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Sun, 28 Apr 2019 16:57:13 +0000 From: abhja kaanlani To: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" Subject: (HBI) Implementing SQLite into the FreeBSD kernel Thread-Topic: (HBI) Implementing SQLite into the FreeBSD kernel Thread-Index: AQHU/eNt/ohpgGTWwEOnH1bISHJHCQ== Date: Sun, 28 Apr 2019 16:57:13 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-incomingtopheadermarker: OriginalChecksum:07A1BDBAB8B7D1094518875ECF2E27C3C75ED59D4D80E83F0B2A3CF550111687; UpperCasedChecksum:84184054AE350691C74ED117000D8800EA78FAD33ABB6A963A61941960A96C18; SizeAsReceived:6729; Count:41 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [WyJ3DltS15IgqZY7xE917NnpMySeD+mEmF528SRTqn22pIiJIfB6e9Qpm62X6jLx] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-incomingheadercount: 41 x-eopattributedmessage: 0 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(5050001)(7020095)(20181119110)(201702061078)(5061506573)(5061507331)(1603103135)(2017031320274)(2017031323274)(2017031324274)(2017031322404)(1601125500)(1603101475)(1701031045); 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RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[live.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.3.0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 28 Apr 2019 16:57:17 -0000 SEJJIHN0YW5kcyBmb3IgaGFsZiBiYWtlZCBpZGVhDQoNCkkgZG9u4oCZdCBrbm93IG11Y2ggYWJv dXQgdGhlIEZyZWVCU0Qga2VybmVsLCBidXQgd2UgY2FuIGFkZCBzcWwgbWV0YWRhdGEgdG8gY2Vy dGFpbiBjb2RlIGZvciBzZWxmIGNvbnRhaW5lZCBkb2N1bWVudGF0aW9uIA0KDQpXaGF0IGRvZXMg ZXZlcnlvbmUgdGhpbms/DQoNClNlbnQgZnJvbSBteSBpUGhvbmU= From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sun Apr 28 17:03:56 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15E64158371B for ; Sun, 28 Apr 2019 17:03:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from asomers@gmail.com) Received: from mail-lj1-f169.google.com (mail-lj1-f169.google.com [209.85.208.169]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5FC326BE5D for ; 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Sun, 28 Apr 2019 10:03:47 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Alan Somers Date: Sun, 28 Apr 2019 11:03:35 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: (HBI) Implementing SQLite into the FreeBSD kernel To: abhja kaanlani Cc: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 5FC326BE5D X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of asomers@gmail.com designates 209.85.208.169 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=asomers@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.25 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:209.85.128.0/17]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[freebsd.org]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[169.208.85.209.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.89)[-0.888,0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[asomers@freebsd.org,asomers@gmail.com]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[live.com]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[asomers@freebsd.org,asomers@gmail.com]; IP_SCORE(-1.35)[ip: (-0.54), ipnet: 209.85.128.0/17(-3.87), asn: 15169(-2.27), country: US(-0.06)]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 28 Apr 2019 17:03:56 -0000 On Sun, Apr 28, 2019 at 10:57 AM abhja kaanlani wro= te: > > HBI stands for half baked idea > > I don=E2=80=99t know much about the FreeBSD kernel, but we can add sql me= tadata to certain code for self contained documentation > > What does everyone think? > > Sent from my iPhone Are you actually trying to use SQLite to implement an in-kernel database, or are you trying to automatically generate API documentation using SQLite? Those are two very different things. If the latter, I suggest you try Doxygen instead. There are already portions of the kernel that use Doxygen's comment format. -Alan From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Sun Apr 28 19:52:26 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D041E1587BBE for ; Sun, 28 Apr 2019 19:52:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: from mail-yw1-xc2e.google.com (mail-yw1-xc2e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::c2e]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9DF1172DAC for ; Sun, 28 Apr 2019 19:52:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: by mail-yw1-xc2e.google.com with SMTP id r139so2981373ywe.12 for ; Sun, 28 Apr 2019 12:52:24 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version:thread-index :content-language; bh=NSTIbpCa7+w7r4ylaTWEYB4Lnu1Q8Sut3YEI09iRwis=; b=U35id6EIDOJ98JNETYQVJnwYNBTY9lipIFKtdZoYj5TnKN/G9mKgqk4O76BXMv3t9a BbeVX+gJZnw2KNm6ydLRKBq+dthp/Xs/Xg2s44XF4ZI1hdbzmpu5d2WEZBzKfgqiqfrJ eYYAEVm+ai7uRdL9vpA3DtIHt1rtrAZSIKErlwipUPIcCLPA8/wPe87TJzGfSlZob/Em hKI9jNTmUzS7tB3WCNReN6pWoSDO2sNhAC2lWnSVOkzhpxDN/OCi69PW5cGSnjjmkBGC JBgK/3Ydt4qVdeu9Hf95f/Me5tTwnInaNORJnO6OqhtPdSWqJQV2aVE1rvoy3l/uuj8a JeBA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:subject:date:message-id:mime-version :thread-index:content-language; bh=NSTIbpCa7+w7r4ylaTWEYB4Lnu1Q8Sut3YEI09iRwis=; b=WZsNeeHDa8eCwe3tpbHfs5OKex9rl/uOiPYjHYPKTrnYhkiaFTS4vFmxzxU7Bx66T2 dVamn3cRsYoRqziobmDdp8AyeMaIBoOB48JIrg50lbCJJ5X0rWtgPrWoshEo5Qb6RQJH dM8zzWiWTemHD12+qbsepL9fZqflY3f0zAEkNUFObOqI2Blqo41ovVwrO2ou0BAPXDCC m6YJtZUjCSKlgDJle23FAcUqR/KtHiJGw+i7LpDMvOY+ivzshbvIMjxpeq8JIYGRFoLh Y/zTx9BdHVPuh2GmmMQ70ga2fTfAF82MdiX81g4n+eaOTr7bMQfmVHo1WKUMoUhZTojl G3pA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAU/Tib0CWo1hciy3ZZudtfM6N7uTV/xyPlP61vcYqq9C4NRTtIs Y7HFRzl9smiMczyr8rhb1BvXyw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxWeBYspJ9/XEuoo3/JUvn0hoC2eoW+jJZT5W0y3roTKwp34/qp77pkDEtj4C5/0zz1Iq31jA== X-Received: by 2002:a81:a104:: with SMTP id y4mr25595960ywg.76.1556481143008; Sun, 28 Apr 2019 12:52:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from KrisWindows (71-136-150-27.lightspeed.knvltn.sbcglobal.net. [71.136.150.27]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id w3sm2969049ywc.45.2019.04.28.12.52.22 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 28 Apr 2019 12:52:22 -0700 (PDT) From: To: , , , , , Subject: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base Date: Sun, 28 Apr 2019 15:52:21 -0400 Message-ID: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AdT9+kYS/QrrZeloRTSTN/rqnNT4jQ== Content-Language: en-us X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 9DF1172DAC X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=U35id6EI; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=ixsystems.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kris@ixsystems.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::c2e as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kris@ixsystems.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.89 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE(-2.91)[ip: (-9.03), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.19), asn: 15169(-2.27), country: US(-0.06)]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ALT3.ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.com]; FROM_NO_DN(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[e.2.c.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[ixsystems.com,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.97)[-0.966,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 28 Apr 2019 19:52:26 -0000 FreeBSD Community, I'm pleased to announce a CFT for builds of FreeBSD 12-stable and 13-current using "TrueOS-inspired" packaged base. These are stock FreeBSD images which will allow users to perform all updating via the 'pkg' command directly. Rather than trying to answer all questions in this announcement, we've created a FAQ page with more details. Please refer to this page, and let us know if you have additional questions that we can include on that page going forward. Additionally, I will be hosting a Package Base working group at BSDCan 2019, and welcome user and developer attendance to discuss this and other ongoing package work: https://wiki.freebsd.org/DevSummit/201905/PackageBase FAQ ------------------------------------------------------------- https://trueos.github.io/pkgbase-docs/ Download Links ------------------------------------------------------------- FreeBSD 12-STABLE: https://pkg.trueos.org/iso/freebsd12-pkgbase/ FreeBSD 13-CURRENT: https://pkg.trueos.org/iso/freebsd-pkgbase/ -- Kris Moore Vice President of Engineering iXsystems, Inc Ph: (408) 943-4100 Ph: (408) 943-4101 The Groundbreaking TrueNAS M-Series - Enterprise Storage & Servers Driven By Open Source From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 04:21:01 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB4FF15928C6 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 04:21:00 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from unidef_rogue@live.com) Received: from NAM03-DM3-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-oln040092008057.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.92.8.57]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.protection.outlook.com", Issuer "GlobalSign Organization Validation CA - SHA256 - G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B95298A3C3; 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[73.19.52.228]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id j20sm47351346pfn.84.2019.04.29.05.11.22 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 29 Apr 2019 05:11:23 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.8\)) Subject: Re: (HBI) Implementing SQLite into the FreeBSD kernel From: Enji Cooper In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 05:11:22 -0700 Cc: Alan Somers , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <4250C851-5CB2-4B0B-8D9B-58414F806D75@gmail.com> References: To: abhja kaanlani X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.8) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 28C7D746A2 X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=uODbpWMx; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=gmail.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of yaneurabeya@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::534 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=yaneurabeya@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.41 / 15.00]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[gmail.com:+]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[gmail.com,none]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[live.com]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[gmail.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[gmail.com:s=20161025]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.95)[-0.954,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-2.95)[ip: (-9.26), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.17), asn: 15169(-2.24), country: US(-0.06)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[4.3.5.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 12:11:26 -0000 > On Apr 28, 2019, at 9:20 PM, abhja kaanlani = wrote: >=20 > It can be used for messaging. Let=E2=80=99s say, for any reason, a = userland command needs to access the sound hardware, there can be a = string sql value (or just a string, kind of like sysctl) attached to a = driver, and it can contain metadata for automation or parsing, maybe = even a callback system >=20 > and sadly I don=E2=80=99t know much of sql. I have a neural database = in the works but that=E2=80=99s moving to c++, but a simple binary tree = with a couple of character arrays and an id along with search functions = (Libc can handle this fine) can simulate a small database without = consuming too much memory once written to disk >=20 > It could be used for up, but there=E2=80=99s way too much overhead I = think, once I sit down with my cigarettes and read the entire kernel on = my desktop I=E2=80=99ll see if I can add a database like this to some = drivers or file system code >=20 >=20 >=20 > struct idb_node0 {=20 > int *id; > char *idb_node_description; > struct idb_node0 *id_node0_direction[MACRO_AND_ENUM_GOES_HERE] // = additional dimensions if ram calculation allows, I=E2=80=99d suggest = some kind of matrice > }; >=20 > struct idb_binary_tree {=20 > int id; > char *idb_binary_tree_description; > struct node0 *idb_binary_tree_direction[MACRO_ENUM]; > } >=20 > Etc sorry I didn=E2=80=99t have time to write the macros and = enumerations >=20 > Macros and enumerations are used to keep how many items in an array, = what dimension should the array have if ram permissible, and keep track = of nodes and indices >=20 >=20 > What I=E2=80=99m getting at is a hardcoded database has its benefits! Hi Abhja, SQLite in the kernel seems a wrong option for dealing with key-value = stores. Are you aware of libnv in FreeBSD (and its kernel analog)? It=E2=80=99s = a key-value store library/infrastructure, available for kernel use. FreeBSD also has access to radix tries too, if the structure matters. Hope this helps, -Enji= From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 12:12:49 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B705F158AD69; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 12:12:49 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from manu@bidouilliste.com) Received: from mail.blih.net (mail.blih.net [212.83.177.182]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.blih.net", Issuer "mail.blih.net" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7E2BC74999; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 12:12:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from manu@bidouilliste.com) Received: from mail.blih.net (mail.blih.net [212.83.177.182]) by mail.blih.net (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 87105727; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:12:40 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=bidouilliste.com; h=date :from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=mail; bh=Ms5XXVorARtlOGUgvbKshdkOgo8=; b=V+JgettZt96XaRWjvJhsyyRzWvlD 7skvprZYj3ZfcbeGVWktzytAYg8KBd7jgnruNjnWkee85fZ1yd0YlDwuEHtiSHxv 4OeeMbBHEl1kCivSHZgY73Jl+KaY6NF5AenaxAuDXCWTGHci9rDkgOlUCp3b5c0v fVd/bs0WPMFG3xo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=bidouilliste.com; h=date :from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; q=dns; s= mail; b=fLgukhsrzDainCJvVhz22KowORFQow/wQuiVQ11LCCN7X0T2vuVwDRQc iUZgVYCFdZKKUx4jcjx2rwtoznm7DkhA9IoVMVoIEnT7QIIpNLWer4Mb+XXU34o2 4iuQsnJIA9Dol0Uksx7Va8zdaBu4NJ10mDBd4vktUSCjyx5GWaU= Received: from knuckles.blih.net (ip-9.net-89-3-105.rev.numericable.fr [89.3.105.9]) by mail.blih.net (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 024e27e4 TLS version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:12:40 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:12:39 +0200 From: Emmanuel Vadot To: Cc: , , , , , Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base Message-Id: <20190429141239.f9de62f6b6721112d7143cf6@bidouilliste.com> In-Reply-To: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd13.0) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 7E2BC74999 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bidouilliste.com header.s=mail header.b=V+JgettZ; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of manu@bidouilliste.com designates 212.83.177.182 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=manu@bidouilliste.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.41 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bidouilliste.com:s=mail]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.56)[-0.561,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:212.83.177.182/32]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bidouilliste.com]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.05)[-0.054,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bidouilliste.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mx-backup.blih.net,mail.blih.net]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[7]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.95)[-0.947,0]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(0.38)[ip: (-0.89), ipnet: 212.83.160.0/19(2.97), asn: 12876(-0.17), country: FR(-0.01)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:12876, ipnet:212.83.160.0/19, country:FR]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 12:12:50 -0000 Hi Kris, On Sun, 28 Apr 2019 15:52:21 -0400 wrote: > FreeBSD Community, > > > > I'm pleased to announce a CFT for builds of FreeBSD 12-stable and 13-current > using "TrueOS-inspired" packaged base. These are stock FreeBSD images which > will allow users to perform all updating via the 'pkg' command directly. > Rather than trying to answer all questions in this announcement, we've > created a FAQ page with more details. Please refer to this page, and let us > know if you have additional questions that we can include on that page going > forward. > While I appreciate the effort I have some doubt about your "re-implementation" of pkgbase. I don't see any improvement compared to what is in base currently, I even see downside of your implementation. - How do you plan with the need of updating kernel first, reboot and updating the rest of the userland after ? (Needed for major and minor upgrade, 12.0 to 12.1 for example, and simple update in -STABLE and -HEAD branch). This is still a problem with the base pkgbase. - This is even worse because you are using the same repository for base and pkg so if a user pkg update and both kernel and pkg(8) needs to be updated and pkg use a new syscall or capsicum thing it will be updated first and couldn't proceed with the rest of the update (this is a supposition, I haven't personally tested). - It seems that multiple kernels isn't supported in your implementation, this is already supported in pkgbase but still need some love. This is an important point as it will allow user to choose easily the kernel that they want to use and will also allow us developper to push kernels with new features to help testing. - Since you reduced the granularity on the userland bits it would mean that if we use your implementation for -p updates we would download the whole userland packages instead of just updating the package that was patched. For example with pkgbase, updating from 12.0 to 12.0p1 will only update the FreeBSD-runtime package. Yes this package is still big to download when you compare to what have changed but until pkg(8) have delta pkg supports (and if it will have support, I don't know if this is a wish or not) this is the best way to go. - I see that you are sorting the plist for kernel and userland based on the line length [1], why is that ? I think that the only advantage that your solution offers is that if we remove a componant of base (rcmds for example in 12-CURRENT) those files would be removed as they are in the userland-base package while for pkgbase the FreeBSD-rcmd package will be deleted in the repo and will not be deleted in the user computer. > > Additionally, I will be hosting a Package Base working group at BSDCan 2019, > and welcome user and developer attendance to discuss this and other ongoing > package work: > > > > https://wiki.freebsd.org/DevSummit/201905/PackageBase > I will be present and looking forward to work with you on this. Cheers, P.S. : FYI I'm working on pkgbase currently and I will have some patches to commit soon (bsdinstall support, memstick creation that install a pkgbase aware installaton etc ...). [1] : https://github.com/trueos/trueos-ports/blob/trueos-master/os/userland-base/Makefile#L35 -- Emmanuel Vadot From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 13:19:43 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6E26158C77B; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:19:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lev@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [96.47.72.83]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 743EE76D39; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:19:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lev@FreeBSD.org) Received: from onlyone.not-for.work (onlyone.not-for.work [148.251.9.81]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: lev/mail) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 20E3BDD53; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:19:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lev@FreeBSD.org) Received: from [192.168.23.186] (unknown [89.113.128.32]) (Authenticated sender: lev@serebryakov.spb.ru) by onlyone.not-for.work (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id E665F152FB; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:19:39 +0300 (MSK) Reply-To: lev@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: kris@ixsystems.com, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> From: Lev Serebryakov Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=lev@FreeBSD.org; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQINBFKbGksBEADeguVs+XyJc3mL3iiOBqDd16wSk97YTJYOi4VsHsINzJr09oFvNDiaDBIi fLn2p8XcJvehcsF2GSgrfXfw+uK4O1jyNIKJmiYA0EtE+ZbRtvDrrE0w6Q8+SDeKA21SWh3Y vSQ0DJUontbgW55ER2CbEiIUTIn34uQ0kmESAaw/v5p/9ue8yPTmURvv130FqPFz8VPzltqL NxyGt54TxPfKAzAHEIwxlEZ63JOwzloKh1UDBExcsf9nJO08/TAVgR5UZ5njFBPzaaquhRoP qPJLEQQDqxPIlvMNtHKf7iIebE4BHeqgCdJA0BoiR6gpa0wlsZtdrTPK3n4wYSphLvGbhfOZ YW/hbcu7HYS/FImkVxB3iY17kcC1UTnx4ZaYeASPBGOOPbXky1lLfmDGWIFT//70yx+G17qD OZzF1SvJJhGvh6ilFYaWMX7T+nIp6Mcafc4D7AakXM+XdubNXOMlCJhzPcZ0skgAEnYV587w V7em5fDVwQccwvtfezzqKeJAU5TGiywBHSR5Svzk2FwRNf6M//hWkpq0SRR63iOhkHGOAEBi 69GfEIwH2/w24rLxP0E+Hqq8n+EWNkPatw1Mhcl5PKkdvGCjJUaGNMkpBffjyYo254JXRscR eEnwdIkJt4ErDvjb2/UrOFq31wWMOiLzJeVchAgvTHBMRfP9aQARAQABtCFMZXYgU2VyZWJy eWFrb3YgPGxldkBGcmVlQlNELm9yZz6JAlYEEwEIAEACGwMHCwkIBwMCAQYVCAIJCgsEFgID AQIeAQIXgBYhBPltHKC19DGLZ0szCuqwPFi/3EePBQJb/TeXBQkPBbfGAAoJEOqwPFi/3EeP LtEQANQLS89OCDSnLDZLyCj7sH5GZbTikJp9Or2McqEOpjgtfY/OgqCe7lfo8f71tTN3gL2t VGtNEtsl6CqKeBdm6fqsetCAed2+waJfbXLZWReLRSFQJ/cbof8MB3h/uEw8Zng1ZbyEU0eG rc41Mhk8bTfxjNRjkXDbp0+2xug+eRr2RYhiY2SxH+iy57AbRIu9gkjfL05VztfvsV5dPxt7 +reHf2Vhtu+qCRtCytGQqDvYWGpVZ8U5fHJxFdsJpn66LAe8w+iRGCbppB5TKeHkqWqDb++u sd5ZHzwep/7qcLBeKggi8+a2C3J1J4TpYBwdPgusrGtBPf2EYSTc/0mW5j86g1l8UDN9qXAI FvWbKf22p5SlYUzf5qRLny4ZdDl1mH13lmJV7ZkZGMKnt0IjJ2x0LRgLGhiSm/D4Lh8yc/MX uhj9BB020XbWcMUPpA7S7YaWeIXbnK3NrPU0yk77prFJblfskOwuaxJIwa2mX+cCAQA95As5 2talifo4Kh8OLSvS1gpbMo64LllTzuGbCWuKecH3fpMlZlD7/10z9lBvkSXA7KgadDfN0yHO xGCK8KE9gXXmEVRlbgGDYOJw9FLWHuSZHUvQTkmr4goXrmMIKa9A4BKO3s9vowP4pJ0vp3kz MIBeEwKSvAeZZfgKbIKggKUuQ5gsAqvF360sG3+UuQINBFKbGksBEAC0a9wfjo2P3JyT7Lc+ QlbFVshGbSbazb4ma7QYG5IZZD5vfLBFkePoG6cnrn3WCXp4A43hszAynCwe4eXyAkv4+gPF 3ZSeNE5Wz3zYG+jh2nm2iGCkyaVykfbA+2chor2DKH5tHpuNMBlF+wSJHZKJmlo/sFIktAnV 1NBVg4/cL+9/hIpvl82cl3hYCD7/e7/qRE+w38CpAAzn65FvbODn7xlY3fsJt+cHPBJ4EBM9 KnTwcce+F+72RQMZQEl7vIAwSRmLdgZHN0MFC533l62SVoKjT0eaOOIBrvesmojhWjfwugib Xr+WRF/tGcW77Bxwe2eQLbEVESqWeMORxRxocx7Q7aACoHmf4G4U1Vzx7zUEfNfHjfjZeQVf AURf/MoUelZSW/BmMIfKCg3lRlWAt+Pq2h2UADPVqAZze45beE/c8z8LZsOZiGoRhYL8NSg6 +ziLTdmYLWdtFGAuZhqOtNp5h6tGj21OksBotcaIa5YjbCmmnImIjGlSBkUKvIhq/RXth5b2 gNwaQdu+Yv4AlZVHRsuVywL/skDFL5+We11bDK6MQ5PzvmntRJcgbyoisn1hiV04OV1LpJJM kJn1j8VlBqDQNT/z+BjB0ru/0anv+5uLj7v0ck06rEo4yiXT/ZAcBM76j7V7FaGbkoba6bUU CQ2H5YYBOKpikjCnpwARAQABiQI8BBgBCAAmAhsMFiEE+W0coLX0MYtnSzMK6rA8WL/cR48F Alv9N7IFCQ8Ft+cACgkQ6rA8WL/cR49wpw//W7QrZHKYUWEVHtPLVMlcM1f7MgwnYlIRe/I6 gykwvt87sqxSYu7eHxfX6JZR2M9UYuUYscSR57gxXKu2Uzqaz2KjvEIXJCwCTsuXZjkQ19oL hAPsucw2AcMI6YqPXbZ7hO0Mh8jMeJzD6vDvx3zvunQxGQoZKxr3BvRUyO7NCYbA7N8ccI3E Tmdjj9JTbtue9WaUeGLszFDiITmkASBdsK07y4ylLAJzUGCvYLBU3gx0bBOB2S8SbxHYmQlj ewjovbp+MbT+CoXNxZp+gDRModGyIMdRIotkRiDbgNl0VWIT0SS1GUUlUHKzQ/ZPUvpvk6Gq s/SYBS7rBQNSoXXmJxNW6I6atVNW7JhInC1tkHxBlbpik4FK07J6NHFTx+9ygyCxbxwNA/Le FGkL3kU0VFXR2dNiAVbeueUPF6tU5Bye5ftgpLKOSAbo1g++EKUkc8335/4oYRBMcGEk4xUr NAvzoFPhA2W3KtklruJ9ThrFt9+//NB5ySlVgTwGWMuBJoskEmNOTBv34/UQPUIuE4xSwy6y H+nRQJooiMFo5QCosslJPlwyV63NS9lYXB6n3QWOCP6sFdWACNUCOFv4uk7LQdY9BsCmt2Tk cLuHmoS+fvUesQXnYV2aQi9HciriPIj2gvJ6WjgiaC/PpePil0fzyrfG/JMyHL0qcgmYoj0= Organization: FreeBSD Message-ID: <1393169f-7988-7ce6-e030-8c61727f78b8@FreeBSD.org> Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:19:39 +0300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.6.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="TpJm1J75TwcSaTJFJfGZFTd5x8HJHCQ4J" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 743EE76D39 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.94 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[FreeBSD.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.94)[-0.942,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:96.47.64.0/20, country:US] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:19:43 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --TpJm1J75TwcSaTJFJfGZFTd5x8HJHCQ4J Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="vEqawuU6GRUsEVGjwIDj1i4SK2KWTYwfU"; protected-headers="v1" From: Lev Serebryakov Reply-To: lev@FreeBSD.org To: kris@ixsystems.com, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Message-ID: <1393169f-7988-7ce6-e030-8c61727f78b8@FreeBSD.org> Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> In-Reply-To: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> --vEqawuU6GRUsEVGjwIDj1i4SK2KWTYwfU Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 28.04.2019 22:52, kris@ixsystems.com wrote: > I'm pleased to announce a CFT for builds of FreeBSD 12-stable and 13-cu= rrent > using "TrueOS-inspired" packaged base. These are stock FreeBSD images w= hich > will allow users to perform all updating via the 'pkg' command directly= =2E > Rather than trying to answer all questions in this announcement, we've > created a FAQ page with more details. Please refer to this page, and le= t us > know if you have additional questions that we can include on that page = going > forward. Is it too coarse, isn't it? I'm not very interested in packetized base for "big servers" which contains full FreeBSd installation, but I have several NanoBSD installations, which have more than 100 "WITHOUT_XXX" options in src.conf. I want to have packetized base to create such images via `pkg' Not all these options could be converted to packages, options like WITHOUT_KERBEROS is more build option, but about 2/3 of these options turn off some file-based features, like sendmail, PPP, toolchain or bzip2= =2E IMHO, to be really useful packets in base should be based on these src.conf options to have ability to skip unneeded "optional" base components (including, for example, man pages!). And one more, not covered with src.conf WITHOUT_XXX: static libraries and header files, of course! --=20 // Lev Serebryakov --vEqawuU6GRUsEVGjwIDj1i4SK2KWTYwfU-- --TpJm1J75TwcSaTJFJfGZFTd5x8HJHCQ4J Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQKTBAEBCgB9FiEE+W0coLX0MYtnSzMK6rA8WL/cR48FAlzG+etfFIAAAAAALgAo aXNzdWVyLWZwckBub3RhdGlvbnMub3BlbnBncC5maWZ0aGhvcnNlbWFuLm5ldEY5 NkQxQ0EwQjVGNDMxOEI2NzRCMzMwQUVBQjAzQzU4QkZEQzQ3OEYACgkQ6rA8WL/c R48NAw/+KK6UG12QnKFby79sKgBJ2TxAq7r5cAqQsCYDtnXVF1az8K5MugU/yGjA 7E/iVSSIqATll5m/AXvBCJZXCNQmv5ufKRm9tjMvDtSksOzpe5o9AMaiEqGD9SEh rcAvji5cZ1L2MRzHXYc1v4vhJ/KfTFeUpQFcoojW2vItdoPwTmDdqavwme1WULaE g21RGKtRy4Hi2E/MoLANRf3YGc5OnjOPTU2ZmBqsNNXdaElzXbeopk8+hhZ90SR9 tGmO1Ej6eXsXY0BGjC0f6lVHHWoh34GQD4lMXPipavzmhOetLcTgqe6cdM0XKC7J b++rpfJh53AoEiZKassTTXmASDGgsci+1TOK9xeunEvzTa1iOa8WTwRdM6MyR29O wzUYGTG4eX9JG3A5iOAthda3m3GnSjYNk6PJInDcHsW1CIL8XSMowgHJ5A9YVNC8 1e2P7HSTqiepW5MvggZRN1ah99AXYANt6KZIewc9VoHhg7e1hTZ2dyx19yGt8utl FVzXKkNUQLRWaK2CSHGetQMtf2+LY0OR+JfBr/KqQZ23XzXSr33qlzlEHvVDc2f4 xcE0lOXR1d1qzwzJSOuOPhwfaZkEzExGT8g7zNHpW4qegFm/voloXr/y5rPSrrZB VabtDf4HbvidUaVKSO9nO4ZijM8YJAt+vjTv/fHJEPeIeJCg7e8= =RYqC -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --TpJm1J75TwcSaTJFJfGZFTd5x8HJHCQ4J-- From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 13:25:15 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87D16158CDB2 for ; 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a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=K5ww+uvGAcRKntVX3CuKClDjGquFkWxKL+ayep4zX10=; b=tNHV2jTHl27Y0IXQmGpkggp41s2W6wq6kiMWtYwlioBBcP2BCxfoEAoDrgE3SoiZvl Bi+E5GbP0vclCrtV7NbzVY5AV6fFIS+boYZ/Lc6FFVS89K4RRe5IYhIfvYYhRVUjJnAY qrzVRBLu9sGojj1Psrc2revtZ3BGJDroEEpCUDoFLM/SyhcHYgSFoMzJ5p7W0pvODIxt 96kxIvw1buVrbe6X7VuckyzuGuIe1ZDyl9g+SGeP3Lj0xNNi34V/VK+AB10ekuuAdoe0 MrDg8azA10JvHpp+XVfu860hqNkm23dkcrvh9+PqNBCS7rgQ1ZfKBc8r52FcecTTNRHS cYVw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWra6TB5XaoxagDgxZn3ZeGlSvwx9YamEP784khfdwnUj8bvvub D6wVhRqYvQfwFfO5rJTckeBDfh3fs/KtbeSVU9AJxQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwm14h2MgICKuqcdrdQJ/8RW3/UZp/daTTGMbYrmHnfG1Ujj5fda1MZPlsSOZzj6zfkimSVCHWyeAgGN3FbvDM= X-Received: by 2002:a24:4682:: with SMTP id j124mr18995293itb.90.1556544313611; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:25:13 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <20190429141239.f9de62f6b6721112d7143cf6@bidouilliste.com> In-Reply-To: <20190429141239.f9de62f6b6721112d7143cf6@bidouilliste.com> From: Kris Moore Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 09:25:05 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: Emmanuel Vadot Cc: FreeBSD Stable , FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 72E607785B X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; 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IP_SCORE(-2.91)[ip: (-9.09), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.17), asn: 15169(-2.24), country: US(-0.06)]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.94)[-0.938,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:25:15 -0000 On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 8:12 AM Emmanuel Vadot wrote: > > Hi Kris, > > On Sun, 28 Apr 2019 15:52:21 -0400 > wrote: > > > FreeBSD Community, > > > > > > > > I'm pleased to announce a CFT for builds of FreeBSD 12-stable and > 13-current > > using "TrueOS-inspired" packaged base. These are stock FreeBSD images > which > > will allow users to perform all updating via the 'pkg' command directly. > > Rather than trying to answer all questions in this announcement, we've > > created a FAQ page with more details. Please refer to this page, and let > us > > know if you have additional questions that we can include on that page > going > > forward. > > > > While I appreciate the effort I have some doubt about your > "re-implementation" of pkgbase. I don't see any improvement compared to > what is in base currently, I even see downside of your implementation. > > - How do you plan with the need of updating kernel first, reboot and > updating the rest of the userland after ? (Needed for major and minor > upgrade, 12.0 to 12.1 for example, and simple update in -STABLE and > -HEAD branch). This is still a problem with the base pkgbase. > We've written our own tool "sysutils/sysup" in GO which handles this. It performs updates using Boot-Environments to ensure that kernel/world are updated at same time. > - This is even worse because you are using the same repository for > base and pkg so if a user pkg update and both kernel and pkg(8) needs > to be updated and pkg use a new syscall or capsicum thing it will be > updated first and couldn't proceed with the rest of the update (this is > a supposition, I haven't personally tested). > See above. > - It seems that multiple kernels isn't supported in your > implementation, this is already supported in pkgbase but still need > some love. This is an important point as it will allow user to choose > easily the kernel that they want to use and will also allow us > developper to push kernels with new features to help testing. > Incorrect, on the 13-CURRENT build if you install kernel-debug, you'll get the Witness-enabled kernel installed alongside non-debugging one. > - Since you reduced the granularity on the userland bits it would mean > that if we use your implementation for -p updates we would download the > whole userland packages instead of just updating the package that was > patched. For example with pkgbase, updating from 12.0 to 12.0p1 will > only update the FreeBSD-runtime package. Yes this package is still big > to download when you compare to what have changed but until pkg(8) have > delta pkg supports (and if it will have support, I don't know if > this is a wish or not) this is the best way to go. > Correct, this is by design. We used the in-tree pkg base for nearly a year, and found that the granularity didn't really offer any savings from a download or time perspective. Updating 100+ packages took far longer than a single one, due to all the meta operations. Additionally in real-world usage, we found that base packages tended to all get updated at the same time, which took far longer via pkg, since it had to go and perform 100+ fetch operations just to download the base system bits. > - I see that you are sorting the plist for kernel and userland based > on the line length [1], why is that ? Whoops! I'll fix :) > > I think that the only advantage that your solution offers is that if > we remove a componant of base (rcmds for example in 12-CURRENT) those > files would be removed as they are in the userland-base package while > for pkgbase the FreeBSD-rcmd package will be deleted in the repo and > will not be deleted in the user computer. > Correct, this is one of the things which prompted us to go this direction. Being able to handle crazy mixed WITH/WITHOUT flags was important to us, current pkg base did not handle that so gracefully. Additionally we've added some additional features, such as being able to 'pkg install os/src' to get system sources used in exact build, as well as being able to rebuild your local world / kernel packages using ports "make config" framework is super handy. > > > > > Additionally, I will be hosting a Package Base working group at BSDCan > 2019, > > and welcome user and developer attendance to discuss this and other > ongoing > > package work: > > > > > > > > https://wiki.freebsd.org/DevSummit/201905/PackageBase > > > > I will be present and looking forward to work with you on this. > > Cheers, > > P.S. : FYI I'm working on pkgbase currently and I will have some > patches to commit soon (bsdinstall support, memstick creation that > install a pkgbase aware installaton etc ...). > Great! Looking forward to discussion then! > > [1] : > > https://github.com/trueos/trueos-ports/blob/trueos-master/os/userland-base/Makefile#L35 > > -- > Emmanuel Vadot > From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 13:39:26 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABA76158D959 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:39:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: from mail-yw1-xc32.google.com (mail-yw1-xc32.