Date: Tue, 29 Mar 2005 16:12:23 -0500 From: Bart Silverstrim <bsilver@chrononomicon.com> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Anthony's drive issues.Re: ssh password delay Message-ID: <c55bcf46e2a520b2fc60c29566485cad@chrononomicon.com> In-Reply-To: <2130059.20050329210146@wanadoo.fr> References: <6b3b25263c4e7776fd5127af2c536cd6@chrononomicon.com> <LOBBIFDAGNMAMLGJJCKNAEPDFAAA.tedm@toybox.placo.com> <2130059.20050329210146@wanadoo.fr>
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On Mar 29, 2005, at 2:01 PM, Anthony Atkielski wrote: > Ted Mittelstaedt writes: > >> He is saying that the microcode was modified and that we speculate >> that >> the mods contain a bug proprietary to the HP implementation of that >> controller. > > What makes it a _bug_? Why would the modified firmware contain a bug > ... but not FreeBSD? Um...because it took an adapter that generically had worked, but after modifying it didn't? Christ, I had OS/2 refusing to install on a system because of the *keyboard* I had connected once. >> He doesen't want to run Windows (on this system at least) > > Correct. It's a more or less spare system and I'm more interesting in > getting more experience with UNIX than with getting more experience > with > Windows. I already know plenty about Windows. I have an old 68k mac laying here...think I can install AmigaDOS on it? no? Maybe because it just wasn't meant to be...that machine just won't take that OS! Try the OS on other hardware, replace the hardware giving trouble, or go back to Windows and stop whining. I and others on the list have suggested numerous times things like self-contained Live-CD's of Linux/FreeBSD, or USB-bootable versions, or talking to the actual developers instead of a USER MAILING LIST (Not DEVELOPER), or swapping the controller out and get matching drives to test against, or even paying someone to fix it with your hardware to test on, or just going back to windows so you can ignore the problem in the first place, and every damn time you poo poo it and continue whining about the group not diving into your eight-year-old frankenserver to fix your specific problem on a modified firmware controller. As far as this list is concerned, it's not gonna happen. You pretend to be so dense that the possibility of a difference between a modded firmware and a generic firmware could not POSSIBLY cause problems as far as you're concerned. I've seen Linux report errors with drives that NT didn't. I've seen printers that wouldn't install under our network until the firmware was updated. But you blindly push forward, bitching on a VOLUNTEER USER list that you demand someone here yank out the debugger and rewrite the driver to work with your brain-dead controller with dissimilar drives hooked up. Aren't you the same person that said MS changed features specifically at your request, but you didn't remember what they were? If so, you never did answer me on how you could have forgotten what that feature was. > In any case, this wonderfully fun experience is pushing me more and > more > in the direction of home-built hardware, and further and further away > from brand-name machines. <holy crap>....how long has it taken you to realize that HP/Compaq routinely do odd proprietary crap to their hardware? you didn't know what the Apple IIe is? You couldn't figure out why someone would suggest testing a problem on another bit of identical hardware to isolate if it was a hardware problem or a software problem? .... How long have you been a sysadmin? > I'm glad I decided to build my own server > instead of buying that IBM eSeries machine. Who knows what problems I > might have had with it? Depends. Get the multithousand dollar support contract with them, run exactly what they tell you to run, and you'll be happy with the support they would give. If you want to start f*'ing around with what's installed and doing custom configurations, you won't be happy. how long have you been doing this, anyway? >> Unfortunately, Anthony won't do the least bit of troubleshooting (such >> as pulling the Quantum disk and just running on the Seagate disk in >> this system to see if perhaps the problem is execerbated by one or the >> other implementations of SCSI in one or the other of the disks - >> granted that is a long shot, but it's within the realm of possibility >> it might fix it) so I doubt he would do anything that the ahc driver >> (who most likely isn't even subscribed to freebsd-questions) tells him >> to do in the way of troubleshooting either. > > Anything isn't going to do anything until someone can tell him what the > existing messages are saying. I don't go pulling boards every time I > see a message that I don't recognize. I heard a similar type of argument from a five year old. Do it my way, I wanna know where we're going first or I'm going to sit on the floor and scream until I get my way... But remember, List Subscribers, YOU'RE the immature ones. >> Also long forgotten in this discussion is Anthony stated once on this >> list that Mandrake Linux wouldn't even install on this Vectra system >> either. > > It stops after the splash screen, but I think that is related to the > same problem that prevents FreeBSD from booting directly from disk. Hmm... I've had several machines where distro X wouldn't work but Distro Y did. But by your logic, this isn't possible, right? >> I am not sure why he's trying to hold FreeBSD up to the driver support >> of Windows NT when Linux won't even talk to the card in his system. > > I don't know what Linux will or won't do, and unlike you, I'm not > prepared to make wild guesses. I know only that Mandrake Linux will > stall after displaying a splash screen, and that's that. You're right. You're getting much farther by insulting people and being obstinate when given suggestions. Anyone here have a crystal ball so we can fix Anthony's problem with the first try? > I suspect they just ask the vendor for information on the hardware. > Even Microsoft has neither the time nor the money to test every > conceivable hardware configuration. What a dichotomy to your insults of FreeBSD developers. > A more likely scenario is that the vendor itself writes the driver and > then has Microsoft certify it. The certification is pretty > rudimentary, > IIRC; essentially MS ensures that the system doesn't melt or spew acrid > smoke when the driver is invoked and that's about it. You mean, it could be buggy or have problems that are "ignored", but it still "works" anyway and gets the MS stamp? But, how could this be?
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