From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 0:59:43 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from resnet.uoregon.edu (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.144.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A07C37B54B for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 00:59:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu) Received: from localhost (dwhite@localhost) by resnet.uoregon.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA89084; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 00:59:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu) Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 00:59:30 -0800 (PST) From: Doug White To: Marc Frajola Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? In-Reply-To: <200002262003.MAA13658@enginet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 26 Feb 2000, Marc Frajola wrote: > Hi... > > I have spent a bit of time messing around with the command-line > fdisk and disklabel commands, and have been unable to setup a proper > fdisk and FreeBSD partition label solely from the command line. Somebody didn't check the usual places! :) http://www.freebsd.org/tutorials/formatting-media/ Also if you are on a recent (3.4?) -STABLE or -CURRENT you have the dangerous yet handy fdisk -e option. You will certainly want to steal my code from the 'install' PicoBSD floppy, which fdisk, disklabels, and newfs's the target disk automatically. Doug White | FreeBSD: The Power to Serve dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | www.FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 8:29: 4 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ab-bg.net (ab-bg.net [212.56.11.129]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id AA27737B5BE for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 08:28:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from v0rbiz@ab-bg.net) Received: (qmail 2469 invoked by uid 1000); 27 Feb 2000 16:25:21 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 27 Feb 2000 16:25:21 -0000 Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 18:25:21 +0200 (EET) From: Victor Ivanov To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: KDGKBSTATE and alt=meta Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi.. there is no shift-keys retrieval ioctl implemented in FreeBSD... why? the KDGKBSTATE ioctl returns just the lock-keys state. actualy it takes the flags int and masks it with the lock-keys bitmask. some applications need the shift-keys state (such as mcedit and the tvision library) and i have added another ioctl to provide it (i could use the same ioctl but... nevermind :). is there a problem adding something like 'options KBD_SHIFTSTATES' to the configuration scripts or somthing... :) the second thing is ALT = META... AT keyboards don't have meta keys and alt for meta is fine... ..thanks :) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 8:42:24 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fep02-svc.mail.telepac.pt (fep02-svc.mail.telepac.pt [194.65.5.201]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 655C437B661 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 08:42:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jpedras@webvolution.net) Received: from manecao.tafkap.priv ([194.65.204.90]) by fep02-svc.mail.telepac.pt (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with ESMTP id <20000227164510.MBPX4775.fep02-svc.mail.telepac.pt@manecao.tafkap.priv> for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 16:45:10 +0000 Content-Length: 530 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3.1 [p0] on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 16:42:17 -0000 (GMT) Reply-To: Joao Pedras From: Joao Pedras To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: custom release Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello all How much disk space is it necessary to have the entire CVS repository ? The idea is to build a custom release. Tkx Joao ^\ /^ O O ----------------------------------------o00-(_)-00o-------------------------- Hummingbirds never remember the words to songs. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- PGP key available upon request or may be cut at http://pedras.webvolution.net/pgpkey.html To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 9:21: 7 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.surf1.de (mail.Surf1.de [194.25.165.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6156037B688 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 09:21:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from alex@cichlids.com) Received: from cichlids.com (postfix@pC19F5466.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [193.159.84.102]) by mail.surf1.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA12155; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 18:20:56 +0100 Received: by cichlids.com (Postfix, from userid 1001) id CAF2EAC28; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 18:21:02 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <20000227182102.A20171@cichlids.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 18:21:02 +0100 From: Alexander Langer To: Joao Pedras , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: custom release References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.91.1i In-Reply-To: ; from Joao Pedras on Sun, Feb 27, 2000 at 04:42:17PM -0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > How much disk space is it necessary to have the entire CVS repository ? Actually almost exactly: /dev/ad0s3f 992439 848276 64768 93% /usr/home/ncvs uhm, approx. 800 MB. > The idea is to build a custom release. This takes some more, I believe at least 3 GB or such. Alex To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 9:34:47 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bigphred.greycat.com (bigphred.greycat.com [207.173.133.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BAA1A37B568 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 09:34:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dann@bigphred.greycat.com) Received: (from dann@localhost) by bigphred.greycat.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA03468 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 09:34:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dann) Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 09:34:40 -0800 From: Dann Lunsford To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Where is 'dip' ... -- Any dip users out there? Message-ID: <20000227093440.A3364@greycat.com> References: <38B43C5A.CE263F66@acm.org> <951384983.334873@caiman.elsevier.nl> <38B72C51.4A9023ED@acm.org> <38b7c901$0$18570@ams2eusosrv31.ams.ops.eu.uu.net> <200002270049.BAA39434@uriah.heep.sax.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <200002270049.BAA39434@uriah.heep.sax.de>; from j@uriah.heep.sax.de on Sun, Feb 27, 2000 at 01:49:14AM +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, Feb 27, 2000 at 01:49:14AM +0100, J Wunsch wrote: > Incidentally, i recently considered removing the entire bsddip port. > (I'm the maintainer of it.) There have never been any updates to the > original bsddip (AFAICT), ppp(8) is actively and nicely maintained by > Brian Somers, and nobody's going to use SLIP anymore anyway (and those > couple of you out there who do wouldn't use dip for it either, would > you? :-). > > So are there really any remaining bsddip users? Otherwise i'll kill > the port some day. Well, I'm still using it. For my setup, dip/CSLIP has a significant performance advantage over PPP (about 5-10%, last time I looked), apparently due to the lack of overhead. And dip makes the setup fairly easy/painless; I'd really dislike having to use the "standard" SLIP. PPP is nice when the setup is dynamic, and if you're using protocols other than IP. In that case, I can see using it. My setup has neither of those characteristics, so, for me, dip/CSLIP is better. I suspect there's a lot of people in the same boat, and will continue to be. So, please don't kill the port. You are (obviously!) not compelled to do anything with it, but leave it around for the people who will need it. Just my $0.02. -- Dann Lunsford The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil dann@greycat.com is that men of good will do nothing. -- Cicero To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 9:38:54 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cicely5.cicely.de (cicely.de [194.231.9.142]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D914837B682 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 09:38:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ticso@cicely5.cicely.de) Received: (from ticso@localhost) by cicely5.cicely.de (8.9.3/8.9.2) id SAA27098 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 18:39:04 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from ticso) Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 18:39:04 +0100 From: Bernd Walter To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: sockets in kernelmodule Message-ID: <20000227183903.A27079@cicely5.cicely.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre3i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Is it valid to use proc0 for socreate() and sobind() in kernel? In my case I need to create a TCP connection which is used from different processes and which may be reconnected from different processes. -- B.Walter COSMO-Project http://www.cosmo-project.de ticso@cicely.de Usergroup info@cosmo-project.de To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 12:32:13 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [216.240.41.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7213937B6DF for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 12:32:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id MAA67166; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 12:31:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 12:31:55 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <200002272031.MAA67166@apollo.backplane.com> To: Ryan Thompson Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Annoying nfsrcv hangs References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :ps al on my system shows multiple nfsrcv hangs on processes such as df, ls :and umount. Without any other characteristic problems, the nfs server :machine's exports all seemed to be working correctly. However, *one* and :only one of the mounts somehow went south. 'mount' on the client machine :shows: : :# mount | grep 10.0.0.2 :10.0.0.2:/usr on /f/usr :10.0.0.2:/devel on /f/devel :10.0.0.2:/bigfs on bigfs I assume the hangs are on the client? Not surprising if its a 3.2 system. A whole lot of NFS fixes went in between 3.2 and 3.4 so I recommend upgrading the client to the latest post 3.4 -stable. :That's verbatim... The mount was NOT done on bigfs... It was in fact done :on /f/bigfs. "We have secretly switched this SysAdmin's mountpoint with I don't know what is going on here, but it kinda sounds like cockpit trouble somewhere either in the exports line or the client's mount command. :The client nfs mounts are mounted intr, yet I still can't send a TERM or :KILL that these processes will catch. : intr is problematic but should basically work. If you are using a TCP NFS mount intr might not work until the tcp connection itself times out, but in either case will almost certainly not work if there is a protocol lockup issue (and there are several in 3.2). : :As you see, I haven't had any longevity problems up until now.. : :Has anything been built into -CURRENT to address these hangs? It has :plagued many in the past, and continues to do so. : : Yours truly, : Ryan Thompson Both -current and -stable have various NFS fixes that earlier releases did not. In general, NFS fixes for the -stable branch have been kept up to date with the work in -current, but -current ought to have much better NFS performance then stable. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 12:49:25 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xena.cs.waikato.ac.nz (xena.cs.waikato.ac.nz [130.217.241.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69C2937B699 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 12:49:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from joerg@lucy.cs.waikato.ac.nz) Received: from lucy.cs.waikato.ac.nz (joerg@lucy.cs.waikato.ac.nz [130.217.241.12]) by xena.cs.waikato.ac.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA26681; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 09:49:11 +1300 (NZDT) Received: (from joerg@localhost) by lucy.cs.waikato.ac.nz (8.9.3/8.9.0) id JAA20045; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 09:49:09 +1300 (NZDT) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 09:49:08 +1300 From: Joerg Micheel To: Brian Beattie Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, joerg@cs.waikato.ac.nz Subject: Re: building a release Message-ID: <20000228094908.Z19133@cs.waikato.ac.nz> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii In-Reply-To: ; from Brian Beattie on Sat, Feb 26, 2000 at 11:47:33AM -0800 Organization: SCMS, The University of Waikato, Hamilton, New Zealand Project: WAND - Waikato Applied Network Dynamics, DAG Operating-System: ... drained by Solaris 7 SPARC Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Feb 26, 2000 at 11:47:33AM -0800, Brian Beattie wrote: > I have looked at the FAQ and find only a partial answer. I would like to > build a a release with base and X11, to do local installs of > 4.0-current. I can build the base from /usr/src/release, I have the > XFree86 sources. > > Can anybody send me notes, or point me at the FAQ? I have tried the same thing last week. All I can say is that you definitely need to run the same -current to build a release of the tree. So, do an installworld first and reboot (or fetch a -current release of the net for now, such as I did) and then go into src/release and follow the instructions in the Makefile. Something like make release CHROOTDIR=/some/dir is required. The CHROOT is the problem with older releases. If you don't run the same kernel, your libc and make etc wil run into problems. I haven't taken this to success, maybe others can add. Joerg -- Joerg B. Micheel Email: Waikato Applied Network Dynamics Phone: +64 7 8384794 The University of Waikato, CompScience Fax: +64 7 8384155 Private Bag 3105 Pager: +64 868 38222 Hamilton, New Zealand Plan: TINE and the DAG's To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 14:27:20 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ntstn.sasknow.com (h139-142-245-100.ss.fiberone.net [139.142.245.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6ED1737B599 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 14:27:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ryan@sasknow.com) Received: from localhost (ryan@localhost) by ntstn.sasknow.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA00871; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 16:27:40 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from ryan@sasknow.com) Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 16:27:40 -0600 (CST) From: Ryan Thompson Reply-To: Ryan Thompson To: Matthew Dillon Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Annoying nfsrcv hangs In-Reply-To: <200002272031.MAA67166@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: Organization: SaskNow Technologies [www.sasknow.com] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Matthew Dillon wrote to Ryan Thompson: > :ps al on my system shows multiple nfsrcv hangs on processes such as df, ls > :and umount. Without any other characteristic problems, the nfs server > : [...] > > I assume the hangs are on the client? Not surprising if its a 3.2 > system. A whole lot of NFS fixes went in between 3.2 and 3.4 so I > recommend upgrading the client to the latest post 3.4 -stable. Yes, the hangs are on the 3.2-R client. An upgrade is currently in the works... Actually it's slated for installation next week. Hopefully that will help kick NFS into shape for me. > :That's verbatim... The mount was NOT done on bigfs... It was in fact done > :on /f/bigfs. "We have secretly switched this SysAdmin's mountpoint with > > I don't know what is going on here, but it kinda sounds like cockpit > trouble somewhere either in the exports line or the client's mount > command. Something strange, certainly... I don't recall changing the mount status of any of those, or mounting/unmounting anything at all for that matter. Didn't see anything weird in messages. Could still have been recent pilot error, I suppose. However, exports on the server haven't changed in eight months and that 'bigfs' was mounted at boot from fstab on the client, many months ago. Nothing OOTO in exports or fstab.. The mounts look pretty homogenous. That's what made me think something was strange; several other similarly-mapped mounts between the same two machines never missed a beat. HOWEVER... (Update, here)... When I finally got in to the office today, I did a `umount -a -t nfs &` on the client (the & for the purpose of regaining my shell while umount hung trying to unmount bigfs :-). Then killed off mountd, nfsd, portmap, and even inetd in that order, and restarted them in the reverse of that order. The hung processes on the client magically became unstuck and terminated, and I was able to unmount that muddled bigfs and start over. Everything seems to be in working order once again. Perhaps the 3.2 client isn't solely to blame, here, after all. I'll try this all again when both machines are running -STABLE. > :Has anything been built into -CURRENT to address these hangs? It has > :plagued many in the past, and continues to do so. > : > : Yours truly, > : Ryan Thompson > > Both -current and -stable have various NFS fixes that earlier releases > did not. In general, NFS fixes for the -stable branch have been kept > up to date with the work in -current, but -current ought to have much > better NFS performance then stable. Performance = transfer rates and latency? Or just generalized stability? I haven't had the time to watch -CURRENT all that closely, but I'll be happy when some of the new functionality becomes -STABLE. Thanks for the reply, - Ryan -- Ryan Thompson Systems Administrator, Accounts Phone: +1 (306) 664-1161 SaskNow Technologies http://www.sasknow.com #106-380 3120 8th St E Saskatoon, SK S7H 0W2 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 14:47:54 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtprch1.nortel.com (smtprch1.nortelnetworks.com [192.135.215.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52D9E37B63E for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 14:47:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from atrens@nortelnetworks.com) Received: from zmers013 by smtprch1.nortel.com; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 16:46:53 -0600 Received: from hcarp00g.ca.nortel.com by zmers013; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 17:46:28 -0500 Received: from hcarp00g.ca.nortel.com (hcarp00g.ca.nortel.com [47.196.31.114]) by hcarp00g.ca.nortel.com (8.9.3/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA63503; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 17:54:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 17:54:57 -0500 (EST) From: "Andrew Atrens" X-Sender: atrens@hcarp00g.ca.nortel.com Reply-To: "Andrew Atrens" To: Jason Allum Cc: freebsd-hackers Subject: Re: powerpc cross compiler? In-Reply-To: <00cd01bf7fa0$b6037cc0$e82da6d1@nxos.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG You'll need to get header files from your _target_ os and then tell gcc where to find them. What's your target OS ? On Fri, 25 Feb 2000, Jason Allum wrote: > Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 09:58:01 -0500 > From: Jason Allum > To: freebsd-hackers > Subject: powerpc cross compiler? > > i'm trying to setup gcc 2.95.2 as a powerpc (7400/G4) cross compiler on > freebsd 3.4-release... i'm having no luck, as it keeps bombing out when it > tries to build libgcc.a... anyone got any ideas? alpha people? ;) > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 16: 4:44 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sprout.cgf.net (adsl-207-215-8-122.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [207.215.8.122]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB77D37B51C for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 16:04:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tomb@cgf.net) Received: from cgf.net (localhost.cgf.net [127.0.0.1]) by sprout.cgf.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA00459 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 16:07:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tomb@cgf.net) Message-ID: <38B9BC38.65AA1B9E@cgf.net> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 16:07:20 -0800 From: tom brown Organization: Badger Basters (We do it with Lard) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.4-STABLE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: scanimage reports "open of device coolscan:/dev/pass4 failed: Invalid argument" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The story so far: Recompiled the kernel with controller scbus0 # SCSI bus (required) device da0 # Direct Access (disks) device sa0 # Sequential Access (tape etc) device cd0 # CD controller scbus1 device cd1 device pass0 Installed the scanner on the second SCSI channel Feb 27 15:27:09 foobar/kernel: pass4: Removable Scanner SCSI-2 device Feb 27 15:27:09 foobar/kernel: pass4: 3.300MB/s transfers build device node: bash#cd /dev bash#./MAKEDEV pass4 Built sane, xsane, gimp from the ports. The config file for the coolscan /usr/local/etc/sane.d/coolscan.conf scsi Nikon * Scanner /dev/pass4 Added the path: SANE_CONFIG_DIR=/usr/local/etc/sane.d And the /dev/pass4 device has the following permissions crw------- 1 root operator 31, 4 Feb 27 14:17 /dev/pass4 Execute scanimage: bash#scanimage -d coolscan:/dev/pass4 scanimage: open of device coolscan:/dev/pass4 failed: Invalid argument Any ideas? I find the device node permissions suspect, but I don't know what they should be "crw_rw_rw_" prehaps? Thanks Tom To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 17: 0: 4 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AAEA37B542 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 16:59:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id LAA04974; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 11:29:21 +1030 (CST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 11:29:21 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: Doug White Cc: Marc Frajola , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? Message-ID: <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> References: <200002262003.MAA13658@enginet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre2i In-Reply-To: WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sunday, 27 February 2000 at 0:59:30 -0800, Doug White wrote: > On Sat, 26 Feb 2000, Marc Frajola wrote: > >> Hi... >> >> I have spent a bit of time messing around with the command-line >> fdisk and disklabel commands, and have been unable to setup a proper >> fdisk and FreeBSD partition label solely from the command line. > > Somebody didn't check the usual places! :) > > http://www.freebsd.org/tutorials/formatting-media/ > > Also if you are on a recent (3.4?) -STABLE or -CURRENT you have the > dangerous yet handy fdisk -e option. fdisk -e is doubly dangerous. OpenBSD uses -e to mean "edit the label". In FreeBSD, it's more like "eradicate the label". Greg -- Finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key See complete headers for address and phone numbers To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 17:21:23 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (genesi.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4573937B690 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 17:21:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (doconnor@cain [203.38.152.97]) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA19294; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 11:49:44 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.4.0 on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 11:49:44 +1030 (CST) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: Victor Ivanov Subject: Re: modem program... Help Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 25-Feb-00 Victor Ivanov wrote: > The modem's escape sequense is three escape symbols (usually '+') which > maybe disabled if the escape symbol is >127 (stored in register 2): > ATS2=x where x>127 disables it, so xxxATH0 won't work. It is good to > disable it (otherwise you get dropped with a simple ping...). > The default value is 43 ('+'). Depends how cheap your modem is.. Hayes patented the guard time between the +'s and the ATH0. They license this, but some modem vendors are too cheap to implement it.. --- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 18: 9:56 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.webmonster.de (datasink.webmonster.de [194.162.162.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6955437B670 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 18:09:51 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from karsten@rohrbach.de) Received: (qmail 74201 invoked by uid 1000); 28 Feb 2000 02:09:49 -0000 Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:09:49 +0100 From: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! Message-ID: <20000228030949.A73905@rohrbach.de> Reply-To: karsten@rohrbach.de Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i X-Arbitrary-Number-Of-The-Day: 42 X-Sender: karsten@rohrbach.de Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ok guys, here's just a little idea on how to get the hardware manufacturer guys a little bit more responsive (in fact, i got somehow "inspired" by the alsa sound project guys because they got something similar)... let's put up a list of hardware manufacturers that do not answer our mails, that do not hear our pleas for driver development, that simply do not react. then we might publish a link to this thing on the freebsd.org homepage and write some cutey little press release on that to zdnet and daemonnews and other news sites. maybe we got some more responsiveness then. i'm tired of write lots of emails just to get some details or techspecs of chipsets and pieces of peripheral hardware sounding like "i am tiny, you are big, please gimme documentation and dont sue me for using it". jordan: how far did you come with the idea of having some legal stuff running over the .org when it comes to nda crap? you told us that you would investigate the possibilites of having nda's signed by officials from freebsd inc., since this would also be a strong point for getting more explicit hardware docu... okay, kill me with your discussion thread! i would have some nice database interface up and running for the blacklist stuff in about one week (cebit is putting quite a sysload on me)... /k -- > May the source be with you! http://www.webmonster.de http://www.apache.de http://www.splatterworld.de (NIC-HDL KR433/KR11-RIPE) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 19:40:59 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from search.sparks.net (search.sparks.net [208.5.188.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D339C37B7CE for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 19:40:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dmiller@search.sparks.net) Received: by search.sparks.net (Postfix, from userid 100) id 9794ADBB4; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 22:40:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by search.sparks.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8541EDBB3 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 22:40:47 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 22:40:47 -0500 (EST) From: David Miller To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Need help with crash debug Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I'm trying my first ever post-mortem on a core file, so please be kind:) I recompiled the kernel with makeoptions DEBUG="-g", copied the kernel to kernel.debug, strip -g the kernel, and booted. I set the dumpdev in rc.conf, and added to the savecore line in /etc/rc so it looks like this: savecore -N /sys/compile/STAGING-1/kernel.debug /var/crash Now I'm trying to follow along in the handbook, so I do what it seems to say: staging-1:/# cd /sys/compile/STAGING- staging-1:STAGING-1# gdb -k kernel.debug /var/crash/vmcore.1 GNU gdb 4.18 Copyright 1998 Free Software Foundation, Inc. GDB is free software, covered by the GNU General Public License, and you are welcome to change it and/or distribute copies of it under certain conditions. Type "show copying" to see the conditions. There is absolutely no warranty for GDB. Type "show warranty" for details. This GDB was configured as "i386-unknown-freebsd"... kernel symbol `SMP_prvspace' not found. (kgdb) where No stack. (kgdb) At this point I'm lost, in search of clues. Details: Intel NLX based motherboard, ncr controllers, two P-III 500 CPU's, 256 MB ram. Running FreeBSD 3.2-Release, with SMP enabled in the config file. FWIW, SMP_prvspace definately isn't in the symbol file: staging-1:STAGING-1# strings kernel.debug |grep SMP_ _SMP_prvstart SMP_ioapic SMP_prvpt Pointers to existing docs I should have known about most welcome. Pointers/clues/advice also welcome. --- David Miller To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 19:53:36 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.nyct.net (bsd4.nyct.net [204.141.86.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D20737B5B6 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 19:53:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mbac@nyct.net) Received: from bsd1.nyct.net (mbac@bsd1.nyct.net [204.141.86.3]) by mail.nyct.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA02319; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 22:53:29 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from mbac@nyct.net) Received: from localhost (mbac@localhost) by bsd1.nyct.net (8.8.8/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA16495; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 22:53:29 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from mbac@nyct.net) X-Authentication-Warning: bsd1.nyct.net: mbac owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 22:53:29 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Bacarella To: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! In-Reply-To: <20000228030949.A73905@rohrbach.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I love the idea myself, but I have no power over FreeBSD :( -MB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 20:19:49 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from xena.cs.waikato.ac.nz (xena.cs.waikato.ac.nz [130.217.241.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B52C37B54F for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 20:19:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from joerg@lucy.cs.waikato.ac.nz) Received: from lucy.cs.waikato.ac.nz (joerg@lucy.cs.waikato.ac.nz [130.217.241.12]) by xena.cs.waikato.ac.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA10632; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:19:34 +1300 (NZDT) Received: (from joerg@localhost) by lucy.cs.waikato.ac.nz (8.9.3/8.9.0) id RAA27401; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:19:31 +1300 (NZDT) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:19:31 +1300 From: Joerg Micheel To: David Miller Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, joerg@cs.waikato.ac.nz Subject: Re: Need help with crash debug Message-ID: <20000228171931.B24598@cs.waikato.ac.nz> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii In-Reply-To: ; from David Miller on Sun, Feb 27, 2000 at 10:40:47PM -0500 Organization: SCMS, The University of Waikato, Hamilton, New Zealand Project: WAND - Waikato Applied Network Dynamics, DAG Operating-System: ... drained by Solaris 7 SPARC Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David, I haven't done too much debugging with FreeBSD either. A few small notes, however. I don't think the gdb version shipped is ready to handle SMP kernels. This is a deficiency, not sure someone is working on it, I believe not. Having said this, it is probably impossible to find the kernel stack pointer (as there are several of them anyways). Which in turn will make it impossible to detect where exactly the kernel crashed. Unless you have seen the machine crashing plus the report on the console, there is not much you can hope for with this crash dump. If this error is repeatable, you may have luck. Disable SMP in the kernel and reboot, let the machine running until it crashes again. Then, have another try. FWIW, I do have a book on kernel crash dump analysis, it is for Solaris, but I expect a great deal to be identical to general kernel debugging, I haven't touched it in years. My debugging is somewhat different these days. Hope this helps. Joerg -- Joerg B. Micheel Email: Waikato Applied Network Dynamics Phone: +64 7 8384794 The University of Waikato, CompScience Fax: +64 7 8384155 Private Bag 3105 Pager: +64 868 38222 Hamilton, New Zealand Plan: TINE and the DAG's To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 20:47: 3 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFD9437B7EF for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 20:44:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA46650; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 23:44:46 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 23:44:42 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey To: Michael Bacarella Cc: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sun, 27 Feb 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > I love the idea myself, but I have no power over FreeBSD :( You may not like the shape of the world, but I don't think getting publicly nasty about it is going to have any positive effect. It WILL have a negative effect, as FreeBSD would gather the reputation of very vindictive; it's even very likely that, somewhere along that road, a lawsuit over some wording would arise. You just can't get what you want all the time. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include C & Java programming, FreeBSD, chuckr@picnic.mat.net | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 21:16:47 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.webmonster.de (datasink.webmonster.de [194.162.162.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D453C37B5E0 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 21:16:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from karsten@rohrbach.de) Received: (qmail 79450 invoked by uid 1000); 28 Feb 2000 05:16:39 -0000 Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 06:16:39 +0100 From: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" To: Chuck Robey Cc: Michael Bacarella , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! Message-ID: <20000228061639.A79398@rohrbach.de> Reply-To: karsten@rohrbach.de References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: ; from chuckr@picnic.mat.net on Sun, Feb 27, 2000 at 11:44:42PM -0500 X-Arbitrary-Number-Of-The-Day: 42 X-Sender: karsten@rohrbach.de Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hm i mean, do the hardware people want their stuff supported or not? that's the main question some seem to choose the NOT. /k Chuck Robey(chuckr@picnic.mat.net)@Sun, Feb 27, 2000 at 11:44:42PM -0500: > On Sun, 27 Feb 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > > > > I love the idea myself, but I have no power over FreeBSD :( > > You may not like the shape of the world, but I don't think getting > publicly nasty about it is going to have any positive effect. It WILL > have a negative effect, as FreeBSD would gather the reputation of very > vindictive; it's even very likely that, somewhere along that road, a > lawsuit over some wording would arise. > > You just can't get what you want all the time. > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Chuck Robey | Interests include C & Java programming, FreeBSD, > chuckr@picnic.mat.net | electronics, communications, and signal processing. > > New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up > fictitious words in the dictionary. > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > Experiments must be reproducible; they should all fail in the same way. http://www.webmonster.de http://www.apache.de http://www.splatterworld.de (NIC-HDL KR433/KR11-RIPE) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 21:23: 6 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from thelab.hub.org (nat196.115.mpoweredpc.net [142.177.196.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D7FD37B82E for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 21:23:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) Received: from localhost (scrappy@localhost) by thelab.hub.org (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id BAA25860; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:22:17 -0400 (AST) (envelope-from scrappy@hub.org) X-Authentication-Warning: thelab.hub.org: scrappy owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:22:17 -0400 (AST) From: The Hermit Hacker To: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" Cc: Chuck Robey , Michael Bacarella , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! In-Reply-To: <20000228061639.A79398@rohrbach.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 28 Feb 2000, Karsten W. Rohrbach wrote: > hm > > i mean, do the hardware people want their stuff supported or not? that's > the main question > some seem to choose the NOT. right, and that is their perogative ... you can't create a "blacklist" and publicize it, it makes us look bad, not them. What you can do is create a "recommended hardware", or "well supported hardware" list ... Don't show the negative, only show the positive ... promote those vendors that are open to FreeBSD, don't put down those that don't ... > /k > > Chuck Robey(chuckr@picnic.mat.net)@Sun, Feb 27, 2000 at 11:44:42PM -0500: > > On Sun, 27 Feb 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > > > > > > > I love the idea myself, but I have no power over FreeBSD :( > > > > You may not like the shape of the world, but I don't think getting > > publicly nasty about it is going to have any positive effect. It WILL > > have a negative effect, as FreeBSD would gather the reputation of very > > vindictive; it's even very likely that, somewhere along that road, a > > lawsuit over some wording would arise. > > > > You just can't get what you want all the time. > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Chuck Robey | Interests include C & Java programming, FreeBSD, > > chuckr@picnic.mat.net | electronics, communications, and signal processing. > > > > New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up > > fictitious words in the dictionary. > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > -- > > Experiments must be reproducible; they should all fail in the same way. > http://www.webmonster.de http://www.apache.de http://www.splatterworld.de > (NIC-HDL KR433/KR11-RIPE) > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Marc G. Fournier ICQ#7615664 IRC Nick: Scrappy Systems Administrator @ hub.org primary: scrappy@hub.org secondary: scrappy@{freebsd|postgresql}.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 21:28: 5 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.webmonster.de (datasink.webmonster.de [194.162.162.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 7714537B846 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 21:28:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from karsten@rohrbach.de) Received: (qmail 79864 invoked by uid 1000); 28 Feb 2000 05:28:01 -0000 Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 06:28:01 +0100 From: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" To: The Hermit Hacker Cc: Chuck Robey , Michael Bacarella , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! Message-ID: <20000228062801.B79545@rohrbach.de> Reply-To: karsten@rohrbach.de References: <20000228061639.A79398@rohrbach.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: ; from scrappy@hub.org on Mon, Feb 28, 2000 at 01:22:17AM -0400 X-Arbitrary-Number-Of-The-Day: 42 X-Sender: karsten@rohrbach.de Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG okay, thats a good point let's concentrate on the good things in life ;-) i mean, with all that yamaha crap i had going on the last weeks i am really demotivated... they should be a little more open minded... apparently, we got no contact i this company and so they wont have their hardware supported - tough luck... (and i dont have any audio on my laptop) /k The Hermit Hacker(scrappy@hub.org)@Mon, Feb 28, 2000 at 01:22:17AM -0400: > On Mon, 28 Feb 2000, Karsten W. Rohrbach wrote: > > > hm > > > > i mean, do the hardware people want their stuff supported or not? that's > > the main question > > some seem to choose the NOT. > > right, and that is their perogative ... you can't create a "blacklist" and > publicize it, it makes us look bad, not them. What you can do is create a > "recommended hardware", or "well supported hardware" list ... > > Don't show the negative, only show the positive ... promote those vendors > that are open to FreeBSD, don't put down those that don't ... > > > > /k > > > Chuck Robey(chuckr@picnic.mat.net)@Sun, Feb 27, 2000 at 11:44:42PM -0500: > > > On Sun, 27 Feb 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I love the idea myself, but I have no power over FreeBSD :( > > > > > > You may not like the shape of the world, but I don't think getting > > > publicly nasty about it is going to have any positive effect. It WILL > > > have a negative effect, as FreeBSD would gather the reputation of very > > > vindictive; it's even very likely that, somewhere along that road, a > > > lawsuit over some wording would arise. > > > > > > You just can't get what you want all the time. > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Chuck Robey | Interests include C & Java programming, FreeBSD, > > > chuckr@picnic.mat.net | electronics, communications, and signal processing. > > > > > > New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up > > > fictitious words in the dictionary. > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > -- > > > Experiments must be reproducible; they should all fail in the same way. > > http://www.webmonster.de http://www.apache.de http://www.splatterworld.de > > (NIC-HDL KR433/KR11-RIPE) > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > > > Marc G. Fournier ICQ#7615664 IRC Nick: Scrappy > Systems Administrator @ hub.org > primary: scrappy@hub.org secondary: scrappy@{freebsd|postgresql}.org > -- > die rechtschreibreform macht spas! http://www.webmonster.de http://www.apache.de http://www.splatterworld.de (NIC-HDL KR433/KR11-RIPE) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 21:29:47 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from picnic.mat.net (picnic.mat.net [206.246.122.133]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B3AB37B859 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 21:29:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Received: from localhost (chuckr@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by picnic.mat.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA46750; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 00:29:00 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from chuckr@picnic.mat.net) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 00:29:00 -0500 (EST) From: Chuck Robey To: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" Cc: Michael Bacarella , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! In-Reply-To: <20000228061639.A79398@rohrbach.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 28 Feb 2000, Karsten W. Rohrbach wrote: > hm > > i mean, do the hardware people want their stuff supported or not? that's > the main question > some seem to choose the NOT. Hmmm. You're saying any one who disagrees with you chooses not to have their stuff supported; "if you don't agree with me, you must be stupid", right? Your approach probably will work, some percent of the time. I maintain that it won't show any real gain over trying to portray ourselves as professionals, and it will definitely hurt our credibility. Some vendors don't read anything sent to them, no matter what it is. Of those that are at least subject to *some* kind of influence, they will just kill-file whining and complaining. Well reasoned pleas (that clearly show that we're not Windows-folks, we don't want their code, just an interface) is *far* more likely to be read, and not make us look so vindictive. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Chuck Robey | Interests include C & Java programming, FreeBSD, chuckr@picnic.mat.net | electronics, communications, and signal processing. New Year's Resolution: I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up fictitious words in the dictionary. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 21:48:29 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dt051n0b.san.rr.com (dt051n0b.san.rr.com [204.210.32.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18E3137B860 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 21:48:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Doug@gorean.org) Received: from gorean.org (doug@master [10.0.0.2]) by dt051n0b.san.rr.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA25378; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 21:48:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Doug@gorean.org) Message-ID: <38BA0C22.C6CF9895@gorean.org> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 21:48:18 -0800 From: Doug Barton Organization: Triborough Bridge & Tunnel Authority X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: karsten@rohrbach.de Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! References: <20000228030949.A73905@rohrbach.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Karsten W. Rohrbach" wrote: > > ok guys, here's just a little idea on how to get the hardware > manufacturer guys a little bit more responsive Please direct this to -advocacy, thanks. Doug -- "Welcome to the desert of the real." - Laurence Fishburne as Morpheus, "The Matrix" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 21:50: 6 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from celery.dragondata.com (celery.dragondata.com [205.253.12.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D72437B61E for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 21:50:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from toasty@celery.dragondata.com) Received: (from toasty@localhost) by celery.dragondata.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id XAA73723; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 23:48:50 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from toasty) From: Kevin Day Message-Id: <200002280548.XAA73723@celery.dragondata.com> Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em To: chuckr@picnic.mat.net (Chuck Robey) Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 23:48:50 -0600 (CST) Cc: karsten@rohrbach.de (Karsten W. Rohrbach), mbac@nyct.net (Michael Bacarella), freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: from "Chuck Robey" at Feb 28, 2000 12:29:00 AM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > i mean, do the hardware people want their stuff supported or not? that's > > the main question > > some seem to choose the NOT. > > Hmmm. You're saying any one who disagrees with you chooses not to have > their stuff supported; "if you don't agree with me, you must be stupid", > right? > > Your approach probably will work, some percent of the time. I maintain > that it won't show any real gain over trying to portray ourselves as > professionals, and it will definitely hurt our credibility. Some vendors > don't read anything sent to them, no matter what it is. Of those that are > at least subject to *some* kind of influence, they will just kill-file > whining and complaining. Well reasoned pleas (that clearly show that > we're not Windows-folks, we don't want their code, just an interface) is > *far* more likely to be read, and not make us look so vindictive. Also, having written drivers with several highly paranoid companies for commercial projects, I can tell you. This isn't going to change their minds. First, many companies choose not to patent some of their neat tricks, since doing so lets everyone know how it works. So, they keep it all wrapped in secrecy. Giving out their databooks gives some serious clues into how their chips work. Secondly, some companies hide their mistakes. I know of one major video chip out there that has one major "OOPS" in it, that I'm certain they don't want to have to explain to everyone. (Yes, it's even worse than what you're thinking) Thirdly, FreeBSD is such a small market for most of these companies, that most aren't going to care. Especially the multimedia guys, since their lifespans are so short, and are doing quite well not helping out. A different large graphic chip company only has 4 techs doing driver-level and chip-level support, and that's only for people buying 100,000+ units/yr. I don't think we could convince them that the relatively small FreeBSD base(even if 100% of them used their product) is worth the effort. (I realize that anyone working on a driver isn't going to likely need support from them, but they still see it as a potential) Lastly, in trying to sway users to FreeBSD, I think the last thing we need is "A list of what we don't support". That'll only serve to scare away people who happen to own that product. If someone is thinking about trying to approach a company requesting databooks, and getting nowhere, let me know off the list, and I'll try to help. I've convinced a few companies so far, and know what they want to hear. Kevin To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 22:47:17 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from camus.cybercable.fr (camus.cybercable.fr [212.198.0.200]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id A479237B6E0 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 22:47:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from herbelot@cybercable.fr) Received: (qmail 14144246 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2000 06:47:08 -0000 Received: from d016.paris-30.cybercable.fr (HELO cybercable.fr) ([212.198.30.16]) (envelope-sender ) by camus.cybercable.fr (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 28 Feb 2000 06:47:08 -0000 Message-ID: <38BA18FC.4D9236C@cybercable.fr> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 07:43:08 +0100 From: "Thierry.herbelot" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.12 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tom brown Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: scanimage reports "open of device coolscan:/dev/pass4 failed: Invalid argument" References: <38B9BC38.65AA1B9E@cgf.