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::c32]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7C62C804A5 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:39:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: by mail-yw1-xc32.google.com with SMTP id u14so3703959ywe.1 for ; 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Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:39:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from KrisYogaC930 ([12.189.233.130]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id d138sm1061418ywa.39.2019.04.29.06.39.24 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:39:24 -0700 (PDT) From: To: , , , References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <1393169f-7988-7ce6-e030-8c61727f78b8@FreeBSD.org> In-Reply-To: <1393169f-7988-7ce6-e030-8c61727f78b8@FreeBSD.org> Subject: RE: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 09:39:23 -0400 Message-ID: <02f301d4fe90$f5270d70$df752850$@ixsystems.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AQFBRupbev+o6AHqgfoJLZwOgBKxNQMpPgSsp2FJpoA= Content-Language: en-us X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 7C62C804A5 X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=PvlNMqK/; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=ixsystems.com; 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FROM_NO_DN(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-2.68)[ip: (-7.90), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.17), asn: 15169(-2.24), country: US(-0.06)] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:39:26 -0000 This should be very doable with this package base. We use it for FreeNAS = in a similar manner, where we disable a couple dozen things from base, = resulting in a much more stripped down userland-base package. By default = we also break out the doc/tests/debug bits into their own userland-* = packages, for same reasons, to keep image nice and small. --=20 Kris Moore Vice President of Engineering iXsystems, Inc Ph: (408) 943-4100 Ph: (408) 943-4101 The Groundbreaking TrueNAS M-Series - Enterprise Storage & Servers Driven By Open Source -----Original Message----- From: Lev Serebryakov =20 Sent: Monday, April 29, 2019 9:20 AM To: kris@ixsystems.com; freebsd-current@freebsd.org; = freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org; freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base On 28.04.2019 22:52, kris@ixsystems.com wrote: > I'm pleased to announce a CFT for builds of FreeBSD 12-stable and=20 > 13-current using "TrueOS-inspired" packaged base. These are stock=20 > FreeBSD images which will allow users to perform all updating via the = 'pkg' command directly. > Rather than trying to answer all questions in this announcement, we've = > created a FAQ page with more details. Please refer to this page, and=20 > let us know if you have additional questions that we can include on=20 > that page going forward. Is it too coarse, isn't it? I'm not very interested in packetized base for "big servers" which = contains full FreeBSd installation, but I have several NanoBSD = installations, which have more than 100 "WITHOUT_XXX" options in = src.conf. I want to have packetized base to create such images via `pkg' Not all these options could be converted to packages, options like = WITHOUT_KERBEROS is more build option, but about 2/3 of these options = turn off some file-based features, like sendmail, PPP, toolchain or = bzip2. IMHO, to be really useful packets in base should be based on these = src.conf options to have ability to skip unneeded "optional" base = components (including, for example, man pages!). And one more, not covered with src.conf WITHOUT_XXX: static libraries = and header files, of course! -- // Lev Serebryakov From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 13:43:46 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52693158DD20; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:43:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lev@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [96.47.72.83]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DD70280934; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:43:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lev@FreeBSD.org) Received: from onlyone.not-for.work (onlyone.not-for.work [IPv6:2a01:4f8:201:6350::2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: lev/mail) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8995FE0A4; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:43:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from lev@FreeBSD.org) Received: from [192.168.23.186] (unknown [89.113.128.32]) (Authenticated sender: lev@serebryakov.spb.ru) by onlyone.not-for.work (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id EE78915309; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:43:43 +0300 (MSK) Reply-To: lev@FreeBSD.org Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: kris@ixsystems.com, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <1393169f-7988-7ce6-e030-8c61727f78b8@FreeBSD.org> <02f301d4fe90$f5270d70$df752850$@ixsystems.com> From: Lev Serebryakov Openpgp: preference=signencrypt Autocrypt: addr=lev@FreeBSD.org; prefer-encrypt=mutual; keydata= mQINBFKbGksBEADeguVs+XyJc3mL3iiOBqDd16wSk97YTJYOi4VsHsINzJr09oFvNDiaDBIi fLn2p8XcJvehcsF2GSgrfXfw+uK4O1jyNIKJmiYA0EtE+ZbRtvDrrE0w6Q8+SDeKA21SWh3Y vSQ0DJUontbgW55ER2CbEiIUTIn34uQ0kmESAaw/v5p/9ue8yPTmURvv130FqPFz8VPzltqL NxyGt54TxPfKAzAHEIwxlEZ63JOwzloKh1UDBExcsf9nJO08/TAVgR5UZ5njFBPzaaquhRoP qPJLEQQDqxPIlvMNtHKf7iIebE4BHeqgCdJA0BoiR6gpa0wlsZtdrTPK3n4wYSphLvGbhfOZ YW/hbcu7HYS/FImkVxB3iY17kcC1UTnx4ZaYeASPBGOOPbXky1lLfmDGWIFT//70yx+G17qD OZzF1SvJJhGvh6ilFYaWMX7T+nIp6Mcafc4D7AakXM+XdubNXOMlCJhzPcZ0skgAEnYV587w V7em5fDVwQccwvtfezzqKeJAU5TGiywBHSR5Svzk2FwRNf6M//hWkpq0SRR63iOhkHGOAEBi 69GfEIwH2/w24rLxP0E+Hqq8n+EWNkPatw1Mhcl5PKkdvGCjJUaGNMkpBffjyYo254JXRscR eEnwdIkJt4ErDvjb2/UrOFq31wWMOiLzJeVchAgvTHBMRfP9aQARAQABtCFMZXYgU2VyZWJy eWFrb3YgPGxldkBGcmVlQlNELm9yZz6JAlYEEwEIAEACGwMHCwkIBwMCAQYVCAIJCgsEFgID AQIeAQIXgBYhBPltHKC19DGLZ0szCuqwPFi/3EePBQJb/TeXBQkPBbfGAAoJEOqwPFi/3EeP LtEQANQLS89OCDSnLDZLyCj7sH5GZbTikJp9Or2McqEOpjgtfY/OgqCe7lfo8f71tTN3gL2t VGtNEtsl6CqKeBdm6fqsetCAed2+waJfbXLZWReLRSFQJ/cbof8MB3h/uEw8Zng1ZbyEU0eG rc41Mhk8bTfxjNRjkXDbp0+2xug+eRr2RYhiY2SxH+iy57AbRIu9gkjfL05VztfvsV5dPxt7 +reHf2Vhtu+qCRtCytGQqDvYWGpVZ8U5fHJxFdsJpn66LAe8w+iRGCbppB5TKeHkqWqDb++u sd5ZHzwep/7qcLBeKggi8+a2C3J1J4TpYBwdPgusrGtBPf2EYSTc/0mW5j86g1l8UDN9qXAI FvWbKf22p5SlYUzf5qRLny4ZdDl1mH13lmJV7ZkZGMKnt0IjJ2x0LRgLGhiSm/D4Lh8yc/MX uhj9BB020XbWcMUPpA7S7YaWeIXbnK3NrPU0yk77prFJblfskOwuaxJIwa2mX+cCAQA95As5 2talifo4Kh8OLSvS1gpbMo64LllTzuGbCWuKecH3fpMlZlD7/10z9lBvkSXA7KgadDfN0yHO xGCK8KE9gXXmEVRlbgGDYOJw9FLWHuSZHUvQTkmr4goXrmMIKa9A4BKO3s9vowP4pJ0vp3kz MIBeEwKSvAeZZfgKbIKggKUuQ5gsAqvF360sG3+UuQINBFKbGksBEAC0a9wfjo2P3JyT7Lc+ QlbFVshGbSbazb4ma7QYG5IZZD5vfLBFkePoG6cnrn3WCXp4A43hszAynCwe4eXyAkv4+gPF 3ZSeNE5Wz3zYG+jh2nm2iGCkyaVykfbA+2chor2DKH5tHpuNMBlF+wSJHZKJmlo/sFIktAnV 1NBVg4/cL+9/hIpvl82cl3hYCD7/e7/qRE+w38CpAAzn65FvbODn7xlY3fsJt+cHPBJ4EBM9 KnTwcce+F+72RQMZQEl7vIAwSRmLdgZHN0MFC533l62SVoKjT0eaOOIBrvesmojhWjfwugib Xr+WRF/tGcW77Bxwe2eQLbEVESqWeMORxRxocx7Q7aACoHmf4G4U1Vzx7zUEfNfHjfjZeQVf AURf/MoUelZSW/BmMIfKCg3lRlWAt+Pq2h2UADPVqAZze45beE/c8z8LZsOZiGoRhYL8NSg6 +ziLTdmYLWdtFGAuZhqOtNp5h6tGj21OksBotcaIa5YjbCmmnImIjGlSBkUKvIhq/RXth5b2 gNwaQdu+Yv4AlZVHRsuVywL/skDFL5+We11bDK6MQ5PzvmntRJcgbyoisn1hiV04OV1LpJJM kJn1j8VlBqDQNT/z+BjB0ru/0anv+5uLj7v0ck06rEo4yiXT/ZAcBM76j7V7FaGbkoba6bUU CQ2H5YYBOKpikjCnpwARAQABiQI8BBgBCAAmAhsMFiEE+W0coLX0MYtnSzMK6rA8WL/cR48F Alv9N7IFCQ8Ft+cACgkQ6rA8WL/cR49wpw//W7QrZHKYUWEVHtPLVMlcM1f7MgwnYlIRe/I6 gykwvt87sqxSYu7eHxfX6JZR2M9UYuUYscSR57gxXKu2Uzqaz2KjvEIXJCwCTsuXZjkQ19oL hAPsucw2AcMI6YqPXbZ7hO0Mh8jMeJzD6vDvx3zvunQxGQoZKxr3BvRUyO7NCYbA7N8ccI3E Tmdjj9JTbtue9WaUeGLszFDiITmkASBdsK07y4ylLAJzUGCvYLBU3gx0bBOB2S8SbxHYmQlj ewjovbp+MbT+CoXNxZp+gDRModGyIMdRIotkRiDbgNl0VWIT0SS1GUUlUHKzQ/ZPUvpvk6Gq s/SYBS7rBQNSoXXmJxNW6I6atVNW7JhInC1tkHxBlbpik4FK07J6NHFTx+9ygyCxbxwNA/Le FGkL3kU0VFXR2dNiAVbeueUPF6tU5Bye5ftgpLKOSAbo1g++EKUkc8335/4oYRBMcGEk4xUr NAvzoFPhA2W3KtklruJ9ThrFt9+//NB5ySlVgTwGWMuBJoskEmNOTBv34/UQPUIuE4xSwy6y H+nRQJooiMFo5QCosslJPlwyV63NS9lYXB6n3QWOCP6sFdWACNUCOFv4uk7LQdY9BsCmt2Tk cLuHmoS+fvUesQXnYV2aQi9HciriPIj2gvJ6WjgiaC/PpePil0fzyrfG/JMyHL0qcgmYoj0= Organization: FreeBSD Message-ID: <021ff3c4-c325-61e1-21d0-2ee0a89e3642@FreeBSD.org> Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:43:43 +0300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.6.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <02f301d4fe90$f5270d70$df752850$@ixsystems.com> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha512; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="EVhsfAW8TLjYCet3GsXtxSUapofh7bE9H" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: DD70280934 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.96 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[FreeBSD.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.960,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:96.47.64.0/20, country:US]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:43:46 -0000 This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --EVhsfAW8TLjYCet3GsXtxSUapofh7bE9H Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="imxEVOpxCXUUdBN4JJEL7DjvJwxWudHQS"; protected-headers="v1" From: Lev Serebryakov Reply-To: lev@FreeBSD.org To: kris@ixsystems.com, freebsd-current@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Message-ID: <021ff3c4-c325-61e1-21d0-2ee0a89e3642@FreeBSD.org> Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <1393169f-7988-7ce6-e030-8c61727f78b8@FreeBSD.org> <02f301d4fe90$f5270d70$df752850$@ixsystems.com> In-Reply-To: <02f301d4fe90$f5270d70$df752850$@ixsystems.com> --imxEVOpxCXUUdBN4JJEL7DjvJwxWudHQS Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 29.04.2019 16:39, kris@ixsystems.com wrote: >=20 > This should be very doable with this package base. We use it for FreeNA= S in a similar manner, where we disable a couple dozen things from base, = resulting in a much more stripped down userland-base package. By default = we also break out the doc/tests/debug bits into their own userland-* pack= ages, for same reasons, to keep image nice and small. >=20 Ok, after # tar tf FreeBSD-HEAD-pkgbase-x64-20190426.iso | grep All dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/ca_root_nss-3.43_1.txz dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/jq-1.6.txz dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/kernel-20190420203550_1.txz dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/oniguruma-6.9.1.txz dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/pkg-1.10.5_5.txz dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-20190420203550.txz dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-base-20190420203550_7.txz dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-docs-20190420203550.txz dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-lib32-20190420203550.txz # I was under impression, that there is only 3 userland packages, not 100+ :-) --=20 // Lev Serebryakov --imxEVOpxCXUUdBN4JJEL7DjvJwxWudHQS-- --EVhsfAW8TLjYCet3GsXtxSUapofh7bE9H Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; 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a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=Ai74ZH6RJlQ/xg8DRg9mt84Y7pRpdQe6G/izcwQAqW4=; b=Lt8FJaQnGW0dokBepL4q+q+lk4O5gl18iQsyM9NhDT9bGOGzqACMJj6xFGDJngodoO OExE5VRCZZxRoU77Sk65JlD3W7n2XCLFHf6uTrHVuPfxh+uQWdpKcvO8vXEbbSXd3C3C iT3DIt/axzsPtqcsICbbS2CaX0DY4dcOYoNGl92gc27POGcBbmDw+TF0ELZlxcylGAEg l0uwH8u8jTUA3bxfklR4P254KCjBVtItmDtNQfum2x9XN0HFhe96b0jXKwQdkCaVp/+l 62kpu0WbmPsNg+qHhL5PgVbpNZvkvfigfeHulOdDFUOv84IQ46EOhXanoLMmzeu00xpf 4Pxg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAW+lgDpa62FiD0kGOccvBgoV5tTatlH4Wfr7/sX5EQ9CdwppGJw KIx11VvRUUrwJE1afpLxmQak+yrFp+AvfFhY4jWy3g== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzZKb2lv3q2OOf+w7yaHybarznTO8K/tnhSjOZXlfJWFBHxKi3uozhNmEFARWNcIC7hliJnsMKhIF6pHcypAxI= X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:1014:: with SMTP id z20mr16025034qkj.258.1556546012497; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:53:32 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <1393169f-7988-7ce6-e030-8c61727f78b8@FreeBSD.org> <02f301d4fe90$f5270d70$df752850$@ixsystems.com> <021ff3c4-c325-61e1-21d0-2ee0a89e3642@FreeBSD.org> In-Reply-To: <021ff3c4-c325-61e1-21d0-2ee0a89e3642@FreeBSD.org> From: Warner Losh Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:53:17 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: Lev Serebryakov Cc: Kris Moore , FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 19ACA81681 X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; 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IP_SCORE(-2.90)[ip: (-9.05), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.17), asn: 15169(-2.24), country: US(-0.06)]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:53:34 -0000 On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 7:50 AM Lev Serebryakov wrote: > On 29.04.2019 16:39, kris@ixsystems.com wrote: > > > > > This should be very doable with this package base. We use it for FreeNAS > in a similar manner, where we disable a couple dozen things from base, > resulting in a much more stripped down userland-base package. By default we > also break out the doc/tests/debug bits into their own userland-* packages, > for same reasons, to keep image nice and small. > > > Ok, after > > > # tar tf FreeBSD-HEAD-pkgbase-x64-20190426.iso | grep All > dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All > dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/ca_root_nss-3.43_1.txz > dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/jq-1.6.txz > dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/kernel-20190420203550_1.txz > dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/oniguruma-6.9.1.txz > dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/pkg-1.10.5_5.txz > dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-20190420203550.txz > dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-base-20190420203550_7.txz > dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-docs-20190420203550.txz > dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-lib32-20190420203550.txz > # > > I was under impression, that there is only 3 userland packages, not > 100+ :-) > It's a tradeoff... 100+ packages is super granular, but also a PITA to manage. 3 package installs quite a bit faster than the 100+ packages due to a large fixed cost in pkg per package, but isn't granular enough to tailor for NanoBSD systems. Warner > -- > // Lev Serebryakov > > From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 13:53:52 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5938E158E656 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:53:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: from mail-yw1-xc2f.google.com (mail-yw1-xc2f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::c2f]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5F6C9816CB for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:53:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: by mail-yw1-xc2f.google.com with SMTP id i66so3717554ywe.5 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:53:51 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; 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Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:53:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from KrisYogaC930 ([12.189.233.130]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id i13sm1383267ywl.22.2019.04.29.06.53.49 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:53:49 -0700 (PDT) From: To: =?UTF-8?Q?'Goran_Meki=C4=87'?= Cc: "'Emmanuel Vadot'" , "'FreeBSD Stable'" , "'FreeBSD Current'" , , , , References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <20190429141239.f9de62f6b6721112d7143cf6@bidouilliste.com> <20190429134329.g7t77muqfb6dh2fj@hal9000.home.meka.rs> In-Reply-To: <20190429134329.g7t77muqfb6dh2fj@hal9000.home.meka.rs> Subject: RE: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 09:53:48 -0400 Message-ID: <03b001d4fe92$f908c990$eb1a5cb0$@ixsystems.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AQFBRupbev+o6AHqgfoJLZwOgBKxNQFhdrr5Ad4+GxoBeMI9n6dU1Bqg Content-Language: en-us X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 5F6C9816CB X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; 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RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[f.2.c.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.975,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:53:52 -0000 Correct, this is ZFS only. And it's something we're using specific to = FreeNAS / TrueOS, which is why I didn't originally mention it as apart = of our CFT.=20 For UFS, there will need to be additional care taken when doing updates. = --=20 Kris Moore Vice President of Engineering iXsystems, Inc Ph: (408) 943-4100 Ph: (408) 943-4101 The Groundbreaking TrueNAS M-Series - Enterprise Storage & Servers Driven By Open Source -----Original Message----- From: Goran Meki=C4=87 =20 Sent: Monday, April 29, 2019 9:43 AM To: Kris Moore Cc: Emmanuel Vadot ; FreeBSD Stable = ; FreeBSD Current = ; freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org; = freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org; freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; = freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 09:25:05AM -0400, Kris Moore wrote: > We've written our own tool "sysutils/sysup" in GO which handles this.=20 > It performs updates using Boot-Environments to ensure that=20 > kernel/world are updated at same time. If I'm right, UFS doesn't support boot environments, so how would it = work for UFS based installs? I personally feel GO is a bit ackward choice of language for something = that practically should be part of base. At least I would expect OS = update/upgrade not to require any external package. Regards, meka From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 13:55:28 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23902158E871; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:55:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from manu@bidouilliste.com) Received: from mail.blih.net (mail.blih.net [212.83.177.182]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.blih.net", Issuer "mail.blih.net" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2CB398197D; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:55:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from manu@bidouilliste.com) Received: from mail.blih.net (mail.blih.net [212.83.177.182]) by mail.blih.net (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 76f0e8c2; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 15:55:23 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=bidouilliste.com; h=date :from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=mail; bh=MLAcrXcF53XA7rh7ywbaMUgcCS4=; b=FrWKqTnTfxlianTyg0eI+7KrLjVb L6GgT4tt8gE90MEQfz8nNlz+3cmzpC6TpXee+8Z20fE6vpTnxZRAh30M+5rI9WB6 Ej2gMptD/Jy7RVJmr4P2BKQ35tfRVBs9Ha/FHvp2VIIVbo9RzFW65ukQ1+Jqh/00 VkeUL2ZjqlWaT8I= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=bidouilliste.com; h=date :from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; q=dns; s= mail; b=DjwipvzFHHdC3LvK7OlJ5FYooPxmQJnYK1IAsoHOChxJo+ZFX+/TobIs z7WpJtQA91Ij5B+cym6YB3/6RKi0GtuybjkqPlwcd1lpZDgbyrN3FBC1VojKmy32 sl+1ajou9LaTXqDqdt8nojcrvdf+abEGIeVQ+/a2vRfI/WRV2wo= Received: from skull.home.blih.net (ip-9.net-89-3-105.rev.numericable.fr [89.3.105.9]) by mail.blih.net (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id 20095b58 TLS version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 15:55:23 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 15:55:22 +0200 From: Emmanuel Vadot To: Kris Moore Cc: FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base Message-Id: <20190429155522.81dcc291a6b252884219de1e@bidouilliste.com> In-Reply-To: References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <20190429141239.f9de62f6b6721112d7143cf6@bidouilliste.com> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd13.0) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 2CB398197D X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bidouilliste.com header.s=mail header.b=FrWKqTnT; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of manu@bidouilliste.com designates 212.83.177.182 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=manu@bidouilliste.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.37 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bidouilliste.com:s=mail]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.45)[-0.454,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:212.83.177.182/32]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bidouilliste.com]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.66)[0.664,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mx-backup.blih.net]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bidouilliste.com:+]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[7]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.18)[0.183,0]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(0.38)[ip: (-0.87), ipnet: 212.83.160.0/19(2.97), asn: 12876(-0.17), country: FR(-0.01)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:12876, ipnet:212.83.160.0/19, country:FR]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:55:28 -0000 On Mon, 29 Apr 2019 09:25:05 -0400 Kris Moore wrote: > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 8:12 AM Emmanuel Vadot > wrote: > > > > > Hi Kris, > > > > On Sun, 28 Apr 2019 15:52:21 -0400 > > wrote: > > > > > FreeBSD Community, > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm pleased to announce a CFT for builds of FreeBSD 12-stable and > > 13-current > > > using "TrueOS-inspired" packaged base. These are stock FreeBSD images > > which > > > will allow users to perform all updating via the 'pkg' command directly. > > > Rather than trying to answer all questions in this announcement, we've > > > created a FAQ page with more details. Please refer to this page, and let > > us > > > know if you have additional questions that we can include on that page > > going > > > forward. > > > > > > > While I appreciate the effort I have some doubt about your > > "re-implementation" of pkgbase. I don't see any improvement compared to > > what is in base currently, I even see downside of your implementation. > > > > - How do you plan with the need of updating kernel first, reboot and > > updating the rest of the userland after ? (Needed for major and minor > > upgrade, 12.0 to 12.1 for example, and simple update in -STABLE and > > -HEAD branch). This is still a problem with the base pkgbase. > > > > We've written our own tool "sysutils/sysup" in GO which handles this. It > performs updates using Boot-Environments to ensure that kernel/world are > updated at same time. > Which could never be imported into FreeBSD. > > > > - This is even worse because you are using the same repository for > > base and pkg so if a user pkg update and both kernel and pkg(8) needs > > to be updated and pkg use a new syscall or capsicum thing it will be > > updated first and couldn't proceed with the rest of the update (this is > > a supposition, I haven't personally tested). > > > > See above. > > > > - It seems that multiple kernels isn't supported in your > > implementation, this is already supported in pkgbase but still need > > some love. This is an important point as it will allow user to choose > > easily the kernel that they want to use and will also allow us > > developper to push kernels with new features to help testing. > > > > Incorrect, on the 13-CURRENT build if you install kernel-debug, you'll get > the Witness-enabled kernel installed alongside non-debugging one. Mhm no, the kernel-debug packages only add the debug file in /usr/lib/debug/boot/ I'm talking about installing multiple kernels in // (i.e. /boot/kernel.GENERIC /boot/kernel.MYFEATUREIWANTTOTEST) like describe here : https://wiki.freebsd.org/PkgBase#Project_goals_and_additional_unresolved_issues in the "How to handle /boot/kernel and /boot/kernel.