23123 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:00:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA10247; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:59:40 -0700 Message-Id: <199602080159.SAA10247@rover.village.org> To: David Holloway Subject: Re: Is there a FreeBSD automounter? Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Wed, 07 Feb 1996 16:47:53 PST Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 18:59:40 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : Would this be an ideal to use with something like : the Nakamichia 7 disc cd changer? Why bother? With the Nakamichi, you just mount all 7 disks and then cd to the mount points. The automounter is for people that have 100000 file systems on 1000 machines and need to access them via the same paths on all of them w/o mounting all of them on all machines. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 18:09:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA24416 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:09:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from sasami.jurai.net (root@sasami.jurai.net [205.218.122.51]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA24409 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 18:08:56 -0800 (PST) Received: (from winter@localhost) by sasami.jurai.net (8.6.12/8.6.9) id UAA06801; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:09:04 -0600 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:09:03 -0600 (CST) From: "Matthew N. Dodd" X-Sender: winter@sasami To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD Lounge In-Reply-To: <199512310315.TAA00449@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I was poking around looking at all the nifty mbone resources you've got and was wondering who I would speak to to get connected. I'm not sure if MCI offers an mbone connection to their customers but if they do, I should probably talk to them. If they don't, who would you suggest talking to? Thanks. | Matthew N. Dodd | winter@jurai.net | http://www.jurai.net/~winter | | Technical Manager | mdodd@intersurf.net | http://www.intersurf.net | | InterSurf Online | "Welcome to the net Sir, would you like a handbasket?"| From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 19:38:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA03482 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 19:38:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA03469 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 19:38:48 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA01394; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 19:38:40 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602080338.TAA01394@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: freebsd doesnt boot from second (hard disk)drive! To: NIMALIN@aol.com Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 19:38:40 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <960207083610_315073440@mail06.mail.aol.com> from "NIMALIN@aol.com" at Feb 7, 96 08:36:11 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk you have to select C: (wd0) to put the bootblock onto. > > I use a 486/sx with adirve C of 80MB and a drive D of 500 MB,and installed > freebsd 2.0.5 succesfully to 300MB of drive D (inDOS terms).But when I boot > the system it directly goes to DOS as it knows nothing about my BSD.during > the installation ichose the easy boot option.Even when I tried to boot with > boot floppy with wd(1,a)/kernel command it didn't change.Please help me. > I'm very sad! > Writing to hackers after "Rroberto@keltia.freenix.fr'S" advice. > please reply as soon as possibe to my email:NIMALIN@aol.com > thanks. > > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 20:15:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA06718 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:15:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from ntanet.net (pluto.ntanet.net [199.171.28.225]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA06703 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:15:45 -0800 (PST) Received: (from daveh@localhost) by ntanet.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA06409; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:32:27 -0800 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:32:26 -0800 (PST) From: David Holloway To: Warner Losh cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Is there a FreeBSD automounter? In-Reply-To: <199602080159.SAA10247@rover.village.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk well, maybe its just me, but actually having several cdroms mounted at once on this machine causes instability. --------------------------------------------------------- daveh@ntanet.net http://www.ntanet.net/ fax: 702.564.2798 phone: 510.848.5189 Nevada Technical Associates --------------------------------------------------------- -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- Version: 2.6.2 mQBtAzEVNTYAAAEDALUtIO0WaiQtAflr1AZ3gS8cc6fOAiCoN9Zw/G6TlNBrlJLK G78gvGXs/bB4nZi7QVaWgltbFIoiV/xDOQ8iZcXaE3qrlJzoKWmGREJv3MKqdGQg KEwM4FTxaKmRT2vIxQAFEbQjRGF2aWQgTSBIb2xsb3dheSA8ZGF2ZWhAbnRhbmV0 Lm5ldD4= =l4en -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- On Wed, 7 Feb 1996, Warner Losh wrote: > : Would this be an ideal to use with something like > : the Nakamichia 7 disc cd changer? > > Why bother? With the Nakamichi, you just mount all 7 disks and then > cd to the mount points. > > The automounter is for people that have 100000 file systems on 1000 > machines and need to access them via the same paths on all of them w/o > mounting all of them on all machines. > > Warner > From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 20:23:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA07569 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:23:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA07545 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:23:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA11483; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:22:40 -0700 Message-Id: <199602080422.VAA11483@rover.village.org> To: David Holloway Subject: Re: Is there a FreeBSD automounter? Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Wed, 07 Feb 1996 20:32:26 PST Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 21:22:40 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : well, maybe its just me, but : actually having several cdroms mounted at once : on this machine causes instability. I've had no problems here, but maybe there is something wrong with the drivers/kernel that you are using. I'm using 2.0R, and it seems stable enough... Maybe 2.1R or -current has some flakiness in it that I wouldn't be seeing... Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 20:53:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA10913 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:53:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from io.org (io.org [198.133.36.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA10899 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 20:53:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from mnewton.newland.com (mnewton.net5a.io.org [199.166.190.83]) by io.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA24301 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:53:01 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:53:01 -0500 Message-Id: <199602080453.XAA24301@io.org> X-Sender: mnewton@io.org (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: hackers@freebsd.org From: mnewton@io.org (Malcolm Newton) Subject: ppp in background anyone Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I have ppp connected to an ISDN line and it runs good. But I can't get it run in background it seems to terminate and won't attach the line to tun0. any ideas ???????? Malcolm Newton President mnewton@io.org http://www.io.org/~mnewton VisiSoft Corp 2145 Dunwin Dr unit 11, Mississauga,Ont. Can L5L 4L9 (905) 607 6263 (905) 607 6122 fax From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 21:07:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA12956 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:07:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from bubba.tribe.com ([205.184.207.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA12950 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:07:31 -0800 (PST) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.tribe.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA06091 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:06:55 -0800 From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <199602080506.VAA06091@bubba.tribe.com> Subject: Re: pwd_mkdb question To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:06:55 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <199602080022.QAA04064@bubba.tribe.com> from "Archie Cobbs" at Feb 7, 96 04:22:17 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk I wrote: > However, /usr/include/pwd.h defines the "pw_uid" field of "struct passwd" > to have type "int". In other words, according to the header file, UID's > ought to be able to be 32 bits long. Another thing: pw_uid should be declared type "uid_t". -Archie _______________________________________________________________________________ Archie L. Cobbs, archie@tribe.com * Tribe Computer Works http://www.tribe.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 21:25:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA15669 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:25:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from paris.CS.Berkeley.EDU (paris.CS.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.34.47]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA15664 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:25:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from paris.CS.Berkeley.EDU (localhost.Berkeley.EDU [127.0.0.1]) by paris.CS.Berkeley.EDU (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA10725; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:24:20 -0800 From: Josh MacDonald Message-Id: <199602080524.VAA10725@paris.CS.Berkeley.EDU> To: "Amancio Hasty Jr." cc: "Matthew N. Dodd" , mailing list account , Warner Losh , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, jmacd@paris.CS.Berkeley.EDU Subject: Re: Hackers ages In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 01 Feb 1996 14:43:43 PST." <199602012243.OAA02062@rah.star-gate.com> Date: Wed, 07 Feb 1996 21:24:18 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >>> "Matthew N. Dodd" said: > > On Thu, 1 Feb 1996, mailing list account wrote: > > > Just blew the curve: 28 - 1 month... > > > > 20. Beat that. :) > > Isn't illegal in California for people younger than 21 to be hacking ? 8) > > Amancio You're just jealous -- 20 years and in CA. From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 21:28:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA16140 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:28:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from sasami.jurai.net (root@sasami.jurai.net [205.218.122.51]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA16100 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:28:02 -0800 (PST) Received: (from winter@localhost) by sasami.jurai.net (8.6.12/8.6.9) id XAA13163; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:28:14 -0600 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:28:14 -0600 (CST) From: "Matthew N. Dodd" X-Sender: winter@sasami To: Josh MacDonald cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Hackers ages In-Reply-To: <199602080524.VAA10725@paris.CS.Berkeley.EDU> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Wed, 7 Feb 1996, Josh MacDonald wrote: > > >>> "Matthew N. Dodd" said: > > > On Thu, 1 Feb 1996, mailing list account wrote: > > > > Just blew the curve: 28 - 1 month... > > > 20. Beat that. :) > > Isn't illegal in California for people younger than 21 to be hacking ? 8) > You're just jealous -- 20 years and in CA. *sigh* Even if I was still in CA, I'd still be an admin, and we can't have admin types have any sort of lives now can we. Down, not across and all that. |!- | Matthew N. Dodd | winter@jurai.net | http://www.jurai.net/~winter | | Technical Manager | mdodd@intersurf.net | http://www.intersurf.net | | InterSurf Online | "Welcome to the net Sir, would you like a handbasket?"| From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Feb 7 22:46:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA27541 for hackers-outgoing; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 22:46:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from metal.ops.neosoft.com (root@metal.ops.neosoft.com [206.109.5.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA27529 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 1996 22:46:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (from smace@localhost) by metal.ops.neosoft.com (8.7.3/8.6.10) id AAA15878 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 00:46:47 -0600 (CST) From: Scott Mace Message-Id: <199602080646.AAA15878@metal.ops.neosoft.com> Subject: HP PCL printers... To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 00:46:46 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8a] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Does anyone have a handy set of commands that will allow me to output various file tyes (plaintext and PS) in HP PCL3 format? I've got a client that has a HP 855C and it speaks only HP PCL3 Scott From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 01:27:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA12408 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 01:27:10 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA12401 for hackers; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 01:27:08 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 01:27:08 -0800 (PST) From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602080927.BAA12401@freefall.freebsd.org> To: hackers Subject: CHROOT changes to login. Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk these are the changes (appropriatly updated) that I used to use to produce the chroot environments for ref in the old 386BSD days. I plan to start doing this again so I'd like to see this made standard I believe it's useful. comments please? Index: src/usr.bin/login/login.1 =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.bin/login/login.1,v retrieving revision 1.3 diff -c -r1.3 login.1 *** login.1 1996/01/30 13:49:29 1.3 --- login.1 1996/02/08 09:22:34 *************** *** 111,116 **** --- 111,131 ---- .Xr utmp 5 files and executes the user's command interpretor. .Pp + If the special group id + .Dq Pa "chroot" + exists in + .Dq Pa /etc/group + then the user's group in + the password database will be compared with it to decide whether this + user should be forced to + .Xr chroot 2 + to a different root directory. If there is a match, then + the home drectory field in the password database is used as a the new + root directory and the password database is closed and reopenned. This + results in the database within the new root subtree being consulted + for password and home directory information + rather than that in the general system. + .Pp Login enters information into the environment (see .Xr environ 7 ) specifying the user's home directory (HOME), command interpreter (SHELL), *************** *** 149,154 **** --- 164,170 ---- .Xr fbtab 5 , .Xr utmp 5 , .Xr environ 7 + .Xr chroot 2 .Sh HISTORY A .Nm login Index: src/usr.bin/login/login.c =================================================================== RCS file: /home/ncvs/src/usr.bin/login/login.c,v retrieving revision 1.11 diff -c -r1.11 login.c *** login.c 1995/08/07 19:17:34 1.11 --- login.c 1996/02/08 09:23:28 *************** *** 91,96 **** --- 91,97 ---- extern void login __P((struct utmp *)); #define TTYGRPNAME "tty" /* name of group to own ttys */ + #define CHROOTGRPNAME "chroot" /* name of group to force chroot */ /* * This bounds the time given to login. Not a define so it can *************** *** 117,122 **** --- 118,125 ---- { extern char **environ; struct group *gr; + int have_chroot_gid; + gid_t chroot_gid; struct stat st; struct timeval tp; struct utmp utmp; *************** *** 192,197 **** --- 195,213 ---- for (cnt = getdtablesize(); cnt > 2; cnt--) (void)close(cnt); + /* + * If the system has a chroot group, take note.. + */ + gr = getgrnam(CHROOTGRPNAME); + if (gr ) { + chroot_gid = (gid_t) gr->gr_gid; + have_chroot_gid = 1; + } else { + have_chroot_gid = 0; + } + endgrent(); + gr = NULL; + ttyn = ttyname(STDIN_FILENO); if (ttyn == NULL || *ttyn == '\0') { (void)snprintf(tname, sizeof(tname), "%s??", _PATH_TTY); *************** *** 231,236 **** --- 247,253 ---- } (void)strcpy(tbuf, username); + done_chroot: if (pwd = getpwnam(username)) salt = pwd->pw_passwd; else *************** *** 243,248 **** --- 260,292 ---- * authenticate. */ if (pwd) { + /* + * If the group for this user is group "chroot" + * then an attempt will be made to chroot to the + * directory given as the home directory. + * The passwd database will then be closed and + * reopenned, giving the user the option to + * match the passwd in the passwd database in the + * chroot environment. + * + * Side effect: accidentally matching the name + * of a chroot user, when you are not a chroot user + * will spam your later passwd tries, as it will + * be done against the wrong database. + * (unless using yp) + */ + if (have_chroot_gid && (chroot_gid == pwd->pw_gid)) { + if (chroot(pwd->pw_dir)) { + fprintf(stderr, "Bad chroot base\n"); + exit(errno); + } + /* Don't do this twice */ + have_chroot_gid = 0; + /* use the new database next time*/ + endpwent(); + pwd = NULL; + goto done_chroot; + } if (pwd->pw_uid == 0) rootlogin = 1; note that I could do with makingthis match the syntax of wuftpd for the same thing.. julian From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 01:46:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA13319 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 01:46:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA13201 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 01:43:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id KAA03309; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 10:40:56 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA11886; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 10:40:44 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id KAA10663; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 10:39:42 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602080939.KAA10663@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: ppp in background anyone To: mnewton@io.org (Malcolm Newton) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 10:39:41 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602080453.XAA24301@io.org> from "Malcolm Newton" at Feb 7, 96 11:53:01 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Malcolm Newton wrote: > > I have ppp connected to an ISDN line and it runs good. But I can't get it run > in background it seems to terminate and won't attach the line to tun0. > any ideas ???????? ppp -auto or ppp -dedicated -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 02:30:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA14631 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 02:30:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA14575 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 02:28:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id KAA03140; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 10:36:29 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id KAA11856; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 10:36:28 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id KAA10290; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 10:27:00 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602080927.KAA10290@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: pwd_mkdb question To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org (FreeBSD hackers) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 10:27:00 +0100 (MET) Cc: archie@tribe.com (Archie Cobbs) Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602080022.QAA04064@bubba.tribe.com> from "Archie Cobbs" at Feb 7, 96 04:22:17 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Archie Cobbs wrote: > So is there some reason why UID's are limited to 16 bits here? > I have a need for big UID's ... (don't ask :-) The warning should remain, but become non-fatal. The only reason i could think of are braindead archive formats (tar, cpio ?), and situations where you have to YP-serve more limited hosts in a network. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 04:00:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA18277 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 04:00:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA18272 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 04:00:15 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id HAA29813; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 07:04:24 -0500 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199602081204.HAA29813@hda.com> Subject: Re: Is there a FreeBSD automounter? To: imp@village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 07:04:23 -0500 (EST) Cc: daveh@ntanet.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602080422.VAA11483@rover.village.org> from "Warner Losh" at Feb 7, 96 09:22:40 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > : well, maybe its just me, but > : actually having several cdroms mounted at once > : on this machine causes instability. > > I've had no problems here, but maybe there is something wrong with the > drivers/kernel that you are using. I'm using 2.0R, and it seems stable > enough... Maybe 2.1R or -current has some flakiness in it that I > wouldn't be seeing... > > Warner I think 2.0R and 2.1R has the bug - are you using all 7 drives? Bruce submitted a patch to fix the problem and it is committed to the recent kernels in -stable and -current. If you have this in cd.c: > if(cd->dkunit > 0) { you have the bug. I tested it out with this: if(cd->dkunit >= 0) { dk_xfer[cd->dkunit]++; dk_seek[cd->dkunit]++; /* don't know */ dk_wds[cd->dkunit] += bp->b_bcount >> 6; } #if defined(SCSI_CDBUG_NOISE) else if (cd->dkunit) { printf("cd: Would have clobberred the kernel.\n"); } #endif Set SCSI_CDBUG_NOISE and you'll see how often you are trashing things. -- Peter Dufault Real-Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 04:35:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA19390 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 04:35:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from shell.monmouth.com (festremera@shell.monmouth.com [205.164.220.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA19385 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 04:35:45 -0800 (PST) Received: (from festremera@localhost) by shell.monmouth.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id HAA16043 for hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 07:33:05 -0500 From: Frank J Estremera Message-Id: <199602081233.HAA16043@shell.monmouth.com> Subject: Confused!!!! To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 07:33:04 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I am so confused as to how to boot FreeBSD from a boot manager, while on a second drive. I have an internal IDE drive running Windows95. I also have a secondary SCSI drive (device 0), totally devoted to FreeBSD. I do have FreeBSD loaded on it, but when I installed FreeBSD, and selected BootEasy as the boot manager, The operating system could not be found when booting to Windows95 (primary drive). I deinstalled BootEasy and installed System Commander as my boot manager. It recognized the SCSI drive as having FreeBSD loaded on it, but when selected, System Commander tells me that the boot block is missing on this device. The only way that I can boot FreeBSD is to insert the install diskette in the A drive, boot from it, and when the BOOT prompt appears, pointing it to hd(1,a)/kernel (I think). Just for laughs I did a disklabel -B sd0 to maybe try to force a boot block on the SCSI device, but to no avail (unless I am totally out in left field, which is likely). What am I missing??? Why is my operating system under Windows95 being clobbered?? (I then have to do an fdisk from diskette to activate my C: partition again). Please shine a flashlight on my face and enlighten me! Frank From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 06:17:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA22375 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 06:17:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from sovcom.kiae.su (sovcom.kiae.su [144.206.136.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA22358 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 06:16:32 -0800 (PST) Received: by sovcom.kiae.su id AA23427 (5.65.kiae-1 ); Thu, 8 Feb 1996 17:06:39 +0300 Received: by sovcom.KIAE.su (UUMAIL/2.0); Thu, 8 Feb 96 17:06:39 +0300 Received: (from ache@localhost) by ache.dialup.ru (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA02600; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 16:46:36 +0300 (MSK) To: Kai.Vorma@hut.fi, "Justin T. Gibbs" Cc: hackers@freebsd.org References: <199602071713.JAA12581@freefall.freebsd.org> In-Reply-To: <199602071713.JAA12581@freefall.freebsd.org>; from "Justin T. Gibbs" at Wed, 07 Feb 1996 09:13:27 -0800 Message-Id: Organization: Olahm Ha-Yetzirah Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 16:46:36 +0300 (MSK) X-Mailer: Mail/@ [v2.42 FreeBSD] From: =?KOI8-R?Q?=E1=CE=C4=D2=C5=CA_=FE=C5=D2=CE=CF=D7?= (aka Andrey A. Chernov, Black Mage) X-Class: Fast Subject: Re: Sup server at nic.funet.fi Lines: 27 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message <199602071713.JAA12581@freefall.freebsd.org> Justin T. Gibbs writes: >> >> > Could you please update it at least 3 times? Due to interference >> > with sleep period I forced to wait much more than 12h for >> > next update :-( >> >>Mirroring freefall too often generates heavy load because of the sup >>protocol. I think I could arrange things so that -stable is mirrored >>once a day and -current more often, but just now I don't have to time >>to do anything (the whole supping system at nic needs some minor >>modifications). >Do you not have sufficient disk space to mirror the cvs tree? >Then you could simply run a CVS update on the two areas >instead of impacting Freefall with two separate SUPs. Times becomes broken using this method and I can't change SUP server as result (in case when somewhat happens with nic) without time-consuming updates on each file. -- Andrey A. Chernov : And I rest so composedly, /Now, in my bed, ache@astral.msk.su : That any beholder /Might fancy me dead - http://dt.demos.su/~ache : Might start at beholding me, /Thinking me dead. RELCOM Team,FreeBSD Team : E.A.Poe From "For Annie" 1849 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 06:50:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA23329 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 06:50:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA23323 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 06:50:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tkXgB-0003w4C; Thu, 8 Feb 96 06:50 PST Received: from localhost.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA00449; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 15:50:34 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost.tfs.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Julian Elischer cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CHROOT changes to login. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 08 Feb 1996 01:27:08 PST." <199602080927.BAA12401@freefall.freebsd.org> Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 15:50:34 +0100 Message-ID: <447.823791034@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > these are the changes (appropriatly updated) that I used to use > to produce the chroot environments for ref in the old 386BSD days. > I plan to start doing this again so I'd like to see this made standard > I believe it's useful. Could we also add a bit of code such that if the logname entered isn't in the primary /etc/passwd, but the special userid "*chroot" (or similar) is, then the chroot /etc/passwd will be consulted ? I would hate to have all the users in the primary /etc/passwd too. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 06:53:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA23470 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 06:53:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA23464 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 06:53:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tkXjD-0003w4C; Thu, 8 Feb 96 06:53 PST Received: from localhost.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA00473; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 15:53:42 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost.tfs.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Julian Elischer cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: TERRY patches.. In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Feb 1996 03:18:02 PST." <199602071118.DAA00521@ref.tfs.com> Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 15:53:42 +0100 Message-ID: <471.823791222@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > I like the namei/lookup addition of the EXCLUDE > flag. Seems good to me.. the moving of some functionality from filesystems > to common code is a good idea. yes, I like this part. > The reworking of mount() is ingenious, but I think we should not > impliment much of it. agree. > I think 'cosmetic reworks' should be avoided, as it tends to: > 1/ make it harder to merge/compare code > 2/ obfuscate the real nature of the change. agree. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 07:52:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA26330 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 07:52:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from brasil.moneng.mei.com (brasil.moneng.mei.com [151.186.109.160]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA26319 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 07:52:15 -0800 (PST) Received: (from jgreco@localhost) by brasil.moneng.mei.com (8.7.Beta.1/8.7.Beta.1) id JAA20762; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:50:48 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199602081550.JAA20762@brasil.moneng.mei.com> Subject: Re: load balancing modems / mslip To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:50:48 -0600 (CST) Cc: peters@staidan.qld.edu.au, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602080119.SAA06975@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 7, 96 06:19:49 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > You may remember a thread a few weeks ago about load balancing ppp / > > slip across two modems. > > > > Someone said that netbsd had mslip for just this purpose. I've been > > looking ever since. The only replies I get from the netbsd lists are > > things like "Gee that sounds great, give me a copy when you get it > > working". > [ ... ] > > Any ideas / info? > > ftp.bsd.com Actually, ftp://ftp.bsdi.com/contrib/networking/slip/bsdi_mslip.tar.gz "Gee, that sounds great, give me a copy when you get it working." 8-) ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/546-7968 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 08:14:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA27434 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 08:14:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA27423 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 08:14:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA14587; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:11:52 -0700 Message-Id: <199602081611.JAA14587@rover.village.org> To: Peter Dufault Subject: Re: Is there a FreeBSD automounter? Cc: daveh@ntanet.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Thu, 08 Feb 1996 07:04:23 EST Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 09:11:52 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : I think 2.0R and 2.1R has the bug - are you using all 7 drives? Yes. : Bruce submitted a patch to fix the problem and it is committed to : the recent kernels in -stable and -current. If you have this in : cd.c: : > if(cd->dkunit > 0) { : you have the bug. I tested it out with this: : : if(cd->dkunit >= 0) { I've applied this one, after reading about it here. There were some other patches to get the driver to probe all the LUNs as well. : Set SCSI_CDBUG_NOISE and you'll see how often you are trashing things. I'll have to do that... I have a second scsi disk that has been going nuts. newfs, create 5M of files, delete some of the, umount, fsck then yields 40K of output :-(. However, this disk has a colorful history in the other machine it was in (an NT box that I had to reinstall NT on twice).... Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 09:19:10 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA02177 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:19:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA02168 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:19:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <14731(4)>; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:18:24 PST Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177478>; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:18:17 -0800 To: "Matthew N. Dodd" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD Lounge In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 07 Feb 96 18:09:03 PST." Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:18:12 PST From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <96Feb8.091817pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message you write: >I'm not >sure if MCI offers an mbone connection to their customers but if they >do, I should probably talk to them. They do. Email mbone@mci.net . Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 09:30:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA02958 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:30:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (rocky.sri.MT.net [204.182.243.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA02952 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:30:21 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id KAA10480; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 10:32:49 -0700 Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 10:32:49 -0700 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199602081732.KAA10480@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: "Peter Stubbs" Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: load balancing modems / mslip In-Reply-To: <4DE116C490F@aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au> References: <4DE116C490F@aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > You may remember a thread a few weeks ago about load balancing ppp / > slip across two modems. > > Someone said that netbsd had mslip for just this purpose It was BSDi that was mentioned, or at least intended. > I did find an MSLiP for Stochastic Linear Programming, but that's not > what we want! ftp.bsdi.com Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 12:46:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA25611 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 12:46:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from clem.systemsix.com (clem.systemsix.com [198.99.86.131]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA25600 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 12:46:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clem.systemsix.