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Date:      Tue, 16 Nov 1999 03:53:49 -0600 (CST)
From:      Erick White <>
To:        David Schwartz <>
Cc:        Joseph Scott <>,, freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG
Subject:   RE: Judge: "Gates Was Main Culprit"
Message-ID:  <>
In-Reply-To: <000001bf3004$979c2b60$>

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	Let me explain this to you yet again. I am not saying people are
stupid. Once again I say people are Miss-Informed. The do not know all the
facts. People in general that is. I dont know how much plainer I can be on
these issues, or how any one else can be. Me, no I am not going to save
the world from their stupidity, I dont think anyone can do that. The world
of mankind is after all in the process of killing itself despite
information of what it is doing. 
	I am not saying that FreeBSD is the answer, or Linux , I am saying
that Microsoft is wrong. You attempt to draw away from my reasoning by
attacking my character. I am not saying that I and I emphasize NOT SAYING
I am going to save people from their stupidity. For the last several days
we have been beating our heads against the proverbial brick wall in trying
to reason with someone who refuses to see reason. It is not just I that
has seen through Microsofts sham! We are not saying we are smarter than
the rest of you. What others here, and I myself, are trying to do is get
you to open your eyes to what they have truly been doing. Those here are
not saying were smarter, we are as a whole saying that we see the truth
what is going on which anyone can see, not that their stupid, just that
they dont have all the facts.
	You however, sir, seem to be ignoring the facts presented before
you and still fight against the truths. I admit that I dont always choose
the right words in order to bring my point across. I might not always be
the most tactful person, but I do know what is there, and when someone is
being misled. 

> >Research? The field test their products not even fully finish the
> >job to begin with in the programming department. Their not spending
> money by and large on research, their using it to cannibalize other
> >threats to their products, and then crush them into powder as the
> >throws its money behind it. Their letting other companies do the
> >for them, then they try to crush them once they see what they need for
> >bare minimum to drive out the competition with a cat o nine tails. What
> >they have been doing, and doing for YEARS is letting the competition
> >the waters, once it realizes that it is a threat it comes up with a
>> "solution" for what it did not think up did not create, and then
>> on its merry way.. Nuh Uh.. not good.... Reread your facts.

>	Yes, that's extremely efficient. That way they (and their
customers) get
>the benefit of the innovations without having to pay for them. That's
>That's extreme market efficiency.

	No, getting someone elses innovations and Ideas from them without
paying for them, that is what is defined in the dictionary as stealing, as
plagiarism at the least.  You see by doing this they are in effect making
themselves crooks.

>	A company can have all the ideas in the world, but if they can't
turn it
>into a product that consumers actually want to buy, it won't amount to a
>hill of beans. Microsoft excels at turning ideas into marketable
>And that's what the market wants -- products, not ideas.

	The reason why Microsoft cannibalized them to begin with is
because the company had turned it into a product customers actually wanted
to buy. That is why the price raised and they were inculcated into the
distribution or another product.  When you make something included and
jack up the price so to speak, then you are in fact making people pay for
a product you made even if they would rather have someone elses, and when
they are ran out of business by Microsoft because the those using their
version begin to believe it is their only option because the other
business can no longer survive under Microsofts heavy hand and
racketeering then you are stuck with an inferior product. In todays world
money is what runs everything. The golden rule of arts and sciences I
		He Who Has the Gold Makes the Rules.
That means that if you can crush another companies income, it doesnt mater
if it is a better product, if they have been crushed, or overflowed by
someone with a stronger power base does that make them any more right?  If
someone had a animal that was dear to them, and another man with more
power took it away from them, and had power to forcefully take it from
him, even though he already had plenty, and the one man with only the one
animal that was dear to that man. Does it make it right just because the
man with plenty had enough men, or power, or strength to take it from the
poorer man? Does that make it right, just because one has the ability to
take from another and ruin their ability at future development? 
	I am sorry sir, but I think not.