$KERNCONF" point. > > > - Since you reduced the granularity on the userland bits it would mean > > that if we use your implementation for -p updates we would download the > > whole userland packages instead of just updating the package that was > > patched. For example with pkgbase, updating from 12.0 to 12.0p1 will > > only update the FreeBSD-runtime package. Yes this package is still big > > to download when you compare to what have changed but until pkg(8) have > > delta pkg supports (and if it will have support, I don't know if > > this is a wish or not) this is the best way to go. > > > > Correct, this is by design. We used the in-tree pkg base for nearly a year, > and found that the granularity didn't really offer any savings from a > download or time perspective. Updating 100+ packages took far longer than a > single one, due to all the meta operations. Additionally in real-world > usage, we found that base packages tended to all get updated at the same > time, which took far longer via pkg, since it had to go and perform 100+ > fetch operations just to download the base system bits. > But you never need to update 100+ packages on a proper pkgbase setup for -p updates. Again on a 12.0 to 12.0-p1 update only one package will be updated. > > > - I see that you are sorting the plist for kernel and userland based > > on the line length [1], why is that ? > > > Whoops! I'll fix :) > > > > > > I think that the only advantage that your solution offers is that if > > we remove a componant of base (rcmds for example in 12-CURRENT) those > > files would be removed as they are in the userland-base package while > > for pkgbase the FreeBSD-rcmd package will be deleted in the repo and > > will not be deleted in the user computer. > > > > > Correct, this is one of the things which prompted us to go this direction. > Being able to handle crazy mixed WITH/WITHOUT flags was important to us, > current pkg base did not handle that so gracefully. Can you give me more info on this ? What where the WITH/WITHOUT flags that causes problems ? > Additionally we've > added some additional features, such as being able to 'pkg install os/src' > to get system sources used in exact build, as well as being able to rebuild > your local world / kernel packages using ports "make config" framework is > super handy. > That would not be hard to add to pkgbase, I'll add it to my todo list. > > > > > > > > Additionally, I will be hosting a Package Base working group at BSDCan > > 2019, > > > and welcome user and developer attendance to discuss this and other > > ongoing > > > package work: > > > > > > > > > > > > https://wiki.freebsd.org/DevSummit/201905/PackageBase > > > > > > > I will be present and looking forward to work with you on this. > > > > Cheers, > > > > P.S. : FYI I'm working on pkgbase currently and I will have some > > patches to commit soon (bsdinstall support, memstick creation that > > install a pkgbase aware installaton etc ...). > > > > Great! Looking forward to discussion then! > > > > > > [1] : > > > > https://github.com/trueos/trueos-ports/blob/trueos-master/os/userland-base/Makefile#L35 > > > > -- > > Emmanuel Vadot > > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-stable@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-stable > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-stable-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" -- Emmanuel Vadot From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 13:57:03 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDDA1158EA6C for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:57:02 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: from mail-io1-xd2a.google.com (mail-io1-xd2a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2a]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C245481B98 for ; 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Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:56:59 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <1393169f-7988-7ce6-e030-8c61727f78b8@FreeBSD.org> <02f301d4fe90$f5270d70$df752850$@ixsystems.com> <021ff3c4-c325-61e1-21d0-2ee0a89e3642@FreeBSD.org> In-Reply-To: From: Kris Moore Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 09:56:48 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: Warner Losh Cc: Lev Serebryakov , FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: C245481B98 X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=SxGfvcEW; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=ixsystems.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kris@ixsystems.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2a as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kris@ixsystems.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.93 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ALT3.ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.com]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[ixsystems.com,none]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[a.2.d.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; IP_SCORE(-2.96)[ip: (-9.35), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.17), asn: 15169(-2.24), country: US(-0.06)]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.960,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:57:03 -0000 On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 9:53 AM Warner Losh wrote: > > > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 7:50 AM Lev Serebryakov wrote: > >> On 29.04.2019 16:39, kris@ixsystems.com wrote: >> >> > >> > This should be very doable with this package base. We use it for >> FreeNAS in a similar manner, where we disable a couple dozen things from >> base, resulting in a much more stripped down userland-base package. By >> default we also break out the doc/tests/debug bits into their own >> userland-* packages, for same reasons, to keep image nice and small. >> > >> Ok, after >> >> >> # tar tf FreeBSD-HEAD-pkgbase-x64-20190426.iso | grep All >> dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All >> dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/ca_root_nss-3.43_1.txz >> dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/jq-1.6.txz >> dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/kernel-20190420203550_1.txz >> dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/oniguruma-6.9.1.txz >> dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/pkg-1.10.5_5.txz >> dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-20190420203550.txz >> dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-base-20190420203550_7.txz >> dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-docs-20190420203550.txz >> dist/FreeBSD:13:amd64/latest/All/userland-lib32-20190420203550.txz >> # >> >> I was under impression, that there is only 3 userland packages, not >> 100+ :-) >> > > It's a tradeoff... 100+ packages is super granular, but also a PITA to > manage. 3 package installs quite a bit faster than the 100+ packages due to > a large fixed cost in pkg per package, but isn't granular enough to tailor > for NanoBSD systems. > > Warner > > Correct. Its all in the FAQ, there are about a dozen available packages: https://trueos.github.io/pkgbase-docs/#which-base-packages-are-available Really you only need a few of them on typical system, userland(meta-pkg)/userland-base/userland-docs/kernel > -- >> // Lev Serebryakov >> >> From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 13:59:19 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DA3E158ECC9 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:59:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: from mail-qt1-x82a.google.com (mail-qt1-x82a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::82a]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 52EFE81F77 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:59:18 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wlosh@bsdimp.com) Received: by mail-qt1-x82a.google.com with SMTP id y49so6261181qta.7 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:59:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=cXwlTQN15puD2Pa0F3N7kQk9nJ67KWObCr8Tpp44eGA=; b=w24sxDd8y3u6ugLEPg2IC0xbLyOg2fZH7LsB9zrm7MRIB8MA1czoqSxhiY+E2vieit 81slAqtrKafxq0RzCBSKF/RZ7U+T7/tx/5wf26qhm/isRaoHMqAEKlE8T2H+swwGMwtF J3APbcWpHXrBH8R98KQE14fmjC5GkEliJGILX49k9oRgfBYg0Xqcmgj7b8smiE37jXDl 7qWH1p5VDeqqpt0ao4KI7GFjHxwi8kSi/f57my5YIxeWeok3fggn8Y1qPwx5CHA2lCTG 79iop9In1RN2IL39Ok8GP6Cc1LQ2h2pGHKF8Z9NmmBj5hvn9tLvXPnrsQT02cCMk86al jWRg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=cXwlTQN15puD2Pa0F3N7kQk9nJ67KWObCr8Tpp44eGA=; b=i0C6WblDgvym+AdoIjEBPNSkcLt1qQU+2C489fqppt2kV7kbvgDISRPmh+xOdgEA26 pirZIxyDl6yL0DwJq329nqZGpl6DLJ0OTlmStgNK7BUlNqcASMQXU1fU0GExJCZc4dRP Q1786InSOOeu5TJdRYSBw/H9A3p+CRlBsCQzyqoUXyAxa9rflP/FZbf55vmGKlIpYKTY ry99gvqjqt3exssZ/L5kdMx5KqJBCv8Rzlry1JFC2UzSUDukVPNnnSOoV/0epu5L/6WF NoxJeQRPaznLxkDKlDCsvWd7bwGvRpXgK7M1jFrxYNO3Bi98Cw1qYX/wrv7lxumJgKYD eslA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXpsBJsZbrk/LrMOukrEovTq/T7Ft/Sd3k4DS85IjhsvOjjAy6N cqh1ZNtYttWLS7jvUwCaVC5Ef4No9t9a/Rk7Ro2L4w== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzh9JsPNNdunEOPcEBLwu3d/BcnzbWLXlJi+1sw8wyqsg8Uzvv8X0HtEeQnZhdJ5AXmqH+DGO34C4xVi440THE= X-Received: by 2002:a0c:980b:: with SMTP id c11mr7533487qvd.115.1556546357808; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 06:59:17 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <23438.1556267575@critter.freebsd.dk> <6CF6472E-1100-475D-987C-071E916D64E8@yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <6CF6472E-1100-475D-987C-071E916D64E8@yahoo.com> From: Warner Losh Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:59:06 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: buf(9) woes: when does bcopy do nothing at all? To: Mark Millard Cc: Poul-Henning Kamp , FreeBSD Hackers , Alan Somers X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 52EFE81F77 X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=w24sxDd8 X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.92 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; IP_SCORE(-2.95)[ip: (-9.26), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.17), asn: 15169(-2.24), country: US(-0.06)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bsdimp.com]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ALT1.aspmx.l.google.com]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[a.2.8.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.965,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; FREEMAIL_TO(0.00)[yahoo.com]; SUBJECT_ENDS_QUESTION(1.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[imp@bsdimp.com,wlosh@bsdimp.com]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:59:19 -0000 On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 12:44 PM Mark Millard via freebsd-hackers < freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org> wrote: > On 2019-Apr-26, at 01:32, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > > -------- > > In message < > CAOtMX2gdw+eQQU_-DC+EgimbCyw6ynbX1haGLUmn1dApk4rMZw@mail.gmail.com>, Alan > Somers writes: > > > >> How is it possible that bcopy() doesn't affect its output array at all? > > > > That conclusion does not follow from your example: > > > >> bcopy(cp, iov->iov_base, cnt); > >> r = memcmp(cp, iov->iov_base, cnt); > >> if (r) > >> printf("uiomove: miscompare\n"); > > > > If [cp:cp+cnt] and [iov_base:iov_base+cnt] overlap the bcopy result > > is undefined. > > > > Try memmove instead ? > > I only see a bcopy man page bcopy(3) but it says: > > DESCRIPTION > The bcopy() function copies len bytes from string src to string dst. > The > two strings may overlap. If len is zero, no bytes are copied. > > Is a kernel bcopy likely to be any different? > kernel bcopy works with overlapping strings. It's always done this on x86, and different archs behaved different, so we fixed that so the all handle it properly. memcpy is still an issue here, potentially, but memmove isn't. But it was also reported things weren't overlapping, etc. so that's not the issue. Warner From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 14:06:25 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22460158F49C for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:06:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: from mail-it1-x131.google.com (mail-it1-x131.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::131]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3B6F0829B2 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:06:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: by mail-it1-x131.google.com with SMTP id v143so5875677itc.1 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:06:24 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; 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Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:06:10 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <20190429141239.f9de62f6b6721112d7143cf6@bidouilliste.com> <20190429155522.81dcc291a6b252884219de1e@bidouilliste.com> In-Reply-To: <20190429155522.81dcc291a6b252884219de1e@bidouilliste.com> From: Kris Moore Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 10:05:59 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: Emmanuel Vadot Cc: FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 3B6F0829B2 X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=HNtcg/lv; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=ixsystems.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kris@ixsystems.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::131 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kris@ixsystems.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.12 / 15.00]; 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charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:06:25 -0000 On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 9:55 AM Emmanuel Vadot wrote: > On Mon, 29 Apr 2019 09:25:05 -0400 > Kris Moore wrote: > > > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 8:12 AM Emmanuel Vadot > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Hi Kris, > > > > > > On Sun, 28 Apr 2019 15:52:21 -0400 > > > wrote: > > > > > > > FreeBSD Community, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm pleased to announce a CFT for builds of FreeBSD 12-stable and > > > 13-current > > > > using "TrueOS-inspired" packaged base. These are stock FreeBSD images > > > which > > > > will allow users to perform all updating via the 'pkg' command > directly. > > > > Rather than trying to answer all questions in this announcement, > we've > > > > created a FAQ page with more details. Please refer to this page, and > let > > > us > > > > know if you have additional questions that we can include on that > page > > > going > > > > forward. > > > > > > > > > > While I appreciate the effort I have some doubt about your > > > "re-implementation" of pkgbase. I don't see any improvement compared to > > > what is in base currently, I even see downside of your implementation. > > > > > > - How do you plan with the need of updating kernel first, reboot and > > > updating the rest of the userland after ? (Needed for major and minor > > > upgrade, 12.0 to 12.1 for example, and simple update in -STABLE and > > > -HEAD branch). This is still a problem with the base pkgbase. > > > > > > > We've written our own tool "sysutils/sysup" in GO which handles this. It > > performs updates using Boot-Environments to ensure that kernel/world are > > updated at same time. > > > > Which could never be imported into FreeBSD. > Not suggesting it should be. Just information on how we solved that problem in our own appliance / platforms. For FreeBSD it would need some tooling still to handle this style of updating, regardless of which pkg base is used. And for what it's worth, FreeBSD is all the poorer for not being able to bring modern language based tools into the base. Personally I'm hoping the shift to base-packages makes this a moot point since the idea of 'what is base' can be diluted to just a manifest of what gets installed out of box. Just my 2C on the matter though :) > > > > > > > > - This is even worse because you are using the same repository for > > > base and pkg so if a user pkg update and both kernel and pkg(8) needs > > > to be updated and pkg use a new syscall or capsicum thing it will be > > > updated first and couldn't proceed with the rest of the update (this is > > > a supposition, I haven't personally tested). > > > > > > > See above. > You can selectively update os/kernel and reboot before doing rest. > > > > > > > - It seems that multiple kernels isn't supported in your > > > implementation, this is already supported in pkgbase but still need > > > some love. This is an important point as it will allow user to choose > > > easily the kernel that they want to use and will also allow us > > > developper to push kernels with new features to help testing. > > > > > > > Incorrect, on the 13-CURRENT build if you install kernel-debug, you'll > get > > the Witness-enabled kernel installed alongside non-debugging one. > > Mhm no, the kernel-debug packages only add the debug file > in /usr/lib/debug/boot/ > I'm talking about installing multiple kernels in // > (i.e. /boot/kernel.GENERIC /boot/kernel.MYFEATUREIWANTTOTEST) like > describe here : > > https://wiki.freebsd.org/PkgBase#Project_goals_and_additional_unresolved_issues > in the "How to handle /boot/kernel and /boot/kernel.$KERNCONF" point. > > Incorrect, os/kernel-debug installs /boot/kernel-debug which is (on 13-CURRENT) the Witness enabled kernel. os/kernel-debug-symbols are the /usr/lib/debug bits. > > > > > > > I think that the only advantage that your solution offers is that if > > > we remove a componant of base (rcmds for example in 12-CURRENT) those > > > files would be removed as they are in the userland-base package while > > > for pkgbase the FreeBSD-rcmd package will be deleted in the repo and > > > will not be deleted in the user computer. > > > > > > > > > Correct, this is one of the things which prompted us to go this > direction. > > Being able to handle crazy mixed WITH/WITHOUT flags was important to us, > > current pkg base did not handle that so gracefully. > > Can you give me more info on this ? What where the WITH/WITHOUT flags > that causes problems ? > I may have to pick Miwi's brain on this, but I believe some of the issues we saw were when introducing flags such as WITHOUT_RADIUS. Additionally there is a runtime problem to solve. I.E. if you change flags mid-stream, and user updates, there was no clean way on pkg-side to remove those already installed granular packages. Not without external tooling anyway. > > -- > Emmanuel Vadot > From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 14:09:32 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43F7D158F869; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:09:32 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: from gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1D9DC82F63; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:09:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: from gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id x3TE9OGH072532; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:09:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id x3TE9OFj072531; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:09:24 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201904291409.x3TE9OFj072531@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base In-Reply-To: <03b001d4fe92$f908c990$eb1a5cb0$@ixsystems.com> To: kris@ixsystems.com Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:09:24 -0700 (PDT) CC: "=?UTF-8?Q?'Goran_Meki=C4=87'?=" , "'Emmanuel Vadot'" , "'FreeBSD Stable'" , "'FreeBSD Current'" , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 1D9DC82F63 X-Spamd-Bar: +++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [3.54 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.29)[-0.286,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.86)[0.858,0]; IP_SCORE(0.04)[ip: (0.15), ipnet: 69.59.192.0/19(0.07), asn: 13868(0.05), country: US(-0.06)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[dnsmgr.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: gndrsh.dnsmgr.net]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.54)[0.537,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[9]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13868, ipnet:69.59.192.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:09:32 -0000 > > Correct, this is ZFS only. And it's something we're using specific to FreeNAS / TrueOS, which is why I didn't originally mention it as apart of our CFT. Then please it is "CFT: FreeNAS/TrueOS pkg base, ZFS only", calling this FreeBSD pkg base when it is not was wrong, and miss leading. > For UFS, there will need to be additional care taken when doing updates. > > -- > Kris Moore > Vice President of Engineering > iXsystems, Inc > Ph: (408) 943-4100 > Ph: (408) 943-4101 > The Groundbreaking TrueNAS M-Series - > Enterprise Storage & Servers Driven By Open Source > > -----Original Message----- > From: Goran Meki? > Sent: Monday, April 29, 2019 9:43 AM > To: Kris Moore > Cc: Emmanuel Vadot ; FreeBSD Stable ; FreeBSD Current ; freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org; freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org; freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; freebsd-ports@freebsd.org > Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base > > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 09:25:05AM -0400, Kris Moore wrote: > > We've written our own tool "sysutils/sysup" in GO which handles this. > > It performs updates using Boot-Environments to ensure that > > kernel/world are updated at same time. > > If I'm right, UFS doesn't support boot environments, so how would it work for UFS based installs? > > I personally feel GO is a bit ackward choice of language for something that practically should be part of base. At least I would expect OS update/upgrade not to require any external package. > > Regards, > meka > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > > -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 14:11:59 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82606158FD19 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:11:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: from mail-io1-xd36.google.com (mail-io1-xd36.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d36]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B34708343F for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:11:58 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: by mail-io1-xd36.google.com with SMTP id a23so9078712iot.4 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:11:58 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=40AQJesMSDreckm3W3V4ATFBI5KF5MeS/44F3ZnXX3c=; b=nYkpusi1yW4pdelw+f5HrIzcu5pHmJ6AtFAUPXdWxhEIzs2O+9mrVst5cpe+9IiTBj buKkqkoH03+f9OlGwIQIwdHPqD+UScMHbimGSo3iV3cGRgp8VY98wSjOBqXByUWBnud2 oxPAEavbyZO9JJUxTfmA5qMUlzAKGxH6VWU/FqaYoD4lqKzsTawG++ufv+n0mqRA7cDA 2Mj0AxeI1IJ+3k0xAoeJlETShu1v7mHO9efo3yRJ4sirKLAj7cBnP39wcn2xLM0/ZSzc 2b81tXEznDwNaTweWwNqLD7WeH2cL9qRzoBVrRzX7/E6YvJ11WYmft729e3Bg1ODOyZ3 lZsw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=40AQJesMSDreckm3W3V4ATFBI5KF5MeS/44F3ZnXX3c=; b=Olqu+iCLPLxC337MdsApjP0AQhZxaIK4Jje2QmuR+logNGlB53j79fmskZTFeLu2VR r1N7csJNLi1KIDtfJBmBHDrshTo7ahiy7llt/v4F/dkN2RDzoEIN/DIU4i4LQrouUXCP xCeCnbjg84nwrBxWDBwSGTWwGiSjtEpJrJerHXBsKoxv9DCJGmIyAjfLk63M3J4gA+G+ Gctf5ZSzJREWgin4Oj34S9S0bwZP4Lih4l00EgD5oeZN/9U0rqlDOVLg3v5vTBk6WAJ8 J051H4CRJ2KIONl1rjTei2gv3Ff14TKVuO2ihheq5wZqgmHDafTdE+uJPWJ7bRvSmgaZ Ns8g== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUEGld+aMEvRauEAzaCEaea+n21IsNPWIZ4eXc5W66D+hcApeNv iBLCAzRc066Xm4Qn2jlHa/1ywIqdY0OTtEcssl0QNA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyZczPSIfSA6FzUHIJ7nQ3lD+luMktNDaF/bc0ZvyXUkQSwBd9pNokOJ/XQddSd0tbCF/391BGIPpYk4cyTzcY= X-Received: by 2002:a6b:f809:: with SMTP id o9mr529367ioh.232.1556547118014; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:11:58 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <03b001d4fe92$f908c990$eb1a5cb0$@ixsystems.com> <201904291409.x3TE9OFj072531@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> In-Reply-To: <201904291409.x3TE9OFj072531@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> From: Kris Moore Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 10:11:47 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: "Rodney W. Grimes" Cc: =?UTF-8?B?R29yYW4gTWVracSH?= , Emmanuel Vadot , FreeBSD Stable , FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: B34708343F X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=nYkpusi1; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=ixsystems.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kris@ixsystems.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::d36 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kris@ixsystems.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.39 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[multipart/alternative,text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ALT3.ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.com]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[6.3.d.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[9]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[ixsystems.com,none]; IP_SCORE(-2.90)[ip: (-9.01), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.17), asn: 15169(-2.24), country: US(-0.06)]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.985,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.29 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:11:59 -0000 On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 10:09 AM Rodney W. Grimes < freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > > > Correct, this is ZFS only. And it's something we're using specific to > FreeNAS / TrueOS, which is why I didn't originally mention it as apart of > our CFT. > > Then please it is "CFT: FreeNAS/TrueOS pkg base, ZFS only", > calling this FreeBSD pkg base when it is not was wrong, > and miss leading. > Sorry, I disagree. This pkg base is independent of the ZFS tool we're using to wrangle boot-environments. Hence why it wasn't mentioned in the CFT. These base packages work the same as existing in-tree pkg base on UFS, no difference. If anything are probably safer due to being able to update all of userland in single extract operation, so you don't have out of order extraction of libc or some such. > > > For UFS, there will need to be additional care taken when doing updates. > > > > -- > > Kris Moore > > Vice President of Engineering > > iXsystems, Inc > > Ph: (408) 943-4100 > > Ph: (408) 943-4101 > > The Groundbreaking TrueNAS M-Series - > > Enterprise Storage & Servers Driven By Open Source > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Goran Meki? > > Sent: Monday, April 29, 2019 9:43 AM > > To: Kris Moore > > Cc: Emmanuel Vadot ; FreeBSD Stable < > freebsd-stable@freebsd.org>; FreeBSD Current ; > freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org; freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org; > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; freebsd-ports@freebsd.org > > Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base > > > > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 09:25:05AM -0400, Kris Moore wrote: > > > We've written our own tool "sysutils/sysup" in GO which handles this. > > > It performs updates using Boot-Environments to ensure that > > > kernel/world are updated at same time. > > > > If I'm right, UFS doesn't support boot environments, so how would it > work for UFS based installs? > > > > I personally feel GO is a bit ackward choice of language for something > that practically should be part of base. At least I would expect OS > update/upgrade not to require any external package. > > > > Regards, > > meka > > > > _______________________________________________ > > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to " > freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > > > > > > -- > Rod Grimes > rgrimes@freebsd.org > From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 14:34:27 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E12FE1591385 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:34:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: from mail-yb1-xb2e.google.com (mail-yb1-xb2e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b2e]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 672E885048 for ; 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FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-3.01)[ip: (-9.58), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.17), asn: 15169(-2.24), country: US(-0.06)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(0.00)[ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; BAD_REP_POLICIES(0.10)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; FROM_NO_DN(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[e.2.b.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:34:27 -0000 > > > > > Incorrect, os/kernel-debug installs /boot/kernel-debug which is (on > > 13-CURRENT) the Witness enabled kernel. os/kernel-debug-symbols are > > the /usr/lib/debug bits. > > I only see kernel-20190420203550_1.txz and kernel-debug- > 20190420203550.txz in https://pkg.trueos.org/pkg/freebsd- > pkgbase/FreeBSD%3A13%3Aamd64/latest/All/ > and kernel-debug only contain the debug files. > If I'm not looking in the right directory please correct me. > > > -- > Emmanuel Vadot Ahh, you are correct. I checked and those packages haven't pushed to the mirrors yet, Jenkins is still chewing on a build of them here. I was using the 12-stable packages yesterday which has these changes. They should be synced up to the mirrors in the next 24-48 hours. Sorry about the confusion. -- Kris Moore Vice President of Engineering iXsystems, Inc Ph: (408) 943-4100 Ph: (408) 943-4101 The Groundbreaking TrueNAS M-Series - Enterprise Storage & Servers Driven By Open Source From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 14:35:30 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A517F15914ED; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:35:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from manu@bidouilliste.com) Received: from mail.blih.net (mail.blih.net [212.83.177.182]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.blih.net", Issuer "mail.blih.net" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3703A8524C; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:35:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from manu@bidouilliste.com) Received: from mail.blih.net (mail.blih.net [212.83.177.182]) by mail.blih.net (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 11eeb002; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:28:47 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=bidouilliste.com; h=date :from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=mail; bh=pd7/fUDtndS60t3fDY8gFbr+Two=; b=AqXJs+17NHV0FINgAotTesH59c+B 109keWOxWL1+TMOSF+NDVQxB4H+HXTzoufryQIkVE+TtguwWQ9iHIhyNKMxw6DMp RScGGZ0hI8U8OtkWinOEOQxUm/tzAs8uQptSM4NCVj/OZ0h6MVS6SKnAwxTN4a1H ENep/QNErV197Gk= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=bidouilliste.com; h=date :from:to:cc:subject:message-id:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; q=dns; s= mail; b=n3JmpHsLPTGSrGwCTV7BGFwAwOPpILae22RBID1ZZiMRhksxrNHRWKqz pWHc2ldbxvBXtXPy51rxP3LbvvXIpZOYQcSKynauU421jQ9Ebow1gQW5B3cJjAYY 2OyQpeurrNKXkP5OnQLesEspie7y6WNyOknQ6b0jg2MyAELY2ag= Received: from skull.home.blih.net (ip-9.net-89-3-105.rev.numericable.fr [89.3.105.9]) by mail.blih.net (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTPSA id d0d7e356 TLS version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:28:47 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:28:47 +0200 From: Emmanuel Vadot To: Kris Moore Cc: FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base Message-Id: <20190429162847.a32262b6073f5523bdbe0ed4@bidouilliste.com> In-Reply-To: References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <20190429141239.f9de62f6b6721112d7143cf6@bidouilliste.com> <20190429155522.81dcc291a6b252884219de1e@bidouilliste.com> X-Mailer: Sylpheed 3.7.0 (GTK+ 2.24.32; amd64-portbld-freebsd13.0) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 3703A8524C X-Spamd-Bar: ++++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=bidouilliste.com header.s=mail header.b=AqXJs+17; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of manu@bidouilliste.com designates 212.83.177.182 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=manu@bidouilliste.