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG tom brown wrote: > [Assuming you use a 3.x version] > The story so far: > > Recompiled the kernel with > > controller scbus0 # SCSI bus (required) > device da0 # Direct Access (disks) > device sa0 # Sequential Access (tape etc) > device cd0 # CD > > controller scbus1 > device cd1 > device pass0 > > Installed the scanner on the second SCSI channel > > Feb 27 15:27:09 foobar/kernel: pass4: > Removable Scanner SCSI-2 device > Feb 27 15:27:09 foobar/kernel: pass4: 3.300MB/s transfers > > build device node: > > bash#cd /dev > bash#./MAKEDEV pass4 > > Built sane, xsane, gimp from the ports. > > The config file for the coolscan /usr/local/etc/sane.d/coolscan.conf > > scsi Nikon * Scanner > /dev/pass4 > > Added the path: > > SANE_CONFIG_DIR=/usr/local/etc/sane.d > > And the /dev/pass4 device has the following permissions > > crw------- 1 root operator 31, 4 Feb 27 14:17 /dev/pass4 you may want to try the following : tfh% ll /dev/pas* crw------- 1 root operator 31, 0 Jan 16 17:50 /dev/pass0 crw-rw---- 1 root saned 31, 1 Jan 16 17:50 /dev/pass1 crw------- 1 root operator 31, 2 Jan 16 17:50 /dev/pass2 crw------- 1 root operator 31, 3 Jan 16 17:50 /dev/pass3 tfh% > > Execute scanimage: > > bash#scanimage -d coolscan:/dev/pass4 > scanimage: open of device coolscan:/dev/pass4 failed: Invalid > argument > > -- Thierry Herbelot /"\ ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGN \ / AGAINST HTML MAIL & NEWS mailto:herbelot@cybercable.fr X PAS DE HTML http://perso.cybercable.fr/herbelot / \ DANS LES COURRIELS To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sun Feb 27 23:26:42 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mta2.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta2.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.26]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A2E237B80F for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2000 23:26:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jbryant@ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net) Received: from ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net ([207.193.186.1]) by mta2.rcsntx.swbell.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8) with ESMTP id <0FQM009AMPZ51D@mta2.rcsntx.swbell.net> for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:26:24 -0600 (CST) Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) id BAA46720; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:25:47 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:25:42 -0600 (CST) From: Jim Bryant Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! In-reply-to: <20000228030949.A73905@rohrbach.de> To: karsten@rohrbach.de Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Reply-To: kc5vdj@swbell.net Message-id: <200002280725.BAA46720@ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Windows: R00LZ!@# MS-Winbl0wz DR00LZ!@# X-files: The truth is that the X-Files is fiction X-Republican: The best kind!!! X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT #8: Sat Oct 30 00:56:56 CDT 1999 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In reply: > ok guys, here's just a little idea on how to get the hardware > manufacturer guys a little bit more responsive (in fact, i got somehow > "inspired" by the alsa sound project guys because they got something > similar)... > > let's put up a list of hardware manufacturers that do not answer our > mails, that do not hear our pleas for driver development, that simply do > not react. then we might publish a link to this thing on the freebsd.org Why not? One or two people calling a week doesn't attract that much attention within these companies. Maybe a list of manufacturers dealing exclusively with Gates would. I have some to add if this ever comes to pass. If we can make this a joint FreeBSD/Linux list, we can get even more media attention to this issue, this would be a good truce issue with the linux folks. We all know by now how MickeySoft does it's vendor deals, it's been well publicised, and it doesn't take rocket science to guess that they are playing dirty. Making such a list could open things up back to the old days when anyone could obtain register-level programming info on any card they wanted to. jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ KC5VDJ - HF to 23cm KC5VDJ@NW0I.#NEKS.KS.USA.NOAM kc5vdj@swbell.net IC-706MkII - IC-T81A - HTX-202 - HTX-212 - HTX-404 - KPC3+ - PK-232MBX/DSP ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ET has one helluva sense of humor, always anal-probing right-wing schizos! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 0: 2:40 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mta3.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta3.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.27]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 692B537B84D for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 00:02:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jbryant@ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net) Received: from ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net ([207.193.186.1]) by mta3.rcsntx.swbell.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8) with ESMTP id <0FQM008B6RNVYT@mta3.rcsntx.swbell.net> for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 02:02:23 -0600 (CST) Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) id CAA46906; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 02:02:15 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 02:02:11 -0600 (CST) From: Jim Bryant Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! In-reply-to: To: chuckr@picnic.mat.net (Chuck Robey) Cc: mbac@nyct.net, karsten@rohrbach.de, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: kc5vdj@swbell.net Message-id: <200002280802.CAA46906@ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Windows: R00LZ!@# MS-Winbl0wz DR00LZ!@# X-files: The truth is that the X-Files is fiction X-Republican: The best kind!!! X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT #8: Sat Oct 30 00:56:56 CDT 1999 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In reply: > On Sun, 27 Feb 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > > > > I love the idea myself, but I have no power over FreeBSD :( > > You may not like the shape of the world, but I don't think getting > publicly nasty about it is going to have any positive effect. It WILL > have a negative effect, as FreeBSD would gather the reputation of very > vindictive; it's even very likely that, somewhere along that road, a > lawsuit over some wording would arise. I call it consumer education. Include call logs in such a list, let the public decide if a honest effort was made to contact such companies for information before being put on such a list. Such call logs can also speak for themselves, maybe add a column to the list for number of times people are told "We only support Windows". Nothing at all vindictive about it, in fact, an open invitation can be posted to be forthcoming with information needed to create drivers, we can point out the fact that there are millions of us, and it's just that much more profit for them. Where people see just cause for a boycott, they tend to support it, thus any action taken against any such list [with documentation on why they are on the list], will gain more people on our side. We can even add a second list of those who open up after being put on the list, proving that we aren't vindictive or nasty, and that all we seek is the info it takes to create drivers with the same functionality as the windows driver which they both wrote and supply. It isn't as if we are asking them to hire support staffs just for FreeBSD. Don't read in things that are not being said, Chuck. Nobody mentioned getting nasty or vindictive, all I saw was a good educational proposal, that would educate the general public about a problem. A lawsuit over such would only make whoever brings it look bad. > You just can't get what you want all the time. If you don't do what it takes to get something, you surely won't get a thing. The boycott is a time-tested technique of getting what it is one wants, especially from corporations. Unless you convince the owner of a corporation that his wallet COULD get lighter, or the shareholders the idea of lower returns, you won't get the time of day out of them. Which water fountain do you drink from? Oh wait, that doesn't matter anymore, some people got off their butts and changed things for the better back in the 50's and 60's, without getting nasty or vindictive, when in fact they had every right to come out shooting. jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ KC5VDJ - HF to 23cm KC5VDJ@NW0I.#NEKS.KS.USA.NOAM kc5vdj@swbell.net IC-706MkII - IC-T81A - HTX-202 - HTX-212 - HTX-404 - KPC3+ - PK-232MBX/DSP ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ET has one helluva sense of humor, always anal-probing right-wing schizos! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 0:13:38 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mgw-out.comptel.com (mgw-out.comptel.com [195.237.145.101]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1E9137B6A5; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 00:13:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from stefan.parvu@comptel.com) Received: from ctlfw1 ([195.237.145.97]) by mgw-out.comptel.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19); Mon, 28 Feb 2000 10:13:22 +0200 Received: from mgw-in.comptel.com ([192.102.20.150]) by ctlfw1.comptel.com; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 10:12:14 +0000 (EET) Received: from comptel.com ([195.237.135.174]) by mgw-in.comptel.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19); Mon, 28 Feb 2000 10:13:21 +0200 Message-ID: <38BA2E82.81B6074D@comptel.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 10:14:58 +0200 From: stefan parvu Reply-To: stefan.parvu@comptel.com Organization: Comptel PLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "freebsd-questions@freebsd.org" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: sotruss utility / Rational porting ? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hello all, I would like to ask you couple of questions: 1. Do we have a tool which is tracing the libraries as in Solaris, sotruss? 2. Do we have a starting point for a proposal to Rational for a porting of ClearCase and Purify tools on FreeBSD 3.x or 4.x? I think they are doing an official port to Linux for ClearCase. We must try, I think, to propose them this, as a native port. I'm writing from Helsinki, Finland and believe me people never heard about BSD OS (FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD) at all. Here everybody is using Linux, (coming from Helsinki) and I think that for FreeBSD we need more effort in this way. thanks, Stefan To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 0:25:58 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mta2.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta2.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.26]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 991DA37B805 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 00:25:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jbryant@ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net) Received: from ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net ([207.193.186.1]) by mta2.rcsntx.swbell.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8) with ESMTP id <0FQM00H3CSQMC5@mta2.rcsntx.swbell.net> for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 02:25:41 -0600 (CST) Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) id CAA47081; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 02:25:25 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 02:25:18 -0600 (CST) From: Jim Bryant Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! In-reply-to: To: scrappy@hub.org (The Hermit Hacker) Cc: karsten@rohrbach.de, chuckr@picnic.mat.net, mbac@nyct.net, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: kc5vdj@swbell.net Message-id: <200002280825.CAA47081@ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Windows: R00LZ!@# MS-Winbl0wz DR00LZ!@# X-files: The truth is that the X-Files is fiction X-Republican: The best kind!!! X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT #8: Sat Oct 30 00:56:56 CDT 1999 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In reply: > On Mon, 28 Feb 2000, Karsten W. Rohrbach wrote: > > > hm > > > > i mean, do the hardware people want their stuff supported or not? that's > > the main question > > some seem to choose the NOT. > > right, and that is their perogative ... you can't create a "blacklist" and > publicize it, it makes us look bad, not them. What you can do is create a > "recommended hardware", or "well supported hardware" list ... > > Don't show the negative, only show the positive ... promote those vendors > that are open to FreeBSD, don't put down those that don't ... Translation: Be a good *BOY*, stay in your place. Read my last post, nothing has to be done negatively in posting a boycott list, in fact, it would be a highly positive experience. I would think that such corporations would be more than willing to open up after a little publicity. IMHO, I think the feds need to take a look at their Microsoft contracts. It's one thing to refuse to hire a support staff for anything other than windows, but totally different to not release information to create independantly supported drivers. The latter in the quantity of companies doing it could quite possibly fit the Fed Civil guidelines for proving conspiracy on say, restraint of trade. It doesn't take rocket science to know Microsoft is playing dirty and looking for new ways to maintain control. "Hi, I'm looking for programming information on the super-duper XYZ card so I can write a device driver for FreeBSD." "I'm sorry, we only support Windows." "I'm not looking for support, I support my own code." "I'm sorry, we only support Windows." "Is this the correct department to ask?" "Yes. I'm sorry, we only support Windows." Yeah, we all know the story, like I said, it ain't rocket science. If Morley Safer got that on the phone, he'd have a camera crew out there the very next day to ask it again in person. We get this every day of the week. jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ KC5VDJ - HF to 23cm KC5VDJ@NW0I.#NEKS.KS.USA.NOAM kc5vdj@swbell.net IC-706MkII - IC-T81A - HTX-202 - HTX-212 - HTX-404 - KPC3+ - PK-232MBX/DSP ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ET has one helluva sense of humor, always anal-probing right-wing schizos! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 0:47:43 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE8BF37B7BC; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 00:47:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA22645; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:47:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id BAA71406; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:47:36 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <200002280847.BAA71406@harmony.village.org> To: Greg Lehey Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? Cc: Doug White , Marc Frajola , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, phk@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 28 Feb 2000 11:29:21 +1030." <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> References: <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> <200002262003.MAA13658@enginet.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:47:36 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> Greg Lehey writes: : fdisk -e is doubly dangerous. OpenBSD uses -e to mean "edit the : label". In FreeBSD, it's more like "eradicate the label". Personally, I'd like to see it changed from -e to -I. Since it is only in 4.0, this shouldn't cause too many problems. Comments? Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 1: 2:58 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [216.240.41.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 124A537B771 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:02:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id BAA71138; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:02:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:02:48 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <200002280902.BAA71138@apollo.backplane.com> To: Ryan Thompson Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Annoying nfsrcv hangs References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> did not. In general, NFS fixes for the -stable branch have been kept :> up to date with the work in -current, but -current ought to have much :> better NFS performance then stable. : :Performance = transfer rates and latency? Or just generalized stability? :I haven't had the time to watch -CURRENT all that closely, but I'll be :happy when some of the new functionality becomes -STABLE. : :Thanks for the reply, :- Ryan There were a few bugs that we couldn't fix in stable, mainly related to localhost NFS mounts and garbage showing up past EOF when mmap()ing a file over NFS. Normal use of NFS will not hit the bugs. -Current fixes those bugs plus adds some major performance optimizations. I'd stick with 3.x for the moment. Move to 4.x after 4.1 is released. -Matt Matthew Dillon :-- : Ryan Thompson : Systems Administrator, Accounts : Phone: +1 (306) 664-1161 : : SaskNow Technologies http://www.sasknow.com : #106-380 3120 8th St E Saskatoon, SK S7H 0W2 : : : :To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org :with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message : To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 1:16:47 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 352E537B551; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 01:16:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id TAA08660; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 19:46:13 +1030 (CST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 19:46:13 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: Warner Losh Cc: Doug White , Marc Frajola , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, phk@FreeBSD.ORG, cvs-committers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? Message-ID: <20000228194613.X4601@freebie.lemis.com> References: <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> <200002262003.MAA13658@enginet.com> <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> <200002280847.BAA71406@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre2i In-Reply-To: <200002280847.BAA71406@harmony.village.org> WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [copying -committers] On Monday, 28 February 2000 at 1:47:36 -0700, Warner Losh wrote: > In message <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> Greg Lehey writes: > : fdisk -e is doubly dangerous. OpenBSD uses -e to mean "edit the > : label". In FreeBSD, it's more like "eradicate the label". > > Personally, I'd like to see it changed from -e to -I. Since it is > only in 4.0, this shouldn't cause too many problems. > > Comments? Do other BSDs have something similar? We obviously have an incompatibility here, and it would be nice to come to an agreement on a standard syntax. It would also be nice to be able to warn people before performing such a destructive step, and allow recovery if you do it before stopping the program. Greg -- Finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key See complete headers for address and phone numbers To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 2: 7:49 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dt051n0b.san.rr.com (dt051n0b.san.rr.com [204.210.32.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A191A37B755 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 02:07:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Doug@gorean.org) Received: from gorean.org (doug@master [10.0.0.2]) by dt051n0b.san.rr.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA27532; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 02:06:59 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Doug@gorean.org) Message-ID: <38BA48C1.FAE77FF5@gorean.org> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 02:06:57 -0800 From: Doug Barton Organization: Triborough Bridge & Tunnel Authority X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT-0227 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jim Bryant Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! References: <200002280825.CAA47081@ppp-207-193-186-1.kscymo.swbell.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Jim Bryant wrote: > > Don't show the negative, only show the positive ... promote those vendors > > that are open to FreeBSD, don't put down those that don't ... > > Translation: > Be a good *BOY*, stay in your place. Well you're certainly acting like a boy, so if the shoe fits... > Read my last post, nothing has to be done negatively in posting a > boycott list, in fact, it would be a highly positive experience. I > would think that such corporations would be more than willing to open > up after a little publicity. What you're failing to understand here is that there is nothing about this approach that could be positive. You're arguing from your imagination with people who deal with real live hardware vendors as part of their day to day experience, and are in fact making progress with bringing freebsd into greater acceptance. Once again, this thread is inappropriate for -hackers. Please take it to -advocacy where it belongs. -- "Welcome to the desert of the real." - Laurence Fishburne as Morpheus, "The Matrix" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 3:30:41 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from sonet.crimea.ua (OTC-sl3-FLY.CRIS.NET [212.110.136.71]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F59937B808 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:30:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from phantom@scorpion.crimea.ua) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by sonet.crimea.ua (8.9.3/8.9.3) with UUCP id NAA00280; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:40:49 +0300 (MSK) Received: (from phantom@localhost) by scorpion.crimea.ua (8.8.8/8.8.5+ssl+keepalive) id NAA20421; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 13:08:32 +0300 (MSK) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 13:08:32 +0300 (MSK) From: Alexey Zelkin Message-Id: <200002291008.NAA20421@scorpion.crimea.ua> To: Joao Pedras , hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: custom release X-Newsgroups: cris.gate.freebsd.hackers In-Reply-To: User-Agent: tin/pre-1.4-980618 (UNIX) (FreeBSD/2.2.7-RELEASE (i386)) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hi, JP> How much disk space is it necessary to have the entire CVS repository ? Litle more than 800 mb. JP> The idea is to build a custom release. You need 1,5-2 Gig. -- /* Alexey Zelkin && phantom@cris.net */ /* Tavric National University && phantom@crimea.edu */ /* http://www.ccssu.crimea.ua/~phantom && phantom@FreeBSD.org */ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 3:52:43 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from furbie.euronet.nl (furbie.euronet.nl [194.134.32.150]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA54D37B6FE for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:52:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from beng@furbie.euronet.nl) Received: (from beng@localhost) by furbie.euronet.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA41965 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 11:52:22 GMT (envelope-from beng) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 12:52:22 +0100 From: Ben Gras To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Question: Problem with PCI network cards (e.g. ed0 and vx0) - no interrupts? Message-ID: <20000228125222.A41924@euronet.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Greetings -hackers, Here's a question I sent to -questions a long time ago. The matter is quite kludged over (by buying an ISA card), but I'm kinda curious regardless. Is this a known thing? =Ben ----- Forwarded message from Ben Gras ----- Subject: Problem with PCI network cards (e.g. ed0 and vx0) - no interrupts? To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 20:43:53 +0200 (CEST) From: Ben Gras Greetings -questions denizens, Any information available on the following problem would be welcome; the symptom is that various PCI network cards will be recognized but Don't Work. vx0 and ed0 will be seen (in booting) but produce "ed%d: device timeout" style errors; reading the code leads me to believe the drivers are expecting interrupts but aren't generated by the card. Searching the archives reveals this is usually caused (with the NE2000 clones at least) by irq conflicts, or the BNC cable not being attached; however, I've removed all other cards (except for the videocard) from the system and tried all possible IRQs (using the BIOS setup), which the system indeed finds on probing it (it uses and configures the irq set in the BIOS, whether it's 5, 9, 10, 11 or .. and makes no difference). The machine is an AMD 486 (80 or 100 MHz), the BIOS is an Award modular BIOS V4.50G, V4.26GN2 (12/07/94; don't ask me about the meanings of those two version numbers). The board calls itself a "486-VIP-IO" mainboard, and it's "Based on the VIA GMC chipset" (this is my bluffing mode) according to the manual. (ISA/VL+PCI). It mentions a VIA VT82C505 as a bus bridge, if that's useful. It claims PCI2.0 compliance. I have more details of this thing if useful. Other things I've tried include other (pci) slots, settings in BIOS (other than changing the irq). The system doesn't say anything about spurious interrupts, so I presume the card isn't generating the wrong ones, but none at all. vmstat -i reports nothing out of the ordinary, except for no interrupts from any network cards of course. Also if I set up nothing in the BIOS, the IRQ will show up as 0 or 255 -- hmm. The manual mentions, a jumper I can twiddle for IRQ 11 if a PCI card is inserted; under "IRQ pull up/pull down", where up is default, and down says, `pull down if pci card is inserted'. I twiddled it without knowing what I was doing; it had no effect though. I presumed this would be a bizarreness of the el-cheapo NE2000 clone I first used, but even the rather sophisticated 3C905B had no luck; same symptom: probe OK, then no interfacing. The videocard, incidentally, is a PCI card too and is OK, although as a clever friend mentioned, it probably doesn't need interrupts to do something useful. Other BIOS PCI features settings I twiddled are "Int using IRQ: " which are set to N/A. IRQ Mode can be Transparent, Transparent invert, Converse and Converse & monitor EOI. The manual reckons the choice depends on the IDE controller card. I can set the latency timer too, per irq, which I've had on 0, 32 and 255 with no difference. "CPU to PCI write buffer", "PCI Master Write Buffer" and "Pci Master Pre-fch [fetch I suppose] buffer" I've twiddled with no effect either. The on-board NCR BIOS is disabled, which has little effect I suppose. The CPU on 80 or 100MHz has no effect. As you probably can tell, I have little experience in dealing with this kind of low-level system problem.. I hope I haven't forgotten any things I've tried or information obtained, I've been plodding on with this thing for months now :/ So far I'm presuming I'm a victim of obsolete or bogus hardware, but I'd really appreciate information folks :) or even information on how to get more information? I'd include dmesg and-so-on output if it as easier, I'm not particularly networked at the moment you see :) cheers, =Ben ----- End forwarded message ----- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 6:32:41 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from balrog.rt.ru (balrog.rt.ru [195.161.0.169]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B833E37B7F6 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 06:32:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dima@rt.ru) Received: from rt.ru (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by balrog.rt.ru (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA47463 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:32:31 +0300 (MSK) (envelope-from dima@rt.ru) Message-ID: <38BA86FF.F4FD5093@rt.ru> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:32:31 +0300 From: "Dmitry S. Rzhavin" Organization: Rostelecom Internet X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 4.0-20000103-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: ru MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: 4.0 and compaq smart array Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi! I'm trying to install 4.0-curr on compaq (proliant 6500) with only 1 disk controller - Smart Array 3200. But I found that kernel from kern.flp does not have drivers for this controller. So, on another 4.0 machine I built kernel (took GENERIC, added device ida device id configured and compiled it), gzipped it and put on kern.flp instead of original kernel.gz. Then, I mounted mfsroot on /mnt, "cd" to /mnt/dev and said "./MAKEDEV ida0", and put new mfsroot on mfsroot.flp. Then I booted from those disks and installed FreeBSD. (It found disk ida0). After installation I put modified GENERIC kernel on /mnt and rebooted. Here is the log of boot: (some kernel checks skipped) ==================== FreeBSD 4.0-20000224-CURRENT #0: Fri Feb 25 19:20:37 MSK 2000 dima@smena2.rt.ru:/usr/src/sys/compile/GENERIC ... ida0: port 0x4000-0x40ff mem 0xc6ff0000-0xc6ff00ff irq 11 at device 0.0 on pci5 ida0: drives=1 firm_rev=4.16 id0: on ida0 id0: 69459MB (142253280 sectors), blocksize=512 ... ata0-slave: identify retries exceeded acd0: CDROM at ata0-master using PIO4 Waiting 15 seconds for SCSI devices to settle Mounting root from ufs:/dev/ida0s1a no such device 'ida' setrootbyname failed ffs_mountroot: can't find rootvp Root mount failed: 6 Mounting root from ufs:id0s1a swapon: adding /dev/ida0s1b as swap device Automatic reboot in progress... /dev/ida0s1a: FILESYSTEM CLEAN; SKIPPING CHECKS /dev/ida0s1a: clean, 39674 free (570 frags, 4888 blocks, 0.9% fragmentation) /dev/ida0s1e: FILESYSTEM CLEAN; SKIPPING CHECKS /dev/ida0s1e: clean, 2533812 free (23132 frags, 313835 blocks, 0.8% fragmentation) /dev/ida0s1f: FILESYSTEM CLEAN; SKIPPING CHECKS /dev/ida0s1f: clean, 9886 free (14 frags, 1234 blocks, 0.1% fragmentation) /dev/ida0s1g: FILESYSTEM CLEAN; SKIPPING CHECKS /dev/ida0s1g: clean, 20325785 free (281 frags, 2540688 blocks, 0.0% fragmentation) /dev/ida0s1h: FILESYSTEM CLEAN; SKIPPING CHECKS /dev/ida0s1h: clean, 44544505 free (9 frags, 5568062 blocks, 0.0% fragmentation) mount: /dev/ida0s1a on /: specified device does not match mounted device Mounting /etc/fstab filesystems failed, startup aborted Enter full pathname of shell or RETURN for /bin/sh: ================== What did I do wrong and how can I install (if can) FreeBSD on my machine? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 7: 5:40 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from search.sparks.net (search.sparks.net [208.5.188.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1ECE37B75F for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 07:05:36 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dmiller@search.sparks.net) Received: by search.sparks.net (Postfix, from userid 100) id 78893DBB4; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 10:05:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by search.sparks.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 644DADBB3; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 10:05:30 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 10:05:30 -0500 (EST) From: David Miller To: Joerg Micheel Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Need help with crash debug In-Reply-To: <20000228171931.B24598@cs.waikato.ac.nz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 28 Feb 2000, Joerg Micheel wrote: > David, > > I haven't done too much debugging with FreeBSD either. A few small > notes, however. > > I don't think the gdb version shipped is ready to handle SMP kernels. > This is a deficiency, not sure someone is working on it, I believe not. > Wow. So if smp core dumps can't be debugged post mortem, how do the developers develop smp kernels? > Having said this, it is probably impossible to find the kernel stack > pointer (as there are several of them anyways). Which in turn will make > it impossible to detect where exactly the kernel crashed. Unless you > have seen the machine crashing plus the report on the console, there > is not much you can hope for with this crash dump. > > If this error is repeatable, you may have luck. Disable SMP in the > kernel and reboot, let the machine running until it crashes again. > Then, have another try. I may resort to this. If it's an smp related bug, this will just make it "go away", which would be OK, except there are times when I need the extra horsepower. > FWIW, I do have a book on kernel crash dump analysis, it is for Solaris, > but I expect a great deal to be identical to general kernel debugging, > I haven't touched it in years. My debugging is somewhat different these > days. > > Hope this helps. Thanks for the input:) --- David To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 7:17:50 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from search.sparks.net (search.sparks.net [208.5.188.60]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2327537B85A for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 07:17:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dmiller@search.sparks.net) Received: by search.sparks.net (Postfix, from userid 100) id BDEEBDBB4; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 10:17:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by search.sparks.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE393DBB3 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 10:17:39 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 10:17:39 -0500 (EST) From: David Miller To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: group permissions question Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Probably a simple question for the hackers in these parts... I have a process which runs as root and is supposed to be started by /usr/local/etc/rc.d/script.sh. This process looks at a queue file, and a table and decides to setuid to some user. No great mysteries here.... If the process is started from the command line things work fine. If it's started from rc.d/script.sh, "id" reports participation in only the primary group listed in the passwd database, not any of the groups it's a member of in /etc/group. IE, user "dist" has a primry group of "dist", but is also listed under "www" in /etc/group. When started at boot, "id" only lists "dist" as member groups. Am I neglecting some system call, expecting something unreasonable, or just out in left field? Thanks:) --- David To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 8:50:35 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B5AF37B8C8; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 08:50:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA24256; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 09:50:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id JAA74180; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 09:50:21 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <200002281650.JAA74180@harmony.village.org> To: Greg Lehey Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? Cc: Doug White , Marc Frajola , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, phk@FreeBSD.org, cvs-committers@FreeBSD.org In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 28 Feb 2000 19:46:13 +1030." <20000228194613.X4601@freebie.lemis.com> References: <20000228194613.X4601@freebie.lemis.com> <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> <200002262003.MAA13658@enginet.com> <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> <200002280847.BAA71406@harmony.village.org> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 09:50:20 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <20000228194613.X4601@freebie.lemis.com> Greg Lehey writes: : Do other BSDs have something similar? We obviously have an : incompatibility here, and it would be nice to come to an agreement on : a standard syntax. It would also be nice to be able to warn people : before performing such a destructive step, and allow recovery if you : do it before stopping the program. OpenBSD's fdisk is the the nly one that I've played around with. It doesn't seem to have a command line option to create an empty disk. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 12:22:36 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from server1.huntsvilleal.com (www.huntsvilleal.com [207.13.224.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D682C37B857 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 12:22:29 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kris@hiwaay.net) Received: from barricuda.bsd.nws.net (kris.huntsvilleal.com [207.13.224.46]) by server1.huntsvilleal.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA18106; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:03:44 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by barricuda.bsd.nws.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA05165; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 14:20:58 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from kris@hiwaay.net) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 14:20:48 -0600 (CST) From: Kris Kirby To: Arun Sharma Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Finding percent idle In-Reply-To: <200002261917.LAA16205@c62443-a.frmt1.sfba.home.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > As another poster pointed out, all of the FreeBSD programs (top, vmstat, > xosview, ktop) get this stuff from kvm - which is a non portable (across > different versions of FreeBSD) interface. FreeBSD also doesn't keep > these numbers on a per CPU basis on a SMP box. > > I wrote a patch for fixing the SMP case and a KLD to get them via > sysctl. With slight modifications to the KLD, you can get those values > exported via sysctl. It would be interesting to see a SMP box with an attached LCD showing load per CPU. --- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR | TGIFreeBSD... 'Nuff said. | ------------------------------------------------------- "God gave them the ability to reproduce... ... Science gave us the hope they won't." -KBK To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 12:50:23 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from orion.ac.hmc.edu (Orion.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D479337B98C for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 12:50:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brdavis@orion.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by orion.ac.hmc.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA02786 for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 12:50:14 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 12:50:13 -0800 From: Brooks Davis To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: mprotect(2) won't make shared memory read-only Message-ID: <20000228125013.A25992@orion.ac.hmc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre4i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On a -current system as of a week or two ago (as well as a 3.3-RC and a 2.2.8-STABLE box) I've found that mprotect fails with with EACCES when trying to make a shared memory segment that was created user read/write read-only. It works find if I malloc the memory instead and making the shm segment write-only or inaccessible works fine as well. Is this expected behavior? If so it's pretty weird. The following program can be used to exercise the bug. Compiled normally it will attempt to use SysV shared memory and compiled with -DUSEMALLOC it will malloc the memory. The correct behavior is to bus error and dump core due to a trap on one of the memory accesses following the mprotect. ---- /* Test the mprotect(2) function */ #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #define SIZE 1024*sizeof(int) int main(int argc, char **argv) { int *array; #ifdef USEMALLOC array = malloc(SIZE); #else int shmid; shmid = shmget(IPC_PRIVATE, SIZE, SHM_R|SHM_W); array = shmat(shmid, NULL, 0); shmctl(shmid, IPC_RMID, NULL); #endif bzero(array, SIZE); if(mprotect(array, SIZE, PROT_READ) != 0) perror("mprotect(array) failed"); fprintf(stderr, "array[0] = %d\n", array[0]); array[0] = 1; return 0; } ---- Thanks, Brooks -- Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 12:53:29 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from thehousleys.net (frenchknot.ne.mediaone.net [24.218.96.75]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E63637B914 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 12:53:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jim@thehousleys.net) Received: from baby.int.thehousleys.net (baby.int.thehousleys.net [192.168.0.24]) by thehousleys.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA06150 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:52:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from thehousleys.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by baby.int.thehousleys.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA35434 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:52:50 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from jim@thehousleys.net) Message-ID: <38BAE022.5C1E2DC9@thehousleys.net> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:52:50 -0500 From: James Housley Organization: The Housleys dot Net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.4-STABLE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Subject: mod_auth_mysql-2.20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I am having trouble installing mod_auth_mysql-2.20 with the apache13-php3 port. I was able to install/configure/use it with the plan apache13 port. MySQL client and server are both install. PHP3 works fine. However it get a mod_auth_sql.c in found error from apache, and different errors. I have tried server different things, including trying to compile it as a DSO. Is there anyone that has done this, and remembers how, that would be willing to give me acouple of pointers? Jim -- The wise man built his network upon U*nx. The foolish man built his network upon Windows. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 13: 6: 5 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from fw.wintelcom.net (ns1.wintelcom.net [209.1.153.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0F9137B949 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:06:00 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bright@fw.wintelcom.net) Received: (from bright@localhost) by fw.wintelcom.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA10474; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:36:08 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:36:08 -0800 From: Alfred Perlstein To: Brooks Davis Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: mprotect(2) won't make shared memory read-only Message-ID: <20000228133608.T21720@fw.wintelcom.net> References: <20000228125013.A25992@orion.ac.hmc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <20000228125013.A25992@orion.ac.hmc.edu>; from brooks@one-eyed-alien.net on Mon, Feb 28, 2000 at 12:50:13PM -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG * Brooks Davis [000228 13:23] wrote: > On a -current system as of a week or two ago (as well as a 3.3-RC and a > 2.2.8-STABLE box) I've found that mprotect fails with with EACCES when > trying to make a shared memory segment that was created user read/write > read-only. It works find if I malloc the memory instead and making the > shm segment write-only or inaccessible works fine as well. Is this > expected behavior? If so it's pretty weird. If you can point out any standards documents that mandate this behavior (i'm not saying there isn't any, but I'm unaware of it) or a list of OSs that support it, it would motivate action. -Alfred To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 13: 8:22 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.rpi.edu (mail.rpi.edu [128.113.100.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE70937B957; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:08:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail.rpi.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA156286; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 16:07:41 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: drosih@mail.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200002280847.BAA71406@harmony.village.org> References: <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> <200002262003.MAA13658@enginet.com> <200002280847.BAA71406@harmony.village.org> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 16:07:55 -0500 To: Warner Losh , Greg Lehey From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: How about Changing fdisk/disklabel before 4.0-release Cc: Doug White , Marc Frajola , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, phk@FreeBSD.ORG Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 1:47 AM -0700 2/28/00, Warner Losh wrote: >In message <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> Greg Lehey writes: >: fdisk -e is doubly dangerous. OpenBSD uses -e to mean "edit the >: label". In FreeBSD, it's more like "eradicate the label". > >Personally, I'd like to see it changed from -e to -I. Since it is >only in 4.0, this shouldn't cause too many problems. > >Comments? If the '-e' parameter is only in 4.0, then I would definitely prefer to see it changed (one way or another) before 4.0 is released. Either change it to be '-I', or change it to be more of the "edit" function that openbsd has. My guess is that it'd be quicker to change it to -I for now, and add a -e later on. Is there any unix command where "-e" means "totally wipe out" something? (note that I dabble with both openbsd and freebsd systems, and it would be really painful if I typed '-e' on the wrong system!). --- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or drosih@rpi.edu Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 13: 9:39 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EA8437BA76; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:09:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA25206; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 14:09:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id OAA76221; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 14:09:22 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <200002282109.OAA76221@harmony.village.org> To: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: How about Changing fdisk/disklabel before 4.0-release Cc: Greg Lehey , Doug White , Marc Frajola , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, phk@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 28 Feb 2000 16:07:55 EST." References: <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> <200002262003.MAA13658@enginet.com> <200002280847.BAA71406@harmony.village.org> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 14:09:22 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message Garance A Drosihn writes: : If the '-e' parameter is only in 4.0, then I would definitely prefer : to see it changed (one way or another) before 4.0 is released. Either : change it to be '-I', or change it to be more of the "edit" function : that openbsd has. I have a partial port of the OpenBSD fdisk -e and disklabel -E to FreeBSD, but it needs to know more about FreeBSD things and there's been some bitrot since I started this, so I don't know if my partial port would even compile. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 13:27:32 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from orion.ac.hmc.edu (Orion.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6699B37B75F for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:27:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brdavis@orion.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by orion.ac.hmc.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA17801; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:27:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:27:17 -0800 From: Brooks Davis To: Alfred Perlstein Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: mprotect(2) won't make shared memory read-only Message-ID: <20000228132717.A13423@orion.ac.hmc.edu> References: <20000228125013.A25992@orion.ac.hmc.edu> <20000228133608.T21720@fw.wintelcom.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre4i In-Reply-To: <20000228133608.T21720@fw.wintelcom.net>; from bright@wintelcom.net on Mon, Feb 28, 2000 at 01:36:08PM -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Feb 28, 2000 at 01:36:08PM -0800, Alfred Perlstein wrote: > * Brooks Davis [000228 13:23] wrote: > > On a -current system as of a week or two ago (as well as a 3.3-RC and a > > 2.2.8-STABLE box) I've found that mprotect fails with with EACCES when > > trying to make a shared memory segment that was created user read/write > > read-only. It works find if I malloc the memory instead and making the > > shm segment write-only or inaccessible works fine as well. Is this > > expected behavior? If so it's pretty weird. > > If you can point out any standards documents that mandate this > behavior (i'm not saying there isn't any, but I'm unaware of it) > or a list of OSs that support it, it would motivate action. I've verified that it workes as expected on Solaris 2.6, Irix 6.4, and some sort of RedHat with at 2.2.5-22 kernel (what I had immediate access to). I can't quote a standards document though. The thing that really got me was that I can take away all access, but I can't take away just and exec write access. That's more then a little bizarre. Thanks, Brooks -- Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 13:48:38 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from houston.matchlogic.com (houston.matchlogic.com [205.216.147.127]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8568937B97B for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:47:56 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from crandall@matchlogic.com) Received: by houston.matchlogic.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 14:47:49 -0700 Message-ID: <5FE9B713CCCDD311A03400508B8B301303DA9F@bdr-xcln.is.matchlogic.com> From: Charles Randall To: Brooks Davis , Alfred Perlstein Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: mprotect(2) won't make shared memory read-only Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 14:47:47 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG The mprotect manual page on Digital Unix specifies that it conforms to the XPG4-UNIX standard. Charles To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 13:48:42 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mrout1.yahoo.com (mrout1.yahoo.com [208.48.125.95]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18C3F37B9B8 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:48:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mfk@yahoo-inc.com) Received: from rootbeer.corp.yahoo.com (rootbeer.corp.yahoo.com [208.48.107.169]) by mrout1.yahoo.com (8.10.0.Beta10/8.10.0.Beta6/y.out) with ESMTP id e1SLmVc53962 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:48:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (mfk@localhost) by rootbeer.corp.yahoo.com (8.9.3/8.6.12) with ESMTP id NAA49745 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:48:14 -0800 (PST) X-Authentication-Warning: rootbeer.corp.yahoo.com: mfk owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 13:48:14 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Kyle X-Sender: mfk@rootbeer.corp.yahoo.com To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Shell Code... (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Doug suggested that I send a message similar to this to the group, instead of my original. So, here is what I'd re'd to Doug. Information or other approaches is appreciated. Mike. Yahoo! ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 21:39:26 -0800 (PST) From: Michael Kyle To: Doug White Subject: Re: Shell Code... Doug, You've been a freeBSD advocate for a quite a while, I'm new to the OS and new to Yahoo. I'm sure you know that Yahoo is a freeBSD org. I really do need help whacking some of our development stuff. One of the things I am trying to do is demonstrate that I can obtain shells on some of our interally used code, in specific instances. While I have never had a problem deriving my own shell code on solaris, irix or linux, for some reason, everything I do on freebsd fails. Do you happen to know where the execve (syscall index 59) snaggs its params? Clearly a gdb dump of the assembler of a simple prog that does nothing more than call execve passing /bin/sh shows the following (gdb) disas main Dump of assembler code for function main: 0x804814c