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA29570 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 13:46:01 -0700 Message-Id: <199602082046.NAA29570@clem.systemsix.com> X-Authentication-Warning: clem.systemsix.com: Host localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 From: Steve Passe To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: 2.2-960130-SNAP on ftp://ftp.freebsd.org/pub/FreeBSD Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 13:45:57 -0700 Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hi, >> o For some reason which I'm still tracking down, /usr/libexec/telnetd and >> possibly other binaries are missing from the bin distribution. > >telnet and libtelnet are also missing, as has been pointed out by a >user of my private 2.2-SNAP CDROM. Comparing against 2.1.0-RELEASE, I found these files to be missing from 2.2-960130-SNAP: /bin: ed red /usr/bin: telnet yppush /usr/sbin: /usr/lib: libtelnet.a libtelnet.so.2.0 libtelnet_p.a /usr/libexec: telnetd ypxfr Question: I have found that trying to run a 2.1.0 shared executable results in: ld.so fail Can a group of .so files from 2.1.0 be installed on 2.2 to overcome this (as with compat20) or must all shared execs be rebuilt? -- Steve Passe | powered by smp@csn.net | FreeBSD From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 13:03:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA26964 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 13:03:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from unix.stylo.it ([194.21.207.250]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA26948 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 13:02:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from trust.stylo.it (trust.stylo.it [194.21.207.253]) by unix.stylo.it (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA05016 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 21:56:33 +0100 Received: by trust.stylo.it with NT SMTP Gateway ver 31 id <311A627C@trust.stylo.it>; Thu, 08 Feb 96 21:52:12 W From: Angelo Turetta To: freebsd-hackers Subject: IPFW Accounting problem (Yes, again.....) Date: Thu, 08 Feb 96 21:51:00 W Message-ID: <311A627C@trust.stylo.it> Encoding: 162 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Well, it's my third attempt on the lists with this subject, I hope this time someone will try to understand what my problem actually is. I'm running 2.0.5R as a router, linking the company LAN to the internet via a dedicated ppp V34 connection (BTW, thanks to Doug Rabson, I've compiled the -current version of IIJPPP and it hangs no more on heavy outgoing traffic: all 2.0.5 users should update their ppp). I'm trying to use ipfw accounting capabilities to monitor the line usage by workstation, but every time I try to manipulate the rules, I get the infamous: ipfw: setsockopt failed. (I remember someone suggested adding some more diagnostic output to error messages, I agree :-) No matter what command, I tried 'ipfw f', 'ipfw adda bidirectional all from 0/0 to 0/0 via 194.21.207.250', and others without any luck: only 'ipfw l' works :-( Joe Greco confirmed that he got accounting to work on 2.0.5R, so there must be some option missing (or conflicting) in my kernel configuration. Anyone can please look at it, and maybe help me make some sense out of this? =======================================================START OF CONFIG # # GENERIC -- Generic machine with WD/AHx/NCR/BTx family disks # # GENERIC,v 1.45.2.3 1995/06/05 21:50:41 jkh Exp # machine "i386" cpu "I386_CPU" #cpu "I486_CPU" #cpu "I586_CPU" ident STYLO maxusers 10 options MATH_EMULATE #Support for x87 emulation options INET #InterNETworking options FFS #Berkeley Fast Filesystem options NFS #Network Filesystem options MSDOSFS #MSDOS Filesystem options "CD9660" #ISO 9660 Filesystem options PROCFS #Process filesystem options "COMPAT_43" #Compatible with BSD 4.3 options "SCSI_DELAY=15" #Be pessimistic about Joe SCSI device #options BOUNCE_BUFFERS #include support for DMA bounce buffers options UCONSOLE #Allow users to grab the console options GATEWAY options IPFIREWALL #firewall options IPFIREWALL_VERBOSE #..... options IPACCT #Accounting config kernel root on wd0 controller isa0 #controller pci0 controller fdc0 at isa? port "IO_FD1" bio irq 6 drq 2 vector fdintr disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 disk fd1 at fdc0 drive 1 #tape ft0 at fdc0 drive 2 controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 vector wdintr disk wd0 at wdc0 drive 0 disk wd1 at wdc0 drive 1 controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 vector wdintr disk wd2 at wdc1 drive 0 disk wd3 at wdc1 drive 1 #controller ncr0 #controller ahc0 #controller bt0 at isa? port "IO_BT0" bio irq ? vector btintr #controller uha0 at isa? port "IO_UHA0" bio irq ? drq 5 vector uhaintr #controller ahc1 at isa? bio irq ? vector ahcintr #controller ahb0 at isa? bio irq ? vector ahbintr #controller aha0 at isa? port "IO_AHA0" bio irq ? drq 5 vector ahaintr controller aic0 at isa? port 0x340 bio irq 11 vector aicintr #controller nca0 at isa? port 0x1f88 bio irq 10 vector ncaintr #controller nca1 at isa? port 0x350 bio irq 5 vector ncaintr #controller sea0 at isa? bio irq 5 iomem 0xc8000 iosiz 0x2000 vector seaintr controller scbus0 device sd0 device st0 device cd0 #Only need one of these, the code dynamically grows #device wt0 at isa? port 0x300 bio irq 5 drq 1 vector wtintr #device mcd0 at isa? port 0x300 bio irq 10 vector mcdintr #device mcd1 at isa? port 0x340 bio irq 11 vector mcdintr #controller matcd0 at isa? port ? bio #device scd0 at isa? port 0x230 bio # syscons is the default console driver, resembling an SCO console device sc0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector scintr # Enable this and PCVT_FREEBSD for pcvt vt220 compatible console driver #device vt0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector pcrint #options "PCVT_FREEBSD=210" # pcvt running on FreeBSD 2.1 #options XSERVER # include code for XFree86 device npx0 at isa? port "IO_NPX" irq 13 vector npxintr device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" tty irq 4 vector siointr device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 vector siointr device sio2 at isa? port "IO_COM3" tty irq 10 vector siointr device sio3 at isa? port "IO_COM4" tty irq 9 vector siointr device lpt0 at isa? port? tty irq 7 vector lptintr #device lpt1 at isa? port? tty #device lpt2 at isa? port? tty # Order is important here due to intrusive probes, do *not* alphabetize # this list of network interfaces until the probes have been fixed. # Right now it appears that the ie0 must be probed before ep0. See # revision 1.20 of this file. #device de0 #device ed0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr device ed1 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr #device ie0 at isa? port 0x360 net irq 7 iomem 0xd0000 vector ieintr #device ep0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 vector epintr #device ix0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 iomem 0xd0000 iosiz 32768 vector ixintr #device le0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd0000 vector le_intr #device lnc0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 10 drq 0 vector lncintr #device lnc1 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 drq 0 vector lncintr #device ze0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector zeintr #device zp0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 iomem 0xd8000 vector zpintr pseudo-device loop pseudo-device ether pseudo-device log pseudo-device sl 1 # ijppp uses tun instead of ppp device pseudo-device ppp 1 pseudo-device tun 2 pseudo-device pty 16 pseudo-device gzip # Exec gzipped a.out's pseudo-device bpfilter 1 #Berkeley packet filter ======================================================= END OF CONFIG Thanks in advance. Angelo. ----------------------------------------------------------------- Angelo Turetta Stylo Multimedia - http:\\www.stylo.it mailto:aturetta@stylo.it From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 13:34:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA00122 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 13:34:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from data.nas.nasa.gov (data.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.23.20]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA00115 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 13:34:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from gizmo.nas.nasa.gov (gizmo.nas.nasa.gov [129.99.36.13]) by data.nas.nasa.gov (8.6.12/NAS.5.b) with SMTP id NAA25866; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 13:34:45 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: data.nas.nasa.gov: Host gizmo.nas.nasa.gov didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6 4/21/95 To: Scott Mace Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: truesdel@nas.nasa.gov Subject: Re: HP PCL printers... In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 08 Feb 1996 00:46:46 CST." <199602080646.AAA15878@metal.ops.neosoft.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 13:34:44 -0800 Message-ID: <10497.823815284@nas.nasa.gov> From: Dave Truesdell Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk -- Your message was: (from "Scott Mace") Does anyone have a handy set of commands that will allow me to output various file tyes (plaintext and PS) in HP PCL3 format? I've got a client that has a HP 855C and it speaks only HP PCL3 Scott -- End of Message For my 600C at home, I use a combination of a modified version of apsfilter and ghostscript-3.51. I get some great results printing both text and color. I don't have my patches to apsfilter available at the moment, but I needed to work around problems the filter had trying to "rewind" stdin on my 2.1-stable system. T.T.F.N., Dave Truesdell Wombat Wrestler/Software Packrat/Baby Wrangler/Newsmaster (truesdel@nas.nasa.gov) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 14:15:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA03105 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 14:15:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from zip0.zipnet.net (root@zip0.zipnet.net [204.176.87.20]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA03100 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 14:15:15 -0800 (PST) Received: (from ejon@localhost) by zip0.zipnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA00401; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 17:15:03 -0500 From: Eric Jones Message-Id: <199602082215.RAA00401@zip0.zipnet.net> Subject: vm problem in 2.1-stable To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 17:15:03 -0500 (EST) Cc: wink@zip0.zipnet.net (Jim Winkleman), ejon@zip0.zipnet.net (Eric Jones) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Dear Cognosenti, I'm running a 2.1-stable system taken from the tree on or about December 6, and have had a perplexing crash. I'm wondering if this sounds familiar to anybody and whether it's a known (and hopefully fixed!) bug. A user (unprivileged) was running mail (yes, /usr/bin/mail). When he exited, the process hung in a vmopar state. At approximatly the same time a message was logged to /var/log/messages which said: /kernel: biodone: buffer already done Some hours later (the process was still hung) the same user attempted to invoke mail again. This brought on a system panic, which logged the message: /kernel: panic: vinvalbuf: flush failed Unfortunately, I don't have a dump to do a postmortem on. If it happens again, I will. Any and all suggestions are welcome. Please send them to ejon@zipnet.net, as I'm currently too mobile to subscribe to ANY mailing lists. Also please cc: wink@tiac.net as he is definitely interested in the outcome of discussions. Thanks, Eric From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 14:18:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA03482 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 14:18:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (schizo.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.32]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA03477 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 14:18:48 -0800 (PST) Received: (from mrcpu@localhost) by schizo.cdsnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA11838; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 14:19:46 -0800 Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 14:19:46 -0800 (PST) From: Jaye Mathisen To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: 3com weirdness. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Unfortunately I have been unable to follow the last couple weeks of hackers mail, due to time constraints. However, I have a box with -stable as of about the 3 of Feb, and I'm having a problem with the 3com 3c509B-TP just freezing up in it for no apparent reason. There was some mention of some changes to the driver, but didn't see if there was a resolution. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 15:04:48 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA05730 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 15:04:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from seraglio.staidan.qld.edu.au (staidans.client.uq.edu.au [130.102.39.106]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA05725 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 15:04:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au (aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au [203.12.39.2]) by seraglio.staidan.qld.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id JAA22049 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:04:47 +1000 Received: from AIDAN/SpoolDir by aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au (Mercury 1.21); 9 Feb 96 09:04:47 -1000 Received: from SpoolDir by AIDAN (Mercury 1.21); 9 Feb 96 09:04:38 -1000 From: "Peter Stubbs" Organization: St Aidan's A.G.S. To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:04:31 -1000 Subject: Re: load balancing modems / mslip Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Message-ID: <4F5B1466581@aidan.staidan.qld.edu.au> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Thanks for the info. I've got a copy. It boasts that it'll do 24 modems at a time. Wow! Now to make it all work. > > > > ftp.bsd.com > > Actually, > ftp://ftp.bsdi.com/contrib/networking/slip/bsdi_mslip.tar.gz > Strange archie.au didn't find this, it has an Aus mirror. Thanks, Peter Peter Stubbs, St Aidan's AGS. ph +61-07-3379-9911, fax +61-07-3379-9432 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 15:20:30 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA06703 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 15:20:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (root@linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.34]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA06694 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 15:20:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from uni4nn.iaf.nl (root@uni4nn.iaf.nl [193.67.144.33]) by linux4nn.gn.iaf.nl (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id AAA18726; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 00:20:00 +0100 Received: by uni4nn.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA00646 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Fri, 9 Feb 1996 00:19:08 +0100 Received: by iafnl.es.iaf.nl with UUCP id AA30802 (5.67b/IDA-1.5); Thu, 8 Feb 1996 23:34:28 +0100 Received: (from wilko@localhost) by yedi.iaf.nl (8.6.12/8.6.6) id TAA00724; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 19:15:45 +0100 From: Wilko Bulte Message-Id: <199602081815.TAA00724@yedi.iaf.nl> X-Organisation: Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands Subject: Re: Hackers ages To: jmacd@CS.Berkeley.EDU (Josh MacDonald) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 19:15:45 +0100 (MET) Cc: hasty@rah.star-gate.com, winter@jurai.net, lists@argus.flash.net, imp@village.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, jmacd@paris.CS.Berkeley.EDU In-Reply-To: <199602080524.VAA10725@paris.CS.Berkeley.EDU> from "Josh MacDonald" at Feb 7, 96 09:24:18 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > >>> "Matthew N. Dodd" said: > > > On Thu, 1 Feb 1996, mailing list account wrote: > > > > Just blew the curve: 28 - 1 month... > > > > > > 20. Beat that. :) > > > > Isn't illegal in California for people younger than 21 to be hacking ? 8) > > > > Amancio > > You're just jealous -- 20 years and in CA. But only if you live near Venice Beach 8-) Wilko _ __________________________________________________________________________ | / o / / _ Wilko Bulte email: wilko@yedi.iaf.nl |/|/ / / /( (_) Private FreeBSD site - Arnhem - The Netherlands -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 15:51:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA09675 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 15:51:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA09649 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 15:51:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id AAA04933; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 00:51:18 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id AAA20092; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 00:51:17 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id AAA12984; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 00:47:47 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602082347.AAA12984@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: HP PCL printers... To: smace@metal.neosoft.com (Scott Mace) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 00:47:47 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602080646.AAA15878@metal.ops.neosoft.com> from "Scott Mace" at Feb 8, 96 00:46:46 am X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Scott Mace wrote: > > Does anyone have a handy set of commands that will allow me > to output various file tyes (plaintext and PS) in HP PCL3 > format? I've got a client that has a HP 855C and it speaks > only HP PCL3 Run ghostscript as a filter. Use apsfilter (or a2ps) to make the plaintext -> PS conversion. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 16:05:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA10792 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 16:05:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA10787 Thu, 8 Feb 1996 16:05:53 -0800 (PST) Received: by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) Message-Id: From: julian@TFS.COM (Julian Elischer) Subject: Re: CHROOT changes to login. To: phk@critter.tfs.com (Poul-Henning Kamp) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 16:05:51 -0800 (PST) Cc: julian@TFS.COM, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <447.823791034@critter.tfs.com> from "Poul-Henning Kamp" at Feb 8, 96 03:50:34 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > > these are the changes (appropriatly updated) that I used to use > > to produce the chroot environments for ref in the old 386BSD days. > > I plan to start doing this again so I'd like to see this made standard > > I believe it's useful. > > Could we also add a bit of code such that if the logname entered isn't > in the primary /etc/passwd, but the special userid "*chroot" (or similar) > is, then the chroot /etc/passwd will be consulted ? > > I would hate to have all the users in the primary /etc/passwd too. not a bad idea, but if you ever type your name wrong, you've had it.. you'll be redirected to the chroot area.. And the nature if that is that you can't get back. Actually I DO have a way of doing this I think chroot("../../../../../../.."); should chroot you back to /, as at this time the CWD has not been changed yet.. I guess if you type the name wrong, and it can't find it in the chroot database, it chroots back to / again? hmmmm The individual users in this scheme can have their OWN chroot areas. (maybe there needs to be a 'root' specified in /etc/group instead?) Login: julian Password: xyzzy [logged in to julian's chroot area] This pre-empts you from having a login in the non-chroot area however. If you want to have both a chroot login and a non chroot login you need to do: Login: chroot ( or some login that has a chroot setup) Passord: > -- > Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. > http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. > whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. > Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 16:17:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA11523 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 16:17:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from kachina.jetcafe.org (kachina.jetcafe.org [206.117.70.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA11518 Thu, 8 Feb 1996 16:17:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] ([127.0.0.1]) by kachina.jetcafe.org (8.6.10/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA28871; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 16:17:09 -0800 Message-Id: <199602090017.QAA28871@kachina.jetcafe.org> To: questions@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Exabyte EXB-2501 Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 16:17:08 -0800 From: Dave Hayes Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I take it that there is no support for this beast? I'm running 2.1 release on a Pent 100. Here's pertinent information about the drive: /kernel: (ahc0:2:0): "EXABYTE EXB-2501 2400" type 1 removable SCSI 2 /kernel: st0(ahc0:2:0): Sequential-Access density code 0x92, drive empty When I do: $ tar cf /dev/nrst0 . I get: /kernel: st0(ahc0:2:0): ILLEGAL REQUEST asc:26,0 Invalid field in parameter list /kernel: st0: Cannot set selected mode /kernel: st0: bad request, must be between 512 and 1024 What gives? Can anyone help? ------ >>> Dave Hayes - Altadena CA, USA - dave@jetcafe.org <<< It's easier to agree to do better tomorrow than to do your best today. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 18:06:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA19705 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 18:06:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA19699 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 18:06:21 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id TAA09246; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 19:04:02 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602090204.TAA09246@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: CHROOT changes to login. To: julian@TFS.COM (Julian Elischer) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 19:04:02 -0700 (MST) Cc: phk@critter.tfs.com, julian@TFS.COM, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Julian Elischer" at Feb 8, 96 04:05:51 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > not a bad idea, but if you ever type your name wrong, you've had it.. > you'll be redirected to the chroot area.. And the nature if that is that you > can't get back. Actually I DO have a way of doing this I think > chroot("../../../../../../.."); > should chroot you back to /, as at > this time the CWD has not been changed yet.. Open the "/" dir and use fchdir on the fd. Then chroot( ".") (relative). Actually, there are some bogons in the vfs_lookup code relative to the chrooted directory. The namei really wants a relative root in the structure instead of pulling the thing from the proc structure directly. Specifically, if you lookup a / path for a traversed mountpoint from /... it's grungy code. But the above should work, for now at least. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 19:13:34 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA23084 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 19:13:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from cocoa.ops.neosoft.com (root@cocoa.ops.neosoft.com [206.109.5.227]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA23077 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 19:13:31 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dbaker@localhost) by cocoa.ops.neosoft.com (8.7.3/8.6.12) id VAA01863; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 21:13:18 -0600 (CST) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 21:13:17 -0600 (CST) From: Daniel Baker X-Sender: dbaker@cocoa.ops.neosoft.com To: Sujal Patel cc: willows@throck.com, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Emulated x86 - FreeBSD Willows Twin Running In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk What exactly is the .tgz or whatever file named? I got registration to the server and apparently I download the wrong file, as I got windows-1.4.6.tgz which is like just windows programs and stuff? Daniel -- Daniel Baker - Daniel@Cuckoo.COM "Huhuhu, thank you, drive through please" From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 20:03:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA26385 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 20:03:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from anacreon.sol.net (anacreon.sol.net [206.55.64.116]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA26378 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 20:03:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from solaria.sol.net (solaria.sol.net [206.55.65.75]) by anacreon.sol.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id WAA19231; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 22:03:13 -0600 Received: from localhost by solaria.sol.net (8.5/8.5) id WAA11721; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 22:04:22 -0600 From: Joe Greco Message-Id: <199602090404.WAA11721@solaria.sol.net> Subject: Re: IPFW Accounting problem (Yes, again.....) To: turetta@stylo.it (Angelo Turetta) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 96 22:04:20 CST Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Angelo Turetta" at Feb 8, 96 09:53:54 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4dev PL65] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > Well, it's my third attempt on the lists with this subject, I hope this time > someone will try to understand what my problem actually is. > > I'm running 2.0.5R as a router, linking the company LAN to the internet via > a dedicated ppp V34 connection (BTW, thanks to Doug Rabson, I've compiled > the -current version of IIJPPP and it hangs no more on heavy outgoing > traffic: all 2.0.5 users should update their ppp). > > I'm trying to use ipfw accounting capabilities to monitor the line usage by > workstation, but every time I try to manipulate the rules, I get the > infamous: > > ipfw: setsockopt failed. > > (I remember someone suggested adding some more diagnostic output to error > messages, I agree :-) > No matter what command, I tried 'ipfw f', 'ipfw adda bidirectional all from > 0/0 to 0/0 via 194.21.207.250', and others without any luck: only 'ipfw l' > works :-( > > Joe Greco confirmed that he got accounting to work on 2.0.5R, so there must > be some option missing (or conflicting) in my kernel configuration. > Anyone can please look at it, and maybe help me make some sense out of this? Your configuration looked OK to me. The following is what I am using on gateway.inr.sol.net: --------------------------------------------------------------- # # ROUTER_ET -- Generic machine with WD/AHx/NCR/BTx family disks # # ROUTER_ET,v 1.45.2.3 1995/06/05 21:50:41 jkh Exp # machine "i386" cpu "I386_CPU" cpu "I486_CPU" cpu "I586_CPU" ident "ROUTER_ET" maxusers 16 options MATH_EMULATE #Support for x87 emulation options INET #InterNETworking options FFS #Berkeley Fast Filesystem options NFS #Network Filesystem #options MSDOSFS #MSDOS Filesystem #options "CD9660" #ISO 9660 Filesystem options PROCFS #Process filesystem options "COMPAT_43" #Compatible with BSD 4.3 options "SCSI_DELAY=15" #Be pessimistic about Joe SCSI device options BOUNCE_BUFFERS #include support for DMA bounce buffers options UCONSOLE #Allow users to grab the console options GATEWAY #internetwork gateway options MROUTING # Multicast routing options IPFIREWALL #firewall options IPACCT #ipaccounting config kernel root on wd0 controller isa0 controller pci0 controller fdc0 at isa? port "IO_FD1" bio irq 6 drq 2 vector fdintr disk fd0 at fdc0 drive 0 disk fd1 at fdc0 drive 1 #tape ft0 at fdc0 drive 2 controller wdc0 at isa? port "IO_WD1" bio irq 14 vector wdintr disk wd0 at wdc0 drive 0 #disk wd1 at wdc0 drive 1 #controller wdc1 at isa? port "IO_WD2" bio irq 15 vector wdintr #disk wd2 at wdc1 drive 0 #disk wd3 at wdc1 drive 1 #controller ncr0 #controller ahc0 #controller bt0 at isa? port "IO_BT0" bio irq ? vector btintr #controller uha0 at isa? port "IO_UHA0" bio irq ? drq 5 vector uhaintr #controller ahc1 at isa? bio irq ? vector ahcintr #controller ahb0 at isa? bio irq ? vector ahbintr #controller aha0 at isa? port "IO_AHA0" bio irq ? drq 5 vector ahaintr #controller aic0 at isa? port 0x340 bio irq 11 vector aicintr #controller nca0 at isa? port 0x1f88 bio irq 10 vector ncaintr #controller nca1 at isa? port 0x350 bio irq 5 vector ncaintr #controller sea0 at isa? bio irq 5 iomem 0xc8000 iosiz 0x2000 vector seaintr #controller scbus0 #device sd0 #device st0 #device cd0 #Only need one of these, the code dynamically grows #device wt0 at isa? port 0x300 bio irq 5 drq 1 vector wtintr #device mcd0 at isa? port 0x300 bio irq 10 vector mcdintr #device mcd1 at isa? port 0x340 bio irq 11 vector mcdintr #controller matcd0 at isa? port ? bio #device scd0 at isa? port 0x230 bio # syscons is the default console driver, resembling an SCO console device sc0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector scintr # Enable this and PCVT_FREEBSD for pcvt vt220 compatible console driver #device vt0 at isa? port "IO_KBD" tty irq 1 vector pcrint #options "PCVT_FREEBSD=210" # pcvt running on FreeBSD 2.1 #options XSERVER # include code for XFree86 device npx0 at isa? port "IO_NPX" irq 13 vector npxintr device sio0 at isa? port "IO_COM1" tty irq 4 vector siointr device sio1 at isa? port "IO_COM2" tty irq 3 vector siointr device sio2 at isa? port "IO_COM3" tty irq 5 vector siointr device sio3 at isa? port "IO_COM4" tty irq 9 vector siointr device lpt0 at isa? port? tty irq 7 vector lptintr device lpt1 at isa? port? tty device lpt2 at isa? port? tty # Order is important here due to intrusive probes, do *not* alphabetize # this list of network interfaces until the probes have been fixed. # Right now it appears that the ie0 must be probed before ep0. See # revision 1.20 of this file. #device de0 device ed0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr device ed1 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr device ed2 at isa? port 0x320 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr device ed3 at isa? port 0x340 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr device ed4 at isa? port 0x360 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector edintr #device ie0 at isa? port 0x360 net irq 7 iomem 0xd0000 vector ieintr device ep0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 vector epintr #device ix0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 iomem 0xd0000 iosiz 32768 vector ixintr #device le0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd0000 vector le_intr #device lnc0 at isa? port 0x280 net irq 10 drq 0 vector lncintr #device lnc1 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 drq 0 vector lncintr #device ze0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 5 iomem 0xd8000 vector zeintr #device zp0 at isa? port 0x300 net irq 10 iomem 0xd8000 vector zpintr device eth0 at isa? port 0x240 net irq 5 iomem 0xd0000 iosiz 0x8000 vector ethintr pseudo-device loop pseudo-device ether pseudo-device log pseudo-device sl 4 # ijppp uses tun instead of ppp device pseudo-device ppp 4 pseudo-device tun 4 pseudo-device bpfilter 16 #Berkeley packet filter pseudo-device pty 16 pseudo-device gzip # Exec gzipped a.out's --------------------------------------------------------------- Note that the "eth0" device is ET's sync serial card. You won't have this driver... other than that, this should be workable for you. ... Joe ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe Greco - Systems Administrator jgreco@ns.sol.net Solaria Public Access UNIX - Milwaukee, WI 414/342-4847 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 20:30:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA27368 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 20:30:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from hp.com (hp.com [15.255.152.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA27361 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 20:30:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from fakir.india.hp.com by hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA202740220; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 20:30:35 -0800 Received: from localhost by fakir.india.hp.com with SMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA168780028; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:57:08 +0530 Message-Id: <199602090427.AA168780028@fakir.india.hp.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: tcpdump / kernel dropping packets Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 09:57:06 +0530 From: A JOSEPH KOSHY Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi, I was testing my network driver and found that `tcpdump' was experiencing a very high packet drop rate. If I run "tcpdump" without the "-n" option, I find (a) the output on screen is `bursty' with long periods of silence (b) at the end of the run tcpdump reports typically 90% of the packets "dropped by kernel". If I run "tcpdump" with the "-n" option (no resolving of IP addresses) it runs with a much smaller loss percentage (but still != 0). I'd like to know if this behaviour is normal or whether there is something wrong with my network setup (read: my driver :)). If normal, what can I do reduce packet loss (eg if FreeBSD is to be the basis for a network analyser tool?). I'm running FreeBSD 2.1.0-R on an 8MB P90 IDE system. The network card is an HPPCLan+ with "if_ed.c" hacked up to support it. The driver is otherwise stable and has been working well for a month now. I'm trying to tune/improve performance at the moment. On this topic, I'd appreciate any pointers on how to measure the effectiveness of ethernet drivers (short of requiring special purpose hardware to be used). I'd like to know if I'm dropping packets, sending out too many packets, munging the network etc. Koshy From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 21:26:45 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA29591 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 21:26:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from ref.tfs.com (ref.tfs.com [140.145.254.251]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA29586 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 21:26:30 -0800 (PST) Received: (from julian@localhost) by ref.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id VAA02802; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 21:23:48 -0800 From: Julian Elischer Message-Id: <199602090523.VAA02802@ref.tfs.com> Subject: Re: tcpdump / kernel dropping packets To: koshy@india.hp.com (A JOSEPH KOSHY) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 21:23:47 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602090427.AA168780028@fakir.india.hp.com> from "A JOSEPH KOSHY" at Feb 9, 96 09:57:06 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > Hi, > > I was testing my network driver and found that `tcpdump' was experiencing > a very high packet drop rate. This is normal > > If I run "tcpdump" without the "-n" option, I find (a) the output on > screen is `bursty' with long periods of silence (b) at the end of the run > tcpdump reports typically 90% of the packets "dropped by kernel". everything backs up while tcpdump is trying to resolve a name that needs to be remotely looked up. > > If I run "tcpdump" with the "-n" option (no resolving of IP addresses) > it runs with a much smaller loss percentage (but still != 0). of course, there are no lookups to do... > > I'd like to know if this behaviour is normal or whether there is something > wrong with my network setup (read: my driver :)). normal. > > If normal, what can I do reduce packet loss (eg if FreeBSD is to be the basis > for a network analyser tool?). > save the packets to disk and analyse them offline. (use tcpdump -w filename and tcpdump -r (options) filename > I'm running FreeBSD 2.1.0-R on an 8MB P90 IDE system. The network card is > an HPPCLan+ with "if_ed.c" hacked up to support it. The driver is otherwise > stable and has been working well for a month now. I'm trying to tune/improve > performance at the moment. it would be better for offline analysis if you used scsi because the heavy use of CPU in IDE might still cause a few lost packets, but hopefully not too many. > > On this topic, I'd appreciate any pointers on how to measure the effectiveness > of ethernet drivers (short of requiring special purpose hardware to be used). > I'd like to know if I'm dropping packets, sending out too many packets, > munging the network etc. > good question... ping a reliable host? > Koshy > From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 21:41:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA00745 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 21:41:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from emout10.mail.aol.com (emout10.