From owner-freebsd-ports@FreeBSD.ORG Sat Dec 15 09:50:56 2007 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:fff6::34]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E44A16A417 for ; Sat, 15 Dec 2007 09:50:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david@vizion2000.net) Received: from dns1.vizion2000.net (77-99-36-42.cable.ubr04.chap.blueyonder.co.uk [77.99.36.42]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAEA113C45A for ; Sat, 15 Dec 2007 09:50:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from david@vizion2000.net) Received: by dns1.vizion2000.net (Postfix, from userid 1007) id 856371CC38; Sat, 15 Dec 2007 02:06:46 -0800 (PST) From: David Southwell Organization: Voice and Vision To: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 02:06:44 -0800 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.7 References: <475F7390.9090509@gmail.com> <47632BFE.6000801@brianwhalen.net> <8B7776E2EBA2B5F1EEA02492@paul-schmehls-powerbook59.local> In-Reply-To: <8B7776E2EBA2B5F1EEA02492@paul-schmehls-powerbook59.local> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200712150206.46161.david@vizion2000.net> Cc: Paul Schmehl Subject: Re: Limitations of Ports System X-BeenThere: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Porting software to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 09:50:56 -0000 On Friday 14 December 2007 18:44:09 Paul Schmehl wrote: > --On December 14, 2007 5:21:02 PM -0800 Brian wrote: > > Information does indeed need to be gathered, and while even the ports > > list will only grab a small percentage of FreeBSD users, other options > > would likely grab a lot less. Plus, most of the users here are > > knowledgeable enough to give decent input. For those of you that don't > > like change may I suggest the book that led to > > http://www.whomovedmycheese.com/. It is really in all of our best > > interest to have the product evolve, the alternative is much worse. > > This really is getting quite irritating. Not one person on this list has > *ever* said they don't want to entertain new ideas for ports. Not one > person on this list has said they don't like change. *All* of the > complaints have been along the lines of "go write some code and stop > filling up this list with posts". And that is *precisely* the point. > > Yet the proponents of the Aryeh bandwagon keep throwing up this straw man > that those of us who have tired of the useless back and forth are refusing > to listen and uninterested in change, when *nothing* could be further from > the truth. ports@ is *not* a development list. Its purpose is to provide > news about ports, discuss problems with ports, get advice on porting and > so forth. Or, to quote its charter, "Discussions concerning FreeBSD's > =E2=80=9Cports collection=E2=80=9D (/usr/ports), ports infrastructure, an= d general > ports coordination efforts. This is a technical mailing list for which > strictly technical content is expected." > > Get that? "Strictly technical". "How do you feel about the present > design" or "what don't you like about the present design" or "if you could > change something about ports, what would it be" are *not* appropriate > discussions for this list. > > It's time to move this "discussion" to some place where those that *care* > about coding and/or redesigning the ports system can participate and > discuss code and return this list to its original purpose. The only > FreeBSD list that would be appropriate (if that - it's not really) would > be arch, which is for architecture and design discussions. This thread is > a design discussion and does not belong here. Please move it to a more > appropriate place and leave this list alone. Ask the FreeBSD maintainers > to create a new list "ports-design@" if you like, but please stop the > discussions here. They are inappropriate for this list. > > And stop lying about the motivations of the many talented people who have > asked, politely and otherwise, to stop. > I think you have been very politely asked to stop highjacking perfectly=20 legitimate discussion by trolling. If you do not want to contribute=20 positively please use your delete key. In accordance with the charter you=20 describe please make some technical contributions in accordance with the=20 charter.=20 I have already indicated the dangers of loss of credibility that follows fr= om=20 any autocratic assumptions that any one individual is entitled to be=20 prescriptive. I do not think you are entitled to assume that your side of t= he=20 argument has a monopoly of talent. IMHO we can all do without incessant=20 hectoring, lecturing and bullying and more collegially expressed=20 contributions on topic.=20 This thread is entitled "The limits of the Ports System" not "Why we should= =20 not discuss the limts of the ports system". If you have nothing to say on=20 topic then please be humble and keep quiet Thank you