Skip site navigation (1)Skip section navigation (2)
Date:      Mon, 28 Jul 2014 22:18:38 -0700
From:      Jos Backus <jos@catnook.com>
To:        Jordan Hubbard <jkh@mail.turbofuzz.com>
Cc:        arch@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: XML Output: libxo - provide single API to output TXT, XML, JSON and HTML
Message-ID:  <CAETOPp0c1xfMj1vDvQRSoV3ec-LdJmyT9AFH02iziN0yuY1D-A@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <A1E63A7A-BB38-4CC3-B5EC-B251BE990572@mail.turbofuzz.com>
References:  <20140725044921.9F0D3580A2@chaos.jnpr.net> <CAETOPp13H7kyLy-1VJRDOsDbOh8A1MWZDxw1xHUBsxTRtMfc7g@mail.gmail.com> <20140728054217.AC1A0580A2@chaos.jnpr.net> <20140728055336.GJ50802@ivaldir.etoilebsd.net> <CAETOPp3hJB8Gj%2BPMj3N951krnNqCYiAOY-cPHxMCBy1CQXWJaQ@mail.gmail.com> <A1E63A7A-BB38-4CC3-B5EC-B251BE990572@mail.turbofuzz.com>

next in thread | previous in thread | raw e-mail | index | archive | help
On Jul 28, 2014 9:49 PM, "Jordan Hubbard" <jkh@mail.turbofuzz.com> wrote:
>
>
> On Jul 27, 2014, at 11:06 PM, Jos Backus <jos@catnook.com> wrote:
>
> > It would be great if libyaml and libucl would converge, but instead it'=
s
> > likely that the number of solutions trying to solve the same problem
will
> > continue to proliferate, and we are stuck with more and more
configuration
> > file formats :-(
>
> I=E2=80=99m a huge fan of unified data formats; Apple picked XML and the =
plist
DTD a long time ago, a decision which has worked rather nicely in practice,
but I=E2=80=99m more in love with the unification that produced than I am i=
n love
with XML itself.  That said, it seems like this late push for YAML is a
similar case for divergence just because=E2=80=A6erm=E2=80=A6 you don=E2=80=
=99t like JSON?  It
seems like libucl has basically backed JSON with the addition of a little
syntactic sugar, so what=E2=80=99s wrong with that?

In general, as a tool, JSON is more limited/less expressive than YAML. Now
YAGNI may apply here but I personally am not sure so I'm tempted to opt for
the more flexible tool because of that. I could be wrong and maybe JSON is
all that's ever needed.

> Is there some reason JSON is not sufficient?  I think that=E2=80=99s a be=
tter
question to ask, since the conversation otherwise quickly tends to sound a
little like =E2=80=9CI=E2=80=99ll accept any single unified format as long =
as it=E2=80=99s the
specific one I like!=E2=80=9D :)   I think the greater good argument would =
suggest
just picking one that=E2=80=99s expressive enough (roll a pair of dice), pu=
t on
your bikeshed-proof sunglasses, and proceed.

That's a good point, and one I don't really disagree with. The main goal
here is to get us machine parsable output.

But part of me is sad because it's a lost opportunity to promote the more
flexible format. One of the reasons JSON is so popular is the network
effect, I think (it's popular because it's popular). Oh well. :)

Jos

>
> - Jordan
>



Want to link to this message? Use this URL: <https://mail-archive.FreeBSD.org/cgi/mid.cgi?CAETOPp0c1xfMj1vDvQRSoV3ec-LdJmyT9AFH02iziN0yuY1D-A>