: pushl %ebp 0x804814d : movl %esp,%ebp # prolog stuff here 0x804814f : subl $0x8,%esp # variables 0x8048152 : movl $0x804833d,0xfffffff8(%ebp) # /bin/sh 0x8048159 : movl $0x0,0xfffffffc(%ebp) 0x8048160 : pushl $0x0 # param 2 to execve 0x8048162 : leal 0xfffffff8(%ebp),%eax 0x8048165 : pushl %eax # param 1 0x8048166 : movl 0xfffffff8(%ebp),%eax 0x8048169 : pushl %eax # param 0 0x804816a : call 0x80481e8 # the call 0x804816f : addl $0xc,%esp 0x8048172 : leave 0x8048173 : ret and (gdb) disas execve Dump of assembler code for function execve: 0x80481e8 : leal 0x3b,%eax # syscall index 0x80481ee : int $0x80 # kernel call-- must know # where to find params 0x80481f0 : jb 0x80481e0 # a jump 0x80481f2 : ret 0x80481f3 : nop End of assembler dump. and for the jb, (gdb) disas 0x80481e0 .... 0x80481e0 : jmp 0x8048307 <.cerror> 0x80481e5 : leal 0x0(%esi),%esi Clearly, a kernel call is performed (index 0x3b) with the passed info on the stack and as an offset to the frame pointer in main. I've tried referencing the values on the stack and seem to screw it up. Any suggestions? What you sent me..... do I need to expand? Mike. On Thu, 24 Feb 2000, Doug White wrote: > On Thu, 24 Feb 2000, Michael Kyle wrote: > > > > > Hi does anyone have shellcode for freebsd. If not, > > I'll disassemble execve, but I'd rather just pick > > it up from the group. > > Yeah, the shellcode is > > 0xb238fb23b238gub2348b223bdfz23a89230934897a324987287bd8970d8997893981deadbeef21398778787aaa9797bb8979878d87f87 > > Doug White | FreeBSD: The Power to Serve > dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | www.FreeBSD.org > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 15:12:42 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from enginet.com (enginet.com [199.2.210.247]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0649137B75F for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:12:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from marc@enginet.com) Received: from enginet.com (marc@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by enginet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA15070; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:12:34 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200002282312.PAA15070@enginet.com> To: Doug White Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sun, 27 Feb 2000 00:59:30 PST." Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:12:33 PST From: Marc Frajola Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > On Sat, 26 Feb 2000, Marc Frajola wrote: > > > Hi... > > > > I have spent a bit of time messing around with the command-line > > fdisk and disklabel commands, and have been unable to setup a proper > > fdisk and FreeBSD partition label solely from the command line. > > Somebody didn't check the usual places! :) > > http://www.freebsd.org/tutorials/formatting-media/ > > Also if you are on a recent (3.4?) -STABLE or -CURRENT you have the > dangerous yet handy fdisk -e option. > > You will certainly want to steal my code from the 'install' PicoBSD > floppy, which fdisk, disklabels, and newfs's the target disk > automatically. > > Doug White | FreeBSD: The Power to Serve > dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | www.FreeBSD.org Doug, Thanks very much for the reply. I checked out the URL you gave (http://www.freebsd.org/tutorials/formatting-media/), and unfortunately I'm still wondering how to create one FreeBSD fdisk slice so that disklabel can actually create partitions. The reason why I sent the message to freebsd-hackers was because when I tried 'fdisk -e', it seems to assign a slice, BUT disklabel gives an error like 'No space left on device' or some such thing after running fdisk, making it obvious that the fdisk -e didn't work as I thought it should. I'm guessing I need to include a different combination of fdisk options or there's a bug. I will check out the 'install' PicoBSD floppy here shortly to see if I can learn anything from that. If anybody knows right off what the sequence of commands (complete with arguments) to fdisk and disklabel a new drive to make a "compatiblity mode" bootable FreeBSD system slice (and make it active), I'd appreciate hearing from you. ...Marc... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 15:17:13 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.rpi.edu (mail.rpi.edu [128.113.100.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3C7F37B907; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:17:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from drosih@rpi.edu) Received: from [128.113.24.47] (gilead.acs.rpi.edu [128.113.24.47]) by mail.rpi.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA412560; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:13:01 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: drosih@mail.rpi.edu Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200002282109.OAA76221@harmony.village.org> References: <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> <200002262003.MAA13658@enginet.com> <200002280847.BAA71406@harmony.village.org> <200002282109.OAA76221@harmony.village.org> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:13:12 -0500 To: Warner Losh From: Garance A Drosihn Subject: Re: How about Changing fdisk/disklabel before 4.0-release Cc: Greg Lehey , Doug White , Marc Frajola , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, phk@FreeBSD.ORG Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 2:09 PM -0700 2/28/00, Warner Losh wrote: >Garance A Drosihn writes: >: If the '-e' parameter is only in 4.0, then I would definitely prefer >: to see it changed (one way or another) before 4.0 is released. Either >: change it to be '-I', or change it to be more of the "edit" function >: that openbsd has. > >I have a partial port of the OpenBSD fdisk -e and disklabel -E to >FreeBSD, but it needs to know more about FreeBSD things and there's >been some bitrot since I started this, so I don't know if my partial >port would even compile. Sounds like the best approach for 4.0 would be to change the current option to -I (or some other out-of-the-way (uppercase) letter), and shoot for including -e in the next release. (March 10th is still the target for 4.0-release, right? I assume that is probably too little time to try to get '-e' finished) --- Garance Alistair Drosehn = gad@eclipse.acs.rpi.edu Senior Systems Programmer or drosih@rpi.edu Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 15:22:23 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bingnet2.cc.binghamton.edu (bingnet2.cc.binghamton.edu [128.226.1.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0212937B9A7 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:22:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from sol.cs.binghamton.edu (sol.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.123.100]) by bingnet2.cc.binghamton.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id SAA24275 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:22:15 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:58:00 -0500 (EST) From: Zhihui Zhang To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Building customized kernel without root passwd Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG My professor plans to use FreeBSD for teaching purpose. We will allow students to build their kernel but do not want to give them root password. So it's better to find a way to let students build kernel under their own account, save the kernel on a floppy and then boot from the floppy. I am familiar with normal kernel build process. But have not done the above before. I hope someone can give me some suggestions and I will try them out. Thanks a lot. -Zhihui To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 15:28:19 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gizmo.internode.com.au (gizmo.internode.com.au [192.83.231.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A8C237B9AD for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 15:28:15 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from newton@gizmo.internode.com.au) Received: (from newton@localhost) by gizmo.internode.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA76883; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 09:59:03 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from newton) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 09:59:02 +1030 From: Mark Newton To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Building customized kernel without root passwd Message-ID: <20000229095902.A73142@internode.com.au> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre3i In-Reply-To: X-PGP-Key: http://www.on.net/~newton/pgpkey.txt Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Feb 28, 2000 at 03:58:00PM -0500, Zhihui Zhang wrote: > My professor plans to use FreeBSD for teaching purpose. We will allow > students to build their kernel but do not want to give them root password. > So it's better to find a way to let students build kernel under their own > account, save the kernel on a floppy and then boot from the floppy. How is this going to buy you anything? Once they've done that, they'll have root on the floppy-booted system, and they'll be able to mount the system's hard disk and change the root password to anything they want. If your students have physical access to the console of a system, the system is not secure. Doubly so if they have access to removable media (like floppy disks). You'd be better off firewalling the lab on the assumption that they *will* have root, in an effort to constrain the damage they can do if they misbehave, then just give them the root password so they won't have to dick around with floppies anymore. - mark -- Mark Newton Email: newton@internode.com.au (W) Network Engineer Email: newton@atdot.dotat.org (H) Internode Systems Pty Ltd Desk: +61-8-82232999 "Network Man" - Anagram of "Mark Newton" Mobile: +61-416-202-223 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 16:55:38 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp2.vnet.net (smtp2.vnet.net [166.82.1.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A87437B9DA for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 16:55:21 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rivers@dignus.com) Received: from dignus.com (ponds.vnet.net [166.82.177.48]) by smtp2.vnet.net (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id TAA23296; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 19:55:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from lakes.dignus.com (lakes.dignus.com [10.0.0.3]) by dignus.com (8.9.2/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA02583; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 19:55:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (from rivers@localhost) by lakes.dignus.com (8.9.3/8.6.9) id TAA16595; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 19:55:12 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 19:55:12 -0500 (EST) From: Thomas David Rivers Message-Id: <200002290055.TAA16595@lakes.dignus.com> To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu Subject: Re: Building customized kernel without root passwd In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > My professor plans to use FreeBSD for teaching purpose. We will allow > students to build their kernel but do not want to give them root password. > So it's better to find a way to let students build kernel under their own > account, save the kernel on a floppy and then boot from the floppy. > > I am familiar with normal kernel build process. But have not done the > above before. I hope someone can give me some suggestions and I will try > them out. > > Thanks a lot. > > -Zhihui Of course, once you've booted the floppy - you realize you can mount the hard disk and change the root password... Doesn't seem like too sound of an idea... - Dave Rivers - To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 17: 4:53 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from orion.ac.hmc.edu (Orion.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9136637B9DA for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:04:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brdavis@orion.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by orion.ac.hmc.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA20023; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:04:43 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:04:43 -0800 From: Brooks Davis To: Brooks Davis Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: mprotect(2) won't make shared memory read-only Message-ID: <20000228170443.A16556@orion.ac.hmc.edu> References: <20000228125013.A25992@orion.ac.hmc.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre4i In-Reply-To: <20000228125013.A25992@orion.ac.hmc.edu>; from brooks@one-eyed-alien.net on Mon, Feb 28, 2000 at 12:50:13PM -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, Feb 28, 2000 at 12:50:13PM -0800, Brooks Davis wrote: > On a -current system as of a week or two ago (as well as a 3.3-RC and a > 2.2.8-STABLE box) I've found that mprotect fails with with EACCES when > trying to make a shared memory segment that was created user read/write > read-only. It works find if I malloc the memory instead and making the > shm segment write-only or inaccessible works fine as well. Is this > expected behavior? If so it's pretty weird. Following up on this. Charles Randall suggested I try shmctl to make the segment read-only. Unfortunatly it appears that shared memory premissions are screwed up as well. You can create a read-only shared memory segment either via shmget or via shmctl on an existing read-write segment and it will appear via ipcs, but it doesn't appear to have any effect. The following program creates a read-only segment and then proceds to write to it twice, both of which work under FreeBSD -current. When run on a Solaris 2.6 machine it segfaults in the first write. ---- /* Test read-only shared memory segments */ #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #define SIZE 1024*sizeof(int) int main(int argc, char **argv) { int *array; int shmid; shmid = shmget(IPC_PRIVATE, SIZE, SHM_R); array = shmat(shmid, NULL, 0); bzero(array, SIZE); fprintf(stderr, "array[0] = %d\n", array[0]); array[0] = 1; fprintf(stderr, "array[0] = %d\n", array[0]); shmctl(shmid, IPC_RMID, NULL); return 0; } ---- Thanks, Brooks -- Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 17:43:27 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ind.alcatel.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7672737B53C for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:43:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com (mailhub [198.206.181.70]) by ind.alcatel.com (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1 (ind.alcatel.com 3.0 [OUT])) with SMTP id RAA09172; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:41:57 -0800 (PST) X-Origination-Site: Received: from utah.XYLAN.COM by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id RAA11029; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:41:56 -0800 Received: from softweyr.com by utah.XYLAN.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (xylan utah [SPOOL])) id SAA24392; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:41:45 -0700 Message-ID: <38BB25A4.10ADE25D@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:49:24 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.3-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: karsten@rohrbach.de Cc: Chuck Robey , Michael Bacarella , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: idea: official hardware manufacturer blacklist - let's wake em up! References: <20000228061639.A79398@rohrbach.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Karsten W. Rohrbach" wrote: > > hm > > i mean, do the hardware people want their stuff supported or not? that's > the main question > some seem to choose the NOT. And that is their choice. YOU can certainly create and maintain a list of hardware vendors who have been uncooperative in helping with FreeBSD, if you wish to do that. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC wes@softweyr.com http://softweyr.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 17:49: 5 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ind.alcatel.com (postal.xylan.com [208.8.0.248]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D37137B564; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:49:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from mailhub.xylan.com (mailhub [198.206.181.70]) by ind.alcatel.com (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1 (ind.alcatel.com 3.0 [OUT])) with SMTP id RAA09232; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:47:15 -0800 (PST) X-Origination-Site: Received: from utah.XYLAN.COM by mailhub.xylan.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (mailhub 2.1 [HUB])) id RAA11202; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:47:14 -0800 Received: from softweyr.com by utah.XYLAN.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4 (xylan utah [SPOOL])) id SAA24414; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:47:05 -0700 Message-ID: <38BB26E4.1717F485@softweyr.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:54:44 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.3-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Warner Losh Cc: Greg Lehey , Doug White , Marc Frajola , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, phk@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? References: <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> <200002262003.MAA13658@enginet.com> <200002280847.BAA71406@harmony.village.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Warner Losh wrote: > > In message <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> Greg Lehey writes: > : fdisk -e is doubly dangerous. OpenBSD uses -e to mean "edit the > : label". In FreeBSD, it's more like "eradicate the label". > > Personally, I'd like to see it changed from -e to -I. Since it is > only in 4.0, this shouldn't cause too many problems. > > Comments? Take a hint from vinum(8) and make it 'fdisk --no-future'? Capital letters are certainly further from the norm, and it would no longer clash with the OpenBSD usage. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC wes@softweyr.com http://softweyr.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 17:59:54 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from aaz.links.ru (aaz.links.ru [193.125.152.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4583037B9AF for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 17:59:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from babolo@links.ru) Received: (from babolo@localhost) by aaz.links.ru (8.9.3/8.9.3) id FAA11909 for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 05:05:38 +0300 (MSK) Message-Id: <200002290205.FAA11909@aaz.links.ru> Subject: expand label? To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 05:05:38 +0300 (MSK) From: "Aleksandr A.Babaylov" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I saw discussion in this list about change MAXPARTITIONS to 16 or 22 instead of 8. And I remember decision to expand. But in FreeBSD 4.0-20000208-CURRENT MAXPARTITIONS=8 and no easy way to expand by only translate with different MAXPARTITIONS. Yes, I edit /dev/MAKEDEV sys/disklabel.h sys/disklabel.h but can't newfs new partitions. Why label not expanded now in 4.0 ? -- @BABOLO http://links.ru/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 18:37:41 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD6FB37B9B1; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:37:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA26233; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 19:37:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id TAA78440; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 19:37:14 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <200002290237.TAA78440@harmony.village.org> To: Wes Peters Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? Cc: Greg Lehey , Doug White , Marc Frajola , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, phk@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:54:44 MST." <38BB26E4.1717F485@softweyr.com> References: <38BB26E4.1717F485@softweyr.com> <20000228112921.G4601@freebie.lemis.com> <200002262003.MAA13658@enginet.com> <200002280847.BAA71406@harmony.village.org> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 19:37:14 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <38BB26E4.1717F485@softweyr.com> Wes Peters writes: : Take a hint from vinum(8) and make it 'fdisk --no-future'? :-) : Capital letters are certainly further from the norm, and it would no longer : clash with the OpenBSD usage. Well, if there's good code that one could contribute back to the OpenBSD tree, I'm sure they would accept it. Maybe they'd also implement -I as well. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 18:40:16 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaze.net.au (gw-blaze.wire.net.au [203.36.3.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D99737BA0B for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:39:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from davidn@freebsd.org) Received: from mobile (op11.wire.net.au [203.36.3.211]) by blaze.net.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id NAA12754 for ; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 13:39:40 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from davidn@freebsd.org) Reply-To: "David Nugent" From: "David Nugent" To: Subject: Unattended ? install Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 13:43:47 +1100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I know that a fair amount of work has been done in building automated installs for FreeBSD. Is this work currently available only in -current, or does it include 3.X as well (I suspect it does as I first saw it mentioned long ago). More importantly, where can I find documentation to use this? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 18:55:33 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (genesi.lnk.telstra.net [139.130.136.161]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F262C37B9AF for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:55:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Received: from cain.gsoft.com.au (doconnor@cain [203.38.152.97]) by cain.gsoft.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA22472; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 13:24:53 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from doconnor@gsoft.com.au) Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.4.0 on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 13:24:52 +1030 (CST) From: "Daniel O'Connor" To: David Nugent Subject: RE: Unattended ? install Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 29-Feb-00 David Nugent wrote: > I know that a fair amount of work has been done in building automated > installs for FreeBSD. Is this work currently available only in -current, > or does it include 3.X as well (I suspect it does as I first saw it > mentioned long ago). > > More importantly, where can I find documentation to use this? Well, I install 2.2 systems using a CD and a sysinstall script on a floppy.. Sysinstall is fairly simple to automate. Its not really 'unattended' tho. (You have to tell it to load the config file etc, and configure X by hand). It adds distributions and packages automatically though. --- Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au "The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from." -- Andrew Tanenbaum To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 18:59:57 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-out.visi.com (kauket.visi.com [209.98.98.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B88A37BA02 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 18:59:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sdk@visi.com) Received: from isis.visi.com (isis.visi.com [209.98.98.8]) by mail-out.visi.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3B033A03 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 20:59:36 -0600 (CST) Received: (from sdk@localhost) by isis.visi.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA01469 for hackers@freebsd.org; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 20:59:36 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 20:59:36 -0600 From: Stephen To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Unattended ? install Message-ID: <20000228205936.A1271@visi.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Mutt/0.96.1i In-Reply-To: ; from David Nugent on Tue, Feb 29, 2000 at 01:43:47PM +1100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Feb 29, 2000 at 01:43:47PM +1100, David Nugent wrote: > I know that a fair amount of work has been done in building automated > installs for FreeBSD. Is this work currently available only in -current, > or does it include 3.X as well (I suspect it does as I first saw it > mentioned long ago). > > More importantly, where can I find documentation to use this? > I wouldn't mind assisting with this effort. I would love to see an automated install process similar to Solaris Jumpstart. sk -- sdk@yuck.net To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 21:27: 6 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.numachi.com (numachi.numachi.com [198.175.254.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 6FCFA37BA4A for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 21:26:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from reichert@numachi.com) Received: (qmail 27396 invoked by uid 1001); 29 Feb 2000 02:07:44 -0000 Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 21:07:43 -0500 From: Brian Reichert To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Stallion EasyConnection 8/64-PCI drivers Message-ID: <20000228210743.A27377@numachi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre4i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Howdy. I've been pawing through the archive, but can't seem to resolve a set of symtoms WRT getting the Stallion EasyConnection 8/64-PCI card (with XP module) to probe under FBSD 3.4-R. I have tried putting this line in my kernel config file: device stl0 I have tried both the Stallion drivers that come with a stock 3.4-R installation, as well as the recent drivers from Stallion: Booting either kernel does not probe the card. This is with the XP module connected, if that's an issue. pciconf(8) reveals: # pciconf -l chip0@pci0:0:0: class=0x060000 card=0x00000000 chip=0x71908086 rev=0x03 hdr=0x00 chip1@pci0:1:0: class=0x060400 card=0x00000000 chip=0x71918086 rev=0x03 hdr=0x01 chip2@pci0:7:0: class=0x060100 card=0x00000000 chip=0x71108086 rev=0x02 hdr=0x00 ide_pci0@pci0:7:1: class=0x010180 card=0x00000000 chip=0x71118086 rev=0x01 hdr=0x00 none0@pci0:7:2: class=0x0c0300 card=0x00000000 chip=0x71128086 rev=0x01 hdr=0x00 chip3@pci0:7:3: class=0x068000 card=0x00000000 chip=0x71138086 rev=0x02 hdr=0x00 none1@pci0:14:0: class=0x078000 card=0x0002124d chip=0x0002124d rev=0x01 hdr=0x00 xl0@pci0:15:0: class=0x020000 card=0x905510b7 chip=0x905510b7 rev=0x30 hdr=0x00 vga0@pci1:0:0: class=0x030000 card=0x58021092 chip=0x002010de rev=0x04 hdr=0x00 I certainly don't see 'stl' in there, but I do see two 'none' entries. The manpage for pciinfo(8) says: If there is no device configured in the kernel for the PCI device in question, the device name will be ``none''. - Do either of these 'none' entries indicate to a misonfigured kernel? - Is the card itself possibly defunct? Silly question, I admit. I suppose I should see if M$ can see it. :/ I'm not used to PCI cards 'not working'; at least, with ISA cards, you could poke and juggle parameters of the card to see in what way the probe was failing... -- Brian 'you Bastard' Reichert reichert@numachi.com 37 Crystal Ave. #303 Daytime number: (781) 899-7484 x704 Derry NH 03038-1713 USA Intel architecture: the left-hand path To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Mon Feb 28 23:17:37 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from elvis.mu.org (elvis.mu.org [207.154.226.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D08037BA73 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2000 23:17:32 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dave@elvis.mu.org) Received: (from dave@localhost) by elvis.mu.org (8.9.1/8.9.1) id BAA81755; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 01:17:29 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from dave) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 01:17:29 -0600 From: Dave McKay To: Stephen Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Unattended ? install Message-ID: <20000229011729.A81617@elvis.mu.org> References: <20000228205936.A1271@visi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=2oS5YaxWCcQjTEyO; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.7i In-Reply-To: <20000228205936.A1271@visi.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --2oS5YaxWCcQjTEyO Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Stephen (sdk@yuck.net) wrote: > On Tue, Feb 29, 2000 at 01:43:47PM +1100, David Nugent wrote: > > I know that a fair amount of work has been done in building automated > > installs for FreeBSD. Is this work currently available only in -current, > > or does it include 3.X as well (I suspect it does as I first saw it > > mentioned long ago). > >=20 > > More importantly, where can I find documentation to use this? > >=20 >=20 > I wouldn't mind assisting with this effort. I would love to see an > automated install process similar to Solaris Jumpstart. I have heard rumors from a good source that a PXE boot for FreeBSD is in the making. This can be made to mirror the=20 solaris jumpstart, or even better improve upon it. I believe it will be committed in the near future. --=20 Dave McKay Network Engineer - Google Inc. dave@mu.org - dave@google.com I'm feeling lucky... --2oS5YaxWCcQjTEyO Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3ia iQCVAwUBOLtyiXY8vP7IQ1TlAQEzPgP/SKlhmWZX6ak9mApHSsQRTyrCyN8hMRK0 7eFXUTZIOPac7voRKpb2jP0NPAWYHtTUKS1Gl6eBihfoZjd2CvttQjK0BPbsN950 Esj7kQieBz9a1L6XHYFkyGmQ/1NA8N9gshssTeWOnpPdC6NNMFMWqxyLKIAxlSUq 3VxyRpV+7hA= =5YQ+ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --2oS5YaxWCcQjTEyO-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 0:46:35 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kremvax.demos.su (kremvax.demos.su [194.87.0.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 429F737BA82 for ; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 00:46:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from vdv@kremvax.demos.su) Received: by kremvax.demos.su (8.6.13/D) from ultra1.demos.su [194.87.2.30] with ESMTP id LAA25472; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 11:46:25 +0300 Received: (from vdv@localhost) by ultra1.demos.su (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) id LAA12720; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 11:46:25 +0300 (MSK) Message-Id: <200002290846.LAA12720@ultra1.demos.su> Subject: Re: 4.0 and compaq smart array In-Reply-To: <38BA86FF.F4FD5093@rt.ru> from "Dmitry S. Rzhavin" at "Feb 28, 2000 05:32:31 pm" To: dima@rt.ru (Dmitry S. Rzhavin) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 11:46:25 +0300 (MSK) Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: "Dmitry Volkov" Reply-To: vdv@demos.su X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG You should use wd0* instead of ida0* or id0* in /etc/fstab. Also you should said ./MAKEDEV ida0 id0 wd0 in /dev ___ vdv > Hi! > I'm trying to install 4.0-curr on compaq (proliant 6500) with > only 1 disk controller - Smart Array 3200. But I found that > kernel from kern.flp does not have drivers for this controller. > So, on another 4.0 machine I built kernel (took GENERIC, added > device ida > device id > configured and compiled it), gzipped it and put on kern.flp > instead of original kernel.gz. Then, I mounted mfsroot on /mnt, > "cd" to /mnt/dev and said "./MAKEDEV ida0", and put new mfsroot > on mfsroot.flp. Then I booted from those disks and installed > FreeBSD. (It found disk ida0). After installation I put modified > GENERIC kernel on /mnt and rebooted. Here is the log of boot: > (some kernel checks skipped) > > ==================== > FreeBSD 4.0-20000224-CURRENT #0: Fri Feb 25 19:20:37 MSK 2000 > dima@smena2.rt.ru:/usr/src/sys/compile/GENERIC > ... > ida0: port 0x4000-0x40ff mem 0xc6ff0000-0xc6ff00ff irq 11 at device 0.0 on pci5 > ida0: drives=1 firm_rev=4.16 > id0: on ida0 > id0: 69459MB (142253280 sectors), blocksize=512 > ... > ata0-slave: identify retries exceeded > acd0: CDROM at ata0-master using PIO4 > Waiting 15 seconds for SCSI devices to settle > Mounting root from ufs:/dev/ida0s1a > no such device 'ida' > setrootbyname failed > ffs_mountroot: can't find rootvp > Root mount failed: 6 > Mounting root from ufs:id0s1a > swapon: adding /dev/ida0s1b as swap device > Automatic reboot in progress... > /dev/ida0s1a: FILESYSTEM CLEAN; SKIPPING CHECKS > /dev/ida0s1a: clean, 39674 free (570 frags, 4888 blocks, 0.9% fragmentation) > /dev/ida0s1e: FILESYSTEM CLEAN; SKIPPING CHECKS > /dev/ida0s1e: clean, 2533812 free (23132 frags, 313835 blocks, 0.8% fragmentation) > /dev/ida0s1f: FILESYSTEM CLEAN; SKIPPING CHECKS > /dev/ida0s1f: clean, 9886 free (14 frags, 1234 blocks, 0.1% fragmentation) > /dev/ida0s1g: FILESYSTEM CLEAN; SKIPPING CHECKS > /dev/ida0s1g: clean, 20325785 free (281 frags, 2540688 blocks, 0.0% fragmentation) > /dev/ida0s1h: FILESYSTEM CLEAN; SKIPPING CHECKS > /dev/ida0s1h: clean, 44544505 free (9 frags, 5568062 blocks, 0.0% fragmentation) > mount: /dev/ida0s1a on /: specified device does not match mounted device > Mounting /etc/fstab filesystems failed, startup aborted > Enter full pathname of shell or RETURN for /bin/sh: > ================== > > What did I do wrong and how can I install (if can) FreeBSD > on my machine? > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 4:12: 1 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from server.baldwin.cx (jobaldwi.campus.vt.edu [198.82.67.146]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19F5A37B78F for ; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 04:11:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jhb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from john.baldwin.cx (john [10.0.0.2]) by server.baldwin.cx (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA02342; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 07:11:56 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from jhb@FreeBSD.org) Message-Id: <200002291211.HAA02342@server.baldwin.cx> X-Mailer: XFMail 1.4.0 on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20000229011729.A81617@elvis.mu.org> Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 07:11:56 -0500 (EST) From: John Baldwin To: Dave McKay Subject: Re: Unattended ? install Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.org, Stephen Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 29-Feb-00 Dave McKay wrote: > Stephen (sdk@yuck.net) wrote: >> On Tue, Feb 29, 2000 at 01:43:47PM +1100, David Nugent wrote: >> > I know that a fair amount of work has been done in building automated >> > installs for FreeBSD. Is this work currently available only in -current, >> > or does it include 3.X as well (I suspect it does as I first saw it >> > mentioned long ago). >> > >> > More importantly, where can I find documentation to use this? >> > >> >> I wouldn't mind assisting with this effort. I would love to see an >> automated install process similar to Solaris Jumpstart. > > I have heard rumors from a good source that a PXE boot for > FreeBSD is in the making. This can be made to mirror the > solaris jumpstart, or even better improve upon it. I believe > it will be committed in the near future. No rumors, it is in the making. However, there are still some issues with the kernel getting corrupted when it is being loaded, and it seems that booting off a kernel loaded over PXE is akin to Russian Roulette. That is with PXE >= 2.0, with older versions of PXE, we are having even less success. It may be committed after 4.0 though to get it out so that more eyes can see it. -- John Baldwin -- http://www.FreeBSD.org/~jhb/ PGP Key: http://www.cslab.vt.edu/~jobaldwi/pgpkey.asc "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.FreeBSD.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 9: 7:27 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ckmso1.proxy.att.com (ckmso1.att.com [12.20.58.69]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4EA037BBE1; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 09:07:17 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from myevmenkin@att.com) Received: from njb140r1.ems.att.com ([135.65.202.58]) by ckmso1.proxy.att.com (AT&T IPNS/MSO-2.2) with ESMTP id MAA07748; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 12:07:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from njb140bh1.ems.att.com by njb140r1.ems.att.com (8.8.8+Sun/ATTEMS-1.4.1 sol2) id MAA24191; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 12:06:30 -0500 (EST) Received: by njb140bh1.ems.att.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 12:07:12 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Yevmenkin, Maksim N, CSCIO" To: "'freebsd-current@freebsd.org'" Cc: "'freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org'" Subject: NETGRAPH (proposal. FINAL) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 12:06:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hello all, here is url: http://home.earthlink.net/~evmax/ng.tar.gz these are final patches for NETGRAPH. new features: - new hook ``divertin'' allows to put frame back to kernel stack. - new control message allows to set raw mode on ``divert'' hook. raw mode assumes that we have fully prepared frame and we do not have to update ``ether_shost'' field. thanks, emax To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 9:55: 5 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from popserver-02.iinet.net.au (popserver-02.iinet.net.au [203.59.24.148]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D873037BF26; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 09:54:55 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from julian@elischer.org) Received: from jules.elischer.org (reggae-02-224.nv.iinet.net.au [203.59.91.224]) by popserver-02.iinet.net.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id BAA20875; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 01:55:07 +0800 Message-ID: <38BC0745.2781E494@elischer.org> Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 09:52:05 -0800 From: Julian Elischer X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Yevmenkin, Maksim N, CSCIO" Cc: "'freebsd-current@freebsd.org'" , "'freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org'" Subject: Re: NETGRAPH (proposal. FINAL) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Yevmenkin, Maksim N, CSCIO wrote: > > hello all, > > here is url: http://home.earthlink.net/~evmax/ng.tar.gz > > these are final patches for NETGRAPH. > new features: > - new hook ``divertin'' allows to put frame back to > kernel stack. > - new control message allows to set raw mode on > ``divert'' hook. raw mode assumes that we have > fully prepared frame and we do not have to update > ``ether_shost'' field. This is good in theory, however the intel 82586 ethernet chip (and 596 in 586 mode) will overwrite anything you put there anyhow as it treats the header specially and fabricates it. (unless you are running in some mode that is not usually used). I don't know how many other chips do this but it may be misleading for the user who sets this on such a chip because the source address he sets will not be put on the wire. The idea is however useful and I guess we'll try add it in in the near future... What do you think Archie? Are we still in code freeze? (I think so). Julian > > thanks, > emax > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- __--_|\ Julian Elischer / \ julian@elischer.org ( OZ ) World tour 2000 ---> X_.---._/ presently in: Perth v To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 10: 1: 4 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from info.iet.unipi.it (info.iet.unipi.it [131.114.9.184]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D39B037BC72; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 10:00:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from luigi@info.iet.unipi.it) Received: (from luigi@localhost) by info.iet.unipi.it (8.9.3/8.9.3) id SAA32145; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 18:59:50 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from luigi) From: Luigi Rizzo Message-Id: <200002291759.SAA32145@info.iet.unipi.it> Subject: Re: NETGRAPH (proposal. FINAL) In-Reply-To: <38BC0745.2781E494@elischer.org> from Julian Elischer at "Feb 29, 2000 09:52:05 am" To: Julian Elischer Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 18:59:50 +0100 (CET) Cc: "Yevmenkin, Maksim N, CSCIO" , "'freebsd-current@freebsd.org'" , "'freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org'" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL61 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > This is good in theory, however the intel 82586 ethernet chip > (and 596 in 586 mode) will overwrite anything you put there anyhow > as it treats the header specially and fabricates it. > (unless you are running in some mode that is not usually used). can you clarify this ? Looong ago i used the '586 on a bridge and it did let me write the MAC header... cheers luigi > I don't know how many other chips do this but it may be misleading > for the user who sets this on such a chip because the source > address he sets will not be put on the wire. > > The idea is however useful and I guess we'll try add it in > in the near future... > What do you think Archie? > Are we still in code freeze? (I think so). > > Julian > > > > > thanks, > > emax > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > > -- > __--_|\ Julian Elischer > / \ julian@elischer.org > ( OZ ) World tour 2000 > ---> X_.---._/ presently in: Perth > v > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-current" in the body of the message > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 10: 4:45 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (critter.freebsd.dk [212.242.40.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BBA8F37B82C; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 10:04:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) Received: from critter.freebsd.dk (localhost.freebsd.dk [127.0.0.1]) by critter.freebsd.dk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA31677; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 19:03:53 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from phk@critter.freebsd.dk) To: Julian Elischer Cc: "Yevmenkin, Maksim N, CSCIO" , "'freebsd-current@freebsd.org'" , "'freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org'" Subject: Re: NETGRAPH (proposal. FINAL) In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 29 Feb 2000 09:52:05 PST." <38BC0745.2781E494@elischer.org> Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 19:03:53 +0100 Message-ID: <31675.951847433@critter.freebsd.dk> From: Poul-Henning Kamp Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message <38BC0745.2781E494@elischer.org>, Julian Elischer writes: >> these are final patches for NETGRAPH. >> new features: >> - new hook ``divertin'' allows to put frame back to >> kernel stack. >> - new control message allows to set raw mode on >> ``divert'' hook. raw mode assumes that we have >> fully prepared frame and we do not have to update >> ``ether_shost'' field. > >This is good in theory, however the intel 82586 ethernet chip >(and 596 in 586 mode) will overwrite anything you put there anyhow >as it treats the header specially and fabricates it. >(unless you are running in some mode that is not usually used). >I don't know how many other chips do this but it may be misleading >for the user who sets this on such a chip because the source >address he sets will not be put on the wire. But the driver would know and could issue an error or warning in that case ? I guess the packet should be failed with ENOCANDO ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp FreeBSD coreteam member phk@FreeBSD.ORG "Real hackers run -current on their laptop." FreeBSD -- It will take a long time before progress goes too far! