From owner-freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Thu Feb 14 23:39:56 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 348F614E691F for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2019 23:39:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-qk1-x72a.google.com (mail-qk1-x72a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::72a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "Google Internet Authority G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 099EC6BB44 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2019 23:39:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-qk1-x72a.google.com with SMTP id y195so4677016qka.12 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2019 15:39:55 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=crl/Jfw+KrP7qohShKzd9MkMnjgQDem6tH0qDCLysLs=; b=A65Zfv5VNpk1KIqOR+cZE62R1gIKlUn0cVPSufIVub47pR+u/lCS8ZgGWyOSRkeZcN 1jBBOE7vH8yLMOtAgKvzK6COJTuyGwSSTkscUiStmzQ6DZ9ifT23DxD90GuQl5ysbPBj 6hjN2FHz8qFKlfv1B42HkpeCbBUuZfnIpwXWzVoDUO0F9bYHKUoX9a0Ywa5WS4NEOPQA neYVWwfziqYj0lTvmqUNXRbF1ps29nlXqDh8CQv+vZUBQ4eFN9VEcyBTkFsLJ/xHwuQd /nnD57UZXfckVrkNfT0RcHl3lQR1agu7P5NyF6wZkUc7aSEz86c3UUX4sVvcXyPBVcjR RjFw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=crl/Jfw+KrP7qohShKzd9MkMnjgQDem6tH0qDCLysLs=; b=WTp9xmArZjBNeedkCk8Xo1qVI11srr/ZXGSQ/pumrz3ijIpFel7Hj4ldsUvMl2doh2 6xPOeQOSoUAY74JbYZJ8mK4NMAGAcfdgTwzxsK/0dMJYCpq/qOtXm6SxXPVHYULPdvKn 3oBgbUKWgNispxfwgAKJtDrH0UJvF67fQ9dzlJfmD5HKtzk13mxq9OnZnW08kfI590SK 8APPb8eEwRAanCa3cHJMfcH8Uy9Udb3RYLfDamtyZC7ex7B/1fXZ2voVwwi6GFaCZWQf rQbKbYKtgIbfLQpnGkwu0V/frbBcyQogZUxYyeEyELy7P2jDOHAADkH3zbpOy2Hlyb+w BWuQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAubGTJROZCpmPFsV99PMnykCNuBSeD0hcHSUkeXOzhjpaCehp+Ki TYFViyL4rT+Db6Ijdlg+FbsqzlEKXmB06nqYfAiHWzHf X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IaGP9JF3TyQmgCJtz/B1fY+OvBWEQ36ZtLPCoKS/wGU1Ktzc5cmUUXiZ4PTBq2TBwJSoB18ra5uETY8tvMXP8g= X-Received: by 2002:a37:9201:: with SMTP id u1mr5054829qkd.258.1550187594349; Thu, 14 Feb 2019 15:39:54 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20190214180101.GB67712@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190214182419.GA67872@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190214190244.GA68143@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190214191739.GA68371@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> <20190214225810.kmfxzeuvr7t7gget@smtp.freebsd.org> <20190214233000.GA2752@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> In-Reply-To: <20190214233000.GA2752@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> From: Warner Losh Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2019 16:39:42 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: "DRM removal soon" is premature To: Steve Kargl Cc: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 099EC6BB44 X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=A65Zfv5V X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.76 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; URIBL_BLOCKED(0.00)[gappssmtp.com.multi.uribl.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.959,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-arch@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bsdimp.com]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[a.2.7.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[ALT1.aspmx.l.google.com,aspmx.l.google.com,ALT2.aspmx.l.google.com]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; IP_SCORE(-2.79)[ip: (-9.32), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-2.56), asn: 15169(-1.98), country: US(-0.07)]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2019 23:39:56 -0000 On Thu, Feb 14, 2019, 4:30 PM Steve Kargl On Thu, Feb 14, 2019 at 02:58:10PM -0800, Ben Widawsky wrote: > > > > Not to pile on unnecessarily here, but I think the fundamental issue is > that > > there is nobody who wants to maintain the in-tree DRM, and removal is > likely a > > better option to half-assed maintenance. I'd imagine there'd be a > different > > discussion if several developers were clamoring to keep this driver well > > maintained in the tree. > > > > Unhooking a driver from the build, so that it cannot expose > a change that breaks said driver is certainly a way to > ensure the driver is not maintained. > It was already unmaintained. Wasted a weekend trying to find and attempting to fix the > damage caused by a change in src/sys to the drm-legacy-kmod > port. You know, the port that was promised as part of the > drm2 removal. I would have spent this weekend testing > changes to cexp, cexpf, the soon-to-be-submitted cexpl, > ccosh, ccoshf, and the soon-to-be-submitted ccoshl. That's > all on hold now as I'm not sure when I'll be able to carve > out time for testing. > That is unfortunate. The root cause though is that the config you are using is on the trailing edge. It would have been fixed, in that it would have built, but I'm pretty sure it would have still broken because no one is using this config. I'd argue that having it in the tree too long, including in 12, lead to an expectation that would continue to work when we knew a year ago there was a high risk of undetected breakage happening. And wasting your time because of those unrealistic expectations we've fostered is definitely not a good outcome. So I too am frustrated. And I'm sorry that it is causing you pain. Warner >