Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2004 20:58:30 +0200 From: Nico Meijer <nico.meijer@zonnet.nl> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Going OT: Re: BigApache for Windows - Why doesn't BSD have aninstaller package like this ??? Message-ID: <4107F756.10203@zonnet.nl> In-Reply-To: <20040728142817.77917.qmail@web41011.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040728142817.77917.qmail@web41011.mail.yahoo.com>
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Hi DK, Sorry if I'll sound somewhat harsh at times. I mean no offense whatsover, so don't take it personal. > BTW: All I have been doing for 6 days is read docs/man/guides... It seems as though you have been missing the point. Completely, at times. Complaining one or two lines from a tutorial don't work (ie. "groupadd mysql") without reading: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/users-modifying.html is plain oversight. If you haven't yet grasped the 'feel' for FreeBSD, why are you trying to drive a Ferrari with it, when you can't even manage a tricycle with it yet? > Refreshing the system without a reboot is a Priority in front of Automount ?? Absolutely! Plus, getting timely security updates (which come in patches, if you like), rock solid stability, a speedy and robust IP stack, tremendous hardware support (rock solid, again). Oh, and it's free as in beer and free as in speech. > nice one developers I think more effort has been put into creating and maintaining a robust, managable and secure server platform than a workstation platform. Your gripe with FreeBSD might just lie there. Plus, if you're unhappy with something: do the work and submit the code. It's that easy. No whining, no fussing. > .. I know its hard for people to swallow, but MS Windows IS easier to use than BSD/Linux/OSX ... The only part that is hard to swallow is you putting *BSD, Linux and OS X on one big pile as if they're basically the same thing (to a user, they're not; to a sysadmin, they're not; they're all only "Unix-like"). Other than that, you're absolutely right. (But only if you accept the Microsoft way of doing things. If you don't, you're screwed.) > thats WHY its the most widely used.... regardless of marketing/costs etc ... I find that statement amusing, thank you. :-) > whats the damn command startxfce4 ??? this doesn't work!)... It worked for me. > If people say it should be used without a GUI... Especially as a server: I use CLI only. A GUI just gets in my way. > they must be over 40, 29 > bald, Just short hair; it's all there. > lonely I love my wife & son very much. > & most love shitty VI - I can EDIT any file faster on a GUI editor >>>then any coder I have seen at UNI/WORK who say VI is better... Good for you. > Gnome starts faster than Windows ?? Start time is not important To me, it is. My FreeBSD 4.10 booting into xdm, me typing in my username and password and logging in to IceWM *and start working* takes almost half the time it takes my coworkers' Windows 2000 Professional 'puters to boot up at all in a workable state. > - I am talking about reaction time of the GUI Yes, it seems that Windows is snappier. The X Window System, however, doesn't get in my way when I do other important stuff (backups, network stressing, whatever). Plus, I get to log in from *anywhere* (even a thin client) ans get *my* desktop on *my* pc. Don't get me started on Terminal Services as I've used it only once; I'd be flat in my face in ten seconds. I found that it completely sucked, but that's just my personal opinion. > nice one Linux Again, you are missing the point. > Whats the purpose of having to manually set the system to automount ?? as opposed to having it as > a system install default ?? if there is an advantage, I am sure its for the 0.01% of the user base How can security be just for 0.01%? Have you ever thought of it this way: "I want my computer to do something when *I* say it to!". >>>I can tell you that 95% of people who use computers want "EASE of USE" I am afraid you are right there. That is why the world of computing is in such a shitty state and we get a new worm or virus every 15 minutes. > - installable YES, configurable ... you've got to be shitting me :o Well... I think I just took a cr*p on your front lawn, dude. ;-) (that really is a pathetic attempt at a joke; I'm just kidding) > Fast Forward to 2004, & all I see are developers adding features that are not that important, yet > missing the basics of what the majority of USER's want(not coders) It all depends on what you use the system for and who you hold accountable. Are FreeBSD's developers accountable for what the WindowMaker people come up with? You are free to choose a GUI that fits you. > Apple OSX understands this(nice GUI over BSD base - shame about the stupid high prices & dumb one > button mouse)... Why? The one button mouse adds even more ease of use, no? > sorry BSD/Linux developers ...your just giving more air to MS by focusing on the > wrong things And rightfully so! Don't you get it? You are *free* to choose whatever system you want. If you choose any of the BSD's (for that matter), you are *free* to choose a GUI or the CLI. Also, should you opt for the GUI, you are *free* to choose which one. Also, you are *free* to choose whatever software you additionally would like to run. An editor? You are *free* to choose which one, be it CLI or GUI. A web server? Again, freedom. Choose Apache, choose thttpd, do so *freely*. <itty bitty rant> But don't bitch about it not doing exactly what *you* happen to want in a full featured web server. Shut up and code, then. </itty bitty rant> > maybe you would like a test of the Apache Web Server on BSD against the Apache Web Server on > Windows 2000 ?? - I will search the net & get back to you on that if you are interested ?? Please check to see if the report happens to be "Sponsored by Microsoft". ;-) > I wonder if people that run web servers on BSD never use a GUI thereby saying how fast BSD is... Why put down all of FreeBSD just because you think a few features suck/don't exist? If I happen to dislike a certain dashboard meter in my new Ford Focus, does that mean I have to hold a grudge against every Ford Motor Company worker? >>>...damn I have gone way off track here... sorry for the ranting people... Me too. Again, don't take it personal. > (I don't like Linux BTW) Wow, you hate FreeBSD, Java *and* Linux! ;-) > If BSD's better performance is due to System Admins running Web Servers but doing so without the > GUI(???)... then you maybe right Remko, BSD may not be right for me. I'd have to agree with Remko here. > - In the year 2004, I refuse to spend my time coding in front of a screen hacking in "cmd line > syntax".. hey thats just me! Which is perfectly okay! Good luck, whatever you happen to choose... Nico
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