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [8.90 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(0.00)[+ip4:212.83.177.182/32]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; URIBL_RED(3.50)[trueos.org.multi.uribl.com]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[bidouilliste.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mx-backup.blih.net]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[7]; HAS_ANON_DOMAIN(0.10)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; IP_SCORE(0.39)[ip: (-0.85), ipnet: 212.83.160.0/19(2.96), asn: 12876(-0.17), country: FR(-0.01)]; ASN(0.00)[asn:12876, ipnet:212.83.160.0/19, country:FR]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(0.00)[bidouilliste.com:s=mail]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.92)[0.924,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[bidouilliste.com]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.90)[0.897,0]; BAD_REP_POLICIES(0.10)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[0.998,0]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; GREYLIST(0.00)[pass,body]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:35:30 -0000 On Mon, 29 Apr 2019 10:05:59 -0400 Kris Moore wrote: > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 9:55 AM Emmanuel Vadot > wrote: > > > On Mon, 29 Apr 2019 09:25:05 -0400 > > Kris Moore wrote: > > > > > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 8:12 AM Emmanuel Vadot > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Kris, > > > > > > > > On Sun, 28 Apr 2019 15:52:21 -0400 > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > FreeBSD Community, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm pleased to announce a CFT for builds of FreeBSD 12-stable and > > > > 13-current > > > > > using "TrueOS-inspired" packaged base. These are stock FreeBSD images > > > > which > > > > > will allow users to perform all updating via the 'pkg' command > > directly. > > > > > Rather than trying to answer all questions in this announcement, > > we've > > > > > created a FAQ page with more details. Please refer to this page, and > > let > > > > us > > > > > know if you have additional questions that we can include on that > > page > > > > going > > > > > forward. > > > > > > > > > > > > > While I appreciate the effort I have some doubt about your > > > > "re-implementation" of pkgbase. I don't see any improvement compared to > > > > what is in base currently, I even see downside of your implementation. > > > > > > > > - How do you plan with the need of updating kernel first, reboot and > > > > updating the rest of the userland after ? (Needed for major and minor > > > > upgrade, 12.0 to 12.1 for example, and simple update in -STABLE and > > > > -HEAD branch). This is still a problem with the base pkgbase. > > > > > > > > > > We've written our own tool "sysutils/sysup" in GO which handles this. It > > > performs updates using Boot-Environments to ensure that kernel/world are > > > updated at same time. > > > > > > > Which could never be imported into FreeBSD. > > > > Not suggesting it should be. Just information on how we solved that problem > in our own appliance / platforms. For FreeBSD it would need some tooling > still to handle this style of updating, regardless of which pkg base is > used. > > And for what it's worth, FreeBSD is all the poorer for not being able to > bring modern language based tools into the base. Personally I'm hoping the > shift to base-packages makes this a moot point since the idea of 'what is > base' can be diluted to just a manifest of what gets installed out of box. > Just my 2C on the matter though :) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - This is even worse because you are using the same repository for > > > > base and pkg so if a user pkg update and both kernel and pkg(8) needs > > > > to be updated and pkg use a new syscall or capsicum thing it will be > > > > updated first and couldn't proceed with the rest of the update (this is > > > > a supposition, I haven't personally tested). > > > > > > > > > > See above. > > > > You can selectively update os/kernel and reboot before doing rest. > > > > > > > > > > > > - It seems that multiple kernels isn't supported in your > > > > implementation, this is already supported in pkgbase but still need > > > > some love. This is an important point as it will allow user to choose > > > > easily the kernel that they want to use and will also allow us > > > > developper to push kernels with new features to help testing. > > > > > > > > > > Incorrect, on the 13-CURRENT build if you install kernel-debug, you'll > > get > > > the Witness-enabled kernel installed alongside non-debugging one. > > > > Mhm no, the kernel-debug packages only add the debug file > > in /usr/lib/debug/boot/ > > I'm talking about installing multiple kernels in // > > (i.e. /boot/kernel.GENERIC /boot/kernel.MYFEATUREIWANTTOTEST) like > > describe here : > > > > https://wiki.freebsd.org/PkgBase#Project_goals_and_additional_unresolved_issues > > in the "How to handle /boot/kernel and /boot/kernel.$KERNCONF" point. > > > > > Incorrect, os/kernel-debug installs /boot/kernel-debug which is (on > 13-CURRENT) the Witness enabled kernel. os/kernel-debug-symbols are the > /usr/lib/debug bits. I only see kernel-20190420203550_1.txz and kernel-debug-20190420203550.txz in https://pkg.trueos.org/pkg/freebsd-pkgbase/FreeBSD%3A13%3Aamd64/latest/All/ and kernel-debug only contain the debug files. If I'm not looking in the right directory please correct me. > > > > > > > > > > > I think that the only advantage that your solution offers is that if > > > > we remove a componant of base (rcmds for example in 12-CURRENT) those > > > > files would be removed as they are in the userland-base package while > > > > for pkgbase the FreeBSD-rcmd package will be deleted in the repo and > > > > will not be deleted in the user computer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Correct, this is one of the things which prompted us to go this > > direction. > > > Being able to handle crazy mixed WITH/WITHOUT flags was important to us, > > > current pkg base did not handle that so gracefully. > > > > Can you give me more info on this ? What where the WITH/WITHOUT flags > > that causes problems ? > > > > > I may have to pick Miwi's brain on this, but I believe some of the issues > we saw were when introducing flags such as WITHOUT_RADIUS. Additionally > there is a runtime problem to solve. I.E. if you change flags mid-stream, > and user updates, there was no clean way on pkg-side to remove those > already installed granular packages. Not without external tooling anyway. > > > > > > > -- > > Emmanuel Vadot > > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-stable@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-stable > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-stable-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" -- Emmanuel Vadot From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 14:50:37 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46D751592682; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:50:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from guru@unixarea.de) Received: from ms-10.1blu.de (ms-10.1blu.de [178.254.4.101]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4225D8646F; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:50:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from guru@unixarea.de) Received: from [188.174.53.230] (helo=localhost.unixarea.de) by ms-10.1blu.de with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1hL7bz-0002Y9-RN; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:50:31 +0200 Received: from localhost.my.domain (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost.unixarea.de (8.15.2/8.14.9) with ESMTPS id x3TEoUWV003159 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:50:30 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from guru@unixarea.de) Received: (from guru@localhost) by localhost.my.domain (8.15.2/8.14.9/Submit) id x3TEoTvi003158; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:50:29 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from guru@unixarea.de) X-Authentication-Warning: localhost.my.domain: guru set sender to guru@unixarea.de using -f Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:50:28 +0200 From: Matthias Apitz To: Emmanuel Vadot Cc: Kris Moore , FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base Message-ID: <20190429145028.GA3124@c720-r342378> Reply-To: Matthias Apitz Mail-Followup-To: Emmanuel Vadot , Kris Moore , FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <20190429141239.f9de62f6b6721112d7143cf6@bidouilliste.com> <20190429155522.81dcc291a6b252884219de1e@bidouilliste.com> <20190429162847.a32262b6073f5523bdbe0ed4@bidouilliste.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="SLDf9lqlvOQaIe6s" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20190429162847.a32262b6073f5523bdbe0ed4@bidouilliste.com> X-Operating-System: FreeBSD 13.0-CURRENT r342378 (amd64) X-message-flag: Mails containing HTML will not be read! Please send only plain text. User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.1 (2018-12-01) X-Con-Id: 51246 X-Con-U: 0-guru X-Originating-IP: 188.174.53.230 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4225D8646F X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.27 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[guru@unixarea.de]; HAS_XOIP(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-3.06)[ip: (-8.83), ipnet: 178.254.0.0/19(-3.59), asn: 42730(-2.85), country: DE(-0.01)]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mail.unixarea.de]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.91)[-0.906,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[8]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[230.53.174.188.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.10]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:42730, ipnet:178.254.0.0/19, country:DE]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[101.4.254.178.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[unixarea.de]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_NOT_FQDN(0.50)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:50:37 -0000 --SLDf9lqlvOQaIe6s Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Why this thread has to go to all these lists? I receive any mail 5 times! matthias --=20 Matthias Apitz, =E2=9C=89 guru@unixarea.de, http://www.unixarea.de/ +49-176= -38902045 Public GnuPG key: http://www.unixarea.de/key.pub N =E2=82=AC I N zur EU! "Gegen das EU-Europa der Banken, Konzerne und Kriegstreiber. F=C3=BCr ein soziales und friedliches Europa der V=C3=B6lker." DKP --SLDf9lqlvOQaIe6s Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAABCAAdFiEEXmn7rBYYViyzy/vBR8z35Hb+nREFAlzHDzEACgkQR8z35Hb+ nREGJw//d4Me8jC0GcEDanOfjeW5fmHAtwKrbve2YkvvA0Iw3Wzmdn9nyh7s2K/H /lzTcGqx4BaKKM4uGhCtD62aVD2xEi9Hv6EPLz9W0MM3pNBMmrgzQYYdYZcA2N7Y pELE84TpCfrPY9n2kIe9mJVHxAcaWcQzltbCvGg1WFNQ1UfxUvyrKFl5ZnwJidHG mo5EyBIX4x/IYMnVRJggapH2agOhSinIlnEFxLnHZ0+/NAIlb4SgbqW04klZZR+Z x0wTwRYN1y2fRXauMuB4mvnv9PJOyYuK8NzSW/Dp6RSi9QhGhvvFbNxnJqs8I/dS WfD4i4MciK7p1wBXUnHcqvsCk7J+z05CXbTzplYoAD+t3ToI1EHlHZSxX0tO2N3z ymKc+bdLhOYVCargYh9Ow9otwRf5+isK0fQvuRAR9MH98EJMAvpNi969VKK1Nj/a teHR0Rf6hpLwFn3/mcwvLCRqoG49DfDU9CpEeISG8fguTnR7ZoE3wtyfSkw9+DoL i4RPA0Yi52iQ2QiVXWY8L8hYxzyoK2nBFOsyBDxqCxCeZKWyc0qgRcmGrIZSVJVT gXdXOLAZYW2pVlhciKtFAzusOTJ/cCZAksO/mwcNaXMaE8DIgOxYO2g/+kDhnIpj Ton1X+UbjzEM+61iLZrQKwWlwXTIdCGcEPFHkje/Wz7Mt3lr+0I= =JlvZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --SLDf9lqlvOQaIe6s-- From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 14:50:55 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DA7A1592730 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:50:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: from mail-yw1-xc2a.google.com (mail-yw1-xc2a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::c2a]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DA7668650A for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:50:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: by mail-yw1-xc2a.google.com with SMTP id g29so3793932ywk.3 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:50:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=from:to:cc:references:in-reply-to:subject:date:message-id :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding:thread-index :content-language; bh=yDWcEIUqpI/8RHhni+7NV8CWfzwUCh3D7x8chiwsbA4=; b=GVbnM8jWMiaofl9yIT2dur5Gd4zyt/k/MWSNopdWF4vt/eSwtQOKucH8/6kKox73y3 V8Ji5goVdsrFYyMfXRPjOk0TiDqxLQozUlg9tCMZaXKEbl0Noo2Nfq/ANLhZ02hQrVsu cYO0fw0uRnKVNVyPS3XqHtkNq7u7s83v0Lv4woTqhBO+yrxv0A04k6yh6PmzralbkOdr WI8fdk9FmrOTp/iRImFUiEPH9mcK71sNXcDsMqyGJ0szb1GE43X8U3b2sFuMGPv8qPGs Sc3rK9OiYNThtG6xQUMr3/u43wO8XHOQ6wsmakxPJ/vSsc5w/BGQBAOV+LKDoKLRYTGF yp8g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:references:in-reply-to:subject:date :message-id:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding:thread-index :content-language; bh=yDWcEIUqpI/8RHhni+7NV8CWfzwUCh3D7x8chiwsbA4=; b=pXF2Fwh6GM2QZ/7Pcc5bc9pLEWFRyM0RGApwW6gp+btkhi/8E/EgXO64uHegLr4EqX MSHzJeB1FZcZRSPvY1B9iWdnq0/JHRJV9nAaGrIDljZMEIkOovijGq12EZxTSyYJNfrD 4phhBvPD4xjKLUhHca02G/8dsVMkzjP3PZYcJsMgfx68BrP4lrvPyNJN4swO9+g7F+Pi K24+lwugiWP38TsMyOK2cbp6PDL3hrnrx1DLra7b9ks8nZNoibUxlI+7vbHoVuDHd98N YKj7gSRr1Rt2ui4jfwEkPkFI+jdL8TdxxFj0KkzpeydWoHwNGIHJ49yzSg8KTcvx0rWy pC/A== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUugwPlJEnh7/XU26GAZGn/4oFKixCK4blOfNOmYvrQ84dLHlka MV8yTYBS19qLZQXvaxFXcqrZoQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxOxZ2n/jEWWoIVaMIBGxQcXd/lwsQcs8+tKZyzj3ZcesHaemSZTZHfpTMMdj0Oh/OWIfulTw== X-Received: by 2002:a0d:f441:: with SMTP id d62mr38198373ywf.350.1556549453101; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:50:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from KrisYogaC930 ([12.189.233.130]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c184sm2254330ywe.75.2019.04.29.07.50.52 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:50:52 -0700 (PDT) From: To: "'Rodney W. Grimes'" Cc: =?iso-8859-2?Q?'Goran_Meki=E6'?= , "'Emmanuel Vadot'" , "'FreeBSD Stable'" , "'FreeBSD Current'" , , , , References: <201904291441.x3TEfMid072751@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> In-Reply-To: <201904291441.x3TEfMid072751@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> Subject: RE: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 10:50:51 -0400 Message-ID: <053101d4fe9a$f1152320$d33f6960$@ixsystems.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AQM63uti6cm6tb0qpYZSIKL3MVPss6OHdbsQ Content-Language: en-us X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: DA7668650A X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=GVbnM8jW; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=ixsystems.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of kris@ixsystems.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::c2a as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=kris@ixsystems.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-5.14 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; IP_SCORE(-2.64)[ip: (-7.73), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.17), asn: 15169(-2.24), country: US(-0.06)]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ALT3.ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.com]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[a.2.c.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; FROM_NO_DN(0.00)[]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[ixsystems.com,none]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[9]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.993,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:50:55 -0000 > -----Original Message----- > From: Rodney W. Grimes > Sent: Monday, April 29, 2019 10:41 AM > To: Kris Moore > Cc: Rodney W. Grimes ; Goran Meki=E6 > ; Emmanuel Vadot ; FreeBSD > Stable ; FreeBSD Current current@freebsd.org>; freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org; freebsd- > pkg@freebsd.org; freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; = freebsd-ports@freebsd.org > Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base >=20 > > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 10:09 AM Rodney W. Grimes < > > freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Correct, this is ZFS only. And it's something we're using = specific > > > > to > > > FreeNAS / TrueOS, which is why I didn't originally mention it as > > > apart of our CFT. > > > > > > Then please it is "CFT: FreeNAS/TrueOS pkg base, ZFS only", = calling > > > this FreeBSD pkg base when it is not was wrong, and miss leading. > > > > > > > Sorry, I disagree. > Which is fine. >=20 > > This pkg base is independent of the ZFS tool we're using > > to wrangle boot-environments. Hence why it wasn't mentioned in the = CFT. > > These base packages work the same as existing in-tree pkg base on = UFS, no > > difference. If anything are probably safer due to being able to = update all > > of userland in single extract operation, so you don't have out of = order > > extraction of libc or some such. >=20 > You missed the major string change and focused on the edge, > No comment on calling iXsystems :stuff: FreeBSD instead of > FreeNAS/TrueOS? >=20 > That was the major point of my statement, your miss leading the user > community, you yourself said this would never be imported into FreeBSD > base, so I see no reason that it should be called "FreeBSD package = Base", > as it is not, that is a different project. >=20 > -- > Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org I think somehow you've missed the entire point here. This is being = brought forth as a FreeBSD CFT in the hopes of upstream adoption. No misleading = here whatsoever. The only thing that I wouldn't expect to be imported into = base was this external tool we use on FreeNAS/TrueOS to handle our specific use-case of ZFS only. Total strawman here. Seriously, suggest you bother looking at it and reading further to get = the full context. If anything this is far less invasive since it doesn't = require lots of hacking on base, and can even be used to package old versions of FreeBSD if desired. The only thing I changed to make these images was a patch to bsdinstall to replace dist-file extraction with 'pkg install userland kernel pkg ...'. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 14:51:39 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 569CC1592853 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:51:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: from mail-yb1-xb36.google.com (mail-yb1-xb36.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::b36]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2F1BE8676F for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:51:38 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kris@ixsystems.com) Received: by mail-yb1-xb36.google.com with SMTP id q17so3867083ybg.7 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:51:38 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; 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Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:51:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from KrisYogaC930 ([12.189.233.130]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r11sm8806468ywb.81.2019.04.29.07.51.36 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:51:36 -0700 (PDT) From: To: "'Matthias Apitz'" , "'Emmanuel Vadot'" Cc: "'FreeBSD Stable'" , , , "'FreeBSD Current'" , , References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <20190429141239.f9de62f6b6721112d7143cf6@bidouilliste.com> <20190429155522.81dcc291a6b252884219de1e@bidouilliste.com> <20190429162847.a32262b6073f5523bdbe0ed4@bidouilliste.com> <20190429145028.GA3124@c720-r342378> In-Reply-To: <20190429145028.GA3124@c720-r342378> Subject: RE: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 10:51:35 -0400 Message-ID: <053501d4fe9b$0b8c0a20$22a41e60$@ixsystems.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 16.0 Thread-Index: AQFBRupbev+o6AHqgfoJLZwOgBKxNQFhdrr5Ad4+GxoCGFDnowGvv4BvAf5pkjQA0yLFdKcr3YuA Content-Language: en-us X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 2F1BE8676F X-Spamd-Bar: ----- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; 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RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[6.3.b.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.993,0]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:51:39 -0000 > -----Original Message----- > From: Matthias Apitz > Sent: Monday, April 29, 2019 10:50 AM > To: Emmanuel Vadot > Cc: Kris Moore ; FreeBSD Stable stable@freebsd.org>; freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org; freebsd- > hackers@freebsd.org; FreeBSD Current ; > freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org; freebsd-ports@freebsd.org > Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base >=20 >=20 > Why this thread has to go to all these lists? I receive any mail 5 = times! >=20 > Matthias Fair point. I'll restrict my replies to the -pkgbase list from here on = out, suggest others do the same. Sorry about the noise =F0=9F=98=8A > -- > Matthias Apitz, =E2=9C=89 guru@unixarea.de, http://www.unixarea.de/ = +49-176- > 38902045 Public GnuPG key: http://www.unixarea.de/key.pub N =E2=82=AC = I N zur EU! > "Gegen das EU-Europa der Banken, Konzerne und Kriegstreiber. > F=C3=BCr ein soziales und friedliches Europa der V=C3=B6lker." DKP From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 13:43:39 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08546158DC84; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:43:39 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from meka@tilda.center) Received: from mail.tilda.center (srv02.tilda.center [199.247.21.11]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D416280907; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:43:37 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from meka@tilda.center) Received: from hal9000.home.meka.rs (79-101-248-108.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs [79.101.248.108]) by mail.tilda.center (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id BA3D318F2E; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 15:43:29 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 15:43:29 +0200 From: Goran =?utf-8?B?TWVracSH?= To: Kris Moore Cc: Emmanuel Vadot , FreeBSD Stable , FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base Message-ID: <20190429134329.g7t77muqfb6dh2fj@hal9000.home.meka.rs> References: <002901d4fdfb$e52eb890$af8c29b0$@ixsystems.com> <20190429141239.f9de62f6b6721112d7143cf6@bidouilliste.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="t5aclbayfnyvbvsj" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: NeoMutt/20180716 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: D416280907 X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of meka@tilda.center designates 199.247.21.11 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=meka@tilda.center X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.27 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; IP_SCORE(-2.84)[ip: (-9.65), ipnet: 199.247.16.0/21(-4.74), asn: 20473(0.24), country: US(-0.06)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.20)[multipart/signed,text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[tilda.center]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mail.tilda.center]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.61)[-0.615,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[8]; SIGNED_PGP(-2.00)[]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+,1:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:20473, ipnet:199.247.16.0/21, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[108.248.101.79.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.11] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 15:40:52 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:43:39 -0000 --t5aclbayfnyvbvsj Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 09:25:05AM -0400, Kris Moore wrote: > We've written our own tool "sysutils/sysup" in GO which handles this. It > performs updates using Boot-Environments to ensure that kernel/world are > updated at same time. If I'm right, UFS doesn't support boot environments, so how would it work for UFS based installs? I personally feel GO is a bit ackward choice of language for something that practically should be part of base. At least I would expect OS update/upgrade not to require any external package. Regards, meka --t5aclbayfnyvbvsj Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIzBAEBCAAdFiEE1WIFkXy2ZeMKjjKEWj1TknovrLYFAlzG/30ACgkQWj1Tknov rLbwqQ//VC6wp5BQt7sP2Jr8NoCIo3pwn7oJOk+JPeFHFGuKqb0G/zyLj31LeYSH mtj+QN6lCIALHNuSis25OAUjBLp6rHXj7VM7oExuKfhtxJ4DJGXBxz4O8TnHwFuk CBGqFCwpv9Suedylc0evdHQls737zS46ExeM96DaDqm7Z86Ca2ODm7zm0RmeO19i m+FAdMDERGGgneQdTs8pHS5If420/vWkqldJzEKQoibXJQyom0hxtWZM/UoIvK8q h07d3yCa0s4A+2qzhWwuAJlTZs+SGZGC+Q/Kt4eMANRmp68obca3grFg7ribm1yq xTcS92ehnGBhLoNILWs3V0Nptcr7jy/aenRiX5Ume4P2ciH5tJEgw7n9iDqwSp49 Q4KVDsBOF5wfNIhrcHM9LGovxdUYPcnJSXOcbgcw1OQ2lOm8UC2rkMsRNx7Wci0P Q4Qi6w7KxQwaVhzzItAM/kdjAAFuXTbVpLmTo5yn81W26lR0t0d9mOF8DQ4Nw8B/ wPp/dOlGRT/tKETMUXTCQcdxFWSklvH6a1QKTVFwgLg4S5zi8fqma5y7B7TLDw1f E/zc4vz6SsT+1q6TSFmRwsjjI3yALWXQGHNb5PcH20j7Ws3+PXkCTFbxe1tHuDNJ nam2pOQyfyWhI9kaveYkVjmEEmuOR9HQDtGM+FmrfKTCpAc1kXs= =h7gm -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --t5aclbayfnyvbvsj-- From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 14:41:31 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3F3F1591C40; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:41:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: from gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (br1.CN84in.dnsmgr.net [69.59.192.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1872C85C1E; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:41:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: from gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id x3TEfNiC072752; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:41:23 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net) Received: (from freebsd-rwg@localhost) by gndrsh.dnsmgr.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) id x3TEfMid072751; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:41:22 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from freebsd-rwg) From: "Rodney W. Grimes" Message-Id: <201904291441.x3TEfMid072751@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base In-Reply-To: To: Kris Moore Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:41:22 -0700 (PDT) CC: "Rodney W. Grimes" , =?UTF-8?Q?Goran_Meki=C4=87?= , Emmanuel Vadot , FreeBSD Stable , FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL121h (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 1872C85C1E X-Spamd-Bar: ++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [2.27 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.78)[-0.776,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.43)[0.430,0]; IP_SCORE(0.04)[ip: (0.15), ipnet: 69.59.192.0/19(0.07), asn: 13868(0.05), country: US(-0.06)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[dnsmgr.net]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: gndrsh.dnsmgr.net]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(0.19)[0.186,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[10]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:13868, ipnet:69.59.192.0/19, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:19:24 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:41:31 -0000 > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 10:09 AM Rodney W. Grimes < > freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > > > > > > Correct, this is ZFS only. And it's something we're using specific to > > FreeNAS / TrueOS, which is why I didn't originally mention it as apart of > > our CFT. > > > > Then please it is "CFT: FreeNAS/TrueOS pkg base, ZFS only", > > calling this FreeBSD pkg base when it is not was wrong, > > and miss leading. > > > > Sorry, I disagree. Which is fine. > This pkg base is independent of the ZFS tool we're using > to wrangle boot-environments. Hence why it wasn't mentioned in the CFT. > These base packages work the same as existing in-tree pkg base on UFS, no > difference. If anything are probably safer due to being able to update all > of userland in single extract operation, so you don't have out of order > extraction of libc or some such. You missed the major string change and focused on the edge, No comment on calling iXsystems :stuff: FreeBSD instead of FreeNAS/TrueOS? That was the major point of my statement, your miss leading the user community, you yourself said this would never be imported into FreeBSD base, so I see no reason that it should be called "FreeBSD package Base", as it is not, that is a different project. > > > For UFS, there will need to be additional care taken when doing updates. > > > > > > -- > > > Kris Moore > > > Vice President of Engineering > > > iXsystems, Inc > > > Ph: (408) 943-4100 > > > Ph: (408) 943-4101 > > > The Groundbreaking TrueNAS M-Series - > > > Enterprise Storage & Servers Driven By Open Source > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Goran Meki? > > > Sent: Monday, April 29, 2019 9:43 AM > > > To: Kris Moore > > > Cc: Emmanuel Vadot ; FreeBSD Stable < > > freebsd-stable@freebsd.org>; FreeBSD Current ; > > freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org; freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org; > > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org; freebsd-ports@freebsd.org > > > Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base > > > > > > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 09:25:05AM -0400, Kris Moore wrote: > > > > We've written our own tool "sysutils/sysup" in GO which handles this. > > > > It performs updates using Boot-Environments to ensure that > > > > kernel/world are updated at same time. > > > > > > If I'm right, UFS doesn't support boot environments, so how would it > > work for UFS based installs? > > > > > > I personally feel GO is a bit ackward choice of language for something > > that practically should be part of base. At least I would expect OS > > update/upgrade not to require any external package. > > > > > > Regards, > > > meka > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > > > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to " > > freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Rod Grimes > > rgrimes@freebsd.org > > -- Rod Grimes rgrimes@freebsd.org From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 18:30:15 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBA4C159894B for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 18:30:14 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wojtek@puchar.net) Received: from puchar.net (puchar.net [194.1.144.90]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 55074681CA for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 18:30:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wojtek@puchar.net) Received: Received: from 127.0.0.1 (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by puchar.net (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x3TIU66Q048883 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 20:30:06 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from puchar-wojtek@puchar.net) Received: from localhost (puchar-wojtek@localhost) by puchar.net (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id x3TIU61h048880 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 20:30:06 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from puchar-wojtek@puchar.net) Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 20:30:06 +0200 (CEST) From: Wojciech Puchar To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: very low performance tcp/rsh Message-ID: User-Agent: Alpine 2.20 (BSF 67 2015-01-07) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 55074681CA X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of wojtek@puchar.net designates 194.1.144.90 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=wojtek@puchar.