Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2001 06:27:49 -0800 From: richard childers <fscked@pacbell.net> To: Mike Meyer <mwm@mired.org> Cc: questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: Pimping FreeBSD Information (was: 'Order') Message-ID: <3AA0FF65.B5071086@pacbell.net> References: <15004.45443.407304.303790@guru.mired.org> <3A9FFBCA.AAECD0C@pacbell.net> <15007.65140.482441.926268@guru.mired.org> <3AA02592.7E156FCF@pacbell.net> <15008.18436.560244.184628@guru.mired.org>
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Since you have not explained what it is that you are doing, I really have to ignore this. -- richard Mike Meyer wrote: > richard childers <fscked@pacbell.net> types: > > I would have to review what you have contributed before I could comment on whether what > > you are doing is *exactly* like what Tim is doing. > > Actually, I wasn't clear. I'm doing the same things that Tim is > doing. I have no idea why he's doing them. You seem to believe that > he's doing them for the same reasons that I am, and find his behavior > objectionable. > > > I haven't seen Tim refer anyone to anything he's written that is in the public domain; > > reviewing the archives, I see several times that he has referenced people to his book, > > explicitly, rather than answer the question. > > So? You haven't seen me refer to anything I've written that's in the > public domain, either. I haven't done it. > > > Tim says he's only been on freebsd-questions since January. So he seems to have offered > > his book for sale to several people, in less than two months, rather than answering > > their questions. > > I haven't *ever* seen Tim offer his book for sale. I haven't seen him > recommend that anyone purchase his book, either. I've seen him > recommend that people read it, which isn't the same thing. > > > I wouldn't care if he offered the book *after* answering the questions; but that's what > > the .signature does, doesn't it? And I have no objections to such. That's been made > > clear to all. > > Why should he retype something he's already written, or even bother > cutting and pasting it? I wouldn't do that - in fact, I don't. I > provide a reference so they can find what I wrote. So does he. If we > believe we're providing a reference to the best source for the > information they need, that's an answer. It's even a good answer, and > in line with the regular postings about how to get the best results > from -questions. > > > When you start pushing your book in lieu of good answers, you can probably assume that > > I will publically object to it. Until then, I think you are missing my point ... > > perhaps deliberately. > > I already push what I wrote instead of providing good answers. I do > that because I've already answered the question to the best of my > ability, and it's easier to provide a reference than to provide the > answer again. I also do it in hopes that it will cause someone to > throw a few dollars my way. Ted also refers people to something he's > written, and presumably believes is the best possible answer. If he > does so in hopes that he may make a few bucks, so what? > > > As for public support, I'm not looking for it. I never asked for it. I'm capable of > > standing up for what's right without a pack behind me to prop me up, thanks. > > You've demonstrated that you can stand up for what you believe in, > anyway. > > > If you need your friends amongst the subscribers to freebsd-questions to prop you up, > > you are free to Cc: them; but don't claim that I am forcing you to such a stooped > > posture. (-; > > Nah, I'm not claiming you forced me to do this. I'm simply standing up > for what's right. In this case, that happens to be not talking about > someone behind their back. Since you're objecting to Ted's behavior on > -questions, -questions is the obvious forum. Out of courtesy, I didn't > cc my reply to your original message there, but warned you that I > would do so in the future. > > <mike > > > -- richard > > > > > > Mike Meyer wrote: > > > > > richard childers <fscked@pacbell.net> types: > > > > "That he's selling it as a book and thus makes a profit if you buy it > > > > isn't relevant." > > > > > > > > Nonsense. Your skill at modularizing has blinded you to fundamental boundaries of > > > > civilized behavior; your web of rationales is interesting but unconvincing. > > > > > > Or possibly your anger at getting no support for your position has > > > made you so desperate to score a point you're