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 10: 7:46 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.4.193]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2188D37BC61; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 10:07:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wollman@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu) Received: (from wollman@localhost) by khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA57238; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 13:07:24 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from wollman) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 13:07:24 -0500 (EST) From: Garrett Wollman Message-Id: <200002291807.NAA57238@khavrinen.lcs.mit.edu> To: Luigi Rizzo Cc: Julian Elischer , "Yevmenkin, Maksim N, CSCIO" , "'freebsd-current@freebsd.org'" , "'freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org'" Subject: Re: NETGRAPH (proposal. FINAL) In-Reply-To: <200002291759.SAA32145@info.iet.unipi.it> References: <38BC0745.2781E494@elischer.org> <200002291759.SAA32145@info.iet.unipi.it> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG < said: > can you clarify this ? Looong ago i used the '586 on a bridge and it did let > me write the MAC header... The 82586 has a mode bit which selects one of two possibilities: 1) The transmit command specifies the destination address and length/ethertype field; the source address is inserted by hardware. The receive buffer descriptor gets the source address and length/ethertype. 2) The transmit and receive buffers include a full Ethernet header. I can't say off the top of my head which the `ie' driver uses, but I would bet on (2) because that's easier for the driver to deal with. These sorts of controllers are the reason why ether_input takes the Ethernet header as a separate parameter. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | O Siem / We are all family / O Siem / We're all the same wollman@lcs.mit.edu | O Siem / The fires of freedom Opinions not those of| Dance in the burning flame MIT, LCS, CRS, or NSA| - Susan Aglukark and Chad Irschick To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 10:17:58 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bubba.whistle.com (bubba.whistle.com [207.76.205.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDD2F37B82C; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 10:17:54 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from archie@whistle.com) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id KAA17413; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 10:17:21 -0800 (PST) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <200002291817.KAA17413@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: NETGRAPH (proposal. FINAL) In-Reply-To: <38BC0745.2781E494@elischer.org> from Julian Elischer at "Feb 29, 2000 09:52:05 am" To: julian@elischer.org (Julian Elischer) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 10:17:20 -0800 (PST) Cc: myevmenkin@att.com (Yevmenkin Maksim N CSCIO), freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG ('freebsd-current@freebsd.org'), freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG ('freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org') X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Julian Elischer writes: > > here is url: http://home.earthlink.net/~evmax/ng.tar.gz > > > > these are final patches for NETGRAPH. > > new features: > > - new hook ``divertin'' allows to put frame back to > > kernel stack. > > - new control message allows to set raw mode on > > ``divert'' hook. raw mode assumes that we have > > fully prepared frame and we do not have to update > > ``ether_shost'' field. > > This is good in theory, however the intel 82586 ethernet chip > (and 596 in 586 mode) will overwrite anything you put there anyhow > as it treats the header specially and fabricates it. > (unless you are running in some mode that is not usually used). > I don't know how many other chips do this but it may be misleading > for the user who sets this on such a chip because the source > address he sets will not be put on the wire. > > The idea is however useful and I guess we'll try add it in > in the near future... > What do you think Archie? > Are we still in code freeze? (I think so). Yes, I was going to take a look at this after 4.0-REL and then commit something hopefully soon thereafter.. By the way, if the ethernet chip doesn't support manual source address then BPF has the same problem that we do.. IMHO, we should just punt and return an error in this case.. -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 10:29:40 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bubba.whistle.com (bubba.whistle.com [207.76.205.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8EEC37BD8D for ; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 10:29:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from archie@whistle.com) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id KAA17466; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 10:29:05 -0800 (PST) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <200002291829.KAA17466@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Re: sockets in kernelmodule In-Reply-To: <20000227183903.A27079@cicely5.cicely.de> from Bernd Walter at "Feb 27, 2000 06:39:04 pm" To: ticso@cicely5.cicely.de (Bernd Walter) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 10:29:05 -0800 (PST) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Bernd Walter writes: > Is it valid to use proc0 for socreate() and sobind() in kernel? > In my case I need to create a TCP connection which is used from different > processes and which may be reconnected from different processes. I'm not sure how valid it is, but that's what the netgraph node type ng_ksocket(8) does. I copied this from the NFS code. Not sure what you're doing, but you might possibly save some work by using ng_ksocket(8). -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 11:44:24 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ckmso1.proxy.att.com (ckmso1.att.com [12.20.58.69]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC1D437BC75; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 11:44:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from myevmenkin@att.com) Received: from gab200r1.ems.att.com ([135.37.94.32]) by ckmso1.proxy.att.com (AT&T IPNS/MSO-2.2) with ESMTP id OAA09748; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 14:44:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from njb140bh2.ems.att.com by gab200r1.ems.att.com (8.8.8+Sun/ATTEMS-1.4.1 sol2) id OAA13021; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 14:45:22 -0500 (EST) Received: by njb140bh2.ems.att.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 14:44:18 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Yevmenkin, Maksim N, CSCIO" To: freebsd-current@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: NETGRAPH (proposal. FINAL) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 14:44:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [...] > > This is good in theory, however the intel 82586 ethernet chip > > (and 596 in 586 mode) will overwrite anything you put there anyhow > > as it treats the header specially and fabricates it. > > (unless you are running in some mode that is not usually used). > > I don't know how many other chips do this but it may be misleading > > for the user who sets this on such a chip because the source > > address he sets will not be put on the wire. > > > > The idea is however useful and I guess we'll try add it in > > in the near future... > > What do you think Archie? > > Are we still in code freeze? (I think so). > > Yes, I was going to take a look at this after 4.0-REL and then > commit something hopefully soon thereafter.. > > By the way, if the ethernet chip doesn't support manual source > address then BPF has the same problem that we do.. IMHO, we should > just punt and return an error in this case.. i think we still have this problem in BPF. as far as i know ``bpfwrite'' calls ``if_output'' which is ``ether_output''. in the same time ``ether_output'' updates ``ether_shost''. so, as far as i know, it's imposible to send frame with custom ``ether_shost''. please correct me if i wrong. thanks, emax To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 13: 1:34 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from stimpy.sasknow.com (h139-142-245-100.ss.fiberone.net [139.142.245.100]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9226D37BBC0 for ; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 13:01:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ryan@sasknow.com) Received: from localhost (ryan@localhost) by stimpy.sasknow.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA18945; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 15:01:56 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from ryan@sasknow.com) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 15:01:56 -0600 (CST) From: Ryan Thompson To: Zhihui Zhang Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Building customized kernel without root passwd In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Organization: SaskNow Technologies [www.sasknow.com] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Zhihui Zhang wrote to freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG: > > My professor plans to use FreeBSD for teaching purpose. We will allow > students to build their kernel but do not want to give them root password. > So it's better to find a way to let students build kernel under their own > account, save the kernel on a floppy and then boot from the floppy. > > I am familiar with normal kernel build process. But have not done the > above before. I hope someone can give me some suggestions and I will try > them out. > > Thanks a lot. > > -Zhihui It might be possible to do... (SHOULD be possible, though modifications to the Makefile would have to be done to point the build away from /usr/src/sys/compile. The install option would also have to be modified to point to the floppy... And watch it die when the write protect tab is locked. ;-) I would STRONGLY recommend against this though, as it's really a false sense of security... Heck, maybe even less... After booting from the floppy (presumably in single user mode), the user can make arbitrary root mounts of the system's hard drive (and any maproot=0 NFS exports allowed by that machine!). In fact, enabling floppy boots on public machines where wide physical access is available is generally a Bad Idea. Of course, not giving the students root's password on that machine is also a moot point, as a 'passwd root' from that boot flopply sort of avoids the whole issue. :-) Most colleges give students responsibility for their own computers for this sort of work. Things tend to go awry when budding SysAdmins (with strict lab deadlines, no less) are given root privileges. It is possible to modify the 'mount' command to require some extra authentication (like a password or challenge phrase) to perform root mounts, but unless you regulate all floppies that enter and exit your lab, there is nothing to stop users with home systems from rolling their own mount from an existing FreeBSD system without such restrictions. Basically, if the user has the permissions to build and boot from their own kernel and/or suite of utilities (be it from a floppy or the local drive), assume they have free reign over the entire system, and any network resources root normally has access to. -- Ryan Thompson Systems Administrator, Accounts Phone: +1 (306) 664-1161 SaskNow Technologies http://www.sasknow.com #106-380 3120 8th St E Saskatoon, SK S7H 0W2 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 14:43:46 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.alpha.net.au (mail2.alpha.net.au [203.41.44.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D658537B766; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 14:43:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dannyh@idx.com.au) Received: from freebsd.freebsd.org (surry-pool-247.alpha.net.au [203.41.44.247] (may be forged)) by mail.alpha.net.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA01351; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 09:44:24 +1100 From: Danny To: stefan.parvu@comptel.com, stefan parvu , "freebsd-questions@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: sotruss utility / Rational porting ? Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 08:29:18 +1100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.21] Content-Type: text/plain Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG References: <38BA2E82.81B6074D@comptel.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <00030108303101.00318@freebsd.freebsd.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Since you are planning to port rational products can you port rational rose Looking forward to your feedback. danny dannyh@idx.com.au On Mon, 28 Feb 2000, stefan parvu wrote: > Hello all, > > I would like to ask you couple of questions: > > 1. Do we have a tool which is tracing the libraries as in Solaris, > sotruss? > > 2. Do we have a starting point for a proposal to Rational for a porting > of ClearCase and Purify tools on FreeBSD 3.x or 4.x? I think they are > doing an official port to Linux for ClearCase. We must try, I think, to > propose them this, as a native port. > > I'm writing from Helsinki, Finland and believe me people never heard > about BSD OS (FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD) at all. Here everybody is using > Linux, (coming from Helsinki) and I think that for FreeBSD we need more > effort in this way. > > > thanks, > Stefan > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-questions" in the body of the message -- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 22:16:33 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from resnet.uoregon.edu (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.144.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01E4937BC54 for ; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 22:16:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu) Received: from localhost (dwhite@localhost) by resnet.uoregon.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA65110; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 22:16:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 22:16:27 -0800 (PST) From: Doug White To: Marc Frajola Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? In-Reply-To: <200002282312.PAA15070@enginet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 28 Feb 2000, Marc Frajola wrote: > Thanks very much for the reply. I checked out the URL you gave > (http://www.freebsd.org/tutorials/formatting-media/), and unfortunately > I'm still wondering how to create one FreeBSD fdisk slice so that > disklabel can actually create partitions. > > The reason why I sent the message to freebsd-hackers was because > when I tried 'fdisk -e', it seems to assign a slice, BUT disklabel > gives an error like 'No space left on device' or some such thing after > running fdisk, making it obvious that the fdisk -e didn't work as I > thought it should. What are you using for your command lines? You have to target the disklabel specifically at slice 1 on the disk otherwise disklabel will think you're trying to overwrite the slice table and get mad. > I will check out the 'install' PicoBSD floppy here shortly to > see if I can learn anything from that. I just did that twice today and it definitely works :) The only problem I had with those is that the disk boot order (this is a L440GX+ board where you can configure it) was screwy (i.e. primary-master wasn't the preferred boot disk). > If anybody knows right off what the sequence of commands (complete > with arguments) to fdisk and disklabel a new drive to make a > "compatiblity mode" bootable FreeBSD system slice (and make it active), > I'd appreciate hearing from you. I have an awk script mercilessly stolen from phk that does the disklabel dirty work. Otherwise it's straightforward: fdisk -e wd0 disklabel .. magic .. newfs /dev/wd0s1a Doug White | FreeBSD: The Power to Serve dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | www.FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 22:25:19 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from resnet.uoregon.edu (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.144.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A74A937BE18 for ; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 22:25:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu) Received: from localhost (dwhite@localhost) by resnet.uoregon.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA85723; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 22:25:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu) Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 22:25:06 -0800 (PST) From: Doug White To: Dave McKay Cc: Stephen , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Unattended ? install In-Reply-To: <20000229011729.A81617@elvis.mu.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 29 Feb 2000, Dave McKay wrote: > > On Tue, Feb 29, 2000 at 01:43:47PM +1100, David Nugent wrote: > > > I know that a fair amount of work has been done in building automated > > > installs for FreeBSD. Is this work currently available only in -current, > > > or does it include 3.X as well (I suspect it does as I first saw it > > > mentioned long ago). > > > > > > More importantly, where can I find documentation to use this? > > > > > > > I wouldn't mind assisting with this effort. I would love to see an > > automated install process similar to Solaris Jumpstart. > > I have heard rumors from a good source that a PXE boot for > FreeBSD is in the making. This can be made to mirror the > solaris jumpstart, or even better improve upon it. I believe > it will be committed in the near future. We (eGroups) used to use a PXE loader for the Linux distribution, until we ran up against the BIOS limit for disk sizes, 8GB. Since nothing was brewing that was going to be ready soon that allowed us to use our 20GB disks fully, I built the PicoBSD install floppy and another coworker figured out RedHat kickstart. Don't underestimate the power of floppies :) Doug White | FreeBSD: The Power to Serve dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | www.FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Tue Feb 29 22:30:27 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from elvis.mu.org (elvis.mu.org [207.154.226.10]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6131237C114 for ; Tue, 29 Feb 2000 22:30:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dave@elvis.mu.org) Received: (from dave@localhost) by elvis.mu.org (8.9.1/8.9.1) id AAA09054; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 00:29:49 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from dave) Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 00:29:49 -0600 From: Dave McKay To: Doug White Cc: Stephen , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Unattended ? install Message-ID: <20000301002949.A8979@elvis.mu.org> References: <20000229011729.A81617@elvis.mu.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=nFreZHaLTZJo0R7j; micalg=pgp-md5; protocol="application/pgp-signature" X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.7i In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --nFreZHaLTZJo0R7j Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Doug White (dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu) wrote: > On Tue, 29 Feb 2000, Dave McKay wrote: >=20 > > > On Tue, Feb 29, 2000 at 01:43:47PM +1100, David Nugent wrote: > > > > I know that a fair amount of work has been done in building automat= ed > > > > installs for FreeBSD. Is this work currently available only in -cur= rent, > > > > or does it include 3.X as well (I suspect it does as I first saw it > > > > mentioned long ago). > > > >=20 > > > > More importantly, where can I find documentation to use this? > > > >=20 > > >=20 > > > I wouldn't mind assisting with this effort. I would love to see an > > > automated install process similar to Solaris Jumpstart. > >=20 > > I have heard rumors from a good source that a PXE boot for > > FreeBSD is in the making. This can be made to mirror the=20 > > solaris jumpstart, or even better improve upon it. I believe > > it will be committed in the near future. >=20 > We (eGroups) used to use a PXE loader for the Linux distribution, until > we ran up against the BIOS limit for disk sizes, 8GB. Since nothing was > brewing that was going to be ready soon that allowed us to use our 20GB > disks fully, I built the PicoBSD install floppy and another coworker > figured out RedHat kickstart. >=20 > Don't underestimate the power of floppies :) >=20 Never. However floppies get a bit cumbersome when dealing with several thousand machines. Also the Redhat and the Univ. of Geneva pxe loaders have problems. The FreeBSD implementation is being written from scratch. --=20 Dave McKay Network Engineer - Google Inc. dave@mu.org - dave@google.com I'm feeling lucky... --nFreZHaLTZJo0R7j Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3ia iQCVAwUBOLy43XY8vP7IQ1TlAQG92QP+NXgNb95tXya1UHMSBS0C/a9Rz+N5MffD svX6ThUvIYMqYk3dcvuzqVWAdRI9viqGlrS0vw/Yk2omzRLxRy6dUrvW3pMY2CzP g5yjioq+5hmr8/r3UmDHbnqGwUAquFmQ2TxPDk7xMaAflGO6edPGMAQ0LchL0JZ/ I6G5aC6/nGU= =N2sd -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nFreZHaLTZJo0R7j-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 1: 5:38 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from enginet.com (enginet.com [199.2.210.247]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5562537BE1A for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 01:05:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from marc@enginet.com) Received: from enginet.com (marc@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by enginet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA16360; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 01:05:32 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200003010905.BAA16360@enginet.com> To: Doug White Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 29 Feb 2000 22:16:27 PST." Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 01:05:31 PST From: Marc Frajola Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, 29 Feb 2000, Doug White wrote: > On Mon, 28 Feb 2000, Marc Frajola wrote: > > > Thanks very much for the reply. I checked out the URL you gave > > (http://www.freebsd.org/tutorials/formatting-media/), and unfortunately > > I'm still wondering how to create one FreeBSD fdisk slice so that > > disklabel can actually create partitions. > > > > The reason why I sent the message to freebsd-hackers was because > > when I tried 'fdisk -e', it seems to assign a slice, BUT disklabel > > gives an error like 'No space left on device' or some such thing after > > running fdisk, making it obvious that the fdisk -e didn't work as I > > thought it should. > > What are you using for your command lines? You have to target the > disklabel specifically at slice 1 on the disk otherwise disklabel will > think you're trying to overwrite the slice table and get mad. Here's what I did: fdisk -e /dev/rda1 disklabel -r -w da1 auto The disklabel command gives 'disklabel: No space left on device'. > > I will check out the 'install' PicoBSD floppy here shortly to > > see if I can learn anything from that. > > I just did that twice today and it definitely works :) The only problem I > had with those is that the disk boot order (this is a L440GX+ board where > you can configure it) was screwy (i.e. primary-master wasn't the preferred > boot disk). > > If anybody knows right off what the sequence of commands (complete > > with arguments) to fdisk and disklabel a new drive to make a > > "compatiblity mode" bootable FreeBSD system slice (and make it active), > > I'd appreciate hearing from you. > > I have an awk script mercilessly stolen from phk that does the disklabel > dirty work. Otherwise it's straightforward: > > fdisk -e wd0 > disklabel .. magic .. > newfs /dev/wd0s1a OK, may I ask what the ".. magic .." part is?? I am using SCSI drives (hence da). I tried doing 'camcontrol rescan da1' as suggested by somebody on the mailing list, and that had no effect on the problem. When I use 'sysinstall', I can write an fdisk slice label and a FreeBSD disk label properly, and all is well. I just can't automate it. I glanced through the source code for disklabel and sysinstall. It looks like sysinstall uses libdisk to write the label. The command-line 'disklabel' utility appears to use an ioctl to set the disklabel, and the DIOCSDINFO call returns the error. My theory is that sysinstall works because it does NOT go through the standard kernel interface (at least if it does, I can't find the DIOCSDINFO call). The reason the kernel returns the error appears to be because it thinks one of the sizes given in the new label exceeds the size of the fdisk slice. Even if I try using 'disklabel -e da1' to edit the label, I still get errors like 'disklabel: ioctl DIOCGDINFO: Invalid argument', so it may not be something wrong with just the 'auto' mode on disklabel. Anyway, I'm still very open to hints after spending several hours trying to figure this out. I noticed that 'fdisk -e /dev/rda1' seems to get the ending cylinder number completely wrong, but even if I run fdisk entering what I think are the proper numbers manually, disklabel still does not seem to be happy. As per your suggestion, I tried 'disklabel -r -w da1s1 auto', and I get the following errors: disklabel: ioctl DIOCGDINFO: Invalid argument disklabel: auto: unknown disk type So I'm doubt that disklabel really wants me to target slice 1 directly. BTW, I'm using an Intel Xeon motherboard (SC450NX) with an Adaptec 2940U2W controller hooked up to a SCSI-to-SCSI RAID controller, and am trying to do the fdisk/disklabel on the RAID drive. The BIOS reports that the drive is slightly larger than what fdisk actually assigns to the partition (in # of sectors -- I actually expected this slight difference in size). I really appreciate all the hints so far even though no solution yet... ...Marc... P.S.: If somebody who has PicoBSD source available could send me any relevant scripts or source excerpts from it that deal with fdisk or disklabel, it would be greatly appreciated. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 1:31:42 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from balrog.rt.ru (balrog.rt.ru [195.161.0.169]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1669D37BE10 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 01:31:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dima@rt.ru) Received: from rt.ru (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by balrog.rt.ru (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA50581 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 12:31:34 +0300 (MSK) (envelope-from dima@rt.ru) Message-ID: <38BCE376.775A886@rt.ru> Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 12:31:34 +0300 From: "Dmitry S. Rzhavin" Organization: Rostelecom Internet X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 4.0-20000103-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: ru MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: mounting filesystem multiple times Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi! I want to mount one filesystem rw once and ro multiple times (lets say, 500 times). Can I do it? And if yes, will it slow FreeBSD down and will it use additional memory, cpu and other system resources in this case? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 4:52:49 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ockle.dev.nanoteq.co.za (ockle.dev.nanoteq.co.za [196.7.114.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EE0C37C247; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 04:52:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from johan@ockle.dev.nanoteq.co.za) Received: by ockle.dev.nanoteq.co.za (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA44568; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 14:52:56 +0200 (SAST) (envelope-from johan) From: Johan Kruger Reply-To: jkruger@oskar.nanoteq.co.za Organization: Nanoteq To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: d: /kernel: malformed input file (not rel or archive) ?? Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 14:49:39 +0200 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-Type: text/plain Cc: current@FreeBSD.ORG MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <00030114525508.00308@ockle.dev.nanoteq.co.za> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG If i try to load the example in /usr/src/share/exaples/lkm/misc/module/misc_mod.o i get the following. Pleeaaaseeee help ? borg# modload ./misc_mod.o ld: /kernel: malformed input file (not rel or archive) modload: /usr/bin/ld: return code 1 -- Johan Kruger ( B.Ing Electronic Engineering ) Developement Engineer Nanoteq PTA ( 012 6727000 ) e-mail : jkruger@oskar.nanoteq.co.za e-mail : jk@nanoteq.co.za To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 5:11: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua [212.9.224.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42B6537BBAA; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 05:11:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Received: from vega.vega.com (dialup4-55.iptelecom.net.ua [212.9.226.247]) by ipt2.iptelecom.net.ua (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA25109; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 15:13:03 +0200 (EET) Received: from altavista.net (big_brother.vega.com [192.168.1.1]) by vega.vega.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA08182; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 15:09:58 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from sobomax@altavista.net) Message-ID: <38BD16A1.D7415F26@altavista.net> Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 15:09:53 +0200 From: Maxim Sobolev Reply-To: sobomax@altavista.net Organization: Vega International Capital X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: uk,ru,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: jkruger@oskar.nanoteq.co.za Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: d: /kernel: malformed input file (not rel or archive) ?? References: <00030114525508.00308@ockle.dev.nanoteq.co.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Johan Kruger wrote: > If i try to load the example in > /usr/src/share/exaples/lkm/misc/module/misc_mod.o i get the following. > Pleeaaaseeee help ? > > borg# modload ./misc_mod.o > ld: /kernel: malformed input file (not rel or archive) > modload: /usr/bin/ld: return code 1 What FreeBSD release you are using? If it is 2.2 than the -current is wrong place to ask, but if it is 4.0 than you must note that the lkm subsustem has been abolished long time ago in favor of the new kld system. See man kld and /usr/share/examples/kld for details. -Maxim To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 8:35:38 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhost.stack.nl (vaak.stack.nl [131.155.140.140]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD5D437BD96 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 08:35:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from davidd@stack.nl) Received: from snail.stack.nl (snail.stack.nl [131.155.140.131]) by mailhost.stack.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2057E5D12E for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 17:35:31 +0100 (CET) Received: by snail.stack.nl (Postfix, from userid 1604) id 62DEAD52; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 17:35:31 +0100 (CET) Subject: FreeBSD-boot To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 17:35:31 +0100 (CET) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL60 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20000301163531.62DEAD52@snail.stack.nl> From: davidd@stack.nl (David van Deijk) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Dear hackers, I have encountered Problems using the FBSDBOOT.exe since version 3.0 3.1 3.2 3.3 3.4. I have looked into the source and could not find ELF support but only aout. Are you able to tell me wheter this is because of me or that i am right in this elf-aout thingy . ThanX in advance. Dag dag David. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 8:57:43 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 758) id 8AE9037C3A6; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 08:57:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03ED42E8157; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 08:57:40 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kris@hub.freebsd.org) Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 08:57:39 -0800 (PST) From: Kris Kennaway To: Johan Kruger Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG, current@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: d: /kernel: malformed input file (not rel or archive) ?? In-Reply-To: <00030114525508.00308@ockle.dev.nanoteq.co.za> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 1 Mar 2000, Johan Kruger wrote: > If i try to load the example in > /usr/src/share/exaples/lkm/misc/module/misc_mod.o i get the following. > Pleeaaaseeee help ? LKMs are deprecated in favour of KLDs. Do you have options LKM in your kernel if you really wnt to play with the old technology? Kris ---- In God we Trust -- all others must submit an X.509 certificate. -- Charles Forsythe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 9:25:37 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lanturn.express.ru (lanturn.kmost.express.ru [212.24.37.109]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DB3B37C3E5 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 09:25:25 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from vova@express.ru) Received: from vova (helo=localhost) by lanturn.express.ru with local-esmtp (Exim 3.11 #1) id 12QCs7-0007Q9-00; Wed, 01 Mar 2000 20:25:15 +0300 Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 20:25:15 +0300 (MSK) From: "Vladimir B. Grebenschikov" X-Sender: vova@lanturn.kmost.express.ru To: David van Deijk Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: FreeBSD-boot In-Reply-To: <20000301163531.62DEAD52@snail.stack.nl> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 1 Mar 2000, David van Deijk wrote: > I have encountered Problems using the FBSDBOOT.exe since version > 3.0 3.1 3.2 3.3 3.4. I have looked into the source and could not > find ELF support but only aout. Are you able to tell me wheter this is > because of me or that i am right in this elf-aout thingy . > ThanX in advance. try to load /boot/loader with FBSDBOOT.exe, and then boot elf kernel from loader I am don't tried to go this way, because of I have no DOS. > Dag dag David. -- TSB Russian Express, Moscow Vladimir B. Grebenschikov, vova@express.ru To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 10:22:31 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhost.stack.nl (vaak.stack.nl [131.155.140.140]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 30B3437BBD3 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 10:22:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from davidd@stack.nl) Received: from snail.stack.nl (snail.stack.nl [131.155.140.131]) by mailhost.stack.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 616085D110; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 19:22:23 +0100 (CET) Received: by snail.stack.nl (Postfix, from userid 1604) id B081AD52; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 19:22:22 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: FreeBSD-boot In-Reply-To: from "Vladimir B. Grebenschikov" at "Mar 1, 2000 08:25:15 pm" To: "Vladimir B. Grebenschikov" Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 19:22:22 +0100 (CET) Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL60 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20000301182222.B081AD52@snail.stack.nl> From: davidd@stack.nl (David van Deijk) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > I have encountered Problems using the FBSDBOOT.exe since version > > 3.0 3.1 3.2 3.3 3.4. I have looked into the source and could not > > find ELF support but only aout. Are you able to tell me wheter this is > > because of me or that i am right in this elf-aout thingy . > > ThanX in advance. > > try to load /boot/loader with FBSDBOOT.exe, and then boot > elf kernel from loader I did try this and he started running /boot/loader @ 0x0100000 and stopped doing anything to my great disappointment. > I am don't tried to go this way, because of I have no DOS. > > > Dag dag David. > > -- > TSB Russian Express, Moscow > Vladimir B. Grebenschikov, vova@express.ru > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 11:11:49 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mass.cdrom.com (mass.cdrom.com [204.216.28.184]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0B7537BCA4 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 11:11:39 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from msmith@mass.cdrom.com) Received: from mass.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mass.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA00739; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 11:11:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from msmith@mass.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <200003011911.LAA00739@mass.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 To: Marc Frajola Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 01 Mar 2000 01:05:31 PST." <200003010905.BAA16360@enginet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 11:11:35 -0800 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > What are you using for your command lines? You have to target the > > disklabel specifically at slice 1 on the disk otherwise disklabel will > > think you're trying to overwrite the slice table and get mad. > > Here's what I did: > > fdisk -e /dev/rda1 > disklabel -r -w da1 auto > > The disklabel command gives 'disklabel: No space left on device'. This is nonsensical; first you are trying to slice the disk, then you are trying to initialise it sliceless without first removing the slices. If you want the disk sliced, use disklabel on rda1sX, where X is the slice you've created. If you want it unsliced, dd 8k of zeroes over the beginning of da1 first. -- \\ Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. \\ Mike Smith \\ Tell him he should learn how to fish himself, \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ and he'll hate you for a lifetime. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 13:20:28 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from goliath.siemens.de (goliath.siemens.de [194.138.37.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E1DA37BD03 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 13:20:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from andre.albsmeier@mchp.siemens.de) X-Envelope-Sender-Is: andre.albsmeier@mchp.siemens.de (at relayer goliath.siemens.de) Received: from mail2.siemens.de (mail2.siemens.de [139.25.208.11]) by goliath.siemens.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA15210 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 22:19:59 +0100 (MET) Received: from curry.mchp.siemens.de (curry.mchp.siemens.de [139.25.42.7]) by mail2.siemens.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA01149 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 22:19:59 +0100 (MET) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by curry.mchp.siemens.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) id WAA57134 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 22:19:59 +0100 (CET) Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 22:19:56 +0100 From: Andre Albsmeier To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: andre.albsmeier@mchp.siemens.de Subject: Fix for quotas grace time when using chown and soft limits are hit again Message-ID: <20000301221956.A10086@internal> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Here is a problem with FreeBSD's quotas that I have observed for a long time now but finally found some time to track it down: Let's assume the following settings on a quota enabled system: soft limits : 100MB hard limits : 200MB grace period: 7 days On day 1, the user U1 creates 150MB of data. The soft limits are reached but not the hard limits. The internal grace timer is set accordingly (to current_time + 7 days). On day 3, the user U1 removes 100MB. There are 50MB remaining and the grace period is no more important. From now on, the users U1's amount of data stays between 50 and 60 MB. On day 10, user U2 leaves system forever. He got 100MB of data and the admin decides that U1 has to take care of them. So he moves U2's data to U1's directory and runs a "chown -R U1" there. Now, U1 has around 150MB of data belonging to him. The admin tells U1 that he is now over the soft limit and has got 7 days time to inspect U2's data. This is where the problem starts: When examining the quotas for U1 we find that the grace period is already over and the soft limits have turned into hard limits. This only happens if U1 has been over the soft limit some time before. So far for the facts - now let's start the wild guess :-) I assume the problem appears because the system still uses the old grace timer (set to day 7) which is exceeded on day 10 when the files are given to U1. This was no problem before (on days 8 and 9) because the grace time is only used if we are over the soft limits. When root does his chown, the grace timer for U1 is not set to day 10 + 7 days. I think the problem can be fixed _somehow_ with the following patch to /sys/ufs/ufs/ufs_quota.c: (I have included some comments manually _after_ creating the patch) --- /sys/ufs/ufs/ufs_quota.c Mon Aug 30 17:56:23 1999 +++ ufs_quota.c Wed Mar 1 21:27:14 2000 @@ -163,6 +163,10 @@ (void) tsleep((caddr_t)dq, PINOD+1, "chkdq2", 0); } dq->dq_curblocks += change; /* check if we hit the soft limits */ + if (dq->dq_curblocks >= dq->dq_bsoftlimit && dq->dq_bsoftlimit) /* check if we have been below the soft limits before */ + if (dq->dq_curblocks - change < dq->dq_bsoftlimit) /* yes, update the timer */ + dq->dq_btime = time_second + + VFSTOUFS(ITOV(ip)->v_mount)->um_btime[i]; dq->dq_flags |= DQ_MOD; } return (0); @@ -279,6 +283,10 @@ (void) tsleep((caddr_t)dq, PINOD+1, "chkiq2", 0); } dq->dq_curinodes += change; /* same as above for inodes */ + if (dq->dq_curinodes >= dq->dq_isoftlimit && dq->dq_isoftlimit) + if (dq->dq_curinodes - change < dq->dq_isoftlimit) + dq->dq_itime = time_second + + VFSTOUFS(ITOV(ip)->v_mount)->um_itime[i]; dq->dq_flags |= DQ_MOD; } return (0); As far as I understood things correctly, chkdq() is being called from the chown code in the kernel. When the amount of blocks (inodes) changes, there is no check being done if the soft limit is hit. In chkdqchg() we find the interesting part which I tried to bring into chkdq() with the above patch. I have no idea about vfs, ufs and all these things so maybe one of the more enlightened people (Matt, Alfred, ...) might be able to correct me. If the current behaviour is desired it would be nice if someone could tell me if my patch goes in the right direction if I want to fix it for me only. Thanks, -Andre To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 14:55:45 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.webmonster.de (datasink.webmonster.de [194.162.162.209]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 4915D37BC23 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 14:55:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from karsten@rohrbach.de) Received: (qmail 89082 invoked by uid 1000); 1 Mar 2000 22:55:31 -0000 Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 23:55:31 +0100 From: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: MAXUSERS question, what is max MAXUSERS setting? Message-ID: <20000301235531.A89015@rohrbach.de> Reply-To: karsten@rohrbach.de Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i X-Arbitrary-Number-Of-The-Day: 42 X-Sender: karsten@rohrbach.de Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hiya folks i just wondered what the maximum MAXUSERS setting for a 3.4 kernel would be on a smp system with 512mb ram... the impact on the system structures seems to be very... errrhh... rather complex. any ideas? it gives me a warning if i got past 512, but what will happen then? /k -- > Motto of the Electrical Engineer: > Working computer hardware is a lot like an erect penis: it > stays up as long as you don't fuck with it. http://www.webmonster.de http://www.apache.de http://www.splatterworld.de (NIC-HDL KR433/KR11-RIPE) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 15:44: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mtiwmhc21.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc21.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.46]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EF2337BD39 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 15:44:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hspio@worldnet.att.net) Received: from default ([12.70.19.77]) by mtiwmhc21.worldnet.att.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.31a 201-229-119-114) with ESMTP id <20000301234359.TOCU9754.mtiwmhc21.worldnet.att.net@default>; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 23:43:59 +0000 Received: from solomon ([209.216.95.2]) by mtiwgwc21.worldnet.att.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.31a 201-229-119-114) with SMTP id <20000301200009.ECXT21162.mtiwgwc21.worldnet.att.net@solomon> for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 20:00:09 +0000 Received: from [209.216.85.14] by solomon (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id ia860400 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 14:58:33 -0500 From: "The Raifords" To: tjlewis@ij.net, TamUSF@aol.com, Ssstaton@aol.com, SKBK4@aol.com, AMANDAD25@aol.com, hkpio@digital.net, grlewis@tampabay.rr.com, hspio@att.net, patty@tampabay.rr.com, jstauff@bellsouth.net, "Hester" Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 14:58:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Great American Gas Out Reply-To: s3braiford@ij.net X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Message-Id: <19583251553599@ij.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Fw: Great American Gas Out This message was received and forwarded - please forward it! Anytime we can stick it to them it's a good day. Last year on April 30,1999, a gas out was staged across Canada and the U.S. to bring the price of gas down, and it worked. It's time to do something about it again.This time, lets make it for three days instead of just one. The oil cartel decided to slow production to drive up gasoline prices. Lets see how many Canadian\American people we can get to ban together for a three day period in April, NOT TO BUY ANY GASOLINE, during those three days. LETS HAVE A GAS OUT. Do not buy any gasoline from APRIL 7, 2000, THROUGH APRIL 9, 2000. Buy what you need before the dates listed above, or after, but try not to buy any during the GAS OUT. If you want to help, just sendthis to everyone you know and ask them to do the same.We brought the prices down once before, and we can do it ag ain! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 15:46:28 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5147837BD39; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 15:46:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id KAA04032; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:16:15 +1030 (CST) Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:16:15 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: Mike Smith Cc: Marc Frajola , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? Message-ID: <20000302101615.I2905@freebie.lemis.com> References: <200003010905.BAA16360@enginet.com> <200003011911.LAA00739@mass.cdrom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre2i In-Reply-To: <200003011911.LAA00739@mass.cdrom.com> WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wednesday, 1 March 2000 at 11:11:35 -0800, Mike Smith wrote: >>> What are you using for your command lines? You have to target the >>> disklabel specifically at slice 1 on the disk otherwise disklabel will >>> think you're trying to overwrite the slice table and get mad. >> >> Here's what I did: >> >> fdisk -e /dev/rda1 >> disklabel -r -w da1 auto >> >> The disklabel command gives 'disklabel: No space left on device'. > > This is nonsensical; first you are trying to slice the disk, then you are > trying to initialise it sliceless without first removing the slices. > > If you want the disk sliced, use disklabel on rda1sX, where X is the > slice you've created. If you want it unsliced, dd 8k of zeroes over the > beginning of da1 first. You've got to admit that that's a workaround. What we really need is some kind of "please start again from scratch" option. Greg -- Finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key See complete headers for address and phone numbers To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 16: 7:38 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from arthur.intraceptives.com.au (arthur.intraceptives.com.au [203.22.72.