From owner-freebsd-chat Tue Aug 20 16:40: 3 2002 Delivered-To: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.FreeBSD.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90A1937B400; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 16:39:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp3.mail.vanderbilt.edu (smtp3.mail.Vanderbilt.Edu [129.59.1.77]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1C8B43E42; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 16:39:51 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from bandix@geekpunk.net) Received: from smtp3.mail.vanderbilt.edu (LOCALHOST [127.0.0.1]) by smtp3.mail.vanderbilt.edu (8.11.6/8.11.6/VU-3.6C+d3.6) with ESMTP id g7KNdH427895; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 18:39:17 -0500 (CDT) Received: from imap3.mail.vanderbilt.edu (imap3.mail.Vanderbilt.Edu [129.59.1.136]) by smtp3.mail.vanderbilt.edu (8.11.6/8.11.6/VU-3.6B+d3.6) with ESMTP id g7KNdGU27885; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 18:39:16 -0500 (CDT) Received: from [192.168.1.101] ([160.129.138.54]) by imap3.mail.vanderbilt.edu (8.11.6/8.11.6/VU-3.6A+d3.6) with ESMTP id g7KNdFY19388; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 18:39:15 -0500 (CDT) Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 18:39:17 -0500 (CDT) From: "Brandon D. Valentine" X-X-Sender: bandix@taran To: Rik van Riel Cc: chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Why did FreeBSD fail? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020820181648.S276-100000@taran> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG Precedence: bulk List-ID: List-Archive: (Web Archive) List-Help: (List Instructions) List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: X-Loop: FreeBSD.org [ Redirected to -chat from -hackers; I'm not on -chat, keep me Cc'd. ] On Tue, 20 Aug 2002, Rik van Riel wrote: > On Tue, 20 Aug 2002, Mosko Bilekic wrote: > > > Gentlemen, it's time to explain why FreeBSD is such a > > failure. > > Maybe it's because the developers prefer to spend their > time and energy on gossip instead of technical issues ? > > No wait, those aren't the developers, can't be. Please > tell me those aren't really the developers... Those most certainly aren't the developers. I will go so far to say with great confidence that the people trolling the list have never written a decently impressive piece of code in their lives. The Internet was once a place where hackers could go about their business without being troubled by such lameness. Unfortunately, the rest of society has jumped onto the Internet and brought their baggage with them. Occasionally one of these non-hackers finds their way into a technical forum and is disappointed when they're made to feel excluded or inferior. They come to the Internet with the misguided notion that they are somehow entitled to some sort of respect or status -- either because they consider themselves of some import in the real world or because they feel that the Internet is their opportunity to grab the piece of the popularity pie that has been denied to them thusfar in life. Most of them experience a rude awakening when the technical forum doesn't even stop to notice them and they become very bitter and vindictive about this perceived "mistreatment". They go so far as to engage in activities such as trolling which drain the community's most valuable resources: it's communication channels and the time of the hackers therein. Behavior of this sort has become the unfortunate and quite obnoxious norm. What this influx of laypeople fail to realize is that the hackers who built and maintain this network built it as a tool for their own ends and have little time to care about the needs of the many. If a non-technical person needs help the prevailing attitude is and should be that that individual can pay for his support. This sense of entitlement to attention, respect or status among non-hackers is a byproduct of a societal emphasis on political correctness and subjectivism. It's annoying. VERY annoying. The engineering community is, has always been, and always should and shall be a meritocracy. There can be no other way. To the trolls I say this: go ahead and feel insulted that nobody paid attention to you. Go ahead and pout. Feel excluded if you must. Nobody excluded you on the basis of who you are. Nobody excluded you because you weren't on the guest list or someone didn't like you. You were excluded for the plain and simple reason that you have yet to demonstrate your worth. You're not entitled to anything. If you want to be part of the club, write some code. We're not elitists, we're practical. Our time is limited. We won't pay attention to you until you bother to demonstrate that you are worth our time. Trolling a mailing list might make you feel good, but nobody cares. Most of us hit delete and kept going without giving it a second thought. If you want people to pay attention to you, write good code or shut the fuck up. Brandon D. Valentine -- http://www.geekpunk.net bandix@geekpunk.net ++[>++++++<-]>[<++++++>-]<.>++++[>+++++<-]>[<+++++>-]<+.+++++++..++ +.>>+++++[<++++++>-]<++.<<+++++++++++++++.>.+++.------.--------.>+. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message