Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2017 20:27:10 -0500 From: Farhan Khan <khanzf@gmail.com> To: bsd-lists@BSDforge.com Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) Message-ID: <a0c0b8bd-966f-4fb5-134e-bb61e7a5155c@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <fe62980cafb2506078b97a35a1c8384d@udns.ultimatedns.net> References: <fe62980cafb2506078b97a35a1c8384d@udns.ultimatedns.net>
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Hi Chris, Thank you for your response. I must disagree. A) If your concern is heritage, people can look into the BSD history. This is readily available online. B) If you feel there is utility, `pkg install fortune`. Everyone is happy. I am not certain how my previous email came off as rude. Perhaps a loss of tone in my voice over email? If you knew me in person, you would know that I did not intend any disrespect. Thanks! Farhan On 11/28/2017 07:19 PM, Chris H wrote: > On Tue, 28 Nov 2017 18:34:24 -0500 "Farhan Khan" <khanzf@gmail.com> said > >> On 11/28/2017 05:11 PM, freebsd@johnea.net wrote: >> > On 2017-11-26 21:46, Cy Schubert wrote: >> >> In message <307f8e8d0ad15d2d00e74a9b602c8c19@udns.ultimatedns.net>, >> "Chris >> > H" writes: >> >>> On Sun, 26 Nov 2017 09:11:43 -0800 "Cy Schubert" >> <Cy.Schubert@komquats.com> >> > said >> >>>> In message <20171126163259.6fb55366@gumby.homeunix.com>, RW via >> > freebsd-hackers writes: >> >>>>> On Sun, 26 Nov 2017 07:59:52 -0800 Cy Schubert wrote: >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>>> Lastly. I'm not totally against games. My 4 and 5 year old >> grandkids >> >>>>>> play games on game tablets. However I would never let my grandkids >> >>>>>> even see what fortune spits out. Much of it was offensive. I would >> >>>>>> have been ashamed had they seen some of the outputs. >> > > This statement is factually incorrect. >> > > It just is not the case. >> > > I've received fortune in email every morning for about 14 years. >> That's well >> > over 5000 fortunes. I've never seen even vaguely offensive content. >> > > The default settings do not deliver patently offensive content, >> period. >> > >>>>> >> >>>>> You have to try quite hard to find them, they aren't given by >> default, >> >>>>> and: >> >>>>> >> >>>>> $ fortune -o >> >>>>> No fortunes found >> >>>>> in /usr/share/games/fortune:/usr/local/share/games/fortune. >> >>>> >> > ... >> >>>> It's 2017. If Red Hat doesn't support fortune why should we? >> >>> OK this is the 2nd time you've said that, and I'm afraid I'm going >> to have >> > to >> >>> respond. :) >> >>> FreeBSD is *not* Red Hat, nor any other "flavor" of Linux. Who >> cares if >> > some >> >>> other flavor of OS does, or does not "do it". >> >>> Sorry. I *greatly* appreciate that FreeBSD is /different/ than all >> the >> > Linux >> >>> flavors, and would dearly hate that it felt that it should feel/be >> "Linux >> > lik >> >>> e". >> >>> Over sensitive? Perhaps. But I simply couldn't resist. >> >>> >> >>> I'm done now. :) >> >> >> >> Of course FreeBSD isn't a Linux distro however RH has probably >> learned that >> >> contentious issues like this aren't worth the risk and exposure and >> the >> >> cost of supporting such software. FreeBSD is a volunteer effort. >> >> Unnecessary software still exacts a cost even in an environment >> like ours. >> >> >> > > I have to agree with the negative reaction to the Red Hat comparison. >> > > Saying that FreeBSD obviously isn't linux doesn't address the >> concern over >> > this comparison. >> > > If you think fortune is a flame war lightning rod, maybe you >> haven't heard of >> > systemd? >> > > systemd is a Red Hat product. >> > > There are many different reasons for the controversy over systemd. >> One of >> > them is that it removes the individuality of adopting distributions, >> making >> > them more uniform. The corporation in charge of that uniformity >> being Red Hat. >> > > People don't like the elimination of fortune for the same reason >> they didn't >> > like the politically-correct-ification of beastie: It makes the OS >> seem less >> > like something made by individuals for individuals, and more like a >> polished, >> > "risk and exposure" averse, corporate product. In a word, dehumanized. >> > > johnea > Respectfully re-flowing your *disrespectful* Top Post >> (I write this with a respectful tone in my voice.) >> >> With respect, FreeBSD is an operating system, not a person to be >> dehumanized. If you so strongly desire to run fortune, do a quick `pkg >> install fortune`. You can continue to utilize this feature as you >> please. Problem solved. No one is censoring anyone's speech, just >> install it from the packages. It will likely take literally 2 seconds. >> >> Being relatively new to FreeBSD on my servers, I always found fortune >> by default as unbecoming of an enterprise-class operating system. It >> would be like having lolcats or cowsay on by default. >> >> You can continue to have the morning email with a fortune quote, you >> will not lose that functionality. Everyone wins. >> > END re-flow > > What I think many responding to this thread may not understand; is that > for some (many?) of us, the source referred to, we have been cobbling on, > and using for 30+ years. In fact fortune(6) (as Shawn noted earlier) > *predates* FreeBSD; or more accurately; the BSD. Point being; fortune(6) > (as well as it's growing data set) is a part of it's heritage. Call > it sentimental if you like. But there's not a hell-of-a-lot of that > heritage left. fortune' data set, for the most part, is quite harmless, > and often, fairly witty. You must directly request the portion that > (apparently) some might find offensive. But in reality, it's really > only references to part of global history. I experienced far worse than > this in my history classes in grade && high school. That being WWII > films that graphically depicted the atrocities imposed/inflicted on > so many the victims. Should we eliminate world history classes, because > some students might not like what they hear, and see? Hell, why not > eliminate school entirely then? > The point I'd like to make here; is that fortune(6), and it's > accompanying data sets are *not* harmful. They are one of the *few* > bits left of the *original* BSD, and should be allowed to stay as-is, > for posterity. Even tho many of the new-comers don't completely > understand. > > Thank you for listening. > > --Chris > >
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