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.64 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; TO_DN_NONE(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[puchar.net]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.83)[-0.827,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[90.144.1.194.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; IP_SCORE(-3.50)[ip: (-9.26), ipnet: 194.1.144.0/24(-4.63), asn: 43476(-3.70), country: PL(0.07)]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[puchar.net]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:43476, ipnet:194.1.144.0/24, country:PL]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 18:30:15 -0000 i tried rsh -l user localhost "cat /dev/zero" >/dev/null got 300MB/s or machine that can do memcpy at 10GB/s (with 1GB blocks - no cache) single threaded. what limits the performance From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 18:59:59 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF87C1599999 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 18:59:59 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Received: from eg.sd.rdtc.ru (eg.sd.rdtc.ru [IPv6:2a03:3100:c:13::5]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "eg.sd.rdtc.ru", Issuer "eg.sd.rdtc.ru" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D1ABD6B287 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 18:59:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) X-Envelope-From: eugen@grosbein.net X-Envelope-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from [10.58.0.4] ([10.58.0.4]) by eg.sd.rdtc.ru (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x3TIxY4B096862 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Tue, 30 Apr 2019 01:59:34 +0700 (+07) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Subject: Re: very low performance tcp/rsh To: Wojciech Puchar , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: From: Eugene Grosbein Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 01:59:29 +0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: D1ABD6B287 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=permerror (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of eugen@grosbein.net uses mechanism not recognized by this client) smtp.mailfrom=eugen@grosbein.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.62 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.86)[-0.856,0]; MX_INVALID(0.50)[greylisted]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.42)[0.420,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.58)[-0.583,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[grosbein.net]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_PERMFAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[country: RU(0.00)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:29072, ipnet:2a03:3100::/32, country:RU]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 19:00:00 -0000 30.04.2019 1:30, Wojciech Puchar wrote: > i tried > > rsh -l user localhost "cat /dev/zero" >/dev/null > > got 300MB/s or machine that can do memcpy at 10GB/s (with 1GB blocks - no cache) single threaded. > > what limits the performance memcpy() runs in user space while reading (pseudo) device does multiple system calls with context switches and copying data from kernel to userland (and back while sending to the net). Also, zero(4) device has additional and significant overhead because it needs to clear many memory pages and it can make heavy load on VM subsystem. Also, rsh is not optimized for multi-GB/s speeds. If you want to measure single-threaded TCP performance, use mdconfig to create memory "disk", put some big file there (2GB should be enought) and run stock ftpd to send big file. Our ftpd uses sendfile() system call that makes kernel read data from file and put it directly to TCP socket without any kind of extra data copying and without extra context switches. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 19:22:09 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66557159A55C for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 19:22:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wojtek@puchar.net) Received: from puchar.net (puchar.net [194.1.144.90]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7A5146CE8E for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 19:22:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from wojtek@puchar.net) Received: Received: from 127.0.0.1 (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by puchar.net (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x3TJM5ot059851 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 29 Apr 2019 21:22:05 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from puchar-wojtek@puchar.net) Received: from localhost (puchar-wojtek@localhost) by puchar.net (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id x3TJM5vq059848; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 21:22:05 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from puchar-wojtek@puchar.net) Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 21:22:04 +0200 (CEST) From: Wojciech Puchar To: Eugene Grosbein cc: Wojciech Puchar , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: very low performance tcp/rsh In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: User-Agent: Alpine 2.20 (BSF 67 2015-01-07) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 7A5146CE8E X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of wojtek@puchar.net designates 194.1.144.90 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=wojtek@puchar.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.78 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[puchar.net]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: puchar.net]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.97)[-0.966,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[90.144.1.194.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; IP_SCORE(-3.51)[ip: (-9.26), ipnet: 194.1.144.0/24(-4.63), asn: 43476(-3.70), country: PL(0.07)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:43476, ipnet:194.1.144.0/24, country:PL]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 19:22:09 -0000 create 32GB hole-file dd if=/dev/zero of=test bs=32k seek=1m count=0 fetch -o /dev/null over ftp (proftpd) gives 1.4GB/s proftpd consumed 100% of single core. much better. tested with FreeBSD ftpd - 1.7GB/s seems like freebsd can saturate 10Gb/s ethernet with single core (Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2620 v4 @ 2.10GHz) Still where is the most overhead? one memcopy to packet buffers+creating packet headers (send). reception is on separate process taking another core. still - quite good. But compared to filesystem overhead - large. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 19:31:44 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 198A3159AB6B; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 19:31:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from smtp-out-so.shaw.ca (smtp-out-so.shaw.ca [64.59.136.139]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9A9B46E3AA; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 19:31:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([70.67.125.17]) by shaw.ca with ESMTPA id LBzshjHmcGusjLBzuhmeZ0; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:31:33 -0600 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=fOdHIqSe c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:117 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:17 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=oexKYjalfGEA:10 a=iKhvJSA4AAAA:8 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=zoJ4fAklMHesfqNpwjwA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=odh9cflL3HIXMm4fY7Wr:22 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (slippy8 [10.2.2.6]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D3E2B3105; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 12:31:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id x3TJV7Bg079805; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 12:31:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from slippy (cy@localhost) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id x3TJV73d079802; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 12:31:07 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Message-Id: <201904291931.x3TJV73d079802@slippy.cwsent.com> X-Authentication-Warning: slippy.cwsent.com: cy owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.8.0 04/21/2012 with nmh-1.7.1 Reply-to: Cy Schubert From: Cy Schubert X-os: FreeBSD X-Sender: cy@cwsent.com X-URL: http://www.cschubert.com/ To: "Rodney W. Grimes" cc: Kris Moore , FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, =?UTF-8?Q?Goran_Meki=C4=87?= , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, Emmanuel Vadot Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base In-Reply-To: Message from "Rodney W. Grimes" of "Mon, 29 Apr 2019 07:41:22 -0700." <201904291441.x3TEfMid072751@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 12:31:07 -0700 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfNzDWI+zWN/ORISOq2YqftqFPdS4edEpOvpU680vr/0sjvuXehwqqYw0ygP6+3T7Viuz3PQ57eRy7ntso0zPA0JjpvAP5KpCIGDydVICtnz/bDuBZkz4 VbYnvaZwzvtOLW8kh/E7iOCeqvOdfrhDDuiTa+Y3tiipLD5wFQ7WpOMBu8d6YrXpgO+nSY1ixyrUmJWDQMUI4uT6jZd+oryQwP57gTjGBm4H7h/9mgQjhYAY SQ1w9uhrKaTp77U96HuJm588nPRfFMJaHYZx/ujMsDcLJ2shhxEYacWnLVCukybqG59i/LE/HnqNK70ShU64HBWLAE0+UKo/j0aEmoKiYmImmhTpfe1quzvx eZfp65MULKH35mmEeRiGdaCZKvJl34o+2v5R9iwIpNcP+v2lEFdlES8D3hdvr1zkghhJAd92ZKzqvEq+P0/RrZed+EmdU0ZCe8iDz1f+E+g4/cZQBThOnlBZ elX6kJv4tFCEr9Dbre3Bz9SgHVyRWEGx7ERsHS2PMdNGgjxvUJk20eu6jc8= X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 9A9B46E3AA X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.49 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[spqr.komquats.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.986,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[10]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[17.125.67.70.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.11]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:6327, ipnet:64.59.128.0/20, country:CA]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[139.136.59.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-2.29)[ip: (-5.71), ipnet: 64.59.128.0/20(-3.21), asn: 6327(-2.45), country: CA(-0.09)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 19:54:17 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 19:31:44 -0000 In message <201904291441.x3TEfMid072751@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net>, "Rodney W. Grimes" writes: > > On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 10:09 AM Rodney W. Grimes < > > freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Correct, this is ZFS only. And it's something we're using specific to > > > FreeNAS / TrueOS, which is why I didn't originally mention it as apart of > > > our CFT. > > > > > > Then please it is "CFT: FreeNAS/TrueOS pkg base, ZFS only", > > > calling this FreeBSD pkg base when it is not was wrong, > > > and miss leading. > > > > > > > Sorry, I disagree. > Which is fine. > > > This pkg base is independent of the ZFS tool we're using > > to wrangle boot-environments. Hence why it wasn't mentioned in the CFT. > > These base packages work the same as existing in-tree pkg base on UFS, no > > difference. If anything are probably safer due to being able to update all > > of userland in single extract operation, so you don't have out of order > > extraction of libc or some such. > > You missed the major string change and focused on the edge, > No comment on calling iXsystems :stuff: FreeBSD instead of FreeNAS/TrueOS? > > That was the major point of my statement, your miss leading the user > community, you yourself said this would never be imported into FreeBSD > base, so I see no reason that it should be called "FreeBSD package Base", > as it is not, that is a different project. Taking the last comment on this thread to ask a question and maybe refocus a little. The discussion about granularity begs the question, why pkgbase in the first place? My impression was that it allowed people to select which components they wanted to either create a lean installation or mix and match base packages and ports (possibly with flavours to install in /usr rather than $LOCALBASE) such that maybe person A wanted a stock install while person B wanted to replace, picking a random example, BSD tar with GNU tar. Isn't that the real advantage of pkgbase? If OTOH it's binary updates V 2.0, what's the point? I'm a little rhetorical here but you get my point. If I want ipfw instead pf or ipfilter instead of the others I should have the freedom. Similarly if I want vim instead of vi I should have the choice to install vim as /usr/bin/vi. Otherwise all the effort to replace binary updates makes no sense. -- Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 19:56:31 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4F32159B9D3 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 19:56:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Received: from eg.sd.rdtc.ru (eg.sd.rdtc.ru [IPv6:2a03:3100:c:13::5]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "eg.sd.rdtc.ru", Issuer "eg.sd.rdtc.ru" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B0DF26FEF8 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 19:56:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) X-Envelope-From: eugen@grosbein.net X-Envelope-To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Received: from [10.58.0.4] ([10.58.0.4]) by eg.sd.rdtc.ru (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x3TJuPTR097409 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Tue, 30 Apr 2019 02:56:25 +0700 (+07) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Subject: Re: very low performance tcp/rsh To: Wojciech Puchar References: Cc: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org From: Eugene Grosbein Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 02:56:20 +0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: B0DF26FEF8 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=permerror (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of eugen@grosbein.net uses mechanism not recognized by this client) smtp.mailfrom=eugen@grosbein.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-0.45 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.86)[-0.859,0]; MX_INVALID(0.50)[cached]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.61)[0.609,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.60)[-0.602,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[grosbein.net]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_PERMFAIL(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[country: RU(0.00)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:29072, ipnet:2a03:3100::/32, country:RU]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 19:56:31 -0000 30.04.2019 2:22, Wojciech Puchar wrote: > create 32GB hole-file > > dd if=/dev/zero of=test bs=32k seek=1m count=0 > > fetch -o /dev/null over ftp (proftpd) gives 1.4GB/s > > proftpd consumed 100% of single core. much better. > > tested with FreeBSD ftpd - 1.7GB/s > > seems like freebsd can saturate 10Gb/s ethernet with single core (Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2620 v4 @ 2.10GHz) > > > Still where is the most overhead? one memcopy to packet buffers+creating packet headers (send). > > reception is on separate process taking another core. > > > still - quite good. But compared to filesystem overhead - large. Do not use file with holes (holes require special processing taking lots of CPU cycles). Create ordinary file within RAM disk and use sock ftp daemon for sake of sendfile(). From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 20:08:44 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D571C159C0A2 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 20:08:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from asomers@gmail.com) Received: from mail-lj1-f171.google.com (mail-lj1-f171.google.com [209.85.208.171]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4319870A9E for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 20:08:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from asomers@gmail.com) Received: by mail-lj1-f171.google.com with SMTP id t10so9546796ljg.7 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:08:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=MBLubrtKQ6UNYqJWo1iMmeW2gT6QQSV7n+RvxLwqolk=; b=tt9+Z2z7ZCX3fCOvdx+M2dMhY3faGMU6yDgwb3vg/VOtidBfB9felPJpTKPsJoTN9c jJVPJVSvL7EtF+CBJo3Hqpo56xH7+JmswtkZekqt9f1A9GWdfnhT4e93e8lGgRfV275y UpWLip4kq2zi4C7N1BPbu+lc0VyD5Cx6lvMlZYJJnRswOratjIowsj0+Jw6yX6ZZp8V/ 2YQPhBSQoBMv1JRp8cJUDZOaJHvMqAS5k7/U7jBlAenhtI+SDQzN8Tc5UJzCks8Hr6Rn rJ6WbRBW5o/x5UqDv5t0nyohgC5yK0K/78bNt8ik6IeH3TBftcm7Dq/f+SYuq9JKJjgk KUNw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWEMq13bATZfjvFGsi2a8J9v5RJ8Arx3ZUHA97K4rD/gJRHmZH7 qJY7y/6x1q/3eubNTMS7xoVgDXZgB3oqwO9I/0c= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxmEJjYeA43zDCTFv48c+WGBLzrEV2ZW7a5GVkQsKpv28VRpZfQ6LGLEtmbrDfglMxM6RKej+qHKG6MCFcbTH0= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:5b5b:: with SMTP id p88mr5048359ljb.53.1556568517015; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:08:37 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Alan Somers Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 14:08:25 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: very low performance tcp/rsh To: Eugene Grosbein Cc: Wojciech Puchar , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4319870A9E X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of asomers@gmail.com designates 209.85.208.171 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=asomers@gmail.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.93 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:209.85.128.0/17]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[freebsd.org]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: alt3.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.58)[-0.580,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[171.208.85.209.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[asomers@freebsd.org,asomers@gmail.com]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[gmail.com]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:209.85.128.0/17, country:US]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[asomers@freebsd.org,asomers@gmail.com]; IP_SCORE(-1.34)[ip: (-0.53), ipnet: 209.85.128.0/17(-3.86), asn: 15169(-2.24), country: US(-0.06)]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 20:08:44 -0000 On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 1:57 PM Eugene Grosbein wrote: > > 30.04.2019 2:22, Wojciech Puchar wrote: > > > create 32GB hole-file > > > > dd if=/dev/zero of=test bs=32k seek=1m count=0 > > > > fetch -o /dev/null over ftp (proftpd) gives 1.4GB/s > > > > proftpd consumed 100% of single core. much better. > > > > tested with FreeBSD ftpd - 1.7GB/s > > > > seems like freebsd can saturate 10Gb/s ethernet with single core (Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2620 v4 @ 2.10GHz) > > > > > > Still where is the most overhead? one memcopy to packet buffers+creating packet headers (send). > > > > reception is on separate process taking another core. > > > > > > still - quite good. But compared to filesystem overhead - large. > > Do not use file with holes (holes require special processing taking lots of CPU cycles). > Create ordinary file within RAM disk and use sock ftp daemon for sake of sendfile(). Better yet, if the goal is simply to measure TCP performance, use benchmarks/netperf. Don't try to do anything involving files. -Alan From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Mon Apr 29 20:12:48 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6B2B159C4C9 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 20:12:48 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jmaloney@ixsystems.com) Received: from mail-yw1-xc42.google.com (mail-yw1-xc42.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::c42]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3364971343 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 20:12:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jmaloney@ixsystems.com) Received: by mail-yw1-xc42.google.com with SMTP id a62so4245601ywa.4 for ; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:12:47 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=6MjsstOZD7psHVBmtlDM1lEe80ANjy/dSzbHny/7BdI=; b=k9foXJI/JSbZgDBP4fCHwVrMBUYq2kvPzTJYVw3Nrjse5oywo8ebK8buMKJIkz5OBm Xs9LGrM+EbX3Sy7b2OJbDT+H+2M4iR1OYRp3j5OZvhAcq6f9WuxrqqPPAY2gKHwsmhGR vsq7NB+JUsqDBH/cH+XPUg45yNdtyRUyNugAn2eDQP2BswakIiaZQiXRZjieIQP418hq +grTgUQzoFUm1hgN9wOhBtw7djqss1NloSPbjYsed7TnFFkWzCwphcMzL9ei2xzZa/Y+ GZoac09S/itq8iVI1JXBqrwfvf9Fp0jd3Bhj1GGl041sLcBaCka4c894oN/cu7TysJuC 5+1w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=6MjsstOZD7psHVBmtlDM1lEe80ANjy/dSzbHny/7BdI=; b=b3O2D9mzHhkCtTqYkXEGDy1p3Nqe/XIEgxguyPwO17gqi7fwlgXpTs6mpAMmq5nbqz IO9LkVh05S5Z9kxRBDlGZwBJWYksc3eNUqNXihwe4/nUlsNC5mFD9rnFMrbKYYbzQjri 4WEVpujFOmwBm2xnnfip+lZ+to1kFthLM9w9f6dxRO5lgSLcgw48uhKvlOzFQdX4PDed +RdvrGOGPMVM1likD5DpXfKTm2k8WnEhzNcaeTet3j7N9kkOhTIPdq3lYRtHCxfSU92A pxG7BHSLSCIBatwUaD5FPhsPE7qeF5UGeJfFUz/gvT2AwR8/dWTyINo3ysNDO57xAc2P wjug== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWWpPT+P1XUlGOVq8fcvIMjrOcQzzhbR5yuU0ajGwAcInkRZCYV BGQ3NncmAnEyCdPw6wBQZW1wag== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxXTtel0TlWm5Rw3TF3NV29b2J9wd5tI5zBCRkqB2n1zoArV3CzMNIGd6dXvgKhLNXQhc7qWQ== X-Received: by 2002:a81:6608:: with SMTP id a8mr22566339ywc.229.1556568766490; Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:12:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.238.1.100] ([12.189.233.131]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id j83sm10920165ywj.93.2019.04.29.13.12.44 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 29 Apr 2019 13:12:45 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.8\)) Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base From: Joe Maloney In-Reply-To: <201904291931.x3TJV73d079802@slippy.cwsent.com> Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 16:12:43 -0400 Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Kris Moore , FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, =?utf-8?Q?Goran_Meki=C4=87?= , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, Emmanuel Vadot Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <6EB65F49-47CD-48B2-8C58-BF387D8C7A58@ixsystems.com> References: <201904291931.x3TJV73d079802@slippy.cwsent.com> To: Cy Schubert X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.8) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 3364971343 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=k9foXJI/; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=ixsystems.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jmaloney@ixsystems.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::c42 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jmaloney@ixsystems.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.71 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ALT3.ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.com]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[11]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.92)[-0.920,0]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[ixsystems.com,none]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.78)[ip: (1.55), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.16), asn: 15169(-2.24), country: US(-0.06)]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[ixsystems-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[2.4.c.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 20:39:31 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2019 20:12:48 -0000 With CFT version you chose to build, and package individual components = such as sendmail with a port option. That does entirely solve the = problem of being able to reinstall sendmail after the fact without a = rebuild of the userland (base) port but perhaps base flavors could solve = that problem assuming flavors could extend beyond python. Joe Maloney Quality Engineering Manager / iXsystems Enterprise Storage & Servers Driven By Open Source > On Apr 29, 2019, at 3:31 PM, Cy Schubert = wrote: >=20 > In message <201904291441.x3TEfMid072751@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net>, "Rodney W.=20= > Grimes" > writes: >>> On Mon, Apr 29, 2019 at 10:09 AM Rodney W. Grimes < >>> freebsd-rwg@gndrsh.dnsmgr.net> wrote: >>>=20 >>>>>=20 >>>>> Correct, this is ZFS only. And it's something we're using specific = to >>>> FreeNAS / TrueOS, which is why I didn't originally mention it as = apart of >>>> our CFT. >>>>=20 >>>> Then please it is "CFT: FreeNAS/TrueOS pkg base, ZFS only", >>>> calling this FreeBSD pkg base when it is not was wrong, >>>> and miss leading. >>>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Sorry, I disagree. >> Which is fine. >>=20 >>> This pkg base is independent of the ZFS tool we're using >>> to wrangle boot-environments. Hence why it wasn't mentioned in the = CFT. >>> These base packages work the same as existing in-tree pkg base on = UFS, no >>> difference. If anything are probably safer due to being able to = update all >>> of userland in single extract operation, so you don't have out of = order >>> extraction of libc or some such. >>=20 >> You missed the major string change and focused on the edge, >> No comment on calling iXsystems :stuff: FreeBSD instead of = FreeNAS/TrueOS? >>=20 >> That was the major point of my statement, your miss leading the user >> community, you yourself said this would never be imported into = FreeBSD >> base, so I see no reason that it should be called "FreeBSD package = Base", >> as it is not, that is a different project. >=20 > Taking the last comment on this thread to ask a question and maybe=20 > refocus a little. >=20 > The discussion about granularity begs the question, why pkgbase in the=20= > first place? My impression was that it allowed people to select which=20= > components they wanted to either create a lean installation or mix and=20= > match base packages and ports (possibly with flavours to install in=20 > /usr rather than $LOCALBASE) such that maybe person A wanted a stock=20= > install while person B wanted to replace, picking a random example, = BSD=20 > tar with GNU tar. Isn't that the real advantage of pkgbase? >=20 > If OTOH it's binary updates V 2.0, what's the point? I'm a little=20 > rhetorical here but you get my point. If I want ipfw instead pf or=20 > ipfilter instead of the others I should have the freedom. Similarly if=20= > I want vim instead of vi I should have the choice to install vim as=20 > /usr/bin/vi. Otherwise all the effort to replace binary updates makes=20= > no sense. >=20 >=20 > --=20 > Cheers, > Cy Schubert > FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org >=20 > The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few. >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Tue Apr 30 01:29:19 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77B6A15A3AB4 for ; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 01:29:19 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from unidef_rogue@live.com) Received: from NAM01-BY2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-oln040092001025.