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.25]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA00740 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 21:41:18 -0800 (PST) From: StevenR362@aol.com Received: by emout10.mail.aol.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id AAA22011; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 00:38:31 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 00:38:31 -0500 Message-ID: <960209003831_418290599@emout10.mail.aol.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org cc: hosokawa@mt.cs.keio.ac.jp Subject: Re: [PCMCIA] pccard-test 960207 is now available Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In a message dated 96-02-07 12:09:08 EST, hosokawa@mt.cs.keio.ac.jp (HOSOKAWA Tatsumi) writes: >We announce the release newest alpha-test version (960207) of our >"pccard-test" package. Shouldn't somebody be blatting this into CVS along a vendor branch so that revision info is maintained on it. I realize it is alpha code, but it could prove useful to have it under CVS in case a card stops working between 9602xx and 960?xx releases. I assume it will eventually go into the current tree. General CVS questions? (I've never used it :) Is there a way to put something into the CVS repository so that it is readily available but also not part of current? Sorta an experimental or reference only section. It might be good to put the removed CCITT, ISO et al stuff in such a reference section too. Steve From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 21:53:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id VAA01208 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 21:53:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA01202 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 21:53:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id QAA20785; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 16:19:15 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602090549.QAA20785@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: tcpdump / kernel dropping packets To: koshy@india.hp.com (A JOSEPH KOSHY) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 16:19:14 +1030 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602090427.AA168780028@fakir.india.hp.com> from "A JOSEPH KOSHY" at Feb 9, 96 09:57:06 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk A JOSEPH KOSHY stands accused of saying: > > I was testing my network driver and found that `tcpdump' was experiencing > a very high packet drop rate. > > If I run "tcpdump" without the "-n" option, I find (a) the output on > screen is `bursty' with long periods of silence (b) at the end of the run > tcpdump reports typically 90% of the packets "dropped by kernel". Your nameserver is not good. > I'd like to know if this behaviour is normal or whether there is something > wrong with my network setup (read: my driver :)). I can watch pretty busy networks (eg. campus backbone with >500 nodes) with an NE2000-klone without any great problems. (Obviously with '-n') Is the machine doing anything else? 8M and IDE make a very poor combination if the system has to go near the disk. > Koshy -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 22:41:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA02715 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 22:41:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA02705 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 22:41:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id HAA22277 ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:41:43 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id HAA02272 ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:41:42 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.3/keltia-uucp-2.7) id CAA26002; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 02:09:36 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199602090109.CAA26002@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: 3com weirdness. To: mrcpu@cdsnet.net (Jaye Mathisen) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 02:09:36 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from Jaye Mathisen at "Feb 8, 96 02:19:46 pm" X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1630 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL5 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Jaye Mathisen said: > However, I have a box with -stable as of about the 3 of Feb, and I'm > having a problem with the 3com 3c509B-TP just freezing up in it for no > apparent reason. Try "ifconfig ... down" then "ifconfig...up". > There was some mention of some changes to the driver, but didn't see if > there was a resolution. I've been running with a 3com 509B for three weeks without problem although the traffic is low (News mostly). -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #5: Sun Feb 4 03:11:17 MET 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 22:41:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA02722 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 22:41:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA02706 for ; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 22:41:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id HAA22273 ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:41:41 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id HAA02269 ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:41:40 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.3/keltia-uucp-2.7) id CAA25992; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 02:05:11 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199602090105.CAA25992@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: Hackers ages To: winter@jurai.net (Matthew N. Dodd) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 02:05:10 +0100 (MET) Cc: jmacd@CS.Berkeley.EDU, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Matthew N. Dodd" at "Feb 7, 96 11:28:14 pm" X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1630 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL5 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Matthew N. Dodd said: > *sigh* Even if I was still in CA, I'd still be an admin, and we can't > have admin types have any sort of lives now can we. > > Down, not across and all that. |!- You've been readin' alt.sysadmin.recovery too many times :-) -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #5: Sun Feb 4 03:11:17 MET 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Feb 8 23:54:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA05916 for hackers-outgoing; Thu, 8 Feb 1996 23:54:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.1.11]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA05883 Thu, 8 Feb 1996 23:53:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from sax.sax.de by irz301.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.6.12/8.6.12-s1) with ESMTP id IAA17784; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:53:28 +0100 Received: by sax.sax.de (8.6.11/8.6.12-s1) with UUCP id IAA25038; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:53:28 +0100 Received: (from j@localhost) by uriah.heep.sax.de (8.7.3/8.6.9) id IAA15328; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:39:09 +0100 (MET) From: J Wunsch Message-Id: <199602090739.IAA15328@uriah.heep.sax.de> Subject: Re: Exabyte EXB-2501 To: dave@kachina.jetcafe.org (Dave Hayes) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:39:08 +0100 (MET) Cc: questions@freebsd.org, hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de (Joerg Wunsch) In-Reply-To: <199602090017.QAA28871@kachina.jetcafe.org> from "Dave Hayes" at Feb 8, 96 04:17:08 pm X-Phone: +49-351-2012 669 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk As Dave Hayes wrote: > > I take it that there is no support for this beast? I'm running > 2.1 release on a Pent 100. Here's pertinent information about > the drive: > /kernel: st0(ahc0:2:0): ILLEGAL REQUEST asc:26,0 Invalid field in parameter list It's not yet supported. There's something that the EXB-2501 doesn't really like in our tape driver, but i don't know yet _what_ it is. I've got the Exabyte SCSI ref manual on behalf of another FreeBSD user whose drive i wanna get humming. I'll be away here for the weekend, so i can pursue this approximately by end of next week again. Should you find a solution yourself meanwhile, please get back at me. -- cheers, J"org joerg_wunsch@uriah.heep.sax.de -- http://www.sax.de/~joerg/ -- NIC: JW11-RIPE Never trust an operating system you don't have sources for. ;-) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 00:05:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA06374 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 00:05:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA06365 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 00:05:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tknou-0003xYC; Fri, 9 Feb 96 00:04 PST Received: from localhost.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA01208; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:23:58 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost.tfs.com didn't use HELO protocol To: julian@TFS.COM (Julian Elischer) cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CHROOT changes to login. In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 08 Feb 1996 16:05:51 PST." Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 08:23:58 +0100 Message-ID: <1206.823850638@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > Could we also add a bit of code such that if the logname entered isn't > > in the primary /etc/passwd, but the special userid "*chroot" (or similar) > > is, then the chroot /etc/passwd will be consulted ? > > > > I would hate to have all the users in the primary /etc/passwd too. > > not a bad idea, but if you ever type your name wrong, you've had it.. That is perfectly fine for me. I see it as your "chroot" group mode is good for a few chrooted users. My "unknown" mode is good for the majority of users being chrooted. Having both is just added flexibility. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 01:35:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA12604 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 01:35:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.netvision.net.il (mail.NetVision.net.il [194.90.1.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA12591 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 01:34:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from Burka.NetVision.net.il (gena@burka.NetVision.net.il [194.90.6.15]) by mail.netvision.net.il (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA04491; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:29:43 +0200 (IST) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 0.4-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <199602090109.CAA26002@keltia.freenix.fr> Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 11:29:53 +0200 (IST) Reply-To: gena@NetVision.net.il X-Face: #v>4HN>#D_"[olq9y`HqTYkLVB89Xy|3')Vs9v58JQ*u-xEJVKY`xa.}E?z0RkLI/P&;BJmi0#u=W0).-Y'J4(dw{"54NhSG|YYZG@[)(`e! >jN#L!~qI5fE-JHS+< Organization: NetVision Ltd. From: Gennady Sorokopud To: Ollivier Robert Subject: Re: 3com weirdness. Cc: (Jaye Mathisen) , hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hello! I have the same problem with 3C509. On 09-Feb-96 Ollivier Robert wrote: >>It seems that Jaye Mathisen said: >> However, I have a box with -stable as of about the 3 of Feb, and I'm >> having a problem with the 3com 3c509B-TP just freezing up in it for no >> apparent reason. > >Try "ifconfig ... down" then "ifconfig...up". This helps, but unfortunately it happens too often, and i can't do this when i'm at home :-) (my system is at work) > >> There was some mention of some changes to the driver, but didn't see if >> there was a resolution. > >I've been running with a 3com 509B for three weeks without problem although >the traffic is low (News mostly). >-- >Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net > FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #5: Sun Feb 4 03:11:17 MET 1996 -------- Gennady B. Sorokopud - System programmer at NetVision Israel. E-Mail: Gennady Sorokopud Homepage: http://www.netvision.net.il/~gena This message was sent at 02/09/96 11:29:53 by XF-Mail From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 01:37:29 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA12883 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 01:37:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from gw.pascal.org (root@pascal.org [205.149.180.206]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA12869 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 01:37:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from gw.pascal.org (pascal@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gw.pascal.org (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id BAA12183; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 01:37:20 -0800 Message-ID: <311B15CD.41C67EA6@pascal.org> Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 01:37:17 -0800 From: "Freeman P. Pascal IV" Organization: The Pascal Family X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0b6a (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.1.0-RELEASE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: FreeBSD Hackers list CC: chris@janus.druidix.com Subject: Unexplained segfaults in 2.1.0-RELEASE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hello all; I have a client who is running 2.1.0-RELEASE on a Pentium 100 ISA/PCI motherboard with, 16Mb, AHA1542, and Orchid SVGA card. I installed 2.1.0 about three weeks ago and for almost two weeks it's been running just fine using the generic kernel and a custom kernel configured for just the cards that are installed, IPFIREWALL and IPACCT. Around a week ago we started seeing processes dying for no obvious reason via segfault (signal 11). There's no pattern to the processes being affected other than it tends to be processes that exec heavily (ie. inetd, sendmail, make, window managers, etc). I tried switching back to the generic kernel that was originally installed without any effect. Thinking it might be a shared library problme, I tried recompiling and swapping out libc.so.2.2 in /usr/lib - no joy. The machine is currently running continueous memory tests (using amidiag). I'm hoping that it shows a bad SIMM. The tests have been acting a bit flakey, but I'm not sure if it's the motherboard, memory, or just that the diags I'm running were designed for 486 class machines. Has anyone seen this behavior with 2.1.0-RELEASE else where? Currently, the way the machines behaving if I can't fix it I'll have to revert back to 2.0.5 which seems to be more stable (at least on this machine I have 2.1.0 running else where without flaw). Any help would be appreciated. -Freeman -- +------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that | | whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting | | life. | | - John 3:16 (KJV) | +------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | F r e e m a n P. P a s c a l I V | | | | Phone Work: (510) 645-3454 Email Work: pascal@tfs.com | | Home: (510) 215-5742 Home: pascal@pascal.org | | Pager: (800) SKY-PAGE Home page: http://www.pascal.org | | PIN: 419-2250 Amateur Radio: KE6LSS | +------------------------------------------------------------------------+ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 01:39:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA13000 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 01:39:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA12980 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 01:39:30 -0800 (PST) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA28516 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:42:09 +0100 Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:42:09 +0100 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199602090942.KAA28516@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: mail sending problem (how can this happen?) Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On a 2.1R system it just happened to me that after sending a mail which I typed in interactively by typing gil>mail -c Subject: . gil> queuename: Cannot create "qfKAA28419" in "/var/spool/mqueue" (euid=107): Permission denied How can this happen. Writing the mail a second time in the same manner worked ok. Could this be a race condition with incoming mail? In this context another question: A colleague had run in 'political' difficulties in his working group where he got attacked of not having informed some other group members about a certain fact. He was sure he sent them a mail but the receiver claimed he never got the mail. I looked into /var/log/maillog and found that sendmail logged Sent (ok) or something. Is this the absolute proof that the message had been delivered correctly to the receiving system? (The sending system is a 2.1R FreeBSD, the receiving system some other - SGI). --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 01:47:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA13900 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 01:47:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.netvision.net.il (mail.NetVision.net.il [194.90.1.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA13893 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 01:46:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from Burka.NetVision.net.il (gena@burka.NetVision.net.il [194.90.6.15]) by mail.netvision.net.il (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA06185; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:47:00 +0200 (IST) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 0.4-alpha [p0] on FreeBSD Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <1206.823850638@critter.tfs.com> Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 11:44:08 +0200 (IST) Reply-To: gena@NetVision.net.il X-Face: #v>4HN>#D_"[olq9y`HqTYkLVB89Xy|3')Vs9v58JQ*u-xEJVKY`xa.}E?z0RkLI/P&;BJmi0#u=W0).-Y'J4(dw{"54NhSG|YYZG@[)(`e! >jN#L!~qI5fE-JHS+< Organization: NetVision Ltd. From: Gennady Sorokopud To: Poul-Henning Kamp Subject: Re: CHROOT changes to login. Cc: (Julian Elischer) , hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hello! That's how i use chroot in login: if (pwd->pw_uid > 100) { char *new_dir; char *p; if (p =3D strstr(pwd->pw_dir, "/./")) { new_dir =3D p + 2; (void)setenv("HOME", new_dir, 1); =20 *p =3D '\0'; if (chroot(pwd->pw_dir) =3D=3D -1) fprintf(stderr, "WARNING! Failed to chroot to %s! Shell may run in unsecure mode!", pwd->pw_dir); } } IMHO "/./" is very convinient and wu-ftpd uses it too. On 09-Feb-96 Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: >>> > Could we also add a bit of code such that if the logname entered isn't >> > in the primary /etc/passwd, but the special userid "*chroot" (or similar) >> > is, then the chroot /etc/passwd will be consulted ? >> >=20 >> > I would hate to have all the users in the primary /etc/passwd too. >>=20 >> not a bad idea, but if you ever type your name wrong, you've had it.. > >That is perfectly fine for me. > >I see it as your "chroot" group mode is good for a few chrooted users. > >My "unknown" mode is good for the majority of users being chrooted. > >Having both is just added flexibility. > >-- >Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. >http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. >whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. >Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. -------- Gennady B. Sorokopud - System programmer at NetVision Israel. E-Mail: Gennady Sorokopud Homepage: http://www.netvision.net.il/~gena This message was sent at 02/09/96 11:44:08 by XF-Mail From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 04:16:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA20283 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 04:16:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA20254 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 04:16:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id NAA02169 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:17:31 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602091217.NAA02169@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:17:31 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I noticed in /usr/X11R6/bin a program called scanpci which apparently scans the pci bus looking for devices. The source is deep into the XF86 source tree, /usr/src/X11R6/xc/programs/Xserver/hw/xfree86/etc/scanpci.c and apparently compiles easily. I find it useful, and although it has some funny imprecisions (it detects the SAA 7116 by Philips as an "Intel SAA7116") I believe it is a nice tool for scanning system configurations. How about contacting the author Robin Cutshaw (robin@xfree86.org) to see if it can be included in /sbin ? The source (which I will be glad to post if needed, it's about 30KB) have a berkeley-like copyright, so that should not be much of a problem. And, one thing I would like to know, is if there exist any program to reconfigure a peripheral on the PCI bus. I believe I have a broken BIOS on one of our motherboards which incorrectly assigns the same interrupt to two boards. I'd like to override this somehow. And I would also like to avoid using INT10 on the PCI bus, as many ISA board often use this interrupt line and they cannot be configured on INT11, 12 or 13 Thanks Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 04:57:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA25912 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 04:57:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA25891 Fri, 9 Feb 1996 04:57:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id EAA19842; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 04:56:37 -0800 To: John Polstra cc: pst@shockwave.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org, current@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: sup%d is broken - I agree In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 12:03:25 PST." <199602062003.MAA14626@austin.polstra.com> Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 04:56:37 -0800 Message-ID: <19840.823870597@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > One thing I should have mentioned in my original tirade, but forgot: I > sup the CVS tree (src and ports), not the -current tree or anything You don't need to sup -current if you sup CVS; you already have it! :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 05:05:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA27054 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:05:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from schizo.cdsnet.net (schizo.cdsnet.net [204.118.244.32]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA27049 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:05:50 -0800 (PST) Received: (from mrcpu@localhost) by schizo.cdsnet.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id FAA12765; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:03:36 -0800 Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:03:36 -0800 (PST) From: Jaye Mathisen To: Ollivier Robert cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 3com weirdness. In-Reply-To: <199602090109.CAA26002@keltia.freenix.fr> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Yeah, well, down->up may work, but that certainly won't cut the mustard with my customers who require the mail servers and news servers to be up pretty much all the time. Whatever is wrong is something that's changed from the 2.1-release kernel through -stable, because old boxes with -release work fine, boxes with -stable don't. On Fri, 9 Feb 1996, Ollivier Robert wrote: > It seems that Jaye Mathisen said: > > However, I have a box with -stable as of about the 3 of Feb, and I'm > > having a problem with the 3com 3c509B-TP just freezing up in it for no > > apparent reason. > > Try "ifconfig ... down" then "ifconfig...up". > > > There was some mention of some changes to the driver, but didn't see if > > there was a resolution. > > I've been running with a 3com 509B for three weeks without problem although > the traffic is low (News mostly). > -- > Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net > FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #5: Sun Feb 4 03:11:17 MET 1996 > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 05:39:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA03182 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:39:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA03172 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:39:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA20017; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:38:13 -0800 To: Sergio Lenzi cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What a OS!! In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 13:53:38 GMT." Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 05:38:13 -0800 Message-ID: <20015.823873093@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > Conclusion: GREAT sofware, ease of use, Good GUI interface, secure,Fast, > and Reliable. Thanks a lot. You're entirely welcome! > PS: Now my custumers is asking for word processor.... Is there any in sight? Have you tried using WordPerfect for SCO? There's a demo on ftp.wperfect.com, I believe. If that seems to be usable for you, you can see what your customers think of it! :) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 05:44:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA04129 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:44:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA04122 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:44:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA20064; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:43:03 -0800 To: Christoph Kukulies cc: lenzi@cwbtwo.bsi.com.br (Sergio Lenzi), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: What a OS!! In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 20:06:04 +0100." <199602061906.UAA18858@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 05:43:03 -0800 Message-ID: <20062.823873383@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Tell him he cannot have everything. Period. :-) Of course he can! This is FreeBSD! :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 05:52:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id FAA06068 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:52:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id FAA06048 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:52:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA20106; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 05:49:14 -0800 To: Terry Lambert cc: nate@sri.MT.net (Nate Williams), rkw@dataplex.net, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: On keeping a src tree In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 06 Feb 1996 17:20:25 MST." <199602070020.RAA03904@phaeton.artisoft.com> Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 05:49:14 -0800 Message-ID: <20104.823873754@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > software ("Fleshy-headed mutant, are you friendly?" "No way, Eh? Radiation > has made me the enemy of all mankind"). Strange Brew, now THAT was a modern classic. :-) Jordan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 06:09:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA10071 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 06:09:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from bbs.galactica.it (bbs.galactica.it [151.99.164.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA10047 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 06:08:59 -0800 (PST) From: davide@galactica.it Message-Id: <199602091408.GAA10047@freefall.freebsd.org> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: 9 Feb 1996 14:21:52 GMT Subject: Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, My pentium 90 has 96 Mb Ram ..... why the FreeBSD 2.0 does not recognize more then 64Mb ram ? Is There any kernel parameter to increase the max visible ram? Thanks for reply Ciao Davide From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 07:08:47 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA14635 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:08:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA14624 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:08:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by Sysiphos id AA07402 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freebsd.org); Fri, 9 Feb 1996 16:07:42 +0100 Message-Id: <199602091507.AA07402@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 16:07:41 +0100 In-Reply-To: Luigi Rizzo "scanpci.c and pci-related stuff" (Feb 9, 13:17) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: Luigi Rizzo Subject: Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Feb 9, 13:17, Luigi Rizzo wrote: } Subject: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff } I noticed in /usr/X11R6/bin a program called scanpci which apparently } scans the pci bus looking for devices. } } The source is deep into the XF86 source tree, } } /usr/src/X11R6/xc/programs/Xserver/hw/xfree86/etc/scanpci.c } } and apparently compiles easily. I find it useful, and although it } has some funny imprecisions (it detects the SAA 7116 by Philips as } an "Intel SAA7116") I believe it is a nice tool for scanning system } configurations. Scanning the PCI bus is quite simple, if you know which configuration mode (1 or 2) to use and have access to I/O ports (i.e. it maust be a setuid ROOT program). } How about contacting the author Robin Cutshaw (robin@xfree86.org) } to see if it can be included in /sbin ? The source (which I will } be glad to post if needed, it's about 30KB) have a berkeley-like } copyright, so that should not be much of a problem. There is code in the PCI sources, that prints out a lot of information about PCI chip sets (boot with -v, if you got some kind of Intel chip set). But it surely is useful to have a user land tool to do the scan. } And, one thing I would like to know, is if there exist any program to } reconfigure a peripheral on the PCI bus. What do you mean with "reconfigure" ??? The PCI bus is designed to be configured by the BIOS, and you can query the values choosen (memory, port and IRQ mappings, which possibly have resulted in chip set registers being set accordingly) but you can't easily modify them. If an interrupt has been assigned to some PCI chip, for example, then the chip set has set up a connection from the PCI IntA line to some IRQ input of the system interrupt controller (in the simplest case). You can change this value without knowing the details of the chip set. There are now PCI BIOS calls that ought to allow such an assignment to be done from user code, but I'd rather not rely on it, since I doubt the functionality is working in more than 5% of the PCI systems currently in use ... Similar problems exist with I/O and memory mappings. There might be hardware limitations which are known to the PCI BIOS (e.g. only accesses to the address range 1GB to 2GB are routed to the PCI bus at all). } I believe I have a broken BIOS on one of our motherboards which } incorrectly assigns the same interrupt to two boards. I'd like to } override this somehow. And I would also like to avoid using INT10 on } the PCI bus, as many ISA board often use this interrupt line and they } cannot be configured on INT11, 12 or 13 The PCI BIOS is not necessarily broken, if it assigns one IRQ to multiple devices. Most motherboards sold until mid 1995 had the PCI IntA line of one slot connected to IntB of its neighbour, under the assumption, that devices that use IntB (multi-function devices or PCI to PCI bridges) aren't commonly used. Please describe the situation where the same IRQ was used for two PCI devices. PCI requires the hardware and software to deal with shared interrupts, and FreeBSD got a good implementation of the required software ... Regards, STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 07:24:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA15598 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:24:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from border.com (janus.border.com [199.71.190.98]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA15571 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:23:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by janus.border.com id <20504-2>; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:24:08 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:12:10 -0500 From: Jerry Kendall To: FreeBSD Hackers Cc: jerry@kcis.com Subject: Disk setup and maintenance tools Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Message-Id: <96Feb9.102408est.20504-2@janus.border.com> Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk OK people. I have just setup NetBSD here at work on about 10 systems... All 486DX4-100 with completely different disks in them all. I got very tired of installing from scratch for every machine. I thought, if there were a way that I could plug the new disk into an existing system, do all the required things ie:fdisk, disklabel, makefs, and just perform a 'dump | restore' from the master to the other disks making the install take alot less time, I would be a very happy camper. I looked at the install scripts that are used, they are standard shell scripts. After about 15 minutes, I had made a modified copy to 'add disks' to an existing system. The end result was a shell script, although quick and dirty, that would allow me to plug another disk into an existing system and perform all the required steps to make it usably by NetBSD. T H E G O O D N E W S ! ! ! ! ! ! ! I now have most of it working using the 'dialog' utility on FreeBSD 2.1R. It presents a nice user interface, does all the required work of adding a new disk to the system. All the user is left to do is add the info to /etc/fstab if they want to. I may put this in the package to make it MORE user friendly.... I should be done early next week. At that point I will put it on 'ftp.freebsd.org' in the FreeBSD/incoming area. The big question. I will need some beta testers for this... Need I ask ?? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Any comments or opinions in this message are my own and may or may not reflect the comments or opinions of my present or previous employers. Jerry Kendall Border Network Technologies Inc. System Software Engineer Tel +1-416-368-7157 ext 303 jerry@border.com Fax +1-416-368-7178 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 07:25:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA15794 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:25:19 -0800 (PST) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA15772 Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:25:15 -0800 (PST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199602091525.HAA15772@freefall.freebsd.org> Subject: QIC-1350, Archive Anaconda To: scsi, hackers Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:25:14 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk my new archive anaconda 1.35 GB QIC drive arrived yesterday. the OS does not recognize its denisty correctly. OR the drive does not advertize its density. time to go into the scsi debug business ;) i will post dmesg output tonight (GMT-5). how do i get the density, scsi version, data from the drive using scsi(8). i have the scsi-ii spec available from the net and the QIC-121 _implementation_of_scsi-2)_for_QIC-compatible_sequential_storage_devices_ spec as well. please reference the spec in the answer. jmb -- Jonathan M. Bresler FreeBSD Postmaster jmb@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD--4.4BSD Unix for PC clones, source included. http://www.freebsd.org/ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 07:30:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA16191 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:30:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA16127 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:29:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id QAA02610; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 16:30:13 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602091530.QAA02610@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff To: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 16:30:12 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602091507.AA07402@Sysiphos> from "Stefan Esser" at Feb 9, 96 04:07:22 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > But it surely is useful to have a user > land tool to do the scan. > > } And, one thing I would like to know, is if there exist any program to > } reconfigure a peripheral on the PCI bus. > > What do you mean with "reconfigure" ??? > The PCI bus is designed to be configured > by the BIOS, and you can query the values > choosen (memory, port and IRQ mappings, > which possibly have resulted in chip set > registers being set accordingly) but you > can't easily modify them. If an interrupt > has been assigned to some PCI chip, for > example, then the chip set has set up a > connection from the PCI IntA line to some > IRQ input of the system interrupt controller > (in the simplest case). > You can change this value without knowing I guess you mean "cannot" > the details of the chip set. There are now > PCI BIOS calls that ought to allow such an >From the meteor.c driver : ... #ifdef METEOR_IRQ /* from the meteor.h file */ old_irq = pci_conf_read(tag, PCI_INTERRUPT_REG); pci_conf_write(tag, PCI_INTERRUPT_REG, METEOR_IRQ); new_irq = pci_conf_read(tag, PCI_INTERRUPT_REG); printf("meteor_attach: irq changed from %d to %d\n", (old_irq & 0xff), (new_irq & 0xff)); #endif METEOR_IRQ ... it looks like it is not that hard, if the above works. Note that I don't want to chang IRQ settings for an active board, just to remap the setting for a board which is not correctly recognised. It is intended as a fixit tool, "use at your own risk". > } I believe I have a broken BIOS on one of our motherboards which > } incorrectly assigns the same interrupt to two boards. I'd like to > } override this somehow. And I would also like to avoid using INT10 on > } the PCI bus, as many ISA board often use this interrupt line and they > } cannot be configured on INT11, 12 or 13 > > The PCI BIOS is not necessarily broken, if > it assigns one IRQ to multiple devices. Most > motherboards sold until mid 1995 had the PCI > IntA line of one slot connected to IntB of its > neighbour, under the assumption, that devices > that use IntB (multi-function devices or PCI > to PCI bridges) aren't commonly used. > > Please describe the situation where the same > IRQ was used for two PCI devices. I have two identical PC-net PCI boards, plugged in adjacent slots. On one particular motherboard they are both configured with IRQ10, on a similar motherboard one gets IRQ10, the other IRQ11 Also, at times I'd like to free some specific IRQs. As an example: here I have a system with the following devices: sio0,1,2 (irq 3, 4, 5) lpt0 (irq7) ed0 (irq10, PCI) meteor (irq9,PCI) vga (irq11, PCI) and I'd like to put in a scanner (can use irq3,5,10) and an SB16. I must free irq10, and possibly irq9 as well. Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 08:15:20 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA19475 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:15:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [165.254.13.209]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA19469 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:15:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from ppp-082.etinc.com (ppp-082.etinc.com [204.141.95.142]) by etinc.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA08027 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:15:53 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:15:53 -0500 Message-Id: <199602091615.LAA08027@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: hackers@freebsd.org From: dennis@etinc.com (dennis) Subject: IPFW impact Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Is there any impact (on performance or anything else) of having the IPFIREWALL option on in the kernel if it isnt used (ie no filters set)? db ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Emerging Technologies, Inc. http://www.etinc.com Synchronous Communications Cards and Routers For Discriminating Tastes. 56k to T1 and beyond. Frame Relay, PPP, HDLC, and X.25 for BSD/OS, FreeBSD and LINUX From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 08:39:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA21217 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:39:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from ncd.com (firewall-user@welch.ncd.com [192.43.160.250]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA21212 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:39:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by ncd.com; id IAA15994; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:41:25 -0800 Received: from z-code.z-code.com(192.82.56.21) by welch.ncd.com via smap (g3.0.1) id xma015981; Fri, 9 Feb 96 08:41:15 -0800 Received: from zolaris.z-code.com (zolaris.z-code.com [192.82.56.41]) by z-code.z-code.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA17487; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:36:46 -0800 Received: by zolaris.z-code.com (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA01040; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:34:36 -0800 From: "Ulf Zimmermann" Message-Id: <9602090834.ZM1038@zolaris.z-code.com> Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:34:35 -0800 In-Reply-To: "Christoph P. Kukulies" "mail sending problem (how can this happen?)" (Feb 9, 10:42) References: <199602090942.KAA28516@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.0 06sep94) To: "Christoph P. Kukulies" , freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: mail sending problem (how can this happen?) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Feb 9, 10:42, Christoph P. Kukulies wrote: > Subject: mail sending problem (how can this happen?) > In this context another question: A colleague had run in 'political' > difficulties in his working group where he got attacked of not having > informed some other group members about a certain fact. He was sure > he sent them a mail but the receiver claimed he never got the mail. > I looked into /var/log/maillog and found that sendmail logged Sent > (ok) or something. Is this the absolute proof that the message had > been delivered correctly to the receiving system? (The sending system > is a 2.1R FreeBSD, the receiving system some other - SGI). >-- End of excerpt from Christoph P. Kukulies It should a prove that the mail left the FreeBSD ok. If the receiving host was the SGI you can normaly say, yes, it was delivered. If it was a relay host, then the mail was only delivered till the relay host. After there anything can happen. So, if you have important mail and want to be sure it arrives, put the Return-Receipt: line into your mailheaders. Ulf. -- Ulf Zimmermann, NCD Software, 101 Rowland Way, Suite 300, Novato, CA 94945 phone: 415-899-7941, email: ulf@z-code.ncd.com, phone-home: 510-865-0204 ====================================== FreeBSD 2.1.0 is available now! -------------------------------------- FreeBSD: Turning PCs into Workstations ====================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 08:40:23 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA21300 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:40:23 -0800 (PST) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA21293 Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:40:22 -0800 (PST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199602091640.IAA21293@freefall.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: mail sending problem (how can this happen?) To: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (Christoph P. Kukulies) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:40:22 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602090942.KAA28516@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> from "Christoph P. Kukulies" at Feb 9, 96 10:42:09 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Christoph P. Kukulies said: > > In this context another question: A colleague had run in 'political' > difficulties in his working group where he got attacked of not having > informed some other group members about a certain fact. He was sure > he sent them a mail but the receiver claimed he never got the mail. > I looked into /var/log/maillog and found that sendmail logged Sent > (ok) or something. Is this the absolute proof that the message had > been delivered correctly to the receiving system? (The sending system > is a 2.1R FreeBSD, the receiving system some other - SGI). its proof that the other system accepted the mail. what happened after that should be recorded in that system's mail logs. non-conclusive, without those logs, sorry. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 08:43:59 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA21445 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:43:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from firtech.lri.fr (firtech.lri.fr [129.175.15.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA21440 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:43:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by firtech.lri.fr (8.6.12/general) id RAA02119 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 17:40:49 +0100 Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 17:40:49 +0100 From: souchu@firtech.lri.fr (Nicolas Souchu) Message-Id: <199602091640.RAA02119@firtech.lri.fr> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: EIDE 2300+ Promise Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Hi, My controller EIDE 2300+ Promise fails at boot in int 13h or just after when executing real_to_proc, I don't know exactly. What's wrong ? The controller has a external bios at address DC000h (by default), should I change this address ? Is it a DMA problem (virtual <-> physical address translation), or something else ? I have an idea. Why not programming a sort of linux-lodlin that would start FreeBSD from DOS after installing the Promise int 13h driver ? Would FreeBSD's kernel be surprised and panic ? Any idea appreciated. Thanks in advance, nicolas email: souchu@firtech.lri.fr From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 08:48:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA21654 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:48:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA21649 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:48:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id RAA02789 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 17:49:06 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602091649.RAA02789@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: PCI problem To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 17:49:05 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk [sorry to bother the list, but I lost the name of the guy who asked me for more info] About the PCI problem I mentioned previously, here is what I see with scanpci: biblio# ./scanpci PCI says configuration type 1 PCI probing configuration type 1 pci bus 0x0 cardnum 0x00, vendor 0x8086 device 0x122d Intel 82437 Triton STATUS 0x2200 COMMAND 0x0006 CLASS 0x06 0x00 0x00 REVISION 0x01 BIST 0x00 HEADER 0x00 LATENCY 0x40 CACHE 0x00 pci bus 0x0 cardnum 0x07, vendor 0x8086 device 0x122e Intel 82471 Triton STATUS 0x0280 COMMAND 0x000f CLASS 0x06 0x01 0x00 REVISION 0x02 pci bus 0x0 cardnum 0x0d, vendor 0x1022 device 0x2000 AMD 79C970 Lance STATUS 0x0200 COMMAND 0x0185 CLASS 0x02 0x00 0x00 REVISION 0x02 BASE0 0x0000ff41 addr 0x0000ff40 I/O MAX_LAT 0x00 MIN_GNT 0x00 INT_PIN 0x01 INT_LINE 0x0b pci bus 0x0 cardnum 0x0e, vendor 0x1013 device 0x00a0 Cirrus Logic GD 5430 STATUS 0x0200 COMMAND 0x0003 CLASS 0x03 0x00 0x00 REVISION 0x47 BASE0 0xfe000008 addr 0xfe000000 MEM pci bus 0x0 cardnum 0x0f, vendor 0x1022 device 0x2000 AMD 79C970 Lance STATUS 0x0200 COMMAND 0x0185 CLASS 0x02 0x00 0x00 REVISION 0x02 BASE0 0x0000ff81 addr 0x0000ff80 I/O MAX_LAT 0x00 MIN_GNT 0x00 INT_PIN 0x01 INT_LINE 0x0b PCI probing configuration type 2 biblio# As you can see, the two network cards share the same int line, even though the kernel believes they are at int 11 and 10 respectively. Any ideas on what can be going on ? The motherboard is an Intel Zappa. Thanks Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 08:51:36 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA21800 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:51:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from who.cdrom.com (who.cdrom.com [192.216.222.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA21785 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:51:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from uahis1.uah.edu (uahis1.uah.edu [146.229.1.2]) by who.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) with SMTP id IAA23372 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:51:28 -0800 Received: from ebs330 by uahis1.uah.edu with SMTP ; Fri, 9 Feb 96 10:52:00 CST Received: from ebs06.eb.uah.edu.uah.edu by ebs330 (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA04284; Fri, 9 Feb 96 10:52:37 CST Received: by ebs06.eb.uah.edu.uah.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA05426; Fri, 9 Feb 96 10:59:16 CST Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:59:15 -0600 (CST) From: Luis Verissimo Subject: Re: Unexplained segfaults in 2.1.0-RELEASE To: "Freeman P. Pascal IV" Cc: FreeBSD Hackers list In-Reply-To: <311B15CD.41C67EA6@pascal.org> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk I have a 486DX4-100 machine running FreeBSD-2.1R. I experienced the same problems. I had to disable both the internal and external caches, of my machine. It then worked find. I have another 486DX2-66 older machine, that keeps getting those signals, even with both caches disabled. Can anybody tell me where is the list of machines that are currently running FreeBSD with no problems? Thank You Luis Verissimo \\|// O-O ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~oOO~~~~~(_)~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~ LUIS VERISSIMO ~ ~ Univ. Alabama Huntsville ~ ~ e-mail: Engineering Bldg. Rm 216-a (205) 895-6509 ~ ~ licau@ebs330.eb.uah.edu Huntsville, AL 35899 (205) 895-6928 ~ ~ ~ ~ web: http://eb-p5.eb.uah.edu/student/licau/index.html (205) 830-2323 ~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~oOO~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | | | -- -- ooO Ooo On Fri, 9 Feb 1996, Freeman P. Pascal IV wrote: > Hello all; > > I have a client who is running 2.1.0-RELEASE on a Pentium 100 ISA/PCI > motherboard with, 16Mb, AHA1542, and Orchid SVGA card. > > I installed 2.1.0 about three weeks ago and for almost two weeks it's > been running just fine using the generic kernel and a custom kernel > configured for just the cards that are installed, IPFIREWALL and > IPACCT. > > Around a week ago we started seeing processes dying for no obvious > reason via segfault (signal 11). There's no pattern to the processes > being affected other than it tends to be processes that exec heavily > (ie. inetd, sendmail, make, window managers, etc). > > I tried switching back to the generic kernel that was originally > installed without any effect. > > Thinking it might be a shared library problme, I tried recompiling and > swapping out libc.so.2.2 in /usr/lib - no joy. > > The machine is currently running continueous memory tests (using > amidiag). I'm hoping that it shows a bad SIMM. The tests have been > acting a bit flakey, but I'm not sure if it's the motherboard, memory, > or just that the diags I'm running were designed for 486 class machines. > > Has anyone seen this behavior with 2.1.0-RELEASE else where? Currently, > the way the machines behaving if I can't fix it I'll have to revert > back to 2.0.5 which seems to be more stable (at least on this machine > I have 2.1.0 running else where without flaw). > > Any help would be appreciated. > > -Freeman > > > -- > +------------------------------------------------------------------------+ > | For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that | > | whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting | > | life. | > | - John 3:16 (KJV) | > +------------------------------------------------------------------------+ > | F r e e m a n P. P a s c a l I V | > | | > | Phone Work: (510) 645-3454 Email Work: pascal@tfs.com | > | Home: (510) 215-5742 Home: pascal@pascal.org | > | Pager: (800) SKY-PAGE Home page: http://www.pascal.org | > | PIN: 419-2250 Amateur Radio: KE6LSS | > +------------------------------------------------------------------------+ > From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 08:58:53 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA22268 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:58:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from terra.Sarnoff.COM (terra.sarnoff.com [130.33.11.203]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA22262 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:58:50 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rminnich@localhost) by terra.Sarnoff.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA20573; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:55:56 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:55:55 -0500 (EST) From: "Ron G. Minnich" To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: multicast config confusion: can't get mrouted to work Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk i'm lost. I can't get mrouted on freebsd to do anything except quit. Release is freebsd 2.1R, options MROUTE is on in the kernel. Here's a sample ifconfig -a lp0: flags=8810 mtu 1500 ep0: flags=863 mtu 1500 inet 130.33.10.216 netmask 0xfffff800 broadcast 130.33.15.255 lo0: flags=8009 mtu 16384 inet 127.0.0.1 netmask 0xff000000 sl0: flags=c010 mtu 552 tun0: flags=8010 mtu 1500 OK, i have two at least multicast capable interfaces. BUT, my ep0 is not multicast capable. Is this because it can broadcast? there's no ifconfig option to set multicast ... next: tres# mrouted -d 3 debug level 3 16:01:11.441 mrouted version 3.6 16:01:11.457 Getting vifs from kernel interfaces 16:01:11.458 Getting vifs from /etc/mrouted.conf 16:01:11.460 can't forward: no enabled vifs no enable vifs? garg. Looking in mrouted source leads me to believe it should find at least lp0 and sl0 above. Geez, i'm really in the dark. Any hints would help. I haven't found anything helpful on the cdrom yet. thanks ron Ron Minnich |" XNFPREP: ERROR 4007: rminnich@sarnoff.com | Everything in the design was deleted." (609)-734-3120 |Was it something I said? ftp://ftp.sarnoff.com/pub/mnfs/www/docs/cluster.html From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 09:08:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA23006 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:08:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.cdrom.com (localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA23001 Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:08:50 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602091708.JAA23001@freefall.freebsd.org> X-Authentication-Warning: freefall.freebsd.org: Host localhost.cdrom.com [127.0.0.1] didn't use HELO protocol To: Jaye Mathisen cc: Ollivier Robert , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: 3com weirdness. In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Feb 1996 05:03:36 PST." Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 09:08:50 -0800 From: "Justin T. Gibbs" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >Yeah, well, down->up may work, but that certainly won't cut the mustard >with my customers who require the mail servers and news servers to be up >pretty much all the time. > >Whatever is wrong is something that's changed from the 2.1-release kernel >through -stable, because old boxes with -release work fine, boxes >with -stable don't. It has to do with the watchdog timer. I'll commit some patches to the driver in -stable sometime this weekend to ensure its doing the right thing. -- Justin T. Gibbs =========================================== FreeBSD: Turning PCs into workstations =========================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 09:19:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA23641 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:19:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA23635 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:19:12 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA10691; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:13:19 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602091713.KAA10691@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:13:19 -0700 (MST) Cc: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602091530.QAA02610@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 9, 96 04:30:12 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Please describe the situation where the same > > IRQ was used for two PCI devices. > > I have two identical PC-net PCI boards, plugged in adjacent slots. > On one particular motherboard they are both configured with IRQ10, on a > similar motherboard one gets IRQ10, the other IRQ11 Apparantly, the motherboards are not that similar... > Also, at times I'd like to free some specific IRQs. As an example: here > I have a system with the following devices: > > sio0,1,2 (irq 3, 4, 5) > lpt0 (irq7) > ed0 (irq10, PCI) > meteor (irq9,PCI) > vga (irq11, PCI) > > and I'd like to put in a scanner (can use irq3,5,10) and an SB16. > I must free irq10, and possibly irq9 as well. Make sure the ISA portion of your motherboard is PlugNPlay capable and that *all* your ISA cards are PlugNPlay cards, and you won't have this problem. In general, there are three interrupts, A, B, and C, assignable for PCI. What ISA interupts these get set to depends on the PCI bridge chipset configuration, which depends on hardware or software switches (very board dependent). The problem you are seeing is typical of internal-ISA-bridged-to-PCI motherboards. An internal-PCI-bridged-to-ISA (for instance, using the chipset DEC uses in the Alpha 21064 evaluation board or the one that Motorolla uses in the Ultra 603/604 PPC evaluation board instead of an Intrel chipset would fix the problem. Use the Apple chipset, and you will get 6 PCI slots without PCI-PCI bridging). In other words, the problem is inherent to you having ISA slots. I'd guess that the board where multiple PCI's are getting assigned the same interrupt is a "Genuine Intel" motherboard, probably a Zappa. The PCI motherboards from the Intel OEM products division assign the same interrupt to all PCI slots. It is up to the interrupt handling in your OS software to realize that this is allowable (but never desirable, Intel, if you are listening) under the spec to require the OS to demux PCI interrupts. In general, there are Intel motherboards that "Do The Right Thing", but Intel typically does not sell them (as Rod Grimes about this one). I recommend against Intel OEM Products Division boards. In your example where the PCI interrupt is "reassigned", what is happening is that the PCI configuration is defaulted in the driver, then read from the PCI -- that is, it is a driver reconfiguration, not a PCI reconfiguration. What you thought was happening is not what actually happened. Without a drive specific to the bridge chip set (and without the capability built into the chipset itself), it's not possible to reassign interrupts once they have been assigend by the conflict resoloution code on the PCI motherboard. The typical conflict case is with PCI-PCI conflicts for pre-2.0 spec motherboards and/or cards (the best example from "the FreeBSD chronicles" is the BusLogic PCI board, which used multiple memory windows but an Intel Zappa with Saturn II ISA->PCI bridge couldn't resolve the conflicts without a BIOS upgrade to PCI 2.0 -- and the hardware couldn't handle the upgrade). This type of confligt is *impossible* to resolve without a BIOS and/or hardware patch. Your problem sounds more like a configuration/interrupt code problem; I don't know the current status of PCI interrupt multiplexing in the FreeBSD kernel (you'd have to have -current to find out yourself), but I suspect that you want to change jumpers on the motherboard or modify a CMOS setup for the PCI on the motherboard to fix your problem. Stephan might have more information on this for specific hardware... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 09:21:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA23851 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:21:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA23846 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:21:05 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id KAA10704; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:17:54 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602091717.KAA10704@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: To: davide@galactica.it Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:17:54 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602091408.GAA10047@freefall.freebsd.org> from "davide@galactica.it" at Feb 9, 96 02:21:52 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > Hi, Hi. You probably wanted "questions@freebsd.org", not "hackers@freebsd.org". > My pentium 90 has 96 Mb Ram ..... why the FreeBSD 2.0 > does not recognize more then 64Mb ram ? Because your CMOS can only contain a value up to 64MB, and there is no other standard interface for determining the amount of RAM present. > Is There any kernel parameter to increase the max visible > ram? Yes. See /sys/i386/conf/LINT for details on the actual option. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 09:40:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA25305 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:40:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA25232 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:40:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id KAA23288; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:38:10 -0700 Message-Id: <199602091738.KAA23288@rover.village.org> To: "Ulf Zimmermann" Subject: Re: mail sending problem (how can this happen?) Cc: "Christoph P. Kukulies" , freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-reply-to: Your message of Fri, 09 Feb 1996 08:34:35 PST Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 10:38:10 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : Return-Receipt: line into your mailheaders. Return-receipt isn't standardized, but it mostly works. If you get it, all that means, typically with sendmail, is that the mail was placed in the user's /var/mail/xxxx file correctly (or that any mail sorting programs "accepted" it). It doesn't mean that the person or persons that you sent it to actually read and/or understood the mail message. It is like to be "good enough" proof that the person in question did get the mail message.[*] However, if you don't get a return receipt, it doesn't mean the person didn't get the mail either. Warner [*] If someone from the list of "kiss of death" sites that I have sends me mail, return receipt requested, they will get a return receipt, but I'll never see the mail because slocal destroys it. Anybody know how to make slocal actually bounce the mail? From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 09:41:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA25359 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:41:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from ncd.com (firewall-user@welch.ncd.com [192.43.160.250]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA25354 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:41:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by ncd.com; id JAA19566; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:43:21 -0800 Received: from z-code.z-code.com(192.82.56.21) by welch.ncd.com via smap (g3.0.1) id xma019546; Fri, 9 Feb 96 09:43:10 -0800 Received: from zolaris.z-code.com (zolaris.z-code.com [192.82.56.41]) by z-code.z-code.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id JAA18017; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:38:46 -0800 Received: by zolaris.z-code.com (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA01102; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:36:35 -0800 From: "Ulf Zimmermann" Message-Id: <9602090936.ZM1100@zolaris.z-code.com> Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:36:34 -0800 In-Reply-To: Warner Losh "Re: mail sending problem (how can this happen?)" (Feb 9, 10:38) References: <199602091738.KAA23288@rover.village.org> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.0 06sep94) To: Warner Losh , "Ulf Zimmermann" Subject: Re: mail sending problem (how can this happen?) Cc: "Christoph P. Kukulies" , freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Feb 9, 10:38, Warner Losh wrote: > Subject: Re: mail sending problem (how can this happen?) > : Return-Receipt: line into your mailheaders. > > Return-receipt isn't standardized, but it mostly works. If you get > it, all that means, typically with sendmail, is that the mail was > placed in the user's /var/mail/xxxx file correctly (or that any mail > sorting programs "accepted" it). It doesn't mean that the person or That's right. Never said something else, but maybe also not pointed out this. > persons that you sent it to actually read and/or understood the mail > message. It is like to be "good enough" proof that the person in > question did get the mail message.[*] > > However, if you don't get a return receipt, it doesn't mean the person > didn't get the mail either. > > Warner > >-- End of excerpt from Warner Losh Ulf. -- Ulf Zimmermann, NCD Software, 101 Rowland Way, Suite 300, Novato, CA 94945 phone: 415-899-7941, email: ulf@z-code.ncd.com, phone-home: 510-865-0204 ====================================== FreeBSD 2.1.0 is available now! -------------------------------------- FreeBSD: Turning PCs into Workstations ====================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 09:54:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA26200 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:54:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA26195 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:54:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id SAA02888; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 18:46:09 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602091746.SAA02888@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 18:46:09 +0100 (MET) Cc: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602091713.KAA10691@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 9, 96 10:13:00 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Thanks Terry for the interesting description. BTW: a hint on how to fill up the handbook: just post a question for every missing section, and hope someone will respond... > > I have two identical PC-net PCI boards, plugged in adjacent slots. > > On one particular motherboard they are both configured with IRQ10, on a > > similar motherboard one gets IRQ10, the other IRQ11 > > Apparantly, the motherboards are not that similar... Or maybe I am mistaken and they both gets assigned the same IRQ but different from the first case... ... > Make sure the ISA portion of your motherboard is PlugNPlay capable > and that *all* your ISA cards are PlugNPlay cards, and you won't > have this problem. i.e. "avoid the problem and you won't have the problem". I'll keep in mind next time... :) > I'd guess that the board where multiple PCI's are getting assigned the > same interrupt is a "Genuine Intel" motherboard, probably a Zappa. good guess > The PCI motherboards from the Intel OEM products division assign the > same interrupt to all PCI slots. It is up to the interrupt handling isn't it "the same interrupt to all boards with the same PCI id ?" otherwise why the meteor and the ethernet get different IRQs ? > in your OS software to realize that this is allowable (but never > desirable, Intel, if you are listening) under the spec to require the > OS to demux PCI interrupts. > > In general, there are Intel motherboards that "Do The Right Thing", but > Intel typically does not sell them (as Rod Grimes about this one). I > recommend against Intel OEM Products Division boards. so what are your recommendations ? For comparable prices, of course. Thanks Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 10:18:11 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA29284 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:18:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail1.infinet.com (mail1.infinet.com [206.103.240.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA29257 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:18:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from donna (cmh-p096.infinet.com [206.103.242.102]) by mail1.infinet.com (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA20632 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:14:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <311B8FDC.17D5646A@cylatech.com> Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 13:18:04 -0500 From: Wilson MacGyver Organization: CylaTech Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (X11; I; Linux 1.2.13 i586) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: strange problem I'm having with 2.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Okay, I installed the 2.1 on a P75 EIDE system with PS/2 mouse. no problem, I recompiled the kernel to support PS/2 mouse. But, everytime after a fresh reboot, the first time I start Xfree 3.1.2, the mouse is frozen, I have to hit ctl-alt-backspace to exit Xfree. Then, I start X again, from this point on, everything will work fine until I reboot again. Problem 2: This is my first experience using FreeBSd on EIDE system. But it seems at random intervals, the kernel goes into panic, and attempt to resync the harddrive, I'll get a message "Kernel Panic, resync 3..3..3..3..3.." and then it dies. At first I thought it was because I mounted DOS paritions, thus I did a fresh install, and mounts nothing else besides the BSD itself. It occured again. Ideas? Guys? Here is my partition setup, EIDE 1.0 GIG drive, 400MB DOS, 600 MB FreeBSD EIDE 1.2 GIG drive, 600MB OS/2, 600 MB linux IDE 1.0 GIG drive, DOS -- Wilson MacGyver macgyver@cylatech.com -------------------------------------- Veni, Vidi, Concidi. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 10:25:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA00302 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:25:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA00295 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:25:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id TAA03031 for hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:26:53 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602091826.TAA03031@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: PDF viewers To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:26:53 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I got this message from an unrelated list. It's a pdf viewer which seems to work reasonably well, and it's probably faster than using ghostscript (and certainly much smaller). Worth a try, and possibly making it a package. Luigi > Date: Tue, 06 Feb 1996 14:38:13 -0500 > From: "Derek B. Noonburg" > Subject: PDF viewers (was Re: Re[2]: data in mpasm and User's Guide) > In-reply-to: "04 Feb 1996 10:45:54 +0200." > <199602050638.BAA12900@vw.ece.cmu.edu> > Sender: pic microcontroller discussion list > To: Multiple recipients of list PICLIST > Reply-to: pic microcontroller discussion list > Message-id: <01I0XG2P9H6C95MVF8@mailsrv.cnuce.cnr.it> > Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT > X-To: pic microcontroller discussion list > X-Status: > ... > > I'll take this opportunity to plug xpdf, my free PDF viewer for X. It's > still an alpha version, but it works reasonably well. I designed it to > be small and efficient (no Motif - and it was developed entirely on a 12 > MB 486 under Linux), so you should be able to run it on pretty much > anything that can handle X. > > One thing -- it seems that some (most? all?) of Microchip's PDF files > are encrypted. Adobe hasn't released the specs for decryption, so > you're forced to use an Adobe viewer. I know that Microchip watches > this list, so I'd like to encourage them to stop using this pointless > encryption. > > The xpdf home page is: > http://www.contrib.andrew.cmu.edu/usr/dn0o/xpdf/xpdf.html > > Source code and several binaries are available from ftp.andrew.cmu.edu > in the /pub/xpdf directory. > > - Derek > ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 10:33:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA00986 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:33:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA00963 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:33:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id TAA10802 ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:32:56 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id TAA06152 ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:32:55 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.3/keltia-uucp-2.7) id TAA28721; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:27:18 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199602091827.TAA28721@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: To: davide@galactica.it Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:27:17 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602091408.GAA10047@freefall.freebsd.org> from "davide@galactica.it" at "Feb 9, 96 02:21:52 pm" X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1630 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL5 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk It seems that davide@galactica.it said: > My pentium 90 has 96 Mb Ram ..... why the FreeBSD 2.0 > does not recognize more then 64Mb ram ? Did you looked at the FAQ ? 8.6. I have 128 MB of RAM but it seems that the system use only the first 64 MB. What's going on ? Due to the manner in which FreeBSD gets the memory size from the BIOS, it can only detect 16 bits worth of Kbytes in size (65535 Kbytes = 64MB). If you have more than 64MB, FreeBSD will only see the first 64MB. To work around this problem, you need to use the kernel option specified below. There is a way to get complete memory information from the BIOS, but we don't have room in the bootblocks to do it. Someday when lack of room in the bootblocks is fixed, we'll use the extended BIOS functions to get the full memory information...but for now we're stuck with the kernel option. ______________________________________________________________________ options "MAXMEM=" ______________________________________________________________________ Where n is your memory in Kilobytes. For a 128 MB machine, you'd want to use 131072. -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #5: Sun Feb 4 03:11:17 MET 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 10:49:18 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA02154 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:49:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from news1.gtn.com (news1.gtn.com [192.109.159.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id KAA02147 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:49:15 -0800 (PST) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by news1.gtn.com (8.7.2/8.7.2) id TAA15155; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:30:22 +0100 (MET) Received: from knobel.gun.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by knobel.gun.de (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA01375; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:25:36 +0100 (MET) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:25:36 +0100 (MET) From: Andreas Klemm To: Dave Truesdell cc: Scott Mace , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: HP PCL printers... In-Reply-To: <10497.823815284@nas.nasa.gov> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Thu, 8 Feb 1996, Dave Truesdell wrote: > -- Your message was: (from "Scott Mace") > Does anyone have a handy set of commands that will allow me > to output various file tyes (plaintext and PS) in HP PCL3 > format? I've got a client that has a HP 855C and it speaks > only HP PCL3 > > Scott > -- End of Message > > For my 600C at home, I use a combination of a modified version of apsfilter and > ghostscript-3.51. I get some great results printing both text and color. > > I don't have my patches to apsfilter available at the moment, but I needed to > work around problems the filter had trying to "rewind" stdin on my 2.1-stable > system. Hmm, did you try apsfilter-4.9.3 from the ports collection ? No problems with 2.1, 2.1-stable and -current here ! -- andreas@knobel.gun.de /\/\___ Wiechers & Partner Datentechnik GmbH Andreas Klemm ___/\/\/ $$ Support Unix - aklemm@wup.de $$ pgp p-key http://www-swiss.ai.mit.edu/~bal/pks-toplev.html >>> powered by <<< ftp://sunsite.unc.edu/pub/Linux/system/Printing/aps-491.tgz >>> FreeBSD <<< From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 11:03:37 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA03022 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:03:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA03014 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:03:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id LAA12069; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:02:28 -0800 Message-Id: <199602091902.LAA12069@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" cc: Sergio Lenzi , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What a OS!! In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Feb 1996 05:38:13 PST." <20015.823873093@time.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 11:01:23 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>> "Jordan K. Hubbard" said: > > Conclusion: GREAT sofware, ease of use, Good GUI interface, secure,Fast, > > and Reliable. Thanks a lot. > > You're entirely welcome! > > > PS: Now my custumers is asking for word processor.... Is there any in sigh t? > > Have you tried using WordPerfect for SCO? There's a demo on > ftp.wperfect.com, I believe. If that seems to be usable for you, you > can see what your customers think of it! :) Well, lets try this again... Has anyone recently ran WordPerfect for SCO successfully? Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 11:57:40 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA06119 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:57:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA06114 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:57:38 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA10958; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:54:16 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602091954.MAA10958@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: PCI problem To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:54:16 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602091649.RAA02789@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 9, 96 05:49:05 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > As you can see, the two network cards share the same int line, even > though the kernel believes they are at int 11 and 10 respectively. > > Any ideas on what can be going on ? The motherboard is an Intel Zappa. Yeah. The kernel is wrong. The PCI bus is right. By default, the kernel will have assigned "guesses" for devices. This derives from not having all devices in a "PlugNPlay" framework and/or probe registration mechanism. Windows95 calls this a "Resource Manager". The cards have the same interrupt assigned by the PCI BIOS. It is the responsibility of the OS to understand PCI interrrupt multiplexing and Deal With It(tm). Very few OS's currently do this because almost all motherboard manufacturers except the Intel OEM products division consider it a mistake to not have an interrupt per PCI slot. You will need to specifically override one of the cards idea of the "correct" interrupt (some PCI card hardware supports jumpering of ISA interrupts), you will need to override the single interrupt assignment on the motherboard (not possible on some Intel boards), or you will need to modify the interrupt handling mechanism (if it hasn't already been done) to support demuxxing the cards. In the last case, it is correct for the cards to have the same interrupt. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 12:07:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA06520 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:07:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA06514 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:07:54 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA10981; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:03:39 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602092003.NAA10981@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:03:39 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, se@zpr.uni-koeln.de, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602091746.SAA02888@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 9, 96 06:46:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Make sure the ISA portion of your motherboard is PlugNPlay capable > > and that *all* your ISA cards are PlugNPlay cards, and you won't > > have this problem. > > i.e. "avoid the problem and you won't have the problem". I'll keep in > mind next time... :) Yeah. That's basically it. 8-). > > The PCI motherboards from the Intel OEM products division assign the > > same interrupt to all PCI slots. It is up to the interrupt handling > > isn't it "the same interrupt to all boards with the same PCI id ?" > otherwise why the meteor and the ethernet get different IRQs ? I'm not sure. The BusLogic SCSI problem seemed to be generic, but I could be wrong here. > > in your OS software to realize that this is allowable (but never > > desirable, Intel, if you are listening) under the spec to require the > > OS to demux PCI interrupts. > > > > In general, there are Intel motherboards that "Do The Right Thing", but > > Intel typically does not sell them (as Rod Grimes about this one). I > > recommend against Intel OEM Products Division boards. > > so what are your recommendations ? For comparable prices, of course. I recommend ASUS motherboards. I don't know if the prices are comparable or not, since I never priced the non-working motherboards. For what it's worth, I think "doesn't work" is the highest price you can pay, no matter what the actual cost. The jury (Stephan) is still out on whether or not the -current code handles PCI interrupt demuxxing trasnparently or not. It's a general problem, so it *should* be succeptible to a general soloution. If so, then the only thing you are paying for on shared interrupts in reduced concurrency. Assuming the code is there, then worst case is poorer performance than unshared interrupts because of average traversal time for the demux being higher than if you didn't have to do a demux. That is, there is a software work-around that may or may not be there yet, and even if it's there, you should avoid the motherboards because they will have lower performance than motherboards that don't rely on the software work-around. And I'm *really* going to let this go now and let Stephan respond to the interrupt mux issue... Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 12:09:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA06611 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:09:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from cwbone.bsi.com.br ([200.250.250.14]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA06602 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:09:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from cwbtr01.bsi.com.br (cwbtr01 [200.250.250.18]) by cwbone.bsi.com.br (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA15207 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 18:08:09 GMT Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 18:12:37 +0000 () From: Sergio de Almeida Lenzi To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: FTP install & NFS install Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi all, Here in bsi, I'm trying to update several machines with 2.1 RELEASE. When I try to install FreeBSD in the network (10Mb) with ftp, the boot diskette makes file systems, gets root image... and after, it says that cannot get bin/bin.aa. (file not found). When I install via NFS, it install the hole system. Curiously, when I try to install via net (freebsd.org FTP) it works.. I have tried with several machines and configurations. Is this an ftp error or an install via ftp in a fast network is buggy??? Help?? Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 12:35:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA08300 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:35:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA08272 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:35:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from gemini.sdsp.mc.xerox.com ([13.231.132.20]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <15303(7)>; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:33:56 PST Received: from gnu.mc.xerox.com (gnu.sdsp.mc.xerox.com) by gemini.sdsp.mc.xerox.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA27552; Fri, 9 Feb 96 15:33:47 EST Received: by gnu.mc.xerox.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA14852; Fri, 9 Feb 96 15:33:45 EST Message-Id: <9602092033.AA14852@gnu.mc.xerox.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.4 10/10/95 To: Paul Hatchman Cc: linux-kernel@vger.rutgers.edu, hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: signal masks and select In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 30 Jan 1996 23:49:00 PST." <199601310749.AA28625@rex.sfe.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:33:45 PST From: "Marty Leisner" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Thanks for the help... I liked this solution for now... > > This can be "solved" by using setjmp/longjmp with select. > ie > if (setjmp (env, 1) == 0) > { > set_sigmask(unblock desired signals) > select(...) > } > > and your signal handler does a longjmp (env) > But this is a kludgey workaround...and using pthreads (where each thread has a signal mask) means env becomes thread private data... It seems very reasonable to have a system call: select_with_newmask(new_mask, ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:40:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id MAA00892; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 12:39:45 -0800 Message-Id: <199602092039.MAA00892@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: hackers@FreeBSD.org cc: Thomas Roell Subject: TV vs. Xinside Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 12:38:41 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk As some of you are awared we have succeded into dumping raw video at high speed to a linear frame buffer. The problem is that some of you have a matrox meteor PCI video capture board and Xinside's Xserver. I proposed to Thomas a small video extension which will push all the intelligence of handling the video inside his X server. My rational is to avoid problems with different graphic architecutres or graphic chip revisions. At any rate, Thomas wants to give us an interface in which he passes us the geometry, depth, and physical location of the frame buffer. Discussions on manipulating the frame buffer, like dithering or scaling by the cpu are beyond the scope of this discussion. In simple terms, I am only interested in high speed video to the frame buffer. Have fun guys, Amancio > The reason why is because I want the people who bought your Xserver and the > authors of the matrox meteor to agree on the selected method. > > With the following addition that the interface to the special extension > shall be : > 0. name raw-video > > 1. device handle --- for now we can call this freebsd video capture > device 1 for the matrox meteor. > > 2. geometry and placement of the window > > 3. hue > > 4. brightness > > If the current color depth is not compatible with the depth of the > video capture board return failure Hmm ... I think you got my idea wrong. What you are proposing is basically putting everything under control of let's say the XVideo extension. What I was thinking about was having an extension with one simple request that would return you stuff like: typedef struct fbDesc { unsigned int winAAttributes; /* banked memory access */ unsigned int winBAttributes; unsigned int winGranularity; unsigned int winSize; unsigned int winABase; unsigned int winBBase; unsigned int displayOrigin; /* byte origin origin of display */ unsigned int bytesPerScanLine; /* scanline offset in bytes */ unsigned int videoMemory; char bitsPerPixel; /* device not X padding !!! */ char memoryModel; char colorModel; /* color model of normal visual */ char bitsRGB; /* 0 means non modifyable */ char redSize, redPosition; /* if model is direct ... */ char greenSize, greenPosition; char blueSize, bluePosition; } fbDescRec, *fbDescPtr; #define WINDOW_SUPPORTED 0x01 #define WINDOW_READABLE 0x02 #define WINDOW_WRITEABLE 0x04 #define MEMORY_TEXT 0x00 #define MEMORY_CGA 0x01 #define MEMORY_HGC 0x02 #define MEMORY_PLANAR 0x03 #define MEMORY_PACKED 0x04 #define MEMORY_RIX 0x05 #define MEMORY_DIRECTCOLOR 0x06 /* same as PACKED */ #define MEMORY_YUV 0x07 #define CMODEL_GRAY 0 /* indexed color, but only 1 LUT */ #define CMODEL_INDEXED 1 /* indexex color, 3 LUTs (RGB) */ #define CMODEL_DIRECT 2 /* no index table */ From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 13:28:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA12768 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:28:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA12762 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:27:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rover.village.org (8.6.11/8.6.6) with SMTP id OAA24022; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 14:27:25 -0700 Message-Id: <199602092127.OAA24022@rover.village.org> To: Luigi Rizzo Subject: Re: PDF viewers Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of Fri, 09 Feb 1996 19:26:53 +0100 Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 14:27:25 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk : I got this message from an unrelated list. It's a pdf viewer which : seems to work reasonably well, and it's probably faster than using : ghostscript (and certainly much smaller). Worth a try, and possibly : making it a package. Aladdin Ghostscript also does the job, but can't be included due to licensing restrictions. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 13:35:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA13471 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:35:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (rah.star-gate.com [204.188.121.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA13466 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:35:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from rah.star-gate.com (localhost.v-site.net [127.0.0.1]) by rah.star-gate.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA02623; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:34:44 -0800 Message-Id: <199602092134.NAA02623@rah.star-gate.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: Luigi Rizzo cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: PDF viewers In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Feb 1996 19:26:53 +0100." <199602091826.TAA03031@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 13:33:41 -0800 From: "Amancio Hasty Jr." Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Most cool tnks a lot for the pointer. Just finished trying it out over here and I was able to read the PNP documents which are in PDF format. Now I don't have to view PDF files on Bettina's SGI Box 8) Cheers, Amancio From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 13:38:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA13717 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:38:27 -0800 (PST) Received: (from jmb@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA13710 Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:38:24 -0800 (PST) From: "Jonathan M. Bresler" Message-Id: <199602092138.NAA13710@freefall.freebsd.org> Subject: Re: PDF viewers To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:38:24 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602091826.TAA03031@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 9, 96 07:26:53 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Luigi Rizzo said > > I got this message from an unrelated list. It's a pdf viewer which > seems to work reasonably well, and it's probably faster than using > ghostscript (and certainly much smaller). Worth a try, and possibly > making it a package. > > > The xpdf home page is: > > http://www.contrib.andrew.cmu.edu/usr/dn0o/xpdf/xpdf.html > > chuck robey has already ported this app. it works but is still "not quite there". hopefully it will continue to improve ;) From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 13:47:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA14328 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:47:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from plains.nodak.edu (tinguely@plains.NoDak.edu [134.129.111.64]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA14322 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:46:59 -0800 (PST) Received: (from tinguely@localhost) by plains.nodak.edu (8.7.1/8.7.1) id PAA29468; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:46:49 -0600 (CST) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:46:49 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Tinguely Message-Id: <199602092146.PAA29468@plains.nodak.edu> To: hackers@FreeBSD.org, rminnich@Sarnoff.COM Subject: Re: multicast config confusion: can't get mrouted to work Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > ep0: flags=863 mtu 1500 > inet 130.33.10.216 netmask 0xfffff800 broadcast 130.33.15.255 > > OK, i have two at least multicast capable interfaces. BUT, my ep0 is not > multicast capable. Is this because it can broadcast? there's no ifconfig > option to set multicast ... you need the if_ep.c multicast fixes. Alicher O Alikhodjaev posted some earlier this week. I admit to have cheated and used the patched if_ep.c from 2.0.5 when a local prof went to 2.1.0. I am sure Alicher's are much better. > > no enable vifs? garg. Looking in mrouted source leads me to believe it > should find at least lp0 and sl0 above. Geez, i'm really in the dark. Any > hints would help. I haven't found anything helpful on the cdrom yet. but these devices are not active. mrouted did the correct thing and ignored them. --mark. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 14:15:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA18143 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 14:15:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from terra.Sarnoff.COM (terra.sarnoff.com [130.33.11.203]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA18129 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 14:14:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from section05 (morse.sarnoff.com [130.33.10.158]) by terra.Sarnoff.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA23458 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 17:11:55 -0500 Received: by section05 (5.x/SECTION05-Client) id AA21352; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 17:12:18 -0500 Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 17:12:17 -0500 (EST) From: "Ron G. Minnich" To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: multicast config confusion: can't get mrouted to work In-Reply-To: Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk OK, i'm better after setting IFF_MULTICAST in the ep0 flags, assuming that there was no reason for it not to be set. Things are making more sense now, but I'm still a little unclear on the role of mrouted. In a dedicated network of 16 machines is there ever a reason to run it? It would appear not. thanks ron Ron Minnich |" XNFPREP: ERROR 4007: rminnich@sarnoff.com | Everything in the design was deleted." (609)-734-3120 |Was it something I said? ftp://ftp.sarnoff.com/pub/mnfs/www/docs/cluster.html From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 14:41:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA21042 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 14:41:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA21024 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 14:41:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id XAA13823 ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 23:40:54 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id XAA07049 ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 23:40:53 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.3/keltia-uucp-2.7) id XAA04426; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 23:08:40 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199602092208.XAA04426@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: mail sending problem (how can this happen?) To: ulf@z-code.ncd.com (Ulf Zimmermann) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 23:08:40 +0100 (MET) Cc: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9602090834.ZM1038@zolaris.z-code.com> from Ulf Zimmermann at "Feb 9, 96 08:34:35 am" X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1630 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL5 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk It seems that Ulf Zimmermann said: > happen. So, if you have important mail and want to be sure it arrives, > put the Return-Receipt: line into your mailheaders. Return-Receipt-To: support was dropped in sendmail 8.7.*. It is supposed to be replaced by DSN (see RFC-1890 or around). > Ulf Zimmermann, NCD Software, 101 Rowland Way, Suite 300, Novato, CA 94945 > phone: 415-899-7941, email: ulf@z-code.ncd.com, phone-home: 510-865-0204 How about a FreeBSD version of Zmail ? -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #5: Sun Feb 4 03:11:17 MET 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 14:42:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA21223 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 14:42:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from franklin-fddi.cris.com (franklin-fddi.cris.com [199.3.126.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA21214 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 14:42:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from fs1.cris.com by franklin-fddi.cris.com [1-800-745-CRIS (voice)] Received: from chad.gaianet.net by fs1.cris.com (8.7.1) id RAA14332; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 17:42:27 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199602092242.RAA14332@fs1.cris.com> X-Sender: zoogy@pop3.cris.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 14:44:57 -0500 To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org From: zoogy@cris.com (Chad Shackley) Subject: Memory above 64MB X-Mailer: Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk >> Is There any kernel parameter to increase the max visible >> ram? >Yes. See /sys/i386/conf/LINT for details on the actual option. This may have changed in a later version, I have 2.1.0-release, but I don't see any mention of the MAXMEM option in the LINT file. I've only seen it in the FAQ, and maybe in the handbook (I don't remember). It's probably not a bad idea for that reference to be put into the LINT file. Chad From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 14:49:24 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA22000 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 14:49:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from franklin-fddi.cris.com (franklin-fddi.cris.com [199.3.126.7]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA21994 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 14:49:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from fs1.cris.com by franklin-fddi.cris.com [1-800-745-CRIS (voice)] Received: from chad.gaianet.net by fs1.cris.com (8.7.1) id RAA14467; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 17:48:54 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199602092248.RAA14467@fs1.cris.com> X-Sender: zoogy@pop3.cris.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 14:51:25 -0500 To: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org From: zoogy@cris.com (Chad Shackley) Subject: Multi-processor X-Mailer: Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk What's the status of support for multi-processor machines? Are any supported yet; are any being looked at? I have a dual-processor pentium 100, and don't like the extra processor going to waste. Thanks. Chad From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 15:02:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA23353 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:02:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from werple.net.au (werple.mira.net.au [203.9.190.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA23341 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:02:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from cimaxp1.UUCP (Ucimlogi@localhost) by werple.net.au (8.7/8.7.1) with UUCP id JAA18304 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:29:22 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199602092229.JAA18304@werple.net.au> X-Authentication-Warning: werple.net.au: Ucimlogi set sender to cimaxp1!jb using -f Received: by cimaxp1.cimlogic.com.au; (5.65/1.1.8.2/10Sep95-0953AM) id AA10698; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:28:38 +1100 From: John Birrell Subject: POSIX 1003.1b compliance (timespec revisited) To: hackers@FreeBSD.org Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:28:38 +1100 (EST) Cc: jb@cimlogic.com.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk G'day, I recently posted a note to this list about the FreeBSD definition of timespec and the fact that it does not comply with IEEE 1003.1b-1993. I noted that NetBSD was about to make the change. Well the NetBSD change has happened and has found its way to at least a mirror at this end of the earth. So how about making the change to FreeBSD too? In /usr/src/sys/src/time.h FreeBSD defines: /* * Structure defined by POSIX.4 to be like a timeval. */ struct timespec { long ts_sec; /* seconds */ long ts_nsec; /* and nanoseconds */ }; NetBSD now defines: /* * Structure defined by POSIX.1b to be like a timeval. */ struct timespec { time_t tv_sec; /* seconds */ long tv_nsec; /* and nanoseconds */ }; which complies with IEEE 1003.1b-1993 14.1.1 I've just taken out all the NetBSD #if defined()'s from our code, but all the non-standard code is still required because of FreeBSD. Grrrr. I hope someone with commit privileges and an up-to-date cvs tree can spend 15 minutes fixing this. I don't see any point in me preparing diffs for this (just grep for ts_sec and ts_nsec!). Regards, -- John Birrell CIMlogic Pty Ltd jb@cimlogic.com.au 119 Cecil Street Ph +61 3 9690 6900 South Melbourne Vic 3205 Fax +61 3 9690 6650 Australia Mob +61 18 353 137 From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 15:17:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA24458 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:17:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from cwbone.bsi.com.br ([200.250.250.14]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA24447 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:17:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from cwbtr01.bsi.com.br (cwbtr01 [200.250.250.18]) by cwbone.bsi.com.br (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA16944 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 21:16:21 GMT Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 21:20:48 +0000 () From: Sergio de Almeida Lenzi cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: What a OS!! In-Reply-To: <199602091902.LAA12069@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 9 Feb 1996, Amancio Hasty Jr. wrote: > > Well, lets try this again... Has anyone recently ran WordPerfect for SCO > successfully? I was poking around and ask some curstomers about word processors, I think they are expensive and not reliable (word...) The best thing I see is Latex and companion. I will try Lyx... Custumers said that word is good for little things but I saw some work done in LaTex and find it has superior quality..., Thanks a lot, Sergio de Almeida Lenzi. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 15:18:56 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA24515 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:18:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from ncd.com (firewall-user@welch.ncd.com [192.43.160.250]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA24510 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:18:55 -0800 (PST) Received: by ncd.com; id PAA16175; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:20:47 -0800 Received: from z-code.z-code.com(192.82.56.21) by welch.ncd.com via smap (g3.0.1) id xma016150; Fri, 9 Feb 96 15:20:25 -0800 Received: from zolaris.z-code.com (zolaris.z-code.com [192.82.56.41]) by z-code.z-code.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA21525; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:16:02 -0800 Received: by zolaris.z-code.com (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA01675; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:13:50 -0800 From: "Ulf Zimmermann" Message-Id: <9602091513.ZM1673@zolaris.z-code.com> Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:13:49 -0800 In-Reply-To: Ollivier Robert "Re: mail sending problem (how can this happen?)" (Feb 9, 23:08) References: <199602092208.XAA04426@keltia.freenix.fr> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.0 06sep94) To: Ollivier Robert , ulf@z-code.ncd.com (Ulf Zimmermann) Subject: Re: mail sending problem (how can this happen?) Cc: kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de, freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Feb 9, 23:08, Ollivier Robert wrote: > Subject: Re: mail sending problem (how can this happen?) > It seems that Ulf Zimmermann said: > > happen. So, if you have important mail and want to be sure it arrives, > > put the Return-Receipt: line into your mailheaders. > > Return-Receipt-To: support was dropped in sendmail 8.7.*. It is supposed to > be replaced by DSN (see RFC-1890 or around). > > > Ulf Zimmermann, NCD Software, 101 Rowland Way, Suite 300, Novato, CA 94945 > > phone: 415-899-7941, email: ulf@z-code.ncd.com, phone-home: 510-865-0204 > > How about a FreeBSD version of Zmail ? >-- End of excerpt from Ollivier Robert I am digging on that ;-) There should be some testing soon. Ulf. -- Ulf Zimmermann, NCD Software, 101 Rowland Way, Suite 300, Novato, CA 94945 phone: 415-899-7941, email: ulf@z-code.ncd.com, phone-home: 510-865-0204 ====================================== FreeBSD 2.1.0 is available now! -------------------------------------- FreeBSD: Turning PCs into Workstations ====================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 15:31:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA25645 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:31:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from rocky.sri.MT.net (rocky.sri.MT.net [204.182.243.