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 9F83D37BDDA for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 16:07:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wwlists@intraceptives.com.au) Received: (qmail 7356 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 00:07:29 -0000 Received: from wks-pc1.intraceptives.com.au (HELO waddy) (203.22.72.32) by arthur.intraceptives.com.au with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 00:07:29 -0000 Message-Id: <4.2.1.20000302103756.05601b50@arthur.intraceptives.com.au> X-Sender: wwlists@arthur.intraceptives.com.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.1 Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 11:07:28 +1100 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: Warren Welch Subject: fdisk / disklabel issues... In-Reply-To: References: <200002282312.PAA15070@enginet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all, I've got a problem with a couple of machines... The first time I saw the problem, I thought it was my hardware, but now I've encountered the problem on three different systems, all with different motherboards, and hard disks. The only think in common, is that with all of them I'm working with FreeBSD 3.4, and that all the disks are LARGER than 12Gb IDE's. One of the things that I notice are that the size of the disk that gets reported by the BIOS, and FreeBSD are totally different... As an example, the following system reports:- wdc0: unit 0 (wd0): wd0: 12419MB (25434228 sectors), 25232 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S from dmesg yet, when I get the system BIOS to probe the disk, it reports:- 24062 cyls 16 heads 63 sects. As you can see, FreeBSD recognizes the disk as larger than what it actually is. I've found that if I partition the disk using the entire disk (fdisk -e wd0), then the last partition on the disk (the one that uses the last sectors on the disk) won't be newfs'd... It's not at all good. sysinstall also seems to have a problem with allowing you to set the geometry. I'd expect that if I set the geometry to what the BIOS detects, and then say to use the entire disk, that it would use that defined geometry. It doesn't... The moment you say to use the entire disk, ('A', No), it resets the geometry to something it likes. If I calculate the number of sectors manually (to what the bios detects), and then create a slice all things work fine within that slice. I think there is something wrong with the way that FreeBSD is detecting the size of the disk. (Interigating the disk that is...) So far I've only had this problem with IDE disks. Warren wwelch@intraceptives.com.au To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 16:11:27 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from arthur.intraceptives.com.au (arthur.intraceptives.com.au [203.22.72.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 7CB7B37BE0C for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 16:11:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wwlists@intraceptives.com.au) Received: (qmail 7439 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2000 00:11:22 -0000 Received: from wks-pc1.intraceptives.com.au (HELO waddy) (203.22.72.32) by arthur.intraceptives.com.au with SMTP; 2 Mar 2000 00:11:22 -0000 Message-Id: <4.2.1.20000302110744.05603720@arthur.intraceptives.com.au> X-Sender: wwlists@arthur.intraceptives.com.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.1 Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 11:11:20 +1100 To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG From: Warren Welch Subject: Disklabel from command line... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi all, Is it possible to create FreeBSD partitions from the command line? I'd really like to be able to script creating a FreeBSD partitions, so that I could create /, /var, /usr, etc. without having to edit the disklabel manually. Any scripts out there already? Any ideas? Thanks in advance, Warren wwelch@intraceptives.com.au To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 18: 8:28 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mailhop1.nyroc.rr.com (mailhop1-1.nyroc.rr.com [24.92.226.166]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EB1037BF11 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 18:08:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from leisner@rochester.rr.com) Received: from mailout2.nyroc.rr.com ([24.92.226.121]) by mailhop1.nyroc.rr.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-59787U250000L250000S0V35) with ESMTP id com; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 21:05:27 -0500 Received: from mail2.nyroc.rr.com ([24.92.226.75]) by mailout2.nyroc.rr.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-59787U250000L250000S0V35) with ESMTP id com; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 20:57:56 -0500 Received: from rochester.rr.com ([24.93.17.24]) by mail2.nyroc.rr.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-53939U80000L80000S0V35) with ESMTP id com; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 21:04:25 -0500 Received: from soyata.home (IDENT:leisner@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rochester.rr.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA12177; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 21:08:17 -0500 Message-Id: <200003020208.VAA12177@rochester.rr.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.0 09/18/1999 To: Ryan Thompson Cc: Zhihui Zhang , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Building customized kernel without root passwd In-Reply-To: Message from Ryan Thompson of "Tue, 29 Feb 2000 15:01:56 CST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 21:08:17 -0500 From: "Marty Leisner" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Well, I never like to do anything as root which I don't need root permissions to do. If you have a "compiling" engine, and a "test" machine, this may be reasonable. Just let the compilers be able to write to the build directory (I think -- I haven't looked into this in a while (and generally use linux). To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 18:38:40 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gizmo.internode.com.au (gizmo.internode.com.au [192.83.231.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40D4237BF18; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 18:38:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from newton@gizmo.internode.com.au) Received: (from newton@localhost) by gizmo.internode.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA87649; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 13:09:34 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from newton) Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 13:09:34 +1030 (CST) From: Mark Newton Message-Id: <200003020239.NAA87649@gizmo.internode.com.au> To: wpaul@freebsd.org Subject: DLink DGE-500SX Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG We've been speaking with our local DLink salescritter about FreeBSD support (we couldn't help it - he coldcalled us with a visit yesterday and tried to demo a whole lot of gear which wouldn't work under FreeBSD :-) We suggested to him that the best way to get us interested would be to contribute some hardware to the FreeBSD project so that some drivers could be written. He called us back today and said he was interested in getting a DGE-500SX Gigabit ethernet card to someone like Bill Paul (Hi, Bill!) along with programming docs, in the hope that there's interest in making it work. So is there? :-) - mark ---- Mark Newton Email: newton@internode.com.au (W) Network Engineer Email: newton@atdot.dotat.org (H) Internode Systems Pty Ltd Desk: +61-8-82232999 "Network Man" - Anagram of "Mark Newton" Mobile: +61-416-202-223 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 19:20:52 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mtiwmhc02.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc02.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.37]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 30E5437BF16 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 19:20:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hspio@worldnet.att.net) Received: from default ([12.70.5.142]) by mtiwmhc02.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.07.07 118-134) with ESMTP id <20000302032040.ZHYH14952@default>; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 03:20:40 +0000 Received: from solomon ([209.216.95.2]) by mtiwgwc21.worldnet.att.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.31a 201-229-119-114) with SMTP id <20000301200009.ECXT21162.mtiwgwc21.worldnet.att.net@solomon> for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 20:00:09 +0000 Received: from [209.216.85.14] by solomon (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id ia860400 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 14:58:33 -0500 From: "The Raifords" To: tjlewis@ij.net, TamUSF@aol.com, Ssstaton@aol.com, SKBK4@aol.com, AMANDAD25@aol.com, hkpio@digital.net, grlewis@tampabay.rr.com, hspio@att.net, patty@tampabay.rr.com, jstauff@bellsouth.net, "Hester" Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 14:58:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Great American Gas Out Reply-To: s3braiford@ij.net X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Message-Id: <19583251553599@ij.net> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Fw: Great American Gas Out This message was received and forwarded - please forward it! Anytime we can stick it to them it's a good day. Last year on April 30,1999, a gas out was staged across Canada and the U.S. to bring the price of gas down, and it worked. It's time to do something about it again.This time, lets make it for three days instead of just one. The oil cartel decided to slow production to drive up gasoline prices. Lets see how many Canadian\American people we can get to ban together for a three day period in April, NOT TO BUY ANY GASOLINE, during those three days. LETS HAVE A GAS OUT. Do not buy any gasoline from APRIL 7, 2000, THROUGH APRIL 9, 2000. Buy what you need before the dates listed above, or after, but try not to buy any during the GAS OUT. If you want to help, just sendthis to everyone you know and ask them to do the same.We brought the prices down once before, and we can do it ag ain! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 19:37:33 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from server.baldwin.cx (jobaldwi.campus.vt.edu [198.82.67.146]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DF1237BBE6 for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 19:37:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jhb@FreeBSD.org) Received: from john.baldwin.cx (john [10.0.0.2]) by server.baldwin.cx (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA00441; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 22:37:19 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from jhb@FreeBSD.org) Message-Id: <200003020337.WAA00441@server.baldwin.cx> X-Mailer: XFMail 1.4.0 on FreeBSD X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20000301163531.62DEAD52@snail.stack.nl> Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 22:37:19 -0500 (EST) From: John Baldwin To: (David van Deijk) Subject: RE: FreeBSD-boot Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 01-Mar-00 David van Deijk wrote: > Dear hackers, > > I have encountered Problems using the FBSDBOOT.exe since version > 3.0 3.1 3.2 3.3 3.4. I have looked into the source and could not > find ELF support but only aout. Are you able to tell me wheter this is > because of me or that i am right in this elf-aout thingy . > ThanX in advance. fbsdboot.exe doesn't work anymore, and it never will. DOS screws up too many things while it is booting (interrupt vectors, etc.) for the loader and/or kernel to even have a chance of booting. > Dag dag David. -- John Baldwin -- http://www.FreeBSD.org/~jhb/ PGP Key: http://www.cslab.vt.edu/~jobaldwi/pgpkey.asc "Power Users Use the Power to Serve!" - http://www.FreeBSD.org/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Wed Mar 1 20:34:52 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rapidnet.com (rapidnet.com [205.164.216.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5659037BE4B for ; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 20:34:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jseidel@rapidnet.com) Received: from localhost (jseidel@localhost) by rapidnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA74517; Wed, 1 Mar 2000 21:34:26 -0700 (MST) Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2000 21:34:26 -0700 (MST) From: Jason Seidel To: Warren Welch Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: fdisk / disklabel issues... In-Reply-To: <4.2.1.20000302103756.05601b50@arthur.intraceptives.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Hi all, > > I've got a problem with a couple of machines... The first time I saw the > problem, I thought it was my hardware, but now I've encountered the problem > on three different systems, all with different motherboards, and hard > disks. The only think in common, is that with all of them I'm working with > FreeBSD 3.4, and that all the disks are LARGER than 12Gb IDE's. This is a commom problem. > > One of the things that I notice are that the size of the disk that gets > reported by the BIOS, and FreeBSD are totally different... As an example, > the following system reports:- > > wdc0: unit 0 (wd0): > wd0: 12419MB (25434228 sectors), 25232 cyls, 16 heads, 63 S/T, 512 B/S > > from dmesg > > yet, when I get the system BIOS to probe the disk, it reports:- > 24062 cyls > 16 heads > 63 sects. > > As you can see, FreeBSD recognizes the disk as larger than what it actually > is. I've found that if I partition the disk using the entire disk (fdisk > -e wd0), then the last partition on the disk (the one that uses the last > sectors on the disk) won't be newfs'd... > > It's not at all good. sysinstall also seems to have a problem with > allowing you to set the geometry. I'd expect that if I set the geometry to > what the BIOS detects, and then say to use the entire disk, that it would > use that defined geometry. It doesn't... The moment you say to use the > entire disk, ('A', No), it resets the geometry to something it likes. If I > calculate the number of sectors manually (to what the bios detects), and > then create a slice all things work fine within that slice. Yep.. Seen this happen > > I think there is something wrong with the way that FreeBSD is detecting the > size of the disk. (Interigating the disk that is...) So far I've only had > this problem with IDE disks. I have had a machine that the bios picks up the drive as one thing, the BSD probe picks it up as another, the sysinstall picks that as another. But the one thing that was weird was that the geometry on the drive said another size yet. What you want to do in the sysinstall is pick "A" like you did and choose to use the entire disk like before. Then after that, you want to set the geometry according to what it says on the hard drive. If you don't have that, look it up on the web. This will keep your partition and the new drive geometry. Remember, FreeBSD doesn't care what the bios says > > Warren > wwelch@intraceptives.com.au > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Jason Seidel [Systems Administrator] RapidNet, INC. USA "Oh, Bother," said Pooh as he jseidel@rapidnet.com reached for the reset button. Web Support: http://www.rapidnet.com Local Phone Support#: (605) 341-3283 FAX #: (605) 348-1031 800 Phone Support#: 1-800-763-2525 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 0: 8: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from david.siemens.de (david.siemens.de [192.35.17.14]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA4EE37C1FE for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 00:08:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from andre.albsmeier@mchp.siemens.de) X-Envelope-Sender-Is: andre.albsmeier@mchp.siemens.de (at relayer david.siemens.de) Received: from mail2.siemens.de (mail2.siemens.de [139.25.208.11]) by david.siemens.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA09392 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 09:08:03 +0100 (MET) Received: from curry.mchp.siemens.de (curry.mchp.siemens.de [139.25.42.7]) by mail2.siemens.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA12025 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 09:08:03 +0100 (MET) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by curry.mchp.siemens.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA61126 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 09:08:03 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 09:07:56 +0100 From: Andre Albsmeier To: Andre Albsmeier Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Fix for quotas grace time when using chown and soft limits are hit again Message-ID: <20000302090756.A22135@internal> References: <20000301221956.A10086@internal> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <20000301221956.A10086@internal>; from andre.albsmeier@mchp.siemens.de on Wed, Mar 01, 2000 at 10:19:56PM +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Oops, I don't remember having sent this twice... -Andre On Wed, 01-Mar-2000 at 22:19:56 +0100, Andre Albsmeier wrote: > Here is a problem with FreeBSD's quotas that I have observed > for a long time now but finally found some time to track it down: > > Let's assume the following settings on a quota enabled system: > > soft limits : 100MB > hard limits : 200MB > grace period: 7 days > > ... To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 0:52:16 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from galileo.poli.hu (polinet-gw.poli.hu [195.199.8.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4D1637BF6D for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 00:51:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mauzi@faber.poli.hu) Received: from faber.poli.hu ([195.199.8.29]) by galileo.poli.hu with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1) id 12QRKW-000Ehk-00; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 09:51:32 +0100 Received: from mauzi (helo=localhost) by faber.poli.hu with local-esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 12QRKa-0002Pt-00; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 09:51:36 +0100 Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 09:51:36 +0100 (CET) From: Egervary Gergely To: "Karsten W. Rohrbach" Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: MAXUSERS question, what is max MAXUSERS setting? In-Reply-To: <20000301235531.A89015@rohrbach.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > i just wondered what the maximum MAXUSERS setting for a 3.4 kernel would > be on a smp system with 512mb ram... the impact on the system structures > seems to be very... errrhh... rather complex. > > any ideas? it gives me a warning if i got past 512, but what will happen > then? see conf/param.c to see what it means. I don't thing you need to set it >128, if you have large network traffic, you should increase NMBCLUSTERS, and other VM limits. -- mauzi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 1:25:33 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from goliath.siemens.de (goliath.siemens.de [194.138.37.131]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE6CD37C005 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 01:25:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from andre.albsmeier@mchp.siemens.de) X-Envelope-Sender-Is: andre.albsmeier@mchp.siemens.de (at relayer goliath.siemens.de) Received: from mail2.siemens.de (mail2.siemens.de [139.25.208.11]) by goliath.siemens.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA23504 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:25:22 +0100 (MET) Received: from curry.mchp.siemens.de (curry.mchp.siemens.de [139.25.42.7]) by mail2.siemens.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA26352 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:25:21 +0100 (MET) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by curry.mchp.siemens.de (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA61902 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:25:21 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:25:21 +0100 From: Andre Albsmeier To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Cc: andre.albsmeier@mchp.siemens.de Subject: Re: Fix for quotas grace time when using chown and soft limits are hit again Message-ID: <20000302102521.A23506@internal> References: <20000301221956.A10086@internal> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <20000301221956.A10086@internal>; from andre@internal on Wed, Mar 01, 2000 at 10:19:56PM +0100 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG [follow up to myself...] On Wed, 01-Mar-2000 at 22:19:56 +0100, Andre Albsmeier wrote: > Here is a problem with FreeBSD's quotas that I have observed > for a long time now but finally found some time to track it down: > > Let's assume the following settings on a quota enabled system: > > soft limits : 100MB > hard limits : 200MB > grace period: 7 days > > ... > > --- /sys/ufs/ufs/ufs_quota.c Mon Aug 30 17:56:23 1999 > +++ ufs_quota.c Wed Mar 1 21:27:14 2000 > @@ -163,6 +163,10 @@ > (void) tsleep((caddr_t)dq, PINOD+1, "chkdq2", 0); > } > dq->dq_curblocks += change; > /* check if we hit the soft limits */ > + if (dq->dq_curblocks >= dq->dq_bsoftlimit && dq->dq_bsoftlimit) > /* check if we have been below the soft limits before */ > + if (dq->dq_curblocks - change < dq->dq_bsoftlimit) > /* yes, update the timer */ > + dq->dq_btime = time_second + > + VFSTOUFS(ITOV(ip)->v_mount)->um_btime[i]; > dq->dq_flags |= DQ_MOD; > } > return (0); > @@ -279,6 +283,10 @@ > (void) tsleep((caddr_t)dq, PINOD+1, "chkiq2", 0); > } > dq->dq_curinodes += change; > /* same as above for inodes */ > + if (dq->dq_curinodes >= dq->dq_isoftlimit && dq->dq_isoftlimit) > + if (dq->dq_curinodes - change < dq->dq_isoftlimit) > + dq->dq_itime = time_second + > + VFSTOUFS(ITOV(ip)->v_mount)->um_itime[i]; > dq->dq_flags |= DQ_MOD; > } > return (0); > Couldn't stand waiting any longer so I tried it on a test box and it seems to work :-). However, I am interested in hearing the opinion from the filesystem specialists if the issue: a) is really a bug b) can be fixed (changed) with the above patch properly Thanks to all in advance, -Andre To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 2:12:15 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hermes.research.kpn.com (hermes.research.kpn.com [139.63.192.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6414537B50E for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 02:12:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from K.J.Koster@kpn.com) Received: from l04.research.kpn.com (l04.research.kpn.com [139.63.192.204]) by research.kpn.com (PMDF V5.2-31 #35196) with ESMTP id <01JMK055M3CQ000TLU@research.kpn.com> for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 11:11:55 +0100 Received: by l04.research.kpn.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id <19A077LC>; Thu, 02 Mar 2000 11:11:54 +0100 Content-return: allowed Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 11:11:53 +0100 From: "Koster, K.J." Subject: RE: Great American Gas Out To: 'FreeBSD Hackers mailing list' Message-id: <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452201313909@l04.research.kpn.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Oh, those Americans. :-) Let's see: $1 per gallon in the US. $1.2 per litre in the Netherlands, times 4.5 (or thereabouts) is $5.4 per gallon in the Netherlands. Everyone in the Netherlands drives cars; everyone thinks gas is expensive. This means that the gas prices in the US can go up 440% and people will still drive cars and buy gas (and complain about gas prices, of course). Kees Jan ============================================== You are only young once, but you can stay immature all your life To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 2:29:40 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from vorbis.noc.easynet.net (vorbis.noc.easynet.net [195.40.1.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id C3D2A37BFC2 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 02:29:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from chrisy@vorbis.noc.easynet.net) Received: (qmail 60775 invoked by uid 1943); 2 Mar 2000 10:29:36 -0000 Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:29:36 +0000 From: Chrisy Luke To: zaph0d Cc: Vinod Balakrishnan , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Multipath routing Message-ID: <20000302102935.A60621@flix.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre2i In-Reply-To: Organization: The Flirble Internet Exchange X-URL: http://www.flix.net/ X-FTP: ftp://ftp.flirble.org/ Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG zaph0d wrote (on Feb 21): > I would also be interested in knowing the same, if numbers of people > wanting it make a difference : ) Sorry. FTP site moved machines - someone forgot some files. It's well out of date now anyway, having not worked actively on it for about a year - usual story. Bringing it into -CURRENT wouldn't be difficult - to be honest the hack is blindingly simple, just increases the memory footprint of a table entry by a few more gateway entries and two integers. Interest was patchy before. If that's different, I have no problem picking it up again. Chris. -- == chris@easynet.net, chrisy@flirble.org. +44 20 7900 4444 == Systems Manager for Easynet, a part of Easynet Group PLC. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 9:38:47 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kcmso1.proxy.att.com (kcmso1.att.com [192.128.133.69]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E28137BDAD for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 09:38:43 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from myevmenkin@att.com) Received: from mo3980r1.ems.att.com ([135.38.12.14]) by kcmso1.proxy.att.com (AT&T IPNS/MSO-2.2) with ESMTP id MAA05812 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 12:38:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from njb140bh1.ems.att.com by mo3980r1.ems.att.com (8.8.8+Sun/ATTEMS-1.4.1 sol2) id MAA19880; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 12:34:10 -0500 (EST) Received: by njb140bh1.ems.att.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 12:38:39 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Yevmenkin, Maksim N, CSCIO" To: "'Michael Kyle'" , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: RE: Shell Code... (fwd) Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 12:34:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hello all, in case if still need it :) here is good skeleton for shell code :-) i DO NOT want to put REAL shell code here. just do ``x/32bx main'' and you will see what you want. :) i'm too lazy to write in assebmler and hate AT&T syntax :) <-------------------------- cut here -------------------------------------> char *cmd = "/bin/sh"; char *arg[] = { "sh", 0 }; void main(void) { /* execve(cmd, argv, env) */ /* pass ``env'' == NULL */ __asm__("xorl %eax,%eax\n"); __asm__("push %eax"); /* pass ``argv[]'' */ __asm__("push $arg\n"); /* pass ``cmd'' */ __asm__("movl $cmd,%edx\n"); __asm__("movl (%edx),%eax\n"); __asm__("push %eax\n"); /* simulate ``libc call '' */ __asm__("push %ecx\n"); /* system call */ __asm__("xorl %eax,%eax\n"); __asm__("movb $0x3b,%al\n"); __asm__("int $0x80\n"); } <------------------------- end cut ----------------------> thanks emax To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 9:49:35 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tinker.com (troll.tinker.com [204.214.7.146]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD41337BDAD for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 09:49:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kim@tinker.com) Received: by localhost (8.8.5/8.8.5) Received: by mail.tinker.com via smap (V2.0) id xma023237; Thu Mar 2 11:48:10 2000 Received: by localhost (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA23987 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 11:52:22 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <38BEA963.DDB0EEC8@tinker.com> Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 11:48:19 -0600 From: Kim Shrier Organization: Shrier and Deihl X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.2-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: disk errors Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I appologize for cross posting this but I haven't recieved any response from freebsd-questions and I need to figure something out soon. --- I am having some trouble with one of my SCSI disks and I am trying to figure out if the problem is the drive or the controller card. The system in question has crashed 4 times in the past year and it never logged anything suspicious until today. Right before the crash, these messages showed up in the log: Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): data overrun detected in Data-Out phase. Tag == 0x4e. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): Have seen Data Phase. Length = 8192. NumSGs = 2. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: sg[0] - Addr 0x4926000 : Length 4096 Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: == 0x4e. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): Have seen Data Phase. Length = 8192. NumSGs = 2. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: sg[0] - Addr 0x4926000 : Length 4096 Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): data overrun detected in Data-Out phase. Tag == 0x4e. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): Have seen Data Phase. Length = 8192. NumSGs = 2. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: sg[0] - Addr 0x4926000 : Length 4096 The machine has an Adaptec 3940uw SCSI controller card and 3 Seagate ST34573W barracuda drives, 2 on the first channel and 1 on the second. The drive giving me the problem is the first drive on the first channel. What I am trying to figure out is if the problem is in the drive or the controller card. Following are the boot messages for the hardware in question: Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: ahc0: rev 0x03 int a irq 11 on pci0.15.0 Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: ahc0: aic7895 Wide Channel A, SCSI Id=7, 255 SCBs Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: ahc1: rev 0x03 int b irq 12 on pci0.15.1 Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: ahc1: aic7895 Wide Channel B, SCSI Id=7, 255 SCBs ... Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: Waiting 5 seconds for SCSI devices to settle Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: changing root device to da0s1a Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da2 at ahc1 bus 0 target 2 lun 0 Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da2: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da2: 20.000MB/s transfers (10.000MHz, offset 8, 16bit), Tagged Queueing Enabled Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da2: 4340MB (8888924 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 553C) Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da0 at ahc0 bus 0 target 0 lun 0 Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da0: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da0: 20.000MB/s transfers (10.000MHz, offset 8, 16bit), Tagged Queueing Enabled Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da0: 4340MB (8888924 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 553C) Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da1 at ahc0 bus 0 target 1 lun 0 Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da1: Fixed Direct Access SCSI-2 device Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da1: 20.000MB/s transfers (10.000MHz, offset 8, 16bit), Tagged Queueing Enabled Mar 1 18:48:53 hrothgar /kernel: da1: 4340MB (8888924 512 byte sectors: 255H 6Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): data overrun detected in Data-Out phase. Tag == 0x4e. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): Have seen Data Phase. Length = 8192. NumSGs = 2. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: sg[0] - Addr 0x4926000 : Length 4096 Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: == 0x4e. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): Have seen Data Phase. Length = 8192. NumSGs = 2. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: sg[0] - Addr 0x4926000 : Length 4096 Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): data overrun detected in Data-Out phase. Tag == 0x4e. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): Have seen Data Phase. Length = 8192. NumSGs = 2. Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: sg[0] - Addr 0x4926000 : Length 40963S/T 553C) Kim Shrier -- Kim Shrier - principal, Shrier and Deihl - mailto:kim@tinker.com Remote Unix Network Admin, Security, Internet Software Development Tinker Internet Services - Superior FreeBSD-based Web Hosting http://www.tinker.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 10:10:11 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kronos.alcnet.com (kronos.alcnet.com [63.69.28.22]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A86AF37C459 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:10:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kbyanc@posi.net) X-Provider: ALC Communications, Inc. http://www.alcnet.com/ Received: from localhost (kbyanc@localhost) by kronos.alcnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3/antispam) with ESMTP id NAA95671; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 13:09:43 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 13:09:43 -0500 (EST) From: Kelly Yancey X-Sender: kbyanc@kronos.alcnet.com To: Kim Shrier Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: disk errors In-Reply-To: <38BEA963.DDB0EEC8@tinker.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 2 Mar 2000, Kim Shrier wrote: [snip common complaint about -questions lacking answers] > > I am having some trouble with one of my SCSI disks and I am trying to > figure out if the problem is the drive or the controller card. The > system in question has crashed 4 times in the past year and it never > logged anything suspicious until today. Right before the crash, these > messages showed up in the log: > > Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): data overrun detected in > Data-Out phase. Tag == 0x4e. > Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): Have seen Data Phase. > Length = 8192. NumSGs = 2. > Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: sg[0] - Addr 0x4926000 : Length 4096 > Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: == 0x4e. > Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): Have seen Data Phase. > Length = 8192. NumSGs = 2. > Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: sg[0] - Addr 0x4926000 : Length 4096 > Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): data overrun detected in > Data-Out phase. Tag == 0x4e. > Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: (da0:ahc0:0:0:0): Have seen Data Phase. > Length = 8192. NumSGs = 2. > Mar 1 15:50:06 hrothgar /kernel: sg[0] - Addr 0x4926000 : Length 4096 > > > > The machine has an Adaptec 3940uw SCSI controller card and 3 Seagate > ST34573W barracuda drives, 2 on the first channel and 1 on the second. > The drive giving me the problem is the first drive on the first > channel. What I am trying to figure out is if the problem is in the > drive or the controller card. Following are the boot messages for the > hardware in question: > > I used to see these exact same messages when drives overheated. Since you are only getting the errors on the one drive, check if it isn't as well ventalated as the others (or maybe it is on top of the stack of drives in your tower?). Kelly -- Kelly Yancey - kbyanc@posi.net - Richmond, VA Analyst / E-business Development, Bell Industries http://www.bellind.com/ Maintainer, BSD Driver Database http://www.posi.net/freebsd/drivers/ Coordinator, Team FreeBSD http://www.posi.net/freebsd/Team-FreeBSD/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 10:23: 3 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tinker.com (troll.tinker.com [204.214.7.146]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01F1E37B53F for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:22:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kim@tinker.com) Received: by localhost (8.8.5/8.8.5) Received: by mail.tinker.com via smap (V2.0) id xma023490; Thu Mar 2 12:20:48 2000 Received: by localhost (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA00655; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 12:24:50 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <38BEB100.612F23D2@tinker.com> Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 12:20:48 -0600 From: Kim Shrier Organization: Shrier and Deihl X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.2-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Kelly Yancey Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: disk errors References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Kelly Yancey wrote: > > I used to see these exact same messages when drives overheated. Since > you are only getting the errors on the one drive, check if it isn't as > well ventalated as the others (or maybe it is on top of the stack of > drives in your tower?). > Thanks for your prompt reply. Yes, the drive is the top one in the tower. Also, there have been some issues with the air-conditioning in the rack space. I am in the process of going to a better enclosure with more cooling fans. Kim -- Kim Shrier - principal, Shrier and Deihl - mailto:kim@tinker.com Remote Unix Network Admin, Security, Internet Software Development Tinker Internet Services - Superior FreeBSD-based Web Hosting http://www.tinker.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 10:39: 7 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pop-c.netway.at (pop-c.netway.at [195.96.0.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08F5B37C34A for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 10:39:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Christian.Gusenbauer@netway.at) Received: from pop-d.netway.at (pop-d.netway.at [195.96.0.131]) by pop-c.netway.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA26394; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 19:39:00 +0100 Received: from bones.my.domain (t2p034.at-732.netway.at [212.27.73.34]) by pop-d.netway.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id e22Icw915743; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 19:38:58 +0100 From: Christian Gusenbauer Reply-To: Christian.Gusenbauer@netway.at To: davidd@stack.nl Subject: Re: FreeBSD-boot Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 19:10:27 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-Type: text/plain Cc: hackers@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <00030219400601.00224@bones.my.domain> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi David! I'm sorry for you, but FBSDBOOT will never support ELF binaries :-(! As developer of this utility I had a discussion about supporting ELF when ELF was introduced into FreeBSD. The reason, why ELF support was not integrated is, that the new boot loader and the kernel rely on the state of the hardware, BIOS and BIOS extensions. Since booting DOS modifies the lower memory and hardware settings (eg. sets registers, or modifies interrupt vectors) this state will not exist, when you start FBSDBOOT. FBSDBOOT itself *can not* restore this state and therefore fails to start up the ELF binary (loader and/or kernel). Of course, there is a well known address in the BIOS, where the original interrupt descriptor table is located, but restoring this table is not enough. You also have to re-initialise the various devices (eg. Adaptec Controller). But you can't control the behaviour of the BIOS init routines; eg. the Adaptec BIOS clears the lower memory and thus the FBSDBOOT code :-(! I'm sorry, but I think FBSDBOOT is died with aout :-(! Ciao, Christian. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 14:54:25 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cube.gelatinous.com (cube.gelatinous.com [207.82.194.150]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id DAD0A37B76B for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 14:54:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from aaron@gelatinous.com) Received: (qmail 49110 invoked by uid 1000); 2 Mar 2000 22:54:22 -0000 Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 14:54:22 -0800 From: Aaron Smith To: Ben Rosengart Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: locked accounts and adduser Message-ID: <20000302145422.C7995@gelatinous.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: ; from ben@skunk.org on Tue, Jan 18, 2000 at 05:14:26PM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Tue, Jan 18, 2000 at 05:14:26PM -0500, Ben Rosengart wrote: > I thought it would be nice if one could create locked accounts with > adduser. So I asked my nice Perl-hacking coworker Evan Leon to come up > with a patch. > > Enter password []: > Use an empty password or lock the password? lock no [yes]: lock > > ... > > # grep user /etc/master.passwd > user:*:1001:1001::0:0:Joe User:/home/user:/bin/sh > > The patch is attached. Anyone like it? Any chance it could be i like this. i hope it gets committed; i would definitely use it. did any committers pick this up? > Another idea I have is to allow adduser to accept a hashed password > instead of a plaintext one. Perhaps if this goes over well, Evan and I > will work on that next. i'd find this useful as well. aaron To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 16:33:26 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cube.gelatinous.com (cube.gelatinous.com [207.82.194.150]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 7F8F837B5F1 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 16:33:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from aaron@gelatinous.com) Received: (qmail 50245 invoked by uid 1000); 3 Mar 2000 00:33:18 -0000 Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 16:33:18 -0800 From: Aaron Smith To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: user-space filesystems Message-ID: <20000302163318.F7995@gelatinous.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hello, i've done some searching and i've seen discussion of userland fs before. has there been any progress in the user-space filesystem area? i have a nifty project and i would like to avoid using loopback NFS; have we got anything akin to linux's userfs yet? if freebsd doesn't have this capability, where would a good place to start be on loopback NFS? maybe somebody has a loopback NFS skeleton i can start from? any pointers/discussion would be helpful. aaron here's one of the messages that made me say "yeah, like that!": > Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 14:57:45 -0400 > From: "David E. Cross" > To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org > Subject: USFS (User Space File System) > Message-ID: <199907171857.OAA81681@cs.rpi.edu> > > I am looking at a project that will require a user based process to > interact with the system as if it were a filesystem. The traditional way I > have seen this done is as the system NFS mounting itself (ala AMD). I > would really like a more clean approach to this. What I am interested in > is a 'User Space File System' that would interact with a user process in a > similiar manor to how nfsd's do. A process would issue a mount (ok, this > is different than NFSDs), then it would make a special system call with a > structure, that call would return whenever a request was pending with the > structure filled in with the appropriate information. The user process > would fulfill the request, pack the return data into the structure and call > kernel again. > > I have a number of questions on more specific ideas (like caching, > inode/vnode interaction, etc). But I am just feeling arround for what > people think about this. Any ideas/comments? To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 17: 0: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from po4.wam.umd.edu (po4.wam.umd.edu [128.8.10.166]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EE2337B69F for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 17:00:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from howardjp@wam.umd.edu) Received: from rac4.wam.umd.edu (root@rac4.wam.umd.edu [128.8.10.144]) by po4.wam.umd.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA11400 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 19:59:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from rac4.wam.umd.edu (sendmail@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rac4.wam.umd.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA29572 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 19:59:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from rac4.wam.umd.edu (howardjp@localhost) by rac4.wam.umd.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA29567 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 19:59:45 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200003030059.TAA29567@rac4.wam.umd.edu> X-Authentication-Warning: rac4.wam.umd.edu: howardjp owned process doing -bs To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Keeping using locally modified source Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 19:59:39 -0500 From: James Howard Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At a site I am working at, we need to be able to limit which users can bind a socket to an address under IPv4. Basically, bind() needs to check the caller's groups and if you are one of several allowable groups, let it pass, otherwise, error out. Now, I glanced over the bind() code and it does not look that difficult. The problem is how do we keep up with -STABLE afterwards? Using CVSup, out changes will get clobbered every time. Is there a facility where you can keep up with the source but let local modifications through? Jamie To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 17:20:21 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from orion.ac.hmc.edu (Orion.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9B2D37B587 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 17:20:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brdavis@orion.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by orion.ac.hmc.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA24014; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 17:16:52 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 17:16:52 -0800 From: Brooks Davis To: James Howard Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Keeping using locally modified source Message-ID: <20000302171652.A22288@orion.ac.hmc.edu> References: <200003030059.TAA29567@rac4.wam.umd.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre4i In-Reply-To: <200003030059.TAA29567@rac4.wam.umd.edu>; from howardjp@wam.umd.edu on Thu, Mar 02, 2000 at 07:59:39PM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, Mar 02, 2000 at 07:59:39PM -0500, James Howard wrote: > At a site I am working at, we need to be able to limit which users can > bind a socket to an address under IPv4. Basically, bind() needs to check > the caller's groups and if you are one of several allowable groups, let it > pass, otherwise, error out. > > Now, I glanced over the bind() code and it does not look that > difficult. The problem is how do we keep up with -STABLE > afterwards? Using CVSup, out changes will get clobbered every time. Is > there a facility where you can keep up with the source but let local > modifications through? Yup, just use cvsup to maintain an up to date copy of the repository localy and then cvs checkout your source tree from there. This allows you to keep in sync and keep local modifications in your tree. Updates take longer and I recommend updating ports via direct cvsup instead of via cvs checkout (it's much faster if you aren't modifying ports), but it works quite well. -- Brooks -- Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 17:38: 4 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from smtp02.teb1.iconnet.net (smtp02.teb1.iconnet.net [209.3.218.43]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C859537BAD2 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 17:38:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from babkin@bellatlantic.net) Received: from bellatlantic.net (client-117-235.bellatlantic.net [151.198.117.235]) by smtp02.teb1.iconnet.