From owner-cvs-all@FreeBSD.ORG Wed May 18 21:00:01 2005 Return-Path: Delivered-To: cvs-all@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D240016A4CE; Wed, 18 May 2005 21:00:01 +0000 (GMT) Received: from pooker.samsco.org (pooker.samsco.org [168.103.85.57]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0081D43D7D; Wed, 18 May 2005 20:59:59 +0000 (GMT) (envelope-from scottl@samsco.org) Received: from [192.168.254.14] (imini.samsco.home [192.168.254.14]) (authenticated bits=0) by pooker.samsco.org (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j4IL38nA089476; Wed, 18 May 2005 15:03:08 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from scottl@samsco.org) Message-ID: <428BAC85.3070103@samsco.org> Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 14:58:45 -0600 From: Scott Long User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.7.7) Gecko/20050416 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Warner Losh References: <20050518103544.18i8c5w3ok8oscgw@netchild.homeip.net> <20050518.074805.26964549.imp@bsdimp.com> <20050518182150.lcak29sfts0ssgws@netchild.homeip.net> <20050518.143949.71148873.imp@bsdimp.com> In-Reply-To: <20050518.143949.71148873.imp@bsdimp.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.8 required=3.8 tests=ALL_TRUSTED autolearn=failed version=3.0.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.0.2 (2004-11-16) on pooker.samsco.org cc: Alexander@Leidinger.net cc: src-committers@FreeBSD.org cc: cvs-src@FreeBSD.org cc: cvs-all@FreeBSD.org cc: des@des.no Subject: Re: cvs commit: src/sys/dev/ata ata-queue.c X-BeenThere: cvs-all@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: CVS commit messages for the entire tree List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 21:00:02 -0000 Warner Losh wrote: >>The discussion started with des saying something like "the classic way is >>bad, don't do this" while it would have been enough to say "and with the new >>procedure it looks like". I don't want to pick on des here, everyone can have >>a bad day. But he isn't the only one, in the past I've seen alot of people >>pointing their gun at someone who uses the classic way and pulling the >>trigger, and I don't think this is OK. > > > OK. The classic method will likely work forever, where 'work' is > narrowly defined as "if your system is compatible enough" which most > developers know. There's too much momentum... I for one only use the > new method for upgrades, and as part of product release scripts. > > >>Let's shut up now and maybe put a sentence or two about KODIR and nextboot >>into the updating description. > > > Sounds good to me. > > Warner Where the traditional method is immensely useful is in customizing your kernel immediately after doing a fresh install from CD/ftp/floppy. You want a slimmer kernel right away without having to suffer through doing a buildworld. This is even more true on 6-CURRENT snapshots where INVARIANTS and WITNESS are enabled and really slow things down. There is simply no need to do a buildworld, since your sources are completely in sync with the system. I appreciate the effort that has happened over the years to make the whole upgrade process smoother, but we can't define 'work' too narrowly or else it becomes just as cumbersome as the problems that we are trying to fix. Scott