From owner-freebsd-arch@freebsd.org Fri May 15 21:24:38 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-arch@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D23842DA536; Fri, 15 May 2020 21:24:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from smtp-out-no.shaw.ca (smtp-out-no.shaw.ca [64.59.134.12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 49P1dK4rsBz4Trd; Fri, 15 May 2020 21:24:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([70.67.125.17]) by shaw.ca with ESMTPA id ZholjRFzcng7KZhonjeaji; Fri, 15 May 2020 15:24:35 -0600 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=ecemg4MH c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:117 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:17 a=xqWC_Br6kY4A:10 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=sTwFKg_x9MkA:10 a=NRF7K_vUAAAA:8 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=EkcXrb_YAAAA:8 a=gs-f4NG6evmkO6fCgWAA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=-TUkS2ffhQBfG7ohTqvO:22 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 a=LK5xJRSDVpKd5WXXoEvA:22 Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (slippy [IPv6:fc00:1:1:1::5b]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 87F985BB; Fri, 15 May 2020 14:24:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 04FLOVL6007256; Fri, 15 May 2020 14:24:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from slippy (cy@localhost) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id 04FLOUNq007253; Fri, 15 May 2020 14:24:31 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Message-Id: <202005152124.04FLOUNq007253@slippy.cwsent.com> X-Authentication-Warning: slippy.cwsent.com: cy owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.9.0 11/07/2018 with nmh-1.7.1 Reply-to: Cy Schubert From: Cy Schubert X-os: FreeBSD X-Sender: cy@cwsent.com X-URL: http://www.cschubert.com/ To: Warner Losh cc: "Julian H. Stacey" , "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" , Kyle Evans , Poul-Henning Kamp , Alan Somers , Arne Steinkamm Subject: Re: [HEADSUP] Disallowing read() of a directory fd In-reply-to: References: <202005151504.04FF423p040952@fire.js.berklix.net> Comments: In-reply-to Warner Losh message dated "Fri, 15 May 2020 09:57:12 -0600." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 15 May 2020 14:24:30 -0700 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfF/LejAwk4X4h+VQDh8s8Y7tD3xRWTO4z/Uh3AqNJMcNt0bNQHxOinQsokyrYz/npQ/hrjg67pmCMVMr5Y6+5g+nOlpTCii7Z8IV/mWNDds0jCWlaYei 0BAiFpRB3J6D0PTF64ws2D7cba+/ISku9/Xfk2yANKMPHnxfCZhvxYLW0K7MtmPehKRvv6fOYgR75HJ+6YhClBPKWpVCOzWkXbKzC8nowAFBTAoAJN67PrKV MT5+tj0NdU9j/fChbiHbBYzEVRk5o5g/3kiPBQ4+aUwrDsT3CM0Im9BTwXKpvLHBGDj7RTZlWN9w6WOQYEqPijSr93skOrhdBBK262b3RVkZqId8Js6cJSKx 5PRIzP0T1eCfNdObuGNmfNqH+mMFKR3F/dPPwBckmkZAmYB2oFI= X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 49P1dK4rsBz4Trd X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of cy.schubert@cschubert.com has no SPF policy when checking 64.59.134.12) smtp.mailfrom=cy.schubert@cschubert.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.25 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_GOOD(0.00)[12.134.59.64.rep.mailspike.net : 127.0.0.18]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[17.125.67.70.khpj7ygk5idzvmvt5x4ziurxhy.zen.dq.spamhaus.net : 127.0.0.11]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[8]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:6327, ipnet:64.59.128.0/20, country:CA]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.55)[ip: (-6.77), ipnet: 64.59.128.0/20(-3.30), asn: 6327(-2.58), country: CA(-0.09)]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[12.134.59.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1] X-BeenThere: freebsd-arch@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.33 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussion related to FreeBSD architecture List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 15 May 2020 21:24:38 -0000 In message , Warner Losh writes: > On Fri, May 15, 2020 at 9:04 AM Julian H. Stacey wrote: > > > kevans@ wasted FreeBSD time with threat of change at 2 days notice, > > for an issue unchanged since 1972. The rush was immature. > > > > kevans@ should retract his threat of forced urgent change, or expect > > core@ be asked to remove his commit bit while FreeBSD considers > > _un-rushed_, allowing sufficient time for all to consider options, > > & to warn users in RELNOTES of any potential future change. > > > > Threats are not tolerated in this project. This hyperbolic response has > gone on long enough. Please stop and treat your fellow committers with > respect and a certain level of professionalism. He's done none of the > nefarious things you've said (I've known about this changes for days if not > weeks as he socialized it, for example). He doesn't deserve this level of > grief over a proposal. It's a request for comments, not a request for abuse > and nasty behaviour. > > This whole thread has gone toxic / hyperbolic over a non-issue. You should > have stopped reading directories in 1983 when readdir was introduced > because UFS broke ls, find, du, etc. At best, it's a nice debugging tool > some folks don't want to lose. At worst, it causes bugs for programs that > accidentally read directories (and maybe some, like grep, need some minor > changes). It's not worth this much bile and venom. +1 -- Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: https://FreeBSD.org NTP: Web: https://nwtime.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few.