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Date:      Tue, 11 Jun 1996 20:56:57 +0300 (EET DST)
From:      Narvi <narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee>
To:        Paul Richards <p.richards@elsevier.co.uk>
Cc:        stable@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: Status of -stable
Message-ID:  <Pine.BSF.3.91.960611204305.19365B-100000@haldjas.folklore.ee>
In-Reply-To: <199606111708.SAA27795@cadair.elsevier.co.uk>

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On Tue, 11 Jun 1996, Paul Richards wrote:

> >>>>> "Narvi" == Narvi  <narvi@haldjas.folklore.ee> writes:
> 
> Narvi> On Mon, 10 Jun 1996, Warner Losh wrote:
> 
> >> I like the idea of -stable where you have MAJOR bugfixes only.
> >> That's it.  No mega-commits.  No trying to get neat new features.
> >> Only security holes, core dumps, data corruption and kernel panic
> >> fixed.  The current -stable branch has been good for me in that it
> >> is 2.1R + a few good patches.  I'd be happy with that.  Something
> >> that you'd have to SUP once or maybe twice a month to keep current
> >> would be ideal.  Wanna commit anything else: Tough.  Use -current.
> >> This is somewhat of a hard line, I know, but it would mirror well
> >> what standard practice in the industry is.
> 
> This is *exactly* my view of what -stable should be.
> 
> Narvi> Then there would not be the ccd driver in -stable... :-(
> 
> Tough, it's a new feature it will be in the next -current release.

It is present in the LINT kernel of the -SNAP and so it will likely make 
to the release in 2.1.5?

> 
> >> I appreciate the monitary concerns raised here.  I think that if
> >> the volume of deltas are very small, one person could handle them
> >> in a sane manner.  Would make a good way to donate to the FreeBSD
> >> project, IMHO.  If no one comes forward, then I believe that the
> >> right approach would be to kill the whole -stable concept.  While
> >> it does differentiate FreeBSD from the other BSDs out there, it is
> >> not worth undue stress and strain on the core team to make it
> >> happen.
> 
> I've already said I'd be willing to maintain -stable if it was *just*
> bug fixes and access to the tree was restricted to a small handfull of
> stable maintainers so that changes were strictly controlled. Absolutely
> no retrofitting of -current stuff into it. My idea would be to run
> things as follows (which is what I'm planning to do for the Apache cvs
> tree as well):
> 
> 1) I think -stable should go away since it's misleaeding, it suggests
> an ongoing stable branch which was never what it was supposed to be and
> is unworkable in practice.

I see the -stable branch almost the only way of warranting the -releases 
to be stable. Perhaps not a -stable branch as we know it now but one that 
diverges off the -current say some months before the -release for more 
throughout testing.

> 
> 2) Development is ongoing and takes place in -current. At some point it's
> decided that things have reached a point where it's time to do a release,
> a cdrom is pressed and the tree is branched so people can keep playing
> in -current. The -whatever (needs a name, probably something based on the
> release number) branch can then be used to maintain minimal
> impace bug fixes. I'd consider the issue of new drivers but other than that
> it really would be strictly maintained as a bug fix only branch.
> 
> 3) The bug fix branch would be available using ctm/sup as an automated bug
> fix support service. We can consider the option of doing a 2.2.1 (e.g.) cdrom
> in between main -current driven releases if the development cycle is
> prolonged (which it always seems to be). Such a cdrom could have updated
> ports as well.
> 
> 4) There would *never* be any merges from -current into -whatever. Fixes to
> -whatever would be done using separate patches (possibly extrated from current
> but more likely as things diverge by simply doing -whatever specific fixes
> by hand).

There should be no *commits* to -stable that cause *anything to happen*. 
Things should be tested and then commited, maybe giving out the patches 
for extra testing - I don't think there would be a patch or change for 
which there would be only one person to want it.

> 
> I'm perfectly happy to do this if resources are kept available on freefall
> to maintain the cvs and sup/ctm facilities.
> 
> 

	Most probably it all shall go your way - unless something changes 
real soon. But I am not going to do anythibg about itr and hope I will 
some time get a computer to play with -current on...

		Sander



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