>> It is monopoly harm, because what
>> their taking credit for was actually researched, updated, run, and
>> designed by someone else's brain.
>	*sigh* What the hell does credit have to do with anything? Who

	What does credit have to with anything? I am sure that if you
created something you would want credit for it. If you created something
and someone took it away from you and made money on it and did nothing to
give you credit or money, You must admit you would be incensed. You want
to know who originally designed Windows? Try Xerox. If you Mean MS
Windows, then it is nothing that has been taken from one company, they
have taken it from many peoples, and companies that no longer exist
because they were crushed with a mailed hand on soft skulls so to speak
	Also here is something else for you to consider. Until recently
you were forced to buy Windows if you bought a new PC unless you custom
built it and put it together yourself. You had no choice. IE has had more
effort put into it recently to crush Netscape. I will admit I like the
integration of IE so that I can type in a command line on a windows box
window and shortcut all the point and clicking. He, however makes people
buy something they dont want every time they buy windows with something
packaged in that has contributed to a higher price that they dont want,
need, or desire.

>	They read reviews, they consider other products, they look at what
other people
>are buying, they look at what might become available in the future, and
>make the best decision they know how to. Why do you think you know better
>than they do?

	The sad truth is most people dont read reviews. They usually dont
consider what you and I might do and consider in such a situation, as you
stated above. They key point you make there however is the best decision
THEY KNOW HOW TO. Without having all the information, can they make an
informed decision? I dont say I know better than a well informed person, I
am saying I am looking at it from an informed point of view on both sides.
	I am also not bitching. I am not paying for an upgrade. Windows
right now has the support of the gaming industry and that is something
that has driven the computer industry for many years as far as
	They buy Windows because it does what most people want yes, but so
do other OSs, other programs, and other companies that although they make
a superior product get crushed by the heavy hand of Microsoft. The finding
of fact points this out. 

>	If the competing technologies are truly better, than they should
be able to
>find better financing. If you can't convince an investor that they're
>better, they probably really aren't. I tell Engineers that investors are
>litmus test of how good their ideas are, since investors specialize in
>knowing what ideas really are good enough to work.
>	If you had an idea that was really better than Microsoft's, that
>give you enough of an advantage to take a sizeable market share. If the
>better idea isn't winning, look long and hard at whether it's really

	No, not a sizeable market share for your ideas when it is being
blocked by a larger power base. By someone who already has the money to
make you go away, or make your company enough problems that it cant bust
through the "Superior Money" of Microsoft. It could very well be a better

>	Ask people why they use Windows instead of FreeBSD. I guarantee
you one
>thing they won't say is because Microsoft is so powerful and impressive
>they have to buy Windows even though it doesn't do what they want. Think
>about it - that's really what you're trying to convince me of.
	No, they will say Free what? Believe me I have asked those kind of
questions. Only those well in the know, and in the computer technical
fields know about such systems in general. I use to get angry at Microsoft
all the time for many things, that is before I found UNIX, this is
although I was good in computers, I did not know anything but Windows
existed. Taking the different path so to speak
	"Has made all the difference"
I still use windows for things that programmers havent released a version
for UNIX for.
	Their is measure to my madness, and it is this: People are not
foolish in general, they are not stupid, and given enough information and
support without a heavy domineering hand, are capable of making the right
choice, when they know all their options. 

>	Yes, but a company with superior technology wouldn't need to
>anyone. If it really had a better product, it would eventually take over
>marketplace. Really.

In an Ideal world yes. However without resources thousands of well thought
out, working ideas or inventions are lost because they cant get through
the initial, our name is what you know buy us phase of the market. Most
things are bought on name value these days. 
Once again, I reiterate. He who has the gold, makes the rules. My attitude
isnt superior to everyone, and it isnt insulting. I am not insulting
anyone, only trying to make you see reason. What do you think everyone
else has been trying to do? I am only pointing to certain facts although I
may have come off in a little more upset matter. I have been feeling under
the weather lately and when you got a class in College in the morning, and
its already 3:00 am, and your not feeling very well, sometimes you lack a
little of the tact that you could use instead.

	Your Friendly, if sometimes cranky UNIX Advocate: Erick

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