From owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Tue Jun 16 12:20:48 2020 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-questions@mailman.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 017553368AE for ; Tue, 16 Jun 2020 12:20:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from mout.kundenserver.de (mout.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.135]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mout.kundenserver.de", Issuer "TeleSec ServerPass Class 2 CA" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 49mS325wT9z3bP1 for ; Tue, 16 Jun 2020 12:20:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd@edvax.de) Received: from r56.edvax.de ([178.8.33.9]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (mreue009 [212.227.15.167]) with ESMTPA (Nemesis) id 1MTiHd-1jJyYj2LHB-00U3AG; Tue, 16 Jun 2020 14:20:44 +0200 Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2020 14:20:43 +0200 From: Polytropon To: Chris Knipe Cc: FreeBSD - Subject: Re: Mailing List Etiquette was freebsd vs. netbsd Message-Id: <20200616142043.7d599458.freebsd@edvax.de> In-Reply-To: References: <20200613154409.GA89618@neutralgood.org> <13115.1592302784@segfault.tristatelogic.com> <20200616071153.00006f4d@seibercom.net> <20200616075548.000066f1@seibercom.net> <20200616140416.bd7b8bf2.freebsd@edvax.de> Reply-To: Polytropon Organization: EDVAX X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.1.1 (GTK+ 2.24.5; i386-portbld-freebsd8.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:SBjF98/WNP6PIGTU6Pb10c37N3wITZnb0gt+Yt/YgI06yAgDSHg G7LCvhazqRRgcXYQpw6p4kElOBrtioYnpwcKzhsd9UZkzXUkFRXz3J11Nr9yMrhk1BZbdJZ wzwcCyrfWfNaYhKESSbx1PozP2TpIAN0U2XLAYpADJ7FTzk8HpfU4/LS3QlxCrFbTO5XCtx Zs3imBOuF+TCHzjsRl7hQ== X-Spam-Flag: NO X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:01gjgiYdceM=:uMTTo4Z/ZTRHS2EdPJVUfC T2M07Fz7jKdGR3iqMsh5PJNUBH1DMhbaZ0JGP55reWQa9Yhpb5vDdHKXqVBRfJNevy6DNULuQ LxLQV8qdPfJKzeIWaEiiqMR01SN0PzAPLCBsVxR2PvxEkIX6nAoq9NN9maQVO3DVAqRkShj6C 29x0C37MVzPGFm4aa9Il1qwMRn01WYX+n8djaiNrHE+Xhg7vZo5jJcgFfSBdBz4WKhv6Atrx7 dXEybABMVg/JalaCPY3eNjrhoak19AD0YRsenLCLyKV51qkCAQsFl04M/C8HIqmcMnHwhXnUz sFUPlQHt2EzZbh0BvE001/+KVH0293FZ6S8dT5blq+HbG0qwqacbixnABNbWFknzdTiaF/Fx0 GUcjXw+xROSKYZhHp+1xHGe6AD76fmcJh54o96KN0iyiwrYN4fLsm2usNBHMGcmPcga3pZu3c bqlpLfRptCaYyWgJatlCXk1JYMxIQ8A/M8W2b2YHYYM3NxoylSn701XQuJRy4p0+OEWMZwGb5 Z58BvgKcwjt81lWV6kiiWsloLOdBe4tsUsYDV0j5MadhIGwTPK3KLzM32F5I0TjIF1kGX8Rcz X0lndLUyepcWSbadgFNiN65MxQR4k345QRYbE4W0MspqcV6cPByex5mDK1lLHz/KwOA7IweSa 2Gl+DwydJpl4igVkGne/S5/vBMAw27Q0QJPyAj5XnxJrMdA+lI0h0AUpPSyvcDLGGS4ZxSQOm ntjfjfSmV8+rDwE74IZG3wcb4vlbzIvQvxFRLnBiWQFvK36b03IhkHe+y5mtS0G46zn2lJkN0 AvkysCMBjjrTlREo4U60L0fLSnduElfUE79KzmjJQ9+OpSrOERD8Y0xnB2iWO7ejBYCNSxD X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 49mS325wT9z3bP1 X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=none; dmarc=none; spf=none (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of freebsd@edvax.de has no SPF policy when checking 212.227.126.135) smtp.mailfrom=freebsd@edvax.de X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.47 / 15.00]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[freebsd@edvax.de]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; HAS_ORG_HEADER(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.91)[-0.909]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[178.8.33.9:received]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:8560, ipnet:212.227.0.0/16, country:DE]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[edvax.de]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.10)[0.096]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.88)[0.880]; MID_CONTAINS_FROM(1.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[212.227.126.135:from]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[no SPF record]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[212.227.126.135:from]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.33 Precedence: list List-Id: User questions List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2020 12:20:48 -0000 On Tue, 16 Jun 2020 14:11:46 +0200, Chris Knipe wrote: > > > > > > While this is true in general, one should always keep in > > mind not to confuse change with improvement: "newer" does > > not magically imply "better", so educated human judgement > > is always welcome. > > > > That is your opinion, and you're entitled to it. Frankly, I am -very- > happy we have moved past 76 character width limitations, [...] This I can definitely agree with - advancement in time _and_ improvement. While it doesn't mean anything technical for the message to have short or long text lines, it's the MUAs task to present them to the user in a way that the user wishes. Remember it never was a limitation: you could send mails with long lines from the beginning, it was a _suggestion_ due to terminal width and addition of quoting levels (see term "comb quotes" for possible unwanted results). > [...] and text based > emails with crappy fonts. I don't understand this. It's rather the other way round when you have HTML-based emails that force a specific unreadable font face and font size, and your MUA cannot be configured for a bigger minimum font size. In text mails, it's the _MUA's_ responsibility to offer the best font that the user (!) desires; in text-based MUAs, this responsibility is moved to the terminal emulator. Luckily, both GUI MUAs and terminals today offer you to change the font to whatever you want - and this option has been there for decades. This is, in my opinion, not a problem with the mail (being text), but wuth the MUA (using unusable fonts and settings). Fonts are not a matter of normal text email. They _can_ be a problem with HTML email. (I won't discuss in how far a mail client is supposed to contain a HTML rendering engine, epsecially in the absence of normal multipart "text _and_ HTML" mail generation.) -- Polytropon Magdeburg, Germany Happy FreeBSD user since 4.0 Andra moi ennepe, Mousa, ...