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.92.1.25]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mail.protection.outlook.com", Issuer "GlobalSign Organization Validation CA - SHA256 - G3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C5C6F86663; 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MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[live.com]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[live.com.dwl.dnswl.org : 127.0.3.0] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 01:29:19 -0000 SGkgRW5qaSwNCg0KSeKAmWQganVzdCBsaWtlIHRvIHN0YXJ0IG9mZiBieSBzYXlpbmcgSeKAmW0g YSB2ZXJ5IG5ldyBrZXJuZWwgZGV2ZWxvcGVyIGFuZCBJIGFwcHJlY2lhdGUgZXZlcnlvbmXigJlz IHJlc3BvbnNlcw0KDQpCdXQgd2hhdCB3b3VsZCBhIEZyZWVCU0QgYnVpbGQgYmUgbGlrZSB3aXRo IHNxbCBsaXRlPyBXb3VsZG7igJl0IGl0IGtpbmQgb2YgYmUgbGlrZSBjKys/IE1pbnVzIGEgbGV2 ZWwgb2YgYWJzdHJhY3Rpb24sIGJ1dCB0aGVyZSB3b3VsZCBCRSBhIGxldmVsIG9mIGFic3RyYWN0 aW9uLiANCg0KVGhlcmUgY291bGQgYmUgYSBkcml2ZXIgdGhhdCBpbnRlcmZhY2VzIHdpdGggb3Ro ZXIgc3FsIGRhdGFiYXNlcywgYW5kIG1heWJlIG1vdmVzIGRhdGEgdG8gdGhlIGNsb3VkLiANCg0K QnV0IGp1c3QgYSBjaGFyICpkZXZfaWRfZGVzY3JpcHRpb247IHRvIHNvbWUgc3RydWN0dXJlcyBj b3VsZCBoZWxwIHRoZSBrZXJuZWwgYmUgbW9yZSBkaWFsZWN0aWNhbCANCg0KSSBsb29rZWQgdXAg bGlibnYsIEkgdGhpbmsgSSBjYW4gdHJ5IHRvIGhhY2sgaXQgdG8gdXNlIG11bHRpcGxlIGRpbWVu c2lvbnMsIGl0IGNhbiBiZSBlYXNpbHkgcmVpbXBsZW1lbnRlZCBpbiB0aGUga2VybmVsISBUaGFu a3MgZW5qaSENCg0KVGhhbmtzIGV2ZXJ5b25lIQ0KDQoNClNlbnQgZnJvbSBteSBpUGhvbmUNCg0K PiBPbiBBcHIgMjksIDIwMTksIGF0IDU6MTEgQU0sIEVuamkgQ29vcGVyIDx5YW5ldXJhYmV5YUBn bWFpbC5jb20+IHdyb3RlOg0KPiANCj4gDQo+PiBPbiBBcHIgMjgsIDIwMTksIGF0IDk6MjAgUE0s IGFiaGphIGthYW5sYW5pIDx1bmlkZWZfcm9ndWVAbGl2ZS5jb20+IHdyb3RlOg0KPj4gDQo+PiBJ dCBjYW4gYmUgdXNlZCBmb3IgbWVzc2FnaW5nLiBMZXTigJlzIHNheSwgZm9yIGFueSByZWFzb24s IGEgdXNlcmxhbmQgY29tbWFuZCBuZWVkcyB0byBhY2Nlc3MgdGhlIHNvdW5kIGhhcmR3YXJlLCB0 aGVyZSBjYW4gYmUgYSBzdHJpbmcgc3FsIHZhbHVlIChvciBqdXN0IGEgc3RyaW5nLCBraW5kIG9m IGxpa2Ugc3lzY3RsKSBhdHRhY2hlZCB0byBhIGRyaXZlciwgYW5kIGl0IGNhbiBjb250YWluIG1l dGFkYXRhIGZvciBhdXRvbWF0aW9uIG9yIHBhcnNpbmcsIG1heWJlIGV2ZW4gYSBjYWxsYmFjayBz eXN0ZW0NCj4+IA0KPj4gYW5kIHNhZGx5IEkgZG9u4oCZdCBrbm93IG11Y2ggb2Ygc3FsLiBJIGhh dmUgYSBuZXVyYWwgZGF0YWJhc2UgaW4gdGhlIHdvcmtzIGJ1dCB0aGF04oCZcyBtb3ZpbmcgdG8g YysrLCBidXQgYSBzaW1wbGUgYmluYXJ5IHRyZWUgd2l0aCBhIGNvdXBsZSBvZiBjaGFyYWN0ZXIg YXJyYXlzIGFuZCBhbiBpZCBhbG9uZyB3aXRoIHNlYXJjaCBmdW5jdGlvbnMgKExpYmMgY2FuIGhh bmRsZSB0aGlzIGZpbmUpIGNhbiBzaW11bGF0ZSBhIHNtYWxsIGRhdGFiYXNlIHdpdGhvdXQgY29u c3VtaW5nIHRvbyBtdWNoIG1lbW9yeSBvbmNlIHdyaXR0ZW4gdG8gZGlzaw0KPj4gDQo+PiBJdCBj b3VsZCBiZSB1c2VkIGZvciB1cCwgYnV0IHRoZXJl4oCZcyB3YXkgdG9vIG11Y2ggb3ZlcmhlYWQg SSB0aGluaywgb25jZSBJIHNpdCBkb3duIHdpdGggbXkgY2lnYXJldHRlcyBhbmQgcmVhZCB0aGUg ZW50aXJlIGtlcm5lbCBvbiBteSBkZXNrdG9wIEnigJlsbCBzZWUgaWYgSSBjYW4gYWRkIGEgZGF0 YWJhc2UgbGlrZSB0aGlzIHRvIHNvbWUgZHJpdmVycyBvciBmaWxlIHN5c3RlbSBjb2RlDQo+PiAN Cj4+IA0KPj4gDQo+PiBzdHJ1Y3QgaWRiX25vZGUwIHsgDQo+PiBpbnQgKmlkOw0KPj4gY2hhciAq aWRiX25vZGVfZGVzY3JpcHRpb247DQo+PiBzdHJ1Y3QgaWRiX25vZGUwICppZF9ub2RlMF9kaXJl Y3Rpb25bTUFDUk9fQU5EX0VOVU1fR09FU19IRVJFXSAgLy8gYWRkaXRpb25hbCBkaW1lbnNpb25z IGlmIHJhbSBjYWxjdWxhdGlvbiBhbGxvd3MsIEnigJlkIHN1Z2dlc3Qgc29tZSBraW5kIG9mIG1h dHJpY2UNCj4+IH07DQo+PiANCj4+IHN0cnVjdCBpZGJfYmluYXJ5X3RyZWUgeyANCj4+IGludCBp ZDsNCj4+IGNoYXIgKmlkYl9iaW5hcnlfdHJlZV9kZXNjcmlwdGlvbjsNCj4+IHN0cnVjdCBub2Rl MCAqaWRiX2JpbmFyeV90cmVlX2RpcmVjdGlvbltNQUNST19FTlVNXTsNCj4+IH0NCj4+IA0KPj4g RXRjIHNvcnJ5IEkgZGlkbuKAmXQgaGF2ZSB0aW1lIHRvIHdyaXRlIHRoZSBtYWNyb3MgYW5kIGVu dW1lcmF0aW9ucw0KPj4gDQo+PiBNYWNyb3MgYW5kIGVudW1lcmF0aW9ucyBhcmUgdXNlZCB0byBr ZWVwIGhvdyBtYW55IGl0ZW1zIGluIGFuIGFycmF5LCB3aGF0IGRpbWVuc2lvbiBzaG91bGQgdGhl IGFycmF5IGhhdmUgaWYgcmFtIHBlcm1pc3NpYmxlLCBhbmQga2VlcCB0cmFjayBvZiBub2RlcyBh bmQgaW5kaWNlcw0KPj4gDQo+PiANCj4+IFdoYXQgSeKAmW0gZ2V0dGluZyBhdCBpcyBhIGhhcmRj b2RlZCBkYXRhYmFzZSBoYXMgaXRzIGJlbmVmaXRzIQ0KPiANCj4gSGkgQWJoamEsDQo+IA0KPiBT UUxpdGUgaW4gdGhlIGtlcm5lbCBzZWVtcyBhIHdyb25nIG9wdGlvbiBmb3IgZGVhbGluZyB3aXRo IGtleS12YWx1ZSBzdG9yZXMuDQo+IA0KPiBBcmUgeW91IGF3YXJlIG9mIGxpYm52IGluIEZyZWVC U0QgKGFuZCBpdHMga2VybmVsIGFuYWxvZyk/IEl04oCZcyBhIGtleS12YWx1ZSBzdG9yZSBsaWJy YXJ5L2luZnJhc3RydWN0dXJlLCBhdmFpbGFibGUgZm9yIGtlcm5lbCB1c2UuDQo+IA0KPiBGcmVl QlNEIGFsc28gaGFzIGFjY2VzcyB0byByYWRpeCB0cmllcyB0b28sIGlmIHRoZSBzdHJ1Y3R1cmUg bWF0dGVycy4NCj4gDQo+IEhvcGUgdGhpcyBoZWxwcywNCj4gLUVuamkNCg== From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Tue Apr 30 04:21:13 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0410915828F4 for ; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 04:21:13 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Received: from eg.sd.rdtc.ru (eg.sd.rdtc.ru [IPv6:2a03:3100:c:13::5]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "eg.sd.rdtc.ru", Issuer "eg.sd.rdtc.ru" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F0C5D8B462; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 04:21:01 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) X-Envelope-From: eugen@grosbein.net X-Envelope-To: asomers@freebsd.org Received: from [10.58.0.4] ([10.58.0.4]) by eg.sd.rdtc.ru (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x3U4KlrH001300 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Tue, 30 Apr 2019 11:20:47 +0700 (+07) (envelope-from eugen@grosbein.net) Subject: Re: very low performance tcp/rsh To: Alan Somers References: Cc: Wojciech Puchar , "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" From: Eugene Grosbein Message-ID: <2da04de7-2e41-2521-8570-18bf3d5ee2c5@grosbein.net> Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 11:20:42 +0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: F0C5D8B462 X-Spamd-Bar: / Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=permerror (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of eugen@grosbein.net uses mechanism not recognized by this client) smtp.mailfrom=eugen@grosbein.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [0.07 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_INVALID(0.50)[greylisted]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.24)[-0.240,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[grosbein.net]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.86)[-0.855,0]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.76)[0.760,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_PERMFAIL(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[country: RU(0.00)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:29072, ipnet:2a03:3100::/32, country:RU]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 04:21:13 -0000 30.04.2019 3:08, Alan Somers wrote: > Better yet, if the goal is simply to measure TCP performance, use > benchmarks/netperf. Don't try to do anything involving files. I have not tried netperf. Is it better than iperf abusing kernel with tons of gettimeofday() system calls (linux-style)? For slow speeds it does not matter but this is very bad for high speed benchmarking. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Tue Apr 30 08:23:12 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8927158867E; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 08:23:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from theraven@FreeBSD.org) Received: from theravensnest.org (theravensnest.org [46.226.110.62]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "theravensnest.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 22C2A931AD; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 08:23:11 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from theraven@FreeBSD.org) Received: from [10.164.186.150] ([167.220.197.150]) (authenticated bits=0) by theravensnest.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id x3U8MAWr015104 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO); Tue, 30 Apr 2019 08:22:10 GMT (envelope-from theraven@FreeBSD.org) X-Authentication-Warning: mail: Host [167.220.197.150] claimed to be [10.164.186.150] Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: Joe Maloney , Cy Schubert Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Kris Moore , FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, =?UTF-8?Q?Goran_Meki=c4=87?= , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, Emmanuel Vadot References: <201904291931.x3TJV73d079802@slippy.cwsent.com> <6EB65F49-47CD-48B2-8C58-BF387D8C7A58@ixsystems.com> From: David Chisnall Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 09:22:56 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.6.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <6EB65F49-47CD-48B2-8C58-BF387D8C7A58@ixsystems.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-GB Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 22C2A931AD X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.97 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[FreeBSD.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.98)[-0.976,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:29169, ipnet:46.226.108.0/22, country:FR] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 10:18:46 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 08:23:13 -0000 On 29/04/2019 21:12, Joe Maloney wrote: > With CFT version you chose to build, and package individual components such as sendmail with a port option. That does entirely solve the problem of being able to reinstall sendmail after the fact without a rebuild of the userland (base) port but perhaps base flavors could solve that problem assuming flavors could extend beyond python. This sounds very much like local optimisation. It's now easy to create a custom base image. Great. But how do I express dependencies in ports on a specific base configuration? This is easy if I depend on a specific base package, but how does this work in your model? For example, if I have a package that depends on a library that is an optional part of the base system, how do I express that pkg needs to either refuse to install it, or install a userland pkg that includes that library in place of my existing version as part of the install process? More importantly for the container use case, if I want to take a completely empty jail and do pkg ins nginx (for example), what does the maintainer of the nginx port need to do to express the minimum set of the base system that needs to be installed to allow nginx to work? One of the goals for the pkg base concept was to allow this kind of use case, easily creating a minimal environment required to run a single service. With a monolithic base package set, you're going to need some mechanism other than packages to express the specific base subset package that you need and I think that you need to justify why this mechanism is better than using small individual packages. David From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Tue Apr 30 22:13:31 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA7A8159FF9D; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 22:13:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=7/jM=TA=quip.cz=000.fbsd@elsa.codelab.cz) Received: from elsa.codelab.cz (elsa.codelab.cz [94.124.105.4]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 11DA96A723; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 22:13:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=7/jM=TA=quip.cz=000.fbsd@elsa.codelab.cz) Received: from elsa.codelab.cz (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by elsa.codelab.cz (Postfix) with ESMTP id B397E28417; Wed, 1 May 2019 00:03:44 +0200 (CEST) Received: from illbsd.quip.test (ip-62-24-92-232.net.upcbroadband.cz [62.24.92.232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by elsa.codelab.cz (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 51D3828411; Wed, 1 May 2019 00:03:43 +0200 (CEST) Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: David Chisnall Cc: Kris Moore , FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, =?UTF-8?Q?Goran_Meki=c4=87?= , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org References: <201904291931.x3TJV73d079802@slippy.cwsent.com> <6EB65F49-47CD-48B2-8C58-BF387D8C7A58@ixsystems.com> From: Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz> Message-ID: <292eadc6-3662-ec43-1175-53fc252487bd@quip.cz> Date: Wed, 1 May 2019 00:03:44 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/52.0 SeaMonkey/2.49.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 11DA96A723 X-Spamd-Bar: ++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [6.46 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.88)[0.883,0]; IP_SCORE(0.94)[ip: (0.49), ipnet: 94.124.104.0/21(0.25), asn: 42000(3.88), country: CZ(0.08)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[quip.cz]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.95)[0.952,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: elsa.codelab.cz]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[1.000,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[9]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[4.105.124.94.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[000.fbsd@quip.cz,SRS0=7/jM=TA=quip.cz=000.fbsd@elsa.codelab.cz]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:42000, ipnet:94.124.104.0/21, country:CZ]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[000.fbsd@quip.cz,SRS0=7/jM=TA=quip.cz=000.fbsd@elsa.codelab.cz]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 22:13:31 -0000 David Chisnall wrote on 2019/04/30 10:22: > On 29/04/2019 21:12, Joe Maloney wrote: >> With CFT version you chose to build, and package individual components >> such as sendmail with a port option.  That does entirely solve the >> problem of being able to reinstall sendmail after the fact without a >> rebuild of the userland (base) port but perhaps base flavors could >> solve that problem assuming flavors could extend beyond python. > > This sounds very much like local optimisation. It's now easy to create a > custom base image.  Great.  But how do I express dependencies in ports > on a specific base configuration? This is easy if I depend on a specific > base package, but how does this work in your model?  For example, if I > have a package that depends on a library that is an optional part of the > base system, how do I express that pkg needs to either refuse to install > it, or install a userland pkg that includes that library in place of my > existing version as part of the install process? > > More importantly for the container use case, if I want to take a > completely empty jail and do pkg ins nginx (for example), what does the > maintainer of the nginx port need to do to express the minimum set of > the base system that needs to be installed to allow nginx to work? > > One of the goals for the pkg base concept was to allow this kind of use > case, easily creating a minimal environment required to run a single > service. With a monolithic base package set, you're going to need some > mechanism other than packages to express the specific base subset > package that you need and I think that you need to justify why this > mechanism is better than using small individual packages. Will it not be maintainer's nightmare to take care of all the dependencies on the base packages for each port we have in the ports tree? Miroslav Lachman From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed May 1 03:56:46 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04312158331C; Wed, 1 May 2019 03:56:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from smtp-out-no.shaw.ca (smtp-out-no.shaw.ca [64.59.134.12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "Client", Issuer "CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E73A974C1C; Wed, 1 May 2019 03:56:43 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from cy.schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from spqr.komquats.com ([70.67.125.17]) by shaw.ca with ESMTPA id LgMEhBJ2TldkPLgMFhnFVa; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 21:56:36 -0600 X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=Ko4zJleN c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:117 a=VFtTW3WuZNDh6VkGe7fA3g==:17 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=oexKYjalfGEA:10 a=YxBL1-UpAAAA:8 a=6I5d2MoRAAAA:8 a=q2XNxBO46EK3obBdrt4A:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=Ia-lj3WSrqcvXOmTRaiG:22 a=IjZwj45LgO3ly-622nXo:22 Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (slippy [10.1.1.91]) by spqr.komquats.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8BF6514E; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 20:56:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from slippy.cwsent.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id x413uX67074032; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 20:56:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from slippy (cy@localhost) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id x413uUnV068470; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 20:56:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Message-Id: <201905010356.x413uUnV068470@slippy.cwsent.com> X-Authentication-Warning: slippy.cwsent.com: cy owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.8.0 04/21/2012 with nmh-1.7.1 Reply-to: Cy Schubert From: Cy Schubert X-os: FreeBSD X-Sender: cy@cwsent.com X-URL: http://www.cschubert.com/ To: Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz> cc: David Chisnall , FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, =?UTF-8?Q?Goran_Meki=c4=87?= , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base In-Reply-To: Message from Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz> of "Wed, 01 May 2019 00:03:44 +0200." <292eadc6-3662-ec43-1175-53fc252487bd@quip.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 20:56:30 -0700 X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfN/xmWRaWQf4f3J4LUJQu3pZlq2R+heRrUgbSIStI3jW7zX/5fMm4b0wrONS30PxYTM3L4AEceAbaUlH0j4Ssk2hgu0ilk7uSIb2ZQm3B34wLKJrGhxU HwWqFVGWz0FbohtGB8vZe+ZhlwMlOl+nV4bTEhDv1vj7LNpbO3NZmQOnMb1uHsrEYnimp8U3o5Ldv1Btob7Oz5spUCDh01syPNS8efzuut3lZbEWglh78Iul sPyzs8ESB8rbpCG1Etz3uwemvekBrPSWvbdp4F0pPhs+i985u/KunSKaEPyPP+EnNKeIq6a2IowFuvaH5ee+dvx8eKz/lEv74EXMf7LyIodLisYvO6SVjh3b 05bnRfDMx0Uroy8xz142FesMv0fY2sueoDnS5Afs/XbfU78s8tk0bOhtge4PbZSjTvqk5TyKv8onRizm9SpnzbpATzmeHLo6AdBYkyy7AWk5lCjRClOg0mbc 1/pTZMJvQHzSrCWq X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: E73A974C1C X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.63 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; HAS_REPLYTO(0.00)[Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: spqr.komquats.com]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.94)[-0.937,0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[9]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[17.125.67.70.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.11]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:6327, ipnet:64.59.128.0/20, country:CA]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW(-0.10)[12.134.59.64.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.1]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCVD_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; IP_SCORE(-2.49)[ip: (-6.68), ipnet: 64.59.128.0/20(-3.21), asn: 6327(-2.46), country: CA(-0.09)]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 01 May 2019 03:56:46 -0000 In message <292eadc6-3662-ec43-1175-53fc252487bd@quip.cz>, Miroslav Lachman wri tes: > David Chisnall wrote on 2019/04/30 10:22: > > On 29/04/2019 21:12, Joe Maloney wrote: > >> With CFT version you chose to build, and package individual components > >> such as sendmail with a port option.  That does entirely solve the > >> problem of being able to reinstall sendmail after the fact without a > >> rebuild of the userland (base) port but perhaps base flavors could > >> solve that problem assuming flavors could extend beyond python. > > > > This sounds very much like local optimisation. It's now easy to create a > > custom base image.  Great.  But how do I express dependencies in ports > > on a specific base configuration? This is easy if I depend on a specific > > base package, but how does this work in your model?  For example, if I > > have a package that depends on a library that is an optional part of the > > base system, how do I express that pkg needs to either refuse to install > > it, or install a userland pkg that includes that library in place of my > > existing version as part of the install process? > > > > More importantly for the container use case, if I want to take a > > completely empty jail and do pkg ins nginx (for example), what does the > > maintainer of the nginx port need to do to express the minimum set of > > the base system that needs to be installed to allow nginx to work? > > > > One of the goals for the pkg base concept was to allow this kind of use > > case, easily creating a minimal environment required to run a single > > service. With a monolithic base package set, you're going to need some > > mechanism other than packages to express the specific base subset > > package that you need and I think that you need to justify why this > > mechanism is better than using small individual packages. > > Will it not be maintainer's nightmare to take care of all the > dependencies on the base packages for each port we have in the ports tree? No more than it is today. Remember, people have been doing this sort of thing for decades. If the folks at Red Hat, Oracle (formerly Sun), and IBM can do it, I'm sure we can too. The dependency lists will be longer. We may require dependency lists that allow the choice of one of many prereqs or coreqs. -- Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed May 1 08:31:47 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62FE4159C6F5; Wed, 1 May 2019 08:31:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=6TW8=TB=quip.cz=000.fbsd@elsa.codelab.cz) Received: from elsa.codelab.cz (elsa.codelab.cz [94.124.105.4]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1B5F76B63C; Wed, 1 May 2019 08:31:45 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=6TW8=TB=quip.cz=000.fbsd@elsa.codelab.cz) Received: from elsa.codelab.cz (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by elsa.codelab.cz (Postfix) with ESMTP id 655DD28423; Wed, 1 May 2019 10:31:43 +0200 (CEST) Received: from illbsd.quip.test (ip-62-24-92-232.net.upcbroadband.cz [62.24.92.232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by elsa.codelab.cz (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5C08428422; Wed, 1 May 2019 10:31:40 +0200 (CEST) Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: Cy Schubert Cc: FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, =?UTF-8?Q?Goran_Meki=c4=87?= , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, David Chisnall , FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org References: <201905010356.x413uUnV068470@slippy.cwsent.com> From: Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz> Message-ID: <56b15cc3-4605-f693-4ad6-188ea865820d@quip.cz> Date: Wed, 1 May 2019 10:31:41 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/52.0 SeaMonkey/2.49.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <201905010356.x413uUnV068470@slippy.cwsent.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 1B5F76B63C X-Spamd-Bar: ++++++ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [6.61 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.98)[0.983,0]; IP_SCORE(0.94)[ip: (0.49), ipnet: 94.124.104.0/21(0.24), asn: 42000(3.88), country: CZ(0.08)]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[quip.cz]; AUTH_NA(1.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(1.00)[0.996,0]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[3]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: elsa.codelab.cz]; NEURAL_SPAM_LONG(1.00)[1.000,0]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[4.105.124.94.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.10.0]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[9]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER(0.30)[000.fbsd@quip.cz,SRS0=6TW8=TB=quip.cz=000.fbsd@elsa.codelab.cz]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:42000, ipnet:94.124.104.0/21, country:CZ]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[000.fbsd@quip.cz,SRS0=6TW8=TB=quip.cz=000.fbsd@elsa.codelab.cz]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 01 May 2019 08:31:47 -0000 Cy Schubert wrote on 2019/05/01 05:56: > In message <292eadc6-3662-ec43-1175-53fc252487bd@quip.cz>, Miroslav > Lachman wri > tes: >> David Chisnall wrote on 2019/04/30 10:22: >>> On 29/04/2019 21:12, Joe Maloney wrote: >>>> With CFT version you chose to build, and package individual components >>>> such as sendmail with a port option.  That does entirely solve the >>>> problem of being able to reinstall sendmail after the fact without a >>>> rebuild of the userland (base) port but perhaps base flavors could >>>> solve that problem assuming flavors could extend beyond python. >>> >>> This sounds very much like local optimisation. It's now easy to create a >>> custom base image.  Great.  But how do I express dependencies in ports >>> on a specific base configuration? This is easy if I depend on a specific >>> base package, but how does this work in your model?  For example, if I >>> have a package that depends on a library that is an optional part of the >>> base system, how do I express that pkg needs to either refuse to install >>> it, or install a userland pkg that includes that library in place of my >>> existing version as part of the install process? >>> >>> More importantly for the container use case, if I want to take a >>> completely empty jail and do pkg ins nginx (for example), what does the >>> maintainer of the nginx port need to do to express the minimum set of >>> the base system that needs to be installed to allow nginx to work? >>> >>> One of the goals for the pkg base concept was to allow this kind of use >>> case, easily creating a minimal environment required to run a single >>> service. With a monolithic base package set, you're going to need some >>> mechanism other than packages to express the specific base subset >>> package that you need and I think that you need to justify why this >>> mechanism is better than using small individual packages. >> >> Will it not be maintainer's nightmare to take care of all the >> dependencies on the base packages for each port we have in the ports tree? > > No more than it is today. Remember, people have been doing this sort of > thing for decades. If the folks at Red Hat, Oracle (formerly Sun), and > IBM can do it, I'm sure we can too. The dependency lists will be > longer. We may require dependency lists that allow the choice of one of > many prereqs or coreqs. They are experts and they are paid for their work. I am not. I am maintaining a few packages and the reality is I don't know what they need in base. Till these days I don't care about this kind of dependency. I am not system developer or programmer and I think there are more than just me who see this as a kind of problem. So in this case, pkg base gives me nothing but more work on those packages. Miroslav Lachman From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed May 1 22:05:29 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FF2415A2115 for ; Wed, 1 May 2019 22:05:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from amesbury@oitsec.umn.edu) Received: from mail.oitsec.umn.edu (mail.oitsec.umn.edu [128.101.238.120]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mail.oitsec.umn.edu", Issuer "InCommon RSA Server CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3C3AC8F82A for ; Wed, 1 May 2019 22:05:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from amesbury@oitsec.umn.edu) Received: from mail.oitsec.umn.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.oitsec.umn.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEE3CB05C6 for ; Wed, 1 May 2019 17:05:20 -0500 (CDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at oitsec.umn.edu Received: from mail.oitsec.umn.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by mail.oitsec.umn.edu (mail.oitsec.umn.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0seZ3qasoGE2 for ; Wed, 1 May 2019 17:05:20 -0500 (CDT) Received: from optimator.uis.umn.edu (optimator.uis.umn.edu [134.84.23.1]) (Authenticated sender: amesbury) by mail.oitsec.umn.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7A73FB05ED for ; Wed, 1 May 2019 17:05:20 -0500 (CDT) From: Alan Amesbury Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.8\)) Subject: SIGPIPE from ssh-keyscan [patch] Message-Id: <047FD22B-04FB-46EB-96D1-BF6E03080F9F@oitsec.umn.edu> Date: Wed, 1 May 2019 17:05:20 -0500 To: FreeBSD Hackers X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.8) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 3C3AC8F82A X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dmarc=fail reason="" header.from=umn.edu (policy=none) X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.09 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.87)[-0.871,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.99)[-0.985,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[120.238.101.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mail.oitsec.umn.edu]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.49)[0.486,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:217, ipnet:128.101.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.01)[country: US(-0.06)]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[umn.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 01 May 2019 22:05:29 -0000 The stock ssh-keyscan bundled with 12.0-RELEASE exits with a SIGPIPE = when it receives weird behavior from hosts it's attempting to = communicate with. Symptoms look like: % ssh-keyscan -f /tmp/randtargetlist > /dev/null # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 Broken pipe %=20 Output from truss confirms it's SIGPIPE: . . . 99597: write(7,"\0\0\^Dd\a\^T\M-Y\M-Jw(E\M-ty"...,1128) =3D 1128 (0x468) 99597: select(8,{ 7 },0x0,0x0,{ 5.000000 }) =3D 1 (0x1) 99597: read(7,"\0\0\^D\M-|\n\^T\M^X\M-N]\M-O\^C"...,8192) =3D 1280 = (0x500) 99597: write(7,"\0\0\0,\^F\^^\0\0\0 0\M^S\M^J#"...,48) =3D 48 (0x30) 99597: select(8,{ 7 },0x0,0x0,{ 5.000000 }) =3D 1 (0x1) 99597: read(7,"\0\0\0\M-<\b\^_\0\0\0003\0\0\0\v"...,8192) =3D 208 (0xd0) 99597: write(1,"[REDACTED] ssh-ed255"...,104) =3D 104 (0x68) 99597: close(7) =3D 0 (0x0) 99597: write(16,"SSH-2.0-OpenSSH-keyscan\r\n",25) ERR#32 'Broken pipe' 99597: process killed, signal =3D 13 The behavior exists in openssh-portable ("$FreeBSD: = head/security/openssh-portable/Makefile 484842 2018-11-12 21:55:35Z = bdrewery $") as well. The arguably naive patch I came up with is: --- /tmp/ssh-keyscan.c 2019-05-01 16:09:11.761587000 -0500 +++ ssh-keyscan.c 2019-05-01 16:08:50.425879000 -0500 @@ -644,6 +644,8 @@ int main(int argc, char **argv) { + // ignore SIGPIPE + signal(SIGPIPE, SIG_IGN); int debug_flag =3D 0, log_level =3D SYSLOG_LEVEL_INFO; int opt, fopt_count =3D 0, j; char *tname, *cp, *line =3D NULL; Straightforward and brutish: it ignores SIGPIPE within the main = function in ssh-keyscan.c. This appears to work as expected, e.g.: % ./ssh-keyscan_PATCHED -f /tmp/randtargetlist -T 15 > /dev/null # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 write ([REDACTED]): Broken pipe write ([REDACTED]): Broken pipe write ([REDACTED]): Broken pipe # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-babeld-81e0741 . . . Is this something that's best done by adding it upstream, in the FreeBSD = source (and ports), or ??? Also, is this sane? I don't see it as a = huge deal because it's not a modification to the actual server or client = code, just to the part that grabs host keys, but I freely admit that I'm = outta my depth here. --=20 Alan From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Wed May 1 23:21:50 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B50F1580848 for ; Wed, 1 May 2019 23:21:50 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ggm@algebras.org) Received: from mail-it1-x143.google.com (mail-it1-x143.