replying to straw men, > > > and not the actual point. > > > > > > Everything I've posted for months has carried an ad for my paid > > > services. I regularly post pointers to text I've written. Writing the > > > text, posting the pointers, and posting the ad are all done in hopes > > > of improving my cash flow. No one has complained yet, and a number of > > > people have thanked me. That's because my goals are *not* > > > relevant. What's relevant is that those people feel they have gotten > > > value for the time they've invested, ads and all. > > > > > > If you want to argue about what I'm doing - which is *exactly* like > > > what Ted is doing - take it back to -questions, where the people who > > > actually pay for and benefit from the messages can have a say. If you > > > reply without including -questions, I'll make sure I include them if I > > > bother to reply. > > > > > > <mike > > > > > > > -- richard > > > > > > > > > > > > Mike Meyer wrote: > > > > > > > > > Garance A Drosihn <drosih@rpi.edu> types: > > > > > > At 7:16 AM -0800 2/27/01, richard childers wrote: > > > > > > >Maybe you should offer to send free copies to people ... or quote > > > > > > >from your book, instead of just referring to it. > > > > > > >I've seen two references to this book ... two attempts to pander > > > > > > >it, to pimp it, to sell it, to drum up orders for it ... but I > > > > > > >don't see you, Ted, contributing any expertise. Just sales > > > > > > >advertisements. > > > > > > After having read the messages that seemed to have annoyed you, > > > > > > I think Ted's comments were fine. The guy wrote a book, that > > > > > > does not mean he is required to stop and provide customized > > > > > > excerpts for the book for everyone who has a question that might > > > > > > be answered by the book. > > > > > > > > > > Right - he's providing a pointer to what he believes is the best > > > > > information that answers the question. That he wrote it isn't > > > > > relevant, though you'd expect an author to consider their work to be > > > > > the best available (otherwise, why write it?). A number of people - me > > > > > included - regularly provide pointers to things they wrote that > > > > > answers questions. It beats typing the information in all over again. > > > > > > > > > > That he's selling it as a book and thus makes a profit if you buy it > > > > > isn't relevant. You don't have to buy it, you just have to read > > > > > it. It'd be nice if he posted it to the web, but he may not have the > > > > > rights to do that. > > > > > > > > > > > >If I am, I'm sure others - not you, Ted - will inform me. And > > > > > > >I will duly apologize. > > > > > > Will you? Good. > > > > > > > > > > Yup. Anyone willing to provide good answers (and Ted does) should be > > > > > encouraged, not discouraged. > > > > > > > > > > <mike > > > > > -- > > > > > Mike Meyer <mwm@mired.org> http://www.mired.org/home/mwm/ > > > > > Independent WWW/Perforce/FreeBSD/Unix consultant, email for more information. > > > > > > > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > > > > > with "unsubscribe freebsd-questions" in the body of the message > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Richard A. Childers > > > > Senor UNIX Administrator > > > > fscked@pacbell.net (email) > > > > 203.556.8471 (voice/msgs) > > > > > > > > # Providing administrative expertise (not 'damage control') since 1986. > > > > # PGP fingerprint: 7EFF 164A E878 7B04 8E9F 32B6 72C2 D8A2 582C 4AFA > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Mike Meyer <mwm@mired.org> http://www.mired.org/home/mwm/ > > > Independent WWW/Perforce/FreeBSD/Unix consultant, email for more information. > > > > -- > > Richard A. Childers > > Senor UNIX Administrator > > fscked@pacbell.net (email) > > 203.556.8471 (voice/msgs) > > > > # Providing administrative expertise (not 'damage control') since 1986. > > # PGP fingerprint: 7EFF 164A E878 7B04 8E9F 32B6 72C2 D8A2 582C 4AFA > > > > > > > -- > Mike Meyer <mwm@mired.org> http://www.mired.org/home/mwm/ > Independent WWW/Perforce/FreeBSD/Unix consultant, email for more information. -- Richard A. Childers Senor UNIX Administrator fscked@pacbell.net (email) 203.556.8471 (voice/msgs) # Providing administrative expertise (not 'damage control') since 1986. # PGP fingerprint: 7EFF 164A E878 7B04 8E9F 32B6 72C2 D8A2 582C 4AFA To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-questions" in the body of the message
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