Date: Fri, 21 Jul 1995 17:33:27 -0700 From: "Jordan K. Hubbard" <jkh@time.cdrom.com> To: Karl Denninger <karl@Mcs.Net> Cc: rgrimes@gndrsh.aac.dev.com, karl@mcs.com, current@freebsd.org, peter@haywire.DIALix.COM, freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org Subject: Re: SUP target for -STABLE, and setup for SUP info? Message-ID: <21238.806373207@time.cdrom.com> In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 21 Jul 1995 15:06:23 CDT." <199507212006.PAA02125@Jupiter.mcs.net>
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> I'm happy to pay for *actual* support which I receive, but my feel on this > is that I am not going to pay for a staffer full-time if the work that he or > she produces goes back to *everyone*. Sorry if I suggested that you'd be expected to pay for a full-time staffer. Such a staffer would not only be too expensive for a single company to support ($40K/yr for a support contract would be a little excessive, to say the least :-) but it also wouldn't make much sense. You don't NEED somebody on the job for MCSNet full-time, you need someone available for bursts of activity when problems are encountered and then, most likely, you don't need anyone at all for awhile. So it's not very useful to debate whether or not the work of said staffer would be "owned" by a single firm - I'm not talking about that kind of money or that kind of easy accountability for the individual (or, more likely, individuals) in question. It's more likely that the support team will be working multiple problems at once and the fixes they generate may cover multiple overlapping areas of concern for more companies than just your own. > That is, I won't pay for everyone *else*'s fix. But I will pay a reasonable > support charge *if and only if* I get actual fixes to problems like this in > a contemporary fashion. Of course. Such a support contract will only work for you and any other companies participating if fixes are made promptly and competently. When the support team isn't working on problems, I'd expect it to also work on generally improving the system and enhancing it in ways that EVERYONE, and that includes yourself, can benefit from. Otherwise, I don't see much point in establishing such an organization. We're a free software effort and any and all such organizations should be set up with our own unique model somewhere in mind. I don't think that this precludes being accountable or prompt with the commercial partners in any way, especially as there will be a significant motivation on the part of those working on this to make the whole concept work. Most software companies have multiple programmers working for little more than a paycheck which, as any programmer knows, isn't always the most motivating of factors. Being able to work for both a paycheck and some "higher goal" (e.g. the results of your work being touted far and wide for a demonstrably "good cause") would represent the best of all possible worlds for many, and if I can put such an organization together then I think that it would not only work, but also work rather well. > power to them. However, my willingness to pay is directly correlated to the > quality of the fixes and the timeliness of what we receive. Natch. I understand this fully. > If I'm going to pay big bucks, then I want the fixes (and the rest of that > person's time) to myself. If its much more reasonable, then so am I. I think that asking you to pay big bucks would actually be counter-productive to us both. It would raise your expectations unreasonably and also put those in the project in something of a bind as they felt somewhat co-opted by the deal. I think "much more reasonable" is exactly that. Just out of curiousity (and I'll direct this question to any and all listening here, not just Karl), what would you consider "reasonable" and what kind of response time would you expect for it? If I can get some reasonable estimates for the size of the potential customer base and the amount of incoming capital they'd represent, then I think that it's entirely possible that I could turn this from idle conjecture into reality. The Internet has also made it possible to "hire" people to work at home, and as long as their work meets some reasonable standard for response time and quality then I also think that I could put such an organization together with far less overhead than a traditional one with offices, 401K plans, etc. The resultant savings could then be passed back to the customer and/or used to finance longer-term goals for the project. Thoughts? Figures? I think this would be a very significant step forward for FreeBSD, but it's also something that I can't without at least a little help. Jordan
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