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::143]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BCD7A6AF6F for ; Wed, 1 May 2019 23:21:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from ggm@algebras.org) Received: by mail-it1-x143.google.com with SMTP id q19so289189itk.3 for ; 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Wed, 01 May 2019 16:21:45 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <201905010356.x413uUnV068470@slippy.cwsent.com> <56b15cc3-4605-f693-4ad6-188ea865820d@quip.cz> In-Reply-To: <56b15cc3-4605-f693-4ad6-188ea865820d@quip.cz> From: George Michaelson Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 09:21:34 +1000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: FreeBSD Stable Cc: freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: BCD7A6AF6F X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=algebras-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.s=20150623 header.b=C4iGPZnr; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of ggm@algebras.org designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::143 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=ggm@algebras.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.23 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[algebras-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com:s=20150623]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip6:2607:f8b0:4000::/36]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[algebras.org]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[6]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[algebras-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM,ALT2.ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM,ASPMX4.GOOGLEMAIL.COM,ALT1.ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM,ASPMX2.GOOGLEMAIL.COM,ASPMX3.GOOGLEMAIL.COM,ASPMX5.GOOGLEMAIL.COM]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[3.4.1.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.4.6.8.4.0.b.8.f.7.0.6.2.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.5.0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.96)[-0.959,0]; IP_SCORE(-0.77)[ip: (1.67), ipnet: 2607:f8b0::/32(-3.19), asn: 15169(-2.25), country: US(-0.06)]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 01 May 2019 23:30:54 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 01 May 2019 23:21:50 -0000 The current state of this looks logical: its the bare minimum to represent the .tgz which we recognized from install menu choices, which minimises any real SAT solver dependency load, because these are not cross-dependant in any strong sense. The goal surely would be to prove this works and test. Then, we can move to the state I think I want, and I presume by extension everyone else wants: Sets which are small enough they expose risk of cross dependency, but once a SAT solver reconciles them, you have ONLY the minimum needed to do your job. So a "tiny" FreeBSD could be back under 4MB (hypothetically) because it was /rescue and the kernel, and if you needed /usr/share you loaded a pkg. -G On Wed, May 1, 2019 at 7:33 PM Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz> wrote: > > Cy Schubert wrote on 2019/05/01 05:56: > > In message <292eadc6-3662-ec43-1175-53fc252487bd@quip.cz>, Miroslav > > Lachman wri > > tes: > >> David Chisnall wrote on 2019/04/30 10:22: > >>> On 29/04/2019 21:12, Joe Maloney wrote: > >>>> With CFT version you chose to build, and package individual componen= ts > >>>> such as sendmail with a port option.=C3=82 That does entirely solve= the > >>>> problem of being able to reinstall sendmail after the fact without a > >>>> rebuild of the userland (base) port but perhaps base flavors could > >>>> solve that problem assuming flavors could extend beyond python. > >>> > >>> This sounds very much like local optimisation. It's now easy to creat= e a > >>> custom base image.=C3=82 Great.=C3=82 But how do I express dependen= cies in ports > >>> on a specific base configuration? This is easy if I depend on a speci= fic > >>> base package, but how does this work in your model?=C3=82 For exampl= e, if I > >>> have a package that depends on a library that is an optional part of = the > >>> base system, how do I express that pkg needs to either refuse to inst= all > >>> it, or install a userland pkg that includes that library in place of = my > >>> existing version as part of the install process? > >>> > >>> More importantly for the container use case, if I want to take a > >>> completely empty jail and do pkg ins nginx (for example), what does t= he > >>> maintainer of the nginx port need to do to express the minimum set of > >>> the base system that needs to be installed to allow nginx to work? > >>> > >>> One of the goals for the pkg base concept was to allow this kind of u= se > >>> case, easily creating a minimal environment required to run a single > >>> service. With a monolithic base package set, you're going to need som= e > >>> mechanism other than packages to express the specific base subset > >>> package that you need and I think that you need to justify why this > >>> mechanism is better than using small individual packages. > >> > >> Will it not be maintainer's nightmare to take care of all the > >> dependencies on the base packages for each port we have in the ports t= ree? > > > > No more than it is today. Remember, people have been doing this sort of > > thing for decades. If the folks at Red Hat, Oracle (formerly Sun), and > > IBM can do it, I'm sure we can too. The dependency lists will be > > longer. We may require dependency lists that allow the choice of one of > > many prereqs or coreqs. > > They are experts and they are paid for their work. I am not. I am > maintaining a few packages and the reality is I don't know what they > need in base. Till these days I don't care about this kind of > dependency. I am not system developer or programmer and I think there > are more than just me who see this as a kind of problem. > So in this case, pkg base gives me nothing but more work on those package= s. > > Miroslav Lachman > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-stable@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-stable > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-stable-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu May 2 01:07:57 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF64A1583624 for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 01:07:57 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from jim@netgate.com) Received: from mail-oi1-x231.google.com (mail-oi1-x231.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::231]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.gmail.com", Issuer "GTS CA 1O1" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7D7016E885 for ; 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Wed, 01 May 2019 18:07:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.10.10.235] ([66.196.5.190]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c3sm10962017otr.57.2019.05.01.18.07.53 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 01 May 2019 18:07:54 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.8\)) Subject: Re: SIGPIPE from ssh-keyscan [patch] From: Jim Thompson In-Reply-To: <047FD22B-04FB-46EB-96D1-BF6E03080F9F@oitsec.umn.edu> Date: Wed, 1 May 2019 20:07:52 -0500 Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <144583E1-828D-4450-99B0-4FBF7FC35B26@netgate.com> References: <047FD22B-04FB-46EB-96D1-BF6E03080F9F@oitsec.umn.edu> To: Alan Amesbury X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.8) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 7D7016E885 X-Spamd-Bar: ------ Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=netgate.com header.s=google header.b=O0/5Wiss; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=netgate.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of jim@netgate.com designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::231 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=jim@netgate.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-6.43 / 15.00]; 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ASN(0.00)[asn:15169, ipnet:2607:f8b0::/32, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 May 2019 01:07:57 -0000 The remote closed the session for some reason before ssh-keyscan wrote = the greening ("SSH-2.0-OpenSSH-keyscan\r\n=E2=80=9D), so you got SIGPIPE = and ERRNO =3D 32 back from the write call. Arguably the right thing occurred here, with the exception that it = killed your ssh-keyscan process. So perhaps instead of ignoring the signal, you should find out why the = remote is exiting before the local can send its greeting. Otherwise, it=E2=80=99s a bit less heavy-handed to=20 Int set =3D 1; setsockopt(sd, SOL_SOCKET, SO_NOSIGPIPE, (void *)&set, sizeof(int)); Where sd is the descriptor in question (16 in your example below). But other parts of ssh-keyscan seem to want to know that EPIPE has = occurred, so neither is the correction solution here. Jim > On May 1, 2019, at 5:05 PM, Alan Amesbury = wrote: >=20 > The stock ssh-keyscan bundled with 12.0-RELEASE exits with a SIGPIPE = when it receives weird behavior from hosts it's attempting to = communicate with. Symptoms look like: >=20 >=20 > % ssh-keyscan -f /tmp/randtargetlist > /dev/null > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > Broken pipe > %=20 >=20 >=20 > Output from truss confirms it's SIGPIPE: >=20 > . > . > . > 99597: write(7,"\0\0\^Dd\a\^T\M-Y\M-Jw(E\M-ty"...,1128) =3D 1128 = (0x468) > 99597: select(8,{ 7 },0x0,0x0,{ 5.000000 }) =3D 1 (0x1) > 99597: read(7,"\0\0\^D\M-|\n\^T\M^X\M-N]\M-O\^C"...,8192) =3D 1280 = (0x500) > 99597: write(7,"\0\0\0,\^F\^^\0\0\0 0\M^S\M^J#"...,48) =3D 48 (0x30) > 99597: select(8,{ 7 },0x0,0x0,{ 5.000000 }) =3D 1 (0x1) > 99597: read(7,"\0\0\0\M-<\b\^_\0\0\0003\0\0\0\v"...,8192) =3D 208 = (0xd0) > 99597: write(1,"[REDACTED] ssh-ed255"...,104) =3D 104 (0x68) > 99597: close(7) =3D 0 (0x0) > 99597: write(16,"SSH-2.0-OpenSSH-keyscan\r\n",25) ERR#32 'Broken pipe' > 99597: process killed, signal =3D 13 >=20 >=20 >=20 > The behavior exists in openssh-portable ("$FreeBSD: = head/security/openssh-portable/Makefile 484842 2018-11-12 21:55:35Z = bdrewery $") as well. >=20 > The arguably naive patch I came up with is: >=20 >=20 > --- /tmp/ssh-keyscan.c 2019-05-01 16:09:11.761587000 -0500 > +++ ssh-keyscan.c 2019-05-01 16:08:50.425879000 -0500 > @@ -644,6 +644,8 @@ > int > main(int argc, char **argv) > { > + // ignore SIGPIPE > + signal(SIGPIPE, SIG_IGN); > int debug_flag =3D 0, log_level =3D SYSLOG_LEVEL_INFO; > int opt, fopt_count =3D 0, j; > char *tname, *cp, *line =3D NULL; >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Straightforward and brutish: it ignores SIGPIPE within the main = function in ssh-keyscan.c. This appears to work as expected, e.g.: >=20 >=20 > % ./ssh-keyscan_PATCHED -f /tmp/randtargetlist -T 15 > /dev/null > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > write ([REDACTED]): Broken pipe > write ([REDACTED]): Broken pipe > write ([REDACTED]): Broken pipe > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-babeld-81e0741 > . > . > . >=20 >=20 >=20 > Is this something that's best done by adding it upstream, in the = FreeBSD source (and ports), or ??? Also, is this sane? I don't see it = as a huge deal because it's not a modification to the actual server or = client code, just to the part that grabs host keys, but I freely admit = that I'm outta my depth here. >=20 >=20 > --=20 > Alan >=20 > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to = "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu May 2 08:19:47 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DFFB158CE30 for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 08:19:47 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Received: from kib.kiev.ua (kib.kiev.ua [IPv6:2001:470:d5e7:1::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 46C0C832DF for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 08:19:46 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Received: from tom.home (kib@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by kib.kiev.ua (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x428Jb0V063134 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 2 May 2019 11:19:40 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 kib.kiev.ua x428Jb0V063134 Received: (from kostik@localhost) by tom.home (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x428Ja1Y063133; Thu, 2 May 2019 11:19:36 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) X-Authentication-Warning: tom.home: kostik set sender to kostikbel@gmail.com using -f Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 11:19:36 +0300 From: Konstantin Belousov To: Jim Thompson Cc: Alan Amesbury , FreeBSD Hackers Subject: Re: SIGPIPE from ssh-keyscan [patch] Message-ID: <20190502081936.GC85201@kib.kiev.ua> References: <047FD22B-04FB-46EB-96D1-BF6E03080F9F@oitsec.umn.edu> <144583E1-828D-4450-99B0-4FBF7FC35B26@netgate.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <144583E1-828D-4450-99B0-4FBF7FC35B26@netgate.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.4 (2019-03-13) X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED,FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD,FREEMAIL_FROM, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on tom.home X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 May 2019 08:19:47 -0000 On Wed, May 01, 2019 at 08:07:52PM -0500, Jim Thompson wrote: > The remote closed the session for some reason before ssh-keyscan wrote the greening ("SSH-2.0-OpenSSH-keyscan\r\n”), so you got SIGPIPE and ERRNO = 32 back from the write call. > > Arguably the right thing occurred here, with the exception that it killed your ssh-keyscan process. > > So perhaps instead of ignoring the signal, you should find out why the remote is exiting before the local can send its greeting. > > Otherwise, it’s a bit less heavy-handed to > > Int set = 1; > setsockopt(sd, SOL_SOCKET, SO_NOSIGPIPE, (void *)&set, sizeof(int)); > > Where sd is the descriptor in question (16 in your example below). > > But other parts of ssh-keyscan seem to want to know that EPIPE has occurred, so neither is the correction solution here. > EPIPE or signal ? SO_NOSIGPIPE only prevents kernel to generate SIGPIPE when it returns EPIPE to userspace. > Jim > > > > On May 1, 2019, at 5:05 PM, Alan Amesbury wrote: > > > > The stock ssh-keyscan bundled with 12.0-RELEASE exits with a SIGPIPE when it receives weird behavior from hosts it's attempting to communicate with. Symptoms look like: > > > > > > % ssh-keyscan -f /tmp/randtargetlist > /dev/null > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > Broken pipe > > % > > > > > > Output from truss confirms it's SIGPIPE: > > > > . > > . > > . > > 99597: write(7,"\0\0\^Dd\a\^T\M-Y\M-Jw(E\M-ty"...,1128) = 1128 (0x468) > > 99597: select(8,{ 7 },0x0,0x0,{ 5.000000 }) = 1 (0x1) > > 99597: read(7,"\0\0\^D\M-|\n\^T\M^X\M-N]\M-O\^C"...,8192) = 1280 (0x500) > > 99597: write(7,"\0\0\0,\^F\^^\0\0\0 0\M^S\M^J#"...,48) = 48 (0x30) > > 99597: select(8,{ 7 },0x0,0x0,{ 5.000000 }) = 1 (0x1) > > 99597: read(7,"\0\0\0\M-<\b\^_\0\0\0003\0\0\0\v"...,8192) = 208 (0xd0) > > 99597: write(1,"[REDACTED] ssh-ed255"...,104) = 104 (0x68) > > 99597: close(7) = 0 (0x0) > > 99597: write(16,"SSH-2.0-OpenSSH-keyscan\r\n",25) ERR#32 'Broken pipe' > > 99597: process killed, signal = 13 > > > > > > > > The behavior exists in openssh-portable ("$FreeBSD: head/security/openssh-portable/Makefile 484842 2018-11-12 21:55:35Z bdrewery $") as well. > > > > The arguably naive patch I came up with is: > > > > > > --- /tmp/ssh-keyscan.c 2019-05-01 16:09:11.761587000 -0500 > > +++ ssh-keyscan.c 2019-05-01 16:08:50.425879000 -0500 > > @@ -644,6 +644,8 @@ > > int > > main(int argc, char **argv) > > { > > + // ignore SIGPIPE > > + signal(SIGPIPE, SIG_IGN); > > int debug_flag = 0, log_level = SYSLOG_LEVEL_INFO; > > int opt, fopt_count = 0, j; > > char *tname, *cp, *line = NULL; > > > > > > > > > > Straightforward and brutish: it ignores SIGPIPE within the main function in ssh-keyscan.c. This appears to work as expected, e.g.: > > > > > > % ./ssh-keyscan_PATCHED -f /tmp/randtargetlist -T 15 > /dev/null > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-OpenSSH_7.4 > > write ([REDACTED]): Broken pipe > > write ([REDACTED]): Broken pipe > > write ([REDACTED]): Broken pipe > > # [REDACTED]:22 SSH-2.0-babeld-81e0741 > > . > > . > > . > > > > > > > > Is this something that's best done by adding it upstream, in the FreeBSD source (and ports), or ??? Also, is this sane? I don't see it as a huge deal because it's not a modification to the actual server or client code, just to the part that grabs host keys, but I freely admit that I'm outta my depth here. > > > > > > -- > > Alan > > > > _______________________________________________ > > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" > > _______________________________________________ > freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org mailing list > https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-hackers > To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-hackers-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu May 2 10:52:42 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 770C115905CA; Thu, 2 May 2019 10:52:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from root@sfc.wide.ad.jp) Received: from mail1.sfc.wide.ad.jp (mail1.sfc.wide.ad.jp [203.178.142.133]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B443E880DC; Thu, 2 May 2019 10:52:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from root@sfc.wide.ad.jp) Received: by mail1.sfc.wide.ad.jp (Postfix, from userid 0) id E3C141B449; Thu, 2 May 2019 19:40:06 +0900 (JST) X-Original-To: micchie@sfc.wide.ad.jp Received: from ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp (ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp [IPv6:2001:200:0:8803:203:178:142:150]) by mail1.sfc.wide.ad.jp (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 66BBB12334 for ; Wed, 1 May 2019 07:17:20 +0900 (JST) Received-SPF: None (ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp: no sender authenticity information available from domain of owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org) identity=pra; client-ip=8.8.178.116; receiver=ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp; envelope-from="owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org"; x-sender="owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp: domain of owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org designates 8.8.178.116 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=8.8.178.116; receiver=ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp; envelope-from="owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org"; x-sender="owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1"; x-record-text="v=spf1 ip4:8.8.178.116 ip4:96.47.72.81 ip6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:2 ip6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:2 ~all" Received-SPF: None (ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp: no sender authenticity information available from domain of postmaster@mx2.freebsd.org) identity=helo; client-ip=8.8.178.116; receiver=ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp; envelope-from="owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org"; x-sender="postmaster@mx2.freebsd.org"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible IronPort-SDR: W157G+hmN4zhwFNoCTJIsNahQelwABGA2MBHcai90tMBGEDfT1J2zSv3SXrU5NF3j51ciXyI4j 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"mx1.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx2.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D1F7E70BEE; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 22:17:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org) Received: from mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (mailman.ysv.freebsd.org [IPv6:2001:1900:2254:206a::50:5]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36E946AAC3; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 22:17:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1556662632; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=cMbAoIsSAQXA1HL2+KazKaL69s2xJHlUgjRGtqZyy34=; b=YE5g4kT5dUBM3jjgJa1cPowNhddLCtPUJEMe+WHHn4o+10iGIB8nr4dE4WV9jukZnXEazG YoN18l5EHeSNScT2ts510mZgHJx6mHfSpuyS4XIXcpHKRgP27501wvIUC+RZZoA56lzom8 lusTaIsoBYN0rvwI16AhwYqsOWjuoNevZRlbxB5+jrCl+fST3v1ePuc7uP5nZUfk+lEMyy STIaRb036pdrrXpwwbW1uRmRgDyabf8J5sV9oaHtdFHT39EjoR/Phpd6UeHXFgKV0rDj7q 6tL0gD0DYn5T4kxORoIMEDJDmZ+LbzqUyTawh5Yj8VyEBGHlNUjfPU7LiymSyg== Delivered-To: freebsd-current@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA7A8159FF9D; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 22:13:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=7/jM=TA=quip.cz=000.fbsd@elsa.codelab.cz) Received: from elsa.codelab.cz (elsa.codelab.cz [94.124.105.4]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 11DA96A723; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 22:13:30 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from SRS0=7/jM=TA=quip.cz=000.fbsd@elsa.codelab.cz) Received: from elsa.codelab.cz (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by elsa.codelab.cz (Postfix) with ESMTP id B397E28417; Wed, 1 May 2019 00:03:44 +0200 (CEST) Received: from illbsd.quip.test (ip-62-24-92-232.net.upcbroadband.cz [62.24.92.232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by elsa.codelab.cz (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 51D3828411; Wed, 1 May 2019 00:03:43 +0200 (CEST) Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: David Chisnall Cc: Kris Moore , FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, =?UTF-8?Q?Goran_Meki=c4=87?= , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-ports@freebsd.org References: <201904291931.x3TJV73d079802@slippy.cwsent.com> <6EB65F49-47CD-48B2-8C58-BF387D8C7A58@ixsystems.com> From: Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz> Message-ID: <292eadc6-3662-ec43-1175-53fc252487bd@quip.cz> Date: Wed, 1 May 2019 00:03:44 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; FreeBSD amd64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/52.0 SeaMonkey/2.49.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: X-Spam: Yes X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1556662632; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=cMbAoIsSAQXA1HL2+KazKaL69s2xJHlUgjRGtqZyy34=; b=qqTynqoOg6Me6PtXZicIUutDA6ISa7JmOIN+iEF2OpFmP53QhuoAY05wh2IDoUPOgHK2t0 9+08a+OgU5xm8Zgt4jYyrsv4YPfjAVAtll3CyabexVSl9TAk3JLuIUxo6juP+utWfp9IgW UDa9Hu97Ql1VTI0qf0KrJSURX5yN2G8yUGa89wN58BsKSQCzM7/SJXcUIpQC0z29P2eFZY 2TO/aq1+zVxDldjd3X5p4BWjpf3WtJkvkBWSi6cqEUcECJAqJmEh78Qjp9b+xHZMVnITAP 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R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+a:mail.sfc.wide.ad.jp]; GREYLIST(0.00)[pass,body]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[freebsd.org:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ironport1.otemachi.wide.ad.jp]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[9]; MAILLIST(-0.20)[mailman]; FORGED_SENDER(0.00)[000.fbsd@quip.cz,root@sfc.wide.ad.jp]; MIME_BASE64_TEXT(0.10)[]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DATE_IN_PAST(1.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[000.fbsd@quip.cz,root@sfc.wide.ad.jp]; ASN(0.00)[asn:2500, ipnet:203.178.128.0/17, country:JP]; IP_SCORE(-1.78)[ip: (-6.60), ipnet: 203.178.128.0/17(-1.45), asn: 2500(-0.80), country: JP(-0.06)]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[freebsd.org:s=dkim]; SPAM_FLAG(5.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ARC_ALLOW(-1.00)[i=1]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-0.25)[-0.253,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[quip.cz]; HAS_LIST_UNSUB(-0.01)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_MEDIUM(0.73)[0.729,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.37)[0.371,0]; RCVD_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[10]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 May 2019 10:52:42 -0000 RGF2aWQgQ2hpc25hbGwgd3JvdGUgb24gMjAxOS8wNC8zMCAxMDoyMjoKPiBPbiAyOS8wNC8yMDE5 IDIxOjEyLCBKb2UgTWFsb25leSB3cm90ZToKPj4gV2l0aCBDRlQgdmVyc2lvbiB5b3UgY2hvc2Ug dG8gYnVpbGQsIGFuZCBwYWNrYWdlIGluZGl2aWR1YWwgY29tcG9uZW50cyAKPj4gc3VjaCBhcyBz ZW5kbWFpbCB3aXRoIGEgcG9ydCBvcHRpb24uwqAgVGhhdCBkb2VzIGVudGlyZWx5IHNvbHZlIHRo ZSAKPj4gcHJvYmxlbSBvZiBiZWluZyBhYmxlIHRvIHJlaW5zdGFsbCBzZW5kbWFpbCBhZnRlciB0 aGUgZmFjdCB3aXRob3V0IGEgCj4+IHJlYnVpbGQgb2YgdGhlIHVzZXJsYW5kIChiYXNlKSBwb3J0 IGJ1dCBwZXJoYXBzIGJhc2UgZmxhdm9ycyBjb3VsZCAKPj4gc29sdmUgdGhhdCBwcm9ibGVtIGFz c3VtaW5nIGZsYXZvcnMgY291bGQgZXh0ZW5kIGJleW9uZCBweXRob24uCj4gCj4gVGhpcyBzb3Vu ZHMgdmVyeSBtdWNoIGxpa2UgbG9jYWwgb3B0aW1pc2F0aW9uLiBJdCdzIG5vdyBlYXN5IHRvIGNy ZWF0ZSBhIAo+IGN1c3RvbSBiYXNlIGltYWdlLsKgIEdyZWF0LsKgIEJ1dCBob3cgZG8gSSBleHBy 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az8KPiAKPiBPbmUgb2YgdGhlIGdvYWxzIGZvciB0aGUgcGtnIGJhc2UgY29uY2VwdCB3YXMgdG8g YWxsb3cgdGhpcyBraW5kIG9mIHVzZSAKPiBjYXNlLCBlYXNpbHkgY3JlYXRpbmcgYSBtaW5pbWFs IGVudmlyb25tZW50IHJlcXVpcmVkIHRvIHJ1biBhIHNpbmdsZSAKPiBzZXJ2aWNlLiBXaXRoIGEg bW9ub2xpdGhpYyBiYXNlIHBhY2thZ2Ugc2V0LCB5b3UncmUgZ29pbmcgdG8gbmVlZCBzb21lIAo+ IG1lY2hhbmlzbSBvdGhlciB0aGFuIHBhY2thZ2VzIHRvIGV4cHJlc3MgdGhlIHNwZWNpZmljIGJh c2Ugc3Vic2V0IAo+IHBhY2thZ2UgdGhhdCB5b3UgbmVlZCBhbmQgSSB0aGluayB0aGF0IHlvdSBu ZWVkIHRvIGp1c3RpZnkgd2h5IHRoaXMgCj4gbWVjaGFuaXNtIGlzIGJldHRlciB0aGFuIHVzaW5n IHNtYWxsIGluZGl2aWR1YWwgcGFja2FnZXMuCgpXaWxsIGl0IG5vdCBiZSBtYWludGFpbmVyJ3Mg bmlnaHRtYXJlIHRvIHRha2UgY2FyZSBvZiBhbGwgdGhlIApkZXBlbmRlbmNpZXMgb24gdGhlIGJh c2UgcGFja2FnZXMgZm9yIGVhY2ggcG9ydCB3ZSBoYXZlIGluIHRoZSBwb3J0cyB0cmVlPwoKTWly b3NsYXYgTGFjaG1hbgpfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fXwpmcmVlYnNkLWN1cnJlbnRAZnJlZWJzZC5vcmcgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0Cmh0dHBzOi8vbGlz dHMuZnJlZWJzZC5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9mcmVlYnNkLWN1cnJlbnQKVG8gdW5zdWJz Y3JpYmUsIHNlbmQgYW55IG1haWwgdG8gImZyZWVic2QtY3VycmVudC11bnN1YnNjcmliZUBmcmVl YnNkLm9yZyIK From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu May 2 10:53:57 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB9D215906E9; Thu, 2 May 2019 10:53:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from root@sfc.wide.ad.jp) Received: from mail1.sfc.wide.ad.jp (mail1.sfc.wide.ad.jp [203.178.142.133]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 82D5B882A6; Thu, 2 May 2019 10:53:55 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from root@sfc.wide.ad.jp) Received: by mail1.sfc.wide.ad.jp (Postfix, from userid 0) id B7B971BCCF; Thu, 2 May 2019 19:40:08 +0900 (JST) X-Original-To: micchie@sfc.wide.ad.jp Received: from ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp (ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp [IPv6:2001:200:0:8803:203:178:142:150]) by mail1.sfc.wide.ad.jp (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7161212691 for ; Wed, 1 May 2019 13:00:36 +0900 (JST) Received-SPF: None (ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp: no sender authenticity information available from domain of owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org) identity=pra; client-ip=8.8.178.116; receiver=ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp; envelope-from="owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org"; x-sender="owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible Received-SPF: Pass (ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp: domain of owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org designates 8.8.178.116 as permitted sender) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=8.8.178.116; receiver=ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp; envelope-from="owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org"; x-sender="owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible; x-record-type="v=spf1"; x-record-text="v=spf1 ip4:8.8.178.116 ip4:96.47.72.81 ip6:2001:1900:2254:206a::19:2 ip6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:2 ~all" Received-SPF: None (ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp: no sender authenticity information available from domain of postmaster@mx2.freebsd.org) identity=helo; client-ip=8.8.178.116; receiver=ironport1.sfc.wide.ad.jp; envelope-from="owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org"; x-sender="postmaster@mx2.freebsd.org"; x-conformance=sidf_compatible IronPort-SDR: +p/mLucn7TetiYTI/wCXSH4l5Y82ShzsEQYCS8CXqmPuihuS1zePafWHrYl5Ch2XhCWivRy9WW K0XWcqc7q31+2PhRFrjJjwaf683iA2We4= IronPort-PHdr: =?us-ascii?q?9a23=3ADlDfjxG8QZTbUO/Q4kPZhJ1GYnF86YWxBRYc79?= =?us-ascii?q?8ds5kLTJ76p8q5bnLW6fgltlLVR4KTs6sC17OP9f6+EjNQqb+681k6OKRWUB?= =?us-ascii?q?EEjchE1ycBO+WiTXPBEfjxciYhF95DXlI2t1uyMExSBdqsLwaK+i764jEdAA?= =?us-ascii?q?jwOhRoLerpBIHSk9631+ev8JHPfglEnjWwba5vIBmsrAjct8YajIlhJ60s1h?= =?us-ascii?q?bHv3xEdvhMy2h1P1yThRH85smx/J5n7Stdvu8q+tBDX6vnYak2VKRUAzs6PW?= =?us-ascii?q?874s3rrgTDQhCU5nQASGUWkwFHDBbD4RrnQ5r+qCr6tu562CmHIc37SK0/VD?= =?us-ascii?q?q+46t3ThLjlTwKPCAl/m7JlsNwjbpboBO/qBx5347Ue5yeOP5ncq/AYd8WWW?= 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[127.0.0.1]) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id x413uX67074032; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 20:56:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Received: from slippy (cy@localhost) by slippy.cwsent.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id x413uUnV068470; Tue, 30 Apr 2019 20:56:32 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com) Message-Id: <201905010356.x413uUnV068470@slippy.cwsent.com> X-Authentication-Warning: slippy.cwsent.com: cy owned process doing -bs X-Mailer: exmh version 2.8.0 04/21/2012 with nmh-1.7.1 Reply-to: Cy Schubert From: Cy Schubert X-os: FreeBSD X-Sender: cy@cwsent.com X-URL: http://www.cschubert.com/ To: Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz> cc: David Chisnall , FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, =?UTF-8?Q?Goran_Meki=c4=87?= , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base In-Reply-To: Message from Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz> of "Wed, 01 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FORGED_SENDER(0.00)[Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com,root@sfc.wide.ad.jp]; RECEIVED_SPAMHAUS_PBL(0.00)[17.125.67.70.zen.spamhaus.org : 127.0.0.11]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DATE_IN_PAST(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:2500, ipnet:203.178.128.0/17, country:JP]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com,root@sfc.wide.ad.jp]; ARC_ALLOW(-1.00)[i=1]; IP_SCORE(-1.94)[ip: (-7.03), ipnet: 203.178.128.0/17(-1.67), asn: 2500(-0.94), country: JP(-0.06)]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[freebsd.org:s=dkim]; REPLYTO_EQ_FROM(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; HAS_LIST_UNSUB(-0.01)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; FORGED_SENDER_MAILLIST(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 May 2019 10:53:57 -0000 In message <292eadc6-3662-ec43-1175-53fc252487bd@quip.cz>, Miroslav = Lachman wri tes: > David Chisnall wrote on 2019/04/30 10:22: > > On 29/04/2019 21:12, Joe Maloney wrote: > >> With CFT version you chose to build, and package individual components = > >> such as sendmail with a port option.=C2=A0 That does entirely solve th= e = > >> problem of being able to reinstall sendmail after the fact without a = > >> rebuild of the userland (base) port but perhaps base flavors could = > >> solve that problem assuming flavors could extend beyond python. > > = > > This sounds very much like local optimisation. It's now easy to create = a = > > custom base image.=C2=A0 Great.=C2=A0 But how do I express dependencies= in ports = > > on a specific base configuration? This is easy if I depend on a specifi= c = > > base package, but how does this work in your model?=C2=A0 For example, = if I = > > have a package that depends on a library that is an optional part of th= e = > > base system, how do I express that pkg needs to either refuse to instal= l = > > it, or install a userland pkg that includes that library in place of my = > > existing version as part of the install process? > > = > > More importantly for the container use case, if I want to take a = > > completely empty jail and do pkg ins nginx (for example), what does the = > > maintainer of the nginx port need to do to express the minimum set of = > > the base system that needs to be installed to allow nginx to work? > > = > > One of the goals for the pkg base concept was to allow this kind of use = > > case, easily creating a minimal environment required to run a single = > > service. With a monolithic base package set, you're going to need some = > > mechanism other than packages to express the specific base subset = > > package that you need and I think that you need to justify why this = > > mechanism is better than using small individual packages. > > Will it not be maintainer's nightmare to take care of all the = > dependencies on the base packages for each port we have in the ports tree? No more than it is today. Remember, people have been doing this sort of = thing for decades. If the folks at Red Hat, Oracle (formerly Sun), and = IBM can do it, I'm sure we can too. The dependency lists will be = longer. We may require dependency lists that allow the choice of one of = many prereqs or coreqs. -- = Cheers, Cy Schubert FreeBSD UNIX: Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few. _______________________________________________ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu May 2 10:47:53 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B12591590333; Thu, 2 May 2019 10:47:53 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from root@sfc.wide.ad.jp) Received: from mail1.sfc.wide.ad.jp (mail1.sfc.wide.ad.jp [203.178.142.133]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with 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08:22:10 GMT (envelope-from theraven@FreeBSD.org) X-Authentication-Warning: mail: Host [167.220.197.150] claimed to be [10.164.186.150] Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: Joe Maloney , Cy Schubert Cc: "Rodney W. Grimes" , Kris Moore , FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, =?UTF-8?Q?Goran_Meki=c4=87?= , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, Emmanuel Vadot References: <201904291931.x3TJV73d079802@slippy.cwsent.com> <6EB65F49-47CD-48B2-8C58-BF387D8C7A58@ixsystems.com> From: David Chisnall Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 09:22:56 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.6.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <6EB65F49-47CD-48B2-8C58-BF387D8C7A58@ixsystems.com> Content-Language: en-GB X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 10:18:36 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=freebsd.org; s=dkim; t=1556619726; h=from:from:sender:sender:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id: list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=3uPMqOLVHtYQgxrxynDls3RQ8GV3oY9kZDZ+kHumHuA=; b=g4gbI4tF+/541QaCNzdPW/8LRGuA+PoEp0ah9c1fu35Ve9czp4mOhHlEdhWziFbcMi5n0Y 2POyiFKnnVlYSaLCRrvMcnn+SLNvODlCpyPvkav6Vq5POiLnblaI3wAT64DTU/LiW26Flz l2Iu8DRmtrPLOGO0FyeQdMECGN76V1a1UcMHQLJSlru+mIOvlXUdVLlgSYm4LO2UJvTGng iGNkO677hHmmSOxXf/bu5D+27ip3n9SVpHPNX7f+5JkeuAhqtDbtffeQ+2VfJz6tQJDjZW LyZtGyR/z46AfT9BoE/5p9fMaYRSCvIDhN69D9k7VcKbhJKNx06xGuEchqQaLw== ARC-Seal: i=1; s=dkim; d=freebsd.org; t=1556619726; a=rsa-sha256; cv=none; b=Kg+ptVck8q6po4TCQr2gAt0NuNEYt+ot69Q2MxR86D99LgRUTnCTl3uyWZh0uqJ9cyh5Ih Dc19+UW5/dU33txeVvzIiOVj/cLNPnmqsXYFNFcTjyOK+oOmQmeXwv2Cm0AuvIVHu9X0KN fTHL9JvNmOejAGy+/0oHiQU3P9bjiCRDFcAtYU/vgYK7/7jUzoNrv8xOY0DV/ZaQsQQOnz rKtNPBjF/1GKrvyH0wEVlqNIPgSFHM6ZCLcWJKhb7aTUwQoNAe9EASpFp56MecR9XLxIsN 6xSQdaSEIW+i2ABKbMaPr7lNhZHbzqvr9G5tX2C+9sPI2Z/0L2mtNSZdhkdHsQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx1.freebsd.org X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 18D2687BEF X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=freebsd.org header.s=dkim header.b=cOCLsWyB; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of root@sfc.wide.ad.jp designates 203.178.142.133 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=root@sfc.wide.ad.jp X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.71 / 15.00]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+a:mail.sfc.wide.ad.jp]; HAS_XAW(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[freebsd.org:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: ironport1.otemachi.wide.ad.jp]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.92)[-0.923,0]; MAILLIST(-0.20)[mailman]; FORGED_SENDER(0.00)[theraven@FreeBSD.org,root@sfc.wide.ad.jp]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; DATE_IN_PAST(1.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:2500, ipnet:203.178.128.0/17, country:JP]; FROM_NEQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[theraven@FreeBSD.org,root@sfc.wide.ad.jp]; ARC_ALLOW(-1.00)[i=1]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[freebsd.org:s=dkim]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[FreeBSD.org]; HAS_LIST_UNSUB(-0.01)[]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCPT_COUNT_TWELVE(0.00)[12]; IP_SCORE(-1.56)[ip: (-5.91), ipnet: 203.178.128.0/17(-1.19), asn: 2500(-0.65), country: JP(-0.06)]; RCVD_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[9]; FORGED_SENDER_MAILLIST(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 02 May 2019 11:20:36 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 May 2019 10:47:54 -0000 On 29/04/2019 21:12, Joe Maloney wrote: > With CFT version you chose to build, and package individual components such as sendmail with a port option. That does entirely solve the problem of being able to reinstall sendmail after the fact without a rebuild of the userland (base) port but perhaps base flavors could solve that problem assuming flavors could extend beyond python. This sounds very much like local optimisation. It's now easy to create a custom base image. Great. But how do I express dependencies in ports on a specific base configuration? This is easy if I depend on a specific base package, but how does this work in your model? For example, if I have a package that depends on a library that is an optional part of the base system, how do I express that pkg needs to either refuse to install it, or install a userland pkg that includes that library in place of my existing version as part of the install process? More importantly for the container use case, if I want to take a completely empty jail and do pkg ins nginx (for example), what does the maintainer of the nginx port need to do to express the minimum set of the base system that needs to be installed to allow nginx to work? One of the goals for the pkg base concept was to allow this kind of use case, easily creating a minimal environment required to run a single service. With a monolithic base package set, you're going to need some mechanism other than packages to express the specific base subset package that you need and I think that you need to justify why this mechanism is better than using small individual packages. David _______________________________________________ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu May 2 11:09:10 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E43351591609; Thu, 2 May 2019 11:09:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from v.velox@vvelox.net) Received: from vulpes.vvelox.net (vulpes.vvelox.net [96.95.67.25]) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AF2D893B7; Thu, 2 May 2019 11:09:08 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from v.velox@vvelox.net) Received: from vvelox.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (Authenticated sender: kitsune) by vulpes.vvelox.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 0D4B023355C1; Thu, 2 May 2019 06:09:00 -0500 (CDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Date: Thu, 02 May 2019 06:09:00 -0500 From: "Zane C. B-H." To: Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz> Cc: David Chisnall , FreeBSD Stable , freebsd-ports@freebsd.org, =?UTF-8?Q?Gor?= =?UTF-8?Q?an_Meki=C4=87?= , freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org, FreeBSD Current , freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org, freebsd-pkg@freebsd.org, owner-freebsd-pkgbase@freebsd.org Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base In-Reply-To: <292eadc6-3662-ec43-1175-53fc252487bd@quip.cz> References: <201904291931.x3TJV73d079802@slippy.cwsent.com> <6EB65F49-47CD-48B2-8C58-BF387D8C7A58@ixsystems.com> <292eadc6-3662-ec43-1175-53fc252487bd@quip.cz> Message-ID: <8d664f5eb336c955475c97332bcd2b2b@vvelox.net> X-Sender: v.velox@vvelox.net User-Agent: Roundcube Webmail/1.3.3 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 0AF2D893B7 X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of v.velox@vvelox.net designates 96.95.67.25 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=v.velox@vvelox.net X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.52 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-0.999,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ip4:96.95.67.25/32]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; DMARC_NA(0.00)[vvelox.net]; NEURAL_SPAM_SHORT(0.14)[0.139,0]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[mail.vvelox.net]; RCPT_COUNT_SEVEN(0.00)[10]; IP_SCORE(-0.95)[ip: (-0.90), ipnet: 96.64.0.0/11(-3.92), asn: 7922(0.14), country: US(-0.06)]; RCVD_NO_TLS_LAST(0.10)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:7922, ipnet:96.64.0.0/11, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; SUSPICIOUS_RECIPS(1.50)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 02 May 2019 11:42:58 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 May 2019 11:09:10 -0000 On 2019-04-30 17:03, Miroslav Lachman wrote: > David Chisnall wrote on 2019/04/30 10:22: >> On 29/04/2019 21:12, Joe Maloney wrote: >>> With CFT version you chose to build, and package individual >>> components such as sendmail with a port option.  That does entirely >>> solve the problem of being able to reinstall sendmail after the fact >>> without a rebuild of the userland (base) port but perhaps base >>> flavors could solve that problem assuming flavors could extend beyond >>> python. >> >> This sounds very much like local optimisation. It's now easy to create >> a custom base image.  Great.  But how do I express dependencies in >> ports on a specific base configuration? This is easy if I depend on a >> specific base package, but how does this work in your model?  For >> example, if I have a package that depends on a library that is an >> optional part of the base system, how do I express that pkg needs to >> either refuse to install it, or install a userland pkg that includes >> that library in place of my existing version as part of the install >> process? >> >> More importantly for the container use case, if I want to take a >> completely empty jail and do pkg ins nginx (for example), what does >> the maintainer of the nginx port need to do to express the minimum set >> of the base system that needs to be installed to allow nginx to work? >> >> One of the goals for the pkg base concept was to allow this kind of >> use case, easily creating a minimal environment required to run a >> single service. With a monolithic base package set, you're going to >> need some mechanism other than packages to express the specific base >> subset package that you need and I think that you need to justify why >> this mechanism is better than using small individual packages. > > Will it not be maintainer's nightmare to take care of all the > dependencies on the base packages for each port we have in the ports > tree? Speaking as a ports maintainer, it will be very annoying. Splitting it into a handful of large ass packages, same as you are presented with during install, would be best. From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu May 2 11:58:10 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5892715931B9 for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 11:58:10 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matthew@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.freebsd.org (smtp.freebsd.org [96.47.72.83]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "smtp.freebsd.org", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C33F48B8A6 for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 11:58:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matthew@FreeBSD.org) Received: from smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk [IPv6:2001:8b0:151:1:c4ea:bd49:619b:6cb3]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk", Issuer "Let's Encrypt Authority X3" (verified OK)) (Authenticated sender: matthew/mail) by smtp.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7C7F5B6EC for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 11:58:09 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from matthew@FreeBSD.org) Received: from leaf.local (unknown [88.212.184.97]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: m.seaman@infracaninophile.co.uk) by smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id DE6EFB006 for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 11:58:06 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: smtp.infracaninophile.co.uk/DE6EFB006; dkim=none; dkim-atps=neutral Subject: Re: CFT: FreeBSD Package Base To: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org References: <201904291931.x3TJV73d079802@slippy.cwsent.com> <6EB65F49-47CD-48B2-8C58-BF387D8C7A58@ixsystems.com> From: Matthew Seaman Message-ID: Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 12:58:04 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.14; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.6.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-GB Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: C33F48B8A6 X-Spamd-Bar: -- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-2.99 / 15.00]; local_wl_from(0.00)[FreeBSD.org]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.99)[-0.993,0]; ASN(0.00)[asn:11403, ipnet:96.47.64.0/20, country:US] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 May 2019 11:58:10 -0000 On 30/04/2019 09:22, David Chisnall wrote: > On 29/04/2019 21:12, Joe Maloney wrote: >> With CFT version you chose to build, and package individual components >> such as sendmail with a port option.  That does entirely solve the >> problem of being able to reinstall sendmail after the fact without a >> rebuild of the userland (base) port but perhaps base flavors could >> solve that problem assuming flavors could extend beyond python. > > This sounds very much like local optimisation. It's now easy to create a > custom base image.  Great.  But how do I express dependencies in ports > on a specific base configuration? This is easy if I depend on a specific > base package, but how does this work in your model?  For example, if I > have a package that depends on a library that is an optional part of the > base system, how do I express that pkg needs to either refuse to install > it, or install a userland pkg that includes that library in place of my > existing version as part of the install process? In principle, this should be covered by the 'provides - requires' functionality in pkg. However at the moment this is limited to just analysing binaries to find what shared libraries they load. There's an arbitrary removal of any base-system shlibs from the provides/requires in the standard port packages built today, but that can be overridden by setting ALLOW_BASE_SHLIBS in pkg.conf. We'd need to add quite a lot of new metadata to packages to fully express all of the things they provide that another package could require -- anything from a high-level concept like 'I need a webserver: anything will do' down to something as specific as 'I need to have exactly this specific file installed.' Some of that can be automatically generated at package build time, but a lot of it will require maintainers to manually add settings. We'd also need to ensure that both the ports tree and pkg(8) handle alternate dependencies correctly. A lot of the effort in maintaining the ports at the moment goes towards generating a self-consistent set of packages with a single dependency inheritance (albeit one that can be switched by changing some flags and recompiling -- eg. to swap between openssl and libressl) Flavourization is one step towards this, but by no means a complete solution. Cheers, Matthew From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu May 2 15:12:41 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A60611598432 for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 15:12:41 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from aleksandr.fedorov@vstack.com) Received: from relay02.itglobal.com (relay02.itglobal.com [46.243.181.6]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C236D92D4C for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 15:12:40 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from aleksandr.fedorov@vstack.com) X-Virus-Scanned: by SpamTitan at itglobal.com DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=vstack.com; s=relay; t=1556809958; bh=8VIO5p2wDYy97ny9+wKX0tdZNqM0jzLPANgoUjJ4fS8=; h=From:To:Subject:Date; b=NkxUwnGExMJSyl9/q8Nd7zeq8GC3/5bQKn1krzvMW8WyLzc23ty1G1A/TZj+m8mTH hxC5LAWxlvMGDO5xKSOCZP1Ae974NIEpXkUCfZIdCghCkHfWOYD2LvaZYKmHufGcT5 0jPbQLVu4ZJr+Nf8ferPLR4eJw3vGWvMNQMd6Bgu03iQjttoYsLikaGxq24zIWW7yq P3+v8Q62bO0f1oDvQ/ydH1d5cL2yciYncOtk9Mza69boyinSrnIQCpohaHzGpMPI+E UZYfYZ+QWdmSKa+iRfaMHSSN/iCTB6uCZxz132WLOAAS3EQWAcIwHZMIN3hCCRSb+c SrdENrfWFRDcg== Received: from exch01-bcl.itglobal.com (unknown [10.32.0.6]) by relay02.itglobal.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9B7C881D0BE for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 18:12:35 +0300 (MSK) Received: from exch01-bcl.itglobal.com (10.32.0.6) by exch01-bcl.itglobal.com (10.32.0.6) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.1531.3; Thu, 2 May 2019 18:12:30 +0300 Received: from exch01-bcl.itglobal.com ([fe80::b5fa:cf7e:9275:f42c]) by exch01-bcl.itglobal.com ([fe80::b5fa:cf7e:9275:f42c%2]) with mapi id 15.01.1531.004; Thu, 2 May 2019 18:12:30 +0300 From: "Fedorov, Aleksandr" To: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" Subject: TASKQUEUE(9) KPI enqueue task only once Thread-Topic: TASKQUEUE(9) KPI enqueue task only once Thread-Index: AQHVAPl199xtjvSjl0Kd7ZzsjajHsQ== Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 15:12:30 +0000 Message-ID: <05b18f73ee054b9696d055ed40610dea@vstack.com> Accept-Language: ru-RU, en-US Content-Language: ru-RU X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.32.254.100] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: C236D92D4C X-Spamd-Bar: --- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dkim=pass header.d=vstack.com header.s=relay header.b=NkxUwnGE; dmarc=pass (policy=none) header.from=vstack.com; spf=pass (mx1.freebsd.org: domain of aleksandr.fedorov@vstack.com designates 46.243.181.6 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=aleksandr.fedorov@vstack.com X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-3.63 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.98)[-0.981,0]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[vstack.com:s=relay]; HAS_XOIP(0.00)[]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+mx]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_ALL(0.00)[]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; PREVIOUSLY_DELIVERED(0.00)[freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000,0]; RCPT_COUNT_ONE(0.00)[1]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; IP_SCORE(0.00)[country: RU(0.01)]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[vstack.com:+]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: relay01.itglobal.com]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[vstack.com,none]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.64)[-0.637,0]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_ALL(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:209974, ipnet:46.243.181.0/24, country:RU]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[] X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 02 May 2019 15:56:32 +0000 X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 May 2019 15:12:41 -0000 Hi Hackers. I need to enqueue task to the taskqueue only if there is no pending tasks. I found the taskqueue_poll_is_busy() function, but the comment above indica= tes that it should be used only from single threaded contexts. Is there a conventional way to do this?= From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu May 2 17:17:28 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A845159BB07 for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 17:17:28 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from amesbury@oitsec.umn.edu) Received: from mail.oitsec.umn.edu (mail.oitsec.umn.edu [128.101.238.120]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "mail.oitsec.umn.edu", Issuer "InCommon RSA Server CA" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 02D8997D8D for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 17:17:26 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from amesbury@oitsec.umn.edu) Received: from mail.oitsec.umn.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.oitsec.umn.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61122B05C6; Thu, 2 May 2019 12:17:25 -0500 (CDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at oitsec.umn.edu Received: from mail.oitsec.umn.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by mail.oitsec.umn.edu (mail.oitsec.umn.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Pg6KHxiS0Qsi; Thu, 2 May 2019 12:17:24 -0500 (CDT) Received: from optimator.uis.umn.edu (optimator.uis.umn.edu [134.84.23.1]) (Authenticated sender: amesbury) by mail.oitsec.umn.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id CB9A6B05E1; Thu, 2 May 2019 12:17:24 -0500 (CDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.8\)) Subject: Re: SIGPIPE from ssh-keyscan [patch] From: Alan Amesbury In-Reply-To: <144583E1-828D-4450-99B0-4FBF7FC35B26@netgate.com> Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 12:17:25 -0500 Cc: FreeBSD Hackers Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <0FE5F47E-99EF-4B64-B6AD-E2E6A1754634@oitsec.umn.edu> References: <047FD22B-04FB-46EB-96D1-BF6E03080F9F@oitsec.umn.edu> <144583E1-828D-4450-99B0-4FBF7FC35B26@netgate.com> To: Jim Thompson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.8) X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 02D8997D8D X-Spamd-Bar: - Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; dmarc=fail reason="" header.from=umn.edu (policy=none) X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-1.94 / 15.00]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-0.98)[-0.984,0]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; MV_CASE(0.50)[]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-0.995,0]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_THREE(0.00)[4]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; TO_DN_ALL(0.00)[]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED(-0.20)[120.238.101.128.list.dnswl.org : 127.0.11.2]; MX_GOOD(-0.01)[cached: mail.oitsec.umn.edu]; RCPT_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-0.24)[-0.243,0]; R_SPF_NA(0.00)[]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; R_DKIM_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; ASN(0.00)[asn:217, ipnet:128.101.0.0/16, country:US]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; IP_SCORE(-0.01)[country: US(-0.06)]; DMARC_POLICY_SOFTFAIL(0.10)[umn.edu : No valid SPF, No valid DKIM,none] X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 May 2019 17:17:28 -0000 On May 1, 2019, at 20:07 , Jim Thompson wrote: > The remote closed the session for some reason before ssh-keyscan wrote = the greening ("SSH-2.0-OpenSSH-keyscan\r\n=E2=80=9D), so you got SIGPIPE = and ERRNO =3D 32 back from the write call. >=20 > Arguably the right thing occurred here, with the exception that it = killed your ssh-keyscan process. >=20 > So perhaps instead of ignoring the signal, you should find out why the = remote is exiting before the local can send its greeting. I can't count on the remote side doing the write thing (yes, pun = intended), as not all of the apparent "SSH servers" I attempt to obtain = keys from are under my direct control. For me it would be better if = ssh-keyscan were simply more robust in handling unexpected input. > Otherwise, it=E2=80=99s a bit less heavy-handed to=20 >=20 > Int set =3D 1; > setsockopt(sd, SOL_SOCKET, SO_NOSIGPIPE, (void *)&set, sizeof(int)); >=20 > Where sd is the descriptor in question (16 in your example below). >=20 > But other parts of ssh-keyscan seem to want to know that EPIPE has = occurred, so neither is the correction solution here. That's why I asked where this was a sane plan. Again, I'm out of my = depth here, and my solution reflects that. --=20 Alan From owner-freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Thu May 2 18:30:52 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: freebsd-hackers@mailman.ysv.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mailman.ysv.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA275159E1E0 for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 18:30:52 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Received: from kib.kiev.ua (kib.kiev.ua [IPv6:2001:470:d5e7:1::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E5BC26CB9F for ; Thu, 2 May 2019 18:30:51 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) Received: from tom.home (kib@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by kib.kiev.ua (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x42IUh9a036720 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 2 May 2019 21:30:46 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 kib.kiev.ua x42IUh9a036720 Received: (from kostik@localhost) by tom.home (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) id x42IUgYu036719; Thu, 2 May 2019 21:30:42 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from kostikbel@gmail.com) X-Authentication-Warning: tom.home: kostik set sender to kostikbel@gmail.com using -f Date: Thu, 2 May 2019 21:30:42 +0300 From: Konstantin Belousov To: "Fedorov, Aleksandr" Cc: "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" Subject: Re: TASKQUEUE(9) KPI enqueue task only once Message-ID: <20190502183042.GH85201@kib.kiev.ua> References: <05b18f73ee054b9696d055ed40610dea@vstack.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <05b18f73ee054b9696d055ed40610dea@vstack.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.11.4 (2019-03-13) X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED,FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD,FREEMAIL_FROM, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on tom.home X-BeenThere: freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: Technical Discussions relating to FreeBSD List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 May 2019 18:30:52 -0000 On Thu, May 02, 2019 at 03:12:30PM +0000, Fedorov, Aleksandr wrote: > Hi Hackers. > > I need to enqueue task to the taskqueue only if there is no pending tasks. > > I found the taskqueue_poll_is_busy() function, but the comment above indicates that > it should be used only from single threaded contexts. > > Is there a conventional way to do this? The reference to the single threaded context above is just a funny way to say that the function is inherently racy. It can only work when enqueue is done from the same thread that executes the task. Why do you need that ? Suppose that you have such function, how would you use it ? Any check for the running task inside such function cannot know if the task function is already on the return path and do not intend to proceed your request that you want to enqueue conditionally. Or, lets formulate the question differently: what is your problem with queueing task despite it is already pending or running ?