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id UAA04200; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 20:37:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <38BF1959.881B5538@bellatlantic.net> Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 20:46:01 -0500 From: Sergey Babkin X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.0-19990626-CURRENT i386) X-Accept-Language: ru, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Christian.Gusenbauer@netway.at Cc: davidd@stack.nl, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD-boot References: <00030219400601.00224@bones.my.domain> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Christian Gusenbauer wrote: > > Hi David! > > I'm sorry for you, but FBSDBOOT will never support ELF binaries :-(! As > developer of this utility I had a discussion about supporting ELF when ELF was > introduced into FreeBSD. The reason, why ELF support was not integrated is, that > the new boot loader and the kernel rely on the state of the hardware, BIOS > and BIOS extensions. Sorry for a stupid question but how was it able to boot with aout ? I think FBSDBOOT never worked after HIMEM.SYS and things like it were loaded, it always required a clear plain DOS to work. So maybe there is a chance that it can be adapted for ELF when started from a plain DOS ? > Since booting DOS modifies the lower memory and hardware settings (eg. sets > registers, or modifies interrupt vectors) this state will not exist, when you > start FBSDBOOT. FBSDBOOT itself *can not* restore this state and therefore > fails to start up the ELF binary (loader and/or kernel). How about loading the kernel starting at 1MB and leaving the memory under 1MB unused ? Then you won't even have to restore the interrupt vectors: as long as DOS is left in its place all the interrupts should not get broken. > Of course, there is a well known address in the BIOS, where the original > interrupt descriptor table is located, but restoring this table is not enough. > You also have to re-initialise the various devices (eg. Adaptec Controller). But I wonder why would you have to do that ? I guess this would be needed only after the ASPI driver was loaded. But if it was not then DOS just blindly calls the BIOS. And I guess for the boot code there shoul be no difference whether this is IDE BIOS or Adaptec BIOS. Well, maybe nowadays when the plain DOS is almost completely displaced by Windows 9x maybe future work on FBSDBOOT is not worth the effort in any case. -SB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 17:45:53 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [216.240.41.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A5BD37BD7B for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 17:45:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id RAA04414; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 17:45:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 17:45:44 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <200003030145.RAA04414@apollo.backplane.com> To: Aaron Smith Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: user-space filesystems References: <20000302163318.F7995@gelatinous.com> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :hello, : :i've done some searching and i've seen discussion of userland fs :before. has there been any progress in the user-space filesystem area? i :have a nifty project and i would like to avoid using loopback NFS; have we :got anything akin to linux's userfs yet? : :if freebsd doesn't have this capability, where would a good place to start :be on loopback NFS? maybe somebody has a loopback NFS skeleton i can start :from? : :any pointers/discussion would be helpful. : :aaron : :here's one of the messages that made me say "yeah, like that!": : :> Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 14:57:45 -0400 :> From: "David E. Cross" :> To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org :> Subject: USFS (User Space File System) :> Message-ID: <199907171857.OAA81681@cs.rpi.edu> :> :> I am looking at a project that will require a user based process to :> interact with the system as if it were a filesystem. The traditional way I :> have seen this done is as the system NFS mounting itself (ala AMD). I :> would really like a more clean approach to this. What I am interested in :... :> :> I have a number of questions on more specific ideas (like caching, :> inode/vnode interaction, etc). But I am just feeling arround for what :> people think about this. Any ideas/comments? It would take a lot of work to be able to do this and make it secure and safe. Essentially the VOP_ calls would have to be turned into userland messages or RPCs, and the kernel would have to audit the entire contents of the response as well as implement timeouts and deal with other issues such as when the userspace fs process seg faults or is killed. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 18:33:22 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from penelope.skunk.org (penelope.skunk.org [208.133.204.51]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8E9837B52E for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 18:33:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from ben@penelope.skunk.org) Received: from localhost (ben@localhost) by penelope.skunk.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id VAA32449; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 21:48:35 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2000 21:48:35 -0500 (EST) From: Ben Rosengart To: Aaron Smith Cc: Evan Leon , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: locked accounts and adduser In-Reply-To: <20000302145422.C7995@gelatinous.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 2 Mar 2000, Aaron Smith wrote: > On Tue, Jan 18, 2000 at 05:14:26PM -0500, Ben Rosengart wrote: > > I thought it would be nice if one could create locked accounts with > > adduser. So I asked my nice Perl-hacking coworker Evan Leon to come up > > with a patch. > > i like this. i hope it gets committed; i would definitely use it. > did any committers pick this up? I emailed Wolfram Schneider about it and he implied that he would commit it after the code freeze is over. If you want to help, the man page needs an appropriate patch. ;-) Or if not, Evan or I will take care of it. -- Ben Rosengart UNIX Systems Engineer, Skunk Group StarMedia Network, Inc. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Thu Mar 2 21:15:43 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from arthur.intraceptives.com.au (arthur.intraceptives.com.au [203.22.72.70]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 94CA137BF55 for ; Thu, 2 Mar 2000 21:15:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wwlists@intraceptives.com.au) Received: (qmail 30320 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2000 05:15:35 -0000 Received: from wks-pc1.intraceptives.com.au (HELO waddy) (203.22.72.32) by arthur.intraceptives.com.au with SMTP; 3 Mar 2000 05:15:35 -0000 Message-Id: <4.2.1.20000303161402.060f6260@arthur.intraceptives.com.au> X-Sender: wwlists@arthur.intraceptives.com.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.1 Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 16:15:34 +1100 To: Jason Seidel From: Warren Welch Subject: Re: fdisk / disklabel issues... Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-Reply-To: References: <4.2.1.20000302103756.05601b50@arthur.intraceptives.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 09:34 PM 3/1/00 -0700, Jason Seidel wrote: >I have had a machine that the bios picks up the drive as one thing, the >BSD probe picks it up as another, the sysinstall picks that as another. >But the one thing that was weird was that the geometry on the drive said >another size yet. MMmmm... Yes, I've see this too! >What you want to do in the sysinstall is pick "A" like you did and choose >to use the entire disk like before. Then after that, you want to set the >geometry according to what it says on the hard drive. If you don't have >that, look it up on the web. This will keep your partition and the new >drive geometry. Yeah... Is there a way to do this from the command line??? >Remember, FreeBSD doesn't care what the bios says Yep... Even so, one would expect that they detect it the same way! W. wwelch@intraceptives.com.au To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 0:45:15 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hermes.research.kpn.com (hermes.research.kpn.com [139.63.192.8]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFB5A37B629 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 00:45:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from K.J.Koster@kpn.com) Received: from l04.research.kpn.com (l04.research.kpn.com [139.63.192.204]) by research.kpn.com (PMDF V5.2-31 #35196) with ESMTP id <01JMLBDVT9XI000RWC@research.kpn.com> for freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 09:45:05 +0100 Received: by l04.research.kpn.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id <19A08CW1>; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 09:45:05 +0100 Content-return: allowed Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 09:45:04 +0100 From: "Koster, K.J." Subject: RE: Keeping using locally modified source To: 'FreeBSD Hackers mailing list' Message-id: <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E45220131391E@l04.research.kpn.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > > The problem is how do we keep up with -STABLE > > afterwards? Using CVSup, out changes will get clobbered > every time. Is > > there a facility where you can keep up with the source but let local > > modifications through? > > Yup, just use cvsup to maintain an up to date copy of the repository > localy and then cvs checkout your source tree from there. This allows > you to keep in sync and keep local modifications in your > tree. Updates > take longer and I recommend updating ports via direct cvsup instead of > via cvs checkout (it's much faster if you aren't modifying ports), but > it works quite well. > Ugh. That's a bit heavy, don't you think? How about diffing your modifications into a patch file and apply the patch every time between "make update" and "make world". Practical upshot is that if you'd like to commit that work, you can just send the diffs. :-) Kees Jan ============================================== You are only young once, but you can stay immature all your life To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 2:39:31 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from assaris.sics.se (assaris.sics.se [193.10.66.234]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 410C337B56B for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 02:39:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from assar@assaris.sics.se) Received: (from assar@localhost) by assaris.sics.se (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA01008; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 11:39:26 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from assar) To: Aaron Smith Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: user-space filesystems References: <20000302163318.F7995@gelatinous.com> From: Assar Westerlund Date: 03 Mar 2000 11:39:26 +0100 In-Reply-To: Aaron Smith's message of "Thu, 2 Mar 2000 16:33:18 -0800" Message-ID: <5lem9s8hi9.fsf@assaris.sics.se> Lines: 29 User-Agent: Gnus/5.070098 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.98) Emacs/20.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Aaron Smith writes: > i've done some searching and i've seen discussion of userland fs > before. has there been any progress in the user-space filesystem area? i > have a nifty project and i would like to avoid using loopback NFS; have we > got anything akin to linux's userfs yet? (As far as I know, userfs in linux is quite bit rotten.) But I think there are two different user-space filesystems for FreeBSD right now: vcoda used by the coda file system. See LINT for enabling it and then the code in /sys/coda xfs used by the arla (afs implementation) file system. Grab code from . There's a port of arla but it's outdated and does not work anymore. See PR 17036. Or just grab the distribution - it builds without problems. These two filesystems are quite similar and of course targeted to the needs of the file systems that use them, but they are useful for other file systems as well. I know that there are other file systems using xfs for implementation ease. Hope this is helpful and send me some more questions if you have any. /assar To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 2:48: 0 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from assaris.sics.se (assaris.sics.se [193.10.66.234]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F25137B95E for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 02:47:57 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from assar@assaris.sics.se) Received: (from assar@localhost) by assaris.sics.se (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA01076; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 11:47:55 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from assar) To: Brooks Davis Cc: James Howard , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Keeping using locally modified source References: <200003030059.TAA29567@rac4.wam.umd.edu> <20000302171652.A22288@orion.ac.hmc.edu> From: Assar Westerlund Date: 03 Mar 2000 11:47:55 +0100 In-Reply-To: Brooks Davis's message of "Thu, 2 Mar 2000 17:16:52 -0800" Message-ID: <5laekg8h44.fsf@assaris.sics.se> Lines: 13 User-Agent: Gnus/5.070098 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.98) Emacs/20.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Brooks Davis writes: > Yup, just use cvsup to maintain an up to date copy of the repository > localy and then cvs checkout your source tree from there. This allows > you to keep in sync and keep local modifications in your tree. Updates > take longer and I recommend updating ports via direct cvsup instead of > via cvs checkout (it's much faster if you aren't modifying ports), but > it works quite well. There's even a hack in FreeBSD cvs and cvsup to allow you to keep a `local' branch that's not clobbered by cvsup, namely the environment variable CVS_LOCAL_BRANCH_NUM. /assar To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 3: 2:50 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com [207.113.159.21]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1319037B5DD for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 03:02:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from imap.gv.tsc.tdk.com (imap.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.198]) by gatekeeper.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id DAA18933; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 03:02:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gdonl@tsc.tdk.com) Received: from salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com [192.168.241.194]) by imap.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id DAA26825; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 03:02:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Don.Lewis@tsc.tdk.com) Received: (from gdonl@localhost) by salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA09390; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 03:02:41 -0800 (PST) From: Don Lewis Message-Id: <200003031102.DAA09390@salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com> Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 03:02:41 -0800 In-Reply-To: <5laekg8h44.fsf@assaris.sics.se> References: <200003030059.TAA29567@rac4.wam.umd.edu> <20000302171652.A22288@orion.ac.hmc.edu> <5laekg8h44.fsf@assaris.sics.se> X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 beta(5) 10/07/98) To: Assar Westerlund Subject: Re: Keeping using locally modified source Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mar 3, 11:47am, Assar Westerlund wrote: } Subject: Re: Keeping using locally modified source } There's even a hack in FreeBSD cvs and cvsup to allow you to keep a } `local' branch that's not clobbered by cvsup, namely the environment } variable CVS_LOCAL_BRANCH_NUM. I thought about using this, but it doesn't appear to be easy to track changes to an official branch. I was looking for something that would be as easy tracking changes made by infrequent imports on the vendor branch. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 4:40:38 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from assaris.sics.se (assaris.sics.se [193.10.66.234]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA7FC37BE1E for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 04:40:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from assar@assaris.sics.se) Received: (from assar@localhost) by assaris.sics.se (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA01187; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 13:40:31 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from assar) To: Don Lewis Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Keeping using locally modified source References: <200003030059.TAA29567@rac4.wam.umd.edu> <20000302171652.A22288@orion.ac.hmc.edu> <5laekg8h44.fsf@assaris.sics.se> <200003031102.DAA09390@salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com> From: Assar Westerlund Date: 03 Mar 2000 13:40:31 +0100 In-Reply-To: Don Lewis's message of "Fri, 3 Mar 2000 03:02:41 -0800" Message-ID: <5lk8jk6xc0.fsf@assaris.sics.se> Lines: 11 User-Agent: Gnus/5.070098 (Pterodactyl Gnus v0.98) Emacs/20.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Don Lewis writes: > I thought about using this, but it doesn't appear to be easy to track > changes to an official branch. I was looking for something that would > be as easy tracking changes made by infrequent imports on the vendor > branch. No, it's just a hack. Having hierarchical repositories would seem to be the right way of attacking this but I don't know of any effort of trying to fit that into CVS. /assar To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 7: 9:30 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pop-c.netway.at (pop-c.netway.at [195.96.0.132]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B6EC37B613 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 07:09:26 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Christian.Gusenbauer@netway.at) Received: from pop-d.netway.at (pop-d.netway.at [195.96.0.131]) by pop-c.netway.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA26603; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:09:21 +0100 Received: from bones.my.domain (t2p055.at-732.netway.at [212.27.73.55]) by pop-d.netway.at (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id e23F9IY18506; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:09:18 +0100 From: Christian Gusenbauer Reply-To: Christian.Gusenbauer@netway.at To: Sergey Babkin Subject: Re: FreeBSD-boot Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:46:33 +0100 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.0.28] Content-Type: text/plain References: <00030219400601.00224@bones.my.domain> <38BF1959.881B5538@bellatlantic.net> In-Reply-To: <38BF1959.881B5538@bellatlantic.net> Cc: davidd@stack.nl, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <00030316102700.00228@bones.my.domain> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi Sergey! I think you wrote on Fr , 03 Mär 2000: > Christian Gusenbauer wrote: > > > > Hi David! > > > > I'm sorry for you, but FBSDBOOT will never support ELF binaries :-(! As > > developer of this utility I had a discussion about supporting ELF when ELF was > > introduced into FreeBSD. The reason, why ELF support was not integrated is, that > > the new boot loader and the kernel rely on the state of the hardware, BIOS > > and BIOS extensions. > > Sorry for a stupid question but how was it able > to boot with aout ? I think FBSDBOOT never worked > after HIMEM.SYS and things like it were loaded, > it always required a clear plain DOS to work. No, that's not a stupid question - it's a kind of question I was waiting for ;-)! FBSDBOOT *did* work with memory managers like himem or 386max. It even worked (sometimes) when called within Windows 3.1x (have a look at winboot in the experimental directory)! You did not need a clean DOS boot. The old aout kernel never relied on the memory layout. So it was possible for me, to load the kernel and execute it. Just load the kernel at 1 MB and start it - that's it! > So maybe there is a chance that it can be > adapted for ELF when started from a plain DOS ? No, because booting DOS is the reason, why the new FreeBSD boot loader and/or kernel can't be executed! They both assume, that they were started from the BIOS using the INT 19h. And that's it. When you boot DOS or an other OS, this assumption is no longer valid and booting FreeBSD fails. > > Since booting DOS modifies the lower memory and hardware settings (eg. sets > > registers, or modifies interrupt vectors) this state will not exist, when you > > start FBSDBOOT. FBSDBOOT itself *can not* restore this state and therefore > > fails to start up the ELF binary (loader and/or kernel). > > How about loading the kernel starting at 1MB > and leaving the memory under 1MB unused ? > Then you won't even have to restore the interrupt > vectors: as long as DOS is left in its place all the > interrupts should not get broken. Yes, you're right. That is the same opinion I had, when I started playing with ELF support for FBSDBOOT. But you really need a clean DOS boot (ie. no drivers loaded, no TSRs loaded etc.) and then perhaps it's possible to boot FreeBSD. I have a FBSDBOOT version, which loads ELF binaries. I tested various kernel configurations and found out, that some kernels booted and some did not. Especially using the VM86 option prevents the kernel from booting, even if you booted a "clean" DOS. > > Of course, there is a well known address in the BIOS, where the original > > interrupt descriptor table is located, but restoring this table is not enough. > > You also have to re-initialise the various devices (eg. Adaptec Controller). But > > I wonder why would you have to do that ? I guess > this would be needed only after the ASPI driver was > loaded. But if it was not then DOS just blindly calls > the BIOS. And I guess for the boot code there > shoul be no difference whether this is IDE > BIOS or Adaptec BIOS. Because I wanted to recreate the memory as it was when the BIOS finished the initialisation phase and called the INT 19h interrupt to boot an OS. The first step was to restore the interrupt descriptor table. This step was quite easy ;-). Then I had to call the BIOS extensions to initialise themself, because some of them want to modify the interrupt table. Unfortunately, the Adaptec BIOS init routine clears the low memory ... > Well, maybe nowadays when the plain DOS is almost > completely displaced by Windows 9x maybe future > work on FBSDBOOT is not worth the effort in any > case. > > -SB Yes, that's my opinion, too. It's a kind of sisyphean task. You solve one problem and get two new problems for free ;-)! Ciao, Christian. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 8:48:26 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (obie.softweyr.com [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A23A37B615 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 08:48:19 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (wes@homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA00229; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 09:48:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 09:56:08 -0700 From: Wes Peters Reply-To: chat@FreeBSD.ORG Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.3-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Koster, K.J." Cc: "'FreeBSD Hackers mailing list'" Subject: Re: Great American Gas Out References: <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452201313909@l04.research.kpn.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG "Koster, K.J." wrote: > > Oh, those Americans. :-) > > Let's see: $1 per gallon in the US. $1.2 per litre in the Netherlands, times > 4.5 (or thereabouts) is $5.4 per gallon in the Netherlands. > > Everyone in the Netherlands drives cars; everyone thinks gas is expensive. > This means that the gas prices in the US can go up 440% and people will > still drive cars and buy gas (and complain about gas prices, of course). First, this off-topic for -hackers, so I've directed replies to -chat if you want to continue. Second, I know people that commute distances that would cross your country. I suspect the average American uses a lot more gas than the average Nederlander. Third, our gas prices here are held down by all sorts of weird government intervention, bizarre market shenanigans, and a public that doesn't understand that the price of gasoline has risen only 4x in the same period that the price of cars has risen 10x. That's certainly NOT a "natural occurence". Fourth, I'm paying $1.48/gal right now, and I want the price to go DOWN, not UP. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC wes@softweyr.com http://softweyr.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 9:24:40 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bubba.whistle.com (bubba.whistle.com [207.76.205.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5B9D37B5BE; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 09:24:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from archie@whistle.com) Received: (from archie@localhost) by bubba.whistle.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id JAA08549; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 09:24:34 -0800 (PST) From: Archie Cobbs Message-Id: <200003031724.JAA08549@bubba.whistle.com> Subject: Netgraph article To: freebsd-net@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 09:24:34 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG For anyone interested in reading about netgraph(4), including technical information about developing your own node types, etc., here is an article that I wrote for this month's Daemon News 'blueprints' column.. http://www.daemonnews.org/200003/netgraph.html -Archie ___________________________________________________________________________ Archie Cobbs * Whistle Communications, Inc. * http://www.whistle.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 10:39:24 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.nyct.net (bsd4.nyct.net [204.141.86.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B885337B658 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 10:39:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mbac@nyct.net) Received: from bsd1.nyct.net (mbac@bsd1.nyct.net [204.141.86.3]) by mail.nyct.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA21064 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 13:39:19 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from mbac@nyct.net) Received: from localhost (mbac@localhost) by bsd1.nyct.net (8.8.8/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA01214 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 13:39:18 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from mbac@nyct.net) X-Authentication-Warning: bsd1.nyct.net: mbac owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 13:39:18 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Bacarella To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Copy-on-write filesystem Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Upon reading of Microsoft's fabulous innovations in the filesystem arena, I started playing with some ideas of my own (not to be confused with ORIGINAL ideas) Can someone tell me why copy-on-write filesystems would be bad? Imagine: cp file file2, file and file2 reference the same exact blocks, but modified chunks of file2 would be given their own private blocks. This probably won't fit into current filesystems, but is it a sane idea worth pursuing in a new filesystem? I performed an analysis on a non-production server and determined that about 66 megs of a typical FreeBSD install is duplicate files (and yes, I ignored hard links and symlinks and non-regular files). This was on a system without a ports tree, also. I think the benefits would be sexy. Copies are closer to instant. More cache hits. Space benefits. Copying /etc/skel to a user's home directory won't take up any blocks at all unless users edit their files, which, if you're an ISP, you know that 95% of users don't do anyway. There's probably a stockpile of drawbacks to this as well. Fire away. /* ---------- Michael Bacarella( mbac@nyct.net ) | (212) 293-2620 Administration / Development / Support | http://nyct.net/ [ N e w Y o r k C o n n e c t . N E T ] | info@nyct.net Bringing New York The Internet Service It Deserves! --------- */ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 10:42:56 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from acl.lanl.gov (acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7486937C029 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 10:42:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from rminnich@lanl.gov) Received: from mini.acl.lanl.gov (root@mini.acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.34]) by acl.lanl.gov (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA378078 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 11:42:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from localhost (rminnich@localhost) by mini.acl.lanl.gov (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA01485 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 11:42:43 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: mini.acl.lanl.gov: rminnich owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 11:42:43 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" X-Sender: rminnich@mini.acl.lanl.gov To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 3 Mar 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > Can someone tell me why copy-on-write filesystems would be bad? It's a good idea. Peter Braam and I have written a device (called memdev) for linux (sorry!) that implements a virtual-memory-backed copy-on-write block device (like the loopback device, but uses anon vm pages for store). It's pretty interesting. It's quite fast, and copy-on-write does seem to work OK for a filesystem. I'm using this thing as one of two pieces of a new private name space implementation that would also work quite well on freebsd. note it's not really a file system, but a loopback block device which does copy-on-write for new blocks. You can also use it to easily implement translucent file system behaviour. ron To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 10:55:23 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail4.aracnet.com (mail4.aracnet.com [216.99.193.36]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CFDD37B677 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 10:55:18 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from beattie@aracnet.com) Received: from shell1.aracnet.com (IDENT:root@shell1.aracnet.com [216.99.193.21]) by mail4.aracnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA12359; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 10:55:26 -0800 Received: by shell1.aracnet.com (8.9.3) id KAA05437; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 10:57:08 -0800 Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 10:57:08 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Beattie To: Michael Bacarella Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 3 Mar 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > > Upon reading of Microsoft's fabulous innovations in the filesystem arena, > I started playing with some ideas of my own (not to be confused with > ORIGINAL ideas) > > Can someone tell me why copy-on-write filesystems would be bad? > > Imagine: cp file file2, file and file2 reference the same exact blocks, > but modified chunks of file2 would be given their own private blocks. > > This probably won't fit into current filesystems, but is it a sane idea > worth pursuing in a new filesystem? I performed an analysis on a > non-production server and determined that about 66 megs of a typical > FreeBSD install is duplicate files (and yes, I ignored hard links and > symlinks and non-regular files). > > This was on a system without a ports tree, also. > > I think the benefits would be sexy. Copies are closer to instant. More > cache hits. Space benefits. Copying /etc/skel to a user's home directory > won't take up any blocks at all unless users edit their files, which, if > you're an ISP, you know that 95% of users don't do anyway. > > There's probably a stockpile of drawbacks to this as well. Fire away. > Sounds very intriquing. The biggest problem I see, right away is fitting it's use into a UNIX environment, were, file copies are made with the write system call, making it impossible to implement for the general case. You could certainly rewrite the "cp" command and that would get a majority of cases, though it is hard to say how many. The answer would depend on how the copies were made. I suspect that a large number of copies on most systems are made by going to the original source (tar file, etc...), these would not be helped by a copy-on-write filesystem. Brian Beattie | The only problem with beattie@aracnet.com | winning the rat race ... www.aracnet.com/~beattie | in the end you're still a rat To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 10:55:34 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [216.240.41.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E92C837B66A for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 10:55:31 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id KAA10948; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 10:55:27 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 10:55:27 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <200003031855.KAA10948@apollo.backplane.com> To: "Ronald G. Minnich" Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :It's a good idea. Peter Braam and I have written a device (called memdev) :for linux (sorry!) that implements a virtual-memory-backed copy-on-write :block device (like the loopback device, but uses anon vm pages for store). : :It's pretty interesting. It's quite fast, and copy-on-write does seem to :work OK for a filesystem. I'm using this thing as one of two pieces of a :new private name space implementation that would also work quite well on :freebsd. : :note it's not really a file system, but a loopback block device which does :copy-on-write for new blocks. : :You can also use it to easily implement translucent file system behaviour. : :ron I think a copy-on-write FS is an excellent idea. Last year I added swap-backed support to VN and started working on an I/O infrastructure for vm_object's (i.e. at the vm_object level rather then the VFS level). It would not be difficult to finish up that work and give the VN device the ability to stack vm_object layers, which would allow us to have a copy-on-write-to-swap layer in front of a partition or file (or even a copy-on-write-to-file layer in front of a partition, giving us persistence). FreeBSD already has something similar with nullfs and unionfs, but those operate at the VFS call level and despite all the bugs I've fixed in them recently they are *still* a broken pile of chunky brown stuff. We can do a lot of things with unionfs but we still can't buildworld reliably. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 11: 9:48 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from bingnet2.cc.binghamton.edu (bingnet2.cc.binghamton.edu [128.226.1.18]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99F0837B64E for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 11:09:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from zzhang@cs.binghamton.edu) Received: from sol.cs.binghamton.edu (sol.cs.binghamton.edu [128.226.123.100]) by bingnet2.cc.binghamton.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA02511; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:09:30 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 11:45:11 -0500 (EST) From: Zhihui Zhang To: Michael Bacarella Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 3 Mar 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > > Upon reading of Microsoft's fabulous innovations in the filesystem arena, > I started playing with some ideas of my own (not to be confused with > ORIGINAL ideas) > > Can someone tell me why copy-on-write filesystems would be bad? > > Imagine: cp file file2, file and file2 reference the same exact blocks, > but modified chunks of file2 would be given their own private blocks. > > This probably won't fit into current filesystems, but is it a sane idea > worth pursuing in a new filesystem? I performed an analysis on a > non-production server and determined that about 66 megs of a typical > FreeBSD install is duplicate files (and yes, I ignored hard links and > symlinks and non-regular files). > > This was on a system without a ports tree, also. > > I think the benefits would be sexy. Copies are closer to instant. More > cache hits. Space benefits. Copying /etc/skel to a user's home directory > won't take up any blocks at all unless users edit their files, which, if > you're an ISP, you know that 95% of users don't do anyway. > > There's probably a stockpile of drawbacks to this as well. Fire away. > If I remember correctly, I read a paper on how to create a snapshot of a file system. They use the COW technique in the filesystem. Now for each block in the filesystem, you need more than one bit to indicate its status (right now we use one bit to record whether this block is allocated or not). This can be tricky. -Zhihui To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 12:58:54 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.enteract.com (mail.enteract.com [207.229.143.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4039F37B6D2 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 12:58:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) Received: from shell-1.enteract.com (dscheidt@shell-1.enteract.com [207.229.143.40]) by mail.enteract.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA20095; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:58:46 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from dscheidt@enteract.com) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:58:46 -0600 (CST) From: David Scheidt To: Michael Bacarella Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 3 Mar 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > > Upon reading of Microsoft's fabulous innovations in the filesystem arena, > I started playing with some ideas of my own (not to be confused with > ORIGINAL ideas) > > Can someone tell me why copy-on-write filesystems would be bad? It wouldn't be. This is how NetApp do their .snapshot direcotries. I think they have some white papers on it on their website. It's very handy. David To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 13:38:28 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mass.cdrom.com (mass.cdrom.com [204.216.28.184]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07EB537C029 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 13:38:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from msmith@mass.cdrom.com) Received: from mass.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mass.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA01275; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 13:37:12 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from msmith@mass.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <200003032137.NAA01275@mass.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 To: Sergey Babkin Cc: Christian.Gusenbauer@netway.at, davidd@stack.nl, hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: FreeBSD-boot In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 02 Mar 2000 20:46:01 EST." <38BF1959.881B5538@bellatlantic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 13:37:12 -0800 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Christian Gusenbauer wrote: > > > > Hi David! > > > > I'm sorry for you, but FBSDBOOT will never support ELF binaries :-(! As > > developer of this utility I had a discussion about supporting ELF when ELF was > > introduced into FreeBSD. The reason, why ELF support was not integrated is, that > > the new boot loader and the kernel rely on the state of the hardware, BIOS > > and BIOS extensions. > > Sorry for a stupid question but how was it able > to boot with aout ? We weren't using anything like as much volatile system state back then. > So maybe there is a chance that it can be > adapted for ELF when started from a plain DOS ? For the umpteenth time, NO. This can't be done. > Well, maybe nowadays when the plain DOS is almost > completely displaced by Windows 9x maybe future > work on FBSDBOOT is not worth the effort in any > case. Now you're starting to think. 8) -- \\ Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. \\ Mike Smith \\ Tell him he should learn how to fish himself, \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ and he'll hate you for a lifetime. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 13:43:46 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gothic.iinet.net.au (gothic.iinet.net.au [203.59.24.252]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84E9237B6D8 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 13:43:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from julian@elischer.org) Received: from jules.elischer.org (reggae-02-137.nv.iinet.net.au [203.59.91.137]) by gothic.iinet.net.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id FAA23704; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:43:08 +0800 Message-ID: <38C0312A.2781E494@elischer.org> Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 13:39:54 -0800 From: Julian Elischer X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04Gold (X11; I; FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT i386) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: David Scheidt Cc: Michael Bacarella , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG David Scheidt wrote: > > On Fri, 3 Mar 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > > > > > > Upon reading of Microsoft's fabulous innovations in the filesystem arena, > > I started playing with some ideas of my own (not to be confused with > > ORIGINAL ideas) > > > > Can someone tell me why copy-on-write filesystems would be bad? > > It wouldn't be. This is how NetApp do their .snapshot direcotries. I think > they have some white papers on it on their website. It's very handy. Kirk McKusick is implementing a Copy-on write functionality for UFS. It is used in conjunction with Soft updates to produce snapshots. It's not what you asked for, but still relevant I think. One problem with "Copy-on-write, when applied to file copies is that you need to assign the blocks up front, even if you don't copy the data, as otherwise you could run out of space when the copy is actually needed. How many files would actually benefit from this? We already symlink and hardlink quite a few of them.. Julian > > David > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- __--_|\ Julian Elischer / \ julian@elischer.org ( OZ ) World tour 2000 ---> X_.---._/ presently in: Perth v To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 13:48:14 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.nyct.net (bsd4.nyct.net [204.141.86.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADD4E37B5F9 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 13:48:08 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mbac@bsd4.nyct.net) Received: from localhost (mbac@localhost) by mail.nyct.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA03572 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:48:07 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from mbac@bsd4.nyct.net) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:48:07 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Bacarella To: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: VFS Change? (was: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > Sounds very intriquing. The biggest problem I see, right away is fitting > it's use into a UNIX environment, were, file copies are made with the > write system call, making it impossible to implement for the general case. > You could certainly rewrite the "cp" command and that would get a majority > of cases, though it is hard to say how many. The answer would depend on > how the copies were made. I suspect that a large number of copies on most > systems are made by going to the original source (tar file, etc...), these > would not be helped by a copy-on-write filesystem. I originally started tossing around the idea as a copy-on-write symlink. Simply vanilla symlinks that made private copies of changes rather than writing through the links to the referenced file. The admin has much more control over it this way. I have no idea why I thought of COPY as an abstract filesystem method, when I clearly knew it copied files by open()'ing a new file and read()/write() old/new I probably thought of it being that way because that's how I would've implemented it. Ho hum. Usually, assuming UNIX does things the way that I probably would has a good success rate, which I will now discredit by stating the following: Objective Soapbox Is a COPY call in the VFS layer a bad idea? Copy is a rather common filesystem primitive, and the filesystem is free to do what it considers to be the best way to make a copy of a set of data, perhaps even supporting copy-on-write at this level, but practically, skipping the overhead of having an application do: while (read()) write(); To simply copy a file. I was lectured about something like that awhile ago, mentioning that FreeBSD isn't optimized for that. (syscall(); stuff; syscall(); repeat 50000 times) The filesystem knows how to do this, and since it can make assumptions about what's going to happen, it can probably optimize the cache being used. (Or at least provide far more reasonably hints to the OS about how to cache it, if caching isn't handled at the FS layer) -MB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 13:56:14 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.nyct.net (bsd4.nyct.net [204.141.86.6]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5656A37B568 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 13:56:11 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mbac@bsd4.nyct.net) Received: from localhost (mbac@localhost) by mail.nyct.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA05416; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:55:24 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from mbac@bsd4.nyct.net) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:55:24 -0500 (EST) From: Michael Bacarella To: Julian Elischer Cc: David Scheidt , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem In-Reply-To: <38C0312A.2781E494@elischer.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > It wouldn't be. This is how NetApp do their .snapshot direcotries. I think > > they have some white papers on it on their website. It's very handy. > > Kirk McKusick is implementing a Copy-on write functionality > for UFS. It is used in conjunction with Soft updates to produce > snapshots. It's not what you asked for, but still relevant > I think. One problem with "Copy-on-write, when applied to > file copies is that you need to assign the blocks up front, even if you > don't copy the data, as otherwise you could run out of space > when the copy is actually needed. That's the only real drawback I've considered. People accept it (barely) when the OS commits to providing virtual memory it does not have, killing processes when the system falls into debt. No one will appreciate that happening to their "permanent" data, especially if the OS decides that the best way to get out of debt is by deleting a file :) -MB To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 14:44:51 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from obie.softweyr.com (obie.softweyr.com [204.68.178.33]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C9A137B5E5; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:44:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Received: from softweyr.com (wes@homer.softweyr.com [204.68.178.39]) by obie.softweyr.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA00947; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 15:44:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from wes@softweyr.com) Message-ID: <38C04239.B6119BFE@softweyr.com> Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 15:52:41 -0700 From: Wes Peters Organization: Softweyr LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 3.3-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Archie Cobbs Cc: freebsd-net@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netgraph article References: <200003031724.JAA08549@bubba.whistle.