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Date:      Sun, 7 Nov 2004 07:16:54 -0800
From:      gabriel <normal1.lists@gmail.com>
To:        Ted Mittelstaedt <tedm@toybox.placo.com>
Cc:        "R. W." <list-freebsd-2004@morbius.sent.com>
Subject:   Re: DSL support
Message-ID:  <efb858204110707166b6bd6e1@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <LOBBIFDAGNMAMLGJJCKNCEJLEPAA.tedm@toybox.placo.com>
References:  <200411070039.45830.list-freebsd-2004@morbius.sent.com> <LOBBIFDAGNMAMLGJJCKNCEJLEPAA.tedm@toybox.placo.com>

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lol, do you work for cisco? - Overall, his views are agreeable. Or get cable! :\


On Sun, 7 Nov 2004 01:49:34 -0800, Ted Mittelstaedt
<tedm@toybox.placo.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> > [mailto:owner-freebsd-questions@freebsd.org]On Behalf Of R. W.
> > Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2004 4:40 PM
> > To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
> > Subject: Re: DSL support
> >
> >
> > On Saturday 06 November 2004 15:34, Mark wrote:
> > > I am on sbc dsl and found this page covered the setup.
> > >
> > > http://renaud.waldura.com/doc/freebsd/pppoe/
> > >
> > > On Fri, Nov 05, 2004 at 09:54:30AM -0800, William Scott wrote:
> > > > Dear Sir or Madam,
> > > >
> > > > Is there any support/documentation for configuring FreeBSD for
> > > > use with a DSL modem (my ISP is SBC)?
> >
> > I recently had some trouble in setting up an ADSL modem (it didn't work
> > with 5.2.1). What I did in the end was buy a 4-port ADSL NAT router,
> > and I think it's actually for the best. They are quite cheap these
> > days, and they have some strong advantages over a basic modem.
> >
> 
> Hi R.W.,
> 
>   I work at an ISP and before anyone goes running off and buying a
> ADSL router please consider this.
> 
>   We have recommended these for the past 3 years now, for DSL lines,
> ever since we started selling DSL.  The big advantage of them from
> our point of view is that windows systems tend to not get infected
> with viruses as rapidly - thus we get fewer support calls.  The
> primary one we have always recommended has been the Linksys BEFSR41.
> This one has several advantages - it can act as a router -or- address
> translator, it has logging, and can send the log to a remote syslogger
> host.  (there is a program someone wrote for FreeBSD that captures the
> log output, BTW)
> 
>   HOWEVER - we are no longer recommending the Linksys devices.  Why -
> because over the last 3 months we have had an increasing number of them
> which have been installed for several years, just fail.  And the failures
> aren't pretty.  Usually the packet flows through the router start getting
> slower and slower, and the user gets an increasing number of disconnections
> from websites and such that they go to.  It is insidious, and very very
> difficult to tell the difference from either a congested ISP or virus
> activity, so most often the user just gets more and more dissatisfied
> with their DSL line, never realizing it's the cheap router that's the
> problem.  When things get bad enough they start power-cycling the router
> and that 'fixes' things for a few hours, and the customer
> gets the impression that this is 'normal' for these devices.
> 
>   It has almost cost us several customers as the customer blames the ISP
> for slowness and not their $35 cheapass device.  And initially when it
> started happening, we didn't catch on that quick.  And we have spent
> far too much time with troubleshooting them now.  Unfortunately a number
> of business customers we have, put these devices in a couple years back
> when they signed up, and now these are coming back to haunt us.
> 
>   And the thing that really scares me is that we have recently had a
> few of these problems show up with dlink and other manufacturers devices.
> I am just hoping that this isn't the start of a trend.
> 
>   Today what we recommend ethernet-to-ethernet Cisco routers or Cisco
> PIX firewalls for businesses.  The PIX and modern Cisco IOS can be
> setup to speak PPPoE directly.  And a used 10-user PIX 501 can be had
> on Ebay fairly cheaply, I have seen them go as cheap as $200, and it
> is ideal for a home setup - assuming that is, that someone at the house
> is really in to networking and wants to work with the real equipment
> that industry uses, not the toys that you get at Fry's.
> 
>   And for home users that are technical but too cheap to do that, I tell
> them to use a PC setup as a router, NOT one of these.
> 
>   Unfortunately we have way too many nontechnical windows users who these
> devices are pretty much the only way they have of putting up a firewall.
> Nowadays when I talk with one of them I put the Fear of God into them
> about these devices with instructions to call immediately if they notice
> the slightest problem with their connections, and I cross my fingers
> that when the time comes for the device to die, that they remember what
> I told them.
> 
>   One last thing with these, while they can do a lot, if you need to
> run a pptp server, it is very problematic to get them to work.  At least
> when using a FreeBSD system as a router, you get a real public IP number
> on the outside interface, rather than everything being private, and
> if you want to run a server, you will have fewest problems with this
> setup over the long run.
> 
> Ted
> 
> 
> 
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-- 
gabriel,

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