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA25630 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:31:18 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nate@localhost) by rocky.sri.MT.net (8.6.12/8.6.12) id JAA12608; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:15:39 -0700 Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:15:39 -0700 From: Nate Williams Message-Id: <199602091615.JAA12608@rocky.sri.MT.net> To: StevenR362@aol.com Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: [PCMCIA] pccard-test 960207 is now available In-Reply-To: <960209003831_418290599@emout10.mail.aol.com> References: <960209003831_418290599@emout10.mail.aol.com> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > >We announce the release newest alpha-test version (960207) of our > >"pccard-test" package. > > Shouldn't somebody be blatting this into CVS along a vendor branch > so that revision info is maintained on it. Unfortunately, this code is a mixture of both the original release code plus some bits from -current. (There were JREMOD diffs in the middle of some of the older diffs for example). I'm keeping the actual /sys/pccard diffs current to -current, and in the process of bringing them back to -stable as well. I'll be working on the /sys/i386/isa bits as well, and hope to commit some of it when I get the lineage a bit more removed. I realize it is alpha code, but > it > could prove useful to have it under CVS in case a card stops working > between 9602xx and 960?xx releases. I assume it will eventually go into > the current tree. I'm going to *attempt* (assumming Poul lets me) to bring in the /sys/pccard bits into both -stable and -current to make it easier to minimize the patches in xperiment. The code is useless in -stable w/out changes to /sys/i386/i386/conf.c anyway, so it won't hurt. However, the patches to /sys/i386 probably won't go into -stable unless they have merit outside of the PCCARD world. And, some of the bits may not go into -current if I or Poul don't feel they are OK to go. > Is there a way to put something into the CVS repository so that it is > readily available but also not part of current? Sorta an experimental or > reference Yep, you add it on a branch. However, I attempted to do this in the past with a verion of CVS, and I don't think anyone had the time and/or desire to look at it, so I'm not convinced it's worth my time and effort to bring things in given the headaches of keeping branch revisions up. Nate From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 15:54:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA27716 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:54:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA27711 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 15:54:16 -0800 (PST) Received: by Sysiphos id AA19472 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freebsd.org); Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:54:06 +0100 Message-Id: <199602092354.AA19472@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:54:06 +0100 In-Reply-To: Luigi Rizzo "PCI problem" (Feb 9, 17:49) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: Luigi Rizzo Subject: Re: PCI problem Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Feb 9, 17:49, Luigi Rizzo wrote: } Subject: PCI problem } [sorry to bother the list, but I lost the name of the guy who asked me } for more info] Might have been me ??? } pci bus 0x0 cardnum 0x0d, vendor 0x1022 device 0x2000 } AMD 79C970 Lance } STATUS 0x0200 COMMAND 0x0185 } CLASS 0x02 0x00 0x00 REVISION 0x02 } BASE0 0x0000ff41 addr 0x0000ff40 I/O } MAX_LAT 0x00 MIN_GNT 0x00 INT_PIN 0x01 INT_LINE 0x0b } pci bus 0x0 cardnum 0x0f, vendor 0x1022 device 0x2000 } AMD 79C970 Lance } STATUS 0x0200 COMMAND 0x0185 } CLASS 0x02 0x00 0x00 REVISION 0x02 } BASE0 0x0000ff81 addr 0x0000ff80 I/O } MAX_LAT 0x00 MIN_GNT 0x00 INT_PIN 0x01 INT_LINE 0x0b } As you can see, the two network cards share the same int line, even } though the kernel believes they are at int 11 and 10 respectively. As I already wrote in my previous reply, the kernel has no right at all to assume an IRQ for a PCI card. The PCI BIOS assigns IRQs at POST time, and configures a PCI Int to ISA IRQ routing network accordingly. } Any ideas on what can be going on ? The motherboard is an Intel Zappa. Well, the Lance based PCI cards aren't a good choice currently, since they are not supported by a PCI driver. Instead they are used with the lnc0 "ISA" driver, which has no concept of shared interrupts ... If there are no other free IRQs, then the BIOS was right to assign IRQ 11 to both cards. Some operating systems (e.g. Win95) support shared interrupts only for devices of the same class (i.e. network cards). The FreeBSD PCI interrupt code doesn't suffer from such limitations. The BIOS choose perfectly valid numbers, but sadly there isn't yet a PCI wrapper for the "lnc" driver. (If you want to write one you could take the "bt" code would be a good starting point. I could review your code, but I really don't have the time to write it and don't have the hardware to test it ...) Regards, STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 16:03:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA28180 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 16:03:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA28172 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 16:03:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by Sysiphos id AA20999 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@FreeBSD.ORG); Sat, 10 Feb 1996 01:02:55 +0100 Message-Id: <199602100002.AA20999@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 01:02:54 +0100 In-Reply-To: Terry Lambert "Re: PCI problem" (Feb 9, 12:54) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: Terry Lambert Subject: Re: PCI problem Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Feb 9, 12:54, Terry Lambert wrote: } Subject: Re: PCI problem } > As you can see, the two network cards share the same int line, even } > though the kernel believes they are at int 11 and 10 respectively. } > } > Any ideas on what can be going on ? The motherboard is an Intel Zappa. } } Yeah. The kernel is wrong. The PCI bus is right. True. } The cards have the same interrupt assigned by the PCI BIOS. It is the } responsibility of the OS to understand PCI interrrupt multiplexing and } Deal With It(tm). Yes. And every good OS does :) } Very few OS's currently do this because almost all motherboard } manufacturers except the Intel OEM products division consider it } a mistake to not have an interrupt per PCI slot. No, that's wrong (sorry ...) If you have two cards in neighbour slots and one of them is either a multi-function PCI device or contains a PCI to PCI bridge, then just about every PCI motherboard will have to assign the same IRQ multiple times. This is caused by having IntA of one slot be connected to IntB of one neighbour. } You will need to specifically override one of the cards idea of the } "correct" interrupt (some PCI card hardware supports jumpering of ISA } interrupts), you will need to override the single interrupt assignment } on the motherboard (not possible on some Intel boards), or you will } need to modify the interrupt handling mechanism (if it hasn't already } been done) to support demuxxing the cards. In the last case, it is } correct for the cards to have the same interrupt. FreeBSD got code for shared PCI interrupts for one year now. And that code is known to work just fine ... The problem is that the Lance PCI cards aren't fully supported (their PCI features, that is). And they call the ISA register_intr() function, which doesn't know anything about shared interrupts ... As long as their is no /sys/pci/lnc.c with a wrapper that just reads teh configuration registers, registers a PCI interrupt handler and then calls the attach code in the ISA Lance driver, the card will be limited by ISA constraints ... Regards, STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 16:12:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA28632 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 16:12:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from multivac.orthanc.com (root@multivac.orthanc.com [206.12.238.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA28626 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 16:12:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (lyndon@localhost) by multivac.orthanc.com (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA08724; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 16:10:29 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602100010.QAA08724@multivac.orthanc.com> X-Authentication-Warning: multivac.orthanc.com: Host lyndon@localhost didn't use HELO protocol From: Lyndon Nerenberg VE7TCP To: "Ulf Zimmermann" cc: imp@village.org, kuku@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Return-Receipt (was: Re: mail sending problem (how can this happen?)) In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Feb 1996 09:36:34 PST." <9602090936.ZM1100@zolaris.z-code.com> Date: Fri, 09 Feb 1996 16:10:28 -0800 Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Ulf" == Ulf Zimmermann writes: >> Return-receipt isn't standardized, but it mostly works. It should be noted that Return-Receipt-To has been officially deprecated by the IETF. Don't count on any MTA supporting this facility in the future. One of the IETF working groups (NOTARY?) is working on providing a (more useful) replacement using a mixture of MIME and ESMTP. The NOTARY mail archives are a good starting point if you want more information on this. --lyndon From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 17:24:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA02714 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 17:24:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA02703 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 17:23:57 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA11964; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 18:20:47 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602100120.SAA11964@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Multi-processor To: zoogy@cris.com (Chad Shackley) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 18:20:47 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@freefall.freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602092248.RAA14467@fs1.cris.com> from "Chad Shackley" at Feb 9, 96 02:51:25 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > What's the status of support for multi-processor machines? Are any > supported yet; are any being looked at? I have a dual-processor pentium > 100, and don't like the extra processor going to waste. An engineer at Intel is looking at making the locore.s changes I need to get the updated patches fully running in -current (so is Peter Wemm 8-)). He is going to send me mail when he has -current up and running on his box (which is, I think, a 4 processor Pentium Pro box), and I am going to send him my updated Jack Vogel patches. I just don't have the equipment (a two-ICE machine) to debug some of the code without writing a *significant* amount of assembly code. After this, there will be patches submitted immediately for integration for low grain paralellism of the type Jack had working (and still works if you apply his patches vs. a 28 Oct 95 checkout from CVS). For the next stage, kernel reeentrancy, there will have to be a lot of setup for kernel synchronization push down. This basically means moving the synchronization code for kernel reentrancy down below the trap and interrupt code. I haven't dealt with the issue of interrupt-time reentrancy... using a push-down, I can do the trap code seperately. Basically, the trap code requires instituting lock states at the system call layer, and then multithreading system calls a subsystem at a time. For the intermediate stage, this pretty much requires single entry/single exit for all routines called from the trap code so that each subsystem can be multithreaded independently without breaking the whole kernel and needing to fix everything at once. You do this by seperating out a subsystem mutex from the MP mutext for a multithreaded subsystem, and applying it in the trap entries for the calls into that subsystem. The file system framework is going to be a bear in this regard, and I expect to have to iterate the code several times to get the interfaces completely seperated out to avoid deadlock on things like vnode locks (which are currently held via VOP_LOCK on a per FS basis because of ihashget). To handle these cases, I think maybe the cache will have to be moved to a dev/offset instead of a vnode/offset. This gets rid of the inode/vnode layer dissociation in vclean() in vfs_subr.c, which means that the VOP_LOCK for vp's can become FS independent (if a union FS needs to lock a vp, it will have to lock the underlying vp's, so advisory VOP_LOCK calls to mostly null op's will still be needed -- but that can be done in the VLOCK/VUNLOCK inlines). The "biggie" will be implementing a hierarchical lock manager to avoid using real mutexes (which are expensive). It has to be hierarchical in order to compute transitive closure... deadlock detection would mean too many code changes because of the amount of state you need to unwind, so deadlock avoidance is a major design principle. I may just "punt" on the interrupt code, and let someone else work it out. I'm sure it will involve immediate requeue and virtualization. The actual interrupt handling should be via kernel thread (like "update" and the pager use, initially), instead of occuring at interrupt level (this is how NT, SVR4 ES/MP, and Solaris operate). Since the problems of kernel reeentrancy and kernel preemption are so very similar, I expect kernel multithreading (and therefore kernel threads) to just "drop out", if the code is written correctly. The overriding goal is to allow the SMP to "compile out" using macro substitution, while keeping the multithreading and reentrancy. Anyway, that's my status. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 18:36:08 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA06703 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 18:36:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA06660 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 18:36:03 -0800 (PST) Received: by Sysiphos id AA22397 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freebsd.org); Sat, 10 Feb 1996 03:34:59 +0100 Message-Id: <199602100234.AA22397@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 03:34:58 +0100 In-Reply-To: Luigi Rizzo "Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff" (Feb 9, 16:30) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: Luigi Rizzo Subject: Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Feb 9, 16:30, Luigi Rizzo wrote: } Subject: Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff } > You can change this value without knowing } } I guess you mean "cannot" Yes. I really shouldn't write mail replies long after midnight after working some 16 hours (what's the current time :) } > the details of the chip set. There are now } > PCI BIOS calls that ought to allow such an } } From the meteor.c driver : } } ... } #ifdef METEOR_IRQ /* from the meteor.h file */ } old_irq = pci_conf_read(tag, PCI_INTERRUPT_REG); } pci_conf_write(tag, PCI_INTERRUPT_REG, METEOR_IRQ); } new_irq = pci_conf_read(tag, PCI_INTERRUPT_REG); } printf("meteor_attach: irq changed from %d to %d\n", (old_irq & 0xff), } (new_irq & 0xff)); } #endif METEOR_IRQ } ... } } it looks like it is not that hard, if the above works. Yes. It looks trivially simple. And it does of course not work at all ... The PCI_INTERRUPT_REG is a Byte register, which has the sole purpose to let the driver know about the BIOS provided interrupt routing setup. You can change this value to whatever you want, but all it will do is confuse whoever later reads the register and believes what he finds :) } Note that I don't want to chang IRQ settings for an active board, just } to remap the setting for a board which is not correctly recognised. } It is intended as a fixit tool, "use at your own risk". It is a NOOP ... (Well, not really. The code later uses this value for the call to register_intr(). But the only reason for a wrong number being written by the BIOS is, that the IRQ routing is done in hardware (i.e. by jumpers) and the PCI BIOS settings have not been adjusted accordingly. Such BIOS jumpers were state of the art in mid 1994, but I doubt there are many systems that still use them. And the correct values have just to be entered in teh BIOS setup ...) } I have two identical PC-net PCI boards, plugged in adjacent slots. } On one particular motherboard they are both configured with IRQ10, on a } similar motherboard one gets IRQ10, the other IRQ11 Yes, I just read your other message ... The problem is the level of PCI support for the Lance. It needs just a few hours of work, I guess ... } Also, at times I'd like to free some specific IRQs. As an example: here } I have a system with the following devices: } } sio0,1,2 (irq 3, 4, 5) } lpt0 (irq7) } ed0 (irq10, PCI) } meteor (irq9,PCI) } vga (irq11, PCI) } } and I'd like to put in a scanner (can use irq3,5,10) and an SB16. } I must free irq10, and possibly irq9 as well. I don't know how your PCI BIOS chooses the IRQ values. All PCI cards but the Lance Etherner cards can share an interrupt. I prefer boards, where I can assign any IRQ to IntA of each PCI slot, but current systems are delivered as PnP, and they just don't offer this config mode anymore ... You really need the PCI attach code for the Lance ... Regards, STefan -- Stefan Esser, Zentrum fuer Paralleles Rechnen Tel: +49 221 4706021 Universitaet zu Koeln, Weyertal 80, 50931 Koeln FAX: +49 221 4705160 ============================================================================== http://www.zpr.uni-koeln.de/~se From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 18:44:06 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id SAA07131 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 18:44:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from Sysiphos (Sysiphos.MI.Uni-Koeln.DE [134.95.212.10]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA07126 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 18:44:04 -0800 (PST) Received: by Sysiphos id AA22467 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for hackers@freebsd.org); Sat, 10 Feb 1996 03:43:58 +0100 Message-Id: <199602100243.AA22467@Sysiphos> From: se@zpr.uni-koeln.de (Stefan Esser) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 03:43:57 +0100 In-Reply-To: Terry Lambert "Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff" (Feb 9, 13:03) X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 alpha(2) 7/9/95) To: Terry Lambert Subject: Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Feb 9, 13:03, Terry Lambert wrote: } Subject: Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff } > isn't it "the same interrupt to all boards with the same PCI id ?" } > otherwise why the meteor and the ethernet get different IRQs ? } } I'm not sure. The BusLogic SCSI problem seemed to be generic, but I } could be wrong here. Hmm, I'm not sure what you mean with the BusLogic SCSI problem. But in fact the "bt" driver suffered from the same problem as the "lnc". It was an ISA driver, that happened to work fine with the PCI card, since that offered a full emulation of the ISA predecessor ... There is now a /sys/pci/bt9xx.c in -current and -stable, and a similar wrapper ahs to be written for the Lance ... } The jury (Stephan) is still out on whether or not the -current code } handles PCI interrupt demuxxing trasnparently or not. It's a general } problem, so it *should* be succeptible to a general soloution. If so, } then the only thing you are paying for on shared interrupts in reduced } concurrency. Shared PCI interrupts are supported for quite some time. } Assuming the code is there, then worst case is poorer performance than } unshared interrupts because of average traversal time for the demux } being higher than if you didn't have to do a demux. True. All devices that share an IRQ are polled to find the one that caused the interrupt. A PCI interrupt handler should first check whether there is anything to do with as little cycles as possible, for this reason. The code applies the correct interrupt mask before calling each handler. } That is, there is a software work-around that may or may not be there } yet, and even if it's there, you should avoid the motherboards because } they will have lower performance than motherboards that don't rely on } the software work-around. I guess that shared interrupts will cost much less than 1% performance even on a heavily loaded server machine with thousands of interrupts a second. Nothing to really worry about ... Regards, STefan From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 19:15:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA08716 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:15:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA08710 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:15:17 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id UAA13389; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 20:11:57 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602100311.UAA13389@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: POSIX 1003.1b compliance (timespec revisited) To: cimaxp1!jb@werple.net.au (John Birrell) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 20:11:57 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, jb@cimlogic.com.au In-Reply-To: <199602092229.JAA18304@werple.net.au> from "John Birrell" at Feb 10, 96 09:28:38 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > I recently posted a note to this list about the FreeBSD definition of > timespec and the fact that it does not comply with IEEE 1003.1b-1993. > I noted that NetBSD was about to make the change. Well the NetBSD change > has happened and has found its way to at least a mirror at this end of the > earth. So how about making the change to FreeBSD too? These structures are everywhere. 8-(. Not to mention that "time" in kernel.h is referenced directly instead of via a macro. 8-(. The cleanup on these things should probably wait until after David Greenman integrates the Lite2 code. I think NetBSD did this some time ago. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 20:22:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA13698 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 20:22:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from ki.net (root@ki.net [142.77.249.8]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA13668 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 20:22:12 -0800 (PST) Received: (from scrappy@localhost) by ki.net (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA04609; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 23:22:24 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 23:22:23 -0500 (EST) From: "Marc G. Fournier" To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: C Coding Question... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Hi... I probably shouldn't send this here, but the only other place I can think of is comp.lang.c, and I don't get that newsgroup :( And last time I checked out that group on another system...it was a bunch of DOS users :( I've written some code, that, for the life of me, I can't figure out why its giving me the results it is: The fragment of code looks like: ----------------- dblist *head, *temp; head = temp = get_dbrec("userid", "template", "advanced", "geoff"); fprintf(stderr, "userid=%s\n", head->value); while(temp != NULL) { temp->value = get_valuer(content, temp->name); fprintf(tfile, "%-20s [%s]: %s [%s]\n", temp->name, head->name, temp->value, head->value); temp = temp->next; } fprintf(stderr, "userid=%s\n", head->value); ----------------- the structure dblist looks like: typedef struct data { char *name; char *value; struct data *next; struct data *key; } dblist; Now, get_dbrec() pulls a record out of a postgres95 database file, and initialize a linked list of values...and it does this correctly. After initializing, head->value == "template", which is correct, and what I'm expecting. When I run the code, the output looks like: userid [userid]: scrappy@ki.net [scrappy@ki.net] fname [userid]: Marc [Marc] street [userid]: [] city [userid]: [] state [userid]: [] phone [userid]: [] job [userid]: No Answer [No Answer] terms [userid]: Qualify [Qualify] score [userid]: 0 [0] pcode [userid]: [] faxphone [userid]: [] Which is where the problem is. head->name, which points at the beginning of the list, has the correct value in it all the way through the while() loop, but for some reason, head->value keeps taking on the new value, even though I'm not assigning it a new value anywhere, or at least, not that I can figure out. The value of 'head->value' *should* remain as 'scrappy@ki.net', just like 'head->name' is 'userid'. I realize that I'm probably missing something *really* stupid, but after working on this for 3 days and trying to figure out the problem, I'm at a complete loss :( I also realize that there is probably incomplete data here as well, but can't think of anything else to add :( Any ideas of where I should look, or what I'm missing? thanks... Marc G. Fournier | POP Mail Telnet Acct DNS Hosting System | WWW Services Database Services | Knowledge, Administrator | | Information and scrappy@ki.net | WWW: http://www.ki.net | Communications, Inc From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 20:56:31 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id UAA15919 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 20:56:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from cd.iidpwr.com ([204.33.177.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA15908 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 20:56:24 -0800 (PST) Received: (from tam@localhost) by cd.iidpwr.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id UAA09869; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 20:56:27 -0800 Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 20:56:27 -0800 (PST) From: Tony Tam To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: NIS slave server Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Could anybody tell me how to configure FreeBSD-2.1.0-RELEASE as a NIS salve server? Tony Tam From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 22:48:19 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id WAA22807 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 22:48:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.eskimo.com (root@mail.eskimo.com [204.122.16.4]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id WAA22787 Fri, 9 Feb 1996 22:48:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from eskimo.com (dpk@eskimo.com [204.122.16.13]) by mail.eskimo.com (8.7.3/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA05736; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 22:47:50 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 22:47:28 -0800 (PST) From: David Kirchner To: Luis Verissimo cc: "Freeman P. Pascal IV" , FreeBSD Hackers list , questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Unexplained segfaults in 2.1.0-RELEASE In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 9 Feb 1996, Luis Verissimo wrote: > I have a 486DX4-100 machine running FreeBSD-2.1R. I experienced the same > problems. I had to disable both the internal and external caches, of my > machine. It then worked find. > > I have another 486DX2-66 older machine, that keeps getting those signals, > even with both caches disabled. That problem happened to me as well, those wouldn't happen to be AMD CPU's would they? Mine is a 486DX4-120 and I didn't only get segfaults, I got drive errors. AMD suggests in the FAQ it's due to people overclocking their CPUs, but I haven't done that personally. They also say if you put the clock back to normal, it'll work again. I'm Cc:'ing this to questions and hackers, feel free to change the Cc list if you want. =) -- David Kirchner -- dpk@eskimo.com From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Feb 9 23:09:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA23376 for hackers-outgoing; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 23:09:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA23369 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 1996 23:09:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id IAA04212; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 08:10:51 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602100710.IAA04212@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: scanpci.c and pci-related stuff To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 08:10:50 +0100 (MET) Cc: terry@lambert.org, se@zpr.uni-koeln.de, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602092003.NAA10981@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 9, 96 01:03:20 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > so what are your recommendations ? For comparable prices, of course. > > I recommend ASUS motherboards. I don't know if the prices are comparable > or not, since I never priced the non-working motherboards. For what > it's worth, I think "doesn't work" is the highest price you can pay, > no matter what the actual cost. when it does the job, it does work. We buy sistems for a student lab, and these usually have a single ethernet card. Only in special cases we need more ethernets on the same motherboard. Not to mention the trouble to get something that local distributor don't carry [it took three months to get a Meteor], and the possible troubles in having things repaired when they come in broken (it happens at time). Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 00:15:26 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA26752 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:15:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from precipice.shockwave.com (precipice.shockwave.com [171.69.108.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA26746 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:15:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost.shockwave.com (localhost.shockwave.com [127.0.0.1]) by precipice.shockwave.com (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA02077 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:14:51 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199602100814.AAA02077@precipice.shockwave.com> To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Cyrix 586 vs. Pentium for FreeBSD? Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:14:50 -0800 From: Paul Traina Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I noticed a slew of manufacturers are using Cyrix 586's in the most recent line of notebook computers instead of Pentiums. I've had a _really_ bad experience with a Cy486DLC which makes me shudder at the thought of another Cyrix purchase, however I wanted to get other people's experiences. Is anyone running FreeBSD on a Cyrix 586? If so, any problems that you could attribute to that processor? Does anyone know if the 586 is really instruction set, timing, and bug compatible with the pentium, or did they "improve" it like they did with the 486? Paul From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 00:44:39 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA27882 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:44:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA27877 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:44:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id TAA25424; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 19:14:12 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602100844.TAA25424@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: Unexplained segfaults in 2.1.0-RELEASE To: licau@ebs06.eb.uah.edu (Luis Verissimo) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 19:14:12 +1030 (CST) Cc: pascal@pascal.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Luis Verissimo" at Feb 9, 96 10:59:15 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Luis Verissimo stands accused of saying: > > I have a 486DX4-100 machine running FreeBSD-2.1R. I experienced the same > problems. I had to disable both the internal and external caches, of my > machine. It then worked find. > > I have another 486DX2-66 older machine, that keeps getting those signals, > even with both caches disabled. > > Can anybody tell me where is the list of machines that are currently > running FreeBSD with no problems? This is (obviously, if you actually think about it for a second) a totally impossible question. Let's see, there are perhaps something of the order of a hundred or so distinct CPU variants that can run FreeBSD. Perhaps a thousand or so major motherboard chipsets, several tens of significantly different disk controllers, several hundred different video cards and so on. Now take each number, one after another, and multiply them all together. This is the total number of possible PC configurations that there are. Let's assume that we were to build one of each of these hundred million or so combinations, and do a 'make world' on each to check them. If we assume that the systems are reasonably fast (not all true 8) this will take perhaps 10 hours each. So now we have a billion testing hours required, or 114,000 testing-years. Do you understand yet why what you ask is impossible? Now, if you said "this is my hardware", and listed everything you have, including the CPU manufacturer and motherboard chipset, it's possible that someone will know something, and will tell you. If not, you can add your two systems to the grouop that FreeBSD does _not_ work on due to fundamental hardware problems. However, it could just be that you have faulty memory, and your motherboard is actually fine, or your CPU could be faulty... > Luis Verissimo -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 00:54:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id AAA28211 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:54:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA28206 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:54:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id TAA25452; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 19:23:25 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602100853.TAA25452@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: What a OS!! To: hasty@rah.star-gate.com (Amancio Hasty Jr.) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 19:23:24 +1030 (CST) Cc: jkh@time.cdrom.com, lenzi@cwbtwo.bsi.com.br, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602091902.LAA12069@rah.star-gate.com> from "Amancio Hasty Jr." at Feb 9, 96 11:01:23 am MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Amancio Hasty Jr. stands accused of saying: > > > > Have you tried using WordPerfect for SCO? There's a demo on > > ftp.wperfect.com, I believe. If that seems to be usable for you, you > > can see what your customers think of it! :) > > Well, lets try this again... Has anyone recently ran WordPerfect for SCO > successfully? I had it up under -STABLE just before 2.1, and on an early-december -current system. You will have untold grief if you try to run it on anything other than an 8-bit display (ie. it won't work). > Amancio -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 01:34:55 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id BAA00278 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 01:34:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA00267 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 01:34:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id KAA04409 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:36:47 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602100936.KAA04409@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Compressed RAM/SWAP To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:36:46 +0100 (MET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Weekend brainstorm: compressed memory/swap. I'd like ideas on the subject. I am asking because there is a bunch of "RAM doubler" PC/MAC utilities. In principle, the same idea could be adopted for FreeBSD. But I am a bit worried about cost/performance: compression takes time, and keeps the CPU busy, while transferring to disk usually leaves the CPU free (except in the case of ISA-IDE controllers). A quick thing I did (on 1.1.5) was the following (swapinfo gave ~6MB out of 32MB of swap in use; discard the absolute performance, that's not an issue, as dd from the raw disk yields slightly above than 1MB/s): dd if=/dev/wd0b bs=4k count=1000 | gzip -1 | wc 4096000 bytes transferred in 13 secs (315076 bytes/sec) 2350 15360 747841 dd if=/dev/wd0b bs=4k count=4000 | gzip -1 | wc 16384000 bytes transferred in 56 secs (292571 bytes/sec) 13254 83574 3838686 dd if=/dev/wd0b bs=4k count=8000 | gzip -1 | wc 32768000 bytes transferred in 101 secs (324435 bytes/sec) 18816 118495 5675208 Trying to compress random, single pages yields highly variable results, but usually does better than 2:1. Many pages even compress to <100 bytes, they are probably unused or bzeroed. Although the above numbers might just mean that swap blocks are not allocated contiguously [is this true ?], it sounds reasonable that the swap in many cases holds bzero-ed pages with sparse non-zero elements. If this is true, then even simpler/ad hoc (and faster) compression algorithms than gzip can work. This said, where could it be reasonable to do this ? Of course, we are talking about systems with limited resources, either RAM or disk space. It will definitely help those systems which swap via NFS. Also, this approach is probably useful only on those system with a load average slightly above 1, where a page fault leaves the system essentially idle. It will definitely not help on high performance systems or busy ones. One possibility is to dedicate some amount of physical memory as an intermediate compressed, in-core, swap area. Pages get compressed to this area, and can be subsequently swapped to disk if needed. Note that if this area is small, then it is just a transient buffer for pages being swapped out, and it's probably meaningless as pages can be compressed in-place (or with just an additional bounce-buffer per CPU; let's think for the future!). If the area has a significant size, say min(2MB, 25% RAM) or more, then chances are that such a compression scheme might be effective. There are of course problems to be solved: the compressed swap should use fragments smaller than 4K, maybe 512b or so. Addressing these blocks might require big changes in the vm system, etc. [I don't know enough on this] Comments ? Have a nice weekend Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 02:32:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA02132 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 02:32:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA02126 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 02:32:41 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id FAA09522; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 05:37:16 -0500 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199602101037.FAA09522@hda.com> Subject: Re: Compressed RAM/SWAP To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 05:37:15 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602100936.KAA04409@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 10, 96 10:36:46 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > Weekend brainstorm: compressed memory/swap. > I'd like ideas on the subject. (...) > Trying to compress random, single pages yields highly variable > results, but usually does better than 2:1. Many pages even compress > to <100 bytes, they are probably unused or bzeroed. > > Although the above numbers might just mean that swap blocks are > not allocated contiguously [is this true ?], it sounds reasonable > that the swap in many cases holds bzero-ed pages with sparse non-zero > elements. If this is true, then even simpler/ad hoc (and faster) > compression algorithms than gzip can work. If there are lots of zero'd pages that aren't used that often, can't be eliminated, and would benefit from compression wouldn't it be better to look at a ZFOD (zero fill on demand) mechanism? Warning: I say this in response to this message and without looking closely enough at the VM source - I see some zero_page stuff in there but it seems to wind up using bzero. -- Peter Dufault Real-Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 02:42:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA02440 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 02:42:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from tfs.com (tfs.com [140.145.250.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA02435 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 02:42:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from critter.tfs.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0tlCkh-0003vsC; Sat, 10 Feb 96 02:41 PST Received: from localhost.tfs.com (localhost.tfs.com [127.0.0.1]) by critter.tfs.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA04551; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:42:00 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: critter.tfs.com: Host localhost.tfs.com didn't use HELO protocol To: Nate Williams cc: StevenR362@aol.com, hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: [PCMCIA] pccard-test 960207 is now available In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Feb 1996 09:15:39 MST." <199602091615.JAA12608@rocky.sri.MT.net> Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:41:59 +0100 Message-ID: <4549.823948919@critter.tfs.com> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > Shouldn't somebody be blatting this into CVS along a vendor branch > > so that revision info is maintained on it. I totally agree and support Nate, this is not yet ready to go into the tree. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | phk@FreeBSD.ORG FreeBSD Core-team. http://www.freebsd.org/~phk | phk@login.dknet.dk Private mailbox. whois: [PHK] | phk@ref.tfs.com TRW Financial Systems, Inc. Future will arrive by its own means, progress not so. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 02:42:46 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA02496 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 02:42:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA02470 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 02:42:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id LAA04471; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:43:51 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602101043.LAA04471@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Compressed RAM/SWAP To: dufault@hda.com (Peter Dufault) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:43:51 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602101037.FAA09522@hda.com> from "Peter Dufault" at Feb 10, 96 05:36:56 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > If there are lots of zero'd pages that aren't used that often, > can't be eliminated, and would benefit from compression wouldn't > it be better to look at a ZFOD (zero fill on demand) mechanism? But this only works if the pages are not accessed at all. The first time they are accessed they must be filled up. Luigi ==================================================================== Luigi Rizzo Dip. di Ingegneria dell'Informazione email: luigi@iet.unipi.it Universita' di Pisa tel: +39-50-568533 via Diotisalvi 2, 56126 PISA (Italy) fax: +39-50-568522 http://www.iet.unipi.it/~luigi/ ==================================================================== From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 02:51:00 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id CAA02777 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 02:51:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from hda.com (hda.com [199.232.40.182]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id CAA02771 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 02:50:57 -0800 (PST) Received: (from dufault@localhost) by hda.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id FAA09574; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 05:55:17 -0500 From: Peter Dufault Message-Id: <199602101055.FAA09574@hda.com> Subject: Re: Compressed RAM/SWAP To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 05:55:17 -0500 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602101043.LAA04471@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 10, 96 11:43:51 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > > If there are lots of zero'd pages that aren't used that often, > > can't be eliminated, and would benefit from compression wouldn't > > it be better to look at a ZFOD (zero fill on demand) mechanism? > > But this only works if the pages are not accessed at all. The first > time they are accessed they must be filled up. Well, yes, but for reads they can all point to the same underlying page, and for writes you're changing them anyway (and if you are sure the writes have to happen before they are accessed again you don't even need to fill them). If the problems are lots of zero pages it seems that there is a better way than compression, though I guess you can argue this is just compression optimized for zero pages. I better back off this discussion as it is outside my usual work. I'll let someone who knows this stuff comment. -- Peter Dufault Real-Time Machine Control and Simulation HD Associates, Inc. Voice: 508 433 6936 dufault@hda.com Fax: 508 433 5267 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 04:13:12 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA01916 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 04:13:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from haldjas.folklore.ee (Haldjas.folklore.ee [193.40.6.121]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA01641 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 04:13:00 -0800 (PST) Received: (from narvi@localhost) by haldjas.folklore.ee (8.6.12/8.6.12) id OAA00550; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 14:12:51 +0200 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 14:12:51 +0200 (EET) From: Narvi To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Unexplained segfaults in 2.1.0-RELEASE In-Reply-To: <199602100844.TAA25424@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk On Sat, 10 Feb 1996, Michael Smith wrote: > Luis Verissimo stands accused of saying: > > > > I have a 486DX4-100 machine running FreeBSD-2.1R. I experienced the same > > problems. I had to disable both the internal and external caches, of my > > machine. It then worked find. > > > > I have another 486DX2-66 older machine, that keeps getting those signals, > > even with both caches disabled. > > > > Can anybody tell me where is the list of machines that are currently > > running FreeBSD with no problems? > > This is (obviously, if you actually think about it for a second) a totally > impossible question. Let's see, there are perhaps something of the order > of a hundred or so distinct CPU variants that can run FreeBSD. Perhaps > a thousand or so major motherboard chipsets, several tens of significantly > different disk controllers, several hundred different video cards and so on. > > Now take each number, one after another, and multiply them all together. > > This is the total number of possible PC configurations that there are. Let's > assume that we were to build one of each of these hundred million or so > combinations, and do a 'make world' on each to check them. If we assume > that the systems are reasonably fast (not all true 8) this will take > perhaps 10 hours each. So now we have a billion testing hours required, > or 114,000 testing-years. Actually, a lot of this has been already done, and is being done all the time by numerous people. Perhaps a file could/should be created, where one could contribute their experiences? That way everybody asking about their configurations could be pointed first to that file... > > Do you understand yet why what you ask is impossible? > That way it would soon become a bit more possible. > Now, if you said "this is my hardware", and listed everything you have, > including the CPU manufacturer and motherboard chipset, it's possible that > someone will know something, and will tell you. If not, you can add your > two systems to the grouop that FreeBSD does _not_ work on due to > fundamental hardware problems. > > However, it could just be that you have faulty memory, and your motherboard > is actually fine, or your CPU could be faulty... > Or faulty SRAM - you can't find out unless you try again using proven RAM... Sander. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 04:48:50 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id EAA16474 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 04:48:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id EAA16425 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 04:48:44 -0800 (PST) Received: (from bde@localhost) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.6.9/8.6.9) id XAA30321; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:42:09 +1100 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:42:09 +1100 From: Bruce Evans Message-Id: <199602101242.XAA30321@godzilla.zeta.org.au> To: hackers@freebsd.org, souchu@firtech.lri.fr Subject: Re: EIDE 2300+ Promise Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk >My controller EIDE 2300+ Promise fails at boot in int 13h or >just after when executing real_to_proc, I don't know exactly. >What's wrong ? I don't know. >I have an idea. Why not programming a sort of linux-lodlin that would >start FreeBSD from DOS after installing the Promise int 13h driver ? dosboot.exe in FreeBSD already does this. Bruce From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 06:07:21 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA24370 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 06:07:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from whome.planix.com (whome.planix.com [204.29.161.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA24361 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 06:07:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by whome.planix.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #38) id m0tlFxK-00075hC; Sat, 10 Feb 96 09:07 EST Received: by mail.kcis.com (KCIS.COM-5) id JAA02566; Sat Feb 10 09:07:37 1996 Organization: Kendall Communications & Information Services, Toronto, Canada Posted-Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:07:37 -0500 (EST) Received-Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:07:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:07:37 -0500 (EST) From: Jerry Kendall To: Terry Lambert cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: POSIX 1003.1b compliance (timespec revisited) In-Reply-To: <199602100311.UAA13389@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 9 Feb 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > > I recently posted a note to this list about the FreeBSD definition of > > timespec and the fact that it does not comply with IEEE 1003.1b-1993. > > I noted that NetBSD was about to make the change. Well the NetBSD change > > has happened and has found its way to at least a mirror at this end of the > > earth. So how about making the change to FreeBSD too? > > These structures are everywhere. 8-(. > > Not to mention that "time" in kernel.h is referenced directly instead > of via a macro. 8-(. > > The cleanup on these things should probably wait until after David > Greenman integrates the Lite2 code. I think NetBSD did this some > time ago. > For those of us, myself included, what is this 'Lite2' code ?? Jerry From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 06:16:52 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA24692 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 06:16:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from whome.planix.com (whome.planix.com [204.29.161.33]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA24687 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 06:16:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by whome.planix.com (Smail3.1.28.1 #38) id m0tlG6Z-00075hC; Sat, 10 Feb 96 09:16 EST Received: by mail.kcis.com (KCIS.COM-5) id JAA02566; Sat Feb 10 09:07:37 1996 Organization: Kendall Communications & Information Services, Toronto, Canada Posted-Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:07:37 -0500 (EST) Received-Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:07:37 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:07:37 -0500 (EST) From: Jerry Kendall To: Terry Lambert cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: POSIX 1003.1b compliance (timespec revisited) In-Reply-To: <199602100311.UAA13389@phaeton.artisoft.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk On Fri, 9 Feb 1996, Terry Lambert wrote: > > I recently posted a note to this list about the FreeBSD definition of > > timespec and the fact that it does not comply with IEEE 1003.1b-1993. > > I noted that NetBSD was about to make the change. Well the NetBSD change > > has happened and has found its way to at least a mirror at this end of the > > earth. So how about making the change to FreeBSD too? > > These structures are everywhere. 8-(. > > Not to mention that "time" in kernel.h is referenced directly instead > of via a macro. 8-(. > > The cleanup on these things should probably wait until after David > Greenman integrates the Lite2 code. I think NetBSD did this some > time ago. > For those of us, myself included, what is this 'Lite2' code ?? Jerry From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 06:56:54 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id GAA26041 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 06:56:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.31.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA26034 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 06:56:50 -0800 (PST) Received: (from kuku@localhost) by gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA03399 for freebsd-hackers@freefall.cdrom.com; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 15:59:34 +0100 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 15:59:34 +0100 From: "Christoph P. Kukulies" Message-Id: <199602101459.PAA03399@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> To: freebsd-hackers@freefall.FreeBSD.org Subject: CAP (Columbia AppleTalk Protocol) - status? Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Windows NT (shudder) Server has built in AppleTalk Server capabilities. It would be nice if FreeBSD would be delivered with that too. There is CAP and I believe NetATalk. Is anyone using one of these under FreeBSD? --Chris Christoph P. U. Kukulies kuku@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 07:45:57 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id HAA28126 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 07:45:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from bacchus.eng.umd.edu (bacchus.eng.umd.edu [129.2.94.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA28119 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 07:45:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from cappuccino.eng.umd.edu (cappuccino.eng.umd.edu [129.2.98.14]) by bacchus.eng.umd.edu (8.7.3/8.7) with ESMTP id KAA17296; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:44:28 -0500 (EST) Received: (chuckr@localhost) by cappuccino.eng.umd.edu (8.7.3/8.6.4) id KAA01014; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:44:26 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:44:25 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey X-Sender: chuckr@cappuccino.eng.umd.edu To: "Jonathan M. Bresler" cc: Luigi Rizzo , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, Satoshi Asami Subject: Re: PDF viewers In-Reply-To: <199602092138.NAA13710@freefall.freebsd.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Fri, 9 Feb 1996, Jonathan M. Bresler wrote: > Luigi Rizzo said > > > > I got this message from an unrelated list. It's a pdf viewer which > > seems to work reasonably well, and it's probably faster than using > > ghostscript (and certainly much smaller). Worth a try, and possibly > > making it a package. > > > > > The xpdf home page is: > > > http://www.contrib.andrew.cmu.edu/usr/dn0o/xpdf/xpdf.html > > > > > chuck robey has already ported this app. it works but is still > "not quite there". hopefully it will continue to improve ;) I integrated the fix you suggested, John, but I ignored one thing: I (and I bet you, too) have X11 aliases for our X11R6 dirs, and the sources all pointed to X11. It would have failed without some fixes that Bill Fenner stuck in and sent to me. I encouraged Bill to send the fixes then to Satoshi, but I haven't heard from either Bill or Satoshi. I cc'ed Satoshi to this, and if he tells me he hasn't heard from Bill Fenner, I'll send the fixes myself. I dunno where it hangs right now. > ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include any kind of voice or data chuckr@eng.umd.edu | communications topic, C programming, and Unix. 9120 Edmonston Ct #302 | Greenbelt, MD 20770 | I run Journey2 and n3lxx, both FreeBSD (301) 220-2114 | version 2.2 current -- and great FUN! ----------------------------+----------------------------------------------- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 08:01:49 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA28574 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 08:01:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw (jdli@linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw [140.113.235.252]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA28568 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 08:01:45 -0800 (PST) Received: (from jdli@localhost) by linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw (8.6.9/8.6.9) id XAA14300 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:59:18 +0800 From: Chien-Ta Lee Message-Id: <199602101559.XAA14300@linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw> Subject: Non-US DES To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:59:17 +0800 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Hi : The Non-US secure dist can be legally distributed out of US/CA, can it be imported into US/CA ?! If no, nothing. If yes, why don't we use it as standard FreeBSD crypt ?! Just a crazy idea .... -- 李 建 達 (Adonis) 交大資工 Mail: jdli@csie.nctu.edu.tw From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 08:35:58 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA29785 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 08:35:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from terra.Sarnoff.COM (terra.sarnoff.com [130.33.11.203]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA29780 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 08:35:56 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rminnich@localhost) by terra.Sarnoff.COM (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA25938; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:31:36 -0500 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:31:35 -0500 (EST) From: "Ron G. Minnich" To: "Christoph P. Kukulies" cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: CAP (Columbia AppleTalk Protocol) - status? In-Reply-To: <199602101459.PAA03399@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Windows NT (shudder) Server has built in AppleTalk Server capabilities. > It would be nice if FreeBSD would be delivered with that too. > There is CAP and I believe NetATalk. you want netatalk if you use anything. It's very nice. It won't currently compile on freebsd, but since it will work on sunos i doubt there's much to it. Linux has native netatalk support, freebsd should too. ron From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 08:45:44 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id IAA00262 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 08:45:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from covina.lightside.com (covina.lightside.com [198.81.209.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA00256 Sat, 10 Feb 1996 08:45:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from hamby1.lightside.net by covina.lightside.com with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0tlIQB-0009XXC; Sat, 10 Feb 96 08:45 PST Received: by hamby1.lightside.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BAF794.47508630@hamby1.lightside.net>; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 08:46:32 -0800 Message-ID: <01BAF794.47508630@hamby1.lightside.net> From: Jake Hamby To: Luis Verissimo , "'David Kirchner'" Cc: "Freeman P. Pascal IV" , FreeBSD Hackers list , "questions@freebsd.org" Subject: RE: Unexplained segfaults in 2.1.0-RELEASE Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 08:37:08 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk ---------- From: David Kirchner Sent: Friday, February 09, 1996 10:47 PM To: Luis Verissimo Cc: Freeman P. Pascal IV; FreeBSD Hackers list; questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Unexplained segfaults in 2.1.0-RELEASE On Fri, 9 Feb 1996, Luis Verissimo wrote: > I have a 486DX4-100 machine running FreeBSD-2.1R. I experienced the = same=20 > problems. I had to disable both the internal and external caches, of = my=20 > machine. It then worked find. >=20 > I have another 486DX2-66 older machine, that keeps getting those = signals,=20 > even with both caches disabled.=20 That problem happened to me as well, those wouldn't happen to be AMD=20 CPU's would they? Mine is a 486DX4-120 and I didn't only get segfaults, = I=20 got drive errors. AMD suggests in the FAQ it's due to people = overclocking=20 their CPUs, but I haven't done that personally. They also say if you put = the clock back to normal, it'll work again. I'm Cc:'ing this to questions and hackers, feel free to change the=20 Cc list if you want. =3D) -- David Kirchner -- dpk@eskimo.com I have an AMD DX4-100 and haven't had any trouble with it. Curiously, I = put together an AMD DX4-120 PCI system for my Internet provider, and we = couldn't get it to boot FreeBSD (or even DOS reliably!) it would = complain of CRC errors when un-gzipping the boot floppy kernel. We = figured it was cheap underspec RAM we had bought (do you need 60ns for a = DX4-120?) so we clocked it down to 100MHz and it has worked perfectly = ever since! YMMV of course... ---Jake From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 09:41:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA01940 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:41:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from ibp.ibp.fr (ibp.ibp.fr [132.227.60.30]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA01931 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:40:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from blaise.ibp.fr (blaise.ibp.fr [132.227.60.1]) by ibp.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with ESMTP id SAA21556 ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 18:40:43 +0100 Received: from (uucp@localhost) by blaise.ibp.fr (8.6.12/jtpda-5.0) with UUCP id SAA10133 ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 18:40:44 +0100 Received: (from roberto@localhost) by keltia.freenix.fr (8.7.3/keltia-uucp-2.7) id RAA02457; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 17:58:04 +0100 (MET) From: Ollivier Robert Message-Id: <199602101658.RAA02457@keltia.freenix.fr> Subject: Re: POSIX 1003.1b compliance (timespec revisited) To: jerry@kcis.com (Jerry Kendall) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 17:58:03 +0100 (MET) Cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: from Jerry Kendall at "Feb 10, 96 09:07:37 am" X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 2.2-CURRENT ctm#1630 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL5 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk It seems that Jerry Kendall said: > > For those of us, myself included, what is this 'Lite2' code ?? 4.4BSD Lite2. FreeBSD is currently based on the 4.4BSD Lite code with some bits from Lite2, the second distribution of Lite. It includes mainly fixes. Due to the differences between FreeBSD now and 4.4BSD Lite[2] (especially in the kernel), each change must be reviewed carefully before inclusion. There are fixes for LFS and the Union FS but the changes are heavily affected by the unified VM/cache changes... -- Ollivier ROBERT -=- The daemon is FREE! -=- roberto@keltia.frmug.fr.net FreeBSD keltia.freenix.fr 2.2-CURRENT #5: Sun Feb 4 03:11:17 MET 1996 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 09:42:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id JAA01990 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:42:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from dyson.iquest.net (dyson.iquest.net [198.70.144.127]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA01981 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:42:03 -0800 (PST) Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) id MAA03889; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:38:15 GMT From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199602101238.MAA03889@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: Compressed RAM/SWAP To: dufault@hda.com (Peter Dufault) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:38:15 +0000 () Cc: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602101037.FAA09522@hda.com> from "Peter Dufault" at Feb 10, 96 05:37:15 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > > If there are lots of zero'd pages that aren't used that often, > can't be eliminated, and would benefit from compression wouldn't > it be better to look at a ZFOD (zero fill on demand) mechanism? > Perhaps using that as a HINT as to which pages might be useful targets for compression??? Maybe eliminating the wasteful attempted compression. John Dyson dyson@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 10:56:32 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id KAA05047 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:56:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA05037 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:56:29 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA16206; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:52:31 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602101852.LAA16206@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: POSIX 1003.1b compliance (timespec revisited) To: jerry@kcis.com (Jerry Kendall) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:52:31 -0700 (MST) Cc: terry@lambert.org, hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: from "Jerry Kendall" at Feb 10, 96 09:07:37 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > I recently posted a note to this list about the FreeBSD definition of > > > timespec and the fact that it does not comply with IEEE 1003.1b-1993. > > > I noted that NetBSD was about to make the change. Well the NetBSD change > > > has happened and has found its way to at least a mirror at this end of the > > > earth. So how about making the change to FreeBSD too? > > > > These structures are everywhere. 8-(. > > > > Not to mention that "time" in kernel.h is referenced directly instead > > of via a macro. 8-(. > > > > The cleanup on these things should probably wait until after David > > Greenman integrates the Lite2 code. I think NetBSD did this some > > time ago. > > > > For those of us, myself included, what is this 'Lite2' code ?? 4.4BSD-Lite was the initial 4.4BSD unencumbered release. It was to be the last CSRG release of all time. Some improvements were made, and a "Lite2" release was cut. FreeBSD is based on the 4.4BSD-Lite code, and has not imported all of the Lite2 improvements, but plans to. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 11:40:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id LAA06831 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:40:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from nike.efn.org (garcia.efn.org [198.68.17.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA06789 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:40:01 -0800 (PST) Received: (from gurney_j@localhost) by nike.efn.org (8.6.11/8.6.9) id LAA08783; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:42:30 -0800 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:42:29 -0800 (PST) From: John-Mark Gurney Reply-To: John-Mark Gurney To: "Christoph P. Kukulies" cc: freebsd-hackers@freefall.freebsd.org Subject: Re: CAP (Columbia AppleTalk Protocol) - status? In-Reply-To: <199602101459.PAA03399@gilberto.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk On Sat, 10 Feb 1996, Christoph P. Kukulies wrote: > Windows NT (shudder) Server has built in AppleTalk Server capabilities. > It would be nice if FreeBSD would be delivered with that too. > There is CAP and I believe NetATalk. > > Is anyone using one of these under FreeBSD? I'm using CAP... it works quite nicelly... just have a bit of a problem with it announcing it's self as an AppleShare server... but I think that is because of the slow machine more than anthing... if you would like more information.. there is a mailing list, "fbsd-atalk@enc.edu", that is specificly designed for AppleTalk on FreeBSD... if you do run CAP... make sure that you get 6.0-pl196 (if I remeber right)... because that has the FreeBSD patches... and if you compile your kernel with BPF you can get full Phase II support... TTYL.. John-Mark gurney_j@efn.org Modem/FAX: (503) 683-6954 (FreeBSD Box) Live in Peace, destroy Micro$oft, support free software, run FreeBSD (unix) GCS/M/Sd#h+s+!gau-a--w++++vC+++++UF++++P---E---N++W---M--V--Y+t+5++G+b+D++ B----eu+h++!f++n---- CD5OUF++++.L-------2W.DM----N.9---NET2SP3s.2,4s.,4d.2,6--- From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 12:13:22 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA08289 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:13:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA08284 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:13:20 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA16449; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 13:10:19 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602102010.NAA16449@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Non-US DES To: jdli@linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw (Chien-Ta Lee) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 13:10:19 -0700 (MST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602101559.XAA14300@linux.csie.nctu.edu.tw> from "Chien-Ta Lee" at Feb 10, 96 11:59:17 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > The Non-US secure dist can be legally distributed out of US/CA, > can it be imported into US/CA ?! It can be legally distributed outside the US if it comes from outside the US. US: The Crypt Motel: Code Checks In, But It Won't Check Out. It can be imported without problems. > If no, nothing. If yes, why don't we use it as standard FreeBSD > crypt ?! We do. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 12:20:35 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA08623 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:20:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA08618 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:20:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <15874(15)>; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:19:50 PST Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177478>; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:19:41 -0800 To: "Ron G. Minnich" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: multicast config confusion: can't get mrouted to work In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Feb 96 08:55:55 PST." Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:19:33 PST From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <96Feb10.121941pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message you write: >[mrouted says "can't forward; no enabled vifs"] > >Here's a sample ifconfig -a >lp0: flags=8810 mtu 1500 lp0 is multicast-capable but is down. >ep0: flags=863 mtu 1500 > inet 130.33.10.216 netmask 0xfffff800 broadcast 130.33.15.255 ep0 is not multicast-capable; this driver has been kind of in limbo for a while and several different sets of multicast patches have been floating around. If you are running -current, one version of the patches got committed on January 29th, but there have been enough other changes that you can't just grab the if_ep.c out of -current. You could *try* applying just these patches to your sources; check out http://www.freebsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/src/sys/i386/isa/if_ep.c?r1=1.38?r2=1.39 for the diffs that got put into -current. >lo0: flags=8009 mtu 16384 > inet 127.0.0.1 netmask 0xff000000 lo0 is loopback so gets ignored. >sl0: flags=c010 mtu 552 sl0 is multicast-capable but is down. >tun0: flags=8010 mtu 1500 tun0 is multicast-capable but is down. I don't see any enabled vifs either. What is it that you *want* to do with mrouted? Even after you get the multicast-capable ep0, you will still only have a single enabled vif. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 12:21:33 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA08677 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:21:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA08672 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:21:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from crevenia.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.116.11]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <15861(15)>; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:20:50 PST Received: from localhost by crevenia.parc.xerox.com with SMTP id <177478>; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:20:42 -0800 To: "Ron G. Minnich" cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: multicast config confusion: can't get mrouted to work In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 09 Feb 96 14:12:17 PST." Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:20:27 PST From: Bill Fenner Message-Id: <96Feb10.122042pst.177478@crevenia.parc.xerox.com> Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk In message you write: >I'm still a little unclear on the role of mrouted. In a >dedicated network of 16 machines is there ever a reason to run it? It >would appear not. mrouted's role is to route multicast between networks. If you have only one subnet, then there is no reason to run mrouted. Bill From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 12:31:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA08997 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:31:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA08992 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:31:13 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id NAA16493; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 13:27:28 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602102027.NAA16493@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: Compressed RAM/SWAP To: luigi@labinfo.iet.unipi.it (Luigi Rizzo) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 13:27:28 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602100936.KAA04409@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> from "Luigi Rizzo" at Feb 10, 96 10:36:46 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > Weekend brainstorm: compressed memory/swap. > I'd like ideas on the subject. > > I am asking because there is a bunch of "RAM doubler" PC/MAC > utilities. In principle, the same idea could be adopted for FreeBSD. > But I am a bit worried about cost/performance: compression takes > time, and keeps the CPU busy, while transferring to disk usually > leaves the CPU free (except in the case of ISA-IDE controllers). The "RAM doubler" products are non-products. For BSD, you might be able to compress swap, but this is not the same thing. In general, it is a bad thing to compress swap, because swap contains only active, dirty pages (BSD is a memory overcommit architecture), and so it is likely that the swap will be referenced again. There is an idea I put forward occasionally, which is to put discardable clean pages from memory into the swap. This is a win in the general case because it is faster to recover a page from swap than it is to recover it from the file system (note: a discarded clean page in this context is one which is to be removed from the cache with the intent of recovering it from slow memory [aka disk] later). This introduces a number of complications that don't currently exist with only dirty pages. > Trying to compress random, single pages yields highly variable > results, but usually does better than 2:1. Many pages even compress > to <100 bytes, they are probably unused or bzeroed. [ ... ] Id have to say that "RAMDoubler" is a non-product for most systems which implement their own virtual memory. It is, in fact, a VM mechanism for systems without VM. For systems with VM (BSD, Win95, etc.) it seems to do nothing more than burn CPU. The two caveats on a VM capable system are: 1) It reduces the swap utilization in trade for CPU cycles; on a system where swap dynamically grows (Win95 or NeXTStep, etc.), this can be a (very very short term) win in a low-space scenario, where it's impractical or disallowed to grow the available swap. 2) It reduces the swap utilization in trade for CPU cycles: on a system with a fixed size swap area, this allows you to overtax the available swap of an overloaded machine to make it an even more overloaded machine. On the other hand, RAMDoubler sales have been huge. It's probably sold more volume than "instant water" (a similar product), so who am I to rain on your parade. 8-). Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 12:52:03 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id MAA10156 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:52:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from Vorlon.odc.net (nwestfal@Vorlon.odc.net [206.250.32.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA10131 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:52:00 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nwestfal@localhost) by Vorlon.odc.net (8.7.1/8.7.1) id MAA07072 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:55:33 -0800 From: Neal Westfall Message-Id: <199602102055.MAA07072@Vorlon.odc.net> Subject: can't free vnode To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 12:55:32 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I have a news server here running FreeBSD-stable and INN 1.4-unoff and I am having a consistent problem of kernel panics. The reason for the panic is usually something to the effect of "can't free vnode; free vnode isn't". This has been a problem ever since we first installed FreeBSD 2.0.5 on the machine and we have tried upgrading everything, even to the point of downloading the src tree for -stable and all the ctm deltas and running a make world. All to no avail, we still have the same problems as before. It should be noted that we are running INN 1.4-unoff and didn't build it from the ports collection, since we wanted the bug fixes in INN 1.4-unoff. What makes the problem even worse is that when it panics, it doesn't automatically reboot the machine, it requires that somebody hit a key to reboot. The last panic occurred at 2:30 last night and we didn't discover it was hanged until 11:00 this morning. We have heard that FreeBSD is a more appropriate operating system for a news server than Linux because of performance and stability issues. However, if we can't figure out what is causing these problems, we will have to switch to Linux because this occurs almost every day. Any help is appreciated. Neal Westfall nwestfal@odc.net Digital Odyssey From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 13:08:14 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA11122 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 13:08:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from Vorlon.odc.net (nwestfal@Vorlon.odc.net [206.250.32.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA11116 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 13:08:09 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nwestfal@localhost) by Vorlon.odc.net (8.7.1/8.7.1) id NAA07230 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 13:11:42 -0800 From: Neal Westfall Message-Id: <199602102111.NAA07230@Vorlon.odc.net> Subject: followup to "can't free vnode" To: hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 13:11:42 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk This is a followup to my first message detailing the problem I am having with my news server. I neglected to mention the hardware configuration of this machine. It is an AMD DX4-100 w/32 meg ram Buslogic 946C SCSI controller 1 540MB + 4 1GB Fujitzu drives (4 drives for news spindles) PCI ethernet card based on DEC chip (de driver) Neal Westfall nwestfal@odc.net Digital Odyssey From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 13:57:27 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id NAA13313 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 13:57:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from werple.net.au (werple.mira.net.au [203.9.190.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA13308 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 13:57:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from cimaxp1.UUCP (Ucimlogi@localhost) by werple.net.au (8.7/8.7.1) with UUCP id IAA07495 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Sun, 11 Feb 1996 08:00:26 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199602102100.IAA07495@werple.net.au> X-Authentication-Warning: werple.net.au: Ucimlogi set sender to cimaxp1!jb using -f Received: by cimaxp1.cimlogic.com.au; (5.65/1.1.8.2/10Sep95-0953AM) id AA05162; Sun, 11 Feb 1996 08:00:28 +1100 From: John Birrell Subject: Re: POSIX 1003.1b compliance (timespec revisited) To: lambert.org!terry@werple.net.au (Terry Lambert) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 08:00:28 +1100 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, jb@cimlogic.com.au In-Reply-To: <199602101852.LAA16206@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 10, 96 11:52:31 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > > Not to mention that "time" in kernel.h is referenced directly instead > > > of via a macro. 8-(. > > > > > > The cleanup on these things should probably wait until after David > > > Greenman integrates the Lite2 code. I think NetBSD did this some > > > time ago. > > > > > > > For those of us, myself included, what is this 'Lite2' code ?? > [...] > FreeBSD is based on the 4.4BSD-Lite code, and has not imported all of > the Lite2 improvements, but plans to. Regardless of when Lite2 is imported, renaming ts_sec to tv_sec and ts_nsec to tv_nsec could take place now. The change doesn't affect the design of the code, and as far as I can see, there are no places where ts_sec or ts_nsec are used for anything other than fields in the timespec structure. [ And even the bogus build process can handle this change! ] > > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- -- John Birrell CIMlogic Pty Ltd jb@cimlogic.com.au 119 Cecil Street Ph +61 3 9690 6900 South Melbourne Vic 3205 Fax +61 3 9690 6650 Australia Mob +61 18 353 137 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 14:09:05 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA13671 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 14:09:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from labinfo.iet.unipi.it (labinfo.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.5]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA13665 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 14:09:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (luigi@localhost) by labinfo.iet.unipi.it (8.6.5/8.6.5) id XAA05138; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:10:59 +0100 From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <199602102210.XAA05138@labinfo.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: Compressed RAM/SWAP To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:10:58 +0100 (MET) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: <199602102027.NAA16493@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 10, 96 01:27:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk > The "RAM doubler" products are non-products. For BSD, you might be > able to compress swap, but this is not the same thing. > > In general, it is a bad thing to compress swap, because swap contains > only active, dirty pages (BSD is a memory overcommit architecture), > and so it is likely that the swap will be referenced again. > The two caveats on a VM capable system are: > > 1) It reduces the swap utilization in trade for CPU cycles; > on a system where swap dynamically grows (Win95 or > NeXTStep, etc.), this can be a (very very short term) win > in a low-space scenario, where it's impractical or disallowed > to grow the available swap. > > 2) It reduces the swap utilization in trade for CPU cycles: > on a system with a fixed size swap area, this allows you to > overtax the available swap of an overloaded machine to make > it an even more overloaded machine. As all tradeoffs, it might help in some cases. When you have your CPU idle while writing/reading to disk, you might as well use your CPU to compress pages and move them somewhere else, but still in RAM. When your disk is very slow (or it is behind a network IF) this might help as well. I guess this is case #3 in your list. > On the other hand, RAMDoubler sales have been huge. It's probably > sold more volume than "instant water" (a similar product), so who am > I to rain on your parade. 8-). I did not say I would have bought one, just wanted to investigate if there is something good in the idea :) Luigi From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 14:22:51 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA14269 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 14:22:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA14262 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 14:22:49 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA16797; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 15:19:44 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602102219.PAA16797@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: can't free vnode To: nwestfal@Vorlon.odc.net (Neal Westfall) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 15:19:44 -0700 (MST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org In-Reply-To: <199602102055.MAA07072@Vorlon.odc.net> from "Neal Westfall" at Feb 10, 96 12:55:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > I have a news server here running FreeBSD-stable and INN 1.4-unoff and I > am having a consistent problem of kernel panics. The reason for the > panic is usually something to the effect of "can't free vnode; free vnode > isn't". > > This has been a problem ever since we first installed FreeBSD 2.0.5 on > the machine and we have tried upgrading everything, even to the point > of downloading the src tree for -stable and all the ctm deltas and > running a make world. All to no avail, we still have the same > problems as before. [ ... ] > We have heard that FreeBSD is a more appropriate operating system > for a news server than Linux because of performance and stability > issues. However, if we can't figure out what is causing these > problems, we will have to switch to Linux because this occurs > almost every day. > > Any help is appreciated. There are two occasions when this happens; the first is in a very low RAM condition when you fill up swap. The fix is to add more swap. The second is when numvnodes == desiredvnodes and a vgone occurs when a recursive lock is held and you get a page fault for the same vnode in the middle of a read or a write. This is actually an endemic problem in the use if the ihash code itself. The fix is to change the vp lock operation to a counting semaphore, and either move the directory cache code up above the lookup instead of doing it per FS (and treat a cache refrence as a reference count), or to actually get rid of the ihash abstraction entirely (some non-trival VM cache index changes are necessary). The easiest workaround for now is to make sure you have sufficient free vnodes by jacking up the desiredvnodes. A less easy workaround would be to call VOP_ISLOCKED() on the vp in vrele() in /sys/kern/vfs_subr.c, and if it is, go to sleep on the address until it isn't. This would be something like: while( VOP_ISLOCKED(vp)) { (void) tsleep( (caddr_t)vp->v_data, PINOD, "vfslk", 0); } This is gross, but works because vp->v_data is the same address as the inode that VOP_UNLOCK(vp) calls the wakeup on in the FS's that use the recursion semantics for potential dissociation of the vnode from the underlying FS (see the vclean() comments in vfs_subr.c)... the address of the per FS inode data. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 14:25:04 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id OAA14350 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 14:25:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA14345 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 14:25:02 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id PAA16815; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 15:21:35 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602102221.PAA16815@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: POSIX 1003.1b compliance (timespec revisited) To: cimaxp1!jb@werple.net.au (John Birrell) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 15:21:35 -0700 (MST) Cc: lambert.org!terry@werple.net.au, hackers@FreeBSD.org, jb@cimlogic.com.au In-Reply-To: <199602102100.IAA07494@werple.net.au> from "John Birrell" at Feb 11, 96 08:00:28 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > FreeBSD is based on the 4.4BSD-Lite code, and has not imported all of > > the Lite2 improvements, but plans to. > > > Regardless of when Lite2 is imported, renaming ts_sec to tv_sec and ts_nsec > to tv_nsec could take place now. The change doesn't affect the design of the > code, and as far as I can see, there are no places where ts_sec or ts_nsec > are used for anything other than fields in the timespec structure. > > [ And even the bogus build process can handle this change! ] The problem is that it increases the diffs against 4.4BSD-Lite2 in all file systems, and so hampers integration. Wait for the 4.4BSD-Lite2 integration, please. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 15:08:01 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA15923 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 15:08:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from dyson.iquest.net (dyson.iquest.net [198.70.144.127]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA15889 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 15:07:58 -0800 (PST) Received: (from root@localhost) by dyson.iquest.net (8.6.11/8.6.9) id SAA04858; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 18:04:39 GMT From: "John S. Dyson" Message-Id: <199602101804.SAA04858@dyson.iquest.net> Subject: Re: can't free vnode To: nwestfal@Vorlon.odc.net (Neal Westfall) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 18:04:39 +0000 () Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602102055.MAA07072@Vorlon.odc.net> from "Neal Westfall" at Feb 10, 96 12:55:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24 ME8] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > I have a news server here running FreeBSD-stable and INN 1.4-unoff and I > am having a consistent problem of kernel panics. The reason for the > panic is usually something to the effect of "can't free vnode; free vnode > isn't". > 1) Change the INND's config.data to be ACT_STYLE READ. 2) Do NOT run out of inodes on the disk. You should probably be okay then. The VM system performs about the same with ACT_STYLE READ, and ACT_STYLE MMAP. John Dyson From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 15:57:17 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id PAA19918 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 15:57:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from werple.net.au (werple.mira.net.au [203.9.190.18]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA19906 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 15:57:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from cimaxp1.UUCP (Ucimlogi@localhost) by werple.net.au (8.7/8.7.1) with UUCP id KAA12413 for hackers@FreeBSD.org; Sun, 11 Feb 1996 10:01:44 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <199602102301.KAA12413@werple.net.au> X-Authentication-Warning: werple.net.au: Ucimlogi set sender to cimaxp1!jb using -f Received: by cimaxp1.cimlogic.com.au; (5.65/1.1.8.2/10Sep95-0953AM) id AA16394; Sun, 11 Feb 1996 10:01:44 +1100 From: John Birrell Subject: Re: POSIX 1003.1b compliance (timespec revisited) To: lambert.org!terry@werple.net.au (Terry Lambert) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 10:01:44 +1100 (EST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, jb@cimlogic.com.au In-Reply-To: <199602102221.PAA16815@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 10, 96 03:21:35 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > The problem is that it increases the diffs against 4.4BSD-Lite2 in all > file systems, and so hampers integration. > > Wait for the 4.4BSD-Lite2 integration, please. When is this likely to occur? Ball-park estimate please. > > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org -- John Birrell CIMlogic Pty Ltd jb@cimlogic.com.au 119 Cecil Street Ph +61 3 9690 6900 South Melbourne Vic 3205 Fax +61 3 9690 6650 Australia Mob +61 18 353 137 From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 16:13:07 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA21637 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 16:13:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from snowcrash.cymru.net (root@SNOWCRASH.CYMRU.NET [163.164.160.3]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA21619 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 16:13:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk (Ulxorguk@localhost) by snowcrash.cymru.net (8.7.1/8.7.1) with UUCP id AAA09608 for freebsd.org!hackers; Sun, 11 Feb 1996 00:06:03 GMT Received: by lightning.swansea.linux.org.uk (Smail3.1.29.1 #1) id m0tlOFY-0005FYC; Sat, 10 Feb 96 22:58 GMT Message-Id: From: alan@lxorguk.ukuu.org.uk (Alan Cox) Subject: Re: signal masks and select To: leisner@sdsp.mc.xerox.com (Marty Leisner) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 22:58:35 +0000 (GMT) Cc: paul@sfe.com.au, linux-kernel@vger.rutgers.edu, hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <9602092033.AA14852@gnu.mc.xerox.com> from "Marty Leisner" at Feb 9, 96 12:33:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > But this is a kludgey workaround...and using pthreads (where each thread > has a signal mask) means env becomes thread private data... > > It seems very reasonable to have a system call: > select_with_newmask(new_mask, ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 16:37:59 -0800 (PST) Received: (from kimc@localhost) by moonpie.w8hd.org (8.6.12/8.6.12) id TAA23716; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 19:37:36 -0500 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 19:37:35 -0500 (EST) From: Kim Culhan To: hackers@Freebsd.org Subject: audio devices In-Reply-To: <199602102352.PAA02258@rah.star-gate.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-hackers@Freebsd.org Precedence: bulk Since I have installed 2.1-stable I need to make devices for bpf0 and the sound stuff for the gusmax. The MAKEDEV does not appear to make the correct devices for these, So far I have been unsuccessful in making devices for these, I think the minor device numbers I'm using are incorrect sooo.. where can the minor device numbers be found? If MAKEDEV works correctly, what is the syntax for making the devices it knows about? regards kim -- kimc@w8hd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 16:44:09 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id QAA25134 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 16:44:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from phaeton.artisoft.com (phaeton.Artisoft.COM [198.17.250.211]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA25125 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 16:44:01 -0800 (PST) Received: (from terry@localhost) by phaeton.artisoft.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) id RAA17094; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 17:40:23 -0700 From: Terry Lambert Message-Id: <199602110040.RAA17094@phaeton.artisoft.com> Subject: Re: POSIX 1003.1b compliance (timespec revisited) To: cimaxp1!jb@werple.net.au (John Birrell) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 17:40:23 -0700 (MST) Cc: lambert.org!terry@werple.net.au, hackers@FreeBSD.org, jb@cimlogic.com.au In-Reply-To: <199602102301.KAA12412@werple.net.au> from "John Birrell" at Feb 11, 96 10:01:44 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk > > The problem is that it increases the diffs against 4.4BSD-Lite2 in all > > file systems, and so hampers integration. > > > > Wait for the 4.4BSD-Lite2 integration, please. > > When is this likely to occur? Ball-park estimate please. Talk to David Greenman. My FS patches are waiting on the same semaphore. Terry Lambert terry@lambert.org --- Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present or previous employers. From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 17:11:43 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id RAA26548 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 17:11:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from time.cdrom.com (time.cdrom.com [192.216.222.226]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA26540 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 17:11:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by time.cdrom.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id RAA29436 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 17:10:55 -0800 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Manuel Bouyer: update of atapi driver Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 17:10:55 -0800 Message-ID: <29434.824001055@time.cdrom.com> From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I would like to campaign for adopting the NetBSD ATAPI driver and throwing ours away. This doesn't come down to any technical comparison between the two, simply the fact that NetBSD's driver appears to be far more actively maintained. The 5 or 6 bug reports and generate "status? help?" queries I've sent to Serge Vakulenko, since 2.1 was released have gone completely unanswered, and I can only conclude that he's abandoned it. This is bad, since it needs a lot more work and ATAPI CDROM is probably one of the most popular types at this point. I would far prefer to start over with a driver that looks like it's actually going to be supported if nobody cares to step in and fill the shoes that Serge has vacated and support our own! Comments? Jordan ------- Forwarded Message From: Manuel Bouyer Subject: update of atapi driver To: port-i386@NetBSD.ORG Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 16:16:39 +0100 (MET) Sender: owner-port-i386@NetBSD.ORG X-Loop: port-i386@NetBSD.ORG I've updated the files in ftp://lix.polytechnique.fr/pub/manu to include the last changes I've made. People who had installed the driver can use the file ftp://lix.polytechnique.fr/pub/manu/patch1 to upgrade their sources. The file ftp://lix.polytechnique.fr/pub/manu/atapi.tar.gz contains the up-to-date diffs for 1.1 and -current. I've also updated the README. For each update, i will update the diffs in atapi.tar.gz, and add a file patch[n+1] to help update from previous release. The only thing I've made from the previous patch is to have the wddump() function compile again. I can have again nice 32M core dumps in my /var/crash directory. - -- Manuel Bouyer, Ecole Nationale Superieure de Techniques Avancees, Paris email: bouyer@ensta.fr - -- ------- End of Forwarded Message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 19:39:25 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id TAA07116 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 19:39:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from Vorlon.odc.net (nwestfal@Vorlon.odc.net [206.250.32.6]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA07099 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 19:39:20 -0800 (PST) Received: (from nwestfal@localhost) by Vorlon.odc.net (8.7.1/8.7.1) id TAA09916; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 19:42:50 -0800 From: Neal Westfall Message-Id: <199602110342.TAA09916@Vorlon.odc.net> Subject: Re: can't free vnode To: terry@lambert.org (Terry Lambert) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 19:42:50 -0800 (PST) Cc: hackers@freebsd.org In-Reply-To: <199602102219.PAA16797@phaeton.artisoft.com> from "Terry Lambert" at Feb 10, 96 03:19:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk > > There are two occasions when this happens; the first is in a very low > RAM condition when you fill up swap. The fix is to add more swap. We have a 100 MB swap partition on this machine. Is this adequate? (keeping in mind the machine has 32MB ram and it is a news server) > The easiest workaround for now is to make sure you have sufficient > free vnodes by jacking up the desiredvnodes. Is this something we can change in the kernel configuration? Or the source? Or is this something we need to patch in INN? > > A less easy workaround would be to call VOP_ISLOCKED() on the vp in > vrele() in /sys/kern/vfs_subr.c, and if it is, go to sleep on the > address until it isn't. This would be something like: > > while( VOP_ISLOCKED(vp)) { > (void) tsleep( (caddr_t)vp->v_data, PINOD, "vfslk", 0); > } > > This is gross, but works because vp->v_data is the same address as the > inode that VOP_UNLOCK(vp) calls the wakeup on in the FS's that use the > recursion semantics for potential dissociation of the vnode from the > underlying FS (see the vclean() comments in vfs_subr.c)... the address > of the per FS inode data. Which method would you recommend? (I'm no kernel hacker, but I'm perfectly comfortable with applying any patches if it will help). Also, is it true that this problem has been fixed in 2.2-current? Any chance the fixes will make it into 2.1-stable? Thanks for your help Neal Westfall > > > Terry Lambert > terry@lambert.org > --- > Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present > or previous employers. > From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 23:02:42 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA16280 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:02:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from koala.scott.net (root@koala.scott.net [204.181.147.2]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA16274 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:02:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from jason.scott.net (dialup66.scott.net [205.241.3.66]) by koala.scott.net (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id BAA03706 for ; Sun, 11 Feb 1996 01:01:59 -0600 Message-ID: <311D948F.167EB0E7@scott.net> Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 01:02:39 -0600 From: Jason Gilbert X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (X11; I; FreeBSD 2.1-STABLE i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: WordPerfect install Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@freebsd.org Precedence: bulk I was just trying to install WP and have hit a snag. When the script hits a point where it is starting the xwpinstall program it complains about not being able to open /dev/XOR. I can't do a MAKEDEV for it. I also can't find any install dirs. I don't think they were created. Anyone else had or having any success with this??? jason From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 23:03:28 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA16299 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:03:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from covina.lightside.com (covina.lightside.com [198.81.209.1]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA16294 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:03:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from hamby1 by covina.lightside.com with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m0tlVoc-0009XyC; Sat, 10 Feb 96 23:03 PST Message-ID: <311D9508.280D@lightside.com> Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:04:40 -0800 From: Jake Hamby X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Jordan K. Hubbard" CC: hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: Manuel Bouyer: update of atapi driver References: <29434.824001055@time.cdrom.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.org Precedence: bulk Jordan K. Hubbard wrote: > > I would like to campaign for adopting the NetBSD ATAPI driver and > throwing ours away. This doesn't come down to any technical > comparison between the two, simply the fact that NetBSD's driver > appears to be far more actively maintained. The 5 or 6 bug reports > and generate "status? help?" queries I've sent to Serge Vakulenko, > since 2.1 was released have gone completely > unanswered, and I can only conclude that he's abandoned it. > > This is bad, since it needs a lot more work and ATAPI CDROM is > probably one of the most popular types at this point. I would far > prefer to start over with a driver that looks like it's actually going > to be supported if nobody cares to step in and fill the shoes that > Serge has vacated and support our own! > > Comments? > > Jordan Go for it! Although Serge's ATAPI driver was usable for me when I built a custom kernel, as I'm sure you remember, none of the ATAPI boot floppies you made for the 2.1.0 SNAPs and RELEASE ever did work for me! If NetBSD's ATAPI driver works with more brands of CD-ROM drives, is stable, and does not interfere with any IDE hard drives (even old ones), and we can get back to having a single GENERIC kernel, I vote yes! Also, I should note that the Workman port never did work with our ATAPI driver (does it work with Mitsumi or Sony, or are there SCSI-specific assumptions in there?). Anyway, if this isn't too much work to integrate with FreeBSD, go for it! By the way, why don't we go one step further and take NetBSD's IDE driver too? After all, IDE and ATAPI are tightly integrated. Does anyone know if NetBSD/i386's IDE driver is any better/faster/more stable than ours? (Typing this from Netscape Mail from Windows NT Beta 4.0... Imagine, all the slowness of the Win95 UI combined with the RAM requirements of NT! I should say that I really do like NT, but I have 24MB of RAM. FreeBSD is MUCH nicer, even with RAM hogs like Netscape and Emacs, on an 8MB system, whereas NT is unusable.. Anyway, just be thankful I'm not using Microsoft Internet Mail (motto: SMTP? What's that?) :-) -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------ Jake Hamby | E-Mail: jehamby@lightside.com Student, Cal Poly University, Pomona | System Administrator, JPL ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------ From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Feb 10 23:32:02 1996 Return-Path: owner-hackers Received: (from root@localhost) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) id XAA17500 for hackers-outgoing; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:32:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au [129.127.96.120]) by freefall.freebsd.org (8.7.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA17441 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 1996 23:31:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from msmith@localhost by genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au (8.6.12/8.6.9) id SAA27556; Sun, 11 Feb 1996 18:02:01 +1030 From: Michael Smith Message-Id: <199602110732.SAA27556@genesis.atrad.adelaide.edu.au> Subject: Re: EIDE 2300+ Promise To: bde@zeta.org.au (Bruce Evans) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 18:02:01 +1030 (CST) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, souchu@firtech.lri.fr In-Reply-To: <199602101242.XAA30321@godzilla.zeta.org.au> from "Bruce Evans" at Feb 10, 96 11:42:09 pm MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk Bruce Evans stands accused of saying: > > >My controller EIDE 2300+ Promise fails at boot in int 13h or > >just after when executing real_to_proc, I don't know exactly. > > >What's wrong ? > > I don't know. This one has been done to death, and a search of the list archives should turn up the answer; the onboard BIOS on the 2300 is _broken_ and must be disabled completely for FreeBSD to boot. I also recall reading that if you subsequently turn it back on, you can/will hose your BSD partition. > >I have an idea. Why not programming a sort of linux-lodlin that would > >start FreeBSD from DOS after installing the Promise int 13h driver ? > > dosboot.exe in FreeBSD already does this. The Promise driver is 'installed' by having the BIOS on the card enabled, it _is_ the source of the problem. > Bruce -- ]] Mike Smith, Software Engineer msmith@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] Genesis Software genesis@atrad.adelaide.edu.au [[ ]] High-speed data acquisition and (GSM mobile) 0411-222-496 [[ ]] realtime instrument control (ph/fax) +61-8-267-3039 [[ ]] "wherever you go, there you are" - Buckaroo Banzai [[