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Archie Cobbs wrote: > > For anyone interested in reading about netgraph(4), including > technical information about developing your own node types, etc., > here is an article that I wrote for this month's Daemon News > 'blueprints' column.. > > http://www.daemonnews.org/200003/netgraph.html Another great blueprints column. Thanks, Archie. -- "Where am I, and what am I doing in this handbasket?" Wes Peters Softweyr LLC wes@softweyr.com http://softweyr.com/ To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 14:48:17 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail2.aracnet.com (mail2.aracnet.com [216.99.193.35]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFD1A37B71D for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:48:13 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from beattie@aracnet.com) Received: from shell1.aracnet.com (IDENT:root@shell1.aracnet.com [216.99.193.21]) by mail2.aracnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA08611; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:47:59 -0800 Received: by shell1.aracnet.com (8.9.3) id OAA09690; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:49:48 -0800 Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:49:48 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Beattie To: Michael Bacarella Cc: Julian Elischer , David Scheidt , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 3 Mar 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > > > It wouldn't be. This is how NetApp do their .snapshot direcotries. I think > > > they have some white papers on it on their website. It's very handy. > > > > Kirk McKusick is implementing a Copy-on write functionality > > for UFS. It is used in conjunction with Soft updates to produce > > snapshots. It's not what you asked for, but still relevant > > I think. One problem with "Copy-on-write, when applied to > > file copies is that you need to assign the blocks up front, even if you > > don't copy the data, as otherwise you could run out of space > > when the copy is actually needed. > > That's the only real drawback I've considered. > > People accept it (barely) when the OS commits to providing virtual memory > it does not have, killing processes when the system falls into debt. > > No one will appreciate that happening to their "permanent" data, > especially if the OS decides that the best way to get out of debt is by > deleting a file :) > Actually, since this is copy-on-write, you do not need the block, until you write. If you need to make a copy, it will be on a write system call (possibly an inode update), just fail the write ENOSPC or whatever. Or am I missing something simple here. > -MB > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message > Brian Beattie | The only problem with beattie@aracnet.com | winning the rat race ... www.aracnet.com/~beattie | in the end you're still a rat To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 14:49:46 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from orion.ac.hmc.edu (Orion.AC.HMC.Edu [134.173.32.20]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5817337B75D for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:49:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brdavis@orion.ac.hmc.edu) Received: (from brdavis@localhost) by orion.ac.hmc.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA06573; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:49:12 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:49:12 -0800 From: Brooks Davis To: Julian Elischer Cc: David Scheidt , Michael Bacarella , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem Message-ID: <20000303144912.B902@orion.ac.hmc.edu> References: <38C0312A.2781E494@elischer.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre4i In-Reply-To: <38C0312A.2781E494@elischer.org>; from julian@elischer.org on Fri, Mar 03, 2000 at 01:39:54PM -0800 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Mar 03, 2000 at 01:39:54PM -0800, Julian Elischer wrote: > David Scheidt wrote: > > > > On Fri, 3 Mar 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > > > > Upon reading of Microsoft's fabulous innovations in the filesystem arena, > > > I started playing with some ideas of my own (not to be confused with > > > ORIGINAL ideas) > > > > > > Can someone tell me why copy-on-write filesystems would be bad? > > > > It wouldn't be. This is how NetApp do their .snapshot direcotries. I think > > they have some white papers on it on their website. It's very handy. > > Kirk McKusick is implementing a Copy-on write functionality > for UFS. It is used in conjunction with Soft updates to produce > snapshots. It's not what you asked for, but still relevant > I think. One problem with "Copy-on-write, when applied to > file copies is that you need to assign the blocks up front, even if you > don't copy the data, as otherwise you could run out of space > when the copy is actually needed. Don't holes already cause this problem? Admittly you are much more likely to run into it if cp doesn't result in block reservations. In any case, if you do prereserve the storage you should probably just make copying lazy so given sufficient quiet time the system will no longer have any COW'd pages. Unfortunaly I think this problem is likely to be a rehash of the memory over subscription flame-wars the pop up periodicly (if you don't know, DON'T ASK, read the archives.) The game has changed a bit though because disk is quite different from memory in terms of access characteristics and purpose. -- Brooks -- Any statement of the form "X is the one, true Y" is FALSE. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 14:53:49 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mass.cdrom.com (mass.cdrom.com [204.216.28.184]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47C7A37B5E5 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:53:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from msmith@mass.cdrom.com) Received: from mass.cdrom.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mass.cdrom.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA02107; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 14:52:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from msmith@mass.cdrom.com) Message-Id: <200003032252.OAA02107@mass.cdrom.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 To: Brian Beattie Cc: Michael Bacarella , Julian Elischer , David Scheidt , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 03 Mar 2000 14:49:48 PST." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 14:52:46 -0800 From: Mike Smith Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > > No one will appreciate that happening to their "permanent" data, > > especially if the OS decides that the best way to get out of debt is by > > deleting a file :) > > Actually, since this is copy-on-write, you do not need the block, until > you write. If you need to make a copy, it will be on a write system call > (possibly an inode update), just fail the write ENOSPC or whatever. Or am > I missing something simple here. Failing a write into the middle of an existing file with ENOSPC is going to break any application that's not expecting a potentially sparse file... -- \\ Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. \\ Mike Smith \\ Tell him he should learn how to fish himself, \\ msmith@freebsd.org \\ and he'll hate you for a lifetime. \\ msmith@cdrom.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 15:46:10 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from gizmo.internode.com.au (gizmo.internode.com.au [192.83.231.115]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFD7A37BFD7; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 15:41:46 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from newton@gizmo.internode.com.au) Received: (from newton@localhost) by gizmo.internode.com.au (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA00423; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 10:12:13 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from newton) Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 10:12:13 +1030 From: Mark Newton To: chat@FreeBSD.ORG Cc: "Koster, K.J." , "'FreeBSD Hackers mailing list'" , Wes Peters Subject: Re: Great American Gas Out Message-ID: <20000304101212.A384@internode.com.au> References: <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452201313909@l04.research.kpn.com> <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre3i In-Reply-To: <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> X-PGP-Key: http://www.on.net/~newton/pgpkey.txt Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, Mar 03, 2000 at 09:56:08AM -0700, Wes Peters wrote: > "Koster, K.J." wrote: > > > Oh, those Americans. :-) > > Let's see: $1 per gallon in the US. $1.2 per litre in the Netherlands, > > times 4.5 (or thereabouts) is $5.4 per gallon in the Netherlands. > > Everyone in the Netherlands drives cars; everyone thinks gas is expensive. > > This means that the gas prices in the US can go up 440% and people will > > still drive cars and buy gas (and complain about gas prices, of course). > > First, this off-topic for -hackers, so I've directed replies to -chat > if you want to continue. Sage advice :-) > Second, I know people that commute distances that would cross your > country. I suspect the average American uses a lot more gas than the > average Nederlander. Bah. In Western Australia there's a sheep station called "Little Texas" which just happens to have a land area larger than the state of Texas; I live in Adelaide, so I have to go 600 km East or 3000 km West or 3000 km North to find another population centre with more than 50,000 people; the nearest interstate Capital city is 980 km away. Our cities are also a hell of a lot more widely laid-out than yours: Adelaide, with a pop. of 1.1 million, has the same surface area as New York City. So let's accept that distances in the US are pissant little commuter hops, shall we? :-) > Third, our gas prices here are held down by all sorts of weird > government intervention, bizarre market shenanigans, and a public that > doesn't understand that the price of gasoline has risen only 4x in the > same period that the price of cars has risen 10x. That's certainly > NOT a "natural occurence". Our prices are held *up* by the fact that over 50% of them constitute State and Federal taxes. > Fourth, I'm paying $1.48/gal right now, and I want the price to go > DOWN, not UP. I'm paying A$0.83c/L right now, which is roughly A$3.73/gal, which is roughly US$2.76. That means the US price of petroleum can rise by almost 100% and people still still drive the kind of distances which usually constitute international travel. - mark :-) -- Mark Newton Email: newton@internode.com.au (W) Network Engineer Email: newton@atdot.dotat.org (H) Internode Systems Pty Ltd Desk: +61-8-82232999 "Network Man" - Anagram of "Mark Newton" Mobile: +61-416-202-223 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 16: 8:46 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.ops.uunet.co.za (axl.ops.uunet.co.za [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 468B237B71D for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:08:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.ops.uunet.co.za) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.ops.uunet.co.za) by axl.ops.uunet.co.za with local-esmtp (Exim 3.13 #1) id 12R27K-000Cwi-00; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 02:08:22 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: Peter Wemm Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: DeCSS In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Feb 2000 10:05:55 +0800." <20000221020555.D5BD51CD9@overcee.netplex.com.au> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 02:08:21 +0200 Message-ID: <49767.952128501@axl.ops.uunet.co.za> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 21 Feb 2000 10:05:55 +0800, Peter Wemm wrote: > I would love to make a port of this, for reasons that become obvious > once you see the page. (Think of all the mailing list archives and > mirrors) > > http://www.totse.com/DeCSS/ Screw the cascading style sheets business, I wanna distribute the real thing. I'd like to see these wankers try to sue me. Especially if it means a free plane trip to the States. :-) Ciao, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 16: 9:21 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B01E037C1E5; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:09:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from grog@freebie.lemis.com) Received: (from grog@localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.9.3/8.9.0) id KAA24347; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 10:39:01 +1030 (CST) Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 10:39:01 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: Mark Newton Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG, "Koster, K.J." , "'FreeBSD Hackers mailing list'" , Wes Peters Subject: Re: Great American Gas Out Message-ID: <20000304103901.A24172@freebie.lemis.com> References: <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452201313909@l04.research.kpn.com> <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> <20000304101212.A384@internode.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre2i In-Reply-To: <20000304101212.A384@internode.com.au> WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog X-PGP-Fingerprint: 6B 7B C3 8C 61 CD 54 AF 13 24 52 F8 6D A4 95 EF Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Saturday, 4 March 2000 at 10:12:13 +1030, Mark Newton wrote: > On Fri, Mar 03, 2000 at 09:56:08AM -0700, Wes Peters wrote: > >> "Koster, K.J." wrote: >> >>> Oh, those Americans. :-) >>> Let's see: $1 per gallon in the US. $1.2 per litre in the Netherlands, >>> times 4.5 (or thereabouts) is $5.4 per gallon in the Netherlands. >>> Everyone in the Netherlands drives cars; everyone thinks gas is expensive. >>> This means that the gas prices in the US can go up 440% and people will >>> still drive cars and buy gas (and complain about gas prices, of course). >> >> First, this off-topic for -hackers, so I've directed replies to -chat >> if you want to continue. > > Sage advice :-) > >> Second, I know people that commute distances that would cross your >> country. I suspect the average American uses a lot more gas than the >> average Nederlander. > > Bah. In Western Australia there's a sheep station called "Little Texas" > which just happens to have a land area larger than the state of Texas; > I live in Adelaide, so I have to go 600 km East or 3000 km West or 3000 km > North to find another population centre with more than 50,000 people; > the nearest interstate Capital city is 980 km away. Melbourne's 750 km. > Our cities are also a hell of a lot more widely laid-out than yours: > Adelaide, with a pop. of 1.1 million, has the same surface area as > New York City. I think you should take a look at Salt Lake City (where Wes lives) before making that sort of claim. SLC is a lot wider than Adelaide. > So let's accept that distances in the US are pissant little commuter > hops, shall we? :-) Depends on the part of the USA. Greg -- Finger grog@lemis.com for PGP public key See complete headers for address and phone numbers To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 16:29:37 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from azazel.zer0.org (azazel.zer0.org [209.133.53.200]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C96237B55C; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:29:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gsutter@zer0.org) Received: (from gsutter@localhost) by azazel.zer0.org (8.9.3/8.9.2) id QAA48344; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:27:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from gsutter@zer0.org) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 16:27:48 -0800 From: Gregory Sutter To: Archie Cobbs Cc: freebsd-net@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Netgraph article Message-ID: <20000303162748.A47591@azazel.zer0.org> References: <200003031724.JAA08549@bubba.whistle.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: <200003031724.JAA08549@bubba.whistle.com>; from archie@whistle.com on Fri, Mar 03, 2000 at 09:24:34AM -0800 Organization: Zer0 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On 2000-03-03 09:24 -0800, Archie Cobbs wrote: > For anyone interested in reading about netgraph(4), including > technical information about developing your own node types, etc., > here is an article that I wrote for this month's Daemon News > 'blueprints' column.. > > http://www.daemonnews.org/200003/netgraph.html Hey, that's pretty nifty. ;) If anyone else is interested in writing a solid tech article, please contact me! (I'm the keeper of the blueprints column.) Greg -- Gregory S. Sutter The best way to accelerate Windows mailto:gsutter@zer0.org is at 9.8 m/s^2. http://www.zer0.org/~gsutter/ PGP DSS public key 0x40AE3052 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 17: 3:52 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [216.240.41.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F7E837B699 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 17:03:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id RAA12519; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 17:03:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 17:03:38 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <200003040103.RAA12519@apollo.backplane.com> To: Brian Beattie Cc: Michael Bacarella , Julian Elischer , David Scheidt , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :> > I think. One problem with "Copy-on-write, when applied to :> > file copies is that you need to assign the blocks up front, even if you :> > don't copy the data, as otherwise you could run out of space :> > when the copy is actually needed. :> :> That's the only real drawback I've considered. :> :> People accept it (barely) when the OS commits to providing virtual memory :> it does not have, killing processes when the system falls into debt. :> :> No one will appreciate that happening to their "permanent" data, :> especially if the OS decides that the best way to get out of debt is by :> deleting a file :) :> : :Actually, since this is copy-on-write, you do not need the block, until :you write. If you need to make a copy, it will be on a write system call :(possibly an inode update), just fail the write ENOSPC or whatever. Or am :I missing something simple here. The issue here is to ensure that you have sufficient swap. There are two ways to do this: One, make sure you have enough swap to cover likely operations done on the overlay, or Two, pre-reserve the entire partition's worth of space in swap. Both these options already exist for fresh swap-backed VN filesystems under 4.0 so you'd get them for free if we were to implement overlay functionality. Trying to do anything fancier then that will create more problems then it solves. -Matt To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 17:38:19 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail4.aracnet.com (mail4.aracnet.com [216.99.193.36]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E924637B712 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 17:38:14 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from beattie@aracnet.com) Received: from shell1.aracnet.com (IDENT:root@shell1.aracnet.com [216.99.193.21]) by mail4.aracnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA16182; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 17:38:10 -0800 Received: by shell1.aracnet.com (8.9.3) id RAA12959; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 17:39:55 -0800 Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 17:39:55 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Beattie To: Matthew Dillon Cc: Michael Bacarella , Julian Elischer , David Scheidt , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem In-Reply-To: <200003040103.RAA12519@apollo.backplane.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Fri, 3 Mar 2000, Matthew Dillon wrote: > :> > I think. One problem with "Copy-on-write, when applied to > :> > file copies is that you need to assign the blocks up front, even if you > :> > don't copy the data, as otherwise you could run out of space > :> > when the copy is actually needed. > :> > :> That's the only real drawback I've considered. > :> > :> People accept it (barely) when the OS commits to providing virtual memory > :> it does not have, killing processes when the system falls into debt. > :> > :> No one will appreciate that happening to their "permanent" data, > :> especially if the OS decides that the best way to get out of debt is by > :> deleting a file :) > :> > : > :Actually, since this is copy-on-write, you do not need the block, until > :you write. If you need to make a copy, it will be on a write system call > :(possibly an inode update), just fail the write ENOSPC or whatever. Or am > :I missing something simple here. > > The issue here is to ensure that you have sufficient swap. Swap? I thought we were talking about a copy-on-write filesystem i.e. disk block, not memory, or did I really miss something Brian Beattie | The only problem with beattie@aracnet.com | winning the rat race ... www.aracnet.com/~beattie | in the end you're still a rat To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 17:41:39 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from apollo.backplane.com (apollo.backplane.com [216.240.41.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B812E37B715 for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 17:41:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon@apollo.backplane.com) Received: (from dillon@localhost) by apollo.backplane.com (8.9.3/8.9.1) id RAA12906; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 17:41:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dillon) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 17:41:24 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Dillon Message-Id: <200003040141.RAA12906@apollo.backplane.com> To: Brian Beattie Cc: Michael Bacarella , Julian Elischer , David Scheidt , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem References: Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG :Swap? I thought we were talking about a copy-on-write filesystem :i.e. disk block, not memory, or did I really miss something : :Brian Beattie | The only problem with Where are you copy-on-writing to? Unbacked memory? No way that would ever work, at least not for any reasonably-sized filesystem. The copied data has to go somewhere. Or are you talking about the copy-on-write softlink business? That's a whole different ball of wax. -Matt Matthew Dillon To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 18:14:54 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from pebkac.owp.csus.edu (pebkac.owp.csus.edu [130.86.232.245]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32E7937B6E8; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 18:14:49 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from joseph.scott@owp.csus.edu) Received: from owp.csus.edu (mothra.ecs.csus.edu [130.86.76.220]) by pebkac.owp.csus.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA00752; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 18:14:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from joseph.scott@owp.csus.edu) Message-ID: <38C0718C.8D30B673@owp.csus.edu> Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 18:14:36 -0800 From: Joseph Scott X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.36 i386) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mark Newton Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG, "Koster, K.J." , "'FreeBSD Hackers mailing list'" , Wes Peters Subject: Re: Great American Gas Out References: <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452201313909@l04.research.kpn.com> <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> <20000304101212.A384@internode.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Mark Newton wrote: > > Fourth, I'm paying $1.48/gal right now, and I want the price to go > > DOWN, not UP. > > I'm paying A$0.83c/L right now, which is roughly A$3.73/gal, which is > roughly US$2.76. That means the US price of petroleum can rise by almost > 100% and people still still drive the kind of distances which usually > constitute international travel. Ug, when I lived in Melbourne ( 92-94 ) I think the price was around A$0.55/L. Of course I think the price back in the states was still around US$0.99/g at the time. Is gas conversion still a big thing? -- Joseph Scott joseph.scott@owp.csus.edu Office Of Water Programs - CSU Sacramento To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 18:45:41 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E52F837B74C for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 18:45:37 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jbryant@ppp-207-193-2-159.kscymo.swbell.net) Received: from ppp-207-193-2-159.kscymo.swbell.net ([207.193.2.159]) by mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8) with ESMTP id <0FQV0092GMBSCC@mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net> for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 20:45:31 -0600 (CST) Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by ppp-207-193-2-159.kscymo.swbell.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) id UAA10031; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 20:45:25 -0600 (CST) Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 20:45:18 -0600 (CST) From: Jim Bryant Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem In-reply-to: To: mbac@nyct.net (Michael Bacarella) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: kc5vdj@swbell.net Message-id: <200003040245.UAA10031@ppp-207-193-2-159.kscymo.swbell.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Windows: R00LZ!@# MS-Winbl0wz DR00LZ!@# X-files: The truth is that the X-Files is fiction X-Republican: The best kind!!! X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT #8: Sat Oct 30 00:56:56 CDT 1999 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In reply: > Imagine: cp file file2, file and file2 reference the same exact blocks, > but modified chunks of file2 would be given their own private blocks. This is not a microsoft innovation, actually, I believe it was a VMS innovation. It's called a generational filesystem. the original is stored, and later generations of the file are stored as diffs. > This probably won't fit into current filesystems, but is it a sane idea > worth pursuing in a new filesystem? I performed an analysis on a > non-production server and determined that about 66 megs of a typical > FreeBSD install is duplicate files (and yes, I ignored hard links and > symlinks and non-regular files). it has it's advantages. and disavantages. one problem in VMS is determining the system-wide policy on such things, such as how many file generations will be kept. this isn't exactly apples to apples, but it's close enough to be discussed. a VMS style filesystem would be interesting. jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ KC5VDJ - HF to 23cm KC5VDJ@NW0I.#NEKS.KS.USA.NOAM kc5vdj@swbell.net IC-706MkII, IC-T81A, HTX-202, HTX-212, HTX-404, KPC3+, PK-232MBX Grid: EM28px ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ET has one helluva sense of humor, always anal-probing right-wing schizos! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 18:48:25 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mta1.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta1.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8313337B75D for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 18:48:16 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jbryant@ppp-207-193-2-159.kscymo.swbell.net) Received: from ppp-207-193-2-159.kscymo.swbell.net ([207.193.2.159]) by mta1.rcsntx.swbell.net (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8) with ESMTP id <0FQV00AKKMG5ZI@mta1.rcsntx.swbell.net> for freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 20:48:12 -0600 (CST) Received: (from jbryant@localhost) by ppp-207-193-2-159.kscymo.swbell.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) id UAA10045; Fri, 03 Mar 2000 20:48:03 -0600 (CST) Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 20:47:57 -0600 (CST) From: Jim Bryant Subject: Re: Copy-on-write filesystem In-reply-to: To: rminnich@lanl.gov (Ronald G. Minnich) Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: kc5vdj@swbell.net Message-id: <200003040248.UAA10045@ppp-207-193-2-159.kscymo.swbell.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL32 (25)] Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Windows: R00LZ!@# MS-Winbl0wz DR00LZ!@# X-files: The truth is that the X-Files is fiction X-Republican: The best kind!!! X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT #8: Sat Oct 30 00:56:56 CDT 1999 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In reply: > On Fri, 3 Mar 2000, Michael Bacarella wrote: > > > Can someone tell me why copy-on-write filesystems would be bad? > > It's a good idea. Peter Braam and I have written a device (called memdev) > for linux (sorry!) that implements a virtual-memory-backed copy-on-write > block device (like the loopback device, but uses anon vm pages for store). > > It's pretty interesting. It's quite fast, and copy-on-write does seem to > work OK for a filesystem. I'm using this thing as one of two pieces of a > new private name space implementation that would also work quite well on > freebsd. Ever experience CDC Cyber NOS? Interesting private-space filesystem with many apps today. jim -- All opinions expressed are mine, if you | "I will not be pushed, stamped, think otherwise, then go jump into turbid | briefed, debriefed, indexed, or radioactive waters and yell WAHOO !!! | numbered!" - #1, "The Prisoner" ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ KC5VDJ - HF to 23cm KC5VDJ@NW0I.#NEKS.KS.USA.NOAM kc5vdj@swbell.net IC-706MkII, IC-T81A, HTX-202, HTX-212, HTX-404, KPC3+, PK-232MBX Grid: EM28px ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ET has one helluva sense of humor, always anal-probing right-wing schizos! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 23:28:51 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix, from userid 758) id 2447037B65B; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 23:28:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2270C2E815A; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 23:28:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from kris@hub.freebsd.org) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 23:28:50 -0800 (PST) From: Kris Kennaway To: Sheldon Hearn Cc: Peter Wemm , hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: DeCSS In-Reply-To: <49767.952128501@axl.ops.uunet.co.za> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 4 Mar 2000, Sheldon Hearn wrote: > > http://www.totse.com/DeCSS/ > > Screw the cascading style sheets business, I wanna distribute the real > thing. I'd like to see these wankers try to sue me. Especially if it > means a free plane trip to the States. :-) You know, I half want to add a note in the release notes that "FreeBSD 4.0 now ships with DeCSS included", but that might be a bit political :-) Kris ---- In God we Trust -- all others must submit an X.509 certificate. -- Charles Forsythe To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 23:31: 7 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from resnet.uoregon.edu (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.144.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1114037B51C for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 23:31:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu) Received: from localhost (dwhite@localhost) by resnet.uoregon.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA86193; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 23:31:02 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 23:31:01 -0800 (PST) From: Doug White To: Marc Frajola Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? In-Reply-To: <200003010905.BAA16360@enginet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Wed, 1 Mar 2000, Marc Frajola wrote: > > What are you using for your command lines? You have to target the > > disklabel specifically at slice 1 on the disk otherwise disklabel will > > think you're trying to overwrite the slice table and get mad. > > Here's what I did: > > fdisk -e /dev/rda1 > disklabel -r -w da1 auto Yeah, this is wrong. You need to specify a slice. I generally don't depend on the 'auto' magic -- it breaks for IDE disks, and I'm not sure it works for slices either. > OK, may I ask what the ".. magic .." part is?? Take a look at src/release/picobsd/install/floppy.tree/etc/prepdisk in the source tree. This is an awk script that generates a root partition and 255MB of swap on the target disk by doing the higher math on the number of sectors on the disk. You may have to change the disk type in the script but otherwise it's the same for IDE and SCSI. I'm looking at the script and notice that it doesn't select slice 1... somehow disklabel DTRT. It works here :-) Doug White | FreeBSD: The Power to Serve dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | www.FreeBSD.org PS: http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi is really handy for browsing the source tree. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Fri Mar 3 23:36: 4 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from resnet.uoregon.edu (resnet.uoregon.edu [128.223.144.32]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD8FA37B60E for ; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 23:36:01 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu) Received: from localhost (dwhite@localhost) by resnet.uoregon.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id XAA00630; Fri, 3 Mar 2000 23:35:53 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu) Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2000 23:35:53 -0800 (PST) From: Doug White To: Warren Welch Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Disklabel from command line... In-Reply-To: <4.2.1.20000302110744.05603720@arthur.intraceptives.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Thu, 2 Mar 2000, Warren Welch wrote: > Is it possible to create FreeBSD partitions from the command line? > I'd really like to be able to script creating a FreeBSD partitions, so > that I could create /, /var, /usr, etc. without having to edit the > disklabel manually. See src/release/picobsd/install/floppy.tree/etc/doinstall and prepdisk. Doug White | FreeBSD: The Power to Serve dwhite@resnet.uoregon.edu | www.FreeBSD.org To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 0: 6:29 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C68B937B6B2; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 00:06:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA44303; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 01:06:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id BAA32550; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 01:06:04 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <200003040806.BAA32550@harmony.village.org> To: Kris Kennaway Subject: Re: DeCSS Cc: Sheldon Hearn , Peter Wemm , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 03 Mar 2000 23:28:50 PST." References: Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 01:06:04 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message Kris Kennaway writes: : You know, I half want to add a note in the release notes that "FreeBSD 4.0 : now ships with DeCSS included", but that might be a bit political :-) It would be political. All things are. What could they do to us? Haul us into court? In which case our legal representative will say "Your honor, these clowns didn't do due diligence in their complaint, we have no clue why we're here. The DeCSS in our produce removes Cascading Style Sheets. Nothing at all to do with DVDs at all. Please dismiss the case and award us our court costs, plus $10M punitive damages to deter such egregious behavior in the future. Thank you." Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 0:15:14 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C917337B78A for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 00:15:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA44338; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 01:15:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id BAA32604; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 01:14:51 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <200003040814.BAA32604@harmony.village.org> To: Doug White Subject: Re: How to fdisk/disklabel whole disk for FreeBSD from command line? Cc: Marc Frajola , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 03 Mar 2000 23:31:01 PST." References: Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 01:14:51 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message Doug White writes: : > fdisk -e /dev/rda1 : > disklabel -r -w da1 auto : : Yeah, this is wrong. You need to specify a slice. But you can't specify a slice here. It won't work. If you give it the whole path, disklabel won't even try. If you day da1s1, it will complain that it can't fit a disklabel for the entire disk into the slice smaller than the disk with some cryptic error message or another :-). : I generally don't depend on the 'auto' magic -- it breaks for IDE : disks, and I'm not sure it works for slices either. It breaks for all disk lables that aren't the entire disk. : I'm looking at the script and notice that it doesn't select slice : 1... somehow disklabel DTRT. It works here :-) Well, you could look at my diskprep script that I just posted a reference to. http://people.freebsd.org/~imp/diskprep (also needs patches to fdisk: http://people.freebsd.org/~imp/fdisk-patch) I'd like to commit it to FreeBSD after 4.0 goes out the door. We have many partital solutions to this problem. It is time to make a simple, standard tool to do this. No, sysinstall doesn't count here because it isn't simple and cannot be driven from a script. The fla tool is limited to fla DOC2K disks. The prepdisk in picobsd has too many things hard coded and will work only for ide disks. It is designed to create a sane slice (ala fdisk -I (since -e -> -I soon)) and put a reasonable disklabel on it. By default it does only one partition, but can be configured to do more. I wrote it to deal with creating dozens of compact flash labeling when I'm given a hodge podge of CF sizes and manufactures to create images for (sometimes 48M parts are available, other times 45M parts, and each of those sizes varies +- 300 blocks between vendors). I have a microbsd-like wrapper that I put around it to actually populate the disk, but it is no where near ready for prime time. Too many local tweaks and special knowledge still in the scripts. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 0:31:44 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from salmon.maths.tcd.ie (salmon.maths.tcd.ie [134.226.81.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D042337B535 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 00:31:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dwmalone@maths.tcd.ie) Received: from walton.maths.tcd.ie by salmon.maths.tcd.ie with SMTP id ; 4 Mar 2000 08:31:32 +0000 (GMT) Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 08:31:27 +0000 From: David Malone To: Warner Losh Cc: Kris Kennaway , Sheldon Hearn , Peter Wemm , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: DeCSS Message-ID: <20000304083127.A27522@walton.maths.tcd.ie> References: <200003040806.BAA32550@harmony.village.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: <200003040806.BAA32550@harmony.village.org>; from imp@village.org on Sat, Mar 04, 2000 at 01:06:04AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Mar 04, 2000 at 01:06:04AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote: Incase anyone is interested, there is a big DVD conference comming up in Dublin, and some people here are going to try to cause some noise while it is on. I can track down details if anyone is interested. Dacid. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 0:42:11 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from freebsd.dk (freebsd.dk [212.242.42.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D0BE37B77D; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 00:42:06 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sos@freebsd.dk) Received: (from sos@localhost) by freebsd.dk (8.9.3/8.9.1) id JAA43078; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 09:41:58 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from sos) From: Soren Schmidt Message-Id: <200003040841.JAA43078@freebsd.dk> Subject: Re: DeCSS In-Reply-To: <200003040806.BAA32550@harmony.village.org> from Warner Losh at "Mar 4, 2000 01:06:04 am" To: imp@village.org (Warner Losh) Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 09:41:58 +0100 (CET) Cc: kris@hub.freebsd.org (Kris Kennaway), sheldonh@uunet.co.za (Sheldon Hearn), peter@netplex.com.au (Peter Wemm), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG It seems Warner Losh wrote: > In message Kris Kennaway writes: > : You know, I half want to add a note in the release notes that "FreeBSD 4.0 > : now ships with DeCSS included", but that might be a bit political :-) > > It would be political. All things are. > > What could they do to us? Haul us into court? In which case our > legal representative will say "Your honor, these clowns didn't do due > diligence in their complaint, we have no clue why we're here. The > DeCSS in our produce removes Cascading Style Sheets. Nothing at all > to do with DVDs at all. Please dismiss the case and award us our > court costs, plus $10M punitive damages to deter such egregious > behavior in the future. Thank you." He, I have the bits ported here since november'99, I'll gladly offer them for inclusion on the CD's :) -Søren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 2:49:41 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.ptd.net (mail1.ha-net.ptd.net [207.44.96.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 3084F37B768 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 02:49:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tms2@mail.ptd.net) Received: (qmail 5597 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2000 10:49:39 -0000 Received: from du42.cli.ptd.net (HELO mail.ptd.net) (204.186.33.42) by mail.ptd.net with SMTP; 4 Mar 2000 10:49:39 -0000 Message-ID: <38C0EA12.A4252C20@mail.ptd.net> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 05:48:51 -0500 From: "Thomas M. Sommers" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Can't write to stdout in assembly Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From what I understand, the following should print "Hello, world." on stdout. I stole the code from the Linux HOWTO, but I think it should work on FreeBSD as well. Instead, the call to write returns 9 (EBADF). .data msg: .string "Hello, world.\n" len = . - msg - 1 .text global _start _start: movl $4, %eax movl $1, %ebx movl $msg, %ecx movl $len, %edx int $0x80 movl $1, %eax xorl %ebx, %ebx int $0x80 Can anyone explain what I've done wrong? As a related question, can anyone point me to the source for the int 0x80 handler? I've looked all over but can't find it. Thanks. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 5:21:56 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from 1Cust163.tnt1.waldorf.md.da.uu.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A21D37B78A; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:21:45 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from green@FreeBSD.org) Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 08:21:50 -0500 (EST) From: Brian Fundakowski Feldman X-Sender: green@green.dyndns.org To: "Thomas M. Sommers" Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Can't write to stdout in assembly In-Reply-To: <38C0EA12.A4252C20@mail.ptd.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 4 Mar 2000, Thomas M. Sommers wrote: > >From what I understand, the following should print "Hello, world." on > stdout. I stole the code from the Linux HOWTO, but I think it should > work on FreeBSD as well. Instead, the call to write returns 9 (EBADF). > [ Linux-specific asm elided ... ] > > Can anyone explain what I've done wrong? > > As a related question, can anyone point me to the source for the int > 0x80 handler? I've looked all over but can't find it. You're trying to run Linux assembly on FreeBSD. The calling conventions are not the same at all, and cannot be treated as such. Even if you really needed to write in assembly, you shouldn't call the syscalls directly. Note that the library stubs are just that, stubs to call the system calls. Try doing something more along the lines of: pushl $stringlen pushl stringaddr pushl $0x1 call write which would result in %eax containing the return value. For what it's worth, you can find all of the syscall calling conventions in src/lib/libc, and you can find where the calling conventions are "defined" by looking at src/sys/i386/i386/trap.c. > Thanks. -- Brian Fundakowski Feldman \ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve! / green@FreeBSD.org `------------------------------' To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 5:39:16 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from axl.ops.uunet.co.za (axl.ops.uunet.co.za [196.31.1.175]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A5F837B78A for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 05:39:10 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sheldonh@axl.ops.uunet.co.za) Received: from sheldonh (helo=axl.ops.uunet.co.za) by axl.ops.uunet.co.za with local-esmtp (Exim 3.13 #1) id 12REjb-000Esy-00; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 15:36:43 +0200 From: Sheldon Hearn To: Max Khon Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: empty lists in for In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 21 Feb 2000 22:10:15 +0600." Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 15:36:43 +0200 Message-ID: <57223.952177003@axl.ops.uunet.co.za> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Mon, 21 Feb 2000 22:10:15 +0600, Max Khon wrote: > bash and ksh complain about unexpected ';'. > /bin/sh (FreeBSD) thinks it's ok and does nothing. > Which behaviour is more POSIXly correct? Neither bash nor ksh claim to be particularly POSIX compliant. our /bin/sh does. I seem to remember POSIX being ambiguous on this one, but my books are at the office. If you haven't gotten a more conclusive answer by Monday, mail me and I'll look it up. Later, Sheldon. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 7: 1: 2 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from galileo.poli.hu (polinet-gw.poli.hu [195.199.8.25]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F367637B77B for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 07:00:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mauzi@aquarius.poli.hu) Received: from dial-6.poli.hu ([195.199.8.22] helo=aquarius.poli.hu) by galileo.poli.hu with esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1) id 12RG35-000Gzh-00 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 16:00:56 +0100 Received: from mauzi (helo=localhost) by aquarius.poli.hu with local-esmtp (Exim 3.12 #1) id 12RG23-00019L-00 for hackers@freebsd.org; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 15:59:51 +0100 Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 15:59:51 +0100 (CET) From: Gergely EGERVARY Reply-To: mauzi@poli.hu To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: PAM modules Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG hello, I've just played a bit with libpam, and the modules. My basic problem is: I _really need_ login accounting, and pam_limits.so (in Linux-PAM) does a good work for me. I have seen that the code imported into the cvs tree is rather old - (v0.65?) so I grabbed the new sources, and started hacking. (btw - It was about 2 minutes to get the module compiled on FreeBSD-CURRENT) I have also seen some code is under rewrite (by jdp, Juniper Networks, ... so what I want to ask is: - what are the future plans with PAM support? - do you need contributors, patches, etc. -- mauzi To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 7: 8: 8 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from freebsd.dk (freebsd.dk [212.242.42.178]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3735437B7E5; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 07:08:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from sos@freebsd.dk) Received: (from sos@localhost) by freebsd.dk (8.9.3/8.9.1) id QAA37587; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 16:07:50 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from sos) From: Soren Schmidt Message-Id: <200003041507.QAA37587@freebsd.dk> Subject: Re: DeCSS In-Reply-To: <200003041042.CAA26860@falcon.hentschel.net> from "thomas@hentschel.net" at "Mar 4, 2000 02:42:29 am" To: thomas@hentschel.net Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 16:07:50 +0100 (CET) Cc: imp@village.org (Warner Losh), kris@hub.freebsd.org (Kris Kennaway), sheldonh@uunet.co.za (Sheldon Hearn), peter@netplex.com.au (Peter Wemm), hackers@FreeBSD.ORG X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL54 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG It seems thomas@hentschel.net wrote: > > > > He, I have the bits ported here since november'99, I'll gladly > > offer them for inclusion on the CD's :) > > > > -Søren > > drwx------ 2 sos wheel 512 Jan 5 08:06 DVD > > Well, I believe you, I just can't get to it :) > Actually, opendvd.org still links to your site, might wanna give them a > hint. Any mirrors ? I have given them hint upon hint, they just dont care :( Mirrors ? dunno, I dont think there are many that will carry the code nowadays, but if you know of one.... -Søren To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 9:22:29 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from lariat.lariat.org (lariat.lariat.org [206.100.185.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D57A37B838; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 09:22:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brett@lariat.org) Received: from mustang (IDENT:ppp0.lariat.org@lariat.lariat.org [206.100.185.2]) by lariat.lariat.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA22524; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 10:22:10 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <4.2.2.20000304091423.040b5590@localhost> X-Sender: brett@localhost (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.2.2 Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 09:20:09 -0700 To: Mark Newton , chat@FreeBSD.ORG From: Brett Glass Subject: Re: Great American Gas Out Cc: "Koster, K.J." , "'FreeBSD Hackers mailing list'" , Wes Peters In-Reply-To: <20000304101212.A384@internode.com.au> References: <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452201313909@l04.research.kpn.com> <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG At 04:42 PM 3/3/2000 , Mark Newton wrote: >Our prices are held *up* by the fact that over 50% of them constitute >State and Federal taxes. Same in the US and Europe. Driving is a sin that must be taxed, y'know. This week, I traveled from Wyoming to California and discovered that gas prices were 25% higher in the Golden State than in the Cowboy State. Why? Because Californians "tax" themselves by requiring that everyone buy fuel with high concentrations of MTBE, an oxygenating agent. MTBE was supposed to reduce pollution, but in fact is a worse pollutant than oxides of nitrogen ever were. However, since only California refineries make gas with a high enough concentration of MTBE, Californians are locked into buying from these few sources and the price goes up. WAY up. Los Angeles will have $2.50 gas this summer. It's the same the whole world over. Energy policies and fuel costs aren't driven by markets or even common sense. They are controlled by big cartels, big government, and politics. --Brett Glass To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 9:39:54 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from etinc.com (et-gw.etinc.com [207.252.1.2]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E723D37B823; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 09:39:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from dennis@etinc.com) Received: from dbsys (dbsys.etinc.com [207.252.1.18]) by etinc.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id MAA15002; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 12:41:03 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200003041741.MAA15002@etinc.com> X-Sender: dennis@etinc.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 12:33:51 -0500 To: Brett Glass , Mark Newton , chat@FreeBSD.ORG From: Dennis Subject: Re: Great American Gas Out Cc: "Koster, K.J." , "'FreeBSD Hackers mailing list'" , Wes Peters In-Reply-To: <4.2.2.20000304091423.040b5590@localhost> References: <20000304101212.A384@internode.com.au> <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452201313909@l04.research.kpn.com> <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG >This week, I traveled from Wyoming to California and discovered that >gas prices were 25% higher in the Golden State than in the Cowboy >State. Why? Because Californians "tax" themselves by requiring that >everyone buy fuel with high concentrations of MTBE, an oxygenating agent. >MTBE was supposed to reduce pollution, but in fact is a worse pollutant >than oxides of nitrogen ever were. However, since only California >refineries make gas with a high enough concentration of MTBE, Californians >are locked into buying from these few sources and the price goes up. >WAY up. Los Angeles will have $2.50 gas this summer. > >It's the same the whole world over. Energy policies and fuel costs aren't >driven by markets or even common sense. They are controlled by big >cartels, big government, and politics. I think you've been reading too much of that commie literature they have out there on the West Coast. Gas taxes are designed to pay for roads and highways, and you have lots more infrastructure in LA than you do in Wyoming. The more you drive, the more you pay. Makes sense to me. As for clean air...Im all for it. You might disagree with specific things being done, but if nothing were done 20 years ago you wouldnt be able to breath in LA at all. Same here in NY. As a staunch Republican I usually disagree with big tax government programs..but the gas tax is very reasonable in this country. Now if we could just do something about those union guys making 100K to put up signs.......does it really take 6 men to fill a pothole? JMO Dennis Emerging Technologies, Inc. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------- http://www.etinc.com ISA and PCI T1/T3/V35/HSSI Cards for FreeBSD and LINUX Multiport T1 and HSSI/T3 UNIX-based Routers Bandwidth Management Standalone Systems Bandwidth Management software for LINUX and FreeBSD To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 10:22: 1 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from cc942873-a.ewndsr1.nj.home.com (cc942873-a.ewndsr1.nj.home.com [24.2.89.207]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9416537B80F; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 10:21:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from cjc@cc942873-a.ewndsr1.nj.home.com) Received: (from cjc@localhost) by cc942873-a.ewndsr1.nj.home.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id NAA48986; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 13:26:12 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from cjc) Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 13:26:11 -0500 From: "Crist J. Clark" To: Brett Glass Cc: Mark Newton , chat@FreeBSD.ORG, "Koster, K.J." , "'FreeBSD Hackers mailing list'" , Wes Peters Subject: Re: Great American Gas Out Message-ID: <20000304132611.B48777@cc942873-a.ewndsr1.nj.home.com> Reply-To: cjclark@home.com References: <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452201313909@l04.research.kpn.com> <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> <20000304101212.A384@internode.com.au> <4.2.2.20000304091423.040b5590@localhost> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: <4.2.2.20000304091423.040b5590@localhost>; from brett@lariat.org on Sat, Mar 04, 2000 at 09:20:09AM -0700 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Mar 04, 2000 at 09:20:09AM -0700, Brett Glass wrote: > At 04:42 PM 3/3/2000 , Mark Newton wrote: > > >Our prices are held *up* by the fact that over 50% of them constitute > >State and Federal taxes. > > Same in the US and Europe. Driving is a sin that must be taxed, y'know. Driving is an activity that incurrs a cost on society, building roads, regular maintainance, salter, snow plows, maintainace to fix the damage the snow plows did, etc. > This week, I traveled from Wyoming to California and discovered that > gas prices were 25% higher in the Golden State than in the Cowboy > State. Why? Because Californians "tax" themselves by requiring that > everyone buy fuel with high concentrations of MTBE, an oxygenating agent. > MTBE was supposed to reduce pollution, but in fact is a worse pollutant > than oxides of nitrogen ever were. However, since only California > refineries make gas with a high enough concentration of MTBE, Californians > are locked into buying from these few sources and the price goes up. > WAY up. Los Angeles will have $2.50 gas this summer. Yet the number of f*cking SUVs and other gas-guzzling vehicles in the region will continue to rise as will the miles driven per vehicle. > It's the same the whole world over. Energy policies and fuel costs aren't > driven by markets or even common sense. They are controlled by big > cartels, big government, and politics. Just like everything else. -- Crist J. Clark cjclark@home.com To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 11:41:53 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from kweetal.tue.nl (kweetal.tue.nl [131.155.2.7]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BF5837B869 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 11:41:50 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from marcov@toad.stack.nl) Received: from hermes.tue.nl [131.155.2.46] by kweetal.tue.nl (8.9.3) for id UAA25342 (ESMTP); Sat, 4 Mar 2000 20:41:41 +0100 (MET) Received: from deathstar (n71.dial.tue.nl [131.155.209.70]) by hermes.tue.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48F3D2E803 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 20:41:40 +0100 (CET) From: "Marco van de Voort" To: Hackers@freebsd.org Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 20:39:13 +0100 Subject: Re: Can't write to stdout in assembly In-reply-to: <38C0EA12.A4252C20@mail.ptd.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12b) Message-Id: <20000304194140.48F3D2E803@hermes.tue.nl> Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > >From what I understand, the following should print "Hello, world." on > stdout. I stole the code from the Linux HOWTO, but I think it should > work on FreeBSD as well. Instead, the call to write returns 9 (EBADF). I disassembled FreeBSD programs (create a small C prog, compile, and use objdump), and it looks more like this: (I haven't tested this yet, but it is definitely stack based, not register based, the part which I haven't tested is if the placing the int $0x80 behind a call is required) pusl $len pushl $Msg pushl $1 mov $4,%eax call _basicsyscall addl $12,%esp . . . _basicsyscall: int $0x80 ret > As a related question, can anyone point me to the source for the int > 0x80 handler? I've looked all over but can't find it. On the libc side? It is very fragmented in several files using a lot of macro code. If you wish I can look up the names for you (I did this some weeks ago) I never searched for the kernel side. (the actual 0x80 handler) Marco van de Voort (MarcoV@Stack.nl) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 12:13:53 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from elwood.akitanet.co.uk (elwood.akitanet.co.uk [212.1.130.149]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 736CC37B880 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 12:13:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from wigstah@akitanet.co.uk) Received: from elwood.akitanet.co.uk (elwood.akitanet.co.uk [212.1.130.149]) by elwood.akitanet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id UAA43563 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 20:21:20 GMT Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 20:21:20 +0000 (GMT) From: Paul Robinson To: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Tuning TCP/IP Performance Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Hi, I've been trying to get TCP/IP performance as fast as possible by playing around with sysctl (playing in the net.inet area) and so on, and was wondering if there were any comprehensive resources on this that I've missed. Whenever I do a sysctl -d -a to get a list of descriptions, I get the following on 3.2-RELEASE: sysctl: sysctl name -1 1024 2: No such file or directory Any idea as to what's going on here? Also, I seem to remember hearing about a method used on SunOS to send the first four bytes of the data payload back with the SYN ACK which gives the appearance of improved performance on benchmarks. Does anybody know as to whether this is possible under any version of FreeBSD? I'll move to 4.0 if I have to. :) -- Paul Robinson - Developer/Systems Administrator @ Akitanet Internet To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 12:34:47 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mimer.webgiro.com (mimer.webgiro.com [212.209.29.5]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35F7D37B88C for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 12:34:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from abial@webgiro.com) Received: by mimer.webgiro.com (Postfix, from userid 66) id 98D7A2DC07; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 21:39:14 +0100 (CET) Received: by mx.webgiro.com (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 000D67811; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 21:30:43 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mx.webgiro.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF73210E16; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 21:30:43 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 21:30:43 +0100 (CET) From: Andrzej Bialecki To: Paul Robinson Cc: hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Tuning TCP/IP Performance In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, 4 Mar 2000, Paul Robinson wrote: > Hi, > > I've been trying to get TCP/IP performance as fast as possible by playing > around with sysctl (playing in the net.inet area) and so on, and was > wondering if there were any comprehensive resources on this that I've > missed. Whenever I do a sysctl -d -a to get a list of descriptions, I get > the following on 3.2-RELEASE: > > sysctl: sysctl name -1 1024 2: No such file or directory Retrieval of descriptions is not implemented yet. I'm afraid you'll need to resort to grepping through the source... > > Any idea as to what's going on here? > > Also, I seem to remember hearing about a method used on SunOS to send the > first four bytes of the data payload back with the SYN ACK which gives the > appearance of improved performance on benchmarks. Does anybody know as to > whether this is possible under any version of FreeBSD? I'll move to 4.0 if > I have to. :) There was a recent discussion (about a month ago) on -current about delayed ACKs. It's in the archives. Andrzej Bialecki // WebGiro AB, Sweden (http://www.webgiro.com) // ------------------------------------------------------------------- // ------ FreeBSD: The Power to Serve. http://www.freebsd.org -------- // --- Small & Embedded FreeBSD: http://www.freebsd.org/~picobsd/ ---- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 12:34:53 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from tardis.patho.gen.nz (tardis.patho.gen.nz [203.97.2.226]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86FFA37B88E for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 12:34:42 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jabley@tardis.patho.gen.nz) Received: (from jabley@localhost) by tardis.patho.gen.nz (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA00177; Sun, 5 Mar 2000 09:34:29 +1300 (NZDT) Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 09:34:28 +1300 From: Joe Abley To: Paul Robinson Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Tuning TCP/IP Performance Message-ID: <20000305093427.A21367@patho.gen.nz> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: ; from wigstah@akitanet.co.uk on Sat, Mar 04, 2000 at 08:21:20PM +0000 X-Files: the Truth is Out There Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG On Sat, Mar 04, 2000 at 08:21:20PM +0000, Paul Robinson wrote: > I've been trying to get TCP/IP performance as fast as possible by playing > around with sysctl (playing in the net.inet area) and so on, and was > wondering if there were any comprehensive resources on this that I've > missed. I haven't heard of any algorithms to tune TCP automagically. When I work with people who have satellite hops in their network, we usually have to tune the TCP knobs by hand, trying a large number of transactions and statistically minimising transaction time. > Whenever I do a sysctl -d -a to get a list of descriptions, I get > the following on 3.2-RELEASE: > > sysctl: sysctl name -1 1024 2: No such file or directory I get that too, but I had never noticed because I didn't know about the "d" flag :) FreeBSD 3.3-RELEASE FreeBSD 3.3-RELEASE #1: Sat Dec 4 15:21:53 NZDT 1999. > Any idea as to what's going on here? > > Also, I seem to remember hearing about a method used on SunOS to send the > first four bytes of the data payload back with the SYN ACK which gives the > appearance of improved performance on benchmarks. Does anybody know as to > whether this is possible under any version of FreeBSD? I'll move to 4.0 if > I have to. :) This is what I generally do before I try to tune anything further: # turn on RFC1323 extensions (timestamps, PAWS, window scaling, etc) These # seem to be on by default in 3.3, YMMV for 3.2. sysctl -w net.inet.tcp.rfc1323=1 # open up the send and receive windows to 131072 bytes; the default # 16k is too small for people living oceans away from the majority of # their content sysctl -w net.inet.tcp.sendspace=131072 sysctl -w net.inet.tcp.recvspace=131072 # If 4.0 (or later 3.x's) support SACK, turn that on here too. SACK is # cool :) This is what I use on OpenBSD: sysctl -w net.inet.tcp.sack=1 # If you want to try transactional TCP (T/TCP, RFC1644) which is the # thing you mentioned with the single segment with SIN, ACK, FIN + payload, # turn this on: sysctl -w net.inet.tcp.rfc1644=1 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 12:51:47 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from dt051n0b.san.rr.com (dt051n0b.san.rr.com [204.210.32.11]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80ECB37B7B5 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 12:51:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Doug@gorean.org) Received: from gorean.org (doug@master [10.0.0.2]) by dt051n0b.san.rr.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA91595; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 12:50:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Doug@gorean.org) Message-ID: <38C1770E.1DD2EB4E@gorean.org> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 12:50:22 -0800 From: Doug Barton Organization: Triborough Bridge & Tunnel Authority X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.0-CURRENT-0302 i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Sheldon Hearn Cc: Max Khon , hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: empty lists in for References: <57223.952177003@axl.ops.uunet.co.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Sheldon Hearn wrote: > > On Mon, 21 Feb 2000 22:10:15 +0600, Max Khon wrote: > > > bash and ksh complain about unexpected ';'. > > /bin/sh (FreeBSD) thinks it's ok and does nothing. > > Which behaviour is more POSIXly correct? > > Neither bash nor ksh claim to be particularly POSIX compliant. I can't speak knowledgeably about ksh, but bash has POSIX compliance as one of it's main goals. Check out http://freebsd.simplenet.com/Bash-FAQ.txt and search for the word POSIX. It even has a "posix mode" that makes it more strict than it already is. > our /bin/sh does. We do a pretty good job here of course. People like Martin Cracauer (and a host of others) have worked very hard to keep our /bin/sh in line with the standards. > I seem to remember POSIX being ambiguous on this one, but > my books are at the office. If you haven't gotten a more conclusive > answer by Monday, mail me and I'll look it up. Unfortunately I missed the original. What was the questioner trying to do? Doug -- "Welcome to the desert of the real." - Laurence Fishburne as Morpheus, "The Matrix" To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 14: 2:17 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from internal.mail.demon.net (internal.mail.demon.net [193.195.224.3]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E5B037B8AD for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 14:02:07 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from fanf@demon.net) Received: from fanf.eng.demon.net (fanf.eng.demon.net [195.11.55.89]) by internal.mail.demon.net with ESMTP id WAA20256; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 22:01:53 GMT Received: from fanf by fanf.eng.demon.net with local (Exim 3.12 #3) id 12RMcJ-0002mZ-00; Sat, 04 Mar 2000 22:01:43 +0000 To: jabley@patho.gen.nz From: Tony Finch Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Tuning TCP/IP Performance In-Reply-To: <20000305093427.A21367@patho.gen.nz> References: Message-Id: Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 22:01:44 +0000 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Joe Abley wrote: > > If 4.0 (or later 3.x's) support SACK, turn that on here too. Neither of them does. Tony. -- f.a.n.finch fanf@demon.net dot@dotat.at 441 the tone-arm of turbidity To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 14: 6: 6 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail-blue.research.att.com (mail-blue.research.att.com [135.207.30.102]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A0A737B897 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 14:06:04 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from fenner@research.att.com) Received: from alliance.research.att.com (alliance.research.att.com [135.207.26.26]) by mail-blue.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A0FE4CE19; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 17:05:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from windsor.research.att.com (windsor.research.att.com [135.207.26.46]) by alliance.research.att.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA21604; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 17:05:58 -0500 (EST) From: Bill Fenner Received: (from fenner@localhost) by windsor.research.att.com (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.5) id OAA13663; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 14:05:28 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200003042205.OAA13663@windsor.research.att.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: don.lewis@tsc.tdk.com Subject: Re: Keeping using locally modified source Cc: assar@sics.se, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <200003030059.TAA29567@rac4.wam.umd.edu> <20000302171652.A22288@orion.ac.hmc.edu> <5laekg8h44.fsf@assaris.sics.se> <200003031102.DAA09390@salsa.gv.tsc.tdk.com> Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 14:05:28 -0800 Versions: dmail (solaris) 2.2g/makemail 2.9a Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I've got this program in my head that takes a CVS tree and turns it into a branch ofanother CVS tree (e.g. FreeBSD rev 1.7 turns into rev 1.1.1.7) but it's never managed to make it out of my head, so it must be harder than I keep thinking it is =) Bill To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 14:53:54 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (blaubaer.kn-bremen.de [195.37.179.254]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 984BA37B6F7; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 14:53:47 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from nox@saturn.kn-bremen.de) Received: from saturn.kn-bremen.de (uucp@localhost) by blaubaer.kn-bremen.de (8.9.1/8.9.1) with UUCP id XAA18631; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 23:47:51 +0100 Received: (from nox@localhost) by saturn.kn-bremen.de (8.9.3/8.8.5) id XAA82879; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 23:43:07 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 23:43:07 +0100 (CET) From: Juergen Lock Message-Id: <200003042243.XAA82879@saturn.kn-bremen.de> To: kuku@gilberto.physik.RWTH-Aachen.DE Subject: ijppp for isdn, ppp compression, and netgraph (also: load balancing) X-Newsgroups: local.list.freebsd.isdn In-Reply-To: <200003031038.LAA52158@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de> Organization: home Cc: freebsd-isdn@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In article <200003031038.LAA52158@gil.physik.rwth-aachen.de> you write: >Don't know whether it is the right term but what would be >desirable is a way to raise priority of certain protocols, and >lower e.g. ftp, http and such. > >You know what I mean? You are fetching a big file, but wanna do >an rlogin at the same time. I'm doing so right now and >it's no fun to type while 7.2Kb/s are running over your head >at the same time :-) I was just looking (finally :) at ijppp again now that it knows i4b, and it already does something like this, look for `set urgent' in its manpage (man ppp). (if you still want to stick with isppp or raw hdlc you could probably also use altq but thats not in the base system.) Of course to really help for the fetching-a-big-file case the same thing would have to be done at the other end of the link as well... And the other reason i'm looking at ijppp is ppp compression. It currently supports deflate (rfc1979) and predictor1 (rfc1978), which should at least help if the other end is running bsd or linux, but if your other end is something like an ascend or an external router (zyxel, cisco(?), there are probably more that speak this protocol), you'd want stac lzs (rfc1974), or if its a wintendo box even you'd want M$' special version of that (yes of course they invented their own `standard' again.) So my question is, is anyone working on this? There is (alpha) code that does this on linux, http://www.ibh-dd.de/~beck/stuff/lzs4i4l/ apparently the only thing it doesn't do is ascend's original predecessor of rfc1974 but it seems at least the later ascends can also be configured to do `proper' rfc1974, they only (well...) do the older thing by default. (ok there also seem to be patent issues with this type of compression and that linux source is GPL'd too so it probably at best could become a port, but that shouldn't stop it from being useful.) And the last thing, is anyone working on moving more of ppp back into the kernel, like, by using netgraph? (i hadn't really looked at this netgraph thing yet until i read the daemonnews article today... impressive stuff.) and is someone working on linking i4b and netgraph? that seems to be the logical way to do more complex stuff like this aodi thing that e.g. the german Telekom wants to use for their low-bandwidth 10 DEM/month isdn `flatrate' which they plan to introduce around the end of the year. (and _if_ this really works it sure will become pretty popular over here as long as all the other `real' flatrates are still in the 100 DEM or more range... :/ ) this seems to be the current draft: http://www.ietf.cnri.reston.va.us/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-pppext-aodi-02.txt Regards, -- Juergen Lock (remove dot foo from address to reply) To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 16: 3:37 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from agora.rdrop.com (agora.rdrop.com [199.2.210.241]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C03E537B8D4 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 16:03:34 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from batie@agora.rdrop.com) Received: (from batie@localhost) by agora.rdrop.com (8.8.5/8.8.7) id QAA28756; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 16:03:33 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from batie) Message-ID: <20000304160333.28186@rdrop.com> Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 16:03:33 -0800 From: Alan Batie To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Onstream? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-md5; boundary=h31gzZEtNLTqOjlF X-Mailer: Mutt 0.88 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG --h31gzZEtNLTqOjlF Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I just got an onstream scsi tape drive only to discover that I should've checked the archives because it don't work. I see that 6+ months ago there was some talk about working on it eventually and I thought I'd see if anything came of that? Is there work being done or should I just send it back? It would be a real shame as for the capacity (25G) it's far cheaper than anything else. Looks like they've taken a Travan cartridge and made it a lot bigger to hold more tape. -- Alan Batie ______ www.rdrop.com/users/batie Me batie@agora.rdrop.com \ / www.qrd.org The Triangle PGPFP DE 3C 29 17 C0 49 7A \ / www.pgpi.com The Weird Numbers 27 40 A5 3C 37 4A DA 52 B9 \/ www.anti-spam.net NO SPAM! --h31gzZEtNLTqOjlF Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQCVAwUBOMGkVIv4wNua7QglAQEUIwQAh1aEO0JKFgd+HCHxuTqOHOj/qX0TXcvP zuJUNKyugfaiXgZqy9j9Oye4IDC32stbmavhECRUajdMW7ofG70T4B8JV/sbhdmj 9L6lsxYx7xIoBgVYlxxjrTVdIji/P0TeVl+N8pAGw5agVxz+3Hk1sPOj5iAiZOa6 x2pAVBfbEUU= =hXhJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --h31gzZEtNLTqOjlF-- To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 16:17:28 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from feral.com (feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3581E37B8E9 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 16:17:24 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from semuta.feral.com (semuta [192.67.166.70]) by feral.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id QAA03906; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 16:17:15 -0800 Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 16:17:15 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Jacob Reply-To: mjacob@feral.com To: Alan Batie Cc: freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Onstream? In-Reply-To: <20000304160333.28186@rdrop.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG I gave up on supporting it- too much work for too little gain, IMO. However, somebody has contacted me about doing the work, but it'll be quite some time before it would be supported. On Sat, 4 Mar 2000, Alan Batie wrote: > I just got an onstream scsi tape drive only to discover that I should've > checked the archives because it don't work. I see that 6+ months ago > there was some talk about working on it eventually and I thought I'd > see if anything came of that? Is there work being done or should I > just send it back? It would be a real shame as for the capacity (25G) > it's far cheaper than anything else. Looks like they've taken a > Travan cartridge and made it a lot bigger to hold more tape. > > -- > Alan Batie ______ www.rdrop.com/users/batie Me > batie@agora.rdrop.com \ / www.qrd.org The Triangle > PGPFP DE 3C 29 17 C0 49 7A \ / www.pgpi.com The Weird Numbers > 27 40 A5 3C 37 4A DA 52 B9 \/ www.anti-spam.net NO SPAM! > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 17:22:34 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from rover.village.org (rover.village.org [204.144.255.49]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 708EA37B908 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 17:22:30 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (harmony.village.org [10.0.0.6]) by rover.village.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA48509; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 18:22:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from imp@harmony.village.org) Received: from harmony.village.org (localhost.village.org [127.0.0.1]) by harmony.village.org (8.9.3/8.8.3) with ESMTP id SAA39251; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 18:22:09 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <200003050122.SAA39251@harmony.village.org> To: mjacob@feral.com Subject: Re: Onstream? Cc: Alan Batie , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 04 Mar 2000 16:17:15 PST." References: Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 18:22:09 -0700 From: Warner Losh Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG In message Matthew Jacob writes: : I gave up on supporting it- too much work for too little gain, IMO. The same thing happened on the IDE side of things. Even with Soren's hacks, I never could get it to work well. It worked as well as one would expect a win-tape drive to work :-<. I have one of these beasts if someone wants it. I got it from the onstream folks (they have an office here in Longmont). I tried to help Soren out, but my tolerence for working in the project was extremely low. Warner To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 17:24:22 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from feral.com (feral.com [192.67.166.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B6CA37B937 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 17:24:20 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from mjacob@feral.com) Received: from semuta.feral.com (semuta [192.67.166.70]) by feral.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA03994; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 17:24:10 -0800 Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 17:24:10 -0800 (PST) From: Matthew Jacob Reply-To: mjacob@feral.com To: Warner Losh Cc: Alan Batie , freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Onstream? In-Reply-To: <200003050122.SAA39251@harmony.village.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Ditto here. What happened with me on this is that I looked at the amount of fooling around it would take, then heard they'd do a "real" SCSI i/f in the next 6 months, and so dropped the ball. I have one also, which I can let someone have. On Sat, 4 Mar 2000, Warner Losh wrote: > In message Matthew Jacob writes: > : I gave up on supporting it- too much work for too little gain, IMO. > > The same thing happened on the IDE side of things. Even with Soren's > hacks, I never could get it to work well. It worked as well as one > would expect a win-tape drive to work :-<. > > I have one of these beasts if someone wants it. I got it from the > onstream folks (they have an office here in Longmont). I tried to > help Soren out, but my tolerence for working in the project was > extremely low. > > Warner > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 18:39:34 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from awfulhak.org (dynamic-87.max4-du-ws.dialnetwork.pavilion.co.uk [212.74.9.215]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E79F137B6FA; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 18:39:22 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from brian@Awfulhak.org) Received: from hak.lan.Awfulhak.org (root@hak.lan.awfulhak.org [172.16.0.12]) by awfulhak.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA94377; Sun, 5 Mar 2000 01:26:23 GMT (envelope-from brian@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org) Received: from hak.lan.Awfulhak.org (brian@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hak.lan.Awfulhak.org (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA01922; Sun, 5 Mar 2000 01:25:51 GMT (envelope-from brian@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org) Message-Id: <200003050125.BAA01922@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 To: Juergen Lock Cc: kuku@gilberto.physik.RWTH-Aachen.DE, freebsd-isdn@FreeBSD.org, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.org, brian@hak.lan.Awfulhak.org Subject: Re: ijppp for isdn, ppp compression, and netgraph (also: load balancing) In-Reply-To: Message from Juergen Lock of "Sat, 04 Mar 2000 23:43:07 +0100." <200003042243.XAA82879@saturn.kn-bremen.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 01:25:50 +0000 From: Brian Somers Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG > And the last thing, is anyone working on moving more of ppp back > into the kernel, like, by using netgraph? (i hadn't really looked > at this netgraph thing yet until i read the daemonnews article > today... impressive stuff.) and is someone working on linking i4b > and netgraph? that seems to be the logical way to do more complex > stuff like this aodi thing that e.g. the german Telekom wants to use > for their low-bandwidth 10 DEM/month isdn `flatrate' which they plan to > introduce around the end of the year. (and _if_ this really works it > sure will become pretty popular over here as long as all the other `real' > flatrates are still in the 100 DEM or more range... :/ ) this seems to > be the current draft: > > http://www.ietf.cnri.reston.va.us/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-pppext-aodi-02.txt I'm looking at pushing more stuff into the kernel using netgraph, but I haven't had much of a chance recently to work on it. Hellmuth has also created an i4b netgraph node, but again, I haven't had a chance to do much with it. Now that I've got a free-in-the-evenings ISDN connection, I have no excuses left though.... (except that it's showing up busy at the moment). Once the freeze is over, I'll be looking at getting things under way. > Regards, > -- > Juergen Lock > (remove dot foo from address to reply) -- Brian Don't _EVER_ lose your sense of humour ! To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 20:38:48 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.ptd.net (mail1.ha-net.ptd.net [207.44.96.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 94FA137B958 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 20:38:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tms2@mail.ptd.net) Received: (qmail 4442 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 04:38:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.ptd.net) (204.186.33.231) by mail.ptd.net with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 04:38:50 -0000 Message-ID: <38C1E4A9.C796D970@mail.ptd.net> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 23:38:01 -0500 From: "Thomas M. Sommers" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Can't write to stdout in assembly References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Brian Fundakowski Feldman wrote: > > On Sat, 4 Mar 2000, Thomas M. Sommers wrote: > > > >From what I understand, the following should print "Hello, world." on > > stdout. I stole the code from the Linux HOWTO, but I think it should > > work on FreeBSD as well. Instead, the call to write returns 9 (EBADF). > > > [ Linux-specific asm elided ... ] > > > > Can anyone explain what I've done wrong? > > > > As a related question, can anyone point me to the source for the int > > 0x80 handler? I've looked all over but can't find it. > > You're trying to run Linux assembly on FreeBSD. The calling conventions > are not the same at all, and cannot be treated as such. I couldn't find any documentation for FreeBSD, so used what I found for Linux as a first approximation. At least it assembled and ran, even if it didn't work. > Even if you > really needed to write in assembly, you shouldn't call the syscalls > directly. I'm doing this as a learning exercise, so I wanted to do it the hard way first. > Note that the library stubs are just that, stubs to call > the system calls. Try doing something more along the lines of: > > pushl $stringlen > pushl stringaddr > pushl $0x1 > call write > > which would result in %eax containing the return value. Using write, and making the other appropriate changes to the code, works. write() uses leal 4, %eax instead of movl $4, %eax before the int $0x80 call. But doing this myself still does not work. At first glance, it doesn't seem that the C startup stuff does anything that would affect syscalls, so I don't see why calling write() would make a difference. > For what it's worth, you can find all of the syscall calling conventions > in src/lib/libc, and you can find where the calling conventions are > "defined" by looking at src/sys/i386/i386/trap.c. It looks like syscall() in trap.c is where int $0x80 is handled. I'll have to do some more digging. Thanks for the help. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 21:20:33 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from mail.ptd.net (mail1.ha-net.ptd.net [207.44.96.65]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id AE88537B972 for ; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 21:20:28 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from tms2@mail.ptd.net) Received: (qmail 2598 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2000 05:20:34 -0000 Received: from du39.cli.ptd.net (HELO mail.ptd.net) (204.186.33.39) by mail.ptd.net with SMTP; 5 Mar 2000 05:20:34 -0000 Message-ID: <38C1EE72.B72F520D@mail.ptd.net> Date: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 00:19:46 -0500 From: "Thomas M. Sommers" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freebsd-Hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Can't write to stdout in assembly References: <20000304194140.48F3D2E803@hermes.tue.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG Marco van de Voort wrote: > > > >From what I understand, the following should print "Hello, world." on > > stdout. I stole the code from the Linux HOWTO, but I think it should > > work on FreeBSD as well. Instead, the call to write returns 9 (EBADF). > > I disassembled FreeBSD programs (create a small C prog, compile, and use > objdump), and it looks more like this: (I haven't tested this yet, but it is definitely > stack based, not register based, the part which I haven't tested is if the placing > the int $0x80 behind a call is required) > It turns out that placing the int $0x80 behind a call is required. I infer that the kernel does not look for the arguments at the top of the stack, but farther down. When you think about it, that makes some sense, since any sane person would call the kernel through libc, and not directly. Thanks for the help. In the remote chance that anyone is interested, here is the code that works: .data msg: .string "Hello, world.\n" len = . - msg - 1 .text .global _start _start: pushl $len pushl $msg pushl $1 movl $4, %eax call make_syscall addl $12, %esp movl $1, %eax pushl $0 call make_syscall make_syscall: int $0x80 ret To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 21:32:56 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from hcshh.hcs.de (hcshh.hcs.de [194.123.40.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 02F4037B96F; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 21:32:48 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from hm@hcs.de) Received: from hcswork.hcs.de([192.76.124.5]) (3596 bytes) by hcshh.hcs.de via sendmail with P:smtp/R:inet_hosts/T:smtp (sender: ) id for ; Sun, 5 Mar 2000 06:32:46 +0100 (CET) (Smail-3.2.0.104 1998-Nov-20 #1 built 1998-Dec-11) Received: by hcswork.hcs.de (Postfix, from userid 200) id 84D2336AB; Sun, 5 Mar 2000 06:32:45 +0100 (MET) Subject: Re: ijppp for isdn, ppp compression, and netgraph (also: load balancing) In-Reply-To: <200003042243.XAA82879@saturn.kn-bremen.de> from Juergen Lock at "Mar 4, 0 11:43:07 pm" To: nox@jelal.kn-bremen.de (Juergen Lock) Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2000 06:32:45 +0100 (MET) Cc: kuku@gilberto.physik.RWTH-Aachen.DE, freebsd-isdn@FreeBSD.ORG, freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Reply-To: hm@hcs.de Organization: HCS Hanseatischer Computerservice GmbH X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL39 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 2559 Message-Id: <20000305053245.84D2336AB@hcswork.hcs.de> From: hm@hcs.de (Hellmuth Michaelis) Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG From the keyboard of Juergen Lock: > And the other reason i'm looking at ijppp is ppp compression. It > currently supports deflate (rfc1979) and predictor1 (rfc1978), which > should at least help if the other end is running bsd or linux, > but if your other end is something like an ascend or an external > router (zyxel, cisco(?), there are probably more that speak this > protocol), you'd want stac lzs (rfc1974), or if its a wintendo box > even you'd want M$' special version of that (yes of course they > invented their own `standard' again.) So my question is, is > anyone working on this? There is (alpha) code that does this on > linux, > > http://www.ibh-dd.de/~beck/stuff/lzs4i4l/ I've looked at that. Its very Linux-centric and i gave up for the moment when i realized how much work it would be to port it. Brian's ppp over i4b does support deflate compression and i get very good results out of it - too good to put more work into the above URL. > today... impressive stuff.) and is someone working on linking i4b > and netgraph? There will be a netgraph node interface which will link an i4b B-channel to netgraph. There are no plans from my side to netgraphify the D-channel part of i4b. > that seems to be the logical way to do more complex > stuff like this aodi thing that e.g. the german Telekom wants to use > for their low-bandwidth 10 DEM/month isdn `flatrate' which they plan to > introduce around the end of the year. (and _if_ this really works it > sure will become pretty popular over here as long as all the other `real' > flatrates are still in the 100 DEM or more range... :/ ) this seems to > be the current draft: - this "flatrate" will only be available to T-Online customers. Since i'm not such a beast and will probably never become one its of not much use for me. - my usage of the internet is not much compatible with what this "flatrate" offers. - the Telecom does not give away anything for free. Check when, why and most important how you are using the internet: the savings you get using this "flatrate" does not pay even a fraction of the time and work needed to implement this - in my eyes. Anyway, i will happily accepting (clean) code which implements it :-) hellmuth -- Hellmuth Michaelis Tel +49 40 55 97 47-70 HCS Hanseatischer Computerservice GmbH Fax +49 40 55 97 47-77 Oldesloer Strasse 97-99 Mail hm [at] hcs.de D-22457 Hamburg WWW http://www.hcs.de To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message From owner-freebsd-hackers Sat Mar 4 23:36: 9 2000 Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from stage1.thirdage.com (stage1.thirdage.com [4.18.197.236]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 153E037B8C2; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 23:36:03 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from jal@stage1.thirdage.com) Received: (from jal@localhost) by stage1.thirdage.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) id XAA15340; Sat, 4 Mar 2000 23:35:00 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 4 Mar 2000 23:35:00 -0800 From: "Jamie A. Lawrence" To: cjclark@home.com Cc: Brett Glass , Mark Newton , chat@FreeBSD.ORG, "Koster, K.J." , "'FreeBSD Hackers mailing list'" , Wes Peters Subject: Re: Great American Gas Out Message-ID: <20000304233500.A15262@thirdage.com> References: <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> <59063B5B4D98D311BC0D0001FA7E452201313909@l04.research.kpn.com> <38BFEEA8.1A465CFC@softweyr.com> <20000304101212.A384@internode.com.au> <4.2.2.20000304091423.040b5590@localhost> <20000304132611.B48777@cc942873-a.ewndsr1.nj.home.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4i In-Reply-To: <20000304132611.B48777@cc942873-a.ewndsr1.nj.home.com>; from Crist J. Clark on Sat, Mar 04, 2000 at 01:26:11PM -0500 Sender: owner-freebsd-hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk X-Loop: FreeBSD.ORG ++ 04/03/00 13:26 -0500 - Crist J. Clark: > Driving is an activity that incurrs a cost on society, building roads, > regular maintainance, salter, snow plows, maintainace to fix the > damage the snow plows did, etc. A cost that is not fully realized in the US. > > This week, I traveled from Wyoming to California and discovered that > > gas prices were 25% higher in the Golden State than in the Cowboy > > State. Why? Because Californians "tax" themselves by requiring that > > everyone buy fuel with high concentrations of MTBE, an oxygenating agent. > > MTBE was supposed to reduce pollution, but in fact is a worse pollutant > > than oxides of nitrogen ever were. However, since only California > > refineries make gas with a high enough concentration of MTBE, Californians > > are locked into buying from these few sources and the price goes up. > > WAY up. Los Angeles will have $2.50 gas this summer. > > Yet the number of f*cking SUVs and other gas-guzzling vehicles in the > region will continue to rise as will the miles driven per vehicle. Sure, personal assult vehicles consume more than they pay for. If they were taxed at a sane rate, far fewer people would drive them. This from a serious anarchist who wants to see private roads everywhere. If everyone payed a private entity to get to work, we'd see a saner commute schedule. It would be a lot different. Makes you ("you" meaning people in CA, US) wonder, I hope. I live here. > > It's the same the whole world over. Energy policies and fuel costs aren't > > driven by markets or even common sense. They are controlled by big > > cartels, big government, and politics. > > Just like everything else. The interesting part is that things are about to become a lot different. The same cartels know that, and they may end up on top, but there is a radical change in personal transport coming. Things are becoming interesting. If people choose (if alternative projects advertise well), we'll see neat things happen. -j To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message